| 00:00.16 | pupnik | javispedro: personally i only have psx memories and cds |
| 00:00.52 | javispedro | pupnik: hehe, np. I don't have psx memories at all so I understand :) |
| 00:02.10 | *** part/#maemo ceronman (~ceronman@190.9.233.95) |
| 00:02.40 | pupnik | atari 2600 for me man. intellivision. commodore pet. apple ii |
| 00:03.33 | *** join/#maemo noobmonk3y (~me@host86-180-21-173.range86-180.btcentralplus.com) |
| 00:03.36 | noobmonk3y | waves |
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| 00:15.41 | ds3 | why is it I am not convinced vncviewer is available for the N900 - http://maemo.org/downloads/Maemo5/network/ |
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| 00:17.23 | noobmonk3y | ? |
| 00:17.29 | noobmonk3y | got it working on mine |
| 00:17.43 | ds3 | take a look at the picture |
| 00:17.49 | noobmonk3y | lol |
| 00:17.54 | noobmonk3y | yeah twas never updated lol |
| 00:19.12 | ds3 | I wonder... is there a way to get the builtin web browser to use a socks proxy? |
| 00:20.07 | noobmonk3y | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=38726&highlight=microb+socks |
| 00:20.14 | noobmonk3y | dont think it is but check that thread :D |
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| 00:31.16 | RiotNOR | ss. |
| 00:31.29 | RiotNOR | good evening |
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| 01:38.46 | ds3 | is there a way to compact the talk.maemo.org pages? each post is taking up way too much room |
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| 01:49.01 | cedar | hi all |
| 01:50.08 | Lumpio- | ds3: User stylesheets |
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| 01:52.43 | ptl | what is this package "ansela"? |
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| 02:16.38 | ebzzry | Is there a way to ssh into an n900 as the user "user"? |
| 02:16.58 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 02:17.10 | ebzzry | SpeedEvil: What is the password? |
| 02:17.17 | SpeedEvil | you need to at least setup ~/.ssh/authorised_keys and stuff |
| 02:17.20 | SpeedEvil | or set a password |
| 02:17.39 | ebzzry | SpeedEvil: So, by default, there is no password for the user user? |
| 02:17.58 | tank-man | most likely |
| 02:18.05 | ebzzry | What are the implications of setting a password for the user "user"? |
| 02:18.40 | ebzzry | Do any of the packages on that machine depend on the user "user" being passwordless? |
| 02:19.01 | SpeedEvil | everything works after I did it |
| 02:19.13 | tank-man | i have a n800 and boot up is normal with a passwrd |
| 02:19.30 | ebzzry | Hmm. That's good to know. |
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| 02:23.22 | ebzzry | SpeedEvil: authorized_keys |
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| 02:46.16 | Emzzzz | http://imggmi.info/DSC-1268361587.jpg/ do my tits look big? |
| 02:46.18 | *** part/#maemo Emzzzz (~Emzzzz@pa58-109-217-87.pa.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 02:54.36 | uhsf | i just learned about kde plasma netbook interface, it seems to be what i need for my micropc, have you tried it? |
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| 03:20.33 | crashanddie | OMFG |
| 03:20.39 | crashanddie | lardman isn't on the front page anymore! |
| 03:20.40 | crashanddie | TWICE |
| 03:20.56 | crashanddie | 3 TIMES |
| 03:21.08 | crashanddie | THE WORLD IS GOING TO END |
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| 05:22.10 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo | http://maemo.org/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ | Please join #meego for MeeGo related questions | http://www.maemoit.org/extra/lapide.jpg | http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.1.1 |
| 05:23.32 | pupnik | Cheese for me. Got that happy effect. |
| 05:30.40 | *** join/#maemo DocScrutinizer (~jr@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
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| 05:39.48 | slackmagic | loves his n900 :D |
| 05:40.26 | TigerTael | Welcome to my club. |
| 05:40.35 | TigerTael | Unfortunately, there is a subscription charge. |
| 05:40.44 | lucent | har. |
| 05:40.45 | TigerTael | Which can easily be sent over paypal or snail mail. |
| 05:40.56 | lucent | my rootfs is filling up so fast :( |
| 05:41.11 | slackmagic | http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/5628/booyal.jpg , pidgin runs just fine when transferring $HOME/.purple/ over to the n900 from a workstation for example |
| 05:41.37 | slackmagic | TigerTael: ;) hey that was my idea! lol |
| 05:41.54 | TigerTael | slackmagic, hehe, soz. |
| 05:42.10 | TigerTael | There is one thing I do find with the N900 community on the forums, everyone is so agro. |
| 05:42.33 | slackmagic | agro? |
| 05:42.33 | lucent | TigerTael: yeah, zealots |
| 05:42.39 | lucent | aggressive pigs |
| 05:42.51 | lucent | that's not just N900 but really any phone community I've seen |
| 05:43.12 | TigerTael | lucent, I agree to an extent, but the talk forums are... quite bad. |
| 05:43.15 | lucent | regular linux zealots see it and it's like "Okay, Go!" for them to jump in |
| 05:43.28 | TigerTael | I mean, I reversed the kernel source for my HTC Magic on Android... |
| 05:43.41 | TigerTael | I generally found people to be quite mellow and supportive. |
| 05:44.04 | TigerTael | Looking on the talk forums, all I see is people cussing and arguing. |
| 05:45.07 | slackmagic | TigerTael: there'll always be bad apples in a basket. Can't make everyone happy unfortunately. Just ignore 'em. Works for me :D |
| 05:46.00 | lucent | the Flashlight applet is impossible to use when I need it |
| 05:46.12 | slackmagic | lucent: how so? |
| 05:46.15 | lucent | anyone else find it useful, but too annoying to activate to be useful? |
| 05:46.28 | slackmagic | lucent: sort of agree there |
| 05:46.49 | lucent | the current behavior is to check for camera in use and bail out if camera is being used |
| 05:47.15 | lucent | so you can't record video with flashlight on... since the last minor revision or so |
| 05:47.32 | lucent | the other thing is you can't just turn on the flashlight, you have to fumble around to close the camera app |
| 05:47.35 | *** join/#maemo talani (~lynn@89.204.247.59) |
| 05:47.36 | Arkenoi | i rather want flashlight to block camera app from launching |
| 05:47.42 | lucent | yeah. |
| 05:47.49 | lucent | how would that work though? |
| 05:47.59 | TigerTael | slackmagic, yeah. |
| 05:48.17 | lucent | what's that widget called with all the status indicators |
| 05:48.52 | lucent | when you tap it a dialog appears with "Battery / (Sound) [ | ]" and a bunch of things like "Clock & Alarms" "Profile" "Internet Connection" |
| 05:49.08 | lucent | how would you possibly detect if the user has that dialog opened? |
| 05:49.52 | lucent | my thinking is *if* the user has that dialog opened, and the lens cover is opened, default to activating the flashlight right then and there. |
| 05:50.58 | *** join/#maemo Ordog_by (~quassel@195.222.85.152) |
| 05:51.11 | Arkenoi | lucent: sounds reasonable |
| 05:51.47 | lucent | Okay. Question remains, what is that "dialog" I mentioned called in a technical term, and how to detect if it is on screen? |
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| 05:56.47 | slackmagic | lucent: statusbar perhaps? |
| 05:57.18 | lucent | okay what happens when you tap the statusbar... the _______ dialog appears ? |
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| 06:05.58 | ebzzry2 | One of the first things I learned when I got my N900 is too keep a close look on rootfs. |
| 06:07.08 | *** join/#maemo Dassu (haikion@amadeus.cc.tut.fi) |
| 06:07.55 | TigerTael | Forgive my noob-ality... but how do I do that? ;p |
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| 06:09.12 | lucent | TigerTael: ctrl+shift+x for terminal, then type in du -sh |
| 06:09.15 | ebzzry2 | Do apps really tend to put stuff in /? |
| 06:09.23 | lucent | the "du -sh" command is how I invoke it anyways |
| 06:09.31 | lucent | it shows a human readable size of mounted filesystems |
| 06:09.40 | lucent | you could do "du -sh /" to be more clear |
| 06:09.42 | Dassu | Should the default player support video through the UpNp? |
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| 06:10.06 | *** join/#maemo dottedmag (~dottedmag@altlinux/developer/dottedmag) |
| 06:11.29 | ebzzry2 | Does anyone find himself in the situation? |
| 06:11.32 | Dassu | I can hear the sound but I can see only the first frame |
| 06:12.15 | ebzzry2 | similar* |
| 06:12.21 | lucent | ebzzry2: a lot of the Ovi store crap made by OffScreen puts their steaming piles in / |
| 06:12.36 | lucent | ...where it festers, forever. |
| 06:12.55 | ebzzry2 | lucent: forever? aww |
| 06:13.21 | lucent | not only that but if you have many repositories enabled for Apt / HAM then those caches take up lots of MB of space |
| 06:13.42 | ebzzry2 | hmm |
| 06:13.55 | lucent | there's not enough space allocated for rootfs if you are going to have the most commonly "developer" used catalogs enabled |
| 06:14.23 | ebzzry2 | what is the current ideal proposed solution so far? |
| 06:15.09 | lucent | re-flash, avoid installing crap. |
| 06:15.15 | lucent | it's not "ideal" |
| 06:16.03 | lucent | OMWeather should be "OMinousWeather" the way it requires confirmation that the user will reboot their device |
| 06:17.12 | ebzzry2 | I've been looking at the ad-hoc solutions posted on maemo. most, if not all are just kludges. What apps would you suggest to uninstall? |
| 06:18.43 | ebzzry2 | maemo.org* |
| 06:18.56 | lucent | "uninstall" is not possible |
| 06:19.00 | lucent | that's what I'm getting at |
| 06:19.20 | slackmagic | TigerTael: could always make an alias and do like df -h|awk '/rootfs/ {print $1 " has " $4 " free."}' |
| 06:19.22 | DocScrutinizer | wonders what kind of stupid spammer Emzzzz might be |
| 06:19.24 | lucent | apps that drag in clutter to rootfs can be uninstalled, but the dependencies are not auto-removed and remain on rootfs |
| 06:19.29 | lucent | so you're totally screwed by it. |
| 06:20.01 | lucent | usually there's tens of MB of libraries you just don't need |
| 06:20.18 | ebzzry2 | That doesn't sound so good. |
| 06:20.24 | *** join/#maemo forke (~forke@vpn.astaro.de) |
| 06:20.37 | lucent | no sensible way I could determine (after -HOURS- of hackery) to pick them out without high potential for damage |
| 06:21.13 | *** join/#maemo Terje1 (~Terje@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 06:21.37 | ebzzry2 | hmm |
| 06:26.46 | DocScrutinizer | TigerTael: cmdline widget, cmd: "df -h /" |
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| 06:30.04 | DocScrutinizer | lucent: I'm hoping for a move of /usr and /var to eMMC eventually |
| 06:30.26 | DocScrutinizer | similar to /home |
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| 06:46.35 | crashanddie | there's a script that analyses which packages use a lot of space on rootfs |
| 06:46.48 | crashanddie | and then moves them + symlink to free up memory |
| 06:46.54 | crashanddie | google around for it, zerojay wrote it |
| 06:46.56 | *** join/#maemo onion (~milang@tori.tal.org) |
| 06:47.44 | DocScrutinizer | crashanddie: I suggest /mode +b Emzz* |
| 06:48.02 | crashanddie | why? |
| 06:48.26 | DocScrutinizer | [2010-03-12 03:46:16] <Emzzzz> http://imggmi.info/DSC-1268361587.jpg/ do my tits look big? |
| 06:49.04 | DocScrutinizer | [openmoko] [2010-03-12 03:55:15] <Emzzzz> http://imggmi.info/DSC-1268362126.jpg/ do my tits look big? |
| 06:49.13 | crashanddie | hmm |
| 06:49.15 | *** mode/#maemo [+o crashanddie] by ChanServ |
| 06:49.20 | *** mode/#maemo [+r] by crashanddie |
| 06:49.28 | crashanddie | is it +r or +R? |
| 06:49.31 | crashanddie | can't remember |
| 06:49.39 | *** mode/#maemo [+q $~a] by crashanddie |
| 06:50.34 | DocScrutinizer | I'm not sure this will help |
| 06:52.06 | DocScrutinizer | looks like a real human advertising a fsck site |
| 06:52.35 | *** topic/#maemo by crashanddie -> Welcome to #maemo | http://maemo.org/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ | Can't talk? Register. Getting spammed? /mode YOURNICK +R | http://www.maemoit.org/extra/lapide.jpg | http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.1.1 |
| 06:52.58 | *** mode/#maemo [-r] by crashanddie |
| 06:53.01 | *** mode/#maemo [-o crashanddie] by ChanServ |
| 06:53.04 | crashanddie | that should do it |
| 06:53.05 | *** join/#maemo pajp (~rasmus@cs181240139.pp.htv.fi) |
| 06:54.35 | DocScrutinizer | +q $~a tends to annoy users as they can'T change their nicks while /join the chan |
| 06:55.20 | crashanddie | then register before joining? |
| 06:55.32 | crashanddie | Either we get spammers, or we get moaners |
| 06:55.40 | crashanddie | It's the lesser of two evils, really |
| 06:55.51 | luke-jr | concurs with identifying before joining |
| 06:56.29 | luke-jr | just put <username>:<password> in the 'server password' field |
| 06:56.39 | luke-jr | then it happens before you even set a nick :) |
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| 07:02.17 | *** join/#maemo Terje1 (~Terje@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 07:03.28 | DocScrutinizer | luke-jr: you'd be surprised how many even experienced users fail to understand that |
| 07:05.43 | DocScrutinizer | btw, (I have no join/quit msgs here, so can't tell for sure, but) I guess Emzzzz is a *real* user who might even register to spread his spam |
| 07:05.53 | *** join/#maemo mece (~mwikstro@mariehamn.abo.fi) |
| 07:07.14 | DocScrutinizer | ssince ircd7 we seen really no automated spam afaik. Freenode is doing an amazingly good job on that one |
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| 07:07.56 | mece | If i optimize a library I use /opt/lib/ as library path? |
| 07:08.08 | DocScrutinizer | optify? |
| 07:08.09 | *** join/#maemo ppenz (~ppenz@cm130-2.liwest.at) |
| 07:08.16 | mece | yes |
| 07:08.17 | mece | sorry |
| 07:08.19 | mece | optify |
| 07:09.08 | DocScrutinizer | no idea, I'd guess it looks about right |
| 07:09.13 | mece | ok. |
| 07:09.14 | mece | hm |
| 07:09.18 | DocScrutinizer | not really |
| 07:09.28 | mece | ? |
| 07:09.38 | DocScrutinizer | you have a link in /lib to /home/opt/lib |
| 07:09.52 | DocScrutinizer | and you use the correct libpath |
| 07:10.40 | DocScrutinizer | otherwise you package will break on non-optified systems |
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| 07:11.54 | DocScrutinizer | aiui the moving&symlinking is even done in a postinstall script |
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| 07:13.45 | DocScrutinizer | so your app executable and lib etc should be configured&built in a way agnostic of optification |
| 07:16.09 | DocScrutinizer | remember: |
| 07:16.15 | DocScrutinizer | ~optification |
| 07:16.16 | infobot | hmm... optification is a botch to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space |
| 07:16.41 | DocScrutinizer | and everybody hopes it'll vanish eventually |
| 07:17.17 | TigerTael | DocScrutinizer, I only have 65mb on rootfs. ;/ |
| 07:17.26 | mece | LOL |
| 07:17.28 | DocScrutinizer | happy you |
| 07:17.33 | mece | "only" |
| 07:17.34 | mece | hahaha |
| 07:17.37 | TigerTael | only... |
| 07:17.40 | mece | I have 19Mb |
| 07:17.47 | DocScrutinizer | 25 here |
| 07:17.50 | TigerTael | ;/ |
| 07:17.57 | mece | TigerTael, you're doing it wrong :P |
| 07:18.08 | TigerTael | What am I doing wrong? :P |
| 07:18.18 | mece | you have too much free rootfs |
| 07:18.22 | DocScrutinizer | yesterday when enabling debian-built-for-maemo repo it dropped to 3.7 temporarily |
| 07:18.24 | mece | could be harmful |
| 07:18.38 | mece | that's a big repo |
| 07:18.40 | mece | apparently |
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| 07:18.43 | TigerTael | hahahaha |
| 07:18.44 | DocScrutinizer | yep |
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| 07:19.03 | lucent | 33.1M free on rootfs here |
| 07:19.05 | TigerTael | Too much free space. |
| 07:19.15 | mece | so anyway... compiled Glest, and it compiled and ran without a hich in sdk. Amazing stuff. |
| 07:19.16 | DocScrutinizer | luckily after I disabled it I was back to 25MB free |
| 07:19.44 | mece | compiling to arm now. I hope it works on the phone. |
| 07:20.02 | DocScrutinizer | what's glest? |
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| 07:20.53 | mece | http://glest.org/en/gallery-screenshots.php |
| 07:21.26 | lucent | holy mother of freedom |
| 07:21.31 | lucent | is Glest MMO? |
| 07:23.06 | Corsac | mece: it seems that it will only work on little endian machines |
| 07:23.11 | TigerTael | Dammit, I -hate- adhoc. |
| 07:23.42 | DocScrutinizer | mece: ""The Autobuilder supports automatic optification of submitted packages via maemo-optify. It is triggered by the file "debian/optify", as described in the README."" http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs |
| 07:23.52 | mece | ok coo.. |
| 07:23.54 | mece | l |
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| 07:25.54 | mece | arm is bi-endian |
| 07:25.58 | mece | afaik |
| 07:26.05 | mece | cd .. |
| 07:26.07 | mece | doh |
| 07:26.24 | DocScrutinizer | rm -rf / |
| 07:26.40 | mece | nownow? |
| 07:26.53 | TigerTael | dammit, firewall blocking my shared wifi connection. ;/ |
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| 07:28.32 | Corsac | mece: it won't run two endianness concurrently though |
| 07:28.55 | mece | righty |
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| 07:32.20 | crashanddie | oh man what a day |
| 07:32.24 | DocScrutinizer | quite obviously an app having endianness issues with anything but raw framebuffer / audio / other hw drivers (there shouldn't be any outside kernel) is really poor programming style |
| 07:33.35 | arachnist | DocScrutinizer: say that to rrdtool developers |
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| 07:35.00 | mece | hmm so sdk doesn't emulate endianness? |
| 07:35.08 | crashanddie | 8AM, go to hostpital to get checked out, 930, go to doctor from a few days ago to pay a due, 10am, go to storage facility to get a unit, 11am go pick up dry cleaning, 1200, take care of laundry, 1300 start packing, 1400 go to office to print out travel documents, 1600, get back to hotel, finish packing up, organise what will stay and come with, 1700, go drop off boxes at storage unit. 1730, ready for takeoff xD |
| 07:35.23 | arachnist | mece: arm is mostly little endian nowadays |
| 07:35.28 | DocScrutinizer | not knowing rrdtool nor the coders, do you really think they might consider they're idiots when I tell them but they weren't able to realize by themselves? |
| 07:35.30 | arachnist | mece: so are x86 PCs |
| 07:35.34 | mece | oh... so.. |
| 07:35.35 | mece | hm |
| 07:35.38 | tigert | hmm |
| 07:35.41 | mece | the endianness shouldn't be a problem |
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| 07:41.14 | mece | why the frak does libglut3-dev depend on xlibmesa in arm but not in x86?? |
| 07:41.37 | mece | err freeglut3-dev I mean |
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| 07:42.44 | mece | curiously enough freeglut3-dbg works fine in both |
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| 07:54.49 | crashanddie | ~ping |
| 07:54.50 | infobot | ~pong |
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| 08:00.57 | TigerTael | ~ding |
| 08:00.57 | infobot | dong |
| 08:01.02 | TigerTael | lol |
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| 08:33.26 | mece | hmm I wonder if libgl-dev didn't come along from the beta version of maemo5 sdk because it's still beta? |
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| 08:37.30 | TigerTael | Guys, is it wiser to use the SDK virtual image or just install a new Ubuntu and start installing the SDK from scratch? |
| 08:37.35 | *** join/#maemo yigal (~yigal@udp290487uds.hawaiiantel.net) |
| 08:37.46 | TigerTael | Because the virtual image seems a bit messed up. ;/ |
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| 08:39.29 | TigerTael | I think I just answered my own question. |
| 08:39.39 | yigal | I just installed easy-debian but I want to increase the size of the image, and I've forgotten what commands do I need to use to do this? resize2fs? etc. ty |
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| 08:42.53 | yigal | found it, http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showpost.php?p=419501&postcount=28 |
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| 08:44.59 | noobmonk3y | aghhhhhhhhhhh really cant be bothered with work today |
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| 08:47.05 | tybollt | awesome |
| 08:47.11 | tybollt | I'll try that w/ my boss |
| 08:47.17 | sobczyk | is there some daemon for rotating the screen on n900? rotate sometimes stops working on my cellphone in all apps |
| 08:47.19 | tybollt | :D |
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| 08:51.32 | Dassu | sobczyk: rotate.py |
| 08:52.04 | Dassu | just search the forums. |
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| 08:53.39 | Funnyface | ok I see how the USB jack of the N900 is made now, and I notice that it requires a lot of force to plug it in and remove it that will eventually wear the socket out, so what are the suggestions to fixing it? squeezing those 2 notches that hold the plug in place? |
| 08:55.26 | DocScrutinizer | TigerTael: well, if you can live with Ubuntu... |
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| 08:56.56 | DocScrutinizer | Funnyface: be carefull with insering/retracting, do *not* mess with the plugs or receptacle, and it will become more gentle eventually |
| 08:57.38 | TigerTael | DocScrutinizer, I'm not sure I can. |
| 08:57.45 | tybollt | DocScrutinizer: You know they said the same about my wife... she never came more gentle w/ time... in fact it got worse! :( |
| 08:57.54 | TigerTael | I think perhaps I should download a new Debian distro. |
| 08:57.59 | TigerTael | Because ubuntu pisses me off. |
| 08:58.02 | DocScrutinizer | tybollt: LOL |
| 08:58.40 | TigerTael | DocScrutinizer, I filed down the teeth/legs on the cable/charger, happy with the results. |
| 08:59.52 | DocScrutinizer | TigerTael: strongly deprecated (but that's only me doing so), as it may introduce all sorts of problems, *including* excessive wear |
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| 09:01.06 | TigerTael | Only question I have as far as the distro goes, 32bit or can I go 64bit? |
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| 09:02.53 | TigerTael | I mean, there shouldn't be a problem if I'm using 64bit right? |
| 09:02.59 | sobczyk | one more thing, I was trying out mscim, uninstalled it and now I can't activate virtual keyboard (alt sym) nor the shift/alt are toggling is there a way to fix it? |
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| 09:04.42 | TigerTael | dammit |
| 09:04.57 | TigerTael | Did anyone answer in regards to 64bit? |
| 09:05.11 | sobczyk | no |
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| 09:06.40 | DocScrutinizer | http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/SDK#Installing_Maemo_5_SDK_on_Fedora_12_x86_64 |
| 09:08.18 | TigerTael | Well, I'm more thinking along the lines of debian x64... |
| 09:08.46 | DocScrutinizer | do you think it's that much of a difference |
| 09:08.48 | DocScrutinizer | ? |
| 09:09.24 | TigerTael | Well, I see there might be some steps unnecessary there... |
| 09:10.21 | TigerTael | I can always just use a 32bit distro if that's easier. ;/ |
| 09:10.27 | TigerTael | No real need for 64bit at this point. |
| 09:10.32 | DocScrutinizer | TigerTael: nota bene the bootlader fix is probably pretty much independent of the particular distro, as it's mostly affecting kernel |
| 09:10.55 | TigerTael | "sudo yum -y install Xephyr" |
| 09:11.34 | TigerTael | And patching the python script... |
| 09:12.33 | TigerTael | I'm guessing it's only the bootloader that I need to sort out? |
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| 09:12.48 | frals | love when you get a call from someone and they go "let me connect you with my assisstant" and you get dropped from the line and cant call back |
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| 09:14.28 | DocScrutinizer | frals: you bet those idiots get a stinky finger at best |
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| 09:15.58 | noobmonk3y | looks around, idiots, where? :D :D |
| 09:18.07 | TigerTael | I haven't actually used fedora in a long time come to think of it |
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| 09:21.13 | frals | hehe, the guy i was talking to was not an idiot thou ;) |
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| 09:23.01 | noobmonk3y | lol :D |
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| 09:23.14 | noobmonk3y | frals - your fmms really is still creating a buzz :D |
| 09:23.25 | frals | hehe |
| 09:23.44 | frals | i feel bad for not having time to code on it the last ~week |
| 09:24.30 | tybollt | is too much of a knucklehead to get that awesome app to work |
| 09:25.02 | mece | hey linux gurus. is there an evironment variable for library paths? |
| 09:25.15 | tybollt | LD_LIBRARY_PATH |
| 09:25.21 | mece | it's emptu |
| 09:25.22 | mece | y |
| 09:25.27 | tybollt | yes |
| 09:25.28 | tybollt | set it |
| 09:25.31 | mece | ok.. |
| 09:25.33 | mece | well.. |
| 09:25.40 | mece | would that path replace the default one? |
| 09:25.45 | mece | or extend it |
| 09:25.52 | tybollt | extend |
| 09:25.58 | mece | cool thanks :) |
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| 09:27.09 | tybollt | you can of course use compile time shitz when making too |
| 09:27.14 | tybollt | like -LPATH |
| 09:29.19 | mece | righty, well I don't feel like recompiling right now. |
| 09:29.32 | mece | it worked fine with LD_LIBRARY_PATH |
| 09:29.34 | DocScrutinizer | as elaborated earlier here, it's kinda deprecated though - at least for optifuckation purposes |
| 09:30.06 | mece | yeah I didn't create a deb for the lib I needed. I just copied the files. |
| 09:30.37 | mece | just testing here. |
| 09:30.40 | tybollt | DocScrutinizer: oh, ok, sorry :S |
| 09:31.18 | DocScrutinizer | np, just create a symlink from the FHS conforming location to the optified one, and use the correct original path in your binary |
| 09:32.29 | noobmonk3y | :D |
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| 09:39.45 | edheldil | there's also LD_PRELOAD |
| 09:39.55 | mece | ouch xfonts-base took a lot of rootfs :/ |
| 09:40.28 | mece | I wonder where they are located |
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| 09:51.38 | noobmonk3y | blinks |
| 09:51.42 | noobmonk3y | must be coffee time! |
| 09:51.48 | Dassu | no. |
| 09:51.53 | tybollt | yes |
| 09:52.21 | Dassu | no. |
| 09:52.28 | Ralph_ | no. |
| 09:52.38 | tybollt | YES! |
| 09:53.13 | Ralph_ | no. |
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| 09:53.46 | Ralph_ | http://ralphplsgo.com/ralph-pootawn-pictures.htm |
| 09:54.09 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 09:55.36 | noobmonk3y | lol |
| 09:55.40 | noobmonk3y | Yes i say YES!!! |
| 09:55.42 | noobmonk3y | lo jaffa :D |
| 09:55.57 | noobmonk3y | sorry was just discussing the importance of me having a coffee.... |
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| 09:58.19 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:59.07 | DocScrutinizer | edheldil: there's also 'man ld.so' |
| 09:59.52 | *** part/#maemo fgs_ (~97352efb@gateway/web/freenode/x-sntyaayisgenbzjj) |
| 10:00.08 | edheldil | SpeedEvil: I have read it as 'importance of being coffinated' |
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| 10:01.54 | noobmonk3y | coffinated lol! |
| 10:02.16 | noobmonk3y | the coffee is here, everyone can get back on with what they are doing :D |
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| 10:45.26 | Dassu | sucks that n900 seems to be unable to play mythtv UpNp media smoothly |
| 10:45.59 | Dassu | In over all the whole thing sucks. I guess it only works for music and specific videos |
| 10:47.03 | pupnik | try knots2 media center |
| 10:47.24 | pupnik | gives you transcoded audio/video with seeking |
| 10:47.46 | ShadowJK | mpeg4/xvid and h264 baseline up to 800x480 with mafw-based players. Less than 640x480 with software based players |
| 10:47.48 | Dassu | For example if I try to access those shares directly from the mediaplayer -> one frame + freeze. If I access those from the file manager -> open them with media player -> no freez but the playback is slow and skipping is not possible. With kmplayer+djmount = very slow plaback with skipping support |
| 10:48.33 | Dassu | pupnik: I think I rather use darwinstreamingserver because it has support for h264 |
| 10:48.43 | pupnik | you need quality software |
| 10:48.55 | Dassu | "quality software" eh |
| 10:49.05 | Dassu | I guess mythweb is alright |
| 10:49.20 | tybollt | h264 ona N900 |
| 10:49.26 | tybollt | you gotta be kidding moi |
| 10:49.47 | pupnik | again, try knots2 media center |
| 10:50.05 | Dassu | tybollt: n900 supports hw acceleration for h264. h264 plays fine on my 6630 too |
| 10:50.17 | Dassu | tybollt: remember that the resolution is rescaled |
| 10:50.55 | Dassu | Sadly I think there is no hw acceleration for mpeg2 O_o |
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| 10:52.44 | zaheerm | mpeg2 patemnt licenses are more expensive |
| 10:53.01 | zaheerm | due to the monopoly on dvd and dvb broadcasts |
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| 10:53.43 | tybollt | unfortunately movies are a deeply profound clustfuck |
| 10:54.28 | tybollt | there are so many royalties and assholes trying to grab your money it is not really worth wathching films |
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| 10:55.05 | tybollt | gunbritt? vafan :) |
| 10:55.22 | Stskeeps | mm? |
| 10:55.28 | Dassu | pupnik: the thing is that I already have darwinstreaminserver installed and I also have encode script. However I don't think I will be watching too much "tv" on my n900 |
| 10:55.37 | Dassu | just wouldn't be worth the time. |
| 10:56.03 | Dassu | same thing with 6630. I already had a darwinstreamingserver but I never used it |
| 10:57.09 | Dassu | knots2 does on-fly-encoding though which is a big plus. |
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| 10:57.52 | Dassu | still would prefer darwin when on 2-3.5G |
| 11:00.28 | Dassu | pupnik: hopefully there will be coming more demo's to the youtube regarding that knots2 because it seems to be really cool especially if it is easy to setup |
| 11:01.04 | tybollt | muahaha :) |
| 11:01.08 | Dassu | doesn't have too much time in his hands to setup a server side again |
| 11:01.09 | tybollt | inteallahonsen: hemma |
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| 11:01.41 | inteallahonsen | :) |
| 11:01.47 | tybollt | inteallahonsen: who are you? |
| 11:02.11 | inteallahonsen | just some guy on the intirnets :) |
| 11:02.29 | tybollt | that doesn't have ... alla hönsen hemma... |
| 11:03.18 | inteallahonsen | well i dunno if internets can send chickens over packets or that it can have them all at home. who knows |
| 11:03.59 | pupnik | dassu it is about as easy as it can be, given the components it requires |
| 11:04.12 | tybollt | anyway change back to the gunbritt nickname now... you crossdresser... |
| 11:04.21 | inteallahonsen | lol |
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| 11:04.59 | pupnik | nicks are like hats |
| 11:06.14 | MiXu- | haha, well said |
| 11:06.40 | inteallahonsen | yeah, I mostly use stuff that pops up in my head. username: yeswhynot password: sure |
| 11:06.41 | inz | Wearing a Nick sounds gay |
| 11:06.42 | inteallahonsen | lol |
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| 11:25.14 | red | how can i disable the default keyring nag upon boot & wifi connection |
| 11:25.27 | red | oops wrong chan :) |
| 11:26.43 | Mece_ | damn fonts! |
| 11:26.47 | Mece_ | grr argh |
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| 11:32.12 | noobmonk3y | lol |
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| 11:46.35 | J_P | is possible to run extra (desktop applications) on maemo, like as google earth? |
| 11:46.54 | Stskeeps | google earth would be cool but i doubt it exists for ARM.. |
| 11:46.55 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 11:47.00 | hrw-n900 | morning |
| 11:47.17 | pupnik | you can run extra applications |
| 11:47.17 | VDVsx | Stskeeps, n1 has google earth |
| 11:47.39 | VDVsx | java based of course |
| 11:47.42 | pupnik | they are in the -extras repository J_P |
| 11:48.10 | hrw-n900 | n1 is from google... |
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| 11:48.36 | J_P | ahh O forgot about google earth don't run in arm |
| 11:48.46 | J_P | a port will be fine :-) |
| 11:49.04 | J_P | well, but for run in android and iphone.. it not was ported? |
| 11:49.07 | J_P | they run arm too |
| 11:49.15 | bilboed-tp | finds Ovi Maps to be way way way way more detailed than any other mapping system |
| 11:49.18 | dottedmag | J_P: *google* ports it to what it wants to |
| 11:49.34 | dottedmag | J_P: Because GE is not free software. |
| 11:49.56 | hrw-n900 | bilboed-tp: you are joking right? |
| 11:49.57 | J_P | dottedmag: humm.. this is a problem with google.. |
| 11:50.03 | Dassu | bilboed-tp: :( ovi maps doesn't have street view |
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| 11:50.27 | Dassu | -> futurama |
| 11:51.00 | bilboed-tp | hrw-n900, Dassu : I don't give a *$(#@ about street views. It is really more detailed than any other mapping system. Find obscure little village in France => it has all the street names. Do the same on google map => fail |
| 11:51.08 | bilboed-tp | that's what I mean by more detailed |
| 11:51.53 | derf | I find this varies a _lot_ by locale. |
| 11:52.30 | bilboed-tp | derf, I guess |
| 11:52.31 | derf | I mean, I've been surprised to find things like an unnamed dirt hiking trail in the middle of Tasmania on Google Maps. |
| 11:52.58 | dottedmag | bilboed-tp: for the town I live in (120 thousands of inhabitants) Ovi does not have any information at all. |
| 11:53.19 | TigerTael | shit happens |
| 11:53.42 | pupnik | use openstreetmap |
| 11:53.48 | pupnik | add what you see |
| 11:54.38 | VDVsx | here in .pt OVI is also better, probably they have better maps of Europe |
| 11:55.17 | dottedmag | had a look |
| 11:55.22 | dottedmag | Hah. in OSM it's pretty detailed |
| 11:55.33 | dottedmag | Google Maps is also does not have a clue about this city |
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| 11:56.04 | VDVsx | dottedmag, you can always improve OSM ;) |
| 11:56.12 | hrw | bilboed-tp: I compare ovi maps to tomtom |
| 11:57.03 | hrw | bilboed-tp: ovi maps is useless in offline. no POI, no GPS fix |
| 11:57.07 | dottedmag | VDVsx: just wanted to stop "blahblah this is best " mantra :) |
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| 11:57.49 | VDVsx | hrw, that's not true, I use offline mode always and works fine |
| 11:58.07 | VDVsx | not in the N900 of course :D |
| 11:58.41 | hrw | VDVsx: I mean ovi maps/n900 |
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| 11:58.56 | VDVsx | hrw, ok, so that's right :D |
| 11:59.02 | hrw | VDVsx: ovi maps/s60 are light years ahead then maemo5 crap version |
| 11:59.30 | J_P | are there a virtual keyboard app that works very well? |
| 11:59.45 | hrw | VDVsx: but thats nokia - they never had good navigation stuff for maemo devices. |
| 11:59.50 | *** join/#maemo promulo (~romulo@189.71.18.127) |
| 11:59.50 | hrw | or good gps receivers |
| 12:00.06 | jacekowski | well |
| 12:00.08 | VDVsx | also my 5800 get gps fixes(seconds, without assist) much faster than my n900(minutes) |
| 12:00.20 | jacekowski | tomtom gps chip is worse than n900 gps chip |
| 12:00.29 | jacekowski | it's just a software that does all magic |
| 12:00.31 | hrw | it is amazing that tomtom 3rd gets gps fix in <1 minute without network connection when n900 in same place/time never gets fix |
| 12:00.43 | frals | VDVsx: i got the opposite experience with my gfs 5800 :D |
| 12:00.45 | jacekowski | hrw: impossible |
| 12:00.55 | jacekowski | hrw: it takes more to sent ephemeris t |
| 12:01.10 | hrw | jacekowski: checked with n810, n900, e66, tomtom |
| 12:01.15 | jacekowski | hrw: cold start takes at least 25 minutes |
| 12:01.22 | MiXu- | I also get a gps fix with N900 in seconds. |
| 12:01.24 | jacekowski | hrw: and there is no way around it |
| 12:01.25 | mece | is there a good way to get standard linux fonts to the N900? |
| 12:01.29 | VDVsx | frals, last ovi maps right ? |
| 12:01.34 | hrw | MiXu-: offline? |
| 12:01.37 | jacekowski | hrw: unless gps have information from other sources |
| 12:01.42 | MiXu- | online of course |
| 12:01.49 | MiXu- | Why would you even use it offline :) |
| 12:01.54 | frals | VDVsx: uh not sure, not tested it for a while so probably not |
| 12:01.59 | mece | MiXu-, roaming... |
| 12:02.01 | VDVsx | online is cheating :D |
| 12:02.07 | jacekowski | hrw: hrw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_to_first_fix |
| 12:02.09 | VDVsx | that doesn't count |
| 12:02.12 | MiXu- | Ok, roaming is acceptable :) |
| 12:03.47 | hrw | jacekowski: I do not remember when last time had to wait 10-20 minutes for fix with tomtom |
| 12:03.50 | VDVsx | I think the problem is in the n900 SW, even my OM can fix faster than my n900 (if in a new location without any cache) |
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| 12:04.35 | VDVsx | offline of course, online is preaty fast |
| 12:04.41 | *** part/#maemo gbraad_afk (~gbraad@188.90.99.129) |
| 12:06.24 | hrw | VDVsx: I prefer to avoid roaming gprs |
| 12:06.38 | VDVsx | me too :) |
| 12:06.43 | VDVsx | I'm poor |
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| 12:10.50 | mece | so how the frak does the font configuration differ between sdk and N900? The n900 seem to have more fonts than the sdk.. |
| 12:10.58 | VDVsx | Maemo is hiring like made people :P : 34 positions open at Nokia to work on Maemo / MeeGo projects in Finland and USA http://tinyurl.com/nnt34l |
| 12:11.18 | xorAxAx | sounds good |
| 12:11.21 | *** join/#maemo bilboed-tp (~bilboed@95.136.185.7) |
| 12:11.24 | xorAxAx | for us customers |
| 12:11.54 | range | Comes back blank for me. |
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| 12:15.17 | DocScrutinizer | (<jacekowski> hrw: cold start takes at least 25 minutes) That's what I thought as well (well, 15 min) - I had to learn though each sat sends his *own* trajectory data quite fast. This way GPS on FR was tuned to get a cold fix within 15sec, if sat signal si strong enough |
| 12:15.54 | derf | You people are confusing the "ephemeris" with the "almanac". |
| 12:15.59 | DocScrutinizer | at least that's what the developer of the GPS lib told me |
| 12:16.35 | DocScrutinizer | ephem takes 3min afaik, alm takes 15 |
| 12:16.47 | derf | Well, no. |
| 12:17.04 | derf | Ephemeris is sent every 30 seconds. |
| 12:17.30 | frals | VDVsx: only shows 26 positions for me there ;P |
| 12:17.31 | derf | A single channel receiver would need 2:00-2:30 to get enough for a fix. |
| 12:17.46 | VDVsx | frals, blame Qgil :D |
| 12:17.54 | VDVsx | his link |
| 12:17.57 | derf | A multichannel receiver could download it from all of the satellites simultaneously. |
| 12:18.21 | frals | hehe |
| 12:18.27 | derf | And have enough for a fix in 0:30-0:60. |
| 12:18.29 | DocScrutinizer | derf: ack |
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| 12:18.59 | derf | Assuming it has a valid almanac. |
| 12:19.09 | derf | _That_ gets sent every 12.5 minutes. |
| 12:19.22 | crashanddie | khertan: ping |
| 12:19.27 | derf | But you don't need to get it again every time. |
| 12:19.33 | DocScrutinizer | and you need a error free transmission for that time |
| 12:19.52 | derf | Well, sure, but that's what modulation schemes are for. |
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| 12:20.45 | DocScrutinizer | aiui that's why a fix is getting much more precise after some 5..20minutes |
| 12:20.50 | DocScrutinizer | sometimes |
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| 12:26.53 | noobmonk3y | has decided the world is QGil's fault......... tis true........ |
| 12:27.38 | crashanddie | lol... [Repetition alert by noobmonk3y in #maemo] |
| 12:27.47 | noobmonk3y | hahaha |
| 12:28.27 | *** part/#maemo ormiret_ (~ormiret@bodaegl.ormiret.com) |
| 12:29.27 | SpeedEvil | Worstcase lock time I've seen without network position outdoors with a good view of the sky is 10 mins. |
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| 12:29.32 | SpeedEvil | Which really rather sucks |
| 12:30.28 | SpeedEvil | is unsure if the ephemeris is broadcast synchronously, or asynchronously on all sats |
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| 12:35.11 | ptl | someone has ported LyX to the N900 yet? |
| 12:35.43 | SpeedEvil | I have lynx installed, which is close. |
| 12:35.49 | VDVsx | noobmonk3y, ah, he's a nice guy, without him, we were probably doomed to a 'Symbian-like treatment' :D :D |
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| 12:37.12 | timeless_mbp | hey, has anyone here heard about harmattan? |
| 12:37.17 | VDVsx | no |
| 12:37.39 | VDVsx | new chewing-gum ? |
| 12:37.47 | ptl | it's an old myth from the locals, isn't it? I don't think it exists. |
| 12:39.00 | hrw | ptl: LyX? what for? |
| 12:39.13 | tybollt | I think Harmattan is a city in the middle east |
| 12:39.26 | ptl | hrw: it'd be useful to me, and I think it fits the purpose of the device |
| 12:39.56 | VDVsx | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmattan |
| 12:39.58 | VDVsx | ;) |
| 12:40.13 | ptl | hrw: if there are people who use it for things like editting word documents (abiword is there), LyX pretty much fits there too... |
| 12:41.01 | hrw | ptl: check that etch recompile repo maybe |
| 12:41.02 | ptl | And aside from a bunch of libraries, there doesn't seem to be a big deterrent to it. LaTeX and texlive are already ported... |
| 12:41.15 | ptl | Yeah... I was thinking about doing that myself... |
| 12:42.07 | ptl | But I have a LyX document to finish first! |
| 12:43.23 | tybollt | lyx in .se means luxury... so you're dealing w/ some fancy document there eh? |
| 12:43.42 | *** join/#maemo ptlo (~senko@213.147.102.45) |
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| 12:45.05 | ptl | tybollt: my dissertation. Why luxury? Any more luxury than these crazy people that write .doc/.xls/.ppt on their mobiles? |
| 12:45.47 | *** join/#maemo warp10 (~warp10@beeseek.org) |
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| 12:47.01 | tybollt | =) |
| 12:47.11 | tybollt | ptl: btw CAN you do that ona 900 anyway? |
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| 12:50.02 | ptl | write docs and xls, definitely. I have abiword and gnumeric working OK in my own device. |
| 12:50.38 | Coke | Hey guys. I'm looking for the Maemo SDK (and scratchbox) distributed in a regular tarball, all I can find are debs and dpkg dependant installers. Any nice urls? |
| 12:50.38 | ptl | About ppt I don't know. Maybe if you boot with easy-debian and fire up openoffice.org? |
| 12:51.02 | ptl | Anyway, LyX is much lighter... |
| 12:51.18 | tybollt | ptl: beh... |
| 12:51.22 | tybollt | ptl: OOo :) |
| 12:53.03 | ptl | 09:43 <tybollt> lyx in .se means luxury... so you're dealing w/ some fancy document there eh? |
| 12:53.06 | ptl | I got the meaning of that phrase now |
| 12:53.08 | ptl | I'm kinda slow |
| 12:53.18 | ptl | you mean 'lyx' is a swedish word for luxury? |
| 12:55.10 | *** join/#maemo Termana (~bradley@123-3-75-151.static.dsl.dodo.com.au) |
| 12:56.27 | ptl | I waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaant PR 1.2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 12:56.45 | arachnist | s/a*/a/ |
| 12:57.22 | ptl | s/\!*/\!/ also |
| 12:58.50 | RST38h | but all you will get is Valium. |
| 12:59.03 | DocScrutinizer | s/.*PR.*1\.2.*// |
| 12:59.06 | tybollt | ok this is silly |
| 12:59.09 | tybollt | http://www.mobil.se/polopoly_fs/Ubuntu-pa-Touch-Pro2-1.336333.html!/image/3867352154.jpg |
| 12:59.25 | tybollt | HTC craptastic phone shitz can do full fledged OOo |
| 12:59.29 | tybollt | but we can't? :-| |
| 12:59.48 | RST38h | tybollt: Looks fine to me |
| 12:59.58 | tybollt | yeah |
| 12:59.59 | RST38h | we also can, but will it run at usable speed? |
| 13:00.18 | tybollt | oh well |
| 13:01.17 | DocScrutinizer | will the menus be usable size? |
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| 13:01.42 | DocScrutinizer | will it print ? ;-P |
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| 13:02.02 | *** part/#maemo Thom86 (~thom86@ip-90-186-148-165.web.vodafone.de) |
| 13:03.32 | DocScrutinizer | will it work as supposed with N900 mouse right button? |
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| 13:17.47 | lupine_85 | watches N900 abjectly fail to last the day |
| 13:18.49 | lupine_85 | that's a bit insane |
| 13:20.05 | *** join/#maemo edisson (~edisson@189.2.128.130) |
| 13:21.12 | lupine_85 | 4 hours |
| 13:21.12 | lupine_85 | and I've not actually been actively using it |
| 13:21.21 | tybollt | yeah |
| 13:21.23 | andre__ | any IM accounts? |
| 13:21.38 | tybollt | the battery is craptastic once you get connected and go for things like MFE etc |
| 13:21.49 | *** join/#maemo viggi (~viggi@cs181168042.pp.htv.fi) |
| 13:22.52 | lupine_85 | yep, two |
| 13:23.06 | lupine_85 | but the day before yesterday it was happy doing 9 hours |
| 13:24.02 | *** join/#maemo danielwilms (~dwilms@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 13:24.27 | SpeedEvil | lupine_85: Should I turn off the live camfeed from your device? |
| 13:24.35 | lupine_85 | quite odd - it spammed me with about 6 battery low alerts in a few minutes |
| 13:24.41 | lupine_85 | SpeedEvil, please :) |
| 13:25.11 | SpeedEvil | I want 'Backlight always on on wall-charger or if fully charged' |
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| 13:27.05 | lupine_85 | argh, 1.8.7 patchlevel 72 is naughty |
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| 13:28.21 | lupine_85 | doesn't like select &b (needs to be select(&b)) and doesn't like def mouse(&b = nil) (needs to be ...(&b)) |
| 13:29.41 | ptl | the battery is only 1320 mAh |
| 13:29.58 | lupine_85 | ahahaha, wrong channel for the ruby-messages |
| 13:30.08 | ptl | most mobile phones of the same kind seem to use a 1400 mAh battery instead... |
| 13:30.10 | lupine_85 | ptl, don't suppose it's replaceable with another, larger, one is it? |
| 13:30.16 | ptl | it is |
| 13:30.25 | lupine_85 | bets it's expensive, has a hunt |
| 13:30.28 | TigerTael | 1320 to 1400mAh won't make that much difference. ;/ |
| 13:30.32 | ptl | there is such a replaceable battery for the N900 but it makes it a lot fatter |
| 13:30.34 | TigerTael | I want an 1800mAh battery, please. |
| 13:30.48 | *** part/#maemo e115sa_ (~epifanov@ip217-77-54-91-nat.sampo.ru) |
| 13:31.02 | pupnik | the problem is websites |
| 13:31.09 | lupine_85 | well, it's about 6% more |
| 13:31.17 | ptl | well, what about 2400 mAh? Would it make a difference? |
| 13:31.18 | pupnik | evil sh1tty websites |
| 13:31.19 | ptl | http://nokiaaddict.com/2010/02/09/the-n900-get-a-bigger-battery-2400mah/ |
| 13:31.42 | TigerTael | ptl, that would be nice. |
| 13:31.50 | RST38h | make your N900 even fatter and heavier? |
| 13:31.50 | lupine_85 | $87.95 |
| 13:31.57 | lupine_85 | it's not that ba |
| 13:31.58 | lupine_85 | ..d |
| 13:32.17 | TigerTael | Well, I don't want to make the phone bigger tbh. |
| 13:32.23 | lupine_85 | one thing I did last night was move some directories from /usr/share to /opt/home |
| 13:32.27 | ptl | http://www.mugen-power-batteries.com/nokia/nokia-n900.html |
| 13:32.28 | lupine_85 | and symlink them |
| 13:32.29 | range | lupine_85: What? It's 7 mm more. |
| 13:32.36 | range | That's prety bad. |
| 13:32.42 | range | +t |
| 13:32.43 | TigerTael | lupine_85, and then what happened? |
| 13:32.50 | lupine_85 | nothing, I just had more room on / |
| 13:33.01 | TigerTael | Oh sweet. |
| 13:33.06 | lupine_85 | I'm just wondering if the increased access of the mmc device would increase power drain? |
| 13:33.12 | *** join/#maemo e115sa (~epifanov@ip217-77-54-91-nat.sampo.ru) |
| 13:33.16 | TigerTael | lupine_85, good point. |
| 13:33.42 | ptl | If I hadn't already ordered a rubber case I'd order this battery |
| 13:33.48 | range | And it's missing a stand. |
| 13:33.53 | TigerTael | I need a silicone case. ;/ |
| 13:33.55 | Funnyface | yes I was hoping that they'd show up with a larger N900 battery |
| 13:34.01 | ptl | to me it's more important to have a long online time than having a light device |
| 13:34.05 | Funnyface | although it doesn't have to be as large as the one posted there |
| 13:34.10 | lupine_85 | so right now the n900 is 17mm |
| 13:34.26 | ptl | my previous mobile phone was a HTC athena |
| 13:34.39 | Funnyface | adding just 3mm to it would be enough to boost the battery time some |
| 13:34.50 | RST38h | ptl: <ouch> |
| 13:35.05 | Funnyface | also, a larger capacity battery powers the device more efficiently, so you have less losses in heat :P |
| 13:35.06 | lupine_85 | TBH, I can't see another 7mm making it xbox hueg |
| 13:35.46 | ptl | it was already large, 5" screen, 133x98x16mm and I even took it with the keyboard and the leather case |
| 13:35.55 | lupine_85 | still, I need to conclusively discover - and fix - whatever's draining the current battery at 2x the speed |
| 13:36.16 | lupine_85 | it just turned itself off *sigh* |
| 13:36.19 | ptl | lupine_85: run powertop for a while in your device |
| 13:36.23 | lupine_85 | yeah |
| 13:37.26 | ptl | RST38h: the good point of having such a heavy device is that you'd never forget it anywhere, you'd always feel if it's not in your (oversized) pocket |
| 13:37.48 | ptl | very good device, btw. Too bad it has WM6.1 |
| 13:38.07 | lupine_85 | if I'm using it as half a laptop replacement, I don't really care whether it's slightly larger than a nokia 3200 |
| 13:38.08 | ptl | I bought it because I saw a video in youtube of someone installing linux on it. |
| 13:38.21 | ptl | I thought by the time I bought it would already be ready for Linux... |
| 13:38.25 | ptl | but it never was. |
| 13:38.42 | *** join/#maemo danielwilms (~dwilms@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 13:39.06 | lupine_85 | (45 x 107 x 20.8 mm) vs (110.9 x 59.8 x 18 or 25 mm) |
| 13:39.10 | ptl | I can't say how it is a long-sought dream of having a mobile phone with such a typical Linux distro. |
| 13:39.35 | lupine_85 | it's good, isn't it? :P) |
| 13:40.08 | ptl | not only good, I finally feel like I'm in control of my own cellphone. |
| 13:40.28 | lupine_85 | and now they're going to ruin it with meego and trusted computing ;) |
| 13:40.31 | ptl | ...or ar you talking about the devices measurements? |
| 13:40.41 | lupine_85 | the linux |
| 13:40.46 | ptl | trusted computing? Hope it's not Dr |
| 13:40.48 | ptl | *DR< |
| 13:40.50 | ptl | aagh |
| 13:41.02 | ptl | *DRM |
| 13:41.04 | lupine_85 | well, maemo 6 was meant to have a hardware TPM |
| 13:41.11 | ptl | I couldn't even spell the name, does this channel have some kind of badwords-protection? |
| 13:41.22 | tybollt | *<DR>o< QUACK! |
| 13:42.02 | nid0 | I do not see the point of the mugen device. if you're willing to carry something chunky and massive, why not carry a zaggsparq or similar, it's 6000mAh *as well* as the 1320 in the phone, rather than just 2400 flat, and you can choose to not carry it round when you want light instead of legs |
| 13:42.02 | ptl | lupine_85: but in the meego statements they said they want to make the OS more open than ever |
| 13:42.03 | lupine_85 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Maemo_security |
| 13:42.17 | TigerTael | nid0, I like that idea better. |
| 13:42.19 | lupine_85 | I've no idea how much of this is planned to go over to meego. I suspect all |
| 13:42.31 | lupine_85 | the plan was to have two modes - DRM-to-the-hilt, and open |
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| 13:42.46 | lupine_85 | then people can sell stuff and artificially restrict it so it'll only run in the DRM-to-the-hilt mode |
| 13:43.08 | ptl | Hmmm |
| 13:43.29 | lupine_85 | anyone see the openssl power-mediated vulnerability? :) |
| 13:43.48 | ptl | nid0: it might be a good compromise for some people, because the zaggsparq (I just checked its page) is still a separate and therefore clumky device |
| 13:43.59 | *** join/#maemo Erod (~Juno@unaffiliated/erod) |
| 13:44.10 | ptl | I haven't, is it something like dsniff all over again, lupine_85? |
| 13:44.14 | J_P | when maemo will complete move to meego? |
| 13:44.37 | ptl | J_P: at this point I think nobody knows, not even Nokia or Intel executives |
| 13:45.25 | tybollt | jury is still out on that one |
| 13:45.25 | ptl | J_P: because it'll probably depend to some extent on community activity |
| 13:45.25 | tybollt | or as nookla like to say it... ottelini and jaaksi are still in the sauna about that one... |
| 13:45.26 | ptl | nid0: hmmm, I'm interested in that zaggsparq, thanks for the suggestion |
| 13:45.27 | lupine_85 | ptl, by injecting power fluctuations into the PSU while it's verifying stuff based on the private key, you can get it to reveal a couple of bits of the PK |
| 13:45.39 | lupine_85 | not sure exactly how it works |
| 13:45.45 | TigerTael | ptl, Energizer have made one like that too. |
| 13:45.49 | lupine_85 | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/03/04/severe_openssl_vulnerability/ |
| 13:45.49 | ptl | lupine_85: wow, that seems rather extreme |
| 13:46.01 | J_P | ptl do you think that this merge is a really adantage for nokia (maemo)? |
| 13:46.05 | lupine_85 | it's an infeasible attack for HTTPS |
| 13:46.12 | nid0 | ptl: that's just one example which happens to have a monster battery in it, there are loads of similar ones though that're also smaller |
| 13:46.13 | ptl | This item is currently |
| 13:46.14 | ptl | OUT OF STOCK |
| 13:46.16 | lupine_85 | for TPMs, it's a buster |
| 13:46.17 | ptl | (zaggsparq) |
| 13:46.22 | TigerTael | J_P, I think for Nokia yes... for the community, who knows. |
| 13:46.53 | J_P | I don't like meego using rpm |
| 13:46.56 | lupine_85 | so I'm happy for them to DRM it. I'll wait for someone better at crypto than me to crack the DRM, then pirate all the good applications |
| 13:47.00 | lupine_85 | ~fin@ |
| 13:47.02 | ptl | J_P: I don't know, I haven't even seen Meego, but I'd prefer debs instead of RPMs, because of the ease with which you can just recompile regular linux packages to maemo. |
| 13:47.14 | nid0 | ptl: energizer and powermonkey both do ones that arent much larger than AA batteries, which is what the energizer one actually uses, and you can swap out batteries - personally I have one that's got a 2500mAh battery in it, is credit-card shaped and maybe 50% the thickness of the n900, and has solar panels |
| 13:47.21 | lupine_85 | ptl, the ease is still there |
| 13:47.34 | lupine_85 | just for source rpms instead of source debs |
| 13:47.36 | TigerTael | nid0, sweet, what is that one called? |
| 13:47.45 | lupine_85 | (and you can still use alien to convert between the two) |
| 13:47.51 | J_P | ptl Yes, I agree.. I prefer debs too.. that is very strange.. |
| 13:48.12 | J_P | marge was "officialy" made, but in the pratical don't exist.. |
| 13:48.29 | ptl | lupine_85: but due to the fragmentation of RPMs, also due to the lack of tools like deb, it'll be more difficult and more distant from the more popular desktop distribution right now. |
| 13:48.37 | nid0 | TigerTael - it's some semi unbranded thing I got from a uk site, its at: http://www.iwantoneofthose.com/solar-charger-v2/index.html |
| 13:48.38 | lupine_85 | apt-rpm? |
| 13:48.43 | nid0 | i'll see if i can find some brand details |
| 13:48.46 | ptl | apt-rpm is unmaintained |
| 13:48.48 | lupine_85 | the whole idea is to remove the distro upstream, AIUI |
| 13:48.50 | ptl | due to smart |
| 13:48.58 | lupine_85 | which might, or might not, be a good thing |
| 13:49.02 | ptl | I used apt-rpm for a couple years |
| 13:49.04 | TigerTael | nid0, maybe I can find one. |
| 13:49.04 | ptl | It was nice |
| 13:49.07 | lupine_85 | it's a clean slate, wot |
| 13:49.16 | lupine_85 | but mostly, the decision isn't going to change just because we complain about it |
| 13:49.53 | *** join/#maemo kkb110 (~kkb110@host133-16.student.udel.edu) |
| 13:50.16 | TigerTael | I'm wondering if I should stick to Debian now or move to Fedora for convenience on development. |
| 13:50.19 | J_P | ptl meego justify that rpm is because process to develop/made pacakges in maemo is dificult.. |
| 13:50.20 | ptl | J_P: they said because of the OBS - Opensuse Build System - which is what they use for building the whole distro (which includes cross-compilation), rpm will fit in better, and has tools that are not available for the deb format |
| 13:50.46 | J_P | hehe |
| 13:50.49 | lupine_85 | TigerTael, apt-get install yum |
| 13:50.56 | lupine_85 | ~fin :) |
| 13:51.02 | ptl | J_P: I don't know anything about OBS. I just hope they're right. I don't care that much about the packaging system if and only if it makes it easy for me to port the programs I'm interested in. |
| 13:51.02 | TigerTael | ehehehe |
| 13:51.11 | TigerTael | lupine_85, well, I wouldn't call that an ideal solution. ;p |
| 13:51.14 | lupine_85 | as long as OBS is nothing like the rest of opensuse, it'll all be ok |
| 13:51.26 | TigerTael | So should I consider OpenSuse too then? ;p |
| 13:51.29 | lupine_85 | yast is something that needs shooting in the face |
| 13:51.38 | TigerTael | lupine_85, agreed. |
| 13:51.44 | lupine_85 | peeks at OBS |
| 13:51.44 | TigerTael | OperSuse was terrible when I tried it last. |
| 13:51.50 | TigerTael | Open* |
| 13:51.54 | J_P | and OBS is really better? |
| 13:51.57 | lupine_85 | looks like it's just launchpad/ppa for rpm |
| 13:52.00 | ptl | I dunno |
| 13:52.15 | ptl | Some people said it can build debs oo |
| 13:52.17 | ptl | *too |
| 13:52.22 | ptl | Can it? |
| 13:52.27 | ptl | Does anyone here know? |
| 13:52.40 | J_P | Maemo is beautiful and fast and pure linux. And I wait meego as one SUPER maemo. |
| 13:52.49 | TigerTael | I haven't used Linux since slackware 8 days... ;/ |
| 13:53.01 | TigerTael | J_P, I would like that too. |
| 13:53.01 | lupine_85 | 'The openSUSE Build Service is the only service that allows developers to package software for all major Linux distributions' |
| 13:53.07 | lupine_85 | ....except everything based on Debian |
| 13:53.09 | lupine_85 | hrh |
| 13:53.12 | TigerTael | LOL |
| 13:53.24 | RST38h | http://www.davidgilson.co.uk/2009/12/nokia-bp-4l-substitute-battery-test/ |
| 13:53.28 | lupine_85 | http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service/cross_distribution_package_how_to |
| 13:53.44 | J_P | ahahha |
| 13:53.51 | J_P | "....except everything based on Debian" |
| 13:53.55 | J_P | that is a joke |
| 13:54.15 | J_P | meego is crazy? |
| 13:54.42 | TigerTael | RST38h, cool, now I need one for N900 please. |
| 13:54.45 | burchr | lupine_85: did you skim over that a little bit too quickly? |
| 13:54.46 | TigerTael | No exploding ones though. |
| 13:54.56 | RST38h | No doughnut for you, sorry =( |
| 13:54.59 | ptl | IF the OBS can build deb packages |
| 13:55.05 | ptl | why use it for rpm? |
| 13:55.06 | tybollt | hmm |
| 13:55.12 | *** join/#maemo etrunko (~edulima@201.82.175.29) |
| 13:55.13 | lupine_85 | ahahaha, so I did |
| 13:55.20 | lupine_85 | http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service/Deb_builds |
| 13:58.17 | ptl | I found out |
| 13:58.20 | *** join/#maemo netvandal (~michele@host-84-222-49-135.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 13:58.28 | ptl | OBS builds deb packages but doesn't use the deb sources |
| 13:58.36 | ptl | it uses .src.rpm's for that |
| 13:59.02 | ptl | so, instead of a halfway change, changing everything would be indeed better. |
| 13:59.03 | ptl | winds of change |
| 13:59.06 | burchr | ptl: pretty sure it can use debian source.. see http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service/Deb_builds#Minimum_set_of_files_required_to_create_.deb |
| 13:59.14 | burchr | but regardless, OBS isn't the only thing in the equation |
| 14:00.15 | lupine_85 | I'm sure it'll all be fine |
| 14:00.22 | ptl | burchr: well, it says this: the Build Service will not create a source repository for .deb-based distributions, but only the .deb will be created |
| 14:00.43 | ptl | burchr: isn't it? |
| 14:00.45 | burchr | ptl: yes, meaning that you can't use a deb package manager to fetch the source... |
| 14:00.59 | lupine_85 | well, indeed. but that's fine |
| 14:01.02 | ptl | burchr: what do we have apart from OBS? |
| 14:01.20 | J_P | lupine_85: considerations of use of rpm I understand, but I this not mean acceptable |
| 14:01.31 | lupine_85 | eh? |
| 14:01.32 | ptl | burchr: not being able to use a deb package manager to fetch the source --> that is just the feature I use extensively to port my packages to maemo...!! |
| 14:01.43 | burchr | ptl: I think you're getting very, very confused |
| 14:01.59 | burchr | ptl: you put debian packaging into OBS, you get a binary package out of it |
| 14:02.02 | ptl | burchr: so unconfuse me please :D |
| 14:02.04 | tybollt | getting burchr? I was always this confused :( |
| 14:02.06 | burchr | ptl: the missing bit is that the end-user can't request source |
| 14:02.38 | *** join/#maemo jgoss (~josh@unaffiliated/jgoss) |
| 14:02.39 | ptl | Ok, but the end-user might benefit if a technical user ports his favorite packages |
| 14:02.45 | burchr | back to the 'what else is there' question, I'd suggest signing up at http://wiki.meego.com/Proposal_for_a_Debian_Packaging_working_group |
| 14:02.50 | burchr | ptl: you're still confused |
| 14:02.51 | ptl | so easing the task of the technical user is a big advantage |
| 14:03.19 | burchr | ptl: all they have to do is to upload the relevant packaging and the source to OBS, and a binary package is built, there is no 'porting' as such |
| 14:03.29 | J_P | burchr: wow good urll.. |
| 14:03.30 | lupine_85 | just... no |
| 14:03.33 | burchr | ptl: the *user* generally doesn't need to know about source |
| 14:03.50 | lupine_85 | there's absolutely no point to one distribution having two packaging systems |
| 14:03.58 | burchr | lupine_85: *shrug*. |
| 14:03.59 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (~rsalveti@200.184.118.130) |
| 14:04.08 | burchr | if people want to spend time on it, it's not like you can stop them |
| 14:04.14 | lupine_85 | absolutely |
| 14:04.17 | burchr | I personally have doubts as to whether it will go anywhere |
| 14:04.23 | lupine_85 | but that doesn't mean I can't ridicule them for it :) |
| 14:04.33 | *** join/#maemo alecrim (~alecrim@187.82.1.235) |
| 14:04.40 | *** join/#maemo waite (~quassel@206.83.81.178.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 14:04.44 | ptl | burchr: I used the wrong word, it's not porting per se (while it might steel need adaptations), it's cross-compiling, but nevertheless, does it make that much of a difference in the argument? |
| 14:04.55 | burchr | ptl: I'm really not understanding you |
| 14:05.02 | ptl | s/steel/still/ |
| 14:05.05 | lupine_85 | ptl, you can get srpm files and cross-compile them as easily as dsc s |
| 14:05.17 | burchr | ptl: for the software packager, there is essentially nothing missing from OBS |
| 14:05.27 | lupine_85 | and most stuff that comes in .deb is also packaged as .rpm |
| 14:05.33 | burchr | ptl: the bit that won't work is apt-get source, as an end-user |
| 14:05.40 | ptl | lupine_85: Yes, I know, and that's the problem, the rpm world is much more fragmented than the deb world |
| 14:05.56 | lupine_85 | *shrug* I wouldn't really say so |
| 14:06.00 | burchr | goes to get productive things done, anyway |
| 14:06.03 | ptl | lupine_85: regardless of whether it was caused by policy, history or such and such |
| 14:06.13 | J_P | Most people in community want/like to use debs, why meego are doing outside.. |
| 14:06.15 | J_P | ? |
| 14:06.26 | lupine_85 | depending on what you mean by fragmented, of course |
| 14:06.30 | burchr | J_P: this argument is done and dead already |
| 14:06.37 | ptl | burchr: yes, that's what I use to get the ubuntu sources to compile for my N900, that is exacly the point |
| 14:06.38 | lupine_85 | J_P, actually, the vast majority are indifferent, hence why they're not talking about it |
| 14:06.40 | ptl | burchr: it's easy |
| 14:06.46 | burchr | J_P: if you're interested in helping out with deb infrastructure, sign up on that wiki page, that's it |
| 14:06.51 | burchr | ptl: again, you miss the point |
| 14:06.53 | lupine_85 | ptl, you could use the fedora repos to exactly the same end |
| 14:07.02 | lupine_85 | or the centos ones, if wanted to |
| 14:07.08 | DocScrutinizer | sighs on the whole batery topic |
| 14:07.08 | lupine_85 | they're exactly equivalent |
| 14:07.13 | ptl | J_P: or sign up in the meego dev lists and reignite the flame! It will be fun! |
| 14:07.15 | lupine_85 | now, I love deb, but I don't care |
| 14:07.49 | lupine_85 | stealing packages of any format from another distro comes a poor second to packaging the upstream directly, specificially for the target distro |
| 14:08.03 | ptl | lupine_85: why? they said they wouldn't have an upstream. And centos and fedora (to a lesser extent) are not very geared towards the end-user like ubuntu. Ubuntu has lots more desktop packages. |
| 14:08.37 | lupine_85 | ptl, when you cross-compile a package from debian/ubuntu, it's not tuned for the n900. it might have some patches for desktop usage, but probably not |
| 14:08.46 | tybollt | hands DocScrutinizer a complimentary pink poneh |
| 14:08.47 | ptl | lupine_85: agreed |
| 14:08.52 | lupine_85 | cross-compiling a fedora srpm will be /exactly the same/ |
| 14:09.05 | lupine_85 | the two operations are exactly equivalent |
| 14:09.08 | ptl | lupine_85: as I said, it sometimes needs an adaptation, which could even be huge. |
| 14:09.08 | J_P | wee needs think very well, because meego (old maemo and moblin) will/are competing with iphone os and android.. wee needa a large community.. |
| 14:09.12 | lupine_85 | all that differs are the exavt tools |
| 14:09.44 | ptl | Ok |
| 14:09.51 | ptl | just to let you have an example |
| 14:10.17 | ptl | recently I had to recompile, both in deb and rpm form, a specific build of bioperl along with several bioinformatic libraries. |
| 14:10.24 | ptl | I had to do that both on Ubuntu and Fedora 11. |
| 14:11.11 | ptl | even with rpms targetted specifically for fedora 11 (which were way more difficult to find than for ubuntu), I had lots more problems and incompatibilities than with Ubuntu (even using files from debian) |
| 14:11.28 | burchr | this is still useless |
| 14:11.33 | ptl | even now the fedora installation does not run as well as the ubuntu installation. |
| 14:11.36 | burchr | talking for hours here isn't going to change anything |
| 14:11.41 | lupine_85 | burchr, indeed |
| 14:11.43 | burchr | if you're interested in deb, sign up at the wiki page I mentioned earlier |
| 14:12.18 | burchr | and fwiw, I don't consider that a very good argument, I've had just as many experiences the other way, for my subjective $0.02 |
| 14:12.31 | ptl | burchr: agreed, but I want a solution. If I am so devilishly forced to use rpm, I want to know how I can solve these problems that I didn' have with debs. |
| 14:12.36 | burchr | (and yet, I still use debian based distros primarily) |
| 14:12.49 | *** join/#maemo dracflamloc (dracflamlo@12.71.4.50) |
| 14:13.04 | burchr | ptl: then wait until there's something more concrete, and you actually encounter a problem that needs solving |
| 14:13.04 | lupine_85 | ptl, if you're really stuck, compile as deb, use alien, chillax ;) |
| 14:13.06 | J_P | I think that decision still more political than pratical.. |
| 14:13.31 | burchr | really goes t o do productive things. |
| 14:13.34 | lupine_85 | J_P, almost certainly. and that's why it's not going to change. doesn't increase the decision's relative importance, though |
| 14:13.35 | ptl | burchr: and the 'talking for hours here isn't going to change anything' argument --- well, we have people from Nokia and Intel here, doesn't that just exposes the problem that they're listening? Is this a community-geared approach or what? |
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| 14:13.47 | burchr | ptl: *argh* |
| 14:13.51 | ptl | burchr: sorry but now you're just boosting my revolted self! :P |
| 14:13.52 | burchr | talking won't make things happen |
| 14:13.57 | lupine_85 | nah, the decision wasn't made with community input |
| 14:14.00 | burchr | *sign up on the wiki page for making things happen* |
| 14:14.08 | ptl | lupine_85: yeaaaah, that's my point |
| 14:14.13 | lupine_85 | it's no biggie |
| 14:14.30 | lupine_85 | the decision to use .deb in the first place wasn't made with community input, I'll bet |
| 14:14.33 | J_P | lupine_85: but if community don't want, political decision will change, because without community help Meego don't exist.. |
| 14:14.36 | ptl | lupine_85: I tried that too many times, hope it was that easy and hadn't had the same problems I mentioned with building rpms, if not worse |
| 14:14.48 | lupine_85 | stops caring |
| 14:15.15 | ptl | btw |
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| 14:15.37 | ptl | much more people can say sane things about not being able to use deb than the ones with the time and knowledge enough for making 'things happen' |
| 14:16.02 | ptl | I could sign to help but I'd probably not have the commitment and time to effectively help. |
| 14:16.22 | burchr | in which case, it won't get done |
| 14:16.25 | ptl | and that does not mean I don't care or I do not want it that way... |
| 14:16.32 | burchr | that's both the blessing and the curse of community development |
| 14:16.34 | burchr | take it or leave it |
| 14:17.02 | ptl | sort of |
| 14:17.02 | ptl | but I believe many more are in my place. |
| 14:17.33 | burchr | I've no doubt there's a lot of people on both sides who have an opinion |
| 14:17.33 | ptl | that's why we'd like a system with a more straightforward approach than rpm. The system we've been using, actually. |
| 14:17.36 | burchr | everyone has one |
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| 14:17.43 | ptl | and someone has to be right |
| 14:17.43 | burchr | what matters is who does the work, not who has the opinions |
| 14:17.56 | burchr | if you want it to happen, you have to make it happen |
| 14:18.02 | ptl | at least on what concerns to the majority of developers |
| 14:18.03 | tybollt | crashanddie: what's w/ the internet content filtering over there and in nz? Is pr0n and terrist-bomb-recipes really that much worse there than elsewhere? |
| 14:18.08 | ptl | some people might be doing much more if their opinion was even considered |
| 14:18.11 | *** join/#maemo flo_lap (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian) |
| 14:18.14 | lupine_85 | really doesn't think the burden of maintaining debian/ directories and rpm sources is something that anyone wants to shoulder |
| 14:18.19 | burchr | jesus. |
| 14:18.19 | ptl | making things work in the open-source world is also a matter of openness |
| 14:18.49 | ptl | and as such you cut out a large parte of community involvement by forcing things down the throat, changing things that were working |
| 14:18.50 | TigerTael | I think Nokia want to implement a more robust DRM system tbh... |
| 14:19.11 | lupine_85 | notes the N900 doesn't have a TPM chip, so whatever they build won't work on it :) |
| 14:19.11 | TigerTael | BUT... |
| 14:19.19 | TigerTael | Open-source and DRM don't go well together. ;p |
| 14:19.20 | DocScrutinizer | ~seen konttori |
| 14:19.22 | infobot | konttori <~konttori@Maemo/OS/konttori> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 19h 26m 53s ago, saying: 'now: mass effect time (just finished 1 for the second time, about to start 2 for the second time)'. |
| 14:19.34 | ptl | the point is: yes, I could be helping if I worked for it hard enough. BUT I'm even better than the people that will just drop off from the ship because of that inconsiderate decision. |
| 14:19.37 | Stskeeps | lupine_85: it's part of the processor |
| 14:19.46 | lupine_85 | oh, is it built into the core the n900 has? |
| 14:19.53 | lupine_85 | just not activated? |
| 14:20.11 | DocScrutinizer | asking for neighbour cells they lynched him ;-P |
| 14:20.32 | SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: IIRC there is a secure and non-secure variant of the proc |
| 14:20.40 | SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: sure we hace the secure one? |
| 14:20.49 | SpeedEvil | the secure one also has all sorts of hw encryption |
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| 14:21.08 | josephnexus | good morning everyone! |
| 14:21.13 | ptl | DRM is not about security, security is making your machine obey you, DRM is making your machine disobey you |
| 14:21.16 | TigerTael | Just give me some turn by turn navigation and I'll be happy. |
| 14:21.20 | TigerTael | ptl, I agree. |
| 14:22.26 | TigerTael | I can't understand why there's no control of the media player via the headset though. |
| 14:22.31 | DocScrutinizer | ooooh, this word again. DRM :-(( oooouch |
| 14:22.32 | *** join/#maemo t7g_ (~t7g@d14-69-127-101.try.wideopenwest.com) |
| 14:22.36 | TigerTael | It has a button, why not make it at least get to the next track. |
| 14:22.37 | DocScrutinizer | runs vomiting |
| 14:22.44 | TigerTael | holds the bucket for DocScrutinizer |
| 14:23.11 | lupine_85 | as long as the hardware functions (gps, radio, wireless) in 'open' mode, I'll be happy |
| 14:23.16 | TigerTael | And I've heard some bad stories about AD2P/Bluetooth headsets. |
| 14:23.23 | ptl | thinks that DocScrutinizer is the one which added the protection on this channel so that he mistyped this world three times |
| 14:23.23 | TigerTael | lupine_85, pretty much the same for me. |
| 14:23.26 | *** join/#maemo ustunozgur (~ustun@pcozgur.ee.bilkent.edu.tr) |
| 14:23.30 | ptl | thinks DocScrutinizer DRM-protected the channel |
| 14:23.34 | TigerTael | And I like not having to hack my device for root access, thanks. |
| 14:23.56 | lupine_85 | eh, TPM will give you root, just as with selinux and apparmour, root won't be able to do everything |
| 14:24.26 | ptl | what's TPM anyway? In portuguese it means PMS. |
| 14:24.31 | TigerTael | lol |
| 14:24.37 | TigerTael | Trusted Platform Module. |
| 14:24.43 | lupine_85 | it's about as nice as PMS ;) |
| 14:24.46 | TigerTael | ;/ |
| 14:24.47 | DocScrutinizer | aka fritz chip |
| 14:25.04 | DocScrutinizer | aka large pile of bullshit |
| 14:25.11 | lupine_85 | heh. also: 'Acronym for Theme Park Mentality. A pejorative term describing a park that has excessively strict rules, especially safety regulations.' |
| 14:25.25 | TigerTael | apt |
| 14:25.34 | lupine_85 | now with super cow powers? |
| 14:25.39 | *** join/#maemo frade (~ivan@esprx01x.nokia.com) |
| 14:25.54 | TigerTael | I moved away from Android to get away from the closed hardware/kernel sources. |
| 14:26.04 | TigerTael | And the shoddy hardware from HTC. ;/ |
| 14:26.12 | DocScrutinizer | ~botsnack |
| 14:26.12 | infobot | :), DocScrutinizer |
| 14:26.20 | lupine_85 | mostly, I dislike java ;) |
| 14:26.28 | TigerTael | lupine_85, I concur. |
| 14:26.41 | lupine_85 | google's approach to the linux kernel is also something I'm not fond of |
| 14:26.42 | lupine_85 | and no X! |
| 14:26.53 | TigerTael | lupine_85, again, I agree. |
| 14:27.09 | lupine_85 | they could at least have a compatibility layer... or they would if they were interested in a /linux/ mobile phone |
| 14:27.09 | ptl | +1 |
| 14:27.15 | lupine_85 | ah well |
| 14:27.23 | TigerTael | Ctrl+shift+x straight to terminal, yay. |
| 14:27.25 | ptl | and android creates a new uid for every process! |
| 14:27.40 | lupine_85 | that might be taking process separation a bit far ;) |
| 14:27.44 | hrw | lupine_85: but it does not change that android phones are linux mobile phones |
| 14:27.54 | hrw | it is just Android/Linux not GNU/Linux |
| 14:27.58 | TigerTael | Linux powered phones... |
| 14:28.00 | lupine_85 | no, they're mobile phones that run a branch of of the linux kernel |
| 14:28.11 | ptl | android was recently expelled from linux |
| 14:28.11 | hrw | lupine_85: so is n900 |
| 14:28.20 | lupine_85 | mm |
| 14:28.23 | TigerTael | ptl, eh? |
| 14:28.28 | ptl | didn't yoy know? |
| 14:28.28 | lupine_85 | difference in attitude, though :) |
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| 14:28.34 | ptl | read the changelog of kernel 2.6.33 |
| 14:28.40 | hrw | n900 is mobile phone that run a branch of the linux kernel - thats your words lupine_85 |
| 14:28.42 | ptl | and the accompanying article to which it links |
| 14:29.01 | TigerTael | ptl, I don't have time for that, about to leave work. |
| 14:29.01 | hrw | ptl: you are not right |
| 14:29.14 | ptl | TigerTael: ok |
| 14:29.18 | lupine_85 | the nokia people at least try with some degree of seriousness to get their code into upstream |
| 14:29.25 | ptl | hrw: what's the wrong part? |
| 14:29.25 | lupine_85 | I guess android is better described as a fork than a branch |
| 14:29.29 | TigerTael | ptl, but I will look into it further later. |
| 14:29.50 | hrw | 'android was recently expelled from linux' is bullshit. the true is 'some android code was dropped from staging part of mainline Linux kernel tree' |
| 14:30.08 | TigerTael | ah. |
| 14:30.14 | ptl | hrw: I think that was close enough |
| 14:30.23 | *** join/#maemo N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 14:30.25 | TigerTael | Well I'm just sick of HTC's attitude and Google's attitude for the most part. |
| 14:30.34 | hrw | ptl: nokia does not use mainline linux and has own changes which did not even get to staging area |
| 14:30.37 | *** part/#maemo swc|666 (~infidel20@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 14:30.48 | RST38h | got badly bitten by C# |
| 14:31.02 | ptl | But I think 'expelled' is a better word than dropped, because there were some controversy on that. |
| 14:31.05 | ptl | hrw: yeah, linux-omap |
| 14:31.07 | RST38h | now hates languages where everything is a reference |
| 14:31.29 | ptl | RST38h: I hate direct manipulation of pointers too |
| 14:31.40 | RST38h | Fucking confusing, no idea why they say it is "easier for beginners" |
| 14:31.40 | hrw | ptl: the question is will n900 be ever supported by mainline linux-omap or linux/torvalds trees |
| 14:31.58 | hrw | ptl: n8x0 was not and I do not know do they are now |
| 14:32.01 | RST38h | ptl: There is no direct manipulation of pointers. There is indirect manipulation of pointers and it is confusing |
| 14:32.10 | SpeedEvil | Is someone willing to put the effort into getting patches pushed upstream? |
| 14:32.26 | hrw | SpeedEvil: which patches? |
| 14:32.26 | RST38h | moo hrw, btw |
| 14:32.29 | SpeedEvil | 'it compiles and works' isn't enough to automatically get it upstream |
| 14:32.37 | TigerTael | SpeedEvil, damn. |
| 14:32.56 | hrw | SpeedEvil: extracting patches from nokia kernel drop is useless as internally they have changes for that code present |
| 14:33.21 | lupine_85 | really? |
| 14:33.37 | SpeedEvil | hrw: that doesn't in principle mean that you couldn't extract any given patch, and submit it for upstream |
| 14:33.42 | hrw | SpeedEvil: so you spend 3h on getting nice patch, send it to ML just to get info from someone@nokia: this patch is useless, we dropped half of that code already in favour of other solutions |
| 14:33.42 | lupine_85 | so when I apt-get source kernel and build it, I get something that's different to the kernel on my n900? |
| 14:33.57 | hrw | lupine_85: you will get same |
| 14:34.05 | lupine_85 | good :) |
| 14:34.14 | hrw | 2.6.28-something |
| 14:34.33 | hrw | which already is quite old but n900 will rather never get newer one |
| 14:34.41 | hrw | not from nokia at least |
| 14:34.48 | SpeedEvil | hrw: I was meaning you don't in principle have to be nokia to get n900 patches upstream. |
| 14:34.55 | hrw | SpeedEvil: I know |
| 14:34.58 | SpeedEvil | k |
| 14:34.58 | VDVsx | RST38h, what do you expected from a Java copy ? :D |
| 14:35.09 | lupine_85 | it's a bit odd that they went with 28, when 27 is the long-term-support one, but never mind |
| 14:35.38 | Stskeeps | hrw, .33 runs decently on n8x0 it looks like |
| 14:35.56 | hrw | Stskeeps: nice. finally |
| 14:36.02 | ptl | What kernel does Mer use? |
| 14:36.38 | Stskeeps | hrw, and tony lindgren is patching in things |
| 14:37.12 | RST38h | VDVsx: well...no, nothing. |
| 14:37.30 | hrw | Stskeeps: who submitted patches? |
| 14:37.32 | RST38h | VDVsx: But I really wonder how those indians get their code to work now |
| 14:37.36 | VDVsx | RST38h, and you can add M$ to that :D |
| 14:37.55 | RST38h | VDVsx: Given that the followin stuff creates an instant fuckup: |
| 14:38.12 | VDVsx | lol |
| 14:38.12 | RST38h | VDVsx: List A,B; B=...; A=B; B.Clear(); |
| 14:38.13 | Stskeeps | hrw, about to board so you'll have to dig yourself |
| 14:38.21 | hrw | ok |
| 14:39.02 | bilboed-tp | RST38h, ... fail :) |
| 14:39.27 | VDVsx | RST38h, references, so that's normal |
| 14:39.28 | RST38h | bilboed: And a nasty fail, for that. Go explain this from the common sense point of view... |
| 14:39.39 | RST38h | VDVsx: Yes, but they do not LOOK like references :) |
| 14:40.00 | VDVsx | if you were a Java coders they will look, I guess |
| 14:40.13 | VDVsx | doesn't knows nothing about c# |
| 14:40.16 | RST38h | VDVsx: I doubt it, especially considering that ints, for example, are not references |
| 14:40.58 | lupine_85 | it's got to have primitives |
| 14:41.04 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (~quassel@p57A16749.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:41.17 | VDVsx | like in Java, Int and Integer probably |
| 14:41.35 | hrw | Stskeeps: so far most of code came from @nokia - nice |
| 14:41.54 | RST38h | hrw: And expected too |
| 14:42.39 | hrw | yes |
| 14:42.43 | hrw | -> food now |
| 14:42.54 | hrw | Stskeeps: thx for informations |
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| 14:43.11 | Stskeeps | hrw: alecrim did work too (mamona) |
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| 14:58.46 | DocScrutinizer | (TPM) http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5115609628556940516&q=trusted+computing |
| 14:59.18 | Corsac | DocScrutinizer: trusted computing isn't only about drm, thoug |
| 14:59.20 | Corsac | h |
| 14:59.53 | josephnexus | it's about your computer trusting you |
| 14:59.55 | josephnexus | ... |
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| 15:06.29 | ptl | hrw: now that you said that nokia's N900 kernel is not as pristine, do you think (or know) Meego will be better in this regard? |
| 15:06.42 | hrw | ptl: why it has to? |
| 15:06.59 | hrw | because name change? |
| 15:07.03 | ptl | because it's supposed to be 'more open'? |
| 15:07.12 | ptl | meego comes with a promise |
| 15:07.14 | hrw | base system will be more open |
| 15:07.28 | ptl | is anything more basic than the kernel? |
| 15:07.29 | tybollt | ja |
| 15:07.29 | hrw | and there is no definition of 'base system' |
| 15:08.07 | tybollt | but Stskeeps keeps (pun very much intended!) saying harmattan will be meego base + _proprietaru nokia shitz_ |
| 15:08.32 | hrw | on call... |
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| 15:09.55 | *** part/#maemo rajat_ (~rajat@59.94.74.217) |
| 15:10.16 | pupnik | anyone here applying for one of those new nokia / meego / maemo jobs? |
| 15:10.59 | lupine_85 | maybe in $some years |
| 15:12.13 | ptl | No. I fear that applying to such a job would corrupt me into a corporate-sold pro-proprietary developer. |
| 15:12.24 | ptl | </flamebait> |
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| 15:16.15 | *** join/#maemo LuciusMare (~5c2b1a23@gateway/web/freenode/x-kzpmndcsguuwzzie) |
| 15:16.38 | LuciusMare | Hi, can i import/export the RSS feeds from the standard RSS app at fremantle? |
| 15:17.13 | VDVsx | pupnik, applying ? I don't have 10+ of expertise :D |
| 15:18.04 | pupnik | i hope they get some great people |
| 15:18.10 | Arif_ | werz ma firmwarz :o |
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| 15:19.17 | ptl | I hope they get smart, productive and pro-open-source people |
| 15:19.37 | Arif_ | and then let them write closed source? |
| 15:19.37 | Arif_ | :D |
| 15:20.28 | *** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@dhcp-128-194-74-197.resnet.tamu.edu) |
| 15:20.52 | ptl | well, that would be better if they get pro-closed-source to write closed-source |
| 15:20.59 | ptl | because the developers would pressure for openness |
| 15:21.17 | Arif_ | I have the feeling they'll never go completely opensource |
| 15:21.24 | tybollt | hmm |
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| 15:23.16 | LuciusMare | Hello? |
| 15:23.20 | Arif_ | Hai? |
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| 15:23.39 | Arif_ | I never used the RSS reader so dont' ask me :P |
| 15:23.45 | LuciusMare | heh |
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| 15:24.00 | LuciusMare | I want to keep a list of my feeds in sync with google reader |
| 15:24.47 | Khertan | Hello All ! |
| 15:25.09 | Khertan | register is now set again ? |
| 15:26.09 | pupnik | can't type |
| 15:29.30 | Khertan | see pupnik typping |
| 15:29.34 | DocScrutinizer | pupnik: you're referring to what exactly? I might be interested |
| 15:30.02 | Khertan | see at least the result of what pupnik type on his keyboard |
| 15:30.33 | pupnik | :) bad joke, sorry |
| 15:32.04 | *** part/#maemo jo-erlend (~Xixaq@176-56-9.connect.netcom.no) |
| 15:32.14 | LuciusMare | Ha-ha |
| 15:33.27 | Arif_ | Bash.org? :P |
| 15:35.02 | ptl | just read in a forum that someone dreamed about his incoming N900 |
| 15:35.10 | ptl | and another guy replied saying he dreamed he was a modem. |
| 15:35.17 | Khertan | and ? |
| 15:35.33 | ptl | well, that's unusual, don't you think? |
| 15:35.53 | josephnexus | i once had a dream that.... |
| 15:35.54 | josephnexus | :-P |
| 15:36.12 | SpeedEvil | has dreamed of tetris. |
| 15:36.13 | josephnexus | btw, the n900 IMAP client seems to be working quite happily |
| 15:36.31 | SpeedEvil | I keep meaning to submit bugs for 'blocks' |
| 15:36.34 | josephnexus | the only problem/frustration that i've really had thus far with mine is that you can't set an alarm if the appointment is for the same day |
| 15:36.35 | *** join/#maemo uhsf (~uhsf@modemcable228.151-57-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 15:36.36 | SpeedEvil | It has poor collision detection. |
| 15:36.41 | SpeedEvil | And no scoretable. |
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| 15:37.29 | josephnexus | and poor controls |
| 15:37.30 | josephnexus | :-P |
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| 15:38.57 | Khertan | http://bash.org/?330261 <<< funny |
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| 15:39.47 | ptl | I had with the videocall thingy. I wanted that because my mother has a smartphone (although she is computer-illiterate) and she lives in another city. My 3G carrier also has a 10-minute-free videocall on my plan, so it'd be nice if I could use the front camera to show her the stuff in my house. |
| 15:39.50 | josephnexus | lol |
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| 15:42.59 | josephnexus | aren't we supposed to have video support in gtalk and skype sometime soon? |
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| 15:44.49 | bilboed-tp | in 1.2 IIRC |
| 15:45.02 | bilboed-tp | s/IIRC/in theory/ |
| 15:45.52 | ponyofdeath | hi, is it save to do an rsync -rav from one nokia n900's /home/user to another for backup/restore? |
| 15:46.09 | tybollt | hmm |
| 15:46.24 | tybollt | ca I only ever have say one "phone" shortcut on the desktop? |
| 15:46.36 | tybollt | ie I can't have one "phone" shortcut per desktop? |
| 15:46.37 | tybollt | :-( |
| 15:46.37 | ptl | josephnexus: yes, gtalk works, I even made a video in youtube showing how to do that. Amsn also works with video. But I am talking about 3G videocalls... |
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| 15:46.57 | josephnexus | yeah |
| 15:47.03 | josephnexus | i saw your video |
| 15:47.04 | josephnexus | :-P |
| 15:47.09 | ptl | a lame video |
| 15:47.10 | ptl | sorry |
| 15:47.11 | josephnexus | but I want to be able to initiate the call |
| 15:47.13 | ptl | I'll improve |
| 15:47.14 | josephnexus | the video was epic |
| 15:47.14 | josephnexus | :-D |
| 15:47.24 | ptl | me too |
| 15:48.26 | DocScrutinizer | tybollt: http://wiki.maemo.org/Customizing_Maemo#Shortcut_to_multiple_desktops |
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| 15:49.41 | tybollt | DocScrutinizer: you forgot the derogatort ~lart tybollt for not searching before asking simple questions ;) |
| 15:49.48 | tybollt | derogatory* |
| 15:49.54 | tybollt | doc: thanks |
| 15:49.57 | aboyer | i have an application that crashes when run on the n900. it is not producing a core dump howerver. why not? can i enable it somehow? |
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| 15:52.24 | DocScrutinizer | aboyer: catchsegv? |
| 15:53.30 | Jaffa | Hmm, to run or not to run. That is the question. Whether 'tis nobler to suffer the strings and arrows of outrageous fortune or die in the pits of tmo. |
| 15:53.47 | ptl | where are the .desktop files placement configured? I want to do that too without changing the telephone application original desktop file |
| 15:54.19 | Jaffa | ptl: /etc/xdg/menus/hildon.menu and /etc/xdg/menus/hildon/applications.menu |
| 15:54.26 | Jaffa | ptl: Or, <plug>install Catorise</plug> ;-) |
| 15:55.26 | aboyer | DocScrutinizer: thx, but it does not produce any core files... |
| 15:55.39 | ptl | I installed Catorise |
| 15:55.46 | DocScrutinizer | hmm, maybe see 'ulimit -c" |
| 15:55.59 | ptl | what does it have to do with this case? |
| 15:56.14 | VDVsx | Jaffa, please run, I can campaign for you and smash every single TMO troll :D |
| 15:56.28 | VDVsx | dunno if I can accomplish last part :D |
| 15:56.28 | aboyer | DocScrutinizer: are the files store somewhere else than the current directory?/ |
| 15:56.31 | VDVsx | hard tasks |
| 15:56.58 | DocScrutinizer | aboyer: sorry dunno off top of my head |
| 15:57.02 | ptl | cd ~user; gfind . -type f -exec grep rtcom-call-ui.desktop {} /dev/null \; |
| 15:57.15 | aboyer | DocScrutinizer: thx anyways... |
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| 15:57.50 | Jaffa | ptl: You can see how it does it |
| 15:57.51 | pgas | aboyer: in the current dir, but you might need something like ulimit -c unlimited before running your app |
| 15:58.00 | Jaffa | VDVsx: Smashing does sound handy |
| 15:59.16 | pgas | (ulimit afffect the current process and the child processes it's not a global thing ... general theory I don't own a maemo device) |
| 15:59.55 | ShadowJK | wonders if crash-reporter does anything useful for devs |
| 16:00.04 | ptl | Jaffa: ah, ok. But reading the source code of catorise is overkill, I think. I'll try simpler ways |
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| 16:00.13 | ShadowJK | otoh im pretty sure the dev guide has a chapter or two on debugging |
| 16:00.18 | ptl | Indeed, I am already trying... gfind ftew |
| 16:00.20 | ptl | *ftw |
| 16:00.52 | FIQ | is supertux in early developing or is it just N900 that have an outdated version? |
| 16:01.02 | FIQ | has* |
| 16:01.15 | FIQ | development* |
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| 16:03.32 | noobmonk3y | is almost at the weekend.......... |
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| 16:05.03 | Jaffa | ptl: What's the specific question then, and I might be able to answer it? |
| 16:07.01 | ptl | Jaffa: just as tybollt asked, I want a 'sticky' phone application on every desktop without adding the application to every desktop. So I am searching for a way to copy the .desktop file of the telephone app, modifying it for X-Multiple-Desktops and then adding to my N900 desktop. |
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| 16:11.08 | Jaffa | ptl: X-Multiple-Desktops? |
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| 16:11.53 | Jaffa | ptl: Way I'd do it is copy the stub catorise has created (because of bug 8111) and then add it to each desktop. But that means adding it up to 4 times... |
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| 16:23.01 | hrw | shit |
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| 16:23.16 | hrw | is there a tool which records calls by headset? |
| 16:23.27 | hrw | recaller records only mic ones |
| 16:23.50 | ptl | Jaffa: X-Multiple-Desktop is a .desktop file option |
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| 16:25.34 | AndrewFBlack | poor noobs > http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=47216 |
| 16:25.40 | Jaffa | ptl: Supported by hildon-desktop? |
| 16:26.11 | ptl | Jaffa: seems to, http://wiki.maemo.org/Customizing_Maemo#Shortcut_to_multiple_desktops -- btw, I confused the name, it's just X-Multiple (=true) |
| 16:26.59 | Jaffa | ptl: Interesting. Anyway, because of bug 8111, I doubt you'll be able to do it on one of the X-Maemo-Prestarted apps |
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| 16:30.11 | ptl | isn't this bug solved? I just launched the telephone app about 10 times from different places (catorise, desktop) |
| 16:30.38 | tybollt | ~bug 8111 |
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| 16:32.04 | ptl | yeah, it's open |
| 16:32.16 | ptl | but I couldn't replicate it here |
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| 16:41.13 | satmd | hrw: best file a bug with recaller |
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| 16:41.24 | satmd | cause it should be trivial with pulseaudio |
| 16:41.36 | satmd | (there's a monitor device for each input) |
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| 16:42.41 | hrw | satmd: good idea |
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| 17:20.29 | Jaffa | ptl: bug 8328 contained a workaround. Catorise creates catorise-rtcom-call-ui.desktop which just uses DBus to launch the single instance which must exist in the menu for it to work |
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| 17:25.46 | ptl | Jaffa: thanks for the info... :) |
| 17:26.01 | ptl | my n900 protection just arrived |
| 17:27.52 | TomaszD | body guards? |
| 17:28.46 | ptl | no, rubber case and screen protector |
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| 17:34.57 | _gpg_ | hello |
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| 17:37.01 | ptl | just installed it |
| 17:37.12 | _gpg_ | I have just started reading https://garage.maemo.org/projects/glmemperf/ and i found the tool versy interesting, id like to know if such a tool is available for opelgles 1.1 |
| 17:37.33 | _gpg_ | my aim is to benchmark pvrtc |
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| 17:39.43 | cedar | howdy all |
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| 17:42.39 | cedar | anyone know why i might be getting this error: insmod: cannot insert 'pl2303.ko': Unknown symbol in module (-1): No such file or directory |
| 17:42.57 | cedar | why i try insmod pl2303.ko on an n810 |
| 17:43.06 | cedar | *when |
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| 17:46.23 | hrw | ok, have a nice weekend everyone |
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| 17:46.59 | cedar | yeah you too |
| 17:47.17 | scr4ve | stupid question: (you'll need the SDL, SDL_ttf, RakNet and rudeconfig libraries) <- will this app run on a n900? |
| 17:51.10 | ptl | you have sdl and sdl_ttf on the n900 |
| 17:51.17 | ptl | lemme check this raknet and rudeconfig |
| 17:51.38 | ptl | couldn't find them |
| 17:52.01 | ptl | hence you'll have to recompile them for the n900 besides the app |
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| 17:54.51 | scr4ve | ptl: http://bit.ly/viU44 - raknet src and rudeconfig are available. for an experienced java/python developer not knowing much about tux - how much time does such a port require? |
| 17:54.53 | scr4ve | any guesses? |
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| 17:57.21 | ptl | scr4ve: does it compile cleanly on linux? it might not be to much, maybe you just need to download them on scratchbox and make a package for them. Have you read the maemo 5 sdk guide? |
| 17:58.12 | scr4ve | ptl: it does. sounds great - haven't read the guide yet as coding only with python /qt on the n900 yet ;) |
| 17:58.54 | scr4ve | just curious because the game is awesome somehow. |
| 17:59.10 | ptl | even with python, there are some subleties |
| 17:59.34 | ptl | like running the script under run-standalone.sh so that it gets the UI improvements of Hildon |
| 18:00.00 | scr4ve | yep. though its pretty easy anyway. |
| 18:00.01 | ptl | what is the game? IP Curve? |
| 18:00.06 | scr4ve | yep |
| 18:00.32 | scr4ve | quite popular in german - something like snake with multiplayer mode, really funny. |
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| 18:11.45 | ogun | /usr/bin/install: will not overwrite just-created `/home/ogun/project/sources/clutter_0_8/debian/tmp//usr/include/clutter-0.8/clutter/clutter-version.h' with `clutter-version.h' |
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| 18:12.10 | ogun | Trying to build the clutter 0.8 from gitorious. Guessing it's either me or autotools being stupid. |
| 18:14.20 | J_P | smarphone with MeeGo and intel atom.. http://www.gsmarena.com/lg_gw990-3164.php |
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| 18:15.36 | ptl | SecondaryVideo call camera |
| 18:15.40 | ptl | so it has videocall 3G? |
| 18:17.01 | ptl | is has 512 MB RAM |
| 18:17.04 | ptl | *it |
| 18:17.06 | slonopotamus | woot |
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| 18:18.15 | slonopotamus | if someone remembers, i destroyed usb connector on my n900 1 month ago and took it to repair center. and guess what? they called me today and said it's fixed. |
| 18:18.33 | Stskeeps | tybollt: what did i say? i said exact opposite, harmattan is debian |
| 18:20.10 | J_P | ptl: and see cpu, is a atom and not arm.. |
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| 18:20.43 | J_P | ptl: this a important and interesting of the merge of nokia and intel.. we will see nokia with atom processors.. eheh |
| 18:20.54 | slonopotamus | -.- |
| 18:21.45 | SpeedEvil | nokia and intel are not merging |
| 18:21.55 | SpeedEvil | they are cooperating on a joint project |
| 18:22.22 | Stskeeps | are we still having that discussion? |
| 18:22.56 | slonopotamus | o_O 112 pages in usb connector thread |
| 18:23.30 | xorAxAx | interestingly, they are about equal size turnover wise |
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| 18:24.41 | ptl | slonopotamus: and does it work now? |
| 18:25.22 | J_P | Stskeeps: not. Just notice that meego are in right way ;-) |
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| 18:30.51 | slonopotamus | ptl, err... otherwise it wouldn't count fixed. i'll take in on monday |
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| 18:33.33 | Djkrikke | when I take my n900 out of my pocket, it looks like it disconnects my caller |
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| 18:34.28 | Djkrikke | when the phone is on the table this doesn't happen |
| 18:35.15 | Djkrikke | is there any reason why this could happen? |
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| 18:37.23 | ptl | maybe the accelerometer is disconnecting the call |
| 18:37.41 | lupine_85 | hmm - weird problem with my 'conversations' app |
| 18:37.45 | ptl | maybe it confuses with the gesture that disconnects the call when you lay it face down |
| 18:37.52 | lupine_85 | it's not actually showing the conversations |
| 18:37.56 | greenfly | Djkrikke: was the screen locked when it's in your pocket? |
| 18:38.07 | lupine_85 | well, it'll show the index of conversations, but not the messages in one |
| 18:38.29 | greenfly | it's also possible your thumb is hitting the disconnect button on the screen when you pull the phone out |
| 18:39.09 | Djkrikke | im sure it didnt hit the disconnect button |
| 18:39.15 | Djkrikke | the screen was locked yes |
| 18:39.31 | *** join/#maemo booiiing (~booiiing]@cl-959.dus-01.de.sixxs.net) |
| 18:40.43 | Djkrikke | can i disable the accelerometer on laying down? |
| 18:42.37 | ptl | good question, I dunno |
| 18:43.08 | *** join/#maemo mango_make (~dan@89.193.62.63) |
| 18:43.16 | *** part/#maemo sylarpowa (~53e04708@gateway/web/freenode/x-buugldzwptutgdek) |
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| 18:45.34 | slonopotamus | Djkrikke, you did hit disconnect button. there was a related bug in bigzie, but it is WONTFIX |
| 18:46.20 | *** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 18:46.40 | lupine_85 | does anyone even know what the conversations application actually is, to give me a starting point for fixing this? |
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| 18:50.51 | lupine_85 | aha! |
| 18:50.53 | lupine_85 | fixxxed |
| 18:51.08 | ptl | how? what? |
| 18:51.11 | *** join/#maemo valdyn (~valdyn@valdyn.org) |
| 18:51.15 | *** join/#maemo dmb (~dmb@unaffiliated/dmb) |
| 18:51.17 | tybollt | Stskeeps: d'oh, my bad. Then that was perhaps Tomaszd that said that then? |
| 18:51.29 | Djkrikke | ive got an incoming call and disconnected. what was that wontfix buga. |
| 18:51.43 | Djkrikke | *bug? |
| 18:52.59 | *** join/#maemo z4chh (~zach@209.189.246.165) |
| 18:53.04 | lupine_85 | when I optified microb-engine, I ymlinked to the wrong location |
| 18:53.04 | lupine_85 | duh |
| 18:55.18 | Djkrikke | who told about the wontfix bug? |
| 18:56.12 | Djkrikke | slonopotamus, can you describe the bug? |
| 18:58.48 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (~slonopota@ns1.possvyaz.ru) |
| 18:59.05 | ptl | slonopotamus: 15:55 <Djkrikke> who told about the wontfix bug? | slonopotamus, can you describe the bug? |
| 19:01.08 | GAN900 | lol . . . my old middle school is switching to iPads for textbooks. |
| 19:01.16 | Lumpio- | :V |
| 19:01.18 | slonopotamus | ptl, very often accidental call rejects when pulling n900 out of pocket when it is placed upside down (natural position, when you pull it out and take to ear, it is placed correctlly) |
| 19:02.59 | *** join/#maemo stiev3 (~stiev3@ip24-253-157-104.hr.hr.cox.net) |
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| 19:03.58 | *** join/#maemo tg (irc@x-net.hu) |
| 19:04.04 | slonopotamus | craaap |
| 19:04.18 | slonopotamus | okay, no more disconnects, moved to room with better coverage |
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| 19:06.17 | *** join/#maemo nicu (~nicu@212.103.70.50) |
| 19:08.06 | ptl | GAN900: o0 really? |
| 19:08.15 | *** join/#maemo ali1234 (~al@robotfuzz.co.uk) |
| 19:08.34 | ptl | slonopotamus: so that's what I said to Djkrikke, due to the 'turnoff' accelerometer gesture |
| 19:08.48 | ptl | but I couldn't locate the bug |
| 19:08.58 | *** join/#maemo tg (irc@x-net.hu) |
| 19:09.20 | *** join/#maemo NishanthMenon (~nmenon@nat/ti/x-fkfxlmwkoalkjrcs) |
| 19:10.01 | slonopotamus | hmm... 1 moment, afair, it's among my voted bugs |
| 19:10.02 | *** join/#maemo lmoura (~lauromour@189.2.128.130) |
| 19:11.02 | Djkrikke | okay slonopotamus, so the problem is really the turnoff gesture and not the disconnect button? |
| 19:12.50 | *** join/#maemo Flyser_ (~flyser@unaffiliated/flyser) |
| 19:13.35 | DocScrutinizer | ~seen konttori |
| 19:13.40 | infobot | konttori <~konttori@Maemo/OS/konttori> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 2d 21m 11s ago, saying: 'now: mass effect time (just finished 1 for the second time, about to start 2 for the second time)'. |
| 19:13.49 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (~murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 19:13.50 | slonopotamus | Djkrikke, the problem is that (0. have screen disabled 1. put finger on disconnect button. 2. pull it out (thus triggering screen enable) 3. remove finger) rejects call. |
| 19:13.52 | *** join/#maemo nicu (~nicu@212.103.70.50) |
| 19:14.25 | slonopotamus | in #2 'it out' == 'n900 out of pocket' |
| 19:14.26 | Djkrikke | ok thats clear, thanks for the explanation |
| 19:14.39 | *** join/#maemo Mousey (~wtfisme@sea02-v600-nat.marchex.com) |
| 19:15.40 | ptl | it was no clear to me, is there a disconnect button on the N900? |
| 19:15.41 | *** join/#maemo Mysterious (~Jonas@c193007.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 19:15.59 | ptl | there isn't even a connect button for calls... I have to call the telephone app on the device... isn't it? |
| 19:16.19 | slonopotamus | bug 5982 |
| 19:16.29 | slonopotamus | ... |
| 19:16.33 | slonopotamus | infobot, ? |
| 19:16.40 | *** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 19:17.07 | slonopotamus | Djkrikke, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5982 |
| 19:17.25 | *** part/#maemo apoirier (~apoirier@sakura.nagare.org) |
| 19:17.45 | ptl | ~bug 5982 |
| 19:17.49 | ptl | ~bugs 5982 |
| 19:17.55 | slonopotamus | i was wrong, it isn't WONTFIX. it's just low priority and comments are not promising. |
| 19:18.00 | DocScrutinizer | povbot: bug 666 |
| 19:18.21 | DocScrutinizer | povbot: #666 |
| 19:20.09 | thopiekar | where is jeremiah? our debmaster? |
| 19:20.18 | slonopotamus | ~poke DocScrutinizer |
| 19:20.19 | infobot | ACTION cuts down a small tree, sneaks up behind DocScrutinizer, pokes DocScrutinizer repeatedly, hilarity ensues. |
| 19:20.45 | josephnexus | poor tree.... |
| 19:21.03 | thopiekar | why is there no python-dev package on maemo? |
| 19:21.22 | Stskeeps | ask the pymaemo guys |
| 19:21.33 | slonopotamus | so, infobot is alive, just doesn't react to bug numbers :/ |
| 19:22.00 | DocScrutinizer | infobot *never* reacted to any bugnumbers |
| 19:22.05 | VDVsx | I think that another bot job |
| 19:22.12 | VDVsx | *that's |
| 19:22.17 | DocScrutinizer | povbot did |
| 19:22.18 | VDVsx | povbot IIRC |
| 19:22.26 | lizardo | thopiekar: > apt-cache search python-dev |
| 19:22.26 | lizardo | python-dev - Header files and a static library for Python (default) |
| 19:22.35 | *** join/#maemo NishanthMenon (~nmenon@nat/ti/x-pveykauqrrirorec) |
| 19:22.44 | thopiekar | o.O! |
| 19:22.45 | VDVsx | thopiekar, http://maemo.org/packages/view/python-dev/ |
| 19:22.50 | slonopotamus | DocScrutinizer, details... :) |
| 19:23.01 | thopiekar | haven't found it on my N800.. |
| 19:23.20 | VDVsx | thopiekar, http://maemo.org/packages is handy for that |
| 19:23.21 | VDVsx | ah |
| 19:23.25 | DocScrutinizer | ~tell slonopotamus about docscrutnizer |
| 19:23.49 | DocScrutinizer | ~tell slonopotamus about docscrutinizer |
| 19:23.55 | VDVsx | thopiekar, did you search in the sdk repo ? |
| 19:23.56 | thopiekar | VDVsx: Not Found - The requested URL /packages was not found on this server. |
| 19:24.01 | thopiekar | no |
| 19:24.11 | DocScrutinizer | slonopotamus: so is that enough detail? |
| 19:24.21 | thopiekar | is atm freshing up the canola packages.. |
| 19:24.43 | *** join/#maemo talani (~lynn@89.204.241.213) |
| 19:24.45 | slonopotamus | DocScrutinizer, jOERG. okay. |
| 19:24.47 | VDVsx | thopiekar, add a slash at the end of the url ; |
| 19:25.16 | thopiekar | same here.. |
| 19:25.22 | GAN900 | ptl, yeah, I don't get it. |
| 19:25.36 | *** join/#maemo NishanthM (~nmenon@nat/ti/x-zqivdfcbgcledjjo) |
| 19:25.46 | thopiekar | maybe a issue of konqueror.. |
| 19:25.47 | thopiekar | mom |
| 19:26.25 | *** join/#maemo Pillum (~Pillum@92.116.110.223) |
| 19:26.33 | thopiekar | yes... konqueror makes a www.maemo.org of maemo.org :/ |
| 19:26.45 | thopiekar | thank you VDVsx |
| 19:27.16 | *** join/#maemo millenomi (~millenomi@93.48.148.99) |
| 19:27.45 | DocScrutinizer | thopiekar: not here |
| 19:28.20 | thopiekar | DocScrutinizer: ? |
| 19:28.37 | *** join/#maemo dmb (~dmb@unaffiliated/dmb) |
| 19:28.42 | DocScrutinizer | my konqueror works great with above link |
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| 19:30.33 | RST38h | moo all |
| 19:31.08 | Pillum | moo RST38h |
| 19:32.29 | slonopotamus | yawns |
| 19:32.42 | Pillum | awwww..... |
| 19:34.24 | DocScrutinizer | [2010-03-12 19:13:35] <kkito> * #maemo :Cannot send to channel |
| 19:34.32 | DocScrutinizer | kkito: see topic |
| 19:34.40 | slonopotamus | DocScrutinizer, my konqueror will konquer your konqueror! |
| 19:34.43 | josephnexus | on my n900, what does the 2.5 under the bars and to the left of my battery icon mean? |
| 19:35.05 | `0660 | edge |
| 19:35.15 | `0660 | 2.5G |
| 19:35.15 | josephnexus | ah, so that's the tech used for data? |
| 19:35.17 | josephnexus | ok |
| 19:35.23 | *** join/#maemo jrocha (~JRocha@230.24.165.83.dynamic.mundo-r.com) |
| 19:35.25 | RST38h | http://toyotasimulator.com/ |
| 19:35.28 | RST38h | yessss |
| 19:35.59 | thopiekar | the maemo sdk - gui installer isn't working for me (UbuntuLucid 10.4) |
| 19:36.02 | thopiekar | http://pastebin.com/HcE3aHWJ |
| 19:36.39 | Pillum | when can we expect qt 4.6 for maemo 5? |
| 19:36.47 | slonopotamus | RST38h, doesn't wonk on n800. there was supposed to be some amounnt of flash? |
| 19:40.42 | DocScrutinizer | kkito: (and any other users with * #maemo :Cannot send to channel issue): /query crashanddie and ask for guidance :-) |
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| 19:47.16 | RST38h | slono: try it on desktop |
| 19:47.16 | *** join/#maemo dneary (~dneary@Maemo/community/docmaster/dneary) |
| 19:47.27 | RST38h | slono: it is a large flash widget I guess |
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| 20:11.28 | Pillum | hi |
| 20:11.33 | *** join/#maemo Sargun (~Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun) |
| 20:13.11 | *** join/#maemo AndrewFBlack (~927e3333@gateway/web/freenode/x-vpwfctnsezcbujal) |
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| 20:18.00 | *** part/#maemo Mohjive (n02jonka@elostirion.midgard.liu.se) |
| 20:21.39 | J_P | I don't know if this is the right place for this question but anyway: I'm using QTcreator (download from meego.com) and has support just for C++. Are plans for add support for Python on QTcreator? |
| 20:21.54 | J_P | ohh sorry, was question for meego chat.. |
| 20:27.50 | *** join/#maemo dmb (~dmb@unaffiliated/dmb) |
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| 20:37.23 | AndrewFBlack | it quiet in here |
| 20:38.02 | *** join/#maemo ogun_ (~ogun@calibra.ipv6.ogun.org) |
| 20:40.12 | toggles_w | NOISE! |
| 20:43.09 | *** join/#maemo frikinz (~lulu@p5B0C55D1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 20:51.12 | Funnyface | am I right in saying that the N900 charges faster with the charger than through USB? |
| 20:51.31 | Mek | yes, charger is 1000mA, USB only 500mA |
| 20:51.42 | Funnyface | kk :> |
| 20:57.39 | *** join/#maemo marreco (~marreco@201009218052.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 20:58.45 | *** join/#maemo jebba (~jebba@Ploegsma.cwx.net) |
| 20:59.35 | MohammadAG | the shortcut to enable browser mode is CTRL+SHIFT+O right? |
| 21:00.03 | *** part/#maemo marreco (~marreco@201009218052.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
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| 21:01.29 | AndrewFBlack | Funnyface: Anything should charge faster off Charger then USB |
| 21:05.25 | AndrewFBlack | konttori_work: Ping |
| 21:06.58 | *** join/#maemo dneary (~dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:07.17 | *** join/#maemo febb (~febb@unaffiliated/febb) |
| 21:09.01 | *** join/#maemo dneary (~dneary@Maemo/community/docmaster/dneary) |
| 21:09.39 | dneary | X-Fade, Ping? |
| 21:09.54 | dneary | I guess you're not here, but maybe... |
| 21:10.12 | dneary | Any test.maemo.org admins about? |
| 21:10.47 | dneary | Anyone else about? :) |
| 21:11.00 | AndrewFBlack | needs ideas for a new theme |
| 21:11.28 | dneary | AndrewFBlack, White on black? |
| 21:11.40 | dneary | AndrewFBlack, How about earthy brown? |
| 21:11.54 | *** join/#maemo Mousey (~wtfisme@sea02-v600-nat.marchex.com) |
| 21:12.16 | josephnexus | i'm here |
| 21:12.17 | josephnexus | :-P |
| 21:12.17 | AndrewFBlack | dneary: I have a white on black on in devel called Buildon I was going to use it for a project that is on hold right now |
| 21:12.36 | AndrewFBlack | was temped to go all nerding and do a Star Trek one |
| 21:12.44 | AndrewFBlack | nerdy i mean |
| 21:12.52 | VDVsx | dneary, can I help ? (guess not, but maybe :)) |
| 21:14.14 | *** join/#maemo Mousey (~wtfisme@sea02-v600-nat.marchex.com) |
| 21:15.22 | dneary | VDVsx, I'm looking for my password for the mysql database on test.maemo.org |
| 21:15.34 | dneary | I'd assumed I could access it without a password locally |
| 21:16.00 | josephnexus | how do you bring up the on screen keyboard |
| 21:16.02 | VDVsx | ah, no rights there |
| 21:18.22 | redeeman | hmm, any news on a "share via command" sharing provider? |
| 21:18.36 | *** join/#maemo netvandal (~michele@host-84-222-49-135.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
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| 21:32.33 | frals | redeeman: theres a "sharing cli" or something project on garage.maemo.org that should have some code up |
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| 21:38.56 | RST38h | http://gizmodo.com/5492176/say-goodbye-to-unlimited-wireless-data-plans |
| 21:39.01 | RST38h | laughs diabolically |
| 21:40.22 | zash | :( |
| 21:40.59 | RST38h | "Lenovo CEO says mobile internet products will soon account for '70 to 80 percent' of sales" <--- oh, finally, the businesses got smart and recognized that ThinkPads are no longer ThinkPads but Lenovos =) |
| 21:42.00 | derf | Now if only Lenovo would get smart and offer a ThinkPad with a decent screen resolution. |
| 21:42.09 | RST38h | moo, derf |
| 21:42.38 | derf | I love my 15" 1600x1200 T60p. |
| 21:42.41 | RST38h | ah, the sooner they die the better, given how crappy their hardware is |
| 21:42.43 | SpeedEvil | I want 2048*1536 12" |
| 21:42.47 | derf | But I can't upgrade it, because they no longer sell anything like that. |
| 21:43.17 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 21:43.26 | SpeedEvil | 100dpiscreens for laptops is _broken_ |
| 21:43.47 | SpeedEvil | 140 or so would be more sane |
| 21:44.43 | derf | RST38h: I've had a lot fewer problems with the T60p than I did with the T20, which was made back when they were still owned by IBM. |
| 21:45.30 | RST38h | derf: I am daily designing various ways of getting rid of T61p |
| 21:46.25 | RST38h | derf: It is the least usable laptop I ever used (old Dell Latitudes included) |
| 21:46.25 | SpeedEvil | RST38h: I can offer you my solution. |
| 21:46.25 | SpeedEvil | RST38h: Sit on it. |
| 21:46.25 | derf | I definitely don't agree there. |
| 21:46.25 | derf | And I had an old Dell Latitude. |
| 21:46.25 | RST38h | SpeedEvil: Does not work. In fact, I know a guy who stood on it |
| 21:46.35 | SpeedEvil | ebay |
| 21:47.03 | RST38h | derf: Connecting to projector screws it up for ~5 minutes as it is trying to find the right resolution |
| 21:47.09 | *** join/#maemo chmac (~chmac@WAN59-43.cablenet.com.ni) |
| 21:47.21 | RST38h | derf: Removing from the cradle - another 5 minutes. Placing back into cradle - blue screen of death |
| 21:47.32 | derf | Cradle? |
| 21:47.41 | derf | You mean a docking station? |
| 21:47.44 | RST38h | derf: The LCD is of so low quality that I am using external one 100% of time |
| 21:47.51 | RST38h | derf: Yes, whatever this thing is called |
| 21:47.58 | derf | I've never used it with one of those. |
| 21:48.06 | derf | And I've had no problems switching to projectors. |
| 21:48.09 | RST38h | derf: + it is 16x9, probably usable for movies, absolute shit for work |
| 21:48.23 | derf | And mine is 4:3. |
| 21:48.29 | RST38h | can go on about this for hours =) |
| 21:48.31 | derf | And I _love_ the LCD. |
| 21:48.48 | RST38h | maybe you have got some (surprisingly) decent model |
| 21:49.02 | RST38h | it is not possible to love T61p's LCD. It is worse than the one in R500 |
| 21:49.13 | derf | I would believe it. |
| 21:49.17 | derf | I got the screen I did for a reason. |
| 21:49.26 | *** join/#maemo pupnik (~pupnik@unaffiliated/pupnik) |
| 21:49.34 | derf | But, as I said, they don't sell anything like it anymore. |
| 21:49.43 | derf | You couldn't even get it on the T61p. |
| 21:49.45 | *** join/#maemo talani (~lynn@213.191.253.29) |
| 21:49.52 | derf | Apparently the glass maker went out of business. |
| 21:49.56 | RST38h | hopes for the soonish removal of "like it" from that sentence |
| 21:50.06 | ptl | I had a t61p |
| 21:50.19 | ptl | didn't notice anything wrong with it |
| 21:50.23 | ptl | I have a T400 now |
| 21:50.25 | RST38h | derf: ah, almost forgot, battery died in 3 months |
| 21:50.32 | RST38h | derf: just stopped working |
| 21:50.38 | *** join/#maemo shinkamui (~KamN900@ip68-11-94-155.no.no.cox.net) |
| 21:50.56 | derf | The one in my HP actually partially exploded. |
| 21:51.02 | RST38h | coool |
| 21:51.06 | ptl | ! |
| 21:51.11 | derf | It was no longer the same shape as when I had inserted it into the slot. |
| 21:51.15 | RST38h | nail it and finish the process! |
| 21:51.20 | derf | It still kind of worked, though! |
| 21:51.41 | derf | For about 15 minutes. |
| 21:51.49 | *** join/#maemo richieeee72 (~richard@host86-156-152-171.range86-156.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:51.56 | RST38h | and then..... yes? |
| 21:52.06 | derf | Well, then it had to be recharged. |
| 21:52.12 | RST38h | pity. |
| 21:52.48 | derf | This was when I first discovered that the batteries were always under a separate warranty from the rest of the machine. |
| 21:53.03 | derf | One that did not actually last 3 years. |
| 21:54.04 | *** part/#maemo ogun_ (~ogun@calibra.ipv6.ogun.org) |
| 21:54.20 | *** join/#maemo Ogun (~ogun@calibra.ipv6.ogun.org) |
| 21:55.08 | Ogun | Mmm, stinkpads. Totally agree that the T61 has an unlovable screen. |
| 21:55.37 | RST38h | derf: Same about the display btw |
| 21:56.18 | derf | The only real complaint I had about the T60p was that after two and a half years, the fan got really noisy. |
| 21:56.25 | derf | So I called them up and they sent me a replacement. |
| 21:57.22 | RST38h | self installable? |
| 21:58.18 | derf | Yes. |
| 21:58.26 | RST38h | interesting |
| 21:58.46 | derf | I had to tell them I had a Ph.D. in CS before they'd believe that I was qualified to install it, though. |
| 21:59.20 | *** join/#maemo uhsf (~uhsf@modemcable228.151-57-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 21:59.27 | RST38h | knows a lot of PhDs in CS who should not be let anywhere near an open computer |
| 21:59.52 | ShadowJK | cs is math |
| 22:00.03 | Ogun | Science, where nothing works but everybody knows why. |
| 22:00.13 | tybollt | CS students today learn how to toy in java, not programing |
| 22:00.25 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (~Valerio@Maemo/community/council/VDVsx) |
| 22:01.09 | uhsf | there's anything else to do with java than toys? |
| 22:01.25 | tybollt | nope |
| 22:07.46 | *** join/#maemo trip900 (~user@32.173.187.113) |
| 22:08.08 | *** join/#maemo bleeter (~bleeter@guifications/developer/bleeter) |
| 22:11.39 | ptl | I don't understand why the abiword on maemo-extras wasn't optified |
| 22:12.01 | ptl | I did a maemo-optify-deb on it and its rootfs usage went from 13.7 MB to 572 kB |
| 22:12.17 | ptl | I think I'll open a bug report for it |
| 22:14.38 | ShadowJK | abiword made it into extras without being optified? |
| 22:14.43 | ShadowJK | that's huge bug |
| 22:15.15 | RST38h | Ehehe |
| 22:15.33 | RST38h | It also does not seem to work very well =( |
| 22:15.35 | pupnik | thanks ptl |
| 22:16.16 | ShadowJK | so 10 people didn't notice it uses almost 14 megs? |
| 22:17.01 | ptl | it seems so... |
| 22:17.07 | ShadowJK | That's a huge chunk of the free space between vanilla-n900 and ssu-no-longer-works... |
| 22:17.09 | ptl | I'll work out and when I get back I'll open the bug report |
| 22:18.13 | RST38h | "...has the unusual property of altering the laws of mathematics in its vicinity, causing rounding errors to occur unless calculated using a base-23 system." |
| 22:18.15 | *** join/#maemo MrGoose (~cache@5ac86e78.bb.sky.com) |
| 22:19.12 | ShadowJK | oh it's only in -devel |
| 22:20.10 | wazd | now THAT's an irony |
| 22:20.34 | wazd | apple added accelerometer to the iPhone to switch screen orientation without buttons |
| 22:20.45 | wazd | and now they added button to turn it off |
| 22:21.13 | wazd | pure genius :) |
| 22:22.06 | RST38h | wazd: picture! picture! |
| 22:22.50 | *** part/#maemo frikinz (~lulu@p5B0C55D1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:23.04 | wazd | http://gizmodo.com/5491899/the-ipads-surprise-button-screen-orientation-lock |
| 22:23.52 | RST38h | OMG |
| 22:23.59 | RST38h | they added MORE BUTTONS! |
| 22:25.13 | inz | Doesn't sound like apple; I thought they believed in one button(tm) |
| 22:25.56 | RST38h | inz: Rumors say that one button is modeled after Steve Jobs' belly button |
| 22:26.10 | RST38h | [of course, remember that next time you are clicking it] |
| 22:26.14 | wazd | RST38h: well, they actually changed the functionality of silent switch :) |
| 22:26.24 | wazd | RST38h: but the irony is overwhelming :) |
| 22:26.27 | inz | RST, haven't used any apple products in ages. |
| 22:26.45 | *** join/#maemo Mousey (~wtfisme@sea02-v600-nat.marchex.com) |
| 22:26.49 | RST38h | wazd: their keyboards have more than one button, I have one and can attest |
| 22:28.33 | ponyofdeath | what is the best way to wipe personal data from an nokia n900 before RMAing it? |
| 22:28.34 | wazd | RST38h: screw buttons, they reinvented accelerometer back :D |
| 22:28.56 | *** join/#maemo Mousey (~wtfisme@sea02-v600-nat.marchex.com) |
| 22:29.04 | RST38h | wazd: Wait until they reinvent multitasking... |
| 22:31.19 | *** join/#maemo gjl (~gjl@cpc1-seve21-2-0-cust257.13-3.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 22:33.41 | DocScrutinizer | ponyofdeath: flash rootfs and eMMC |
| 22:35.13 | DocScrutinizer | ponyofdeath: no idea though if there's some sort of call history inside modem, and if so how to clear it then |
| 22:36.47 | *** join/#maemo JoeBrain (~JoeBrain@173-11-92-50-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 22:37.41 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (~javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 22:38.16 | VDVsx | tries to patent "button to turn accelerometer off" |
| 22:38.25 | VDVsx | damn, already patented by apple :P |
| 22:38.56 | javispedro | what? |
| 22:39.07 | VDVsx | http://gizmodo.com/5491899/the-ipads-surprise-button-screen-orientation-lock |
| 22:39.11 | *** join/#maemo Jophish_n900 (~Jophish@hermi.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 22:39.15 | javispedro | they patented it? |
| 22:39.24 | javispedro | Ctrl+Shift+I! Prior art! ;) |
| 22:39.32 | *** join/#maemo jabis (~jabis@69.162.91.23) |
| 22:39.55 | VDVsx | dunno, just joking |
| 22:40.11 | VDVsx | they patented "slide to unlock", so... |
| 22:40.23 | javispedro | the good news is that if apple does it we can rest assured devices to come for the next years will have it (and more buttons is _always_ a good thing) |
| 22:40.31 | VDVsx | they are using that patent against Nokia and HTC :D |
| 22:41.00 | ptl | how long until patent law blows up and dies? |
| 22:41.07 | RST38h | So, no slide-to-unlock in the next tablet/ |
| 22:41.08 | RST38h | ? |
| 22:41.17 | javispedro | btw, moo :) |
| 22:41.30 | RST38h | ptl: Well let us make bets: patent law or health system? |
| 22:41.36 | RST38h | javis: moo indeed |
| 22:41.43 | RST38h | ptl: which one goes first? =) |
| 22:42.00 | VDVsx | RST38h, probably the N900 has to leave the US market, since has slide to unlock, lolol |
| 22:42.08 | VDVsx | same for a couple of droids |
| 22:42.11 | VDVsx | so silly |
| 22:42.12 | derf | They've been working on HCR since the early 90's. |
| 22:42.26 | derf | While efforts to reform patent law are just starting, and going in the wrong direction. |
| 22:42.36 | *** join/#maemo zs__ (~zs@188-220-50-10.zone11.bethere.co.uk) |
| 22:42.51 | ptl | RST38h: :( always the weaker |
| 22:42.54 | RST38h | VDVsx: there is US market for Nokia phones? |
| 22:42.59 | javispedro | "Nokia Asks Judge to Dismiss Apple's Antitrust Claims" :) |
| 22:43.19 | RST38h | Hmm...Modest already managed to create a folder on my newly inserted sd card |
| 22:43.33 | VDVsx | very wrong direction when someone can patent great inventions like slide to unlock |
| 22:43.35 | javispedro | "he most recent move comes from Nokia, who seeks to dismiss Apple's antritrust claims using pretty much the same arguments Apple used to counter Psystar's antitrust claims." |
| 22:43.35 | VDVsx | :D |
| 22:43.47 | *** join/#maemo swc|666 (~infidel20@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 22:44.14 | *** join/#maemo lbt_ (~david@Maemo/community/contributor/lbt) |
| 22:45.51 | VDVsx | my favorite patent is the one that tries to patent "patent trolls" :D |
| 22:45.55 | VDVsx | awesome |
| 22:46.31 | ptl | is it possible to have an analogue for the GPL in the patent world? |
| 22:46.56 | RST38h | VDVsx: Well, as this wonderful system is starting to intefere with large corporations' business, it will probably get reformed in the next 10-20 years |
| 22:47.01 | ptl | like 'you can't patent that idea and its derivatives, but you can use as you will' |
| 22:47.34 | nid0 | and whod use it? |
| 22:47.37 | RST38h | VDVsx: Nobody gives a shit about Joe the Innovator, but when it comes to Microsoft or IBM or Google... |
| 22:48.22 | ptl | nid0: whoever wants it |
| 22:48.39 | VDVsx | I think they can't sue you if use their patents in OSS projects and don't sell anything |
| 22:48.51 | nid0 | no company is going to design things and patent them with a "use this for free" patent |
| 22:49.02 | Pio | oo i think they can |
| 22:49.22 | ptl | IBM did something like that |
| 22:49.28 | RST38h | derf: I will believe in HCR once it is completed and a person will be able to walk into a hospital and get care, without losing their life savings in a week |
| 22:49.29 | ptl | made some patents available for public use |
| 22:49.55 | nid0 | yeah they probably threw 4 or 5 simplistic patents into the wild to look good for PR reasons |
| 22:50.05 | RST38h | derf: before that it is bullshit and the competition of patent law vs health care stands ;) |
| 22:50.05 | ptl | anyway, they did. |
| 22:50.10 | VDVsx | here's the patent of all patents :D :http://boingboing.net/2008/11/17/halliburton-tries-to.html |
| 22:50.15 | nid0 | could you imagine the income an IP company like nokia would lose by making their patents freely usable? |
| 22:50.19 | nid0 | not a chance |
| 22:50.20 | VDVsx | probably will be accepted :D |
| 22:50.21 | ptl | it's better than nothing and tells us there is something wrong with patents |
| 22:50.32 | Pio | nid0, they just lose their ability to countersue apple :) |
| 22:50.44 | javispedro | what we need is clearly, a patent, patent-testing and patent-stable set of repositories. |
| 22:50.48 | nid0 | and make money from every other mobile device manufacture on the planet |
| 22:50.54 | javispedro | s/patent-stable/patent-devel (how could I get that wrong?) |
| 22:51.08 | nid0 | whats 1 lawsuit when every other mobile there is is paying them royalties |
| 22:51.14 | nid0 | mobile company* |
| 22:51.43 | Pio | ugh i try not to think about it.. it just hurts my head |
| 22:51.47 | VDVsx | nid0, well, as long they don't patent things like slide to unlock |
| 22:51.50 | RST38h | oh cooool ovi maps found me |
| 22:51.58 | Arif_ | where were you? |
| 22:54.01 | ptl | patent-granting, patent-pending and patent-applied would be more appropriate, don't you think? |
| 22:54.11 | ptl | *patent-granted |
| 22:54.35 | RST38h | Arif: Outside of the range for which I downloaded maps offline |
| 22:54.42 | Arif_ | aww |
| 22:54.46 | Arif_ | just download whole EU |
| 22:54.58 | RST38h | Arif: Why would I need EU? |
| 22:55.09 | Arif_ | US then? |
| 22:55.16 | ptl | I tried to use ovi maps these days |
| 22:55.17 | RST38h | Whole US is a 1.1GB ZIP |
| 22:55.26 | ptl | I can't understand it |
| 22:55.28 | RST38h | just got the states he expects to visit |
| 22:55.28 | ptl | really |
| 22:55.29 | Arif_ | that's not too big |
| 22:55.36 | ptl | it's so different from the regular GPS programs |
| 22:55.39 | ptl | tried mapper also |
| 22:55.44 | ptl | no better |
| 22:55.49 | RST38h | yes, it is fucked up |
| 22:55.58 | RST38h | We all kinda know that already though |
| 22:57.07 | ptl | But I know why Sygic didn't make it into Ovi Story |
| 22:57.29 | RST38h | not yet at least |
| 22:57.32 | ptl | it's due to the fact that Ovi Maps will be greatly improved on PR 1.2 and will trump Sygic maps! |
| 22:57.41 | RST38h | The best mapping program for N900 is Maep at the moment |
| 22:58.01 | ptl | so nokia is avoiding the shame of sygic |
| 22:58.04 | RST38h | Its only drawback is that you have to predownload manually by browsing the map. Not a very good idea |
| 22:58.04 | ptl | maep??? |
| 22:58.29 | RST38h | is still hoping that someone will write a Python script that predownloads Maep data |
| 22:58.44 | ptl | it says it's simple |
| 22:58.49 | ptl | is it better than mapper? |
| 22:58.54 | RST38h | yes. it works. |
| 22:59.01 | RST38h | mapper does not, right now |
| 22:59.01 | ptl | mapper might be complicated but it has many features |
| 22:59.42 | *** join/#maemo hassanakevazir (~hassanake@CPE0021296837af-CM001ceacc8352.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:59.45 | ptl | does it trace routes? |
| 23:00.13 | *** part/#maemo richieeee72 (~richard@host86-156-152-171.range86-156.btcentralplus.com) |
| 23:03.02 | RST38h | ptl: Mapper current has problems downloading maps. |
| 23:03.07 | RST38h | currently |
| 23:04.52 | thresh | it has some other problems as well |
| 23:05.02 | thresh | like it's ridiculously SLOW |
| 23:06.20 | *** join/#maemo chantra (~chantra@ns22757.ovh.net) |
| 23:06.28 | RST38h | thresh: correct |
| 23:06.58 | RST38h | thresh: Maybe we should provide Shmuma with a box of beer every time he makes an improvement? :) |
| 23:07.34 | *** join/#maemo flo_lap (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian) |
| 23:08.29 | thresh | RST38h: that could work =) |
| 23:09.11 | RST38h | thresh: ...and allow us to bet on whether he completes the Mapper to a usable condition or becomes alcoholic first |
| 23:10.01 | ptl | in that case, use absinthe. |
| 23:10.03 | ptl | beer just makes you fat. |
| 23:10.12 | RST38h | [notes to himself] No Yandex maps for Maryland. |
| 23:10.35 | ptl | (absinthe - the best drink ever) |
| 23:10.43 | thresh | prefers whiskey |
| 23:10.52 | RST38h | ptl: is that absinthe telling you that? |
| 23:11.06 | RST38h | into a non-yet-amputated ear? =) |
| 23:11.13 | ptl | lol |
| 23:11.19 | ptl | you could say so |
| 23:11.31 | *** join/#maemo Djkrikke (~Djkrikke@d54C2F708.access.telenet.be) |
| 23:13.16 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslip (~fnoridans@94-30-69-47.xdsl.murphx.net) |
| 23:13.23 | ptl | With real absinthe, you can't really really become alcoholic in short term, it's expensive and it has to be drunk following a ritual, it's better with people around and it is more of a social drink. Also, you have to dilute it on water to taste it like it should - the essential oils it has only become active (and make themselves be tasted) when the alcoholic degree decreases. |
| 23:13.39 | ptl | ok, too offtopic |
| 23:13.50 | RST38h | this sounds like a drug addiction |
| 23:13.50 | ptl | sorry |
| 23:13.53 | thresh | nothing is too offtopic in a middle of friday night |
| 23:13.59 | RST38h | so, no, it won't be *called* alcoholism |
| 23:14.30 | ptl | yeah, that's thujone, absinthe even has an active ingredient whose psychoactive effects are not yet well known |
| 23:14.50 | ptl | I even bought a thujone addictive for my absinthe from China. |
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| 23:27.32 | crashanddie | tybollt: haven't noticed anything of the like |
| 23:27.53 | crashanddie | tybollt: but then again, I'm always in hotels, so maybe the owners will get arrested from browsing porn in a couple of months after I'm long gone |
| 23:34.35 | *** join/#maemo Constantinegggfg (uaconstant@91.202.130.222) |
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| 23:46.36 | javispedro | I really dislike how both the N810/N900 touch panels lose precision and sensitiveness in borders. |
| 23:46.52 | *** part/#maemo Constantinegggfg (uaconstant@91.202.130.222) |
| 23:46.59 | *** join/#maemo wazd_e63 (~wazd@188.123.241.73) |
| 23:47.21 | javispedro | why? these two are the only two resistive panels where I've seen this happen. |
| 23:47.33 | *** part/#maemo MrGoose (~cache@5ac86e78.bb.sky.com) |
| 23:47.59 | pupnik | i dunno |
| 23:48.26 | pupnik | just watched 5 youtubes, browsed 10 sites. battery half gone |
| 23:51.10 | ptl | pupnik: in firefox or microb? |
| 23:51.28 | ptl | I've noticed that firefox (fennec) supports on N900 html5 perfectly |
| 23:51.40 | ptl | I can see all html5 videos on youtube and even play html5 games |
| 23:51.49 | pupnik | ptl in zoutube to save battery |
| 23:51.58 | ptl | k |
| 23:52.01 | pupnik | hmm wow |
| 23:52.10 | *** join/#maemo gjl_ (~gjl@cpc1-seve21-2-0-cust257.13-3.cable.virginmedia.com) |
| 23:52.23 | ptl | in fennec, you have to go to about:config and enable.html5 to true |
| 23:52.36 | ptl | and then join the beta html5 program of youtube |
| 23:52.41 | ptl | but just that, then it works |
| 23:52.49 | pupnik | sweet |
| 23:53.22 | pupnik | do they transcode existing youtubes to play in html5 ptl? |
| 23:53.59 | ptl | not all of them |
| 23:54.04 | ptl | but many of them they do |
| 23:54.19 | ptl | you'll notice when it's html5... the loading spin-wheel shows 'html5' on it |
| 23:54.24 | ptl | and the controls are slightly different |
| 23:56.00 | *** join/#maemo svu (~svu@089-101-099223.ntlworld.ie) |
| 23:58.54 | *** join/#maemo wizkoder (~quassel@190.27.60.141) |
| 23:59.12 | josephnexus | does the n900 support html5? |
| 23:59.29 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 23:59.36 | josephnexus | bummer |
| 23:59.37 | SpeedEvil | It's a computer, the browser does that |
| 23:59.48 | ptl | josephnexus: fennec does |
