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| 01:40.20 | ds3 | anyone here besides the developers seriously considering the new MB option for the N900? |
| 01:40.58 | Tekk_ | seriously considering how? |
| 01:41.16 | ds3 | as in ready to write a check if the kickstarter funds |
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| 01:41.36 | Tekk_ | personally I'm not interested in it since it seems like a really puny upgrade for the extra price |
| 01:42.17 | ds3 | but is there really anything better that is useable? |
| 01:42.29 | Tekk_ | I'd just continue using the old board |
| 01:43.07 | Tekk_ | until something else(hopefully mer/nemo based) comes along |
| 01:44.00 | ds3 | what would make it worthwhile for you? |
| 01:44.18 | Tekk_ | the motherboard upgrade? |
| 01:45.22 | Tekk_ | probably at least 1 gb ram, cpu either with more cores(might be helpful since maemo is so multitask friendly) or at least clocked higher than people overclock the original processor to |
| 01:45.24 | bef0rd | it can't get any cheaper if the production quantities are low |
| 01:45.35 | bef0rd | it's 1GB RAM already |
| 01:45.42 | Tekk_ | I thought it was 512 |
| 01:45.44 | ds3 | yes |
| 01:45.48 | Tekk_ | okay, that just leaves the cpu then :) |
| 01:45.58 | bef0rd | http://neo900.org/ |
| 01:46.13 | Tekk_ | hmm |
| 01:46.16 | ds3 | isn't multicore going to slam battery life? |
| 01:46.19 | Tekk_ | actually does the new modem support at&t freqs? |
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| 01:46.47 | ds3 | wish there was some clear indicator on if they will add BLE or not though |
| 01:46.59 | bef0rd | there are three modem options, but I don't know about at&t freqs |
| 01:47.56 | Tekk_ | lte modem does |
| 01:47.57 | Tekk_ | cool |
| 01:48.07 | Tekk_ | and the 3g |
| 01:48.22 | ds3 | I do wonder if they are going to get IMEI blocked by ATT since ATT likes to certify their devices |
| 01:48.48 | Tekk_ | might be worth it between being able to use better than edge and more ram |
| 01:48.55 | Tekk_ | but I haven't any money to pledge |
| 01:49.16 | unclouded | a big advantage will be that the hardware is much better supported by the kernel, meaning you won't be stuck with 2.6 and other operating systems will run on it much better |
| 02:01.24 | bef0rd | yea, hopefully the nokia closed bits won't affect the kernel in anyway |
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| 03:52.34 | brolin_empey | Tekk_: The Nokia N900 does not support the UMTS bands used by Telus Mobility, Bell Mobility, and their MVNOs in Canada. Telus Mobility and Bell Mobility use only CDMA2000 and UMTS, not GSM. If the Neo900 supports these UMTS bands, then the Neo900 has a significant advantage over the Nokia N900 in Canada. |
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| 09:19.58 | Sysaxed | Hello! I'm experiencing something weird. Yesterday I was asking here about my phone not booting, but it finally booted and everything was fine. Today I was using my phone and suddenly it said that my sim card was disconnected. Ok, but after 10 seconds it told me that now it is connected and asked me for the pin code. I entered my pin code correctly two times each time receiving "invalid pin", on the third try it worked and connected |
| 09:19.58 | Sysaxed | correctly. Okay, but after some time this happened again... and again and again. So I decided to reboot my phone, but now it was not booting again. So I was playing around with reinserting the battery and finally it worked, but it did not manage to boot and got stuck on these loading dots. I've tried again - didn't work... So some time later I've tried it again and it worked from the third try or so. SIM card problem appeared soon after |
| 09:19.58 | Sysaxed | successful boot. Now it is working, but says that sim card is not there. Also if I try to charge it I get "Not Charging" message. Any ideas? |
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| 09:39.56 | chainsawbike | Sysaxed, it sound like the issue when due to heat/the board flexing a chips solder joints have broken :( ( cant think of what to search for on the forums, but its there somewhere) |
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| 10:11.29 | Sysaxed | hmmm, okay, anybody else? |
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| 10:12.15 | Sysaxed | chainsawbike: thanks, but it is still weird that it happened without anything happening before |
| 10:12.30 | Sysaxed | I can understand if it fell and then started to act like this |
| 10:12.37 | Sysaxed | but maybe you're right |
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| 10:31.43 | cehteh | Sysaxed: do you do any over/under clocking/volting? |
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| 10:37.05 | narcos | Hi maemo folks. Some time back one of you gave me a URL that when browsed to on the N900 would load a bunch of repos automatically. Anyone got that link mentally cached? |
| 10:48.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | dang |
| 10:49.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | for the record: http://maemo.cloud-7.de/repositories.install |
| 10:49.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | or simply |
| 10:49.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jrtools |
| 10:49.30 | infobot | rumour has it, jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools |
| 10:49.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | which has a link to the file |
| 10:50.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sysaxed: sounds like hw defect :´( |
| 10:51.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | when you're extremely lucky, it's just the battery that's defect |
| 10:52.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sysaxed: standard recommendation: full reflash PR1.3.1, no installation of any additional apps, test for a week in this state |
| 10:53.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | I know reflash sounds inconvenient, but given the alternative of instantly binning the device, it's for sure worth to give it a try |
| 10:54.25 | sono | excellent howto but what IS rw/tools? |
| 10:54.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm? |
| 10:54.53 | sono | sorry, i just wanted to know what the outlined procedure is for |
| 10:55.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | whichone? |
| 10:55.07 | sono | becaues it sounds like something i might want to do, ... |
| 10:55.11 | sono | jrtools |
| 10:55.29 | sono | is CSSU = thumb = jrtools? |
| 10:55.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | jrtools is a collection of little hints I found/developed during last 4 years |
| 10:55.48 | sono | ah |
| 10:56.03 | sono | ok, CSSU = what i am using now |
| 10:56.07 | sono | thumb = probably somewhere in the wiki |
| 10:56.19 | sono | and this page = doc's personal howtos |
| 10:56.21 | sono | thanks |
| 10:56.25 | deepy | is there any email client that supports gmail? |
| 10:56.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | not sure |
| 10:56.37 | sono | gmail supports pop3 and imap so yes, any, probably? |
| 10:57.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | modest (stock mailer) supports imap and pop3 and smtp |
| 10:57.12 | deepy | youd think so, but I get an error about the message not existimg on server |
| 10:57.24 | sono | hrm. "an error" |
| 10:57.36 | sono | maybe sniff in on that and try to find out what is going on |
| 10:57.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | seems imap support is kinda flawed in stock modest, use CSSU |
| 10:57.57 | sono | DocScrutinizer05: "modest"? |
| 10:58.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | the maemo mailer |
| 10:58.06 | sono | thanks |
| 10:58.19 | deepy | I thought I was using CSSU |
| 10:58.24 | sono | bloody UI stuff never told me what it was called =) |
| 10:58.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | check changelog linked to on |
| 10:58.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~cssu |
| 10:58.28 | infobot | cssu is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU |
| 10:58.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | it has fixes particularly for gmail iirc |
| 10:59.35 | sono | finds https://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU/Thumb and reads |
| 10:59.40 | sono | gotta use that lunch break for something useful =) |
| 10:59.56 | Sysaxed | cehteh: no, I've not done any overclocking |
| 11:03.03 | Sysaxed | DocScrutinizer05: what if it is the battery, would changing the battery fix the problem? |
| 11:03.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 11:04.38 | Sysaxed | hmmm |
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| 11:04.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | old worn battery LiIon cells tend to develop high effective Series Resistance (ESR), and sometimes behave quite random on this. A high ESR causes "brownout" when current bursts are drawn from battery by e.g. the modem during TX |
| 11:05.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | and the modem switches off earlier than the OMAP APE linux system |
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| 11:05.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | earlier as in "higher battery voltage" |
| 11:05.26 | Sysaxed | DocScrutinizer05: sounds logical |
| 11:05.45 | Sysaxed | considering the fact that these are some random chinese batteries |
| 11:06.09 | Sysaxed | ok, I have another battery working perfectly with another n900 |
| 11:06.15 | Sysaxed | I'll give it a try soon |
| 11:06.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | short brownouts can cause quite random erratic behaviour of all components of a system |
| 11:06.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | think of it like extreme undervolting |
| 11:07.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | processes can segfault at random |
| 11:07.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | memory IO may fail |
| 11:07.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | make sure you try a good battery |
| 11:08.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | but, sorry to say this, I have only little hope it's caused by your battery |
| 11:08.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | try to install ksyslogd and provide a full pastebin, so I could have a look at it |
| 11:09.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | syslog may reveal some hints on what's going on |
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| 14:25.10 | zamn900 | DocScrutinizer05, hello... do you know a way to save the xchat configuration to prevent its reset after closing this app on n900? |
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| 14:40.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | zammy: just close the app via the app's close-app button/menu |
| 14:41.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | alternatively there once been a "save settings" menu entry, dunno if it still exists |
| 14:42.24 | zemmy | ohthanks |
| 14:43.29 | zemmy | DocScrutinizer05, but it says something like Error key binding.. stuff |
| 14:44.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, then there's probably a syntax or semantics error in the key bindings |
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| 14:46.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | can't find the "save settings" menu entry |
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| 14:50.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | editing the keybindings is a painful exercise anyway, simply because the display is too small to show any reasonable overview or detail view for assigning a binding to a key |
| 14:51.31 | zemmy | right... for this reason I want to save the configuration DocScrutinizer05 because it's not only key binding configurable... |
| 14:52.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't have many bindings. I think shift-space for nick-completion is basically the only one |
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| 14:52.19 | zemmy | yes |
| 14:52.28 | zemmy | that's all indeed DocScrutinizer05 |
| 14:52.40 | zemmy | I edit font also |
| 14:52.45 | zemmy | and some color |
| 14:52.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | often I find it simpler ro edit the raw config files in ~/.xchat2/* |
| 14:53.04 | zemmy | does it affect? |
| 14:53.12 | zemmy | I tried... it seemed not |
| 14:53.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | you mustn't have xchat started when editing those files |
| 14:53.42 | zemmy | yes I know |
| 14:53.51 | zemmy | but anyway did not effect |
| 14:53.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | strange |
| 14:54.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | I couldn't figure where else xchat stores settings, afaik they are all in /home/user/.xchat2/ |
| 14:55.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | and several users said they were happy with my files from |
| 14:55.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jrxchat |
| 14:55.18 | infobot | from memory, jrxchat is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/xchat/ |
| 14:55.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | which implies it had effect to "edit" aka change the content of those files |
| 14:55.45 | zemmy | but most of all weird thing on xchat is that this can handle its own tray icon settings and conf but no real output of this trayicon |
| 14:56.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are a few options that are meaningless under maemo/hildon |
| 15:03.44 | zemmy | I hate xchat... not editable at all |
| 15:08.29 | ShadowJK | xchat trayicon worked in Maemo4 |
| 15:08.44 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (~VDVsx@a88-114-88-95.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 15:11.03 | RST38h | does remember he had to kick xchat to enable that |
| 15:15.19 | *** join/#maemo zamn900 (~sammy@ppp-172-77.98-62.inwind.it) |
| 15:17.06 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (~bef0rd@unaffiliated/beford) |
| 15:20.47 | zamn900 | hello |
| 15:23.11 | *** join/#maemo NIN101 (~NIN@p5DD283B2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:23.18 | *** join/#maemo zamn900 (~sammy@ppp-172-77.98-62.inwind.it) |
| 15:24.48 | zamn900 | alright DocScrutinizer05 I was doing one of mines again... I mixed the hexchat of my linux on pc with this n900 xchat and that was messing up all |
| 15:25.22 | zamn900 | now xchat loads naturally its own configuration |
| 15:25.43 | zamn900 | but still I would minimize it in tray |
| 15:26.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | minimizing in tray would mean you need a systemmenu entry to un-minimize it |
| 15:27.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | in hildon there are no dedicated popup menues from particular systray icons when clicking them |
| 15:30.19 | zamn900 | so? no way at all? |
| 15:30.46 | zamn900 | just keeping this as an open chat as all task window |
| 15:37.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | what alternative to having xchat in taskswitcher would you suggest to un-iconify it? |
| 15:38.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | I can't think of any, and I don't know of any that xchat offers |
| 15:38.12 | zamn900 | maybe screen and some tips of screen it self |
| 15:38.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm? |
| 15:38.49 | zamn900 | trying to answer not being developer |
| 15:38.56 | zamn900 | sorry |
| 15:39.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm asking for a method from user perspective, to un-iconify xchat when minimized to systray |
| 15:42.29 | zamn900 | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:43.06 | zamn900 | that's user friendly side for trayicon |
| 15:44.58 | zamn900 | otherwise the telepathy plugin for irc should be more developed |
| 15:45.06 | zamn900 | but idk |
| 15:46.07 | RST38h | telepathy irc plugin is not going to give you proper experience no matter how you develop it |
| 15:46.23 | RST38h | simply because it has to use a completely alien ui |
| 15:47.13 | zamn900 | right that's the of idk was minding to |
| 15:53.03 | *** join/#maemo samn900 (~samn900@ppp-172-77.98-62.inwind.it) |
| 15:54.07 | samn900 | if this telepathy thing-room could remain open |
| 15:56.27 | sono | remote host, mosh, tmux, irssi, bitlbee |
| 15:56.50 | samn900 | what's this |
| 15:56.50 | sono | bit of effort and learning curve, but *so* worth it |
| 15:56.59 | deepy | is there any reason not to use the fimger for pressing the softkeys in terminal? |
| 15:57.12 | samn900 | irssi I already know |
| 15:57.29 | samn900 | but are samely likely xchat |
| 15:58.05 | samn900 | I would iconify the client |
| 15:58.12 | sono | samn900: first you need an always-on system to connect to, at home (pi, openwrt, ... or an entire rootserver or shell e.g. uberspace.de) |
| 15:58.16 | samn900 | whichever client |
| 15:58.47 | sono | samn900: then you run mosh on that. configure ssh with key auth for easy access |
| 15:59.13 | sono | samn900: run a tmux session there, where you keep irssi open |
| 15:59.36 | samn900 | maybe a bounce in tcl of my eggdrop on my vps do you mean? |
| 15:59.43 | sono | samn900: connect irssi to bitlbee for other IM clients |
| 16:00.09 | sono | nah bncs are totally 90's imho |
| 16:00.09 | samn900 | I knewed about it but never started to configure a try it |
| 16:01.24 | samn900 | but maybe it's time to try at least |
| 16:02.15 | sono | take one step at a time |
| 16:02.27 | sono | first comes the host and ssh |
| 16:02.36 | zemmy | I have a vps |
| 16:02.38 | sono | the hardest part perhaps |
| 16:02.42 | sono | ok |
| 16:02.56 | zemmy | I have an eggdrop but not connected to this server freenode |
| 16:03.03 | zemmy | to another one |
| 16:04.34 | zemmy | I never understood how the bounce script works actually so I never tried it |
| 16:04.58 | sono | you dont need it in the described setup |
| 16:07.39 | wnd | I prefer IRC proxies/bouncers because that gives me the option to freely choose my client (and run it locally, if desired) and still stay online |
| 16:07.42 | *** part/#maemo samn900 (~samn900@ppp-172-77.98-62.inwind.it) |
| 16:08.47 | sono | i prefer having a central instance |
| 16:08.57 | zemmy | yes that's what I knewed... wnd so how this happens and what makes the bouncer |
| 16:09.27 | sono | it makes managing channels etc. SO much easier |
| 16:09.43 | zemmy | cool |
| 16:10.06 | *** join/#maemo drussell (dave@conference/canonical-cloud-sprint/x-clhjquogsdjxxfva) |
| 16:10.11 | sono | as well as offering all the other advantages of a remote shell |
| 16:10.27 | zemmy | can I use the same eggdrop to connect at two different servers with two different nicks? |
| 16:10.48 | sono | nowadays shells are actually commercially available, cheap products.. |
| 16:11.10 | sono | even root VMs are dirt cheap |
| 16:11.27 | sono | last bnc i ran was 1998 or so |
| 16:12.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | mosh is nonsense |
| 16:13.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | and why you need tmux when you already run mosh? |
| 16:13.46 | sono | no, and yes. |
| 16:13.55 | sono | mosh does not replace tmux |
| 16:14.01 | wnd | unless I'm mistaken, mosh doesn't transfer (cleanly) from one host running the client to another |
| 16:14.06 | sono | and atm i am on the bus |
| 16:14.22 | sono | if you ever used ssh while moving |
| 16:14.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | I do that all the time |
| 16:14.40 | sono | you won't claim mosh is nonsense |
| 16:14.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | mosh IS nonsense |
| 16:15.00 | sono | if yoy say so |
| 16:15.16 | Sysaxed | DocScrutinizer05: it seems like my phone works correctly with another battery |
| 16:15.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | calling an app anything "mobile" that sends a ping every 5 sec or whatever, that is the definition of nonsense |
| 16:16.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sysaxed: great |
| 16:16.09 | sono | ok |
| 16:16.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | you could as well call ping a battery-saver |
| 16:16.59 | sono | (mosh is the next best thing after butter btw. already lost link twice this bus ride) |
| 16:17.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | *shrug* |
| 16:17.33 | sono | doc. you close it when you dont actively use it. it really is that siimple |
| 16:17.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's bullshit |
| 16:18.00 | sono | ok |
| 16:18.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | I could as well call VNC a "desktop optimized for mobile" |
| 16:18.35 | sono | no |
| 16:18.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 16:18.41 | sono | no |
| 16:18.46 | sono | =P |
| 16:18.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | I just did it, so yes |
| 16:19.06 | sono | =) |
| 16:19.38 | wnd | that's the number one reason I don't want to use mosh: to run it on my n900 without killing the battery, I'd have to close it before idling |
| 16:20.02 | sono | closing it takes a click |
| 16:20.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | so what? |
| 16:20.14 | sono | new session into tmux takes a click |
| 16:20.20 | wnd | indeed, but creating another connection takes much more than that |
| 16:20.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | so what? |
| 16:20.29 | sono | no |
| 16:20.46 | sono | tmux: run byobu |
| 16:20.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | why the heck do you need to "create connections"?? |
| 16:20.58 | sono | ssh: public key |
| 16:21.16 | sono | mosh-client: oneliner |
| 16:21.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | pfff |
| 16:21.41 | zemmy | wow I am trying sygic on n900 |
| 16:21.43 | zemmy | it's cool |
| 16:22.19 | wnd | I can't trust a mobile device to have a passphraseless ssh key that allows me to log in to any relevant host, and using an agent doesn't really solve anything here |
| 16:23.28 | sono | thats why i use this host that only has crap on it |
| 16:24.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | my "mosh": while ! ssh -o ServerAliveInterval=300 -p22022 78.46.9287.666 screen -R; do sleep 1; done |
| 16:25.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | to make it more like your mosh, use ServerAliveInterval=3 |
| 16:26.44 | sono | hhahaha |
| 16:27.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | and honestly, fix your APN config, so you don't get a new DHCP lease each time you roam from one cell to another |
| 16:27.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | my ssh sessions stay for a week |
| 16:27.58 | sono | sgood for you |
| 16:28.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually for 24h-1s |
| 16:28.13 | sono | some people use consumer carriers |
| 16:28.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | some people do what? |
| 16:30.18 | sono | german vodafone, good luck with that apn config |
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| 16:33.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm? |
| 16:33.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | what's wrng with vodafone? |
| 16:33.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | wrong even |
| 16:35.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | only thing I could figure is: your carrier has a sparse coverage and a national roaming agreement with another carrier network, so each time your device is roaming from one network to the other it most likely would get a new DHCP lease and thus IP-addr |
| 16:36.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | while obviously discarding the old lease locally. So when roaming back from network B to A, it can't resume the lease it had in A either, but again would request a new DHCP lease |
| 16:37.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | this *could* get handled in dnsmasq/ICD, I guess |
| 16:38.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway a connectivity dropout of a few (tens of) seconds never may justify a new DHCP lease |
| 16:39.22 | sono | look, i can paste all that to their hotline if you like |
| 16:39.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't care |
| 16:39.44 | sono | if they're feeling funny they might escalate the ticket |
| 16:39.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's your crappy connection |
| 16:39.55 | sono | and send us an amusing response |
| 16:40.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm just telling you that your problems are not exactly normal |
| 16:40.39 | sono | they pretty much are, here |
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| 16:40.41 | *** join/#maemo frals (~frals@Maemo/community/contributor/frals) |
| 16:43.22 | sono | either way i relax while you frantically hit ~. |
| 16:43.39 | sono | shrugs |
| 16:43.48 | sono | let's let it pass |
| 16:45.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm listing the possible causes so you could investigate further, but I'm not interested in reports of the "it's like this here, and I found a way to automate the 50 keypresses I need to do twice per minute to cope with it" class |
| 16:46.39 | sono | there just isn't anything to investigate except where you live so ican move there and have a week old tcp connection on my mobile, too. |
| 16:46.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | when a carrier network doesn't allow DHCP leases that stay longer than 30s, then there's sth fundamentally wrong with the network. I can't believe anybody would be that stupid. |
| 16:47.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | sono: ok, then please spare us your ranting about your problems, when you don't feel like investigation what cause the have |
| 16:47.57 | sono | wo.o |
| 16:48.04 | sono | i was ranting? |
| 16:48.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | even worse, you suggested mosh to a user that for sure doesn't have same problems you got |
| 16:48.34 | sono | you went "bullshit" all over me without a second thought |
| 16:48.59 | sono | ok you know what? i just shut up, |
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| 17:28.47 | Sysaxed | DocScrutinizer05: hey :D |
| 17:29.06 | Sysaxed | ah |
| 17:29.08 | Sysaxed | maybe not.... |
| 17:29.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sysaxed: hey! :-) glad a new battery fixed it |
| 17:29.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe not? |
| 17:29.47 | Sysaxed | well, I'm not sure, but it seems like I've fixed my old battery |
| 17:30.07 | Sysaxed | seems like contacts on it were pushed to sides from wear |
| 17:30.24 | Sysaxed | so I picked them with a needle and bent towards the center |
| 17:30.36 | Sysaxed | and it seems like everything works great now |
| 17:32.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, sounds pretty plausible. Particularly when you maybe connected/contacted the battery with other devices or chargers or whatever |
| 17:32.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | cleaning the device contact blades also might help |
| 17:34.04 | Sysaxed | I'm not sure if it keeps working(last time it started to fail again on another day), but if I don't come here crying that my n900 is dead, then it is fixed :) |
| 17:34.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | install syslog |
| 17:36.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | a bq27200.sh 5 >>/media/mmc1/bat.log also comes in handy |
| 17:36.50 | Sysaxed | mmm, what for? |
| 17:37.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | to check how battery behaves |
| 17:37.15 | Sysaxed | oh |
| 17:37.28 | Sysaxed | well, doesn't really matter for me while it works |
| 17:37.54 | Sysaxed | If only I get the same problem once again... |
| 17:38.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | then you'll miss reference data from the period when it worked |
| 17:39.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe don't use 5 (period time) but 30, to not consume too much space and power |
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| 17:41.54 | Sysaxed | good point |
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| 19:34.21 | zemmy | how do I activate sygic map? |
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| 20:32.19 | sixwheeledbeast | zemmy: IIRC sygic send a key in an e-mail on purchase. |
| 20:32.32 | zemmy | shhh |
| 20:32.49 | zemmy | I know... but yet solved |
| 20:33.03 | zemmy | anyway thanks |
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| 20:34.40 | sixwheeledbeast | solved how? |
| 20:36.14 | Pali | freemangordon: your maemo extras package xkb-data-extkbd eating 2MB on rootfs, what about optification? |
| 20:40.05 | zemmy | secret |
| 20:40.24 | zemmy | cook secret XP |
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| 20:45.18 | sixwheeledbeast | mmm, I would be interested if I reflash my device with SMM10 on, if I could re-install it again. |
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| 20:52.58 | Pali | freemangordon: look at this autobuilder error: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/gucharmap_2.28.2-1nix1/armel.root.log.FAILED.txt |
| 20:53.14 | Pali | autobuilder failed to prepare build env |
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| 20:58.53 | freemangordon | Pali: weird |
| 21:02.57 | freemangordon | Pali: seems lynx has never made it to stable |
| 21:03.16 | freemangordon | So I guess the package is broken |
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| 21:03.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | why would any package need lynx to get built? |
| 21:03.46 | freemangordon | NFC |
| 21:04.06 | Pali | freemangordon: what I did was: downloaded source package from extras, increased version, added debian/optify and sent it to autobuilder |
| 21:04.18 | Pali | nothing more, I did not added any dependency |
| 21:04.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | me neither, probably autobuilder too |
| 21:05.02 | freemangordon | Pali: well, SB in autobuilder is hathor, not aphophis as used to be before the migration |
| 21:05.11 | freemangordon | *apophis |
| 21:05.30 | freemangordon | that might be the reason |
| 21:05.54 | freemangordon | Setting up lynx (2.8.6-2.1maemo3) ... |
| 21:05.55 | freemangordon | update-alternatives: error: alternative path /usr/bin/lynx doesn't exist. |
| 21:05.55 | freemangordon | dpkg: error processing lynx (--configure): |
| 21:06.22 | freemangordon | so lynx should be fixed first IMO |
| 21:07.05 | freemangordon | Pali: I don;t dare to downgrade autobuilder SB :) |
| 21:07.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | the gucharmap package should get checked what for it allegedly needs lynx to support make and/or gcc |
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| 21:08.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, it#s absolute nogo to try and download sth from internet to autobbuilder, during package build |
| 21:08.24 | Pali | so problem is in lynx package? |
| 21:08.30 | Pali | I will look at it then... |
| 21:08.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I hope it would fail anyway |
| 21:09.08 | Pali | I pushed more packages to extras-devel which needed optification |
| 21:09.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | for the life of mine I can't think of any reasonable use for lynx during building a package |
| 21:09.24 | Pali | to make rootfs more free |
| 21:09.45 | Pali | gtk using lynx when building documentation |
| 21:09.59 | Pali | generate text files from html (or similar) |
| 21:10.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: I hope you thoroughly checked for each single one if it actually may get optified |
| 21:10.22 | freemangordon | Pali: look at this http://pastebin.com/6wzPMw3j, according to google it is from 2010 |
| 21:10.23 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: I checked that which are installed on my n900 |
| 21:11.25 | Pali | and I have my own script which sort packages by sum of size of files stored on ubifs rootds |
| 21:11.37 | freemangordon | Pali: unfortunately google cannot find any references to that pastebin |
| 21:11.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | ??? |
| 21:11.55 | freemangordon | but you're not the first to hit that lynx problem |
| 21:13.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: packages need check if they are needed during boot before they may get optified |
| 21:14.04 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: do you think packages in maemo-extras could be needed for booting? |
| 21:14.48 | Pali | no those packages should not be needed at boot - before rcS-late (which mounting /opt/) |
| 21:14.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | I seem to recall some fool optified PA codecs, which caused epic audio breakdown |
| 21:15.24 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: those packages are in extras, not in SDK ;) |
| 21:15.33 | Pali | I optified only packages which are not installed by default on clean n900 |
| 21:15.35 | freemangordon | ( Pali's packages) |
| 21:15.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: that's safe |
| 21:15.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | thanks |
| 21:16.28 | Pali | there is one very big, part of ssu (which I did not touched!): posix-locales |
| 21:16.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | (at least as long as the packages don't replace other packages that are installed by default) |
| 21:16.38 | Pali | eating 23MB on rootfs |
| 21:17.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, so? |
| 21:17.14 | Pali | maybe we should check if that package is needed and when... |
| 21:17.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | known failwale |
| 21:17.20 | freemangordon | Pali: you can;t optify that, it is part of libc afaik |
| 21:17.30 | Pali | then, ok |
| 21:17.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | the package IS needed, even during boot |
| 21:17.50 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: I do not know that, so this is why I'm asking... |
| 21:18.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's all locales |
| 21:18.09 | freemangordon | Pali: maybe ask aapo, he played a lot with libc |
| 21:18.38 | freemangordon | but i doubt locales can be optified |
| 21:18.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | core maemo system component |
| 21:18.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | no they can't |
| 21:19.01 | Pali | freemangordon: I see dosbox in cssu-thumb, can you optify it? |
| 21:20.02 | freemangordon | Pali: me?!? it is there just for the test purposes |
| 21:20.15 | freemangordon | I just get the source from the repos and recompiled |
| 21:20.36 | freemangordon | Pali: BTW are you sure it is not optified? |
| 21:22.08 | Pali | yes, dosbox has 1,7MB on rootfs |
| 21:22.29 | freemangordon | hmm, I guess I can optify the .deb |
| 21:23.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | blames Nokia's bad-to-the-bones rotten mindset to not FOSS locales |
| 21:23.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | which gives us this 23MB abomination |
| 21:24.13 | freemangordon | Pali: dosbox will have to wait, there are more thing I have to do I don;t have time for |
| 21:24.22 | Pali | ok :-) |
| 21:25.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, it's *TEXT*!!! |
| 21:25.26 | freemangordon | first of them to report OMAPFB CMA failures to CMA maintainer, but I don;t think I'll have time before Sunday :( |
| 21:28.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil could RE this friggin blob locale.cache 23MB, and split it into original locale text files one for each locale |
| 21:28.52 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: it is part of libc |
| 21:28.57 | freemangordon | afaik |
| 21:29.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | shouldn't be too hard to write a simple disassembler based on awk or whatever |
| 21:29.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: sure, the file format is completely documented |
| 21:30.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's basically just like shipping text in a tarball for which no untar exists since nobody ever needed such tool |
| 21:31.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | the "tar" however exists in source FOSS |
| 21:32.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | Nokia "tarred up" the 39some locales into that locales.cache and never published the original files from which that locales.cache got built |
| 21:32.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | afaik |
| 21:32.25 | Pali | looks like package is open: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/p/posix-locales/ |
| 21:32.33 | Pali | in maemo SDK |
| 21:33.16 | freemangordon | posix-locales_2.7.2-1maemo7-binonly0+0m5.tar.gz doesn't exactly look like source package :) |
| 21:33.47 | freemangordon | but older versions are |
| 21:33.47 | Pali | https://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/posix-locales |
| 21:34.41 | freemangordon | we're missing the latest version |
| 21:35.00 | freemangordon | but changes should't be that hard to add |
| 21:35.12 | freemangordon | Pali: BTW why do you ned more space on rootfs? |
| 21:35.17 | freemangordon | *need |
| 21:35.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's not all the plain textx that show up instead of "tana-fi-modest-error-imap" |
| 21:35.28 | Pali | because I had 10MB :-) Now I have 20MB |
| 21:35.40 | freemangordon | Pali: rm your syslog :P |
| 21:36.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | this 23MB blob contains ALL texts of ALL language versions of ALL core apps |
| 21:37.29 | freemangordon | anyway, /me is out, night guys |
| 21:37.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | too |
| 21:42.57 | Pali | freemangordon: it looks like posix-locales 2.7.2-1maemo7-binonly0+0m5 is based on git version 2.7.2-1maemo6 |
| 21:43.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: I mean the compressed(?) cache is 23MB in size. The original set of language specific text definitions must be significantly more than this - this is one of the reasons Nokia didn't ship them on device I guess |
| 21:43.54 | Pali | I'm generating that binary files from source files from git |
| 21:44.09 | Pali | and will run diff on binary files if are different... |
| 21:44.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | which binary files? |
| 21:44.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | which source files? |
| 21:44.55 | Pali | binary from http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/p/posix-locales/ |
| 21:45.07 | Pali | and source from https://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/posix-locales |
| 21:45.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | again: I don't see any of the textx of any of the apps in those |
| 21:45.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | texts* |
| 21:45.40 | Pali | on http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/p/posix-locales/ is version 2.7.2-1maemo7-binonly0+0m5 |
| 21:45.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | so what? |
| 21:45.54 | Pali | and on https://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/posix-locales 2.7.2-1maemo6 |
| 21:46.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | again, how's that related? |
| 21:46.24 | Pali | find source files of package posix-locales |
| 21:46.31 | Pali | for version 2.7.2-1maemo7-binonly0+0m5 |
| 21:46.40 | Pali | look at http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/p/posix-locales/posix-locales_2.7.2-1maemo7-binonly0%2b0m5.tar.gz |
| 21:46.51 | Pali | specialy at script update-from-git.sh |
| 21:46.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | where are the texts that show up e.g. on microb-menu? |
| 21:47.12 | Pali | these are posix locales |
| 21:47.17 | Pali | not microb locales |
| 21:47.34 | Pali | posix locales are used in coreutils, gnu apps, etc. |
| 21:47.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | headdesks |
| 21:47.52 | Pali | (maybe in busybox too, do not know) |
| 21:48.25 | Pali | and there are info for LC_NUMERIC |
| 21:48.28 | Pali | LC_TIME |
| 21:48.43 | Pali | and all other info used also on linux desktop... |
| 21:48.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/p/posix-locales/posix-locales_2.7.2-1maemo7-binonly0+0m5.tar.gz has zilch |
| 21:49.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | just the 23MB blob |
| 21:49.26 | Pali | look how that blob is generated |
| 21:49.46 | Pali | from https://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/posix-locales by script update-from-git.sh |
| 21:50.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | aha |
| 21:51.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/posix-locales/source/94d56d5480188e718bcace41ebe27f83b00f5a04:locales/de_DE looks pretty sparse |
| 21:51.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | I can't find *any* of the texts I'd expect in there |
| 21:51.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's the plain locale format definitions, no texts |
| 21:58.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | /usr/share/hildon/filemanager.desktop: Name=sfil_ap_name. sfil_ap_name is not defined in that maemo.gitorious.org aiui |
| 21:58.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | it however comes from /user/lib/locale/locale-archive |
| 22:00.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | all those tana_fi_homebutton and sfil_ap_name and what_not_elsefoobar come from those 23MB blob, and I never seen the source for all those definitions. timeless once published his own version of texts, since he wasn't too happy with the job done by Nokia's translators |
| 22:00.41 | *** join/#maemo xes (~xes@unaffiliated/xes) |
| 22:01.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | but aiui he was able to do this only because he had access to those non-published sourcefiles which the 23MB megablob locale-archibve gets built from |
| 22:04.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | otherwise I'd happily nuke that 23MB monster with all the cz_CZ and hu_HU and whatnot texts in it, and replace it by non-archived de_DE and en_EN locales only, which would eat <500k |
| 22:07.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | en_EN needed since nokia in their eternal wisdom decided to not use plain technical english texts in their source/binaries but rather that sfil_ap_name gibberish. Thus lang=C doesn't work in maemo, and if it would, you'd see filemanager named sfil_app_name and the menus look all similar to that |
| 22:08.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | allegedly the translators would get confused when they had real legible meaningful english texts like "filemanager" to translate, rather that "sfil_app_name" |
| 22:08.41 | nox- | oh dear... |
| 22:08.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/that/than/ |
| 22:11.41 | *** join/#maemo maybeHere (~cl@p5B16582C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:11.54 | *** join/#maemo dos1 (~dos@unaffiliated/dos1) |
| 22:12.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | nox-: ? |
| 22:14.18 | nox- | just those non-en string stuff |
| 22:14.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 22:16.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | RE/"decompress" and split into locales of that locale-archive 22.8MB would indeed be a heroic achievement and do a lot of benefit for maemo |
| 22:29.59 | *** join/#maemo andre__ (~andre__@wikimedia/aklapper) |
| 22:32.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | wonders where pali found any update-from-git.sh applicable for maemo |
| 22:34.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | but pali just left this server, without saying "good night" :-S |
| 22:34.30 | Sysaxed | http://sumoudou.org/Using%20the%20same%20.emacs%20file%20on%20a%20PC%20and%20Nokia%20N900%20GNU%20mobile%20phone.html |
| 22:34.38 | Sysaxed | holy shit what's wrong with this page |
| 22:35.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | err, the color? |
| 22:35.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | my eyes bleed, despite I closed the window after 1.75s |
| 22:36.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | prolly the result from following the instructions it gives |
| 22:39.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, at least it's W3Cxhtml and W3Ccss compliant ;-P |
| 22:39.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I'm blind now |
| 22:39.54 | Sysaxed | the tutorial part starts about here |
| 22:39.58 | Sysaxed | "To do this:</p> <ul> <li>Create the scripts: <table bgcolor="#000000" border="1"><tr><td border="0"><font color="#FFFF00"><b>" |
| 22:40.02 | Sysaxed | and so on... |
| 22:46.57 | *** join/#maemo jon_y_ (~enforcer@2001:e68:4053:3ece:e01f:8e6d:cdca:d0e5) |
| 22:48.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe run it through lynx twice or three times, to filter out the real info - though I dount it's worth the effort |
| 22:48.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | when somebody sends me such email, he's automatically on my spam blacklist |
| 22:50.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | and bg=#000000 fg=#ffff00 is on purpose, just for that the responsible person should receive special punishment |
| 22:52.26 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: wait, really? i thought C was supposed to be ascii english |
| 22:53.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | C is the default builtin text afaik |
| 22:53.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | which of course is _supposed_ to be plain english |
| 22:54.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | just that Nokia doesn't care |
| 22:55.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | tbh I have no clue what C really means |
| 22:55.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | I gather it's not the coding language |
| 22:59.51 | r00t|home | http://www.gnu.org/software/libc/manual/html_node/Standard-Locales.html |
| 22:59.59 | r00t|home | ''"C" |
| 22:59.59 | r00t|home | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:00.29 | r00t|home | note that locales are not just text translations, also behaviour of various i/o and string functions |
| 23:02.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 23:02.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway it's actually the coding language. Thanks for that quote |
| 23:02.29 | r00t|home | in that context 'C' makes sense |
| 23:03.11 | r00t|home | been wondering myself and looked it up, 5th google hit for: c locale |
| 23:03.33 | r00t|home | enjoy |
| 23:03.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 23:04.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | do you know of any tool to "unpack" locales-archive? |
| 23:04.40 | r00t|home | no... |
| 23:04.58 | r00t|home | find the tool to "pack" one and go from there? |
| 23:05.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, as "useless" as a disassembler |
| 23:05.43 | r00t|home | or just find the code libc uses to read it? |
| 23:05.52 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: Maybe you could appreciate viewing http://brolin.be/ in author mode with ECMAScript enabled? ;-) |
| 23:07.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | r00t|home: :nod: |
| 23:08.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | brolin_empey: hm? |
| 23:08.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | what's "author mode" ? |
| 23:09.48 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: A term used by Opera Desktop: author mode as opposed to user mode. |
| 23:09.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | errr |
| 23:10.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | no opera here |
| 23:11.53 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: Author mode means the document is presented as specified by the author of the document. |
| 23:13.10 | r00t|home | brolin_empey: sick |
| 23:14.54 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: User mode means the document is presented as specified by the user. |
| 23:15.46 | r00t|home | DocScrutinizer05: he's just trying to destroy what's left of your eyes after viewing that emacs tutorial... |
| 23:16.04 | *** join/#maemo dos1 (~dos@unaffiliated/dos1) |
| 23:16.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | thought as much ;-P |
| 23:16.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | r33b.net |
| 23:17.47 | *** join/#maemo Ex-Opesa (~Ex-Opesa@unaffiliated/ex-opesa) |
| 23:17.59 | brolin_empey | r00t|home: Maybe you would prefer http://brolin.be/clock/ over http://brolin.be/ ? |
| 23:18.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, found update-from-git.sh |
| 23:22.35 | brolin_empey | is finally installing the CSSU-stable because he wants to use modest to access a Google Mail account via the IMAP. |
| 23:23.48 | brolin_empey | IMAP on OMAP. ☺ |
| 23:47.36 | *** join/#maemo ALoGeNo (~alogeno@unaffiliated/alogeno) |