| 00:01.37 | Macer | eink |
| 00:01.37 | Macer | haha |
| 00:01.55 | Macer | i'm more curious as to how they get the silver thing on the side |
| 00:02.10 | Macer | wants metalic silver on his n810 screen |
| 00:02.36 | Macer | it doesn't really flip the pages all that fast either |
| 00:02.44 | Macer | takes like a couple seconds to fetch and redraw |
| 00:03.18 | mavhc | I'd rather buy books than license them |
| 00:03.34 | Macer | isn't it the same thing as buying them? |
| 00:03.37 | CutMeOwnThroat | I'd miss the IR diodes on the N810 to switch channels on TV... if I had a TV |
| 00:03.38 | Macer | i mean the first one has an sd |
| 00:03.51 | mavhc | no, I can sell my books |
| 00:03.58 | Macer | it acts as a remote? |
| 00:04.03 | Macer | i never did that with my n810 |
| 00:04.24 | GeneralAntilles | CutMeOwnThroat, N810 has IR? |
| 00:04.25 | CutMeOwnThroat | and the laser-cutter for slicing bread |
| 00:04.28 | CutMeOwnThroat | no! |
| 00:04.32 | Macer | oh |
| 00:04.33 | Macer | haha |
| 00:04.36 | CutMeOwnThroat | but the N900 will have all that and more |
| 00:04.36 | Macer | the ir sounded plausable |
| 00:04.44 | Macer | slicing bread? |
| 00:04.47 | GeneralAntilles | Ah, I see. |
| 00:04.48 | Macer | who needs to do that nowadays? :) |
| 00:05.01 | CutMeOwnThroat | well, slice people then |
| 00:05.04 | Macer | are we back in the 1940s? |
| 00:05.15 | Macer | ok. that makes a little more sense. but then people would need firearms cards for them |
| 00:05.20 | CutMeOwnThroat | yeah, thanks to the time-travel module |
| 00:05.56 | Macer | lord |
| 00:06.02 | Macer | my son is awake and active.. bbl :) |
| 00:06.07 | Macer | looks like nap time is over |
| 00:06.15 | CutMeOwnThroat | guess the lord you can reach via sip-phone |
| 00:06.16 | CutMeOwnThroat | ... |
| 00:07.05 | *** join/#maemo hannesw_ (n=hannes@91-114-233-83.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 00:08.24 | *** join/#maemo ziyourenxiang (n=ziyouren@unaffiliated/ziyourenxiang) |
| 00:14.36 | *** join/#maemo FireFox16 (n=b-man16@pool-98-115-96-125.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 00:15.14 | FireFox16 | ~seen xnt14 |
| 00:15.38 | infobot | xnt14 <n=xnt@pool-98-113-71-238.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 22h 43m 14s ago, saying: 'well, im on my server right now, ill switch to my xps'. |
| 00:15.58 | FireFox16 | xP |
| 00:22.47 | *** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (i=1000@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 00:24.55 | *** join/#maemo xxiao (n=chatzill@24.174.117.226) |
| 00:28.12 | javispedro | Eldar again mentions "N920 without hw keyboard" |
| 00:28.39 | FireFox16 | heh |
| 00:29.18 | *** join/#maemo rm_you (n=rm_you@66-90-182-169.dyn.grandenetworks.net) |
| 00:30.51 | *** join/#maemo fernand0 (n=fernand0@190.24.51.94) |
| 00:31.12 | oilinki | good morning |
| 00:33.59 | FireFox16 | 8:33 pm here >.> xDD |
| 00:34.04 | *** join/#maemo b0unc3_ (n=user@94.162.57.187) |
| 00:34.30 | *** join/#maemo milos_ (n=milos@92.36.201.197) |
| 00:34.42 | oilinki | we are 11 hours ahead of you :) |
| 00:36.28 | milos_ | did anyone read eldar's review? |
| 00:37.27 | AStorm | no, never, cellphone w/o a keyboard = pointless |
| 00:38.09 | *** join/#maemo hannesw_ (n=hannes@91-115-221-150.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 00:39.08 | JayBomb999 | I tried but my Russian is terrible. |
| 00:40.24 | FireFox16 | oilinki: where are you located? |
| 00:40.45 | milos_ | JayBomb999: http://tinyurl.com/kjkjb6 |
| 00:41.43 | JayBomb999 | milos: I actually "read" the translation. It's still a bit difficult to understand but overall, he seems to have lost pretty much all his enthusiasm regarding the N900. |
| 00:42.14 | JayBomb999 | Do you agree? |
| 00:42.35 | milos_ | JayBomb999: yup |
| 00:42.59 | JayBomb999 | I typically respect his opinion so I can't lie... it does give me pause as I have the N900 of pre-order. |
| 00:43.22 | JayBomb999 | There are legitimate questions about which firmware/hardware he has though... |
| 00:44.34 | oilinki | FireFox16: Phuket, Thailand |
| 00:44.48 | FireFox16 | ah :) |
| 00:45.44 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, he's got a stolen prototype running very old firmware. |
| 00:46.03 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, calling it a review is disingenuous at best. |
| 00:46.23 | JayBomb999 | GeneralAntilles: Yes I agree. |
| 00:46.50 | milos_ | JayBomb999: not sure about browser speed. He said that Iphone's Safari is much faster than MicroB. I would like someone to test little more. To try to turn off flash on MicroB and than compare. Currently comparing these two on some heavy flash sites is not fair. |
| 00:46.54 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, he's also been accusing anybody who asks anything specific of him of being either a Nokia employee or a shill. |
| 00:47.10 | lcuk | i dont blame him |
| 00:48.03 | lcuk | how do i find out what software i have |
| 00:48.10 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, wait for a real review with final software. |
| 00:48.19 | JayBomb999 | I think he raised a few legitimate (and common) concerns about the device (portrait mode, limited media player, etc), but the slow browser stuff seemed to contradict the demos I saw... |
| 00:48.36 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, he's incorrect about portrait mode. |
| 00:48.43 | GeneralAntilles | It's not shipped with most of Nokia's default applications |
| 00:48.56 | GeneralAntilles | but 3rd-party developers can provide support for it in their own applications very easily. |
| 00:49.12 | JayBomb999 | GeneralAntilles: What do you mean "incorrect about portrait mode"? |
| 00:49.13 | GeneralAntilles | Heck, we could provide patches for Nokia's open source stuff pretty easily. |
| 00:49.28 | JayBomb999 | ah.. NM |
| 00:49.30 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, he's been claiming that it'll be really difficult for developers to implement portrait. |
| 00:49.40 | *** join/#maemo n6pfk (n=mike@96.238.186.191) |
| 00:49.59 | GeneralAntilles | As for the media player there'll be plenty of alternatives. |
| 00:50.02 | JayBomb999 | Oh I see. It was hard to discern specifics view google translate |
| 00:50.18 | JayBomb999 | Really? Like? |
| 00:50.18 | GeneralAntilles | MAFW will make implementing 3rd party media players a lot easier. |
| 00:50.34 | GeneralAntilles | Canola, for one. |
| 00:50.38 | JayBomb999 | I am pretty new to Maemo so forgive my ignorance. |
| 00:51.11 | JayBomb999 | Yes I've seen canola running on a N810. Looks good. I'd be happy with that. |
| 00:51.27 | GeneralAntilles | It'll be even better in Fremantle. |
| 00:51.42 | GeneralAntilles | Thanks to the hardware speedup if nothing else. |
| 00:52.20 | oilinki | JayBomb999: canola looks good, but it has some really annoying features.. like trying to kill the program by clicking buttons for 10 times. |
| 00:52.21 | JayBomb999 | What about a podcast player? I dont' see that built into the media player... |
| 00:52.45 | milos_ | JayBomb999: gpodder |
| 00:52.57 | GeneralAntilles | ^ |
| 00:53.04 | GeneralAntilles | The recent releases of which look absolutely amazing. |
| 00:53.39 | JayBomb999 | I have seen gpodder for ubuntu/gnome (my primary OS) ans wasn't too impressed honestly. Is it different in Maemo5? Compatible with the UI? |
| 00:53.52 | GeneralAntilles | It's different on Maemo 5. |
| 00:53.54 | JayBomb999 | I'll check it out thanks.. |
| 00:54.09 | lcuk | JayBomb999, and you know something - thats fine |
| 00:54.13 | GeneralAntilles | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=331728#post331728 |
| 00:54.14 | lcuk | you are free not to like gpodder |
| 00:54.18 | lcuk | there will be others |
| 00:54.30 | lcuk | but if it had been in the os and you didnt like it you would rant |
| 00:54.34 | GeneralAntilles | Canola does podcasts, too. |
| 00:54.35 | lcuk | and it would be harder to remove |
| 00:54.42 | javispedro | lcuk++ |
| 00:54.45 | AStorm | yes, with a plugin right now |
| 00:55.07 | lcuk | JayBomb999, maemo is unrestricted |
| 00:55.08 | AStorm | and does so fairly well |
| 00:55.19 | AStorm | well, mostly unrestricted |
| 00:55.24 | AStorm | we have hardware restrictions ;p |
| 00:55.31 | lcuk | in what way is it restricted |
| 00:55.32 | javispedro | :P i'm not getting autobuilder emails |
| 00:55.44 | JayBomb999 | I realize such initial trade-offs are the nature of the beast with a most open OS like Maemo. As a linux enthusiast/geek I'm ok with that. |
| 00:55.57 | AStorm | what tradeoffs? |
| 00:56.02 | javispedro | did maemo.org just died? |
| 00:56.05 | AStorm | which phone does podcasts by default? |
| 00:56.12 | lcuk | then as a linux maemo enthusiast, you dont mind helping to build the barn |
| 00:56.18 | JayBomb999 | Do I really need to say AStorm? |
| 00:56.19 | lcuk | theres a hammer and some wood over there |
| 00:56.33 | AStorm | JayBomb999: yes, do. |
| 00:56.43 | AStorm | *by default*. |
| 00:56.43 | JayBomb999 | iPhone. |
| 00:56.46 | AStorm | not in Appstore. |
| 00:56.50 | JayBomb999 | iPhone |
| 00:56.55 | AStorm | and others? |
| 00:57.01 | AStorm | nopes. |
| 00:57.10 | JayBomb999 | Well.. you only asked for one. :) |
| 00:57.18 | AStorm | ;p |
| 00:57.45 | lcuk | what if you dont like the media player on iphone |
| 00:57.45 | lcuk | what do you do |
| 00:57.46 | AStorm | seems like maemo.org is slow at responding |
| 00:57.51 | AStorm | DDoS? some server change? |
| 00:58.12 | lcuk | really likes media player on tablet |
| 00:58.12 | AStorm | jailbreak (yeah, real easy and all ;p ) |
| 00:58.13 | javispedro | just before i noticed autobuilder builds were finishing but I was not getting emails |
| 00:58.14 | AStorm | and install another one |
| 00:58.15 | JayBomb999 | I agree with the point you're making lcuk. |
| 00:58.19 | lcuk | was also happy with the one on 810 |
| 00:58.30 | JayBomb999 | I am not a fan of "walled gardens". |
| 00:59.25 | JayBomb999 | That said, I do like the media player on the iPhone. What I dont' like is the necessity of iTunes and the encrypted USB connection. |
| 00:59.27 | AStorm | the one on n810 was ok |
| 00:59.34 | AStorm | \but looked very plain |
| 00:59.45 | AStorm | and video playback was slow (mostly hardware reasons) |
| 01:00.08 | GeneralAntilles | No more slow video playback. ;) |
| 01:00.08 | JayBomb999 | sorry... encrypted database might be more accurate. |
| 01:00.13 | AStorm | JayBomb999: try to fight with the most important proponent of DRM |
| 01:00.25 | GeneralAntilles | Actually, I wonder how battery life will be with video playback. |
| 01:00.25 | AStorm | GeneralAntilles: sure I know :) |
| 01:00.38 | GeneralAntilles | Audio decoding on ARM, video on DSP. |
| 01:00.55 | AStorm | or both on ARM for less demanding formats? |
| 01:01.03 | AStorm | (to save power) |
| 01:01.10 | GeneralAntilles | Dunno |
| 01:01.18 | GeneralAntilles | Wonder if MAFW has some clues. |
| 01:01.25 | AStorm | h264 certainly needs that DSP code |
| 01:01.30 | javispedro | MAFW uses gst. |
| 01:01.37 | javispedro | actually I remember reading it has swappable backends |
| 01:01.52 | GeneralAntilles | javispedro, yeah, it does. |
| 01:02.19 | javispedro | qt/phonon switch hint. |
| 01:02.40 | AStorm | yes, although phonon does gst as well |
| 01:02.50 | AStorm | and I see no real reason not to use gst w/ Qt |
| 01:03.01 | AStorm | unless they want full Qt code. |
| 01:03.14 | javispedro | AStorm: someday phonon might target whatever Symbian uses |
| 01:03.19 | JayBomb999 | I'm sure this is asked often here, but has anyone actually used the N900 personally? Demo or otherwise? |
| 01:03.28 | AStorm | (and phonon has been debugged, since it's right now hardly useful) |
| 01:03.35 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, nearly anybody here who has is under NDA. |
| 01:03.50 | GeneralAntilles | JayBomb999, there are demo units in many of Nokia's big stores, though. |
| 01:03.56 | AStorm | well, I can tell you I don't have it. |
| 01:03.58 | AStorm | ;p |
| 01:04.11 | lcuk | has an n900 |
| 01:04.12 | JayBomb999 | I live in Detroit and we don't have Nokia stores... or an economy in general. |
| 01:04.13 | javispedro | has not either. |
| 01:04.22 | Pavlov | <3 n900 |
| 01:04.32 | javispedro | we have nokia stores here but then I'd doubt they have the n900. |
| 01:04.35 | AStorm | we're not talking about chinese ripoffs actually |
| 01:04.41 | lcuk | javispedro, here? |
| 01:04.42 | AStorm | unless you guys are under NDA |
| 01:04.49 | AStorm | ;> |
| 01:04.56 | javispedro | here. near my home ;) |
| 01:05.03 | lcuk | cant help but be disclosed |
| 01:05.06 | lcuk | lol |
| 01:05.19 | lcuk | i keep forgetting where that is |
| 01:05.44 | JayBomb999 | I was curious about the transistions. My biggest concerns derived from viewing demos is that the transitions seemed... laggy. I am hoping this gets smoothed about before it arrives at my door. :) |
| 01:06.15 | JayBomb999 | I don't know if opinions on this issue would be prohibited by NDAs. |
| 01:06.26 | lcuk | JayBomb999, i can categorically say it is the best internet tablet i have ever owned. it manages to expand in every single area on the strengths the n810 had and adds entirely new weapons as well |
| 01:07.01 | javispedro | read that as "being concerned about the transistors" |
| 01:07.24 | AStorm | JayBomb999: that's a software problem |
| 01:07.31 | lcuk | JayBomb999, my software runs faster and smoother on this device than it has run on the previous devices |
| 01:07.32 | AStorm | this means, it's fixable |
| 01:07.39 | lcuk | (tho i manage to get it to run well there too) |
| 01:08.29 | JayBomb999 | lcuk: That's good to here. Does anyone think I'm wrong about the transitions? I've voiced this opinion before and been told I'm nuts... |
| 01:08.57 | Robot101 | in general, the transitions last as long as the apps take to redraw/appear/etc |
| 01:09.03 | Robot101 | they've been shaved down to as long as they need to be |
| 01:09.13 | Robot101 | so making them faster doesn't actually get you anything sooner |
| 01:09.16 | Robot101 | it just looks less good |
| 01:09.16 | Robot101 | :) |
| 01:09.22 | lcuk | :) i have never concerned myself with perfection in many things, but i can the n900 is slick and the transitions are better than anything i can manually code |
| 01:09.39 | lcuk | +1 robink |
| 01:09.43 | lcuk | Robot101, |
| 01:10.23 | lcuk | i remember balancing transitions in old and new liqbase and without transitions actually got the system too fast |
| 01:10.25 | JayBomb999 | lcuk: I suppose I'm a bit more shallow then. :) I really like a fluid UI. |
| 01:10.52 | lcuk | as do i :) |
| 01:11.22 | AStorm | JayBomb999: don't buy the N900 or any phone then |
| 01:11.28 | lcuk | i wrote my liqbase on the back of a poor ui on n810, on n900 im wondering just how fudging much time ive wasted |
| 01:11.31 | AStorm | none of them has a fluid UI |
| 01:11.37 | AStorm | not even the Apple's |
| 01:11.42 | lcuk | +1 |
| 01:12.34 | JayBomb999 | AStorm: My experience has been different. 3Gs and Palm pre are pretty smooth in my opinon. Also, while not a phone, the Zune HD's UI is pretty spectacular too. Just saying... |
| 01:13.12 | lcuk | how easy are they to code for? |
| 01:13.16 | lcuk | is it open? |
| 01:13.20 | JayBomb999 | It doesn't have to be fancy, I just notice stuttering and hesitation a lot when going full screen from "the dashboard". |
| 01:13.22 | javispedro | palm pre, smooth? |
| 01:13.24 | lcuk | well - pre yeah tis |
| 01:13.29 | javispedro | O.o |
| 01:13.33 | FireFox16 | xD |
| 01:13.37 | lcuk | seems it |
| 01:13.39 | lcuk | is it now |
| 01:13.41 | lcuk | not |
| 01:13.43 | FireFox16 | try the SDK ;) |
| 01:13.50 | Pavlov | javispedro: the zune hd's music app is great |
| 01:13.54 | Pavlov | they nailed it |
| 01:14.02 | javispedro | FireFox16: on a PC, even windows xp is "smooth". |
| 01:14.27 | AStorm | Palm Pre is really *not* smooth :) |
| 01:14.35 | javispedro | yeah. |
| 01:14.36 | AStorm | it is fast, but that has nothing to do with smoothness |
| 01:14.54 | JayBomb999 | I am only speaking about transitions here... not the OS. :) |
| 01:14.58 | javispedro | sighs |
| 01:15.23 | AStorm | javispedro: could you link to a movie showing that problem? |
| 01:15.33 | javispedro | the only phone I tried, and you tell me is fast. |
| 01:15.46 | AStorm | fairly. |
| 01:15.52 | AStorm | not *really* fast |
| 01:15.59 | AStorm | fast for a phone ;. |
| 01:16.14 | Pavlov | my problem with the zune hd was i was on a train when i was using one |
| 01:16.15 | lcuk | old rotary telephones had amazing transitions |
| 01:16.18 | Pavlov | and couldn't connect to the internet ;/ |
| 01:16.28 | lcuk | the way the dial would slide smoothly back round after you reached a number was amazing |
| 01:16.35 | JayBomb999 | :) |
| 01:16.56 | javispedro | not only amazing, but analog. infinite fluidity. |
| 01:16.58 | javispedro | take that! |
| 01:17.09 | lcuk | computers, pah! |
| 01:17.13 | JayBomb999 | Fluidity is a good word. |
| 01:17.20 | lcuk | we need arduino devices to linkup those transitions |
| 01:17.23 | javispedro | checks in case he made it up |
| 01:17.31 | javispedro | no, google returns quite a few hits |
| 01:17.32 | JayBomb999 | That's what I'd like the transistions to look like in Maemo... fluid. |
| 01:17.34 | lcuk | JayBomb999, my code slides around on a layer of baconfat |
| 01:17.36 | AStorm | heh, rotary phones aren't really smooth |
| 01:17.38 | lcuk | its slippery smooth |
| 01:17.47 | lcuk | mine was |
| 01:18.08 | AStorm | no, smooth were those phones where you had to crank to achieve line potential |
| 01:18.14 | AStorm | *that* was smooth |
| 01:18.20 | AStorm | no need to turn any wheels |
| 01:18.20 | lcuk | JayBomb999, every device has times when the cpu is a bit busy |
| 01:18.28 | lcuk | its like women, most of the month they look good |
| 01:18.35 | lcuk | but then for a few days you cant get close |
| 01:18.37 | javispedro | smooth is when you beat the n900 until you get fine black powder. |
| 01:18.43 | javispedro | now that powder *is* smooth. |
| 01:18.44 | lcuk | NO! |
| 01:18.50 | lcuk | dont breath that in |
| 01:18.53 | lcuk | its maemo smoke |
| 01:18.54 | Pavlov | i was thinking about buying a blendtec |
| 01:18.57 | Pavlov | and seeing if it blends |
| 01:19.02 | javispedro | yes, I read the advice from the blendtec evil man. |
| 01:19.31 | lcuk | javispedro, you are up late btw |
| 01:19.38 | lcuk | even im goin to bed now! |
| 01:19.48 | javispedro | yeah. waking up late tomorrow. |
| 01:19.58 | javispedro | (finally!) |
| 01:20.16 | javispedro | is so lazy... and evil. |
| 01:20.26 | lcuk | i need to get drunk soon |
| 01:20.33 | lcuk | not tonight tho |
| 01:20.41 | JayBomb999 | Never drink and code... |
| 01:21.31 | lcuk | ballmer peak |
| 01:21.40 | lcuk | its ricky, but can pay off |
| 01:21.45 | lcuk | risky even |
| 01:21.50 | lcuk | isnt bianca |
| 01:23.21 | *** join/#maemo gunni_ (n=quassel@xdsl-213-196-229-247.netcologne.de) |
| 01:25.59 | lcuk | gnite folks \o |
| 01:26.24 | javispedro | gnie |
| 01:26.30 | JayBomb999 | Night. Thanks for the info. |
| 01:26.39 | javispedro | i'll leave too |
| 01:27.07 | javispedro | wtf |
| 01:27.52 | javispedro | autobuilder broken. |
| 01:28.26 | javispedro | probably in berserk mode since it failed building but then "queued the packages for loading into extras-devel". |
| 01:29.20 | javispedro | well, see you, bye |
| 01:33.51 | *** join/#maemo vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 01:38.30 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=rsalveti@187.78.99.136) |
| 01:53.43 | *** join/#maemo tonikitoo (n=tonikito@201.75.63.222) |
| 01:58.08 | *** join/#maemo dreamer_ (n=dreamer@c-71-239-79-222.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 02:07.23 | *** join/#maemo n6pfkk (n=mike@96.238.186.191) |
| 02:09.12 | *** join/#maemo penguinbait (n=mlewis@c-68-62-26-176.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 02:15.12 | *** join/#maemo cjdavis (n=cjdavis@cpe-71-67-99-208.cinci.res.rr.com) |
| 02:29.15 | *** join/#maemo milos_ (n=milos@92.36.199.98) |
| 02:33.18 | *** join/#maemo eichi_ (n=eichi@stgt-5f70b554.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 02:37.09 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@9.148.45.66.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 02:37.54 | *** join/#maemo pcfe (n=pcfe@a88-115-13-182.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 02:42.00 | GeneralAntilles | I have to download Flash to download the stupid Nokia software updater because Nokia hates North America and wont provide freaking OTA updates here. |
| 02:43.42 | GeneralAntilles | Wow and it automagically installed Google toolbar without my permission. |
| 02:44.07 | microlith | what are you installing it to? |
| 02:44.39 | GeneralAntilles | I'm trying to update my 5800. |
| 02:44.44 | GeneralAntilles | Which, of course, requires Windows XP |
| 02:44.57 | microlith | hmm |
| 02:48.37 | Proteous | I've done a OTA update on my n97 |
| 02:49.40 | GeneralAntilles | 5800 apparently isn't supported in NAM |
| 02:49.46 | Proteous | ah |
| 02:49.47 | Proteous | yeah |
| 02:50.08 | GeneralAntilles | Nokia's complete and utter failure to sell devices here is completely and utterly deserved. |
| 02:50.15 | GeneralAntilles | Owning a Nokia device in the US == pain. |
| 02:50.17 | Proteous | heh |
| 02:50.21 | Proteous | I love mine |
| 02:50.23 | Proteous | so :P |
| 02:52.21 | GeneralAntilles | Christ |
| 02:52.26 | GeneralAntilles | I can't even get v30 on here. |
| 02:52.33 | GeneralAntilles | Symbian. Is. The. Worst. |
| 02:55.13 | GeneralAntilles | I'd stick this piece of shit in a blender if I had the money. |
| 02:55.55 | Proteous | heh |
| 03:06.53 | *** join/#maemo ejdav_gon (n=james@d66-183-52-25.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 03:09.25 | GeneralAntilles | Maemo's the only thing that can save the company. |
| 03:09.33 | GeneralAntilles | I mean, how incompetent can you get? |
| 03:09.53 | GeneralAntilles | I'd be impressed if it weren't so infuriating. |
| 03:12.51 | Pavlov | why would you own a symbian phone in the US? |
| 03:13.07 | Pavlov | aside from testing |
| 03:14.52 | Proteous | becuase WM sucks |
| 03:18.11 | *** join/#maemo ejdav_gon (n=james@d66-183-52-25.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 03:23.46 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-224-11.om.om.cox.net) |
| 03:24.37 | GeneralAntilles | Pavlov, other options are limited. |
| 03:24.41 | GeneralAntilles | I'd heard good things about them. |
| 03:24.54 | GeneralAntilles | I wanted a touchscreen phone that sucks less than the iPhone and Android. |
| 03:24.55 | GeneralAntilles | I'm an idiot. |
| 03:26.10 | Pavlov | lol |
| 03:26.46 | GeneralAntilles | Seriously, though, it's like Nokia WANTS to fail in the US. |
| 03:27.21 | GeneralAntilles | The other side of it, though, is that the N900 is a fucking revolution. |
| 03:28.45 | luke-jr | GeneralAntilles: what are you complaining about? |
| 03:29.10 | GeneralAntilles | The shittastic 5800. |
| 03:30.53 | *** join/#maemo fernand0 (n=fernand0@190.24.51.94) |
| 03:31.56 | *** join/#maemo milos_ (n=milos@92.36.188.83) |
| 03:31.57 | *** join/#maemo fernand0 (n=fernand0@190.24.51.94) |
| 03:33.08 | Pavlov | GeneralAntilles: the n97 is pretty bad |
| 03:33.41 | Pavlov | i still think the iphone is the best/most together/consistent phone |
| 03:33.43 | *** join/#maemo snuxoll (n=snuxoll@74.82.5.157) |
| 03:33.45 | Pavlov | touchscreen |
| 03:34.09 | Pavlov | the pre is probably 2nd, closely followed by the htc magic |
| 03:34.18 | Pavlov | n900 in there somewhere prolly |
| 03:34.40 | Pavlov | n900 really needs a capacitive touchscreen |
| 03:35.51 | GeneralAntilles | Pfft |
| 03:35.58 | GeneralAntilles | Capacitive would suck so hard at 800x480 |
| 03:36.04 | Pavlov | why? |
| 03:36.07 | GeneralAntilles | iPhone is just plain boring. |
| 03:36.12 | GeneralAntilles | You couldn't hit any small widgets. |
| 03:36.22 | Pavlov | stuff still has to be finger friendly |
| 03:36.25 | GeneralAntilles | The KDE/OpenOffice/whatever ports are all right out the window. |
| 03:36.30 | Pavlov | mm's are all mm's |
| 03:36.32 | Pavlov | ah, yes |
| 03:36.34 | GeneralAntilles | You also can't sketch. |
| 03:36.40 | Pavlov | it would be less friendly for random linux apps |
| 03:36.44 | GeneralAntilles | Did you ever try MyPaint on the N800? |
| 03:36.49 | Pavlov | yep |
| 03:36.50 | GeneralAntilles | It would hurt the platform. |
| 03:37.03 | Pavlov | it would be a substantially better device and phone |
| 03:37.10 | GeneralAntilles | and a good resistive is competitive with capacitive for sensitivity. |
| 03:37.12 | Pavlov | at the cost of some of its current market, perhaps |
| 03:37.16 | GeneralAntilles | Not for me, thanks. |
| 03:37.18 | Pavlov | GeneralAntilles: it really isn't |
| 03:37.30 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, Nokia's great at abandoning its current markets. |
| 03:37.40 | GeneralAntilles | Pavlov, having using both rather extensively, I find it is. |
| 03:37.50 | Pavlov | gentle swipes on a restive touchscreen simply don't register |
| 03:37.57 | GeneralAntilles | Well, duh. |
| 03:38.09 | GeneralAntilles | It doesn't have an EM field hovering over it. |
| 03:38.10 | Pavlov | where as they move my capacitive screens around as i'd expect |
| 03:38.20 | GeneralAntilles | This sounds like a personal problem. |
| 03:38.28 | Pavlov | nah |
| 03:38.30 | Pavlov | its a market problem |
| 03:38.37 | Pavlov | people who are used to capacitive won't understand resistive |
| 03:38.49 | Pavlov | if you've never had a capacitive one, then sure you can learn resistive |
| 03:39.19 | GeneralAntilles | Personally, capacitive people can go elsewhere. |
| 03:39.22 | Pavlov | lol |
| 03:39.26 | Pavlov | they will |
| 03:39.28 | GeneralAntilles | I'd rather have a device that works for me, not a device that works for a dozen other people. |
| 03:43.09 | *** join/#maemo Empero (i=empero@62.237.4.21) |
| 03:56.30 | *** join/#maemo jgoss_ (n=josh@pool-98-111-12-222.sctnpa.east.verizon.net) |
| 03:58.49 | *** join/#maemo ljp (n=quagmire@218.185.108.156) |
| 03:59.43 | Stskeeps | twitches at maemo-community |
| 04:00.10 | RST38h | Eldar published a new review. |
| 04:00.11 | *** join/#maemo _jason5986 (n=thot@59-105-27-43.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw) |
| 04:01.24 | Stskeeps | does he keep on whining? |
| 04:01.34 | RST38h | Oh yessss |
| 04:02.55 | RST38h | But praises it too, partially |
| 04:03.37 | Stskeeps | i think he may just have a bad batch |
| 04:05.03 | RST38h | Well, some of his complaints seem to be valid, others are just plain whining |
| 04:05.24 | *** join/#maemo GAN800 (n=ryan@c-68-59-48-143.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 04:05.55 | *** part/#maemo smackpotato (n=user@bas1-toronto26-1176325432.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 04:14.31 | *** join/#maemo Moku (n=John@f048068004.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 04:16.37 | *** join/#maemo swc|666 (n=infidel2@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 04:20.54 | zerojay | RST38h: Like...? |
| 04:21.29 | RST38h | like endless complaints abl=out lack of portrait mode |
| 04:26.33 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (n=slonopot@83.149.9.230) |
| 04:33.28 | snuxoll | well, the lack of a portrait mode is somewhat annoying, especially when the N900 looks like any other phone to most people |
| 04:34.16 | snuxoll | wasn't such a big deal when there was only the N8XX and 770 to worry about |
| 04:45.59 | *** join/#maemo Milhouse (n=irc_milh@dsl-217-155-26-150.zen.co.uk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:45.59 | *** join/#maemo Dar_AFK (n=darrenk@192.18.1.36) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:45.59 | *** join/#maemo LoCusF (n=asuomala@cs.uku.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:45.59 | *** join/#maemo guerby (n=guerby@228.156.90-79.rev.gaoland.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:45.59 | *** join/#maemo mk8 (n=torello@ip-212-141.sn1.eutelia.it) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:45.59 | *** join/#maemo keesj (n=keesj@ip49-193-210-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 04:51.29 | *** join/#maemo Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun) |
| 04:54.42 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181192153.pp.htv.fi) |
| 04:56.15 | *** join/#maemo macmaN6789 (n=lkraav@84-50-206-151-dsl.est.estpak.ee) |
| 05:04.03 | *** join/#maemo warp10 (n=andrea@93-42-160-165.ip87.fastwebnet.it) |
| 05:18.24 | *** join/#maemo promulo (n=romulo@189.71.11.127) |
| 05:33.13 | *** join/#maemo Meiz_n810 (n=Meizirkk@padedu-62-165-142-134.phnet.fi) |
| 05:47.24 | *** join/#maemo herzi (n=herzi@kiwi.mediascape.de) |
| 05:50.21 | *** join/#maemo konttori__ (n=konttori@a88-113-140-230.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 05:52.10 | *** join/#maemo geaaru (n=geaaru@host6-224-dynamic.30-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 05:53.01 | *** join/#maemo LB (n=LB@58.108.160.52) |
| 05:57.12 | *** join/#maemo Wikier (n=wikier@cm-staticIP-85-152-18-129.telecable.es) |
| 06:09.15 | *** join/#maemo MikaT (n=mtapoja@projects.sse.fi) |
| 06:15.52 | *** join/#maemo bubill (n=bubillya@210.21.227.34) |
| 06:21.46 | *** join/#maemo gomiam (n=magao@157.88.94.233) |
| 06:22.03 | bubill | hi all |
| 06:22.42 | *** join/#maemo zap (n=zap@28.169.249.ozerki.net) |
| 06:28.21 | *** join/#maemo robink (n=robink@fatcat.creosotehill.org) |
| 06:28.53 | *** join/#maemo _marcell_ (n=malengye@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 06:34.48 | *** join/#maemo lpotter (n=quiggly@58.173.176.153) |
| 06:36.08 | *** join/#maemo jrocha (n=JRocha@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 06:43.10 | *** join/#maemo trickie (n=trickie@94.100.112.225) |
| 06:45.30 | Stskeeps | what on earth is Archentgi (sp) smoking? P |
| 06:50.57 | RST38h | Sts: Another fanboy |
| 06:51.11 | RST38h | Logical thinking impaired. |
| 06:51.36 | RST38h | could somebody show me an example of accelerometer use? |
| 06:52.08 | Razumihin | Great we have fanboys even before the device is out to public... |
| 06:52.26 | Stskeeps | RST38h: there's a wiki page on it |
| 06:52.36 | RST38h | url? =) |
| 06:53.08 | RST38h | Razumihin: Crazies will get obsessed over anything, they do not need a particular device |
| 06:53.24 | Myrtti | feels crazy |
| 06:53.26 | RST38h | At least he is not a nazi or a mind control freak =) |
| 06:53.39 | Razumihin | :) |
| 06:53.47 | Myrtti | *DINGDONGDINGDONG* |
| 06:54.18 | *** join/#maemo croppa_ (n=stuart@135.27.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) |
| 06:54.33 | RST38h | winds up Myrtti |
| 06:54.43 | Myrtti | I'm wound up already |
| 06:55.14 | Myrtti | I've heard the intro of Moby's In My Life for two and half hours already |
| 06:55.29 | Myrtti | in my head |
| 06:55.51 | *** join/#maemo hannesw_ (n=hannes@91-115-221-150.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 06:56.10 | RST38h | Sts: found it! |
| 06:57.48 | *** join/#maemo tekojo (n=tekojo@192.100.124.156) |
| 06:57.50 | RST38h | thanks lcuk in absentia |
| 06:58.37 | RST38h | moo tekojo |
| 06:59.29 | Myrtti | one day I'll resign and start a new life as organic carrot farmer |
| 06:59.44 | Stskeeps | excellent choice |
| 07:00.18 | *** join/#maemo mairas (n=mairas@a150-238.24online.fi) |
| 07:00.26 | Myrtti | or move to Hebrides and make a living selling handknitted mittens in Etsy |
| 07:01.09 | *** join/#maemo jukey (n=jukey@kamiserver.de) |
| 07:01.56 | *** join/#maemo FireFox16 (n=b-man16@pool-98-115-99-19.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 07:02.06 | RST38h | Where would you get your food other than carrots? |
| 07:03.37 | tekojo | RST38h moo! |
| 07:03.39 | *** join/#maemo gaspa (n=gaspa@host134-118-static.61-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 07:03.59 | Myrtti | I do knit nicely, I'm sure I'd make enough moneys to buy lamb mince in the Hebrides |
| 07:03.59 | tekojo | Myrtti excellent plan! |
| 07:04.38 | Myrtti | kicks sed/awk/bash/grep/LaTeX in the groin |
| 07:05.14 | *** join/#maemo FireFox16_ (n=b-man16@pool-98-115-100-173.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 07:09.04 | *** join/#maemo Mr (n=bubillya@210.21.227.34) |
| 07:09.59 | *** join/#maemo L0cMini9 (n=kki@host-84-223-127-225.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 07:10.38 | *** join/#maemo millenomi (n=millenom@93-35-147-242.ip55.fastwebnet.it) |
| 07:10.41 | *** join/#maemo FireFox16__ (n=b-man16@pool-98-115-99-113.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 07:11.14 | *** join/#maemo tekojo1 (n=tekojo@192.100.124.156) |
| 07:14.11 | *** join/#maemo dslvictim (i=530f89fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-osckyqiuebjlpvxv) |
| 07:14.28 | dslvictim | hello world |
| 07:16.18 | bubill331 | hello maemo |
| 07:17.17 | dslvictim | did people comment on http://tinker.it/now/2009/09/15/rewind-rethinking-old-school-devices-using-the-nokia-n900/ ? |
| 07:18.57 | Stskeeps | sure, but it's hard to impress us when we know the tablets are very versatile devices ;) |
| 07:19.24 | bubill331 | tablets can phone ?? |
| 07:19.24 | dslvictim | well, i missed it :) |
| 07:19.33 | dslvictim | the n900 isn't a tablet |
| 07:19.42 | Stskeeps | per definition it is kinda a tablet .. |
| 07:20.07 | dslvictim | well, short of a couple of annoying bugs, it's the best phone i've ever used :) |
| 07:20.09 | Stskeeps | but a n810 could phone over skype or SIP .. |
| 07:20.09 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 07:20.22 | dslvictim | should have upgraded to a later version before traveling |
| 07:20.56 | dslvictim | dsl=damn small linux fwiw, this hostel in krakow is using a version that included ff1.0.6 :o |
| 07:21.14 | Stskeeps | hehe |
| 07:21.24 | dslvictim | sadly neglected to ask the desk about a certain tour in time and missed it :( |
| 07:21.26 | Stskeeps | ah, hi timeless |
| 07:21.27 | *** join/#maemo alexga (n=alex@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 07:21.30 | dslvictim | hi |
| 07:21.50 | Stskeeps | how\s poland? |
| 07:21.58 | dslvictim | took a bunch of night photos |
| 07:22.09 | dslvictim | border control was unfortunate |
| 07:22.25 | dslvictim | there was at one point only one line for non EU nationals |
| 07:22.33 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 07:23.02 | Stskeeps | wonders idly if it is a bad sign one of his headphone plugs is warm - after dropping it yesterday to the coffee |
| 07:23.06 | dslvictim | and the lady trying to enter was stuck for a really long time |
| 07:23.09 | Stskeeps | plugs/earplugs |
| 07:23.19 | dslvictim | yeah, probably not a good idea |
| 07:23.39 | dslvictim | did you see the headphones that were contact aware? iirc sony announced them a few days ago |
| 07:24.01 | *** join/#maemo Mr (n=bubillya@210.21.227.34) |
| 07:24.08 | Stskeeps | i should start using my SE A2DP set.. best headphones i ever had |
| 07:24.08 | dslvictim | ok, second battery charged, and i have a walking tour in 40mins... what to do :) |
| 07:24.10 | Mr | but it's a s60 5th plateform |
| 07:24.27 | dslvictim | mr: eh?? |
| 07:24.27 | Stskeeps | Mr, what? :P |
| 07:24.42 | Stskeeps | bubill: N900 is Maemo |
| 07:24.46 | Stskeeps | not Symbian |
| 07:24.59 | Stskeeps | 770, N800, N810 is Maemo too :P |
| 07:25.06 | bubill | but a n810 could phone over skype or SIP ..---- |
| 07:25.17 | Stskeeps | sure - and that's maemo mgaic |
| 07:25.17 | Stskeeps | magic |
| 07:26.16 | bubill | oh |
| 07:26.18 | Myrtti | randomness |
| 07:26.27 | dslvictim | although skype in n900 is integrated w/ the call app |
| 07:26.35 | dslvictim | unlike the previous version |
| 07:26.51 | dslvictim | that'd be spiffy i suppose if i cared about my phone bill and could find my username+password |
| 07:27.43 | bubill | maemo in the future |
| 07:27.51 | dslvictim | gah. please remind me to thrash the ui designer for the status menu |
| 07:27.58 | dslvictim | i can't trigger MfE from it anymore |
| 07:29.25 | dslvictim | nice, there |
| 07:29.31 | dslvictim | 's no space in /tmp |
| 07:29.39 | dslvictim | wonders which apps will break because of that :o |
| 07:30.16 | bubill | hehe |
| 07:30.44 | *** join/#maemo eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-5-24.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 07:31.37 | dslvictim | cool, wifi here has 600+K/s uplink for me :) |
| 07:32.19 | dslvictim | (and then it stalls, i guess that's burst uplink) |
| 07:32.31 | *** join/#maemo DarwinSurvivor (n=DarwinSu@S0106000f6683e05d.vs.shawcable.net) |
| 07:33.36 | *** join/#maemo sergio (n=sergio@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 07:33.56 | *** join/#maemo millenomi (n=millenom@93-35-147-242.ip55.fastwebnet.it) |
| 07:37.45 | *** join/#maemo ziyourenxiang (n=ziyouren@unaffiliated/ziyourenxiang) |
| 07:41.02 | johnx | dslvictim, not too much broke on maemo4 for lack of /tmp |
| 07:41.21 | johnx | it broke because of other non-standard stuff first :) |
| 07:45.19 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 07:45.56 | dslvictim | johnx: good to know |
| 07:46.04 | dslvictim | i know that some parts of the call app break if / is full |
| 07:46.13 | dslvictim | needs to check to see if that's still the case |
| 07:46.19 | dslvictim | anyway, i have a tour to catch |
| 07:50.59 | Jaffa | zerojay: google-album-art-downloader doesn't work for me: a) the result I get from Google Images doesn't contain the URLs in question; b) changing it to use the search API and a regexp work perfectly; except gio/gvfs isn't letting me read the file once I've recompiled it. |
| 07:54.12 | *** join/#maemo lbt (n=david@78.32.229.233) |
| 07:54.21 | *** part/#maemo MrGoose1 (n=cache@5ac515cf.bb.sky.com) |
| 07:56.49 | *** join/#maemo LB (n=LB@pa58-111-31-3.pa.nsw.optusnet.com.au) |
| 07:57.03 | *** join/#maemo pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0C0BA.access.telenet.be) |
| 08:00.27 | *** join/#maemo fab (n=bellet@monkey.creatis.insa-lyon.fr) |
| 08:07.37 | *** join/#maemo femorandeira (n=Felipe@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 08:09.36 | *** join/#maemo __t (n=t@85.183.53.28) |
| 08:18.44 | *** join/#maemo calvaris (n=calvaris@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 08:19.16 | *** join/#maemo andre__ (n=andre@85.183.48.167) |
| 08:20.09 | *** join/#maemo atx_fh (n=atx@139.6.19.200) |
| 08:24.11 | *** join/#maemo warp10 (n=andrea@93-42-173-70.ip87.fastwebnet.it) |
| 08:24.31 | atx_fh | could someone give me a hint, how i get qemu system emulation + the sbrsh devkit working in the scratchbox dev. env. ? |
| 08:27.58 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.151.204) |
| 08:29.55 | *** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@54.200.49.122-static.velocitynet.com.au) |
| 08:30.32 | *** join/#maemo eocanha (n=eocanha@91.117.227.63) |
| 08:30.54 | *** join/#maemo JamieBennett (n=JamieBen@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) |
| 08:46.06 | *** join/#maemo bubill331 (n=bubillya@210.21.227.34) |
| 08:47.11 | *** join/#maemo Free_maN (n=Free_maN@217.174.199.201) |
| 08:48.04 | *** join/#maemo trbs (n=trbs@87.215.139.10) |
| 08:49.02 | RST38h | Tilt input added |
| 08:50.11 | RST38h | http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1206007/Pictured-The-freakish-Frankensteins-monster-nations-ideal-pet.html |
| 08:51.46 | lcuk | johnx, when are you arriving for the summit |
| 08:54.25 | *** join/#maemo STiAT (n=quassel@80.244.241.60) |
| 09:01.51 | *** join/#maemo ToyKeeper (n=nnnToyKe@74.95.113.201) |
| 09:02.57 | *** join/#maemo LB (n=LB@58.108.160.52) |
| 09:03.25 | *** join/#maemo wazd (n=Miranda@195.91.228.225) |
| 09:04.34 | *** join/#maemo ameng (n=fm@124.42.107.194) |
| 09:04.35 | wazd | hello all |
| 09:04.42 | *** join/#maemo hellwolf (n=hellwolf@62.28.143.10) |
| 09:15.52 | lcuk | mornin wazd |
| 09:16.38 | *** join/#maemo nslu2-log_ (n=nslu2-lo@limax.nslu2-linux.org) |
| 09:17.24 | *** join/#maemo MikaT (n=mtapoja@projects.sse.fi) |
| 09:17.24 | *** join/#maemo koan (n=koan@unaffiliated/koan) |
| 09:17.24 | *** join/#maemo nomis (i=simon@vmax.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de) |
| 09:17.25 | *** join/#maemo wiretapped (n=leif@75.101.62.89) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:17.25 | *** join/#maemo muep_ (n=muep@www.sse.fi) |
| 09:17.25 | *** join/#maemo philipl (i=1000@c-98-234-156-166.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:17.25 | *** join/#maemo mpk (n=mpk@209.20.91.138) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo Free_maN (n=Free_maN@unaffiliated/freeman) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo mairas (n=mairas@a150-238.24online.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo GAN800 (n=ryan@c-68-59-48-143.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo fernand0 (n=fernand0@190.24.51.94) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12_N810 (n=faheem@78-86-35-231.zone2.bethere.co.uk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo Stskeeps (n=chobits@pc-10-195.skjoldhoej.dk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo dottedmag (n=dottedma@altlinux/developer/dottedmag) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo k-s[AWAY] (n=gustavo@enlightenment/developer/k-s) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo MaceN8x0 (n=macer@rancorous.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo vcgomes (n=vcgomes@li17-238.members.linode.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo nelson (n=nelson@rrcs-72-43-17-200.nys.biz.rr.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo Proteous (n=mike@atlantic.devin.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo acydlord (n=acydlord@174-17-73-174.phnx.qwest.net) |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo cmvo_ (n=cmvo@ex4.73a.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo CaptSolo (i=captsolo@kaste.lv) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo LiraNuna (i=liranuna@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo else58 (n=else58@70.114.141.31) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo l7_ (n=l7@evil-wire.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo thresh (n=popa3d@videolan/developer/thresh) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo ds3 (i=noinf@netblock-66-245-251-24.dslextreme.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.01 | *** join/#maemo bmidgley (n=bmidgley@c-67-171-119-91.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo disco_stu (n=wrt54gl@190.216.32.137) |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0C0BA.access.telenet.be) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo L0cMini9 (n=kki@host-84-223-127-225.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo robink (n=robink@fatcat.creosotehill.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo herzi (n=herzi@kiwi.mediascape.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-224-11.om.om.cox.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo chx (n=chx@drupal.org/user/9446/view) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.130) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo CutMeOwnThroat (n=XXXy@chem014254.chem.northwestern.edu) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.18 | *** join/#maemo CShadowRun (n=cshadowr@cshadowrun.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo barnoid (n=barney@holly.queeg.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo ryoohki (n=ryoohki@208.96.15.252) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo carloscesa (n=carlos@189.2.128.130) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo timoph (i=mjolk@kapsi.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo suihkulokki (n=nchip@narury.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo cosmo (i=cosmo@beer.modeemi.cs.tut.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo dev-zero (n=dev-zero@gentoo/developer/dev-zero) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo MuJ (n=muttilai@84.20.130.10) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo toggles_w (n=irssi_to@tommywatson.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo dev (n=dev@itc-scholz.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo aspect (n=aspect@abstracted-spleen.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo sneakret (n=sneakret@mithril.fjarlq.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo tableteer (n=cosinus@nomad.last-refuge.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.19 | wazd | lcuk: what have you done :) |
| 09:18.19 | *** join/#maemo mpk (n=mpk@aggr.com) |
| 09:18.19 | wazd | lcuk: heya :) |
| 09:18.20 | *** join/#maemo AStorm (n=nnnnastr@unaffiliated/astralstorm) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.20 | *** join/#maemo t_s_o (n=tso@25.84-49-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 09:18.20 | *** join/#maemo Khertan (i=5c8e5fd2@gateway/web/freenode/x-lfdsorhnfqjqgqkf) |
| 09:18.21 | Khertan | Hi ! |
| 09:18.56 | lcuk | wazd :'( it wasnt me |
| 09:19.02 | lcuk | hi! khertan! |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo parasight (i=parasigh@propelli.cop.fi) |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo jeremiah (n=jeremiah@c83-248-143-10.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo lardman (n=vircuser@enpc-smm11.bath.ac.uk) |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo LB (n=LB@58.108.160.52) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo STiAT (n=quassel@80.244.241.60) |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo JamieBennett (n=JamieBen@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@54.200.49.122-static.velocitynet.com.au) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo calvaris (n=calvaris@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo femorandeira (n=Felipe@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo sergio (n=sergio@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo DarwinSurvivor (n=DarwinSu@S0106000f6683e05d.vs.shawcable.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo gaspa (n=gaspa@host134-118-static.61-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo croppa (n=stuart@135.27.233.220.static.exetel.com.au) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo jrocha (n=JRocha@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo Wikier (n=wikier@cm-staticIP-85-152-18-129.telecable.es) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo promulo (n=romulo@189.71.11.127) |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo macmaN6789 (n=lkraav@84-50-206-151-dsl.est.estpak.ee) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (i=1000@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo Komzzpa (n=kom@mm-71-245-57-86.leased.line.mgts.by) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.15 | *** join/#maemo Openfree` (n=Openfree@203.110.163.133) |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo brut- (n=brut-@h66-173-4-254.mntimn.dedicated.static.tds.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo aSIMULAtor (n=boo@68-117-129-120.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo oilinki (n=oil@ip-208-109-22-97.ip.secureserver.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo lmoura (n=lauromou@200.184.118.130) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo alterego (i=alterego@sverige.freeshell.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo SpComb (i=terom@zapotek.paivola.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo timo2 (n=Timo@kawari.kabuto.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo mavhc (n=mavhc@cpc1-basf7-0-0-cust298.nott.cable.ntl.com) |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo ScriptRipper (n=martin@opensuse/member/MartinMohring) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo Shapeshifter (n=Shape@saskatoon.icu.uzh.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo RST38h (i=marat@trantor.komkon.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo imhotep (n=imhotep@hikaru.yumegakanau.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo rmrfchik (n=rmrfchik@linuxhacker.ru) |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo Patina (n=tomas@1385158752.dhcp.dbnet.dk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo roope (i=rainisto@xob.kapsi.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo solarion (n=solarion@fsf/member/solarion) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo doffm (n=doffm@67-207-128-217.slicehost.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:28.16 | *** join/#maemo fuz_ (i=nobody@vau75-10-88-164-23-88.fbx.proxad.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:29.25 | *** join/#maemo gomiam (n=magao@157.88.94.233) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:30.06 | RST38h | Italian police and "reptile wranglers" have seized a 1.7-metre-long crocodile allegedly used by a Naples Mafia boss to "intimidate" extortion victims. |
| 09:30.23 | lcuk | o_O |
| 09:30.43 | wazd | RST38h: heya :) |
| 09:31.04 | RST38h | hello to you too |
| 09:31.25 | bubill331 | anbody know some java channel of irc ? |
| 09:31.29 | wjt | RST38h: they sent it to rehab \o/ |
| 09:31.55 | glass | crocs on coke? |
| 09:32.38 | RST38h | that is going to be by secondary ingestion |
| 09:32.54 | bubill331 | ./lis |
| 09:32.56 | bubill331 | ./list |
| 09:33.35 | *** join/#maemo eichi_ (n=eichi@stgt-5f70b554.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 09:34.42 | *** join/#maemo yerga (n=yerga@87.223.174.42) |
| 09:34.47 | gomiam | bubill331: you can try writing commands without dots in front with /say or /quote |
| 09:35.02 | gomiam | /say /msg gomiam Something like this. |
| 09:35.31 | *** join/#maemo florian (n=fuchs@port-217-146-132-69.static.qsc.de) |
| 09:36.53 | wazd | btw, M-R Maemo5 review is out |
| 09:37.04 | wazd | nothing serious as expected |
| 09:37.43 | RST38h | wazd: Same stuff - no portrait, no MMS |
| 09:38.01 | wazd | RST38h: no office editor :D |
| 09:38.03 | RST38h | wazd: "Wait for firmware v3, like iPhone" |
| 09:38.17 | RST38h | Doesn't DataWiz provide that? |
| 09:40.57 | X-Fade | Pretty funny to see who he has added to contacts :) |
| 09:41.55 | wazd | and fake appointments :D |
| 09:42.19 | wazd | "Download M6 build" elouel :) |
| 09:42.33 | frals | is it out in english yet? |
| 09:44.08 | wazd | X-Fade: no Quim and Jussi though :) |
| 09:48.30 | *** join/#maemo _berto_ (n=berto@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 10:02.43 | RST38h | frals: tomorrow |
| 10:03.02 | frals | roger, thanks :) |
| 10:03.05 | RST38h | frals: Although I guess we can translate it to English, if it is really needed |
| 10:03.14 | *** join/#maemo __t1 (n=t@85.183.53.28) |
| 10:03.31 | *** join/#maemo admiral0|wrk (i=5e5429d1@gateway/web/freenode/x-jbefrkrtdkbhpqby) |
| 10:03.46 | RST38h | There isn't much new though. He loves the address book. He gives passing grade to the browser, saying that "iphone is still better" |
| 10:04.04 | frals | just curious if he says what fw/sw version hes using and what the current is |
| 10:04.08 | admiral0|wrk | hi. i was wondering... which are the drivers of n900 that are closed src? |
| 10:04.12 | wazd | better because it has portrait view |
| 10:04.13 | RST38h | Hates the phone (says phone dropped 3G calls in Korea and has some UI problems) |
| 10:04.21 | RST38h | frals: He admitted of using 34.14 |
| 10:04.27 | RST38h | frals: I.e. August |
| 10:04.37 | frals | ok ty |
| 10:04.55 | RST38h | He wants the portrait view everywhere and calls N900 a "geek device" |
| 10:05.05 | Jaffa | And given Nokia are producing new builds every night, this is a very *very* old build |
| 10:05.26 | RST38h | Says nothing will be fixed until Summer 2010 when the second Fremantle device is apparently due |
| 10:05.43 | RST38h | Looks like he is either not aware of SSU or has chosen to ignore it |
| 10:06.03 | aSIMULAter | 34-14 geez |
| 10:06.27 | RST38h | Jaffa: I can produce builds every night with a script, it is not any indication of improvement. Still, August is kinda far off |
| 10:06.58 | RST38h | Ah, almost forgot: he wants the MMS :) |
| 10:07.01 | Jaffa | RST38h: Yes, of course. But the point is they are working on it again |
| 10:07.06 | Jaffa | still. |
| 10:07.07 | Jaffa | whatever. |
| 10:07.25 | RST38h | And apparently thinks that adding portrait mode is so "hard" Nokia only managed to do it for the Phone |
| 10:07.37 | suihkulokki | funny calender too |
| 10:07.44 | frals | aight |
| 10:07.56 | X-Fade | RST38h: That is why gpodder use it too, right :D |
| 10:08.06 | Jaffa | And Conboy |
| 10:08.21 | frals | so hes not a programmer by a long shot and assumes a bit much then |
| 10:08.43 | X-Fade | You know what they say about assume :) |
| 10:08.50 | frals | aye :) |
| 10:09.10 | JamieBennett | Jaffa do you have a copy of the travel agents email for the Summit, I never got sent one :( |
| 10:09.19 | JamieBennett | and I need to sort out how I'm getting there |
| 10:10.02 | frals | on another note, serving your gf with waffles w/ whipped cream and jam scores you major points |
| 10:10.14 | RST38h | XFade: I tried explaining that to him in general terms but he is kinda jittery when presented with the facts |
| 10:10.24 | frals | also makes you full enough to throw up halfway thru the day :p |
| 10:10.57 | X-Fade | RST38h: I wouldn't waste my time ;) |
| 10:11.25 | X-Fade | RST38h: Let him have his opinion. That makes it fun. |
| 10:11.46 | frals | btw, any decent irc clients for the previous maemo versions out? i.e. touchfriendly? |
| 10:12.04 | frals | or is ssh + screen&irssi the way to do it? ;) |
| 10:12.19 | wazd | RST38h: and he still thinks that Nokia developer and third party maemo dev are same people :) |
| 10:12.46 | aSIMULAter | ssh + screen + irssi :P |
| 10:13.17 | RST38h | wazd: He went into full anal defense mode yesterday around midnight |
| 10:13.32 | frals | roger aSIMULAter ;) |
| 10:13.39 | RST38h | wazd: You should have been more polite with him, to prolong the fun =) |
| 10:13.41 | aSIMULAter | well thsi is how i do it at least |
| 10:14.58 | wazd | RST38h: no, seriously, he's talking crap using my quotes out of the context, and says that it should be like that |
| 10:15.00 | frals | yeah i figured that to be a good way, but buttons to change channels would be cool, i think, unless you remap some of the keys on the hw kboard |
| 10:16.08 | RST38h | wazd: that is normal |
| 10:26.07 | lcuk | wazd, if you dont feed the trolls he cannot take your quotes out of context |
| 10:26.09 | *** join/#maemo zap (n=zap@213.59.86.89) |
| 10:26.36 | *** part/#maemo ameng (n=fm@124.42.107.194) |
| 10:26.39 | ccooke | frals: A while back I was considering some irssi plugins to work with maemo. |
| 10:26.54 | pupnik | such as? |
| 10:27.00 | ccooke | frals: preferably ones that would work from the other side of an ssh link. :-) |
| 10:27.35 | ccooke | pupnik: well, in maemo 4 terms, notifications when someone queries you |
| 10:27.47 | pupnik | same idea here |
| 10:27.59 | ccooke | pupnik: how far did you get? |
| 10:28.35 | pupnik | no beeping on tablet yet |
| 10:28.44 | pupnik | but beeping in urxvt |
| 10:28.52 | pupnik | thru ssh + screen |
| 10:29.33 | frals | cool |
| 10:29.35 | ccooke | nice. |
| 10:29.41 | *** join/#maemo calvaris (n=calvaris@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 10:29.56 | lbt | hmm not heard of this before... http://www.tomtom.com/page/openLR |
| 10:30.40 | lcuk | RST38h, mmm ? "RST38h thanks lcuk in absentia" |
| 10:31.04 | lcuk | lbt, secret project by keesj? :D |
| 10:31.05 | pupnik | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:31.12 | pupnik | hmm |
| 10:31.26 | RST38h | lcuk: For the accelerometer code in wiki |
| 10:31.33 | lcuk | smiles |
| 10:31.44 | _berto_ | is there any problem with the git server at garage ? |
| 10:31.49 | *** join/#maemo Meiz_n810 (n=Meizirkk@padedu-62-165-142-134.phnet.fi) |
| 10:32.41 | X-Fade | _berto_: What's up? |
| 10:32.47 | _berto_ | error: Cannot access URL https://git.maemo.org/projects/hildon/, return code 18 |
| 10:32.56 | _berto_ | i cannot push anything |
| 10:34.16 | X-Fade | _berto_: Ferenc seems to be working on git, I'll try to find out what the problem is. |
| 10:34.34 | *** join/#maemo trbs (n=trbs@80.101.123.149) |
| 10:34.43 | _berto_ | X-Fade: thanks |
| 10:35.14 | pupnik | ccooke you just need to get 1) irssi generating ascii bells (see config) 2) ensure screen and ssh do not mangle bells and 3) ensure that your term program (client) generates a beep on ctrÃl-g |
| 10:35.38 | ccooke | pupnik: that's not really what I wanted |
| 10:36.09 | ccooke | I'd thought of actual text notifications, and clicking on them causing irssi to be refocussed and switch to the relevant tab |
| 10:36.09 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (n=lizardo@189.2.128.130) |
| 10:36.50 | pupnik | k. need to write irssi plugin plus maemo daemon |
| 10:38.27 | ccooke | yes |
| 10:38.46 | ccooke | it's easy enough with screen - you end up dedicating one screen window to it. |
| 10:39.43 | pupnik | makes me want some middleware |
| 10:40.52 | pupnik | like the irssi plugin, instead of using some custom protocol, could appear itself as an irssi server |
| 10:40.55 | ccooke | the simple (and ugly) way is to make a plugin that writes a logfile of events, then your daemon does an ssh+tail on the logfile and parses it for notifications... |
| 10:41.12 | pupnik | mhm |
| 10:41.31 | pupnik | s/irssi/irc/ |
| 10:41.56 | ccooke | What would make more sense, though, is irssiproxy |
| 10:42.59 | pupnik | .. |
| 10:43.10 | zerojay | yawns |
| 10:43.17 | *** join/#maemo hannesw_ (n=hannes@91-114-225-72.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 10:43.23 | pupnik | everything looks like a bad compromise |
| 10:43.24 | ccooke | so you end up with an ssh to set up port forwardings, then irssi-proxy running in a screen session on the tablet. That way, the plugin can just do the maemo stuff itself |
| 10:43.52 | ccooke | pupnik: that's because everything *is* a bad compromise :-) |
| 10:45.29 | pupnik | that works |
| 10:45.46 | pupnik | just dont send stuff over wlan U dont need to |
| 10:46.05 | pupnik | save batt, i think |
| 10:46.12 | ccooke | yes. |
| 10:46.30 | ccooke | it would also be more responsive |
| 10:47.19 | pupnik | how about something more general |
| 10:47.48 | ccooke | a generic daemon for notifications? |
| 10:47.51 | pupnik | irssi plugin reroutes pms to some IM service, which could run on maemo, or phone ot anything |
| 10:48.09 | ccooke | that would be Complicated. |
| 10:48.34 | pupnik | k just pondering |
| 10:48.57 | ccooke | also, the point for me is that I like the irssi interface |
| 10:49.50 | pupnik | bah, find out how to give maemo xterm audible bell or LED flask, and im set |
| 10:50.07 | pupnik | and/or LED flash |
| 10:50.08 | lbt | dbus |
| 10:50.25 | ccooke | pupnik: I can do it with screen... |
| 10:50.30 | pupnik | i think it might be in stty settings |
| 10:50.57 | ccooke | just attach a filter to the screen window, then trigger a bell sound every time it sees a ^a! (*shudder*) |
| 10:51.52 | pupnik | it is the law that terms handle bell character :) just got to find the setting |
| 10:56.22 | *** join/#maemo tekojo (n=tekojo@192.100.124.156) |
| 10:56.55 | *** join/#maemo Anunakin (n=fazzi@187-25-82-116.3g.claro.net.br) |
| 10:57.19 | *** join/#maemo ShadowJK (i=jk@terminus.enivax.net) |
| 10:57.48 | X-Fade | _berto_: Is the problem still there? |
| 10:58.08 | _berto_ | X-Fade: checkin |
| 10:58.36 | _berto_ | X-Fade: yes |
| 10:58.46 | _berto_ | CURLE_PARTIAL_FILE (18) A file transfer was shorter or larger than expected. This happens when the server first reports an expected transfer size, and then delivers data that doesn't match the previously given size. |
| 10:59.52 | *** part/#maemo admiral0|wrk (i=5e5429d1@gateway/web/freenode/x-jbefrkrtdkbhpqby) |
| 11:01.21 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@nemein.suvilahti.nemein.net) |
| 11:06.37 | *** join/#maemo sopi (n=sopi@nemein.suvilahti.nemein.net) |
| 11:10.59 | *** join/#maemo tbf (n=mathias@86.56.37.235) |
| 11:15.02 | MaceN8x0 | hello |
| 11:19.06 | lcuk | ponders |
| 11:20.54 | *** join/#maemo ab (n=ab@pdpc/supporter/professional/ab) |
| 11:24.32 | Macer | hm |
| 11:24.41 | Macer | i would use chrome on this xp box but... |
| 11:24.45 | Macer | chrome is still underdeveloped |
| 11:24.48 | Macer | like android |
| 11:24.57 | Macer | google does release some semi-good shit |
| 11:25.04 | Macer | too bad they seem to fail on follow through |
| 11:25.45 | Macer | i could only imagine the horror that is googleos that will be coming out |
| 11:26.31 | Macer | installs firefox |
| 11:27.38 | aquatix | is rather happy with what HTC did to Android with Sense |
| 11:28.08 | Macer | in the US the tethering app was taken from the market |
| 11:28.14 | Macer | because it is against the tmob agreement |
| 11:28.23 | aquatix | that's not Android's fault |
| 11:28.25 | Macer | good thing i installed BEFORE it was taken off the market heh |
| 11:28.29 | aquatix | blame your stupid providers :) |
| 11:28.33 | Macer | didn't say it was. was just saying ;) |
| 11:28.40 | aquatix | Macer: be sure to backup the .apk |
| 11:29.07 | aquatix | otoh, i really like the MoDaCo rom O:) |
| 11:29.07 | Macer | aquatix: no need. i just won't touch the phone until the n900 comes out |
| 11:29.14 | aquatix | heh, fair enough |
| 11:29.23 | Macer | i don't like android anyways |
| 11:29.30 | Macer | i think mostly because of its app development |
| 11:29.41 | Macer | and its immaturity in certain areas |
| 11:29.49 | Macer | like the almost complete lack of bt support |
| 11:29.54 | aquatix | true |
| 11:30.10 | Macer | the apps are sometimes horrible |
| 11:30.12 | aquatix | with a rooted phone, that's less of an issue |
| 11:30.16 | aquatix | but still an issue |
| 11:30.17 | Macer | and its market is full of crap apps |
| 11:30.28 | aquatix | myeah, so is each other market |
| 11:30.29 | Macer | aquatix: well. depends on the rom you are running |
| 11:30.48 | Macer | like i have to run hidd manually (after building it myself in their sdk) |
| 11:30.55 | Macer | in order to use a bt keyboard? |
| 11:31.02 | Macer | what crap :) |
| 11:31.10 | aquatix | hm, didn't try a bt keyboard yet |
| 11:31.22 | Macer | i mean the stuff is there for the support and they are relying on the community in order to keep their OS vaiable |
| 11:31.31 | aquatix | my iGo worked out of the box with my n810 and sony ericsson m600i |
| 11:31.37 | *** join/#maemo penguinbait (n=mlewis@68.62.26.176) |
| 11:31.44 | Macer | why pay your own devs when you can have some 14 yr old pumping out garbage apps? :) |
| 11:31.49 | aquatix | ghehe |
| 11:31.50 | aquatix | myeah |
| 11:32.06 | Macer | not to mention the quickoffice crap |
| 11:32.10 | aquatix | true |
| 11:32.12 | Macer | i was disgusted with that one |
| 11:32.17 | aquatix | but that was crap on my m600i too |
| 11:32.22 | Macer | on symbian quickoffice was totally awesome |
| 11:32.26 | Macer | at least on my n95 it was |
| 11:32.36 | Macer | so i figured the android ver would be just as good |
| 11:32.41 | aquatix | hm, true |
| 11:32.45 | Macer | and it was only a viewr they were selling for $20 |
| 11:32.45 | Macer | haha |
| 11:32.51 | aquatix | on UIQ3 you could at least edit stuff |
| 11:32.56 | aquatix | heh |
| 11:32.57 | Macer | jumping on the android market get rich bandwagon |
| 11:33.12 | aquatix | doesn't use office apps anyway |
| 11:33.18 | Macer | aquatix: i do ;) |
| 11:33.21 | aquatix | but a decent spreadsheet could be nice |
| 11:33.24 | Macer | i thought androffice was going to be an entire suite |
| 11:33.29 | Macer | but it was just a spreadsheet editor |
| 11:33.30 | aquatix | there's a decent spreadsheet app btw |
| 11:33.36 | Macer | and the devs "are working on a document editor" |
| 11:33.38 | *** join/#maemo tonikitoo (n=tonikito@189.2.128.130) |
| 11:33.42 | aquatix | heh, ouch |
| 11:34.20 | aquatix | http://www.androlib.com/android.application.com-bytesquared-spreadsheet-qqxq.aspx <- that one looks decent |
| 11:34.30 | aquatix | but i'd really would like a port of gnumeric :) |
| 11:34.38 | aquatix | loves gnumeric on maemo |
| 11:35.00 | Macer | well. abiword and gnumeric are very lightweight. but they work :) |
| 11:35.13 | Macer | wish they had cups support and could print from the n810 directly but blah |
| 11:35.46 | *** join/#maemo radic (n=radic@109.85.17.51) |
| 11:35.50 | Macer | yeah. androffice is still only a spreadsheet editor |
| 11:36.04 | Macer | so they should seriously just change the name to "andsheet" or something :) |
| 11:36.15 | Macer | either way. there is no easy way to get a bt kb to work on an android phone |
| 11:36.26 | Macer | if i didn't have root on my phone it wouldn't work at all |
| 11:36.49 | Macer | so far it's been about a year and android has been fail |
| 11:36.58 | aquatix | myeah, it works for me |
| 11:37.02 | aquatix | only no bt keyboard |
| 11:37.06 | Macer | i couldn't believe they released the phone without a2dp support |
| 11:37.07 | aquatix | but i love my Hero as a phone |
| 11:37.14 | Macer | heh |
| 11:37.24 | Macer | i haven't tried a hero rom yet. i'd rather have working apps than a bunch of eye candy |
| 11:37.30 | Macer | sighs thinking about an n900 |
| 11:37.36 | aquatix | well, it's not only eye candy |
| 11:37.48 | aquatix | they actually managed to put in quite some usability stuff |
| 11:37.53 | SpeedEvil | sig11s thinking about a n900. |
| 11:37.56 | aquatix | which nokia put in the n900 too |
| 11:38.20 | aquatix | ooh, androffice can edit .ods |
| 11:38.24 | aquatix | hmmm |
| 11:38.29 | Macer | yeah |
| 11:38.35 | Macer | but no doc editor? |
| 11:38.40 | Macer | :) it's not an office suite |
| 11:38.48 | Macer | it's a spreadsheet editor |
| 11:38.54 | Macer | quickoffice on the n95 was so awesome |
| 11:38.58 | *** join/#maemo L0cutus_ (n=kki@84.223.127.225) |
| 11:39.07 | aquatix | i only need a text editor for my latex stuff |
| 11:39.11 | Macer | i typed entire term papers on it |
| 11:39.15 | aquatix | maybe a latex processor would be nice ;) |
| 11:39.16 | aquatix | hm |
| 11:39.19 | Macer | :) |
| 11:39.26 | Macer | with my n95 + su8w |
| 11:39.27 | aquatix | maybe i can build an app to offload that to a server |
| 11:39.36 | aquatix | now there's an idea |
| 11:39.41 | Macer | ah well. i have to go clean a little bit |
| 11:39.43 | Macer | bbl |
| 11:39.48 | aquatix | Macer: term papers on n95? |
| 11:39.53 | aquatix | with bt keyboard i presume? |
| 11:40.16 | aquatix | otherwise: eek :) |
| 11:41.13 | aquatix | anyways, good luck |
| 11:41.32 | frals | im still feeling a bit sad about retiring my n95 for the n900 (when my order lands) |
| 11:42.00 | frals | on the other hand i have a feeling i wont regret it :p musicplayer dying while browsing t.m.o is getting annoying ;) |
| 11:42.01 | aquatix | i rather liked my combo of n810 and SE m600i |
| 11:42.09 | aquatix | ghehe, yeah |
| 11:43.51 | frals | this guy seems a bit more positive than the russian http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=368144#368144 :D |
| 11:46.13 | *** join/#maemo ziyourenxiang (n=ziyouren@unaffiliated/ziyourenxiang) |
| 12:01.15 | *** join/#maemo bubill (n=bubillya@119.139.169.38) |
| 12:06.32 | wazd | I think there's something really wrong with Eldar's nxx |
| 12:07.03 | wazd | Maybe someone sent him broken one like a joke :D |
| 12:07.14 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 12:07.57 | *** join/#maemo halves (n=higor@nat/ibm.br/x-azwbpnomyxudjdod) |
| 12:08.40 | *** join/#maemo alecrim (n=alecrim@189.2.128.130) |
| 12:09.06 | ab | bergie, I cannot thumb up packages on maemo.org, either from FF or IE. What's wrong there? |
| 12:09.26 | X-Fade | ab: You probably can, but takes a while for it to show. |
| 12:09.35 | wazd | are you logged in? |
| 12:09.42 | ab | X-Fade, no activity to my presses |
| 12:09.46 | ab | wazd, sure |
| 12:09.54 | X-Fade | ab: It just looks that way. |
| 12:10.02 | frals | ab: I've had instances where I didn't get any feedback when it happend, but after a refresh it showed up |
| 12:10.03 | X-Fade | ab: Because there is no feedback what so ever. |
| 12:10.03 | wazd | ab: just in case :) |
| 12:10.04 | ab | X-Fade, ok, now it showed up |
| 12:10.34 | X-Fade | ab: Styling is pretty broken yes, do ping bergie about that ;) |
| 12:10.38 | ab | anyone else, please thumb up "ogg support" package |
| 12:10.45 | ab | :) |
| 12:10.51 | ab | we need two more votes to promote it |
| 12:11.07 | X-Fade | ab: Only after actually testing it of course :) |
| 12:11.18 | ab | X-Fade, that is what we all did here :) |
| 12:12.33 | ab | MediaPlayer is playing Ogg out loud right now on my table |
| 12:13.31 | frals | on the brainstorm, is there a way to report a solution as duplicate? ie #2 and #4 on http://maemo.org/community/brainstorm/view/portrait_mode_input/ |
| 12:15.29 | *** join/#maemo eichi_ (n=eichi@stgt-5f70b554.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 12:15.48 | X-Fade | ab: Anyway, there is a supposed to be a 10 day quarantine period. |
| 12:16.31 | X-Fade | ab: But I haven't implemented that yet, so you might be lucky ;) |
| 12:16.38 | ab | X-Fade, I doubt there is a development quarantine :) |
| 12:17.17 | X-Fade | ab: promotion quarantine. |
| 12:18.32 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@80.220.238.64) |
| 12:20.33 | *** join/#maemo avs (n=avs@80-186-117-121.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 12:22.00 | lcuk | grrr @ lazy vdvsx |
| 12:24.14 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (n=javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 12:24.31 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 12:25.28 | tekojo | ab ogg-support seems to have 10/10 |
| 12:26.53 | kulve | that was fast |
| 12:26.53 | kulve | it got 3 thumbs since yesterday and now it got the rest quickly :) |
| 12:27.39 | Jaffa | Yay, attitude is up to 4: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/attitude/0.0.8 |
| 12:28.42 | *** join/#maemo wms (n=wms___@198.146.5.4) |
| 12:28.44 | lcuk | :D jaffa! you included a link to the package |
| 12:29.36 | *** join/#maemo Meiz_n810 (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 12:29.51 | Jaffa | lcuk: could've been worse, I could've put a link to the AJAX request for thumbs up ;-) |
| 12:30.01 | lcuk | yes! |
| 12:30.05 | lcuk | and it wouldv been good |
| 12:30.06 | Jaffa | wonders how well midgard's voting handles CSRF |
| 12:30.08 | lcuk | simplicity |
| 12:30.12 | lcuk | streamlining |
| 12:30.28 | *** join/#maemo blade_runner (n=arezende@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:31.21 | lcuk | jaffa, we have a webbrowser on device - i think it needs using as suggested - perhaps the shortest/quickest method would be to open browser on testing page from ham |
| 12:31.27 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 12:31.55 | atx_fh | bye the way, JNI works fine under meamo arm :) |
| 12:31.56 | X-Fade | Jaffa: That requires login at least. |
| 12:32.55 | *** join/#maemo penguinbait (n=mlewis@173-10-44-233-Michigan.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 12:34.33 | ab | kulve, yep, smart promotion within the development team |
| 12:34.50 | *** join/#maemo mihu (n=mhunold@p5098aa8a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 12:35.43 | kulve | I promoted the package again. I guess that means that it ends up to extras..? |
| 12:35.46 | *** join/#maemo Mapping (n=mapping@88.193.136.137) |
| 12:36.08 | X-Fade | kulve: yes |
| 12:36.14 | kulve | good :) |
| 12:36.43 | *** join/#maemo fernand0_ (n=fernand0@190.27.58.55) |
| 12:40.41 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@67.72.73.34) |
| 12:44.46 | Anunakin | what is the best store (price and time to receive) to buy a N900 ? |
| 12:44.51 | Anunakin | amazon? |
| 12:45.18 | X-Fade | Anunakin: Everything is preorder still, so no actual sales yet. |
| 12:45.35 | _berto_ | Anunakin: if you live in the UK you can get one with a contract |
| 12:46.43 | RST38h | X-Fade: Could you enable extras-testing/non-free and *disable* promotions to extras from there? |
| 12:46.54 | RST38h | X-Fade: Or will it be too much trouble? |
| 12:46.54 | *** join/#maemo briglia (n=briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 12:47.37 | X-Fade | RST38h: I will open -devel for non-free soon, I hope. |
| 12:48.00 | *** join/#maemo radic (n=radic@109.84.247.209) |
| 12:48.16 | X-Fade | RST38h: But testing requires promotion, as we need to do the dependency checks etc. |
| 12:48.30 | X-Fade | RST38h: So that takes a bit longer. |
| 12:49.00 | *** part/#maemo mihu (n=mhunold@p5098aa8a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 12:49.37 | *** join/#maemo pupnik_ (n=pupnik@unaffiliated/pupnik) |
| 12:52.43 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (n=Valerio@bl5-195-200.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 12:53.39 | *** join/#maemo t_s_o (n=tso@25.84-49-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 12:55.49 | javispedro | RST38h: i uploaded openttd today |
| 12:56.01 | RST38h | X-Fade: Oh |
| 12:56.07 | javispedro | RST38h: can you use the Game options menu while in non-scaled mode? |
| 12:56.10 | RST38h | javis: Seen it, but could not scale =) |
| 12:56.15 | *** join/#maemo ArSa (n=ArSa@nc-71-0-121-232.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 12:56.17 | RST38h | javis: It does not scale for me |
| 12:56.29 | javispedro | RST38h: did you select a "lower" res in game options? |
| 12:57.09 | RST38h | javis: Yes, and it simply showed black screen |
| 12:57.10 | javispedro | if you can't phisically hit the options widgets i'll find a way to set that from the cmd line/config file |
| 12:57.24 | javispedro | :P |
| 12:57.36 | *** join/#maemo murrayc_ (n=murrayc@dslb-084-056-016-055.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:57.55 | javispedro | ok, works here. |
| 12:58.01 | RST38h | javis: No I managed to set it, let me try again |
| 12:58.06 | RST38h | This is on startup, right? |
| 12:58.14 | javispedro | yea, startup screen -> game options |
| 12:59.22 | *** join/#maemo chenca (n=chenca@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:59.48 | *** join/#maemo renato (n=renato@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:00.35 | Jaffa | X-Fade: How does it identify "Bugtracker" on the package page? |
| 13:00.48 | X-Fade | Jaffa: I added those manually. |
| 13:01.03 | X-Fade | And you can use Xsbc-bugtracker of course ;) |
| 13:01.21 | X-Fade | Xsbc-Bugtracker even. |
| 13:01.35 | Jaffa | X-Fade: I was about to introduce XSBC-Bugtracker (once I found the actual name) for Attitude, but then saw it was already there |
| 13:01.37 | *** join/#maemo ouilsen (n=ouilsen@linuxc54.rz.RWTH-Aachen.DE) |
| 13:01.49 | Stskeeps | yawns |
| 13:01.50 | Jaffa | still isn't quite sure about the armel/i386 split for comments/rankings etc. |
| 13:02.22 | X-Fade | Jaffa: They should be viewed separate but rating should probably only be on the armel part. |
| 13:02.49 | RST38h | javis: Tested it again. Shows black screen, briefly flashing the image when task switching |
| 13:02.59 | RST38h | javis: I selected 400x240 |
| 13:03.09 | javispedro | that's fullscreen |
| 13:03.13 | javispedro | select the lower one. |
| 13:03.21 | RST38h | a'ok |
| 13:03.39 | javispedro | I know it does not make much sense in n900 but on n810 having fullscreen is a must. |
| 13:04.56 | RST38h | Trying it on n810 |
| 13:05.54 | javispedro | ah, sorry :P |
| 13:06.17 | *** join/#maemo sav1 (n=user@200.255.103.130) |
| 13:06.27 | javispedro | then I cannot think of anything else other than a bad updaterects call, lemme check |
| 13:06.30 | RST38h | javis: Same thing at 400x210 |
| 13:06.35 | *** join/#maemo andrei1089 (n=andrei10@81.18.92.10) |
| 13:06.43 | *** part/#maemo sav1 (n=user@200.255.103.130) |
| 13:07.57 | *** join/#maemo fiferboy (n=quassel@216.185.81.34) |
| 13:09.16 | *** join/#maemo juliank (n=juliank@ubuntu/member/juliank) |
| 13:09.57 | *** join/#maemo briglia (n=briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 13:14.29 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:18.02 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@gateway.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 13:21.43 | *** join/#maemo trbs (n=trbs@d126113.upc-d.chello.nl) |
| 13:22.14 | *** join/#maemo andrei1089 (n=andrei10@81.18.92.10) |
| 13:24.08 | *** part/#maemo bubill (n=bubillya@119.139.169.38) |
| 13:24.27 | *** join/#maemo chenca (n=chenca@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:25.48 | *** join/#maemo gunni (n=quassel@xdsl-84-44-157-61.netcologne.de) |
| 13:27.23 | Jaffa | X-Fade: I think I'm going to change Attitude to try and use Clutter or even OpenGL-ES rather than Cairo. Feel free to raise a bug and you can get some karma ;-) |
| 13:27.38 | *** join/#maemo rkirti (n=oespirit@203.199.213.3) |
| 13:27.44 | X-Fade | Jaffa: Heh, it is a bit slideshow-ish ;) |
| 13:28.08 | tigert | make a bubble-level mode |
| 13:28.18 | tigert | and calibration adjustment |
| 13:28.29 | *** join/#maemo dolphin (n=dolphin@unaffiliated/dolphin) |
| 13:28.55 | tigert | it shows a bit off for me - maybe do a 10 sec sampling and filter to find the most stable value |
| 13:29.16 | tigert | of course one needs a straight surface to begin with :) |
| 13:29.58 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:30.06 | Jaffa | tigert: timsamoff's drawing me some nice graphics for a bubblelevel mode |
| 13:30.33 | Jaffa | tigert: It's doing sampling at the moment, but Cairo not using any 2D accel's a bit of a pain |
| 13:30.44 | Jaffa | tigert: It's doing sampling at the moment, but Cairo not using any 2D accel's a bit of a pain |
| 13:31.02 | Jaffa | wants to get Hermes up and into extras-testing ASAP. That'll be much more popular (and useful) |
| 13:31.17 | X-Fade | Jaffa: Yeah, it maxes out the cpu ;) |
| 13:31.48 | Jaffa | X-Fade: That's not a QA requirement ;-p |
| 13:32.00 | X-Fade | Jaffa: Does now waste energy? :) |
| 13:32.05 | X-Fade | *not |
| 13:32.09 | RST38h | Jaffa: I just open fb0 and bang it directly |
| 13:32.15 | Jaffa | RST38h: Heh |
| 13:32.22 | javispedro | openvg! openvg! |
| 13:32.26 | tigert | Jaffa: cool |
| 13:32.30 | X-Fade | But the SGX should even have hardware dithering. |
| 13:32.40 | RST38h | unless you need to zoom or draw lots of stuff, direct banging is the best option |
| 13:33.07 | RST38h | Why would you need to dither in 16bpp? |
| 13:33.13 | tigert | whats hermes? |
| 13:33.18 | RST38h | Or do you mean antialiasing? |
| 13:33.20 | X-Fade | RST38h: Banding |
| 13:33.45 | SpeedEvil | 16bpp has only 5 bits of red and blue |
| 13:33.59 | SpeedEvil | banding is unfortunately obvious on some images |
| 13:34.01 | SpeedEvil | s/some/many |
| 13:34.12 | RST38h | X-Fade: mmm, at our size of the screen? :) |
| 13:34.29 | X-Fade | RST38h: Yeah, start attitude and see :) |
| 13:34.34 | RST38h | Heh |
| 13:34.48 | *** join/#maemo Vulcanis (n=CBabbage@uhartford236105.hartford.edu) |
| 13:34.58 | RST38h | Blizzard actually does antialiasing, but this is different... |
| 13:35.00 | Jaffa | tigert: Hermes will make sure your contacts have pictures and birthdays against them, if you use Facebook or Twitter |
| 13:36.53 | *** join/#maemo dneary (n=dneary@ALyon-152-1-41-74.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 13:41.57 | Jaffa | X-Fade: BTW, Attitude 0.0.6 still shows up in the Repository QA Queue, even 0.0.8 is in there as well |
| 13:42.09 | X-Fade | Jaffa: Yeah, bug.. |
| 13:42.23 | X-Fade | I'll remove 0.0.6 completely. |
| 13:42.35 | Jaffa | X-Fade: ta |
| 13:44.08 | *** join/#maemo baraujo (n=Bruno@189.2.128.130) |
| 13:45.46 | kulve | X-Fade: any idea how long it should take for a package to be shown in extras after promoting in testing? |
| 13:46.01 | Anunakin | any here using "debian easy"? |
| 13:46.01 | X-Fade | kulve: Yeah, I know exacly how long. |
| 13:46.19 | *** join/#maemo calvaris (n=calvaris@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 13:49.58 | GeneralAntilles | chuckles at the Mer thread. |
| 13:50.25 | Jaffa | The Mer sub-section thread? |
| 13:50.33 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah |
| 13:50.40 | Jaffa | Pfft |
| 13:51.17 | GeneralAntilles | The "Maemo Council" wants to steal my pocket lint! |
| 13:52.05 | Stskeeps | well at least they're taking pride in the community project |
| 13:52.50 | *** join/#maemo Meiz_n810 (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:58.24 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.151.204) |
| 13:59.02 | Jaffa | Stskeeps: Indeed. The suggestion that "the powers that be" don't want Mer to succeed is a little insulting. |
| 13:59.39 | Jaffa | Stskeeps: What's your feeling on a Mer subsection? You pretty much decided last time it came up; time to revisit? Or do you agree with lbt, wait until it's closer to end-user ready? |
| 14:00.22 | lbt | I think there are + and - |
| 14:00.42 | lbt | + makes it more official and brings attention (and maybe resource) |
| 14:01.24 | lbt | - makes it appear that it should be as glossy as N900 videos ... and people are unhappy and we get fights and distractions |
| 14:01.26 | GeneralAntilles | will point out again that it's shit like that that takes the fun out of this job. |
| 14:01.28 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 14:01.49 | Stskeeps | let's make the people happy? :P |
| 14:02.03 | GeneralAntilles | Steal their pocket lint! |
| 14:02.10 | GeneralAntilles | Then their paranoid delusions can be right. |
| 14:02.24 | jaska | and knit screen wipers from the lint? |
| 14:02.43 | X-Fade | Less talk, more doing. |
| 14:02.47 | Jaffa | There's a Mer hacking push at the summit? Let's create the sub-forum then, and populate it with a prepared sticky? |
| 14:03.18 | Jaffa | Don't want to give the trolls the satisfaction of thinking they did it ;-) |
| 14:05.01 | Stskeeps | i'd rather not want a repetition of the fact the smartq mer community warped out into a seperate forum, heh |
| 14:10.11 | *** part/#maemo tekojo (n=tekojo@192.100.124.156) |
| 14:13.26 | GeneralAntilles | Calibrating 5 LCDs takes forever. |
| 14:16.24 | *** join/#maemo zuii (n=zuii@222.212.107.248) |
| 14:17.12 | zuii | is there anyone know how to install libhildonmm library? |
| 14:17.59 | zuii | hello? |
| 14:18.16 | Stskeeps | install it from extras? |
| 14:20.32 | zuii | sorry, calling... |
| 14:23.32 | *** join/#maemo ferulo (n=fherrera@233.118.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es) |
| 14:24.13 | *** join/#maemo caotic (n=caotic@189.183.26.81) |
| 14:26.12 | zuii | stskeeps.. |
| 14:26.37 | zuii | the sdk i installed is maemo5 beta2 |
| 14:26.45 | asj_wrk- | http://media.weathersealed.com/maps/mcd_us_high.jpg -- I find this disturbing |
| 14:27.06 | Stskeeps | hah :P |
| 14:27.20 | aquatix | oh wow |
| 14:27.29 | *** join/#maemo lopz (i=gentoo@unaffiliated/lopz) |
| 14:27.31 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@dslb-084-056-016-055.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 14:27.53 | lopz | hi ;) |
| 14:28.04 | zuii | there is no extra source for libhildonmm |
| 14:28.27 | murrayc | zuii: Is this on Fremantle? |
| 14:28.41 | zuii | yes |
| 14:28.52 | murrayc | zuii: http://maemomm.garage.maemo.org/docs_unstable/tutorial/html/sec-installation.html |
| 14:29.11 | murrayc | Basically, it's in extras-devel. |
| 14:29.12 | zuii | thx let me see |
| 14:31.02 | zuii | updating... |
| 14:31.49 | *** join/#maemo carloscesa (n=carlos@189.2.128.130) |
| 14:34.40 | *** join/#maemo wirelessdreamer (n=anderson@chrobd01.vailsys.com) |
| 14:34.49 | zuii | installing..... thanks very much,murrayc |
| 14:36.24 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.151.204) |
| 14:41.40 | pupnik_ | mplayer seems (?) to have no way to tell codecs to timescale - eg playback mp3/mp4/ogg/aac etc fraöes at varying speeds (without changing pitch) |
| 14:42.02 | pupnik_ | s/fraöes/frames/ |
| 14:42.44 | pupnik_ | a slick media player should support that (flag to all @ nokia :) |
| 14:44.06 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 14:44.15 | pupnik_ | wish i had a job where i could tell people what to do :) |
| 14:44.30 | SpeedEvil | Get a job as a traffic warden. |
| 14:44.43 | pupnik_ | :) |
| 14:45.37 | asj_wrk- | pupnik_: all jobs have people telling you want to do, run your own company with 50 staff, now you just have 100 customers tell you want to do |
| 14:45.55 | asj_wrk- | s/want/what/g |
| 14:46.07 | pupnik_ | obviously |
| 14:47.07 | pupnik_ | is what made my comment ironic |
| 14:47.10 | asj_wrk- | ah well |
| 14:47.32 | *** join/#maemo GuySoft (i=guy@93-173-255-180.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 14:47.42 | pupnik_ | regardless, ill put a varispeed player on my to do list |
| 14:48.52 | *** join/#maemo Sho_ (n=EHS1@kde/hein) |
| 14:48.55 | pupnik_ | heres the reason: many non-native english speakers can understand fast native english better when played back timestretched to 0.7 speed |
| 14:48.58 | asj_wrk- | what do people use that for? |
| 14:49.03 | *** join/#maemo lardman|home (n=vircuser@78.145.93.111) |
| 14:49.03 | asj_wrk- | ah |
| 14:49.07 | lardman|home | afternoon all |
| 14:49.15 | pupnik_ | esp :) |
| 14:49.33 | pupnik_ | hi |
| 14:49.41 | pupnik_ | how u dooing? |
| 14:49.44 | SpeedEvil | pupnik_: it's probably a filter I suspect, not a codec thing |
| 14:49.52 | pupnik_ | no no no |
| 14:50.13 | pupnik_ | :) |
| 14:50.14 | lardman|home | hi pupnik_ |
| 14:50.24 | pupnik_ | mplayer seems (?) to have no way to tell codecs to timescale - eg playback mp3/mp4/ogg/aac etc fraÃmes at varying speeds (without changing pitch) |
| 14:50.30 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 14:50.42 | ShadowJK | Mplayer has a scaletempo filter |
| 14:50.46 | SpeedEvil | pupnik_: yes - that is not a thing a codec can often sanely do |
| 14:50.52 | SpeedEvil | pupnik_: it would be a filter |
| 14:50.53 | ShadowJK | Codecs have nothing to do with it |
| 14:50.55 | pupnik_ | yes, that resamples the pcm audio |
| 14:51.03 | ShadowJK | -af scaletempo |
| 14:51.05 | pupnik_ | sounds like shit |
| 14:51.18 | ShadowJK | Might be newer feature than rc1 though |
| 14:51.21 | pupnik_ | mplayer -af scaletempo=scale=.6 bnt.mp3 |
| 14:51.43 | SpeedEvil | pupnik_: which did the required fft magic - some codecs - for example PCM or FLAC - have no idea at all of frequency spectrum - and would need to totally reimplement the same code to do pitch bending |
| 14:51.45 | pupnik_ | without resampling the pcm stream as an audio plugin does |
| 14:52.05 | SpeedEvil | You fundamentally have to resample, the maths cannot be denied. |
| 14:52.07 | pupnik_ | correct speedevil |
| 14:52.50 | pupnik_ | any way you slice it, the mplayer codec api needs a new timescale variable |
| 14:53.02 | ShadowJK | Resampling is a different operation again :) |
| 14:53.08 | pupnik_ | andso freq domain codecs can implement it |
| 14:53.23 | zuii | is there anyone using ESbox now? |
| 14:53.36 | zuii | How to import a project? |
| 14:53.53 | ShadowJK | Pupnik: what, shift the mp3 bands up on decode? |
| 14:54.06 | pupnik_ | no, pkayback frames faster |
| 14:54.13 | pupnik_ | pitch stays same |
| 14:54.23 | ShadowJK | It doesn't work like that |
| 14:54.25 | pupnik_ | oror slower |
| 14:54.31 | pupnik_ | yes.. it.. does |
| 14:54.39 | pupnik_ | freq domain does |
| 14:55.03 | zuii | i got it ... |
| 14:55.20 | pupnik_ | good luck zuii |
| 14:55.25 | ShadowJK | i know of no codec that support it anyway. So an API is a chicken-egg problem right now anyways |
| 14:55.34 | zuii | thx |
| 14:57.07 | *** join/#maemo alsuren (n=alsuren@host86-157-116-246.range86-157.btcentralplus.com) |
| 14:58.34 | *** join/#maemo blade_runner (n=arezende@200.184.118.130) |
| 15:03.00 | pupnik_ | i just want it on the record that pupnik said "IT WILL BE SO" on |
| 15:03.10 | pupnik_ | Thu Sep 24 17:03:02 CEST 2009 |
| 15:09.44 | *** join/#maemo ijon_ (n=ijon@95.108.172.152) |
| 15:09.45 | zuii | I met a error when i want to run my gtk application, osso_initialize failed |
| 15:10.14 | zuii | anyone know how to fix it? |
| 15:11.37 | zuii | use run-standalone.sh can make it work, but why? |
| 15:11.54 | sp3000 | environment stuff |
| 15:12.05 | GAN800 | dneary, ping? |
| 15:12.16 | sp3000 | depending on how you got your command line you may not have the ...dunno, dbus somethings and such |
| 15:12.17 | dneary | GAN800: Pong! |
| 15:12.38 | *** join/#maemo acouto (n=adriano@201.56.102.13) |
| 15:12.39 | zuii | maemo 5 beta2 |
| 15:12.50 | GAN800 | dneary, so, I'd like to see about running through the site content and cleaning up everything before the Summit. |
| 15:13.04 | GAN800 | Moving/deleting/revising |
| 15:13.23 | GAN800 | Since we've got a lot of half-working (email forums) and legacy stuff. |
| 15:13.32 | *** join/#maemo felipec (n=felipec@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 15:13.53 | *** join/#maemo Passeli (n=passeli@85.23.73.223) |
| 15:14.33 | acouto | hi all |
| 15:14.33 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.151.204) |
| 15:14.41 | *** join/#maemo jnettlet (n=jnettlet@216-19-186-197.dyn.novuscom.net) |
| 15:15.59 | acouto | which package do i have to install to use liblocation on scratchbox? (DIABLO_ARMEL) |
| 15:20.18 | zuii | i don't know.... |
| 15:23.17 | lcuk | acouto, isnt liblocation the thing that uses gps? |
| 15:23.26 | lcuk | or is it the one that does clock selection |
| 15:23.55 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.151.204) |
| 15:24.33 | acouto | lcuk, gps |
| 15:25.09 | *** join/#maemo Vulc|Laptop (n=A_Lovela@137.49.64.53) |
| 15:25.26 | lcuk | normally the sdk includes -dev versions of the libraries |
| 15:25.36 | ShadowJK | Is liblocation a diablo thing or is it new in fremantle? |
| 15:25.40 | *** join/#maemo herzi (n=herzi@p579A6B5C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:25.49 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@98.168.224.11) |
| 15:26.47 | acouto | ShadowJK, diablo |
| 15:29.12 | *** join/#maemo CutMeOwnThroat (n=XXXy@chem014254.chem.northwestern.edu) |
| 15:29.25 | *** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (i=1000@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 15:30.03 | SpeedEvil | stabs random unexplained lockups with nothing in syslog. |
| 15:32.01 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12 (n=Faheem@78-86-35-231.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 15:32.14 | Stskeeps | wb qw |
| 15:32.22 | Stskeeps | qwerty12 |
| 15:32.22 | qwerty12 | Thanks, STiAT |
| 15:32.32 | qwerty12 | *Stskeeps, sorry STiAT |
| 15:32.53 | *** join/#maemo briglia (n=briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 15:34.39 | lcuk | SpeedEvil, what happens if the error is with writing to syslog |
| 15:35.47 | GeneralAntilles | ShadowJK, new in Fremantle. |
| 15:36.35 | SpeedEvil | lcuk: yeah - possible - I need to work out some method of oops-logging |
| 15:37.05 | lcuk | GeneralAntilles, that would explain his problem then lol |
| 15:38.49 | *** join/#maemo fab (n=bellet@82.225.61.136) |
| 15:38.50 | Jaffa | wants a libgpsbt <-> liblocation bridge so that navicore will work on Fremantle |
| 15:39.02 | *** part/#maemo zuii (n=zuii@222.212.107.248) |
| 15:39.12 | GeneralAntilles | wants a cake pony. |
| 15:39.21 | Myrtti | votes for cheesecake |
| 15:39.35 | RST38h | Why the hell do you want navicore? |
| 15:39.44 | Jaffa | RST38h: Cos I've used Ovi Maps ;-) |
| 15:39.48 | lardman|home | is libgpsbt closed? |
| 15:39.50 | RST38h | ah |
| 15:40.01 | RST38h | is navicore better then? |
| 15:40.26 | Jaffa | RST38h: Navicore seems quicker; does voice turn-by-turn nav; shows you your speed and I paid 10 quid for a 3 year licence for it. |
| 15:40.46 | lardman|home | yeah same here |
| 15:40.54 | GeneralAntilles | Be nice if Nokia provided an upgrade route for Navicore users. |
| 15:40.55 | Jaffa | RST38h: Navicore also uses pre-downloaded maps; whereas Ovi tends to want to download on demand (although their is an S60 area downloader, which might work for the Maemo version too) |
| 15:41.01 | *** join/#maemo zuii (n=zuii@222.212.107.248) |
| 15:41.32 | RST38h | I think you can predownload for ovi |
| 15:41.45 | RST38h | just need to know where to place stuff |
| 15:42.17 | Jaffa | Yeah, there are various cache directories which look appropriate |
| 15:42.30 | lardman|home | anyone got a link to the libgpsbt deb? |
| 15:42.33 | Jaffa | Ovi Maps looks pretty, but seems pretty limited in functionality (and the UI is a confusing mess IMHO) |
| 15:42.42 | RST38h | the ovi maemo ui looks confusing though |
| 15:42.47 | lcuk | i really like the nightmode |
| 15:42.48 | RST38h | heh |
| 15:42.56 | lcuk | the maps look like 3d tunnels and pipework |
| 15:44.20 | Jaffa | lardman|home: http://maemo.org/api_refs/4.0/gpsbt/group__gpsbt__api.html is the API ref |
| 15:44.33 | *** join/#maemo nielsslot (n=quassel@86.93.198.169) |
| 15:44.33 | RST38h | that is changeable, but what the hell is my current address doing in the middle of the map? And why can't I remove it? |
| 15:44.56 | Jaffa | RST38h: Yeah. Loads of wasted space, mostly in where you want to go |
| 15:45.17 | qwerty12 | lardman|home: Diablo's one is part of nokia-binaries; look in your homedir for your SB account |
| 15:45.30 | RST38h | Jaffa: My guess is that they ported S60 UI with 1:1 precision. But the S60 UI was designed for small screens and button input |
| 15:45.42 | RST38h | Jaffa: On the tablet, it looks weird and out of place |
| 15:45.50 | GeneralAntilles | Hopefully it'll improve. |
| 15:45.56 | lardman|home | qwerty12: ok cool |
| 15:46.30 | RST38h | General: It won't unless 10-20 people tell Quim/Peter/etc that it is ridiculous |
| 15:46.30 | RST38h | And point out exactly why |
| 15:46.33 | lardman|home | Jaffa: well those functions don't look too exciting to me |
| 15:46.39 | GeneralAntilles | Somebody should prep a review article. |
| 15:46.44 | RST38h | Even in that case it may still not improve, but anyway |
| 15:46.44 | lardman|home | Jaffa: perhaps Navicore could be tricked |
| 15:47.09 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (n=javier@80.32.146.69) |
| 15:47.09 | RST38h | General: Actually, Eldar seems to have done a good job (translation tomorrow), except for his whining |
| 15:47.31 | Jaffa | lardman|home: Indeed, either a new libgpsbt which just maps through to the appropriate real calls; or just a copy of the diablo variants ;-) |
| 15:48.20 | lardman|home | pairing stuff could be ignored |
| 15:48.25 | Jaffa | lardman|home: I didn't look much further than a dpkg-repack and an unsatisfied link dependency when starting it |
| 15:49.14 | lardman|home | does Navicore read from a gpsd port, or from a dev entry? |
| 15:50.03 | *** join/#maemo elninja (n=r@adsl-76-208-19-229.dsl.sbndin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 15:50.45 | lardman|home | just hope Navicore doesn't have any hardcoded gstreamer elements in it |
| 15:50.58 | lardman|home | like dsp sinks |
| 15:51.32 | javispedro | lardman: navicore, gst? |
| 15:51.44 | javispedro | why? O.o |
| 15:51.49 | lardman|home | well it makes noises, so it must come out somehow |
| 15:51.52 | RST38h | javispedro: ok, good news and bad news |
| 15:52.02 | RST38h | javispedro: Good news: 420x210 does work |
| 15:52.22 | javispedro | :) |
| 15:52.23 | javispedro | bad news? |
| 15:52.43 | RST38h | javispedro: Bad news: command line options do not work in this binary, and enabling this mode from the menu is near impossible, especially considering that once you resize, you can no longer close the window |
| 15:53.08 | javispedro | ah, that rings a bell, wait. |
| 15:53.38 | RST38h | javispedro: Fixing the command line options and inseting the right resolution into .desktop file should do the job |
| 15:53.56 | javispedro | i did not touch anything cmd line options related |
| 15:54.00 | RST38h | javispedro: This leaves a few small problems, like the news items being wider than the screen |
| 15:54.18 | RST38h | javis: probably means they have been already broken :) |
| 15:54.21 | *** join/#maemo hecklejeckle (n=hangeles@173-15-176-105-BusName-Philadelphia.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 15:54.30 | javispedro | were they broken in prev binary? |
| 15:54.34 | RST38h | dunno |
| 15:54.47 | javispedro | you may still have it in /usr/games if you did not replace it |
| 15:54.54 | *** part/#maemo hecklejeckle (n=hangeles@173-15-176-105-BusName-Philadelphia.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 15:55.21 | javispedro | and, can you elaborate what you mean by "broken"? -h works well |
| 15:55.54 | lcuk | ahhhhh my eyes are hurting |
| 15:56.02 | lcuk | vnc is flickering worse than a crt |
| 15:56.22 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.130) |
| 16:00.08 | *** part/#maemo gaspa (n=gaspa@host134-118-static.61-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 16:00.33 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 16:00.40 | javispedro | "If Maemo 5 begin popular, it will be copied. If not popular, not copied." :D |
| 16:00.46 | RST38h | javispedro: replaced it |
| 16:02.22 | felipec | maemo is a bunch of open source software, how can you copy that? it's already out there |
| 16:04.19 | *** join/#maemo ouilsen (n=ouilsen@88.77.148.85) |
| 16:08.53 | *** join/#maemo danilocesar (n=danilo@200.184.118.130) |
| 16:16.37 | lcuk | felipec, shhhh |
| 16:17.58 | felipec | lcuk: heh, what? did I reveal a secret? |
| 16:19.25 | lcuk | ontday entionmay itsway openway ourcesay orway everyoneway |
| 16:19.25 | lcuk | illway opycay itway |
| 16:19.54 | lardman|home | digs out his one-time cipher pad |
| 16:20.51 | lcuk | http://users.snowcrest.net/donnelly/piglatin.html |
| 16:21.21 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=rsalveti@200.184.118.130) |
| 16:21.48 | lardman|home | :) |
| 16:22.34 | lardman|home | bit random mind you |
| 16:22.58 | *** join/#maemo hannesw__ (n=hannes@91-114-229-122.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 16:26.36 | GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, ping? |
| 16:26.49 | VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, pong |
| 16:26.57 | GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, wanna room? |
| 16:27.56 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@98.168.224.11) |
| 16:28.06 | VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, sure :) |
| 16:28.19 | GeneralAntilles | Cool. |
| 16:28.22 | GeneralAntilles | edits away. ;) |
| 16:29.09 | lardman|home | hmm, half the pre-booked rooms are filled, but mostly with only one person |
| 16:29.18 | lardman|home | well 50% |
| 16:30.43 | lcuk | HOMETIME! |
| 16:30.51 | keesj | lcuk: About http://www.tomtom.com/page/openLR I only heard of it when the the press release was created and I was really puzzeld |
| 16:30.55 | lardman|home | are you not there all day long? |
| 16:31.15 | lcuk | keesj, i was only joking, but its a really cool thing coming from your company |
| 16:32.10 | lcuk | bbiab anyway |
| 16:33.30 | keesj | I like the idea , I don't understand the whole concept. Would like them to make the libs at least lgpl |
| 16:33.38 | keesj | v.s. gpl |
| 16:40.00 | Jaffa | has lost his rag on the Mer thread now |
| 16:40.37 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (n=mlpug@a88-115-164-40.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:41.28 | keesj | are people using different interfaces to the forum or do you really need to click for every few messages to the next page? |
| 16:41.40 | lbt | there's a forum? |
| 16:41.52 | GeneralAntilles | keesj, you can change how many messages it displays per page. |
| 16:41.55 | GeneralAntilles | But it defaults to 10. |
| 16:42.07 | Jaffa | didn't know you could change the count. Interesting |
| 16:42.19 | RST38h | Hmmm...Sodaville released |
| 16:43.13 | RST38h | Meanwhile: The USA is suffering the most severe ammunition famine in living memory. Gun fanciers, fearing a Democrat crackdown on every American's right to pack heat, are clearing shelves at ammo shops and hoarding cartridges. |
| 16:43.20 | GeneralAntilles | http://talk.maemo.org/profile.php?do=editoptions |
| 16:43.32 | GeneralAntilles | RST38h, it's so goddamn expensive to go shooting. |
| 16:43.51 | GeneralAntilles | 3 or 4x times the price it 18 months ago. |
| 16:43.55 | RST38h | General: I tried a couple of times, a few years ago, it was already expensive |
| 16:44.00 | *** join/#maemo danilocesar (n=danilo@200.184.118.130) |
| 16:44.03 | lardman|home | lol |
| 16:44.08 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, but at least it was doable. |
| 16:44.41 | GeneralAntilles | $11.99 for a box of 50 Winchester Whitebox 9mms |
| 16:44.48 | GeneralAntilles | $10 for the range fee. |
| 16:44.56 | GeneralAntilles | Call it $50 to go for an evening. |
| 16:45.10 | lardman|home | I got to say I'd be in favour of adding a Mer subsection |
| 16:45.31 | lardman|home | GeneralAntilles: I can buy 2 rounds of drinks for that, stop complaining |
| 16:45.41 | GeneralAntilles | lardman|home, that was then. |
| 16:45.51 | GeneralAntilles | Now you can't even get the whiteboxes. |
| 16:46.15 | lardman|home | well I've not often been able to buy ammo down my local pub I must admit |
| 16:46.24 | lardman|home | though I reckon I know a few where it might be possible |
| 16:46.41 | lardman|home | where's qwerty12 when you need him...? ;) |
| 16:46.41 | Jaffa | lardman|home: I don't care; but I object to the way the opinions have been expressed. |
| 16:46.43 | qwerty12 | lardman|home: In quiet little Bath? Surely not |
| 16:46.48 | Jaffa | penguinbait in particular |
| 16:46.53 | lardman|home | Jaffa: oh yeah of course |
| 16:46.55 | Jaffa | Well, not in particular |
| 16:47.06 | GeneralAntilles | I was considering going a couple months ago but it'd've been $150 just to shoot off 100 9mms. |
| 16:47.53 | Stskeeps | ponders if he should get into that thread or not. |
| 16:48.04 | lardman|home | Jaffa: he's talking about some people who were removed from the council being in the way of creating the new forum? |
| 16:48.10 | lardman|home | s/forum/subsection |
| 16:48.24 | lardman|home | not that many of us.... |
| 16:48.28 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 16:48.29 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, it'd probably help. |
| 16:48.36 | aSIMULAter | good evening |
| 16:48.43 | ShadowJK | Wtf, n920 thread. Atleast nokia wont have issues coming up with names |
| 16:48.45 | GeneralAntilles | Since at this point the opinion seems to be that the "evil" council is trying to get the working man down. |
| 16:49.06 | Jaffa | lardman|home: I *think* he's suggesting that the new council should just make a decision and that the old council is trying to control things whilst they desperately cling to power. |
| 16:49.43 | Stskeeps | i'm heavily counting on the majority of council being sane. |
| 16:49.58 | lardman|home | oh, it sounded like the old old council members who left were the ones at fault... |
| 16:50.01 | Jaffa | But I'm not aware of many ppl on the council who've actually posted "no, it's a bad idea". In fact, I don't even remember any "no, it's a bad idea" from anybody. Just that it is like this for a reason, and the decision should be taken sensibly |
| 16:50.08 | lardman|home | hmm, I might change my mind now :) |
| 16:50.17 | Jaffa | Stskeeps: Hopefully, there aren't too many insane names on the new ballot |
| 16:50.29 | RST38h | ShadowJK: Back story: in some twitter/lj post Eldar Murtazin referred to "N920" as a legendary RX-56 (?) device to be released in the summer 2010 |
| 16:50.46 | lardman|home | I wonder if I have those superpowers anyway |
| 16:50.57 | RST38h | ShadowJK: Some t.m.o loony applid Google Translate to that and went nuts |
| 16:51.15 | Stskeeps | Nokia Gruntmaster 10.000 |
| 16:51.48 | RST38h | ShadowJK: To perpetrate the madness, I can inform you all that Eldar also mentioned 2 non-Nokia Maemo5 devices, currently in dev board form |
| 16:52.05 | *** join/#maemo jkyro (i=jasu@dsl-hkibrasgw1-fe23f900-77.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 16:52.30 | *** join/#maemo konttori__ (n=konttori@88.113.140.230) |
| 16:52.49 | *** join/#maemo rkirti (n=oespirit@203.199.213.3) |
| 16:53.40 | Stskeeps | RST38h: if he thinks wazd is a nokia employee things might start getting confusing |
| 16:55.03 | GeneralAntilles | RST38h, Beagle Board, Touchbook? ;) |
| 16:55.10 | RST38h | Sts: he once claimed all maemo.org people to be in pay of Nokia |
| 16:55.12 | *** join/#maemo arquebus (n=sdf@201.139.156.133.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx) |
| 16:55.13 | Myrtti | cheesecake |
| 16:55.22 | GeneralAntilles | RST38h, what, we're not? ;) |
| 16:55.23 | RST38h | General: My crystal balls say Samsung, but I won't bet on it |
| 16:55.40 | GeneralAntilles | I'd have a hard time seeing Nokia licensing Maemo. |
| 16:56.15 | lardman|home | wtf, that 920 thread links to some wishful thinking blog posts |
| 16:56.45 | RST38h | General: They licensed S60, so why not Maemo? They sell hw after all |
| 16:56.54 | arquebus | could I trouble someone to tell me how apps are installed on maemo? is there a package manager or repo? |
| 16:57.02 | Myrtti | or? |
| 16:57.12 | Myrtti | they're certainly not exclusive |
| 16:57.23 | lardman|home | arquebus: repos w/ package manager or apt-get, etc |
| 16:57.23 | arquebus | Myrtti: didnt say there were |
| 16:57.49 | *** join/#maemo eichi_ (n=eichi@stgt-5f70b554.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 16:57.52 | arquebus | lardman: k thx |
| 16:58.30 | *** join/#maemo filip42 (n=filip@ankh-morpork.disque-monde.org) |
| 16:58.45 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, Application Manager |
| 16:59.10 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, it's basically a dumbed-down, mobile-friendly package manager similar to Ubuntu's Add/Remove. |
| 17:00.19 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: ok, surprised to hear that, I didnt think commercial apps would work well with a package manager |
| 17:00.31 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, what commercial apps? |
| 17:00.41 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, Ovi Store is, apparently, coming at some point, but not yet. |
| 17:00.47 | GeneralAntilles | It's unclear how it will be implemented. |
| 17:01.09 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: I dont know, I dont have a maemo device, Im just wondering how easy it will be to dev for it |
| 17:01.48 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, http://maemo.org/development/sdks/ |
| 17:02.06 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: thx |
| 17:02.18 | lbt | arquebus: you looking to develop OSS or closed apps? |
| 17:02.27 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, not radically different from developing for any normal Linux distro. |
| 17:02.34 | lbt | either one will work with a package manager |
| 17:02.35 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, minus the cross-compilation part. |
| 17:02.35 | arquebus | lbt- closed apps |
| 17:02.39 | arquebus | like games |
| 17:02.59 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, those will work fine with the Application Manager but there's no payment system through it and no DRM. |
| 17:03.13 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: ok, great |
| 17:03.30 | lbt | your main issue is to make sure you don't depend on any GPL stuff then - otherwise, just a package. |
| 17:03.59 | lbt | no DRM either |
| 17:03.59 | SpeedEvil | commercial doesn't have to mean DRM |
| 17:04.27 | lbt | no, worth mentioning though as there can be an expectation |
| 17:04.46 | arquebus | lbt- good point, hope maemo does opengl well |
| 17:05.11 | GeneralAntilles | SpeedEvil, of course not, but it's certainly a possibility. |
| 17:05.24 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, OpenGL ES 2.0 |
| 17:05.32 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: ok |
| 17:05.44 | GeneralAntilles | Some overview here: http://wiki.maemo.org/OpenGL-ES |
| 17:06.04 | Stskeeps | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=332992&postcount=27 <- will the thread explode? |
| 17:06.24 | lbt | wonders how to do OSS 'for pay' |
| 17:06.52 | lbt | there should be an option to provide a GPL app that you hold the copyright for through the store |
| 17:07.25 | SpeedEvil | OSS for pay is just like OSS without pay, but with a 'buy' button. |
| 17:07.28 | SpeedEvil | As one option. |
| 17:07.34 | Myrtti | lbt: there's several different models |
| 17:07.47 | GeneralAntilles | lbt, XChat for Windows. |
| 17:07.50 | arquebus | lbt- GPL is totally wrong for that, GPL means always in public domain, a BSD or MIT license can be closed and owned privately |
| 17:07.51 | SpeedEvil | Then you've got open-source - but no permission to modify and distribute |
| 17:07.56 | GeneralAntilles | Source is free, binaries are charged for. |
| 17:08.02 | *** join/#maemo wirelessdreamer (n=anderson@chrobd01.vailsys.com) |
| 17:08.08 | lcuk | lbt, bespoke apps constructed to requirements by interested parties without the skills to do it themselves |
| 17:08.10 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, GPL is not public domain. |
| 17:08.15 | lbt | I want to sell *my* GPL apps |
| 17:08.29 | SpeedEvil | You can sell your GPL apps - but you can't stop anyone forking them |
| 17:08.30 | lbt | so put them on an app store and have people pay to install them |
| 17:08.33 | lcuk | nothing stopping you |
| 17:08.34 | SpeedEvil | if it's GPL |
| 17:08.36 | lbt | I know they can be forked |
| 17:08.41 | Myrtti | a) precompiled binaries are commercial, like xchat for windows b) support is commercial, like canonical does with ubuntu etc |
| 17:08.48 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: what I mean is that source must always be made open, you cant close source and take ownership of your version |
| 17:08.51 | lcuk | its not the code that matters |
| 17:08.56 | lbt | but what I don't want is for the store to assume that GPL is free :) |
| 17:08.56 | lcuk | its the brand recognition from the app |
| 17:09.08 | GeneralAntilles | arquebus, you're the copyright holder, you can do whatever you want. |
| 17:09.11 | lcuk | and any fork would have to build up its own brand |
| 17:09.28 | GeneralAntilles | You can't relicense already distributed code, but you can stop distributing under the GPL. |
| 17:09.29 | arquebus | GeneralAntilles: anything accept close source |
| 17:09.32 | SpeedEvil | arquebus: If you're teh author you can |
| 17:09.48 | SpeedEvil | arquebus: If you write something as GPL, you can also license it however you like. |
| 17:10.11 | *** join/#maemo frade (n=ivan@a88-114-94-13.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 17:10.12 | lcuk | if all parties who are involved in its development are in agreement |
| 17:10.13 | arquebus | SpeedEvil: ok, maybe Im not very knowledgable |
| 17:10.39 | SpeedEvil | For example, there may be a pay-for-license which gives the purchasor the right to incorporate the software into non GPL projects |
| 17:10.47 | SpeedEvil | Which they couldn't do with the GPL version |
| 17:11.16 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.130) |
| 17:12.15 | arquebus | thx all |
| 17:12.16 | *** part/#maemo arquebus (n=sdf@201.139.156.133.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx) |
| 17:12.59 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, you're in league with the cabal! |
| 17:13.37 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: next up they start claiming i'm a nokian or something and i want to bring down the community.. |
| 17:13.40 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 17:14.00 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (n=thopieka@p57A1769E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:14.01 | GeneralAntilles | doesn't know when he let -developers get up to 438 unread mails. |
| 17:14.34 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (n=slonopot@80.90.124.131) |
| 17:18.52 | *** join/#maemo matt_c_ (n=mcroydon@gateway.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 17:20.34 | javispedro | GeneralAntilles: what? oh my. |
| 17:21.20 | keesj | it's funny but it's only since today that I am at least able to explain to techniqual people what maemo is. I think tell it's the linux based os that run's Nokia's first open-source based phone finally rings a bell |
| 17:22.19 | GeneralAntilles | lol |
| 17:22.47 | Stskeeps | you try and explain Mer to people then |
| 17:22.52 | Stskeeps | that's fun. uhm. :P |
| 17:23.00 | *** join/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host81-155-227-212.range81-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:23.10 | *** part/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host81-155-227-212.range81-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:23.33 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, the only people I'd ever try to explain that to would have the background to understand it. |
| 17:24.04 | *** join/#maemo penguinbait (n=mlewis@c-68-62-26-176.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 17:24.34 | javispedro | ah, the issues of oss evangelization. |
| 17:24.53 | Stskeeps | tries to find nice places to visit in helsinki |
| 17:25.10 | lcuk | facepalms |
| 17:25.27 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, go find a Nokia executive to ask them why they had North America. :P |
| 17:25.36 | _berto_ | Stskeeps: all helsinki is nice |
| 17:25.36 | toggles_w | Stskeeps: want my ex girlfriends digits? |
| 17:25.46 | Stskeeps | toggles_w: nah, my wife is coming up |
| 17:25.52 | Myrtti | Stskeeps: Suomenlinna |
| 17:25.52 | toggles_w | ;-) |
| 17:26.04 | Stskeeps | Myrtti: provided weather is nice.. |
| 17:26.07 | Myrtti | Stskeeps: take the ferry, but be sure to be clothed properly |
| 17:26.08 | Myrtti | yeah |
| 17:26.21 | qwerty12 | toggles_w: So, has Stskeeps /msg'ed you for them yet? ;) |
| 17:26.28 | Myrtti | there's a picasso show going on |
| 17:26.39 | Stskeeps | yeah.. advertisements everywhere |
| 17:26.40 | toggles_w | qwerty12: lol, no |
| 17:27.11 | Stskeeps | temple square church looks interesting |
| 17:27.26 | Myrtti | yeah, I've always wanted to see it |
| 17:27.28 | Myrtti | never have |
| 17:27.32 | SpeedEvil | prefers fishfingers. Less legal problems. |
| 17:28.08 | *** join/#maemo avs (n=avs@85-156-49-35.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 17:28.09 | _berto_ | i think i liked seurasaari more than suomenlinna |
| 17:28.36 | Corsac | hhmh |
| 17:28.55 | *** join/#maemo jhp (n=jhp@zeus.jhprins.org) |
| 17:29.08 | Corsac | Disponibilité: Arrivage prévu Jeudi 22 Octobre |
| 17:29.10 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus_ (n=slonopot@80.90.124.131) |
| 17:30.44 | SpeedEvil | tries to remember what Jeudi is. |
| 17:31.00 | SpeedEvil | wedensday? |
| 17:32.09 | _berto_ | thursday |
| 17:32.19 | _berto_ | wednesday is mercredi |
| 17:32.27 | jhp | Hi everyone. I'm looking for a new phone for me and my boss, and now I found the Nokia 900 looking very promissing. |
| 17:32.46 | _berto_ | jhp: it is ;) |
| 17:32.59 | GeneralAntilles | jhp, buy it. ;) |
| 17:33.06 | jhp | My boss had 2 questions though, can it do desent Imap with folder subscriptions etc and multiple accounts? |
| 17:33.21 | jhp | And can I use is as a "modem" for my laptop |
| 17:33.23 | *** join/#maemo secureendpoints (n=chatzill@cpat002.wlan.net.ed.ac.uk) |
| 17:33.52 | _berto_ | jhp: the mail client suppots imap and multiple accounts |
| 17:34.02 | jhp | And this second part would be great if you could have a phone call and at the same time use the HSDPA connection for internet on your laptop |
| 17:34.33 | javispedro | laughs at n920 thread. |
| 17:35.08 | jhp | _berto_: and you can also do more that just the inbox? |
| 17:35.35 | _berto_ | jhp: yes |
| 17:35.35 | jhp | Great. |
| 17:35.36 | _berto_ | jhp: all folders |
| 17:35.56 | jhp | And also subscriptions / leave folder out? |
| 17:36.02 | Stskeeps | jhp: and if you get upset with the internal mail client, there's alternatives :) |
| 17:36.10 | jhp | Thunderbird? |
| 17:36.12 | SpeedEvil | elm? |
| 17:36.29 | jhp | elm is good |
| 17:36.39 | _berto_ | jhp: not completely sure about subscriptions |
| 17:36.53 | jhp | But my boss is more a Thunderbird kind of gue |
| 17:36.56 | jhp | guy |
| 17:37.18 | jhp | And does it do openvpn? |
| 17:37.41 | ShadowJK | i use openvpn on n800/n810 |
| 17:38.00 | jhp | Great. This phone starts to be more and more apealing to me. |
| 17:38.03 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (n=thopieka@p57A1769E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:38.09 | _berto_ | jhp: it's a debian-based distro, you can install just about any package |
| 17:38.14 | GeneralAntilles | Mac Pro is here!!!! |
| 17:38.22 | ShadowJK | Not sure if it's available for n900 yet, I'll cross that bridge when I have it in my hands :) |
| 17:38.41 | ShadowJK | jhp: are you a linux/unix type person? |
| 17:38.49 | jhp | Yes, and so is my boss. |
| 17:39.02 | jhp | We run a Linux business. |
| 17:39.48 | jhp | But I have a really old phone and he got stuck with some win mobile crapp thing. |
| 17:39.49 | javispedro | GeneralAntilles: nice! hopefully you got it with an apology signed by the steveness himself. |
| 17:39.55 | jhp | So we both want something different |
| 17:40.37 | ShadowJK | Open the xterm, type 'sudo gainroot', knock yourself out |
| 17:40.46 | jhp | Great |
| 17:40.50 | *** join/#maemo victorpoluceno (n=Victor@187.4.244.138) |
| 17:41.21 | _berto_ | jhp: they're telling me that the email client doesn't support subscriptions, it gets all folders |
| 17:41.24 | jhp | And can you use it as a Wireless APP for you notebook ? |
| 17:41.48 | jhp | Or can you plugg a usb cable in for ethernet on usb? |
| 17:42.01 | jhp | Something to give internet to my laptop while on the road. |
| 17:42.12 | jhp | In that case I can ditch my hsdpa modem |
| 17:43.01 | _berto_ | jhp: not completely sure, but I don't see a reason why you wouldn't be able to do it |
| 17:43.10 | jhp | It must have the interface to do it and the kernel must support it. |
| 17:43.28 | *** join/#maemo ArSa (n=ArSa@nc-71-0-121-232.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 17:43.34 | Stskeeps | ethernet over usb you mean, as in kernel usbnet |
| 17:43.39 | jhp | I mean, the iphone could also do it and they killed it in the last update. |
| 17:43.56 | jhp | Stskeeps: For example |
| 17:43.56 | Stskeeps | jhp: you're always free to recompile your kernel :) |
| 17:43.57 | ShadowJK | Dunno how the support is out of the box |
| 17:44.07 | _berto_ | well, the kernel is free software, I don't think you'll have problems to enable the ethernet over usb module |
| 17:44.18 | _berto_ | (assuming that it doesn't come with it) |
| 17:44.33 | jhp | But noone knows ..... |
| 17:44.35 | jhp | ? |
| 17:44.47 | ccooke | Oh, that's fun |
| 17:44.58 | Stskeeps | jhp: i think until release a bunch of people are covered by NDA but it would surprise me a lot if g_ether wasn't enable-able. |
| 17:45.04 | ShadowJK | The bluez guys are going to post a guide on how to enable serving out internet over bluetooth |
| 17:45.08 | *** join/#maemo ouilsen (n=ouilsen@dslb-088-077-148-085.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:45.22 | jhp | ShadowJK: That is an option as well |
| 17:45.24 | Stskeeps | jhp: you can sudo into being root and probably flash your own kernel.. work your way from there :) |
| 17:45.37 | ccooke | article from the UK recommending the n900 because "It's cheap, really cheap." |
| 17:45.37 | _berto_ | yes, I think there's lots of way to create a network interface between the n900 and your laptop |
| 17:45.43 | jhp | Stskeeps: is an option. |
| 17:45.55 | ccooke | ( http://www.itproportal.com/portal/news/article/2009/9/24/4-great-alternatives-o2s-palm-pre-2842-month/ ) |
| 17:46.01 | SpeedEvil | has a slightly different definition of cheap :) |
| 17:46.18 | ShadowJK | Ccooke: well you get it free with subscription in UK |
| 17:46.38 | SpeedEvil | I suppose in a way they're right. |
| 17:46.43 | ccooke | ShadowJK: I know. It's a truly marvellous state of affairs. |
| 17:47.08 | Stskeeps | jhp: check out the situation with n800/n810 internet tablets. probably similar solution |
| 17:47.11 | ShadowJK | And when you compare prices that dont require a marriage with an operator, it's 150-500E below iphone 3gs :> |
| 17:47.21 | Stskeeps | n900 should be bloody flexible :) |
| 17:47.41 | ccooke | it *is* cheap... I currently pay £30 a month for my wife's phone. She uses it enough to justify that. I've got her an n900 on a 24-month contract for £35 |
| 17:47.45 | SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: I agree. That way the screen won't break if you sit on it. |
| 17:47.54 | ccooke | that works out at £120 *additional* over two years. |
| 17:48.16 | ccooke | So basically, I'm paying £120 for a £500 device. Not going to complain :-) |
| 17:48.20 | SpeedEvil | ccooke: on voda? |
| 17:48.24 | ccooke | yeah |
| 17:48.45 | lcuk | *vodka |
| 17:48.52 | SpeedEvil | does the USA have a similar independant phone shop sector? |
| 17:49.01 | *** join/#maemo pH5 (n=ph5@e178207174.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:49.10 | SpeedEvil | Where the shops get kickbacks for contracts, and can apply that to any phone |
| 17:49.14 | SpeedEvil | ? |
| 17:49.19 | SpeedEvil | (if they choose to) |
| 17:49.21 | ccooke | SpeedEvil: What I've seen makes me doubt it. The market in the US seems rather constrained |
| 17:50.06 | toggles_w | there is one here, sites like wirefly.com |
| 17:50.23 | ccooke | I mean, in the UK the biggest high street names are the independant phone shops - carphone warehouse, phones4u are at least as recognised as the networks - CPW more so |
| 17:50.31 | SpeedEvil | What pisses me off abou thte UK market is that you can't take the above contract with SIM only. |
| 17:50.38 | ccooke | IIRC someone said that CPW would be subsidising the n900, too |
| 17:50.44 | lardman|home | bbiam |
| 17:50.46 | SpeedEvil | Well - you can - but it's the same price as with a hundred quiddish phone |
| 17:51.01 | Myrtti | somethings I'm going to miss from Finland then in UK |
| 17:51.14 | ccooke | Myrtti: oh? |
| 17:51.27 | SpeedEvil | The mobile phone market is a lot less screwed now than it was a few years back. |
| 17:51.38 | SpeedEvil | (in the UK) |
| 17:51.44 | ccooke | SpeedEvil: yes |
| 17:51.51 | Myrtti | there's exactly one phone that you can't get from Finland without a contract |
| 17:52.03 | SpeedEvil | wonders if it has a relation to fruit. |
| 17:52.05 | Myrtti | and all contracts and all simcards work with all phones |
| 17:52.29 | javispedro | Myrtti: a phone with an apple logo somewhere? ;) |
| 17:52.33 | Myrtti | javispedro: bingo |
| 17:53.42 | _berto_ | Myrtti: is it locked to a single carrier ? |
| 17:53.50 | ccooke | If they could, Apple would make the iphone without a SIM card at all :-) |
| 17:54.05 | _berto_ | ccooke: they did, it's called iPod Touch |
| 17:54.07 | jaska | its strange.. considering its available unlocked elsewhere |
| 17:54.25 | Myrtti | _berto_: I doubt any of the phones in finland are *really* locked to a sim and a sim carrier |
| 17:54.35 | *** join/#maemo adriano_ (n=adriano@201.56.102.13) |
| 17:54.37 | SpeedEvil | What happened with the screwing up unlocked legally iphone things on update/ |
| 17:54.42 | lcuk | i thought capacitive screens had problems in cold weather |
| 17:54.51 | _berto_ | Myrtti: I mean, in Spain you can only get an iPhone from Telefonica, and I think it's the same in the US with AT&T |
| 17:54.56 | lcuk | and in detailed high precision environments |
| 17:54.58 | SpeedEvil | UK = O2 |
| 17:55.06 | _berto_ | O2 is Telefonica I think |
| 17:55.11 | javispedro | yes |
| 17:55.18 | ccooke | lcuk: and when wet |
| 17:55.36 | Myrtti | _berto_: yeah, only one carrier that have it - but I don't know if the device has actual software restrictions that stop it working with any other sim/network than theirs |
| 17:55.40 | lcuk | mmm im not sure i would ever like to test that one |
| 17:55.53 | lcuk | tho ive seen nokia phone doofer of guy swimming then taking a call |
| 17:56.04 | ccooke | lcuk: no, I mean if your fingers are wet |
| 17:56.09 | *** join/#maemo lardman_ (n=simon@78.145.93.111) |
| 17:56.20 | lcuk | you cant use it? |
| 17:56.24 | _berto_ | Myrtti: I say that because in some countries you can't sell it locked to a single carrier, all of them must be able to offer it |
| 17:56.43 | dragorn | Myrtti: apple has made significant efforts to lock it to a single carrier, both in the baseband and in the OS layer |
| 17:56.51 | jaska | yeah.. locked phones were illegal here before, sadly someone managed to lobby it through |
| 17:56.52 | ccooke | lcuk: capacitive screens are unreliable when even slightly damp |
| 17:57.02 | Myrtti | *shrug* I'm a Nokia fangirl, don't know, don't care |
| 17:57.02 | lcuk | interesting |
| 17:57.05 | ShadowJK | Myrtti: yeah it's locked in .fi, but if you pay off the full price of it, sonera must legally unlock it for you |
| 17:57.16 | lcuk | smiles |
| 17:57.52 | Myrtti | I had a Samsung phone for about a year once, hated it quite a lot |
| 17:58.16 | ccooke | lcuk: it's a little annoying on my current HTC Magic. |
| 17:58.41 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 17:58.45 | lardman|home | realises he's given away his last old Nokia charger and now needs one for his other sim card |
| 17:58.48 | dragorn | ShadowJK: unfortunately apple has taking to blocking stuff in the OS if it's a non-authorized network, even on factory unlocked phones |
| 17:59.07 | lcuk | dragorn, good! |
| 17:59.22 | _berto_ | well, you can't even use it without iTunes ... |
| 17:59.29 | javispedro | dragorn: what?? |
| 17:59.32 | javispedro | O.o |
| 17:59.35 | jaska | itunes.. eww |
| 17:59.48 | dragorn | javispedro: looking for the article. it started with blocking push notifications, there's something new that they did recently |
| 18:00.13 | javispedro | i've understimated the iphone evilness again, seems. |
| 18:00.25 | lcuk | dragorn, maybe thats not conspiracy and just crapinterconnects ;) |
| 18:00.54 | lcuk | javispedro, of course you have - try to change the on device media player ;) |
| 18:01.20 | javispedro | easy. meld the phone and replace it with a sony walkman. |
| 18:01.21 | dragorn | javispedro: oh right, tethering |
| 18:01.43 | dragorn | javispedro: they've disabled tethering on non-authorized networks, even on legitimately unlocked phones |
| 18:01.50 | dragorn | javispedro: to prevent you from moving your data plan |
| 18:01.58 | dragorn | (well, if you use pc tethering, anyhow) |
| 18:02.10 | javispedro | that's a topic it has always surprised me. |
| 18:02.15 | dragorn | http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2151255&start=0&tstart=0 |
| 18:02.23 | lcuk | remembers to file a bug actually |
| 18:02.44 | javispedro | so, even my years old phone allows you to use it as serial modem. |
| 18:02.58 | _berto_ | for me the fact alone that it requires itunes is enough to stop me from even considering it |
| 18:03.04 | javispedro | then the word "tethering" started to appear all over the place and insteand of meaning "more connectivity options" meant less. |
| 18:03.29 | Myrtti | is too geeky to have a iphone |
| 18:03.54 | lcuk | is too old to have an iphone |
| 18:04.06 | lcuk | i learnt how to use a pencil |
| 18:04.10 | javispedro | is too por to have an iphone |
| 18:04.14 | lcuk | and havent stopped since |
| 18:05.49 | lcuk | lbt, your fan assisted mer project |
| 18:05.51 | _berto_ | i had the chance to try an ipod touch a year or two ago and I was shocked when I realized that I had to plug it to a computer with iTunes, otherwise it was just a brick |
| 18:05.54 | lcuk | hows it comin on |
| 18:06.13 | SpeedEvil | _berto_: Indeed - broken. |
| 18:06.20 | Myrtti | itunes doesn't install into wine |
| 18:06.26 | lcuk | cant you get the store to do that for you when you buy it, and then never use it again |
| 18:06.30 | _berto_ | I agree that most people don't care |
| 18:06.31 | Myrtti | can't be arsed to put up a vm for it |
| 18:06.37 | lcuk | Myrtti, drink more wine then |
| 18:07.43 | lardman|home | _berto_: you can use it wirelessly though, download stuff from iTunes can't you? |
| 18:07.50 | _berto_ | but well, I'm a happy linux user for more than 10 years and it's amazing that in 2009 we have to see this kind of things |
| 18:08.02 | *** join/#maemo igagis (n=igagis@ns2.vsev.lanck.net) |
| 18:08.13 | _berto_ | lardman|home: it was new, it hadn't been booted before |
| 18:08.23 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@98.168.224.11) |
| 18:08.29 | _berto_ | it doesn't even boot for the first time if you don't have itunes |
| 18:08.39 | javispedro | lol. that total blenders consts $399.95 |
| 18:08.43 | javispedro | er. |
| 18:08.49 | javispedro | s/blenders consts/blender costs/ |
| 18:08.54 | lardman|home | _berto_: really, oh well |
| 18:10.48 | lardman|home | anyone know if the N800 used a different VIDEO_SRC to the N810? |
| 18:11.00 | lardman|home | i.e. gconfv4l2src as opposed to v4l2src? |
| 18:11.09 | lardman|home | I get errors trying to create the former |
| 18:11.24 | lardman|home | GStreamer obviously ;) |
| 18:11.25 | X-Fade | lardman|home: There is a video code example in the docs. |
| 18:12.06 | *** join/#maemo trofi (n=slyfox@ip133-37.17.dsl.minsktelecom.by) |
| 18:12.10 | X-Fade | lardman|home: diablo docs that is. |
| 18:12.16 | lardman|home | yeah, seems to use plain v4l2src, but I want the src to flip the video for me |
| 18:12.23 | lardman|home | if poss |
| 18:12.34 | lardman|home | In Python a gconfv4l2src works, just not in C |
| 18:13.32 | *** join/#maemo Andy80 (n=andy80@84.123.86.203.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 18:14.09 | lardman|home | https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/2700/camera_viewer.c |
| 18:14.10 | lardman|home | perhaps I need to install something else on my N800 |
| 18:16.26 | Captain_Picard | wao: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhQA-06kSLU&NR=1 |
| 18:16.28 | Captain_Picard | Star Trek |
| 18:16.29 | Captain_Picard | rocks |
| 18:18.01 | *** join/#maemo GAN800 (n=ryan@c-68-59-48-143.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 18:21.03 | *** join/#maemo johnsq (n=therippe@252.60.broadband3.iol.cz) |
| 18:21.11 | johnsq | Hi |
| 18:23.27 | *** join/#maemo z4chh (n=zach@dhcp-128-194-74-219.resnet.tamu.edu) |
| 18:24.03 | *** join/#maemo kpel (n=mcu@unaffiliated/kpel) |
| 18:26.05 | lardman|home | hmm working, typo |
| 18:26.09 | lardman|home | oops |
| 18:31.08 | jeremiah | ENOBACON |
| 18:31.22 | lardman|home | :) |
| 18:31.32 | jeremiah | =] |
| 18:31.51 | lardman|home | I've set my wife to work to correct that error ;) |
| 18:32.02 | jeremiah | heh |
| 18:32.06 | lardman|home | assuming I now survive to eat it |
| 18:32.26 | jeremiah | Fry_up_some_lard_woman!() || ENOBACON |
| 18:32.29 | lcuk | you will survive eating, its whether its digestable without toxins thats the issue |
| 18:32.41 | jeremiah | toxins schmoxins |
| 18:32.49 | lcuk | you forgot to use sudo |
| 18:34.06 | lardman|home | well I've not moved back to C code |
| 18:34.18 | lardman|home | far more lines than Python |
| 18:34.26 | jeremiah | My pseudo code was perl anyway. :P |
| 18:34.32 | lardman|home | but starts up quickly which is good |
| 18:34.46 | lardman|home | jeremiah: ah no, this is not directly related |
| 18:34.54 | lcuk | is python startup time dependent on parsing the includes |
| 18:35.08 | lcuk | and what can be done |
| 18:35.14 | lardman|home | imports |
| 18:35.22 | lardman|home | yeah, only import some things? |
| 18:35.43 | lcuk | no, importing still needs to parse all the files |
| 18:35.50 | lcuk | even if you only do select things within a file |
| 18:36.07 | lcuk | i mean, can you do same sort of precompiled headers thing you can use with normal c++ type compilation |
| 18:36.21 | lcuk | to just load a binary blob |
| 18:36.26 | lcuk | slower to start first run |
| 18:36.36 | lcuk | but after that your subset is stored pre-parsed |
| 18:37.04 | lardman|home | no idea |
| 18:37.09 | lardman|home | pyrex |
| 18:37.31 | lcuk | me neither - but loading a single header generated by ctypes for liqbase was horrid |
| 18:37.36 | lcuk | and that only had 10 lines of code |
| 18:38.18 | *** join/#maemo florian (n=fuchs@f048230032.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:38.50 | lardman|home | SWIG might be better then, generates a py class beforehand |
| 18:39.32 | lardman|home | how can I get xvideosink to drop frames, set the sync property to fasle? |
| 18:39.37 | lardman|home | false even |
| 18:40.17 | lardman|home | xvimagesink also |
| 18:40.29 | qwerty12_N810 | Set it to ture |
| 18:40.31 | lcuk | im not sure how it drops frames tbh |
| 18:40.32 | *** join/#maemo Firebird (n=Firebird@pool-138-88-239-94.res.east.verizon.net) |
| 18:40.37 | lardman|home | qwerty12_N810: true? |
| 18:40.44 | lardman|home | then it stays in sync with the pipeline? |
| 18:40.47 | lcuk | ctypes produced a .py file too |
| 18:40.56 | qwerty12_N810 | lardman|home: Dunno, I was taking the piss |
| 18:41.08 | lardman|home | oh |
| 18:41.14 | lardman|home | useful :p |
| 18:41.19 | lardman|home | ;) |
| 18:41.20 | *** join/#maemo GeneralAntilles (n=GeneralA@c-68-59-48-143.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 18:41.21 | pupnik_ | lardman|home: yo |
| 18:41.41 | lardman|home | hi pupnik_ |
| 18:41.43 | pupnik_ | do you know any mp3 or ogg players that allow variation of playback rate (before rendering to pcm)"? |
| 18:41.45 | lcuk | http://code.google.com/p/unladen-swallow/wiki/ProjectPlan |
| 18:41.51 | pupnik_ | looking at mpg321 atm |
| 18:42.02 | Myrtti | pupnik_: hold on, I found one in ubuntu |
| 18:42.04 | lardman|home | pupnik_: non sorry, need pitch correction then |
| 18:42.26 | pupnik_ | here's one way to think about it |
| 18:42.29 | Myrtti | yatm - Command line audio file player with time stretching capabilities |
| 18:42.36 | pupnik_ | you lie to the codec and say "render to 96khz |
| 18:42.44 | pupnik_ | wait no forget that :) |
| 18:42.52 | lcuk | ponders diving into cpython and doing some digging |
| 18:43.08 | pupnik_ | Myrtti: that rules |
| 18:43.10 | Myrtti | I found that looking for an audiobook player :-/ |
| 18:43.12 | lardman|home | lcuk: swig is quite good |
| 18:43.20 | *** join/#maemo cymacs (n=cymacs@host-94-101-2-131.taloyhtioverkot.fi) |
| 18:43.21 | lcuk | lardman, i have a final .py file |
| 18:43.24 | Myrtti | the *nonexistent* audiobook player |
| 18:43.25 | GeneralAntilles | cackles evilly. |
| 18:43.30 | lcuk | its the startup time that bothers me for now |
| 18:43.33 | lardman|home | pupnik_: must be a gstreamer element for that somewhere |
| 18:43.59 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: macbook pro or gadget delivery day? |
| 18:44.10 | GeneralAntilles | _Mac_ Pro |
| 18:44.17 | GeneralAntilles | FedEx and UPS came one after another. |
| 18:44.25 | pupnik_ | awesome awesome awesome awesome Myrtti |
| 18:44.25 | GeneralAntilles | FedEx with the computer (which I totally wasn't expecting) |
| 18:44.27 | pupnik_ | dances |
| 18:44.35 | GeneralAntilles | and UPS with all of the accessories. |
| 18:44.35 | pupnik_ | this is the most awesomest thing - interactive speed |
| 18:44.53 | pupnik_ | choose-your-bpm, gentlemen! |
| 18:45.09 | *** join/#maemo TheJere (n=TheJere@83.134.208.251) |
| 18:45.11 | lcuk | spin device round head and haaaavvvvvveeeeeeeeeeee iiiiiiittttttttttt mess up |
| 18:45.25 | pupnik_ | haha listening to rap at 1y5 |
| 18:45.27 | pupnik_ | 175% |
| 18:45.53 | jeremiah | http://gizmodo.com/5366263/the-pink-phone-pictures-microsoft-doesnt-want-you-to-see-yet?skyline=true&s=x |
| 18:46.37 | qwerty12_N810 | Eww, thanks, jeremiah, for ruining my otherwise good day |
| 18:46.43 | jeremiah | heh |
| 18:46.45 | jeremiah | Sorry |
| 18:46.53 | Myrtti | it's not even PINK. |
| 18:46.58 | Myrtti | sucks arse |
| 18:47.11 | jeremiah | Ooops. Sorry Myrtti |
| 18:47.28 | Myrtti | np, I chose to have pink in my hilights |
| 18:48.19 | pupnik_ | i love making speakers sound drunk |
| 18:48.36 | RST38h | jeremiah: What is it? A soapbox? |
| 18:48.56 | *** join/#maemo swc|666 (n=infidel2@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 18:49.25 | jeremiah | A chunk O plastic |
| 18:49.55 | lardman|home | hmm, response is still too slow |
| 18:50.26 | *** join/#maemo JamieBennett (n=JamieBen@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) |
| 18:51.48 | lardman|home | goes to eat that bacon, amongst other things |
| 18:53.53 | lcuk | ok with all the stuff about n900 usb modes - i saw a think on the nokia pushn900 blog about making robots. http://blogs.nokia.com/pushn900/ |
| 18:54.41 | lcuk | somehow, the thought of making a killer robot control mechanism depend on bluetooth makes me somewhat queezy (and tingly with mad scientist laugh) |
| 18:56.14 | lcuk | should a killer robot droid be autonomous, or a simple remote controlled toy? |
| 18:56.18 | Firebird | autonomous RC heli controller :o |
| 18:56.27 | *** join/#maemo jophish_ (n=jophish@80.47.52.37) |
| 18:56.42 | lcuk | Firebird, dont tell lbt, he is playing with making a cpu fan whirr |
| 18:56.50 | lcuk | skynet will be upon us |
| 18:57.14 | lcuk | Firebird, you would need a larger unit to carry n900 |
| 18:57.22 | Firebird | larger unit? |
| 18:57.31 | lcuk | would need ~18inch plus blades most likely |
| 18:57.36 | Firebird | no? |
| 18:57.42 | *** join/#maemo gabriel (n=gabriel@gw.csrg.inf.utfsm.cl) |
| 18:57.45 | Firebird | does the thing weigh like 20 pounds? |
| 18:57.56 | lcuk | my indoor heli has trouble carrying any payload i try |
| 18:58.04 | Firebird | oh, I have a 450 sized heli |
| 18:58.08 | gabriel | hi! i need a little help |
| 18:58.16 | lcuk | mind you, finding enough packing tape to hold the cat still has its own problems |
| 18:58.36 | Firebird | lcuk, ever seen a hobby grade heli? http://site.xheli.com/trex450selarge.jpg |
| 18:58.39 | lcuk | gabriel, oh noes, whats up |
| 18:58.44 | gabriel | heh |
| 18:58.54 | lcuk | yeah - an outdoor model |
| 18:59.05 | lcuk | whats the rotor span |
| 18:59.07 | Firebird | it can lift 10lbs and chop your hand off, I'm sure it can handle the N900 |
| 18:59.18 | gabriel | i need a short answer, is possible compile a java 1.6 version for armv5 ? |
| 18:59.24 | Firebird | lcuk, ~650mm? |
| 18:59.34 | lcuk | which is how much in inches.. |
| 18:59.44 | Firebird | 25 |
| 19:00.00 | lcuk | which is a bit bigger than my guess of ~18inches |
| 19:00.25 | Firebird | the N900 would be perfect with its accelerometers.. and maybe some external sensors |
| 19:00.28 | lcuk | yeah |
| 19:00.29 | lcuk | camera |
| 19:00.35 | lcuk | would be wicked and practical |
| 19:00.42 | lcuk | X-Fade, is a heli guy too :) |
| 19:00.45 | lcuk | -, |
| 19:00.56 | Firebird | don't want to trash my heli testing though :/ |
| 19:01.08 | lcuk | get it right first time then |
| 19:01.21 | lcuk | gabriel, unsure |
| 19:01.33 | lcuk | java isnt something i have dived into |
| 19:02.55 | RST38h | it's hot and opaque |
| 19:02.59 | RST38h | AVOID |
| 19:03.07 | gabriel | whell, a small context... i have a cross-compile environment configured (scratchbox armv5) and i download a recent official release of sun to armv5, when i tried to exec it, this shows a error with libpthread.so.0 library |
| 19:03.12 | lcuk | Firebird, besides, if you do it from a controller feedback loop - you could most likely work it using handheld and simulator |
| 19:03.17 | *** join/#maemo mcpi (n=user@p579B94E3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:03.31 | lcuk | to see how it responds |
| 19:03.46 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Lies, you actually, in secret, worship it like you do the Tentacled One |
| 19:04.12 | Firebird | well, then what good would the acceleromets be |
| 19:04.21 | Firebird | lcuk, like the n900 controling the transmitter? |
| 19:04.36 | lcuk | its one option for first generation |
| 19:04.42 | lcuk | rather than direct servo control |
| 19:04.55 | keesj | gabriel: that is already pretty good news I would say , what is the output of "ldd java" |
| 19:05.32 | Firebird | n900 controling an aurdino board would be neat |
| 19:06.23 | keesj | gabriel: https://wiki.evolvis.org/jalimo/index.php/Maemo Might be what you are looking for ( I don't know if it's 1.6) and I did not follow upon what sun has been up-to in the last years |
| 19:07.33 | *** join/#maemo gabriel (n=gabriel@gw.csrg.inf.utfsm.cl) |
| 19:07.41 | gabriel | sorry :P |
| 19:07.46 | keesj | gabriel: https://wiki.evolvis.org/jalimo/index.php/Maemo Might be what you are looking for ( I don't know if it's 1.6) and I did not follow upon what sun has been up-to in the last years |
| 19:08.43 | lcuk | Firebird, the aurdino is useful indeed, just thinking of your concerns about failure |
| 19:09.16 | Firebird | fly to 50' and if it fails go to manual control would/should work for failure |
| 19:10.07 | *** join/#maemo millenomi (n=millenom@93-35-146-102.ip55.fastwebnet.it) |
| 19:10.36 | *** join/#maemo GeneralAntilles (n=GeneralA@c-68-59-48-143.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 19:10.55 | RST38h | qwerty: Yes, the more Java programmers, the more food for the Tentacled One. |
| 19:11.08 | gabriel | this is the output of ldd |
| 19:11.09 | gabriel | http://pastebin.com/m111e7666 |
| 19:11.50 | lcuk | Firebird, but if you have replaced the control mechanism with one from arduino that would be more difficult |
| 19:12.04 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: But he's already so big... :/ |
| 19:12.10 | lcuk | one answer |
| 19:12.12 | lcuk | parachute |
| 19:12.21 | Firebird | parachute? into the blades? |
| 19:13.03 | RST38h | qwerty: He has got transcedental volume. |
| 19:13.07 | lcuk | good point lol |
| 19:13.22 | lcuk | big matress |
| 19:13.44 | *** join/#maemo Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun) |
| 19:13.48 | lcuk | i think we should stick with landborne control mechanisms |
| 19:13.51 | gabriel | keesj, i'm downloading the package...(crossing fingers) |
| 19:13.56 | lcuk | learn to drive before we fly lol |
| 19:14.01 | Firebird | heh |
| 19:14.35 | lcuk | mini version of the darpa grand challenge |
| 19:14.43 | lcuk | drive around nokia store without bumping into legs |
| 19:15.08 | lcuk | all the while capturing some cgreat shots with the camera |
| 19:15.45 | lcuk | do you think they will let us use laser range finders |
| 19:16.36 | Firebird | sure... that would be neat, darpa grand challenge cars in full scale controlled by a phone-tablet |
| 19:19.58 | lcuk | just surfed down the stairs :S |
| 19:20.20 | lcuk | i slipped and thought for sure i was gonna die |
| 19:20.32 | Stskeeps | better than getting killed in a nokia door |
| 19:20.33 | lcuk | but somehow i stayed on my feet and thudded down each one |
| 19:20.45 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@67.72.73.34) |
| 19:20.45 | lcuk | yeah |
| 19:20.47 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@82.181.192.153) |
| 19:20.58 | lcuk | i landed at the bottom and luke laughed |
| 19:21.25 | lcuk | i dont think i could do that again if i ever wanted to try |
| 19:21.47 | Myrtti | Stskeeps: hehe |
| 19:22.03 | *** part/#maemo JamieBennett (n=JamieBen@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) |
| 19:22.33 | RST38h | Sts: Not killed, slowly DISMEMBERED. And that Nokia door has not finished with him yet. |
| 19:22.33 | SpeedEvil | Firebird: See James Bond. |
| 19:22.35 | *** join/#maemo Allvaro (n=sebastia@94.246.155.7) |
| 19:22.46 | Allvaro | Hello ;) |
| 19:23.00 | Firebird | wonders why he is seeing James Bond |
| 19:23.15 | lcuk | spits out milk |
| 19:23.18 | lcuk | RST38h, dont |
| 19:23.44 | RST38h | noo. |
| 19:23.53 | RST38h | moo, that is |
| 19:23.57 | lcuk | that door must have its own scp |
| 19:24.02 | Allvaro | Any1 want invitatnion to lockerz xd? i have 15 invitations |
| 19:24.09 | RST38h | of course there is an scp for the door |
| 19:24.16 | jaska | haha |
| 19:24.34 | *** join/#maemo jamie_ (n=jamie@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) |
| 19:24.34 | jaska | ovi = door.. coincidence? |
| 19:24.46 | Stskeeps | skynet. |
| 19:24.46 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 19:25.30 | lcuk | shows you all the finger :P |
| 19:25.56 | Firebird | shows lcuk a finger |
| 19:26.37 | lcuk | Firebird, :) you dont actually know what we are talking about do you lol |
| 19:26.45 | Firebird | nope :P |
| 19:27.02 | qwerty12_N810 | does, but he shows lcuk his middle finger for the fuck of it |
| 19:27.19 | lcuk | .7.. |
| 19:27.21 | *** part/#maemo Allvaro (n=sebastia@94.246.155.7) |
| 19:27.28 | *** join/#maemo zap (n=zap@28.169.249.ozerki.net) |
| 19:27.48 | snuxoll | wow, when did #maemo become my high school locker room? |
| 19:27.59 | Myrtti | ohai snuxoll |
| 19:28.05 | Stskeeps | snuxoll: time travel |
| 19:28.11 | lcuk | firebird, pick a level - 1,2,3 increasing levels of blood |
| 19:28.12 | snuxoll | yo Myrtti |
| 19:28.15 | Myrtti | snuxoll: welcome to reality |
| 19:28.21 | Firebird | lcuk, 3? |
| 19:28.27 | wazd | snuxoll: you have a "kick me" sticker on your back :D |
| 19:28.29 | snuxoll | Myrtti: this is reality? I want my money back |
| 19:28.36 | snuxoll | wazd: wouldn't be the first time |
| 19:28.59 | Myrtti | snuxoll: yeah, sadly it is |
| 19:29.40 | snuxoll | gives Myrtti a cupcake with pink frosting to compensate for a dull reality |
| 19:29.43 | Myrtti | the times I've winced at the discussion... *sigh* |
| 19:29.55 | lcuk | bloody picture - i had the end pushed back over tho http://liqbase.net/finger1_beforestitch.jpg |
| 19:30.14 | Myrtti | #maemo - now with more blood and gore |
| 19:30.20 | lcuk | lol sorry Myrtti |
| 19:30.25 | lcuk | blame nokia |
| 19:30.27 | lcuk | they started it |
| 19:30.37 | Myrtti | no worries, I'm planning to dig a pit in front of the door |
| 19:30.40 | Myrtti | trap pit |
| 19:30.44 | lcuk | :D |
| 19:30.54 | snuxoll | Nokia doesn't start fights, that's Mann Co's job |
| 19:31.10 | Firebird | lcuk, doing a little too much sketching on the tablet? |
| 19:31.18 | SpeedEvil | wishes he'd taken a picture of his finger injury. |
| 19:31.28 | snuxoll | is glad SpeedEvil didn't |
| 19:31.31 | SpeedEvil | I made a large diameter router bit for my dremel. |
| 19:31.35 | Myrtti | nokia doesn't start fights, they give that task to subcontr^Wcommunity members |
| 19:31.40 | SpeedEvil | It sliced up my finger good! |
| 19:31.41 | snuxoll | ahaha |
| 19:31.44 | lcuk | yeah firebird |
| 19:31.58 | lcuk | ouch SpeedEvil |
| 19:32.03 | snuxoll | SpeedEvil: my sister did something not too dissimilar, but with a handheld blender/mixer |
| 19:32.16 | snuxoll | SpeedEvil: most enjoyable trip I've ever had to the ER |
| 19:32.41 | Firebird | only time I've hurt my finger was when I drilled right through it after the drill bit snapped |
| 19:32.58 | jaska | ew |
| 19:32.59 | snuxoll | grr, I can't seem to get my glasses clean |
| 19:33.19 | lcuk | pour boiling water over em and cut through the grease :P |
| 19:34.28 | lcuk | is freezing |
| 19:34.38 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (n=thopieka@p57A1769E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:34.44 | lcuk | which nokia mobile computers are waterproof |
| 19:34.45 | Myrtti | has her furry slippers |
| 19:35.14 | lcuk | btw, screen on n900 seems v durable |
| 19:35.20 | lcuk | its been in my pocket with my keys :O |
| 19:35.50 | Firebird | curious, what does the N900 stylus look like? |
| 19:35.57 | snuxoll | has a feeling he'll be waiting for the N900 US variant for a very long time |
| 19:36.15 | lcuk | Firebird, a beachball |
| 19:36.15 | Firebird | the N810 one was/looked really cheap |
| 19:36.15 | Myrtti | Firebird: lolololol |
| 19:36.25 | Firebird | hurray >_> |
| 19:36.40 | ShadowJK | I thought the N810 stylus was elegant simple |
| 19:36.41 | snuxoll | lcuk: is it a spinning beachball? |
| 19:36.49 | snuxoll | lcuk: because I already have plenty of those |
| 19:36.49 | Myrtti | if n810 is anything like the N800 one, it's about twice the level of professional than 770's stylus |
| 19:36.50 | SpeedEvil | http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/24/hondas-u3-x-personal-mobility-device-is-the-segway-of-unicycles/ |
| 19:36.54 | SpeedEvil | Fun. |
| 19:36.55 | lbt | Firebird: my maemo controlled heli took off last night |
| 19:36.58 | lcuk | curiously after you said that i just whipped out both |
| 19:36.58 | Firebird | the N800 stylus was nice however, whth its nice metalic part on the end |
| 19:37.16 | qwerty12_N810 | Honestly, the N900 doesn't need a stylus |
| 19:37.32 | lcuk | for normal use i agree qwerty |
| 19:37.35 | qwerty12_N810 | And I'm an avid stylus-freak when it comes to the N8X0 |
| 19:37.37 | lbt | shame it's not as advanced as you may hope :) |
| 19:37.38 | lcuk | but for writing its essential |
| 19:37.43 | Myrtti | I have my long fingernails, I don't need a stylus in any case :-D |
| 19:37.43 | Firebird | lbt, mmhmm |
| 19:37.53 | lcuk | Myrtti, how do you write |
| 19:37.57 | *** join/#maemo JamieBennett (n=JamieBen@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) |
| 19:38.01 | Myrtti | lcuk: thumbnails |
| 19:38.03 | Firebird | http://mynokiablog.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/stylus.jpg , hmm, looks like a larger version of the N810 stylus |
| 19:38.17 | lbt | http://mer-l-in.blogspot.com/2009/09/want-to-push-need-kickstart.html |
| 19:38.31 | lcuk | its about 5mm longer |
| 19:38.32 | qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: I don't write for shit; my handwriting is God-awful :) |
| 19:38.34 | snuxoll | Firebird: I could go for that |
| 19:38.37 | Myrtti | that looks like 770 stylus |
| 19:38.40 | lcuk | tho that stylus fits in n810 slot |
| 19:38.42 | snuxoll | Firebird: though that is a f'ewge stylus |
| 19:38.43 | lbt | used that control board DAC to manage the throttle pot on the R/c unit |
| 19:38.54 | *** part/#maemo JamieBennett (n=JamieBen@5ac884ca.bb.sky.com) |
| 19:39.05 | Firebird | ah, nice lbt |
| 19:39.14 | wazd | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhsl5bOSk5Y |
| 19:39.21 | wazd | 10 minutes of bounce |
| 19:39.31 | Firebird | a full metal stylus would be nice |
| 19:39.32 | wazd | for loosers without device :D |
| 19:39.54 | *** join/#maemo radic (n=radic@109.84.82.24) |
| 19:39.59 | Firebird | woa, that almost blew up my sub-woofer |
| 19:40.08 | Myrtti | lcuk: one of the reasons I've never warmed to N810, I'm really fast with two thumbs with long nails on the vkb |
| 19:40.11 | SpeedEvil | I made a nice one out of a couple of sections of an antenna, filled with lead. |
| 19:40.22 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 19:40.28 | lcuk | Myrtti, thats not writing tho |
| 19:40.33 | lcuk | thats typing and i agree |
| 19:40.57 | Myrtti | lcuk: I don't really write anything - I might draw, or annotate knitting pattern pdf |
| 19:41.04 | lcuk | cavepaints |
| 19:41.30 | Myrtti | but my nails are long enough to replace the stylus in any case |
| 19:41.54 | lcuk | my finger also now contains an implanted stylus - or it wouldv if the doctor had let me |
| 19:44.10 | *** join/#maemo LB (n=LB@58.108.160.52) |
| 19:44.24 | lcuk | jamiebennet has robosapien |
| 19:44.36 | lcuk | we need to make an n900 pusher robot! |
| 19:44.41 | lcuk | to defeat the scum |
| 19:45.37 | *** join/#maemo L0cutus_ (n=kki@94.160.45.50) |
| 19:46.28 | lcuk | lbt, can you get your flying bot created in time lol |
| 19:46.44 | lbt | probably not |
| 19:46.53 | keesj | pusher bot wars FTW |
| 19:47.22 | lcuk | keesj, it would be great to have a reason lol |
| 19:47.35 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (n=lizardo@189.2.128.130) |
| 19:47.42 | lcuk | awww shucks lbt |
| 19:47.52 | RST38h | Microsoft Opening Windows Cafe In Paris (Will they pour C# instead of java there?) |
| 19:48.04 | lcuk | increases miliatry spending to include beer and cheese |
| 19:48.44 | lbt | did you see the donuts with bacon at the kernel conference lcuk |
| 19:48.53 | *** join/#maemo LHB (n=LB@58.108.160.52) |
| 19:49.01 | lcuk | o_O no |
| 19:50.52 | lcuk | hey - would actually be really really cool to organise robot wars - nokia vs apple vs microsoft |
| 19:52.18 | lcuk | i suppose we need a real robot first |
| 19:52.25 | *** join/#maemo LinuxCode (n=LinuxCod@fedora/LinuxCode) |
| 19:52.34 | ShadowJK | Robot wars was kinda fun until those guys invented hypnodisc and all the rules started coming |
| 19:53.19 | lcuk | yeah, it was kinda impressive in its destructiveness |
| 19:54.10 | lcuk | chaos 2 was brutal too |
| 19:54.59 | Myrtti | killer robots with cheesecake |
| 19:56.01 | Myrtti | since when has flickr logo had yahoo on it too |
| 19:56.12 | Myrtti | or on flickr |
| 19:56.29 | lcuk | bbl bath |
| 19:56.31 | lcuk | with rubber duck |
| 19:56.36 | Myrtti | oooo |
| 19:56.49 | Myrtti | I don't think I'm allowed baths yet :-( |
| 19:56.55 | qwerty12_N810 | The rubber duck will be deflated by the time lcuk is done with it |
| 20:00.17 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (n=javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:01.10 | lardman|fed | mmmm bacon |
| 20:01.19 | RST38h | never understood why nobody used mass destruction weapons on Robot Wars |
| 20:01.20 | javispedro | heh |
| 20:01.42 | javispedro | lardman: I was expecting to see "lcuk" at the right of that bacon reference. what a surprise when I read "lardman" instead ;) |
| 20:02.12 | javispedro | oh, btw, hi :) |
| 20:02.27 | RST38h | A smallish thermobaric explosion - and you instantly win |
| 20:02.45 | javispedro | why smallish? |
| 20:02.59 | RST38h | because largish will destroy the video evidence |
| 20:03.05 | ShadowJK | I guess projectile weapons are forbidden too |
| 20:03.20 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 20:03.24 | javispedro | remembers that BOFH story about a robot wars tournament were the winner robot was designed the search & destroy the humans instead of the robots |
| 20:03.25 | RST38h | also the audience, the anchor, and yourself |
| 20:03.42 | lardman|fed | hey javispedro |
| 20:03.56 | javispedro | heya |
| 20:04.08 | SpeedEvil | I looked at the UK rules, and could find nothing precluding (at the time) a rocket engine to make your robot hover. |
| 20:04.22 | SpeedEvil | Hover over your opponent - melting them. |
| 20:04.48 | *** join/#maemo amaurymedeiros (n=amaury@150.165.63.86) |
| 20:04.54 | lardman|fed | hmm, don't these things weigh at least 100kg? |
| 20:05.00 | ShadowJK | what about flamethrowers? |
| 20:05.11 | lardman|fed | not sure they are allowed, would be cool though |
| 20:05.23 | ShadowJK | I suspect the added weight limitations at some point? |
| 20:05.27 | lardman|fed | or rather quite toasty, for the audience too |
| 20:05.30 | ShadowJK | (and the house robots can ignore them) |
| 20:05.49 | SpeedEvil | lardman: no - rocket engines can be whatever size you make them. |
| 20:05.53 | lardman|fed | ShadowJK: I meant the robot, you need quite a bit of thrust to lift that |
| 20:06.05 | SpeedEvil | ah |
| 20:06.05 | SpeedEvil | right |
| 20:06.12 | ShadowJK | depends how long you want to lift it for :) |
| 20:06.20 | lardman|fed | sorry wrong autocomplete |
| 20:06.25 | ShadowJK | Carmack's early rocket engines looked tiny compared to what they were lifting |
| 20:06.26 | lardman|fed | yeah true |
| 20:07.00 | ShadowJK | I liked his hydrogen peroxide stuff, although fuel availability is a problem :) |
| 20:07.02 | SpeedEvil | Generally for sea-level use you want 14PSI or so at the exhaust - so 10 square inches for 140lb, ... |
| 20:07.17 | SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: I found a source willing to ship me pallets of 95% |
| 20:07.27 | ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, awesome :-) |
| 20:07.28 | SpeedEvil | IIRC ~1000e for 400l of 95% |
| 20:07.47 | ShadowJK | What was it that carmack wanted, 95% or 99%? and what was it that he then tried to use? |
| 20:07.49 | lardman|fed | 95% what? |
| 20:07.54 | GeneralAntilles | is failing to saturate 8 cores. |
| 20:07.56 | lardman|fed | H2O2? |
| 20:08.01 | ShadowJK | yeah |
| 20:08.07 | lardman|fed | GeneralAntilles: try harder! |
| 20:08.30 | lardman|fed | 8 cores, show off! |
| 20:08.34 | javispedro | no doubt the RDF at work |
| 20:08.38 | GeneralAntilles | 16 virtual. :P |
| 20:08.49 | javispedro | the 8 cores will always be enough right until the 16 cores Mac Pro shows up |
| 20:09.14 | GeneralAntilles | Well, 12 core. |
| 20:09.18 | GeneralAntilles | Which should be middle of next year. |
| 20:09.23 | javispedro | at which point suddenly 8 cores will feel like a 12-digit calculator |
| 20:09.45 | GeneralAntilles | Apple starts disabling them remotely. |
| 20:10.54 | RST38h | 8 cores should feel like an 8-digit calculator shouldn't they? |
| 20:11.07 | javispedro | damn washing machines |
| 20:11.10 | javispedro | oh i hate hardware |
| 20:11.11 | ShadowJK | rofl: http://media.armadilloaerospace.com/2009_09_07/2009_09_07_Labor_Day_wiener_cam.wmv |
| 20:11.18 | ShadowJK | Now that's a creative use of a rocket ship |
| 20:11.40 | *** join/#maemo SpeedEvil (n=user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 20:11.56 | *** join/#maemo felipec (n=felipec@a91-153-253-80.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 20:12.09 | Firebird | GeneralAntilles, md5sum every file on your harddrive at the same time |
| 20:12.18 | RST38h | javis: do you hate hardware like I hate hardware, after finding out that certain sequences of opcodes corrupt TV encoder output? =) |
| 20:12.39 | javispedro | no. I hate hardware that can wet you. |
| 20:12.44 | javispedro | specially when it does so. |
| 20:12.48 | lardman|fed | hmm, will taste funky I bet, or is it an O2 H2 rocket? |
| 20:12.49 | RST38h | ah THAT hardware |
| 20:13.04 | lardman|fed | probably is from the exhaust |
| 20:13.33 | ShadowJK | i haven't followed them for ages, and they're always changing engine tech and fuels.. |
| 20:14.02 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=luke-jr@98.168.224.11) |
| 20:14.16 | lardman|fed | nice anyway :) |
| 20:14.41 | lardman|fed | right, GStreamer gurus, where are you all? |
| 20:15.01 | javispedro | lardman: oh, I once wrote a gstreamer demuxer, do I qualify? ;) |
| 20:15.08 | lardman|fed | yes, you win! |
| 20:15.36 | lardman|fed | so..... I have a fakesink and an xvimagesink, and a pretty tight barcode decoder loop, I'd like my xvimagesink to be less laggy |
| 20:15.53 | lardman|fed | barcode data comes from the handoff of the fakesink |
| 20:16.18 | lardman|fed | separate queues used for each sink, and the decoder runs in the handoff callback fn |
| 20:17.12 | javispedro | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:17.18 | javispedro | just slow |
| 20:17.20 | javispedro | ? |
| 20:17.28 | lardman|fed | variable, but perhaps 1 frame every few seconds |
| 20:17.39 | lardman|fed | so yes, slow |
| 20:18.28 | *** join/#maemo herzi (n=herzi@kiwi.mediascape.de) |
| 20:18.31 | javispedro | er... dunno. |
| 20:18.49 | lardman|fed | interestingly, when I start up the pipeline, I get the YUV data output in the display window |
| 20:18.59 | lardman|fed | this lasts a few frames, then I get full screen |
| 20:19.14 | javispedro | i'd say wrong timestamp in gstbuffer, but then I don't know how fakesink works |
| 20:19.17 | lardman|fed | when I say YUV, I mean two small images and one large one at the bottom |
| 20:19.19 | *** join/#maemo lcuk2 (i=lcuk@cpc3-oldh7-0-0-cust590.manc.cable.ntl.com) |
| 20:19.38 | lardman|fed | I've just disabled datamatrix decoding, now runs ok with sync turned off |
| 20:19.57 | lardman|fed | will have to try running the datamatrix decoding in a separate thread and see if that helps at all |
| 20:20.02 | javispedro | ah, so you're sure its a output thing? |
| 20:20.14 | lardman|fed | the strange display? |
| 20:20.22 | lardman|fed | yeah, just happens for a couple of frames though |
| 20:20.29 | lcuk | 2 small then one large |
| 20:20.32 | lcuk | mmm inverted? |
| 20:20.38 | lardman|fed | all in one image |
| 20:20.49 | lardman|fed | yeah inverted, but this is an N800 so that's normal |
| 20:20.56 | lcuk | screenshot |
| 20:20.57 | lcuk | photo |
| 20:20.59 | lardman|fed | though not for the output of course |
| 20:21.17 | lardman|fed | hmm, let me try |
| 20:21.35 | ShadowJK | lardman|fed, I think it's an alcohol engine |
| 20:22.10 | ShadowJK | since they say nasa wanted them to make one that runs on methane, and they tried feeding methane to their alcohol engine with a few "tweaks", and that didn't work out |
| 20:22.11 | javispedro | i do not understand what you're doing, do you have two pipelines? |
| 20:22.40 | javispedro | (v4l ! fakesink) - - - - - > bar code decoding - - - - - > (src ! xvimagesink) ? |
| 20:23.10 | lardman|fed | javispedro: one pipeline with a tee |
| 20:23.23 | lardman|fed | splits to the xvimagesink and the fakesink |
| 20:23.36 | javispedro | ah, I see. |
| 20:23.43 | lardman|fed | right I have a photo, but have to go chuck the bins out, give me 5 |
| 20:23.56 | SpeedEvil | If you have no split - is it nice and fast? |
| 20:24.23 | coldboot | In our build system, for arm builds, we need to force scratchbox to use Python 2.5.1. But the stupid scratchbox /scratchbox/tools/bin/python overrides anything you do, unless you move it out of the way. What's the best way to force SCons to use /usr/bin/python? |
| 20:25.04 | javispedro | two things. first one is that /scratchbox/tools/bin/python is in path. second is export SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE="/usr/bin/python" |
| 20:25.28 | coldboot | javispedro: So I have to do both, remove it from the path and set a redirect ignore? |
| 20:25.39 | javispedro | yes, both |
| 20:25.44 | coldboot | Okay thanks. |
| 20:26.16 | coldboot | Is there an absolute way to find where scratchbox has been installed? |
| 20:28.59 | *** join/#maemo eichi_ (n=eichi@stgt-5f70b554.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 20:30.14 | konttori__ | new version of theme maker in https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=36 |
| 20:30.32 | Stskeeps | instantly downloads |
| 20:30.52 | Stskeeps | big improvements? |
| 20:35.37 | *** join/#maemo ferulo (n=fherrera@233.118.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es) |
| 20:38.12 | lardman|fed | re |
| 20:38.34 | lardman|fed | ShadowJK: nothing wrong with food cooked in alcohol of course ;) |
| 20:38.39 | *** join/#maemo bobbyd (n=chatzill@94-168-157-37.cable.ubr11.dund.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 20:38.42 | bobbyd | hi |
| 20:38.53 | bobbyd | can anyone confiirm that the n900 supports Activesync? |
| 20:39.27 | bobbyd | I can see on the official page that it mentions Exchange, but it's not clear if it supports push email and calendar updates over the air |
| 20:40.36 | lardman|fed | image here: http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/nokia770/temp/20090924_003.jpg |
| 20:41.02 | lardman|fed | just looks plain broken now I look harder at it |
| 20:41.19 | lardman|fed | perhaps something to do with the GStreamer caps negotiation |
| 20:41.33 | mfinkle | in an effort to maximize screen space, we are trying to turn off the autocompletion widget used on n810 |
| 20:41.54 | mfinkle | looks like I can pass something to GConf |
| 20:41.59 | mfinkle | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:42.04 | lardman|fed | there's a control panel setting iirc |
| 20:42.08 | javispedro | http://img.thedailywtf.com/images/200909/graphic_design_resume.gif |
| 20:42.12 | mfinkle | but I want to do it for all languages |
| 20:42.24 | *** join/#maemo koan (n=koan@unaffiliated/koan) |
| 20:42.28 | lardman|fed | have been summoned, back later |
| 20:42.39 | mfinkle | lardman|fed: we only want to disable it for our app, not the entire device |
| 20:42.51 | qwerty12_N810 | Now it's lardman's turn to make the bacon ;) |
| 20:42.53 | lardman|afk | mfinkle: ah, no idea then, good luck |
| 20:43.09 | lardman|afk | qwerty12_N810: that has a double entendre you know ;) |
| 20:43.28 | *** join/#maemo _jason6046 (n=thot@59-105-27-43.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw) |
| 20:43.47 | javispedro | mfinkle: ctrl+space hides/shows it |
| 20:43.57 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: how do you make things start with lowercase in fields? wasnt there a option? |
| 20:44.15 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: yeah, bringing up the API reference |
| 20:44.19 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 20:44.21 | javispedro | mfinkle: shift+space actually :P |
| 20:44.35 | qwerty12_N810 | mfinkle: http://maemo.org/api_refs/4.0/gtk/GtkEntry.html#hildon-gtk-entry-set-input-mode |
| 20:44.37 | mfinkle | javispedro: that's a good fallback for the end user |
| 20:45.20 | ShadowJK | lardman, scary, they bolted one of carmack's engine to an airplane and they found people who'd fly it |
| 20:45.25 | javispedro | Stability Level: Unstable |
| 20:45.26 | javispedro | uh? |
| 20:47.21 | ShadowJK | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJJT8639Weo (rocket racer) |
| 20:47.45 | *** join/#maemo koan (n=koan@unaffiliated/koan) |
| 20:47.57 | mfinkle | qwerty12_N810: hmm, I was looking at that to disable the autocap feature too |
| 20:48.13 | *** join/#maemo mau_mex (n=mauricio@189.160.7.177) |
| 20:49.13 | qwerty12_N810 | I haven't used it, personally, to disable anything other than auto-caps but using it to unset HILDON_GTK_INPUT_MODE_DICTIONARY may work... |
| 20:49.41 | mau_mex | Hi there , This is Mauricio from Mexico |
| 20:51.44 | mau_mex | I am Newbie on linux and i`m having a problem installing scratchbox, |
| 20:52.46 | *** join/#maemo koan (n=koan@unaffiliated/koan) |
| 20:52.46 | mau_mex | can some one confirm this: |
| 20:52.47 | mau_mex | mau@mau:~> /home/mau//Documents/maemo-scratchbox-install_5.0beta2.sh -u mau |
| 20:52.58 | mau_mex | is correct? |
| 20:54.01 | *** join/#maemo hannesw_ (n=hannes@91-114-229-122.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 20:54.12 | wazd | javispedro: aw the shot from n900 with DrNokSnes icon in it :D |
| 20:54.20 | javispedro | wazd: :D |
| 20:54.21 | wazd | s /aw/saw/ |
| 20:54.30 | javispedro | wazd: seen http://depot.javispedro.com/drnoksnes/fremantle.png ? |
| 20:54.51 | wazd | javispedro: nope, looks awesome :) |
| 20:55.01 | tuukkah | mau_mex, you may need to add bash to the front of that line |
| 20:55.15 | javispedro | :) |
| 20:58.21 | *** join/#maemo Andy80 (n=andy80@84.123.86.203) |
| 20:59.37 | *** join/#maemo geaaru (n=geaaru@host6-224-dynamic.30-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 20:59.47 | lbt | Jaffa: Mer can't have it's own section in TMO until #mer gets karma |
| 20:59.54 | *** join/#maemo DarwinSurvivor (n=DarwinSu@S0106000f6683e05d.vs.shawcable.net) |
| 21:00.10 | *** join/#maemo igagis (n=igagis@ns2.vsev.lanck.net) |
| 21:01.50 | wiretapped | is the n900 hitting us stores this sunday?! |
| 21:02.25 | Robot101 | wiretapped: don't think so, mid-october? |
| 21:02.31 | *** join/#maemo koan (n=koan@unaffiliated/koan) |
| 21:06.14 | *** join/#maemo bef0rd (n=bef0rd@190.24.51.84) |
| 21:06.41 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslip (n=fnoridan@94-30-69-47.xdsl.murphx.net) |
| 21:11.01 | *** join/#maemo elninja (n=r@adsl-76-208-19-229.dsl.sbndin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:11.05 | *** join/#maemo aquatix (n=aquatix@higgs.soleus.nu) |
| 21:12.59 | *** join/#maemo ferulo (n=fherrera@233.118.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es) |
| 21:13.06 | wiretapped | http://thenokiablog.com/2009/09/14/nokia-n900-available-september-27th/ |
| 21:13.28 | wiretapped | that seems to be the source of all the 27th reports |
| 21:13.37 | wiretapped | is ready |
| 21:13.49 | AStorm | hehe |
| 21:14.23 | AStorm | what about PL retailers? |
| 21:14.28 | AStorm | any info on that? |
| 21:14.34 | AStorm | or DE or other countries |
| 21:15.13 | *** join/#maemo ouilsen (n=ouilsen@dslb-088-077-148-085.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 21:15.59 | AStorm | so if everything goes well, it will hit stores ~1st october in the US |
| 21:16.57 | RST38h | AStorm: "never"? =) |
| 21:17.30 | AStorm | RST38h: wrong, nokia.pl is offering it already |
| 21:17.35 | AStorm | in preorder |
| 21:17.40 | RST38h | ! |
| 21:17.56 | RST38h | Seriously though, unless it is an official Nokia blog, I doubt Sep 27 date |
| 21:18.13 | AStorm | yes, it's some "behind the curtains" info |
| 21:18.15 | javispedro | yes, seems to early. |
| 21:18.17 | AStorm | but it might be accurate |
| 21:18.26 | *** join/#maemo lcuk2 (i=lcuk@cpc3-oldh7-0-0-cust590.manc.cable.ntl.com) |
| 21:18.27 | AStorm | Sep 27 is to the DISTRIBUTORS. |
| 21:18.36 | AStorm | retailers have to order it from them. |
| 21:18.53 | AStorm | that takes time, so I expect some first shops to offer it on 1st if it's accurate |
| 21:19.27 | AStorm | + other delays |
| 21:19.27 | RST38h | it is still too early date to be true |
| 21:19.41 | AStorm | so it might be beggining of October, for example |
| 21:19.41 | AStorm | it's possible. |
| 21:19.50 | AStorm | they have the devices likely in full production |
| 21:20.21 | RST38h | hardware isn't the only thing that has to be ready |
| 21:20.34 | AStorm | yes, but software has to be dogfood-ready |
| 21:20.40 | AStorm | and it already is. |
| 21:20.57 | AStorm | improvements can be done later. |
| 21:21.08 | RST38h | not in mass market situation |
| 21:21.18 | AStorm | yes in mass market situation |
| 21:21.23 | AStorm | what has iPhone done there? |
| 21:21.33 | Corsac | the dates I've seen for fr are more like oct end |
| 21:21.37 | AStorm | shipped with a really unfinished version of software |
| 21:21.54 | Corsac | oct 22 for expansys |
| 21:21.54 | AStorm | Corsac: possible too. |
| 21:22.11 | Corsac | http://www.expansys-usa.com/d.aspx?i=186949 |
| 21:22.31 | AStorm | the trick is that they can ship english-language versions before localizations are done |
| 21:23.09 | AStorm | same likely with Finnish and maybe other nordic. |
| 21:23.17 | RST38h | AStorm: comparisons to iphone are meaningless. |
| 21:23.21 | AStorm | *Finn? or maybe Suomi. w/e |
| 21:23.24 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 21:23.39 | AStorm | RST38h: sure they are meaningful. It's the only phone on the market with major internet support for updates. |
| 21:23.48 | Corsac | internet support? |
| 21:24.01 | AStorm | uh, support for internet updates. |
| 21:24.01 | Corsac | don't you have to plug the iphone to your itunes? |
| 21:24.10 | AStorm | yes, you have. |
| 21:24.15 | AStorm | but it's easy enough |
| 21:24.20 | RST38h | He means the jailbreaking community ;)) |
| 21:24.24 | Corsac | hmhm ok, internet support apple-side |
| 21:24.28 | Corsac | not client-sid |
| 21:24.28 | AStorm | as opposed to flashing firmware on other phones |
| 21:24.38 | AStorm | and getting it via weird channels |
| 21:25.40 | Corsac | well, iphone updates are reflash, aren't they? |
| 21:25.43 | *** join/#maemo promulo (n=romulo@150.165.63.86) |
| 21:25.51 | AStorm | they are, but it's automated |
| 21:26.06 | AStorm | the updates try to retain files, apps and configuration |
| 21:26.20 | AStorm | that's what I call support for updates. |
| 21:27.37 | AStorm | even plain availability of improved firmware is better than what other phones allow |
| 21:28.07 | AStorm | s/allow/offer/ |
| 21:28.08 | javispedro | ~ping |
| 21:28.09 | infobot | ~pong |
| 21:28.10 | SpeedEvil | yeah - and breaking existing functionality... |
| 21:28.35 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: happens, yes. Better than having broken existing non-functionality usually. |
| 21:28.40 | ShadowJK | S60 phones has had flash-from-PC for years and years... and now with s60v5 and s60v3.2 also pure client-side updates without need for computer.. |
| 21:28.47 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 21:28.54 | AStorm | ShadowJK: mmmm |
| 21:29.04 | AStorm | flash-from-pc with standard USB cable |
| 21:29.10 | AStorm | with included software to do that? |
| 21:29.13 | ShadowJK | yeah |
| 21:29.28 | AStorm | hmm, neat. |
| 21:29.50 | AStorm | users still don't care too much for offline updates |
| 21:30.02 | AStorm | that's why online update is so nice to have |
| 21:30.27 | AStorm | (like what S60v3.2, S60v5 and Maemo since Diablo something have) |
| 21:30.48 | AStorm | heck, the phone itself could remind you to check for updates |
| 21:31.11 | ShadowJK | If you buy a phone that is crippled by the operator though, the operator will first cripple/add bugs to the new firmware, or they just wont care and never give you a firmware upgrade |
| 21:31.23 | AStorm | yes, exactly |
| 21:31.25 | AStorm | the "tunings" |
| 21:31.36 | AStorm | instead of proper changes in configuration |
| 21:32.06 | AStorm | there should be either very good, update-friendly support for operator customizations |
| 21:32.15 | AStorm | or no operator customizations at all ;p |
| 21:32.51 | AStorm | most operators could live with a few logos |
| 21:32.57 | AStorm | and a bunch of default settings |
| 21:32.58 | ShadowJK | http://europe.nokia.com/get-support-and-software/download-software/device-software-update/faq#faq4 |
| 21:33.02 | mavhc | if you can't push a bugfix for a SMS overflow security hole over the air you'd think you'd be screwed |
| 21:33.23 | AStorm | ShadowJK: hey, you are still |
| 21:33.31 | AStorm | since people usually don't have data plans yet |
| 21:33.41 | ShadowJK | I am still? |
| 21:33.53 | AStorm | missed. mavhc ^ |
| 21:34.17 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 21:34.21 | *** join/#maemo Vulcanis (n=CBabbage@uhartford236105.hartford.edu) |
| 21:34.37 | AStorm | so you can't push in general |
| 21:34.48 | AStorm | instead, you can remind the user to pull/check |
| 21:35.21 | ShadowJK | Without Internet connectivity you're pretty screwed, because operators are utterly uncooperative and wont lift a finger to push updates of any sort |
| 21:35.33 | AStorm | ayup |
| 21:35.51 | AStorm | they could do that... send a bunch of prepared broadcast messages for example |
| 21:35.54 | mavhc | and that's why you should root all their phones and use them to DDoS their own network |
| 21:36.09 | AStorm | mavhc: lol |
| 21:36.24 | AStorm | stupid use of a rooted phone |
| 21:38.04 | AStorm | extra bonus if some ISP does push a rootkitbreaker |
| 21:38.13 | AStorm | which will work against unpatched phones |
| 21:38.26 | AStorm | prompting the users to upgrade manually if auto is unsafe or impossible |
| 21:39.16 | AStorm | or push an antivirus via the hole ;p |
| 21:39.53 | AStorm | (to catch all the dumb exploits that don't patch the hole themselves) |
| 21:39.54 | crashanddie_ | ShadowJK, unless the operator sold the handset and have control over it, also, if they risk losing money, they will push |
| 21:40.12 | AStorm | they don't risk losing money usually |
| 21:40.20 | AStorm | since blah blah legal print |
| 21:40.34 | ShadowJK | I wouldn't be surprised if instead of pushing a OTA update, they insisted each handset be sent to the manufacturer for update |
| 21:40.46 | AStorm | yep |
| 21:40.51 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-224-11.om.om.cox.net) |
| 21:41.01 | AStorm | which of course nobody will do |
| 21:41.04 | ShadowJK | just avoids locked/crippled phones |
| 21:41.19 | Mousey | hands ShadowJK a palm pre |
| 21:41.21 | AStorm | if a popular enough phone gets rooted in a funny way... they *will* lose money finally |
| 21:41.24 | AStorm | and have to think |
| 21:41.32 | crashanddie_ | in my day job I'm actually currently in the process of discussing the feasability of implementing an authentication platform for mobile devices that would allow operators to give users access to specific features -- one of the features mainly talked about would be allowing (forcing is more like the word) user access to a specific piece of information |
| 21:41.52 | crashanddie_ | this comes from the idea that the more advanced the devices become, the greater the risk of a widespread "attack" |
| 21:41.56 | Mousey | crashanddie_: goodluckwiththat |
| 21:42.34 | AStorm | until some large operator gets bit by that, it's unlikely to be implemented |
| 21:42.47 | ShadowJK | on recent s60 you get a popup when new firmware version is available :-) |
| 21:42.55 | ShadowJK | and on Maemo we get the orange blinking ! :D |
| 21:42.59 | crashanddie_ | from an authentication point of view, it's not necessarily hard -- it's the handset step that's pretty damn complicated (and out of scope for my work, I might add) |
| 21:43.02 | AStorm | *if* you have a data plan |
| 21:43.22 | AStorm | it should blink some annoying message if you haven't connected and checked for updates in X time. |
| 21:43.26 | crashanddie_ | AStorm, no, the whole point would be that you give users data access for such a feature |
| 21:43.41 | AStorm | you mean like minor trickle? |
| 21:43.47 | crashanddie_ | minor trickle? |
| 21:43.47 | AStorm | free packets? |
| 21:43.50 | crashanddie_ | yeah |
| 21:43.59 | crashanddie_ | only for specific updates or software pushes, though |
| 21:44.20 | AStorm | yep |
| 21:44.22 | AStorm | good enough |
| 21:44.29 | AStorm | but operator maintenance heavy |
| 21:44.38 | AStorm | they get to enable each update to be fetched in that way |
| 21:44.39 | crashanddie_ | well, it's a start |
| 21:45.01 | ShadowJK | I guess a separate APN for updates |
| 21:45.02 | AStorm | that is, until they get an automated tool that does that |
| 21:45.20 | AStorm | ShadowJK: good idea, yes |
| 21:45.28 | ShadowJK | I'm not a big fan of reinventing the wheel anyway |
| 21:45.49 | ShadowJK | When operators stop living in the 20th century and step into the 21st century and give us the datapipe we want, we'll all be better off |
| 21:46.17 | AStorm | yeah, when they stop caring about extra $$$... oh really? |
| 21:46.58 | AStorm | once that happens (a true unlimited data plan with enough bandwidth behind it to make it fast enough), there will be no way back ;p |
| 21:47.08 | ShadowJK | Well US will always be years behind others when they've got such good lock-ins to limit competition :) |
| 21:47.21 | ShadowJK | I think it has happened here |
| 21:47.22 | AStorm | what lock-ins? |
| 21:47.26 | AStorm | it's same in EU |
| 21:47.49 | AStorm | ShadowJK: no, they dropped the "unlimited" part |
| 21:47.54 | ShadowJK | Well they've got different frequencies and different tech so it's difficult to make a phone that works on them all |
| 21:47.55 | AStorm | very very quickly |
| 21:48.03 | ShadowJK | they haven't dropped it here yet |
| 21:48.04 | AStorm | so it felt more like a marketing move to me |
| 21:48.20 | AStorm | yeah yeah |
| 21:48.25 | AStorm | check if you have no transfer limit |
| 21:48.38 | AStorm | unless the link is fairly slow... ;p |
| 21:48.44 | AStorm | or number of users low |
| 21:48.44 | ShadowJK | If I have, it's more than 30 gigs per month, which they claimed I did last month |
| 21:48.57 | AStorm | hehe |
| 21:49.14 | AStorm | consider what would happen if people started using those connections as main ones |
| 21:49.32 | ShadowJK | People have already started doing that :) |
| 21:49.34 | AStorm | they likely won't anyway (since land-based are faster, lower latency and more reliable) |
| 21:49.46 | AStorm | yes, started |
| 21:49.54 | AStorm | the question is, will some kind of "boom" happen |
| 21:52.37 | AStorm | whether really large cell-phone data transfers become common |
| 21:52.45 | AStorm | (as in, say, monthly total) |
| 21:53.23 | AStorm | 4G LTE is supposed to bring flat IP(v6?) architecture |
| 21:54.15 | AStorm | 3GPP LTE actually, or 4G |
| 21:57.00 | ShadowJK | hm, in 2008, 10% of the .fi population has mobile internet subscribtion... |
| 21:57.16 | ShadowJK | and 30% used "mobile internet data services" |
| 21:57.43 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@user-10lfcke.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 22:00.58 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr_ (n=luke-jr@98.168.224.11) |
| 22:03.45 | AStorm | finland is a small country and quite a special case |
| 22:03.50 | AStorm | oh btw.. |
| 22:03.53 | AStorm | "A data rate of at least 100 Mbit/s between any two points in the world," |
| 22:04.05 | AStorm | this reminds me of a quote from Space Odyssey |
| 22:04.05 | Stskeeps | http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/mermantle.png <- mer, hildon-desktop, mesa sw rendering |
| 22:04.08 | Stskeeps | x86 |
| 22:04.14 | ShadowJK | AStorm, special case how? :-) |
| 22:04.36 | ShadowJK | maybe special in the way that we had competitive environment :/ |
| 22:04.38 | AStorm | (corrupted)"He knew how to do it, but didn't know what it was good for. He'd think of something" |
| 22:04.44 | AStorm | ;p |
| 22:05.04 | AStorm | ShadowJK: exactly that |
| 22:05.21 | AStorm | and Finland has had mobile services with national range for how long in comparison? |
| 22:06.03 | ShadowJK | no national 3G coverage yet :D |
| 22:06.25 | AStorm | 3G is one thing, I'm talking about voice |
| 22:06.37 | AStorm | and then data (2G is ok there too) |
| 22:06.56 | ShadowJK | since forever :) |
| 22:07.19 | ShadowJK | Though it reached widespread use in mid 90s iirc |
| 22:07.54 | AStorm | see, that's longer in most other countries I think |
| 22:07.58 | AStorm | *than in |
| 22:08.20 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@user-10lfcke.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 22:09.12 | ShadowJK | Yeah, but the infrastructure has to be rebuilt every 5-10 years anyway :) |
| 22:14.27 | AStorm | no, most of it not. |
| 22:14.38 | AStorm | usually it's a partial update |
| 22:17.27 | *** join/#maemo _jason6980 (n=thot@59-105-27-43.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw) |
| 22:18.05 | kpel | depends on the technology |
| 22:19.43 | *** join/#maemo pupnik64 (n=pupnik64@p54B2EEA9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:21.25 | AStorm | 2G -> 3G -> 3G+ -> ...? |
| 22:21.38 | AStorm | or rather, 2G -> 2.5G -> 3G -> 3G+ -> ... |
| 22:21.50 | AStorm | yes, base stations have to be replaced |
| 22:21.54 | kpel | what exactly is 3g+? HSPA? HSPA+? |
| 22:22.05 | AStorm | HSPA and HSPA+ is mostly same |
| 22:22.12 | AStorm | but it is HSPA. |
| 22:22.21 | ShadowJK | gsm -> gprs -> edge -> 3g -> hsdpa (in about 7 generations) -> hsupa -> hsdpa+ |
| 22:22.41 | kpel | there are quite a few extra features in hspa+ afaik |
| 22:23.07 | ShadowJK | And the backbone capacity and links to the cells msut be upgraded to ethernet, and the capacity must be constantly upgraded when bandwidth is growing 10X per year on cellphone networks :) |
| 22:23.23 | kpel | yes, it's a lot of trouble |
| 22:23.58 | AStorm | not that much really, more a question of money and how often you upgrade |
| 22:24.14 | ShadowJK | It's also a question of trouble :) |
| 22:24.29 | *** join/#maemo milos_ (n=milos@92.36.188.149) |
| 22:24.29 | AStorm | in a good modular design, the radio part would be replaced |
| 22:24.32 | AStorm | bandwidth can wait |
| 22:24.44 | AStorm | since users won't upgrade their devices fast enough |
| 22:24.57 | AStorm | then you do a lumped bandwidth update |
| 22:25.31 | ShadowJK | I mean total bandwidth use, not individual user's maximum speed |
| 22:25.44 | javispedro | Stskeeps: wow |
| 22:25.48 | AStorm | total bandwidth is unimportant |
| 22:25.54 | AStorm | what is important is peak bandwidth |
| 22:26.04 | javispedro | Stskeeps: glx? |
| 22:26.15 | AStorm | and maybe RMS bandwidth ;p |
| 22:26.15 | Stskeeps | javispedro: mesa on virtualbox |
| 22:26.22 | Stskeeps | (sw render) |
| 22:26.23 | javispedro | Stskeeps, I mean, opengl instead of ogles. Can you test if the color swap bug appears? |
| 22:26.38 | Stskeeps | yes, it's instead of ogles |
| 22:26.41 | ShadowJK | AStorm, peak to trough is only factor of 2 or so and year on year growth was a factor of 11 2006-2007, for example :) |
| 22:26.57 | AStorm | but what was the baseline for that growth? :p |
| 22:27.07 | AStorm | note that you can't extrapolate trends too far |
| 22:27.18 | ShadowJK | yeah it was about 5X 2007-2008 :) |
| 22:27.23 | AStorm | otherwise car sales would still be increasing 10% per year ;p |
| 22:27.32 | AStorm | (to 200%) |
| 22:28.00 | ShadowJK | 99% of traffic produced by computers not (smart)phones :) |
| 22:28.12 | AStorm | this is the useful modelling tool: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gompertz_curve |
| 22:28.19 | javispedro | Stskeeps: but of course, very nice :) I hope the transitions are resolution independent :) |
| 22:30.18 | kpel | AStorm: out of curiosity, how many do you think are the differences between hspa and hspa+? |
| 22:30.58 | AStorm | MIMO support. |
| 22:31.16 | AStorm | (on the receiver side) |
| 22:31.24 | AStorm | some firmware upgrade on the operator side |
| 22:31.27 | kpel | downlink yes |
| 22:31.35 | Stskeeps | javispedro: think transitions are copyrighted and we really dont want them |
| 22:31.59 | mavhc | the software is what changes the bandwidth used though, noone sends videos unless sending videos is easy |
| 22:32.23 | AStorm | mavhc: true, and even if it is easy, no one sends because there's not enough targets |
| 22:32.30 | AStorm | again, Gompertz curve ;p |
| 22:33.01 | kpel | AStorm: so if you add MIMO to 3GPP release 6 you have HSPA+? |
| 22:33.10 | AStorm | kpel: let me check |
| 22:33.28 | AStorm | MIMO needs communication between cells |
| 22:33.33 | AStorm | but that is likely already there |
| 22:33.46 | kpel | it adds overhead |
| 22:34.04 | AStorm | you need 64QAM support. |
| 22:34.22 | AStorm | likely a firmware update on most well-designed sending devices |
| 22:34.25 | kpel | but i find it hard to believe that MIMO is the only difference |
| 22:34.35 | AStorm | MIMO and 64QAM. |
| 22:34.39 | AStorm | (new modulation) |
| 22:34.44 | kpel | at L1 maybe |
| 22:34.51 | AStorm | yes. |
| 22:35.00 | kpel | there are more features in the rest of the stack |
| 22:35.27 | AStorm | nah. |
| 22:35.36 | AStorm | an *optional*, but reommended feature is IP support |
| 22:35.43 | AStorm | *recommended |
| 22:35.51 | AStorm | flat IP. |
| 22:36.45 | kpel | that's just one thing. There have been quite a few changes since rel6 |
| 22:36.53 | AStorm | minor really. |
| 22:36.56 | AStorm | software upgrades |
| 22:37.23 | kpel | well, maemo is software. is it a minor component? |
| 22:37.57 | AStorm | not *this* software |
| 22:37.57 | AStorm | receiver firmware |
| 22:37.57 | kpel | just because you make changes in the baseband it doesn't mean the changes are minor |
| 22:37.57 | AStorm | you can get partial HSPA+ with one receiver |
| 22:38.05 | AStorm | just supporting 64QAM |
| 22:38.08 | AStorm | that may or may not be easy. |
| 22:38.19 | AStorm | (depending on the receiver used) |
| 22:38.46 | pupnik64 | Maemo users who want to listen to lectures speeches might be interested in 'yatm' - can play back mp3/ogg/speex at faster and slower rates keeping the pitch steady. |
| 22:39.02 | AStorm | blah. |
| 22:39.09 | pupnik64 | maybe autobuilder it - console app |
| 22:39.12 | AStorm | may I point those users to sox? |
| 22:39.15 | AStorm | ;p |
| 22:39.30 | AStorm | it has time scaling effects as well |
| 22:39.39 | AStorm | write a simple script and you have yatm |
| 22:40.46 | pupnik64 | no |
| 22:40.48 | AStorm | (unless yatm has some higher quality or DSP accelerated effect, that is) |
| 22:40.49 | javispedro | sox supports mp3? |
| 22:40.53 | AStorm | sure it does. |
| 22:40.57 | pupnik64 | you fail to grasp the essence of tai quan leep |
| 22:41.02 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@65.87.178.142) |
| 22:41.05 | pupnik64 | approach so that you may learn |
| 22:41.10 | pupnik64 | <boot to the head> |
| 22:41.18 | AStorm | that's why I don't approach ;p |
| 22:41.24 | *** join/#maemo myosound (n=myosound@173.13.200.50) |
| 22:41.28 | pupnik64 | ever heard that comedy skit? |
| 22:41.35 | pupnik64 | very funny - 'boot to the head' |
| 22:41.38 | AStorm | the question is, why nobody used sox enough |
| 22:41.50 | pupnik64 | anyway the sound quality of resampling time-stretch sucks |
| 22:41.57 | AStorm | it even has fairly easy libsox |
| 22:42.06 | pupnik64 | what you want is to slowdown/speedup playback within the decoder |
| 22:42.09 | AStorm | pupnik64: resampling? it's not resampling |
| 22:42.13 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-231-25.om.om.cox.net) |
| 22:42.13 | pupnik64 | because that way you don't get stuttering effects |
| 22:42.23 | *** join/#maemo angasule (n=angasule@201.250.112.19) |
| 22:42.35 | AStorm | no, you can't simply "slowdown" playback in the decoder |
| 22:42.39 | AStorm | that would lower the pitch |
| 22:42.53 | pupnik64 | hahah |
| 22:42.56 | AStorm | you have to cut the signal into pieces then reconstruct missing data (somehow) |
| 22:42.57 | pupnik64 | wanna bet? |
| 22:42.59 | pupnik64 | how much? |
| 22:43.00 | AStorm | then repaste the pieces |
| 22:43.12 | pupnik64 | bet you whatever you want you're wrong |
| 22:43.15 | javispedro | yatm seems to cut some parts of the tune |
| 22:43.19 | AStorm | pupnik64: show me. |
| 22:43.24 | javispedro | at least a constant beat gets turned into an irregular one |
| 22:43.25 | AStorm | I mean, the code. |
| 22:43.37 | pupnik64 | mp3 and ogg represent sound in the frequency domain |
| 22:43.44 | *** join/#maemo b-man16 (n=b-man16@pool-98-115-99-113.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 22:43.51 | AStorm | partially, yes |
| 22:43.55 | pupnik64 | in a certain slice of time, they store the various intensities of frequencies from 20 to 20khz |
| 22:43.58 | pupnik64 | or something like that |
| 22:44.02 | AStorm | you can't just take the windowed signal and move apart the windows |
| 22:44.11 | AStorm | you have to regenerate signal between them |
| 22:44.13 | AStorm | that's resampling. |
| 22:44.29 | AStorm | so you still get to time-stretch the signa. |
| 22:44.34 | AStorm | +l |
| 22:44.39 | pupnik64 | each snapshot in the frequency domain can be visualized as a series of sine wave oscillators at different intensities |
| 22:44.53 | pupnik64 | i.e. you have a whole series of sine wave oscillators from 20hz to 20khz |
| 22:44.57 | AStorm | I know how DFT works, thanks. |
| 22:45.00 | AStorm | :) |
| 22:45.06 | AStorm | or MDCT actually. |
| 22:45.20 | pupnik64 | if you let them 'ring on' you can let as much time go by as you want before adjusting them to the next frame's intensities |
| 22:45.23 | AStorm | or even windowed MDCT which is what MP3 does. |
| 22:45.24 | pupnik64 | and the pitches stay the same |
| 22:45.36 | AStorm | so you stretch window transitions |
| 22:45.41 | pupnik64 | right |
| 22:45.44 | AStorm | that will sound uneven and horrible. |
| 22:45.48 | AStorm | :) |
| 22:45.58 | javispedro | that may be what this thing does |
| 22:46.06 | pupnik64 | much better than resampling and pasting different echoes over each other |
| 22:46.08 | AStorm | it might work for noise-like signals... sometimes |
| 22:46.14 | AStorm | which means speech |
| 22:46.21 | AStorm | no no, not *over* each other |
| 22:46.22 | AStorm | between |
| 22:46.24 | pupnik64 | no, you get a perfectly smooth transition from one frame to another |
| 22:46.29 | AStorm | the idea is that you don't really resample |
| 22:46.35 | pupnik64 | completely unlike chopping-up the wave into 30ms frames and overlapping them |
| 22:46.37 | javispedro | a constant beeping "accelerated" throught this tool sounds like random beeping |
| 22:46.39 | pupnik64 | that is what sox does |
| 22:46.43 | pupnik64 | and mplayer |
| 22:46.58 | AStorm | you do something like: take the samples you have, run a ZOH between (or some better interpolation), lowpass |
| 22:47.06 | AStorm | uh, cut into pieces |
| 22:47.34 | AStorm | all samples. |
| 22:47.39 | AStorm | since MP3 is pre-cut... |
| 22:47.41 | SpeedEvil | pupnik64: It doesn't work right - you need to rewindow the signals. |
| 22:47.45 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr (n=luke-jr@ip98-168-224-11.om.om.cox.net) |
| 22:47.51 | AStorm | you *could* use that knowledge to improve quality some |
| 22:47.56 | SpeedEvil | pupnik64: And it's more complex than that as you're screwing with it. |
| 22:47.56 | AStorm | not a whole lot though |
| 22:48.19 | SpeedEvil | But it's not something that's sane to put into each codec - it would be a lot of hairiness in each codec. |
| 22:48.23 | SpeedEvil | vs one filter. |
| 22:48.33 | pupnik64 | hmm |
| 22:49.18 | SpeedEvil | You fundamentally cannot achieve a perfect pitch shifting. |
| 22:49.24 | SpeedEvil | Information will always be lost. |
| 22:49.40 | AStorm | or missing. |
| 22:50.04 | AStorm | (and guessed, oh I mean interpolated) |
| 22:50.17 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 22:50.28 | AStorm | SoX tempo effect does a smart thing for shortening |
| 22:50.29 | SpeedEvil | If you're speeding up time, youhave to merge adjacent windows |
| 22:50.35 | *** join/#maemo jauaor (n=araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo) |
| 22:50.36 | AStorm | in that it uses good overlap-based check |
| 22:50.41 | SpeedEvil | If you're slowing it down, you need to duplicate |
| 22:50.57 | SpeedEvil | You'll always have wierd phase effects though. |
| 22:50.57 | AStorm | picking right samples to merge using least squares fit |
| 22:51.06 | pupnik64 | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:51.06 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 22:51.21 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: not really, esp. not for integer sample ratios |
| 22:51.43 | SpeedEvil | AStorm: I mean for arbitrary ratios. |
| 22:52.01 | AStorm | arbitrary ratios won't have phase distortion either in a good filter design |
| 22:52.22 | SpeedEvil | I don't think you can avoid it in the multi-tone case |
| 22:52.27 | AStorm | but that doesn't change the fact that the data has been interpolated. |
| 22:52.29 | SpeedEvil | Sure you can in the single tone. |
| 22:52.39 | SpeedEvil | I mean phase distortion at the joins |
| 22:52.39 | ShadowJK | yatm doesn't slow down or speed up anything in the decoder. |
| 22:52.40 | AStorm | multi-tone is possible too, but interpolation is guess-work |
| 22:53.11 | AStorm | you can either copy a window of the signal (likely short) |
| 22:53.26 | AStorm | or interpolate |
| 22:53.37 | AStorm | both solutions are guesses. |
| 22:53.50 | SpeedEvil | Unless it's a midi file. |
| 22:53.55 | AStorm | copy (+ lowpass) will work better for multi-tone likely |
| 22:53.57 | SpeedEvil | In which case you can do it right ;) |
| 22:55.37 | AStorm | and sox algorithm is tuned for real music. |
| 22:56.12 | AStorm | for expected noise-like signals you can do extra noise restoration |
| 22:56.16 | AStorm | to remove some artifacts |
| 22:56.19 | GeneralAntilles | chuckles http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=333230&postcount=173 |
| 22:56.38 | ShadowJK | One of the AAC modes encodes noise just by its statistical properties :) |
| 22:56.38 | AStorm | instead of copying, you'd guess the kind of noise to insert |
| 22:56.46 | AStorm | yes yes, you mean HE-AAC |
| 22:56.52 | ShadowJK | probably |
| 22:56.53 | javispedro | ShadowJK: wow |
| 22:57.16 | AStorm | Vorbis does something similar as well, but not patent-infringing |
| 22:57.34 | ShadowJK | Not infringing on declared AAC patents, anyway |
| 22:57.42 | AStorm | yes |
| 22:58.24 | AStorm | for speech, you can use an inverse version of speech codec |
| 22:58.36 | AStorm | like Speex algorithms for error correction |
| 22:58.53 | AStorm | s/correction/masking/ |
| 22:59.20 | ShadowJK | At the end of the day though, you can't create more information than what is contained in the original signal :) |
| 22:59.32 | SpeedEvil | Sure you can! |
| 22:59.38 | SpeedEvil | Though it won't be meaningful. |
| 22:59.42 | javispedro | you lie. |
| 22:59.44 | javispedro | :) |
| 22:59.54 | ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, right :) |
| 23:00.19 | ShadowJK | It's funny how many people are fooled by 320x240 resolution videos upsampled to HD, with noise added to make it look like very tiny pixels |
| 23:00.21 | sp3000 | hrm, why is "report abuse" louder than the actual comment text on, say, http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/conboy/0.5.4 |
| 23:00.30 | *** join/#maemo tonikitoo (n=tonikito@201-75-11-244-ma.cpe.vivax.com.br) |
| 23:00.49 | *** join/#maemo beavis (n=mk@p4FC3326D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:01.27 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: it's guesswork anyway ;p |
| 23:01.36 | Firebird | hm, how can you tell if library packages have made it to extras[-testing]... /me is still waiting to push his packages to testing |
| 23:01.38 | AStorm | but it's better guesswork than dumb guesses made by interpolation |
| 23:01.40 | AStorm | or copy |
| 23:03.50 | SpeedEvil | wonders if there is a library of pathalogical cases. |
| 23:04.17 | SpeedEvil | For example - I have a meatloaf album that some of the tracks leap out and smack you in the face with compression artifacts if encoded in mp3 under 320k |
| 23:05.08 | pupnik64 | heh |
| 23:05.37 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: MP3 is old. still, I bet LAME can do good work on it. |
| 23:05.54 | AStorm | good enough that you won't be able to ABX prove that you can hear it |
| 23:05.55 | pupnik64 | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:06.11 | AStorm | note "decoded" |
| 23:06.14 | ShadowJK | :) |
| 23:07.00 | sp3000 | bug 5190 |
| 23:07.03 | pupnik64 | looking at yatm.cc |
| 23:07.11 | SpeedEvil | AStorm: that was with lame |
| 23:07.21 | SpeedEvil | AStorm: admittedly an old version. |
| 23:07.23 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: tried with VBR yet? |
| 23:07.24 | lardman|home | what should ~isdigit("9") return? |
| 23:07.27 | AStorm | how old? |
| 23:07.33 | SpeedEvil | (it was running on overclocked ppro 160s0 |
| 23:07.39 | ShadowJK | Even the yatm website says it uses soundtouch |
| 23:07.48 | AStorm | 3.90.sth + is fairly good |
| 23:07.52 | AStorm | but later have many tunings |
| 23:07.58 | SpeedEvil | The album had some wierd 70s stereo effects |
| 23:08.14 | AStorm | ShadowJK: oh, soundtouch is suck compared to SoX |
| 23:08.29 | AStorm | it should steal^Wborrow some algorithms |
| 23:08.34 | AStorm | or become a thin wrapper ;p |
| 23:08.54 | AStorm | although it might have a slight advantage in speed. |
| 23:09.20 | AStorm | yatm.cc exists? |
| 23:09.28 | ShadowJK | mplayer's scaletempo is "WSOLA technique with cross correlation", "inspired by SoundTouch" |
| 23:09.28 | AStorm | OpenDNS doesn't know about it. |
| 23:09.40 | AStorm | ShadowJK: hehehe |
| 23:09.49 | AStorm | that was also what SoX previous algorithm did |
| 23:09.52 | pupnik64 | yeah mplayer tries to adjust the overlap window |
| 23:10.02 | pupnik64 | it ends up bunching-together consonant frames |
| 23:10.04 | AStorm | it fails miserably |
| 23:10.08 | AStorm | :) |
| 23:10.11 | ShadowJK | AStorm, filename not domain name |
| 23:10.46 | AStorm | ahh. |
| 23:10.48 | AStorm | drat. |
| 23:10.52 | AStorm | link please? |
| 23:11.05 | AStorm | since "yatm" is not googlable |
| 23:11.27 | javispedro | AStorm: you might be surprised. it is. |
| 23:11.33 | javispedro | first hit here. |
| 23:11.43 | AStorm | wtf? |
| 23:11.51 | AStorm | it's that "Yet another time machine"? |
| 23:11.54 | javispedro | yes. |
| 23:11.55 | AStorm | talk about a good name |
| 23:11.56 | AStorm | ;p |
| 23:12.00 | AStorm | or a good title |
| 23:12.24 | *** join/#maemo debian-san (n=fred@h203-091-167-167.user.starcat.ne.jp) |
| 23:12.45 | zerojay | http://maemo.org/community/brainstorm/view/make_cellular_data_stats_easier_for_users_to_find/ |
| 23:12.50 | zerojay | Make your voice heard, plz. |
| 23:12.57 | AStorm | :> |
| 23:13.13 | AStorm | maybe provide a panel plugin to show these? |
| 23:13.19 | lardman|home | argh, s/~/! |
| 23:13.22 | AStorm | or desktop or whatever it's called now |
| 23:13.24 | AStorm | dashboard? |
| 23:13.35 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=luke-jr@2002:62b3:1d4c:0:20e:a6ff:fec4:4e5d) |
| 23:13.57 | zerojay | Solution 1: Desktop Widget |
| 23:14.02 | AStorm | pupnik64: sox uses an empirically derived window size |
| 23:14.08 | zerojay | Solution 2: Status Area menu |
| 23:14.09 | AStorm | ;) |
| 23:14.24 | javispedro | lardman|home: !isdigit("9") will return a non zero value, since "9" is a string ;) |
| 23:14.26 | ShadowJK | What about Settings->connection manager ;-D |
| 23:14.31 | sp3000 | oh |
| 23:14.38 | javispedro | and isdigit takes chars. |
| 23:14.39 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=luke-jr@2002:62b3:1d4c:0:20e:a6ff:fec4:4e5d) |
| 23:14.45 | javispedro | so it will also emit a compiler warning. |
| 23:14.52 | sp3000 | so when you're rating an app, it makes a net call without any feedback |
| 23:15.00 | AStorm | ShadowJK: not convenient enough |
| 23:15.02 | zerojay | ShadowJK: Far too buried. |
| 23:15.04 | sp3000 | so I was sorta clicking at it thinking it's not working |
| 23:15.45 | AStorm | hehe |
| 23:15.46 | sp3000 | wth |
| 23:15.52 | lardman|home | javispedro: that's what I thought, but I was thinking in a different lang, hence the s/~/! bit |
| 23:15.58 | sp3000 | I thumbed up this app twice?! |
| 23:16.00 | lbt | ShadowJK: mean anything ? : http://pastebin.com/fbe059a5 |
| 23:16.05 | javispedro | ah, python? |
| 23:16.17 | AStorm | sp3000: bad server is bad. it should be fixed to drop replayed votes |
| 23:16.20 | ShadowJK | on Symbian it's menu -> control panel -> Connectivity -> Connectivity Manager -> Active data connections, or: menu -> log -> packet data |
| 23:16.39 | AStorm | maybe by doing it like real people - tacking a random-generated id |
| 23:16.40 | sp3000 | AStorm: well, or it should be just counting people, not votes |
| 23:16.41 | AStorm | in the form. |
| 23:16.41 | *** join/#maemo jgoss (n=josh@pool-98-111-7-29.sctnpa.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:16.55 | sp3000 | since it's showing people anyway |
| 23:17.01 | sp3000 | so now I get listed twice :) |
| 23:17.05 | AStorm | he :) |
| 23:17.05 | sp3000 | feels special |
| 23:17.09 | *** join/#maemo MrGoose1 (n=cache@5ac515cf.bb.sky.com) |
| 23:17.39 | sp3000 | I liked how it was showing me "9 out of 10" with "10 up 0 down" before I reloaded |
| 23:18.42 | lardman|home | javispedro: MATLAB |
| 23:18.45 | AStorm | I like votes with stdev shown |
| 23:18.55 | AStorm | :) |
| 23:19.05 | AStorm | good for esp. larger number of ratings |
| 23:19.16 | AStorm | nice measure of polarization as well |
| 23:19.43 | zerojay | ShadowJK: Yes, again, that's far too buried especially on a device where you're bound to use more data naturally. |
| 23:20.17 | AStorm | menu->log->packet data is almost good |
| 23:20.34 | ShadowJK | On the other hand, this is the kind of device where its entire design purpose is defeated by not having always-on connectivity, so it'd be kinda silly to not have unmetered plan ;) |
| 23:20.40 | AStorm | albeit a panel plugin would be nice for people who have to track usage all the time |
| 23:20.51 | AStorm | or maybe show it in browser? |
| 23:21.59 | AStorm | I don't really know the Maemo 5 UI, other than it looks cool |
| 23:22.05 | AStorm | don't know what is possible there |
| 23:23.27 | AStorm | pupnik64: soundtouch has one plus - all of its effects are real-time tunable |
| 23:23.33 | zerojay | ShadowJK: Except that almost no parts of the world have unmetered plans so... |
| 23:23.52 | AStorm | yeah, like 1GB |
| 23:24.05 | AStorm | or even <shudder /> prepaid |
| 23:24.14 | AStorm | where your connection can just end. |
| 23:25.00 | *** join/#maemo hellwolf-n810 (n=hellwolf@a83-132-251-80.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 23:25.07 | SpeedEvil | A spike meter would be nice. |
| 23:25.12 | AStorm | (in subscription data plans, it usually only downgrades to very low speed - here it's 64 kbps) |
| 23:25.22 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: ? |
| 23:25.33 | SpeedEvil | 'don't bother me if I'm using the device and datarate is under 10k/s or a total of 1M/session' |
| 23:25.53 | SpeedEvil | But I want to know right away if something uses 400K/s or 2M |
| 23:25.55 | AStorm | aah |
| 23:26.07 | AStorm | you mean like ntop? |
| 23:26.09 | AStorm | :) |
| 23:26.24 | SpeedEvil | Stupid silent flash animation ate 20M of my 3G quota the other night |
| 23:26.59 | *** join/#maemo brolin_ (n=brolin@nat222.udea.edu.co) |
| 23:27.26 | AStorm | http://www.ntop.org/overview.html - this is how ntop looks like |
| 23:28.01 | AStorm | but a variant optimized for tiny devices |
| 23:28.10 | AStorm | hmmh |
| 23:28.31 | AStorm | spike detector is fairly trivial |
| 23:28.46 | SpeedEvil | yeah - very. |
| 23:28.46 | AStorm | but it won't discern loading a website from loading a flash movie in short bursts |
| 23:29.08 | AStorm | good enough though, maybe someone can make a MicroB extension like that |
| 23:29.14 | AStorm | I can't write XUL/JS that well |
| 23:30.06 | AStorm | what's more, MicroB has enough info to know that it's e.g. flash dling a lot of data |
| 23:30.39 | ShadowJK | I always surf with images and flash off when on metered :) |
| 23:30.56 | *** join/#maemo b-man16 (n=b-man16@pool-98-115-99-113.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 23:31.07 | zerojay | Might as well just be on a standard cell phone then. |
| 23:31.18 | AStorm | there's metered and metered |
| 23:31.28 | ShadowJK | Nah, on opera mini I just set image quality to lowest :) |
| 23:31.45 | AStorm | metered comes in three kinds: 1) you pay more 2) link breaks 3) link degrades |
| 23:31.46 | ShadowJK | used to have 20meg monthly quota :D |
| 23:31.55 | ShadowJK | of the "you pay more" variety |
| 23:32.16 | AStorm | I am "lucky" to have the last variety |
| 23:32.29 | ShadowJK | then they came out with the 100meg package, that was awesome |
| 23:32.36 | AStorm | so can e.g. use IRC and view websites on slow link |
| 23:32.38 | ShadowJK | and then the 64kbps unmetered :D |
| 23:32.43 | AStorm | and even maybe check mail ;p |
| 23:33.02 | ShadowJK | now I have 2Meg unmetered |
| 23:33.09 | AStorm | yeah, 64kbps is likely similar to a width of normal phone call |
| 23:33.14 | ShadowJK | and live outside 3G coverage area :/ |
| 23:33.23 | AStorm | hehe. |
| 23:33.28 | ShadowJK | I used to not even get edge here |
| 23:33.32 | AStorm | that's why they could give 2M unmetered |
| 23:33.40 | AStorm | since few people will have access anyway ;p |
| 23:33.54 | ShadowJK | Except there was one base station 10km away with edge. If I covered the phone with hands, the signal would degrade and it would have to switch to another cell |
| 23:34.01 | ShadowJK | and if I was lucky it picked the one with edge |
| 23:34.21 | AStorm | huh. |
| 23:34.33 | AStorm | I had a funny problem once, in the mountains |
| 23:34.41 | AStorm | the phone saw 2 cells with similar signal |
| 23:34.44 | AStorm | and switched between them |
| 23:35.14 | AStorm | since it's HSPA and not HSPA+ (which sports cell coordination), the connection broke on each switch |
| 23:35.44 | AStorm | just a funny place with almost equal signal from both cells |
| 23:36.00 | AStorm | moved some meters down, all was good ;p |
| 23:36.10 | *** join/#maemo JayBomb999 (n=jaybomb@c-68-40-222-67.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 23:36.35 | ShadowJK | hm |
| 23:37.10 | AStorm | (actually, it was "almost equal with some very narrow band of low signal between the coverages") |
| 23:37.38 | AStorm | dumb phone tried to switch cell each time it got that low signal |
| 23:38.17 | ShadowJK | When I drive to city, I can start downloading a file when at home (edge), drive into gprs-only, back into edge, into 3g, into hspdpa (not +), and reverse order on the way home, without the download breaking |
| 23:38.39 | AStorm | yes, that usually works |
| 23:39.00 | AStorm | except when the phone tries to switch net every 5 packets |
| 23:39.07 | AStorm | then TCP throttles connection to hell |
| 23:39.24 | AStorm | ;p |
| 23:39.27 | zerojay | Kind of sad having a device this good and just being on EDGE. |
| 23:39.58 | ShadowJK | web browsing suffers a bit |
| 23:40.08 | AStorm | hint for Nokia: use TCP Veno policy |
| 23:40.16 | AStorm | it's in mainline kernel |
| 23:40.51 | AStorm | net.ipv4.tcp_congestion_control = veno |
| 23:40.53 | AStorm | this sysctl. |
| 23:41.37 | ShadowJK | reno and cubic available on n810 |
| 23:41.49 | ShadowJK | doesnt the sending side need this too.. |
| 23:42.05 | AStorm | no. |
| 23:42.13 | AStorm | I mean, for maximum gain, why not. |
| 23:42.42 | zerojay | what the fuck... something used 30+MB in the last two hours since I reset the data counters. |
| 23:42.50 | AStorm | :P |
| 23:42.51 | zerojay | And I've been on wifi almost the entire time. |
| 23:43.06 | SpeedEvil | You need a spike meter! :/ |
| 23:43.20 | zerojay | Even just ntop would be nice. |
| 23:43.24 | SpeedEvil | yeah |
| 23:43.47 | SpeedEvil | I've made somethign that goes 'bing' for my 3G connection - when it's moved a me |
| 23:43.47 | SpeedEvil | g |
| 23:44.12 | javispedro | i personally won't use the n900 in any non-flat plan. |
| 23:44.32 | AStorm | http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.2.1469 |
| 23:44.41 | AStorm | that's the Veno paper |
| 23:44.47 | SpeedEvil | 'Flat' plans here all have fair uses |
| 23:44.49 | AStorm | there have been some extra enhancements to Veno too |
| 23:44.54 | lardman|home | zerojay: you leave it connected all the time? |
| 23:44.57 | javispedro | A salient feature of Veno is that it modifies only the sender-side protocol of Reno without changing the receiver-side protocol stack. |
| 23:45.24 | lardman|home | I guess that's the idea mind you |
| 23:45.55 | javispedro | SpeedEvil: agreed. which is why that means "no cell data" for me. |
| 23:46.20 | AStorm | javispedro: yes, so you gain regardless of the ISP. |
| 23:46.44 | javispedro | (actually, I then steal the bandwidth from my alma mater ;) ) |
| 23:46.49 | AStorm | it will be best if your ISP uses a mobile-friendly congestion protocol as well |
| 23:48.00 | javispedro | i'm not used to tcp parlance. "sender" as in sender (who emits data) or "sender" as in host? |
| 23:48.27 | AStorm | sender is the side that sends packets. ;p |
| 23:48.40 | AStorm | which means, the one who uploads. |
| 23:48.52 | AStorm | still, TCP is session-based, so you gain regardless |
| 23:49.04 | AStorm | since two-way communication is always necessary |
| 23:49.12 | AStorm | at least for ACKs |
| 23:49.22 | javispedro | so you gain "few". |
| 23:50.19 | javispedro | it's the remote host the one who would have to enable Veno |
| 23:50.24 | *** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@nat/ibm/x-hkfsebvgfxkhixlx) |
| 23:50.35 | AStorm | you gain still, and that is good |
| 23:50.42 | AStorm | esp. you gain when actually uploading data |
| 23:50.49 | SpeedEvil | damn |
| 23:51.00 | SpeedEvil | tries to work out when he tried to implement this. |
| 23:51.09 | SpeedEvil | 1992? |
| 23:51.13 | GeneralAntilles | Ah, more good fun http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=333270#post333270 |
| 23:51.14 | AStorm | as a bonus, your TCP flow will compete favorably with other TCP flows in the network |
| 23:51.20 | GeneralAntilles | I LOVE that thread. :D |
| 23:51.29 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: implement what? :) |
| 23:51.36 | javispedro | AStorm: your _upload_ flow. |
| 23:51.42 | SpeedEvil | My connection to my favourite mud sucked in 1992. It had lots of packet loss - 25% or so |
| 23:52.06 | SpeedEvil | I simply hacked in a linear backoff not exponential |
| 23:52.24 | AStorm | javispedro: which means your download too |
| 23:52.27 | SpeedEvil | Or linear after 3s - I forgot. |
| 23:52.33 | AStorm | if your upload flow is dead, you can't send ACKS |
| 23:52.34 | AStorm | *ACKs |
| 23:52.39 | AStorm | so the server will retransmit |
| 23:52.58 | javispedro | what use is a 100% fine upload flow in such a congested network? |
| 23:53.03 | AStorm | ... |
| 23:53.03 | javispedro | download will suck either way |
| 23:53.10 | AStorm | there's suck and suck |
| 23:53.11 | SpeedEvil | it's not congestion |
| 23:53.17 | SpeedEvil | it's packet loss due to bit errors |
| 23:53.20 | SpeedEvil | Different things. |
| 23:53.25 | AStorm | or other errors, yes |
| 23:53.27 | javispedro | but same as they affect both upload and download. |
| 23:53.34 | AStorm | not same |
| 23:53.35 | javispedro | (in this concrete example) |
| 23:53.44 | AStorm | Reno will cut your upload rate on error |
| 23:53.53 | javispedro | on upload error. |
| 23:53.53 | AStorm | so the ACKs won't reach the target in time |
| 23:53.58 | AStorm | so your download speed drops |
| 23:53.58 | javispedro | k |
| 23:54.05 | SpeedEvil | Packet loss of >30% or so and you're guaranteed exponential backoff to silly proportions some of the time |
| 23:54.20 | AStorm | SpeedEvil: even a burst of total packet loss |
| 23:54.22 | javispedro | and I agree with that. |
| 23:54.38 | AStorm | and that tends to happen on cell nets |
| 23:55.21 | javispedro | but I don't see why enabling Veno on a host will magically help its download speeds in an apreciable way |
| 23:55.52 | javispedro | so yes. acks will now flow. but there's still 30% packet loss. the receive window will suck., |
| 23:56.20 | AStorm | yes, if you use Reno |
| 23:56.27 | AStorm | if you use Veno, it shouldn't scale the window down |
| 23:56.30 | javispedro | if the other end uses Reno. |
| 23:56.45 | AStorm | true, their windows will scale down |
| 23:56.58 | AStorm | it's still a major improvement |
| 23:57.13 | javispedro | well, I don't have benchmarks to rebate that :) |
| 23:57.14 | AStorm | since as your ACK reaches the destination, their windows will quickly scale up |
| 23:57.23 | AStorm | this paper does have benchmarks. |
| 23:57.30 | zerojay | lardman|home: When I'm home, I leave it connected all the time to my home wifi. When I'm out, I leave it connected to my cellular data. That doesn't mean I wanted some 30MB download to happen though. |
| 23:57.45 | lardman|home | no, fair enough |
| 23:58.08 | lardman|home | C question, I would like to do something like this: if(data[0]=="9"){} |
| 23:58.14 | lardman|home | it won't work, why not? |
| 23:58.25 | javispedro | AStorm: then again, we're talking about noise. ACK packets are small. |
| 23:58.34 | javispedro | (or should be :P) |
| 23:58.35 | lardman|home | well presumably as the "9 is tucked away somewhere as a pointer to some data" |
| 23:58.37 | AStorm | lardman|home: what type is data[0]? |
| 23:58.43 | lardman|home | char* |
| 23:58.48 | lardman|home | it's a string |
| 23:58.50 | AStorm | data[0]? |
| 23:58.54 | lardman|home | "9" |
| 23:58.58 | AStorm | maybe data is a string |
| 23:59.05 | lardman|home | oh, well that's a char then |
| 23:59.05 | AStorm | otherwise, use strcmp |
| 23:59.17 | AStorm | then data[0] == '9' |
| 23:59.23 | AStorm | compare char to char :) |
| 23:59.24 | lardman|home | ah, single quotes |
| 23:59.26 | AStorm | not char to string |
| 23:59.33 | lardman|home | they are different? |
| 23:59.39 | AStorm | sure yeah (in C) |
| 23:59.40 | lardman|home | obviously |
| 23:59.44 | javispedro | (char to int actually :P ) |
| 23:59.55 | lardman|home | yeah, ok, was wondering if it was a quote thing |
| 23:59.56 | lardman|home | thanks |
