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| 03:14.03 | qwerty123 | is there any way to use vkb with easy debian in n900 |
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| 03:22.54 | qwerty123 | and change to musca window manager in easy debian??! |
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| 03:28.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | you won't see an answer to your questions when you leave the channel 20min after asking |
| 03:30.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | you also chosen a time of day (UTC) that's not ideal to get any answer at all, since most of the channel's users are meanwile actually sleeping (Europe TZ) |
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| 03:35.50 | qwerty123 | okay thanks for the info! should i ask about it in forum? |
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| 03:55.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think this might be too lightweight for tmo |
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| 03:56.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | resp prolly already answered in some thread which just wait to be found by you |
| 03:58.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | for vkb however I might already guess it's very complicated or impossible to use that in a chroot like easydeb |
| 03:58.48 | qwerty123 | okay thank you Doc. :) |
| 03:59.14 | qwerty123 | harmanttan n n810 has vkb in easy deb! |
| 04:01.48 | SAiF | Doc never sleeps |
| 04:07.13 | qwerty123 | well,needed DocS sometime back,when i had n continue to have problem with my powertop c0 bein 98.4 even after a newly flashed device!! freemangordon suggested to wait for him after running out of options! |
| 04:24.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, you have to wait a little bit longer, since even when I never sleep, I have times busy with other things |
| 04:29.19 | qwerty123 | sure :) |
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| 04:34.07 | ebzzry | Is camera-ui2 exclusive to CSSU-Testing? |
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| 16:53.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm currently actively pushing gta04-n900 project as already suggested by me on community-ML and tmo, in direct chats with Nikolaus (GolDeliCo). Nikolaus needs a (original) N900 to disassemble it and take dimensions of the whole thing with caliper. I consider to send a device to him, sponsored from HiFo-funds |
| 16:57.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | @council: what do you think about sponsoring a device for Nikolaus? OR would you prefer finding a broken device for him, or even a loaner device he would return to the one offering it? |
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| 16:58.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | chem|st: merlin1991: thedead1440: sixwheeledbeast: qwazix: ^^^^ |
| 16:59.32 | qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, +1 for sponsoring a device |
| 16:59.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | also what does board think about it? |
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| 17:01.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | hi qwazix! :) thanks for your vote |
| 17:02.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: Jaffa: Win7Mac: what's board's notion? |
| 17:02.54 | lexik | in czech republic n900 coasts something about 50-100 dolars... +1 for sponsoring :) |
| 17:03.24 | lexik | (on internet..) |
| 17:03.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | lexik: I have a hard time spotting decent offers in czech internet |
| 17:04.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | due to the language barrier |
| 17:04.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | fleabay has ~17 N900 offered ATM |
| 17:05.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.ebay.com/itm/ORIGINAL-NEW-NOKIA-N900-UNLOCKED-BOXED-1-YEAR-WARRANTY-/161048871619 for example |
| 17:06.44 | lexik | Pali and me are from czech, however n900 is ~cheap~ worldwide |
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| 17:07.43 | lexik | and if he need just case, it will be super-cheap to find broken one |
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| 17:14.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd think Nikolaus should receive a basically working device, so he can check details like LCD interface (which he needs to adapt in GTA04 to use the N900 ACX565AKM instead the Openmoko Topoly LCD), the digitizer, etc- |
| 17:16.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | also i'd get proactive and send him one from my shelf of spare N900 and later on fill up my shelf with the one ordered anew |
| 17:17.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | to avoid weeks of waiting for parcel to arrive |
| 17:17.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have no broken N900 I could send to him |
| 17:19.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | lexik: nevertheless I'm highly interested to learn about (and get some of) those cheap czech N900 |
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| 17:32.27 | qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, crazy idea but if we are doing franken900's why not go all the way and use, say, the case of E7? |
| 17:32.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm right |
| 17:33.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have to muse about that a bit |
| 17:34.09 | qwazix | Or the case of N810 :) |
| 17:35.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | we would need to find out about all the (lectronic) parts we can't produce ourselves, starting at display and not ending at GSM aerial. Need to either find datasheets and/or schematics that really are useful (means: with part labels etc). Think flex-cable, camera module (maybe), domesheet (kbd) etc pp |
| 17:36.47 | qwazix | :nod: |
| 17:36.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | I dunno if N810 spare cases are available at all. The starting point actually been that N900 2nd source cases are abundance |
| 17:37.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | while the GTA04 original GTA01/2 case is as rare an object like the Topoly LCD |
| 17:37.57 | qwazix | ok N810 seems to be out, very few listings on ebay |
| 17:38.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | also GSM aerial integration in N810 is a PITA |
| 17:38.32 | qwazix | E7 still has a lot though |
| 17:38.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | spare cases? LCDs? |
| 17:39.09 | qwazix | spare cases. LCD's might be a problem: nHD |
| 17:39.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, I guess the N900-factor is something we don't want to miss |
| 17:39.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | also e7 is c-ts, no? |
| 17:40.47 | qwazix | yep |
| 17:40.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | so we could christianize that one GTA04-N950E and sell it for EUR1800 ;-P |
| 17:41.14 | qwazix | exactly :P ! |
| 17:42.01 | qwazix | E7 glass is not fused with lcd like N9 so we could use any other lcd in theory |
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| 17:42.20 | qwazix | 4" is pretty common |
| 17:42.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually aside from building the hardware, our main problem is finding a small crew of really professional hackers to port fremantle to the GTA04 platform |
| 17:44.30 | qwazix | As I said back when I was thinking about the Nexus 7 I think the way to go is to just build hildon on a modern platform and recompile extras, instead of porting fremantle |
| 17:44.43 | Sicelo | wouldn't be easier to take a 'standard distro, eg debian, then addd hildon? |
| 17:44.48 | Sicelo | qwazix: +1 |
| 17:44.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | so far I spot 4..5 major problems domains: bootloader, graphicslib, DSP, libisi/modem, and depending on hw adaption PA |
| 17:45.08 | qwazix | I have built hildon on latest ubuntu, I have some problems with themes, but it works |
| 17:45.46 | qwazix | (also that will mean a shitload of new apps from ubuntu touch) |
| 17:46.24 | qwazix | the same thing could be done with mer instead of ubuntu, I just said ubuntu as it's really close to maemo (upstart, apt) |
| 17:46.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd like to keep ABI compatibility, so N900 binaries can run on GTA04-n900 |
| 17:48.35 | qwazix | My humble opinion is that it's pointless. Most distros don't keep binary compatibility from version to version either, we are not microsoft. |
| 17:48.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | a true N900 replacement, that just needs its own kernel and some core system adaptions (think BME), otherwise works exactly same like N900 on frematle extras repos |
| 17:49.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | I wanna keep fremantle |
| 17:49.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | incl all the services |
| 17:49.34 | qwazix | We should just do fremantle-2.0 extras and recompile everything we can |
| 17:49.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | this is a huuuge selling point |
| 17:50.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | to make replacing a broken or too "old" and lame N900 by a GTA04-n900 a nobrainer for users |
| 17:51.28 | *** join/#maemo LauRoman (~LauRoman@5-14-93-219.residential.rdsnet.ro) |
| 17:52.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | same apps? check. Same UI? check. Use all customizations? check (with minor exceptions that are really difficult, like H-E-N or bme-replacement) |
| 17:52.46 | Wizzup | gta04? |
| 17:52.47 | *** join/#maemo Guest23543 (~user@89.204.138.222) |
| 17:52.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | use same knowledge base? check |
| 17:52.50 | Wizzup | *confused* |
| 17:52.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | gta04.org |
| 17:53.03 | Wizzup | ty |
| 17:55.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: we still could (or even migh have to) do a fremantle-gta04 set of repos, e.g all with support for 3730 and thumb by default. Still we need compatibility on all the above mentioned problem domains |
| 17:55.37 | *** join/#maemo dhbiker (~dhbiker@APN-122-106-187-gprs.simobil.net) |
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| 17:56.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: you're free to quote me on that story ^^^ in MWKN ;-) |
| 17:57.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | Nikolaus would need at least 200 "preorders" to start on that enterprise for real |
| 17:57.35 | qwazix | I still think we should get rid the deprecated maemo core. Things are becoming more and more difficult for people due to old packages. It's not maemo, we love, it's what we can do with it. And a recent distro with GTK and Qt plus hildon can fulfill that |
| 17:59.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | I disagree. What I love is the available apps ready built as well as what I can do with maemo fremantle (get further apps that are not yet built) |
| 18:00.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | I had a smartphone I been able to do with whatever I liked. It been called GTA02 and major problem been the lack of apps available ready to install from a repo |
| 18:00.25 | qwazix | But apps are trivial to recompile, compared to the effort of making, say, csd run on new hardware |
| 18:00.55 | qwazix | I mean, 95% of extras should just work under any debian based distro |
| 18:01.06 | Wizzup | I would also suggest (without serious knowledge) not to imitate maemo drivers, but rather fix the few very specific packages |
| 18:01.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | another problem been the poor optimization of kernel and system to the hw platform GTA02, resulting in abysmal powersaving. This hasn't changed much until this very day |
| 18:01.26 | Wizzup | hides |
| 18:02.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: csd supposed to work ootb on a decently adapted kernel on a OMAP platform, no? |
| 18:02.51 | Pali | I sent email to Nokia with request for source code of maemo5 |
| 18:03.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: you're golden :-D |
| 18:03.10 | qwazix | probably, I have no idea, I just thought that being closed would cause some problems |
| 18:03.37 | Pali | I got automatic reply that only written request are accepted |
| 18:03.56 | Pali | so then I found time and sent letter to Nokia |
| 18:03.59 | qwazix | Pali, written as in hand-written? |
| 18:04.05 | Pali | yes |
| 18:04.09 | Pali | sent to Nokia postal address |
| 18:04.21 | qwazix | omg, what poor nokia has come to... |
| 18:04.38 | Pali | and I got answer (letter) with DVD |
| 18:04.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | LOL |
| 18:05.01 | Pali | on letter was written that "is is open source code and look on wikipedia what is means" |
| 18:05.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | lemme guess, it been a copy of linux main branch? |
| 18:05.17 | Pali | I opened DVD and there one BIG file |
| 18:05.29 | Pali | ISO image of CD :D:D:D |
| 18:05.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | ROTFL |
| 18:05.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | sob |
| 18:05.44 | Pali | I mounted that ISO image via loopback |
| 18:05.57 | Pali | and there was only copy of repository.maemo.org |
| 18:06.05 | Sicelo | nice. |
| 18:06.07 | Pali | nothing new |
| 18:06.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | and surprise surprise, it had flasher-3,5 and images |
| 18:06.20 | Pali | but I never got DVD with ISO image :D:D:D |
| 18:06.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | morons |
| 18:06.44 | Pali | not only open source software which is in maemo scrastchbox sdk |
| 18:07.21 | Pali | but this was really funny, they do not know how to burn iso image to DVD... in nokia |
| 18:07.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: see backscroll |
| 18:07.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | we might need your expertise |
| 18:07.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | long term project |
| 18:08.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | port KP52 to a new platform, incl all drivers ;-D |
| 18:08.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, slightly new |
| 18:08.28 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: problem is that I do not have time :-( |
| 18:08.36 | Pali | why KP52 and not upstream kernel? |
| 18:09.00 | Pali | linux 2.6.28 is old and dead |
| 18:09.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | because of the fremantle specific nokia patches that are not to be found in upstream |
| 18:09.26 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: this can be fixed |
| 18:09.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | so basically for same reason why we don't use kernel-3.6 on fremantle N900 |
| 18:09.40 | Pali | in CSSU-devel I removing needs for nokia custom patches |
| 18:09.54 | Pali | I can use 3.10 on fremantle :-) |
| 18:10.02 | Pali | but not working correclty... |
| 18:10.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | the GTA04-n900 shall first instance mimik a true N900 as closely as possible |
| 18:10.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | simply with faster CPU and more RAM |
| 18:11.06 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: needed maemo5 interfaces I forward-ported to 3.10 kernel and which was not needed I removed from maemo scripts |
| 18:11.34 | Pali | problematic is only GSM part |
| 18:11.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 18:11.49 | Pali | which not working and I do not know how to fix it :-( |
| 18:11.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | this has to see major redesign anyway |
| 18:12.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | libisi-compatible top to AT-cmdset bottom |
| 18:12.26 | Pali | freemangordon wrote that he maybe could fix that problem... |
| 18:12.41 | Pali | like he fixed harmattan DSP to work on fremantle |
| 18:12.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | well that's for new kernel on N900 |
| 18:13.12 | Pali | need to strace nokia applications |
| 18:13.17 | Pali | and see why it failing |
| 18:13.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | what i'm talking about is basically old kernel on new modem, not BB5 cmt |
| 18:13.59 | Pali | old kernel with new HW is really big problem |
| 18:14.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | not that much, i guess |
| 18:14.34 | Pali | and problem is that nobody will help you with this |
| 18:14.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's the point |
| 18:14.50 | Pali | because kernel devs do not care about 2.6.28 |
| 18:15.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | when nobody is interested in a faster newer N900 with original fremantle maemo running on it, it won't happen |
| 18:15.45 | Pali | really if you want maemo5 on new HW, just reuse my patches which are in CSSU-devel and my patches for 3.10 kernel |
| 18:15.47 | *** join/#maemo discopig (~discopig@unaffiliated/discopig) |
| 18:16.02 | Pali | this is easy and better way |
| 18:16.03 | *** join/#maemo _rd (~rd@p57B48322.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:16.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | and what stops us from doing same on N900? there must be a reason why we keep KP on 2.6.28 for N900 |
| 18:17.16 | Pali | reason is that in nokia patched 2.6.28 kernel are dirty hacks for omap3 power save mode |
| 18:17.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | exactly |
| 18:17.28 | Pali | and there are hacked camera drivers |
| 18:17.42 | Pali | and working GSM/3G drivers |
| 18:17.48 | Pali | which are not in upstream |
| 18:17.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | and it's exactly those dirty hacks we need for GTA04-N900 as well |
| 18:18.15 | Pali | gta04 is omap3? |
| 18:18.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | since we don't need yetz another mer that cuts through battery in no time, thanks to "we want leete new kernel, no matter what it costs us" policy |
| 18:19.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, OMAP4 |
| 18:19.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | like N9 |
| 18:19.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | err nope |
| 18:19.25 | *** join/#maemo mvp (~mvp@port463.ds1-abc.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 18:19.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | 36xx |
| 18:19.35 | Pali | n9 is omap3 and it is different as omap4 |
| 18:19.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | still omap3 I think |
| 18:20.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway GTA04 is 3630 |
| 18:20.11 | Pali | ok |
| 18:20.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | or rather DL37000 or sth |
| 18:21.04 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: do you know something about jolla HW? |
| 18:21.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | zilch |
| 18:22.22 | Pali | maybe if they have device with qwerty keyboard and open bootloader + some public spec it could be possible to use maemo5 |
| 18:22.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | the secret souce of a decent working embedded system with good powersaving *are* those nasty jacks you dispise so much |
| 18:22.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | sauce* |
| 18:22.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | and hacks even |
| 18:23.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: GTA04 exists. We plan to slightly modify it in shape and design to fit into N900 case and display |
| 18:24.02 | *** join/#maemo kimitake_idle (~kimitake@107.200.10.147) |
| 18:24.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | the idea of that being to offer a *true* alternative for N900 users who broke their device and just want a new possibly better one, to continue exactly where they stopped on their beloved rover RX51 |
| 18:25.51 | Pali | sounds good, but I'm afraid it is not easy and dont belive it happen in near future... |
| 18:26.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | and it seems there are still a few out there who love fremantle |
| 18:26.16 | Pali | me too |
| 18:26.22 | Pali | but I do not have time... |
| 18:26.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | porting fremantle to beagleboard been done by stskeeps years ago |
| 18:26.50 | Pali | school obligations |
| 18:26.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | GTA04 is based on that protoboard, like N9 is |
| 18:27.05 | ShadowJK | heh |
| 18:27.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | hi ShadowJK |
| 18:27.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 18:27.28 | ShadowJK | beagleboard original was like n900's omap side |
| 18:27.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | err right |
| 18:27.49 | ShadowJK | But they kept swapping in the latest omap3 and ram+nand |
| 18:28.03 | ShadowJK | So latest version is pretty much like N9 |
| 18:28.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 18:28.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | how do you like the GTA04-N900 idea? |
| 18:30.02 | ShadowJK | Sounds marginally less doomed than ideas of desoldering beagleboards to replace N900 SoC |
| 18:30.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | we will keep charging as in GTA04 (via tpd65950, no bq), but I hope to make changes to adopt pretty much all other peripherals except modem (and GPS) exactly like on N900 |
| 18:31.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: keep in mind GTA04 exists |
| 18:31.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are 100s of those devices being sold already |
| 18:31.25 | ShadowJK | <qwazix> I still think we should get rid the deprecated maemo core. Things are becoming more and more difficult for people due to old packages. It's not maemo, we love, it's what we can do with it. And a recent distro with GTK and Qt plus hildon can fulfill that |
| 18:32.10 | *** join/#maemo japa-fi (~jani@dsl-hkibrasgw4-54f843-160.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 18:32.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | I wholeheartedly disagree. It's been the "own distro" that kept GTA0x from flying |
| 18:32.24 | *** join/#maemo sunny_s_ (~sunny_s@business-092-079-020-027.static.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:32.26 | Pali | DocScrutinizer05: I think there is bigger problem as linux n900 phone... I'm not able to find some working notebook where can be linux installed and working... |
| 18:32.48 | Pali | every new HW is with that fucking UEFI and enabled secureboot |
| 18:33.10 | ShadowJK | I thought it could be disabled? |
| 18:33.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | not on ARM |
| 18:33.20 | Pali | and all hotkeys and buttons are managed via WMI |
| 18:33.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | ? |
| 18:33.37 | Pali | on ARM, UEFI cannot be disabled |
| 18:33.42 | ShadowJK | I think pali is talking about x86 laptops |
| 18:33.46 | Pali | on x86 somewhere yes |
| 18:34.18 | Pali | but some x86 firmware not allow you to update UEFI list of bootloaders also when secureboot is disabled |
| 18:34.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, i'm out. Busy with GTA04, no time for netbooks |
| 18:34.42 | Mac3 | DocScrutinizer05: yeah seems like it was the ad blocker |
| 18:34.45 | Mac3 | fail heh |
| 18:35.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | Mac3: I already augmented ~jrtools |
| 18:35.32 | Mac3 | jrtools? |
| 18:35.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jrtools |
| 18:35.56 | infobot | rumour has it, jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools |
| 18:36.55 | Mac3 | oh heh |
| 18:37.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: I have a hard time seeing how this whole "future for maemo" thing could fly when nobody is the slightest bit enthusiastic about it |
| 18:39.15 | Pali | chain how changing brightness working on my hp: I press decrease btightness button --> emit ACPI brigtness event --> kernel handle it and translate to key code --> userspace daemon (or KDE/...) read it and tel kernel to change brightness --> kernel will call ACPI method for that --> ACPI bytecode of that method will emit signal need to change brightness --> kernel handle this event and tell it to drivers which watching for event --> graphics |
| 18:39.15 | Pali | radeon drm driver will get it and write to some register something: this will change brightness finally --> then kernel emit event that brightness was changed |
| 18:39.24 | Pali | this is not normal ^^^^ |
| 18:39.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's hardly on topic |
| 18:40.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you think a working linux netbook has higher priority than maemo future, then maybe discuss in in #netbook |
| 18:41.11 | Mac3 | seems like quite a few steps to change brightness |
| 18:42.27 | Mac3 | DocScrutinizer05: didnt you scream at me that maemo has no future on other devices a while back? ;) |
| 18:43.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | the point is: this is NOT "another" device. This is a device tailored to duplicate N900 |
| 18:43.35 | Mac3 | oh? |
| 18:43.41 | Mac3 | which device? |
| 18:43.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | www.gta04.org |
| 18:44.02 | *** join/#maemo kimitake_idle (~kimitake@107.200.10.147) |
| 18:44.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | the gta04-n900 variant of it |
| 18:44.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | yet to come |
| 18:44.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | in a original N900 case, with original n900 display/ts |
| 18:45.39 | Mac3 | seems vaporware :) have you gotten one yet? |
| 18:45.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I'm just trying to find experts who are optimistic about "and with original fremantle running on it" |
| 18:45.45 | Mac3 | made in bavaria? |
| 18:45.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, 18 months ago |
| 18:45.55 | Mac3 | oh |
| 18:46.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | no vaporware |
| 18:46.09 | Mac3 | what does it come with stock? |
| 18:46.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | 100s sold already |
| 18:46.13 | Mac3 | os wise |
| 18:46.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | whatever you want |
| 18:46.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | it doesn't "come with" |
| 18:46.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's a hw hacker product, not a complete consumer product |
| 18:47.05 | Mac3 | ah ok. |
| 18:47.13 | Mac3 | and you can speak on it? heh |
| 18:47.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 18:47.24 | Mac3 | wow. seems interesting |
| 18:47.29 | *** join/#maemo sid_blub (~sid@nrbg-4dbfc674.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 18:47.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | if phonecalls is what you meant |
| 18:47.31 | Mac3 | especially if it is truly open |
| 18:47.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | it is |
| 18:47.35 | Mac3 | ys. i did |
| 18:47.50 | Mac3 | well. have to admit. that is very interesting |
| 18:47.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | it hardly can get more open |
| 18:48.05 | Mac3 | although... a8 is rather ancient |
| 18:48.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | currently some guys in the openmoko community bitch at Nikolaus to share the gerber files needed to produce the PCB |
| 18:48.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
| 18:49.08 | Mac3 | haha |
| 18:49.29 | Mac3 | hardware is always the issue huh? |
| 18:49.41 | Mac3 | is he producing them too slowly? |
| 18:49.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | Mac3: if you can afford buying 1mio SoCs from TI and paying a 100 man team to develop a device based on that SoC during 6 months, you're free to do better than Nikolaus |
| 18:49.52 | Mac3 | cant see there being much demand for them |
| 18:50.20 | Mac3 | lol. i wasnt being judgmental... i was just pointing out a fact. |
| 18:50.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | the fact is that it's a fine 99% replacement for N900, just faster and more RAM |
| 18:51.00 | Mac3 | sure. not judging |
| 18:51.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | and 100% free |
| 18:51.21 | Mac3 | so did you manage to get maemo on it? |
| 18:51.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | and we can do tweaks to the hw to all our liking |
| 18:51.31 | Mac3 | or are you having problems with the closed bits still? heh |
| 18:52.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | Mac3: sorry, we're still developing. Not the right time to ask such end consumer questions |
| 18:52.31 | *** join/#maemo Guest23543 (~user@port-92-206-13-180.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 18:52.35 | Mac3 | oh. i just figured the closed bits of maemo would still prove problematic |
| 18:53.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's what I just tried to discuss here, when guys digressed to netbooks and whatnot |
| 18:53.09 | Mac3 | plus wouldnt you run into awkward licensing issues with telepathy? |
| 18:53.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | o.O ??? |
| 18:53.41 | Mac3 | i thought telepathy was closed |
| 18:53.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | how is there any licencing in telepathy? |
| 18:54.06 | Mac3 | guess i'm wrong? |
| 18:54.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have no problem whatsoever to copy and use any closed blob of maemo on another platform |
| 18:54.46 | Mac3 | oh. nokia doesnt restrict that sort of use? |
| 18:54.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | maemo got donated to community, incl the right to redistribute blobs |
| 18:54.58 | Mac3 | oh. nice |
| 18:55.04 | Mac3 | guess that helps heh |
| 18:55.34 | LjL-Alps | surely telepathy isn't closed since i believe it's part of GNOME? |
| 18:56.02 | Mac3 | LjL-Alps: not sure. i remember someone discussing it here or maybe in symbian |
| 18:56.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | after all such blobs are vastly useless on any other hw platform anyway... except this tailored-to-fit gta04 hw |
| 18:56.29 | Mac3 | DocScrutinizer05: well. hoefully the other closed bits dont prove to be a problem |
| 18:56.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | telepathy is FOSS for all I know |
| 18:56.50 | Mac3 | but it would be awesome to see if you can mange to get it consumer workable |
| 18:56.58 | Mac3 | and eliminate the blobs if possible |
| 18:57.08 | Mac3 | you might find more maemo support doing that |
| 18:57.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | *I* won't do that |
| 18:57.34 | Mac3 | well... whoever does these things. the maemo dev pool is rather shallow heh |
| 18:57.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's *you* - the community - who needs to make it happen |
| 18:58.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm just your humble coordinator who happens to know another guy who is a wizard at hw design and manufacturing |
| 18:59.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | and interested in my idea to convert gta04 into a N900-look-alike |
| 18:59.04 | Mac3 | one begets the other |
| 18:59.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | hw wise |
| 18:59.17 | Mac3 | i would say the "community" starts with development |
| 18:59.23 | Mac3 | not with end users ;) |
| 18:59.45 | Mac3 | i doubt anybody would care if it looks like an n900 |
| 18:59.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | whatever you say |
| 18:59.51 | Mac3 | so long as it has maemo on it |
| 19:00.25 | Mac3 | well. you asked to discuss it... so I am discussing ;) |
| 19:00.55 | raccoon_ | i dunno about that; i for one chose n900 for the keyboard |
| 19:01.27 | raccoon_ | it being maemo actually was an awesome bonus |
| 19:01.44 | raccoon_ | but now i don't ever want to change away from maemo... or the keyboard. |
| 19:01.59 | trx | DocScrutinizer05 that would actualy be great |
| 19:02.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | so GTA04-N900 is for you |
| 19:02.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | it won't be cheap! at *least* as much as N900 cost when it came out |
| 19:02.43 | LjL-Alps | i'm probably not going to use the N900 as my main phone, fancy buying a Galaxy Nexus or something else that runs Replicant :( feel bit guilty though |
| 19:03.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | the more devices we get preordered, the cheaper it gets (or rather, the less expensive) |
| 19:04.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | buying 200 SoC and buying 1000 SoCs makes already a huge difference |
| 19:04.50 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: wouldn't the dialer be completely different, anyway? |
| 19:05.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: I hope for our cracks to code a janus lib that interfaces from libisi API to plain AT commandset on modem interface |
| 19:06.06 | kerio | and shouldn't we *want* a dialer? |
| 19:06.22 | kerio | a new* |
| 19:06.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | prolly simpler than the already existing interface in FSO to interface to BB5 ISI interface |
| 19:06.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | err, did I really use same wort 3 times in one sentence? |
| 19:07.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | what i meant: Mickey Lauer wrote a BB5 interface in FSO framework, so the other way arounf should also be feasible |
| 19:07.57 | *** join/#maemo e-yes_ (~e-yes@109.188.125.231) |
| 19:08.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | I actually asked for a FSO to libisi compatibility layer for long time, thus slipping in FSO framework into maemo/meego ;-) |
| 19:08.23 | kerio | what graphics does the gta04 have? |
| 19:08.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | same as N900 |
| 19:08.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | aiui |
| 19:08.39 | kerio | that's convenient |
| 19:08.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's a 3630 basically |
| 19:11.47 | kerio | does it have the same issues with the thumb2 ISA as the 3430? |
| 19:13.46 | ShadowJK | My guess would be that it's a newer revision and has many hw errata fixed |
| 19:13.54 | kerio | your *hope* |
| 19:14.06 | kerio | who was the 3630 made for? |
| 19:14.19 | ShadowJK | Part of the reason nobody wants to deal with the thumb errata in N900's 3430, is that newer 3430 had that issue fixed and was widely available on beagleboards |
| 19:14.28 | kerio | oic |
| 19:18.29 | *** join/#maemo _rd (~rd@p57B48322.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:20.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | thus [2013-08-25 19:55:27] <DocScrutinizer05> qwazix: we still could (or even migh have to) do a fremantle-gta04 set of repos, e.g all with support for 3730 and thumb by default. |
| 19:21.35 | raccoon_ | DocScrutinizer05: i don't care about the cost, if i can trust it to function the same as the n900 (with maemo + whatever parts needed/found for this project) i'm all game |
| 19:21.56 | kerio | alright raccoon_ doesn't care about the cost |
| 19:21.57 | raccoon_ | is there a crowdfunding project or otherwise more informative details available on this? |
| 19:21.57 | *** join/#maemo Macer (mace@scientiam.org) |
| 19:22.02 | kerio | raccoon_: it's going to cost 250k€ |
| 19:22.11 | kerio | we got our funds! |
| 19:22.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | raccoon_: we're in the initial phase to set up something like that |
| 19:22.44 | raccoon_ | kerio: you want me to explicitly prefix each line withe "personally, it's my humble opinion that..."? |
| 19:22.48 | raccoon_ | with* |
| 19:23.21 | raccoon_ | i take for granted you won't run up the price just for the sake of it, therefor i assume the price will justify the costs. for a fucking awesome phone. |
| 19:23.47 | kerio | no i meant that you, not caring about the costs, can fund the whole thing :D |
| 19:23.53 | raccoon_ | hahaha |
| 19:23.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | raccoon_: for now you might utter your interest so Nikolaus can hear it. Maybe on https://shop.goldelico.com/wiki.php?page=Wishlist&referer=GTA04 |
| 19:24.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | clearly mention gta04-N900 |
| 19:24.06 | raccoon_ | kerio: if i had that kinda monies, it'd be my pleasure :-P |
| 19:24.30 | raccoon_ | DocScrutinizer05: aight, cool. will spread the words to some n900 enthusiasts at our hackerspace too |
| 19:24.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | cool! we need that so much! |
| 19:25.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | we also need hackers who are willing to port maemo fremantle to that platform |
| 19:26.24 | raccoon_ | just make the project accessible and i'll help you out in any way i can |
| 19:26.25 | kerio | on the one hand, if the hardware isn't similar enough, we might have to make something completely new |
| 19:26.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | it shouldn't be too hard I guess. But anyway we need to start with evaluation _how_ hard it actually will get |
| 19:26.37 | kerio | on the other hand, if the hardware isn't similar enough we can get rid of all the maemo cruft |
| 19:26.42 | raccoon_ | i mean, make projects public (easy to contribute to, at least as easy to share info about) |
| 19:26.54 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: mer with hildon-desktop! |
| 19:27.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | mer never arrived at proper power management, iirc |
| 19:28.03 | kerio | you can't do proper power management without the hardware to manage |
| 19:28.15 | kerio | it never arrived to proper power management on n900 because nobody cared |
| 19:28.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | raccoon_: fro a start you could /join #openmoko-cdevel, where a small part of the discussion takes place |
| 19:28.53 | *** join/#maemo Vlad_on_the_road (~Vlad_on_t@ip-66.net-82-216-1.versailles2.rev.numericable.fr) |
| 19:29.00 | kerio | i would join too, but i can offer no help whatsoever with stuff like this :s |
| 19:29.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/openmoko-cdevel/openmoko-cdevel.20130825.txt |
| 19:29.11 | raccoon_ | DocScrutinizer05: awesome, was about to ask |
| 19:30.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | also check community@lists.openmoko.or ML |
| 19:31.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/ |
| 19:32.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | I also posted a suggestion on maemo community ML, several weeks ago, in parallel to openmoko ML |
| 19:32.42 | raccoon_ | community@lists.openmoko.org == maemo-community@lists.maemo.org ? |
| 19:32.45 | raccoon_ | ah ok |
| 19:32.47 | raccoon_ | not the same then |
| 19:32.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | it is the same |
| 19:33.00 | *** join/#maemo dos1 (~dos@unaffiliated/dos1) |
| 19:33.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | just my local mail addr it sends new post from |
| 19:33.20 | LjL-Alps | why don't you raise $32m on indiegogo for a new N900 |
| 19:34.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | LjL-Alps: first of all: because *nobody* can build new N900 nowadays. You can't source the parts anymore |
| 19:34.29 | *** join/#maemo ikarus_ (~ikarus@ip51cdc735.speed.planet.nl) |
| 19:34.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | some parts like BB5 you probably never could |
| 19:35.07 | *** join/#maemo dos1 (~dos@unaffiliated/dos1) |
| 19:35.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | second when we build new device, we at least use the best SoC that still offers 100% compatibility |
| 19:35.47 | *** join/#maemo _rd (~rd@p57B48322.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:36.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | 3rd we won't ever rise 32mio |
| 19:36.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | 100k was already fine ;-D |
| 19:36.34 | LjL-Alps | DocScrutinizer05: erm, it was a joke about the Ubuntu Edge, not a question as to why you aren't trying to replicate the N900 exactly... :P |
| 19:37.51 | *** join/#maemo lexik (5864985a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.88.100.152.90) |
| 19:38.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | raccoon_: OOPS sorry, I messed up maemo ML with OM ML |
| 19:39.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | raccoon_: here's the correct link: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/ |
| 19:43.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | raccoon_: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2013-August/068802.html |
| 19:44.29 | lexik | DocScrutinizer05: hi :) this n900 is for 2699CZK --> something about 140 dolars... this is cheap, in my opinion. Mine device is from the same server (aukro.cz) and it cost 2000CZK (100 dolars..) but i really dont know if it is cheaper than in other countries |
| 19:44.34 | lexik | http://aukro.cz/nokia-n900-32gb-kompletni-dobry-stav-qwerty-i3486838451.html |
| 19:45.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | thanks a lot! |
| 19:45.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | is this new or used one? |
| 19:45.47 | lexik | used one |
| 19:45.52 | trx | says good kondition in the link |
| 19:45.57 | trx | condition* |
| 19:46.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, used ones are dangerous |
| 19:47.02 | lexik | not from this server :) trust me :) it is not ebay similar :) |
| 19:47.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | and not much more expensive here in Germany or anywhere else on the internet. For Nikolaus it might suffice nevertheless |
| 19:47.44 | LjL-Alps | eh, bought an N900 on ebay for €85, was perfectly fine so far as i can tell, unused accessories |
| 19:47.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | used ones often have semi-borked USB and/or broken cmt |
| 19:47.55 | LjL-Alps | cmt? |
| 19:47.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | modem |
| 19:48.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | GSM |
| 19:48.01 | LjL-Alps | oh |
| 19:48.02 | lexik | does it matter? |
| 19:48.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | not for nikolaus |
| 19:48.14 | *** join/#maemo dfgdfh (~1@178.154.26.182) |
| 19:48.15 | lexik | for what he need n900 pcd? |
| 19:48.20 | lexik | *pcb |
| 19:48.48 | *** join/#maemo cpt_nemo (cpt_nemo@rfc1459.de) |
| 19:48.49 | lexik | he just need the case and screen, or not? |
| 19:48.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | he needs a complete N900 to adapt the GTA04 PCB to fit into the case and to the LCD and kbd etc |
| 19:48.57 | LjL-Alps | i think ebay is alright if you use some good judgement when picking sellers |
| 19:49.14 | raccoon_ | DocScrutinizer05: cheers! |
| 19:49.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-9 |
| 19:49.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) even |
| 19:50.21 | lexik | wtf |
| 19:50.32 | Milhouse | this guy was just kicked from the openelec channel for spamming |
| 19:50.35 | LjL-Alps | dafuq |
| 19:51.06 | Milhouse | we got a channel admin to kick dfgdfh? |
| 19:51.09 | *** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ |
| 19:51.26 | Milhouse | cheers doc, if indeed it was you |
| 19:51.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | no alas not |
| 19:51.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc how to stop it |
| 19:51.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | yet |
| 19:51.44 | LjL-Alps | nobody did anything |
| 19:51.50 | lexik | weird guy |
| 19:51.54 | Milhouse | maybe he's just moved on to annoy another channel |
| 19:51.55 | LjL-Alps | still, it seems to have stopped by itself so far |
| 19:52.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's no user -dfgdfh and "no messages from outside" is set |
| 19:52.30 | LjL-Alps | DocScrutinizer05: uhm, yes there is a user dfgdfh |
| 19:52.38 | dfgdfh | [22:49:53] <Milhouse> cheers doc, if indeed it was you |
| 19:52.38 | dfgdfh | [22:50:01] <@DocScrutinizer05> no alas not |
| 19:52.38 | dfgdfh | [22:50:07] <@DocScrutinizer05> nfc how to stop it |
| 19:52.38 | dfgdfh | [22:50:10] <@DocScrutinizer05> yet |
| 19:52.38 | dfgdfh | [22:50:11] <LjL-Alps> nobody did anything |
| 19:52.38 | LjL-Alps | and they're in this channel |
| 19:52.45 | dfgdfh | [22:49:53] <Milhouse> cheers doc, if indeed it was you |
| 19:52.45 | dfgdfh | [22:50:01] <@DocScrutinizer05> no alas not |
| 19:52.45 | dfgdfh | [22:50:07] <@DocScrutinizer05> nfc how to stop it |
| 19:52.45 | dfgdfh | [22:50:10] <@DocScrutinizer05> yet |
| 19:52.45 | dfgdfh | [22:50:11] <LjL-Alps> nobody did anything |
| 19:52.53 | *** mode/#maemo [+b dfgdfh!*@*] by DocScrutinizer05 |
| 19:52.53 | LjL-Alps | indeed |
| 19:52.55 | *** kick/#maemo [dfgdfh!~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg] by DocScrutinizer05 (User terminated!) |
| 19:53.03 | LjL-Alps | takk |
| 19:53.17 | Raimu | "The call is coming from inside the house!" |
| 19:53.22 | LjL-Alps | this guy wasn't helping my data cap |
| 19:54.16 | *** join/#maemo LauRoman (~LauRoman@5-14-93-219.residential.rdsnet.ro) |
| 19:55.08 | *** mode/#maemo [+q *!*@178.154.26.182] by DocScrutinizer05 |
| 19:55.16 | *** mode/#maemo [-q *!*@178.154.26.182] by DocScrutinizer05 |
| 19:55.25 | *** mode/#maemo [+b *!*@178.154.26.182] by DocScrutinizer05 |
| 19:55.35 | *** join/#maemo florian (~fuchs@sign-4db6a9c0.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 19:55.45 | *** join/#maemo florian (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian) |
| 19:56.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | sucker! |
| 19:56.36 | LjL-Alps | O.o |
| 19:56.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | [Whois] dfgdfh is ~1@178.154.26.182 (One who has the truth is the strongest) |
| 19:56.49 | *** join/#maemo Ex-Opesa (~Ex-Opesa@unaffiliated/ex-opesa) |
| 19:56.58 | LjL-Alps | yes, that's his IP for sure |
| 19:58.07 | *** join/#maemo hubutm20 (~hubutm20@79.114.15.161) |
| 19:58.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | somebody willing to do temporary +o? |
| 19:58.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have to leave |
| 19:59.10 | Wizzup | I guess |
| 19:59.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | you guess what? |
| 19:59.49 | Wizzup | I guess I can do that, if no one else wants to |
| 19:59.56 | *** mode/#maemo [+o Wizzup] by ChanServ |
| 20:00.05 | *** mode/#maemo [-o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ |
| 20:00.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | thanks |
| 20:00.13 | Wizzup | welcome |
| 20:00.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | + cheers |
| 20:00.28 | LjL-Alps | welcomes the new wizzy overlord |
| 20:00.50 | lexik | okey... back to the gta04-n900 :) (i really like this idea).. it will be a good idea to: 1) make an wiki page with info for new "users" and some progress, 2) maybe a thread about it, 3) and finnaly that nice "CSSU brick banner" for donation option (cant it be funded via hildon PP?) |
| 20:02.01 | LjL-Alps | i probably wouldn't fund an indie smartphone project because of cost... but i must say, i'd consider one that were actually intended to run *fully* on free software |
| 20:02.40 | lexik | all we need now is just one n900 :D |
| 20:02.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | I dunno if I finished that line when the fool kicked in: RL calling, so I'm away for now. I hope I kicked off someting this weekend. Please continue to spread the word and discuss our options esp regarding fremantle with everybody interested |
| 20:02.56 | LjL-Alps | i won't give you mine! i just got it! |
| 20:03.25 | lexik | i dont want yours n900 :D |
| 20:03.41 | LjL-Alps | whew...! |
| 20:03.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think I can handle the N900 "sample" issue |
| 20:04.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe with some help from lexik. I'll ping you if I need to |
| 20:04.24 | Wizzup | DocScrutinizer05: btw, how long did you want me to op? |
| 20:04.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | doesn't matter, just stay opped |
| 20:04.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | for now |
| 20:04.44 | Wizzup | okay |
| 20:04.48 | Wizzup | I presume my conn will manage ;-) |
| 20:04.54 | LjL-Alps | shut up and stay opped |
| 20:05.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | cya folks |
| 20:05.52 | LjL-Alps | see you |
| 20:06.31 | lexik | oh yeah, and a new "codename" for it, because gta04-n900 is not as userfriendly as "MaemoX900" or my favorite: "L3X900" :D |
| 20:07.19 | *** join/#maemo mavhc (~mavhc@cpc3-basf10-2-0-cust617.12-3.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 20:12.25 | *** join/#maemo arcean (~arcean@aaes220.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 20:13.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | I invited some maybe interested users from #openmoko "side" |
| 20:14.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | /topic |
| 20:14.07 | *** join/#maemo kimitake_idle (~kimitake@107.200.10.82) |
| 20:14.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog |
| 20:14.19 | *** join/#maemo e-yes_ (~e-yes@109.188.125.229) |
| 20:14.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok, cul8r |
| 20:20.02 | *** join/#maemo eijk (~eijk@e178213192.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:21.50 | dos1 | New900 :D |
| 20:23.49 | *** join/#maemo lexik (~user@90.152.broadband5.iol.cz) |
| 20:26.40 | raccoon_ | why not N9001 ? |
| 20:26.46 | raccoon_ | it's over 9000... |
| 20:27.07 | raccoon_ | dos1: haha |
| 20:27.35 | raccoon_ | maybe "!N900", but that might only make programmers chuckle |
| 20:27.39 | raccoon_ | and others confused |
| 20:28.24 | dos1 | or maybe Neo900 |
| 20:28.30 | lexik | good |
| 20:28.48 | dos1 | name with nods to both Maemo and Openmoko roots ;) |
| 20:29.28 | lexik | and the os will be neomo? |
| 20:29.42 | dos1 | :D |
| 20:32.42 | Wulfe | lol |
| 20:35.35 | lexik | some my Neo900 dreams: 3.10 kernel, android bootable, everything thumb compiled, cost under 200 dolars :D |
| 20:35.54 | dos1 | 3.10 kernel - checked, GTA04 already has one |
| 20:36.21 | dos1 | Android - there's ongoing work in Replicant project to support it |
| 20:36.28 | raccoon_ | yeah neo900 was really good |
| 20:36.47 | dos1 | thumb compiled - I think it is in most distros already available for it |
| 20:37.13 | dos1 | cost - well... you would need milions of buyers to achieve this price :) |
| 20:37.32 | *** join/#maemo jake42 (~jake42@webcache.rommel.stw.uni-erlangen.de) |
| 20:38.24 | lexik | the 3.10 kernel problem is not with the HW but with the maemo itself |
| 20:39.02 | dos1 | about current GTA04: 1 buyer: 3000 EUR, 10 buyers: 1500 EUR, 1000 buyers: 490 (better CPU included), 10k: 390 (new plastic case included), 100k: 290, 1M: 240, 10M: 199 |
| 20:39.45 | lexik | hm.. okey, maybe kickstarter? :D |
| 20:40.03 | lexik | 1k buyers is nonimpossible :) |
| 20:40.19 | *** join/#maemo SmilyOrg (Smily@89.142.40.4) |
| 20:40.22 | lexik | but that will need some Jolla like campaign |
| 20:40.23 | dos1 | lexik: ouch, yeah. But I think if we'll port OS to completely new hardware, then there's no point in limiting ourselves to old kernel |
| 20:40.40 | dos1 | we'll have lots of things to fix regardless of version :D |
| 20:42.35 | *** join/#maemo VD (priv8@my.irc.so) |
| 20:43.15 | dos1 | hmm, I missed one milestone: 100 buyers: 590 EUR ;) |
| 20:45.05 | lexik | the steps: buy a one experimental n900 for openmoko community, make this mod to a few more n900's from maemo community members -- test it, develop HW specific patches and release "Maemo reloaded" - neomo :), create and kickstarter project and start an linux-users/geeks-targeted campaign |
| 20:46.13 | lexik | oh yeah and finally: profit |
| 20:48.12 | lexik | what we can do now: create a wiki page, thread and a call for donations on tmo :) |
| 20:48.20 | dos1 | I'm all excited about this idea |
| 20:48.31 | dos1 | right! |
| 20:49.10 | dos1 | just yesterday I've created a draft for new GTA04 homepage - http://dosowisko.net/gta04/ |
| 20:49.31 | dos1 | but maybe we'll wait and use something like that when neo900 arrives :) |
| 21:08.12 | *** join/#maemo saidinesh5 (~quassel@argon247.server4you.de) |
| 21:11.34 | *** join/#maemo Vlad_on_the_road (~Vlad_on_t@ip-66.net-82-216-1.versailles2.rev.numericable.fr) |
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| 21:19.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | hi dos1! |
| 21:19.41 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: hello :) I'm hyped for your gta04-n900 idea! |
| 21:19.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | don't you think this was a nice kickoff for Neo900 (I love that project name) |
| 21:20.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | now we need to catch up the tiny initial momentum |
| 21:20.40 | dos1 | yeah |
| 21:20.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | like making fire with a stick and a board |
| 21:21.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | needs 4 weeks of drilling, then carefully blow to boost the flame |
| 21:21.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) |
| 21:21.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | 4 weeks drilling already been done, I think today I seen the first smoke |
| 21:22.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | kudos for your website work! |
| 21:23.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | mayybe start a new thread on tmo? |
| 21:23.38 | dos1 | I'll keep fingers crossed for that flame :) it's amazing idea, can bring Openmoko and Maemo community really close for a common goal |
| 21:23.48 | dos1 | s/community/communities/ |
| 21:24.59 | *** join/#maemo lexik (~user@37-48-37-136.tmcz.cz) |
| 21:25.50 | dos1 | who, me? I can do that |
| 21:26.04 | dos1 | but maybe your name will bring more attention and trust, i'm completely unknown there |
| 21:26.36 | lexik | what what? what i missed? |
| 21:26.47 | dos1 | just "[23:23] <DocScrutinizer05> mayybe start a new thread on tmo?" ;) |
| 21:27.11 | lexik | thanks |
| 21:27.52 | lexik | dosl: that website about gta04 is nice, one day we will need similar one for Neo900 |
| 21:29.36 | *** join/#maemo freemangordon (~freemango@130-204-50-168.2074221835.ddns.cablebg.net) |
| 21:29.58 | lexik | new thread on tmo is a good idea, as wikipage is (but that could wait) |
| 21:31.49 | lexik | replicant will be awesome - but NITDroid team will maybe kill us (hi, e-yes).. |
| 21:32.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1369343#post1369343 here you are |
| 21:32.34 | NeutrinoPower | hi, why don't work the gprs/gsm/umts... internet access on my N900 anymore? I tried the sim on a android-smartphone with success but on Maemo I only get an IP with gprs-device but cannot reach a website.. |
| 21:32.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry for terribly terse post, i'm really in a hurry now |
| 21:33.19 | *** join/#maemo Guest23543 (~user@89.204.138.199) |
| 21:34.13 | lexik | DocScrutinizer05: GREAT! |
| 21:34.19 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: thanks, I'll write down some details there :) |
| 21:34.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | feel free to augment the thread with details |
| 21:34.52 | lexik | ;) |
| 21:35.19 | freemangordon | OMG, new mc in extras-devel :D |
| 21:35.28 | *** join/#maemo Mike11 (~user@unaffiliated/mike11) |
| 21:35.48 | lexik | freemangordon: good to see some progress :) |
| 21:35.57 | freemangordon | yeah |
| 21:35.58 | lexik | "progress" |
| 21:41.21 | lexik | DocScrutinizer05: can we bought an n900-guinea-pig for openmoko community from hildon foundation PP account? |
| 21:41.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 21:42.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: MWKN http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1369343#post1369343 |
| 21:44.04 | freemangordon | no fmtx and hwkbd :( |
| 21:45.07 | lexik | so it it will be a good idea to create an separate "maemo brick" (just like CSSU one or "help us keep on the lights") ... something like "Maemo future? You are. Neo900." |
| 21:55.33 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: posted :) |
| 21:55.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | thanked |
| 21:55.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | :) |
| 21:56.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: eh? |
| 21:56.56 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: hmm, lemme read the post first, maybe I didn't get it |
| 21:57.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | we build a new PCB and place it into a N900 spare case from Hongkong |
| 21:57.30 | dos1 | freemangordon: current GTA04 has fmtx, and GTA04-N900 vel Neo900 will have hw-keyboard, because N900 case has it ;) |
| 21:58.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | and a "prototype" of the new PCB already exists: GTA04 |
| 21:59.15 | freemangordon | ok, so the idea is to use the casing and screen from n900? |
| 21:59.23 | freemangordon | dos1: good |
| 22:00.45 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: well, I guess I can help with the kernel part :) |
| 22:04.38 | kerio | freemangordon: DocScrutinizer05's plan is crazy though |
| 22:04.43 | kerio | he wants to reuse even the closed bits |
| 22:05.07 | freemangordon | kerio: so? |
| 22:05.28 | Wizzup | I would prefer to use open bits only, IF possible |
| 22:05.46 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (~bef0rd@unaffiliated/beford) |
| 22:05.46 | kerio | the idea is to actually tweak fremantle for the new hw |
| 22:05.47 | Wizzup | I could probably help coding a bit, too :) |
| 22:05.47 | kerio | and, well |
| 22:05.53 | freemangordon | kerio: what is the problem? |
| 22:05.55 | kerio | fremantle is a horrible linux distro |
| 22:06.19 | freemangordon | might be, ut it is better suited for mobile computer than anything else IMO |
| 22:06.29 | kerio | oh absolutely |
| 22:06.29 | Wizzup | freemangordon: its mostly just debian, isn't it? |
| 22:06.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | exactly |
| 22:06.37 | LjL-Alps | yeah, i wouldn't put money into a project that moves a weirc closed distro to new hardware, even though i spend (a small amount) of money to get the original hardware |
| 22:06.43 | kerio | Wizzup: it's like a really outdated debian with crap laying everywhere |
| 22:06.57 | freemangordon | Wizzup: ^^^ |
| 22:07.02 | Wizzup | right, so why not start with debian and pull in all open packages and work from that? |
| 22:07.15 | freemangordon | Wizzup: because we don;t have HW |
| 22:07.24 | Wizzup | (I'm just a computer scientist without any real maemo knowledge) |
| 22:07.49 | freemangordon | Wizzup: BTW aapo is already doing lots of stuff in that regard |
| 22:07.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | LjL-Alps: the hardware is 100% open and free, you're free to run on it whatever you like. For 100% fremantle compatibilty though, you have to sacrifice some of your openness-requirements |
| 22:08.14 | Wizzup | I think especially gprs is problematic to have an open version |
| 22:08.27 | Wizzup | so for drivers it makes sense, I guess, but for user space not so much? |
| 22:08.42 | Wizzup | DocScrutinizer05: So what does 100% fremantle compat offer vs 95% fremantle compat? |
| 22:08.45 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: if there is enough interest, we can RE/rewrite whatever we like |
| 22:09.04 | freemangordon | Wizzup: iiuc this is still to be discussed |
| 22:09.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | Wizzup: BT, WLAN, GPU |
| 22:09.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | dialer |
| 22:09.23 | Wizzup | DocScrutinizer05: sure, but those components aren't fremantle specific are they? those are just drivers |
| 22:09.31 | Wizzup | I can expect those to be closed |
| 22:09.36 | Wizzup | I mean, I'd hope them to be open, but yeah |
| 22:09.52 | freemangordon | Wizzup: almost everything else is open |
| 22:10.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: (RE) sure |
| 22:10.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | just like on CSSU |
| 22:10.23 | freemangordon | yep |
| 22:10.28 | freemangordon | I know :P |
| 22:10.28 | Wizzup | freemangordon: okay then :-) that seems sensible |
| 22:11.05 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: and we have FOSS rewrites of most of the important applications |
| 22:11.07 | freemangordon | :D:D:D |
| 22:11.16 | Sc0rpius | freemangordon, I promoted my package to extras but it says missing dependencies and that's very weird |
| 22:11.20 | Sc0rpius | since dependencies are PR 1.3 |
| 22:11.27 | Sc0rpius | look: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/yappari/1.0.37/ |
| 22:11.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm more concerned about some libs, e.g. liblocation |
| 22:11.45 | freemangordon | Sc0rpius: ok |
| 22:11.45 | Sc0rpius | and that didn't happen in extras/testing or extras/devel |
| 22:11.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | ICD2 |
| 22:11.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | stuff like that |
| 22:12.02 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: liblocation is some 20k arm binary iirc |
| 22:12.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 22:12.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | and ICD2 should prolly "just work" |
| 22:12.29 | freemangordon | that 2-3 days to be REed |
| 22:12.33 | freemangordon | *that needs |
| 22:12.35 | LjL-Alps | DocScrutinizer05: hmm is it? i thought gta04 needed more than its fair share of proprietary firmwares, or at least the wifi one |
| 22:13.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, I consider firmware not any part of the OS |
| 22:14.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's a set of initialization data transfered to some peripherial chip |
| 22:14.23 | freemangordon | Sc0rpius: I guess this is false alarm, it just says this is not compatible with PR1.0 |
| 22:15.13 | freemangordon | Sc0rpius: did you try to install it using HAM? |
| 22:16.42 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: see, If the project starts and new developers join or "old" come back, there will be resources to do whatever we want from the SW side |
| 22:16.42 | freemangordon | IMO |
| 22:17.11 | *** join/#maemo qwazix_ (~qwazix@cust-159-92.on5.ontelecoms.gr) |
| 22:17.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | hah! that would be an awesome surprise |
| 22:17.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | ho qwazix |
| 22:17.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1369345 |
| 22:18.26 | freemangordon | Sc0rpius: is there any problem besides those "missing dependencies"? |
| 22:19.22 | Macer | im a bit curious tho as what there is to be gained by making a knockoff n900 |
| 22:19.58 | Macer | unless there was some serious dev behind it. n900 at least had a nokia jump start for about a year |
| 22:20.32 | dos1 | Macer: we want to piggy-back on work done for both N900 and Openmoko |
| 22:21.00 | lexik | ive just posted my motivation post to Neo900 thread :) |
| 22:21.24 | freemangordon | Macer: besides viber, what exactly fremantle lacks from the SW POV? |
| 22:21.45 | kerio | freemangordon: recent libraries |
| 22:21.48 | kerio | recent apt |
| 22:22.05 | Macer | recent social apps heh |
| 22:22.11 | kerio | Macer: don't be silly |
| 22:22.19 | Macer | couldnt help it |
| 22:22.20 | kerio | we've got a whatsapp clone |
| 22:22.27 | kerio | and we have a facebook thingie |
| 22:22.28 | *** join/#maemo Neutron115 (~neutron@36.80-202-98.nextgentel.com) |
| 22:22.34 | Wizzup | I just tried - installing yappari seems to work |
| 22:22.34 | Macer | a fb plugin? |
| 22:22.42 | Wizzup | (didn't try lauching it) |
| 22:22.48 | Wizzup | perhaps a different (older) version? |
| 22:22.51 | Macer | for photos and im? |
| 22:23.08 | freemangordon | kerio: CSSU has already upgraded some of the libs. ANd AFAIK aapo did the same for lots more |
| 22:23.12 | Macer | sociality had a lot of promise but i dont think it is worked on |
| 22:23.27 | freemangordon | Macer: there if FB photo/video uploader since ages |
| 22:23.33 | Macer | i know |
| 22:23.35 | freemangordon | s/if/is/ |
| 22:23.44 | Macer | that is what i meant... photo uploader and im |
| 22:24.13 | freemangordon | Macer: ooh, so you miss FB app? omg, use the browser |
| 22:24.16 | Macer | the widget launches microb to use fb ;) there is no real app... the twitter app wasnt too bad |
| 22:24.31 | Macer | freemangordon: there are disadvantages to that |
| 22:24.40 | freemangordon | bullshit, we have browser, that is why we don;t need app for the next piece of crap |
| 22:25.05 | dos1 | well |
| 22:25.06 | Macer | ie: uses more mem, doesnt cache as well, no unnecessary js/php running etc |
| 22:25.13 | Macer | no ads :) |
| 22:25.22 | dos1 | Openmoko project showed that completely own software can be problematic |
| 22:25.39 | dos1 | I'm using my Neo Freerunner with SHR as my daily, main phone |
| 22:25.52 | Macer | how is it? |
| 22:25.54 | dos1 | but I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who's not as crazy geek as me |
| 22:26.24 | freemangordon | dos1: fremantle libs can be upgraded to more recent versions IMO |
| 22:26.32 | freemangordon | maybe not easy, but possible |
| 22:26.35 | Sc0rpius | freemangordon, I would have to try to download the package in a stock N900 to test those dependencies won't fail |
| 22:26.41 | dos1 | we can gain a lot by using fremantle |
| 22:26.43 | Sc0rpius | but in my phone there's no point since I have those packages installed |
| 22:26.49 | dos1 | to just provide something that works from the start |
| 22:27.01 | dos1 | and then of course everything can happen, since it's free platform |
| 22:27.11 | Macer | heh. first thing would be to get the gta04 into hands of devs |
| 22:27.16 | freemangordon | dos1: makes sense |
| 22:27.18 | dos1 | you can run QtMoko, SHR, Debian, Replicant - they already work on GTA04 |
| 22:27.20 | Macer | normally nokia would do this :) |
| 22:27.34 | Macer | so who fronts the money for these devices? devs with a cause? |
| 22:27.54 | Macer | D.W.a.C. |
| 22:28.05 | dos1 | you can port anything else - Fremantle would be there just as one option |
| 22:28.11 | dos1 | for people who just want to upgrade their N900 |
| 22:28.16 | dos1 | (at least that's how I see it) |
| 22:28.59 | freemangordon | dos1: hmm, maybe one should contact the Cordia people. They gave up because of the lack of HW |
| 22:29.05 | freemangordon | afaik |
| 22:30.25 | Macer | what is the gta02 running? |
| 22:30.32 | Macer | if an a8 is an "upgrade" heh |
| 22:30.33 | dos1 | may be good idea |
| 22:30.36 | Macer | armv5? |
| 22:30.41 | freemangordon | arm11? |
| 22:30.41 | dos1 | Macer: armv4t |
| 22:30.47 | Macer | oh. ouch |
| 22:31.05 | dos1 | Samsung 2442 SoC, 256MB RAM |
| 22:31.12 | Macer | too bad symbian wasnt released to the public :( |
| 22:31.36 | Macer | poor symbian is in russian limbo... like ecomstation |
| 22:31.45 | jake42 | dos1: 128MB RAM iirc |
| 22:31.54 | dos1 | jake42: ouch, right |
| 22:32.04 | Macer | kind of cool how modular it is |
| 22:32.19 | dos1 | stupid me :) it lays in front of me and i still can't get specs right :D |
| 22:32.20 | Macer | although it says "peeling off the lcd" |
| 22:32.35 | Macer | you have to peel off the lcd? |
| 22:33.34 | dos1 | Macer: with GTA04? yup, the point is to use LCD from your old GTA01/02 with GTA04 |
| 22:33.57 | dos1 | with Neo900 it wouldn't be the case anymore, as we can use new spare parts |
| 22:34.00 | Macer | yeah i saw that heh. well. i have none of the above. |
| 22:34.04 | freemangordon | Sc0rpius: iiuc Wizzup has installed it a couple of minutes ago. |
| 22:34.35 | Macer | they dont sell them preassembled? |
| 22:34.38 | Sc0rpius | huh? |
| 22:34.43 | dos1 | Macer: that's the point. GTA04 as it is now can't reach the masses, cause there's very limited number of GTA01/02 owners |
| 22:34.45 | Sc0rpius | really? |
| 22:34.55 | dos1 | Macer: and even more limited numbers of people interested :) |
| 22:35.10 | Macer | heh |
| 22:35.15 | jon_y | heh, how do I even get one? |
| 22:35.16 | dos1 | Macer: you can buy it preassembled from used GTA02, provided that used GTA02s are in stock |
| 22:35.19 | *** join/#maemo freemangordon (~freemango@130-204-50-168.2074221835.ddns.cablebg.net) |
| 22:35.33 | Macer | thn buy all the gta04 parts? |
| 22:35.51 | Macer | lol. sounds like far too much of a hassle |
| 22:35.53 | dos1 | Macer: some parts aren't produced anymore, hence the switch to N900 |
| 22:35.57 | Macer | looks awesome tho |
| 22:35.57 | dos1 | yup, it is |
| 22:36.01 | *** join/#maemo RiD (kamisakea@2.83.39.156) |
| 22:36.03 | dos1 | right now |
| 22:36.11 | dos1 | Neo900 is going to change it :) |
| 22:36.26 | Macer | thats what they said about the first freerunner ;) |
| 22:36.33 | Macer | your optimism is good tho |
| 22:36.52 | dos1 | well, I think that's exactly what was missing in whole GTA04 concept |
| 22:37.08 | Macer | optimism? |
| 22:37.21 | dos1 | haha :D no, things Neo900 can change |
| 22:37.38 | dos1 | but maybe more optimism would be nice too, there was rather poor demand ;) |
| 22:37.39 | freemangordon | dos1: what about the camera module? |
| 22:37.47 | dos1 | I thank DocScrutinizer05 a lot for this idea |
| 22:37.59 | RiD | GTA=4 |
| 22:38.01 | RiD | what |
| 22:38.09 | Macer | heh |
| 22:38.12 | dos1 | freemangordon: GTA04 as it is right now has some optional camera module |
| 22:38.19 | Macer | well if it manages to work out |
| 22:38.29 | Macer | i will buy one ;) |
| 22:38.33 | freemangordon | which can't be optional if put in n900 case ;) |
| 22:38.39 | dos1 | freemangordon: right |
| 22:39.02 | Macer | heh |
| 22:39.10 | RiD | you guys are crazy |
| 22:39.24 | *** join/#maemo lexik_ (~user@37-48-38-33.tmcz.cz) |
| 22:39.48 | dos1 | freemangordon: it's good question, but I think it's a bit too early to answer (i mean - *which* camera module, maybe even the original one if there are spare parts available? not *if*, it has to be there for sure :) ) |
| 22:41.09 | RiD | would the internal flash be quite faster than the n900? |
| 22:41.13 | freemangordon | dos1: :nod: |
| 22:41.29 | freemangordon | RiD: who cares, with the RAM doubled :) |
| 22:42.00 | RiD | ehh, sure, double ram would mean that we could very well keep more stuff on the background for faster opening, but still |
| 22:42.39 | RiD | not wanting to be negative or anything, i find that a crazy idea (in it's good way) and I'd like it to be successfull |
| 22:43.04 | dos1 | GTA04 itself was very crazy idea |
| 22:43.24 | dos1 | yet it worked - there are around ~100 devices out there right now |
| 22:43.36 | dos1 | and I think it's a lot given a VERY specific niche it targets |
| 22:44.02 | RiD | i sadly wouldn't buy one (eh, not the best financial situation) but when i look at all other "alternatives" i just sit on a corner and start crying |
| 22:44.17 | *** join/#maemo Guest23543 (~user@p54BD6709.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:44.28 | freemangordon | dos1: BTW why 512MB of RAM, woudn't 768MB or even 1GB make more sense? |
| 22:44.43 | lexik | swap? |
| 22:44.56 | RiD | keep swap minimal |
| 22:44.58 | RiD | runs |
| 22:44.59 | freemangordon | lexik: this is what kills the preformance on N900 |
| 22:45.11 | freemangordon | performance even |
| 22:45.19 | dos1 | (well, it targets only people who already have Openmoko device, are crazy enough to pay a lot for something with pretty much low specs and are still active in Openmoko community - 100 is a lot) |
| 22:45.42 | RiD | i remember seeing that thread with unresized pictures and made my n900 sh__ itself |
| 22:46.01 | dos1 | freemangordon: dunno, price maybe? I think Neo900 can have slightly better specs than current GTA04. |
| 22:46.07 | freemangordon | RiD: yeah, I hit hat too |
| 22:46.24 | RiD | opera handles images much better though :P |
| 22:46.50 | RiD | its a love/hate relationship |
| 22:47.21 | dos1 | freemangordon: it's all matter of demand. If you have only 100 customers, you want to keep specs minimal to keep some decent price |
| 22:47.53 | freemangordon | dos1: I'd happily change 3730/1GHz with 512MB for 3530/720MHz with 1GB. Though I have NFC if that is possible and how much it will cost :) |
| 22:48.24 | RiD | speaking of that, how about the "overclockability" of these cpus |
| 22:48.29 | dos1 | freemangordon: go state that in tmo thread :) |
| 22:48.42 | freemangordon | RiD: think N9 |
| 22:48.51 | RiD | ah well |
| 22:49.05 | freemangordon | not much iiuc |
| 22:49.08 | dos1 | freemangordon: idea appeared few days ago, first prototypes are some months away |
| 22:49.12 | RiD | even for the 3530? |
| 22:49.16 | freemangordon | dos1: sure |
| 22:49.17 | dos1 | freemangordon: there's big room for discussion |
| 22:49.19 | RiD | i know you cant really tell anyways |
| 22:50.00 | dos1 | and I'm not even the right person to properly discuss stuff like that - I'm just supporter :) |
| 22:50.18 | freemangordon | dos1: sure, but seems you have more info than me |
| 22:50.32 | freemangordon | that is why I am trying to steal as much as I can from you :) |
| 22:50.44 | dos1 | you can reach Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller who designs GTA04 board on Openmoko and OpenPhoenux community maillists |
| 22:51.05 | dos1 | he runs Golden Delicious, who produces GTA04 |
| 22:51.59 | dos1 | and if Neo900 idea really kicks off, that's him and his team who will be redesigning it for N900 case and components |
| 22:52.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | and maybe me |
| 22:52.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
| 22:52.31 | RiD | if i win the lottery i'll make sure i drop a few pennies |
| 22:52.31 | freemangordon | well, I'll discuss that with DocScrutinizer05 for now, we have a long history of arguing :D |
| 22:52.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehehehhe |
| 22:53.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: we will get the best SoC we can grab |
| 22:54.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | sourcing SoC is one of the more complicated things |
| 22:54.34 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: sure, but "best" needs to be defined first I guess |
| 22:55.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | not if your choice is limited to 1 or max 2 types anyway ;-) |
| 22:55.19 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: afaik RAM is not a part of the SoC |
| 22:55.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | you ever tried to buy a OMAP3430? |
| 22:55.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | it is |
| 22:55.39 | freemangordon | me? no :) |
| 22:55.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | kinda |
| 22:55.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | PoP |
| 22:55.56 | LjL-Alps | DocScrutinizer05, i tend to put "uploaded firmware" beyond the line. because if the firmware is already in the peripheral, then you don't see it, but if you do have to see it, then you might not be able to redistribute it etc. also, firmware for devices that communicate very closely with the system (share RAM) can pose security threats |
| 22:55.59 | freemangordon | isn't it on the top of the Soc? |
| 22:56.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | LjL-Alps: we have no shared-RAM peripherals |
| 22:56.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: yep |
| 22:56.58 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: I am judging from the different N900 revisions, some have 2x128MB, some 1X256MB |
| 22:57.10 | freemangordon | different manifacturers, etc |
| 22:57.18 | RiD | would 2x128 be better than 1x256 |
| 22:57.35 | freemangordon | I guess no |
| 22:57.51 | freemangordon | or rather no difference |
| 22:57.51 | dos1 | LjL-Alps: yup, shared-RAM wouldn't be acceptable for this project |
| 22:58.10 | dos1 | LjL-Alps: closed firmware, but with ability to redistribute |
| 22:58.21 | dos1 | LjL-Alps: that's "the worst" we can still accept |
| 22:58.33 | LjL-Alps | fair enough |
| 23:01.36 | freemangordon | anyway, time to have some sleep. Count me in, when it comes to porting the kernel/Fremantle. night |
| 23:02.09 | lexik | gn |
| 23:02.28 | dos1 | good night :) |
| 23:03.01 | lexik | however, me to, good night :) |
| 23:03.29 | *** join/#maemo Vanadis (~vanadis@77-56-167-203.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 23:08.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: this feels like it actually could fly |
| 23:08.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 23:09.20 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: yup :) |
| 23:09.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | many thanks for your support! you're way better than me on such stuff |
| 23:10.37 | *** join/#maemo Ex-Opesa (~Ex-Opesa@unaffiliated/ex-opesa) |
| 23:10.37 | dos1 | no prob |
| 23:10.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm wondering what Nikolaus will say when he returns from holiday tomorrow and sees the 2mess" we created :-D |
| 23:10.56 | dos1 | hehe :D |
| 23:11.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, he knows the basics already since I had some mails with him today, but the last few hours are probably new development to him |
| 23:15.10 | dos1 | I think even such small thing (compared to scope of whole project) as hardware keyboard can be a huuuge benefit over current GTA04 |
| 23:16.18 | dos1 | I smell that if we do this right, we can get more interested people than just Maemo guys and some Openmoko leftovers |
| 23:17.22 | RiD | speaking of keyboard, who's willing to sell an english variant of the n900 keyboard for only 1 |
| 23:25.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd buy some for even more |
| 23:29.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: exactly. We might even get the news about some freaks who love vintage & free over leete new phablets out to the media |
| 23:31.56 | dos1 | so hipster :D |
| 23:38.44 | *** join/#maemo LjL-Alps (~ljl@unaffiliated/ljl) |
| 23:38.46 | RiD | 245 seconds |
| 23:43.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: I think it's essential to showcase a working fremantle on a Goldelico device, no matter what subsystems still missing, no matter if even a kbd attached or whatever. Just build a KP52 with boardcfg of GTA02 and install some sort of hildon desktop so you can start an xterm under the well known hildon-desktop look&feel. Then publish that |
| 23:43.51 | Win7Mac | Holy cow, just reading backlog... nice! |
| 23:44.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | on youtube or7and gta04.org and/or maemo.org |
| 23:44.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | Win7Mac: hi! |
| 23:44.53 | Win7Mac | think kickstarter and you'll easily get tens of kilo$$ |
| 23:45.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | we probably gonna do something like that, with a goal of 500 devices |
| 23:45.49 | Win7Mac | 1st thought: n900 is quite klunky, E7 would be so much nicer |
| 23:46.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, but it's actually much harder to use E7 spare parts for our purposes |
| 23:46.39 | Win7Mac | ...but still need to read backlog ;) |
| 23:46.49 | Win7Mac | yeah, already got that |
| 23:46.55 | Win7Mac | :reading: |
| 23:47.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehe |
| 23:48.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: did you mail Nikolaus about your notion regading my "idea"? |
| 23:49.10 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (~bef0rd@unaffiliated/beford) |
| 23:49.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | not that it would seem like Nikolaus needs much more arguments to look into Neo900, he already mailed me he starts to love the idea |
| 23:49.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | but he for sure can use more confirmation |
| 23:49.47 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: nope |
| 23:50.32 | dos1 | I'll do that, either to him privately or to openphoenux maillist, but tomorrow - going to bed soon ;) |
| 23:50.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | send him a link to your initial post on neo900 thread! it's awesome |
| 23:51.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | right, this damn openphoenux ML where I dropped off for strange reasons |
| 23:52.12 | dos1 | I realised few days ago that I wasn't even subscribed |
| 23:52.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think I once been, but somebody kicked me off that ML |
| 23:53.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | or maybe that been internal developers' ML |
| 23:53.40 | dos1 | I think something changed at some time, cause I thought I had subscribed when project was starting |
| 23:54.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw dos:seen mickeyL |
| 23:54.51 | *** join/#maemo mkaindl (~mkaindl@ama-dablam.markus-kaindl.de) |
| 23:55.01 | dos1 | ouch, I was, but in gta04-owner |
| 23:55.32 | *** join/#maemo HtheB (~HtheB@62.140.132.190) |
| 23:55.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | dos1: any news about mickey? |
| 23:55.46 | dos1 | I think that was the only one on goldelico servers back then, so I subscribed regardless of not being gta04 owner :D |
| 23:56.08 | HtheB | gta5 coming soon |
| 23:56.08 | HtheB | lol |
| 23:56.15 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: hmm, I don't know |
| 23:56.23 | HtheB | sorry, I really had to say that :P |
| 23:56.36 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: I wasn't even looking at IRC recently |
| 23:57.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | I seem to not have seen/heard of him for several months |
| 23:57.09 | dos1 | DocScrutinizer05: but he was "endorsing" me on LinkedIn from time to time ;) |
| 23:57.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd like to hear what he thinks of this little "merger" project |
| 23:57.59 | dos1 | so looks like he's still alive |
| 23:58.13 | dos1 | yup, I'm curious too |
| 23:58.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | good, that's the most important thing |
| 23:58.29 | HtheB | yo doc |
| 23:58.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | he and the kid and family |
| 23:59.09 | HtheB | areyouu going to get GTA5? |
| 23:59.14 | HtheB | are you |
| 23:59.17 | Wulfe | does this Openmoko merger affect us N810 users? |
| 23:59.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | alas not |
| 23:59.32 | Wulfe | damn |
| 23:59.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe -alas |
| 23:59.58 | Wulfe | N810 is dieing off =( |