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| 03:21.51 | LLckfan | I am looking to speed up my computer and get all the crude off of it. What channel do I need for that |
| 03:22.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | #ubuntu? |
| 03:22.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | *win7? |
| 03:22.39 | Hurrian | #ssd |
| 03:22.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | #debian? |
| 03:23.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | Hurrian: you missed the idea to speed it up by deleting stuff. However futile |
| 03:24.25 | Hurrian | too tired to optimize my system nowadays, threw everything on a 128GB SSD and it all 'just works' now. |
| 03:25.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | optimize my system... lemme think! maybe get rid of friggin polypaudio? |
| 03:25.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | avahid |
| 03:25.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | any damn tracker, however it's called (akonadi prolly, nowadays) |
| 03:27.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | but honestly with an i5 and a 250GB SSD and a 2TB HD I don't feel like I need much "optimization" either |
| 03:30.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://privatepaste.com/64cad1e071 ;-P |
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| 03:31.29 | Hurrian | fwiw even a 32GB SSD to keep / on is way, way more than enough, just keep /home on a rust drive |
| 03:32.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | saturn:/ # df -h ~jr |
| 03:32.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on |
| 03:32.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | /dev/sdc3 867G 193G 673G 23% /home |
| 03:33.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | saturn:/ # df -h / |
| 03:33.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on |
| 03:33.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | /dev/sda2 79G 17G 59G 23% / |
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| 03:36.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | saturn:/ # time du -xsh / |
| 03:36.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | 16G / real 0m1.305s user 0m0.132s sys 0m0.633s |
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| 03:37.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | the latter one is quite impressive, eh? ;-) |
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| 03:40.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw I don't think you can find any good fast 32GB SSD nowadays |
| 03:40.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | prolly starts at 160 |
| 03:41.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, I missed read |
| 03:42.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | saturn:/ # time dd of=/dev/null if=/ssd-aux/x bs=50M count=100 |
| 03:42.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | 100+0 records in |
| 03:42.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | 100+0 records out |
| 03:42.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | 5242880000 bytes (5.2 GB) copied, 12.6627 s, 414 MB/s |
| 03:44.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | funny how write is faster than read |
| 03:45.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | might have one GB of write buffer |
| 03:50.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | how much NAND would you want on Neo900? |
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| 03:59.42 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: ideally? 1x32/64GB PCIe SSD |
| 04:01.25 | Hurrian | realistically? probably 32GB of SATA MicroSSD |
| 04:01.47 | Hurrian | if this could be done by interleaving 2x16GB chips, better. |
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| 04:04.41 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: what display connector is Neo900 planning to use, by the way? |
| 04:05.13 | Hurrian | same as on N900 or is the design free to use something new? |
| 04:07.30 | jonwil | Since the intent is to use the same display then one would be using the same display connector I would have thought |
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| 04:12.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, I asked for NAND, not for eMMC |
| 04:13.33 | jonwil | how much does the N900 have? |
| 04:13.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | err 256MB, no? |
| 04:13.46 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: ah, nand, as in what comes with a OneNAND? |
| 04:13.58 | Hurrian | well, guess we could get the cheapest stuff you can get your hands on |
| 04:14.19 | Hurrian | and dump fremantle into the emmc/sd/usb otg/etc |
| 04:15.34 | Hurrian | RAM would be the big elephant in the room - put savings from lower NAND storage to buy a OneNAND unit with more memory |
| 04:16.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | we can't get OneNAND with >512MB RAM |
| 04:16.40 | jonwil | So 512MB is the most the Neo900 can possibly have? |
| 04:16.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | so I guess we'll use a 1GB of RAM-only PoP chip, and place a discrete NAND chip next to SoC |
| 04:16.47 | jonwil | oh ok |
| 04:16.54 | jonwil | sounds good |
| 04:17.41 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: does the planned SoC support DDR3/DDR3L memory? |
| 04:17.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | thus I asked "how much NAND would you consider OK?" |
| 04:17.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | nope |
| 04:17.55 | Hurrian | aww |
| 04:18.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, I dunno if it *works* with DDr3, but it *supports* LPDDR1 only |
| 04:19.14 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: 32MB sounds healthy for NAND |
| 04:19.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | meh, nope |
| 04:19.31 | Hurrian | kernel/bootloader + tiny command line system? |
| 04:19.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's a regression from N900 |
| 04:20.54 | Hurrian | 512MB (N9/50 size)? |
| 04:21.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | sounds better |
| 04:21.38 | x29a | too bad that adding more RAM is so hard :/ 2GB like the blackberry q10 would be awesome |
| 04:22.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | omap37xx has an addr space for RAM of only 1GB |
| 04:22.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | by no means we can get any higher than that |
| 04:23.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | unless we go for omap5 |
| 04:23.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | which we prolly won't do |
| 04:23.26 | jonwil | and going for omap5 would defeat the purpose of the Neo900 |
| 04:23.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 04:23.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | largely |
| 04:23.45 | jonwil | the purpose is to be backwards compatible with the N900 as much as possible |
| 04:24.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | otherwise I wouldn't even stabd up in the morning to work on this |
| 04:24.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | stand up* |
| 04:25.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | since when we lose fremantle compatibility, we are competing with every other crappy android/whatever device out there |
| 04:26.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | and *I* for one would refuse to spend _any_ money on such a device, when it doesn't come with a promise of a proper fremantle |
| 04:27.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | porting debian could've done on shamgung galaxy9 since years |
| 04:28.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | fremantle binary compatibility is the single unique selling point of this platform |
| 04:28.59 | jonwil | I wont consider Neo900 "done" until the stock Fremantle dialer app and messaging app function 100% on Neo900. |
| 04:29.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 04:29.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | as well as any other app fresh from original extras repo |
| 04:29.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | aka "HAM working as well" |
| 04:29.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
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| 04:34.44 | jonwil | ok, so regarding Neo900 audio, do we know if we can even get the TLV320AIC34 (same audio chip as N900) for use in Neo900? |
| 04:44.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | Nikolaus is still pretty reluctant, but I'll convince him since we need that mixer/codec. Or did I get your question wrong? |
| 04:45.34 | jonwil | what I meant is, is there a supplier that we could buy it from |
| 04:45.55 | jonwil | I know for example that we wont be able to get the WL12xx wifi chip because we are too small |
| 04:45.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, check digikey: ~12EUR |
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| 04:46.04 | jonwil | ok, thats good to know |
| 04:46.28 | jonwil | Seems like the hardest chips to get hold of tend to be wireless chips (cellular, bluetooth, WiFi etc) |
| 04:46.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | and 1GB PoP |
| 04:48.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | in the end we might not be able to source anything better than 512/512 |
| 04:48.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | compatibility of 156p PoP 1GB RAM not yet checked |
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| 04:49.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | unless we find the magic supplier of N9 spare parts ;-) |
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| 05:10.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmmm |
| 05:10.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | IroN900:~# du -hs /opt |
| 05:10.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | 575M /opt |
| 05:28.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: Nikolaus lists WL1271-TiWi as option |
| 05:28.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | ( "LS Research" ?) |
| 05:29.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | WL1271-typeTN would look beeter though ( "Murata" ) |
| 05:29.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | better even |
| 05:29.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:30.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | BLE, dang |
| 05:30.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | TiWi has just BT2.1EDR |
| 05:33.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, but it says "software upgrade to BLE" |
| 05:37.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | UGH typeTN is HUUUGE |
| 05:39.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, actually Nikolaus says "TiWi5 like in pandaboard" - don't see how that relates to twl1271-TiWi |
| 05:41.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | we could use W2CBW0015 instead of W2CBW003, comes with b/g/n and BT3.0, significantly smaller than 003 (9.5*9.5*1.3 instead 12*12*1.5), based on 8787 |
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| 05:54.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | idly wonders: 802.11bgn+BT3.0 = 9.5*9.5*1.3mm; LTE modem: 30*37*2.1mm |
| 05:59.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | AAAH TiWi5: http://www.lsr.com/wireless-products/tiwi5 |
| 05:59.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | nice |
| 06:00.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | k, 13*18*1.9 |
| 06:02.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | a(!)bgn,2.1EDR/4.0BLE |
| 06:10.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | ifdly wonders how the 2.4GHz WiFi antenna will perform on 5GHz |
| 06:10.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | 5.8(!)GHz |
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| 06:38.51 | jonwil | seems like getting a better WiFi chip than the GTA04 isn't out of the question then |
| 06:39.39 | jonwil | better WiFi and bluetooth |
| 06:41.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 06:48.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | real hard sourcing is modem module |
| 06:48.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | the Option with 2.1mm is already most flat module you can find |
| 06:49.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | and it's still 0.6mm too high |
| 06:49.07 | jonwil | Even finding Option modem would have been nearly impossible if it wasn't for that one shop |
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| 07:12.25 | Timmy | how can I access stored SMSes in SIM card ? |
| 07:14.04 | Pali | on n900? no normal way |
| 07:14.46 | Timmy | yes, on n900. then what is the difficult method? |
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| 07:15.59 | Pali | RE isi/phonet library |
| 07:16.24 | Pali | I do not know about any way to access it now |
| 07:17.00 | Timmy | well, I'm going to find my Nokia 3310 |
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| 07:26.00 | jonwil | I dont know if the cellmo even supports accessing SMS on the SIM |
| 07:26.47 | jonwil | Oh wait it does |
| 07:26.48 | jonwil | or appears to |
| 07:26.51 | jonwil | com.nokia.csd.SMS.SIM exists |
| 07:27.17 | jonwil | Let me grep the codebase and see if anyone actually uses it |
| 07:27.22 | jonwil | grep the filesystem I mean |
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| 07:27.50 | Pali | jonwil: maybe creating program for access sim sms could be usefull! |
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| 07:29.19 | jonwil | maybe |
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| 07:41.01 | jonwil | ok so yes it looks like the cellular services daemon does support reading SIM SMS |
| 07:41.09 | jonwil | but nothing else on the system uses that functionalty |
| 07:41.33 | jonwil | And I dont know how to decode the SMSs as returned by the relavent dbus call |
| 07:41.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | why would any |
| 07:41.46 | FatPhil | Binary noise? |
| 07:42.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: check smscb |
| 07:42.28 | FatPhil | jonwil pastebin a few, see if any patterns drop out. |
| 07:42.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/usr/local/bin/smscb.py |
| 07:43.02 | jonwil | Maybe its a standard SMS PDU |
| 07:43.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | there won't be any patterns, it's 7/8 |
| 07:43.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, it is |
| 07:43.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | at least afaik |
| 07:48.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's a standard SMS "codec" on ~phonecontrol |
| 07:48.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~phonecontrol |
| 07:48.32 | infobot | somebody said phonecontrol was http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control |
| 07:49.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | modem can buffer SMS locally, store them to SIM, or directly and synchronously deliver them to APE |
| 07:50.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | theoretically |
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| 07:50.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | and - also theoretically - you can read the local buffer and the SIM SMS storage |
| 07:51.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I guess that's exactly what CSD does. All three of them |
| 07:51.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | probably from SIM it will read only SMS marked as "unread" |
| 07:54.20 | jonwil | CSD has specific dbus calls for SIM SMS |
| 07:54.38 | jonwil | and I dont think it feeds SIM SMSs to anything else in the AP stack, just regular incoming SMSs |
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| 07:55.07 | jonwil | i.e. the only way to read SIM SMSs is by calling manually com.nokia.csd.sms.sim |
| 07:57.35 | FatPhil | DocScrutinizer05: that was my reasoning: packed 7-bits is simple to decide |
| 07:57.39 | FatPhil | decode, even |
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| 08:33.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | 3gpp AT command lists give some inspiration how a modem *might* handle that stuff |
| 08:34.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | see http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=548948&postcount=52 |
| 08:40.47 | jonwil | I bet if I wanted to I could probably write something and use some code from ofono to decode the SMS (same as I did to decode the cell broadcast SMSs) |
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| 08:52.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: SMs from modem are always same encoding, no matter if realtime or read from SIM |
| 08:52.37 | jonwil | yeah |
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| 09:36.18 | joshgillies | hey Pali is 0xffff able to flash emmc yet? |
| 09:36.43 | joshgillies | noticed some activity in on the repo |
| 09:36.49 | Pali | no, 0xFFFF has no eMMC support |
| 09:36.49 | joshgillies | seems to be progressing nicely |
| 09:38.19 | joshgillies | good to know, thanks for the info :) |
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| 13:06.41 | jonwil | Still getting nowhere with pulseaudio stuff |
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| 13:14.46 | jonwil | I still cant figure out what tells pulseaudio-nokia-voice "hey, feed this audio through the cellular audio pathway and libcmtspeech" |
| 13:17.26 | jonwil | I also cant figure out just what processing is applied to VoIP (or to cellular) audio and whether we will need that same processing on the Neo900 or not |
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| 14:13.33 | DrCode | hi all |
| 14:14.37 | DrCode | for some resone cssu crashed in install, I will need to reflush meamo or Is it possible to reinstall it? |
| 14:24.37 | Defiant | uhm..this is bad |
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| 14:25.26 | Defiant | What is wrong when my n900 does not charge from AC-10E anymore? Tried a new charger => same problem. It still charges from USB |
| 14:28.33 | FatPhil | DrCode: I would hope that the install is just a sequence of apt commands, so should be relatively stateless, and capable of being rerun. Emphasis on "hope". |
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| 14:39.59 | DrCode | hi faari-ddr |
| 14:40.10 | DrCode | hi FatPhil |
| 14:40.28 | DrCode | I will reflaush it again |
| 14:41.35 | DrCode | I am waitting till my battery recharge |
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| 15:13.35 | Defiant | uhm does nokia still repair n900s? |
| 15:13.48 | wmarone | unlikely |
| 15:13.55 | Defiant | damn |
| 15:13.55 | wmarone | since they're probably all out of warranty by now |
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| 15:19.19 | Defiant | looks like I have to try fixing the usb myself then? :( |
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| 17:26.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | I guess in 35 min there's another council meeting? I hope this time all council members ahve a chance to join in, we got urgent need to discuss and coordinate elections |
| 17:27.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | thedead1440: sixwheeledbeast: chem|st: merlin1991: qwazix: ^^^ |
| 17:27.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~seen woody14619 |
| 17:28.01 | infobot | woody14619 <~Woody@66-162-186-66.static.twtelecom.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 28d 23h 34m 33s ago, saying: 'odd... Time to reboot. :)'. |
| 17:28.16 | sixwheeledbeast | FYI on holiday for a week starting now, lift just arrived. TTFN o/ Laters, DocScritinizer05 |
| 17:31.04 | qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, present! |
| 17:40.17 | Win7Mac | present! |
| 17:49.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | good |
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| 17:51.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | warfare: kolp: FatPhil: freemangordon: we'll need you there too, since I hope for discussion of karma as a mandatory prerequisite for elections |
| 17:52.21 | kolp | I'm (t)here, but can only pay attention tothe chat with half an eye |
| 17:53.57 | sono | are processes suspended when switching tasks? |
| 17:55.03 | FatPhil | DocScrutinizer05: meeting where? |
| 17:55.06 | kolp | sono: In maemo? No. |
| 17:55.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | #maemo-meeting |
| 17:55.22 | FatPhil | heaven forfend! |
| 17:56.20 | sono | must have been a freak incident |
| 17:56.29 | sono | i am downloading the debian image and switched to a second running xterm |
| 17:56.39 | sono | and when i switched back, the download was in a stall |
| 18:00.55 | sono | a nice device for its time |
| 18:00.59 | sono | never owned one before |
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| 18:01.14 | sono | i hope to make it my primary phone, perhaps |
| 18:03.48 | sono | sorry, i am talking about an n900 of course. |
| 18:09.08 | DrCode | hi all |
| 18:09.14 | DrCode | I try to flash again |
| 18:10.48 | DrCode | n.m |
| 18:10.50 | DrCode | It worked |
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| 18:47.59 | DrCode | hi all |
| 18:48.05 | DrCode | I have strange problem in n900 |
| 18:48.40 | DrCode | when I am using 3g data, I can ping to wan address, but it can't resolve names |
| 18:48.41 | DrCode | any idea? |
| 18:48.51 | Wizzup | dns not working? |
| 18:49.05 | DrCode | I tryid to had goole dns , nameserver 8.8.8.8 |
| 18:49.09 | DrCode | and it dosn';t work |
| 18:49.13 | DrCode | put ping work ok |
| 18:49.29 | DrCode | yes |
| 18:49.39 | DrCode | like somthing blocking udp port 53 |
| 18:50.13 | DrCode | Wizzup, any idea? |
| 18:51.05 | Wizzup | not really, beyond no name server being set |
| 18:51.36 | DrCode | ok |
| 18:51.39 | DrCode | I will check it again |
| 18:52.17 | DrCode | I use those flash: RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin |
| 18:52.18 | DrCode | RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin |
| 18:52.18 | DrCode | is it ok? |
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| 20:48.50 | sono | hmm it appears that xcb has an endianness bug resulting in a failed assertion at xcb_io.c:249 |
| 20:49.09 | sono | doesn't have a build toolchain up yet |
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| 20:59.52 | Pali | endianess bug?? |
| 21:00.17 | Pali | I think that endianness can appear only on big endian arch |
| 21:00.49 | Pali | because sw is probably written for pc/i386 little endian |
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| 21:08.39 | Pali | on armel (it is low endian) there should be no endianness problem in sw written for i386 |
| 21:10.19 | sono | right, silly me |
| 21:10.48 | sono | probably those (long)'s, the remote is 64bit. |
| 21:10.53 | sono | anyway, i'll look at it tomorrow |
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| 21:29.42 | Pali | use int64_t or int32_t |
| 21:29.54 | sono | yea i have no build toolchain |
| 21:29.59 | Pali | and no problem with longs... |
| 21:30.03 | sono | yea.. |
| 21:31.01 | Pali | but I heard that there are platforms which char is not 8 bit... |
| 21:31.10 | sono | some say so |
| 21:31.36 | sono | iirc, the pdp-11 was one |
| 21:31.45 | sono | i'm way to young for that stuff, however |
| 21:32.03 | sono | only knows the old days from lore |
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| 21:58.57 | Pali | ~bootmenu |
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| 23:23.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | DrCode: COMBINED is OK, not completely sure about VAANILLA, but looks right too |
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