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| 07:57.30 | fruct | Who know - how to set dmesg to booting on n900? |
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| 08:26.03 | chem|st | DocScrutinizer05: nope |
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| 10:28.31 | jonwil | yay, my N900 is finally fixed :) |
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| 10:38.09 | zsolt | hello |
| 10:38.18 | zsolt | my custom kernel cant boot |
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| 11:59.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | stardiviner: install bash4, look at |
| 11:59.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~jrtools |
| 11:59.49 | infobot | rumour has it, jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools |
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| 12:02.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~tell stardiviner about messybox |
| 12:05.50 | stardiviner | DocScrutinizer05: thanks |
| 12:06.11 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: hm, differences between bash and bash4? |
| 12:06.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | see changelog |
| 12:07.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think mainly background processes in scripts |
| 12:07.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | help coproc |
| 12:08.24 | kerio | meh |
| 12:08.32 | kerio | i'm fine with bash (3) on my n900 |
| 12:08.46 | kerio | and my laptop, too |
| 12:09.05 | kerio | my debian sid server has bash4 though |
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| 12:29.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: actually my N900 also has bash3 |
| 12:31.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | and t900 even still has 2.05b.0(1)-release |
| 12:31.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | which still has proper help, unlike the 3.2.33(2)-release on IroN900 |
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| 13:48.39 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: yeah, the lack of help kinda sucks :c |
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| 14:12.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: I pondered preparing a dead simple shellscript executable named "help" |
| 14:13.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | just lacking input which I had to pick somewhere from sourcecode I guess |
| 14:14.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | (I don't think recycling help output from bash2 is a smart idea) |
| 14:14.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | NFC who thought it's clever to leave help out of bash3 build :-( |
| 14:16.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, save 5k helptext string consts in bash3, while bloating busybox-power by 500k. After all bash can happily live on /opt while busybox has TB to waste on / |
| 14:16.11 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: it's to save rootfs space! :D |
| 14:16.26 | kerio | besides, is bash optified? |
| 14:16.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | it should |
| 14:16.36 | kerio | (and bash4 does indeed have help) |
| 14:16.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc if it is |
| 14:16.45 | kerio | (and it's not optified) |
| 14:16.52 | kerio | (the help files are in /usr/share/bash) |
| 14:16.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, you always can optify manually |
| 14:17.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | we got even tools for that |
| 14:17.16 | kerio | and screw over dpkg in the process? |
| 14:17.58 | teotwaki | kerio: it doesn't really matter, I seem to remember it uses hardlinks, so dpkg doesn't notice. |
| 14:18.07 | kerio | >hardlinks |
| 14:18.09 | kerio | >over filesystems |
| 14:18.12 | kerio | wtfamireading.jpg |
| 14:18.29 | teotwaki | kerio: I may be mistaken, but I've used it for a long time, never had issues |
| 14:18.42 | kerio | osso-optify-whatever.sh, right? |
| 14:18.52 | teotwaki | I think so, yeah. |
| 14:19.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | /usr/sbin/maemo-optify-make-mountbind.sh /usr/sbin/maemo-optify-firstboot.sh /usr/sbin/maemo-optify-auto-opt.sh /usr/sbin/maemo-optify-lib.sh |
| 14:20.40 | kerio | apart from the moundbinding, do those do more than mv+ln? |
| 14:20.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | one of them even has several lines of "howto" comment |
| 14:22.00 | kerio | damn, the n900's wifi powersaving is *really* aggressive |
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| 14:23.40 | kerio | # Copyright: (C) 2010 Nokia |
| 14:23.40 | kerio | # License: DO WHAT YOU WANT TO PUBLIC LICENSE |
| 14:23.46 | kerio | oh lawds |
| 14:24.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | head -n 18 /etc/maemo-optify-auto-opt.conf |
| 14:26.23 | kerio | neat |
| 14:26.24 | kerio | :D |
| 14:27.15 | kerio | what is a package supposed to do, btw? |
| 14:27.24 | kerio | manually put stuff in /opt/<packagename> or use that? |
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| 14:28.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc |
| 14:28.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway I guess you may safely append a few lines for bash to /etc/maemo-optify-auto-opt.conf |
| 14:28.59 | kerio | yeah, yeah |
| 14:29.13 | kerio | echo / >>/etc/maemo-optify-auto-opt.conf |
| 14:30.15 | kerio | hm, what makes the bindmounts for python? |
| 14:30.24 | kerio | and *why*? |
| 14:30.50 | kerio | oh, pymaemo-optify in /etc/init.d |
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| 14:37.04 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: ooh, a way to do that could be to add dpkg diverts |
| 14:37.12 | kerio | but you still have to make the symlinks manually |
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| 14:40.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | afaik there's never been any "official definition" on how to use optification. so some pkgs (e.g. alarmed) hape binaries sitting in /opt/*/*/* and no symlink at all from anywhere inside $PATH to that binary |
| 14:40.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | while others probably create symlinks by their own, and yet others might use maemo-optify* |
| 14:41.03 | kerio | well, of the ones that i ever installed, only liqbase added something to maemo-optify*.conf |
| 14:41.13 | kerio | and of course maemo chess and some other stupid stuff |
| 14:41.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | no surprise, since ,ae,o-optify* been developed by lcuk, like liqbase |
| 14:41.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | maemo-optify* |
| 14:42.02 | kerio | anyway, dpkg diverts are resistant to package upgrades/removals |
| 14:42.19 | kerio | and if you have to put a dpkg-indexed file somewhere else, you should use those |
| 14:42.28 | kerio | dpkg powah! |
| 14:42.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, can't parse |
| 14:43.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | or rather, wtf is a dpkg-indexed file? |
| 14:43.25 | kerio | a file that dpkg knows of |
| 14:43.29 | kerio | because it was installed by a package |
| 14:43.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | and why do you have to put it somewhere? and how are you supposed to use it? |
| 14:43.41 | kerio | because you want to optify it |
| 14:43.52 | kerio | and the original package writer sucks |
| 14:44.02 | kerio | *package maintainer |
| 14:44.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | still don't get it |
| 14:44.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc what you're suggesting |
| 14:44.36 | kerio | instead of using the silly maemo-optify-* or manually moving and symlinking |
| 14:44.46 | kerio | you make a dpkg diversion and then symlink |
| 14:45.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | mhm, I make a dpkg diversion |
| 14:45.11 | kerio | because at that point dpkg knows that every time a package wants to install something in the initial directory, it has to put them where you decided |
| 14:45.50 | kerio | actually nevermind |
| 14:45.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | now if you'd bother to elaborate on 2make dpkg diversion", I actually might profit from your info shared |
| 14:45.56 | kerio | you can't divert directories |
| 14:47.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | I guess that's where symlinks and maemo-optify* come in |
| 14:47.51 | kerio | dpkg-divert --divert /opt/manual-optification-yo/bigassfile --rename /usr/path/to/bigassfile |
| 14:48.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | iirc there's been a suggested way to automatically optify stuff when building in SB |
| 14:49.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | like "touch please-optify" |
| 14:50.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | of course it's questionable why bash lives in / |
| 14:50.41 | kerio | because bash is the shit |
| 14:50.52 | kerio | also login shell |
| 14:50.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | you only would want to keep it in / if you were mad enough to use it as default init shell |
| 14:51.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | login shell is not mandatorily living in / |
| 14:52.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | since to login you evidently need a system that kinda booted up to full X and connectivity |
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| 14:52.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | which means /opt is available at that point in time |
| 14:53.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | (btw same applies for busybox-power) |
| 14:54.38 | kerio | to be fair busybox-power is only good for the extra commands (which can be linked to a busybox living in /opt and for the extra stuff in the commands that are already there |
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| 14:55.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | (the reason I frown on replacing space-conserving busybox that *has* to live in rootfs by busybox-power that is clearly targeted at interactive thus login-shell and ergo _should_ get optified and NOT waste precious space in rootfs) |
| 14:56.37 | kerio | and because it adds options to builtin commands |
| 14:58.46 | *** join/#maemo LinuxCode (~LinuxCode@fedora/LinuxCode) |
| 15:06.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | if distro maintainers had groked the difference between /bin and /usr/bin (same for sbin) and strictly moved all binaries needed during early boot to /(s)bin where they belong, we could've done with optification by simply moving /usr to /opt (the full picture is a tad more complex due to /us/lib etc, but basically it's been Nokia fscking up then instead of fixing their mess invented optification). Oh well, seems I posted that years ago, |
| 15:06.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | in |
| 15:06.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~optification |
| 15:06.15 | infobot | optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the systeminit *and* partitioning is FUBAR, http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish they looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 dot3" |
| 15:09.01 | *** join/#maemo APTX (~APTX@unaffiliated/aptx) |
| 15:09.31 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: why didn't maemo 5 run directly from eMMC? |
| 15:11.44 | *** join/#maemo wmarone_ (~wmarone@c-67-174-151-253.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
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| 15:48.02 | kerio | ~m32g |
| 15:48.09 | kerio | no, dammit |
| 15:48.13 | kerio | ~m5g32 |
| 15:48.25 | kerio | hrmpf |
| 15:49.58 | kerio | ~m32gb |
| 15:49.58 | infobot | i guess m32gb is https://code.launchpad.net/~pali/+junk/maemo_M32GB |
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| 16:33.09 | Sicelo | what is this M32GB? |
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| 16:41.57 | Sicelo | hmm, nice |
| 16:59.27 | kerio | Sicelo: yeah, it's kinda neat |
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| 17:04.36 | *** part/#maemo luca__ (~luca@i5E8796EC.versanet.de) |
| 17:06.10 | DocScrutinizer51 | hmm |
| 17:07.10 | DocScrutinizer51 | I'd much prefer a proper bootable image and a entry in uBoot, rather than a pivotroot from stock maemo |
| 17:07.13 | kerio | indeed |
| 17:07.39 | kerio | otoh, an entry in uBoot would require the appropriate modules |
| 17:08.45 | DocScrutinizer51 | btw look into preinit, you'll be surprised to find similar legacy from maemo4 to pivotroot from initrd to nand rootfs |
| 17:09.05 | kerio | fucking hysterical raisins |
| 17:09.38 | DocScrutinizer51 | eeeeek PANIC!! |
| 17:10.30 | DocScrutinizer51 | idly wonders if google pictures would yield good hits for "hysterical raisins" |
| 17:12.02 | *** join/#maemo timo^ (~timo@unaffiliated/tiempjuuh) |
| 17:12.56 | DocScrutinizer51 | meh! I got the weird habit to click that yellow ! in status always when I'm away from home |
| 17:12.59 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: just call the standard fremantle install a bootloader :D |
| 17:13.30 | DocScrutinizer51 | hm? |
| 17:14.25 | DocScrutinizer51 | so, keep HAM open now, close, or actually update marble? |
| 17:14.33 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: yes |
| 17:14.47 | DocScrutinizer51 | ok |
| 17:21.28 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: btw, why are you using HAM? |
| 17:21.31 | kerio | >:D |
| 17:21.52 | kerio | also, my calibration script worked |
| 17:22.02 | kerio | (bq27k calibration) |
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| 17:37.34 | *** join/#maemo CaveyCoUk (~Cavey@unaffiliated/caveycouk) |
| 17:39.03 | CaveyCoUk | Heya. Am trying to install the kernel for power users, but it cant find package "kernel-power" and googling gives someone's IRC logs but no answers..... any ideas greatly appreciated. |
| 17:39.50 | kerio | enable extras-devel, apt-get install kernel-power-flasher |
| 17:39.59 | freemangordon | kerio: KP50 is in extras |
| 17:40.14 | freemangordon | no need to enable extras devel |
| 17:40.29 | CaveyCoUk | I tried that, didnt work. |
| 17:41.15 | freemangordon | CaveyCoUk: what "didn't work" exactly means? |
| 17:41.41 | CaveyCoUk | Sorry. It didn't solve my problem, kept giving teh same problem |
| 17:42.07 | freemangordon | CaveyCoUk: and the problem is? |
| 17:43.45 | CaveyCoUk | When I try to install kernel-power-flasher it complains that it cant find the kernel-power package |
| 17:44.26 | freemangordon | hmm, do you have maemo-extras enabled? |
| 17:44.41 | CaveyCoUk | Yes, but I just realised I have two of them |
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| 17:45.00 | CaveyCoUk | Two pointing to http:repository.maemo.org/extras |
| 17:45.15 | freemangordon | funny |
| 17:45.16 | CaveyCoUk | One has a blank distribution, the other "freemantle-1.3" |
| 17:45.30 | CaveyCoUk | Any idea which is correct? |
| 17:45.53 | freemangordon | lemme check |
| 17:45.59 | CaveyCoUk | Thank you |
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| 17:52.51 | kerio | see, this time you had to wait is one of the reasons HAM sucks |
| 17:53.18 | kerio | CaveyCoUk: "fremantle" |
| 17:53.19 | freemangordon | kerio: no, I just have some other things to do ;) |
| 17:53.26 | kerio | not sure if fremantle-1.3 works too |
| 17:53.33 | *** join/#maemo [CaveyCoUk] (~Cavey@94.196.66.168.threembb.co.uk) |
| 17:53.34 | freemangordon | CaveyCoUk: fremantle-1.3 |
| 17:53.44 | kerio | really? :o |
| 17:53.52 | freemangordon | yes |
| 17:53.52 | [CaveyCoUk] | Thanks |
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| 17:54.35 | [CaveyCoUk] | Just tarted trial and error |
| 17:55.07 | [CaveyCoUk] | Seems disabling extras-testing means there is no more error |
| 17:56.04 | *** join/#maemo CaveyCoUk (~Cavey@unaffiliated/caveycouk) |
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| 17:57.17 | CaveyCoUk | Guess it is time to start the sweepstake on how long til I brick my phone.... |
| 18:00.35 | CaveyCoUk | Thank you very much freemangordon |
| 18:00.51 | freemangordon | CaveyCoUk: is it ok now? |
| 18:02.13 | CaveyCoUk | Its installed and rebooted, so I can at least move on to installing the next bits. |
| 18:02.58 | CaveyCoUk | It looks like it was some sort of conflict between different application catalogues resulting in a package being unavailable, which is odd :\ |
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| 18:16.06 | CaveyCoUk | My connection is being flakey, so am gonna scoot. Thanks again. |
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| 18:23.30 | Sicelo | still wonders wtf his N900 just bombs out on Pali's u-boot+bootmenu combo |
| 18:30.01 | kerio | why is bootmenu related to uboot? |
| 18:30.54 | Sicelo | this one, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 |
| 18:31.03 | kerio | NIN101: does the kernel in rescue-os have the thumb2 errata workaround patched in? |
| 18:31.35 | Sicelo | re:thumb2, i doubt |
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| 18:31.56 | kerio | i was afraid of that, yeah |
| 18:34.38 | Sicelo | i really like this uboot/bootmenu combo, if only it would work for me :( |
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| 18:40.45 | Psotnick | Can anyone tell me how can I make hildon_picker_dialog disappear after first change? |
| 18:43.17 | kerio | yo vi_ |
| 18:43.24 | kerio | freemangordon needs a n950 screen |
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| 18:57.50 | DocScrutinizer06 | kerio: are you mad? why woulod you need thumb patch in rescue-os? |
| 18:58.24 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: chroot? |
| 18:58.30 | freemangordon | a wild guess |
| 18:58.33 | DocScrutinizer06 | pff |
| 18:58.43 | DocScrutinizer06 | that's not what rescue-os is meant for |
| 18:58.51 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: ok |
| 18:58.52 | freemangordon | :) |
| 18:59.44 | kerio | what is it meant for? |
| 19:00.01 | DocScrutinizer06 | I however could see a problem for users planning to run binaries from their borked original system in resue-os environment |
| 19:00.19 | DocScrutinizer06 | if those binaries are thumb-compiled |
| 19:00.21 | NIN101 | kerio: no it doesn't |
| 19:00.52 | kerio | NIN101: yeah, i thought so :( |
| 19:03.16 | DocScrutinizer06 | idly wonders if a lib.so can modify own symbol table, just by writing new values to pointer associated to random-function() symbol |
| 19:04.20 | DocScrutinizer06 | or is the symbol table "static" and just loaded to non-writable RAM when randomlib.so gets loaded? |
| 19:05.11 | kerio | DocScrutinizer06: well, aren't libraries shared between binaries? |
| 19:05.21 | DocScrutinizer06 | sure |
| 19:05.35 | DocScrutinizer06 | that's the idea of sHAREDoBJECT |
| 19:06.22 | kerio | wouldn't stuff break if a library could change itself? |
| 19:06.28 | kerio | or is it copy-on-write? |
| 19:06.34 | DocScrutinizer06 | but this sharing is done by processes resp ld.so opening the library via dlopen() |
| 19:07.28 | DocScrutinizer06 | before ld.so resolves/links references to symbols in lib.so for $binary, the lib.so gets loaded and _init of the lib gets executed |
| 19:07.57 | DocScrutinizer06 | in _init the library could do some initialization stuff (you probably have guessed that yet) |
| 19:08.25 | DocScrutinizer06 | incl changing the addr pointer associated to a symbol in symbol table |
| 19:08.54 | kerio | so is the symbol table specific to each process? |
| 19:09.30 | DocScrutinizer06 | then ld.so resolves/links the refernece in $binary to randomfunction() in lib.so, and replaces the jump addr with what it finds in the table |
| 19:10.14 | DocScrutinizer06 | see man dlsym |
| 19:10.31 | DocScrutinizer06 | man dlopen |
| 19:10.37 | DocScrutinizer06 | (same) |
| 19:12.12 | *** part/#maemo MrPingu (~Thunderbi@86.92.226.97) |
| 19:12.34 | DocScrutinizer06 | the user can override any symbol in any lib.so by defining "LD_PRELOAD=my-overriding-lib-with-symbol-that-replaces-original.so anybinary" |
| 19:13.18 | DocScrutinizer06 | FILE *fopen64(const char *path, const char *mode) { |
| 19:13.19 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:13.21 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:13.22 | DocScrutinizer06 | return next_fopen64(path, mode); |
| 19:13.24 | DocScrutinizer06 | } |
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| 19:14.23 | trumee | ~ping |
| 19:14.23 | infobot | ~pong |
| 19:14.23 | DocScrutinizer06 | ^^^overrides original fopen64() |
| 19:14.28 | kerio | well that's kind of a stupid wrapper |
| 19:14.41 | DocScrutinizer06 | the lib itself should be able to handle that even smarter |
| 19:16.31 | DocScrutinizer06 | if not, than glibc could dlopen("glibc-helper-fakePselect.so") and implement an emulation for 'own' true pselect in that glibc-helper-fakePselect.so |
| 19:18.58 | Sicelo | OT: i wonder if this will be a hackable-enough device, http://www.gsmarena.com/zte_grand_x_in-4962.php |
| 19:21.08 | kerio | ooh, intel atom |
| 19:21.10 | kerio | neat |
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| 19:26.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sicelo: there's one question if it's hackable, another question if somebody actually will port a decent OS to it |
| 19:27.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | Sicelo: I don't care about buntkuh shite without proper dialer or anything, without support for GPS and WLAN and whatnot else |
| 19:28.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:44.28 | kerio | port maemo to it! |
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| 20:20.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, since maemo(5) is made for porting. And alredy been ported to 580 some other platforms |
| 20:22.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually that's the grave sin of Nokia regarding maemo - they managed to make it impossible to port |
| 20:24.54 | *** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@redhat/pcfe) |
| 20:31.59 | kerio | "impossible" |
| 20:32.57 | kerio | [Linus quote about linux not going to ever support non-AT hard drives] |
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| 20:36.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | "what the fuck? A strawberry!" [Peter Schoeppel quote on unknown occasion] |
| 20:37.51 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: wut? |
| 20:38.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
| 20:39.04 | vi__ | maemo 5 can suck my nuts. |
| 20:39.14 | vi__ | Hildon is where it is at. |
| 20:39.24 | ZogG_laptop | hildon is ported |
| 20:39.29 | kerio | well, right |
| 20:39.31 | ZogG_laptop | and it's only DE |
| 20:39.39 | vi__ | yeah... |
| 20:39.50 | kerio | it has a weird, non-standard notification area though |
| 20:40.25 | ZogG_laptop | it is nice for tablets/mobiles |
| 20:40.35 | vi__ | n950 vs n900 |
| 20:40.38 | ZogG_laptop | i would like to see hildon+swipe hybrid |
| 20:40.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | mumbles "sensorfw" and some rather nasty other terms, heads out to do something nicer than discussing maemo porting |
| 20:40.46 | vi__ | ffs |
| 20:40.57 | vi__ | swipe can get bent. |
| 20:41.10 | ZogG_laptop | vi_, swipe is nice but i feel like it's so not customizable and there is such a waste of space there |
| 20:41.34 | ZogG_laptop | like feed screen- and if i don't use feeds? why would i want black screen with just a date |
| 20:41.45 | ZogG_laptop | why not to make it widgets's screen |
| 20:41.47 | vi__ | LCARS |
| 20:41.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | honestly I rather use Braille HID than meego UI |
| 20:42.08 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: ! |
| 20:42.09 | ZogG_laptop | Braille HID? |
| 20:42.22 | ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer05, you are just too old for those things :P |
| 20:42.46 | vi__ | ZogG_laptop: the older you get the less tolerant to utter bullshit you get. |
| 20:42.53 | ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer05, i bet you don't use big thumb, u handle in one hand and use pointer thumb to click buttons :P |
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| 20:43.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://static.ddmcdn.com/gif/braille-4.jpg |
| 20:43.36 | ZogG_laptop | vi_, u need to understand that swipe for portrait mostly and without hw kbd |
| 20:43.53 | vi__ | so for retarded cripples? |
| 20:44.01 | vi__ | I have 2 hands. |
| 20:44.03 | kerio | yep! |
| 20:44.08 | vi__ | and multiple fingers. |
| 20:44.13 | ZogG_laptop | and |
| 20:44.19 | ZogG_laptop | how is it related? |
| 20:45.19 | ZogG_laptop | beilive me, u can't compete swype with hw kbd |
| 20:45.22 | ZogG_laptop | it's too small |
| 20:45.22 | vi__ | If you make a UI for spastics, you will have a device only useable by spastics. |
| 20:45.46 | ZogG_laptop | vi_, it's just hard for some people to get inovations, that's it |
| 20:46.11 | ZogG_laptop | like Ms made tablet and everyone boo'ed and apple made tablet and everyone had orgasms |
| 20:46.48 | *** join/#maemo thuttu77 (~thuttu77@cs181246145.pp.htv.fi) |
| 20:47.04 | vi__ | eventually computers will be so reduced in functionallity and controls we will just have a giant button for a KB the you slap with your idiot flipper to make the screen change colours. |
| 20:47.26 | vi__ | while bellming. |
| 20:47.52 | vi__ | wtf, ms did not make the tablet. |
| 20:48.12 | vi__ | apple did |
| 20:48.20 | vi__ | called the apple newton. |
| 20:48.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | and everybody boo'ed ;-P |
| 20:48.49 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: because it sucked. |
| 20:49.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | too much ahead of its time |
| 20:49.08 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: probably has a giant sealed lead acid battery. |
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| 20:50.32 | vi__ | If only there was a hildon implementation for the n950. |
| 20:50.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | indeed |
| 20:51.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | incl aegis-nuker |
| 20:51.03 | vi__ | fuckit. |
| 20:51.33 | vi__ | when my n900 breaks I am going to get a mobile phone the size of a pen with no screen. |
| 20:52.53 | vi__ | to dial, you will click the button on the end like back when you tried to scam free calls by hitting the hang-up on a pulse dial phone line. |
| 20:53.16 | vi__ | they will call it revolutionary. |
| 20:53.32 | vi__ | re-envisioning the roll of the mobile phone. |
| 20:53.47 | *** join/#maemo kodomo_ (~gregor@g225034071.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:54.11 | vi__ | for hands free you would just stick it in your ear like a loose cigarette |
| 20:54.38 | vi__ | also, it would be a pen. |
| 21:03.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: they already have invented wrist-phone, you listen to it by sticking finger in your ear, the sound gets transported by vibration of your hand |
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| 21:08.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm not so much interested in phone though. I had palm pilot and one of the things I missed from it was it enabling me to get rid of my phone. That's how phone is related to handheld computing for me, and N900 is not a phone |
| 21:08.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | N9 clearly *is* a phone, and hardly anything beyond |
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| 21:12.16 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: a phone with better specs than the n900 though :( |
| 21:12.35 | kerio | do you guys actually make a lot of phone calls with the n900? |
| 21:12.52 | *** join/#maemo Ian-- (~ian@46.11.127.182) |
| 21:15.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | I basically make *all* my calls with the N900 |
| 21:19.50 | Skry | me too |
| 21:21.19 | jaska | ditto |
| 21:21.30 | kerio | yeah, me too |
| 21:21.55 | kerio | but i don't make a lot of phone calls at all |
| 21:23.31 | SpeedEvil | I just connected my n900 as my main landline |
| 21:23.31 | SpeedEvil | sip/WiFi |
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| 21:29.54 | niouby | hello, i don't know why but when i emit a call with the phone app it switches to the running apps list, ie backgrounding the phone app, any idea ? |
| 21:31.44 | niouby | this focus loosing prohibits the proximity detection that enables/disables the loudspeaker, so using the babyphone app my baby can ear the call ringing ... |
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| 21:32.04 | chem|st | SpeedEvil: 2.8y late |
| 21:32.19 | chem|st | :) |
| 21:33.49 | chem|st | SpeedEvil: some service providers do sip for telephony anyways and some are stupid enough to have the password for it in clear text in modem's logfiles... |
| 21:34.59 | SpeedEvil | my ISP offers free sip (well, no extra sub), and works out cheaper than my phone provider |
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| 22:32.28 | rzr | <PROTECTED> |
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| 22:44.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | hi SpeedEvil! :-) |
| 22:46.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | rzr: some |
| 22:53.42 | rzr | DocScrutinizer05: i was thinking about using it a gps unit but navit is a bit harsh |
| 22:54.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, the N810 GPS never been paricularly good, at least in my experience |
| 22:55.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | A-GPS never made it from a beta to a proper system upgrade package afaik |
| 22:56.14 | rzr | i was happy using wayfinder |
| 22:56.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | neither I know wayfinder, nor navit |
| 22:58.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | afk for a beer |
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| 23:09.33 | merlin1991 | so far the only *maemo* device where the gps works halfway properly without an internet connection is sadly the n9(50) :/ |
| 23:09.45 | merlin1991 | at least in my experience |
| 23:10.58 | rzr | r u using it along a car charger ? |
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| 23:12.09 | merlin1991 | with and without |
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| 23:27.10 | rzr | mine complain there is not enough power |
| 23:27.21 | rzr | it is said to deliver 1.2A |
| 23:27.45 | rzr | bu I checked it is actually 0.8 |
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