IRC log for #maemo on 20110913

`00:00.08`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:00.28`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:02.31`	`*** join/#maemo penguinbait (~snoopy@71-13-52-195.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com)`
`00:05.20`	`*** join/#maemo kW_ (~kW@port-92-206-77-241.dynamic.qsc.de)`
`00:09.33`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:11.45`	`*** join/#maemo X-Fade (~xfade@d5152FFD8.static.telenet.be)`
`00:12.06`	`*** join/#maemo dmb (dmb@unaffiliated/dmb)`
`00:15.16`	`Estel_`	`Hey, sorry if it was covered before, but I've strange problem with connecting via maemo xchat using ssl`
`00:17.16`	`Estel_`	`Normally, I get "Verify E: unable to get local issuer certificate.? (20)"`
`00:17.58`	`Estel_`	`when i check "accept invalid certificates", I can connect using ssl at first try, and error 20 is properly ignored...`
`00:18.22`	`*** join/#maemo joga (FwivYnzz@rikki.fi)`
`00:18.44`	`Estel_`	`ho ever, if I try to reconnect, or disconnect and connect again, i got error 27, "certificate is not trusted"`
`00:19.25`	`Estel_`	`it seems, that error 27 untrusted certificate ignores "accept invalid certificates" option`
`00:20.10`	`Estel_`	`so, basically, I'm able to connect via ssl only initially, every reconnect attemp fail miserably. Only one solution is to restart maemo xchat as a whole.`
`00:20.50`	`Estel_`	`I suspect it's due to GANDI SAS being not trusted root in fremantle`
`00:22.39`	`Estel_`	`but the strangest part is that I'm able to connect initially. Also, I tried irGGu irc client for maemo, and I got no issues with ssl there... But, irGGu lack support for almost every command (or i was to clueless to discover how use them there), I was unable to even register my nickname to nickserv, cause /msg was not working...`
`00:23.20`	`Estel_`	`so, anyone got any clues about that strange ssl/cert problem in xchat? sorry again, if it was covered somewhere, wasn't able to find it in forum`
`00:23.48`	`Estel_`	`And I suspect most people here use xchat on N900, so maybe it's known roblem`
`00:23.52`	`Estel_`	`thanks in advance`
`00:26.15`	`*** join/#maemo fizzie (fis@iris.zem.fi)`
`00:31.17`	`*** join/#maemo eMHa_ (~mh@HSI-KBW-078-042-037-221.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de)`
`00:32.00`	`*** join/#maemo eijk (~eijk@e178226077.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`00:35.17`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:37.28`	`*** join/#maemo gmathisz (~gmathisz@208-104-65-10.dyn.fttp.comporium.net)`
`00:38.21`	`SpeedEvil`	`I've never used ssl`
`00:38.31`	`*** join/#maemo kthomas_vh (~kthomas@c-69-244-203-127.hsd1.tn.comcast.net)`
`00:39.13`	`Estel_`	`hm, can You at least try if You can reproduce problem, i.e. it's not limited to my device/my xchat settings?`
`00:39.58`	`Estel_`	`it's only a matter of changing freenode port to 7000 and checking "use ssl" in connection options of xchat`
`00:40.16`	`Estel_`	`if it fails, check again with "ignore invalid certificates"`
`00:40.51`	`Estel_`	`of course keeping an eye for error messages, in case of fail`
`00:44.13`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:45.36`	`*** join/#maemo n900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)`
`00:45.39`	`*** join/#maemo Estel^ (~Estel^@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:46.46`	`SpeedEvil`	`Where's the port setting - I see the ssl setting`
`00:47.33`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel_@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`00:47.50`	`SpeedEvil`	`Wheres the port setting - I see the ssl setting`
`00:49.11`	`Estel_`	`You set port in first tab of server editing, where You ,robably see chat.freenode.net, or something like that`
`00:49.20`	`Estel_`	`you just add port after /`
`00:49.31`	`*** join/#maemo N900ev1l (~Speedevil@mauve.plus.com)`
`00:49.44`	`Estel_`	`so, it should look like chat.freenode.net/7000`
`00:49.58`	`Estel_`	`of course Your freenode domain of choose may wary`
`00:50.18`	`SpeedEvil`	`...issuer certificate`
`00:50.18`	`Estel_`	`but all of their servers use exact same ort configuration`
`00:50.31`	`Estel_`	`error 20?`
`00:50.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`yes`
`00:50.57`	`SpeedEvil`	`and cert not trusted if accept invalid`
`00:51.02`	`SpeedEvil`	`27`
`00:51.17`	`Estel_`	`btw, the strangest part is that IrGGu got no problem even without accept invalids`
`00:51.33`	`Estel_`	`hehe, funniest part is that if You now restart xchat totally`
`00:51.45`	`Estel_`	`You'll be connected with "accept invalid"`
`00:51.46`	`SpeedEvil`	`I'm on 2.8.6`
`00:52.05`	`Estel_`	`but, reconnect attempt wil fail again`
`00:52.38`	`wblaze`	`IrGGu?`
`00:52.41`	`Estel_`	`it seems that at first connection attempt, xchat cant get connection with certificate container`
`00:52.46`	`*** join/#maemo n900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)`
`00:52.53`	`SpeedEvil`	`(not ssl this time)`
`00:53.17`	`Estel_`	`= error 20, and that is ignored if "accept invalid certs" = 1`
`00:53.41`	`*** join/#maemo zakkkkkm (~zakkkkkm@199.119.232.2)`
`00:53.54`	`Estel_`	`but, error 27 is "stronger" that accept invalid cert, so at wnd attempt it check it in cert container`
`00:54.05`	`zakkkkkm`	`Hey, anyone know how to make it autolock to the point of pin asking, on rocker pushing?`
`00:54.08`	`zakkkkkm`	`or screen off`
`00:54.22`	`Estel_`	`wblaze - yes, irGGU, somehow nice client for irc and maemo`
`00:54.38`	`zakkkkkm`	`Recently moved to blackbery 9700 for work purposes, wanting to switch back, but i need proper locking/pin asking.`
`00:55.11`	`Estel_`	`in fact we're talking about xchat issues with ssl, and irGGU seems to not be affected, but irGGu lacks basic funcionalities on the other hand`
`00:55.16`	`wblaze`	`I'll have to take a look, though ssh to my screen/irssi session seems to work beautifully so far`
`00:56.02`	`wblaze`	`zakkkkkm: I'm sorry, I moved from a 9700 to a n900 and there is honestly no way I could switch back now :\|`
`00:56.21`	`Estel_`	`zakkkkkm - You would need to make script that monitor dbus, and deauth sim on locking phone`
`00:56.28`	`Estel_`	`wblaze, thanks.`
`00:56.42`	`zakkkkkm`	`wblaze, heh i did it for Work, not cause i count it a better phone.`
`00:57.02`	`*** join/#maemo dangergrrl (~ariana@161.98.13.100)`
`00:57.05`	`*** join/#maemo ptl (~patola@unaffiliated/ptl)`
`00:57.08`	`zakkkkkm`	`im here now, to try and switch back :)`
`00:57.17`	`Estel_`	`I don't know if You watch conversation from beginnig (You may consider checking logs), I've written detailed info on problem here, earlier`
`00:57.22`	`zakkkkkm`	`Estel_, do you know of one?`
`00:57.40`	`Estel_`	`zakkkkkm, why lock code isnt enough?`
`00:58.04`	`wblaze`	`zakkkkkm: understandable, just... I feel for you.`
`00:58.08`	`zakkkkkm`	`lock code is enough, i just need it to happen at rocker pushing`
`00:58.10`	`Estel_`	`You understabd, that with such approach, every time You lock device, You would be disconnected to GSM?`
`00:58.14`	`Estel_`	`from*`
`00:58.45`	`Estel_`	`i see, but can You elaborate more on what You mean by "rocker pushing"?`
`00:58.50`	`zakkkkkm`	`i basically want the "press power button and click secure device" .. everytime i press power button or move the rocker`
`00:59.03`	`Estel_`	`ah i see`
`00:59.52`	`Estel_`	`honestly, I use power button + secure +lock manually, but its doable by editing systemui.xml`
`01:00.05`	`Estel_`	`for power button`
`01:00.12`	`zakkkkkm`	`?`
`01:00.29`	`Estel_`	`You can bind it for example to long press of power button...`
`01:00.45`	`Estel_`	`not such script exist`
`01:00.53`	`zakkkkkm`	`bind the secure action, to the power button itself?`
`01:01.13`	`Estel_`	`You would need to look how that thing is achieved originally by "secure device" button`
`01:01.26`	`Estel_`	`and replicated it for lock device state`
`01:01.48`	`Estel_`	`perfectly doable, but require some work and probably trial-and-error`
`01:02.34`	`Estel_`	`wblaze, as for xchat problem, good to know that I can always switch to irrsi and its working with ssl :)`
`01:03.19`	`zakkkkkm`	`powerup_memainmenu_lockdevice i see.`
`01:03.55`	`Estel_`	`yea, but it send some values for it`
`01:04.04`	`Estel_`	`sorry, I'm no expert on those`
`01:04.48`	`*** part/#maemo gmathisz (~gmathisz@208-104-65-10.dyn.fttp.comporium.net)`
`01:05.20`	`Estel_`	`brb, Im switching back to xchat from irGGu. The later would be great lightweight irc client for N900, but need some more love, it's quite rough at the edges`
`01:06.02`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel_@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`01:07.02`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`01:07.31`	`Estel_`	`is back`
`01:07.39`	`zakkkkkm`	`can you change the rocker config? :)`
`01:08.05`	`Estel_`	`damn, I don't remember, but it must be possible.`
`01:08.22`	`zakkkkkm`	`Estel_, sorry :(`
`01:08.29`	`Estel_`	`robbiethe1st use lock slider to abort backup in backupmenu, for example`
`01:08.43`	`Estel_`	`sorry for?`
`01:08.51`	`zakkkkkm`	`bugging with questions`
`01:08.57`	`Estel_`	`search wiki or forum, slider must be somewhere`
`01:09.13`	`Estel_`	`are You joking, dude? no problem, this channel is for questions`
`01:09.30`	`Estel_`	`I've also bugged with questions a while ago :)`
`01:10.09`	`Estel_`	`hey, I got different idea for Your feature request`
`01:10.31`	`zakkkkkm`	`?`
`01:10.46`	`Estel_`	`If You could get shortcut on desktop, that instantly (on press) secure device`
`01:10.54`	`Estel_`	`that would be enough?`
`01:11.16`	`Estel_`	`easily achievable via .sh script and correctm.sudoers file`
`01:11.48`	`Estel_`	`or, totally easy way, via application "applocker" and dummy script, blacklisted inside applocker`
`01:11.58`	`zakkkkkm`	`normally right now, i have one of those cases that goes on belt, and i would put my blackberry on it and it would lock the phone. I am trying to achieve the same kind of "simple action"`
`01:12.10`	`*** join/#maemo sheepbat (~lev3k@c-98-238-227-32.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`01:12.18`	`zakkkkkm`	`thats why iwas thinking of power button single press or slider`
`01:12.26`	`zakkkkkm`	`im done with it, move the slider.. and it locks it`
`01:12.37`	`zakkkkkm`	`it turns off the screen, i dont get why i cant add it to secure at same time :(`
`01:12.38`	`*** join/#maemo Frampis (frampis@reformiklubi.fi)`
`01:13.02`	`Estel_`	`first approach require to write simple script, that secure and lock device on execution`
`01:13.40`	`Estel_`	`hm, what about long "press" on proximity sensor?`
`01:13.52`	`zakkkkkm`	`proximity sensor?`
`01:14.35`	`Estel_`	`via ShortcutD package, You can bind command/script to camera button half press (long or short), and for proximity sensor coverage (outside call) long or short`
`01:14.38`	`Estel_`	`yea`
`01:15.11`	`zakkkkkm`	`i dont know what you mean by proximity sensor.`
`01:15.18`	`Estel_`	`so, our little securing script would be executed on long proximity sensor coverage, or long camera shutter half-press`
`01:15.36`	`Estel_`	`proximity sensor is that "thing" near Your front camera`
`01:16.09`	`Estel_`	`it makes phone touchscreen deactivate, when You talk on phone. Without it, You would push screen buttons with ear`
`01:16.16`	`zakkkkkm`	`the square thing?`
`01:16.43`	`Estel_`	`it's just few milimeters under camera`
`01:16.45`	`*** join/#maemo hardaker (~hardaker@mail.hardakers.net)`
`01:16.49`	`Estel_`	`front camera`
`01:17.43`	`zakkkkkm`	`it can detect press?`
`01:18.02`	`Estel_`	`in fact, it detect when something is very close to it`
`01:18.34`	`Estel_`	`so, You can feel like jedi master, and execute things holding finger few milimeters above screen ;)`
`01:18.47`	`Estel_`	`To be 100% honest with You`
`01:19.08`	`zakkkkkm`	`so i can set it so if i cover my finger with it .. it will turn off and secure device?`
`01:19.27`	`Estel_`	`I think pushing power button, choosing "secure" and using slider (or tapping power button twice" is so easily learnable habit`
`01:19.47`	`Estel_`	`that it's not worth the effort, but if You want to achieve it anyway...`
`01:20.12`	`Estel_`	`You can install ShortcutD, write simple script securing/locking device`
`01:20.44`	`Estel_`	`and tell ShortcutD to execute it on covering proximity sensor for few seconds or for a moment`
`01:20.56`	`Estel_`	`(long or short "press")`
`01:21.34`	`*** join/#maemo Estel^ (~Estel_@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`01:22.15`	`zakkkkkm`	`cool cool, going to try :) Thanks.`
`01:22.35`	`*** join/#maemo trx (~ns-team@212.200.198.215)`
`01:22.39`	`*** join/#maemo kthomas_vh_ (~kthomas@c-69-244-203-127.hsd1.tn.comcast.net)`
`01:23.15`	`*** join/#maemo auenf (David@171.72.233.220.static.exetel.com.au)`
`01:36.11`	*** join/#maemo Openfree` (~Openfreer@116.228.88.131)
`01:36.45`	`*** join/#maemo schend (suresh@nat/nokia/x-dgiwmcpqwgfsvupj)`
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`01:39.11`	`Guest166`	`what's that program that runs commands, etc. based of GPS location/possibly mobile tower ID?`
`01:44.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: pong`
`01:45.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: I gather you planned to add recovery-terminal to dsme-tool -f hildon-desktop ?`
`01:46.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`if that's the plan, it's not that simple maybe`
`01:47.52`	`*** join/#maemo penguinbait (~snoopy@71-13-52-195.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com)`
`01:47.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I guess dsmetool is async, i.e. a call to dsmetool will return before the -t or -f <process> actually terminated`
`01:48.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`we'd need to patch dsmetool, or kick it out completely for starting h-d`
`01:59.01`	`*** join/#maemo x29a (~x29a@p5DD4CD4E.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`01:59.17`	`*** join/#maemo x29a (~x29a@unaffiliated/x29a)`
`02:01.11`	`*** join/#maemo Estel_ (~Estel@d35-11.icpnet.pl)`
`02:01.49`	`Estel_`	`hello DocScrutinizer`
`02:02.34`	`Estel_`	`I'm just wondering, any clues about my "findings" about hostmode errors? (the one unrelated to booston)`
`02:03.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`not yet, but thanks a lot for the verbose report. I just had no time to look into it closely`
`02:03.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`doesn't mean I plan to ignore it ;-)`
`02:05.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's just so detailed that it will take some time to process it, and I recently had not that much spare time`
`02:11.32`	`Estel_`	`thanks for answer and no worries, I just wanted to check if it was not "lost" due to many updated to single post`
`02:11.52`	`Estel_`	`You know, updates doesn't show as "new messages".`
`02:12.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: obviously the errors ("typos") in my originally published augmented booston were there all the time and would've spoiled it for everybody testing it, so it's evident nobody did before you, or they didn't bother to give feedback`
`02:12.38`	`Estel_`	`and no problem, my pleasure to test it ;)`
`02:12.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: I know. No worries, I'm looking into tmo for that`
`02:12.50`	`Estel_`	`hm, I thought it's impossible ;)`
`02:13.03`	`Estel_`	`i mean no one testing`
`02:13.29`	`Estel_`	`ho ever, I think its effect of "lets wait for new devel version"`
`02:13.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`users like to install a package, but a simple "please copy this to a file XY then do chmod a+x XY" is obviously too much for most of them`
`02:14.05`	`Estel_`	`You know, it was one thing I promised myself to check someday, but havent got around it until yesterday`
`02:14.52`	`Estel_`	`true, and I'm afraid I also act like that many times, i.e manual things end up in pile of things to do at free time`
`02:14.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I ponder to publish a small script that is doing the wget and chmod stuff`
`02:16.01`	`Estel_`	`(btw, maybe its better to publish such things in devel - at least You'll have 100 reports with cries about it not working, because everyone use devel and will autoupdate :P)`
`02:16.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmm, yeah`
`02:17.04`	`Estel_`	`"release early, release often" :Pnot that I'm criticizing current approach.`
`02:17.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I asked MohammadAG about doing this, along with an overhaul of the GUI, I think back in February`
`02:17.23`	`Estel_`	`eh...`
`02:17.53`	`Estel_`	`I didn't wanted to sound rude, buts that exactly what about I've been thinking`
`02:17.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`maybe April`
`02:18.29`	`Estel_`	`lack of updates for H-E-N, even the "status" ones. No one sane except -devel beta to be polished.`
`02:18.33`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@a88-115-0-126.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`02:18.33`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@redhat/pcfe)`
`02:19.00`	`Estel_`	`Honestly, what is holding him / You all from publishing development stuff for hen? lack of time?`
`02:19.17`	`Estel_`	`It seems to me that You would also opt for it being released.`
`02:19.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sure, just I'm not the devel of any code relating h-e-n (except the boost thingie)`
`02:19.36`	`Estel_`	`at least i got such feeling from Your post with booston`
`02:19.39`	`Estel_`	`I see.`
`02:19.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`h-e-n maintainer is MohammadAG`
`02:20.05`	`*** join/#maemo KrayonWORK (~krayon@pdpc/supporter/28for7/krayon)`
`02:20.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`according to what's written in the app package description`
`02:20.26`	`Estel_`	`but You probably know why he doesn't want to do it?`
`02:20.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`too many other distracting things to do, I guess`
`02:20.50`	`Estel_`	`i see`
`02:21.44`	`Estel_`	`hey, but package description also say You're project admin ;)`
`02:21.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and then aiui h-e-n GUI is written by MohammadAG in a language that he's not that much interested in anymore nowadays`
`02:22.15`	`Estel_`	`dont get me wrong, I'm not demanding anything or searching whom to blame.`
`02:22.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'm admin. Doesn't mean I can give orders to devels`
`02:22.20`	`Estel_`	`ah, I see`
`02:22.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I only suggest, or ask`
`02:22.53`	`Estel_`	`yes, yes. Understood. You know, I just wen through qwerty rant inside his last application`
`02:23.01`	`Estel_`	`so I may be quite distracted`
`02:23.11`	`Estel_`	`You know, attack from surprise ;)`
`02:23.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah`
`02:24.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: it's not quite obvious, but my augmented booston doesn't need any more the boostoff script. It's completely enough to just kill (ctrl-C) the script`
`02:25.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`just on a sidenote ^^^`
`02:25.22`	`Estel_`	`good to know`
`02:25.55`	`Estel_`	`thanks. Does it handle higher idle current draw problem?`
`02:26.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'll have another look into the vboost led pattern thing. here it works, maybe the mce.ini I published back when also has some oopsies`
`02:26.26`	`Estel_`	`You know, the thing that need N900 to "think" wallcharger is vonnected`
`02:26.30`	`Estel_`	`hm`
`02:26.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(idle current) not yet, but I'll add this next`
`02:27.20`	`Estel_`	`To not misslead You, I'm ussing my own mce.ini, just copied Your pattern name and pattern settings from charging pattern, then edited priority and pattern itself inside editor`
`02:27.29`	`Estel_`	`aye :)`
`02:27.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's actually a problem that should get fixed in kernel space`
`02:28.08`	`Estel_`	`maybe freemangordon or colin.stephane could do it? You tried to contact them?`
`02:30.01`	`Estel_`	`They seems to maintain kernel-power more than Pali, at least for now`
`02:30.34`	`*** join/#maemo maybeHere (~cl@p5B1636CD.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`02:32.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no, as it's a matter of actually bugfixing the hostmode patches, not about just applying patches to the powerkernel`
`02:33.01`	`*** join/#maemo swc\|666 (~gecko@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821)`
`02:33.08`	`Estel_`	`understood.`
`02:33.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`for a short time I hoped some other kernel hackers would join h-e-n team and pick up where paul left`
`02:34.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I know about most kernel tweaks done for hostmode, but I'm not really into kernel coding business atm`
`02:35.00`	`Estel_`	`hm... lack of human power and no one tried? Or, maybe they're just ashamed to propose that, due to H-E-N glory? ;) no lubricating here.`
`02:35.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`even less is anybody else into USB kernel driver hacking, it's a very special domain`
`02:36.39`	`*** join/#maemo Mek_ (~quassel@93.157.1.37)`
`02:36.58`	`Estel_`	`By the way, it's one of the moments I really regret not having enough (even basic, to be honest) knowledge about it. And it makes me wonder how You guys "started", to get to point where You can "hack" such things as kernel as whole or USB kernel drivers`
`02:37.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: the syslog shows quite some rough edges of the hostmode patches`
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`02:38.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: (how we got there) for me it was like 200h of reading kernel sources, talking with gifted hackers like javispedro, paul etc, to finally get an idea how kernel USB driver does work`
`02:39.42`	`Estel_`	`hehe, but it probably require some high ammount of base knowledge, to at least understabd such kernel sources?`
`02:39.45`	`SpeedEvil`	`Start with the datasheet of the chip - several thousand pages - find a dozen versions, and read closely for differenced, ...`
`02:40.12`	`Estel_`	`You know, You're talking to guy who can barely write shell script based on someone else work.`
`02:41.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`when it comes to reading those musb_hdrc driver kernel sources, I guess there's not that much difference in how each of us both feels about that`
`02:42.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`;-D`
`02:42.29`	`Estel_`	`I've also noticed that You guys (ones who actually code) almost totally doesn't involve in "politics" about how maemo should look in future and other blabla`
`02:42.31`	`Estel_`	`hahaha`
`02:43.19`	`Estel_`	`I guess coding guys doesn't have time for chit-chatting bullshit repeated over and over in multiple threads? ;)`
`02:43.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I don't have time and nerves for tmo at large`
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`02:47.55`	`Estel_`	`I think that's why I've created irc account - it seems very calm and easy here, without some "individuals" from tmo, You know what I mean`
`02:48.07`	`Estel_`	`btw, one lastquestion, if You don't mind`
`02:48.24`	`Estel_`	`You know autobuilder things perfectly, right?`
`02:49.49`	`Estel_`	`There is funny situation when I convinced one to-be dev to put his quite usefull program to repositories, and he got ,problem, and its a situation when two non-even coders are trying to help him go through autobuilgder.`
`02:50.11`	`Estel_`	`reminds me of bling man guiding one with wooden leg`
`02:50.25`	`*** join/#maemo em (~em@unaffiliated/emma)`
`02:50.33`	`Estel_`	`anyway, we almost managed to put 100% working program to repos`
`02:50.41`	`*** join/#maemo kthomas_vh (~kthomas@h-64-105-218-107.atlngahp.static.covad.net)`
`02:50.52`	`Estel_`	`except, that its lacking files like icons etc.`
`02:51.13`	`Estel_`	`normally, they're to be found in 'data.tar' file`
`02:51.53`	`Estel_`	`but we don't have idea to to achieve this in autobuilder, despite reading it's documentation dozens of times and performing voodoo rituals.`
`02:52.04`	`Estel_`	`overlooking obvious, probably.`
`02:52.45`	`Estel_`	`DEveloper asked for that in forum, but hes probably not elaborative enough, cause only one response he get was to "check how others do it".`
`02:53.12`	`Estel_`	`Yea, we tried many times. and someone suggested that it may have something to do with makefile script`
`02:53.30`	`Estel_`	`no clues, ho ever. That's why I'm asking here. as last resort ;)`
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`03:01.40`	`Estel_`	`OK, it's 5 AM here, and my little Son is going to wake up in approximately 5 hours, so I'm off to get some sleep :-) Thanks for looking into my little report, and take Your time. If You need someone to test something before release, count me in! BTW in case of any need (in which I doubt) You can ping me here, even if I'm outside, just include "Estel" in message. I'll search everyday irc log for that string, so I'm gonna read it anyway.`
`03:01.50`	`Estel_`	`See ya and goodnight.`
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`03:07.43`	`Sazpaimon_`	`guys, anyone around`
`03:07.53`	`Sazpaimon_`	`im trying to replace the digitizer but I cant figure out how it hooks up`
`03:12.35`	`*** join/#maemo DocScrutinizer (~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg)`
`03:29.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: sorry I was busy with fixing router issues. Anyway I can't help much with autobuilder, you may have to wait until somebody else with more experience picks up on it`
`03:30.02`	`Guest166`	`is the Shepherd cron script the only/most developed tool out there for changing Profile/running command based on Cell tower ID?`
`03:30.24`	`Guest166`	`i thought there was a more mature location daemon for gps/location based jobs.`
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`03:35.24`	`Sazpaimon_`	`okay`
`03:35.30`	`Sazpaimon_`	`i managed to figure out where the digitizer goes`
`03:35.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I wonder what cron got to do with it, but then I dunno that Shepherd cron script`
`03:35.40`	`Sazpaimon_`	`but I cant seem to re-screw the six back screen screws`
`03:35.45`	`Sazpaimon_`	`i dont see where they screw into`
`03:36.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yay`
`03:36.17`	`Sazpaimon_`	`oh I see`
`03:36.27`	`Sazpaimon_`	`my old digitizer has this metal part in the back`
`03:36.35`	`Sazpaimon_`	`the new one does not...`
`03:37.38`	`Sazpaimon_`	`and i cant seem to remove it from the old one...`
`03:38.18`	`Sazpaimon_`	`http://maemoworld.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Nokia_N900_RX-51_Service_Manual_Service_Level_1_2 page 18 step 48`
`03:38.23`	`Guest166`	`My impression was Shepherd just periodically ran through a list of job + criteria`
`03:38.30`	`Sazpaimon_`	`the metal bit on the digitizer`
`03:38.34`	`Sazpaimon_`	`this isnt in the new one shipped to me`
`03:38.39`	`Sazpaimon_`	`is this going to be a huge problem?`
`03:38.40`	`Guest166`	`and ran only the ones who;'s criteria matched, eg: wifi location, bluetooth on, etc.`
`03:39.39`	`Sazpaimon_`	`wait`
`03:39.50`	`Sazpaimon_`	`this thing doesnt even have a place to put the earpiece!`
`03:39.57`	`Sazpaimon_`	`oh my god`
`03:40.00`	`Sazpaimon_`	`what the fuck is this`
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`04:00.14`	`wblaze`	`Sazpaimon__: isn't that one you have to cut?`
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`04:08.19`	`Sazpaimon__`	`wblaze, huh`
`04:08.45`	`Sazpaimon__`	`wblaze, no, I mean the meal piece attached directly to the digitizer`
`04:09.27`	`wblaze`	`oh, digitizer, seems I managed to gloss over that`
`04:09.54`	`Sazpaimon__`	`I dont know how this came from the factory without the metal backing`
`04:09.58`	`Sazpaimon__`	`its just the plastic part`
`04:11.08`	`wblaze`	`when I was replacing parts, I managed to save that :\|`
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`04:11.47`	`wblaze`	`120Km/h off the top of a car, and the screen assembly wasn't even scratched, hah`
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`04:20.45`	`wblaze`	`but, the short version is - ignore me, I mistook parts and can't help with this one, heh`
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`05:58.00`	`Sazpaimon`	`so wait`
`05:58.13`	`Sazpaimon`	`i see a lot of listings for N900 digitizers without the frame`
`05:58.16`	`Sazpaimon`	`how does that even work`
`05:58.22`	`Sazpaimon`	`isnt the frame physically attached to the digitizer?`
`05:59.37`	`jacekowski`	`no`
`05:59.46`	`jacekowski`	`it's glued`
`06:00.40`	`Sazpaimon`	`okay so my point still stands`
`06:00.47`	`Sazpaimon`	`whats the point of the digitizer without the frame attached`
`06:00.53`	`Sazpaimon`	`afaik you cant get the frame seperate`
`06:00.56`	`cehteh`	`profit :)`
`06:00.57`	`jacekowski`	`you can`
`06:01.14`	`Sazpaimon`	`and getting the frame off of an existing digitizer isnt easy, it not downright impossible`
`06:01.27`	`cehteh`	`prolly not that easy to reglue in the kitchen`
`06:02.09`	`cehteh`	`warming up, peeling, clean, glue the new one, without dust and you only have one try`
`06:02.51`	`*** join/#maemo ellise (~elis@222.124.84.157)`
`06:04.02`	`Sazpaimon`	`also the digitizer i got without the frame stopped working after one try`
`06:04.15`	`jacekowski`	`that's because you broke it`
`06:04.17`	`Sazpaimon`	`the leads look like they got scratched`
`06:04.21`	`Sazpaimon`	`i dont know how`
`06:04.26`	`jacekowski`	`it's same digitiser as nokia is installing`
`06:04.36`	`Sazpaimon`	`I followed the service manual exactly`
`06:04.40`	`jacekowski`	`they just have better kung-fu than you do`
`06:04.43`	`*** part/#maemo ellise (~elis@222.124.84.157)`
`06:04.51`	`Sazpaimon`	`that said this thing is useless without the frame`
`06:05.01`	`Sazpaimon`	`i guess I'll settle with an OEM digitizer on the cheap`
`06:05.04`	`jacekowski`	`nokia gets them without frame`
`06:05.12`	`jacekowski`	`and then assembles everything`
`06:05.32`	`cehteh`	`well they have clean rooms and assembly machines for that`
`06:05.33`	`Sazpaimon`	`the service manual never said anything about the frame`
`06:05.39`	`jacekowski`	`but with/without frame cost pretty much the same`
`06:05.46`	`jacekowski`	`Sazpaimon: not in service`
`06:05.54`	`jacekowski`	`Sazpaimon: when they make device first time`
`06:05.57`	`Sazpaimon`	`well its not much use for me`
`06:06.02`	`Sazpaimon`	`is it`
`06:06.07`	`jacekowski`	`that's when they assemble digitiser`
`06:06.27`	`Sazpaimon`	`http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-OEM-Touch-Screen-Digitizer-Frame-Nokia-N900-/280719181900?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item415c2ac84c`
`06:06.27`	`jacekowski`	`nokia care places and stuff get already assembled ones to replace`
`06:06.31`	`Sazpaimon`	`$25 for the digitizer?`
`06:06.35`	`jacekowski`	`Sazpaimon: not bad`
`06:06.43`	`Sazpaimon`	`but its OEM`
`06:06.46`	`Sazpaimon`	`not genuine nokia`
`06:06.50`	`Sazpaimon`	`:/`
`06:06.53`	`jacekowski`	`ekhm`
`06:06.56`	`jacekowski`	`that's the same`
`06:07.03`	`Sazpaimon`	`not all the time`
`06:07.18`	`jacekowski`	`OEM - original equipment manufacturer`
`06:07.19`	`Sazpaimon`	`unless it says genuine nokia it can be from any plant`
`06:07.28`	`jacekowski`	`it's same company that makes them for nokia`
`06:08.15`	`cehteh`	`i doubt they have some other company doing compatible parts`
`06:08.30`	`cehteh`	`the fake phones are lookalikes but the hardware isnt compatible`
`06:08.30`	`jacekowski`	`Sazpaimon: it's same thing as with cars`
`06:08.43`	`jacekowski`	`Sazpaimon: manufacturers don't really make parts for it`
`06:08.52`	`cehteh`	`and there is no big market to create compatible replacements parts`
`06:08.56`	`Sazpaimon`	`<cehteh> i doubt they have some other company doing compatible parts`
`06:08.59`	`Sazpaimon`	`oh yeah?`
`06:09.02`	`Sazpaimon`	`http://www.amazon.com/Neewer-Screen-Display-Nokia-Prying/dp/B005G5WZGG`
`06:09.50`	`jacekowski`	`Sazpaimon: neewer is a shop that rebrands OEM stuff`
`06:09.57`	`cehteh`	`Sazpaimon: the LCD is some stock thing, i forgot the manufacturer but there are specs available somewhere`
`06:10.17`	`cehteh`	`while the brezel and digitizer is exclusive for the n900`
`06:10.21`	`Sazpaimon`	`anyway I guess I'll grab that digitizer`
`06:10.33`	`Sazpaimon`	`i wish i could use my old digitizer, but its peeled`
`06:10.39`	`Sazpaimon`	`and the contacts are ripped`
`06:10.40`	`Sazpaimon`	`:/`
`06:10.54`	`Sazpaimon`	`and this new one has broken leads`
`06:10.59`	`*** join/#maemo archl (~chatzilla@110-174-150-114.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`06:11.05`	`Sazpaimon`	`i still dont know why, my test connection worked perfectly fine`
`06:11.15`	`cehteh`	`my screen protector got serious scratches meanwhile the outer layer is damaged, i should apply a new one :P`
`06:11.27`	`Sazpaimon`	`and on my second connection the screen vibrated when i touched it, but it didnt respond to anything`
`06:11.48`	`Sazpaimon`	`then i tried to reconnect it, and it stopped vibrating on touch too`
`06:12.25`	`Sazpaimon`	`"Item location: æ·±å³å¸, å»£æ±ç, China"`
`06:12.26`	`Sazpaimon`	`fml`
`06:12.29`	`Sazpaimon`	`F`
`06:12.29`	`Sazpaimon`	`M`
`06:12.30`	`Sazpaimon`	`L`
`06:12.41`	`Sazpaimon`	`i bought this last digitizer, it took 30 days to arrive`
`06:12.57`	`archl`	`;p`
`06:13.08`	`Sazpaimon`	`currently i have an without a front face taped together as my replacement phone`
`06:13.09`	`archl`	`I thought Im in #ubuntu-cn channel`
`06:13.29`	`Sazpaimon`	`*an E71`
`06:13.39`	`Sazpaimon`	`E71 is a great phone, when it has all its parts`
`06:14.20`	`archl`	`Sazpaimon: try to buy a N900 from China and reflash it. 95% new looking cost only 900 local currency.`
`06:14.35`	`archl`	`thats about $140`
`06:14.51`	`Sazpaimon`	`im not going to spend any more large bills on an N900`
`06:14.51`	`archl`	`if you want to.`
`06:15.02`	`Sazpaimon`	`$30 is the max im going to waste on this phone`
`06:15.03`	`archl`	`Sazpaimon: right,`
`06:15.29`	`Sazpaimon`	`no sense keeping a dying phone alive more than I have to`
`06:15.41`	`Sazpaimon`	`saving up for an N9 anyway`
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`06:15.54`	`cehteh`	`Sazpaimon: if your phone is dead you can send it to me for scraping it :P`
`06:16.01`	`Sazpaimon`	`its not dead`
`06:16.02`	`cehteh`	`i dont plan to buy a n9`
`06:16.04`	`Sazpaimon`	`I have a working LCD`
`06:16.06`	`ds3`	`has the cheap N900 sales arrived yet?`
`06:16.09`	`Sazpaimon`	`just need a new digitizer`
`06:16.19`	`cehteh`	`i could need a new camera module`
`06:16.28`	`Sazpaimon`	`I can probably use it with VNC`
`06:16.29`	`archl`	`N900 cheap sales start soon.`
`06:16.40`	`cehteh`	`ds3: n900 are mostly out of stock only some shops have some left`
`06:16.41`	`archl`	`as N9 release.`
`06:17.00`	`ds3`	`cehteh: but they don't seem to be discounted like how the N810's were`
`06:17.33`	`cehteh`	`just because they dont have any devices anymore`
`06:17.48`	`ds3`	`do we know for sure if the N9 will take a full size sim or not?`
`06:18.04`	`Sazpaimon`	`microsim`
`06:18.05`	`cehteh`	`full size?`
`06:18.13`	`ds3`	`full size vs microsim`
`06:18.15`	`cehteh`	`thats credit card :P`
`06:18.15`	`Sazpaimon`	`N9 is microsim`
`06:18.16`	`archl`	`n9 take cutting full size.`
`06:18.50`	`ds3`	`arrg`
`06:19.19`	`ds3`	`so there is no successor phone that can take the same sim as the N900?!`
`06:19.27`	`Sazpaimon`	`okay so getting this OEM digitizer with attached frame is basically what the nokia care guys would get`
`06:19.30`	`Sazpaimon`	`right?`
`06:19.30`	`archl`	`N950?`
`06:19.50`	`archl`	`How to get Nokia manufacturing N950!`
`06:19.53`	`ds3`	`but the N950 is not offered for sale, right?`
`06:20.18`	`*** part/#maemo joga (FwivYnzz@rikki.fi)`
`06:21.54`	`archl`	`not in Nokia Plan. I guess, currently, Meego is better than WP7 in their labs.`
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`06:23.09`	`ds3`	`BAH so there is no successor that can use a normal full sim :(`
`06:24.16`	`fortytwo`	`If you're careful you can always cut your current SIM down to size ;)`
`06:24.22`	`cehteh`	`full sim isnt used since the 80's anymore`
`06:24.26`	`fortytwo`	`That does work IIRC`
`06:24.43`	`cehteh`	`full sim is credit card size! :P`
`06:25.02`	`cehteh`	`what you use in the n900 is already a stamped out mini sim`
`06:25.39`	`fortytwo`	`Haha, looks like I need to keep an eye out for a full size one :P`
`06:25.43`	`cehteh`	`http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subscriber_Identity_Module#Formats`
`06:26.09`	`cehteh`	`iirc the motorola bones used full sims`
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`06:37.36`	`KrayonWORK`	`I've got a Motorola that uses the full size`
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`06:38.54`	`cehteh`	`KrayonWORK: old one?`
`06:40.32`	`KrayonWORK`	`Yeah, it's cool as. I have 2 batteries and an external charger too, wanna buy?`
`06:40.33`	`KrayonWORK`	`:P`
`06:40.50`	`cehteh`	`which one?`
`06:41.15`	`cehteh`	`does it even work with modern low power/voltage sim cards? or does it fry them?`
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`06:44.22`	`KrayonWORK`	`I've not used it in many many years so who knows :P`
`06:44.29`	`KrayonWORK`	`The batteries are probably screwed too :/`
`06:45.10`	`KrayonWORK`	`It's the 7500 I believe: http://images.google.com.au/images?q=motorola+7500&hl=en`
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`07:02.07`	`psycho_oreos`	`~aegis`
`07:02.07`	`infobot`	`from memory, aegis is http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Developing_for_Harmattan/Harmattan_security/Security_guide , or "The purpose of this framework is: ... to make sure that the platform meets the requirements set by third party software that requires a safe execution environment.", or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing#Criticism, or ...`
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`07:17.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`trows a motorola 620 at KrayonWORK`
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`07:20.54`	`KrayonWORK`	`DocScrutinizer: :P A V620? Because that's not NEARLY as old school as my 7500`
`07:21.28`	`KrayonWORK`	`Or is it this: http://www.oaktreevintage.com/web_photos/Telephones/Motorola_Cellular-One_Cell-Phone_web.jpg`
`07:21.42`	`KrayonWORK`	`'cause you win if so.`
`07:22.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`http://handy-sammler.de/Handys/motorola_td1_620.htm`
`07:22.13`	`KrayonWORK`	`Extra points for THIS one: http://files.sharenator.com/old_motorola_mobile_phone_Think_your_mobile_phone_is_too_big_pics-s450x299-229-580.png`
`07:23.58`	`cehteh`	`KrayonWORK: you didnt seen the first mobile ones :P`
`07:24.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`""Made in Germany by Motorola"" ;-D`
`07:25.20`	`cehteh`	`well the first ones where "portable" .. not "mobile" :)`
`07:26.04`	`ds3`	`fine. mini SIM`
`07:27.18`	`KrayonWORK`	`DocScrutinizer: From what documentation I can find, yours came out 1995, mine 1994.`
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`07:27.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but I can throw sharper`
`07:27.57`	`KrayonWORK`	`cehteh: Heh, reminds me of my step father's first ... portable computer, something like this: http://oldcomputers.net/pics/osborne1.jpg`
`07:28.03`	`KrayonWORK`	`DocScrutinizer: Heh yeah OK, you win :P`
`07:28.22`	`KrayonWORK`	`weighed about 7 million KG that thing.`
`07:28.23`	`cehteh`	`yeah the osborne was a classic :) and later the comodore sx-64`
`07:28.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wouldn't know how to even test this brick, with the friggin crdit card size SIM it needs`
`07:29.08`	`KrayonWORK`	`Actually, now I think about it, I believe his was an IBM portable of some kind.`
`07:29.36`	`KrayonWORK`	`DocScrutinizer: Here in Australia most sims still come in that size`
`07:29.55`	`KrayonWORK`	`Though I guess as cehteh says if thye've changed the voltage or something maybe it wouldn't work :P`
`07:30.07`	`FIQ\|n900`	`portable aka "you can move it but you don't want to"`
`07:30.38`	`KrayonWORK`	`FIQ\|n900: heh yeah exactly.`
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`07:30.53`	`KrayonWORK`	`One of the Motorola's I have sold on eBay for $30 :P Was for charity though`
`07:31.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`FIQ\|n900: so it's been very modern wrt this. The most expensive laptops are quite the same nowadays`
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`07:33.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'd like to hear of a single user that got h-e-n working with new PK48`
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`07:36.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1087244#post1087244`
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`07:45.30`	`Trewas`	`nokia started taking pre-orders for N9 in finland, 699 euros for 64gb model... I would say "lol", except that I never say that`
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`07:46.34`	`Jartza`	`I already dismissed the N9`
`07:46.42`	`Jartza`	`too late`
`07:47.31`	`Corsac`	`do we know the final specs?`
`07:47.39`	`FIQ\|n900`	`6999 euros...`
`07:47.48`	`FIQ\|n900`	`s/999/99/`
`07:48.09`	`Jartza`	`I could pay 450e max`
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`07:48.31`	`FIQ\|n900`	`i payed 6k SEK for N900 :3`
`07:48.55`	`FIQ\|n900`	`dunno how much that's in euro...`
`07:49.54`	`Corsac`	`<PROTECTED>`
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`07:50.13`	`Corsac`	`I think I paid around ~200â¬ with 1y contract`
`07:50.22`	`FIQ\|n900`	`gcalc says 655`
`07:50.37`	`FIQ\|n900`	`but yeah, somewhere around that`
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`07:51.13`	`Jartza`	`I paid 450 for N900`
`07:51.19`	`Jartza`	`euros`
`07:51.20`	`FIQ\|n900`	`N9 doesn't have a keyboard`
`07:51.30`	`FIQ\|n900`	`Therefore, I will not buy N9`
`07:51.40`	`FIQ\|n900`	`at all`
`07:52.22`	`FIQ\|n900`	`not that i would rush and buy if it had, but then i would look at it as an eventual successor when my N900 breaks`
`07:52.51`	`hiemanshu`	`looks at his N950 and goes MEH`
`07:53.03`	`FIQ\|n900`	`screw you D:`
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`07:53.11`	`FIQ\|n900`	`Argh, i don't like capacitive touch screens either`
`07:53.32`	`FIQ\|n900`	`Seriously, I always use my nails for precision on my N900`
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`07:54.00`	`FIQ\|n900`	`It's impossible, more or less, to do that on things like galaxy s2, iphone, whatever uses capacitive screens`
`07:55.42`	`Choom`	`you can use your fingertips on a capacitive screen for precision too`
`07:55.45`	`Choom`	`nals are not needed`
`07:56.23`	`FIQ\|n900`	`but i'm used to it :D`
`07:56.24`	`edheldil`	`I used to carry something similar to this phone: http://www.retrobrick.com/1000.html`
`07:56.44`	`FIQ\|n900`	`i will have a hard time using a new phone the first week/weeks due to that`
`07:56.50`	`Choom`	`the capacitive screens on the ipad / iphone sense my fingers without almost any pressure, sometimes even before I sense the screen`
`07:57.02`	`FIQ\|n900`	`but of course you will get used to it sooner or later`
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`07:58.35`	`Choom`	`I am kinda tempted to order an N9 even though I'm not gonna be using it`
`07:59.08`	`Choom`	`though the fact that nokia isn't selling them almost anywhere will make it difficult`
`07:59.13`	`FIQ\|n900`	`does it still come with xterm installed per default? :3`
`07:59.39`	`psycho_oreos`	`difficult but not impossible`
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`08:14.59`	`psycho_oreos`	`DocScrutinizer, ping`
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`08:16.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`pong`
`08:16.57`	`psycho_oreos`	`when you were referring to new kp48, you mean the one that colin.stephane and freemangordon were building up? (aka power49)? or just power48 from extras-devel?`
`08:17.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`latter`
`08:17.49`	`psycho_oreos`	`power48 from extras-kernel? I have it working on my other N900 (with cssu maemo15 installed)`
`08:17.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`freemanG is building PK now? great, this guy is incredible`
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`08:18.12`	`psycho_oreos`	`I don't know if he's actually building it but he's contributing heaps of patches :)`
`08:18.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's no the question. Do you have h-e-n working with it`
`08:19.02`	`psycho_oreos`	`yes, I have sandisk 32GB flash drive attached to my other N900 and it is working.. the flash drive is mounted and I could see the contents`
`08:19.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`OK, mayn thanks`
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`08:20.21`	`psycho_oreos`	`also I should add that I have not applied any patches mentioned on t.m.o. threads.. this is just h-e-n from extras-devel with no jrbme script nor that modded booston`
`08:20.29`	`psycho_oreos`	`but no worries :)`
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`08:29.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	psycho_oreos: could you do a `which booston` please
`08:29.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	and a `which i2xget`
`08:29.50`	`psycho_oreos`	`DocScrutinizer, sure, moment please`
`08:29.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	and a `which i2cget`
`08:31.03`	`psycho_oreos`	`which booston == /usr/sbin/booston, which i2cget == /usr/sbin/i2cget`
`08:31.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(my development system is so heavily messed up / tweaked from all the modding I did, I dunno where those are usually)`
`08:31.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`thanks very much`
`08:31.45`	`psycho_oreos`	`seems like those files are in the directories that are in $PATH :)`
`08:31.45`	`psycho_oreos`	`nw`
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`08:32.52`	`psycho_oreos`	`lol my rootfs on both my N900 are butchered.. I've been ignoring warnings that you should never install scratchbox tools on your N900 directly ;D`
`08:33.12`	`psycho_oreos`	`thinks he'll get told someday for all that mess`
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`08:42.08`	`cehteh`	`psycho_oreos: man chroot :P`
`08:43.02`	`psycho_oreos`	`DocScrutinizer, hahaha just saw your thread and noticed my typo :D extras-kernel.. lolwtf.. I meant extras-devel.. hahaha my bad`
`08:43.25`	`psycho_oreos`	`cehteh, indeed but I guess I was rather lazy.. heh still somewhat am :p`
`08:43.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`psycho_oreos: eh? not even noticed it. Should I worry?`
`08:45.00`	`psycho_oreos`	`DocScrutinizer, nevermind.. I'll post my self mocking reply :D`
`08:46.12`	`psycho_oreos`	`gotta love xchat with black background and grey text foreground, that plus small fonts and tiredness factor lol`
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`09:23.40`	`robbiethe1st`	`heh. transferring files onto a NFS mount really drains the battery`
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`09:34.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`robbiethe1st: hey morning`
`09:34.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`javispedro: moo`
`09:34.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`tzz`
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`11:16.53`	`DocScrutinizer51`	`~ping`
`11:16.53`	`infobot`	`~pong`
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`11:20.36`	`ildar`	`boinc`
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`11:55.10`	`rd`	`Does anybody sync the KDE addressbook with the n900 address book?`
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`12:05.41`	`ildar`	`hi`
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`12:06.07`	`ildar`	`I like the idea to sync every device to one central addr.book`
`12:06.20`	`ildar`	`Google is very good at it`
`12:06.47`	`ildar`	`http://wiki.maemo.org/Sync#Synchronising_with_Google`
`12:07.08`	`ildar`	`just find how to sync your kaddr to google`
`12:08.22`	`chem\|st`	`ildar: never worked for me, it synced the addresses from google to my device but not the way back`
`12:08.40`	`ildar`	`hmmm`
`12:08.56`	`ildar`	`didn't try dev->Google yet`
`12:09.03`	`chem\|st`	`some people have contacts working but no calender, some have working both...`
`12:09.55`	`ildar`	`I have both`
`12:10.13`	`ildar`	`but didn't try dev->Google as I said`
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`12:14.17`	`chem\|st`	`ildar: an initial sync does both`
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`12:14.27`	`ildar`	`ahhh!`
`12:14.29`	`ildar`	`I see`
`12:14.47`	`ildar`	`I almost don't use calendar`
`12:14.57`	`ildar`	`so I can't be sure about it`
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`12:42.41`	`ShadowJK`	`heh, loaded "tomato" on my Linksys WRT54GL wifi accesspoint. My N800 and N810 began consuming alot less power. Turns out they're not receiving and broadcast traffic anymore. Yay for saving power. Oops they're no longer pingable or reachable over ssh.`
`12:43.31`	`ildar`	`:)`
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`12:46.01`	`RST38h`	`Don't install various funky shit! =)`
`12:47.09`	`ShadowJK`	`Actually I'm not sure if it did this with stock firmware too, as I had it placed in an area of the house I would never have placed Nxxx in and then tried access from another device`
`12:47.34`	`RST38h`	`Starting with something like PR1.1, N900 pinged really good`
`12:47.46`	`RST38h`	`Before that - trouble`
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`12:51.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`my devices all ping fine here, unless DNS lease times out and device fails to renew it`
`12:51.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`DHCP lease?`
`12:52.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`funny effect: device can talk to internet just fine (ARP), but no way to ssh to device (DNS)`
`12:53.39`	`SpeedEvil`	`My solution to that.`
`12:53.42`	`SpeedEvil`	`static IP`
`12:54.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`meh, my router (new since lightning stroke) has static IP configured but it seems there's a bug in that crappy D-Link DHCP-server implementation`
`12:55.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`not even the logs of router mention any DHCP event, and WLAN on N900 returned with "Can't connect. Didn't get valid IP"`
`12:56.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`dunno if booting router, or booting N900 fixed it. I guess none of both, I had to redo the static IP DHCP config on router, to make it work again`
`12:57.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`is frowning on "DHCP lease timeout: -1" for the static IPs`
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`13:00.32`	`edheldil`	`DocScrutinizer: Consider reflashing the router to openwrt. Look here for supported iron: http://wiki.openwrt.org/toh/start#d-link`
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`13:11.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`edheldil: seems D3E revision isn't supported`
`13:11.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`DIR-615`
`13:13.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it has other idiocies as well: e.g. you can't define schedules (for fw rules, interface uptime etc) that span across midnight`
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`13:14.19`	`ShadowJK`	`has static IP configured on client side`
`13:14.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`a schedule that's active from 23:00 to 22:00 next day isn't possoble`
`13:15.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: I doubt that can help when router doesn't route anymore`
`13:15.31`	`DocScrutinizer`	`seems the device falls out of router's ARP table`
`13:15.41`	`ildar`	`ÉÎÕ ÆÄÄ`
`13:15.43`	`ildar`	`oops`
`13:15.45`	`ildar`	`bye all`
`13:15.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or dunno what exactly`
`13:16.19`	`edheldil`	`DocScrutinizer: too bad, sorry`
`13:16.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nah, probably router`
`13:16.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`router's local DNS fails`
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`13:17.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'm not really familiar how 192.168.1.33 pings 192.168.1.44`
`13:17.55`	`ShadowJK`	`no dns, no dhcp needed for that`
`13:18.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`maybe .33 sends out an ARP request?`
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`13:18.21`	`ShadowJK`	`yes`
`13:18.25`	`ShadowJK`	`to broadcast`
`13:18.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`who_is_.44`
`13:19.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`then it's probably my local ARP table on linux that fscks up, seens this frequently`
`13:19.25`	`edheldil`	`DocScrutinizer: d3e is not specifically listed, but not specifically unlisted either.`
`13:19.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`something's odd with this TCP-IP stack and associated crap on that openSuse`
`13:19.59`	`ShadowJK`	`entries in arp tables are pretty short lived`
`13:21.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`frequently when I "unplug the ethernet cable" I need a "/etc/init.d/network restart" if there's been a data transmission during unplugging`
`13:21.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sth with the kernel network-card driver fscks up`
`13:22.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`edheldil: indeed, but I'm not too happy with it not being listed`
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`13:59.49`	`Treibholz`	`has anybody tried yet to install a regular Debian on the n900?`
`13:59.59`	`e0x`	`reason for reboot loop ?`
`14:00.37`	`Treibholz`	`e0x: no, not yet :-)`
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`14:01.04`	`e0x`	`i mean , what are the common reason for reboot loop`
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`14:02.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`usually roofs no-free-space, kernel not matching modules, and desktop widgets going apeshit causing >3 segfaults of h-d in 2 min`
`14:03.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I guess that's the top 3, in no particular sorting order`
`14:03.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`then there's also PEBKAC`
`14:03.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I.E. messing up init scripts etc`
`14:04.05`	`e0x`	`then i and fuck, it first started loosing all telephony function ( i check and i see that the sim card was a little floofy ) i fix that now with 80% of battery i lose the telephony function againd i reboot it and is on reboot loop now , i remove the battery and do the same when i put it back again`
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`14:04.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`eeew`
`14:04.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`reflash as long as battery is fresh enough`
`14:06.20`	`e0x`	`:(`
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`14:07.27`	`RST38h`	`"I wish NASA would finance future missions by selling interestingly packaged astronaut foods in general" -- timothy@Slashdot`
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`14:07.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`e0x: not to play the partypooper, but it sounds like a hw defect`
`14:07.55`	`e0x`	`last night happen me to too but i left it connect to the wall charge and boot up ( the battery was low )`
`14:08.08`	`e0x`	`DocScrutinizer: yes i think the same`
`14:08.08`	`Sazpaimon`	`so, until I get ANOTHER replacement digitizer (the one I ordered last month came without the frame), I'm stuck on my E71`
`14:08.12`	`e0x`	`o drop it a few time`
`14:08.17`	`e0x`	`s/o/i`
`14:08.20`	`Sazpaimon`	`and my E71 is missing the front part of the casing`
`14:08.30`	`e0x`	`DocScrutinizer: any idea what hardware can i check ?`
`14:08.37`	`Sazpaimon`	`so ive taped together the keypad onto the phone and around the screen for protection`
`14:08.48`	`Sazpaimon`	`its serioulsy the most ghetto thing ever`
`14:08.49`	`DocScrutinizer`	`probably no hope to check any hw`
`14:08.56`	`e0x`	`ok`
`14:08.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`reflash`
`14:09.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hope for the best`
`14:09.15`	`e0x`	`i will try boot it again to save some data and then reflash`
`14:09.22`	`Sazpaimon`	`im failing to understand why someone would sell an N900 digitizer without the metal frame`
`14:09.27`	`e0x`	`i will the the wall charge thing again`
`14:09.45`	`Sazpaimon`	`i get that they came from the factory like that, but its pretty much useless without the frame`
`14:10.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`metal frame?`
`14:10.57`	`Sazpaimon`	`yes, the metal part behind the digitizer`
`14:11.07`	`Sazpaimon`	`where the earpiece is attached to and where the screws go into`
`14:11.18`	`Sazpaimon`	`without it its just the plastic piece`
`14:12.07`	`Sazpaimon`	`http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/1/2/8/4/2/7/2/webimg/494732953_o.jpg?nc=435 here's what it should b`
`14:12.10`	`Sazpaimon`	`*be`
`14:13.24`	`Sazpaimon`	`http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/gamerlined66/M01022-34.jpg this is what I ended up getting`
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`14:21.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmm, right. Though you should be able to separate the transparent plastic from old metal frame`
`14:22.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`the possibly mount the new digitizer touchpad with doublesided sticky or dunno what`
`14:22.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`Heating the old one to ~80C may make it lots easier to unpeel`
`14:22.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah`
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`15:01.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`laughs at french politicians calling a potential http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticality_accident "no atomic incident but an industrial incident"`
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`15:07.46`	`crashanddie`	`That incident was horsecrap.`
`15:07.57`	`crashanddie`	`It's a slip up.`
`15:08.03`	`crashanddie`	`Who the fuck cares, really.`
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`15:21.54`	`_trine`	`http://www.pwnieexpress.com/pwn_phone.html is this another xxx\|666 scam`
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`15:48.20`	`e0x`	`DocScrutinizer: hmm i put back the battery and boot normal`
`15:48.32`	`e0x`	`well is booting normal so far`
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`15:50.10`	`e0x`	`warning a unxpected reboot occured, Your Custom kernel settings ware NOT loaded`
`15:50.15`	`e0x`	`any idea ?`
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`15:53.42`	`DocScrutinizer51`	`meh`
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`15:56.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sounds like powerkernel with any one of those mostly insane tweaking GUIs`
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`15:59.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`if ! [ -e /var/powerkernel/bootfailedflag ]; then echo "it failed!" >/var/powerkernelgui/bootfailedflag; do_random_bs_and_OC_to_3GHz; rm /var/powerkernelgui/bootfailedflag; fi;`
`16:00.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`good luck with hoping for a sync() prior to do_random_bs_and_OC_to_3GHz X-P`
`16:00.26`	`rm_work`	`if [ text = 'rm' ]; then echo "PING RM_YOU"; fi;`
`16:00.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`don't let noobs mess with your system's kernel settings`
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`16:06.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rm_work: you were about to do some brightness stuff, no?`
`16:07.15`	`rm_work`	`i gave up`
`16:07.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmm`
`16:07.31`	`rm_work`	`i got way too discouraged by everyone telling me it was useless`
`16:07.39`	`rm_work`	`started working on other stuff`
`16:07.41`	`rm_work`	`like pandora`
`16:07.52`	`rm_work`	`(the radio client, not the board)`
`16:07.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`aah`
`16:08.08`	`rm_work`	`and package management solutions`
`16:08.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah, HARM`
`16:08.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and fsckaegis`
`16:08.40`	`rm_work`	`PackRat / non-obs-repos`
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`16:09.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I gave up on HARM more or less`
`16:10.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`too much injury in HARM`
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`16:12.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rm_work: just wondered if you know details about ALS and mce + plugins, esp /usr/lib/mce/modules/libfilter-brightness-als.so`
`16:13.09`	`rm_work`	`nope :( i messed with it a bit but`
`16:13.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`there's that odd effect of indicator RGB LED going dim on pattern activation when bright sun shines into ALS`
`16:13.20`	`rm_work`	`not sure exactly about the libfilter ones`
`16:13.28`	`rm_work`	`those are seperate from what i was working with`
`16:14.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`:nod:`
`16:14.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`thanks`
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`17:06.40`	`e0x`	`DocScrutinizer: i have power kernel but not OC , i just install it for use mobilespot`
`17:06.49`	`e0x`	`i will do a reflash`
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`17:45.58`	`Estel_`	`hello there - could anyone experienced with autobuilder packaging help me?`
`17:47.53`	`Estel_`	`if anyone, who did any successul package uploading will read this, please just ping me and I'll give details. Thanks in advance.`
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`17:48.38`	`Estel_`	`disclaimer: I'm just looking for info, not for someone to upload package for me. Really ;)`
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`18:12.45`	`SpeedEvil`	`http://i.imgur.com/yAxd9.jpg - Unicode fail.`
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`18:27.11`	`Sazpaimon`	`SpeedEvil, It got to its destination`
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`18:27.25`	`Sazpaimon`	`so good on the post office`
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`18:42.40`	`Estel_`	`~ping`
`18:42.40`	`infobot`	`~pong`
`18:43.03`	`Estel_`	`~tw4030_usb`
`18:43.47`	`DocScrutinizer51`	`twl4030?`
`18:44.12`	`DocScrutinizer51`	`I doubt there's any such factoid`
`18:44.13`	`Estel_`	`hey there, I was just checking how good infobot database is ;)`
`18:44.31`	`DocScrutinizer51`	`~listkeys 4030`
`18:45.27`	`DocScrutinizer51`	`~listvalues 4030`
`18:45.57`	`Estel_`	`I got no idea how it works, lol. You won't believe, but yesterday was my first contact with irc, I just saw logs and though that much valuable info is shared here`
`18:46.36`	`Estel_`	`+ less latency compared to tmo, for some things`
`18:46.53`	`Estel_`	`anyway, still no luck about autobuilder`
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`18:47.31`	`Estel_`	`it must be common info - almost every package use that, Well, I guess people got their time occupied`
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`19:46.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: you should repeat a terse description of your problem with autobuilder. There are a few experts around here every now and then`
`19:47.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: anyway see`
`19:47.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~ask`
`19:47.47`	`infobot`	`Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will.`
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`19:49.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: nobody's going to ping you to ask for details. If your problem can't be described in one sentence, then you probably need to think it over again`
`19:49.26`	`Estel_`	`thanks DocScrutinizer`
`19:50.02`	`Estel_`	`i just wanted to not spam channel about my question over and over, but rule of thumb acknowledged.`
`19:51.03`	`Sicelo`	`always liked the part : "e are all here voluntarily or _against our will._" lol`
`19:52.09`	`Estel_`	`hey there, I got problem with packaging through autobuilder. Despite reading whole manual, I can't seem to find how add to package specific files (graphic, for example), the ones that normally sits in 'data.tar'. I suspect that this got something to do with makefile, but no idea further.`
`19:52.54`	`Estel_`	`tense enough, or do You think I shall make it more like newspaper title? ;-)`
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`19:54.46`	`Estel_`	`I know irc is for short sentences - rather, but I fear of stripping it too much of actual sense.`
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`20:05.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: I think that's been quite appropriate. send a link to the file you suspect is incorrect, so others can look into it`
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`20:06.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`also actually asking for this (looking into the file) is better than just listing facts, as the answer to this might be "so what?"`
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`20:57.42`	`Estel_`	`DocScrutinizer, thanks. Ho ever, there is no problematic file - I just thing it may be achievable via 'makefile', but I dont have idea how, searching doesnt help either.`
`20:58.37`	`Estel_`	`I got idea I just overlook obvious, but two other people also can't seem to find it, so maybe it's obvious only if You already know it ;-)`
`20:59.06`	`Estel_`	`anyway, thank You for trying to help and warning me about certain habits here ;)`
`21:03.03`	`Sazpaimon`	`http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005HA3Y2O/`
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`21:08.41`	`Sazpaimon`	`http://www.engadget.com/2011/09/13/andy-rubin-shows-off-medfield-based-android-phone-at-idf-2011-r/ welp, so much for meego`
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`21:14.27`	`SpeedEvil`	`meh`
`21:16.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`when estel thinks it doesn't help when others look into his project ("two other people also can't seem to find it") then I really don't understand why he's asking here at all.`
`21:16.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`:-S`
`21:17.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`actually he didn't ask anything`
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`21:18.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ooh he did -> >><Estel_> hello there - could anyone experienced with autobuilder packaging help me?<<`
`21:19.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`answer: probably not, as you're not sharing enough detail, and instead are requesting to ping you`
`21:20.22`	`Estel_`	`hey, before asking that I've asked few times today with a details :P`
`21:21.03`	`Estel_`	`then, I asked once like that to not spam here with my question, but, indeed, DocScrutinizer told me thats its better to ask with details again anyway`
`21:22.18`	`Estel_`	`DocScrutinizer, You've missunderstood me (checked logs)`
`21:23.20`	`Estel_`	`I would love to show file here, but there is nothing to show, cause I can't seem to find basic info about adding non-source code files to autobuilder (like graphic)`
`21:23.39`	`Estel_`	`anyway, there is package in repository - Deskyapplet`
`21:23.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: place one precise question like "in this project ( http://maemo-Garage-URL ) I expected the icons provided via <insert link to method here> to show up in the *.deb. Ãlease tell me what's wrong with the project as they don't shop up when I install the built project`
`21:24.13`	`Estel_`	`it install, but doesn't work properly due to missing files, which must be placed manually`
`21:24.31`	`Estel_`	`ok`
`21:25.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or "please point me to a howto when I want to add a *.jpg for the background of my app to the project"`
`21:26.45`	`Estel_`	`understood, will fix my question :)`
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`21:34.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Estel_: I'd guess wallpaper/theme/ringtone packages do not much more than just transporting and installing "binary" data (.png, .mp3)`
`21:35.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`looking into the source of any app of such or similar type might give a clue how to add missing non-sourcecode files to a project`
`21:45.33`	`Estel_`	`You're absolutely right. I'm just collecting enough info to ask again smarter way, I'm not even "main" person in this project.`
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`21:46.49`	`Estel_`	`DocScrutinizer, I've just helped original developer to go through autobuilder at all ;) so, anyway, thanks for pointing out my mistakes in question "building"`
`21:49.58`	`Estel_`	`Also, it seems dev screwed uploading to garage, or I'm too stupid, cause I can't seem to find sources in .garage page, only .deb.`
`21:50.13`	`Estel_`	`I'll probably check that more thoroughly and ask again.`
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`22:15.05`	`ThreeM`	`wtf? Intel first Smartphone use Android? facepalm`
`22:17.57`	`ruskie`	`rofl`
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`22:19.49`	`ThreeM`	`this makes no sense`
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`22:21.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I've not seen much sense making in smartphone business at large lately`
`22:22.42`	`ThreeM`	`true`
`22:23.41`	`ThreeM`	`but intel, come on... a few days before they deny the roumor that they will stop meego and now this bad news :(`
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`22:47.54`	`Pali`	`DocScrutinizer: can you help me with host mode and charging?`
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`23:01.13`	`TiagoTiago`	`hi`
`23:02.20`	`TiagoTiago`	`does anyone have any idea why WizardMounter can mount folders on computer B, computer B can see folders shared by computer A (both running WinXP), but Wizard Mounter says "Connection Refused" when i try to mount a folder from computer A?`
`23:06.07`	`TiagoTiago`	`already tried disabling firewall, nothing changed`
`23:06.52`	`ThreeM`	`security config on windows`
`23:07.41`	`TiagoTiago`	`those things there with group policies and stuff?`
`23:07.50`	`ThreeM`	`i think so`
`23:08.17`	`ThreeM`	`its not wizard mounters fault.`
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`23:12.00`	`TiagoTiago`	`Any idea why it would be different between the two computers?`
`23:12.17`	`ThreeM`	`nope sorry`
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`23:48.50`	`TiagoTiago`	`seems some people had "connection refused" issues at http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=44188 (WM's thread), but i haven't found anything there that helps me so far :/`
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`23:55.41`	`TiagoTiago`	`ok, it does work if i mount it via command line, but not via Wizard Mounter`
`23:55.51`	`TiagoTiago`	`what's the deal?`
`23:56.25`	`Ken-Young`	`Does anyone know of a PDF viewer with a search feature which will run on the N900?`
`23:57.27`	`zutesmog`	`strace is documented as being in an strace package, but apt-get is telling me Package strace is not available, but is referred to by another package.`
`23:57.27`	`zutesmog`	`This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or`
`23:57.27`	`zutesmog`	`is only available from another source`
`23:57.27`	`zutesmog`	`E: Package strace has no installation candidate`
`23:57.41`	`zutesmog`	`Any one know wher strace has ended up ?`
`23:58.11`	`zutesmog`	`my camera app has just started crashing after 8months, and trying to work out what is going on.`
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