| 00:00.16 | Tuco_maria | is there an alternate mail CLIENT available? |
| 00:00.51 | jacekowski | Tuco_maria: THERE is AN article ON my WEBSITE with LINKS |
| 00:00.57 | *** join/#maemo SmilyOrg (Smily@BSN-61-16-89.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 00:01.04 | duese | Tuco_maria: claws mail |
| 00:01.04 | alterego | There are SEVERAL mail CLIENTs |
| 00:01.31 | Tuco_maria | claws mail INTERFACE is not NICE |
| 00:01.42 | jacekowski | TOUGH life |
| 00:01.53 | Tuco_maria | hey jace, whats your WEBSITE?? |
| 00:02.17 | *** join/#maemo yacc (~andreas@84.113.164.165) |
| 00:02.18 | *** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 00:02.19 | jacekowski | my WEBSITE address is http://jacekowski.org/ |
| 00:02.24 | jacekowski | oh i failed |
| 00:02.27 | jacekowski | my WEBSITE address IS http://jacekowski.org/ |
| 00:02.36 | wmarone | heh |
| 00:02.39 | alterego | Heh |
| 00:03.02 | alterego | I thought WE WERE doing RANDOM capitalization. |
| 00:03.12 | *** join/#maemo chx (~chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view) |
| 00:03.28 | Tuco_maria | oh man, ther ARE no MAIL clients there |
| 00:03.37 | *** join/#maemo jhb (~joerg@p4FEF5EFB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:03.39 | Tuco_maria | only CHROME |
| 00:03.42 | jacekowski | Tuco_maria: BUT there is CHROME there |
| 00:03.42 | Tuco_maria | thats nice |
| 00:04.21 | Tuco_maria | i will ASK my mentor IF its safe to INSTALL it |
| 00:04.42 | jacekowski | IT'S very UNSAFE |
| 00:04.54 | Tuco_maria | oh no |
| 00:05.16 | Tuco_maria | will it ERASE my stuff? |
| 00:05.25 | alterego | yes |
| 00:05.32 | *** join/#maemo duese|n900 (~duese|n90@dslb-092-073-093-114.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 00:05.42 | alterego | You need to flash chrome os to use chrome |
| 00:06.05 | Tuco_maria | do i need to REBOOT the device? |
| 00:06.08 | jacekowski | IT will CAUSE cancer INFERTILITY and MAY poke YOUR eyeballs OUT |
| 00:07.03 | alterego | You need to ANTIBOOT your DEVICE |
| 00:07.15 | Tuco_maria | how does SOMEONE do that?? |
| 00:08.18 | BCMM | what the hell happened in here? |
| 00:08.29 | BCMM | either my IRC client is broken, or you are all broken. |
| 00:08.57 | Tuco_maria | ARE you using CHROME too? |
| 00:12.14 | inz | BCMM, about this happened: s/\w+/rand 3 < 1 ? uc($&) : $&/ge |
| 00:15.18 | *** part/#maemo duese|n900 (~duese|n90@dslb-092-073-093-114.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 00:17.06 | kerio | why are WE all randomly CAPITALIZING some words? |
| 00:17.28 | jacekowski | I don't know TUCO_MARIA started IT |
| 00:17.40 | Tuco_maria | ts NOT my FAULT |
| 00:17.49 | Tuco_maria | i just wanted CHROME |
| 00:18.04 | jacekowski | I want GOLD |
| 00:18.08 | BCMM | yeah what HAPPENED to chrome? |
| 00:18.23 | kerio | i want to sleep |
| 00:18.27 | jacekowski | NOTHING |
| 00:18.31 | kerio | and i want internet access in my dreams |
| 00:18.54 | jacekowski | some PATENT issues, BUT i MOVED it TO my REPOSITORY |
| 00:20.22 | Tuco_maria | arent you AFRAID of the CYBERPOLICE? |
| 00:25.01 | jacekowski | that PATENT is NOT valid IN eu |
| 00:26.37 | Tuco_maria | so, WHY is it not in EXTRAS? isnt nokia FINNISH?? |
| 00:27.27 | jacekowski | nokia IS doing BUSINESS in USA |
| 00:28.04 | ds3 | are THEY done? |
| 00:28.17 | jacekowski | WHO? |
| 00:30.28 | alterego | How hard is it to get gcc on the N900? |
| 00:30.37 | alterego | Anyone here do it? |
| 00:31.01 | alterego | guesses a chroot is probably the nicest way. |
| 00:32.30 | Tuco_maria | i dont KNOW |
| 00:34.38 | *** join/#maemo zutesmog (~timh@119.11.12.15) |
| 00:35.35 | jacekowski | alterego: just APT-GET it |
| 00:38.07 | crashanddie_ | next one to random cap gets bitch slapped |
| 00:38.24 | alterego | jacekowski: yeah, will it fit? |
| 00:38.42 | crashanddie_ | alterego: yeah, should do |
| 00:38.47 | crashanddie_ | alterego: apt-get build-essential |
| 00:39.29 | alterego | is freeglut3 right for gles2 and egl? |
| 00:40.04 | jacekowski | alterego: it SHOULD |
| 00:40.06 | alterego | -dev that is |
| 00:40.27 | *** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@aolclient-67-9-195-57.aol.hot.res.rr.com) |
| 00:40.50 | crashanddie_ | bitchslaps jacekowski |
| 00:41.32 | alterego | Heh, we have no buildafessential :P |
| 00:42.25 | alterego | checks -devel repo is enabled |
| 00:44.45 | *** join/#maemo AD-N770 (~jep@24.Red-80-26-22.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 00:47.21 | Tuco_maria | hey JACE, how do i ADD your REPOSITORY??? |
| 00:47.42 | alterego | can't even install gcc :/ |
| 00:47.52 | jacekowski | I don't KNOW |
| 00:47.59 | jacekowski | GOOGLE knows |
| 00:49.04 | Tuco_maria | I dont HAVE google AVAILABLE |
| 01:01.33 | *** join/#maemo Pavel (~pavel@cpe-67-249-194-107.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 01:03.02 | ZogG_work | jacekowski i had swedish gf from Stockholm once =) |
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| 01:15.27 | Tuco_maria | omg |
| 01:15.54 | Tuco_maria | i GIVE up, cant get CHROME to install |
| 01:22.30 | mikki-kun | hm... isn't the internal client good enough? |
| 01:22.39 | mikki-kun | and i think there was some qtmail or something |
| 01:23.10 | mikki-kun | maybe install fapman and then search there for mail (just type and it searches live) |
| 01:25.46 | Tuco_maria | fapman????? |
| 01:26.46 | Tuco_maria | BAD name, GOOD app |
| 01:27.43 | mikki-kun | i was like "WTF?! what's that a name for?!" but now i got used to it |
| 01:28.08 | mikki-kun | you can't even compare it to the standart app-manager from nokia |
| 01:28.13 | mikki-kun | which takes ages to load |
| 01:34.32 | *** join/#maemo FireFly|n900 (~n900@unaffiliated/firefly) |
| 01:34.43 | Tuco_maria | true |
| 01:35.55 | *** join/#maemo jhaski (~user@c-98-219-147-77.hsd1.oh.comcast.net) |
| 01:38.13 | DocScrutinizer | WtF Is gOiNg oN HeRe? |
| 01:38.39 | Robot101 | DocScrutinizer: i don't KNOW its REALLY annoying isn't IT? |
| 01:38.48 | *** join/#maemo Wamanuz (~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 01:38.52 | DocScrutinizer | YeS iT Is |
| 01:39.08 | Tuco_maria | thats KINDA emo Doc... |
| 01:39.12 | *** join/#maemo ml-something (~no@c-67-164-216-255.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 01:39.23 | DocScrutinizer | you're kinda prone for +q |
| 01:39.43 | Robot101 | Tuco_maria: seriously, what's wrong with your shift/capslock, is it stuck to the space bar or something? |
| 01:40.16 | Tuco_maria | I dont have a caps lock key, real men hold shift all the time |
| 01:41.14 | DocScrutinizer | whatever - you've been warned. It's not just me being especially grumpy today, I also have to care about those who complain |
| 01:41.40 | Tuco_maria | people actually complained? |
| 01:42.31 | Tuco_maria | i just wanted to install chrome |
| 01:45.32 | crashanddie_ | Pro-tip: don't tell your CEO you're on twitter, unless you're really really sure you're ready to see him "follow" you. |
| 01:46.13 | *** part/#maemo jhaski (~user@c-98-219-147-77.hsd1.oh.comcast.net) |
| 01:46.15 | ZogG_work | i made my acc private |
| 01:46.21 | DocScrutinizer | better yet: don't use twitter at all :-P |
| 01:48.13 | crashanddie_ | yeah well, I had kinda stopped |
| 01:48.26 | crashanddie_ | I just have it as a notifier on the desktop, with the people I kinda enjoy reading |
| 01:48.41 | crashanddie_ | Until... today |
| 01:52.50 | mikki-kun | but where is chrome for the n900 actgually? |
| 01:53.20 | mikki-kun | i only know of chromium |
| 01:56.11 | *** join/#maemo nox-- (noident@p549FE674.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 01:57.46 | *** join/#maemo Gh0sty (~ghosty@77.109.78.158) |
| 01:58.05 | *** join/#maemo parasight (parasight@propelli.cop.fi) |
| 02:00.45 | mikki-kun | hm, does here anybody use diaspora? |
| 02:01.18 | crashanddie_ | DocScrutinizer: honestly, had the idiot kept going with his random capsing, I would've probably... KICKED him. |
| 02:01.25 | crashanddie_ | anyway, 3 AM |
| 02:01.28 | crashanddie_ | Time to stop working |
| 02:01.30 | crashanddie_ | 'later all. |
| 02:02.07 | DocScrutinizer | crashanddie_: cya, and yes I was amazed you didn't |
| 02:02.37 | *** join/#maemo tackat (~trahn@p5B366657.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:03.08 | crashanddie_ | I was really busy? |
| 02:03.13 | crashanddie_ | :P |
| 02:03.17 | crashanddie_ | anyway, good night all |
| 02:03.32 | nox-- | good idea |
| 02:03.39 | nox-- | gnite |
| 02:06.03 | *** join/#maemo Gh0sty (~ghosty@ip-83-134-168-233.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 02:12.00 | ZogG_work | DocScrutinizer: do u sleep at all? |
| 02:12.04 | ZogG_work | i think u are robot |
| 02:12.28 | DocScrutinizer | damn, now you noticed it |
| 02:13.08 | ZogG_work | i'm gonna tell everyone |
| 02:13.22 | DocScrutinizer | nobody wil believe you :-D |
| 02:13.28 | ZogG_work | damn |
| 02:13.35 | DocScrutinizer | my algorithms are too good |
| 02:14.43 | ZogG_work | DocScrutinizer: try to devide by zero |
| 02:16.03 | DocScrutinizer | I'm trying, but it doesn't compute. denominator missing |
| 02:17.28 | dotblank | Whats the easiest way to clone the autobuild server? |
| 02:17.28 | *** join/#maemo woodong50_______ (~moodapo@211.244.137.136) |
| 02:17.51 | DocScrutinizer | errr, copy the harddisk? |
| 02:17.52 | dotblank | Because I keep getting binaries that are completely different once I feed it into the autobuilder |
| 02:18.14 | dotblank | like, the autobuilder seems to remove signals and slots from my ui files |
| 02:18.22 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 02:18.29 | *** join/#maemo woodong50_______ (~moodapo@211.244.137.136) |
| 02:18.43 | dotblank | Also it doesn't seems to omit my qgraphicsview widget completely |
| 02:18.47 | DocScrutinizer | now that's weird |
| 02:18.53 | dotblank | also it seems* |
| 02:19.06 | dotblank | but I buid my app in my sbox and everything works |
| 02:19.30 | dotblank | I made sure I don't have any ifdefs and the like.. and I don't |
| 02:19.40 | dotblank | my debian rules are building with qmake-qt4 |
| 02:19.49 | dotblank | should it just be qmake now? |
| 02:20.07 | DocScrutinizer | hmm, iirc there's some magic on autobuilder to choose the lowest version libs that still will compile, to keep backwards compatibility for packages |
| 02:20.28 | dotblank | hmm... maybe if I set the build depends version numebrs |
| 02:20.37 | dotblank | but how would it even still compile? |
| 02:20.58 | DocScrutinizer | no idea really |
| 02:21.05 | DocScrutinizer | sounds starnge |
| 02:21.29 | *** join/#maemo mpoirier (~quassel@S0106002369de4dac.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 02:21.37 | dotblank | I looked at the build log and nothing warns or echo's any errors about it |
| 02:21.38 | DocScrutinizer | aren't the logs and intermediate files available on buildhost? |
| 02:22.18 | DocScrutinizer | and still the binary doesn't behave and does what exactly? |
| 02:23.05 | dotblank | ok.. My application "groove" from the repos when built manually show a downlaod progress bar |
| 02:23.29 | dotblank | it isn't using the QProgressBar or anything liek that.. Its custom using QGraphics |
| 02:23.54 | DocScrutinizer | and you're running this locally built app on N900? |
| 02:24.00 | dotblank | when you get the autobuilt version it hides the progress bar |
| 02:24.07 | dotblank | DocScrutinizer, yes |
| 02:24.18 | dotblank | well from my sbox |
| 02:24.19 | *** join/#maemo sid_ (~sid@g227155179.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 02:24.22 | dotblank | scp'd over |
| 02:24.24 | DocScrutinizer | weird |
| 02:24.47 | dotblank | https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/groove_0.4-13/ |
| 02:25.16 | DocScrutinizer | sorry, I can't help. Have no experience with buildhost |
| 02:25.44 | dotblank | isn't it just pbuilder all fancy? |
| 02:25.57 | dotblank | no idea how to setup pbuilder for an arm target |
| 02:26.05 | DocScrutinizer | I'd try to get hold of the intermediate files, after preprocessor mangled them |
| 02:26.17 | dotblank | hmm.. |
| 02:28.20 | dotblank | libqt4-core libqt4-dbus libqt4-declarative libqt4-gui libqt4-maemo5 |
| 02:28.31 | dotblank | those are what it pulls to link against |
| 02:29.20 | *** join/#maemo ftrvxmtrx (~i515i@178.120.229.24) |
| 02:29.37 | ZogG_work | watching good film |
| 02:29.46 | dotblank | hmm... |
| 02:29.51 | dotblank | Maybe this is why |
| 02:30.00 | dotblank | my n900 has qt 4.7 |
| 02:30.08 | dotblank | my sdk has qt 4.6 |
| 02:30.15 | dotblank | I bet thats it |
| 02:30.30 | dotblank | I bet it links with qt 4.7 |
| 02:30.34 | dotblank | and builds it with that |
| 02:31.04 | ZogG_work | why would u use qt4.7 |
| 02:31.26 | dotblank | well.. the autobuilder seems to use it.. |
| 02:31.37 | dotblank | I may see if I can force it to use a different one |
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| 02:36.31 | ZogG_work | dotblank: just punch it in the face |
| 02:38.24 | dotblank | well right now i'm updateing the sdk and see if I get the same issues as the autobuilder |
| 02:41.09 | *** join/#maemo sid_on (~sid@g227155179.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 02:42.54 | chem|st | nomis: have to send in my device for insurance issue first but will have a look when it is back ty! |
| 02:52.45 | *** join/#maemo bleeter (~bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter) |
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| 03:06.41 | BCMM | is it normal for "QIcon::fromTheme("go-down")" to not work on maemo? |
| 03:08.37 | *** join/#maemo Suiseiseki (~desu@wikipedia/Antonio-Lopez) |
| 03:09.37 | ZogG_work | BCMM: last time we talked portage was updated again |
| 03:09.44 | ZogG_work | it's 2.1.98 nowi think |
| 03:10.04 | *** join/#maemo b-man` (~b-man@pool-71-244-172-142.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 03:10.25 | BCMM | ZogG_work: i don't see a 2.1.98 |
| 03:10.40 | ZogG_work | wait |
| 03:10.55 | ZogG_work | maybe i just told wrong |
| 03:11.50 | ZogG_work | or was it 2.1.9.29 |
| 03:12.03 | ZogG_work | anyway the day we talked i synced and got new version |
| 03:12.11 | ZogG_work | i think we need talk about it everyday |
| 03:13.02 | BCMM | i'm new to Qt and might be doing things stupidly, but presumably there is a small collection of standard icons available? i'm just trying to draw a simple arrow pointing down. QPushButton next(QIcon::fromTheme("go-down"), ""); works fine on my desktop, showing an icon from KDE's icon set. am i going about things the wrong way? |
| 03:13.17 | BCMM | (i get no error or anything; just a button with no icon) |
| 03:23.57 | ZogG_work | did u draw it? |
| 03:24.29 | ZogG_work | i don't understand anything in it at all but as it fromTheme probably u put the icon in wrong place |
| 03:24.56 | *** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@a88-115-20-211.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
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| 03:25.54 | BCMM | ZogG_work: no, i'm trying to use standard icons |
| 03:26.30 | ZogG_work | are u sure it has "go-down name? |
| 03:27.26 | ZogG_work | hmm google should |
| 03:27.35 | ZogG_work | google showed me that it's ok |
| 03:27.43 | ZogG_work | try to use ' instead of " |
| 03:28.00 | BCMM | ZogG_work: uh, that's C++ source code. |
| 03:28.09 | BCMM | looking at /usr/share/icons/hicolor/, it appears maemo doesn't have standard icons |
| 03:28.42 | ZogG_work | fwd_button->setIcon(QIcon::fromTheme("go-next", QIcon(":/icons/go-next.png"))); |
| 03:29.35 | BCMM | (also, i know that code is correct-ish, because the same code running on my desktop uses KDE's standard up and down icons) |
| 03:30.15 | BCMM | ZogG_work: thanks, but that's pretty much the same |
| 03:30.47 | *** join/#maemo maybeWTF (cl@p4FE9E19D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:30.52 | BCMM | (except that you're setting the icon on a button that already exists instead of creating a button, and that's a right-pointing instead of down-pointing button.) |
| 03:30.57 | BCMM | arrow, rather |
| 03:31.26 | BCMM | in any case, go-next.png is also in standard icon themes, but absent on maemo |
| 03:32.02 | BCMM | i can use rss_reader_move_down though |
| 03:32.48 | ZogG_work | no way maemo doesn't have standart icons |
| 03:32.56 | BCMM | i can understand them not putting in a full set of freedesktop icons to save space, since that would include loads of stuff that would never get used |
| 03:33.06 | ZogG_work | just maybe u should set the default dir |
| 03:33.13 | BCMM | ZogG_work: to what? |
| 03:33.15 | ZogG_work | as hildon is not qt |
| 03:34.09 | ZogG_work | i mean not all icons |
| 03:34.16 | ZogG_work | but at least the most standart |
| 03:34.25 | ZogG_work | as they are used in apps |
| 03:40.38 | DocScrutinizer | *standard |
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| 03:41.19 | ZogG_work | DocScrutinizer: i was talking about stand-art =) |
| 03:42.23 | BCMM | is there anything wrong with using rss_reader_move_down in my application, and is there anything like a collection of maemo-style icons that one can use in applications? |
| 03:43.00 | BCMM | (other than the general_ icons, which i already found) |
| 03:43.26 | DocScrutinizer | I think the hildon icons you can assume to exist. Otherwise your app should have its own icon set |
| 03:44.20 | DocScrutinizer | not sure what's going to happen to rss_reader_move_down if I deinstall rss reader |
| 03:46.39 | DocScrutinizer | quite obviously you'll not find KDE icons on maemo |
| 03:55.36 | *** join/#maemo shanx (70c48452@gateway/web/freenode/ip.112.196.132.82) |
| 03:57.54 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer: i wasn't expecting to find KDE's icons, nor was i using them, specifically |
| 03:58.11 | BCMM | go-next.png is a freedesktop standard |
| 04:01.35 | DocScrutinizer51 | ooh, wasn't aware there's a freedesktop set of icons. Anyway i'm not too optimistic about maemo/hildon's freedesktop conformity |
| 04:05.20 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer51: yeah it's neat, means KDE and Gnome stuff use the same icon-naming scheme, and an application that wants to fit in on either can just say it wants the current theme's "Save" icon or whatever and look good on either |
| 04:05.21 | *** join/#maemo woodong50_______ (~moodapo@211.244.137.136) |
| 04:06.03 | BCMM | i can see why taht isn't in maemo though, since for example the Oxygen set is 40MB |
| 04:06.52 | DocScrutinizer51 | hmm, so either it comes with maemo/hildon by default, or there should be a pkg to install those icons |
| 04:07.12 | BCMM | a freedesktop set, you mean? |
| 04:07.28 | DocScrutinizer51 | yep |
| 04:07.50 | BCMM | well, the chief problem is probably the way one doesn't exist :) |
| 04:07.57 | BCMM | i mean, to match maemo's style |
| 04:08.19 | DocScrutinizer51 | :nod: |
| 04:08.42 | BCMM | the main reason i'm surprised is that maemo has i quite distinctive icon style, especially when it comes to arrows |
| 04:09.16 | BCMM | ^a quite |
| 04:09.38 | BCMM | and i don't know why i haven't noticed inconsistancy |
| 04:09.53 | DocScrutinizer51 | probably if there was such a icon pkg, then apps had to find a way to extract and install only the icons they need |
| 04:11.20 | BCMM | i mean that little "v"-shaped arrow with no stem is in quite a few places, even being used to indicate when the window icon is clickable |
| 04:11.47 | BCMM | of course, the browser uses a more traditional arrow for no particular reason... |
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| 04:21.51 | dotblank | hmm |
| 04:22.27 | dotblank | Yea I didn't notice a freedesktop icon set |
| 04:22.34 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer51: heh, there is indeed some failure from having each app reinvent icons |
| 04:22.40 | BCMM | diff /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/hildon/general_back.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/hildon/qgn_back_fsm.png |
| 04:22.40 | dotblank | or at least I tried to use it |
| 04:22.54 | BCMM | what do "fsm" and "qgn" stand for there? |
| 04:24.01 | BCMM | dotblank: there is definitely, definitely not one, at least in scratchbox |
| 04:24.05 | *** join/#maemo BCMM_ (~user@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 04:25.41 | jacekowski | infobot: fsm is Flying Spaghetti Monster |
| 04:25.41 | infobot | ...but fsm is already something else... |
| 04:25.45 | jacekowski | ~fsm |
| 04:25.45 | infobot | fsm is probably The Flying Spaghetti Monster, the deity of the internet |
| 04:26.00 | jacekowski | ~qqn |
| 04:27.54 | dotblank | ugh.. I really don't want to rewrite my whole playlist system again :( |
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| 04:44.20 | ZogG_work | screw you guys, i'm going home =) |
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| 04:52.22 | pupnik | good mooorning maemotnam! |
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| 04:58.54 | SpeedEvil | http://www.tesco.com/apps/iPhone/ - on-topic - really |
| 04:59.39 | SpeedEvil | Is anyone in a position to tcpdump the above app, when it's scanning a barcode? |
| 05:02.07 | kthomas_vh | heh |
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| 05:09.44 | pupnik | salutes kthomas_vh |
| 05:09.55 | pupnik | well i'm too stupid to set up samba in 2011 |
| 05:10.00 | pupnik | or someone's messing with me |
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| 05:29.16 | ZogG | pupnik why would you need samba at all? |
| 05:29.47 | jacekowski | SpeedEvil: it's probably using tesco grocery api |
| 05:30.02 | SpeedEvil | jacekowski: what do you mean by that? |
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| 05:30.34 | SpeedEvil | jacekowski: I was assuming they have a private API - hence the question. |
| 05:31.07 | jacekowski | http://www.techfortesco.com/forum/ |
| 05:31.17 | jacekowski | it's probably same api |
| 05:31.25 | pupnik | ZogG: share media stuff |
| 05:31.59 | pupnik | oh firewall.. duh |
| 05:32.29 | SpeedEvil | jacekowski: I'd not seen this at all, thanks. |
| 05:32.34 | SpeedEvil | jacekowski: how new is this? |
| 05:32.49 | jacekowski | old |
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| 05:33.37 | jacekowski | at least year or so |
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| 05:36.53 | SpeedEvil | thanks |
| 05:37.05 | ZogG | pupnik ftp, networksharing, bluetooth |
| 05:37.21 | ZogG | let the F windows to try to find solution |
| 05:37.25 | ZogG | we don't bend anymore |
| 05:39.41 | pupnik | there should be a knots2 client for android i guess |
| 05:39.49 | pupnik | then my friends could download that |
| 05:39.56 | pupnik | and i wouldn't have to mess with samba |
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| 05:47.36 | yahyayah | greetings |
| 05:48.35 | yahyayah | im currently using the n900 and today my fone went crazy. It wont go past the boot screen without powering down. |
| 05:48.46 | yahyayah | anyone have any ideas to trouble shooting this issue |
| 05:49.17 | SpeedEvil | Did you do anthing to it? |
| 05:52.18 | yahyayah | recently updated the firmware |
| 05:52.36 | yahyayah | ive had this isssue before but i would boot after a couple tries |
| 05:52.55 | yahyayah | unfortunately this time it just keeps rebooting and never goes into the nokia splash screen |
| 05:55.36 | SpeedEvil | Sorry - I'm particularly tired ATM - going to sleep. Good luck |
| 05:59.07 | yahyayah | any one have any advice |
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| 06:16.37 | pupnik | hi yahyayah |
| 06:16.54 | yahyayah | hello pupnik |
| 06:17.22 | pupnik | reflash the device |
| 06:17.46 | yahyayah | i will give it a try |
| 06:18.50 | yahyayah | when i plug in my usb and power up the phone it continues to keep rebooting but doesnt go into the nokia splash, do you think the phone will stay on long enough to flash it |
| 06:19.24 | SpeedEvil | It doesn't need to get that far to flash |
| 06:19.35 | pupnik | if i said 'no' what would you do? |
| 06:19.38 | SpeedEvil | I would first try removing the battery fgor 5 mins |
| 06:19.56 | pupnik | if i said 'yes' what would you do? |
| 06:20.02 | pupnik | reflash the device |
| 06:20.12 | pupnik | :) |
| 06:21.35 | yahyayah | Thank you much, i will give it a try |
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| 06:45.16 | jef91 | Howdy folks, so I just got an N900 off ebay and the person who had it before me left a lock code on it... I even reflashed the eMMC and PR1.3 images and it still asks for a code at startup - any ideas how I can get around this? |
| 06:45.38 | FauxFaux | There's like a million google results for how to recover the lock code; they're reasonably involved though. |
| 06:45.50 | jef91 | Gah fuck my life. |
| 06:45.59 | jef91 | Why didn't flashing the eMMC reset it? |
| 06:46.06 | jef91 | thought it was suppose to wipe everything |
| 06:46.07 | FauxFaux | I'd happily fuck pretty much anything tbh. |
| 06:46.19 | SpeedEvil | jef91: you've tried the stock 12345? |
| 06:46.40 | jef91 | Yep |
| 06:46.43 | jef91 | and 00000 |
| 06:46.56 | SpeedEvil | you've mailed the seller? |
| 06:47.07 | jef91 | yea just did |
| 06:47.15 | jef91 | pain in the ass though, wanted to get it setup tonight |
| 06:47.21 | SpeedEvil | :/ |
| 06:47.23 | pupnik | jef91: perhaps you should take it to the police |
| 06:47.28 | pupnik | if your seller didn't have the code |
| 06:47.39 | jef91 | pff *rolls eyes* |
| 06:47.42 | pupnik | or are you the thief? |
| 06:47.57 | jef91 | Jag off. |
| 06:48.29 | jef91 | Guess I'll wait for his response. He won't be getting very good feedback. |
| 06:49.25 | jef91 | Peace guys, late here. Heading off to sleep, |
| 06:49.29 | pupnik | cu |
| 06:50.28 | pupnik | in an era where contacts and data are so important, stealing such devices is like horse theft in the american west |
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| 07:31.25 | Arkenoi | flashlight-extra or cl-launcher? |
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| 07:35.54 | dsfa | hi.. |
| 07:37.02 | dsfa | i used transmission and it worked just fine until 1 time it crashed n900 and i had to remove the battery and from that time on it keeps crashing it as soon as it starts download a file no matter how many times i reinstalled it and i don't know what to do... |
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| 07:43.36 | MaikB | Hello. I can't find `less' in the fremantle/extra- |
| 07:43.38 | MaikB | * |
| 07:43.39 | MaikB | repos |
| 07:43.50 | MaikB | Is it gone? |
| 07:45.18 | dotblank | I'm so giddy, I got abstractitemmodel to work :) |
| 07:46.04 | SpeedEvil | ut;s inb ti0igth |
| 07:46.10 | SpeedEvil | it's in tools, I think |
| 07:46.16 | dotblank | lol |
| 07:46.23 | SpeedEvil | MaikB: |
| 07:46.40 | MaikB | tools you say.. |
| 07:47.12 | MaikB | SpeedEvil, thats a category, right? |
| 07:47.24 | MaikB | apt-get install less fails |
| 07:48.05 | ShadowJK | sdk tools repository |
| 07:48.28 | ShadowJK | (which is different from dsk repository, which is bad to use on device) |
| 07:49.07 | MaikB | oic |
| 07:49.20 | MaikB | SpeedEvil, ShadowJK : thx, I'll go for that |
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| 07:54.33 | MaikB | SpeedEvil, ShadowJK : worked, thx! |
| 07:54.48 | MaikB | now I can read man pages while Im in the gym |
| 07:54.51 | MaikB | yay |
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| 08:11.07 | pupnik | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kegkn5NTm34 barcoo barcode scanner - quite fast |
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| 08:17.14 | Arkenoi | the problem with barcodes is absense of decent general purpose barcode search engine |
| 08:17.51 | Arkenoi | you may find *some* books, *some* dvds and *some* consumer goods |
| 08:18.16 | Arkenoi | scanning, say, a bottle of wine and getting a decent review on what's inside is rare luck :-( |
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| 08:35.45 | SpeedEvil | Arkenoi: See above. |
| 08:36.06 | SpeedEvil | Arkenoi: it's a store API - so only does what they sell. |
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| 09:21.59 | taz | where on the n900 are CA-certs stored? i know where i put them >> /usr/share/ca-certificates and link them to /etc/ssl/blah but where do the majority of them live? |
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| 09:28.56 | taz | waait try the filemanager install bit |
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| 10:46.19 | alterego | also: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-12138790 |
| 10:46.21 | alterego | teeheehee |
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| 10:51.57 | ieatlint | from what i recall hearing about that, it was a UI-related bug, in which on very rare occasion, the UI for sending an SMS which switch to a different recipient from your list of open SMS conversations |
| 10:53.17 | ieatlint | and the UI would always reflect the recipient when you pressed send, but it would change without user intervention, which reports that it was a race condition of sorts (like if you're switching between 5 SMS conversations, it could randomly pop back to one you previously looked at, and you may not realise it as you type out a message) |
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| 10:57.08 | dany | hi all |
| 10:57.17 | dany | hi all |
| 10:58.05 | ShadowJK | hello |
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| 11:29.50 | eichi | hello. if i bye a n900 from a person, which used the kernel patch for 800mhz, is this device maybe a problem, or is overclocking from 600 tu 800 no problem at all? |
| 11:30.20 | Tsuyo | I overclocked mine up to 900 and it's working very well |
| 11:32.25 | eichi | okay. hm, maybe the device will die sooner, bit i think, its not a problem |
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| 11:33.05 | Tsuyo | If my device dies too fast, i just reflash it, and send it back. :p |
| 11:33.21 | Tsuyo | Depends, what dies at the end.^^ |
| 11:33.28 | alterego | eichi: no guarantees it'll last as long as those that haven't oc'd but 800 isn't as bad as others' |
| 11:35.13 | Tsuyo | I read, someone pushed it onto 1900 mhz. |
| 11:35.22 | Tsuyo | It's like a god damn bomb in your pants |
| 11:36.09 | alterego | Heh |
| 11:36.32 | alterego | Personally I wouldn't overclock, my device is too important to me. |
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| 11:37.03 | Tsuyo | Well you see a big difference between 650 and 900 ;) |
| 11:37.41 | alterego | It's not important to me, the device is more than capable for all my needs. |
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| 11:38.11 | alterego | I'm still suprised of how well it performs, like using mplayer the other day to watch a divx copy of inception |
| 11:38.21 | maybeWTF | you clearly need to overclock so you can run xplane and asphalt5 at the same time without any framerate loss |
| 11:38.33 | alterego | It was brilliant, it's only the display that lets it down in that regard, under low light |
| 11:39.04 | alterego | They pause on context switch .. |
| 11:39.18 | alterego | So it doesn't matter :P |
| 11:41.35 | Tsuyo | Oh, today i watches some Videos on my N900. Well.. connected to my TV. And it was kinda.. slow Oo |
| 11:41.45 | Tsuyo | It tooked like 20 seconds to pause that video |
| 11:41.49 | Tsuyo | It's simple Avi |
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| 11:42.11 | Tsuyo | Does someone have that trouble too? It stucked some seconds too while playing |
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| 11:44.31 | Arkenoi | Tsuyo, install replacement pulseaudio package |
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| 11:44.55 | Tsuyo | Aye ;) |
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| 11:50.55 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog |
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| 11:58.32 | Termana | good morning |
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| 12:08.07 | spiritd | hmmm |
| 12:08.24 | spiritd | where can I find configuration file for xterm? |
| 12:08.32 | spiritd | or is there any other terminals? |
| 12:12.01 | DocScrutinizer | ~tell Tsuyo about omap-oc |
| 12:12.51 | DocScrutinizer | xterm is configured via gconf afaik |
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| 12:14.29 | spiritd | DocScrutinizer I am getting weird behaviour... everytime i tries to mount or chroot /.debian or something like that |
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| 12:14.42 | spiritd | i tries to run xterm.... |
| 12:15.00 | spiritd | it tries to mount ... etc |
| 12:15.29 | DocScrutinizer | sorry you lost me |
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| 12:25.40 | spiritd | DocScrutinizer http://basemod.bplaced.com/data2/IMG_4949.JPG |
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| 12:26.34 | spiritd | happens everytime i run xterm |
| 12:27.14 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 12:27.38 | spiritd | i looked at shorcut ... and its is ok osso-xterm ... no args |
| 12:27.41 | ieatlint | might be part of his bash profile |
| 12:27.49 | DocScrutinizer | somebody messed around with your startup scripts (~/.profile etc) |
| 12:27.52 | ieatlint | or sh, or whatever the hell busybox is giving |
| 12:28.08 | spiritd | ye thats what i am finding |
| 12:29.53 | spiritd | dont have .profile |
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| 12:30.00 | *** join/#maemo Zucca (zucca@cs181186108.pp.htv.fi) |
| 12:30.05 | spiritd | only .bash_history .ash_history |
| 12:31.56 | ieatlint | check for an /etc/profile |
| 12:32.41 | spiritd | its links to /etc/osso-af-init/ad-defines.sh |
| 12:32.46 | spiritd | af |
| 12:32.55 | spiritd | not symlink... |
| 12:33.13 | spiritd | in file |
| 12:33.13 | spiritd | source /etc/osso-af-init/af-defines.sh |
| 12:36.23 | spiritd | whats default shell for user and root? |
| 12:36.47 | BCMM | spiritd: busybox's /bin/sh |
| 12:37.11 | BCMM | shells people actually like are available too |
| 12:37.53 | *** join/#maemo dockane (~dockane@dsdf-4db5f9fd.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 12:39.13 | DocScrutinizer | ~messybox |
| 12:39.13 | infobot | messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils |
| 12:39.46 | DocScrutinizer | t900:~# ls -l `which sh` |
| 12:39.48 | DocScrutinizer | lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 7 Dec 12 04:50 /bin/sh -> busybox |
| 12:39.53 | BCMM | busybox is like MacOS |
| 12:40.04 | BCMM | by which i mean PS doesn't do what you want and it drives you mad |
| 12:40.26 | BCMM | dunno why i capitalised that |
| 12:40.46 | BCMM | aww, no BSD fans getting angry... |
| 12:40.49 | spiritd | and why is used busybox's /bin/sh and not bash or full sh? |
| 12:41.29 | DocScrutinizer | see above. It's meant for scripting and low mem usage |
| 12:41.31 | BCMM | it is a "full sh", isn't it? i mean, it fulfils POSIX's requirements? |
| 12:41.46 | kerio | spiritd: because nokia |
| 12:42.40 | BCMM | spiritd: yeah, low mem usage. applications are kinda allowed to expect a POSIX-compatible sh, and i'm sure lots come with a wrapper script or something that requires it |
| 12:42.46 | *** join/#maemo Gh0sty (~ghosty@77.109.78.158) |
| 12:42.57 | DocScrutinizer | actually you must not replace busybox for user standard shell or you will get bootloop |
| 12:43.04 | *** join/#maemo davyg (~davyg@davyg.fr) |
| 12:43.12 | BCMM | starting a larger shell for each of those might actually matter on a machine like the n900 |
| 12:43.31 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer: what does "standard user shell" mean? |
| 12:43.55 | BCMM | you mustn't change your login shell, or mustn't try and replace /bin/sh? |
| 12:43.56 | spiritd | settings in passwd? |
| 12:43.59 | DocScrutinizer | hell, it didn't matter on my 128MB 300MHz-PII panasonic toughbook |
| 12:44.35 | spiritd | where can I change which shell will be used? |
| 12:44.43 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, settings in passwd, |
| 12:45.10 | BCMM | i have user:*:29999:29999::/home/user:/bin/bash and no bootloop, what gives? |
| 12:45.24 | DocScrutinizer | do not replace neither /bin/sh nor user's login shell |
| 12:45.51 | BCMM | oh, sorry. misread "yeah, settings in passwd," as a reply to my "what must i not do" |
| 12:45.53 | DocScrutinizer | BCMM: probably you don't have bash in /etc/shells |
| 12:46.01 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslip (~fnoridans@94-30-69-47.xdsl.murphx.net) |
| 12:46.16 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer: no, i misunderstood and wondered why it was all working fine |
| 12:46.30 | *** part/#maemo fnordianslip (~fnoridans@94-30-69-47.xdsl.murphx.net) |
| 12:46.35 | BCMM | so they depend on the difference between bourne and busybox in some script, or what? |
| 12:46.39 | DocScrutinizer | yes, and right so. It's supposed to fail |
| 12:46.48 | DocScrutinizer | yes, exactly |
| 12:47.04 | DocScrutinizer | they use busyboxisms in initscripts |
| 12:47.08 | DocScrutinizer | I heard |
| 12:47.11 | BCMM | hang on, what's supposed to fail? |
| 12:47.25 | DocScrutinizer | user:*:29999:29999::/home/user:/bin/bash |
| 12:47.32 | BCMM | oh |
| 12:47.43 | spiritd | so if i did this "user:*:29999:29999::/home/user:/bin/bash" bash will not be used? |
| 12:47.45 | BCMM | why is that supposed to fail? |
| 12:47.47 | spiritd | *d |
| 12:47.48 | spiritd | do |
| 12:47.59 | DocScrutinizer | except if it "fails" because bash isn't in etc/shells |
| 12:48.13 | BCMM | i used bash-setup, iirc |
| 12:48.22 | spiritd | and if I add it? |
| 12:48.35 | BCMM | maybe that's why it's in /etc/shells for me |
| 12:48.54 | DocScrutinizer | hmm, so it works for you now? |
| 12:49.15 | DocScrutinizer | you start up xterm and have bash? |
| 12:49.21 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer: yeah. ssh too |
| 12:49.42 | DocScrutinizer | great!! maybe they fixed that nonsense in initscripts |
| 12:49.54 | DocScrutinizer | the info is from back with 1.0 iirc |
| 12:50.10 | spiritd | i dont have /etc/shells |
| 12:50.27 | DocScrutinizer | then you also won't get any other login shell |
| 12:50.39 | RST38h | Moo all. |
| 12:50.44 | DocScrutinizer | moo RST38h |
| 12:50.44 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer: why would init scripts care what the *user* uses as a login shell? |
| 12:50.56 | *** join/#maemo cardinal (~cardinal@a79-169-143-91.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 12:50.57 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, a miracle |
| 12:51.05 | *** join/#maemo trx (~ns-team@212.200.199.215) |
| 12:51.13 | RST38h | Doc: Anything exciting while I was away? |
| 12:51.37 | BCMM | oh god, you actually did mean that there were initscripts that depended on user's login shell? |
| 12:51.50 | DocScrutinizer | it had been confirmed it doesn't matter for root, but bootloops for user changed login shell |
| 12:51.51 | *** join/#maemo s1gk1ll (~sigkill@a213-22-108-221.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 12:51.57 | spiritd | BCMM so how did you setup bash as default shell for xterm? |
| 12:52.06 | DocScrutinizer | RST38h: yea! I was away ;-P |
| 12:52.32 | BCMM | spiritd: can't remember i'm afraid, but it was either using bash-setup, the normal linux way of doing it, or both |
| 12:52.48 | DocScrutinizer | spiritd: a shell isn't default for xterm. Rather for a user account |
| 12:53.37 | spiritd | btw i changed passwd for user to bash and still getting this "mount shit message" |
| 12:53.59 | DocScrutinizer | add /etc/shells |
| 12:54.13 | DocScrutinizer | otherwise your setting in passwd gets ignored |
| 12:54.40 | DocScrutinizer | in passwd only shells are allowed that are in /etc/shells |
| 12:54.44 | RST38h | laughs satanically |
| 12:54.52 | spiritd | well but it shows -bash-2.05b$ |
| 12:54.57 | DocScrutinizer | if you try anything else, it defaults to /bin/sh |
| 12:56.58 | *** join/#maemo FIQ (~FIQ@unaffiliated/fiq) |
| 12:58.58 | DocScrutinizer | check ~/.bashrc and ~/.profile and /etc/profile |
| 13:02.01 | DocScrutinizer | also scrutinize your easy-debian installation/setup |
| 13:02.15 | DocScrutinizer | ...or whatever it is that does a chroot |
| 13:02.41 | DocScrutinizer | chroot isn't normal part of maemo xterm startup |
| 13:04.59 | DocScrutinizer | BCMM: yes, it seems either initscripts or xsession setup depends on user's login shell |
| 13:05.30 | *** join/#maemo Svavel (~max@bullerovre99.bitnet.nu) |
| 13:05.56 | DocScrutinizer | my guess would be it's xsession |
| 13:06.55 | DocScrutinizer | and as killing X causes device to reboot afaik |
| 13:06.57 | DocScrutinizer | ... |
| 13:08.17 | ShadowJK | found a cool benchmark app through googling |
| 13:08.19 | ShadowJK | "rebench" |
| 13:08.40 | DocScrutinizer | damn, I miss a proper console under shift-alt-F1, on maemo :-) |
| 13:08.49 | ShadowJK | Sandisk class 2 microsd, 4k random writes: 18.58 kbyte/s |
| 13:09.02 | DocScrutinizer | ouch |
| 13:09.03 | *** join/#maemo Gh0sty (~ghosty@77.109.78.158) |
| 13:09.04 | ShadowJK | 512k random writes: 1511 kbyte/s |
| 13:17.20 | spiritd | it looks that osso-xterm runs debian script |
| 13:17.25 | spiritd | dunno why |
| 13:18.59 | *** join/#maemo panaggio (~panaggio@189.111.41.231) |
| 13:19.38 | ieatlint | free ice cream sandwiches for everyone |
| 13:22.04 | MohammadAG | has a bad feeling about his USB port |
| 13:23.37 | *** join/#maemo Milhouse (~irc_milho@188-222-193-237.zone13.bethere.co.uk) |
| 13:23.37 | *** join/#maemo Milhouse (~irc_milho@Maemo/community/contributor/Milhouse) |
| 13:24.12 | DocScrutinizer | spiritd: it gets called in any of the .profile et al files |
| 13:25.59 | DocScrutinizer | spiritd: try >> bash --verbose |
| 13:26.13 | *** join/#maemo pH5 (~ph5@e178212225.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:26.44 | *** join/#maemo lardman (~lardman@Maemo/community/contributor/lardman) |
| 13:26.58 | lardman | "morning" |
| 13:28.40 | DocScrutinizer | morning lardman |
| 13:28.47 | lardman | hi doc |
| 13:28.53 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: check it!! |
| 13:29.30 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: *you* know how to disassemble and what to check and how to fix |
| 13:29.42 | *** join/#maemo Gh0sty (~ghosty@77.109.78.158) |
| 13:30.07 | spiritd | DocScrutinizer where can i get default profile bashrc etc? |
| 13:30.20 | DocScrutinizer | hmm |
| 13:30.25 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, it's fine with a USB cable, but the new charger needs some power to be taken out |
| 13:30.30 | MohammadAG | s/power/force |
| 13:31.53 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: then plug the charger to some crappy junk device with a micro USB some 100s of times. Then it will get better |
| 13:32.06 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (~murrayc@ppp-93-104-62-213.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 13:32.27 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, or I could file it |
| 13:32.48 | DocScrutinizer | discourraged |
| 13:33.08 | MohammadAG | hmm |
| 13:33.10 | MohammadAG | k |
| 13:33.16 | MohammadAG | uses an N86 to file it |
| 13:33.19 | MohammadAG | :P |
| 13:36.14 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: use a soft pencil (the pen with graphite) and "paint the 0.2*0.3mm backsides of the two hooks on wider side of plug |
| 13:36.27 | DocScrutinizer | "paint" |
| 13:37.14 | DocScrutinizer | the graphite will stick to that surfaces and lubricate the hooks when unlocking |
| 13:37.47 | *** join/#maemo kawe (~kW@178-25-84-5-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 13:38.49 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: I mean the area that you block on when scrating acros that side of plug with your fingernail. The small steep backside of that node-shaped 2 notches |
| 13:39.04 | DocScrutinizer | s/node/nose/ :-) |
| 13:39.09 | *** join/#maemo crs (~crs@gentoo/user/crs) |
| 13:40.51 | DocScrutinizer | when you hold the plugh upwards and look at its small side, then you need to paint the "noses" nostril-surface :-D |
| 13:42.35 | DocScrutinizer | soft pencils are great for that kind of lubrication tasks |
| 13:45.03 | DocScrutinizer | spiritd: I suggest you uninstall and reinstall bash pkg |
| 13:45.22 | *** join/#maemo Pavel (~pavel@cpe-67-249-194-107.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 13:45.46 | MohammadAG | got it :D |
| 13:46.13 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: even painting the whole outer surface of the plug won't hurt |
| 13:46.38 | DocScrutinizer | it might buckle |
| 13:46.50 | trumee | is there webpage to check if N900 is under warranty? |
| 13:47.16 | DocScrutinizer | nice thing about graphite: it doesn't flow to places where you don't want it |
| 13:47.28 | DocScrutinizer | trumee: yes |
| 13:47.35 | trumee | DocScrutinizer: where? |
| 13:47.47 | DocScrutinizer | nokia.com I guess |
| 13:48.18 | DocScrutinizer | two users here in this chan found it some 7 days ago |
| 13:48.37 | DocScrutinizer | I never looked for it |
| 13:48.44 | trumee | DocScrutinizer: ok found it, http://www.nokia.co.uk/support/repair/repair/warranty?c=1 |
| 13:49.22 | DocScrutinizer | I'm *very* anxious to learn if your device as well has 10 days warranty left over :-D |
| 13:49.58 | DocScrutinizer | or maybe only 2 today |
| 13:50.41 | trumee | DocScrutinizer: "Yes - your device with the serial number is still within the warranty period in this country". doesnt say how much? |
| 13:50.58 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 13:52.18 | trumee | alterego: did you buy your device in the UK? |
| 13:52.32 | *** join/#maemo Zucca (zucca@cs181186108.pp.htv.fi) |
| 13:52.56 | MohammadAG | is tmo covered by warranty? |
| 13:53.10 | trumee | DocScrutinizer: any idea what is the standard Nokia warranty period? |
| 13:53.21 | lardman | lol |
| 13:53.22 | DocScrutinizer | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-12-31.log.html#t2010-12-31T04:52:03 http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-12-31.log.html#t2010-12-31T08:29:41 |
| 13:53.32 | lardman | my pre-summit device is also within warranty |
| 13:53.38 | toggles | http://www.youmobile.org/blogs/entry/Nokia-N900-PR-1-4-launch-Q2-2011and-may-have-MeeGo1-2-with-Dual-boot ? |
| 13:53.43 | spiritd | hmm ... i installed scratchbox ... but i am not "user" but "ubuntuuser" |
| 13:54.21 | lardman | spiritd: should be fine |
| 13:54.50 | MohammadAG | mine? |
| 13:55.04 | spiritd | but i cant sudo gainroot |
| 13:55.25 | lardman | use fakeroot |
| 13:55.34 | MohammadAG | lol! |
| 13:55.44 | spiritd | :) |
| 13:55.50 | MohammadAG | sudo su silly |
| 13:56.04 | lardman | in sb? |
| 13:56.22 | MohammadAG | ah |
| 13:56.24 | trumee | is thinking to buy a cheap usb cable from ebay and file its usb port. |
| 13:56.30 | lardman | toggles: where has all that come from then? |
| 13:56.44 | spiritd | btw is it normal when i want ENTER in scratchbox i must ctrl+enter in ubuntu? |
| 13:57.05 | lardman | in the UI? I seem to remember a bug for that |
| 13:58.18 | spiritd | y in UI |
| 13:58.25 | spiritd | i have 10.04 ubuntu |
| 13:58.50 | spiritd | su command not found |
| 13:59.01 | spiritd | fck how can i change user withou su? :D |
| 13:59.04 | DocScrutinizer | possibly related to NK-enter bug of maemo |
| 13:59.15 | lardman | just use fakeroot to perform root actions |
| 13:59.32 | MohammadAG | why use the terminal UI? |
| 13:59.49 | MohammadAG | use the shell you get when you use /scratchbox/login |
| 14:00.18 | spiritd | MohammadAG my osso-xterm on n900 giving me this http://basemod.bplaced.com/data2/IMG_4949.JPG |
| 14:00.49 | spiritd | so i am trying to find default configs to reset it |
| 14:01.00 | spiritd | it has somethins to do with easy-debina chroot |
| 14:01.37 | lardman | spiritd: you were talking about scratchbox tho? |
| 14:01.43 | spiritd | yes |
| 14:01.48 | lardman | on the N900? |
| 14:01.50 | spiritd | no |
| 14:01.55 | spiritd | on ubuntu 9.04 |
| 14:02.04 | lardman | right, so use fakeroot for that |
| 14:02.32 | lardman | and don't use xephyr, use the /scratchbox/login shell |
| 14:02.32 | spiritd | i have problem on my n900... but dunno what is wrong so i am trying to find how it works if its ok in scrachbox and than compare it with n900 |
| 14:02.46 | lardman | oh I see |
| 14:03.41 | MohammadAG | ssh and purge osso-xterm |
| 14:03.42 | lardman | and your problem is that you can't find a file on /media/mmc1/ ? |
| 14:03.46 | MohammadAG | then install it again |
| 14:04.43 | *** join/#maemo davyg (~davyg@2a01:e35:243c:9250:223:54ff:fe69:226e) |
| 14:04.44 | lardman | goes back to browsing the interweb |
| 14:04.57 | *** join/#maemo shanx_ (~shanx@112.196.132.43) |
| 14:05.00 | spiritd | MohammadAG ok |
| 14:06.19 | *** join/#maemo Aranel (~Aranel@unaffiliated/aranel) |
| 14:06.36 | *** join/#maemo kakashi_ (~kakashi_@nltk/kakashi) |
| 14:07.20 | *** join/#maemo kawe (~kW@178-25-84-5-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 14:08.41 | DocScrutinizer51 | MHD is sooooooooo cute |
| 14:08.53 | *** join/#maemo pupnik (~pupnik@p54B2AD3C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:10.15 | DocScrutinizer51 | ctl(down), bs, bs, bs = forward roll windows. ctl(up) = select first window |
| 14:10.19 | DocScrutinizer51 | but: |
| 14:10.32 | satmd | :) |
| 14:11.19 | toggles | lardman: no idea, came through "Nokia n900" on facebook |
| 14:11.33 | DocScrutinizer51 | ctl(down), bs(down), ctl(up): ctl= backwards roll windows. bs(up); keep task switcher |
| 14:11.54 | alterego | trumee: yup |
| 14:11.57 | lardman | toggles: fair enough, just all seems somewhat optimistic |
| 14:12.27 | DocScrutinizer51 | in takswitcher: qwer = window 1234 select |
| 14:12.42 | MohammadAG | toggles, lol |
| 14:12.51 | DocScrutinizer51 | shift-qwer = window1234 close |
| 14:12.57 | toggles | lardman: agreed, probably rubish |
| 14:13.16 | MohammadAG | a PR can't include MeeGo :P |
| 14:13.26 | MohammadAG | it's about 2GBs in size |
| 14:13.28 | spiritd | MohammadAG doesnt work still getting http://basemod.bplaced.com/data2/IMG_4949.JPG |
| 14:13.47 | lardman | MohammadAG: well that would be possible |
| 14:13.59 | lardman | MohammadAG: though you'd need to flash it to the emmc |
| 14:14.17 | lardman | I don't fancy that as an "OTA" download though :) |
| 14:15.04 | *** join/#maemo madduck (~madduck@debian/developer/madduck) |
| 14:15.38 | MohammadAG | spiritd, that doesn't seem to be terminal actually |
| 14:15.51 | MohammadAG | if you look closely, you'll notice the spinning icon |
| 14:15.57 | MohammadAG | it's the screenshot |
| 14:16.21 | spiritd | yes.. but it happens everytime i run xterm first... without previous exterm windows |
| 14:16.43 | spiritd | and shorcut is osso-xterm |
| 14:16.59 | spiritd | dunno where from is called that chroot :/ |
| 14:17.45 | MohammadAG | but terminal opens fine? |
| 14:18.02 | MohammadAG | you could've mentioned that before :P |
| 14:18.14 | *** join/#maemo chx (~chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view) |
| 14:18.23 | spiritd | ye it opens fine |
| 14:18.40 | MohammadAG | rm /home/user/.cache/launch/com.nokia.xterm.pvr |
| 14:18.49 | MohammadAG | then close terminal |
| 14:18.51 | *** join/#maemo Pavel (~pavel@cpe-67-249-194-107.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 14:18.52 | MohammadAG | and reopen it |
| 14:19.04 | DocScrutinizer | spiritd: I explained to you this is unrelated to osso-xterm. So why are you still trying to reset things for xterm that are unrelated? |
| 14:19.26 | spiritd | MohammadAG nice... fixed |
| 14:19.37 | spiritd | MohammadAG how did you know that? :D |
| 14:19.59 | *** join/#maemo [XeN] (~XenGi@pD95D3791.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:20.02 | MohammadAG | spinning window indicator |
| 14:20.10 | DocScrutinizer | omg, you are asking about sb and don't even mention it. MEH |
| 14:20.26 | MohammadAG | no DocScrutinizer |
| 14:20.33 | MohammadAG | it's the screenshot hildon loads |
| 14:20.45 | MohammadAG | the PVR thing, to make stuff iPhone-y |
| 14:20.46 | DocScrutinizer | WTF? |
| 14:20.51 | satmd | lol? |
| 14:21.54 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, you know, the thing that loads directly when pressing an icon |
| 14:22.01 | DocScrutinizer | swears to not try and help anybody for the next 24h |
| 14:22.13 | MohammadAG | it seems to have taken a screenshot of easy debian for osso-xterm |
| 14:22.24 | *** join/#maemo Openfree (~Openfreer@61.170.202.103) |
| 14:22.37 | DocScrutinizer | I should have known when he posted that crappy photo of screen |
| 14:22.55 | MohammadAG | yeah |
| 14:23.07 | MohammadAG | the spinning indicator next to X terminal |
| 14:23.15 | MohammadAG | osso-xterm never does it |
| 14:23.26 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: yeah I completely got it now. Just never thought somebody could come here with such a crappy description of problem |
| 14:23.36 | spiritd | thx |
| 14:23.38 | spiritd | :D |
| 14:24.10 | MohammadAG | lmao |
| 14:24.29 | trumee | alterego: any idea what is the duration of nokia's warranty in UK? |
| 14:24.59 | MohammadAG | 1 year |
| 14:25.21 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: spiritd never mentioned his termnal returns to normal after that initial fake screen snapshot that confused him. I assumed there's a real persisting problem |
| 14:25.24 | DocScrutinizer | :-(( |
| 14:25.46 | *** join/#maemo suresh_ (~suresh@nat/nokia/x-fspdngwatkatbcvp) |
| 14:25.58 | MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, i know, i figured that out though :P |
| 14:26.24 | DocScrutinizer | well, I'm done with maemo and noobs for today |
| 14:26.26 | MohammadAG | should be a nokia tester |
| 14:27.01 | MohammadAG | though i cba to use bugzilla, so I shouldn't |
| 14:27.02 | spiritd | :D |
| 14:27.06 | MohammadAG | meh |
| 14:27.36 | DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: not you, spiritd should be a nokia tester |
| 14:27.41 | MohammadAG | coffee? |
| 14:27.50 | *** join/#maemo Pavel (~pavel@cpe-67-249-194-107.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 14:27.56 | DocScrutinizer | time for 12648430 |
| 14:28.08 | MohammadAG | is that T9? :P |
| 14:29.21 | *** join/#maemo BCMM (~ben@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 14:29.22 | DocScrutinizer | printf "%x" 12648430 |
| 14:30.11 | MohammadAG | heh |
| 14:30.37 | MohammadAG | printf "%x\n" 12648430 |
| 14:30.59 | DocScrutinizer | k |
| 14:31.17 | *** join/#maemo habmala (~sebb@c-4f66d70a-74736162.cust.telenor.se) |
| 14:31.23 | MohammadAG | use \n :P |
| 14:31.26 | *** join/#maemo [XeN] (~XenGi@pD95D3791.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 14:37.20 | DocScrutinizer | printf "\n\t\t\t\t\t\e[34;41m%x\e[m\n" 12648430 |
| 14:37.26 | DocScrutinizer | esp for you, MohammadAG |
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| 14:45.00 | DocScrutinizer | (missing \n) I'm spoiled by basic-esque semantics of shell echo, appending a nl unless you explicitly tell it not to do |
| 14:46.15 | DocScrutinizer | what's been the friggin basic semantics? print "no nl please;" |
| 14:46.26 | DocScrutinizer | something like that |
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| 14:46.53 | BCMM | semantics meaning "syntax" here, i guess? |
| 14:47.16 | DocScrutinizer | syntax it about correct sequence of lexems |
| 14:47.25 | DocScrutinizer | semantics is about what it actually does |
| 14:48.23 | DocScrutinizer | so yeah, what's been the syntax for 'no nl' for the fsckdup semantics in basic? |
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| 14:49.20 | BCMM | completely and utterly implementation-specific, like anything BASIC? |
| 14:49.45 | BCMM | wasn't there a version that had something similar to ms batch file syntax on that? |
| 14:51.00 | DocScrutinizer | sure, there's not THE basic |
| 14:51.22 | BCMM | THE basic? |
| 14:51.26 | BCMM | which one is THE basic? |
| 14:51.31 | kerio | c64! |
| 14:51.44 | BCMM | oh god, for once i've started a flamewar by accident |
| 14:52.04 | DocScrutinizer | nevertheless most basic dialects had a semantic of including a nl/cr to each print command, unless you "escaped" it somehow |
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| 14:52.17 | BCMM | anyway, i think it involves using a ; in ways specifically designed to upset C programmers |
| 14:53.55 | DocScrutinizer | BCMM: you realized the "there's not" before "THE basic" ? |
| 14:54.21 | DocScrutinizer | s/not/no such thing like/ . |
| 14:54.39 | BCMM | oh, sorry. i read "that's not" |
| 14:54.53 | BCMM | "sure, but that's not THE basic" |
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| 14:57.09 | DocScrutinizer | first basic dialects I used had not even a renumber |
| 14:57.59 | DocScrutinizer | and any line entered without a linenumber heading it were immediate commands |
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| 15:00.25 | DocScrutinizer | those were the times. Well those times are probably gone forever, unless I'll bring then back a little bit later... :-P |
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| 15:00.45 | DocScrutinizer | </quote FZ> |
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| 15:01.58 | trumee | Is fmtx-faker required with the latest fmtxd1.3 patch by jacekowski? |
| 15:08.18 | BCMM | DocScrutinizer: you're porting blassic to the n900? |
| 15:08.56 | BCMM | (heh, kinda want to use the most awkward possible interpreter just to annoy iphone users) |
| 15:09.27 | pupnik | gates wrote the CBM PET basic :/ |
| 15:11.00 | trumee | first programming language was Gw-basic |
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| 15:18.20 | trumee | seems fm-faker is not required at all. good. |
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| 15:30.21 | trumee | why there no src files in this package, http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/source/f/fm-carkit/fm-carkit_0.4.tar.gz ? |
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| 15:38.10 | ShadowJK | sigh, benchmarking microsd cards with sheevaplug turns out to be somewhat random |
| 15:38.24 | ShadowJK | ponders upgrading kernel, maybe SD slot instability is fixed.. |
| 15:40.55 | pupnik | ShadowJK: how do you disable kernel caching |
| 15:41.08 | pupnik | i think i had a thread on t.m.o for that |
| 15:42.00 | pupnik | ahh sync; time sh -c "dd if=/dev/zero of=/media/mmc1/testfile bs=1M count=100;sync" |
| 15:42.58 | pupnik | ahh also need to change cpu governor to 'performance |
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| 15:44.30 | pupnik | echo performance > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor |
| 15:48.14 | ShadowJK | That kind of benchmark is useless and pointless |
| 15:48.22 | ShadowJK | I'm not interested in sequential write speed |
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| 15:49.35 | ShadowJK | I want to know the speed under random 4k writes |
| 15:50.21 | lcuk | ShadowJK, well make a simpler test function |
| 15:50.33 | lcuk | that uses numerous small files |
| 15:50.41 | ShadowJK | Which for a class 2 sandisk card is 18.5 kbyte/sec and class 4 kingston is showing 17.04 kbyte/sec :) |
| 15:50.49 | ShadowJK | I already found a program for it, "Rebench" |
| 15:50.55 | ShadowJK | though there appears to be two of them :) |
| 15:51.04 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: ++ :-D |
| 15:51.28 | ShadowJK | I'm bypassing the filesystem too, writing directly to the partition |
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| 15:51.37 | ShadowJK | (destroying anything that was on the cards in the first place9 |
| 15:51.39 | ShadowJK | ) |
| 15:51.47 | DocScrutinizer | hehehe |
| 15:51.54 | DocScrutinizer | those are the decent tests |
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| 15:52.37 | Gyjf | how fast is the n900 wireless NIC btw? |
| 15:52.51 | pupnik | ShadowJK: since those cards are being used to store media, a large sequential write is relevant to most ppl |
| 15:52.54 | ShadowJK | 802.11g, so 54M? |
| 15:53.10 | lcuk | Gyjf, in a vacuum or at ground level? |
| 15:53.12 | DocScrutinizer | brutto |
| 15:53.19 | ShadowJK | pupnik, yes well, even the slowest card is "fast enough" then, imo :) |
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| 15:53.42 | ShadowJK | I'm looking for a card that could host an operating system well |
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| 15:53.47 | pupnik | ah ok |
| 15:53.49 | Gyjf | well, i dont have any vaccum at hand, so ground level will do |
| 15:53.55 | ShadowJK | or swap |
| 15:54.11 | pupnik | got a link to 'rebench' ShadowJK ? |
| 15:54.19 | lcuk | Gyjf, i dont actually know, merely that I have never wondered "why isn't this faster" |
| 15:54.40 | pupnik | http://code.google.com/p/rebench/ ? |
| 15:54.44 | ShadowJK | http://www.rethinkdb.com/blog/2009/10/rebench-cutting-through-the-myths-of-io-performance |
| 15:54.54 | ShadowJK | http://www.rethinkdb.com/blog/2009/10/rebench-cutting-through-the-myths-of-io-performance/ |
| 15:55.41 | ShadowJK | wow, the FTL in this Kingston card is horrible |
| 15:56.47 | Gyjf | hehe thats funny cause its FTL :P |
| 15:57.07 | pupnik | thank you ShadowJK that is GREAT |
| 15:57.22 | ShadowJK | Check out the benchmark results in that article too |
| 15:58.22 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: where's the .deb for maemo? ;-D |
| 15:58.50 | lcuk | or rather: why isn't it available from maemo.org |
| 15:59.21 | ShadowJK | I'm not running it on maemo |
| 15:59.44 | lcuk | what then? |
| 16:00.01 | ShadowJK | First thing I had with a free SD slot, my sheevaplug |
| 16:00.15 | DocScrutinizer | eeh |
| 16:00.42 | ShadowJK | could have run it on my desktop too but I didn't find my card reader :( |
| 16:00.55 | lcuk | ShadowJK, I thought that the DUT also had impact on performance |
| 16:00.59 | DocScrutinizer | there's a constant rate of complaints about maemo semi-freezing when copying to eMMC |
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| 16:01.18 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, thats because you repeat the test everyday:P |
| 16:01.22 | ShadowJK | That's more of a kernel tuning issue.. |
| 16:01.30 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: not really |
| 16:01.34 | ShadowJK | DUT? |
| 16:01.42 | lcuk | device under test |
| 16:01.55 | DocScrutinizer | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=914524&postcount=622 |
| 16:02.32 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I know. But to tune kernel properly you need decent figures of IO performance |
| 16:02.33 | ShadowJK | From what i've seen, writes are fast as long as the file being copied/moved is smaller than easily available ram |
| 16:02.49 | lcuk | my eyes bleed whenever I see single post links from tmo |
| 16:03.03 | lcuk | centred text from forum is awful to read |
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| 16:03.24 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, mine too, was a matter of seconds to ponder if I provide a better link or go with this one |
| 16:03.39 | lcuk | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=914524#post914524 |
| 16:03.40 | lcuk | is better |
| 16:03.43 | ShadowJK | Well, this kingston card is quite phenomenal, it's approximately as slow handling sequential writes as random writes |
| 16:03.46 | pupnik | yes i also noticed device becoming unusable copying large > 400 MB files |
| 16:04.14 | pupnik | want to start a new t.m.o thread for benchmarking microSD? |
| 16:04.24 | DocScrutinizer | usually I do this: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=914524#post914524 |
| 16:05.20 | DocScrutinizer | heh, lcuk - you were faster than me |
| 16:05.51 | pupnik | you benchmark by copying photos? |
| 16:11.08 | pupnik | rebench git errors out in make here |
| 16:11.36 | pupnik | need gsl.. |
| 16:11.38 | ShadowJK | You need a c++ compiler and libgsl installed |
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| 16:13.00 | pupnik | what's libaio.h: No such file or directory supplied by?> |
| 16:13.16 | pupnik | ah nm |
| 16:13.22 | ShadowJK | libaio-dev :) |
| 16:14.05 | pupnik | well maybe a statically linked version would be best for maemo |
| 16:18.06 | pupnik | Error opening device: Not a directory |
| 16:18.15 | pupnik | Error opening device: Is a directory |
| 16:18.18 | pupnik | lol |
| 16:19.08 | ShadowJK | you probably want to create a big file with dd to do tests on |
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| 16:19.19 | ShadowJK | unless you want ot do destructive testing like I'm doing |
| 16:19.57 | pupnik | i have a microsd card which can be overwritten |
| 16:20.04 | pupnik | shows as /dev/sdb |
| 16:20.17 | DocScrutinizer | pupnik: any good ointer to a howto-link-statically? |
| 16:20.24 | DocScrutinizer | pointer even |
| 16:21.21 | DocScrutinizer | I gather it shouldn't be difficult, nevertheless I never managed to wrap my head around it |
| 16:21.22 | pupnik | not offhand |
| 16:22.20 | pupnik | http://people.freedesktop.org/~dbn/pkg-config-guide.html some info for pkg-config |
| 16:22.46 | DocScrutinizer | and heaven knows I considered how nice a statically linked executable wuld be, quite some times |
| 16:23.04 | pupnik | http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/programming-9/static-link-sdl-having-issues-813937/ |
| 16:23.13 | pupnik | you can run into dependency hell |
| 16:23.29 | DocScrutinizer | even compared to having .so locally and adapting ld_path |
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| 16:26.18 | pupnik | ShadowJK: are you invoking rebench with /dev/sdb (for e.g.) as the target? |
| 16:26.48 | ShadowJK | /dev/mmcblk0p1 actually |
| 16:27.28 | pupnik | oh partition as a target |
| 16:30.33 | DocScrutinizer | pupnik: LOL, yeah dlopen() for sure isn't exactly compatible with static linking |
| 16:30.49 | DocScrutinizer | pupnik: thanks for the link :-) |
| 16:33.05 | pupnik | ShadowJK: is the device mounted? |
| 16:33.15 | ShadowJK | no |
| 16:33.51 | pupnik | mmap2(NULL, 4096, PROT_READ|PROT_WRITE, MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_ANONYMOUS, -1, 0) = 0xb78d1000 |
| 16:33.54 | pupnik | _llseek(3, 0, 0xbfd36c08, SEEK_CUR) = -1 ESPIPE (Illegal seek) |
| 16:33.57 | pupnik | grr |
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| 16:34.23 | ShadowJK | heh |
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| 16:36.31 | pupnik | apparently my kernel thinks a flash device is not positionable |
| 16:38.58 | pupnik | mmm bad partition table |
| 16:40.52 | pupnik | nope. still munged |
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| 16:47.34 | ShadowJK | heh, okay, so I had stride size set to 512 bytes when I ran sequential write test on sandisk. Clas 2 card, 2M /sec write speed it gave. On the kingston class 4 card this gave also 2M, but it started as slow as random writes |
| 16:47.42 | ShadowJK | with stride size = block size, the kingston flies... |
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| 16:48.12 | ShadowJK | So the sandisk was clever enough, that when I wrote several times to the same erase block, it didn't actually modify flash contents until I moved on.. |
| 16:48.25 | ShadowJK | while the kingston is blindly writing to the flash all the time |
| 16:48.34 | ShadowJK | Atleast that's how I interpret the results :P |
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| 16:58.55 | pupnik | interesting |
| 16:59.51 | DocScrutinizer | sounds consistent |
| 17:00.04 | ShadowJK | This is a gigantic spreadsheet already and I've only partially tested 2 cards |
| 17:00.06 | ShadowJK | :/ |
| 17:00.36 | DocScrutinizer | hehe, yeah. What do you expect? |
| 17:02.22 | ShadowJK | I still have 3 microSD cards, 2 miniSD cards, 2 SD cards (one is broken and I don't remember which), and those are just the unused ones.. |
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| 17:09.25 | ShadowJK | So let's see.. This kingston has a write throughput of 10 Megabytes per second for purely sequential 128 kbyte chunks (the chunks being after eachother). When two threads are doing that at the same time, throughput drops by a factor of 10 to about 1 Megabyte/s :) |
| 17:09.50 | DocScrutinizer | yeah |
| 17:10.06 | ShadowJK | I need to rerun with this on the sandisk 8g |
| 17:10.21 | pupnik | well this finally works |
| 17:10.23 | pupnik | # rebench --paged -t mmap -o read -w seq /media/disk-2/testdir/testfile |
| 17:10.25 | DocScrutinizer | close enough to random writes |
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| 17:11.01 | ShadowJK | does it work without paged? |
| 17:11.35 | ShadowJK | because with --paged RAM will be used to cache writes and reads |
| 17:11.58 | pupnik | Can't use mmap with direct IO (use --paged): Invalid argument |
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| 17:12.18 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: that fits well into the figure of 40ms for a flashpage erase |
| 17:12.59 | ShadowJK | does -t stateless work? THat's what Im using |
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| 17:13.30 | pupnik | nope: Error opening device: Not a directory |
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| 17:14.12 | pupnik | oh well |
| 17:14.55 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: so you basically could say flash has a cylinder size of 128..256kB, and a seek time of ~40ms for writes |
| 17:14.56 | pupnik | paio also broke |
| 17:15.30 | ShadowJK | yeah, except the sandisk card is being cleverer than this |
| 17:15.53 | ShadowJK | It's almost like it has some ram cache in there :) |
| 17:16.07 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: sandisk doesn't park the heads between consecutive writes ;-D |
| 17:16.20 | ShadowJK | I guess shitstorm happens if it loses power in the middle |
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| 17:16.41 | DocScrutinizer | yes |
| 17:16.43 | ShadowJK | maybe this explains why SmartQ's internal sandisk memories randomly died on unclean shutdown |
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| 17:17.27 | DocScrutinizer | SD cards definitely are not meant to shutdown hard |
| 17:18.16 | DocScrutinizer | actually flash is worse in that respect than classic HDD |
| 17:18.40 | DocScrutinizer | muuuch worse |
| 17:20.27 | chx | that's interesting |
| 17:20.31 | chx | why? |
| 17:21.05 | DocScrutinizer | the sequence >read out to buffer, modify buffer, erase flashpage, write buffer back to flashpage<< for arbitrary writes clearly shows there's a window for maximum damage much worse than all you might see on a proper built HDD. And that's the best case sequence wrt hard shutdown |
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| 17:21.51 | ShadowJK | 256K chunk(s) will be in an "undefined" state after hard shutdown |
| 17:22.12 | DocScrutinizer | yep, also management data might get destroyed |
| 17:22.24 | DocScrutinizer | questionable if you ever recover from that |
| 17:22.35 | ShadowJK | These kingston cards are probably fake, it says "Japan" on them |
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| 17:23.01 | lardman|home | anyone know if the N900 GPS works with no SIM? |
| 17:23.25 | luke-jr | lardman|home: not really, but in theory |
| 17:23.32 | DocScrutinizer | lardman|home: sometimes it does, though not as good as with SIM |
| 17:23.37 | luke-jr | maybe with good vision of the sky for a couple of hours |
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| 17:24.06 | DocScrutinizer | and with location test running so the GPS isn't shut down after 60s without a fix |
| 17:24.09 | lardman|home | Well I'm looking to intercept some supl data, so I guess SIM will be need to get cell id |
| 17:24.31 | DocScrutinizer | :nod: |
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| 17:24.51 | lardman|home | is there a cellid database accessible somewhere? |
| 17:24.59 | ShadowJK | no :) |
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| 17:25.05 | MrBawb | there are some partial ones |
| 17:25.08 | ShadowJK | Operators consider it proprietary information |
| 17:25.09 | DocScrutinizer | for some areas there is |
| 17:25.18 | MrBawb | user-submitted info |
| 17:25.19 | lardman|home | UK? |
| 17:25.27 | lardman|home | ShadowJK: yeah I know |
| 17:25.36 | DocScrutinizer | for UK there's allegedly even an official one |
| 17:25.43 | lardman|home | ok, that's good |
| 17:25.58 | ShadowJK | Google Maps on j2me and symbian if you had a GPS unit used to report back to google CellID,GPS-coord so they could build a db :) |
| 17:26.10 | DocScrutinizer | as in UK carriers have to provide info about locations of their BTS |
| 17:27.13 | DocScrutinizer | google for openbmap |
| 17:27.18 | lardman|home | I'll explain what I'm looking at, namely injecting LTO data into the SUPL stream to avoid needing to connect to the SUPL server |
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| 17:27.27 | lardman|home | DocScrutinizer: will do |
| 17:28.08 | MrBawb | lardman|home: location-proxy is the process that contacts the supl server, I think |
| 17:28.29 | MrBawb | it's at least one of the processes (if there's more than one) |
| 17:28.45 | lardman|home | yep, I was thinking that a supl-proxy would be nice and easy, no need to understand the way the location framework talks to the chipset |
| 17:29.18 | SpeedEvil | The UKs official one blows goats. |
| 17:29.29 | SpeedEvil | It's not suitable for programmatic use |
| 17:29.35 | DocScrutinizer | lardman|home: in Germany (maybe elsewhere as well) O2 is sending position of BTS in CB-channel 221, as gauss-wegener coords |
| 17:29.38 | lardman|home | well wasting time like that could explain the poor quality ;) |
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| 17:31.09 | *** join/#maemo me|kor (~melkor@91-66-109-228-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 17:31.12 | lardman|home | so anyone have any reasons why it might not work? |
| 17:31.20 | lardman|home | i.e. shoot it down now |
| 17:31.57 | SpeedEvil | lardman: what - just woke up |
| 17:32.12 | lardman|home | not sure how much data would need to be cached from NASA's LTO, or alternatively the number crunching required to predict |
| 17:32.20 | lardman|home | hey SpeedEvil |
| 17:32.35 | SpeedEvil | hy |
| 17:32.48 | lardman|home | am thinking about inserting a supl proxy and trying to inject LTO generated data to avoid needing to bring up a net connection |
| 17:32.59 | SpeedEvil | ah |
| 17:33.10 | SpeedEvil | LTO? |
| 17:33.16 | lardman|home | long term orbit |
| 17:33.49 | SpeedEvil | That does not of itself generate position, it just delays the decay of the sat coords |
| 17:33.51 | lardman|home | i.e. ephemeris data predicted a few days out, or some such |
| 17:33.57 | lardman|home | yes indeed |
| 17:34.16 | lardman|home | I'd like to get the GPS up faster without needing live assistance data |
| 17:34.33 | lardman|home | as something to do of a Saturday afternoon ;) |
| 17:34.43 | DocScrutinizer | alas N900 seems isn't considered worthy by Nokia to learn support CBSMS |
| 17:34.55 | DocScrutinizer | :-(( |
| 17:34.58 | *** join/#maemo BCMM_ (~ben@unaffiliated/bcmm) |
| 17:35.07 | *** join/#maemo fuz_ (nobody@vau75-10-88-164-23-88.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:35.07 | SpeedEvil | Turning the GPS on, when on power, and maybe even intermittently when not may be an idea |
| 17:35.39 | DocScrutinizer | ...so maybe voting for https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8347 helps |
| 17:35.41 | povbot | Bug 8347: Cell Broadcast Feature not available |
| 17:36.39 | lardman|home | DocScrutinizer: nothing will help for Maemo5 now I don;t think |
| 17:36.43 | SpeedEvil | Doibt it. |
| 17:36.48 | SpeedEvil | IT's not maemo5 |
| 17:36.49 | SpeedEvil | it's hw |
| 17:36.55 | lardman|home | SpeedEvil: yes, to refresh the ephemeris data before they expire |
| 17:37.03 | *** join/#maemo FredrIQ|n900 (~fiq@unaffiliated/fiq) |
| 17:37.19 | SpeedEvil | It's depressing there isn't a way to talk in depth to the GPS |
| 17:37.27 | *** join/#maemo sge (~username@62.240.71.4) |
| 17:37.44 | lardman|home | well there's that page on the wiki about communicating with it |
| 17:37.56 | MohammadAG | hmm, chemistry is mindfuck sometimes |
| 17:37.58 | lardman|home | but that's reverse engineering of the protocol |
| 17:38.02 | *** join/#maemo scoobert1on (~tom@93.186.150.89) |
| 17:38.43 | chem|st | MohammadAG: sometimes? |
| 17:38.53 | SpeedEvil | lardman: naah - I mean in depth. |
| 17:38.56 | *** join/#maemo aloril (~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 17:39.21 | MohammadAG | chem|st, doing my ASs, Unit 3B is hard |
| 17:39.37 | SpeedEvil | lardman: Someone got the openmoko freerunner to do ~5cm accuracy, with another nearby freerunner |
| 17:39.45 | lardman|home | SpeedEvil: yeah, but no real way we're going to be able to do that |
| 17:39.51 | DocScrutinizer | I can understand N900 not supporting SAT/STK, but honestly these missing standard features all the time, like SSC (which got enabled with *#-ena and a easteregg after massive complaints), and CBSMS, and whatnot else - that's an insult and impudence |
| 17:39.59 | chem|st | MohammadAG: have no idea what you are talking about... |
| 17:39.59 | lardman|home | SpeedEvil: that's pretty good! :) |
| 17:40.16 | MohammadAG | GCEs chem|st |
| 17:40.43 | lardman|home | MohammadAG: what's up with your chemistry then? |
| 17:41.17 | chem|st | MohammadAG: that is far off of what I would call mindfucking |
| 17:41.25 | lardman|home | DocScrutinizer: what are those acronyms? |
| 17:41.58 | DocScrutinizer | SIM App Toolkit, Cell Broadcast SMS |
| 17:42.13 | DocScrutinizer | Supplementary Service Codes |
| 17:42.51 | DocScrutinizer | while the last one isn't correct, it's the plain service codes that weren't implemented/enabled |
| 17:42.58 | lardman|home | ok, thanks |
| 17:42.59 | DocScrutinizer | not the supplementary ones |
| 17:43.16 | *** join/#maemo rd (~rd@p57B49CA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:43.51 | lcuk | any idea how I detect the maemo version, diablo/fremantle? |
| 17:44.17 | lardman|home | maemo-version |
| 17:44.20 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 17:44.36 | chem|st | lcuk: guess you mean the other way |
| 17:44.54 | DocScrutinizer | OSSO_PRODUCT_RELEASE_NAME='Maemo 5' |
| 17:45.11 | lcuk | nm have found another way already in code, ta |
| 17:45.13 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: >>set |
| 17:45.15 | lcuk | (reading /proc/component_version) |
| 17:45.29 | *** join/#maemo scoobert2on (~tom@93.186.150.89) |
| 17:45.39 | lcuk | gets me an RX-34 RX-44 RX-48 etc |
| 17:45.56 | DocScrutinizer | OSSO_PRODUCT_HARDWARE=RX-51 |
| 17:46.07 | DocScrutinizer | set!! |
| 17:46.13 | DocScrutinizer | set|less even |
| 17:46.39 | DocScrutinizer | or echo $OSSO_PRODUCT_RELEASE_NAME |
| 17:48.33 | DocScrutinizer | or |
| 17:48.45 | DocScrutinizer | echo $OSSO_VERSION# |
| 17:48.48 | DocScrutinizer | echo $OSSO_VERSION |
| 17:49.25 | DocScrutinizer | if you want to have it in detail |
| 17:49.55 | DocScrutinizer | checked it on N810-diable and N900-maemo5 |
| 17:49.59 | DocScrutinizer | looks good |
| 17:50.27 | *** part/#maemo praveenchand (5faf52e2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.175.82.226) |
| 17:51.43 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: I guess those envs are there for that precise purpose |
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| 17:59.40 | DocScrutinizer | ~botsnack |
| 17:59.40 | infobot | DocScrutinizer: aw, gee |
| 17:59.46 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, thanks \o |
| 17:59.54 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: yw |
| 18:00.07 | lcuk | now I just have to make sure liqcalendar runs on it ;) |
| 18:00.20 | lcuk | and without a diablo scratchbox |
| 18:00.21 | DocScrutinizer | ?? |
| 18:00.29 | lcuk | I am forced to have to do it the old fashioned way ;) |
| 18:00.44 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, I am getting bug reports from users on diablo |
| 18:00.51 | DocScrutinizer | ooh |
| 18:00.52 | lcuk | and to diagnose/fix I need to build/test |
| 18:01.19 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, well liqbase apps were initially designed to run well on n8x0 :) |
| 18:01.37 | DocScrutinizer | so you're going to have some if (arch() == "diablo") ? |
| 18:02.18 | *** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (1000@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 18:02.48 | *** join/#maemo doode (~doode@unaffiliated/doode) |
| 18:02.54 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, I already have some of that |
| 18:03.00 | lcuk | but theres a single bug crept in |
| 18:03.06 | lcuk | which I didnt check against |
| 18:03.15 | lcuk | its relating to the x11 overlay handling |
| 18:03.31 | *** join/#maemo merlin1991 (~x@84.114.238.170) |
| 18:03.33 | lcuk | actual code code still works, its initialisation thats screwed |
| 18:03.47 | MohammadAG | hmm |
| 18:03.56 | DocScrutinizer | hmm? |
| 18:04.10 | MohammadAG | why does telepathy's dbus signal send status instead of name when someone goes online/offline |
| 18:04.26 | DocScrutinizer | err? |
| 18:04.57 | DocScrutinizer | maybe because telepathy is a bit screwed? |
| 18:05.35 | DocScrutinizer | well, probably it's my mind that gets screwed when I try to understand how telepathy works |
| 18:05.38 | MohammadAG | it's nice actually |
| 18:06.06 | MohammadAG | that's called mindfuck :P |
| 18:07.09 | MohammadAG | i want an online/offline presence indicator |
| 18:07.42 | DocScrutinizer | per contact*account? |
| 18:08.48 | MohammadAG | yes |
| 18:09.21 | DocScrutinizer | well, anyway ask me why hal is sending same useless dbus signal for arbitrary switch state changes |
| 18:10.17 | DocScrutinizer | without any proper detail about state of switch, or even which particular switch |
| 18:10.56 | *** join/#maemo PhonicUK (~PhonicUK@pdpc/supporter/student/phonicuk) |
| 18:11.17 | DocScrutinizer | nah, don't ask me. I don't want to enter that mood |
| 18:11.21 | lardman|home | in both cases the signal designer seems to have assumed that the app will then query specifics |
| 18:11.45 | lardman|home | rather than maintaining its own internal state and updating that when it receives a DBus signal |
| 18:11.47 | DocScrutinizer | which is BS |
| 18:12.00 | lcuk | apt-get install build-essential |
| 18:12.02 | *** join/#maemo Gh0sty (~ghosty@ip-213-49-109-52.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 18:12.07 | lcuk | has missed that line :) |
| 18:12.07 | lardman|home | well yeah, it would be almost cost free to add extra info to the messages |
| 18:12.21 | DocScrutinizer | yes |
| 18:13.39 | DocScrutinizer | and it would be muuuch less cost than every app polling the details off /sys et al each time |
| 18:13.42 | lardman|home | alterego: you about? |
| 18:14.18 | lardman|home | DocScrutinizer: sure |
| 18:15.12 | lardman|home | going back a bit, here's the supl stuff: http://www.tajuma.com/supl/index.html |
| 18:15.24 | *** join/#maemo rd (~rd@p57B49CA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:16.45 | lcuk | apt-get install libliqbase-dev |
| 18:16.47 | *** join/#maemo Spookje (~ghost@82.74.121.137) |
| 18:16.55 | lcuk | and then I can build liq apps :) |
| 18:16.58 | lcuk | on the n810 :D |
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| 18:24.50 | lcuk | hrm, problem (code built ok) which package gives /usr/bin/install (needed for make install) |
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| 18:44.22 | ShadowJK | Best performing card so far: Kingston 512MB Mini-SD from 2006 |
| 18:44.43 | ShadowJK | (for random write perf) |
| 18:44.55 | *** join/#maemo VladNistor-mob (~VladNisto@89.137.122.100) |
| 18:46.14 | DocScrutinizer | lcuk: diablo has no dump-area for kernel OOPS and panics, like maemo5's mtd2 aka "log" ? |
| 18:46.27 | lcuk | i dont know? |
| 18:46.35 | pupnik_ | ShadowJK: any good microsd for that? |
| 18:46.39 | pupnik_ | small writes |
| 18:47.50 | DocScrutinizer | anybody with diablo knowhow give me a pointer/hint how to figure what makes my N810 reboot randomly? |
| 18:48.06 | lcuk | n80 doesnt reboot randomly |
| 18:48.10 | lcuk | 810 |
| 18:48.22 | lcuk | you are imagining things |
| 18:48.53 | DocScrutinizer | ooh, so it's a scheduled reboot then, based on a fractal timeschedule |
| 18:49.24 | lcuk | sounds reasonable |
| 18:49.33 | ShadowJK | /proc/bootreason, /var/lib/dsme/stats |
| 18:49.48 | DocScrutinizer | meh, I wonder why your comments are so extemely helpful usually |
| 18:49.58 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I checked both |
| 18:50.27 | DocScrutinizer | no luck |
| 18:50.46 | ShadowJK | timestamp on 32wd_to and sw_rst? |
| 18:53.01 | ShadowJK | lol, this .5G kingston minisd sucks otherwise, I'm not getting more than 500 kbyte/s out of it :) |
| 18:53.07 | *** join/#maemo Pavel (~pavel@cpe-67-249-194-107.twcny.res.rr.com) |
| 18:53.27 | ShadowJK | it even seems to be running slower with sequential writes than with random writes.. |
| 18:53.38 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: what timestamp? |
| 18:53.56 | *** join/#maemo scoobertron (~tom@93.186.150.89) |
| 18:55.15 | DocScrutinizer | Nokia-N810-23-14:~# cat /var/lib/dsme/stats/32wd_to |
| 18:55.17 | DocScrutinizer | 202 |
| 18:55.25 | DocScrutinizer | a bit high maybe |
| 18:55.29 | *** join/#maemo duese (~duese@dslb-092-073-093-114.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:55.40 | *** join/#maemo scoobert1on (~tom@93.186.150.89) |
| 18:57.59 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, do you have a diablo scratchbox there? |
| 18:58.04 | Tsuyo | Is it possible to extend the ram of the N900? I knew a way to do that in Windows via USB-Sticks |
| 18:58.10 | DocScrutinizer | nope |
| 18:58.22 | ShadowJK | And you can't extend ram in windows via usb sticks, it's a scam |
| 18:58.34 | lcuk | shame hmm |
| 18:58.38 | *** join/#maemo santra (~quassel@wel-114.cs.helsinki.fi) |
| 18:58.42 | Tsuyo | I think that was some kind of virtual ram |
| 18:58.51 | Tsuyo | Read it years ago, so i can't remember much |
| 18:59.26 | DocScrutinizer | Tsuyo: linux has that type of virtual ram since ~50years |
| 18:59.33 | DocScrutinizer | it's called swap |
| 18:59.36 | ShadowJK | There's 768M of it |
| 18:59.38 | ShadowJK | on N900 |
| 18:59.40 | lcuk | sigh |
| 18:59.42 | *** join/#maemo dmb (~dmb@unaffiliated/dmb) |
| 19:00.03 | lcuk | windows uses usb sticks as a faster prelaunch thingy or some uber cache or something |
| 19:00.19 | *** join/#maemo woodong50_______ (~moodapo@211.244.137.136) |
| 19:00.21 | lolloo | readyboost |
| 19:00.26 | lcuk | so its not quite a memory extension, but it does do things faster than just putting swap onto hard drive |
| 19:00.28 | DocScrutinizer | useless cruft |
| 19:00.36 | DocScrutinizer | even slower than usual HDD |
| 19:00.41 | lcuk | yeah lolloo thanks |
| 19:01.14 | Tsuyo | I don't even think about to extend my ram, just read it a few minutes ago and wanted to know, if it's legit ;) |
| 19:01.24 | *** join/#maemo Smily (Smily@BSN-61-44-244.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 19:01.29 | ieatlint | it's actually valid... it works for anything that requires small amounts of throughput, but benefits from low latency... like a bunch of tiny files |
| 19:01.31 | lolloo | HDD is around 150mbit |
| 19:02.11 | lcuk | lolloo, depends on the HD and interface in use |
| 19:02.23 | DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: c't tested it and found boot times are same or longer than without |
| 19:02.36 | ieatlint | c't? |
| 19:02.43 | DocScrutinizer | ct.de |
| 19:02.49 | lcuk | DocScrutinizer, possibly with latest kit and high caches on the drives now |
| 19:03.06 | lolloo | SSDs are avbove 200mbit |
| 19:03.09 | lcuk | but seems reasonable for when its been used in slightly older kit |
| 19:03.18 | lcuk | lolloo, this isnt ssds |
| 19:03.30 | lcuk | since an ssd is indistinguishable from hard drive |
| 19:03.45 | lcuk | readyboost is for actual usb flash drives afaik |
| 19:03.53 | lolloo | I bought gskills pheonix pro ssd |
| 19:04.07 | lolloo | it reads peak 250mb |
| 19:04.41 | lolloo | sata 2 ofcourse |
| 19:05.09 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, SSD is about fopen() / s though |
| 19:05.30 | DocScrutinizer | and there are *huge* differences |
| 19:05.56 | ieatlint | well, i've little experience with current versions of windows, and never used readyboost, so i'll readily admit that my perceptions of it actually being remotely useful are way off |
| 19:06.22 | DocScrutinizer | same here |
| 19:06.49 | DocScrutinizer | I only recall it has been tested worthless in c't quite some time ago |
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| 19:09.45 | ShadowJK | My 5400 RPM harddrives do 100 Megabytes/sec, which is something like a gigabit/sec... |
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| 19:11.02 | ShadowJK | sequential is a bit of a meaningless number though, unless you spend your days copying data from one harddrive to another |
| 19:11.17 | lolloo | or you have an OS on it |
| 19:11.31 | ShadowJK | No |
| 19:11.41 | ShadowJK | For that you want IOPS |
| 19:11.55 | ds3 | with a modern drive, how do you do sequential? is there a method of access that lets you line up with the physical geometry? |
| 19:11.58 | ieatlint | i'm actually about to install and SSD in my laptop, heh |
| 19:12.05 | haltdef | want vertex 3 pro :> |
| 19:12.36 | lolloo | go for crucial if you have sata 3 |
| 19:12.43 | ieatlint | ds3: assuming hdd, i think it's mostly assumed that sectors will be roughly consecutive most of the time |
| 19:12.45 | ShadowJK | ds3, it's still linear |
| 19:12.47 | lolloo | runs above 300mb |
| 19:12.57 | ieatlint | excepting bad sector stuff and plate changes |
| 19:13.10 | ShadowJK | look at the random iops instead, it's a much more useful number on how the drive performs with an OS on it |
| 19:13.22 | lolloo | yeah your right. |
| 19:13.39 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: |
| 19:13.43 | DocScrutinizer | Nokia-N810-23-14:~# cat /proc/bootreason |
| 19:13.45 | DocScrutinizer | 32wd_to |
| 19:14.03 | ds3 | but with sector remapping, even that isn't true all of the time nor is it true between runs |
| 19:14.13 | DocScrutinizer | however I got nfc how to figure what is causing the wd to trigger |
| 19:14.21 | ShadowJK | The blind quest for sequential throughput is what gave us the crappy SSDs that benchmarked 300 megabyte/s, yet typing a single line of chat into an Instant Messenger made the entire machine lock up for half a second. |
| 19:14.51 | ds3 | ShadowJK: early stock eeePC drives? :D |
| 19:15.00 | lolloo | heh |
| 19:15.01 | DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I even did things like running top in a remote shell session |
| 19:15.11 | ShadowJK | ds3, no those were actually SD cards weren't they? |
| 19:15.23 | ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, nfi really :) |
| 19:15.40 | ieatlint | nah, early eeepcs were ssd |
| 19:15.54 | ShadowJK | oh I thought they were emmc or sd :) |
| 19:15.55 | ieatlint | but the cheap ones... equiv to a flash drive, but with a minipci interface |
| 19:16.08 | ShadowJK | everything jmicron anyway |
| 19:16.09 | ds3 | ShadowJK: no, miniPCIe cards |
| 19:16.21 | ShadowJK | before Indilinx came along |
| 19:16.34 | ieatlint | happily the drive going into my laptop is not one of those fun flawed ones, but an intel x25-m |
| 19:17.06 | ShadowJK | I'm not sure anyone has beaten x25-m yet :) |
| 19:17.11 | ShadowJK | except maybe with slc |
| 19:17.21 | ieatlint | i think it has.. these are relatively cheap now |
| 19:17.30 | ieatlint | this drive sells for $180 now |
| 19:17.55 | ieatlint | 80gb |
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| 19:18.12 | haltdef | sf-1200 based drives are the best for now I believe |
| 19:18.27 | lolloo | OCZ use them. |
| 19:18.28 | ieatlint | but my browser will move faster, and i won't be as freaked about the risk of scratching a platter |
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| 19:19.09 | haltdef | mmhmm, delightful 120GB vertex 2e on my desktop, indilinx based solid 2 on laptop |
| 19:19.37 | lolloo | nice |
| 19:20.06 | haltdef | I know sata 6gbps drives were just around the corner but sod it :P |
| 19:20.12 | haltdef | knew |
| 19:20.53 | lolloo | i updated my gskills ssd firmware last month |
| 19:21.07 | lolloo | now supports trimming. |
| 19:22.30 | ShadowJK | http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4020/34081.png ah I guess intel was beatne long time ago |
| 19:22.30 | Tsuyo | I'm new into app development. If i enter "ifconfig usb0 192.168.2.14 up" into my terminal, i loose my connection to the internet, has someone encountered that problem too? |
| 19:23.14 | *** join/#maemo rd (~rd@p57B49CA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:24.13 | lardman|home | cu later chaps, /me heads to grab some food |
| 19:24.19 | ieatlint | Tsuyo: you fucked up your routes |
| 19:24.27 | DocScrutinizer | dn't you think this description is missing a few bits? |
| 19:24.34 | MohammadAG | isn't zerojay part of the maemo community? |
| 19:24.55 | Tsuyo | ieatlint: Pardon? |
| 19:25.19 | DocScrutinizer | Tsuyo: which OS, which terminal, etc pp |
| 19:25.20 | ShadowJK | so, without really knowing what you're trying to do or what the guide you're following is trying to do, I'd imagine that if you executed that on a computer or a phone, which was connected to the internet through another interface such as eth0 or wlan0, through 192.168.0.0/16 or a 192.168.42.2/24 network, that new network you create would overlap the old one and take precedence, and the device in question would be trying to contact the default gateway over |
| 19:25.24 | Tsuyo | I'm using Archlinux |
| 19:25.26 | ShadowJK | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:25.31 | Tsuyo | standart xfce4 terminal |
| 19:25.35 | Tsuyo | -t +d |
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| 19:25.49 | Tsuyo | My connection is going throgh cable |
| 19:25.57 | Tsuyo | through*. Gah. |
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| 19:26.36 | ieatlint | so i don't have a one line answer, but the basic situation is that your default route is being changed when you run that command |
| 19:26.43 | DocScrutinizer | Tsuyo: we have no f'ing clue about your setup. There are terminals all over the place. And we don't even know if your question is maemo5 related |
| 19:26.55 | *** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@aolclient-67-9-195-57.aol.hot.res.rr.com) |
| 19:27.01 | ieatlint | which shouldn't happen normally, but may be related to something like networkmanager getting pissy |
| 19:27.23 | Tsuyo | Ah, well, sorry. I wanted to develop small qt apps for my N900. i fellowed this tutorial: http://doc.qt.nokia.com/qtcreator-2.1-snapshot/creator-developing-maemo.html |
| 19:27.59 | Tsuyo | It's working well, except, that i don't have an internet connection while connected to my device |
| 19:28.41 | DocScrutinizer | you connect your desktop PC to N900 via USB, and that moment the PC is losing internet connectivity? |
| 19:28.42 | ds3 | > |
| 19:29.08 | Tsuyo | after i enter "ifconfig usb0 192.168.2.14 up" to connect to my device, yes. |
| 19:29.23 | ieatlint | Tsuyo: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Configuring_Network#For_Static_IP |
| 19:29.37 | luke-jr | Tsuyo: is your real LAN 192.168.2.* ? |
| 19:29.56 | ieatlint | you want to add an interface entry there for usb0... don't enter a gateway or nameservers for it (leave your normal eth0 or similar unchanged) |
| 19:29.59 | Tsuyo | yep, 192.168.2.101 |
| 19:30.04 | luke-jr | Tsuyo: that's why |
| 19:30.06 | ieatlint | oh, haha |
| 19:30.16 | DocScrutinizer | one possible explanation: your PC detects N900 as a network access, and tries to cnfigure your system to route data to N900 rather than your former internet |
| 19:30.38 | luke-jr | Tsuyo: if you want to make USB + Ethernet a single network, you need a bridge |
| 19:30.42 | luke-jr | which Linux doesn't make easy |
| 19:30.51 | Tsuyo | : / |
| 19:30.55 | luke-jr | what OS? |
| 19:31.00 | ieatlint | yeah, simple solution is change your network's ip address range |
| 19:31.00 | Tsuyo | Arch |
| 19:31.08 | ieatlint | slightly less simple solution is change the phone's ip address |
| 19:31.22 | Tsuyo | Aye, give me a second. I load up MAD |
| 19:31.38 | luke-jr | Tsuyo: do you care if your N900 can connect through it? |
| 19:31.45 | ieatlint | i would really not try and do a bridge... that's a lot of extra shit that is generally unnecessary |
| 19:32.02 | Tsuyo | luke-jr: no. |
| 19:32.21 | luke-jr | Tsuyo: then just use another range for N900 |
| 19:32.28 | luke-jr | ifconfig usb0 192.168.0.1 |
| 19:32.30 | luke-jr | etc |
| 19:33.09 | DocScrutinizer | yeah |
| 19:33.13 | Tsuyo | looks like .. its workig :) |
| 19:33.21 | Tsuyo | Thank you guys :) |
| 19:34.48 | ieatlint | note that if you just changed the ip on the phone, you will have to repeat that step every time you reboot the phone |
| 19:35.14 | Tsuyo | wouldnt be a problem for me. |
| 19:35.22 | lolloo | nice congrats. |
| 19:35.25 | Tsuyo | I don't even restart my phone often |
| 19:36.15 | SpeedEvil | There is a stupid hack to do init scripts when you don't want to do init scripts. |
| 19:36.20 | *** join/#maemo Sicelo (~Sicelo@41.215.145.1) |
| 19:36.25 | SpeedEvil | Queen Beecon can launch scripts at system start. |
| 19:36.27 | SpeedEvil | Do that |
| 19:37.29 | Tsuyo | allright |
| 19:39.46 | DocScrutinizer | yuck |
| 19:40.17 | ieatlint | and thus today had the first female political assassination in the US |
| 19:40.47 | DocScrutinizer | ETAB? |
| 19:40.52 | ShadowJK | tell me someone starting with P got it |
| 19:41.07 | ieatlint | hey, that's my rep :P |
| 19:41.19 | ieatlint | nah, some woman from arizona that i've never heard of |
| 19:41.23 | ShadowJK | oh wow, this 512M kingston is performing compeltely the opposite way of the Kingstons.. |
| 19:41.44 | DocScrutinizer | err... |
| 19:41.53 | ShadowJK | the microsd kingstons :) |
| 19:41.58 | DocScrutinizer | kingston vs Kingston? |
| 19:42.21 | ShadowJK | also the microsd kingsotns are a bit dubious, I think they all came from HK |
| 19:42.37 | *** join/#maemo cardinal (~cardinal@a79-169-143-91.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 19:43.59 | ShadowJK | it seems to be running faster at rewrite than at write.. |
| 19:44.35 | ShadowJK | Also seems to run faster the more threads I throw at it |
| 19:44.53 | ShadowJK | This makes about as much sense as ketchup on pancakes |
| 19:45.49 | lcuk | what os are you testing this in? |
| 19:46.10 | lcuk | oh this is on shiva isnt it |
| 19:46.27 | ShadowJK | ye |
| 19:46.42 | lcuk | so get onto #shiva or whatever and moan there |
| 19:46.46 | lcuk | or start testing on maemo |
| 19:46.53 | lcuk | :P |
| 19:47.15 | ShadowJK | This is basically direct to hw, the OS and HW shouldn't be interfering at all |
| 19:47.28 | luke-jr | ⦠|
| 19:47.45 | luke-jr | that makes no sense :P |
| 19:47.56 | ShadowJK | If I tested on N900 I'd see the same values |
| 19:47.59 | *** join/#maemo talineo (4ee4dbd5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.228.219.213) |
| 19:49.08 | talineo | hi, can someone help me with an n810 problem, I think I have some bad bad mistake (like updating udev and reboot the tablet ...) |
| 19:49.50 | ShadowJK | apt-get upgrade is mostly a mistake |
| 19:49.57 | VladNistor-mob | there was some crap flying around the net about pr 1.4 in Q2 2011, it's just that isn't it? |
| 19:49.58 | luke-jr | talineo: yeah, that's a mistake |
| 19:50.20 | ShadowJK | VladNistor-mob, April 1st is in Q2 2011, right? |
| 19:50.30 | lolloo | wow nice! |
| 19:50.31 | luke-jr | lol |
| 19:50.45 | talineo | luke-jr: |
| 19:51.07 | talineo | luke-jr: is this some mistake I can get out of ? |
| 19:51.08 | VladNistor-mob | yes, it starts then, and I also see your point |
| 19:51.27 | VladNistor-mob | just wondering though |
| 19:51.29 | talineo | the device start and restart again and again ... |
| 19:51.33 | lcuk | bug 11384 |
| 19:51.35 | povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/11384 Diablo extras & extras devel badly signed with Fremantle repository key |
| 19:51.38 | luke-jr | talineo: cold-flash? |
| 19:51.49 | lcuk | X-Fade, ping, can something be done about this please :$ |
| 19:52.07 | VladNistor-mob | luke-jr, that comes with menopause i hear |
| 19:52.16 | ShadowJK | lcuk, you know how people are always saying "Get a fast class 6 or class 10 card" when talking about N900 for MeeGo and such, I've only tested half the unused cards I have, and I'm already finding that higher class rating doesn't mean universally faster |
| 19:52.39 | *** join/#maemo smooph1 (~smooph@e180129233.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 19:52.49 | lcuk | ShadowJK, i dont know |
| 19:52.57 | luke-jr | talineo: do you have another OS installed? |
| 19:53.07 | lcuk | because testing on one device does not mean same results on maemo devices |
| 19:53.25 | talineo | lukep-jr: no |
| 19:53.28 | luke-jr | talineo: otherwise, if it's /really/ important to just undo it, I could probably help you build a recovery kernel, but it would take so much time I'd have to charge for it |
| 19:53.29 | lcuk | since in part its how the os talks to the card too |
| 19:53.37 | talineo | luke-jr: no |
| 19:53.38 | luke-jr | talineo: probably a couple of days |
| 19:53.57 | luke-jr | if it's not important, just reflash ⺠|
| 19:54.11 | luke-jr | but do it soon |
| 19:54.22 | talineo | luke-jr: sorry it's hard to follow you |
| 19:54.24 | luke-jr | broken OS tend to not charge your battery |
| 19:54.30 | talineo | what means reflash ? |
| 19:54.34 | luke-jr | â¦â¦â¦â¦ |
| 19:54.40 | MohammadAG | ShadowJK, and I'm guessing a class 10 isn't faster than the eMMC right? |
| 19:54.41 | luke-jr | download the firmware and flash it |
| 19:54.44 | talineo | loosing it all ? |
| 19:54.52 | luke-jr | MohammadAG: class 2 is probably faster than eMMC |
| 19:54.56 | luke-jr | talineo: yes |
| 19:55.15 | talineo | but just the OS and Apps, not home data ? |
| 19:55.21 | lolloo | blame nokia for software charging |
| 19:55.24 | luke-jr | not sure, possibly everything |
| 19:55.27 | ShadowJK | MohammadAG, I don't think you can unviersally say that |
| 19:55.39 | luke-jr | ShadowJK: I do. the eMMC is SLOW |
| 19:55.54 | luke-jr | I just threw an off-the-shelf 2 GB uSD in mine and it was faster |
| 19:55.56 | talineo | for the battery I remove it for now, so no big problem |
| 19:56.08 | ShadowJK | I'm pretty sure these Class 4 Kingstons are slower :-) |
| 19:56.08 | luke-jr | talineo: ok, but still don't wait weeks |
| 19:56.13 | luke-jr | batterys discharge over time |
| 19:56.18 | talineo | ok |
| 19:56.32 | ShadowJK | You would lose /home, but /media/mmc1 /media/mmc2 would be saved |
| 19:57.22 | DocScrutinizer | yeah :-S |
| 19:57.30 | DocScrutinizer | diablo is awesome |
| 19:57.55 | talineo | home is very problematic, because of gpe |
| 19:58.01 | DocScrutinizer | when optification is just that, what's diablo partitioning then? |
| 19:58.22 | DocScrutinizer | ~optification |
| 19:58.23 | infobot | optification is probably a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish somebody had looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", or http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 sentence3 |
| 19:59.04 | ShadowJK | luke-jr, I haven't figured out a way to sanely benchmark the emmc yet.. |
| 19:59.15 | luke-jr | ShadowJK: dd |
| 19:59.42 | ShadowJK | first, dd is a stupid benchmark. it tells you nothing. Second, you'd need to run your benchmark tool when the device is in a state where it's not using the emmc, at all |
| 20:00.02 | DocScrutinizer | hehehe |
| 20:00.15 | DocScrutinizer | run dd with realtime scheduling |
| 20:00.27 | ShadowJK | Not good enough :P |
| 20:00.39 | ShadowJK | You'd need to run the benchmark without /home, without MyDocs and without swap |
| 20:00.41 | DocScrutinizer | disable irq |
| 20:00.43 | DocScrutinizer | :-P |
| 20:01.10 | ShadowJK | Which means running it from one of the early bootscripts right after the mmc driver has been loaded but before swapon and mount |
| 20:01.14 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, even rt will pass control to system, when waiting for IO |
| 20:01.25 | luke-jr | ShadowJK: it's called Gentoo |
| 20:01.43 | *** join/#maemo user___ (~user@c-76-102-65-152.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 20:01.49 | DocScrutinizer | ooh, I thought that's the name of this year's flu virus |
| 20:02.02 | user___ | hey, how do I lookup the wep key I stored on this thing? |
| 20:02.19 | lcuk | X-Fade, ahh it doesn't actually block usage of the repo, it just gives bad warning when you refresh |
| 20:02.43 | user___ | instead of having it show up as stars in the internet connections prefs |
| 20:03.37 | DocScrutinizer | user___: iwconfig will show you the encryption key in hex |
| 20:03.38 | ShadowJK | But anyway, Kingston Class 4 MicroSD, sequential writes in 512k blocks: 10 megabytes/second. Same card, 4 threads writing sequentially in 128k blocks: 500 kbyte/s. Sandisk class 2 (yes, two) card, 4 threads writing sequentially in 128k blocks: 3.3 Megabytes/second. |
| 20:03.58 | ShadowJK | The class 2 is outperforming the class 4 by a factor of 6. |
| 20:04.13 | ShadowJK | The class 6 only wins in the single-tasking digital camera use case |
| 20:04.18 | toresbe | hm |
| 20:04.18 | DocScrutinizer | user___: nfc where it's stored though |
| 20:04.20 | ShadowJK | sorry, class 4 |
| 20:04.29 | toresbe | maybe buying the class 6 wasn't a good idea then |
| 20:04.43 | ShadowJK | Well it's not the entire story |
| 20:04.55 | user___ | instead of having it show up as stars in the internet connections prefs |
| 20:05.01 | Sicelo | ~nfc |
| 20:05.01 | infobot | somebody said nfc was No Fucking Clue |
| 20:05.10 | ShadowJK | The whole story is something like "A good class 2 beats a shitty class 6." |
| 20:05.41 | user___ | how do I look in nfc? |
| 20:05.48 | toresbe | I have nfc. |
| 20:06.30 | kerio | the problem is that "ULTRA SUPER XXXXXTREME" SDs are heavily optimized for very fast sequential writes |
| 20:06.37 | DocScrutinizer | probably you need to dig through all gconf keys to find it |
| 20:06.38 | *** join/#maemo vblazquez (~vic@32.154.221.87.dynamic.jazztel.es) |
| 20:07.26 | ShadowJK | Inside the microSD is a small little ARM MCU that translates block device requests from the host into reads and writes to the flash. The speed difference I'm observing comes most likely from the "good" card having a more capable ARM processor inside, or having more sophisticated programming than the "cheap" class 4 :) |
| 20:08.19 | user___ | how do I get to gconf keys? can you give me a path? |
| 20:08.22 | kerio | why can't i use the raw memory inside the SD? :( |
| 20:08.25 | lcuk | ? microsd has ARM chip inside? |
| 20:08.32 | SpeedEvil | yes luck |
| 20:08.36 | kerio | lcuk: yup |
| 20:08.45 | kerio | and it's pretty much gratis |
| 20:08.55 | ShadowJK | lcuk, yes |
| 20:09.10 | kerio | because the cost of testing the NAND before selling it without a controller is bigger than the cost of the controller |
| 20:09.49 | *** join/#maemo FIQ|n900 (~user@unaffiliated/fiq) |
| 20:09.58 | ShadowJK | Around 2006 or so I saw Transcend advertising that their SD cards' CPU could be reprogrammed on the fly |
| 20:10.09 | ShadowJK | Of course, you'd only gotten info on how to do that if you paid them megabucks :( |
| 20:10.19 | talineo | luke-jr: how many would you charge ? |
| 20:10.27 | kerio | µSDs are a *tiiiiiiiiny* cpu and a nand |
| 20:10.43 | SpeedEvil | physically tiny |
| 20:10.49 | SpeedEvil | It's quite capable logically |
| 20:10.56 | jaska | probably mmuless arm? |
| 20:11.02 | *** join/#maemo rosseaux (znc@133-18-182-46.nbiserv.com) |
| 20:11.09 | kerio | well, i'd assume that, being a cpu, it has at least AND and XOR |
| 20:11.11 | SpeedEvil | 32 bit, mmuless, probably |
| 20:11.27 | *** join/#maemo Diod (~Diod@unaffiliated/diod) |
| 20:11.49 | SpeedEvil | getting 200K of RAM on the CPU isn't cheap, and pretty much means you're into 32 bit territory |
| 20:12.10 | kerio | does that mean that all of our hacker badges should be revoked because nobody can run arbitrary code on microSDs they own? |
| 20:12.21 | ShadowJK | yes |
| 20:12.22 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 20:12.36 | kerio | :( |
| 20:12.42 | SpeedEvil | Arbitrary code is interesting, as it'd allow raw-mode. |
| 20:12.46 | SpeedEvil | As well as other things. |
| 20:12.54 | ShadowJK | They also have to be able to run that DRM shit that *SD supports (but nobody uses) |
| 20:13.34 | lcuk | can someone please back this up with web resources |
| 20:13.37 | kerio | ShadowJK: except windows phone 7 |
| 20:13.40 | kerio | :) |
| 20:13.55 | SpeedEvil | http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=918 lcuk |
| 20:14.10 | ShadowJK | I was going to paste that :) |
| 20:14.21 | MohammadAG | programs his uSD's CPU to compile a kernel |
| 20:14.53 | SpeedEvil | http://bunniestudios.com/blog/images/microsd_lineup.jpg |
| 20:15.49 | SpeedEvil | microSDs are insane - they have multiple shaved chips stacked on top of each other |
| 20:18.00 | MohammadAG | hmm |
| 20:18.17 | MohammadAG | how do I decapsulate a uSD? |
| 20:18.42 | ShadowJK | acid |
| 20:18.51 | SpeedEvil | nitric+sulphuric acid, warmed, sprayed over the chip |
| 20:19.10 | ShadowJK | Does it also "decasulate" human hands? |
| 20:19.11 | SpeedEvil | use a flouropolymer rubber gasket to contain it. |
| 20:19.13 | ShadowJK | decapsulate |
| 20:19.17 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 20:20.15 | SpeedEvil | lcuk: you basically don't get datasheets or other info for the NAND controller chips, as the are made to be sold only to people making 10M cards at a time. |
| 20:20.39 | MohammadAG | hmm |
| 20:21.30 | SpeedEvil | http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/96515/SAMSUNG/UM_S3C49F9X.html |
| 20:21.36 | SpeedEvil | though mabe that may be pessimistic |
| 20:21.44 | kerio | let's buy 10M cards |
| 20:21.50 | SpeedEvil | the above chip is mentioned in the bunnie blog |
| 20:21.55 | SpeedEvil | well - a related chip |
| 20:22.00 | SpeedEvil | this is a CF flash controller |
| 20:22.12 | kerio | OpeµSD |
| 20:22.40 | lcuk | SpeedEvil, its just not required under normal circumstances |
| 20:22.42 | kerio | a µSD for nerds |
| 20:22.49 | lcuk | its a memory card |
| 20:22.54 | *** join/#maemo Sicelo (~Sicelo@41.215.145.1) |
| 20:22.54 | SpeedEvil | what's not required? |
| 20:23.16 | ShadowJK | This is why I'm hoping Windows Phone 7 will take off, because I suspect Microsoft will create a IOPS based Speed Rating for memory cards :) |
| 20:23.43 | ShadowJK | Like how their ReadyBoost requirements changed the market |
| 20:24.34 | *** join/#maemo lardman|home (~lardman@2.96.82.5) |
| 20:27.47 | ShadowJK | It'd be nice to get told about the failure modes too beforehand :) |
| 20:28.10 | kerio | no, srsly, OpeµSD |
| 20:28.18 | kerio | i'd buy that |
| 20:32.37 | SpeedEvil | Me too. I'd love it as a datalogger. |
| 20:34.36 | *** join/#maemo lolloo (~lolloo@94.97.104.81) |
| 20:40.27 | *** join/#maemo rosseaux (znc@133-18-182-46.nbiserv.com) |
| 20:40.45 | DocScrutinizer | meh, who's user____? |
| 20:40.47 | MohammadAG | where's libqtm's git? |
| 20:41.37 | DocScrutinizer | anyway: dig up wlan key: gconftool-2 -R /|grep -C15 <SSID-of-AP> |
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