| 00:00.30 | Robot101 | so we're pondering some other stuff like google-style 10% time, or accumulating days to work on R&D/community stuff |
| 00:00.34 | zerojayPC | Because right now... idle is one bad little boy. :/ |
| 00:00.35 | Robot101 | (like you accumulate vacation) |
| 00:00.35 | Mace_N8x0 | maybe nokia will do a 360 and have a fremantle for n8x0 |
| 00:01.04 | Robot101 | but this stuff is pretty tricky because it makes it harder to negotiate contracts |
| 00:01.20 | Robot101 | oh yeah 2 days out of 10 this guy is going to be on vacation for one and hacking on some other shit for another, ok? :P |
| 00:01.41 | GeneralAntilles | Mace_N8x0, there are a variety of reasons why that isn't feasible. |
| 00:01.47 | GeneralAntilles | They've been rehashed and rehashed again. |
| 00:01.54 | GeneralAntilles | That's why we have Mer instead. |
| 00:02.31 | zerojayPC | Is there anyone with a Fremantle device that can check something out for me real quick with the updated Media Player? Just checking to see if a bug still exists or not, very simple and quick. |
| 00:02.32 | Mace_N8x0 | damnit |
| 00:02.55 | Mace_N8x0 | i got a new debit card |
| 00:03.27 | Mace_N8x0 | and keep finding stuff that is auto paid getting declined because i forgot to change it |
| 00:03.34 | Mace_N8x0 | like skype heh |
| 00:08.52 | GeneralAntilles | Mace_N8x0, yeah, same here. :\ |
| 00:15.18 | Mace_N8x0 | ugh |
| 00:15.19 | zerojayPC | wtf... how long after I register on the site does it take to be added to participants on the Maemo Summit wiki page? |
| 00:15.28 | Mace_N8x0 | and changing skype's is a pain |
| 00:16.09 | GeneralAntilles | zerojayPC, should be instant. |
| 00:16.14 | GeneralAntilles | Cache issue? |
| 00:16.22 | *** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@nat/ibm/x-cc6264d2e22cefb4) |
| 00:17.04 | zerojayPC | I guess I'll resubmit then... hmm. |
| 00:17.42 | Mace_N8x0 | there |
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| 00:17.57 | Mace_N8x0 | now i just have to wait for the next screw up |
| 00:18.00 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 00:18.06 | lcuk | arghhh |
| 00:18.15 | lcuk | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:18.22 | lcuk | wtf did i do |
| 00:18.24 | Mace_N8x0 | like when i walk into the gym and a giant red light flashes and a buzzer goes off |
| 00:18.30 | lcuk | (git push btw |
| 00:18.35 | *** join/#maemo promulo (n=romulo@189.71.115.99) |
| 00:18.49 | Mace_N8x0 | with a DEADBEAT sign scrolling across |
| 00:19.05 | Mace_N8x0 | :) |
| 00:19.13 | lcuk | heh Mace_N8x0 |
| 00:19.20 | lcuk | did you get dpkg workin? |
| 00:19.28 | zerojayPC | Actually... I might have found a bug in the submission process. Heh. |
| 00:19.40 | Mace_N8x0 | still working on it |
| 00:19.52 | Mace_N8x0 | i havent had much time the past cpl days |
| 00:19.55 | Mace_N8x0 | and |
| 00:20.10 | Mace_N8x0 | i had to start logging it because i was getting lost |
| 00:20.28 | lcuk | yeah, its heavy going |
| 00:20.37 | lcuk | things just cascade |
| 00:20.38 | Mace_N8x0 | so i started over 3 days ago and started logging the steps on tech.rancorous.net |
| 00:20.41 | Mace_N8x0 | yeah |
| 00:20.45 | Mace_N8x0 | fast too heh |
| 00:20.46 | lcuk | you start off with "i just need core-utils" |
| 00:20.52 | Mace_N8x0 | hahaha |
| 00:20.56 | Mace_N8x0 | yeah |
| 00:21.05 | lcuk | ;) |
| 00:21.13 | lcuk | its a slippery fucking slope |
| 00:21.26 | lcuk | http://xkcd.com/456/ |
| 00:21.28 | Mace_N8x0 | more like "i need to make my own coreutils because the pkg sucks and breaks everything" |
| 00:21.37 | Mace_N8x0 | haha |
| 00:21.56 | Mace_N8x0 | using individual src pkgs |
| 00:22.02 | Mace_N8x0 | one at a time |
| 00:22.07 | *** join/#maemo nickar (n=nickar@190.1.20.141) |
| 00:22.19 | lcuk | wget http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/m4/m4-1.4.9.tar.gz |
| 00:22.19 | lcuk | gzip -dc m4-1.4.9.tar.gz | tar xf - |
| 00:22.19 | lcuk | cd m4-1.4.9 |
| 00:22.19 | lcuk | ./configure |
| 00:22.19 | lcuk | make |
| 00:22.22 | lcuk | like that ... |
| 00:22.57 | Mace_N8x0 | i think when i start doing that i will call the article "the tangent" |
| 00:22.59 | lcuk | i didnt realise the selection cursor in console was so good |
| 00:23.06 | lcuk | i thought it was silly that it retained selection |
| 00:23.23 | Mace_N8x0 | maybe that is what i will name the project |
| 00:23.28 | Mace_N8x0 | Tangent |
| 00:23.28 | lcuk | but i see the greatness in it, especially combined with right mouse click |
| 00:23.32 | Mace_N8x0 | hahaha |
| 00:23.41 | Mace_N8x0 | because that is what it will feel like |
| 00:24.05 | lcuk | heh yeah |
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| 00:33.17 | javispedro | that's a good way to instantly slashdot any page |
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| 00:53.45 | lcuk | javispedro, ? |
| 00:54.01 | javispedro | the global notice url is still overloaded |
| 00:54.28 | lcuk | it cant have been that global |
| 00:54.33 | lcuk | i havent seen anything lol |
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| 01:26.46 | pupnik | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xf20Effo6ds&fmt=18 ---------- The Pixies - Alec Eiffel ------- TURN IT UP |
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| 01:32.03 | smackpotat | . |
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| 01:33.20 | gogol | quick q: usb gender changer and usb keyboard...require external power or no? |
| 01:34.00 | smackpotat | depends on how much current your using whats hooked up and waht tablet |
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| 01:34.30 | pupnik | tablet supplies a couple hundred milliamp, yes? |
| 01:34.36 | pupnik | 800, 810 |
| 01:35.08 | gogol | i thought i read an n810 could do such a setup without external usb power |
| 01:35.12 | smackpotat | i hooked up a 770 to 16mbflash and usesd a usb hub |
| 01:36.28 | smackpotat | what are you connecting |
| 01:36.40 | gogol | i dont know yet, shopping :) |
| 01:37.03 | smackpotat | ahhh |
| 01:37.03 | gogol | want to find a small-ish keyboard to use with n810 |
| 01:37.34 | gogol | not bluetooth though, seems like a battery killer and probably more than i can afford |
| 01:37.34 | smackpotat | can a wifi doggle be conected |
| 01:38.30 | gogol | i think people have done that? not sure |
| 01:38.46 | gogol | http://www.google.com/custom?hl=en&client=google-coop&cof=FORID%3A13%3BAH%3Aleft%3BS%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fmaemo.org%2F%3BCX%3Amaemo%252Eorg%3BL%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Ftalk.maemo.org%2Fmaemo%2Fstyle%2Fimg%2Flogo.jpg%3BLH%3A58%3BLP%3A1%3BVLC%3A%23551a8b%3BGFNT%3A%23666666%3BDIV%3A%23cccccc%3B&adkw=AELymgUqFKWI8AGw3jPWZlO8VHt6JQ7LFmifKo4hfXncUpZvKP-hGVlJZbfNDdOu0yt3QgS2E5P2izMwEs6Gd7s5UNLYOpFBsD3ykF2wPFHnJEAKxjZnD |
| 01:38.48 | gogol | esamYYPTReMEXyNeK52hgQUVo1xIFQdzNLYgaq0Yt-_gKXO6dBKW2QhJ7EomCCz6DM6p7PCjRSPGwmcFHzgJjEq&boostcse=0&q=&btnG=Search&cx=002415088715645836938%3A6esxclqviui is what im using |
| 01:38.49 | gogol | holy shit |
| 01:38.56 | gogol | ! |
| 01:39.17 | gogol | needs a tinyurl |
| 01:39.46 | gogol | http://tinyurl.com/q7btxk |
| 01:43.34 | smackpotat | I'd think a keyboard wouldn't draw much power and you'd be ok. but thats a guess |
| 01:46.01 | gogol | im sure there's a thread on it, just have to find it ;_ |
| 01:46.23 | *** join/#maemo Cira (i=Cira@dynamic-78-30-171-8.adsl.eunet.rs) |
| 01:48.09 | smackpotat | i can't post to maemo talk is that my problem |
| 01:48.50 | *** part/#maemo Cira (i=Cira@dynamic-78-30-171-8.adsl.eunet.rs) |
| 01:48.56 | gogol | ? |
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| 02:47.39 | divide_by_zero | does anyone change their user-agent string in the NIT browsers so that websites think you use iPhone or other more popular mobile devices, and present you a mobile version of the page? |
| 02:49.20 | Luke-Jr | divide_by_zero: such websites are broken |
| 02:50.44 | divide_by_zero | The other day I made a script to filter the BBS RSS so its links take me to the "clean" version of their pages... I was wondering if I would be automatically sent tehre if they detected me as a mobile device |
| 02:50.52 | divide_by_zero | BBC I mean |
| 02:55.24 | *** join/#maemo victorpoluceno (n=victorpo@200-193-73-49.bnut3700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 02:55.26 | zerojayPC | Yeah, I can see why you'd need a clean version of the BBC pages: http://bit.ly/1an2Ni |
| 02:57.13 | gogol | so would something like this work with a USB gender changer on an n810? http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=usb+mini+keyboard&hl=en&cid=5735096772581395978&sa=title#p |
| 03:01.36 | divide_by_zero | zerojayPC: yeah, must clean all that extra fat! :) |
| 03:02.03 | gogol | without external power? anyone? |
| 03:04.08 | divide_by_zero | I've heard keyboards are OK... don't remember which thread |
| 03:04.57 | divide_by_zero | I'm looking forward to try one myself, but i don't have the gender changer yet |
| 03:05.13 | divide_by_zero | gender changing has always creeped me out |
| 03:06.52 | gogol | i figure the computer industry could use more gender bending |
| 03:08.07 | gogol | jesus bluetooth ones start at like 60 bucks. re-dick-ulous |
| 03:09.09 | gogol | divide_by_zero: you buy any accessories for your nokia gadgets |
| 03:10.48 | divide_by_zero | nope, I just bought it... It's a N800. I'm saving for a new memory card now. |
| 03:11.07 | divide_by_zero | my nokia phone is a 1100 :) |
| 03:12.01 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.130) |
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| 03:13.31 | gogol | i got a data plan via t-mobile so i could use google voice and not pay for minutes, but my phone dies in two hours using bluetooth constantly... sigh. i wonder what battery life will be like on the n900 (not like i'll EVER be able to afford it) |
| 03:14.07 | Mace_N8x0 | do they call it an n900? |
| 03:14.11 | Mace_N8x0 | hi |
| 03:14.24 | gogol | doesnt know shit |
| 03:14.34 | gogol | the rx-51 |
| 03:14.39 | gogol | (?) |
| 03:15.40 | Mace_N8x0 | i dont know, i was asking ;) |
| 03:15.59 | divide_by_zero | _we_ call it N900 ;) |
| 03:16.10 | divide_by_zero | Nokia doesn't call it anything, it doens't exist :D |
| 03:16.36 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 03:16.44 | Mace_N8x0 | not at all huh? |
| 03:17.00 | Mace_N8x0 | have they started making it? |
| 03:17.22 | Mace_N8x0 | stares at the pandora |
| 03:17.26 | gogol | they made one n900, just for me |
| 03:17.40 | gogol | looks a lot like a worn out n810, but its not |
| 03:17.45 | gogol | its *special* |
| 03:17.47 | Mace_N8x0 | lol |
| 03:18.02 | Mace_N8x0 | like the n95 running maemo? |
| 03:18.21 | divide_by_zero | I remember some time ago reading about some company in chine receiving orders for two nokia products. They specilated it might be their netbook and somethingelse. Maybe one of them was the Rover/rx-51/N900 |
| 03:19.01 | Mace_N8x0 | er |
| 03:19.04 | gogol | nokia has a netbook? |
| 03:19.20 | divide_by_zero | rumors... |
| 03:19.44 | divide_by_zero | http://www.engadget.com/2009/06/24/atom-based-nokia-netbook-reportedly-on-track-for-q3/ |
| 03:19.45 | Mace_N8x0 | they did send "c-series" into the patent office |
| 03:20.01 | Mace_N8x0 | atom based? |
| 03:20.04 | Mace_N8x0 | fail |
| 03:20.44 | Mace_N8x0 | fucking.... FAIL, I dont trust engadget tho |
| 03:20.50 | gogol | android-based? |
| 03:21.13 | Mace_N8x0 | they are like the national enquirer of the tech world |
| 03:21.26 | pupnik | given the vast oceanic reserves of hatred i have for intel, they could come out with a 100mA SoC that outperforms an Athlon and sucks me off at the same time, and i'd still wish slow death upon them. |
| 03:21.50 | pupnik | no not oceanic |
| 03:21.51 | Mace_N8x0 | hahahaha |
| 03:21.59 | Mace_N8x0 | thats rough |
| 03:22.00 | gogol | http://www.netbookera.com/n97-the-nokia-netbook-unveiled/ |
| 03:22.01 | pupnik | like... the sum of estimated dark matter in the universe |
| 03:22.03 | pupnik | that is my hate |
| 03:22.16 | pupnik | it is bending spacetime to be closed and not open |
| 03:22.19 | Mace_N8x0 | n97? |
| 03:22.25 | gogol | well the vid doesnt play for me |
| 03:22.25 | *** part/#maemo smackpotat (n=john@cheetah-tiv-ppp1005.bmts.com) |
| 03:22.34 | Mace_N8x0 | isnt that a phone? |
| 03:22.37 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 03:22.40 | Mace_N8x0 | i had an n95 |
| 03:23.26 | Mace_N8x0 | well |
| 03:23.37 | Mace_N8x0 | if you are going for vastness |
| 03:23.53 | Mace_N8x0 | open space would have been a better choice |
| 03:25.21 | divide_by_zero | http://digitaldaily.allthingsd.com/20090226/a-nokia-netbook-seriously/ |
| 03:25.55 | gogol | http://www.geekstuff4u.com/mini-bluetooth-keyboard.html?___store=en <--what a deal! |
| 03:26.18 | gogol | what is that, pesos? |
| 03:26.38 | divide_by_zero | that what? |
| 03:26.49 | gogol | and that keyboard is no better than the n810s anyway |
| 03:27.11 | Mace_N8x0 | i use my su8w |
| 03:27.17 | Mace_N8x0 | it isnt bad |
| 03:27.32 | Mace_N8x0 | wish i could get the special keys working |
| 03:27.42 | Mace_N8x0 | probably could if i tried |
| 03:28.54 | divide_by_zero | 5990 Japanese yen = 62.27204 U.S. dollars |
| 03:29.24 | Mace_N8x0 | mmmmkay? |
| 03:29.49 | gogol | ah. |
| 03:29.57 | gogol | <---stupid american |
| 03:30.02 | divide_by_zero | :) |
| 03:30.14 | gogol | can i super size that? |
| 03:30.22 | divide_by_zero | tought you guys used to buy lots of japanese cars ;) |
| 03:30.35 | gogol | ive never bought a car in my life |
| 03:30.46 | gogol | oh wait, a volkswagen for $50 |
| 03:31.14 | divide_by_zero | what was that, a VW iPhone app? :) |
| 03:31.19 | gogol | not too hip to world economics |
| 03:31.24 | Mace_N8x0 | why are we called americans? |
| 03:31.37 | gogol | after some guy |
| 03:31.57 | gogol | santa claus america-smith |
| 03:31.57 | Mace_N8x0 | like, north and south america have quite a few countries |
| 03:32.06 | gogol | oh right |
| 03:32.14 | Mace_N8x0 | canada is in north america too |
| 03:32.28 | Mace_N8x0 | shouldnt we be unitedians |
| 03:32.41 | gogol | because we're the dumbest, and loudest. and we kill people when we want to. |
| 03:32.50 | Mace_N8x0 | or statian? |
| 03:32.58 | Mace_N8x0 | hahaha |
| 03:33.13 | gogol | we could decide to call ourselves THE EARTHIANS and nobody would question it im sure |
| 03:33.14 | Mace_N8x0 | i just never understood that |
| 03:33.24 | Mace_N8x0 | naw |
| 03:33.39 | divide_by_zero | There is the work "Estadunidense" here in Brazil, but we only use it when we are fighting :) |
| 03:33.43 | Mace_N8x0 | if they did we would use our military arsenal to silence them |
| 03:34.06 | gogol | who is 'we'> |
| 03:34.07 | gogol | ? |
| 03:34.19 | Mace_N8x0 | hahaha |
| 03:34.29 | gogol | i wouldnt fight for anything USA. no way. |
| 03:34.37 | Mace_N8x0 | lost my capital letter again |
| 03:34.41 | Mace_N8x0 | damnit |
| 03:34.42 | gogol | maybe this is all waay OT. |
| 03:34.46 | Mace_N8x0 | bbl |
| 03:36.02 | divide_by_zero | What if the finnish secret service used devices disguised as cell phones to spy on America? Would you fight?? |
| 03:39.16 | *** join/#maemo genewitch (n=genewitc@cpe-72-129-51-84.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 03:39.47 | genewitch | is there an easy or fancy way to do something like the following pseudo bash set of commands to use my internal card as main storage: |
| 03:40.01 | divide_by_zero | so, using the internet via wi-fi drains the battery?... are there cell phone modems you can use in the usb port?... |
| 03:40.16 | divide_by_zero | s/wi-fi/bluetooth |
| 03:41.01 | genewitch | mv /usr /media/mmc1/usrbak & rm -f /usr & ln -s /media/mmc1/usr /usr & mv /media/mmc1/usr/* /usr/ |
| 03:41.26 | genewitch | divide_by_zero: you can use any tetherable bluetooth phone to surf the internet |
| 03:41.51 | genewitch | oh |
| 03:41.56 | gogol | well it kills my cell phone's battery in a matter of hours. n810 does ok though, probably better than it does over wifi, not sure though. |
| 03:42.19 | genewitch | gogol: have you tried the wimax? |
| 03:42.37 | gogol | no, couldnt afford a whole 'nother tablet |
| 03:42.38 | genewitch | oh |
| 03:43.07 | genewitch | i just want to know if i can force the nokia to use the card as main storage, since i run out of space on the internal memory really fast |
| 03:43.07 | gogol | use your internal card for main storage for what? |
| 03:43.14 | genewitch | gogol: everything |
| 03:43.26 | genewitch | i want to map /usr to the /media/mmc2/usr |
| 03:43.29 | genewitch | for instance |
| 03:43.40 | gogol | that would be nice! |
| 03:43.58 | genewitch | i have 10 gigs of storage, the 800 only has like <90mb of user storage available |
| 03:44.23 | genewitch | i know that's how Mer does it, the whole of the file system is on the memory card |
| 03:45.11 | gogol | i know there's partitioning tricks that work that way |
| 03:45.30 | gogol | you can has /usr on a separate partition |
| 03:45.37 | genewitch | i know |
| 03:45.51 | gogol | wonder if symlinks would really work...i d k |
| 03:46.03 | genewitch | yeah i know |
| 03:46.07 | *** join/#maemo Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun) |
| 03:46.13 | genewitch | however the memory cards are not linux partitions |
| 03:46.27 | genewitch | and you can't access the onboard memory via USB (at least not easily) |
| 03:47.29 | genewitch | if you could access the internal memory you could copy /usr to a type 24 partition on the memory card, then use fstab to make the mountpoint /usr relative to root |
| 03:48.24 | genewitch | I'm going to back up and reset my device in the next 24 hours |
| 03:48.30 | genewitch | i was just hoping there were guidelines for this |
| 03:48.35 | GAN800 | ~boot-sd |
| 03:48.36 | infobot | boot-sd is probably https://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card |
| 03:49.01 | GAN800 | Symlinks are a bad plan for a variety of reasons. |
| 03:49.08 | genewitch | GAN800: roger that. |
| 03:49.10 | GAN800 | Just boot straight. |
| 03:49.24 | genewitch | GAN800: any idea which reader is faster and or HC |
| 03:50.57 | genewitch | IE can the internal MMC read 8 gig cards, and is it faster than the "external" one? |
| 03:51.19 | GAN800 | I'd just use the internal. They're both about the same speed with faster kernels. |
| 03:51.20 | genewitch | i usually boot mer off the external and it's god awful slow at loading but really perky after it boots |
| 03:51.35 | genewitch | well, ok |
| 03:51.42 | GAN800 | Wait, N800 or N810? |
| 03:51.42 | genewitch | thanks for the link, i'm totally doing that. |
| 03:51.44 | genewitch | 800 |
| 03:51.48 | genewitch | i have two card readers |
| 03:51.56 | GAN800 | Ah, it's totally card dependent. |
| 03:52.11 | genewitch | i have ridata 100x cards in both slots |
| 03:52.13 | GAN800 | Might want to look at a 48MHz kernel, though. |
| 03:52.20 | genewitch | uh oh |
| 03:52.38 | GAN800 | 100x sounds like a class 2 |
| 03:52.40 | genewitch | does that run diablo/maemo/whatever or is it custom like mer |
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| 03:52.47 | GAN800 | Slow cards, I think. |
| 03:53.01 | GAN800 | It's a Diablo kernel with patches. |
| 03:53.13 | genewitch | it's something i can replace later with a faster card, no worries. |
| 03:53.27 | genewitch | my pc writes to them at like 6mb/sec |
| 03:53.41 | GAN800 | Might want to order up a 4 or 8GB class 6. |
| 03:53.57 | genewitch | any brand or is ridata cool |
| 03:54.09 | genewitch | I'm sort of a brand loyalist :-p |
| 03:54.21 | GAN800 | AData I've had some trouble with. |
| 03:54.31 | GAN800 | The rest are mostly equal. |
| 03:54.47 | GAN800 | SanDisk is usually significantly better. |
| 03:54.54 | genewitch | alright |
| 03:54.56 | GAN800 | But you pay for it. |
| 03:55.31 | genewitch | I don't mind |
| 03:55.51 | genewitch | i have a ton of sandisk "thumbdrives" that i use as swap partitions on various linux boxes around the house |
| 03:56.18 | genewitch | "uh oh this perl script needs 5 gigs of ram... plug in the 4 gigger!" |
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| 04:05.29 | *** join/#maemo jaem_N810 (n=jaem@S0106001ee54415ec.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 04:05.39 | jaem_N810 | hello folks |
| 04:06.35 | jaem_N810 | Is there a sane way to set up my N810 to share its connection with my (non-wifi-enabled) desktop? Google/t.m.o isn't turning up much for me |
| 04:07.16 | genewitch | usb networking |
| 04:07.17 | genewitch | ? |
| 04:07.19 | jaem_N810 | yep |
| 04:07.25 | jaem_N810 | but I mean the sharing part |
| 04:07.41 | jaem_N810 | networking isn't my forte, and I have no idea how to do that in Maemo |
| 04:07.48 | genewitch | you mean so the PC can use the 810's internet? |
| 04:07.50 | jaem_N810 | yep |
| 04:08.23 | jaem_N810 | this is just a temporary situation, so I can't justify buying a wifi dongle for the PC |
| 04:08.27 | genewitch | give me a moment my 800 is really busy |
| 04:08.33 | jaem_N810 | kk |
| 04:09.52 | genewitch | evidently there's iptables |
| 04:09.53 | genewitch | http://www.revsys.com/writings/quicktips/nat.html |
| 04:10.00 | genewitch | warning, that may break your device or not work. |
| 04:10.04 | jaem_N810 | heh |
| 04:10.23 | genewitch | backup and have your maemo installer handy. |
| 04:10.44 | genewitch | as long as you have both device names you can forward from one to the other like that |
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| 04:11.12 | genewitch | you don't have a bluetooth dongle on your pc? they're like $6 |
| 04:11.19 | jaem_N810 | I have BT |
| 04:11.34 | jaem_N810 | well, an excuse for a BT dongle :P |
| 04:11.51 | genewitch | if it does the bt networking you can probably share it that way |
| 04:12.01 | genewitch | you still need to forward with iptables though |
| 04:12.18 | jaem_N810 | its HW address is 11:11:11:11:11:11... about what I expected, given the vendor XD |
| 04:12.25 | genewitch | heh |
| 04:12.25 | jaem_N810 | okay, that's a thought |
| 04:13.03 | genewitch | the control panel doodad that i have is called "PC-Connectivity Manager" |
| 04:13.15 | genewitch | it lets you set up ad-hoc 802.11 and bt and USB networking |
| 04:13.24 | jaem_N810 | oh, nice - thanks |
| 04:13.36 | genewitch | that's on the nokia, btw, not the PC :-p |
| 04:13.56 | jaem_N810 | my laptop's in for service, and doing /everything/ on my N810 gets cumbersome |
| 04:14.02 | jaem_N810 | yeah - I got that :P |
| 04:14.59 | genewitch | http://wiki.maemo.org/Bluetooth_networking |
| 04:15.07 | jaem_N810 | thanks |
| 04:15.18 | jaem_N810 | I'll look into that |
| 04:15.19 | genewitch | where do you live that you're lucky enough to have wimax? |
| 04:15.25 | jaem_N810 | I don't |
| 04:15.30 | jaem_N810 | ? |
| 04:15.36 | genewitch | how do you ... |
| 04:15.43 | jaem_N810 | oh |
| 04:16.02 | genewitch | borrowing the internet from a roommate with a wireless router? |
| 04:16.14 | jaem_N810 | my downstairs neighbour let me hook my switch+AP tup to her connection |
| 04:16.24 | genewitch | ah |
| 04:16.33 | jaem_N810 | and normally I'd run it through my laptop, but it's not here |
| 04:16.38 | genewitch | gotcha |
| 04:17.22 | jaem_N810 | her connection is overkill for her use, so she lets me use it for free, and doesn't miss the bandwidth ;) |
| 04:17.48 | jaem_N810 | anyhow, thanks for the help |
| 04:17.50 | jaem_N810 | g'night |
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| 04:20.09 | Mace_N8x0 | blah |
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| 04:24.41 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
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| 04:49.13 | genewitch | drat, i already had the modified initfs flashed. i just wasted 10 minutes of my life ;-) |
| 04:49.22 | genewitch | although i did learn that this can boot off a USB HD? |
| 04:49.26 | genewitch | kinda awesome. |
| 04:49.38 | Mace_N8x0 | usb hd? |
| 04:49.52 | genewitch | yeah |
| 04:50.04 | Mace_N8x0 | the n810? |
| 04:50.18 | genewitch | n800 |
| 04:50.27 | genewitch | dunno about n810, i don't have one |
| 04:50.37 | Mace_N8x0 | doesnt the n810 use a proprietary cable? |
| 04:50.41 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 04:50.49 | genewitch | i'm currently installing the OS onto my SD card |
| 04:50.54 | genewitch | so i have more space for programs |
| 04:50.57 | Mace_N8x0 | it looks like it is but so does a g1 usb port |
| 04:51.01 | Mace_N8x0 | oh |
| 04:51.10 | Mace_N8x0 | yah. good idea |
| 04:51.26 | Mace_N8x0 | sure wish they kept the internal sd with the n810 |
| 04:51.33 | Mace_N8x0 | bastards |
| 04:51.37 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 04:53.44 | RST38h | moo all |
| 04:54.01 | Mace_N8x0 | hey |
| 04:54.18 | pupnik_ | RST38h: |
| 04:54.20 | pupnik_ | http://pupnik.de/brainmlt.jpg Beer = Brain Melt |
| 04:54.53 | pupnik_ | it's the 90s photoshop lens flare! |
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| 04:55.52 | genewitch | indeed it is |
| 04:56.28 | genewitch | Mace_N8x0: isn't there a bunch of extra nifty stuff that is installed on that soldered internal card though? |
| 04:56.35 | genewitch | like the mapping software, et al |
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| 04:57.29 | Mace_N8x0 | dunno |
| 04:57.37 | Mace_N8x0 | wiped it before noticing |
| 04:57.42 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
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| 04:57.56 | Mace_N8x0 | can i unsolder it and put a normal sd? |
| 04:58.02 | genewitch | i was wondering |
| 04:58.06 | genewitch | that. |
| 04:58.51 | genewitch | then again, sdhc cards are cheap so popping a different card in whenever isn't that big of a deal |
| 04:58.58 | genewitch | i don't use my internal card for much, really |
| 04:59.11 | genewitch | i think it has every gameboy game on it and a couple of books and a video, and that's it |
| 04:59.43 | genewitch | at least they went with SD and not memory stick |
| 05:00.04 | genewitch | Those fellas cost a ton comparatively. |
| 05:05.56 | pupnik_ | genewitch: that image taught me how to do rendering and postprocessing |
| 05:06.07 | pupnik_ | back when it was newish |
| 05:06.48 | genewitch | heh |
| 05:07.15 | genewitch | Success! my nokia "device memory" now says 409 MB free! |
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| 05:15.31 | Mace_N8x0 | er |
| 05:15.50 | Mace_N8x0 | 409? |
| 05:16.17 | genewitch | yup |
| 05:16.25 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 05:16.47 | genewitch | i was getting sick of having to uninstall some software to install new software |
| 05:17.07 | Mace_N8x0 | what is the easiest way to log the output of initfs flasher? |
| 05:17.32 | Mace_N8x0 | init_flasher > foo.log? |
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| 05:21.11 | RST38h | pupnik: Why drink and drive when you can smoke and fly? |
| 05:21.53 | Stskeeps | &> ? |
| 05:22.46 | pupnik_ | RST38h: the cheap beer in minnesota was called "Grain Belt" - "Brain Melt" was just... my little idea |
| 05:23.52 | pupnik_ | anyway alcohol is a sledgehammer drug. perverse that it is the heaviest legal one. |
| 05:23.53 | RST38h | Heh |
| 05:24.10 | Mace_N8x0 | &> allows input? |
| 05:24.12 | RST38h | Internet not included, I am sure? |
| 05:24.47 | pupnik_ | i also just had a chance to test thinkpad resilience to a freaking beer poured all over it |
| 05:25.13 | pupnik_ | t42p - now sticky as a snail and the screen looks "interesting" - but it still works, due to the drainage slot in the keyboard |
| 05:25.29 | RST38h | Yes, thinkpads are full of drainage slots |
| 05:25.58 | pupnik_ | you shoud;ld see the screen though... crazy improvement in contrast where the beer crept under the rim |
| 05:26.34 | RST38h | heh |
| 05:26.58 | pupnik_ | i am guessing there might be a space between backlight and lcd element that go tfilled - but the strange strange thing is that the borders are 1:1 diagonal in most of it |
| 05:27.37 | pupnik_ | on the one hand, i ruined my thinkpad, on the other hand, it is not unsteal/unsellable |
| 05:27.42 | pupnik_ | now |
| 05:40.55 | divide_by_zero | woohoo, my script to fix the ogg fiels at the media library worked!! |
| 05:42.05 | kulve | divide_by_zero: I have a small control panel applet that removes the navigator oggs from the playlist. Should we add there a button for your script? :) |
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| 05:46.17 | divide_by_zero | might be good! :] |
| 05:47.44 | divide_by_zero | here it is, version 0.1 gopher://sdf.lonestar.org/0/users/nwerneck/ogg-hat-hacker.py |
| 05:47.58 | divide_by_zero | going to sleep, see you all |
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| 05:55.48 | Mace_N8x0 | hm |
| 05:56.09 | Mace_N8x0 | joining more than one irc server seems a little screwed up in rtcom |
| 05:56.27 | Mace_N8x0 | telepathy? |
| 05:56.29 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 05:56.31 | Mace_N8x0 | ah well |
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| 07:23.57 | RST38h | Hmmm...AppManager will no longer support installing from files |
| 07:24.16 | qwerty12_N810 | Yep... |
| 07:24.24 | Mek | not even in red pill mode? |
| 07:24.30 | RST38h | Apparently |
| 07:24.40 | RST38h | Next step: removing apt-get! |
| 07:24.53 | qwerty12_N810 | Not saying it was the right thing to do, at all, but it didn't work great |
| 07:25.39 | RST38h | Worked fine for me |
| 07:26.12 | RST38h | Yes, you could screw things up by installing a wrong package, but that was up to you |
| 07:26.59 | qwerty12_N810 | I usually resorted to dpkg because Application Manager wouldn't install dependencies. From a X terminal, I could just apt-get -f install afterwards |
| 07:28.04 | qwerty12_N810 | apt-get won't be removed though: Quim said about people knowing how to install packages are free to use the command line (incidentially, one of the things I do love about Maemo) |
| 07:28.10 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 07:28.23 | qwerty12_N810 | Morning Jaffa |
| 07:28.41 | Jaffa | qwerty12_N810: Indeed, which is why RST38h saying "removing apt-get" is effectively a troll ;-) |
| 07:28.46 | Jaffa | s/a troll/trolling/ |
| 07:29.04 | Jaffa | Simplifying the UI whilst keeping the power under the hood is fine by me. |
| 07:30.48 | RST38h | Jaffa: You are reminding me to post this suggestion to talk =) |
| 07:31.00 | Jaffa | Oh noes! |
| 07:31.07 | RST38h | hehe |
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| 07:32.52 | RST38h | Jaffa: BTW, should I file separate trackers for every requested XTerm improvement? |
| 07:35.07 | timeless_mbp | fwiw, my harmattan manager is just as annoyed as externals about not being able to install from .deb's using ham :) |
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| 07:37.10 | Tomaterr | hi |
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| 07:38.31 | Jaffa | RST38h: Yes, I think so. |
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| 07:41.40 | RST38h | Ok, adding |
| 07:42.18 | RST38h | qwerty: Do you know the source of that patch that added vertical button placement for xterm? |
| 07:43.22 | qwerty12_N810 | It wasn't a patch, it was like that by default in one of the osso-xterm versions (0.12-<something>) IIRC |
| 07:44.17 | RST38h | Ok, referred tracker to OS2007 version at maemo hackers |
| 07:44.38 | RST38h | The maintainer will probably use this as an excuse to no work on this bug, but it is better than nothing |
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| 07:49.33 | Andy80 | hi |
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| 07:59.27 | RST38h | qwerty: here? |
| 07:59.32 | qwerty12_N810 | yessir |
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| 08:01.44 | RST38h | qwerty: I created trakcers for all the XTerm improvements |
| 08:02.06 | RST38h | qwerty: So if you still haven't abandoned hope of seeing them integrated, go vote/comment and bring the other folks =) |
| 08:02.29 | qwerty12_N810 | Hehe, thanks :) |
| 08:03.19 | Macer | hi |
| 08:03.33 | Macer | hm. n810 died |
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| 08:05.15 | RST38h | Macer: That is because you cheated on it with Touchbook\ |
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| 08:07.23 | qwerty12_N810 | "Coreutils: serious business." |
| 08:10.07 | Stskeeps | Macer: killed your device you say? :P |
| 08:10.20 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: re x86 Mer: please add an option to the first-boot-wizard to blacklist pcspkr |
| 08:10.26 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: oh, hell yes :P |
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| 08:12.01 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: i hate pcspkr module |
| 08:12.57 | qwerty12_N810 | Same here :) |
| 08:13.23 | Stskeeps | tell me what to add to the x86 image for it to blacklist it and i'll gladly add it to imager :P |
| 08:15.16 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: A "/etc/modprobe.d/blacklist-pcspkr.conf" containing "blacklist pcspkr" should be enough |
| 08:15.16 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: consider it done |
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| 08:15.17 | qwerty12_N810 | Thanks |
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| 08:18.13 | RST38h | Jaffa: Same, if you want this stuff integrated into XTerm, vote/comment |
| 08:19.19 | Macer | hm |
| 08:19.25 | Macer | wtf |
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| 08:21.00 | Jaffa | RST38h: Will do. |
| 08:21.12 | Macer | RST38h: only for Mer? |
| 08:21.14 | Macer | hehe |
| 08:21.26 | Macer | i want composited windows |
| 08:21.31 | Macer | ! |
| 08:21.36 | slonopotamus | weird. my tablet started rebooting sometimes when on charger. |
| 08:21.59 | Macer | installed coreutils? |
| 08:22.03 | Macer | ;) |
| 08:22.06 | qwerty12_N810 | Macer: xcompmgr and transset-df is in -devel. Beware of the speed, however... |
| 08:22.26 | Macer | qwerty12_N810: wow.. i was joking haha |
| 08:22.37 | Macer | no powervr support im guessing? |
| 08:22.44 | slonopotamus | and bme says 'ignoring PONG from processwd' several times after reboot |
| 08:22.48 | RST38h | Macer: No, I have filed for 5.0beta2 and any later version |
| 08:23.02 | RST38h | Macer: Only because filing for Diablo does not bring any response nowadays |
| 08:23.13 | Macer | lol |
| 08:23.23 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: is this on bugs.maemo.org? I can only see reports from 07 on maemo-hackers.org |
| 08:23.43 | RST38h | qwerty: Yes, it is on bugs.maemo.org, I will give tracker numbers in a moment |
| 08:23.44 | Macer | maybe they will release fremantle for n810s |
| 08:23.48 | Macer | ;) |
| 08:23.56 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Ah, OK, would explain a lot... |
| 08:23.59 | Macer | like an actual nokia build |
| 08:24.51 | RST38h | qwerty: 4912,4913,4914,4915,4916 |
| 08:25.05 | RST38h | qwerty: I *think* I have covered 'em all, but not sure |
| 08:25.25 | qwerty12_N810 | Macer: There'd be no point in that considering that people are told that said problem in bug report is fixed in Mer |
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| 08:25.29 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: thanks |
| 08:26.11 | Stskeeps | RST38h: don't you have commit access to push those modifications? :) |
| 08:27.02 | Stskeeps | Marat Fayzullin is't it? |
| 08:27.20 | Stskeeps | you're listed as a project admin on osso-xterm so there's really no excuse not to patch :P |
| 08:27.23 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: will vote & comment |
| 08:27.32 | Macer | can you run hildon in mer? |
| 08:27.38 | Macer | :) |
| 08:27.41 | Stskeeps | mer is primarily hildon.. |
| 08:27.41 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 08:27.53 | Macer | but i mean the maemo hildon |
| 08:28.00 | Stskeeps | we did in the past |
| 08:28.12 | Stskeeps | hang on |
| 08:28.37 | Macer | that would be kind of cool |
| 08:28.49 | Macer | bbl. have to do something |
| 08:29.00 | Stskeeps | you're waiting one minute |
| 08:29.01 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 08:30.00 | Stskeeps | http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/mer-homediskfree.png |
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| 08:34.33 | RST38h | Sts: Actually, I do |
| 08:34.58 | RST38h | Sts: But 1) no time and 2) if I do try pushing them, there may be backlash from the maintainers |
| 08:35.27 | Stskeeps | RST38h: i think they'd be happy, tbh |
| 08:35.51 | timeless_mbp | andre__: ping |
| 08:35.52 | RST38h | Sts: Need at least a week of joblesness :) |
| 08:36.02 | Stskeeps | but anyway, you can use 15 minutes to checkout the svn, patch, compile, test, instead of complaining 30 minutes on a bug :) |
| 08:36.18 | timeless_mbp | andre__: please import the latest bug such that the body of comment 1 is before comment 0 |
| 08:36.21 | RST38h | Sts: That is, no full time work, no contract work, family sent away, telephones cut |
| 08:36.40 | t_s_o | seems there will be a whole lot of people running app manager in permanent red pill mode in fremantle... |
| 08:36.42 | RST38h | Sts: No, it isn't this easy. The current XTerm patches apply to OS2007 and OS2008 |
| 08:36.52 | timeless_mbp | t_s_o: well |
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| 08:37.02 | timeless_mbp | most likely a lot of people will install a replacement ham |
| 08:37.07 | RST38h | Sts: So, integrating them into OS2009 codebase is gonna take more than 15 minutes, ESPECIALLY if doing it well |
| 08:37.08 | timeless_mbp | which doesn't require permanent red pill mode |
| 08:37.16 | qwerty12_N810 | t_s_o: why? it's not gonna bring back the "install from local .deb" feature ;) |
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| 08:37.42 | t_s_o | :P |
| 08:37.43 | RST38h | Sts: Besides, will have to ask wazd for a better keyboard overlay, the current one is garish |
| 08:37.43 | Stskeeps | RST38h: there's literally not much change between os2009 osso-xterm and os2008 one :P |
| 08:39.00 | Stskeeps | still, it shows that it just takes one person to ask for commit access to get the stuff done |
| 08:39.04 | Stskeeps | you got added without much protest |
| 08:39.38 | RST38h | Sts: I was asked if I want this job |
| 08:39.55 | RST38h | Sts: And agreed. Haven't done shit though. |
| 08:40.00 | t_s_o | qwerty12_N810: maybe i should put it like this then, right now there seems to be a very short distance between "sheep" and "wizard" in the package management department... |
| 08:42.00 | Andy80 | t_s_o, what you mean? |
| 08:42.29 | Stskeeps | t_s_o: they didn't say no .install files |
| 08:42.45 | t_s_o | so we are back at third party repos? |
| 08:43.07 | Stskeeps | i do understand why they want to do it like that though |
| 08:43.20 | Mek | btw, last I checked app manager in fremantle still had install from file in red pill mode... |
| 08:43.35 | t_s_o | Mek: red pill opens a whole different can of worms... |
| 08:43.41 | Stskeeps | t_s_o: or local repos for that sake |
| 08:44.15 | t_s_o | heh, now i am tempted to see if i can run a repo of a SD card ;) |
| 08:44.22 | Stskeeps | sure you can |
| 08:44.24 | Mek | that works just fine |
| 08:44.26 | Stskeeps | apt-ftparchive is your friend |
| 08:44.34 | qwerty12_N810 | installed the early diablo betas like that... |
| 08:44.48 | Mek | I've installed lots of stuff whith no wifi around that way... |
| 08:44.58 | t_s_o | figures |
| 08:45.43 | timeless_mbp | t_s_o: you can run a repo off anything |
| 08:45.49 | timeless_mbp | i have a test package which install a repo into /root |
| 08:45.53 | t_s_o | meh, damned if you do, damned if you dont... |
| 08:45.56 | timeless_mbp | it's referenced from a Fremantle bug report |
| 08:46.18 | timeless_mbp | (a bug they fixed i might add) |
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| 08:50.05 | linuxeventually | Hello all |
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| 09:04.24 | andre__ | timeless_mbp, that's not a blocker, but okay |
| 09:04.42 | timeless_mbp | andre__: such bugs need to be fixed early |
| 09:04.52 | timeless_mbp | i should have spotted it months ago when i was working on the Mer strings |
| 09:05.10 | timeless_mbp | andre__: from an l10n perspective, it blocks the ability to have decent strings |
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| 09:05.31 | timeless_mbp | it's more important than a bug where a string is misspelled |
| 09:05.35 | andre__ | then every l10n bug would be a blocker |
| 09:05.38 | timeless_mbp | no |
| 09:05.46 | timeless_mbp | only bugs where the underlying code is inflexible |
| 09:06.00 | timeless_mbp | which in fact is about 50% of bugs but should be <2% |
| 09:06.13 | andre__ | right, misspelled strings are l10n bugs. this issue is an i18n bug |
| 09:06.21 | timeless_mbp | right |
| 09:06.43 | timeless_mbp | i18n bugs essentially are blockers by default, yes |
| 09:06.49 | timeless_mbp | put another way |
| 09:06.58 | timeless_mbp | if an i18n bug isn't fixed, a given language shouldn't ship |
| 09:07.05 | timeless_mbp | because it can't do its job |
| 09:07.20 | timeless_mbp | it literally blocks the entire deliverable |
| 09:08.42 | Stskeeps | what's the difference between l10n and i18n? :P |
| 09:08.52 | pupnik_ | are there any particular things to avoid when persuading an old woman to go down on you? |
| 09:08.57 | timeless_mbp | internationalization is the ability to make something available |
| 09:09.03 | ShadowJK | pupnik_, dentures |
| 09:09.06 | timeless_mbp | localization is the act of actually translating |
| 09:09.13 | timeless_mbp | there's also l12y |
| 09:09.17 | timeless_mbp | localizability |
| 09:09.29 | timeless_mbp | which is really what we're talking about more than l18n |
| 09:09.35 | timeless_mbp | l18n is more of a superset |
| 09:09.45 | timeless_mbp | and l12y/l10n are mostly complements |
| 09:10.01 | timeless_mbp | that's a really rough explanation |
| 09:10.28 | timeless_mbp | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/describekeywords.cgi#l12y |
| 09:10.43 | timeless_mbp | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/describekeywords.cgi#intl |
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| 09:11.14 | timeless_mbp | that's about the best i can offer |
| 09:11.52 | timeless_mbp | actually replace my original definition of internationalization with a more process oriented definition covering l12y+l10n :) |
| 09:12.19 | linuxeventually | @Pupnik, I realize this off-topic, but I was wondering if the driver qwerty12 compiled for r8187 (realtek rtl8187) works with the latest Diablo kernel? |
| 09:12.24 | timeless_mbp | in general, nokia doesn't get l12y right ever |
| 09:12.38 | timeless_mbp | not for gender (see references from yesterday) |
| 09:12.45 | timeless_mbp | and not for regional stuff (see bug) |
| 09:12.55 | timeless_mbp | i can't wait for all the fun plural bugs |
| 09:13.04 | RST38h | f10n |
| 09:13.07 | timeless_mbp | and note that even for simple plurals nokia doesn't get them right |
| 09:13.38 | RST38h | As in "stick to pidgin English to avoid f10n" |
| 09:14.48 | pupnik_ | 11:12 -!- pupnik_ was kicked from #politics by RAS| [I would ask you to leave, but why, when I can force you?] |
| 09:14.57 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 09:15.03 | pupnik_ | yaay my ban for the day |
| 09:15.16 | pupnik_ | just gotta be creative |
| 09:15.21 | timeless_mbp | good to get that out of the way early :) |
| 09:15.37 | RST38h | pupnik: So, what was it? |
| 09:15.55 | pupnik_ | the comment that got me banned? my silly sex question |
| 09:16.04 | RST38h | Ah |
| 09:16.29 | linuxeventually | Ah |
| 09:17.29 | pupnik_ | <chirp> |
| 09:17.41 | pupnik_ | when you're on a roll you just gotta soar |
| 09:17.50 | RST38h | pupnik: Next time ask for a slightly used stuffed owl, in a good condition |
| 09:18.11 | RST38h | That USUALLY makes most people think |
| 09:18.16 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: another Mer gotcha: WebKit, itself, is hardcoded to use /home/user for its cookie storage |
| 09:18.28 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: probably another g_free issue.. |
| 09:18.40 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: got a file i can look at? |
| 09:19.11 | qwerty12_N810 | I just searched in his diff after noticing that /home/user was created after running Tear |
| 09:19.35 | linuxeventually | I would like to add to the topic brought forth by timeless_mbp the suggestion that the universal symbol for currency ¤ be used in the future as the label on the hardware key that then redirects to the appropriate $, Â¥, â¬, £ etc based on user localization so as to not waste function keys and be more globally accepting |
| 09:19.37 | Stskeeps | i'm really wondering if it's good or bad that we have $USER != user |
| 09:20.00 | timeless_mbp | linuxeventually: so |
| 09:20.04 | timeless_mbp | that's problematic |
| 09:20.08 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: I can give him a patch that'll use g_get_home_dir() - it'll work for Maemo too.. |
| 09:20.11 | RST38h | linueventually: Finally, all the keyboards will be marked like we had them back in .SU |
| 09:20.13 | timeless_mbp | because i use $ to mean "go to end of line" in vi |
| 09:20.25 | timeless_mbp | and i use $ to mean "this is a shell variable" in my shell |
| 09:20.29 | RST38h | Please, also adopt the IBM backspace symbol (arrow with a cross) |
| 09:20.38 | timeless_mbp | or $ to mean "this is a scalar variable" in perl |
| 09:20.50 | timeless_mbp | RST38h: EWAYTOORATIONAL |
| 09:20.56 | timeless_mbp | and IBM owns RATIONAL :) |
| 09:21.44 | timeless_mbp | RST38h: do you mean the icon used here: http://www.nokiaphoneblog.com/images/e61i.jpg |
| 09:22.21 | linuxeventually | That's true, but are the yen or euro characters used as variables/shortcuts in any programs or programming languages? I'm just curious. |
| 09:22.35 | Stskeeps | i vote for one world currency |
| 09:22.35 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 09:23.26 | timeless_mbp | USD :) |
| 09:23.33 | qwerty12_N810 | GBP |
| 09:23.41 | timeless_mbp | linuxeventually: to my knowledge none are |
| 09:23.42 | RST38h | Golden sovereigns |
| 09:23.42 | linuxeventually | It was just something I was thinking about the other day, so as to free more space for other characters |
| 09:23.53 | suihkulokki | bottlecaps |
| 09:24.06 | RST38h | qwerty: Can you still make your own sovereigns in the UK? |
| 09:24.06 | timeless_mbp | linuxeventually: i'm not saying there isn't something to be said for the approach |
| 09:24.11 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: no idea |
| 09:24.15 | timeless_mbp | i certainly don't approve of the 5 character rotate left in the n810 |
| 09:24.18 | timeless_mbp | that was insane |
| 09:24.40 | Stskeeps | sheep as world currency |
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| 09:26.19 | linuxeventually | Okay I guess no one wants to abandon their own currency, so I suppose I'm going to put name in for more keys in the future then (; |
| 09:26.41 | linuxeventually | *My name |
| 09:27.13 | RST38h | just remove all markings off the keys |
| 09:27.25 | linuxeventually | So no one wants to talk about the alfa usb driver I mentioned earlier? |
| 09:27.27 | linuxeventually | Lol |
| 09:27.27 | RST38h | People who need to use them will know |
| 09:27.40 | RST38h | The rest can have one-buttoned mouse |
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| 09:28.40 | linuxeventually | No thanks one-button mouse |
| 09:28.57 | Stskeeps | just put tiny lcd displays in the keys.. |
| 09:28.57 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 09:29.17 | qwerty12_N810 | With keys that size? :P |
| 09:29.48 | ShadowJK | saw keys with oled 64x64 pixel displays sold on a chinese website |
| 09:29.55 | linuxeventually | I'd like to see a faux middle click in addition to our faux right-click (i of course refer to the menu key) rather than relying soley on a single input |
| 09:30.06 | linuxeventually | The optimus keyboard? |
| 09:30.13 | ShadowJK | no |
| 09:32.35 | timeless_mbp | yeah, lcd keyboards are definitely available |
| 09:32.53 | timeless_mbp | or you know... someone could invest enough time and money to make a working touch screen based keyboard |
| 09:32.57 | timeless_mbp | oh,... apple already did that |
| 09:33.04 | timeless_mbp | i guess no one else should then |
| 09:33.06 | *** part/#maemo jukey (n=jukey@kamiserver.de) |
| 09:33.14 | ShadowJK | whoever designed E75 keyboard never tried entering ip:port addresses with it :/ |
| 09:33.21 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 09:33.41 | timeless_mbp | my e61i has shift+. = : |
| 09:33.46 | timeless_mbp | and they're stacked vertically |
| 09:34.37 | timeless_mbp | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:34.37 | ShadowJK | e75 has FN+. = : |
| 09:34.43 | timeless_mbp | http://www.ubergizmo.com/photos/2009/2/nokia-e75.jpg ? |
| 09:35.21 | ShadowJK | I guess the layout for specials is different between languages again.. |
| 09:35.34 | timeless_mbp | nokia is great at tha |
| 09:35.41 | timeless_mbp | may i ask why you bought the e75? |
| 09:35.58 | timeless_mbp | nokia thinks that it adds value to have incompatible variants |
| 09:36.36 | linuxeventually | I think my biggest personal annoyance of the n810 hardware keys is that the numerical keys are part of the homerow. |
| 09:36.44 | ShadowJK | Because my E70 died and nokia has no replacement yet.. I would've bought E71, but it's stuck on the older OS, so I got E75 instead |
| 09:37.12 | linuxeventually | I can only assume they have a fragmented keyboard design team |
| 09:37.20 | timeless_mbp | they don't |
| 09:37.30 | linuxeventually | Really? |
| 09:37.32 | timeless_mbp | they have a fragmented requirements team |
| 09:37.38 | timeless_mbp | and insist on catering to each group |
| 09:37.43 | linuxeventually | Ah |
| 09:37.48 | timeless_mbp | at least, that's what we have |
| 09:37.58 | timeless_mbp | i have to assume the same applies for Symbian divisions |
| 09:38.11 | timeless_mbp | nokia is really proud of its variants system |
| 09:38.21 | timeless_mbp | it really does think a lot of value is had from it |
| 09:39.27 | ShadowJK | Nokia has too many variants of everything, when nokia itself even fails to make apps portable across variants |
| 09:40.44 | timeless_mbp | would be happy if nokia managed to make one app that worked properly for one variant |
| 09:40.48 | timeless_mbp | overjoyed even |
| 09:41.07 | linuxeventually | Yes I thought Ovi was their way of doing that |
| 09:41.10 | linuxeventually | But then |
| 09:41.15 | *** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@54.200.49.122-static.velocitynet.com.au) |
| 09:41.18 | linuxeventually | Not so much |
| 09:41.27 | ShadowJK | Some of them do work if you limit yourself to a featureset smaller than what the program appears or claims to support ;-) |
| 09:42.04 | ShadowJK | The S60 Browser works for downloading files, as long as you split them up to 350 meg or so |
| 09:42.20 | linuxeventually | I find it humourous that symbian application designed for the N95 are not functional on the N97 due the lack of softkeys |
| 09:42.20 | timeless_mbp | you've managed to download a 350mb file? |
| 09:42.27 | ShadowJK | yes |
| 09:42.33 | timeless_mbp | wow |
| 09:42.46 | timeless_mbp | my phone would probably just reboot :) |
| 09:42.58 | timeless_mbp | (n81 8gb) |
| 09:43.05 | ShadowJK | Just started it in the morning, left phone on charger, and the next day in the evening it beeped and said file saved to E:\Downloads |
| 09:43.06 | timeless_mbp | it likes to reboot if i try to connect to freenode |
| 09:43.08 | linuxeventually | I think that's to remind people using US telecos that they have a 5gb limit (; |
| 09:43.22 | timeless_mbp | heh |
| 09:44.13 | ShadowJK | I don't know exactly where the limit is, but when there was 1.8 gig free on the memory card it failed to download a 1 gig file with "insufficient space" or something similar.. |
| 09:44.13 | slonopotamus | lardman|afk, ping |
| 09:44.23 | linuxeventually | Hmm |
| 09:44.27 | linuxeventually | I wonder |
| 09:44.37 | linuxeventually | If it's something similar |
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| 09:44.57 | ShadowJK | It probably downloads to a temp folder and then copies? :-) |
| 09:45.04 | linuxeventually | To the practice of reserving 5% of a partition for root |
| 09:45.09 | linuxeventually | Or that |
| 09:46.12 | ShadowJK | Out of the box, the Camera app crashed on everything except taking a picture. If you tired change settings -> crash, if you tried switch flash on/off -> crash |
| 09:46.37 | ShadowJK | one day phone asked approval for updating firmware and I said yes, camera started working after that :-) |
| 09:49.22 | RST38h | Shadow: N97? |
| 09:49.52 | ShadowJK | E75 |
| 09:50.00 | RST38h | Ah |
| 09:50.15 | slonopotamus | lardman|afk, gcc supports c54x and c4x targets. now i wonder if c54x binaries will work on c55x |
| 09:50.25 | RST38h | The insuffficient state thing is a known problem |
| 09:50.47 | RST38h | Shadow: it copies crap to a temp directory on C: |
| 09:52.46 | ShadowJK | that can't be, C: isn't even big enough for a 350 meg download |
| 09:53.08 | RST38h | Well, it applies to .sis files |
| 09:53.13 | RST38h | Not sure about firmware updates |
| 09:53.42 | ShadowJK | Oh I was downloading random shit |
| 09:53.46 | RST38h | Poor old E70 can only be flashed wholesale, not that there is any reason to do that for the last few years |
| 09:54.01 | ShadowJK | actually an mp3 XORd so that the damn browser wouldn't try to invoke the media player |
| 09:54.29 | ShadowJK | I think it can be flashed with data cable and PC Suite? |
| 09:54.33 | RST38h | Ehehe, this is fixable I think :) |
| 09:54.38 | RST38h | Yes, it can be |
| 09:54.47 | RST38h | If you are bold enough to install PC Suite |
| 09:54.53 | ShadowJK | isn't |
| 09:55.10 | ShadowJK | I've stumbled across various siemens, nokia, ericsson software on people's computers |
| 09:55.11 | RST38h | Well, you will jsut have to manually clean registry afterwards |
| 09:55.14 | ShadowJK | and it scares me |
| 09:55.34 | RST38h | Actually, hijackThis does good job at eliminating PC Suite |
| 09:58.07 | linuxeventually | Perhaps it would work in a virtual machine that could just be junked later? |
| 09:58.45 | RST38h | too complicated |
| 09:58.53 | RST38h | thenyou would have to clean up after vmware instead |
| 09:59.18 | _berto_ | i tried pc suite in qemu |
| 09:59.30 | glass | e70 can be home-flashed with pcsuite.. |
| 09:59.36 | glass | pcsuite makes it more useful anyways |
| 09:59.46 | _berto_ | but it didn't work |
| 09:59.58 | RST38h | glass: Not for me |
| 10:00.16 | RST38h | glass: Ironically, what made e70 more useful for me was Personal Web Server |
| 10:00.38 | RST38h | glass: If I were Nokia, I would ditch PC Suite and replace it with PWS on the phone |
| 10:00.43 | glass | RST38h: yes, but arranging files, getting images automatically out, managing stuff |
| 10:01.02 | glass | RST38h: would pws make dialing up to internet a one click thing? |
| 10:01.03 | RST38h | glass: BT/USB mass storage does this very well |
| 10:01.19 | RST38h | glass: No, but you do not need PC Suite for that either |
| 10:01.49 | RST38h | glass: For managing files, standard USB mass storage + FAR Manager serve all my needs |
| 10:01.52 | lcuk2 | does the tablet connect wiht pcsuite stuff? the only desktop software ive tried is the windows flasher |
| 10:01.57 | lcuk2 | and i rated that 5stars lol |
| 10:02.03 | RST38h | lcuk: Actually, it does |
| 10:02.11 | RST38h | lcuk: In a limited way |
| 10:02.25 | glass | RST38h: standard usb mass storage gets you mmc only, no? |
| 10:02.26 | lcuk2 | interesting, so its recognised then? |
| 10:02.34 | RST38h | glass: Yes, but so what? |
| 10:02.39 | glass | RST38h: a lot so what |
| 10:02.47 | RST38h | glass: I have got 1GB MMC there and a really tiny 64MB C: |
| 10:03.02 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: did I fuck something up here: http://slexy.org/view/s21cm9qprc |
| 10:03.07 | RST38h | glass: Why would I care? |
| 10:03.14 | glass | RST38h: i guess you don't want to look at logs from c |
| 10:03.27 | *** join/#maemo ijon_ (n=ijon@dhcp172-152-red.yandex.net) |
| 10:03.32 | RST38h | glass: Not often, but when I do, there is BT |
| 10:03.46 | RST38h | glass: And I can look at them locally using XFiles |
| 10:04.04 | glass | RST38h: pcsuite allows faster installing of sis files too |
| 10:04.20 | glass | RST38h: all and all, using either that, or remotes60 or such, comes pretty useful when developing |
| 10:04.27 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: looks correct to me |
| 10:04.49 | RST38h | glass: The only problem is, not all sis files installed by pcsuite work afterwards :) |
| 10:04.52 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: Good, it shouldn't mess up usage under Maemo |
| 10:05.02 | glass | RST38h: .. such as? |
| 10:05.13 | glass | RST38h: the installer is ran on the phone anyways |
| 10:05.13 | RST38h | glass: google :) |
| 10:05.23 | lcuk2 | qwerty12_N810, webkit uses curl? |
| 10:05.26 | RST38h | glass: I know, but there appear to be some discrepancies |
| 10:05.31 | glass | RST38h: such sis files would be called 'broken' |
| 10:05.34 | RST38h | glass: Never took time to figure which ones |
| 10:05.46 | RST38h | glass: Dunno, it installs everytihing just fine locally |
| 10:06.43 | qwerty12_N810 | lcuk2: no, libsoup but Bundyo has to use the CURL backend so that it compiles for Diablo (diablo has too old libsoup) |
| 10:06.43 | glass | RST38h: pre 2nd edition, the installer ran completely on the pcsuite. was very useful |
| 10:06.43 | RST38h | glass: I never found this thing useful, really |
| 10:06.43 | glass | RST38h: if one put the exe to run after install, then testing on phone was supereasy |
| 10:06.43 | lcuk2 | qwerty12_N810, understood |
| 10:06.48 | glass | RST38h: but a lot of things got broken in the installer in 3rd edition |
| 10:06.54 | RST38h | glass: It is awful :( Slow, crashy, leaves crap all over the registry |
| 10:06.56 | glass | RST38h: a _lot_ |
| 10:07.06 | RST38h | glass: not only in the installer... |
| 10:07.14 | timeless_mbp | RST38h: i'm quite happy with virtualbox |
| 10:09.36 | ShadowJK | has a little arm box under his desk with bluetooth dongle attached, automatically connects through phone to intarwebs whenever phone is in range |
| 10:12.42 | *** join/#maemo nickar (n=nickar@190.1.20.141) |
| 10:16.13 | genewitch | can i develop software for the nokia n800 on an old sparc workstation? |
| 10:16.18 | qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: I've also given Bundyo a patch that checks to see if /media/mmc1/ exists before making databaseDirectory "/media/mmc1" so that should hopefully be resolved too if Bundyo includes it... |
| 10:16.28 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: alright, - sounds good |
| 10:16.40 | lcuk2 | genewitch, you can sit on whatever is comfortable |
| 10:16.50 | Stskeeps | we'll probably adopt /media/mmc* eventually when we have the event daemon :P |
| 10:16.52 | lcuk2 | but im not sure if the sdk will work |
| 10:17.14 | genewitch | i'm thinking of making a LAMP server out of the sparc workstation, or SAMP if i can't find a useful linux to run on it |
| 10:17.26 | lcuk2 | you could try using the vmware image or something |
| 10:17.29 | genewitch | i really only write console stuff |
| 10:17.50 | Stskeeps | genewitch: sparc and scratchbox would probably be fun.. in scratchbox2 it's more likely |
| 10:18.32 | genewitch | i have no desire to learn qt4 or whatever API for maemo; the GUI space in my brain is reserved for windows :-( |
| 10:19.06 | genewitch | no out loud pun intended. |
| 10:20.12 | ShadowJK | small console stuff can probably be compiled on the tablet fine |
| 10:20.30 | genewitch | how? mer? |
| 10:21.09 | ShadowJK | If you're careful, you can add the SDK repo and install gcc and libc6-dev |
| 10:21.24 | *** join/#maemo yerga (n=yerga@87.223.221.225) |
| 10:25.10 | genewitch | you have a link? |
| 10:25.13 | genewitch | i'd love that |
| 10:25.48 | genewitch | i tried to get it on there a while back but to no avail |
| 10:28.00 | Stskeeps | ShadowJK: are you trying to drive people to mass psychosis? :P |
| 10:28.09 | linuxeventually | I'd be interested as well. However I would think it would "brick"/unusable the particular install. Also it takes a couple gigs, right? |
| 10:28.15 | lcuk2 | deb http://repository.maemo.org diablo/sdk free non-free |
| 10:28.15 | lcuk2 | deb http://repository.maemo.org diablo/tools free non-free |
| 10:29.09 | ShadowJK | Stskeeps, luck isn't psychotic |
| 10:29.12 | lcuk2 | then you can apt-get sdk stuff available directly on tablet. you cannot run things like ./configure, nor can you build packages with dpkg |
| 10:29.13 | *** part/#maemo newdep (n=pedon@3E33C9F4.dslaccess.aol.com) |
| 10:29.18 | genewitch | why would having a compiler and a library brick an install? you can usually tell it to install into it's own folder, however much hell that would play on gmake |
| 10:29.22 | lcuk2 | but you can use gcc and make happily |
| 10:29.44 | *** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (n=timeless@192.100.124.156) |
| 10:29.59 | pupnik_ | i am a libertarian |
| 10:30.00 | pupnik_ | a person of clear mind, generous heart, and joyous spirit |
| 10:30.05 | ShadowJK | That's what I said "carefully", the SDK repo isn't entirely compatible, and sometimes it will ask you to remove a dozen packages in order to install something. Say no. |
| 10:30.46 | lcuk2 | ShadowJK, heh i think its coreutils that does that |
| 10:31.01 | lcuk2 | it removes busybox and tries to put the other stuff on, and you get almost 2 pages of removals |
| 10:31.17 | lcuk2 | and you have to type "stskeeps told me to do it" |
| 10:31.23 | lcuk2 | before it will actually do it |
| 10:32.14 | lcuk2 | genewitch, ^^^ thats why it can brick an install |
| 10:32.27 | linuxeventually | "stskeeps made me do it" LOL |
| 10:33.09 | slonopotamus | scary |
| 10:33.29 | slonopotamus | build crosstoolchain for dsp |
| 10:33.59 | pupnik_ | where is somumaha |
| 10:34.05 | pupnik_ | damn finns |
| 10:34.12 | qwerty12_N810 | ukki? he's in #knots |
| 10:34.15 | linuxeventually | Yeah installing core packages from a different repo tends to do that to linux installs, heh. i probably have a record for most bricked installs. "What do you mean libc cannot be installed" etc |
| 10:34.20 | pupnik_ | ty! |
| 10:34.48 | pupnik_ | qwerty12_N810: if you're ever like dying or something.... drop me a privmsg and i'll help |
| 10:35.07 | qwerty12_N810 | Hehe, thanks :D |
| 10:35.07 | Stskeeps | ShadowJK: you obviously haven't met him ;p |
| 10:35.16 | lcuk2 | linuxeventually, libc6 to be installed is v3, but you currently have v4. do you want to downgrade? |
| 10:35.18 | lcuk2 | yeah |
| 10:35.18 | pupnik_ | the offer includes helicopters and armed people |
| 10:35.23 | lcuk2 | KABOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM! |
| 10:35.54 | lcuk2 | :O oi! |
| 10:36.08 | linuxeventually | More of a apt-get upgrade on a knoppix hd install that was 2 years old, hah |
| 10:36.11 | pupnik_ | so my vmps electrostatics seem farked. so i'm cranking just the carbn woofer bass drivers with 2.5kg magnets |
| 10:36.31 | pupnik_ | it's not club-level-loud but et get's the bowels moving |
| 10:36.37 | genewitch | ouch |
| 10:37.04 | pupnik_ | if anybody likes hi-fi, and comes through frankfurt, contact me |
| 10:37.05 | genewitch | i sound like such a cad |
| 10:37.19 | genewitch | is there a java VM or whatever for maemo? |
| 10:37.26 | pupnik_ | sort of |
| 10:37.33 | genewitch | ie java javaprog.java |
| 10:38.04 | slonopotamus | genewitch, jalimo |
| 10:38.12 | Jaffa | genewitch: Yes. See Jalimo. |
| 10:38.29 | Jaffa | has run Eclipse's OSGi-container (Equinox) using it |
| 10:38.43 | genewitch | OSGi |
| 10:38.56 | genewitch | i can write java in notepad++ |
| 10:39.19 | Jaffa | OSGi is nothing to do with Eclipse's IDE |
| 10:39.22 | genewitch | now i can 1-up my iPhone wearing friends. "we both have java, but i still have flash and you don't" |
| 10:39.32 | Jaffa | genewitch: The iPhone has Java? |
| 10:39.37 | Jaffa | I didn't think it did. |
| 10:40.21 | genewitch | i could be wrong |
| 10:40.25 | genewitch | erg |
| 10:40.46 | genewitch | ~jalimo |
| 10:41.05 | linuxeventually | I thought most phones had java mobile (or whatever it is called)? But no idea about apple products |
| 10:41.58 | Jaffa | linuxeventually: Many/most phones to have a Java ME implementation. The iPhone is not one of them. Android doesn't either (IIRC), but its apps are written in the Java language and run on a Java-like platform. |
| 10:42.15 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (n=lizardo@189.2.128.130) |
| 10:42.24 | linuxeventually | Yeah java-like. |
| 10:43.10 | *** join/#maemo baraujo (n=Bruno@189.2.128.130) |
| 10:43.17 | Jaffa | For most developers, the slightly different class library and the Dalvik VM aren't relevant and it's as close to Java to make the difference somewhat immaterial |
| 10:43.20 | genewitch | microsoft virtual machine definition of "java-like"? |
| 10:43.51 | lcuk2 | "java-like" as in pepsi is "coke-like" |
| 10:43.55 | linuxeventually | I know "turbo easyDEB" has some version of java installed, probably not sun java, I haven't looked into it |
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| 10:44.47 | genewitch | Applications / There is no result matching the search criteria. Please try again. |
| 10:44.52 | genewitch | for jalimo |
| 10:45.20 | Jaffa | genewitch: No. It's a version of the class library with some additions (and some removals) and a non-Java-bytecode VM |
| 10:45.45 | Jaffa | https://wiki.evolvis.org/jalimo/index.php/Main_Page |
| 10:48.43 | linuxeventually | (That debian lxde env. contains openjdk, eww) |
| 10:48.58 | lcuk2 | xnt keeps mucking about with a java framework i think |
| 10:51.29 | Stskeeps | hmm, qole's birthday today |
| 10:51.52 | genewitch | happy birthday qole |
| 10:51.56 | genewitch | brb |
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| 10:59.31 | RST38h | Hahaha, QuickOffice guys suddenly felt the ground being removed form udner their feet |
| 11:00.36 | Stskeeps | wtf is the deal with #4915 and worksforme->reopened->fixed? :P |
| 11:02.26 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (n=javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 11:04.48 | javispedro | oh, my garage application was rejected |
| 11:04.57 | javispedro | who is the garage admin? |
| 11:04.59 | Jaffa | javispedro: For? |
| 11:05.07 | Stskeeps | snes9x license? ;) |
| 11:05.20 | qwerty12_N810 | Having Maemo in the name? :P |
| 11:05.21 | javispedro | "I didn't specify a license", though I remember choosing "Other/propietary" and I'm sure I filled the license textfield. |
| 11:05.22 | Jaffa | Stskeeps: My diablo X Term (without patches) allows me to change the font |
| 11:06.42 | X-Fade | javispedro: There is an unspoken rule not to allow hosting closed source apps on garage, I thnk. |
| 11:06.51 | suihkulokki | RST38h: one still needs to wonder if m$ will manage to make a useful office port - they have a habit of making half-assed ports to their competitors platforms |
| 11:07.08 | javispedro | It's not closed source, but uses a rather uncommon BSD-like with advertising license and no-commercial. |
| 11:07.32 | suihkulokki | even office for windoes ce is quite sucky too.. |
| 11:08.00 | linuxeventually1 | Well I guess you can just host elsewhere until it is cleared up. And yes it is a license formality. If it had a binary blob we wouldn't have support =@ |
| 11:08.34 | RST38h | suihkulokki: One does not need to wonder, MS will not. |
| 11:08.34 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=rsalveti@200.184.118.130) |
| 11:09.00 | X-Fade | javispedro: I'll check who denied it and what was the reasoning behind it. |
| 11:09.07 | RST38h | suihkulokki: For reference, you only need to look at their IE port to Solaris |
| 11:09.14 | javispedro | X-Fade, thanks. |
| 11:09.16 | RST38h | suihkulokki: Or at Skype port to Symbian |
| 11:09.28 | RST38h | suihkulokki: (to view the problem from the other end) |
| 11:10.17 | javispedro | for the record, Wikipedia says the license is "Free software": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snes9x#Licenseç |
| 11:10.27 | javispedro | damn ç key near return. |
| 11:10.39 | lcuk2 | X-Fade, what happened with canola then? |
| 11:10.48 | lcuk2 | for the longest time wasnt that closed |
| 11:11.05 | *** join/#maemo plastun (n=plastun@86.57.177.190) |
| 11:11.10 | zerojayPC | yep |
| 11:11.30 | lcuk2 | and didnt someone get round the problem of autobuilder and blobs |
| 11:12.16 | X-Fade | lcuk2: Probably got grandfathered in somewhere in 2006. |
| 11:12.37 | lcuk2 | nods |
| 11:12.44 | X-Fade | lcuk2: And why would you use the autobuilder for closed apps a all? There is direct upload for non-free? |
| 11:12.53 | lcuk2 | you were a PFY yourself then lol |
| 11:13.15 | lcuk2 | i dunno, but if theres a method to upload non-free doesnt that mean you allow closed source? |
| 11:13.29 | javispedro | or things the autobuilder doesn't like. |
| 11:13.33 | suihkulokki | RST38h: IE for UNIX was funny.. came with half of windows :) |
| 11:13.33 | lcuk2 | or is it just garage hosted |
| 11:13.58 | Jaffa | lcuk2: Extras, auto-builder and garage have *nothing* to do with each other. |
| 11:14.27 | X-Fade | Jaffa: Well, that is not exactly true. |
| 11:14.56 | lcuk2 | ok, each has its own little rules. cool ill stop digging |
| 11:14.59 | Jaffa | X-Fade: In terms of proejcts etc. |
| 11:15.25 | Jaffa | X-Fade: i.e. you don't need a garage project to upload to the auto-builder; you don't need to use the auto-builder to get into extras (for non-free) |
| 11:16.05 | X-Fade | Jaffa: But you need a garage account and both run on the same machine ;) |
| 11:16.12 | linuxeventually1 | Speaking of that snes emulator, is it usable at this stage? |
| 11:16.28 | Jaffa | X-Fade: Yeah, yeah - I know ;-p |
| 11:17.00 | javispedro | linuxeventually1, if you can live without saves :D |
| 11:17.04 | linuxeventually1 | Excuse me the term is "playable" |
| 11:17.09 | linuxeventually1 | Ah cool |
| 11:17.55 | *** join/#maemo jpeeters (n=jpeeters@193.5-14-84.ripe.coltfrance.com) |
| 11:17.58 | RST38h | suihkulokki: Right. Now imagine Office for Symbian coming to Symbian with half Windows =) |
| 11:18.47 | linuxeventually1 | Haha |
| 11:18.47 | suihkulokki | I'd have nightmares of that mental image :) |
| 11:19.02 | javispedro | I just wanted a repo, so don't push very hard X-Fade (I mean I really could just use gitourius or ask dreamhost for yet another svn repo) |
| 11:20.30 | X-Fade | javispedro: No problem, just want to know myself too. |
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| 11:38.10 | lcuk2 | are binaries compiled in diablo sdk usable on fremantle? |
| 11:38.42 | thopiekar | hii |
| 11:38.48 | javispedro | lcuk2, this is always a matter of luck |
| 11:39.14 | javispedro | a bare C console application: for sure |
| 11:39.23 | lcuk2 | but the cpuopcode and binary format itself is compatible |
| 11:39.28 | lcuk2 | cool |
| 11:39.42 | javispedro | the opposite is not true though |
| 11:39.51 | javispedro | the fremantle toolchain uses arm7 opcodes by default |
| 11:40.03 | RST38h | qwerty: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4912 |
| 11:40.14 | javispedro | going out a but |
| 11:40.16 | RST38h | qwerty: If you have got a moment, give 'em that code snippet |
| 11:40.18 | javispedro | * abit :P |
| 11:40.24 | lcuk2 | ahhh, so a diablo binary would run on fremantle, but wouldnt necessarily be optimally compiled |
| 11:40.31 | RST38h | 'cause right now it is developing exaclty as I predicted |
| 11:41.41 | *** join/#maemo zerojay (n=zerojay@74.198.12.5) |
| 11:41.49 | Stskeeps | wb zerojay |
| 11:42.07 | zerojay | Thanks, whomever that was. ;) |
| 11:42.13 | qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: you'll have to wait some hours (it's GTFO the computer time) and I can't remember the exact versions where the move was done. Apart from that: I'll be glad to comply |
| 11:45.38 | RST38h | qwerty: My guess is that they will not WONTFIX the bug right away :) |
| 11:46.10 | RST38h | qwerty: I will look at it myself in the meantime, although as far as hacking xterm is concerned you will be a much more capable choice |
| 11:46.40 | qwerty12_N810 | Not really... you actually know what you're doing :P |
| 11:47.01 | RST38h | Me? Know? |
| 11:47.08 | RST38h | qwerty: About that font config thing |
| 11:47.32 | RST38h | qwerty: Was that for the full font configuration or just a quick Tiny/Small/Normal/Big thing? |
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| 11:48.14 | qwerty12_N810 | it'd be for a "Tiny/Small/Normal/Big thing", it added options to the menu to do what would be done with the zoom buttons |
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| 11:48.33 | RST38h | All right, I will make a correct to the tracker |
| 11:49.57 | qwerty12_N810 | (as Benson said: it was useful when rotated (as going to the zoom buttons was a bit annoying if screen was rotated to the right) and I understand Fremantle will have rotation) |
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| 11:51.33 | Stskeeps | zerojay: mer guy who often shows up without a color :P |
| 11:51.57 | zerojay | Heh |
| 11:54.29 | RST38h | qwerty: Not in the applications |
| 11:54.42 | RST38h | qwerty: If we are lucky, at least the GTK widgets will support rotation |
| 11:55.02 | qwerty12_N810 | Ah, right |
| 11:57.46 | lcuk2 | qwerty12_N810, jeremiah both of you need another big thank you, with the knowedge you two imparted, I have now constructed a standard packaging template for liq* applications and its now hopefully nice and simple to create packages for all the apps i want :) |
| 11:58.16 | lcuk2 | (and keesj, but i havent heard him in chan recently :P0 |
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| 12:04.11 | *** part/#maemo linuxeventually1 (n=user@cpe-75-80-124-205.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 12:06.05 | zerojay | It's not hard to see that having 1000 mp3s in the default media player library wasn't in Nokia's test plans. |
| 12:06.46 | *** join/#maemo _BuBU (n=_BuBU@88.146.87-79.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 12:07.44 | javispedro | zerojay, test plans for the fremantle media player? :( |
| 12:08.16 | zerojay | No, diablo. |
| 12:08.30 | zerojay | Better not be the case for fremantle. |
| 12:08.30 | javispedro | aww, yes. |
| 12:08.49 | zerojay | Especially with 32gb internal. |
| 12:08.59 | javispedro | hope this MetaTracker thing works OK. |
| 12:09.27 | *** join/#maemo Mace_N8x0 (n=Mace_N8x@rancorous.net) |
| 12:09.54 | Mace_N8x0 | good morning |
| 12:09.59 | javispedro | morning |
| 12:10.09 | lcuk2 | \o hey macer |
| 12:10.25 | javispedro | ah, the h-a-m bug was fixed |
| 12:10.29 | Mace_N8x0 | hey... going to work on this stuff some more heh |
| 12:10.49 | Mace_N8x0 | have to make an 8G maemo partition tho |
| 12:10.51 | lcuk2 | javispedro, which one |
| 12:11.01 | javispedro | the ban on "=" depends |
| 12:11.16 | Mace_N8x0 | 2G wasnt enough and i have been so damn busy |
| 12:11.18 | lcuk2 | = is evil ho |
| 12:11.36 | Mace_N8x0 | = ? |
| 12:11.37 | lcuk2 | Mace_N8x0, it best have been, i did all my testing on stock internal |
| 12:11.39 | javispedro | works well for e.g. data packages containing strings in some binary format |
| 12:11.56 | *** join/#maemo Bleadof (i=tarmo@lumi.tango.jyu.fi) |
| 12:12.03 | lcuk2 | yeah but not so for libraries |
| 12:12.11 | Mace_N8x0 | lcuk, i was trying to build qt on it |
| 12:12.17 | Mace_N8x0 | it ran out haha |
| 12:12.19 | lcuk2 | ahhh |
| 12:12.39 | lcuk2 | i defer to stskeeps original observation - you mad fool :p |
| 12:12.41 | Mace_N8x0 | and i have to learn how to make a repo |
| 12:12.46 | Mace_N8x0 | lol |
| 12:13.03 | jeremiah | Mace_N8x0: Use reprepro |
| 12:13.07 | Mace_N8x0 | if mer could do everything maemo could.... |
| 12:13.10 | javispedro | Mace_N8x0, I used reprepro (in my first days before I learned maemo.org was trying to push everything to extras) |
| 12:13.28 | jeremiah | reprepro is the best tool for serious repos |
| 12:13.31 | Mace_N8x0 | heh.. well, i want to keep it local |
| 12:13.39 | *** join/#maemo halves (n=higor@nat/ibm.br/x-710b41fcbc1ef05a) |
| 12:13.41 | jeremiah | debpool is going to be good too, eventually |
| 12:13.55 | Mace_N8x0 | i will try them out soon |
| 12:14.01 | javispedro | i liked its "archiving old packages" ability |
| 12:14.13 | Mace_N8x0 | have to be able to make pkgs on the tablet first |
| 12:14.24 | Mace_N8x0 | build and make |
| 12:14.40 | Mace_N8x0 | all from src :) |
| 12:14.45 | Mace_N8x0 | bbl |
| 12:14.55 | jeremiah | dpkg-buildpackage is your friend |
| 12:15.14 | Mace_N8x0 | jerimah, sure if it works on the tablet |
| 12:15.31 | Mace_N8x0 | i have to first make a working dev enviroment |
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| 12:25.20 | *** join/#maemo GAN8001 (n=ryan@166.192.97.157) |
| 12:32.37 | Macer | hm |
| 12:32.45 | Macer | does cfdisk have ncurses as a dep now? |
| 12:33.08 | qwerty12_N810 | No, ncurses-base must still be installed manually |
| 12:33.53 | Macer | ok qwerty12_N810 .. thanks. just checking.. going to start teh partitioning section now |
| 12:33.59 | qwerty12_N810 | my excuses for not updating: 1) I'm lazy and 2) it's in extras-devel. Anything goes... |
| 12:34.22 | X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: Anything goes? :) |
| 12:34.24 | Macer | hah |
| 12:34.35 | Macer | it's ok. it's just 1 extra step ;) a quick one too |
| 12:34.41 | qwerty12_N810 | X-Fade: well, you know what I mean? :P |
| 12:34.49 | *** join/#maemo luck (n=luck@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:35.05 | qwerty12_N810 | Obviously, I wouldn't expect to see something running rm -rf... |
| 12:35.14 | qwerty12_N810 | / |
| 12:35.48 | Macer | qwerty12_N810: one will slip by... have to grab thsi n810 tha ti left like all the way across the house |
| 12:35.51 | Macer | damnit |
| 12:35.55 | javispedro | horrors at the idea that running that on his tablet will not only erase his tablet but also his nfs-enabled workstation |
| 12:37.09 | *** join/#maemo secureendpoints_ (n=chatzill@cpe-24-193-47-88.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 12:39.06 | Macer | javispedro: i almost did that once |
| 12:39.07 | Macer | :) |
| 12:39.24 | Macer | luckily i sneezed or something and had an epiphany |
| 12:40.22 | qwerty12_N810 | actually did that on his tablet. I have a bad habit of running "rm -rf *". When I ran it, I had no idea I was root and I was in /... |
| 12:41.18 | lcuk2 | o_O yikes |
| 12:41.24 | javispedro | reads about root_squash cause is already scared |
| 12:41.52 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
| 12:41.53 | X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: Enable interactive mode as an alias? |
| 12:42.16 | *** join/#maemo fiferboy (n=quassel@216.185.81.34) |
| 12:42.22 | javispedro | https://bugs.maemo.org/attachment.cgi?id=1307&action=view oh cool, I didn't know I wrote a h-a-m patch ;) |
| 12:42.42 | javispedro | this RTCOMM bug can cause serious confusion :D |
| 12:42.55 | qwerty12_N810 | X-Fade: A good idea, but having to answer "yes" is an annoyance to me. Would explain my laziness in using "*" instead of giving file names directly... |
| 12:43.56 | Corsac | zsh asks me if I'm sure only when I use the wildcard |
| 12:44.18 | lcuk2 | x-fade, false economy - as soon as you get used to it, and you start using rm -rf thinking you are protected... |
| 12:44.29 | lcuk2 | you reinstall a machine or go elsewhere and it wipes everything out |
| 12:44.31 | lcuk2 | much worse |
| 12:44.49 | X-Fade | Hehe, yeah true. |
| 12:45.10 | lcuk2 | just avoids the console |
| 12:45.12 | javispedro | at least on fedora they patched rm not to allow "rm -rf /" |
| 12:45.20 | RST38h | sees nothing wrong with rm -rf - less retention = less pain =) |
| 12:45.39 | RST38h | javis: And it is just one of many, MANY misfeatures of Fedora... |
| 12:46.00 | lcuk2 | javispedro, but there are circumstances where you want it |
| 12:46.05 | lcuk2 | so i hear |
| 12:46.21 | javispedro | then you have to type it in some other way |
| 12:46.24 | lcuk2 | some people in a chan were telling me i could become op if i typed that :( |
| 12:46.25 | javispedro | like rm -rf /usr/.. |
| 12:46.30 | lcuk2 | how will i become op |
| 12:47.39 | RST38h | lcuk2: are you ready for some hard work? |
| 12:47.52 | *** join/#maemo guysoft42 (n=guysoft@93-173-152-74.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 12:49.04 | lcuk2 | im doin some, ive just got a brainf*ck here cos of legacy vb code |
| 12:49.24 | RST38h | lcuk: Ok, get a lipstick and a map of Sweden |
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| 12:49.52 | *** join/#maemo renato (n=renato@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:49.54 | RST38h | lcuk: Using lipstick, copy the map to your display surface |
| 12:50.18 | RST38h | lcuk: Once you do that, you should instantly become op! |
| 12:50.30 | lcuk2 | o rly? |
| 12:50.45 | *** join/#maemo setanta (n=setanta@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:50.52 | lcuk2 | on that matter, i have been doing tracings recently lol |
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| 12:51.52 | glass | lcuk2: hehe |
| 12:52.22 | glass | hey anyone want to collaborate on a chess game? |
| 12:52.33 | Macer | screw this. i am too tired to type this out |
| 12:52.36 | Macer | although i have most of it done |
| 12:52.46 | Macer | but i have to make screen shots from the n810 and move them over and blahblahblha |
| 12:52.54 | Macer | i'm going to take a nap. nite |
| 12:54.17 | *** join/#maemo zerojay (n=zerojay@74.198.12.5) |
| 12:54.55 | lcuk2 | glass a real one, or writing a maemo chess game |
| 12:55.07 | zerojay | I've somehow broke media player completely. |
| 12:56.28 | glass | lcuk2: maemo or other, preferably multiplat |
| 12:56.33 | glass | lcuk2: maybe just web |
| 12:56.58 | glass | lcuk2: i got my chess piece set ready, you see :D http://jussin.net/~glass/chs/pieces.png |
| 12:57.35 | glass | lcuk: chess pieces make for a good modelling practice |
| 12:59.41 | glass | lcuk: actually i'm pretty sure there would be free chess engines to rip off |
| 12:59.56 | RST38h | glass: Just port gnu chess |
| 13:00.11 | RST38h | glass: no need to rip off, port it |
| 13:00.22 | RST38h | Unless you are satisfied with the gnu chess port from osso-games |
| 13:00.28 | glass | RST38h: chess is boring against cpu.. |
| 13:00.49 | RST38h | glass: Gnu Chess has multiplayer features |
| 13:00.52 | glass | so in my 'idea' it would have a server that had game states, and supereasy to start a new game |
| 13:00.59 | RST38h | Done already |
| 13:01.07 | RST38h | Waitamoment, will locate info |
| 13:01.38 | glass | RST38h: i'm busy doing more worthwhile stuff, thus was looking for someone to collaborate with |
| 13:01.39 | RST38h | glass: http://www.gnu.org/software/chess/chess_faq.html |
| 13:02.57 | lcuk2 | glass, the chess implementation on maemo is actually quite a challenge according to most folks (myself included) |
| 13:03.24 | lcuk2 | we should really use gps for chess |
| 13:03.38 | lcuk2 | and have players running around real city blocks |
| 13:03.41 | Stskeeps | pacman in the streets of london |
| 13:03.48 | glass | lcuk2: i'm pretty sure i could find chess programs that would challange me :).. wouldn't make it much more intresting |
| 13:03.50 | lcuk2 | obviously, it would need a trip to a grid oriented city |
| 13:04.33 | glass | Stskeeps: pill eating and club hopping? isn't that the norm in uk? |
| 13:04.46 | lcuk2 | agreed, heh, with the n900 (assumed cos of your 3d render) you could use the acceleromater to adjust your view |
| 13:04.49 | lcuk2 | to look around the board |
| 13:05.04 | glass | yeah |
| 13:05.05 | lcuk2 | bbiab |
| 13:05.56 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 13:06.41 | roope | Yes, the Maemo Chess is quite tricky. I even filed a bug against it back in the days. :) I tried to make it easier. |
| 13:06.44 | Andy80 | is Maemo.org down for you? |
| 13:06.52 | Stskeeps | maemo chess beats me constantly :/ |
| 13:06.58 | roope | Or then alternatively I suggested to name the difficulty levels to "Medium", "Hard", "Very Hard". |
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| 13:16.25 | *** join/#maemo Wooly (n=Wooly@stapler.eee.strath.ac.uk) |
| 13:17.09 | Wooly | hey guys, I downloaded and installed sdlquake, but it segfaults when I try to run it. It gives a FindFile: can't find gfx/pop.lmp error. Any ideas? |
| 13:19.50 | zerojay | Got the original game files installed? |
| 13:21.19 | *** join/#maemo mardi__ (n=mardi_@nat/ibm/x-ldjbqgbtckhxfkzc) |
| 13:21.21 | Wooly | zerojay: I'm not sure, I downloaded a zip called quakesw... and extracted that into /usr/lib/sdlquake/id1 |
| 13:22.05 | Wooly | do I also need a copy of the sdlquake-files.zip extracted there too? |
| 13:22.17 | RST38h | glass: Generally, GNU Chess made most chess programs obsolete, so I would strongly suggest a close look at it first, before trying to do something on your own |
| 13:23.44 | RST38h | glass: If you have an itch for writing a game, I would suggest a clone of Eggerland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggerland_%28series%29) preferably in 3D :) |
| 13:24.10 | glass | RST38h: i got some original ideas too :p |
| 13:24.47 | lcuk2 | make notes |
| 13:24.59 | lcuk2 | flesh them out keep your ideas together |
| 13:25.01 | X-Fade | Interesting to see how oFono is being tested. Using a usb cable connected to a nokia phone. |
| 13:25.10 | X-Fade | So your N810 could do that too :) |
| 13:25.26 | Wooly | zerojay: Is that what you mean? |
| 13:25.36 | javispedro | still not a single screenshot of the call placing gui? :) |
| 13:25.56 | zerojay | I've never used it, so... Just was a suggestion. |
| 13:26.00 | X-Fade | javispedro: ofono is only the framework. So only cli logs ;) |
| 13:26.20 | Wooly | zerojay: ahh okay, thanks anyway :) |
| 13:29.20 | *** join/#maemo divide_by_zero (n=nwerneck@189.78.125.50) |
| 13:29.23 | RST38h | glass: Lately, every "original" idea I get, I find it already implemented by some Linux guy :) |
| 13:29.45 | *** join/#maemo dieb_ (n=dieb@189.71.121.80) |
| 13:30.07 | lbt | shoulders of giants RST38h |
| 13:30.20 | lbt | (or lots of midgets anyhow) |
| 13:30.35 | lcuk2 | originality isnt important - look at the ipod, there were 100s of mp3 players |
| 13:30.45 | lbt | heh.... "Linux... stand on the shoulders of midgets... lots of them" |
| 13:31.46 | RST38h | lbt: while trying to keep them pacified |
| 13:32.04 | divide_by_zero | it's a distributed thing, the power to raise linux come from lots of small ants! |
| 13:32.13 | divide_by_zero | emergence |
| 13:32.20 | RST38h | Oh cool there is a screenshot-rich Eggerland site: http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/eggerland/eggerland2.htm |
| 13:32.32 | RST38h | And just one guy cloning it (last version released in 2005) |
| 13:32.51 | javispedro | that is a chess game? |
| 13:32.53 | lbt | goes to hack fakeroot and ld-linux..... what could possibly go wrong |
| 13:33.33 | RST38h | javis: no, just a decent puzzle game |
| 13:33.52 | RST38h | javis: Chess is too easy nowadays (1. Port GNU Chess 2. Done) |
| 13:35.44 | divide_by_zero | Eggerland is completely awesome!!!!!!!!! but I am used to the MSX version, the graphics look different |
| 13:36.03 | fiferboy_ | lbt: Have you tried the finger scrolling changes? |
| 13:36.09 | RST38h | played them all, MSX and NES |
| 13:36.18 | glass | RST38h: my original ideas are not so much as original as rehashes of old stuff as more playable |
| 13:36.36 | glass | RST38h: coin-op emulators are a very good source for inspiration |
| 13:36.43 | lbt | fiferboy: I am building it at the moment... it failed in dh_install :( |
| 13:36.49 | RST38h | glass: heh, same here :) |
| 13:37.03 | RST38h | glass: But most dynamic games won't run very well on tablets |
| 13:37.17 | fiferboy | lbt: You went for the packages |
| 13:37.18 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
| 13:37.28 | fiferboy | I usually call it quits when the library is created :) |
| 13:37.31 | glass | RST38h: i coded dynamic games as a kid for dos for 386.. |
| 13:37.38 | lbt | fiferboy: Mer build |
| 13:37.43 | RST38h | glass: And for RPGs, I can't think of anything more fruitful than a decent nethack/Angband port with axonometric UI |
| 13:37.45 | lbt | You should see scrolling on the Q7 |
| 13:37.52 | glass | RST38h: plenty of power nowadays on almost every plat if one sticks to basics or trickery |
| 13:37.53 | lbt | 667 Mhz CPU :) |
| 13:38.00 | fiferboy | lbt: That would be nice! |
| 13:38.00 | RST38h | glass: those PCs had arrow buttons :) |
| 13:38.04 | glass | RST38h: yeah nethack ui would be sweet |
| 13:38.14 | glass | RST38h: i've played a lot of it |
| 13:38.17 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
| 13:38.24 | RST38h | prefers Angband/Zangband |
| 13:38.44 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
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| 13:39.37 | divide_by_zero | see you |
| 13:40.05 | X-Fade | javispedro: There? |
| 13:40.11 | javispedro | yep |
| 13:40.23 | *** join/#maemo veiz (n=veiz@222.209.179.146) |
| 13:40.33 | X-Fade | javispedro: Ok, rejection was based on confusion ;) |
| 13:41.00 | X-Fade | javispedro: I'm going to try to revert the reject and accept. Let's see if that doesn't break anything ;) |
| 13:41.15 | javispedro | hope so :) Thanks! |
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| 13:46.17 | RST38h | X-Fade: "Yes is no and no is yes. Format drive C? [Yes/No]" |
| 13:46.57 | javispedro | that's a BOFH ripoff ;) |
| 13:47.05 | javispedro | i'm sure the original was unixy |
| 13:47.10 | X-Fade | RST38h: Does recursion come in to play there? |
| 13:48.57 | Wooly | anyone got sdlquake working on their N810 while booting from MMC? |
| 13:49.19 | lcuk2 | lbt, vid! |
| 13:49.45 | lbt | lcuk2: OK, when the latest Qt builds... |
| 13:49.49 | lbt | remind me |
| 13:50.06 | lcuk2 | lbt, upload a vid |
| 13:50.32 | lbt | hears a buzzing sound |
| 13:52.12 | RST38h | X-Fade: Who knows... |
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| 14:05.52 | lopz | hola |
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| 14:09.24 | X-Fade | javispedro: Looks like it worked. Don't know if you got a mail, but everything should be setup. |
| 14:09.39 | *** part/#maemo danielwilms (n=dwilms@dasasob.nokia.com) |
| 14:10.02 | javispedro | nope, no email. |
| 14:10.48 | javispedro | I see the repo is up, I'll try to start using it as soon as I sort this caos a bit |
| 14:11.06 | javispedro | thanks again :) |
| 14:13.55 | lardman | hmm, not liking the look of flights from Berlin to Amsterdam |
| 14:14.49 | Mek | train from berlin to amsterdam is perhaps better? |
| 14:14.51 | Mek | direct train... |
| 14:16.15 | lardman | yeah, will have to look at that |
| 14:16.34 | lardman | any thought on which website to try? |
| 14:16.44 | Mek | bahn.de? |
| 14:16.56 | X-Fade | lardman: transavia.com 30 euro for the 08:45 on thursday. |
| 14:17.09 | *** join/#maemo promulo (n=romulo@150.165.63.86) |
| 14:17.11 | lardman | yeah can't do Thursday have a meeting 'till 4pm |
| 14:17.25 | RST38h | moo lardman |
| 14:17.27 | X-Fade | Yeah, friday is at 15:50 |
| 14:17.43 | lardman | unfortuntely Thursday is in the morning |
| 14:17.47 | lardman | hi RST38h |
| 14:18.47 | X-Fade | lardman: http://www.edreams.com/flights/berlin-amsterdam/ |
| 14:19.10 | lardman | thanks, will have a look |
| 14:20.23 | lardman | ouch, getting expensive there |
| 14:20.31 | lardman | ~210euros |
| 14:20.33 | X-Fade | Doesn't look ok. |
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| 14:23.34 | lardman | hmm train is 6h and arrives pretty late |
| 14:23.36 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=rsalveti@200.184.118.130) |
| 14:23.42 | lardman | ~80 euros though |
| 14:24.37 | qwerty12_N810 | Perhaps you could find some renting a Segway? |
| 14:24.47 | lardman | good call :) |
| 14:24.51 | qwerty12_N810 | *someone |
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| 14:26.43 | lcuk2 | lardman, ride across europe on a wild boar |
| 14:27.16 | lardman | am just looking for where to fly to in the middle, then onto Amsterdam |
| 14:27.22 | lardman | perhaps a quick stopover in Ibiza |
| 14:28.36 | lardman | right, Berlin -> Luton -> Amsterdam ~£50 |
| 14:30.06 | lardman | what are the thoughts on accommodation atm? |
| 14:30.22 | Mek | find a nice bridge to sleep under? |
| 14:30.28 | lcuk2 | sleep where you fall |
| 14:30.34 | javispedro | use that Segway to cover yourself? |
| 14:30.46 | lcuk2 | or you can pay for a special hotel. for some reason they charge by the half hour though |
| 14:30.54 | lardman | ah |
| 14:31.00 | lardman | free drugs I assume |
| 14:31.08 | Mek | and you even have to share the room with someone? |
| 14:31.18 | lcuk2 | thats extra |
| 14:31.26 | qwerty12_N810 | I hear there's handcuffs involved |
| 14:32.08 | lardman | I've got my wife with me |
| 14:32.11 | lardman | so ideal |
| 14:32.42 | lardman | chokes at the cost of the hotel in Berlin |
| 14:32.55 | lardman | 317e is the cheapest rate |
| 14:33.07 | lardman | ah, silly me, that's for a few days |
| 14:33.10 | lardman | thank God |
| 14:35.05 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.130) |
| 14:36.41 | andre__ | oh nokia, hildon-libs, hildon-widgets, libhildon, .... we should have a proposal contest at the summit to come up with even more names |
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| 14:37.25 | qwerty12_N810 | hildon-tablet-launch-countdown |
| 14:37.51 | _berto_ | andre__: i don't even know which name to use most of the times :-D |
| 14:37.53 | Stskeeps | we should rename Mer to Freemantle. |
| 14:37.54 | Stskeeps | ;P |
| 14:38.16 | andre__ | :-D |
| 14:38.39 | andre__ | "hildon-stuff"? |
| 14:38.50 | _berto_ | hildon is always hildon -> http://www.winecellarsales.co.uk/acatalog/hildon.jpg |
| 14:39.00 | timeless_mbp | heh |
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| 14:39.25 | _berto_ | we should have ordered a few bottles for GCDS |
| 14:39.31 | timeless_mbp | andre__: i hope you don't seriously expect me to be able to find the right component in our bugzilla :) |
| 14:39.42 | andre__ | timeless_mbp, found it already |
| 14:39.48 | timeless_mbp | our = public |
| 14:39.50 | timeless_mbp | the internal one is easier |
| 14:40.02 | timeless_mbp | actually no |
| 14:40.03 | andre__ | public is easy too :) |
| 14:40.04 | timeless_mbp | not for this bug |
| 14:40.10 | andre__ | hildon-widgets. that's all. |
| 14:40.23 | _berto_ | file a bug against the organization of bugzilla |
| 14:40.33 | timeless_mbp | i already reorganized it once |
| 14:41.09 | andre__ | maemo.org bugzilla is okay. :-P |
| 14:41.18 | *** join/#maemo jrocha (n=JRocha@40.86.117.91.dynamic.mundo-r.com) |
| 14:41.29 | andre__ | it's the tradeoff between "developers' organization" and "users need normal package names to file bugs" |
| 14:41.53 | timeless_mbp | a table would help |
| 14:42.07 | timeless_mbp | normally for localization bugs and spec bugs, the internal one is ok |
| 14:42.14 | timeless_mbp | for anything else, the internal one is a disaster |
| 14:42.23 | timeless_mbp | sadly this isn't really a localization/spec bug |
| 14:42.26 | timeless_mbp | well, it is |
| 14:42.27 | timeless_mbp | but... |
| 14:43.03 | timeless_mbp | goes to see where andre__ put the bug |
| 14:43.07 | andre__ | internal is quite... complicated. |
| 14:43.08 | _berto_ | you're talking about #4917 ? |
| 14:43.10 | andre__ | yours? |
| 14:43.16 | andre__ | to hildon-widgets of course. that's where it belongs. |
| 14:43.31 | andre__ | _berto_, yes |
| 14:43.41 | timeless_mbp | andre__: thanks, you made the bug much more readable |
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| 14:44.00 | andre__ | heh. welcome |
| 14:44.06 | _berto_ | just saw it |
| 14:44.38 | timeless_mbp | _berto_: does the bug actually interest you? |
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| 14:45.23 | thux | they say (joey hess) that palm pre spy phone owner, wonder what info, if any these tablets send to nokia? |
| 14:46.05 | _berto_ | if I understand correctly, we would need those logical strings first, right? |
| 14:46.15 | aquatix | only selected webcam images and videos based on sound recognition |
| 14:46.39 | _berto_ | and then we would update hildon-widgets to use the new ones |
| 14:47.01 | timeless_mbp | _berto_: technically yes, but in practice you can immediately create them |
| 14:47.11 | timeless_mbp | by just copying the original string to the pair _am / _pm |
| 14:47.47 | _berto_ | yes, but I mean, you're proposing the creation of two strings that don't exist yet? |
| 14:48.14 | zerojay | Hmm |
| 14:48.25 | *** join/#maemo veiz (n=veiz@222.209.179.146) |
| 14:49.32 | Wooly | has anyone tried the VGBA emulator? |
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| 14:55.11 | javispedro | Wooly, yes |
| 14:55.34 | Wooly | I was thinking of pairing it with a wii remote and the wii remote package, have you tried that also? |
| 14:55.45 | javispedro | nope |
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| 14:56.18 | javispedro | depending on how the wii remote package works (the emu is closed source) it may or may not work |
| 14:57.11 | Wooly | it maps input from the wii remote to x events |
| 14:57.16 | Wooly | simulating keypressed etc |
| 14:57.23 | Wooly | keypresses* |
| 14:58.29 | javispedro | I suppose it'll work then :P |
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| 14:59.29 | Wooly | now it's just a case of actually getting all my GBA games into the emulator, which I guess cant be talked about here? |
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| 15:09.24 | divide_by_zero | great, just found out my firewall blocks port 6667 but doesn't 8001!... |
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| 15:35.53 | lbt | lcuk2: how easy is taking a piccy using the camera? I don't suppose : cp /sys/camera/photo /file.jpg works |
| 15:37.10 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
| 15:38.04 | lcuk2 | lbt, no liqbase uses a simplified gstreamer stack/thingy |
| 15:38.14 | lbt | ok, nm then |
| 15:38.40 | lcuk2 | there is meant to be a gstreamer command line interface that you could use |
| 15:38.43 | lbt | stupid driver should be exposed via /sys/ |
| 15:38.44 | lcuk2 | i think there is a photosink |
| 15:39.21 | lcuk2 | however for a one shot deal, camera would take >10seconds to warm up |
| 15:39.27 | lcuk2 | whichever way you do it |
| 15:39.33 | lbt | still, I guess jpg libs in the kernel may not be so hot ;) |
| 15:39.42 | lcuk2 | heh |
| 15:40.11 | lcuk2 | dont see why not tho, use it to compress all that meaningless driver code |
| 15:40.24 | lcuk2 | it should still look kinda right when you get it back ;) |
| 15:41.17 | *** part/#maemo uzzed (n=alexandr@189.115.87.98) |
| 15:41.43 | *** join/#maemo LinuxCode (n=LinuxCod@fedora/LinuxCode) |
| 15:43.44 | mgedmin | doesn't the camera use v4l? |
| 15:44.54 | lcuk2 | yes "v4l2src" |
| 15:45.16 | lcuk2 | on n810, dunno if its the same on new device |
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| 16:03.56 | lardman | Right, all booked |
| 16:03.57 | lardman | :) |
| 16:04.14 | keesj | is still alive |
| 16:04.42 | *** join/#maemo Vulcanis (n=CBabbage@ool-43566062.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 16:06.16 | lardman | cu all later |
| 16:06.27 | *** join/#maemo konttori__ (n=konttori@a88-113-140-230.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:08.20 | *** join/#maemo konttori__ (n=konttori@a88-113-140-230.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:09.35 | *** join/#maemo torkiano (n=torkiano@118.154.60.213.dynamic.mundo-r.com) |
| 16:14.27 | lcuk2 | keesj, good to hear it \o |
| 16:15.55 | lcuk2 | keesj, what was the name of that camera eye software you had in copenhagen |
| 16:16.04 | lcuk2 | lardman was talking about wanting to look into it |
| 16:19.13 | *** part/#maemo ziyourenxiang (n=ziyouren@unaffiliated/ziyourenxiang) |
| 16:20.24 | keesj | lasertraq |
| 16:21.02 | keesj | and motion for the still motion movie I created |
| 16:22.47 | lcuk2 | excellent, cool thx |
| 16:22.57 | *** join/#maemo Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun) |
| 16:22.58 | lcuk2 | the motion one is especially interesting :) |
| 16:26.57 | keesj | here is the movie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Pf9FFojvjE |
| 16:28.55 | keesj | I think the problem with motion was that is doesn't use gstreamer but the v4lv1 api |
| 16:30.04 | ShadowJK | hm? |
| 16:30.22 | ShadowJK | iirc asking for yuv from v4l1 leads to kernel crapping out |
| 16:30.48 | keesj | the cam is v4l2 AFAICR |
| 16:31.49 | ShadowJK | or v4l2.. |
| 16:32.29 | ShadowJK | I don't think either will give out yuv without kernel going bananas, despite driver claiming it can give out yuv :) |
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| 16:45.45 | keesj | how's lcuk2 doing? |
| 16:46.38 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@89.129.154.148) |
| 16:51.58 | lcuk2 | keesj, im quite good actually |
| 16:52.28 | lcuk2 | ive finally stopped pulling my hair out |
| 16:54.15 | keesj | happy with the Google SoC stuff? |
| 16:55.35 | keesj | anyway good new I guess |
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| 17:02.53 | lcuk2 | keesj, yeah, z4chh has been doing well and things are looking and feeling a lot better |
| 17:03.31 | lcuk2 | apologies for lag, im makin t |
| 17:04.02 | z4chh | o.o |
| 17:04.36 | lcuk2 | z4chh, oh you do come in this chan |
| 17:04.46 | z4chh | lol im always idle here |
| 17:04.52 | lcuk2 | idle is the word :P |
| 17:05.05 | z4chh | yar |
| 17:05.07 | lcuk2 | in all chans |
| 17:06.49 | lcuk2 | z4chh are you goin to any of the us gsoc events |
| 17:06.53 | lcuk2 | (are there any happening?) |
| 17:06.56 | keesj | I am not dead I am idle :p |
| 17:08.31 | lcuk2 | :D irc ran out of ink |
| 17:08.43 | lcuk2 | are you comin to the summit kees? |
| 17:09.53 | keesj | of course |
| 17:09.54 | *** join/#maemo Wooly (n=Wooly@stapler.eee.strath.ac.uk) |
| 17:10.14 | lcuk2 | excellent, are you presenting anything |
| 17:10.16 | Wooly | I've just downloaded VGBA, but dont have any games for it yet; is there anywhere I can get them from? |
| 17:10.19 | keesj | I also need to help find hotels and such near the location (not that easy) |
| 17:10.43 | lcuk2 | yeah you do |
| 17:10.53 | keesj | no , I didn't plan on doing that |
| 17:10.55 | lcuk2 | most hotels nearby charge rooms at half hourly rates |
| 17:11.11 | aol | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:11.23 | lcuk2 | Wooly, gameboy roms are something you would have to find on your own - they are afterall copyrighted |
| 17:12.04 | zerojay | You can dump them yourself too. |
| 17:12.25 | lcuk2 | do you need extra hardware? |
| 17:12.33 | zerojay | Yep |
| 17:12.49 | lcuk2 | ahhh i thought the new style card readers mightv included cb cart slots lol |
| 17:13.02 | Wooly | unfortunately, I dont have the GBA card reader unfortunately :( |
| 17:13.34 | Luke-Jr | Wooly: it's not too hard to find GB ROMs online |
| 17:13.38 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (n=lizardo@189.2.128.130) |
| 17:13.46 | Luke-Jr | as long as you're only downloading, there's no risk to you |
| 17:14.06 | zerojay | It's still illegal. |
| 17:14.12 | Luke-Jr | not the downloading |
| 17:14.19 | lcuk2 | yes, it is. |
| 17:14.21 | Wooly | I'll take a look when I get home :) |
| 17:14.22 | Luke-Jr | no |
| 17:14.22 | zerojay | Yes, the downloading |
| 17:14.37 | Luke-Jr | in most countries, the illegality is on the uploader |
| 17:14.52 | zerojay | That's not the case. |
| 17:15.14 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: then downloading nVidia's blob drivers for Linux is illegal. enjoy your conclusion. |
| 17:15.15 | lcuk2 | no, they go after the uploader to stop at source, but downloading copyrighted material is illegal |
| 17:15.25 | lcuk2 | its like drug users and drug dealers |
| 17:15.27 | *** join/#maemo brankinhu (n=quassel@201.56.102.13) |
| 17:15.29 | Luke-Jr | it's not. |
| 17:15.33 | zerojay | Possession of rom images are also illegal. |
| 17:15.36 | Luke-Jr | possession of drugs is actually illegal |
| 17:15.40 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: no |
| 17:15.44 | zerojay | Yes |
| 17:15.57 | Luke-Jr | possession of ROM images is a right guaranteed by copyright law |
| 17:16.09 | GAN800 | Legal Advice by Luke-Jr |
| 17:16.10 | lcuk2 | if you own the rom |
| 17:16.14 | zerojay | I'm writing this from my desk in the ubisoft building. |
| 17:16.17 | GAN800 | Do you have commercials? |
| 17:16.21 | Luke-Jr | lcuk2: if you bought the game at all, even if on a cartridge |
| 17:16.30 | *** join/#maemo vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 17:16.34 | *** join/#maemo frenky (n=frenky@dslb-088-066-228-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
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| 17:16.38 | zerojay | It's illegal, if you have a legal copy of the game or not. |
| 17:16.40 | frenky | hi |
| 17:16.52 | Wooly | but Luke-Jr do you ever actually own the ROM? |
| 17:16.55 | lcuk2 | frenky, you best get a helmet and flak jacket |
| 17:16.59 | Wooly | Luke-Jr: or do you just own the right to play it? |
| 17:17.12 | *** part/#maemo frenky (n=frenky@dslb-088-066-228-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:17.19 | Luke-Jr | Wooly: generally, you license use of it |
| 17:17.22 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (n=javier@69.Red-80-32-146.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 17:17.24 | zerojay | You only buy a license. |
| 17:17.30 | Luke-Jr | which under copyright law entitles you to a backup |
| 17:17.35 | zerojay | Buzzzz |
| 17:17.43 | zerojay | Not for console games. |
| 17:17.53 | zerojay | There's an exception made. |
| 17:18.02 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: where in copyright law is there an exception for "console games"? |
| 17:18.08 | Luke-Jr | furthermore, where is "console games" defined in law? |
| 17:18.23 | Luke-Jr | there is no difference between "console games" and "non-console games" |
| 17:18.44 | Luke-Jr | they're both mere data |
| 17:18.47 | zerojay | I've got work to do. The rom images are illegal, plain and simple. |
| 17:18.53 | Luke-Jr | nonsense, zerojay |
| 17:18.57 | Luke-Jr | it's just FUD |
| 17:19.00 | zerojay | It's not. |
| 17:19.01 | lcuk2 | most roms come with copyright protection circuits/software encryption - the DMCA makesz it explicitely forbidden to break these i believe |
| 17:19.10 | zerojay | Bingo. |
| 17:19.12 | Luke-Jr | lcuk2: that's another matter |
| 17:19.22 | lcuk2 | thats the law |
| 17:19.23 | ShadowJK | I thought dmca only bans "effective" protections :-) |
| 17:19.26 | lcuk2 | don't copy that floppy |
| 17:19.30 | ShadowJK | only bans breaking of... |
| 17:19.32 | Luke-Jr | if someone else breaks it, though, it doesn't affect your right to have a backup copy |
| 17:19.53 | Wooly | handbags at dawn |
| 17:19.53 | Luke-Jr | also |
| 17:19.54 | javispedro | at, the eternal debate. |
| 17:20.04 | Luke-Jr | GB games mostly don't have any kind of protection |
| 17:20.09 | woglinde | hi javis |
| 17:20.12 | zerojay | Backup does not apply and all eulas for games that you agree to for games make you give up that right anyways. |
| 17:20.18 | javispedro | hi all |
| 17:20.25 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: when I buy a game, I never agree to an EULA |
| 17:20.30 | zerojay | Being on the cart counts as protection. |
| 17:20.35 | Wooly | i didn't think the EULA was enforceable by law? |
| 17:20.36 | zerojay | Yes, you do. |
| 17:20.54 | Luke-Jr | EULAs have no legal force in most cases |
| 17:21.03 | Luke-Jr | because you never agree to them |
| 17:21.31 | Luke-Jr | if I pay $100 for a license, and it is accepted, and I have not had to agree to any contract, that's the end of it |
| 17:21.42 | zerojay | You agree to them when you remove the shrink wrap. |
| 17:21.48 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: nope |
| 17:21.54 | aol | which country's law are you talking about |
| 17:21.55 | zerojay | Lol |
| 17:22.00 | Luke-Jr | nobody sees the EULA before you remove the shrink wrap |
| 17:22.02 | aol | or are you assuming every country has same laws |
| 17:22.19 | zerojay | I'm sitting here with a lawyer laughing at this. |
| 17:22.25 | zerojay | Have fun, lol |
| 17:22.29 | Wooly | http://www.sealandgov.org/ |
| 17:23.11 | aol | I'm sitting here with queen of England |
| 17:23.11 | Wooly | well ladies, I'd love to stay and chat, but I feel if I dont get out of work soon, I might kill a kitten |
| 17:23.14 | aol | she's not amused |
| 17:23.15 | *** join/#maemo amit_dusual (n=amit@59.178.133.41) |
| 17:23.18 | Luke-Jr | "The enforceability of an EULA depends on several factors, one of them being the court in which the case is heard. Some courts that have addressed the validity of the shrinkwrap license agreements have found some EULAs to be invalid, characterizing them as contracts of adhesion, unconscionable, and/or unacceptable pursuant to the U.C.C." |
| 17:23.29 | divide_by_zero | What if you have a computer virus that goes on accepting all eulas without you ever reading them? |
| 17:23.45 | zerojay | Regardless of eula, it's illegal, case closed. |
| 17:23.56 | Wooly | tattie bye folks |
| 17:24.13 | Luke-Jr | ROMs are a guaranteed right in copyright law. Breaking copy protection is illegal, but does not repeal that right AFAIK |
| 17:24.29 | zerojay | It's not guaranteed. |
| 17:24.31 | Luke-Jr | and cartridges are a medium of data storage, not copy protection |
| 17:24.40 | javispedro | it's definitely illegal, but what isn't? |
| 17:25.27 | GAN800 | Public beatings of javispedro. :P |
| 17:25.27 | divide_by_zero | i've heard in some places even suicide is illegal! |
| 17:25.36 | zerojay | In the us, it's illegal since 83 to make backups of game roms. |
| 17:25.37 | lcuk2 | common sense says: someone spent time and money to create that rom and its not your place to second guess their licensing choices |
| 17:26.01 | lcuk2 | so unless it says "you can copy this game/rom/program. dont do it |
| 17:26.02 | RST38h | What ROMs? |
| 17:26.16 | zerojay | The law allowingbackups was made for magnetic media which fails fast. |
| 17:26.19 | GAN800 | Common sense says copyright should be for a reasonable term. |
| 17:26.21 | javispedro | i don't know, have you been discussing this since I departed? |
| 17:26.30 | RST38h | Gentlemen, first of all if you dump an unencrypted ROM, you are not breaking copyright protection |
| 17:26.37 | zerojay | Carts do not fall into that. |
| 17:26.42 | lcuk2 | GAN800, all software created before 1908 is in the public domain |
| 17:26.49 | RST38h | zerojay: Encrypted cards like NDS do not |
| 17:26.59 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: the law specifically says "magnetic media"? |
| 17:27.02 | javispedro | checks the logs |
| 17:27.08 | javispedro | ah, some guy asked for gba roms here. |
| 17:27.32 | RST38h | Secondly, if you own the actual ROM, the only thing that prevents from using it out of the cartridge form is the EULA |
| 17:27.41 | zerojay | Atari vs Js&A - look it up. |
| 17:27.56 | zerojay | Wrong, rst. |
| 17:27.57 | RST38h | Atari actually took some effort to protect their ROMs |
| 17:28.22 | lcuk2 | yeah, they set up missile defenses near athe major cities! |
| 17:28.35 | lcuk2 | loves that game |
| 17:28.41 | zerojay | Illegal, protection or not. |
| 17:29.02 | javispedro | zerojay, I'm not sure about that last affirmation. |
| 17:29.09 | zerojay | At least in nthe us. |
| 17:29.16 | javispedro | afaik there are dead-simple copy protection schemes |
| 17:29.16 | RST38h | zerojay: That is one court case based on the false assumption by the court. Should I quote? |
| 17:29.23 | javispedro | just designed so that you can say "yes, I put it one! see!!" |
| 17:29.47 | zerojay | Please do. |
| 17:29.59 | RST38h | "The court found that a computer program embedded within a piece of hardware, such as the ROMs used within a typical videogame cartridge, cannot be reprogrammed or erased." |
| 17:30.00 | Luke-Jr | Atari vs JS&A looks utterly retarded |
| 17:30.09 | Luke-Jr | it had nothing to do with breaking copy protection or such |
| 17:30.25 | RST38h | zerojay: The problem here is that ROMs *can* be erased, even if they are mask ROMs |
| 17:30.34 | zerojay | Regardless, it set up the way things are. |
| 17:30.38 | RST38h | zerojay: And you do not even need to physically destroy the chip |
| 17:30.38 | Luke-Jr | JS&A needs to get better witnesses |
| 17:31.21 | zerojay | Roms are far less volitile than magnetic media. |
| 17:31.36 | ShadowJK | roms are hardwired... |
| 17:31.46 | RST38h | Shadow: What kind of ROMs? |
| 17:31.52 | RST38h | Shadow: I know of at least 3 |
| 17:32.02 | RST38h | Shadow: One is electrically erasable |
| 17:32.12 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: not true |
| 17:32.15 | RST38h | Shadow: One can be erased by UV radiation |
| 17:32.25 | zerojay | Haha |
| 17:32.33 | ShadowJK | EEPROM and EPROM? :-) |
| 17:32.37 | zerojay | I guess the sky is red in your world. |
| 17:32.38 | Luke-Jr | ROMs can easily break by power surge or such |
| 17:32.42 | RST38h | Shadow: And the last one is mask ROMs which are supposed to be unerasable but can be fucked up all the same |
| 17:32.52 | zerojay | That's far more rare. |
| 17:32.56 | Luke-Jr | Optical media, like CDs, have a better argument than ROMs |
| 17:33.03 | RST38h | zerojay: Mask ROMs? Everywhere in game carts. |
| 17:33.05 | ShadowJK | mask ROMs are like any other circuitry... breaks the same way |
| 17:33.05 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: more rare than a super-strong magnet? |
| 17:33.15 | RST38h | ShadowJK: Almost... |
| 17:33.19 | zerojay | Yes. |
| 17:33.19 | Luke-Jr | power surges are more common than super-strong magnets |
| 17:33.41 | zerojay | Everytime magnetic media is read, it's slightly corrupted. |
| 17:33.44 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: Atari vs JS&A was effectively overturned by Vault vs Quaid |
| 17:33.44 | RST38h | ShadowJK: Except that correctly applied high (+24V or so) voltage is known to make...mm..."modifications" to them |
| 17:34.00 | zerojay | Therefore why you have the right to backups. |
| 17:34.10 | ShadowJK | They're far more likely to break when the user has his machine full of grit, shit and dust, and then rubs the cart against his wool sweatshirt to "clean" it.. |
| 17:34.18 | RST38h | Also, the case is based on the idea that the user backs up the ROM |
| 17:34.35 | RST38h | The user may also choose to USE the ROM in a system different from the one it was designed for |
| 17:34.49 | Luke-Jr | that's also legal |
| 17:34.50 | RST38h | In this case, the only thing stopping him is the EULA |
| 17:34.56 | zerojay | Lol |
| 17:35.01 | Luke-Jr | EULAs have no legal force here |
| 17:35.09 | RST38h | Well, this depends on the country |
| 17:35.19 | RST38h | And the way these EULAs are presented to the user |
| 17:35.34 | RST38h | Nintendo used to have them tucked away in the game booklets |
| 17:36.11 | zerojay | It's hilarious that i'm here with an expert on this law and you guys are saying he's wrong, hahaha |
| 17:36.29 | *** join/#maemo fiferboy (n=quassel@216.185.81.34) |
| 17:36.34 | aol | EULAs dont mean shit over here |
| 17:36.39 | zerojay | Anyways, back to submission testing... Fun fun. |
| 17:36.40 | Luke-Jr | zerojay: a biased "expert" I bet |
| 17:36.40 | Stskeeps | zerojay: ah, you're at work :) |
| 17:36.44 | aol | (Finland) |
| 17:36.52 | zerojay | Indeed, i am at work. |
| 17:37.07 | *** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=rsalveti@200.184.118.130) |
| 17:37.37 | zerojay | One of the best jobs in the world even on bad days. |
| 17:37.37 | *** join/#maemo linuxeventually (n=user@cpe-75-80-124-205.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 17:38.14 | Luke-Jr | sure you want a company lawyer to know you're slacking off on IRC on company time? ;) |
| 17:38.20 | zerojay | Did you know the world click is banned from all games for nintendo platforms? |
| 17:39.01 | zerojay | I work in a game studio. It's not nose to the grindstone stuff. :) |
| 17:39.07 | *** join/#maemo zimmerle (n=zimmerle@200.184.118.136) |
| 17:39.28 | zerojay | All my work for the week is already done anyways. |
| 17:39.35 | aol | I did not know I care |
| 17:40.19 | X-Fade | Not that is a concept: "All my work is done" |
| 17:40.24 | X-Fade | Sweet! |
| 17:40.28 | zerojay | Now you know. |
| 17:40.40 | timeless_mbp | hello world |
| 17:40.47 | linuxeventually | Why is "click" banned? o.O |
| 17:40.54 | X-Fade | s/Not/Now/ |
| 17:40.54 | zerojay | Well, there are just times when work is blocked... So... |
| 17:41.05 | timeless_mbp | aol: are you near HEL? |
| 17:41.13 | aol | yeah |
| 17:41.14 | X-Fade | zerojay: And then there is nothing else you can do? |
| 17:41.26 | zerojay | Click is banned because they want you to use terms like press and push. |
| 17:41.29 | X-Fade | zerojay: That is a single track line of work then ;) |
| 17:41.31 | linuxeventually | Ah |
| 17:41.34 | zerojay | Not for the moment. |
| 17:41.44 | timeless_mbp | aol: at some point we'll probably go off to dinner near kamppi in case you're really nearby :) |
| 17:41.51 | *** join/#maemo briglia (n=briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 17:42.05 | zerojay | No, not usually. This is one of those times though. |
| 17:42.09 | qwerty12_N810 | X-Fade: Your job must be good, too; you're always on IRC ;P |
| 17:42.27 | aol | timeless_mbp: sounds good |
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| 17:42.47 | X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: Ah, but I'm getting payed to scan it ;) |
| 17:43.24 | qwerty12_N810 | lol, getting paid for IRC :P |
| 17:43.45 | qwerty12_N810 | That is a real job :( |
| 17:44.03 | X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: Well not exactly, but yeah it is one of the ways information comes in yes. |
| 17:46.41 | GAN800 | lol |
| 17:47.09 | zerojay | Be a social marketer. You can just sit and post to twitter every few days. ;) |
| 17:47.16 | javispedro | :D |
| 17:47.26 | javispedro | and twitter posts are 140-ish chars |
| 17:47.29 | *** join/#maemo drjnut (n=drjnut@caladan.darksnow.org) |
| 17:47.34 | javispedro | so you're not going to get RSI either |
| 17:47.54 | zerojay | Probably another job i'm going to be absorbing here. |
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| 17:51.04 | aol | my hobby == my work |
| 17:51.13 | aol | it's odd it's still fun :) |
| 17:51.21 | *** join/#maemo brankinhu (n=quassel@201.56.102.13) |
| 17:51.26 | zerojay | What do you do? |
| 17:51.53 | aol | programming |
| 17:53.07 | divide_by_zero | programming what with what? :] |
| 17:54.06 | zerojay | Computers with fingers. ;) |
| 17:54.26 | aol | C++ and mobile devices |
| 17:54.54 | aol | I don't care much which platform as the applications is what I like doing, not the platform itself |
| 17:55.13 | zerojay | Did mobile games with java and brew for a while until the company switched focus. |
| 17:55.26 | aol | nevertheless I'm quite excited about RX-51 |
| 17:55.29 | lcuk2 | the platform decides the options available |
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| 17:55.55 | zerojay | Ever worked on the nokia 3650/7650? |
| 17:56.02 | aol | yes. |
| 17:56.12 | zerojay | What hell. |
| 17:56.13 | glass | as well |
| 17:56.26 | glass | erm. not on the platform itself |
| 17:56.28 | aol | I did lot of stuff for the first S60 |
| 17:56.36 | aol | apps, not the platform |
| 17:56.39 | zerojay | Garbage collection was completely broken. Lol |
| 17:56.47 | glass | aol: though do mmf plugins count as part of plat? |
| 17:56.48 | lcuk2 | apps need the platform to stand on |
| 17:56.52 | aol | I do C++, I dont care for garbage collection |
| 17:57.28 | glass | actually one could do very nice stuff for j2me on 3650 |
| 17:57.32 | glass | the vm was just full of bugs |
| 17:57.32 | zerojay | The phone just never would remove anything marked dirty |
| 17:57.37 | zerojay | Yep. |
| 17:57.38 | glass | for example the nokia triangle drawing method |
| 17:57.55 | glass | if you used it as the first thing, it crashed the whole phone |
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| 17:58.17 | glass | but if you placed, say 10 meaningless color settings, it didn't crash |
| 17:58.20 | zerojay | There was a nice samsung whose drawline method was off by one pixel. |
| 17:58.25 | glass | heh |
| 17:58.41 | zerojay | If you drew 1 pixel lines... Well... Nothing would show. |
| 17:58.53 | aol | sounds like just normal day with Symbian |
| 17:59.07 | zerojay | Pretty much. |
| 17:59.07 | lcuk2 | sounds liek a normal day with computers |
| 17:59.09 | aol | nowadays it's better as you can go read the source code |
| 17:59.38 | aol | but that's pretty new in symbian world |
| 17:59.40 | zerojay | Yeah, we didn't have that chance back then |
| 17:59.48 | glass | aol: once one learnt the holes, gamedev on j2me on 3650 became a breeze |
| 18:00.04 | aol | yeah well application development on 3rd edition is the same |
| 18:00.06 | glass | aol: but i knew c++ would be faster.. which is why turned to it |
| 18:00.18 | zerojay | Even gameloft couldn't figure out the 3650. |
| 18:00.22 | aol | I know pretty much 20 ways to make different phones to freeze totally :) |
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| 18:00.40 | glass | i just got my first m3g cube to show up! |
| 18:00.46 | glass | on the subject |
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| 18:01.09 | ipndrmath | Question: Is there a way to lock and unlock the N810 via the command line? |
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| 18:01.34 | aol | now I'm learning iPhone ... I thought it would be wise to come out of the closet early |
| 18:01.48 | lcuk2 | glass, which platform |
| 18:01.52 | aol | but I refused to swap my work phone to iPhone .... as I'm waiting for RX-51 :D |
| 18:02.01 | zerojay | We've been using unity for iphone dev. |
| 18:03.14 | aol | my company does sw for iphone, maemo, symbian, blackberry, android and windows mobile so it's quite nice to learn different stuff |
| 18:04.11 | aol | I guess it would be quite risky to do only symbian projects, as you can loose your business overnight at some point |
| 18:04.20 | aol | or Windows Mobile ... or .... |
| 18:04.28 | javispedro | or Palm. |
| 18:04.31 | aol | yes |
| 18:04.54 | javispedro | (which has happened recently so it's a good example ;) ) |
| 18:05.00 | aol | most of the stuff is still Symbian |
| 18:05.19 | aol | lot of iPhone and Android lately .. surprisingly WM too |
| 18:05.30 | aol | I guess there is some push because of 6.5 |
| 18:07.36 | VDVsx | consultancy company or a real software house ? :) |
| 18:08.52 | glass | lcuk2: j2me on symbian |
| 18:09.02 | glass | lcuk2: i wanna find out how usable it could be |
| 18:09.03 | zerojay | One of our worst programmers was let go last year and he started working for a consultancy company. |
| 18:09.17 | glass | zerojay: he wont work forever |
| 18:09.24 | zerojay | Which works almost exclusively for the government. |
| 18:09.37 | glass | ah, 4 years then |
| 18:09.57 | zerojay | Which explains why the government sent me a check for $-0.00 last week. |
| 18:10.32 | ipndrmath | Or ... does anyone know the softkey (i.e. F1) for the lock slider? |
| 18:11.51 | VDVsx | ipndrmath, did you tried to inspect the d-bus message, while you lock and unlock the device ? |
| 18:12.15 | *** join/#maemo plastun (n=plastun@86.57.177.190.pppoe.vitebsk.by) |
| 18:12.27 | aol | VDVsx: software factory |
| 18:12.39 | aol | VDVsx: no own products |
| 18:12.56 | qwerty12_N810 | ipndrmath: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=20599 |
| 18:12.59 | ipndrmath | No I hadn't. I'm currently away from the device and VNCed in, but it doesn't respond as the device is locked. |
| 18:13.10 | ipndrmath | k, thax one min |
| 18:13.16 | VDVsx | qwerty12_N810, just found the same |
| 18:13.19 | VDVsx | :) |
| 18:13.28 | qwerty12_N810 | :) |
| 18:13.43 | VDVsx | google skills , lol |
| 18:13.46 | aol | we don't really do concultancy, but software projects .... just with other peoples ideas (and risk :) |
| 18:13.56 | ipndrmath | Ah, thanks. My search skills failed me. |
| 18:14.04 | ipndrmath | I appreciate it. :) |
| 18:14.28 | VDVsx | aol, ah, now I get it :) |
| 18:15.08 | VDVsx | ipndrmath, :) |
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| 18:22.06 | z4chh | X-Fade, |
| 18:22.20 | z4chh | around? :P |
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| 18:33.44 | javispedro | bah |
| 18:33.55 | javispedro | hum |
| 18:34.09 | javispedro | er.. nothing. |
| 18:34.59 | lcuk2 | heh |
| 18:35.09 | javispedro | zerojay, do you have some benchmarks about that snesadvance.dat thing? some games I tested gain "a mere" 5fps, while others lose 1fps. |
| 18:35.12 | lcuk2 | javispedro, how did your frame skip timing loop doofer go |
| 18:35.47 | javispedro | lcuk2, it's a monster now :P |
| 18:36.17 | javispedro | but I like it |
| 18:36.25 | RST38h | moos |
| 18:36.28 | zerojay | No. Sorry |
| 18:36.28 | javispedro | it plans when the next frame "should" be drawn |
| 18:36.32 | RST38h | javis: what have you optimized? |
| 18:37.01 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
| 18:37.02 | javispedro | i was trying to use the snesadvance dat thing, which is a db of "patches" to games |
| 18:37.12 | javispedro | they basically list at which point the game is waiting for the video irq |
| 18:37.28 | javispedro | so that emu can just fire it at that point and skip the wait |
| 18:39.22 | RST38h | oh |
| 18:39.31 | RST38h | bad, bad kludge |
| 18:39.36 | javispedro | video irq, i mean the blanking interrupt or whatever is called |
| 18:39.38 | RST38h | never falls this low |
| 18:40.22 | javispedro | they say it helps a lot |
| 18:40.33 | RST38h | it's cheating |
| 18:40.38 | javispedro | but I guess the limit on the n8x0 is still rendering and not cpu emu |
| 18:40.43 | Luke-Jr | it's optimizing |
| 18:40.53 | RST38h | no, this one is cheating |
| 18:40.59 | RST38h | javis: Not really :) |
| 18:41.00 | Luke-Jr | is it? |
| 18:41.14 | zerojay | It is cheating, but that's why they are called speed hacks. ;) |
| 18:41.21 | Luke-Jr | sounds to me like nooping a second-counter and providing that value in native code when needed |
| 18:41.25 | RST38h | You have not seen speed hacks |
| 18:41.46 | zerojay | Righhht. |
| 18:42.10 | zerojay | Damn ndas. |
| 18:42.20 | Luke-Jr | that said, shouldn't a N8x0 be able to emulate something as old as a SNES easily? |
| 18:42.29 | RST38h | Yes and no |
| 18:42.55 | RST38h | 65816 CPU should not be a problem if done in ARM assembler |
| 18:43.21 | zerojay | Emulators are getting more accurate, so as work continues, it'll get slower. |
| 18:43.28 | RST38h | Video is a bitch though. SNES supports up to 4 (?) playfields overlaid on top of each other |
| 18:43.33 | javispedro | yep |
| 18:43.38 | javispedro | a lot |
| 18:43.39 | zerojay | Bsnes is bus-accurate. |
| 18:43.41 | RST38h | + sprites, + rotation |
| 18:43.45 | RST38h | + color effecs |
| 18:43.46 | zerojay | Yes, 4 |
| 18:44.00 | RST38h | Nobody needs bus-accurate |
| 18:44.09 | zerojay | Rotation only on background layers. |
| 18:44.16 | RST38h | As long as it plays the games nobody cares how it is done |
| 18:44.26 | zerojay | Aside from sprites. |
| 18:44.42 | RST38h | Also, there is APU |
| 18:44.48 | javispedro | the cpu is already in ARM (that's the main difference from previous snes ports). |
| 18:44.48 | RST38h | SNES APU is a separate CPU |
| 18:44.51 | javispedro | the spc700 too. |
| 18:44.59 | javispedro | (in ARM I mean) |
| 18:45.10 | zerojay | True, in general. |
| 18:45.11 | javispedro | a bit verbosey for my linking though. |
| 18:45.14 | RST38h | And then there is sound problem |
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| 18:45.31 | javispedro | *liking. |
| 18:45.41 | RST38h | If you do not fill up audio buffer in time, your sound will suck (see VGBA) |
| 18:46.18 | javispedro | i prefer reasonable audio and playable games. |
| 18:46.38 | Luke-Jr | Freeciv! |
| 18:46.54 | lcuk2 | RST38h, cant you cheat re graphics, or do you need pixel perfect |
| 18:46.59 | RST38h | javis: If you can't get into 50fps or higher, there will be audio problem |
| 18:47.07 | RST38h | lcuk: Goooood question |
| 18:47.16 | javispedro | RST38h, the cpu is not the problem. |
| 18:47.18 | javispedro | rendering is. |
| 18:47.20 | RST38h | lcuk: You cant, usually, because the resolution is already 256x224 |
| 18:47.27 | RST38h | javis: exactly |
| 18:47.32 | zerojay | You can cheat some stuff like mode 7. |
| 18:47.36 | RST38h | javis: and only when you have got enough playfields |
| 18:47.47 | lcuk2 | original liqbase has a 512*448 resolution specifically for this ;) |
| 18:47.49 | RST38h | javis: One or two playfields are fine |
| 18:47.55 | lcuk2 | when discussing it with pupnik lol |
| 18:48.02 | javispedro | which means than audio only gets bad if the thing can't keep up while frameskipping |
| 18:48.13 | RST38h | correct |
| 18:48.17 | javispedro | or if the sync code is awful (which may be the case :P ;) ) |
| 18:48.23 | RST38h | but you can't frameskip more than 70% frames |
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| 18:48.46 | zerojay | But not much. |
| 18:49.15 | RST38h | javis: at some point you will come to conclusion that you cannot sync with the physical audio |
| 18:49.23 | lcuk2 | RST38h, last thing i heard, there was an RGB xv mode somewhere around |
| 18:49.25 | zerojay | Frameskip also kills control. |
| 18:49.33 | RST38h | no |
| 18:49.44 | RST38h | you can still read controls at full rate |
| 18:50.00 | javispedro | in fact I currently do, which I shouldn't |
| 18:50.21 | zerojay | Yes, i know, but the perception that you lost some control happens anyways. |
| 18:50.31 | RST38h | javis: So, leave the physical audio run and just top up the phsysical buffer |
| 18:50.49 | javispedro | this follows a nice approach. there's a separate thread "rendering" audio. |
| 18:50.57 | RST38h | zerojay: As I said, anything with >70% frameskip is doomed to suck |
| 18:51.08 | RST38h | javis: there always is |
| 18:51.21 | javispedro | since the apu is mostly separated from the rest of the snes it makes sense |
| 18:51.30 | *** join/#maemo L0cutus (n=kki@94.162.0.240) |
| 18:51.30 | RST38h | javis: in some cases you do not have a thread, you just have hardware dma |
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| 18:52.28 | javispedro | btw, xsp is very nice |
| 18:52.56 | RST38h | xsp is? |
| 18:52.56 | javispedro | either it interpolates a bit or I am losing sight, cause it looks god. |
| 18:53.04 | javispedro | pixel doubling |
| 18:53.05 | RST38h | Oh |
| 18:53.15 | RST38h | Ok, you may want to look at my stuff |
| 18:53.25 | RST38h | And win yourself a few fps |
| 18:54.38 | RST38h | The nice interpolated effect you see is probably caused by hardware zooming in N810 |
| 18:54.56 | RST38h | But you can access it directly, this way you avoid X11 |
| 18:56.26 | javispedro | oh, you are fms! |
| 18:56.41 | javispedro | lol I didn't know ! |
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| 19:01.39 | javispedro | well, gotta go, will need to read a goot git tutorial :) |
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| 19:12.56 | lcuk2 | X-Fade, (or anyone) how long before "queued for loading into repository" and availablility in the repository |
| 19:13.16 | lcuk2 | is it pot luck? 3 weeks? 10 minutes? |
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| 19:16.56 | johnsq | Hi |
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| 19:19.08 | lcuk2 | hi johnsq |
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| 19:43.44 | divide_by_zero | cya |
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| 19:51.10 | Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: sent you mail @gmail - the HAM strings are probably obsolete in 0.16 though |
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| 20:14.25 | lcuk2 | if i install a .deb by double clicking, would it look on the repositories for dependencies |
| 20:14.41 | qwerty12_N810 | Nope |
| 20:15.11 | johnsq | lcuk2: no, but fails, if something missing |
| 20:15.29 | lcuk2 | dang |
| 20:15.59 | lcuk2 | can i have a .install file to start install of a library |
| 20:16.09 | lcuk2 | which normally wouldnt be listed |
| 20:16.26 | zakkm | lcuk2: https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/install/extras-devel.install ? |
| 20:16.41 | lcuk2 | zakkm, not what im after |
| 20:16.55 | lcuk2 | ive got an app binary .deb - its not in extras-devel |
| 20:16.59 | lcuk2 | but the library is |
| 20:17.19 | zakkm | you want a .install that will install library then apps? |
| 20:17.28 | qwerty12_N810 | lcuk2: No, packages without a category that is not user/ cannot be installed directly (in blue pill mode), only as part of a dependency of another program that has a section of user/ |
| 20:17.30 | lcuk2 | how can that library be installed by someone thats not a command line ninja |
| 20:18.06 | zakkm | .deb open in application manage,r and checks repository for the dependencies , doesnt it? |
| 20:18.16 | *** join/#maemo zs (n=zs@188.220.50.10) |
| 20:18.33 | lcuk2 | o_O you are right |
| 20:18.35 | lcuk2 | it does |
| 20:18.40 | lcuk2 | its only dpkg -i that doesnt |
| 20:18.49 | lcuk2 | thats it zakkm, it will do it then? |
| 20:19.08 | zakkm | if library is in repository,, and they open deb in application manager |
| 20:19.14 | zakkm | it will download the dependencies from repository |
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| 20:19.18 | zakkm | if commandline.. it wont get |
| 20:19.32 | lcuk2 | because from a command line, you go straight to dpkg |
| 20:19.35 | zakkm | dpkg -i cant read repositories |
| 20:19.37 | lcuk2 | instead of the fluff around it |
| 20:19.48 | zakkm | application manager will apt-get the libs itself |
| 20:19.50 | lcuk2 | perfect! :D |
| 20:19.53 | fiferboy | How is opening a local deb in the app manager any different from double-clicking on it? |
| 20:19.58 | zakkm | its not |
| 20:20.13 | zakkm | if you double click it, it opens app manager and opens deb |
| 20:20.18 | zakkm | its the same thing with a different route |
| 20:20.22 | lcuk2 | fiferboy, no, i didnt know what app it brought up |
| 20:20.38 | *** join/#maemo _BuBU (n=_BuBU@21.232.197-77.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 20:20.47 | zakkm | but if you do dpkg -i ____ .. it doesnt read repositories, dpkg doesnt do that |
| 20:21.16 | zakkm | app manager will read the dependency part of the deb file, get them through repository , and then dpkg -i the deb |
| 20:21.35 | fiferboy | Have you tried that? I thought it failed if it didn't have the dependencies already installed... |
| 20:21.52 | qwerty12_N810 | It does. |
| 20:21.53 | lcuk2 | cannot test really |
| 20:22.03 | zakkm | lcuk2: ill test if you want? |
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| 20:22.06 | lcuk2 | ive got the libs installed by non standard means |
| 20:22.06 | zakkm | i got a empty maemo install |
| 20:22.08 | fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: Does fail, or does process deps? |
| 20:22.13 | zakkm | send theee deb |
| 20:22.16 | qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: fails |
| 20:22.31 | fiferboy | I was pretty sure it would |
| 20:22.31 | qwerty12_N810 | You get a nice "Application packages missing" |
| 20:22.45 | zakkm | thats only if its not in repository, isnt it qwerty12_N810 ? |
| 20:22.59 | zakkm | the dependencies |
| 20:23.35 | qwerty12_N810 | It only resolves dependencies if the program you are installing is in a repository |
| 20:23.57 | lcuk2 | :( |
| 20:24.24 | lcuk2 | do i have to make my own repo? |
| 20:25.08 | lcuk2 | shite! liqbase is fast. i'd forgotten how quick |
| 20:25.44 | *** join/#maemo Tomaterr (n=user@adsl-99-146-96-40.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 20:25.46 | lcuk2 | hmmm |
| 20:25.47 | lcuk2 | bbl |
| 20:27.34 | Tomaterr | is there an unzipper for maemo? |
| 20:28.17 | qwerty12_N810 | I assume you mean something graphical? If so, there's xarchiver in Extras |
| 20:28.25 | Tomaterr | ty |
| 20:29.21 | Tomaterr | awesome |
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| 20:34.23 | woglinde | re javis |
| 20:34.52 | Tomaterr | isn't xarchiver just a front end? |
| 20:35.17 | qwerty12_N810 | Yes, but there is also unzip in the same repository |
| 20:35.32 | qwerty12_N810 | (Should be better than the Busybox one...) |
| 20:36.25 | Tomaterr | ah |
| 20:37.03 | Tomaterr | kk |
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| 21:00.17 | *** join/#maemo lardman (n=vircuser@78.150.0.243) |
| 21:00.20 | lardman | evening all |
| 21:00.45 | javispedro | http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html this page is pure gold |
| 21:02.49 | woglinde | jo lardman |
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| 21:20.14 | divide_by_zero | Can I make Hildon start all applications maximized, and never bring a window to top without me asking for? |
| 21:21.01 | timeless_mbp | um |
| 21:21.08 | timeless_mbp | hildon is more of a toolkit |
| 21:21.11 | timeless_mbp | and less of a window manager |
| 21:21.23 | timeless_mbp | hildon-desktop / matchbox are more window managerish |
| 21:21.52 | timeless_mbp | in diablo, some applications didn't really have full screen modes |
| 21:21.58 | timeless_mbp | e.g. the game start screen |
| 21:22.07 | timeless_mbp | and some applications didn't have non full screen modes |
| 21:22.10 | timeless_mbp | e.g. the games themselves |
| 21:24.01 | divide_by_zero | ok, i want the maximizable ones to start maximized by default |
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| 21:34.56 | johnsq | divide_by_zero: look if matchbox supports rules or config of apps |
| 21:35.55 | lardman | hey woglinde, sorry for the lag |
| 21:36.11 | divide_by_zero | ok... now i'm sitting here wondering would a matchbox hold my clothes? :] |
| 21:37.30 | divide_by_zero | i imagine it's possible because fremantle will be like this, right? |
| 21:38.41 | woglinde | lardman no prob |
| 21:41.37 | lcuk2 | hello lardman \o woglinde |
| 21:42.11 | lardman | hi lcuk2 |
| 21:42.21 | woglinde | jo lcuk |
| 21:43.46 | lardman | well I've just booked my flights to Amsterdam |
| 21:44.20 | lardman | the wonders of air travel, have to fly from Berlin to Luton, then back to Amsterdam |
| 21:44.54 | *** join/#maemo Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/Staff/Sargun) |
| 21:46.00 | woglinde | lardman hehe |
| 21:46.11 | woglinde | we could met at the airport |
| 21:46.44 | lardman | what time do you get in? I think we get in at 21:00 |
| 21:48.24 | zerojay | As a north american, amsterdam is a fable that i'm not so sure exists. :P |
| 21:48.39 | lardman | because of the weed you mean? |
| 21:48.50 | lardman | or the English tourists? |
| 21:49.10 | zerojay | Yeah, it's that mythical weed place. |
| 21:49.12 | woglinde | lardman lol |
| 21:49.18 | lardman | I'm not sure I met a single dutchman last time I was there, then again they all speak English better than the tourists that's for sure ;) |
| 21:49.23 | woglinde | I meant on the airport in berlin |
| 21:49.29 | woglinde | and I will stay in berlin |
| 21:49.35 | woglinde | I will not got to the summit |
| 21:49.45 | lardman | woglinde: ah ok, will be there for flight at 16:20 iirc |
| 21:49.50 | lardman | woglinde: why not? |
| 21:50.40 | lardman | gives a small curse for having to debug a student's FDE code |
| 21:50.50 | lardman | and goes to get another beer to help himself along |
| 21:51.13 | zerojay | Being drunk at work is nice |
| 21:51.35 | zerojay | Celebrating our boss going to a new office. |
| 21:51.56 | woglinde | lardman no time and family |
| 21:52.04 | lardman | ah, not at work, it's nearly 23:00 here |
| 21:52.21 | woglinde | zerojay lol |
| 21:52.27 | lardman | woglinde: am bringing mine (wife) |
| 21:52.31 | woglinde | whois the new boss? |
| 21:52.56 | zerojay | Dunno, i'll be following her there in a month or so. |
| 21:53.21 | *** join/#maemo Luddek (n=Adium@c-093672d5.610-106-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 21:53.42 | zerojay | Actually, a week after i get there, maemo summit. |
| 21:54.00 | zerojay | Two months then |
| 21:54.16 | lardman | mmmm, beer + nuts |
| 21:54.28 | zerojay | When i told my boss i need time off and she asked why |
| 21:54.48 | zerojay | I said "to save the world, one tablet at a time" |
| 21:55.10 | zerojay | She just said "sounds important" and approved. |
| 21:55.18 | Luddek | hah |
| 21:56.16 | zerojay | Someone here at the office saw me using my tablet and told her i was playing ds games, lol |
| 21:56.32 | zerojay | So i showed her the tablet. |
| 21:56.51 | zerojay | She's buying rx-51 at launch now. |
| 21:57.18 | divide_by_zero | then she saw you were jun on irc!... |
| 21:57.28 | divide_by_zero | just |
| 21:57.29 | zerojay | Hah |
| 21:57.46 | zerojay | No biggie. |
| 21:58.17 | woglinde | lol |
| 21:58.25 | Luddek | what do you work with? |
| 21:58.38 | zerojay | I make videogames |
| 21:58.54 | zerojay | We use scrum, just like maemo does |
| 21:59.17 | Luddek | ah ok |
| 21:59.44 | divide_by_zero | is it? great!... |
| 22:00.21 | zerojay | My life is nothing but sprints now, lol |
| 22:00.25 | divide_by_zero | but ive heard they dont stimulate ppl to use scrumm itself, is it true? because of licensing... |
| 22:01.07 | zerojay | Scrum's a development methodology, nothing to do with licenses |
| 22:01.34 | divide_by_zero | oh sorry, i tought you ment scumm :D |
| 22:01.45 | zerojay | Hehe |
| 22:02.05 | Luddek | i also thought that at first but than i read quickly on wikipedia |
| 22:02.11 | divide_by_zero | a friend of mine uses that at his work... |
| 22:02.29 | zerojay | Maemo uses it in a looser sense. |
| 22:03.27 | divide_by_zero | there was an interview the other day at floss weekly with one of scummvm's developers. |
| 22:20.51 | Macer | lol |
| 22:21.06 | woglinde | jo macer |
| 22:22.09 | Macer | "when people are called yellow, what are they?" "chinese" "wrong" "cowards" "correct" |
| 22:22.33 | Macer | cowards was the answer given by the chinese kid |
| 22:22.41 | zerojay | Lol |
| 22:22.43 | Macer | the white girl said chinese hahaha |
| 22:22.44 | zerojay | Wtf |
| 22:22.56 | Macer | i saw a video for some kids show |
| 22:23.04 | zerojay | Do i even wanna know? |
| 22:23.06 | Macer | and that is what the girl said |
| 22:23.12 | *** join/#maemo victorpoluceno_ (n=victorpo@189-11-160-82.bnut3700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 22:23.12 | Macer | hahahaha |
| 22:23.29 | Macer | ever see the south park where the dad is on wheel of fortune? |
| 22:23.35 | Macer | ;) |
| 22:24.36 | zerojay | Hah |
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| 22:28.45 | *** part/#maemo Luddek (n=Adium@c-093672d5.610-106-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 22:36.44 | Macer | wow youtube sucks |
| 22:38.48 | qwerty12_N810 | Reading the comments? ;) |
| 22:39.32 | *** join/#maemo jpereira (n=jpereira@unaffiliated/jpereira) |
| 22:41.45 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: you don't read the articles do you...? ;) |
| 22:43.19 | zerojay | Hah |
| 22:43.31 | *** join/#maemo MrGoose (n=cache@5ac86efa.bb.sky.com) |
| 22:43.39 | Macer | qwerty12_N810: heh |
| 22:43.45 | *** join/#maemo straind (n=stupidpe@n080s062.bbr1.shentel.net) |
| 22:43.45 | qwerty12_N810 | lardman: depends :> |
| 22:43.51 | Macer | search for stupid game show answers |
| 22:44.00 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: :) |
| 22:44.01 | Macer | some of them had me dying laughing |
| 22:48.00 | Macer | "something your husband will absolutely NOT let you put on his weiner" "ben-gay" |
| 22:48.03 | Macer | hahahahaha |
| 22:48.31 | lardman | worries a little for Macer's sanity ;) |
| 22:48.49 | qwerty12_N810 | Wow. Modest really is whorish. I have no e-mail accounts, at all, configured but, yet, it still insists on loading at timed intervals. |
| 22:49.21 | lardman | and if you do have them, it still sucks any cpu power away as soon as you connect |
| 22:49.23 | lardman | ;) |
| 22:49.53 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: I ask again, are you sure you're not going to be able to make i tto the summit? |
| 22:49.57 | lardman | please |
| 22:50.02 | lardman | you know it will be fun |
| 22:50.05 | lardman | :) |
| 22:50.26 | qwerty12_N810 | lardman: it would be but I am certain that I won't be able to :) |
| 22:50.36 | lardman | ah go on, it's not far away |
| 22:50.49 | lardman | it'll be a good laugh |
| 22:51.18 | lardman | beer, women (well I have a wife, who will be with me), weed (I don't smoke); but there's still beer! |
| 22:52.16 | qwerty12_N810 | However much I'd like to go, it's just not possible. I don't have a passport and college would find new ways of keeping me busy :> |
| 22:53.01 | lardman | well the passport can be sorted out with ~£80 and a few photos, what's your course? I'm sure we can all chip in and help with that :) |
| 22:53.30 | lardman | actually in the EU a driver's licence will do.... |
| 22:53.35 | lardman | though that might not help you |
| 22:53.50 | qwerty12_N810 | Nah, I get a provisionial next year |
| 22:54.38 | VDVsx | well, the national identification card, will do in EU |
| 22:54.44 | VDVsx | :) |
| 22:54.50 | lardman | pah, we don't do those! |
| 22:54.58 | VDVsx | no ? |
| 22:55.00 | lardman | thankfullly :) |
| 22:55.02 | lardman | no |
| 22:55.07 | VDVsx | oh |
| 22:55.16 | VDVsx | what do you got for ID ? |
| 22:55.28 | lardman | I just booked my flights today, am trying to think what forms of ID they will accept |
| 22:55.33 | lardman | VDVsx: nothing |
| 22:55.45 | lardman | VDVsx: we don't have to carry ID at all |
| 22:55.54 | qwerty12_N810 | lardman: £20 ;) |
| 22:56.13 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: your customs officials are cheap! :) |
| 22:56.24 | VDVsx | lardman, but you have one right ? |
| 22:56.26 | Mace_N8x0 | blah |
| 22:56.32 | javispedro | qwerty12_N810, that's indeed what a friend of mine used as "ID" in some south african country :D |
| 22:56.34 | lardman | VDVsx: usually passport in the bank, drivers licence for everything else |
| 22:56.35 | Mace_N8x0 | going to order a pizza |
| 22:56.52 | lardman | VDVsx: ID? No, passport & drivers' licence yes |
| 22:56.54 | qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: rofl |
| 22:57.05 | lardman | :D |
| 22:57.23 | lardman | Mace_N8x0: you're making me hungry and it's nearly midnight |
| 22:57.46 | VDVsx | lardman, and minors, what they have ? |
| 22:57.56 | lardman | nothing afaik |
| 22:58.10 | lardman | well petrol bombs and knives if you believe the news ;) |
| 22:58.34 | VDVsx | lol |
| 22:58.40 | VDVsx | very strange for me :) |
| 22:58.46 | lardman | but you can get false IDs iirc, Eurocard or somesuch? |
| 22:59.00 | lardman | qwerty12_N810: you'll know more about that than I do, was a long time ago |
| 22:59.10 | lardman | ISIC card prrhaps? |
| 22:59.40 | qwerty12_N810 | Something like that, my friend got a fake one made with some French "agency" on it.. |
| 23:00.39 | qwerty12_N810 | It looked decent but it was made on some rubbish material that bent quite easily |
| 23:00.57 | lardman | all quite entertaining, as kids look like kids, and that's all there is to say about it :D |
| 23:01.06 | javispedro | fwiw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ID#European_Union |
| 23:01.35 | lardman | yeah, I was once stopped in Germany and had to run away as I didn't have my passport on me |
| 23:01.52 | lardman | was a long time ago, and wasn't doing anything illegal at all, promise |
| 23:02.26 | *** join/#maemo zerojayPC (n=jay@modemcable180.240-23-96.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 23:03.09 | VDVsx | only foreigns got ID cards, lol |
| 23:06.59 | Mace_N8x0 | we need national id cards in the US |
| 23:07.31 | lardman | expensive |
| 23:07.34 | Mace_N8x0 | screw it |
| 23:07.39 | Mace_N8x0 | world IDs |
| 23:07.42 | lardman | and not proved to reduce fraud really |
| 23:07.43 | Mace_N8x0 | ! |
| 23:07.58 | Mace_N8x0 | lardman, I was joking |
| 23:08.04 | Mace_N8x0 | ;) |
| 23:08.06 | lardman | yeah no worries :) |
| 23:08.36 | Mace_N8x0 | although |
| 23:08.44 | qwerty12_N810 | wonders what the Nokla version of the N900 will look like |
| 23:08.49 | Mace_N8x0 | a national drivers lic would be nice |
| 23:08.53 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 23:09.04 | lardman | they would be good, if the infrastructure that uses them is also good, but that;s not going to happen |
| 23:09.25 | lardman | ah right, you have per-state licences? |
| 23:09.34 | Mace_N8x0 | yes |
| 23:09.52 | Mace_N8x0 | so joe drunk driver |
| 23:10.04 | Mace_N8x0 | would get away with it in another state |
| 23:10.45 | Mace_N8x0 | there are all types of avoidable things that can be done by crossing states |
| 23:10.52 | lardman | no interstate reporting? |
| 23:11.02 | Mace_N8x0 | lardman, it is a joke |
| 23:11.06 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 23:11.16 | Mace_N8x0 | probably running off a tethered phone |
| 23:11.24 | Mace_N8x0 | ;) |
| 23:11.32 | lardman | I understand we finally have cross-Europe reporting for vehicle stuff now |
| 23:11.47 | Mace_N8x0 | heh |
| 23:12.10 | lardman | I'm sure it works if you get nicked in France; I doubt it works if a Frenchman gets nicked over here though |
| 23:12.11 | Mace_N8x0 | well.. the rural areas would be too difficult |
| 23:12.19 | Mace_N8x0 | haha |
| 23:12.19 | zerojayPC | qwerty12_N810: Yeah, can't wait for the N900 to be revealed so that we can spend the next three months hearing complaints. ;) |
| 23:12.37 | lardman | zerojayPC: c'est la vie |
| 23:12.39 | qwerty12_N810 | Heh |
| 23:12.53 | Mace_N8x0 | zerojayPC, touch books should have been shipping for 2 weeks now |
| 23:13.07 | zerojayPC | lardman: Yep, I know. |
| 23:13.11 | Mace_N8x0 | so far not a single person has received one |
| 23:13.17 | *** join/#maemo CutMeOwnThroat (n=XXXy@chem014237.chem.northwestern.edu) |
| 23:13.18 | qwerty12_N810 | At least "it's not a phone" will be a thing of the past |
| 23:13.27 | zerojayPC | I don't know what a touch book is. |
| 23:13.35 | Mace_N8x0 | qwerty, it isnt a phone i thought |
| 23:13.44 | Mace_N8x0 | just a tablet with hspda |
| 23:14.02 | Mace_N8x0 | zerojay, good |
| 23:14.08 | Mace_N8x0 | dont find out |
| 23:14.10 | zerojayPC | Well... I said it was a phone, but Qole said it wasn't announced as one... but all the FCC documents refer to it repeatedly as a phone... over and over. |
| 23:14.20 | qwerty12_N810 | Mace_N8x0: well, T-Mobile are gonna be carrying it... |
| 23:14.21 | Mace_N8x0 | it will suck you in and disappoint |
| 23:14.31 | Mace_N8x0 | wow really? |
| 23:14.37 | zerojayPC | I think it's safe to say it'll be a phone. |
| 23:14.52 | Mace_N8x0 | tmobile's nokia selection totally sucks |
| 23:15.00 | zerojayPC | And that the entire Maemo project was just a research mission really. |
| 23:15.04 | zerojayPC | To get us to this point. |
| 23:15.09 | Mace_N8x0 | zerojay, is a sidekick a phone? |
| 23:15.15 | zerojayPC | Yes. |
| 23:15.17 | lardman | I agree it will have to be a phone, certainly with the smaller screen size |
| 23:15.19 | Mace_N8x0 | ah |
| 23:15.27 | zerojayPC | How is it not a phone? |
| 23:15.27 | qwerty12_N810 | Maemo 5 is really Hildon running atop Symbian ;) |
| 23:15.43 | Mace_N8x0 | i think the n810 is a good phine size |
| 23:15.47 | Mace_N8x0 | haha |
| 23:15.58 | *** join/#maemo brolin (n=brolin@200.24.16.85) |
| 23:16.06 | Mace_N8x0 | hahaha |
| 23:16.16 | Mace_N8x0 | qwerty.. that would be awesome |
| 23:16.28 | qwerty12_N810 | It would? |
| 23:16.39 | Mace_N8x0 | yes |
| 23:16.45 | zerojayPC | :/ |
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| 23:17.55 | Mace_N8x0 | hildon running on symbian using qt ftw |
| 23:18.11 | Mace_N8x0 | with powervr support |
| 23:18.34 | javispedro | ot os a pme |
| 23:18.38 | lardman | hmm, I see the magic words |
| 23:18.38 | javispedro | arg |
| 23:18.47 | javispedro | it is a phone: http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt317/uthe_cute/SDC10929.jpg |
| 23:18.56 | javispedro | if that's not a speaker hole |
| 23:19.00 | javispedro | i don't what is. |
| 23:19.12 | javispedro | today's not my typing gay. |
| 23:19.17 | javispedro | dang it. |
| 23:19.21 | *** join/#maemo hellwolf-n810 (n=hellwolf@a213-22-69-165.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 23:19.22 | lardman | lol |
| 23:19.27 | lardman | I have that too |
| 23:19.40 | qwerty12_N810 | A typing gay? ;P |
| 23:19.46 | javispedro | *day :( |
| 23:19.53 | lardman | not specifically the day/gay thing mind you :p |
| 23:20.10 | javispedro | also, damn snes9x disabled the key autorepeat if held down |
| 23:20.21 | lardman | my fingers do just type whatever they want though, once I've started the word |
| 23:20.26 | javispedro | (on my desktop) |
| 23:20.37 | javispedro | so deleting is a pain |
| 23:20.45 | lardman | I blame the wine/beer/time of night/government/USA |
| 23:20.52 | lardman | seems fair |
| 23:21.37 | javispedro | "xset r on" fixed it :) |
| 23:23.13 | javispedro | so it is a phone. |
| 23:23.36 | lardman | which is good as my contract has just expired and I need a new one |
| 23:23.38 | lardman | :) |
| 23:24.40 | zerojayPC | What I don't understand is why "it is a phone" causes such a panic, like as if suddenly all the stuff that is in and being worked on for Maemo 5 was thrown out. |
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| 23:24.40 | javispedro | I personally fear two things: $$, and carriers. |
| 23:24.43 | zerojayPC | It's going to be a tablet... with phone capabilities. |
| 23:24.53 | zerojayPC | No different than the N810 and the other tablets. |
| 23:25.12 | javispedro | more expensive for a start. we'll see. |
| 23:25.29 | zerojayPC | We don't know that. :) |
| 23:26.01 | zerojayPC | Good chance of it happening, though. |
| 23:26.13 | zerojayPC | But it's not the phone hardware causing that high price. |
| 23:27.20 | javispedro | just the fact that it can be used as a phone increases the price. if they have to keep adding hardware to justify the price so that it does not seem like a total ripoff they'll do it. |
| 23:27.36 | javispedro | i don't know why, but that happens. |
| 23:29.45 | javispedro | hum. this linus guy knows how to do scms. must be a good coder I guess ;) |
| 23:30.02 | jeremiah | Not too shabby eh? |
| 23:30.11 | qwerty12_N810 | I hear he's a git ;) |
| 23:30.20 | jeremiah | There is an O'Reilly webcast on git on the 20th |
| 23:30.39 | jeremiah | From the guy who wrote 'pro git' and works at Github |
| 23:30.50 | jeremiah | Shaun Chancon I think his name is |
| 23:34.05 | javispedro | i only "accidentally erased" around 1 hour of work while trying to setup everything so it must be good :) |
| 23:34.29 | derf | That sounds like git alright. |
| 23:36.42 | zerojayPC | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjCDLMtkNGc <-- best trick ever. |
| 23:38.22 | GeneralAntilles | yawns. |
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