| 00:00.03 | Estel_ | Sysaxed, then you havent seen what DocScrutinizer05 is capable off :P |
| 00:00.08 | Estel_ | of, even |
| 00:00.11 | Estel_ | iweron, thx |
| 00:00.20 | Sysaxed | Estel_, he was very friendly |
| 00:00.29 | Estel_ | try to disagree with him ;) |
| 00:00.46 | Estel_ | for example about feasibility of using sqlite database to store map tiles :P |
| 00:00.48 | Estel_ | ok, enough. |
| 00:00.56 | Sysaxed | well, I do disagree that 90 mA usage is ok... XD |
| 00:00.57 | Estel_ | checking pastebin |
| 00:01.30 | Estel_ | as i suspected |
| 00:01.35 | Estel_ | ~90 mA in flight mode |
| 00:01.41 | Estel_ | = same as with gsm connected |
| 00:01.48 | iweron | DocScrutinizer05, whatever, but what do you think is it? |
| 00:02.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: sorry i'm out, ask Mr Estel_, I'm sure he'll tell you extremely nifty way to make sure your wlan is damaged |
| 00:02.04 | Estel_ | some shit is eating your power |
| 00:02.11 | iweron | =_= |
| 00:02.18 | Sysaxed | Estel_, maybe it's a good idea to try it out with sim card inserted? |
| 00:02.22 | Estel_ | btw see my question about how your wlan got damaged |
| 00:02.30 | Sysaxed | Estel_, or maybe run the test as fast as he could after boot? |
| 00:02.31 | Estel_ | Sysaxed, he have sim card as i understand it? |
| 00:02.41 | Sysaxed | without* |
| 00:02.46 | Estel_ | fast after boot wont help, n900 may be busy rightly |
| 00:02.47 | iweron | I have no idea how |
| 00:02.55 | Estel_ | iweron, symptomes |
| 00:03.00 | Sysaxed | Estel_, even if it's busy, it wont drain 90 mA |
| 00:03.02 | Estel_ | symthomes, even |
| 00:03.11 | Estel_ | Sysaxed, active cpu can drain so much |
| 00:03.19 | Estel_ | if busy |
| 00:03.32 | Estel_ | the thing is his powertop shows 80-92% in idle |
| 00:03.38 | Estel_ | yet 90 mA power draw in idle |
| 00:03.43 | Estel_ | iweron, no batterypatch? |
| 00:03.53 | Estel_ | no stupid undervolting settings? |
| 00:04.01 | Estel_ | or messing with frequency governor? |
| 00:04.07 | Estel_ | but you said you've reflashed... |
| 00:04.15 | Estel_ | scratches head |
| 00:04.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: go back to stock kernel |
| 00:04.27 | Sysaxed | Estel_, if wlan is broken, and if he's disabling it each time after boot, maybe it's a good idea to reboot and see what happens without disabling it? |
| 00:05.00 | iweron | when I got a phone it was already damaged. Symptomes are: when I open connections menu my system crashed (seems to be kernel panic and the only way is reboot device removing the battery) |
| 00:05.52 | iweron | Estel_, I installed batterypatch, but it didn't help and cpu usage was always 500MHz, so I removed it |
| 00:05.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: even do a full reflash to stock maemo5, do *no app installs* and then check again |
| 00:06.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | BWAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA |
| 00:06.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~crappatch |
| 00:06.10 | infobot | i guess speedpatch is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1012405#post1012405 >>first i don't realy understand what does this patch do (that is why it is called miracle patch)<< [/quote original-author-of-speedpatch] |
| 00:06.15 | iweron | DocScrutinizer05, but I did it already 5 times |
| 00:06.19 | Estel_ | well, SpeedEvil isn't meant to help with battery usage |
| 00:06.21 | iweron | and always the same thing |
| 00:06.23 | Estel_ | speedpatch i mean |
| 00:06.26 | Estel_ | sorry SpeedEvil :P |
| 00:06.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | then you did it wrong 5 times |
| 00:06.28 | iweron | 6-8 hours and out |
| 00:06.42 | Estel_ | iweron, installed anything after reflash? |
| 00:06.49 | Estel_ | reflash was full fiasco image? |
| 00:06.57 | Estel_ | how do you disable wifi module? |
| 00:07.16 | iweron | nope, clear system. |
| 00:07.23 | iweron | modprobe -v -r wl12xx |
| 00:07.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: you evidently even got powerkernel installed |
| 00:07.32 | iweron | now yes |
| 00:07.34 | Estel_ | try with installing only i2ctools and bq27200.sh after reflash (and rootsh, for example) |
| 00:07.42 | Estel_ | if it still eats 90 mA idle |
| 00:08.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | then it's a hw issue |
| 00:08.06 | iweron | I should try |
| 00:08.09 | iweron | but anyway |
| 00:08.13 | iweron | if it is hw issue |
| 00:08.18 | kerio | aww, Estel_ and DocScrutinizer05 are finishing each other's phrases now :3 |
| 00:08.23 | Estel_ | it's something fishy in hardware. If, OTOH, fresh system with only 3 things installed (rootsh, i2ctools, and bq27200.sh) works ok, then it is system |
| 00:08.43 | iweron | the only way is to throw away my phone ) |
| 00:08.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~batterypatch |
| 00:08.48 | infobot | from memory, speedpatch is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1012405#post1012405 >>first i don't realy understand what does this patch do (that is why it is called miracle patch)<< [/quote original-author-of-speedpatch] |
| 00:08.50 | Estel_ | hehe, next step, we will start to feed each other like birds |
| 00:09.11 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, but he said he havent used it |
| 00:09.16 | Estel_ | just tried once if it help |
| 00:09.24 | Estel_ | but not after all reflashes |
| 00:09.43 | Estel_ | idk wtf is with his system that it reboots when trying to search for wifi's, even after reflash |
| 00:09.50 | Estel_ | syslog output needed, maybe? |
| 00:10.05 | Estel_ | what is so broken in hardware, that device reboots when trying to use wifi |
| 00:10.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | reflash done wrong |
| 00:10.21 | iweron | device doesn't reboot itselt |
| 00:10.27 | Estel_ | he bought this device as one with wifi broken, and it persist after reflash'es |
| 00:10.30 | Estel_ | you said it does? |
| 00:10.58 | Estel_ | sorry |
| 00:11.00 | Estel_ | <iweron> when I got a phone it was already damaged. Symptomes are: when I open connections menu my system crashed (seems to be kernel panic and the only way is reboot device removing the battery) |
| 00:11.04 | iweron | it just starts to behave strangely |
| 00:11.08 | Estel_ | define "systen crashes" |
| 00:11.08 | iweron | for example |
| 00:11.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: do a *full* reflash |
| 00:11.15 | Estel_ | nods |
| 00:11.18 | Estel_ | including vanilla emmc |
| 00:11.24 | iweron | nothing works in terminal, I can not open any app in menu |
| 00:11.27 | iweron | etc |
| 00:11.39 | Estel_ | and don't install anything other than i2ctools, bq27200.sh and rootsh. Check power usage then |
| 00:11.41 | Estel_ | hey |
| 00:11.48 | iweron | I understand |
| 00:11.49 | Estel_ | he said he disable wifi just by unloading module |
| 00:11.57 | Estel_ | more things are required to disable wifi properly |
| 00:12.08 | Estel_ | maybe something repeatedly polls for absent module? |
| 00:12.14 | Estel_ | wlancond? |
| 00:12.35 | Estel_ | before you reflash, install advanced interface switcher |
| 00:12.43 | Estel_ | reboot, and use it to disable wifi |
| 00:12.49 | Estel_ | then compare idle device power usage |
| 00:13.12 | Estel_ | if nothing looks better, reflash and do as adviced with installing only 3 things. And by reflash, I mean vanilla emmc too |
| 00:13.19 | iweron | I have a button to disable wifi |
| 00:13.37 | iweron | in system tray or how is it called |
| 00:13.39 | Estel_ | if that doesn't help, hardware of wlan is borked and i bet it have smth to do with power usage |
| 00:14.18 | iweron | Global version? |
| 00:14.37 | kerio | http://maemo.jacekowski.org/binary/firmware/ |
| 00:15.07 | iweron | If it wouldn't help I will remove wifi chip :D |
| 00:17.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | which might make it worse, unless you terminate the dangling connections with proper resistors to correct voltage level |
| 00:18.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | digital electronics hate dangling lines |
| 00:18.14 | *** join/#maemo hardaker (~hardaker@mail.hardakers.net) |
| 00:18.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | particularly cmos |
| 00:20.23 | Estel_ | iweron, yea, global |
| 00:20.38 | iweron | I donwloaded it from here http://maemo.jacekowski.org/binary/firmware/ |
| 00:25.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pr1.3 |
| 00:25.34 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, pr1.3 is the latest (and probably last) software update for Fremantle, available since Monday October 25 2010. More information at http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.3 -- see ~flashing for how to update |
| 00:25.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~combined |
| 00:26.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~combined is the rootfs fiasco image of maemo. For N900 latest (PR1.3.1) see http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/fiasco+co/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin or http://nds2.fds-fire.nokia.com/fdp/interface/FiRe/2011/9/--FID--A0A22MVWFVFAM/--LID--FiRe1317015685654/RX-51_2009SE_21.2011.38-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin |
| 00:26.57 | infobot | okay, DocScrutinizer05 |
| 00:27.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pr1.3.1 is <reply>see combined |
| 00:27.26 | infobot | DocScrutinizer05: okay |
| 00:27.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pr131 is <reply>see combined |
| 00:27.39 | infobot | okay, DocScrutinizer05 |
| 00:31.21 | iweron | Reflashed |
| 00:31.42 | Sysaxed | oh that was quick |
| 00:33.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe too quick |
| 00:33.39 | *** join/#maemo unclouded (~neil@2001:4428:200:80fc:c89b:f093:fc88:9141) |
| 00:33.48 | iweron | its ok |
| 00:33.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | both flashing COMBINED and flashing VANILLA shall take at least 30s |
| 00:34.34 | iweron | hm, I have to install debs but |
| 00:34.46 | iweron | if I open file manager the system will crash |
| 00:34.48 | iweron | lol |
| 00:34.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | you have to install what? |
| 00:35.04 | iweron | rootsh |
| 00:35.14 | iweron | i2ctools |
| 00:35.33 | iweron | okay, I will unload wifi then install them and reboot |
| 00:35.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | system crash on opening FM is an indication that something is terribly wrong |
| 00:35.53 | iweron | wifi is wrong |
| 00:36.07 | iweron | actually I don't know if it will crash |
| 00:36.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | no use in proceeding with *anything* before that issue got sorted |
| 00:36.09 | iweron | I will try |
| 00:36.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | huh? |
| 00:36.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-10 01:34:46] <iweron> if I open file manager the system will crash |
| 00:37.19 | Sysaxed | well, if he turns his wifi off it'll be ok |
| 00:37.26 | iweron | okay |
| 00:37.34 | iweron | opened FM |
| 00:37.36 | iweron | no crash |
| 00:37.39 | Sysaxed | woot |
| 00:37.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm rather sure iweron did some severe mess on his system, like installing thumbified pkgs to a non-thumb kernel |
| 00:38.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | in the past |
| 00:38.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | which would explain everything |
| 00:38.29 | *** part/#maemo Aoyagi (~opera@222.18.broadband15.iol.cz) |
| 00:38.29 | *** join/#maemo e-yes (~e-yes@94.45.179.115) |
| 00:39.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | how about testing WLAN now after proper reflash? |
| 00:40.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | odds are the former owner messed up firmware/system and that resulted in WLAN not working anymore |
| 00:41.12 | Estel_ | he mean that if he open HAM, ham will want to use wifi |
| 00:41.18 | Estel_ | and system will crash due to wifi |
| 00:41.25 | Estel_ | anyway +1 on testing wifi |
| 00:41.29 | Estel_ | before anything else |
| 00:41.34 | Estel_ | then, those 3 packages |
| 00:41.34 | Sysaxed | how can you break your wifi using software? :O |
| 00:41.39 | Estel_ | but order shouldn't matter |
| 00:41.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | I've seen so many N900 sold as "defect" and when you ask if the system got reflashed then answer is "what's flashing?" |
| 00:41.49 | Estel_ | i2ctools dont break thing (on its own) |
| 00:42.00 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, I dount it's the case here |
| 00:42.06 | Estel_ | we will know in a minute or so :) |
| 00:42.16 | Estel_ | s/dount/doubt/ |
| 00:42.57 | Estel_ | unless he fckd all former reflashes, this one won't change a thing... Of course I hope for it to be otherwise |
| 00:42.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sysaxed: that's pretty easy: install some leete WLAN drivers for example |
| 00:43.12 | Estel_ | he meant hardware breaking. |
| 00:43.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | or a bitched wlan-firmware.bin |
| 00:43.24 | Estel_ | aware of anything like that in existence? |
| 00:43.26 | iweron | Erm.. /bin/sh: /home/user/MyDocs/bq27200.sh: Permission denied |
| 00:43.30 | Estel_ | would be intresting to know |
| 00:43.33 | iweron | it is under root |
| 00:43.35 | Estel_ | iwrron, rootsh |
| 00:43.40 | iweron | installed |
| 00:43.47 | iweron | should I reboot? |
| 00:43.50 | Estel_ | no. |
| 00:43.55 | Estel_ | take it out from mydoc |
| 00:43.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | chmod +x `path-to-bq27200.sh` |
| 00:43.59 | Estel_ | mydocs |
| 00:44.00 | Estel_ | wont help |
| 00:44.04 | Estel_ | mydocs is noexec |
| 00:44.05 | iweron | [02:43] <DocScrutinizer05> chmod +x `path-to-bq27200.sh` |
| 00:44.07 | iweron | already done |
| 00:44.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, MyDocs |
| 00:44.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | is VFAT, no +x there |
| 00:44.35 | Estel_ | mv /home/user/MyDocs/bq27200.sh /root/bq27200.sh |
| 00:44.35 | iweron | but I executed it from MyCods before |
| 00:44.39 | Estel_ | for example |
| 00:44.49 | *** join/#maemo Aoyagi (~opera@222.18.broadband15.iol.cz) |
| 00:44.49 | Estel_ | it mean some shit messed with your system before |
| 00:44.57 | Estel_ | mydocs $HOULD be noexec |
| 00:45.22 | Estel_ | and don't change it unless you know why you may want to change it |
| 00:45.34 | iweron | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:45.51 | Estel_ | sh /root/bq27200.sh |
| 00:45.58 | Estel_ | are you sure you're root? |
| 00:46.06 | Estel_ | $: whoami |
| 00:46.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | even `mv /home/user/MyDocs/bq27200.sh \usr\local\sbin\` |
| 00:46.12 | iweron | yeah |
| 00:46.15 | iweron | it worked |
| 00:46.21 | iweron | with sh |
| 00:46.28 | Estel_ | wtf? |
| 00:46.42 | Estel_ | ah |
| 00:46.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | \_o_/ |
| 00:46.50 | Estel_ | chmod +x /root/bq27200.sh |
| 00:46.53 | *** join/#maemo amospalla (~amospalla@amospalla.es) |
| 00:46.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | err |
| 00:46.57 | Estel_ | as first chmod didnt worked |
| 00:47.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | s.\./. |
| 00:47.01 | Estel_ | due to being in vfat |
| 00:47.20 | iweron | At first I made chmod +x in MyDocs and it didn't work ) |
| 00:47.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | even `mv /home/user/MyDocs/bq27200.sh /usr/local/sbin/` |
| 00:47.23 | Estel_ | you can also move it to /usr/sbin as DocScrutinizer05 said, /root/ was just example |
| 00:47.36 | iweron | okay |
| 00:47.36 | Sysaxed | haha, chmod +x on fat? :D |
| 00:47.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | local |
| 00:47.42 | Estel_ | then you will be able to execute it as just bq27200.sh without path |
| 00:47.56 | iweron | kk |
| 00:47.59 | iweron | next time |
| 00:48.04 | iweron | now testing |
| 00:48.09 | Estel_ | ok |
| 00:48.19 | Estel_ | be sure to let it run for a 2 minutes or so with |
| 00:48.24 | Estel_ | bq27200.sh 30 |
| 00:48.27 | Estel_ | even longer |
| 00:48.38 | iweron | it is already 2 mins running |
| 00:49.03 | Estel_ | with screen of, nothing happening there, and GSM turned on? |
| 00:50.00 | iweron | gsm on |
| 00:50.06 | iweron | screen off |
| 00:50.15 | iweron | I didn't change anything |
| 00:50.22 | iweron | just installed rootsh and ic2 |
| 00:50.25 | iweron | i2c* |
| 00:50.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd make sure trackerd and similar shit doesn't hog system |
| 00:51.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: run `w` |
| 00:51.47 | iweron | wtf |
| 00:51.54 | iweron | Segmentation failed |
| 00:52.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | it shall output 2 lines, first line with sth like >> 01:51:10 up 59 days, 1:38, 0 users, load average: 0,16, 0,04, 0,01", watch the last 3 numbers, they shall be close to zero |
| 00:54.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | segfault? in which process? |
| 00:56.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | wonders what's taking that long. visions of iweron doing weird things come to mind |
| 00:58.52 | *** join/#maemo em (~em@unaffiliated/emma) |
| 00:59.28 | iweron | shit |
| 01:01.23 | iweron | just trying to bring the output here... |
| 01:01.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | If I were interested in starting the "trolls vs experts" game for another match, I'd remark that it's not really uncommon for OC idiots to seel their N900 with whatever random "$rnd defect" tag on ebay, when they realize they cooked the SoC. The new owner can have weeks and months of fun with trying to find out about root cause of a plethora of weird arcane system failures |
| 01:01.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/seel/sell/. |
| 01:02.36 | Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05, there should probably be a stress test program to see whether or not the SoC still comes up with non-potato results. |
| 01:02.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 01:04.23 | iweron | finally |
| 01:04.24 | iweron | http://pastebin.com/JkggkReQ |
| 01:04.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | this looks like system busy |
| 01:05.06 | iweron | Stock system |
| 01:05.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | did you do the `w` thing I told you to do? |
| 01:05.10 | iweron | I didn't change anything |
| 01:05.13 | iweron | full reflash |
| 01:05.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's not uncommon when trackerd hogs CPU for ~10 min after boot |
| 01:06.16 | Estel_ | especially, that he just reflashed - tracker and friends may be busy |
| 01:06.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | also make sure nothing is plugged in to USB |
| 01:06.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 01:06.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | thus: `w` |
| 01:06.38 | iweron | nothing |
| 01:06.42 | iweron | w? |
| 01:06.45 | Estel_ | btw, what segfaulted and when |
| 01:06.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | w |
| 01:07.04 | iweron | oh, nvm |
| 01:07.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-10 01:54:17] <DocScrutinizer05> segfault? in which process? |
| 01:07.07 | iweron | about segfault |
| 01:07.14 | iweron | vi |
| 01:07.20 | iweron | I installed vim |
| 01:07.29 | iweron | instead of vi |
| 01:07.35 | Estel_ | I got a bad feelings about this (tm han solo shot first) |
| 01:07.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | o.O |
| 01:07.48 | iweron | it is okay |
| 01:07.54 | Estel_ | first of all, his device settled down to 96 mA usage, just like before reflash |
| 01:08.02 | Estel_ | not to mention that vi shouldnt segfault |
| 01:08.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | not to mention that vi comes with messybox |
| 01:08.22 | Estel_ | wifi is still borked? |
| 01:08.23 | iweron | segfault was when I trying to paste output |
| 01:08.32 | iweron | I just didn't find > :) |
| 01:08.38 | Estel_ | I see |
| 01:08.49 | Estel_ | ah, thats normal |
| 01:08.51 | Estel_ | anyway |
| 01:08.56 | Estel_ | wifi isn't alive? |
| 01:08.59 | iweron | Dunno about wifi, I could test |
| 01:09.02 | Estel_ | sure |
| 01:09.18 | Estel_ | although I know results, sadly :/ |
| 01:09.33 | iweron | Okay |
| 01:09.37 | iweron | kernel panik |
| 01:09.40 | iweron | c* |
| 01:09.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~90mA anyway was normal for WLAN scanning since not associated |
| 01:09.45 | Estel_ | it's not kernel panic, but yea |
| 01:09.52 | Estel_ | his wlan can't scan ;) |
| 01:10.03 | Estel_ | module was unloaded |
| 01:10.05 | Estel_ | anyway |
| 01:10.13 | Estel_ | borked hw :( |
| 01:10.18 | iweron | it can not scan and crashes system |
| 01:10.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: what makes you think there's been PANIC? |
| 01:10.46 | Estel_ | wrong use of words, it's not kernel panic. His system goes unstable, when trying to use wifi hardware |
| 01:10.50 | iweron | cause device willn't start even if I will turn it off |
| 01:10.57 | iweron | or it will turn off itselft |
| 01:11.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | what now? |
| 01:11.09 | iweron | untill I will remove battery |
| 01:11.16 | Estel_ | = same as before |
| 01:11.24 | iweron | yeah |
| 01:11.27 | iweron | :( |
| 01:11.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | meh, ok rhen do whatever you want. I don't bother anymore asking for details which never get delivered |
| 01:12.16 | Estel_ | ~96 mA idle usage without CPU getting awake, system going unstable due to power variations when trying to use wifi hardware via module... |
| 01:12.26 | Estel_ | you could install syslog and check what happens |
| 01:12.31 | Estel_ | when you try to use wifi |
| 01:12.34 | Estel_ | I would do that for sure... |
| 01:12.43 | Estel_ | but it won't change fact, that your hardware is borked :( |
| 01:12.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | just pretty please never ponder to open tickets on b.m.o with reports of that quality and etail |
| 01:13.16 | iweron | but since I do anything with wifi terminal and other apps stop working |
| 01:13.37 | Estel_ | screen freeze? |
| 01:13.53 | Estel_ | or rather "kinda" worka but nothing works in reality? |
| 01:14.05 | iweron | second variant |
| 01:14.05 | Estel_ | s/worka/works/ |
| 01:14.09 | Estel_ | nod |
| 01:14.30 | Estel_ | clear signs of crazy power fluctuation, when module tries to talk with wifi hardware |
| 01:14.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | is amazed about Estel_'s endurance to ask for proper descriptions of what's actually happening |
| 01:14.47 | iweron | :D |
| 01:14.50 | Estel_ | when you unload module, device is stable, but something in wifi hw still leak power |
| 01:15.02 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (~bef0rd@unaffiliated/beford) |
| 01:15.04 | iweron | Okay, I am not able to discribe anything correctly :) |
| 01:15.12 | Estel_ | i bet syslog would give us interesting output to analyze, but wouldn't help nevertheless :P |
| 01:15.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's a suspicion of yours |
| 01:15.35 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, everything is suspicious when i don't have device in hands, that right, but I know exact same case |
| 01:15.45 | Estel_ | although with bluetooth/FM |
| 01:15.53 | iweron | should I use soldering-iron? |
| 01:16.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | to do what? |
| 01:16.05 | Estel_ | exactly :P |
| 01:16.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | light a cig with it? yeah, do that! |
| 01:16.31 | iweron | To fuck up wifi chip |
| 01:16.44 | Estel_ | would be funny to know what would happen with wifi module unsoldered, if you can unsolder it properly, which is harder than you think |
| 01:16.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | why not fuck up CPU? |
| 01:16.57 | Estel_ | of couse DocScrutinizer05 is right about dangling connection |
| 01:17.03 | Estel_ | but can't be worse than it is :P |
| 01:17.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you say that |
| 01:17.21 | Estel_ | unless you screw some other part, which is quite expected |
| 01:17.27 | iweron | Just kiddin |
| 01:17.29 | iweron | anyway |
| 01:17.32 | Estel_ | I know. |
| 01:17.43 | Estel_ | if you want to be useful for science, install syslog |
| 01:17.46 | Estel_ | mess with wifi |
| 01:17.54 | Estel_ | and paste output of /var/log/syslog |
| 01:17.59 | Estel_ | after that |
| 01:18.07 | iweron | I have to do smth with power consumption or... |
| 01:18.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | *full* output |
| 01:18.13 | Estel_ | won't help your device, but may be interesting to rea |
| 01:18.17 | Estel_ | yea, full one |
| 01:18.20 | iweron | or I will buy a new phone =\ |
| 01:18.31 | Estel_ | sell it as "99% OK" on ebay ;) |
| 01:18.44 | Estel_ | then buy another N900 |
| 01:18.57 | Estel_ | can be evil, as he never buys N900's on ebay |
| 01:19.14 | iweron | This device was bought on ebay :) |
| 01:19.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, and I commented on that a few minutes ago |
| 01:19.41 | Estel_ | considering ammount of people that go to sell devices after getting ensured about hardware error here or on TMO, ebay should hate us |
| 01:19.44 | iweron | :) |
| 01:20.03 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, except for your usual bashing about overclocking, which is hardly related to this case :P |
| 01:20.04 | iweron | So, the only probles is how to save the output of syslog |
| 01:20.08 | iweron | problem* |
| 01:20.10 | Estel_ | it saves itself |
| 01:20.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | ebay loves everybody who does business with them |
| 01:20.17 | Estel_ | to /var/log/syslog |
| 01:20.20 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, true |
| 01:20.25 | Estel_ | so ebay should love us :P |
| 01:20.45 | Estel_ | btw have you seen semi-fix for gsm modem problems? |
| 01:20.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: it *is* already saved |
| 01:20.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | in /var/log/syslog |
| 01:21.01 | Estel_ | it will be if you install syslog |
| 01:21.03 | Estel_ | :P |
| 01:21.05 | Estel_ | syslogd |
| 01:21.11 | Estel_ | then reboot device |
| 01:21.14 | Estel_ | then mess with wifi |
| 01:21.26 | Estel_ | then reboot again and paste full content of /var/log/syslog |
| 01:21.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | ksyslogd |
| 01:21.32 | Estel_ | which is a text log file |
| 01:21.37 | Estel_ | ? |
| 01:22.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are 2 or three *syslog* pkgs |
| 01:22.27 | iweron | sysklogd ? |
| 01:22.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 01:22.40 | Estel_ | shit |
| 01:22.48 | Estel_ | what are differencies? |
| 01:23.00 | Estel_ | freemangordon once suggested me to install syslogd |
| 01:23.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | one is for userland, other is for kernel logs |
| 01:23.06 | Estel_ | no idea about other ones :/ |
| 01:23.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | afaik |
| 01:23.23 | Estel_ | ksyslogd is for userland? |
| 01:23.35 | Estel_ | as syslogd clearly gives me kernel logs |
| 01:23.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway one depends on the other, and it doesn't hurt to install all of them |
| 01:25.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | klogd - Kernel Logging Daemon |
| 01:25.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | sysklogd - System Logging Daemon |
| 01:27.56 | iweron | omg |
| 01:27.57 | iweron | wtf |
| 01:28.02 | iweron | trying to install sysklogd |
| 01:28.11 | iweron | it writes that I should install klogd |
| 01:28.18 | iweron | trying to install klogd |
| 01:28.27 | iweron | it writes that I should install sysklogd first |
| 01:28.31 | iweron | O_O |
| 01:28.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | > >The klogd daemon listens to kernel message sources and is responsible for prioritizing and processing operating system messages. The klogd daemon can run as a client of syslogd or optionally as a standalone program << |
| 01:29.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | apt-get install sysklogd |
| 01:30.27 | iweron | can not |
| 01:30.30 | iweron | I have no internet |
| 01:30.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5/syslog |
| 01:31.18 | Estel_ | iweron, insert sim or get usb networking |
| 01:31.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 01:31.54 | iweron | second variant seems good to me |
| 01:32.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~usbnetworking |
| 01:32.07 | infobot | i guess usbnetworking is http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_networking |
| 01:32.56 | *** join/#maemo stardiviner (~stardivin@218.74.179.122) |
| 01:33.15 | Estel_ | most user-friendly way is to install qtmobilehotspot package, it also allow usb networking without madde etc |
| 01:34.30 | Estel_ | of course instruction on wiki is good too, just require shitload of time to setup |
| 01:34.39 | Estel_ | for the first time, at least |
| 01:34.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | installing any pkg seems a pain without internet |
| 01:35.00 | Estel_ | btw funny that qtmobilehotspot may help your device with broken wifi |
| 01:35.02 | Estel_ | fact |
| 01:35.06 | Estel_ | dependency hell |
| 01:35.36 | Estel_ | sim->3G or gprs -> qtmobilehotspot -> usb networking |
| 01:35.42 | Estel_ | would be my path of choice |
| 01:35.50 | Estel_ | for fastest way of reaching internet |
| 01:36.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | so installing qtmobilehotspot seems even more of a cumbersome effort that installing syslog |
| 01:36.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/that/than/. |
| 01:36.37 | Estel_ | sure :P but he may want to install something else 10 seconds after disabling usb networking :P |
| 01:36.44 | Estel_ | think about it as time investment :P |
| 01:37.17 | Estel_ | any method will be ok as long as he get it, anyway |
| 01:37.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | GPRS sounds like a reasonable bootstrap plan |
| 01:39.44 | Estel_ | I wonder about efficiency of wireless usb |
| 01:40.08 | Estel_ | and n900 hostmode |
| 01:40.29 | Estel_ | 200 mA should be enough... could mod dongle to allow charging to, of course via real cable |
| 01:40.56 | Estel_ | connecting something to N900 for hostmode via xxx meters of cables is quite troublesome on my desk |
| 01:41.20 | iweron | it seems that I have to unload wifi modules before using qt hotspot app |
| 01:41.25 | Estel_ | cables keep acting like springs and throwin out of balance my other stuff on desk :P |
| 01:41.26 | iweron | cause it crashed my phone |
| 01:41.51 | Estel_ | you should unload wifi module as first thing after booting, anyway, and set qtmobilehotspot to usb mode |
| 01:42.10 | iweron | should I configure anything on my comp? |
| 01:42.11 | Estel_ | if it crashes it in usb only mode, it would be interesting |
| 01:42.20 | Estel_ | operating system on desktop is? |
| 01:42.39 | iweron | Debian |
| 01:42.42 | iweron | Crunchbang |
| 01:42.50 | Estel_ | just your usual way to share connection |
| 01:42.57 | Estel_ | drivers are already there |
| 01:43.49 | iweron | omg |
| 01:43.54 | iweron | I should run powerkernel |
| 01:44.09 | iweron | to use qt hotspot |
| 01:46.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~usbnetworking |
| 01:46.09 | infobot | from memory, usbnetworking is http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_networking |
| 01:46.52 | Estel_ | yes |
| 01:46.54 | Estel_ | :D |
| 01:47.11 | Estel_ | or... install kp52, it is only 3 or 4 packages :P |
| 01:47.24 | Estel_ | I admit doing it manually would be faster, after all |
| 01:47.34 | kerio | omap1 has usb networking, doesn't it |
| 01:47.49 | Estel_ | (though, using sim and gprs to install qtmobilehotspot and dependencies, would be faster even more :P) |
| 01:48.04 | Estel_ | yea, it's probably aboout wifi sharing |
| 01:49.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually this page in wiki is not applicable |
| 01:50.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | it doesn't cover the PC-master&N900-client case |
| 01:51.55 | Estel_ | lol |
| 01:52.19 | Estel_ | hm, does it matter which one is master? it just matter to pc being one sharing network, should be doable as slave? |
| 01:52.23 | Estel_ | or not? |
| 01:52.52 | kerio | well for instance HAM will outright refuse to use the usb connection |
| 01:52.58 | kerio | unless you have a dummy connection enabled |
| 01:53.07 | Estel_ | I seem to recall connecting N900 via qtmobilehotspot (N900 master) and serving net from pc |
| 01:53.31 | Estel_ | ham can go and f itself |
| 01:53.49 | kerio | unless you redpill and enable "assume net connection" |
| 01:53.52 | Estel_ | hate how this program is written |
| 01:54.01 | kerio | it's not HAM, it's maemo applications |
| 01:54.03 | Estel_ | funny, I've never redpilled ham |
| 01:54.09 | Estel_ | why, browser works :P |
| 01:54.12 | kerio | nope |
| 01:54.18 | Estel_ | i never used dummy |
| 01:54.22 | Estel_ | yet it worksforme? |
| 01:54.48 | kerio | hm |
| 01:54.56 | kerio | doesn't it complain, at least? |
| 01:55.01 | Estel_ | or i actually did something to make it gtfo without using dummy, but replicating what it does? can't remember now |
| 01:55.12 | Estel_ | maybe youmre right, I vaguely remember something |
| 01:55.37 | Estel_ | it must have been just small irritating thing, as I don't remember it well... |
| 01:55.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/maemo-pc-connectivity/0.5/ |
| 01:55.53 | Estel_ | wtf is that? |
| 01:56.14 | kerio | ew |
| 01:56.23 | kerio | from the name, it sounds like some diablo BS |
| 01:56.38 | Estel_ | Convenience metapackage which installs extra Control Panel applets, openssh, sshfs and sbrshd in tablet. |
| 01:56.42 | Estel_ | wtf, doc? |
| 01:56.44 | kerio | called it! |
| 01:57.05 | Estel_ | fremantle from the name looks like diablo to you? :P |
| 01:57.20 | Estel_ | fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel |
| 01:57.30 | Estel_ | Meant to be used with ESbox Eclipse plugin. |
| 01:57.32 | iweron | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:57.35 | iweron | I don't have this |
| 01:57.37 | iweron | wtf? |
| 01:57.38 | Estel_ | whatever t f it is |
| 01:57.49 | Estel_ | install kernel-power :P |
| 01:58.01 | iweron | :D |
| 01:58.05 | Estel_ | it seems that wiki page assume kp anyway |
| 01:58.13 | iweron | ~kernel-power |
| 01:58.17 | Estel_ | install it from manual link |
| 01:58.19 | iweron | :( |
| 01:58.23 | Estel_ | in kp51 thread |
| 01:58.34 | Estel_ | kp51 thread have kp52 links in first post |
| 01:58.38 | Estel_ | I know, logical ;) |
| 01:58.48 | kerio | Estel_: it's a package that comes from diablo |
| 01:58.57 | Estel_ | kerio, right |
| 01:59.07 | Estel_ | I don't get how it could help in usb networking, though |
| 01:59.09 | iweron | unstable? |
| 01:59.15 | Estel_ | btw dummy network comes from diablo too |
| 01:59.23 | Estel_ | iweron, kp52 is perfectly stable |
| 01:59.25 | kerio | that's why i use libicd-network-null |
| 01:59.33 | kerio | and that diablo crap never works |
| 01:59.37 | Estel_ | kerio, what it is and how to eat it? |
| 01:59.41 | kerio | same as maemo-pan and whatevs |
| 01:59.50 | kerio | Estel_: it's better than libicd-network-dummy |
| 01:59.58 | kerio | because it's the exact same thing |
| 02:00.05 | Estel_ | ok, how it knows which real network I'm using? |
| 02:00.15 | Estel_ | when I connect to dummy to make maemo happy? |
| 02:00.30 | Estel_ | it redirect properly no matter is is use usb, or bluetooth, or whatever? |
| 02:00.37 | Estel_ | or usb->ethernet adapter? |
| 02:00.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: it doesn't matter for usb-ethernet which is master and which is slave. However on N900 you need to set up proper route etc, and on PC side you need to share your internet |
| 02:00.50 | Estel_ | nods |
| 02:00.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | the wiki page instructs to do exactly opposite way |
| 02:01.01 | Estel_ | qtmobilehotspot set route automagically |
| 02:01.06 | Estel_ | that is why i recommended it |
| 02:01.10 | Estel_ | I see |
| 02:01.47 | Estel_ | it's miracle that no one ever released automagic package for us networking, and atmobilehotspot, with usb as just addition, stepped as gui slution for thaty |
| 02:02.38 | Estel_ | ... which reminds me that I still have to get my dongle working, as Pali refused to include its module in KP, even despite it works nicely after getting compiled against kp headers :( |
| 02:02.55 | iweron | hm |
| 02:02.58 | iweron | I found only http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/kernel-power-flasher/2.6.28-10power51r1/ |
| 02:03.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's idiotic. And even wiki had a page that described the case PC="NIC"&N900="PC" - I can't find it anymore |
| 02:03.19 | Estel_ | said smth about having it compiled as external module is one thing, and including it the way autobuilder likes it in KP is other, so he doesn't have time for the latter |
| 02:03.26 | *** join/#maemo is_null (~jpic@pdpc/supporter/professional/is-null) |
| 02:03.39 | Estel_ | iweron, wait a second |
| 02:04.16 | Estel_ | here |
| 02:04.17 | Estel_ | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85665&highlight=kernel-power |
| 02:04.22 | Estel_ | first post |
| 02:04.25 | Estel_ | links there |
| 02:04.25 | is_null | hi all, is it possible to have gmail contacts sync like in android on n900 ? else, are there python hooks for the contact system which i could take advantage of ? |
| 02:04.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~kp |
| 02:04.25 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, kp is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85665 |
| 02:04.32 | Estel_ | you dont need kernel-power-bootimg |
| 02:04.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | you shouldn't install KP just to get USB-networking |
| 02:05.04 | Estel_ | is_null, whatever you mean by "like android" ? |
| 02:05.10 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, no module g_ether |
| 02:05.12 | Estel_ | on omap |
| 02:05.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's absolutely contraproductive to investigate about syslog and power usage |
| 02:05.53 | Estel_ | well, we know that kp doesn't result in making his problems worse, so it is, at worst, not productive |
| 02:05.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | g_nokia afaik |
| 02:05.59 | Estel_ | but not counter productive |
| 02:06.02 | Estel_ | hm |
| 02:06.15 | is_null | Estel_: in my contacts list: i can see all gmail contacts. When i add a contact on the phone -> it is added in gmail. When I add a contact on gmail -> it is added on the phone. And so on |
| 02:06.17 | Estel_ | would be ok, but I can't find wiki page for using g_nokia either |
| 02:06.38 | Estel_ | is_null, it is already included |
| 02:06.54 | Estel_ | when i add contact using modest (mail client), it is stored in contacts |
| 02:06.56 | is_null | Estel_: i just tried without SSU and it didn't work |
| 02:07.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | KP makes things worse, since it for example doesn't reset musb_hdrc to idle after messing with hostmode. Which results in ~80mA wasted power |
| 02:07.08 | Estel_ | when i write mail, i can choose one of contacts as recipent |
| 02:07.15 | is_null | oh, so you're not using the exchange gmail server ? |
| 02:07.19 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, not true? |
| 02:07.21 | is_null | but can you call a gmail contact ? |
| 02:07.22 | Estel_ | since ages? |
| 02:07.24 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: are you sure? |
| 02:07.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 02:07.32 | kerio | where's your bug report? |
| 02:07.37 | kerio | >:P |
| 02:07.38 | Estel_ | why not filled bug. |
| 02:07.40 | Estel_ | ? |
| 02:07.41 | Estel_ | lol |
| 02:07.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | pfff it's commonly known |
| 02:07.50 | Estel_ | bullshit, I use hostmode daily |
| 02:08.05 | Estel_ | my usage after disconnecting is 3-4 mA offline mode |
| 02:08.16 | Estel_ | at least using |
| 02:08.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | fine, then it got fixed |
| 02:08.18 | Estel_ | ~usbmode |
| 02:08.19 | infobot | it has been said that usbmode is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85658 |
| 02:08.25 | Estel_ | but you know what? |
| 02:08.29 | Estel_ | it have been fixed since... |
| 02:08.32 | Estel_ | since... |
| 02:08.36 | Estel_ | kp47? |
| 02:08.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | definitely not |
| 02:08.52 | Estel_ | mhm |
| 02:09.49 | Estel_ | not to mention that in his case he isn't messing with hostmode :P |
| 02:09.52 | Estel_ | anyway |
| 02:10.00 | Estel_ | freemangordon, ^ |
| 02:10.03 | Estel_ | just to ensure |
| 02:10.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | a known workaround been to plug device to a usb host and then unplug again, since that puts usb to idle correctly |
| 02:10.16 | Estel_ | <DocScrutinizer05> KP makes things worse, since it for example doesn't reset musb_hdrc to idle after messing with hostmode. Which results in ~80mA wasted power |
| 02:10.23 | Estel_ | could you confirm that it wasw fixed? |
| 02:10.31 | Estel_ | or connect charger |
| 02:10.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 02:10.43 | Estel_ | but it is ancient bug, which was fixed ages ago IIRC |
| 02:10.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | I can't confirm anything in that regard |
| 02:10.58 | iweron | Can not install it with dpkg -i kernel-power-flasher_2.6.28-10power51r1_armel.deb |
| 02:11.00 | *** join/#maemo kolp_ (~quassel@212.255.22.206) |
| 02:11.09 | Estel_ | because it is kp52 |
| 02:11.21 | Estel_ | ~kp |
| 02:11.21 | infobot | well, kp is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85665 |
| 02:11.24 | Estel_ | first post |
| 02:11.31 | Estel_ | links there to kp52 |
| 02:11.57 | iweron | oh ok |
| 02:16.22 | iweron | kk |
| 02:16.26 | iweron | seems to be installed |
| 02:17.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | is *.m.o going FUBAR again? Stuff seems slow like geotectonics |
| 02:18.11 | Estel_ | talk.maemo.org doesn't count, yes? |
| 02:18.58 | Estel_ | can't confirm, package interface and wiki is blazing fast here |
| 02:20.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have a hard time believing into http://wiki.maemo.org/index.php?title=USB_networking&action=history |
| 02:20.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | no edits since 2010??? |
| 02:25.11 | *** join/#maemo iweron (5434118b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.84.52.17.139) |
| 02:25.17 | iweron | hm |
| 02:25.26 | iweron | hotspot deleted my pppoe connection |
| 02:25.42 | iweron | so I had to reboot |
| 02:28.50 | iweron | =\ |
| 02:32.56 | *** join/#maemo zogg__ (~zoggrules@bzq-79-181-174-101.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 02:34.59 | iweron | anyway thx everybody for your support :3 |
| 02:40.35 | *** join/#maemo shamus (~shmaus@ip-206-192-195-49.marylandheights.ip.cablemo.net) |
| 02:55.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | FINALLY!! http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking |
| 02:55.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~usbnetworking |
| 02:55.29 | infobot | methinks usbnetworking is http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_networking |
| 02:55.39 | *** part/#maemo Aoyagi (~opera@222.18.broadband15.iol.cz) |
| 02:55.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~listvalues N900_USB_networking |
| 02:55.50 | is_null | ok, it seems that calling gmail contacts is fully supported in the latest ssu (i've read that for some people it stopped working after a while) |
| 02:56.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~literal usbnetworking |
| 02:56.07 | infobot | "usbnetworking" is "http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_networking" |
| 02:56.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~usbnetworking is also http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking |
| 02:56.27 | infobot | DocScrutinizer05: okay |
| 02:57.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | dang, like 1+h for spotting this friggin wiki page |
| 03:00.37 | *** join/#maemo maybeArgh (~cl@p5B1661B7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:00.56 | *** join/#maemo dos11 (~dos@unaffiliated/dos1) |
| 03:08.16 | *** join/#maemo mvp_ (~mvp@fl-207-30-52-254.dyn.embarqhsd.net) |
| 03:19.52 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, |
| 03:20.08 | Estel_ | N900_USB_Networking was linked from USB_Networking |
| 03:20.10 | Estel_ | :P |
| 03:20.30 | Estel_ | ~usbnetworking |
| 03:20.30 | infobot | rumour has it, usbnetworking is http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_networking, or http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking |
| 03:21.04 | Estel_ | first thing after table of content in USB_Networking |
| 03:21.11 | *** join/#maemo uen| (~uen@p5DCB2676.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:21.14 | Estel_ | USB networking for N900 |
| 03:21.36 | Estel_ | Please visit N900 USB networking. |
| 03:21.47 | *** join/#maemo at1as (~at1as@kurios.r4780y.com) |
| 03:21.50 | Estel_ | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking |
| 03:21.51 | Estel_ | :P |
| 03:22.58 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, while we are at it |
| 03:23.35 | Estel_ | what was that command to tell someone something when he log in to channel, and how to do it the way it will tell him only on one channel, not everywhere, where that person joins, and infobot is present? |
| 03:23.46 | Estel_ | I mean some sentence, no about factoid like in ~tell |
| 03:24.44 | *** join/#maemo darkschneider (~gab@93-32-63-175.ip32.fastwebnet.it) |
| 03:24.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | there is no such command |
| 03:25.58 | iweron | So okay |
| 03:26.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | there been but it got locked for normal users since they were too dull to use it |
| 03:26.08 | iweron | I will make smth with syslog |
| 03:26.24 | iweron | next time, when I get an internet connection somehow |
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| 03:29.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | iweron: see http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking |
| 03:30.40 | iweron | thx |
| 03:31.28 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, statistics for packages doesnt work |
| 03:31.32 | Estel_ | it is known thing? |
| 03:32.14 | Estel_ | why the hell device reboots after ~30 seconds, if one modprobe -r both bq27x00_battery and rx51_battery? spank Pali |
| 03:32.43 | Estel_ | looks like watchdog, but why only, if both things reporting voltage to hald-addon-bme are disabled... |
| 03:32.54 | Estel_ | and why the hell does it reboot at all? *confused* |
| 03:33.12 | Estel_ | kerio, are you here? |
| 03:33.42 | Estel_ | why your fork of applet show 0/0 when battery is not calibrated, instead of just splitting whatever bq27 chip says, even if it's wrong? |
| 03:33.54 | Estel_ | bug, or done in purpose? |
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| 03:42.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: not really known yet |
| 03:43.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you like you should feel encouraged to send another ticket mail to nemein support. Last one been absolutely nice |
| 03:43.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | CC techstaff@m.o |
| 03:47.13 | kerio | Estel_: because hald-addon-bme doesn't present that data |
| 03:48.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | lol, bme is such a random generator: battery.reporting.last_full = 612 (0x264) (int) |
| 03:48.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | bq27k-detail: |
| 03:49.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | 0x13 - 0x12: 6958 LMD Last Measured Discharge High - Low Byte 3.57 µVh (1) R |
| 03:49.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:52.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually even: |
| 03:52.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:52.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:52.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | whike statusbar applet clearly shows (correct) battery full state |
| 03:52.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | while* |
| 03:53.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | since device is on charger |
| 03:53.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
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| 04:33.14 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, lol @ bme |
| 04:34.42 | Estel_ | btw, I'll gladly send another ticket, but is it just to propagate episolography, or have chance of actually having any impact? |
| 04:34.58 | Estel_ | it seems like support@nemein.com got bind to /dev/null |
| 04:35.14 | Estel_ | kerio, damn hald-addon-bme |
| 04:35.31 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, kerio, now something really BIG as a WTF thing |
| 04:35.34 | Estel_ | *fanfares* |
| 04:35.53 | Estel_ | My 2nd N900 is charging @ 700 mA from my 1st n900 (via hostmode) |
| 04:36.02 | Estel_ | WHAT THE FUCK?! I ask... |
| 04:36.29 | robbiethe1st | I don't think that's possible... |
| 04:36.52 | Estel_ | 2nd N900 is in backupmenu which charges via kernel-power module (modified it) |
| 04:37.14 | Estel_ | so it think it is connected tp wall charger and try to suck as much power as possible |
| 04:37.26 | Estel_ | now, first N900 was discharging at 1200 mA |
| 04:37.50 | Estel_ | after connecting charger via y-cable, power draw drop to only 500 mA |
| 04:38.04 | Estel_ | after enabling charging, it is ~0 |
| 04:38.21 | Estel_ | I was so sellshocked, that I actually went for claw multimeter at this hour |
| 04:38.55 | Estel_ | it indicated 700 mA flowing through cable between N900's without charger connected, which is in line with what first N900 reported |
| 04:39.11 | Estel_ | now, how it compares to 200 mA hardware limitation? |
| 04:39.37 | Estel_ | btw, everything is working fine on both N900's, copying data from partition on 1st one to 2nd one |
| 04:39.49 | Estel_ | even using xchat for write it now on 1st one |
| 04:40.36 | Estel_ | (checked that data transfer wasn't terminated, so usb connection seems to be happy despite device sending 700 mA power via usb) |
| 04:40.52 | Estel_ | robbiethe1st, thats why I'm surprised ;) |
| 04:41.33 | Estel_ | could Pali accidentally go-around limitation that was meant to be hardware one? is it the same for every N900 with kp52 and usbmode? |
| 04:41.55 | Estel_ | or my device miracolously overcome that limitation and went into another level of being one with the force? |
| 04:41.58 | Estel_ | ;) |
| 04:43.03 | Estel_ | will try same trick in reversed order, with 2nd device giving power, tomorrow, when transfer is complete |
| 04:43.21 | Estel_ | still, it was like big WTF |
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| 05:03.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | bq24150 is supposed to throw error at overcurrent which is 200mA iirc. It *might* continue to deliver power directly from battery without boosting up to 5V nevertheless |
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| 05:13.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | Cycle by cycle current limit for I(BLIMIT) V(BUS_B) = 5.05 V, 2.5 V < V(AUXPWR) < 4.5 Vboost: 1 A |
| 05:16.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | means: bq24150 can drive up to 1A through the boost choke while energizing the choke. Obviously as soon as the switch to GND opens and the diode/switch from choke to Vbus opens, same 1A max will flow from Bat+ through choke and diode/switch to Vbus. Usually this current declines rapidly since Vbus=5.05V while Vbat<=4.2V |
| 05:16.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | if however Vbus < Vbat, this 1A *might* flow continuously |
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| 05:17.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | HTH |
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| 05:40.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | however: |
| 05:41.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>The bq24150/1 provides a built-in overload protection to prevent the device and battery from damage whe nVBUS is over loaded. Once over load condition is detected, Q1 operates in linear mode to limit the output curren twhile VPMID keeps in voltage regulation. If the overload condition lasts for more than 30 ms, the overload fault i sdetected. When an overload condition is detected, the bq24150/1 turns off the PWM converter, rese tOPA_ |
| 05:41.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | MODE bit to 0, sets fault status bits, and sends out fault pulse in STAT pin. The boost will not start until th ehost clears the fault register.<< |
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| 05:43.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | this would mean that something in source N900 needs to restart boostmode (via i2c-command) every 30ms |
| 05:45.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | IOW bq24150 in boostmode *can* deliver up to 1A or even more to Vbus, when Vbus < Vbat. But only for 30ms |
| 05:48.47 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer05, my battery at source N900 was at ~3.300 at this point |
| 05:49.12 | Estel_ | (under 1200 mA load voltage dropped to 3.3V, anyway) |
| 05:49.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | that makes stuff even stranger |
| 05:49.19 | Estel_ | exactly |
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| 05:49.48 | Estel_ | that is why i quickly took multimeter and measured to confirm, then, connected charger, invoked boostoff and measured again, then, invoked charging |
| 05:50.04 | Estel_ | as i was transferring 4GB of data and didn't wanted device to shut down due to low power |
| 05:50.22 | Estel_ | funny fact is that it haven't even become warmer than usual |
| 05:50.33 | Estel_ | no idea wtf, will investigate more tomorrow |
| 05:51.02 | Estel_ | ah, btw voltage on cable was ~5V as it should be |
| 05:51.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | o.O |
| 05:51.16 | Estel_ | (measured before conencting charger to dongling plug of y-cable) |
| 05:51.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | *some* detail can't be correct in this story |
| 05:52.10 | Estel_ | frankly I wouldn't belive anyone until seeing it myself. Either voodo electric or I'll reveal some error while testing tomorrow |
| 05:52.16 | Estel_ | just no idea what it could be |
| 05:52.42 | Estel_ | btw I would really like someone to recreate those conditions |
| 05:53.05 | Estel_ | (2nd device on bq2415 set as "dedicated", first device in hostmode) |
| 05:53.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | probing errors due to non-sinusodial waveforms? |
| 05:53.36 | Estel_ | maybe, but errors both in N900 bq27x00 readout and clamp multimeter, both in line with each other? |
| 05:54.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | bq27200 and Vbus current are not identical, by design |
| 05:54.29 | Estel_ | mhm, but bq should be aware of power draw by vbus? |
| 05:54.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~0.7 * 5 / 3.3 |
| 05:54.29 | infobot | 1.060606060606 |
| 05:54.55 | Estel_ | otherwise bq would get decalibrated every time one use hostmode |
| 05:55.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | ^^^ this is your assumed minimal battery power drain in A, on source device |
| 05:55.28 | Estel_ | it was higher, as said |
| 05:55.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | needs correction by efficiency of boost-converter: / 0.7 |
| 05:55.33 | Estel_ | 1200+ mA |
| 05:56.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~1.06 / 0.75 |
| 05:56.08 | infobot | 1.413333333333 |
| 05:56.11 | Estel_ | btw, only time I seen so much DISCHARGE rate, was when I enabled everythingp including torch and gps |
| 05:56.15 | Estel_ | hm |
| 05:56.53 | Estel_ | so, considering probing errors, could it be 500mA? |
| 05:57.06 | Estel_ | ~0.5 * 5 / 3.3 |
| 05:57.06 | infobot | 0.757575757576 |
| 05:57.27 | Estel_ | ~0.76 / 0.75 |
| 05:57.27 | infobot | 1.013333333333 |
| 05:57.40 | Estel_ | + 200 mA for device with screen on |
| 05:57.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 05:58.04 | Estel_ | still no idea why it would give 500 mA like desktop usb |
| 05:58.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 05:59.55 | Estel_ | as said will try to re-do experiment later, if someone want to try it to, be my guest. I'll have damn good reason, as on 2nd device I made backup to mydocs (due to lack of sd card in 2nd device) and then re-created partition table for 2nd device... |
| 06:00.11 | Estel_ | and got surprised that i can't restore backup from mydocs :P |
| 06:00.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd like to reproduce this, but no lab equipment here, not even a decent DVM |
| 06:01.12 | Estel_ | thankfuly those 4GB of data transfered were for ed on separate partition, so I just need to re-do home into ext3, reflash, re-apply tweaks, get into backupmenu again, don't screw backupping, and restore into ext4 |
| 06:01.16 | Estel_ | I see |
| 06:01.45 | Estel_ | well, even power draw from 1nd device measured by bq in scale of 1.2 A would be strange sight |
| 06:02.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | I however could solder up some crap consisting of a LED, a cutup micro-USB cable, and several resistors as load |
| 06:02.24 | Estel_ | as said, kp52 on source device and kp52 on receiving one, on the latter, bq24 module set to treat every connection as dedicated charger |
| 06:02.36 | Estel_ | (= pull as much power as you can up to 950 mA) |
| 06:03.05 | Estel_ | hehe |
| 06:03.20 | Estel_ | if it require work from your side, better wait for my tommorow's results |
| 06:03.28 | Estel_ | maybe I won't be able to recreate phenomena |
| 06:03.34 | Estel_ | or spot some stupidity |
| 06:03.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 06:04.01 | Estel_ | if it comes to be reproducible, I'll call for testing arms whenever possible, as it would be... well. shocking ;) |
| 06:04.17 | Estel_ | good, erm, night for now ;) |
| 06:04.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | I first time joined here when some user reported to Openmoko/me that Freerunner got extremely hot by trying to charge a N900, some device from pre-summit |
| 06:05.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | so charging with usb-hostmode doesn't shock me anymore. Strange things seem to happen |
| 06:06.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | NB freerunner supposed to deliver 500mA in hostmode, and has no D+- short |
| 06:07.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:08.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | at least not to a point were tech savvy users get scared |
| 06:31.25 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: hmm, are crappatches migrated to the "new" RMO? |
| 06:31.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 06:31.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | we're sysops, not censors |
| 06:32.05 | freemangordon | and who is the censor? |
| 06:32.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) |
| 06:32.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, council? |
| 06:32.15 | freemangordon | I need him :D:D:D |
| 06:32.32 | freemangordon | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1328022&postcount=3322 |
| 06:32.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | *knock knock* |
| 06:32.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | nobody at home at $council |
| 06:34.14 | freemangordon | not that this is a matter of urgency |
| 06:35.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | speedpatch |
| 06:35.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~speedpatch |
| 06:35.20 | infobot | speedpatch is probably http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1012405#post1012405 >>first i don't realy understand what does this patch do (that is why it is called miracle patch)<< [/quote original-author-of-speedpatch] |
| 06:37.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | answered, CBA to do more about it |
| 06:38.13 | freemangordon | yep |
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| 08:04.03 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: the tmo admin could happily put a bright red admin message on top of those threads saying "THIS SHIT SUCKS YO" |
| 08:05.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: the problem is that neither admins nor council nor any other executive are supposed to abuse their powers for personal censoring in any form |
| 08:06.03 | kerio | i'm fairly sure that the tmo admin can do whatever it wants |
| 08:06.12 | kerio | that's... what being the admin means, isn't it |
| 08:06.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | council or board would remove him |
| 08:06.41 | thedead1440 | it doesn't mean censoring things that even 2 people say works for them even though its being proven to be crap |
| 08:06.54 | kerio | it's not censoring, it's a warning message |
| 08:07.15 | thedead1440 | then you would need a warning on many other things too |
| 08:07.30 | thedead1440 | its a slippery slope once you go down that route |
| 08:13.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's a clear rule that "authorities" only go active on stuff that's evidently harmful to the hw or software in an irreversible way |
| 08:13.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | we removed backupmenu1 based on this IIRC |
| 08:14.09 | thedead1440 | indeed just like the firefox os apps compatibility layer was removed by me for the same reason |
| 08:14.21 | thedead1440 | as it had "rm -rf /" in its first few lines |
| 08:14.22 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: robbiethe1st "consented" though, right? |
| 08:14.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 08:14.30 | kerio | thedead1440: haha wat |
| 08:14.50 | thedead1440 | kerio: it was supposed to be for /tmp but the OP didn't add "cd /tmp" |
| 08:15.01 | thedead1440 | at least 1 person lost all his data because of it |
| 08:15.05 | kerio | even then, you don't delete /tmp |
| 08:15.15 | thedead1440 | indeed |
| 08:15.27 | kerio | also, wouldn't rm stop working after a while? hmm |
| 08:15.28 | thedead1440 | it was for some folder because he was outputting to /tmp |
| 08:15.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | posting massively dangerous and rogue commands anywhere is always a sure ban |
| 08:15.56 | thedead1440 | someone used on the N9 and lost full /home/user/ data |
| 08:16.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's almost enough to quote it like thedead1440 did |
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| 08:17.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | thedead1440: btw cd /tmp wouldn't change the way this command works |
| 08:17.19 | thedead1440 | kerio: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=88991 |
| 08:18.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, you noticed that |
| 08:18.00 | thedead1440 | The second page has Blueslee quoting the offending lines (his data was the one lost) :D |
| 08:18.41 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: yup i had sketchy recollection its in the second page |
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| 08:21.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | nah, it's *, not / |
| 08:21.51 | thedead1440 | yup |
| 08:22.10 | thedead1440 | its cd temp then rm -rf * |
| 08:22.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually rm -xy / doesn't work afaik, a sane rm is rejecting this particular command |
| 08:22.27 | thedead1440 | so for someone who ran it as regular user in terminal lost everything in /home/user/ |
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| 08:23.09 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: yup i read it has been disabled since a few releases in distros but not sure if its disabled on the N9 too |
| 08:23.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | only noobs and idiots use relative pathes in sciprs |
| 08:23.37 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: well, if cd succeeds you're supposed to be in the correct directory |
| 08:23.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | no |
| 08:23.50 | kerio | no? :O |
| 08:23.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | cd tmp ??? |
| 08:24.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | c'mon! |
| 08:24.09 | kerio | i meant in general |
| 08:24.11 | thedead1440 | exactly! |
| 08:24.25 | kerio | and yeah, not using *one* subdir in /tmp makes you a bad person |
| 08:25.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | those 2 lines are BS in so many respects, I dunno where to start |
| 08:25.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | a) depends on CWD |
| 08:25.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | b) uses relative path |
| 08:25.29 | kerio | not only that, but a tempdir made with mktemp |
| 08:25.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | c) doesn't test for success of cd |
| 08:26.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | and d) you MUST NOT rm /tmp/* since there may be files you don't own |
| 08:27.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | and generally you never rm *, you select and maybe even store filenames to rm - store in case of e.g. mktmp |
| 08:28.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | and then a really cool coder will clean up in a cleanup(); |
| 08:28.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | and add a trap cleanup EXIT; |
| 08:29.40 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: does that get called when SIGTERM hits? |
| 08:29.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | since then it doesn't matter how your script terminates, it always will clean up at end |
| 08:29.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: sure |
| 08:30.00 | kerio | also nope, that's a big fat lie |
| 08:30.07 | kerio | there's no way to trap SIGKILL |
| 08:30.26 | kerio | (or SIGSTOP, fwiw) |
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| 08:30.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~sigkill kerio |
| 08:30.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | how,s sigstop mattering here?? |
| 08:31.09 | kerio | it doesn't, but it's the other untrappable signal |
| 08:31.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | ktnx |
| 08:31.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | never heard about before |
| 08:31.45 | kerio | you can trap SIGCONT, which gets handled when the execution restarts |
| 08:31.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | ORLY? |
| 08:32.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | you also can read about siganls and about trap command in manpages |
| 08:32.28 | kerio | but #maemo is so much more convenient :3 |
| 08:33.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | no thanks, I prefer manpages over your online lessons |
| 08:33.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | the latter are too thin |
| 08:34.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I don't like somebody calling me a liar |
| 08:47.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | just to mention it, usually when killing a process you don't use the term "process terminates" since that implies the process caused the termination of itself |
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| 08:48.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | if anything, you use the term "the process GOT terminated" or rather "process got killed" |
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| 09:08.11 | sixwheeledbeast | oh dear somebody else hit with speedpatch :( |
| 09:08.25 | sixwheeledbeast | i can't believe this got in extras |
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| 09:24.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, raise a request to remove it from extras, with *good* rationale why it's a destructive or rogue thing, and bring it up on next council meeting |
| 09:25.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | hint: some property that should have been checked by QA testers and would have resulted in demoting the pkg, but actually never got checked, always helps |
| 09:25.48 | thedead1440 | wasn't it voted into extras? |
| 09:26.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | this isn't a vote, this is a QA certification, often done by fools |
| 09:26.37 | thedead1440 | ah |
| 09:27.08 | thedead1440 | i'm not aware of the process; just read a few pages of the thread and karam keeps asking people to vote so i thought it was voted into extras |
| 09:27.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's a pretty precise ruleset for QA, that nobody usually follows |
| 09:28.50 | thedead1440 | is there like a QA committee? |
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| 09:29.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | no |
| 09:29.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-testing/QA_Checklist |
| 09:30.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are "supertesters" with heavy votes |
| 09:32.02 | thedead1440 | the last QA meeting was 3 years ago? o.O |
| 09:32.25 | sixwheeledbeast | yep the voting was a joke for this package |
| 09:32.47 | thedead1440 | let me guess; fanboys of karam voted it in? |
| 09:32.50 | sixwheeledbeast | people with no clue or testing knowledge voted up |
| 09:32.56 | sixwheeledbeast | yep |
| 09:33.05 | thedead1440 | democracy at its best :D |
| 09:33.21 | sixwheeledbeast | i for one looked though the sources and thought eek |
| 09:33.39 | sixwheeledbeast | had to reflash my testing n900 postrm |
| 09:34.24 | thedead1440 | when i first got my n900 i had installed these two patches too and re-flash... i hadn't read the thread just browsing via fapman and i was infected :D |
| 09:34.46 | sixwheeledbeast | yep this is why i don't like them in extras |
| 09:35.10 | sixwheeledbeast | people with no knowledge damaging there devices |
| 09:35.18 | thedead1440 | true |
| 09:35.36 | thedead1440 | the thing is surely there are enough fanboys of his to object to its downgrade from extras |
| 09:35.43 | sixwheeledbeast | IIRC there is no warning it sets 500-805 overclock |
| 09:35.59 | thedead1440 | i've read quite a bit of the thread and he has pretty radical people standing up for him :D :D |
| 09:36.12 | sixwheeledbeast | :nod: |
| 09:37.03 | sixwheeledbeast | hence voting chaos, some have never voted for anything else IIRC |
| 09:37.31 | thedead1440 | maybe instead of taking it out from extras, an action that may cause these radicals to come back, maybe something could be added to its description directing people to read the thread before installing it |
| 09:38.34 | sixwheeledbeast | I doubt if it was moved back to devel anyone would notice |
| 09:38.59 | sixwheeledbeast | but how many have been infected? |
| 09:40.02 | thedead1440 | true too i just don't trust these people and especially with the council having to spar with Rob this would mean one more shitstorm thread in-waiting |
| 09:40.52 | sixwheeledbeast | also i was trying to start the testing packages motive back up, but infra issues stopped this. |
| 09:41.17 | sixwheeledbeast | :nod: best to leave it be for the time being |
| 09:41.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | ((<sixwheeledbeast> had to reflash my testing n900 postrm)) already a blocker :-) |
| 09:41.56 | sixwheeledbeast | i voted down |
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| 09:43.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | ((<sixwheeledbeast> IIRC there is no warning it sets 500-805 overclock)) blocker for sure |
| 09:43.18 | sixwheeledbeast | one of the reason why i voted down |
| 09:44.19 | thomasjfox | DocScrutinizer05: good morning. Rob from HiFo reacted to my email and requested Tim / Cosimo to update the supports wall |
| 09:44.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | lol, not as if this was the first request of this kind |
| 09:45.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | Tim??? |
| 09:45.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | Tim resigned |
| 09:45.16 | thedead1440 | thomasjfox: Yes, I'll update the donation wall. Probably I won't have time this week, though. <--- Cosimo dated 27/02/13 |
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| 09:45.35 | thedead1440 | he replied that to me 11 days ago |
| 09:45.45 | thomasjfox | hmm. probably I'm too much of an optimist :) |
| 09:46.06 | thomasjfox | may be he has a bad cold and didn't get to do it yet :o) |
| 09:46.37 | thedead1440 | nope you aren't; i did the same request on a TMO thread it went unanswered for >7 days before I sent an email to Cosimo. tl;dr i've chased this since >18 days and no action taken yet |
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| 09:47.13 | thedead1440 | maybe you too should send an email to Cosimo |
| 09:47.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: thedead1440: anyway, I encourage you to go ahead and do something about crappatches. Council won't act on own initiative on it |
| 09:48.18 | sixwheeledbeast | I can't see my vote ? http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/speedpatch/4.0/ |
| 09:48.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | post to tmo thread and list all the blockers according to QA rules, which justify taking pkg down from extras. We'll happily discuss it in council |
| 09:49.01 | sixwheeledbeast | anyway as you can see vote downs were serious issues |
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| 09:49.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | please be verbose and precise in explaining each single issue |
| 09:50.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | council won't probably act on testing votes results, we don't review them |
| 09:50.14 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: why don't you edit the roof-on-fire thread and inform people donations are not required for the time being? Its useless going to a place people don't even bother to update on donation status |
| 09:50.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | if nobody stepped up in time to declare a blocker, you need to do it now |
| 09:50.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | thedead1440: have ypu hit F5 recently ;-P |
| 09:51.22 | thedead1440 | ah |
| 09:51.28 | thedead1440 | missed the light blue part |
| 09:51.30 | thedead1440 | :D |
| 09:52.40 | sixwheeledbeast | looking at karma:- all votes down = trusted community members, all votes up = 3 karma |
| 09:52.51 | thedead1440 | the votes show 10-5 in favour of the patch |
| 09:53.01 | thedead1440 | is there a % of how many up votes required? |
| 09:53.17 | sixwheeledbeast | clear 6 more positive |
| 09:53.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | afaik 3 downvotes suffice to block, or sth like that |
| 09:54.25 | thedead1440 | and it was still promoted? |
| 09:54.44 | thedead1440 | so the threshold must have been >3 or >5 even |
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| 09:56.59 | thedead1440 | "just wanna say something i see some a fake account created and voted no probably by a hater of speedpatch" <--- haha; "up" votes must have happened that way karam... |
| 09:57.36 | sixwheeledbeast | this is why i start the broken package thread, we need to get rid of the crap in extras IMO |
| 09:57.52 | sixwheeledbeast | the wiki says +10 votes |
| 09:58.08 | thedead1440 | fmg's own assessment fails it only on licensing and "no missing announce features" |
| 09:58.19 | sixwheeledbeast | so there can be 9 V and 10 ^ to promote, madness |
| 09:58.55 | thedead1440 | yup who ever thought it out must have been drunk |
| 09:59.33 | sixwheeledbeast | only if there is one completed checklist in QA |
| 09:59.45 | sixwheeledbeast | this is fmgs down one! |
| 10:00.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | dafaq I can't even switch to page2 of comments :-S |
| 10:00.30 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: i thought too; its actually comment number not page number switching |
| 10:00.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | LOL |
| 10:00.42 | thedead1440 | try click 7 and it takes you to fmg's comment solely |
| 10:00.48 | sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: garage has been like that for ages |
| 10:01.07 | sixwheeledbeast | ahh comment number |
| 10:01.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | not even that |
| 10:01.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | editing URL to pagenumber=10 doesn't chnage anything |
| 10:02.25 | sixwheeledbeast | I haven't got a 7 only 1-6> |
| 10:02.50 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: it hates you :p |
| 10:03.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | there is no "7" |
| 10:03.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | you're kidding me? |
| 10:04.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | I can click whatever I want, nothing changes |
| 10:04.46 | thedead1440 | http://db.tt/pEJrCG1K |
| 10:05.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly I can't see how messing with existing cgroups is a valid practice either |
| 10:05.35 | thedead1440 | Doc my screen shows 7 and one comment in isolation see the link above |
| 10:05.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | dunno what you do |
| 10:06.02 | thedead1440 | dunno what *you* do :p :p |
| 10:06.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | *I* use a sane browser |
| 10:06.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | and carefully adjusted cookie policies |
| 10:06.34 | thedead1440 | I use firefox; i know its a resource hog etc but its sane though |
| 10:07.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | and similarly carefully ajusted reluctant java/(script) enabling |
| 10:07.57 | sixwheeledbeast | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:09.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | meh, this page is a fuckedup as crappatch itself |
| 10:09.33 | sixwheeledbeast | agreed, ff in safe mode doesn't work either |
| 10:10.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | "optimized for FF on M$ crap" ? |
| 10:10.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually a lot of Nokia stuff only works with MSIE or FF in default mode |
| 10:10.55 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: mine is ff 19 on mint |
| 10:11.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | probably some midgard template |
| 10:11.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | I honestly don't care |
| 10:11.37 | thedead1440 | it should be filed as a bug too? |
| 10:11.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | I blamed it at meego.com, and on maemo several times |
| 10:11.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | nobody ever cared |
| 10:12.00 | thedead1440 | s/it/shouldn't it/ |
| 10:12.24 | sixwheeledbeast | Doc you'll hate me but ff on *bunt* |
| 10:12.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | *shrug* |
| 10:13.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have more severe "problems" to track |
| 10:14.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually I don't need any more comments on crappatch to know it's borked |
| 10:15.00 | sixwheeledbeast | it's not comments on the package more comments on it being in extras |
| 10:15.17 | sixwheeledbeast | but i agree there are better things to do |
| 10:15.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | we could just state "on comment 318 there been 7 blockers mentioned which the original author never targeted. Promotion to extras been by accident - reverted. sorry for the inconvenience!" ;-P |
| 10:16.39 | sixwheeledbeast | yes please, who can do this? |
| 10:17.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | I *can* do remmoval from extras in 90s |
| 10:17.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | but i MUSTN'T |
| 10:17.28 | thedead1440 | Council? |
| 10:17.44 | thedead1440 | or Rob? (shock and horror) |
| 10:18.13 | sixwheeledbeast | it was "lost" in migration :) |
| 10:18.30 | thedead1440 | hehe imagine putting this request to HiFo and Rob would search how he could be held liable for any demotion etc |
| 10:18.51 | thedead1440 | if he doesn't demote it he could still be held liable so either way he would be in a ditch :D |
| 10:19.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | luckily that's a council domain issue clearly |
| 10:21.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's why I say "write blockers up in a precise and verbose manner somewhere publicly, with rationale and all. Send a mail to council about it, pointing to that place, and rise the topic on next council meeting" |
| 10:21.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | I already gave you several hints |
| 10:21.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | OC by default is a BLOCKER |
| 10:22.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | no optification: blocker |
| 10:22.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | no proper uninstall: blocker |
| 10:22.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | not delivering announced features: blocker |
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| 10:25.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | and probably you could find several colateral damages that would justify removal each single one of them, like messing up of databases, power issues, whatnot else |
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| 10:26.45 | sixwheeledbeast | but i would have to reinstall the bugger to remind me of the issues |
| 10:27.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-testing/QA_Checklist#Blockers |
| 10:28.07 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: just broken functionality i.e. overclocking without notice and cgroup modification without notice would be sufficient right? That way you don't need to go thru the nightmare again :D |
| 10:28.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>The main security risks are financial damage, access to private data and harm to device components. If you find such risk in an application then you need to report it and the app can't be uploaded to Extras until a deeper analysis has been done with favourable results.<< |
| 10:29.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | OC == damage to hw |
| 10:29.09 | thedead1440 | yup |
| 10:30.06 | sixwheeledbeast | mmm, trying to be as fair as possible by having the application for testing but i suppose i can go off past testing expirence from when i "voted" |
| 10:34.29 | sixwheeledbeast | downloading the source now to remind me. mmm, there is also potential of being attacked by fanboys via pm and what not :-/ |
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| 10:35.24 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: you can report PMs ;) |
| 10:41.27 | sixwheeledbeast | mmm, seems we are getting all the *patches mixed up anyhow |
| 10:42.20 | sixwheeledbeast | speedpatch is cgroups only, batterypatch is 500-800 overclock with underclocking on locked device |
| 10:43.20 | thedead1440 | so speedpatch can't be downgraded in that event? |
| 10:44.31 | sixwheeledbeast | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:44.44 | thedead1440 | hehe |
| 10:45.02 | sixwheeledbeast | thedead1440: possibly not |
| 10:45.27 | sixwheeledbeast | I can only see that the copyright file has only "GPL" in |
| 10:45.34 | thedead1440 | either way even if one is downgraded it should be enough |
| 10:45.34 | kerio | hahaha fmg's comment in speedpatch is gold |
| 10:45.40 | kerio | sixwheeledbeast: i think that's a debian thing actually |
| 10:45.55 | kerio | [X] No performance problems. OK. As this SW does nothing, there should not be performance impact. |
| 10:46.04 | thedead1440 | kerio: you mean the comment that it has taken them only 2-3 years to come back to stock config |
| 10:46.06 | thedead1440 | oh that one |
| 10:47.36 | kerio | thedead1440: ohoh, which one? |
| 10:47.47 | thedead1440 | i read it previously on the thread |
| 10:49.13 | sixwheeledbeast | well i can't see how speedpatch uninstalls cleanly |
| 10:50.47 | sixwheeledbeast | it's makes allsorts of directories and there's only one rm line in prerm and no postrm |
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| 10:52.19 | sixwheeledbeast | wtf changelog for batterypatch "fixed heat problem" |
| 10:58.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | ROTFL |
| 10:59.05 | thedead1440 | kerio: found it :D http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1166208&postcount=3064 |
| 11:02.50 | sixwheeledbeast | caution if you use this patch you may get your fingers burnt :-/ |
| 11:03.24 | thedead1440 | you should read post 3065 too; karam explains the "development" time-frame |
| 11:04.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | >> |
| 11:04.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | currently i haven't seen any SW that modifies /syspart |
| 11:04.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | and if any future SWs |
| 11:04.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | well thaey will have to check for speedpatch existen in postinst |
| 11:04.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | << |
| 11:04.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | blocker |
| 11:04.22 | thedead1440 | haha |
| 11:04.24 | thedead1440 | lol |
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| 11:06.42 | thedead1440 | the thread is full-on entertainment |
| 11:07.48 | sixwheeledbeast | plus like the theme-customizer issue, it has it's own stock version to restore to, not good coding IMO. |
| 11:08.13 | sixwheeledbeast | thats /syspart BTW |
| 11:09.12 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: i reckon that any violation of the debian packaging policy should also be a blocker, unless the dev has very good reasons |
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| 11:11.17 | ShadowJK | is the debian packaging policy duplicated in maemo.org documentation? |
| 11:14.00 | sixwheeledbeast | http://wiki.maemo.org/Packaging/Guidelines |
| 11:15.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: quite probably |
| 11:16.12 | kerio | well then blast that piece of crap off rmo |
| 11:17.11 | sixwheeledbeast | lol |
| 11:17.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | where is the rationale posted that I'll point those to, who ask me why it got removed? |
| 11:18.00 | kerio | a package modifying another package's files without going through dpkg bureaucracy is a critical bug in debian |
| 11:18.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | this is no beauty contest |
| 11:18.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | document it, send a mail to council |
| 11:19.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | we'll evaluate what you wrote ponder what to do. We will do NUTTIN otherwise |
| 11:20.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly, please read backscroll, I explained all that before |
| 11:21.28 | thedead1440 | "currently i'm trying to find a way to inject a script inside /usr/share/application/hildon/*.desktop after Exec to put every application launched in User cgroup" <-- imagine the shit if he had managed to do this :D |
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| 11:23.06 | sixwheeledbeast | so can it be removed from extras and/or devel or what? both packages batterypatch and speedpatch, one is extras one is only devel. |
| 11:23.44 | sixwheeledbeast | if the correct info why is provided obv. |
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| 11:24.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | YES!!! |
| 11:25.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | I won't explain it a third time |
| 11:25.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | pkgs that have passed QA by fraud or ignorance of testers can get removed from extras |
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| 11:26.07 | sixwheeledbeast | thank you |
| 11:26.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | any blocker grade bug or flaw will do |
| 11:26.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | though it would be better if it's a *severe* blocker |
| 11:27.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | of the class I quoted above: security issues |
| 11:28.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | OC without notice to users and by default will qualify for such blocker. Messing with /syspart so other software doesn't possibly find what it expects on a stock maemo qualifies as well |
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| 11:35.57 | thomasjfox | DocScrutinizer05: can you send me the URL of the infrastructure monitoring tool again? I lost it. |
| 11:36.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://213.128.137.6/ganglia |
| 11:36.30 | thomasjfox | thanks! |
| 11:37.17 | thomasjfox | should I add it to the wiki? It's still listed in the "to do" section |
| 11:39.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | no thanks, we'll take care |
| 11:45.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | thomasjfox: what you could do is: prepare a list of all related URLs/services/webpages for a pkg you've built, and tell us for each if it looks like expected |
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| 11:45.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | starting at web-uploader frontend, to builder logs, to package download statistics |
| 11:46.00 | thomasjfox | well, f.e. I didn't get a build log via email yet |
| 11:46.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, that's since we can't send any mail without proper domain Ns MX |
| 11:46.51 | thomasjfox | there was a "maemo.org/packages" interface, but I didn't manage to find it at the new IP (.20) |
| 11:48.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, maemo.org/* is maemo.orf/* |
| 11:48.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | what do you mean by "couldn't find it"? |
| 11:49.26 | thomasjfox | well, I wanted to look at the build logs of the latest rockbox build |
| 11:49.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | obviously you need etc7hosts hack to get proper URL in HTTP request from your browser |
| 11:49.48 | thomasjfox | I'll give it a try |
| 11:52.26 | thomasjfox | that looks much better with the /etc/hosts hack |
| 11:57.08 | thomasjfox | DocScrutinizer05: the "Relases" section of the build package doesn't seem to get updated: http://maemo.org/packages/view/rockbox/ |
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| 11:57.33 | thomasjfox | It lists the release from 2011 as the latest one, the one successfully built yesterday is not listed |
| 11:58.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | could you sum it all up and send to techstaff@m.o? |
| 11:59.12 | thomasjfox | yep |
| 11:59.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | or post to "discussion" on the wiki? |
| 11:59.31 | thomasjfox | do you see it also (I just put "maemo.org www.maemo.org static.maemo.org planet.maemo.org downloads.maemo.org" in my hosts file)? |
| 12:00.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't patch my hosts since it would cut me from real m.o |
| 12:00.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | I got a VM for trsts but it's a pita |
| 12:01.04 | thomasjfox | ok |
| 12:01.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's why I ask for URLs to check in that VM |
| 12:05.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | thomasjfox: we're going to reboot blade-a for switching kernel. So a short downtime is expected |
| 12:06.03 | thomasjfox | thanks for the info, I was just starting another upload |
| 12:06.35 | thomasjfox | the i386 sometimes fails for an unknown reason that is beyond me (weird scratchbox error message) |
| 12:06.41 | thomasjfox | i386 build |
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| 12:30.44 | thomasjfox | DocScrutinizer05: builder seems broken since the reboot. Some NFS mount missing? |
| 12:31.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | why do you think it's broken? |
| 12:31.21 | thomasjfox | https://213.128.137.26/builder/fremantle/rockbox_2013-03-10maemo1/summary.log |
| 12:31.57 | thomasjfox | niels@maemo.org even sent me the output via email :) |
| 12:32.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | huh? |
| 12:34.19 | thomasjfox | do you want to see the message (including all headers)? I could forward it |
| 12:34.36 | thomasjfox | seems to be sent from garage.maemo.org |
| 12:35.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-10 13:32:23] <jacekowski> btw. restarting when build is in progress is a bad idea |
| 12:35.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-10 13:33:31] <warfare> there was nothing running on builder. |
| 12:35.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | [2013-03-10 13:34:24] <jacekowski> build failed on input/output error |
| 12:36.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | thomasjfox: I don't get it |
| 12:36.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | what got niels to do with it? |
| 12:36.33 | thomasjfox | "niels@maemo.org" was the sender of the "build failed" email |
| 12:36.37 | thomasjfox | I'll just forward it to you |
| 12:36.57 | thomasjfox | done |
| 12:37.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmmm |
| 12:37.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | we fixed mail |
| 12:37.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | I honestly doubt Niels has looked into *new* |
| 12:38.14 | thomasjfox | I'll try another build |
| 12:39.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | It doesn't really help for our job |
| 12:41.01 | thomasjfox | alright, I stop it. Let me know when I should give it another test run |
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| 12:52.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | I *think* the package got built meanwhile and probably you should have received a second mail about that fact? |
| 12:52.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | thomasjfox: ^^^ |
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| 13:14.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | thomasjfox: could you prepare a list of all related URLs/services/webpages for a pkg you've built, and tell us for each if it looks like expected? |
| 13:15.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | starting at web-uploader frontend, to builder logs, to package download statistics |
| 13:15.55 | thomasjfox | I'm probably the wrong guy for this since I rarely use the websites (upload via scp f.e.) |
| 13:16.12 | thomasjfox | sorry |
| 13:16.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | scp is an URL too |
| 13:17.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | we need to create a comprehensive list of services to checkmark if they're working as expected |
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| 13:18.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | I have absolutely *no* idea about all that stuff |
| 13:19.09 | thomasjfox | hmm, I don't have that much of a clue either |
| 13:19.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway for all you used we could enter a record to that list, and we'd not need to check it ourselves anymore |
| 13:19.57 | thomasjfox | should I put it on the wiki? |
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| 13:20.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | to discussion please |
| 13:20.10 | thomasjfox | ok |
| 13:20.16 | thomasjfox | after lunch :) |
| 13:20.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | np, ta |
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| 13:21.56 | sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: kerio: thedead1440: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1328060&postcount=3325 |
| 13:22.14 | sixwheeledbeast | ~council e-mail? |
| 13:22.30 | thedead1440 | council@maemo.org |
| 13:22.37 | sixwheeledbeast | ta |
| 13:22.44 | sixwheeledbeast | i thought as mucho |
| 13:22.55 | thedead1440 | nice write-up :D |
| 13:23.04 | kerio | sixwheeledbeast: hm, are you sure that "GPL" isn't debian for "this package follows gpl 2 or later and the license can be found somewhere in /usr/share/doc"? |
| 13:23.16 | sixwheeledbeast | ta |
| 13:23.33 | sixwheeledbeast | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:23.57 | kerio | sixwheeledbeast: i'm right actually |
| 13:24.19 | kerio | hm, no i'm not? |
| 13:24.25 | kerio | Use of a standard short name does not override the Debian Policy requirement to include the full license text in debian/copyright |
| 13:24.48 | kerio | wtf, there's a format specification for licensing of different files in debian/copyright, it can't also be the place to put the license's text |
| 13:24.52 | sixwheeledbeast | maemo has to follow debian policy |
| 13:25.31 | sixwheeledbeast | and the debian policy says every package must have the full license no symlink or tar |
| 13:25.31 | kerio | ah indeed |
| 13:25.53 | sixwheeledbeast | i did my research :) |
| 13:27.01 | sixwheeledbeast | http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-docs.html#s-copyrightfile |
| 13:28.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: brilliant. Please send a reminder mail to council@m.o and rise the topic on next counil meeting (Friday 1800UTC #maemo-meeting), I think we can act based on that |
| 13:29.06 | sixwheeledbeast | kk, will do my best to be at #m-m |
| 13:29.34 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: can't you add it in /topic of #m-m too discuss this post? |
| 13:29.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | add to topic??? |
| 13:30.01 | sixwheeledbeast | If not thedead1440 would you mind in my absence? |
| 13:30.16 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: no probs i'll be there |
| 13:30.21 | sixwheeledbeast | ta |
| 13:30.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | don't you think /topic is a bit... restricted in length to add all meeting minutes? |
| 13:30.43 | thedead1440 | true; i thought of it as reminder of agenda |
| 13:31.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's what the mail to council@m.o is for |
| 13:32.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | we can't add the full agenda to topic, and we don't need a reminder that there is (or isn't) any agenda at all |
| 13:32.15 | thedead1440 | ok |
| 13:32.45 | sixwheeledbeast | lunch and then I'll e-mail cc... |
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| 13:39.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/index.php?title=Migrating_to_Community-driven_Infrastructure&diff=51108&oldid=51106 .oO(??) |
| 13:40.41 | thedead1440 | what is he trying to imply :/ |
| 13:43.14 | sixwheeledbeast | DocScrutinizer05: your nose fell off? |
| 13:44.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | touches nose, notices with relief it's still where it belongs |
| 13:44.07 | thedead1440 | lol |
| 13:44.12 | sixwheeledbeast | lol |
| 13:44.22 | is_null | hi all, is it possible to get the screen package via apt ? |
| 13:45.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | thedead1440: N*F*C but deleting a staement from techstaff is another insult in my book |
| 13:45.10 | sixwheeledbeast | is_null: screen package? |
| 13:45.18 | is_null | the GNU/screen one |
| 13:45.37 | is_null | SCREEN(1): screen - screen manager with VT100/ANSI terminal emulation |
| 13:45.49 | is_null | or maybe equivalent ? |
| 13:46.11 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: ignore him; he's a guest of few weeks only :D |
| 13:46.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm actually temped to rollback/undo and then lock the wikipage |
| 13:46.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | thedead1440: you're sure about that? |
| 13:47.12 | thedead1440 | elections will have to happen, no? |
| 13:47.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | so what? do you think significantly >7 will run for HoFo even? |
| 13:48.44 | thedead1440 | hmm true that's a blocker |
| 13:49.11 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: why don't you run for next HiFo BoD? |
| 13:50.36 | sixwheeledbeast | err...i don't have time for RL work politics never mind HiFo politics |
| 13:52.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: it's not that bad, according to woody |
| 13:52.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | council is much worse |
| 13:52.41 | thedead1440 | yeah and its politics only when politicians make it in |
| 13:53.06 | sixwheeledbeast | he's a lawyer no? |
| 13:53.20 | thedead1440 | yeah but he's quite happy to play politics |
| 13:53.45 | thedead1440 | a BoD of Doc, qwazix + woody and a few more would be pretty little politics and work done infact |
| 13:53.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd say it's a meeting every 3 months (maybe every 4 weeks even), ready a few mails per day, and occasional nod-off of stuff |
| 13:54.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/ready/reading/ |
| 13:54.41 | sixwheeledbeast | I am away from a computer most of day so unlikely to get much done. |
| 13:55.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | ask woody |
| 13:55.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | if we can't form a proper HiFo board on next elections, we're doomed |
| 13:56.08 | kerio | is_null: it's in the fremantle/tools repo iirc |
| 13:56.13 | kerio | there's also tmux in extras-devel |
| 13:56.19 | kerio | which is BETTER >:C |
| 13:56.25 | is_null | cool, thanks |
| 13:56.43 | is_null | yeah maybe another time we can war on this xD |
| 13:57.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | tmux is a biatch and kills your battery |
| 13:58.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | which kinda anihilates the purpose tmux been written for, no? |
| 13:59.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe they had PC in mind when they specified that insane protocol that sends keep-alive pkt every 10some seconds |
| 14:00.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly before I use tmux, I rather use VNC |
| 14:01.08 | sixwheeledbeast | cc you have mail... :) |
| 14:02.47 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: hm, i think you're mistaken |
| 14:02.58 | kerio | mosh is the remote thing |
| 14:03.01 | kerio | tmux is strictly local |
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| 14:04.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | oooh |
| 14:04.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, indeed mixed it up |
| 14:05.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | my bad, scrub my rant |
| 14:05.30 | is_null | ok i will get tmux |
| 14:05.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | or rather, mv to mosh |
| 14:06.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | rrrrrright, MObileSHell |
| 14:06.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | I already had a strange feeling when I mentioned the envisioned usecase |
| 14:07.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | since tmux gives no hint why it would be a tool for mobile |
| 14:09.24 | kerio | well, in some sense it is |
| 14:09.35 | kerio | it's really useful if you have flaky, intermittent connections |
| 14:09.43 | kerio | which mobile connections tend to be, for obvious reasons |
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| 14:51.51 | sixwheeledbeast | ah a response from karam |
| 14:52.26 | thedead1440 | hehe |
| 14:52.35 | thedead1440 | please fix the package for him :D |
| 14:52.51 | sixwheeledbeast | "help fixing and modifying what's needed be modified or fixed" |
| 14:52.54 | thedead1440 | who's going to tell him fixing his package == removing it |
| 14:53.05 | sixwheeledbeast | not it :) |
| 14:54.10 | thedead1440 | coming to think of it; if someone had done such a proper response in the first place he might not have been able to propagate it as much |
| 14:54.57 | sixwheeledbeast | why, thank you |
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| 14:58.32 | sixwheeledbeast | if he can't maintain it anymore, then it's unlikely to be repaired by anyone. |
| 14:58.48 | sixwheeledbeast | not like it can be "repaired" |
| 15:04.29 | sixwheeledbeast | hmm, i feel a *patch war brewing on TMO |
| 15:05.03 | thedead1440 | hehe |
| 15:05.20 | kerio | submits a SpeedKludge package that does nothing at all |
| 15:05.35 | kerio | then i'll put some fake benchmarks on TMO |
| 15:05.38 | thedead1440 | but your answers are detailed; anyone wanting to fight will have to give a proper rebuttal which none of the fanboys can do |
| 15:06.00 | sixwheeledbeast | like the previous 84 pages of the thread |
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| 15:06.30 | kerio | i don't get how you can be a fanboy of some tweaked settings |
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| 15:06.51 | thedead1440 | kerio: its the us $users against them $established_devs |
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| 15:17.48 | is_null | is there any neogeo or mame package in any repo ? can't find them |
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| 15:19.38 | sixwheeledbeast | mame is in devel never tested it tho |
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| 15:19.51 | sixwheeledbeast | is_null: ^^^ |
| 15:21.01 | is_null | ah ok thanks will enable devel then |
| 15:22.25 | sixwheeledbeast | is_null: repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/m/mame/mame_0.138u1-0maemo0_armel.deb |
| 15:24.24 | is_null | yep, thanks, had extras only |
| 15:25.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | extras-devel meant to not get permanently enabled |
| 15:25.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's no "update repo" |
| 15:26.03 | kerio | NachoPoncho: you're so nice ^____^ |
| 15:26.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: ??????????? |
| 15:26.32 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: -ssu |
| 15:26.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: ?????????????????????? |
| 15:27.10 | kerio | what are you so weirded out by? |
| 15:27.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | thedead1440: he answers like Rob :-o |
| 15:27.33 | NachoPoncho | Me? |
| 15:27.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
| 15:27.38 | thedead1440 | lol |
| 15:28.04 | kerio | damn, mame in the repos is 0.138? |
| 15:28.09 | kerio | the current stable is 0.148 |
| 15:29.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | NachoPoncho: nah, kerio |
| 15:32.07 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: there should be factoid for "rob's answer" :D |
| 15:32.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, the existing factoid seems close enough (SIC!) |
| 15:33.20 | thedead1440 | what is it? |
| 15:33.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~rob's_answer |
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| 15:33.51 | thedead1440 | ~rob's_answer |
| 15:34.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | see? |
| 15:34.05 | sixwheeledbeast | nothing |
| 15:34.08 | thedead1440 | haha got it :D |
| 15:36.30 | is_null | yep i imagined so, thanks |
| 15:37.13 | is_null | is there anyway to get the unzip command ? |
| 15:45.50 | is_null | ok got it with busybox-power |
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| 15:52.57 | kerio | looks at doc, giggling |
| 15:56.03 | freemangordon | likes the fact he is not a politician :P |
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| 15:57.39 | NachoPoncho | So, are there a few missing dependencies in the repos.. or am I completely retarded. :( |
| 15:57.53 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: I just can't imagine if you weren't in the council. What your reply to jim's post would've been :P |
| 15:59.04 | NachoPoncho | It seems like the general consensus is that the repositories are now functional, and I must be experiencing pebkac? |
| 15:59.41 | freemangordon | hashsum erros fixed? |
| 15:59.44 | freemangordon | *errors |
| 16:00.13 | NachoPoncho | I've just had unmet dependencies for ncurses, wireless tools, and a few other random packages |
| 16:00.36 | freemangordon | NachoPoncho: hmm, could be you are missing some repos |
| 16:01.08 | NachoPoncho | I have: Maemo Community, Extras, Testing, and Devel enabled. |
| 16:01.23 | NachoPoncho | I use fapman. |
| 16:01.31 | freemangordon | ~fapman |
| 16:01.31 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, fapman is Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU). It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default. |
| 16:01.50 | freemangordon | NachoPoncho: what about nokia repos? |
| 16:02.15 | NachoPoncho | I didn't do the system upgrade from fapman :) |
| 16:02.29 | NachoPoncho | One moment, let me check my sources. |
| 16:02.31 | freemangordon | NachoPoncho: do you have Nokia repos enabled? |
| 16:12.02 | sixwheeledbeast | > ~fapman has changed? |
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| 16:12.26 | thedead1440 | yeah Estel changed it |
| 16:17.48 | sixwheeledbeast | I am having trouble w/ fennec from thumb repo, XPCOMGlueLoad error, any ideas on how to fix? |
| 16:18.20 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: hmm, strange |
| 16:18.24 | freemangordon | never seen that |
| 16:18.39 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: did you try to remove cache? |
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| 16:19.38 | sixwheeledbeast | cache of? this is a fresh device with cssu thumb and all cssu devel updates |
| 16:20.45 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: do you have maliit installed by chance? |
| 16:21.57 | sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: nope fresh device only fennec, new "ade" theme-customizer and swappolube |
| 16:22.08 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: "cache" is /home/user/.mozilla/fennec |
| 16:22.32 | sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: delete it? |
| 16:22.36 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: do you have qtm1.2 installed? |
| 16:22.52 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: yes, delete is, but first ^^^ |
| 16:22.58 | freemangordon | *delete it |
| 16:24.11 | sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: qtm 1.3-2+0m5 |
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| 16:25.43 | Guest85811 | ciao |
| 16:25.52 | Guest85811 | !list |
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| 16:26.03 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: NFC what ^^ is, however, you need libqtm-12 |
| 16:27.04 | sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: http://pastebin.com/yfCjkJLT |
| 16:27.33 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: "libQtFeedback.so.1:" |
| 16:27.52 | freemangordon | toldya, you need libqtm-12 |
| 16:29.43 | sixwheeledbeast | freemangordan: shouldn't this have been pulled as dependency? |
| 16:30.00 | freemangordon | well... :) |
| 16:30.14 | freemangordon | It should have been |
| 16:30.24 | sixwheeledbeast | works now, ta |
| 16:30.30 | freemangordon | If me was not lasy ;) |
| 16:31.17 | sixwheeledbeast | freemangordon: I am surpised only I have had issue |
| 16:31.54 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast: well, libqtm-12 is needed by lots of apps, chances it is already installed are bgi |
| 16:31.59 | freemangordon | *big |
| 16:32.45 | sixwheeledbeast | not on a fresh install :P |
| 16:32.55 | freemangordon | sure :) |
| 16:33.14 | thomasjfox | DocScrutinizer05: http://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Migrating_to_Community-driven_Infrastructure |
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| 16:44.56 | Estel_ | frankly, I belive that no matter who would end up in hifo - be it freemangordon, DocScrutinizer05, thedead1440 and sixwheeledbeast - it will end up in being politics anyway, due to idiotic statute |
| 16:45.35 | Estel_ | BTW if hifo won't get merged into Council's respinsibilities, I would like to see most vocal HiFo haters in HiFo, showing them how it should be done |
| 16:46.04 | freemangordon | Estel_: you mean youself? |
| 16:46.08 | Estel_ | not that I like HiFo at current state, mind you ;) |
| 16:46.14 | thedead1440 | freemangordon: lol |
| 16:46.21 | Estel_ | hm, I'm not vocal about it at all |
| 16:46.23 | Estel_ | IIRC |
| 16:46.36 | Estel_ | I have no opinion about hifo-council war |
| 16:46.50 | Estel_ | I see council doing much of the work and hifo messing with legals. |
| 16:46.56 | freemangordon | Estel_: you are vocal about HiFo in principle ;) |
| 16:47.10 | Estel_ | I'm not sure if current council members would be better at messing with legals due to wrong statute |
| 16:47.19 | Estel_ | erm, I'm vocal about hifo? when? |
| 16:47.24 | Estel_ | hifo = rob now, yes? |
| 16:47.43 | thedead1440 | Estel_: you go on and on about statues but never have I seen you really present amendments. Even in by-laws thread only 1 of your post was related to by-laws so its a bit rich of you to keep complaining when you don't give your alternate vision |
| 16:47.51 | Estel_ | before, tim was there, too? quote any of my comments about tim or rob not older than half year ago |
| 16:48.20 | Estel_ | Well, I gave it already here, and IIRC even your hero DocScrutinizer05 agreed ;) |
| 16:48.32 | freemangordon | Estel_: I'm too lazy now to search, but you said something like "the whole by-laws is flawed, corrupted and whatnot" |
| 16:48.39 | Estel_ | and aboiut thread - yes, I absolutely agree, I gave up on taking poart in TMO poolitics threads ages ago |
| 16:48.55 | Estel_ | no, I said about warning that separating hifo and council was bad idea |
| 16:48.58 | thedead1440 | Estel_: see those statements are which don't help. You keep calling people names or wanna-be politicians even when taken to a proper discussion |
| 16:49.17 | Estel_ | and that Council should get hifo respinsibilities, or were going to have war no matter who sits on what chair |
| 16:49.44 | freemangordon | Estel_: I am not sure merging legal with tachnical stuff is a good idea |
| 16:49.52 | freemangordon | *technical |
| 16:49.52 | Estel_ | well, as said, I'll shamelessly refrain to bitching at irc, as posting anything on approriate threads is useless due to ensorship |
| 16:50.10 | Estel_ | freemangordon, otherwise technical and legal folks will always hate each other |
| 16:50.28 | Estel_ | at least IMHO |
| 16:50.34 | Estel_ | with highlight on H |
| 16:51.02 | thedead1440 | Estel_: another lie; nobody censors you unless you resort to personal insults but your sheer blindness for anything logical that doesn't involve kissing your arse and agreeing your previous agenda is worth pushing till date is pathetic |
| 16:51.02 | Estel_ | I think it's too easy to criticise legal guys, when you're technic one - you're lowed due to keeping infra alive |
| 16:51.11 | Estel_ | bullshit, thedead |
| 16:51.53 | Estel_ | last time I *politely* criticised idea of having same person candidating for SEpARATE hifo and council, and idea of candidating + "don't vote for me' just for get election rolling, as parody of democracy... |
| 16:51.55 | Estel_ | I got banned |
| 16:51.56 | thedead1440 | proof? Still want to talk about those two stupid posts during your ban? Tell me anything else that got censored? |
| 16:51.57 | Estel_ | ;) |
| 16:52.08 | thedead1440 | s/during/before/ |
| 16:52.09 | Estel_ | so don't count on impact from me |
| 16:52.18 | thedead1440 | you were using insults in your post FFS |
| 16:52.20 | Estel_ | s/impact/contribution/ |
| 16:52.41 | Estel_ | thedead1440, yea, and got censored due to two posts where 0 insults were present |
| 16:52.48 | thedead1440 | you can criticize but not insult; i don't go on TMO and tell Rob he is a $!@%!@% but debate constructively |
| 16:52.49 | Estel_ | whatever, I don't care about it anymore |
| 16:53.21 | Estel_ | telling someone that candidqating just to get vote rolling and asking "don't vote for me" is a joke of democracy isn't insult in my book |
| 16:53.23 | thedead1440 | if you don't care then don't slag people off unnecessarily. You keep pushing your bs agenda in every single argument consisting of TMO/HiFo |
| 16:53.58 | Estel_ | thedead1440, frankly, you seem to have very vague knowledge about events, just following "public opinion" about them |
| 16:54.01 | thedead1440 | you keep bringing the topic back to your ban etc instead of focusing on the now and here |
| 16:54.12 | Estel_ | have you even seen two posts of mine that were official excuse for ban? ;) |
| 16:54.22 | thedead1440 | Estel_: No! I was involved in the very thread you are speaking about |
| 16:54.41 | Estel_ | and I haven't started discussions about my ban. You were interested why I don't post suggestions in approriate threads |
| 16:54.46 | thedead1440 | The posts that were deleted? I saw them before deletion but not exact contents. FWIW my reply to you was deleted too |
| 16:55.00 | Estel_ | no, those posts were not even deleted |
| 16:55.15 | Estel_ | you don't have slightest idea of what you're talking about, honestly |
| 16:55.23 | thedead1440 | yes the mod name s****** deleted those incl mine |
| 16:55.38 | Estel_ | mailing list thread still have link to post that was reason for ban, and it is reachable |
| 16:55.42 | Estel_ | anyway, whatever |
| 16:56.01 | Estel_ | lets agree that we have different views on what censorship is, OK? |
| 16:56.47 | Estel_ | I don't feel urge to be part of your politics, while I feel shameless right to criticise (politely) what I think is wrong. If it's not allowed, go and ban me *shrug* |
| 16:57.02 | Estel_ | you're absolutely free to think that it is immature :) |
| 16:57.04 | thedead1440 | My politics? Estel_ you are hopelessly wrong... |
| 16:57.15 | freemangordon | Estel_:please, stop that ban thingie already. esp in regard to HiFo/Council |
| 16:57.43 | freemangordon | it is just not related, IMO |
| 16:57.46 | Estel_ | why so, i posted polite single liner, that i don't belive even freemangordon, thedead1440, or DocScrutinizer05 would make better hifo, due to stupid statute |
| 16:57.52 | Estel_ | is it offensive? |
| 16:57.57 | freemangordon | Estel_: no |
| 16:58.01 | freemangordon | who said it is? |
| 16:58.09 | Estel_ | feel free to disagree, or even prove me wrong by candidating ands fixing things |
| 16:58.26 | freemangordon | At least I don;t find it offensive |
| 16:58.48 | Estel_ | I think it's easy to be community super-hero (rightly so! due to awesome contributions), but much harder to retain this status, when you need to mess with legal stuff |
| 16:59.01 | Estel_ | Rob was community superhero too, once ;) |
| 16:59.05 | thedead1440 | neither do i; i asked for you to take the initiative to propose amendments |
| 16:59.44 | Estel_ | and I answered you that I won't take initiative on TMO, as in my book people responsible for wrong actions like censorship for opinions etc, were not punished, even opposite, rewarded |
| 17:00.00 | Estel_ | so I refrain to express my opinion in free discusions, like on irc |
| 17:00.15 | is_null | sometimes it's good to step back to have a better view of the picture |
| 17:00.34 | thedead1440 | yeah you always hark back to your ban by keep speaking about that censorship. Like I said tell me of instances where you have been censored... |
| 17:00.45 | Estel_ | I think that in current situation, anyone who get sandwitched as legal guy between technical Council and absent Nokia/Nemeinp, will get hated |
| 17:01.03 | is_null | sometimes users and/or make mistakes, it shouldn't be a big deal |
| 17:01.09 | is_null | users and/or admins |
| 17:01.25 | Estel_ | for me, banning due to unpopular opinion is form of censorship, even if you don't delete postsl Anyway, you don't like me reffering to it, so lets skip that topic ;) |
| 17:02.07 | Estel_ | going back to hifo, I just don't see anyone being able to make it right as hifo member, given current statute, Council role, etc |
| 17:02.08 | freemangordon | Estel_: HiFo's job is not to make decisions on technical stuff if they don;t have the expertise |
| 17:02.22 | Estel_ | problem is that statute give them right to |
| 17:02.22 | freemangordon | They shuld just trust the council. period |
| 17:02.36 | Estel_ | who said that, yoiu!? I agree, but it's not in statute |
| 17:02.46 | freemangordon | Estel_: you can't revoke that right, it makes no sense |
| 17:03.03 | Estel_ | and hifo prime task is to care about assets re legal side of things. |
| 17:03.16 | freemangordon | Estel_: sure |
| 17:03.20 | Estel_ | without knowledge about technical - where I agree with you - they make bad decisions |
| 17:03.54 | Estel_ | hoever if they trust Council and make something wrong legally, due to this, they answer to the law themselves, not council |
| 17:04.06 | freemangordon | Estel_: IMO you can't put in by-laws, that technical s**t belongs to the council only |
| 17:04.14 | Estel_ | we need to have same people KNOW technical side, and be responsible by the law, at the same time |
| 17:04.48 | Estel_ | no, as if you're not the one answering to the law yourself, you tend to stretch legal things to practical side, ignoring the law a little |
| 17:05.13 | *** join/#maemo rcg (~rcg@2a02:908:e252:e101:d1fa:c05b:37d3:6d29) |
| 17:05.13 | is_null | maybe there needs to be a pirate repo ? |
| 17:05.13 | Estel_ | without feeling legal responsibility on You, yet knowing technical side well, equilibrium between the two can't be maintained, IMHO |
| 17:05.40 | freemangordon | Estel_: I guess this is what Rob tries to achieve with woody and jim - having technical knowledge in HiFo |
| 17:06.01 | Estel_ | and maybe it is not bad idea, although idk who jim is |
| 17:06.01 | sixwheeledbeast | Estel_: council and board relations should be strong with at least weekly updates, atm this seems not the case |
| 17:06.08 | Estel_ | agreed. |
| 17:06.12 | freemangordon | +1 |
| 17:06.42 | Estel_ | I just thing that at least head of admin staff - DocScrutinizer05 currently? should be member of hifo too, to feel legal responsibility on him |
| 17:06.51 | Estel_ | (no matter who it will be in future) |
| 17:06.57 | thedead1440 | would the problems have arosen if the BoD were present at the Council meetings? I don't think so; maybe they would be solved in the meeting itself |
| 17:07.03 | thedead1440 | arisen* |
| 17:07.22 | Estel_ | well, I warned that meeting once a 3 months as in statuite (or smth like that) is bad |
| 17:07.33 | Estel_ | at times of bylaws creation ;) |
| 17:07.37 | thedead1440 | Friday's meeting had a disagreement and solved within the meeting; that's how things should be |
| 17:07.44 | Estel_ | in digital world, 3 months is age |
| 17:07.53 | freemangordon | Estel_: in "normal" times that may work |
| 17:08.14 | Estel_ | ,maybe, but no one know when normal times end |
| 17:08.28 | freemangordon | nothing is stopping HiFo and council to have 2 ,eetings per day :) |
| 17:08.43 | Estel_ | lack of responsibility of doing so is blocking it ;) |
| 17:09.21 | thedead1440 | if your own individual responsibility can't bring you to attend meetings but to stand behind statues then you are not the right person to be volunteering |
| 17:09.26 | Estel_ | also, there really would be better communication between legal<->tech, if head of tech would be hifo member too, one signing his name under papers and being legally rewponsible to the law, if something is fucked |
| 17:09.33 | freemangordon | Estel_: ivgalvez (no matter what your personal opinion re him is) was on maemo-meeting almost every time AFAIK |
| 17:09.44 | Estel_ | freemangordon, absolutely agreed. |
| 17:10.12 | Estel_ | but he had vague understanding of law, and was rather like unofficial council member, tghan hifo one, in practice :P |
| 17:10.26 | thedead1440 | freemangordon: i'll disagree; actually the past few months he was missing more than present. |
| 17:10.33 | Estel_ | thats right too |
| 17:10.43 | Estel_ | fmg meant first part of cadence |
| 17:10.45 | freemangordon | thedead1440: he had some real-life troubles |
| 17:11.03 | thedead1440 | yup |
| 17:11.11 | Estel_ | the problem is that in deceased hifo, despite having 3 members, only rob signed papers |
| 17:11.11 | freemangordon | iirc he was in hospital for a couple of weeks, changed home, work, etc |
| 17:11.19 | Estel_ | and law would be only on his ass if problems arise |
| 17:11.38 | Estel_ | so he was too cautios, where other parts (tech staff) were exactly at opposite extreme |
| 17:11.49 | freemangordon | thedead1440: sometimes shit happens, you know :) |
| 17:12.10 | Estel_ | to maintain balance, head of tech staff need o be legally responsible as foundation head (one of) too, IMO, again |
| 17:12.14 | thedead1440 | freemangordon: indeed and its best to find ways to clean it up instead of crying like a broken record |
| 17:12.43 | Estel_ | well, that is almost insultive, especially that I've already repeated 3 times a quite constructive proposition ;) |
| 17:13.01 | Estel_ | agree or not, but don't call it crying, please. |
| 17:13.18 | *** join/#maemo FlameReaper-PC (~FR@203.106.65.1) |
| 17:13.25 | freemangordon | thedead1440: you got me wrong - I meant that I wouldn;t blame ivgalez' absence in the light of his real-life events |
| 17:14.30 | thedead1440 | freemangordon: i understand; i meant that things happen even if one was wronged minorly its best to propose suggestions for way forward instead of repeating how one was wronged at every available opportunity and i'm thankful finally Estel is doing the same |
| 17:15.18 | freemangordon | thedead1440: ooh, I see, sorry to interrupt :P |
| 17:15.21 | thedead1440 | Estel_: I actually think Doc has taken liability too or maybe not; i remember this being discussed |
| 17:15.40 | Estel_ | if you would read my opoinions more carefully, instead of relying on "well known facts" (aka bullshit), you would notice earlier, that I proposed it ages ago :P |
| 17:16.08 | thedead1440 | He is the maemo administrator so he has taken legal liability; not too sure but i'm very sure reading something about this |
| 17:16.17 | Estel_ | thedead1440, nope, no formal bounds with foundation, at least for being responsible for hifo decisions |
| 17:16.23 | Estel_ | you need to be part of board for that |
| 17:16.37 | Estel_ | board make decisions as one body |
| 17:17.01 | Estel_ | every board members is equally responsible for decisions made by board about foundation |
| 17:17.07 | thedead1440 | not compulsorily; BoD can appoint a tech person who is responsible in the event of technical side of things going wrong |
| 17:17.27 | Estel_ | responsible to who? not to the law, unless statute get changed |
| 17:17.33 | thedead1440 | things going wrong == legal liability |
| 17:18.01 | Estel_ | he si responsible for stealing etc, but as said, IMO, to really have good balance and communication, tech head should be full privileged member of board |
| 17:18.12 | thedead1440 | Doc had proposed taking legal liability for the IPHH move too when he wanted things sped up so I don't see him avoiding it |
| 17:18.17 | Estel_ | thus having both impact and liability about board *every* decision |
| 17:18.27 | Estel_ | I don't said he avoid it |
| 17:18.41 | thedead1440 | DocScrutinizer05: you want to share if you have any legal liability as maemo administrator? |
| 17:19.10 | teotwaki | hi all |
| 17:19.14 | thedead1440 | Also if we remember Doc was supposed to be a HiFo candidate ;) |
| 17:19.18 | teotwaki | sorry to barge in, but, legal liability for what, exactly? |
| 17:19.35 | Estel_ | I don't know who is candidating to hifo, but if he is, I would certainly vote for him. |
| 17:20.11 | Estel_ | unless he state that becoming board member = his resigning for being head of tech staff, as it would be counter-productive to what I think about equilibrium in responsibilities |
| 17:20.22 | thedead1440 | Estel_: he was the candidate and was taken off; few events leading to it but useless going back there |
| 17:20.31 | Estel_ | ah, that thing |
| 17:20.35 | Estel_ | know about it ;) |
| 17:20.40 | Estel_ | I mean upcoming election |
| 17:21.04 | thedead1440 | I don't know if he has decided on upcoming election; ask him :) |
| 17:21.45 | Estel_ | why should I, I'm not interested in Maemo politics, just using my democrathic right to bitch about things being wrong, without taking part in it :P |
| 17:21.59 | teotwaki | hello? |
| 17:22.06 | Estel_ | vote for, not against, stand aside - me is at 3th Option ;) |
| 17:22.14 | thedead1440 | teotwaki: legal liability as BoD of HiFo |
| 17:22.16 | Estel_ | s/not/for/ |
| 17:22.24 | Estel_ | ~useless |
| 17:22.24 | infobot | ACTION starts crying and hides from estel_ in the darkest corner of the room. :( |
| 17:22.47 | teotwaki | erhm, you suck at regex, is all, Estel_, infobot isn't useless |
| 17:22.57 | teotwaki | thedead1440: yeah, but legal liability for what? |
| 17:23.14 | Estel_ | for everytime teotwaki abuses chanop to kill a kitten |
| 17:23.27 | thedead1440 | legal liability for anything. If you are a BoD you are legally liable for your actions. |
| 17:24.00 | thedead1440 | Estel was more broadly speaking about Rob being a lawyer and worried about legal matters hence his reluctance to speed things up as required by Council |
| 17:24.30 | thedead1440 | so he was saying both bodies should be merged or the tech person should be a BoD too so that he is legally responsible for his own actions |
| 17:24.40 | teotwaki | Estel_: worst part in your statement is it actually made me think how I could kill a kitten with #maemo chanop... |
| 17:24.48 | thedead1440 | lol |
| 17:25.05 | freemangordon | hehe |
| 17:26.00 | teotwaki | BoD? |
| 17:26.08 | teotwaki | In IRC terms, that's "Beginning of Day". |
| 17:26.10 | thedead1440 | Board of Director |
| 17:26.20 | teotwaki | what does that even mean? |
| 17:26.23 | thedead1440 | i thought IRC has no day no night |
| 17:26.30 | teotwaki | no, IRC has UTG |
| 17:26.35 | teotwaki | UGT, sorry |
| 17:26.36 | teotwaki | ~UGT |
| 17:26.36 | infobot | hmm... ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html |
| 17:26.41 | *** join/#maemo xes (~xes@unaffiliated/xes) |
| 17:26.54 | thedead1440 | ah it was that thing |
| 17:27.07 | thedead1440 | teotwaki: Board of Director of Hildon Foundation |
| 17:27.22 | teotwaki | yeah, except the term "board of director" doesn't mean anything in English. |
| 17:27.26 | teotwaki | You can't be a board of one. |
| 17:27.39 | teotwaki | You can be the Board Director |
| 17:27.44 | teotwaki | You can be part of the Board of Directors |
| 17:27.49 | teotwaki | You can't be "a" Board of Director. |
| 17:27.55 | thedead1440 | yes sir |
| 17:28.04 | thedead1440 | my English took off for a toss ;) |
| 17:28.14 | teotwaki | so which one is it? |
| 17:28.25 | thedead1440 | part of the Board |
| 17:28.34 | teotwaki | ah |
| 17:28.34 | teotwaki | ok |
| 17:28.53 | teotwaki | so would only one person be liable? |
| 17:28.57 | teotwaki | Or the whole Board? |
| 17:29.59 | Estel_ | whole. |
| 17:30.09 | Estel_ | problem is, DocScrutinizer05 isn't part of board |
| 17:30.09 | teotwaki | ok |
| 17:30.13 | Estel_ | ;) |
| 17:30.15 | teotwaki | know, liability for what? |
| 17:30.18 | Estel_ | and he i tech staff |
| 17:30.25 | Estel_ | for every decisions of foundation |
| 17:30.26 | teotwaki | s/k/// |
| 17:30.35 | Estel_ | to maintain equilibrium |
| 17:30.43 | Estel_ | doc or any furtherr head of tech staff |
| 17:30.53 | thedead1440 | regrets being part of the discussion; missed 1st half of manutd's game :/ |
| 17:31.00 | Estel_ | I *assume* that head of tech staff would have good relationship with other techs |
| 17:31.08 | Estel_ | so no war between tech staff and head of tech |
| 17:31.11 | teotwaki | thedead1440: it's a shit game |
| 17:31.32 | Estel_ | teotwaki, see? everyone have own priorities ;) |
| 17:31.34 | thedead1440 | you mean the sport is shit or the current match is shit? the 2 goals have been brilliant though ;) |
| 17:31.46 | Estel_ | s/teotwaki/thedead1440 / |
| 17:32.14 | teotwaki | thedead1440: chelsea is looking like a bunch of nancies trying to understand which goal is theirs. |
| 17:32.18 | thedead1440 | Estel_: I fail to get your point. |
| 17:32.34 | Estel_ | joking about regretting being part of discussion. |
| 17:32.45 | thedead1440 | teotwaki: as long as they have the fat spanish waiter in-charge it won't change :D |
| 17:32.52 | thedead1440 | Estel_: lol |
| 17:33.14 | teotwaki | some of them are running with their eyes squinting; they kind of remind of of GW Bush trying to constantly remember his own name. |
| 17:33.26 | thedead1440 | haha |
| 17:33.52 | Estel_ | okp now going to heck wth my n900 was charging another N900 @ 500 mA, if 200 mA should be limit |
| 17:34.00 | Estel_ | freemangordon, you may get interested in this :P |
| 17:34.03 | thedead1440 | i assume you are a chelsea fan teotwaki? |
| 17:34.14 | teotwaki | thedead1440: nope, I hate football. |
| 17:34.44 | Estel_ | later, folks. |
| 17:34.48 | thedead1440 | one of those people who hates football but keeps watching the matches? |
| 17:34.49 | teotwaki | 'later |
| 17:34.53 | thedead1440 | later Estel_ |
| 17:34.57 | teotwaki | Estel_: hey, for once I didn't kick you out of the channel! |
| 17:34.59 | teotwaki | Hip hip! |
| 17:35.01 | thedead1440 | haha |
| 17:36.09 | teotwaki | thedead1440: nha, it's just that we got this massive 60" display at the office |
| 17:36.19 | teotwaki | thedead1440: and frankly I wanted to see how good the image quality would be. |
| 17:36.27 | thedead1440 | ah |
| 17:37.44 | sixwheeledbeast | put something decent on then... |
| 17:37.58 | *** join/#maemo BCMM (~user@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 17:42.59 | thedead1440 | stupid manutd not making the pressure count; if it goes to 2-1 its a draw |
| 17:58.07 | sixwheeledbeast | thedead1440: you where saying :p |
| 17:58.15 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: yup :( |
| 17:59.37 | sixwheeledbeast | lol |
| 18:07.55 | *** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@91-64-221-58-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 18:07.55 | *** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@redhat/pcfe) |
| 18:14.20 | is_null | how many gigs to make a repository mirror ? i have a 1Gbps server but only around 80G to spare .. |
| 18:14.52 | is_null | i feel like torturing the main repo server downloading at 32kbps |
| 18:15.05 | *** part/#maemo Noma (arponen@hilla.kapsi.fi) |
| 18:15.18 | thedead1440 | is_null: iirc rmo itself is ~300GB |
| 18:15.27 | kerio | is_null: there's mirrors, anyway |
| 18:15.36 | kerio | they're still outdated though, i think |
| 18:15.53 | is_null | thanks, too big for me |
| 18:15.59 | thedead1440 | outdated? |
| 18:16.09 | kerio | thedead1440: compared to the new rmo |
| 18:16.28 | thedead1440 | i think yeah by 1 or 2 packages that were uploaded to test new |
| 18:17.00 | thedead1440 | also rmo doesn't have latest CSSU releases iirc ;) |
| 18:17.18 | thedead1440 | merlin has them and skeiron synced those from merlin |
| 18:18.57 | is_null | is this something i should report ? Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/i/irwi/irwi_0.2-9_armel.deb Hash Sum mismatch |
| 18:19.31 | thedead1440 | known issue in old; solved in new rmo |
| 18:19.52 | is_null | what's the new rmo ? |
| 18:20.02 | thedead1440 | ~rmo-new |
| 18:20.02 | infobot | rumour has it, rmo-new is do `echo 213.128.137.22 repository.maemo.org >>/etc/hosts` on your N900, as root, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1327342#post1327342 |
| 18:20.09 | is_null | ah thanks !! |
| 18:21.14 | qwazix | Estel_, just read the backlog. I'm not a lawyer but I believe that you don't have to be in BoD to have legal responsibility, otherwise all corpos would have the techstaff on BoD. By being appointed techstaff you accept responsibility. If somebody will hold you accountable in case of disaster is another question. |
| 18:24.30 | thedead1440 | sixwheeledbeast: draw full-time :( |
| 18:26.52 | is_null | what about those ? W: GPG error: https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com ./ Release: The following signatures were invalid: KEYEXPIRED 1349249546 KEYEXPIRED 1349249546 KEYEXPIRED 1349249546 |
| 18:26.54 | *** join/#maemo kamtar (59cbd201@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.203.210.1) |
| 18:27.02 | thedead1440 | is_null: ignore it... |
| 18:27.07 | is_null | nothing we can do against KEYEXPIRED and nokia not changing keys right ? |
| 18:27.08 | is_null | ok |
| 18:29.15 | kamtar | have anyone link for compiled uvc drivers module? (N810 kernel 2.6.21) |
| 18:41.43 | freemangordon | qwazix: hi. anything new re browsers :) |
| 18:42.20 | freemangordon | qwazix: BTW (in case you've missed it) I found what is the problem with webgl |
| 18:42.46 | qwazix | freemangordon, I saw it. The power of 2 thingie |
| 18:43.06 | freemangordon | now we only need a fix. And higher fps on html5 videos and we should be ready to go life :D |
| 18:43.11 | *** join/#maemo FReaper-PC (~FR@203.106.65.1) |
| 18:43.51 | qwazix | I didn't manage to work on it this weekend, I'll try my best to work on it during the week |
| 18:44.07 | qwazix | Fortunately next weekend is long one :) |
| 18:45.34 | *** join/#maemo Kilroo (~Kilroo@cpe-065-188-184-047.triad.res.rr.com) |
| 18:47.13 | freemangordon | qwazix: np, xulrunner is not ready either |
| 18:47.15 | freemangordon | :) |
| 18:49.06 | qwazix | :nod: |
| 18:49.20 | XDS2010 | sold my n900 :( |
| 18:49.28 | XDS2010 | got 175 |
| 18:49.37 | freemangordon | euros? |
| 18:49.42 | XDS2010 | it was in mint condition with A/V cables |
| 18:49.48 | XDS2010 | dollars |
| 18:49.51 | freemangordon | aah |
| 18:49.58 | XDS2010 | the guy got his moneys worth |
| 18:50.20 | freemangordon | well, you won't enjoy ff22 then :P |
| 18:50.29 | XDS2010 | wtf is ff22 ? |
| 18:50.36 | freemangordon | firefox 22 |
| 18:50.52 | XDS2010 | fuck that |
| 18:51.01 | freemangordon | ok |
| 18:51.05 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (~bef0rd@unaffiliated/beford) |
| 18:51.05 | XDS2010 | ill get that shit on my n1 |
| 18:51.12 | freemangordon | goes having sex |
| 18:51.22 | XDS2010 | :P |
| 18:51.35 | XDS2010 | have fun! |
| 18:53.50 | XDS2010 | guys you gotta check out this concept |
| 18:53.52 | XDS2010 | http://www.core77.com/blog/transportation/rana_2_visions_of_an_electric_motorcycle_future_from_frog_22111.asp |
| 18:54.25 | XDS2010 | i thought this was fantastically done. the bike design is a little odd but the concept is just freakin fantastic |
| 18:55.05 | teotwaki | XDS2010: that looks horrendous to drive. |
| 18:55.16 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: yep! |
| 18:55.38 | XDS2010 | but the HUD on the pavement idea is freakin fantastic ! |
| 18:55.52 | teotwaki | erhm, no it don't. |
| 18:55.53 | XDS2010 | the bike design is ugly as hell |
| 18:56.01 | XDS2010 | r u serious ?! |
| 18:56.06 | teotwaki | yeah, that's horrible |
| 18:56.11 | XDS2010 | why !? |
| 18:56.12 | teotwaki | you're not a biker, are you? |
| 18:56.29 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: not really. my uncle is in motorcross |
| 18:56.42 | teotwaki | yeah, but that's why you think it's cool. |
| 18:57.00 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: i've ridden before |
| 18:57.07 | XDS2010 | whats the big deal ? |
| 18:57.11 | teotwaki | when you ride a bike on the road, you have to pay attention to every little detail in the road |
| 18:57.23 | qwazix | I don't want everybody in the street knowing that I have a text from Becky! |
| 18:57.37 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: thats why the HUD is optionally turned on and off |
| 18:57.49 | teotwaki | having lights that distract you, and prevent your eyes from picking up on the smallest detail can be lethal. |
| 18:58.06 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: omg i know ! |
| 18:58.21 | XDS2010 | ive wiped out before it freakin sucked |
| 18:58.30 | XDS2010 | went right into a tree |
| 18:58.36 | teotwaki | Second, anyone who designs a motorbike system with audio support ("Now playing The Pixies") doesn't ride motorbikes. |
| 18:58.55 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: well i think that part was/is for show |
| 18:59.11 | XDS2010 | qwazix: same to you ^^^^^ |
| 18:59.26 | qwazix | just joking :) |
| 18:59.34 | XDS2010 | ah :) |
| 18:59.44 | teotwaki | Third, as soon as you take a bend, the rider moves around on the bike. Basically, as you're moving around all the time, your FoV is going to be limited. |
| 18:59.59 | teotwaki | I definitely don't want to have to move my head to look for vital information in a bend. |
| 19:00.42 | sixwheeledbeast | teotwaki: agreed on all things bike related |
| 19:00.56 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: i get your point. but with stuff like accelerometers i think all that stuff can be fine tuned |
| 19:01.06 | teotwaki | Yeah, all that stuff isn't needed |
| 19:01.10 | teotwaki | it's gimmickery |
| 19:01.20 | teotwaki | it will make bike prices go up, for no good reason. |
| 19:01.26 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: even f16's have a HUD |
| 19:01.36 | *** join/#maemo Snafu777 (~Snafu777@unaffiliated/snafu777) |
| 19:01.51 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: have you ever flown in a f16 ? |
| 19:02.02 | teotwaki | Yeah, well, ping me next time you see an F16 HUD that displays your facebook updates, right? |
| 19:02.17 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: THEY CAN DO IT! |
| 19:02.20 | XDS2010 | omg |
| 19:02.22 | XDS2010 | dude |
| 19:02.29 | teotwaki | oh fuck off you idiot |
| 19:02.31 | sixwheeledbeast | XDS2010: less trees to hit in the sky! |
| 19:02.32 | XDS2010 | flex 900 mhz |
| 19:02.57 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: all f16's have a txt system built into the HUD |
| 19:03.00 | Snafu777 | Does anyone know how to turn off power management for the wifi nic? I've tried iwconfig, but to no avail |
| 19:03.27 | Snafu777 | Or what file the setting might be located in? /etc/pm does not exist |
| 19:03.34 | XDS2010 | sixwheeledbeast: it was unkind :) |
| 19:03.44 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: what do you drive ? |
| 19:03.45 | sixwheeledbeast | Snafu777: power saving for wifi? |
| 19:03.54 | Snafu777 | This is forcing my soft access point to drop at 5 mins exactly |
| 19:03.56 | Snafu777 | Yes |
| 19:04.02 | XDS2010 | < 99 kawasaki |
| 19:04.02 | Snafu777 | How can I disable it? |
| 19:04.06 | sixwheeledbeast | XDS2010: it's true |
| 19:04.20 | Snafu777 | I've tried iwconfig |
| 19:04.24 | XDS2010 | sixwheeledbeast: i know im saying the time i wiped out was dumb |
| 19:04.24 | Snafu777 | No luck |
| 19:04.31 | Estel_ | qwazix, rightp but real legal liability require signed papers |
| 19:04.49 | sixwheeledbeast | Snafu777: Settings > Internet Connections > foo-network > Advanced |
| 19:05.05 | Snafu777 | Hmm |
| 19:05.14 | Snafu777 | I'm using airbase-ng though |
| 19:05.16 | Estel_ | maemo head of tech staff haven't signed any papers. + I don't mean it for case of wrong doing |
| 19:05.27 | Estel_ | I mean feeling responsible for all board decisions |
| 19:05.43 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: not all future motorbikes are going to be fully hydrolic / engine based. I wish i could change your mentality here. As someone with many uncles that have driven in motorcross |
| 19:05.47 | Estel_ | instead of b**** about board being cautious, when its not your neck that goverment lawyers will twist |
| 19:05.53 | sixwheeledbeast | XDS2010: I am saying you have time to glance at a HUD in the sky |
| 19:06.04 | teotwaki | XDS2010: I have a 2010 CBF 125 for commuting, an 2010 F800GS for trips and a 2012 street triple r. Also, I ordered a GT86 last week. |
| 19:06.13 | kerio | i have a bus card :3 |
| 19:06.36 | XDS2010 | sixwheeledbeast: i was a loadmaster i know the capabilities of a f16 quite well. You. Have. No. Time. |
| 19:06.57 | XDS2010 | sixwheeledbeast: 101 ANG |
| 19:06.58 | Estel_ | or, another extreme like with rob, being too cautious, due to not knhowing technical side almost at all |
| 19:07.02 | *** join/#maemo Martix (~martix@4.177.broadband3.iol.cz) |
| 19:07.04 | Snafu777 | Is there a way to turn off power management on the wifi nic without joining the network? |
| 19:07.26 | Snafu777 | Or do u know what file that te advanced section references? |
| 19:07.27 | sixwheeledbeast | XDS2010: and your saying bikers have time? |
| 19:07.45 | XDS2010 | sixwheeledbeast: experiences ones who know what the fuck they are doing |
| 19:07.49 | teotwaki | XDS2010: and F16 pilots are trained for ages before they get put in a dangerous situation. If you have the flu, you don't fly. If you're mentally unstable, you don't fly. If you get a call saying your kid was hit by a drunk driver, you're going to take that bike in the worst possible conditions. |
| 19:08.16 | XDS2010 | " " |
| 19:08.31 | sixwheeledbeast | teotwaki: exactly |
| 19:08.41 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: " " |
| 19:08.58 | XDS2010 | Wipeouts suck |
| 19:09.12 | XDS2010 | Been in them. Seen them happen. They suck |
| 19:09.39 | teotwaki | XDS2010: basically, you're a 12 year old kid who just got a boner because of what he saw on some pictures. You're the same kid who wet his pants when Steve Jobs showed you a big ole' resized iPhone and called it an iPad. You're going for hype, no more, no less. |
| 19:09.49 | Snafu777 | Anybody know? Trying to flush a serious bug out.... |
| 19:10.05 | XDS2010 | But when you are on the highway and you have time to react with no other vehicles around this becomes helpful |
| 19:10.12 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: try 31 |
| 19:10.19 | teotwaki | yeah, but it's a gimmick, nonetheless. |
| 19:10.32 | XDS2010 | tomato |
| 19:10.37 | teotwaki | I put that shit in the same drawer as idiots who buy a hummer when they live in LA. |
| 19:10.53 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: hummers are dumb |
| 19:10.59 | XDS2010 | agree with you there |
| 19:11.16 | teotwaki | It's trying to compensate for some of your physical complexes, it's like putting a massive leovince exhaust on a 125cc bike. |
| 19:11.29 | teotwaki | You don't look like, people just know your girlfriend laughed when you undressed. |
| 19:11.38 | teotwaki | s/like/cool/ |
| 19:11.55 | XDS2010 | teotwaki: -.- my word man. tell me what you think about google glass ? does that suck too ? |
| 19:12.12 | freemangordon | WTF is google glass? |
| 19:12.20 | XDS2010 | o.O |
| 19:12.27 | Snafu777 | Hah, got it. I know u fuckers don't care about hacking with yet damn n900, but heck yeah, I got it |
| 19:12.28 | teotwaki | freemangordon: get out of your rock |
| 19:12.34 | XDS2010 | freemangordon: been under a rock ? |
| 19:12.35 | teotwaki | ~google project glass |
| 19:12.36 | Snafu777 | If anyone wants the trick let me know |
| 19:12.40 | Snafu777 | Fuckers... |
| 19:12.45 | XDS2010 | !g google glass |
| 19:12.45 | kerio | freemangordon: glasses with voice controls and a fancy video ad that will probably not resemble reality |
| 19:12.54 | freemangordon | oh |
| 19:13.03 | teotwaki | ~search google project glass |
| 19:13.05 | freemangordon | I am too old for this shit |
| 19:13.08 | kerio | well, voice controls, a hud, a videocamera and a mic |
| 19:13.11 | teotwaki | infobot: you useless PoS |
| 19:13.14 | sixwheeledbeast | XDS2010: helpful possibly, distracting definitely |
| 19:13.46 | XDS2010 | hell im still waiting for the day when the HUD is implanted in our brain eye sockets :) |
| 19:13.53 | freemangordon | so, now google reinvents virtual reality. how sweet |
| 19:14.03 | sixwheeledbeast | Snafu777: do share |
| 19:14.18 | teotwaki | what's a brain eye socket? |
| 19:14.22 | XDS2010 | freemangordon: where you being serious ? you really dont know what google glass is ? |
| 19:14.27 | Snafu777 | Well hang on, I turned the stupid thing off |
| 19:14.28 | XDS2010 | eye sockets* |
| 19:14.40 | Snafu777 | Now it's time to see if that stopped my issue |
| 19:14.46 | freemangordon | XDS2010: ever seen me joking? |
| 19:14.57 | Snafu777 | I have to wait exactly 5 minutes |
| 19:15.11 | XDS2010 | freemangordon: http://www.google.com/glass/start/ |
| 19:15.11 | teotwaki | freemangordon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9c6W4CCU9M4 |
| 19:15.26 | freemangordon | thanks, will check it out |
| 19:15.32 | XDS2010 | http://www.gizmag.com/sportiiiis-hud-for-athletes/20248/ < like gg but available NOW |
| 19:15.57 | XDS2010 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFn2vJzy3Wc&feature=player_embedded |
| 19:16.05 | XDS2010 | ill be buying these soon |
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| 19:19.52 | sixwheeledbeast | I dont see the benifit over wristwatch type TBH |
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| 19:23.26 | kerio | sixwheeledbeast: for instance, you don't have to use a wristwatch |
| 19:26.37 | XDS2010 | keri.. freemangord.. sixwheeledbea.. what i'm sad about here however is that conventional watches might take a back burner even more than they already are because of smartphones etc. I would truly rather have a subaqua noma III on my wrist than a iphone in my pocket |
| 19:27.07 | XDS2010 | people just don't realize the benefit of a great well designed automatic watch |
| 19:27.28 | kerio | what about the penalties? |
| 19:27.35 | kerio | for instance, no NTP |
| 19:27.53 | XDS2010 | and no DST too |
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| 19:28.01 | XDS2010 | so who cares |
| 19:28.08 | XDS2010 | shrugs |
| 19:28.45 | kerio | cares about the handful-of-seconds discrepancies |
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| 19:30.09 | sixwheeledbeast | has never seen the point of a wrist watch eithier, or worn one. |
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| 19:35.48 | GeneralAntilles | sixwheeledbeast, you must not need to follow a schedule very often |
| 19:35.59 | GeneralAntilles | and obviously have never seen a Bluetooth watch. |
| 19:36.59 | sixwheeledbeast | uses calender app for all scheduled events |
| 19:39.32 | sixwheeledbeast | he also drives a van a lot which has the clock on the dash |
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| 20:20.48 | teotwaki | sixwheeledbeast: I can see myself using Google Glass, if it weren't for all the blaring privacy issues I'm uncomfortable with. |
| 20:20.57 | teotwaki | GeneralAntilles: I know you'd be a bitch for Google Glass. |
| 20:21.29 | GeneralAntilles | It kinda terrifies me, actually |
| 20:21.31 | GeneralAntilles | It's too connected |
| 20:21.54 | teotwaki | I just have two problems with Google Glass. |
| 20:22.01 | teotwaki | 1- Where is the fucking battery. |
| 20:22.07 | teotwaki | 2- Where are the fucking antennas. |
| 20:22.31 | teotwaki | Because, if the antennas are in the glasses' branches, that means your head becomes a frying pan for microwaves. |
| 20:22.35 | GeneralAntilles | At least I have to shift my attention to see a watch or look at a phone |
| 20:22.36 | GeneralAntilles | The glasses are RIGHT THERE all day |
| 20:22.36 | GeneralAntilles | Scary |
| 20:22.36 | GeneralAntilles | I'm disconnected from life enough. :D |
| 20:23.14 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe |
| 20:23.39 | GeneralAntilles | I can't imagine it sucks more juice than a smart watch |
| 20:23.50 | teotwaki | Well, if it's recording 1080p video |
| 20:24.07 | teotwaki | and transmitting that in real time to the interwebs |
| 20:24.31 | sixwheeledbeast | where is the storage, cloud? |
| 20:24.58 | teotwaki | On Friday, the IT manager came to my office, showing his laptop streaming video that his S3 was capturing, with minimal delay |
| 20:26.05 | teotwaki | My answer was something along the lines of "That's nice, we did that back in 2008. On a single-core with the power of a post-epileptic-fit anaemic hamster" |
| 20:26.36 | teotwaki | I've become the cliché of a unix sysadmin, haven't I? |
| 20:26.50 | teotwaki | yells GET OFF MY LAWN. |
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| 20:33.49 | GeneralAntilles | teotwaki, ah, didn't realize it'll do video |
| 20:33.49 | GeneralAntilles | Hmm |
| 20:34.05 | GeneralAntilles | I'm distancing myself from all of the Google shit |
| 20:34.31 | teotwaki | I'm getting one of the cheap chinese galaxy note clones tomorrow or Tuesday |
| 20:34.37 | teotwaki | Company wants me to stress test it |
| 20:34.54 | teotwaki | I don't know what I'm scared about |
| 20:35.02 | teotwaki | that I'll love the form factor and buy a note 2 |
| 20:35.11 | teotwaki | that the chinese government now knows my passwords |
| 20:35.21 | teotwaki | or that google knows when I sit down for a crap. |
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| 20:37.57 | GeneralAntilles | Note formfactor looks nice |
| 20:38.04 | GeneralAntilles | I suspect that's where phones are headed |
| 20:38.34 | GeneralAntilles | Part of the reason tablets are so goddamn popular is the old person factor |
| 20:38.46 | GeneralAntilles | they can't see any of the 3.5"-4.5" screens. |
| 20:39.35 | teotwaki | Well, I used a few notes for a while |
| 20:39.42 | teotwaki | mostly without the pen, though it's a nice addition |
| 20:39.50 | teotwaki | and it makes sense |
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| 20:40.00 | teotwaki | I don't understand much of Android, so I'm not going to criticise over that |
| 20:40.14 | teotwaki | but it felt solid in hand, not toy-y or plastic-y. |
| 20:40.30 | teotwaki | Though, the Galaxy S4 is starting to get ridiculous |
| 20:40.40 | teotwaki | octocore CPU in a phone, really? |
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| 20:41.43 | kaawee_ | Hello! Does anybody use hardware AES encryption on the N900? |
| 20:41.59 | sixwheeledbeast | clarkson theory = power!!!. what happened to efficient coding? |
| 20:43.09 | GeneralAntilles | Android is bloated shit |
| 20:43.18 | GeneralAntilles | I can't stand using it. |
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| 21:06.34 | sixwheeledbeast | ~mirrors |
| 21:06.35 | infobot | hmm... mirror is http://maemo-archive.wedrop.it/ http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1315143#post1315143 http://maemo.merlin1991.at/apt-mirror/, or extras-devel.merlin1991.at - for fighting hashsum error, or see ~rmo-new |
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| 21:37.59 | Vlad_on_the_road | hi there |
| 21:38.17 | Vlad_on_the_road | does anyone could help me setting up scratchbox+thumb toolchain plz ? |
| 21:38.29 | Vlad_on_the_road | i am following wiki : http://wiki.maemo.org/CSSU-thumb_toolchain_setup_%28gcc4.7.2-linaro%29 |
| 21:39.05 | Vlad_on_the_road | but i am facing a problem when it comes to do the first apt-get upgrade |
| 21:39.26 | Vlad_on_the_road | I get a load of unmet dependencies |
| 21:39.46 | Vlad_on_the_road | like "libosso-abook-dev: Depends: libgalago-dev but it is not installable" |
| 21:40.36 | Vlad_on_the_road | i think it's due to the fact I couldn't install nokia binaries using the given command line "fakeroot apt-get install nokia-binaries nokia-apps" |
| 21:41.44 | Vlad_on_the_road | to bypass this I went to the skeiron repos and installed all the debs in "Maemo_Dev_Platform_Nokia_Binaries_v2.0.tar.gz", "Maemo_Dev_Platform_rootfs_Nokia_Binaries_v2.2.tar.gz" and "Maemo_Dev_Platform_rootstrap_Nokia_Binaries_v2.2.tar.gz " |
| 21:41.57 | Vlad_on_the_road | but not sure it did the trick |
| 21:42.35 | Vlad_on_the_road | any idea where it's wrong ? |
| 21:43.51 | Vlad_on_the_road | might be my sources.list missing a repo I guess...but i can't figure which one... |
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| 22:17.35 | Vlad_on_the_road | hmm nevermind, started from scratch, didn't bother to install the nokia binaries and now i got to stage where thumb is installing |
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| 22:41.57 | is_null | hi all, would you recommend pyside over nokia's recommendation of pyqt ? http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Getting_started_with_PyQt_for_Maemo |
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| 22:57.20 | merlin1991 | pyside > pyqt |
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