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| 03:56.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmmmff |
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| 08:15.06 | Sicelo | hmm, don't know if 'm the only one with this.. but Nokia Maps seems to now pick the longest possible routes :( |
| 08:15.44 | Sicelo | it was perfect all along, finding shortest routes on the first go, even better than Google Maps |
| 08:17.38 | Sicelo | but now, now, to travel from Johannesburg, South Africa to Mbabane, Swaziland, Maps tells me to go through Botswana! wtf |
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| 09:03.56 | Sicelo | but now, now, to travel from Johannesburg, South Africa to Mbabane, Swaziland, Maps tells me to go through Botswana! wtf |
| 09:04.08 | Sicelo | aw.. sorry for repeat.. |
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| 10:17.17 | divVerent | the extras assistant... why does it not ask me for the source file? |
| 10:17.29 | divVerent | it asks me for debian.tar.gz and dsc, after uploading the .changes file |
| 10:17.50 | divVerent | but it does not ask for the orig.tar.gz |
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| 10:37.51 | freemangordon | divVerent: it decides on what to ask for based on your .dsc |
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| 10:38.36 | divVerent | freemangordon: the .dsc mentions the .orig.tar.gz |
| 10:38.38 | divVerent | dput did it right |
| 10:39.03 | freemangordon | divVerent: sorry, based on .changes, but lemme check once again, just to be sure |
| 10:39.09 | divVerent | .changes lists it too |
| 10:39.18 | divVerent | and yes, probably based on .changes, as that is uploaded first |
| 10:39.42 | freemangordon | divVerent: maybe .orig.tar.gz is already there? |
| 10:39.55 | divVerent | hm... I would wonder why |
| 10:40.01 | divVerent | given the package got released only days ago |
| 10:40.09 | divVerent | and Maemo didn't have it at all before |
| 10:40.20 | freemangordon | divVerent: which package is that? |
| 10:40.26 | divVerent | clex |
| 10:40.46 | freemangordon | or rather, may I look at .changes/.dsc? |
| 10:41.04 | divVerent | can you still see them on the build server? |
| 10:41.08 | divVerent | if not, I can upload separately |
| 10:41.26 | freemangordon | hmm, "Build succeeded" |
| 10:41.41 | divVerent | yes |
| 10:41.43 | divVerent | I used dput |
| 10:41.51 | divVerent | after the web interface looked like it would fail when I would do it |
| 10:41.58 | divVerent | due to not asking me for the orig file |
| 10:43.21 | freemangordon | strange |
| 10:45.53 | divVerent | another thing... is there a way to send Alt-F8 in the terminal? |
| 10:45.57 | divVerent | or ESC F8 |
| 10:46.00 | divVerent | esc esc 8 doesn't do |
| 10:47.23 | divVerent | ESC ESC [ 19 ~ seems to be the sequence |
| 10:47.58 | divVerent | hehe, typing that whole monster works ;) but is barely practicable |
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| 11:10.53 | divVerent | of course, not REALLY needed, I can change clex's config to not need that :P |
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| 11:23.41 | lexik | freemangordon: yes! after a few modifications, i have successfully packaged FANN library with dpkg-buildpackage, now, there are two files: the .deb package,a and .tar.gz one, to the extras-devel i must upload the .tar.gz? |
| 11:23.51 | Iridos | hm, are there any things I have to think of, ordering a new usb-charger for the N900? |
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| 11:25.16 | lexik | also there is an .dsc and .changes file, where to put them? |
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| 11:40.00 | vi___ | Yo. |
| 11:40.11 | vi___ | neo900 |
| 11:40.17 | vi___ | Very exciting! |
| 11:40.42 | vi___ | DocScrutinizer51: good afternoon. |
| 11:40.51 | vi___ | DocScrutinizer51: Is there an N900 BOM? |
| 11:44.04 | vi___ | Or indeed any note of the footprint of the white camera LEDs? |
| 11:46.16 | vi___ | Or possibly what the forward voltage of those LEDs are or perhaps the current supplied when thy flash? |
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| 12:21.48 | ccxCZ | http://www.staff.amu.edu.pl/~kalmar/blog/?p=247 << do we have this? |
| 12:22.37 | ccxCZ | or better yet some "hold modifier to right-click" configuration |
| 12:24.37 | ccxCZ | there's supposedly some "mouseemu" script that's supposed to be able to do that, but it's website is down |
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| 12:59.37 | vi___ | ccxCZ: Yes there is hold to right click. |
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| 13:01.07 | ccxCZ | is that on by default? can I change the delay? |
| 13:01.19 | vi___ | ccxCZ: read the second half of this wiki entry: |
| 13:01.20 | vi___ | |
| 13:01.26 | vi___ | http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping |
| 13:01.52 | vi___ | The above is keyboard modifier. |
| 13:02.03 | vi___ | I did not read your question close enough. |
| 13:03.42 | ccxCZ | I'd be really grateful to have mod-click so I can play few mouse-driven games via dosbox. it has keyboard remapper by itself but can't do a thing about mouse apparently |
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| 13:50.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi___: check the cam driver, it has comments about current |
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| 13:52.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | I am rather sure current been 300mA, max 0.5seconds. voltage prolly 5..6Vmaybe 8 |
| 13:53.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | max continuous current 50mA iirc |
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| 13:58.36 | vi___ | DocScrutinizer05: That sounds plausible. The 2 LEDs are in series. |
| 13:58.50 | vi___ | 300mA for 500mS. |
| 13:59.02 | vi___ | That is plenty meat. |
| 13:59.22 | vi___ | FYI they are a 2.15*1.65mm footprint. |
| 14:00.29 | vi___ | ccxCZ: The article I linked talks about mapping a keyboard modifier to middle and right click. |
| 14:00.46 | vi___ | AFAIK some users use that method to play dosbox games. |
| 14:01.49 | vi___ | The 8v Vf sounds plausible that is. |
| 14:02.04 | vi___ | by 8, I of course meant 6. |
| 14:09.52 | freemangordon | vi___: hi, long time no see |
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| 14:16.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi___: maybe it been 200mA, and maybe 0.7s or 0.4s |
| 14:17.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | check cam driver source! |
| 14:19.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | or even the fine wiki |
| 14:21.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Flash_Torch RTFM! |
| 14:21.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>It can flash brightly for a maximum of 0.5 s, with an LED current of no more than 320 mA, or be in torch mode for arbitrary duration, at a current of no more than 50 mA<< |
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| 14:35.51 | vi___ | DocScrutinizer05: Ty doc |
| 14:35.59 | vi___ | freemangordon: hello FMG. |
| 14:36.07 | vi___ | Yeah, I got a new job. |
| 14:36.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | yw, but pretty please check wiki! :-D |
| 14:36.13 | vi___ | I am now mega busy. |
| 14:36.35 | vi___ | Not much time for messing with technology. |
| 14:36.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi___: thanks for support on Neo900 |
| 14:36.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91142 |
| 14:36.56 | vi___ | If it is as good as the idea seems, I am all in! |
| 14:37.21 | vi___ | I really think you should look into things like kickstarter etc. |
| 14:37.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | we could need every help we can get, for fremantle porting task force |
| 14:37.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/need/use/ |
| 14:38.01 | *** mode/#maemo [+v povbot_] by ChanServ |
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| 14:39.03 | vi__ | oops, irssi had a fit! |
| 14:39.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | huh? |
| 14:40.13 | vi__ | I am using irssi on a windos box. |
| 14:40.36 | vi__ | I accidentally pressed ctrl+z |
| 14:40.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, windows term. I'm not familiar with those ;-P |
| 14:40.46 | vi__ | The whole thing spazzed out. |
| 14:41.05 | vi__ | I assume ctrl+z is left over from th 'nix version. |
| 14:41.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw 8V Vf is more likely than 6V |
| 14:41.32 | vi__ | 4V Vf for each LED? |
| 14:41.41 | vi__ | That seems quite high. |
| 14:41.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | yup, usual for blue end white LED of high power |
| 14:41.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/end/and/ |
| 14:42.11 | vi__ | oh. |
| 14:42.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | see nichia and osram 1W 3W 5W LEDs |
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| 14:42.40 | vi__ | LED like the cree XML have a Vf of ~3.1V at 1.5A |
| 14:42.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | and cree of course |
| 14:43.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | check again, iirc that's not true for blue and white |
| 14:43.42 | vi__ | I will. |
| 14:43.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, they differ a lot between types |
| 14:44.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | obviously those are 1W LEDs in N900 |
| 14:44.31 | vi__ | Yes, just 4V is probably the highest I have seen. I could not find a part number for the N900 flash LEDs though. |
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| 14:55.58 | lexik | /disconnect/names |
| 14:56.02 | lexik | fuuu |
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| 15:05.58 | ShadowJK | I've seen 4.5V Vf on a crappy chinaled |
| 15:06.30 | ShadowJK | Cree has LEDs with Vf around 2.7V @ 350mA, iirc |
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| 15:42.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: there probably is no part number / name of those LED available |
| 15:44.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: all I have is: |
| 15:44.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | Main PCB, Top User Interface Optical Semiconductor LED 2 Primary Camera Flash - High Intensity White 2 2.15 1.65 0.80 |
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| 15:50.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | and this looks pretty much like a crippled original Nokia BOM that got leaked to those guys who did the RE |
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| 15:53.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.electronicproducts.com/Nokia_N900_Mobile_Phone-whatsinside_text-90.aspx |
| 15:55.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | HTH |
| 15:55.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's best I could find |
| 15:59.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: "Typical forward voltage @ 1.4 A (V), 85°C: 37.0" ;-P |
| 15:59.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.cree.com/LED-Components-and-Modules/Products/XLamp/Arrays-NonDirectional/XLamp-CXA3050 |
| 16:03.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED Components and Modules/HB/Data Sheets/CLM1CWKW(879) "TYPICAL ELECTRICAL & OPTICAL CHARACTERISTICS (TA = 25°C)" "Vf typ: 3.2V max:4.0V" |
| 16:07.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED Components and Modules/HB/Data Sheets/CLA1A(1075) typ:3.6V max:4.2V |
| 16:08.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | all no high power LEDs which tend to have even higher Vf usually, afaik |
| 16:11.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | generally 1W LEDs seem to average at 2.3V for red and orange, 3.5V for green blue and white |
| 16:15.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.media.highlight-led.de/products/documents/pdf/77900010.pdf |
| 16:21.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | very interesting: http://www.uskoreahotlink.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/1-Watt.pdf with a binning/rank of 4=3.3V Vf to 10=4.0V Vf |
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| 16:27.33 | Apic | goldkatze: *caress* |
| 16:30.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | also interesting (I didn't know of it yet): >> In particular, if a reverse voltage is continuously applied to the product, such operation can cause migration resulting in LED damage << |
| 16:31.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | winks to all OC-fanboys who seem to think EM is a hoax |
| 16:33.46 | ShadowJK | lookup Cree XP-G and XR-E too |
| 16:38.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | cree.com seems to no longer provide info for those |
| 16:39.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED Components and Modules/XLamp/Data and Binning/XLampXPG.pdf |
| 16:39.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | Vf 3.25V |
| 16:40.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | typ |
| 16:42.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway in the end who cares about Vf? It's mandatory to operate those LEDs by a constant current source |
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| 16:54.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | XR-E Vf (white >5000° (!!)) 3.7V |
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| 18:11.21 | bennypr0fane | hello, I'd like to install kernel power 52, but the version I find in HAM is 51r1, (have extras-devel enabled) |
| 18:14.23 | bennypr0fane | does anyone know where I would find 52? |
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| 18:20.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | o.O |
| 18:20.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | allegedly KP52 got promoted to extras-devel, for all I know |
| 18:21.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pkg |
| 18:21.08 | infobot | pkg is probably http://maemo.org/packages/ |
| 18:22.10 | Wulfe | it did |
| 18:22.24 | Wulfe | there is a forums posting on it at least saying so |
| 18:22.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/kernel-power-flasher/2.6.28-10power52/ |
| 18:23.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/kernel-power/2.6.28-10power52/ |
| 18:23.29 | Wulfe | http://www.tizenexperts.com/2013/04/announce-kernel-power-stable-v52-extras-devel/ |
| 18:23.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | tizenWUT? |
| 18:24.06 | Wulfe | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=89823 |
| 18:24.15 | Wulfe | idk some blogger |
| 18:25.14 | Wulfe | but he sourced it right off maemo.org so i know he is accurate |
| 18:28.21 | bennypr0fane | then why do I see only 51r1 in HAM? |
| 18:28.40 | bennypr0fane | is there another way to install it? |
| 18:29.13 | Wulfe | apt-get "kernel-power-flasher" |
| 18:29.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly I don't know. Seems something is flawed. Please ask Pali and freemangordon and merlin1991 to investigate what's wrong, and them fix it ASAP |
| 18:30.18 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: check your distribution. Also make sure you did refresh |
| 18:30.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | you're supposed to see KP52 in HAM, definitely |
| 18:31.06 | merlin1991 | it's definitely in extras |
| 18:31.55 | Wulfe | yeah i am looking at it in the repo now, it is there. something wrong on his end. |
| 18:32.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | apt-cache policy |
| 18:33.15 | bennypr0fane | freemangordon I'm on thumb 8.2 |
| 18:33.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | oooh, and could somebody fix apt-cache to show full repo URL pretty please!? KTNX |
| 18:33.32 | freemangordon | shouldn't matter |
| 18:33.49 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: as long as you haev maemo-extras repo enabled |
| 18:33.52 | freemangordon | *have |
| 18:34.11 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: in HAM, click on the menu and selct "Refresh" |
| 18:34.17 | freemangordon | select even |
| 18:34.35 | bennypr0fane | ok, done |
| 18:34.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | disable extras-devel |
| 18:34.43 | Wulfe | and make sure you are not using multiboot |
| 18:34.46 | freemangordon | that fast? |
| 18:34.50 | Wulfe | use u-boot instead |
| 18:34.51 | bennypr0fane | i.e. "done" |
| 18:35.00 | Wulfe | it will break with multiboot |
| 18:35.13 | bennypr0fane | as done is after hitting a button in HAM... |
| 18:35.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | everything breaks with multiboot ;-P |
| 18:35.19 | Wulfe | indeed |
| 18:35.20 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: HAM refreshed the catalogues in 10 seconds?!? |
| 18:35.23 | freemangordon | ooh |
| 18:35.28 | bennypr0fane | no multiboot |
| 18:35.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~maemo-multiboot |
| 18:35.31 | infobot | rumour has it, maemo-multiboot is deprecated, and a horrible hack. PROBLEMS WITH NITDROID/MULTIBOOT? reflash rootfs&kernel aka COMBINED |
| 18:35.31 | Wulfe | good |
| 18:36.09 | bennypr0fane | just reflashed, acutally after corrupted fs |
| 18:36.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | disbale extras-devel (and extras-testing) |
| 18:37.00 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: wait ;) |
| 18:37.03 | freemangordon | http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle-1.3/free/k/kernel-power/ |
| 18:37.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | KP52 is in extras aiui |
| 18:37.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | ugh |
| 18:37.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok, scratch that |
| 18:37.27 | freemangordon | hates that shit |
| 18:37.36 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: though I wonder... |
| 18:37.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | me not: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/kernel-power/2.6.28-10power52/ |
| 18:37.54 | freemangordon | according to the logs on stage, this SHOULD be in 1.2 and 1.3 repos |
| 18:38.13 | freemangordon | but not here http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle-1.3/free/k/kernel-power/ |
| 18:38.28 | bennypr0fane | Doc well I don't get it. it's in devel, right? |
| 18:38.29 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: check your maemo-extras distribution |
| 18:38.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | FSCK DAMN fremantle-1.3!!!! |
| 18:38.42 | freemangordon | it should be fremantle, not fremantle-1.3 |
| 18:38.43 | bennypr0fane | maemo-extras? |
| 18:38.48 | bennypr0fane | aha |
| 18:38.58 | bennypr0fane | I have 1.3 |
| 18:39.08 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: I think it is about time to fix that shit |
| 18:39.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | there *is* *no* fremantle-1.3 |
| 18:39.29 | bennypr0fane | in all the extras repos, or just stable? |
| 18:39.37 | freemangordon | all of them |
| 18:39.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | fremantle-1.3 is actually fremantle, plain vamilla fremantle without fancy extensions |
| 18:40.10 | bennypr0fane | is missing the tab button on n900 in xchat |
| 18:40.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | tab? |
| 18:40.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | for nick expansion? use shift-space |
| 18:40.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jr-xchat |
| 18:40.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jrxchat |
| 18:40.54 | infobot | jrxchat is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/xchat/ |
| 18:41.13 | bennypr0fane | DocScrutinizer05, ha, awesome |
| 18:41.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | yw |
| 18:41.34 | bennypr0fane | jrxchat is not xchat? |
| 18:43.12 | lexik | i'm trying to upload my package but: "Upload error, no repository selected!" ? |
| 18:43.32 | freemangordon | lexik: select repository :P |
| 18:43.39 | freemangordon | fremantle, diablo,... |
| 18:44.05 | lexik | freemangordon: :P... i did that.. twice |
| 18:44.22 | lexik | twice times the same error |
| 18:44.26 | freemangordon | lexik: obviously she doesn;t like you :P |
| 18:44.37 | lexik | probably |
| 18:45.45 | freemangordon | lexik: what browser? |
| 18:47.06 | lexik | chromium |
| 18:47.24 | freemangordon | lexik: have mozilla aound? |
| 18:47.46 | lexik | iceweasel |
| 18:47.47 | bennypr0fane | it's kinda like my backspace key is broken |
| 18:48.12 | lexik | i will try it with it |
| 18:51.12 | lexik | thats really weird.. extras assistant is looking absolutely differently in firefox than in chromium :D |
| 18:51.22 | lexik | nicer :D |
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| 18:54.38 | freemangordon | lexik: besides looking nicer, does it work? |
| 18:54.46 | bennypr0fane | i can move the cursor in ham, but not deleting |
| 18:55.10 | lexik | ... nope. |
| 18:55.15 | lexik | the same error |
| 18:55.37 | lexik | is is caused by browser? |
| 18:55.42 | freemangordon | lexik: hmm, weird |
| 18:55.51 | freemangordon | NFC, never seen such an error |
| 18:56.03 | lexik | i can try chrome :/ |
| 18:56.52 | bennypr0fane | ah, it works for devel and testing, but not maemo.org. can't delete that 1.3 from fremantle |
| 18:57.22 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: wait a bit |
| 18:59.20 | bennypr0fane | you mean before Itry to delete 1.3? I waited for more than 5 mins. moving the cursor worled in that time |
| 18:59.33 | bennypr0fane | *and also worked |
| 18:59.51 | freemangordon | bennypr0fane: wait for me to fix the repo :D |
| 19:00.53 | bennypr0fane | ok |
| 19:01.23 | bennypr0fane | but devel and testing are already good? |
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| 19:30.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | starting public technical discussion / hearing, about the fremantle-1.3 issue |
| 19:32.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | assumption: fremantle-1.3 repo been invented for whatever reasons during times of PR1.2, to be "safe for future" as a symlink to fremantle repo, and during migration#1/consolidation some funny guy "mirrored" the repo and converted the symlink to a separate unlinked repository dir during the process |
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| 19:34.49 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: actually the real repos are different, but got synced from one and the same source. IIUC |
| 19:35.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | my first suggestion been to simply nuke the complete fremantle-1.3 repo, since it's redundant and cruft and serves no particular purpose. But I've been told that flashing gets you fremantle-1.3 repo instead of fremantle repo |
| 19:35.28 | freemangordon | correct |
| 19:36.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | now while this is a brainfart done by somebody in nokia, if it's correct, we now have to deal with it |
| 19:37.07 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: again, IMO, simply symlinking 1.3 to fremantle on stage will solve that next time a package enters extras. And I will push autobuildertest in extras to make that happen |
| 19:37.38 | freemangordon | we'll still have lots of wasted HD space, but at least stuff will work |
| 19:37.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | further implication: during (or after) consolidation some of the builder/repomanagement scripts obviously got messed up, so now we have dependencies to fremantle-1.3 even in those scripts |
| 19:38.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | where from does the wasted HD space come, wehn we effectively nuke freamntle-1.3 and replace it by a symlink? |
| 19:40.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | what I anticipate is a mega disaster by repo-management running over the same rapo two times |
| 19:40.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | repo even |
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| 19:41.41 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: we'll do that on stage, but not on live |
| 19:41.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | what is live? |
| 19:42.16 | freemangordon | "/var/repository/live", this is what you see when you open http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle-1.2/free/ for example |
| 19:42.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | so what is stage? |
| 19:42.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | and actually, who would want to open fremantle-1.2? |
| 19:43.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | could you come up with a better not so fringe case example please? |
| 19:43.19 | freemangordon | autobuilder puts the packages in incoming, queue manager puts the on stage "/var/repository/stage" and rsync_to_live.sh copies stage to live |
| 19:43.28 | freemangordon | *them |
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| 19:43.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | why? |
| 19:44.02 | freemangordon | NFCm but that is how it works |
| 19:44.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | we don't need to rsync from one dir to another dir on same physical and even logical machine, eh? |
| 19:44.42 | freemangordon | I guess this is a legacy from the times there were lots of "live" servers |
| 19:44.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | possibly |
| 19:45.12 | freemangordon | and those were different machines |
| 19:45.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | so first of all we need to nuke that cruft |
| 19:45.39 | freemangordon | I guess we don;t need to rsync, but that would mean a major rewrite IMO |
| 19:45.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | if it's actually nothing else but just an rsync |
| 19:46.17 | freemangordon | And I'd rather have it working as it is supposed to work before I "fix" it :) |
| 19:46.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | rewrite? I think we can simply retire the whole process step |
| 19:47.04 | freemangordon | maybe |
| 19:47.50 | freemangordon | or no, I am not sure what will happen while packages.gz etc are being rebuilt |
| 19:48.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok, actually irrelevant. Why do we keep fremantle-1.3 on live? |
| 19:48.38 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: but see, the first to do is to fix that 1.3 crap |
| 19:49.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | fremantle-1.3 has to go, for good |
| 19:49.36 | freemangordon | because of the reflash. but ask gregoa or someone who knows repos better than me what will happen if you have the same packages.gz for different distributions |
| 19:49.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | then after we eradicated it, we will eventually create a convenience-symlink for those poor users who got fremantle-1.3 in their list of catalogs |
| 19:50.00 | freemangordon | I have NFC if distribution is included in .gz file |
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| 19:50.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | see: [2013-09-02 21:32:52] <DocScrutinizer05> assumption: fremantle-1.3 repo been invented for whatever reasons during times of PR1.2, to be "safe for future" as a symlink to fremantle repo, and during migration#1/consolidation some funny guy "mirrored" the repo and converted the symlink to a separate unlinked repository dir during the process |
| 19:51.35 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: there are 2 "repos", one is "stage" the other is "live" |
| 19:51.49 | freemangordon | ^^^ happened on "stage" iiuc |
| 19:51.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | verify that assumption, then act accordingly. When it got introduced during consolidation, we can as well nuke it now |
| 19:52.38 | freemangordon | the only way to verify it is to mv fremantle-1.3 from stage and to symlink fremantle-1.3->fremantle. But won;t do it now, I run out of time |
| 19:53.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | or, in other words: if it been a symlink before consolidation then there can't be any problems in making it a symlink again, now |
| 19:53.12 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: sure |
| 19:53.39 | freemangordon | actually there are problems now it is not a symlink :) |
| 19:53.47 | dos1 | I dunno how it works here, but in SHR we're rsyncing from staging dir to "production" exactly for that reason with rebuilding package lists |
| 19:53.59 | freemangordon | dos1: :nod: |
| 19:54.04 | freemangordon | my point exactly |
| 19:54.07 | dos1 | and if something breaks during builds, repo is left intact and safe |
| 19:54.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | fair point |
| 19:55.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | but a rsync would keep symlinks as symlinks, no? |
| 19:55.23 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: so please, discuss with someone who knows how repos work, to explain if it is possible to have different distributions using one and the same packages.gz file |
| 19:55.53 | dos1 | it would, but AFAIR only if you use it with proper options |
| 19:56.00 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: I guess no, maybe it depends on how is rsync called. and maybe it was hardlink, not symlink |
| 19:56.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, I'm afk now for some RL urgent stuff. I think somebody else has to pick up on where I leave here and now |
| 19:56.27 | freemangordon | guys, gtg, night, will continue tomorrow |
| 19:56.32 | freemangordon | :) |
| 19:57.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | I can't take care of every single BS char in any single script |
| 19:57.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are guys much more experiencend than I am, with repositories |
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| 19:58.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't see the benefit and I don't see any free schedule in my calendar, to manage fremantle-1.3 sanitizing |
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| 19:58.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | ther are ~45 guys around here who are better qualified to sort this issue |
| 19:59.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | if it doesn't get sorted soon, I eventually will simply nuke fremantle-1.3 and wait for the impact |
| 20:00.32 | *** part/#maemo Sysaxed (~alex@82.131.46.32.cable.starman.ee) |
| 20:02.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | meanwhile you could start with checking what in Packages.gz and signature of a repo might be hardlinked to the repo's name (fremantle vs fremantle-1.3) |
| 20:03.38 | xes | hi DocScrutinizer05... does my repo comparison sorted something? |
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| 20:04.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | I didn't use it for anything yet, but I hope others will do, soon. |
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| 20:05.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | you're free to post the link to those files here |
| 20:05.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | so everybody willing to help can access them |
| 20:05.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | please keep this running without me pushing and coordinating it |
| 20:05.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | I cannot do this |
| 20:07.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | it would require too much learning about repository management that i'm not an expert, and I have no time to do this, my plate is already filled. |
| 20:08.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | so, it's up to the community now to investigate and fix this issue, before in maybe 2 weeks we are forced to simply nuke fremantle-1.3 and nothing been done to mitigate the fallout |
| 20:10.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you can dig up any historical info why and when fremantle-1.3 got invented, by whom, and based on which rationale, etc. - please by all means speak up here |
| 20:26.04 | xes | freemangordon: have you seen my repo comparison? |
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| 20:30.03 | freemangordon | xes: no. don't have time now, GF needs my attention :) |
| 20:30.54 | Apic | goldkatze: wb |
| 20:31.25 | xes | freemangkrdon: NMI ...not masquerable interrupt :) |
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| 20:36.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | Apic: YOLD 3149? ddate? |
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| 20:40.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | jr@saturn:~> ddate |
| 20:40.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | Today is Setting Orange, the 26th day of Bureaucracy in the YOLD 3179 |
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| 20:47.59 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: just googled neo900. We've already got few mentions in Slashdot comments under Elop-as-possible-MS-CEO article and some comments/posts in russian, czech and french forums; facebook post from italian fanpage of N900 owners, few tweets etc. |
| 20:49.03 | dos1 | "for this price I can get shiny quad-core phone" theme appeares quite often, but it was easy to predict; there are also some enthusiastic voices (at least that they seem to be enthisiastic via google translate :D) |
| 20:49.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehe |
| 20:50.04 | dos1 | there are some fears coming from ex-Freerunner owners who weren't happy with it |
| 20:50.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | at this price you can even get a hooker for 4 weeks to 2 years, in some countries |
| 20:50.42 | dos1 | or s/owners/users/ |
| 20:51.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | or find somebody to shoot you down |
| 20:51.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think Neo900 better compared to a hooker than to a quad-core phone |
| 20:52.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) |
| 20:52.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | since it neither is a phone, nor has it quad or dual cores |
| 20:53.01 | dos1 | let's build better neo900... with hookers! and blackjack! |
| 20:53.48 | LjL-Alps | on the other hand, it has a keyboard that can slide in and out, it's only so slightly resistive to touch, and its back is magnetic |
| 20:53.51 | LjL-Alps | sounds like hookers to me |
| 20:54.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | so for 700EUR you also get: a very nice x86 PC; a full week of booze from morning till whatever time you fail to open your eyes; a gun; a 20kg bag full of really exciting surplus electronics; a case for your iPhone;... meh, gets boring |
| 20:56.57 | Wizzup | and mips? |
| 20:57.00 | *** join/#maemo BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 20:57.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | on a sidenote, today we first time see >10% of voters for >=700 |
| 20:57.11 | Wizzup | I like paprika mips |
| 20:57.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | and we got a rate of ~10% / week for 700-sweetspot |
| 20:59.09 | dos1 | looks pretty optimistic too me |
| 20:59.57 | dos1 | gathering 200 orders for 700+ will still take some time, but it seems to be doable from those results |
| 21:00.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | ack |
| 21:01.15 | dos1 | and there were few posts mentioning wish for changing their votes to higher ones |
| 21:01.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | obviously next step is: somebody needs to do a rough port of fremantle to a GTA04 and show off some basic icon juggling and a xterm |
| 21:02.26 | dos1 | and /me, who failed to notice "complete device" in poll question and voted for what he'd pay at most, even if only for board |
| 21:02.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | haha |
| 21:03.43 | dos1 | I wonder if more votes could be higher for the same reason |
| 21:04.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | some may go higher, some others may go down, after initial excitement |
| 21:04.29 | dos1 | yeah |
| 21:04.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't give too much about this poll |
| 21:04.43 | *** join/#maemo soltys (soltys@soltys.info) |
| 21:05.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | it served it's pupose to attract interest |
| 21:05.32 | dos1 | let's hope those who will go down are 1000 EUR and will drop to 700 :D |
| 21:05.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | users are eager to vote on polls |
| 21:06.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | I see this more like a statistic |
| 21:07.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | thus, the >10% are way more exciting to me than the 250 votes total or the 25 votes for >=700 |
| 21:07.54 | dos1 | right, I was expecting even higher percentage on the left side that it is now |
| 21:08.10 | lexik | I'm still 'initialy excited', the $500 is MINIMUM which i'm ABLE to pay, when i will see working prototype (with camera (!)) and with some +features i can make some +many and pay 700+... but now, it is just 'poll-about-nothing' |
| 21:08.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | and we had this ~10% figure from very beginning, and I notice it's increasing slightly, which tells me I suceed in explaining what this device will be and how much it has to cost |
| 21:09.16 | LjL-Alps | i will pay $200 but only if it's got a back glass that GLITTERS |
| 21:10.59 | lexik | when we will have a working prototype, is a fracking good idea to make an kickstarter project where can users offer Neo for better price (that's problem i know..) |
| 21:11.32 | dos1 | I'll pay 1337 EUR if it's got ponies everywhere on it! |
| 21:12.31 | lexik | bronies must die |
| 21:12.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | we're still sorting out basic feasibility of whole project (Nikolaus still waiting for a N900 to disassemble and investigate), after that's done we will come up with a sort of cowdfunding for the prototypes |
| 21:12.39 | dos1 | lexik: some crowdfunding may be needed for producing prototypes, as those are the costliest beasts |
| 21:13.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | first guess is ~10k for prototypes |
| 21:13.42 | FIQ | hi |
| 21:13.54 | lexik | crowdfunding is the only option ;) |
| 21:14.19 | lexik | or some billionaire TMO user |
| 21:14.27 | FIQ | I've been frustrated over some odd bug where xchat will disconnect immediately when reading scrollback containing something evil |
| 21:14.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, again this shit? |
| 21:15.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | I thought that got fixed |
| 21:15.09 | FIQ | After some experimenting, I found the bad line -- however I'm not sure if submitting it to a bugtracker would be a good idea due to potential abuse |
| 21:15.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's basically known |
| 21:15.33 | FIQ | ok |
| 21:15.50 | FIQ | hm |
| 21:15.51 | *** join/#maemo shentey (~shentey@g225185242.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 21:15.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | we had similar attack some 1 or two years ago |
| 21:16.03 | FIQ | wonder where I can submit a report about it then |
| 21:16.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/clean-N900xchat-scrollback-from-rogue-string.sh |
| 21:18.02 | FIQ | # have this rogue string, assuming xchat stopped logging to the file on receiving the string. |
| 21:18.20 | FIQ | this is not fully correct, xchat kept running just fine and logged etc |
| 21:18.21 | Earthwings | hi DocScrutinizer05 |
| 21:18.29 | FIQ | only on connect did the issue arise |
| 21:18.50 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: seems we're close to get shentey into full maintainer role for marble |
| 21:19.07 | FIQ | also it seems to search for something vastly different |
| 21:19.12 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: one last thing i'd like to do is to make him an admin of the marble package so he can promote packages to -testing |
| 21:19.44 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: either i miss the correct page to manage that or i can't change that on my own? |
| 21:19.46 | FIQ | sec |
| 21:21.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | FIQ: I didn't say it's a 100% remake of that other attack, I just sayd the hoax is known, based on bugs in utf-8 handling |
| 21:21.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | Earthwings: you *should* be able to change other users' permissions in your project |
| 21:22.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | on garage |
| 21:22.14 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: shentey is marked as an admin there already |
| 21:22.48 | FIQ | ok |
| 21:22.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, then this is another bug in sync-users-groups.php script |
| 21:23.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | the script is known to only propagate new users and new projects, but not correctly forwards changes |
| 21:23.34 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: although i didn't change that setting in years |
| 21:24.01 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: shall i remove and re-add him? or may that hurt? |
| 21:24.04 | *** join/#maemo BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 21:24.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | ask merlin1991 or freemangordon to fix shentey's permissions on drop and whatever needed |
| 21:25.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | errr. I think it won't help since the friggin script also doesn't remove users |
| 21:25.08 | Macer | no lumia 1020 for tmobile . blah heh |
| 21:25.11 | Macer | damn you at&t! |
| 21:25.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | lemme check sth |
| 21:25.32 | *** join/#maemo Xzanth (~Xzanth@xzanth.com) |
| 21:25.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | project name is marble? |
| 21:25.50 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: right |
| 21:26.38 | Earthwings | Added Usershentey2012-11-02 12:10 |
| 21:26.47 | Earthwings | so still somehow recent ;-) |
| 21:36.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, no dice in midgard either. Try to request maintainership for the project |
| 21:38.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.org/packages/view/marble/ "Request to be maintainer of this package" ( http://maemo.org/packages/maintainer/request/marble/ ) |
| 21:39.51 | shentey | DocScrutinizer05: requested |
| 21:40.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | approved |
| 21:42.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | wow, this terribly messed up the package interface page http://maemo.org/packages/view/marble/ |
| 21:42.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | but it had some effect at least |
| 21:43.36 | shentey | DocScrutinizer05: thx a lot! |
| 21:43.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | shentey: please check http://maemo.org/packages/view/marble/ |
| 21:44.33 | shentey | I still don't see the promote links |
| 21:45.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | thismight take some time to propagate to wherever it's queried anyway |
| 21:45.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | check again tomorrow, if it still doesn't work, please pester freemangordon about "promotion not working (only for some maintainers)" |
| 21:46.13 | shentey | I'm listed as maintainer already, though |
| 21:46.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 21:46.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | this are like 6 VM that need occasional sync |
| 21:47.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | done by cronjobs and scripts |
| 21:48.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | might even need a new repo build until you're in the list of maintainers for the package to promote, I dunno, really |
| 21:48.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, afk |
| 21:49.10 | shentey | alright, I'll be waiting until the schizophrenia settles ;) |
| 21:49.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 21:49.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry for the inconvenience |
| 21:49.42 | shentey | DocScrutinizer05: np, thx for helping me out |
| 21:52.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh shentey, Earthwings: what's about monav in extras-devel? should it get fixed, or nuked, or renamed? |
| 21:53.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | or might you maybe review your package dependencies in marble? |
| 21:53.16 | shentey | DocScrutinizer05: good question... Earthwings said it wouldn't work with Marble |
| 21:53.17 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: would love to have it nuked. not sure if anyone might use it though. |
| 21:53.45 | *** join/#maemo SmilyOrg (Smily@149.126.141.17) |
| 21:53.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | who maintains it? |
| 21:54.01 | Earthwings | the file format has changed. monav 0.3 files are incompatible with it |
| 21:54.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | couldn'tyou DEPEND on a working revision of monav? |
| 21:54.49 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: does the package manager handle that? |
| 21:54.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep, afaik it does |
| 21:55.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | check mp-fremantle-pr, full of dependencies to specific versions |
| 21:56.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually that#s the only purpose of this friggin MP |
| 21:56.42 | Earthwings | shentey: can you check whether that works? changing the monav dependency in the control file |
| 21:57.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe you got no dependency on monav at all? |
| 21:57.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, I'm out |
| 21:57.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | OO |
| 21:58.46 | Earthwings | DocScrutinizer05: ah, right, it's truly optional. iirc i tried with conflicts entries, but the package manager did bring up error messages then (or uninstall packages) |
| 21:59.26 | shentey | yeah, I can try that |
| 22:00.09 | shentey | bot not tonight any more... |
| 22:01.18 | *** part/#maemo benedikt (~benedikt@unaffiliated/benedikt) |
| 22:07.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: a huge amount of voters will be willing to shell out another 100 or 200 once there's actually something to show off |
| 22:08.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: ideally, a fremantle on GTA04 with above mentioned ison tossing and xterm, *plus a compass app* |
| 22:09.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | to demonstrate you can make use of the new features under good'ole fremantle |
| 22:10.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | port friggin SHR dialer or whatever to show GSM working as well ("we will see how much effort it cost us to push maemo dialer to work") |
| 22:10.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | should be feasible in a person-week of work |
| 22:11.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | after all they ported fremantle to other platforms already |
| 22:11.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | (sure also without any of the nokia blobs) |
| 22:14.17 | *** join/#maemo Mike11 (~Mike@unaffiliated/mike11) |
| 22:14.33 | shentey | DocScrutinizer05: which platforms? |
| 22:15.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | shentey: see |
| 22:15.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91142 |
| 22:17.25 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: I agree with you. I'd like to help, but I don't have GTA04, and well, I don't think I want to start porting Fremantle to GTA02 :P |
| 22:18.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | shentey: or did you mean this one http://www.omappedia.com/wiki/Maemo_Getting_Started |
| 22:23.04 | shentey | it's been ported to the BeagleBoard... interesting |
| 22:24.45 | *** join/#maemo quackquack1 (~testuser@unaffiliated/quackquack) |
| 22:38.07 | x29a | oh id love to see the neo900 thing happen |
| 22:38.12 | x29a | but with > 512mb ram |
| 22:41.38 | *** join/#maemo drathir (~kamiljk8@s51.linuxpl.com) |
| 22:42.44 | entitled | Hardware keyboard or the lack of it, is a deal-breaker for me |
| 22:46.13 | *** join/#maemo sheepbat (~lev3k@c-98-238-227-32.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 22:48.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | both topics already answered in |
| 22:48.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91142 |
| 22:49.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | n900 case *has* a kbd, and >512MB isn't feasible on DM3730 it seems, but we will try to find a really good alternative |
| 22:51.30 | *** join/#maemo BCMM (~BCMM@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 22:55.34 | *** part/#maemo sheepbat (~lev3k@c-98-238-227-32.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 22:57.53 | dos1 | finally! |
| 22:58.13 | dos1 | looks like i finally memorized ln syntax correctly! |
| 22:58.39 | nox- | ln works like cp just it doesnt copy but links |
| 22:58.42 | dos1 | when I tried to make some symlink, I was *always* getting arguments in the wrong way :D |
| 22:59.57 | dos1 | yeah, now it seems easy... :D |
| 23:01.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | I sometimes get weird results on ln, particularly when trying to link a dir |
| 23:02.09 | Macer | hm |
| 23:02.15 | Macer | can't seem to find out where you change the search engine for pale moon |
| 23:02.39 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: if you mix up the order, then you'll make symlink inside the folder you wanted to link to |
| 23:04.01 | dos1 | and that always happened to me... and each time I thought "now i'll do it the other way than usual", but did the same anyway |
| 23:04.31 | dos1 | dunno why; now it was the first time i noticed that i did it correctly few times in row :D |
| 23:07.28 | ecc3g | has anyone ever played with an x86 smartphone? I wonder how bad they are in terms of battery life, features, etc. (ignore the OS :) |
| 23:33.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think x86 smartphones are vaporware, or a big hoax |
| 23:33.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | I son't even know of x86 tablets to be honest |
| 23:33.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | don't* |
| 23:37.13 | nox- | maybe he means ultrabooks? |
| 23:37.33 | nox- | but yeah x86 usually needs more power |
| 23:43.14 | *** join/#maemo RiD (kamisakea@bl22-9-146.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 23:59.21 | RST38h | Doc: New Galaxy Tab is supposed to be x86 based |
| 23:59.37 | RST38h | Doc: At least this is what leaked specs are saying |