| 00:24.44 | *** join/#maemo damiano (~damiano@dynamic-adsl-78-13-148-133.clienti.tiscali.it) |
| 00:36.27 | TiagoTiago|AFK | Is there a way to do a backup using the builtin backup system but just from the console, without having access to the GUI? |
| 00:44.42 | DocScrutinizer | alas not, what an idiocy |
| 00:45.09 | DocScrutinizer | stopped me from implementing a nice automatic backup scheduled by alarmed |
| 00:46.18 | DocScrutinizer | btw exactly same shit with notes app, you can't tell it to open a particular file, which very effectively defeated my simple approach to have a icon shortcut to a shopping list on desktop |
| 00:46.57 | TiagoTiago | Does the builtin backup proggie does anything special or can all the steps to recreate a valid backup file be performed by a shell script? |
| 00:47.26 | DocScrutinizer | good question,probably it could, if you knew exactly what it does |
| 00:48.14 | TiagoTiago | Is that documented somewhere? |
| 00:48.43 | TiagoTiago | I mean, somewhere where the public in general can see online without the need to sign an NDA nor anything such |
| 00:48.57 | ShadowJK | it does stop some services during backup, iirc |
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| 00:52.43 | TiagoTiago | http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Generic_Platform_Components/Using_Backup_Application#D-Bus_description_and_methods_of_back-up_application ; in particular: "Method: activate"..."Description: "Used to activate the application with auto-activation". I s that what i'm looking for? |
| 00:54.41 | DocScrutinizer | prolly not, iirc I looked into it and it still doesn't do unattended backup |
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| 00:55.26 | DocScrutinizer | I.E. it still pops up the GUI and needs attention from user to proceed |
| 00:56.20 | TiagoTiago | Why is it called auto-activation if it isn't automated and just another way to start the GUI? |
| 00:56.25 | DocScrutinizer | but I'd appreciate when you look into it again, to make sure |
| 00:58.04 | TiagoTiago | That would be much easier if i had a working screen to see what is going on... |
| 01:00.06 | DocScrutinizer | aaah |
| 01:00.36 | DocScrutinizer | >>For backing up, the backup_start and backup_finish D-Bus signals will be emitted on the session bus, indicating to applications that they should not write to disk.<< HAHA I wonder how many apps are aware of and obey those |
| 01:01.50 | TiagoTiago | I didn't expect things would go this bad with a simple resolder job performed by someone that does things like that for a living. Obviously i should've backuped anyway, hindsight 20/20... |
| 01:04.06 | DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: >> Method activate Parameters none Returns Empty reply Description Used to activate the application with auto-activation << since that's the only method, and it takes no parameters, I conclude it's how HAM is invoking backup when a OS update is due. This will not result in unattended backup afaik |
| 01:04.33 | TiagoTiago | :( |
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| 01:06.55 | villager | TiagoTiago: probably that auto-activate was so that the application manager can start the backup application before a system upgrade |
| 01:07.21 | TiagoTiago | Btw, do you know of a way i can copy everything from a N900 to a Windows machine i such a way that all the file properties, symlinks etc will be restored properly when copying back to the N900? |
| 01:07.28 | TiagoTiago | in such* |
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| 01:11.11 | villager | perhaps you have to use tar for that... or use some backup server that can store stuff like that in some kind of database... |
| 01:15.12 | damiano | you could use tar and netcat to transfer |
| 01:15.49 | TiagoTiago | Can the tar be created already on the Widnows machine? I'm not sure i got enough free space on the N900... |
| 01:16.40 | damiano | you can send on the fly |
| 01:18.08 | villager | yes... basically, tar to stdout, then send stdout through netcat or ssh or whatever to something on the windows machine |
| 01:19.15 | damiano | exactly argumet for f option is "-" |
| 01:19.17 | villager | but the tar command must run on the n900, of course... on the windows machine it's too late |
| 01:20.36 | damiano | on windows you need to run only netcat server |
| 01:20.56 | DocScrutinizer | netcat? |
| 01:20.59 | DocScrutinizer | ssh! |
| 01:21.35 | damiano | why not netcat? |
| 01:21.53 | DocScrutinizer | why netcat? |
| 01:22.09 | damiano | netcat doesn't crypt and so is faster |
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| 01:22.54 | damiano | you have slow cpu on n900 |
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| 01:24.18 | DocScrutinizer | umm |
| 01:24.59 | damiano | if you are in a trusted lan of course |
| 01:25.25 | DocScrutinizer | and if you got the nerves to set up netcat on *both* ends |
| 01:25.51 | damiano | It's not more difficult than set ssh |
| 01:26.12 | villager | I'd expect it to be easier to make a netcat server than a ssh server on windows |
| 01:26.20 | DocScrutinizer | while a ssh N900 tar -foobar >this/is/on/local/PC/backup.tgz is painless to set up |
| 01:26.34 | DocScrutinizer | damiano: mhm, is it? |
| 01:27.21 | DocScrutinizer | ohwell, windows, NFC |
| 01:27.39 | DocScrutinizer | is *anything* simple on windows? except losing your mind |
| 01:27.41 | TiagoTiago | What's NFC? |
| 01:27.47 | DocScrutinizer | ~nfc |
| 01:27.48 | infobot | from memory, nfc is No Fucking Clue, or near field communications |
| 01:27.56 | TiagoTiago | thanx |
| 01:28.00 | damiano | we talk about transfer to windowss machine |
| 01:28.24 | TiagoTiago | there are lots of things simpler on Windows, specially if you're familiar with it; but i guess the same could be said about Linux |
| 01:29.41 | damiano | I don't understand the problem |
| 01:29.42 | villager | I suppose it would work to do a "ssh n900 tar > ..." from windows if you're using something like cygwin there |
| 01:31.58 | DocScrutinizer | I guess it could even work in dosbox |
| 01:31.58 | villager | but for most windows gui ssh clients it would be a no go |
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| 01:33.02 | DocScrutinizer | no idea if there's a cmdline ssh client for dosbox though |
| 01:33.06 | damiano | There should be a ssh server for windows |
| 01:33.33 | damiano | I think |
| 01:33.34 | DocScrutinizer | I refuse to discuss windows stuff :-D |
| 01:33.46 | TiagoTiago | I think one comes with cygwin |
| 01:34.05 | damiano | I'm not a windows user so I'm not sure |
| 01:34.07 | DocScrutinizer | I'm cursed to use windows on my daywork, and I'm happy I found cygwin lately |
| 01:34.10 | TiagoTiago | http://www.fs-driver.org/ <- seems promising |
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| 01:35.42 | villager | TiagoTiago: that's not going to help you, it requires you to have an ext2 partition on the windows machine, *and* it still can't handle attributes and symlinks |
| 01:35.54 | TiagoTiago | oh, damn :( |
| 01:36.30 | DocScrutinizer | suggests to crank up a linux in a VM and use rsync |
| 01:36.30 | villager | it's useful only for a dual boot system to allow the windows to access the linux files, I use it on my laptop |
| 01:36.49 | villager | yeah, a vm could work |
| 01:37.17 | DocScrutinizer | for tested rsync invocation see: |
| 01:37.19 | damiano | you don't need it furthermore |
| 01:37.21 | DocScrutinizer | ~jrtools |
| 01:37.22 | infobot | it has been said that jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools |
| 01:39.17 | DocScrutinizer | but honestly if you already can log in to device via ssh, why not simply copy everything to either uSD right away, or to MyDocs and from there via mass-storage-mode |
| 01:40.58 | DocScrutinizer | aaah mass storage no option, when USB broken |
| 01:41.08 | DocScrutinizer | so you still got uSD |
| 01:42.02 | DocScrutinizer | btw if you opt for tar, do NOT use compression! |
| 01:42.24 | DocScrutinizer | it *really* will slow down things to a grinding halt |
| 01:43.14 | DocScrutinizer | (while encryption in shh is no major issue, at least here) |
| 01:43.15 | TiagoTiago | Do you happen to know of a free SSH enabled FTP client with decent download resuming capabilities, that does store the linux file system metadata in a manner that can be reapplied when uploading? |
| 01:43.35 | TiagoTiago | I mean, one that rusn on Windows |
| 01:44.04 | DocScrutinizer | no way to make ftp store metadata on a fs that'S not compatible |
| 01:44.26 | TiagoTiago | Also being able to throttle the download speed from within the program to keep the N900 from crashing from the intense disk activity would be great |
| 01:44.37 | villager | not sure ftp even supports transferring attributes |
| 01:44.51 | DocScrutinizer | neither |
| 01:45.08 | TiagoTiago | i don't mean store it the way Linux does, but perhaps using it's own format in a parallel database, and then reapplying that metadata when uploading |
| 01:45.12 | DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: no crashing will happen |
| 01:45.17 | TiagoTiago | it has for me |
| 01:45.25 | DocScrutinizer | not on reading |
| 01:45.49 | TiagoTiago | intense disk activity freezes the system enough that some watchdog or whatever kills essential system process and forces a reboot |
| 01:45.58 | DocScrutinizer | might be an issue when copying on device from eMMC to uSD |
| 01:46.17 | DocScrutinizer | meh, never happened here |
| 01:46.43 | DocScrutinizer | only thing that could cause this is swap hell |
| 01:46.56 | DocScrutinizer | on reading you'll not see any swap hell I'd guess |
| 01:47.11 | TiagoTiago | The way shit's been falling apart i probably got some aged unit from the store or somthing |
| 01:47.34 | DocScrutinizer | unlikely the cause of any of your problems |
| 01:49.14 | villager | such reboots have happened to me, but that was when doing lots of crap to big loopback-mounted filesystem (stored on eMMC), with lots of swapping thrown in |
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| 01:50.55 | villager | I don't think just reading the filesystem would do it |
| 01:51.20 | TiagoTiago | My screen looks like it has been thru a micrometeorite shower in a couple patches, the keys are loosing the paint on the inside (or at least looks that way), the USB and flex seems to have failed much sooner; battery life always sucked big time, freezes from disk activity have been common from the start, and even the lowest ranges of OC most people consider safe are dangerous to try; i... |
| 01:51.22 | TiagoTiago | ...don't think the unit i got was one of the best individuals of the species |
| 01:53.33 | TiagoTiago | (not the expression i was going for, but i can't remember the exact words right now) |
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| 02:05.28 | DocScrutinizer | well, you started with OC which is a warranty for problems by its own as well as you doing other silly thinsg as well. Don't blame device for that |
| 02:05.55 | robbiethe1st | If you're OCing, you'd better be tweaking the voltages to your device. If you expect it to work right, anyway. |
| 02:06.19 | robbiethe1st | Using a stock OC profile, is, well, asking for trouble. On top of the other potential OC issues. |
| 02:06.30 | DocScrutinizer | you better don't even think about OC unless you have a *very* clearly defined need for it |
| 02:07.05 | robbiethe1st | Or, just remember that it could kill your phone and be OK with that. |
| 02:07.26 | DocScrutinizer | you as well shouldn't ponder using any random widget or app you run into, just because it sounds 17337 |
| 02:07.45 | DocScrutinizer | nope |
| 02:08.08 | DocScrutinizer | it's always those who OC for no good reason that complain the most about crappy hardware |
| 02:08.33 | DocScrutinizer | don't you think there's a more than random correlation? |
| 02:08.40 | TiagoTiago | In the end i couldn't get it to perform any less crapy, and it was never really stable, i didn't leave it OC'd |
| 02:08.57 | robbiethe1st | I dunno; I've had two random N900s that have OC'd perfectly nicely; no crashes. I'd say it's more because such people can't follow instructions right... |
| 02:09.25 | TiagoTiago | It would get hotter with just plain charging or installing an update anyway, so i don't think that would explain the issues with the keys and the screen surface |
| 02:09.32 | DocScrutinizer | you never tried with stock setup. instead you complained about performance (caused by crap you installed or did to device) and tried to fix it by adding more crap on top |
| 02:10.00 | TiagoTiago | it was crappy with stock material already |
| 02:10.17 | DocScrutinizer | pff |
| 02:10.48 | DocScrutinizer | then your metrics are different than mine, and N900 definitely not the device for you |
| 02:10.55 | DocScrutinizer | get an iphone! |
| 02:11.16 | TiagoTiago | Like i said, it's not the model, it's this unit in specific |
| 02:11.31 | DocScrutinizer | when it was crappy with stock settings already, then WTF did you get it first instance? |
| 02:12.11 | DocScrutinizer | BS |
| 02:12.30 | robbiethe1st | Wwell, to be fair, stock settings were pretty bad |
| 02:12.34 | TiagoTiago | The N900 is great, i just got unlucky. |
| 02:12.39 | DocScrutinizer | there are no units with crappy performance |
| 02:13.28 | TiagoTiago | brb |
| 02:13.29 | DocScrutinizer | this is not a cake that's different each time |
| 02:13.53 | damiano | I can't oc with smartreflex |
| 02:13.53 | DocScrutinizer | OMG |
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| 02:14.32 | DocScrutinizer | deletes the answer |
| 02:14.35 | damiano | my n900 become unstable |
| 02:14.48 | DocScrutinizer | OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG |
| 02:14.59 | robbiethe1st | smartreflex is not usable. Period. |
| 02:15.11 | DocScrutinizer | mine even doesn't run at all - when battery empty |
| 02:15.42 | damiano | is it usual? |
| 02:15.49 | DocScrutinizer | suspects april's fool trolling at its best |
| 02:17.01 | damiano | if I remove smartreflex I can reach 1150 without problems but heat and battery |
| 02:17.18 | DocScrutinizer | is it usual my car doesn't run on gasoil when it's a gasoline type? it doesn't work on gasoil even when I cut up all the tires |
| 02:17.45 | damiano | ? |
| 02:17.59 | robbiethe1st | He's being sarcastic. DocS doesn't like OC |
| 02:18.08 | TiagoTiago | Dunno, perhaps the luggage handlers threw the bag a bit, or the Sun might've been particularly active during that flight; or simply i i got unlucky and Nokia had a bad batch of components when they were building my unit ('ive seen that happen with other eletronic devices) |
| 02:18.09 | damiano | ah ok |
| 02:19.00 | DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: so what? this causing watchdog to kick in on lots of reads?? BWAHAHA |
| 02:19.58 | DocScrutinizer | bad components make things FAIL, not going "crappy performance" |
| 02:20.18 | DocScrutinizer | usually |
| 02:20.24 | damiano | do you think there is a chance to see maemo on new smartphone in the future? |
| 02:20.31 | TiagoTiago | Bad storage media gradually corrupting one or two bits here and there, bad conduits making some actions run a tad slower etc |
| 02:20.33 | DocScrutinizer | no |
| 02:20.42 | robbiethe1st | That being said, ECC(and related technology) is designed to mitigate borderline random issues... |
| 02:20.53 | DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: that's nonsense |
| 02:21.10 | damiano | I like maemo I think tizen won't be same thing |
| 02:21.16 | TiagoTiago | robbiethe1st: doesn't the performance get degraded a bit when those things spot a mistake? |
| 02:21.17 | robbiethe1st | a borderline OC'd device can create 'random' issues as one or another borderline voltage just barely turns on a transistor |
| 02:21.22 | DocScrutinizer | tizen already dead |
| 02:21.23 | robbiethe1st | Yes. |
| 02:21.53 | DocScrutinizer | robbiethe1st: that's analog |
| 02:22.03 | DocScrutinizer | this however is a mainly digital device |
| 02:22.03 | damiano | but it isn't born yet... |
| 02:22.16 | robbiethe1st | And a digital device doesn't have those issues? Suuure. |
| 02:22.36 | robbiethe1st | When a CPU's being run at borderline voltages already... which is done to reduce power usage.. |
| 02:22.39 | TiagoTiago | Digital is just a less smooth analog |
| 02:22.49 | DocScrutinizer | it won't see gradual decay of performance on those issues. It simply starts to fail completely |
| 02:23.00 | DocScrutinizer | TiagoTiago: again BS |
| 02:23.04 | DocScrutinizer | for this topic |
| 02:23.05 | robbiethe1st | That's true |
| 02:24.02 | DocScrutinizer | there's no such thing as slow bits |
| 02:24.11 | ShadowJK | Even TI says smartreflex is broken and unusable now |
| 02:24.58 | TiagoTiago | Didn't a loose cable ''cause scientists to think neutrinos might had been moving faster than the speed of light due to the delays 'caused by the bad connection? |
| 02:25.22 | damiano | yes here in Italy |
| 02:25.25 | robbiethe1st | Yes. |
| 02:25.28 | damiano | :-) |
| 02:25.37 | robbiethe1st | And timing can screw up just about anything |
| 02:25.39 | DocScrutinizer | well, let alone the delay in the reporter's nerve signal propagation |
| 02:26.41 | TiagoTiago | 'caused* |
| 02:26.51 | TiagoTiago | caused* |
| 02:27.24 | DocScrutinizer | I recently found a blob of neutrinos between two of the ALU gates in my SoC. Cleaned it out and guess what - my device is twice as fast now |
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| 02:27.56 | TiagoTiago | Their high speed were probably causing some time dilatation effects... |
| 02:28.50 | damiano | I have a problem with missed calls and I don't know what to do... don't appear in the log |
| 02:29.18 | DocScrutinizer | yawns |
| 02:29.21 | TiagoTiago | That, or the time paradoxes were wrecking havoc with the error correction stuff |
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| 02:30.32 | DocScrutinizer | listen buddy, there's no error correction anywhere except storage. on read it won't delay things, on write it only will delay *once* then block is marked bad and not used anymore |
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| 02:31.48 | damiano | when I receive a call and I don't see it no sign remains of it |
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| 02:32.10 | DocScrutinizer | quite usually (in 99.9999% of cases) an error in digital domain simply causes a segfault or a wrong behaviour of a program, never a delay though |
| 02:32.40 | DocScrutinizer | when you receive a call and you don't see it then you're not receiving a call |
| 02:33.09 | damiano | I didn't notice I mean |
| 02:33.13 | TiagoTiago | Perhaps the filesystem is readonly and it can't log new calls? |
| 02:33.23 | DocScrutinizer | if however you mean your missed calls are ringing but not logged then I suggest you clean your eventsdb |
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| 02:33.35 | DocScrutinizer | it's known to get corrupt eventually |
| 02:33.44 | DocScrutinizer | occasionally rather |
| 02:34.44 | DocScrutinizer | esp since with corrupt eventsdb you also might miss SMS afaik |
| 02:34.59 | damiano | filesystem is rw |
| 02:35.14 | DocScrutinizer | yawns louder |
| 02:35.25 | damiano | do I need to remove it? |
| 02:35.50 | DocScrutinizer | there's a couple of threads in tmo that describe how to fix the corruption |
| 02:36.20 | DocScrutinizer | or you simply delete the whole db and hope for it getting recreated on next usage |
| 02:36.32 | DocScrutinizer | might or might not work |
| 02:37.06 | DocScrutinizer | maybe it even helps to delete all those old conversations |
| 02:38.07 | DocScrutinizer | or you go fancy and use sqlite cli to purge the whole db table |
| 02:39.01 | damiano | I don't find those threads... |
| 02:40.16 | damiano | ohi ohi |
| 02:40.30 | DocScrutinizer | without checking I think http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1182569&postcount=369 is what you search |
| 02:42.55 | damiano | I'll try to remove db |
| 02:43.26 | DocScrutinizer | ithout warranty |
| 02:43.35 | DocScrutinizer | you might end reflashing |
| 02:44.19 | DocScrutinizer | or simply restoring prev state via backupmenu (haven't thanked robbiethe1st today for it yet) |
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| 02:56.49 | damiano | no it doesn't resolve |
| 02:58.43 | damiano | if I refuse call then it is reported in the log with a green arrow like received ones |
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| 03:03.09 | damiano | :-( |
| 03:07.13 | DocScrutinizer | strange |
| 03:07.41 | DocScrutinizer | may I suggest the 'easy windows solution"? reflash |
| 03:09.33 | DocScrutinizer | probably will need a full reflash (combined + vanilla) to clean homedir |
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| 03:10.11 | DocScrutinizer | still with a proper set of backup of MyDocs and backup app you'll not lose anything |
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| 04:56.38 | Macer | watching the hunger games |
| 04:56.40 | Macer | it's pretty awesome |
| 04:56.48 | Macer | very well made movie |
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| 11:25.12 | MrPingu | DocScrutinizer? |
| 11:26.18 | MrPingu | Sorry about yesterday's mediafire, it used to be good on MicroB, times have changed -.- |
| 11:26.24 | MrPingu | New link: https://gist.github.com/cb83c248423a77b92a07 |
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| 11:32.42 | DocScrutinizer | MrPingu: thanks |
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| 15:33.19 | jonwil | hi |
| 15:33.23 | jonwil | ~seen pali |
| 15:33.32 | infobot | pali is currently on #maemo (2h 44m 29s) #maemo-ssu (2h 44m 29s), last said: 'err, not finite but pushdown automaton'. |
| 15:38.50 | Pali | jonwil, hi |
| 15:39.33 | jonwil | You ever hear anything more from the Nokia people? |
| 15:40.13 | Pali | no, nothing |
| 15:40.39 | jonwil | ok :( |
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| 15:43.05 | Pali | jonwil, can you look at cbs widget problem reported in TMO? |
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| 15:43.20 | jonwil | what problem? |
| 15:43.41 | Pali | it show me @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ |
| 15:43.55 | Pali | see my post in your tmo thread |
| 15:44.13 | Pali | my idea is that this patch should be problem: https://gitorious.org/~pali/community-ssu/pali-operator-name-cbs-widget/commit/533fb818be137879b800db3feb755134913b198b |
| 15:44.23 | Pali | but I did not tried compile it yet |
| 15:45.24 | jonwil | Can you tell me what the output of ls -l /usr/lib/libsms* on the device in question looks like? |
| 15:46.30 | Pali | I do not have my n900 here |
| 15:46.37 | Pali | but libsms is correctly patched |
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| 15:46.52 | Pali | it sometimes show that @@@@@ and sometimes correct cell name |
| 15:47.48 | jonwil | The way to tell whats going on is to enable the CBSMS logging and grab logs of when its showing the @ symbols |
| 15:48.44 | Pali | my logs was same as that attached by other people in that thread |
| 15:49.05 | Pali | if you want really my logs, I can attach it to that thread tomorow |
| 15:50.00 | jonwil | ok |
| 15:50.28 | jonwil | well I dont know why this is happening, the way libsms.so works it shouldn't be possible for that to happen |
| 15:52.27 | jonwil | Most useful way to find out whats going in would be to packet log the phonet packets being sent for the invalid CBSMS in question |
| 15:52.36 | jonwil | but I cant remember how to do that off the top of my head |
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| 16:00.10 | jonwil | in any case I dont think your patch is the correct fix, the correct fix is to dump the phonet packets and find out exactly what the cbsms phonet packet looks like and then find out why its displaying the @ symbol based on that |
| 16:01.17 | jonwil | I do know that I was getting the @ symbol before myself and it was caused because somehow (without me knowing) something had screwed up and the symlinks and patches related to libsms.so had screwed up somehow |
| 16:01.33 | jonwil | in your case thats not the case because you sometimes get correct output, sometimes now |
| 16:01.35 | jonwil | not |
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| 18:48.05 | Sicelo | thinks about the elections |
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| 19:00.29 | DocScrutinizer | burp |
| 19:00.33 | DocScrutinizer | elections? |
| 19:01.14 | DocScrutinizer | guesses there's again another council election maybe |
| 19:02.06 | DocScrutinizer | I wonder if it will be "better" than last one. Last one went unnoticed, I didn't even receive a token or whatever |
| 19:03.09 | DocScrutinizer | probably it got cancelled due to number of applicants < number of council seats |
| 19:03.57 | Sicelo | SD69 really tried |
| 19:05.34 | Sicelo | DocScrutinizer: why don't you run? ;) |
| 19:06.28 | DocScrutinizer | ME??? |
| 19:06.37 | ShadowJK | no nominations so far |
| 19:06.37 | DocScrutinizer | XP |
| 19:06.38 | ShadowJK | :P |
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| 19:08.00 | Sicelo | is relatively new to maemo.. |
| 19:08.19 | Sicelo | what did previous councils achieve? |
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| 19:09.14 | ShadowJK | that's a bit of a weird question |
| 19:10.50 | ShadowJK | It's not like there ever was a shortage of people with bright ideas and strong opinions |
| 19:10.58 | ShadowJK | there's a shortage of doers :P |
| 19:11.22 | Sicelo | yeah. true that |
| 19:13.55 | Sicelo | wrt elections, CrashandDie says : Frankly, I think this telling. Maybe it's time to consider wrapping things up in a "so long and thanks for all the fish"-kinda way? |
| 19:14.55 | ShadowJK | Well there's not much of a point with having a council to communicate with Nokia when Nokia is dead :P |
| 19:15.39 | ShadowJK | But for sure maemo.org should be kept up years still for people still using their devices |
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| 19:16.26 | Sicelo | is that something having a council could help in? :/ |
| 19:16.28 | DocScrutinizer | indeed |
| 19:17.38 | DocScrutinizer | Sicelo: not really, unless you consider council an authority that it never was meant to be |
| 19:18.03 | DocScrutinizer | or a service provider that it also never been |
| 19:18.28 | Sicelo | gotcha |
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| 19:20.27 | DocScrutinizer | of course council could decide to accept either or even both roles |
| 19:21.06 | DocScrutinizer | community at large probably won't accept authorities anyway |
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| 19:22.38 | DocScrutinizer | hell, they blamed me for formerly being a member of Openmoko_the_Inc and still I take care about 'our' server infra. Some guy actually demanded "we" shall give OM to 'the community' |
| 19:23.40 | Sicelo | heh |
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| 19:25.05 | DocScrutinizer | community server admin - here's the password. SURE! |
| 19:25.22 | *** join/#maemo vi__ (~user@72.76.113.87.dyn.plus.net) |
| 19:25.49 | vi__ | hello |
| 19:26.16 | vi__ | what is the name of the program that displays a picture of the program you are currently loading? |
| 19:26.26 | vi__ | pvr somthing?? |
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| 19:26.39 | Sicelo | i do think sometimes we take things too far when it comes to open source and related stuff |
| 19:28.01 | vi__ | Sicelo: ?? |
| 19:28.39 | DocScrutinizer | vi__: yeah, sth like that |
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| 19:29.06 | Sicelo | vi__: community at large probably won't accept authorities anyway.. << i was just echoing this comment |
| 19:32.13 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer: can I remove it? |
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| 19:33.33 | DocScrutinizer | vi__: I think it's a function in H-D. You only could comment it out, or neuter it in any other way (e.g. by removing the pvr pictures and setting the dir r/o) |
| 19:33.45 | DocScrutinizer | mere handwaving though |
| 19:34.06 | vi__ | bleh |
| 19:34.09 | vi__ | thanks |
| 19:34.24 | DocScrutinizer | btw iirc it actually needs code in every app using it |
| 19:34.37 | DocScrutinizer | at least to create the image |
| 19:35.03 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG might know details, he looked closer nto it |
| 19:35.05 | vi__ | it is a waste of precious cpu cycles and the pictures are always out of date. |
| 19:35.12 | DocScrutinizer | yep, sure |
| 19:35.24 | DocScrutinizer | and it nags big time |
| 19:35.49 | DocScrutinizer | I *always* try to scroll down in settings screen before it's actually loaded |
| 19:36.07 | DocScrutinizer | annoying nonsense |
| 19:36.19 | vi__ | yup |
| 19:37.13 | Sicelo | hmm, what are you talking about? |
| 19:38.28 | ShadowJK | splash screen |
| 19:38.37 | DocScrutinizer | the pvr thingie, that shows a picture of the app before the app actually starts |
| 19:38.39 | ShadowJK | shows pic of app before app is loaded |
| 19:38.57 | DocScrutinizer | introduced with PR1.2 iirc |
| 19:39.44 | DocScrutinizer | and I'd think a valid candidate for a CSSU config option "X-CSSU-NO-PVR" |
| 19:39.45 | ShadowJK | i thought it existed in first version |
| 19:40.44 | Sicelo | well, i'm possibly blind/dumb.. i don't see it here |
| 19:40.58 | DocScrutinizer | then it's actually working for you ;-P |
| 19:41.44 | DocScrutinizer | e.g in settings screen you might notice some of the menu points pop up or vanish some 2 seconds after the screen initially pops up |
| 19:42.03 | DocScrutinizer | until then what you see was a snapshot, not the real program |
| 19:42.08 | ShadowJK | Do you see spinning circle in titlebar when you open settings? |
| 19:42.12 | Sicelo | ah, now i get you |
| 19:42.54 | Sicelo | i never knew that was some splashscreen |
| 19:44.12 | ShadowJK | it's a screenshot of the app |
| 19:46.38 | DocScrutinizer | I'd honestly prefer the big spinning wheel like it was in early PR version iirc |
| 19:47.47 | DocScrutinizer | or simply blanking the screen. Some kind of feedback is actually fine though |
| 19:48.08 | ShadowJK | i don't remember a big spinning wheel |
| 19:48.09 | ShadowJK | ever |
| 19:48.13 | Sicelo | i suppose they introduced it to fool us noobs -- i understand people complained that N900 apps take long to load. this PVR thing is nice April's fool :D |
| 19:48.19 | DocScrutinizer | otherwise you try to hit button / icon again, as you don't think it's already working |
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| 19:55.25 | Sicelo | i notice MAG also developed some app to customize the PVR files |
| 19:57.03 | *** join/#maemo DHR (~hugh@CPE00606767ed59-CM000f9fa81660.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 19:57.04 | DocScrutinizer | yep |
| 19:57.37 | DocScrutinizer | I forgot the name, and why I didn't use it though |
| 20:00.12 | vi__ | 'pvrcreator' |
| 20:00.14 | DocScrutinizer | I think my idea was to automate the editing of those PVR images, to simply blur them or whatever |
| 20:00.36 | DocScrutinizer | pvrcreator can't probably do that |
| 20:01.38 | *** join/#maemo ALoGeNo (~alogeno@unaffiliated/alogeno) |
| 20:02.32 | DocScrutinizer | vi__: my TAB gets me pvrsrvinit |
| 20:02.35 | DocScrutinizer | nfc |
| 20:03.40 | vi__ | so why wont those nemo guys compile a fixed powervr driver for n900 maemo kernel? |
| 20:03.42 | DocScrutinizer | doesn't accept --help |
| 20:03.58 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer: exactly whqat i just tried. |
| 20:04.30 | vi__ | another of those nokia cmd bodges that doesnt provide any cmd line help |
| 20:05.30 | *** join/#maemo vblazquez (~vic@122.199.19.95.dynamic.jazztel.es) |
| 20:05.42 | vi__ | ala commandline tool for calander engine. |
| 20:05.47 | vi__ | worst |
| 20:05.49 | vi__ | program |
| 20:05.51 | vi__ | ever |
| 20:09.02 | MrPingu | I guess ussd widget =/ |
| 20:09.20 | vi__ | is there a legitimate way to emulate middle click with xbindkeys? |
| 20:09.43 | MrPingu | Is there a way to emulate right click? |
| 20:09.44 | vi__ | for example can xbindkeys detect the press/release of a button |
| 20:09.59 | vi__ | MrPingu: press and hold |
| 20:13.02 | ShadowJK | vi__; they don't have powervr source? |
| 20:13.32 | ShadowJK | besides, it's a bloody pain to make new drivers work on ancient kernels.. |
| 20:14.06 | DocScrutinizer | vi__: it's called in /etc/event.d/sgx: |
| 20:15.29 | DocScrutinizer | MrPingu: ussd widget? |
| 20:16.02 | DocScrutinizer | it's a) not Nokia, b) no cmdline tool, c) obsolete |
| 20:18.16 | MrPingu | Well ussd widget can't display my creditbalance |
| 20:18.29 | MrPingu | while ussd app does it =/ |
| 20:19.05 | *** join/#maemo retro|cz (~retro@106.142.broadband6.iol.cz) |
| 20:19.26 | MrPingu | Keeps saying: click to update so I uninstalled it... |
| 20:19.46 | MrPingu | Anyway to display credit through qbw? |
| 20:22.38 | DocScrutinizer | umm, aah. you want a widget that automatically displays the reply |
| 20:23.33 | MrPingu | Yeah ;) |
| 20:24.01 | DocScrutinizer | I'd recommend not to do that, it eats large amounts of your battery, by inadvertently sending via cellmo to BTS to inquire the balance |
| 20:24.37 | MrPingu | vi__ right click doesn't work in chromium in Easy Debian, when holding... |
| 20:24.41 | DocScrutinizer | for sure you're better of with a "click to update" approach |
| 20:25.06 | DocScrutinizer | better off even |
| 20:25.30 | MrPingu | Well I meant, click to update. I want just to see quickly my left credit |
| 20:25.54 | MrPingu | Way faster, than phone and dialing *101# |
| 20:26.03 | DocScrutinizer | I got a contact "balance" with number "*103#" and a shortcut to that contact on my desktop, so it's a matter of two clicks for me to get my balance on demand |
| 20:26.19 | MrPingu | And I sometimes forget to check xD |
| 20:26.36 | MrPingu | Like today, thought of calling someone to pick me up |
| 20:26.45 | MrPingu | no credit left... |
| 20:27.10 | MrPingu | Yep, long way home :P |
| 20:27.16 | DocScrutinizer | doing the query at random is no sensible approach |
| 20:28.06 | DocScrutinizer | and usually your provider offers a service to remind you with an SMS when your balance drops below some particular amount |
| 20:28.18 | DocScrutinizer | mine does at least |
| 20:28.53 | MrPingu | Yes they do, but that's when I still have 500 SMS left -.- |
| 20:28.59 | DocScrutinizer | you forgetting to check is a problem that's impossible to solve |
| 20:29.20 | MrPingu | Yes but a desktop widget would help reminding me ;) |
| 20:29.48 | DocScrutinizer | then check once a day? |
| 20:29.54 | DocScrutinizer | automatically |
| 20:30.17 | MrPingu | Need to get that in my daily routine then... |
| 20:30.31 | DocScrutinizer | there's e.g. alarmed for that |
| 20:30.55 | DocScrutinizer | and probably queenbeecon can also do that |
| 20:31.09 | guly | someone written an app for vodafone italy |
| 20:31.23 | guly | maybe you can take it and modify to suite your operator |
| 20:31.38 | guly | it needs internet connectivity someway |
| 20:31.43 | DocScrutinizer | if both fails, you can do a script that returns the cached value, just once a day updates cache by inquiry |
| 20:32.16 | MrPingu | Probably beyond my skill |
| 20:32.30 | DocScrutinizer | hmm, maybe not beyonf mine |
| 20:32.54 | DocScrutinizer | if you're lucky I'll come up with a threeliner in a few minutes or hours |
| 20:32.55 | MrPingu | The best way is, I think just be learn from this incident |
| 20:33.21 | MrPingu | Yeah, nice grammar MrPingu |
| 20:33.49 | guly | anyway it shouldn't be hard to script smssend/sms-manager |
| 20:34.07 | MrPingu | And tomorrow I have oral exam english :P gonna be fine... xD |
| 20:34.09 | *** join/#maemo bugzy (~bugzy@adsl-99-125-70-148.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net) |
| 20:34.12 | guly | i'd prefer something like this than using a colorful widget :) |
| 20:34.29 | MrPingu | Guly, it's not a SMS |
| 20:34.42 | DocScrutinizer | USSD |
| 20:34.52 | DocScrutinizer | *4711# |
| 20:35.19 | DocScrutinizer | the thingie that starhash-enabler tackles |
| 20:35.38 | DocScrutinizer | not exactly but almost |
| 20:36.07 | MrPingu | Battery running empty, just go on I will read the log when I miss something. Hope I will be back soon... |
| 20:36.12 | *** join/#maemo Venemo (5986993e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.134.153.62) |
| 20:36.28 | *** join/#maemo Raimu-Z (~raimu@kameli.net) |
| 20:36.46 | DocScrutinizer | I bet your battery runs empty, when you check your balance every 30s ;-P |
| 20:37.07 | *** join/#maemo FIQ|n900 (~FIQ@unaffiliated/fiq) |
| 20:37.28 | *** join/#maemo 20WAADIR8 (~koo@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz) |
| 20:37.42 | MrPingu | If I did, I could be home a lot earlier today :P |
| 20:38.36 | MrPingu | Sometimes you need to "feel" your stupidness |
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| 20:39.07 | DocScrutinizer | hey here we got 0800 numbers to place R-calls |
| 20:39.39 | DocScrutinizer | won't charge your battery though ;-D |
| 20:39.58 | MrPingu | :P Ahah where do you live, if I may ask? |
| 20:40.25 | DocScrutinizer | sometimes at Germany |
| 20:41.16 | MrPingu | ach so, ich spreche ein bisschen Deutsch aber nicht so gut =P |
| 20:41.27 | DocScrutinizer | but my provider is really nasty, if my balance is at zero, I mustn't even do free calls |
| 20:41.42 | DocScrutinizer | ich auch ;-D |
| 20:42.15 | DocScrutinizer | anyway Iprefer English on IRC |
| 20:42.38 | MrPingu | Me too, so everybody can read what we are saying |
| 20:43.36 | MrPingu | I just remember we have a service SMS 0808 <phonenumber of friend> |
| 20:43.52 | DocScrutinizer | since most of my conversation is been via IRC for the last 5 or so years, I tend to prefer English even for monologues ;-D |
| 20:44.17 | MrPingu | and your friend will get a SMS, Please call me back, I have run out of credit... |
| 20:45.16 | DocScrutinizer | so I gather you either pay for inbound SMS (= USA), or this service is absolutely rogue and collects numbers for spamming |
| 20:45.17 | MrPingu | I prefer english too, I mean as soon as I am conversating for about 5 minutes my whole mind switches to english and I start even thinking in english :P |
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| 20:46.21 | *** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@Maemo/community/contributor/MohammadAG) |
| 20:46.43 | MrPingu | Probably the last xD However never received spam and my lil bro send me lots of these SMS'es |
| 20:47.28 | MrPingu | and I can't remember it touched my credit either when I received them... |
| 20:47.34 | *** join/#maemo Raimu-Z (~raimu@kameli.net) |
| 20:48.18 | MrPingu | However, I tend to neglect checking credit |
| 20:48.27 | DocScrutinizer | well, here you don't pay for nbound SMS or calls. But those 0800 R-call services charge your carrier for so called termination-fee |
| 20:48.41 | *** join/#maemo Timmy (~Timmy@unaffiliated/timmyt) |
| 20:48.56 | *** join/#maemo valerius (~user@85.26.180.130) |
| 20:49.24 | DocScrutinizer | while they are charged by sender's carrier for the inbound 0800 call |
| 20:49.39 | MohammadAG | vi__: It's in hildon-desktop's code, the method is called an API in libhildon |
| 20:49.40 | MohammadAG | You can simply comment out the code |
| 20:49.42 | MohammadAG | Grep for .cache |
| 20:49.43 | DocScrutinizer | seems the balance is positive |
| 20:50.17 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: o/ |
| 20:50.25 | Timmy | where can i set the fonts of maemo to be in italic mode? ive used theme customizer to customize my fonts but it doesnt have any option to set italic mode |
| 20:50.38 | MohammadAG | PVR creator was when my coding sucked, it's a butchered fMMS GUI |
| 20:50.47 | MohammadAG | Thanks to frals for that |
| 20:51.02 | MohammadAG | o/ DocScrutinizer |
| 20:51.47 | MohammadAG | I see the N9 can be overclocked now, let's see if polycarbonate melts before heat protection kicks in |
| 20:52.54 | *** join/#maemo MrPingu (~MrPingu@86.92.226.97) |
| 20:53.17 | MrPingu | Hello, I am back |
| 20:53.23 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: polycarbonate doesn't melt at all, basically |
| 20:54.02 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer: Kinda have doubts it's 100% Polycarbonate |
| 20:54.08 | MohammadAG | What's the short name for that? |
| 20:54.12 | MohammadAG | PVC? |
| 20:54.18 | DocScrutinizer | that's one of the reasons it's used for vending machines |
| 20:54.38 | DocScrutinizer | pvc is ployvinylchloride |
| 20:54.39 | MrPingu | PolyVinylChloride isn't poly carbonate |
| 20:55.00 | MrPingu | doh, you were faster. |
| 20:55.00 | MohammadAG | Thought they were the same actually |
| 20:55.22 | MohammadAG | He didn't capitalize the first letter each initial standed for |
| 20:55.24 | MrPingu | Well they have in common they exists of lots of C atoms |
| 20:55.35 | MohammadAG | You get extra points for that, it's a tie |
| 20:55.59 | MohammadAG | I'm aware of that, chemistry in high school teaches you stuff you know :p |
| 20:56.18 | MrPingu | Tomorrow having a test about it :P |
| 20:56.42 | MrPingu | Just came here to relax before I go to bed xD |
| 20:56.46 | MohammadAG | What's C10H22? Draw its structural formula |
| 20:57.07 | DocScrutinizer | wtf |
| 20:57.23 | MohammadAG | Just revising for him |
| 20:57.44 | DocScrutinizer | wonders what might be c10h22 |
| 20:57.44 | MohammadAG | To stay on topic, draw it in ASCII |
| 20:57.46 | MohammadAG | Have fun |
| 20:58.10 | MohammadAG | Some alkane |
| 20:58.17 | MrPingu | CH3-(CH2)8-CH2 |
| 20:58.31 | MohammadAG | CnH2n+2 |
| 20:58.32 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:58.43 | DocScrutinizer | HCCCCCCCCCCH |
| 20:58.44 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:59.15 | MrPingu | DocScrutinizer get the points I guess |
| 21:00.48 | MrPingu | Have lots to do with maemo? :P |
| 21:01.22 | DocScrutinizer | sure, it's used to clean PCB during production ;-P |
| 21:02.12 | DocScrutinizer | and with PCB I don't mean pentachloride biphenol |
| 21:02.59 | MrPingu | To get back on topic: Is there some "go to end of page" shortcut in MicroB? |
| 21:08.48 | DocScrutinizer | umm, shift-pgdn? |
| 21:09.01 | DocScrutinizer | err, cursor-down |
| 21:09.18 | DocScrutinizer | just for scrolling I guess |
| 21:09.49 | *** join/#maemo Dibblah (~Dibblah@host86-139-0-141.range86-139.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:11.35 | DocScrutinizer | nope, actually shift+cursorUp/Down jumps to beginning/end of page |
| 21:13.44 | DocScrutinizer | space to next "screen" down, and cursor without shift for smooth scrolling |
| 21:14.41 | DocScrutinizer | ooh, shift-space one "screen" up |
| 21:15.46 | DocScrutinizer | next question: why doesn't exist a single decent pizza service here, to deliver by night? |
| 21:15.52 | DocScrutinizer | :-/ |
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| 21:22.41 | *** part/#maemo mardi (~Rod@host86-130-93-160.range86-130.btcentralplus.com) |
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| 21:24.11 | MrPingu | Thank you, that about the space I knew. |
| 21:24.26 | MrPingu | Because it's sunday? |
| 21:25.44 | DocScrutinizer | no, because this town sucks regarding that |
| 21:25.56 | DocScrutinizer | each day of week |
| 21:27.56 | MrPingu | We have 2, but 1, really don't know what they put in there it's taste in not bearable :p |
| 21:28.20 | MrPingu | s/in/is |
| 21:29.22 | MrPingu | Both are closed on sunday and monday though |
| 21:36.49 | DocScrutinizer | here you can starve from hunger after 22:30 |
| 21:38.08 | MrPingu | I never order after 22:30 when I am home, so I don't know xD |
| 21:38.32 | DocScrutinizer | but I found a estaurant that still is willing to sell me a pizza when I fetch it at their place |
| 21:39.04 | DocScrutinizer | \o/ |
| 21:39.13 | DocScrutinizer | bbl |
| 21:41.23 | MrPingu | Let me listen 4 songs, then I am gone. I don't want to be tired at my tests... |
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