IRC log for #maemo on 20100327

`00:00.02`	`corecode_`	`wuh?`
`00:00.05`	`corecode_`	`set/getcontext`
`00:00.12`	`luke-jr`	`http://gitorious.org/geneticchat`
`00:00.21`	`luke-jr`	`actually, nm`
`00:00.23`	`corecode_`	`since you also need to preserve the fp state etc`
`00:00.27`	`luke-jr`	`that's fork vs single-thread`
`00:00.56`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: i can't see which overheads would build up`
`00:01.05`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: for any reasonable workload`
`00:01.37`	`javispedro`	`exactly. 10000 is not a reasonable workload IMHO.`
`00:01.53`	`corecode_`	`well, let's say we have enough ram for the stacks`
`00:01.59`	`javispedro`	`probably would be i/o boun`
`00:02.22`	`corecode_`	`i don't know what the application at hand would be`
`00:02.26`	`javispedro`	`(each task, ie the only reason I can think for having 10000 threads is serving 10000 i/o requests)`
`00:02.27`	`corecode_`	`a web server?`
`00:02.54`	`corecode_`	`10000 chat client connections != 10000 ftp data connections`
`00:03.04`	`corecode_`	`etc.`
`00:03.30`	`corecode_`	`but event vs threat has been beaten to death`
`00:03.36`	`corecode_`	`and i'm on the event side as well`
`00:03.45`	`corecode_`	`although it makes programming more difficult`
`00:05.02`	`corecode_`	`now i still didn't find out how the suggested way of writing a daemon for maemo is`
`00:05.18`	`ptl`	`by 'event' you mean 'select()'?`
`00:05.23`	`corecode_`	`no`
`00:05.29`	`corecode_`	`generic term`
`00:05.38`	`corecode_`	`usually something superior`
`00:05.58`	`corecode_`	`like kqueue`
`00:06.05`	`corecode_`	`or the linux equivalent`
`00:06.07`	`ptl`	`ok`
`00:06.21`	`corecode_`	`select is the worst interface`
`00:06.32`	`javispedro`	`event queues, of which I'm a fan too`
`00:06.43`	`*** join/#maemo TheNewAndy (~andy@60-242-120-238.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`00:07.51`	`corecode_`	`daemon, anyone?`
`00:08.01`	`corecode_`	`how do you start them, how should they behave?`
`00:08.09`	`*** join/#maemo k-s (~gustavo@187.106.19.157)`
`00:08.09`	`*** join/#maemo k-s (~gustavo@enlightenment/developer/k-s)`
`00:10.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: xchat was updating 'meters' every second afaik`
`00:11.12`	`ShadowJK`	`DocScrutinizer, and checking dcc timeout`
`00:11.21`	`ShadowJK`	`even when no dccs active`
`00:11.35`	`*** join/#maemo angasule (~angasule@201.250.104.40)`
`00:11.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's realy genius`
`00:12.06`	`corecode_`	`heh`
`00:12.29`	`javispedro`	`well`
`00:12.37`	`javispedro`	`a few years ago who would have though you'd have things like no_hz`
`00:12.51`	`javispedro`	`from all the major platforms only palmos did something like that`
`00:12.52`	`corecode_`	`no`
`00:12.59`	`corecode_`	`right`
`00:13.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, as long as you got to wake up every second anyway, it's probably shorter code / less overhead to simply check, rather than to wind a timed alarm`
`00:13.07`	`corecode_`	`and it makes code much easier`
`00:13.09`	`corecode_`	`often`
`00:13.15`	`ptl`	`I didn't even know kqeue`
`00:13.18`	`ptl`	`*kqueue`
`00:13.24`	`corecode_`	`ptl: that's a freebsd thing`
`00:13.30`	`corecode_`	`don't know the linux equiv`
`00:13.40`	`ptl`	`yes but it seems that at least two linux libraries support it`
`00:13.43`	`javispedro`	`workqueue?`
`00:13.46`	`ptl`	`libev and libevent0`
`00:13.58`	`ptl`	`Alan Cox said you could use epoll instead of kqueue`
`00:14.14`	`corecode_`	`epoll`
`00:14.14`	`corecode_`	`yes`
`00:14.16`	`corecode_`	`that's it`
`00:14.31`	`javispedro`	`oops, workqueue is something entirely different`
`00:15.16`	`corecode_`	`so, nobody developing for maemo here?`
`00:15.23`	`corecode_`	`am i in the wrong channel?`
`00:15.23`	`ptl`	`not yet.`
`00:15.32`	`ptl`	`not yet --> me`
`00:15.39`	`ptl`	`but there is also #maemo-devel`
`00:15.43`	`corecode_`	`aha`
`00:15.45`	`ptl`	`anyway`
`00:16.15`	`ptl`	`I forced myself not to developer anything but simple shell scripts until I finish my master degree dissertation's fixes.`
`00:16.18`	`ptl`	`I am too lazy. :(`
`00:16.24`	`ptl`	`*not to develop anything`
`00:17.03`	`*** join/#maemo dougt (~dougt@nat/mozilla/x-phncumdwwiyzqfkt)`
`00:17.34`	`*** join/#maemo bearkitten (~vladi@cpe-75-80-173-106.san.res.rr.com)`
`00:17.47`	`corecode_`	`bleh`
`00:17.50`	`corecode_`	`doesn't work`
`00:17.56`	`corecode_`	`just means that you're doing less in total`
`00:18.00`	`corecode_`	`at least for me`
`00:18.39`	`*** join/#maemo _Elwood_ (~elwood@unaffiliated/-elwood-/x-7688307)`
`00:19.16`	`ptl`	`?`
`00:19.22`	`SpeedEvil`	`corecode_, pay him so he doesn't need to continue study!`
`00:19.33`	`SpeedEvil`	`or her`
`00:19.36`	`corecode_`	`if i stall life because i need to finish something`
`00:19.37`	`*** join/#maemo c-s-b-n900 (~C-S-B@92.29.72.108)`
`00:19.37`	`javispedro`	`a daemon? I'd first ask if you really, really, really need it`
`00:19.43`	`ptl`	`oh`
`00:19.43`	`javispedro`	`autospawned d-bus service maybe?`
`00:19.49`	`ptl`	`I am too compulsive, corecode_`
`00:19.56`	`ptl`	`I can't stop once I start programming anything...`
`00:20.02`	`ptl`	`been sick a few times recently because of that`
`00:20.02`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: i want to download a new backdrop every 5/10 minutes`
`00:20.08`	`corecode_`	`heh`
`00:20.14`	`javispedro`	`alarmd`
`00:20.28`	`corecode_`	`# alarmd - daemon process that keeps track of current alarms`
`00:20.30`	`corecode_`	`that one?`
`00:20.33`	`javispedro`	`yep`
`00:20.37`	`ptl`	`I've once lost the whole vacations days due to this obsessive behaviour.`
`00:20.48`	`*** join/#maemo lmoura (~lmoura@187.78.183.251)`
`00:20.49`	`corecode_`	`ah, so not just BEEP BEEP alarm?`
`00:20.52`	`javispedro`	`yep`
`00:20.53`	`corecode_`	`but also timers`
`00:21.03`	`corecode_`	`that wasn't clear from that description`
`00:21.05`	`javispedro`	`for example, the rss app uses it to refresh stuff every 15 min`
`00:21.14`	`ptl`	`I simply stood at home, programming.`
`00:21.17`	`corecode_`	`ptl: you mean you enjoyed hacking`
`00:21.30`	`ds3`	`what time base is the alarm system running off of?`
`00:21.33`	`corecode_`	`how can you call that losing vacation?`
`00:21.37`	`ptl`	`No, I mean I am kidnapped by it.`
`00:21.43`	`ptl`	`well`
`00:21.58`	`ptl`	`I did a good code, even upload to a brazilian site similar to sourceforge`
`00:22.17`	`ptl`	`a few months later, I went too busy and couldn't update the code or the site on which I used it`
`00:22.30`	`Lynoure`	`ptl: sounds like coding is not something you want to do for living?`
`00:22.39`	`ptl`	`and then a few further months and I decided to simply close the site.`
`00:22.46`	`corecode_`	`so?`
`00:22.57`	`corecode_`	`natural evolution of code`
`00:23.20`	`ptl`	`Lynoure: at that time that was what I did. Today, it's not, I am a support sysadmin at IBM. I earn the same money, but get less obsessed about stuff.`
`00:23.21`	`*** join/#maemo swo (~swo@p54AEDF96.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`00:23.37`	`ptl`	`I like programming once in a while, for fun.`
`00:23.39`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: keeping the process around might mean less power used`
`00:23.47`	`ptl`	`I do not make it an obligation anymore.`
`00:23.49`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: because python doesn't have to start all the time`
`00:24.00`	`Lynoure`	`ptl: the fine line between great motivation and unhealthy strain, I guess.`
`00:24.04`	`gouverneur`	`re`
`00:24.06`	`javispedro`	`ah, python...`
`00:24.16`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: yea, i won't code that in C`
`00:24.28`	`ptl`	`Lynoure: yeah, I think so...`
`00:25.18`	`corecode_`	`i think there is nothing wrong with hacking for 15 hours in a 24 hour window`
`00:25.34`	`*** join/#maemo swc\|666 (~infidel20@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821)`
`00:25.41`	`Lynoure`	`corecode_: depends on what else one would need to achieve in that 24h window.`
`00:25.55`	`corecode_`	`philosophically, nothing`
`00:26.03`	`corecode_`	`does that make me a nihilist?`
`00:26.16`	`Lynoure`	`Throw in 8h of job, and other responsibilities, and suddenly that amount of hours can become a problem.`
`00:26.32`	`Lynoure`	`corecode_: mostly just blessed, I think`
`00:26.55`	`corecode_`	`i used to do that as student`
`00:27.16`	`crashanddie`	`Lynoure: 8h of work, 15h of hacking, 1h of sleep. Sounds about right.`
`00:27.26`	`corecode_`	`what`
`00:27.29`	`corecode_`	`9 hours of sleep`
`00:27.57`	`crashanddie`	`statistically speaking, people who sleep 9h every night die younger than those who sleep 6h every night`
`00:27.59`	`corecode_`	`you must have wrong jobs`
`00:28.12`	`Lynoure`	`crashanddie: Short term, sure :) I'd add in eating and shower, but that's just me :)`
`00:28.13`	`corecode_`	`crashanddie: yea, i still challenge that study`
`00:28.13`	`crashanddie`	`I figure if I only sleep 1h per night, I'll live to be 200`
`00:28.14`	`*** join/#maemo firestorm (~5ea9acd2@gateway/web/freenode/x-ohxruqfqrwtlbfwe)`
`00:28.19`	`ptl`	`lol`
`00:28.37`	`firestorm`	`mms on the phone is there any 3rd party app for this.`
`00:28.44`	`corecode_`	`i think they did some wrong selection towards sick/sleeps long`
`00:29.15`	`ptl`	`firestorm: fMMS`
`00:29.25`	`ptl`	`firestorm: it's on extras-devel.`
`00:29.27`	`firestorm`	`ty.`
`00:29.41`	`ptl`	`yw`
`00:29.47`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: i can't find info on alarmd`
`00:30.08`	`crashanddie`	`corecode_: actually, a few months ago I was doing an average of 15-16h of work on a daily basis, weekends included ;)`
`00:30.13`	`javispedro`	`http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Generic_Platform_Components/Alarm_Framework`
`00:30.26`	`corecode_`	`crashanddie: for money or for fun?`
`00:30.35`	`crashanddie`	`both`
`00:30.41`	`corecode_`	`i was searching in the api docs :/`
`00:30.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`corecode_: believe me, you'll feel like that :-P`
`00:30.49`	`corecode_`	`crashanddie: that's the best`
`00:30.55`	`crashanddie`	`indeed it is`
`00:30.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`crashanddie: ^^^`
`00:31.34`	`crashanddie`	`DocScrutinizer: ?`
`00:31.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`crashanddie: you'll feel like 200, even while you're just 45`
`00:32.02`	`crashanddie`	`haha`
`00:32.17`	`*** join/#maemo eMHa (~mh@HSI-KBW-085-216-116-101.hsi.kabelbw.de)`
`00:32.34`	`firestorm`	`pti as in the app manager?`
`00:32.38`	`ptl`	`corecode_: there's also the API for libalarm, under here: http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/`
`00:32.48`	`ptl`	`firestorm: yes, you have to add the extras-devel repository`
`00:33.06`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: how do you even execute the application on startup?`
`00:33.12`	`firestorm`	`ah n this may sound dumb how lol`
`00:33.22`	`corecode_`	`ptl: yes, i had a look at that`
`00:33.55`	`javispedro`	`corecode_: alarmd is persistent`
`00:34.16`	`corecode_`	`ah, maybe that's not right then`
`00:34.28`	`corecode_`	`i need some sort of best effort every 5 minutes`
`00:34.30`	`corecode_`	`or 10`
`00:34.42`	`corecode_`	`but how do i ever start an application`
`00:35.41`	`javispedro`	`does it matter? you can set it up for a 5 minute repeating event without waking up the system`
`00:35.55`	`corecode_`	`ok`
`00:36.05`	`corecode_`	`still, i need to set it up`
`00:36.10`	`corecode_`	`that means i have to run it`
`00:36.18`	`corecode_`	`or some other application`
`00:36.31`	`corecode_`	`i mean obviously i could do that in xterm`
`00:36.44`	`javispedro`	`or at install time, or as part of a cpanel applet, ...`
`00:37.00`	`corecode_`	`ok`
`00:37.08`	`corecode_`	`now i just need to find out how to do that in python`
`00:37.08`	`javispedro`	`cause it should be configurable, so it'll have a gui.`
`00:37.10`	`corecode_`	`or shell`
`00:37.16`	`corecode_`	`actually no`
`00:37.27`	`corecode_`	`the picture i'm loading only appears every 10 minutes`
`00:37.28`	`corecode_`	`fixed`
`00:37.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`points at alarmed app`
`00:37.49`	`corecode_`	`DocScrutinizer: hum?`
`00:37.50`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's python ;-P`
`00:37.51`	`firestorm`	`ptl: how do i dot hat :p sorry for the dumb questions it's all new to me, or point me to some where`
`00:38.17`	`*** join/#maemo jhford (~jhford@johnford.info)`
`00:38.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`maemo's crond`
`00:38.34`	`ptl`	`firestorm: http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras`
`00:39.06`	`ptl`	`firestorm: see the bottom of the pages, extras-testing and extras-devel`
`00:39.09`	`firestorm`	`ty :)`
`00:39.11`	`firestorm`	`i see it :)`
`00:39.34`	`firestorm`	`basically a beta... then`
`00:39.38`	`ptl`	`yep`
`00:39.44`	`firestorm`	`i can't belive they make a epic phone but don't do mms :S`
`00:39.58`	`ptl`	`but there are lots and lots of applications. It's like a russian roulette: one of them will break your phone :P`
`00:40.18`	`firestorm`	`cool we liikw russians :p`
`00:40.19`	`SpeedEvil`	`none have broken mine so far`
`00:40.31`	`corecode_`	`i need a python-alam package?`
`00:40.32`	`corecode_`	`:/`
`00:40.34`	`firestorm`	`like even`
`00:40.53`	`firestorm`	`do you know if they plan to release a mms app for the phone in a later update as that is annoying`
`00:41.05`	`nthx`	`ptl: or fill rootfs till u have no space left :/`
`00:41.24`	`lcuk`	`mmm firestorm ?`
`00:41.25`	`ptl`	`firestorm: if you search for mms on talk.maemo.org you'll see lots and lots of discussion and whining about it.`
`00:41.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: phototranslate (or similar) seems to break flashlight`
`00:41.33`	`*** part/#maemo kalikianatoli (~kalikiana@xfce/goodies-developer/kalikiana)`
`00:41.43`	`ptl`	`firestorm: basically, they did it for technical and practical (i.e. priorities) reasons.`
`00:41.52`	`firestorm`	`yer seen it before but it's not good enough`
`00:41.53`	`ptl`	`I mean, they didn't do it.`
`00:41.54`	`corecode_`	`javispedro: can't be that everybody installing alarms has to write a C program?`
`00:41.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`even though it doesn't work on taking photos itself`
`00:42.07`	`firestorm`	`it's like take a dummy from a baby`
`00:42.10`	`ptl`	`nthx: yes, that's one of the things that can 'break' your phone`
`00:42.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, it looks somewhat 'commercial' ;-P`
`00:42.21`	`javispedro`	`corecode_: DocScrutinizer was telling you that alarmed, which is an alarmd gui frontend, is written in python...`
`00:42.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`probably I'm on his ignorelist XP`
`00:43.09`	`firestorm`	`lcuk: ?`
`00:43.15`	`corecode_`	`no`
`00:43.35`	`corecode_`	`i was more searching for a shell only solution`
`00:43.47`	`corecode_`	`since i only want to program one repetitive alarm`
`00:44.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`corecode_: somebody nagged the author to implement a cmdline interface ;-P`
`00:44.10`	`ptl`	`you mean you don't want 'cron-like' functionality, only 'at-like'.`
`00:44.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`to alarmed`
`00:44.22`	`ptl`	`at now +5m...`
`00:44.27`	`corecode_`	`ptl: cron is good enough`
`00:44.29`	`ptl`	`*5 minutes`
`00:44.39`	`corecode_`	`i just want to set it up`
`00:44.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`there's no cron on maemo`
`00:44.45`	`ptl`	`I know`
`00:44.51`	`ptl`	`that's why I said cron-like`
`00:44.54`	`corecode_`	`without having to write a c program to do so`
`00:45.39`	`lcuk`	`corecode_, setup an alarm or make a daemon autostart?`
`00:45.50`	`corecode_`	`either`
`00:45.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`corecode_: would you evetually consider to give a try to alarmed?`
`00:46.15`	`corecode_`	`DocScrutinizer: yes, my sdk doesn't seem to have these things yet`
`00:46.21`	`corecode_`	`the extras repos`
`00:46.57`	`*** join/#maemo Wild_Doogy (~ben@vtelinet-66-220-237-209.vermontel.net)`
`00:47.24`	`ptl`	`are you using python? or do you really need shell, corecode_?`
`00:47.33`	`ptl`	`because there are binding for python`
`00:47.33`	`ptl`	`python-alarm - Python bindings for libalarm library`
`00:47.40`	`corecode_`	`my program is python`
`00:48.40`	`ptl`	`so just use python-alarm, it's on extras... won't it work the way you want?`
`00:50.16`	`*** join/#maemo swc\|666 (~infidel20@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821)`
`00:50.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`corecode_: http://paste.debian.net/66069/`
`00:52.24`	`ptl`	`I don't think it's a good idea to set a dependence on a whole app like alarmed... it's better to use libalarm`
`00:52.25`	`firestorm`	`any one tried running a mail server on there phones being linux based?`
`00:52.50`	`ptl`	`also, there are two apps that do the same as alarmed, fcron and some other whose nome I forgot`
`00:54.07`	`ptl`	`firestorm: now THAT's something that would be difficult to handle. mail servers do not work well with dynamic IPs, also for the cellphone network, usually the IP's are under NAT`
`00:54.16`	`corecode_`	`so what if i'd simply like to run a daemon on boot? init.d or something else?`
`00:54.27`	`ptl`	`corecode_: event.d (upstart)`
`00:54.29`	`corecode_`	`firestorm: to receive or to send?`
`00:54.31`	`ptl`	`/etc/event.d`
`00:54.33`	`firestorm`	`i know pti, just thought someone would given it ago lol`
`00:54.40`	`firestorm`	`both :p`
`00:54.44`	`ptl`	`the same as ubuntu, but ubuntu used /etc/init directory instead of /etc/event.d`
`00:55.42`	`corecode_`	`i see i see`
`00:55.50`	`ptl`	`corecode_: there is the /etc/init.d directory but if you put the scripts there it doesn't work, i.e. they are not started automatically (/etc/rc2.d or whatever)`
`00:56.11`	`ptl`	`corecode_: there is some package with sysv-something, I didn't test it, maybe it enables sysv compatibility mode for upstart.`
`00:57.19`	`ptl`	`hmmm`
`00:57.38`	`ptl`	`no, it's sysvinit-utils and it's nothing to do with sysv init.`
`01:00.08`	`ptl`	`btw`
`01:00.51`	`ptl`	`DocScrutinizer: I installed alarmed on my N900, but when I go to it, it shows only the text, and the whole background (with probably with the boxes for entering data) in black.`
`01:01.04`	`ptl`	`DocScrutinizer: do you know anything about this?`
`01:01.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`never seen that`
`01:01.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`works like a charm here`
`01:01.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`both cmdline and gui`
`01:02.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ask Shapeshifter`
`01:02.50`	`ptl`	`ok`
`01:03.22`	`*** join/#maemo promulo (~romulo@189.71.32.4)`
`01:04.07`	`*** join/#maemo kkb110 (~kkb110@c-69-141-4-35.hsd1.de.comcast.net)`
`01:04.42`	`corecode_`	`wow why is this such an old python version :/`
`01:05.01`	`ptl`	`DocScrutinizer: http://patola.org/ss.png if you want to take a look though`
`01:05.25`	`ptl`	`tried with two themes already`
`01:06.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmm, theme would have been my only guess... sorry`
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`01:10.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`as I said, as Shapeshifter - he's the author`
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`01:12.04`	`ptl`	`Shapeshifter: are you here?`
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`01:13.33`	`ds3`	`are there binaries for SLiRP on any of the repos?`
`01:13.50`	`ds3`	`think I've had enough of fighting pnatd`
`01:14.46`	`pupnik`	`~gronmayer.it`
`01:14.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`fighting pnatd? sounds lke fun... until you learn about the missing features`
`01:15.37`	`ptl`	`[user@n900 user]% apt-cache search slirp`
`01:15.37`	`ptl`	`[user@n900 user]%`
`01:15.41`	`ptl`	`no luck`
`01:18.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: fyi - default theme here`
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`01:20.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`though I'd guess alarmed.py is using standard widgets which should be tested and working with all commonly used themes, no?`
`01:20.27`	`ds3`	`DocScrutinizer: pnatd doesn't dump debugging info and the other end is equally tightlipped`
`01:20.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yo`
`01:20.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lol`
`01:20.53`	`ds3`	`cross compiling slirp... I know the remote end is fine with a raw pppd so slirp 'should' just drop in and work`
`01:21.36`	`ptl`	`hmmm`
`01:21.40`	`ptl`	`it uses pyside. qt`
`01:21.56`	`ptl`	`I've seen on the changelog of PR1.2 something about QT not getting the theme colors right.`
`01:22.02`	`ptl`	`It might be this case.`
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`03:01.30`	`ptl`	`is there a chance of someone developing a program like this one (math program) for the N900? ---> http://www.spacetime.us/pocketpc/`
`03:01.51`	`ptl`	`...and don't tell me about recompiling xmaxima / macsyma...`
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`03:07.04`	`crashanddie`	`you need to recompile xmaxima / macsyma`
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`03:11.12`	`FlavioFerreiraBr`	`http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/How_to_get_accelerometer_data_of_N900_using_Qt`
`03:11.44`	`ptl`	`found something even better, crashanddie`
`03:11.46`	`ptl`	`kayali`
`03:11.47`	`ptl`	`it's qt`
`03:11.49`	`ptl`	`it's pythin`
`03:11.52`	`ptl`	`*python`
`03:12.05`	`ptl`	`this seems just the right app`
`03:12.22`	`ptl`	`it is very much like spacetime.`
`03:12.23`	`ptl`	`wow.`
`03:12.59`	`ptl`	`I mean`
`03:13.07`	`ptl`	`it uses maxima also`
`03:13.22`	`ptl`	`but it has a simplified interface`
`03:13.25`	`ptl`	`easy to port to mobile`
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`03:16.49`	`ptl`	`oh... it has been abandoned in 2007`
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`04:47.50`	`yigal`	`are there any other channels on irc for umpc/mids running linux?`
`04:47.51`	`*** join/#maemo Abhinav1 (~Abhinav1@unaffiliated/abhinav1)`
`04:48.21`	`yigal`	`other than #mer`
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`04:51.24`	`yigal`	`well I guess I'll join ##philosophy for the fun of it then, in the mean time that is`
`05:04.58`	`*** join/#maemo njsf_ (~n@sxemacs/devel/njsf)`
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`05:30.59`	`Andrewfblack`	`GAN900, Ping`
`05:31.15`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, pong.`
`05:31.37`	`*** part/#maemo yigal (~yigal@m3f0436d0.tmodns.net)`
`05:31.39`	`Andrewfblack`	`GAN900, just saw my minimalist theme wont be needed for meego`
`05:31.52`	`cehteh`	`mhm`
`05:32.08`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, I just got the Morning Industries version of that lock for Insteon integration, by the way.`
`05:32.19`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, just ignore him and do it anyway.`
`05:32.21`	`cehteh`	`is there somewhere a website showing screenshots of all available themes?`
`05:32.40`	`Andrewfblack`	`GAN900, got it tonight?`
`05:32.50`	`cehteh`	`imo its a bit unfortunate that theme are just mixed with all other stuff in HAM`
`05:33.32`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, like some random Intel guy has say`
`05:33.57`	`Andrewfblack`	`GAN900, If Meego doesn't want a minimalist theme that is fine with me less work for me to do, btw is Reggie not running forums over there, who was that guy btw?`
`05:33.58`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, day before yesterday`
`05:34.07`	`GAN900`	`Switching the whole house to Insteon`
`05:34.07`	`*** join/#maemo DocScrutinizer (~jr@openmoko/engineers/joerg)`
`05:34.10`	`GAN900`	`Amazing`
`05:34.12`	`*** join/#maemo avs (~avs@a88-113-5-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`05:34.37`	`*** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg)`
`05:34.37`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, Reggie's the one with say.`
`05:34.56`	`GAN900`	`One of the Intel infra people.`
`05:35.19`	`Andrewfblack`	`Havn't looked at Insteon yet is it zwave?`
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`05:51.15`	`GAN900`	`Andrewfblack, no, better`
`05:51.19`	`GAN900`	`Dual band`
`05:51.26`	`GAN900`	`RF and powerline`
`05:51.36`	`GAN900`	`More stuff available.`
`05:52.06`	`Andrewfblack`	`GAN900, I might take a look at it. I havn't taken the time to install my door lock yet.`
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`06:07.55`	`Andrewfblack`	`well bed time for me. Later`
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`06:28.22`	`Stskeeps`	`morning`
`06:29.34`	`RST38h`	`moorning Sts`
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`07:15.10`	`Khertan`	`Hello !`
`07:15.49`	`Khertan`	`I got a problem with ham ... can t uninstall MaStory ... required by PyGTKEditor`
`07:16.00`	`Khertan`	`there is no dep on it`
`07:16.24`	`Khertan`	`apt-get remove didn t have the same problem`
`07:18.31`	`crashanddie`	`Khertan: You are foutu.`
`07:18.38`	`*** join/#maemo Sargun (~Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun)`
`07:18.57`	`crashanddie`	`Khertan: There is no survie possible, give up all espoir of reussite.`
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`07:32.32`	`Khertan`	`crashanddie: i m not foutu ... but Hildon Application Manager is foutu`
`07:33.07`	`Stskeeps`	`can't wait till we switch to rpms`
`07:33.08`	`Stskeeps`	`:P`
`07:35.27`	`Khertan`	`lol ...`
`07:35.35`	`Khertan`	`will be worse`
`07:36.26`	`Stskeeps`	`as far as i can tell, hardly :P`
`07:36.33`	`Stskeeps`	`(i used debs before, now i kinda like rpms)`
`07:37.28`	`Khertan`	`how ? really ? as an user and a maintainer?`
`07:37.49`	`Stskeeps`	`both`
`07:38.10`	`Stskeeps`	`zypper helps insanity a lot`
`07:39.54`	`Khertan`	`look like a bit like apt-get for an usert`
`07:39.55`	`Khertan`	`look like a bit like apt-get for an user`
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`07:42.16`	`Khertan`	`ok the problem is clearly ham ... mix depandancy between package`
`07:42.48`	`Khertan`	`ok will use only apt in cmd line now`
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`07:51.43`	`ds3`	`wheeeee DUN finally working with a patched up slirp!`
`07:51.50`	`Stskeeps`	`woo`
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`08:19.51`	`thresh`	`moroning`
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`08:25.59`	`asj`	`evening thresh`
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`08:27.40`	`optimus_prime`	`my name is ninto antok`
`08:28.09`	`optimus_prime`	`i'm a student interested to participate in gsoc 2010`
`08:28.27`	`optimus_prime`	`is there anybody who can help me`
`08:28.51`	`Stskeeps`	`ask your questions :)`
`08:29.30`	`optimus_prime`	`i have an idea . where can i propose`
`08:29.34`	`optimus_prime`	`?`
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`08:33.26`	`user_`	`hi i cannot choose a differemt protocol than aim in pidgin are there alternatives so i can use msn on the n900?`
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`08:35.43`	`Stskeeps`	`install the pecan msn plugin`
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`08:38.48`	`optimus_prime`	`?`
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`08:40.57`	`Stskeeps`	`optimus_prime: wiki.maemo.org is a good start`
`08:42.17`	`optimus_prime`	`thank you. let me check out`
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`08:56.42`	`Shapeshifter`	`ptl: I am now ;)`
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`08:57.16`	`Shapeshifter`	`ptl: and for the next 14 or so hours, mostly`
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`09:02.36`	`noobmonk3y`	`hhmmmmmmmm`
`09:03.07`	`noobmonk3y`	`at some point yesterday i saw a screen in hildon with a report "bug button" - looked like a pre-setup solution for bug reporting from an app? or was i imagining things?`
`09:04.44`	`Stskeeps`	`hildon extras maybe?`
`09:05.55`	`noobmonk3y`	`thanks Stskeeps - yup! - HeAboutDialog`
`09:06.56`	`noobmonk3y`	`pity the wiki page doesnt actually explain how to use them though :P`
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`09:13.17`	`noobmonk3y`	`meh`
`09:16.25`	`noobmonk3y`	`all in c :(`
`09:18.50`	`Shapeshifter`	`Mh. Could someone help me with fixing a bug in my app? It's the frontend to alarmd. Some guy posted an excellent problem report here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=582996#post582996 Especially the lower part about syncevolution. The problem is: When someone wants to create a custom command for scheduling, it seems like I cannot just give it to libalarm in direct fashion, e.g.: 'action.command = echo "foo" >> /tmp/foo'. i ...`
`09:18.56`	`Shapeshifter`	`... tried this and it doesn't work, probably (my guess), because of the '>>'. So I thought, I'd wrap stuff in /bin/ash -c '<here>', but this seems to work randomly for people, and randomly not. :\| For example that dude in the post: If he puts his syncevolution command inside my GUI, it comes out like this in alarmd_queue.ini: "action0.exec_command: /bin/ash -c '/opt/syncevolution/sync.py --quiet goosync'" and it does NOT work. ...`
`09:19.02`	`Shapeshifter`	`... However, if he runs exactly this from the command line, it works.`
`09:19.59`	`Shapeshifter`	`I just don't get what alarmd expects the exec_command parameter to be. For some commands, it works just putting them there, for me, they work if put int /bin/ash -c '', for some it works if that is changed to /bin/ash without the "-c", and for some commands, it works without any prefix -.-`
`09:20.02`	`*** join/#maemo atiti (~user@0103ds1-vir.0.fullrate.dk)`
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`09:32.33`	`Shapeshifter`	`mh, the same dude found out that scripts shebanged with /bin/bash don't seem to work if bash is not installed. And I believed it was symlinked to ash >.>`
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`09:34.23`	`Kurppa_`	`<PROTECTED>`
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`09:41.33`	`lbt`	`ping X-Fade`
`09:46.50`	`noobmonk3y`	`~seen vdvsx`
`09:46.51`	`infobot`	`vdvsx <~Valerio@Maemo/community/council/VDVsx> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 2d 12h 16m 22s ago, saying: 'GeneralAntilles, ehehe, but everybody knows that you're a undercover Nokian :p'.`
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`10:06.05`	`Shapeshifter`	`tmo: "essential updates on 'realistic wish list': Firewall and Anti-Virus software (especially since maemo is open code?)." lmao.....`
`10:06.38`	`*** join/#maemo konttori (~konttori@Maemo/OS/konttori)`
`10:10.11`	`lcuk`	`mornin noobmonk3y \o konttori \o`
`10:10.56`	`lcuk`	`optimus_prime, it would be better to talk in here`
`10:11.13`	`optimus_prime`	`ya sure`
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`10:12.18`	`lcuk`	`so you want to take part in gsoc, whats your trouble`
`10:12.25`	`optimus_prime`	`so i've discussed certain issues with nobmonk3y but i need to know how can i make it into gsoc`
`10:12.42`	`*** join/#maemo Raveesh (~raveeshbh@122.177.195.87)`
`10:12.57`	`optimus_prime`	`i've an idea in mind how can i propose it`
`10:12.59`	`optimus_prime`	`?`
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`10:14.01`	`lcuk`	`well theres an ideas page for proposals on the gsoc wiki page, but talking about it here cant hurt either :)`
`10:14.23`	`lcuk`	`http://wiki.maemo.org/GSoC_2010`
`10:14.52`	`ccooke`	`Morning, all`
`10:15.06`	`*** join/#maemo jldugger (~jldugger@ubuntu/member/jldugger)`
`10:15.20`	`lcuk`	`mornin charles`
`10:15.48`	`Raveesh`	`Optimus Prime: visit the gsoc wiki page, and click on the "Edit" option next to the difficulty level you believe your project belongs to. A page would open showing you an editable region where you'd notice the current projects are present. Have a look at it's structure, and based on the symmetry post your proposal`
`10:17.03`	`optimus_prime`	`thanks friend i'm on it`
`10:17.22`	`optimus_prime`	`how can i find a mentor then?`
`10:17.42`	`*** join/#maemo Shashank (~link4shas@59.178.83.96)`
`10:18.24`	`lcuk`	`well since nobody knows of your project or its merits no mentors have been assigned yet (the projects havent been chosen either`
`10:18.26`	`Raveesh`	`That is something I'm not sure of myself. It's my first time at GSoC too. I believe the Maemo community people may search for one for you, or you can try to look around, see the current mentors, and search on this IRC as wel`
`10:20.33`	`optimus_prime`	`well that was helpful indeed`
`10:21.15`	`optimus_prime`	`i'm tryin to develop a multimedia application in mobiles`
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`10:22.43`	`saltsa_`	`anyone experienced with modest? Why it has the imap idle disabled even it lefts the tcp connection open?`
`10:27.15`	`gouverneur`	`Shapeshifter: had a laugh on that ++`
`10:27.34`	`gouverneur`	`morning btw`
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`10:29.47`	`Shapeshifter`	`moin moin`
`10:30.21`	`gouverneur`	`Shapeshifter: I am close to stop laughing on those people`
`10:30.47`	`gouverneur`	`Shapeshifter: wo bist du denn her`
`10:30.58`	`Shapeshifter`	`gouverneur: zÃ¼rich ^^`
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`10:31.27`	`gouverneur`	`ah da war ich eben erst, meine mutter und meine tante wohnen um zuri`
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`10:31.52`	`gouverneur`	`seedamm/dietikon`
`10:32.01`	`Shapeshifter`	`mhhhm`
`10:33.07`	`gouverneur`	`your name sounds familiar to me but more from rpg nwn as from knowing you`
`10:33.46`	`Shapeshifter`	`well I'm not related to any rpg.`
`10:34.12`	`Shapeshifter`	`also, my nick is not related to star trek, the dnb artist or werwolves.`
`10:34.45`	`gouverneur`	`is an elite cleric class, you might be a dragon though`
`10:35.18`	`Shapeshifter`	`ROAR`
`10:35.22`	`gouverneur`	`hehe`
`10:35.50`	`Arif_`	`throws the 7 dragon balls at Shapeshifter`
`10:36.43`	`Shapeshifter`	`Arif_: ouch, that hurts, stop throwing stuff at me ^^`
`10:36.48`	`gouverneur`	`I got an endlevel shapeshifter in nwn and sometime I would find it just useful in real life... a coward cleric running up at a crowded place and puff a 6m red dragon joins the fight`
`10:36.57`	`Shapeshifter`	`grabs a pencil and throws it in Arif_ general direction`
`10:37.09`	`Arif_`	`I didn't wish for a pencil!`
`10:37.09`	`Arif_`	`={`
`10:37.35`	`gouverneur`	`Arif_: you dont have to ask for it...`
`10:37.53`	`Arif_`	`the cartoon lied to me ;(`
`10:38.52`	`gouverneur`	`^^`
`10:41.16`	`Arif_`	`wishes for a white DSi XL in yourope`
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`10:59.40`	`optimus_prime`	`hey anybody there?`
`11:00.16`	`nidO`	`depends`
`11:00.30`	`hd1`	`optimus_prime: nope`
`11:00.47`	`optimus_prime`	`hehe`
`11:01.01`	`optimus_prime`	`wanna ask qstn`
`11:01.04`	`optimus_prime`	`?`
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`11:09.03`	`Shapeshifter`	`optimus_prime: on IRC, you're usually supposed to just ask, not ask to ask, and wait for an answer a reasonable amount of time.`
`11:09.25`	`hd1`	`optimus_prime: don't pm me, mate`
`11:09.26`	`optimus_prime`	`thanks`
`11:10.18`	`optimus_prime`	`what are the basic requirements for developing a video based application besides sdk`
`11:10.19`	`optimus_prime`	`?`
`11:10.42`	`Shapeshifter`	`optimus_prime: what do you mean by "video based"? like, playing videos?`
`11:10.59`	`optimus_prime`	`manipulaing it`
`11:11.05`	`Shapeshifter`	`I'd say knowing/learning gstreamer is a good start regarding maemo.`
`11:11.05`	`optimus_prime`	`like reversing`
`11:11.17`	`corecode_`	`seems that updating the wallpaper with gconf only works if you change the filename`
`11:11.22`	`optimus_prime`	`selecting frames etc`
`11:11.55`	`Shapeshifter`	`optimus_prime: gstreamer or ffmpeg`
`11:11.57`	`corecode_`	`which is silly`
`11:12.16`	`optimus_prime`	`thanks mate`
`11:12.43`	`corecode_`	`which is silly`
`11:12.54`	`Arif_`	`waits for coreplayer on Moomo 5...`
`11:12.57`	`hd1`	`blame canada, blame canada`
`11:13.06`	`hd1`	`loves south park`
`11:13.26`	`corecode_`	`anybody have an idea how i can force a reload of the wallpaper?`
`11:13.58`	`Arif_`	`hd1, you should read a book! :D`
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`11:16.43`	`hd1`	`Arif_: nah, I'd rather blame Canada :)`
`11:16.52`	`dan2003`	`how can i install packages without apt/dpkg re-downlaoding them? they are all already on my system under ${scratchnox}/var/cache/apt/archives/`
`11:16.54`	`Arif_`	`or write your own :(`
`11:16.56`	`hd1`	`or something equally silly`
`11:17.13`	`hd1`	`Arif_: write? I'm illeter8`
`11:17.25`	`Arif_`	`and on irc? :p`
`11:17.36`	`Arif_`	`dan2003, apt-get install /where/is/my.file?`
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`11:18.02`	`dan2003`	`Arif_: will that find dependancies in the same place?`
`11:18.10`	`Arif_`	`No idea ;D`
`11:18.34`	`Shapeshifter`	`dan2003: dpkg -i /path/to/file`
`11:18.50`	`hd1`	`depends on how the dpkg description file is configured`
`11:19.06`	`Arif_`	`should stop confusing commands..`
`11:19.06`	`Arif_`	`={`
`11:19.27`	`hd1`	`well, apt-get is just a wrapper around dpkg`
`11:19.30`	`Shapeshifter`	`apt is stupid anyway.`
`11:19.59`	`hd1`	`Shapeshifter: are you one of those "real men write their own bootloader" types?`
`11:20.13`	`dan2003`	`dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/libqt4-maemo5-* seems to have doen the trick`
`11:20.16`	`Shapeshifter`	`hd1: nope`
`11:20.26`	`Arif_`	`you can just poke the deb files with filemanager too`
`11:20.26`	`Arif_`	`;o`
`11:20.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mooo Shapeshifter`
`11:20.59`	`nidO`	`real men dont write their own bootloaders, they write the whole os on the fly.`
`11:21.19`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: moin`
`11:21.26`	`dan2003`	`in assembly`
`11:21.37`	`dan2003`	`bootstram from biological memeory`
`11:21.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: heard the sad story from ptl ?`
`11:21.44`	`Arif_`	`and the normal user will leech off them?`
`11:22.23`	`hd1`	`Arif_: if their task is ever completed, yes, that is what they hope anyway`
`11:22.28`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: no, what was it about?`
`11:22.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`notices a flashing yellow "!"`
`11:22.45`	`Arif_`	`opensource projects never get completed :p`
`11:22.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`http://patola.org/ss.png`
`11:23.00`	`Shapeshifter`	`I think he doesn't have hilighting enabled in his IRC client. he asked me twice while I was away and I replied but he didn't get the message apparently.`
`11:23.12`	`hd1`	`Arif_: gcc seems pretty complete to me`
`11:23.27`	`hd1`	`same with emacs`
`11:23.35`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: huh what on earth is that. the background of his text input field isn't white?`
`11:23.38`	`hd1`	`goes to bed`
`11:23.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`pr1.2?`
`11:24.36`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: pr1.2? well that looks like some broken Qt.`
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`11:25.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[2010-03-27 02:20:07] <DocScrutinizer> though I'd guess alarmed.py is using standard widgets which should be tested and working with all commonly used themes, no? [2010-03-27 02:21:40] <ptl> it uses pyside. qt [2010-03-27 02:21:56] <ptl> I've seen on the changelog of PR1.2 something about QT not getting the theme colors right`
`11:26.20`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: but why does he have pr1.2? is that an sdk shot?`
`11:26.28`	`Arif_`	`also got a yellow !`
`11:26.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: no idea`
`11:27.07`	`Arif_`	`oo`
`11:27.11`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: whatever it is, I doubt I can do something about it. it uses Qt, well pyside, yeah. But pyside gets a new and very fresh/different release soon to extras-devel anyway.`
`11:27.13`	`Arif_`	`picodrive and ukeyboard got updated`
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`11:27.30`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: they already have released Shiboken, but not made a .deb yet for pyside-shiboken.`
`11:27.58`	`dan2003`	`k, im devleoping qt4.6 in sdk (with pr1.2 update) can i install 4.6 onto device alongside 4.5 or not?`
`11:28.00`	`Shapeshifter`	`should come out in a few days. this way, alarmed will also lose the libboost dependencies and all that.`
`11:28.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~nuke libboost`
`11:28.36`	`infobot`	`ACTION prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at libboost ... Bâ¢â¢M!`
`11:28.47`	`dan2003`	`sorry, am developing an qt4.6 app , not qt itself`
`11:28.57`	`Kurppa_`	`I think it's either 4.5 or 4.6, not both.`
`11:29.21`	`dan2003`	`so we have to eait for pr1.2 device update b4 able to try on device ? :(`
`11:29.37`	`noobmonk3y`	`dan2003, yes :D (or in sdk)`
`11:29.39`	`dan2003`	`as it just seg faults if i try to launcg on device atm`
`11:29.47`	`dan2003`	`yeah wokrs on desktop`
`11:29.50`	`Arif_`	`hm`
`11:29.53`	`Arif_`	`I can't update ukeyboard`
`11:30.08`	`*** join/#maemo jsa- (~Macbook@dna23-252.tampere.customers.dnainternet.fi)`
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`11:30.28`	`Arif_`	`hildon-im-fkb (>=3.9.61-1) is missing`
`11:32.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`update of simple-brightness-applet fails due to missing libhildon1(>=2.2.10)`
`11:32.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`will refrain from updating anything for a few days`
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`11:33.31`	`BadRobot`	`hi there`
`11:33.38`	`Arif_`	`at least I know there's a Turkish virtual keyboard for pr1.2 now....=D`
`11:34.33`	`*** part/#maemo BadRobot (~BadRobot@a91-156-177-3.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
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`11:41.40`	`ech0dish`	`anyone know how many devices joikuspot can support? just curious..`
`11:43.20`	`*** join/#maemo ech0dish (~ech0@m310e36d0.tmodns.net)`
`11:43.46`	`*** part/#maemo ech0dish (~ech0@m310e36d0.tmodns.net)`
`11:43.51`	`RST38h`	`moos distractedly`
`11:43.55`	`*** join/#maemo ech0dish (~ech0@m310e36d0.tmodns.net)`
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`11:46.00`	`MohammadAG`	`ech0dish, as much as the Wifi spec allows? (ad-hoc)`
`11:46.58`	`noobmonk3y`	`lol`
`11:47.01`	`noobmonk3y`	`w0000ps`
`11:48.17`	`ech0dish`	`i dont understand why joikuspot doesn't support WPA`
`11:48.37`	`ech0dish`	`it only has WEP... wtf thats just cheep`
`11:49.28`	`Arif_`	`it wants to support the Nintendo DS :P`
`11:49.28`	`cos^`	`WPA would be probably much more difficult to implement and possibly more heavy on cpu?`
`11:50.38`	`ech0dish`	`might as well make the password letmein if your going to use WEP...`
`11:51.48`	`Arif_`	`the N900 probably has a range of 10cm anyway`
`11:52.08`	`ech0dish`	`has a good range`
`11:52.21`	`ech0dish`	`i can go far, thats not issue`
`11:52.42`	`noobmonk3y`	`how far is far? interested as i will be using it next wee k:D`
`11:52.55`	`ech0dish`	`seems just as good as my d-link wireless g router`
`11:53.03`	`ech0dish`	`i can use it anywhere in my apartment`
`11:53.07`	`noobmonk3y`	`yay!`
`11:53.15`	`Arif_`	`is too cheap to buy joiku ={`
`11:53.20`	`noobmonk3y`	`lol`
`11:53.24`	`ech0dish`	`tested in the bathroom`
`11:53.39`	`Arif_`	`you need internet in the bathroom?`
`11:53.53`	`ech0dish`	`yeah with the n900 in the kitchen`
`11:53.59`	`ech0dish`	`plugged in chargin on the counter`
`11:54.01`	`noobmonk3y`	`wohooooooooooooooooooooooooo!`
`11:54.02`	`ech0dish`	`worked great`
`11:54.14`	`ech0dish`	`streamed perfect youtube vids`
`11:54.15`	`noobmonk3y`	`healthcheck update stacked windows work!!! (extras-devel)`
`11:54.19`	`Arif_`	`thats better than I expected!`
`11:54.42`	`Arif_`	`noobmonk3y, yay! now you need to get people to use it!`
`11:54.51`	`noobmonk3y`	`hehe 18,000+ downloads :\|`
`11:54.56`	`ech0dish`	`i have it`
`11:55.11`	`ech0dish`	`used it to test the front cam`
`11:55.16`	`noobmonk3y`	`cool :D :D`
`11:55.18`	`Arif_`	`that's pretty impressive for a platform that has 7 users :P`
`11:55.24`	`noobmonk3y`	`will be updating that to front video soon too`
`11:55.29`	`noobmonk3y`	`Arif_, lol!`
`11:55.42`	`ech0dish`	`arif, can i pm u?`
`11:55.46`	`noobmonk3y`	`8) - Louis walsh has one lol`
`11:55.55`	`*** join/#maemo LuciusMare (~LuciusMar@gprs7.vodafone.cz)`
`11:56.06`	`Arif_`	`no need to ask...`
`11:56.11`	`LuciusMare`	`Hi, how much space will the easy debian take?`
`11:56.20`	`LuciusMare`	`hi Arif`
`11:56.22`	`noobmonk3y`	`~wink at Arif_`
`11:56.26`	`noobmonk3y`	`meh`
`11:56.30`	`*** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@dhcp-128-194-74-49.resnet.tamu.edu)`
`11:56.32`	`noobmonk3y`	`infobot doesnt love me no more`
`11:57.00`	`noobmonk3y`	`ech0dish, is there anything else you would like to see in healthcheck? :D - other then better graphics lol`
`11:57.11`	`noobmonk3y`	`ooo btw - thinking of doing a 3d test in it :D`
`11:57.52`	`nidO`	`has healthcheck got a proper vibrate test yet>? :D`
`11:57.56`	`Arif_`	`LuciusMare, itll take about and exactly 2GB`
`11:57.57`	`noobmonk3y`	`yup :D`
`11:58.10`	`noobmonk3y`	`nidO, lets you select form some of the built in patterns`
`11:58.21`	`noobmonk3y`	`from*`
`11:58.35`	`nidO`	`nice`
`11:58.37`	`noobmonk3y`	`well the devel version does`
`11:58.45`	`noobmonk3y`	`got sound tests, led patterns too`
`11:58.49`	`Arif_`	`(File info for) H:\debian-m5-v3b.img.ext2 (Size) 2.00GB (Created) Wednesday, 24.03.2010 17:24:43 (Modified) Thursday, 25.02.2010 18:43:08 (Attributes) A`
`11:58.50`	`nidO`	`okay, heres an ideas`
`11:58.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`[2010-03-27 12:50:37] <ech0dish> might as well make the password letmein if your going to use WEP... --- ech0dish, ad-hoc is basically just "letmein"`
`11:58.58`	`noobmonk3y`	`and now just added the ascreen accuracy & keyboard test + dead pixel test :D`
`11:59.11`	`nidO`	`maybe have healthcheck do a backup check, and warn you if you have no backup / a backup over say a month old`
`11:59.19`	`noobmonk3y`	`oooo`
`11:59.24`	`noobmonk3y`	`thats a clever idea :D`
`11:59.33`	`noobmonk3y`	`assuming backups are all of the same file tpye?`
`11:59.34`	`*** join/#maemo guardian_ (~guardian@ANantes-252-1-40-218.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`11:59.37`	`noobmonk3y`	`type?`
`12:00.05`	`*** join/#maemo sepultina (~quassel@zux221-069-081.adsl.green.ch)`
`12:00.05`	`nidO`	`good question, checking`
`12:00.06`	`noobmonk3y`	`:D`
`12:00.11`	`noobmonk3y`	`brb's - shower`
`12:01.28`	`*** join/#maemo jwittema (~jwittema@5ED2890C.cable.ziggo.nl)`
`12:01.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`noobmonk3y should include a healthcheck for the battery cell :-P`
`12:02.21`	`*** join/#maemo Pavlov (~pavlov@shell.off.net)`
`12:03.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`also wonders if healthcheck has a notion about the number of bad blocks on NAND`
`12:05.35`	`nidO`	`okay backup files have no extension, but you cant specify a folder for them so the backups will always be in /home/user/MyDocs/backups or in /backups on the sd card`
`12:06.23`	`*** join/#maemo davyg (~davyg@2a01:e35:243c:9250:223:54ff:fe69:226e)`
`12:06.42`	`nidO`	`also rather bizzarely... I cant access sshd on my device while it's charging, anyone seen that? :<`
`12:07.39`	`noobmonk3y`	`DocScrutinizer, can you explain that a bit more? - mha etc?`
`12:07.52`	`noobmonk3y`	`ahaaaaa cheers nidO`
`12:10.02`	`*** join/#maemo bilboed (~bilboed@89.129.129.4)`
`12:11.11`	`*** join/#maemo Dialekt (~Dialekt@cpe-75-85-113-244.socal.res.rr.com)`
`12:13.12`	`*** join/#maemo andrei1089 (~andrei108@81.18.92.10)`
`12:13.33`	`*** join/#maemo jsa- (~Macbook@dna23-252.tampere.customers.dnainternet.fi)`
`12:15.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`points to backup.metadata`
`12:16.04`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`12:16.08`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`12:16.35`	`*** join/#maemo Dialekt (~Dialekt@cpe-75-85-113-244.socal.res.rr.com)`
`12:16.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nidO: I'm doing this (access ssh while charging) all the time. No problems`
`12:17.14`	`*** join/#maemo tuxer (~mikko@a91-153-133-115.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`12:18.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`noobmonk3y: nidO: MyDocs/backups/<backupname>/(*.zip\|backup.metadata)`
`12:19.01`	`Shapeshifter`	`nidO: you sure you're not just trying the wron IP or something?`
`12:22.31`	`*** join/#maemo leandroal (~leandro@187.65.24.234)`
`12:24.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`noobmonk3y: I was halfway kidding. It's not simple task to check cell health. You could try to readout bq27200 values (see http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/battery/bq27k-detail for a few details on bq27xxx chip). You could check voltage drop during enabling a strong consumer (e.g. vibrator, gprs tx, toggle backlight on/off)...`
`12:25.52`	`noobmonk3y`	`hmmmm not a bad idea though`
`12:25.56`	`noobmonk3y`	`something i could work on :D`
`12:27.03`	`*** join/#maemo tonikitoo (~tonikitoo@201-75-11-233-ma.cpe.vivax.com.br)`
`12:27.21`	`SpeedEvil`	`impedence spectrometry`
`12:27.35`	`SpeedEvil`	`backlight is a good candidate`
`12:27.53`	`*** join/#maemo jhford (~jhford@johnford.info)`
`12:28.32`	`SpeedEvil`	`apply a superposed pwm sequence of 0.01,1,10hz`
`12:29.01`	`SpeedEvil`	`synchronus demod of battery response`
`12:29.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: that's what I thought, yes`
`12:29.41`	`dan2003`	`anybody here use mpd?`
`12:30.12`	`dan2003`	`(im making a clinet for n900) seen an exsiting onw, (cuteMPD) but inmy opinion its to "fiddly", makin gone with nice big easy to use buttons,`
`12:31.30`	`*** join/#maemo FIQ (~FIQ@unaffiliated/fiq)`
`12:32.09`	`SpeedEvil`	`mpd?`
`12:33.08`	`noobmonk3y`	`mobilephonesdirect in my book lol`
`12:34.18`	`noobmonk3y`	`is off, c'yall laters`
`12:34.40`	`Arif_`	`wants a DVBService client :P`
`12:34.54`	`FIQ`	`will PR1.2 break compatibility with older maemo versions?`
`12:35.24`	`*** join/#maemo lizardo (~lizardo@189.2.128.130)`
`12:35.54`	`Arif_`	`ukeyboard is already broken`
`12:35.57`	`*** join/#maemo wazd (~wazd@188.123.241.73)`
`12:36.45`	`FIQ`	`ukeyboard doesn't work yea`
`12:36.54`	`FIQ`	`but.. what's the problem?`
`12:37.19`	`FIQ`	`breaking compatibilities when the only new thing is some bug fixes and package updates...`
`12:37.23`	`FIQ`	`seems odd to me`
`12:37.26`	`*** join/#maemo spliffy_ (~spliffy@p4FE93986.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`12:37.45`	`Arif_`	`you can't install the new version on PR1.1.1`
`12:37.49`	`Arif_`	`=}`
`12:37.56`	`FIQ`	`i know`
`12:38.01`	`Arif_`	`which is understandable`
`12:38.07`	`Arif_`	`as PR1.2 has a new virtual keyboard layout`
`12:38.17`	`FIQ`	`ah`
`12:38.17`	`FIQ`	`hm`
`12:38.50`	`FIQ`	`but that's not what i mean, i mean, why will the update make the old packages unusable?`
`12:38.51`	`Arif_`	`lets all boycot PR1.2 if apps don't work`
`12:38.51`	`Arif_`	`:P`
`12:39.05`	`FIQ`	`or have i done some major mis-understand? :d`
`12:39.18`	`FIQ`	`good point`
`12:39.20`	`Arif_`	`I guess older apps will work...`
`12:39.30`	`Arif_`	`go install the sdk and try :P`
`12:39.46`	`FIQ`	`yay, the packagelistupdate is done`
`12:40.04`	`FIQ`	`took only 5 minutes!`
`12:40.13`	`Arif_`	`yay!`
`12:45.32`	`*** join/#maemo dl9pf_ (~dl9pf@p5B21472B.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`12:50.46`	`FIQ`	`hm`
`12:51.05`	`FIQ`	`you know, the alt+f2 thing at linux desktop`
`12:51.24`	`FIQ`	`is that feature in hildon?`
`12:51.50`	`Arif_`	`what does that do?`
`12:52.17`	`FIQ`	`a text field on the screen`
`12:52.26`	`FIQ`	`type an application name will launch it`
`12:52.43`	`Arif_`	`apparently that feature will be in the menu`
`12:52.47`	`Arif_`	`in pr1.2`
`12:53.10`	`FIQ`	`some of them also makes it possible to run bash commands, but that's not required for me`
`12:53.10`	`FIQ`	`ah, nice`
`12:53.31`	`Arif_`	`and fÄ±nally a way to rearrange Ä±cons!`
`12:53.42`	`Arif_`	`alphabeticallly=stupid :D`
`12:54.39`	`*** join/#maemo adisbladis (~user@92.244.27.51)`
`12:55.24`	`*** join/#maemo somecodehere (~ingvar@16.198.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee)`
`12:55.56`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@62.219.120.20)`
`12:58.06`	`corecode_`	`any ideas how to update the wallpaper when the filename stays the same`
`12:58.11`	`corecode_`	`but the content changes?`
`12:59.55`	`*** join/#maemo tbf (~mathias@86.56.57.78)`
`13:04.00`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@62.219.120.20)`
`13:04.36`	`dan2003`	`mpd = ,usic player daemon`
`13:04.51`	`dan2003`	`s\,usic\mysic`
`13:04.54`	`dan2003`	`grr`
`13:05.16`	`dan2003`	`sticks finger in over to defrost`
`13:05.59`	`*** join/#maemo Wizzup (~puzziw@ip54507690.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl)`
`13:09.31`	`Arif_`	`xD`
`13:09.41`	`*** join/#maemo atiti_ (~user@0x5ebd10c0.terminal.tdcmobil.dk)`
`13:13.35`	`*** join/#maemo ankur (~ankurlnmi@210.212.97.196)`
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`13:23.10`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`13:23.40`	`*** join/#maemo jatt (~jatt@89.204.153.66)`
`13:24.04`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@p11811112.orange.net.il)`
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`13:25.29`	`*** join/#maemo Shashank (~link4shas@59.178.211.4)`
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`13:26.11`	`jatt`	`do you use pidgin? i cannot select a protocol different than aim`
`13:26.23`	`*** join/#maemo twillber (~twillber@redhat/twillber)`
`13:26.26`	`Unksi`	`jatt: msn works fine here`
`13:26.53`	`jatt`	`8`
`13:26.59`	`jatt`	`i see`
`13:28.23`	`jatt`	`i installed pidgin but for some reason the drop down with the protocols is not working properly`
`13:30.03`	`MohammadAG`	`did you restart the device?`
`13:31.02`	`*** join/#maemo hannesw__ (~hannes@80-121-104-184.adsl.highway.telekom.at)`
`13:31.05`	`jatt`	`yes several times i tries with the stylus too but the drop down closes immediately`
`13:31.42`	`jatt`	`so no chance to select msn from the list`
`13:32.08`	`*** join/#maemo andre__ (~andre@Maemo/community/bugmaster/andre)`
`13:32.16`	`Unksi`	`jatt: dont stop pressing before you have chosen the entry you want`
`13:32.16`	`dan2003`	`watchout with msn! its a discustingly bloated protocl, if yr on mobile data plan it could cost u a fortune`
`13:32.19`	`*** join/#maemo ech0dish (~ech0@c-76-31-129-15.hsd1.tx.comcast.net)`
`13:32.38`	`ech0dish`	`is there something special i have to do to access the ovi store?`
`13:33.27`	`jatt`	`i am using a flat rate and my gf only uses msn :)`
`13:33.31`	`ech0dish`	`tells me to upgrade to maemo5 but i already have`
`13:33.47`	`*** join/#maemo mlpug (~mlpug@a88-115-164-40.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`13:33.53`	`Stskeeps`	`pr1.1.1 i think`
`13:34.25`	`haltdef`	`n900 arriving monday :(`
`13:34.40`	`haltdef`	`working today so won't care but tomorrow will be torture`
`13:34.41`	`SpeedEvil`	`:(?`
`13:34.44`	`SpeedEvil`	`ah`
`13:35.15`	`SpeedEvil`	`is apperecoatong his n900 more since laptop broke.`
`13:35.23`	`SpeedEvil`	`up to 30wpm now.`
`13:35.27`	`ech0dish`	`grr i don't get this.. why does it think i don't have maemo5?`
`13:35.31`	`*** join/#maemo andrewgodwin (~andrew@hydrae.aeracode.org)`
`13:35.37`	`jatt`	`any alternatives to pidgin for msn?`
`13:35.47`	`Stskeeps`	`use msn-pecan..`
`13:35.47`	`Stskeeps`	`:P`
`13:35.49`	`andrewgodwin`	`does anyone know if the source code for the maemo.org voting system is available?`
`13:35.58`	`*** join/#maemo dl9pf (~dl9pf@p5B21472B.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`13:35.58`	`*** join/#maemo dl9pf (~dl9pf@opensuse/member/dl9pf)`
`13:36.00`	`haltdef`	`pecan eh, all I knew of was amsn, pidgin and haze`
`13:36.02`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG_ (~MohammadA@p11811112.orange.net.il)`
`13:36.18`	`*** join/#maemo netvandal (~michele@host-84-223-96-149.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`13:37.07`	`jatt`	`is it in the official repos? will check`
`13:37.16`	`Stskeeps`	`jatt: it's somewhere, but it integrates`
`13:38.30`	`dan2003`	`when i was travelling in oz, used mobile phone for internet, was using msn to start with, but just be online used roughly a meg/hr, my contract n990 pay (uk vodafone) is "unlimited internet" which actually means 500 meg limit!!, so if i was online with msn for 10 hrs a day it would use most of that - and thats without even saying anything`
`13:38.48`	`jatt`	`the other alternative for me would be emacs+bitlbee but I haven't have the guts to install emacs :)`
`13:39.54`	`jatt`	`wow 1mb/hour while idle?`
`13:39.58`	`MohammadAG`	`I can ssh over adhoc, nice!`
`13:41.19`	`dan2003`	`jatt: yeah, and if yr one of these that has about 300 "freinds" on yr msn account, itll be more , i had about 15`
`13:42.12`	`jatt`	`i wanted to test skype but I'm also on a 200mb limit and I guess a skype call would reach that limit easily`
`13:45.10`	`ech0dish`	`is there a way to check the firmware version`
`13:47.40`	`*** join/#maemo Shashank (~link4shas@59.178.216.76)`
`13:47.59`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B-N900 (~C-S-B@82.132.248.133)`
`13:52.09`	`*** join/#maemo adalal (~aritra@cpc4-clif8-2-0-cust778.know.cable.virginmedia.com)`
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`14:02.39`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`14:02.43`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`14:03.38`	`*** join/#maemo yashi (~yashi@dns1.atmark-techno.com)`
`14:05.50`	`*** join/#maemo LuciusMare (~5c2b1a23@gateway/web/freenode/x-loitodwcunnuhxkg)`
`14:06.03`	`LuciusMare`	`Hi, no lisp for fremantle?`
`14:07.29`	`*** join/#maemo olivluca (~quassel@236.pool85-52-13.dynamic.orange.es)`
`14:07.31`	`dan2003`	`no, we all use fortran here ;)`
`14:07.51`	`*** join/#maemo oly (~sysadmin@94-194-177-179.zone8.bethere.co.uk)`
`14:07.57`	`LuciusMare`	`:)`
`14:07.57`	`aquatix`	`dan2003: I don't`
`14:08.00`	`aquatix`	`Ada ftw`
`14:08.08`	`LuciusMare`	`seriously :)`
`14:08.40`	`dan2003`	`http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=42339`
`14:09.30`	`LuciusMare`	`great!`
`14:09.37`	`LuciusMare`	`kisses dan2003`
`14:09.49`	`*** join/#maemo hcarrega (~hcarrega@a85-139-128-194.cpe.netcabo.pt)`
`14:10.43`	`oly`	`hi, is there a map app that can download maps for offline navigation ?`
`14:10.57`	`oly`	`ideally using openstreetmaps`
`14:11.08`	`Stskeeps`	`Maep can, but navigation is a wide term`
`14:11.24`	`nidO`	`sorry was afk a while - DocScrutinizer + Shapeshifter - i'm fairly sure i've ssh'd to it plenty while charging before as well, but its just not playing now - while charging I get timeouts, unplug it and retry the connection, goes through immediately`
`14:11.29`	`oly`	`well to find how to get where you want :)`
`14:11.50`	`oly`	`i have osm2go but thats more for mapping out small areas from what i can tell`
`14:11.54`	`oly`	`i will try meap`
`14:12.25`	`oly`	`going on holiday soon, and want some maps of the area that i can use with out a net connection`
`14:12.32`	`*** join/#maemo hoxtonhopper (~trevor@i-195-137-40-20.freedom2surf.net)`
`14:16.34`	`*** join/#maemo stevenhong (~user@117.136.12.67)`
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`14:16.57`	`oly`	`how does maep work for offline ?`
`14:17.03`	`*** part/#maemo stevenhong (~user@117.136.12.67)`
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`14:17.15`	`oly`	`do i just need to view the area and then its available offline ?`
`14:17.31`	`oly`	`can not see an option to download in the app`
`14:19.07`	`Stskeeps`	`right`
`14:19.47`	`*** part/#maemo twillber (~twillber@redhat/twillber)`
`14:20.40`	`*** join/#maemo VDVsx (~Valerio@Maemo/community/council/VDVsx)`
`14:20.48`	`*** join/#maemo VDVsx_ (~Valerio@92.250.90.231)`
`14:20.59`	`*** join/#maemo netvandal (~michele@host-84-223-96-149.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
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`14:24.40`	`*** join/#maemo smaug___ (~chatzilla@cs181150024.pp.htv.fi)`
`14:26.16`	`Chiku\|dc`	`will PR1.2 the last one? then it well be meego?`
`14:26.24`	`Chiku\|dc`	`will*`
`14:26.50`	`*** join/#maemo choppa (~chigge@pD95F0FC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`14:29.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`probably the name will change, yes`
`14:29.52`	`Stskeeps`	`who knows`
`14:30.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`what's inside is another question`
`14:30.36`	`Stskeeps`	`and i doubt they'll call maemo5 meego`
`14:31.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`meego-0.5 maemo edition ? ;-P`
`14:31.23`	*** join/#maemo `0660 (~olli@ppp121-45-213-107.lns20.cbr1.internode.on.net)
`14:31.33`	`*** join/#maemo dmj726_n900 (~user@m560e36d0.tmodns.net)`
`14:31.42`	`VDVsx`	`there's a pr1.3 (nokian said so at TMO)`
`14:31.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`prolly more like meego-0.6`
`14:32.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`aah, then meego-0.5.1.3 maemo edition XP`
`14:35.48`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B (~csb@89.243.36.36)`
`14:35.49`	`*** join/#maemo RST38h (marat@trantor.komkon.org)`
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`14:37.00`	`MohammadAG`	`VDVsx, does a package with broken dependencies get deleted? I uploaded a package into extras-devel and set it to a wrong dependency (fixed it in 0.2-1)`
`14:37.17`	`*** join/#maemo netvandal (~michele@host-84-223-96-149.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`14:37.44`	`VDVsx`	`MohammadAG, not, afaik`
`14:37.55`	`VDVsx`	`only if you upload a couple of new versions`
`14:37.57`	`Stskeeps`	`installs sygic and likes it`
`14:38.41`	`VDVsx`	`has free ovi maps and likes it :P`
`14:39.06`	`MohammadAG`	`VDVsx, already uploaded a couple :P`
`14:39.07`	`Stskeeps`	`doesn't particularly like ovi maps`
`14:39.07`	`*** part/#maemo olivluca (~quassel@236.pool85-52-13.dynamic.orange.es)`
`14:39.08`	`Stskeeps`	`:P`
`14:39.17`	`Stskeeps`	`(also, we're going to use this in our car with voice navigation)`
`14:39.31`	`MohammadAG`	`dislikes the fact that only Google Maps has maps for Israel`
`14:40.08`	`VDVsx`	`Stskeeps, I'm talking about the real deal, not the n900 version, works pretty well with voice navigation :)`
`14:40.42`	`VDVsx`	`MohammadAG, so don't worry if you have a new version`
`14:40.50`	`Stskeeps`	`VDVsx: ah, yes`
`14:42.36`	`MohammadAG`	`VDVsx, kk, didn't want to waste ~300 kb from your repos :)`
`14:43.49`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`14:43.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`considers to finaly try and sync N900 to Kontact`
`14:43.55`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`14:44.15`	`VDVsx`	`MohammadAG, the removes of old stuff happen, not sure about the periodicity, you have to ask X-Fade about that :)`
`14:45.00`	`MohammadAG`	`VDVsx, I thought you managed packages`
`14:45.22`	`VDVsx`	`MohammadAG, nah, I don't manage anything :p`
`14:45.24`	`*** join/#maemo choppa_ (~chigge@pD95F0FC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`14:45.43`	`VDVsx`	`MohammadAG, X-Fade from the maemo.org team does that`
`14:46.02`	`VDVsx`	`I only give orders sometimes :p`
`14:46.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lol`
`14:46.20`	`VDVsx`	`based in the community requests of course ;)`
`14:46.58`	`MohammadAG`	`lol`
`14:47.26`	`VDVsx`	`but that is also about to end`
`14:47.39`	`VDVsx`	`my term in the council ends next week`
`14:48.17`	`MohammadAG`	`you weren't nominated for next year?`
`14:48.37`	`DocScrutinizer`	`anybody a better pointer off top of his head, than just 'google: maemo kontact sync' ?`
`14:48.52`	`VDVsx`	`I was, but didn't accepted :D`
`14:49.50`	`*** join/#maemo povbot (~supybot@office.pov.lt)`
`14:50.05`	`GAN900`	`VDVsx has had ne`
`14:50.13`	`GAN900`	`enough of the whipping boy post. :P`
`14:51.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heh, wasn't it as pleasant as expected?`
`14:51.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wrong whip I assume :-P`
`14:51.56`	`*** join/#maemo spectre- (~n900@41.210.191.6)`
`14:52.01`	`VDVsx`	`crosses GAN900 from his voting list`
`14:53.06`	`VDVsx`	`damn, already voted :(`
`14:53.54`	`lcuk`	`o_O`
`14:54.01`	`lcuk`	`has big multitouch pc`
`14:54.08`	*** join/#maemo `0660 (~olli@ppp121-45-220-75.lns20.cbr1.internode.on.net)
`14:54.10`	`aquatix`	`lcuk: ?`
`14:54.38`	`lcuk`	`i just bought a new computer`
`14:54.59`	`VDVsx`	`lcuk, isn't only a screen ? or has cpu as well ?`
`14:55.01`	`aquatix`	`a tablet?`
`14:55.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lcuk: I thought you broke your screen in a very unique way ;-)`
`14:55.22`	`aquatix`	`DocScrutinizer: ghehe`
`14:55.34`	`*** join/#maemo hassanakevazir (~hassanake@CPE0021296837af-CM001ceacc8352.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`14:55.45`	`lcuk`	`aquatix, large format monitor for next to me`
`14:55.49`	`lcuk`	`VDVsx, full machine`
`14:55.52`	`lcuk`	`allinone`
`14:55.57`	`MohammadAG`	`HP Touchsmart?`
`14:55.59`	`MohammadAG`	`oh nvm`
`14:56.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`gesture for black, gesture for fading to white`
`14:56.04`	`lcuk`	`was gonna get one`
`14:56.15`	`lcuk`	`but was concerned about amd :)`
`14:56.33`	`lcuk`	`so i got a packard bell onetwo which has intel chip :)`
`14:56.38`	`MohammadAG`	`Touchsmarts use AMD?`
`14:56.48`	`MohammadAG`	`facepalm`
`14:57.03`	`lcuk`	`i think theres different models, the only touchsmarts i saw were amd`
`14:57.08`	`lcuk`	`they had a hp tablet too`
`14:57.16`	`lcuk`	`multitouch but my stylus didnt work with it`
`14:57.22`	`lcuk`	`and i didnt like the stylus they supplied`
`14:57.53`	`lcuk`	`so i got the packard bell that works with my n900 stylus :)`
`14:58.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wonders how multituch with stylus does work`
`14:59.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lcuk: you'll need 2 N900 ;-P`
`14:59.18`	`lcuk`	`thats easy :)`
`14:59.24`	`lcuk`	`i already have that`
`14:59.38`	`SpeedEvil`	`DocScrutinizer, it's for japan`
`14:59.39`	`VDVsx`	`lcuk, only 2 ? :p`
`14:59.47`	`lcuk`	`:)`
`14:59.48`	`SpeedEvil`	`DocScrutinizer, 4 styluses`
`14:59.50`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: XP`
`15:00.05`	`*** join/#maemo t3rm1n4l (~slynux@59.93.35.154)`
`15:00.07`	`lcuk`	`anyone coming to birmingham tonight?`
`15:00.23`	`VDVsx`	`no :P`
`15:00.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`how to sync to KDE Kontact? anybody?`
`15:00.53`	`ShadowJK`	`lol?`
`15:01.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`k`
`15:01.52`	`VDVsx`	`DocScrutinizer, did you try to search at Tmo ? I read something about that but can remember where :(`
`15:02.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`VDVsx: ok, I'll try the google approach then`
`15:03.17`	`*** join/#maemo kamui__ (~KamN900@ip68-11-94-155.no.no.cox.net)`
`15:05.00`	`ShadowJK`	`oh yeah, I vaguely remember a linux program for syncing now.. it had a very weird name :/`
`15:05.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`kitchensync?`
`15:05.51`	`MohammadAG`	`likes how Joikuspot doubles as a portable heater`
`15:06.52`	*** join/#maemo `0660 (~olli@ppp121-45-193-93.lns20.cbr1.internode.on.net)
`15:07.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wonders if setting N900 on fire would serve same purpose`
`15:08.31`	`*** join/#maemo N900evil_ (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)`
`15:08.53`	`MohammadAG`	`nah, setting it on fire would kill it for good, Joikuspot just locks the CPU @ 600MHz`
`15:09.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heard that's also killing it for good ;-P`
`15:10.19`	`MohammadAG`	`not in this weather :P`
`15:10.44`	`ShadowJK`	`MohammadAG, it locks it at 600? really?`
`15:11.06`	`ShadowJK`	`I thought the heat would mostly be because it puts wlan in adhoc mode which has no powersaving at all`
`15:11.17`	`MohammadAG`	`well CPU is running at 100% all the time`
`15:11.22`	`MohammadAG`	`and I'm assuming that's 600`
`15:11.43`	`MohammadAG`	`ShadowJK, Ad-hoc doesn't raise it as much`
`15:11.46`	`MohammadAG`	`check top`
`15:12.11`	`ShadowJK`	`I havent reid joikuspot... does it fix the kernel issues?`
`15:12.12`	`MohammadAG`	`hmm it's cooling down`
`15:12.19`	`MohammadAG`	`which issues?`
`15:12.28`	`ShadowJK`	`crashing ones :)`
`15:12.42`	`MohammadAG`	`never crashes for me`
`15:12.43`	`ShadowJK`	`powertop should give statistics of cpu states anyway..`
`15:12.53`	`MohammadAG`	`BUT it doesn't work on custom kernels`
`15:12.59`	`MohammadAG`	`you have to use the stock kernel`
`15:13.30`	`ShadowJK`	`it comes with a funny kernel module iirc`
`15:13.35`	`MohammadAG`	`ShadowJK, after 30 second-analysis...`
`15:13.49`	`ShadowJK`	`it probably does nat/something in userspace`
`15:13.54`	`MohammadAG`	`it seems that when the screen is locked, CPU is running at less than 10%`
`15:14.15`	`MohammadAG`	`but the speedometer they use seems to be raising this, and that happens when the screen is unlocked`
`15:14.27`	`MohammadAG`	`the kernel module is open source`
`15:14.54`	`ShadowJK`	`yeah`
`15:15.01`	`ShadowJK`	`it just passes packets really..`
`15:15.21`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`15:15.23`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`15:15.34`	`*** part/#maemo Omegamoon (~egoe@demolitionman.xs4all.nl)`
`15:16.23`	`MohammadAG`	`ShadowJK, Xorg uses about +60% when the screen is unlocked`
`15:16.31`	`ShadowJK`	`lol :)`
`15:17.23`	`*** join/#maemo hassanakevazir1 (~hassanake@CPE0021296837af-CM001ceacc8352.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`15:18.58`	`*** join/#maemo ioeee (~Emilio@83.53.196.126)`
`15:19.52`	`*** join/#maemo Soder (~Soder@c-4f668e01-74736162.cust.telenor.se)`
`15:21.28`	`*** join/#maemo hassanakevazir (~hassanake@CPE0021296837af-CM001ceacc8352.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`15:21.33`	`*** join/#maemo sr71 (~sr71@r.0x.to)`
`15:23.32`	`*** join/#maemo sr71 (~sr71@r.0x.to)`
`15:24.17`	`*** join/#maemo KMFDM (~tKMFDM@ip5658167f.direct-adsl.nl)`
`15:30.17`	`*** join/#maemo wizkoder (~quassel@201.244.101.76)`
`15:30.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hooray for updating speedometer at 200fps`
`15:31.46`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@62.219.120.20)`
`15:32.47`	`*** join/#maemo t_s_o (~tso@48.84-49-129.nextgentel.com)`
`15:36.44`	`MohammadAG`	`something's wrong`
`15:36.49`	`MohammadAG`	`the N900 isn't charging`
`15:37.12`	`MohammadAG`	`it's charging (as in it says charging) but when I remove the cable it dings`
`15:39.55`	`ptl`	`dings?`
`15:41.07`	`*** join/#maemo t3rm1n4l (~slynux@59.93.35.154)`
`15:42.04`	`ShadowJK`	`low battery warning I'd assume`
`15:42.13`	`*** join/#maemo jackslayton (~jackslayt@p5B1308B8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`15:42.54`	`MohammadAG`	`ptl ^`
`15:43.37`	`*** join/#maemo andrei1089 (~andrei108@81.18.92.10)`
`15:43.56`	`ptl`	`:/`
`15:44.18`	`*** join/#maemo niko59-fr_kiba (~sabayon5@211.233.146.195.dynamic.adsl.abo.nordnet.fr)`
`15:44.53`	`*** join/#maemo chittoor (~chittoor@117.204.52.72)`
`15:45.16`	`mortal`	`is it possible to install the latest tear on os2008`
`15:46.02`	`*** join/#maemo andrei1089 (~andrei108@81.18.92.10)`
`15:46.23`	`ShadowJK`	`There's one for maemo5 and there's one for maemo4(os2008), pick the right one`
`15:46.43`	`mortal`	`where do I find the libwebkit packages`
`15:49.31`	`*** join/#maemo wazd (~wazd@188.123.241.73)`
`15:49.41`	`*** join/#maemo GAN9001 (~ryan@166.195.72.21)`
`15:52.28`	`*** join/#maemo jatt (~jatt@89.204.153.66)`
`15:53.25`	`ShadowJK`	`http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=28539&highlight=tear+browser`
`15:53.31`	`jatt`	`it,s safe to use the n900 with the ac adapter connected even if the battery is full?`
`15:54.09`	`*** join/#maemo philipl (~mrkiasu@c-98-234-156-166.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`15:54.34`	`ShadowJK`	`yes it is`
`15:55.50`	`MohammadAG`	`it discharges iirc`
`15:56.01`	`MohammadAG`	`and then starts recharging when the battery goes down`
`15:56.05`	`jatt`	`i read in the manual i think tha this could lead to trouble`
`15:56.08`	`MohammadAG`	`so it doesn't run on AC power`
`15:56.35`	`MohammadAG`	`it might waste energy so your bill we be a cent or two higher :P`
`15:58.07`	`El_Angelo`	`hi`
`15:58.18`	`El_Angelo`	`any of you found a car charger that works with the n900 ?`
`15:58.58`	`El_Angelo`	`http://www.hama.de/portal/articleId166923/action2563`
`15:59.03`	`El_Angelo`	`i bought this one`
`15:59.15`	`El_Angelo`	`but my nokia ain't charging with it :(`
`15:59.36`	`*** join/#maemo alecrim (~alecrim@189.2.128.130)`
`16:00.18`	`mortal`	`thanks`
`16:02.44`	`jatt`	`hmm the applet doesn't show as it is discharging but anyway i think that was the issue written in the manual`
`16:04.03`	`MohammadAG`	`jatt, it shouldn't`
`16:04.49`	`jatt`	`it should'nt run on ac power?`
`16:05.45`	`*** join/#maemo MrCoder (~4e8fe17a@gateway/web/freenode/x-gyctwkaeyysfpwwc)`
`16:05.52`	`MohammadAG`	`No`
`16:07.37`	`ShadowJK`	`El_Angelo, yes I have the nokia DC-10 car charger. Works fine.`
`16:07.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~tell jatt about batteryfaq`
`16:08.03`	`ShadowJK`	`El_Angelo, searh tmo for "solution dumb charger"`
`16:08.19`	`ShadowJK`	`DocScrutinizer, we should write one specific to n900 too :-)`
`16:08.36`	`*** join/#maemo disco_stu (~wrt54gl@190.216.32.137)`
`16:08.42`	`dan2003`	`El_Angelo: i beleive u may need to short the 2 usb signl pins in the charger plug if it refuess to charge`
`16:09.01`	`dan2003`	`tho the one i got just wokred`
`16:09.14`	`MrCoder`	`Hi guys, Is it possible to get GTK+2.0 => 2.1.8 on the N900?`
`16:09.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: most parts of the OM batfaq are generic, not specific to any particular hw platform`
`16:10.19`	`ShadowJK`	`dan2003, the nokia car charger is obviously microusb charging compliant and "just works"`
`16:11.01`	`*** join/#maemo Noobmonk3y_ (~Noobmonk3@cpc2-lanc4-0-0-cust67.brig.cable.ntl.com)`
`16:11.06`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`waves`
`16:11.31`	`dan2003`	`ShadowJK: i didnt buy the nokai one, i bought an el-cheapo one from ebay`
`16:11.46`	`ShadowJK`	`3670mV and 20mAh left the battery meter says.. it fails so hard with the 2400mAh batttery :D`
`16:11.47`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`ooo two of me, must have left my laptop on`
`16:11.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`dan2003: as would any standard 12v->USB adapter`
`16:12.00`	`*** join/#maemo jonaskoe1ker (~jonas@ip-32-9.bnaa.dk)`
`16:12.19`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`oooo decent batteries exist? :)`
`16:13.18`	`ShadowJK`	`noobmonk3y, well it's twice as thick as the original battery`
`16:13.37`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`ahhhh mugen stylee?`
`16:13.39`	`*** join/#maemo chittoor (~chittoor@117.204.52.72)`
`16:13.43`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Hi all. Has anyone used the locate package? I'm puzzled: it creates a buncha folders in /usr/{lib,bin} and so forth, but doesn't put any files there. It puts all the files in /opt/maemo/... (e.g. /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnu/locate)`
`16:13.47`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`what's up with that?`
`16:14.03`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`noooo idea`
`16:14.16`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`space for temp files?`
`16:14.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~optification`
`16:14.28`	`infobot`	`[optification] a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs`
`16:14.34`	`Ken-Young`	`jonaskoe1ker, Sounds like bad optification.`
`16:14.44`	`dotCOMmie`	`is there a good media player for n900 which can play based on directories?`
`16:14.58`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`ah`
`16:15.34`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`but wait, shouldn't /opt/.../bin be in my $PATH ... ?`
`16:15.35`	`ShadowJK`	`noobmonk3y, yes this is the mugen fatbattery`
`16:15.48`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`and ... why don't people just fix the partitioning? Is that a hairy, sticky process?`
`16:15.59`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`ahhhh did you get one? my main concern is no cam cover?`
`16:16.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: and being twice as thick it should have at least 2.5 times the capacity :-/`
`16:16.46`	`RST38h`	`jonas: it is a hairy sticky process.`
`16:16.46`	`mortal`	`is it possible to edit the menus on os2008?`
`16:16.56`	`RST38h`	`and the details are too hairy for you to understand.`
`16:17.07`	`*** join/#maemo lullos (~a@c-c96a72d5.02-137-736b651.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)`
`16:17.13`	`ShadowJK`	`DocScrutinizer, the actualy cell is shorther than the original though`
`16:17.28`	`*** join/#maemo netvandal (~michele@host-84-223-96-149.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`16:17.35`	`*** join/#maemo GAN900 (~ryan@Maemo/community/contributor/GeneralAntilles)`
`16:17.55`	`ShadowJK`	`but anyway, small manufacturers like mugen don't have access to the awesome battery factories like the bog boys such as nokia do..`
`16:18.10`	`tybollt`	`bog boys? :D`
`16:18.18`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`:)`
`16:18.21`	`ShadowJK`	`s/bog/big/`
`16:18.29`	`tybollt`	`sjk: www.b0g.org :)`
`16:18.35`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`if only nokia realised they had the technology lol`
`16:18.58`	`ShadowJK`	`Considering their same-volume battery for N800 had 1200mAh compared to nokia original 1500mAh :)`
`16:19.12`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`RST38h: really? Hm... I'd figure you'd install a mini-linux which lets you pxe-boot over wifi (pesky wpa2 and so forth) an OS which then fidgets the file systems...`
`16:19.12`	`ShadowJK`	`(the 1200 was advertised as 1800)`
`16:19.17`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`RST38h: or something like that`
`16:19.43`	`tybollt`	`well`
`16:19.44`	`dotCOMmie`	`Maybe its possible to play all mp3s in a folder with default player? I cant seem to find that option`
`16:20.02`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: I think it's designed to not have it`
`16:20.05`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`i think you have to vcreate a play list first`
`16:20.16`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: designed by people who think they know what you want`
`16:20.37`	`*** join/#maemo zehrique (~zehrique@ubuntu/member/zehrique)`
`16:20.49`	`dotCOMmie`	`jonaskoe1ker: is there an alternative music player that can do this?`
`16:20.58`	`tybollt`	`the thing is - when nokia had made the N900 and everyone realized "shit this bat won't cut it" the normal marketing things is "let's not release an add on bat, instead - let's make the bat for the NEXT GEN device beefier and tout that at launch" ... simple as that`
`16:21.02`	`Noobmonk3y_`	`dont think so`
`16:21.04`	`dan2003`	`its not quite that simple, there is a 256Meg nand flash, which ahs the syste on, and a further 32 gig as a eMMC flash, so they cannot just be repartioned`
`16:21.11`	`dan2003`	`they are seperate physical mediums`
`16:21.19`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: I don't know if they've been packaged, but mpd and mplayer are what I use on my desk/laptops, and they're _mighty_ fine :)`
`16:21.36`	`ShadowJK`	`tybollt: well the original battery manages the stated goal of lasting the day for me..`
`16:21.38`	`*** join/#maemo dmj726_n9001 (~user@adsl-75-56-49-240.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net)`
`16:21.48`	`dan2003`	`i am in the process (right now) of writing a mpd client for n900, (i dont like cuteMPD)`
`16:21.57`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dan2003: ah, I see`
`16:21.59`	`dotCOMmie`	`jonaskoe1ker: I use moc(p) on my laptops but.. it would be nice to not have to use a keyboard`
`16:22.12`	`dotCOMmie`	`I guess mplayer * will have to do for now`
`16:22.29`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: how about "find -type f > playlist.m3u"`
`16:22.45`	`ShadowJK`	`tybollt, I think the biggest issue is finding out what eats battery, because top is worthless for it, and what eats power and how much is pretty unintuitive to the average developer, let alone user`
`16:23.12`	`dotCOMmie`	`I organize music by folders and usually play them like that having hundreds of playlist is suboptimal`
`16:23.25`	`dotCOMmie`	`esp since you wont get hierachy`
`16:23.38`	`ShadowJK`	`powertop is somewhat usable, but it's still a trial and error of disabling/uninstalling desktop widgets until wakeups go down..`
`16:23.54`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`16:23.58`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`16:24.03`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: well, I meant to create one big hunking playlist`
`16:24.23`	`*** part/#maemo jackslayton (~jackslayt@p5B1308B8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`16:24.29`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: then you have some sort of folder locality/clustered-together-ness because of similar (full) file names`
`16:25.04`	`dotCOMmie`	`jonaskoe1ker: yeah that would work. But its silly there is now file browser in music player`
`16:25.15`	`dotCOMmie`	`almost every musics player does`
`16:25.26`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`dotCOMmie: I agree 100% :)`
`16:25.47`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`it's rather silly. It's also a poor backend choice for gPodder, because it adds podcasts to my media library ^_^`
`16:26.10`	`*** join/#maemo hannesw__ (~hannes@80-121-104-184.adsl.highway.telekom.at)`
`16:26.12`	`dan2003`	`i use my zaurus with MPD to play the music and have a home made ui for client, the audio files are hosted by nas on my wifi router, am writing a client for n900 atm, plus use minion firefox plugin from laptop/dekstop`
`16:26.22`	`mortal`	`wow, tear is very nice`
`16:26.25`	`dan2003`	`also havea gumstix with audiostix which i plan on setting up with mpd`
`16:26.39`	`dan2003`	`for the other room`
`16:26.59`	`*** part/#maemo andrewgodwin (~andrew@hydrae.aeracode.org)`
`16:26.59`	`dotCOMmie`	`gumstick have soundcard add ons?`
`16:27.30`	`dan2003`	`indeed`
`16:27.42`	`dotCOMmie`	`neat`
`16:28.00`	`dan2003`	`and wifistix`
`16:28.13`	`dan2003`	`the 3 stacked up make for one teenie mpd server`
`16:28.15`	`corecode_`	`any idea why the n900 would say "not charging" when it is on usb?`
`16:28.24`	`corecode_`	`it is not the nokia cable, but still...`
`16:28.32`	`dotCOMmie`	`why not just get openwrt compatible router with usb sound card?`
`16:28.47`	`dotCOMmie`	`it'll only be 10 times larger d:`
`16:29.20`	`dan2003`	`cos i have this tuff alread ;) i have 2 x asus router with usbhost . (usb audio cabaple) also`
`16:29.30`	`*** join/#maemo raster (~raster@enlightenment/developer/raster)`
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`16:33.44`	`dan2003`	`anybody know which repo has libwebkit in ?`
`16:34.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`corecode_: it says "not charging" ?`
`16:34.41`	`corecode_`	`DocScrutinizer: yes`
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`16:34.51`	`corecode_`	`DocScrutinizer: first "charging" appears`
`16:34.58`	`corecode_`	`DocScrutinizer: then right after "not charging"`
`16:35.02`	`corecode_`	`yellow box`
`16:35.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmm, wrong voltage maybe`
`16:35.23`	`RST38h`	`is amazed by how quickly the Chinese design houses have caught up with TI and other big companies`
`16:35.27`	`corecode_`	`dunno`
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`16:35.55`	`corecode_`	`now i need a upstart script`
`16:36.09`	`corecode_`	`and a way to remove my old symlinks`
`16:36.27`	`corecode_`	`too bad /tmp is so small`
`16:36.32`	`*** join/#maemo rsalveti (~rsalveti@189.115.170.89)`
`16:36.37`	`MohammadAG`	`corecode_, tried a different PC?`
`16:37.37`	`*** join/#maemo rsalveti (~rsalveti@189.115.170.89)`
`16:39.29`	`Kurppa_`	`Not charging means the USB host you have plugged it into, cannot provide enough current to charge the phone.`
`16:40.06`	`*** join/#maemo rsalveti_ (~rsalveti@189.115.170.89)`
`16:40.08`	`Kurppa_`	`Standard current for USB is 100mA, if the USB device is not a "supported" device.`
`16:40.19`	`*** join/#maemo ddweerasiri (~denis@203.115.29.231)`
`16:40.22`	`Kurppa_`	`500mA if it is a supported device.`
`16:40.59`	`Kurppa_`	`This means, that if you plug it into a modem for example, and the modem does support reading the device in mass storage mode, you will get 500mA if you have the phone in mass storage mode.`
`16:41.03`	`MohammadAG`	`BTW the not charging happened to me once and it was a sw bug, a reboot fixed it`
`16:41.24`	`Kurppa_`	`If the phone is in PC suite mode, you will get 100mA because the phone is not recognised by the modem.`
`16:41.55`	`disco_stu`	`Kurppa_, cool tip, did not know that, thx :)`
`16:42.03`	`Kurppa_`	`And will definitely get the "not charging" notification.`
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`16:42.30`	`disco_stu`	`Kurppa_, i've been wondering why my phone wont charge, even with my notebook's power share activated`
`16:42.51`	`Kurppa_`	`In a PC that does not have Nokia drivers installed, you will also get "not charging" if you have it in PC suite mode, since the phone is not recognised.`
`16:43.40`	`MohammadAG`	`noobmonk3y, ping`
`16:43.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: that's partially a question of N900 doing correct ENUM on USB though`
`16:44.00`	`dmj726_n9001`	`Kurppa: that only applies to windows`
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`16:44.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: the 'supported device" bit is mostly a OTG issue`
`16:44.26`	`Kurppa_`	`The phone also remembers which mode you had it last in. If you had it on PC suite mode and now you only select "charging only", it will still be advertised to the PC in "pc suite" mode and you will get 100mA.`
`16:44.56`	`Kurppa_`	`So if it does not charge correctly, plug it into PC, select "mass storage" mode, and then it will charge correctly.`
`16:45.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: ee`
`16:45.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`err what?`
`16:45.34`	`Kurppa_`	`That's how it's supposed to work. It's part of USB specification.`
`16:46.12`	`Kurppa_`	`You can google "usb unit load" for a better explanation, I'm crappy at explaining things :-)`
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`16:47.54`	`RST38h`	`"Ubuntu Will Switch To Base-10 File Size Units In Future Release"`
`16:47.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: any standard USB gadget will do a proper negotiation of allowed VBUS current on ENUM, aiui. The 'known device' bit is a OTG extension where you got no ENUM as there's no master`
`16:48.01`	`RST38h`	`Is it April 1st already???`
`16:48.04`	`Kurppa_`	`The AC adapter that came with the phone is different though, and will charge much faster than a PC can. It delivers 900mA or 9 unit load.`
`16:48.27`	`MohammadAG`	`Ugh I'm downgrading to ubuntu 9.10`
`16:48.33`	`MohammadAG`	`too many crashes in the beta`
`16:48.39`	`MohammadAG`	`it feels like windows...`
`16:49.03`	`dmj726_n9001`	`Rst38h: I'm waiting for base ten x86 cpus.`
`16:49.16`	`El_Angelo`	`dan2003: which one did you get?`
`16:49.41`	`El_Angelo`	`car charger that is...`
`16:49.43`	`ShadowJK`	`the ac adapter that came with my n900 delivers 1200mA`
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`16:49.45`	`Kurppa_`	`DocScrutinizer: N900 is different then, if I understood you correctly :-)`
`16:50.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: my charger is capable of 1200mA`
`16:50.51`	`dan2003`	`El_Angelo: uhm - i donno, was a generic one from hong-kong on ebay. I'll pop to car and loko if u want but i doubt itll have anythhing on it to identify it by`
`16:51.26`	`Kurppa_`	`It's capable of 1200mA, but I think the phone only charges at 900mA if I remember correctly. Good point though, mine was the same, 1200mA.`
`16:52.01`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: Is 9.10 safe?`
`16:52.10`	`RST38h`	`Mohammad: Does it run Scratchbox2?`
`16:52.49`	`Kurppa_`	`Ubuntu beta has always been crashy. It's still been crashy 2 months after release :-)`
`16:53.25`	`*** join/#maemo lardman (~simon@78.148.144.86)`
`16:53.39`	`lardman`	`afternoon all`
`16:53.51`	`Kurppa_`	`Hello there.`
`16:53.56`	`*** join/#maemo lardman (~simon@Maemo/community/contributor/lardman)`
`16:54.06`	`lardman`	`hi Kurppa_`
`16:54.22`	`RST38h`	`moo lardman`
`16:54.31`	`*** join/#maemo chintu (~mmmaneesh@122.168.97.225)`
`16:54.40`	`lardman`	`hey RST38h`
`16:54.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: whenever I plug my N900 to my laptop I see it in lsusb, and it has negotiated the max of 500mA. That's not dependent on g_ether or whatever, or on vendorid being listed in the database file`
`16:55.18`	`chintu`	`hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii`
`16:55.25`	`*** part/#maemo chintu (~mmmaneesh@122.168.97.225)`
`16:55.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`i stuck?`
`16:55.59`	`*** join/#maemo kulve (~kulve@humboldt.pingu.fi)`
`16:55.59`	`Kurppa_`	`Alright. I don't know if it's my phone that's just malfunctioning then.`
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`16:56.27`	`Kurppa_`	`Every time I've had it in PC suite mode and plugged it into a PC without PC suite drivers, it's been saying "not enough juice to charge".`
`16:56.39`	`lardman`	`so is pr1.2 out yet?`
`16:56.42`	`ShadowJK`	`battery low warning at 3637mV... fail`
`16:56.59`	`Kurppa_`	`lardman: not today.`
`16:56.59`	`lardman`	`lcuk: you about?`
`16:57.12`	`lardman`	`Kurppa_: I've been out of touch for a couple of weeks, so was just wondering`
`16:57.18`	`Kurppa_`	`Ah, I see.`
`16:57.22`	`ShadowJK`	`Kurppa_, iirc if you remove drivers added by pc suite/ovi suite it starts working again.. something like that`
`16:58.30`	`Kurppa_`	`I've tried on a couple of pristine PC:s. PC suite has never been installed on them. But I do not know if it's just a bug in my phone.`
`16:59.09`	`*** join/#maemo ankur (~ankurlnmi@210.212.97.196)`
`16:59.12`	`ShadowJK`	`In general that message is displayed when the host pc does not agree to supply power`
`16:59.40`	`Kurppa_`	`Yes. It has always helped if I get the PC to recognise the device using mass storage mode.`
`17:00.09`	`Kurppa_`	`There could be a difference in how windows and unix handle it.`
`17:00.12`	`lardman`	`hmm, I could really do with Google Street view (or similar) with a hook into the land registry house prices so I can walk around and see the price of houses in the vicinity`
`17:00.14`	`TomaszD`	`anyone knows Gabriel Shulhof?`
`17:00.25`	`Kurppa_`	`You said you have used lsusb, so I assume you've used linux or another variant of unix.`
`17:00.44`	`lcuk`	`lardman, just whats up?`
`17:00.44`	`Kurppa_`	`I've only tried in win xp and 7.`
`17:00.51`	`lardman`	`compass would help too, I don't suppose a hidden compass has been discovered in the N900 in the past couple of weeks? ;)`
`17:00.52`	`lcuk`	`(setting off to birmingham in ~ 5mins`
`17:00.58`	`*** join/#maemo angasule (~angasule@201.250.104.40)`
`17:01.11`	`lardman`	`lcuk: Trying to remember the name of that gst source switcher you found for me`
`17:01.23`	`lardman`	`or a vague date?`
`17:01.26`	`Kurppa_`	`lardman: it has. And a kitchen sink was found as well.`
`17:01.38`	`lardman`	`Kurppa_: wonderful ;)`
`17:02.23`	`lcuk`	`cripes lardman !`
`17:02.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: connect to laptop, select 'PC Suite', halley:~ # lsusb -v -s 1:4; ->... bmAttributes 0x80`
`17:02.41`	`lardman`	`lcuk: :)`
`17:02.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:03.34`	`Kurppa_`	`Yep. Looks good. I think this linux or whatever you're using is a lot smarter than my those windows pc:s I've tried.`
`17:03.46`	`Kurppa_`	`Minus the my.`
`17:03.53`	`*** join/#maemo ferdna (~ferdna@cpe-24-92-116-14.elp.res.rr.com)`
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`17:05.15`	`Kurppa_`	`I'll try that as well after I find an usb cable to see if it's just a bug in the software I'm using in the phone. Or in the phone itself :-)`
`17:05.26`	`lcuk`	`lardman, :) check your pm`
`17:05.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah, windoze is known to do some weird nasty things to USB`
`17:05.37`	`*** join/#maemo jonaskoe1ker (~jonas@ip-32-9.bnaa.dk)`
`17:05.47`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Hi all. How do I proegramatically fiddle with my contacts?`
`17:05.49`	`lardman`	`lcuk: thanks mate, have a safe trip back home`
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`17:06.04`	`lcuk`	`will do - i have new toys so will play later`
`17:06.07`	`lardman`	`jonaskoe1ker: what sort of fiddling?`
`17:06.09`	`Kurppa_`	`The contacts are probably stored in this sqlite database.. I forget where.`
`17:06.09`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`several have gotten multiple identical facebook account #s attached to them, I want to remove them all`
`17:06.19`	`lardman`	`lcuk: will try to catch you later on`
`17:06.26`	`lcuk`	`\o ttyl`
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`17:06.51`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`17:07.12`	`lardman`	`libosso-abook`
`17:07.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: so your explanations might be perfectly correct for MS based USB host systems`
`17:07.20`	`*** part/#maemo jsa- (~Macbook@dna23-252.tampere.customers.dnainternet.fi)`
`17:07.27`	`lardman`	`jonaskoe1ker: http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo_5_api_documentation/`
`17:08.07`	`Kurppa_`	`jonaskoe1ker: are you using PR1.2?`
`17:08.30`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`PR1.2?`
`17:08.49`	`*** part/#maemo ddweerasiri (~denis@203.115.29.231)`
`17:09.11`	`Kurppa_`	`Never mind. I just didn't understand correctly.`
`17:09.23`	`lardman`	`hmm, has sb moved to pr1.2 libs now, so nothing can be installed?`
`17:09.34`	`lardman`	`or rather s/sb/sb rootfs`
`17:10.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`jonaskoe1ker: I found contactinfos pkg yesterday in the repos. It's supposed to provide access to contacts database via dbus. Alas I wasn't able to find a decent API description`
`17:10.31`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`no sysfs'ish interface?`
`17:10.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nope`
`17:10.51`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`I mean the g--damn phone runs unix. Everything is a file. Lines of text. That sort of... gah... :\`
`17:11.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's a clib interface`
`17:11.21`	`lardman`	`there is code floating about, in fact there's some on my webpage to see which contacts are online`
`17:11.34`	`lardman`	`you could use something similar and remember the facebook/etc. ids`
`17:13.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`jonaskoe1ker: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Generic_Platform_Components/Using_Address_Book_API http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/libosso-abook/OssoABookContact.html`
`17:13.33`	`lardman`	`praise be to the FSM, selector is already available in extras!`
`17:14.14`	`Kurppa_`	`Selector?`
`17:15.23`	`lardman`	`gst input selector element`
`17:15.25`	`Kurppa_`	`(can't find anything about it on google)`
`17:15.35`	`lardman`	`http://www.gstreamer.net/data/doc/gstreamer/head/gst-plugins-bad-plugins/html/gst-plugins-bad-plugins-input-selector.html`
`17:16.02`	`lardman`	`is good, need to have file and video src for barcode pipeline`
`17:16.22`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B-N900 (~C-S-B@89.243.36.36)`
`17:16.30`	`lardman`	`and having done nothing on this for a month or so, I think I should pull my finger out and get it released`
`17:16.59`	`lardman`	`though with the autobuilder building for pr 1.2 (afaiu), I may have chosen the wrong time`
`17:20.16`	`mortal`	`what do the different wlan power saving levels do on os2008?`
`17:20.27`	`mortal`	`like if I have the middle one, what will it do?`
`17:20.36`	`mortal`	`the highest one did not work well`
`17:21.11`	`lardman`	`use more power`
`17:21.18`	`lardman`	`;)`
`17:21.52`	`lardman`	`though some routers don't like the power saving methods it uses, so you have to dial it back`
`17:22.15`	`lardman`	`what exactly the methods are, I can't remember`
`17:22.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`MUHAHAHA reboot on plugging laptop USB to the device`
`17:22.42`	`RST38h`	`so, what rebooted? laptop or the tablet?`
`17:22.42`	`*** join/#maemo fab (~bellet@bellet.info)`
`17:23.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`tablet of course`
`17:23.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`:-P`
`17:23.46`	`RST38h`	`once again notices how slow App Manager is`
`17:24.22`	`lardman`	`RST38h: is that because it's been updating for the last two weeks? ;)`
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`17:25.07`	`RST38h`	`lardman: Naah, it is just naturally like that`
`17:25.19`	`RST38h`	`lardman: Megabytes of repo indices do not help either`
`17:25.47`	`lardman`	`I think the update strategy could also be improved`
`17:25.55`	`lardman`	`i.e. do it while the list is still present`
`17:26.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`bootcount:3, bootreason:sw_rst`
`17:26.26`	`lardman`	`and even work out which packages need to be removed/added behind the scenes so there is less waiting around`
`17:27.09`	`*** join/#maemo Milhouse (~irc_milho@Maemo/community/contributor/Milhouse)`
`17:27.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`~praise cmdline execution widget`
`17:27.12`	`infobot`	`All hail cmdline execution widget!`
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`17:29.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`tzz, TV takinghead: "sleep faster tonight!"`
`17:30.26`	`*** part/#maemo minivip (~55340dec@gateway/web/freenode/x-nmnjqroluwvanxvg)`
`17:31.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`+l`
`17:32.39`	`*** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg)`
`17:34.57`	`*** join/#maemo angasule (~angasule@201.250.112.97)`
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`17:36.28`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@62.219.120.20)`
`17:38.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`is it just me to feel it's kinda silly Nokia not even bothered to create a whatever rudimentary Nokiasuite for Linux Desktop hosts, though the device is Linux?`
`17:38.30`	`*** join/#maemo GAN900 (~ryan@Maemo/community/contributor/GeneralAntilles)`
`17:38.40`	`derf`	`'The video shows that the Predators invented the "slide to unlock" feature circa 1987.'`
`17:38.51`	`Raveesh`	`Hi all, I've got a question regarding the GSoC. I've put up a project suggestion on the site and it appears in the list, but I wanted to ask if we're required to provide a more "formal" application of sorts, or is it sufficient that the project appears there.`
`17:41.12`	`*** join/#maemo jatt (~jatt@89.204.153.66)`
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`17:42.20`	`N900evil_`	`DocScrutinizer, it is handy. I've gotten a desktop widget to set the backlight to '2' (very dim) when clikcked.`
`17:42.37`	`Kurppa_`	`DocScrutinizer: it's not just you..`
`17:43.01`	`Kurppa_`	`They even have a cross platform GUI toolkit for that.`
`17:43.14`	`Kurppa_`	`sigh`
`17:43.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heh, I guess it's called Qt?`
`17:43.51`	`Kurppa_`	`Yes. Yes it is..`
`17:48.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`N900evil_: good idea. Found it quite annoying to swing from menu to submenu to subsub quite some times. E.g. for switchin backlight to 'always on'`
`17:49.00`	`RST38h`	`~`
`17:49.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`RST38h: ~~ ?`
`17:49.46`	`*** join/#maemo Erod (~Juno@unaffiliated/erod)`
`17:50.06`	`derf`	`ã`
`17:50.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`duh`
`17:51.02`	`*** join/#maemo t3rm1n4l (~slynux@59.93.32.251)`
`17:52.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`derf: what'sâ®that`
`17:52.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Â¿`
`17:54.55`	`*** join/#maemo sheepbat (~lev3k@c-98-238-227-32.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`17:55.06`	`ShadowJK`	`docscrutinizer: I'd hope we'd get away from the 1990s with special sofware for each device, and support standard protocols ;(`
`17:55.16`	`derf`	`DocScrutinizer: http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/301c/index.htm`
`17:55.42`	`*** join/#maemo pupnik (~pupnik@unaffiliated/pupnik)`
`17:55.58`	`*** join/#maemo dmj726_n900 (~user@m2a0e36d0.tmodns.net)`
`17:57.40`	`range`	`â¾ is the small brother, I guess ...`
`17:58.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ShadowJK: ack. anyway some 'conduits' might be needed, even while clinging to standards as much as possible. I can live without a Nokia wrapper around xterm ssh, and sftp. But the approach to 'ship with' Windoze support, and forget about Linux, well that's stupid anyway`
`18:01.44`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`18:01.49`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`18:02.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`s/Linux/Linux&Mac`
`18:03.50`	`*** join/#maemo N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)`
`18:06.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`N900evil: any idea how to set Simple Brightness App to 'keep display on', via cmdline?`
`18:06.54`	`N900evil`	`nope, sorry.`
`18:07.46`	`ShadowJK`	`I thought the windows softwaredidnt work either, atleast people whine about N900 Ovi Suite support all the fucking time`
`18:09.24`	`Kurppa_`	`Nope, it doesn't work.`
`18:09.38`	`*** join/#maemo thopiekar (~quassel@p57A14167.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`18:09.38`	`RST38h`	`Ovi Suite is a clusterfuck, has been this way for years`
`18:10.07`	`RST38h`	`Converting it to Java at some point obviously did not help it any`
`18:10.25`	`Kurppa_`	`You install PC suite, it doesn't work and says you need to install Ovi suite. Ovi suite removes PC suite when you click OK and starts installing. After it's started up, it says your phone is not supported.`
`18:11.01`	`Kurppa_`	`You try to remove Ovi suite to get even some of the functionality back that PC suite had. Ovi suite uninstaller keeps crashing so it can't be uninstalled.`
`18:11.12`	`*** join/#maemo rdorsch (~rd@p5B201941.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`18:11.13`	`Kurppa_`	`Then you're just screwed.`
`18:12.06`	`*** join/#maemo spenap (~simon@24.6.165.83.dynamic.mundo-r.com)`
`18:12.09`	`Kurppa_`	`And you have rebooted your PC about 3 times during all this.`
`18:12.43`	`RST38h`	`Why are you forgetting 6-7 background programs it installs on Windows?`
`18:12.55`	`RST38h`	`That will now run on startup`
`18:13.15`	`Kurppa_`	`Got to have some daemons. They're nice.`
`18:14.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`facepalms`
`18:16.16`	`dmj726_n900`	`try ubuntu for charging?`
`18:16.37`	`dmj726_n900`	`is half serious`
`18:17.24`	`Kurppa_`	`VMWare Ubuntu for charging.`
`18:17.41`	`*** join/#maemo kunal (~kunal@121.242.23.197)`
`18:18.20`	`*** join/#maemo GAN900 (~ryan@Maemo/community/contributor/GeneralAntilles)`
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`18:25.13`	`Shapeshifter`	`mhh, I just tried sudo reboot and it seems to be working allright. Is this the proper way of rebooting maemo?`
`18:25.22`	`Shapeshifter`	`and, is it coupled to rootsh being installed?`
`18:25.35`	`Shapeshifter`	`I'm not sure. someone just asked me how to reboot the device from CLI and I just tried this.`
`18:27.28`	`nidO`	`should be a perfectly clean way to do it`
`18:28.38`	`Kurppa_`	`Beats pulling out the battery.`
`18:29.18`	`nidO`	`you could just skip a call with shutdown -r now though`
`18:29.45`	`Shapeshifter`	`nidO: meh :P`
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`18:33.46`	`*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (~timeless@94.140.33.202)`
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`18:34.30`	`corecode_`	`i wonder...`
`18:34.43`	`corecode_`	`how do i package upstart scripts properly`
`18:35.09`	`*** join/#maemo lovelyboy (~89de670c@gateway/web/freenode/x-ykowkqlatbebtypi)`
`18:36.53`	`lovelyboy`	`Hi, I want to embed Python in C app, I added the header file #include <Python.h>. But how to link it with gcc?`
`18:36.58`	`*** join/#maemo bizzle (~bdogg64@m035e36d0.tmodns.net)`
`18:37.36`	`corecode_`	`does it work in linux?`
`18:37.53`	`lovelyboy`	`I think so`
`18:38.05`	`corecode_`	`can you make sure?`
`18:38.35`	`jensp`	`Hey, flash stopped working for me in the microb browser, any idea what I could have messed up?`
`18:38.56`	`*** join/#maemo aziwoqpd (~jperry@onigiri.lfx.org)`
`18:39.59`	`lovelyboy`	`corecode: not very sure about it, cause I never use Python before. But I wrote a simple helloworld.py to print "Hello, World", and I run" python helloworld.py", it works in scratchbox`
`18:40.50`	`jensp`	`When I check the Add-ons/Plugins the field is empty.`
`18:41.40`	`timeless_mbp`	`jensp: that'd be a problem...`
`18:42.24`	`jensp`	`timeless_mbp: Any idea how to get it back? Flash doesn't seem to be in the repos.`
`18:42.38`	`timeless_mbp`	`it isn't`
`18:42.43`	`timeless_mbp`	`you're not supposed to delete it ;-)`
`18:43.02`	`timeless_mbp`	`add-ons/plugins is entirely empty?`
`18:43.16`	`jensp`	`I didn't do so conciously...`
`18:43.18`	`timeless_mbp`	`i have 5 things, including 'default plug-in'`
`18:43.21`	`jensp`	`yep`
`18:45.38`	`timeless_mbp`	`cat ~/.mozilla/microb/pluginreg.dat`
`18:47.40`	`jensp`	`timeless_mbp: http://dpaste.com/176760/`
`18:48.30`	`corecode_`	`lovelyboy: what i'm getting at is, you should try it in linux first before you try it in maemo`
`18:49.11`	`*** join/#maemo smhar (~salman@94.79.216.77)`
`18:49.58`	`timeless_mbp`	`did you do anything stupid lately? :)`
`18:50.35`	`corecode_`	`hmm`
`18:50.44`	`jensp`	`timeless_mbp: obviously yes, but I'm not sure what ;) the .mozilla/plugins directory contains the files btw`
`18:50.56`	`corecode_`	`how do i start upstart tasks from a debian package?`
`18:51.09`	`*** part/#maemo MrGoose (~cache@5ac51550.bb.sky.com)`
`18:51.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`that file shouldn't be anywhere near that empty`
`18:51.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`it should be ~48 lines`
`18:51.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`[re]moving /usr/lib/browser/plugins counts as stupid fwiw :)`
`18:51.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`ls /usr/lib/browser/plugins`
`18:52.53`	`jensp`	`timeless_mbp: http://dpaste.com/ wtf?!`
`18:53.09`	`jensp`	`woops sry`
`18:53.17`	`jensp`	`http://dpaste.com/176763/`
`18:53.18`	`hcarrega`	`llkik`
`18:53.25`	`hcarrega`	`7 mil carcaÃ§as`
`18:54.36`	`MohammadAG`	`timeless_mbp, shouldn't the files that's empty in his case be regenerated if it was deleted?`
`18:55.03`	`MohammadAG`	`s/files/file/`
`18:56.26`	`jensp`	`MohammadAG: I guess it would be if my plugins wouldn't consist of a weird loop of symlinks oO`
`18:56.58`	`*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (~timeless@94.140.33.202)`
`18:57.01`	`*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (~timeless@firefox/developer/timeless)`
`18:57.12`	`MohammadAG`	`jensp, I have many symlinks in /usr/lib`
`18:57.57`	`jensp`	`MohammadAG: Yeah, but as you can see in my paste http://dpaste.com/176763/ the symlinks are pointing to themselves`
`18:59.07`	`*** join/#maemo mavhk (mavhc@cpc4-basf8-2-0-cust689.know.cable.virginmedia.com)`
`18:59.13`	`MohammadAG`	`jensp, again, I have many symlinks pointing to themselves`
`18:59.15`	`MohammadAG`	`sec`
`18:59.35`	`jensp`	`ok... seems weird to me.`
`18:59.41`	`MohammadAG`	`actually, the browser plugins aren't`
`19:00.23`	`FIQ`	`i've 98% of my rootfs filled`
`19:00.43`	`corecode_`	`i don't think maemo is actually using upstart`
`19:00.46`	`corecode_`	`seriously`
`19:00.52`	`MohammadAG`	`jensp, http://dpaste.com/176764/`
`19:00.58`	`MohammadAG`	`FIQ get out of -devel`
`19:01.29`	`*** join/#maemo asolsson (~asolsson@84-238-115-186.u.parknet.dk)`
`19:01.34`	`MohammadAG`	`I think the repository links for -devel should be removed from the wiki`
`19:01.59`	`corecode_`	`why?`
`19:02.59`	`jensp`	`MohammadAG: thanks, any idea how I could get those files? I just downloaded the latest maemo5 image, I'll see if I can get them extracted from there...`
`19:03.00`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`19:03.04`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`19:03.41`	`MohammadAG`	`jensp, yes you can get them from the image, extract it using flasher-3.5 and mount the root.jffs2 file`
`19:03.55`	`MohammadAG`	`the N900 uses ubifs, so you'll need a ubifs enabled kernel on your desktop`
`19:03.59`	`*** join/#maemo millenomi (~millenomi@93-35-147-39.ip55.fastwebnet.it)`
`19:04.36`	`timeless_mbp`	`jensp: please figure out how you managed to convince your system to eat those files`
`19:04.36`	`timeless_mbp`	`that's obviously a bad thing`
`19:04.36`	`timeless_mbp`	`and someone should promise not to eat them`
`19:04.51`	`corecode_`	`euhm`
`19:05.00`	`corecode_`	`upstart, anybody?`
`19:05.06`	`Kurppa_`	`Heh. That was actually info I needed at work. Thanks MohammadAG!`
`19:05.37`	`MohammadAG`	`lol np :)`
`19:06.57`	`jensp`	`timeless_mbp: I am, currently looking through my shells history, but I can't find anything suspicious.`
`19:08.34`	`MohammadAG`	`~ping`
`19:08.35`	`infobot`	`~pong`
`19:08.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`jensp: i'm more interested in your package install/update history`
`19:08.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`i'd be surprised if you personally shot yourself in your leg w/o remembering doing something like it`
`19:08.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`i mean, it's possible to have serious amnesia after a self inflicted wound`
`19:08.47`	`timeless_mbp`	`but...`
`19:10.31`	`*** join/#maemo Erod (~Juno@unaffiliated/erod)`
`19:11.11`	`*** join/#maemo hannesw__ (~hannes@80-121-104-135.adsl.highway.telekom.at)`
`19:11.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`timeless_mbp: like drilling a hole into your skull?`
`19:12.27`	`*** join/#maemo Dantonic (~david@c-67-174-39-138.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`19:16.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`jensp: you're sure /usr/lib/browser/plugins/ isn't itself just a symlink to ~/.mozilla/plugins ?`
`19:17.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ahh,nevermind. 'disbaled/' has a different timestamp`
`19:18.55`	`*** join/#maemo Sargun (~Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun)`
`19:21.54`	`*** join/#maemo slaxium (~slaxium@tmo-099-41.customers.d1-online.com)`
`19:21.56`	`*** join/#maemo Erod (~Juno@unaffiliated/erod)`
`19:25.45`	`jensp`	`got it to work with the plugins extracted from the image, thanks everyone`
`19:26.44`	`*** join/#maemo zs (~zs@188-220-50-10.zone11.bethere.co.uk)`
`19:28.24`	`*** join/#maemo unixSnob (~unixSnob@starfury.spearlink.com)`
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`19:37.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`timeless: if you'd suggest how to get HAM log via cmdline... A 'history \| grep apt \| pastebinit ' seems simple enough`
`19:42.59`	`Kurppa_`	`I hope thdere will be some kind of new battery technology available soon. I've almost emptied the battery 4 times today. :-)`
`19:44.21`	`Kurppa_`	`That "5 minutes to full charge" technology that was in the news a couple of years ago would work for me as well.`
`19:44.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: I wonder why you even removed the device from charger at all :-P`
`19:45.02`	`Kurppa_`	`I'm finnish so I'm chatting from sauna. :-P`
`19:45.17`	`Kurppa_`	`And the cord is so short..`
`19:46.12`	`*** join/#maemo dmj726_n9001 (~user@adsl-75-56-49-240.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net)`
`19:46.24`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: 5min-charging never will work, thanks to china and EU making usb-charging mandatory. You need >1h to charge a battery over USB, simple because you can't have more than 1A of current on the plugs afaik`
`19:47.09`	`Kurppa_`	`Ah, there's some kind of upper cap on the charging current then?`
`19:47.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`on the plug current, yes`
`19:47.48`	`Kurppa_`	`Or is the 1A just a limitation of current li-ion/li-po battery technology.`
`19:48.01`	`Kurppa_`	`I see. But laws can be changed.`
`19:48.22`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nope, you can charge LiIon much faster, depending on particular cell technology`
`19:48.27`	`atiti`	`and 500mah limit for usb :p`
`19:48.36`	`Kurppa_`	`And I'm sure there will be tech workarounds for laws, when the technology is ready for it.`
`19:50.43`	`Kurppa_`	`Yeah. I guess some part of the 1A limit is also because they don't want the mobile phone getting too hot.`
`19:51.24`	`Kurppa_`	`Would suck if it was burning hot in your pocket after charging.`
`19:51.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nah, that's solvable`
`19:52.09`	`Kurppa_`	`By a huge heatsink on the side of the phone.`
`19:52.16`	`wazd`	`charging for a theme is kinda lame`
`19:52.37`	`Kurppa_`	`Capitalism.`
`19:53.25`	`wazd`	`charging for actions that are described in details, like theme packaging, is lame^2`
`19:53.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`by designing a charger control that has high efficiency, or by completely doing the regulator business in charger rather than in phone (the motorola way iirc)`
`19:54.17`	`wazd`	`I was talking bout it at the FRUCT conference - OSS is "for fun"`
`19:54.25`	`*** join/#maemo juliank (~juliank@ubuntu/member/juliank)`
`19:54.34`	`wazd`	`if you don't have fun by doing themes - then don't do it`
`19:55.32`	`*** join/#maemo Flyser_ (~flyser@unaffiliated/flyser)`
`19:55.39`	`*** join/#maemo Tuxprobe (~mschr@0x57397642.cpe.ge-1-1-0-1105.srnqu1.customer.tele.dk)`
`19:56.01`	`wazd`	`Arkenoi, do you have some kind of invisibility spell or something? :D`
`19:56.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`BS! I'm even paying the neighbor's kid to maw my lawn`
`19:56.43`	`Kurppa_`	`I guess for example those RC car chargers do huge currents on those li-ion batteries`
`19:57.18`	`Kurppa_`	`I wish I had a lawn. I'd go roll on it right now.`
`19:57.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`it's described very well how to do it, so is paying for it lame? It's not fun to me, so the lawn shouldn't see mawing at all?`
`19:57.28`	`Kurppa_`	`Winter. Bah.`
`19:58.53`	`wazd`	`DocScrutinizer: well, mawing is work`
`19:59.15`	`wazd`	`DocScrutinizer: charging 10 bucks for clicking 1 button - lame :)`
`19:59.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`PAYING 10 bucks is lame`
`19:59.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`charging 10 bucks is perfectly ok`
`20:00.58`	`wazd`	`why?`
`20:01.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`need explanation for the obvious?`
`20:01.53`	`wazd`	`charging old people 100 bucks to, well, check their e-mail is ok? :)`
`20:02.00`	`wazd`	`yes, please`
`20:04.47`	`Kurppa_`	`Asking the price is ok. Paying it is stupid.`
`20:05.10`	`wazd`	`and btw`
`20:05.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`exactly. Unless you got a monopoly`
`20:05.28`	`*** join/#maemo visz (vis@irkki.fi)`
`20:05.40`	`Kurppa_`	`But believe or not, many people make their living by doing just that. Take for example Nokia's Vertu phones ;-)`
`20:05.41`	`wazd`	`I don't think that use of MADDE to make money is not violating EULA`
`20:07.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wazd: duh. I think you're seriously mistaken here`
`20:07.15`	`wazd`	`DocScrutinizer: where exactly? :)`
`20:09.11`	`Kurppa_`	`Morally, conning old people is wrong.`
`20:09.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wazd: with EULA. Please quote`
`20:11.14`	`wazd`	`DocScrutinizer: well, right now I don't have time to dig thru all that infinite papers, but I'll ask Daniel later`
`20:12.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well I've seen EULAs for compilers forbidding their use by military or in weapon development, but honestly I doubt MADDE would forbid creating commercial packages, that's not exactly what Nokia is after`
`20:14.17`	`Stskeeps`	`doubts too`
`20:14.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`except of course if they possibly plan to have a commercial version of MADDE for companies to pay for it, so they can create their profit`
`20:14.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(see Qt)`
`20:16.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`use free MADDE for free products, pay for commercial grade MADDE to create commercial products`
`20:18.23`	`*** join/#maemo javispedro (~javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net)`
`20:18.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`curses free-as-in-beer mentality`
`20:19.27`	`*** join/#maemo rdorsch (~rd@p5B201941.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`20:19.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`"heh, it's just like hitting a button, and I'd do that for fun. So while I don't bother to actually do, how may you dare to charge me for that?!?"`
`20:20.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you should give me a buck so you're allowed to do that fun!`
`20:22.34`	`*** join/#maemo wazd1 (~wazd@188.123.241.73)`
`20:22.53`	`javispedro`	`having fun? I have that patented!`
`20:23.27`	`SpeedEvil`	`ponders a wonderojus world where you can ask a browser 'dump page related state to swap atomically'`
`20:23.51`	`SpeedEvil`	`has 6 windows open, and it's getting slow.`
`20:23.55`	`Kurppa_`	`You can always ask.`
`20:25.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heard some weeks ago someone patented patenting patent patenting, so your patent is void, javispedro X-P`
`20:25.59`	`*** join/#maemo jatt (~jatt@89.204.153.66)`
`20:27.12`	`*** join/#maemo wazd (~wazd@188.123.238.194)`
`20:28.40`	`*** join/#maemo wazd2 (~wazd@188.123.241.73)`
`20:29.18`	`Kurppa_`	`Phone almost out of battery. Where is my lifeline?`
`20:29.40`	`*** join/#maemo jatt (~jatt@89.204.153.66)`
`20:30.32`	`Kurppa_`	`Anybody know if there is an app for adjusting headphones 'gain'?`
`20:31.01`	`Kurppa_`	`Right now if I use headphones, the incoming call volume is so loud it breaks my ears.`
`20:31.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`notices the above scheme resembles to selling a fence to be painted by the meter to eager painters`
`20:31.52`	`Kurppa_`	`I have to keep it loud so I can hear from the speakers that the phone ringing. They share the same volume setting.`
`20:31.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`'hey, dude, it's FUN'`
`20:32.20`	`jatt`	`in xchat when i click on a link the maemo browser is not launched how do I configure this?`
`20:32.38`	`SpeedEvil`	`jatt, wfm`
`20:32.51`	`ptl`	`~wfm`
`20:32.52`	`infobot`	`it has been said that wfm is (Wired For Management Baseline) This is an Intel hardware specification that is designed to allow for compliance with easier management of desktop PCs in a networked environment. The specification calls for computers to be compatible with a pre-boot protocol that can be used to update the system or perform other management options. Also, the computer must be compatible with network/desktop management applications.. Works ...`
`20:33.45`	`ptl`	`wonders how xchat might have a pre-boot protocol that can be used toupdate the system!`
`20:33.55`	`ptl`	`considers using xchat instead of flasher`
`20:34.08`	`jatt`	`what is wfm? a command I need to run from the shell?`
`20:34.22`	`ptl`	`beats me too`
`20:34.25`	`ptl`	`write the fucking manual?`
`20:34.30`	`luke-jr`	`WFM = Works For Me`
`20:34.31`	`Kurppa_`	`Never heard.`
`20:34.34`	`ptl`	`oh.`
`20:34.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`jatt: click and hold`
`20:34.37`	`SpeedEvil`	`works for me`
`20:34.50`	`luke-jr`	`in other words, "you are delusional"`
`20:34.53`	`ptl`	`acronyms!`
`20:34.54`	`luke-jr`	`or "it's in your head"`
`20:35.04`	`SpeedEvil`	`naah.`
`20:35.09`	`Kurppa_`	`WFM on my PC.`
`20:35.21`	`ptl`	`lemme check it here`
`20:35.39`	`SpeedEvil`	`just saying it works for me. Not that it might not fail for others.`
`20:36.01`	`jatt`	`;) ok will try holding a little bit more`
`20:36.04`	`SpeedEvil`	`do yolu get a dialog on clicking?`
`20:36.09`	`*** join/#maemo jo-erlend (~Xixaq@15-188-8.connect.netcom.no)`
`20:36.13`	`*** part/#maemo jo-erlend (~Xixaq@15-188-8.connect.netcom.no)`
`20:36.22`	`*** join/#maemo ptl-n900 (~patola@187.10.11.107)`
`20:36.42`	`DocScrutinizer`	`me? yes`
`20:36.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`context menu`
`20:36.50`	`ptl`	`select it`
`20:36.54`	`ptl`	`'open link in browser'`
`20:36.58`	`ptl`	`then microb starts`
`20:37.00`	`ptl`	`worked ok`
`20:37.13`	`ptl-n900`	`yeah, it did`
`20:37.22`	`*** join/#maemo rkirti (~oespirit@203.199.213.3)`
`20:37.35`	`ptl-n900`	`that's all, folks! Test complete.`
`20:37.38`	`jatt`	`yes it's working I wasn't holding long enough, thanks guys`
`20:37.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sure, doing that all the time`
`20:37.49`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yw`
`20:38.09`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`20:38.13`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`20:38.26`	`*** join/#maemo lullos (~a@c-c96a72d5.02-137-736b651.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)`
`20:41.49`	`*** join/#maemo Gilly (~btw@about/essy/ilkimys/gilly)`
`20:42.23`	`*** join/#maemo jo-erlend (~Xixaq@15-188-8.connect.netcom.no)`
`20:42.29`	`*** part/#maemo jo-erlend (~Xixaq@15-188-8.connect.netcom.no)`
`20:42.30`	`*** join/#maemo skule (~svs@cpe.atm2-0-12843.arcnxx10.customer.tele.dk)`
`20:44.12`	`*** part/#maemo spenap (~simon@24.6.165.83.dynamic.mundo-r.com)`
`20:44.26`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B-N900 (~C-S-B@89.243.36.36)`
`20:46.37`	`Stskeeps`	`moo wazd2`
`20:46.59`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: heya :)`
`20:47.17`	`Stskeeps`	`how's it going?`
`20:48.08`	`*** join/#maemo hassanakevazir (~hassanake@CPE0021296837af-CM001ceacc8352.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`20:48.55`	`*** join/#maemo Flyser (~flyser@p4FDE6896.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`20:48.58`	`*** join/#maemo Flyser (~flyser@unaffiliated/flyser)`
`20:49.04`	`Arkenklo`	`that's odd, I installed an application and got .2 MB free space in /`
`20:49.29`	`*** join/#maemo FIQ (~FIQ@unaffiliated/fiq)`
`20:51.35`	`*** join/#maemo ZZzzZzzz (~ZZzzZzzz@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-11-40.w81-48.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
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`20:53.42`	`Kurppa_`	`You could try apt-get autoremove, but even that has a bug which prevents you from doing it if you have too little space.`
`20:53.52`	`Kurppa_`	`Free some up soon. I`
`20:54.17`	`Arkenklo`	`no I mean the free space increased by .2 MB`
`20:54.17`	`Kurppa_`	`'ve seen things getting truncated from /etc if there is too little space.`
`20:54.24`	`Kurppa_`	`Ah.`
`20:54.50`	`godrik`	`hi guys`
`20:55.09`	`Arkenklo`	`which is kinda odd, but I don't complain`
`20:55.10`	`godrik`	`does anybody know how to get a transparent window/widget ?`
`20:55.22`	`Kurppa_`	`Well, it's an on-the-fly compressing filesystem. Maybe that has something to do with it. Or maybe HAM did some cleanup.`
`20:55.33`	`godrik`	`I am writing a home pluging for diablo`
`20:55.39`	`jatt`	`so do apt-get and ipkg both work on the n900?`
`20:55.58`	`godrik`	`I ma using a gtktextview but that's not transparent and hide my backgronud`
`20:56.00`	`SpeedEvil`	`sync will free deleted space`
`20:56.01`	`godrik`	`any idea ?`
`20:56.08`	`jatt`	`which is the default package system?`
`20:58.20`	`*** join/#maemo visz (vis@irkki.fi)`
`20:58.50`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: well, FRUCT party time is over, back to work :)`
`21:00.12`	`Stskeeps`	`hehe`
`21:00.17`	`Stskeeps`	`any interesting events from there?`
`21:00.29`	`GAN900`	`WTF`
`21:00.41`	`GAN900`	`Off Topic just went waaay off into left field.`
`21:01.16`	`*** join/#maemo cyborg-one (99@85-238-111-176.broadband.tenet.odessa.ua)`
`21:01.25`	`Shapeshifter`	`mh. I feel there's something wrong with how my n900 camera takes pictures in the dark. they're totally green`
`21:01.33`	`Shapeshifter`	`and the preview isn't. just the picture taken`
`21:01.54`	`Shapeshifter`	`I tried other white balances but they're all green`
`21:02.11`	`*** join/#maemo Tuxprobe (~mschr@0x57397642.cpe.ge-1-1-0-1105.srnqu1.customer.tele.dk)`
`21:02.33`	`Shapeshifter`	`and way too dark. I think it's taking the picture not while the flash is on`
`21:02.39`	`Shapeshifter`	`exposure is a 0`
`21:03.09`	`joga`	`hmm..`
`21:03.41`	`joga`	`I started the phone app and at the same time opened the keyboard, now I can't click anything on the desktop`
`21:03.44`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: aeen that, but seemed to me to be fixed with pr1.1.1`
`21:04.37`	`joga`	`or, uh, I can click on a contact though`
`21:04.53`	`joga`	`but no shortcuts or widgets are working`
`21:05.58`	`joga`	`and things seem to break as I use them, I can access one thing once and then it doesn't open any more until I try again a bit later or something :)`
`21:06.22`	`*** join/#maemo Martiini (~martin@88-196-141-145-dsl.rpl.estpak.ee)`
`21:06.32`	`joga`	`is there some process I can kill or something?`
`21:07.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: also I can't reproduce the issue here`
`21:08.08`	`joga`	`what happens if I kill hildon-home or hildon-desktop, will they restart? :)`
`21:08.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: what I noticed though is: autofocus on <50cm is severely flawed by overexposure, in automatic mode. Works in macro mode`
`21:08.17`	`Kurppa_`	`Do you guys have the same problem as me? When I take pictures in dark with Camera, the top right corner of the image is bluish because the shiny border around the lens cover is reflecting the flash back to the lens?`
`21:08.55`	`Kurppa_`	`I'm just wondering if that's a hardware bug, or if it's just my device.`
`21:09.37`	`*** join/#maemo type_t (~markwire@c-98-228-74-254.hsd1.il.comcast.net)`
`21:09.47`	`Kurppa_`	`joga: I think hildon-home at least restarts. Killing hildon-desktop might reboot the device.`
`21:09.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Kurppa_: known issue. There's even a bug ticket for it iirc`
`21:09.57`	`*** join/#maemo Milhouse (~irc_milho@Maemo/community/contributor/Milhouse)`
`21:10.09`	`Kurppa_`	`Not 100 percent sure on the current implementation.`
`21:10.12`	`joga`	`Kurppa_: ok, let's see :)`
`21:10.14`	`Kurppa_`	`I see.`
`21:10.23`	`*** join/#maemo MrGoose (~cache@5ac51550.bb.sky.com)`
`21:10.24`	`Shapeshifter`	`Kurppa_: black marker can fix it`
`21:10.34`	`andre__`	`Kurppa_, yes. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8168`
`21:10.36`	`Shapeshifter`	`haven't tried it though as I don't really use the camera that often`
`21:10.36`	`povbot`	`Bug 8168: N900 photo quality is poor--particulary bad light handling`
`21:10.39`	`Kurppa_`	`Yeah, that's what I was thinking.`
`21:11.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`grabs the marker :-)`
`21:11.09`	`Kurppa_`	`Company phone though. Need to ask if I'm allowed to paint this thing :-)`
`21:11.32`	`joga`	`Kurppa_: hildon-home restarted and now shortcuts work, but apparently some widgets disappeared too :)`
`21:11.33`	`Kurppa_`	`Pink.`
`21:11.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`should fix it before it starts to get annoying`
`21:11.44`	`Kurppa_`	`They will come back.`
`21:11.47`	`Martiini`	`Does anyone from Nokia Finland ever come here ?? I want to ask them something`
`21:11.57`	`Kurppa_`	`Just pan the desktop, that might help.`
`21:12.08`	`Kurppa_`	`Martiini: yes.`
`21:12.23`	`*** join/#maemo flo_lap (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian)`
`21:12.26`	`*** join/#maemo frals (~frals@Maemo/community/contributor/frals)`
`21:12.35`	`joga`	`Kurppa_: nah, they're gone :) but that's ok, maybe they would be there if I rebooted`
`21:12.39`	`*** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@dhcp-128-194-74-49.resnet.tamu.edu)`
`21:12.44`	`SpeedEvil`	`!bug 6584`
`21:12.45`	`andre__`	`Martiini: but maybe anyone not from Nokia Finland might also know the answer?`
`21:12.45`	`povbot`	`Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6584 GPS geotagged pictures truncate precision of GPS reading (0 decimal places)`
`21:12.50`	`joga`	`or knew how to kick it..`
`21:12.53`	`Kurppa_`	`Yeah, reboot at least fixes things.`
`21:13.39`	`*** join/#maemo ZZzzZzzz (~ZZzzZzzz@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-11-40.w81-48.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`21:13.41`	`*** join/#maemo ZZzzZzzz_ (~ZZzzZzzz@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-11-40.w81-48.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`21:14.13`	`Martiini`	`just want to hear from Nokia people if they are going to release something like ... an iPhone with Android`
`21:14.37`	`joga`	`why would anyone do that? ;)`
`21:14.42`	`Kurppa_`	`There are Nokians lurking here, but many that know the answer to your problem might not be reading this channel at 23:14 (11 pm) on a saturday evening.`
`21:14.44`	`Martiini`	`cause ... n900 isnt even close to iphone .. and .. maemo is not as good as Android`
`21:14.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`Martiini, what do you mean?`
`21:14.54`	`joga`	`hehe`
`21:14.58`	`Stskeeps`	`Martiini: are you a troll? :P`
`21:15.08`	`*** join/#maemo T7g (~t7g@d14-69-127-101.try.wideopenwest.com)`
`21:15.10`	`Kurppa_`	`Or might not have the permission to answer that question :-)`
`21:15.16`	`Arkenklo`	`Martiini: they're not. Sorry to spoil it for ya`
`21:15.19`	`Martiini`	`I mean .. nokia phones suck and they need to up their game`
`21:15.34`	`ptl`	`wow.`
`21:15.35`	`joga`	`Martiini: how long have you used the n900?`
`21:15.39`	`Martiini`	`unless they intend to release somethig like .. iphone + android`
`21:15.49`	`*** join/#maemo Gary (gary@freenode/staff/colchester-lug.gary)`
`21:15.55`	`Kurppa_`	`Martiini: it's been like that for 10 years. Buy the new HTC phone.`
`21:15.56`	`ptl`	`wonders why is this troll still alive.`
`21:16.00`	`joga`	`:)`
`21:16.04`	`Martiini`	`I dont have an n900 and not going to buy one`
`21:16.05`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: how it looks taken with n900: http://stuff.moritzg.ch/20100327_011.jpg (WAY to dark and green), how it looks on the screen, while taking the picture: http://stuff.moritzg.ch/DSC09997.JPG (looks fine) and how it should look (taken with my sony pocket): http://stuff.moritzg.ch/DSC09992.JPG`
`21:16.12`	`*** join/#maemo hcarrega (~hcarrega@a85-139-128-194.cpe.netcabo.pt)`
`21:16.14`	`ptl`	`Martiini: well, goodbye then.`
`21:16.20`	`ptl`	`Martiini: or did you come here for trolling?`
`21:16.41`	`Shapeshifter`	`mhhhhhh`
`21:16.45`	`Shapeshifter`	`I think that's my finger there`
`21:16.49`	`Shapeshifter`	`>:(`
`21:17.03`	`Kurppa_`	`I agree with him though. Don't buy it if you don't want to hack your phone.`
`21:17.13`	`Shapeshifter`	`ah no it isnt`
`21:17.15`	`Shapeshifter`	`it's my mouse pad.`
`21:17.29`	`Kurppa_`	`If you just want a working phone, you can get it for much cheaper :-)`
`21:17.29`	`*** join/#maemo anotnac (~chatzilla@cpc2-dudl9-2-0-cust805.wolv.cable.virginmedia.com)`
`21:17.37`	`Shapeshifter`	`lol I was thinking I was just covering the flash. which would have explained the darkness. But I just redid the picture. it comes out green and dark.`
`21:17.57`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org)`
`21:18.01`	`*** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@ubuntu/member/warp10)`
`21:18.46`	`Arkenklo`	`I admire apple for being able to be so incredibly restrained with their products, I wouldn't stand making a product with so much unused potential`
`21:19.53`	`jatt`	`lol that guy comparing the n900 with the iphone`
`21:20.17`	`joga`	`Kurppa_: after reboot they weren't back, but I put them back again :)`
`21:20.23`	`Kurppa_`	`But it was supposed to be the iPhone killer!`
`21:20.27`	`*** join/#maemo Mysterious (~Jonas@c189099.adsl.hansenet.de)`
`21:20.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: ok, it took another few shots and can confirm now`
`21:20.40`	`Kurppa_`	`Ah. Reboot always seemed to fix it for me.`
`21:20.43`	`jatt`	`the ipad?`
`21:21.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`at least for macro, but I guess won't change for standard pics`
`21:21.10`	`joga`	`Kurppa_: maybe if I had rebooted before trying to fix it myself by killing it, it would have worked :)`
`21:21.31`	`DocScrutinizer`	`s/it/I`
`21:21.36`	`ptl`	`note to self: collect troll energy from this Martiini guy and after that go around iphone forums trolling back, spending the energy for the greater good.`
`21:22.07`	`Kurppa_`	`You'd just be increasing the misery in the world.`
`21:22.26`	`Arkenklo`	`Martiini: what's your favourite forum?`
`21:22.35`	`*** join/#maemo tbf (~mathias@86.56.57.78)`
`21:22.49`	`SpeedEvil`	`4chan, I guess.`
`21:22.57`	`ptl`	`MSDN`
`21:23.07`	`SpeedEvil`	`ponders 4chan browser app.`
`21:23.20`	`Arkenklo`	`message board =/ forum`
`21:23.22`	`Kurppa_`	`Maye he's a maemo fanatic posing as an apple fanatic and is trying to get a flame war started.`
`21:23.24`	`SpeedEvil`	`A scrolling desktop feed of /b/`
`21:23.32`	`*** join/#maemo Erod (~Juno@a88-114-175-238.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`21:23.32`	`*** join/#maemo Erod (~Juno@unaffiliated/erod)`
`21:23.53`	`Kurppa_`	`What am I saying.`
`21:23.54`	`ptl`	`Kurppa_: yeah, maybe he's trying to collect arguments to use elsewhere.`
`21:24.07`	`ptl`	`like I said... Troll energy`
`21:24.19`	`Arkenklo`	`SpeedEvil: or you could just create a forkbomb and get the same battery killing results :D`
`21:24.39`	`ptl`	`troll energy is what trolltech (now nokia) used to make QT and Maemo.`
`21:25.25`	`*** join/#maemo dmb (~dmb@unaffiliated/dmb)`
`21:25.40`	`jatt`	`does the maemo browser catch its results? it looks to me it fetches pages from the net everytime`
`21:25.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`incrdible. I haven't noticed any kick msg`
`21:25.54`	`jatt`	`i mean cache`
`21:26.02`	`jatt`	`not catch`
`21:26.10`	`dmj726_n9001`	`there is a cache size limit.`
`21:26.18`	`dmj726_n9001`	`so yes an no`
`21:26.31`	`dmj726_n9001`	`you can increase the cache size.`
`21:27.19`	`dmj726_n9001`	`I've heard the ideal size is 40 MB`
`21:27.57`	`jatt`	`when i go to the history and select the most recent entry it looks as the page is fetched again`
`21:28.12`	`*** join/#maemo adam___ (~adam@hypnos.fscker.com)`
`21:28.22`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: I couldn't even find an open bug report for this. I wonder if I should report it.`
`21:28.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`green img? sure`
`21:28.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'll confirm`
`21:29.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you already got good documentation to show`
`21:29.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`tbh without that I never had noticed, as I'm really not in photgraphy that much`
`21:29.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`now it's quite annoying`
`21:31.03`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: I rarely use the camera; for my needs it's waaay too bad. People are really excited about the image quality and it might be good "for a phone" but it's horrible imo. but stuff should at least be visible and bright and not green and dark ;)`
`21:31.04`	`Martiini`	`<PROTECTED>`
`21:31.15`	`Kurppa_`	`Can you link the bug here when you're done?`
`21:31.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wonders if the flash LEDs' colo temperature is maybe rising on flash, compared to torch mode`
`21:31.50`	`Martiini`	`so .. Maemo is based on Debian and you can "hack" it like any linux distro .. Anroid and Iphone get more development code`
`21:31.56`	`Martiini`	`am I right?`
`21:32.06`	`Martiini`	`Im correct`
`21:32.14`	`Kurppa_`	`Bingo.`
`21:32.24`	`dmj726_n9001`	`Andorid and ithing get more dedicated apps`
`21:32.26`	`Arkenklo`	`Martiini: the first part is correct, the second is irrelevant`
`21:32.37`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: ^^^ any thoughts?`
`21:32.40`	`jatt`	`the kernel has a development time of nearly decades`
`21:32.42`	`dmj726_n9001`	`n900 get linux apps in hours/days`
`21:33.00`	`jatt`	`maemo benefits from this`
`21:33.05`	`SpeedEvil`	`DocScrutinizer, not impossible`
`21:33.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`""white ballance done in torch mode doesn't fit for flashlight pictures""`
`21:35.03`	`Martiini`	`but .. one would not call n900+maemo "A PHONE" .. when you can call an iphone or HTC a "smartphone"`
`21:35.28`	`Martiini`	`thats what I try to sa`
`21:35.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SpeedEvil: My wild guess would be characteristics of the yellow flourescent change on higher energy pumping blue levels`
`21:35.39`	`dmj726_n9001`	`Let me know when firefox mobile with flash and ad block plus hits the app store for free.`
`21:35.39`	`Stskeeps`	`Martiini: talk.maemo.org sounds like a perfect place for oyu`
`21:35.40`	`Stskeeps`	`:P`
`21:36.21`	`Proteous`	`I just correct my n900 pictures in photoshop`
`21:36.25`	`Arkenklo`	`I view it as a computer with phone-like characteristics`
`21:36.44`	`Proteous`	`the flash sucks, but I rarily have lighting that is any good anyway`
`21:36.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Stskeeps: tmo/off_topic, to be precise`
`21:37.14`	`luke-jr`	`Martiini: no.`
`21:38.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`don't feed the troll!`
`21:38.15`	`luke-jr`	`Martiini: Debian and other such "distros" tend to be open source. Maemo is very much closed. Your description fits Mer and possibly MeeGo.`
`21:38.57`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9741`
`21:38.58`	`povbot`	`Bug 9741: Pictures taken with flash have wrong white balancing (green tint) and are too dark.`
`21:39.03`	`Kurppa_`	`If he's really from estonia, give him some credit. It's getting late there and it takes some dedication to come trolling late on saturday evening.`
`21:39.47`	`Kurppa_`	`I like the guy/gal already.`
`21:39.58`	`Stskeeps`	`he can stay if he brings cheap vodka`
`21:39.58`	`Stskeeps`	`:P`
`21:40.00`	`Stskeeps`	`;)`
`21:40.04`	`Proteous`	`heh`
`21:40.15`	`Kurppa_`	`It's all about the effort.`
`21:40.26`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@a88-115-20-77.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`21:40.28`	`*** join/#maemo pcfe (~pcfe@redhat/pcfe)`
`21:42.33`	`Martiini`	`luke-jr: so .. maemo should be open source instad? .. you claim maemo is not open source?`
`21:42.52`	`SpeedEvil`	`DocScrutinizer, yes, plausible`
`21:43.05`	`dmj726_n9001`	`maemo is 80 percent open source...`
`21:43.24`	`dmj726_n9001`	`not 100 percent`
`21:43.33`	`luke-jr`	`Martiini: Maemo is not open source. Fact.`
`21:43.36`	`luke-jr`	`dmj726_n9001: more like 40%`
`21:43.43`	`dmj726_n9001`	`really?`
`21:43.51`	`luke-jr`	`at least for N810/Maemo4`
`21:44.03`	`ali1234`	`even if it was only 1% it's still the 1% that you need to do anything`
`21:44.04`	`dmj726_n9001`	`I refer to fremantle`
`21:44.05`	`luke-jr`	`for now, I will need to defer to someone else as far as N900/Maemo5`
`21:44.09`	`luke-jr`	`ali1234: wrong`
`21:44.13`	`luke-jr`	`ali1234: it's the useless 1%`
`21:44.27`	`ali1234`	`luke-jr: you have a way to charge the battery without closed bins?`
`21:44.32`	`Kurppa_`	`Try getting source codes for any of the maemo 5 apps..`
`21:44.35`	`luke-jr`	`dmj726_n9001: I've heard Fremantle is more open, and I've heard it's more closed. not sure which is accurate.`
`21:44.36`	`Martiini`	`well .. whatever ... at least they have got a serious competitor in Android, iphoneOS, windows mobile etc`
`21:44.41`	`luke-jr`	`ali1234: nope.`
`21:44.47`	`ali1234`	`well then case in point`
`21:44.59`	`luke-jr`	`Martiini: where is the serious competitor? :(`
`21:45.04`	`luke-jr`	`ali1234: my point :p`
`21:45.14`	`dmj726_n9001`	`I heard more open...the gui layers of the apps and the drivers are closed.`
`21:45.28`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: well, same marketing dude came again :D`
`21:45.35`	`luke-jr`	`dmj726_n9001: what's more open then?`
`21:45.46`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: and told that nokia cares bout russian developers and stuff :D`
`21:45.56`	`jatt`	`martini works for apple?`
`21:45.57`	`Martiini`	`when Nokia deliver an iPhone style phone with qt5 linux .. I buy one .. most definately`
`21:46.10`	`dmj726_n9001`	`I think backends stuff`
`21:46.11`	`luke-jr`	`Martiini: iPhone style = crap`
`21:46.12`	`Shapeshifter`	`xD`
`21:46.20`	`luke-jr`	`dmj726_n9001: the drivers are all I care about tbh`
`21:46.21`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: I can feel that care with all my body actually :D`
`21:46.22`	`Shapeshifter`	`hilarious.`
`21:46.30`	`dmj726_n9001`	`like the media player backend is open but not the gui`
`21:46.39`	`Shapeshifter`	`iphone style, as in "can only run one app at a time"`
`21:46.50`	`jacekowski`	`luke-jr: drivers can be easily reversed`
`21:46.51`	`Martiini`	`as in design`
`21:46.54`	`*** join/#maemo GAN900 (~ryan@Maemo/community/contributor/GeneralAntilles)`
`21:46.56`	`dmj726_n9001`	`luke-jr...I want more driver open too`
`21:47.00`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: "easily"? no.`
`21:47.01`	`jacekowski`	`luke-jr: or at least made compatible with other kernels`
`21:47.10`	`ptl`	`the bad thing about all this is stablishing an iPhone as parameter.`
`21:47.20`	`univac`	`jacekowski: :o`
`21:47.20`	`ali1234`	`reversing BME would probably be quite easy, it's usespace isn't it?`
`21:47.23`	`ptl`	`it's like windows vs. linux when the parameter is linux. You just can't win.`
`21:47.28`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: we have complete code for a lot of N810 hardware, but it's still expensive to port Linux to it`
`21:47.31`	`ptl`	`N900 is different. It achieves other purposes.`
`21:47.38`	`ptl`	`much better purposes.`
`21:47.44`	`luke-jr`	`ali1234: BME is quite large.`
`21:47.48`	`ptl`	`and it's open, flexible, hackable.`
`21:47.49`	`jacekowski`	`it's still a phone`
`21:48.00`	`jacekowski`	`luke-jr: but that's userland`
`21:48.11`	`ali1234`	`so? it talks d-bus or whatever, it can be traced`
`21:48.15`	`jacekowski`	`luke-jr: and can be just moved to different OS easily`
`21:48.16`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: no, I'm referring to driver code`
`21:48.19`	`Stskeeps`	`wazd2: you're getting thinner? :P`
`21:48.39`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: "can be just moved" does not justify proprietary`
`21:49.10`	`Shapeshifter`	`wonders if the n900 will adjust the time tonight.`
`21:49.19`	`luke-jr`	`Shapeshifter: why would it?`
`21:49.28`	`luke-jr`	`daylight savings was like 2 weeks ago`
`21:49.28`	`Shapeshifter`	`luke-jr: because it knows my time zone`
`21:49.30`	`jacekowski`	`besides, unless i don't know something`
`21:49.30`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: yeah, and loosing hair :D`
`21:49.39`	`Shapeshifter`	`luke-jr: here it is tonight.`
`21:49.40`	`jacekowski`	`what's so complicated in BME`
`21:49.43`	`jacekowski`	`that it's huge`
`21:49.48`	`luke-jr`	`Shapeshifter: well, if it's half-sane, it uses UTC internally`
`21:49.50`	`*** join/#maemo Noobmonk3y_ (~Noobmonk3@212.183.140.100)`
`21:49.59`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: oh, and Forum.Nokia guy was hilarious`
`21:50.19`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: he spent 15 minutes describing all that ddp and stuff`
`21:50.46`	`*** join/#maemo GAN9001 (~ryan@248-35.187-72.tampabay.res.rr.com)`
`21:50.49`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: probably nothing`
`21:50.53`	`wazd2`	`Stskeeps: and then Vlad asked "You know that all that ddp magic doesn't actually work in Russia, right?"`
`21:51.08`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: if things were only as large as they needed to be, we could get by with Maemo in 16 MB RAM`
`21:51.26`	`ali1234`	`ha ha, xorg in 16mb, maybe 15 years ago...`
`21:51.39`	`jacekowski`	`well it's doing same thing`
`21:51.43`	`jacekowski`	`but using more memory`
`21:52.49`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: as memory gets cheaper, it's traded in for development time`
`21:52.59`	`luke-jr`	`more abstraction, higher-level languages, etc chew up memory`
`21:53.24`	`*** join/#maemo goshawk (~quassel@93-34-57-221.ip48.fastwebnet.it)`
`21:53.27`	`luke-jr`	`I reverse engineered a lot of N8x0 BMEs, but it's still huge :/`
`21:53.48`	`jacekowski`	`a lot?`
`21:54.06`	`jacekowski`	`define a lot in your case`
`21:54.38`	`luke-jr`	`I forget, lemme look quickly`
`21:54.46`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Hi all. I'm using the jabber conversations plugin to be available for facebook chat. Some of my contacts have jabber accounts attached to them, yet don't show as having any online/busy/etc status. How come?`
`21:55.04`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`And how do I fix this in time O(1) in the number of contacts? :)`
`21:55.26`	`*** join/#maemo Gadgetoid_mbp (~phil@cpc3-nrwh9-2-0-cust561.4-4.cable.virginmedia.com)`
`21:55.36`	`luke-jr`	`about 163 functions or so`
`21:56.08`	`jacekowski`	`and total for n8x0 is?`
`21:56.27`	`Kurppa_`	`jonaskoe1ker: do you know that they are in fact signed into facebook?`
`21:56.58`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: what do you mean? "Do you know that account number ${n} exists?"?`
`21:56.58`	`Kurppa_`	`And that the account is online?`
`21:57.24`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: I know that every account has _some_ online-ness status`
`21:57.38`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: I don't care what it is, I just want to see it in my contacts list`
`21:57.57`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: I know that people exist on facebook, because I've befriended them there`
`21:58.00`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: 527`
`21:58.09`	`Kurppa_`	`I mean that for the account entry to show the facebook chat option, the contact you're trying to chat with must be online.`
`21:58.36`	`Kurppa_`	`Maybe I misunderstood you though.`
`21:58.49`	`*** join/#maemo MohammadAG (~MohammadA@62.219.120.20)`
`21:59.48`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: you might have. I have my facebook friend "Alice" on my contacts list. There's no green circle, nor a white circle with a cross, nor anything else next to her name.`
`22:00.02`	`luke-jr`	`jacekowski: also, N800 and N810 have different BME binaries. I'm not 100% certain I noted the differences properly.`
`22:00.17`	`Kurppa_`	`I see. Is that on a N900?`
`22:00.26`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: ... but I've written her u[number]@chat.facebook.com thing onto her entry`
`22:00.30`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: apparently this has already been reported and will be fixed in 1.2`
`22:00.31`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: yep`
`22:00.55`	`luke-jr`	`"fixed in N920"`
`22:01.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lol`
`22:01.23`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`:)`
`22:01.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: you found a dup-ticket after crating yours? tztztzz`
`22:02.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Shapeshifter: number?`
`22:02.20`	`Kurppa_`	`jonaskoe1ker: alright. Then I don't know what's going on. It sounds like the facebook jabber account is not signed in, but if you can see the status for some people and not others, I'm baffled..`
`22:02.42`	`*** join/#maemo alecrim (~alecrim@189.2.128.130)`
`22:02.59`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`Kurppa_: you mean _I_ have to be logged on (with either jabber/facebook) to see statuses? Yeah, sure, I know that. I am`
`22:03.22`	`Kurppa_`	`Yup.`
`22:03.27`	`jacekowski`	`and they have to give you authorisation`
`22:03.34`	`jacekowski`	`for you to see their statuses`
`22:04.12`	`jacekowski`	`and as far as i know there is no way of requesting authorisation on n900`
`22:05.18`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`huh?`
`22:05.19`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7060 mine was already marked as a duplicate just now`
`22:05.20`	`povbot`	`Bug 7060: Sometimes photos are very green`
`22:05.32`	`DocScrutinizer`	`already there`
`22:05.38`	`Shapeshifter`	`DocScrutinizer: I DID search for a bug before posting mine, but searching for "green" or "dark" didn't do it ^^`
`22:05.49`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`jacekowski: I see _some_ online-nesses, and I haven't requested anything on my n900, except facebook friendship in the web browser`
`22:06.10`	`jacekowski`	`maybe it's treated in a same way`
`22:06.25`	`Kurppa_`	`jonaskoe1ker: sounds like some weird bug. Sorry I couldn't help.`
`22:07.24`	`Kurppa_`	`Or a feature I'm not familiar with..`
`22:08.44`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`I think Hermes is the (or at least _a_) culprit---the address book tends to get a lot of dupes when I run it`
`22:09.22`	`jonaskoe1ker`	`I notice (reading the source) that is uses the evolution address book. Is osso-abook something distinct from that? How do the two connect?`
`22:09.24`	`Kurppa_`	`Yup. You need to merge those dupes yourself.`
`22:09.28`	`*** join/#maemo GAN900 (~ryan@Maemo/community/contributor/GeneralAntilles)`
`22:09.50`	`Stskeeps`	`ah, lovely maemo once in a while`
`22:09.54`	`LiraNuna`	`will this help debugging why SmartReflex is crashing? https://gforge.ti.com/gf/project/omapkernel/wiki/?pagename=Power+Management`
`22:10.08`	`Stskeeps`	`SDK provides make 3.80. gcc requires make (>= 3.81)`
`22:10.58`	`*** join/#maemo Jax (~cptjack@5e06c1ef.bb.sky.com)`
`22:11.21`	`Kurppa_`	`Night folks.`
`22:12.10`	`ptl`	`pata pata pata pon.`
`22:13.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`LiraNuna: huh? SmartReflex(R) is crashing? o.O Pointer please`
`22:14.08`	`LiraNuna`	`DocScrutinizer, well, that's what bug reports are sating`
`22:14.11`	`LiraNuna`	`saying*`
`22:14.22`	`LiraNuna`	`I only enabled it yesterday`
`22:14.22`	`*** join/#maemo promulo (~romulo@189.71.32.4)`
`22:14.35`	`LiraNuna`	`https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7633`
`22:14.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you enabled what`
`22:14.36`	`povbot`	`Bug 7633: Enable SmartReflex on N900 by default`
`22:15.08`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B (~csb@89.243.36.36)`
`22:15.42`	`LiraNuna`	`I know my english is horrible, but I don't think I make no sense`
`22:19.04`	`*** join/#maemo elninja (~r@adsl-76-208-2-87.dsl.sbndin.sbcglobal.net)`
`22:19.37`	`Tobarja`	`does anyone know how to get python-sqlalchemy?`
`22:23.13`	`*** part/#maemo adisbladis (~user@92.244.27.51)`
`22:23.31`	`*** join/#maemo rhulad (~rhulad@188.72.255.192)`
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`22:29.05`	`*** join/#maemo N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil)`
`22:29.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmmm`
`22:30.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`LiraNuna: nah, you're perfectly reasonable`
`22:32.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`leaves me puzzled. Nobody seems interested in what this tweaking of a sysnode actually does in hardware. I honestly doubt all the posters to this ticket acually know`
`22:33.47`	`javispedro`	`"Sensors that adapt voltage dynamically in response to silicon processes and temperature variations. " (aka nothing)`
`22:34.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`SmartReflex to all my knowledge is a rather complex multilayered technology, and it's not quite sure which parts of it are affected by that sysnode tweaking`
`22:34.50`	`javispedro`	`from a commercial point of view it encompasses most of the omap power saving related features`
`22:34.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`javispedro: this part for sure isn't simply switched on/off via a sysnode`
`22:35.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`javispedro: yep`
`22:35.05`	`javispedro`	`DocScrutinizer: docs said it can be switched via i2c`
`22:35.48`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, parts of it, as far as the PMU aka GAIA aka TL4030 is concerned`
`22:35.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`my guess`
`22:36.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`adaptive LDOs`
`22:36.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or somesuch`
`22:36.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`the CPU bits for sure aren't switched via I2C, if at all`
`22:36.53`	`*** join/#maemo djdm (~deejaydee@195.80.4.93)`
`22:37.01`	`*** join/#maemo _Elwood_ (~elwood@unaffiliated/-elwood-/x-7688307)`
`22:37.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well the whole SmartReflex thing is TI IP and as far as it's software it's for sure closed source which Nokia can't disclose easily`
`22:39.25`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so... hard to debug`
`22:39.47`	`javispedro`	`... from reading at the driver behind that sysfs entry, seems to set some some memory mapped i/o regs`
`22:39.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and the batlife statements seem to me are mere handwaving`
`22:40.29`	`javispedro`	`at 0x480C9000`
`22:40.36`	`javispedro`	`device "SR1"`
`22:40.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`status register one? great`
`22:41.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`well, we need the tech ref manual for the OMAP SoC`
`22:41.36`	`N900evil`	`I know there was hundreds of pages in the omap datasheets on smartreflex.`
`22:41.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no other way to understand a little tiny bit of that shit`
`22:41.59`	`N900evil`	`I haven't read it closely though`
`22:42.02`	`javispedro`	`sr_vdd1_autocomp -> sr1, sr_vdd2_autocomp -> sr2`
`22:42.11`	`N900evil`	`the 3300 page one?`
`22:42.20`	`nidO`	`anyone (ideally in the uk) got 1 minute and mind lending a hand?`
`22:42.26`	`javispedro`	`was the 3430 leaked?`
`22:42.31`	`javispedro`	`s/3430/3430 manual`
`22:43.14`	`javispedro`	`(cause I saw someone linking to another model's manual... like if it hadn't "confidential" written all over the place)`
`22:43.31`	`N900evil`	`google spruf98`
`22:43.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`N900evil: yep, please :-D the whole 3k3 pages :-P`
`22:43.41`	`N900evil`	`nidO, ?`
`22:43.42`	`joga`	`hmm...too bad manage views doesn't allow reordering the desktops`
`22:43.52`	`javispedro`	`N900evil: "OMAP35xx"`
`22:44.05`	`joga`	`I seem to have put the two I use most separated from each other by another`
`22:44.08`	`joga`	`:)`
`22:44.15`	`nidO`	`N900evil - if you or anyone else could, go here, register, and vote: https://nationaltrust.uservoice.com/forums/45145-iphone-app-feedback-and-ideas-public-/suggestions/601935-app-for-other-platforms-too-?ref=title`
`22:44.17`	`N900evil`	`yes - it's not the individual part manual`
`22:44.47`	`nidO`	`or just vote, not sure if registration's actually needed`
`22:45.17`	`*** join/#maemo Noobmonk3y_ (~Noobmonk3@host86-179-231-209.range86-179.btcentralplus.com)`
`22:45.56`	`N900evil`	`Also. TI has a forum.`
`22:46.04`	`nidO`	`noobmonk3y you're responsible and in the uk, you'd help right`
`22:46.06`	`N900evil`	`With actual engineers`
`22:46.20`	`N900evil`	`nidO, what is this?`
`22:46.42`	`nidO`	`trying to get the national trust to recognise that crummy iphones arent the only smartphones that exist`
`22:48.50`	`joga`	`I installed screen and made a convenient shortcut for 'screen -RDU -s bash' if I want to have local persistence with terminal progs`
`22:50.16`	`*** join/#maemo dieb_ (~dieb_@enlightenment/developer/dieb)`
`22:50.47`	`*** join/#maemo type_t (~markwire@c-98-228-74-254.hsd1.il.comcast.net)`
`22:51.03`	`joga`	`apparently also needs bindkey -a -k fe stuff ^M in .screenrc for enter to work correctly in vim at least`
`22:52.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(smartreflex) anyway, to me it seems this whole tweaking won't cut it for mere standby time, and also it won't for massive datatransfer over wifi or even GSM. In the first case the CPU seems quite humble on its powerdemands, it the later cases there are other much more greedy consumers. It might have an impact on things like mp3-listening with screen off`
`22:53.15`	`*** join/#maemo hardaker (~hardaker@mail.hardakers.net)`
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`22:54.01`	`TomaszD`	`DocScrutinizer, > msg`
`22:54.30`	`Arif_`	`sneezes`
`22:55.48`	`*** join/#maemo C-S-B (~csb@89.243.36.36)`
`22:55.57`	`N900evil`	`DocScrutinizer, or reading books at low brightness.`
`22:56.30`	`Veggen`	`hmm. The n900 will know about DST automatically, no?`
`22:57.01`	`ShadowJK`	`yes`
`22:57.03`	`*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (~timeless@94.140.33.202)`
`22:57.03`	`*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (~timeless@firefox/developer/timeless)`
`22:57.14`	`Veggen`	`I use it as alarm, DST starts tonight, and I have a plane to catch tomorrow morning :)`
`22:57.31`	`ShadowJK`	`bangs head against desk trying to get something useful out of bme with gdb`
`22:57.33`	`Stskeeps`	`don't rely on only a n900 then`
`22:57.46`	`Veggen`	`nah.`
`22:58.05`	`ptl`	`Some countries don't have fixed dates for their DST, so the file containing it must be constantly updated. Is maemo prepared for this?`
`22:58.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`N900evil: reading books is a run-to-idle situation. Nothing for SmartReflex to help much`
`22:58.34`	`ShadowJK`	`as well as an other distro`
`22:58.44`	`ShadowJK`	`whether nokia will push timezone updates or not is another question :-)`
`22:59.17`	`ptl`	`My country just switched from a variable DST dates regime to a fixed one`
`22:59.45`	`ptl`	`ShadowJK: ubuntu is prepared for this, I think fedora too`
`22:59.52`	`Arif_`	`Lets just get rid of DST`
`22:59.52`	`Arif_`	`;(`
`22:59.55`	`ptl`	`it's constantly updating its timezones`
`22:59.56`	`N900evil`	`DocScrutinizer, IIRC it impadts having some functional units up, and some down.`
`22:59.58`	`ShadowJK`	`My guess would be that there'd be no timezone updates unless someone points out that it's wrong as is`
`23:00.13`	`ShadowJK`	`(if it's wrong)`
`23:00.19`	`range`	`Hmmm.`
`23:00.26`	`range`	`But tzdata gets constantly updated.`
`23:00.38`	`ptl`	`yes`
`23:00.51`	`range`	`When things change (the last ones were for the relatively short sighted chilenian updates after the earthquake)`
`23:01.08`	`range`	`They're not changing that package for fun :)`
`23:01.59`	`DocScrutinizer`	`N900evil: yep, but I doubt this functions will be disabled by that sysnode=0`
`23:02.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`otherwise the whole device wouldn't get a >24h standby`
`23:02.35`	`ShadowJK`	`iirc @nokia.com said it's not guaranteed to change stuff except shortly after boot?`
`23:03.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`in the ticket there was a comment WTTE`
`23:03.48`	`ShadowJK`	`anyway.. "I enabled smartreflex and the device crashed" is a bit of a "doctor doctor" type thing..`
`23:05.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yeah`
`23:06.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you'd bet if it was safe, Nokia would have enabled it. And they damn sure should know a bit more about it than we do`
`23:07.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lease notice I usually don't state such pro-closed-wisdom statements`
`23:08.05`	`LiraNuna`	`oh don't get me wrong - I never said SmartReflex is responsible for crashes`
`23:08.27`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but smartreflex is really fucking complicated and impossible to debug if you got not decent tools (hw tools) and a lot of devices to rip and mess with them, plus all the sources for SmartReflex sw drivers`
`23:08.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`LiraNuna: seems it is, though`
`23:09.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but only nokia knows exactly why, and what to do to fix it`
`23:10.07`	`*** join/#maemo Pvt_Ryan (~pvt_ryan@93-97-217-226.zone5.bethere.co.uk)`
`23:10.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`at least that's how I tend to see the situation. I'd love to stand corrected, and some smart guys work into that to a point where they tell Nokia how to fix it`
`23:10.35`	`ptl`	`maybe not even nokia, because the processor is OEM, isn't it?`
`23:10.50`	`ptl`	`hey buy it as a closed package`
`23:10.56`	`ptl`	`and use in their mobiles`
`23:10.59`	`ShadowJK`	`or they just thought "it crashes and it'll probably take months to debug this"`
`23:10.59`	`*** join/#maemo djdm (~deejaydee@212.183.140.16)`
`23:11.00`	`ShadowJK`	`:P`
`23:11.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`could be, yes`
`23:11.19`	`LiraNuna`	`DocScrutinizer, apparently the /sys/power triggers are given from TI's -omap kernel patches`
`23:11.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`yup, makes sense`
`23:11.48`	`LiraNuna`	`https://gforge.ti.com/gf/project/omapkernel/wiki/?pagename=Power+Management`
`23:12.37`	`ptl`	`hey, is it possible to get the frequencies of some Infrared Control using the regular N900 camera?`
`23:12.45`	`ptl`	`I've tested and it detects the infrared light.`
`23:13.02`	`ptl`	`I just don't know if it detects fast enough to get the frequencies...`
`23:14.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`LiraNuna: please don't think I'm rude, but I'm just fine with >48h of idle standby on GSM. And as soon as I use GPRS and do IRC or websurfing abroad, I know where the powerhogs are, and smartreflex won't fix that`
`23:15.31`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: N900evil and me discussed that "barcode interference approach" some weeks ago. Seems it might work`
`23:16.09`	`ptl`	`DocScrutinizer: where did you discuss that? tmo?`
`23:16.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`N900evil: i.e if you take a video, and place the IR TX diode directly to the camera lens, you might get all the info you need, from the resulting videofile`
`23:16.51`	`DocScrutinizer`	`here`
`23:17.27`	`N900evil`	`yes. especially if the shutter time is short`
`23:17.49`	`Arif_`	`doesn't IR equipment go way faster than 30FPS?`
`23:18.04`	`ptl`	`I dunno`
`23:18.16`	`*** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@dhcp-128-194-74-49.resnet.tamu.edu)`
`23:18.33`	`Arif_`	`still hasn't gotten QtIrrecco to work ={`
`23:18.33`	`ptl`	`but it seems low frequency`
`23:18.37`	`DocScrutinizer`	`Arif_: the idea is you get a barcode like interference with the "rolling shutter" of the cam`
`23:18.39`	`ptl`	`neither did I`
`23:18.50`	`nidO`	`qtirreco entirely depends on the remote that you choose`
`23:19.00`	`Arif_`	`I tried all three remotes in technotrend`
`23:19.04`	`nidO`	`the app itself works, but like 70-80% of the remotes are broken with it`
`23:19.06`	`Arif_`	`and neither work :D`
`23:19.46`	`ptl`	`Examination of LIRC datafiles shows the vast majority of remote handsets use 38 kHz.`
`23:19.55`	`nidO`	`btw`
`23:19.58`	`ptl`	`38 kHz? This would be impossible to detect`
`23:20.02`	`nidO`	`lend a hand and give a vote :D http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=48497`
`23:20.04`	`Arif_`	`so like`
`23:20.06`	`Arif_`	`3800 FPS? :P`
`23:20.12`	`ptl`	`30 fps (30 Hz) is the maximum, isn't it?`
`23:20.18`	`ptl`	`more like 38000 FPS`
`23:20.22`	`ptl`	`actually`
`23:20.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: you got a carrier of 32..42KHz, which is 100% on/off modulated by a 20..100baud 'serial' data stream`
`23:20.39`	`ptl`	`it would have to be double the frequency to detect the signal, 76000fps`
`23:20.54`	`ptl`	`hmm`
`23:20.58`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heh guys! you seen my comment above???`
`23:21.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`the idea is you get a barcode like interference with the "rolling shutter" of the cam`
`23:21.14`	`ptl`	`DocScrutinizer: so you'd actually assume, say, 38 kHz and use whatever on/off (larger pattern) you detect there?`
`23:22.07`	`Arif_`	`you could try finding a camera that shoots 76000 pictures in one second too`
`23:22.11`	`*** join/#maemo crashanddie (~slauwers@Maemo/community/contributor/crashanddie)`
`23:22.30`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: depends on what you actually can get from such a video. standard video format is 16K lines/s`
`23:22.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`each line may consist of marks and spaces`
`23:23.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`two marks and spaces / line make a carrier of 32KHz`
`23:23.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`get the picture?`
`23:23.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(muhaha what a pun)`
`23:24.38`	`ptl`	`not really... Or is there a way to concentrate the optical chip on such lines and making it refresh the same spot every time?`
`23:24.49`	`Arif_`	`offers DocScrutinizer a job in anime translations`
`23:25.10`	`N900evil`	`probably, but there isn't a datasheet`
`23:25.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`my english here is anime t10n enough ;-P`
`23:25.58`	`*** join/#maemo TheAppleMan (~quassel@cpc1-warw12-2-0-cust79.3-2.cable.virginmedia.com)`
`23:25.58`	`*** join/#maemo TheAppleMan (~quassel@funtoo/contributor/theappleman)`
`23:26.11`	`Arif_`	`I'm really impressed how they made 250*20 minutes of puns for YuGiOh...:P`
`23:26.45`	`ptl`	`new stupid topic on tmo, how to get a girl into bed using N900`
`23:26.46`	`ptl`	`lol`
`23:26.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: depending on the way the cam chip reads out its pixels, you might have a timeskew of 1s/fps/lines/dots-per-line`
`23:27.05`	`*** join/#maemo spectre- (~n900@41.210.191.7)`
`23:27.07`	`Arif_`	`ptl, there was a topic about sharing pr0n made with the N900`
`23:27.08`	`Arif_`	`XD`
`23:27.20`	`ptl`	`(I'm "Patola" on tmo)`
`23:27.30`	`ptl`	`yeah`
`23:27.33`	`ptl`	`I did some posts there`
`23:27.33`	`ptl`	`in the end there was no shared pr0n`
`23:27.37`	`Arif_`	`doubts a black brick can get a girl into bed`
`23:27.45`	`ptl`	`only some (dressed) boobs and some ass.`
`23:27.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`if the IR TX iluminates the whole sensor same time, the readout of the sensor pixels is a timeline graph of the brightness`
`23:28.14`	`Arif_`	`ptl, aww...there's more to see outside...`
`23:28.53`	`ptl`	`what about using the proximity sensor to detect the IR? :P It detects light, isn't it?`
`23:29.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(timeskew) 1/(50fps * 600dpl * 512lines_per_frame)`
`23:29.07`	`ptl`	`you'd have to have a very dark room, I think`
`23:29.29`	`ptl`	`(obs.: this was a joke)`
`23:30.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: the prox chip has some logic aiui which probably does debouncing, maybe even filtering and one probe each 500ms, idling the remaining 499,9ms`
`23:31.34`	`*** join/#maemo mattedm (~mattedm@s204-191-119-183.ab.hsia.telus.net)`
`23:32.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: nota bene the prox chip is an active chip which emits IR and detects the reflected light. It won't do that all the time`
`23:33.13`	`*** join/#maemo vanadismobile (~user@gprs03.swisscom-mobile.ch)`
`23:33.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(all time) means it'll do a active/idle cycle with very short active time, otherwise power consimption is too high`
`23:33.53`	`ptl`	`i imagined something like that`
`23:34.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and from schematics it seems to me the chip does that autonomously, not under cpu control`
`23:34.28`	`ptl`	`ok, ok... next try, the lux detector?`
`23:34.49`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no way. has builtin logic and A/D converters`
`23:34.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`slooooow`
`23:35.56`	`*** join/#maemo aSIMULAtor (~me@dsl-hkibrasgw2-fef7de00-17.dhcp.inet.fi)`
`23:36.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and before you ask, the camslider detector is probably the same as the prox`
`23:37.42`	`ptl`	`I didn't even know the camslider detector was optical`
`23:37.46`	`ptl`	`I thought it was mechanical`
`23:37.57`	`ptl`	`ooops`
`23:37.58`	`ptl`	`never mind.`
`23:38.04`	`ptl`	`confused camslider with keyboard slide.`
`23:38.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`but I did a video holding a IR-remote directly to the cam, and I got stillvideo pics showing a light/dark/light bar pattern representing the 75baud data at least`
`23:40.05`	`DocScrutinizer`	`zooming in might reveal more detail in the light bars indicating the carrier frequency`
`23:40.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`if not, just use the raw data and try with your appliance, with different carriers until you succeed to control it`
`23:40.50`	`ptl`	`hmmm... that seems good. Is there any such program for other mobiles (iPhone, android etc.)?`
`23:41.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`not that I've ever heard of`
`23:41.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`heh, every once in a while I got a own genuine thought`
`23:42.48`	`ptl`	`which resolution did you use on your video?`
`23:43.03`	`ptl`	`(supposing you can choose. I haven't filmed with the N900 yet)`
`23:43.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`lol, no idea. is there so much choice?`
`23:43.14`	`ptl`	`For better framerates, should I choose lower resolutions?`
`23:43.16`	`*** join/#maemo adisbladis (~user@92.244.27.51)`
`23:43.23`	`*** part/#maemo hd1 (~hdiwan@c-76-126-175-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`23:43.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I'd think I haven't used any zoom-in`
`23:43.46`	`DocScrutinizer`	`which might be worth a try`
`23:44.00`	`adisbladis`	`Is there any app that acts as a launcher for external shellscripts? I have written a shellscript i want a launcher for on the desktop but i cant figure out how`
`23:44.11`	`adisbladis`	`N900 that is`
`23:44.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`err, what? cmdline execution widget?`
`23:44.36`	`ptl`	`desktop commander execution`
`23:44.40`	`ptl`	`queen beecon widget`
`23:44.46`	`adisbladis`	`DocScrutinizer: Exactly`
`23:44.49`	`ptl`	`*desktop command execution`
`23:44.56`	`ptl`	`these two do the job`
`23:45.03`	`ptl`	`queen beecon widget is a fork of DCE with more features.`
`23:45.09`	`adisbladis`	`Thanks =)`
`23:45.25`	`ptl`	`yw`
`23:46.17`	`DocScrutinizer`	`methinks, it's called "Commadline Execution Widget" pkg. bah, nevermind`
`23:46.24`	`ptl`	`You might want to check the thread for queen beecon widget on tmo (talk.maemo.org)`
`23:46.37`	`ptl`	`desktop-cmd-exec - Results of custom commands in your desktop.`
`23:46.52`	`ptl`	`but I prefer queen beecon widget`
`23:46.53`	`ptl`	`:P`
`23:47.00`	`ptl`	`it's fancier`
`23:47.37`	`adisbladis`	`Hum.. That wasnt quite what i wanted..`
`23:47.39`	`ptl`	`I just wish beacon was written correctly.`
`23:47.54`	`ptl`	`then what do you want?`
`23:47.57`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ok, Desktop Command Execution Widget`
`23:48.49`	`adisbladis`	`I wanted something to create a button for launching applications`
`23:48.50`	`_llll_`	`fancier how?`
`23:48.57`	`adisbladis`	`Not displaying their output`
`23:49.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`adisbladis: that's exactly Desktop Cmd Exec Widget. See option "execute cmd on click"`
`23:50.14`	`DocScrutinizer`	`adisbladis: if your cmd has no output, none will be displayed`
`23:50.15`	`lardman`	`night all`
`23:50.20`	`*** join/#maemo GAN900 (~ryan@Maemo/community/contributor/GeneralAntilles)`
`23:50.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`adisbladis: you can have arbitrary string for a label`
`23:50.45`	`DocScrutinizer`	`and you can configure hight/width`
`23:50.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`of the "button"`
`23:51.25`	`ptl`	`queen beecon too`
`23:51.32`	`ptl`	`you can also configure a nice icon for it`
`23:51.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`aaaah, DCEW can't do the icon stuff`
`23:53.35`	`adisbladis`	`Now i just got to complete my scrip to actually test it ;)`
`23:54.01`	`C-S-B-N900`	`hey DocScrutinizer`
`23:54.08`	`C-S-B-N900`	`how are you.`
`23:54.27`	`C-S-B-N900`	`i now have a very small scratch on the screen...`
`23:54.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`pissed by my own laziness`
`23:54.39`	`C-S-B-N900`	`its bugging me.`
`23:54.53`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ouch`
`23:55.21`	`ptl`	`there's a thread on tmo about spare parts for the n900`
`23:55.25`	`C-S-B-N900`	`its only visible in a certain light at a certain angle`
`23:55.30`	`ptl`	`or maybe if you get a screen protector it will make the scratch invisible`
`23:55.37`	`C-S-B-N900`	`but im anal.`
`23:56.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`ptl: (invisible) I was going to propose that`
`23:56.49`	`C-S-B-N900`	`i think im going to get the lifetime out of this screen, then replace the screen after.`
`23:57.10`	`C-S-B-N900`	`i think replacing it will invite dust which is even worse.`
`23:57.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`for the spare parts I'm really sad, as I missed my qwerty keyboard for one day. When I finally made it to get creditcard, it wasn't availÃ¶able any longer`
`23:57.54`	`C-S-B-N900`	`whats wrong with your kba.`
`23:58.02`	`C-S-B-N900`	`a=?`
`23:58.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`german layout. up/down are blue`
`23:58.17`	`C-S-B-N900`	`whya.`
`23:58.23`	`C-S-B-N900`	`oh crap.`
`23:58.56`	`C-S-B-N900`	`and what is wrong with blue up and down arrows?`
`23:59.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`drives me nuts. and I'm sure I used the Ã¤Ã¶Ã¼ for less than 5 keypresses each`
`23:59.39`	`*** join/#maemo ReadyKilowatt (~eric@c-24-8-103-185.hsd1.co.comcast.net)`
`23:59.39`	`C-S-B-N900`	`am i to assume you are german?`
`23:59.40`	`*** join/#maemo lbt (~david@Maemo/community/contributor/lbt)`

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