IRC log for #maemo on 20090521

00:01.29ShadowJKall my nokia chargers scream now :( I wonder if they always did that, and I only started noticing after only sleeping with one computer running... or if they start screaming/whining due to old age
00:01.34luke-jrwhich sats can you see?
00:01.46luke-jrI can see23, 3, 19, 25, 13, 10, 6, 7, 8, and 16
00:02.01ShadowJKim indoors, id see none
00:02.06luke-jrwhy?
00:02.14luke-jrI'm indoors too
00:02.16ShadowJKnot even sirfstar sees
00:03.03ShadowJKmetal roof :)
00:03.13luke-jrI have a whole apartment above me :p
00:05.28*** join/#maemo Dantonic (n=user@m230e36d0.tmodns.net)
00:05.45LiraNunathat's weird, I got a map installed in internal sd but 'maps' will not find it
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00:29.17fauxmightShadowJK: I have two chargers. one screams and one does not. The screamer has a damaged cord and if I change its position, it will occasionally stop screaming. I'm sure it will fry me in my house one day, but it charges whether it screams or not.
00:29.48fauxmightI have two n810s in use else I wouldn't use the second charger.
00:31.01GAN8001fauxmight, Amazon has the charger for about $2 a piece.
00:33.38Proteousthe screaming is just some high frequency vibration probably from one of the tiny transformers or ICs in the charger
00:33.46Proteoususualy isn't something to worry about
00:34.05Proteousyou can open it up and spread some hot glue around the part that is causing it if you want...
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00:34.31Infektahello
00:34.33Proteousor just get a new one for $2
00:34.41Proteoushowdy Infekta
00:35.13Infektahey im curious about something... is there a way to change the internal MMC
00:35.33Proteouson an N810?
00:35.37Proteousno, it's soldered in
00:35.38Infektayes
00:35.41Infektafack
00:35.43Infektalol
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00:35.53Proteouswell, with the right tools you might be able to do it
00:35.59*** part/#maemo zakkm (n=Adium@CPE0013f7b6e1a2-CM0013f7b6e19e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
00:36.02Proteousno guarenttee it would work
00:36.03Infektayeah i do have soldering tools
00:36.06Infektabut
00:36.25Infektai dont think i will find a solderable SD card anywhere
00:36.31Infektao well
00:36.39lcukinside a normal sd card?
00:36.43lcukunsolder that one ;)
00:36.51Proteousyou would need tools to do really fine chip replacement
00:37.02Proteousdifferent stuff then just a soldering iron
00:37.06lcukhammer and chisel not fine enough?
00:37.09Proteouslol
00:37.11Proteousprobably not
00:37.22lcukused to work on circuit repair
00:37.29Proteouscool
00:37.43ProteousI just worked on bigger stuff, use to do stereo repair
00:37.52Proteousregular soldering iron worked fine
00:38.24lcukyeah they would come out of the smt machine after the bath and layout
00:38.45*** join/#maemo wazd (n=chatzill@gwh-1-22-val21.ln.rinet.ru)
00:39.06lcukbut it wasnt unheard of to get the wick out scoop up everything and replace half the board
00:39.30lcukcant think of the right name for his mini blowtorch
00:39.47Proteousthe smallest stuff I would do is surface mount resistors and caps
00:39.52Proteousno ICs
00:40.00Proteouswell, not really small ones anyway
00:40.04lcukeasier to remove than to replace lol
00:40.10Proteousyeah
00:40.23Proteousfix peoples botched PS2 mods
00:40.47*** join/#maemo joelmaher (n=joelmahe@67.205.203.107)
00:40.53lcukmost common soldering i bother with nowadays is mouse button replacement
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00:41.34Proteousthat's pretty extreme
00:41.43Proteousconsidering a new mouse is $5.00
00:41.51lcuknot relaly, i like my mouse and i cant find em anywhere brick n mortor lol
00:41.57Proteousheh
00:42.38lcuk's mouse has balls
00:42.41Proteouslast soldering I did was solder together my arcade control panel
00:42.43lcuka ball :|
00:42.47Proteousfuckin ball mice
00:42.54Proteouswhat a joke
00:42.54Proteousheh
00:43.12lcukworks and is the right weight :)
00:43.22Infektaif all else fails
00:43.29Infektause a shotgun
00:43.42lcukand laser mice have a nasty habit of shooting off west when i pick em up and wiggle em
00:43.50Infektalol
00:44.06Infektacoz they got a vasectomy at birth
00:44.07lcuk"omg omg the floor under me moved, quick send the pointer to africa
00:44.21lcukwhereas a ball mouse merely twitches :)
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00:58.11chxI use an Evoulent Vertical Mouse
00:58.19chxdefinitely not the five bucks category
00:58.23chxbut soooooo comfy
01:09.34GAN800lcuk, you need a mousepad and a mouse that doesn't suck
01:09.45GAN800The MX518 is really nice.
01:12.10GAN800Merging these tablet school articles is going to be a pain.
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02:03.00Bobbemorning
02:04.34GAN800lol . . . American Idol. Rod Stewart got old.
02:05.37Bobbelol
02:05.53Bobbehis face looks like a broken mirror or something
02:05.59Bobbewrinkles held still with botox or sth
02:16.58disco_stuhi
02:20.48Macerchernobyl set off alarms in sweden :)
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03:10.04Macerhm
03:21.45*** part/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@c-71-198-208-205.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
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03:58.55cyrus_mcwhich package provides tools like mkfs.ext2, ext3 for maemo (I have an n810)
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04:08.19Bobbee2fsprogs
04:08.24Bobbeit's in extras-devel
04:10.47Bobbecyrus_mc, u there?
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04:12.41cyrus_mcya
04:12.47cyrus_mcok..I need ot add that repos
04:12.56cyrus_mcany idea where I get it or the details to add to the repos file
04:15.06Bobbehttp://wiki.maemo.org/Extras#Extras-devel
04:15.18Bobbethere will be a link like 'click this .install to add the repo' or sth similar
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04:18.26cyrus_mck
04:18.27cyrus_mcty
04:18.32Bobbenp
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04:35.59cyrus_mcBobbe - i enabled that repos but e2fsprogs is still not available
04:37.11cyrus_mchmm.had to reboot and then it was availble
04:37.17cyrus_mcstrange..never had to do that before when adding a repo
04:37.54Macerhttp://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133044
04:37.58Maceri want to make a gaming box in that case
04:38.01Macerthat thing is awesome
04:38.05Maceri should start pricing everything
04:38.18luke-jrFacebook: "Matthew is killing the environment, one clorox spill at a time."
04:38.19luke-jrXD
04:39.09Macerphenom IIs are still using am+ right?
04:39.22Maceror do they use am3?
04:40.38ShadowJKsupposedly backwards compatible
04:40.47luke-jrMacer: most CPUs come in more than one socket
04:40.50luke-jrat least for AMD
04:41.12ShadowJK(if you can find bios upgrade for your old mobo))
04:43.15ShadowJKi've almost managed to squeeze 800 mAh out of this n800 battery now :) but it's on the edge of triggering the low alert...
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04:50.42Macerhttp://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103675
04:51.26Macerthat is not bad for that kind of processor
04:54.06Macera comparable i7 costs twice as much
04:54.07Macerwow
04:54.31luke-jr$()@*$@
04:54.39luke-jrstupid N810
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04:55.56ShadowJKcomparable? no i7 is comparable, they don't go that low
04:56.09Macerlol
04:56.22Macerthere is a 2.91GHz i7
04:56.40Macerbut.. they sell Phenom IIs that are X3?
04:56.42Macerwtf?
04:57.41ShadowJKyeah but 2.91GHz i7 has performance of a 4.5GHz phenomII, or something like that...
04:58.20Macerlol
04:58.29Maceroh cmon :) you are exagerating
04:59.15luke-jrMacer: not sure he is
04:59.21luke-jrit's quite possible
04:59.36luke-jrMacer: 3-core systems are quad-core, but with a dud core disabled
04:59.43ShadowJKcorr2quad is better comparison, and there the performance for a 225 dollar non-s c2q is similar to that phenomII
05:00.32luke-jrmy fastest system is a single-core (dual core didn't exist back then) Athlon64 3200+
05:01.25Macerluke-jr: i know but i figured they fixed their fabrication
05:01.26*** join/#maemo Meizirkki (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-fee7dc00-167.dhcp.inet.fi)
05:01.28Macerand stopped releasing those
05:01.36Macerthey seriously need to
05:01.43luke-jrMacer: uh, defects will always exist
05:01.48luke-jralways have, always will
05:01.52ShadowJKthere is no 'fix'
05:02.01luke-jrit's not cost efficient to "fix" it to be perfect
05:02.12luke-jrjust disable a core and sell it for a bit less
05:02.19Macerwell... usually defect is you have to sell it at a lower clock speed
05:02.36Macernot disable an entire core :)
05:02.49luke-jrin quad-core systems, all 4 cores need to be the same speed :p
05:03.01luke-jrso one lower spec would pull the other 3 down
05:03.04Maceri know
05:03.15luke-jrsometimes it makes better sense to just forego the fourth
05:03.29Maceri think with the amds though.. the actual core was faulty
05:03.32Macerbroken.
05:03.57Macerit is like selling a new car with a donut for a 4th tire
05:04.23*** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@nat/ibm/x-2bc032a197297c5e)
05:04.24ShadowJKsometimes they dont run correct at any acceptable speeds at acceptable voltages
05:04.48RST38xmoos
05:04.58Macerthen they should recycle them and save their company from the utter destruction it caused
05:05.01Macer:)
05:05.13Macerinstead of being stuck in 2nd rate status
05:05.14ShadowJKthere's even X2 phenomII, but I think they call them something different :)
05:05.38luke-jrMacer: some people would rather save money on 3-core than get a quad-core
05:05.43Macerhow did they find out the 4th core was broken?
05:05.52Macerdid they sell them and people noticed it wasn't working?
05:05.57RST38hluke: those people will all buy atoms now :)
05:06.06MacerRST38h: haha.. i agree :)
05:06.16ShadowJKuh, they test them all?
05:06.41Maceri see
05:06.55Macerand when they first released them. were they all X3s?
05:07.32Macerno offense. but amd should have sucked up the short term losses and shelved the X3s and released only good X4s at the time of its release
05:08.18Macernow they are forced to sell their flagship at an incredibly low price because there is a stigma about them that they make inferior products
05:08.29luke-jrMacer: the short term losses are infinite
05:08.39luke-jris there a stigma?
05:08.46Maceri think there is :)
05:08.47RST38hwhat stigma?
05:08.52luke-jrI think the people who understand a X3 is an X4 with a core disabled is few
05:09.05luke-jrand out of those who do understand it, most understand that it's just fine
05:09.06ShadowJKintel's bottleneck in meeting demand for atom was actually in testing.. they could fit shitloads of them on a disc but their testing pipeline was designed for fewer amount and yield of chips that they'd get with huge cpus like core2
05:09.26luke-jrand besides, what will they buy instead?
05:09.29luke-jrIntel does the same thing
05:10.03Macerluke-jr: but intel never released a processor with a core turned off
05:10.11RST38htesting cores for certain clock frequencies and releasing "faulty" cores with lower frequency rating is a standard practice
05:10.13Maceramd released the fight club recall car :)
05:10.36Maceryes.. with lower freqs
05:10.46Maceramd released a cpu that it was boasting about for a long time
05:10.53ShadowJKyeah x3 are nice, you get 3 good cores at discount, they're likely to overclock much better than x4 :)
05:10.53Maceron how great its quad core performance was going to be
05:10.54luke-jrMacer: Intel releases core-disabled CPUs *all the time*
05:10.55RST38hselling chips that have non-working parts with different part number is also a standard practice
05:10.59luke-jrMacer: Just like AMD
05:11.20luke-jrwhat do you think the Core Trio is?
05:11.22RST38hThe best example is probably a bunch of 68EC030 chips that were 68030 with faulty MMU
05:11.48Macerluke-jr: but it didn't release that information :) . i think broken when i think X3
05:11.54RST38hwhat is core trio?
05:12.02RST38hplease, do tell me
05:12.05luke-jrMacer: that's a problem isolated to yourself
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05:12.30Macerluke-jr: well.. i would agree with you if amd wasn't selling their top line cpus at crackhead prices to play catch up to intel
05:12.32ShadowJKinteo releases cpus with parts of cache disabled... cache takes up huge amount of die, so there's good chance defects will occur there
05:13.25Macerand i am sure the amd stock took a hit when it was discovered there was a MAJOR flaw in their destign that caused huge amounts of processors to come out as X3s instead of the quad core it was supposed to be marketed as
05:13.34Macerlet me check :)
05:13.41ian_at_synthhey, any savvy maemo mapper users/devs in here? my copy of MM just stopped being able to download Gstreet or Gsat maps for some reason, and i'm not sure how to fix it
05:15.27Macerlet's see if i can find out when amd released the phenom and people discovered they were X3s instead of what they said it was supposed to be
05:15.37ShadowJKuh, intel most likely has same rate of defects per die area as amd, amd just sells more of the good stuff instead of dumping into landfill
05:15.45RST38hAMD marketed Phenom as x3 from the beginning
05:15.55RST38hSo, folks, I am not sure what you are arguing about
05:16.50ShadowJKyep, they promised x3 and x2 parts in addition to x4 parts long before the launch
05:17.06luke-jrRST38h: I guess someone made it up
05:17.10MacerRST38h: uhm.
05:17.17luke-jrRST38h: see the disclaimer above that my fastest CPU is single-core
05:17.48Macerthe phenom was supposed to be a quad core cpu from teh beginning
05:17.53Macernot an x3
05:18.15RST38hluke: Right.
05:18.45ian_at_synthdoes maemo mapper store preferences anywhere other than the Maps directory and the /home/user/.maemo-mapper dir? i've tried deleting those directories and removing/reinstalling maemo mapper, but it still fails to download Gstreet or Gsat maps. all other map repos work...
05:18.46Macerbefore it was released amd was saying they were supposed to be quad core cpus... the only reason they released them as x3 was because there was a flaw
05:18.55luke-jrsomeone has a 40+ core CPU IIRC
05:19.13luke-jrian_at_synth: no doubt Google broke those by changing things
05:20.07ian_at_synthi just spoke to my brother, and he said he was able to download from them still...
05:20.15RST38hMacer: whatever AMD was saying before relase does not matter
05:20.46Macertell that to politicians
05:20.55luke-jrlol
05:21.01luke-jrpretty sure the politicians all know that XD
05:21.36ShadowJKamd might actually be selling cpus with 4 working cores as x3, people who've bought x3 and re-enabled the fourth core haven't been able to find anything wrong with the fourth :)
05:22.05luke-jryou can't reenable it
05:22.10luke-jrthe core is laser-cut off
05:22.45Macerhttp://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2007/07/27/amd_shows_off_phenom_at_3ghz/1
05:22.56ShadowJKthe demand for x3 was probably higher than amd thought it would be, or they get less dies with too broken cores now
05:22.59MacerIn order to prove that its soon-to-be-released Phenom processor isn.t broken...
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05:23.30RST38hShadow: When AMD says "core does not work" it may not actually mean that the core does not work at all
05:24.04RST38hShadow: All it means is that one of 10000+ tests failed on this core at the clock frequency they rated that chip at
05:24.25pupnikthe wlan icon should show signal strength
05:24.44RST38hSo, you can reenable and use it, but AMD will not guarantee that it won't screw you up in some really weird way
05:24.45pupnikmorning rst
05:24.53RST38hehlo pupnik
05:25.12pupnikmy t42p died :(
05:25.18pupnikcries
05:25.49pupnikn810 lives tho
05:26.19ShadowJKluke-jr: http://my.ocworkbench.com/2009/asrock/M3A790GXH-128M-Review/g1.htm for example
05:26.51MacerRST38h: i am telling you. the fact remains that after the phenom was released it was described as a broken cpu due to the X3 method amd used :) i am trying to track their stock in relation
05:27.40Macerfrom july it had taken 7 quarterly losses
05:27.47Macerof 2008
05:27.55ShadowJKbut they announced x3 parts well before the release...
05:27.57Macerthe actual economic mainsteram collapse occured around aug
05:28.11MacerShadowJK: and that is when their stock started taking hits
05:28.44Macerbecause the world viewed them flaunting how they were beating intel and releasing a quad core cpu ...
05:29.02Macerthen didn't deliver and released what most considered a broken cpu with the X3
05:29.34Macerif you look at a 3 or 5 year graph of their stock you will see it as they are beating intel in the cpu race
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05:29.40Macerit spikes .. then dives
05:29.47Macerafter the release of broken phenoms
05:29.59pupnikvgba still rules
05:30.01Macermaking amd non-profitable because the world shifted to intel for "quality" cpus :)
05:30.32Maceri am not saying that a phenom is a bad cpu. i think it is a good one. but they are forced to sell it at absolutely lowest pricing to push it out
05:30.44Macerwhile intel is reaping in a price tag of $400+ for theirs
05:30.48pupnikamd must survive
05:30.59RST38hor intel gets sued as a monopoly :)
05:31.07RST38hso, yes, amd should survive :)
05:31.28ShadowJKwell no, it's a bad cpu, but x3 and x2 are irrelevant in that context :p
05:31.34Macerwell... amd is in a freefall now and it all started when they finally started to beat intel in the cpu race
05:31.51Macerand released X3s and the market viewed them as broken
05:31.55pupnikmaybe ati will save amd
05:32.08Macersince they were boasting a "better than intel quad core cpu"
05:32.11Macerand did not deliver
05:32.16RST38hcan't beat intel in x86 cpu race
05:32.19Macerlike the hare that took a nap
05:32.25MacerRST38h: they could have :) they screwed up
05:32.29RST38hamd should have known
05:32.55pupnikmaybe they can innovate in power saving
05:32.58RST38hMacer: Intel simply learned a lesson and caught up, that's all
05:33.18RST38hpupnik: Transmeta and later VIA tried that
05:33.24pupnikmhm
05:33.25Maceri honestly believe if they kept the X3s under wraps and released the X4s for a while.. then said "we have these somewhat defective cpus but they work and we will sell them cheap"
05:33.27RST38hBut the fact is that users do not care about power in desktops
05:33.31johnxintel fell asleep at the wheel for years, and came back out of nowhere
05:33.39ShadowJKi don't think x3 makes a difference, with phenomII X4 amd said they'd catch up with intel, but they're still barely able to perform like low-end intel c2q, and intel i7 is far ahead...
05:33.39Macerthey should have never released the X3s in the beginning
05:33.44pupnikin eu they will begin to rst
05:33.46johnxthat's the power of having a huge amount of money to blow on R&D
05:33.55pupnikyep
05:34.19Macerthe market would have accepted it if they eased into it
05:34.38Macerbut releasing the X3s and saying the word "problem" was AMDs biggest mistake
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05:35.50RST38hpupnik: only if artifically made to care
05:35.58RST38hpupnik: like by some law
05:36.21RST38hanyways, off to work
05:36.35pupnikcheers
05:36.35luke-jrMacer: AMD didn't say "problem" :p
05:36.40ShadowJKthey never did say problem. journalists said it, along with praising amd for being clever and not dumping those cpus in landfills like intel does
05:38.01ShadowJKenthusiasts and journalists actually like the advantages x3 and x2 gives, so I have a hard time seeing it as a mistake...
05:41.04ShadowJKyou could just as well say intel q9550 ayou could just as well say intel q9550 are broken and that intel should bin them instead of charging extra for the fixed q9550s :)
05:43.30MacerAMD currently has no answer for Intel's upcoming SSE4 instructions, which may widen the performance gap further in selected applications. On the other hand, unlike Intel's quad-core parts, which are basically two dual-core CPUs using a shared bus interface, Phenom has four distinct cores, which should also offer benefits.
05:43.49Macerwashington post 2007
05:43.54Macernovember
05:44.36Macerhttp://money.cnn.com/quote/quote.html?symb=AMD&time=5yr
05:44.55Macerpoints at november 2007
05:46.21MacerHe also said the scarcity of review units was due to the complexity of a rollout that also involves the new 790FX Spider chip set and ATI 3800 series graphics cards, not because of any problem fabricating the new chips
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05:46.54Macernow mind you they had 1 month from a rollout.. and they are telling the washington post their "QUAD CORE" cpu is being released.
05:48.55luke-jrare you guys STILL going on about the core thing?
05:49.10Macerno. but i am reading about it
05:49.26luke-jromfg
05:49.31luke-jrhow hard is it to just PICK ONE AND BUY
05:49.41luke-jryou're spending more time on it than the price difference is worth
05:49.53Macerer.. i'm not :)
05:49.59Maceri already bought the phenom II
05:50.00Macerlol
05:50.05Myrttiluke-jr: is it spent from your pocket or your time?
05:50.29Macerthe discussion was really on the fact that amd released a faulty processor and sold it off and that it was seen as being broken
05:51.02Macerhttp://www.wired.com/techbiz/people/news/2007/10/rattner
05:51.04luke-jrMyrtti: well, it keeps making the channel red
05:51.18Macerthat's wired magazine's interview with intel's cto
05:51.51ProteousI'm happy with my Phenom x4
05:51.52Macer:) at the bottom he talks about amd
05:52.02MacerSo, yes, (AMD has) a four-core product. I'm sure when they looked at their yield losses, they said, "Wow, we can offer a three-core version of this if one of those cores are dead or slow or whatever it turns out to be."
05:52.19ShadowJKnow that's an unbiased person to ask :)
05:52.23Macerlol
05:52.33Macerno.. it is hard to tell if he is defending them or helping them
05:52.54Macerat the very bottom where he talks about amd's tri cores
05:53.18ShadowJKwell intel too sells with various combinations of broken cache
05:53.21Maceramd said they released them because there was a small market for quad cores haha
05:53.46MacerShadowJK: but it didn't disable the core because the cache was broken
05:53.53ShadowJKwhile amd sells also the ones with working cache but a broken core
05:54.01Macerheh
05:54.24MacerRattner: I wouldn't make that much of it. This is a yield-improvement technique, plain and simple. IBM and Sony with their Cell processor -- they have eight (processors) on that that chip, and they said, well seven is the actually the number and one is a spare, or one is dead
05:54.28ShadowJKbecause both do the broken cache thing nobody thinks about it anymore
05:54.37Macerlook at that.. bitchslapped 3 competitors with one statement
05:54.42Macerthat guy is my hero :)
05:55.05Macerand even makes it look like he is being nice when really he is saying "our shit is less broken than theirs"
05:55.09Macerhaha
05:55.40ShadowJKhe isn't saying or implying that though :)
05:56.00Maceri don't know. it looks like he picked his words very carefully for that one
05:56.13Macerwhere he doesn't want to come off as arrogant but still wants to bitchslap the other guys
05:57.23Maceri mean if you read into it... he is saying "sure.. sometimes things aren't perfect.. but ibm and sony are selling dead cell processors and amd is releasing something that can't compete against us since it's also broken"
05:57.50ShadowJKhe's probably jelous intel didn't think of it first :) but that might also be because intel didn't have any genuine 4core cpus
05:58.08Macerlol.. i suppose not.. but still he was probably clicking his heels after that interview
05:58.45Macerhe just got put into the #2 spot of Macer's hero list... bill gates is still #1
05:59.40ShadowJKthey glue together 2 dual cores, so that gives them higher yields at cost of performance, but they're so far ahead it doesnt matter if they're 50 or 55 percent faster :)
05:59.56Macerlol
06:00.36Maceryeah i suppose they aren't "spider" tech.. but they were doing pretty well with that method
06:00.53Macerlike i said. i think amd produces some awesome processors .. but that X3... it just left a bad taste
06:01.24Proteous...
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06:01.53johnxah the aeshetics of choosing a CPU :)
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06:02.07ProteousI go by price mostly...
06:02.39johnxsame here. usually I end up buying the mobo+cpu special of the week when it looks good enough
06:02.44Proteousheh
06:02.45Proteousyeah
06:02.58johnxbut I might not upgrade my desktop anymore at this rate
06:03.02Proteouswhy doesn't anyone make true vertical LCDs
06:03.05Macerever buy an X3? :)
06:03.11ProteousI have an X4
06:03.18Macerwhy not the X3?
06:03.26Proteousalmost got an X3 but newegg had a crazy deal on the X4 that I got
06:03.31johnxMacer, I'll wait until there is a fry's or newegg special on an x3+mobo :)
06:03.32Proteousended up being cheaper
06:03.43ShadowJKtheinquirer has high praize for x3 saying it's the most exciting thing for enthusiasts in many years :)
06:04.00Macerinquirer?
06:04.10Proteousheh
06:04.12Macerisn't that a tabloid?
06:04.21Proteousthat's enquierer
06:04.23Proteousor whatever
06:04.25ShadowJKno
06:04.28Macerah .. :) i see
06:04.32Proteousbut yeah, inquirer almost is
06:04.37MacerProteous: haha
06:05.01Maceris everything ok in the world of nokia?
06:05.11ShadowJKnow nvidia on the other hand has a real defect issue on hand
06:05.13Proteousno, my n97 hasn't arrived yet
06:05.24ProteousI have a friend who works at Nvidia
06:05.29Macerdoes the n97 support tmob?
06:05.32Macer3G?
06:05.34Proteousno
06:05.36Macerdamnit
06:05.37Macer:)
06:05.41Proteousnothing does except special Tmobile phones
06:05.42ljpMacer: just peachy
06:06.01MacerProteous: that sucks... i want an n9x that supports tmob already
06:06.02ShadowJKalmost all their chips from the last few years are dying (physically)
06:06.14Proteousthey use the standard 1900 and 2100 freq but in a different way
06:06.23Maceri thought they used 1700
06:06.28Proteousnot compatable with your normal 3g phones that work on ATT
06:06.43Proteouswho can remember numbers
06:06.45Proteousgah
06:06.50Macerheh
06:06.52ProteousI'd have to look it up to double check
06:06.57Macerworks with their edge :-\
06:06.58Proteousbut it still won't work :P
06:07.00Proteousyeah
06:07.02Macerbut that's just not cutting it
06:07.03Proteousworks with edge
06:07.17Maceri take my n95 when i don't need to do net stuff.. like taking my son to the park
06:07.20Proteousit's sad, tmobile has better data plans
06:07.21Macerit takes awesome photos and video
06:07.23Proteouscries
06:07.27Maceryeah they sure do
06:07.35Maceri *HATE* att :)
06:08.16Macerif i am ever in my lifetime in a position to buy them out and sell them at a loss i would do it
06:08.16Proteousand tmobile is putting up a new tower 1000 feet from my house...
06:08.16Macerhaha
06:08.24Maceryou might as well run a cat6 cable to it
06:08.27Proteouslol
06:09.02Maceri like my G1.. android isn't too bad.. but man i LOVE my n95 and wish it woudl work with tmob's 3G
06:09.24Proteousthere's always the palm preeeeeeee
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06:09.44Maceri wouldn't buy a thing that has Web in its OS name :)
06:09.47Proteouslol
06:10.05ProteousI almost got a G1 but I wanted a higher rez screen
06:10.07Macerthe gigabyte n810 wannabe seemed nice tho
06:10.16Proteousand something with a battery that lasts more then 4 hours
06:10.17MacerProteous: yeah. it's pretty low
06:10.25MacerProteous: you can get an extended battery for it
06:10.29Proteousyeah
06:10.37ProteousI was mostly joking about the battery part
06:10.42Macerthey have a 2600mah for $50 from some company that lasts like 48 hours
06:10.50Macerbut it bulks up your phone :)
06:10.55ProteousI bet
06:11.17Proteousyou could make one that fits in a special belt that is connected to the phone by a cord
06:11.21Macerbut i seriously love my n95 .. i want 3G on it with tmob :(
06:11.31Proteousreally?
06:11.33Proteousyou don't say
06:11.50Macerhave you used an n97?
06:11.52Proteousno querty for ssh == no good
06:12.00Macerhaha
06:12.04Maceryeah that does kind of suck
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06:12.10Macerbut there's always an su9w bt keyboard ;)
06:12.16Macer8w
06:12.23Proteoushard to use while walking down the street
06:12.34ShadowJKe70 is the best for ssh :)
06:12.35Maceri don't ssh while walking down teh street ;)
06:12.50Proteousif you want to see 4 letters at at time sure
06:12.54Maceri wanted the n95 more for the video capabilities than anything
06:13.00Proteousthen you are not l337 Macer
06:13.01Proteouslol
06:13.02Macerwell.. and the 3G :)
06:13.04Macerhaha
06:13.10Proteousheh
06:13.21ProteousI use ssh for my IM and email
06:13.21Macerand the cam
06:13.31Proteousso it's important
06:13.37Maceryou use it for IM? :) why not just use an app on the phone?
06:13.52Macerfor both actually
06:14.22Proteousbecause I can have a persistant IM/irc session that runs on a server that I can connect to from wherever I can get a ssh session, which is anywhere
06:14.28Proteousit's very usefull
06:14.38Macerspeaking of n95.. i need to use it tomorrow so i should swap the sim out
06:14.42Proteousssh+screen+irssi+bitlbee
06:15.04Proteous+mutt
06:15.06Proteousheh
06:15.30locutusits a bummer that the n810 has no alt key :-/
06:15.31Macertoday is thurs? wtf?
06:15.34locutusmakes Emacs unusable for me
06:15.52Proteousmakes irssi more dificult to use as well
06:16.11Proteousalthough you can haxor the keyboard to add one I belive
06:16.18locutusalso, no pipe
06:16.19Proteousnever tried myself
06:16.19locutuswtf
06:16.30ShadowJKnone of them have esc/alt :(
06:17.36ShadowJKbut i guess you have esc in xterm on the touchscreen of n810 and pipe is addable there
06:17.44Macerhm. i haven't gotten paid yet. wtf
06:17.51Macerwill give them til 2
06:17.59Maceri'm on sick leave so my pay has gotten strange
06:18.33Proteousthen you will put strychnine in the guacamole
06:18.44ShadowJKi found a cheap bt keyboard, but I find i only use it occasionally, even with n800
06:19.15Proteousa BT keyboard sorta defeats the purpouse of having a tablet for me
06:19.37ShadowJKi discovered I have insufficient number of hands for holding both keyboard and device :)
06:19.41Proteouslol
06:19.42MacerProteous: i couldn't stand pecking at my n800 anymore
06:19.53Proteoussome sort of belt mounted stand
06:19.59Proteousthen you could ssh while walking down the street
06:20.11Macerespecially after i got a g1 and used the qwerty for a while
06:20.16Proteousand with a keyboard mounted to your crotch you'd be soooo l337
06:20.35MacerProteous: i always figured that someone would make pressure gloves
06:20.37Macer:)
06:20.46ProteousI had a 770, wasn't too fond of the OSK
06:20.49Macerwhere you walk down the street typing with your hands
06:20.58ShadowJKoddly my n810 is on the desk and im using n800... the touchscreen on it annoys me less
06:20.58Macerand have your phone hooked up into glasses that give you a hud
06:21.04ProteousI also wasn't too fond of the WSOD
06:21.09Proteousheh
06:21.17Macerwhy hasn't anybody made hud glasses yet?
06:21.28Proteousheh
06:21.29Macerthey can't be that hard to make
06:21.34ShadowJKthere are hud glasses
06:21.39Macerare there ??
06:21.46Proteousbecause it's not easy, and there isn't much of a market for it, and they give you a nasty headache
06:21.56MacerShadowJK: are they huge?
06:21.59ShadowJKi've seen them mentioned in context of beagleboard
06:22.00Macerlike 5" thick or something?
06:22.02Proteousheh, yes
06:22.08Macerdamn :)
06:22.18Macersomeone needs to make them the size of normal glasses
06:22.19Macerhaha
06:22.36ShadowJKa bit thicker than sunglasses it looked like on the photos
06:22.39Macerpictures having a phone in his glasses
06:22.54Maceroakley makes mp3 glasses.. why not hud? cmon oakley!
06:23.04Macerwtf
06:23.05Proteousfrom yesterday: http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/05/19/1734244
06:23.45MacerI have been awaiting a lightweight, head-mounted display that actually has decent resolution and doesn't look like a brick tied to your face
06:23.48Macerhahahaha
06:23.55Proteoushehe
06:24.28ShadowJKthey're all low res :(
06:24.56Macerwow
06:24.56johnxhmm, there was one that didn't look bad to me
06:25.04Macerthose wrap 920s are pretty awesome
06:25.06johnxyou looked at it by glancing down
06:25.08ShadowJKfor tv and video, i guess
06:25.21MacerComing Fall of 2009
06:25.27Macerhe is right though. the res is too low
06:25.36Macerbut those might be awesome for a phone. how do they get the video?
06:25.43johnxdepends on what you want to use it for
06:26.24ShadowJKcomposite probably
06:26.28johnxa heads up gps, weather/time, incoming mail/msg/call kind of thing wouldn't be bad
06:26.39Macerjohnx: no it wouldn't
06:27.01Macerwonder how much those will cost
06:27.03Maceri want some :)
06:27.04johnx320x240 for some arrows and text with lots of antialiasing
06:27.08ShadowJKwhat can you get out of the video out on highend nokias, svideo and composite?
06:27.26Macer640x480 is kind of crappy but
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06:27.40MacerShadowJK: i have never tried it
06:27.42ShadowJKlots of aliasing you mean? :)
06:27.44johnxhttp://www.myvu.com/Myvyu-Shades-C25.aspx <- these look a lot goofier on him then I pictured they would :/
06:28.14Macerlol!
06:28.19Maceryeah they do
06:28.25johnxheh, well the aliasing is free, the antialiasing is user provided ;P
06:28.43Macerthe wrap looks a lot more realistic
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06:28.50johnxhe might just be a goofy looking guy though :D
06:29.06johnxthe thing is I want a glance down interface, not something covering my whole field of vision
06:30.01pupnikcool
06:32.43ShadowJKand they must be indistinguishable from normal glasses so your boss doesn't realize you're watching simpsons
06:33.25johnxstill, this stuff is a lot closer than it was 10 years ago :D
06:34.00pupniktaking too long.   govt  thieving capital.  not enough tech investment
06:34.02johnxI remember looking at it in 1999/2000 and it cost more than I paid for my current car ...
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08:06.23JaffaMorning, all
08:06.53sanjay6976morning
08:07.19sanjay6976af-sb-init.sh command not found
08:07.22sanjay6976hi
08:07.27Stskeepsmorning jaffaf
08:07.28Stskeeps-f
08:08.05sanjay6976i am getting an error af-sb-init.sh command not found
08:08.54sanjay6976in DIABLO_ARMEL while giving af-sb-init.sh start
08:09.11MacerThe shift supervisor then deceived the radiation control supervisor and entered the room of the incident and possibly attempted to pour the solution down a floor drain, causing a large nuclear reaction that irradiated the shift supervisor with a fatal dose of radiation. The shift supervisor's actions are the subject of a Darwin Award.[11]
08:09.32Macerlol
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08:25.46MacerCherenkov radiation is produced by charged particles which are travelling through a dielectric substance at a speed greater than the speed of light in that medium.
08:25.50Macerwtf
08:27.18pupnik#physics
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08:42.56lcuk2what dates are the summit on again
08:43.49Stskeepsoctober, start
08:43.52Stskeepsi think
08:44.08yerga9-11?
08:44.15yergaof october I mean
08:44.30Stskeepsyeah
08:45.07lcuk2got it \o thx
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10:04.46lardmanmorning
10:12.22pupnikhi lardster
10:12.48pupnikpasses out lard to all
10:20.15lardmangets the bacon frying
10:20.30lardmanpupnik: you're first in line don't worry
10:21.09lcukonly because you have bacon fat introvenously
10:28.21robtaylormmm. introveinous bacon
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10:34.02lardmanmight have to be lardons so they can travel through the valves
10:34.11lardmansmall lardons at that
10:45.05VDVsxhow should we test the application suggested here: http://wiki.maemo.org/Accelerometers ?
10:45.39VDVsxI don't have the device :P
10:46.20lcukdidnt someone have a usb one plugged in?   and isnt craves1 working on some addin for it
10:47.21lcukdoes the wiimote driver work, or can it be jimmied to supply values on that same /sys/class branch?
10:48.42VDVsxwell, it's using the future d-bus accelerometer interface, so I think is fremantle specific
10:49.42lcukok, but if we could hackup the wiimote stack to fake it but using the same location and values as the expected future stuff then it would work wouldnt it?
10:50.06lcuki remember looking at wiimote stuff a couple of years ago and the params that the wiki page says looks pretty similar to all that stuff
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10:50.32VDVsxif we can plug some kinda of acceleromter to the SDK, we probably can test this feature, or probably not, letme check :P
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10:51.15lcukwhat does i2c-adapter mean
10:51.32lcukcos google is giving me results from lots of places
10:51.40lcuknot accel specific
10:51.59VDVsxis a path
10:52.02lcukahhhhh
10:52.05lcuk"The I2C bus helps you monitor the health of your system"
10:52.27lcukso its a generic input device - for fans and temp and stuff as wlel
10:53.06VDVsxwhere normally are some kinda o hardware sensors, bluetooth, leds
10:53.18lcukopenmoko has accel :O
10:53.27VDVsxyes two
10:53.45lcukkewl
10:54.14VDVsxapparently the same model that the fremantle device will have
10:56.11VDVsxanyway gonna ask on talk, if there is some magic way to test the stuff on that page or it is just for the luck ones with the device :P
10:56.49lcukVDVsx, do you still have your openmoko
10:56.56lcukand does it still work
10:57.15VDVsxlcuk, yes :P
10:57.36lcukhave you considered getting mer onto it and testing this yourself
10:57.47lcukdoes mer even work on it now, i know there was noises
10:59.02Macerwhich openmoko device do you have?
10:59.04pupnikok, flash is getting the boot
10:59.58Macera dash or something?
10:59.58VDVsxlcuk, appear that the d-bus api is closed yet, at least I don't found anything in the repos
11:00.13lcukthen go to the fs
11:00.15VDVsxMacer, nop GTA-02, neo freerunner
11:01.01Macerhow is the freerunner?
11:01.29StskeepsVDVsx: know of a decent firmware where gps and such works on the freerunner? :P
11:02.51Macerstares at the debug boar
11:02.52Macerboard
11:02.58VDVsxStskeeps, last time I used my device, everything worked, are you talking about the kernel image right ?
11:03.05Stskeepsnot sure
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11:03.37VDVsxMacer, have some problems, and a big lack of decent software :P
11:04.04Stskeepsand it being armv4t just makes it more difficult :P
11:06.09VDVsxStskeeps, you probably can used the FSO stack to test/debug the harware, is available in the debian repos
11:06.19*** join/#maemo pupnik (n=user@pD95FE605.dip.t-dialin.net)
11:07.02pupnikmytube needs sort-by-date
11:07.33lcuki thought tubes were sorted by date anyway
11:07.36lcukfirst in first out
11:08.46rm_youalright headed to WA, bbl :)
11:08.58rm_yousee yall from another state ^_^
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11:21.29VDVsxhumm, a maemo developer competition on the DK weekend, should be fun :P
11:29.59lcukVDVsx, i keep pondering that
11:30.20lcukis there a page
11:30.50VDVsxlcuk, go for it, the prize is a nxxx :P
11:31.03lcuklink
11:31.25VDVsx1 sec, I'm joking about the prize
11:31.59VDVsxlcuk, http://wiki.maemo.org/Mozilla_Maemo_Danish_Weekend#Schedule
11:32.12VDVsxat the end of the section
11:32.18lcuk:D nokia nxxx edition is endororsed by sasha grey
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11:33.50lcukheh, since its "some hacker competition"
11:34.26lcukshould i push for "coolest new microapp in liqbase" ;)
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11:36.39VDVsxlcuk, heheh
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11:50.57lcukjeremiah_hacking, i hope you dont have a facemask on
11:53.05jeremiah_hackingeh?
11:53.54lcukif you are hacking you dont wanna look like jason
11:54.11jeremiah_hacking:P
11:54.27jeremiah_hackingI know what you did last summer!
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11:55.56oDudahello all !
11:55.56lcuk:O yeah, i wrote liqbase lol
11:56.20lcukhello oDuda \o
11:56.35oDudasomebody knows about cards life using as virtual memory on NIT ?
11:56.53oDudahello lcuk ! hows ?
11:57.39lcukoDuda, obviously lots of writing to a card isnt good (its not good for hard disks either..)
11:57.53lcukbut the price of them is such that as long as you have backups i wouldnt worry
11:58.59oDudalcuk: sure... i worry on these cards during less than 1 one year...
11:59.31oDudalcuk: is that the case ?
11:59.47lcukoDuda, you should worry about all online media storage after 1 minute.  the lifespan of anything is not 100% certain
12:00.03lcukyou can break a new harddrive within minutes
12:00.08jeremiah_hackingI wish lcuk wasn't right, but he is.
12:00.18lcukor the same one could last for decades
12:00.26jeremiah_hackingbackups are key
12:00.36oDudahahahaha this subject affects all the people....
12:01.15lcukjeremiah_hacking, fact of life.  if you assume failure from day one you are protected (without going overboard)
12:01.35jeremiah_hackingYes.
12:01.38jeremiah_hackingIndeed.
12:01.54jeremiah_hackingFrog.
12:01.57lcuktries to be a defensive programmer :)
12:02.00oDudalcuk: thanks... if its will during or not.. i think that the virtual memory is needed  to avoid against on time crashes too...
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12:02.16lcukyes i agree
12:02.33oDudawith me ?
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12:02.45lcukyes, put the vm on lol
12:03.12oDudayeah just using the 128 that comes with N800 as VM...
12:03.26oDuda128 mb card...
12:04.05oDudato use 128mb is a bit little... so ... that will be a vm memory... hehe
12:04.08lcuki didnt know the n800 came with anything, i know it had slots
12:04.20timeless_mbpthey're teasers
12:04.26lcukdidnt think the n800 was a computer ;)
12:04.28timeless_mbpthe 770 came w/ 64mb
12:04.32oDudait cames with a 128mb card...
12:04.38lcukahh enough to get you started
12:04.57timeless_mbpiirc the n800's was actually mini w/ a mini->sd adapter
12:04.58oDudayes... but i put a new 4gb on it too... so...
12:05.09timeless_mbpbut i could be wrong, it's been a while
12:05.14derftimeless_mbp: It wasn't.
12:05.36timeless_mbp128mb full size? oh well
12:05.47oDudano ! 128mb mini...
12:05.54derfI assumed it was old stock they couldn't sell any more.
12:06.10timeless_mbplooks between oDuda and derf ...
12:06.14timeless_mbpis confused
12:06.40oDudaohhhhh at all pages that i saw... the 128mb card follow the product..
12:06.51lcukdoes it matter - its a small card easily replaced
12:07.18lcuktimeless, dont be confused, it puts you off working :P
12:07.26timeless_mbpthat's irc ;-)
12:08.00timeless_mbpcries
12:08.03timeless_mbphttp://www.nokiausa.com/buy-online/accessories
12:08.10timeless_mbphover over "Recommender"
12:08.12timeless_mbpis it a link?
12:08.14oDudaand about to setting the VM in N800... the max is 12X mb ?
12:08.49timeless_mbpthe ui max might have been
12:09.03timeless_mbpin practice, linux and vm isn't such a wonderful combination
12:09.11oDudayes... and hacking conf file is possible ?
12:09.19oDudano ?
12:09.21timeless_mbpin general you'll find that it's really one app that needs all the vm
12:09.34timeless_mbpand in that case, you'll end up swapping to death
12:09.48oDudadeath ?
12:09.54timeless_mbpthe win is mostly in paging out all the other stupid apps that you aren't using
12:10.00lcuktimeless_mbp, you remember your stress page
12:10.07timeless_mbp128mb of vm for the apps you aren't using, 128mb for your one app
12:10.19timeless_mbplcuk: we were testing and talking about it this week
12:10.19timeless_mbp:)
12:10.30timeless_mbpwhy do you ask? :)
12:10.42timeless_mbpthe page is timeless :)
12:10.50lcukheh cool, well ive been thinking about it as well and with something ive done i think it would be possible to browse it from tablet :)
12:11.07timeless_mbpi tried using it to test the next Images app
12:11.14timeless_mbpevery single step of that test failed *miserably*
12:11.23lcukits similar in theory to the graffiti wall
12:11.31timeless_mbp(starting w/ just downloading the page)
12:11.54timeless_mbpnods
12:12.04lcukwhat the graffiti wall does (and my cells in general) is each cell holds the filename and only if that cell is requested to be rendered does the image get loaded
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12:12.17timeless_mbpnods
12:12.27lcukso when i show the wall only the first 12 sketches/images are loaded
12:12.29oDudatimeless_mbp: should i turn the VM off in N800 ?
12:12.33lcukbut then as scrolled they are loaded
12:12.41lcukhave you seen the playtest for liqbase yet
12:12.47lcukthe new new one
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12:13.08lcukcos that has the effect visible on the maemo users tiled images wall
12:13.23timeless_mbpoDuda: i'm not saying that
12:13.29timeless_mbpi'm just saying it isn't a panacea
12:13.38lcukoDuda, turn it on, forget about it
12:13.43oDudai hate panaceas...
12:13.44lcukif everything dies replace card
12:13.46oDudatoo..hehe
12:13.47lcukbe happy, dont stress
12:13.52timeless_mbpi'm saying don't spend too much time thinking about it
12:14.01oDudapanaceas to me is useless too..
12:14.10timeless_mbpi think w/ most things on the n800 the right answer is "turn it on to the max, and forget about it"
12:14.20timeless_mbpe.g. browser cache which ships w/ the smallest size
12:14.24timeless_mbp= stupid :)
12:14.33thuxoDuda: i use swap and got better uptime less reboots
12:14.37oDudayou are right timeless
12:14.49timeless_mbpoDuda: mostly depressed
12:14.55lcuki leave my n800 idle and charging and get amazing uptime
12:15.24oDudahahahahahaha... idle without uptime...
12:15.33oDudaboot uptime...
12:15.39oDudatime to bootup...
12:16.15oDudawhere is all ?
12:16.26lcukanyway timeless, ill carry on pondering stress  :P
12:16.33timeless_mbplcuk: some advice
12:16.40timeless_mbp1. have you seen cooliris?
12:16.42lcukputs it on a back burner
12:16.58timeless_mbp2. you don't want to load "just what you see"
12:17.11timeless_mbpyou want to load "what you should see" and "what you are likely to want to see next"
12:17.37lcukiris wont work well on stress though
12:17.43oDudathe society is like that...
12:17.44lcukyou have to wait for entire thing to load properly surely
12:17.57lcuki agree about loading future items as well
12:18.27timeless_mbplcuk: to be honest, i've never really used iris
12:18.29lcukthe old graffiti view used idle time to automatically load the next sketches
12:18.38lcukthe video looks right
12:18.47lcukfor pre-stored content it looks amazing
12:19.11lcukbut there has to be a large cost in loading those textures over the pcix or agp bus in the first place
12:19.59lcukso yeah - you can have an entire super wall rotatable but it doesnt look like  its got google earth type  stitching etc
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12:23.38oDudahey jegp i am jecp hehe...
12:23.59lcukbbl
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12:24.08oDudahb lcuk
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12:28.17timeless_mbpfinally installs iris
12:30.17oDudairis is what ?
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12:34.50oDudairis is for win ?
12:39.11thuxhttp://www.iris.edu/seismon/
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12:39.59timeless_mbphttp://www.cooliris.com/
12:40.09timeless_mbpit works on linux and osx
12:40.25pupnik_browsing does seem much snappier with flashplugin removed
12:40.38timeless_mbppupnik_: which platform?
12:41.34pupnik_maemo
12:42.33timeless_mbppupnik_: note that our browser has one of the simplest ui's for toggling flash out of the box of any browser i've met
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12:43.58oDudathux: thank you... very cool aplication... run at n800 ?
12:44.40lcuktimeless, whenever this subject comes up, i wonder what the mileage of a generic clicktoview (like flashblock) would be that is binary standard plugin and doesnt depend on processing the entire js page searching for stuff the browser has already processed and identified as plugin
12:45.02lcuk^reprocessing
12:45.17timeless_mbpshrugs
12:45.26lcukheh
12:45.26timeless_mbpthere have been a couple of plugin spy impls
12:45.36timeless_mbpthey basically do passthrough service to real plugins
12:45.51timeless_mbpit's certainly technically possible to take one of those and have it do something /slightly/ more interesting
12:45.55timeless_mbp(i.e. click to play)
12:46.10lcukyeah i did some  deep investigation on firefox/flashblock and found a whole load of limitations and things which could be done quicker
12:46.15timeless_mbppersonally, when i use firefox, i don't mind that noscript is blocking things for me
12:46.18timeless_mbpthe perf doesn't matter
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12:46.33timeless_mbpyou're looking at it from the wrong perspective
12:46.43timeless_mbpif you load a page and don't need th
12:46.46timeless_mbperr
12:46.56timeless_mbpimagine you visit http://stupid.example.com/
12:47.04timeless_mbpit can take 10s to load the page w/o images
12:47.07timeless_mbp10s to load the images
12:47.13timeless_mbp10s to load a flash applet
12:47.21timeless_mbpnow imagine that you don't need the images or flash applet
12:47.36timeless_mbpimagine it cost you 9s for a script to prevent you from getting the flash and images
12:47.44timeless_mbp19s is still cheaper than 20s or 30s
12:48.17lcukbut 10s to get and process the page and add the clicker is even better than 19s
12:48.47lcukand that works generically no matter what page size
12:48.50lcukand for all media types
12:48.56lcukthat req a plugin
12:49.18lcukalso - for that extra 9 seconds the flash might actually be running
12:49.27lcuk(as it does using flashblock on firefox)
12:50.12timeless_mbppuzzles
12:50.17timeless_mbpthat's not my experience w/ noscript
12:50.22timeless_mbpdoesn't use flashblock
12:50.35lcukflashblock runs AFTER the page has been loaded, the flash is instentiated and runs and only gets replaced after
12:50.39timeless_mbpw/ noscript, the flash apps afaict are never instantiated until i click on them, not even downloaded
12:50.40lcukyeah maybe
12:50.46timeless_mbptry switching
12:51.30lcukmost sites i visit have js tho and its useful
12:51.45lcuki dont want to have to unblock each individually
12:51.50timeless_mbptries to kill safari
12:52.08timeless_mbpnoscript can default to letting the main site's js run
12:52.18timeless_mbpand you typically whitelist domains
12:52.24timeless_mbpreally, give it a try
12:52.27lcukcool, ill give it a try then
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13:16.19timeless_mbphey, i was productive at work today!
13:16.45Stskeepsi'm not sure why wally from dilbert suddenly appeared in front of my eyes
13:17.51RST38hDoes he have any messages for you?
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13:18.09StskeepsRST38h: http://dilbert.com/fast/2009-04-09/
13:18.19Stskeeps;)
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13:21.56timeless_mbppersonally, i prefer http://dilbert.com/fast/2009-04-05/
13:22.55Stskeepshehe
13:25.30timeless_mbpthis is of course nice: http://dilbert.com/fast/2009-04-19/
13:25.35timeless_mbpbut i haven't fought him in a while
13:26.35timeless_mbphttp://dilbert.com/fast/2009-04-23/
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13:27.51Stskeepstimeless_mbp: you'd want to see the next one, and wonder if that applies to nokia cameras :P
13:28.24timeless_mbpi'm going to pretend that on the advice of my lawyer i neither look at nor comment on any such item
13:28.25timeless_mbp:)
13:29.01suihkulokkiI'm so happy there is no culture of rebates in the shops in northern europe :P
13:29.12timeless_mbpsuihkulokki: they're called expense reports
13:29.29timeless_mbpand i think at this point i've failed to collect between 2,000 and 5,000 EUR
13:30.12timeless_mbphttp://dilbert.com/fast/2009-04-28/
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13:31.51timeless_mbphttp://dilbert.com/fast/2009-05-03/
13:33.16timeless_mbphttp://dilbert.com/fast/2009-05-08/
13:33.55Stskeepsand there went timeless_mbp's productivity ;)
13:34.03timeless_mbpyeah well... http://dilbert.com/fast/2009-05-10/
13:34.17timeless_mbpi only have 20 patches to put into bugs (must file first)
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13:36.42Stskeepsheh.. i think my idle time in cph will be used to file bugs towards maemo really - we have started cleaning up our act so we can now see where our fixes are :P
13:37.00timeless_mbpcph?
13:37.09timeless_mbpspeaking of bugs
13:37.10Stskeepsyeah, the danish developer weekend? :P
13:37.12timeless_mbpcan you file a bug for me?
13:37.26Stskeepspossibly
13:37.35Stskeepsare you banned from bugtracker by now? ;)
13:37.59timeless_mbpmy results aren't improving w/ time
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13:47.13andrewfblackhello
13:47.57Stskeepslo andrewfblack
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13:53.46andrewfblackjust released some new screenshots of minimalist theme
13:56.28RST38handrew: itt?
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13:57.03fiferboylbt: I played around with some default values in QAbstractScrollArea last night
13:57.30RST38handrew: do make menu bar smaller
13:57.49RST38handrew: the same size as the Welcome bar, with the same font, different background color so that it stands out
13:58.47RST38handrew: lines separating categories are ugly, why not use the same white bars as used in the stats at the bototm of the same screenshot?
13:59.14lbtfiferboy: any suggestions?
13:59.14RST38hEdit|Quote|Quick Reply should be in much smaller font
13:59.30RST38hThere is no need for word "Reply" under "Testing"
13:59.54fiferboylbt: VMAX at 500 and DECEL_PC at 93 work REALLY nicely for me.
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14:00.41fiferboyI also tried SENSITIVITY at 6 (like in h-p-a) but it was too sensitive.  20 seems good to me.
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14:07.55timeless_mbpfwiw, i just tested cooliris on stress
14:08.02timeless_mbpit can't keep up for an initial pan :(
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14:12.01lbtfiferboy: OK... I'll change them here ... thanks
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14:12.15fiferboyNo problem.
14:12.57fiferboyI was just trying out the finger scrolling withint scratchbox, and the deceleration looks AMAZING when the system is fast enough for it.
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14:13.35fiferboyIt looks nice enough on the tablet, but you can tell (at least with my application) that it is struggling a bit
14:13.45pupnikany tricks to get mplayer to handle toutube HD video?
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14:21.08Macerhm. watching a special on chernobyl
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14:29.31fiferboylbt: I just added some quick code to theme all scrollbars (for fingerscroll areas) like Fremantle
14:29.52lbtooh
14:30.16lbtmail me a patch?
14:30.54fiferboylbt: Will do.  We could either have it on all the time (ie for Diablo as well) or put some Frementle IFDEFs around it.
14:31.18lbthow about basing it on a dynamic property
14:31.38lbtand defaulting on/off based o ifdefs
14:32.06fiferboylbt: That sounds good.  I would like to use it in birdlist, so I could turn it on.  Works for me.
14:33.20fiferboyI notice you set a "FingerScrollable" property, so we could do it like that.
14:33.32lbtyep
14:34.22fiferboyOkay, I will change my code to use that before I send it off
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14:44.42RST38hMeanwhile: http://jrioni.blogspot.com/
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14:50.37fiferboylbt: Your "FingerScrollable" property just works on a widget-by-widget basis, right?
14:50.52fiferboyHow do I get a global property for the entire application?
14:52.22lbtqApp ?
14:52.36fiferboyAwesome.
14:52.36lbt:D
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14:57.35andrewfblackRST38h: to make you and qgil happy I lowered the font size of reply links and main menu links
15:00.18andrewfblackanyone go any input for minimalist theme?
15:01.48lbtit's too dark?
15:02.02*** join/#maemo gomiam (n=magao@84.79.25.26)
15:02.05andrewfblackdid you look at new screenshots?
15:02.08jeremiah_hackingandrewfblack: I will take a look, where is the URL again?
15:02.23lbtshouldn't poke the lions....
15:02.25jeremiah_hackingI like minimal
15:02.34andrewfblackwill have to look at screenshots on this posthttp://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=289040#post289040
15:03.12*** join/#maemo flo_lap (n=fuchs@f049038042.adsl.alicedsl.de)
15:03.47jeremiah_hackingandrewfblack: I like it. I will use it.
15:03.51lbtlooks good to me... qgil is right about the Edit/Quote text
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15:04.05jeremiah_hackingThanks for doing all that work.
15:04.40andrewfblackjeremiah_hacking: no complaints at all?
15:04.55andrewfblacklbt: Yeah I lowered them
15:05.01jeremiah_hackingandrewfblack: None. Not a single one.
15:05.11jeremiah_hackingandrewfblack: Well, will it make me sexier?
15:05.19jeremiah_hackingIf not then I have to complain.
15:06.07*** join/#maemo Dar (n=Dar_K@nat/sun/x-802ee1395ed42040)
15:08.33andrewfblacklol
15:08.49andrewfblackjeremiah_hacking: minimalist themes always make you sexier
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15:17.05lcukjeremiah_hacking, you STILL hacking? :D
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15:21.17timeless_mbpkinda defeats a bug
15:21.25timeless_mbptoday was an officially productive day at work
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15:27.45jeremiah_hackinglcuk: About to stop. :P
15:31.23fiferboylbt: Do you have to register properties somewhere?
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15:34.11fiferboyArg, I think I know my problem.  I am not building my program against the modfied library version.
15:35.08lopzhola
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15:40.47qgilhi there is Luke Dashjr or Stskeeps around=?
15:40.59luke-jr…
15:41.23qgilhi, about https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4380
15:41.49qgilis Mer able to circunvent the fact that the GPS driver expects a "user" user?
15:43.10luke-jrqgil: gpsdriver aborts when getpwnam fails
15:44.11qgiland can't there be a "user" user created in the system to make that driver happy? luke-jr ?
15:45.49luke-jrshrug. my goal is to replace gpsdriver with something open. these problems are just the method I am focusing on at the moment before more complex methods.
15:46.08qgilluke-jr: I guess you see the technical difficulties of playing with such driver... but it looks like you are overseeing that complications of opening it up
15:46.32luke-jris it that complex if TI IPR is stripped out?
15:47.11qgilluke-jr: how do you strip IPR out? Is not that simple.
15:47.47luke-jrif it's TI IPR, then presumably it preexists the Nokia code around it and can be identified easily?
15:48.00luke-jror is this more of a NDA-type issue?
15:48.44Jaffaqgil: I'm not such I can speak for Stskeeps or others, but the intention of h-a-m patches I submitted was to remove Maemo-isms like "user" from code running on Mer, as the first thing it does - as an OS - is ask what user you want to create; and that the packages are intended to run on relatively arbitrary systems
15:49.44Jaffaqgil: It would seem pretty horrible to have a *standard* "user" user, but perhaps a "gpsdriver-compat" package (which is open) could add the `user' account if a) gpsdriver can't be replaced; b) gpsdriver can't be changed to be programmed more flexibly or c) something else I've just forgotten
15:49.46qgilJaffa: and I understand that, but hopefully it is understandable that being able to user the Maemo binaries 'as is' in unofficial releases is already good enough
15:50.01Jaffanods
15:50.37lcukqgil quick question, in the bug report you mention that inside the gps driver there is code for uploading this info the nokias servers?  do we have any documentation on when this occurs or how to disable it?
15:50.53JaffaMight it be worth trying to get a Nokia policy change on future developments to not assume things like /home/user
15:50.56luke-jrlcuk: that's is supl-daemon I think
15:51.08fiferboylbt: Have you tested your FingerScrollable dynamic property?
15:51.15lbtno
15:51.40lcukok, just stuck out, the raw driver listens and decodes gps signals, it shouldnt ever need to talk ot or know about anything else
15:51.41fiferboyI don't see where anything is connected to when an application changes the property.
15:51.43qgilJaffa: do you mind making a enhancement request, or pointing me to any already filed?
15:51.45luke-jrthough you do raise an interesting point, lcuk
15:52.04luke-jranother reason not to have proprietary GPS driver, is to ensure our own personal privacy
15:52.14fiferboylbt: Do we need to use QDynamicPropertyChangeEvent?
15:52.15lbtfiferboy: it's not an api... more a status flag
15:52.34fiferboyAh, mine needs to be something that is changed programatically, I think.
15:52.43qgiler... that connection actually happens with the A-GPS and you are accepting the terms in that dialog asking for permissions to connect etc etc
15:52.51Jaffaqgil: I'll try and have a look tonight for one, and raise one if there isn't one
15:53.08lcukahh ok qgil :) so its in agps and not in the gps driver itself
15:53.23lcukhasnt installed agps
15:53.27luke-jrqgil: is it practical to get a quick low-level library to the GPS?
15:53.56qgilluke-jr: I don't understand your question, sorry
15:54.25fiferboylbt: Or I can define a Q_PROPERTY for it to be read and set
15:54.46*** part/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)
15:55.06luke-jrqgil: gpsdriver basically "converts" ttyS0 data to NMEA data; I'm assuming the NMEA output generation is not TI IPR, and the TI IPR is the ttyS0 end
15:55.24luke-jrqgil: if Nokia can make a simple C library to take the ttyS0 end, we could write the other side from scratch
15:55.54qgilluke-jr: I don't know the technical details but the basic thing is: that driver will stay as it is because all our development is focused on a completely different location architecture
15:56.00luke-jr(ideally giving the library its ttyS0 path/pointer)
15:56.08Jaffaluke-jr: If Nokia were doing that, they could put the effort into opening the non-TI NMEA-generation bit - since it'd have to be written anyway
15:56.17JaffaWhich, as qgil says, ain't gonna happen
15:56.29luke-jrqgil: how about supporting Nokia's current hardware?
15:57.44qgilluke-jr: I have nothing to add to all that has been said about the support to N810 customers
15:58.15lcukthey are, it is supported and works :D  todd on gps tells us where traffic circles are
15:58.39luke-jrlcuk: it "works" with an unmaintained Maemo version
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15:59.14lcukluke-jr, expecting nokia to support every OS out there is impractical
15:59.22Jaffaalso wonders (because this is better than doing anything else) about whether, if this is a growing problem (see also 3D drivers), the community could realistically find (& fund?) someone to work on behalf of Nokia to do the necessary work to split things up into reusable binary blobs.
15:59.25lcukshould they supply windows drivers?
15:59.34luke-jrlcuk: I'm not expecting them to, just expecting some kind of low-level library so *we* can write support ourselves
15:59.39JaffaBut that assumes the work on behalf of Nokia Legal is of no cost/budget to Maemo Software
16:00.13qgilthere is this idea of getting a community developer sign an NDA and etc etc
16:00.23qgilwell, in practice things don't work like this
16:00.47qgilNDAs are useful when the one who signs it can respond to liabilities
16:00.57Jaffaqgil: What're the biggest obstacles? Drain on dev. team to support new developer?
16:00.58VDVsxlcuk, we can try to setup community bounties for that propose
16:01.14qgilif you are a developer of a Fortune500 company you won't have much trouble getting offers to sign an NDA
16:01.22VDVsxeerr^^ Jaffa
16:01.34qgilif you are a community developer is clear that in case of trouble you basically are no liable
16:01.35Jaffaqgil: Ah, so an individual (even one in a company capacity?) doesn't have enough leverage to risk the leak?
16:02.13Stskeeps.. okay, what conversation did i just stumble into?
16:02.16qgilTI sues you Jaffa - so what?
16:02.38luke-jrStskeeps: gpsdriver
16:03.02luke-jrhmm
16:03.10Jaffaqgil: Why, fundamentally, is a Nokia employee more trustworthy though? Losing one's job (if one wants to be malicious) isn't necessarily the end of the world
16:03.10luke-jrqgil: so we need to find a CEO willing to back this? ;)
16:03.21lardmanthe other option is to simply write the code, present it to Nokia as a fait accompli. and ask them to sign it off
16:03.23qgilNow Maemo SW makes some kind of NDA agreement with Jaffa but then he goes and accidentally or not published the whole source code somewhere
16:03.32qgilTI sues Jaffa? No, of course.
16:03.45qgiland Nokia sues Jaffa? No of course.
16:03.48luke-jrlardman: um, if we write the code w/o any help from Nokia, then why present it to them at all?
16:03.51JaffaNo, TI sues Nokia. That's where the money is.
16:04.03lardmanluke-jr: to prevent from being sued by anyone
16:04.05JaffaJust like they would if a Maemo Software employee did the same.
16:04.39luke-jrlardman: as Quim is mentioning, individuals have no reason to fear being sued :p
16:04.52Stskeepsqgil: my personal view is that gpsdriver is fine closed, we can make a wrapper to fix the user problem (simply hijacking the getpwnam call), it's not perfect and a simple GPSDRIVER_USER environment variable patch to gpsdriver (still closed) would also be most welcome
16:04.53lardmanwell you could hire someone as a contractor, assuming you trust them, and pay them an arbitrary $1 for their work
16:05.04Stskeepsluke-jr doesn't share my view but i think more in direction of practicality
16:05.20lcuk+1 sts :)
16:05.26lardmanStskeeps: agreed there
16:05.28luke-jrlardman: still doesn't create liability
16:05.33qgilJaffa: companies work trusting each other - and companies trust their employees (even if they make them sign some papers just in case)
16:05.38lcukmiddle ground path of least resistance works best for all concerned :)
16:05.49lardmanluke-jr: yes it does, being employed by the company in question
16:05.51Stskeepsa little aid to very small patches to closed source packages would always be welcome, if a wrapper is not trivial
16:05.59luke-jrlardman: for $1, no loss if you lose that job
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16:06.27Jaffawonders how wonderfully thorough Nokia's recruitment process must be ;-)
16:06.32lardmanluke-jr: the point is not the job, but the access and the fact that being a member of a large company you're more likely to be offered the NDA to sign
16:06.57Jaffalardman: I think qgil's point is that *Nokia* have everything to lose by taking the liability, and not the person signing the NDA
16:07.03luke-jrlardman: yes, but Nokia isn't going to want to accept that liability
16:07.18qgilJaffa: well, you go through some rounds - I have heard worse horror stories from very popular companies
16:07.22lardmanJaffa: as I said, depends if you trust the person
16:07.30Stskeepsluke-jr: btw, thanks for telling me which syscall i have to wrap :P
16:07.37luke-jrStskeeps: -.-
16:07.56qgilJaffa: and this is why Nokia won't do anything like signing an NDA with a community developer, no matter how many karma points  ;)
16:07.57Jaffalardman: Indeed. I can see why Nokia (as a corporation) would make the distinction, even though I think we have good metrics - and evidence - of trustiness of particular people
16:08.33JaffaAnd so, at a practical level, the distinction is probably arbitrary (but, as I say, understandable to my corporate-addled mind)
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16:09.09Stskeepson the other hand, won't most professional community developers be incorporated? :P
16:09.38Stskeepsthey have a tendancy to group together
16:09.38qgilyou need to apply first  :)
16:10.09qgilmany community developers are now professionals working with Nokia, either as employees or external companies
16:10.34luke-jrso which of these community developers are working with Nokia as an external company?
16:10.42luke-jrpresumably they could solve this?
16:10.52qgilanyway, I hope the point about https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4380 is clear, even if you don't agree with the resolution
16:11.17VDVsxqgil, but a lot of them are, just naming indt and igalia for starters :P
16:11.33Stskeepsqgil: from mer POV i agree - there might eventually be a need for simple patches to fix specific problems on some packages, but that's a totally different discussion
16:11.41qgilluke-jr: where do you think many of these small companies come from http://wiki.maemo.org/Companies_in_Maemo_development
16:11.43lardmanqgil: so pvr will have to be a diy job then...?
16:12.16qgillardman no, we are still discussing with TI
16:12.35lardmanfor them to do the work though?
16:12.45qgiland they are willing to find a solution so that code can go out with a good legal relationship with the Kernel license
16:12.55lardmanah ok
16:12.56Stskeepsthat sounds like a huge leap forward :)
16:13.03luke-jrqgil: can't discuss GPS with TI? :/
16:13.13luke-jrfrom what I hear, it's an obsolete model of theirs
16:13.17luke-jrmaybe they'll just let it go?
16:13.22qgilask them
16:13.42qgilfirst things first and the pvr was the first thing that was asked
16:13.58luke-jrNokia releases gpsdriver code if we get clearance from TI?
16:14.16Stskeepsqgil: much looking forward to hearing results of those talks, - even a open source kernel driver will be a big leap forward
16:14.17qgilI'm actually amazed about the amount of time and attention both companies have put in the acceleration drivers
16:14.26lardmanno, Ti would probably have to release you the specs and you write your own
16:15.09lardmanluke-jr: the other problem with gpsdriver is the supl stuff
16:15.22luke-jrlardman: libsupld is BSD-licensed anyway
16:16.17Stskeepsyeah, probably a legal bug
16:16.22*** join/#maemo brolin (n=brolin@iner.udea.edu.co)
16:17.07Stskeepscontinues making slides for copenhagen
16:18.04lardmancontinues writing a report
16:18.15lardmanand dreaming dreams of PowerVR goodness
16:19.19Stskeepswonders how gtk doc building can take so long time
16:19.27qgillardman & other "accelerated" developers, if in the Maemo Summit you find some Kimmo Nikkanen
16:19.41qgilplease buy him a beer because he is being your secret godfather
16:19.48lardmanok, will do :)
16:19.57qgilhe is an expert on that area, and he really cares about the community being able to experiment
16:19.59lardmancan we have a mugshot? :)
16:21.19Stskeepswe should make some location based game on "find the nokia employee and drink with him"
16:21.34lardmanNokia employee bingo?
16:21.51Stskeepsgot to get them all ;)
16:22.37lardmanyep
16:22.40lardmanor some %
16:22.40qgilnow I realize he has a web page: http://koti.mbnet.fi/knikkane/
16:22.58VDVsxStskeeps, nokiamon :P
16:23.29StskeepsVDVsx: .. almost sounds like a fun game to play :>
16:24.38timeless_mbplcuk: it's unreasonable to demand nokia provide Windows-ARM drivers for their tablets?
16:24.41timeless_mbpdarn
16:24.44timeless_mbpwon't buy another one
16:24.55lardmanqgil: I'll have to email him to put up his picture :) I wonder if the thought of all of us tracking him down to buy him beer will make him more or less likely to do so :D
16:25.12timeless_mbpoh you mentioned that
16:26.37luke-jrtimeless_mbp: I'm already planning to go with some kind of SmartQ next time around.
16:26.43luke-jrat least their stuff is open
16:27.41qgilgoes elsewhere
16:27.42qgilbye
16:27.45Stskeepscya :)
16:27.56Stskeepsnext up on #maemo: luke-jr complaining of the closed source JPEG accelerator driver
16:28.04lardmancheers qgil, assuming you see the logs to read this message :)
16:28.18lardmanStskeeps: ah, well that's open actually
16:28.24luke-jrStskeeps: think it'll get to the infliential people? :p
16:28.34lardmanyes, it will really annoy them
16:28.43luke-jrStskeeps: I'm pretty happy about the SmartQ SoC specs being 100% open
16:28.46lardmanbut hopefully it won't affect how they deal with the rest of the community
16:28.55Stskeepsluke-jr: you didn't notice the "CONFIDENTIAL" part of that pdf?
16:28.56Stskeeps:P
16:28.58luke-jrlardman: hey, it was their own decisions that led to that comment
16:29.05luke-jrStskeeps: that doesn't make it apply as a NDA
16:29.11lardmanindeed, but there are reasons for the decisions
16:29.59Corsacluke-jr: what about the touchbook, when it starts being real? :)
16:30.08Stskeeps'd get a touchbook.
16:30.19luke-jrwell, here's hoping it makes them wake up and realize there's no real middle ground if they want a faithful market
16:30.25luke-jrCorsac: wtf is that?
16:30.28Corsac!
16:30.43Corsachttp://www.alwaysinnovating.com/touchbook/
16:30.49Stskeepshow can you not know what a touchbook is
16:30.51lardmanluke-jr: no, you're wrong there. We went through all of this arguing business back when we first asked for the pvr driver
16:31.09Stskeepsit's practically a portable beagleboard
16:31.12Corsac's brother in law will work at AI starting next year
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16:31.31luke-jrStskeeps: it's not in my field of interest?
16:31.34luke-jrlooks too big
16:31.56lardmanCorsac: I'd never heard of it, looks cool though
16:32.26luke-jrStskeeps: maybe my wife will want one
16:32.31Stskeepslardman: http://gizmodo.com/5162584/first-hands-on-touch-book-is-a-part+netbook-part+tablet
16:32.32Corsacyeah, it's more netbook sized than NIT sized
16:32.58Stskeepsstill, 10-12 hours of battery life
16:33.12lardmanI still want something inbetween, umid or psion 5 sized
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16:34.24CorsacI just love the fridge stuff
16:36.14*** join/#maemo skibur (n=skibur@adsl-66-142-93-41.dsl.snantx.swbell.net)
16:38.57luke-jrI want to max out my pocket space :p
16:39.16luke-jrmaybe fold out into a dual-display
16:41.52GAN800Ah, absolutism is fun.
16:42.40lardmanEvangelism
16:42.50lardmanbut yeah
16:43.06lardmanhow goes it anyway General?
16:43.07minradosbox
16:43.20StsN800lo GeneralAntilles
16:47.08GAN800Work, work, work
16:47.36GAN800lardman, '100% open or nobody will ever buy' ;)
16:47.38lardmanI am!
16:47.55lardmanyeah, I can't quite get that attitude
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17:06.23*** join/#maemo LiraNuna (n=LiraNuna@98.210.12.193)
17:06.33GAN800lardman, especially since it has zero basis in reality. ;)
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17:08.35yergacan't connect to the garage svn...
17:08.41yergasomeone can confirm it?
17:08.59yergathe git server works great though
17:09.25Stskeepsyawns
17:10.04lardmanGAN800: yeah, feels like the "discussions" from back when we were campaigning for the PowerVR driver doens't it :)
17:10.42lardmanGAN800: did you see qgil's comments re. Ti & ImgTech being interested in getting a workable driver available
17:10.44lardman?
17:10.54GAN800lardman, didn't you hear? Communities are cyclical.
17:11.17lardmanI must just have a very long wavelength
17:11.23lardmanor low velocity
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17:12.15Stskeepsat least we didn't have "Let's get Windows CE working!"
17:12.32lardmanwe used to have that though :)
17:12.48lcukfuck CE< i want windows 7 on my hardware
17:12.53lardmanand the questions about geting WINE working :D
17:13.15lardmanlcuk: tut tut tut, there are young viewers at this time of night
17:13.17lcukheh simon we make extensive use of wine already, and beer
17:13.29lardmandon't mention the Windows 7 word
17:13.34lcukflip CE< then even - apologies
17:13.35lardmanis drinking a beer too :)
17:13.53lcukohh yeah a beer would be good at this point
17:14.06lcuki dont think the shop will serve jake yet tho
17:14.45lardmanwhy not give him your drivers licence? He could turn up in a car to buy the beers
17:15.12GAN800lardman, yeah, saw it.
17:15.20lardmanhe'd probably get in more trouble with the cops for buying beer than driving the car anyway :p
17:15.36lcukluke came home with a random driving license yesterday actually
17:15.42lardmanlol
17:15.48lardmansomeone bought a laminator....?
17:16.03lcukheh no a proper one he found it on the street, gonna post it off to the address
17:16.10lardmanGAN800: and I was just getting stuck into the asm
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17:16.37sanjay6976hi
17:16.49Meizirkkihi sanjay6976
17:16.51MeizirkkiAny medibox expert here?
17:17.35*** join/#maemo n6pfk (n=mike@c-76-104-54-202.hsd1.va.comcast.net)
17:17.39Meizirkkii cannot figure out why MediaBox plays everything nicely thru Gstreamer on my Ubuntu-box, but on n810 it is unable to use the output
17:17.57Meizirkki(in Mer n8x0)
17:18.05lardmanwhat are you playing?
17:18.11lardmanGStreamer components missing?
17:18.13Meizirkkimp3
17:18.16StskeepsMeizirkki: did you enable xine output?
17:18.25Stskeepsah
17:18.32MeizirkkiStskeeps, Xine output works somehow too
17:18.35Stskeepsthat's probably ubuntu related, you have to dl a codec from multiverse
17:18.35Stskeepsafaik
17:18.46LiraNunahttp://www.crn.com/mobile/217600442 < "market that does not exist" !?
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17:19.15MeizirkkiStskeeps, i have all the codecs, but mediabox doesn't recognise the output
17:19.25Meizirkkionly selectable is Xine
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17:22.47sanjay6976after installing maemo 4.1.2 if i run af-sb-init  in DIABLO_ARMEL i get the error " /home/maemouser/.osso/current-gtk-key-theme:1: Unable to find include file: "keybindings.rc""
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17:26.37sanjay6976the problem is that i am not able to lanch emulator gui from ARMEL
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17:28.50sanjay6976any help
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17:34.42lardmansanjay6976: iirc it's not possible to launch the GUI from the ARMEL target
17:35.11lardmanif you want to do GUI programming you must target X86 and try there, or run it on-device
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17:36.29luke-jrGAN800: I didn't so "or nobody will buy", but when you're targetting the *open source* community with your product, one of the main factors to focus on is keeping things *open source*
17:36.52luke-jrand if they're targetting *general purpose* users, they sure did a crappy job of the PIM software
17:37.14luke-jrso in the end, they're not really satisfying *either* market
17:37.23sanjay6976lardman:thanks is there any way i can achive it
17:37.27luke-jrwhich has got to be worse than picking one and satisfying that market
17:40.58VDVsxlardman, humm, is this also valid for Diablo ?, I thought it is only a fremantle issue
17:43.55VDVsxnahh, the emulated GUI works fine in my armel target (Diablo)
17:45.38GAN800luke-jr, things aint that black and white
17:46.02GAN800and you're not being realistic about the market.
17:47.00sanjay6976VDVsx: is it maemo 4.1.2?
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17:48.15sanjay6976VDVsx: how did u do that?
17:48.34VDVsxsanjay6976, nop, is 4.1, a old installation
17:49.09VDVsxsanjay6976, did you installed the entire sdk runtime ?
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17:51.07lardmanVDVsx: ah, ok
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17:51.35VDVsxsanjay6976, try to install the runtime + dev packages (fakeroot apt-get install maemo-sdk-dev)
17:51.41sanjay6976VDVsx:i did maemo-sdk-dev
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17:53.32timeless_mbpluke-jr: i think we're very much aware of our failings
17:53.45timeless_mbpwhich isn't to say that some people shouldn't be reminded of them
17:53.50RST38hmoo all
17:53.53timeless_mbpalthough in this case, you should complain to Ari
17:54.03timeless_mbpQuim can't really do much
17:54.49timeless_mbpponders
17:55.13timeless_mbphow many software updates did you get to your Original Nintendo Entertainment System ?
17:55.25timeless_mbpfor the record, I got <ZERO>
17:55.36timeless_mbpbut I was quite happy with it and used it for many years
17:55.46RST38hOriginal NES had no builtin firmware.
17:55.55MyrttiI still used mine two years ago :-(
17:56.07RST38hSo this point does not apply to NES.
17:56.17VDVsxsanjay6976, can you pastebin the entire output of the af-sb-init command ?
17:56.42RST38hMyrtti: It is time to move on to iNES :)
17:56.59MyrttiRST38h: I've moved to NDS
17:57.18timeless_mbpRST38h: i'm drawing a weak parallel
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17:57.31timeless_mbpthere were components in the nintendo
17:57.40timeless_mbpit was theoretically possible for some of those components to break
17:57.43RST38hMyrtti: not a bad idea
17:57.51timeless_mbpif they broke and you were in warranty, you could get nintendo to replace them
17:58.09timeless_mbpnintendo never promised to give you schematics, and to my knowledge there were no user serviceable parts
17:58.29RST38hHow is it related to software? Especially, how is it related to software in NIT firmware that has been broken from the moment it has been shipped to users?
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17:58.34timeless_mbpi'm not sure about your 770, as to whether Nokia promised hardware schematics
17:58.51timeless_mbpbut... walk slowly
17:58.57timeless_mbphas to find other devices
17:59.08RST38hYea, go search for other examples.
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17:59.20sanjay6976VDVsx:[sbox-DIABLO_ARMEL: ~] > af-sb-init.sh start Note: For remote X connections DISPLAY should contain hostname! Sample files present. Starting DBUS system bus Starting D-BUS session bus daemon Starting Maemo Launcher: maemo-launcher. defender: died my parent is not who he claims to be maemo-launcher: warning rising the oom shield for pid=26027 status=2816
17:59.21timeless_mbphasn't really purchased many items
17:59.44*** part/#maemo nascentmind (n=nascentm@122.172.24.17)
17:59.59RST38h(although it will be somewhat of a problem under given preconditions)
18:00.22luke-jrtimeless_mbp: who is Ari?
18:00.31MyrttiAri Jaaksi I presume
18:00.33timeless_mbphttp://jaaksi.blogspot.com/
18:00.35RST38h(like you may have to use WinCE devices as an example and THAT would look really desperate)
18:00.46sanjay6976VDVsx:Unable to find include file: "keybindings.rc" it gives
18:00.47timeless_mbpi was hoping someone would spell his name and save me the effort
18:01.00timeless_mbp"it's all his fault"
18:01.11Myrttihe's really a nice guy though
18:01.18timeless_mbp(and he's welcome to claim any success he can find)
18:01.28VDVsxsanjay6976, yah, paste the output here: http://pastebin.ca/  and send me the link
18:04.03sanjay6976VDVsx:i have pasted at  http://pastebin.ca/1430131
18:06.17timeless_mbpponders
18:06.23timeless_mbpanyone here happen to have purchased a Newton?
18:06.45timeless_mbpI'd rather not point to my iPod touch (for which i've had to pay for bug fixes and new features)
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18:12.41VDVsxsanjay6976, try to check this: http://pastebin.ca/1430139
18:13.51timeless_mbpshrugs
18:13.57timeless_mbpit's really not worth explaining
18:14.18timeless_mbpNintendo has two groups, a hardware group which sells devices
18:14.25timeless_mbpand a software group which makes and sells games
18:14.39timeless_mbpNokia is a hardware company, it makes and sells hardware
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18:14.45timeless_mbpthe hardware happens to include software
18:15.00timeless_mbpnokia has virtually no experience in other markets
18:15.15timeless_mbpit'll take years for us to learn how to get some other mix
18:15.48timeless_mbpbtw, i finally used the transflexive display of my n810, when i was in Mountain View
18:15.54timeless_mbpand I'm happy to report that it really works!
18:15.58Stskeepshehe
18:16.08luke-jrmeaning?
18:16.10timeless_mbpin other news, my n81 8GB failed that test miserably
18:16.20timeless_mbpi could use my n810 in the sun while i was outside
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18:16.56timeless_mbpabout a week later i finally discovered my n81's display was dimmed to nearly the lowest possible setting, which explains why i couldn't use it outside, but ...
18:17.18timeless_mbpit took me a week to discover that :)
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18:17.29timeless_mbpa week which i spent cursing the phone ;)
18:18.01timeless_mbpluke-jr: for reference, the n800 does not work outside in the sun
18:18.08timeless_mbp(nor did the 770 for that matter)
18:18.39timeless_mbpone of the major improvements the n810 had (and the only one that interested me) was the display technology
18:19.09timeless_mbpbut when people asked us about it as the product was announced, all I could say at the time was "it's winter here in helsinki, ask me in a few months when the sun comes out"
18:19.32timeless_mbpon this trip, someone forced me to remove the original plastic film that you're supposed to remove when you get your device
18:19.47timeless_mbp(which i think means the sheet lasted about 2 years)
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18:20.03Stskeepstimeless_mbp: i have a good screenprotector that makes it decently viewable in the sun for n800 :P
18:20.16luke-jrtimeless_mbp: I always leave that on as a screen protecter
18:20.25luke-jrthough mine didn't come with one :/
18:20.36timeless_mbpluke-jr: i always try to, and have been relatively good at keeping them that way
18:20.44timeless_mbpmy e61i still had its when the screen died
18:21.02timeless_mbpi took off my n81's when i was trying to figure out why the screen didn't work in the sun :(
18:22.13timeless_mbpwonders how to rename a google map
18:22.37sanjay6976VDVsx:what will be the DISPLAY variable for xephr for armel
18:23.00timeless_mbpsanjay6976: xephyr typically runs on :2
18:23.18timeless_mbpbut when you're running xephyr itself, you typically need DISPLAY set to the normal Xserver (:0)
18:28.09sanjay6976i am trying to launch maemo emulator from armel i am getting the errori given in the link  http://pastebin.ca/1430154 with display=:2
18:29.30timeless_mbpso, env vars are um... not quite case insensitive
18:29.45timeless_mbpdid you run xephyr?
18:29.49timeless_mbpit's basically:
18:29.51timeless_mbpDISPLAY=:0
18:29.57timeless_mbpstart-xephyr.sh
18:30.00timeless_mbpDISPLAY=:2
18:30.12timeless_mbpstart-maemo-however.sh
18:30.22timeless_mbpxephyr of course should be run from outside scratchbox
18:30.27timeless_mbpand maemo would be inside
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18:30.59timeless_mbploves the unsupported syscall's
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18:37.00sanjay6976i feel there is some error in xephyr
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18:40.30sanjay6976while launchin xephyr it gives  "Extended Input Devices not yet supported. Impelement it at line 625 in kinput.c"
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18:44.51StskeepsGAN800: you ran Mer on the dell mini 9?
18:45.29sanjay6976any help
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18:51.23RST38hsanjay: Doesn't it tell you directly what to do?
18:51.39RST38hkinput.c, line 625 =)
18:52.24Stskeepssanjay6976: ubuntu 9.04?
18:52.53sanjay6976no fedora
18:53.38sanjay6976RST38h:what i have to implement
18:53.59sanjay6976not getting it
18:55.28VDVsxsanjay6976, did you followed the instruction that I sent ?
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18:55.59VDVsxsanjay6976, you have the same error or a different one ?
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19:00.16sanjay6976VDVsx:sorry but i didn't get the instruction please if u can send it again the error is same
19:01.40VDVsxsanjay6976, try to check this: http://pastebin.ca/1430139
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19:04.42tank-mananyone know anything about a newer garnet (palmos) vm ? current one has timebomb that expires in 10 days
19:05.42lcuk*cue dramatic 24 clock beeps*
19:06.11lcukno tank-man didnt know it had a best before date
19:06.33*** join/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host86-167-104-90.range86-167.btcentralplus.com)
19:06.41Javipropietary software, you know
19:08.48Javia pity for those who are using agendus or some other palm pim soft
19:08.59Javion 10 days we promise... kaos
19:10.14*** join/#maemo FilipLinux4BE (n=filip@77.109.122.141)
19:16.57sanjay6976tried setting that please check the outputin http://pastebin.ca/1430194
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19:52.44Macerhm. did russia bury a bunch of bodies after chernobyl?
19:54.30*** join/#maemo brolin (n=brolin@200.24.16.55)
19:56.12RST38hYes, and they still glow
19:56.38*** join/#maemo geaaru (n=geaaru@host34-227-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
19:56.56RST38h(aside from the ones that dug themselves out and walked away looking for humans that is)
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20:00.59sanjay6976while running qmake i get the error "mmap: No such device or address"
20:02.29*** join/#maemo lardman_ (n=vircuser@89.243.0.184)
20:04.30GAN800Yes, worked fine minus the virtual input issues.
20:04.35*** join/#maemo dieb_ (n=dieb@189.71.65.235)
20:05.29GAN800Er, Stskeeps.
20:06.19*** join/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)
20:07.24Stskeepsmm?
20:07.25Stskeepsah
20:07.27Stskeepsthanks
20:09.40*** join/#maemo flo_lap (n=fuchs@f049038042.adsl.alicedsl.de)
20:09.45GAN800Stskeeps, I'd probably consider switching over at some point.
20:09.59GAN800Although Moblin's new UI efforts look nice.
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20:13.01Macerthe japanese are strange
20:13.20sanjay6976<PROTECTED>
20:13.56VDVsxsanjay6976, good :)
20:15.00sanjay6976I am getting error now while trying to run qmake it gives me "mmap: No such device or address"
20:16.24sanjay6976while trying to run qmake of Qt over this
20:16.36StskeepsJaffa: around?
20:18.01*** join/#maemo t_s_o (n=tso@40.84-49-134.nextgentel.com)
20:19.51Stskeepsgah
20:19.54Stskeepsanother libtime victim
20:25.20Stskeepsis fucking tired of silly nokia-binaries stuff like libtime which is a dbus wrapper.
20:27.49ShadowJKdude, writing wrappers is the best thing ever. You end up writing many many lines of code, with minimal effort!
20:28.01JaffaStskeeps: yup (semi-briefly, hopefully)
20:28.51GAN800Stskeeps, go kick some ass.
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20:29.08GAN800Mailing list rants are always fun. ;)
20:29.35StskeepsJaffa: did you add extra patches to HAM when that was?
20:29.43StskeepsGAN800: i did already
20:29.46Stskeeps(on bugs.*
20:31.15JaffaStskeeps: yeah - ones not already in bmo were logged (i.e. the "don't depend on user" one which got resolved recently)
20:31.25Stskeepsk
20:31.42Stskeepsi can't upgrade to fremantle beta HAM anyway due to silly libtime-dev
20:32.05JaffaEverything *should* have been carefully committed separately in bzr
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20:34.43timeless_mbpShadowJK: exactly
20:34.49timeless_mbpwrapping wrappers for fun and profit!
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20:35.32ShadowJKThe most fun is writing wrappers/frameworks that don't have a use yet
20:35.55ShadowJKthen the next guy who actually finds a use for it comes and goes "wtf", and goes to great lengths to adapt his software to your strangeish framework ;)
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20:37.24timeless_mbpShadowJK: you must have tried to use browser-eal :)
20:37.35timeless_mbpor maemo-location
20:37.41timeless_mbpor any hildon framework
20:37.43timeless_mbpor gnomevfs
20:37.46timeless_mbpponders
20:37.52timeless_mbpor pretty much any software that's been touched here :)
20:38.06ShadowJKgpsbt or whatever it was called
20:38.25timeless_mbpyeah
20:38.36timeless_mbpframeworks are indeed fun
20:38.47timeless_mbpit's also fun to work w/ people who change the api every day or week
20:39.08timeless_mbpthey're learning how to do it now
20:39.21*** join/#maemo abner (n=birunko@189.70.76.86)
20:39.23ShadowJKyou need rules for that. You change the API, you also change/send patches for all software using it ;)
20:39.28timeless_mbpwhile people are using it and writing code which is supposed to be more production stable than the framework being written concurrently :)
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20:39.41timeless_mbpShadowJK: if only it were that simple
20:39.52ShadowJK:)
20:39.57timeless_mbpfirst you'd have to find all the consumers and the repos and the builders
20:40.09timeless_mbpand then you'd have to find the version that still builds and get everything pushed in a single lump
20:40.16timeless_mbpsighs
20:40.22timeless_mbpworking on mozilla was so much easier
20:40.27timeless_mbpeveryone lived in one tree
20:40.39timeless_mbpif i changed an api, i posted a patch for all of the consumers, gave them a warning
20:40.40ShadowJKLinux kernel people have that "you break api you fix users" policy, it also works as an incentive for driver developers to not have their drivers bitrot outside the kernel :)
20:40.44timeless_mbpand then landed for everyone concurrently
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20:40.57timeless_mbps/users/in-tree consumers/
20:41.09timeless_mbpyep
20:41.30crashanddiehey timeless_mbp
20:41.38timeless_mbphey
20:41.42timeless_mbpi owe you guys a fax
20:41.45timeless_mbpwonders how to print
20:41.55crashanddie@All: How do I remove Mer?
20:42.03crashanddieI need the internal mem card for storage
20:42.20crashanddietimeless_mbp, you never told me how it went, you got anything beneficial from the lunch?
20:42.43lbtcfdisk
20:43.17ShadowJK'd imagine format card thingy in the file browser in maemo might be useful too (but I wouldn't dare use it with external card in slot)
20:43.19lbtalso /etc/bootmenu.d/Mer.item
20:45.39crashanddielbt, got anything more verbose?
20:48.29lbtnot really....
20:48.40lbtwhat do yo want to do?
20:48.45lbtget rid?
20:49.24crashanddielbt, think I got it, cheers
20:49.43*** join/#maemo biiter (n=biiter@r6cu133.net.upc.cz)
20:49.44lbtheh ... I was going to walk you through and update the wiki
20:50.08RST38hhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/12905355@N05/3551920702/
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21:12.02luke-jrcrap
21:12.10luke-jrless than 24 hours to figure out how to get my stupid N810 to record audio
21:12.12luke-jr:/
21:16.03Infektawhy do you only have that much time?
21:16.16Infektaand i thought i saw an app that did that
21:16.56*** join/#maemo Vudentz (n=luiz@200.184.118.130)
21:17.34luke-jrInfekta: it just records silence x.x
21:18.02Infektahave you tried using the headset with it?
21:18.33*** part/#maemo minra (n=Min-ra@pD95FADBE.dip.t-dialin.net)
21:20.12luke-jrInfekta: no, I don't want to use a headset for input :/
21:20.18luke-jrand I forget where i put it..
21:20.41*** join/#maemo Sho_ (n=EHS1@kde/hein)
21:21.12Macerwhite light black rain sucked
21:26.46*** join/#maemo xnt14 (n=xnt@pool-96-232-136-40.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
21:28.45*** join/#maemo zimmerle (n=zimmerle@200.184.118.130)
21:30.34xnt14~seen b-man
21:30.37infobotb-man is currently on #maemo (32m 32s), last said: 'it's a bit complicated - but i'll figure it out :)'.
21:30.47xnt1432 mins :P
21:31.19*** join/#maemo radic (n=radic@ip-77-24-37-124.web.vodafone.de)
21:31.24*** join/#maemo towo (i=towo@littlelamb.szaf.org)
21:32.23jeremiahwhen have an infobot?
21:32.26jeremiahw00t
21:32.44jeremiah~seen xfade
21:32.45infoboti haven't seen 'xfade', jeremiah
21:32.52jeremiahWell then you suck inforbot
21:33.36lbt~seen X-Fade
21:33.37infobotx-fade <n=xfade@78-20-14-109.access.telenet.be> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 6h 54m 45s ago, saying: 'lizardo: Yeah, but at least covering the obvious ones will help.'.
21:34.20lbtpolishes his shoe on his trouser leg and whistles nonchalantly...
21:35.49timeless_mbpjeremiah: i'm fairly certain infobot predates you :)
21:36.43Macerthe damn pay insurance company i have .. has a mailbox that only allows 3MB emails
21:36.46Macer:) wtf?
21:37.09xnt14xD
21:38.42*** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@147.17.168.202-static.velocitynet.com.au)
21:42.59*** join/#maemo biiter (n=biiter@r6cu133.net.upc.cz)
21:44.43jeremiahtheh
21:44.47jeremiah?
21:44.57jeremiahMy fingers cannot spell.
21:45.16b-manlol
21:45.18jeremiahtimeless_mbp: Impossible, I was born a long, long time ago.
21:45.37lardman_in a galaxy far, far away....
21:49.54*** join/#maemo lbt (n=david@78.32.229.233)
21:49.55lardman_night all
21:51.01Macerhow the hell is this woman alive
21:51.12Macershe was 240 meters from ground 0 in hiroshima
21:51.37Macerand is like 90
21:51.49Macerlike.. do some people just not get cancer from atomic bombs or something?
21:52.29lbtnope
21:52.58lbtmost of what we know is by observation of these people
21:53.15lbtshe demonstrates the statistical nature of radiation damage
21:54.34Maceri suppose so. i guess being iradiated doesn't always end up causing death
21:54.41*** join/#maemo secureendpoints (n=chatzill@cpe-24-193-47-88.nyc.res.rr.com)
21:55.02Macerthen they all went back to the city
21:56.02Macerthey lived in the radation cities and a lot of them survived
21:57.33lbtyes
21:58.01lbtafter a certain time the risk is then the particles in the environment
21:58.21Maceramazing
21:58.32Macersorry. i am watching white light black rain
21:58.54Macerand i always just assumed that anybody who had huge doses of radiation in the cities had died
22:00.57*** join/#maemo krutt (n=mk@p4FC33A3D.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:06.05lbtworked in nuclear industry many years ago
22:23.30b-man~nuke lbt
22:23.31infobotACTION prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at lbt ... B☢☢M!
22:23.36b-manXD
22:23.41xnt14xD
22:23.57lbtlives near AWE Aldermaston.... we have defences...
22:24.25lbtAWE = Atomic Weapons Establishment....
22:24.35b-man~nuke lbt's defences
22:24.36infobotACTION prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at lbt's defences ... B☢☢M!
22:24.37xnt14~destroy defences
22:24.38infobotno
22:24.39b-manXD
22:24.42xnt14xD
22:25.19b-man~attack lbt's defences
22:25.20infobotACTION grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing lbt's defences
22:25.27b-manOMFGLOLROFL!!!
22:25.27xnt14xD
22:25.33xnt14that does not make sense xD
22:25.43b-mani know! XD
22:26.06xnt14~hack lbt's defences
22:26.07infobotACTION teaches lbt's defences nethack so that lbt's defences will play until 6 AM
22:26.15xnt14?
22:26.16b-manlol
22:26.19xnt14lol
22:26.40xnt14now lbt's defences are busy playing nethack xD
22:26.45xnt14~nuke lbt
22:26.46infobotACTION prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at lbt ... B☢☢M!
22:26.48b-man~burn lbt's defences
22:26.49infobotACTION pours gasoline all over lbt's defences, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze
22:26.49xnt14xD
22:26.53b-manXD
22:27.14xnt14try to not abuse infobot xD
22:27.23b-manyeah XD
22:27.51lbtretreats to #mer
22:28.02b-manXD
22:28.15lbtleaves killer kitten behind
22:28.15b-manvictory!! XD
22:28.25b-mannooo!! DX
22:28.28*** join/#maemo xntbot (n=xnt@pool-96-232-136-40.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
22:28.42xnt14Nooo
22:28.54b-mansends killer kitten to #mer
22:29.00b-manXD
22:29.04xnt14$cage kitten
22:29.25xntbottakes a huge cage and places it over the killer kitten
22:29.30xnt14yay
22:29.39b-manXD
22:29.42xnt14xD
22:29.59b-man$xntbot
22:30.02xnt14xntbot, Im bored, are you?
22:30.11xntbotb-man, what?
22:30.27xntbotxnt14, yes I am bored
22:31.16b-man$xntbot blow up
22:31.54xntbotblows up
22:32.01b-manXD
22:32.04b-man$cage xnt14
22:32.05xnt14$fix xntbot
22:32.22xntbotb-man, I am currently broken
22:32.32xntbotxnt14, thankyou, I am fixed
22:32.42b-man$cage xnt14
22:32.46xnt14$chase b-man
22:32.51b-manlol
22:33.07xntbotgrabs a bat and chases b-man
22:33.09xnt14xD
22:33.17b-mannoooo!!!!
22:33.21xnt14$% remove cage
22:33.35b-mangets beaten by xntbot
22:33.57xnt14$stop action(beat,b-man);
22:33.59xnt14xD
22:34.11b-manXD
22:34.34xnt14$kick b-man shin
22:34.40xntbotkicks b-man in the shin
22:34.48xnt14xD
22:35.11b-man$kick xnt14 $´#*
22:35.22xntbotb-man, invalid syntax
22:35.25xnt14$runover b-man
22:35.38xntbotxnt14, unknown command
22:35.44xnt14oops xD
22:35.49b-man$kick xnt14 crouch
22:36.11b-manXD
22:36.21xntbotb-man, sorry, the "kick" command is only availible to my owner
22:36.25xnt14xD
22:36.32b-mannooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!
22:36.59xnt14$action(grab,b-man,n800,hand,run);
22:37.20xntbotgrabs b-man's n800 from hus hand, and runs
22:37.27xntbot_kicks xnt14 in the crouch
22:37.48xnt14$sequence(xntbot_clone,xntbot_)
22:38.03xntbot_kicks xnt14 in the crouch
22:38.16b-manlol
22:38.26xnt14lol :p
22:38.35xntbotdismantles xntbot_
22:38.44b-manlol
22:38.45xntboterror: no nick xntbot_
22:38.49xnt14:p
22:38.51b-manyeah!!!!
22:38.53b-manlol
22:39.19xnt14$action(deathnote, write,"Brian Mckenzie");
22:39.37xntbotwrites Brian McKenzie in his Deathnote
22:39.45b-manlol
22:40.52b-man$action(deathnote, write, "xnt14");
22:41.11*** part/#maemo FilipLinux4BE (n=filip@77.109.122.141)
22:41.14b-mandies of a heartattack
22:41.31xnt14xD
22:42.05xntbotb-man, sorry, the action() command is only available to my owner because it allows execution of shell scripts
22:42.19FireFoxnooooooooooooo!!!!
22:42.30xnt14$add F0x
22:42.37FireFoxinfobot: kill xntbot
22:42.38infobotACTION shoots a charged pseudoelectron gun at xntbot
22:42.41F0xregistered?
22:42.44FireFoxXD
22:42.53xnt14$remove F0x
22:43.23FireFoxfollows hellwolf
22:43.28FireFoxlol
22:43.31xnt14$response(attckfrmotrbots,infobot)
22:44.17xntbot*infobot's charged pseudoelectron shot bounces off of xntbots armor
22:44.22xnt14lol
22:44.32xnt14$fry infobot
22:44.52*** join/#maemo etrunko (n=edulima@189.70.16.5)
22:44.53FireFoxlol
22:45.07FireFox~burn infobot
22:45.08infobotACTION pours gasoline all over infobot, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze
22:45.14FireFoxre:
22:45.30FireFox~burn xntbot
22:45.30infobotACTION pours gasoline all over xntbot, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze
22:45.34xntbotfocuses sunlight via a mirror and burns infobots charred body
22:45.36FireFox:)
22:45.57xnt14$response(infobot,"~burn")
22:46.23xntbot's body is fireproof :)
22:46.49FireFox~screw up xntbot
22:46.49infobotACTION asks up xntbot to bend over
22:47.01FireFoxDX
22:47.09xnt14xDxDxD
22:47.29xnt14$crack FireFox
22:47.52[Fox]ha!
22:47.59xntbotcracks FireFox with a hammer
22:48.23[Fox]~attack xntbot
22:48.24infobotACTION grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing xntbot
22:48.31*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp_ (n=timeless@192.100.124.156)
22:48.42xnt14$alias(b-man,b-man16,b-man626,FireFox,[Fox])
22:48.51xntbotcreates the alias
22:48.58xnt14crap!
22:49.04Fox16XD
22:49.22*** join/#maemo christefano (n=christef@c-71-232-116-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
22:49.59xnt14$alias(id=16,n=b-man@pool-71-124-32-204.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
22:50.03xnt14ha
22:50.18xnt14now the alias is tied to your hostname
22:50.18Fox16changes his mac adress
22:50.24Fox16ha!!!
22:50.36xnt14actaually
22:50.39xnt14*actually
22:50.46xnt14thats your ipaddress
22:50.52Fox160o
22:51.02Fox16changes his ip
22:51.11xnt14checks
22:51.20Fox16lol
22:51.33xnt14still the same xD
22:52.24xnt14can't change his ip unless he calles verizon, and goes through a crappy phone system, and multiple operators xD (they don't even know what a DHCP Reset is)
22:52.36Fox16lol
22:52.43xnt14**calls
22:53.05xnt14$clip b-man,phoneline
22:53.18b-manpings xnt14
22:53.32xntbotgoes to ohio,b-man's house and clips b-mans dsl line
22:53.37xnt14PONG
22:53.40xnt14*pong xD
22:53.48b-manlol
22:53.54xnt14lol
22:54.17xnt14wait ping as if in irc ping? or the ping unix command?
22:54.44b-man<PROTECTED>
22:54.45xnt14goes down to the garage to check his fios ONT
22:55.14xnt14:P
22:55.59xnt14strangely the fiberoptic activity and the ethernet ectivity light is solid on my ONT
22:56.29*** join/#maemo dieb_ (n=dieb@201008161167.user.veloxzone.com.br)
22:56.51b-man~ping
22:56.52infobot~pong
22:57.01b-manXD
22:57.12xnt14$(sudo addsource deb http://paparazzi.enac.fr/ubuntu intrepid main)
22:57.43xnt14$(sudo apt-get update ; sudo apt-get install paparazzi-bin)
22:57.50xnt14bot apt-get installs ftw
22:58.06xntbotxnt14, all commands complete
22:58.12b-manXD
22:58.16xnt14xD
22:58.27b-manwhere did you get that bot?????
22:58.30b-manXD
22:58.59xnt14$killall xntbot
22:59.06xntbot:(
22:59.15xnt14$emotion happy
22:59.17b-man>:D
22:59.18xntbot:)
22:59.37xnt14:P
22:59.54xnt14@init xntbotv2
23:00.17xnt14:)
23:00.23*** join/#maemo xntbotv2 (n=xnt@pool-96-232-136-40.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
23:00.27xnt14yay
23:00.28xnt14:P
23:00.41xntbotv2hello xnt14, upgrade complete
23:00.46b-manXD
23:00.50xnt14$version
23:01.12xntbotv2xntbot version 2.0 development build
23:01.27b-manXD
23:01.32xnt14$inof
23:01.34xnt14*
23:01.40xnt14*./
23:01.46xntbotv2disregarded
23:01.51xnt14$info
23:02.30xntbotv2info: xntbot 2.0 running on xs1.xceleo.org as xntbot in hypervisor kvm
23:02.42xnt14kvm ftw
23:03.01xnt14$info verbose=3
23:03.06b-man$source
23:03.08b-manXD
23:03.54xntbotv2info: xntbot 2.0 running on xs1.xceleo.org as xntbot in hypervisor kvm, connected clients: 10.5.1.4, 10.5.1.21,pool-71-124-32-204.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net
23:04.11xntbotv2b-man, sourcecode is not currently available
23:04.19b-mannooooooooooooo
23:04.26xnt14yet
23:04.36xnt14not available yet xD
23:04.42b-manXD
23:04.46xnt14xd
23:05.07b-manwhat's it written in?
23:05.16xnt14$bind(xD,"xD? what does that mean?")
23:05.19xntbotv2set
23:05.29xnt14$source,lang
23:05.40xnt14$#! b-man
23:05.47xnt14*!!
23:05.50b-manah
23:06.03xntbotv2b-man, I am written in python
23:06.20xnt14xD
23:06.21xntbotv2xD? what does that mean?
23:06.25xnt14xD
23:06.28xntbotv2xD? what does that mean?
23:06.33b-manxD
23:06.33xnt14lol
23:06.36xntbotv2xD? what does that mean?
23:06.38b-manlol
23:06.40xnt14lo
23:06.43xnt14*lol
23:07.15xnt14$compile /dv/b-manbot/
23:07.27xntbotv2Checking /dv/b-manbot
23:07.32xntbotv2found makefile
23:08.00xntbotv2Output: make: *** No targets specified Stop.
23:08.05b-manXD
23:08.11xntbotv2xD? what does that mean?
23:08.16b-manlol
23:08.47xnt14$shell(rm /dv/xntbot/custom_binds/kw/xD);
23:08.47b-man~fix xntbotv2
23:08.48infobotACTION opens the hood of xntbotv2 , looks inside and says "that'll be 500 dollars."
23:08.54b-manxD
23:08.54xnt14xDDDD
23:09.05xnt14$reaction
23:09.11LiraNunaanyone knows the maintainer for dosbox maemo?
23:09.44xntbotv2slams his hood shut, and smashes infobots cpu and says "that will be 100,000 dollars"
23:09.53*** join/#maemo torkiano (n=torkiano@179.154.60.213.dynamic.mundo-r.com)
23:09.57xnt14LiraNuna: nope, let me check
23:10.10LiraNunahttp://members.chello.sk/apauer/dosbox4/dosbox4.html
23:10.17LiraNunaARM dynarec for x86
23:10.20b-manxnt14: lol
23:10.28xnt14$search(google,DosboxMaemo)
23:10.54LiraNunaoh wow it's old
23:11.00xntbotv2http://www.google.com/search?q=DosBox+Maemo&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
23:11.14xnt14lol
23:11.24b-manXD
23:11.37xnt14$hit,self,wrench
23:11.50b-manxntbot needs to replace infobot :)
23:11.50xntbotv2hits himself with a wrench
23:11.56xnt14:)
23:11.57b-manwtf
23:12.18b-manlols out loud
23:12.26xnt14$upgrade, seemless,v3.0i
23:12.34xntbotv2upgrading
23:12.59xntbotv3ihello xnt14, upgrade complete
23:13.02xnt14:)
23:13.12b-manneeds to eat dinner - i'll be back ;)
23:13.15xnt14ok
23:13.41xnt14$suspend,todisk,hypervisor=kvm
23:13.48xntbotv3isuspending...
23:14.46xntbotv3i[sleep]Send "$wakeup" to wakeup
23:14.55xnt14:)
23:15.23xnt14ok now to test out paparazzi http://paparazzi.enac.fr/wiki/Main_Page
23:21.07*** join/#maemo stv0 (n=steffen@dslb-084-058-207-201.pools.arcor-ip.net)
23:22.09*** part/#maemo stv0 (n=steffen@dslb-084-058-207-201.pools.arcor-ip.net)
23:31.31*** join/#maemo gentooer (n=asdfsf@pool-72-90-137-15.nwrknj.east.verizon.net)
23:32.59b-manis back
23:34.06*** join/#maemo GvzEvxre (n=timr@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker)
23:37.07*** join/#maemo KurtKraut (n=ktk@unaffiliated/kurtkraut)
23:45.57*** join/#maemo sanjay6976 (i=7d119087@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-29847a5a7e7090a5)
23:52.37*** join/#maemo kfx (n=k_f_x@unaffiliated/kfx)

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