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| 00:05.59 | Drathir | hi |
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| 00:13.31 | jacekowski | Drathir: ho |
| 00:14.30 | *** join/#maemo rlinfati (~rlinfati@190.163.244.184) |
| 00:14.42 | rlinfati | Wrong checksum during receive of 'http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/w/wide-dhcpv6/wide-dhcpv6-client_20080615-11.1maemo1_armel.deb' |
| 00:14.58 | rlinfati | also wide-dhcpv6-relay and wide-dhcpv6-server |
| 00:15.00 | jacekowski | what where when? |
| 00:15.34 | rlinfati | jacekowski, |
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| 00:15.42 | rlinfati | md5 expected: 0a0fd6406f9f9eb1aee0e7172871cb91, got: 257e4779510df16e93b91313ba1b0314 |
| 00:15.42 | rlinfati | sha1 expected: 53f4df456b4093dc5a8c159c1a4bf5afb5a9ba56, got: e1d4a299432b09212ea40119f71023f2d84560e2 |
| 00:15.42 | rlinfati | sha256 expected: 0f1b867680313b9a16177f0660bbc020cc02a40efc863effc7bf3976503503d8, got: e7a1f789aefa4ecdf7fb16523f772a477221d98b5ce0f84b52e40b2c18850e6e |
| 00:15.42 | rlinfati | size expected: 98066, got: 98076 |
| 00:17.53 | jacekowski | ffs |
| 00:25.43 | jacekowski | ahh |
| 00:26.13 | jacekowski | that explains some things |
| 00:27.31 | rlinfati | ehh ? |
| 00:29.35 | jacekowski | apt-ftpmirror has problems with same versions |
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| 00:38.01 | jacekowski | rlinfati: everything should be ok in ~hour |
| 00:39.10 | rlinfati | thanks |
| 00:47.18 | Drathir | btw pacserve is great things... |
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| 01:11.52 | Macer | go figure |
| 01:11.53 | Macer | 2013 |
| 01:12.02 | Macer | and a "supported sane scanner" |
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| 01:12.04 | Macer | doesn't work lol |
| 01:12.11 | Macer | GO LINUX! :) |
| 01:17.08 | Drathir | usb host mode? |
| 01:32.01 | Drathir | 6 |
| 01:32.41 | Drathir | fail sorry |
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| 04:35.41 | Macer | ever find out what was wrong with maemo.org DocScrutinizer05 ? |
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| 04:52.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | Macer: sorry? |
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| 04:57.20 | Macer | the high load |
| 04:57.23 | Macer | nm |
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| 05:25.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, the high load mainly seen on www? |
| 05:26.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's caused by cronjobs for autobuilder etc, and I think those jobs need a proper refactoring to remove some parallelism |
| 05:27.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's insane when a job needs >6GB of memory(!) to proceed. And the high load is probbaly just a side effect of this |
| 05:29.52 | Cor-Ai | 6GB? damn :P |
| 05:29.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, even apt/yum are happy with a few 100MB of RAM to build a complete dependency datastructure of all packages available in a full linux distro. I can't imagine any task in maemo that would need to handle more complex and thus larger datastructures |
| 05:30.12 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: database preloading? |
| 05:30.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | Hurrian: yes, probably |
| 05:30.34 | Hurrian | TMO is huge. |
| 05:30.38 | Hurrian | Frickin' huge. |
| 05:30.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | tmo is unrelated to www |
| 05:31.02 | Hurrian | ah |
| 05:32.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's probably all related to package interface |
| 05:32.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pkg |
| 05:32.23 | infobot | hmm... pkg is http://maemo.org/packages/ |
| 05:32.39 | Hurrian | is the pkg queue that long? |
| 05:33.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | and yes, this probably accesses db VM via remote mysql queries done in php jobs on www VM |
| 05:34.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | so if each such php-mysql interface loads a complete view of a nonsensical query of db, this will hog RAM for sure, if those jobs run in parallel for several packages |
| 05:35.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | php-mysql "SELECT * on maemo_packages" --> damage done |
| 05:35.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't think it's THAT bad, but you get the idea |
| 05:36.04 | Hurrian | it could be that bad. |
| 05:36.44 | Hurrian | assuming the dev is doing their job properly, the PHP script could simply directly access the column for that package. |
| 05:36.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | yup |
| 05:37.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's why I say the jobs on www need a refactoring |
| 05:38.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | this is a very common mistake done by devels accessing db, they are not aware of what actually happens on machine when they do SQL queries etc |
| 05:39.31 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: god way to setup builider to few 2-4 cores if is 8cores all |
| 05:40.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | we have no problems with builder |
| 05:40.22 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: compile always tale a lots of ram more than installing apps i think... |
| 05:40.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://213.128.137.6/ganglia/?c=maemo&h=builder1& |
| 05:41.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://213.128.137.6/ganglia/?c=maemo&h=www& |
| 05:43.43 | Hurrian | checking the heatmap, www is really getting hammered. |
| 05:44.12 | Hurrian | oh, and there seems to be load spikes every 20 minutes or so. |
| 05:44.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 05:44.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | cronjobs |
| 05:44.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | every 15 I think |
| 05:44.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | and a monster one every hour |
| 05:46.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | or rather every 30min |
| 05:46.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | it takes 20min to eat up to 6GB of RAM, then collapses |
| 05:47.13 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: not looks so bad, but drive space is on the edge... anyway when something is build is only one package or few in one time? |
| 05:47.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | builder doesn't need drivespace |
| 05:48.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I think builder is building aone package at a time, from queue |
| 05:49.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | in former times we had like 5 or 10 builder engines |
| 05:50.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | which again is giving us errors right now, since there's no more user builder2 for example, but scripts occasionally still use that |
| 05:50.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | jacekowski is fixing all that |
| 05:50.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | during last week or so |
| 05:51.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | kudos to jacekowski |
| 05:51.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | but there's obviously still a lot left over to cleanup |
| 05:52.29 | Drathir | yea when have a ram all take and handle inside ram... |
| 05:53.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | whole maemo.org machinery seen massive restructuring when nemein ported it from Nokia infra to their own infra, and nobody ever fixed all that stuff before jacekowski looked into it |
| 05:55.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | and we have two problems: understanding how stuff been meant to work before migration#1 (to nemein), and understand and implement how to fix stuff so it work *now* on new infra after migration#2 |
| 05:57.15 | Drathir | that the worst... not touching if works when must somthing do after longthat is a hard workaround.... and when moving is added that is really scarry thing |
| 05:58.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | it often is a game of "who's faster - you with searching for the existing script that did XY before it got disabled, or I with writing a new script that re-implements same function" |
| 05:58.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | documentation on all that: zero |
| 05:59.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | usually not even much in header comment of shell/php-scripts |
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| 06:05.07 | Drathir | documentatikon changed with people working on server because i think all people was own way to maanage the server... |
| 06:06.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | for example I asked Nemein 3 days ago how to create new developer accounts. We have no clue, though we guss there must be a script or even a web frontend for that |
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| 06:14.39 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: i have similar when helping to care and develop game server... |
| 06:15.48 | Drathir | but that was smal and there is a huge... |
| 06:21.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | I fixed some users ssh pubkey on a few VMs, only to learn it gets reset to old after w while. Obviously the master copy of pubkey is stored in db and gets deployed to ~/.ssh/auth*keys every 15min by some unknown cronjob |
| 06:29.47 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: thats is interesting in db mean mysql? |
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| 06:34.19 | Drathir | i also have keys in file that contains a list of keys files... ssh keys with keychain is great connection... |
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| 06:45.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | Drathir: yes, db VM is our central mysql database |
| 06:48.03 | Drathir | doc thats amazing idea for me... and also work... great idea... |
| 06:48.48 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: * |
| 06:50.17 | Drathir | big brains can do amazing things... |
| 06:52.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, without any documentation such things are way more scary and puzzling than amazing |
| 06:52.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | whole maemo.org internals is a constant "WTF?!" |
| 06:54.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | much of it introduced by midgrad |
| 06:54.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | midgard even |
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| 06:55.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | e.g. we have no idea how to edit content of http://www.maemo.org |
| 06:55.46 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: bubut the moment when thinking what the hell that works should be interesting... |
| 06:56.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's a web frontend supposed to be somewhere for that, since midgard is a CMS I've been told. Nobody has a clue where to look for such web frontend though |
| 06:57.36 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: and looking all files should take a years... :/ |
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| 07:03.08 | Drathir | i sometimes have that i dont know how i do somethings, but it works like i want... a |
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| 07:23.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | on a maybe somewhat interesting sidenote: we're running those 45CPU/14hosts on maemo.orh with a total of ~200W |
| 07:24.04 | kerio | who's paying for the electricity? iphh? |
| 07:24.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 07:24.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | their donation to us |
| 07:24.33 | kerio | <3 |
| 07:25.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | *yawn* spam-day on council.m.o ML |
| 07:26.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | I guess our spamassassin needs an update |
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| 07:29.34 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: you joke right? |
| 07:29.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | ? |
| 07:30.19 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: with 200W power |
| 07:30.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't even know how joge is written |
| 07:30.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | PSU1: 98W, PSU2:86W |
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| 07:31.16 | Drathir | lol |
| 07:31.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | according to IPMI |
| 07:34.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't even know how to spell "joge" (sorry for my french) |
| 07:34.54 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: interesting what motherboard there are... |
| 07:35.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Migrating_to_Community-driven_Infrastructure |
| 07:36.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | didn't you ask same question a few days ago already? |
| 07:36.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Migrating_to_Community-driven_Infrastructure#Operational_Platform |
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| 07:46.18 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: thats all is perfect organized... |
| 07:47.11 | Drathir | i think that a much bigger hard drives... |
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| 07:51.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry? |
| 07:52.33 | Drathir | for all data i think there must be bigger hdd butisnt that... |
| 07:55.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | our primary data fits onto 2TB |
| 07:56.23 | Drathir | all hdd is less than 3TB on that big community is not bad i think |
| 07:58.43 | Drathir | i trying to setup xen in little home server but he bite with qemu :/ |
| 07:59.09 | Drathir | btw that ganglia looks little modern that munin... |
| 07:59.44 | Drathir | than* |
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| 08:00.37 | Drathir | WIP = work in progres? |
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| 08:15.09 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: i find a bug on site one core somewhere hide... in section Cpu Cores, RAM (in MB), storage (DISK, in GB), of the VMs |
| 08:16.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, probably one core is reserved for dom0 |
| 08:17.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | WIP is work in progress, yes |
| 08:17.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | that table is not exactly up-to-date, it's at least one week behind |
| 08:18.06 | jacekowski | and i can tell you exactly which job updates authorized_keys |
| 08:18.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 08:18.54 | jacekowski | */10 * * * * $EXECUTER dav-svn/create_users.php /var/www/homedirs/ |
| 08:18.59 | Drathir | i think that small amount of cores to db only 2 ? little suprised me... |
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| 08:19.24 | jacekowski | mysql is pretty fast |
| 08:19.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | Drathir: we can juggle CPUs as we need |
| 08:19.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | even during runtime |
| 08:19.45 | jacekowski | you can have 10kq/s on single not so fast core |
| 08:19.59 | jacekowski | if you have reasonable queries |
| 08:20.03 | jacekowski | anyways |
| 08:20.05 | jacekowski | i've got to go |
| 08:20.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah! only then |
| 08:20.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | cya jacekowski |
| 08:24.04 | Drathir | jacekowski: thanks a lot i write that because that really interesting me... |
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| 08:26.46 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: all earlier infrastructure alo was on xen containers ? |
| 08:27.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | no |
| 08:27.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | probably not, though we have no way to know for sure |
| 08:27.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | we had no access to any internals prior to Nemein completing migration#1 |
| 08:28.24 | kerio | hm, how does adding a cpu to a running system even work? :o |
| 08:28.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | since originally maemo.org been mixed with other Nokia proprietary stuff on same machines, so they couldn't allow access for us |
| 08:29.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: I guess that's a question for XEN faq |
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| 08:30.07 | kerio | mmcblk0: error 1 sending read/write command, response 0x0, card status 0x900 |
| 08:30.11 | kerio | oh shit |
| 08:30.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd suspect the virtual CPUs get "hotplugged" |
| 08:30.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | ohshit indeed |
| 08:32.27 | kerio | doing a fsck -c |
| 08:32.35 | kerio | on the important partition |
| 08:32.52 | kerio | luckily, i have errors=remount-ro :) |
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| 08:34.20 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: vcpu hotplug is a mess and not really well implemented |
| 08:34.36 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: and it's one way only |
| 08:34.45 | Drathir | what i read the most interestings was xen and openvz system, but dont know if its true... |
| 08:35.22 | jacekowski | it's just xen |
| 08:37.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | nayway, CPU grunt obviously isn't our main concern on maemo.org infra |
| 08:37.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | jobs eating 6GB while running... that's a real problem |
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| 08:40.32 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: do you use maemo conversation IM ? |
| 08:43.14 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: hm, a fsck -c updated the bad blocks list |
| 08:43.16 | kerio | hopefully it's ok now |
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| 08:44.56 | Drathir | DocScrutinizer05: sharing memor cache if works was be good but when compile i dont know if its possible and second part myst bee running min 2 compiling works to have fenefit of them... |
| 08:45.15 | Drathir | benefits* |
| 08:46.17 | Drathir | kerio: what files system is used? |
| 08:47.18 | XATRIX | How can i disable sound/vibra notifications for IMs while i'm in DnD mode ? |
| 08:48.01 | XATRIX | Also is it possible to initiate skype-video calls from the handset ? |
| 08:50.02 | XATRIX | Also, there's a 'Advanced Power app' that shows the percentage of the batter, and time to discharge, as i was told about , it provides some 'ticks' that will cause me battery charge, as the cpu does the updates |
| 08:50.11 | thedead1440 | XATRIX: for no sound/vibra choose silent without vibrate. For skype-video just select a contact who can receive a skype video call and there'll be an option to select skype video call |
| 08:50.28 | XATRIX | But the default one indicator does that 'ticks' also, so i think it's equal to |
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| 08:51.10 | XATRIX | thedead1440: I can't skype-video anyone, doesn't matter is he able to receive or not |
| 08:51.26 | XATRIX | Simply no way to initiate call with video |
| 08:51.31 | thedead1440 | XATRIX: shouldn't be so; i've initiated skype video calls several times |
| 08:51.42 | thedead1440 | ask someone to call you via skype video |
| 08:51.50 | XATRIX | I can only enable video during the call that was made from the outside of |
| 08:52.06 | thedead1440 | then try if selecting that person from recent calls shows skype video |
| 08:52.15 | XATRIX | thedead1440: 'ask someone to call' :) that way it works :) |
| 08:52.20 | thedead1440 | ah |
| 08:52.24 | thedead1440 | for me it works either way |
| 08:52.27 | XATRIX | I need to be able to make video-calls by myself |
| 08:52.35 | thedead1440 | usually i initiate it from contacts app myself |
| 08:52.46 | XATRIX | Alright i'll try now |
| 08:56.01 | XATRIX | You're right, it's possible to start video call from the contacts |
| 08:56.09 | thedead1440 | :) |
| 08:56.12 | XATRIX | I tried it from 'last calls' |
| 08:56.21 | thedead1440 | ah that's not accurate then |
| 08:56.25 | *** join/#maemo M4rtinK (~M4rtinK@ip-86-49-81-87.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 08:56.29 | XATRIX | You know, when you open your phone app |
| 08:56.33 | thedead1440 | last calls shows the number that called you and allows you to call back that number |
| 08:56.49 | XATRIX | Yea |
| 08:56.56 | XATRIX | What about the dnd more ? |
| 08:56.59 | thedead1440 | f.e. a contact of mine has 3 numbers and calls me from the first number when i want to call back only the first number is allowed |
| 08:57.12 | XATRIX | If you disable sound/vibra in Profiles |
| 08:57.20 | XATRIX | It will disable sound completely |
| 08:57.27 | thedead1440 | yup |
| 08:57.58 | XATRIX | I need to disable sound/vibra/notifications for IM while i'm in 'Red' dnd mode |
| 08:58.12 | XATRIX | All the other sounds (non-IM) should work as well |
| 08:58.44 | thedead1440 | hmm not sure of that but just choose general profile then with no vibra and silent the im volume |
| 08:59.01 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: If i set the output power of wifi from 100mW -> 10mW will it help to save charge ? |
| 08:59.31 | XATRIX | thedead1440: Not a best way, if use go Silent, you're completely out of notifications |
| 09:00.25 | thedead1440 | you don't want notifications for IM right? So in general silencing IM allows you to have all other notifications except for IM right? |
| 09:01.01 | XATRIX | Yeap, it's should be as you discribed |
| 09:01.18 | XATRIX | Currently if i'm in DND mode for IM, i'm still have all the notifications enabled |
| 09:01.34 | thedead1440 | yeah so go to settings->profiles-> and in the general tab lower down the volume for IM |
| 09:01.35 | XATRIX | But there's simply no chat opens while you receive the messages |
| 09:02.10 | Drathir | AD-N770: better than wi fi i think dimm lcd lightning... |
| 09:02.14 | thedead1440 | DND mode doesn't affect your system profile. Think of the availability as a status to show not for your phone to act on. |
| 09:02.28 | XATRIX | Nope, if you decrease the volume for IM in settings, you simply disable the sound , and for BOTH modes, Online+DND |
| 09:02.47 | thedead1440 | ah that's what you mean |
| 09:02.55 | XATRIX | Yeap |
| 09:03.05 | XATRIX | It should act like the desktop does |
| 09:03.16 | thedead1440 | i think you would have to use dbus to get the status and then change the volumes. Not sure but check Phone Control |
| 09:03.21 | thedead1440 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control |
| 09:03.42 | XATRIX | If you're in DND - no popup notifications, no sound notif. no visual. But the main sounds works, as well as the sound of other apps |
| 09:04.34 | thedead1440 | no idea how to make that work. Like I said DND on device is simply meant to show others your status but not something for your phone to act on |
| 09:04.36 | *** join/#maemo mvp (~mvp@port463.ds1-abc.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 09:04.48 | XATRIX | You gotta be kidding me, :) i'm not dev. It's like a SDK for dev guys :) |
| 09:05.13 | thedead1440 | Well if you want to customize things you should be willing to learn, shouldn't you? "_" |
| 09:06.09 | XATRIX | :) |
| 09:06.37 | XATRIX | Yea, but if i want to customize things, i don't have to actually become a coder :) |
| 09:06.58 | XATRIX | starts to recall in memory the years of C++/asm |
| 09:11.00 | Drathir | AD-N770: sorry tabfail |
| 09:11.20 | thedead1440 | From what i understand of things IM status was not meant to affect your phone. This is carried on in the N9 too. I can have multiple IM accounts and change each of their status' separately. So if you want to do something that wasn't an intention then you'll certainly have to work-around it :) AFAIK dbus signals are the way to go sadly. On the n9 i gave up on dbus and used mc-tool when i wanted to read the current status of specific accounts; |
| 09:11.21 | thedead1440 | maybe something similar on the n900 could help |
| 09:11.54 | XATRIX | Yea |
| 09:11.59 | XATRIX | Thanks anyway |
| 09:16.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | XATRIX: Wifi power 10/100 doesn't make much of a difference in real life |
| 09:16.49 | XATRIX | I think even 10 percent of power should drastically drain cell |
| 09:17.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | huh? |
| 09:18.13 | XATRIX | Every +10% i think affects greatly on charge |
| 09:18.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, WIFI isn't using much energy from battery, since it's not sending all the time, and even if it would, 100mW are not really that much |
| 09:20.07 | XATRIX | Are you sure ? Even stationary WIFI access-points, use 100mW |
| 09:20.19 | XATRIX | But it has a PSU ~1-2A 5V |
| 09:22.48 | jacekowski | that's for the CPU and other things |
| 09:24.49 | XATRIX | And N900 use no CPU ? :) |
| 09:25.37 | XATRIX | Or you mean it should also power up FEthernet port, and the whole base board itself inside the access-point ? |
| 09:27.26 | *** join/#maemo gn00b (~gn00b@75-172-168-30.phnx.qwest.net) |
| 09:29.03 | *** join/#maemo valerius (~user@85.26.180.147) |
| 09:33.35 | XATRIX | Where the files for localization /etc/systemui/systemiu.xml ? |
| 09:33.44 | XATRIX | "powerup_memainmenu_poweroff" and etc... |
| 09:39.06 | *** join/#maemo rooster_rus (~user@broadband-37-110-68-92.nationalcablenetworks.ru) |
| 09:39.34 | rooster_rus | http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/ is dead for me. Where else I can get firmware images? |
| 09:39.58 | thedead1440 | ~skeiron |
| 09:39.58 | infobot | i guess skeiron is the semi-official backup and emergency standin for all internet borne maemo resources: http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/ http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1315143#post1315143 |
| 09:40.04 | thedead1440 | rooster_rus: ^^^ |
| 09:41.27 | *** join/#maemo Martix_ (~martix@static-84-242-103-180.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 09:43.02 | rooster_rus | thanks a lot |
| 09:43.22 | thedead1440 | np |
| 09:45.46 | XATRIX | mmc1: new high speed MMC card at address 0001 - it's a simple SD card inside the handset ? Or it's a soldered die on MB ? |
| 09:46.20 | divVerent | when the video player refuses a file... is there a way to get a more exact error message? |
| 09:46.34 | divVerent | like, "This codec is not supported" or "This parameter violates H.264 Level 3.0"? |
| 09:46.49 | *** join/#maemo topro (~topro@host-62-245-142-50.customer.m-online.net) |
| 09:46.59 | divVerent | one way might be using gst-launch to get a similar playback chain running... has anyone done that yet? |
| 09:47.16 | divVerent | (I don't know how to access the HW decoder via gst-launch) |
| 09:47.58 | divVerent | 10:16:03 DocScrutinizer05 | XATRIX: Wifi power 10/100 doesn't make much of a difference in real life |
| 09:48.01 | divVerent | makes virtually none at all |
| 09:48.06 | divVerent | because it just sets the max power |
| 09:48.19 | divVerent | and wifi is already designed to always use the "minimum possible without too much loss" |
| 09:48.38 | *** join/#maemo rooster_rus (~user@broadband-37-110-68-92.nationalcablenetworks.ru) |
| 09:48.40 | divVerent | so by limiting to 10, either nothing changes, OR you will get more packet loss and/or leave the network |
| 09:48.52 | divVerent | only in the latter case you'd actually save power :P |
| 09:48.54 | XATRIX | divVerent: never heard about sucha a "design" |
| 09:49.02 | divVerent | the wifi power management always does it |
| 09:49.09 | divVerent | transmit power is dynamically adjusted while you are inside |
| 09:49.15 | divVerent | the farther you are from the AP, the higher is the power |
| 09:49.21 | XATRIX | Hmm |
| 09:49.37 | divVerent | it dynamically adjusst based on measurements e.g. of signal/noise ratio of the AP's signal |
| 09:50.13 | divVerent | so to get most battery drain, run a download with the N900 in a partial faraday cage, blocking as much of the signal as you can without interrupting the download ;) |
| 09:50.47 | divVerent | on normal linux systems you actually can watch the power adjustment in iwconfig, have not checked that on the N900 yet |
| 09:51.16 | XATRIX | hmm |
| 09:51.19 | divVerent | also, the N900 has generally quite good wifi reception compared to the iPhone 4, at least it shows a LOT more networks when scanning ;) |
| 09:51.24 | XATRIX | maybe you have a point |
| 09:52.03 | XATRIX | Acer Aspire One d255e |
| 09:52.07 | XATRIX | wlan0 Power Management:off |
| 09:52.17 | XATRIX | Link Quality=70/70 Signal level=-38 dBm |
| 09:52.34 | XATRIX | and |
| 09:52.36 | XATRIX | Bit Rate=65 Mb/s Tx-Power=19 dBm |
| 09:53.20 | divVerent | in case it does NOT auto adjust, you may be able to tell the chipset to do it by iwconfig wlan0 txpower auto |
| 09:53.32 | divVerent | but if it's 19 for you, it probably IS audo adjusted |
| 09:53.50 | divVerent | I currently have 20 dBm transmit power and 41/100 link quality, it clearly is at the max power level |
| 09:55.22 | XATRIX | Hm |
| 09:55.54 | XATRIX | http://fpaste.org/hH5j/ - that's for my N900 |
| 09:56.09 | divVerent | 10dBm is 10mW |
| 09:56.13 | divVerent | 20dBm is 100mW |
| 09:56.24 | divVerent | so you currently are limited to 10mW and the signal is good |
| 09:56.40 | XATRIX | And actually i've powered it down maually to 10mW |
| 09:56.44 | XATRIX | So, switching to 100 |
| 09:57.07 | divVerent | it also may take a while to adjust, and I am not sure if you can always see the txpower difference |
| 09:58.55 | XATRIX | Bit Rate=54 Mb/s Tx-Power=20 dBm |
| 09:59.01 | XATRIX | Power Management:on |
| 09:59.05 | XATRIX | Link Quality=70/100 Signal level:-49 dBm Noise level=-86 dBm |
| 09:59.07 | divVerent | I am currently trying to see if txpower actually changes |
| 09:59.12 | divVerent | or if one can't see what the card internally does |
| 09:59.26 | divVerent | I know the chips DO the txpower management, but I am trying to see how to find out |
| 10:00.17 | XATRIX | Passed a minute still 20dBm |
| 10:01.08 | divVerent | yes, same here, wondering if one can even ask the actual power |
| 10:01.18 | XATRIX | That's the difference bettern 100mW (http://fpaste.org/UaoM/) and 10mW (http://fpaste.org/hH5j/) |
| 10:01.25 | divVerent | from "iw": |
| 10:01.27 | divVerent | dev <devname> set txpower <auto|fixed|limit> [<tx power in mBm>] |
| 10:01.29 | divVerent | Specify transmit power level and setting type. |
| 10:01.30 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: maybe you'll pay some interest as well |
| 10:02.07 | divVerent | basically, similar quality level... I would guess also similar actual txpower :P |
| 10:02.09 | XATRIX | Yep, but i suppose it to adjust automatically |
| 10:02.31 | *** join/#maemo discopig (~discopig@unaffiliated/discopig) |
| 10:02.36 | teotwaki | "When i connect to the manager with username/passwod and i try to regenerate the setup contact and i see the the wheel that round but i never see the green writing of success. I also can't see in the console the indicator." |
| 10:02.40 | teotwaki | Gotta love some bug reports |
| 10:02.45 | XATRIX | Yeap, but with 10mW it was the same quality level but 48Mbit\s instead of 54 |
| 10:03.00 | XATRIX | But 10mW is less than 100 in 10 times!!! |
| 10:03.01 | divVerent | probably changes to 54 too |
| 10:03.03 | divVerent | sometimes |
| 10:03.07 | XATRIX | So, 10 times less drain |
| 10:03.11 | divVerent | I am saying, it doesn't ACTUALLY use the 100mW |
| 10:03.17 | divVerent | I just want to find a way to prove it :P |
| 10:03.48 | XATRIX | But it constantly gives me 20dBM |
| 10:03.53 | XATRIX | And doesn't go down |
| 10:04.28 | divVerent | I am trying to find out if the iwconfig value actually reads the status |
| 10:04.34 | divVerent | of if it just shows the set limit |
| 10:05.09 | XATRIX | I think it does the actual |
| 10:05.17 | divVerent | then why would it never change |
| 10:05.38 | divVerent | even when I explicitly tell it to do auto on my notebook via "iw" |
| 10:05.45 | XATRIX | Because it does adjust it onece at start |
| 10:06.04 | XATRIX | I think the default value is auto |
| 10:06.25 | XATRIX | Bit Rate=48 Mb/s Tx-Power=20 dBm |
| 10:06.29 | XATRIX | I changed nothing |
| 10:06.34 | XATRIX | Link Quality=73/100 Signal level:-47 dBm Noise level=-92 dBm |
| 10:06.47 | divVerent | the "iw" tool distinguishes between setting the upper limit, or forcing the value |
| 10:07.07 | *** join/#maemo florian_kc (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian) |
| 10:07.14 | divVerent | iw dev wlp2s0 set txpower limit 1400 sets a limit of 14dBm |
| 10:07.23 | divVerent | but "fixed 1400" forces the value |
| 10:07.45 | divVerent | but it never changes when read back for me |
| 10:07.56 | XATRIX | Hm |
| 10:09.02 | vi__ | Altering tx power on the n900 does f* all in terms of power saving. |
| 10:09.12 | divVerent | vi__: yes, that is the experimental result :P |
| 10:09.25 | vi__ | At worst it just ruins the SNR |
| 10:09.25 | divVerent | 90mW isn't all that much anyway... even if it DOES anything, it's like 30mA |
| 10:09.50 | divVerent | but I would still like to see if WiFi auto txpower works on the N900's chip or not |
| 10:10.04 | XATRIX | I don't think so |
| 10:10.04 | vi__ | The thing that allows for most savings is sleep timeout etc. |
| 10:10.27 | XATRIX | I i still believe that 10mW drains 10 times less energy than 100mW |
| 10:10.37 | XATRIX | Because it hardware limited |
| 10:10.38 | divVerent | only in worst case |
| 10:10.42 | divVerent | you're not even sending permanently |
| 10:10.44 | *** join/#maemo Martix_ (~martix@eduroam-sci-dhcp67.sci.muni.cz) |
| 10:10.52 | vi__ | yes but 100mW does not give you 10 times the range. |
| 10:10.52 | XATRIX | I'm in idle mode currently |
| 10:11.08 | XATRIX | Only 5IM protocols in action ,and handset is in standby mode |
| 10:11.22 | *** join/#maemo Martix_ (~martix@dhcp-227-025.eduroam.muni.cz) |
| 10:11.32 | vi__ | And the most power savings happen when the the TX is off. |
| 10:12.01 | XATRIX | vi__: no, i'm not talking about the range, for the 'ranged' environments i use GPRS data connection |
| 10:12.15 | XATRIX | I'm after prolonging the cell life |
| 10:12.22 | vi__ | ? |
| 10:12.27 | vi__ | battery cell? |
| 10:12.32 | XATRIX | Actual time to discharge |
| 10:12.34 | XATRIX | Yea |
| 10:12.46 | vi__ | With wifi on? |
| 10:13.03 | vi__ | actually, gsm radio is the power hog. |
| 10:13.10 | vi__ | Wifi is just fine. |
| 10:13.15 | XATRIX | I mean, how long i can stay without recharging, and yes, wifi is on, GPRS is also auto-connectable |
| 10:13.45 | XATRIX | My handset search every 10 minutes, and auto-connect to any available GPRS/WIFI |
| 10:13.50 | vi__ | That depends entirely on how much you ise it! |
| 10:14.07 | XATRIX | Only for IM |
| 10:14.14 | XATRIX | No web-surfing |
| 10:14.17 | vi__ | Wow, that is going to be brutal on power. |
| 10:14.39 | XATRIX | I just need to be constantly online via IM, nothing extra |
| 10:15.02 | XATRIX | I think IM doesn't deal that much ? Sends only keepalives while in idle |
| 10:16.25 | vi__ | Well, I am connected via wifi all day and I get around 1.5-2 days depending on useage. |
| 10:17.11 | vi__ | iwconfig wlan0 rate 12M txpower 20 power period 1 unicast power timeout 20u |
| 10:17.25 | vi__ | ^is what I use when streaming internet radio. |
| 10:18.03 | vi__ | It takes power usage from ~250mA down to ~90mA |
| 10:18.09 | XATRIX | vi__: Do you use some IM protocols or any network software ? |
| 10:18.27 | vi__ | I think this is due to internet radio somehow turning PSM off for the wifi. |
| 10:18.58 | vi__ | I have google talk, skype and a SIP account logged in all the time. |
| 10:19.50 | XATRIX | Are you on GRPS/3G or only Wifi ? |
| 10:20.45 | vi__ | wifi 90% of the time. |
| 10:21.14 | XATRIX | Hmm |
| 10:21.28 | XATRIX | Don't know even what to say |
| 10:21.38 | vi__ | what is the problem? |
| 10:22.20 | XATRIX | CSOC: 97 % RSOC: 97 % |
| 10:22.20 | XATRIX | Average Current: 186 mA |
| 10:22.27 | XATRIX | But it's currently chargin |
| 10:22.56 | XATRIX | USB charge |
| 10:23.50 | XATRIX | also , what's the command to enable PowerManagement on ? |
| 10:23.51 | *** join/#maemo geaaru (~geaaru@host170-152-static.43-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 10:24.19 | vi__ | From shell... |
| 10:24.27 | vi__ | iwconfig wlan0 power on |
| 10:24.29 | vi__ | I think. |
| 10:25.02 | XATRIX | I'm trying to enable it on my laptop |
| 10:25.06 | vi__ | Does not seem to throw an error. |
| 10:25.14 | XATRIX | Just to experiment with |
| 10:25.18 | XATRIX | root@HP-Compaq-nc4010:~# iwconfig wlan0 power on |
| 10:25.18 | XATRIX | Error for wireless request "Set Power Management" (8B2C) : |
| 10:25.18 | XATRIX | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:25.34 | vi__ | is the wifi device on? up? in use? |
| 10:25.46 | XATRIX | Sure, i'm currently via wifi |
| 10:25.56 | XATRIX | Sounds if my chip doesn't support PM |
| 10:26.05 | XATRIX | Broadcom Corporation BCM4313 802.11b/g/n Wireless LAN Controller |
| 10:26.10 | vi__ | Depends how new the chip is. |
| 10:26.28 | divVerent | ok, one thing is for sure: iwconfig can NOT possibly read the current txpower |
| 10:26.41 | XATRIX | O_o |
| 10:26.42 | divVerent | somewhat obvious from the cfg80211_wext_giwtxpower code |
| 10:26.56 | XATRIX | divVerent: any idea how to get tx ? |
| 10:27.02 | divVerent | I am checkign kernel source for that |
| 10:27.05 | vi__ | what do you mean? |
| 10:27.16 | vi__ | wlan0 IEEE 802.11bg ESSID:"edinst" |
| 10:27.16 | vi__ | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:27.16 | vi__ | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:27.16 | vi__ | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:27.28 | divVerent | the 20dBm is the limit, not the current power |
| 10:27.44 | vi__ | why do you care about the current power? |
| 10:28.10 | divVerent | why not? |
| 10:28.46 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (lizardo@nat/indt/x-szujcnvpdeefzkxy) |
| 10:28.50 | XATRIX | Yea, i'm also care about current power |
| 10:29.18 | vi__ | Well, there is a murata test connector on the PCB... |
| 10:29.25 | *** join/#maemo muellisoft (~muelli@port-4794.pppoe.wtnet.de) |
| 10:29.33 | divVerent | if I am right, the wLAN driver is wl12xx |
| 10:29.37 | vi__ | y |
| 10:30.12 | XATRIX | vi__: Are you kidding :) I'd like not to disassemble the handset and apply multimeter :) |
| 10:31.28 | vi__ | Then you clearly do not want to know the TX power SO much. |
| 10:31.42 | XATRIX | I do :) |
| 10:32.03 | XATRIX | Cause i want to optimize my power drain |
| 10:32.17 | divVerent | one OTHER way BTW would be setting up an adhoc WLAN |
| 10:32.22 | vi__ | I think you are barking up the wrong tree. |
| 10:32.24 | divVerent | then seeing on the OTHER host the receive power |
| 10:32.35 | divVerent | by that you would see if it even changes if you change the txpower limit between 10 and 100 |
| 10:32.43 | vi__ | The real power hoover is the screen, then the CPU. |
| 10:32.51 | divVerent | sure, I know that |
| 10:32.54 | divVerent | for me it's just interesting |
| 10:33.11 | *** join/#maemo calvaris (~calvaris@12.98.117.91.dynamic.mundo-r.com) |
| 10:33.15 | divVerent | also, I do like limiting tx power because nobody knows how harmful it is or not |
| 10:33.21 | divVerent | especially when you have the thing right at your head :P |
| 10:34.08 | *** join/#maemo rooster_rus (~user@broadband-37-110-68-92.nationalcablenetworks.ru) |
| 10:34.15 | *** join/#maemo kaawee_ (~user@port-92-206-211-185.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 10:34.56 | vi__ | Maybe this can help you? |
| 10:34.57 | vi__ | http://www.knownokia.ca/2011/06/pushing-wireless-limits-on-n900.html |
| 10:35.54 | divVerent | right, that is especially helpful if you want a limit BETWEEN 10 and 100 mW :P |
| 10:37.08 | divVerent | too bad iwlist relies on the same ioctl to get current txpower |
| 10:37.47 | XATRIX | I use 2 bars from the brightness level bar |
| 10:40.26 | XATRIX | Nokia-N900:~# iwlist wlan0 txpower |
| 10:40.26 | XATRIX | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:40.33 | divVerent | that uses same info as iwconfig |
| 10:40.38 | XATRIX | Yep |
| 10:40.39 | divVerent | as strace shows :P |
| 10:41.57 | XATRIX | What about bleeding edge drivers ? |
| 10:42.06 | divVerent | am just downloading source of these to check |
| 10:42.16 | divVerent | cloning the repo from https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/luca/wl12xx.git/ takes a while |
| 10:43.00 | XATRIX | Also that article guys was able to rise 20dBm -> 30 |
| 10:43.26 | XATRIX | Also WTF 5G ? http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ix484JMVSAU/TfZ8h77Nl2I/AAAAAAAAAaA/KwzqkwPV4Wo/s1600/HX.png |
| 10:43.31 | divVerent | yes |
| 10:44.51 | XATRIX | Never heard about 5G O_o |
| 10:45.20 | Hurrian | It's a secret radio technology only used by N900 users. |
| 10:45.32 | XATRIX | :) |
| 10:47.23 | XATRIX | "Radios consume power for both transmitting and receiving. A typical laptop WiFi radio may consume a few watts while in use. There are several tricks and tweaks you can perform to reduce the power consumption, even when you are using WiFi all the time. " |
| 10:47.27 | XATRIX | https://lesswatts.org/tips/wireless.php |
| 10:47.47 | XATRIX | About WIFI power saving mode |
| 10:55.52 | divVerent | if I see this right, the wl12xx driver cannot turn on/off automatic send power levelling |
| 10:56.02 | divVerent | and also has no code to ask the chip for current power |
| 10:56.09 | divVerent | so either it always does the levelling, or never |
| 10:57.16 | divVerent | so MAYBE the driver does indeed no auto levelling... |
| 10:57.19 | divVerent | only one way to check |
| 10:57.22 | divVerent | measure |
| 10:57.44 | divVerent | maybe someone has an AP that can tell receive power per client? |
| 10:59.07 | *** join/#maemo Natch (~Natch@c-fecee155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 11:06.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: XATRIX: divVerent: power hog of WLAN chip is not TX, neither on 10mW not on 100mW. It's RX(!) that cuts thru battery, particularly scanning for APs or a AP that doesn't support proper PSM |
| 11:06.58 | divVerent | sure |
| 11:07.15 | divVerent | was talking more about the radiation effect :P |
| 11:07.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's why maemo/N900 scans for available APs only once every 5/10/30/60 min |
| 11:08.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | TX is never much more than 50mW on average, usually <1mW average |
| 11:09.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | battery has ~4000mWh |
| 11:09.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | screen backlight is 150..200mW *minimum* |
| 11:10.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | iirc |
| 11:10.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | (depends on ALS though) |
| 11:10.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly worrying about WLAN 10/100 setting is nonsensical |
| 11:11.48 | *** join/#maemo futpib (~futpib@89.106.197.60) |
| 11:12.12 | jaska | being connected to some accesspoints that dont have psm or broken power saving stuff seems to take a whole lot |
| 11:13.16 | jaska | and some other accesspoints have power saving that the n900 default wlan driver doesnt seem to understand so it makes ssh lag like hell |
| 11:13.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | ...or a AP that doesn't support proper PSM |
| 11:14.16 | jaska | well, some of the shit at work has something odd going on with psm :) |
| 11:14.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | luckily you can ajust PSM per AP/connection afaik |
| 11:15.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | in N900 network config |
| 11:15.10 | jaska | yeah, but if i turn it off, woosh there goes my ~2500mAh |
| 11:15.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 11:16.12 | jaska | started keeping wlan off when i dont need it because of that :| |
| 11:16.29 | divVerent | there is this auto disconnect tool BTW |
| 11:20.10 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: Thatiswhatisaid.jpeg |
| 11:20.12 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: batter has ~1300mAh |
| 11:20.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | XATRIX: so what? |
| 11:21.02 | XATRIX | Not 4000 |
| 11:21.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~1300*3.7 |
| 11:21.04 | infobot | 4810 |
| 11:21.08 | vi__ | Buy a better battery. |
| 11:21.12 | *** join/#maemo mvp (~mvp@port463.ds1-abc.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 11:21.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | W=V*A |
| 11:21.29 | XATRIX | O_o |
| 11:21.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | WLAN says "10mW" not "10mA" |
| 11:21.59 | XATRIX | Yea |
| 11:22.26 | *** join/#maemo eijk (~eijk@e178224221.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 11:25.31 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: It's kinda strange, because all of my friends who has iPhones told me wifi drastically decrease the battery life |
| 11:26.03 | kerio | well, idle vs idle+wifi with power saving is like half |
| 11:26.13 | kerio | but you're going from 8 to 16mA |
| 11:26.16 | XATRIX | Yea, something like this |
| 11:26.26 | kerio | having the screen on dwarfs both |
| 11:26.55 | kerio | vi__: i bought the same battery as you and only got 1400mAh :( |
| 11:27.06 | XATRIX | Chinese |
| 11:27.10 | XATRIX | Like i have |
| 11:27.23 | XATRIX | I have KEVA 1700, but actually 1300 |
| 11:27.30 | XATRIX | But i have doubts abuout |
| 11:28.36 | XATRIX | Maybe it has the same resistor as the original Nokia has, to be compatible, and actually it has more Li-po detergent inside to capacitate more energy |
| 11:28.48 | vi__ | kerio: I am sorry I recommended a dud :/ |
| 11:29.19 | kerio | vi__: are you *sure* you've got 1700 and it's not just a calibration artifact? |
| 11:29.26 | vi__ | kerio: 1600 |
| 11:29.38 | vi__ | Well I did it 3 times. |
| 11:29.40 | kerio | it's ok, 1400 is like a current official bl-5j, and i paid this one a quarter |
| 11:29.53 | kerio | (of the official price) |
| 11:30.09 | vi__ | On a spare n900. |
| 11:34.12 | XATRIX | kerio: nope, i did calibrate 3 times with Doc's script |
| 11:34.19 | XATRIX | And it seems like it's relevant |
| 11:34.55 | *** join/#maemo tx0h_ (~tx@g226036081.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 11:35.19 | *** join/#maemo zeq (~s_j_newbu@2a01:348:1e3:1:e6ec:10ff:fe9a:d418) |
| 11:35.28 | XATRIX | I have Last Measured Discharge: 1298 mAh |
| 11:35.36 | XATRIX | a week ago it was exact 1300 |
| 11:50.22 | *** join/#maemo FlameReaper-PC (~honoo-pc@203.106.65.1) |
| 12:05.30 | *** join/#maemo RST38h (marat@wsip-184-180-40-182.ri.ri.cox.net) |
| 12:13.59 | *** join/#maemo deepy (~deepy@wrongplanet/deepa) |
| 12:19.28 | *** join/#maemo eddyb (~eddy@unaffiliated/eddyb) |
| 12:19.32 | eddyb | whoops |
| 12:19.43 | eddyb | I've had the bad idea to play with a metro card |
| 12:19.52 | eddyb | and get it between my display and my keyboard |
| 12:19.59 | *** join/#maemo valerius (~user@95.153.162.35) |
| 12:20.27 | eddyb | I've accidentally disconnected everything in the display half of my N900 |
| 12:20.56 | eddyb | now I need to take it apart and put it back together |
| 12:21.40 | Hurrian | eddyb, hopefully you didn't rip it. |
| 12:23.22 | vi__ | OMFG, this code is an abomination. |
| 12:23.28 | vi__ | This shit barely runs. |
| 12:23.35 | vi__ | my boss: Ship it! |
| 12:24.00 | vi__ | My pride as an engineer becomes more depleted as each day passes. |
| 12:26.14 | Hurrian | vi__: don't scratch away that pride, start building a pile of hate for middle management. |
| 12:26.47 | vi__ | The problem is he is a total cunt. |
| 12:27.14 | vi__ | But my LAST 2 engineers could have done this in a day! he shouts. |
| 12:27.28 | vi__ | Your last 2 fuck goons are the reason we are in this mess. |
| 12:27.35 | Hurrian | vi__: ah, a total bellhead. |
| 12:28.40 | vi__ | me: it is not so easy with NO debug hardware. I have to spam stuff to the serial port just to observe variable changes. |
| 12:28.47 | Hurrian | vi__: the real question is, how do you drive the point into his thick skull that the program is a potato when it runs fine? |
| 12:29.08 | vi__ | him: nonsense! You just look at the code and follow it through on paper. |
| 12:29.24 | vi__ | me: it is easier said than done. |
| 12:29.41 | vi__ | him: Nonsense, I have done it before! |
| 12:30.30 | vi__ | What a fucknut. This is >15000 lines of badly written, uncommented, non documented, non formatted C using a 6 year old IDE. |
| 12:30.59 | vi__ | What do you mean the program is a potatoe? |
| 12:31.15 | Hurrian | It's a total mess, almost garbage, etc. |
| 12:32.42 | *** join/#maemo Martix_ (martix@nat/redhat/x-nktrufvdmahoyfhn) |
| 12:33.21 | Hurrian | vi__: Try describing what you want to do as "Restructuring the human-readable, unprocessed, raw declaration of the executable binary to be run on an embedded semi-cloud appliance, to increase efficiency and ROI exponentially." |
| 12:33.25 | vi__ | when the 2 previous guys were 'learn on the job' non-programmers. yes. |
| 12:33.40 | vi__ | lolwut. |
| 12:33.46 | vi__ | Are you a manager? |
| 12:35.11 | Hurrian | vi__: According to a recent study, PHB cooperation is increased by utilization of vocabulary that exceeds utilization limits imposed by the PHB niche. |
| 12:37.24 | vi__ | The routines that handle the display are a kind of finite state machine except the states are not named anything reasonable. |
| 12:37.43 | vi__ | There names range from -5 to 67 |
| 12:37.47 | vi__ | ^their |
| 12:38.22 | vi__ | The handling of the states is functioned across about 3 different files. |
| 12:38.44 | vi__ | There is even functional code in header files. |
| 12:39.08 | teotwaki | What's wrong with functional code in header files? |
| 12:39.30 | vi__ | I am probably wrong but I feel it should not be there. |
| 12:39.32 | Hurrian | teotwaki: when they're not library functions. |
| 12:39.40 | teotwaki | Try writing templates in a cpp file for giggles. |
| 12:39.50 | vi__ | No. |
| 12:40.44 | teotwaki | I can't be bothered to put Foo const & mycomp::myclass:get_foo() { return this->foo; } in a cpp file. |
| 12:41.12 | *** join/#maemo benedikt (~benedikt@unaffiliated/benedikt) |
| 12:41.39 | benedikt | so my n900 decided to shut down in the middle of a large apt-get dist-upgrade (over ssh, my fault probably) |
| 12:41.58 | *** join/#maemo SmilybOrg (Smily@BSN-142-187-36.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 12:42.00 | benedikt | if i try to power on, i just get the nokia logo on the white screen and then its off again. |
| 12:42.10 | jacekowski | bootloop |
| 12:42.12 | jacekowski | flash it |
| 12:42.17 | Hurrian | it's bricked, baby. |
| 12:42.27 | benedikt | (i've used debian for more than a decade so i'm coming from a techinical background) |
| 12:42.34 | jacekowski | flash it |
| 12:42.38 | benedikt | sweet |
| 12:42.49 | benedikt | i got it used from a coworker and ive been wondering how to reinstall |
| 12:43.04 | jacekowski | ~flashig |
| 12:43.06 | benedikt | jacekowski: can you link me to an appropriate wiki page? |
| 12:43.07 | jacekowski | ~flashing |
| 12:43.08 | infobot | somebody said maemo-flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware |
| 12:43.09 | Hurrian | If you feel like wasting time, boot into RescueOS, chroot into Maemo, properly mount /opt, and restart the dist-upgrade. |
| 12:43.28 | benedikt | Hurrian: no, i'd rather start with a clean slate. she left it pretty bloated |
| 12:43.47 | jacekowski | benedikt: flash it |
| 12:43.56 | benedikt | jacekowski: are you some sort of bot? |
| 12:43.58 | teotwaki | vi__: don't badmouth the people who did things before you. They probably did so to the best of their knowledge and capabilities. If you think you can do better, do it; but ranting about how stupid your boss is or how shit the code is is pretty poor. |
| 12:44.08 | teotwaki | vi__: I do exactly the same, I don't blame management though. |
| 12:44.09 | Hurrian | benedikt: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware |
| 12:44.16 | benedikt | Hurrian: i'm there |
| 12:44.19 | benedikt | thanks for the help |
| 12:44.31 | jacekowski | benedikt: no |
| 12:44.41 | Hurrian | download both eMMC and rootfs files, run the command, note that internal storage is wiped too. |
| 12:44.42 | benedikt | jacekowski: :D |
| 12:45.33 | infobot | thinks DocScrutinizer05 is a bot |
| 12:46.05 | teotwaki | infobot: that's because that douche is one. |
| 12:46.05 | infobot | teotwaki: what are you talking about? |
| 12:46.21 | teotwaki | infobot: what you just said, bitface. |
| 12:47.48 | vi__ | ~buttrape infobot |
| 12:47.58 | vi__ | ~beat infobot |
| 12:47.58 | infobot | ACTION relentlessly beats infobot over the head with a Louisville Slugger |
| 12:48.14 | teotwaki | ~rape herself |
| 12:48.14 | infobot | ACTION takes herself behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams |
| 12:48.22 | vi__ | ~3d6 |
| 12:48.29 | vi__ | ~1d6 |
| 12:48.30 | infobot | You roll a 6 |
| 12:48.36 | vi__ | BAM! |
| 12:48.50 | teotwaki | ~1d256 |
| 12:49.01 | vi__ | It is not as smart as you hope |
| 12:49.07 | vi__ | ~!99999999999 |
| 12:49.12 | Hurrian | ~vfpv3d16 |
| 12:49.21 | teotwaki | ~human |
| 12:49.21 | infobot | i heard human is the mind of an angel in the body of an animal |
| 12:49.31 | vi__ | ~!9 |
| 12:49.37 | vi__ | !9 |
| 12:49.45 | vi__ | ~=!9 |
| 12:50.21 | teotwaki | vi__: stop ridiculing yourself. It's weird for everyone who's watching. |
| 12:51.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~dice 100d10 |
| 12:52.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~9! |
| 12:52.59 | infobot | i guess 9! is 362,880 |
| 12:53.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | sighs |
| 12:53.24 | vi__ | stop ridiculing yourself. It's weird for everyone who's watching. <- please explain this. |
| 12:53.52 | teotwaki | ~dict ridicule |
| 12:54.09 | eddyb | back |
| 12:54.12 | teotwaki | ~dict weird |
| 12:54.35 | eddyb | Hurrian: nah it was a paper card, I think I just took a flexible connector out of its socket |
| 12:55.47 | eddyb | now a question... have you ever used adb on the N900, connected to another phone/tablet? |
| 12:56.10 | eddyb | I want to root a Galaxy Tab 2 7" with just my N900 :D |
| 12:56.48 | eddyb | if it's 4.0.3, it has a security hole and I can just use adb. but I need a special USB cable and adb on maemo :/ |
| 12:57.38 | *** join/#maemo hardaker (~hardaker@mail.hardakers.net) |
| 12:58.05 | vi__ | what is adb? |
| 12:58.44 | eddyb | android debug bridge |
| 12:59.01 | vi__ | is it opensource/compiled for arm? |
| 12:59.21 | eddyb | it's like an USB debug shell, once you've enabled usb debugging in an android phone you can connect to it |
| 12:59.23 | thedead1440 | vi__: http://developer.android.com/tools/help/adb.html |
| 13:00.15 | eddyb | vi__: random post: http://blog.alexworld.it/post/9707276488/how-to-build-android-adb-on-arm |
| 13:00.16 | benedikt | Hurrian: for future reference, how do i boot into RescueOS? |
| 13:00.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | wtf got android debug bridge to do with maemo? |
| 13:00.54 | *** join/#maemo frafl (~Thunderbi@e178073059.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:01.02 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: I need to run it from maemo |
| 13:01.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | LOL |
| 13:01.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok, good luck |
| 13:01.28 | eddyb | I can't carry my laptop with me to the scene :P |
| 13:01.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you got a linux source for adb, and it doesn't too leete tricks to USB, it actually *might* work |
| 13:02.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | though I honestly doubt H-E-N is fit for that type of usecase |
| 13:03.01 | eddyb | yeah, I have never used it and I don't know how to even connect the two devices |
| 13:03.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe when you use a usb hub |
| 13:03.20 | eddyb | https://gist.github.com/splhack/958335 so there's two files related to usb |
| 13:03.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | then you're out of luck i guess |
| 13:04.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | afk, bbl |
| 13:04.20 | infobot | waves |
| 13:06.26 | eddyb | https://github.com/android/platform_system_core/tree/master/adb <3 github |
| 13:08.07 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: basic libusb usage, I'm sure it would work :D |
| 13:08.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | still not |
| 13:09.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | H-E-N doesn't provide connect detection |
| 13:09.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | you have to do ENUM manually |
| 13:09.33 | eddyb | actually, there's a usbdevice_fs version and another one with libusb |
| 13:09.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | for all I know adb depends on instant ENUM |
| 13:10.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, I'm out |
| 13:10.03 | eddyb | ssize_t cnt = libusb_get_device_list(ctx, &devs); |
| 13:10.59 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: however, the linux usbdevice_fs version starts a thread scanning for devices |
| 13:12.54 | *** join/#maemo NeutrinoPower (~neutrino@HSI-KBW-078-042-162-195.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 13:16.29 | *** join/#maemo sLumPia (~sLumPia@182.5.212.50) |
| 13:19.07 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: what can you say about Advanced Power v0.5.0-3 |
| 13:19.08 | XATRIX | ? |
| 13:19.34 | XATRIX | My logic tells me that default one indicator also does the syscalls and drain power |
| 13:19.48 | XATRIX | But this one gives good information tho |
| 13:25.37 | *** join/#maemo Hurrian (~Hurrian@121.54.2.104) |
| 13:28.09 | *** join/#maemo disco_stu_droid (~wrt54gl@190.211.81.139) |
| 13:29.43 | kerio | XATRIX: use the battery applet from cssu-devel |
| 13:29.55 | XATRIX | kerio: link ? |
| 13:33.46 | XATRIX | Can't find anything |
| 13:46.13 | *** join/#maemo topro (~topro@host-62-245-142-50.customer.m-online.net) |
| 13:46.40 | *** join/#maemo Hurrian (~Hurrian@121.54.2.104) |
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| 14:23.55 | benedikt | Where can i download the flasher for linux? |
| 14:23.59 | benedikt | the links on the wiki are dead |
| 14:27.55 | Hurrian | http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/ |
| 14:28.08 | benedikt | Hurrian: found that site, but it appear to not include flasher-3.5 |
| 14:28.34 | Hurrian | http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/maemo_dev_env_downloads/maemo_flasher-3.5_2.5.2.2_i386.deb |
| 14:28.39 | benedikt | (is there a reason why the wiki hasn't been updated to point there instead?) |
| 14:28.44 | benedikt | Hurrian: sweet |
| 14:29.01 | benedikt | Hurrian: where is that accessible from the sitE? |
| 14:29.17 | Hurrian | http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/nokia_N900/ |
| 14:29.26 | Hurrian | see the first link on the page |
| 14:29.39 | benedikt | "Maemo releases"? |
| 14:30.32 | benedikt | Hurrian: flasher-3.5 isn't on that page |
| 14:30.44 | thedead1440 | "Command line flasher binaries are available here." |
| 14:30.48 | Hurrian | maemo_flasher-3.5_2.5.2.2_i386.deb 59328 Maemo Flasher-3.5 Tool for Fremantle and Diablo, installation package for Debian based Linuxes (x86, 32-bit) |
| 14:31.00 | benedikt | thedead1440: aaah! |
| 14:33.33 | *** join/#maemo mickname (mickname@low6.kyla.fi) |
| 14:33.35 | *** join/#maemo konelix__ (~konelix@190.143.170.66) |
| 14:35.20 | benedikt | what are OS200{7,8}HE? |
| 14:35.22 | *** join/#maemo sunny_s (~sunny_s@86.57.254.135) |
| 14:36.47 | benedikt | has no idea what to pick from http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/nokia_N900/ |
| 14:36.52 | teotwaki | Old versions of Maemo, Hacker Editions. |
| 14:38.34 | benedikt | "Latest Maemo 5 Global release for Nokia N900 " |
| 14:38.49 | benedikt | i assume this is newer than "Maemo 5 Global release for Nokia N900 " ? |
| 14:39.15 | benedikt | and when do i want to flash the eMMC? |
| 14:51.24 | benedikt | where can i get the source for flasher-3.5 |
| 14:54.07 | *** join/#maemo Martix_ (martix@nat/redhat/x-wryyylcowfxqgwvc) |
| 15:01.57 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (~bef0rd@186.29.26.86) |
| 15:02.27 | benedikt | so flasher-3.5 depends on a version of libc6 that isnt in either ubuntu or debian |
| 15:02.44 | jacekowski | flasher-3.5 is binary only |
| 15:02.50 | jacekowski | fuck yeah, breaking abi on linux |
| 15:03.46 | benedikt | yeah, this is breaking a lot of things |
| 15:03.52 | benedikt | i thought maemo was free software? |
| 15:04.36 | jacekowski | it's free as in beer |
| 15:04.43 | benedikt | not as in freedom? |
| 15:04.43 | jacekowski | and no it's not |
| 15:04.49 | jacekowski | not fully |
| 15:05.13 | jacekowski | there is a lot of closed bits including flasher |
| 15:05.28 | benedikt | well that sucks |
| 15:05.30 | benedikt | anyhow |
| 15:05.37 | benedikt | managed to get it running on an ubuntu computer |
| 15:07.06 | DocScrutinizer51 | ~closed |
| 15:07.06 | infobot | from memory, closed is http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages or https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages |
| 15:07.33 | DocScrutinizer51 | for ultralatest, see maeo.cloud-u.de |
| 15:08.22 | DocScrutinizer51 | it has PR1.3.1 |
| 15:08.39 | DocScrutinizer51 | ~pr131 |
| 15:08.40 | infobot | combined is probably the rootfs fiasco image of maemo. For N900 latest (PR1.3.1) see http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/fiasco+co/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin or http://nds2.fds-fire.nokia.com/fdp/interface/FiRe/2011/9/--FID--A0A22MVWFVFAM/--LID--FiRe1317015685654/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin |
| 15:08.52 | benedikt | DocScrutinizer51: nah, i want something thats stable |
| 15:09.03 | DocScrutinizer51 | that IS stable |
| 15:09.18 | benedikt | oh |
| 15:09.26 | benedikt | isn't there any wiki you can trust? |
| 15:09.33 | DocScrutinizer51 | it's just the release for Nokia servicepoints |
| 15:09.38 | benedikt | wiki.maemo.org seems to be abandoned (lot of dead lines) |
| 15:10.08 | benedikt | and i was sent to skeiron.org, which i think is a mirror of an old maemo site that has disappeared |
| 15:10.10 | DocScrutinizer51 | wiki is mostly just fine |
| 15:10.26 | DocScrutinizer51 | yes |
| 15:10.33 | DocScrutinizer51 | ~skeiron |
| 15:10.33 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, skeiron is the semi-official backup and emergency standin for all internet borne maemo resources: http://skeiron.org/tablets-dev/ http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1315143#post1315143 |
| 15:10.55 | benedikt | how much older is the stuff on skeiron than what you linked to? |
| 15:11.33 | DocScrutinizer51 | skeiron is up-to-date |
| 15:11.44 | benedikt | then what is http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/fiasco+co/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin ? |
| 15:12.22 | DocScrutinizer51 | what I linked to is so new it harly exists |
| 15:12.23 | DocScrutinizer51 | hardly |
| 15:12.43 | DocScrutinizer51 | I.E. Nokia never published that image on tablets-dev |
| 15:13.35 | DocScrutinizer51 | see ~pr131 |
| 15:14.11 | *** join/#maemo Dynamit (~Mohamed@84-55-71-22.customers.ownit.se) |
| 15:14.19 | DocScrutinizer51 | the second link is Nokia |
| 15:16.37 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: what can you say about Advanced Power v0.5.0-3 ? |
| 15:16.46 | XATRIX | My logic tells me that default one indicator also does the syscalls and drain power |
| 15:21.46 | benedikt | DocScrutinizer51: cool |
| 15:21.52 | benedikt | sounds like thats what i should download |
| 15:23.18 | benedikt | DocScrutinizer51: is that the "global" release? |
| 15:25.53 | Drathir | XATRIX: better than wi fi i think dimm lcd lightning |
| 15:27.18 | *** join/#maemo eijk (~eijk@e178224072.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 15:27.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | XATRIX: I don't know advanced-power |
| 15:28.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | benedikt: MR0 is global, afaik, yes |
| 15:30.22 | Drathir | what i see go to 10mW on n900 have less coverage and less data transfer rate... |
| 15:30.54 | eddyb | dammit |
| 15:30.59 | eddyb | I need to get one of these http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-Galaxy-Tab-Data-Cable/dp/B0044EAVSY/ref=pd_sim_computers_6#productDetails |
| 15:32.03 | *** join/#maemo konelix (~konelix@190.143.170.85) |
| 15:32.16 | Drathir | yes n900 wifi sensitivity is a quite good also with weak networks... |
| 15:32.52 | *** join/#maemo dhbiker (~dhbiker@95.87.145.172) |
| 15:33.40 | eddyb | hmm |
| 15:34.01 | eddyb | so for $5 I can get an USB micro OTG adapter |
| 15:34.54 | eddyb | and for $10 I can get a samsung galaxy tab 2 data cable |
| 15:36.43 | eddyb | I put those two together and I can connect the tab as a device to the N900 |
| 15:37.29 | ShadowJK | there's no point of using 10mW |
| 15:37.32 | eddyb | lolz, the tablet data cable is cheaper if you get an original |
| 15:37.44 | ShadowJK | The option only exists because legally you're limited to 10mW outdoors in France |
| 15:37.54 | eddyb | lol? |
| 15:38.02 | benedikt | where is that option |
| 15:38.26 | eddyb | in any wifi network's advanced settings |
| 15:38.31 | eddyb | but it changes for all of them |
| 15:40.51 | eddyb | does this look like it will work with the N900? http://cdn03.gsmnet.ro/poze_produse/55560/supermari/adaptor-microusb-usb-samsung-i9100-galaxy-s-ii_0.jpg |
| 15:40.59 | XATRIX | DocScrutinizer05: it's a much detailed batter charge indicator. Stock one shows only a gauge, and this one shows the percentage + time to discharge |
| 15:42.10 | benedikt | after reflashing, its normal that it takes way longer to boot than normally, right? |
| 15:42.59 | benedikt | it booted |
| 15:43.15 | benedikt | is all user data kept on teh eMMC, including settings? (dotfiles?) |
| 15:43.36 | eddyb | OH WTF |
| 15:43.38 | eddyb | https://www.google.com/search?q=filetype%3Apdf+site%3Agsmnet.ro |
| 15:43.53 | eddyb | google indexed a shitton of private data |
| 15:44.51 | Apic | Tell news. |
| 15:45.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | benedikt: yep |
| 15:45.03 | benedikt | eddyb: thats called google dorking, its actually pretty big |
| 15:45.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | takes longer |
| 15:45.17 | benedikt | DocScrutinizer05: its up now |
| 15:45.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | benedikt: yes, /home is on eMMC |
| 15:45.43 | eddyb | benedikt: it would have never happened if those files weren't public in the first place |
| 15:45.56 | eddyb | benedikt: or if they weren't linked from anywhere |
| 15:46.25 | eddyb | weird, I expected http://www.gsmnet.ro/facturi/ to be a dumb directory lister |
| 15:48.40 | kerio | ShadowJK: hahahha what? who limits their wifi tx power? |
| 15:48.49 | kerio | and how do you enforce it? |
| 15:49.33 | benedikt | kerio: with laws. vendors and manufacturers follow them |
| 15:49.48 | kerio | he said "outside" |
| 15:49.53 | kerio | which means that there's no such limit inside |
| 15:50.12 | kerio | which means that you're legally able to sell wifi cards that do more |
| 15:50.18 | XATRIX | eMMC = RAM memory die or a standart SD card ? |
| 15:52.04 | eddyb | oh shit... worst part about my phone being decapitated is that I don't have a phone number in case they phone me about the order I'm about to make |
| 15:52.05 | eddyb | :S |
| 15:52.18 | kerio | eddyb: no other mobile phones? |
| 15:52.25 | eddyb | nope |
| 15:53.01 | eddyb | well, there's a crappy Nokia 1000 I could try to revive :/ |
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| 15:56.38 | eddyb | so why does the service manual say to not reuse the screws? |
| 15:56.41 | eddyb | what's that about? |
| 15:57.26 | eddyb | ok, I only need to remove 4 screws to get access to the flex connector |
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| 16:16.14 | eddyb | 2/4 taken out. they're really easy to unscrew :D |
| 16:18.49 | eddyb | OH FUCK |
| 16:18.55 | eddyb | the flex is ripped off >:( |
| 16:19.23 | eddyb | that stuff isn't even plastic |
| 16:19.26 | eddyb | cheap nokia |
| 16:19.33 | eddyb | it's some shitty rubber |
| 16:19.44 | eddyb | it looks very bad without the cut, thermal damage |
| 16:22.00 | Drathir | eddyb: oc cpu? |
| 16:22.57 | eddyb | just the past couple of days, but the flex looks like it aged in a mildly heated environment |
| 16:23.06 | eddyb | is plastic too much to ask? |
| 16:23.22 | eddyb | this is like rubber paper |
| 16:23.50 | eddyb | Drathir: but you could destroy the flex if you overclocked the CPU for months, I think |
| 16:23.57 | eddyb | this shit is soo fragile |
| 16:24.23 | eddyb | where the heck do I even get a new one? |
| 16:32.45 | ShadowJK | kerio; just look at random people randomly changing it to 10mW and claiming batteryife doubled ;) |
| 16:33.36 | eddyb | underclocking works for me |
| 16:33.51 | kerio | ShadowJK: would that really even happen? |
| 16:33.55 | eddyb | when I don't need to be constantly using it |
| 16:34.09 | kerio | i expect my tx power to be at a solid 0 the vast majority of the time |
| 16:34.14 | ShadowJK | kerio; would what happen? |
| 16:34.16 | kerio | because of powersaving |
| 16:34.26 | kerio | doubling battery life by lowering the tx power |
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| 16:42.49 | ShadowJK | Yeah no, the emitted power is a small part of total power use of wifi |
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| 16:59.19 | eddyb | oh |
| 16:59.23 | eddyb | I can order a replacement one :D |
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| 17:04.15 | eddyb | http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRAND-NEW-FAKE-CAMERA-FLAT-FLEX-CABLE-RIBBON-REPLACEMENT-FOR-NOKIA-N900-c57A-/150661584677?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2314215725 |
| 17:04.21 | eddyb | or http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Flex-Cable-Ribbon-with-Camera-For-Nokia-N900-/280966940848?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item416aef48b0 |
| 17:04.38 | sixwheeledbeast | eddyb: ~fixribbon |
| 17:04.44 | sixwheeledbeast | ~fixribbon |
| 17:04.44 | infobot | i heard fixribbon is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1324171#post1324171 |
| 17:05.18 | sixwheeledbeast | just repaired mine there's a full walkthrough |
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| 17:06.04 | eddyb | thanks, that will be helpful :D |
| 17:06.14 | sixwheeledbeast | np |
| 17:07.35 | eddyb | for $50 I can get an original display :D (looking for replacement parts) |
| 17:09.59 | eddyb | http://www.gsmnet.ro/banda-flat-cable-flex/nokia I hope I can get one here |
| 17:11.34 | eddyb | damn they don't have N900 |
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| 17:14.23 | sixwheeledbeast | Be careful to check the images and description. I spotted some that where listed as N900 but definitely not. You can see my one from halagsm is clearly the correct one on the link. |
| 17:14.41 | eddyb | sixwheeledbeast: I can't open the two middle screws under the slider :( |
| 17:15.18 | sixwheeledbeast | very tight be careful do to round them |
| 17:15.34 | eddyb | ? |
| 17:15.38 | sixwheeledbeast | s/do to/to not/ |
| 17:15.56 | eddyb | well... |
| 17:16.05 | eddyb | at least they're meant to be one-use-only |
| 17:17.03 | eddyb | I can find this http://www.ebay.com/itm/Philips-PH00-Precision-Screwdriver-Repairing-Screw-Driver-Tool-Cellphone-/251140466420?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a792366f4 |
| 17:17.11 | eddyb | but I can't find the screws on ebay :/ |
| 17:17.53 | sixwheeledbeast | if you can't get them out you have a big problem, see my ~fixribbon for more... |
| 17:18.39 | sixwheeledbeast | IIRC i had a PH0 PH00 PH000 screwdrivers the display screws where PH000 |
| 17:19.08 | eddyb | the service manual says 00 |
| 17:19.47 | sixwheeledbeast | well I went off what fitted snuggly.... |
| 17:20.51 | eddyb | "In the end I removed the head with a tiny dremmel bit." |
| 17:21.12 | eddyb | this sounds worse and worse |
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| 17:24.32 | eddyb | now I'm curious |
| 17:24.45 | eddyb | is it possible to replace the touch screen with a capacitive one? |
| 17:25.49 | sixwheeledbeast | why that's the best part, the accuracy of resistive |
| 17:27.05 | eddyb | I guess the controller is resistive-specific anyway |
| 17:27.23 | eddyb | sixwheeledbeast: but capacitive touchscreen can have multitouch, right? |
| 17:27.42 | eddyb | and I found where to buy from http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GENUINE-NEW-NOKIA-N900-SLIDE-SLIDER-RIBBON-CABLE-FLEX-WITH-CAMERA-N-900-/280762188838?pt=UK_Replacement_Parts_Tools&hash=item415ebb0426 |
| 17:28.01 | sixwheeledbeast | but maemo doesn't need it. |
| 17:28.08 | eddyb | that will arrive much sooner than a post package from hong kong |
| 17:28.19 | eddyb | and it has two tools to help me :D |
| 17:28.42 | eddyb | sixwheeledbeast: just asking :D |
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| 17:32.49 | sixwheeledbeast | eddyb: someone with the same wishful thinking http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1330319&postcount=323 |
| 17:34.13 | eddyb | isn't that worse than me? |
| 17:34.35 | sixwheeledbeast | lol |
| 17:34.46 | eddyb | I mean, I'm asking about the possibility of a hardware replacement |
| 17:34.52 | eddyb | he seems clueless |
| 17:34.57 | eddyb | semi-clueless |
| 17:35.04 | sixwheeledbeast | mmm |
| 17:36.52 | eddyb | oooof course |
| 17:36.57 | eddyb | paypal account is kinda empty |
| 17:36.58 | eddyb | darn |
| 17:39.59 | Drathir | btw maybe someone know it is possible to broke card reader in this way i have a sd card from blackberry formated in bb device with its data encryption and when i put it on n900 sd reader and close case and checking dmesg cant mount that sd and when i put out sd cart it is a very hot... |
| 17:40.48 | Drathir | very hot not mean little warm, but really hot... |
| 17:41.03 | Drathir | but i dont sure it is reason format of card or card is broken... i have no idea how to check that... |
| 17:43.47 | teotwaki | ~veryhot is not mean little warm, but really hot... |
| 17:43.47 | infobot | okay, teotwaki |
| 17:45.32 | sixwheeledbeast | well, you could try it in the bb again |
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| 17:48.22 | Drathir | sixwheeledbeast: if i can that be great, but my bb9300 have a accident sadly... |
| 17:49.11 | eddyb | sixwheeledbeast: WOOO I found one closer by :D |
| 17:49.18 | eddyb | I still need the screwdriver |
| 17:49.30 | eddyb | mine doesn't fit that well |
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| 17:50.02 | sixwheeledbeast | screwdrivers are one use only :P |
| 17:50.19 | eddyb | weren't the screws one-use-only? |
| 17:50.24 | Drathir | sixwheeledbeast: dmesg output http://pastebin.com/aY9QxNbp |
| 17:50.46 | eddyb | hmm |
| 17:50.50 | eddyb | now that I think of it |
| 17:50.58 | eddyb | someone could take all these replacement parts |
| 17:51.10 | eddyb | and have a custom motherboard inside |
| 17:51.31 | eddyb | preferably something powerful |
| 17:51.36 | eddyb | put android on it and enjoy :D |
| 17:53.37 | eddyb | at least now I know what I'm looking for |
| 17:53.41 | eddyb | it's called "band" here |
| 17:58.40 | sixwheeledbeast | Drathir: do you need the data off it? |
| 18:00.28 | Drathir | sixwheeledbeast: i think about dump with dd data but i dont know if it possible in that case |
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| 18:08.27 | sixwheeledbeast | what's the latest version of CSSU stable in r.m.o at the moment? |
| 18:13.56 | sixwheeledbeast | anyone? Smaemo5 or Smaemo6 ? |
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| 18:32.27 | Drathir | botsnack |
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| 18:35.43 | Drathir | sixwheeledbeast: i try to check stable but my testing is |
| 18:35.43 | Drathir | sixwheeledbeast: i try to check stable but my testing is Community SSU installed |
| 18:35.43 | Drathir | Version: 21.2011.38-1Tmaemo7.2 |
| 18:36.08 | Drathir | Flavor: Testing |
| 18:36.59 | sixwheeledbeast | it's k, wondering if the repos have been updated since infra move. |
| 18:37.56 | Drathir | if good remember in near future bomming a big update... |
| 18:38.03 | Drathir | comming* |
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| 18:42.52 | eddyb | sixwheeledbeast: so what did you do with your drilled screw? |
| 18:42.57 | eddyb | did you replace it? |
| 18:43.57 | eddyb | gaah |
| 18:44.02 | eddyb | I can't find screws anywhere |
| 18:49.16 | eddyb | http://iphone4parts.com/shop/iphone-3gs-iphone-3g-screw-set-p-121.html |
| 18:49.24 | eddyb | doesn't say which type of screws they are |
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| 18:51.11 | eddyb | I had to check out C1-01's service manual |
| 18:51.15 | eddyb | to see if the screws match |
| 18:51.40 | eddyb | nope, torx+ size 4 |
| 18:53.00 | eddyb | does anyone know if the iphone screws are the right ones? |
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| 18:59.56 | eddyb | oh, finally, http://www.thenokiaparts.com/eng/tuotteet/N900-spare-parts |
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| 19:02.57 | eddyb | can I not get replacement screws |
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| 19:37.27 | RiD | hello |
| 19:43.26 | RiD | i need help from the microUSB experts -> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=89531 |
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| 19:57.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | eddyb: noody really uses replacement screws ever |
| 19:57.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | except nokia care |
| 19:58.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | nobody even |
| 19:58.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | you should use relacements if you ruined the original ones on unscrewing them |
| 19:59.18 | eddyb | no ood ever? |
| 19:59.33 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: I'm afraid I'm going to ruin the screws :| |
| 19:59.53 | RiD | i'd be afraid of you runing the plastic things around the screws |
| 19:59.55 | RiD | ruining* |
| 20:00.29 | eddyb | RiD: those 4 screws are really easy to unscrew |
| 20:01.01 | eddyb | but the 6 on the back of the display module are very tight >:( |
| 20:01.18 | eddyb | and I don't have a darn PH00 around |
| 20:01.25 | RiD | get a hammer |
| 20:01.31 | eddyb | fu |
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| 20:02.16 | eddyb | there's one online shop, but it doesn't let me buy stuff under $3 (and the screwdriver is $1) |
| 20:02.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | get 3 |
| 20:02.29 | RiD | buy 3 |
| 20:02.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-P |
| 20:02.36 | eddyb | are they *that* bad? |
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| 20:02.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly? yes |
| 20:03.25 | eddyb | I was thinking of getting a 000, too, as per sixwheeledbeast's comments |
| 20:03.57 | RiD | DocScrutinizer05 do you know anything about microUSB fixes? |
| 20:04.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | a bit |
| 20:04.49 | RiD | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=89531 if you could take a look :P |
| 20:05.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | what for? |
| 20:05.48 | RiD | i want to know if oh2btg's fix (last image) has any mistakes on it |
| 20:06.08 | RiD | because he says it was based on mipo, and mipo did something wrong and ruined it |
| 20:06.19 | RiD | i'm paranoid |
| 20:06.31 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: you must be kidding me. it's not exactly $3, it's $3.(3). it's easier when I say it in dollars, but this is in my local currency |
| 20:07.02 | RiD | buy 4 |
| 20:07.06 | eddyb | yepp |
| 20:07.19 | eddyb | the delivery is like 2.5 screwdrivers worth |
| 20:07.21 | RiD | or try buying 3 and a half |
| 20:07.25 | eddyb | lol |
| 20:07.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | RiD: this fix looks basically fine |
| 20:07.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~usbfix |
| 20:07.36 | infobot | somebody said usbfix was http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=75920 - and **NEVER** use epoxy (unless you want to seal your device for underwater) |
| 20:07.55 | RiD | yeah i've seen that thread countless times already :P |
| 20:08.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | but honestly, your PCB looks perfectly intact |
| 20:08.38 | RiD | it WAS |
| 20:08.39 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: thanks, time to write all my personal details for the millionth time today |
| 20:08.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | you don't need that wire nightmare |
| 20:08.48 | RiD | until someone ruined it, trying to fix it |
| 20:08.55 | RiD | don't have a pic of that though |
| 20:09.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | eddyb: eh? |
| 20:09.11 | eddyb | DocScrutinizer05: delivery address |
| 20:09.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | wut? |
| 20:09.19 | RiD | one of these pins (don't know what to call them) doesn't work. It's the 2nd one, counting from right |
| 20:09.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | not my problem |
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| 20:10.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | what do you mean by "doesn't work"? |
| 20:10.26 | RiD | bad wording, lol. It was loose |
| 20:10.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | the pad? |
| 20:10.56 | RiD | what is the pad |
| 20:11.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | what was loose? |
| 20:11.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | pads are those copper with solder on it aread on your board |
| 20:12.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | pins are the little wires coming out of components |
| 20:13.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly, I can't help based on sparse facts |
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| 20:14.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | to me your PCB looks like perfect condition to solder a new USB receptacle component to it |
| 20:14.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | definitely, no doubt |
| 20:15.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | zhe photo is pretty good |
| 20:15.21 | RiD | back, it seems that the pads are not solid anymore, one of them was ripped off and two or so were "raised" (terrible english) by the previous guy trying to fix it |
| 20:15.33 | RiD | i don't have an actual pic, but it looks nowhere as pretty as it does on that picture |
| 20:15.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-/ |
| 20:15.50 | eddyb | then get a pic |
| 20:15.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | the heck |
| 20:15.58 | RiD | have to disassemble it first |
| 20:16.06 | eddyb | do it? |
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| 20:16.11 | eddyb | do you have the tools? |
| 20:16.32 | RiD | I'll have to wait after dinner |
| 20:16.45 | RiD | it's not me who disassembles it, it's my father |
| 20:16.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | so why theheck are you posting a meaningless photo? |
| 20:19.02 | RiD | good question |
| 20:19.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1018141#post1018141 |
| 20:21.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | so if seconf from right pad is defect, simply ignore it |
| 20:22.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | for rightmost pad you can use a short wire to nearby mech support pad (the large square one) |
| 20:23.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | since both are GND |
| 20:23.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | the other 3 pads need to be ok, or you need the wire workaround |
| 20:27.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | so to answer your initial question: no, there's nothing obviously wrong with that photo in that post (except the short from rightmost pin to 2nd right, which isn't needed and doesn't serve a purpose |
| 20:32.09 | RiD | so, the 2nd right doesn't need to be "welded" like he did on the picture, only the rightmost? |
| 20:34.49 | RiD | I see on the picture that he "ripped" that metal frame - i guess that it's quite hard to fix usb without removing it, am i right? |
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