IRC log for #maemo on 20110402

`00:04.26`	`*** join/#maemo jonne (~jonne@188.189.77.131)`
`00:04.42`	`*** join/#maemo spiritd (~spiritd@188.75.128.2)`
`00:05.20`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`...will i be safe on skype video calls XD`
`00:05.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`should`
`00:05.44`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`hehe`
`00:05.49`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`kidding`
`00:05.50`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`=)`
`00:06.44`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`maybe a silly question cpu OC get reset to stock after flash?`
`00:06.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yes`
`00:07.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but not the damage done`
`00:07.38`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`yeah =/`
`00:07.47`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`warranty ftw`
`00:07.50`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`^^`
`00:08.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah, test thoroughly`
`00:10.11`	`*** join/#maemo Rarok (~Rarok@65.99.165.83.dynamic.mundo-r.com)`
`00:10.19`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`will do`
`00:11.23`	`*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)`
`00:12.57`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B (~csb@ipv4-95-152-205-90.static.as8844.net)`
`00:14.26`	`*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)`
`00:17.00`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`any key or combo on hardware keyboard for TAB`
`00:17.06`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`?`
`00:17.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ctrl-i might work`
`00:17.34`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`:D`
`00:17.43`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`ty`
`00:18.01`	`*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)`
`00:18.52`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`seems it didnt`
`00:19.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`for what?`
`00:19.24`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`replace for TAB`
`00:19.29`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`key`
`00:19.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`where?`
`00:19.41`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`xterm`
`00:19.50`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`duh`
`00:19.55`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`theres a buttun`
`00:19.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`xterm has a tab on the bar at bottom`
`00:20.02`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`XD`
`00:20.07`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`yeah sorry`
`00:20.32`	`*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)`
`00:28.06`	`*** join/#maemo bigbrovar2 (~yaaic@83.229.6.19)`
`00:30.50`	`*** join/#maemo bigbrovar (~quassel@83.229.6.19)`
`00:33.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`o0-Dan-0o: check http://maemo.org/packages/view/notmynokia/ before inserting SIM!`
`00:37.52`	`*** join/#maemo chx (~chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view)`
`00:41.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`o0-Dan-0o: http://wiki.maemo.org/PR1.2_compulsory_My_Nokia_subscription`
`00:46.26`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`is it bad to register`
`00:46.28`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`?`
`00:47.36`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`oh i guess 2nd link explains it`
`00:47.37`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`=)`
`00:48.20`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`before inserting sim`
`00:48.28`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`wont be possible..`
`00:49.01`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`i mean.. only if i reboot without it`
`00:49.13`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`y`
`00:49.24`	`*** join/#maemo khorben_ (~dont@2002:53ec:d9a1:1:221:28ff:fe14:b106)`
`00:49.57`	`*** join/#maemo chx (~chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view)`
`00:50.18`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`lmao`
`00:50.23`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`... involves a text (SMS) being sent from the device to Nokia, which might be at the owner's expense...`
`00:52.37`	`*** join/#maemo Tr4sK (~user@home.biboum.fr)`
`00:53.09`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`indeed doesnt look very nice/legal`
`00:53.44`	`o0-Dan-0o`	`will look at it tomorrow and try to disable =)`
`01:03.54`	`SpeedEvil`	`It's explicitly illegal in the UK.`
`01:05.50`	`*** join/#maemo AdmiralSausage (~Pete@cpc5-aztw24-2-0-cust341.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com)`
`01:06.49`	`*** join/#maemo pupnik (~pupnik@p54B2B3E5.dip.t-dialin.net)`
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`01:14.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: while reading thru this, and doing a lil bit of mc'ing I find /etc/X11/Xsession.post/32mafw and 3?mafw*`
`01:14.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`could you confirm you got same files, and the mafw* seem utterly redundant or even evil regarding mafw does same thing?`
`01:14.55`	`SpeedEvil`	`...`
`01:16.41`	`SpeedEvil`	`Nokia-N900:/etc/X11/Xsession.post# ls mafw`
`01:16.42`	`SpeedEvil`	`32mafw-gst-renderer 34mafw-tracker-source`
`01:16.42`	`SpeedEvil`	`33mafw-iradio-source 35mafw-upnp-source`
`01:17.18`	`SpeedEvil`	`All have dates of Feb 17-19 2010, renderer Jun 21 2010`
`01:19.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`32mafw 2009-09-17 493`
`01:19.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`LOL`
`01:20.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	for plugin in /usr/lib/mafw-plugin/.so; do # For uninstall to work, we must start them using just the # basename without '.so'. plugin="${plugin##/}"; plugin="${plugin%.so}"; nice=""; if test "x$plugin" = "xmafw-gst-renderer"; then # Run the renderer with a nice value nice="-7"; fi
`01:20.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sudo /usr/bin/mafw.sh start "$plugin" $nice & done`
`01:21.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ok, it has a sudo`
`01:22.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`seems somebody missed to uninstall this when updating SSU from 1.0 to 1.3`
`01:24.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I wonder if I got a super-multimedia-device now that each mafw-plugin gets started twice`
`01:24.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`;-P`
`01:25.58`	`pupnik`	`movin to montana soon... gona be a dental floss tycoon...`
`01:27.06`	`*** join/#maemo bef0rd (~fercho@unaffiliated/beford)`
`01:27.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MOVIN TO MONTANA SOON, GONNA BE A MENTAL TOSS FLYCOON (whatever that means)`
`01:28.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG51: ps\|grep mafw`
`01:28.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you might think it's looking odd /usr/bin/mafw-playlist-daemon has no dbus-wrapper`
`01:31.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, at least starting those plugins twice doesn't mean I got two processes of each`
`01:32.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`still I'm temped to move away that 32mafw and see if device boots 4s faster`
`01:32.55`	`*** join/#maemo chx (~chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view)`
`01:33.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`plus a super-YUCK for the hardcoded inline nice value (-7)`
`01:33.35`	`SpeedEvil`	`Stick a script that moves it back, and then exits in place first of course.`
`01:33.50`	`*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)`
`01:34.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`good plan`
`01:42.27`	`*** join/#maemo wooden (~anon@user-1087hp5.cable.mindspring.com)`
`01:42.27`	`*** join/#maemo wooden (~anon@pdpc/supporter/active/wooden)`
`01:42.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	though my mood been more ambitious a few hours ago: mv /usr/bin /usr/bin2; mkdir /usr/bin; for f in /usr/bin2/; do echo -e 'echo `date` /usr/bin2/"$@"'>/var/log/bootusage.log; \n"$@"'>/usr/bin/${f##/}; done
`01:46.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`of course you'd need a link of /usr/bin2 to /usr/bin rather than moving it, then create /usr/bin1 that way I suggested for /usr/bin, then mv /usr/bin1 to /usr/bin`
`01:48.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but somehow I lost my venturous mood while pondering similar rescue schemes you suggested, SpeedEvil`
`01:49.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nevertheless eventually I'll do this and then sanitaze this whole optification mess`
`01:50.25`	`luke-jr`	`so if a HD overheats, is it likely replacing the PCB will fix it?`
`01:51.34`	`SpeedEvil`	`busybox bootchart`
`01:51.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`move all the misplaced /usr/bin/binaries that are used before mount of eMMC to /(s)bin, then move /usr to an own partition and de-optify all the shit`
`01:51.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`o.O`
`01:52.13`	`SpeedEvil`	`http://gitorious.org/busybox/busybox/commit/adbbee46ad0661bf695d2bfe7a07ebced4bbe780`
`01:52.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`luke-jr: unclear`
`01:54.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: sounds handy, but where to get it?`
`01:56.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`'our' messybox says "bootchartd: applet not found"`
`02:13.03`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@a88-115-28-127.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
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`02:15.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`luke-jr: did it make noises prior to failure?`
`02:16.21`	`luke-jr`	`DocScrutinizer: dunno, I just plugged it in the night before`
`02:16.36`	`luke-jr`	`â¦ to make backups, ironically enough`
`02:19.43`	`*** join/#maemo pcacjr (~pcacjr@unaffiliated/pcacjr)`
`02:20.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`luke-jr: why do you think it overheated?`
`02:21.10`	`luke-jr`	`DocScrutinizer: it had no cooling?`
`02:21.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`an external HDD shouldn't need a cooling usually`
`02:21.58`	`luke-jr`	`it's "internal", but hooked up to a minimal adapter`
`02:22.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so ambient temperature was like normal?`
`02:22.39`	`nox-`	`i have one external esata/1394/usb disk that the 1394 interface has died on...`
`02:22.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`a single drive that has some convection does rarely overheat`
`02:23.04`	`luke-jr`	`DocScrutinizer: I guessâ¦`
`02:23.16`	`luke-jr`	`but why else would it suddenly fail?`
`02:23.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`electrical`
`02:23.43`	`*** join/#maemo swc\|666 (~x00@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821)`
`02:23.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sudden death of a semiconductor, nothing completely unheard`
`02:24.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`even the cable might be broken ;-D`
`02:25.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`does it still spin up?`
`02:26.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`the by far most 'popular' point of failure is power`
`02:28.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(on a related sidenote: my Nokia wallcharger went poof while I was out for breakfast)`
`02:29.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and >50% of 'dead' PCs I fixed had a broken PSU`
`02:29.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`another significant number probably broken regulators for CPU core power`
`02:30.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`- ok - a lot of those had dry or bursted elcos`
`02:30.57`	`*** join/#maemo maybeArgh (cl@p5B165E71.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`02:32.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`in SPSU it's usually the schottkys and/or power switch transistors`
`02:36.23`	`*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)`
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`02:54.06`	`*** join/#maemo joc (~joc@unaffiliated/joc)`
`02:54.48`	`joc`	`Hey guys just bought a used n900 and set it up on tmobile. I was seeing a enter sim unlock code prompt and no connection to the network so I'm flashing. Any other suggestions?`
`02:56.59`	`joc`	`just flashed to 1.3 global - do I need to use the usa release?`
`02:59.53`	`pupnik`	`are you in germany?`
`03:00.04`	`joc`	`I'm in the states.`
`03:00.08`	`pupnik`	`which states?`
`03:00.30`	`joc`	`washington, idaho, utah, california`
`03:02.02`	`joc`	`i'm going to try the us version`
`03:02.03`	`pupnik`	`i think you need to use the german release`
`03:02.05`	`*** join/#maemo githogori (~githogori@adsl-66-123-22-146.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net)`
`03:02.17`	`joc`	`why is that?`
`03:02.24`	`pupnik`	`cause deutsch is cool`
`03:02.30`	`pupnik`	`and you can learn a new language`
`03:02.53`	`joc`	`I'd learn German if I could get the phone to connect with tmobile.`
`03:03.14`	`joc`	`what exactly does "enter code for unlocking SIM card" mean?`
`03:03.30`	`joc`	`Seems a bit weird to me. I just bought this phone used from Amazon.`
`03:06.00`	`pupnik`	`i am not sure`
`03:06.28`	`pupnik`	`i think the phone can be locked to a carrier`
`03:06.44`	`pupnik`	`unfortunately the USA is a very bad place for cell phones`
`03:07.17`	`joc`	`I'm looking forward to maemo on other phones. =-)`
`03:07.40`	`joc`	`I'm flashing to the us release now`
`03:07.57`	`joc`	`wonders if he'll need to reflash when traveling.. ??`
`03:08.36`	`pupnik`	`sorry i don't have better answers`
`03:08.42`	`pupnik`	`i think you may need an unlock code`
`03:09.16`	`pupnik`	`perhaps you can search the forums`
`03:12.57`	`joc`	`Looks like I need a puk.`
`03:12.59`	`joc`	`:)`
`03:16.21`	`ArGGu^^`	`http://www.elisanet.fi/irggu/`
`03:16.38`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B (~csb@ipv4-95-152-205-90.static.as8844.net)`
`03:16.52`	`ArGGu^^`	`There is my IRC client website if anyone is interested`
`03:17.13`	`ArGGu^^`	`It is not yet in ovi store or maemo extra repositories`
`03:17.23`	`ArGGu^^`	`but in the website there is deb for download`
`03:22.24`	`*** join/#maemo pcacjr (~pcacjr@187.78.137.123)`
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`03:32.23`	`pupnik`	`games are just a ridiculous power drain on this thing`
`03:33.25`	`lolloo`	`I have a pc I built myself that I play games on.`
`03:40.52`	`Sazpaimon`	`does the power kernel support ipv6`
`03:41.22`	`*** join/#maemo jonwil (~jonwil@27-33-137-199.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`03:41.42`	`lolloo`	`yep`
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`05:36.07`	`ArGGu^^`	`If someone happend to download my IRC client http://www.elisanet.fi/irggu/ download again I just found bug and fixed it.`
`05:38.59`	`ArGGu^^`	`oh great just found another bug :S`
`05:44.51`	`ArGGu^^`	`and now it is fixed`
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`07:29.45`	`Termana`	`good morning`
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`09:17.02`	`Jaffa`	`Morning, all`
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`10:15.12`	`achipa`	`morning, all`
`10:16.22`	`achipa`	`MohammadAG: heya, about 4.7.2, not really, no significant maemo improvements, 4.7.4 is the one that will be interesting`
`10:16.50`	`MohammadAG`	`achipa, so should I revert commits back to 4.7.0 then compile that?`
`10:17.23`	`achipa`	`hm, if you don't have the exact tag....`
`10:17.31`	`MohammadAG`	`basically, I really need this https://qt.gitorious.org/+qt-developers/qt/x11-maemo/commit/4b7e212918fb43495c44cb7948070a43318138de`
`10:17.31`	`achipa`	`because the SSU one is not really even 4.7.0`
`10:18.23`	`MohammadAG`	`o_O`
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`10:20.38`	`achipa`	`technically it was 4.7.0 RC`
`10:20.46`	`achipa`	`IIRC`
`10:21.36`	`achipa`	`though seems not much bugs there luckily`
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`10:22.05`	`achipa`	`MohammadAG: but the bottom line is, are you compiling gitorious sources, or something from maemo.org/nokia ?`
`10:22.14`	`MohammadAG`	`achipa, gitorious`
`10:22.43`	`MohammadAG`	`I need a source with git history, not sure if Nokia's sources from the repos includes the .git dir`
`10:23.17`	`achipa`	`right`
`10:23.44`	`achipa`	`in that case I would try 4.7.2`
`10:23.58`	`achipa`	`there is a slim chance that we might see a few regressions`
`10:24.20`	`achipa`	`I remember seeing some apps actually relying on buggy behaviour but can't remember what it was for the life of me...`
`10:25.16`	`MohammadAG`	`achipa, there should be no ABI breaks right?`
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`10:25.33`	`achipa`	`emphasis on should`
`10:25.47`	`MohammadAG`	`also, I should rename qt4-experimental to qt4-maemo5 right?`
`10:25.59`	`achipa`	`in theory Qt is binary backward and forward compatible`
`10:26.06`	`achipa`	`NOOOO !!!!!`
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`10:26.26`	`achipa`	`MohammadAG: *-maemo5 qt packages should have never been named like that`
`10:27.07`	`MohammadAG`	`qt4-x11?`
`10:27.28`	`MohammadAG`	`cause that's what the default source package is called`
`10:27.42`	`achipa`	`yes, I'd stick with that`
`10:27.47`	`achipa`	`experimental in another thing again`
`10:28.15`	`achipa`	`(we won't be seeing interest in experimental until QtQuick 1.1 IMHO)`
`10:29.52`	`achipa`	`you can use the libqtm-11 packages as a base for mobility`
`10:30.25`	`achipa`	`MohammadAG: though I might have not pushed all my mods... /me adds a todo item`
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`10:31.35`	`MohammadAG`	`achipa, mobility can be upgraded outside the SSU though right?`
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`10:35.13`	`achipa`	`nope, it's a SSU package (because of Ovi, blah, blah)`
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`10:38.16`	`Theon144`	`hey, where does openssh server on fremantle keep it's logs?`
`10:40.00`	`Theon144`	`I ask because I have a problem with key authentication - I copied my dsa public key to the n900 (~/.ssh/authorized_keys) and it still says "Permission denied"`
`10:44.06`	`MohammadAG`	undefined reference to `gtk_widget_get_visible' <-- thoughts anyone?
`10:44.08`	`ShadowJK`	`it logs through syslog. Syslog goes to /dev/null. If you install syslogd package from sdk/tools repo, and reboot, logs appear in /va/log. Uninstall syslogd after youamve resolved the issue, so that logs don't fill up diskspace.`
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`10:49.59`	`Theon144`	`ShadowJK: thanks`
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`11:18.05`	`divan`	`any thoughts why N900 sometimes reboots while unpacking large archives (tar.gz > 100MB)?`
`11:18.34`	`divan`	`Even if no reboot occured device becomes really laggy. Swapplube is installed and activated, and it does help a little but not too much.`
`11:20.03`	`divan`	`The archive itself is on the vfat partition and unpacked to the same partition.`
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`11:31.19`	`MohammadAG`	`overclocked?`
`11:36.16`	`ShadowJK`	`divan, wanna try these settings? 1 > /proc/sys/vm/dirty_background_ratio, 40 > /proc/sys/vm/dirty_ratio, 3000 > dirty_expire_centisecs, 5 > page-cluster, 10 > swappiness, 100 > vfs_cache_pressure, 8192 > /sys/block/mmcblk0/queue/nr_requests, 8192 > /sys/block/mmcblk1/queue/nr_requests`
`11:36.25`	`ShadowJK`	`untested, because I don't like reboots`
`11:36.27`	`ShadowJK`	`:P`
`11:37.38`	`divan`	`ShadowJK, thanks, I'll try to play with it.`
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`12:35.19`	`ThreeM`	`is it possible to manage upnp-av devices from N900? Zhaam looks good, but misses a lot of items from my music libary`
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`13:05.59`	`divan`	`Is there any non-GUI tool to configure tracker? Except sed.`
`13:09.37`	`DocScrutinizer`	`never pondered to uninstall syslogd`
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`13:14.14`	`MohammadAG`	`divan, perl! But seriously, nope, not that I know of`
`13:14.31`	`MohammadAG`	`you can check out these`
`13:14.34`	`MohammadAG`	`tracker-files tracker-meta-folder tracker-query tracker-services tracker-status tracker-unique`
`13:14.34`	`MohammadAG`	`tracker-info tracker-processes tracker-search tracker-stats tracker-tag`
`13:14.52`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, I just echo "" > /var/log/syslog every once in a while`
`13:15.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`too`
`13:15.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nah I even just ">/var/log/syslog"`
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`13:18.21`	`divan`	`MohammadAG, the tracker-utils does other things. Ok, I think I'll do it with QSettings, the format is pretty much .ini.`
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`13:20.19`	`MohammadAG`	`divan, keep in mind, QSettings will freak out with comments, which tracker.cfg has`
`13:22.11`	`divan`	`MohammadAG, hmm thanks.`
`13:23.17`	`MohammadAG`	`divan, to see what I mean, open the file with QSettings, do QSettings::sync() or write some value, all # will be changed to some numbers (UTF-8 code?)`
`13:24.54`	`divan`	`MohammadAG, yeah, I've got it. You're right, it will rewrite the original file. Not sure I want to do this with tracker cfg. But I have to find easy and reliable way to add one dir to NoWatchDirectory (if not added already).`
`13:25.28`	`divan`	`Perhaps sed is the best choice.`
`13:26.58`	`MohammadAG`	`divan, looks at mceledpattern`
`13:27.25`	`MohammadAG`	`it edits /etc/mce/mce.ini to include new patterns, but the concept is the same`
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`13:28.08`	`divan`	`I guess that's it. sed -e '/NoWatchDirectory/s:$HOME\/MyDocs\/Games;::' -e '/NoWatchDirectory/s:$:$HOME\/MyDocs\/Games;:' /home/user/.config/tracker/tracker.cfg`
`13:28.17`	`divan`	`MohammadAG, thanks for the tips, I'll take a look.`
`13:34.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: (QSettings will freak out...) WUT? I start to learn to hate Qt more every single day`
`13:34.51`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, it doesn't expect comments`
`13:35.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I don't expect real humans in that development dept`
`13:36.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`they must have outsourced development to next zoo`
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`13:37.49`	`MohammadAG`	`xD`
`13:39.39`	`RST38h`	`Moo, folks`
`13:39.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`moo`
`13:40.01`	`RST38h`	`What? Qt Hate setting in? =)`
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`13:42.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yep`
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`13:43.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`seems every other day there's some new OMFG facepalm shit surfacing`
`13:44.15`	`RST38h`	`The important thing is to fix it though`
`13:44.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it feels like Fukushima: Nokia burrying whole maemo/meego under a sticky layer of Qt shit to neutralize it`
`13:44.36`	`RST38h`	`I think Qt people (thiago et al) are active at #meego, so you can complain there =)`
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`13:45.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'd not know where to start. having a generic filesensor object class that POLLS isn't sth you can discuss about. There's just one thing you can do: fire the whole dev team and move the source to dev(null`
`13:47.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's clearly more effort to proofread the whole mess and correct it, than to start new from scratch with a team that has a clue`
`13:49.11`	`divan`	`what's default file ownership for /home/user/.config/tracker/tracker.cfg ? I rewrited it under root, can someone check?`
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`13:49.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`system architecture and linrary development is like hw EE: it MUST be correct prior to mass production/deployment, otherwise you have to live with shit for ever. That's clearly a point where app devels regularly fail each and every time`
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`13:50.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`-rw-r--r-- 1 user users 2867 Mar 30 2010 tracker.cfg`
`13:50.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`<PROTECTED>`
`13:51.33`	`divan`	`SpeedEvil, thanks!`
`13:51.56`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Talk to thiago, in as politically correct terms as possible`
`13:52.15`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Pick a few typical mistakes, and provide examples of why these APIs will not work`
`13:52.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`divan: I hope you're not planning to publish something that's going to delete all comments from that config, just to make it work with some BS in Qt?!`
`13:52.51`	`RST38h`	`Point it out to him that once this crap solidifies, it will stay solid, making developers look elsewhere (direct DBus calls, etc)`
`13:53.13`	`divan`	`DocScrutinizer, no, don't worry. :)`
`13:53.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: you're right, but I'm extremely poor at those tasks`
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`14:00.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: btw each time I tried to raise the topic (or a similar class of topic) at #meego, the answer of the self-nominating gods of meego had been "wait until V1.0 rolls out (some months), then you're free to provide patches"`
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`14:01.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: ...so not even getting next to the elementary problem that is "you CAN NOT patch a fubar system architecture, you CAN NOT patch a fuckedup library API"`
`14:04.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's why I started to hate meego, and that's where I start to hate Qt even more since a few days, as it intrudes and spoils our relatively nice maemo biotop`
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`14:07.34`	`GAN900`	`It does everything in its power to discourage people who disagree with things from participating.`
`14:07.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`""sorry acme-coder, your app is really really nice, with a good concept, well designed UI, and all. But alas you used QtMobility and that renders your whole app useless. Thanks for your effort improving maemo user experience so far, we have to ask you to do nasty shit now to work around all the glitches in the Qt et al toolset""`
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`14:10.26`	`Corsac`	`looks like it really was a good idea to switch to rpm and qt ;p`
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`14:15.31`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, actually, Qt is nice, Qt Mobility, not so sure about that`
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`14:21.49`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: original trolltech team been extremely gifted talented young guys with a clue about how to implement a complex set of objects in a consistent manner. Seems things have changed a lot, probably since Trolltech became Nokia`
`14:22.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`also QtMob is way more low level and hw depending, spoiling the abstract world of Qt devels`
`14:23.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`s/spoiling/tainting/.`
`14:24.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`at least that's my take on it`
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`14:25.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or in short terms: kernel and hw aren't object oriented`
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`14:28.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`for the polling_the_proxswitch (filesensor) issue: they could have integrated kevents netlink socket concept into their signal&slot thing. But only if they whould understand about it, at least ever heard about it, were aware about nasty aspects of polling...`
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`14:34.17`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Well, even when talking to these people correctly, the chance of getting things changed is still close to nil`
`14:34.25`	`RST38h`	`Doc: BUT, nothing prevents us from trying`
`14:34.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yes`
`14:34.35`	`RST38h`	`Meanwhile: http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/02/qualcomms-1-5ghz-dual-core-msm8660-destroys-the-competition-in/`
`14:34.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`meh`
`14:35.11`	`RST38h`	`(notice that it is not Quallcomm against TI, but Quallcomm's 3D chip against PVR)`
`14:35.43`	`RST38h`	`Doc: What I kinda dislike about Qt people is the high-nosed approach to comments`
`14:35.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'm done with trying, as I explained above. "wait, then provide patches" isn't any option for me. Not even a basis to start a discussion (probably stated exactly to achive this - stop any discussion)`
`14:36.34`	`RST38h`	`Doc: They easily fall into good-object-oriented-design discussion and start rolling around there, on their own mainly`
`14:36.52`	`RST38h`	`Maybe just needs to be better explained`
`14:37.20`	`RST38h`	`This is not something fixable with a patch. It is an architectural issue.`
`14:37.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`my point`
`14:38.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I tried in vain to discuss this when it came to sensorfw and how to deal with exactly this polling_vs_IRQ-driven issues and decisions. Answer: "wait, then provide patches"`
`14:40.23`	`RST38h`	`Let us catch thiago next week`
`14:40.30`	`RST38h`	`Or someone else from the team`
`14:40.41`	`Macer`	`haha`
`14:40.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`the most disclosing statement been "we need to start somewhere and we need to roll out some stuff _quickly_. We can not afford to discuss system architecture right now" (OWTTE)`
`14:41.17`	`RST38h`	`I think it is possible to persuade him that they need to AT LEAST discuss it a bit, until it is too late`
`14:41.21`	`Macer`	`sounds about right`
`14:41.28`	`RST38h`	`The direction of discussion may not be what you are expecting though`
`14:41.30`	`pupnik`	`sometimes it's hard to make people understand the problem`
`14:41.52`	`RST38h`	`BTW, the sensors poll stuff is going on since Maemo5 APIs`
`14:42.22`	`Macer`	`pupnik: honestly. that exact reason is why open src fails on closed devices`
`14:42.31`	`Macer`	`you can't get fired`
`14:42.35`	`RST38h`	`At that time, I got a response from Nokia guys that these low level APIs are done by platform (?) people who say this is the only way they can expose them`
`14:42.38`	`Macer`	`:)`
`14:43.10`	`pupnik`	`on the other hand, maybe you don't understand their constraints.`
`14:43.19`	`RST38h`	`Basically, to do all that signals stuff, you either have to poll at the platform level, OR have some way to set up interrupts`
`14:43.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: MUHAHA. Ok they might have been right sometime around <2006`
`14:43.50`	`RST38h`	`I suspect that they are either unable or unwilling to set up interrupt handlers for all this stuff`
`14:44.29`	`RST38h`	`platform-level polling will obviously kill your battery`
`14:44.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, seems at least lis302 driver DOES set up a correct standard sysfs with kevent`
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`14:47.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but this one (written by Nokia) isn't good enough for meego, as is the (slightly better I heard) lis302 driver from OM. Instead they use a "upstream" (WTF?!) lis3lv02 or similar driver in meego, which is clearly designed to service a wired joystick and has no idea about proper exploiting IRQ capabilities of lis302/N900`
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`14:48.17`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Won't Stskeeps be the person to address this?`
`14:48.35`	`RST38h`	`And the Nokia guys who have not pushed their driver upstream?`
`14:48.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`been there, done that... through with it`
`14:48.54`	`RST38h`	`ok`
`14:49.51`	`Macer`	`heh`
`14:49.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's not about this one driver. It's about a mindset aware of the design principle basics. See filesensor in Qt, exact duplicate of the sensorfw/lis302 driver thing`
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`14:50.03`	`Macer`	`there is always option b... make your own phone`
`14:50.10`	`Macer`	`:)`
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`14:50.41`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Well, they did not think about it too much =)`
`14:50.57`	`RST38h`	`Macer: He already has, it did not work =)`
`14:51.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`whole meego folks are designing like a handheld is a small desktop with unlimited CPU grunt and battery capacity from a mains cable`
`14:51.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: exactly`
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`14:51.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and they don't like to get called out on it now. "We'll deal with that later"`
`14:52.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`app coder attitude`
`14:52.33`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Weeeelll... You know, it is primarily designed for Atom-based SoCs...`
`14:52.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`they haven't got the idea you CAN NOT patch system architecture`
`14:52.48`	`RST38h`	`They have.`
`14:52.54`	`RST38h`	`You just have not explained well enough.`
`14:54.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`they haven't! when I asked where to find a whitepaper about design principles and guidelines like "Do NOT poll (and how this affects things like sensorfw)" they didn't even answer`
`14:55.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(whitepaper related to meego foundation, not a generic one)`
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`14:56.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Macer: RST38h (it didn't work) of course it did, and still does. It just doesn't sell`
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`14:57.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Macer: and NB the N900 hw is excellent`
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`15:00.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Macer: there are guys that build "our own phone" software. see FSO, SHR, #openmoko-cdevel et al`
`15:00.54`	`RST38h`	`starts giggling`
`15:02.25`	`Macer`	`:)`
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`15:03.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: compare SHR-N900 with meego-handheld-ux/arm, then you'll stop giggling. At least when you consider those are like 8..15guys working on porting SHR to like 5 different platforms, while meego-arm team is what? several dozen? even paid by companies?`
`15:05.01`	`ruskie`	`any link for SHR-N900? and will it actually be usable?`
`15:05.53`	`RST38h`	`Never.`
`15:06.01`	`RST38h`	`Neither will Meego-N900 though, I guess`
`15:06.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but that's probably the big advantage of SHR/FSO team. they are few, and even so I'm not an active participating devel they listen when I rise a topic, and decisions are made based on common sense`
`15:06.21`	`ruskie`	`I thought the whole point of the nokia developer edition effort is to get a usable meego on the n900`
`15:08.26`	`Macer`	`RST38h: hahahaha`
`15:09.13`	`Macer`	`ruskie is one of the crazies`
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`15:09.51`	`Macer`	`once ms got their claws into nokia you can kiss anything nokia makes that was good... goodbye`
`15:11.19`	`Macer`	`although there hasnt been many things good that came out of nokia since the early 2000s`
`15:12.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ruskie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywkWbb_BetI&feature=related SHR running on N900. State as of 6 months ago`
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`15:13.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`NB I'm not stating it had a better UI or whatever. Just saying there are projects that perform better than meego, on a conceptual level`
`15:15.05`	`ruskie`	`plenty of those around`
`15:15.28`	`khorben_`	`and soon hackable:1 too`
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`15:19.53`	`ruskie`	`hmm shr looks interesting UX wise`
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`15:29.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ruskie: enlightenment & illume based (whatever that means :-D )`
`15:30.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`basically a lot of that stuff is from rasterman`
`15:30.55`	`ruskie`	`always good`
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`15:43.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ruskie: the major difference probably is: it's targeted at bringing true linux to handheld users. Not - like maemo and even more meego - bring handheld to windoze lusers while exploiting the benefits of a free-as-in-beer OS`
`15:43.54`	`RST38h`	`Sony CEO May Have Inadvertently Revealed iPhone 5's 8MP Camera`
`15:44.25`	`tank-man`	`why is sony making press releases about apple products?`
`15:44.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`<yawn>`
`15:45.19`	`RST38h`	`tank: ran out of their own`
`15:45.21`	`MohammadAG`	`8MP?`
`15:45.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`8mp in a slim phone. Can't pan out, as we discussed just yesterday here`
`15:45.37`	`RST38h`	`I think they supply the camera units`
`15:45.49`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Enter Nokia E7`
`15:46.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`eh?`
`15:46.04`	`RST38h`	`Doc: With a fixed focus camera that can't read barcodes =)`
`15:46.42`	`RST38h`	`does not use phone cameras that much, but has to admit that E7's unit is bad even by his very low standards`
`15:47.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`the ever-higher-numbers hype is such a brainfart thing, for CPU clock freq as much as for camera mp`
`15:47.21`	`RST38h`	`The photo/video editing software Nokia ships on these Symbian^3 phones is pretty damn nice though`
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`15:47.43`	`RST38h`	`Doc: also see screen resolutions.`
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`15:50.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`for CPU you want higher MFLOPS etc, not higher clock. For camera you want larger sensor area for beter pictures, not 57mp with a plastic lens size of a pinhead, and a sensor area of 6mm^2`
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`15:54.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wonder why the N900 front cam is so damn poor quality? even with a mere 640*480? Simply because it's so damn small, it has to be so small to fit into the screen housing. This causes small sensor area, which in turn yields poor sesitivity (you need much light), and still gives lots of noise. You easily could build such a small cam with like 10mp, but it's utterly useless, even making things worse, as area per pixel gets much lower`
`15:57.12`	`ruskie`	`I really wish they were to limit MPs to 8 and just increase the dynamic range`
`15:58.30`	`MohammadAG`	`I still don't get how the iPhone 4 gets quite good pics`
`15:58.43`	`MohammadAG`	`and I don't get why the f it has two mics`
`15:58.51`	`ruskie`	`stereo recording`
`16:00.25`	`MohammadAG`	`nope`
`16:00.35`	`MohammadAG`	`at least I don't think it does`
`16:00.45`	`MohammadAG`	`since one mic was broken, but audio recording went fine`
`16:01.50`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: (2 mics) ambient noise cancellation`
`16:02.13`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: They are not good pics`
`16:02.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: (good pics) they use extremely long shutter times, and combine the partial pictures taken to compose something not too shakey - that's my take on it`
`16:02.55`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: What iPhone does is a bit of cheating. It "colors" its pics into vidid colors and does some more clever preprocessing`
`16:03.11`	`ruskie`	`so basically like everyone else`
`16:03.12`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: This way, they become optimized for viewing on small screens or publishing on websites`
`16:03.39`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: But try printing one like you do with a normal digital photo, and you will see that it is not`
`16:03.47`	`RST38h`	`Or at least try zooming at it =)`
`16:04.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah, where's those 5mp then? :-P`
`16:04.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`BS`
`16:04.25`	`RST38h`	`There was a nice comparison with someone making a picture of some London street with iPhone and aNokia`
`16:04.52`	`RST38h`	`iPhone picture was brighter, had brighter colors with the warm yellowish tint`
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`16:04.56`	`MohammadAG`	`heh`
`16:05.05`	`RST38h`	`Nokia picture was gray and sad looking`
`16:05.10`	`MohammadAG`	`HDR doesn't work on the iPhone 4`
`16:05.35`	`RST38h`	`So they argued for ever and ever until some Londoner said "whaddayawant? it is really that sad and grey here!"`
`16:05.36`	`MohammadAG`	`take a photo of someone with the sun in the background, they'll be "black"`
`16:05.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: LOL -point set and match`
`16:06.14`	`Corsac`	`+game`
`16:07.17`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: also see this nice artefact: http://zeitgeistinapetiole.wordpress.com/2009/01/17/propeller-photo-taken-with-iphone/`
`16:07.38`	`RST38h`	`(comes from Apple saving money on that camera)`
`16:08.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`exactly what I meant by "they combine partial pictures"`
`16:09.37`	`DocScrutinizer`	`really funny that one`
`16:10.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's what happens when higly evolved postprocessing fails on the assumtions taken about what the cam looked at`
`16:10.23`	`mtnbkr`	`hey everyone... Just got my N900 back from repair (USB/charger connector broke loose) During the time just before I shipped it, the intermittent connectivity cause the flash and my 8GB microsd card to become corrupted. I fixed the flash by flashing N900 back to defaults and restoring from a backup, but the microsd is corrupted. How can I partition microsd (I have no external microSD reader)`
`16:11.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`umm`
`16:11.19`	`mtnbkr`	`fdisk is not present on device, but sfdisk is`
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`16:11.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`fdisk also doesn't really help here`
`16:12.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`neither soes sfdisk`
`16:12.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you need to mkfs, to format the disk/card`
`16:12.24`	`mtnbkr`	`right... Is it possible the microsd is damaged beyond repair?`
`16:12.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`possible`
`16:12.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but maybe unlikely`
`16:13.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`most simple way afaik is to erase the first few blocks, then reinsert it and you'll get the option to "format card" in filemanager`
`16:13.37`	`mtnbkr`	`hmmm, I was going to mkfs.vfat the whole card, but thought it neede to have 1 vfat partition, and not the whole 'device' be vfat.`
`16:13.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you might try if this option is already there right now`
`16:13.46`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: hmmm... ok`
`16:14.11`	`mtnbkr`	`yeah, when I insert the card, I get a yellow banner something like "memory card corrupted"`
`16:14.20`	`mtnbkr`	`so I have nothing to lose`
`16:14.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`open filemanager, see what context menu shows`
`16:16.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: yes, you usually want one partition rather than superfloppy format`
`16:16.18`	`mtnbkr`	`Memory card/ "Memory card format unsupported"`
`16:18.37`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: as long as the card shows up in filemanager, you should probably see "format" in context menu of the card (click&hold)`
`16:19.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it starts to get tricky if the card doesn't show up at all`
`16:19.09`	`mtnbkr`	`AHHH! I never saw nor thought of that... trying now... Thanks`
`16:19.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yw`
`16:21.37`	`mtnbkr`	`Hmmm... a yellow banner flashed "formatting memory" but it goes away quickly... should there be any other indication, like a % complete status?`
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`16:22.56`	`MohammadAG`	`formatting shouldn't take time`
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`16:23.25`	`MohammadAG`	`another closed source component down the drain, https://gitorious.org/community-ssu/maemo-statusmenu-fmtx`
`16:23.42`	`*** join/#maemo jimmy1980 (~jimmy@112.224.3.41)`
`16:23.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`\o/`
`16:24.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`is that a .so plugin?`
`16:24.28`	`mtnbkr`	`arg... it still shows up as "Memory card format unsupported" when I try go into it using filemanager`
`16:24.29`	`*** join/#maemo s1gk1ll (~sigkill@a89-155-177-225.cpe.netcabo.pt)`
`16:24.34`	`MohammadAG`	`yeah`
`16:25.04`	`*** join/#maemo aloisiojr (~aloisio@187.113.126.201)`
`16:25.06`	`MohammadAG`	`qwerty12 rewrote it last year, I added some configuration options and got rid of my old system()-filled edits`
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`16:25.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: remount it (i.e. open and close battery cover)`
`16:25.28`	`MohammadAG`	`also, check dmesg`
`16:25.39`	`mtnbkr`	`well, in a shell, dmesg shows I/O errors when I attempt the format from the filemanager`
`16:25.56`	`MohammadAG`	`maybe the card's dead?`
`16:26.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yup`
`16:26.15`	`mtnbkr`	`I think so.`
`16:26.26`	`mtnbkr`	`it is very new actually.`
`16:26.31`	`mtnbkr`	`dang.`
`16:26.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`last resort: dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/mmcblk1 bs=1M count=<size-of-card-in-MB>`
`16:27.13`	`*** join/#maemo steve___ (~steve___@unaffiliated/steve/x-19302814903)`
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`16:27.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`please doublecheck that command, it comes without any warranty, neither explicit nor implied :-)`
`16:27.28`	`steve___`	`What is the name of the phone app in maemo?`
`16:27.36`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: hah I did that (almost) already... didn't do the whole card though... what've I got to lose... here goes. :)`
`16:27.53`	`MohammadAG`	`heh, I have a 4 year old 16GB microSD that's working fine, a 3 month old 4GB one died on me`
`16:28.00`	`MohammadAG`	`rtcom-call-ui`
`16:28.01`	`mtnbkr`	`no, that looks OK`
`16:29.53`	`*** join/#maemo IR1095 (~ircap8@154.Red-79-148-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net)`
`16:29.57`	`IR1095`	`olaa`
`16:30.00`	`IR1095`	`hellow`
`16:30.22`	`steve___`	`MohammadAG: Is there any way to increase the speaker volume? I can barely hear people if I'm not using a BT headset.`
`16:30.25`	`IR1095`	`there is a beautiful guy heree`
`16:30.29`	`IR1095`	`i need a guy`
`16:30.31`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@a88-115-28-127.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`16:30.31`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@redhat/pcfe)`
`16:30.33`	`IR1095`	`hot guay`
`16:30.34`	`*** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ`
`16:30.39`	`MohammadAG`	`no that I know of`
`16:30.40`	`*** mode/#maemo [+b IR1095!@] by DocScrutinizer`
`16:30.41`	`*** kick/#maemo [IR1095!~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg] by DocScrutinizer (WTF?!)`
`16:30.51`	`*** mode/#maemo [-o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ`
`16:31.00`	`MohammadAG`	`damn that was fast DocScrutinizer`
`16:31.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hah`
`16:31.23`	`steve___`	`Must have hit a nerve ;)`
`16:31.28`	`MohammadAG`	`but it needs a guy`
`16:31.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'm a better bot than that lousy spam script`
`16:31.44`	`steve___`	`ha`
`16:32.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`actually:`
`16:32.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[2011-04-02 18:30:00] <IR1095> hellow`
`16:32.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[2011-04-02 18:30:07] [Whois] IR1095 ist ~ircap8@154.Red-79-148-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net (IRcap[8.2] Â www.ircap.com)`
`16:32.40`	`steve___`	`Does anyone else find it difficult to hear ppl? Now that more and more ppl are starting to use voip I'm finding it a bit of a problem.`
`16:34.06`	`MohammadAG`	`I find it weird how if I move the device up/down 1cm volume is greatly decreased`
`16:34.25`	`MohammadAG`	`anyway, I'm usually using a headset while calling`
`16:34.56`	`*** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ`
`16:35.47`	`*** mode/#maemo [+b !@154.Red-79-148-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] by DocScrutinizer`
`16:36.26`	`*** mode/#maemo [-o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ`
`16:41.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`steve___: try amixer`
`16:42.10`	`MohammadAG`	`75 files to upload in the next CSSU update :S`
`16:42.22`	`MohammadAG`	`= 48 new packages`
`16:42.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`err alsamixer -c0`
`16:43.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`o/`
`16:43.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`bbl`
`16:46.01`	`steve___`	`DocScrutinizer: PCM is 100`
`16:46.45`	`steve___`	`I'll fiddle with the other levels.`
`16:47.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`do during call. Don't miss on resetting each one to original level when it isn't the right one`
`16:48.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you might want to use amixer (sic!) to get a dump of current state, prior to fiddling with alsamixer`
`16:48.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`l8r`
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`17:12.15`	`GAN900`	`Why did Google have to go and make search so bloated and useless.`
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`17:12.46`	`derf`	`The better to show you ads with.`
`17:13.41`	`SpeedEvil`	`you can turn most of theshit off.`
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`17:15.26`	`GAN900`	`SpeedEvil, how?`
`17:17.51`	`steve___`	`DocScrutinizer: No change.`
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`17:20.19`	`SpeedEvil`	`GAN900: If you mean the instant search results.`
`17:22.06`	`SpeedEvil`	`GAN900: Setup a google account, login, then set 'search settings'`
`17:22.24`	`SpeedEvil`	`you can turn off instnat search`
`17:24.19`	`*** join/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@bch66-2-88-164-78-176.fbx.proxad.net)`
`17:24.19`	`*** join/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@Maemo/community/contributor/crashanddie)`
`17:24.34`	`ruskie`	`GAN900, or just use scroogle`
`17:24.49`	`GAN900`	`ruskie, good plan.`
`17:24.59`	`GAN900`	`I hate that they insist on hijacking a bunch of keys`
`17:25.13`	`GAN900`	`up/down arrow should go to the start and end of the line on a Mac.`
`17:25.28`	`GAN900`	`Not scroll through your inane suggested completions.`
`17:28.14`	`kerio`	`GAN900++`
`17:28.39`	`kerio`	`otoh, cmd+k or cmd+f-tab give you a perfectly standard search box`
`17:28.50`	`kerio`	`(not sure if safari has a particular hotkey)`
`17:29.17`	`GAN900`	`JavaScript is too much an aberation`
`17:29.36`	`GAN900`	`Tired of sites monkeying with my browser.`
`17:29.49`	`GAN900`	`It's too bad Firefox on OS X is so uselessly terrible.`
`17:33.06`	`*** join/#maemo The_Fellow1 (~spider1@glida.mooo.com)`
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`17:35.18`	`luke-jr\|otg`	`GAN900, s/Firefox on //`
`17:36.04`	`GAN900`	`luke-jr, dunno, it works fairly well on Windows.`
`17:38.02`	`Corsac`	`s/on OS X//`
`17:39.27`	`kerio`	`Â¿que?`
`17:39.31`	`kerio`	`firefox works perfectly fine here`
`17:39.39`	`kerio`	`and if you really want, there's always camino`
`17:39.42`	`kerio`	`which is cute ^_^`
`17:40.24`	`GAN900`	`Camino's dead, now.`
`17:40.35`	`GAN900`	`Gecko's embedded support is ending`
`17:40.49`	`GAN900`	`Besides, sort of defeats the advantage without the plugins.`
`17:40.58`	`kerio`	`:(`
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`17:45.17`	`MohammadAG`	`mv Corsac /dev/null`
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`18:01.05`	`MohammadAG`	`Firefox is epic`
`18:05.10`	`*** join/#maemo pranq (20253@ninthfloor.org)`
`18:08.34`	`jacekowski`	`as in epic slow`
`18:08.53`	`jacekowski`	`tbh. new firefox is just opera clone`
`18:10.34`	`GAN900`	`Just installed 4 this morning.`
`18:10.42`	`GAN900`	`We'll see if I hate it any less.`
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`18:22.47`	`MohammadAG`	`jacekowski, I see it more of a chromium clone`
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`19:43.05`	`derf`	`The better to show you ads with.`
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`20:09.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`jacekowski: (as in epic slow) Just because I've been in a pub and reading this on xchat-n900 it wasn't first to answer exactly that :-D`
`20:10.36`	`jacekowski`	`DocScrutinizer: ?`
`20:10.51`	`jacekowski`	`DocScrutinizer: are you talking about my firefox looking like opera comment?`
`20:10.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[2011-04-02 20:01:05] <MohammadAG> Firefox is epic`
`20:11.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[2011-04-02 20:08:34] <jacekowski> as in epic slow`
`20:11.40`	`MohammadAG`	`actually, it's quite fast`
`20:12.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`not here, not on a 1.8GHz dual-core :-P`
`20:12.20`	`MohammadAG`	`2.4GHz quad core :P`
`20:12.36`	`MohammadAG`	`with some weird Intel turboboost to 2.93GHz stuff`
`20:12.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so show my sth that's NOT fast on this CPU`
`20:13.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`prolly you'll find few apps to be slow, except a 2 FF running concurrently`
`20:13.34`	`Jade`	`i used firefox 3 on a 350mhz pentium 2 with 64mb of ram`
`20:13.35`	`Jade`	`on freebsd`
`20:13.36`	`Jade`	`it was fast`
`20:14.53`	`*** join/#maemo shanttu (~shanttu@cs78181065.pp.htv.fi)`
`20:15.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, to give some flesh to the bones: i'll start FF now`
`20:15.31`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and now it opens`
`20:15.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`about:blank`
`20:16.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no content to render`
`20:16.57`	`MohammadAG`	`I'll do the same`
`20:17.01`	`MohammadAG`	`time, from ... now`
`20:17.07`	`MohammadAG`	`opened`
`20:17.24`	`MohammadAG`	`since I'm lagging like shit on Freenode, that took 4 seconds`
`20:17.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, like 20 here`
`20:17.45`	`*** join/#maemo frade (~ivan@a88-114-94-13.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`20:18.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's one of the reasons I still prefer and usually use Konqueror`
`20:19.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`even though it sometimes fails on over-nifty ecmascript shit`
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`20:19.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and also sometimes reders differently to FF`
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`20:24.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`develpers testing their crap on top notch hw should get outlawed. They should get forced to use their own elaborate on a ... well, let's say 300MHz Pentium-II with 256MB, and in case of web-coders on a internet connection via ISDN (64kBd)`
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`20:26.14`	`cehteh`	`hehe`
`20:26.50`	`cehteh`	`generally agrees .. while the hw is a bit negitiateable :)`
`20:27.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~dict negitiateable`
`20:27.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`aah`
`20:27.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~spell negitiateable`
`20:27.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sorry, tired`
`20:29.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`got distracted by 'negligible'`
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`20:31.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`cehteh: sure. I wouldn't require youtube to make their videos run on a 300MHz w/o hw-accel for video, via ISDN. -- At least not without a reasonable preprocessing lag for filling buffers and decoding to a less compue-demanding format`
`20:33.20`	`SpeedEvil`	`Umm.`
`20:33.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but it's a shame the friggin flash10 plugin yields sth like 2..3fps on my 1.8GHz Pentium dualcore, just because there's no proper hw-accel for gfx`
`20:33.36`	`SpeedEvil`	`was playing youtube videos just fine on a PII/300 not _that_ long ago.`
`20:34.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: depends. the flash10 has a nice "info" about video format etc, and it seems 320*200 plays just fine here, while more demanding formats blow junks or just get jerky`
`20:36.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`NB some AVI (mpg2?) videos play 'just fine' here, when playback via kafeine et al`
`20:36.35`	`RST38h`	`sacrifices a hamster to the Tentacled One`
`20:36.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`even full screen, and those are not 320*200`
`20:36.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: thanks`
`20:37.25`	`ShadowJK`	`240p videos are decodable on 300MHz P2 I'd think`
`20:37.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: seems I played youtube on a PII/300 fine when it's been flash8/9`
`20:38.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`flash10 seems way worse`
`20:38.18`	`RST38h`	`Doc: I do suspect there is something else wrong with your PC, other than CPU specs`
`20:38.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sis gfx`
`20:38.36`	`RST38h`	`Doc: No idea what it is, but flash10 should not behave this way`
`20:38.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no hw accel`
`20:38.56`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Well, gfx probably does not affect flv decompression`
`20:39.06`	`RST38h`	`Hey, I do not have hw accel either and they all play`
`20:39.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nfc`
`20:39.51`	`RST38h`	`Having said that, SiS graphics hw is freaking shit, get rid of it, buy a normal laptop =)`
`20:40.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`send money!`
`20:40.19`	`RST38h`	`sacrifices another hamster`
`20:40.57`	`RST38h`	`Doc: I have an Asus Digimatrix (P4@2GHz with SiS gfx and other crap thrown in). It has no problems with flash10`
`20:41.14`	`ShadowJK`	`I'm not sure, but I think flash tries to use 3D GPU for hw scaling instead of Xv. Partially because of the way flash is designed, it adds whatever crap the author of the flash player (as in .swf) in RGB colourspace, so for flash to use Xvideo, it would have to do 2 colourspace transforms in software, which is something like doubling the CPU required for decoding`
`20:41.21`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Also plays 720p Xvids, but chokes on the .mkv crap`
`20:41.53`	`ShadowJK`	`So it probably stumbles on the Sis gpu not being able to handle that heavy (ab)use of 3D :-)`
`20:41.57`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: Color space transforms are kinda cheap compared to decoding though`
`20:42.03`	`ShadowJK`	`RST38h, not really`
`20:42.15`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: I do them all the time, unless it is something convoluted, they are about the same as a buffer copy`
`20:42.26`	`ShadowJK`	`Yeah, that's the problem.`
`20:42.53`	`RST38h`	`When calling Sis thing "GPU", always use quotes =)`
`20:43.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heh, this is probably UMA`
`20:43.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`D-:`
`20:43.35`	`ShadowJK`	`IIRC when MPlayer eliminated one extra memcpy() in the video decode path, CPU requirements for DVD went from P3-500 to P3-300 or something like that`
`20:44.22`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: Dunno, sounds unlikely`
`20:44.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah, sounds like an accurate analysis of flash10 on cheap SiS gfx hw`
`20:44.41`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: I have found that buffer copies do indeed suck, but not as much as other pipeline parts`
`20:45.10`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: Scaling, especially generalized one, sucks big time. Color merging and alpha-channeling in software also suck`
`20:45.29`	`ShadowJK`	`RST38h, basically as a 16x16 chunk was decoded, it was output directly to graphics card's YV12 memoryspace from CPU cache`
`20:45.52`	`RST38h`	`2xSAI sucks like crazy, and it is difficult to optimize unless you have special hw buffers for storing previous/next scanlines.`
`20:45.58`	`ShadowJK`	`And also copied to a buffer for use as reference to decode next frame`
`20:46.36`	`ShadowJK`	`Generic colourspace transforms back and forth blow away caches and push bandwidth requirements up`
`20:46.38`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: sounds harmless`
`20:46.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: you had some fun time at #qt-mobility ?`
`20:47.01`	`RST38h`	`Weeelll, as you are already processing the whole frame, you can kiss your cache good bye :)`
`20:47.12`	`ShadowJK`	`My Sempron3100 with Sis graphics was so memory starved, that using an optimized memcpy() made Sis framebuffer drop pixels :-)`
`20:47.16`	`RST38h`	`Doc: Nah, it is weekend, and I do not think we will get anything useful there`
`20:47.30`	`RST38h`	`Doc: But, if you feel like trolling 'em, why not... =)`
`20:47.55`	`RST38h`	`Really need to find someone responsible for Qt overall arch and pitch your point of view to him`
`20:47.58`	`*** join/#maemo loft (~Thumper@tuxhacker/loft306)`
`20:47.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it might be surprising, but actually I don't take fun in trolling`
`20:48.13`	`RST38h`	`Doc: But, sooner or later, you will!`
`20:49.16`	`RST38h`	`Authorities have captured a 74-foot camouflaged submarine nearly twice as long as a city bus with twin propellers and a 5-foot conning tower that, with a crew of four to six, has a maximum operational range of 6,800 nautical miles on the surface, can go 10 days without refueling and was probably designed to ferry cocaine underwater to Mexico.`
`20:49.37`	`GAN900`	`DocScrutinizer, liar! :P`
`20:51.17`	`ShadowJK`	`Alright, benchmark of decoding a 61 second XVID clip on my C2Q 9550, to YV12: 0.386s .. Decoding+transform to RGB32: 0.790s`
`20:51.41`	`ShadowJK`	`(no video output, just decoding)`
`20:53.23`	`em`	`hello friends`
`20:53.26`	`RST38h`	`Hmm, FUkushima continues delivering.`
`20:53.32`	`ShadowJK`	`This is a bit silly test on C2Q, because the monstrous CPU cache fits over 40 frames :-)`
`20:53.33`	`em`	`what is the state of maemo as of right now?`
`20:53.44`	`ShadowJK`	`em, what do you mean`
`20:53.47`	`RST38h`	`em:dead.`
`20:53.58`	`em`	`i hear bad rumors in other channels. Im hoping that they aren't true.`
`20:53.59`	`ShadowJK`	`Yeah that's a pretty good summary :-)`
`20:54.17`	`em`	`nooooooooooo :(`
`20:54.20`	`ShadowJK`	`Well, Nokia hasn't worked on Maemo for like a year or so`
`20:54.29`	`RST38h`	`Unless you count Harmattan`
`20:54.33`	`em`	`maemo is a good thing made by talented good people why are you letting it die?!`
`20:54.35`	`ShadowJK`	`no wait, last update was in October wasn't it`
`20:55.13`	`ShadowJK`	`em, MeeGo came. And then w7m came.`
`20:55.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`burp`
`20:56.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`time for 12648430 â`
`20:56.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`em: zombies are immortal`
`20:56.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`em:`
`20:56.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~cssu`
`20:56.56`	`infobot`	`it has been said that cssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU`
`20:58.20`	`ShadowJK`	`fail: GSM dit-dit-dat-dit can be heard on N900 movie recording`
`20:59.31`	`*** join/#maemo muelli (~muelli@port-17371.pppoe.wtnet.de)`
`21:00.00`	`RST38h`	`ShadowJK: Well, no wonder`
`21:00.13`	`RST38h`	`Even heard on a TV standing in 3m from the phone`
`21:03.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: movie recording? like camera taking video?`
`21:04.09`	`BCMM`	`i hadn't realised how many people recognised that noise until i noticed they have a fake on in GTA IV`
`21:04.10`	`ShadowJK`	`yeah`
`21:04.29`	`BCMM`	`(on car radios right before the player character's phone rings)`
`21:06.04`	`em`	`i dont know what you mean by zombies are immortal DocScrutinizer`
`21:06.17`	`*** join/#maemo Kilroo (~Kilroo@cpe-174-111-058-051.triad.res.rr.com)`
`21:07.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`em: you asked "what about state of maemo", several answers were: "dead", my answer... see above`
`21:07.24`	`em`	`nhmmmmmmmmmmmmmm`
`21:09.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`if you prefer the more optimistic phrasing: it can't get worse, so the future is bright`
`21:12.23`	`*** join/#maemo rcg (~rc@g230048029.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`21:12.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`only thing I'm afraid of is zombie fighter Nokia with his sharp weapons meego/harmattan and qt-mobility`
`21:13.24`	`*** join/#maemo FIQ\|n900 (~FIQ@unaffiliated/fiq)`
`21:23.08`	`FIQ\|n900`	`Where is the bugtracker(s) for Maemo 5?`
`21:23.15`	`*** join/#maemo jevin (~jevin@jevinskie-1-pt.tunnel.tserv9.chi1.ipv6.he.net)`
`21:23.49`	`FIQ\|n900`	`i.e. the operating system, not software from Extras or something like that`
`21:24.14`	`FIQ\|n900`	`~bugtracker`
`21:24.15`	`infobot`	`extra, extra, read all about it, asterisk bugs is at the asterisk bug tracking system is at http://bugs.digium.com . If you have a bug you may submit it there. READ http://www.digium.com/bugtracker.html BEFORE you submit a bug! Also see http://snipurl.com/3n9v`
`21:24.15`	`MohammadAG`	`bugs.maemo.org`
`21:24.25`	`FIQ\|n900`	`ah, ty`
`21:24.26`	`*** join/#maemo trbs (~trbs@2001:470:d2ad:1:4a5b:39ff:fe7d:1623)`
`21:26.10`	`MohammadAG`	`DBus hijacked, stock player widget opens my mediaplayer now :)`
`21:26.53`	`*** join/#maemo Tsuyo (~Tsuyo@dslb-084-061-122-146.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`21:32.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`NB infobot got no chan specific factoids enabled for #maemo`
`21:33.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~chaninfo`
`21:33.26`	`infobot`	`I'm on 110 channels: #debian/1111, #meego/446, #maemo/391, #gsoc/370, #kde/362, #asterisk/204, #wowace/172, #wowuidev/167, #oe/166, #wowhead/159, #openmoko/118, #htc-linux/114, #webos-internals/109, #openmoko-cdevel/82, #sc2mapster/69, #utah/62, #curseforge/61, #bzflag/58, #uclibc/57, #edev/54, #tomcat/52, #asterisk-dev/45, #slug/42, #gllug/34, #elinux/34, #norganna/33, #brlcad/29, #/28, #uphpu/27, #utos/25, ##kierra/24, #storm/23, #asterisk-bugs/22, ...`
`21:33.26`	`infobot`	`i've cached 5215 users, 3855 unique users, distributed over 110 channels.`
`21:34.03`	`MohammadAG`	`I wonder how I could make a window take focus and get on top`
`21:34.22`	`*** join/#maemo kthomas (~kthomas@adsl-93-48-207.owb.bellsouth.net)`
`21:35.14`	`*** join/#maemo visz (hv@kytkin.vipu.org)`
`21:35.23`	`*** join/#maemo RangerBob (~Brian@pool-71-171-98-198.clppva.fios.verizon.net)`
`21:35.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`umm, call setfocus() or sth like that?`
`21:36.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but actually that's a STRONGLY deprecated practice for almost all cases`
`21:37.36`	`FIQ\|n900`	`let's use it everytime someone writes something in a channel in xchat`
`21:37.37`	`MohammadAG`	`not this case, suppose you have a media player window open, you click the widget, it should show now playing right?`
`21:37.40`	`FIQ\|n900`	`:D`
`21:37.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`an app may switch itself to foreground on user interaction or some rare high importance event. No app may ever try to stay in foreground`
`21:37.53`	`MohammadAG`	`I don't want to create another window (obviously), so there has to be a way to show it on top`
`21:38.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: right, that's the case "on user interaction"`
`21:39.21`	`MohammadAG`	`yeah, sorry, IRC's lagging`
`21:39.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: check how arbitrary other apps (or is it HDM?) do it, as virtually every app gets focus and foreground (ontop) when starting it while it's running`
`21:39.57`	`MohammadAG`	`that's the window manager (h-d in this case)`
`21:40.09`	`MohammadAG`	`hmm`
`21:40.14`	`*** join/#maemo mc_teo (~hah@unaffiliated/mcteo/x-951735)`
`21:40.39`	`MohammadAG`	`I wonder if it's activateWindow()`
`21:41.00`	`MohammadAG`	`heh, activateWindow it is`
`21:41.10`	`MohammadAG`	`I'd have expected setFocus() to do it, but meh...`
`21:42.26`	`*** join/#maemo joga (jzBNmycA@rikki.fi)`
`21:51.37`	`MohammadAG`	`grumbles`
`21:51.37`	`MohammadAG`	`Nokia-N900:~# dbus-send --print-reply --dest=com.nokia.mediaplayer /com/nokia/mediaplayer com.nokia.mediaplayer.mime_open string:"test"`
`21:51.37`	`MohammadAG`	`Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.UnknownMethod: No such method 'mime_open' in interface 'com.nokia.mediaplayer' at object path '/com/nokia/mediaplayer' (signature 's')`
`21:54.53`	`*** join/#maemo The_Fellow (~spider1@glida.mooo.com)`
`21:56.34`	`MohammadAG`	`oh yay, figured it out`
`21:58.40`	`*** join/#maemo trbs (~trbs@2001:470:d2ad:1:4a5b:39ff:fe7d:1623)`
`22:00.13`	`MohammadAG`	`I wonder how I could differentiate music files from video ones`
`22:00.33`	`*** join/#maemo The_Fellow (~spider1@glida.mooo.com)`
`22:00.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`umm, there's a unix cmd called file`
`22:00.55`	`SpeedEvil`	`ponders making a calculus joke, and then backs away from the nerdiness.`
`22:01.16`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, in Qt/C++/C/Glib/whatever`
`22:01.22`	`kerio`	`SpeedEvil: what joke?`
`22:01.23`	`kerio`	`i'm a nerd!`
`22:01.27`	`kerio`	`a math one!`
`22:01.39`	`kerio`	`i like math jokes`
`22:01.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: there's probably no other/better/equivalent way to what file does`
`22:03.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so this is a perfect example to follow basic unix design principles and use existing general simple functions to build more specific functions out of them - in expression use system()`
`22:03.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or you find a lib that's doing what file cmd does`
`22:04.43`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, I'm not launching file from my app`
`22:04.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`:shrug:`
`22:05.13`	`SpeedEvil`	`I vaguely recall libmagic`
`22:05.18`	`MohammadAG`	`I just need to know if the file is a video or an audio file to show the correct window`
`22:05.28`	`SpeedEvil`	`yeah`
`22:06.03`	`MohammadAG`	`#define MAFW_METADATA_KEY_MIME: Describes the type and format of the item. Its value is a string of <type> '/' <subtype> defined in RFC2045 section 5.1. The value should be interpreted according to that standard.`
`22:06.06`	`MohammadAG`	`interesting`
`22:06.14`	`MohammadAG`	`isn't that music/subtype or video/subtype?`
`22:15.03`	`*** join/#maemo TheXception\|off (~thexcepti@unaffiliated/thexception)`
`22:17.37`	`*** join/#maemo sleepee (~sleepee@adsl-64-237-137-214.prtc.net)`
`22:17.55`	`*** join/#maemo crs (~crs@gentoo/user/crs)`
`22:22.02`	`*** join/#maemo ferdna (~ferdna@cpe-67-10-220-35.elp.res.rr.com)`
`22:32.14`	`*** join/#maemo nox- (noident@p4FCBE6C2.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`22:37.35`	`*** join/#maemo muellisoft (~muelli@port-18904.pppoe.wtnet.de)`
`22:38.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`whatever it is, it's just a #define`
`22:39.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`maybe mafw-* has some method to determine the mimetype of a file and pass back a result according to that define.`
`22:39.49`	`*** join/#maemo swordi (~swordi@p4FDB1CEA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`22:40.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`maybe hildon has a general mimetype management (which then probably works similar to 'file' in some aspects)`
`22:40.54`	`MohammadAG`	`well, yeah, that, but it's not working :P`
`22:40.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil's hint about libmagic is a realy good one`
`22:41.10`	`MohammadAG`	`and the stock player isn't doing it, it just jumps to playback according to DBus`
`22:42.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sure, stock MP is relying on tracker data. And tracker also has some way to determine type of file. Dunno how it works exactly`
`22:43.07`	`MohammadAG`	`no, tracker also uses DBus`
`22:43.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`for some strange reason the terms "conduit" and "plugin" have a fight in my mind`
`22:43.21`	`MohammadAG`	`and it's not poking at that`
`22:43.33`	`MohammadAG`	`it's using some C/GLib API`
`22:43.49`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: tracker can't read and index files via DBus`
`22:43.51`	`MohammadAG`	`gnome_vfs_get_mime_type_from_uri <-ha`
`22:44.10`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, all calls to tracker are done via DBus`
`22:44.11`	`*** join/#maemo sid (~sid@g227011128.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`22:44.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah sure`
`22:44.32`	`MohammadAG`	`since both mafw and the mediaplayer are using tracker, it causes slowness`
`22:44.37`	`MohammadAG`	`that's why the stock UI sucks`
`22:44.51`	`RST38h`	`Tracker!`
`22:44.54`	`RST38h`	`Evil@!`
`22:44.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's unrelated to tracker's indexing and file content scanning/classifying action though`
`22:45.43`	`MohammadAG`	`well, tracker indexes on its own`
`22:45.47`	`MohammadAG`	`then provides the data over DBus`
`22:45.53`	`MohammadAG`	`dbus-monitor --session`
`22:45.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`we all know that`
`22:45.59`	`RST38h`	`Yea`
`22:46.13`	`MohammadAG`	`then start the stock player, it gives me headaches`
`22:47.46`	`RST38h`	`It behaves...weirdly. So does Modest though`
`22:48.09`	`RST38h`	`Check out what happens with mail account update times in the main view, for example =)`
`22:48.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ponders stopping trackerd (from autoindexing a certain directory), then copy over some e.g. mp3, and click on that file unknown to tracker in HFM`
`22:48.34`	`RST38h`	`In the stock media player, see what happens with the list of songs to be played`
`22:48.42`	`RST38h`	`Similar crap`
`22:48.55`	`*** join/#maemo ftrvxmtrx (~i515i@178.121.246.50)`
`22:50.14`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, it'd work fine`
`22:51.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I bet HFM somehow has to determine the type of file. I'd not be surprised it asks tracker about type of file, and tracker in turn notices it's a file not yet indexed and starts to find out about the file's properties like tracker usually does`
`22:52.13`	`kerio`	`tracker is as tracker does`
`22:52.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	this means this very moment tracker will do sth similar to `file <file>`
`22:52.51`	`*** join/#maemo mva (mva@pirate-party.ru)`
`22:53.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	either you use same procedure (asking tracker via DBus), or you consider doing the filetype inspection on your own, using `file` or libmagic or whatever you find appropriate
`22:55.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or you don't care and simply try to open the file for video playback (or audio or whatever the user asked for) and see if it works or fails`
`22:55.34`	`*** join/#maemo Kilroo (~Kilroo@cpe-174-111-058-051.triad.res.rr.com)`
`22:56.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`NB some audio formats (e.g .au) are hard or impossible to determine by anything other than listening to them :-)`
`22:57.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, probably those formats are hard to playback in MP either, as you'd need to specify sampling rate and other parameters`
`22:58.18`	`ShadowJK`	`implemented .au once`
`22:58.35`	`*** part/#maemo JenasonAKX (~Jenasonak@93-153-38-2.tmcz.cz)`
`22:59.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(I'm not absolutely sure about .au. IIRC it's the headerless raw audio dump format used by Sun?)`
`23:00.14`	`ShadowJK`	`"Originally it was headerless, being simply 8-bit Âµ-law-encoded data at an 8000 Hz sample rate" ... "Newer files have a header that consists of six unsigned 32-bit words, an optional information chunk and then the data (in big endian format)."`
`23:00.49`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, umm, I already mentioned what it uses`
`23:01.01`	`MohammadAG`	`const char* gnome_vfs_get_mime_type_from_uri (GnomeVFSURI *uri);`
`23:01.09`	`MohammadAG`	`http://library.gnome.org/devel/gnome-vfs-2.0/2.20/gnome-vfs-20-gnome-vfs-mime.html#gnome-vfs-get-mime-type-from-uri`
`23:01.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: sounds fine, no?`
`23:03.16`	`MohammadAG`	`if it didn't segfault, yeah`
`23:03.45`	`*** join/#maemo zakkkkm (~zakkkkm@199.7.156.40)`
`23:03.58`	`zakkkkm`	`Is meego 1.2RC n900 worth trying?`
`23:04.11`	`zakkkkm`	`does it have call/text/sms/data support?`
`23:04.26`	`MohammadAG`	`#meego`
`23:04.42`	`zakkkkm`	`they would know about the n900 port?`
`23:05.08`	`MohammadAG`	`they're the ones working on it, not us`
`23:05.32`	`MohammadAG`	`but if you're not a dev, you don't need to install it`
`23:05.36`	`MohammadAG`	`Maemo's quite fine`
`23:05.47`	`zakkkkm`	`it is, i just want to experiment for fun`
`23:05.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: maybe interesting: find /usr/ -name 'mim'`
`23:06.01`	`zakkkkm`	`kind of bored weekend :)`
`23:06.20`	`zakkkkm`	`i bought the n900 cause of maemo. I wont leave maemo.`
`23:07.20`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, not much help, it's segfaulting and gdb's showing it segfaults @ strchr`
`23:07.24`	`MohammadAG`	`whatever that function is`
`23:07.33`	`*** join/#maemo khorben_ (~dont@2002:53ec:d9a1:1:221:28ff:fe14:b106)`
`23:07.43`	`RST38h`	`Tokyo Electric Power Company is going to get a massive hollow floating platform from Shizuoka City. TEPCO plans to use it to store radioactive water at its crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant.`
`23:10.24`	`*** join/#maemo lawl0r (~skskill@2001:470:25:1ee:21c:c0ff:fe19:5277)`
`23:10.37`	`zakkkkm`	`is u-boot from extras-devel safe to run?`
`23:11.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: you might want to look at /usr/share/mime/packages/mediaplayer-service-mime.xml and see who's using it and how you can exploit that`
`23:11.53`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, I don't want nasty hacks when there's a perfectly good function for it, that segfaults`
`23:12.01`	`MohammadAG`	`gnome_vfs_get_mime_type_from_uri (uri); <-- is where it's segfautling`
`23:12.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lol`
`23:12.20`	`zakkkkm`	`your reverse engineering?`
`23:12.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sorry, your wording made me laugh`
`23:12.58`	`MohammadAG`	`it was intended, I'm sure :P`
`23:13.05`	`MohammadAG`	`zakkkkm, no, just replacing the stock player`
`23:13.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MohammadAG: "...see who's using it and how you can exploit that" wasn't meant to suggest "nasty hacks". Just stating that file probably is part of the existing perfectly working solution`
`23:14.19`	`MohammadAG`	`DocScrutinizer, I think that's read by gnome vfs`
`23:14.28`	`MohammadAG`	`that's how gnome based desktops work, not sure how KDE does it`
`23:14.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so yes, then probably that lib is the one you want to use`
`23:16.01`	`mtnbkr`	`MohammadAG, DocScrutinizer: looks like the microsd reader is shot on my N900. Took the 8GB microsd to someone who had a reader for it and everything was fine. but phone will not read it. shows up as "corrupted memory card (or whatever) So I bought a 16GB microsd and the phone does not even see it at all. :(`
`23:16.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`though /usr/lib/libhildonmime.so.0 and even more /usr/lib/microb-engine/libsmime3.so make me frown and scratch my head`
`23:16.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: oh shit`
`23:17.18`	`*** join/#maemo visz (hv@kytkin.vipu.org)`
`23:17.19`	`mtnbkr`	`yeah :(`
`23:17.26`	`MohammadAG`	`btw, make sure the card doesn't have a Symbian lock on it`
`23:17.44`	`MohammadAG`	`that makes the driver returns error code -10 (or -110, can't remember)`
`23:17.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`oh yes. that one nasty crap`
`23:17.50`	`mtnbkr`	`well, the 8GB had been working in my N900 since Dec 12th '10`
`23:18.10`	`mtnbkr`	`they are both "SanDisk" cards one 8GB on 16GB`
`23:18.20`	`mtnbkr`	`s/on/one/`
`23:18.41`	`mtnbkr`	`haha not actually infobot :)`
`23:18.55`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Anybody good IDing helicopters? http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/5571688290/`
`23:20.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: some rare cards don't work with particular readers. Also it might be possible you bitkilled the SDcard driver of your system (->reflash). And finally it might be bad luck and you got two shaky cards`
`23:20.19`	`mtnbkr`	`GeneralAntilles: Eurocopter BK 117?`
`23:20.27`	`*** join/#maemo scoobertron (~tom@93.186.151.75)`
`23:21.34`	`MohammadAG`	`GnomeVFSURI* uri = gnome_vfs_uri_new (text_uri);`
`23:21.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: actually cards that are broken or shaky ootb are way more common than you'd guess`
`23:21.35`	`*** join/#maemo chenca (~chenca@187.112.2.63)`
`23:21.43`	`MohammadAG`	`uri is NULL for some reason :/`
`23:21.43`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: I am guessing the former since the 8GB (original) was fully readble by some due with a windws machine who told me I might have to reboot my phone for it to recognize the card... I told him my phone runs Linux, I don't need to reboot it for such trivial things. lol`
`23:22.33`	`mtnbkr`	`so describe "bitkilled" and then describe "how to fix" lol`
`23:22.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`at OM (freerunner) we seen several problems with SD cards that needed reduced clock frequency to work reliably`
`23:23.03`	`*** join/#maemo sq-one (~sq-one@p54A1E216.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`23:23.50`	`mtnbkr`	`GeneralAntilles: oh wait, that is an EC 35 http://www.bayflite.com/about/aircraft.php`
`23:23.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`bitkilled=something caused incorrect bits/bytes/data inside the SD-driver.ko -- fix: ~flashing`
`23:24.29`	`mtnbkr`	`grr`
`23:24.52`	`mtnbkr`	`perhaps I can just get a good SD-driver.so and overwrite?`
`23:25.02`	`mtnbkr`	`prefer not to reflash (again)`
`23:25.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`first you might just re-install the driver modules, and flash a new kernel`
`23:25.26`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: got a URL?`
`23:25.46`	`MohammadAG`	`apt-get --reinstall install kernel kernel-modules kernel-flasher`
`23:25.49`	`DocScrutinizer`	`flasher-3.5 --flash=kernel`
`23:25.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sth along that lines`
`23:26.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah, what MohammadAG says`
`23:26.12`	`mtnbkr`	`ok... lemme try...`
`23:26.16`	`mtnbkr`	`thanks guys`
`23:26.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yw`
`23:26.57`	`mtnbkr`	`GeneralAntilles: and I meant to say EC 135, not EC 35`
`23:27.02`	`*** join/#maemo xnt14 (~xnt14@unaffiliated/xnt14)`
`23:27.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`mtnbkr: I spent 30 minutes trying to find actual useful about information on their about page the other day.`
`23:27.28`	`GeneralAntilles`	`mtnbkr: clearly I fail. g`
`23:27.49`	`mtnbkr`	`I cheated`
`23:27.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: also make sure your SDcard holder's contacts are clean, and similar 'trivial' stuff`
`23:28.13`	`zakkkkm`	`anyone try KDE over easy-debian on the n900?`
`23:28.15`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: yeah... checked that... they are good...`
`23:28.24`	`*** join/#maemo AdmiralSausage (~Pete@cpc5-aztw24-2-0-cust341.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com)`
`23:28.24`	`mtnbkr`	`GeneralAntilles: i cheated`
`23:28.36`	`GeneralAntilles`	`mtnbkr: cheating's for winners. ;)`
`23:28.48`	`mtnbkr`	`hahah`
`23:29.04`	`lawl0r`	`Why do you guys use maemo? Android is superior. It runs Java.`
`23:29.12`	`zakkkkm`	`java isnt superior?`
`23:29.19`	`zakkkkm`	`and maemo runs java too`
`23:29.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`lawl0r: don't troll, Androidiot.`
`23:29.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lawl0r: you're serious??`
`23:29.32`	`zakkkkm`	`GeneralAntilles: Still around? :)`
`23:29.39`	`lawl0r`	`but.... trolling is fun :)`
`23:29.47`	`GeneralAntilles`	`zakkkkm: vaguely.`
`23:29.51`	`mtnbkr`	`saw your flikr image, googled bayflight helicopter model and clicked the 1st and 3rd links... best part is the FIRST link was a photo of a MODEL :)`
`23:29.52`	`zakkkkm`	`Has anybody left maemo? :P`
`23:29.54`	`zakkkkm`	`you remember me?`
`23:30.06`	`GeneralAntilles`	`lawl0r: right now, in here, it's mostly just depressing. ;)`
`23:30.09`	`mtnbkr`	`Androidiot hahahah`
`23:30.18`	`mtnbkr`	`lawl0r: DRM sux`
`23:30.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`zakkkkm: yeah, how was Japan? ;)`
`23:30.23`	`zakkkkm`	`japan?`
`23:30.28`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yes, a few people have left Japan`
`23:30.28`	`zakkkkm`	`you dont remember me :)`
`23:30.38`	`lawl0r`	`Android has a decent appstore.`
`23:30.43`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Weren't you about to board a flight to Japan last time you were in here?`
`23:30.43`	`zakkkkm`	`probably more than a few`
`23:30.49`	`zakkkkm`	`no.`
`23:30.51`	`MohammadAG`	`and a non-decent shell`
`23:30.55`	`lawl0r`	`also i don't accidently fuck shit, because i don't have root.`
`23:30.56`	`zakkkkm`	`3 years ago, was it?`
`23:30.59`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Hrm, wonder which z-nick I'm confusing you with.`
`23:31.02`	`Vanadis`	`lawl0r, you can shut down your computer now.`
`23:31.27`	`lawl0r`	`android has no viruses, because google removes them for me.`
`23:31.30`	`zakkkkm`	`bricked my nokia 770 back in like '08 , then got a 800`
`23:31.41`	`MohammadAG`	`lawl0r, are you trolling maemo or android?`
`23:31.42`	`Vanadis`	`lawl0r, google also removes your pr0n.`
`23:31.49`	`mtnbkr`	`lawl0r: google is not your friend`
`23:32.05`	`lawl0r`	`MohammadAG, doesn't matter, as long as it's trolling`
`23:32.05`	`zakkkkm`	`lawl0r: i am an android developer, google doesnt do shit to stop "viruses" lol.`
`23:32.09`	`mtnbkr`	`lawl0r: and google tracks every thing you do EVERYTHING`
`23:32.09`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Haha`
`23:32.17`	`GeneralAntilles`	`s/a few people have left Japan/Maemo/`
`23:32.25`	`*** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)`
`23:32.26`	`lawl0r`	`OMG, trolling you guys is easier than i tought`
`23:32.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lawl0r: please stop that. It's too lame for trolling, and too stupid for a serious discussion`
`23:32.29`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Sorry, I'm watching the baseball game and it's dividing my intelligence into two idiots.`
`23:32.38`	`lawl0r`	`especially because i already said i'm trolling`
`23:32.43`	`zakkkkm`	`is easy debian worth trying on n900?`
`23:33.11`	`GeneralAntilles`	`zakkkkm: works fine.`
`23:33.13`	`mtnbkr`	`wonders why people actually try to be douches`
`23:33.24`	`zakkkkm`	`i wanna try kde4 :)`
`23:33.27`	`lawl0r`	`ok, serious mode now: maemo is cool, nokia is stoopid.`
`23:33.35`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yes.`
`23:34.12`	`lawl0r`	`maemo runs only on one nokia phone, ergo -> maemo is stupid.`
`23:34.22`	`*** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ`
`23:34.24`	`zakkkkm`	`lol`
`23:34.29`	`mtnbkr`	`will someone just kick the douche?`
`23:34.32`	`*** mode/#maemo [+q lawl0r!@] by DocScrutinizer`
`23:34.42`	`*** mode/#maemo [-o DocScrutinizer] by ChanServ`
`23:34.45`	`mtnbkr`	`thank you ;)`
`23:34.50`	`*** join/#maemo nostyle (~a@unaffiliated/nostyle)`
`23:35.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lawl0r: query me if you think you found a way to contribute non-trolling statements`
`23:38.52`	`MohammadAG`	`k, I think mixing gnome code doesn't work well`
`23:38.56`	`mtnbkr`	`guesses he DIDN'T "find a way"`
`23:39.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[Notice] -lawl0r- it's okay, at the moment i'm in troll mode, i'll notice you if that should change`
`23:39.50`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'm fine with that for now`
`23:39.54`	`MohammadAG`	`cause I'm not doing anything wrong http://pastebin.com/3fce1HtZ`
`23:40.04`	`NIN101`	`http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=910633&postcount=16`
`23:40.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`NIN101: what's that?`
`23:41.07`	`NIN101`	`Well, a serious contribution to a serious discussion, nothing more.`
`23:41.10`	`NIN101`	`:-)`
`23:42.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`please don't post context-free uncommented URLs that don't even have a hint in their text about the topic the page is about`
`23:44.08`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: at least it was DRM-free too though`
`23:44.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: what was DRM free?`
`23:45.26`	`mtnbkr`	`apt-get --reinstall install kernel kernel-modules kernel-flasher then reboot, insert 8GB card that works find on some dumb windows machine, close back cover "Memory card corrupted" :(`
`23:45.47`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: re: DRM-free his post`
`23:46.12`	`*** join/#maemo isak (~isak@78-73-90-85-no169.tbcn.telia.com)`
`23:46.15`	`mtnbkr`	`so, I think officially my N900 microsd reader is shot :(`
`23:46.26`	`ShadowJK`	`Do you still have the magnet?`
`23:46.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I had no lok at that post, as I generally never click on URLs just to find out why they got posted by some fool`
`23:46.39`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: me too`
`23:46.42`	`mtnbkr`	`sadly :)`
`23:47.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: I guess you missed a point: if the magnet is missing, the system won't touch the SD card at all`
`23:48.01`	`mtnbkr`	`so, any other options or am I out of luck? all my RUSH, Steve Vai and Jo Satriani was on that micrsd card :(`
`23:48.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: I'd try with a 3rd and fourth card, just to make sure it's not bad luck`
`23:48.41`	`mtnbkr`	`yeah, but each 16GB microsd is ~ $50`
`23:48.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`preferably another brand`
`23:49.02`	`ShadowJK`	`recommends sandisk`
`23:49.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so try a 1GB or even 512MB`
`23:49.18`	`*** join/#maemo pcacjr (~pcacjr@187.78.130.29)`
`23:49.18`	`*** join/#maemo pcacjr (~pcacjr@unaffiliated/pcacjr)`
`23:49.18`	`nox-`	`mtnbkr, or try reading the card on a pc reader?`
`23:49.19`	`mtnbkr`	`I am not actually made of money (even though I bought the N900 in Nov 2010 at FULL REATAIL lol`
`23:49.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: both were sandisk`
`23:49.41`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: yeah, good idea`
`23:49.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: same here :-)`
`23:50.00`	`mtnbkr`	`I COULD. NOT. WAIT. lol`
`23:50.15`	`ShadowJK`	`I bought it Nov 2009 retail :-)`
`23:50.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I paid it like 2009-08`
`23:50.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`shipped some 8 weeks later`
`23:50.59`	`mtnbkr`	`BTW, I had to use my old iPhone 3G while this was being repaired... I HATE the iPhone! I only keep it around since I have a cool app that I can plug my electric guitar into and add in effects etc...`
`23:51.33`	`ShadowJK`	`btw, "Corrupted memory card" could mean anything from a partition table the N900 doesn't like, to filesystem corruption, to actual memory card brokenness`
`23:51.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yep`
`23:52.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it might even be formated (/[not] partitioned) as a superfloppy`
`23:52.27`	`mtnbkr`	`ShadowJK: right but the card IS readable on some dude's windows machine`
`23:52.31`	`DocScrutinizer`	`windoze will happily use those`
`23:53.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`try listing the partition(s) with sfdisk`
`23:53.18`	`mtnbkr`	`DocScrutinizer: p[lus earlier today I dd'ed it and then it was STILL readable so it tells me my sd reader/writer is non-functional since all those 0's never made it to the microsd card`
`23:53.18`	`ShadowJK`	`mtnbkr, do you speak linux`
`23:53.30`	`mtnbkr`	`ShadowJK: almost exclusively`
`23:53.48`	`mtnbkr`	`I also speak mountain biking, beer, OS/2 and RPN :)`
`23:54.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mtnbkr: good point, yeah. dd should have erased it`
`23:54.28`	`ShadowJK`	`Right.. I'd fire up a rootshell on N900, try mount it manually (check with 'mount' first to check what MyDocs device name is called, because they can jump around and get renamed a bit)`
`23:54.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`if you dd to phy device, not mtd*1`
`23:54.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`err mmc*1`
`23:55.05`	`ShadowJK`	`also dmesg`
`23:55.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yep`
`23:55.41`	`zakkkkm`	`ShadowJK: wow, everyone is still in maemo scene eh`
`23:55.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`then there's been that tool to read out properties of storage devices... can't recall the name`
`23:57.01`	`ShadowJK`	`In general, after you insert microsd and close the battery cover, dmesg will contain some info and partition list, or errors, or nothing at all. I'd start from there`
`23:57.49`	`ShadowJK`	`zakkkkm, what do you mean?`
`23:58.04`	`zakkkkm`	`ShadowJK: i remember you when i was here about 3 years ago.`
`23:58.13`	`ShadowJK`	`Oh :-)`
`23:58.14`	`zakkkkm`	`and alot of the same people are still here.`
`23:58.25`	`*** join/#maemo internetishard (~root@c-24-14-196-146.hsd1.il.comcast.net)`
`23:58.31`	`ShadowJK`	`I didn't know I had been here 3 years. And I'm sorry I don't remember you :-(`
`23:58.40`	`zakkkkm`	`sold my 800 in early 09 i believe, and recently got n900 so im back.`
`23:58.48`	`ShadowJK`	`welcome back :D`
`23:58.49`	`zakkkkm`	`dont expect you too, dont believe we ever talked.`
`23:59.16`	`ShadowJK`	`bought N810, N800, N900, in that order`
`23:59.18`	`ShadowJK`	`still use them all`
`23:59.29`	`zakkkkm`	`i had 770 , got wsod.. then had 800 , and now n900`
`23:59.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`is missing 800`
`23:59.44`	`ShadowJK`	`I don't have 770 :/`
`23:59.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`neither`
`23:59.57`	`zakkkkm`	`loved maemo 3`

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