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| 00:15.36 | Sysaxed` | what is the minimum voltage of bl-5j battery when it is discharged? |
| 00:16.02 | Sysaxed` | highest possible one seems to be around 4.1V |
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| 00:18.23 | kwtm | Need some pointers on how to create pop-up dialog boxes on the N900. I'm trying to write a script, executing in the background (thus terminal window might not be open) to pop up a msgbox or something at a preset time. (My google-fu is not as strong as I had hoped -- hard to filter out irrelevant results on search results.) |
| 00:19.11 | Sysaxed` | kwtm: have you tried this? http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control#Notifications |
| 00:19.34 | kwtm | to clarify: I'm writing a shell script. Prefer the "sh" but at this moment I happen to be writing for bash. |
| 00:19.34 | kwtm | Sysaxed`: Will look into this, Thx. |
| 00:20.29 | kwtm | Sysaxed`: On first glance, looks like what I need. Will play around. Thx! |
| 00:20.42 | Sysaxed` | kwtm: yeah |
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| 00:20.57 | Sysaxed` | kwtm: also there was some package that did all that for you |
| 00:21.21 | Sysaxed` | I mean, super-long dbus commands don't look clean |
| 00:21.34 | Sysaxed` | but there was some script that wrapped it |
| 00:21.42 | kwtm | Sysaxed`: I came across that under "Hildon-Extras". Since I have an extra N900 with barebones functionality as a backup, I'd prefer to use built-in. |
| 00:21.48 | kwtm | But it's useful to know. |
| 00:21.52 | Sysaxed` | :) |
| 00:22.07 | kwtm | In fact, what I'm doing is replacing that limited alarm notification that's built in to the N900 |
| 00:22.56 | ShadowJK | Sysaxed`; bme shuts device down at approximately 3.2-3,3V. Hardware shutdown at 2.8V (before that though, the modem starts browning out and rebooting). Battery minimum voltage is somewhere just below 2.8, after which battery's own protection circuit will kick in and shut it off. |
| 00:22.57 | kwtm | It takes about 4 or 5 screen taps (with waiting in between) just to set an alarm for "remind me in 1 hour". :P |
| 00:23.32 | kwtm | ShadowJK: Talking about the N900 battery? What's the nominal voltage? |
| 00:23.38 | ShadowJK | Significant time (days-weeks) spent at low voltage significantly degrades battery performance |
| 00:25.02 | ShadowJK | Charge voltage 4.2, most of energy depleted at 3.2 .. 3.2 + (4.2-3.2)/2 = 3.7V |
| 00:25.40 | kwtm | ShadowJK: ok thx |
| 00:26.48 | Sysaxed` | ShadowJK: thank you! |
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| 01:26.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sysaxed`: I didn't know of any not so long dbus-send commands |
| 01:27.16 | Sysaxed` | DocScrutinizer05: there was a script that was doing dbus communication |
| 01:27.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | seems there's no way to create a valid reasonably short dbus-send command |
| 01:27.30 | Sysaxed` | DocScrutinizer05: so instead of doing dbus stuff directly you can call that script |
| 01:27.45 | Sysaxed` | DocScrutinizer05: same thing, but at least you don't have a mess in your script :) |
| 01:27.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't see how that could possibly help |
| 01:28.45 | Sysaxed` | um, it had pretty readable command line arguments |
| 01:28.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | you still need busname, client name(?), function name, all three friggin long artifacts |
| 01:29.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, you can use env vars |
| 01:29.18 | Sysaxed` | sure, but you're doing it indirectly |
| 01:29.34 | Sysaxed` | you're not following me, let me find it.. |
| 01:29.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | like dbus-send $param |
| 01:30.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | and |
| 01:30.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | param=$dest $path $funtion $param |
| 01:30.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | err |
| 01:30.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | param=$dest $path $funtion $payload |
| 01:31.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | and dest=--dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications |
| 01:31.16 | Sysaxed` | o, that one |
| 01:31.17 | Sysaxed` | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=60251 |
| 01:31.37 | Sysaxed` | it provides you a nice interface over the same dbus commands |
| 01:31.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | path=/org/freedesktop/Notifications |
| 01:32.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | function=org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteDialog |
| 01:32.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | payload='string:"QUESTION?" uint32:4 string:"OK"' |
| 01:34.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | aah, phonecontrol script |
| 01:34.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | well |
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| 01:34.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | sounds abit like overkill |
| 01:37.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~3.2 + (4.2-3.2)/2 |
| 01:37.24 | infobot | 3.7 |
| 01:38.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | I need a break. This formula looks correct but weird |
| 01:40.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | 3.2 + (4.2-3.2)/2 = (3.2 * 2 + 4.2 - 3.2) /2 |
| 01:40.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | =(3.2 + 4.2)/ |
| 01:41.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | =(3.2 + 4.2)/2 rather |
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| 05:54.51 | natsukao1 | hi |
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| 06:13.13 | natsukao1 | i need help |
| 06:13.25 | natsukao1 | can anyone help me ? |
| 06:14.17 | natsukao1 | when i boguht in 2006 the nokia 770, there was by default its own firmware |
| 06:15.15 | natsukao1 | then readin on the web i saw that were possible to gain privilegies of root, and to do became the device r&d |
| 06:15.52 | natsukao1 | i did and went ok, today it works again, only the battery is to change |
| 06:16.09 | natsukao1 | but i have an important query for you |
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| 06:16.55 | natsukao1 | 24 december 2013 my aunt and my uncle did as gift a mobile phone mediacom mp720m |
| 06:19.54 | natsukao1 | after to have searched on line, i installed the packages: bosybox free; busybox installer; connectbot; f-droid; framaroot; Libre FM; OpenVPN ; Root Verifier; SuperSU; Terminal Emulator; VimTouch; VLC; Yaaic |
| 06:20.35 | natsukao1 | it is a mobile phone with Android 4.1, i would like to know how to set up r&d |
| 06:20.56 | natsukao1 | do you know how to do on Android ? |
| 06:28.24 | bef0rd | r&d mode is a maemo thing |
| 06:30.08 | bef0rd | on android to get root you use 1. exploits 2. unlocked bootloaders not sure what else, you have to search for your specific device |
| 06:33.47 | natsukao1 | eh eh |
| 06:33.48 | natsukao1 | :-) |
| 06:33.48 | natsukao1 | this is the problem |
| 06:33.48 | natsukao1 | seems i am the thir person in the www which is working on it |
| 06:40.25 | bef0rd | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85JdFgSgtWI |
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| 06:59.58 | natsukao1 | i am replying to that short movie |
| 07:29.14 | natsukao1 | i know thanks to adb, and thanks to busybox, which are the specs of my hardware, then i installed cpu-z, it was only a package that is a little more complete than cat /proc/cpuinfo and cat/proc/meminfo |
| 07:29.27 | natsukao1 | but really does the same things |
| 07:32.33 | natsukao1 | i love you "dmsg" |
| 07:32.46 | natsukao1 | i love you "busybox" |
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| 11:49.15 | Sicelo | please help me with setting up Scratchbox |
| 11:50.16 | Sicelo | seems to be installed ok, but now i need the Nokia binaries. I don't know how to get around set 12.1/12.2 in http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation |
| 11:50.41 | Sicelo | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation#Installing_Maemo_5_SDK_using_Text-based_Installer rather |
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| 12:01.32 | Hurrian | alright, i gotta admit it, i take back everything I said about MAFW sucking hard. |
| 12:01.54 | Hurrian | after trying to go android for a few days, I simply can't. |
| 12:02.21 | Hurrian | believe it or not, Android is more broken than Maemo/MeeGo is. |
| 12:02.55 | Hurrian | among others, the sound pipeline just breaks when having multiple streams playing at the same time D: |
| 12:03.48 | SiceloSB | you sure it's not just the android device you tested on? |
| 12:04.04 | Hurrian | SiceloSB: GalaxyS2 and Note 2. |
| 12:04.13 | SiceloSB | :p |
| 12:04.27 | Hurrian | I usually have them sitting on my desk, either as portable internet browsers, or dev devices. |
| 12:04.57 | Hurrian | before I tried them out, I had my N9 as a daily driver phone - and as a phone it is amazing. |
| 12:05.29 | SiceloSB | that's great. Maemo ftw! |
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| 12:05.32 | Hurrian | can't really say much for its use outside that, but you can see the amount of polish Harmattan has. |
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| 12:07.40 | SiceloSB | i'm still on N900, as a daily (and only) device |
| 12:07.46 | SiceloSB | still loving it |
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| 12:10.07 | SiceloSB | Hurrian: would you be able to help me in connection with Scratchbox? |
| 12:11.22 | Hurrian | SiceloSB: What issue, exactly? |
| 12:11.25 | Sicelo | 11:49 < Sicelo> please help me with setting up Scratchbox |
| 12:11.27 | Sicelo | 11:50 < Sicelo> seems to be installed ok, but now i need the Nokia binaries. I don't know how to get around set 12.1/12.2 in |
| 12:11.32 | Sicelo | 11:50 < Sicelo> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation#Installing_Maemo_5_SDK_using_Text-based_Installer |
| 12:11.51 | SiceloSB | can't figure out how the get the nokia binaries installed |
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| 12:13.53 | Hurrian | shouldn't it be up at skeiron? |
| 12:14.25 | SiceloSB | i can't really tell which ones :$ |
| 12:15.41 | Hurrian | deb http://skeiron.org/repo/repository.maemo.org/ fremantle/4bc37c7c77ebe90177c050b805a8dc79 nokia-binaries ? |
| 12:17.31 | Sicelo | yay! that looks like it. thanks. let me see what happens |
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| 12:23.59 | Sicelo | thankssss :) |
| 12:24.04 | Sicelo | installing atm |
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| 12:28.00 | Sicelo | quick one, is it ok to put this on the wiki, or it we just don't want to get in 'trouble' with nokia? |
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| 13:09.06 | antithesis_ | Is there a Maemo device with both a capacitive touch screen and a hardware keyboard? |
| 13:09.27 | antithesis_ | Or can I see a list of Maemo devices somewhere? |
| 13:09.31 | Hurrian | antithesis_: if the N950 counts, then it is |
| 13:09.49 | antithesis_ | Why would it not count? |
| 13:10.06 | antithesis_ | Oh, because I can't get one for myself |
| 13:10.06 | antithesis_ | Hmpf. |
| 13:11.22 | antithesis_ | A resistive touch screen means no multi-touch, right? |
| 13:11.32 | Hurrian | yep. |
| 13:17.16 | SiceloSB | Hurrian: is it 'normal |
| 13:17.52 | SiceloSB | Hurrian: is it 'normal' to not have XTerm when starting the UI framework with the i386 target in Scratchbox? |
| 13:18.26 | Hurrian | SiceloSB: should be included, try installing the package |
| 13:19.44 | SiceloSB | ok. thanks. will see. otherwise the basic UI does load :) |
| 13:21.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | SiceloSB: possibly the latter |
| 13:21.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | to your quick one |
| 13:22.41 | SiceloSB | ok DocScrutinizer05. i wanted to put it in the wiki. guess we'll leave it as it is |
| 13:23.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | otoh, who cares |
| 13:23.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | go ahead |
| 13:26.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | I heard all that stuff is on torrents as well, and probably also on a dozen of other mirrors |
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| 13:34.26 | antithesis_ | Can Maemo be used primarily with the keyboard, without generally using the touch screen? |
| 13:34.50 | FIQ | touchscreen is needed |
| 13:35.05 | FIQ | there's unusually many keyboard shortcuts |
| 13:35.25 | FIQ | compared to most hw-kbd:ed phones |
| 13:35.28 | FIQ | but you can't avoid the touchscreen fully |
| 13:35.28 | antithesis_ | What are examples of things I can't do without the touch screen? |
| 13:35.47 | FIQ | well |
| 13:36.04 | FIQ | fire up programs which lack shortcuts |
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| 13:36.16 | FIQ | as a start |
| 13:36.37 | FIQ | use the browser |
| 13:36.54 | FIQ | close programs |
| 13:37.17 | FIQ | (unless you go via xterm, which is silly) |
| 13:37.30 | antithesis_ | Nah, xterm is fine |
| 13:37.31 | FIQ | etc |
| 13:37.37 | FIQ | the list goes on |
| 13:37.40 | antithesis_ | I'll just pkill all the programs |
| 13:37.45 | FIQ | xterm... for closing apps? |
| 13:37.47 | FIQ | why |
| 13:37.54 | FIQ | also |
| 13:37.58 | antithesis_ | Because it lets me avoid the touch screen |
| 13:38.03 | FIQ | you can use xterm to start apps too |
| 13:38.05 | FIQ | : |
| 13:38.07 | FIQ | *:D |
| 13:38.21 | FIQ | but applications which require TS use |
| 13:38.22 | antithesis_ | Can I switch between applications without using the touch screen? |
| 13:38.30 | FIQ | obviously wont work w/o one |
| 13:38.40 | antithesis_ | What's TS? |
| 13:38.45 | FIQ | Not sure - iirc there was some application which allowed you to |
| 13:38.51 | FIQ | with ctrl+directions |
| 13:38.57 | FIQ | touch screen |
| 13:39.02 | antithesis_ | oh |
| 13:39.11 | FIQ | but |
| 13:39.22 | FIQ | using N900 w/o touch screen |
| 13:39.27 | FIQ | cripples you badly |
| 13:39.36 | FIQ | any particular reason you want to do this? |
| 13:39.42 | FIQ | also |
| 13:39.44 | antithesis_ | Because I hate touch screens. :) |
| 13:39.49 | FIQ | if you have a locked SIM |
| 13:39.59 | FIQ | good luck getting past PIN entry |
| 13:40.14 | FIQ | not sure you can write it with the keyboard |
| 13:40.35 | FIQ | but yes |
| 13:40.37 | antithesis_ | Can I see a list of packages available for Maemo through apt somewhere? |
| 13:40.48 | FIQ | if you passionately refuse to use the touchscreen |
| 13:40.55 | FIQ | you can |
| 13:40.58 | FIQ | but it wont be fun |
| 13:41.01 | FIQ | just saying |
| 13:41.05 | FIQ | well |
| 13:41.15 | FIQ | there's apt-cache search | less |
| 13:41.28 | antithesis_ | Yeah, but I don't have a Maemo device right now, obviously |
| 13:41.54 | antithesis_ | I'm looking for a smartphone to buy and my main requirement is that I can operate it with the keyboard |
| 13:42.06 | FIQ | well |
| 13:42.22 | FIQ | I wouldn't call maemo "usable without touchscreen" |
| 13:42.30 | antithesis_ | If I can install uzbl or vimprobable or some similar browser on it, I can use the browser without a touch screen |
| 13:42.30 | FIQ | if that's what you're going for |
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| 13:42.40 | FIQ | you're looking at the wrong place tbh |
| 13:42.43 | antithesis_ | It depends on what programs I can install it |
| 13:42.52 | antithesis_ | Is there any right place for this? |
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| 13:43.14 | FIQ | no I mean you're probably looking at the wrong alternative |
| 13:43.51 | antithesis_ | Maemo is Debian-based, and Debian requires the least use of a pointer device |
| 13:43.58 | ShadowJK | I don't think such a thing exists anymore |
| 13:44.00 | antithesis_ | That's why it seems right to me to look at Maemo |
| 13:44.42 | FIQ | antithesis_: oh you're looking for an open phone specifically |
| 13:44.54 | antithesis_ | Yeah |
| 13:45.07 | antithesis_ | But the Neo900 isn't out yet and it's expensive |
| 13:45.12 | FIQ | I just thought you wanted a non-touch phone, in which case S60 would probably be of more use |
| 13:45.35 | FIQ | but that's stone age :D |
| 13:45.37 | FIQ | anyway |
| 13:45.42 | FIQ | there's lynx |
| 13:45.47 | FIQ | and probably w3m as well |
| 13:46.08 | FIQ | not sure if there's gui browsers that doesn't require touch screen in maemo's repositories |
| 13:46.16 | FIQ | you can always make your own ;) |
| 13:46.22 | antithesis_ | Can I check that for myself anywhere? |
| 13:46.28 | antithesis_ | I'd rather port an existing one |
| 13:47.45 | FIQ | you can check the repositories at maemo.org directly yes |
| 13:47.50 | FIQ | if that's what you're asking |
| 13:47.54 | FIQ | Also |
| 13:47.59 | FIQ | System upgrades |
| 13:48.09 | FIQ | i.e. equavilent of dist-upgrade |
| 13:48.27 | FIQ | is strongly recommended to be done via hildon-application-manager |
| 13:48.38 | FIQ | because it does some tricky stuff that apt* doesn't do on its' own |
| 13:48.46 | FIQ | and it requires touch use :p |
| 13:49.08 | antithesis_ | I can live with that |
| 13:49.55 | ShadowJK | repository.maemo.org iirc |
| 13:50.34 | antithesis_ | Yeah I found it |
| 13:51.49 | antithesis_ | Wait, can't I just emulate Debian on it? |
| 13:52.02 | antithesis_ | Easy Debian |
| 13:54.31 | antithesis_ | Is that a complete Debian system with access to all its packages? |
| 13:54.43 | ShadowJK | more or less |
| 13:55.58 | antithesis_ | Isn't that a bit heavy for such a device? |
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| 13:58.19 | ShadowJK | also squeezing it into 800*480 on 3.5" area is a bit tight |
| 14:00.39 | Sicelo | so looks like my Maemo is kaput inside SB. How to remove all Maemo stuff in it to reinstall nokia binaries? |
| 14:02.03 | FIQ | [14:55:56] <antithesis_> Isn't that a bit heavy for such a device? |
| 14:02.07 | FIQ | well it works |
| 14:02.15 | FIQ | but it's a bit slow |
| 14:02.29 | FIQ | if you run too itensive stuff |
| 14:02.53 | FIQ | works just fine for terminal applications and/or simpler gui ones though |
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| 14:26.30 | antithesis_ | Okay, looks pretty fucking nice to me |
| 14:26.32 | antithesis_ | ShadowJK: more or less |
| 14:26.34 | antithesis_ | Explain? |
| 14:27.51 | Sicelo | you can't upgrade some of the stuff, eg gconf2 (or smething like it) |
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| 15:14.54 | Sicelo|SB | :) |
| 15:15.08 | Sicelo|SB | have successfully built irssi with perl support in scratchbox |
| 15:15.09 | Sicelo|SB | :) |
| 15:15.28 | Sicelo|SB | unfortunately, can't seem to see how to make it work in the ARMEL target too |
| 15:19.04 | FIQ | doesn't irssi already exist in repositories? |
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| 15:30.59 | Sicelo | FIQ: it does. no perl support though :( |
| 15:32.11 | FIQ | oh ok |
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| 16:22.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: switching between programs and closing programs is easy via hw-kbd in MHD |
| 16:25.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | antithesis_: rather "more" than "less" :-) |
| 16:26.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw on maemo diablo (N810) you could get away without using touchscreen for almost all sitations. With fremantle they messed that up and I blamed that from beginning |
| 16:27.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | I however guess you could implement a mouse emu, to move a cursor with the cursor keys for example, and "press mouse butten2 via e.g. the spacebar |
| 16:27.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | or even use accelerometer based guestures to move the cursor ;-) |
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| 16:58.06 | antithesis_ | Heh, reminds me of Dasher, an input application that can be controlled fully with the accelerometer |
| 16:58.13 | antithesis_ | It's interesting, but not really worth the trouble |
| 16:58.20 | antithesis_ | DocScrutinizer05: what's MHD? |
| 16:58.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | modified hildon desktop |
| 16:58.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~mhd |
| 16:58.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | thought as much |
| 16:59.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~ping |
| 16:59.07 | infobot | ~pong |
| 16:59.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | MHD comes with CSSU per default, since it is used to fix several bugs/flaws in standard/stock HD |
| 17:00.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's basically the desktop manager of maemo |
| 17:01.02 | antithesis_ | ±CSSU |
| 17:01.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~cssu |
| 17:01.07 | infobot | cssu is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU |
| 17:01.14 | antithesis_ | Thanks |
| 17:01.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jrtools |
| 17:01.21 | infobot | from memory, jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools |
| 17:01.28 | antithesis_ | This is a hackintosh, I don't know where the tilde button is, lol |
| 17:01.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | haha |
| 17:02.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | infobot: cssu |
| 17:02.01 | infobot | hmm... cssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU |
| 17:02.21 | antithesis_ | N810 is too weak a device for me |
| 17:02.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 17:04.38 | antithesis_ | Serious question: how come Maemo isn't that popular? It seems a lot more capable and advanced than Android |
| 17:04.45 | antithesis_ | Does it have to do with marketing or something? |
| 17:05.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | see jrtools >> |
| 17:05.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | ## OBSOLETE with CSSU, so now commented out #o# ##### |
| 17:05.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | # fix annoying hildon-desktop cpu hog bug |
| 17:06.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | antithesis_: it's not easy to port maemo to any new hw platform, due to the amount of nokia proprietary closed blobs in userland |
| 17:06.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually until 6 months ago I claimed it was impossible |
| 17:08.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | ## new: with ctrl-BS for nice taskswitching, see |
| 17:08.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | ## http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/repo/Modified_Hildon_Desktop.html |
| 17:08.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | ## new: with ctrl-BS for nice taskswitching, see |
| 17:08.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | ## http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/repo/Modified_Hildon_Desktop.html |
| 17:08.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | oops sorry |
| 17:08.51 | antithesis_ | Well, doesn't Nokia want it to be ported? |
| 17:09.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | nokia never bothered about FOSS really, and for sure had no (commercial) interest for maemo to be portable |
| 17:09.37 | antithesis_ | I can see why Apple is like that; they make a lot of profit by forcing people to buy their hardware. But isn't it in Nokia's advantage if more people use it? |
| 17:09.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, since Nokia also sells hardware |
| 17:10.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | just like Jolla does |
| 17:11.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | so all those companies actually try to exploit/abuse FOSS/linux for their own commercial interests |
| 17:11.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | when they write any piece of software to better support their product, they have no motivation to make it FOSS |
| 17:12.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | Nokia - driven/pushed by Quim Gill - once tried to be different regarding this |
| 17:12.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | but they never really arrived where they claimed to aim at |
| 17:13.49 | SiceloSB_ | where is QGill nowadays? |
| 17:13.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | no idea |
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| 17:14.36 | antithesis_ | I'm pretty sure Google is making a lot of profit from Android, even though it's open-source, though |
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| 17:14.48 | SiceloSB_ | lol antithesis_ |
| 17:14.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | Nokia went mad, community gone toxic, he turned away and does different stuff now, I guess |
| 17:15.25 | warfare | antithesis_: Android isn't open source - all the important bits are in "Google Play services" |
| 17:15.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | HI warfare!!! |
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| 17:15.39 | warfare | Hey DocScrutinizer05 :) |
| 17:15.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | long time no see! |
| 17:15.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | all fine at your end? |
| 17:15.54 | warfare | been busy building 30C3 network :) |
| 17:15.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | aaah sure |
| 17:16.22 | antithesis_ | Do devices ship with these bits? |
| 17:16.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | which bits? |
| 17:16.42 | antithesis_ | The important proprietary bits |
| 17:16.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 17:16.47 | warfare | antithesis_: Sure, if they are "Google approved" |
| 17:16.51 | antithesis_ | AFAIK, you can still have a working Android system without those bits |
| 17:17.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | Android is a whole different annoying topic |
| 17:17.48 | antithesis_ | But the point is, other manufacturers use Android on their devices and Google is encouraging that, not opposing |
| 17:17.59 | antithesis_ | Why can't that be the case with Maemo? |
| 17:18.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, Goggle made their business model base on a different concept |
| 17:18.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | but htey fsckd up linux thoroughly before that, so it's not even worth discussing the benefits of android |
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| 17:20.58 | FIQ | <DocScrutinizer05> FIQ: switching between programs and closing programs is easy via hw-kbd in MHD |
| 17:21.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | Nokia been building and selling hardware, so their approach to maemo linux been centric to their hardware. While Google started with a business model that didn't even involve Google selling hardware at all |
| 17:21.14 | FIQ | MHD? |
| 17:21.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: can you read backscroll? |
| 17:21.30 | antithesis_ | Already been asked |
| 17:21.35 | antithesis_ | lol |
| 17:21.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~listkeys mhd |
| 17:21.56 | FIQ | DocScrutinizer05: yeah I saw it |
| 17:22.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | weird |
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| 17:22.34 | FIQ | how do you switch between applications and close them? |
| 17:22.37 | FIQ | assuming installed CSSU |
| 17:22.46 | FIQ | IIRC it was something like ctrl+arrows |
| 17:22.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~#maemo MHD is Modified Hildon Desktop. See ~CSSU and http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/repo/Modified_Hildon_Desktop.html |
| 17:22.49 | infobot | okay, DocScrutinizer05 |
| 17:23.04 | FIQ | but I never got it to work when trying when antithesis_ brought it up |
| 17:23.20 | antithesis_ | http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/catalog-reveals-nsa-has-back-doors-for-numerous-devices-a-940994.html |
| 17:23.22 | antithesis_ | nice. |
| 17:24.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: see ~jrtools |
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| 17:25.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-12-29 18:05:24] <DocScrutinizer05> ## OBSOLETE with CSSU, so now commented out #o# ##### |
| 17:25.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | ff |
| 17:25.43 | FIQ | ~jrtools |
| 17:25.44 | infobot | i heard jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools |
| 17:26.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | # set ctl-BS to my preferred operation mode, ' |
| 17:26.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | ## also for CSSU!!' ## |
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| 17:34.39 | FIQ | can I disable trackerd fully? |
| 17:35.10 | zammy | there was an earthquake dudes |
| 17:35.16 | zammy | I felt it on my skin |
| 17:35.22 | zammy | just few minutes ago |
| 17:35.32 | zammy | in naples near Rome |
| 17:39.18 | *** join/#maemo Ashley` (me@unaffiliated/ashley/x-5226587) |
| 17:39.21 | Ashley` | hi there |
| 17:39.58 | Ashley` | I have a question about making keyboard maps for Nokia N900 |
| 17:40.47 | Ashley` | Can I bind some key (eogonek (ę) for example) to camera shutter half-press + e? |
| 17:41.45 | Sicelo | FIQ: i should think yes.. but then you will not see anything in Media Player, Photos, etc |
| 17:44.40 | zammy | 9km SW of campobasso deep 10km and magnitude 5 and more |
| 17:44.52 | zammy | to me all is fine |
| 17:44.56 | zammy | thanks to god |
| 17:45.03 | zammy | but well felt |
| 17:45.59 | kerio | zammy: my mom was telling me about it |
| 17:46.14 | zammy | you know the datas now |
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| 17:51.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: antithesis_: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/media/MHD_demo_20090108_001.mp4 |
| 17:52.37 | FIQ | <Sicelo> FIQ: i should think yes.. but then you will not see anything in Media Player, Photos, etc |
| 17:52.40 | FIQ | this is not an issue |
| 17:52.44 | FIQ | because I never used these |
| 17:53.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: trackerd.conf |
| 17:53.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | should offer sufficent ways to reduce or completely stop trackerd from indexing |
| 17:55.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | re *.mp4 above, sorry for messed up mimetype. You prolly will need to download the file to playback from local storage |
| 17:56.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | Ashley`: I doubt that works |
| 17:56.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | cam trigger is not a good modifier key for key mappings |
| 17:56.47 | Ashley` | Why not? |
| 17:56.58 | Ashley` | It is unused when not in camera app |
| 17:57.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | ^^^ |
| 17:57.24 | Ashley` | and camera app doesn't need keyboard, I think |
| 17:57.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | unlike vol+/- which are F7/8 iirc, cam trigger is completely unknown to kbd drivers |
| 17:57.46 | Ashley` | Ah |
| 17:57.49 | Ashley` | ok. |
| 17:57.55 | Ashley` | :c |
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| 17:59.01 | ShadowJK | Also proximity and camdoor are unknown to kbd :P |
| 17:59.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | *maybe* you could come up with a method that would detect cam trigger activation and execute some binary that loads a different keymap |
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| 17:59.31 | Ashley` | DocScrutinizer05, pressing that key shows up in dmesg |
| 17:59.41 | Ashley` | I'll try |
| 17:59.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | but you will want to male sure that the standard keymap gets loaded eventually ;-) |
| 18:00.04 | Ashley` | yeah, I know :P |
| 18:00.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | Ashley`: you probably can get the event from dbus or at least from HAL |
| 18:00.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | no need to grep dmesg |
| 18:00.59 | FIQ | DocScrutinizer05: wow, ty for the hints @ ctrl+BS-setup |
| 18:01.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | yw |
| 18:01.10 | FIQ | this was far more powerful than I thought |
| 18:01.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, pretty convenient |
| 18:01.46 | FIQ | but I have some trouble with roll-backward, it seems to have trouble deciding wtf to do with it |
| 18:01.53 | Ashley` | DocScrutinizer05, hmmm there is dbus event for it |
| 18:01.56 | FIQ | oh well, just the "roll forward" option is probably enough for what I'll use mostly |
| 18:02.03 | Ashley` | DocScrutinizer05, thanks :) |
| 18:02.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | yw |
| 18:02.42 | FIQ | oh |
| 18:02.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: the trick is to hold down either BS or ctrl, and push-release the other button of both |
| 18:02.47 | FIQ | I think I see the issue with roll-backward |
| 18:03.03 | FIQ | there's no "stop" before it goes into repeat-key |
| 18:03.23 | FIQ | and thus, just mildly pressing ctrl makes programs switch way too much |
| 18:03.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | push-and-hold: ctrl, BS. Release: ctrl |
| 18:03.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | all in 0.5s |
| 18:04.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | then push-release ctrl will scroll backwards |
| 18:04.19 | FIQ | yes I know, but |
| 18:04.31 | FIQ | if I push ctrl, applications like to scroll a lot more than just once |
| 18:04.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | ugh |
| 18:04.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | too fast key repeat |
| 18:04.48 | FIQ | this is not the case with backspace hold |
| 18:05.09 | FIQ | there's no delay before key repeat triggers for ctrl |
| 18:05.11 | FIQ | it seems |
| 18:05.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm |
| 18:05.18 | FIQ | unlike for BS |
| 18:05.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | I had no problems |
| 18:05.32 | FIQ | (roll-forward works just fine for me, not roll-backward, that's where issues arise) |
| 18:05.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | mhm |
| 18:05.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | dunno |
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| 18:08.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, you noticed you also can select with "qweasd" and close with shift-qweasd |
| 18:08.25 | FIQ | yeah I saw that |
| 18:08.29 | FIQ | in the comments |
| 18:08.34 | FIQ | of jrtools |
| 18:09.10 | FIQ | will it adjust if I have, say 8 applications open? |
| 18:09.16 | FIQ | to mimic taskswitcher's window I mean |
| 18:09.23 | FIQ | s/window/interface/ |
| 18:09.31 | *** join/#maemo amizraa (~amizraa@gateway/tor-sasl/amizraa) |
| 18:09.32 | FIQ | i.e. qwer for first 4, asdf for bottom 4 |
| 18:09.44 | FIQ | let's see |
| 18:10.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | which makes amaizing sense considering that when app doesn't know about ctrl-Q, you can send a close-window event via ctrl-(BS+Q) |
| 18:10.21 | antithesis_ | DocScrutinizer05: thanks |
| 18:10.25 | antithesis_ | That's the kind of shit I like |
| 18:10.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 18:10.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | me too |
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| 18:11.17 | FIQ | DocScrutinizer05: can I make it remember window order from activity? |
| 18:11.28 | FIQ | rather than from opening order |
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| 18:12.01 | FIQ | hm |
| 18:12.05 | FIQ | strange |
| 18:12.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | it sorts by activity already, afaik |
| 18:12.29 | FIQ | it seems like when I open taskswitcher, what I just had open ends up last in the list |
| 18:12.39 | FIQ | and the one I had 2nd opened appears first |
| 18:12.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
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| 18:13.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | ctrl-BS always switches back to last task opened |
| 18:13.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | active |
| 18:13.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | switch back and forth between two windows is a breeze |
| 18:19.18 | FIQ | hm |
| 18:19.36 | FIQ | would be convenient if N900's menu could be used as a runner |
| 18:19.54 | FIQ | (and preferably be easily accessible too without touch :p) |
| 18:22.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, I pondered long and often about augmenting MHD to take a kbd shortcut to jump from taskswitcher to appstarter menu, and there use cursor keays to move around a highlight that gets selected when pressing enter or space key |
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| 18:24.20 | FIQ | would be nice if you could just type the name, or at least something close to it (xc<enter> for xchat for example) |
| 18:24.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep, also a nice idea, but that thing is easy to implement |
| 18:25.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | just an app that does this for you |
| 18:25.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | doesn't need to get integrated into HD |
| 18:25.18 | FIQ | mhm |
| 18:25.19 | FIQ | makes sense |
| 18:25.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe such thing already exists |
| 18:26.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | quickstarter or whatever |
| 18:26.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | check apps, package interface |
| 18:26.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pkg |
| 18:26.39 | infobot | somebody said pkg was http://maemo.org/packages/ |
| 18:27.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | search for start, or launch |
| 18:27.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | I never checked |
| 18:27.57 | FIQ | searched runner |
| 18:28.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | curses his internet, his NATs/routers (plural!), his KDE, and generally everything internet |
| 18:29.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | for unclear reasins refreshing of e.g. tmo windows takes forever, plus 5 times hitting F5 |
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| 18:30.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | prolly rlated to friggin DNS |
| 18:30.31 | FIQ | powerlaunch seemed to have what I looked for (kinda, don't know how it exactly worked), and then it's just for diablo :p |
| 18:30.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | stupid DHCP |
| 18:32.53 | FIQ | hm, found something, but when actually looking for what it was, I found this interesting TMO thread as the only source of information of what it actually did: "[processstarter] wont start" |
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| 22:01.22 | ShadowJK | I discovered a dns issue in my setup today |
| 22:01.35 | ShadowJK | Primary dns was typoed to 127.0.1.1 |
| 22:02.03 | ShadowJK | So everything not recently accessed too 5 seconds for 127.0.1.1 to timeout before asking secondary dns server. :) |
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| 23:27.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: you know they hack eMMC controller firmware now? |
| 23:27.53 | ShadowJK | nop |
| 23:28.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2096045 |
| 23:28.29 | ShadowJK | Some samsung microsds that bunniestudios decapped contained an ARM core inside :) |
| 23:28.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | M3 |
| 23:29.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | M4? |
| 23:30.53 | ShadowJK | SpeedEvil: ^ should be interesting for you too |
| 23:30.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | I really start giggling when thinking about RMS and his FSF-certified laptop that for sure also has at least 2 or 3 controllers that are considered "chips" but actually can change their firmware |
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| 23:35.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: (127.0.1.1) sounds pretty much similar to my problem, judging by symptoms. OTOH I think 127.x.x.x is all supposed to be LOCALHOST |
| 23:37.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually localhost (servernames and uppercase don't go together well) |
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| 23:38.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | I learned the hard way when trying to name a server L2.domain.tld |
| 23:39.02 | Hurrian | whoa, that's pretty cool - they put ARM cores in eMMCs now? |
| 23:39.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | which broke munin |
| 23:39.20 | kerio | Hurrian: it's cheaper than shipping perfect flash chips |
| 23:39.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 23:39.31 | Hurrian | looks like SSD-style wear leveling has hit the low-end :D |
| 23:39.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | always did |
| 23:40.02 | ShadowJK | Hurrian; well |
| 23:40.41 | ShadowJK | CF, SD, uSD have had arm cores and other uCs for 5-10 years |
| 23:41.11 | ShadowJK | Kingston actually has a controller desgiend from scratch, but they rarely use it, and it sucks |
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| 23:41.59 | Hurrian | Counting down to when people use them as complete system-on-package... |
| 23:42.47 | ShadowJK | Oh, that exists |
| 23:43.23 | ShadowJK | wifi+linux system in a SD card form factor, iirc |
| 23:43.56 | Hurrian | those WiFi SD cards run Linux? |
| 23:45.02 | ShadowJK | "electric imp" |
| 23:47.44 | Hurrian | wow, there are ARM cores in everything now... |
| 23:50.13 | ShadowJK | worth keeping in mind that arm scales very small |
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