| 00:00.13 | mece | Ken-Young, agh--crap. I have the same one. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5232 says that the problem should have been fixed in 0.1.0-1maemo1 |
| 00:00.14 | povbot | Bug 5232: Desktop Widget does not appear in "Add Widget" list |
| 00:00.34 | *** join/#maemo ravas (~rexs@c-24-18-245-99.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 00:03.44 | *** part/#maemo Crash2108 (~Crash@65.29.58.169) |
| 00:05.59 | Xisdibik | wazd: I see one issue with your Marina theme |
| 00:08.04 | wazd | Xisdibik: let me guess |
| 00:08.08 | wazd | Xisdibik: gear? :) |
| 00:09.01 | Xisdibik | wazd: gear? what gear? in modest, the author/time are in blue, which happens to be the color that new mail is supposed to be as well :P |
| 00:09.30 | wazd | Xisdibik: can you make a screenshot? |
| 00:09.32 | Xisdibik | I opened my email and was like woah howd all my mail become unread.. oh its not :P |
| 00:09.48 | Xisdibik | well lemme test it a little first |
| 00:09.52 | Xisdibik | gonna send myself a mail and see how it looks |
| 00:10.28 | Xisdibik | ah its ok wazd |
| 00:10.36 | Xisdibik | the Subject shows in blue if its unread |
| 00:10.43 | Xisdibik | so i can distinguish between unread and red |
| 00:10.44 | Xisdibik | read* |
| 00:11.59 | *** join/#maemo B-man|N900 (~b-man17@cpe-98-30-191-249.woh.res.rr.com) |
| 00:22.19 | Pavel | On Ovi Maps on N900, is there a way to "bookmark" a location for future use? |
| 00:23.29 | *** join/#maemo panaggio (~panaggio@187.35.243.216) |
| 20:03.38 | *** join/#maemo infobot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 20:03.38 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo | http://maemo.org/ | http://maemo.nokia.com/ | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org/ | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Free software mirror: http://espejo.freemoe.org/ |
| 20:03.47 | javispedro | s/suddenly/which is suddenly |
| 20:03.59 | t-tan | javispedro: have you? |
| 20:04.03 | odin_ | javispedro, block allocation is simple to detect, if the write is heading for an unallocated block we know its new data, the only issue is out-of-order matters (since you can not control the order the implemntation manipulated the logical device) |
| 20:04.24 | GeneralAntilles | wazd, seriously, Marina's quite tasty. |
| 20:04.30 | GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, try it yet? |
| 20:04.41 | timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: marina? |
| 20:04.44 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah |
| 20:05.21 | GeneralAntilles | and can somebody PLEASE give me some input here? http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/community/57839 |
| 20:05.22 | javispedro | t-tan: odin_: I tried to do this to support writes to builtin Palm T|X drive through Mass Storage. And it is a engineering nightmare. |
| 20:05.28 | odin_ | javispedro, think of it like a load of open transactions but at some point the the picture will become clear |
| 20:05.37 | GeneralAntilles | (preferably on -community so it'll stimulate some discussion) |
| 20:05.49 | jophish | ok, no worries. thanks anyway t-tan |
| 20:05.56 | timeless_mbp | is it in extras or do i need testing? |
| 20:05.59 | *** join/#maemo guysoft42 (~guysoft@93-173-231-97.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 20:06.07 | GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, should be in -testing. |
| 20:06.09 | t-tan | odin_, javispedro: a read only solution should be easy |
| 20:06.12 | *** join/#maemo Mysterious (~Jonas@d047045.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 20:06.26 | odin_ | javispedro, you can quickly detect writes to: superblock, FAT1, FAT2, directory, existing file, new data block (on a request by request basis) |
| 20:06.27 | javispedro | t-tan: a both sides read-only solution, yes. |
| 20:06.38 | javispedro | t-tan: if you factor in writes are coming from the ext3 side, it's not easy any longer |
| 20:06.46 | javispedro | t-tan: it's a suicide |
| 20:07.21 | javispedro | odin_: again, please grab a dump of the access patterns of the windows fastfat driver. you'd be surprised. |
| 20:07.37 | timeless_mbp | i don't see it in testing |
| 20:07.40 | timeless_mbp | maybe it's installed? :) |
| 20:07.42 | odin_ | write's can't come from ext3, by definition the host expects it to have exclusive access to the filesystem |
| 20:07.53 | GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, or possibly -devel, not sure. |
| 20:08.24 | t-tan | javispedro: correct. you'd have to lock all exported files |
| 20:08.47 | konttori | GeneralAntilles: what input do you need? |
| 20:08.58 | TomaszD | US-based people, there's a cool linux-based gadget for cheap only today http://www.woot.com/ |
| 20:09.09 | odin_ | the existing mechanism must already have a stratagy for merging changes by N900 and changes over USB, but I'm saying you can control kernel block allocation (and availability to never error) |
| 20:09.46 | javispedro | so basically you're going to present two diferent filesystem to both sides? |
| 20:09.47 | jophish | If I wanted to have /var/cache symlinked to /home/var/cache what would be the best way of doing this, so that it works over a reboot |
| 20:10.33 | t-tan | jophish: should be no problem - it is preserved over reboots |
| 20:10.37 | odin_ | javispedro, well the FAT version is 100% emulated, it doesn't exist as FAT, but the FAT layout and design is used as the communication mechnism |
| 20:11.00 | jophish | thanks t-tan |
| 20:11.11 | *** join/#maemo ptl_ (~patola@201-68-171-146.dsl.telesp.net.br) |
| 20:11.17 | GeneralAntilles | konttori, anything, really. |
| 20:11.23 | GeneralAntilles | konttori, particularly stuff about the specific metrics, though. |
| 20:11.26 | jaska | iirc qemu does fat-emulation |
| 20:11.30 | konttori | that the idea of statistics is nice? |
| 20:11.55 | GeneralAntilles | konttori, mostly about the specifics of said statistics. |
| 20:12.10 | konttori | Well, one interesting metric would be votes killed (so bug X has 20 bugs, it's resolved -> 20 votes killed) per month per component? |
| 20:12.13 | GeneralAntilles | konttori, input on how to get qualitative answers from the data, etc. |
| 20:12.50 | konttori | and that compared to open votes for that component. |
| 20:13.16 | konttori | that gives a nice metric of speed a component is fixing serious issues. |
| 20:13.27 | konttori | or that it's not |
| 20:13.49 | GeneralAntilles | The 3 samples I put in the email were weirdly consistent. |
| 20:13.58 | timeless_mbp | konttori: what to do about votes on wontfix bugs |
| 20:14.01 | wazd | GeneralAntilles: well, thanks again, glad you enjoy it :) |
| 20:14.09 | timeless_mbp | there's a bug asking the browser bookmarks menu to match the browser menu |
| 20:14.22 | timeless_mbp | the ui team doesn't like making things consistent, so the bug's wontfix |
| 20:14.30 | konttori | timeless - interesting choice. I suppose they remain as if they were actual bugs. |
| 20:14.32 | timeless_mbp | would actually not mind having the menu items present |
| 20:14.40 | timeless_mbp | the problem though |
| 20:14.48 | timeless_mbp | is that a bug can potentially have 100 voters |
| 20:14.51 | GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, provide commentary about how much we hate UI people and a management? :P |
| 20:14.52 | timeless_mbp | and be wontfix |
| 20:14.53 | konttori | Invalid is a different resolution and then they should be treated as if they never existed |
| 20:15.14 | *** join/#maemo wazd_ (~wazd@80-240-220-132.dnat.migtel.ru) |
| 20:15.23 | RST38h | wazd moo |
| 20:15.27 | timeless_mbp | GeneralAntilles: actually, most of the ui people ceased to exist as of today |
| 20:15.28 | GeneralAntilles | But, really, stupid stuff that ends up on Talk and gets 50 votes but is WONTFIX because it's stupid skews stuff. |
| 20:15.30 | *** join/#maemo ceolin (~ceolin@201.82.175.29) |
| 20:15.31 | konttori | timeless_mbp: doesn't that still mean that that issue was something that 100 people wanted fixed and it's still not fixed? |
| 20:15.31 | timeless_mbp | so we now hate ghosts |
| 20:16.18 | konttori | perhaps the wontfix statistics should only affect that single month but not subsequent? |
| 20:16.44 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (~ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 20:16.53 | timeless_mbp | i could live w/ that |
| 20:16.59 | GeneralAntilles | As far as grading goes, |
| 20:17.22 | GeneralAntilles | I'm mostly interested in getting people from those products involved in Bugzilla. |
| 20:17.42 | timeless_mbp | we just had someone do an internal review |
| 20:17.52 | timeless_mbp | and about the only positive mark was general involvement in the internal bugzilla |
| 20:18.03 | GeneralAntilles | So whether stuff is being looked at and responded to by @Nokia (and @Nokia contractor) persons. |
| 20:18.05 | timeless_mbp | we have a bunch of other tools which got very high NEGATIVE marks |
| 20:18.31 | jophish | nothing should break if I just use a small FAT loop file on a large ext3 partition as /home/user/Mydocs? |
| 20:18.46 | jophish | going to get rid of the fat partition completly |
| 20:18.49 | timeless_mbp | jophish: very funny |
| 20:19.03 | timeless_mbp | that won't make usb mass storage magically work |
| 20:19.14 | jophish | oh, and fix that too |
| 20:19.26 | timeless_mbp | i'm not sure if camera will work |
| 20:19.36 | timeless_mbp | i didn't spend enough time figuring out what the heck it was doing |
| 20:19.40 | GeneralAntilles | I'd like to encourage higher "positive" resolution rates, but the number of factors involved in that makes trying to make those numbers useful more difficult. |
| 20:20.04 | *** join/#maemo ignacius (~ignacius@193.153.107.19) |
| 20:20.25 | jophish | timeless, I believe that the camera can output to ext3 now |
| 20:20.51 | GeneralAntilles | It'd be easier if people were more careful about actually picking up bugs. |
| 20:20.52 | Damion2 | may work if you point /dev/blkthing1 to loop0 but that probably won't last past a reboot |
| 20:21.07 | GeneralAntilles | If somebody says they're working on something, then they need to mark it ASSIGNED. . . . |
| 20:21.27 | Damion2 | I think stock boot expects 3rd part tol be fat. dunno what size |
| 20:21.28 | jophish | changing /usr/sbin/osso-usb-mass-storage-enable.sh |
| 20:21.42 | jophish | the third partition is swap |
| 20:21.45 | Damion2 | ah |
| 20:21.48 | jophish | first is fat by default |
| 20:21.51 | Damion2 | k |
| 20:22.28 | Damion2 | anyway I know ruskie had to flash his a few times playing |
| 20:23.29 | ifreq | tryes to crosscompile some games for maemo |
| 20:23.33 | ruskie | a few lol |
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| 20:23.57 | *** join/#maemo asedeno_work (~asedeno@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com) |
| 20:23.57 | Damion2 | you could linear concat raid several 4GB blocks on the fat to make large ext2/3 part |
| 20:24.07 | *** part/#maemo domenico3444 (~domenic@host106-5-dynamic.246-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 20:24.08 | ruskie | 5 days straight when I got it, probably once every 4-5 hours |
| 20:24.15 | *** join/#maemo asj_ (~asj@124-171-132-105.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 20:25.01 | jophish | ruskie, Thanks for your efforts |
| 20:25.16 | jophish | mind if I explain what I'm going to do? |
| 20:25.20 | t-tan | jophish: I've uploaded an edited version of my restore script http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Tanner (untested) |
| 20:25.21 | Damion2 | it's dos style partition despite being completely different architecture? |
| 20:25.24 | jophish | oh thanks t-tan |
| 20:25.45 | Damion2 | you might be able to shrink fat and make p4 out of the space after kit |
| 20:25.46 | Damion2 | it |
| 20:25.49 | ruskie | Damion2, just how data is stored on the partition |
| 20:25.53 | ruskie | jophish, sure thing |
| 20:26.59 | Damion2 | ruskie: yes, but it's based on old BIOS things like having an active boot flag and pointless 512bytes at the start |
| 20:27.43 | jophish | On the internal flash, one large ext3 partition and the 700mb swap. a bunch of things from /usr symlinked to dirs on the ext3 partition. And a small FAT loop in /home/user |
| 20:28.17 | jophish | scripts I have to update are, the mass storage ones, and /etc/event.d/rcS-late |
| 20:30.00 | *** join/#maemo pupnik (~pupnik@unaffiliated/pupnik) |
| 20:30.01 | *** join/#maemo woglinde (~heinold@g225006225.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:30.05 | woglinde | jo |
| 20:30.11 | woglinde | ~seen javispedro |
| 20:30.15 | infobot | javispedro <~javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 20m 29s ago, saying: 'so basically you're going to present two diferent filesystem to both sides?'. |
| 20:30.43 | asj_ | waves good morning to everyone |
| 20:30.54 | woglinde | *g* |
| 20:31.02 | woglinde | its nearly time to go to bed |
| 20:31.26 | jophish | goodnight |
| 20:31.31 | pupnik | johnsu01: looks like nethack needs a symlink or shellscript in /usr/bin |
| 20:31.38 | *** join/#maemo user__ (~user@hermi.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 20:31.48 | woglinde | he pupnik |
| 20:32.17 | *** join/#maemo spectre- (~n900@41.202.225.146) |
| 20:32.41 | Damion2 | I wonder if the kernel would panic if a r/o fat mount changed underneath it |
| 20:33.23 | *** join/#maemo user__ (~user@hermi.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 20:33.30 | odin_ | Damion2, why should it panic ? |
| 20:33.33 | Damion2 | if I r/o mount MyDocs after it's exported to my ps3 |
| 20:33.48 | Damion2 | then videos saved to it could be rsynced to my nas |
| 20:34.03 | johnsu01 | pupnik: Yeah, not sure what to do about that -- the issue is /usr/games not being in the default $PATH which I believe is also true on typical gnu/linux systems |
| 20:34.17 | Damion2 | odin_: it'll be changing at the block layer beyond what it's expecting |
| 20:34.21 | woglinde | hm debian has it |
| 20:34.23 | cehteh | accessing a block device concurrently by filesystems is a reciepe for desaster |
| 20:34.39 | satmd | breakage guaranteed |
| 20:34.54 | Damion2 | cehteh: the mount would be ro :) |
| 20:34.58 | *** join/#maemo Jophish_n900 (~Jophish@hermi.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 20:35.01 | cehteh | still |
| 20:35.22 | Damion2 | I have an EyeFi which does it |
| 20:35.27 | johnsu01 | woglinde: it does? |
| 20:35.28 | cehteh | r/o still means the kernel caches vital datastructures in ram |
| 20:35.41 | woglinde | johnsu01 /usr/games in path |
| 20:35.48 | Damion2 | yes that was my q about likelihood for panics |
| 20:35.50 | cehteh | if these get changed unexpected then it will break |
| 20:35.51 | pupnik | johnsu01: yeah, and how to make that change so that it works for autobuilder? don't ask me |
| 20:35.51 | johnsu01 | woglinde: my install doesn't seem to... |
| 20:35.57 | cehteh | Damion2: dont do that |
| 20:36.00 | woglinde | /usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games |
| 20:36.27 | johnsu01 | woglinde: is that defined somewhere other than /etc/skel? |
| 20:36.44 | Damion2 | cehteh: maybe detect activity in the usb exported storage daemon and umount, then remount for rsync when the ps3 settles down |
| 20:36.56 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (~javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:37.02 | johnsu01 | wow, it's awesome that mmpc pauses my stereo when the phone rings |
| 20:37.17 | cehteh | Damion2: mounted device will not be exported, usb-storage connected device can not be mounted |
| 20:37.18 | *** join/#maemo wazd (~Miranda@80-240-220-132.dnat.migtel.ru) |
| 20:37.26 | woglinde | zsh/zshenv: export PATH="/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/games" |
| 20:37.35 | johnsu01 | ah zsh :) |
| 20:37.38 | cehteh | unless you circumvent that somehow .. but then you really shoot in your own foot |
| 20:37.41 | woglinde | same for bash |
| 20:37.57 | woglinde | hm or not |
| 20:38.14 | cehteh | Damion2: you can use mtools to access a fat block device without mounting it, that should be safe |
| 20:38.19 | johnsu01 | woglinde: yeah, I don't think so, I've had this in my .bashrc for a long time |
| 20:38.34 | woglinde | login.defs:ENV_PATH PATH=/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/local/games:/usr/games |
| 20:39.24 | Damion2 | cehteh: ahh yes mixed with fuse it could seem to be mounted |
| 20:39.30 | Jophish_n900 | ruskie, replacing the partition table with this: http://pastebin.com/m3248f90b |
| 20:39.45 | Jophish_n900 | not so sure about p2 there though |
| 20:39.48 | *** join/#maemo Dantonic (~david@c-24-7-146-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 20:39.48 | Damion2 | cehteh: unmounted device can be presented at the client usbstorage |
| 20:39.56 | cehteh | Damion2: soem fuse-mounting might work too *if* you explicitly turn off all caching |
| 20:40.02 | pupnik | and there's the 'fun' with our debhelper that doesn't seem to accept alternate destination prefixes. see odin_ |
| 20:40.02 | *** join/#maemo trem (~trem@AToulouse-256-1-104-191.w86-210.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:40.08 | javispedro | cehteh: on both sides |
| 20:40.17 | Damion2 | cehteh: I'd write that part myself |
| 20:40.22 | ShadowJK | at some point using smb/cifs or nfs becomes more sensible.. |
| 20:40.38 | cehteh | yes but libfuse caches some things internally iirc you have to turn that off |
| 20:40.46 | pupnik | at no point is nfs sensible for a wlan connection |
| 20:40.51 | woglinde | pupnik? |
| 20:41.13 | *** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (~timeless@Maemo/community/contributor/timeless) |
| 20:41.20 | *** join/#maemo satmd|n900 (~satmd@88-117-48-87.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 20:41.27 | Damion2 | cehteh: ps3 mounts the block dev from my phone. I monitor load / data in/out on the block and mount r/o to run a quick rsync before umount |
| 20:41.31 | javispedro | well, from a security point of view, only all_squash nfs is "safe". |
| 20:41.31 | johnsu01 | woglinde: Hm, yeah, guess so. So the question is why doesn't maemo do that? :) |
| 20:41.52 | cehteh | Damion2: i'd opt for some usb-storeage server which emulates a virtual FAT over any other filesystem |
| 20:41.57 | timeless_mbp | konttori: remind me to try to lecture people about strings |
| 20:42.11 | cehteh | that would be awesome and there is already some code in qemu for doing that readonly |
| 20:42.21 | javispedro | cehteh: ... that doesn't work in windows |
| 20:42.23 | timeless_mbp | they're mixing strings for Fooâupdated <h:mm> and Fooâupdated <date+time> |
| 20:42.30 | timeless_mbp | which unfortunately doesn't work |
| 20:42.31 | cehteh | who cares about windows :P |
| 20:42.41 | woglinde | johnsu01 dont ask me |
| 20:42.44 | javispedro | cehteh: if you don't care about windows why are you keeping the FAT partition in the first place |
| 20:42.51 | ShadowJK | suggests rsync over usb then |
| 20:42.51 | woglinde | maybee its not following LSB |
| 20:42.58 | cehteh | dunno i would delete it :) |
| 20:43.06 | Damion2 | cehteh: eek not sure that's feasable. the mounting device expects a stock block it can do what it wants with |
| 20:43.33 | cehteh | well would quite some work to do, you have to virtualize a complete fat system |
| 20:43.35 | javispedro | it's feasable when both sides are read only, and even then is hard. |
| 20:43.36 | Damion2 | my mount of say ext then colnverted into a fake blobk with fat? v.hard |
| 20:43.37 | timeless_mbp | cehteh: yeah, it's really "not simple" |
| 20:43.44 | konttori | are you talking about region settings? |
| 20:43.48 | konttori | or what? |
| 20:43.49 | timeless_mbp | konttori: no |
| 20:43.55 | timeless_mbp | MfE's sync status |
| 20:43.56 | Damion2 | look up the eyefi |
| 20:43.58 | timeless_mbp | in the system menu |
| 20:44.10 | timeless_mbp | cehteh: the system can make an arbitrary series of writes over an arbitrary amount of time |
| 20:44.15 | konttori | oh, well, I suppose we can mess up dates in other places and not just in locales |
| 20:44.22 | konttori | (or the lack of use of locales) |
| 20:44.23 | cehteh | i am actually wondering why the n900 doesnt do usb networking by default and starts a samba for the poor windows users |
| 20:44.39 | timeless_mbp | cehteh: because windows doesn't come w/ usb networking drivers |
| 20:44.42 | timeless_mbp | which means it wouldn't work |
| 20:44.46 | cehteh | that would be simple enough to setup and way more flexible |
| 20:44.48 | timeless_mbp | this stuff has been discussed |
| 20:44.48 | SpeedEvil | it's not only windows |
| 20:44.52 | timeless_mbp | it's also in the #maemo logs |
| 20:44.53 | Damion2 | yeah. other that playstation I use ssh and sshfs |
| 20:44.54 | cehteh | timeless: ewww |
| 20:44.56 | timeless_mbp | i know, because i put it there |
| 20:45.02 | SpeedEvil | it's also plugging it into a printer - and having it 'just work' to print photos |
| 20:45.06 | timeless_mbp | now, be a good boy and find the logs so i can write them up |
| 20:45.10 | SpeedEvil | if the printer can take mass storage devices. |
| 20:45.12 | javispedro | Damion2: the eyefi requires a "compatible" camera |
| 20:45.20 | SpeedEvil | or mp3 systems... |
| 20:45.27 | timeless_mbp | but yeah, what SpeedEvil said |
| 20:45.30 | timeless_mbp | it's not just windows |
| 20:45.36 | cehteh | SpeedEvil: it doesnt support PICT bridge anyways .. thats another thing :P |
| 20:45.41 | timeless_mbp | usb mass storage is the universal standard because it's the universal standard |
| 20:45.52 | ShadowJK | when I plug in my N900, in "charging only" mode it pretends to be a usb ethernet thing of some sort |
| 20:45.54 | *** join/#maemo Aisling (ash@blk-222-192-36.eastlink.ca) |
| 20:45.55 | cehteh | yeah and FAT sux |
| 20:46.02 | Damion2 | javispedro: by compatible camera that just means /DCIM/100CANON/filename.jpg |
| 20:46.19 | *** join/#maemo onen|openBmap (~quassel@vbo91-1-89-87-201-85.dsl.club-internet.fr) |
| 20:46.23 | javispedro | Damion2: no. it means they have a _specific_ fat driver they care about |
| 20:46.25 | javispedro | and ignore the rest. |
| 20:46.47 | Damion2 | my linux box saved in to that dir and it worked |
| 20:46.47 | ShadowJK | But you could do like the S60 people have done, put pcsuite "drivers" on a windows readable partition with autostart |
| 20:46.50 | cehteh | hence the rather complicated suggestion to make some virtual fat server .. |
| 20:46.57 | javispedro | Damion2: how do you tell it to upload the fotos? |
| 20:47.02 | cehteh | that would be compatible and flexible .. but quite a lot work to do |
| 20:47.22 | Damion2 | you don't it just seems to detect no save activity and run a sync |
| 20:47.38 | ShadowJK | Nokia is even doing that for linux now, apparently. The CS-15 modem presents itself as a cdrom, and contains .deb for Ubuntu and autostart crud for windows drivers :-) |
| 20:47.38 | satmd|n900 | just port samba? |
| 20:47.48 | javispedro | Damion2: that sounds so stupid. |
| 20:47.51 | *** join/#maemo johnsq (nobody@252.60.broadband3.iol.cz) |
| 20:47.54 | satmd|n900 | or cifs |
| 20:47.58 | johnsq | Hi |
| 20:47.59 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: in charging only mode |
| 20:48.08 | timeless_mbp | you're supposed to be an unconfigured usb device and get 100mA |
| 20:48.13 | javispedro | Damion2: so what If I write half-photo then my computer freezes for a few seconds and it decides to start uploading corrupting photos |
| 20:48.16 | konttori | is using paradigm of no-context-menus in the new media player (and not only to be nice to timeless_mbp) |
| 20:48.22 | Damion2 | it sounds easyfor users and seems to work |
| 20:48.23 | javispedro | *corrupted |
| 20:48.27 | timeless_mbp | if you don't pick pcsuite mode, then we're not supposed to ask for more |
| 20:48.37 | timeless_mbp | konttori: hrm |
| 20:48.47 | Damion2 | javispedro: dunno, cameras probably don't do that |
| 20:48.48 | timeless_mbp | the few context menus in the maemo5 media player are lame |
| 20:48.53 | ShadowJK | timeless_mbp: my N900 presents itself as usb networking and asks for 500mAh in charging only mode |
| 20:48.55 | timeless_mbp | so i won't cry when you show me they aren't there |
| 20:48.57 | javispedro | Damion2: _compatible_ cameras, I remark. |
| 20:48.59 | woglinde | he javis |
| 20:49.02 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: yeah |
| 20:49.02 | javispedro | Damion2: why do you think they keep a list? |
| 20:49.05 | timeless_mbp | iirc we cheat |
| 20:49.11 | timeless_mbp | but historically we didn't |
| 20:49.17 | timeless_mbp | which meant you'd die way too easily |
| 20:49.24 | javispedro | moo woglinde |
| 20:49.26 | ShadowJK | timeless_mbp: I thought it was a clever solution :-) |
| 20:49.32 | woglinde | javis edward nevielle rockz |
| 20:49.32 | *** join/#maemo pobega (~pobega@student-209-222.sunyit.edu) |
| 20:49.37 | Damion2 | javispedro: I think most will work if they save in the right place |
| 20:49.41 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: illegal i believe, but yeah, it's a pretty nice hack |
| 20:49.45 | woglinde | he pushed thumbee support into openjdk |
| 20:50.41 | jophish | I guess that there is no way I can resize the home partition while inside maemo |
| 20:50.44 | javispedro | woglinde: nice |
| 20:50.49 | javispedro | woglinde: have url? |
| 20:50.59 | ShadowJK | is there actual current limiting to 500mA on N900 side? |
| 20:51.09 | ShadowJK | or does it take what it can get.. |
| 20:51.23 | Damion2 | javispedro: you write a byte to /EyeFi/XXXX (I forget the XXXX name) and moments later anotther file in that directory shows a list of detected access points. it's all rather funky |
| 20:51.41 | *** join/#maemo Mousey (~wtfisme@sea02-v600-nat.marchex.com) |
| 20:51.43 | lcuk | you cannt get certified as a usb host device afaik if you supply more than 500ma |
| 20:51.53 | lcuk | Shadikka, ^ |
| 20:51.58 | lcuk | ShadowJK even |
| 20:52.11 | woglinde | javispedro here bugfixing sruff |
| 20:52.15 | woglinde | javis -> http://icedtea.classpath.org/hg/icedtea6/rev/ab2479dd2f87 |
| 20:52.43 | javispedro | woglinde: pretty ironic Zero gained architecture specific support :) |
| 20:52.43 | ShadowJK | in practice lots of computers have no overcurrent protection, or then they just have one limiter for all ports |
| 20:52.55 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: we take 1.2mA from our 'usb charger' |
| 20:53.07 | woglinde | javis I will test it |
| 20:53.10 | cehteh | mA? :) |
| 20:53.16 | timeless_mbp | 1.2A |
| 20:53.18 | timeless_mbp | whatever |
| 20:53.24 | timeless_mbp | what's 1000x between friends? |
| 20:53.27 | woglinde | when I have oe opendjdk support in shape |
| 20:53.33 | cehteh | forever you mean .. what charging would take |
| 20:53.38 | cehteh | hehe |
| 20:53.43 | GeneralAntilles | The new server messages are weirding me out. |
| 20:53.48 | ShadowJK | yeah but the charger tells N900 it's okay to pull as much as it wants until voltage drops.. |
| 20:54.19 | Jaffa | re |
| 20:54.27 | woglinde | jo jaffa |
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| 20:55.19 | javispedro | woglinde: it's nice, though it still surprises me they're using Zero as a JIT... this will end up duplicating a lot of code |
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| 21:02.22 | SpeedEvil | http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/10/02/01/1555206/Nokia-N900-Linux-Smartphone-Running-OS-X?from=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2Fslashdot+%28Slashdot%29&utm_content=Google+Feedfetcher |
| 21:02.48 | ifreq | sigh |
| 21:02.52 | ifreq | "cool" |
| 21:02.53 | iPeter- | Hey how can i change format of date and time on maemo 5? |
| 21:03.02 | *** join/#maemo LuserN800 (~lo@p4FE93F85.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:03.09 | timeless_mbp | sp3000: progress |
| 21:03.09 | timeless_mbp | # Summary: 9 / 53 |
| 21:04.40 | *** join/#maemo Anaconda- (anaconda@xen.ihme.org) |
| 21:05.03 | timeless_mbp | so, that just leaves me w/ the annoying strings |
| 21:05.13 | timeless_mbp | tries to decide how to deal w/ 'to' |
| 21:06.19 | javispedro | is surprised the first think a supposed geek criticizes about the n900 "debianness" is the /etc/sudoers |
| 21:06.27 | javispedro | (on slashdot article) |
| 21:06.32 | Stskeeps | ... |
| 21:06.33 | *** join/#maemo MrGoose1 (~cache@5ac515cd.bb.sky.com) |
| 21:06.52 | timeless_mbp | javispedro: you mean that you have to use /etc/sudoers.d/ ? |
| 21:06.56 | *** join/#maemo jX (~grey@firefox/community/jx) |
| 21:06.59 | timeless_mbp | (and update-sudoers) |
| 21:07.22 | javispedro | timeless: http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1532544&threshold=1&commentsort=0&mode=thread&pid=30985824#30986130 |
| 21:07.26 | pupnik | all intelligence flees http |
| 21:08.03 | timeless_mbp | hrm |
| 21:08.16 | javispedro | "from what I read online". Even more weird. No one in Slashdot is criticizing the "debinannes" of the N900 (in fact the grandposter is saying "it has a sane filesystem layout") |
| 21:09.49 | iPeter- | Is there any own N900 channel where to ask questions bout maemo and how tos |
| 21:10.00 | GeneralAntilles | javispedro, clearly Nokia shills. |
| 21:10.20 | javispedro | GeneralAntilles: that, or no one has it yet. |
| 21:10.25 | pupnik | iPeter-: yes, ##n900 but it hasn't become popular |
| 21:10.36 | Stskeeps | or #maemo-users ? |
| 21:10.38 | iPeter- | Damn |
| 21:10.41 | Stskeeps | nm |
| 21:10.57 | javispedro | though someone hints at the monster behind the facade, quietly: "although N900 had me at 'df -h'". |
| 21:11.29 | woglinde | damn classpath |
| 21:11.30 | pupnik | still getting badsig from maemo.org... :( |
| 21:12.09 | iPeter- | But how to change date style, i have language on english but region setting on Finland, still it shows time like 02/01/10, it should show 01/02/10, where to change it on N900 |
| 21:12.23 | SpeedEvil | you can't |
| 21:12.29 | SpeedEvil | at least yet |
| 21:12.54 | jebba | in evince on maemo5 how do you get out of full screen view? |
| 21:12.56 | *** join/#maemo LuserN800 (~lo@p4FE93F85.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:13.16 | SpeedEvil | jebba: I find camerad helps with that |
| 21:13.19 | pupnik | W: GPG error: http://repository.maemo.org fremantle Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG E40DC434616730BD maemo.org |
| 21:13.26 | *** join/#maemo ZZzzZzzz_ (~ZZzzZzzz@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-56-26.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 21:13.33 | SpeedEvil | jebba: also ctrl-enter? |
| 21:13.36 | iPeter- | jebba: Press power button, if you are running example nes emulator and want to close it press power button for options |
| 21:13.37 | javispedro | pupnik: they're signing packages now!! O.o |
| 21:14.14 | javispedro | jebba: or the builtin ctrl-backspace, but I think you know that already. If this the same diablo source package then there's no other fullscreen hotkey iirc. |
| 21:14.21 | jebba | ya, i can close it, i just want to keep viewing it in evince but not in fullscreen. It's definitely not F11 like in regular evince ;) |
| 21:14.30 | jophish | does the maemo kernel support inline resizing? |
| 21:14.37 | iPeter- | Whats best media player for Maemo5? |
| 21:14.38 | javispedro | jebba: try the diablo F6 |
| 21:14.38 | jophish | online* |
| 21:15.04 | jebba | this is just whatever evince is in maemo-extras* |
| 21:15.40 | asj_ | http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1532544&cid=30984582 -- who would have thought you would hear such praise about a Nokia phone ;) |
| 21:15.49 | javispedro | hum.. not same version as in diablo, so dunno. |
| 21:15.57 | jophish | also, would the following partition table be valid, and would swap be mounted correctly? |
| 21:15.59 | Jophish_n900 | http://pastebin.com/m3248f90b |
| 21:16.18 | javispedro | asj_: that's exactly the nokia shill we where discussing just a few minutes ago :) |
| 21:16.32 | javispedro | s/where/were, s/we/I :) |
| 21:17.09 | pupnik | no idea how to fix this - teh googles are not helping |
| 21:17.33 | javispedro | pupnik: if they just started signing packages, the key they used must be lying around somewhere |
| 21:17.49 | Veggen | mmf. |
| 21:18.03 | pupnik | this error has been happening since at least december 14 javispedro |
| 21:18.44 | javispedro | pupnik: are you completely sure, or was it "a slightly diferent error" talking about missing pgp signature? |
| 21:18.52 | Veggen | mmf. my enter in xterm is buggy.. |
| 21:19.00 | Veggen | norwegian layout. |
| 21:19.03 | pupnik | the BADSIG matches http://ibot.rikers.org/%23maemo/20091214.html.gz |
| 21:20.04 | jebba | ah cool, SpeedEvil ctrl-enter does it on evince. thx! :) |
| 21:20.21 | Damion2 | Veggen: known bug |
| 21:20.44 | *** join/#maemo tkharju (~tkharju@84-253-209-126.satp.customers.dnainternet.fi) |
| 21:20.53 | Veggen | ah. probably will be fixed then? |
| 21:21.50 | jebba | hmm, but you can't zoom in full screen mode (?). |
| 21:21.52 | Damion2 | sorry don't know |
| 21:22.03 | Damion2 | presumably |
| 21:22.53 | Damion2 | I've mapped it in vim other apps don't tend to care, such as irssi |
| 21:23.13 | *** join/#maemo shdb (~shdb@80-218-240-206.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 21:24.33 | jophish | hmm, I have a feeling bad things are about to happen. I have used sfdisk to expand the mmcblk0p1 partition to take up all the space up to the swap, made p2 size 0, |
| 21:24.56 | jophish | resisize2fs isn't resizing p1 to fill the partition |
| 21:25.36 | javispedro | jophish: have you read the numerous threads in talk.maemo.org about repartitioning? |
| 21:25.44 | javispedro | like, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37869 |
| 21:25.48 | jophish | I have been through them a bit |
| 21:26.03 | *** join/#maemo mat (~mat@2a01:e0b:1:98:21c:c0ff:fe65:2f9d) |
| 21:26.04 | *** join/#maemo mat (~mat@igoan/mat) |
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| 21:26.18 | Damion2 | diskpart needed to sync kernel's cached idea of the partition? |
| 21:26.57 | jophish | hmm? |
| 21:27.06 | Damion2 | or is it partprobe |
| 21:27.26 | Damion2 | the script/walkthrough I read had a few reboots |
| 21:27.46 | Damion2 | which achieves the same without crosscompiling partprobe |
| 21:27.59 | jophish | I have used sfdisk to change the internal card to the following: |
| 21:28.00 | Jophish_n900 | http://pastebin.com/m3248f90b |
| 21:28.27 | jophish | shouldn't resize2fs on /dev/mmcblk0p1 expand it to fill the remaining space in it's partition? |
| 21:28.51 | Damion2 | yeah but unless the kernel outputted a fresh idea of the partition like when you plug an mmc in, I doubt it'll work |
| 21:28.51 | Jaffa | Veggen: You can use Ctrl-M - it's a known bug |
| 21:28.54 | Damion2 | dmesg? |
| 21:28.58 | jophish | ah of course |
| 21:29.03 | jophish | and partprobe isn't here |
| 21:29.07 | javispedro | so, reboot. |
| 21:29.22 | Jaffa | Veggen: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6009 |
| 21:29.26 | povbot | Bug 6009: "Enter" key sends wrong keycode to console applications |
| 21:29.27 | Damion2 | of course it might not come up now |
| 21:29.38 | *** join/#maemo mat (~mat@2a01:e0b:1:98:21c:c0ff:fe65:2f9d) |
| 21:29.38 | *** join/#maemo mat (~mat@igoan/mat) |
| 21:29.39 | jophish | fingers crossed then |
| 21:29.40 | jophish | thanks |
| 21:30.43 | t-tan | jophish: if you want to shrink the ext3 parition you can do it before mounting it in rcS-late |
| 21:31.00 | jophish | oh, that's a good trick |
| 21:31.14 | jophish | Linux is so brilliant |
| 21:31.16 | javispedro | t-tan: what does happen if I comment that line on rcS-late. does it boot normally, putting the files in / ? |
| 21:31.43 | t-tan | jophish: you might find some inspiration in my modifications of the scripts in http://www.maemory.com/N900/misc/mmc/ |
| 21:31.48 | *** join/#maemo _Elwood_ (~elwood@unaffiliated/-elwood-/x-7688307) |
| 21:31.51 | t-tan | jophish: but backup first! |
| 21:32.16 | t-tan | javispedro: sorry, which line? |
| 21:32.35 | javispedro | t-tan: mount /home. |
| 21:32.43 | *** part/#maemo mat (~mat@igoan/mat) |
| 21:32.59 | t-tan | javispedro: IIRC it means REFLASH |
| 21:33.27 | javispedro | but for unknown causes? |
| 21:33.32 | *** join/#maemo N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 21:33.40 | javispedro | the rootfs fills? |
| 21:34.05 | pupnik | that's a 'great' one Jaffa >_< |
| 21:34.09 | jophish | t-tan, all is hunky-dory, I now have a nice big ext3 home partition |
| 21:34.34 | t-tan | javispedro: I think it crashes at "mkdir /home/user" without the -p |
| 21:34.50 | pupnik | and when it gets fixed, we get to switch back SDL programs to use Enter |
| 21:34.57 | javispedro | ??? /home exists in rootfs, and /home/user would succeed then. |
| 21:35.08 | jophish | now to create symlinks |
| 21:35.17 | jophish | your script is very useful by the way t-tan |
| 21:35.18 | t-tan | javispedro: you right |
| 21:35.54 | javispedro | I should try that some day. Just put in /usr/sbin/sshd & sleep 50 there and see what's going on |
| 21:36.11 | t-tan | javispedro: good luck! :) |
| 21:37.36 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (~jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
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| 21:45.00 | pupnik | J.S. Bach - Chromatic Fantasies ... +++ |
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| 21:48.39 | jophish | pupnik, my favourite Bach piece |
| 21:49.08 | pupnik | bbiab |
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| 22:06.08 | ifreq | can anyone help howto get scratchbox working with apt-get? |
| 22:07.24 | inz | ifreq, like this: http://inz.fi/blog/2007/10/22/multi-target-development-for-maemo/ ? |
| 22:07.47 | sp3000 | doesn't understand https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8679#c2 |
| 22:07.48 | povbot | Bug 8679: Make calendar default view configurable via calendar settings menu |
| 22:08.18 | ifreq | inz: okay, sec |
| 22:08.25 | sp3000 | how is pref bloat, options separated from their immediate results, more convenient than implicit customizability by persisting view type? |
| 22:10.10 | sp3000 | sure, there's slight improvement for things like, same state whenever opened, but since it's largely dynamic content the muscle memory part doesn't really weigh that much |
| 22:11.31 | *** join/#maemo n1c0 (~n1c0@unaffiliated/n1c0) |
| 22:11.34 | n1c0 | lo |
| 22:11.39 | DocScrutinizer | suggests a "make this view default" and "default to last state" button |
| 22:11.48 | n1c0 | sms is nice with n900, well done ! |
| 22:12.01 | DocScrutinizer | rather a toggle |
| 22:15.05 | *** join/#maemo embedded (~luigi@host140-57-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 22:15.18 | embedded | Hi to all |
| 22:15.23 | GeneralAntilles | sp3000, because they're users. ;) |
| 22:16.00 | sp3000 | dislikes options |
| 22:16.08 | sp3000 | except the ones I change, those are awesome |
| 22:19.12 | *** join/#maemo ptl (~patola@unaffiliated/ptl) |
| 22:20.45 | mikhas | n1c0, you can even continue your interrupted sms at a later point |
| 22:20.54 | mikhas | for each conversation, that is |
| 22:21.58 | n1c0 | yeah its cool |
| 22:22.12 | n1c0 | it's like instantmessage |
| 22:22.18 | Damion2 | does anyone know how I can map \033[M....... to ^I ? where the dots are regex style arbitrary charactors ? |
| 22:22.28 | mikhas | yup, telcos will be pleased with my increases sms usage |
| 22:22.40 | Damion2 | screen's bindkey wants exacts |
| 22:25.08 | *** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 22:28.16 | *** join/#maemo penguinbait (~mlewis@c-98-209-247-133.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 22:30.50 | sp3000 | wonders if there's a doc for what was implemented for bug 5357 |
| 22:30.51 | povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5357 Does not accept GSM (USSD) Codes starting with *# |
| 22:31.33 | *** join/#maemo Mek (~marijn@93.157.1.37) |
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| 22:33.12 | sp3000 | would like to be able to refer to something when looking at a dup |
| 22:34.23 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (~Valerio@Maemo/community/council/VDVsx) |
| 22:34.58 | *** join/#maemo LukeL_ (nobody@unaffiliated/lukel) |
| 22:37.27 | pupnik | hope y'all cashed out your 401k's |
| 22:40.28 | Damion2 | why are ppl switching to tmux from screen? |
| 22:41.08 | Stskeeps | cos scren rocks? |
| 22:41.11 | *** join/#maemo `0660 (~olli@ppp121-45-202-127.lns20.cbr1.internode.on.net) |
| 22:42.07 | Damion2 | so why are they switching? |
| 22:42.23 | Damion2 | it can't just be the licence |
| 22:42.31 | *** join/#maemo edisson_ (~edisson@189.2.128.130) |
| 22:44.11 | ShadowJK | pupnik: something happened? |
| 22:45.16 | ShadowJK | I have an impeccable ability to predict these things. whenever I buy a share, the stockmarket tends to collapse the next day. Guess I should start warning people |
| 22:45.47 | Stskeeps | buying nokia stock? |
| 22:47.49 | ShadowJK | i wish :) |
| 22:48.46 | *** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
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| 22:55.07 | timeless_mbp | wah |
| 22:55.13 | timeless_mbp | kino tv is advertising Dexter |
| 22:55.15 | timeless_mbp | but i don't get it |
| 22:56.19 | red | Damion2: id like to know that too :p |
| 22:58.07 | Damion2 | red how to map stuff of what the fuss is about swicthing to tmux? |
| 22:58.42 | ShadowJK | timeless: hm :) |
| 22:58.57 | ShadowJK | dont get it why people still use texttv? |
| 22:59.25 | Damion2 | is that aalib output of mythtv? |
| 22:59.53 | *** join/#maemo go1dfish (~alex@66.240.221.253) |
| 23:00.03 | zash | ShadowJK: s/text// |
| 23:01.33 | ShadowJK | Damion2: no it's digital data embedded in the analog tv signal. it carries 40*20 char text pages, up to 800ish different ones max, and you can pick with remote control which one to view |
| 23:01.44 | *** join/#maemo jabis (~jabis@69.162.91.23) |
| 23:01.55 | ShadowJK | usually has tv programme info, news, sport results etc |
| 23:02.09 | Damion2 | like teletext? |
| 23:02.16 | ShadowJK | same thing |
| 23:02.29 | Damion2 | right, never heard of texttv |
| 23:02.41 | Damion2 | subtitles were also sent |
| 23:02.50 | ShadowJK | each country calls it something different... |
| 23:02.58 | ShadowJK | videotext in germany iirc |
| 23:03.10 | Damion2 | had involvement in BBC R&D's developement of digital text mheg stream |
| 23:03.56 | Damion2 | the linux pcs which fed in to the transport stream ran my build of slackware |
| 23:04.46 | Damion2 | and my team supported the tcl based scripts on the sun server that fed the carosel of data |
| 23:04.57 | Damion2 | this was 1999/2000 ish |
| 23:05.27 | *** join/#maemo tonikitoo (~tonikitoo@201-75-10-206-ma.cpe.vivax.com.br) |
| 23:05.36 | *** join/#maemo benh (~benh@nat/ibm/x-ukrmjlfihpadpihm) |
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| 23:05.45 | red | mm, thinking of tethering N900 at school pc to connect the school PC directly into my linux server at home |
| 23:06.05 | red | effectively being able to use folderwatching in realmtime and when i save stuff its at home directly |
| 23:06.08 | SpeedEvil | Does /usr/bin/smartcal core for otehrs? |
| 23:06.21 | SpeedEvil | red: over usb? |
| 23:07.46 | ShadowJK | school pc not connected to internet? |
| 23:08.04 | SpeedEvil | probably nasty filter? |
| 23:08.11 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: i don't think the usa really has it |
| 23:08.18 | timeless_mbp | i've seen it in france, germany and finland |
| 23:08.25 | timeless_mbp | but it was one of those things that i think we missed |
| 23:08.38 | DocScrutinizer51 | hat's smartcal? |
| 23:08.47 | DocScrutinizer51 | What* |
| 23:09.00 | timeless_mbp | the tv-text nonsense |
| 23:09.05 | SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: I dunno. |
| 23:09.15 | SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer: I just know it coredumped when I ran it. |
| 23:09.18 | SpeedEvil | I was going for smem |
| 23:09.24 | SpeedEvil | http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/10/02/01/1555206/Nokia-N900-Linux-Smartphone-Running-OS-X?from=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2Fslashdot+%28Slashdot%29&utm_content=Google+Feedfetcher |
| 23:09.25 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 23:09.27 | SpeedEvil | not that |
| 23:09.34 | SpeedEvil | http://www.selenic.com/smem/ |
| 23:09.35 | SpeedEvil | that |
| 23:09.45 | DocScrutinizer51 | man smartcal doesn't work here :-P |
| 23:09.51 | SpeedEvil | which is a handy memory tool that's a bit better |
| 23:09.55 | SpeedEvil | than my awk hack |
| 23:10.46 | derf | timeless_mbp: We have "closed captions"... but nothing user-navigable. |
| 23:10.58 | timeless_mbp | closed captions are totally different |
| 23:11.04 | timeless_mbp | the text stuff is roughly speaking its own channel |
| 23:11.18 | timeless_mbp | which happens to multiplex a whole bunch of 'text channels' |
| 23:11.23 | ShadowJK | timeless: sadly if you're looking for specific info like a channel's schedule or a sport channel's sport results, texttv is often faster and easier to navigate than the web pages :-) |
| 23:11.46 | ShadowJK | they dont have that much room for extra crap on texttv pages |
| 23:12.01 | SpeedEvil | no. |
| 23:12.03 | trem | nite all, sweet dreams |
| 23:12.08 | SpeedEvil | night. |
| 23:12.09 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: well, the usa tv guide systems have worked much better than whatever for decades |
| 23:12.17 | *** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 23:12.23 | timeless_mbp | plus tivo solved epg over a decade ago |
| 23:12.29 | derf | I wouldn't agree. |
| 23:12.36 | SpeedEvil | The UK is fucking it up. |
| 23:12.40 | derf | The TV guide system was horribly before Tivo. |
| 23:13.06 | timeless_mbp | derf: the tv guide stuff i have here in .fi is worse than the tv guide i had in 1990 in the us |
| 23:13.14 | derf | Okay, that I can believe. |
| 23:13.23 | SpeedEvil | They are 'encrypting' the data in a manner that may stop STB makers using linux |
| 23:13.58 | SpeedEvil | Though the data is required to be broadcast in the clear, they are encrypting the EPG - with a already leaked huffman code... |
| 23:14.12 | derf | I've never really used the Tivo-style DVR-provided listings. |
| 23:14.45 | sp3000 | the ringtone selection dialog has a button that says "Done", right? |
| 23:14.47 | derf | But they look _so_ much better than the old system of having a dedicated channel that scrolled past the listings for 70+ channels... very... very... slow... ly... |
| 23:14.49 | sp3000 | timeless_mbp knows |
| 23:15.20 | timeless_mbp | yes |
| 23:15.25 | sp3000 | tx |
| 23:15.38 | timeless_mbp | 'more' [sic] and 'done' |
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| 23:22.29 | GeneralAntilles | derf, you gotta target the slowest readers. ;) |
| 23:23.49 | derf | My solution was to just stop watching TV. |
| 23:24.03 | SpeedEvil | passes derf the super-shotgun to target the slowest readers with. |
| 23:24.21 | SpeedEvil | is listening to more radio. |
| 23:24.28 | SpeedEvil | radio4++ |
| 23:24.50 | SpeedEvil | UK speech radio. It's really - really not 'talk' radio as is known in the US. |
| 23:25.05 | *** join/#maemo Guest36580 (~user@p5B0C3EB7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:25.13 | SpeedEvil | http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006qyyb - for example |
| 23:25.17 | ScribbleJ | Sure. |
| 23:25.24 | ScribbleJ | And a water fountain isn't a bubbler. |
| 23:25.33 | ScribbleJ | And a garage isn't a mechanic. |
| 23:25.35 | javispedro | RST38h: I'm going to promote vultures to diablo extras, if you don't mind. |
| 23:25.37 | Guest36580 | any idea if the fosdem schedule is available in binary, somewhere? |
| 23:26.07 | Guest36580 | also, will there be n910 to play with? |
| 23:26.16 | SpeedEvil | cat /dev/random - and wait till it comes along? |
| 23:26.29 | *** join/#maemo wazd_ (~Miranda@80-240-220-132.dnat.migtel.ru) |
| 23:26.49 | SpeedEvil | the above source also has pictures of tne n910, and video reviews. |
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| 23:29.35 | mtd | what's the easiest way to hack on modest (I'd like to try out some changes on my n900)? |
| 23:29.41 | *** join/#maemo Dantonic (~david@c-24-7-146-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 23:29.55 | mtd | is it likely to be easily buildable on my n900? |
| 23:30.28 | Guest36580 | speedevil the bbc site does not |
| 23:30.37 | mtd | looks for git, fears library-dependency hell... |
| 23:31.10 | ptl | apt-get source modest ? |
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| 23:32.54 | mtd | ptl: hmm, need to get sources in my sources.list... |
| 23:32.54 | SpeedEvil | Guest3: no, it doesn't. The n910 is - as I understand it - not publically confirmed to exist - or ecvent to have that number. |
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| 23:32.57 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (~javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 23:33.13 | SpeedEvil | Guest: I was refering to /dev/random |
| 23:33.23 | ptl | n910? |
| 23:33.25 | ptl | c'mon |
| 23:33.27 | ptl | my n900 hasn't even arrived yet |
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| 23:34.04 | *** join/#maemo febb (~febb@unaffiliated/febb) |
| 23:34.13 | GeneralAntilles | Guest36580, lol. . . . |
| 23:34.16 | *** join/#maemo spectre- (~n900@41.202.225.146) |
| 23:34.23 | Guest36580 | ah; k |
| 23:34.28 | GeneralAntilles | Because Nokia ALWAYS does major product announcements at FOSDEM. . . . |
| 23:34.42 | *** join/#maemo kalikiana (~kalikiana@xfce/goodies-developer/kalikiana) |
| 23:35.36 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: ofcourse they're going to announce N910 running symbian, android, webos and even iphoneos and windows mobile, with turn-by-turn navigation, friggen lasers and ovi maps tha doesn'tsuck |
| 23:35.40 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 23:35.44 | GeneralAntilles | lol |
| 23:36.12 | ShadowJK | laser for pointing a stars, guided by the compass and gyro! |
| 23:36.16 | *** join/#maemo N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 23:37.51 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, I dunno how people can say "Man, I'm just going to buy a Droid/iPhone/Pre/HD2/whatever". |
| 23:38.02 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, nobody even comes close to matching Maemo. |
| 23:38.28 | javispedro | Stskeeps: and then they're going to announce that "we're leaving to the community to implement all those features to the N900" |
| 23:38.45 | GeneralAntilles | javispedro, but taking down all of the source code repositories? *eg* |
| 23:38.46 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: some people in #mer are trying to port Mer to Droid. |
| 23:38.52 | javispedro | can't wait for friggin lasers closed source drivers. |
| 23:38.53 | GeneralAntilles | lol |
| 23:38.57 | GeneralAntilles | Just buy a freaking N900. . . . |
| 23:39.00 | mtd | GeneralAntilles: for which target audience? |
| 23:39.05 | GeneralAntilles | Better keyboard, better screen, better build. |
| 23:39.17 | GeneralAntilles | mtd, for ME. |
| 23:39.24 | GeneralAntilles | mtd, since I'm clearly the only person who matters. ;) |
| 23:39.34 | mtd | GeneralAntilles: bigger, slower scrolling, more confusing software |
| 23:39.42 | mtd | GeneralAntilles: ah, then I agree. |
| 23:39.43 | javispedro | IT'S NOT SMOOTH! DEALBREAKER! |
| 23:39.55 | *** join/#maemo SmilybOrg (Smily@BSN-143-113-98.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 23:40.19 | mtd | GeneralAntilles: ah, then I agree. |
| 23:40.22 | GeneralAntilles | mtd, bigger in which dimension? |
| 23:40.23 | mtd | ugh |
| 23:40.34 | mtd | GeneralAntilles: thickness |
| 23:40.37 | GeneralAntilles | The Droid is a bit wider, I think. |
| 23:41.00 | GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, boo hiss! Use the Council blog. |
| 23:41.03 | mtd | javispedro: you clearly have not given steve jobs enough money this week. |
| 23:41.26 | *** join/#maemo Docscrutemp (~Joerg_rw@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 23:41.29 | zash | N900 with LAZORS!!! OMG GIF *starts throwing money around* |
| 23:41.58 | SpeedEvil | It would be nice if stuff would be smooth |
| 23:42.11 | Damion2 | I'll be happy with a keyboard and accurate fingernail friendly touchscreen |
| 23:42.15 | mtd | awaits the rumours about laser-fearing iphone owners and warnings about overclocking the lasers |
| 23:42.38 | SpeedEvil | Surely it can't be _that_ hard to have a fixed element - and a large off-screen fully mapped element that's blitted into place by the gpu |
| 23:42.41 | VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, cofh, cofh, I don't want to spend one hour editing a simple post ;) |
| 23:42.43 | SpeedEvil | r composited or something |
| 23:43.06 | mtd | SpeedEvil: nokia thinks we like it rough. |
| 23:43.38 | mtd | should get back to pretending it may be possible to build modest |
| 23:43.39 | derf | Nothing a good belt-sander can't fix. |
| 23:43.56 | pillar | I have just gotten used to it, scrolling is never smooth with nokia |
| 23:44.14 | SpeedEvil | But it could be so beautifully smooth with the hardware :/ |
| 23:44.18 | SpeedEvil | look at frigging bounce. |
| 23:44.31 | SpeedEvil | get rovio to do the UI! |
| 23:44.37 | pillar | yeah, I believe you |
| 23:44.41 | SpeedEvil | Problem solved! |
| 23:44.55 | SpeedEvil | imagines angrybirds application launcher. |
| 23:45.05 | pillar | even the bookmark view is laggy! |
| 23:45.12 | Damion2 | my scrolling is smoth |
| 23:45.13 | VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, humm, that remembers me, have to request some kind of syndication for the council blog (don't like midgard' engine') |
| 23:45.14 | Damion2 | smoothy |
| 23:45.17 | Damion2 | smooth |
| 23:45.29 | MistaED1 | xorg could be a major factor to the bad smooth, the linux desktop is the same |
| 23:45.37 | *** join/#maemo gomiam (~magao@89.130.117.126) |
| 23:45.53 | MistaED1 | need moar xcb and less xlib so processes don't choke the xserver :( |
| 23:46.11 | mtd | Damion2: launch the email client, view your inbox, drag the view down until you can see above the "+ New mail" button |
| 23:46.25 | VDVsx | blames hildon, since Qt and EFL have very smoth and fast scroll |
| 23:46.29 | Damion2 | I use alpine |
| 23:46.31 | mtd | Damion2: watch your cpu get pegged and the image tear. |
| 23:46.37 | MistaED1 | android bypasses this entirely, they don't use an xserver |
| 23:46.41 | Damion2 | contacts scroll and browser scroll are smooth |
| 23:47.04 | mtd | Damion2: browser scroll is implemented completely differently. |
| 23:47.17 | MistaED1 | xorg can't do vsync, its design doesn't allow it so you get tearing |
| 23:47.32 | Damion2 | so they should fix the email client |
| 23:47.50 | javispedro | contacts is hardly smooth by steve jobs standards. |
| 23:47.50 | Damion2 | MistaED1: even with DRI or GL ? |
| 23:47.51 | MistaED1 | a better approach is to port the toolkits over to EGL directly |
| 23:48.00 | Damion2 | javispedro: it's as good as android |
| 23:48.13 | Damion2 | maybe we should have the debian user space with a freebsd based kernel |
| 23:48.28 | *** join/#maemo sp3001 (~chatzilla@hoasnet-fe21dd00-183.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 23:48.33 | MistaED1 | Damion2: hmm good question dri2 might've fixed it for the linux desktop |
| 23:48.34 | mtd | Damion2: do you have any idea what you're talking abojut? |
| 23:48.35 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx_ (~Valerio@bl5-194-99.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 23:48.46 | javispedro | Damion2: of course it's as good and usable as android! and I don't even have an iphone to compare but it's clearly not enough for tmo! =) |
| 23:49.01 | pillar | yeah, jobs just blamed flash and bluray to be not good enough for them, I don't want to hear what he says about n900 scrolling :) |
| 23:49.15 | Damion2 | mtd: macos was freebsd kernel based |
| 23:49.24 | pillar | then again, I don't want to hear anything else he says either.. |
| 23:49.38 | mtd | Damion2: that'd be a "no", then. ok. |
| 23:49.57 | Damion2 | I've used fbsd for months and it had a nicer lower latency feel than linux as a desktop in X |
| 23:50.59 | MistaED1 | when Qt or GTK get rendered to the screen it goes through texture from pixmap, so the cpu renders the result to a pixmap, the EGL extension converts it to a texture and then the hildon compositor can display it |
| 23:51.06 | mtd | Damion2: your ideas are compelling and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter. |
| 23:51.09 | MistaED1 | this is very inefficient but gets the job done |
| 23:51.27 | DocScrutinizer | drools over his 150mW geen and his 405nm laser |
| 23:51.36 | MistaED1 | but if they render via clutter (opengl es directly) it doesn't go through this path fortunately |
| 23:52.10 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (~Valerio@Maemo/community/council/VDVsx) |
| 23:52.30 | woglinde | MistaED1 qt-opengl should be the same as clutter |
| 23:52.31 | javispedro | MistaED1: rendering a interface using GLES is hardly much faster. |
| 23:53.18 | MistaED1 | does maemo do the texture from pixmap step on a GLES rendered context still? |
| 23:53.38 | javispedro | MistaED1: yes, except if the window is fullscreen. |
| 23:53.54 | MistaED1 | i'm guessing this is what hildon non composited window does to bypass it? |
| 23:54.00 | DocScrutinizer | build a 405nm laser module to the screen slider. make screen slide open by servo. create spindle motor out of vibrator -> here you got your B&O alike DVD player on N900 XP |
| 23:54.21 | javispedro | MistaED1: that is now (mostly) gone. Fullscreen windows are unredirected by default. |
| 23:54.48 | DocScrutinizer | errr bluray of course |
| 23:54.58 | javispedro | friggin lasers! |
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| 23:55.10 | MistaED1 | javispedro: i did notice rendering panda3d samples in windowed mode to fullscreen makes the framerate double |
| 23:55.57 | javispedro | yep |
| 23:56.51 | MistaED1 | i wonder though, would interfacing with xcb instead of xlib stop the stutters as well? xcb was all about low latency and being thread safe so that no single window would choke the whole xserver or something |
| 23:57.24 | javispedro | I think this doesn't have anything to do with latency, though... |
| 23:57.27 | DocScrutinizer | spindle fixture plugged in to the 3.5mm AV hole to connect to the vibrator |
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| 23:59.44 | DocScrutinizer | comes with hansaplast patches ;-) "if ever you touch the spinning bluray disc accidentally and get hurt" |