| 00:00.42 | Venemo | when trying to SSH to the N900, I get "Error: Host key verification failed Please select another viewer and try again." |
| 00:00.44 | Venemo | wft is this? |
| 00:02.42 | pupnik | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:02.58 | pupnik | or the N900 got a different IP addresss |
| 00:03.16 | pupnik | yes? |
| 00:03.27 | Venemo | no, I reflashed it |
| 00:03.34 | *** join/#maemo valerius (~user@smtp.elizovotv.ru) |
| 00:04.07 | *** join/#maemo smooph (~smooph@e180130001.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 00:04.14 | pupnik | doesn't know the proper precise answer |
| 00:04.19 | luke-jr | DocScrutinizer: there's a config file somewhere |
| 00:05.01 | luke-jr | diffs old and new /etc |
| 00:05.04 | DocScrutinizer | no config file, it's done somewhere in rcs-early or sth |
| 00:05.22 | DocScrutinizer | that file isn't in /etc ;-) |
| 00:05.29 | *** join/#maemo bazi (~bazi@188-195-7-143-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 00:06.32 | luke-jr | DocScrutinizer: no, I am SURE there is a config file |
| 00:06.50 | luke-jr | aha |
| 00:06.55 | luke-jr | /etc/pmconfig |
| 00:07.15 | DocScrutinizer | oooh |
| 00:07.23 | pupnik | i wish that ownta.com site would give the dimensions for those speakers |
| 00:07.40 | Venemo | solution was to edit ~/.ssh/known_hosts on my laptop |
| 00:07.43 | *** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@rt.miraclelinux.com) |
| 00:08.00 | DocScrutinizer | ownta.com are fools |
| 00:08.14 | DocScrutinizer | they sell chips like potato chips |
| 00:08.25 | DocScrutinizer | no clue |
| 00:08.31 | Venemo | nah, bye-bye guys |
| 00:08.42 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: ?? |
| 00:08.44 | *** join/#maemo smooph1 (~smooph@e180133217.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 00:08.51 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer: ?? ?? |
| 00:09.20 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer: [01:00] <Venemo> when trying to SSH to the N900, I get "Error: Host key verification failed Please select another viewer and try again." ---> [01:07] <Venemo> solution was to edit ~/.ssh/known_hosts on my laptop |
| 00:09.25 | *** join/#maemo joppu (~joppu@cs184129.pp.htv.fi) |
| 00:10.04 | DocScrutinizer | Venemo: ssh -o StrictHostKeyChecking=no -o UserKnownHostsFile=/dev/null root@192.168.0.202 |
| 00:11.12 | Venemo | DocScrutinizer: that's a hack instead of a proper solution, isn't it |
| 00:11.27 | DocScrutinizer | known issue, that friggin known-hosts is supposed to stop MITM attacks, but usually just throws stick at your feet |
| 00:11.53 | Venemo | mhm |
| 00:11.58 | Venemo | okay, thanks DocScrutinizer :) |
| 00:12.03 | Venemo | anyway, I should be sleeping |
| 00:12.06 | Venemo | so good night |
| 00:12.10 | DocScrutinizer | it's meant for a internet where's no dynamic IPs |
| 00:13.23 | luke-jr | DocScrutinizer: sleep_ind controls the flashing |
| 00:14.59 | *** join/#maemo valeriusN (~valeriusN@smtp.elizovotv.ru) |
| 00:24.06 | DocScrutinizer | luke-jr: exactly, and sleep_ind actually is a GPIO |
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| 00:24.22 | DocScrutinizer | and you can control it via some /sys node |
| 00:25.02 | pupnik | intel/apple "thunderbolt" connector promises 10 Gbps connections (usb 2.0 = 480 Mbps) |
| 00:25.21 | DocScrutinizer | GPIO162 |
| 00:26.22 | kerio | usb always sucked |
| 00:26.58 | luke-jr | DocScrutinizer: I prefer to use config :>P |
| 00:27.11 | DocScrutinizer | and afair somewhere in init process, probably in rcS_early or what it's called, I've seen some bootmode cmdline tool asking if R&D is set and doing an according echo 0/1 >/sys/foo |
| 00:30.03 | luke-jr | I probably found this config file by looking at that init process :p |
| 00:30.07 | luke-jr | and seeing that it checks the config |
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| 01:10.56 | aap | how do i change ovi map to mappero? to auto launch from address book. |
| 01:13.43 | aap | is there a prefered application setup config file? |
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| 02:52.22 | luke-jr | Argh! |
| 02:52.28 | luke-jr | PR1.3 doesn't seem to work with T-Mobile |
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| 02:57.31 | nox- | it does in germany if thats of any help... |
| 02:57.54 | nox- | (i suppose not) |
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| 03:33.14 | DocScrutinizer | how the F is PR1.3 going to break compatibility with a single carrier? |
| 03:33.51 | *** join/#maemo maybeWTF (cl@p5B164C02.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:34.40 | DocScrutinizer | also don't you think it's strange there's not been a single report like that I heard of, since errr - when was it PR1.3 was published? |
| 03:36.20 | DocScrutinizer | if an update would render a quarter of the devices in a large area (like USA) inoperable, that for sure would make some more noise |
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| 03:39.23 | jonwil | anyone in the US using a N900 is either going to be using t-mobile or using AT&T GSM |
| 03:39.33 | jonwil | since AFAIK the N900 doesn't do AT&T 3G |
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| 03:59.37 | RobbieThe1st | Hello guys |
| 04:00.29 | bmidgley_ | hey |
| 04:00.52 | RobbieThe1st | So... I never thought I'd ever be asking this, but..: I'm looking for a cheapish Android phone that's easily rooted and works on the T-mobile network. Used is acceptable, hardware keyboard required. Any suggestions? |
| 04:01.02 | RobbieThe1st | (Mind, not for me - I'm keeping my N900) |
| 04:01.41 | bmidgley_ | that is heresy |
| 04:03.01 | RobbieThe1st | Yea yea... I know. :( Hopefully, though, a rooted android phone won't be -too- bad - I'm intending to give it to my mom so she can check emails and such on-the-go. |
| 04:03.38 | *** join/#maemo schend (~suresh@a88-112-2-112.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 04:04.27 | bmidgley_ | maybe webos will be the best community supported hackable going forward |
| 04:04.36 | jonwil | If it wasnt for the hw keyboard requirement I would suggest the Nexus One |
| 04:04.41 | jonwil | or the Nexus S |
| 04:04.49 | Dassu | ... My dad bought a freaking Nokia 5230 when I told him that it would be cool if he had a phone with wlan so I could call him directly by skype.... |
| 04:05.03 | Dassu | Needless to say that phone doesn't' have a wlan |
| 04:05.09 | bmidgley_ | my main phone is android and it bugs me to no end... pathetic ui |
| 04:05.24 | jonwil | all the Android phones that work with t-mobile and have hw keyboard cant be rooted easily |
| 04:06.33 | DocScrutinizer | also what's the use of roting for your mom? |
| 04:06.39 | DocScrutinizer | rooting* |
| 04:07.11 | bmidgley_ | webos or gasp, ios would be what I chose for grandma |
| 04:07.24 | DocScrutinizer | fsckng winmo6 |
| 04:08.35 | DocScrutinizer | kinda "looks like a computer" UI |
| 04:09.11 | DocScrutinizer | for M$ tainted techno-ignorants |
| 04:09.49 | *** join/#maemo Natunen (nalle@213-186-248-75.bb.dnainternet.fi) |
| 04:10.25 | DocScrutinizer | heh, I got a Samsung OMNIA here, almost unused. You can get it for... err... probably you get one cheaper next corner |
| 04:15.39 | *** join/#maemo trupheenix (~trupheeni@nat/nokia/x-ptvsvwlasxppmvqi) |
| 04:16.30 | DocScrutinizer | dh, hw kbd. So you might be interested in my Eten GloFiish M800 - but that's a real collector's item ;-D |
| 04:17.24 | Sc0rpius | by the way |
| 04:17.30 | Sc0rpius | I just noticed the N8 has all 5 bands in UMTS |
| 04:17.40 | Sc0rpius | that's nice hardware, but terrible software |
| 04:17.58 | DocScrutinizer | errr, all 5 bands? |
| 04:18.04 | Sc0rpius | yes |
| 04:18.12 | Sc0rpius | 850/900/1700/1900/2100 |
| 04:18.17 | Sc0rpius | in UMTS |
| 04:18.42 | Sc0rpius | 3G Network HSDPA 850 / 900 / 1700 / 1900 / 2100 |
| 04:18.50 | Sc0rpius | http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_n8-3252.php |
| 04:19.11 | Sc0rpius | and it's quad band in GSM as expected |
| 04:19.21 | Sc0rpius | there should be a way to put Maemo in that |
| 04:19.22 | Sc0rpius | :( |
| 04:20.20 | DocScrutinizer | meh, you're talking about that USA rubbish |
| 04:20.41 | Sc0rpius | what exactly is rubbish? the phone? or the bands? hehe |
| 04:20.44 | Sc0rpius | or the country? |
| 04:20.46 | DocScrutinizer | I really wonder how they can call that UMTS |
| 04:20.59 | Sc0rpius | why not |
| 04:21.01 | DocScrutinizer | #2, mayber #3 |
| 04:21.18 | bmidgley_ | I wrote a helper app that brings geolocation api to maemo, anyone interested in helping to polish it a bit |
| 04:21.28 | Sc0rpius | I'm not in the USA but at least in the same continent. I get 3 Mbps with my phone in 3G, not bad |
| 04:22.23 | DocScrutinizer | USA was idiotic enough to use GSM bands for UMTS |
| 04:22.34 | *** join/#maemo trupheenix_ (~trupheeni@nat/nokia/x-wammpldnpbzjbglw) |
| 04:23.02 | Sc0rpius | then talk about Europe using 900 MHz for voice AND for 3G ? |
| 04:23.08 | Sc0rpius | that was worse! |
| 04:24.10 | jonwil | Australia has a wierd mix of bands, we have 900MHz and 1800MHz for GSM across 3 networks |
| 04:24.31 | jonwil | plus we have one network using 850MHz UMTS and possibly also 2100MHz UMTS (not sure) |
| 04:24.36 | jonwil | and another network using 900/2100 |
| 04:24.44 | Sc0rpius | well lemme talk you about my ISP |
| 04:24.49 | Sc0rpius | he started using GSM 900 as voice |
| 04:24.58 | jonwil | and a third network currently running 900/2100 and about to launch UMTS 0n 850 |
| 04:25.01 | Sc0rpius | when 3G came, the also installed 3G in 900 MHz, like European ISPs |
| 04:25.12 | Sc0rpius | then there's not enough spectrum, and had to move voice from 900 to 1800 MHz |
| 04:25.20 | *** join/#maemo RobbieThe1st (~RobbieThe@174-31-55-156.spkn.qwest.net) |
| 04:25.22 | Sc0rpius | but there were phones 900 MHz only, they had to change those for free |
| 04:25.28 | Sc0rpius | it was a total mess, it still is |
| 04:25.41 | DocScrutinizer | http://www.mobileworldlive.com/maps/network.php?cid=280&cname=United States |
| 04:25.48 | Sc0rpius | clicks |
| 04:25.53 | jonwil | Find me a country where the allocation of spectrum for mobile telephony ISNT a nightmare |
| 04:26.04 | jonwil | Every country has a mess of different spectrum |
| 04:26.09 | Sc0rpius | hehe that's true |
| 04:27.07 | jonwil | now we have one carrier launching LTE on IIRC 850MHz |
| 04:31.32 | DocScrutinizer | http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Mobile_Telecommunications_System#Duplex-Verfahren http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_System_for_Mobile_Communications#Verwendete_Frequenzen |
| 04:31.49 | DocScrutinizer | the digits are english ;-) |
| 04:32.03 | DocScrutinizer | the ETLAs as well |
| 04:35.29 | DocScrutinizer | so at least in Germany we got UMTS uplink on 1900 (not same as GSM) and downlink 2100 |
| 04:35.39 | Sc0rpius | oh that's nice |
| 04:35.40 | DocScrutinizer | no conflicts with GSM |
| 04:36.17 | Sc0rpius | and why your phone works |
| 04:36.18 | DocScrutinizer | GSM here is at 900 and 1800 |
| 04:36.21 | Sc0rpius | N900 is 900/2100 |
| 04:37.08 | DocScrutinizer | while USA is using 850 1900 and whatnot else, for whatever the particular carrier likes |
| 04:37.15 | Sc0rpius | heh |
| 04:39.02 | DocScrutinizer | see mobileworldlive link above, even AT&T is using same freq for UMTS in USA and for GSM in Costa Rica |
| 04:39.20 | DocScrutinizer | err Puerto Rico |
| 04:39.45 | ShadowJK | Sc0rpius, you imply 3g has no voice ;p |
| 04:40.04 | DocScrutinizer | I do? what makes you think that? |
| 04:40.11 | DocScrutinizer | oops |
| 04:40.24 | ShadowJK | <3 umts 900 |
| 04:40.34 | Sc0rpius | I have UMTS 900 in my carrier |
| 04:40.42 | Sc0rpius | and GSM was moved to 1800 |
| 04:40.48 | Sc0rpius | but it was initialliy at 900 |
| 04:41.03 | DocScrutinizer | GSM is and stays at 900 |
| 04:41.10 | Sc0rpius | in your case |
| 04:41.30 | *** join/#maemo zutesmog (~timh@119.11.18.123) |
| 04:41.32 | DocScrutinizer | it's your carrier that invented some new rubbish, and calls that UMTS now |
| 04:41.34 | Sc0rpius | because your carrier was smart enough to get the 2100MHz spectrum |
| 04:41.48 | ShadowJK | gsm+umts at 900, gsm+lte at 1800, umts at 2100 |
| 04:41.52 | ShadowJK | here at least :P |
| 04:42.08 | ShadowJK | and now they want lte at 800 or 450 or something too |
| 04:42.19 | ShadowJK | 450 currently used by flash-ofdm |
| 04:42.33 | Sc0rpius | In my country 2100 MHz is used by the army and it's not open |
| 04:42.55 | Sc0rpius | so carriers use UMTS @ 900 or 1900 depending on the carrier |
| 04:43.00 | DocScrutinizer | that's a lame excuse |
| 04:43.11 | Sc0rpius | and GSM in 850/900/1800/1900 again depending on the carrier |
| 04:43.17 | ShadowJK | They started umts on 2100 here, it was terrible. The short range of 2100 made it suck so hard :) |
| 04:43.34 | Sc0rpius | yeah UMTS @ 900 is the best |
| 04:43.39 | Sc0rpius | because of the long range |
| 04:44.05 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, UMTS for the poor |
| 04:44.26 | Sc0rpius | I get nice speed, as I said, 3 Mbps and it's stable |
| 04:44.44 | Sc0rpius | I'm happy with it :) |
| 04:44.50 | Sc0rpius | and my N900 last 2 whole days at 3G |
| 04:44.53 | Sc0rpius | (battery) |
| 04:45.13 | ShadowJK | downloaded at 800kbyte/s yesterday, 9-10km from the base station :) |
| 04:45.16 | Sc0rpius | my english is getting worse everyday instead of improving |
| 04:45.24 | Sc0rpius | nice ShadowJK |
| 04:45.26 | DocScrutinizer | carrier needs only 1/10 of BTS, and who cares about battery of MTs is empty 4 times faster, nobody can afford using UMTS for long anyway |
| 04:45.59 | ShadowJK | Looks like carriers aren't that interested in upgrading my local tower though :( |
| 04:46.13 | ShadowJK | Maybe 50 people live within its range ;p |
| 04:48.19 | DocScrutinizer | just annoying every phone owner on this world has to pay 3 bucks extra for USA idiocy of using bands nonstandard |
| 04:49.42 | *** join/#maemo gggs (~g@unaffiliated/gggs) |
| 04:50.06 | RobbieThe1st | DocScrutinizer: Tell me about it. Not only that, but they make sure to use different bands for each carrier, making it hard to switch between carriers :\ |
| 04:50.25 | DocScrutinizer | that's all intentional |
| 04:50.36 | RobbieThe1st | Of course. |
| 04:50.38 | DocScrutinizer | carefully thought and planned |
| 04:51.25 | RobbieThe1st | Doesn't make it -right-. IMHO, the FCC should step in and force them to be inter-operable; I mean, they said that Jailbreaking is legal, so this would be the next logical step |
| 04:52.02 | DocScrutinizer | FCC insisted on the 850/1900 scheme for GSM in USA |
| 04:52.29 | RobbieThe1st | That explains why AT&T/T-mobile are compatible at least. |
| 04:52.54 | jonwil | They should have insisted on a uniform band for UMTS in the US also |
| 04:53.18 | jonwil | instead of the wierd 1700 band t-mobile are using |
| 04:53.38 | DocScrutinizer | and nobody can tell me military isn't ale to tune their walkietalkies and radars down from 900 to 850 |
| 04:54.19 | RobbieThe1st | Mind, the military isn't gonna be on the same band as civilian stuff - for good reason |
| 04:54.40 | *** join/#maemo radic_ (~radic@dslb-094-216-224-223.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 04:54.57 | DocScrutinizer | in USA they are on a band that 's civilian in rest of this world |
| 04:55.34 | DocScrutinizer | I can't see any other rationale for the 850/1900 instead of 900/1800 in USA |
| 04:56.11 | DocScrutinizer | well, except the secret *real* reasons to differ from anybody else |
| 04:56.14 | RobbieThe1st | IIRC, I read something about that - US and who was it - England perhaps? - setup opposite bands for military/cvilian. |
| 04:56.29 | RobbieThe1st | So whichever the US had, the other country had em backwards |
| 04:56.31 | DocScrutinizer | which is more about economics than about military |
| 04:57.19 | DocScrutinizer | 900/1800 is pretty much worldwide standard |
| 04:57.29 | DocScrutinizer | for GSM |
| 04:57.39 | RobbieThe1st | Of course, these days it should be possible to just make a super-dodeka-band chip that covers every frequency and transmission scheme ever used. |
| 04:58.18 | DocScrutinizer | but it's almost impossible to create a decent antenna for that |
| 04:58.36 | *** join/#maemo NishanthMenon (~nmenon@nat/ti/x-hlexdgwytaasruuz) |
| 04:59.34 | RobbieThe1st | Could it be possible to make an all-in-one device that handles Bluetooth and Wifi as well, and uses say four antennas to handle it? |
| 04:59.59 | DocScrutinizer | why do you think the worldwide standard is 900/2*900 - it's just do facilitate antenna design |
| 05:00.10 | *** join/#maemo GNUton-BNC (~gnuton@84-231-39-23.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 05:00.50 | RobbieThe1st | Yea, I suppose |
| 05:01.17 | RobbieThe1st | I dunno... is the new LTE 4G or w/e going to all be on the same band? |
| 05:01.30 | *** join/#maemo s1gk1ll (~sigkill@a89-155-177-225.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 05:01.39 | DocScrutinizer | afaik LTE is backwards compatible |
| 05:02.12 | DocScrutinizer | not sure about it though |
| 05:02.26 | *** join/#maemo ZZzzZzzz1 (~ZZzzZzzz@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-44-224.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 05:02.41 | DocScrutinizer | i.e. LTE == UMTS+++ |
| 05:02.59 | rtyler | any maemo folks going to SCALE this weekend in LA? |
| 05:04.43 | ShadowJK | and the whole "cognitive radio" thing :/ |
| 05:05.14 | RobbieThe1st | Hm... Y'know, the -other- option would be to simply build the radio/antenna into a sim-card-like-device - You'd then be able to use almost any phone with any carrier, in any region |
| 05:05.30 | RobbieThe1st | Course, it'll never happen - Too easy to change carriers :\ |
| 05:05.52 | ShadowJK | like a miniature USB hsdpa modem, except not usb, and not necessarily hsdpa ;p |
| 05:05.59 | RobbieThe1st | Yea |
| 05:07.07 | ShadowJK | It's probably going the other way though |
| 05:07.10 | RobbieThe1st | Heck, make it SD-card compatible; then you can use it in all sorts of current devices and applications |
| 05:07.14 | ShadowJK | apple is working on removing the sim card ;p |
| 05:07.44 | RobbieThe1st | Oh, I'm sure. :\ Then, -no- way to change carriers. Lock down hooray! |
| 05:20.18 | RobbieThe1st | I have to say once more that the n900's just about the most awesome phone ever. I was able to just download a webm file off youtube, drop it on my n900, and play it with the built in media player quite nicely. |
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| 05:35.58 | ShadowJK | huh, I don't think that's supposed to work |
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| 05:43.01 | RobbieThe1st | ShadowJK: ? |
| 05:43.25 | RobbieThe1st | (Mind, I installed decoders-support or w/e earlier) |
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| 05:52.21 | DocScrutinizer | pupnizzzz: http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/N810-disassembly/ |
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| 06:01.21 | slonopotamus | morn |
| 06:03.11 | slonopotamus | https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/libnet-smtp-ssl-perl_1.01-2maemo1/i386.build.log.FAILED.txt ideas? |
| 06:10.09 | slonopotamus | the funniest thing is that it fails in i386 target |
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| 06:19.40 | villager | slonopotamus: probably division by zero |
| 06:20.20 | slonopotamus | villager: thanks, Captain :) |
| 06:21.36 | villager | slonopotamus: don't know enough perl to look at why, though... (nor do I want to know perl)... was just implying that division by zero is likely to happen on i386 also... |
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| 06:31.40 | slonopotamus | villager: okay, that was scratchbox, again |
| 06:31.45 | slonopotamus | SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE ftw! |
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| 08:23.33 | pupnizzzz | DocScrutinizer: thanks - as i suspected the resonant chamber is also larger |
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| 08:30.05 | pupnik | http://i.imgur.com/3S6ya.jpg heheh sfw |
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| 08:39.34 | RST38h | <yawn> |
| 08:39.43 | pupnik | <yuan> |
| 08:39.49 | RST38h | how much? |
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| 09:02.26 | jonwil | is still going nowhere with his N900 work |
| 09:05.49 | alterego | jonwil: relax, have a coffee, and do something more productive :P |
| 09:06.28 | jonwil | I am just frustrated that the features I want on my N900 are not possible, like per-contact ringtones or cell broadcast SMS |
| 09:07.10 | pupnik | per-contact ringtones would be appreciated by many people for sure |
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| 09:07.47 | jonwil | hmmm, before I abandon that idea completly, firstly I need to ID which binary reads the ringtone value from the config and plays it |
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| 09:08.54 | pupnik | good plan |
| 09:09.00 | alterego | There are a few good technical reasons why contact ringtones aren't available tbh |
| 09:09.16 | jonwil | what technical reasons would that be? |
| 09:09.36 | alterego | Ringtones are stored as wavs (i think in rootfs) |
| 09:09.45 | alterego | So space requirements are quite large .. |
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| 09:09.55 | jacekowski | other phones can do it |
| 09:09.59 | jacekowski | keep it compressed |
| 09:10.03 | jacekowski | in easy decompressible format |
| 09:10.08 | jacekowski | and mlock decoders |
| 09:10.10 | alterego | jacekowski: other phones aren't the N900 |
| 09:10.12 | jacekowski | single decoder* |
| 09:10.24 | jonwil | well let me look up which binaries are involved in playing ringtones |
| 09:10.30 | jonwil | and see how fesable it is to do some changes |
| 09:10.59 | alterego | I'm not saying it's not possible, I can think of several ways to do it, it's just pa performance is somewhat delicate already in regards to calls |
| 09:12.01 | jonwil | if it wasnt for those damn closed-source PulseAudio modules, it would be much easier to solve some of those problems IMO |
| 09:12.11 | jonwil | but all the "good bits" are closed source :( |
| 09:12.14 | alterego | one way would be to make the ke the ringtone a named pipe, then listen on dbus for the incoming call setup and create a gst pipeline to decompress and appsink out to the pipe. |
| 09:13.24 | ruskie | alterego, considering that the ringtone can also be $random file anywhere I don't really see a point... |
| 09:13.35 | RobbieThe1st | Out of curiosity, couldn't we just run say 'mplayer /path/to/ringtone' from a script when there's an incoming call which meets certain criteria? Surely the phone-number's available via Dbus |
| 09:13.38 | ruskie | in that technical reason |
| 09:13.55 | alterego | RobbieThe1st: yes, in theory :) |
| 09:14.18 | RobbieThe1st | 'course, if we need wavs, just stick em in MyDocs - Plenty of space there! |
| 09:14.20 | alterego | That is also an interesting idea |
| 09:14.32 | ruskie | my ringtone is mp3 |
| 09:14.35 | jonwil | Once I find out which binary plays the rintone, I will know how easy it will be to do something about it |
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| 09:14.41 | ruskie | so don't really see why it needs to be wav or where you got that idea |
| 09:14.48 | alterego | Problem is I think the PA policy will mute that line and use the dialer .. |
| 09:15.07 | jonwil | mine is MP3 but the phone copied it as wav |
| 09:15.15 | jonwil | and copied it somewhere |
| 09:15.17 | alterego | ruskie: because it -is- wav, generated from whatever file you select. |
| 09:15.21 | RobbieThe1st | ruskie: mp3 gets decompressed to (essentially) a .wav file before being played. a .wav file is raw audio data mostly |
| 09:15.32 | jacekowski | first thing |
| 09:15.38 | jacekowski | get rid of pulseshit |
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| 09:15.50 | ruskie | alterego, really? where does it store it? |
| 09:15.53 | jonwil | I doubt you could drop PulseAudio and not break the system completly |
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| 09:16.27 | jacekowski | RobbieThe1st: have you seen how long it takes for mplayer to load and read something from mydocs if you have something heavy running |
| 09:16.33 | alterego | ruskie: rootfs (i think) it's for performance. |
| 09:16.42 | ruskie | RobbieThe1st, that sounds broken... if it does before playing it... |
| 09:16.46 | ruskie | alterego, where exactly? |
| 09:16.53 | jacekowski | ruskie: it's not broken |
| 09:16.54 | alterego | ruskie: I don't know, google :P |
| 09:17.05 | ruskie | so you just assume then that this is so? |
| 09:17.09 | jacekowski | no |
| 09:17.14 | jacekowski | that file is there |
| 09:17.16 | alterego | I know it's a wav. |
| 09:17.18 | RobbieThe1st | ruskie: No, I mean simply that's how things work on -any- system. The actual DAC takes raw binary data. |
| 09:17.21 | ruskie | yet nobody knows where... |
| 09:17.24 | alterego | I just don't recall where it is .. |
| 09:17.27 | jacekowski | ruskie: we know where |
| 09:17.50 | RobbieThe1st | ruskie: mp3 is compressed. Whether it gets decoded by a specific chip, or on the CPU, it still gets decoded to raw data before being played. |
| 09:17.52 | alterego | And if you're interested, fucking google. |
| 09:18.06 | alterego | goes for a shower |
| 09:18.07 | pupnik | aplay snd.wav is faster loading than mplayer for e.g. |
| 09:18.13 | pupnik | but the named pipe idea is clever |
| 09:18.23 | jacekowski | no |
| 09:18.27 | jacekowski | it doesn't work |
| 09:18.29 | RobbieThe1st | jacekowski: Yea, I suppose. But that's as much a problem of the IO stuff than anything else |
| 09:18.30 | jacekowski | somebody tried it |
| 09:18.37 | jacekowski | RobbieThe1st: io and cpu |
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| 09:19.08 | alterego | jacekowski: really? oh :( |
| 09:19.13 | jacekowski | that's why if we would recompress stuff as mp3 and have decoder running at -19 nice |
| 09:19.25 | jacekowski | and mlock it |
| 09:19.30 | jacekowski | we could do it |
| 09:19.30 | alterego | I was thinking you'd probably have to always make sure there was data available |
| 09:19.32 | pupnik | jonwil is the only guy actually not-bullshitting atm :) |
| 09:19.40 | RobbieThe1st | jacekowski: I say IO's more of a problem cause we have nice(etc) working to prioritize. With the stock n900, I don't think we have anything like that for io |
| 09:19.48 | RobbieThe1st | ionice is - afaik - not installed |
| 09:20.09 | jonwil | the ringtones are stored in /home/user/.local/share/sounds |
| 09:20.14 | jonwil | thats where the .wavs go |
| 09:20.15 | alterego | pupnik: hey! I'm just telling it like it is :P |
| 09:20.17 | jacekowski | as far as i remember nice -19 sets io prio quite high |
| 09:20.47 | jonwil | The ringtone is set in a config file by the tag ringing.alert.tone |
| 09:20.48 | jacekowski | but ionice isnt'a problem |
| 09:20.53 | jonwil | which is referenced in 4 binaries |
| 09:20.54 | jacekowski | it's single syscall |
| 09:21.00 | jonwil | profiles control panel |
| 09:21.16 | jonwil | make that 3 |
| 09:21.19 | jonwil | hildon plugins notify sv |
| 09:21.23 | ruskie | hmm interesting solution on how to silence ringtones... |
| 09:21.27 | jonwil | and mediaplayer.launch |
| 09:21.31 | ruskie | it actually symlinks them to silence.wav |
| 09:22.08 | ruskie | and from what I can tell it's all kept on the emmc so don't really see a technical limitation for size... |
| 09:22.16 | pupnik | you know the 'rotating lady' illusion - now you can switch it back and forth at will... http://imgur.com/gallery/2LGKQ (OT) |
| 09:22.23 | RobbieThe1st | Hm... Could we setup a script that - upon recieving a call - basically "pauses" all of user's applications, then plays the ringtone? By preventing other stuff from doing IO/using CPU, we ought to be able to get good performance for that |
| 09:22.24 | alterego | ruskie: fair enough |
| 09:23.02 | alterego | ruskie: I presumed it was on root, if it's emmc than that does reduce the burden |
| 09:23.28 | alterego | It may be possible to symlink different tones before the call pipeline is setup. |
| 09:23.33 | ruskie | yeah |
| 09:23.35 | ruskie | was thinking about that |
| 09:23.45 | ruskie | since that's how ringtoned seems to actually work for silent profile as well |
| 09:23.54 | alterego | There's a lot of dbus traffic whilst incoming calls are setup |
| 09:24.02 | jonwil | so /home/user is on emmc? |
| 09:24.06 | alterego | way before the ringtone gets started |
| 09:24.11 | alterego | jonwil: yes |
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| 09:24.30 | alterego | Anyhow, shower time, bbiab |
| 09:24.39 | ruskie | it's part of /home where also /home/opt lives |
| 09:24.40 | jonwil | The easy solution is to either ask Nokia for the source code to Hildon-plugins-notify-sv or to reverse engineer Hildon-plugins-notify-sv ourself and make a functional replacement |
| 09:24.55 | jonwil | since thats where the ringtones come from |
| 09:25.06 | ruskie | the big chunk of space is /home/user/MyDocs which is a separate mount |
| 09:25.22 | ruskie | so basically a lot of stuff in /home/user will reduce /opt space as well |
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| 09:26.00 | psycho_oreos | /home/user only has 2GB so yeah its shared between the two (/home/user and /opt) |
| 09:26.04 | ruskie | still don't get it why nokia then provides their own tunes in .aac if in the end it needs to be cached as wav... |
| 09:26.06 | RobbieThe1st | ^^ |
| 09:26.25 | RobbieThe1st | ruskie: Cause that's how things work at the chip-level? |
| 09:26.42 | ruskie | RobbieThe1st, you're not feeding the chip the raw encoded file |
| 09:26.54 | ruskie | you do: decoder > devicetooutputto |
| 09:27.05 | ruskie | you know.. like any other system does it on the pc mac etc... |
| 09:27.07 | RobbieThe1st | Exactly. You're decoding it(to wav) before outputting it |
| 09:27.16 | ruskie | RobbieThe1st, no in this case it's PRE-decoded as wav |
| 09:27.29 | ruskie | it's not let's take the mp3... and decode it just now to the audio device |
| 09:27.30 | RobbieThe1st | To save CPU time I'd imagine |
| 09:28.04 | RobbieThe1st | They probably intended it to be decoding on the fly... But ran into performance issues and just cached it |
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| 09:29.06 | jonwil | anyone know anything about libplayback or libprofile or profiled or profile-data? |
| 09:29.47 | jonwil | damn, looks like libplayback (whatever that is) is closed source with no -dev package |
| 09:29.53 | jonwil | oh wait there IS a -dev package |
| 09:29.56 | jonwil | GOOD |
| 09:30.27 | jonwil | looks like every package that Hildon-plugins-notify-sv depends on has a -dev package at the very least |
| 09:30.39 | jonwil | which will help with cloning it |
| 09:30.51 | jonwil | the fact that it has a nokia-binaries x86 package also helps |
| 09:31.51 | jonwil | as x86 is easier to reverse engineer than ARM |
| 09:32.07 | jonwil | and its high enough up the OS stack that its unlikely to contain different code for x86 vs ARM |
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| 09:34.20 | jonwil | time to warm up the linux box and pull the plugin from my SDK install |
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| 09:41.10 | jonwil | Lets see how hard this is going to be to clone |
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| 09:51.22 | Jaffa | DocScrutinizer51: jonwil: Did you manage a wiki page, btw? |
| 09:51.32 | jonwil | for what? dialer? no |
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| 09:51.48 | Jaffa | DocScrutinizer51: jonwil: (regarding the closed stuff and who/what/why wanted it open) |
| 09:51.50 | crashanddie | jonwil, what are the advantages of talking to oneself? |
| 09:52.20 | jonwil | I did come up with that wiki btw |
| 09:52.35 | jonwil | tempted to file a bug (and add a wiki entry |
| 09:52.36 | toadpole | hey does the region-specific firmware come with local language support? |
| 09:52.44 | jonwil | related to custom ringtones |
| 09:53.02 | toadpole | on the n900, tha is |
| 09:53.06 | toadpole | *that |
| 09:53.52 | Jaffa | jonwil: URL for the wiki page? |
| 09:53.58 | Jaffa | would like to send it to Nokia |
| 09:54.03 | Jaffa | bergie: ping |
| 09:54.09 | jonwil | http://wiki.maemo.org/index.php?title=Open_development/Why_the_closed_packages#List_of_outstanding_requests_that_are_still_relevant |
| 09:54.24 | Jaffa | jonwil: thanks |
| 09:54.30 | jonwil | Let me handle this custom ringtone thing first before you send it |
| 09:54.42 | jonwil | let me see if there is already a request for the feature |
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| 09:55.38 | jonwil | unlike, say, rtcom-dialer-ui, I dont think libhildon-plugins-notify-sv is out of the relms of possiblity for Nokia to open source |
| 09:56.44 | jonwil | no bug exists, let me file one |
| 10:01.59 | tybollt | < crashanddie> jonwil, what are the advantages of talking to oneself? |
| 10:02.13 | tybollt | That way I always know I'm talking to a complete asshole. :-) |
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| 10:07.16 | jonwil | whats the name of the app that lets you edit contacts? |
| 10:08.50 | Jaffa | jonwil: "Contacts"? |
| 10:09.02 | jonwil | found it, the package is osso-addressbook |
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| 10:13.29 | jonwil | ok, there are too many closed-source back end libraries and other things for it to be possible to store the per-contact ring-tone information with other contact details in the address book |
| 10:13.46 | jonwil | plus I cant see Nokia open sourcing the address book backends anymore than they already have |
| 10:13.49 | jonwil | for all sorts of reasons |
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| 10:18.59 | Jaffa | jonwil: The plugin API, or the use of a dummy "account" might make it work? |
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| 10:19.43 | Khertan1 | Morning |
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| 10:20.57 | *** join/#maemo mairas (~mairas@nat/nokia/x-tpdiluqznhebeusi) |
| 10:21.20 | Khertan1 | a little gui question ... how to display a list of accounts (which is a set of a 6 parameters ... login, password, host, ... ) in a settings dialog. Put them all in a editable qtreeview ? or did you have better idea ? |
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| 10:21.35 | lolcat | N900 for 535USD, new? |
| 10:21.50 | lolcat | Good deal? |
| 10:21.52 | *** join/#maemo jatt (~user@85.115.3.118) |
| 10:22.00 | jatt | can I get "Angry Birds" for free? |
| 10:22.16 | lolcat | I belive there is a free demo with 10 levels |
| 10:22.35 | ruskie | lolcat, erm.. I can get new full 2 year warranty for 180eur ;) |
| 10:23.12 | jatt | did your n900 screen got scratches? |
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| 10:23.47 | lolcat | jatt: Mine had scratches when I got it |
| 10:24.01 | jatt | wow |
| 10:24.02 | lolcat | ruskie: A warranty, I am talking of the phone |
| 10:24.09 | jatt | I meant after using it for a while |
| 10:24.13 | lolcat | jatt: Got it cheap, display model |
| 10:24.21 | jatt | I think is unavoidable? |
| 10:24.51 | jatt | oh, and another question, can you clean the screen with the same stuff you clean laptop screens? |
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| 10:25.07 | lolcat | I clean my screen with the stuff I clean windows with |
| 10:25.11 | jatt | lol |
| 10:25.21 | jatt | I mean the n900 screen |
| 10:26.27 | ruskie | lolcat, I meant a n900 with a full 2 year warranty |
| 10:26.53 | *** join/#maemo dschoepe (~dschoepe@unaffiliated/dschoepe) |
| 10:28.25 | lolcat | jatt: Me too |
| 10:28.31 | lolcat | I clean everything with this shit |
| 10:28.35 | lolcat | Jif Window cleaner |
| 10:28.50 | jonwil | ok, bug 11983 filed |
| 10:28.52 | povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/11983 Open source libhildon-plugins-notify-sv |
| 10:29.12 | *** join/#maemo zogg_ (~zoggrules@bzq-79-182-49-247.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 10:29.39 | jonwil | I dont know if per-contact ringtones will be possible without the dialer and SMS app source (which is what talks to this code) |
| 10:29.46 | jonwil | but its worth looking into |
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| 10:30.35 | jonwil | oh wait I guess our new ringtone thing could register with telepathy and mission-control to pick up all incoming calls and SMSs |
| 10:30.42 | jonwil | including skype etc |
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| 10:33.23 | cos^ | does anyone know how to get sound from flite on command line? |
| 10:33.25 | lolcat | ruskie: How can you get that cheap? |
| 10:34.19 | ruskie | lolcat, second hand... ppl buy it with their contract for 180eur then flog it to others from 180-300eur |
| 10:34.49 | ruskie | but yeah... new not used original everything |
| 10:34.52 | ruskie | including warranty |
| 10:35.03 | lolcat | Hmm |
| 10:35.15 | lolcat | I need a drunkphone! |
| 10:35.30 | ruskie | I'm planing on buying one for somewhere in the 180-300 area this year |
| 10:36.20 | jonwil | Jaffa: http://wiki.maemo.org/Open_development/Why_the_closed_packages#List_of_outstanding_requests_that_are_still_relevant is updated |
| 10:36.27 | jonwil | with the ringtone thing |
| 10:36.32 | pupnik | ruskie: used worn units sell for 200-260 here |
| 10:37.13 | ruskie | pupnik, well here they are new in box... |
| 10:37.32 | ruskie | note 180 is the cheapest I saw(and that's for how much they were being flogged by the cellcos) |
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| 10:37.53 | pupnik | in .ru? |
| 10:37.57 | ruskie | slovenia |
| 10:38.04 | ruskie | don't assume based on nick |
| 10:38.22 | Jaffa | jonwil: Thanks |
| 10:38.59 | ruskie | well not really suprised that the 180 eur deal has been sold already |
| 10:40.07 | ruskie | the next one up after that is 200 for an 8month used... 260 for a new in box with everything |
| 10:40.37 | ruskie | 533eur is the full asking price in store |
| 10:40.40 | psycho_oreos | I wonder if it'll be cheaper if I buy one from one of the asian countries, no I'm not thinking about clones but maybe making a deal with the shop owner to buy one and get one free or the second one at some discount knowing that N900 didn't sell like hotcakes :D |
| 10:42.02 | ruskie | 400eur is the cheapest new from store I can see... |
| 10:42.21 | ruskie | and that is on sale |
| 10:42.35 | jatt | the thing is a mini computer the price is fair |
| 10:44.35 | *** join/#maemo Rarok (~Rarok@107.158.116.91.dynamic.mundo-r.com) |
| 10:44.44 | psycho_oreos | the smartphones these days can also function as a mini computer, plus some of them have better hardware than that of found in N900. |
| 10:45.11 | jonwil | Jaffa: So you are going to push those requests to the right people at Nokia and see if they are possible? |
| 10:45.25 | jonwil | Is there anything on that list that doesnt sound like its possible? |
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| 10:50.20 | lolcat | ruskie: That is around 535USD |
| 10:50.37 | ruskie | what is? |
| 10:50.42 | ruskie | 400 eur? |
| 10:50.44 | lolcat | Yes |
| 10:50.57 | ruskie | 400 Euros = 552.96 U.S. dollars |
| 10:51.15 | ruskie | I guess you could call it a deal |
| 10:51.24 | lolcat | Mine has 5 years warranty! |
| 10:52.50 | ruskie | not manufacturers probably |
| 10:53.09 | lolcat | Country |
| 10:53.12 | lolcat | Wich is bether |
| 10:53.25 | lolcat | They have two attempts to fix an error |
| 10:53.38 | lolcat | if it breaks again I get a refund |
| 10:54.04 | ruskie | erm country? |
| 10:54.14 | lolcat | Norway |
| 10:54.16 | ruskie | also note Which != Wich |
| 10:57.53 | lolcat | Wich wich is wich? |
| 10:58.12 | ruskie | someone actually uses wich as his nickname and tends to point outh that which != wich |
| 10:58.55 | ruskie | wich is actually a variant of wick |
| 10:59.02 | *** join/#maemo kakashi_ (~kakashi_@80.85.106.221) |
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| 11:00.00 | ruskie | while which is what you are looking for |
| 11:00.11 | ruskie | </grammar> |
| 11:00.21 | lolcat | Wick? |
| 11:01.03 | ruskie | www.dict.org |
| 11:01.05 | ruskie | helps ;) |
| 11:04.38 | ruskie | reintegrated his old n95 as an alarm solution... seems to be having more effect now... |
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| 11:09.08 | *** join/#maemo andre__ (~andre@Maemo/community/bugmaster/andre) |
| 11:09.11 | lolcat | What I really want is USB support |
| 11:11.06 | ruskie | you mean OTG? |
| 11:12.31 | SpeedEvil | OTG is not USB host. |
| 11:13.11 | *** join/#maemo arno0ob_ (~arno0ob@af83-2.dd.bearstech.net) |
| 11:13.28 | SpeedEvil | USB host is female, USB OTG is transexual. |
| 11:14.54 | alterego | kinky |
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| 11:16.17 | SpeedEvil | So I suppose the analogy would complete and make the n900 a girl that claimed not to be able to take her strap-on off. |
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| 11:18.23 | jacekowski | rotfl |
| 11:18.39 | jacekowski | thing is that not many people want to deal with trans |
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| 11:46.48 | jatt | you had problems with the micro usb connector? I read it breaks |
| 11:47.35 | ruskie | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/02/25/microsoft_mozilla_do_not_track/ <-- hmm |
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| 11:58.48 | mc_teo | The barman says, "We don't serve time travellers in here." |
| 11:58.48 | mc_teo | A time traveller walks into a bar. |
| 11:59.02 | ruskie | hehe |
| 11:59.18 | pupnik | i think us maemo guys were right in 2006. Nokia needed to make maemo big, and fast |
| 12:00.06 | pupnik | speaking of time travel.. |
| 12:00.37 | LjL | i don't know, i'm not fond of something half open-source half not, but what's for sure is you can't make a half-assed OS, put it on one or two models targeted at geeks, and expect it to become great all by itself |
| 12:01.32 | niala1 | hi, |
| 12:01.45 | ruskie | nokia should have based as much as it could on open source |
| 12:02.09 | pupnik | seen the maemo5 look+feel for N800? it could be running on 400mhz omap2 devices and compete in the featurephone segment today |
| 12:02.11 | ruskie | the only differentiator should have been at the user interface... |
| 12:02.59 | niala1 | question: for a second hand n900, i would know if it's difficult to unlock? |
| 12:03.06 | ruskie | niala1, there is no unlocking |
| 12:03.08 | ruskie | it's not locked |
| 12:03.09 | niala1 | can i do it for free? |
| 12:03.37 | ruskie | there is no unlocking |
| 12:03.38 | niala1 | ok ty. now just wait for the seller. grmpf :) |
| 12:03.46 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: yes, there is |
| 12:03.57 | ruskie | Venemo_N900, I'm assuming he meant operator locking |
| 12:03.58 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (~ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 12:04.10 | niala1 | yes operator locking |
| 12:04.14 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: yeah. N900s can be operator locked |
| 12:04.31 | ruskie | well I would assume any GSM device can be operator locked |
| 12:04.32 | jacekowski | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/10/14/nokia_dilbert/ |
| 12:04.38 | jatt | change the sim, done |
| 12:04.40 | niala1 | i don't know maybe it's not, i havent see it now |
| 12:04.48 | ruskie | but just because it can be... doesn't mean it will be |
| 12:04.49 | jatt | change operator, done |
| 12:04.52 | Venemo_N900 | this is why there is an option to "enter code to remove operator lock" in the settings app menu |
| 12:04.59 | ruskie | I haven't seen an operator locked n900 atm... |
| 12:05.06 | ruskie | Venemo_N900, there is? |
| 12:05.14 | ruskie | where??? |
| 12:05.50 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: settings app, app menu |
| 12:05.51 | ruskie | I don't see it... and I would assume it would be visible... |
| 12:05.54 | jacekowski | ruskie: n900 can be operator locked |
| 12:05.57 | jacekowski | ruskie: and some are locked |
| 12:06.08 | niala1 | I note. so, i suppose it's possible? |
| 12:06.13 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: tap the titlebar of the settings app |
| 12:06.20 | jacekowski | ruskie: like any other rapuyama, rap3g, and similiar phones |
| 12:06.31 | ruskie | jacekowski, as said... I would assume any GSM device can be locked |
| 12:06.41 | ruskie | Venemo_N900, hmm... Enter SIM unlock code ? |
| 12:07.08 | jatt | the phone cannot be locked, the sim card can be locked |
| 12:07.09 | niala1 | ok if it's possible to lock it's possible to unlock. or i must verify that first? |
| 12:07.27 | niala1 | i have my own sim |
| 12:08.04 | *** join/#maemo povbot (~supybot@office.pov.lt) |
| 12:08.05 | jatt | just type your password |
| 12:08.10 | jacekowski | jatt: no |
| 12:08.13 | jatt | to unlock it |
| 12:08.14 | MohammadAG | timeless_w7ip, ping |
| 12:08.14 | jacekowski | jatt: phone can be locked |
| 12:08.15 | *** join/#maemo Treibholz (~treibholz@sozial-inkompetent.de) |
| 12:08.18 | MohammadAG | or timeless_office |
| 12:08.28 | jatt | what? where |
| 12:08.34 | jacekowski | jatt: by operator |
| 12:08.45 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: see topleft button in http://i51.tinypic.com/anlwug.png |
| 12:08.50 | Treibholz | has anybody ever got xbmc-potato to work? |
| 12:08.55 | jacekowski | niala1: no public unlock is available at the moment |
| 12:08.59 | *** join/#maemo mgedmin (~mg@office.pov.lt) |
| 12:09.06 | ruskie | Venemo_N900, ahh I have community translation installed... |
| 12:09.11 | ruskie | odd that it calls it SIM unlock |
| 12:09.28 | jacekowski | ruskie: because it's called simlock |
| 12:09.38 | jacekowski | ruskie: it locks phone to sims from specific operator |
| 12:09.39 | niala1 | jacekowski: so if it's locked i musn't buy it ? |
| 12:09.44 | jacekowski | niala1: yeah |
| 12:09.52 | jacekowski | niala1: but it's very unlikely that it's locked |
| 12:10.28 | *** join/#maemo jonwil (~jonwil@27-33-137-199.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 12:11.38 | niala1 | I'll burn a candle then to the god of Gsm |
| 12:11.59 | niala1 | thank you all |
| 12:12.32 | Venemo_N900 | niala1: try it with your sim before buying |
| 12:13.25 | niala1 | yep i must think of bring them |
| 12:20.02 | *** join/#maemo n900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 12:22.40 | jonwil | Was the N900 ever sold locked to a particular carrier? |
| 12:23.23 | Venemo_N900 | jonwil: I can't account for every carrier that sold it, but I'd say it's likely |
| 12:23.43 | jonwil | That depends on whether the N900 supports the feature in the first place |
| 12:23.54 | jonwil | I havent seen any evidence that it does |
| 12:24.28 | Treibholz | I thought they didn't want to sell it because you can do to much with it. |
| 12:24.30 | *** join/#maemo the_lord (~david@190.114.240.2) |
| 12:24.33 | Venemo_N900 | jonwil: see http://i51.tinypic.com/anlwug.png or read scrollback |
| 12:24.46 | jonwil | ok, so it does |
| 12:24.59 | Venemo_N900 | jonwil: why would there be a "remove operator lock" feature if it didn't support operator locks? |
| 12:27.01 | Treibholz | I have this option on my device, too. But it definitelly has no SIM-lock. |
| 12:27.51 | Venemo_N900 | yeah, mine doesn't either |
| 12:28.11 | *** join/#maemo suresh_ (~suresh@a88-112-2-112.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 12:28.15 | ruskie | from what I understand the only limitation for operators was no custom firmware |
| 12:28.40 | ruskie | and I'm assuming SIM locking is part of the GSM stack so that's where the locking/unlocking would actually happen |
| 12:30.30 | *** join/#maemo bergie (~bergie@78.142.159.230) |
| 12:32.19 | Khertan1 | hu ... i ve this menu too |
| 12:33.40 | *** join/#maemo smooph (~smooph@e180133153.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 12:33.49 | ruskie | well I'm 100% sure mine isn't locked since I actually bought it direct from the nokia distributor here |
| 12:34.02 | ruskie | long long before any cellco here had any interest in the device |
| 12:34.08 | Venemo_N900 | yeah |
| 12:34.11 | ruskie | took them like 9 months or so to even start offering it |
| 12:34.34 | Venemo_N900 | I bought mine used from an auction site a year ago |
| 12:34.52 | lolcat | Venemo_N900: How much? |
| 12:35.01 | lolcat | I can't get windows 95 to boot properly |
| 12:35.08 | *** join/#maemo auenf (David@171.72.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 12:35.19 | Venemo_N900 | lolcat: 120 000 HUF, a year ago |
| 12:35.52 | *** join/#maemo briglia (~briglia@187.58.101.14) |
| 12:35.54 | *** join/#maemo bmidgley_ (~bmidgley@c-76-27-89-77.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 12:36.03 | lolcat | HUF never heard of that kind of money |
| 12:36.13 | ruskie | hungarian |
| 12:36.16 | ruskie | forint iirc |
| 12:36.45 | Venemo_N900 | correct |
| 12:36.46 | ruskie | 440 eur or so |
| 12:37.55 | Venemo_N900 | it was around 440 EUR |
| 12:38.06 | Venemo_N900 | sorry, o |
| 12:38.20 | Venemo_N900 | just calculated it with a conversion site |
| 12:38.24 | Venemo_N900 | it was 420 eur |
| 12:38.35 | Venemo_N900 | fairly reasonable price a year ago |
| 12:38.51 | lolcat | My N900 just shut down without a reason :( |
| 12:38.58 | MohammadAG | overclocked? |
| 12:39.15 | lolcat | Maybe a little... |
| 12:39.17 | ruskie | hehe |
| 12:39.54 | lolcat | Good I got that offer for a new N900 then xD |
| 12:40.40 | Khertan1 | uh ... nokia.fr didn't sell anymore n900 |
| 12:40.53 | lolcat | Crap, it won't boot xD |
| 12:44.04 | lolcat | You think it is dead forever? :P |
| 12:44.22 | ruskie | tried charging it? |
| 12:44.28 | Venemo_N900 | lolcat: evidence that ocing will kill your phone |
| 12:44.32 | lolcat | Good thinking |
| 12:44.48 | Venemo_N900 | lolcat: DocScrutinizer will be happy to see this. yours is the first one :) |
| 12:45.05 | lolcat | It shows the Nokia logo and then it dies xD |
| 12:45.15 | lolcat | I got to the loading this time |
| 12:45.31 | *** join/#maemo Rarok (~Rarok@65.99.165.83.dynamic.mundo-r.com) |
| 12:45.37 | lolcat | Which(?) means the cpu works |
| 12:45.45 | Venemo_N900 | lolcat: a pity |
| 12:45.46 | Venemo_N900 | lolcat: try a reflash |
| 12:45.47 | lolcat | I killed my laptop in a similar fashion |
| 12:46.02 | jonwil | would never overclock something |
| 12:46.13 | ruskie | suggest plug in to decent power... then leave it for some 5 minutes charging |
| 12:46.16 | ruskie | THEN try booting it up |
| 12:46.17 | lolcat | Venemo_N900: Migth have an empty battery, it was several houres since last time I charged it xD |
| 12:46.33 | Khertan1 | 379 euros ... best price in france |
| 12:46.35 | Khertan1 | http://www.ldlc.com/fiche/PB00102133.html?ao=15 |
| 12:46.42 | Khertan1 | i found that still a bit high |
| 12:46.42 | ruskie | is happy he can run his n900 for a few days |
| 12:46.54 | lolcat | ruskie: Custom battery? |
| 12:47.12 | ruskie | nope |
| 12:47.23 | ruskie | sw tweaks is all |
| 12:47.29 | lolcat | Oo |
| 12:47.43 | ruskie | default switch to 2G, auto disconnect, no mail checking, no IM |
| 12:47.55 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: what tweaks? |
| 12:48.01 | ruskie | and I think the display is set to 4/5 |
| 12:48.01 | lolcat | Yeah, it booted! |
| 12:48.15 | ruskie | Venemo_N900, atleast those ;) |
| 12:48.24 | ruskie | disabled a pile of auto-start apps |
| 12:48.37 | Venemo_N900 | ruskie: which ones? and how? |
| 12:48.40 | ruskie | I can wait 5 seconds longer to start an app... no need to prelead it for me... |
| 12:48.44 | ruskie | editing .desktop files |
| 12:48.54 | ruskie | there's a pile of apps that are preloaded |
| 12:49.06 | ruskie | browser, modest, iirc phone... and some others |
| 12:49.26 | lolcat | Shouldn't phone be preloaded |
| 12:49.35 | lolcat | ? |
| 12:49.36 | timeless_office | psycho_oreos: the versions of microb for the n900 support xul. the addons dialog is xul |
| 12:49.55 | ruskie | lolcat, well I think I left that one to be preloaded |
| 12:50.11 | timeless_office | but note that 'xul' is usually meant to mean '.xul', whereas 'libxul' is just "gecko" |
| 12:50.13 | ruskie | but generally I hate things to be preloaded... |
| 12:50.25 | lolcat | Ok GUYS! This wasn't a OC thing! I simply used all the battery! |
| 12:50.32 | timeless_office | i didn't write microB on my own fwiw, i'm just one of the people involved |
| 12:50.51 | lolcat | Not strange really, I used 805mhz at 95%+ for an houre or two |
| 12:50.57 | Venemo_N900 | hehe |
| 12:50.59 | Venemo_N900 | anyway |
| 12:51.01 | ruskie | would be nice if microb actually supported ssl client certs properly :( |
| 12:51.04 | Venemo_N900 | I have to leave now |
| 12:51.30 | timeless_office | javispedro, docscrutinizer: it wasn't a failure to nickserv, it was a nick collision w/ a ghost during a net-split merge |
| 12:52.26 | *** join/#maemo NIN101 (~NIN101@p5DD283C7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 12:52.26 | lolcat | Is there a way to get the programs I don't use in a folder? |
| 12:52.32 | lolcat | I have too many icons |
| 12:52.43 | *** join/#maemo trupheenix_ (~trupheeni@nat/nokia/x-oucvgdpwbspuwxrl) |
| 12:52.58 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (~murrayc@85.183.48.167) |
| 12:53.04 | *** join/#maemo GNUtoo|laptop (~gnutoo@host68-143-dynamic.54-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:53.14 | timeless_office | mohammadag: pong? |
| 12:53.18 | lolcat | ruskie: Where is teh .desktop file? |
| 12:53.33 | ruskie | /usr/share/applications/ |
| 12:53.35 | ruskie | under there |
| 12:53.43 | Khertan1 | lolcat: /usr/share/applications/hildon/ |
| 12:55.11 | *** join/#maemo bazi (~bazi@188-195-7-143-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 12:55.40 | lolcat | It is not a single file to edit? |
| 12:56.10 | ruskie | no |
| 12:56.10 | jonwil | ok, I confirmed the operator lock stuff is done by a packet sent to the cell modem (as I suspected :) |
| 12:56.11 | ruskie | multiple |
| 12:56.36 | ruskie | lolcat, examine the phone.desktop file whatever it is |
| 12:56.38 | Khertan1 | jonwil: so locking n900 is possible ... |
| 12:56.40 | ruskie | you should see some X- stuff |
| 12:56.45 | jonwil | yes it is |
| 12:56.45 | ruskie | iirc |
| 12:56.53 | Khertan1 | jonwil: ouch ... |
| 12:57.09 | jonwil | it would only be locked if it was bought from a carrier who wanted it locked |
| 12:57.39 | Khertan1 | jonwil: so ... the french azerty edition's are all unlocked ... no carrier sell it :) |
| 12:58.35 | jonwil | mine is definatly unlocked |
| 13:00.08 | ruskie | http://www.reghardware.com/2011/02/25/mobile_phones_becomes_speakers_at_gigs/ <-- O.o N900 mentioned |
| 13:00.22 | lolcat | I installed Opera and FF 4 beta |
| 13:00.48 | ruskie | wants vimprobable2 on his n900... |
| 13:01.17 | jonwil | wants Nano on his N900 |
| 13:01.23 | Khertan1 | a little gui question ... how to display a list of accounts (which is a set of a 6 parameters ... login, password, host, ... ) in a settings dialog. Put them all in a editable qtreeview ? or did you have better idea ? |
| 13:01.29 | ruskie | jonwil, that's dead easy |
| 13:01.46 | Khertan1 | apt-get install nano |
| 13:01.47 | jonwil | actually nano would be useless due to lack of a ctrl key |
| 13:01.48 | Khertan1 | :) |
| 13:01.53 | jonwil | or rather easy-to-get-at ctrl key |
| 13:01.59 | ruskie | jonwil, there is a ctrl key |
| 13:02.01 | lolcat | You have a ctrl key |
| 13:02.02 | jonwil | oh yeah right |
| 13:02.10 | lolcat | I discovered it today xD |
| 13:02.21 | Khertan1 | vim is difficult as it s lack an escape key |
| 13:02.22 | lolcat | I have had the n900 for several months |
| 13:02.57 | ruskie | Khertan1, not really |
| 13:03.03 | jonwil | heh, I can even begin to imagine the horror that would flow from emacs-on-n900 |
| 13:03.24 | ruskie | has Ctrl Tab Esc Up Dn ~ | > keys in xterm bar |
| 13:03.37 | ruskie | erm PgUp PgDn |
| 13:03.46 | Khertan1 | ruskie: it s not key it s shortcut |
| 13:03.55 | Khertan1 | and slower to use :) |
| 13:04.00 | ruskie | Khertan1, I think I might have bound it to a key combo as well |
| 13:04.09 | ruskie | aka changed the keymap |
| 13:04.16 | Khertan1 | ruskie: i ve code my own editor :) |
| 13:04.18 | ruskie | but no... it's not slower to use |
| 13:04.18 | pupnik | "I worked for Nokia..in an effort to show how S40 could be re-used on smartphones a clever little group installed embedded linux, with QT, and managed to get S40 running on it. The whole hack made it look like a linux phone, but all the S40 stuff people liked did not have to be re-written or ported - it was taken as-is." |
| 13:04.49 | Khertan1 | pupnik: gnié? |
| 13:04.56 | ruskie | ? |
| 13:05.25 | pupnik | Khertan1: i'm just reading from article comments on theregister.co.uk |
| 13:05.33 | Khertan1 | so you got the unliked look like of a linux phone with the lack of feature of s40 |
| 13:05.35 | Khertan1 | ? |
| 13:06.28 | ruskie | s40 is a good stack |
| 13:06.37 | pupnik | "Let's not forget that WinPho7 is - natch - the 7th iteration of Mobile Windows. And under its achingly edgy UI, it's still a pile of steaming badger kidneys." hahah |
| 13:06.52 | lolcat | Could we run S60 on our phone? |
| 13:07.18 | ruskie | lolcat, why? |
| 13:07.26 | lolcat | ruskie: Spotify offline |
| 13:07.27 | jonwil | you couldn't pay me to use a Windows Phone 7, Symbian or IOS phone |
| 13:08.05 | ruskie | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/02/25/tfl_nfc/ <-- fun... now you can get scammed by the transport authority... I think I'll stick to having a separate card for everything... |
| 13:08.36 | ruskie | not to mention last I checked the human rights specify I can haz right to anonymous travel... which means no you can't have my CC info to track me by... |
| 13:08.48 | ruskie | why are people so stupid and want to give up their rights... |
| 13:09.27 | jonwil | I like the N900 because you can program it in C/C++, to program iOS I would need to learn the bastardized piece of crap known as Objective-C |
| 13:10.06 | ruskie | jonwil, isn't ObjC just C with a few objective pecific additions? |
| 13:10.21 | jonwil | its C with a rather crappy OOP later on top |
| 13:10.29 | ruskie | and C++ is? |
| 13:10.42 | jonwil | C++ is far nicer than Objective-C |
| 13:10.43 | *** join/#maemo arno0ob (~arno0ob@nor75-32-78-237-172-37.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:10.46 | ruskie | C with a weird syntax and crappy OOP layer on top... ;) |
| 13:11.06 | ruskie | if it's based on C it will always have crappy OOP layer on top |
| 13:11.30 | derf | I hate C++ with burning fire of a thousand suns, but even I agree ObjectiveC is crap in comparison. |
| 13:12.58 | ruskie | I'd say each has their strengths and weaknesses |
| 13:13.37 | derf | Until iOS, ObjectiveC's primary strength was that nobody used it. |
| 13:14.29 | ruskie | derf, you mean other than MacOS? |
| 13:14.30 | jonwil | JAVA is even worse |
| 13:14.43 | ruskie | and NeXT |
| 13:14.48 | *** join/#maemo kwtm (~kwtm1@adsl-75-61-98-203.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 13:15.19 | jonwil | C# |
| 13:15.23 | jonwil | is worse still |
| 13:15.41 | ruskie | C# line for line looks almost exactly like JAVA |
| 13:15.56 | *** join/#maemo zogg_ (~zoggrules@bzq-79-182-49-247.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 13:16.18 | derf | ruskie: Exactly. Nobody. |
| 13:16.40 | crashanddie | how about you take the trollfest to somewhere people care? |
| 13:16.55 | lolcat | Why won't dosbox in debian use the dosbox in maemo's config |
| 13:17.00 | lolcat | Where should I copy it too? |
| 13:17.12 | ruskie | crashanddie, as soon as you point out the trollfest |
| 13:17.18 | ruskie | crashanddie, we're simply having a nice civil debate |
| 13:17.28 | crashanddie | C# vs Java vs MacOS |
| 13:17.31 | ruskie | since the rest of the channel seems to be quiet |
| 13:18.08 | pupnik | crashanddie trolls with the best of them |
| 13:18.10 | crashanddie | you're still mightily offtopic, and purposefully discussing topics that will raise something out of people, so just put a cork on it, will ya? |
| 13:18.44 | crashanddie | pupnik, I think we're both roughly on the same troll-scale gradient ;) |
| 13:19.29 | lolcat | ruskie: Do you know? |
| 13:19.36 | MohammadAG | there's nothing wrong with having an opinion about a language |
| 13:20.16 | crashanddie | MohammadAG, unless you argue that opinion with mere triviality rather than facts |
| 13:21.07 | crashanddie | MohammadAG, and claiming that a language is shit because "nobody uses it", or "it looks like crap", is about as righteous as saying the Mona Lisa is a crap piece of art because she's not asian |
| 13:21.31 | crashanddie | 'nuff said |
| 13:21.50 | ruskie | crashanddie, yet all of those are valid opinions ;) |
| 13:21.54 | ruskie | an opinion does not require to be technical to be valid |
| 13:22.29 | crashanddie | "Opinions are like assholes, everyone got them. Still no reason for you to shove them up under other people's noses for inspection" |
| 13:22.47 | ruskie | glad to hear your opinion about everything |
| 13:23.02 | ruskie | since you opinioned on the whole debate that it's a trollfest |
| 13:23.04 | crashanddie | you're about 30 seconds away from getting banned. And that's a fact. |
| 13:23.23 | ruskie | that would be a first |
| 13:23.52 | Jaffa | It's doubly off-topic because none of C#, Java or Mac OS run on Maemo or Maemo devices well. |
| 13:24.08 | crashanddie | Has anyone ever tried porting Mono to Maemo? |
| 13:24.09 | lolcat | can write C# |
| 13:24.19 | kerio | lolcat: but can you write LOLCODE? |
| 13:24.23 | lolcat | At least in theory |
| 13:24.32 | ruskie | http://www.mono-project.com/Mono:ARM |
| 13:24.33 | Jaffa | (and, FFS, if you're going to try and look all knowledgable about the pros & cons of different languages, at least learn that "Java" is not an acronym, and not CAPITALISED) |
| 13:24.39 | MohammadAG | canhaz <Qt> |
| 13:24.44 | kerio | hmm, why should someone learn C# instead of java? |
| 13:24.45 | lolcat | kerio: Not really, had a class on C#. 4 houres a week for a year |
| 13:24.45 | crashanddie | Jaffa++ |
| 13:24.49 | MohammadAG | kerio, see, I can) |
| 13:24.56 | Jaffa | crashanddie: There was a port, IIRC. But it got as much traction as the Java port. |
| 13:25.08 | crashanddie | kerio, mainly because some vendors only provide C# APIs |
| 13:25.13 | ruskie | http://www.mono-project.com/Maemo <-- to be precise |
| 13:25.16 | kerio | MohammadAG: that's not lolcode |
| 13:25.26 | crashanddie | kerio, and AFAICT, you can use Java classes from C#, but not the other way around. |
| 13:25.27 | Jaffa | Primarily because of: a) no (decent) JIT; b) lack of GUI bindings |
| 13:25.30 | lolcat | kerio: Most of the time I got errors it was because I forgott what language I was writing. VB and C# apparently has very diffrent syntaxes |
| 13:25.34 | kerio | MohammadAG: CAN HAS QT? |
| 13:25.43 | MohammadAG | Qt* |
| 13:25.46 | Jaffa | crashanddie: Presumably you could drop to C#'s equivalent of JNI and then back up through JNI to Java? |
| 13:25.49 | kerio | lolcat: of course, one is visual basic and the other is java |
| 13:25.58 | crashanddie | Jaffa, hardly |
| 13:26.02 | kerio | MohammadAG: STDIO is full caps, so i assume Qt is too |
| 13:26.12 | Jaffa | not done much with C#, fortunately. |
| 13:26.16 | MohammadAG | QT sucks kerio |
| 13:26.20 | MohammadAG | Qt otoh... |
| 13:26.30 | kerio | why should someone learn C# or java instead of python? |
| 13:26.31 | Jaffa | Why is QuickTime sucking kerio? |
| 13:26.35 | *** join/#maemo SmilyOrg (Smily@BSN-61-108-18.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 13:26.43 | MohammadAG | said that |
| 13:26.51 | Jaffa | kerio: Because the job markets for C# and Java are about a bazillion times more wide and highly paying? |
| 13:26.55 | MohammadAG | last time I used QT it took over all my MIMEs |
| 13:27.01 | crashanddie | Jaffa, this one guy made a Java compiler entirely in C#, so that you can take any .class file and you'll get a .dll instead, with the whole lot usable from C#. I used it and it's pretty awesome. |
| 13:27.19 | MohammadAG | any dbus pros around? |
| 13:27.26 | *** join/#maemo schend (~suresh@a88-112-2-112.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:27.29 | kerio | Jaffa: lies :< |
| 13:27.32 | xkr47 | kerio, because they are faster? |
| 13:27.35 | ruskie | Jaffa, according to some ozzie research doing stuff like Delphi, Foxpro, Cobol can get you a $500/hour paying job |
| 13:27.36 | kerio | xkr47: not really |
| 13:27.47 | xkr47 | really |
| 13:27.52 | kerio | pypy is about as fast as java 6 steady state |
| 13:27.53 | crashanddie | ruskie, in a very limited pool of opportunities |
| 13:27.58 | ruskie | crashanddie, true |
| 13:28.06 | kerio | also there are no slow languages, just slow implementations |
| 13:28.08 | ruskie | and specificaly in australia |
| 13:28.10 | Jaffa | kerio: If you're a hobbyist programmer, use a language that's available on the platform your hobby targets. For Maemo, that's Python. For desktop Windows, C# or Java would probably be better. For desktop Windows, it's probably a three way tie |
| 13:28.15 | thp | MohammadAG: what's the d-bus problem? |
| 13:28.15 | xkr47 | kerio, exactly |
| 13:28.52 | MohammadAG | thp, solved |
| 13:29.16 | crashanddie | kerio, actually, that's not entirely true. A language with sloppy typecasting will always be slower than a heavily typed language, simply because any kind of comparison, stack inspection or operation won't have to do conversions... |
| 13:29.16 | Jaffa | ruskie: I don't claim there aren't high-paying jobs out there for obscure languages like Delphi (hell, we use(d) Delphi here). My point is that the total salary of all Java developers will be higher than the total salary of all paid Python developers; because there are so many more jobs in it. |
| 13:29.16 | MohammadAG | thp, sorry about that :P |
| 13:29.31 | lcuk | Jaffa, of course, my hobby language was ASM |
| 13:29.33 | kerio | crashanddie: so python is fast! :D |
| 13:29.41 | xkr47 | why would I learn python.. |
| 13:29.54 | ruskie | Jaffa, yes but the person getting a job will only be interested in how much they can get ;) |
| 13:29.55 | *** join/#maemo MadViking (~user@dsl-roibrasgw1-ff96c100-143.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:30.22 | xkr47 | kerio, well there is of course jython :-) |
| 13:30.24 | ruskie | needs to learn to learn languages... |
| 13:30.25 | Khertan1 | a little gui question ... how to display a list of accounts (which is a set of a 6 parameters ... login, password, host, ... ) in a settings dialog. Put them all in a editable qtreeview ? or did you have better idea ? |
| 13:30.28 | Jaffa | lcuk: BBC BASIC, 6502 assembler, ARM assembler, Perl and now it's a mix of shell scripting; Perl; Python; Java; Groovy |
| 13:30.55 | MohammadAG | Venemo, replacement dialog ready, is Qt Animation framework easy? |
| 13:31.00 | xkr47 | Jaffa, you should try bytecode languages :-) |
| 13:31.11 | thp | MohammadAG: ;) |
| 13:31.23 | crashanddie | kerio, it also lacks all of the enterprise features that Java offers... Go ask IBM to dump PI or JHI or RFT on your Python app, just for shits and giggles ;) |
| 13:31.28 | Jaffa | xkr47: I've done a tiny bit of Java bytecode manipulation ;-) |
| 13:31.31 | *** join/#maemo baraujo (~Bruno@189.2.128.130) |
| 13:31.37 | *** join/#maemo djszapi (~lpapp@plexyplanet.org) |
| 13:31.40 | xkr47 | Jaffa, yeah it's fun :) |
| 13:31.57 | djszapi | How can I open a chat window up inside the gmail account from the left side with my N900 ? |
| 13:31.57 | *** join/#maemo trx (~ns-team@194.247.207.155) |
| 13:32.01 | xkr47 | Jaffa, should investigate other ones as well, like the perl6 bytecodes and c# etc |
| 13:32.04 | thp | Khertan1: 6 rows of label + text entry pairs, or text entry with "default" (gray) text without labels? |
| 13:32.09 | djszapi | I am trying the one, double click with stylus, but nothing happens regarding that. |
| 13:32.18 | Khertan1 | Jaffa: i know some well paid python dev working in finance that get arround same than 15 java dev together :) |
| 13:32.18 | Jaffa | kerio: The obstinance of typical open source developers to look beyond there own trivial projects at the massive amount of money and investment in ecosystems like Java constantly surprises me. |
| 13:32.38 | Jaffa | xkr47: I still follow Parrot with interest and fascination |
| 13:32.39 | MohammadAG | thp, do you know how to get the string here in Qt? |
| 13:32.48 | xkr47 | Jaffa, agreed on both :) |
| 13:32.48 | Khertan1 | thp: on the small screen of the n900 ... difficult to see what it ll render |
| 13:32.48 | MohammadAG | signal sender=:1.19 -> dest=(null destination) serial=8361 path=/com/nokia/csd/call; interface=com.nokia.csd.Call; member=Coming |
| 13:32.48 | MohammadAG | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:32.48 | MohammadAG | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:33.07 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (~aloisio@187.58.101.14) |
| 13:33.22 | thp | MohammadAG: "string here in qt"? |
| 13:33.31 | Jaffa | Khertan1: As I said, some Python devs get paid a lot. So do some Java devs. Most aren't rich beyond the dreams of avarice, but there are more Java jobs out there. |
| 13:33.32 | *** join/#maemo auenf (David@171.72.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 13:33.35 | crashanddie | Jaffa, that before-last sentence didn't compute with me |
| 13:33.38 | kerio | Jaffa: yeah, stupid open source programmers that nobody pays, working on their hobbies instead of focusing on enterprise |
| 13:33.40 | derf | I still maintain that Java is an excellent language for mediocre programmers. |
| 13:33.44 | MohammadAG | thp, the string from that dbus message |
| 13:33.54 | Khertan1 | thp my problem isn't coding the things ... but found something that is readable :) |
| 13:33.55 | derf | Which is good, because there are a lot of mediocre programmers. |
| 13:34.00 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (~mlpug@a88-115-171-217.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:34.09 | Khertan1 | Jaffa: depends on functional domain ... |
| 13:34.15 | Jaffa | crashanddie: I've met lots of people online (different IRC channels, talkers, /.) who say things like "nobody uses Java" |
| 13:34.15 | crashanddie | derf, agreed |
| 13:34.25 | kerio | lots of people use java |
| 13:34.28 | kerio | it doesn't mean they should |
| 13:34.33 | crashanddie | Jaffa, oh, right. |
| 13:34.47 | crashanddie | kerio, to be very brutally honest, there is no alternative. |
| 13:34.49 | crashanddie | As simply as that. |
| 13:34.50 | thp | MohammadAG: in the normal d-bus python bindings, you'll add a signal receiver / filter (don't know the terms in QtDBus) |
| 13:34.51 | Khertan1 | Jaffa: and there is far more dev ... so it s difficult to catch attention of employer |
| 13:35.12 | Khertan1 | s/is/are |
| 13:35.41 | MohammadAG | thp, ui->numberLabel->setText(message.arguments()[1].toString()); |
| 13:35.45 | MohammadAG | that was easy :p |
| 13:35.56 | Khertan1 | MohammadAG: toString() ???? |
| 13:36.00 | Khertan1 | MohammadAG: beurk |
| 13:36.12 | MohammadAG | why? |
| 13:36.13 | thp | oh, so you already received the message |
| 13:36.38 | crashanddie | kerio, the simple mind boggling amount of absolutely fantastic tools that help any big (300k+ SLOC) application to understand where the bottleneck is, how to streamline the processes involved, and visualise every single piece information through bite-sized chunks is enough to convince me that Java is still one heck of a language |
| 13:37.01 | thp | Khertan1: it's a QVariant |
| 13:37.08 | Khertan1 | MohammadAG: use sip api2 |
| 13:37.15 | Khertan1 | faster ... better ... stronger ... |
| 13:37.18 | MohammadAG | sip? |
| 13:37.19 | Khertan1 | (and maintained) |
| 13:37.19 | crashanddie | harder |
| 13:37.20 | lcuk | what language do they use on the shuttle? |
| 13:37.27 | Khertan1 | MohammadAG: or pyside |
| 13:37.31 | crashanddie | lcuk, good question |
| 13:37.36 | MohammadAG | Khertan1, this is C++, why should I use Python |
| 13:37.44 | Khertan1 | MohammadAG: ah ... oups sorry :) |
| 13:37.54 | lcuk | I believe the computer systems are dual coded by different teams in completely different environments |
| 13:37.56 | Khertan1 | you still need to do conv and type casting so :) |
| 13:37.57 | MohammadAG | lol no worries |
| 13:38.09 | crashanddie | lcuk, "HAL/S is a real-time aerospace programming language, best known for its use in the Space Shuttle program. It was designed by Intermetrics in the 1970s for NASA. HAL/S is written in XPL, a dialect of PL/I." |
| 13:38.12 | *** join/#maemo MadViking (~user@dsl-roibrasgw1-ff96c100-143.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:38.13 | lcuk | and then deployed to different machines |
| 13:38.16 | crashanddie | They fucking named their programming language HAL |
| 13:38.30 | lcuk | that is because NASA are simply awesome. |
| 13:38.53 | Khertan1 | GOTO++ Will rulez all !!!! |
| 13:38.54 | crashanddie | "HAL/S has native support for integers, floating point scalars, vector, matrices, booleans and strings of 8-bit characters, limited to a maximum length of 255. Structured types may be composed using a DECLARE STRUCT statement." |
| 13:39.10 | Khertan1 | http://www.gotopp.org/index.html.en |
| 13:39.13 | lcuk | so, no unicode on the shuttle |
| 13:39.15 | crashanddie | which explains why it took them so long to accept foreign astronauts, the system would segfault on UTF-8 characters |
| 13:39.20 | kerio | hahaha |
| 13:39.31 | *** join/#maemo smooph1 (~smooph@e180163225.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:39.34 | ruskie | fun |
| 13:39.35 | lcuk | heh |
| 13:39.49 | lardman | what was it used for? Design of the craft or on-board systems? |
| 13:40.15 | *** join/#maemo markinfo (~marek@dhcp09.algebra.tuwien.ac.at) |
| 13:40.23 | crashanddie | "The three key principles in designing the language were reliability, efficiency, and machine-independence. The language is designed to allow aerospace-related tasks (such as vector/matrix arithmetic) to be accomplished in a way that is easily understandable to people who have spaceflight knowledge, but may not necessarily have proficiency with computer programming." |
| 13:40.28 | lcuk | lardman, onboard systems afaik |
| 13:41.20 | crashanddie | "For instance, the letter 'C' in the first column indicates that the whole line is a comment and should be ignored by the compiler." |
| 13:41.27 | crashanddie | So much for variables or statements that begin with C |
| 13:41.27 | lardman | seems fair |
| 13:41.41 | lardman | you even program in FORTRAN crashanddie? |
| 13:41.41 | lcuk | crashanddie, does that mean everything you say should be ignored by the compiler :P |
| 13:41.47 | lardman | s/even/ever |
| 13:41.52 | crashanddie | lardman, nope |
| 13:42.04 | crashanddie | lcuk, not a capital C... Close, but no cigar. |
| 13:42.07 | *** join/#maemo SmilyOrg (Smily@BSN-61-108-18.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 13:42.08 | lardman | well be happy then ;) |
| 13:42.17 | markinfo | Hi. I am testing html5 videos on youtube with Firefox mobil at nokia n900. But it seems terribly slow - nearly unusable. Is there any chance it will be better? |
| 13:42.43 | crashanddie | markinfo, well, it would probably need hardware acceleration, which is unlikely in the near future |
| 13:43.01 | lcuk | markinfo, how well do youtube videos work direct from the website on your other mobile devices? |
| 13:43.08 | derf | markinfo: Do the videos play okay outside of YouTube? |
| 13:43.12 | *** join/#maemo MadViking (~user@dsl-roibrasgw1-ff96c100-143.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:43.13 | Khertan1 | the better command of the GOTO++ : GOTOGOTO() %label |
| 13:43.25 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (~aloisio@187.58.101.14) |
| 13:43.30 | *** join/#maemo lauri (~lauri@194.203.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee) |
| 13:43.30 | lolcat | How do I reduce the voltage? |
| 13:43.39 | lcuk | finds youtube actually plays well enough to be watchable on n900 :) |
| 13:43.45 | Khertan1 | there is 50% chance of jumping to the label ... and 50% to jump randomly in the code :) |
| 13:43.47 | markinfo | lcuk, you mean to save them loal and play direct? |
| 13:44.18 | lcuk | markinfo, no, I mean how well does youtube website play from other handheld devices |
| 13:45.07 | kerio | Khertan1: that's even better than COME FROM |
| 13:45.16 | markinfo | lcuk, I have only nokia n900 .... this phone was quite expensive - so I am awaiting some power. |
| 13:46.17 | markinfo | Adobe flash is not working - o.k. ...but html5 video also not. |
| 13:46.22 | lcuk | markinfo, this device is smaller than your hand |
| 13:46.53 | lcuk | I was looking a computer that was bigger than a room the other day |
| 13:46.57 | markinfo | what is more powerfull device actually? |
| 13:47.30 | *** join/#maemo dschoepe (~dschoepe@unaffiliated/dschoepe) |
| 13:47.31 | *** join/#maemo the_lord (~david@201.208.33.26) |
| 13:47.36 | Metallik1ttu | htc desire? |
| 13:47.41 | markinfo | is there some new model? ... iHeard smartphones has 1GHZ CPU today. |
| 13:48.09 | crashanddie | well, "iHurd" in this case might be appropriate |
| 13:48.15 | jaska | iHurld |
| 13:48.29 | Metallik1ttu | N900 would be good if flash 10.1 at least |
| 13:48.34 | lcuk | markinfo, and I can carry my laptop |
| 13:48.40 | Metallik1ttu | +hardware accel |
| 13:48.40 | pupnik | markinfo: you can buy a phone with the 'power' to slide transitions at 60fps. and click on icons. |
| 13:49.02 | *** join/#maemo SmilybOrg (Smily@BSN-61-108-18.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 13:49.05 | pupnik | or you can buy a n900 to have the power to do many different things besides poke at the screen |
| 13:49.23 | crashanddie | talking about iHurd, I bought an iPod Touch and Airport Express. Just awesome to control the macbook through remotetap/remote and have the soundsystem in the living room play music without any wires, nor computers in said livingroom. |
| 13:49.27 | crashanddie | </troll> |
| 13:49.52 | *** join/#maemo d1b (~db@d1b.org) |
| 13:49.57 | pupnik | the n900 is more powerful than any other phone. but most people don't know how to use those powers. |
| 13:50.05 | MetalliKettu | Still there is no phone at market that I would switch my N900 though. |
| 13:50.15 | MetalliKettu | Despite it's shortcomings. |
| 13:50.20 | crashanddie | its |
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| 13:50.59 | markinfo | hm - i had long time nokia n810 and week ago a bought nokia n900 ... and just in a few days gone and I see there again not power enough? |
| 13:51.13 | crashanddie | "A specialist ice cream parlor plans to serve up breast milk ice cream and says people should think of it as an organic, free-range treat. The breast milk concoction, called the "Baby Gaga," will be available from Friday at the Icecreamists restaurant in London's Covent Garden." |
| 13:51.25 | crashanddie | lardman & Jaffa: you guys definitely have to try that :D |
| 13:51.25 | pupnik | i could use more battery power more than i could use more cpu power |
| 13:51.40 | pupnik | but carrying a spare battery (or two) solves that |
| 13:51.40 | lardman | crashanddie: yuck! |
| 13:52.11 | *** join/#maemo frade (~ivan@nat/nokia/x-fhmuwywowhaucbsc) |
| 13:52.13 | MetalliKettu | I just bought a new battery :) I get 2 days uptime now |
| 13:52.19 | nid0 | whats yuck is the price of it |
| 13:52.21 | MetalliKettu | My old one was really worn out :) |
| 13:52.26 | ruskie | I get 4 days uptime |
| 13:52.31 | markinfo | yess - attery should be twice so big ... I do not know why is nokia n900 so small. It was better with nokia n810. |
| 13:52.31 | ruskie | with the original battery |
| 13:52.39 | MetalliKettu | I have 3G and connections always on. |
| 13:52.43 | ruskie | now coming on to ~18 months of use in a few months... |
| 13:52.57 | crashanddie | nid0, 14 quid per serving... |
| 13:53.00 | nid0 | yep |
| 13:53.29 | MetalliKettu | I also run skype + latitude daemon etc so that why it sucks some juice. |
| 13:53.34 | crashanddie | Haha, lardman and nid0: ""Some people will hear about it and go, 'yuck' but actually it's pure, organic, free-range and totally natural," he said. "I had a Baby Gaga just this morning and I feel great."" |
| 13:53.41 | MetalliKettu | But I think two days is decent. |
| 13:53.44 | Jaffa | crashanddie: Depends on the breasts, surely? |
| 13:53.58 | nid0 | Jaffa: they have like 15 mothers signed up to donate |
| 13:53.59 | crashanddie | Jaffa, I don't think the icecream comes out of the breasts |
| 13:54.09 | lardman | not with this weather anyway |
| 13:54.11 | lcuk | Jaffa, "100% pure organic male breast milk" |
| 13:54.30 | *** join/#maemo MadViking (~user@88.193.150.143) |
| 13:54.31 | crashanddie | "Hang on a second, that's not a breast" |
| 13:54.37 | Jaffa | crashanddie: Would probably be a Health & Safety issue to get it coming out frozen... |
| 13:54.44 | Jaffa | crashanddie: Eww |
| 13:54.56 | lardman | shock freezing as it hits the cold air |
| 13:55.12 | crashanddie | those nipples will look like straws. |
| 13:55.15 | Jaffa | lardman: It's warm in London today |
| 13:55.15 | lardman | probably a nipple eye danger then though |
| 13:55.20 | lardman | crashanddie: +1 :D |
| 13:55.55 | lcuk | Maemo, code, computers, breasts. |
| 13:56.10 | markinfo | can be installed on this http://www.htc.com/www/product/7pro/specification.html some other operating systeM? |
| 13:56.17 | Jaffa | lcuk: Is this in descending order of interest? |
| 13:56.23 | Jaffa | lcuk: Or on-topicness? |
| 13:56.40 | crashanddie | Jaffa, breasts should be higher than computers |
| 13:56.40 | lcuk | Jaffa, I have already made it clear boobies are high priority, especially for multitouch interaction. |
| 13:56.48 | crashanddie | I mean, when she's standing. |
| 13:57.10 | Jaffa | crashanddie: Or he. |
| 13:57.17 | MohammadAG | o_O |
| 13:57.44 | crashanddie | Jaffa, if he's sitting in front of the computer, then technically his boobies are allowed to be under it |
| 13:57.49 | *** join/#maemo scoobertron (~tom@93.186.150.199) |
| 13:58.46 | lardman | wonders how large your screen is to get usable multitouch performance from breasts |
| 13:59.07 | lcuk | lardman, I have a 20" multitouch |
| 13:59.16 | crashanddie | lardman, men get "usable multitouch" with just 2 to 3 inches... |
| 13:59.22 | lcuk | but it works on my 10" one as well |
| 13:59.34 | lcuk | it might also work on your less than average 7" one |
| 13:59.42 | crashanddie | You know what |
| 14:00.00 | crashanddie | I'm so fucking happy I still use that corny nickname instead of like my real name |
| 14:00.13 | crashanddie | I'd be screwed during the next job interview if they googled my name and this came up |
| 14:00.16 | Jaffa | :-) |
| 14:00.18 | lardman | lol |
| 14:00.26 | Jaffa | considers pasting a /who crashanddie |
| 14:00.29 | crashanddie | "So, tell us about your multitouch breast experience over IRC" |
| 14:00.48 | lcuk | crashanddie, at least my stuff is related |
| 14:00.53 | lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liq.packard.bell.multitouch.boobies.fail.20100402_003.mp4 :P |
| 14:01.01 | crashanddie | lcuk, go ahead ;) |
| 14:01.03 | lcuk | "helping to ensure multitouch actually bloody works" |
| 14:01.06 | crashanddie | err, Jaffa, go ahead |
| 14:01.16 | Treibholz | If a company would ask that seriously, I wouldn't want to work there, either... |
| 14:01.19 | crashanddie | lcuk, safe for work? |
| 14:01.24 | Jaffa | crashanddie: Yeah, spotted that. |
| 14:01.37 | lcuk | crashanddie, yes |
| 14:01.54 | crashanddie | Treibholz, depends, if she's really hot or not... |
| 14:01.56 | *** join/#maemo andre__ (~andre@Maemo/community/bugmaster/andre) |
| 14:02.07 | lcuk | crashanddie, one of the HP guys at the meego conf actually went digging and found the user reports which matched |
| 14:02.14 | *** join/#maemo mva (mva@pirate-party.ru) |
| 14:02.27 | lcuk | its a nown issue for every large panel MT display I have tried |
| 14:02.31 | *** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp) |
| 14:02.37 | lcuk | known * |
| 14:03.36 | Treibholz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meego_(TV_series) lol |
| 14:03.36 | *** join/#maemo FIQ|n900 (~user@unaffiliated/fiq) |
| 14:03.56 | Treibholz | "Meego was canceled halfway through its first season." |
| 14:03.59 | Treibholz | hmm... |
| 14:04.03 | crashanddie | lcuk, lol... |
| 14:04.30 | crashanddie | Treibholz, I think you'll find me and khertan laughing about that about 20 minutes after the MeeGo announced a year ago... :) |
| 14:05.01 | *** join/#maemo dneary (~dneary@Maemo/community/docmaster/dneary) |
| 14:05.08 | Treibholz | crashanddie: Yes, I somehow knew, it was old for you.... |
| 14:06.06 | lcuk | crashanddie, sampling rate and aliasing effects - its cured by increasing the read rate |
| 14:06.21 | lcuk | this meego ideapad does not have problem that I can see :) |
| 14:06.48 | Treibholz | lcuk: I did't get wifi to work on mine.. |
| 14:07.34 | lcuk | Treibholz, on your what? |
| 14:08.38 | *** join/#maemo mase (~mase@p5DD3BD25.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:08.47 | Treibholz | lcuk: IdeaPad S10e |
| 14:09.10 | lcuk | that is odd indeed, are you sure you enabled the wifi switch o nthe side of it o_O |
| 14:09.17 | lcuk | on the * |
| 14:09.20 | timeless_office | treibholz: yeah, i was rather depressed when i first heard the name choice |
| 14:09.34 | timeless_office | and for once, the blame doesn't lie w/ the Finn |
| 14:09.38 | Treibholz | lcuk: it works perfectly with Windows, Debian, and MacOS X |
| 14:09.47 | timeless_office | the Intel guy should have done the research against americana |
| 14:10.07 | *** join/#maemo frade (~ivan@nat/nokia/x-exyzcbyxhsrvsoim) |
| 14:10.51 | Treibholz | btw.: is the sqlite-database of the callendar of Meego HX like the one in meamo? |
| 14:13.03 | *** join/#maemo tekojo (~quassel@Maemo/maemo.org/infrastructure/tekojo) |
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| 14:17.12 | markinfo | will be this http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=10116069 a solution to get powerfull smartphone? |
| 14:17.39 | *** join/#maemo hardaker (~hardaker@75-101-64-22.dsl.dynamic.omsoft.com) |
| 14:18.21 | markinfo | there is a video about using Ubuntu on HTC. working with firefox seems to be quite fast. Much faser than on nokia n900. |
| 14:18.27 | jonwil | the HD2 is not that good by todays standards |
| 14:18.36 | jonwil | plus its not sold anymore |
| 14:18.51 | jonwil | Now Ubuntu on the HD7 on the other hand, THAT might be interesting |
| 14:19.57 | markinfo | HD7 is not on the list: http://htc-linux.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page (maybe yet?) |
| 14:21.09 | *** join/#maemo hardaker (~hardaker@75-101-64-22.dsl.dynamic.omsoft.com) |
| 14:21.23 | jonwil | I think no-one has a way to run alternative OSs on Windows Phone handsets yet |
| 14:21.27 | jonwil | due to all the lockdown |
| 14:22.07 | markinfo | for android Phones is it easysier? |
| 14:23.07 | *** part/#maemo djszapi (~lpapp@plexyplanet.org) |
| 14:23.09 | *** join/#maemo mpoirier (~quassel@S0106002369de4dac.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 14:24.55 | Treibholz | I was a little bit shocked, when I tried NITdroid, how fast it was. |
| 14:26.05 | markinfo | Treibholz, do you have still NITroid on your Nokia? |
| 14:26.11 | luke-jr | jonwil: nor Android phones last I checked |
| 14:26.39 | jonwil | Custom kernels can run on a bunch of Android phones |
| 14:26.44 | jonwil | including the Desire Z |
| 14:26.47 | jonwil | and Desire HD |
| 14:27.07 | jonwil | and if you can run a custom kernel, that's all you need for a real linux setup |
| 14:27.52 | *** join/#maemo Arkenoi (~ark@81.200.10.86) |
| 14:28.21 | Treibholz | markinfo: not really. I still have the MicroSD-card, but when you run it from a MicroSD, the OS is often slow. |
| 14:28.33 | Treibholz | but it's much, much faster than meego |
| 14:28.34 | luke-jr | jonwil: custom *Linux* kernels? |
| 14:28.38 | luke-jr | or just Android kernels? |
| 14:28.57 | jonwil | well they can completly replace the binary |
| 14:29.02 | jonwil | and the rootfs |
| 14:29.05 | luke-jr | jonwil: with what? |
| 14:29.41 | jonwil | I dont see any real difference between a linux kernel and an android kernel if you port over the right hardware drivers |
| 14:29.54 | markinfo | Treibholz, it would be interessting if for example this video in html5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtlEl_jJ9eU would be playable on ot. |
| 14:30.38 | markinfo | the whole firefox mobile is too slow on nokia n900. |
| 14:31.33 | ccooke | markinfo: it's too slow on everything I've tried it on. It was too slow on an overclocked n900. It's too slow on the overclocked desire Z I'm currently using. |
| 14:31.34 | Treibholz | markinfo: here on my desktop, Flash uses less CPU than "native" HTML5-videos in FF4b |
| 14:32.11 | Treibholz | I don't know how they get it so slow... |
| 14:32.23 | Treibholz | maybe the decoder is in JavaScript... |
| 14:32.43 | markinfo | hm - adobe flash uses probably some hardware acceleration. |
| 14:33.25 | derf | So does Firefox, but it's disabled on a lot of systems due to driver crashes. |
| 14:33.45 | markinfo | but only to scroll text - it freezes sometimes seconds .... |
| 14:35.41 | markinfo | is there some software that shows in menu CPU utilization? |
| 14:37.12 | *** join/#maemo hannesw__ (~hannes@178-190-14-107.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 14:37.52 | ccooke | markinfo: well, top will do it, from the terminal... :-) |
| 14:37.55 | *** join/#maemo ToJa92 (~ToJa92@90-231-124-110-no126.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 14:38.14 | ccooke | (IIRC there's an applet for it, yeah) |
| 14:39.31 | markinfo | maybe Firefox is slow - but there is no other browser today that supports html5 so good. Or? |
| 14:40.46 | ccooke | markinfo: depends who you talk to, really |
| 14:41.37 | lcuk | Treibholz, it is EASY to make software run slowly |
| 14:41.52 | lcuk | any developer can clog up the cpu of even the fastest machine |
| 14:42.11 | derf | The decoder is about the only part that's actually fast. |
| 14:42.17 | lcuk | however, it takes a delicate fine highly skilled developer to make a cpu purr :) |
| 14:42.25 | derf | It's everything that happens after decoding before it gets on the screen that's slow. |
| 14:43.01 | lcuk | derf - it is decoded to a backbuffer and then the buffer is painted to the screen with scaling (at least that is what happens when you use +- keys |
| 14:43.07 | markinfo | hm - even on my desktop dual core 1.8GHz takes this html5 video from youtube nearly 50% of CPU. |
| 14:43.26 | derf | lcuk: If only it were that simple. |
| 14:43.33 | lcuk | software bitmap scaling (if including AA) is something that is heavy for the cpu |
| 14:43.47 | derf | markinfo: Are you trying to play the 720p version? |
| 14:44.05 | markinfo | 360p |
| 14:44.37 | derf | That's... pretty ridiculous. |
| 14:44.52 | derf | What OS is your desktop running? |
| 14:46.34 | markinfo | XFCE on debian squeeze. Interesting - if the video Window ist hided - for example page is scrolled down it falls to nearly to zero CPU even the video is playing further. |
| 14:46.45 | *** join/#maemo mardi (~mardi@41.94.2.81.in-addr.arpa) |
| 14:47.02 | derf | What happens if you run Firefox with MOZ_GLX_IGNORE_BLACKLIST=1 ? |
| 14:47.34 | *** join/#maemo johnsu01 (~user@fencepost.gnu.org) |
| 14:47.49 | *** join/#maemo jhb1 (~joerg@p4FEF5B03.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:48.56 | markinfo | derf, how to do that? Starts firefox with this parameter? |
| 14:49.19 | derf | Type export MOZ_GLX_IGNORE_BLACKLIST=1 |
| 14:49.24 | derf | Then run Firefox. |
| 14:49.37 | MohammadAG | or MOZ_GLX_IGNORE_BLACKLIST=1 firefox |
| 14:49.37 | derf | (from the same shell) |
| 14:49.49 | derf | Yes, that works, too. |
| 14:51.46 | *** join/#maemo tackat (~trahn@pd95c4acb.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:52.34 | Treibholz | makes no difference on my Core-i5-notebook here |
| 14:52.38 | markinfo | it seems to be the same. |
| 14:53.24 | derf | Are you sure you completely closed the browser first? |
| 14:53.36 | markinfo | but glxgears makes: 8736 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1747.072 FPS |
| 14:54.20 | lcuk | marwhen glxgears adds a webbrowser component it can be used as a fair comparison |
| 14:54.33 | lcuk | markinfo, when* |
| 14:56.56 | crashanddie | OK WHAT THE HOLY FUCK? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxd96qRa6wY |
| 14:57.11 | *** join/#maemo hurbu_ (~hurbanza@88-149-237-136.dynamic.ngi.it) |
| 14:58.23 | nid0 | what, it was only time before motion-sensing tech started getting used for adult games :P |
| 14:59.04 | APTX | booooring |
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| 15:16.30 | Venemo | alterego: ping |
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| 15:59.38 | DocScrutinizer | Jaffa: there's already per-contact-ringtones as by barisione |
| 16:00.50 | Jaffa | DocScrutinizer: Indeed. I was going to point that out to jonwil but couldn't be arsed to do the Googling |
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| 17:10.31 | sssup | hello |
| 17:10.36 | sssup | anyone der ? |
| 17:10.42 | sssup | anyone who is into hacing |
| 17:10.52 | sssup | hacking |
| 17:11.18 | crashanddie | hacking? |
| 17:11.24 | crashanddie | Define: "hacking". |
| 17:11.56 | sssup | welll i just wanttto get the password of sm one anyone can help me in tht |
| 17:12.05 | crashanddie | Nope |
| 17:12.09 | sssup | huh |
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| 17:12.38 | lardman | sssup: whose password are you trying to get? |
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| 17:25.40 | unixSnob | if you want their NIT password, you'll have to install video surveillance |
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| 17:29.40 | alterego | sighs |
| 17:30.16 | celesteh | when my n900 logs in to facebook chat, does it report it's user agent as opera on winxp? |
| 17:30.37 | Sc0rpius | what?!? |
| 17:30.39 | sivang | celesteh: no |
| 17:30.41 | unixSnob | This command launches a browser window, but not the webpage; what am i doing wrong? => /usr/bin/browser www.maemo.org |
| 17:30.54 | sivang | celesteh: MicroB on linux would be my bet |
| 17:31.08 | Jaffa | unixSnob: You have to use DBus |
| 17:31.19 | MohammadAG | browser launches another engine |
| 17:31.27 | celesteh | sivang: facebook keeps telling me that somebody is logging in on opera on winxp and their locations seem to match mine, so i thought it might be my phone |
| 17:31.28 | sivang | anybody know why after upgrading last night, I get antoher upgrade offer and when I check the status it says 'broken but upgradeable' ? |
| 17:31.30 | unixSnob | Jaffa: i know the DBus command.. but I read somewhere that it can be launched |
| 17:31.47 | sivang | celesteh: I would be very surprised if this is the case. |
| 17:31.58 | MohammadAG | unixSnob, you're spawning another instance of the browser = wasting memory |
| 17:32.10 | sivang | hey MohammadAG |
| 17:32.19 | MohammadAG | hi |
| 17:32.30 | sivang | MohammadAG: you have any idea about this upgrade issue? it seems that qt sensors lib is missing also due to this. |
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| 17:32.40 | MohammadAG | hmm |
| 17:32.42 | unixSnob | MohammadAG: actually, this is for cases where I want the first instance |
| 17:32.46 | sivang | /usr/local/bin/qtbubblelevel: error while loading shared libraries: libQtSensors.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
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| 17:32.49 | MohammadAG | pokes achipa |
| 17:32.49 | sivang | Finished running remote process. |
| 17:32.59 | MohammadAG | apt-get install libqtm-sensors |
| 17:33.02 | Jaffa | unixSnob: It can be launched using dbus on the command line |
| 17:33.08 | unixSnob | got my answer, i think => browser --url=http://www.maemo.org |
| 17:33.13 | celesteh | sivang: hmmm, this is annoying / alarming |
| 17:33.19 | sivang | MohammadAG: hrm, I guess it won't help saying this should have happened by itself with the upgrade? :) |
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| 17:33.28 | sivang | MohammadAG: 'user platform etc etc' ;) |
| 17:33.35 | MohammadAG | probably doesn't depend on it for some reason |
| 17:33.46 | MohammadAG | on that note |
| 17:33.49 | sivang | wonders what the hell happened to the firmware upgrade |
| 17:34.00 | MohammadAG | achipa, libqtm-12 doesn't depend on libqtm-12-connectivity |
| 17:34.06 | sivang | what should be the reported version fot latest upgrade if I am not using CSSU? |
| 17:34.25 | MohammadAG | not a big issue though |
| 17:34.38 | MohammadAG | 20.2010.36-2 whether you're using the CSSU or not |
| 17:34.40 | sivang | celesteh: sorry dude, wish I could help. Google identifies me as N900 / MicroB (gecko) etc |
| 17:34.51 | MohammadAG | the CSSU uses that number + maemoXX |
| 17:35.01 | sivang | ah okay, cool |
| 17:35.09 | sivang | like a downstrream upgrade |
| 17:35.10 | celesteh | sivang: is there a way i can use google to find out what the chat agent signs in as? |
| 17:35.17 | unixSnob | Jaffa: i just verified the --url switch and it works... but out of curiousity, whats the dbus command if you don't have a browser running yet? Presumably it's different than the regular command |
| 17:35.46 | sivang | MohammadAG: so this is my version, and still it tells me to upgrade when I use holdon app manager to 'update' |
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| 17:37.45 | sivang | MohammadAG: ah okay, something got screwed. I am not on that version. Before the upgrade reboot it said I am on that version. |
| 17:37.50 | sivang | wonders if to try and upgrade again |
| 17:38.35 | sivang | celesteh: well, you can use a page to do this. There are tons on the internet |
| 17:39.13 | celesteh | sivang: yeah, but it's not the browser, it's the chat client that i think is identifying this way |
| 17:40.45 | lardman | lol @ work's message re lack of email: http://pastebin.com/Rs4MQaVv /me wonders if a sink hole opened up under the server farm |
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| 17:42.12 | unixSnob | this fails to launch => ssh user@10.15.66.37 /usr/bin/dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.osso_browser /com/nokia/osso_browser/request com.nokia.osso_browser.load_url string:http://www.maemo.org |
| 17:43.29 | unixSnob | and replacing "--system" with "--session" is worse.. gets an error about libraries being wrongly setup |
| 17:45.34 | jacekowski | unixSnob: if browser isn't running you can't start it with dbus |
| 17:46.02 | slonopotamus | ... and if it IS running already, you don't need to start it :D |
| 17:46.24 | unixSnob | jacekowski: okay.. Jaffa was saying otherwise |
| 17:46.53 | jacekowski | ah |
| 17:46.55 | jacekowski | browserd |
| 17:47.09 | jacekowski | then it should take same command |
| 17:48.20 | unixSnob | jacekowski: what do you mean? |
| 17:49.42 | slonopotamus | unixSnob: you can't use --session because you're not in desktop session when logging in via ssh |
| 17:50.44 | unixSnob | slonopotamus: desktop session? sounds like something I want to use. Does that mean I can get the desktop in an x window? |
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| 17:51.23 | slonopotamus_ | meh |
| 17:51.31 | slonopotamus_ | unixSnob: you can't use --session because you're not in desktop session when logging in via ssh |
| 17:51.33 | slonopotamus_ | unixSnob: you need to google for reusing same dbus session |
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| 17:52.22 | slonopotamus_ | unixSnob: makes sense? |
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| 17:54.35 | unixSnob | slonopotamus_: doesn't sound like what I'm after. I thought for a minute there that dbus could be used to launch a new browser window |
| 17:55.03 | unixSnob | no big deal.. i'll just use browser --url when I want to launch a window |
| 17:56.12 | slonopotamus_ | unixSnob: it can be used (it works when run from gui terminal) |
| 17:56.38 | jhanely | Hey guys. I'm trying to build a custom kernel for my n810. I have started with the n8x0_defconfig, but when booting it just shows the Nokia splash screen for about a minute, and then powers off. I have tried to enable the fb console, but... either I'm doing it wrong, or the kernel isn't booting far enough to initialize the console. Anybody have any tips, or a known-good .config file I could start from? |
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| 17:57.49 | slonopotamus_ | jhanely: you want omap2420_defconfig |
| 17:57.58 | jhanely | Ah, thank you. |
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| 17:59.06 | sivang | MohammadAG: CSSU are not enabled by default right? |
| 17:59.34 | MohammadAG | hmm? |
| 17:59.53 | sivang | MohammadAG: I just got paranoid thinking they are enabled by default. Excuse me :) |
| 18:00.19 | Jaffa | "Enabled by default"? |
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| 18:11.03 | lolcat | Making the cable for usb hostemode is difficult |
| 18:14.20 | jacekowski | not really |
| 18:14.24 | jacekowski | all you need is a gender bender |
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| 18:25.47 | jhanely | Slonopotamus: I did not find an omap2420_defconfig, though I did find an omap_generic_2420_defconfig. Building from that, I still can't even tell if the kernel is starting at all. It sits on the Nokia screen for a moment, and then powers off. Do you know of any way to get output from the bootloader or something? |
| 18:26.22 | jhanely | I have lots of experience configuring and building kernels, but very little with embedded devices. |
| 18:26.32 | MohammadAG | rx51_defconfig for the N900 |
| 18:26.59 | jhanely | I'm trying to build for the n810. |
| 18:27.16 | MohammadAG | oh, rx44 maybe? idk |
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| 18:38.11 | jhanely | No luck there. |
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| 18:43.32 | DocScrutinizer | N8x0_defconfig sounds just fine to me (noob speaking here) |
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| 18:44.46 | DocScrutinizer | jhanely: unlike N900, the N8x0 devices use initrd |
| 18:44.57 | DocScrutinizer | afaik |
| 18:45.42 | jhanely | Yeah, it does. For getting started though, as long as I can get the basic stuff built in that shouldn't matter. Or so I believe. |
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| 18:46.49 | jhanely | At this point, I'm really just looking for any indication that my kernel is booting at all. Mounting root and/or initfs can be dealt with once I get that far. |
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| 18:48.18 | DocScrutinizer | for all I know initrd has to match kernel, otherwise it will stall |
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| 18:48.43 | jhanely | Yes, if you need to load any modules before root is mounted, they have to come from initrd. And they have to match the kernel. |
| 18:49.02 | javispedro | and there's not much space left in the n8x0 initrd partition |
| 18:49.24 | jhanely | Indeed not. 2mb for the kernel image, and I'm not sure how much for the initrd. |
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| 18:50.26 | jhanely | I can easily fit the fb console related drivers in the kernel though, and still fit in 2mb. So if the kernel is starting up, I should be able to see some output. |
| 18:50.44 | MohammadAG | Jaffa, javispedro http://gitorious.org/slide2answer/slide2answer |
| 18:51.17 | MohammadAG | javispedro, it doesn't kill the stock dialog (yet), it simply pops over it |
| 18:51.18 | DocScrutinizer | jhanely: I'm not sure about fb console support in N8x0 kernel |
| 18:51.47 | DocScrutinizer | maybe javispedro knows better details |
| 18:52.01 | javispedro | I know it exists =) |
| 18:52.05 | javispedro | but never used it. |
| 18:52.15 | DocScrutinizer | odds are it never did |
| 18:52.20 | DocScrutinizer | ...work |
| 18:52.30 | jhanely | Luke-jr's 2.6.33.2 kernel (at http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showthread.php?p=954899) has fb console support. |
| 18:52.34 | javispedro | well I don't see why not, on N810 x11 actually enters much late in the picture |
| 18:52.35 | jhanely | And I can get that one to boot. |
| 18:52.51 | DocScrutinizer | hmm, ok |
| 18:52.58 | jhanely | That's what led me here - I posted a reply asking for his config, and he suggested I log on here. |
| 18:53.19 | javispedro | luke-jr: ^^ |
| 18:53.30 | javispedro | (he might be here later today, or not...) |
| 18:53.41 | jhanely | He's in the list now, though apparently not active. |
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| 18:54.28 | javispedro | jhanely: which toolchain do you use to build? |
| 18:55.02 | divan | Does someone know how debian/optify file works? Any documentation on this? I put 'auto' to this file but seems the package created by dpkg-buildpackage isn't optified |
| 18:55.24 | javispedro | divan: only autobuilder will take care of that file |
| 18:55.50 | javispedro | divan: on your host do "fakeroot maemo-optify-deb <package_etc_etc.deb>" |
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| 18:57.20 | javispedro | alterego: there? |
| 18:57.44 | divan | javispedro, thanks, it works. So it's supposed to do run each time I rebuild by deb? Or is there any way to make it part of deb build process? |
| 18:57.49 | jhanely | I'm building with armv6j-unknown-linux-gnueabi. |
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| 18:57.53 | RST38h | moo javispedro |
| 18:58.05 | javispedro | divan: there was a maemo-buildpackage somewhere, but I don't remember where =) |
| 18:58.38 | divan | javispedro, ok, thanks. |
| 18:58.47 | javispedro | jhanely: I have no idea if luke-jr did, but I suggest you use codesourcery2005 (aka the one that comes with the Diablo SDK). All kernels I've built I used that. |
| 18:58.59 | javispedro | moo RST38h |
| 18:59.10 | javispedro | RST38h: saw today's slashdot article about maemo? |
| 19:00.14 | divan | I'll update http://wiki.maemo.org/Packaging_Qt_Creator_Apps_for_Maemo_Extras wiki page cause it mention on creating debian/optify file, but not running maemo-optify. |
| 19:01.15 | javispedro | divan: you do not need to run it if you plan to send the app to Extras. |
| 19:01.48 | divan | javispedro, ohh, clear! Thanks again ) |
| 19:02.04 | Jartza | hmmh |
| 19:02.13 | MohammadAG | javispedro, mind trying it out http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/slide2answer :) |
| 19:02.18 | Jartza | has anyone done qt-programs for n800? :) |
| 19:02.22 | RST38h | javispedro: no, were they gloating? |
| 19:02.34 | Jartza | am I doing something wrong as the window doesn't look correctly "hildonized"? |
| 19:02.35 | javispedro | RST38h: I'm still at it, http://news.slashdot.org/story/11/02/25/1556239/Nokia-and-Open-Source-mdash-a-Trial-By-Fire?from=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2Fslashdot+%28Slashdot%29 |
| 19:02.52 | javispedro | Jartza: you're missing "run-standalone.sh"? |
| 19:02.54 | Jartza | meaning, the lower right part of the window is missing the "theme pieces": rounded window corner etc. |
| 19:02.59 | Jartza | javispedro: no I'm not |
| 19:03.24 | Jartza | I thought if using QMainWindow, the application should be "Hildonized" |
| 19:04.10 | Jartza | oh wait |
| 19:04.26 | Jartza | it also happens with other qt-applications |
| 19:04.39 | Jartza | hmm. bug in qt library itself? |
| 19:04.59 | MohammadAG | I thought that only applies to Qt 4.6 |
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| 19:05.11 | *** join/#maemo moshee (~moshee@unaffiliated/moshee) |
| 19:05.33 | Jartza | MohammadAG: the bug, or qmainwindow? :) |
| 19:05.41 | MohammadAG | QMainWindow |
| 19:05.50 | javispedro | Jartza: I don't remember that happening with the Sudoku sample application |
| 19:06.28 | Jartza | hmm |
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| 19:06.40 | Jartza | but 4.5 is the latest "official" for n800 |
| 19:07.04 | Jartza | or atleast it was the one that was easiest to find :) |
| 19:07.11 | MohammadAG | I might be wrong, never had an N800 |
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| 19:07.44 | divan | MohammadAG, I've tried slide2answer as well. The default Answer window appears and in a few seconds your slide window opens (with rotation). Sliding works though ) |
| 19:07.59 | javispedro | tbh |
| 19:08.06 | MohammadAG | divan, yeah, race conditions, it's intentional till I find a way to kill the stock dialog |
| 19:08.18 | Jartza | well. it doesn't really affect the application usage though, it's just annoying. |
| 19:08.24 | javispedro | I just noticed that the sample sudoku aplication does not have hildon rounded lower coners :( |
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| 19:08.28 | javispedro | *corners |
| 19:08.34 | MohammadAG | QTimer::singleShot(500, this, SLOT(show())); |
| 19:08.39 | Jartza | I just wanted the application to look perfect like other maemo-apps :) |
| 19:09.08 | Jartza | javispedro: so it's a bug. using 4.5 or 4.6? |
| 19:09.17 | Jartza | I found that there is a 4.6 also, but I think not official |
| 19:09.24 | javispedro | Jartza: 4.5.2 |
| 19:09.40 | Jartza | ok |
| 19:09.49 | divan | MohammadAG, nice idea anyway ) I always afraid of pressing 'Cancel' button on the way of taking out phone from the pocket on incoming ring. |
| 19:09.50 | Jartza | same here |
| 19:10.27 | MohammadAG | divan, it's still in very early stages, I want it to be instant as a first |
| 19:10.37 | MohammadAG | and of course, change the sliders to something more appealing |
| 19:10.44 | Jartza | so the qt doesn't generate correct hildonwindow |
| 19:10.56 | MohammadAG | when I figure out QPropertyAnimation |
| 19:11.06 | divan | MohammadAG, yeah, sure. Which process starts stock dialog? |
| 19:11.11 | MohammadAG | rtcom-call-ui |
| 19:11.32 | MohammadAG | I need to kill the window itself using XUnmapWindow, javispedro really helped a lot here |
| 19:11.40 | sivang | wonders if we are talking about fixing the accidental take call issue with rtcom-call-ui |
| 19:11.48 | *** join/#maemo Natunen (nalle@213-186-248-75.bb.dnainternet.fi) |
| 19:11.58 | sivang | anybody knows why would latest offical NOkia update fails to install? |
| 19:12.06 | MohammadAG | but I have no idea how to find the window id of the rtcom-call-ui using C++ |
| 19:12.13 | MohammadAG | or C, doesn't matter |
| 19:12.33 | javispedro | MohammadAG: it's kind of a black art, specially considering it seems you also have to guess when it appears. |
| 19:12.40 | Jartza | hmmh. |
| 19:12.49 | sivang | after the update I still have 10.2010.19-1 |
| 19:12.51 | javispedro | if you knew it was there you just query the X11 window tree and, well, search for it... |
| 19:12.56 | divan | MohammadAG, can we in some way just 'unsubscribe' this CallUI from getting DBus event? |
| 19:12.58 | Jartza | well... annoying, but maybe not that fatal |
| 19:13.20 | MohammadAG | javispedro, we can monitor X I guess |
| 19:13.20 | sivang | Jartza: do you know if the script you foun for swappiness tweaks is good as Swapolube ? |
| 19:13.27 | DocScrutinizer | tweak gtk theme, to change appearance of dialer buttons |
| 19:13.28 | MohammadAG | s/guess/hope |
| 19:13.36 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, that won't change signals |
| 19:13.46 | DocScrutinizer | uhih, why? |
| 19:14.08 | MohammadAG | cause clicked() on a button isn't the same as valueChanged(int) on a slider |
| 19:14.18 | MohammadAG | idk what gtk uses for the signal names, but you get the idea, I hope |
| 19:14.39 | MohammadAG | divan, I highly suggest we don't, call handling after answering is still handled by that |
| 19:14.52 | DocScrutinizer | wtf, I didn't say use slider, I said change the way BUTTON works |
| 19:15.09 | MohammadAG | so you want to change the library |
| 19:15.13 | Jartza | sivang: not sure at all |
| 19:15.26 | MohammadAG | and how would that not break all other buttons? |
| 19:15.34 | MohammadAG | i.e dialer buttons |
| 19:15.44 | DocScrutinizer | by applying that theme to dialer only |
| 19:15.58 | MohammadAG | the dialer buttons are part of the same binary |
| 19:16.10 | DocScrutinizer | by checking what other properties the button has, eg text.value |
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| 19:16.15 | divan | MohammadAG, maybe worth research this way.. Disable callUI from getting signal, show own UI, and resend Answer event on slide. |
| 19:16.21 | Venemo | hey guys |
| 19:16.23 | Venemo | what's up? |
| 19:16.34 | MohammadAG | divan, killing the window's easier, a lot easier |
| 19:17.02 | MohammadAG | I wonder if X sends a signal when a window's mapped |
| 19:17.08 | sivang | hey Venemo |
| 19:17.14 | MohammadAG | hi Venemo |
| 19:17.41 | DocScrutinizer | if button.text == "ACCEPT" or button.text == "REJECT" then change_appearance_to_slider |
| 19:17.45 | sivang | Venemo: may be you know something about a pr1.3 that seems to be installing but after reboot reported version is still the previous one. |
| 19:17.48 | sivang | Venemo: ? :) |
| 19:18.08 | DocScrutinizer | s/button/self/g |
| 19:19.10 | sivang | divan: I like this. we can try and unsub callui from dbus through the server |
| 19:19.22 | sivang | divan: kill it's subscrition or service file.. |
| 19:19.55 | sivang | divan: thing is, how will rtcomm-call react when it loses dbus subscription.. |
| 19:20.21 | MohammadAG | hmm |
| 19:20.27 | divan | sivang, how it reacts? |
| 19:20.36 | merlin_N900 | trial and error? |
| 19:20.40 | sivang | divan: yes, it might do stupid thing like reboot the device or so , who knows.. |
| 19:20.54 | divan | reboot2answer |
| 19:20.55 | sivang | divan: maemo has an interesting notion of 'vital' stuff. |
| 19:21.08 | sivang | merlin_N900: yes, that would be the way. |
| 19:21.30 | SpeedEvil | wants a thingy that pops up the unlock screen when there is an orientation change, the prox sensor goes on->off, and there is light. |
| 19:21.32 | sivang | so we need to kill its sbscription, and then disallow it from connecting (i forgot how that's done) |
| 19:21.52 | sivang | SpeedEvil: ohh slick |
| 19:22.11 | sivang | :-) |
| 19:22.13 | divan | worth to try. Killing X window looks too hackish for me. I believe killing window will cause auto call cancellation. |
| 19:22.16 | sivang | searches the wiki for pr1.3 issues |
| 19:22.23 | MohammadAG | divan, no |
| 19:22.25 | MohammadAG | already tried it |
| 19:22.32 | DocScrutinizer | divan: the whole thing is WAY TOO hackish |
| 19:22.33 | SpeedEvil | Oh - that reminds me of a brosrr issue. |
| 19:22.35 | sivang | divan: they are seperate |
| 19:22.38 | SpeedEvil | Browser. |
| 19:22.41 | SpeedEvil | Listen to music. |
| 19:22.42 | MohammadAG | and changing gtk libraries isn't? |
| 19:22.46 | SpeedEvil | Switch to browser. |
| 19:22.47 | divan | Oke ) |
| 19:22.48 | SpeedEvil | Lock screen |
| 19:22.56 | sivang | divan: e.g. in process and archi |
| 19:22.57 | MohammadAG | all approaches are hackish, till they open source the dialer |
| 19:23.24 | SpeedEvil | Use volume buttons to change volume - nothing happens. |
| 19:23.32 | sivang | MohammadAG: +1 to try and kill it's dbus subscription, make it unauthorized to subscribe and sub our own process |
| 19:23.34 | MohammadAG | heh |
| 19:23.43 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: actually tweaking GTK theme isn't |
| 19:23.59 | DocScrutinizer | it's perfectly inside what GTK is meant to do |
| 19:24.01 | MohammadAG | sivang, there's a risk you'll break call handling |
| 19:24.09 | sivang | SpeedEvil: it is for zooming :) |
| 19:24.12 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, I'm not a gtk expert, feel free to do it |
| 19:24.16 | DocScrutinizer | well, except maybe the check for self.test |
| 19:24.22 | sivang | curses pr1.3 |
| 19:24.33 | DocScrutinizer | self.text |
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| 19:25.50 | DocScrutinizer | frankly, nobody here is expert for dialer<->telepathy/telephonystack communication either, so I don't see the fundamental difference |
| 19:26.07 | SpeedEvil | sivang: yes - but with the screen locked - the user clearly does not want to zoom |
| 19:26.49 | MohammadAG | I'm not cloning telepathy handling DocScrutinizer |
| 19:26.57 | DocScrutinizer | and when I hear "killing X windows" and " try and unsub callui from dbus through the server" - sorry I get goosepimples and start to shudder |
| 19:27.12 | MohammadAG | I'm only redoing the answer dialog, when you answer, it's handled over to rtcom-call-ui |
| 19:27.22 | MohammadAG | then don't use it DocScrutinizer |
| 19:27.31 | MohammadAG | we had the discussion yesterday, let's not do it again |
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| 19:28.49 | DocScrutinizer | your rationale is as wrong as the overclocking-app devels' - "I insist in coding broken-by-design potentially dangerous (911 calls) BS, don't use it if you don't like" |
| 19:29.30 | sivang | SpeedEvil: right |
| 19:29.41 | sivang | MohammadAG: We can at least try |
| 19:29.48 | MohammadAG | umm, wtf are you talking about |
| 19:29.52 | sivang | MohammadAG: just to see what happens |
| 19:29.54 | MohammadAG | this doesn't stop 911 calls |
| 19:29.54 | alterego | javispedro: ? |
| 19:30.01 | alterego | not for long though |
| 19:30.09 | MohammadAG | this doesn't kill rtcom-call-ui |
| 19:30.23 | MohammadAG | this only changes the answer dialog |
| 19:32.36 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: ooh it doesn't??? what's going to happen when you are at a 911 call and a inbound concurrent call is knocking? what's going to happen when slider-dialog pops up over the current established call dialog, and then you kill X? are you really sure it's a brilliant idea to mess around with communication between call-ui and telepathy, just to change look of a button? |
| 19:32.41 | javispedro | alterego: yeah I'm getting a call atm so I'm busy too, we'll talk later |
| 19:33.18 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, go read the code before arguing on BS facts |
| 19:33.19 | alterego | javispedro: okay, I'll ping you again when I'm free. |
| 19:33.22 | MohammadAG | and stop spreading crap |
| 19:33.55 | MohammadAG | where did I say I was killing X, or telepathy, or rtcom-call-ui |
| 19:33.58 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: go learn system design fundamentials before corecting me on BS assumptions of yours |
| 19:34.31 | MohammadAG | system design fundamentals assume the phone app is open source, your argument is invalid |
| 19:35.03 | DocScrutinizer | your argument is |
| 19:35.11 | DocScrutinizer | and everybody can see that |
| 19:35.11 | jacekowski | what is the argument |
| 19:35.16 | jacekowski | nobody calls 911 |
| 19:35.16 | Sc0rpius | senses some kind of tension in this channel |
| 19:35.19 | jacekowski | nobody cares |
| 19:35.37 | MohammadAG | nobody's fucking with 911, see? you're spreading BS DocScrutinizer |
| 19:35.39 | jacekowski | and 911 doesn't even work here |
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| 19:36.09 | MohammadAG | anyway, to answer your question |
| 19:36.18 | MohammadAG | what's going to happen when slider-dialog pops up over the current established call dialog |
| 19:36.22 | DocScrutinizer | jacekowski: stfu, why are you adding to the BS spead here? |
| 19:36.25 | jacekowski | it's 112 in europe |
| 19:36.31 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: for lulz |
| 19:36.31 | MohammadAG | you either answer, or reject, it's not rocket science |
| 19:36.40 | Sc0rpius | hehe |
| 19:36.52 | MohammadAG | and if you answer, you're sent back to rtcom-call-ui by rtcom-call-ui |
| 19:37.07 | MohammadAG | no one's killing X |
| 19:37.46 | DocScrutinizer | "it's not rocket science" said the inventor of the rocket chair, prior to blasting himself to pieces |
| 19:38.02 | RST38h | a proofpic? |
| 19:38.19 | jacekowski | what are you trying to do |
| 19:38.20 | MohammadAG | I'm not making a rocket chair, that's not rocket science either :) |
| 19:38.21 | dm8tbr | prefers rocket-surgery |
| 19:38.59 | MohammadAG | jacekowski, I'm not trying to, http://i51.tinypic.com/2zgdefq.jpg |
| 19:39.13 | DocScrutinizer | no, you are coding a text editor by adding custom functions to spreadsheet cells, so each cell holds one of your chars |
| 19:40.09 | jacekowski | MohammadAG: what are these sliders doing? |
| 19:40.22 | MohammadAG | jacekowski, slide to answer and slide to reject |
| 19:40.35 | MohammadAG | what every resistive touchscreen phone has |
| 19:40.44 | jacekowski | make it a one slider |
| 19:41.00 | jacekowski | but well, i don't see a problem there |
| 19:41.08 | DocScrutinizer | that's what some dude actually did, as only thing he knew was spreadsheet (actually excel). Same here, you don't know GTK so you're implementing an abomination of overwhelming comlexity and unknown side effects, to do something that could be done in a straight and easy to evaluate way by just using the right tools |
| 19:41.21 | MohammadAG | jacekowski, design is still a concept |
| 19:41.40 | javispedro | hm... what's going on here? |
| 19:41.50 | jacekowski | i don't see anything it could mess up |
| 19:41.55 | jacekowski | that would be life critical |
| 19:41.57 | Sc0rpius | what's the straight and easy way? |
| 19:42.13 | jacekowski | unless you consider a lost call life critical thing |
| 19:42.20 | javispedro | ah |
| 19:42.22 | jacekowski | but then you shouldn't be using mobile phone in first place |
| 19:42.23 | MohammadAG | it won't lose you a call |
| 19:42.25 | Sc0rpius | I could disassemble the code and fix the button but that would be illegal |
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| 19:42.27 | *** join/#maemo florian (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian) |
| 19:42.53 | MohammadAG | I don't want to patch anything |
| 19:43.11 | MohammadAG | otherwise I'll just change hildon-desktop and get rid of the HILDON_STACKING_LAYER bit that javispedro found |
| 19:43.13 | javispedro | so I'll describe the problem at hand: csd or someone else (MohammadAG could say) emits a d-bus signal, rtcom-call-ui catches it and after N cycles shows a window. This window has a X11 property that causes h-d to pin it on top |
| 19:43.14 | Sc0rpius | I don't even know what the problem is actually |
| 19:43.32 | DocScrutinizer | jacekowski: it could mess with established calls for example, when a second call comes in. Just occurs to me after 10s of thinking |
| 19:43.34 | MohammadAG | csd, yes |
| 19:43.35 | javispedro | MohammadAG wants to replace the window with his own, in order to X stuff |
| 19:43.38 | divan | Sc0rpius, the problem is we need to kill stock Answer dialog. |
| 19:43.45 | Sc0rpius | why |
| 19:43.47 | MohammadAG | javispedro, I can show on top of it |
| 19:43.58 | MohammadAG | but I'd need to know when it's created |
| 19:44.04 | MohammadAG | the stock dialog lags, a LOT |
| 19:44.07 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: i don't have call waiting |
| 19:44.08 | DocScrutinizer | jacekowski: just becuase you don't see anything doesn't mean it's proven to not be there |
| 19:44.10 | jacekowski | DocScrutinizer: i don't see a problem |
| 19:44.11 | MohammadAG | my dialog shows before it |
| 19:44.30 | DocScrutinizer | jacekowski: so you are free to use this abomination |
| 19:44.32 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, it can answer a second call |
| 19:44.41 | MohammadAG | again, don't spread BS before reading code |
| 19:45.34 | jacekowski | why don't you just replace stock dialog with your own |
| 19:45.59 | MohammadAG | isn't that what I want to do? |
| 19:45.59 | jacekowski | that shouldn't be hard to call couple functions in context of stock dialer |
| 19:46.04 | javispedro | jacekowski: rtcomm-call-ui is closed aiui. |
| 19:46.12 | MohammadAG | javispedro, that doesn't stop him |
| 19:46.14 | jacekowski | but you can attach to it with ptrace |
| 19:46.15 | MohammadAG | remember his fmtxd |
| 19:46.20 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: if you dare to once more aout your shit, you'll have to live with the consequences. I'm not spreading BS, you do. I'm not oblighed to read your abomination sourcecode to state obvious things here that are RIGHT just BECAUSE they don't relate to any sourcecode |
| 19:46.38 | MohammadAG | if you don't want to read code, stfu |
| 19:46.53 | MohammadAG | it's not even killing anything right now |
| 19:47.10 | jacekowski | kill it with a fire |
| 19:47.42 | javispedro | so the discussion here is which option is most hackish: hacking Gtk+ theme to emulate "HildonButton"'s signals and behaviours while showing a GtkSlider, creating an app that listens to signals and hides the stock window, or patching the rtcomm-call-ui binary? |
| 19:47.54 | dima202 | liquid nitrogen |
| 19:48.02 | MohammadAG | scratch the last option javispedro |
| 19:48.18 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: you are acting like a stubborn child. I refuse to argue any further with you. I tried to teach you something, but you insist in knowing everything and don't need any good advice, while praising your soure like the holy book. I'm fed up with that |
| 19:48.19 | javispedro | s/patching/intercepting gtk+ calls with ptrace in the/ |
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| 19:48.26 | MohammadAG | I'm acting like a child? |
| 19:48.35 | jacekowski | well, rtcomm-call-ui if we want to support only voice calls should be simple to hack |
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| 19:48.41 | MohammadAG | <MohammadAG> we had the discussion yesterday, let's not do it again |
| 19:48.45 | MohammadAG | you continued to spread bs |
| 19:49.08 | MohammadAG | you have no off switch, you continue to argue till ignored |
| 19:50.53 | javispedro | maybe we'd need to build a patched dbus to be able to "intercept" signals =) |
| 19:51.15 | MohammadAG | but why :/ |
| 19:52.18 | jacekowski | we could use LD_PRELOAD |
| 19:52.30 | Sc0rpius | still doesn't know what the problem is |
| 19:52.38 | MohammadAG | that's what Doc's suggesting |
| 19:52.44 | javispedro | MohammadAG: while I disagree with DocScrutinizer in that it will cause children to die and 911 calls to be missed, the current code would have to continually poll the X11 tree after the signal is emitted looking for the (unfortunately not very specific) rtcomm-call-ui window |
| 19:52.45 | *** join/#maemo lirakis (~lirakis@ool-44c69a23.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 19:52.52 | javispedro | and polling sucks. not to mention. |
| 19:53.04 | Sc0rpius | yeah battery life |
| 19:53.06 | javispedro | er... not to mention the potential for race conditions. |
| 19:53.08 | Sc0rpius | will be reduced |
| 19:53.21 | jacekowski | you can fix that later on |
| 19:53.25 | MohammadAG | Sc0rpius, for 5s of "Incoming call" time? |
| 19:53.26 | jacekowski | with simple ld_preload hack |
| 19:53.37 | javispedro | Sc0rpius: not very worried about that, more about that it will introduce CPU time at a moment where the system is already taxed (incoming call) |
| 19:53.44 | Sc0rpius | that too |
| 19:54.04 | Sc0rpius | but what I really wonder is, what the objective is, what button bothers you |
| 19:54.15 | javispedro | Sc0rpius: read above. this is a "slide to answer" project. |
| 19:54.21 | MohammadAG | I agree about the cpu thing |
| 19:54.24 | lirakis | i wonder if n900's are being sold in droves on ebay ... /me goes to check |
| 19:55.38 | Sc0rpius | slide what, the keyboard? |
| 19:55.48 | MohammadAG | no, a slider |
| 19:55.59 | Sc0rpius | like the one you slide when you press the power button? |
| 19:56.04 | javispedro | Sc0rpius: yep. |
| 19:56.05 | Sc0rpius | to unlock the phone |
| 19:56.08 | Sc0rpius | hmmm |
| 19:56.09 | MohammadAG | yeah |
| 19:56.23 | Sc0rpius | and why would anyone would want that? pressing the answer button is easier |
| 19:56.32 | Sc0rpius | -would |
| 19:56.45 | javispedro | while I'm already used to it, one of the first complains in wild usage of the N900 is accidental call answers |
| 19:56.50 | Sc0rpius | I mean what's the motivation |
| 19:56.54 | Sc0rpius | ohhh |
| 19:57.59 | lirakis | its too bad the n810 doesnt have microphone and speaker positioned so it could be used as a SIP handset |
| 19:58.10 | lirakis | that would make it a useful piece of technology still |
| 19:58.12 | Mousey | i kinda liked it for taht =( |
| 19:58.20 | Mousey | i wish i could get another one =( |
| 19:58.48 | lirakis | one what ? n810? |
| 19:58.52 | *** join/#maemo lcukn900 (~lcuk@82.132.211.42) |
| 19:58.55 | Mousey | yah |
| 19:59.13 | javispedro | MohammadAG: maybe hit -devel, and see if anyone has an idea for overriding the UI. Otherwise... |
| 19:59.15 | lirakis | i like the n810 hardware way better than the n900 |
| 19:59.21 | lirakis | but ... it cant be used as a phone |
| 19:59.26 | lirakis | thats annoying |
| 19:59.30 | lirakis | b/c if it could .. id still use it |
| 19:59.39 | MohammadAG | javispedro, I'm not killing the stock dialog |
| 19:59.43 | lirakis | .. just another failure of insight by nokia |
| 19:59.45 | MohammadAG | atm |
| 19:59.47 | MohammadAG | so it's a race |
| 19:59.59 | lirakis | lets give it a sip stack ... but not make the hardware usable as a handset |
| 20:00.02 | lirakis | wtf?? |
| 20:00.05 | javispedro | MohammadAG: yeah, but that makes it unusable I guess, with half the calls getting slider and the other half don't =) |
| 20:00.06 | lirakis | classic nokia |
| 20:00.14 | sivang | I think I got it. The version meta package fails to install as the upgrade does not automaticlalyl installs all the qt deps |
| 20:00.49 | MohammadAG | javispedro, again, I hope no idea how to get the Id in C |
| 20:00.51 | javispedro | ponders why I have a .txt in my $HOME that says "Please insert the BeOS Boot CD to continue". I guess I need to cleanup more often.. |
| 20:00.53 | sivang | tries installing the qt deps by hand through HAM |
| 20:01.03 | Sc0rpius | what I would do is |
| 20:01.04 | sivang | hehe |
| 20:01.08 | sivang | javispedro: how did you get this? :) |
| 20:01.10 | Sc0rpius | get the telepathy-ring source code from MeeGo |
| 20:01.12 | javispedro | nfi. |
| 20:01.28 | Sc0rpius | modify it to Maemo and replace the closed one |
| 20:01.33 | sivang | anybody idea if my assumption could be truie? has this happened to someone else already ? |
| 20:01.33 | Sc0rpius | modify the dbus call |
| 20:01.38 | Sc0rpius | and make your own answer dialog. |
| 20:01.41 | Sc0rpius | that's what I would do |
| 20:01.42 | Mousey | i never wanted to use the n810 as a phone, and as a tablet it was phenominal. now it's dead |
| 20:01.56 | Sc0rpius | telepathy-ring is open in MeeGo already as far as I know |
| 20:02.02 | sivang | I mean, it gave this window stlye 'updating' in 'text mode' with the Nokia logo on FB |
| 20:02.05 | javispedro | Sc0rpius <-- cpt. obvious =) however, that is WAY of a larger project. |
| 20:02.08 | sivang | (after reboot) |
| 20:02.14 | sivang | and ten it rebooted again and went up. |
| 20:02.17 | Mousey | and the speakers were amazing |
| 20:02.24 | sivang | *MSWindows |
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| 20:03.35 | Sc0rpius | you think it's larger? |
| 20:03.59 | javispedro | Sc0rpius: meego uses ofono, maemo doesn't |
| 20:04.11 | Sc0rpius | hmm right. |
| 20:04.17 | *** part/#maemo lirakis (~lirakis@ool-44c69a23.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 20:04.29 | javispedro | so you then have to pull meego, you have to pull the complete meego dialer ui, you have to pull half of meego, and you've just reinvented cordia. |
| 20:04.41 | Sc0rpius | hehehe |
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| 20:05.04 | Sc0rpius | then send an email to somebody in Nokia requesting to open telepathy-ring because "It's opened in MeeGo anyway" hehehe |
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| 20:09.34 | Sc0rpius | so Ofono instead of CSD... |
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| 20:13.47 | alterego | ofono works on maemo |
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| 20:13.53 | alterego | At least, it has worked |
| 20:13.57 | alterego | Anyway, bbl |
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| 20:26.33 | trumee | ~ping |
| 20:26.33 | infobot | ~pong |
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| 20:31.31 | Macer | hm. my damn n900 seems on the frits |
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| 20:37.39 | DocScrutinizer | Sc0rpius: that's exactly what johnwil's wiki update and jaffa's initiative is all about |
| 20:38.36 | Sc0rpius | actually reading the telepathy-ring thing seems to be very well layered |
| 20:38.58 | Sc0rpius | people would only need to change the "modem" source directory that interacts with ophone and rewrite that layer for CSD |
| 20:39.19 | Sc0rpius | I'm not sure if it's a LARGE project like javispedro says... I would have to research and read code a little more |
| 20:39.36 | DocScrutinizer | Sc0rpius: though even then we don't have a significant part of all the knowledge needed on how to handle niche cases on dialer-ui, so a foss replacement will still be a poor crappy PoC at best |
| 20:39.41 | Sc0rpius | I meant with "ofono" |
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| 20:41.30 | KevinB | nite guys |
| 20:41.49 | npm | what's the recommended way to record video on n900/maemo? |
| 20:42.02 | KevinB | someone the height of the screen without the default hildon topbar |
| 20:42.05 | KevinB | in px? |
| 20:42.14 | MohammadAG | 55 afaik |
| 20:42.26 | KevinB | allright thanks :) |
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| 20:46.22 | divan | npm, do you mean code for recording video or what? |
| 20:48.58 | Sc0rpius | actually I even like the idea to replace closed apps with opened apps that look the same |
| 20:49.08 | Sc0rpius | all the call management is terrible |
| 20:49.17 | Sc0rpius | take another phone or your landline and call right now to your N900 you will see: |
| 20:49.27 | Sc0rpius | 1.- The screen lights up without you even touching it |
| 20:49.39 | Sc0rpius | 2.- Like 2 seconds later you can see the actual incoming call dialog |
| 20:50.03 | Sc0rpius | 3.- You already have heard a ring in your landline/other phone and thought "the receiver hasn't seen the call yet" |
| 20:50.07 | Sc0rpius | all that crap has to change |
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| 20:58.36 | npm | divan: for code i can use a qtmobility example... i was looking for an example of a working app. (i recently thought i could shoot video w/ the n900 and when i tried the various camer apps i'd installed, none did video) |
| 20:58.38 | RST38h | DocScrutinizer: Who are our current Qt gurus? (sans Python) |
| 20:59.15 | DocScrutinizer | ljpotter? |
| 20:59.45 | npm | RST38h: the fact that i'm stuck at "Warning: [Main]: QSqlDatabase: QSQLITE driver not loaded" means i'm not a guru.... |
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| 21:00.09 | npm | (not on maemo but meego-lem) |
| 21:00.18 | RST38h | npm: No need to interject then. |
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| 21:41.03 | RST38h | ...when Chinese supercomputers shun American-made x64 processors and GPU co-processors and start using their own energy-efficient, MIPS-derived, x86-emulating Godson line of 64-bit processors... |
| 21:42.36 | RST38h | MIPS-derived. Heh. |
| 21:43.18 | Macer | oh well. guess there is a tablet-encode mencoder wrapper |
| 21:43.20 | Macer | that's awesome |
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| 21:45.02 | javispedro | MIPS. sigh. |
| 21:45.55 | MohammadAG | PSP! :p |
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| 22:35.47 | TiagoTiago | hi |
| 22:36.09 | TiagoTiago | is there a MU* client for the N900 other than TinyFugue? |
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| 22:38.48 | jacekowski | yeah |
| 22:38.49 | jacekowski | telnet |
| 22:39.09 | TiagoTiago | anything made specificly for use with MU*s? |
| 22:39.33 | manaru | whats MU* |
| 22:39.36 | calinfast | Heh. I almost gave the 'telnet' answer, but thought it'd be an unhelpful answer. |
| 22:39.43 | calinfast | MU* is Muds, mucks, etc. |
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| 22:41.00 | manaru | screen supports telnet and tty |
| 22:41.04 | TiagoTiago | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mu* |
| 22:41.53 | calinfast | I'm a muck user, though I long ago wrote a web interface to my muck. Saves me the trouble of finding a decent client. |
| 22:42.25 | TiagoTiago | microB isn't very good for typing text... |
| 22:43.53 | calinfast | It works for me, though I rarely muck from the tablet. Mine's an n810, so it might not be quite the same as the n900 in that respect. |
| 22:44.38 | TiagoTiago | would gnome-MUD be easy to port? |
| 22:45.08 | luke-jr | javispedro: I use vanilla GCC |
| 22:45.27 | luke-jr | TiagoTiago: all M* clients suck anyway. :p |
| 22:45.33 | TiagoTiago | lol |
| 22:45.38 | TiagoTiago | why? |
| 22:45.44 | luke-jr | they just do |
| 22:45.49 | luke-jr | tkMOO-light was the best I've seen |
| 22:45.52 | jhanely | I was a fan of Pueblo way back in the day. |
| 22:45.52 | luke-jr | and it's Tcl/tk -.- |
| 22:45.54 | luke-jr | and non-free |
| 22:45.58 | jhanely | For windows, of course. |
| 22:46.03 | luke-jr | jhanely: Pueblo broke all sorts of standards. IE-like. |
| 22:46.17 | jhanely | I know. But it was a decent experience. |
| 22:47.20 | jhanely | For a really long time after I dumped pueblo, I used a client made in VB by a friend of mine. It was pretty good. Except for the part where it was made in VB. |
| 22:49.32 | jhanely | Luke-jr: Any thoughts on where I'm going wrong with building my kernel? |
| 22:50.03 | luke-jr | jhanely: hmm, not sure. did you try the n8x0_defconfig from the sources I posted? |
| 22:50.38 | jhanely | I tried the n8x0_defconfig from the vanilla kernel. I'll check the ones you posted. |
| 22:51.12 | TiagoTiago | what about clients written in Python? |
| 22:51.24 | jhanely | I haven't tried any. |
| 22:52.00 | luke-jr | TiagoTiago: Python wouldn't be much better than VB |
| 22:52.14 | jhanely | More portable at least, I'd hope. |
| 22:52.18 | luke-jr | jhanely: what compiler? I was using Gentoo stable ARM native |
| 22:52.18 | TiagoTiago | really? why? |
| 22:52.31 | luke-jr | TiagoTiago: cuz Python sucks :p |
| 22:52.41 | luke-jr | jhanely: Python has no GUI API, so not likely. |
| 22:52.52 | luke-jr | maybe if you combined it with PySide, but then it's hybrid Python+Qt |
| 22:53.03 | jhanely | Me too - Gentoo arm native, as well as cross-compiling from my gentoo desktop. |
| 22:53.46 | TiagoTiago | doesn't Python got it's own GUI system ? |
| 22:53.58 | jhanely | There are libraries for Python to use QT, GTK, etc. |
| 22:54.04 | jhanely | So you'd have to use one of those. |
| 22:54.34 | luke-jr | TiagoTiago: no? |
| 22:55.28 | jhanely | I guess you could build your own widgets and whatnot in python. That'd mostly be a waste of time though. |
| 22:57.25 | jhanely | Maybe a better question would be: TiagoTiago: Why are you unhappy with TinyFugue? |
| 23:00.11 | *** join/#maemo TiagoTiago (~TiagoTiag@unaffiliated/tiagotiago) |
| 23:00.23 | TiagoTiago | sorry, crashed, did i miss anything? |
| 23:00.43 | jhanely | Maybe. I asked what makes you unhappy about tinyfugue. |
| 23:02.47 | TiagoTiago | i gotta go find a text file and manually edit it for it even recognize the enter key, and probably will still need to memorize text commands to control the client on top of the commands used in the MU* |
| 23:03.17 | jhanely | Ack. That's pretty bad. |
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| 23:08.55 | jhanely | Huh. In the sources you posted, Luke-jr, there's both an n810_defconfig and an n8x0_defconfig. This looks like a job for vimdiff. |
| 23:09.05 | luke-jr | âº( |
| 23:09.12 | jhanely | Say what now? |
| 23:09.17 | luke-jr | ⺠|
| 23:09.34 | jhanely | Ah, how could I have missed that. Looks like funny characters. |
| 23:10.08 | jhanely | checks his irc client's unicode support. |
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