IRC log for #maemo on 20140814

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17:06.55*** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet
17:06.56*** mode/#maemo [+v infobot] by ChanServ
17:07.08DocScrutinizer51~factinfo flatbatrecover
17:07.08infoboterror: you do not have enough flags for that. (o required)
17:07.08infobotflatbatrecover -- created by DocScrutinizer <~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg> at Mon Jul 26 02:02:58 2010 (1480 days); last modified at Fri Aug  1 20:48:27 2014 by DocScrutinizer05!~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg; it has been requested 87 times, last by kerio, 4d 9h 50m 54s ago.
17:07.16APicDocScrutinizer05 can fix everything ­ even reanimate the Dead.
17:07.33keriopraise the doc
17:12.07kerioAPic: PRAISE HIM
17:12.22APicfalls on his Knees and praises epic DocScrutinizer05.
17:12.46*** join/#maemo Kabouik (~quassel@221.77.69.86.rev.sfr.net)
17:12.49DocScrutinizer51damnstop that!
17:13.29kerioaww
17:13.31keriohe's so...
17:13.33keriomodest
17:13.44kerio(and by that i mean slow and fat)
17:16.05APic☺
17:17.03kerioi wonder if there's a way to make irssi stop sending data until you're mentioned
17:18.46APicProbably not hard to script.
17:18.57APicNot that hard to Patch the C Core either prolly…
17:19.04DocScrutinizer51irssi? *sending* data?
17:19.37DocScrutinizer51I guess you wanna talk to ShadowJK
17:19.46DocScrutinizer51anbout netfilters
17:20.25APicB)
17:22.09kerioDocScrutinizer51: either through irssi_proxy or on the terminal itself
17:22.59keriofor your weird-ass workflow
17:23.07keriowhere you keep your n900 locked with xchat open
17:25.46DocScrutinizer51meh
17:25.49bencohactually irssi doesnt send that much
17:26.04bencoh(well, ssh/screen/irssi at least)
17:26.05DocScrutinizer51ZNC and netfilter rule, ask ShadowJK
17:26.27ShadowJKIt's not the data that's the issue, it's the frequency
17:26.35DocScrutinizer51yep
17:26.48ShadowJK1 byte of data every 5 second consumes approximately same amount of power as 10Mbit/s data for 5s
17:26.49DocScrutinizer51the 'kee TX alive' pinga
17:26.56bencohsure
17:27.17bencohbut you dont need to send keepalives if irssi is at the other end of your ssh ;)
17:27.20DocScrutinizer51the 'keep TX alive' pings
17:27.39DocScrutinizer51check TCP
17:28.04bencohyeah, default tcp timeout is way higher
17:28.11kerioyeah you definetely want a clean tcp connection
17:28.17keriodoes ssl have keepalives?
17:28.32DocScrutinizer51even when UMTS itself doesn't send ACK (which I guess it foes)
17:28.36bencohyou can even put your laptop to sleep and wake it a few hours later and see your ssh session come back to life
17:28.44keriofair enough
17:28.51bencohssh on 2G is fine here at least
17:29.01bencoh(battery-wise ... and user experience wise as well)
17:29.13keriois there a netfilter way to only do data bursts?
17:29.18DocScrutinizer512G is fine
17:29.24DocScrutinizer513G is a hog
17:29.29kerioalso, can you enable/disable that on screen lock/unlock
17:29.31DocScrutinizer51ask ShadowJK
17:30.22DocScrutinizer51for each data in, you'll send an ACK or sth on several OSI levels
17:30.50DocScrutinizer51and that single package keeps 3G TX active for10s
17:31.03DocScrutinizer51or 5, or 15
17:31.04bencohexactly, when you send/receive data :)
17:31.12ShadowJKJust having a TCP connection open doesn't consume any significant amount of power
17:31.24bencohif ssh has nothing to tell you and you have nothing to tell, everything's fine ;)
17:31.42ShadowJKtcp keepalives default to off almost everywhere
17:32.13DocScrutinizer51ShadowJK: I'm talking of ACKs
17:32.30bencohacks dont cost much, since you're already sending/receiving
17:32.43ShadowJKWell your phone is going to be transmitting whether there are ACKs on IP level or not
17:33.10kerioDocScrutinizer51: some nokia phones have a way to disable hspa
17:33.14bencoh(it costs when your link is lossy ... but then you want data to go through :)
17:33.29DocScrutinizer51bencoh: nope
17:33.41bencohnope what ?
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17:34.53kerionope
17:37.13DocScrutinizer51ShadowJK: exactly what I said
17:38.35DocScrutinizer51data in means sending. So to make sending less frequent you bundle your inbound-to-mobile data into bursts on proxy. U use netfilters for that
17:40.13DocScrutinizer51you trigger out of pace flush of buffer and temporary reduction of bundling window to 1s down from 60 when your proxy finds highlights in data
17:41.51DocScrutinizer51ShadowJK: wasnt it you who had a netfiler script for that?
17:42.12DocScrutinizer51(without the nifty highlight detecting)
17:42.29ShadowJKyes
17:42.49ShadowJKjust iptables -j DROP on the proxy server for a little while
17:43.18*** part/#maemo mkaindl (~mkaindl@ama-dablam.markus-kaindl.de)
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17:44.30DocScrutinizer51iptables, ipchains, netfilters, I wonder how many names this stuff had already
17:45.17DocScrutinizer51DROP?
17:45.24keriotcp is cool
17:45.28kerioit'll deal with it
17:45.40DocScrutinizer51wouldn"t that lose data?
17:45.45kerioof course not
17:46.05kerioREJECT would close connections
17:46.07kerioDROP is silent
17:46.12keriopackets get dropped
17:46.22keriowhich means "rate too high, try again more slowly plz"
17:46.53DocScrutinizer51which is sth freenode prolly won5 do, eh?
17:47.57kerioit's how tcp *works*
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17:48.01DocScrutinizer51meh, I'm 40m from atlantic ocean here, shouldn't worry aout TCP flooding
17:48.16kerioyeah if there's some flooding just throw it in the ocean
17:48.23kerioseriously tho
17:48.36keriodropping packets when the rate's too high is how tcp adjusts the transfer rate
17:48.50DocScrutinizer51yeah
17:49.05keriothere MUST be no adverse effects to dropping packets for a bit
17:49.16DocScrutinizer51until you TX stack gets a timeout on missing ACK
17:49.21keriowell ok
17:50.07ShadowJKTCP tp Mars wouldn't work because of the latency, but maybe a tenth of the way to mars
17:51.13DocScrutinizer51qhat we're talking here? max distance to mars (roundabout 15min)?
17:51.39ShadowJKOh I see, 5 minutes by default, reconfigurable thgouh RFC 5482.. though that one is newer than N900 :)
17:51.45DocScrutinizer51or minimum which is maybed 1min
17:52.20keriothere's that big of a difference? :O
17:52.33DocScrutinizer51pff sure
17:52.34keriooh of course there is
17:52.35kerioi'm dumb
17:52.44kerioopposite sides of the sun
17:52.49DocScrutinizer51yep
17:53.10keriowhy can't these fucking dumb planets just rotate around the sun every 24 hours
17:53.23DocScrutinizer51lol
17:53.50honestlywhy is the power draw going down to under 100mA o.O
17:53.59honestlywhile it's still charging
17:54.01DocScrutinizer51because that would cause really nasry climate on earth
17:54.28DocScrutinizer51honestly: please ask better questions
17:54.34honestlyokay, let me try
17:55.14honestlyhow much power does the n900 typically use when all peripherals (gps, 3g, etc.) and the screen is turned off?
17:55.20keriovery little
17:55.23ShadowJK6,A
17:55.28ShadowJK4-6mA
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17:56.06honestlywell, the phone modem is on
17:56.15ShadowJKUSB connected counts as peripheral activated in some circumstances too :)
17:56.34DocScrutinizer51indeed
17:56.53DocScrutinizer51eating up to 80mA
17:56.55ShadowJKmodem in standby doesn't add too much
17:57.11DocScrutinizer51some 15mA usually
17:57.29DocScrutinizer51err more like 10
17:57.54DocScrutinizer51~power
17:57.54infoboti guess power is http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Power_Consumption
17:59.29DocScrutinizer51honestly: also please check what means CCCV charging
18:00.43DocScrutinizer51honestly: and keep in mind that USB has 5V which get *transformed* into 3.x to 4.2V for battery charging
18:01.16honestlyah
18:02.58DocScrutinizer51with an efficiency of 80 to 95percent
18:03.20APic=)
18:04.46DocScrutinizer51and the bq27200 logs are on battery level
18:04.54DocScrutinizer51not USB
18:13.58DocScrutinizer51notes that there's no easily found wiki page about charging and bme (hw level) and bq24150
18:16.46DocScrutinizer51~wiki cccv
18:18.15kerioDocScrutinizer51: why can't we
18:18.16keriolike, as a species
18:18.21keriomake batteries that charge at 5V
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18:18.57ShadowJKIt's chemistry, not numerology
18:19.12kerioi didn't ask you!
18:19.17DocScrutinizer51exactly
18:19.41DocScrutinizer51actually electrochemical volyage ?
18:20.10*** join/#maemo shentey (~shentey@f052194213.adsl.alicedsl.de)
18:20.20DocScrutinizer51why would you want batteries that charge at 5V?
18:20.23ShadowJKeven if it existed, it wouldn't take long before someone maade electronics run at 4V/8V instead of 5V
18:20.54ShadowJKSo you could LDO comfortably on the battery voltage ;D
18:20.54DocScrutinizer51that would be pretty annoying since then USB voltage doesn't suffuce
18:22.15DocScrutinizer51for now a simple buck converter suffices to charge LiIon from USB
18:23.02DocScrutinizer51with LiXy Voltage higher than 4.2V you need a buck-boost
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18:23.53DocScrutinizer51;-P
18:24.11APic8☺
18:24.18APicWhat is Channel Mode +C in FreeNode?
18:24.29APicAh gosh, i'll look it up on teh™ Intarwebs
18:25.08APicCTCP-Block, ok
18:25.15DocScrutinizer51actually voltage is so marmelade, it's just about Wh/kg resp /volume
18:25.18APicSo my Smiley came through in yellow?
18:26.02DocScrutinizer51yes
18:28.06*** join/#maemo shentey (~shentey@f052194213.adsl.alicedsl.de)
18:28.08DocScrutinizer51but anybody abusing channel colors too much is begging for a kick
18:28.19Humpelstilzchenwhy?
18:28.50DocScrutinizer51because it alreadybeen a discussion to enable colors at all
18:29.26APiclol
18:29.28DocScrutinizer51and your wird char for example doesn't make it to my client
18:29.32APicic
18:30.38DocScrutinizer51colors are kinda deprecated on irc
18:31.11DocScrutinizer51I hardly could see that smiley
18:31.20APicOh
18:31.33APicYou did not mean the Smiley by „weird Char”.
18:31.50DocScrutinizer51no, I meant Humpelstilzchen
18:32.18DocScrutinizer51I guess that been a faied 'color'
18:32.26DocScrutinizer51failed even
18:33.03APicIt was Blink.
18:33.20DocScrutinizer51whatever... gibberish here
18:35.06DocScrutinizer51fsk wikipedia which doesn't know CCCV either
18:35.52DocScrutinizer51but FSFE is Farmacias sin Fronteras Espania
18:36.07DocScrutinizer51;-P
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18:40.15DocScrutinizer51honestly: you want to rea about LiIon battery charging using ConstantCurrent ConstantVoltage charging concept
18:40.25DocScrutinizer51read*
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18:50.54honestlyI don't, I just want to know whether my n900 is performing inside safe parameters :P
18:51.18DocScrutinizer51it always does
18:51.56DocScrutinizer51otherwise Nokia wouldn't dare to sell it
18:51.57APic=]
18:51.59APicTrue.
18:52.19DocScrutinizer51unless you overclock it
18:52.27honestlysometimes things break
18:52.34DocScrutinizer51no
18:52.36honestlysuch as the usb receptacle (:
18:52.45DocScrutinizer51actually not this way
18:54.08DocScrutinizer51and it doesn't make sense to come to this palce and ask about random numbers to verify that nothing is broken
18:54.51DocScrutinizer51as long as you don't face obvious trouble, just assume all is fine
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22:22.31useretailhello, is anyone here alive?
22:23.11kerionope
22:23.14keriowe're all dead
22:23.41keriowaiting on the rapture
22:23.50useretailhow to play mp3 file instead of microphone output during call?
22:24.03keriomh, have you tried just playing it?
22:24.14kerioapart for that, i'm not entirely sure
22:24.25keriothere's ways to record the audio call, so there's probably a way to also redirect it
22:25.18useretailno, i haven't tried it, but i don't think person will hear it
22:27.05useretailis there a way to detect the moment when someone picks up the phone during call?
22:27.41useretaili mean does n900 detects that somehow?
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