| 00:01.33 | javispedro | AStorm, can't see any of that goodness :( it opens a single stream on unsuspend() |
| 00:01.56 | javispedro | then again, this is debian lenny version (aka OLD) |
| 00:02.43 | AStorm | checking 0.9.15 here |
| 00:03.22 | AStorm | yes, it does... I'll better ask devs |
| 00:03.44 | javispedro | AStorm, ta! |
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| 00:07.31 | javispedro | finally found PA svn. |
| 00:07.55 | AStorm | it seems that hardware mixing would be a non-trivial change |
| 00:07.59 | AStorm | but not impossible |
| 00:09.20 | javispedro | as I thought... it would require breaking api compatibility with all sinks. fun stuff. |
| 00:12.10 | Macer | hm |
| 00:12.26 | Macer | damnit. have to go somewhere and don't have enough time to encode the last 2 episodes of eureka |
| 00:12.30 | Macer | maybe 1 |
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| 00:23.39 | AStorm | javispedro: no, bad and bad... and worse |
| 00:23.44 | AStorm | resamplers are one big .c file |
| 00:23.57 | AStorm | they'd need modularization |
| 00:24.44 | javispedro | AStorm: do you know if the make logs in #pa ? |
| 00:24.50 | AStorm | and hardware mixing is supposedly dead and buried |
| 00:24.55 | AStorm | hmm. |
| 00:24.58 | AStorm | I'll check |
| 00:25.22 | javispedro | i'm in the channel :P got pointers from google to a discussion that "happened there" but can't find logs |
| 00:26.01 | AStorm | no logs apparently |
| 00:26.17 | javispedro | well :) |
| 00:26.20 | AStorm | at least, no public ones |
| 00:26.33 | javispedro | don't worry, and thanks |
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| 00:46.00 | Proteous | trying to use OVI maps turn by turn in San Fancisco == teh lose |
| 00:46.28 | Proteous | well, it's great if you want to explore random places and get on and off the freeway a lot |
| 00:47.09 | Proteous | but the directions tend to lag about 30 seconds behind where you actualy are so it sorta sucks |
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| 00:50.36 | ShellEvil | Is it losing GPS position - or is it just failing at routing? |
| 00:50.53 | user_ | hi |
| 00:51.07 | Proteous | the routes were funky, but really it was the lag that made it mostly useless |
| 00:51.36 | SpeedEvil | I assume lots of tall buildings? |
| 00:51.47 | Proteous | actualy, the positioning did pretty good |
| 00:51.51 | user_ | I am left-handed, and want to relocate the browser scrollbar to the left |
| 00:52.06 | Proteous | a few times it thought I took a turn I didn't and recalculated the route |
| 00:52.30 | Proteous | I ended up just going back to the overhead map and just planning my own route |
| 00:52.50 | user_ | editing about:config does not work on my n810 |
| 00:53.23 | user_ | what can I do |
| 00:53.55 | javispedro | i think there's a theme or gtk patch for left scrollbars? |
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| 01:04.50 | AStorm | Proteous: sounds like an app bug then |
| 01:05.08 | AStorm | it forgot to take account of your current position when redoing notifications |
| 01:05.19 | javispedro | AStorm: interesting conversation, truly. I recorded every word :) |
| 01:05.20 | AStorm | (and speed) |
| 01:05.33 | javispedro | (in #pa) |
| 01:08.13 | Proteous | I think part of it is probably the slow CPU on my n97 |
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| 01:09.56 | AStorm | Proteous: unlikely, more like missing caching |
| 01:10.00 | AStorm | (of the directions) |
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| 01:50.26 | Tu13es | are there any better ways to connect to my ssh/screen/irssi session than xterminal? |
| 01:50.31 | Tu13es | from my n800, that is |
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| 01:56.16 | angasule | hmm, does anyone have a link to a video recorded by an n8x0? one that hasn't been reencoded to youtube or anything |
| 01:58.41 | zerojayPC | angasule: well... it looks like complete crap, so... heh.. |
| 01:59.18 | angasule | really? :? |
| 02:00.07 | msh_ | I suppose it works OK as a light level sensor ;) |
| 02:00.55 | zerojayPC | It's a shitty vga camera so... yeah. |
| 02:01.03 | zerojayPC | Not really meant for filming videos. |
| 02:01.11 | angasule | oh |
| 02:01.21 | angasule | I thought it was more like the N900 |
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| 02:04.37 | SpeedEvil | shitty vga cams are under $1 per |
| 02:04.41 | SpeedEvil | which is prolly why |
| 02:06.42 | comhack | I have a weird issue. I setup the mail program that comes with th n810 for gmail but it only retrieves messages up until two months ago. Nothing current? Any ideals? |
| 02:07.05 | comhack | I get juna and july but not agust or setember |
| 02:07.11 | comhack | #june |
| 02:08.38 | SpeedEvil | Nobody likes you anymore? |
| 02:08.53 | SpeedEvil | reminds me of the comedy openoffice won't print on tuesdays bug |
| 02:09.24 | comhack | hehe |
| 02:10.01 | comhack | Yeah I figured it was a conspiracy |
| 02:10.26 | SpeedEvil | Do you have lots of messages sitting on the server? |
| 02:10.33 | SpeedEvil | is stabbing in the dark here. |
| 02:10.44 | zerojayPC | angasule: The front camera is meant for video chat. |
| 02:10.49 | zerojayPC | angasule: Just like the N900. |
| 02:10.58 | zerojayPC | angasule: So they are relatively shitty. |
| 02:11.23 | zerojayPC | comhack: You probably have it set to only download your most recent 200 messages or something like that. |
| 02:11.25 | angasule | does the N900 have two cameras? |
| 02:11.31 | SpeedEvil | angasule: yes |
| 02:11.33 | zerojayPC | angasule: One front, one back. |
| 02:11.35 | SpeedEvil | angasule: one quite nice one |
| 02:11.41 | comhack | zerojayPC: wouldnt that be the newest 200 |
| 02:11.47 | SpeedEvil | Have there been released pictures of the 5mp one? |
| 02:11.49 | comhack | not two mnths ago |
| 02:12.00 | msh_ | SpeedEvil: there are a few on flickr |
| 02:12.02 | angasule | aah, ok, I'm interested in the nice one :) but good to know there is one for chatting |
| 02:12.04 | zerojayPC | comhack: Don't know. I don't know your inbox. :) |
| 02:12.34 | zerojayPC | comhack: Check your account settings. There's an option there to specify which to download. Also, the Gmail site also controls how many messages you receive. |
| 02:13.02 | comhack | yeah I know that |
| 02:13.07 | comhack | all setting perfect |
| 02:13.13 | comhack | thats the weird part |
| 02:13.19 | comhack | using pop gonna try imap |
| 02:13.21 | zerojayPC | There are pics out there from the N900's 5MP camera, but I wouldn't use them to judge image quality right now. It's still a prototype and things can change between now and final. |
| 02:14.20 | SpeedEvil | I doubt that the hardware quaility is changing. |
| 02:14.27 | SpeedEvil | Noise reduction tweaks - maybe |
| 02:14.50 | zerojayPC | It's not a matter of the hardware changing but the image compression and so on. |
| 02:15.14 | zerojayPC | So quality can vary wildly from now until release. |
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| 02:51.02 | esaym153 | linux is a good program |
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| 02:55.01 | Sryche | hi, how can I reinstall the Maemo on my N800? |
| 02:55.20 | zerojayPC | You'll want to reflash the OS. |
| 02:55.59 | zerojayPC | http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware |
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| 02:57.42 | Sryche | zerojayPC: thanks! |
| 02:58.34 | Sryche | well, i'm having some problems to remove the battery :| |
| 02:58.52 | Sryche | any tips? |
| 02:58.52 | Sryche | XD |
| 03:00.53 | Sryche | is there some kind of lock? |
| 03:00.53 | Sryche | |: |
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| 03:13.55 | esaym153 | Sryche: have you gotten the back cover off |
| 03:13.56 | esaym153 | ? |
| 03:14.08 | esaym153 | the battery should just slip out |
| 03:14.14 | esaym153 | get a knife of something |
| 03:14.52 | zerojayPC | There's a latch. |
| 03:14.54 | esaym153 | or* |
| 03:15.09 | zerojayPC | You need to have the stand open to get to it. |
| 03:15.21 | zerojayPC | Then you can just move the latch over and the back cover comes off. |
| 03:15.33 | zerojayPC | Battery should come out extremely easily. |
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| 03:17.29 | MaceN8x0 | ugh |
| 03:17.44 | MaceN8x0 | had to go out and do dumb shit again |
| 03:17.47 | MaceN8x0 | i hate people |
| 03:18.14 | MaceN8x0 | a person in general is ok, but people in general are idiots |
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| 05:22.26 | Stskeeps | morn |
| 05:22.35 | RST38h | heya sts |
| 05:22.53 | thux | morning |
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| 05:34.04 | Stskeeps | morning slonopotamus_ |
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| 05:34.30 | slonopotamus_ | Stskeeps, moo |
| 05:34.47 | Stskeeps | how's the various projects with gentoo ging? |
| 05:34.49 | Stskeeps | oing |
| 05:37.21 | slonopotamus_ | Stskeeps, not bad :) hacking on emerge performance mostly, libcal is only missing erasing stuff |
| 05:37.54 | MaceN8x0 | damn i love eureka |
| 05:37.54 | MaceN8x0 | heh |
| 05:39.10 | MaceN8x0 | they had a "flashback" show kinda this last episode and it made me want to watch it all again |
| 05:45.09 | Sho_ | slonopotamus_: you work on portage? |
| 05:45.47 | Sho_ | MaceN8x0: I've been meaning to give Eureka a second chance ... the pilot didn't grip me back then |
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| 05:47.13 | MaceN8x0 | Sho_, you have to get 3 episodes into a show to truly judge |
| 05:47.36 | MaceN8x0 | if it doesn't catch you by the 3rd or 4th , then it sucks |
| 05:47.56 | MaceN8x0 | character relationship and development takes a while |
| 05:48.02 | GeneralAntilles | Sho_, worth a second look. |
| 05:48.09 | GeneralAntilles | Little hoaky, little campy, but fun |
| 05:48.10 | MaceN8x0 | eureka is great tho heh |
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| 05:48.20 | MaceN8x0 | it has a good balance to it |
| 05:48.26 | slonopotamus_ | Sho_, contributing performance-wise patches |
| 05:48.40 | Sho_ | MaceN8x0: it was a busy a season with many new shows contending for attention heh :) |
| 05:48.44 | johnx | mornin' |
| 05:49.07 | Stskeeps | morning johnx |
| 05:49.07 | MaceN8x0 | Sho_, yeh, tell that to Firefly |
| 05:49.08 | MaceN8x0 | ;) |
| 05:49.38 | Sho_ | that one i actually did watch |
| 05:49.54 | MaceN8x0 | Castle is better than i thought it would be |
| 05:50.02 | MaceN8x0 | more of a comedy than anything else |
| 05:50.29 | Sho_ | castle is still on my todo |
| 05:50.45 | Sho_ | right now I only have time for defying gravity |
| 05:50.57 | MaceN8x0 | defying gravity? |
| 05:50.59 | MaceN8x0 | :) |
| 05:51.07 | Sho_ | a space-based show on ABC |
| 05:51.23 | MaceN8x0 | docmentary type? |
| 05:51.34 | MaceN8x0 | or science fiction type? |
| 05:51.51 | Sho_ | no, though it tries to be realistic |
| 05:52.04 | Sho_ | it's not really a must see, but as a space nut you have to take what you can get |
| 05:52.16 | MaceN8x0 | haha |
| 05:52.22 | MaceN8x0 | so more like a drama? |
| 05:52.28 | Sho_ | it's set around 2050, with 8 astronauts on a mission to tour the solar system |
| 05:52.41 | MaceN8x0 | oh |
| 05:52.54 | MaceN8x0 | more science fiction then |
| 05:53.06 | MaceN8x0 | hm, i'll check it out |
| 05:53.08 | Sho_ | and an overarching mystery plot about an apparently sentient mystery device they have on board that seems to have been dug up during a mars mission 10 years prior |
| 05:53.24 | SpeedEvil | Sho_: does the mystery device have a military mode? |
| 05:53.34 | MaceN8x0 | reminds me of 2001 and 2010 |
| 05:53.51 | MaceN8x0 | nice to see back then they thought we would be on manned missions to Jupiter |
| 05:53.57 | Sho_ | at to that a dose of relationship/romance plots. sort of grey's anatomy in space. |
| 05:54.08 | MaceN8x0 | 2010 is next year |
| 05:54.09 | Sho_ | nice sfx though, done by the same studio that does them for heroes. |
| 05:54.12 | MaceN8x0 | what happened? |
| 05:54.14 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: well - a lot of programs got cancelled. |
| 05:54.23 | MaceN8x0 | hahaha |
| 05:54.29 | Sho_ | SpeedEvil: no military dude so far |
| 05:54.32 | Sho_ | err |
| 05:54.35 | Sho_ | -dude +mode |
| 05:54.49 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: for example - there was - just after apollo - a orion test vehicle. |
| 05:55.00 | MaceN8x0 | Sho_, space sound effects? |
| 05:55.15 | MaceN8x0 | like loud rocket engines in space vaccum? |
| 05:55.15 | MaceN8x0 | heh |
| 05:55.19 | Sho_ | MaceN8x0: hm, good question ... no "swoooowsh" on flybys i think |
| 05:55.26 | Sho_ | *swoooosh |
| 05:55.32 | MaceN8x0 | firefly was silent |
| 05:55.37 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: you take nuclear bombs, and light them off under a curved plate. Plate moves sharply away from the bomb, shock absorber absorbs the blast, spacecraft is going 10-20m/s faster |
| 05:55.38 | Sho_ | and shakeycam, yeah |
| 05:55.44 | MaceN8x0 | which was awesome |
| 05:55.56 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: but got cancelled. |
| 05:56.12 | MaceN8x0 | SpeedEvil, uhm. ok? where did that come from? |
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| 05:56.40 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: I was attempting to answer why we hadn't done 2010 in reality. |
| 05:56.51 | SpeedEvil | needs sleep. |
| 05:57.25 | MaceN8x0 | normal fuel won't get there? |
| 05:57.45 | Myrtti | GOOD MORNING INTERTUBES! |
| 05:57.52 | Myrtti | today is a *WONDERFUL* day! |
| 05:57.54 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: it's an exponential thing |
| 05:57.55 | Stskeeps | morning myrtti |
| 05:58.05 | MaceN8x0 | i always thought it was the lack of the communist war machine and the ending of the cold war |
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| 05:58.28 | MaceN8x0 | geopolitical competition drove space travel for decades |
| 05:58.36 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: A fuel that's twice as good doesn't get you going twice as fast - it's more like well over 4 times. |
| 05:59.26 | MaceN8x0 | unless the shuttle carrying the plutonium blows up and scatters it all over the world |
| 05:59.35 | MaceN8x0 | :) |
| 05:59.49 | SpeedEvil | MaceN8x0: that - and the ICBM derived launchers are horribly expensive by design. The fuel for the shuttle costs ~300k - for the liquid - yet a shuttle launch - a large slice of a billion. |
| 06:00.23 | SpeedEvil | _much_ effort is put into weight reduction - when actually spending 3m on liquid fuel isn't an issue. |
| 06:00.33 | SpeedEvil | Anyway - I should not be on IRC at 7AM |
| 06:00.41 | MaceN8x0 | well, find a way to reverse gravity wells ;) |
| 06:00.59 | SpeedEvil | Fairy dust, and sunbeams trapped in cucumbers. |
| 06:01.01 | SpeedEvil | Night |
| 06:01.02 | MaceN8x0 | use space as a spring |
| 06:01.08 | MaceN8x0 | hahahaha |
| 06:01.15 | MaceN8x0 | tgouche |
| 06:01.18 | MaceN8x0 | touche too |
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| 06:06.22 | Myrtti | I think I might need to reflash my N800 |
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| 06:22.16 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
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| 06:23.23 | aSIMULAtor | morning |
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| 06:51.56 | tigert | mrong |
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| 07:03.33 | benson | morning |
| 07:04.39 | mavhc | if being mrong is wrong then I don't want to be mrite |
| 07:06.49 | *** join/#maemo glass (n=glass@ip242.otanner5.opintanner.fi) |
| 07:07.25 | *** join/#maemo carboncopy (n=carbonco@85.0.111.218.kmr02-home.tm.net.my) |
| 07:07.41 | carboncopy | Hi everybody, am back, with another "issue" |
| 07:08.20 | carboncopy | am looking for a bluetooth 3G(HSDPA) modem to be used with N8*0 |
| 07:10.58 | *** join/#maemo bergie_ (n=bergie@a88-115-3-122.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 07:11.09 | johnx | which provider are you with? |
| 07:11.14 | RST38h | moo all |
| 07:11.27 | RST38h | ehlo johnx |
| 07:11.35 | johnx | and a fine morning to you RST38h |
| 07:12.19 | carboncopy | i don't want a phone, as I already have a phone, and the data package will be separate from the phone |
| 07:14.26 | johnx | carboncopy, any reason not to just tether to a phone? |
| 07:14.57 | Stskeeps | yeah, a cheap 3g one |
| 07:17.05 | *** join/#maemo vigneswari (n=vigneswa@203.129.255.188) |
| 07:19.15 | RST38h | carboncopy: you do understand how awkward your n8*0 will look with that modem stuck in? |
| 07:20.19 | Stskeeps | bluetooth.. |
| 07:20.31 | RST38h | do 3G modems come with bt? |
| 07:20.44 | RST38h | I thought they were stricly USB devices? |
| 07:20.57 | johnx | closest thing I can think of is a 3G->WiFi portable access point |
| 07:22.00 | till- | is bt fast enough for 3g? |
| 07:22.07 | Myrtti | http://thereallymobileproject.com/2009/09/novatel-mifi-2352-portable-wifi-hotspot-first-look/ |
| 07:22.18 | till- | afaik bt has ~ 1mbit, 3g up to 10mbit |
| 07:22.24 | johnx | Myrtti, yup, exactly what I was thinking |
| 07:22.35 | RST38h | Kinda pointless here, no 3G |
| 07:22.45 | RST38h | sheds a tear |
| 07:23.09 | till- | 3g data is to expensive |
| 07:23.25 | Myrtti | cheaper than soap ;- |
| 07:23.26 | Myrtti | ) |
| 07:23.29 | till- | my opinion :) |
| 07:23.30 | RST38h | Enjoy: http://rixstep.com/1/1/20070724,00.shtml |
| 07:23.48 | till- | and i've got wifi coverage on my campus, my home and my friends |
| 07:23.59 | RST38h | Since when price became an opinion? |
| 07:24.42 | till- | if you decide wheter you will use 3g or not |
| 07:24.48 | till- | i would say |
| 07:25.41 | johnx | RST38h, too expensive for the value (cost/benefit analysis) is a personal choice |
| 07:25.53 | *** join/#maemo eocanha (n=eocanha@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 07:25.54 | RST38h | johnx: yea, but it is separate |
| 07:26.21 | RST38h | price is just a number, published and thus known, can't call it "opinion" =) |
| 07:26.54 | johnx | RST38h, expensive is a value judgment |
| 07:27.14 | till- | i didn't say a price, just its to expensive right now :) |
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| 07:50.11 | tigert | the moment you have flatrate 3g |
| 07:50.21 | tigert | is the moment you dont care much about wifi |
| 07:50.32 | tigert | because you can keep your ssh and such running all the time |
| 07:52.35 | suihkulokki | well, in some 3rd world countries and USA the 3g coverage is spotty, especially indoors |
| 07:53.44 | RST38h | can keep his ssh running all the time over egprs |
| 07:53.54 | RST38h | ssh isn't really a problem, web is |
| 07:54.16 | till- | don't need ssh running all the time |
| 07:55.50 | *** join/#maemo sergio (n=sergio@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 07:58.43 | Proteous | keeps ssh running all the time over edge |
| 08:01.47 | tigert | suihkulokki: yeah |
| 08:02.08 | tigert | does ssh + screen all the time |
| 08:02.18 | tigert | its the only sensible way to run irc in my opinion :) |
| 08:02.34 | tigert | RST38h: why is web the problem? |
| 08:02.52 | RST38h | tigert: too much data to transfer over egprs |
| 08:02.57 | RST38h | takes time |
| 08:02.57 | tigert | ah |
| 08:03.22 | tigert | hdspa or whatever it is, |
| 08:03.36 | tigert | its getting fast enough that I dont care about how fast it is |
| 08:03.39 | tigert | its fast enough |
| 08:03.47 | RST38h | no hsdpa, no umts here |
| 08:04.08 | timeless_mbp | hey |
| 08:04.13 | timeless_mbp | how do i try to vote for something? |
| 08:04.15 | RST38h | Military is saying 2.1GHz band interferes with their missile defense systems |
| 08:04.15 | timeless_mbp | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/liqtorch/0.1.5 |
| 08:04.18 | timeless_mbp | i want to promote that |
| 08:04.20 | *** join/#maemo lbt (n=david@78.32.229.233) |
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| 08:07.20 | timeless_mbp | pokes stemosco |
| 08:07.22 | timeless_mbp | pokes Stskeeps |
| 08:07.26 | *** join/#maemo pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0C0BA.access.telenet.be) |
| 08:07.26 | timeless_mbp | randomly pokes people |
| 08:07.37 | timeless_mbp | tigert: remind me to whack someone who worked on clock :( |
| 08:08.49 | tigert | timeless_mbp: found another crazy cornercase? :) |
| 08:09.26 | timeless_mbp | tigert: absolutely improper use of strings |
| 08:09.33 | timeless_mbp | open clock |
| 08:09.40 | timeless_mbp | look at the "world clock" labels |
| 08:09.46 | timeless_mbp | note the one that lists "GMT" ... |
| 08:09.49 | *** join/#maemo bergie_ (n=bergie@192.100.124.156) |
| 08:09.49 | *** join/#maemo AD-N770 (n=jep@o.bcn.fluendo.net) |
| 08:09.50 | timeless_mbp | now tap it |
| 08:10.04 | timeless_mbp | note a different description for the first item under <add> |
| 08:10.12 | timeless_mbp | if you don't have any additional items, add one |
| 08:10.15 | timeless_mbp | then tap that item |
| 08:10.27 | timeless_mbp | now look for the line where it references your time zone |
| 08:10.30 | tigert | I never use the clock anyway |
| 08:10.38 | timeless_mbp | you've met two strings, one that uses GMT and one that doesn't |
| 08:10.41 | tigert | file a bug :) |
| 08:10.44 | timeless_mbp | yeah yeah |
| 08:10.46 | timeless_mbp | i'm sick |
| 08:11.00 | tigert | it doesnt seem to stop you from ircing :) |
| 08:11.09 | timeless_mbp | i actually unlocked my bugzilla account before i left work yesterday just so i could file this bug |
| 08:11.11 | Stskeeps | being sick and ircing is compatible :P |
| 08:11.21 | timeless_mbp | sips tea |
| 08:11.21 | *** join/#maemo vladovg (n=vladooo@91.139.148.54) |
| 08:11.37 | vladovg | hi |
| 08:11.38 | vladovg | :) |
| 08:11.54 | vladovg | and good morning |
| 08:13.15 | lbt | morning all (and vladovg) |
| 08:13.33 | timeless_mbp | ooh |
| 08:13.36 | timeless_mbp | madbomber has a product |
| 08:14.43 | carboncopy | sorry, was out of office |
| 08:14.43 | carboncopy | am looking through the discussion now |
| 08:14.46 | carboncopy | http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/13/huawei-announces-i-mo-hspa-modem-with-wifi/ |
| 08:21.09 | *** join/#maemo dneary (n=dneary@ALyon-152-1-132-182.w86-209.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 08:24.18 | timeless_mbp | help |
| 08:24.22 | timeless_mbp | madbomber is unhappy |
| 08:24.29 | timeless_mbp | but it doesn't know it |
| 08:24.37 | timeless_mbp | and i can't get apt/dpkg/ham to tell me |
| 08:26.37 | *** join/#maemo gunni_ (n=quassel@xdsl-84-44-235-44.netcologne.de) |
| 08:29.20 | *** join/#maemo florian_kc (n=fuchs@port-217-146-132-69.static.qsc.de) |
| 08:33.08 | timeless_mbp | wah |
| 08:33.21 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: "Send Failed, please try again." [Close] |
| 08:33.24 | timeless_mbp | onedotzero ... |
| 08:33.46 | *** join/#maemo femorandeira (n=Felipe@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
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| 08:34.12 | lcuk | ahhh timeless you require a big projector on the side of the BFP Southbank |
| 08:34.17 | lcuk | sorry, its a dependency# |
| 08:34.19 | lcuk | :D |
| 08:34.22 | timeless_mbp | hrm |
| 08:34.29 | timeless_mbp | which reminds me |
| 08:34.41 | *** join/#maemo dottedmag (n=dottedma@altlinux/developer/dottedmag) |
| 08:34.47 | timeless_mbp | i need to figure out if the dvr i have has composite out or composite in |
| 08:34.57 | timeless_mbp | my lcd doesn't have composite in :( |
| 08:35.25 | florian | hi all |
| 08:36.15 | timeless_mbp | wonders who owns findmine |
| 08:37.17 | lcuk | timeless, "testmsg" |
| 08:37.32 | timeless_mbp | ? |
| 08:37.37 | lcuk | onedotzero |
| 08:37.46 | lcuk | gets you through without the checks |
| 08:38.29 | *** join/#maemo glass_ (n=glass@ip242.otanner5.opintanner.fi) |
| 08:38.36 | RST38h | Why would agps-ui install a daemon listening on port 7275? |
| 08:39.04 | timeless_mbp | more fun |
| 08:39.18 | RST38h | internet says it is "OMA UserPlane Location" |
| 08:39.46 | *** join/#maemo AltC (n=AltC@84.92.70.37) |
| 08:40.43 | Corsac | woot, n900 is now 619e on expansys.fr |
| 08:40.55 | RST38h | Is it going up or down? |
| 08:41.59 | Corsac | down |
| 08:42.06 | RST38h | goooooooooooood |
| 08:42.11 | Jaffa | lcuk: Gah, produce presentation material for onedotzero today - after I found out I'm being roped in yesterday. |
| 08:42.13 | Corsac | it made 750 → 650 -> 620 |
| 08:42.14 | Jaffa | Not fun. |
| 08:42.23 | lcuk | jaffa lol |
| 08:42.28 | Corsac | but anyways it was cheaper in it and de afair |
| 08:42.30 | lcuk | its ok, at least you can get to london |
| 08:42.33 | Corsac | like 600 since the beginning |
| 08:42.37 | lcuk | repeated questions have so far been fruitless |
| 08:42.42 | *** join/#maemo hannesw (n=hannes@chello062178166147.12.14.vie.surfer.at) |
| 08:42.49 | lcuk | and im meant to be there |
| 08:42.50 | lcuk | today |
| 08:43.07 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 08:43.13 | timeless_mbp | that's pretty bad |
| 08:43.22 | lcuk | nods |
| 08:43.23 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: can't you take a train? |
| 08:43.32 | lcuk | no job, no money |
| 08:43.37 | Jaffa | lcuk: Get on the Virgin train from Manchester Piccadilly; travel first class and charge 'em back. |
| 08:43.43 | Jaffa | Should only be about 150ukp |
| 08:43.43 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: how much is the train? |
| 08:43.50 | timeless_mbp | ukp? |
| 08:44.00 | Corsac | £ |
| 08:44.19 | timeless_mbp | someone didn't like GBP and had to be politically correct? |
| 08:44.27 | lcuk | i dunno but i have been told by the one with purse strings i am on extremely limited budget |
| 08:44.31 | *** join/#maemo beavis (n=mk@p4FC3326F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:44.32 | Jaffa | GBP is wrong (although right) |
| 08:44.36 | Jaffa | lcuk: doh |
| 08:45.02 | Jaffa | Cos Great Britain is a geological island; UK is a political country |
| 08:45.21 | timeless_mbp | and it's used in Belfast? |
| 08:45.31 | timeless_mbp | please keep in mind that the n900 doesn't think Belfast is in UK |
| 08:45.40 | timeless_mbp | we're geographically challenged here |
| 08:46.51 | *** part/#maemo bigbrovar (n=bigbrova@83.229.6.19) |
| 08:49.19 | Jaffa | timeless_mbp: Belfast is in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Belfast's currency is GBP. |
| 08:49.24 | *** join/#maemo plastun (n=plastun@80.94.171.101) |
| 08:49.32 | Jaffa | timeless_mbp: Dublin is in the Republic of Ireland and uses EUR |
| 08:49.44 | timeless_mbp | Jaffa: as i said, we're geographically challenged here |
| 08:49.49 | timeless_mbp | we don't think Belfast is in UK :) |
| 08:49.56 | timeless_mbp | find an n900 and see for yourself :) |
| 08:50.00 | Jaffa | FFS |
| 08:50.29 | timeless_mbp | we also decided to highlight a place called Guam in Missouri and say it was in time zone +10 |
| 08:50.37 | timeless_mbp | which is typical of pacific island nations :) |
| 08:50.47 | timeless_mbp | you like having islands in the continental us, right? |
| 08:51.17 | carboncopy | looks like this is what am looking for :) http://www.huawei.com/mobileweb/en/news/view.do?id=1000&cid=61&type=0 |
| 08:51.17 | carboncopy | now, to convince my employer I need it for my work :D |
| 08:52.03 | Corsac | timeless_mbp: are those easter eggs? :) |
| 08:52.18 | timeless_mbp | Corsac: depends on when you like finding your easter eggs |
| 08:52.31 | timeless_mbp | i think there's something about rotten easter eggs that you find months later |
| 08:52.42 | plastun | hello! |
| 08:52.50 | Corsac | they usually don't smell that good |
| 08:52.53 | plastun | When the Maemo summit 2009 results will be published? |
| 08:54.44 | timeless_mbp | plastun: eh? |
| 08:54.47 | timeless_mbp | Corsac: so i've heard |
| 08:54.53 | timeless_mbp | thankfully we don't deal w/ easter eggs |
| 08:55.17 | timeless_mbp | instead, i'm supposed to clean my apt of crumbs in time for the event that was responsible for that schism |
| 08:55.28 | timeless_mbp | s/clean/cleanse/ |
| 08:55.42 | timeless_mbp | Jaffa: how do you like them eggs? |
| 08:55.45 | plastun | I mean sponsorship results |
| 08:55.48 | *** join/#maemo tbf (n=mathias@86.56.53.13) |
| 08:55.55 | timeless_mbp | in case people are curious, there really is a Guam, MO |
| 08:56.07 | timeless_mbp | it's an unincorporated town in a county whose population is <30k |
| 08:56.24 | Corsac | but still not in pacific |
| 08:56.31 | timeless_mbp | we called the US census bureau to check :) |
| 08:56.44 | timeless_mbp | Corsac: yeah, i'm pretty sure the time zone there isn't +10 |
| 08:58.39 | Corsac | how many potential n900 users is there in Guam, MO? |
| 08:59.21 | RST38h | <30k |
| 09:00.01 | *** join/#maemo lardman (n=vircuser@78.145.165.218) |
| 09:00.10 | lardman | morning |
| 09:00.34 | lardman | anyone know about Python bindings for C code? |
| 09:00.47 | timeless_mbp | Corsac: based on population, i'd say 0 |
| 09:00.59 | *** join/#maemo wazd_n800 (n=wazd@83.149.10.216) |
| 09:01.01 | timeless_mbp | however i could imagine someone who owns or looks at an n900 searching for guam |
| 09:01.01 | jrocha | lardman, you mean Hildon bindings for Python? |
| 09:01.09 | timeless_mbp | and being confused when they find it in the continental us |
| 09:01.43 | wazd_n800 | 'lo all) |
| 09:01.48 | lardman | I've got a buffer, which I'm told is a string, and want to pass it to my C code. I guess the PyArg_ParseTuple format should be either s or S, but does s assume my buffer will contain no null chars? |
| 09:02.05 | RST38h | heya wazd |
| 09:02.05 | lardman | jrocha: no, I want to wrap some C code to call it from Python |
| 09:03.39 | jrocha | lardman, don't know much about that, the opposite is more usual I guess, nonetheless, check this out: http://www.cs.tut.fi/~ask/cinpy/ |
| 09:04.01 | lardman | or should I just use e.g. SWIG and not try to work out how to do it by hand? |
| 09:04.49 | lardman | Thanks for that, I think I'd be better implementing a Python function that wraps the C though as the C is pretty big |
| 09:06.00 | *** join/#maemo zap_ (n=zap@213.59.86.89) |
| 09:06.25 | lardman | mm, SWIG looks easy enough |
| 09:07.26 | RST38h | lardman, what are you doing in python anyway? |
| 09:07.35 | lardman | barcode decoder UI |
| 09:07.39 | RST38h | ah! |
| 09:07.46 | lardman | but the guts are written in C |
| 09:08.21 | RST38h | finally, a good use for the camera |
| 09:08.30 | lardman | yeah :) |
| 09:08.36 | lardman | actually works too, which is nice |
| 09:08.51 | thp | lardman: depending on how much data need to be passed between frontend/backend, separate processes and pipes might be an option |
| 09:08.55 | lardman | though the 1D decoder spits out too much rubbish, QR and Datamatrix work though |
| 09:09.32 | lardman | thp: it shouldn't be too much, just single image frames of ~320 x 240 |
| 09:09.46 | RST38h | whoever got moderation rights at tmp, the spammer guy is at it again |
| 09:09.50 | lardman | I don't want ipc overhead either really |
| 09:10.05 | lardman | RST38h: TMO? linky? |
| 09:10.13 | RST38h | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=323600#post323600 |
| 09:10.24 | RST38h | but he is carpet bombing, so there is more |
| 09:10.44 | lardman | he's gine |
| 09:10.46 | lardman | gone |
| 09:10.49 | RST38h | =) |
| 09:11.02 | thp | lardman: http://docs.python.org/extending/index.html is a good starting point |
| 09:11.40 | lardman | thp: my confusion is really that the camera output on the Python side is said to reside in a string, which is fine, but the import function looks for a null terminated string |
| 09:11.53 | lardman | but perhaps that's only on the way back into Python, rather than the way in? |
| 09:12.23 | lardman | i.e. my buffer of camera data may contain null chars when being passed from Python to C |
| 09:12.27 | *** join/#maemo _berto_ (n=berto@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 09:13.10 | thp | should be no problem, as long as you know the size of the buffer |
| 09:13.13 | lardman | yep |
| 09:13.31 | lardman | also, what's the difference between a char array string and a string object? |
| 09:14.41 | *** join/#maemo jsears (n=jsears@217.155.42.43) |
| 09:14.43 | lardman | as in how can I tell which one has been created in Python? |
| 09:15.55 | jrocha | lardman, why can't you build the UI in C? |
| 09:16.08 | lardman | I can, but Python GTK is much nicer than C |
| 09:16.13 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: no one in their right mind builds a ui in c |
| 09:16.18 | thp | lardman: http://docs.python.org/c-api/string.html#PyString_AsStringAndSize maybe this is the function you are searching for? |
| 09:16.56 | lardman | thanks thp |
| 09:16.57 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, what??? |
| 09:17.09 | jrocha | I've written UIs in C and in Python |
| 09:17.20 | lardman | I should also add that sqlite is much nicer in Python than C too |
| 09:17.21 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: and in the former cases, you weren't in your right mind |
| 09:17.25 | thp | and PyString_Check can be used on a PyObject* to check if its a python string |
| 09:17.31 | timeless_mbp | that doesn't imply you were in your right mind for the latter case |
| 09:17.47 | lardman | jrocha: it's a good point though |
| 09:17.47 | jrocha | of course I prefer Python but C seems to be a better choice in this case since you already have something that looks extensive, written in C |
| 09:18.24 | lardman | jrocha: I switched to Python because the C code was buggy (my own fault), and have been able to track down my bugs now, so I could pretty easily switch back to C and correct the bugs |
| 09:18.42 | lardman | jrocha: well the ui and decoders are separate |
| 09:18.49 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, I've actually started with Python and I like both and don't think that one is out of his mind just because of using one language |
| 09:19.03 | lardman | though my UI code was written in C and I ported it to Python |
| 09:19.15 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: *shrug* |
| 09:19.21 | timeless_mbp | you're welcome to share sample ui code |
| 09:19.35 | timeless_mbp | however, i have a good record of tearing C code to shreds |
| 09:19.42 | timeless_mbp | so you're warned not to :) |
| 09:19.43 | lardman | :) |
| 09:19.50 | timeless_mbp | hubris is the better part of valor (?) |
| 09:19.55 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, I've ported the EOG to Maemo, you can check it |
| 09:20.04 | timeless_mbp | is it in extras? |
| 09:20.06 | lardman | once I get the 1D decoder working decently I'll probably need some help with infernal treeviews :) |
| 09:20.08 | jrocha | not yet |
| 09:20.17 | timeless_mbp | how do i install it then? |
| 09:20.19 | jrocha | but you can get it at: git.igalia.com |
| 09:21.03 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, criticizing code is easy, writing code is a bit harder |
| 09:21.24 | timeless_mbp | i write code too |
| 09:21.29 | timeless_mbp | i just try to avoid doing it :) |
| 09:21.30 | jrocha | I'm gonna make a deb and try to have it on extras too |
| 09:21.40 | _berto_ | criticizing is always easier than doing things :p |
| 09:21.49 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, then I'm sorry for you :) |
| 09:21.56 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: why? |
| 09:22.05 | timeless_mbp | a wise coder writes as few lines of code as possible |
| 09:22.10 | timeless_mbp | the fewer lines, the fewer bugs :) |
| 09:22.28 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, you said you avoid doing code.. |
| 09:22.45 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, that (about # lines of code) is wrong |
| 09:22.47 | *** join/#maemo Free_maN (n=Free_maN@217.174.199.201) |
| 09:22.50 | timeless_mbp | not that much, i just pick my battles |
| 09:23.13 | lcuk | timeless_mbp, i mustnt be in my right mind either |
| 09:23.17 | lcuk | liqbase is written in c |
| 09:23.18 | timeless_mbp | anyway, if you only ported eog, what would i read? |
| 09:23.30 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: liqbase is different |
| 09:23.34 | lcuk | howso? |
| 09:23.35 | timeless_mbp | you built your own toolkit |
| 09:23.51 | timeless_mbp | that by definition means you're out of your mind :) |
| 09:23.51 | lcuk | its a full gui with objects and events and hooks and stuff |
| 09:23.52 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, you'd read all the fremantle code |
| 09:23.56 | lcuk | hahaha |
| 09:24.11 | jrocha | anyway guys, gotta go back to writing code |
| 09:24.16 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: i've probably skimmed through more maemo internal code than most people @nokia |
| 09:24.35 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, good for you :) |
| 09:24.38 | timeless_mbp | no |
| 09:24.41 | timeless_mbp | bad for my sanity |
| 09:24.43 | timeless_mbp | definitely bad |
| 09:24.50 | lcuk | you dont just skim it though - you find the pathways to fail exceedingly well! |
| 09:25.00 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: yeah well... that too |
| 09:25.21 | timeless_mbp | which reminds me, someday you should point me to your sources |
| 09:25.27 | timeless_mbp | lemme know when you want a review :) |
| 09:25.43 | *** join/#maemo sergio (n=sergio@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 09:25.45 | lcuk | anytime |
| 09:25.54 | lcuk | http://github.com/lcuk |
| 09:26.00 | lcuk | but only if you are willing to hop in and help |
| 09:26.09 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.09 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.09 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.09 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.10 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.10 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.12 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:26.17 | timeless_mbp | coughs |
| 09:26.19 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 09:26.20 | Myrtti | smacks timeless_mbp |
| 09:26.33 | lcuk | hi Myrtti how you feelin today? |
| 09:26.35 | timeless_mbp | "hi, we don't care about how localization should work, so we did something incredibly stupid but tried to justify it" |
| 09:26.52 | Myrtti | lcuk: better every day :-) |
| 09:27.05 | lcuk | :) good |
| 09:27.25 | lcuk | you coming to the summit? |
| 09:27.31 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: what kind of indentation algorithm are you using? |
| 09:27.33 | timeless_mbp | http://github.com/lcuk/libliqbase/blob/a07d844b2364784ddf2de55267280a8299e1d44a/src/filebuf.c |
| 09:27.38 | timeless_mbp | renders really strangely |
| 09:27.41 | Myrtti | nah, I'll be attending a wedding in Littlehampton then |
| 09:28.14 | lcuk | timeless, yeah not a very tidy one, my editor eats things at different times |
| 09:28.21 | *** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@54.200.49.122-static.velocitynet.com.au) |
| 09:28.28 | lcuk | and for a while had its own thought about how many spaces made a tab |
| 09:28.40 | lcuk | boooooo |
| 09:28.51 | timeless_mbp | might i suggest you find something to reformat your code? |
| 09:28.51 | lcuk | sack the wedding off and come anywya |
| 09:28.54 | timeless_mbp | *anything* |
| 09:29.13 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@192.100.124.156) |
| 09:29.21 | Myrtti | lcuk: and miss an opportunity to "Meet the Extended Family"? nah... ;-) |
| 09:29.28 | lcuk | timeless, you could suggest many things whether i get round to them is another matter |
| 09:29.37 | lcuk | i might infact have to drop the whole thing very soon |
| 09:29.45 | lcuk | heh |
| 09:29.52 | timeless_mbp | while((charwidth)>3) |
| 09:29.58 | timeless_mbp | why the extra parens? :) |
| 09:30.33 | lcuk | it needed a hug |
| 09:30.43 | jrocha | lcuk, LOL! |
| 09:30.57 | lcuk | normally when things like that happen its been sat at ((charwidth-1)>3) |
| 09:31.05 | lcuk | and ive removed the -1 |
| 09:31.11 | timeless_mbp | in this case i ithink it was -=4 |
| 09:31.21 | jrocha | that had happened to me |
| 09:31.30 | lcuk | i havent modified that file since i wrote it tho i dont think |
| 09:31.31 | timeless_mbp | imgdata = &imgdata[-x]; |
| 09:31.32 | timeless_mbp | gross |
| 09:32.20 | lcuk | that was my first bit of code i wrote for the original book reader :$ |
| 09:32.26 | lcuk | first time in c in over 10 years :) |
| 09:32.43 | lcuk | ahh you are on other stuff lol |
| 09:34.54 | timeless_mbp | http://github.com/lcuk/libliqbase/blob/a07d844b2364784ddf2de55267280a8299e1d44a/src/liqapp.c#L80 |
| 09:35.02 | timeless_mbp | your error handling there is unfortuate |
| 09:35.06 | timeless_mbp | s/ua/una/ |
| 09:35.19 | timeless_mbp | when getcwd fails, it fills buf with the error string |
| 09:35.27 | timeless_mbp | which means that 86 will do something _funny_ |
| 09:35.55 | timeless_mbp | 91/97 don't handle failure :) |
| 09:37.23 | lcuk | nods |
| 09:37.25 | lcuk | thanks |
| 09:37.38 | *** join/#maemo bergie_ (n=bergie@192.100.124.156) |
| 09:37.46 | lcuk | damn, andre isnt here |
| 09:37.56 | lcuk | could do with somewhere to make a proper note about these |
| 09:38.06 | lcuk | im slammed with other stuff so wont change it right now |
| 09:38.52 | lcuk | mails himself |
| 09:39.21 | timeless_mbp | your spelling of "it's" as "its" in |
| 09:39.21 | timeless_mbp | http://github.com/lcuk/libliqbase/blob/a07d844b2364784ddf2de55267280a8299e1d44a/src/liqapp.c#L385 |
| 09:39.24 | timeless_mbp | is annoying :) |
| 09:39.39 | lcuk | its a comment |
| 09:39.43 | lcuk | ;) |
| 09:39.44 | RST38h | A disturbing probe into the potential for apparently innocent biscuits' ability to do harm has revealed that an astounding 25 million Brits have been injured while indulging in some light coffee/tea break snack action, with 500 victims requiring hospital treatment. |
| 09:40.21 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: "int" is 32bits, right? |
| 09:40.31 | lcuk | think so |
| 09:40.38 | timeless_mbp | int liqapp_filesize(char *filename) |
| 09:40.51 | timeless_mbp | won't work very well when you encounter an ISO on the 30GB file system of an n900 :) |
| 09:42.03 | timeless_mbp | char *liqapp_filename_walkoverpath(char *filename) |
| 09:42.10 | timeless_mbp | will do something less than helpful for "/tmp/" |
| 09:42.49 | timeless_mbp | (possibly intentional, but the comment should explain that) |
| 09:43.42 | timeless_mbp | int liqapp_file_copy (char * from, char * to, int allowoverwrite) |
| 09:43.52 | timeless_mbp | coverity will probably complain about the ability to lose a symlink race |
| 09:43.56 | timeless_mbp | doesn't care |
| 09:43.59 | lcuk | has never been used |
| 09:44.06 | lcuk | was going to but abandoned |
| 09:44.17 | lcuk | the walkoverpath is used with files only |
| 09:44.28 | lcuk | ie, i already know its a filename and not a dir |
| 09:44.31 | timeless_mbp | app.version = strdup(version); |
| 09:44.36 | lcuk | and just want to drop the last bit |
| 09:44.39 | lcuk | path |
| 09:44.40 | timeless_mbp | isn't checked for failure |
| 09:45.19 | lcuk | the title isnt either |
| 09:45.28 | lcuk | if you pass in nulls your program will fail at first run |
| 09:45.32 | lcuk | if a dev lets that out .. |
| 09:45.36 | *** join/#maemo Cwiiis (n=cwiiis@158.43.2.102) |
| 09:46.31 | timeless_mbp | oh, i mean alloc failure |
| 09:46.38 | timeless_mbp | strdup(0) will crash iirc |
| 09:47.18 | timeless_mbp | snprintf(buf,FILENAME_MAX,"%s/.liqbase/liqbase.force.home.user",envhome); |
| 09:47.24 | timeless_mbp | technically the way you're doing this is unfortunate |
| 09:47.29 | lcuk | yes |
| 09:47.30 | lcuk | very |
| 09:47.33 | timeless_mbp | you really should stick a canary at the end of the string |
| 09:47.36 | lcuk | but i couldnt think of a better way |
| 09:47.41 | timeless_mbp | and make sure it's properly managed |
| 09:47.52 | timeless_mbp | because if it isn't, then you're writing to a file which isn't the one you think you are |
| 09:47.53 | lcuk | so im still running at root |
| 09:48.10 | lcuk | but i want access to the same data i do when i run from the icon |
| 09:48.16 | *** join/#maemo gaspa (n=gaspa@host134-118-static.61-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 09:48.36 | lcuk | but obviously ~ is different |
| 09:48.42 | timeless_mbp | basically if envhome is incredibly long |
| 09:48.51 | timeless_mbp | then it's possible to write to envhome/.liqb |
| 09:49.03 | timeless_mbp | because the 'b' might be the last thing that "safely" fits into the buffer |
| 09:49.03 | lcuk | it doesnt write anywhere |
| 09:49.09 | lcuk | it just checks existance |
| 09:49.16 | lcuk | so if that happened |
| 09:49.21 | lcuk | it would just carry on regardless |
| 09:49.28 | lcuk | using the ~ that it originally had |
| 09:49.41 | timeless_mbp | ok :), still bad style :), someone might copy your code and think it's safe/good :) |
| 09:49.56 | timeless_mbp | 666 and friends don't alloc check |
| 09:50.01 | lcuk | well, that is safe/good - there is a max length of the system filenames |
| 09:50.05 | lcuk | and i honour that length |
| 09:50.43 | lcuk | if not my fault if a filepath ends up too long |
| 09:50.47 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 09:51.03 | lcuk | and who on maemo has a ~ path that would break filename_max |
| 09:51.14 | timeless_mbp | shrugs |
| 09:51.36 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:51.58 | lcuk | nods |
| 09:52.01 | timeless_mbp | the path itself doesn't have to break filename_max, just the path plus your long string :) |
| 09:52.39 | lcuk | there are much longer strings inside ~ |
| 09:52.46 | lcuk | than i attempt to use there |
| 09:52.50 | lcuk | buried in subfolders |
| 09:52.54 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 09:53.01 | timeless_mbp | i just like flagging things once |
| 09:53.13 | timeless_mbp | it's something i want people to be aware of, since they usually don't really pay attn to such things |
| 09:53.17 | lcuk | you are like former boss - its damned good |
| 09:53.19 | timeless_mbp | "i'm safe, i used snprintf instead of sprintf" |
| 09:53.37 | lcuk | he has a way of breaking apps - and hence making them stronger |
| 09:53.39 | timeless_mbp | "but what happens when you actually hit that case?" "oh.. um... dunno, it must be safe, right?!" |
| 09:53.47 | lcuk | heh yeah |
| 09:53.56 | timeless_mbp | exit(returnstatus); |
| 09:53.56 | timeless_mbp | return returnstatus; |
| 09:54.06 | timeless_mbp | surely someone warns that the return is unreachable? |
| 09:54.51 | lcuk | i dont think gcc does for the settings im using, but yeah its silly :$ |
| 09:55.05 | lcuk | theres warnings in numerous places that could do with regoing over |
| 09:55.17 | lcuk | mostly unused variables |
| 09:55.42 | *** join/#maemo dantonic (n=david@c-24-7-146-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 09:58.45 | *** join/#maemo Cwiiis_ (n=cwiiis@158.43.2.102) |
| 09:59.13 | timeless_mbp | anyway, i'm tired :) |
| 09:59.25 | timeless_mbp | but my ips is still "creating plan" |
| 09:59.30 | lcuk | not the only one, i think i had 3 hours last night |
| 09:59.51 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: so um |
| 10:00.00 | timeless_mbp | the strings EOG use are disturbing :) |
| 10:00.16 | timeless_mbp | "_Remove from Toolbar" |
| 10:00.30 | timeless_mbp | why is Toolbar capitalized? |
| 10:00.47 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, that was not part of my port |
| 10:00.57 | timeless_mbp | what did you actually do? :) |
| 10:01.12 | lcuk | sighs relief as timeless switches focus ;) |
| 10:01.13 | timeless_mbp | without guidance, i will wander aimlessly :) |
| 10:01.14 | jrocha | and I haven't synced the sources in a couple of weeks, so it might be a solved bug |
| 10:02.10 | timeless_mbp | rotfl |
| 10:02.17 | timeless_mbp | http://git.igalia.com/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi?p=eog.git;a=blob;f=po/en_GB.po;h=0d053041222b8e03d9afeb71c6d80813a39346b9;hb=HEAD#l353 |
| 10:02.32 | timeless_mbp | feel free to tell their british localizer that he's supposed to um.... localize words.... |
| 10:02.52 | timeless_mbp | oh, and tell the guy who wrote the original that it's "chosen" not "choosen" |
| 10:04.12 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, I did all the fremantle code inside EOG |
| 10:04.23 | timeless_mbp | jrocha: give me a url |
| 10:04.30 | timeless_mbp | i can't randomly find stuff short of xref'ing it |
| 10:04.34 | timeless_mbp | and i'm too lazy to do that :) |
| 10:04.49 | jrocha | timeless_mbp, nr 1: look for the ifdef USE_HILDON if you want |
| 10:04.55 | jrocha | nr 2: I'm at work |
| 10:05.04 | timeless_mbp | anyway, if EOG has a bugs.maemo.org product, i'll file a couple of bugs |
| 10:05.10 | *** join/#maemo ignacius (n=ignacius@4.Red-88-9-186.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 10:05.38 | jrocha | nr 3: I haven't asked for your review and I couldn't care less about string issues |
| 10:06.42 | timeless_mbp | can't figure out how to use gitweb |
| 10:08.27 | lcuk | just crashed gdb |
| 10:08.48 | lcuk | A problem internal to GDB has been detected, |
| 10:08.48 | lcuk | further debugging may prove unreliable. |
| 10:08.48 | lcuk | Quit this debugging session? (y or n) ^C |
| 10:11.05 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (n=valerio@bl5-195-39.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 10:17.02 | *** join/#maemo ssvb (n=ssvb___@viktor.cosmicparrot.net) |
| 10:21.27 | lcuk | timeless_mbp, when you have played and ran through the playground or onedotzero have you encountered any stability issues |
| 10:21.36 | timeless_mbp | nope |
| 10:21.37 | lcuk | ie - could this be related to the build i have here |
| 10:21.44 | lcuk | system build i mean |
| 10:22.00 | lcuk | thats good then :) |
| 10:22.02 | timeless_mbp | i don't seem to have playground anymore |
| 10:22.19 | lcuk | i got word today that icons have finally appeared for things |
| 10:22.25 | timeless_mbp | yep |
| 10:22.26 | lcuk | mm |
| 10:22.30 | timeless_mbp | icons = yum |
| 10:22.43 | lcuk | yeah the rocket pencil is dreamy :D |
| 10:23.21 | qwerty12_N810 | i.e. it doesn't leave much to the imagination? :) |
| 10:23.26 | timeless_mbp | grumbles |
| 10:23.26 | lcuk | that same pencil should be in the top right of every screen as well :) |
| 10:23.30 | timeless_mbp | why doesn't ham support portrait? |
| 10:23.31 | lcuk | if you press it you can draw on anything |
| 10:23.47 | lcuk | lol qwerty12_N810 |
| 10:24.02 | lcuk | with liqflow moving, the rocket looks like its flying through space :$ |
| 10:24.10 | timeless_mbp | lcuk: you need to get an icon for the package too |
| 10:24.10 | lcuk | i need to add control for it :D |
| 10:24.16 | lcuk | yeah thats what i mean |
| 10:24.20 | lcuk | this morning i was told it appeared |
| 10:24.43 | lcuk | i didnt do anything more since qwerty showed me how a couple of weeks ago |
| 10:25.31 | lcuk | timeless problem with my dev at the moment, i have to maintain compatability with the sdk repo |
| 10:26.32 | timeless_mbp | wait, liqflow listens to the accelerometer/ |
| 10:26.36 | lcuk | yeah |
| 10:26.45 | lcuk | if you hold it up |
| 10:26.52 | lcuk | it falls like rain |
| 10:26.55 | lcuk | no matter what orientation |
| 10:27.05 | lcuk | i want to do the same with the individual widgets |
| 10:27.16 | lcuk | but i havent got a polyfill or roto texture mapper |
| 10:27.34 | lcuk | i need the gl backend really |
| 10:27.45 | lcuk | hopes javispedro does well with his basics of gles |
| 10:28.24 | Captain_Picard | http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid263777539?bctid=10635445001 n900 users need theese arms |
| 10:28.40 | lcuk | timeless, it also does something if you shake it |
| 10:28.56 | timeless_mbp | yeah, i found shaking too |
| 10:28.57 | lcuk | i should really put a video up of all the little nuggets in the system |
| 10:29.08 | lcuk | but im goin to london today |
| 10:29.18 | lcuk | qwerty12_N810, you still up for saturday? |
| 10:29.32 | lcuk | timeless, that flow works on 8x0 :) |
| 10:29.38 | lcuk | it surprised me immensely |
| 10:30.05 | lcuk | i thought i would need the power of omap3 |
| 10:30.06 | qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: hopefully. but I still need to look into getting tickets |
| 10:30.19 | lcuk | quim |
| 10:30.24 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: go for Thursday instead |
| 10:30.32 | lcuk | ahh h even better |
| 10:30.35 | lcuk | you two discuss |
| 10:30.42 | lardman | lcuk: did you say it was worth going in? |
| 10:30.45 | lardman | Or not? |
| 10:30.47 | qwerty12_N810 | lardman: nah, Saturday works out better for me |
| 10:30.57 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: fair enough |
| 10:31.02 | lcuk | ill text you once i get there and let you know |
| 10:31.13 | lcuk | you two should be able to get sorted tho |
| 10:31.14 | lcuk | hold on |
| 10:31.23 | lcuk | didnt someone say something |
| 10:31.37 | lcuk | crap |
| 10:31.42 | lcuk | actually, dig in the itt thread |
| 10:31.43 | lcuk | and look |
| 10:31.52 | lcuk | ive gotta do some code changes before i get sorted for leaving |
| 10:32.10 | lardman | yeah just wondering if it's still open after 5pm though |
| 10:32.48 | lcuk | pub is either way |
| 10:32.56 | lardman | indeed |
| 10:34.39 | Jaffa | 'll be there on Saturday now |
| 10:35.00 | lcuk | you kinda have to be now lol |
| 10:35.03 | lardman | hmm, I chose the wrong day to go to London from the looks of it |
| 10:35.03 | Jaffa | Yeah |
| 10:35.15 | Jaffa | lcuk: I just can't say no to Jussi ;-) |
| 10:35.32 | lcuk | you can |
| 10:35.44 | Jaffa | Well, I can. |
| 10:35.45 | lcuk | but only when you are far away from doors |
| 10:36.14 | ccooke | preorders an n900. Given the cost, I'm glad I put down some money for this in December :-/ |
| 10:36.31 | lcuk | ccooke, i cannot fault the device |
| 10:36.49 | lcuk | its cpu is second to none :D |
| 10:38.26 | ccooke | lcuk: *grin* |
| 10:38.43 | lcuk | feels the POWER |
| 10:38.50 | ccooke | Hell, this'll be the first time I've ever bought an unlocked phone. Never really cared before |
| 10:39.42 | ccooke | But waiting to see if Vodafone take the phone on and offer a subsidy would take too long... especially since I've already upgraded this year (Though on the offchance they do, my wife's due an upgrade :-) |
| 10:39.54 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 10:40.07 | timeless_mbp | fwiw, my sister really loves the audio quality on the n900 |
| 10:40.13 | timeless_mbp | she can tell that i'm using it and is very happy |
| 10:40.14 | ccooke | (and I'm not exactly thinking it likely there'll be any subsidies) |
| 10:40.27 | timeless_mbp | (i.e. when i call her from it) |
| 10:40.39 | timeless_mbp | i love the audio quality too |
| 10:40.58 | timeless_mbp | (and as people here will note, i rarely give anything resembling praise about products) |
| 10:41.17 | timeless_mbp | debates walking to work while sick to grab a bite to eat |
| 10:41.43 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: I pre-ordered an n810 when they were announced. Grabbed my wife one for her next birthday. We'd both been using Zauruses (Zaurii? :-) before then, but since they're discontinued... |
| 10:41.49 | lcuk | ccooke, what im impressed by isnt the phone, its the possibility of the phone when i need it - i use tablet much more in data mode and always have done (doh!) |
| 10:42.15 | lcuk | the datasim in it works perfectly and for the first tiem ever i did internetty stuff whilst sat in the car |
| 10:42.16 | timeless_mbp | i was quite happy to ditch my n81 |
| 10:42.33 | timeless_mbp | and oddly, i'm not having any problems transitioning from my e61i to the n900's keyboard |
| 10:42.47 | timeless_mbp | no one will say they love the n900 keyboard, but it definitely works for me |
| 10:42.52 | ccooke | I'm currently using an HTC Magic. Android is a very nice system, but... there are some limitations I don't like. |
| 10:43.11 | suihkulokki | < timeless_mbp> i love the audio quality too |
| 10:43.30 | suihkulokki | are you sure it's just not the drugs and fever? :P |
| 10:43.35 | ccooke | suihkulokki: tbh, I was expecting the audio quality to be good. The n810 has stunning audio for such a small device |
| 10:43.42 | tigert | nobody loves a tiny keyboard when compared to a real one, sure |
| 10:44.26 | ccooke | has been resigned (and happy enough) to carry two devices with him everywhere - one for internet tablet and one phone/camera |
| 10:44.39 | timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: i've said it a couple of times at work |
| 10:44.43 | lcuk | timeless, i like the size (assuming my proto is same size) and with kb open it is natural to use both the screen and the keyboard |
| 10:44.43 | timeless_mbp | people will confirm i've said it |
| 10:45.10 | ccooke | Android is a very good phone and a reasonable replacement for a tablet, but it's terrible as a camera and has limitations I really miss |
| 10:45.23 | timeless_mbp | shrugs |
| 10:45.26 | lcuk | liek a "fixed in fremantle" sticker? |
| 10:45.42 | timeless_mbp | i know tigert has managed to use the n900 camera to get good pictures |
| 10:46.08 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (n=lizardo@189.2.128.130) |
| 10:46.20 | ccooke | There are a few apps I'm going to have to try to recreate in Maemo, though. |
| 10:46.28 | ccooke | Anyone used the Android app Locale? |
| 10:47.43 | lcuk | oooh im mentioned http://blogs.nokia.com/nseries/index.php/2009/09/03/first-creative-application-of-n900 |
| 10:47.56 | Stskeeps | what rock have you been hiding under? :P |
| 10:48.04 | timeless_mbp | rotfl |
| 10:48.06 | Myrtti | +1 Stskeeps |
| 10:48.17 | ccooke | lcuk: of *course* you're mentioned :-) |
| 10:48.20 | lcuk | Stskeeps, one where im working very hard lol |
| 10:48.35 | timeless_mbp | repokes Stskeeps |
| 10:48.36 | lcuk | im coding now a whole list of mods |
| 10:48.41 | Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: yes, i can test it now :P |
| 10:48.53 | *** join/#maemo frade (n=ivan@esprx01x.nokia.com) |
| 10:49.09 | timeless_mbp | :) |
| 10:49.24 | Stskeeps | grabs rootsh |
| 10:49.50 | timeless_mbp | yeah, i had to do that too |
| 10:49.55 | ccooke | Hmm |
| 10:50.13 | ccooke | What sort of API access is there to phone functions on the n900? |
| 10:50.23 | timeless_mbp | ccooke: dunno :) |
| 10:50.30 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: heh |
| 10:50.35 | timeless_mbp | i don't think we've really promised open access to the phone |
| 10:50.40 | timeless_mbp | i could be wrong |
| 10:50.45 | *** join/#maemo baraujo (n=Bruno@189.2.128.130) |
| 10:50.52 | Stskeeps | APIs? pft, who needs apis when you can move the earth with your device ;p |
| 10:50.55 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: surely there'll be a programmatic way of - say - sending an SMS |
| 10:50.56 | lcuk | facepalms |
| 10:51.02 | lcuk | i have a profanity filter in the app |
| 10:51.03 | timeless_mbp | ccooke: not necessarily |
| 10:51.11 | timeless_mbp | sending an SMS w/o user confirmation is incredibly scary |
| 10:51.13 | lcuk | but it warns them they are swearing but doesnt stop em sending |
| 10:51.24 | timeless_mbp | especially in some markets where an sms can cost 4EUR |
| 10:51.27 | timeless_mbp | (finland?) |
| 10:51.34 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: *how* much? |
| 10:51.35 | *** join/#maemo eichi__ (n=eichi@stgt-5f709063.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 10:51.39 | till- | i would prefer a global switch for cellphone activity notification |
| 10:51.43 | timeless_mbp | you can buy things by SMS in this country |
| 10:51.44 | till- | and confirmation |
| 10:51.51 | timeless_mbp | e.g. a tram ticket |
| 10:51.56 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: oh, sure. Same here. |
| 10:52.03 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: sorry, I misunderstood for a moment! |
| 10:52.05 | Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: the current way to rip people off is by charging for receipts, heh |
| 10:52.21 | lcuk | brb, need bacon |
| 10:52.24 | timeless_mbp | ccooke: i skip over the details, straight to the bottom line |
| 10:52.28 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: *nod* |
| 10:52.44 | timeless_mbp | anyway, i'm not really sure what is offered |
| 10:53.07 | timeless_mbp | ideally you should be able to open an SMS compose window w/ prefilled content |
| 10:53.10 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: Fair enough. I see I'll have to play around. |
| 10:53.17 | timeless_mbp | however i'm not certain if that exists |
| 10:53.21 | timeless_mbp | and even that is scary |
| 10:53.26 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: There are good use cases for sending an automatic SMS, though |
| 10:53.31 | timeless_mbp | oh, i know |
| 10:53.40 | timeless_mbp | the n810 maps app had a way to use it for beacons |
| 10:53.43 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: I can give you several extremely good examples |
| 10:53.51 | timeless_mbp | (the strings there were incredibly shitty, but...) |
| 10:53.58 | timeless_mbp | ccooke: nah, not required |
| 10:54.05 | ccooke | *nod* |
| 10:54.28 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: so really, what's needed is a way for the user to authorise a particular app to send SMS. |
| 10:54.36 | timeless_mbp | yeah |
| 10:54.36 | till- | maybe a white-list with "truested" numbers where sms can be send to without notification |
| 10:54.44 | timeless_mbp | but i don't think we have a framework for that in fremantle |
| 10:54.48 | ccooke | I think that could work. |
| 10:55.04 | timeless_mbp | and if hypothetically, harmattan were to have such a thing |
| 10:55.04 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: it could be built easily. |
| 10:55.04 | timeless_mbp | i'm sure people would complain :) |
| 10:55.28 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: thing is, if you have root access to the phone you should be able to send SMS. GSM is not a difficult protocol. |
| 10:55.29 | timeless_mbp | in unix, doing that requires either proper acls or users/groups |
| 10:55.40 | till- | just imagines some sort of "virus" which sends such sms |
| 10:55.45 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: sudo. |
| 10:56.03 | timeless_mbp | till-: aren't there symbian things that do precisely that? :) |
| 10:56.05 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: it's not hard to run an app with a modified sudo wrapper. |
| 10:56.08 | *** join/#maemo Komzpa (n=kom@mm-71-245-57-86.leased.line.mgts.by) |
| 10:56.13 | timeless_mbp | ccooke: ham :) |
| 10:56.19 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: ham? |
| 10:56.27 | timeless_mbp | hildon-application-manager, commonly "ham" |
| 10:56.31 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: oh, right |
| 10:56.47 | timeless_mbp | anyway, it's definitely doable |
| 10:57.04 | timeless_mbp | and i think it's reasonable to assume some approach for doing it is under discussion at nokia |
| 10:57.18 | timeless_mbp | however, i don't think it was done for fremantle, and i don't know if it will appear in harmattan |
| 10:57.44 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: yes, but why bother waiting? I'd be willing to bet that I could knock up the backed for such a thing for my own use with little effort |
| 10:58.22 | timeless_mbp | well, i'm not going to stop you |
| 10:58.27 | ccooke | *grin* |
| 10:58.47 | timeless_mbp | i'll just remind you about security concerns |
| 10:58.47 | timeless_mbp | the people @nokia are busy working on other things |
| 10:58.47 | timeless_mbp | or this for harmattan |
| 10:58.47 | timeless_mbp | shrugs |
| 10:59.11 | *** join/#maemo ignacius_ (n=ignacius@4.Red-88-9-186.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 10:59.22 | ccooke | Knowing what Nokia are working on is always problematic |
| 10:59.32 | ccooke | They've generally chosen a good set of things, of course |
| 10:59.32 | timeless_mbp | so many things, so little time |
| 10:59.32 | timeless_mbp | i work for nokia |
| 10:59.36 | timeless_mbp | i have no idea what everyone's doing :) |
| 10:59.47 | timeless_mbp | yesterday i discovered a number of surprises |
| 10:59.56 | ccooke | Yeah, I know a couple of people who work for Nokia and I hear that a lot :-) |
| 11:00.15 | timeless_mbp | if you want a cool challenge, we have one available |
| 11:00.20 | ccooke | Oh? |
| 11:00.35 | RST38h | wants money. Is any available? |
| 11:00.36 | timeless_mbp | it probably requires: 1. kernel hacking. 2. hal glue. 3. a bit of userspace near some media player (ukmp, whatever) |
| 11:00.46 | timeless_mbp | RST38h: i could toss up a bit for this, yes |
| 11:01.04 | timeless_mbp | probably 50EUR, but it really isn't enough to cover the basic pain |
| 11:01.04 | ccooke | bows out, if there's people wanting money :-) |
| 11:01.16 | timeless_mbp | oh, and i'll toss in the relevant accessory too :) |
| 11:01.27 | ccooke | What's the problem, anyway? |
| 11:01.27 | RST38h | nah. |
| 11:01.28 | timeless_mbp | ccooke: oh, i doubt RST38h would actually take the offer |
| 11:01.42 | lardman | go on, you've got us hooked now :) |
| 11:02.17 | lcuk | till-, there was a recent report/thing about using iphone to bring down cell towers |
| 11:02.55 | lcuk | jussi thinks maemo hackers will do more! |
| 11:02.57 | Myrtti | um, I just installed dropbear ssh client to my N800... how the hell do I use it? should I reboot or something to make the device detect it's there, or is it installed by some other app name than ssh? |
| 11:02.57 | lcuk | http://twitter.com/luovanto/status/2915994278 |
| 11:02.57 | RST38h | lcuk: So, how do you do it? Find the sweet spot and bury iPhone there, wrapped in thermal blanket ? |
| 11:03.14 | lcuk | you could throw enough of em at it |
| 11:03.18 | lardman | that won't work as you need low level access |
| 11:03.30 | lcuk | but *gasp* we have root |
| 11:03.36 | RST38h | Myrtti: Not sure about dropbear but the standard ssh does not seem to require reboot |
| 11:03.37 | jaska | connect explosives to iphone, tape iphone to celltower, run away, call iphone |
| 11:03.38 | ccooke | Myrtti: open up the terminal and type 'ssh' |
| 11:03.43 | lardman | no, low level with the GSM stuff |
| 11:03.49 | lcuk | yeah i know |
| 11:03.53 | Myrtti | ccooke: unsurprisingly, I did. |
| 11:03.54 | lcuk | we can only talk to the modem |
| 11:03.56 | RST38h | Myrtti: You install it, enter new root password, and get both client and server (the latter running) |
| 11:04.01 | ccooke | Myrtti: and you had an error message? |
| 11:04.04 | lcuk | and if the modem is written properly it should be impossible |
| 11:04.14 | Myrtti | -sh: ssh: not found |
| 11:04.25 | lcuk | hey lardman i got a usb broadband router from o2 |
| 11:04.28 | lcuk | £30 |
| 11:04.33 | lcuk | it came with a pay and go sim :) |
| 11:04.40 | lcuk | guess where it got rehomed ;) :D |
| 11:04.43 | Myrtti | fuck it, I'll install openssh |
| 11:04.43 | lardman | I use TalkTalk :) |
| 11:05.00 | lcuk | Myrtti, |
| 11:05.04 | lcuk | to run ssh for the first time |
| 11:05.07 | lcuk | reboot, or |
| 11:05.13 | lcuk | /usr/sbin/sshd |
| 11:05.23 | Myrtti | lcuk: I only wanted the client... |
| 11:05.24 | RST38h | Myrtti: dpkg-query -L <package> |
| 11:05.25 | Myrtti | oh well |
| 11:05.28 | lcuk | oh lol |
| 11:05.44 | RST38h | Myrtti: before you do the right thing (openssh), do dpkg-query -L |
| 11:05.52 | RST38h | Out of academic curiosity |
| 11:06.37 | lcuk | timeless, does your console now remember history correctly - at first and on this build it doesnt remember between sessions |
| 11:06.51 | timeless_mbp | ? |
| 11:06.53 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@nemein.suvilahti.nemein.net) |
| 11:07.03 | lcuk | using ssh |
| 11:07.17 | lcuk | whenever i restart sessino my 810 would remember last X commands |
| 11:07.31 | lcuk | this old (very!) buld i have here doesnt remember anything |
| 11:07.38 | timeless_mbp | oh |
| 11:08.18 | timeless_mbp | doesn't seem to here |
| 11:08.34 | Myrtti | dbclient?! what happened to obvious appnames? |
| 11:08.34 | timeless_mbp | not sure if that's busybox being unhelpful |
| 11:08.34 | timeless_mbp | or a config thing |
| 11:08.35 | timeless_mbp | or ... |
| 11:08.36 | Myrtti | gah |
| 11:08.49 | timeless_mbp | Myrtti: obvious app names like eog? |
| 11:09.03 | lcuk | Myrtti, they were removed in the update for pink_ponies |
| 11:09.45 | timeless_mbp | oh |
| 11:09.52 | timeless_mbp | didn't know ham supported install from file |
| 11:10.03 | lcuk | does anyone recognise the font in use on these screenies |
| 11:10.04 | lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liqbase_river.php?username=lcuk |
| 11:10.28 | lcuk | and do they have it on their system, and could you just do me a quick mockup screen if i asked |
| 11:10.51 | lcuk | cannot wait for email |
| 11:11.34 | zerojayPC | timeless_mbp: I thought HAM was supposed to not have that ability in Fremantle? |
| 11:12.00 | timeless_mbp | zerojayPC: i think there's a difference between "ham features" and "red pill" |
| 11:12.02 | ccooke | lcuk: looks familiar. I could ask a couple of typophiles for you, if you like |
| 11:12.08 | timeless_mbp | and it looks like it moved to red pill |
| 11:12.24 | zerojayPC | hmm, k |
| 11:12.30 | lcuk | please, ive been asked to insert an intermediate "sending message, please wait" screen |
| 11:12.36 | lcuk | but havent had any artwork back yet |
| 11:13.27 | lcuk | (and its not the pictures of jacob or the sketches lol |
| 11:13.27 | ccooke | lcuk: specifically the font on the first row of screens? |
| 11:13.27 | qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: How do you use a font in your program without knowing how to at least get the name? :) |
| 11:13.28 | ccooke | (the "Move me", "Shake me" bit?) |
| 11:13.36 | lcuk | qwerty12_N810, its artwork - sent over from psd |
| 11:13.39 | lcuk | i know nothing |
| 11:13.43 | qwerty12_N810 | ah |
| 11:13.44 | lcuk | i can just throw things around |
| 11:13.50 | lcuk | yeah ccook |
| 11:13.57 | lcuk | just something that isnt my default crappy thing :$ |
| 11:14.34 | ccooke | lcuk: Okay. Looks like the people I know are semi-offline, but I'll let you know when they reply |
| 11:14.38 | timeless_mbp | yeah. red pill supports install file |
| 11:14.41 | timeless_mbp | cute |
| 11:15.02 | lcuk | ccooke, ta - i mightv heard back in half hour, just wanting to tick it off my list |
| 11:15.05 | zerojayPC | nice |
| 11:15.09 | lcuk | still has 120301230123129823423 things to do |
| 11:15.59 | lcuk | zerojayPC, :) yeah looks good with a bit of makeup on doesnt it |
| 11:16.16 | zerojayPC | lcuk: Red pill? |
| 11:16.21 | lcuk | oh lol |
| 11:16.24 | ccooke | lcuk: I hope any todo list app you write has bignum support, then |
| 11:16.26 | zerojayPC | :) |
| 11:16.36 | lcuk | lol ccooke yeah it should have |
| 11:16.54 | lcuk | at least if the number is long enough i know i can scroll smoothly to the end :) |
| 11:17.25 | lcuk | wishes he had the database working faster - the combined graffiti wall on the web looks so good |
| 11:24.17 | ccooke | lcuk: what DB is it? |
| 11:24.51 | *** join/#maemo ziyourenxiang (n=ziyouren@unaffiliated/ziyourenxiang) |
| 11:25.08 | *** join/#maemo stemosco (n=stemosco@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 11:25.58 | lcuk | ccooke, |
| 11:26.01 | lcuk | sqlite |
| 11:26.28 | ccooke | Ah :-/ |
| 11:26.31 | lcuk | i wrote it to use it, and when i filled it up it was 115mb |
| 11:26.51 | lcuk | and it was slower saving a new sketch into it that it is to upload to web |
| 11:26.55 | ShadowJK | it's funny how review sites claim N810 can't run more than one app at the same time |
| 11:27.16 | lcuk | using data modem |
| 11:27.16 | lcuk | show em liqbase |
| 11:27.24 | ccooke | ShadowJK: er. They do? |
| 11:27.42 | zerojayPC | Yes, the Register does. |
| 11:27.50 | lcuk | maybe its the visual app at once thing |
| 11:27.53 | zerojayPC | And also claims the N900 is a combo GSM/CDMA phone. |
| 11:27.57 | *** join/#maemo alecrim (n=alecrim@189.2.128.130) |
| 11:28.18 | ShadowJK | theinquirer also claims no multitasking on n810 |
| 11:28.29 | zerojayPC | It's pretty irresponsible. |
| 11:28.55 | ccooke | zerojayPC: you're expecting good journalism from the register and theinquirer?! |
| 11:29.05 | AStorm | their tech reports should die ;P |
| 11:29.21 | zerojayPC | ccooke: I expect good journalism from anyone that considers themselves to be journalists, yes. |
| 11:29.32 | ccooke | lcuk: Typophile says: "heh. A lot of the identifying letters aren't there. no numbers, no punctuation, no special characters, no G Q J" |
| 11:29.41 | lcuk | heh |
| 11:29.43 | ccooke | zerojayPC: I wish I lived in your world :-) |
| 11:29.43 | lcuk | yeah i know |
| 11:30.18 | lcuk | zerojayPC, i dont think the register or inquirer have ever thought of themselves as journos |
| 11:30.30 | lcuk | infact, BOFH could be modelled on their daily activities |
| 11:30.37 | zerojayPC | ccooke: If you don't expect good journalism from every journalist, you get nothing but shit from everyone. All you gotta do is expect it and if they don't give it to you, roast them for it. |
| 11:31.00 | ShadowJK | "Besides being quad band GSM phone, we've been told the N900 is also a quad band CDMA phone for accessing almost all North American networks. There is no other phone in the Nokia portfolio to date that has this vast rage of communications capabilities. Nokia hasn't made public whose chipset it has used for the phone functions of the N900, but it has worked in HSPA over the HSDPA variant for the much improved uplink speeds, which isn't even in their flag |
| 11:31.06 | ShadowJK | ship N97 model." |
| 11:31.22 | AStorm | ffs. HSPA is not CDMA. |
| 11:32.03 | ccooke | AStorm: it does not say that |
| 11:32.11 | *** join/#maemo wnd (n=wnd@katei.fi) |
| 11:32.16 | ccooke | it says "It has CDMA and they've also added HSPA" |
| 11:32.34 | Captain_Picard | nokia comming out with LTE next year |
| 11:32.35 | Captain_Picard | =) |
| 11:32.36 | AStorm | at most, it can be said it *uses* WCDMA |
| 11:32.44 | Captain_Picard | forget WCDMA and HSPA |
| 11:32.46 | AStorm | CDMA that means RSIM? |
| 11:32.48 | Captain_Picard | LTE is here |
| 11:33.01 | AStorm | except no operator supports it, so it's dead |
| 11:33.07 | AStorm | ;P |
| 11:33.14 | AStorm | oh, except Finland. |
| 11:33.16 | Captain_Picard | not yet! |
| 11:33.30 | *** join/#maemo jrocha (n=JRocha@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 11:33.39 | AStorm | next year is still too soon |
| 11:33.55 | *** join/#maemo ZogG (n=zogg@bzq-84-108-233-33.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 11:33.57 | AStorm | LTE needs hardware overhaul at the cells |
| 11:34.11 | AStorm | unlikely to happen so fast |
| 11:34.59 | AStorm | except where it's already there, like Finland |
| 11:35.03 | ShadowJK | Nobody is running LTE in finland either |
| 11:35.25 | ShadowJK | But some operators have applied for license to share 1800MHz (or was it 1900?) with GSM and LTE |
| 11:35.26 | AStorm | they don't advertise it, but the hardware is present at least |
| 11:35.44 | AStorm | oh BTW, LTE should use IPv6 |
| 11:35.56 | AStorm | otherwise it will be fairly pointless ;> |
| 11:35.59 | suihkulokki | wasnt 3g supposed to use IPv6 too? :P |
| 11:36.09 | ShadowJK | yeah it would, if the operators stopped being asshats. |
| 11:36.10 | AStorm | nah, 3G is not IP-based really |
| 11:36.31 | ShadowJK | Nokia has been a supported of IPv6 for ages. All their symbian phones have IPv6 support |
| 11:36.39 | ShadowJK | IPv6 improves battery life :) |
| 11:37.22 | ShadowJK | Also according to theinq; N900 has 24 hour always-on batterylife, twice that of N810 |
| 11:37.38 | ShadowJK | I think they use random number generator :) |
| 11:37.41 | *** join/#maemo DarwinSurvivor (n=DarwinSu@S0106000f6683e05d.vs.shawcable.net) |
| 11:38.29 | ShadowJK | AStorm, there's not even decent 3G coverage in .fi yet, let alone any LTE :) |
| 11:38.53 | ShadowJK | But the data plans are decent, atleast. |
| 11:40.13 | AStorm | ShadowJK: that is idle lifetime |
| 11:40.18 | AStorm | possible. |
| 11:40.30 | ShadowJK | Yeah |
| 11:40.42 | ShadowJK | N8x0 idles 2 days or something on wifi |
| 11:40.45 | AStorm | since the biggest consumer is the display backlight... and that has been improved |
| 11:40.51 | ShadowJK | and my E75 does a couple of days idling on irc :P |
| 11:40.53 | AStorm | ShadowJK: not with screen on. |
| 11:41.38 | AStorm | idling on irc? hardly possible, unless it uses EDGE with heavy power saving |
| 11:41.59 | AStorm | actually, it'd be a fairly smart modem to toggle techs |
| 11:42.13 | ShadowJK | Yeah only edge coverage here |
| 11:42.23 | Corsac | ShadowJK: 2 days on wifi with PM enabled |
| 11:42.25 | ShadowJK | in 3G coverage it does toggle between 3g and 3.5g |
| 11:42.34 | Corsac | ShadowJK: not all access point manage that :( |
| 11:42.55 | Corsac | (freeboxes, the wifi box used by one of the top french ISP, isn't PM friendly at all :/ ) |
| 11:43.25 | AStorm | my Linksys WAG200 supports power saving |
| 11:43.33 | AStorm | but it's likely still not enough |
| 11:43.45 | AStorm | N810 and N900 should toggle transmit power dynamically |
| 11:43.52 | Corsac | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3481 |
| 11:44.04 | ShadowJK | Luckily ISPs here aren't providing wifi boxes (not many, atleast) |
| 11:44.08 | AStorm | (n810 doesn't, it always blasts 100 mW, just less often if PM is present) |
| 11:44.28 | ccooke | lcuk: On the font: It's not in the databases she has access to. Is it a nokia-specific trademarked font? |
| 11:44.38 | ShadowJK | AStorm, oh once I compared power use when sending a file from N810 to PC over wifi, with 100mW and smaller... there was hardly any difference in total power use.. |
| 11:44.58 | ShadowJK | most of the power goes elsewhere.. |
| 11:46.58 | ShadowJK | N810 power use at max wifi transmit speed is something like 1.5+ Watt. 0.1 vs 0.01 is relatively marginal :/ |
| 11:47.51 | AStorm | heh. |
| 11:47.56 | AStorm | true. |
| 11:48.26 | AStorm | I think SDHC and display backlight are the worst power consumers there |
| 11:48.26 | ccooke | It's the idle usage that matters |
| 11:48.40 | lcuk | ccooke, i dunno lol |
| 11:48.51 | lcuk | is not wise to such things |
| 11:49.03 | ccooke | I've replaced an access point because it wouldn't use PM properly - our N810s would die without about 10 hours |
| 11:49.19 | lcuk | thanks for asking tho |
| 11:51.15 | AStorm | idle is not as important as you'd think... unless that idle means "connected and using minor webapps" |
| 11:51.27 | *** join/#maemo setanta (n=setanta@189.70.17.37) |
| 11:51.33 | AStorm | which would be e.g. weather, mail check, irc, idle IM |
| 11:52.29 | ShadowJK | :) |
| 11:52.36 | ccooke | AStorm: my n810 is never offline :-) |
| 11:52.48 | ShadowJK | with IPv6 the mail check could actually be imap idle |
| 11:52.50 | ccooke | well, apart from the tube or at work (where it's not allowed on the wifi) |
| 11:53.08 | ShadowJK | in reality with IPv4 all sorts of NAT crap means TCP sessions on survive only 10 seconds in worst case |
| 11:53.11 | ShadowJK | or was it 30 seconds |
| 11:53.12 | ccooke | There's a question I've been meaning to ask |
| 11:53.25 | ShadowJK | sending a keep-alive every 10 seconds for a day eats batterylife even if no emails were to arrived |
| 11:53.35 | ccooke | Anyone know if the Mail for Exchange on the n900 supports push email? |
| 11:53.42 | timeless_mbp | push? |
| 11:54.37 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: As opposed to polling. |
| 11:55.21 | timeless_mbp | the settings don't seem to indicate it does |
| 11:55.30 | ccooke | Drat. |
| 11:55.38 | timeless_mbp | does that actually work well? |
| 11:55.53 | timeless_mbp | i'd imagine it'd result in lots of stuck network connections while traveling |
| 11:56.01 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: er... Most of the mobile world has been doing it for years now. |
| 11:56.14 | *** join/#maemo halves (n=higor@201-77-125-1.desktop.com.br) |
| 11:56.14 | timeless_mbp | does most of the mobile world travel to iceland? :) |
| 11:56.16 | ccooke | it works very well. |
| 11:56.23 | timeless_mbp | i'm told the cellular world sucks up there :) |
| 11:56.28 | SpComb | IPv6 will still have stateful firewalls... |
| 11:56.42 | ShadowJK | I get "stuck connections" on Saunalahti/Elisa in .fi when moving from 2G to 3G coverage :) |
| 11:56.54 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: it's sympathy w/ iceland :) |
| 11:56.54 | ShadowJK | but on DNA it's rock solid |
| 11:57.12 | ShadowJK | unfortunately dna doesn't even have edge coverage here :) |
| 11:57.20 | timeless_mbp | or fortunately? |
| 11:57.27 | ShadowJK | what do you mean.. |
| 11:57.33 | ccooke | timeless_mbp: I've never experienced a stuck connection dealing with push email. First time I used it on a phone was a SE k750 IIRC, but it wasn't new then. |
| 11:57.50 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: how do you know edge isn't the cause of the problem? :) |
| 11:57.58 | ShadowJK | heh |
| 11:57.59 | ccooke | (that was imap push support) |
| 11:58.06 | glass | timeless_mbp: it's rather stupid to say that no coverage is better than some |
| 11:58.18 | glass | which i suspect is the case? |
| 11:58.19 | timeless_mbp | glass: who said no coverage? |
| 11:58.24 | ShadowJK | timeless, right, when I'm out driving, when I get this problem on elisa, I also drive in and out of DNA edge and 3g coverage areas, and that works seamlessly :) |
| 11:58.25 | timeless_mbp | he said no edge. that doesn't imply no 2g |
| 11:58.29 | kirma | properly functioning NATs should really drop UDP connections only after half a minute or so, and TCP connections after two hours or something... or at least tens of minutes |
| 11:58.55 | glass | timeless_mbp: i'd think dna to have edge everywhere they got masts, or then they're using some stone age equipment |
| 11:58.57 | timeless_mbp | glass: low quality but consistently working coverage is better than variable coverage which gets stuck and requires something tantamount to a reboot |
| 11:59.16 | timeless_mbp | glass: ask ShadowJK .... |
| 11:59.17 | ShadowJK | glass, yeah most of their masts are gprs |
| 11:59.21 | ShadowJK | without edge |
| 11:59.36 | glass | urgh |
| 11:59.38 | timeless_mbp | glass: please don't assume i'm wrong |
| 11:59.40 | timeless_mbp | it's unfair to me |
| 11:59.59 | glass | dna should get off their butts then.. but i suppose thats not news |
| 12:00.12 | timeless_mbp | sighs |
| 12:00.16 | timeless_mbp | goes off to screwer someone |
| 12:00.32 | ShadowJK | Plus, all 3 networks basically have something like 99.9% gprs coverage, I took that for granted |
| 12:00.42 | *** join/#maemo stemosco (n=stemosco@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 12:00.52 | ShadowJK | (in saying no edge and not mentioning gprs) |
| 12:02.24 | AStorm | here, almost all have EDGE |
| 12:03.03 | glass | it's been a while since i've seen non-edge too, been on sonera for a while though(not my choice or money paying for it..) |
| 12:03.08 | AStorm | HSPA has more problems with reach (esp. in cities, woods or mountains, even if a mast is available) |
| 12:03.15 | ShadowJK | edge coverage seems to grow randomly, at approximately the rate ancient equipment breaks and is replaced by now :) |
| 12:03.22 | timeless_mbp | glass: hey, you speak Finnish, right? |
| 12:03.27 | glass | yeah |
| 12:03.31 | glass | rudely |
| 12:03.33 | timeless_mbp | how often do native Finnish speakers confuse First and Second person? |
| 12:03.33 | ShadowJK | Sonera has no edge within about 50km or so :) |
| 12:03.45 | timeless_mbp | or how easily do they do that? |
| 12:03.56 | glass | timeless_mbp: there's this thing called teitittely in finnish |
| 12:04.18 | timeless_mbp | i don't know that word :) |
| 12:04.19 | glass | timeless_mbp: which is basically some ancient remains of thou dost shit you see in ultima games |
| 12:04.25 | ShadowJK | huh |
| 12:04.42 | ShadowJK | I can't enumerate language, I need examples! :-) |
| 12:04.49 | glass | timeless_mbp: he/she gets confused quite often |
| 12:04.52 | kirma | first and second person are not the same as singular and plural |
| 12:04.56 | timeless_mbp | glass: that's third person |
| 12:05.08 | timeless_mbp | how about confusing "Me" and "You" ? |
| 12:05.09 | glass | timeless_mbp: you can be sinä, sä, te |
| 12:05.19 | glass | sä is not correct but is used quite often |
| 12:05.30 | timeless_mbp | i understand that finns are mostly gender free |
| 12:05.41 | timeless_mbp | which means that they have more chances to insult Poles |
| 12:05.44 | glass | timeless_mbp: and plenty of local dialects/slang thworn in |
| 12:05.47 | ShadowJK | confusing me and you? Ho do you do that |
| 12:05.49 | ShadowJK | how* |
| 12:05.53 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: that's my question :) |
| 12:05.54 | kirma | "sinä" in this case is rather a replacement for passive... or at least if it isn't, it doesn't make sense |
| 12:05.59 | suihkulokki | in polite finnish, one does not use "vittu" as comma and "perkele" as period |
| 12:06.06 | kirma | :) |
| 12:06.13 | timeless_mbp | suihkulokki: the former is a curse |
| 12:06.14 | lcuk | there is so much language |
| 12:06.19 | lcuk | so verbose |
| 12:06.28 | glass | vittu is the fuck of finnish language |
| 12:06.28 | ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, now you just have to give us an example |
| 12:07.18 | glass | "ne vitun idiootit ei vittu oo taaskaan vittu tehneet niit juttui vittu" those fucking idiots haven't done stuff, again, fuck! |
| 12:07.33 | glass | rather "that stuff" |
| 12:08.00 | suihkulokki | timeless_mbp: the joke goes that the only way a finn was able to explain the widespread usage of those words to foreigner was they are used in place of comma and period in common speech |
| 12:08.09 | Macer | hm |
| 12:08.13 | lcuk | timeless, i mentioned before about rotating widgets |
| 12:08.14 | lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liqbase_mediareply.php?replyname=lcuk&replyid=185 |
| 12:08.14 | Macer | whattodowhattodo |
| 12:08.55 | Macer | hm. my artigo's bios isn't compatible with win7 it seems |
| 12:09.05 | Macer | wtf is so special with acpi that it REQUIRES it? :) |
| 12:09.21 | lcuk | drm isnt it |
| 12:09.35 | lcuk | full protected pathway ensuring no hypervisor (so i thought) |
| 12:09.43 | jaska | acpi? nah.. not drm |
| 12:09.59 | jaska | they just didnt want to support old-style configuration |
| 12:10.31 | glass | Macer: huh. did it refuse to install? |
| 12:10.37 | *** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:10.43 | Macer | glass: yes |
| 12:10.46 | Macer | got a blue screen |
| 12:10.56 | Macer | and a "not fully acpi compatible bios" msg |
| 12:10.58 | glass | crazy decisions |
| 12:11.17 | RST38h | glass: so, vit* is "fuck"? |
| 12:11.20 | Macer | wanted to put win7 on my artigo .. with its 1GHz C7 processor beast |
| 12:11.29 | jaska | vittu means cunt literally, but its used like fuck |
| 12:11.38 | RST38h | weird |
| 12:11.45 | glass | RST38h: fuck means fucking, as in making love. vittu doesn't, vittu as such "is" pussy but almost never used in that way |
| 12:12.21 | glass | as such it's just a word that sounds nice when swearing and or putting a point |
| 12:12.35 | glass | you can put a lot of emotional force on it |
| 12:12.37 | Jaffa | X-Fade: ping |
| 12:13.37 | RST38h | glass: Russians normally use male organs in this context |
| 12:13.44 | glass | "vittujen kevät ja kyrpien takatalvi" can be used when everything hits the fan. which in finland tends to be quite often |
| 12:14.09 | glass | "spring of pussies and extended winter of dicks" |
| 12:14.44 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 12:14.51 | glass | i guess lots of farmers got screwed by late snows |
| 12:15.00 | RST38h | glass: too long |
| 12:15.19 | RST38h | glass: amounts to one pussy-derived word in Russian |
| 12:15.23 | Macer | wow |
| 12:15.27 | Macer | dow is looking profitable again :) |
| 12:15.49 | RST38h | Angels we have heard on high / Tell us "go out and buy!"? ? |
| 12:15.54 | Macer | sad when the only good news is "it isn't getting worse" |
| 12:15.57 | Macer | haha |
| 12:16.01 | glass | finnish can be used to sound harsh or poetry like, depending |
| 12:16.20 | Macer | RST38h: haha |
| 12:16.23 | Macer | maybe |
| 12:16.42 | RST38h | glass: Even English can be used both ways, and it is not that rich in morphology |
| 12:16.43 | ShadowJK | Macer, too bad you noticed only now, when it's basically over ;) |
| 12:16.43 | Macer | if the economy rebounds past 10,000 then obama is going to get re-elected |
| 12:17.02 | Macer | ShadowJK: not really. i could care less.. i have enough money to last ;) |
| 12:17.03 | *** join/#maemo povbot (n=supybot@office.pov.lt) |
| 12:17.07 | RST38h | Macer: Will he get reelected BEFORE his current term is up? =) |
| 12:17.09 | Macer | i mean when is enough.. enough? |
| 12:17.15 | ShadowJK | Macer, it's not about what level the dow is.. it's about jobs, jobs, jobs :) |
| 12:17.19 | Macer | RST38h: personally i don't think he has done a bad job |
| 12:17.25 | Macer | ShadowJK: not really |
| 12:17.28 | ShadowJK | and I don't mean Steve |
| 12:17.31 | RST38h | ShadowJK: Who mentioned Steve Jobs again in this channel? |
| 12:17.37 | Macer | cashing in on stock can make money ;) |
| 12:17.44 | Macer | just inflate it a bit and sell it |
| 12:17.45 | glass | problem with learning finnish is quite often that the book-finnish has quite often nothing to do with the finnish people actually speak |
| 12:17.48 | Macer | points at enron |
| 12:17.50 | RST38h | Macer: Given the current cluster fuck, there is not much he can do |
| 12:18.03 | Macer | RST38h: well.. he doesn't really have to do anything |
| 12:18.10 | Macer | i mean when he got in it was rock bottom |
| 12:18.11 | derf | Macer: The vast majority of the US population does not own stocks. |
| 12:18.15 | Macer | so honestly he can just sit back |
| 12:18.24 | RST38h | glass: Hehe, try learning Ukrainian :) |
| 12:18.32 | Macer | by the time his term is up he can claim responsibility on a better economy |
| 12:18.38 | derf | And most of those that do own them in mutual funds in retirement accounts. |
| 12:18.40 | thresh | ukrainian is easy |
| 12:18.40 | glass | RST38h: i'd rather not :D whats ukrainian related to? |
| 12:18.43 | RST38h | glass: Then suddenly find out most Ukrainians speak slightly accented Russian. |
| 12:18.43 | thresh | just broken russian |
| 12:18.43 | Macer | clinton did it ;) |
| 12:18.58 | Macer | everybody loved clinton because times were good and the computer industry was in an absolute boom |
| 12:19.02 | glass | RST38h: actually on the russian side of the border theres small villages that speak sort-of-finnish |
| 12:19.14 | RST38h | glass: Written Ukrainian is a somewhat artifical language created by 3 bored intellectuals at the end of XIX century |
| 12:19.22 | glass | hah |
| 12:19.37 | Macer | RST38h: like klingon? :) |
| 12:19.52 | RST38h | glass: It merges all the dialects they could find, the problem is that they were all dialects of Russian :) |
| 12:19.55 | thresh | that's just not true |
| 12:20.00 | thresh | it wasnt invented in XIX |
| 12:20.03 | RST38h | Macer: Klingon is original :) |
| 12:20.17 | RST38h | thresh: Well, this is what Wiki seems to imply |
| 12:20.20 | dottedmag | requests the Zolotaryov and Siberian language to this channel! |
| 12:20.40 | Macer | there is a siberian language? :) |
| 12:20.43 | RST38h | dottedmag: Only if we start with a human sacrifice to Perun |
| 12:20.45 | glass | what do they do in siberia for fun nowadays? |
| 12:20.50 | ShadowJK | Macer, several I'm sure |
| 12:20.51 | thresh | dottedmag: ohai |
| 12:20.54 | derf | glass: Leave. |
| 12:20.55 | Macer | glass: they move ;) |
| 12:20.57 | Macer | haha |
| 12:20.59 | dottedmag | thresh: preved |
| 12:21.13 | glass | haha |
| 12:21.14 | dottedmag | Macer: there are skams |
| 12:21.27 | Macer | skams? |
| 12:21.32 | dottedmag | glass: I'm damn sitting here in front of monitor. Not really fun. |
| 12:21.38 | Macer | is that a type of shellfish? |
| 12:21.51 | dottedmag | Macer: scams |
| 12:21.54 | RST38h | glass: Whoe republic of Mari El speaks sort of finnish |
| 12:22.00 | Macer | dottedmag: huh? |
| 12:22.17 | *** join/#maemo blade_runner (n=arezende@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:22.18 | Macer | capitalism is one big scam ;) |
| 12:22.28 | Macer | sell something worth less than someone else pays for it |
| 12:22.33 | glass | RST38h: if it's a whole republic it's not such pointless as a village with 50-100 people |
| 12:22.34 | RST38h | glass: And Komi too, or whatever is left of them anyway |
| 12:22.45 | dottedmag | Macer: read the history of Siberian wikipedia. They finally closed it fortunately. |
| 12:22.46 | RST38h | glass: And Mordovia |
| 12:23.01 | RST38h | glass: And Udmurtia, for that matter |
| 12:23.03 | Macer | oh. you mean siberian language :) |
| 12:23.14 | dottedmag | yep |
| 12:23.21 | Macer | i always just ifugred siberia was a part of Russia so people there spoke russian |
| 12:23.30 | thresh | of course they do |
| 12:23.37 | dottedmag | Yes, we do :) |
| 12:23.41 | Macer | heh |
| 12:23.43 | glass | vodka is vodka in any language |
| 12:23.46 | RST38h | Macer: "siberian" is a special case |
| 12:23.46 | thresh | they don't really look like proper humans, though |
| 12:23.49 | Macer | glass: haha |
| 12:23.52 | thresh | some of them have dog heads |
| 12:24.07 | dottedmag | And we all speak ISO-8859-5 |
| 12:24.07 | RST38h | Macer: There was a guy suggesting splitting Siberia off and he started by creating a language |
| 12:24.08 | thresh | as i've heard |
| 12:24.46 | ssvb | RST38h: or alternatively Russian language is a broken version of Ukrainian (result of the influence from Tatars when Russians were conquered by them), there is no point discussing this crap or take it serious |
| 12:25.10 | RST38h | ssvb: That won't fly, as there is no single dialect of Ukrainian |
| 12:25.19 | ShadowJK | Macer, Siberia is also where they dumped all the unwanted people. So there are hundreds of small communities isolated from the world with their own languages |
| 12:25.21 | dottedmag | BTW, regarding languages. |
| 12:25.25 | ShadowJK | iirc they're still discovering them today |
| 12:25.28 | dottedmag | where to look for input methods on incoming n900? |
| 12:25.29 | *** join/#maemo alextreem (n=alex@82-171-161-1.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 12:25.31 | RST38h | ssvb: The idea of a single proto-language from which they all developed is a valid one though |
| 12:25.35 | dottedmag | Are they adjustable? |
| 12:25.35 | Macer | ShadowJK: haha |
| 12:26.09 | *** join/#maemo tonikitoo| (n=tonikito@189.2.128.130) |
| 12:26.09 | Macer | RST38h: all languages are derived from another... look at english. :) doesn't it have the same characteristics? |
| 12:26.16 | RST38h | dottedmag: Two input methods, full screen kbd and physical kbd |
| 12:26.26 | Macer | you find all types of different english dialects throughout the US alone |
| 12:26.29 | dottedmag | RST38h: well, I'm interested in physical keyboard layout |
| 12:26.30 | RST38h | dottedmag: rest is apparently dead unless you are willing to add your own |
| 12:26.42 | dottedmag | Is it plain old xkb? |
| 12:26.51 | RST38h | Macer: There is standard American English though |
| 12:27.01 | glass_ | problem with finnish currently is that there's people who want to keep it pure, which is a failure as it seriously hampers engineering discussions and even teaching them |
| 12:27.03 | Macer | RST38h: there isn't standard russian? |
| 12:27.07 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (n=slonopot@pronto2comstar.hands.ru) |
| 12:27.11 | RST38h | Macer: There is |
| 12:27.17 | *** join/#maemo m3kyd (i=m3boy@93-173-163-203.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 12:27.20 | Macer | so what's the difference? |
| 12:27.29 | RST38h | Macer: But spoken Ukrainian varies so widely that you can't pin it down |
| 12:27.37 | Macer | most southerners in the US to not adhere to using standard english |
| 12:27.45 | RST38h | Macer: There is written, literary Ukrainian, but it is kinda artifical |
| 12:27.54 | dottedmag | RST38h: spoken German too, who cares? |
| 12:28.02 | ShadowJK | keeping finnish pure is a pretty strange concept, when lots of linguists love finnish because it has absorbed (and preserved) so many words from other languages over the centuries :) |
| 12:28.05 | Macer | RST38h: language evolution |
| 12:28.07 | RST38h | dottedmag: Don't know much about German |
| 12:28.18 | Macer | shakespeare invented hundreds of words |
| 12:28.29 | RST38h | Did he? |
| 12:28.36 | Macer | sure did ;) |
| 12:28.44 | RST38h | Example? =) |
| 12:28.50 | RST38h | wasn't aware |
| 12:28.52 | thresh | as well as Black Adder did |
| 12:29.23 | *** join/#maemo chenca (n=chenca@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:29.27 | Macer | http://piksels.com/words-invented-by-shakespeare/ |
| 12:29.38 | ShadowJK | As a funny sidenote, the guy who translated the Bible to finnish had to invent a word for "mercy" ;-) |
| 12:29.39 | RST38h | =) |
| 12:30.03 | Macer | so it might not be an "artificial" language.. simply the same language reinvented |
| 12:30.06 | Macer | which is very common |
| 12:30.16 | Macer | look at ebonic english for example |
| 12:30.19 | RST38h | macer: TORTURE? ASSASSINATION??? |
| 12:30.29 | Macer | amazing huh? |
| 12:30.30 | RST38h | Macer: No, it is not reinvented |
| 12:30.38 | RST38h | Macer: absolutely |
| 12:30.45 | Macer | sure it is |
| 12:30.53 | Macer | didn't we have this discussion before? :) |
| 12:31.02 | Macer | get enough people to call a tree a horse.. then a tree is a horse |
| 12:31.09 | RST38h | Macer: There are two discussions: if you mean Shakespeare, it is awesome |
| 12:31.15 | Macer | heh |
| 12:31.25 | Macer | i'm suprised you didn't know that ;) |
| 12:31.26 | RST38h | Macer: If you mean same language reinvented, it was not like that with Ukrainian |
| 12:31.40 | Macer | that is a tiny list |
| 12:31.46 | Macer | there are a lot of words he just made up |
| 12:31.55 | Macer | probably for poetic justice in some of his writings |
| 12:32.04 | RST38h | Macer: Multiple local dialects were gathered and the words were cherry picked from these dialects to create a synthetic language |
| 12:32.12 | RST38h | macer: Sorta like a local esperanto |
| 12:32.37 | Macer | RST38h: in abstract, one might say all languages are artificial ;) |
| 12:33.03 | RST38h | Macer: Wasn't evolution, wasn't reinvention, was rather a mashup. The result is not that bad btw, except that very few people speak it and every .UA nazi seems to be bent on changing it to his liking |
| 12:33.08 | Macer | which was my point with pointing out shakespearian invented words |
| 12:33.40 | RST38h | Macer: Not meaning anything deep or philosophical, really |
| 12:33.43 | Macer | english is derived from multiple languages also, which evolved over years |
| 12:34.12 | Macer | words start out locally and spread, and if enough people use the word it is accepted into the culture |
| 12:34.28 | RST38h | Macer: Way different story with English |
| 12:34.39 | Macer | why? because it was more recent? |
| 12:34.58 | RST38h | Macer: Because English has not been created by 3 intellectuals 150 years ago |
| 12:35.22 | RST38h | Macer: It evolved as result of different people speaking it, then writing in it |
| 12:35.31 | Macer | just because english had more people to create it doesn't make the Ukrane language any different |
| 12:35.58 | Macer | as i said. if you get enough people to use the same words.. then it is just another language |
| 12:36.09 | RST38h | Macer: Again, we are not talking "less" people, we are talking of a finite countable number of 3 :) |
| 12:36.09 | Macer | the speed of its evolution is irrelevant |
| 12:36.23 | Macer | so... like klingon ;) |
| 12:36.40 | RST38h | Macer: Klingon is completely artificial though but yes, I see your point :) |
| 12:36.43 | *** join/#maemo jgoss (n=josh@pool-98-111-5-170.sctnpa.east.verizon.net) |
| 12:37.12 | Macer | i still hold firm in every language being artificial |
| 12:37.27 | RST38h | Not really |
| 12:37.35 | timeless_mbp | ShadowJK: giving you an example requires me to pull out another phone |
| 12:37.38 | timeless_mbp | i'm too lazy to do that |
| 12:37.42 | Macer | i wish i could find an image of the painting that reminds me of this |
| 12:37.51 | RST38h | But there are some really funny examples, like Hebrew or modern Greek |
| 12:38.12 | Macer | i had this discussion in a humanities class where the painting was shown |
| 12:38.27 | Macer | it had proper words for things except a horse was called a door or something like that |
| 12:38.31 | lcuk | well thats the one im at |
| 12:38.35 | lcuk | shit |
| 12:38.35 | Macer | and the professor asked "why is it different?" |
| 12:39.01 | Macer | i told her "maybe in the artist's land.. a horse is called a door" |
| 12:39.03 | Macer | :) |
| 12:39.16 | *** join/#maemo wazd (n=Miranda@gwh-1-22-val21.ln.rinet.ru) |
| 12:39.28 | ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, ah. Nokia has mostly fixed that now IME :) |
| 12:39.52 | timeless_mbp | ? |
| 12:40.01 | timeless_mbp | i have 5 phones w/ batteries easily accessible, 4 w/ sims |
| 12:40.03 | Macer | words are just accepted descriptions |
| 12:40.17 | timeless_mbp | i'd just need to get one of the two that aren't n900s |
| 12:40.24 | Macer | so all language is artificial ... the moon is called the moon simply because most people have agreed on a name for it |
| 12:40.59 | timeless_mbp | Macer: yareach |
| 12:41.01 | ShadowJK | timeless_mbp, Oh. I thought you were ircing from s60v3fp0 and afraid of opening browser to find the example would kill the irc client ;) |
| 12:41.09 | timeless_mbp | oh, no |
| 12:41.17 | Macer | ShadowJK: hahaha |
| 12:41.21 | timeless_mbp | connecting to freenet typically causes my n81 to reboot |
| 12:41.26 | Macer | ShadowJK: that sounds more like android than symbian |
| 12:41.29 | timeless_mbp | _mbp = macbook pro |
| 12:41.45 | Macer | android randomly closes apps running in the background to free memory |
| 12:41.54 | Macer | it is idiotic |
| 12:42.01 | ShadowJK | Macer, symbian kills stuff when you run out of RAM, and early S60 nokia phones were very RAM-starved :) |
| 12:42.04 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslip (n=fnoridan@94-30-69-47.xdsl.murphx.net) |
| 12:42.13 | Macer | ShadowJK: hm. my n95 never seemed to do that |
| 12:42.23 | ShadowJK | N95 has 128M RAM |
| 12:42.46 | ShadowJK | It's more of an issue on the ones where you've got 14M ram free with no apps at all open |
| 12:42.46 | usir | n810 is amazingly scratch resistant |
| 12:43.03 | Macer | ShadowJK: heh. yeah .. like android ;) |
| 12:43.48 | Macer | my G1 is notrious forthat |
| 12:44.23 | *** join/#maemo hannesw (n=hannes@62-99-202-58.zollergasse.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 12:44.30 | Macer | mind you it has 192MB |
| 12:44.40 | glass | Macer: n95's ram situation improved a lot when they added on demand paging on fw update |
| 12:44.54 | kirma | N70 was nice otherwise... but it had 64M RAM or something. |
| 12:44.58 | kirma | E70 even |
| 12:45.06 | Macer | android is like the Vista of phones |
| 12:45.13 | glass | n70 had the most(?) of 2nd ed devices of free ram, was sweet |
| 12:45.15 | ShadowJK | oh wait, it's only N95 8g that has 128M ram.. the non-8g version has less ram |
| 12:45.18 | kirma | that was pretty horrible in contrast to earlier S60s |
| 12:45.27 | Macer | ShadowJK: i had the n95-3 |
| 12:45.38 | kirma | I typoed, E70 I meant... |
| 12:45.45 | glass | i think -3 had the bigger amount of ram too, not sure(it's on forum nokia pages though..) |
| 12:46.00 | Macer | glass: got rid of it when i got rid of att |
| 12:46.02 | *** join/#maemo chenca (n=chenca@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:46.04 | glass | 3250 however, is the biggest crapper of all s60's |
| 12:46.04 | usir | does ovi have a reasonable pay-to-play drm? |
| 12:46.13 | Macer | bought a black housing for it and sold it to someone for $150 |
| 12:46.28 | Macer | if i could find a way to bankrupt att on purpose i would do it :) |
| 12:46.31 | Macer | i hate att so much |
| 12:46.40 | RST38h | Who likes AT&T? |
| 12:46.41 | glass | hehe |
| 12:46.47 | glass | Macer: gov would bail it i'm afraid :\ |
| 12:46.48 | RST38h | Aside from Darth Vader that is |
| 12:46.50 | Macer | RST38h: i guess a lot of people |
| 12:46.53 | Macer | glass: hahaha |
| 12:47.00 | RST38h | I can't think of any |
| 12:47.03 | Macer | yeah. we've given up on true capitalism since enron |
| 12:47.14 | usir | since 1913 |
| 12:47.17 | Macer | RST38h: well. they are still the largest ;) |
| 12:47.18 | RST38h | way before that |
| 12:47.19 | jaska | speaking of s60s... i need to go loot the camera sensor from the 6600 |
| 12:47.36 | glass | jaska: is it easily interfaceable, to say, atmega projects? |
| 12:47.44 | Macer | RST38h: no. deregulation of power was a step towards real capitalism |
| 12:47.46 | jaska | dont know yet.. its lowres tho (vga) |
| 12:47.55 | Macer | too bad we had corperate hitlers running the show with it |
| 12:47.58 | SpeedEvil | glass: no |
| 12:48.02 | glass | jaska: yeh but i got a 6600 somewhere stashed hehe |
| 12:48.15 | jaska | it was my first and last symbian/s60:) |
| 12:48.19 | SpeedEvil | glass: essentially all phone cameras use the SCCM (?) bus |
| 12:48.37 | Macer | man i loved my n95 cam |
| 12:48.41 | glass | SpeedEvil: ok, would be easier to write a prog for symbian that dumped the data then i suppose |
| 12:48.44 | *** join/#maemo jukey (n=jukey@kamiserver.de) |
| 12:48.44 | Macer | i wish i could have kept my n95 with tmob |
| 12:48.50 | Macer | but they had to use their crazy freq |
| 12:49.20 | glass | 6600 has ir too. hmm |
| 12:49.21 | SpeedEvil | glass: this has I2C - to setup the camera - which the micro can do fine. And then it has a parallel databus that you have to read fast enough to read the whole camera data out in 1/60th of a second. They don't have any onboard storage - and going slower than that will not give a picture |
| 12:49.40 | glass | okays |
| 12:49.41 | usir | in germany most phones can run on most networks, iirc |
| 12:49.56 | SpeedEvil | glass: very few small micros can read most of a megabyte in 1/60th sec |
| 12:50.04 | glass | in europe in most regions the operators played nice with others when choosing tech |
| 12:50.31 | Macer | glass: well. in the US they are all cut throat |
| 12:51.15 | Macer | i'm sure berkley is sad they allowed the gnu to come about |
| 12:51.17 | glass | yeh been following some usa mobilers |
| 12:51.49 | Macer | i just pray that the n900 is supported by tmob |
| 12:52.00 | RST38h | macer: cut customers' throat that is |
| 12:52.04 | Macer | if it's not i'm giving up on a phone altogether |
| 12:52.11 | Macer | RST38h: oh. that's all business ;) |
| 12:52.11 | glass | hehe |
| 12:52.24 | Macer | some places aren't like that.. like usually newspapers work together |
| 12:52.35 | *** join/#maemo alecrim (n=alecrim@189.2.128.130) |
| 12:52.55 | Macer | they try not to step on each other's toes in order to keep sales stable |
| 12:53.22 | usir | i wonder what government regulatory structure incentivises this market failure |
| 12:53.23 | Macer | that's the only business i can think of though heh |
| 12:53.50 | Macer | usir: low pricing |
| 12:54.28 | Macer | and i don't really think it is the government regulatory structure |
| 12:55.06 | Macer | realisticailly, if the economy takes off and the government profits from its bail out money by selling shares for 2x their worth when bought. how much of that money do you think will truly make it into a tax cut? :) |
| 12:55.40 | Macer | is thinking none considering the country's debt |
| 12:55.48 | usir | if you dont know the answer just admit |
| 12:56.11 | Macer | misdirection didn't work huh? :) |
| 12:56.27 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@9.148.45.66.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 12:56.58 | usir | smart guz :) |
| 12:57.04 | Macer | hahaha |
| 12:57.24 | Macer | wasn't a term of the car bail out that manufacturing comes back into the US? |
| 12:57.55 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 12:58.15 | Macer | and that unions were told to take a pay cut in order to cushion the car companies? |
| 12:58.27 | usir | Roosevelt killed 6 million pigs. Obama kills x million cars. Same stupidity, 80 years later |
| 12:58.33 | RST38h | For manufacturing to come back, USD should fall to 1/2-1/3 of its current value |
| 12:58.41 | usir | right |
| 12:58.41 | Macer | that seems like a good incentive for both the unemployed and companies |
| 12:58.51 | RST38h | would rather prefer USD to stay the same |
| 12:59.12 | Macer | RST38h: i'm sure it will fall when china starts dumping dollars :) |
| 12:59.12 | *** join/#maemo kabtoffe (n=kbergstr@80.221.13.14) |
| 12:59.27 | RST38h | Macer: Which means China can't start dumping dollars. |
| 12:59.35 | asj_wrk | no no the USD should fall like crazy, I'm about to leave the US and still have a mortage in USD ;) |
| 12:59.41 | usir | impossible with the human capitol in USA now rst |
| 13:00.08 | RST38h | usir: what? can't work at assembly lines? |
| 13:00.17 | usir | can not build much high tech with them. capitol investments can not zoeld high productivity |
| 13:00.20 | RST38h | or have you meant something else? |
| 13:00.52 | *** join/#maemo lmoura_ (n=lauro@mobile.cin.ufpe.br) |
| 13:00.53 | usir | no, high eff. requires flexi workers. yes, usa can still do poor quality assembly line work |
| 13:01.12 | RST38h | Ahhhhahahahaha |
| 13:01.19 | *** join/#maemo fiferboy (n=quassel@216.185.81.34) |
| 13:01.20 | Macer | :) |
| 13:01.22 | Macer | that's rough |
| 13:01.28 | RST38h | Apple pulls iPhone C=64 from its store AGAIN! |
| 13:01.51 | Macer | usir: the global economy ;) |
| 13:01.55 | RST38h | They have found that you can still program in C=64 BASIC inside the emulator and THEORETICALLY use it to break iPhone |
| 13:02.20 | usir | heh nice |
| 13:02.23 | RST38h | facepalms |
| 13:02.27 | Macer | RST38h: wow they sure are hellbent on preventing it huh? |
| 13:02.36 | Macer | is it that serious? :) |
| 13:02.39 | RST38h | Preventing what? :) |
| 13:02.55 | asj_wrk | the terms and conditions of the SDK says no 3rd party programming languages or something like that |
| 13:03.03 | RST38h | I mean, who in their right mind would come up with this scenario, BASIC running on artificial hardware and all? |
| 13:03.05 | SpeedEvil | Unless there is a C64 app store |
| 13:03.18 | Macer | SpeedEvil: hahaha |
| 13:03.24 | SpeedEvil | Then you can upload your own c64 asm app |
| 13:03.31 | SpeedEvil | to the emulator |
| 13:03.36 | SpeedEvil | so basic doesn't matter |
| 13:03.46 | usir | i hope the initial responses on n900 are good enough to warrant future cheaper models soon |
| 13:03.59 | RST38h | usir: Q1. Fremantle based. |
| 13:04.07 | RST38h | user: Harmattan in Q3/Q4. |
| 13:04.22 | Macer | what is the cost in $ for an n900? |
| 13:04.22 | SpeedEvil | I hope the initial responses on the n900 are for many chinese vendors to start shipping phones. |
| 13:04.23 | RST38h | Apparent model numbers are RX-71 and RX-56 |
| 13:04.25 | asj_wrk | SpeedEvil: you maybe only able to get apps through the c64 emulator vendor, or so I'm guessing |
| 13:04.31 | Macer | i remmber the nokiaworld brief was in euros |
| 13:04.33 | SpeedEvil | MaceR: $699? |
| 13:04.34 | usir | thank you |
| 13:04.36 | Macer | oh |
| 13:04.43 | Macer | not too bad if it can deliver :) |
| 13:04.48 | SpeedEvil | yeah - that sounds right |
| 13:04.55 | AStorm | usir: I don't know how can it be made any cheaper except by cutting features |
| 13:05.03 | Macer | is reminded of the e90 |
| 13:05.09 | Macer | fail |
| 13:05.15 | jaska | s60 on a communicator :( |
| 13:05.23 | usir | over time perhaps astorm |
| 13:05.24 | Macer | jaska: heh yeah |
| 13:05.24 | RST38h | AStorm: subtract keyboard, FM chip, GSM chip |
| 13:05.41 | RST38h | AStorm: cut mmc1 to 8GB |
| 13:06.01 | RST38h | AStorm: cut camera to 3mpx |
| 13:06.03 | Macer | yeah, but then you'd have the poor man's N900 |
| 13:06.10 | AStorm | RST38h: and you'll end up with a useless junk phone? ;) |
| 13:06.13 | Macer | like a 6cyl mustang |
| 13:06.17 | RST38h | No, it will be LIGHT, every man's N900 |
| 13:06.26 | Komzpa | cut processor, ram and get n800 :) |
| 13:06.29 | AStorm | except it will be 1/3 as usable |
| 13:06.32 | RST38h | AStorm: No, as all the software will still be running |
| 13:06.32 | Macer | RST38h: like i said. the poor man's :) |
| 13:06.32 | SpeedEvil | cut mmc1 to 0 |
| 13:06.50 | usir | i suspect rst has a good plan |
| 13:06.54 | RST38h | AStorm: Yes it will cut down on some usage scenarios, but it won't be that bad. See cheaper version of 5800 |
| 13:07.08 | Macer | $700 for a phone that has as much power as a slower computer? i think it's worth it |
| 13:07.19 | asj_wrk | rst is right, look at the 5320 or 5230 what ever it is, cheap at dirt 5800 |
| 13:07.19 | Macer | but maemo will have to be amazing |
| 13:07.34 | SpeedEvil | Personally - cut mmc1 to 0 - add two SD slots - 640*480 4" or so display, lose the small camera, ... |
| 13:07.38 | RST38h | AStorm: To see Nokia having done it before, check out 7650/3650 and N95/following phones |
| 13:07.57 | RST38h | AStorm: Also look at 5800/5320, as asj says |
| 13:08.06 | Macer | SpeedEvil: it has 2 cams? |
| 13:08.08 | RST38h | AStorm: You will easily see the pattern |
| 13:08.33 | Macer | heh |
| 13:08.41 | SpeedEvil | MaceR: yes |
| 13:08.45 | asj_wrk | a more interesting question though is, would you want to do that? if Maemo is the high end fancy device do you want to create a neutered version of it? That can kill a market since people tend to buy something cheap first they may get a bad taste for it. |
| 13:08.47 | Macer | if it has the 2 cam thing going on like the n95 |
| 13:09.01 | Macer | wow it would be awesome if i could use google video on it to see my son |
| 13:09.03 | RST38h | asj: it will actually extend the market |
| 13:09.19 | usir | google video does video chat? |
| 13:09.19 | RST38h | asj: again, see how it turned out on previous turns |
| 13:09.32 | Macer | usir: yeah |
| 13:09.41 | asj_wrk | RST38h: only if it's a truely good device on it's own though |
| 13:09.42 | Macer | browser plugin now only i believe |
| 13:09.44 | SpeedEvil | asj_wrk: I don't personally care if it has the nokia badge |
| 13:09.49 | Macer | i've used it. works well |
| 13:10.07 | RST38h | asj: Nokia throws expensive kitchen sink at early adopters/fans. Nokia watches carefully how that kitchen sink is being used. Nokia comes up with several mass-market devices that implement viable usage scenarios observed in step #2 |
| 13:10.20 | asj_wrk | lol, now that's what I want, Ad block pro on my mobile browser :) |
| 13:10.26 | RST38h | asj: It will be a truly good device, at least when compared to S60 |
| 13:10.28 | asj_wrk | RST38h: gotcha |
| 13:10.35 | SpeedEvil | asj_wrk: I have no objection to nokia 'winning' - but if a chinese vendor sticks something nice out at half the price... |
| 13:10.35 | AStorm | Macer: $700 for a phone that has more power than eeePC |
| 13:10.36 | usir | anytime i see browser + high perfomance app (videoy) i want to puke blood |
| 13:10.43 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@80.220.238.64) |
| 13:10.49 | Macer | AStorm: and probably lasts just as long on a single charge? |
| 13:10.50 | Macer | ;) |
| 13:10.51 | SpeedEvil | usir: No - think positive! |
| 13:10.57 | SpeedEvil | usir: make them puke blood! |
| 13:10.58 | Macer | probably longer |
| 13:11.07 | AStorm | yes longer, especially when idle |
| 13:11.14 | tigert | how long do eepc's go? |
| 13:11.32 | AStorm | 5h |
| 13:11.32 | SpeedEvil | tigert: 4h or so |
| 13:11.32 | Macer | well. i was thinking "in use" |
| 13:11.32 | tigert | the problem is, the more fun the device is, the less it is idle :P |
| 13:11.32 | SpeedEvil | tigert: lots more if you suspend |
| 13:11.34 | Stskeeps | impressive |
| 13:11.48 | Stskeeps | one day after company registration in .pl i already get spam |
| 13:11.49 | AStorm | suspend can be done on n900 as well... if it's not already there |
| 13:11.57 | Macer | Stskeeps: hahaha! |
| 13:12.02 | Stskeeps | and mail spam |
| 13:12.04 | AStorm | Stskeeps: .pl spam? |
| 13:12.06 | Stskeeps | written with address in hand |
| 13:12.16 | AStorm | yeah :P |
| 13:12.27 | AStorm | those databases are almost transparent |
| 13:13.12 | Macer | Stskeeps: well. whatever you do don't give your bank acct # for your distant Nigerian price relative who left you in his will |
| 13:13.16 | Stskeeps | i'm warsaw based now so :P |
| 13:13.17 | dottedmag | contact information of companies is public information, isn't it? |
| 13:13.21 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 13:13.25 | asj_wrk | RST38h: well, I had a lot of hope for the N97, but s60v5 is such a mess, especially when programming for it. Symbian C++ feels like I backed up 10+ years, and capabilities just make it worse. It's sad. |
| 13:13.28 | Stskeeps | still, that was quick |
| 13:14.15 | *** join/#maemo m3kyd (i=m3boy@93-173-163-203.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 13:14.19 | Macer | well. time for me to unwind |
| 13:15.06 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslipeee (n=darren@94.30.69.47) |
| 13:15.07 | *** join/#maemo renato (n=renato@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:21.06 | AStorm | Stskeeps: hiring? ;> |
| 13:21.25 | m3kyd | gimmie an n900 |
| 13:21.29 | m3kyd | plz |
| 13:21.31 | AStorm | m3kyd: buy one. |
| 13:21.37 | Stskeeps | AStorm: one man company but one of my purposes is actually mobile development.. |
| 13:21.47 | AStorm | hehe |
| 13:21.59 | AStorm | subcontractor? |
| 13:22.07 | m3kyd | $650 and only in october! |
| 13:22.07 | Stskeeps | subsub atm |
| 13:22.43 | Stskeeps | right, back to hacking |
| 13:22.53 | *** join/#maemo amaurymedeiros (n=amaury@150.165.63.86) |
| 13:24.13 | ccooke | I think I'm being a moron. Can someone point me at the latest fremantle API docs? I can't seem to find anything more recent than a few months ago |
| 13:24.29 | RST38h | asj: I still can't figure out how to do working settings lists on 5800 |
| 13:24.51 | RST38h | asj: and the direct screen access crashes when I rotate the damn thing |
| 13:25.32 | RST38h | asj: on the other hand, user experience is fine as far as I am concerned |
| 13:25.58 | fiferboy | lcuk: ping? |
| 13:26.14 | lcuk | yes fiferboy |
| 13:26.46 | fiferboy | I've pushed an app to extras-devel, but I need someone to run it on a device... |
| 13:27.49 | *** join/#maemo brolin_ (n=brolin@iner.udea.edu.co) |
| 13:28.09 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:28.13 | lcuk | fiferboy, unfortunately now isnt the time |
| 13:28.22 | lcuk | i would normally be happy to |
| 13:28.31 | fiferboy | lcuk: Yeah, I wasn't sure if you would be able too |
| 13:28.44 | fiferboy | I imagine you need your N900 in a pretty stable state right now |
| 13:28.59 | lcuk | hah |
| 13:29.01 | lcuk | its not that |
| 13:29.03 | lcuk | im still coding |
| 13:29.09 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@67.72.73.34) |
| 13:29.14 | lcuk | liqbase is crashing left right and centre |
| 13:29.20 | lcuk | but im just gonna have to make do :) |
| 13:29.26 | lcuk | the onedotzero app is solid tho |
| 13:29.27 | *** join/#maemo etrunko (n=edulima@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:29.28 | fiferboy | Ah |
| 13:29.32 | lcuk | and in their testing they havent mentioned anything |
| 13:30.00 | fiferboy | Does anyone with an N900 want to test a new app? |
| 13:30.38 | lcuk | how about you testing liqbase-playground on your 810 for me |
| 13:30.44 | lcuk | and when i have 5 mins ill test yours |
| 13:30.53 | vesa | fiferboy: what kind? |
| 13:31.09 | fiferboy | vesa: A desktop applet |
| 13:31.10 | *** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-feeedc00-64.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 13:31.18 | fiferboy | lcuk: The version in extras-devel? |
| 13:31.21 | lcuk | yeah |
| 13:31.24 | lcuk | got updated last night |
| 13:31.28 | lcuk | might even have an icon now |
| 13:31.54 | fiferboy | vesa: It is called countdown-home, it allows you to display the time remaining (or passed) to different important dates you might have |
| 13:32.39 | vesa | fiferboy: you got a link somewhere? i haven't had much time to look at the device yet but i can ask how to install =) |
| 13:33.01 | lcuk | lol fiferboy |
| 13:33.07 | lcuk | make a liq* version :P |
| 13:33.11 | lcuk | it would be simple |
| 13:33.20 | fiferboy | vesa: It is in extras-devel, so as long as you have that repo you can get it through the app manager |
| 13:33.29 | fiferboy | lcuk: Can liq* do desktop applets? |
| 13:33.39 | lcuk | all liq* stuff are applets |
| 13:33.44 | lcuk | from full apps to silly screens |
| 13:33.47 | lcuk | everything is a plugin |
| 13:34.01 | fiferboy | lcuk: Ah, yes |
| 13:34.24 | lcuk | when i compile them i produce 2 binaries |
| 13:34.26 | fiferboy | lcuk: I'm install playground on my n810 now |
| 13:34.34 | lcuk | :D kewl |
| 13:35.14 | lcuk | it would be good to see how much i still respect optimal running :) |
| 13:35.29 | lcuk | fiferboy, when you get an n900 you will be blown away |
| 13:35.34 | fiferboy | lcuk: I'll try to be brutally honest |
| 13:35.35 | lcuk | theres so much cpu available |
| 13:35.40 | lcuk | oh gawd |
| 13:35.42 | fiferboy | lcuk: IF I get a N900... |
| 13:36.16 | fiferboy | lcuk: dev program would likely be my only shot for a new device in the next few years |
| 13:36.20 | vesa | fiferboy: ooh, not too bad the ui here. i got the repo showing with no help. although it's now stuck on 'checking for updates, please wait' |
| 13:36.53 | timeless_mbp | fiferboy: i can try |
| 13:37.09 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: That would be fantastic |
| 13:37.18 | lcuk | laughs |
| 13:37.26 | lcuk | evily |
| 13:37.26 | timeless_mbp | fiferboy: please remember that you should provide a pretty name and an icon for your deb :) |
| 13:37.37 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: If you could, could you send me a screen shot? I want to know what it looks like without the graphical glitches in scratchbox... |
| 13:37.55 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: That will be in the next version :) |
| 13:39.53 | timeless_mbp | so, the widget title is too wide, it effectively doesn't fit into the box |
| 13:39.57 | timeless_mbp | i'd suggest "Countdown" |
| 13:40.00 | vesa | fiferboy: whats the app called? |
| 13:40.03 | timeless_mbp | and make sure there's padding |
| 13:40.07 | fiferboy | vesa: countdown-home |
| 13:40.12 | vesa | ah, right. i'm blind =) |
| 13:40.20 | timeless_mbp | fiferboy: also |
| 13:40.26 | timeless_mbp | you're not really doing things the way we want them done |
| 13:40.32 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: Ok... |
| 13:40.37 | timeless_mbp | you're supposed to plug into this other thing |
| 13:40.39 | timeless_mbp | don't ask me how |
| 13:41.17 | vesa | fiferboy: screenshot utility, you know of one? |
| 13:41.31 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: What is the other thing? Something that unifies the desktop? |
| 13:41.43 | fiferboy | vesa: I don't, unfortunately :| |
| 13:42.35 | fiferboy | lcuk: The liqbase icon show up! |
| 13:42.41 | lcuk | :D:D:D:D:D:D |
| 13:42.45 | lcuk | thats qwerty magic |
| 13:42.57 | esaym153 | is there an sshd package that makes it easy to start and stop sshd? |
| 13:43.04 | esaym153 | I don't want it running all the time |
| 13:43.21 | lcuk | why |
| 13:43.27 | timeless_mbp | esaym153: no :) |
| 13:43.29 | fiferboy | lcuk: I saw the "thanks to qwerty :)" banner on install |
| 13:43.32 | esaym153 | :( |
| 13:43.33 | lcuk | :D |
| 13:43.43 | lcuk | fiferboy, his name is littered around |
| 13:43.48 | timeless_mbp | esaym153: it'd be fairly easy to write a control panel or widget to do that |
| 13:43.57 | lcuk | his knowledge of all things linux is immense and he has the hacker spirit :) |
| 13:43.57 | timeless_mbp | there might even be a more generic one for managing services |
| 13:44.05 | lcuk | (and when he reads this he will smile and blush) |
| 13:44.10 | esaym153 | will having sshd running all the time reduce battery life? |
| 13:44.11 | *** join/#maemo MaceN8x0 (n=macer@rancorous.net) |
| 13:44.18 | timeless_mbp | not significantly |
| 13:44.24 | fiferboy | lcuk: Is there a way to make liqbase run full-screen? |
| 13:44.50 | lcuk | yeah |
| 13:44.57 | lcuk | ~/.liqbase/liqbase.prefs |
| 13:45.00 | lcuk | add fullscreen=1 |
| 13:45.09 | lcuk | i wanted windowed mode for a video i was making |
| 13:45.14 | lcuk | but its a bit buggy |
| 13:45.21 | lcuk | and aspect ratio of strokes is a bit off |
| 13:45.35 | fiferboy | lcuk: That was going to be my next comment :) |
| 13:46.08 | *** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@office.pov.lt) |
| 13:46.11 | esaym153 | timeless_mbp: to make a script start sshd it would have to be root right? |
| 13:46.27 | lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liqbase_mediareply.php?replyname=lcuk&replyid=169 |
| 13:46.34 | asj_wrk | RST38h: well, if you could the double click/single click as incredibly annoying user experiance I think that alone is enough to drive anyone up the wall |
| 13:46.37 | timeless_mbp | you mean suid? |
| 13:46.39 | timeless_mbp | shrugs |
| 13:46.44 | timeless_mbp | depends on how those scripts work |
| 13:46.44 | lcuk | esaym153, or you could add to sudoers |
| 13:46.52 | vesa | fiferboy: it shows on the desktop. that's about how much it works =P |
| 13:47.05 | fiferboy | lcuk: Drawing and scrolling look as smooth as ever |
| 13:47.16 | fiferboy | vesa: You can't configure it, or add events? |
| 13:47.19 | asj_wrk | s/could/count/ |
| 13:47.27 | vesa | fiferboy: oh sorry, my date is all off on the device =P |
| 13:47.33 | asj_wrk | lol that's cute |
| 13:47.38 | lcuk | fiferboy, |
| 13:47.42 | lcuk | on the playground |
| 13:47.50 | lcuk | type "flow" |
| 13:47.55 | lcuk | and open up liqflow :) |
| 13:47.57 | vesa | fiferboy: you can add dates, add the title and they show up |
| 13:47.57 | esaym153 | lcuk: by that you mean I would have to define the program location in sudoers right? I think I remember doing something like that before... |
| 13:48.08 | vesa | fiferboy: the background is full black though, not seethrough |
| 13:48.30 | lcuk | esaym153, im not a linux guy but yeah i think so |
| 13:48.46 | fiferboy | vesa: Thanks, that was one of the things I was wondering about |
| 13:48.52 | fiferboy | lcuk: SWEET! |
| 13:49.02 | lcuk | did you draw on it |
| 13:49.08 | fiferboy | lcuk: You bet I did! |
| 13:49.11 | lcuk | :D |
| 13:49.19 | vesa | fiferboy: the countdown time does seem to be correct =) |
| 13:49.21 | lcuk | with the accelerometer it also falls |
| 13:49.25 | lcuk | always to the ground |
| 13:49.28 | fiferboy | vesa: Something encouraging! |
| 13:49.31 | lcuk | no matter what orientation |
| 13:49.43 | fiferboy | lcuk: I got it swirling in a sweet circle |
| 13:49.50 | lcuk | yeah its like a blackhole |
| 13:49.55 | fiferboy | lcuk: I might leave my tablet like this until the battery dies! |
| 13:50.10 | lcuk | with the accelerometer the interactions are even more sweet because it introduces randomness |
| 13:50.12 | *** join/#maemo amit_usual (n=Amit@59.178.60.251) |
| 13:50.15 | lcuk | i do |
| 13:50.17 | fiferboy | vesa: Do the dialogs look correct? |
| 13:50.19 | vesa | fiferboy: removing a date, makes the widget size stay as before |
| 13:50.24 | vesa | ie. it doesn't resize to being smaller |
| 13:50.33 | fiferboy | vesa: Yes, I have to fix that. thanks |
| 13:50.34 | vesa | fiferboy: yeah, they look right |
| 13:50.35 | esaym153 | ok so now, should I used the dropbear sshd or the openssh sshd? |
| 13:50.43 | fiferboy | vesa: What about adding more than three events? |
| 13:51.17 | timeless_mbp | pokes fiferboy |
| 13:51.17 | msh_ | esaym153: dropbear, of course :) |
| 13:51.21 | msh_ | (I may be biased) |
| 13:51.32 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: Yes? |
| 13:51.35 | esaym153 | yea I am thinking dropbear too |
| 13:51.35 | timeless_mbp | see /query |
| 13:51.41 | timeless_mbp | i gave you a bunch of bits of feedback |
| 13:51.45 | vesa | fiferboy: you get big buttons to the right for scrolling |
| 13:52.04 | vesa | passed events work too =) |
| 13:52.13 | msh_ | esaym153: actually not sure there'll be that much diff in size. though depends how crammed the device is |
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| 13:53.12 | timeless_mbp | fiferboy: i wouldn't use "passed", you might use "overdue" |
| 13:53.17 | timeless_mbp | or "ago" |
| 13:53.23 | timeless_mbp | depending on your goal |
| 13:54.24 | esaym153 | does the dropbear ssh client have scp? |
| 13:54.28 | *** join/#maemo joelmaher (n=joelmahe@67.205.203.107) |
| 13:54.34 | esaym153 | or is that just an openssh thing? |
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| 13:56.12 | mgedmin | always used openssh on his tablets because he was afraid there *might* be features missing in dropbear |
| 13:56.35 | timeless_mbp | fiferboy: "Refresh*" ... "*requires restart to take effect" |
| 13:56.38 | timeless_mbp | restarting *what* ? |
| 13:56.52 | timeless_mbp | also, "Countdown Global Settings"... |
| 13:56.58 | timeless_mbp | I'd probably write "Global Countdown Settings" |
| 13:57.02 | timeless_mbp | (don't ask me why) |
| 13:57.05 | RST38h | What is the point in using dropbear anyway> |
| 13:57.34 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: Actually, it doesn't require a restart any more, I'll have to change that line |
| 13:57.40 | timeless_mbp | :) |
| 13:57.56 | timeless_mbp | personally, i'd also change it to something like: |
| 13:58.04 | timeless_mbp | Update Every [ 1 minute ] |
| 13:58.10 | timeless_mbp | where the time is part of the number |
| 13:58.18 | timeless_mbp | and you have no label in the widget |
| 13:58.30 | esaym153 | RST38h: I think it is just smaller, hopefully it will use less cpu cycles when transfering too... |
| 13:58.33 | timeless_mbp | using shrunken text is mostly annoying |
| 13:58.35 | *** join/#maemo usul (n=Muad@p54B2DEF4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:58.51 | timeless_mbp | also, please kill the accelerators on "OK" |
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| 13:58.56 | timeless_mbp | they're an eyesore :) |
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| 13:59.08 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: Gotcha, thanks |
| 13:59.29 | timeless_mbp | um |
| 13:59.32 | timeless_mbp | you crashed hildon-home |
| 13:59.35 | timeless_mbp | i think |
| 14:00.06 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: On remove? |
| 14:00.21 | timeless_mbp | approximately |
| 14:00.29 | usul | there times when i could be presented with a team of professional ladies in a state of undress, and i would easily prefer playing javispedro's DrNokSnes Super Nintendo emulator |
| 14:00.33 | timeless_mbp | perhaps you didn't kill your timer before you removed your widget |
| 14:00.52 | timeless_mbp | fiferboy: if you want someone to grovel for a stack trace, that could be arranged |
| 14:00.56 | timeless_mbp | but i'd sooner do something else :) |
| 14:01.20 | timeless_mbp | hildon-home-6C3E-11-1079.rcore.lzo |
| 14:01.29 | timeless_mbp | that'd mean something to someone @nokia |
| 14:02.10 | timeless_mbp | hrm |
| 14:02.17 | timeless_mbp | your description has too many hard line wraps |
| 14:02.35 | timeless_mbp | and your category is bad :) |
| 14:02.37 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: I do a "g_source_remove" on the timer id, but it might be coming too late |
| 14:02.46 | timeless_mbp | shrugs |
| 14:02.55 | wazd | lcuk: http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/08/video-high-res-image-enlargement-tech-for-ps3-and-psp-takes-ext/ |
| 14:02.59 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: I do it on the hitem destroy dignal |
| 14:03.01 | timeless_mbp | if you want to find out, ask sp3000 or someone to look up the stack :) |
| 14:03.31 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: Thanks. Also, do we not need to hard wrap the description for the app manager? |
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| 14:03.56 | timeless_mbp | ham should be responsible for dealing w/ line wrapping in the long description field, i think |
| 14:04.02 | fiferboy | Excellent |
| 14:04.04 | timeless_mbp | i'll let someone correct me if i'm terribly wrong |
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| 14:04.34 | timeless_mbp | i think debian says that your description lines should be ~78 chars long |
| 14:04.44 | timeless_mbp | so yes you should wrap, but nowhere near where you're doing it |
| 14:04.54 | timeless_mbp | and someone should remind me to shoot ham for using such a small font |
| 14:05.26 | timeless_mbp | rootsh's description is slightly better than yours |
| 14:05.40 | timeless_mbp | for now, assume it's doing things properly |
| 14:05.44 | timeless_mbp | and follow its example |
| 14:06.30 | fiferboy | timeless_mbp: Thanks |
| 14:06.50 | timeless_mbp | bangs head |
| 14:07.11 | timeless_mbp | someone should probably tell the getting starting wizard people that their debian description is visible |
| 14:07.24 | timeless_mbp | ... and that the n900 is not an internet tablet ... |
| 14:08.12 | timeless_mbp | sp3000: hey, Belfast just made BBC :) |
| 14:08.55 | timeless_mbp | anyone here familiar w/ the package promotion ui? |
| 14:08.58 | sp3000 | hm? |
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| 14:10.18 | timeless_mbp | oh, there was a couple hundred pound explosive somewhere nearby |
| 14:10.21 | timeless_mbp | which they defused |
| 14:10.41 | ShadowJK | timeless, do people in suits and dark shades come and stare at you and "educate" you it's a "mobile computer"? :) |
| 14:10.51 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=rsalveti@200.184.118.130) |
| 14:10.59 | timeless_mbp | that clearly don't do a very good job |
| 14:11.02 | fiferboy | sp3000: timeless_mbp mentioned that you may be able to look up a stck trace for me? |
| 14:11.08 | fiferboy | sp3000: hildon-home-6C3E-11-1079.rcore.lzo |
| 14:11.11 | Jaffa | timeless_mbp: fiferboy: Debian packaging standard says that lines should be wrapped in the Description: field in debian/control. There's a HAM bug where it does its own wrapping on top, without unwrapping the field first. |
| 14:11.18 | sp3000 | a bit later |
| 14:11.22 | timeless_mbp | Jaffa: glory |
| 14:11.25 | fiferboy | sp3000: Thanks! |
| 14:11.29 | sp3000 | heads out for a run, hopes it doesn't rain too much |
| 14:11.37 | timeless_mbp | since the owner of the tutorial didn't get the memo |
| 14:11.38 | fiferboy | Jaffa: Good to know |
| 14:12.08 | fiferboy | lbt: ping? |
| 14:12.10 | Jaffa | timeless_mbp: fiferboy: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5076 |
| 14:12.12 | lcuk | Jaffa, if people are worried about travel to summit |
| 14:12.13 | *** join/#maemo lopz (i=gentoo@unaffiliated/lopz) |
| 14:12.24 | lcuk | i think im just about to get a ticket now to go to london |
| 14:12.28 | lcuk | leaving in about 2 hours |
| 14:12.55 | Jaffa | lcuk: I'll wave as my train goes past you in the opposite direction at about 18:45 ;-) |
| 14:13.00 | lcuk | haha |
| 14:13.14 | lcuk | its gonna be manic tho |
| 14:13.21 | lcuk | rushhour out of manchester.. |
| 14:13.35 | lcuk | well |
| 14:13.42 | qwerty12_N810 | Jaffa: You mean that you *willingly* go up north? :) |
| 14:13.42 | lcuk | i suppose it is worse for you lol |
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| 14:14.02 | timeless_mbp | anyone know the author of "belltower" ? |
| 14:14.42 | lbt | fiferboy: pong |
| 14:15.07 | fiferboy | lbt: I know you have been busy, but have you looked at my finger scroll changes? |
| 14:15.28 | lbt | ummm |
| 14:15.29 | Jaffa | qwerty12_N810: Only every day when I'm going home ;-p |
| 14:15.34 | Jaffa | qwerty12_N810: London sucks |
| 14:16.04 | lbt | "Fix for the "Infinite Oscillation" bug in finger scrolling" |
| 14:16.10 | lbt | ? |
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| 14:16.23 | qwerty12_N810 | Jaffa: Lies... there's a reason why I'm not up north anymore :p |
| 14:16.47 | fiferboy | lbt: In my clone I have a "fs-exp" branch that fixes a bunch of bugs and makes the overshoot a bit more logical |
| 14:17.07 | lbt | ah... url? |
| 14:17.08 | qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: I don't know him but he seems to be on some IRC channels with the nick of "marnanel" |
| 14:17.10 | fiferboy | lbt: It kind of seemed to me that overshoot was smoother on my N810, but it could have been complete placebo |
| 14:17.16 | lopz | hi |
| 14:17.23 | lbt | fiferboy: I just started on this again over the last day or so |
| 14:17.30 | lbt | you probably saw on the list |
| 14:17.34 | fiferboy | lbt: Yes. |
| 14:17.47 | lbt | hates gcc and co |
| 14:17.49 | fiferboy | lbt: It looks like Antonio has some nice changes coming up for fremantle |
| 14:17.57 | lbt | *nod* |
| 14:18.10 | fiferboy | lbt: http://qt.gitorious.org/~fiferboy/qt/fiferboys-clone/commits/exp-fs |
| 14:18.34 | fiferboy | lbt: The lack of hildon-stackable-window was very noticable in my application |
| 14:18.44 | timeless_mbp | Jaffa: so how exactly does this promotion stuff work? |
| 14:19.11 | timeless_mbp | i keep trying to click on a thumb, and it feels like nothing happens |
| 14:19.12 | lbt | fiferboy: yes, I'm rebuilding shopper too and it looks/feels good |
| 14:19.25 | lbt | the current scroll is working really well on Diablo too |
| 14:19.41 | lbt | and I have merged Gesture support into it too |
| 14:19.44 | fiferboy | lbt: The parentless dialog thing is a bit annoying in some cases |
| 14:20.00 | fiferboy | lbt: Gesture support into the finger scrolling patches? |
| 14:20.05 | lbt | so you can select/delete using a stroke and the like |
| 14:20.16 | lbt | sorry, not into |
| 14:20.24 | lbt | alongside - compatible |
| 14:20.42 | lbt | phone - back in a bit |
| 14:21.33 | Stskeeps | mm, anyone know any good tools to diff two .c files which has been indented in different ways? |
| 14:21.40 | timeless_mbp | wonders how transmission got negative karma |
| 14:21.42 | timeless_mbp | diff -w ? |
| 14:22.05 | Stskeeps | hmm, maybe |
| 14:22.08 | thp | Stskeeps: run the tool 'indent' on both and then diff normally? |
| 14:22.18 | qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: easily... that build sucks |
| 14:22.50 | Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: that seems to have done the trick, ta |
| 14:23.41 | RST38h | "Windows 7 reintroduces remoted BSOD" |
| 14:23.44 | RST38h | heh |
| 14:23.46 | Jaffa | timeless_mbp: It's possible that the thumbs on the promotion page suffer from the same "don't give any feedback until the AJAX call completes" problem as /news/ |
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| 14:41.24 | timeless_mbp | Jaffa: sounds right |
| 14:47.58 | Jaffa | ~seen X-Fade |
| 14:48.01 | infobot | x-fade is currently on #maemo (18h 17m 54s), last said: 'timeless_mbp: Walk over to Ed.'. |
| 14:48.16 | timeless_mbp | fwiw, i couldn't find ed |
| 14:48.21 | timeless_mbp | i found his office, but it was empty |
| 14:48.43 | Jaffa | wonders where X-Fade is: can't send out the summit approvals cos of a 500 server error :( |
| 14:49.07 | qwerty12_N810 | Jaffa: I smell a conspiracy... |
| 14:49.27 | VDVsx | me too ;) |
| 14:50.24 | Stskeeps | they took the sponsorship budget and went on a trip around the world? ;) |
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| 14:51.23 | VDVsx | Stskeeps, not a bad idea ;) |
| 14:52.17 | RST38h | Sts: Do not give 'em any wrong ideas =) |
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| 14:58.22 | lardman | server error because the signal's not too strong on the average deserted tropical island beach? |
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| 15:01.16 | lcuk | is there a version of xchat for fremantle |
| 15:01.16 | lcuk | hi javispedro |
| 15:01.22 | javispedro | afternoon |
| 15:01.29 | Jaffa | lardman: N900 manufacturing defect ;-) |
| 15:01.30 | lcuk | shits bricks |
| 15:01.45 | javispedro | ohmy, #maemo logs are broken again |
| 15:01.48 | lardman | :) |
| 15:02.40 | GeneralAntilles | lcuk, think there's a Diablo version in Extras you can use. |
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| 15:03.33 | lcuk | thanks gen |
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| 15:06.47 | mgedmin | what, somebody broke the logs again? |
| 15:07.31 | *** join/#maemo skibur (n=skibur@adsl-69-153-61-180.dsl.snantx.swbell.net) |
| 15:07.32 | mgedmin | povbot: are you there? |
| 15:07.32 | povbot | mgedmin: Error: "are" is not a valid command. |
| 15:07.45 | mgedmin | javispedro: please state your complaint about #maemo logs a bit more clearly |
| 15:08.16 | javispedro | mgedmin: ah, sorry. Today's log is not there. |
| 15:08.20 | mgedmin | the logging bot was down half last week due to an unfortunate server misconfiguration problem |
| 15:08.29 | javispedro | There being http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog |
| 15:08.35 | mgedmin | hmm... you're right |
| 15:08.45 | mgedmin | looks like the log -> html cron script is not working |
| 15:08.47 | mgedmin | investigates |
| 15:08.50 | javispedro | ta |
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| 15:12.20 | mgedmin | there, all fixed |
| 15:12.27 | mgedmin | javispedro: thanks for the heads up! |
| 15:14.13 | javispedro | no, thanks to you for the service :) |
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| 15:34.19 | Wooly | lardman: ping |
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| 16:03.59 | lardman | damn, missed him again |
| 16:05.28 | *** part/#maemo gaspa (n=gaspa@host134-118-static.61-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 16:06.53 | *** join/#maemo calvaris (n=calvaris@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 16:07.11 | *** join/#maemo simula (n=mark@209.189.194.130) |
| 16:08.39 | GeneralAntilles | waits impatiently for a phone call. |
| 16:10.41 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (n=slonopot@80.90.124.131) |
| 16:11.00 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (n=valerio@bl5-199-133.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 16:11.13 | lardman | wills people to phone GeneralAntilles |
| 16:11.16 | lcuk | tracy is driving to london on sunday morning, could one of you guys help her to reflash tablet when she asks |
| 16:11.24 | lcuk | byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee |
| 16:11.52 | qwerty12_N810 | lardman: do one better: ring GeneralAntilles yourself ;) |
| 16:11.52 | lardman | hopes this tablet is not the vital link in the Sat presentation..... |
| 16:12.12 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: yeah, was just Googling the likely sites to find his number ;) |
| 16:12.26 | qwerty12_N810 | adultfriendfinder? |
| 16:12.29 | qwerty12_N810 | ducks |
| 16:12.48 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: I was thinking more the list you made from the London phonebox adverts |
| 16:13.11 | lardman | though they may not exist any more :) |
| 16:13.31 | qwerty12_N810 | Stop dashing my hopes like that :( |
| 16:14.14 | lardman | I had a friend who covered his wall at school with ads he'd taken down from phoneboxes, became a challenge to cover every square inch |
| 16:15.19 | thp | X-Fade: here? |
| 16:16.28 | *** join/#maemo jmc93739653 (n=jmc93739@74-33-17-94.dsl1.mond.mn.frontiernet.net) |
| 16:17.18 | *** join/#maemo krutt (n=mk@p4FC3326F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:18.24 | lardman | ~curse residues |
| 16:18.25 | infobot | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, residues ! |
| 16:18.47 | lardman | hmm, that may sound bad, I'm thinking of loop phase residues of course |
| 16:23.10 | *** join/#maemo simula (n=mark@209.189.194.130) |
| 16:27.23 | GAN800 | lardman, Apple Customer Relations rep specifically. ;) |
| 16:27.57 | *** join/#maemo stv0 (n=steffen@dslb-088-076-039-089.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 16:28.13 | *** part/#maemo stv0 (n=steffen@dslb-088-076-039-089.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 16:28.20 | *** join/#maemo Wooly (n=Wooly@stapler.eee.strath.ac.uk) |
| 16:28.21 | Wooly | lardman: ping |
| 16:28.48 | *** join/#maemo GAN8001 (n=GAN800@c-98-230-62-25.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 16:32.01 | lardman | Wooly: hi |
| 16:32.05 | lardman | did you get my email? |
| 16:32.11 | lardman | probably not :) |
| 16:32.19 | Wooly | I did not, what email address did you send it to? |
| 16:32.37 | lardman | The computer you logged in from |
| 16:33.04 | lardman | probably some sysadmin at Strathclyde wondering who Wooly and lardman are :) |
| 16:33.08 | Wooly | haha |
| 16:33.13 | Wooly | more than likely :D |
| 16:33.29 | lardman | I was just wondering if you had those batoo Python bindings handy? |
| 16:33.29 | Wooly | stephen.bell@strath.ac.uk |
| 16:33.33 | Wooly | for future reference :D |
| 16:33.40 | Wooly | I will do, in around a half hour? |
| 16:33.47 | Wooly | I'm still in work, but heading home asap |
| 16:33.51 | lardman | thanks |
| 16:33.55 | Wooly | oh no, wait. I've got my laptop in with me |
| 16:34.00 | Wooly | should be able to forward them on now |
| 16:34.03 | lardman | yeah no rush, in fact I may go another route now anyway, but might be useful |
| 16:34.18 | Wooly | what's the other route? |
| 16:35.09 | lardman | well zbar 0.8 (which has derf's QR support) has too many false positives, so until 0.9 gains QR support I thought I'd combine derf's QR, the batoo for EAN 1D and libdmtx with a little C wrapper, then wrap that with Python |
| 16:35.10 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 16:35.23 | Wooly | cool |
| 16:35.35 | Wooly | unfortunately, I've not had the chance to actually test these batoo bindings |
| 16:35.43 | Wooly | what is it you need, as I've forgotten what I actually did :D |
| 16:36.41 | lardman | oh just the bindings if you've got them, so I can see how they are done |
| 16:36.48 | lardman | or did you use SWIG? |
| 16:37.17 | Wooly | I used SWIG |
| 16:37.44 | lardman | ah ok, well no worries then, I may as well use that too as my interface will be different |
| 16:37.56 | Wooly | they're not on my laptop unfortunately, but I know where they are, on scratchbox at hom |
| 16:37.57 | Wooly | e |
| 16:38.10 | Wooly | that's fine |
| 16:38.35 | Wooly | home time, I'll forward the stuff I have on anyway if you pass on an email address :) |
| 16:38.42 | lardman | cheers |
| 16:38.50 | lardman | s dot g dot pickering at bath dot ac dot uk |
| 16:39.04 | Wooly | oh yeah I forgot you were at bath |
| 16:39.13 | Wooly | what department are you in again? |
| 16:39.18 | lardman | us academics hey :) |
| 16:39.20 | lardman | mech eng |
| 16:39.22 | Myrtti | soup ♥ |
| 16:39.43 | Wooly | ahh cool :) |
| 16:39.52 | Wooly | i know a few of the folks from cs through working on this PhD |
| 16:40.19 | lardman | I'm afraid I don't, through and through engineer :) |
| 16:40.25 | Wooly | haha |
| 16:41.01 | Wooly | alright, it's TODO'd |
| 16:41.07 | Wooly | I'll forward them on when I'm in from work |
| 16:41.14 | Wooly | tata! |
| 16:41.20 | lardman | thanks! bye |
| 16:47.21 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslipeee (n=darren@94-30-69-47.xdsl.murphx.net) |
| 16:49.31 | ccooke | considers... As an interested user, is there any point going to the Maemo summit? |
| 16:49.55 | ccooke | It looks like I have (tons of) holiday left this year, so it's quite doable. |
| 16:52.24 | *** join/#maemo mojocafe (n=Miranda@c179157.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 16:52.33 | mojocafe | hi everyone :) |
| 16:52.47 | mojocafe | i am searching for someone with a n810 to test out the new mojocafe mojos... anyone willing to ? |
| 16:53.09 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (n=slonopot@80.90.124.131) |
| 16:54.42 | Jaffa | ccooke: Yes. There's a track dedicated to users. There's a party. There'll be lots of geeks and you can feel superior with non-geeky inter-personal skills? |
| 16:56.34 | mojocafe | hey tiago... portugal ? |
| 16:57.14 | rmt | ccooke, Of course there's a point - it's in Amsterdam!! |
| 16:57.33 | rmt | ccooke, Grab a joint and a beer (preferably belgian) and enjoy! |
| 16:58.13 | mojocafe | rmt: lol |
| 16:58.17 | *** join/#maemo andrei1089 (n=andrei10@81.18.92.10) |
| 16:58.22 | mojocafe | rmt: you own an n810 ? |
| 16:58.36 | rmt | mojocafe, I own an N810. |
| 16:58.50 | mojocafe | rmt: would you like to test something out for me 1? |
| 16:59.01 | sp3000 | fiferboy: so the stacktrace doesn't say too much because it dies where it has no symbols |
| 16:59.22 | fiferboy | sp3000: Thanks for looking into it. I think I have found the problem, I'm just testing it now |
| 16:59.22 | sp3000 | Program terminated with signal 11, Segmentation fault. #0 0x40af8dcc in ?? () from /usr/lib/hildon-desktop/lib-countdown-home-widget.so #1 0x41174dd8 in pthread_setspecific () from /lib/libpthread.so.0 #2 0x00000000 in ?? () |
| 16:59.51 | mojocafe | rmt: i just want to know if the flash lite version of the mojocafe works on the n810 |
| 16:59.57 | fiferboy | sp3000: For the record, I was removing my timer too late, I was trying to do it after the object was already destroyed... |
| 17:00.03 | sp3000 | heh |
| 17:00.25 | fiferboy | Yup, just tested it and it is working now. |
| 17:00.30 | fiferboy | sp3000: Thanks for checking for me |
| 17:00.34 | sp3000 | np |
| 17:01.22 | mojocafe | rmt: no time ? shall i ask someone else ? |
| 17:01.31 | rmt | mojocafe, Little pushed today.. |
| 17:01.39 | mojocafe | rmt: aight no problem. thanks. |
| 17:01.43 | rmt | Is it just a URL? |
| 17:01.47 | mojocafe | yes |
| 17:01.54 | mojocafe | http://m.mojocafe.net |
| 17:03.08 | mojocafe | and then enter 30-pcww as code .... |
| 17:03.27 | *** join/#maemo alehorst (n=alehorst@187.59.31.216) |
| 17:04.45 | rmt | Really wish the 810 had more memory |
| 17:06.00 | rmt | is waiting for things to swap in & out. |
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| 17:09.33 | *** join/#maemo xnt14 (n=xnt14@pool-98-113-71-238.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:10.42 | *** join/#maemo andrei1089 (n=andrei10@81.18.92.10) |
| 17:11.21 | mojocafe | rmt_ do you mean that it does not work ? |
| 17:11.35 | *** join/#maemo caotic (n=caotic@189.183.26.81) |
| 17:12.37 | *** join/#maemo hexa-- (n=bernd@p4FDC4032.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:21.10 | Myrtti | my irc is broken - nobody says a thing |
| 17:21.28 | wazd | yeah, mine too |
| 17:21.38 | rmt | Not mine. |
| 17:22.10 | SpeedEvil | my irc is broken - nobody says a thing |
| 17:22.32 | Jaffa | My IRC's cool, it blots out my password: ********* |
| 17:23.09 | wazd | o really? Let me try! ihatejaffa |
| 17:23.16 | wazd | :D |
| 17:23.20 | Jaffa | :-p |
| 17:23.32 | Jaffa | Hey, that's my password - and it wasn't blanked out here |
| 17:23.53 | wazd | Jaffa: oops :) |
| 17:24.05 | ccooke | Jaffa: (just back after a meeting, so reading backlog): Yeah right. I'm a sysadmin. Non-geeky personal skills aren't an option ;-) |
| 17:24.37 | Jaffa | ccooke: Ah, BOFHs are even worse than devs ;-) |
| 17:24.44 | Jaffa | Anyway, more the merrier |
| 17:25.00 | ccooke | Naturally. I mean, devs aren't encouraged to believe that they can take over the world. |
| 17:25.03 | Myrtti | raspberry tea ♥ |
| 17:25.59 | ccooke | I'm a user of the Nokias because... well... I'm a sysadmin. The coding I do is backend stuff: Elegance happens only in structures, not in interfaces |
| 17:26.18 | ccooke | And that's not the sort of thing that's needed much :-) |
| 17:29.06 | RST38h | moos |
| 17:29.16 | RST38h | Myrtti: blackberry tastes better |
| 17:30.15 | ccooke | I had some quince tea a while back - that was lovely |
| 17:30.33 | ccooke | (but that was black-tea-with-quince; possibly not what you're referring to :-) |
| 17:30.49 | Myrtti | RST38h: all tea is lovely, lovely is all tea |
| 17:31.16 | *** join/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host86-171-219-254.range86-171.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:31.40 | *** part/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host86-171-219-254.range86-171.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:32.42 | RST38h | Hehe |
| 17:33.50 | wazd | "Elegance happens only in structures, not in interfaces" - that's why 80% of OSS software looks like crap I suppose :D |
| 17:34.19 | RST38h | making good interface is difficult and does not bring you lulz |
| 17:34.56 | RST38h | But both Gnome and KDE feature relatively good UIs, so I do not see why you only count them as 20% =) |
| 17:34.58 | wazd | elegant interface = good structure |
| 17:35.21 | *** join/#maemo eichi__ (n=eichi@stgt-5f709063.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 17:35.38 | wazd | RST38h: Gnome/KDE is like hildon |
| 17:35.45 | RST38h | i.e.? |
| 17:35.56 | asj_wrk | individual applications within gnome/kde have varying levels of UI success |
| 17:36.00 | ccooke | wazd: You're right, but in this case I'm referring to UI (not API/etc, if you meant that too :-) |
| 17:36.16 | wazd | RST38h: it's nice, until someone tries to make something with it :) |
| 17:36.36 | ccooke | wazd: A large part of the problems with OSS UIs is people thinking they're good at UI development when they're not. I prefer to admit upfront that I'm not good at it :-) |
| 17:37.14 | ShadowJK | 's UI consists of a series of scripts |
| 17:37.32 | asj_wrk | ccooke: I'm not sure that's true, all OSS I write is to solve some missing app. I'm not good at UI and I know it, but unless someone who's good at UI cares it'll never get touched. |
| 17:38.24 | RST38h | wazd: both are quite harmless api-wise |
| 17:38.29 | ccooke | asj_wrk: oh, sure. I'm definitely not saying that everyone who codes a UI is bad at it - just that I've seen many who *think* they are and *aren't8 |
| 17:38.33 | RST38h | wazd: You want evil, try Motif or tk/tcl |
| 17:39.15 | ShadowJK | rst38h: as a user I like. fast smooth and light |
| 17:39.20 | ccooke | asj_wrk: (I'll also code UIs for things... and wish that I were good at it. It's always a problem) |
| 17:39.47 | wazd | RST38h: I don't want evil, nono :D |
| 17:40.23 | *** join/#maemo Luke-Jr2 (n=Luke-Jr@ip98-179-26-71.om.om.cox.net) |
| 17:40.35 | asj_wrk | ccooke: people also complain a lot about UI on OSS, but sadly a lot of small company commerical software has huge UI issues too. Just saying. :) |
| 17:40.46 | ccooke | asj_wrk: Agreed :-) |
| 17:40.53 | ccooke | asj_wrk: same problem, I think |
| 17:41.02 | *** join/#maemo wjs_ltop (n=wsuethol@204.238.52.86) |
| 17:41.05 | asj_wrk | ayup :) |
| 17:41.57 | RST38h | Shadow: What? Motif? |
| 17:42.42 | RST38h | (and S60 for ultimate evil) |
| 17:43.35 | ccooke | RST38h: motif and tcl/tk, running on S60? |
| 17:43.38 | ccooke | *ewww* |
| 17:43.52 | asj_wrk | I'm kinda hoping Qt for S60 might help there...dunno is that too much to ask? |
| 17:44.07 | RST38h | Qt for Symbian you mean |
| 17:44.14 | asj_wrk | sorry |
| 17:44.19 | RST38h | Because "S60" is just another name for Avkon toolkit |
| 17:44.54 | RST38h | There is also Eikon (the original toolkit from Symbian), it would be interesting to see what part of it is retained when moving to qt |
| 17:46.15 | asj_wrk | what feature/functions does Eikon provide? just roughly |
| 17:46.33 | RST38h | Eikon is basically X11/Xutil |
| 17:46.56 | RST38h | + some Xt (simple dialogs, etc) |
| 17:47.14 | asj_wrk | ah ok, not sure how that would mesh into the Qt event loop...? |
| 17:47.15 | RST38h | Avkon is like a full UI toolkit on top of Eikon |
| 17:47.25 | ccooke | Hmm |
| 17:47.33 | RST38h | asj: Eikon ha got its own event loop |
| 17:47.35 | ccooke | So symbian phones are basically running X? |
| 17:47.41 | RST38h | And hierarchical message passing mechanism |
| 17:47.53 | RST38h | ccooke: No, it is just me making an analogy for penguin worshippers |
| 17:47.58 | ccooke | RST38h: oh, sorry |
| 17:48.30 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181192153.pp.htv.fi) |
| 17:48.44 | RST38h | I guess they will have to kill Eikon to use Qt |
| 17:48.53 | RST38h | That would be the cleanest solution |
| 17:49.16 | ShadowJK | they'll just pile it ontop |
| 17:49.16 | ccooke | RST38h: probably. |
| 17:49.19 | asj_wrk | RST38h: I guess I'm stuck in the penguin world, but you have to eventually block somewhere, can you block on both easily? Well I guess Qt already has that concept so I probably ansewered my own question |
| 17:49.47 | RST38h | asj: Yes, Symbian apps block by going into Eikon event loop |
| 17:50.07 | RST38h | Shadow: That would cause a serious case of split personality |
| 17:50.38 | RST38h | asj: In fact, a Symbian app has no main(). It is a bunch of classes with some custom implemented methods |
| 17:51.03 | RST38h | asj: Symbian will call these methods to initialize application, it will then call event-handling methods as events arrive |
| 17:51.10 | ccooke | RST38h: which is similar to many other UI toolkits |
| 17:51.22 | RST38h | ccooke: Well you usually do have main |
| 17:51.31 | RST38h | ccooke: and call event loop explicitely |
| 17:51.33 | *** join/#maemo stv01 (n=steffen@dslb-088-077-195-023.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:51.48 | RST38h | i.e. if you wish, you can insert your own code into the loop |
| 17:51.56 | asj_wrk | hmmmm, the last symbian app I wrote has a main32 or something, I think had to create/register an event queue I thought...but that was months ago, I'm busy moving so my Symbian learning stopped in June |
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| 17:52.09 | RST38h | asj: That was entry point for the DLL |
| 17:52.14 | asj_wrk | ok |
| 17:52.17 | RST38h | asj: EMAIN32 |
| 17:52.29 | RST38h | asj: it has nothing to do with traditional main |
| 17:52.38 | asj_wrk | ah ok |
| 17:53.18 | RST38h | If Nokia is clever, they will hide all the traditional Symbian stuff and just allow for main() and standard Qt code |
| 17:53.22 | asj_wrk | honestly the biggest problem I had with Symbian was finding upto date books/tutorials that weren't $50 a pop |
| 17:53.40 | RST38h | asj: You do not really need any |
| 17:54.30 | RST38h | asj: stuff at newlc.com + samples should be suffcicient |
| 17:54.40 | asj_wrk | RST38h: coming from a linux/qt background the whole C class, T class, etc ideas need some explanation. I needed the 50 page, Symbian for Linux people ;) |
| 17:55.24 | ShadowJK | pys60 is sufficient for hobbyhacking :) |
| 17:55.29 | RST38h | There is no 50-page symbian |
| 17:56.19 | asj_wrk | ShadowJK: pys60 has it's issues |
| 17:56.22 | glass_ | asj_wrk: the books that are fifty bucks a pop ain't up to date either |
| 17:56.39 | glass_ | so, the wiki, newlc etc are the way to go |
| 17:56.53 | asj_wrk | glass_: heh, too bad I didn't have this channel back in May ;) |
| 17:57.31 | *** join/#maemo _jason8912 (n=thot@59-105-27-43.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw) |
| 18:00.20 | rmt | mojocafe, doesn't seem to work, btw .. click on it and get prompted for a download link |
| 18:02.42 | *** join/#maemo andrei1089 (n=andrei10@81.18.92.10) |
| 18:02.49 | aSIMULAtor | good evening maemonians |
| 18:02.55 | aSIMULAtor | maemoians |
| 18:02.57 | aSIMULAtor | maemorites |
| 18:03.23 | *** join/#maemo dark2 (n=user@201.149.208.199) |
| 18:03.34 | rektide | maemorites is funniest. ++ |
| 18:03.47 | aSIMULAtor | let's stick with that, maemorite |
| 18:03.48 | aSIMULAtor | :P |
| 18:03.56 | timeless_mbp | sp3000: you alive? :) |
| 18:03.59 | RST38h | also: maemorism |
| 18:04.17 | slonopotamus | mememto maemori |
| 18:04.22 | sp3000 | checks pulse |
| 18:04.42 | RST38h | maemento |
| 18:05.03 | slonopotamus | oh, true. uno maemento |
| 18:05.51 | aSIMULAtor | uno maemento por favor |
| 18:08.55 | *** join/#maemo igagis (n=igagis@ns2.vsev.lanck.net) |
| 18:13.43 | *** join/#maemo etrunko (n=edulima@200.184.118.130) |
| 18:13.59 | *** join/#maemo coldboot (n=neil@exchange.wgen.net) |
| 18:16.17 | GeneralAntilles | The 5800's lack of alphabet on the dialer really sucks. |
| 18:16.54 | asj_wrk | the n97 doesn't have it either, that is lame |
| 18:17.44 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.131.142) |
| 18:17.51 | timeless_mbp | grumbles |
| 18:18.21 | timeless_mbp | sp3000: i can't do work from this side of the world? |
| 18:18.54 | GeneralAntilles | asj_wrk, I have this bookmarked as a reference. . . . http://www.rigacci.org/docs/biblio/online/intro_to_networking/stdimages/page77.gif |
| 18:19.01 | *** join/#maemo jofjdi (n=jsherman@67.72.73.34) |
| 18:19.40 | *** join/#maemo johnsq (n=therippe@252.60.broadband3.iol.cz) |
| 18:19.51 | johnsq | Hi |
| 18:21.23 | *** part/#maemo stv01 (n=steffen@dslb-088-077-195-023.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:21.50 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12_N810 (n=faheem@78-86-35-231.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:22.36 | *** join/#maemo hannesw (n=hannes@chello062178166147.12.14.vie.surfer.at) |
| 18:24.08 | coldboot | For some reason when using SCons for Maemo on ARM only (works fine with i386), I get it terminating with error 126 unless I move python out of the way first. |
| 18:24.12 | coldboot | moving python like this: mv /scratchbox/tools/bin/python /scratchbox/tools/bin/python.old |
| 18:24.20 | *** join/#maemo jnettlet (n=jnettlet@216-19-186-197.dyn.novuscom.net) |
| 18:25.34 | *** join/#maemo _jason2701 (n=thot@59-105-27-43.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw) |
| 18:26.43 | Stskeeps | that's fairly normal for sb1.. |
| 18:26.44 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 18:29.28 | Stskeeps | wonders idly who badger is on the forums |
| 18:29.50 | johnsq | has anybody the quiver source code? the home-page seems dead. |
| 18:30.11 | *** join/#maemo kozak (n=subbu@122.166.48.72) |
| 18:30.44 | Stskeeps | think its closed source |
| 18:31.57 | *** join/#maemo kozak|work (n=kozak@122.166.48.72) |
| 18:33.00 | johnsq | thats bad, than i can't compile it for gentoo :( |
| 18:34.12 | coldboot | Did you want to funroll its loops? |
| 18:35.01 | johnsq | i wan't to compile it for a sane / standard system |
| 18:36.21 | Jaffa | Yeah, Quiver is closed source IIRC |
| 18:36.46 | qwerty12_N810 | It's in non-free, at least |
| 18:37.18 | dark2 | How i can install deb package in maemo |
| 18:37.48 | coldboot | fakeroot dpkg -i package.deb |
| 18:37.52 | coldboot | dark2: ^ |
| 18:38.04 | dark2 | And thats all |
| 18:38.17 | johnsq | too bad, first usable picture viewer, as I already asked any other alternatives? |
| 18:38.18 | *** join/#maemo Giovani_ (n=Giovani@ip72-220-147-46.sd.sd.cox.net) |
| 18:38.23 | Jaffa | Anyone with a better Internet connection than me willing to go to http://garage.maemo.org/ or http://maemo.org/profile/list/ and tell me exactly how many maemo.org accounts there are now? |
| 18:38.29 | coldboot | dark2: That's it. |
| 18:38.33 | dark2 | And where i can execute the commans arp |
| 18:38.45 | coldboot | dark2: What? |
| 18:38.52 | Jaffa | dark2: X Terminal ships as standard |
| 18:38.53 | dark2 | Yes |
| 18:39.01 | dark2 | i need to run arp -a |
| 18:39.09 | dark2 | And i donnt have it |
| 18:39.17 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:39.29 | dark2 | I searched and found it on /sbin/ |
| 18:39.54 | SpeedEvil | Jaffa: I get ~6*30 |
| 18:40.05 | SpeedEvil | Jaffa: err - no - hangon |
| 18:40.31 | SpeedEvil | bisects. |
| 18:40.47 | Jaffa | is putting together a rushed presentation on the Maemo community for onedotzero and they want the slides yesterday |
| 18:41.23 | SpeedEvil | searching now |
| 18:41.39 | johnsq | dark2: you found it on your desktop or not? |
| 18:41.42 | johnsq | dark2: you found it on your desktop or nit? |
| 18:41.45 | *** join/#maemo florian (n=fuchs@f054171093.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:41.53 | Jaffa | SpeedEvil: ta |
| 18:41.58 | dark2 | On my maemo |
| 18:41.59 | *** join/#maemo hellwolf (n=hellwolf@a213-22-69-165.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 18:42.23 | johnsq | dark2: then you need only gain root. see wiki maemo |
| 18:44.10 | dark2 | I press root |
| 18:44.17 | dark2 | And im root |
| 18:44.27 | dark2 | /mnt/initfs/proc/net/arp |
| 18:44.50 | SpeedEvil | Jaffa: and that link is slow. ~180*30 - better numbers in a bit |
| 18:44.50 | dark2 | /mnt/initfs/proc/net/arp |
| 18:45.55 | johnsq | dark2: that no command, that the kernel config for arp |
| 18:46.18 | dark2 | How eck it |
| 18:46.29 | dark2 | How i can check it |
| 18:46.33 | johnsq | dark2: cat /mnt/initfs/proc/net/arp |
| 18:47.52 | SpeedEvil | hmm. Fatal error: Maximum execution time of 30 seconds exceeded in /mnt/netapp/pear/midcom/lib/midcom/core/privilege.php on line 457 |
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| 18:50.04 | SpeedEvil | Asking for over page 180 or so seems to die horribly |
| 18:50.54 | Jaffa | Hmm |
| 18:51.14 | SpeedEvil | Page 185(*30) has a karma of 5 |
| 18:51.24 | Jaffa | I'll try and ask X-Fade or someone for n account grep from the db |
| 18:51.35 | Jaffa | There's a very long tail |
| 18:51.40 | Jaffa | SpeedEvil: Thanks |
| 18:52.03 | SpeedEvil | Asking for more seems to be hitting php errors |
| 18:52.07 | SpeedEvil | np |
| 18:52.46 | coldboot | I have a problem with scratchbox 1 where all the resources of my Qt applications are now messed up, only for ARM. |
| 18:55.34 | *** join/#maemo hannesw (n=hannes@chello062178166147.12.14.vie.surfer.at) |
| 18:55.36 | coldboot | The main window of the application has majorly corrupted resources, and it runs extremely slow. |
| 18:55.53 | coldboot | It works fine in i386, though. |
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| 19:06.44 | *** join/#maemo trbs (n=trbs@82-171-197-35.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 19:08.01 | trbs | anybody from europe figured out if it's cheaper to pre-order the n900 from the us ? google says 650dollar is 447euro... while europe pre-order stores list the n900 for 600 euro... but i don't know if there hidden costs to importing one ? |
| 19:08.24 | Stskeeps | well you are bound to be hit with some degree of customs fee.. |
| 19:08.39 | johnsq | trbs: |
| 19:08.59 | asj_wrk | trbs: and will the euro version have normal 2100mhz 3g? the US version at 2100mhz t-mo AWS may not work...? |
| 19:09.02 | johnsq | trbs: about 19% + 2% in germany |
| 19:09.22 | mandara | trbs, well at expansys is 499euro |
| 19:09.49 | trbs | asj_wrk, ah good point... cell is not the same everywhere as well.... |
| 19:09.49 | Corsac | 620 for .fr :( |
| 19:10.13 | SpeedEvil | They have to include the voltaic charger for france though. |
| 19:10.20 | SpeedEvil | And frogs-legs aren't cheap. |
| 19:10.38 | Corsac | but tasty |
| 19:10.55 | asj_wrk | aren't all nokia charges 100-240v? of course the plug won't fit |
| 19:13.06 | trbs | didn't europe did the all phones need compatible chargers thing ? :) |
| 19:13.14 | trbs | s/did/do/ |
| 19:13.22 | trbs | lol |
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| 19:21.21 | SpeedEvil | infobot: recently |
| 19:21.27 | SpeedEvil | infobot: gotta be mini-b |
| 19:21.30 | SpeedEvil | or something |
| 19:21.35 | SpeedEvil | which sucks - but... |
| 19:22.59 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (n=valerio@bl6-98-131.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 19:23.24 | asj_wrk | micro-b |
| 19:23.31 | asj_wrk | (which is better than mini-b) |
| 19:23.57 | Stskeeps | am i the only one getting weird conspiracy vibes over http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31351 ? :P |
| 19:25.33 | SpeedEvil | yeah - micro-b |
| 19:25.44 | *** join/#maemo Free_maN (n=Free_maN@unaffiliated/freeman) |
| 19:25.46 | SpeedEvil | would personally preferred 2.5mm fourpole - but meh |
| 19:27.41 | coldboot | Whenever I compile a qt-maemo application in Scratchbox 1 for the armel target, the image resources are corrupted a lot, and the program runs extremely slow. I've posted the question here with details: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1395859/qt-maemo-resources-screwed-up-in-scratchbox-1-for-the-armel-target |
| 19:28.02 | coldboot | Does anyone know what could be wrong with my scratchbox install? It's happened before, and I had to clean install scratchbox to get it working again. |
| 19:28.50 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: Weird conspiracy vibes? No, just sad a person who evidently doesn't understand the device got one. |
| 19:29.05 | qwerty12_N810 | +I'm |
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| 19:31.11 | lbt | any mesa/GL people here? |
| 19:31.25 | lbt | I'm looking for a mesa equiv to GLES |
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| 20:03.10 | lbt | pulls the latest mesa-7.6 which has SW support for GL ES2.0 .... interesting... |
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| 20:09.11 | javispedro | lbt: Vincent. Or the PowerVR TI SDK stuff. |
| 20:09.42 | lbt | gallium |
| 20:09.52 | lbt | http://zrusin.blogspot.com/2009/05/opengl-es.html |
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| 20:10.05 | Woolly | lardman: ping |
| 20:10.32 | lbt | ftp://ftp.freedesktop.org/pub/mesa/beta/MesaLib-7.6-devel-20090908.tar.gz |
| 20:10.46 | lbt | it's .... rare.... bleu even |
| 20:11.06 | javispedro | a nightly? |
| 20:11.14 | javispedro | hm. |
| 20:11.27 | *** join/#maemo homeasvs__ (n=thomas@163.220-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 20:11.30 | lbt | grabs the debian packaging and the dev source and squishes them together and calls it Mer-stable |
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| 20:17.28 | coldboot | Has anyone seen fureddo lately? |
| 20:17.44 | coldboot | He was in here on August 14th, and had the same BadDrawable X error I'm having. |
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| 20:23.19 | GeneralAntilles | The Runaround @ Apple |
| 20:23.20 | GeneralAntilles | Woo! |
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| 20:27.11 | coldboot | GeneralAntilles: What/ |
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| 20:37.38 | GeneralAntilles | Finally! |
| 20:37.46 | woglinde | where? |
| 20:38.02 | GeneralAntilles | Mac Pro is being configured for me as we speak. |
| 20:38.08 | GeneralAntilles | Customer Relations people are useless. |
| 20:38.14 | GeneralAntilles | The Store guys were so much more helpful. |
| 20:38.38 | woglinde | I dont care about mac pro |
| 20:38.59 | GeneralAntilles | woglinde, I do, since it's free. |
| 20:39.08 | *** join/#maemo gomiam (n=magao@84.79.25.26) |
| 20:39.25 | woglinde | I would have taken a mac air |
| 20:39.38 | GeneralAntilles | For a dual-2.5GHz G5? |
| 20:39.40 | GeneralAntilles | I don't think so. |
| 20:39.50 | woglinde | g5? |
| 20:39.59 | woglinde | no chance for snow leopard |
| 20:40.10 | GeneralAntilles | Liquid cooled G5. |
| 20:40.14 | GeneralAntilles | It leaked at the beginning of the year |
| 20:40.20 | GeneralAntilles | Apple authorized a no-cost repair for me. |
| 20:41.10 | GeneralAntilles | Then the repair failed, so the Store authorized a replacement, but told me I needed to call the Customer Relations people to figure out what the straight replacement would be for the BTO options. |
| 20:41.36 | GeneralAntilles | So I called Customer Relations, they gave me the runaround and told me I needed to deal with the Store. |
| 20:41.50 | GeneralAntilles | Called the Store back and they said "Oh. OK, then, what'll you have." |
| 20:41.52 | GeneralAntilles | Done and done. |
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| 20:44.57 | coldboot | In general, when someone says: "You need to go talk to this other person who's part of my organization, directly or indirectly..." |
| 20:45.08 | coldboot | They should talk to them themselves. |
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| 20:59.39 | GeneralAntilles | coldboot, yeah, probably, but it's done now. |
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| 22:19.03 | *** join/#maemo mece (i=50dc3f2c@gateway/web/freenode/x-sawwufuzrzxokwlu) |
| 22:19.28 | mece | Hello |
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| 22:22.56 | mece | hello? |
| 22:22.59 | GeneralAntilles | Howdy |
| 22:23.11 | mece | nice, not all idles :D |
| 22:24.28 | *** join/#maemo GoodStudent (n=GoodStud@41.252.37.81) |
| 22:25.00 | GoodStudent | what software other than PC Suite can I use to access and backup my "stopped to appear" contact list? |
| 22:26.25 | mece | on what system? |
| 22:26.32 | mece | err.. device I mean |
| 22:27.15 | *** join/#maemo angasule (n=angasule@201.250.83.253) |
| 22:27.43 | GoodStudent | Nokia N97 |
| 22:28.04 | GoodStudent | I'm really screwed up |
| 22:28.19 | GoodStudent | sepcially if I can not get my contacts back |
| 22:28.30 | mece | no idea. maybe you should try some symbian forums? |
| 22:29.09 | GoodStudent | i'm into the symbian channel but doesn't seem like there is any living creatures to answer out there |
| 22:29.25 | GoodStudent | all my contact are vanished |
| 22:29.45 | woglinde | GoodStudent next time make a backup |
| 22:30.19 | GoodStudent | there won't be next time if I couldn't get the current contacts list. |
| 22:31.44 | mece | GoodStudent if you use ovi then your contacts might be saved there. check it. |
| 22:32.14 | GoodStudent | what is ovi? |
| 22:32.20 | mece | I on the other hand actually have a maemo sdk related question, so it might be more up this channels alley. |
| 22:32.30 | mece | GoodStudent http://www.ovi.com |
| 22:32.38 | GoodStudent | what about those thired parties softwares like oxygen? |
| 22:34.32 | mece | I'm a big spotify user, and I thought I'd make a simple despotify client for maemo5 while I wait for my N900. |
| 22:36.02 | Captain_Picard | im a small spotify user! |
| 22:36.11 | mece | anyway, I built despotify in the sdk, and turns out that there acutally is a maemo client, maemify that seems to somewhat work in maemo |
| 22:36.13 | mece | 5 |
| 22:36.36 | Captain_Picard | nice! |
| 22:37.17 | mece | but I was wondering, does one get sound from scratchbox? i built despotify in scratchbox/fremantle and it compiled nicely, and I was able to run everything, and the log said that songs were played. |
| 22:37.23 | mece | but no sound. |
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| 22:37.49 | mece | no errors either, so it seems that despotify works out of the box, atleast with default and simple client |
| 22:38.00 | mece | you need a premium account though. |
| 22:38.42 | Captain_Picard | why |
| 22:38.46 | Captain_Picard | do you need a premium account |
| 22:39.13 | mece | dunno. spotify demands it. despotify doesn't work with free or even daypass accounts |
| 22:39.19 | *** part/#maemo dark2 (n=user@201.149.208.199) |
| 22:40.39 | mece | either way, does anyone know if you can get sound from fremantle sdk on scratchbox? |
| 22:51.40 | mece | no? Well I'm off anyway. have a good one. |
| 22:55.24 | *** join/#maemo pacopil (n=n@160.230.221.87.dynamic.jazztel.es) |
| 22:56.04 | pacopil | online boxing game http://www.kobox.org/kobox-fande-Nourine.html |
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