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| 05:18.07 | b1101 | well, I'm making offers for an n900 on ebay. |
| 05:18.18 | b1101 | I want my baby back |
| 05:19.11 | Luke-Jr | Mozilla still has a ton <.< |
| 05:19.35 | b1101 | huh |
| 05:20.20 | b1101 | are they selling them somewhere ? |
| 05:20.48 | Luke-Jr | no, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=701784 |
| 05:20.49 | povbot | 04Bug 701784: was not found. |
| 05:22.29 | b1101 | ah |
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| 11:40.32 | ShadowJK | I wonder if anyone has tried changing rootfs compression from lzo to libz... |
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| 11:43.18 | zammy | hello DocScrutinizer where is the xterm config file? |
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| 15:13.13 | _ade_ | sixwheeledbeast: ping |
| 15:13.34 | sixwheeledbeast | _ade_: ping |
| 15:13.41 | sixwheeledbeast | pong even |
| 15:14.44 | _ade_ | could you download/install easylist once more using the dropbox link? |
| 15:15.18 | sixwheeledbeast | ok |
| 15:18.27 | _ade_ | and then: mv /home/user/.config/EasyList/listItems.conf /home/user/.config/EasyList/listItems.conf.old |
| 15:18.41 | _ade_ | to start with a fresh item list |
| 15:22.05 | sixwheeledbeast | done, still the same with the strike-through |
| 15:24.49 | _ade_ | if you start it using /opt/easylist/bin/easylist, does it throw any specific errors? |
| 15:25.19 | _ade_ | once you do a clean command |
| 15:25.41 | _ade_ | btw: you are using the thumb version? |
| 15:27.23 | sixwheeledbeast | no not thumb on this device, BTW |
| 15:28.56 | _ade_ | when I should test the non-thumb again. I assumed thumb use. |
| 15:30.30 | sixwheeledbeast | I have a few devices with different setups. I can try the thumb one if that would help? |
| 15:30.50 | _ade_ | lemme test non-thumb first |
| 15:32.57 | _ade_ | works fine here... |
| 15:33.52 | _ade_ | but you could try the latest thumb one on a different device if you want |
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| 15:34.51 | sixwheeledbeast | mmm... I will. I just don't understand how only I have the issue |
| 15:35.53 | _ade_ | yeah, and you experience it not just with the ubuntu font. |
| 15:36.21 | _ade_ | you have seen no error messages, right? |
| 15:37.44 | sixwheeledbeast | not tested for error messages yet. installing thumb one on thumb device now. I have tested on device with standard fonts and it's the same yes. |
| 15:38.53 | _ade_ | really curious how that works out |
| 15:39.20 | sixwheeledbeast | thumb is the same with the strike-through |
| 15:39.55 | sixwheeledbeast | so this is reproduced on three different devices now |
| 15:40.13 | _ade_ | O~o |
| 15:40.53 | sixwheeledbeast | mmm, indeed |
| 15:41.24 | _ade_ | okay, I will like at the code and see if I can find something strange |
| 15:41.43 | _ade_ | s/like/look |
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| 15:44.10 | sixwheeledbeast | FWIW the ghost strike-through disappears if you edit the list again. |
| 15:44.28 | sixwheeledbeast | no obvious errors in terminal either |
| 15:45.57 | _ade_ | you could try and see what the extras-devel version does |
| 15:46.08 | sixwheeledbeast | k |
| 15:49.55 | _ade_ | wait a minute, I can reproduce it! Looks like it is related to some config settings |
| 15:50.38 | _ade_ | Can you activate sort A-Z? |
| 15:51.26 | _ade_ | Then it should not happen |
| 16:05.39 | _ade_ | sixwheeledbeast: I updated the TMO post and will try to fix it. Thanks for testing ^^^ |
| 16:06.55 | sixwheeledbeast | _ade_: sorry I was busy, do you need me to test something? |
| 16:08.39 | _ade_ | activate sort A-Z in the latest version and see if it helps |
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| 16:12.15 | sixwheeledbeast | yes, that's it :) |
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| 16:12.57 | sixwheeledbeast | _ade_: np, anytime |
| 16:17.25 | sixwheeledbeast | FWIW it's not reproducible in 0.3.31 with A-Z on or off |
| 16:21.35 | _ade_ | sixwheeledbeast: okay, then I must have introduced it. I always work with sort A-Z and checked to bottom, so I can always miss such things. |
| 16:22.33 | sixwheeledbeast | yes, well that's what testing is for, everyone likes things set differently |
| 16:24.03 | sixwheeledbeast | BTW I never used willem's version, I think you have made everything a lot tidier. The checkboxes don't look great. |
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| 16:24.55 | sixwheeledbeast | I guess the idea behind the icons is to avoid the need for translations |
| 16:28.00 | _ade_ | The checkboxes eat a bit to much space. Once the line is too long, the list starts "floating" horizontally. |
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| 16:29.48 | _ade_ | And I liked the icons. They use a bit less space than the text (I added the pick list as extra) and saves possible translation indeed. |
| 16:31.32 | sixwheeledbeast | :nod: |
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| 16:35.57 | _ade_ | sixwheeledbeast: going to fire up cooktimer to prepare some food :-), bye |
| 16:36.24 | sixwheeledbeast | _ade_: bye, enjoy :) |
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| 17:35.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | what we learned (today??): testing an app doesn't mean "make sure it works for me with my particular set of options/parameters", a developer shall test *all* options and parameters before shipping their product |
| 17:36.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | of course including all error handling |
| 17:37.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's a reason for the widely accepted calculation that assigns >50% of the development effort to testing |
| 17:39.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | maemo QA in extras-testing is NOT about those tests, it just is supposed to check that this testing actually been done |
| 17:39.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | done by developer |
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| 18:48.22 | sixwheeledbeast | I think that's a bit unfair. Things can get over looked accidentally, the issue was relative minor and unnoticed by everyone but myself. The package was inherited, plus it's not even in -devel yet, it's still a .deb beta in a post. We are not talking about a development team here, just one person wishing to contribute something useful. |
| 18:52.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: it wasn't meant as bashing, just a general remark that felt loosely related. I've seen this negligence in testing in ~90% of all packages getting published, not only in maemo even. |
| 18:53.09 | sixwheeledbeast | :nod: |
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| 18:54.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's rather a pretty commonly found difference between commercial products and FOSS, with the latter generally performing pretty poor on the much-hated testing duties |
| 18:55.06 | sixwheeledbeast | it seems with a lot of things there are so many options, the world is a beta tester. |
| 18:55.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | doesn't work |
| 18:55.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | this is not about beta-testing |
| 18:56.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | this is about testframes |
| 18:56.17 | Humpelstilzchen | Funny, there is enough commercial Software out there which looks pretty untested for me |
| 18:56.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | about systematically checking each segment of your code |
| 18:56.56 | sixwheeledbeast | Commerical products should have more funds to sink into testing |
| 18:57.06 | Humpelstilzchen | not really |
| 18:57.24 | Humpelstilzchen | time to market etc |
| 18:57.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | Humpelstilzchen: yes, a lot of commercial software falls short on testing as well, but only if the company is pretty clueless about QA and doesn't care about own reputation |
| 18:58.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | in *professional* sw-development there are standard procedures like code-coverage-check etc |
| 18:59.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | module tests |
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| 19:00.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | defining test scenario and the needed tools are part of the architectural design of each piece of software |
| 19:01.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | often the testframe is larger than the "payload" code you develop |
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| 19:05.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | IOW the developer not only writes a lib or function, but also a comprehensive set of testing framework that checks/tests the correct behavior of that lib/function particularly (but not only) in extreme sitautions like paramaters out of bound, low memory etc pp |
| 19:08.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | then using this testframe you run tests against your lib/function while you check it for memleaks, for code-coverage (make sure each single line of code got "covered" i.e. executed and thus tested for correct operation), and whatnot else |
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| 19:09.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | thus in the end often development of the payload code (the lib/function itself) is only 25% of the work the developer has to do |
| 19:10.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | ret is testing and *documentation* |
| 19:10.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | rest* |
| 19:11.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | peer review is another mandatory part of developing professional software |
| 19:11.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | only *after* all that been accomplished, you start beta-testing |
| 19:13.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | waiting for the 100% warranted reply by random FOSS hacker: "but then we wouldn't publish *any* software ever! we can't do that, too much work" |
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| 19:14.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | (ambiguity of "warranted" on purpose) |
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| 19:21.48 | sixwheeledbeast | That was the point I was making before, I agree with the above. |
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| 20:32.07 | Ashley` | Is somewhere VirtualBox image with Debian or Ubuntu and Maemo SDK installed available for download? |
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| 20:43.10 | sixwheeledbeast | Ashley`: I installed them separately. I used Debian Squeeze |
| 20:48.46 | sixwheeledbeast | FIQ: seems there are more reports of odd battery applet behaviour. I still think it's a placebo and it's the usual BME throwing a fit. |
| 20:49.06 | sixwheeledbeast | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=80525&page=41 |
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| 21:09.27 | Satorin | My battery never charges over 90%, and sometimes the percentage randomly increases during use... |
| 21:09.32 | Satorin | What a mysterious thing it is. |
| 21:10.55 | ShadowJK | The default battery meter is confused |
| 21:11.10 | ShadowJK | and it gets worse with older batteries |
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| 21:24.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | Ashley`: there's a VM available |
| 21:25.01 | Ashley` | where? |
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| 21:26.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~skeiron |
| 21:26.13 | infobot | hmm... skeiron is the semi-official backup and emergency standin for all internet borne maemo resources: http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/ http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1315143#post1315143, or see: ~tabletsdev |
| 21:30.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation#Installing_Maemo_5_SDK_on_non-Linux_operating_systems |
| 21:30.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_SDK_Virtual_Images |
| 21:32.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/maemo-dev-env-downloads.php replacing nokia by skeiron |
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| 21:35.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/maemo_dev_env_downloads/ |
| 21:35.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | pretty hard to find |
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| 21:43.58 | Ashley` | thanks C: |
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| 21:51.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | LOL @ http://privatepaste.com/2c71f04d93 in http://developer.nokia.com/info/sw.nokia.com/id/c05693a1-265c-4c7f-a389-fc227db4c465/Maemo_5_SDK.html "SDK installer ()" |
| 21:53.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemovmware.garage.maemo.org/2nd_edition/ seems thoroughly outdated / obsolete too |
| 21:55.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | I admit it feels lile maemo/nokia does all to alien newcomers |
| 21:55.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | like |
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| 22:34.53 | b1101 | does fmms work well ? |
| 22:35.59 | mad_dev | What are the minimal xorg packages other than core common video driver mouse keyboard that are actually required for usage? |
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| 23:18.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | b1101: it at least is supposed to work, yes |
| 23:18.39 | int_ua | is there only one defaults.list on maemo? |
| 23:19.09 | int_ua | I'm having this problem: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1334985 |
| 23:19.32 | int_ua | but only on one N900 |
| 23:21.09 | int_ua | ok, looks like it was URL-escaped on the problematic one |
| 23:31.36 | int_ua | but copying file from the working one didn't fix the problem |
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