IRC log for #maemo on 20101004

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00:10.00dsgCan anyone explain the purpose of these files: http://gitorious.org/maemo-5-certificate-manager/maemo-security-certman/commit/b551ece82b3707baaea1f40cca15e435f05c0da4 ?
00:10.30dsgIt's a SSL CA key and certificate, but it's installed under /etc/certs/trusted and the same everywhere.
00:11.06SpeedEvilhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Root_certificate
00:11.25dsgSpeedEvil: I know what a root certificate is. I want to know what this one is used for.
00:11.41dsgIt's the same for all phones, and the private key is public. I don't see the point.
00:11.59dsgBut it's clearly loaded from some maemo crypto libraries
00:12.57dsgIt also happens to be expired since ~2009...
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00:15.16TermanaDesireGood morning
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00:16.31SpeedEvilah.
00:16.49SpeedEvilOk - it's hard to guage technical knowledge sometimes.
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01:56.11GeneralAntillesDocScrutinizer, ping?
01:56.33DocScrutinizer51hmm?
01:56.51GeneralAntillesDocScrutinizer51, what the hell is your maemo.org username? joerg_rw?
01:57.02DocScrutinizer51yes
01:57.03GeneralAntillesI'm experiencing another episode of Moments in Competence here.
01:57.06GeneralAntillesOK, thanks.
02:00.28DocScrutinizer51whatever episode that might be, seems I'm missing some meanings of words
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03:11.50GeneralAntillesAnybody know how the E.F.F. script works?
03:12.07GeneralAntillesI mean, to save me from having to download it and read the source. :P
03:13.35GeneralAntillesAh, guess it's not the hardware feature.
03:13.38GeneralAntillesHo hum
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03:33.22SpeedEvilhttp://b3ta.com/board/10189575 :)
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03:38.32MohammadAG51who knows gconf, C, and hildon
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05:15.25foowafflehello
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05:16.00slonopotamusohai
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05:18.30foowafflewhat phones have meego on it?
05:20.27slonopotamusfoowaffle: -> #meego
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05:21.34slonopotamusyou can run meego on n900, but it ain't for daily use
05:22.06foowafflewoops sorry didnt notice the drifferent
05:22.11foowafflethanks
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05:49.51slonopotamusmaemo.org down?
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05:57.24Termanaslonopotamus, maemo.org is up
05:57.30Termanaslonopotamus, http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com for future use :p
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05:58.48slonopotamusdownforeveryoneorjustme.com down?
05:58.53slonopotamus:P
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07:42.22rantomHehehe
07:42.34rantomAnd yet again, we see the quality of the talk.maemo.org
07:42.39rantomhttp://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=830726&postcount=202
07:42.49rantomhttp://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=832650&postcount=218 reply :)
07:43.28rantomGranted, I got some good laughs from that, not a bad way to start a new day
07:47.33jacekowskiInvalid Post specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator
07:47.40rantomDarn it
07:47.43rantomThey removed it
07:47.43jacekowskican you paste content
07:47.51rantomNo, unfortunately not
07:47.55jacekowskior say what was it about
07:48.46rantomNah, I was just being quite politely clear about the fact, that how annoying it is to get "i think hes dead" with bad English to your inbox, since it's not helping at all on the development
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07:49.08rantomAnd the response was purely cursing and bad English
07:49.33rantomAnd some kind of note for me to get a life. Wonder what that is though...
07:49.39jacekowskiand that "i think hes dead" was related to what?
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07:50.03rantomTo the developer
07:50.09rantom's activity*
07:50.24jacekowskiis he?
07:50.27rantomHe had not kept his promises and I defended hi
07:50.27rantomm
07:50.32rantomNo
07:50.47jacekowskideveloper of what?
07:51.29rantomMohammadAG of Kinetic Scrolling for PR 1.2
07:51.47jacekowskiwell, yeah, that's a problem with most open sources communities
07:51.53Termanaheh, he's definitely not dead ;p
07:51.58jacekowskiyou can't say anything because it will be taken against you
07:52.25rantomFunniest part here was that the MohammadAG and four other users Thanked! me for that post :D
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07:53.06jacekowskiwhen i do something i just announce it when it's done
07:53.15rantomThat's the way it should be
07:53.30rantomDo NOT frustrate the developer
07:55.58rantomAha, and I got an infraction worth of 20 points
07:56.00rantomYay :D
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07:58.57rantomhttp://talk.maemo.org/faq.php?faq=vb3_board_faq "Infraction and Banning"
07:59.18rantomNot that big of a deal to me though, I'll let them ban if they see it fit
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08:04.12jacekowskicunts
08:04.54rantomYou mean the mods?
08:05.08rantom(or moderators, which one you prefer)
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08:07.53rantomIn any case, if you did mean the mods, I woulnd't blame them. It's my fault, since my attack was indeed too direct, I should've written instead "Would you mind to stop the spamming" more or less non-personal "attack"
08:08.03rantomOh well, what's done is done
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08:10.12jacekowskiwell, all of them really
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08:56.09n900-spacehi all
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08:56.29n900-spaceI cant set madde target, can anyone help?
08:56.40n900-spacei have installed the latest nokia qt sdk
08:56.58n900-spaceTargets: fremantle-1030     (installable) maemo412-1         (installable)  Runtimes: qemu-n900-pr12  (installable)
08:57.27n900-spacebut when i do a "mad set fremantle-1030" it doesnt work
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08:57.42timeless_mbpdoesn't installable imply you haven't installed it?
08:57.48n900-spacesays "Target 'fremantle-1030' does not exist"
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08:58.03n900-spacehow do i install it
08:58.19n900-spacei installed the complete nokia sdk
08:58.31timeless_mbpum, i just woke up, and haven't touched that ui in about 6-12 weeks
08:58.38n900-spaceyou mean the madde console
08:58.39n900-space?
08:58.49timeless_mbp(i touched it precisely once, producing 50-100 items of feedback for the madde team)
08:59.24timeless_mbpoh, and i was using the GUI version not the CLI :)
08:59.35timeless_mbpif you're new here, i'd suggest you consider trying the GUI first
08:59.51alteregoThere's a GUI
08:59.59alteregoAre you talking about Qt Creator?
09:00.07n900-spaceplus there is one more problem :( ... the QT Creator I launch, says the examples are not installed (but i can find them in the directories), plus no help is available, the index comes emtpy, I dont know whats wrong,
09:00.21n900-spacei have uninstalled and installed the whole sdk several times but same results.
09:00.29timeless_mbpbtw, it's Qt, not QT
09:00.30alteregoStrange,
09:00.31timeless_mbpQT is QuickTime
09:00.40alteregoHeh
09:00.52n900-spaceNo I was talking about madde, when I said the "mad set fremantle-1030" is not working ..
09:01.11n900-spaceok about QT :)
09:01.19n900-spaceQt is what i'm talking about.
09:01.30n900-spaceThis has been frustrating.
09:01.54timeless_mbpuse the GUI. iirc it's MADE (as opposed to madde, the number of D's matter. gah)
09:02.13n900-spaceBtw I'm in windows 7. So i rebooted to fedora 12, Installed the Nokia Qt SDK there also. But I dont know how to access madde there on console.
09:02.19Venemohi
09:02.28n900-spaceno its "madde", with double D
09:02.41Venemon900-space: sorry, I'm a bit late to the party. what's your issue?
09:02.54n900-spacehi Venemo
09:03.06alteregoNot tried with Windows 7, might do today actually, would be nice to have a series 60 compilation environment.
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09:03.43Venemon900-space: MADDE and Nokia Qt SDK works for me on Windows 7, so what's your problem?
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09:04.41n900-spaceSeveral: First: I installed the latest Nokia Qt Sdk. Launched qt creator, it says examples not installed. But I can find them in the directories (maybe some configurations problem), also qt creator doesnt show any help
09:04.49n900-spaceHelp index comes up blank.
09:05.18timeless_mbpfile bugs to Nokia Qt SDK team :)
09:05.20Venemon900-space: yes, that is happening for me too
09:05.38Venemon900-space: the guys in #qt may be of better help for issues like this
09:06.13n900-spaceok then Venemo tell me this, during the installation, did u get any errors like "qmake.exe is already busy" with Ignore/Retry button options?
09:06.58Venemon900-space: no, I didn't
09:07.03n900-spacehmm
09:07.10n900-spaceok about madde.
09:07.12jarkkomI had all kinds of issues with Qt SDK on windows until I installed it in default location at C:\NokiaQtSDK
09:07.25n900-spaceI'm getting problem doing "mad set"
09:07.42jarkkomafter that, it works fine on win7 64bit
09:07.48n900-spaceTargets: fremantle-1030     (installable) maemo412-1         (installable)  Runtimes: qemu-n900-pr12  (installable)
09:08.15n900-spacejarkkom: I'm also installing it on the default location.
09:08.38n900-spaceVenemo: when i do a "mad set fremantle-1030", it says target is not installed.
09:08.44n900-spaceSo how do i install it?
09:09.23Venemon900-space: I'm not sure what that command does
09:09.32Venemon900-space: for me, it simply works after installation
09:09.45n900-spaceor, how do you set target? Or when you do "mad list" do you get any target that is set to "default"
09:10.09n900-spaceyes it used to work seemlessly with the 1.0 nokia sdk, but now it doesnt
09:10.11n900-space:(
09:10.31Venemomad-list says that "fremantle-pr12" is the default for me
09:10.38n900-spaceaha
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09:11.02n900-spaceWhy dont they give a proper help for madde?
09:11.14Venemon900-space: they do
09:11.27n900-spaceI mean is there a proper help page with all commands completely listed?
09:11.34Venemon900-space: what does "mad list" say to you?
09:11.53n900-spaceI know one, but it only works if your "default" is already set, then everything is fine.
09:12.00n900-spacewell my mad list is this
09:12.04n900-spaceTargets:
09:12.08n900-spacefremantle-1030     (installable)
09:12.12n900-spacemaemo412-1         (installable)
09:12.16n900-spaceRuntimes:
09:12.19n900-spaceqemu-n900-pr12  (installable)
09:12.38Venemoso it is screwed up, hm.
09:12.45n900-spaceis it?
09:12.49VenemoI dunno.
09:12.53Venemomine says:
09:13.04VenemoTargets:
09:13.04Venemofremantle-pr12     (default)
09:13.04Venemomaemo412-1         (installable)
09:13.04VenemoRuntimes:
09:13.05Venemorx51-fremantle-pr12  (default)
09:13.12n900-spacewhere is the proper madde documentation?
09:13.22alteregoThere's documentation?
09:13.32n900-spacemadde documentation :)
09:13.35n900-spaceis there ?
09:13.36n900-space:)
09:15.45n900-spacethis page http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Getting_started_with_MADDE_on_Windows is no help .. so basic
09:15.57Venemon900-space: http://wiki.maemo.org/MADDE
09:16.21Venemon900-space: you may also want to download MADDE itself from tablets-dev
09:16.36n900-spacethanks Venemo
09:17.13n900-spaceyes but then how does it work, i mean there is going to be one installed with the nokia sdk and one downloaded seperately. Its confusing for me
09:17.30n900-spaceI have a whole huge folder of madde inside nokia sdk
09:18.26TermanaDesiren900-space: stop spamming the room. I can scroll up and see two screens of basically you on seperate lines. Join sentences to one line and pastebin code, errors etc. Thanks :)
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09:19.18n900-spaceoh sorry ...
09:19.21Venemon900-space: yeah. you can either uninstall that completely, or just use the one that you can install separately
09:20.40n900-spaceaha
09:20.45n900-spacesigh
09:20.52n900-spaceokk tell me one thing.
09:21.19Venemon900-space: I for one will uninstall the Nokia Qt SDK completely. Since I use a newer Qt Creator nightly along with the separately downloadable MADDE...
09:21.21n900-spaceSay I download the source code of xchat from maemo.org repositories, and now i want to compile it.
09:21.46n900-spaceWill I somehow open it in qt creator, or just compile and build and deploy from the madde console? How do people do it?
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09:24.26alteregoOooo, mobility 1.1.0
09:25.01Venemon900-space: XChat is not Qt-based.
09:25.31Venemon900-space: so Qt Creator may not be able to do that job for you
09:26.22n900-spacehmm
09:27.50n900-spacesigh
09:27.58n900-spacemeans a lot of time online for all this :)
09:28.06n900-spacethank you guys :)
09:28.12Venemon900-space: it might (I for one successfully used it for some Gtk stuff), but I dunno
09:28.28n900-spaceVenemo: that madde help page is helpful thanks, I can finally *install* a new target I think :)
09:28.41Venemon900-space: I'm happy I could help
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09:38.51lcukVenemo, you are MADDE using mad to build all extra stuff, but that sort of experimentation is awesome
09:39.44n900-spaceplease explain lcuk
09:40.27lcukn900-space, Venemo knows exactly what I mean, I think hes awesome for pushing what MADDE can do inside it
09:40.31alteregoWell, if you plan on uplkoading to extras, scratchbox is somewhat better suited as it's the same environment the autobuilder uses.
09:40.37Chanioh boy.
09:40.39lcukalterego, sure
09:40.46timeless_mbpalterego: eh?
09:40.47alteregoBut madde is fun
09:40.48Chaniwas thinking of trying out madde next
09:40.51timeless_mbpdoesn't MADDE use scratchbox?
09:41.01Venemolcuk: yeah, as the application's name suggests, I am a "mad developer" :D
09:41.03alteregotimeless_mbp: erm, no
09:41.05Venemotimeless_mbp: nope.
09:41.11mecekubuntu mobile.. could be sweet
09:41.16alteregotimeless_mbp: madde is it's own toolchain and root image.
09:41.19alteregoDoesn't use chroot
09:41.29timeless_mbpso it's classic cross compile?
09:41.34alteregotimeless_mbp: yeah
09:41.40timeless_mbpoops
09:41.42alteregoNot as much wacky magick
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09:43.40timeless_mbpgrumbles
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09:44.20n900-spacehmm
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09:53.16sivangmorninga
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09:53.46sivangor rather morning
09:53.52Venemosivang: good morning
09:53.57sivangtimeless_mbp: back at mbp
09:54.03sivangmorning Venemo
09:54.44timeless_mbpyep
09:54.55timeless_mbpphone's dead
09:55.00timeless_mbpit forgot to get a charger
09:55.04sivangah
09:55.05timeless_mbphome sweet starving
09:55.14sivangno food at home?
09:55.33timeless_mbpno charger plugged into the power strip for the phone
09:55.47sivangah
09:55.49timeless_mbpmy mac was unhappy when i came back, i had left the strip unplugged so the mac starved while i was away
09:56.02sivangah, I see
09:56.14timeless_mbpgoes to feed phone
09:56.18VenemoI'd like to install the latest fennec nightly, but I get "E: Handler silently failed" from apt-get
09:56.23sivangI hate when it happens. Sometimes it makes the battery die
09:56.25lcuktimeless_mbp, did any of the UK accents make you giggle more than others?
09:56.27Venemowhat can I do about this?
09:56.38timeless_mbplcuk: some were really hard to understand
09:56.53timeless_mbplike N.I. (bus driver) having just gotten off the boat
09:56.59timeless_mbp(from Scotland)
09:57.51lcukheads up display showing subtitles might be good for future generations! :D
09:58.04jacekowskiwelsh is hard to understand
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09:59.18timeless_mbpignoring the bus driver...
09:59.29timeless_mbpi think i had more trouble w/ accents of women than men
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10:02.04timeless_mbp(17-40)
10:02.16timeless_mbpthat might be because the women were often talking to eachother or other locals
10:02.26timeless_mbpwhereas i was generally speaking directly with individual men
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10:12.30Khertan_Hi !
10:12.52Venemohey Khertan_ !
10:13.04Khertan_Does ovi store is wronking for you ?
10:13.17Khertan_i ll like to test Kroll
10:13.30Khertan_s/wronking/working
10:13.49Khertan_but ovistore said there is no content in all category
10:13.56VenemoKhertan_: weird
10:13.59Khertan_s/category/categories
10:14.00Khertan_hi Venemo
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10:36.08Khertan_hate ovistore ... why they didn't put Kroll on the maemo repository !
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10:44.27timeless_mbpsp3000:  you @lunch?
10:44.32timeless_mbpdidn't quite wake up properly
10:44.33timeless_mbp:(
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10:45.22sp3000lunched already
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10:46.06timeless_mbpdid you make it to 9am?
10:46.24sp3000sure
10:46.40timeless_mbphrm, picasa said copying 205 of 204 files...
10:47.17janiwas there anything interesting in the 9am meeting ?
10:48.17timeless_mbpi wasn't there
10:48.22timeless_mbpbut it shouldn't be discussed here
10:48.32timeless_mbpmaybe i can invite people to an afternoon tea :)
10:49.14timeless_mbpgoes back to coughing
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10:51.44tybollttimeless_mbp: will there be cookies?
10:52.29timeless_mbpi didn't pick up any on this trip ;(
10:52.39timeless_mbpbut yeah, i can probably spring for some
10:52.39Termanatimeless, and Nigerian Dog Attacks?
10:53.47timeless_mbpdo i want to know?
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10:56.36Termanatimeless, are you bringing some NDAs to your little tea party?
10:57.14timeless_mbptea would be served on the ground floor
10:57.27timeless_mbpso technically any visitor is able to visit
10:57.36timeless_mbpbut you're supposed to have a host and a guest badge
10:57.46timeless_mbpsince i don't know anything, someone else would have to bring the other stuff
11:00.46janiground floor calling, i need a doze of freshly burned nicotine..
11:02.55timeless_mbphrm, i'm 15mins away
11:03.07timeless_mbp(not counting time to import my photo album)
11:03.20janibtw, is creating merge requests always *slow* in gitorious ?
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11:03.39Venemojani, gitorious is always slow
11:04.01timeless_mbpjani: i don't really know what gitorious merge requests *do*
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11:06.12janiomg. i just started to hate gitorious.  i need that break right now.
11:07.15timeless_mbpwell, i've imported another 1/2gb of photos
11:07.19timeless_mbpi guess i could visit the tea center
11:08.37Venemo"apt-get install fennec" -> "E: Handler silently failed" :(((
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11:08.53Venemowtf is this error message?
11:09.37timeless_mbptry dpkg -i w/ partial/archives?
11:10.11Venemotimeless_mbp: I'm sorry?
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12:26.47Khertan_Nokia-N900:~# apt-get install kroll Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done E: Handler silently failed
12:26.52Khertan_lol any idea ?
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12:30.32crashanddieKhertan_, try with apt-get -v install kroll
12:30.34crashanddieor -V
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12:34.10Khertan_crashanddie: thx i'll try once apt-get update finish his job :)
12:34.21crashanddieits job :)
12:35.52Khertan_crashanddie: but it didn't do its job well
12:35.59Khertan_:)
12:36.40Khertan_http://pastebin.com/JHAQLv5q
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12:37.37jacktherippercan't I choose a file (or filesystem) on the N900 to expose instead of MyDocs when connected to a computer through USB ?
12:38.02crashanddieno
12:38.21jacktheripperno as in impossible, or no as in complicated ?
12:38.34mgedminalmost nothing is impossible in software
12:38.43jacktheripperthat's what I think.
12:39.06jacktheripperand that's also why I'm checking ke-recv's source.
12:39.11mgedminwhat problem are you trying to solve?
12:40.03jacktherippera linux rescue livecd that's stored on my phone and that can boot whatever computer.
12:40.28mgedminsolvable
12:40.30mgedminshould be
12:40.44crashanddiejacktheripper, i guess you could mount something else to /home/user/MyDocs
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12:40.50crashanddiejust mount an iso instead
12:41.11jacktheripperI'll try that
12:41.14crashanddieroot; umount /home/user/MyDocs; mount -o loop myfile.iso /home/user/MyDocs
12:41.19mgedminI used this recipe to make a bootable USB flash drive that boots an ISO image from a file in it: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1288604
12:41.20crashanddiedon't know what the behaviour will be though.
12:41.23mgedmincrashanddie, won't work
12:41.34mgedminI'm 85% sure
12:42.36jacktherippermgedmin, that's probably possible, but the boot files right on MyDocs would look dirty I think. That would be my final resort. I'm trying to have the choice to choose any ISO to mount and expose to a computer.
12:43.22jacktheripperor any filesystem image.
12:43.28mgedminjacktheripper, do you have a spare USB flash drive?
12:43.34jacktherippersure
12:43.36mgedmincan you try dd'ing the ISO image into it and booting from it?
12:43.42mgedminthis needs special support from the ISO image, AFAIU
12:43.51mgedmine.g. Fedora's ISOs can be booted that way, Ubuntu's can't
12:44.13jacktheripperI remember that :/
12:44.25mgedminso, if you've got an ISO image that can be booted directly, I suppose it should be possible to have a n900 map its USB mass storage device blocks directly to a file
12:44.30mgedminI wonder how that's done ...
12:44.54mgedminif the kernel needs a block device to export, you could always create a temporary loopback
12:45.07jaskachange the usb module to claim its an usb cd/dvd drive?:)
12:45.18jacktheripperand it'd be even better to fool a computer into thinking it's a usb optical drive
12:45.19jacktheripperyes!
12:45.25jacktheripperbut to complicated
12:45.27jacktheripper*too
12:46.00mgedminshould be a fun project if you have a couple of months free time
12:46.38jacktheripperI tried changing the dev file in the shell scripts that are responsible for USB Mass Storage. It fails, saying device in use.
12:46.49jaskaor do something like what qemu does with vfat hd emulation to export a directory as a vfat hd
12:46.57jacktheripperI'd say it fails during mounting a loopback with vfat options.
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12:52.28mgedminjaska, ooooh
12:52.44mgedminbut that still wouldn't let two OSes use the same directory at the same time
12:52.46Khertan_crashanddie: lol no apt didn't find package kroll
12:52.54Khertan_ovi store is a major failure !
12:53.30jaskamgedmin, sortof.. perhaps if the vfat device pretends its removable so the "other" device using it doesnt write cache
12:53.56jaskanot sure how windows etc. react to a filesystem they think is a block device changes underneath them :)
12:55.20jaskashivers at the thought of doing the vfat emulator in kernelspace
12:55.42jacktheripperbah I'll just use unetbootin with an ubuntu image on MyDocs, I have explored the sources for too long.
12:56.14jaskai guess bioses cant boot from usb-cdc network device yet?:)
12:56.30mgedminis that the one that extracts the contents of the live CD all over your VFAT?
12:56.47mgedminthat sort of clutter is why I started figuring out how to convince grub to chain-boot an ISO image
12:56.48MohammadAG51using squashfs?
12:57.14jaskahmm... booting from a n900 over usb networking would be interesting
12:57.27MohammadAG51just use vfat
12:57.40MohammadAG51it's not really interesting :P
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12:58.03jaskawell, for certain values of interesting
12:58.14jaskai doubt any bios supports it
12:58.19jacktheripperis the MMC's lifetime only decreased by writes ?
12:59.30hrwwho remember my 2009.51 system-updates repository?
12:59.40Arkenoiwhat is recommended os for 770 now? i found 2007he to be best fit two years ago (2008 was unstable due to lack of resources), did anything change since then?
12:59.52hrwArkenoi: I would say os2006
13:00.34hrwnever liked 2007he on 770 - it was hard to fit it in 64MB ram
13:00.43hrwSetting up mp-fremantle-generic-pr (10.2010.19-1.hrw1) ...
13:00.53hrwnow I can produce updates ;D
13:01.02RST38hYou too, Brutus? =)
13:01.02Arkenoihrw: 2007he appears reasonably stable for me
13:01.20hrwArkenoi: without swap?
13:01.32Arkenoiwith some swap on mmc
13:01.37MohammadAG51i want 2009HE
13:01.46RST38h2011HE
13:01.52hrwArkenoi: I still have only that 64MB rs-mmc which was added
13:02.03hrwMeeGo 2.0 '770' edition
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13:19.56_trinehas anyone any idea why my petrovich wont open the folder when I start it,, it appears to attempt to start then just falls back to the n900 desktop and does nothing
13:20.27crashanddieplay with it, stroke it, feed it.
13:20.54RST38h<yawn>
13:21.46MohammadAG51<spawn>
13:21.51pupnikwhat's the simple, transparent way to send audio from laptop to stereo system?
13:21.57*** join/#maemo Psi (~ben@ip-58-28-158-238.static-xdsl.xnet.co.nz)
13:22.03crashanddiepupnik, a cable
13:22.12MohammadAG51a transparent one
13:22.14xkr47:D
13:22.16pupnikthat's what i'm using now.  i like the latency
13:22.34crashanddielatency should be near nill
13:22.37xkr47earlyency
13:22.49crashanddieunless your soundcard was built in the 60s
13:23.09MohammadAG51what's the best way to route mic audio to speakers
13:23.13Termanacrashanddie has plenty of those, that's how he knows
13:23.21MohammadAG51other than calling echo123 using skype
13:23.23Termana:p
13:23.30*** join/#maemo SWFu (~SWFu@unaffiliated/swfu)
13:23.34xkr47MohammadAG51, sox I guess
13:23.37MohammadAG51sox?
13:23.45MohammadAG51i thought those were for xmas
13:24.03pupnikif you had a 770 hooked to stereo aux-in, how would you route laptop audio to it?
13:24.04xkr47sox is season-agnostic
13:24.16TermanaMohammadAG51, I have a much better solution than xkr47
13:24.25Termanaxkr47 solution is wimpy
13:24.26MohammadAG51Termana, oh boy
13:24.31TermanaHere's what you need to do
13:24.34MohammadAG51expects trolling
13:24.50xkr47pulls sox on his head and hides
13:25.15TermanaGet 2 N900s
13:25.29TermanaThen you need to call one of those N900s
13:25.33MohammadAG51sometimes... i wish i had +o
13:25.36Termanafrom the other one
13:25.54MohammadAG51kicks Termana in the nuts
13:25.57Termanaplug a double ended cable from the speaker hole on one of them into your microphone jack
13:26.10MohammadAG51there isn't a mic jack
13:26.18crashanddiesure there is
13:26.20TermanaFine, just put it on speaker
13:26.20MohammadAG51any
13:26.35TermanaSo your microphone picks the sound up
13:26.47MohammadAG51takes a flamethrower a shoves it in Termana's bum
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13:27.00MohammadAG51opens fire
13:27.11TermanaMohammadAG51, anyway, aren't you suppose to be dead?
13:27.16*** join/#maemo leandrosansilva (~quassel@187.59.90.12)
13:27.17TermanaSomeone on t.m.o said you were dead
13:27.19Termana;P
13:27.23MohammadAG51yeah, seen it
13:27.27crashanddielolwut?
13:27.31MohammadAG51i'm a zombie process
13:27.48xkr47t.m.o = trackmania original
13:28.04xkr47also, MohammadAG51 do you play team fortress 2 ? ;)
13:28.08MohammadAG51or too much orgy, oops
13:28.18MohammadAG51xkr47, nope, it looks childish :P
13:28.19crashanddiebtw, MohammadAG51 any new replies on the faux-kernel-driver-hacker thread?
13:28.32MohammadAG51not that i've noticed
13:29.13MohammadAG51xkr47, cod on the other hand...
13:30.03xkr47what are your favourite sites for browsing maemo5 apps ?
13:30.18MohammadAG51maemo.org
13:30.34SpeedEvil4chan
13:30.37crashanddiexkr47, IRC
13:30.39TermanaMaemo 5 apps?
13:30.44TermanaI didn't know there was any
13:30.48TermanaYEEEAAHHHH...
13:30.50crashanddiethere were
13:30.50Sceltxkr47: http://nokian900applications.com
13:31.00Termanacrashanddie, until the repos stopped working at least
13:31.02Termana;P
13:31.03xkr4716:30:54 Ignoring ALL from Termana
13:31.11crashanddieTermana, "there were any"
13:31.24MohammadAG51crashanddie, i can haz op?
13:31.29xkr47Scelt, thx
13:31.36*** mode/#maemo [+o MohammadAG51] by ChanServ
13:31.36Termanacrashanddie, thanks, at least I know I always have you to correct my sentences
13:31.42TermanaHere we go
13:31.52Termanagets ready to feel the pain of the kickhammer
13:31.55*** kick/#maemo [Termana!~lagrange@Maemo/community/contributor/MohammadAG] by MohammadAG51 (I've been wanting to do this for a long, long time :P)
13:32.02*** join/#maemo Termana (~bradley@123-3-149-71.static.dsl.dodo.com.au)
13:32.05MohammadAG51/kick crashanddie backstab!
13:32.09*** mode/#maemo [-o MohammadAG51] by MohammadAG51
13:32.19xkr47bet someone could make a censored cartoon of this event
13:32.19Khertan_have finally found a work around to download kroll from this bugged ovistore
13:32.27TermanaThat has satisfied your needs for the day I suppose MohammadAG51? ;p
13:32.52Vertig0Is Ovistore accessable in MeeGo at this point?
13:32.54MohammadAG51Termana, nah, a month or 4 i'd say
13:33.18MohammadAG51i wonder what crashanddie would've done if i kicked him
13:33.26Khertan_Vertig0: yep if the browser works but it ll be useless :)
13:33.46crashanddieadd a "veto MohammadAG51 becoming an op process" to my todo list.
13:33.47Vertig0Ok :)
13:33.53RST38hMohammadAG: Badmouth you, threaten your health, then ban you?
13:33.56MohammadAG51veto?
13:34.13_trineno matter what I seem to try petrovich refuses to do anything ,, any ideas anyone?
13:34.19MohammadAG51he wouldn't ban me, he'd lose his op if he did :P
13:34.28crashanddieeh?
13:34.35StskeepsMohammadAG51: x-fade's on vacation
13:34.36Stskeeps:P
13:34.38crashanddieI would lose a pain in the but
13:34.39TermanaRST38h, I was thinking more like secure him, being a security expert and all
13:34.41Termana;P
13:34.54MohammadAG51why use petrovich when you can use the file manager
13:34.56MohammadAG51Stskeeps, err, f*ck
13:35.11MohammadAG51runs
13:35.34MohammadAG51crashanddie, i'd expect someone like you to know the difference between buts and butts
13:35.56crashanddiecrap
13:36.00crashanddienow I wrote butt to my manager
13:36.16MohammadAG51lies!
13:36.17MohammadAG51:P
13:36.17_trineMohammadAG51, well it was working and now it isnt ,, it may be something to do with the large amount of files I copied to the phone last night ,, perhaps I have a file stsem problem
13:36.23crashanddieIt's a good thing he doesn't understand english...
13:36.35Termanacrashanddie, At least you told him the truth - "I like big butts and I cannot lie!"
13:36.43MohammadAG51butt = mouth
13:36.47crashanddieI don't actually
13:36.55MohammadAG51then ask him to invite his wife for dinner
13:37.19MohammadAG51I got big booty bitches, big booty bitches
13:37.23MohammadAG51damn that song's epic
13:37.32crashanddiemate, this may be France, but I don't think inviting someone else's wife out for dinner is considered a nice thing to do between colleagues...
13:37.54MohammadAG51crashanddie, I didn't say you'd have to be with them
13:38.15MohammadAG51just tell him that butt = mouth, he'll do the rest of the fun stuff xD
13:39.06crashanddieYou do realise I have to pay the bills and stuff
13:39.35MohammadAG51lol
13:39.36crashanddieMohammadAG51, I'm not living the student life anymore, where electricity is included in the rent
13:39.55MohammadAG51electricity isn't included in rent here :P
13:40.37crashanddieso you pay electricity at home?
13:41.03MohammadAG51i was referring to student life :P
13:41.12MohammadAG51though i'm not living in a rent house
13:42.59*** join/#maemo odin_ (~dlm@93-97-168-38.zone5.bethere.co.uk)
13:43.24_trinehow can I check the integrity of Mydocs folder
13:44.00MohammadAG51umount /home/user/MyDocs
13:44.04*** join/#maemo bergie (~bergie@dsl-hkibrasgw2-fef3de00-234.dhcp.inet.fi)
13:44.08lcukleave a file containing $5000 on the root and see if Mydocs folder steals it
13:44.18MohammadAG51fsck.vfat -a /dev/mmcblk0p1
13:44.25MohammadAG51lol lcuk
13:46.31Termanalol
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13:51.33_trinestill no luck I have checked the FS reinstalled petrovich and rebooted but still it does not open the files and start
13:52.05_trineI cant think of anything else to check
13:52.37*** join/#maemo dos1 (~dos@dbr184.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
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13:52.55_trineIs it possible to reinstall the blue tooth drives on the n900
13:53.07_trinedrivers*
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13:55.02crashanddieMohammadAG51, You utter PILLOCK
13:55.22MohammadAG51opens up google translate
13:55.25crashanddieMohammadAG51, you bloody trigger happy clot
13:55.38Khertan_someone know what it s the timezone of maemo.org/packages QA Quarantine ends: ENDED 2010-10-04 13:45
13:55.53*** part/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@Maemo/community/contributor/crashanddie)
13:56.00*** join/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@Maemo/community/contributor/crashanddie)
13:56.01crashanddiewrong ubtton
13:56.17Khertan_:)
13:56.18MohammadAG51hmm, shit
13:56.39_trinecrashanddie, if you are not going to behave yourself you should be kicked
13:56.39crashanddieMohammadAG51, you fecking idiot, you couldn't even open up the .rar file to see if it even included the injection driver?
13:56.53*** join/#maemo zs (~zs@188-223-195-142.zone14.bethere.co.uk)
13:56.58crashanddie_trine, oh right, sorry
13:57.01*** join/#maemo bilboed-tp (~bilboed@143.55.233.67)
13:57.03crashanddie</sarcasm>
13:57.04MohammadAG51Noun for Idiot, fool. Originally a slang term for the penis but fairly inoffensive now its this meaning has been forgotten. Derog. ref British Slang Dictionary
13:57.23MohammadAG51that's a new word
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13:57.43MohammadAG51crashanddie, the rar has an install file that points to a repo
13:58.03*** join/#maemo juliank (~juliank@ubuntu/member/juliank)
13:58.15MohammadAG51which doesn't have any source, i don't care about injection drivers, he's breaking the gpl unless he upps a source
13:59.01crashanddiehmm
14:00.37TermanaI think I'm going to call the Cyber Police
14:00.50crashanddieMohammadAG51, I have his phone number :D
14:01.01crashanddieand address
14:01.11MohammadAG51mine is in the maemo irc logs, somewhere
14:01.44RST38hmaemos.ru claims PR1.3 coming in October
14:01.54MohammadAG51it is
14:02.01MohammadAG51October 2010
14:02.09GAN900RST38h, it is or it's never coming.
14:02.16MohammadAG51but
14:02.24RST38hGAN: Why?
14:02.33MohammadAG51can someone at nokia please a trolololo boot screen?
14:02.34RST38hAre they closing down all Maemo development in October?
14:02.49RST38hMohammad: Better make a trololo tmo skin
14:03.08MohammadAG51or a "We Are Maemo, and we pronouce it like this, THE END"
14:03.15MohammadAG51fail
14:03.23MohammadAG51"We Are Maemo, and we pronouce PR1.3 like this, THE END"
14:03.57*** join/#maemo ayanes (~ayanes@rs-15.research.netlab.hut.fi)
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14:04.20pupnikthey need that happy 60's orchestra sound for meego ads
14:04.26Termanamaemo.org should go down on the 1st of April with a page that says "Shutdown forever" and then redirect in 5 seconds to a trololololo video
14:04.36*** join/#maemo etrunko (~edulima@187.75.148.141)
14:05.10crashanddieTermana, or rather... an ironic "Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down..."
14:05.22Termanalol :p
14:08.05*** join/#maemo vcgomes (~vcgomes@li17-238.members.linode.com)
14:09.21sivangwhat's theat Trololololo video?
14:09.26*** join/#maemo ZogG (~zoggrules@bzq-79-178-11-23.red.bezeqint.net)
14:09.33Termanasivang, I am disappoint
14:09.46sivangTermana: I apologize, been having a bad day
14:11.04Termanasivang, my favourite version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z4m4lnjxkY - the sing along! But I am disappointed because you have missed out on the whole internet meme
14:11.57*** join/#maemo carloscesa (~carlos@189.2.128.130)
14:13.01*** join/#maemo JaMa (~martin@161-24.13.24.78.awnet.cz)
14:13.13RST38hHmm, N8 seems to be having problems focusing
14:13.15Termanasivang, also, don't apologise, I was kidding ;P - I just don't have a life :P
14:13.29TermanaRST38h, it already had a problem before that
14:13.43RST38h*Or* Eldar Murtazin is shaking every time he holds this piece-of-shit-nokia-product in his puffy hands
14:14.04StskeepsRST38h: he's wanking at the same time
14:14.12TermanaStskeeps, lol
14:14.28RST38hStskeeps: I am almost inclined to believe it
14:14.28pupniki'm not sure eldar is qualified to review a camera at all
14:14.44RST38hpupnik: Well, he made photos and put them up for comparison
14:14.47MohammadAG51Stskeeps, I believe the word wanking doesn't nelong here, take it to the fapman thread
14:14.52Termanapupnik, I'm not sure Eldar is qualified to review anything
14:15.06StskeepsMohammadAG51: not helping
14:15.06RST38hpupnik: His commentary is kinda worthless, but the samples are of some interest of course
14:15.08sivangTermana: Not that I do :)  I occasionally do miss the whole internet meme - Not sure how I manage to do that, but after being told about something I go and read about it and use it after everybody else already forgot about it and then considered old-school :-p </teens-of-the-eighties>
14:15.10MohammadAG51eldar is only qualified to bitch about thigs
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14:15.26MohammadAG51i remember he said the N97 was awesome, it was shit
14:15.34MohammadAG51N900 was shit, it was awesome
14:15.42pupnikmy first high tech portable was a casette walkman
14:16.17MohammadAG51mine was an atari :p
14:16.21RST38hAnyways, samples here: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n8-camera.shtml
14:16.34sivangmine was a spectra video and an atari
14:16.41RST38hiPhone 4 is postprocessing like crazy, BTW
14:16.44sivangatari for playing games, spectra video for BASIC programming
14:16.51pupnikyes it is
14:16.53MohammadAG51RST38h, indeed
14:17.03RST38hThe MSX-comparible SVI or their own design?
14:17.05MohammadAG51i've tried one, the effects are irreversible
14:17.14pupnikRST38h: the n8 is almost unique in the amount of dynamic range it preserves in photos - i don't know another phone that comes close
14:17.22sivangTermana: they guy in the video is Frankenstein?
14:17.34RST38hpupnik: I have not found anything unique in the samepls I have seen
14:17.48Termanasivang, no, what made you say that? :p
14:17.56RST38hpupnik: It isn't bad though, for a phone. Apparently has problem focusing.
14:18.11pupniklook for blown highlights and loss of shadow detail in competitors RST38h
14:18.14sivangTermana: he's horrific
14:18.22sivangRST38h: you bought one?
14:18.38crashanddiefuck me, the n8 makes horrible low-light pictures
14:18.41Termanasivang, watch out his last name is Khil. He'll Khill you
14:18.44sivangRST38h: these some niftly looking photos
14:18.50RST38hpupnik: Probably has other typical problems (low optical resolution, going pinkish in cloudy weather, going grayish in low light, etc)
14:18.51sivangHEHE
14:18.52TermanaKhil*
14:19.02jaskakhil phil
14:19.09RST38hsivang: me? no.
14:19.10pupnikRST38h: i don't think the n8 focuses at all
14:19.18RST38hpupnik: That would be weird
14:19.28MohammadAG51pupnik, it does focus
14:19.30sivangRST38h: you wrote this russian article?
14:19.39RST38hsivang: No.
14:19.41crashanddiepupnik & RST38h: I'm thinking Eldar has parkinson's, he shakes all over the place
14:19.41pupnikoh i'm wrong
14:19.46MohammadAG51OMG RST38h IS ELDAR
14:19.48pupnikit's the e7 with fixed focus
14:19.50sivangthat's eldar?
14:19.52sivangwho's eldar?
14:19.55RST38hsighs
14:20.01sivangmisses yet another interenet meme
14:20.02MohammadAG51eldarmurtazin
14:20.06pupnikhttp://nokiafanboy.com/2010/09/17/nokia-n8-vs-nokia-e7-the-comparisson-on-two-symbian3-monster/
14:20.07RST38hsivang: Google, for Tentacled's sake...
14:20.08sivanggooges
14:20.11MohammadAG51a guy who gets all nokias early
14:20.23MohammadAG51and makes them look like shit
14:20.29MohammadAG51just for the heck of it
14:20.35MohammadAG51i wonder if he has a job
14:20.52RST38hpupnik: I would not believe anything at nokiafanboy.com :)
14:20.57_trinehas no one any idea about how i can get petrovich working again on my n900
14:21.20MohammadAG51use filebox
14:21.30RST38hpupnik: nor would I, of course, believe mobile-review, for obvious reasons
14:21.48MohammadAG51wouldn't believe Apple.com
14:22.15pupnikyou can believe the published specs of a released phone.  stfu
14:22.23*** join/#maemo `0660 (~olli@124-168-61-136.dyn.iinet.net.au)
14:22.30RST38hpupnik: Wouldn't believe even that
14:22.39*** part/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@Maemo/community/contributor/crashanddie)
14:22.42RST38hpupnik: They usually omit important stuff ;)
14:22.45*** join/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@Maemo/community/contributor/crashanddie)
14:22.47crashanddiecrap, again.
14:23.13RST38hpupnik: Like N900 optics having worse resolution than its sensor
14:23.22sivangwhat's the deal with the video?
14:23.28sivangwhy is it an interenet meme?
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14:24.11pupnikgood point RST38h
14:24.47crashanddieRST38h, that's actually quite common
14:24.50lcukRST38h, huh? optics being analog lens
14:25.07lcukthat has no concept of resolution or pixels?
14:25.12crashanddielcuk, sure they do
14:25.14RST38hlcuk: oh you can make a lens in many different ways ;)
14:25.29RST38hlcuk: But for the purpose of experiment, do this:
14:25.54pupniki forgot how the lens limits resolution
14:26.00RST38hlcuk: Walk outside, focus your N900 on some far-away building with a lot of detail (appartment blocks will do) and make a shot
14:26.16RST38hlcuk: Choose the best available weather (have you still got sun there? :))
14:26.34RST38hlcuk: Once you make the shot, zoom all the way in and see what the details of those buildings look like
14:26.46sivangTermana: ^^
14:26.56RST38hlcuk: I can almost bet you will not see any detail at all, just spots
14:26.59crashanddieRST38h, not really an accurate description of MTF, but well...
14:27.16RST38hcrashanddie: Well, I am going for a practical test
14:27.20lcukRST38h, its digital zoom and camera sensors are noisy since they are small.  thats known anyway?
14:27.27lcukbut not related to the lens optics
14:27.33crashanddieRST38h, plus, that test can be buggered by weird ISO and poor processing on the N900's part.
14:27.35RST38hlcuk: Do not use digital zoom. Use the best available weather.
14:27.39sivangis there a video of Murtazin somewhere?
14:27.54RST38hlcuk: So, no digizoom. No noise to speak about (hell, configure FCamera to use smallest ISO)
14:28.05RST38hlcuk: You will STILL get garbage. Try it.
14:28.07pupnikgood camera lenses need more depth than people are willing to pocket in a cell phone
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14:28.27Termanasivang, http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/trololo-edward-hill-russian-rickroll - you may need to bookmark knowyourmeme ;) :p
14:28.28sivangnokia published in the official blog that he has unlawufully obtained Nokia devices
14:28.42RST38hlcuk: Please note that even our little family Casio (whose main selling feature was "makes Youtube videos") will pass this test quite nicely
14:28.46sivangTermana: great! Now I will never miss a meme again
14:28.55lcukhubble takes amazing pixtures with its 1mpixel sensor
14:29.07_trineMohammadAG51, I have just tried to install filebox and the n900 refused ,, it said some application packages required for the installation are missing
14:29.07lcukbecause it has pels about 4 metres each :D
14:29.31lcukRST38h, i dont know what I am looking for
14:29.45lcukjoin in with the crowds and post a blog
14:29.51lcukshowing the issue
14:30.07RST38hlcuk: You know what I think of blogs. I will get you an image of this though.
14:30.21crashanddielcuk, MTF describes how much of the subject brightness (which varies tremendously) is being sent through to the sensor. More info at: http://www.schneiderkreuznach.com/knowhow/opt_quali_e.htm
14:30.24lcukand get one that doesnt show it from your other camera
14:30.25pupniki want to see a camera mfgr ballsy enough to do another side-oriented camera that can have a 2-3cm deep zoom optics
14:30.48lcukto be honest tho, i just use the camera and take happy shots
14:31.00sivangTermana: very nice, I'll RSS
14:31.08lcuklots of photos and not noticed anything that makes me go "arghhh"
14:31.44crashanddielcuk, look at my latest tweet to Jussi
14:31.54sivangRickrolled!
14:32.00RST38hlcuk: A lot of people are incapable of being permanently happy
14:32.15pupnikHave any of you seen the n8 video?  How is it for tearing/wobblies?
14:32.19RST38hlcuk: In fact, I would call permanent unconditional happiness a psychological deviation :)
14:32.31lcukRST38h, I didnt mean like that
14:32.35lcukhttp://liqbase.net/20100921_020.jpg
14:32.35crashanddiepupnik, just like most sensors, it sucks at fast panning
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14:33.01lcukcrashanddie, post link i cant find anything in my twitter stream
14:33.33pupnikcrashanddie: it's depressing how meaningless "720p" video is today, to describe video quality, with this range we have
14:33.56crashanddielcuk, yeah, and the fuzziness around everything 9bricks in the wall facing left, red noise in the grass all over, etc) makes that picture OK-ish in 30% reduction, and nearly unusable in 100% crop
14:34.10lcukhuh?
14:34.17lcuknearly unusable?
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14:34.35crashanddiein 100% crop.
14:34.56crashanddie(photo geek term for original size, showing every pixel)
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14:35.11SpeedEvilOriginal size? 1/5th of an inch?
14:35.42crashanddieSpeedEvil, no, displaying every pixel for what it is, without reducing the total size of the image
14:35.50sivangso nokiaqtsdk is stuck at 76%
14:35.55sivangand not progressing further
14:35.57crashanddieeven if it means panning/scrolling.
14:35.58sivanganybody an idea?
14:36.01RST38hlcuk: Here it is: http://picasaweb.google.com/luarvique/Moscow#5483324943458865282
14:36.05SpeedEvilYeah - I've said that for a long time
14:36.21RST38hlcuk: Zoom in, look at the skyline
14:36.21lcukhttp://liqbase.net/liq.20100911_032.history.of.science.jpg
14:36.21lcukhmm
14:36.33sx0ni am glad that i am just regular photographer
14:36.35RST38hlcuk: Notice the perfect shooting conditions
14:37.09sivanggives up and fetches the offline version
14:37.38SpeedEvilThat's not quite right
14:37.42SpeedEvilthe whites are blown out
14:37.54SpeedEvilIf you corrected the exposure, it'd look a bit better
14:37.58lcuk"blown out"?
14:37.59crashanddielcuk, notice how fuzzy the right-hand wall gets after about 2 meters from the camera? Even immediately to the right, the "white" is noisy. Everywhere you look, it's noisy
14:38.03lcuki think it looks pretty RST38h
14:38.18RST38hSpeed: I tried several different exposures
14:38.25RST38hSpeed: Same shit with the skyline
14:38.26lcukcrashanddie, not really its going over a whole range of focus depths
14:38.29lcukso its expected?
14:38.35crashanddienot at all
14:38.42crashanddieyou should expect bokeh, not noise.
14:39.00SpeedEvilYou do realise that focus depth with a 1.6mm lens loses all meaning over a couple of meters?
14:39.07RST38hSpeed: Yes
14:39.18lcukbut i fail to see a problem with the images i have
14:39.25RST38hSpeed: But any other camera will still focus on "infinity" in this picture
14:39.28SpeedEvilThey are not bad, for a phone.
14:39.29lcuksince they are 100x better than they used to be
14:39.33lcuknow i learnt how to stop moving
14:39.39lcukas much as possible
14:39.52lcuktracy is great at taking photos
14:39.52MohammadAG51needs training
14:39.54RST38hlcuk: Taxidermy!
14:40.05MohammadAG51the N86 shoots photos in less than half a second
14:40.13MohammadAG51the N900 needs a second or two
14:40.43lcukdepends
14:40.54sx0n4000*3000 takes some time to capture
14:41.00lcukprefocused and flash
14:41.09lcuktake time too
14:41.31MohammadAG51the N900 takes more time to capture the image, from half press to full press, the N86 beats it hands down
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14:41.50MohammadAG51the N86's flash is brighter
14:41.51lcukfair enough
14:42.03MohammadAG51even though it's dual LED
14:42.20MohammadAG51looking at the flash on the N86 isn't pleasant
14:42.43sx0ni have managed to get some red eye pictures with n8, should there be some kind of dual flash etc to remove that?
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14:43.38crashanddielcuk, http://www.flickr.com/photos/violin6918/5051285752/sizes/o/in/photostream/
14:44.30crashanddielcuk, notice the difference in fuzziness around the colour edges compared with a 100% crop of a n900 picture?
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14:46.56lcukcrashanddie, ? taken with a dslr?
14:47.06crashanddieyeah, with a 5dmkii
14:47.08lcuklikes http://liqbase.net/liq.20100601_139.fire.dragon.jpg
14:47.16dnearyI'm right in thinking that the Maemo 5 messaging application is not free software, amn't I?
14:47.25dnearyOr is it just Empathy on speed?
14:47.27crashanddieyou am
14:47.30*** join/#maemo frade (~ivan@nat/nokia/x-uplledshfmxfgull)
14:47.39crashanddieor you amn't, depends on how you look at it.
14:48.03pupniki thought the n900 camera was pretty awesome tbh, but then again i was coming from the n810
14:48.17sivangI hink it is awesome indeed
14:48.31sivangI saw iphone's produce and it's far inferior in my taste
14:48.51crashanddiestop frigging comparing everything with the iphone, for f's sake.
14:48.54pupnik:)
14:48.55sivangtrue
14:49.14crashanddiefor a day-to-day, don't-give-a-crap-about-picture-quality-and-just-want-to-immortalize-a-day-out-with-the-family, the n900 is fine
14:49.19sivangcrashanddie: I was just thinking, "but quim said on the goals for meego that beating iphone cannot be a goal per se"
14:49.26pupnikIt has the best linux-phone camera, at least :)
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14:49.35lcukdneary, i think its mostly closed.
14:49.44lcukpupnik, past tense? the n900 camera is still awesome
14:49.59sivanglcuk++
14:50.02lcukand seriously outclasses the old family digital camera
14:50.17pupnikthen that camera sucked
14:50.30lcukespecially now with us having 2 of them, we get sets of comparable photos
14:50.35lcukpupnik, possibly
14:50.45fluxfcamera is nice as well. is there a way to replace the builtin camera app with that?
14:50.48lcukbut it was what we knew and used it
14:51.20lcuksivang, making something as XYZ beater never realistically gets you anywhere
14:51.22pupnikanyway n900 camera is plenty good enough for me.  i wouldn't want to pay a lot more for a better one tbh
14:51.35lcukfor years people were wanting to make a better walkman than sony
14:51.45dnearylcuk, Thought so
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14:51.54dnearyJust watched Sintel - pretty amazing
14:51.57lcukpupnik, the n8 camera is obviously good too
14:52.00dnearyThose guys get better with every film
14:52.07dnearyAs you'd expect, I suppose...
14:52.29crashanddiedneary, I was a bit disappointed by the Sintel scenario
14:52.35pupnikyeah lcuk i got to see side by side n8 vs n900 pics.  the n900 doesn't do too bad, but n8 has the edge
14:52.38sivanglcuk: true
14:52.46sivangenough with all this beating!
14:52.51crashanddiedneary, I mean, I understood the whole "oh crap, I've been doing this for 30 years" instant, but I really felt like crap that she killed her dragon.
14:53.08lcuksivang, bring out the bacon fat and make your own path
14:53.10dnearycrashanddie, That's the point
14:53.13sivangso the sdk installer downloades stuff at 1M per 2 seconds from a92-122-135-154.deploy.akamaitechnologies.com
14:53.25kerio<PROTECTED>
14:53.32pupniki really liked n8's auto-white balance too. plus combined with that black screen.. it's just so fun .. argh.
14:53.39dnearycrashanddie, But then the continuity of the baby dragon following her (after she'd just killed their daddy, no less) was nice
14:53.51lcukbtw, this http://liqbase.net/liq.20100601_139.fire.dragon.jpg fire dragon only made flames for ~0.5second
14:53.51sivangthinks to open a bug report to qt people about adding special progress for the MADDE download
14:54.02lcukme and tracy were stood there with cameras poised waiting to catch it
14:54.04crashanddiedneary, if I want to feel like shit, I'll watch Requiem for a Dream, I want shortfilms to make me think, or laugh...
14:54.09sivangsince it is much larger and takes much more time
14:54.11dnearycrashanddie, But then, maybe we shouldn't be spoiling the plot for everyone who hasn't seen it, no?
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14:54.27crashanddiedneary, they had it coming if they didn't watch it yet.
14:54.31dnearycrashanddie, /me never seen req for dream
14:54.45dnearycrashanddie, I only just watched it for the first time today
14:54.57dnearycrashanddie, At a conference all last week when it came out
14:55.29crashanddieI'm playing the world's smallest violin, just for you :)
14:55.40crashanddie:P
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14:57.03crashanddiesx0n, red eye is really not something you can remove accurately, no matter the camera
14:57.16lindi-W#gnu
14:57.19lindi-whoops :)
14:57.30RST38hcrashanddie: actually, just remove bright red :)
14:57.45crashanddiehow is that helping anything?
14:57.50crashanddieWhat if you're taking a photo of santa?
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14:57.57crashanddieHE'LL BE GREY!!!
14:58.26crashanddiecase $loc: s/GREY/GRAY/;
14:58.56dnearycrashanddie, Sure you can - accurate selection tools & apply curves or levels to the red channel
14:59.04dnearyIt'll be perfectly acceptably realistic
14:59.15crashanddiedneary, that's post processing :)
14:59.25dnearyNeed to be careful not to put a cyan tint on the whites of the eyes...
14:59.44crashanddieanyone able to call international for free?
14:59.52dnearycrashanddie, Sure
15:00.07crashanddiedneary, call: +34 620 379 905, and tell him that he's a dick for violating GPL :P
15:00.14dnearyno
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15:02.14Termanacrashanddie, have you done so?
15:02.24crashanddiehe's not answering
15:02.36TermanaHe knows
15:02.46TermanaHe must be watching us
15:03.17TermanaAnd in that case I have one thing to say:
15:03.19TermanaFuck you
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15:03.49GAN900Nutjobs
15:03.55crashanddieTermana, I had a couple of people ask me to ban you because of your rude behaviour.
15:04.32Termanacrashanddie, heh, really? Couple of people being MohammadAG51? :p
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15:04.36GAN900Ban ban ban!
15:04.43TermanaHit me with your best shot!
15:04.50crashanddieI simply replied saying they were fucking idiots.
15:04.53Stskeepsand people have been pissed about your behaviour too, crashanddie - so how about we all just fight in person after getting hammered on tequila?
15:04.59Termana:p
15:05.16crashanddiewho the hell did I piss off lately?
15:05.28crashanddieI've been seriously nice and making efforts and all for the past few months
15:05.34Stskeepsnote on 'have'
15:06.04crashanddiewell, yeah, but what can I say, I was under a lot of stress?
15:06.11crashanddieI promise honey, it'll be different now?
15:06.27MilhouseI've just been banned from engadget :) Pointed out a sight that highlighted how biased they were in their N8 vs iPhone4 camera comparison - wasn't at all sweary, just posted a link to the debunking web site and suggested they might want to post a retraction - instead they wiped my post and banned me. Unbelievable! :)
15:06.28Stskeepsdon't call me honey, you know it makes me blush
15:06.32Termana:P
15:06.41Milhousesight => site
15:07.06MilhouseBlog Nazis... gits.
15:07.13sivangStskeeps: lol
15:07.14crashanddieMilhouse, not necessarily :)
15:07.37StskeepsMilhouse: so there's worse places than tmo ;)
15:07.47Milhousecrashanddie: Not nazis, gits or they didn't wipe my post and ban me?
15:08.01MilhouseStskeeps: Oh yes, much worse! :)
15:08.03crashanddieMilhouse, sight/site
15:08.18GAN900Milhouse, links are spam.
15:08.22Milhousecrashannie: aha...
15:08.26GAN900Milhouse, spammer.
15:08.37MilhouseGAN900: Not all, only those that show engadget to be a bunch of biased hacks
15:08.51GAN900Either way, your first mistake was posting on Engadget. *g*
15:08.58MilhouseGAN900: Clearly... will have to register with a new account now! :)
15:09.10GAN900It's link when a friend of mine got baited into arguing on YouTube.
15:09.14MilhouseGAN900: Some of the anti-Nokia, anti-MeeGo shite they post is incredible
15:09.35GAN900Much like newspapers, it's all editorial.
15:10.04MilhouseGAN900: I wonder how much financial harm some of the non-journalists cause, considerable when their posts go unchallenged and treated as fact
15:10.46GAN900A bit, I'd say
15:10.57GAN900But what can you do?
15:11.11crashanddieMilhouse, to quote the title of a song by Skunk Anansie: "Yes It's fucking Political"
15:11.36MilhouseNokia do seem to be a magnet for bad press whether it's justified or not - it seems to be a popular sport these days. That Russian buffoon is leading the charge as usual.
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15:15.30GAN900Nokia hasn't done itself many favors.
15:15.37crashanddieEvery company is a magnet for bad press
15:15.45crashanddieIt really just depends of the websites you look at
15:16.47*** join/#maemo kthomas_vh_ (~kthomas@bzq-218-125-200.red.bezeqint.net)
15:16.55nidOthe bias on "popular" sites against nokia is just incredible though
15:17.22nidOI couldnt help but laugh all the way through the iphone vs blackberry vs n8 usability test on gizmodo the other day
15:18.54*** join/#maemo maybeWTF (cl@p4FE9C6C4.dip.t-dialin.net)
15:19.11kerionidO: link pls
15:19.23nidOhttp://gizmodo.com/5653621/gizmodo-hq-video-throwdown-how-usable-is-nokias-new-n8
15:19.36MilhouseI prefer to avoid sites that are pro-Nokia in an attempt to get a more unbiased opinion, but most of the "popular" tech web sites seem to pleasure in taking pot shots at Nokia, as if it's some kind of new sport.
15:19.54Milhousenid0: that was shocking
15:19.55nidOits like... fast typer with months of using an iphone, vs fast typer with months of using a blackberry, vs arthritic cripple with 20 seconds of looking at an n8
15:20.04*** join/#maemo slonopotamus (~slonopota@83.149.9.169)
15:20.04nidO"zomg n8 sux!"
15:20.41Milhousenid0: here's a video "reply" to Gizmodo: http://mynokiablog.com/2010/10/03/video-answer-to-gizmodos-usability-test-of-the-nokia-n8/
15:21.31nidOyar i saw it, says a lot
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15:23.24MilhouseWhat *is* interesting about these engadget and Gizmodo hatchet jobs, is that an awful lot of people are seeing through it and in many cases bigging up the N8, which is heatening - Nokia really do need it to succeed.
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15:23.40DocScrutinizer2moos at GAN900 and shows crashanddie how to properly remove a red eye. Using small spoon helps a lot
15:25.46_trineDocScrutinizer2, would you have any idea why petrovich on my N900 has stopped working
15:26.16_trineit no longer opens the folder as it once did
15:26.55_trineI see others on the net have had the same problem but there does not appear to be a solution I can find
15:27.13DocScrutinizer_trine: not really, but I as well had lots of issues with petrovich, and cuteexplorer (or somesuch) comes with BT file sending as one of many useful options
15:27.27nidOhas petrovich even been updated to work with 1.2? it's been kinda pointless since then
15:28.06_trineit used to work ok until yesterday and its still working on my wifes N900
15:28.18_trineand both phones are on 1.2
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15:28.39DocScrutinizernevermind petrovich, use cute explorer
15:29.07_trinecan cute explorer send vis BT
15:29.33nidOyou can send files via bt using the built-in file manager
15:30.24_trinenidO, whats the builtin file manager called
15:30.39nidOwell in your app list, "File manager".
15:30.43DocScrutinizeryes, even HFM can 'publish' 'over BT'
15:31.38_trinepetrovich was so easy to use
15:32.19DocScrutinizerbut CuteExplorer can access *whole* filesystem, not only the crippled version holding 2 folders "MyDocs" and "media/mmc1" that Nokia thinks are sufficient for users to have access to them
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15:33.03nidOwell, nokia are right. enthusiast device or not, giving whole filesystem access via a ui file manager out of the box is asking for problems
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15:33.24nidOofc, an option to enable access to the rest of the fs woulda been nice to have.
15:33.38DocScrutinizerhmm, hiding 2/3 of the fs is asking just for different problems
15:34.06nidOyes, but those problems are "bah, i have to use shell / install another filemanager" rather than "waaa i borked my phone".
15:34.16nidOI can easily imagine which nokia prefers.
15:34.36jdhaving full access to the fs through alternative file managers and shell is good enough for me
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15:34.41jdthere isn't any real lock anywhere
15:34.53DocScrutinizernidO: my words since 12 months: have a textedit field to enter arbitrary current directories (without restrictions) like on OSX finder
15:34.56jdi wish they had made / bigger though
15:35.00jd256mb is tight
15:35.24jdother than that i have no issues with anything
15:35.32jdi just made symlinks to fix some stuff and it works fine now i guess
15:36.01lcukGAN900, "But what can you do?"    <<< we can try to do as Nokia should do: innovate
15:36.04DocScrutinizernidO: that's nonsense (borked my phone), you got permissions for that, which reliably keep restricted user from "borking phone"
15:36.07_trineit seems really odd that petrovich can no longer open the file system
15:36.18lcukget off haunches and actually make something revolutionary :)
15:39.51DocScrutinizernidO: if you got a proper complete pathname in your filemanager, and can cd up and down like on any usual unix, that doesn't mean user can erase or modify arbitrary files. It just means display isn't artificially messed up so even experienced users need to think each time about "wtf was 'Documents' now?? :-/"
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15:40.57DocScrutinizerhonestly, a filemanager that doesn't allow user to even *read* own $HOME, that's completely insane
15:41.11jdi've had a n900 for a few months now
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15:41.16jdand so far it's the best phone i've ever had
15:41.32jdthe battery life isnt even that bad compared to other phones i had before, it lasts me 2 days or so on a charge with regular use
15:44.11keriothe n900 is ridiculously great
15:44.14TomaszDhas tmo gone to the grave permanently?
15:44.17kerioshame it has some really, really stupid flaws :(
15:44.17nidODocScrutinizer: it's effectively a neverending argument though. If the default filesystem could read the entire fs, someone would complain that it should run as root, afterall its not a file "manager" if you cant manage the files because the user filemanager cant touch root-owned files. a middle ground between having users borking phones and making the filesystem inaccessible has to be found,
15:44.17nidOand as I said, having an *option* to access the full fs would be nice, I can fully see why it doesnt allow it as standard
15:44.30nidOdefault filesystem = default filemanager*
15:44.49kerionidO: why the hell would you want to change files as root from a graphical filemanager
15:44.50crashanddieMy Blackberry 9700 holds a week with daily usage
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15:45.34nidOkerio: I wouldnt. but then, im happy making changes via shell anyway, lack of graphical filesystem to access above docs doesnt much bother me
15:45.58kerionow, having the browser inable to choose arbitrary files... that's bad
15:46.24DocScrutinizer51nidO: which desktop linux has such rationale? was the fact none (except mac) has ever a problem?
15:47.01kerioDocScrutinizer: the Finder has options to show hidden&system files
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15:47.21DocScrutinizer51kerio: I know, I mentioned that above
15:47.31kerioand you can just tell it to go to /bin/ or whatever
15:50.06kerioreally, how is one supposed to upload a file in... /home/user/ to a website
15:50.51DocScrutinizerit's always the same, someone has a good concept to hide complex functions from default MMI and streamline UX, and then epigons implement the same basic simplified UX but completely leave out the extended functions that originally only were hidden
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15:54.18DocScrutinizerthen 3rd party jumps in to the void and offers complementary means to cope with the missing 'advanced functions' in that crippled UI, and so the whole originally nice concept is turned into an awfull mess
15:55.20DocScrutinizerand everybody claim " *I* did the _right_ thing!"
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15:57.29kerioDocScrutinizer: is the file manager opensource?
15:57.35DocScrutinizeryes
15:57.42kerioso patch it :)
15:57.46DocScrutinizerbah
15:58.30DocScrutinizerit needs patching of the underlying lib.so or whatever. Or why do you think pertovic did same shit like HFM?
15:58.39timeless_xchathttp://ics.svc.ovi.com/ics/app?page=livestream/herenow&service=page&mcc=244&mnc=5&cmcc=244&cmnc=5&cid=407115&bear=&lac=29000&language=1&width=800&height=480&tz=p0300&vejr=HN_S60_2.0
15:58.57DocScrutinizerit's the file selector widget that is completely fscked up
15:59.04DocScrutinizernot HFM
15:59.57timeless_xchatjaffa, i got "Location not detected"
16:00.05DocScrutinizertbh I'd not even say a word about HFM implementing that. It's the fact the whole system is built to force app devels into same shit
16:01.57_trineDocScrutinizer, what could have changed on my N900 to stop petrovich from picking up the files?
16:02.24DocScrutinizersorry, no idea
16:02.36_trineok
16:02.47yaccAny quick way to make the N900 reconnect the chat services?
16:03.02yaccWithout going "online" => "offline" => "online"?
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16:05.57_trinepetrovich is only 1 file in /user/bin and I have reinstalled it and it still does not work so it must be something else that has changed somewhere
16:05.59DocScrutinizerkerio: see tickets about "HFM doesn't display file extensions", "HFM doesn't show full patchname" and the idiocy you can't tell apart 2 file of same basename in backup app, even when one of the files is on uSD and the other stored on the phone. WTF!
16:06.07DocScrutinizerttyl
16:06.36DocScrutinizers/oatchname/pathname/
16:06.49timeless_xchatyacc: you can create profiles that are subsets of offline
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16:07.01yacctimeless_xchat, ?
16:07.01timeless_xchats/off/on/
16:07.28timeless_xchatand switch from online to a subset that excludes the account you want to kick
16:07.36timeless_xchatand then switch back to online
16:09.08yacctimeless_xchat, how do I do that?
16:09.52yaccAh well, yes, I meant anyway not "offline" (flight mode), but "offline" (IM presence).
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16:10.10yaccI was thinking more along the line of one button to click to make it refresh it's connections.
16:10.56MohammadAG51<Termana> crashanddie, heh, really? Couple of people being MohammadAG51? :p
16:11.19MohammadAG51i don't usually report people
16:11.27MohammadAG51-1 for you
16:11.46MohammadAG51meh, he's offline
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16:23.22timeless_xchatyacc: i'm talking about presence
16:24.37timeless_xchatwe don't have a ui to create phone profiles
16:24.46timeless_xchatonly im status profiles
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16:43.06MohammadAG51what's the dev node for a mic?
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16:57.02DocScrutinizerdev node for mic? don't think there's such a thing
16:57.11johnsqHi
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17:02.21Jaffare
17:03.25DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: there's /dev/snd/* holding device nodes for the ADCs & DACs available in the system
17:04.49DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: and there's */controlC0 as lowest level access to mixer, aiui. Mic has no own device node, as it's not a distinct device
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17:16.32_trinefrom wht I can see of it all these blue tooth apps only send 1 file at a time,, is this correct?
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17:45.47Goliath23hi. qtcreator offers me to update from qt 4.6 to qt 4.7 .. can I still target pr 1.2 after that?
17:45.53Goliath23(on the n900 I mean)
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17:49.22lcukGoliath23, qt4.7 is at present in -devel
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17:51.48mecelcuk, qt4.7 final?
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17:52.08lcukmece, not sure if its been updated since the final came out
17:52.13lcukhave a look on packages though
17:52.21mecelcuk, don't think so.
17:52.27lcuk<PROTECTED>
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17:54.22MohammadAG51wants Frets on Fire
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18:06.26Goliath23lcuk: where can I search through the repo contents? is there something like packages.ubuntu.org?
18:06.43timeless_mbpsp3000: oh
18:06.48lcukyes Goliath23 http://maemo.org/packages/
18:06.53timeless_mbpi think i know why my mac is starting to slow down!
18:06.54Goliath23lcuk: thanks
18:07.32timeless_mbpi only have 10gb of disk space left on my mac
18:07.34lcuktimeless_mbp, you added a tinfoil hat?
18:07.42timeless_mbplcuk: kinda
18:09.18timeless_mbplcuk: basically every time my system tries to write to disk, i think it has to think harder about finding space
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18:12.48Venemowhat's the difference between 'su' and 'su -' ?
18:13.02FauxFauxOne destroys the environment more.
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18:13.31VenemoFauxFaux: ?
18:13.44FauxFauxVenemo: ?
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18:14.09VenemoFauxFaux: what do you mean by "destroys the environment", and how much "more"?
18:14.34RST38hmoo all
18:14.52FauxFauxVenemo: Try it and find out?  Observe the current directory etc.
18:15.28VenemoFauxFaux: well, I haven't noticed anything different yet, but someone once told me that 'su -' is "better" - he didn't explain why though
18:15.30lcuktimeless_mbp, sounds like many things
18:15.44lcukhaving a good cleanup and reorganisation should do you good :P
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18:19.58timeless_mbplcuk: i don't have that much data..
18:20.36timeless_mbpi mean, sure, 175gb of vm's :)
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18:27.52ZogGis TMO down?
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18:28.35Venemohm... when launching the Maemo 5 SDK, Xephyr displays only a blank black window... what can be the issue?
18:29.01Venemoit was working previously
18:29.25sp3000man my microwave is dumb
18:29.39sp3000noo I can't add 10s to the time after it's started. or 10min for that matter
18:29.45timeless_mbpheh
18:29.50sp3000I can add 1min, but not with the button labeled 1min
18:29.56sp3000but the start button
18:29.58sp3000!
18:30.13timeless_mbprotfl
18:30.48Stskeepssp3000: fixed release schedule microwave
18:31.05timeless_mbpStskeeps: upgrades available for 150EUR
18:31.41timeless_mbpoh, and upgrades don't include a warranty
18:32.12timeless_mbpis almost done reading spam
18:32.22timeless_mbpit's sad, but reading spam is so much faster than reading mail
18:33.28Venemohere is the error message: Could not create server lock file: /tmp/.X2-lock
18:33.39RST38hyou have got another Xephyr running
18:33.44Venemono I haven't
18:33.55RST38hdo ls -l /
18:34.02RST38hand paste the "tmp" line
18:34.26sp3000timeless_mbp: you'd wish all mail was spam! ...oh, wait
18:34.34VenemoRST38h: drwxrwxrwt.  28 root root 12288 Oct  4 20:33 tmp
18:34.47RST38hhm
18:35.02RST38hDO ls -l /tmp/.X*
18:35.39VenemoRST38h: http://fpaste.org/4nyj/
18:36.01wmaronedoh
18:36.06wmaroneTMO is toast
18:36.11Venemohow so?
18:36.14Venemowhat happened to it?
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18:36.23wmaronevbulletin database error
18:36.27Corsacthe n770 has frozen?
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18:36.51VenemoRST38h: should I delete the folder it is trying to access from /tmp ?
18:36.55VenemoCorsac: lol!
18:37.06RST38hVenemo: rm -rf /tmp/.X2-lock
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18:37.25MohammadAG51fucking router
18:37.27VenemoRST38h: rm: cannot remove `/tmp/.X2-lock': Operation not permitted
18:37.38MohammadAG51sudo?
18:37.46RST38hSUDO!
18:37.50Venemoooops
18:38.02RST38hsighs: some people are really better off with Windows
18:38.26Venemookay
18:38.39Venemo'su -c 'rm -rf /tmp/.X2-lock'' did the trick
18:38.53MohammadAG51Nokia's devs? :P
18:39.13MohammadAG51Oh noes
18:39.17VenemoFatal server error:
18:39.18MohammadAG51tmo database error
18:39.19VenemoCannot establish any listening sockets - Make sure an X server isn't already running
18:39.29Venemothis is what it says
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19:00.00timeless_mbphrm, i guess i could get some space back by deleting a 50gb vm image :)
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19:06.04jukwhere is radio list located by default from vanila image ?
19:06.40jukone the best things I get from bying N900
19:07.21juklearn some deutch also
19:07.38jukand finish :D
19:08.13juksorry Finnish
19:09.08jukFinnish Phone :D
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19:10.43jukwhere is radio list located by default from vanila image ?
19:11.00MohammadAG51what radio list
19:11.06MohammadAG51all N900s have the same radios
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19:11.44jukMohammadAG51: I mean internet radio, music
19:12.01MohammadAG51oh, idk
19:12.33jukMohammadAG51: I listed for xml, html, txt, list nothing
19:13.13jukMohammadAG51: they did some modifications I guess
19:14.38jukMohammadAG51: idk, thats it?
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19:19.15RST38hhttp://thpmaemo.blogspot.com/2010/10/qt-write-once-ifdef-everywhere.html
19:19.30RST38hFun fun fun, make note of the AknUi usage :)))
19:20.03jukMohammadAG51: ok i'll try to decrypt what idk meant, see ya
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19:20.17MohammadAG51infobot, wtf idk
19:20.24MohammadAG51exactly
19:20.28MohammadAG51idk = that
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19:31.10pupnikhow is the latency through that gateway n900evil ?
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19:46.05Venemohey guys
19:46.07Venemohttp://pastebin.com/0wSz9JUH
19:46.12Venemothis is what Xephyr keeps saying to me
19:46.30Venemocould anyone please help?
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19:47.20larsemilanyone knows if there is any new phone coming with maemo on it? n900 is starting to get bit old?
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19:48.19Venemolarsemil: the next release will probably have new hardware. there are rumours but nothing is announced yet
19:48.34larsemilno other vendors picking it up?
19:48.43larsweyi miss my N900 :(
19:48.55larsweydidnt stand 2 hours under salt water
19:49.12pupnikimagine n900 with bigger screen and more keys
19:49.33pupnikthat would make my gumdrops burst with flavor
19:50.38Venemopupnik: what happened?
19:50.48pupnik?
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19:51.32pupnikpicture stretching n900 screen a couple centimeters each direction to get 1024x600 or somth
19:52.30GAN900pupnik, I want more DPI.
19:52.50pupnikdiminishing returns GAN900 - where does it end?
19:54.30Venemopupnik: "i miss my N900 :("... what happened to it?
19:54.47pupnikwater splashed onto keyboard
19:55.01pupnikbut it's beyond the loan date now anyway
19:55.15DocScrutinizerseem infobot has grammatical problems, correct wording is "Gee...  I don't know IS what idk means..." X-P
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19:55.47GAN900pupnik, when I can't see pixels with a magnifying glass.
19:55.48n900evilwhat gateway?
19:55.51n900evilpupnik:
19:56.00pupniktor n900evil
19:56.16n900evilthis is not a pipe.
19:56.17ds3not being able to see pixels is a good thing
19:56.46pupnikn900 is too high dpi for old eyes
19:56.50GAN900We're damn close with the N900.
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19:56.58GAN900pupnik, that's a software problem.
19:57.43pupniki'd like to see more AI now.  pixels don't excite
19:58.20DocScrutinizerthere's no such thing like "too high DPI", at least for user experience. Too high DPI just *could* really mean "too weak GFX engine"
19:58.47*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@Maemo/community/contributor/MohammadAG)
19:58.59pupnikDocScrutinizer: - i think all factors must be in balance
19:59.00Arkenoiwell, i guess 300-350 dpi could be kinda enough :-)
19:59.18n900evilToo high dpi is under 60nm dot pitch
19:59.24DocScrutinizerpupnik: why?
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19:59.47pupnikDocScrutinizer: engineering and economic trade-offs
20:00.08DocScrutinizern900evil: yep, when the DPI actually starts creating optically active structures, then that's for sure too high DPI
20:00.45n900evilMore seriously, I am unconvinced by arguments for over 250dpi
20:00.45DocScrutinizerpupnik: that's not "too high DPI", rather that's "too expensive display" then
20:01.43DocScrutinizern900evil: >>250 DPI come in just handy, for HMDs ;-)
20:01.47pupnikok thanks DocScrutinizer - i see your point now
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20:02.32n900evilHMD sure.
20:02.47n900evilfor that you want 25000
20:03.00DocScrutinizerhehe
20:03.20VenemoScratchbox and Xephyr keep screwing me up
20:03.28Venemohere is what it says: http://pastebin.com/YMN6UPqf
20:03.32Venemocould anyone please help me?
20:05.03poghello, does it harm, to reformat the FAT32 space to FAT32 and ext? Because I prefer some space for a linux installation.
20:05.17pogI talk from the N900
20:05.22lcukVenemo, tried rebooting?
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20:07.46Venemolcuk, yes
20:08.00lcukoooer Venemo
20:08.26lcuki dont normally use xephyr myself so havent seen this
20:08.35lcukDocScrutinizer, what ppi is the CCD on the n900?
20:08.41Venemoand Scratchbox login tells me, "Session setup problem, abort."
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20:09.03DocScrutinizerdamn, I installed a few apps yesterday for testing them (e.g flashlight-extra, tower cell info...) and it seems something is causing considerable hickups of whole system now :-/
20:09.30MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, flashlight-extra
20:09.42MohammadAGsee dmesg, it gave a shitload of kernel errors
20:09.50DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: yup, I as well suspect that one
20:09.53MohammadAGUnable to start flashlight-extra
20:09.55DocScrutinizerouch
20:09.58MohammadAGdsme: respawning
20:10.04DocScrutinizeryuck
20:10.05MohammadAGlemme try and find eit
20:10.07MohammadAGit*
20:10.26DocScrutinizerlcuk: the math is easy, no?
20:10.41MohammadAGSep 22 23:48:37 Nokia-N900 init: flashlight-extra main process ended, respawning
20:10.52lcukDocScrutinizer, sure if the variables are known, I don't know the sensor dimensions
20:11.01MohammadAGSep 22 23:48:52 Nokia-N900 init: flashlight-extra main process ended, respawning
20:11.07DocScrutinizerlcuk: sensor?
20:11.21lcukccd sensor
20:11.50DocScrutinizerlcuk: according to my tools used this very minute the display is 78mm wide
20:11.59DocScrutinizerand has 800 as we all know
20:12.42DocScrutinizerso DPI is 800 / (78 / 25.4) if I'm not completely wrong
20:12.46VenemoI'll try to reboot again
20:12.51lcukDocScrutinizer, CCD
20:13.00lcukthe camera sensor
20:13.03lcuknot the screen display
20:13.14DocScrutinizerooh, ccd. I guess we don't have any CCD on N900
20:13.22DocScrutinizeryeah, camera is cmos
20:13.30DocScrutinizeranyway, idk
20:13.38MohammadAGso, the back sensor is IR
20:13.55MohammadAGit detects colour, so I'm assuming it detects how much the IR is reflected
20:14.08lcukcos thats at the sort of resolution n900evil needs for an eyeball one :P
20:14.13MohammadAGsadly, both the front proximity sensor and the back sensor flash at a very high rate
20:14.18lcukand ahhh i thought all cameras were CCD :$
20:14.34MohammadAGwhich imo, would save a lot of battery if they didn't
20:14.42lcuknever needed to dig deeper
20:14.44MohammadAGwhy didn't they go the N95-way
20:15.05MohammadAGa mechanical switch for camera, and a menu item to unmount the card
20:15.07DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: what are you after??
20:15.27MohammadAGNokia's hardware designer's head
20:15.53DocScrutinizerhmm, lemme reprase
20:16.00MohammadAG"I deleted boot, please help" nice thread title
20:16.04DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: what's the problem, what's the topic?
20:16.08lcuka mechanical button being used on a removable/movable piece wears easily
20:16.27lcuk(speaking of the reasoning for the camera slide detection
20:16.33MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, why the hell does the proximity sensor not turn off
20:16.47MohammadAGwhy doesn't it stay off until needed
20:17.00DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: because somebody keeps the device node open
20:17.03MohammadAGlcuk, my N95's been working fine for 3 years, or a bit more
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20:17.51lcukMohammadAG, idk then
20:18.23MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, that wastes battery life
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20:18.34MohammadAGnot by a lot, but it does waste battery life
20:18.44DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: the sensors are amazingly humble on power
20:18.54MohammadAGreally?
20:18.57DocScrutinizeryes
20:19.07MohammadAGso they can't be exploited as a mug warmer, DAMN IT
20:19.15DocScrutinizerlol
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20:23.20MohammadAGyay
20:23.25MohammadAGtracker is on my PC
20:23.33Stskeepskill it with fire!
20:23.35MohammadAGthank you canonical, that's all I needed to rape my CPU
20:23.38MohammadAG<PROTECTED>
20:23.38kerioOH NO IT'S SPREADING
20:23.50MohammadAGyay, 80C
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20:25.15MohammadAGThe following packages will be REMOVED:
20:25.21MohammadAGhmm, doesn't look right
20:25.38MohammadAGah, forgot --purge
20:25.53kerioyou forgot --kill-it-with-fire
20:26.11keriois there a way to tell apt to shred the files instead?
20:26.22MohammadAGlol
20:26.33MohammadAGnah, it has supercow powers
20:26.38MohammadAGit'll shred them on its own
20:28.56yaccI wondered if there is a tool that auto-adjusts the brightness?
20:29.28yaccConsidering that there seems to be a sensor even on the front to sense how bright the environment is, ...
20:29.46MohammadAGafaik brightness is adjusted by default
20:32.13Venemoyacc: it is called an ambient light sensor, and it does auto-adjust the brightness
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20:36.42yaccVenemo, yeah, but the N900 seems not to adjust the brightness, ...
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20:37.10Venemoyacc, it does
20:37.22Venemoyacc, bring it to a bright room, then to darkness
20:37.32yaccVenemo, now for the G1 for example which does not such a sensor somebody wrote a tool that uses the camera (won't work on the N900 because of the slider) to decide the brightness, not all the time, but some time, ...
20:38.17yaccVenemo, you mean the brightness slider just sets the "effect" that I want to have, and the N900 has been busy giving me the brillant image quality all the time on it's own?
20:38.25MohammadAGyacc, if you restart mce it's broken until the next reboot
20:38.34MohammadAGalso, I think qwerty12's applet breaks it sometimes
20:40.19yaccmce?
20:40.53MohammadAG~mce
20:40.53infobotMCE = Machine Check Exception
20:40.56MohammadAGfuck
20:40.57MohammadAGyou
20:41.07MohammadAG~mce is also Mode Control Entity
20:41.07infobotMohammadAG: okay
20:41.08yacc?
20:41.15MohammadAGI hate that bot sometimes
20:41.15piggzis there a libqt4-qt3support package for maemo that is uptodate with the current libqt4?
20:41.17MohammadAG~mce
20:41.18infobotMCE = Machine Check Exception.  Mode Control Entity
20:41.22MohammadAGsigh
20:41.34MohammadAGyacc, it's what controls most lights in the system
20:41.40MohammadAGvibration is a light
20:41.49Venemoyacc, it won't affect the brightness slider
20:44.48yaccWhen we are at the topic, anyway to see what process caused some light/vibration/sound event?
20:45.30VenemoMohammadAG: it also controls the screen orientation
20:45.42Venemo~MohammadAG
20:45.48yaccI've got the N900 just last week, and it has this tendency to give off all kinds of sounds, but when I check the display there is nothing marked (the left top corner icon is just blue, no yellow marking for a message for example).
20:46.01Venemowhat sort of sounds?
20:46.02MohammadAGyeah, it polls the accelerometer and reports orientation, sometimes crashes under the tension of life
20:46.15Venemoyacc, perhaps you installed something that messes things up.
20:46.31yaccYeah, but how do I figure what messes things up?
20:47.09Venemoyacc, difficult to answer
20:47.24Venemoyacc, perhaps if you would explain in more detail, the guys here could help you more
20:47.28yaccYeah, that's why I ask ;)
20:47.42yaccE.g. yesterday I had it play everytime I've turned the screen off or on.
20:47.48yaccToday it does not do this, ...
20:48.16yaccVenemo, luckily for me I had no time yet to fool around myself, ... :)
20:48.47pupnikyacc: your problem description is hard to understand.  perhaps you can youtube upload a video of the problem
20:49.54dRbiGhmm, just wondering, proper way to pronounce maemo is like ma-emo or does ae stands for something more fancy here? :)
20:50.22yaccpupnik, well, the issue is that it's not doing it today.
20:50.50yaccGenerally speaking not being able to figure out what process has played a sound, vibrated or activated leds is bad, ...
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20:51.20Venemowell, it usually plays a sound when you receive an e-mail/sms, and stuff
20:51.30Venemoyou can also set what events you want the LED to turn on fo
20:51.39Venemoyou can also set what events you want the LED to turn on for in the Settings application
20:51.45yaccpupnik, it would be perhaps different with a stupid device, but with a device that is so "extensible", ....
20:52.24yaccVenemo, yeah, but if an app plays a sound, while not giving a visible cue, it's hard to figure out what's happening.
20:53.08pupnikusers learn which sound means what after a few days
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21:03.51`Francesca_Lucchhow do i  ake screen shots in n900?
21:04.06MohammadAGCTRL+SHIFT+P
21:04.09SpeedEvilctrl-shift-p
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21:04.28merlincoreythere's an app for that, too
21:04.36merlincoreyI've always wanted to say that in a non-i-zone
21:04.51merlincoreybut yeah there's an app that does screenshots/screencasting
21:05.00SpeedEvilcpu-applet
21:05.07SpeedEvilgenerally a good thing to install
21:05.48merlincoreyyeah I like that one - odd that it adds a little meter AND does screenshotting but hey :P
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21:12.12DocScrutinizera mandatory thing to install
21:14.08Venemois it possible to install the Diablo SDK alongside the Fremantle one?
21:16.01timeless_mbpVenemo: using scratchbox?
21:16.36DocScrutinizeryacc: sounds are also played for loss/establishing of connectivity
21:17.08Venemotimeless_mbp: yes, for now
21:17.20DocScrutinizerthen a warning sound is played for bat-low notifications
21:17.30timeless_mbpVenemo:  basically you create a distinct scratchbox for each sdk
21:17.50timeless_mbpwell, one for x86-diablo, one for arm-diablo, one for x86-fremantle, one for arm-fremantle
21:17.57timeless_mbpyou just switch between them...
21:18.54Venemotimeless_mbp: yes, that much I know
21:19.08Venemotimeless_mbp: the question is, where do I get the packages for the Diablo SDK?
21:19.22Venemotimeless_mbp: there's no download link on http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/#sdk_releases
21:19.31luke-jr_…
21:19.48luke-jr_I need an app that does an alarm every N hours, allowing me to reset it early
21:19.51luke-jr_any ideas?
21:19.56timeless_mbphttp://tablets-dev.nokia.com/diablo/INSTALL.txt ?
21:20.57Venemotimeless_mbp: k, thanks
21:21.21DocScrutinizeryacc: first you could try "for f in /usr/share/sounds/*; do echo $f; aplay $f; sleep 1; done" and find out which sound exactly it was that pestered you
21:21.53*** join/#maemo jonne (~jonne@91.182.19.145)
21:27.07DocScrutinizer51luke-jr_: alarmed?
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21:52.11lardmanhates writing GUI code
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21:55.15johnsqlardman: it is easy text box and let enter the commands.
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21:55.33lardman:)
21:55.36lardmanif only
21:55.57lardmantrying to get my head around pyqt
21:56.53Chanipyqt ftw :)
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21:57.42lardmancan you add a layout to a layout? Seems not, quite confusing coming from GTK+
21:57.43CarnequeHey all, anyone know if MeBook reads pdf files?
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22:02.44lardmanhmm, seems rather than being able to group together widgets in H or V Boxes, one needs to generate a GridLayout and set the exact positions
22:02.46lardmanshame that
22:03.35Chanio.0
22:03.41Chanilardman: yes you can add a layout to a layout.
22:03.58Chaniqt is very anti-exact-positions ;)
22:04.10lardmanoh right
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22:04.20lardmanwell that is good, I wonder why my IDE was moaning at me
22:04.22Chaniit should be something like layout1.addLayout(layout2)
22:04.27Chanioh, IDEs..
22:04.28*** join/#maemo smooph1 (~smooph@e180145243.adsl.alicedsl.de)
22:04.31lardmanyeah that was what I was doing
22:04.33Chanilardman: qt designer?
22:04.44lardmannah, am using Spyder
22:04.48lardmanis PyQT
22:04.49Chanioh. never heard of it
22:04.57Chanimakes a note
22:05.06lardmannor me, just wanted something that worked under Windows and did completion
22:05.20lardmanis a bit like MATLAB, which is nice for me
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22:06.13lardmanah, I think I need to s/set/add
22:06.16Chanilardman: btw, #qt is a good channel for questions like that :)
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22:07.02lardmanChani: yeah, I was more just thinking out loud, but I guess I should head there and ask if I have problems
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22:09.33lardmanooo! I'm happy, I have a GUI finally working (under Windows at least, but it's a start)
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22:09.49Chani:)
22:10.11nuovodnahi, i receive this error with "apt-get dist-upgrade" : pymaemo-optify but is not going to be installed
22:10.15lardmanI always find it's that effort to get the first UI up and running that is the worst, then it's just modification
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22:10.27nuovodnabut pymaemo-optify is installed (extras-devel active)
22:10.29lardmanlikes algorithms, not presentation
22:10.41Chaniusually starts by modifying an existing app ;)
22:11.16lardmanChani: yeah I was considering that, but thought (foolishly) that it would be quicker to write from scratch than dig out something similar
22:11.40Chanipyqt + .ui files dynamically loaded = stupidly easy UI prototypes
22:12.05lardmannot so fond of .ui files tbh
22:12.13lardmanI'd prefer to see the code
22:12.22Chanieh.. depends on the situation
22:12.23lardmanand I also don't much like QT Designer
22:12.36pupniktell me of your homeworld, usul
22:13.16lardmanit's a bit half-hearted in terms of UI 0design - can't drag stuff around and resize, hard to add items to layouts or other widgets, etc
22:13.21Chanifor fairly straightforward, static UIs (say, a config dialog or a toy app) ui files are much easier and maintainable. for a more complex, dynamic UI you end up wanting code.  ...or you can use both :)
22:13.55lardmansure, I just don't see much time saved using it really
22:14.03Chanilardman: I never had problems dragging things around... I tend to only resize the main dialog though, everything else follows its layout and if it's not the right size then I didn't do the layout right ;)
22:14.08lardmanfor me perhaps, but not next time round, etc
22:15.00lardmanre layouts - that may be my failing there, the only GUI design tool I've used is the dreaded VB, which sets absolute positions and sizes, so is a bit hard to get away from that thinking
22:15.08Chanieeeeew
22:15.24lardmancan't argue that VB produces code quickly though ;)
22:15.44Chanidesigner's layouting can be a bit fiddly at times, though. I never tought the draggable layouts, I always right-click a widget to set its layout
22:16.00Chanis/tought/touch/
22:16.05Chaniaand I really need sleep :P
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22:16.44lardmanIf I have widgets in the UI already, I had all sorts of troubles trying to insert a layout into iirc a QGroupBox widget
22:17.28lardmanas the widget was 2 pixels high and wouldn't let me insert anything
22:17.43lardmanbut again that may be my fault, as perhaps I needed to wrap something in a layout, or not
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22:18.46lardmanshame the little tree diagram showing widgets and layouts doesn't allow dragging and dropping of the various bits and bobs to change things when it's hard to do in the graphical representation
22:22.02lardmanChani: night night, thanks for the help :)
22:22.26luke-jr_DocScrutinizer51: is that an app?
22:22.47DocScrutinizeryes
22:23.04DocScrutinizerthough not for debian afaik
22:23.13DocScrutinizeror gebtoo
22:23.20DocScrutinizergentoo*
22:24.08*** join/#maemo smooph (~smooph@e180140218.adsl.alicedsl.de)
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22:26.49*** part/#maemo RSpliet (~roy@53537511.cable.casema.nl)
22:28.08luke-jr_DocScrutinizer: thinking for Maemo atm
22:28.32*** part/#maemo dob (gintomik@otitsun.oulu.fi)
22:29.52*** join/#maemo benh (~benh@67.13.70.115.static.exetel.com.au)
22:31.34lcuk2DocScrutinizer, you got an internal schematic of n900?
22:31.45lcuk2around the stylus slot especially
22:31.58DocScrutinizererr, sorry?
22:32.06lardmanwhere's qwerty when you need him? ;)
22:32.09DocScrutinizerwhat's an internal schematic?
22:32.36lardmanlcuk2: I have one, but not handy, can send it to you tomorrow - schematic iirc and pics
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22:32.54lcuk2lardman, :) awesome, thanks
22:33.02lcuk2something appears to have been forced into it
22:33.04lcuk2and its broken
22:33.07lardmanhmm
22:33.09DocScrutinizer(i got friggin transition failures with mhd though :-( No fun)
22:33.13lcuk2can get a stylus in, but not out
22:33.27lardmanI've got the disassembly guide thing which should show the hw layout
22:33.53lardmanotoh a quick search of e.g. rapidshare might get you the pdf this evening
22:34.11DocScrutinizerlcuk2: why don't you ask for what you really need?
22:34.43MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, transition failures?
22:34.51DocScrutinizerlardman: all this is easily available and well documented where to get it
22:35.02lardmanindeed
22:35.28MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, uninstall mhd, install my modified desktop, then install matan's
22:35.36MohammadAG51you're probably missing pr1.2 libs
22:36.03MohammadAG51ignore that, don't install mine, you're on 1.1.1
22:36.06DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: weird shit. dialer refuses to change screen orientation until I click on the menu and select (e.g.?) "rotation". This very moment it rotates accordingly and then is sticky there again
22:36.27*** join/#maemo smooph1 (~smooph@e180139246.adsl.alicedsl.de)
22:36.33MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, did you reboot after installation?
22:36.33DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: nope, clean PR1.2 here
22:36.44DocScrutinizererr, good call
22:37.03MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, btw, matan's deb only has the hildon-desktop binary
22:37.12MohammadAG51you need the new transitions.ini
22:37.20DocScrutinizerduh
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22:38.02DocScrutinizeranyway efect was weird, transitions/screen-rotation only took place when opening a new window
22:38.17MohammadAG51yeah, happens here sometimes
22:38.27MohammadAG51http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/debfiles/new/hildon-desktop-kinetic_2.2.138-1+0m5_armel.deb
22:38.37lcuk2DocScrutinizer, http://liqbase.net/IMG_1940_tab.jpg
22:38.38MohammadAG51uninstall mhd, install that, then install mhd
22:38.45MohammadAG51or just extract transitions.ini
22:38.47lcuk2based on your photos here
22:38.48lcuk2http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/n900/
22:38.51MohammadAG51downgrades lcuk2
22:38.55DocScrutinizermeh, why isn't that in the dependen... errr it's a .deb :-S
22:39.01lcuk2http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/n900/images/IMG_1940.JPG
22:39.19lcuk2the circled highlight on my device has a metal tab sticking out
22:40.00MohammadAG51lcuk2, can't you bend it back in?
22:40.26*** join/#maemo b0tz (~b0tz@unaffiliated/b0tz)
22:40.31lcuk2i might be able to now I have seen photos
22:41.26MohammadAG51goes to bed
22:41.29MohammadAG51night
22:41.40lcuk2\o
22:41.40*** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)
22:42.07lardmannighty night MohammadAG51
22:42.18lardmanhey SpeedEvil
22:43.13*** join/#maemo DocScrutinizer (~halley@openmoko/engineers/joerg)
22:43.42*** join/#maemo Venusaur (~desu@wikipedia/Antonio-Lopez)
22:44.03SpeedEvilhey
22:44.45babsher_are there any minimal distributions of maemo out there. Like ones with not GUI
22:44.52DocScrutinizerdamn DSL outage
22:45.12DocScrutinizerlcuk2: what exactly is your question?
22:45.16wmaronebabsher_: not really, since there are no other distributions of Maemo
22:45.32DocScrutinizerI looked at the photos, but don't really understand your problem
22:45.46babsher_I have heard of people building there own images
22:45.56*** join/#maemo laasonen (~laasonen@ape3000.com)
22:46.00lcuk2DocScrutinizer, dont fret :) I knew you had taken photos of the internals of n900
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22:46.12wmaronesure, but they cannot redistribute them
22:46.14lcuk2i needed to see one from around the stylus hole
22:46.21babsher_ok well that is fine
22:46.34babsher_How would you go about doing that then.
22:46.39DocScrutinizerlcuk2: all the photos I took are on that page you referred to
22:46.42babsher_can you do it with scratch box
22:47.08DocScrutinizerin original resolution and all
22:47.10lcuk2DocScrutinizer, yes and I found that after I spoke in here.
22:47.13lardmanbabsher_: what sort of image do you want to create?
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22:47.46babsher_well i just want a shell with python
22:48.18lcuk2babsher_, no ui?
22:48.31babsher_ya no ui
22:48.45lardmanmight be worth looking at the Meego image builder then
22:48.52lardmanotherwise there's OE
22:49.04babsher_i have messed around with oe a bit
22:49.14babsher_i never got it to compile though
22:49.23*** join/#maemo lcuk (lcuk@Maemo/community/contributor/lcuk)
22:49.32lardmanbabsher_: Meego is more up to date
22:49.49babsher_do you have a link
22:49.49lardmanand afaiu the build process, quite similar
22:50.25lardmanhttp://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900
22:50.28*** join/#maemo smooph (~smooph@e180132019.adsl.alicedsl.de)
22:51.02lardmanThere's a link there for Meego Image Creator, which is what you will want
22:51.32babsher_ok i found it
22:51.36babsher_thanks for the help!
22:51.50lardmannp, I hope it will do what you need
22:52.20babsher_looks like it is for fedora
22:52.38lardmanbuild system? Yeah
22:52.50lardmanchroot so Stskeeps suggests
22:53.16babsher_i am running ubuntu. maybe i could get a fedora virtual machine
22:53.46lardmanping Stskeeps tomorrow
22:54.52DocScrutinizerlcuk: so what's your problem? can't pull out stylus?
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22:56.07DocScrutinizerlcuk: if that's your problem, it most probably isn't caused by the spring you marked in your picture
22:56.52lardmanI do hate the way the PyQt docs are all repros of the C++ stuff
22:57.03lardmanstill using C++ code to boot
22:57.16wmaroneaww
22:57.40wmaronepandaboard requires removal of 28 resistors and jumpering of 28 connections to activate the parallel display lines
22:58.03lardmansoldertastic
22:58.10DocScrutinizerhmm, sounds fair enough
22:58.55DocScrutinizerafter all removing 0402 or 0603 isn't really an art
22:59.00babsher_looks like there are Debian packages, for the meego image creator
22:59.12lcukDocScrutinizer, i have stylus out now, but ive got a metal shard sticking out in the stylus canal
22:59.23DocScrutinizerouch
22:59.25lcukso i can push it in, then it gets trapped on the ledge of the stylus
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23:00.12DocScrutinizerweird scary FFS
23:00.42lcukyeah, its a bit rubbish, I cant insert tweezers to pull the shard into different pos
23:00.50lcukand it just flexes when I press it
23:00.50DocScrutinizerI wonder though how such thing can happen
23:01.12DocScrutinizernah, you need to disassemble
23:01.14lcukthere appears to be more of a gap now towards the body of the device
23:01.19lcuklooks like it was pushed at an angle
23:01.25*** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (1000@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)
23:01.36lcuki cant' its my n00
23:03.19*** join/#maemo nox- (noident@p5B107959.dip.t-dialin.net)
23:05.06lardmanhits the sack, night all
23:05.18nox-moin
23:09.38SpeedEvillcuk: how did that happen?
23:09.52SpeedEvillcuk: Oh - someone jammed it in your hole.
23:09.54SpeedEvilI forgot.
23:09.55lcukSpeedEvil, IDK put stylus back in after a couple of weeks
23:10.01keriothat's what she said
23:10.05*** join/#maemo evilrob (~rhaig@butters.hackboy.com)
23:10.15lcuklol
23:10.19SpeedEvilHave you considere nokia care?
23:10.30lcukSpeedEvil, I have only just discovered it
23:10.42lcukand never heard of it before
23:11.08evilrobIm not figuring out how to enable google traffic in mappero. there is a tile set for it, but how do i turn it on?
23:11.09lcukmy stylus hole has teeth.
23:11.32keriofeed it bacon
23:11.48lcukmy n900 runs on bacon already
23:12.06kerioomnomnom
23:12.13evilrobmmm bacon
23:12.17SpeedEvilOh
23:12.22lcukI replaced the BL-5J battery with BA-ON
23:12.27SpeedEvillcuk: Someone elsehitthesame problem
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23:13.00lcukhmm SpeedEvil link
23:13.05SpeedEvilno
23:13.15kerioba-on?
23:13.15evilrobmappero help?
23:13.20SpeedEvilLook at the logs about a week to four weeks ago.
23:13.23lcukevilrob, not sure :$
23:13.30lcukkerio, - == C
23:13.43evilrob:(
23:13.48keriohuh?
23:14.02keriowhat's a BA-ON
23:14.16lcukmmmm BA-ON
23:14.22keriolol
23:14.26*** join/#maemo mitsutaka (~mitsutaka@p1227-ipbf3907marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp)
23:14.57keriowe gotta make a bacon-cell battery
23:15.23evilrobthats the only app i really want but dont have.  i have more than i want otherwise
23:15.26*** join/#maemo FIQ|n900 (~user@2.70.80.178)
23:15.39kerioa bacon app?
23:15.40lcukevilrob, search help docs
23:16.01evilrobcant now. driving.
23:16.08lcukkerio, bacon-cells are nearly as awesome as alcohol powered fuel cells
23:16.10keriobut that would make the bacon-powered battery a perpetual motion machine
23:16.53lcuki do like the idea of the BA-ON battery
23:17.01SpeedEvilHoovering++
23:17.20SpeedEvilFound a few pogo-pins.
23:18.07*** join/#maemo merlincorey (~merlin@nginx/adept/merlincorey)
23:18.24lcukSpeedEvil, still curious about the stylus issue
23:19.39lcukjohnxI let someone else hold it to give me directions in the car, they took the stylus out, checked directions, jammed the stylus back in at an angle and now the stylus doesn't want to fit in
23:19.54lcukholy crap johnx, snap!
23:20.02lcukthanks for the tip SpeedEvil
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23:23.38*** join/#maemo FredrIQ|n900 (~user@2.69.3.106)
23:23.53*** join/#maemo FredrIQ|n900 (~user@unaffiliated/fiq)
23:24.29evilrobit appears mappero has no help, but a talk.maemo.org thread
23:24.40SpeedEvillcuk: It was someone that passed the n900 to someont to look at something, and they jammed trhe stylus in wrong
23:24.52SpeedEviloh
23:24.55SpeedEvilright
23:25.19lcukyes I found it
23:25.37SpeedEvilyeah. I sometimes fail at actually reading the words on the screen.
23:25.44pupniki love this omap3 portable with 4200mAh battery
23:25.50pupnikit just needs to get built
23:26.56lcukpupnik, I would like something with uptime calculated in months even with always on? :D
23:27.27lcukhow long do eink devices last?
23:28.01SpeedEvilWell - I have got a battery that will do about a month.
23:28.08SpeedEvilAnd it is portable - sort-of.
23:28.21ShadowJKshoulder strap?
23:28.21SpeedEvilCar battery.
23:28.32SpeedEvilsighs.
23:28.38ShadowJKbackpack then
23:28.52SpeedEvilI wish mechanical prototyping was easier.
23:29.04*** join/#maemo brendans (~user@199.7.158.34)
23:29.40SpeedEvilI want to make a little thing that is maybe the same size as the n900, you drop it on the floor, and then step on it 100 times to get enough charge to recharge the phone.
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23:33.22*** part/#maemo brendans (~user@199.7.158.34)
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23:36.04*** join/#maemo kthomas_vh (~kthomas@bzq-218-125-200.red.bezeqint.net)
23:36.33ShadowJKmy new sim-issue fix attempt: padding everywhere EXCEPT sim bay
23:36.58kthomas_vhheh
23:37.06kthomas_vhI'll try that :)
23:40.27*** join/#maemo smooph1 (~smooph@e180136252.adsl.alicedsl.de)
23:42.41ShadowJKactually im just padding one side of battery bay right now
23:42.51ShadowJKto elevate battery away from sim holder
23:45.44pupniklcuk: unfortunately the market is not aligned with my tastes in portables.  1000-1500mAh batteries with omap3 class SOCs are about 3x too small for me.  I want a real full-day and that means 3000+ mAh
23:46.37pupnikthere are a few guys who agree with my priorities in terms of power vs battery, and that's the openpandora guys
23:48.30ShadowJKis using 2400mAh battery with n900 and it's not enough for comfortably streaming music during a day at work
23:49.11jaskao.O? theres a larger battery for n900? where?
23:49.55ShadowJKmugen power
23:50.11jaskahmm, i wonder if i can get them in .fi somehow
23:50.32ShadowJKsure
23:50.39ShadowJKthey ship worldwide
23:51.01ShadowJKif you have a cc
23:51.02jaskai presume thatd require a credit card
23:51.10SpeedEvilI've been pondering making a backup pack.
23:51.39ShadowJKor paypal
23:52.07pupnikwhy not make a n901 with 1500mAh battery, n810 speakers and a 4-row keyboard...
23:52.21*** join/#maemo loufoque_ (~loufoque@188-222-130-75.zone13.bethere.co.uk)
23:52.31loufoque_what is the name of the N900 successor and where can I find info about it?
23:52.32lcukSpeedEvil, make a magazine that can take BJ-4L
23:52.39lcukBL-5J
23:52.40lcukeven
23:52.54ShadowJKThere is no info about a successor
23:52.55lcukthen you load that into n900
23:53.50ds3much rather have the old 800 style w/o the keyboard. just a handful of buttons
23:53.53DocScrutinizerpupnik: simple answer? Making hw is fsckng expensive
23:54.02luke-jr_ShadowJK: liar :P
23:54.17luke-jr_loufoque_: IIRC engadget had a teardown
23:54.21ShadowJKluke-jr, there are rumours and speculation, sure
23:54.22FIQ|n900i prefer having a keyboard than not having it
23:54.24lcukds3, everyone has their own
23:54.27lcukfavourite
23:54.48loufoque_lcuk: i thought they said it would be out very soon
23:54.52lcukI would rather just run same apps on all of them
23:54.52ShadowJKluke-jr, and didnt that turn out to be e7 or c6-01 or something?
23:54.53loufoque_nokia N9 i think it was called
23:55.14DocScrutinizerhttp://www.engadget.com/photos/nokias-qwerty-slidin-n9-shows-up-in-the-wilds-of-china/#3277333
23:55.28lcukds3, interested to see how well liqbase would run on iphone hardware for instance
23:55.44ds3lcuk:L yes
23:55.49ds3s/L //
23:55.52FIQ|n9004-row-keyb :D
23:55.57pupnikDocScrutinizer: thanks, good answer
23:55.58luke-jr_pfft 4
23:56.01lcukfor people like pupnik who like the pandora, I would like same things there
23:56.06luke-jr_I want at least 6
23:56.10ShadowJKjaska: http://shop.eten.hu/mugen-power-nokia-n900-2400mah-extended-replacement-battery-with-battery-door.html
23:56.16ds3keyboard is nice but buttons are more usable
23:56.29luke-jr_ds3: nonsense
23:56.39luke-jr_touchscreen can replace buttons easily
23:56.40FIQ|n9006 would be useful indeed if done right on such a small device
23:56.42ds3keep the 5Mpixel camera but put it back on that pop out thing
23:56.43lcukmy pocket loox had foot buttons like the n800
23:56.51DocScrutinizerpupnik: molds for a 3 parts case are ~100k$
23:56.54ds3luke-jr: screen is too small for that
23:56.57luke-jr_FIQ|n900: half the problem with N900 is that it's too effing small
23:57.06ds3I sorely miss teh D-pad
23:57.11FIQ|n900well
23:57.19FIQ|n900as long as it fits in the pocket
23:57.30luke-jr_FIQ|n900: C760 fit in my pocket
23:57.33FIQ|n900and has phone+linux functionalty
23:57.36luke-jr_and it was 2x the side of N810
23:57.37FIQ|n900i'm happy
23:57.46FIQ|n900uh
23:57.46jaskait probably wont fit in my old htc-p4350 belt case with that tho
23:57.52DocScrutinizerpupnik: then you need keyboard, PCB (which never is right on first 3 takes), FCC cert (another 100k) etc etc
23:57.54FIQ|n900that was a big pocket
23:57.55pupnikDocScrutinizer: look at all the 'silly looking' plastic around the n900 battery... do you think a bigger one would have been possible?
23:57.56lcukthe N8 would be cool to run on
23:58.02ds3luke-jr_: as in the Z?
23:58.03lcukas would the n97
23:58.18luke-jr_ds3: yes
23:58.29DocScrutinizerpupnik: nope, not significantly. Most of that silly looking plastic actually has a function
23:58.32luke-jr_N810 and N900 fit in my pocket and had room to spare for other stuff
23:58.43luke-jr_which is nice, but not as nice as a quality handheld
23:58.54ds3round up funding, let's build one :D
23:59.22ShadowJKremembers having N810, cellphone and gps receiver in one pocket
23:59.26*** join/#maemo Jucato (~jucato@kde/developer/jucato)
23:59.28jaskahmm, need to look into finding that 2400mAh bat in .fi tomorrow.. its 3 in the morning :D
23:59.37DocScrutinizerShadowJK: cargopants
23:59.40luke-jr_ds3: as I've said many a time, whoever makes a handheld fitting my needs gets my business (~$800)
23:59.53jaskabeing a large person with large pockets helps.. used to carry a 8.9" display laptop

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