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| 05:56.40 | Vajb | hooray. In version 2.0.21 of yappari i was finally able to leave group. Remains to be seen if yappari will be stable now. |
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| 06:38.25 | ceene | cool! |
| 06:38.38 | ceene | i hope so too |
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| 07:37.43 | Vajb | i think i tried to leave group since version .18. I even deleted the group log from yappari folder, but still that group stayed in my history. |
| 07:37.50 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 07:38.26 | KotCzarny | https://gxben.wordpress.com/2008/08/24/why-do-i-hate-dlna-protocol-so-much/ |
| 07:38.29 | KotCzarny | dlna is evil |
| 07:48.36 | Vajb | sounds more like plain stupid for me :) |
| 07:49.21 | KotCzarny | nope, planned evil |
| 07:49.50 | KotCzarny | one good thing it's standardizing to some little subset |
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| 07:50.10 | KotCzarny | bad thing, makes ligthweight embedded server impossible without pricy hardware |
| 07:51.11 | Vajb | but cpu sellers will happily sell u their newest cpu :) |
| 07:51.24 | KotCzarny | see tht pricy hardware part |
| 07:51.58 | Vajb | just tried to be sarcastic :p |
| 07:53.21 | Sicelo | um, dlna is evil? |
| 07:53.36 | KotCzarny | it is castrated upnp a/v |
| 07:53.37 | Sicelo | goes to the article ... at this rate what won't be evil?? |
| 07:54.00 | bencoh | everything is evil |
| 07:54.09 | KotCzarny | article is from 2011, some things might have changed since that time |
| 07:56.00 | KotCzarny | sicelo: open standards and no patents |
| 07:59.07 | KotCzarny | (and yeah, looking to add upnp/dlna client support to oscp) |
| 08:01.29 | Vajb | so then it would be able to serve as media server for ps3, right? |
| 08:03.03 | KotCzarny | no, client, not server |
| 08:03.13 | KotCzarny | for ps3 see the ushare |
| 08:03.44 | KotCzarny | people donated ps3 to libdlna/ushare author |
| 08:03.48 | KotCzarny | and it works |
| 08:04.03 | KotCzarny | and you can install it on n900 probably |
| 08:04.52 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 08:05.01 | KotCzarny | unless i misread your sentence |
| 08:05.14 | KotCzarny | you want to play what from where? |
| 08:07.36 | Sicelo | rygel does dlna or upnp? |
| 08:08.16 | KotCzarny | rygel - GNOME UPnP/DLNA services |
| 08:08.20 | KotCzarny | who knows |
| 08:08.56 | Sicelo | i get this guy's point about formats, etc, but the rest looks like advertising ushare :/ |
| 08:09.08 | KotCzarny | nope, its not only about formats |
| 08:09.58 | Sicelo | i've used rygel a couple of times with n900 ... then again. i hardly ever stream media... i just wanted to test the functiona!ity on the n900 |
| 08:10.55 | KotCzarny | sicelo, as for ushare argument, it's a blog of the author, so he wrote about his experiences with implementing upnp/dlna |
| 08:11.06 | KotCzarny | in comments you see another upnp author |
| 08:11.14 | KotCzarny | which agrees with him |
| 08:11.58 | KotCzarny | As the developer/maintainer of GUPnP/Rygel, I have been dealing with DLNA for some years now and I must say I fully agree with everything you said here. Actually, I was thinking of writing up a post like this but I guess you saved me time by writing it for me. |
| 08:12.04 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 08:13.33 | Sicelo | the formats/codecs/containers issue is real .. i did notice it ...had problems transcoding on the fly for n900 as client |
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| 08:14.05 | KotCzarny | if they made some content negotiation, it would be easier |
| 08:14.17 | KotCzarny | but less money |
| 08:15.42 | KotCzarny | as in, 'lets most popular httpd server and write a module for implementing flexible standard' |
| 08:15.53 | KotCzarny | s/lets/lets grab/ |
| 08:16.06 | ceene | all i can say is i've got minidlna running on quite an old and not very powerful pc |
| 08:16.15 | ceene | to watch films and series on a samsung tv |
| 08:16.18 | ceene | and it works wonderfully |
| 08:16.18 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 08:16.18 | ceene | :P |
| 08:16.27 | ceene | it's got 256Mb of ram or so |
| 08:16.31 | ceene | so more or less like the n900 |
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| 08:18.59 | zGrr | moin :) |
| 08:19.20 | KotCzarny | oink |
| 08:20.16 | KotCzarny | sicelo, have you seen the link about nokia maps script? |
| 08:20.49 | Sicelo | yes, that's the "standard" way :) |
| 08:20.58 | Sicelo | don't know if the path is still correct |
| 08:21.07 | KotCzarny | well, script worked |
| 08:21.13 | KotCzarny | tried it yesterday |
| 08:21.19 | KotCzarny | and started downloading maps |
| 08:22.45 | Maxdamantus | downloaded the OpenStreetMap data a few years ago. |
| 08:22.53 | Sicelo | 11:54 < Sicelo> in the meantime, i think we have better chances trying to get the url which is used by Nokia Suite, and then we can download ourselves :) |
| 08:22.57 | Sicelo | 11:55 < Sicelo> which is how most of us Linux users have mostly been getting maps on N900 even when map download was working properly |
| 08:22.59 | Maxdamantus | was something like a 300 GB XML file. |
| 08:23.07 | Sicelo | 11:55 < KotCzarny> but this is hit and run game |
| 08:23.28 | Sicelo | 11:56 < Sicelo> why? |
| 08:23.28 | Sicelo | 11:57 < KotCzarny> because it can change at any time, and without vendor support there is no guarantee how long it would work |
| 08:23.28 | Maxdamantus | compressed to twenty something. |
| 08:23.28 | Sicelo | nice |
| 08:23.37 | KotCzarny | maxd: single file? |
| 08:24.54 | Maxdamantus | Yes. |
| 08:25.18 | KotCzarny | must be hell of a random access |
| 08:25.28 | Wizzup | not if it is all in ram |
| 08:25.55 | KotCzarny | ssd mapped as ram |
| 08:26.06 | Maxdamantus | It's pretty much as hard in RAM. |
| 08:26.16 | Maxdamantus | you need an additional index in either case. |
| 08:26.34 | Wizzup | I have not seen said XML file anyway |
| 08:26.44 | Wizzup | Let alone know if they really used that as backend |
| 08:27.10 | KotCzarny | modifying that file is hell too |
| 08:27.22 | KotCzarny | bet they keep it in sql and just export as xml |
| 08:27.23 | Maxdamantus | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 303G May 18 2012 planet-120508.osm |
| 08:27.53 | Wizzup | ok, so how do you use this file to serve content? |
| 08:27.59 | Wizzup | and how does osm do it? |
| 08:28.09 | Maxdamantus | You don't. The idea is to transform it into a form you can use. |
| 08:28.17 | Wizzup | ok, then xml makes perfect sense |
| 08:28.27 | Maxdamantus | XML is a bit silly tbh. |
| 08:28.31 | Maxdamantus | They have a binary format too. |
| 08:28.38 | KotCzarny | how big is the binary one? |
| 08:28.52 | Maxdamantus | Only slightly smaller (compressed) |
| 08:29.04 | Maxdamantus | uncompressed, it'll be a lot smaller. |
| 08:29.25 | Maxdamantus | though afaik it's still not inherently indexable. |
| 08:29.39 | Maxdamantus | (you can of course create indexes for either format) |
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| 08:31.45 | Maxdamantus | An actual useful form would be bigger any more complicated anyway. |
| 08:32.14 | KotCzarny | i guess, they could export it as sqlite db |
| 08:32.16 | Maxdamantus | eg, you can't just use an XML file like that to render an outline of the US. |
| 08:33.12 | Maxdamantus | Probably better solutions than sqlite3. |
| 08:33.41 | Maxdamantus | You'd probably want some sort of quad tree. |
| 08:34.10 | Maxdamantus | Where information is simplified each time you approach the root. |
| 08:35.20 | Maxdamantus | Well, for doing spatial things with it at least. |
| 08:35.59 | Maxdamantus | if you want to create a search index to look up coordinates for things, you'd want something else. |
| 08:36.46 | Maxdamantus | but that's very different to looking up what is within some particular area. |
| 08:37.24 | Maxdamantus | http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/QuadTiles |
| 08:38.05 | KotCzarny | hmm, offtopic, any way of making wget -c and -O options work as expected? |
| 08:39.06 | Maxdamantus | Do they not work? |
| 08:39.14 | KotCzarny | not as expected |
| 08:39.23 | KotCzarny | wget -c "${server}/${basedir}/NorthCentralAmerica.zip" -O ./IndexNorthCentralAmerica.zip |
| 08:39.28 | KotCzarny | tries to reget whole file |
| 08:39.31 | Maxdamantus | Are you the one that added all the busybox symlinks? |
| 08:39.35 | KotCzarny | even if its already done |
| 08:39.45 | KotCzarny | nope, apt-get install wget |
| 08:40.00 | KotCzarny | ii wget 1.10.2-2osso3 |
| 08:40.13 | Maxdamantus | Maybe the server doesn't support partial downloads. |
| 08:40.26 | KotCzarny | i'll try without -O then, just for that |
| 08:40.42 | Maxdamantus | -c is the one to do with partial downloads. |
| 08:40.54 | KotCzarny | yes, but -O breaks it |
| 08:41.02 | KotCzarny | at least in wget 1.10.2 |
| 08:42.03 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 08:42.38 | KotCzarny | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:42.44 | KotCzarny | so it SHOULD work |
| 08:42.58 | KotCzarny | but apparently doesnt (even without -O) |
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| 08:46.32 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 08:46.46 | KotCzarny | works with -c -O on kernel.org |
| 08:47.01 | KotCzarny | might be broken ovi.com server |
| 08:52.24 | KotCzarny | or just weird display in wget |
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| 09:09.00 | Maxdamantus | is downloading these files now. |
| 09:17.18 | Maxdamantus | So does ovimaps usually just do partial requests on the zip files? |
| 09:17.51 | Maxdamantus | Length: 1988953069 (1.9G) [application/zip] Saving to: âstatic.maploader.maps.svc.ovi.com/map5/maploaderzip-00.01.28.107/981.zipâ |
| 09:17.59 | Maxdamantus | I'm guessing it doesn't normally download that entire file. |
| 09:18.14 | KotCzarny | nokia map loader does just that |
| 09:18.48 | Maxdamantus | Oh, so map loading is a separate function? |
| 09:18.55 | KotCzarny | most likely |
| 09:19.06 | KotCzarny | see the '.maploader.' in url? |
| 09:19.26 | KotCzarny | it might be different service from that maps uses for 'on demand' downloads |
| 09:19.27 | Maxdamantus | hasn't seen OVI maps functioning. |
| 09:19.46 | Maxdamantus | has opened it once or twice and guessed the service had disappeared. |
| 09:20.06 | KotCzarny | would be nice to have offline maps, especially legit ones |
| 09:20.47 | KotCzarny | does nokia maps have offline route calculation? |
| 09:21.44 | Sicelo | yes |
| 09:21.52 | KotCzarny | cool |
| 09:22.00 | Sicelo | only search doesn't work offline. |
| 09:22.07 | KotCzarny | um |
| 09:22.08 | KotCzarny | what? |
| 09:22.22 | Sicelo | you can also "hack" voice nav guidnance |
| 09:22.34 | Sicelo | you cannot search locations offline |
| 09:22.42 | zGrr | Is there a good OSM satnav? |
| 09:22.55 | zGrr | I mean, as good as garmin or better. |
| 09:23.03 | KotCzarny | you mean, i cannot find city/street offline? |
| 09:23.28 | Sicelo | by "typing" its location? yes you cannot. |
| 09:23.36 | KotCzarny | o.O |
| 09:23.37 | Sicelo | you can 'point' to it ;) |
| 09:24.16 | KotCzarny | that's just crazy talk |
| 09:24.30 | Sicelo | :/ |
| 09:24.34 | Sicelo | not sure i follow |
| 09:24.49 | KotCzarny | situation, im in some unknown city |
| 09:25.01 | KotCzarny | i know the street address, but i dont know where that street is in that city |
| 09:25.18 | KotCzarny | can i use nokia maps on n900 without internet to guide me there? |
| 09:25.24 | Sicelo | no |
| 09:25.50 | buZz | what about OSM? |
| 09:25.53 | KotCzarny | not even street search? (without street address) |
| 09:25.58 | Sicelo | search is completely online |
| 09:26.16 | Sicelo | there's a bug report about it, marked as wontfix |
| 09:26.21 | ceene | the only good thing about that is that it searches on new maps |
| 09:26.26 | ceene | as it requests the place to here.com maps |
| 09:26.34 | ceene | so if they get improved, you'll get that improvement |
| 09:26.37 | buZz | there isnt a offline OSM tool for maemo? |
| 09:26.39 | KotCzarny | oh well, 'we want money-pot safeguard' |
| 09:26.41 | ceene | but no, you can't search for any place offline |
| 09:26.57 | buZz | oh there is |
| 09:26.58 | buZz | http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Software/Maemo |
| 09:27.00 | ceene | buZz: there's marble at least |
| 09:27.01 | buZz | a shitton |
| 09:27.08 | ceene | to be honest |
| 09:27.13 | ceene | i found all of them ugly |
| 09:27.13 | Sicelo | buZz: not Ovi Maps |
| 09:27.15 | buZz | nearly all of them allow local street search |
| 09:27.18 | ceene | and not very useful |
| 09:27.28 | ceene | the best is still sygic |
| 09:27.34 | buZz | OSM dataset is insanely usefull here in western europe |
| 09:27.38 | Maxdamantus | It's not necessarily offline. |
| 09:27.55 | Sicelo | and i'm wiith ceene here .. i've tried all maps (except) sygic, and for my places, nothing beats here.com. |
| 09:28.04 | Maxdamantus | (it's probably not offline) |
| 09:28.16 | Sicelo | even on the browser on pc .. google maps just doesn't do it |
| 09:28.32 | buZz | fyi, of that list, only 2 dont do offline storage |
| 09:28.36 | buZz | the 7 others do |
| 09:28.47 | buZz | (as listed on that wikipage) |
| 09:28.48 | KotCzarny | bummer |
| 09:29.04 | KotCzarny | i have automapa for android, which is completely offline |
| 09:29.23 | Sicelo | try the others then KotCzarny |
| 09:29.55 | KotCzarny | sicelo, gotta check nokia maps first, and decide if i shall purge or use it |
| 09:30.10 | Sicelo | :) |
| 09:30.12 | Maxdamantus | buZz: is that meant to be listed on that page? |
| 09:30.27 | Maxdamantus | Oh, "Stores map-data off-board" |
| 09:30.34 | Sicelo | seems the search offline is a very important feature for you though |
| 09:30.37 | KotCzarny | what is the point of maps without search or route calculation |
| 09:30.44 | buZz | Maxdamantus: on-board ;) |
| 09:30.45 | Maxdamantus | er, on-board |
| 09:30.57 | buZz | oh lol, yeah |
| 09:31.00 | buZz | ALL do offline |
| 09:31.01 | buZz | nice |
| 09:31.47 | Sicelo | route works fine offline |
| 09:31.48 | buZz | ah, osm2go is in extra repo :D |
| 09:31.50 | buZz | lets see |
| 09:32.09 | Sicelo | and n900 does better routing (again for my locations at least) than google |
| 09:32.27 | Maxdamantus | tried downloading a range of images from Google maps once. |
| 09:32.33 | Maxdamantus | got blocked. |
| 09:32.51 | KotCzarny | you need to watch for captcha |
| 09:32.56 | Maxdamantus | was unable to use Google maps for a day or two. |
| 09:32.57 | KotCzarny | then just present it to user |
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| 09:40.44 | bencoh | offline search in marble/OSM kinda "works" ... kinda. |
| 09:41.00 | bencoh | but "exact" search only |
| 09:46.16 | Wizzup | is hoping for a nice wiki article summarizing all this |
| 09:46.23 | Wizzup | I've been wanting to find some better mapping sw |
| 09:46.26 | Wizzup | I use maep mostly |
| 09:46.30 | Wizzup | but it has no (working) search |
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| 09:46.47 | KotCzarny | make a tmo post, gather data, create wiki page? |
| 09:46.59 | Wizzup | something like that. |
| 09:48.27 | KotCzarny | dont forget to include app versions |
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| 10:53.40 | Maxdamantus | Hm. Does the thing on the back cover only need to be ferromagnetic, not actually magnetic? |
| 10:54.28 | Maxdamantus | Seems like it. |
| 10:54.40 | Maxdamantus | I can activate the sensor just using a pin or an SD card. |
| 10:56.02 | Maxdamantus | The camera shutter one, that is. |
| 10:57.03 | ceene | probably what the board has is an inductive sensor |
| 10:57.05 | ceene | not a magnet |
| 10:57.14 | ceene | so anything that excites the inductive sensor would work |
| 10:57.24 | ceene | like the one you have on the bike to measure speed :) |
| 11:00.08 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:11.55 | buZz | ceene: those are hall effect sensors |
| 11:12.01 | buZz | (on bicycles) |
| 11:39.33 | *** join/#maemo jonwil (~jonwil@27-33-80-219.tpgi.com.au) |
| 11:43.11 | jonwil | Anyone else having problems with Skype? Mine has issues connecting and issues displaying the online/offline status of people |
| 11:43.24 | buZz | yes |
| 11:43.27 | buZz | skype = down |
| 11:43.43 | buZz | the NSA servers crashed so they turned off skype to prevent dataloss |
| 11:44.04 | KotCzarny | its amazing m$ didnt kill off nmaemo skype |
| 11:44.18 | KotCzarny | maybe they are bound to some license |
| 11:44.23 | buZz | they cant, that would require changing the protocol |
| 11:44.30 | jonwil | Its possible killing Maemo Skype would kill Skype on other platforms they still need |
| 11:44.32 | buZz | but as they fired nearly all their coders, they cant really do that |
| 11:44.35 | jonwil | things that cant be upgraded |
| 11:44.49 | Wizzup | buZz: and replaced them with .js people -- hence web.skype.com ;) |
| 11:44.58 | buZz | ;) |
| 11:45.24 | jonwil | and now MS are making big noise about how "Skype works plugin-free on our new Windows-10 browser"... |
| 11:46.00 | buZz | very edgy :P |
| 11:46.13 | KotCzarny | well, they killed desktop skype easily by forcing to upgrade old versions |
| 11:46.32 | KotCzarny | which in turn required m$ login |
| 11:48.41 | jonwil | The good news is that in theory if it runs in Edge without plugins (and Edge isn't providing some weird proprietary undocumented algorithms or interfaces to work which it probably doesn't given Microsoft has said it wants to make it work plugin free on other browsers once they support the right stuff) it should be possible to build a non-browser client that plugs into the same JS stuff and... |
| 11:48.42 | jonwil | ...backend in theory |
| 11:49.06 | jonwil | that said, Javascript is something I know nothing about and couldn't program in if my life depended on it so I dont know just how possible stuff like that might be :P |
| 11:50.30 | jonwil | anyhow its good to know Skype is just down and not broken |
| 11:50.35 | erlehmann | just don't |
| 11:50.36 | Wizzup | using a plugin it can also work in mozilla and chrome |
| 11:50.40 | Wizzup | it'll probably work in the future |
| 11:50.54 | Wizzup | jonwil: skype seems to resolve to localhost at some places |
| 11:50.56 | Wizzup | as in, the skype urls |
| 11:52.38 | jonwil | I received a message just over 12 hours ago from someone, turned it off to go out and do stuff (so it wouldn't kill my battery and drain my expensive mobile data) and now it wont work either on my home WiFi or my mobile data link |
| 11:53.50 | jonwil | in any case http://heartbeat.skype.com/ says "we are having issues" so that confirms that it isn't me :) |
| 11:56.19 | jonwil | All in all, I dont regret the decision to buy a Nokia N900 one bit |
| 11:56.28 | KotCzarny | i bought 4 |
| 11:56.35 | KotCzarny | #noregrets |
| 11:57.32 | jonwil | Some people have told me I should have bought something more mainstream (particularly since if I owned such a thing I could then develop apps for it, put them in the app store and use that to boost my portfolio and have a better chance of getting a job writing software) but screw em |
| 11:57.38 | jonwil | The N900 is the best cellphone I have ever used |
| 11:57.51 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:57.54 | jonwil | and the only reason I will stop using it is if it fails in a way where it cant be fixed |
| 11:58.17 | jonwil | Or if I upgrade to something better (and the only thing I know of that would quality is a Neo900) |
| 11:58.35 | Wizzup | I'm hoping to replace my maemo-based n900 with something very basic, kernel 4.1.0+ which can do 3g and phonecalls |
| 11:58.42 | Wizzup | or at least start using both |
| 11:59.26 | jonwil | Neo900 is the only "cellphone" I know of that might be usable with a modern kernel and a full Linux system |
| 11:59.53 | KotCzarny | jonwil: buy few spares, they go as cheap as 15eur for fully functional ones |
| 12:00.19 | jonwil | Not here in Australia, getting hold of genuine working usable N900s is hard |
| 12:00.28 | KotCzarny | hard but possible |
| 12:00.43 | jonwil | Especially since I have had VERY bad experiences in the past with eBay and PayPal and refuse to use either company |
| 12:00.49 | KotCzarny | if you keep on searching |
| 12:01.14 | KotCzarny | browse local classifieds regularly |
| 12:03.39 | jonwil | right now my N900 is fine though except for some minor screen damage, something wonky with the way it calculates battery levels (sometimes it will be at "battery low, charge me now" state then it will go up to a few bars without me plugging it in) and a little bit of minor cosmetic damage. |
| 12:04.00 | buZz | weird stuff, batt was at 60% , reboot, boom; 95% |
| 12:04.20 | Wizzup | jonwil: why do you say that? |
| 12:04.32 | Wizzup | http://elinux.org/N900 |
| 12:05.33 | jonwil | Wasn't aware you could get a modern kernel on a N900 without loss of functionality |
| 12:05.40 | jonwil | But if you can, that's great :) |
| 12:05.47 | Wizzup | 'without loss of functionality' |
| 12:05.51 | Wizzup | that's a very mean sentence |
| 12:05.59 | Wizzup | check that page to see what works |
| 12:06.01 | jonwil | I am happy enough with the stock kernel though :) |
| 12:06.12 | Wizzup | some of the interfaces are (slightly) different, so you cannot just put it in maemo |
| 12:06.15 | Wizzup | That' |
| 12:06.18 | Wizzup | s good |
| 12:06.23 | Wizzup | I want a more recent kernel if it at all possible |
| 12:09.59 | jonwil | The N900 may not have LTE or Bluetooth 4.0 or 802.11nac or other more modern standards but its still way better than anything crApple has ever made :P |
| 12:10.35 | jonwil | Apple is the only phone maker where you have to pay money to take an app you wrote and run it on a device you own. |
| 12:10.45 | jonwil | Even Microsoft stopped that a while back |
| 12:10.57 | buZz | apple doesnt, you can just sideload your own apps |
| 12:10.59 | buZz | no payment |
| 12:11.03 | buZz | same @ android and winderp |
| 12:11.23 | jonwil | I wasn't aware Apple had changed its policies to allow you to side-load things onto an iPhone |
| 12:11.34 | buZz | this has been the case since iphone #1 |
| 12:11.44 | jonwil | jailbreaking yes |
| 12:11.57 | buZz | of course, if you dont have root on your device you dont own it |
| 12:12.15 | jonwil | But I wasn't aware that there was an official way to run your own code on an iPhone without paying the $99 to Apple |
| 12:12.40 | buZz | random google hit > Xcode 7 allows anyone to download, build and âsideloadâ iOS apps for free |
| 12:13.06 | jonwil | ok, so Apple must have changed its policy at some point |
| 12:13.37 | buZz | and before that there was http://try.macbuildserver.com/ |
| 12:14.45 | jonwil | You still need to buy both an iDevice AND a Mac to do it though so its a much higher cost of entry than other devices |
| 12:17.05 | jonwil | Anyhow, I love my N900 and if I had the time and energy I would get back into writing code for it |
| 12:17.24 | KotCzarny | jonwil, battery woes == old battery, just buy replacement |
| 12:17.27 | KotCzarny | ~polarcell |
| 12:17.27 | infobot | polarcell is, like, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/390402445382 BL-5J Replacement |
| 12:18.02 | jonwil | This isn't a particularly old battery, its about 1.5 years old |
| 12:18.14 | KotCzarny | did you buy it new? |
| 12:18.20 | jonwil | yes |
| 12:18.25 | jonwil | Its not the original battery that went with the phone though, its a replacement (that may or may not have been a genuine Nokia) |
| 12:18.37 | KotCzarny | spent time in hot areas? |
| 12:18.58 | jonwil | Well I do live in Queensland where it can get VERY hot and humid at times |
| 12:21.01 | jonwil | bq27200.sh says my NAC/CACD/CACT (total capacity of the battery I think) is 767mAh which seems a little low |
| 12:21.08 | KotCzarny | um |
| 12:21.12 | jonwil | suggesting maybe this isn't a genuine Nokia BL-5J... |
| 12:21.19 | KotCzarny | very low |
| 12:21.28 | KotCzarny | what is value of CI ? |
| 12:21.52 | jonwil | I dont see a CI value |
| 12:21.58 | jonwil | wait I do |
| 12:21.59 | Maxdamantus | has finally bought new earphones. |
| 12:22.01 | jonwil | CI is zero |
| 12:22.08 | KotCzarny | then values should be true |
| 12:22.32 | KotCzarny | anyway, buy new battery, that polarcell link is tried and tested one |
| 12:22.40 | jonwil | whats even weirder is that "Last Measured Discharge" claims its 886mAh |
| 12:22.42 | Maxdamantus | wonders if the Neo900 is meant to have a better audio signal than the N900 (not that I'm intending on getting one) |
| 12:23.22 | Maxdamantus | hears noise on most things on his current earphones. |
| 12:23.48 | KotCzarny | maxd: hearing voices? |
| 12:23.50 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:23.56 | Maxdamantus | basically everything except the two dedicated music player devices I have. |
| 12:24.01 | Wizzup | I think you're just a bit more sensitive when it comes to most things than other people in here |
| 12:24.06 | Maxdamantus | No, just electrical static. |
| 12:24.11 | Wizzup | I've never heard noise on my n900 port |
| 12:24.20 | Wizzup | audio port* |
| 12:24.32 | Maxdamantus | They're supposedly relatively low-impedence. |
| 12:24.54 | jonwil | As for new battery, I just spent $50 on new ink cartridges for my printer, I cant afford a new battery right now :P |
| 12:25.06 | KotCzarny | jonwil: polarcel is ~10eur |
| 12:25.16 | KotCzarny | brand new 1500mAh action |
| 12:25.36 | Maxdamantus | is meant to be getting one of those too in a few days. |
| 12:25.37 | jonwil | Is there somewhere to buy one that isn't eBay? And I bet shipping to Australia is expensive... |
| 12:25.48 | buZz | Maxdamantus: just add some 10k ohm resistors between your headphones |
| 12:25.51 | Maxdamantus | Shipping is free to Australia. |
| 12:25.55 | buZz | Maxdamantus: i'm sure that'll make the noise go away |
| 12:26.03 | jonwil | but its still eBay :P |
| 12:26.07 | KotCzarny | and do yourself a favour and buy kyocera ecosys laser printer (7200 pages on one ~30eur toner) |
| 12:26.17 | Maxdamantus | jonwil: it's from a trusted distributor. |
| 12:26.36 | Maxdamantus | ~polarcell |
| 12:26.36 | infobot | it has been said that polarcell is http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/390402445382 BL-5J Replacement |
| 12:26.43 | jonwil | Its nothing to do with the seller, I just hate eBay and PayPal for all sorts of reasons I dont want to go into |
| 12:26.49 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:26.51 | jonwil | and wont use them for anything no matter how good |
| 12:27.16 | KotCzarny | ask someone to buy one for you? |
| 12:27.17 | jonwil | As for the printer, this Canon Inkjet was a birthday gift so I didn't pick it |
| 12:27.21 | KotCzarny | (loophole) |
| 12:28.00 | KotCzarny | jonwil, you know that ink printers cost next to nothing and companies make money out of the cartridges? |
| 12:28.13 | jonwil | yes I know |
| 12:28.22 | jonwil | but like I said, it wasn't my decision |
| 12:28.25 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:28.51 | KotCzarny | dealer rule: first shot is free |
| 12:29.05 | KotCzarny | then then hook you up and drain you |
| 12:29.22 | jonwil | Also unless things have changed, color laser printers that can do photo-quality prints are still quite expensive (and yes I print things where quality is important) |
| 12:29.23 | KotCzarny | *they |
| 12:29.31 | KotCzarny | um |
| 12:29.37 | KotCzarny | print things in photoshop? |
| 12:29.41 | KotCzarny | much cheaper |
| 12:29.45 | KotCzarny | and higher quality |
| 12:30.07 | KotCzarny | phot shop i mean |
| 12:30.20 | KotCzarny | the one that prints your photos, not adobe money maker |
| 12:31.30 | jonwil | I dont know of any photo printing place that can print custom-made stickers for LEGO creations onto special sticker paper. And certainly not one that can do it from an SVG file created in Inkscape (or that can print multiple test prints first so I can check the sizing and such before I print on the stickers) |
| 12:31.40 | sixwheeledbeast | cba with inkjets, use more ink in cleaning than printing |
| 12:31.59 | KotCzarny | you can render svg into high res jpeg |
| 12:32.01 | jonwil | In any case I now have a new pair of cartridges for this Canon and I can print the things I want to print :) |
| 12:32.16 | Maxdamantus | They also have a website, so you can avoid eBay at least: http://www.wannsee-electronic.de/handyakkus/nokia/polarcell_hochleistungs-akku_ersetzt_originalakku_nokia_bl-5j_i2_62_0.htm |
| 12:32.27 | Maxdamantus | Though I suspect you'd have to pay through PayPal. |
| 12:32.38 | Maxdamantus | and I can't tell if the shipping is worldwide there because it's in German. |
| 12:32.55 | Maxdamantus | all the emails I got from buying it on eBay were also in German. |
| 12:33.16 | KotCzarny | http://www.wannsee-electronic.de/information/7/Versandkosten.htm?IT=62&VN=0 |
| 12:33.21 | KotCzarny | shipping price |
| 12:33.34 | KotCzarny | 4.90 eur to australia |
| 12:33.37 | Maxdamantus | âIhre aktuellen Versandkosten für Vorauskasse Deutschlandâ sounds like not worldwide. |
| 12:33.50 | jonwil | I know of a very good (reputable reliable been around for ages) local chain store that does batteries for basically everything known to man and they can do a BL-5J compatible |
| 12:34.11 | jonwil | They even told me it comes with some juice in it and I could test it out to make sure it works |
| 12:34.48 | jonwil | so if I decide to buy a new one I will go there |
| 12:34.50 | KotCzarny | jonwil, just remember, n900's mAh counter gets close to real capacity in 3-5 cycles |
| 12:34.51 | Maxdamantus | "test it" as in use it for a few cycles? |
| 12:35.05 | jonwil | no, test it as in make sure its compatible |
| 12:35.11 | jonwil | Which is all that would matter for the purchase |
| 12:35.16 | KotCzarny | nope |
| 12:35.17 | jonwil | These guys dont make crap or fake junk |
| 12:35.28 | KotCzarny | buying 700mAh knock off is not as good as 1500mAh one |
| 12:35.49 | Maxdamantus | Well, I suspect they wouldn't be making the batteries. |
| 12:35.54 | jonwil | no they dont |
| 12:36.00 | jonwil | but they wouldn't be putting their name on junk |
| 12:36.16 | KotCzarny | anyway, you shouldnt pay more than 15eur for good one |
| 12:36.18 | KotCzarny | (new) |
| 12:36.46 | KotCzarny | as you can get one from polarcell shop for 12eur+5eur shipping to australia |
| 12:37.14 | jonwil | anyhow, its not a high priority right now |
| 12:37.19 | KotCzarny | um |
| 12:37.26 | jonwil | since my phone DOES work |
| 12:37.33 | jonwil | and DOES get a full day of use most of hte time |
| 12:37.34 | Maxdamantus | Checking compatibility isn't a very good test. |
| 12:37.35 | jonwil | the time |
| 12:37.36 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:37.41 | jonwil | I know that max |
| 12:37.58 | Maxdamantus | not a very good test as in you probably shouldn't even waste your time doing it. |
| 12:38.03 | jonwil | :P |
| 12:38.16 | Maxdamantus | if it really is reputable, then "BL-5J" will be enough information to know that it's compatible. |
| 12:38.38 | jonwil | :) |
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| 12:39.52 | Maxdamantus | Fair dinkum, that is. |
| 12:40.43 | Maxdamantus | sleeps. |
| 12:44.19 | jonwil | wonders if there are many people left writing code for N900 or if everything is dead now |
| 12:44.35 | KotCzarny | jonwil, do you listen to music on n900? |
| 12:44.45 | jonwil | No I dont listen to music on my N900 |
| 12:44.48 | KotCzarny | pity |
| 12:44.54 | jonwil | why is that? |
| 12:45.00 | KotCzarny | otherwise i would show you my audio player |
| 12:45.07 | KotCzarny | do you listen ot music at all? |
| 12:45.29 | KotCzarny | because you can still run my player on some linux box and control it from n900 |
| 12:46.16 | jonwil | The only place I specifically listen to music from my music collection is on my main PC |
| 12:46.55 | KotCzarny | so, wanna check my player? |
| 12:47.25 | jonwil | which happens to be running Windows 7 right now since none of the games I play are on Linux |
| 12:47.38 | KotCzarny | 32 or 64bit? |
| 12:47.53 | jonwil | 64 bit |
| 12:47.57 | jonwil | and no I dont need a new media player |
| 12:48.01 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:48.02 | jonwil | WinAmp works great :) |
| 12:48.13 | KotCzarny | yeah, old school players ftw |
| 12:48.21 | jonwil | for those times when I am not randomly browsing YouTube for cool crap to listen to |
| 12:48.23 | KotCzarny | none of that media library crap |
| 12:49.13 | jonwil | that's the good thing about YouTube, its got so much cool music (especially covers of existing songs) that it would take me years to listen to it all |
| 12:49.20 | jonwil | And more is being uploaded all the time |
| 12:49.39 | KotCzarny | cutetube2 for n900 |
| 12:49.47 | KotCzarny | i think it was still working for youtube |
| 12:50.05 | jonwil | Don't need YouTube on my N900 |
| 12:50.13 | jonwil | Perfectly happy with YT on my desktop |
| 12:50.21 | jonwil | YT on N900 is just a great way to guzzle battery |
| 12:50.23 | jonwil | and mobile data |
| 12:50.32 | KotCzarny | wifi? |
| 12:50.41 | KotCzarny | also, you know about talk.maemo.org ? |
| 12:50.57 | KotCzarny | thats a nice place for checking anything maemo |
| 12:50.59 | jonwil | yes, what about it? |
| 12:51.05 | jonwil | I do know all about it |
| 12:51.08 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:51.10 | jonwil | and have posted many things on that forum |
| 12:51.42 | KotCzarny | and yes, there are still people writing/porting to n900 |
| 12:51.44 | jonwil | I have written a fair bit of N900 code in the past |
| 12:53.11 | buZz | is oscp in repo working yet? |
| 12:53.20 | KotCzarny | buzz, grab one from extras-devel |
| 12:54.01 | KotCzarny | one day i might gather enough active users to vote it into extras |
| 12:54.12 | buZz | gimme link where to click |
| 12:54.16 | buZz | to vote |
| 12:54.44 | KotCzarny | bookmark the oscp's thread, i'll post announcement one day |
| 12:54.53 | KotCzarny | s/bookmark/subscribe/ |
| 12:55.15 | buZz | i'll wait for your announcement :) |
| 12:56.07 | KotCzarny | buzz: what you can do right now is to gather your experiences, feature requests, bugs, etc and post |
| 12:56.27 | buZz | bug; installing ocsp from appmanager doesnt work |
| 12:56.29 | buZz | :) |
| 12:57.03 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:57.04 | jonwil | wonders if the work he did on MCE has been of benefit to the Maemo community |
| 12:57.26 | KotCzarny | workaround: enabling extras-devel temporarily |
| 12:57.38 | KotCzarny | jonwil: ask the cssu people |
| 12:57.52 | jonwil | :) |
| 12:58.07 | KotCzarny | buzz: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_non-free_armel/oscp/0.9.7-26/ |
| 12:58.11 | KotCzarny | link to vote |
| 12:58.31 | buZz | what, i need a user? |
| 12:58.32 | buZz | :( |
| 12:58.46 | KotCzarny | make one? |
| 13:00.07 | buZz | some day |
| 13:00.11 | buZz | doesnt like forums |
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| 14:17.38 | L29Ah | i wonder why doesn't n900 want to charge if it fails to talk via usb |
| 14:23.38 | kerio | because protocols n shit |
| 14:25.22 | erlehmann | my n900 rebooted if it failed to talk |
| 14:31.22 | APic | ⥠|
| 14:32.15 | APic | It probably needs to negotiate higher Current than USB provides per Default i could imagine |
| 14:52.45 | KotCzarny | maybe something gets stuck in the usb and bme doesnt get notification that i can charge |
| 14:52.50 | KotCzarny | *it |
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| 16:13.01 | L29Ah | i wonder if i can force it to charge anyway |
| 16:13.11 | L29Ah | dead microusb cables is a plague :/ |
| 16:17.07 | Sicelo | i2c |
| 16:17.33 | Sicelo | use the charge21 script .. BUT not with PC, use wallcharger only |
| 16:17.38 | APic | You do not own the original Wall-Wart? |
| 16:17.48 | Wizzup | are you sure the usb port is not broken? |
| 16:18.18 | Wizzup | iirc the n900 charges just fine with 'dumb' chargers too |
| 16:18.32 | bencoh | not with all "dumb" chargers |
| 16:18.41 | L29Ah | sure it's not, it works with some other cables |
| 16:18.41 | Wizzup | I think I made a custom usb condom and it worked fine |
| 16:18.51 | Wizzup | which just passes no data |
| 16:18.55 | bencoh | yeah |
| 16:19.00 | L29Ah | and the cables that are fucked up charge my android shit while being unable to talk to it |
| 16:19.12 | bencoh | it depends on the cable (and/or dumbness) |
| 16:19.22 | Wizzup | bencoh: how much more dumb than no data' can it get? |
| 16:20.33 | Sicelo | N900 will charge with any charger if that carger has a short for thr D+ & D- signals |
| 16:22.45 | Sicelo | *charger rather |
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| 17:37.00 | ShadowJK | charge21 doesn't care if charger is smart or dumb |
| 17:37.18 | ShadowJK | It will just try to draw charge at .95A |
| 17:40.17 | KotCzarny | which is what it should do by default |
| 17:43.16 | bencoh | oh ... |
| 17:43.38 | sixwheeledbeast | Not necessarily, you may not want the N900 pulling .95A from whatever you have it plugged into. |
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| 17:46.48 | KotCzarny | swb: shouldnt device be amp regulated anyway and not give more than specced? |
| 17:47.40 | sixwheeledbeast | I am more thinking for example: you have a laptop and wish to copy some files about but not flatten your laptop battery |
| 17:48.14 | KotCzarny | still, usb chip shouldn't give more than specced |
| 17:49.17 | Wizzup | Which is 0.5A |
| 17:49.18 | sixwheeledbeast | agreed but still if in the wall charge I would want as fast as possible charging, if in a USB I probably wouldn't want it to charge. |
| 17:49.22 | Wizzup | unless negiotiated differently |
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| 18:09.42 | ShadowJK | Also, sometimes you can pull .95A from something, if you start low and slowly ramp up |
| 18:10.03 | ShadowJK | I forget if I had that in version 21, though if it's included there, it's only active on start of the script |
| 18:11.21 | kerio | i'm pretty sure that my laptop can do 1A |
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| 18:11.21 | kerio | on a single USB port |
| 18:11.28 | kerio | i don't actually know if it will, however |
| 18:12.41 | kerio | because apple |
| 18:13.16 | KotCzarny | most laptops can do 1A on usb ports |
| 18:13.29 | KotCzarny | and it was preapple thing |
| 18:17.10 | kerio | holy shit i think it can actually do 2100mA |
| 18:17.50 | kerio | Sleep current 2100 |
| 18:18.11 | kerio | ayy lmao |
| 18:20.17 | bencoh | ? |
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| 19:31.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: sure that's not µA ? |
| 19:32.18 | kerio | i'm pretty sure that an ipad would not charge at sub-mA currents |
| 19:32.26 | kerio | no wait |
| 19:32.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | usually Amperes and Volts are in micro-magnitudes |
| 19:32.45 | kerio | is it 2.1 or 0.0021 |
| 19:34.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | no idea where from you got that value anyway, so not even exact semantics of "sleep current" is clear |
| 19:35.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | in USB specs there's a suspend mode iirc, that actually is specified to do sth in the 1 to 2 mA range |
| 19:35.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | for OTG or somesuch |
| 19:36.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are also special charging USB host specs that can do more than the nominal 500mA |
| 19:36.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | supposedly even in device suspend mode |
| 19:38.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | but generally you don't want N900 draw arbitrary too high current from an unidentified unspecified power source. Nokia been very cautious about that, not to break anything which would cause havok on them on a multitude of aspects |
| 19:38.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | and yes, there *are* laptops that simply break when pulling >500mA from USB |
| 19:38.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | very few but there are reports |
| 19:39.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | AFK BBL |
| 20:00.12 | Maxdamantus | `i2cset -y -m 0xFF 2 0x6b 0x04 0x42;` â so would that 0x04 be changed to 0x01 to make it draw 0.65 A instead of 0.95? |
| 20:01.18 | Maxdamantus | would like to try that on some silly solar charger he has, which seems to only charge the N900 with a flimsy cable that came with it. |
| 20:01.35 | Maxdamantus | suspects it has a resistor in it. |
| 20:01.49 | KotCzarny | maxd: there are usb volt/amp meters |
| 20:02.02 | KotCzarny | easy to check how device behaves |
| 20:03.15 | Maxdamantus | wait, no, that line has to do with voltage. |
| 20:04.24 | Humpelstilzchen | Maxdamantus: iirc the d+/d- lines need a special connection |
| 20:04.38 | Humpelstilzchen | both to gnd or something |
| 20:05.23 | Humpelstilzchen | oh, just d+ to d- |
| 20:06.24 | Maxdamantus | and 0x04 is the register. |
| 20:06.25 | KotCzarny | http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-Charger-Doctor-Mobile-Power-Detector-Battery-Tester-Voltage-Current-Meter-/251570967031 |
| 20:06.29 | Maxdamantus | has to leave. |
| 20:06.31 | KotCzarny | something similat to that thing |
| 20:06.38 | KotCzarny | *similar |
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| 20:20.47 | Maxdamantus | Humpelstilzchen: yes, but ShadowJK said charge21 draws 0.95 A regardless. |
| 20:21.16 | Maxdamantus | ie, it's the software that decides not to charge based on the inability to negotiate. |
| 20:22.41 | Maxdamantus | KotCzarny: it'd probbaly be quicker to just connect a multimeter I already have to it. |
| 20:23.20 | KotCzarny | sure, if you dont mind breaking the cable, still, 1.5usd and free shipping |
| 20:23.35 | KotCzarny | and no mess with exposed cables |
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| 20:24.25 | KotCzarny | and you can check all the devices you have for real amp draw |
| 20:25.05 | KotCzarny | not only for charging, but peripherials too |
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