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| 01:07.35 | iluminator105 | where can i find libcpap for wireshark for n900 |
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| 06:19.14 | DocScrutinizer06 | libpcap? |
| 06:22.23 | DocScrutinizer06 | IroN900:~# apt-cache policy libpcap0.8 |
| 06:22.25 | DocScrutinizer06 | libpcap0.8: |
| 06:22.26 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:22.28 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:22.29 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:22.31 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:22.32 | DocScrutinizer06 | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:22.45 | DocScrutinizer06 | NB: Installed: (none) |
| 06:23.15 | DocScrutinizer06 | tshark works nevertheless, afaik it has libpcap "built in" |
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| 06:35.02 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: BTW copyright in the header applies to the source code, not to the underlying technology AFAIK, so it seemes javispedro's concern was about IDA |
| 06:35.49 | DocScrutinizer06 | nonono |
| 06:36.24 | DocScrutinizer06 | I'm pretty sure his whole concern been about GPLing some decompiler output |
| 06:36.50 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: http://gitorious.org/kaiser-linux/kernel/blobs/3834c3f227725e2395840aed82342bda4ee9d379/fs/ntfs/mft.c |
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| 06:36.56 | DocScrutinizer06 | no matter if IDA or $your_fav_disassembler |
| 06:37.11 | freemangordon | now, tell me how is that GPL-ed |
| 06:37.19 | freemangordon | NTFS ;) |
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| 06:38.30 | freemangordon | every single file in NTFS driver is under GPL and is parto of the linux kernel |
| 06:38.39 | DocScrutinizer06 | well, looks to me like somebody has *written* that, and thus actually created a piece of intelectual property of his own |
| 06:39.06 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: you mean I didn't write what I published |
| 06:39.17 | freemangordon | I did it, it is not a simple copy/paste |
| 06:39.26 | DocScrutinizer06 | it looks like IDA "written" it |
| 06:39.29 | freemangordon | no |
| 06:39.51 | freemangordon | lemme show you what ida produces as output to end that, just a minute |
| 06:40.44 | DocScrutinizer06 | well, then I don't know (and I believe in your words, no need to show me IDA output) |
| 06:41.13 | DocScrutinizer06 | ask javispedro if he as well had that misconception |
| 06:41.23 | DocScrutinizer06 | or he actually meant something else |
| 06:42.35 | Macer | freemangordon: just use ida and throw the code out there! wooo!! |
| 06:42.39 | Macer | hack the planet! |
| 06:43.20 | Macer | DocScrutinizer06: it's not against licensing to decompile and rewrite code? ;) |
| 06:43.55 | Macer | i always figured that was almost always part of a license with most closed software |
| 06:44.15 | freemangordon | Macer: I missed your point(still having my coffee), but IDA/hexrays output cannot be compiled back, no matter what |
| 06:44.51 | Macer | freemangordon: oh im just saying.. if you do decompile... and then write something from teh output... |
| 06:45.02 | freemangordon | yes? |
| 06:45.12 | Macer | i figure the decompiling itself is restricted by the software's license |
| 06:45.49 | Macer | or is this the method typically used to "write" gpl'd src for hardware? |
| 06:45.57 | freemangordon | well, take a look at NTFS example I gave above |
| 06:46.11 | Macer | i did.. that is why i am asking |
| 06:47.26 | Macer | the real question is how did they write it to begin with? |
| 06:47.38 | Macer | did they take ntfs and decompile it, learn how it worked, then recompile? |
| 06:47.43 | Macer | well.. write then recompile |
| 06:47.46 | freemangordon | by doing RE |
| 06:47.55 | Macer | if so how is that not a violation of the eula from ms? :) |
| 06:48.01 | freemangordon | it is |
| 06:48.04 | freemangordon | :D |
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| 06:48.11 | DocScrutinizer06 | Macer: that's gray zone |
| 06:48.30 | Macer | DocScrutinizer06: i doubt it is very gray. i'm sure MS has it vividly written in the eula |
| 06:49.00 | DocScrutinizer06 | most licences/eulas have a § that forbids decompiling but also in several jurisdictions that's just moot |
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| 06:49.38 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: I am almost sure javispedro's concern is about me using IDA, which I don't have the right to :) |
| 06:49.41 | Macer | DocScrutinizer06: meaning the eula doesn't hold any force of law? even tho the end user HAS to agre in order to use it? |
| 06:50.03 | DocScrutinizer06 | what's definitely forbidden, even under normal copyright, is decomoiling and then publishing |
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| 06:50.31 | Macer | yeah but what justifies a rewrite? |
| 06:50.43 | Macer | what if there is only 1 way to do it? ;) |
| 06:51.10 | Macer | i would assume there is probably no way to avoid using none of the decompiled code in order to get it to work |
| 06:51.12 | DocScrutinizer06 | meh, please consult wikipedia about it. IANAL |
| 06:51.13 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: but that us actually a rewrite, it is not the output of decompiler/disassembler |
| 06:51.43 | freemangordon | no matter what tools i used during the rewrite |
| 06:51.55 | Macer | i mean quite honestly... if i were a dev i'd probably just have my own special n900 |
| 06:52.08 | Macer | running some other awesome os with stuff i decompiled and got working :) |
| 06:52.18 | Macer | then throw a torrent on tpb .. but that's just me haha |
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| 06:53.25 | freemangordon | well, maybe it is better to wait for javispedro to appear and throw some lit on WTF "WTF" means |
| 06:53.34 | freemangordon | s/lit/light/ |
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| 07:36.52 | zeq1 | Macer: _Legally_ (IANAL either) EULAs can't remove end user *rights* including the right to reverse engineer for interoperability etc. They can only provide *additional* rights to those normally reserved by copyright law. |
| 07:38.32 | DocScrutinizer06 | but plain (C) law is pretty simple, in that you mustn't redistribute intelectual property of others under your own name and licence. |
| 07:39.18 | zeq1 | Except under "fair use" or with permission. |
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| 07:42.28 | DocScrutinizer06 | doesn't matter if the original binary is represented as a binary file, a hex dump, or a disassembler output, if you copy complete or partial. You simply must not use the original code in your work if you want to distribute your work. You *may* use disassembler to understand what original code does, then write something that does about the same thing, since the algorithm isn't protected by law. Like with a book, you may write your won |
| 07:42.29 | DocScrutinizer06 | story that tells exacxtly same plot, but you mustn't copy a few lines of original book's text, no matter if you change layout or font or even translate it to another language |
| 07:43.30 | DocScrutinizer06 | s/won/own/. |
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| 07:46.47 | zeq1 | Exactly so, but EULAs claim to explicitly ban RE, which in most jurisdictions isn't legally enforcible (US law notwithstanding) |
| 07:47.18 | DocScrutinizer06 | I already mentioned that, yes |
| 07:47.28 | zeq1 | yup |
| 07:47.56 | zeq1 | I would be wary of doing just about anything if I lived in the US though... |
| 07:48.11 | zeq1 | look at what happened to Samsung |
| 07:48.20 | DocScrutinizer06 | :nod: |
| 07:48.48 | zeq1 | I've been reading the groklaw blog for years, it just seems to get crazier and crazier. |
| 07:48.59 | kerio | well, google will probably sue apple now |
| 07:49.29 | DocScrutinizer06 | since we got "permission" from quim gill to redistribute Nokia(C) blobs, we probably are safe when we keep original Nokia (C) in header of disassembly of those blobs |
| 07:50.33 | Venemo_N9 | heh |
| 07:51.06 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: but that is not disassembly |
| 07:51.16 | DocScrutinizer06 | doesn't matter |
| 07:51.24 | DocScrutinizer06 | we just pretend it is |
| 07:51.32 | kerio | US Pat. 5710987, Receiver having concealed external antenna |
| 07:51.51 | kerio | Assignee: Motorola, Inc. |
| 07:51.57 | freemangordon | zeq1: could you help on that? |
| 07:52.07 | jaska | US Pat. $random, A multi-pronged utensil to eat food with. |
| 07:52.14 | zeq1 | freemangordon: what is it exactly? |
| 07:52.25 | kerio | the patent doesn't talk about a special technique to do so |
| 07:52.39 | kerio | just... you know... put the antenna inside the body of the phone |
| 07:52.51 | freemangordon | 00:22 <javispedro> freemangordon: wtf are you doing |
| 07:52.54 | freemangordon | <javispedro> freemangordon: http://gitorious.org/community-ssu/hildon-im-vkbrenderer3/blobs/master/src/hildon-im-vkbrenderer.c#line1854 |
| 07:52.56 | freemangordon | <javispedro> freemangordon: you cannot just paste a IDA decompiler output and relicense it under GPL3 |
| 07:52.59 | freemangordon | zeq1: ^^^ |
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| 07:53.34 | freemangordon | I still fail to grok the problem :( |
| 07:53.55 | DocScrutinizer06 | the problem is you put somebody else's code/property under a new licence |
| 07:54.03 | zeq1 | you want my opinion on whether using the information gleaned from IDA is okay? |
| 07:54.18 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: it is not somebody else code |
| 07:54.24 | freemangordon | zeq1: basically yes |
| 07:54.28 | DocScrutinizer06 | *sigh* |
| 07:55.09 | zeq1 | it's the code to render vkb? |
| 07:55.10 | DocScrutinizer06 | what javispedro wrote actually *IS* assuming it's just that, somebody else's code |
| 07:55.20 | freemangordon | zeq1: yes |
| 07:55.31 | DocScrutinizer06 | freemangordon: please dissect problem correctly |
| 07:56.23 | DocScrutinizer06 | >>javispedro: "you cannot just paste a IDA decompiler output and relicense it under GPL"<< this is absolutely correct |
| 07:56.24 | zeq1 | it's slightly grey if you manually parsed the output from the decompiler and re-wrote it |
| 07:56.42 | freemangordon | adn that is what I did |
| 07:56.45 | zeq1 | if you wrote specs from the de-compiler then wrote new code from spec you're definitely ok |
| 07:57.15 | zeq1 | if you can convince yourself that's what you did in your head... ;) |
| 07:57.56 | DocScrutinizer06 | my staement: "under qgil licence, you may paste a IDA decompiler output, givven you do NOT relicence it" |
| 07:58.57 | DocScrutinizer06 | to comply with the latter, it's _not_ mandatory to copy _complete_ orifinal code's decompiler output |
| 07:59.11 | DocScrutinizer06 | official* |
| 07:59.16 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: but it is not IDA decompiler output (well, some parts need cleanup, I agree) |
| 07:59.19 | DocScrutinizer06 | err original* |
| 07:59.28 | freemangordon | but it is a matter of cleanup |
| 07:59.51 | zeq1 | You could argue the IDA output is a machine generated specification |
| 08:00.02 | DocScrutinizer06 | whatever, either you grok the issue now or you need to find help from somebody else, I'm definitely short on time |
| 08:00.05 | zeq1 | *maybe* |
| 08:00.42 | freemangordon | nowhere in the IDA output there are structure/class definitions, function names, etc |
| 08:01.42 | zeq1 | freemangordon: I would lean to your side, it's just that these things can be iffy |
| 08:01.47 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: np, thanks anyway, will wait for javispedro to appear and elaborate |
| 08:02.17 | zeq1 | It's mostly comes down to whether you feel you can document your process |
| 08:02.51 | freemangordon | zeq1: document? man, why using taboo words, I am developer after all :D |
| 08:04.04 | freemangordon | well, I can explain, the you give me your toughts, ok? |
| 08:04.15 | freemangordon | if you have tiem |
| 08:04.18 | freemangordon | time* |
| 08:04.58 | zeq1 | it's not likely there would be any issue. but if you got an email from Nokia you might want to be able to demonstrate you wrote your code from the functional specification rather than just manually parsing their "IP" |
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| 08:06.03 | zeq1 | IMHO, I really can't see it being a problem, we're probably "violating" patents with every line of code we write anyway... :P |
| 08:06.34 | zeq1 | but as I said IANAL |
| 08:06.42 | freemangordon | hmm, I got the point. The problem is that for the most SW i wrote (esp the FOSS one) there is no specification elsewhere but in my head |
| 08:07.20 | freemangordon | not that I say I know how vkb works :) |
| 08:08.07 | zeq1 | It might be worth you cleaning up your RE work into a specification document if you have any concerns. |
| 08:08.23 | zeq1 | I know how that must make you feel though ;) |
| 08:09.04 | DocScrutinizer06 | or you consider my suggestion |
| 08:09.29 | zeq1 | there's a reason commercial companies insist on lots of documentation |
| 08:09.42 | DocScrutinizer06 | and state "all disassembled parts in this document (C)Nokia, under licence applicable to maemo" |
| 08:10.04 | zeq1 | definitely |
| 08:10.18 | freemangordon | well, that is over any limits :D. So I will wait for javispedro to elaborate (as I still have the feeling he told me I am not allowed to use IDA) and after that will ask merlin1991 |
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| 08:11.15 | DocScrutinizer06 | this is not over any limits, this is in line with qgil permission to redistribute (C)Nokia blobs in CSSU |
| 08:11.20 | freemangordon | if it requires several months that source to be in a condition that will make everyone happy, i'll consider asking merlin to just remove it |
| 08:11.37 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer06: it was re documentation :) |
| 08:12.15 | DocScrutinizer06 | and probably the _only_ way to get this into official CSSU repos |
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| 08:13.35 | freemangordon | ok, I'll ask merlin1991 to put whatever license he finds appropriate, I told you, I don't care if my name is mentioned in the header |
| 08:15.20 | freemangordon | though to be honest I don' think Nokia can care less :) |
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| 08:17.26 | zeq1 | freemangordon: I'm sure Nokia would rather we all just disappeared |
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| 08:21.55 | zeq1 | freemangordon: in http://www.snewbury.org.uk/maemo/sigmask there is the glibc source package |
| 08:23.06 | freemangordon | zeq1: thanks |
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| 08:23.41 | zeq1 | it enables pselect by just bumping the min kernel version, and also the patch to allow packages using inlines to compile against it using current gcc versions |
| 08:24.08 | freemangordon | zeq1: do you plan to compile and package newer gcc 4.7.2? |
| 08:24.11 | zeq1 | I ported it from the glibc2.6 git branch |
| 08:24.23 | zeq1 | yes, I will do it today if I get time |
| 08:25.05 | freemangordon | BTW I think we should first asm merlin1991 to create a repo on gitorious, containing the original glibc code and apply those patches on top of it |
| 08:25.11 | freemangordon | *ask |
| 08:26.15 | zeq1 | it needs to depend on kernel "sigmask syscalls" feature, I didn't do that |
| 08:27.03 | zeq1 | (and also remember it has to be built with the stock compiler) |
| 08:27.35 | zeq1 | I never managed to find a way of not breaking the locales using 4.7 |
| 08:27.46 | zeq1 | (or 4.6 for that matter) |
| 08:28.02 | zeq1 | unfortunate. |
| 08:28.31 | zeq1 | the libs are half the size compiled with thumb :( |
| 08:29.12 | zeq1 | (no performance difference on benchmarks though) |
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| 08:30.27 | zeq1 | freemangordon: I have a patch for hildon-desktop to build using -ffast-math too, shall I put that on the server too? |
| 08:31.44 | zeq1 | As I mentioned before my holiday it's necessary to change the finite math functions |
| 08:33.33 | zeq1 | freemangordon: you already merged the float branch into your cssu-thumb version didn't you? |
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| 09:14.18 | freemangordon | zeq1: no, I didn't |
| 09:15.28 | freemangordon | zeq1: andwe'd better use gitorious for patches, it does not make sense me to apply the patches you did :) |
| 09:15.48 | freemangordon | i.e. cone, edit, request a merge is the correct way AIUI |
| 09:15.54 | freemangordon | s/cone/clone/ |
| 09:16.34 | freemangordon | that way the others have the chance to review the patches too |
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| 09:25.52 | kerio | wtf |
| 09:26.02 | kerio | my bupbat worked after more than a minute D: |
| 09:26.21 | kerio | i don't even |
| 09:26.36 | kerio | does this make sense? |
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| 09:28.35 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: my bupbat resisted more than a minute of lack of battery |
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| 09:36.13 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: are you sure that the bupbat doesn't power bq24k? |
| 09:36.33 | kerio | it definetely powered bq27k |
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| 10:22.02 | zeq1 | freemangordon: ok will do |
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| 10:32.26 | DocScrutinizer51 | kerio: (bupbat) yes, quite sure |
| 10:34.10 | DocScrutinizer51 | though I fail to understand how duration of bupbat supply would indicate it also supplying any bq chip |
| 10:35.38 | DocScrutinizer51 | anyway bupbat is connected to twl4030 and just supplies the CMOS clock and some registers in there |
| 10:36.26 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: i wanted to reset bq24k because it's still in a silly state because of Pali's module |
| 10:36.43 | kerio | bq27k didn't lose the calibration - is it fair to think that bq24k wasn't reset either? |
| 10:36.54 | DocScrutinizer51 | NB twl4030 also is responsible for powering up device on VBUS detect |
| 10:37.29 | DocScrutinizer51 | there's basically nothing to reset in bq24150 |
| 10:39.14 | kerio | i see |
| 10:39.22 | kerio | so it's twl that could be in a weird state |
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| 10:40.17 | DocScrutinizer51 | but bq24150.ko afaik also is messing with USB for charger detect and whatnot, and that's PHY 1707, and twl4030 |
| 10:41.19 | DocScrutinizer51 | we already had reports of allegedly permanently messed up twl4030 settings in early days of h-e-n |
| 10:42.01 | DocScrutinizer51 | and due to bupbat it *might* be tricky to reset twl4030 |
| 10:42.11 | kerio | :c |
| 10:43.08 | DocScrutinizer51 | I for one never completely investigated that topic, since we made sure we don't do any evil |
| 10:43.23 | DocScrutinizer51 | bbl |
| 10:43.33 | kerio | goddammit pali |
| 10:48.48 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: hm, where could i find a datasheet for twl4030 so i can look for a way to reset it? |
| 10:50.14 | DocScrutinizer51 | check wiki, there has to be a link |
| 10:50.39 | DocScrutinizer51 | tps65595 iirc |
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| 10:51.11 | kerio | tps65950 apparently |
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| 10:52.25 | kerio | oh god, 171 pages |
| 10:54.08 | kerio | hm, the only mentions of "reset" talk about a power-on reset |
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| 10:54.24 | kerio | whoops |
| 10:54.38 | kerio | so... idk |
| 10:59.52 | DocScrutinizer51 | kerio: your lucky day! I'm sitting at work, bored, with internet access on my fingertips |
| 11:03.07 | kerio | yay! :D |
| 11:03.33 | kerio | right now i'm just going to wait like an hour for bupbat to fucking fail |
| 11:03.46 | kerio | i swear, those things do the exact opposite of what you want them to do |
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| 11:06.17 | kerio | DocScrutinizer51: assuming it's healthy, how much would i have to wait? |
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| 11:10.28 | DocScrutinizer51 | read 8.1.2 |
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| 11:25.25 | kerio | ok, bupbat resisted 25 minutes |
| 11:25.31 | kerio | :s |
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| 11:47.31 | DocScrutinizer51 | kerio: what's up now? did it 'reset'? |
| 11:47.44 | DocScrutinizer51 | did you even flash sane kernel? |
| 11:48.04 | kerio | of course not, still on kp51r1 :) |
| 11:48.25 | kerio | i'd have to downgrade to kernel-cssu that matches kp50 |
| 11:49.40 | kerio | anyway, the only problem i had was that triggering a watchdog reboot caused the phone to enter act-dead mode with no charger plugged in |
| 11:49.48 | kerio | which was weird |
| 11:50.04 | kerio | but once i properly boot, it works fine |
| 11:57.38 | kerio | yep, i can replicate that |
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| 11:58.05 | kerio | watchdog reboot enters act-dead mode for a bit |
| 11:58.15 | kerio | and then it boots |
| 11:58.27 | kerio | oh pali, what did you do to my n900 ç_ç |
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| 12:13.13 | freemangordon | kerio: kernel-cssu3 is kp51r1 |
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| 12:21.08 | DocScrutinizer51 | btw WTF are the register descriptions for tps65950? |
| 12:27.02 | DocScrutinizer51 | if *I* were TI designing twl4030 chip, I'd specify a generic reset procedure: hold poweron button while inserting battery, maybe keep it for a further 10s |
| 12:29.02 | DocScrutinizer51 | kerio: did you find further manuals than the one on TI webpage that has electrical specs and that bupbat stuff under 8.x.y as I said above? |
| 12:29.23 | kerio | no, but i haven't actually searched |
| 12:29.29 | kerio | i mean, that's the whole datasheet as provided by TI |
| 12:36.54 | DocScrutinizer51 | funny sidenote: for N9 Nokia obviously got a special custom build called TPS65951 |
| 12:44.03 | StyXman | hmm, I have an ex-TI 5m behind me |
| 12:44.15 | StyXman | what manuals are you lloking for? |
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| 12:50.18 | kerio | StyXman: twl |
| 12:50.29 | kerio | aka tps65950 |
| 12:50.38 | kerio | we want to know if there's a way to reset it without removing power to it |
| 12:50.46 | kerio | because that would require removing the bupbat, if it still works (like mine) |
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| 12:56.36 | DocScrutinizer51 | nm, all on one page, just need to scroll down |
| 12:58.47 | DocScrutinizer51 | www.ti.com/product/tps65950 and scroll down |
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| 13:01.40 | StyXman | DocScrutinizer51: ack |
| 13:01.58 | DocScrutinzrWrk | http://www.ti.com/lit/an/swca025/swca025.pdf |
| 13:03.51 | kerio | StyXman: syn+ack |
| 13:04.12 | DocScrutinzrWrk | HAHA!!! |
| 13:04.44 | fizzie | Ack, followed by syn+ack... must be some kind of a backwards handshake. |
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| 13:04.56 | DocScrutinzrWrk | Note: One exception: when the user presses the PWRON (power-on) button for 8 seconds and removes the battery in the next 8 seconds, the TPS65950 enters NO SUPPLY state instead of BACKUP state, even if a valid backup battery is present. In such a situation, the backup domain registers are also reset, along with the VRRTC domain registers. |
| 13:05.04 | kerio | :D :D D: |
| 13:05.05 | kerio | er |
| 13:05.06 | kerio | :D :D :D |
| 13:05.55 | DocScrutinzrWrk | gimme 5 |
| 13:06.06 | kerio | <DocScrutinizer51> if *I* were TI designing twl4030 chip, I'd specify a generic reset procedure: hold poweron button while inserting battery, maybe keep it for a further 10s |
| 13:06.17 | kerio | the hw engineering is strong in this one |
| 13:06.50 | kerio | hm, how would i use that thing? |
| 13:07.08 | StyXman | kerio: rst |
| 13:07.17 | kerio | oh, i'll just shutdown with held PWRON and then remove the battery i guess |
| 13:08.31 | kerio | would that work? |
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| 13:09.19 | DocScrutinzrWrk | ~n900-full-reset is when the user presses the PWRON (power-on) button for 8 seconds and removes the battery in the next 8 seconds, the TPS65950 enters NO SUPPLY state instead of BACKUP state, even if a valid backup battery is present. In such a situation, the backup domain registers are also reset, along with the VRRTC domain registers. |
| 13:09.19 | infobot | DocScrutinzrWrk: okay |
| 13:09.44 | kerio | DocScrutinzrWrk: would USB PHY be reset in the same way? otherwise it's not really a full reset :) |
| 13:10.19 | DocScrutinzrWrk | PHY should get reset by removing battery (mind you, it's not backed up by bupbat) |
| 13:10.24 | kerio | k |
| 13:10.33 | kerio | removing battery + wait the usual minute or so? |
| 13:10.47 | DocScrutinzrWrk | you however should remove bat for 120+ seconds |
| 13:11.23 | kerio | hm, tps65951 has a way to reset its own USB PHY |
| 13:11.37 | kerio | does the N9 have a separate chip for usb, like the n900? |
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| 13:14.54 | DocScrutinzrWrk | shorting N900 battery terminals of N900 might shorten capacitor discharge time |
| 13:15.08 | kerio | does it work if i just touch them? :) |
| 13:15.24 | DocScrutinzrWrk | N9 uses tps65951 PHY |
| 13:15.36 | DocScrutinzrWrk | kerio: basically yes |
| 13:15.51 | DocScrutinzrWrk | maybe with slighly humid fingertips |
| 13:16.12 | fizzie | Soon you'll have him spitting in his phone. |
| 13:16.19 | DocScrutinzrWrk | hehe |
| 13:16.27 | Lava_Croft | protip: dont pee on it |
| 13:16.59 | kerio | i wasn't going to D: |
| 13:17.30 | kerio | so |
| 13:17.34 | kerio | bq27k calibration data is still there |
| 13:17.41 | kerio | i'll try triggering a reboot again |
| 13:17.48 | kerio | that seemed to showcase the problem before |
| 13:18.32 | kerio | ok, normal booting :D |
| 13:18.41 | kerio | Estel_: you might want to try this too |
| 13:18.54 | kerio | (before it used to enter act-dead mode while charging for a bit) |
| 13:21.42 | DocScrutinzrWrk | frowns on Note at bottom of §3 in http://www.ti.com/lit/an/swca025/swca025.pdf, p.6 |
| 13:22.21 | DocScrutinzrWrk | wonders if maemo5 maybe never even activates bupbat charging |
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| 13:33.13 | kerio | DocScrutinzrWrk: hahahah oh wow |
| 13:33.17 | kerio | maybe it never did |
| 13:33.37 | kerio | although i thought that failures in bupbats were due to physical problems |
| 13:35.21 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: good finding, maybe we should ask Pali to include that in charger driver |
| 13:35.52 | freemangordon | most probably that is the reason most of those batteries to be empty in an year or so |
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| 13:37.02 | kerio | we should also ask Pali to make the charger driver not completely fuck up twl4030 :) |
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| 13:43.50 | DocScrutinzrWrk | if bupbat never gets charged, it will break and go EOL after ~1 year or so |
| 13:43.57 | DocScrutinzrWrk | due to deep discharge |
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| 14:09.23 | kerio | anyway, the n900 is surprisingly resilient |
| 14:09.49 | kerio | i mean, the guy that nandtested the whole NAND has something that boots now |
| 14:11.40 | Gh0sty | nandtested? |
| 14:12.19 | kerio | nandtest, from mtd-utils |
| 14:12.30 | kerio | a destructive nand test |
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| 14:12.44 | kerio | dude overwrote most of CAL with random data |
| 14:12.48 | kerio | well, all of CAL |
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| 14:15.07 | Gh0sty | how did he fix it? |
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| 14:18.54 | kerio | Gh0sty: he didn't :) |
| 14:19.01 | kerio | he coldflashed and then reflashed |
| 14:19.03 | kerio | but CAL is still borked |
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| 14:23.40 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: :nod: |
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| 14:23.57 | freemangordon | the question is if it can be revived |
| 14:25.02 | jacekowski | kerio: does it boot now? |
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| 14:28.34 | kerio | jacekowski: he said it does |
| 14:29.02 | DocScrutinzrWrk | freemangordon: a deep discharged LiIon is considered dead usually. Even a LiSiIon bupbat |
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| 14:50.44 | Gh0sty | kerio: and how do you coldflash? |
| 14:51.00 | kerio | ~coldflash |
| 14:51.00 | infobot | i heard coldflash is http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-10-31.log.html#t2010-10-31T23:09:54 and next ~200 posts, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware/Cold_Flashing |
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| 14:55.10 | jacekowski | kerio: what about rapuyama |
| 14:55.14 | jacekowski | kerio: does rapuyama boot? |
| 14:55.28 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: well, depends on how deep |
| 14:55.37 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: i've discharged liion to 1.2V |
| 14:55.47 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: and recharged after that |
| 14:55.49 | kerio | jacekowski: ask sambo7 |
| 14:55.52 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer05: and it recovered quite well |
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| 15:09.00 | SpeedEvil | You probably haven't. |
| 15:09.11 | SpeedEvil | If you mean a nokia type battery |
| 15:09.33 | SpeedEvil | once it hits 2.5V or so, the protection circuitry kicks in, and disconnects the cell |
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| 15:14.48 | DocScrutinzrWrk | indeed |
| 15:14.52 | DocScrutinzrWrk | should |
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| 15:28.11 | freemangordon | hmm, but we are talking about cell battery, i don't think there is any protection circuitry built in |
| 15:30.12 | freemangordon | ~seen javispedro |
| 15:30.23 | infobot | javispedro <~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo-ssu, 18h 5m ago, saying: 'freemangordon: you cannot just paste a IDA decompiler output and relicense it under GPL3'. |
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| 15:39.40 | DocScrutinzrWrk | http://www.ti.com/lit/er/swcz001g/swcz001g.pdf SiErr on TPS6595x: 26 VDD1, VDD2, may have glitches when their output value is updated // The OMAP device may reboot if the VDD1 or VDD2 go below the core minimum operating voltage.// Negative glitches may occur on VDD1, VDD2 output. It occurs when the output voltage is changed and the DCDC are running on their internal oscillator. |
| 15:39.59 | DocScrutinzrWrk | I read that as "don't use SmartReflex, it's instable" |
| 15:40.10 | kerio | but... :c |
| 15:40.23 | kerio | it worksforme! |
| 15:40.26 | DocScrutinzrWrk | I might be wrong |
| 15:42.15 | kerio | TI might be wrong! |
| 15:42.45 | kerio | hm, is smartreflex even useful if you don't OC? |
| 15:43.12 | DocScrutinzrWrk | also: 27 VDD1 and / or VDD2 DCDC clock may stop working when internal clock is switched |
| 15:43.42 | DocScrutinzrWrk | Impact: VDD1 and/or VDD2 output voltages may collapse if clock stops. |
| 15:44.56 | kerio | nice |
| 15:47.15 | kerio | disables smartreflex |
| 15:48.48 | kerio | i don't know how D: |
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| 15:52.45 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: the same could happen when you change the OPP |
| 15:52.58 | kerio | OPP? |
| 15:54.43 | freemangordon | frequency |
| 15:55.07 | kerio | hm, should i overclock this? |
| 15:55.21 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: also the note says "...DCDC are running on their internal oscillator." |
| 15:55.33 | freemangordon | is that the case in n900? |
| 15:55.39 | kerio | anyway, removing /etc/default/kernel-power and rebooting gave me the stock settings |
| 15:55.47 | kerio | i'm probably going to *save* these to a file |
| 15:57.08 | kerio | hmm, "default" differs from stock in more than one way |
| 15:57.47 | kerio | the voltage for 250 is a bit lower, and the dsp frequency is 500 instead of 520 for a lot of high frequencies |
| 15:59.37 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: libhildon-im-vkbrenderer3_3.3.20-1+0m5_armel.deb (stock) does not contain license, what now? |
| 16:02.10 | DocScrutinizer51 | well, I guess then standard maemo licence applies |
| 16:02.24 | freemangordon | which is? |
| 16:02.53 | freemangordon | hmm, where is ivgalvez :( |
| 16:02.54 | DocScrutinizer51 | the eula you accept on firmware dl website |
| 16:03.29 | *** join/#maemo toxaris (~toxaris@90-230-114-186-no34.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 16:06.12 | DocScrutinizer51 | and probably qgil's special 'licence' for CSSU overrides that EULA |
| 16:06.18 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: why is that eula applicable? I didn't get the binaries from the device. Maybe I should check what SDK license says. |
| 16:07.16 | DocScrutinizer51 | yep, that too |
| 16:07.58 | freemangordon | Maemo SDK Virtual Image is part of the Maemo Eclipse Integration project. |
| 16:07.59 | freemangordon | Contents released under the Eclipse Public License v1.0. |
| 16:08.19 | freemangordon | http://www.eclipse.org/legal/epl-v10.html |
| 16:08.42 | freemangordon | hehe "each Contributor hereby grants Recipient a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free copyright license to reproduce, prepare derivative works of, publicly display, publicly perform, distribute and sublicense the Contribution of such Contributor, if any, and such derivative works, in source code and object code form." |
| 16:10.06 | DocScrutinzrWrk | probably only applicable to SDK IDE itself |
| 16:10.45 | freemangordon | sure, but if there is no license coming with .debs, then what? |
| 16:11.04 | freemangordon | I am glad I am a developer, not a lawyer :D |
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| 16:13.18 | freemangordon | hmm, there is an additional euale one should agree berfore download, lemme read it |
| 16:15.32 | SpeedEvil | freemangordon: the nokia n900 battery has a little protection board in it |
| 16:15.37 | SpeedEvil | it's not a bare cell |
| 16:15.51 | freemangordon | SpeedEvil: we were talking about backup battery |
| 16:16.09 | SpeedEvil | Oh - my mistake |
| 16:16.22 | SpeedEvil | that does not have any protection at all. I should read further context |
| 16:16.33 | freemangordon | :) |
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| 16:22.09 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: well, according to that EULA (http://pastebin.com/4Sg73wZj) .debs we are talking about are not copyrighted, or at least that is my undertanding. So I will end that discussion until someone finds a reason why I should change the license |
| 16:22.36 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: ^^^ |
| 16:27.42 | DocScrutinzrWrk | http://www.ti.com/lit/ug/swcu050g/swcu050g.pdf p.265 (SmartReflex) bottom: >>The registers are described in and .<< NIIIICE! |
| 16:27.54 | freemangordon | but of course |
| 16:28.25 | freemangordon | in 3430 TRM there is a note that this information is confidential :D:D:D |
| 16:30.00 | freemangordon | "This information is not available in public domain" |
| 16:31.46 | DocScrutinzrWrk | p.409/410 has SR regs |
| 16:33.22 | kerio | does flasher do something more than nandwrite when flashing the kernel? |
| 16:34.59 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: no, those are voltage control registers ;) |
| 16:35.20 | freemangordon | there are about 10-20 more |
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| 16:37.45 | freemangordon | DocScrutinzrWrk: exactly 13 more registers |
| 16:38.41 | freemangordon | check in the trm, section 4.14.2.13 Global_Reg_PRM Registers |
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| 16:44.38 | DocScrutinzrWrk | TRM of what? OMAP? |
| 16:45.09 | freemangordon | yes, OMAP34xx_ES3.1.x_PUBLIC_TRM_vZM.pdf |
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| 16:46.32 | DocScrutinzrWrk | I suppose that are OMAP registers then |
| 16:47.03 | freemangordon | could be, but does not matter, as SR is actually controlled by those |
| 16:47.59 | freemangordon | though iirc they are accessed through i2c |
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| 16:55.07 | DocScrutinzrWrk | http://www.ti.com/lit/ug/swcu050g/swcu050g.pdf p.441 ROTFL |
| 16:56.05 | DocScrutinzrWrk | luckily we don't use any of that in N900 |
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| 17:06.40 | kerio | DocScrutinzrWrk: should i remind you that the N900 uses rx51_BME? |
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| 17:20.13 | DocScrutinzrWrk | kerio: how is that related? |
| 17:20.23 | DocScrutinzrWrk | we're talking hw right here |
| 17:21.05 | MrPingu | Hiyaa |
| 17:21.30 | MrPingu | my issue is fixed by a reflash and have an awesome low number of wakeups now via powertop :) |
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| 17:23.31 | kerio | yay |
| 17:24.22 | DocScrutinzrWrk | MrPingu: so what's the conclusion? |
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| 17:24.35 | DocScrutinzrWrk | kernel buggy? |
| 17:24.43 | MrPingu | It's not the battery |
| 17:24.45 | MrPingu | ;) |
| 17:24.59 | DocScrutinzrWrk | aaah the battery issue |
| 17:26.01 | MrPingu | Battery is just fine so it "must" have been something else... |
| 17:26.32 | DocScrutinzrWrk | I asked "was it the kernel?" |
| 17:26.56 | DocScrutinzrWrk | prolly you dunno yet |
| 17:27.32 | MrPingu | Well mtd2 last oops was from kp47 :p |
| 17:27.45 | DocScrutinzrWrk | seen that |
| 17:28.23 | MrPingu | Don't know what to blame in my phone... |
| 17:28.29 | MrPingu | Failing microSD |
| 17:28.31 | MrPingu | ? |
| 17:28.41 | MrPingu | Don't have swap enabled on SD now... |
| 17:28.42 | DocScrutinzrWrk | unlikely |
| 17:28.52 | DocScrutinzrWrk | OOOOOH! |
| 17:28.59 | DocScrutinzrWrk | then more than likely |
| 17:29.52 | MrPingu | Just came to my mind... |
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| 17:30.17 | kerio | DocScrutinzrWrk: hm, why? |
| 17:30.23 | DocScrutinzrWrk | didn't I mention a possible explanation along lines of "watchdog triggered due to system freeze by IO overload/congestion"? |
| 17:30.31 | kerio | ooh |
| 17:30.33 | kerio | right |
| 17:30.47 | MrPingu | Yes you did ;) |
| 17:31.07 | DocScrutinzrWrk | there you are |
| 17:31.08 | MrPingu | I remember changing IO que to 4096 after someone suggested that here |
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| 17:31.41 | DocScrutinzrWrk | IO queue prolly doesn't help for swap |
| 17:32.25 | kerio | he didn't use sd swap |
| 17:32.32 | kerio | oh, he did |
| 17:32.37 | kerio | nvm |
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| 17:33.01 | MrPingu | How do you know what I did? :P |
| 17:33.18 | kerio | you don't have swap enabled on SD *now* |
| 17:33.22 | kerio | that's what you said |
| 17:33.33 | MrPingu | Enabled swap again on SD, lets see if it's stable |
| 17:34.00 | DocScrutinzrWrk | OL |
| 17:34.04 | DocScrutinzrWrk | LOL even |
| 17:35.28 | DocScrutinzrWrk | another cig.... bbl |
| 17:35.38 | MrPingu | enjoy |
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| 17:38.46 | DocScrutinizer51 | yeah thanks! will do |
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| 17:40.46 | DocScrutinizer51 | was ADCIN0 bat BSI and ADCIN1 temp? |
| 17:41.09 | kerio | haha i love how we can track your irc client based on your nickname |
| 17:41.31 | DocScrutinizer51 | freemangordon: ^ |
| 17:41.56 | DocScrutinizer51 | ShadowJK: ^ |
| 17:42.02 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: can't remember, I was always relying on you for that :D |
| 17:42.21 | DocScrutinizer51 | no schematics at hand |
| 17:42.24 | freemangordon | though I think it was adcin1 |
| 17:42.43 | freemangordon | for temp |
| 17:43.03 | DocScrutinizer51 | :nod: makes sense |
| 17:43.06 | freemangordon | zeq1: ping |
| 17:44.54 | DocScrutinizer51 | I stll wonder if 'somebody' was able to 'reset twl4030' |
| 17:44.55 | freemangordon | ADIN1: Battery temperature, according to TPS65950 Integrated Power Management/Audio Codec |
| 17:45.18 | DocScrutinizer51 | that's where I came from |
| 17:45.18 | freemangordon | ADIN0: Battery type/GP input |
| 17:46.03 | freemangordon | hmm, what was your question then? |
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| 17:52.46 | DocScrutinzrWrk | freemangordon: basically my question was if the schematics of N900 are in line with twl4030 TRM |
| 17:53.04 | freemangordon | aah, ok, misunderstood |
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| 18:30.46 | DocScrutinzrWrk | o/ |
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| 18:46.35 | DocScrutinizer51 | is eager to test bupbat chrg config with i2cget when at home |
| 18:47.12 | freemangordon | I am all for it |
| 18:47.51 | freemangordon | actually the only thing in n900 that annoys me to death is the fact that battery |
| 18:48.09 | freemangordon | on both devices I have is dead |
| 18:48.38 | freemangordon | so I have to set date/time everytime I remove the main battery |
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| 18:51.18 | DocScrutinizer51 | I won't hold my breath |
| 18:51.26 | freemangordon | :) |
| 18:51.45 | DocScrutinizer51 | after all some users changed bupbat for capacitor and reported it works |
| 18:52.04 | freemangordon | yeah, but if it is fixable by software... |
| 18:52.12 | DocScrutinizer51 | wouldn't if charging was completely KO |
| 18:52.31 | freemangordon | hmm, yeah, I see :( |
| 18:52.40 | DocScrutinizer51 | wouldn't work with capacitor |
| 18:52.59 | freemangordon | though that could be some leakage that charges the capacitor |
| 18:53.25 | DocScrutinizer51 | and on OM gta02 we had exactly same problem |
| 18:53.39 | freemangordon | bad batteries? |
| 18:53.47 | DocScrutinizer51 | hard to think we have same kernel problem there |
| 18:53.50 | DocScrutinizer51 | yep |
| 18:53.55 | freemangordon | damn |
| 18:54.06 | DocScrutinizer51 | same fsckng bad bupbat |
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| 18:55.28 | DocScrutinizer51 | plus I have ~50 spare components HBH414 or what's the name, and all are dead as well |
| 18:56.15 | DocScrutinizer51 | *all* |
| 18:56.23 | DocScrutinizer51 | 50 |
| 18:56.39 | freemangordon | fuck |
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| 19:02.28 | DocScrutinizer51 | indeed a freakin rippoff those japanese LiIon bupbat |
| 19:03.06 | freemangordon | zeq1: ping |
| 19:03.14 | DocScrutinizer51 | a primary cell would've performed better |
| 19:04.16 | DocScrutinizer51 | after all it's actually used _only_ wehn main bat removed |
| 19:04.30 | *** join/#maemo Shapeshifter (~Shapeshif@saskatoon.icu.uzh.ch) |
| 19:04.35 | fasta | Under what preconditions is date lost on n900? |
| 19:04.58 | kerio | fasta: failure of bupbat |
| 19:05.01 | kerio | ~bupbat |
| 19:05.02 | infobot | from memory, bupbat is http://www.mouser.com/catalog/632/2009.pdf http://il.farnell.com/taiyo-yuden/pas414hr-va5r/cap-0-06f-3-3v-80ohm-4-8mm-coin/dp/1853000?Ntt=PAS414HR-VA5R, or use the capacitive type, LiIon are breaking during 12 months |
| 19:05.04 | kerio | hm |
| 19:05.26 | fasta | kerio: does that fall under warranty? |
| 19:05.43 | freemangordon | why not? |
| 19:05.45 | kerio | fasta: sure |
| 19:05.54 | kerio | otoh, the second link there sells batteries for 1.21$ |
| 19:06.46 | DocScrutinizer51 | 60000 uF |
| 19:06.52 | fasta | If I turn the phone off, and wait a really long time, shoudn't the same thing happen? |
| 19:06.56 | DocScrutinizer51 | but hard to order them |
| 19:07.07 | kerio | fasta: of course not |
| 19:07.18 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: farnell? |
| 19:07.23 | kerio | the bl-5j can keep the real-time clock going for *a looooooooooooooong time* |
| 19:07.34 | DocScrutinizer51 | freemangordon: yup |
| 19:07.36 | fasta | kerio: how long is that? |
| 19:07.44 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: why hard then? |
| 19:08.15 | DocScrutinizer51 | they don't sell to customers here afaik, only b2b |
| 19:08.47 | DocScrutinizer51 | fasta: longer than any of us lives to tell |
| 19:09.02 | freemangordon | hmm, I bought some very special UHF transistors from them a few years ago, there was no problem |
| 19:09.11 | kerio | fasta: |---------------------| this long |
| 19:09.15 | kerio | (not in scale) |
| 19:09.32 | fasta | DocScrutinizer51: odd that a component can 'semi-work' then. |
| 19:09.57 | fasta | I'd expect it to either break completely or not. |
| 19:10.01 | freemangordon | fasta: there is a second battery in n900 which kicks in when main battery is remioved |
| 19:10.12 | freemangordon | removed even |
| 19:10.13 | kerio | fasta: the backup battery is supposed to keep the real-time clock going |
| 19:10.24 | kerio | but most batteries used in the production of n900s are known to fail |
| 19:10.28 | *** join/#maemo mzanetti (~mzanetti@2a01:4f8:130:8481::2) |
| 19:10.31 | freemangordon | it is the same as CSOM battery in the PCs |
| 19:10.38 | kerio | *cmos |
| 19:10.40 | freemangordon | yep, thanks |
| 19:10.44 | DocScrutinizer51 | ~1320 / 0.02 /24 / 365 |
| 19:10.44 | infobot | 7.534246575342 |
| 19:11.01 | DocScrutinizer51 | ooh, only 7.5 years |
| 19:11.04 | fasta | Is it easy to replace the component yourself? |
| 19:11.16 | freemangordon | well, noone knows the production year ;) |
| 19:11.18 | DocScrutinizer51 | if I didn't shift a decimal |
| 19:11.51 | freemangordon | it coulkd be easily around 1005 :D |
| 19:11.59 | freemangordon | 2005* |
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| 19:13.33 | DocScrutinizer51 | well, that's from one main battery charge |
| 19:13.57 | DocScrutinizer51 | assuming 20uA for RTC |
| 19:14.28 | DocScrutinizer51 | I've read it this afternoon but forgot |
| 19:17.13 | *** join/#maemo mzanetti (~mzanetti@2a01:4f8:130:8481::2) |
| 19:18.07 | DocScrutinizer51 | but less than 5s? c'mon! |
| 19:18.55 | DocScrutinizer51 | prolly a 47uF could do better |
| 19:19.33 | freemangordon | deffinitely :) |
| 19:20.29 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: could it be that it is undercharged? |
| 19:21.04 | DocScrutinizer51 | negative capacity? :-P |
| 19:21.14 | freemangordon | I meant the battery |
| 19:21.52 | DocScrutinizer51 | define undercharge |
| 19:22.36 | freemangordon | well, iirc controller assumes battery empty under 1.8 V |
| 19:22.56 | freemangordon | charges stops when he thinks there ar 2.5 V |
| 19:22.59 | *** join/#maemo antero (~antero@cs181045014.pp.htv.fi) |
| 19:23.07 | freemangordon | s/charges/charging/ |
| 19:23.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | ajustable |
| 19:23.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | 2.5..3.3 |
| 19:23.45 | freemangordon | yes, we don't know what is the exact threshold |
| 19:24.01 | freemangordon | btw who should do that, BME or kernel? |
| 19:24.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | kernel |
| 19:24.19 | freemangordon | twl4030 driver? |
| 19:24.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | yup |
| 19:24.35 | freemangordon | ok, lemme try to find what is going on |
| 19:24.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 19:24.44 | freemangordon | from the SW side |
| 19:24.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe it's e ven NOLO |
| 19:26.24 | freemangordon | well, kernel should not depend on the booloader |
| 19:26.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | should, yeah |
| 19:27.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | twl4030 is NOLO anyway, you need proper core voltages before booting linux |
| 19:27.20 | freemangordon | sure, but kernel reprograms it |
| 19:27.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe |
| 19:27.34 | freemangordon | deffinitely |
| 19:27.53 | freemangordon | at least SD/eMMC/SIM voltages are programmed by kernel |
| 19:27.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 19:28.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | and SR ;-) |
| 19:28.22 | freemangordon | yeah |
| 19:29.15 | freemangordon | twl4030_bci_battery.c |
| 19:29.26 | freemangordon | lets see what is in there |
| 19:29.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: |
| 19:30.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | bbl, needs chillout |
| 19:30.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | from doing nuttin at work, except reading TI TRM |
| 19:30.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P |
| 19:36.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | don't miss to post me an URL |
| 19:36.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | MXR |
| 19:36.59 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: the driver is not compiled/loaded |
| 19:38.00 | freemangordon | # CONFIG_TWL4030_BCI_BATTERY is not set |
| 19:38.35 | freemangordon | and I can bet noone charges the bugger :D |
| 19:39.06 | kerio | haha |
| 19:39.10 | kerio | awsum |
| 19:40.35 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer51: feel free to play with i2c tools, at least you can read the voltage and make the conclusions ;) |
| 19:43.13 | freemangordon | though I am tempted to compile that module and load it |
| 19:46.42 | sambo7 | hi nandtester here...my device is working again...internet,phone works...bluetooth doesn't |
| 19:47.56 | sambo7 | I guess all the things that need to read hw rev don't work |
| 19:48.10 | freemangordon | maybe you miss BT MAC |
| 19:48.51 | sambo7 | where/how can I locate that |
| 19:49.10 | sambo7 | wifi mac is ok |
| 19:49.28 | freemangordon | where did you get WIFI mac from? |
| 19:49.44 | freemangordon | or it was there? |
| 19:50.30 | sambo7 | it was there |
| 19:50.59 | freemangordon | hmm, anything in syslog/dmesg? |
| 19:51.37 | sambo7 | phone and wifi is ok...when I try to enable bt,I get some phonet messages in syslog |
| 19:52.56 | sambo7 | at least the last time I tried to enable it |
| 19:53.03 | sambo7 | this time no syslog entry |
| 19:54.16 | *** join/#maemo Free-MG (~test@p5DD7CF5F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:55.10 | sambo7 | bt not working doesn't bother me a lot |
| 19:56.09 | sambo7 | but I can't install many things,that seem to need to read hw rev to work properly |
| 19:57.29 | kerio | sambo7: wait, phone works? really? :O |
| 19:59.01 | kerio | well, looks like SOMEONE overestimated the importance of CAL |
| 19:59.13 | kerio | jacekowski: |
| 19:59.16 | sambo7 | at least it's ringing & I can initiate calls...will try if I get a connection...cause I'm not using it as a phone primarily |
| 19:59.45 | kerio | no one uses it as a phone primarily :) |
| 20:03.17 | kerio | i wonder if it's possible to use libcal to write the bt mac address |
| 20:04.37 | sambo7 | :)just switched my sim and....phone works-checked both directions |
| 20:06.27 | kerio | neat |
| 20:06.41 | jacekowski | sambo7: bt can probably be recovered |
| 20:07.26 | jacekowski | sambo7: how did you flash it in the end? |
| 20:07.37 | jacekowski | sambo7: phoenix? |
| 20:07.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | coldflash |
| 20:08.09 | sambo7 | can someone take a look at product info & tell me what should be written below Nokia N900, where my device says unknown |
| 20:09.17 | sambo7 | phoenix didn't work for me |
| 20:09.46 | sambo7 | coldflashing was successful but then tried to warm flash and failed |
| 20:10.20 | sambo7 | with flasher the cold flashing procedure which is described, didn't work for me to |
| 20:12.11 | sambo7 | flasher-3.5 -h RX-51:2101 -F RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2.203.1_PR_COMBINED_203_ARM.bin -c -S usb -f |
| 20:12.30 | sambo7 | this is,what helped me to revive my device in the end |
| 20:14.47 | kerio | are you sure your n900 is a 2101? |
| 20:14.54 | sambo7 | with the cold flashing procedure described I always got stuck after loading the temporary bl, because usb connection was lost |
| 20:15.11 | sambo7 | I'm not sure if it is |
| 20:15.38 | sambo7 | when I flashed I got some output with hw rev 0000 |
| 20:16.23 | sambo7 | which was then overriden by the flasher sw |
| 20:16.47 | kerio | i think that means "you nandtested your CAL, you moron" |
| 20:16.51 | sambo7 | the 0000 hw rev was what flasher got back from the device |
| 20:17.34 | sambo7 | I guess I knew that before;-) |
| 20:18.13 | sambo7 | anybody any experience with using nandwrite?:-) |
| 20:19.23 | kerio | assuming you've got a partially-working CAL now, you should use libcal |
| 20:19.37 | kerio | it's a library to read and write from CAL |
| 20:21.17 | sambo7 | I guess I will have to be the forerunner once again |
| 20:21.23 | kerio | :D |
| 20:21.27 | kerio | isn't that exciting? |
| 20:24.27 | *** join/#maemo diverse_izzue (~hunzikea@2606ds5-by.0.fullrate.dk) |
| 20:24.48 | sambo7 | somehow yes... |
| 20:25.02 | kerio | that's the spirit! |
| 20:25.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | sambo7: I used nandwrite to flash/partition other devices |
| 20:26.41 | sambo7 | is this CAL closed source or encrypted? |
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| 20:28.56 | sambo7 | is it still possible to figure out which hw rev my device has with the CAL erased? |
| 20:30.30 | kerio | sambo7: i think it's been partially reverse-engineered |
| 20:30.34 | kerio | the bad thing is that a part of it has to be signed |
| 20:30.41 | kerio | but idk, if the phone works... |
| 20:31.09 | sambo7 | can someone take a look at product info & tell me what should be written below Nokia N900, where my device says unknown |
| 20:31.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd flash a CAL image from another device |
| 20:31.40 | sambo7 | version also sys unknown...is this where the hw rev should be? |
| 20:32.00 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: what if the hw revs don't match? |
| 20:32.47 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: well, BCI module loaded, nothing happens :(. |
| 20:32.51 | kerio | sambo7: "Nokia N900" "Maemo 5" "Versione: 21.2011.38-1" "Indirizzo MAC WLAN: [redacted]" "Indirizzo Bluetooth: [redacted]" "IMEI: [oh hell no]" |
| 20:32.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | does "0000" match to anything? |
| 20:33.14 | kerio | sambo7: the hw rev should be in /proc/component_version |
| 20:33.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | not when CAL erased |
| 20:34.05 | kerio | well of course :) |
| 20:34.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | sambo7: try: |
| 20:34.42 | sambo7 | it says |
| 20:34.46 | sambo7 | product RX-51 nolo 1.4.14 boot-mode normal |
| 20:34.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | xterm on N900: pnatd |
| 20:34.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | ATI2 |
| 20:36.47 | kerio | how do i exit pnatd? D: |
| 20:37.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | sambo7: what do you get? |
| 20:37.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | close shell |
| 20:37.34 | sambo7 | V ICPR82_10w08 25-02-10 RX-51 (c) Nokia Nokia X-XXX (RX-51) Maemo (0.0.0) Linux version 2.6.28-omap1 |
| 20:37.34 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: that's not a good way :c |
| 20:37.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | or open another shel, killall pnatd |
| 20:37.43 | kerio | sambo7: ouch |
| 20:38.04 | kerio | haha it doesn't even know it's a n900 |
| 20:38.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: :-( |
| 20:38.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | err sambo7^^^ |
| 20:38.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | here it's Nokia N900 (RX-51 rev 2101) |
| 20:38.27 | kerio | same here |
| 20:38.29 | kerio | except it's 2104 |
| 20:38.36 | sambo7 | what would be a proper output? |
| 20:38.51 | kerio | hm, i wonder what are the changes between 2101 and 2104 |
| 20:39.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | nobody knows, but jes... err Nokia |
| 20:39.56 | sambo7 | what output do you guys get with that command |
| 20:40.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | sambo7: you *could* tell your printed device serial number, and ask if somebody has same range |
| 20:40.07 | kerio | sambo7: what DocScrutinizer05 said |
| 20:40.10 | beford | pnatd crashes here :| |
| 20:40.16 | kerio | beford: sudo pnatd |
| 20:40.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | o.O |
| 20:40.22 | beford | ah |
| 20:40.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | aaah |
| 20:40.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 20:40.27 | kerio | no, nvm |
| 20:40.31 | kerio | worksforme |
| 20:40.39 | kerio | no it doesn't |
| 20:40.45 | kerio | yeah, you need root privs |
| 20:40.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 20:40.54 | sambo7 | so where I have X-XXX it should be N900 |
| 20:40.59 | kerio | sambo7: yep :) |
| 20:41.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 20:41.29 | sambo7 | and what about (0.0.0)? |
| 20:41.37 | sambo7 | you got that too? |
| 20:41.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | V ICPR82_10w08 25-02-10 RX-51 (c) Nokia Nokia N900 (RX-51 rev 2101) Maemo 5 (21.2011.38.1) Linux version 2.6.28-omap1 Product 0560826A |
| 20:42.11 | kerio | V ICPR82_10w08 25-02-10 RX-51 (c) Nokia Nokia N900 (RX-51 rev 2104) Maemo 5 (21.2011.38.1) Linux version 2.6.28.10-power51 Product 0560826A |
| 20:42.21 | kerio | fuck yeah kernel-power |
| 20:42.24 | kerio | fuck yeah higher revision |
| 20:42.28 | sambo7 | so,no hw rev, no maemo and no product |
| 20:42.35 | sambo7 | for me# |
| 20:42.37 | kerio | yep |
| 20:43.15 | beford | V ICPR82_10w08 25-02-10 RX-51 (c) Nokia Nokia N900 (RX-51 rev 2101) Maemo 5 (21.2011.38.1) Linux version 2.6.28.10-cssu3 Product 0560952A |
| 20:43.30 | sambo7 | besides hw rev, I at least know/have the other data |
| 20:44.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | if you'd get your serial number (or IMEI) you could ask for others with similar and what's their hw-rev |
| 20:44.58 | sambo7 | so now it's up to find out about hw rev and try to get all the data back into my device |
| 20:45.35 | sambo7 | I can tell you both if this could help me to completely restore my N900 |
| 20:47.52 | sambo7 | if I knew where this infos reside in CAL/mtd1 I also could check out different hw revisions |
| 20:47.58 | sambo7 | these |
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| 20:50.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | CAL is a dynamic strucure, like a filesystem |
| 20:53.25 | sambo7 | maybe it's possible to find out hw rev with imei and product id...for Nokia? |
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| 21:00.34 | sambo7 | if I read /proc/cpuinfo I get this |
| 21:00.35 | sambo7 | Hardware : Nokia RX-51 board Revision : 2101 Serial : 0000000000000000 |
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| 21:03.18 | sambo7 | maybe some of you can check if this matches the hw rev you get when you look at /proc/component_version |
| 21:04.16 | jacekowski | that's probably in rom |
| 21:04.22 | vi__ | wait... |
| 21:04.28 | jacekowski | but yeah, that's the hw revision |
| 21:04.37 | vi__ | how TF did you hose your CAL? |
| 21:04.43 | jacekowski | nandtest |
| 21:04.55 | jacekowski | but i'm just testing stuff in qemu |
| 21:05.01 | vi__ | ffs, another one? |
| 21:05.05 | jacekowski | no |
| 21:05.08 | jacekowski | it's the same one |
| 21:05.17 | jacekowski | and i'm starting to think that nolo can write cal |
| 21:05.21 | jacekowski | dead cal |
| 21:05.26 | jacekowski | via flasher |
| 21:05.50 | jacekowski | i thought that nolo could write cal and everything |
| 21:06.10 | jacekowski | but after you managed to recover your n900 it looks more like it can write dead cal as well |
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| 21:09.09 | sambo7 | can I use cal from another device and write it to my device?if yes,how?with nandwrite?libcal? |
| 21:14.37 | sambo7 | I'm still waiting for my N900 that I got on ebay from GB...so I could take a look at a "hopefully" working device and compare one with each other |
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| 21:24.57 | vi__ | coldflash? |
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| 21:29.20 | sambo7 | vI_are you talking to me?I guess I already did that-> flasher-3.5 -h RX-51:2101 -F RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2.203.1_PR_COMBINED_203_ARM.bin -c -S usb -f |
| 21:33.23 | jacekowski | sambo7: you can even do dd if=/dev/mtdX |
| 21:33.29 | jacekowski | sambo7: to back it up on one device |
| 21:33.34 | jacekowski | sambo7: and similiar on the other to write |
| 21:34.28 | DocScrutinizer51 | not id there are bad plaocks |
| 21:34.36 | DocScrutinizer51 | blocks* damn |
| 21:35.20 | DocScrutinizer51 | btw main difference between hw revs might be organization of NAND |
| 21:35.29 | sambo7 | it did nanddump to back it up...does it do the same as dd? |
| 21:35.39 | sambo7 | at least for mtd |
| 21:43.36 | Macer | "patents" heh |
| 21:43.44 | Macer | the patent system is totally screwed |
| 21:44.02 | Macer | completely vague patents should be outlawed |
| 21:44.57 | Macer | my tf101 has "rounded corners" |
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| 23:21.00 | SpeedEvil | Everything has rounded corners. |
| 23:21.08 | SpeedEvil | Atoms are not rectiliniar. |
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