| 00:00.14 | b-man | lcuk, join #random-chatt |
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| 00:07.06 | b-man | lcuk, why? - for entertainmen if you're bored - and to (hopefully) reduce spam on #maemo ;) |
| 00:07.12 | b-man | *entertainment |
| 00:07.51 | lcuk | yeah i know, but theres not much spam here lol |
| 00:11.05 | Jaffa | Especially at midnight UTC :) |
| 00:14.47 | b-man | .......good point - but it's still great if you're bored and want to type random stuff without annoying the living hell out of people ;) |
| 00:14.54 | b-man | indeed :) |
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| 00:22.34 | kfx | browserd is basically using all my ram whether I use the browser or not |
| 00:22.51 | kfx | any fixes for this? |
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| 00:38.29 | Bobbe_ | kfx, u sure there aren't any browser processes running (besides browserd)? It's using 10mb here with nothing open, but that's it |
| 00:38.31 | tank-man | kfx, maybe restart the service? |
| 00:41.19 | tank-man | ex: /etc/init.d/tablet-browser-daemon restart |
| 00:43.08 | kfx | I'll try that |
| 00:51.11 | kfx | well |
| 00:51.31 | kfx | that saved 6mb but now maemo-launcher is soaking it all up |
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| 01:25.04 | sneakret | Howdy. I want to format my N810's mini SD card as ext2, and I'm having trouble finding instructions. |
| 01:25.48 | GeneralAntilles | ~boot-sd |
| 01:25.49 | infobot | somebody said boot-sd was https://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card |
| 01:25.56 | sneakret | (I know other people have done this, so I'd rather not figure it out again) |
| 01:26.36 | sneakret | Hmm... I'm not trying to boot from SD, but I reckon formatting is a part of that. :) |
| 01:26.40 | sneakret | Thanks. |
| 01:27.33 | sneakret | any news on the next NIT? |
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| 01:35.42 | GeneralAntilles | ~rx-51 |
| 01:35.43 | infobot | rx-51 is probably http://maemo.org/community/council/community_highlights_for_december_2008-part_i-january_2009-part_ii/ http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9093153240.html |
| 01:44.42 | sneakret | sounds cool. |
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| 01:52.02 | Bobbe_ | is there a roadmap for the release of the rx-51? I tried to look for it but couldn't find it |
| 01:56.23 | Jaffa | Bobbe_: sometime between now and the end of the year. Hopefully summerish. |
| 01:56.55 | Jaffa | The final public roadmap item was "beta SDK" which was released a few weeks ago. But there's been no device announcement yet, so it's all still fairly vague. |
| 01:57.14 | Jaffa | should go to bed. Body clock is probably still on French time, which is now 4am. |
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| 02:05.42 | Jaffa | Right. That's it. I'm done. |
| 02:06.01 | Jaffa | penguinbait has pissed me off once too often, and I've been back online for less than 6 hours. |
| 02:06.26 | Proteous | damn penguinbait |
| 02:06.33 | Proteous | always drivin people off |
| 02:12.13 | b-man | hmm : |
| 02:12.21 | b-man | *:( |
| 02:13.59 | GeneralAntilles | penguinbait is clearly incapable of discussion things rationally. |
| 02:14.13 | GeneralAntilles | Anyway, thanks, Jaffa|gone. :) |
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| 02:24.37 | sneakret | I wonder how much the rx-51 will cost. Seems like a lot of hardware... |
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| 02:25.37 | sneakret | I didn't notice any info about CPU speed... |
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| 02:27.43 | sneakret | some sort of video out would rock. |
| 02:28.46 | sneakret | babbles. |
| 02:31.02 | doc|home | TI OMAP 3430? |
| 02:31.13 | doc|home | 600mHz isn't a big speed improvement |
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| 02:35.34 | sneakret | 50%... |
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| 02:37.18 | sneakret | combined with video acceleration and other dedicated hardware, it should make a noticeable difference. |
| 02:37.56 | doc|home | yeah, but for an internet tablet how much page rendering can you pass off to a video accelerator? |
| 02:38.29 | doc|home | having said that, it's not appalling now |
| 02:40.26 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, the MHz isn't the important part |
| 02:40.42 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, that's not Apples-to-Apples to an ARM11 |
| 02:40.44 | doc|home | more cache? |
| 02:40.50 | doc|home | hmmm, ok |
| 02:40.52 | GeneralAntilles | It's a Cortex A8 which is way faster |
| 02:40.58 | doc|home | ok, that'd be good. |
| 02:41.02 | GeneralAntilles | 2-3x speedup compared to ARM11 for most stuff |
| 02:41.07 | doc|home | nice |
| 02:41.09 | GeneralAntilles | Vastly more for some specific other stuff |
| 02:41.13 | GeneralAntilles | It's got SIMD |
| 02:41.34 | sneakret | SIMD? |
| 02:42.13 | doc|home | anyone guessing at a price? :) |
| 02:42.41 | sneakret | I was wondering that too. |
| 02:42.57 | sneakret | I figure with video acceleration, more flash apps will run at reasonable speeds. |
| 02:43.05 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, ~$500 |
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| 02:43.31 | doc|home | thanks |
| 02:43.35 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, the DSP and GPU are both also way faster than the ones in the OMAP2 |
| 02:43.44 | GeneralAntilles | Video decoding will be done on the DSP |
| 02:43.55 | GeneralAntilles | So, D1 in h.264 will work fine. |
| 02:44.02 | GeneralAntilles | 720p in MPEG4 part 2 |
| 02:44.11 | doc|home | nice |
| 02:44.21 | sneakret | $500 would be awesome, and is a smart target price, but I'm guessing it'll be closer to $600 initially. |
| 02:44.35 | GeneralAntilles | sneakret, we'll see. |
| 02:44.40 | sneakret | yup |
| 02:44.45 | GeneralAntilles | The OMAP3 isn't really the cost thing |
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| 02:44.53 | doc|home | hsdpa? |
| 02:44.56 | GeneralAntilles | Cost is more likely to be all the little accessories. |
| 02:44.59 | GeneralAntilles | Nah, not that |
| 02:45.02 | doc|home | accessories? |
| 02:45.04 | doc|home | hmmm |
| 02:45.06 | sneakret | I would be thrilled with $500 |
| 02:45.12 | doc|home | could this do telephone stuff? |
| 02:45.17 | GeneralAntilles | Accelerometers, FM RX/TX, dual cameras, etc. |
| 02:45.30 | doc|home | has never used the radio nor the camera |
| 02:45.31 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, VoIP, sure, GSM voice is a remote possibility |
| 02:45.40 | doc|home | GSM would be sweet |
| 02:45.47 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, 5 MP on the back (with LED flash and autofocus) and VGA on the front |
| 02:45.53 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, you see oFono? |
| 02:46.01 | doc|home | searches |
| 02:46.03 | man_in_pda | yay, downloading maps for maemo-mapper |
| 02:46.09 | GeneralAntilles | 720p video recording, should be. |
| 02:46.33 | GeneralAntilles | I suspect we'll PROBABLY see a compass with the GPS/ |
| 02:46.34 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: oh sweet, could pick up where openmoko didn't.... well, ya know :) |
| 02:47.18 | doc|home | sniffs at his still mostly unusable freerunner |
| 02:47.24 | sneakret | A decent GPS receiver would be handy. |
| 02:47.40 | GeneralAntilles | sneakret, dunno about qualify |
| 02:47.49 | GeneralAntilles | But AGPS should be a lot easier with HSPA |
| 02:47.53 | man_in_pda | umm |
| 02:48.09 | GeneralAntilles | So even if it's as crap as the one we've got now, it should work better in the RX-51 than the N810 |
| 02:48.09 | man_in_pda | why is /topic just 's'? |
| 02:48.29 | GeneralAntilles | Somebody messed it up, I guess |
| 02:48.53 | *** join/#maemo christefano_ (n=christef@9.sub-75-195-248.myvzw.com) |
| 02:48.59 | sneakret | I thought that's what we were talking about. |
| 02:49.00 | GeneralAntilles | I can't remember what the proper topic is |
| 02:49.07 | GeneralAntilles | Somebody have it in scrollback? |
| 02:49.11 | doc|home | oli is to blame |
| 02:49.12 | doc|home | one sec |
| 02:49.18 | sneakret | Ah, 's'... what an awesome letter. |
| 02:50.00 | *** topic/#maemo by doc|home -> Welcome to #maemo | http://maemo.org | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog |
| 02:50.20 | GeneralAntilles | Thanks! |
| 02:50.25 | doc|home | np |
| 02:50.26 | man_in_pda | yay |
| 02:50.41 | sneakret | I miss 's'. |
| 02:50.46 | doc|home | heh |
| 02:51.53 | sneakret | I hope Nokia tidies up some of the software, like media player. |
| 02:52.04 | sneakret | for the next device |
| 02:52.09 | GeneralAntilles | sneakret, see the Modest screencast? |
| 02:52.20 | sneakret | Nope. |
| 02:52.37 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-D-J0Y7ufM |
| 02:52.42 | GeneralAntilles | Expect that level of polish |
| 02:52.50 | GeneralAntilles | sneakret, read up on MAFW |
| 02:52.53 | doc|home | heh |
| 02:53.12 | sneakret | mawf? |
| 02:53.14 | doc|home | now if only rogers would get a decent data plan |
| 02:53.36 | GeneralAntilles | sneakret, Media Application Framework |
| 02:53.41 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, goodluckwiththat |
| 02:53.48 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: I know :( |
| 02:54.01 | sneakret | Cool. Thanks. |
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| 03:25.51 | GeneralAntilles | It'll be really nice once ubiquitous data connectivity is reasonably priced. |
| 03:25.57 | GeneralAntilles | and, well, ubiquitous. |
| 03:27.52 | fireun | and then data will be charged for |
| 03:27.52 | doc|home | hehe |
| 03:27.53 | doc|home | yeah |
| 03:27.57 | doc|home | fireun: it is already |
| 03:28.01 | fireun | every google query costs 10cents |
| 03:28.07 | doc|home | eh? |
| 03:28.25 | fireun | what, you think they'll always give it away for free? (: |
| 03:28.44 | GeneralAntilles | I'm rather amazed I went without cellular data previously. |
| 03:28.50 | doc|home | no, which is why I pay for a net connection :) |
| 03:28.59 | GeneralAntilles | I remember the first time I loaded Engadget on my 770 over my 6682. . . . |
| 03:29.11 | GeneralAntilles | I about lost it. |
| 03:29.19 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: really? I rarely miss it, and only because my work is very strict about net connections |
| 03:29.42 | fireun | doc|home: every google search makes 7g CO2 |
| 03:29.58 | doc|home | fireun: I somehow doubt that |
| 03:30.11 | fireun | http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7823387.stm |
| 03:30.21 | fireun | depends on who you believe, and which data center it goes thru |
| 03:30.23 | doc|home | bwahahaha, you're trusting the bbc on tech stuff?! |
| 03:30.38 | fireun | well google figures .2g co2 |
| 03:30.48 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, being able to load up wikipedia at a restaurant to settle a dispute, check reviews when shopping in a store or IRC from just about anywhere. |
| 03:31.02 | doc|home | ok, the reviews thing I would like |
| 03:31.09 | GeneralAntilles | I figure you're looking at the CO2 values the wrong way |
| 03:31.13 | doc|home | but as for irc, I want to get shit done too :) |
| 03:31.34 | GeneralAntilles | Think of how much would be consumed if you had to drive to the library. |
| 03:31.37 | GeneralAntilles | Or, hell, walk. |
| 03:31.57 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, sure, but having access the internet practically anywhere is really great. |
| 03:32.02 | doc|home | not to mention the manufacturing of those books |
| 03:32.10 | doc|home | the heating for the library |
| 03:32.20 | fireun | half my brain runs on the internet |
| 03:32.22 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: rogers-- :) |
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| 03:32.48 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, yeah, I tether on a $15/mo plan on AT&T |
| 03:33.54 | doc|home | any bandwidth cap? |
| 03:34.02 | doc|home | I'd like that if it wasn't at&t |
| 03:34.12 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, the claim is "unlimited" |
| 03:34.18 | doc|home | nice |
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| 03:34.27 | GeneralAntilles | But I'd bet they'd start looking at you funny if you started pushing more than 10GB |
| 03:34.40 | GeneralAntilles | I don't really do anything particularly data intensive, though. |
| 03:34.57 | GeneralAntilles | Last time I checked I had hit about 800MB in one month. |
| 03:35.16 | doc|home | here, rogers cheapest is 500mb for $25 |
| 03:35.36 | doc|home | plus "system access fee" of 6.95 |
| 03:36.11 | GeneralAntilles | I'm amazed at how bad it is up there. |
| 03:36.43 | GeneralAntilles | With your population density I'd figure they'd be beating down the doors to sell cheap cellular data access. |
| 03:36.57 | GeneralAntilles | Legislated cellular monopolies or something? |
| 03:37.19 | doc|home | pretty much |
| 03:37.25 | GeneralAntilles | Fun stuff |
| 03:37.40 | doc|home | the top dog at the communications regulator is a former bell and telus exec |
| 03:37.54 | doc|home | more competition on the way allegedly but I'm not holding my breath |
| 03:38.10 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah |
| 03:38.22 | GeneralAntilles | It's amazing the kinds of people they tend to install in those positions |
| 03:38.52 | doc|home | not if you understand politics :( |
| 03:39.14 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe, well. . . . |
| 03:39.19 | doc|home | :) |
| 03:39.21 | GeneralAntilles | It's disgusting, anyway. |
| 03:39.24 | doc|home | yep |
| 03:39.32 | GeneralAntilles | I'm personally in favor of firing them all out of a cannon into the sun. |
| 03:39.36 | doc|home | indeed |
| 03:39.40 | doc|home | deregulate the entire thing |
| 03:40.06 | GeneralAntilles | It's incredible that they can get away with pissing all over the constitution down here without anybody batting an eye. |
| 03:40.20 | GeneralAntilles | That shit should be treason. |
| 03:40.26 | doc|home | it is, isn't it? |
| 03:40.35 | doc|home | swearing an oath, then ignoring it? |
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| 03:40.48 | GeneralAntilles | Clearly not, because none of them have been shot yet. :D |
| 03:41.02 | doc|home | because who's going to do it? Other politicians? :D |
| 03:41.16 | GeneralAntilles | I'll be happy to volunteer. ;) |
| 03:41.16 | doc|home | no point in pissing off the current holder of the pie if you want a piece |
| 03:41.18 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: they're too powerful |
| 03:41.32 | GeneralAntilles | luke-jr_, psh |
| 03:41.38 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: wave to the NSA. Remember, they're friendly with your data provider :) |
| 03:41.47 | doc|home | waves |
| 03:41.49 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: the batting of eyes tends to be in the form of suicide |
| 03:41.56 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, don't use AT&T at home. :D |
| 03:41.57 | luke-jr_ | it's quite common these days |
| 03:42.00 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: hehe |
| 03:42.04 | GeneralAntilles | They're only powerful because we let them dupe us into fighting eachother instead of fighting them. |
| 03:42.07 | fireun | yeah, where do you think Alpha came from? |
| 03:42.09 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: aye |
| 03:42.15 | doc|home | fireun: alpha? |
| 03:42.43 | fireun | http://www.wolframalpha.com/index.html |
| 03:42.52 | GeneralAntilles | Democrats vs Republicans is just a ploy to keep everybody occupied while they slowly take away our rights. |
| 03:42.58 | fireun | http://gizmodo.com/5167257/wolfram-alpha-search-engine-will-answer-all-your-questions-take-us-to-infinity-and-beyond |
| 03:43.20 | doc|home | fireun: nowhere that will allow it to work? |
| 03:43.26 | doc|home | GeneralAntilles: absolutely |
| 03:43.26 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: slowly? |
| 03:43.33 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: try exercising your rights even today |
| 03:43.48 | luke-jr_ | you might get away with talking about them |
| 03:44.03 | GeneralAntilles | luke-jr_, however bad it seems, we still have the power to change things. |
| 03:44.06 | luke-jr_ | but try to actually exercise them and you'll get punished |
| 03:44.12 | GeneralAntilles | We're not quite at the armed revolution stage yet. |
| 03:44.13 | *** join/#maemo doc|laptop (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 03:44.25 | GeneralAntilles | Vote the bastards out. |
| 03:44.26 | doc|home | don't try too hard |
| 03:44.29 | doc|home | :) |
| 03:44.31 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: you can't |
| 03:44.39 | fireun | doc|home: what? |
| 03:44.40 | luke-jr_ | the power is in the hands of the unelected |
| 03:44.50 | fireun | doc|home: rephrase please |
| 03:44.50 | GeneralAntilles | Sure, because the vast majority of people are under their control. |
| 03:44.54 | doc|laptop | fireun: it doesn't work, you can't use it |
| 03:45.00 | fireun | not yet |
| 03:45.09 | fireun | its still may yet |
| 03:45.10 | GeneralAntilles | But, trust me, you get enough people to vote them out, it'll work |
| 03:45.13 | GeneralAntilles | For a few more years yet, anyway. |
| 03:45.41 | luke-jr_ | you think a judge can be voted out? |
| 03:45.49 | luke-jr_ | or a state employee? |
| 03:46.05 | doc|laptop | GeneralAntilles: if there was someone to vote for :/ The sheep don't even realise/care |
| 03:46.07 | GeneralAntilles | luke-jr_, depends on your municipality. |
| 03:46.15 | *** join/#maemo thekondor (n=kondor@wall.syntext.com) |
| 03:46.16 | doc|laptop | GeneralAntilles: they think obama is good change.... |
| 03:46.35 | GeneralAntilles | doc|laptop, sure, but that's a different issue than it being impossible to vote them out. |
| 03:46.36 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe |
| 03:46.38 | luke-jr_ | I would have voted for Obama. |
| 03:46.44 | GeneralAntilles | Obama sells warm fuzzies. |
| 03:46.47 | luke-jr_ | because McCain was no-change |
| 03:46.47 | doc|laptop | luke-jr: he's all the same |
| 03:46.50 | GeneralAntilles | Warm fuzzies are a popular product. |
| 03:46.56 | luke-jr_ | Obama at least brings hope of the USA collapsing |
| 03:46.56 | doc|laptop | luke-jr: and obama's change was... ? |
| 03:47.07 | doc|laptop | luke-jr: no, he'll just speed it up |
| 03:47.10 | luke-jr_ | exactly |
| 03:47.15 | luke-jr_ | the sooner the better |
| 03:47.27 | GeneralAntilles | There is something to that |
| 03:47.35 | GeneralAntilles | But my worry is that something worse will take its place |
| 03:47.46 | GeneralAntilles | Or something really irreversible will happen in the process. |
| 03:47.47 | doc|laptop | GeneralAntilles: I saw Lewis Black at the weekend and he was saying exactly the same thing, both parties are the same, but then he turned around and said capitalism was greed and the banks weren't regulated enough, when regulation is the only thing keeping them alive. |
| 03:47.50 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: perhaps, but not as large a reason |
| 03:47.56 | luke-jr_ | region* |
| 03:48.07 | GeneralAntilles | doc|home, yeah, that's called a cognitive disconnect. :D |
| 03:48.13 | luke-jr_ | if we end up with 50 countries, at least some of them might be tolerable |
| 03:48.28 | doc|laptop | GeneralAntilles: sure, but he's still miles ahead of the sheep :/ |
| 03:48.45 | doc|laptop | GeneralAntilles: scary, because that's the nonsense we'll have to deal with :/ |
| 03:48.46 | *** join/#maemo johnx (n=john@c-71-197-211-29.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 03:48.51 | doc|laptop | (when it collapses) |
| 03:49.41 | luke-jr_ | IMO, the US is too far gone to be worth trying to save |
| 03:49.49 | luke-jr_ | collapse and rebuild is faster |
| 03:49.58 | GeneralAntilles | I disagree |
| 03:50.00 | fireun | yay agrarian society! |
| 03:50.05 | kfx | you clearly have no experience with a collapsed state |
| 03:50.15 | luke-jr_ | kfx: at least anarchy doesn't protect the criminals |
| 03:50.24 | GeneralAntilles | I think we're at the point where two things can happen. Either we get to the point where people start to "get" it and we still have time to fix things |
| 03:50.26 | kfx | uh |
| 03:50.31 | luke-jr_ | without the state, I can use armed defense |
| 03:50.32 | kfx | when was the last time you got shot |
| 03:50.42 | GeneralAntilles | or we get to that point and nothing changes and things just fall apart anyway. |
| 03:50.55 | kfx | are you in the habit of checking your ammo loadout before you go get water |
| 03:51.08 | luke-jr_ | kfx: I didn't say I was prepared :) |
| 03:51.11 | kfx | because I've been there and this doesn't suck at all in comparison |
| 03:51.16 | fireun | that kind of stress really wears you down |
| 03:51.31 | fireun | forget being able to think meta, you're down to basic instincts |
| 03:51.50 | doc|laptop | kfx: it's not over yet |
| 03:51.55 | doc|laptop | kfx: far from it |
| 03:52.07 | doc|laptop | kfx: the fact is, politicians are making it far worse |
| 03:52.09 | kfx | when I got back to the states it took concerted mental effort not to reach for a weapon at every road intersection |
| 03:52.22 | doc|laptop | kfx: from... ? |
| 03:52.31 | kfx | it's nice not having to wake up in the morning and check your pistol |
| 03:52.45 | kfx | the road thing happened after a while in afghanistan |
| 03:52.53 | luke-jr_ | kfx: better than waking up in the morning and realizing there's nothing you can do to stop the torture |
| 03:52.53 | doc|laptop | see, that wasn't anarchy |
| 03:52.58 | kfx | doc|laptop: hahahaha ok |
| 03:53.01 | fireun | the first fourth of july was real bad |
| 03:53.05 | kfx | go hang out north of kandahar for a while |
| 03:53.14 | doc|laptop | kfx: it's chaos, but that's an incorrect definition of anarchy |
| 03:53.17 | luke-jr_ | kfx: I can't, I'm a prisoner of the state. |
| 03:53.22 | kfx | doc|laptop: you're mincing words |
| 03:53.29 | doc|laptop | kfx: not at all. Look up agorism. |
| 03:53.36 | kfx | I'm not talking about politics |
| 03:53.41 | doc|laptop | kfx: we are :) |
| 03:53.41 | kfx | I'm talking about a collapsed state |
| 03:53.47 | kfx | no politics, period |
| 03:53.57 | kfx | I'm familiar with the definition of anarchy and agorism |
| 03:54.09 | doc|laptop | kfx: a great idea. No one taking my taxes? I pay for things I use myself? |
| 03:54.09 | kfx | I'm *more* familiar with what happens when a government falls |
| 03:54.22 | doc|laptop | kfx: ok, so you're talking about the medium term. |
| 03:54.52 | luke-jr_ | kfx: in my situation where my family is being held hostage and the government stands in the way of armed rescue, anarchy is superior |
| 03:55.00 | fireun | doc|laptop: he's familiar with the experience, not the concept |
| 03:55.08 | kfx | your idealism won't help you survive the near-term, doc|laptop |
| 03:55.36 | doc|laptop | kfx: it won't, but it does help me realise I am on my own. When the government collapses who's paying the police? |
| 03:55.42 | fireun | the food hidden in the walls might |
| 03:55.49 | doc|laptop | kfx: I do realise however that I can pay someone to help protect me |
| 03:55.56 | kfx | no, you can't |
| 03:55.57 | doc|laptop | kfx: most people won't realise that. |
| 03:56.00 | doc|laptop | kfx: why not? |
| 03:56.01 | kfx | there's no enforcement of contract law |
| 03:56.08 | kfx | you make a deal, he gets the money, you die |
| 03:56.11 | fireun | sometimes to prevent having to be on your own, you have to work with others |
| 03:56.13 | kfx | then he gets everything else |
| 03:56.20 | doc|laptop | kfx: so you pay after the fact |
| 03:56.37 | doc|laptop | kfx: I can enforce that contract law myself should they breach it |
| 03:56.41 | kfx | nobody accepts that |
| 03:56.44 | kfx | money up front |
| 03:56.47 | kfx | no contract law, no trust |
| 03:57.10 | luke-jr_ | there's little enforcing contract law now anyway |
| 03:57.10 | doc|laptop | kfx: I wouldn't pay anyone I don't trust |
| 03:57.11 | kfx | if you're paying someone to protect you, they by definition are stronger than you and/or in a position to kill you |
| 03:57.28 | kfx | luke-jr_: in the US? that's a ridiculous statement |
| 03:57.29 | doc|laptop | kfx: not at all. If I pay them then I can do what I'm good at. |
| 03:57.35 | fireun | removes himself from the discussion |
| 03:57.37 | kfx | this whole country is built on contract law |
| 03:57.52 | doc|laptop | kfx: governments often undermine contract law |
| 03:58.03 | GeneralAntilles | kfx, basic assumption seems to be that people are basically evil. |
| 03:58.03 | luke-jr_ | kfx: if I don't pay a bill, nothing bad will happen to me |
| 03:58.11 | GeneralAntilles | agrees with fireun. |
| 03:58.12 | johnx | kfx++, everyone else is being hilariously optimistic |
| 03:58.15 | doc|laptop | kfx: if the worst comes to the worst I could protect myself, but I would choose to pay someone because it's financially better for me to do so |
| 03:58.16 | luke-jr_ | GeneralAntilles: that would be a correct assumption |
| 03:58.30 | johnx | hey GeneralAntilles :) |
| 03:58.34 | kfx | GeneralAntilles: basic assumption is that people with no prospects will stop at nothing to gain any advantage |
| 03:58.39 | GeneralAntilles | Hi, johnx. :) |
| 03:58.41 | doc|laptop | johnx: haha, optimism is something I've never been accused of in a discussion like this |
| 03:58.45 | GeneralAntilles | Recovered from the roadtrip? |
| 03:58.51 | kfx | doc|laptop: you're definitely displaying it |
| 03:59.00 | kfx | it's either a profound optimism or a profound naivete |
| 03:59.05 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, yup, and starting to settle into my new job |
| 03:59.12 | GeneralAntilles | johnx? |
| 03:59.20 | GeneralAntilles | wonders who the hell john_G1 is. . . . |
| 03:59.23 | doc|laptop | kfx: why? because I'm willing to pay someone for security? Stores do it all the time, do you see store security robbing the store customers/management? |
| 03:59.49 | kfx | doc|laptop: because you think money will mean anything in a post-state environment, for one |
| 03:59.50 | johnx | no G1 here. it'll be a Freerunner before a G1 :P |
| 04:00.04 | doc|laptop | kfx: that is an entirely different question |
| 04:00.34 | kfx | money is also based on contract law |
| 04:00.34 | kfx | unless you're talking about barter, but if you make it known you own something of value someone'll just kill you for it |
| 04:00.48 | *** join/#maemo gopi (n=gopi@adsl-69-228-208-70.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 04:00.50 | kfx | I watched a kid steal a pistol magazine once |
| 04:00.59 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, sorry, the question was: New job? :) |
| 04:01.05 | doc|laptop | kfx: oh, well, that one example... fine, you win... |
| 04:01.10 | kfx | he made it about three blocks before some passing man saw it, shot him, took the clip, and disappeared |
| 04:01.24 | kfx | it was representative of the bahavior pattern in the area |
| 04:01.35 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, a new old job. Back at the job I had before I moved to Japan (and totally thrilled with it) |
| 04:01.43 | GeneralAntilles | Ah |
| 04:02.01 | doc|laptop | kfx: if that was normal then we'd do that as part of our normal day to day lives. The police here are more likely to taser a person than to protect them. |
| 04:02.11 | doc|laptop | it's far easier to work with people than fight them constantly |
| 04:02.26 | doc|laptop | that is why trade/barter came about in the first place |
| 04:02.37 | doc|laptop | and gold/silver are really just proxies for barter |
| 04:02.39 | kfx | I hope you never have the chance to find out how incredibly incorrect your assumptions are there |
| 04:03.09 | doc|laptop | kfx: would you not agree that most of the problems in that country come from different groups attempting to have control of it? |
| 04:03.15 | kfx | It's always far, far easier to shoot someone and take what you want |
| 04:03.22 | doc|laptop | that in day to day business, people trade rather than rob? |
| 04:03.33 | kfx | not really |
| 04:03.37 | doc|laptop | oh come on... |
| 04:03.44 | doc|laptop | I'm not buying that for a moment |
| 04:04.00 | doc|laptop | if that were the case, no trade would exist anywhere in the world |
| 04:04.08 | johnx | it really doesn't take huge percentage of criminals to totally destabilize a country |
| 04:04.19 | kfx | don't care what you buy |
| 04:04.34 | doc|laptop | kfx: you don't see the flaw in that logic? |
| 04:04.39 | kfx | people who can afford to protect themselves travel a long way to do business in the relatively lawful areas |
| 04:05.27 | doc|laptop | johnx: I'm not arguing otherwise, but I'm saying that you don't need a giant political machine which takes 30-50% of your income every year just to facilitate trade |
| 04:05.41 | kfx | doc|laptop: I agree with that |
| 04:05.46 | johnx | doc|home, so where are your counter examples of people living in peace and harmony without a government? |
| 04:05.49 | kfx | but it's not "no government" or "huge government" |
| 04:05.59 | kfx | there are middle paths to take |
| 04:06.17 | kfx | and my whole point is that "no government" is far worse than you can apparently imagine |
| 04:06.23 | kfx | this isn't hypothetical, by the way |
| 04:06.26 | luke-jr_ | kfx: destruction of huge government is faster than reduction |
| 04:06.48 | kfx | luke-jr_: yeah, because solid political theory is always founded on "how fast can we..." |
| 04:06.48 | luke-jr_ | kfx: no government just requires preparation |
| 04:06.49 | doc|laptop | johnx: it's not perfect, but if you look at somalia, which has it's own legal system, in comparison to some of its neighbours it's doing much better. And you can talk about piracy but I see little difference between piracy and state tariffs. |
| 04:07.03 | johnx | luke-jr, and jumping out of an airplane is faster than waiting for it to land |
| 04:07.04 | luke-jr_ | kfx: while my family is held hostage, speed is of utmost importance |
| 04:07.15 | kfx | gandhi's most famous quote was "passive resistance takes too long let's burn this shit down" |
| 04:07.20 | luke-jr_ | kfx: and I couldn't care less about the general welfare of people |
| 04:07.42 | kfx | doc|laptop: hahahaha "somalia", "legal system" |
| 04:07.46 | doc|laptop | kfx: sure, I'd much rather the middle path, less government to no government. But it can still happen. |
| 04:07.48 | kfx | have you ever set foot in somalia |
| 04:08.08 | doc|laptop | kfx: you laugh, but outside of the areas being fought over, the economy there is working well. |
| 04:08.13 | kfx | somalia's even worse than afghanistan |
| 04:08.20 | doc|laptop | and if you don't believe that, then it's research time |
| 04:08.23 | kfx | I spent a week in mogadishu and I still can't believe I'm still alive |
| 04:08.34 | doc|laptop | which is one of the fought over areas... right? |
| 04:09.43 | doc|laptop | there's plenty of the country which is both peaceful and improving. |
| 04:09.43 | kfx | ok |
| 04:09.44 | kfx | send me a postcard |
| 04:09.44 | kfx | but do it right after you get off the plane, because otherwise you won't have the chance |
| 04:09.45 | johnx | doc|laptop, how about a different example then? |
| 04:09.46 | luke-jr_ | Chile? |
| 04:10.12 | doc|laptop | kfx: nice, take cheap shots just to ignore my point. |
| 04:10.24 | kfx | doc|laptop: you're working on unreliable information |
| 04:10.27 | doc|laptop | johnx: there aren't any. Politics makes sure of that. |
| 04:10.35 | kfx | you don't really have a point, just some thoughts about how you think people work |
| 04:10.37 | doc|laptop | kfx: that also is not any sort of useful response. |
| 04:10.45 | kfx | I've got over a decade of experience in lawless areas |
| 04:10.53 | doc|laptop | kfx: please, do some research on this. |
| 04:11.02 | kfx | I've personally been to lots of these places |
| 04:11.11 | kfx | I've done my research with my own eyes, on the ground |
| 04:11.12 | luke-jr_ | kfx: I've got over a year of torture by the state of Nebraska. |
| 04:11.13 | doc|laptop | kfx: see, I'm not talking about lawless, I'm talking about governmentless. |
| 04:11.19 | doc|laptop | kfx: there is a difference. |
| 04:11.24 | kfx | meaningless semantics |
| 04:11.35 | doc|laptop | kfx: not at all. |
| 04:11.39 | johnx | doc|laptop, soooo, kind of an opt-in legal system? :> |
| 04:11.41 | kfx | I could just as easily posit that any law-producing body is a de facto government |
| 04:12.25 | kfx | you can split hairs over your terminology; I've been there, and I see how people actually live in real life |
| 04:12.44 | johnx | kfx wins one internet. new discussion. |
| 04:12.48 | doc|laptop | johnx: to some extent. One sec. |
| 04:13.11 | kfx | for the first time this week, I'm actually gonna go to bed before midnight |
| 04:13.11 | doc|laptop | kfx: depends on how you define it |
| 04:13.20 | johnx | 'night kfx :) |
| 04:13.30 | kfx | in a house with no guns, because I'm fortunate enough to live in an area where that's not a fatal oversight |
| 04:13.33 | kfx | :D |
| 04:13.33 | kfx | night all |
| 04:13.38 | doc|laptop | sighs |
| 04:13.51 | doc|laptop | kfx: one sec |
| 04:14.31 | doc|laptop | johnx: do a ctrl-f for "jilab" http://mises.org/story/2066 |
| 04:15.16 | doc|laptop | that will give you a general overview, then I'd suggest reading it from the top :) It's very interesting (to me :) ) |
| 04:15.20 | doc|laptop | kfx: ^ |
| 04:16.00 | doc|laptop | sorry, jilib |
| 04:16.26 | johnx | I'm sensing some bias |
| 04:16.56 | doc|laptop | johnx: read it first, it's the experience of someone (a westerner iirc) who married a somalian and lived there for years. |
| 04:17.37 | johnx | nah, I'll just pass on this discussion. for the first time this week I have hacking to do that's not work related ;) |
| 04:18.36 | doc|laptop | johnx: you peed all over the idea, then when given information on a case, you ignore it. Then you'll bitch when having to pay taxes :) |
| 04:19.02 | johnx | doc|laptop, nope. I love paying taxes |
| 04:19.12 | johnx | I'd love it even more if it covered social health care |
| 04:19.19 | johnx | I'd gladly pay more even |
| 04:19.40 | doc|laptop | the government can tax you 100% and still not meet it's existing obligations. Good luck with that... |
| 04:19.50 | doc|laptop | it's mathematically impossible |
| 04:19.53 | johnx | and, BTW, it's your biased source that I take issue with wading through |
| 04:20.00 | doc|laptop | shrugs |
| 04:20.07 | johnx | doc|laptop, the difference is I've personally seen social health care work |
| 04:20.24 | johnx | and you've never lived in a governmentless state |
| 04:20.31 | doc|laptop | johnx: you have? I'm living in a country where it exists and sucks, coming from a country where it exists, and sucks. |
| 04:21.03 | johnx | yup, sometimes it sucks, but if implemented properly it sucks less than the alternatives |
| 04:21.08 | fireun | mars is still pretty empty of govement |
| 04:21.24 | fireun | but you may have to wait awhile for the immigration office to open |
| 04:21.29 | doc|laptop | johnx: with no competition, unlikely |
| 04:22.55 | doc|laptop | and I'm not really sure what bias you're talking about, it's a piece on a book that was written by a person who lives in the country... what more do you want? :/ |
| 04:23.00 | doc|laptop | anyway, I've things to do |
| 04:23.18 | sneakret | 21:32 <GeneralAntilles> doc|home, yeah, I tether on a $15/mo plan on AT&T |
| 04:23.18 | sneakret | 21:33 <doc|home> any bandwidth cap? |
| 04:23.18 | sneakret | 21:34 <doc|home> I'd like that if it wasn't at&t |
| 04:23.20 | johnx | I was referring mostly the bias of the site |
| 04:23.34 | doc|laptop | johnx: bias? |
| 04:23.36 | sneakret | I tether with a $15/month plan from Verizon... |
| 04:23.49 | johnx | doc|laptop, uhm, the whole site seems to be pretty anti-government |
| 04:23.59 | sneakret | (no cap) |
| 04:24.02 | doc|laptop | johnx: sure, you expect to see that posted on whitehouse.gov? |
| 04:24.28 | doc|laptop | sneakret: yeah, I'm in Canada there. Not a lot of competition here to drive prices down. :( |
| 04:24.38 | johnx | doc|laptop, eh, they have bias too |
| 04:24.43 | doc|laptop | s/there/here |
| 04:25.10 | sneakret | Prices are pretty bad in the states too. I had to tweak my phone to get tethering to work. |
| 04:25.15 | doc|laptop | johnx: and? Again, a piece written by them based on a book you can go out and buy |
| 04:25.19 | sneakret | otherwise they wanted $30/month |
| 04:25.32 | doc|laptop | johnx: and as far as I know, that person wasn't in any way linked with them |
| 04:25.50 | johnx | doc|laptop, there's bias. I have better things to do. if you want to think you've won the discussion, then feel free |
| 04:26.30 | doc|laptop | johnx: I didn't think it was about winning anything.... It was about explaining this |
| 04:26.44 | doc|laptop | for me anyway |
| 04:26.46 | doc|laptop | anyway |
| 04:26.48 | doc|laptop | I've things to do |
| 04:27.03 | johnx | me too :) |
| 04:27.16 | johnx | maybe later I'll have time to read and we can go in depth |
| 04:27.25 | johnx | and I'll tell you about what working social healthcare is like |
| 04:28.07 | doc|laptop | sure, happy to discuss it. This might not be the best place though. Bye |
| 04:28.16 | johnx | 'later |
| 04:28.27 | *** join/#maemo RST38h (i=marat@trantor.komkon.org) |
| 04:28.42 | johnx | m00f RST38h |
| 04:28.47 | RST38h | heya johnx |
| 04:29.36 | johnx | how's the weather over there lately? :) |
| 04:30.33 | RST38h | +8..+10oC, rain |
| 04:30.43 | RST38h | got soaked yesterday |
| 04:30.59 | johnx | yeah, it rained today here and everyone started driving with their butts |
| 04:31.24 | GeneralAntilles | I flooded here today |
| 04:31.33 | johnx | after an hour of what should have been a 30 minute drive I pulled off, got something to eat and let the traffic die down |
| 04:31.35 | GeneralAntilles | First rain we've had in weeks and weeks and it comes with hail |
| 04:31.39 | fireun | GeneralAntilles: where is your high water mark? |
| 04:32.01 | Macer | i want to join ZFT |
| 04:32.02 | Macer | :) |
| 04:32.11 | GeneralAntilles | fireun, when I have to detour around an intersection because the water's too high. :P |
| 04:32.17 | fireun | Macer: you watch too much tv |
| 04:32.21 | Macer | haha |
| 04:32.28 | Macer | i got hurt a week ago |
| 04:32.35 | fireun | sorry to hear it |
| 04:32.36 | Macer | so i've been watching everythig like a fucking vegetable |
| 04:32.37 | johnx | steers for the deep puddles |
| 04:32.43 | GeneralAntilles | fireun, when we don't get rain for a while the storm drains tend to get stopped up |
| 04:32.48 | GeneralAntilles | so it floods in interesting ways. |
| 04:32.50 | fireun | Macer: and its season finale week |
| 04:32.54 | Macer | you must too if you know what it was fireun |
| 04:32.56 | Macer | :) |
| 04:33.07 | GeneralAntilles | Woo! 5800 tomorrow. |
| 04:33.11 | fireun | GeneralAntilles: I lived where the ground was so hard and dry, any amount of rain turned into a flash flood |
| 04:33.35 | Macer | it has been storming for a long time today |
| 04:33.42 | fireun | Macer: guilty |
| 04:33.52 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, I think I've come to the conclusion that I don't want to do non-touchscreen mobile devices. |
| 04:34.08 | Macer | haha |
| 04:34.11 | GeneralAntilles | Looking back, there hasn't been a single one that hasn't managed to thoroughly piss me off. |
| 04:34.29 | Macer | i'm watching the one where the woman just left the bus, started on fire.. and exploded |
| 04:34.30 | GeneralAntilles | So it came down to E71 or 5800 and I went with the 5800. |
| 04:34.32 | johnx | my phone isn't pissing me off that much, but it's just a phone |
| 04:34.43 | johnx | <- big fan of phones with some physical keys |
| 04:35.00 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, I fail miserably at T9 and I'm not a fan of itty bitty QWERTY boards. |
| 04:35.01 | Macer | physical keys |
| 04:35.17 | GeneralAntilles | Virtual finger keyboards, however, I can do. ; ) |
| 04:35.25 | johnx | ah, I got used to T9. Just takes me a while to properly build the dictionary I like |
| 04:35.35 | Macer | :) |
| 04:35.45 | Macer | i hate T9 |
| 04:36.03 | Macer | it's all about qwerty phones |
| 04:36.07 | Macer | :) |
| 04:36.14 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, I'm quite sure I could get used to it. |
| 04:36.17 | GeneralAntilles | But I don't really want to. |
| 04:36.26 | johnx | fair enough |
| 04:36.27 | Macer | omg now it's storming again |
| 04:36.33 | johnx | I'm used to getting used to things |
| 04:36.36 | GeneralAntilles | Besides, I like being able to poke things without trying to find them with a dpad |
| 04:36.37 | Macer | wtf... it stops then starts .. it is rather soothing though |
| 04:36.44 | johnx | even macs don't make me that crazy anymore |
| 04:36.56 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, I'm used to getting used to things that I want to get used to. :D |
| 04:37.15 | GeneralAntilles | T9 is not one of those things, since my future plans all involve some sort of reasonable sized keyboard. |
| 04:37.17 | johnx | IT means I get paid to get used to whatever else someone pays me to get used to :) |
| 04:37.34 | johnx | <- department of redundancy department |
| 04:39.15 | Macer | johnx: don't know how you keep your sanity |
| 04:39.53 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, "paid" is the operative term there |
| 04:40.40 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, yup. are you saying no one's even paying you to use that mac? O_o; |
| 04:41.10 | johnx | ducks |
| 04:41.57 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, well, I use it to do productive work related things from time to time. . . |
| 04:42.05 | GeneralAntilles | But, anyway, it's what I grew up with. |
| 04:42.15 | GeneralAntilles | It sure as hell works better than this GNOME piece of shit. :) |
| 04:43.03 | johnx | I actually have gnome and mac setup almost comparably now. both would probably drive anyone besides me nuts :> |
| 04:43.38 | RST38h | GNOME is ok |
| 04:44.07 | RST38h | MacOS left me somewhat disappointed though: lots of eye candy, but hellishly difficult to do certain things |
| 04:44.30 | johnx | yeah, it's not bad if you let it bend you to its workflow |
| 04:44.40 | johnx | the lack of 'focus follows pointer, no autoraise' drives me a little insane |
| 04:44.57 | Macer | you actually like focus follows pointer? |
| 04:45.20 | RST38h | johnx: I absolutely hate this "workflow" thing |
| 04:45.32 | RST38h | johnx: when I say "jump" it should jump. Hence my usage of PICO :) |
| 04:45.35 | johnx | Macer, yup, and I have it set so windows don't raise even when I click inside them |
| 04:45.45 | doc|laptop | I liked focus follows pointers until people started making multiple panelled applications :( |
| 04:45.52 | johnx | is ok with emacs or vi |
| 04:46.14 | johnx | actually, I like pico and joe as well |
| 04:46.29 | Macer | wow. haven't used joe in a long time |
| 04:46.38 | johnx | me neither |
| 04:46.39 | RST38h | used joe on FreeBSD, a while ago |
| 04:46.44 | johnx | got used to vi |
| 04:46.54 | Macer | i never memorized all the vi commands |
| 04:47.02 | Macer | only basic editing |
| 04:47.05 | RST38h | (even used Emacs, long time ago, at the university, before finding the 'pico' command) |
| 04:47.06 | johnx | I started using joe/jpico when RedHat pulled pico from its default install |
| 04:47.33 | johnx | errr...or maybe when I switched to debian |
| 04:47.36 | Macer | is rhel pay only? |
| 04:47.52 | Macer | like you can only get it if you pay for it? |
| 04:48.35 | johnx | yup, but look up CentOS |
| 04:49.07 | Macer | oh i know centos is the same thingish |
| 04:49.11 | RST38h | Fedora too |
| 04:49.13 | Macer | but i never really looked at rhel |
| 04:49.24 | RST38h | centos sucks moose balls |
| 04:49.31 | Macer | to see if it was something that you can only get if you pay for it |
| 04:49.32 | doc|laptop | it does |
| 04:49.33 | doc|laptop | big ones |
| 04:49.37 | doc|laptop | big hairy ones |
| 04:49.38 | Macer | RST38h: i use it for my zimbra server |
| 04:49.40 | Macer | :) |
| 04:49.48 | doc|laptop | and their IRC channel is even worse |
| 04:49.51 | Macer | it runs |
| 04:50.18 | Macer | $349 for a basic 1 yr sub |
| 04:50.20 | Macer | wow |
| 04:50.40 | Macer | that's ms server pricing :) |
| 04:50.44 | RST38h | Macer: you probably did not have to do anything complicated |
| 04:51.10 | RST38h | remembers some package requiring the latest version of Python or PERL (don't remember) |
| 04:51.20 | Macer | RST38h: not really. just zimbra |
| 04:51.35 | RST38h | After that new version was installed, the whole package management system broke completely |
| 04:51.48 | Macer | RST38h: reminds me of gentoo |
| 04:51.52 | johnx | remembers upgrading RHEL4, inside a point release, and it just failing to boot |
| 04:51.58 | RST38h | Because it relied on the older version of PERL/Python and did not come with its own install in some safe place |
| 04:52.18 | Macer | RST38h: definately sounds like gentoo :) |
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| 04:52.50 | RST38h | Macer: To hell with them all. I am used to FreeBSD which never ever breaks unless you hit it with a lightning bolt |
| 04:52.57 | RST38h | And this Linux crap drives me mad. |
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| 04:53.09 | Macer | :) i'm sad to say i agree with you |
| 04:53.16 | Macer | but i do like nexenta |
| 04:53.34 | johnx | heh...nexenta was kinda b0rken last time I tried |
| 04:53.36 | RST38h | kinda came to peace with Ubuntu/Debian, which do not act up too much, but the other distros just drive him mad |
| 04:53.51 | Macer | johnx: i'm using it for my fs |
| 04:54.03 | Macer | so far it's been pretty solid |
| 04:54.09 | johnx | RST38h, with you on that :) |
| 04:54.22 | Macer | i think lenny is pretty nice |
| 04:54.29 | Macer | but it's the ext2/3 that linux is still stuck with |
| 04:54.58 | johnx | eh, ext3 never did me wrong |
| 04:55.07 | Macer | :) |
| 04:55.14 | Macer | make huge storage with it |
| 04:55.20 | Macer | and tell me that again |
| 04:56.31 | johnx | huge storage? |
| 04:56.32 | johnx | how big? |
| 04:56.50 | Macer | something past 5TB? :) |
| 04:57.04 | johnx | aaaand, what happens then? |
| 04:57.06 | Macer | 16TB |
| 04:57.07 | Macer | heh |
| 04:57.32 | johnx | I think we're pushing at least 4TB at work with no real problems |
| 04:57.32 | Macer | some things are like sex. they are just meant to be experienced |
| 04:58.06 | johnx | so, is this like sex or like falling down the stairs |
| 04:58.08 | johnx | ? |
| 04:58.38 | Macer | having sex while falling down the stairs |
| 04:58.55 | Macer | heh.. ok. i need to get some sleep |
| 04:59.36 | fireun | apparently |
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| 05:00.42 | RST38h | http://exiledonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/obamaspock-275x235.jpg |
| 05:04.28 | doc|home | spock was smarter than becoming US president |
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| 05:12.08 | man_in_ltop | waves |
| 05:12.21 | man_in_ltop | what's a good quick sketch app for maemo? :D |
| 05:12.44 | GeneralAntilles | liqbase, Xournal, MaemoPad+ |
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| 05:20.23 | aspect | xournal is nice |
| 05:21.44 | RST38h | needs an update though |
| 05:21.57 | man_in_ltop | what update? |
| 05:23.53 | RST38h | whatever is in extras-devel version has to get debugged and merged into official one |
| 05:25.20 | man_in_ltop | ok |
| 05:29.22 | RST38h | lots of offtopic threads lately... |
| 05:29.52 | RST38h | unless nokia releases something soon, it is all going downhill =( |
| 05:31.05 | johnx | yeah, seems like things are kind of hanging in limbo. I guess that's the danger of a software platform that doesn't really run on the existing hardware |
| 05:31.27 | StsN800 | RST38h, encourage rumour on Star Trek, Maemo and 'Rover' |
| 05:32.01 | StsN800 | (a codename we saw) |
| 05:32.40 | ljp | I can say for certain that maemo guys are hard at work on the next maemo device, so no limbo, just not talking :) |
| 05:33.20 | StsN800 | it's causing community psychosis to wait :> |
| 05:33.28 | RST38h | Sts: Exactly |
| 05:33.39 | RST38h | Sts: And then everybody gets tired and goes away |
| 05:34.40 | johnx | ljp, oh, the people *here* definitely know, but I think it's causing some people to hold off 1) buying tablets and 2) starting projects |
| 05:35.16 | johnx | RST38h, a couple people getting tired actually seems preferable to things fragmenting in 6 different directions |
| 05:36.10 | RST38h | johnx: if these people are your whole community... |
| 05:36.37 | johnx | RST38h, we can renew interest, it's hard to un-fragment |
| 05:38.35 | man_in_ltop | if they make a n810-compat OS with wpa-eap/pap, i'll be happy :P |
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| 05:52.59 | RST38h | Toshiba slapped 512GB SSD drive into an R600 |
| 05:53.29 | RST38h | (instead of fixing the LCD :)) |
| 05:54.45 | man_in_ltop | 512GB ssd? |
| 05:56.57 | man_in_ltop | gah, now my n810 won't boot again |
| 05:59.00 | man_in_ltop | ah, flat battery |
| 05:59.24 | man_in_ltop | someone turned off my charger |
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| 06:05.20 | thux | morning |
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| 06:06.19 | johnx | morning thux |
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| 06:34.11 | RST38h | If anybody interested, AlmostTI source code is now available athttp://fms.komkon.org/ATI85/ |
| 06:35.22 | Sts|office | woo :) |
| 06:35.26 | Sts|office | what license, out of curiousity? |
| 06:35.44 | Sts|office | (i'm not going to ask "why not gpl", in case you wonder) |
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| 06:37.33 | RST38h | Sts: no commercial use, have to make a reference to me when using it otherwise |
| 06:37.38 | Sts|office | fair enough |
| 06:37.53 | RST38h | Sts: and yes, if you do not make major changes to the code, do not call it a different name :) |
| 06:38.26 | Sts|office | hehe.. i had that with my ircd |
| 06:38.29 | Sts|office | but through a sneaky trick |
| 06:38.47 | Sts|office | if you were able to figure out what made it crash if you changed the ircd name, you were allowed to change the name ;) |
| 06:38.52 | Sts|office | that kept forks at a record low |
| 06:38.57 | RST38h | heh |
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| 06:39.50 | Sts|office | and manifested the 83% dominance on the ircd market ;) |
| 06:40.04 | RST38h | !!! |
| 06:40.21 | RST38h | Btw, would you care to dump your 84+ ROM? |
| 06:40.47 | Stskeeps | yeah - i just have a couple of things to do but i'll work on it when i get a free moment |
| 06:40.58 | RST38h | Thanks - it should be relatively easy too |
| 06:41.14 | Stskeeps | i bought the 84+ and used it for one measly exam. |
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| 06:58.22 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
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| 07:00.48 | luke-jr_ | RST38h: pfft, non-Free |
| 07:01.59 | luke-jr_ | RST38h: false advertising on the page, since it isn't Free |
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| 07:05.45 | RST38h | luke: it isn't RMS-free |
| 07:06.05 | RST38h | luke: do you see any mention of RMS at the page? |
| 07:06.13 | tank-man | http://www.opensource.org/licenses/alphabetical lots to choose from |
| 07:06.53 | luke-jr_ | RST38h: "free" is independent of RMS |
| 07:07.10 | luke-jr_ | it's an English word even! |
| 07:07.51 | luke-jr_ | maybe you mean "free of charge", a small subset of "free" also known as "gratis" |
| 07:12.57 | RST38h | luke: ATI85 is free in terms of English |
| 07:16.39 | thux | i have always wondered which one is more 'free' bsd-license or gpl-license |
| 07:16.53 | Stskeeps | depends if you're a gnubie or not |
| 07:17.00 | RST38h | In terms of things you can do, BSD license is better |
| 07:17.24 | RST38h | GPL comes with strings attached, BSD is "do what you want" type |
| 07:18.03 | thux | ok seems clear |
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| 08:12.54 | JZA | hi anyone here |
| 08:13.09 | JZA | I have experienced issues with my chat client |
| 08:13.15 | JZA | I get duplicate and even triplicate contacts |
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| 08:13.27 | JZA | is there a way to get rid fo them without deleating the contact? |
| 08:13.36 | JZA | my guess is that they are just nodes in an XML file |
| 08:13.42 | JZA | anyone can help me out debug this |
| 08:18.26 | RST38h | ICQ? |
| 08:18.27 | JZA | where can I find the specs for the maemo chat |
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| 08:22.42 | Stskeeps | dear god on the participants list for danish weekend: |
| 08:22.43 | Stskeeps | | 48 || doe john || || null |
| 08:23.36 | JZA | where can I find the specs for the maemo chat |
| 08:23.48 | RST38h | are || participants too? |
| 08:24.25 | rmt | I think I'll try to come to the Amsterdam thing in October.. |
| 08:24.32 | rmt | Want to visit some friends in Holland anyway. :-) |
| 08:24.46 | rmt | And should probably de-register myself from Den Haag. ;) |
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| 08:46.49 | RST38h | This netbook I would probably buy: http://www.engadget.com/2009/05/14/asus-eee-keyboard-to-launch-by-end-of-june/ |
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| 08:50.32 | timeless_mbp_ | crashanddie: hey... |
| 08:50.36 | timeless_mbp_ | is scared |
| 08:50.40 | Razumihin | <PROTECTED> |
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| 08:51.45 | Razumihin | Irc while you play? |
| 08:52.06 | Stskeeps | always good? :P |
| 08:52.09 | Razumihin | (and can I have that with keytronic ergoforce keyboard please :)) |
| 08:52.45 | RST38h | Razumihin: prolly not =) |
| 08:53.02 | RST38h | Razumihin: but it if can play movies well, it will make a decent video center |
| 08:53.08 | timeless_mbp | w/ hdmi for the real display |
| 08:53.20 | timeless_mbp | the touch display can be for things like enter a pin or sign your name |
| 08:53.32 | timeless_mbp | or a game / special nav/input region |
| 08:53.59 | *** join/#maemo romullo (n=romulo@150.165.63.86) |
| 08:54.45 | *** join/#maemo matthias_ (n=matthias@leila.wist.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 08:55.50 | RST38h | The mother (and father) of all remote controls |
| 08:56.10 | *** join/#maemo florian_kc (n=fuchs@port-217-146-132-69.static.qsc.de) |
| 08:56.49 | Razumihin | Hmh... is maemo mapper just pure gtk... I think I could make those menus less confusing someday... |
| 08:56.58 | lcuk | RST38h, i would have one but for the fact im a left hander and cant use that side, and also my keyboard gets tonnes of crap on it |
| 08:57.07 | Razumihin | Who the heck has invented the option orders... |
| 08:57.13 | RST38h | lcuk: turn it upside down then :) |
| 08:57.18 | suihkulokki | RST38h: without infrared and bluetooth? |
| 08:57.40 | RST38h | suhkulokki: Yes. WiFi is sufficient. And they seem to promise some wireless video link for it. |
| 08:57.42 | Razumihin | I think if I would try to find "show me my position" button while i was driving I would hit something. |
| 08:58.24 | RST38h | RazumihinL Want to improve maemo mapper, start by adding overlaid "my position", "zoom in", and "zoom out" buttons a la Map application |
| 08:58.43 | Razumihin | RST38h: Yep. That's my plan... |
| 08:58.45 | lcuk | heh RST38h |
| 08:59.10 | Razumihin | For zooming i prefer the hw keys, but slider would be ok. |
| 08:59.11 | lcuk | the most novel thing ive seen like that has been putting LCD into the touchpad on a laptop |
| 08:59.14 | timeless_mbp | Razumihin: don't gps and drive |
| 08:59.16 | lcuk | cant remember where i saw it.. |
| 08:59.23 | RST38h | Razumihin: this is the most obvious problem with its UI and the developer does not like overlaid buttons for some reason |
| 08:59.23 | Razumihin | timeless_mbp: I normally irc and drive... |
| 08:59.26 | lcuk | mornin timeless \o |
| 08:59.33 | timeless_mbp | it's explicitly in the manual .... |
| 08:59.36 | timeless_mbp | hi lcuk |
| 08:59.40 | RST38h | Razumihin: slider is actually worse than two buttons with + and - |
| 08:59.44 | timeless_mbp | it's 2am, so yes, technically |
| 09:00.04 | Razumihin | Oh, speaking of which I have to go and turn my parking disc... |
| 09:00.11 | RST38h | Razumihin: Slider is harder to control, especially considering high CPU usage that will make UI hang when you slide |
| 09:00.23 | Razumihin | RST38h: Yeah, true. |
| 09:00.28 | Razumihin | Maybe buttons then. |
| 09:00.30 | lcuk | RST38h, a real proper variable rheostat slider :D |
| 09:00.33 | Razumihin | But let's see when I have time.. |
| 09:00.49 | RST38h | lcuk: I am sure RX-51 will have one :) |
| 09:00.53 | Razumihin | dinner-> |
| 09:00.56 | lcuk | hahahahah |
| 09:01.41 | RST38h | Seriously, why doesn't Nokia release at least one or two steampunk-stylized devices? |
| 09:02.02 | RST38h | They make all kinds of weird designer crap why no steampunk? |
| 09:02.05 | Stskeeps | wooden rx-51? ;p |
| 09:02.05 | lcuk | cos its all fun and games until someone pokes their eye out |
| 09:02.18 | timeless_mbp | beagleboard? |
| 09:02.23 | lcuk | has a wooden 810 |
| 09:02.54 | lcuk | but you are right,asus are expanding their bamboo line i hear |
| 09:03.14 | lcuk | RST38h, you can punk your 8x0 right now |
| 09:03.29 | lcuk | all it needs is some sticky back plastic, a hot glue gun and some bits from the shed |
| 09:03.37 | RST38h | lcuk: yes but it is to dear to me and I am bad at modding :) |
| 09:04.19 | lcuk | heh its ok, Stskeeps is bad at dressmaking, but hes gotta stitch in 30 devices to make a dress |
| 09:04.34 | Razumihin | I have already got steampunk nokia 9500 ;) |
| 09:05.14 | lcuk | cool |
| 09:06.16 | Razumihin | Whttp://laite.ath.cx/9500STMPNK.jpg |
| 09:06.17 | *** join/#maemo tchan1 (n=tchan@c-67-173-9-133.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 09:06.26 | Razumihin | But the dinner ;) |
| 09:06.44 | Razumihin | Base is fully black on that |
| 09:09.21 | lcuk | heh |
| 09:09.39 | lcuk | i thought this was an 810 from the thumbnail |
| 09:09.42 | lcuk | http://www.ubergizmo.com/photos/2008/7/steampunk-laptop-skin.jpg |
| 09:10.18 | lcuk | now what would be cool would be something like that, but when you press keys, the screen actually makes the innards move and stuff |
| 09:10.35 | JZA | I have experienced issues with my chat client |
| 09:10.41 | JZA | I get duplicate and even triplicate contacts |
| 09:10.48 | JZA | is there a way to get rid fo them without deleating the contact? |
| 09:10.51 | lcuk | :( |
| 09:10.55 | JZA | anyone can help me out debug this |
| 09:11.03 | lcuk | i dunno i dont use it sorry |
| 09:11.05 | JZA | my guess is that they are just nodes in an XML file |
| 09:11.19 | RST38h | uses Pidgin |
| 09:11.34 | JZA | where can I find the specs for maemo chat? |
| 09:11.39 | JZA | or the source |
| 09:11.44 | man_in_ltop | pidgin is evil |
| 09:11.56 | man_in_ltop | maemo chat is a jabber/xmpp client |
| 09:11.59 | RST38h | Pidgin is a bird. |
| 09:12.33 | lcuk | bbl anyway |
| 09:12.57 | wjt | maemo chat? |
| 09:13.43 | man_in_ltop | chat client that comes with maemo :P |
| 09:14.37 | *** join/#maemo zap__ (n=zap@94.25.228.90) |
| 09:22.48 | *** join/#maemo avs (n=avs@net-109.nrpn.net) |
| 09:22.53 | *** join/#maemo simboss (n=simone@host30-200-dynamic.37-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 09:25.26 | *** join/#maemo AD-N770 (n=jep@o.bcn.fluendo.net) |
| 09:31.31 | *** part/#maemo JZA (n=opera@189.132.183.210) |
| 09:33.16 | wjt | man_in_ltop: oh in which case |
| 09:33.31 | wjt | damn. jza left before i could direct them to the telepathy source |
| 09:33.55 | RST38h | he probably wouldn't be able to make use of it anywya |
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| 09:42.18 | *** part/#maemo mardi__ (n=mardi_@212.183.136.194) |
| 09:58.58 | Stskeeps | wonders why there's matchbox-window-manager 1 development going on on the stage svn |
| 09:59.19 | lcuk | ? |
| 09:59.21 | lcuk | link |
| 09:59.41 | Stskeeps | well just that the old WM is still being developed |
| 10:00.35 | lcuk | i still poke around in some of my old code bases occasionally :P |
| 10:00.50 | lcuk | made an alteration to one from 2001 just last week :D |
| 10:01.06 | Stskeeps | still, nokia normally doesn't do things for no reason |
| 10:01.43 | lcuk | thats true for any stable project |
| 10:02.34 | RST38h | Sts: really? =) |
| 10:03.02 | Robot101 | Stskeeps: yeah I'd contest that :P |
| 10:03.18 | Stskeeps | but really, why work on a WM they don't use anymore? :P |
| 10:03.30 | lcuk | isnt it used in olpc |
| 10:03.33 | *** join/#maemo hannesw_ (n=hannes@pluto.systemone.at) |
| 10:08.03 | *** join/#maemo t][s][o (n=tso@40.84-49-134.nextgentel.com) |
| 10:09.32 | RST38h | finally found who keeps him without 3G |
| 10:09.43 | *** join/#maemo AD-N770 (n=jep@o.bcn.fluendo.net) |
| 10:10.10 | RST38h | Freaking military is saying that 3g interferes with their frequencies |
| 10:10.27 | Stskeeps | lol |
| 10:12.28 | *** join/#maemo cmvo_ (n=cmvo@ex4.73a.net) |
| 10:13.23 | Razumihin | :P |
| 10:13.23 | Razumihin | nice. |
| 10:14.27 | *** join/#maemo borism (n=boris@195-50-204-63-dsl.krw.estpak.ee) |
| 10:14.43 | RST38h | They do promise 3G on the subway by the end of 2Q2009 |
| 10:15.41 | *** join/#maemo mardi__1 (n=mardi_@nat/ibm/x-ac2b7d867f979aa6) |
| 10:17.26 | Stskeeps | wb lardman |
| 10:17.33 | RST38h | wonders what would military use 2.1GHz for: it is too short for long distance communications, radars would not care about some measly 3G stations, and the short distance comms are not traditionally using this band |
| 10:17.36 | *** join/#maemo dforsyth (n=dforsyth@cripple.student.umd.edu) |
| 10:17.49 | *** join/#maemo radic (n=radic@ip-90-187-157-190.web.vodafone.de) |
| 10:18.45 | lcuk | RST38h, isnt that microwave frequency, and arent the mil interested in crowd control.. |
| 10:19.04 | *** part/#maemo mardi__1 (n=mardi_@nat/ibm/x-ac2b7d867f979aa6) |
| 10:19.06 | RST38h | lcuk: microwave is 2.4GH |
| 10:19.41 | RST38h | lcuk: Somehow, the military has swallowed all those ovens and wifi stations and didn't puke |
| 10:19.47 | Stskeeps | wtf @ thp's post |
| 10:20.14 | RST38h | But 2.1GHz they have problems with, afraid to take a bribe in the open or just want too much, dunno |
| 10:20.34 | Stskeeps | http://khan.thpinfo.com/~thp/tmp/frmntl/ |
| 10:21.11 | Stskeeps | (yes, i know that's probably vnc and such) |
| 10:21.24 | lcuk | vnc |
| 10:21.27 | lcuk | lol |
| 10:21.46 | Stskeeps | i will throw a honest to god fit if suddenly nokia comes out with fremantle for n8x0 :P |
| 10:22.04 | X-Fade | Well, I don't see why what he shows can't run in n810. |
| 10:22.17 | RST38h | Sts" looks slow |
| 10:22.27 | X-Fade | It is certainly not using any acceleration ;) |
| 10:22.28 | Stskeeps | yeah, i really wonder why use clutter in the first place |
| 10:22.36 | lcuk | ive been telling ppl this is a great way to feel it :) |
| 10:22.57 | RST38h | does not get reasons behind clutter either |
| 10:23.17 | X-Fade | Only used for bling? |
| 10:23.25 | RST38h | it looks like a really messy way to do Flash animations with glib |
| 10:23.48 | RST38h | X-Fade: isn |
| 10:23.56 | RST38h | t it kinda overkill for bling? :) |
| 10:24.12 | X-Fade | RST38h: Nah, OpenGLES bling ;) |
| 10:24.28 | lcuk | hates lag |
| 10:24.48 | X-Fade | lcuk: It is probably used to display something during lag that is already there? |
| 10:24.55 | lcuk | can someone close the browser window on my machine i opened and now cant see anything with.. |
| 10:26.31 | lcuk | heh X-Fade it was movie lag |
| 10:26.57 | lcuk | grrrs @ sts |
| 10:36.43 | lardman | so was that video with sw ogles? |
| 10:36.52 | lardman | is a bit behind the times |
| 10:37.02 | Stskeeps | lardman: i think it was just VNC/something |
| 10:37.11 | lcuk | qoles trick :D |
| 10:37.36 | lardman | oh, well that's a bit crap |
| 10:37.41 | lardman | pardon my French |
| 10:37.51 | Stskeeps | lardman: if you listen to the music you'd understand :) |
| 10:38.33 | *** join/#maemo EgS (n=egs@quassel/developer/egs) |
| 10:38.54 | lardman | ah, no speakers at work |
| 10:39.04 | Stskeeps | "wouldn't it be nice.." song :P |
| 10:39.26 | Stskeeps | at least the theme isn't orange. |
| 10:39.39 | lardman | ah ok |
| 10:40.03 | *** join/#maemo `0660 (n=olli@dsl-jnsbrasgw2-fea4df00-239.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 10:40.46 | lcuk | lardman, we need a progress bar for how much disassembly you have gotten through |
| 10:40.52 | *** join/#maemo christefano (n=christef@c-76-24-2-238.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 10:41.05 | *** join/#maemo VDVsx (i=c189b3b5@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-cc74cf2f142655f3) |
| 10:41.12 | lcuk | and we expect holly to help whilst on honeymoon |
| 10:41.23 | lardman | lol |
| 10:41.28 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 10:41.50 | lardman | nothing since yesterday, I was splitting the functions into their original source files (the names of which were included in the debugging info) |
| 10:41.53 | lcuk | where are you goin for that |
| 10:42.09 | lardman | but might give that up as it looks a bit dodgy and some choices are hard |
| 10:42.14 | lardman | Red Sea, Egypt |
| 10:42.28 | lcuk | at least its not mexico |
| 10:42.31 | Stskeeps | tablet on a pyramid pic ;p |
| 10:42.32 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 10:42.59 | X-Fade | lardman: Hurgada? |
| 10:43.03 | lardman | yeah, we were thinking of Mexico, thankfully we decided against |
| 10:43.06 | lcuk | lol if lardman tries that one, the next pic will be n810 in the nile |
| 10:43.35 | lcuk | closely followed by lardman in the nile :D |
| 10:43.38 | lardman | X-Fade: looked at that, but decided for Sharm as we fancy some snorkelling, etc |
| 10:44.10 | X-Fade | lardman: Did a lot of diving in Hurgada. Red sea is excellent for that. |
| 10:44.28 | X-Fade | But.. I'll never go to Egypt again. |
| 10:44.30 | lardman | I'm not a diver, though Holly is, so I want reefs close to the shore :) |
| 10:44.47 | lardman | yeah, well we thought we'd take a chance and see how it goes... |
| 10:44.55 | lardman | USA & Europe are really expensive for us atm |
| 10:45.07 | X-Fade | Nature is very nice there. |
| 10:45.46 | X-Fade | It is just that the people are so poor that they make walking around hard. And especially for women. |
| 10:45.49 | lardman | just not the food? ;) |
| 10:46.11 | X-Fade | And the armed soldiers at every corner weren't very nice too. |
| 10:46.13 | lardman | yeah, well we're all set for a couple of weeks of chilling out and sunbathing, so no probs there |
| 10:46.19 | lardman | sounds a bit like India |
| 10:46.21 | X-Fade | The food? Well do you like stews? |
| 10:47.08 | X-Fade | lardman: Yeah, as long as you stay in your resort/hotel is not a problem. |
| 10:49.15 | RST38h | .GR or .BG is the answer |
| 10:49.21 | soap | the reefs are close to the shore in Guam. ;) |
| 10:49.25 | *** join/#maemo doc|work (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 10:49.38 | RST38h | Not as nice sea but at least you can walk around |
| 10:49.39 | X-Fade | soap: That can be a downside too. |
| 10:50.00 | X-Fade | soap: Locals standing on top of coral always give me the creeps. |
| 10:50.25 | lardman | expensive |
| 10:51.04 | RST38h | more expensive than Egypt indeed, but not nearly as bad as other places |
| 10:51.20 | lbt | used http://www.oonasdivers.com/ a couple of times... would use them again :) |
| 10:51.21 | lcuk | a wet weekend in bognor |
| 10:51.49 | lbt | had a great week on a liveaboard for not much money... and AC! |
| 10:52.04 | lardman | I did suggest Bognor... :) |
| 10:52.27 | lbt | also had a week under canvas down at Sharm el Sheik (IIRC) and there was no town there so no issues with safety |
| 10:52.32 | lcuk | have you had the stitches out now? |
| 10:52.50 | lardman | lcuk: nah, wrist lock |
| 10:52.52 | lardman | ;) |
| 10:52.56 | lcuk | heh |
| 10:53.16 | soap | X-Fade, in guam the reefs in Tumon are ruined due to tourists, but on the other 90% of the shore they have barely been touched since WWII. |
| 10:53.30 | lcuk | wonders where i would go on honeymoon |
| 10:53.35 | *** part/#maemo dl9pf (n=dl9pf@opensuse/member/dl9pf) |
| 10:53.37 | soap | seriously, 99% on the beach traffic is on 5% of the island. |
| 10:53.46 | X-Fade | soap: Yeah, most of the time when you move out a little bit it is a lot better. |
| 10:54.14 | lardman | we quite fancied California, not for diving mind you, but the prices were shocking |
| 10:54.16 | lcuk | i love the way tourists bitch about other tourists causing problems |
| 10:54.32 | soap | but the water is quite shallow all the way out to the reef almost everywhere. |
| 10:54.52 | soap | lcuk, I go there for work, so :P |
| 10:55.22 | lcuk | ahhh tourist wrangler, a demanding summer job |
| 10:55.59 | soap | nope, guess again. |
| 10:56.14 | lbt | crab tickler? |
| 10:56.15 | lcuk | pirate captain? |
| 10:56.38 | X-Fade | tsunami expert? |
| 10:56.47 | *** join/#maemo Pyrhos (n=PyrO@ANantes-158-1-49-105.w86-195.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 10:56.49 | soap | I map the Air Force's deeply deeply buried com lines. |
| 10:57.31 | lcuk | cool, how often are they cut by "anchors" over there |
| 10:57.36 | soap | I'm not sure a tsunami would hurt Guam. They build their houses like bunkers there due to the typhoons. |
| 10:57.52 | soap | lcuk, never - I'm talking about nuke-proof land-lines. |
| 10:58.22 | *** join/#maemo Dar (n=Dar_K@nat/sun/x-6b2ff282abba0a6e) |
| 10:58.39 | soap | no longer the AF's once they leave the base. Don't honestly know which branch owns the submarine optical. |
| 10:59.04 | lcuk | you must have a hard job then mapping what you cannot see |
| 10:59.14 | *** join/#maemo povbot` (n=supybot@office.pov.lt) |
| 10:59.58 | soap | I have all sorts of equipment for doing this. Induction locators, rf rabbit and hound pairs, radar, etc. |
| 11:00.12 | lardman | blokes with spades |
| 11:00.26 | lardman | and buckets |
| 11:00.29 | lardman | ? |
| 11:00.32 | lcuk | backhoe operators are great at finding buried cables! |
| 11:00.42 | lcuk | they have a 6th sense about em |
| 11:00.44 | soap | in guam, yes, blokes with spades. On mainland I have a vac truck to excavate with air and water so as never to risk the line. |
| 11:00.57 | lardman | yeah, just call in the gas company they are bound to find any electrical/telecoms cables nearby |
| 11:01.05 | lcuk | :D |
| 11:01.39 | lardman | may I ask why you need to find the cables, aren't they mapped anyway? |
| 11:01.52 | lcuk | i think they move |
| 11:02.08 | soap | You trust plans when digging next to such expensive infrastructure? |
| 11:02.17 | soap | Never. You always want as-builts. |
| 11:02.37 | lardman | ah I see, so it's not a yearly "let's see where they are", it's a "let's check they got it right before we cut through it" |
| 11:02.51 | lardman | cool |
| 11:03.21 | soap | Also, why attempt and assume to cobble together 50 years of incomplete plans when we'll give you a full DB-backed inventory of every connection in every manhole with 3D coordinates of the lines and conduit fill patterns? |
| 11:03.39 | *** join/#maemo ignacius (n=ignacius@193.153.107.200) |
| 11:03.39 | lardman | I assumed you already had the latter |
| 11:03.51 | soap | we make it for them. |
| 11:03.58 | lardman | ok |
| 11:04.07 | lcuk | and then in another year they ignore and map again |
| 11:04.11 | soap | Some of these manholes have nearly 100 conduits in them. |
| 11:04.23 | soap | real fricking mess. |
| 11:04.43 | lcuk | should see the mess behind our router! |
| 11:05.05 | lcuk | you and your mil spec nuke proof wiring has nothing on the rats nest back there! :p |
| 11:05.30 | lcuk | infact, what are your civvy rates lolo |
| 11:05.35 | soap | ahh, but how many of those do you have on site? I'm talking hundreds of them on the average base. ;) |
| 11:06.12 | lcuk | yeah i bet you do, its the same the world over |
| 11:06.30 | soap | can't wait for copper to die. |
| 11:07.50 | lcuk | its the same with fibre tho |
| 11:08.21 | lbt | used to do something similar in Sellafield... |
| 11:08.41 | lbt | quite alarming to find entire buildings on the map but not there |
| 11:08.43 | lcuk | soap, isnt it a log more difficult to detect fibre |
| 11:08.46 | lbt | or vice-versa |
| 11:08.54 | lcuk | lot^ |
| 11:08.57 | Stskeeps | lbt: taken by UFOs ;) |
| 11:09.05 | lbt | "oh, we demolished it" |
| 11:09.33 | lbt | more alarming to wander around the waste ponds and then have the monitors go wild as you left.... cold chills.... |
| 11:10.21 | lbt | and the time we found criticality waste in some drums and the foreman offered to "come in and shift 'em on the sunday when it's quiet" |
| 11:10.40 | Stskeeps | ponders what to do while kernel-diablo builds in stable |
| 11:10.42 | Stskeeps | er |
| 11:10.43 | Stskeeps | testing |
| 11:11.11 | lbt | good idea... testing |
| 11:11.55 | lcuk | lbt, if you work in hazardous conditions for long enough you get used to it and it becomes normal |
| 11:12.11 | lcuk | so his offer wasnt anything different to other normal ones |
| 11:13.55 | lbt | you should have seen the defences proposed to be built around that place after it turned up... |
| 11:14.14 | lbt | to be fair it was all worst case scenario... but that's nuclear safety for you |
| 11:14.43 | lcuk | yeah scary stuff |
| 11:16.27 | *** join/#maemo danielwilms (n=dwilms@dasasob.nokia.com) |
| 11:16.28 | *** join/#maemo dforsyth (n=dforsyth@cripple.student.umd.edu) |
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| 11:21.10 | lardman | wishes for some indication of n900 release data as Pandora looks like it might be back on |
| 11:21.16 | lardman | s/data/date |
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| 11:22.49 | *** join/#maemo simon_ (n=simon@ap164169.wlan.jku.at) |
| 11:22.53 | RST38h | lardman: naaah |
| 11:23.01 | lardman | I want some new hw! |
| 11:23.09 | RST38h | concludes that SmartQ is now the only "new" device on the map |
| 11:23.27 | lardman | they seem to reckon June delivery, but I'll be away, but then it will probably slip anyway so perhaps.... |
| 11:23.35 | lardman | Q7 isn't out yet though |
| 11:23.59 | lcuk | i got over my hardware fetish at christmas with my x41 |
| 11:24.16 | lardman | I thought I'd have too with a Pandora, but no |
| 11:24.19 | lcuk | im now regretting it cos it is pen touch and isnt easy to get pen out to touch on the wall |
| 11:25.12 | lcuk | i might go and nab one of the touch panels from the trafford centre lol |
| 11:28.55 | RST38h | lcuk: I am not sure what x41 may have in common with fetish |
| 11:29.38 | lcuk | heh ive wanted a big touchpanel for yonks now |
| 11:30.19 | lcuk | and the x41 proves the principle works, but with the pen and fact its dpi is shockingly low compared to my 810 |
| 11:30.39 | RST38h | plus the thing is ugly like hell and made by Lenovo |
| 11:32.16 | *** join/#maemo lizardo (n=lizardo@189.2.128.130) |
| 11:32.49 | lardman | bbiab |
| 11:36.17 | lcuk | RST38h, i think it looks and feels good :) |
| 11:36.30 | lcuk | but stuff like that is subjective anyway |
| 11:36.35 | RST38h | lcuk: puzzles me endless |
| 11:36.37 | RST38h | ly |
| 11:36.43 | lcuk | lol |
| 11:36.46 | lcuk | ill bbl as well |
| 11:37.07 | RST38h | lcuk: To me, Thinkpads are beyond subjective area, they are just plain ugly and unusable |
| 11:37.41 | lcuk | its a small light laptop that works well :) |
| 11:37.47 | RST38h | On just about any other laptop I can accept "subjective" but not on this abomination =) |
| 11:37.52 | lcuk | and happens to have touchscreen |
| 11:37.59 | lcuk | and was cheap |
| 11:38.05 | lcuk | cya later |
| 11:38.14 | RST38h | good luck |
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| 11:38.30 | RST38h | it's freaking 3.5lbs, ohhh... |
| 11:40.32 | *** join/#maemo pupnik_ (n=pupnik@unaffiliated/pupnik) |
| 11:40.53 | pupnik_ | that was so cool the dude who ID'd a song for me based on a sample i uploaded |
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| 12:34.06 | pupnik_ | how is excitement for linuxtag in germany? |
| 12:34.37 | X-Fade | pupnik_: non-existent? |
| 12:34.59 | *** join/#maemo mardi__ (n=mardi_@nsabfw1.nsab.se) |
| 12:35.04 | pupnik_ | k |
| 12:35.21 | X-Fade | pupnik_: Well, at least there is nothing planned for maemo? |
| 12:35.40 | pupnik_ | i'll bring my n810 and show it to ppl |
| 12:35.54 | pupnik_ | and - lol - the pandora if it gets finished :) |
| 12:36.22 | pupnik_ | maybe i can even finish a new emu conversion |
| 12:36.24 | *** join/#maemo luke-jr__ (n=quassel@2002:46bb:1a76:0:20e:a6ff:fec4:4e5d) |
| 12:36.40 | pupnik_ | yes, that thing i wanted to have done last year |
| 12:36.48 | lcuk | lol pupnik, while you are there do you wanna finish my presentation from last year as well |
| 12:37.27 | pupnik_ | heh |
| 12:37.35 | pupnik_ | maybe i can demo the liq coolness to some ppl |
| 12:37.39 | pupnik_ | but i have to learn it |
| 12:38.06 | pupnik_ | somebody should make a game out of that voxel engine i optimized |
| 12:38.14 | pupnik_ | a maemo-commanche |
| 12:38.17 | pupnik_ | would be easy as pie |
| 12:38.19 | lcuk | you mean the landscape thing? |
| 12:38.22 | pupnik_ | yup |
| 12:38.31 | lcuk | that was indeed the coolest thing i saw out of sdl on this device :) |
| 12:38.39 | pupnik_ | :) thank you! |
| 12:39.36 | pupnik_ | my friend who wrote one of the first 3d games |
| 12:39.44 | pupnik_ | he guessed the algorithm by seeing the artifacts |
| 12:40.01 | lcuk | well theres something to be said from looking at the optimizations people made in the past :) |
| 12:40.32 | lcuk | its just nowadays people expect multiple layers and complexity that just cant be done! |
| 12:40.49 | pupnik_ | that's the joy of these low power devices |
| 12:40.54 | pupnik_ | i mean theoretically |
| 12:41.13 | pupnik_ | joy of programming etc - you know |
| 12:41.33 | lcuk | well i'm hooked! |
| 12:41.34 | pupnik_ | tell you something about music production with synths |
| 12:41.42 | lcuk | you arent coming to copenhagen are you |
| 12:41.51 | pupnik_ | sometimes the best work you do, is with a few low power synths, not a full studio |
| 12:42.03 | pupnik_ | the limitation helps the creative process |
| 12:42.03 | lcuk | pupnik_, i would love a full orchestra on these devices |
| 12:42.09 | pupnik_ | copenhagen? |
| 12:42.21 | lcuk | you have seen boxar and the theremin and even pyano |
| 12:42.22 | pupnik_ | when |
| 12:42.26 | pupnik_ | yah |
| 12:42.26 | lcuk | its entirely possible |
| 12:42.30 | lcuk | errr dunno |
| 12:42.34 | lcuk | anyone got link with dates |
| 12:42.37 | lcuk | end of this month |
| 12:42.43 | pupnik_ | ok no, still moving |
| 12:42.57 | lcuk | you never stop moving, even when underground |
| 12:43.10 | pupnik_ | it's cause i can only move a few boxes a day |
| 12:43.12 | *** join/#maemo fiferboy (n=quassel@216.185.81.34) |
| 12:43.14 | pupnik_ | screwed up my back |
| 12:43.31 | lcuk | do you think you could pull together the gaming aspects of maemo in time for the summit? |
| 12:43.34 | lcuk | ouch! |
| 12:43.49 | pupnik_ | i can't think right now - pain level too high |
| 12:43.53 | lcuk | summit is in amsterdam - could do another mad tour |
| 12:43.56 | lcuk | ouchy |
| 12:43.59 | pupnik_ | when when |
| 12:44.07 | lcuk | you dont have to think, just hit ppl with sticks |
| 12:44.13 | *** join/#maemo blade_runner (n=arezende@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:44.14 | lcuk | again im hoping someone gives links |
| 12:44.21 | pupnik_ | ok |
| 12:44.23 | lcuk | im on vnc and cant open a browser |
| 12:44.25 | RST38h | stab 'em with sticks even |
| 12:44.29 | pupnik_ | no i really can't sit/stand/walk right now |
| 12:44.41 | pupnik_ | just maybe 20-30 minutes at a stretch |
| 12:44.42 | lcuk | what happened |
| 12:44.53 | pupnik_ | have a herniated disc - 4-5th lumbar |
| 12:45.09 | pupnik_ | an order of magnitude worse than a broken ankle, just for rough estimate |
| 12:45.11 | lcuk | once again, ouch! |
| 12:45.23 | lcuk | what about a broken finger |
| 12:45.33 | pupnik_ | still broke! is a joke! |
| 12:45.51 | pupnik_ | hows yours coming along |
| 12:46.21 | X-Fade | mikkov_: ping? |
| 12:46.46 | lcuk | it will grow back ive stopped stressin that its gonna reopen now, tho i thought i had last night after a bath |
| 12:49.30 | pupnik_ | oh baths can be bad. use cream. |
| 12:49.40 | pupnik_ | antiseptic |
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| 12:50.09 | pupnik_ | so who here had the audio sample identification app? |
| 12:50.13 | pupnik_ | i have another song i love |
| 12:50.24 | lcuk | its not infection im worried about (theres my own body protection from that |
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| 12:50.34 | lcuk | it was the swelling, it was like a frikkin sponge |
| 12:50.38 | pupnik_ | bleh |
| 12:50.40 | pupnik_ | :( |
| 12:50.42 | lcuk | expanded back up to et proportions |
| 12:50.58 | pupnik_ | i bite my fingernails. i think stuff like that helps immune system stay trained on external grot |
| 12:52.29 | lcuk | the nail has started growing now, its just growing in the wrong direction |
| 12:52.49 | pupnik_ | lol. that sucks! |
| 12:52.54 | lcuk | that will take a while to settle down lol |
| 12:52.59 | pupnik_ | :) |
| 12:53.01 | pupnik_ | damn |
| 12:53.52 | lcuk | i am so tempted to wedge a stylus in the bandage and see how well it would work |
| 12:54.57 | lcuk | did you see the mascot competition on the forums? :D |
| 12:54.57 | X-Fade | lcuk: When everything fails: http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/when_reality_meets_product_concepts/ |
| 12:55.30 | lardman | lcuk: you realise your finger will be a whithered wraith-like thing once you get the bandage off :D |
| 12:55.48 | lcuk | yeah X-Fade quim mentioned on forums he was former meamo related guy.. |
| 12:56.03 | lardman | they'll probably give you special finger exercises to do |
| 12:56.11 | lcuk | lardman, i already do |
| 12:56.16 | *** part/#maemo janneke (n=janneke@88.159.206.46) |
| 12:56.17 | lcuk | ive taken bandage off myself twice now |
| 12:56.19 | X-Fade | lcuk: Yep, he was at the last summit too. |
| 12:56.33 | lcuk | and last night i was shocked at how much skin came off in the water |
| 12:56.39 | *** join/#maemo danilocesar (n=danilo@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:56.39 | X-Fade | lcuk: Ehm, no was coming, but didn't make it. |
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| 12:56.49 | lcuk | then the finger blew up like a balloon soaking it up |
| 12:56.53 | lcuk | ahhh x |
| 12:57.21 | lardman | as I said, osmosis, trying to equalise the alcohol inside and out ;) |
| 12:57.30 | lcuk | heh |
| 12:57.38 | lcuk | "they" wont give me anything to do |
| 12:57.51 | *** join/#maemo StsN801 (n=user@212088073001.static.sonofon.dk) |
| 12:58.42 | lcuk | ive not seen an english doctor yet - i went to see nurses and they have just given me more bandages now its dried and healing |
| 12:58.47 | lcuk | its only a fingertip.. |
| 12:59.06 | lardman | plenty more where that one came from hey |
| 13:00.41 | lcuk | wiggles them all |
| 13:00.47 | lcuk | including my fingerpuppet |
| 13:01.06 | lcuk | (hence the mentioning at the start of the mascot thread ;)) |
| 13:03.09 | pupnik_ | for people considering maemo summit in amsterdam: i can organize rental of a house for a few days. |
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| 13:03.48 | pupnik_ | even a houseboat (fun option) |
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| 13:09.49 | lcuk | pupnik_, heh getting drunk and then seasick too!" |
| 13:10.23 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181192153.pp.htv.fi) |
| 13:10.48 | pupnik_ | frankly i think nokia should just identify the dudes who are working on useful stuff, and fly them to a meeting |
| 13:10.52 | pupnik_ | not people like me |
| 13:12.07 | fiferboy | lbt: Hi David |
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| 13:15.20 | RST38h | pupnik: Crimson Fields got ported to S60 |
| 13:15.38 | RST38h | pupnik: How about doing a Mameo port? ;) |
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| 13:19.06 | pupnik_ | dunno crimson fields - will look |
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| 13:21.51 | andrewfblack | Hello |
| 13:22.24 | StsN801 | lo afb |
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| 13:29.22 | andrewfblack | stupid mibbit I really need to install a real irc client on my work computer |
| 13:30.24 | *** part/#maemo qgil (n=qgil@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 13:31.05 | lcuk | lol andrewfblack whenever im in with mibbit i forget and open links or just close the browser |
| 13:31.26 | lcuk | im used to irc just goin to task tray and not actually closing |
| 13:32.00 | andrewfblack | Yeah same here |
| 13:32.24 | andrewfblack | and yesterday Freenode had mibbit blocked due to some spamming |
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| 13:37.08 | lbt | hi fiferboy |
| 13:37.15 | *** join/#maemo fkz (n=fkz@201.82.65.97) |
| 13:37.28 | fiferboy | lbt: I have tested nested scrolling and vmax |
| 13:37.33 | lbt | .... |
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| 13:37.45 | fiferboy | Nested scrolling is working well, and got rid of the performance issue in preferences |
| 13:37.50 | lbt | good |
| 13:38.06 | pupnik_ | what is vmax? |
| 13:38.09 | fiferboy | vmax seems a little bit too restricted in a long scroll area |
| 13:38.23 | andrewfblack | can't figure out the last bug keeping Minimalist 2.0 from being launched |
| 13:38.28 | fiferboy | pupnik_: Restricting the maximum scroll speed for Qt finger scrolling |
| 13:38.31 | lbt | limit the maximimum speed when you release your finger |
| 13:38.35 | lbt | I guessed 100 |
| 13:39.05 | lbt | it has no effect whilst your finger is touching |
| 13:39.31 | pupnik_ | are there any interesting apps that would use these features if ported? |
| 13:39.34 | fiferboy | Right. |
| 13:39.47 | fiferboy | lbt: hildon-pannable-area uses 500 by default |
| 13:39.51 | lbt | pupnik_: any Qt apps :) |
| 13:40.00 | lbt | units though.... |
| 13:40.12 | pupnik_ | k |
| 13:40.13 | lbt | I have no clue ... 100 whats? |
| 13:40.22 | fiferboy | pixels per frame |
| 13:40.39 | lbt | so it should be per second |
| 13:40.42 | fiferboy | "Maximum distance the child widget should scroll per 'frame' in pixels per frame" |
| 13:40.48 | *** part/#maemo jegp (n=jegp@190.2.193.222) |
| 13:41.15 | lbt | that's pannable |
| 13:41.21 | lbt | I meant my "100" |
| 13:41.37 | lbt | could be the same |
| 13:42.26 | fiferboy | It sounds like h-p-a means 500 pixels (maximum) 25 times per second to me. |
| 13:42.38 | lbt | that's a lot |
| 13:42.40 | *** join/#maemo etrunko (n=edulima@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:42.49 | fiferboy | I assume a frame is a motion event, and it defines 25 motion events a second |
| 13:42.49 | lbt | on a 800x480 screen |
| 13:43.09 | fiferboy | True, but a list widget can be much, much longer than the 480 |
| 13:43.09 | lbt | 500/sec sounds more rational |
| 13:43.23 | fiferboy | It depends on how they define a frame |
| 13:43.30 | lbt | 25 screenfulls per second.... |
| 13:44.00 | *** join/#maemo flavioribeiro (n=avaty@189.71.54.219) |
| 13:44.26 | fiferboy | Hmm, that does sound too fast. |
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| 13:44.57 | GuySoft | is Eero Tamminen here? |
| 13:45.40 | lbt | anyhow, current setting is too slow for you? |
| 13:46.59 | fiferboy | It seems to scroll about a screen height when I try it as fast as I can |
| 13:47.57 | lbt | 100 -> 200 ? |
| 13:48.25 | fiferboy | I think that would be much better, assuming it directly translates to twice the scroll distance |
| 13:48.56 | lbt | if you scroll fast you should be able to reach twice the distance |
| 13:49.02 | lbt | there's no 'boost' |
| 13:49.25 | glass | scrollspeed boost would be nice option imho |
| 13:49.35 | lbt | (although I've considered that... boosting highspeed and damping low speed) |
| 13:49.40 | lcuk | lbt are the scroll untis just steps per frame, or steps per second |
| 13:50.04 | lbt | I think 100s per second |
| 13:50.09 | lbt | looking at the code |
| 13:50.40 | lcuk | the initiall code in liqbase for kinetics is units per frame |
| 13:50.50 | lcuk | and fades too quickly on laptop |
| 13:50.55 | lbt | yeah but then the frame rate changes :) |
| 13:51.00 | lcuk | yeah |
| 13:51.11 | lcuk | the zooming view uses seconds correctly now :) |
| 13:52.11 | lbt | back in a bit |
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| 14:10.57 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: there? |
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| 14:16.55 | X-Fade | mikkov_: Automatically imported apps from Extras to Downloads. |
| 14:16.59 | X-Fade | mikkov_: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/crawl/ |
| 14:17.43 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (n=thopieka@p57A14882.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:17.47 | X-Fade | mikkov_: Info is from description in Extras. |
| 14:22.14 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: yeah, I noticed |
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| 14:24.02 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: I'm not sure if it's good to have _everything_ from extras in downloads |
| 14:24.02 | mikkov_ | I need to do some editing at least |
| 14:24.29 | mikkov_ | and maybe fix crawl install, because I think that it doesn't work |
| 14:26.25 | *** join/#maemo briglia (n=briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 14:26.36 | X-Fade | mikkov_: Well, it is in user/* so it is it should be there :) |
| 14:26.49 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: the import didn't use Maemo-Display-Name? |
| 14:26.49 | X-Fade | mikkov_: I flagged everything beta quality. |
| 14:27.46 | X-Fade | mikkov_: No.. crap forgot that :( |
| 14:28.53 | mikkov_ | heh |
| 14:28.54 | X-Fade | Well, I can do a fix run later. |
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| 14:30.49 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: you used the new name "Extras" for .install's. now application manager will have two extras, maemo Extras and just Extras |
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| 14:31.00 | *** join/#maemo lopz (n=gentoo@unaffiliated/lopz) |
| 14:31.08 | X-Fade | mikkov_: It doesn't match on name, but on url? |
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| 14:31.37 | lopz | hola |
| 14:32.19 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: now there's two Bombermans http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/bomberman-2008 and http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/bomberman . Other one has to be removed |
| 14:32.44 | mikkov_ | and fix the unixname for the original entry |
| 14:32.56 | Jaffa | re |
| 14:33.26 | X-Fade | mikkov_: Yeah, that is what you get when people don't follow instructions ;) |
| 14:35.31 | *** join/#maemo dlmarti (n=David@dsl092-055-171.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 14:36.58 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: it's not possible to delete entries? |
| 14:37.11 | X-Fade | mikkov_: No, not for mere mortals ;) |
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| 14:38.31 | X-Fade | mikkov_: Problem solved ;) |
| 14:38.42 | mikkov_ | there's also stuff like http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/gcompris-data/ which doesn't belong to downloads (or in user/*) |
| 14:38.59 | X-Fade | mikkov_: Not in user/* probably. |
| 14:39.58 | X-Fade | woosh, gone.. |
| 14:42.44 | thopiekar | X-Fade: Could you remove two of my projects on garage? |
| 14:42.50 | thopiekar | *please :) |
| 14:42.58 | X-Fade | thopiekar: Sure. |
| 14:43.24 | *** join/#maemo des^ (n=nnscript@rstk-5f76f69e.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 14:45.17 | *** part/#maemo fr01 (n=fr@212.30.2.18) |
| 14:47.06 | *** join/#maemo Sho_ (n=EHS1@kde/hein) |
| 14:49.58 | *** join/#maemo jpuderer (n=jpuderer@69-196-189-72.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 14:51.08 | *** join/#maemo harbaum_ (n=harbaum@i59F4BB2C.versanet.de) |
| 14:53.07 | *** join/#maemo qgil (n=qgil@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 14:53.27 | qgil | Stskeeps: how do you say "join us" in Danish? |
| 14:54.01 | *** join/#maemo fireun (n=tako@72-160-100-72.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 14:54.34 | qgil | Sts|office - StsN802 ? Or anybody else with a clue of Danish? |
| 14:54.52 | *** join/#maemo radic (n=radic@ip-77-25-38-213.web.vodafone.de) |
| 14:55.22 | Stskeeps | yeah - it depends on the context :) |
| 14:55.48 | qgil | "Mozilla/Maemo Danish Weekend: join us!" |
| 14:55.55 | qgil | or something along these lines |
| 14:56.00 | qgil | for the subject of a blog post |
| 14:56.06 | *** join/#maemo tulkastaldo (n=tulkas@24-236-213-147.dhcp.trcy.mi.charter.com) |
| 14:57.22 | Stskeeps | "Vær med til Mozilla/Maemo Danish Weekend!" (join the mozilla/maemo danish weekend) |
| 14:57.40 | qgil | and the ? is one of those "o"? |
| 14:57.51 | Stskeeps | one of the 'ae' |
| 14:58.01 | qgil | I'll look for one :) |
| 14:58.17 | andrewfblack | lol never seen a ? mark in a black box before lol |
| 14:58.25 | Stskeeps | æ ? |
| 14:58.44 | *** join/#maemo mib_w1tezb (i=5ad235f9@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-3aced2726afa94d7) |
| 14:59.08 | qgil | Vær med til Mozilla/Maemo Danish Weekend! |
| 14:59.11 | mib_w1tezb | Is this a place where I can ask for help |
| 14:59.15 | qgil | ah, I had found it in the character map |
| 14:59.19 | *** join/#maemo vingtetun (n=chatzill@89.196.73-86.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 14:59.23 | qgil | (first time I find anything there, actually) |
| 14:59.29 | Stskeeps | it's the ae in maemo :P |
| 14:59.35 | qgil | jeje |
| 15:00.15 | Stskeeps | you can also do "Deltag i Mozilla/Maemo Danish Weekend" which is more along the lines of participate |
| 15:02.54 | qgil | whatever you say, I trust you (glubs) |
| 15:03.26 | Stskeeps | the worst part is that i actually think my english is better than my danish, even though it's my mothertongue :P |
| 15:03.33 | qgil | but... I like the more the "ae" |
| 15:03.36 | Stskeeps | hehe |
| 15:03.50 | qgil | and "See you in Copenhagen!" (that's for the closure |
| 15:04.06 | fireun | http://www.nasa.gov/ntv |
| 15:04.11 | qgil | mib_w1tezb: sure, just ask |
| 15:04.15 | fireun | some awesome video today of the hubble repair |
| 15:04.18 | Stskeeps | "Vi ses i Koebenhavn!" (oø) |
| 15:04.20 | fireun | fyi |
| 15:04.29 | lbt | mib_w1tezb: yes.... just ask :) |
| 15:04.42 | mib_w1tezb | thanks |
| 15:04.46 | Stskeeps | eh. why does my irssi say oe is oo. |
| 15:04.50 | qgil | Koe or Kø ? |
| 15:05.25 | Stskeeps | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copenhagen ;) |
| 15:05.27 | mib_w1tezb | how do i use my n810 with email, and make it sync so that when i delete something using hotmail.com it deletes from the n810 |
| 15:08.42 | fireun | I tried using the realmedia link for nasatv on my 770 running 2008 at school yesterday - but it kept saying corrupt data |
| 15:08.56 | fireun | should I use the yahoo feed or something? |
| 15:09.03 | *** join/#maemo ceyusa_ (n=ceyusa@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 15:10.01 | *** join/#maemo zap (n=zap@94.25.228.90) |
| 15:11.06 | qgil | Stskeeps: alright, thanks! http://flors.wordpress.com/2009/05/14/v%c3%a6r-med-til-mozillamaemo-danish-weekend/ |
| 15:12.49 | lcuk | qgil, the mascot/logo for the event looks wicked |
| 15:13.06 | lcuk | they should use it for more than one event! |
| 15:13.07 | Stskeeps | np, i even received a notice about the event from a professor at my uni/work earlier :) |
| 15:13.23 | Stskeeps | i wonder if they've made the connection between me and Mer yet :> |
| 15:13.40 | mib_w1tezb | #nick jack |
| 15:13.44 | mib_w1tezb | dam |
| 15:13.45 | lcuk | i wonder if you have made a connection between you and mer yet :) |
| 15:13.53 | mib_w1tezb | *jack |
| 15:13.56 | qgil | lcuk: I would have preferred a beats with five eyes, you know |
| 15:14.01 | mib_w1tezb | *nick jack |
| 15:14.11 | qgil | I'm sure that there is plenty of those fossiles in the Danish soil |
| 15:14.18 | Stskeeps | lcuk: that's a very good question |
| 15:14.37 | lcuk | heh then speak up! i quite like the catoonowl thing |
| 15:14.59 | qgil | the narval was cool, but has no dpad |
| 15:15.16 | lcuk | we could genetically modify it |
| 15:15.23 | pacifictyphoon | so could aanybody help me |
| 15:15.39 | qgil | a kangaroo would honor the case of the 770 |
| 15:15.43 | lcuk | pacifictyphoon with what? |
| 15:15.51 | pacifictyphoon | the email thing |
| 15:16.20 | pacifictyphoon | how do i get my n810 to reconise when ive deleted something using hotmail.com on a pc |
| 15:16.30 | pacifictyphoon | i delete emails but they are not deleted on my n810 |
| 15:16.31 | *** join/#maemo ceyusa (n=ceyusa@155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com) |
| 15:16.37 | lcuk | you know quim, your mentioning of code in your hands was cool :) would be good to find a nice overview archive of the history of maemo |
| 15:16.52 | Stskeeps | the mascot should be that first maemo server ;p |
| 15:16.56 | lcuk | sorry pacifictyphoon i dont use email |
| 15:16.57 | pacifictyphoon | i want to know how to fully sync it |
| 15:17.09 | lcuk | others will though, or post onto talk.maemo.org |
| 15:17.40 | *** join/#maemo Andy80 (n=andy80@host194-204-dynamic.52-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 15:18.00 | pacifictyphoon | when i post on talk.maemo nobody helps |
| 15:18.20 | pacifictyphoon | everybodys more interested in prototype mumbo jumbo |
| 15:18.26 | [A2K]_ | pacifictyphoon: did you try to use imap? |
| 15:18.42 | pacifictyphoon | whats imap |
| 15:18.51 | [A2K]_ | mail protocol |
| 15:18.52 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (n=thopieka@p57A14882.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:18.56 | [A2K]_ | much better then pop3 |
| 15:18.59 | lcuk | mmm doesnt sound normal, i usually see folks falling over themselves, perhaps your question is so obscure use case that people dont encounter it |
| 15:19.27 | pacifictyphoon | does hotmail have imap? |
| 15:19.40 | lcuk | ask microsoft? |
| 15:20.05 | lcuk | the hotmail connection info should know |
| 15:20.13 | [A2K]_ | i think it does. pop3 is obsolete today. |
| 15:20.20 | lcuk | i thought pop was disabled on hotmail years ago tho |
| 15:20.20 | pacifictyphoon | kk thanks for the help |
| 15:20.27 | pacifictyphoon | nope still up |
| 15:20.48 | lcuk | o_O so i couldv kept my outlook express account! |
| 15:22.08 | *** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@office.pov.lt) |
| 15:22.52 | *** join/#maemo konttori_ (n=konttori@a88-113-140-230.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 15:23.05 | pacifictyphoon | is this irc just for talking about maemo or can we talk about anything |
| 15:23.27 | Stskeeps | bacon is a much discussed topic |
| 15:23.31 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@dslb-084-056-009-146.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:23.42 | lcuk | no it isnt |
| 15:24.01 | lcuk | the first rule of #maemo is dont mention the bacon |
| 15:24.12 | lcuk | if you tell everyone then we wont have much for us! |
| 15:24.14 | suihkulokki | mmm.. bacon |
| 15:25.03 | *** join/#maemo lardman (n=vircuser@92.26.79.240) |
| 15:25.19 | Jaffa | Hmm, definite bacon shortage at the Jaffahaus recently |
| 15:25.24 | pacifictyphoon | well if we can talk about anything... who watched paccquio hatton?? |
| 15:25.27 | *** join/#maemo murrayc_ (n=murrayc@dslb-084-056-009-146.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:25.38 | lardman | hires a C-130 |
| 15:25.42 | lcuk | see look, you mention bacon and lardman smelt it from outside IRC! |
| 15:25.43 | Jaffa | Oh, I had lardons in a galette earlier this week |
| 15:26.37 | lcuk | if you do an air-drop of bacon supplies, does that mean that pigs have flown! |
| 15:26.38 | lardman | prepares to fly past at 500' with 50 tons' |
| 15:26.58 | Jaffa | lcuk: lol |
| 15:27.18 | lcuk | anyway, vanishing lol \o cyas later |
| 15:27.21 | *** join/#maemo jukey (n=jukey@kamiserver.de) |
| 15:27.56 | Bobbe_ | pretty cool, fireun |
| 15:28.21 | Bobbe_ | the video, I mean. I wonder how cool it would be if they focused on some guy's box and he was watching happy tree friends or pr0n or sth |
| 15:28.22 | pacifictyphoon | nobody watched it then? |
| 15:30.33 | Stskeeps | pacifictyphoon: is that some anime or how was it? :P |
| 15:30.34 | Jaffa | pacifictyphoon: 'fraid not |
| 15:30.44 | Jaffa | Stskeeps: Boxing |
| 15:30.48 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 15:30.53 | Stskeeps | well then no :P |
| 15:31.54 | andre__ | jeremiah, around? |
| 15:31.54 | pacifictyphoon | lol stskeeps are you a programmer by any chance |
| 15:32.13 | Stskeeps | pacifictyphoon: no, i'm a perfectly normal person |
| 15:32.16 | Stskeeps | but some might disagree |
| 15:32.17 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 15:32.48 | Jaffa | Demi-god, perhaps? |
| 15:33.15 | thopiekar | etrunko : PING? |
| 15:33.16 | Stskeeps | demi moore? :P |
| 15:33.32 | thopiekar | hi Jaffa |
| 15:33.49 | Jaffa | Stskeeps: More like Dudley ;-p |
| 15:33.53 | Jaffa | lo thopiekar |
| 15:33.53 | pacifictyphoon | so anybody into sports? |
| 15:37.06 | *** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (n=timeless@24.6.218.39) |
| 15:37.49 | pacifictyphoon | whats smpt |
| 15:37.58 | pacifictyphoon | better or worse than pop3 |
| 15:38.23 | Stskeeps | smtp is the mailbox you put a letter into for it to be sent, pop3 is your home mailbox |
| 15:38.37 | Stskeeps | (well, or retrival service rather..) .. and imap is a home mailbox |
| 15:39.33 | pacifictyphoon | so imap will remove emails that i have deleted |
| 15:39.45 | pacifictyphoon | becasue pop3 does not |
| 15:39.55 | pacifictyphoon | pop3 only seems to download them |
| 15:40.12 | *** join/#maemo Meiz_n810 (n=Meizirkk@bbwirelessgw2-fee7dc00-167.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 15:40.23 | Stskeeps | pop3 downloads them and often removes them online afterwards |
| 15:40.37 | Stskeeps | imap accesses your mailbox directly (and its stored on the server) |
| 15:41.39 | pacifictyphoon | if i delete an email on my laptop using the hotmail.com it does not delete off my nit |
| 15:41.47 | pacifictyphoon | can pop3 do that or not |
| 15:42.18 | Stskeeps | imap should do that - if the NIT checks it |
| 15:42.25 | Stskeeps | but the email client on NIT is .. interesting |
| 15:42.59 | pacifictyphoon | well i used claws mail aswell but pop3 did not do that |
| 15:43.17 | pacifictyphoon | havent tried imap because i do not know if hotmail supports it |
| 15:45.06 | Bobbe_ | pop3 can delete messeges on server if you configure it to |
| 15:45.24 | *** join/#maemo lardman_ (n=vircuser@host-138-38-192-7.vpn.bath.ac.uk) |
| 15:45.47 | pacifictyphoon | can it delete them on device? |
| 15:46.39 | *** join/#maemo lardman|home (n=vircuser@92.26.79.240) |
| 15:46.54 | Bobbe_ | what do u mean? |
| 15:47.23 | *** join/#maemo TimRiker (n=timr@173-117-8-29.pools.spcsdns.net) |
| 15:47.47 | pacifictyphoon | if something is deleted by the hotmail web service will the emails delete off my NIT |
| 15:49.51 | Bobbe_ | no, probably not |
| 15:50.05 | Bobbe_ | pop3 doesn't sync, it just downloads what is there when it connects |
| 15:52.49 | pacifictyphoon | ok thanks |
| 15:52.50 | Bobbe_ | ur looking for imap =), and a better e-mail provider |
| 15:53.00 | Bobbe_ | gmail will do all the magic you want/need |
| 15:53.13 | Bobbe_ | can't you set hotmail to forward your mail to gmail while ppl get used to the new address? |
| 15:53.16 | pacifictyphoon | if i delete something on NIT will it be deleted on the server? |
| 15:53.23 | *** join/#maemo brolin (n=brolin@200.24.16.55) |
| 15:54.28 | Bobbe_ | what usually happens is that you can configure your pop3 settings to delete the e-mail on the server once it is _downloaded_ into your device. But once again, it doesn't sync |
| 15:54.40 | qgil | andre__: ping |
| 15:54.45 | *** join/#maemo andre_ (n=andre@berlin-gw.trolltech.de) |
| 15:54.53 | qgil | ? |
| 15:55.02 | qgil | andre_ ping |
| 15:55.13 | pacifictyphoon | thanks bobbe |
| 15:55.27 | Bobbe_ | np |
| 15:55.32 | andre__ | qgil, pong |
| 15:55.37 | qgil | hi there |
| 15:55.43 | andre__ | nickname conflicts ;-) |
| 15:55.48 | mikkov_ | X-Fade: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29001 |
| 15:55.54 | andre__ | hi |
| 15:56.02 | qgil | one thing, the email Richard sent about buggy apps in extras-devel |
| 15:56.09 | andre__ | qgil, working on it already |
| 15:56.13 | qgil | for some reason has vanished completely in may mailbox |
| 15:56.18 | qgil | no inbox, no trash.. |
| 15:56.22 | andre__ | want a copy? :) |
| 15:56.24 | Bobbe_ | pacifictyphoon, doesn't hotmail have forwarding? If it does, set it to forward to a gmail account. Gmail has imap support, and all the features you wished hotmail had =) |
| 15:56.54 | pacifictyphoon | but then i would have to control my hotmail and gmail |
| 15:56.54 | qgil | ok, but forward to jeremiah since it's also a bout missing dependencies in pythin packages and etc |
| 15:57.21 | qgil | jeremiah can then ask the python project if they are planning to work on those packages |
| 15:57.26 | qgil | or if there is anything deprecated, etc |
| 15:57.38 | andre__ | qgil, i've pinged jeremiah here already about it, waiting for an answer |
| 15:57.43 | qgil | ok |
| 15:57.49 | *** join/#maemo JZA (n=opera@189.132.183.210) |
| 15:57.49 | qgil | thanks! |
| 15:58.04 | qgil | and now... time to leave this office |
| 15:58.08 | andre__ | okay, going to split this up into two tasks and send an update of the first part to you soon |
| 15:58.14 | andre__ | have a nice evening :) |
| 15:58.19 | qgil | u2 |
| 15:58.22 | *** part/#maemo qgil (n=qgil@esprx02x.nokia.com) |
| 15:58.30 | *** join/#maemo gletelli_ (n=chatzill@fw-tnat.cambridge.arm.com) |
| 15:58.48 | Bobbe_ | pacifictyphoon, not really. if it forwards everything, why bother? Blow hotmail to hell =)) |
| 15:59.10 | *** part/#maemo JZA (n=opera@189.132.183.210) |
| 16:00.16 | *** join/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com) |
| 16:00.23 | pacifictyphoon | i use msn and would like everything to be in 1 place |
| 16:00.35 | pacifictyphoon | ill resort to it if its nessicary |
| 16:00.48 | *** join/#maemo leandroal (n=leandro@150.165.63.86) |
| 16:01.04 | lardman|home | sees that he has ~450 unread emails in his hotmail account |
| 16:01.14 | lardman|home | only uses it for messenger |
| 16:01.23 | *** join/#maemo fkz (n=fkz@201.82.65.97) |
| 16:01.39 | pacifictyphoon | when replying to emails it will come up with my gmail |
| 16:02.15 | Bobbe_ | yes |
| 16:02.58 | pacifictyphoon | well if somebody sent it to my hotmail |
| 16:04.04 | lardman|home | that would be rejected by my email spam filter then probably |
| 16:04.15 | lardman|home | different from and reply to addresses and all that |
| 16:06.37 | Bobbe_ | true |
| 16:06.57 | Bobbe_ | g-mail has a "send as" function in its web interface that would be just fantastic to have on an e-mail client |
| 16:07.38 | Bobbe_ | what I'm doing with my nit is abandoning modest (not pushing accurately enough, takes a long time to refresh) and using mnotify + gmail web interface |
| 16:07.42 | Bobbe_ | been working like a charm so far |
| 16:08.08 | Bobbe_ | and if you use the web interface of gmail you can easily add your hotmail account as a pop account and reply to ppl using your hotmail address |
| 16:08.18 | lcuk | isnt modest open and actively being worked on again? |
| 16:11.11 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (n=mlpug@a91-156-60-235.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:12.14 | Bobbe_ | I dunno lcuk. App Manager hasn't shown any updates for it, and it's the default client for OS2008. Should be pretty stable, I guess. Still, it spends hours under active wifi without noticing anything different, even if I tell it to check every 10 min. Then like 1:30h later it starts beeping like it's going to explode, 329048920348 e-mail arriving at once |
| 16:12.38 | Bobbe_ | *e-mails |
| 16:12.40 | lcuk | heh Bobbe_ |
| 16:13.47 | lcuk | i understand that kind of frustration, i think its only recently been woken (i might be completely wrong and nopthing is happening with it) and if thats the case we might get updates eventually |
| 16:14.53 | *** join/#maemo thopiekar (n=thopieka@p57A14882.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:16.36 | Bobbe_ | was thoroughly chastised over his command of the language the other day. Don't wanna make more people angry at my unforgivable forgetfullness of indefinite articles in an irc channel |
| 16:16.54 | Bobbe_ | exactly lcuk, it doesn't deliver |
| 16:16.57 | Bobbe_ | (quite literally) |
| 16:17.01 | Bobbe_ | let's hope it does in the future |
| 16:19.53 | *** join/#maemo melmoth (n=melmoth@did75-18-88-171-132-204.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 16:21.27 | *** join/#maemo slonopotamus (n=slonopot@83.149.10.185) |
| 16:22.01 | *** join/#maemo stv0 (n=steffen@dslb-084-058-200-104.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 16:23.26 | *** part/#maemo stv0 (n=steffen@dslb-084-058-200-104.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 16:25.00 | *** join/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host86-167-104-90.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) |
| 16:25.27 | toggles_w | anyone have issues with ekiga.net registrations? |
| 16:25.51 | *** join/#maemo jeremiah (n=jeremiah@c83-248-143-10.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 16:26.47 | andre__ | define "issues"? |
| 16:28.03 | yerga | andre__, just received your mail ;) |
| 16:28.17 | andre__ | yerga, you like it? ;-) |
| 16:28.28 | yerga | andre__, it's weird because actually hex-a-hop don't use maemo-select-menu... |
| 16:28.48 | andre__ | i didn't test myself, these are nokia results |
| 16:29.13 | yerga | yeah, I Imagine |
| 16:30.50 | andre__ | yerga, hmm... just ignore my email in that case? :-) |
| 16:31.58 | *** join/#maemo philipl (i=1000@c-71-204-181-202.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:32.33 | yerga | andre__, I'll do :) Anyway I have to update it soon, so I'll do sure it doesn't happen. |
| 16:32.44 | andre__ | k |
| 16:32.46 | *** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.130) |
| 16:38.52 | toggles_w | andre__: n810 wont register with ekiga, registers with diamondcard though |
| 16:39.43 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181192153.pp.htv.fi) |
| 16:40.10 | andre__ | describe "wont register". |
| 16:40.19 | andre__ | any errors? what steps? |
| 16:40.49 | *** join/#maemo filip42 (n=filip@ankh-morpork.disque-monde.org) |
| 16:41.04 | toggles_w | andre__: i setup my ekiga account, connect to some wifi, the little online symbol up top says there is an error and a little icon in it says 'sip network error' |
| 16:42.07 | andre__ | anything else works when using that wifi? |
| 16:42.09 | andre__ | did you try with another wifi? |
| 16:42.26 | toggles_w | yep, gtalk registers and i can talk |
| 16:42.51 | *** join/#maemo hvelarde (n=chatzill@201.151.237.154) |
| 16:42.51 | toggles_w | has worked on a couple of wifi's but most of the time ti fails |
| 16:45.08 | toggles_w | weird part is same account on same network on pc registers |
| 16:45.18 | *** join/#maemo wnd^ (n=wnd@katei.fi) |
| 16:45.43 | andre__ | ok, that's really strange. hmm, no idea |
| 16:46.26 | toggles_w | andre__: any pointers on where to look? and way to get a log? run it in verbose mode? |
| 16:46.53 | andre__ | toggles_w, http://wiki.ekiga.org/index.php/Debugging_Ekiga |
| 16:47.03 | *** join/#maemo kabtoffe (n=kbergstr@hoasb-ff0ddd00-14.dhcp.inet.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 16:47.03 | toggles_w | andre__: Thanks! |
| 16:47.04 | *** join/#maemo t5vaha01 (i=t5vaha01@rhea.oamk.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 16:47.26 | toggles_w | andre__: actually, it's not ekiga, is it rcom ? the default sip client |
| 16:47.35 | toggles_w | andre__: Thanks though. |
| 16:47.49 | Macer | watching the wrath of khan |
| 16:48.17 | andre__ | rtcom |
| 16:48.24 | toggles_w | yeah ;-) |
| 16:48.45 | andre__ | toggles_w, http://wiki.maemo.org/Bugs:Stock_answers#SIP.2Frtcom.2FInternet_Call |
| 16:48.58 | Macer | it cracks me up when they talk about cryogenic ships sent out into deep space in 1996 with genetically engineered humans onboard :) |
| 16:49.19 | andre__ | toggles_w, hmm, well, my link is not really that helpful, but that's what i'd ask for in a bug report :) |
| 16:49.29 | toggles_w | andre__: thanks mate |
| 16:49.32 | Macer | wow that moon landing seriously fucked up people's sense of perception of advancement |
| 16:50.14 | *** join/#maemo Bleadof (i=tarmo@lumi.tango.jyu.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 16:50.14 | *** join/#maemo dob (i=gintomik@otitsun.oulu.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
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| 16:50.21 | _gpg_ | hello |
| 16:51.20 | andre__ | hi |
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| 16:52.09 | lbt | fiferboy: ... I *just* got it to scoll out of bounds :) |
| 16:52.13 | *** join/#maemo elninja (n=r@adsl-76-208-35-34.dsl.sbndin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 16:52.23 | fiferboy | lbt: Nice! |
| 16:52.26 | fiferboy | What's it look like? |
| 16:52.33 | lbt | white |
| 16:53.01 | lbt | I kindof expected a segfault... |
| 16:53.23 | fiferboy | So, it's not exactly ready for release? |
| 16:53.27 | elninja | What's white? |
| 16:54.04 | lbt | no, I meant as you logged in I got the first .so onto the tablet and it overshoots :) |
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| 16:54.13 | lbt | it doesn't bounce back yet |
| 16:54.30 | lbt | elninja: the bg colour |
| 16:54.36 | fiferboy | Does it work in all directions? |
| 16:54.43 | elninja | bg color of what? |
| 16:54.58 | elninja | I just joined in the middle of the conversation |
| 16:54.59 | lbt | fiferboy: yes |
| 16:55.02 | _gpg_ | i was looking for some coverflow demo application using Qt, i didn't get any success from Qt chanel since i'm looking for something accelerated using QGLWidget for example, i would like to know if some of you tried this in maemo project |
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| 16:55.29 | lbt | _gpg_: not coverflow... but we're doing fingerscrolling |
| 16:55.34 | _gpg_ | anything work perfectly when using a strong PC but for handless devices it's more complicated to find a good answer |
| 16:55.42 | fiferboy | Sweet. I was looking at the declaritive UI examples, and if you overshoot in two directions at once it only bounces back in one direction |
| 16:56.02 | lbt | fiferboy: mine just flies off the screen in an unbounded way |
| 16:56.17 | lbt | which isn't surprising since there is no rubberband yet |
| 16:56.40 | _gpg_ | lbt, thank you |
| 16:56.52 | fiferboy | That's just as good, except I expect you can fly of the screen in two directions. QtKinetics can only do one! |
| 16:56.52 | *** join/#maemo mardi__ (n=mardi_@host81-146-18-52.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net) |
| 16:57.41 | lbt | yes indeed |
| 16:58.17 | fiferboy | What happens to the scrollbars when you overshoot? |
| 16:58.59 | lbt | they sit there.... no squish... but they don't fly out the ends either ;) |
| 16:59.12 | lbt | just trying a textedit area... and that's fine |
| 16:59.24 | fireun | "the dark side of the earth" |
| 17:00.00 | fiferboy | lbt: I like the look of this list view: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2x_bS4M3jhY&feature=PlayList&p=084A46CE1D502DB3&index=3 |
| 17:00.46 | lbt | very nice |
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| 17:00.51 | lbt | we can do that |
| 17:01.13 | lbt | ok... food now.... bak l8r |
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| 17:05.16 | RST38h | GP2X is out |
| 17:05.58 | *** join/#maemo filip42 (n=filip@ankh-morpork.disque-monde.org) |
| 17:06.30 | _gpg_ | i have some download problem, can anyone confirm to me if CPULOAD http://maemo.org/development/documentation/man_pages/cpuload/ tool is a part of the SDK ? |
| 17:06.34 | *** join/#maemo fab (n=bellet@bellet.info) |
| 17:07.10 | lardman|home | RST38h: so it beat the pandora after all |
| 17:08.05 | lardman|home | hmm, is that the right one? |
| 17:08.41 | lardman|home | ah, the GP2X Wiz |
| 17:10.27 | _gpg_ | is cpuload a generic C application ? (i'm not on linux, please help if you can) |
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| 17:19.26 | _gpg_ | I would just like to know if it's source code is available or if it's something provided as binary from nokia for example |
| 17:22.08 | lardman|home | where did you read this? |
| 17:22.20 | lcuk | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8H8HnaTIcmk hahahaha |
| 17:22.21 | lardman|home | sounds like a measurement to me, like "outside temperature" |
| 17:23.55 | _gpg_ | lardman|home, http://maemo.org/development/documentation/man_pages/cpuload/ (i dont know if you were talking to me) |
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| 17:26.09 | lardman|home | _gpg_: yes I was, looks like it's a scratchbox stress tool |
| 17:26.36 | lardman|home | so I was wrong |
| 17:26.36 | lcuk | _gpg_, pool/maemo4.1.2/free/s/sp-stress/sp-stress_0.1.1-1_armel.deb |
| 17:26.50 | _gpg_ | lcuk, thank you |
| 17:26.51 | lcuk | Description: Tools for creating cpu/io/memory load |
| 17:26.51 | lcuk | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:26.51 | lcuk | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:26.51 | lardman|home | lcuk: was that a piss-take call? |
| 17:26.55 | _gpg_ | lardman|home, than you |
| 17:26.56 | lcuk | check for source using that package |
| 17:27.06 | lcuk | lardman|gone, apparantly not |
| 17:27.10 | RST38h | Hehehehe: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/14/us/14explorers.html?_r=2&ref=us |
| 17:27.13 | lardman|home | very odd |
| 17:27.21 | RST38h | Explorers, hehe |
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| 17:28.09 | lcuk | my god :) having network working jsut by coming home is a dream :) |
| 17:28.27 | Stskeeps | pigs are flying, lcuk has an AP? ;) |
| 17:28.34 | lcuk | slap |
| 17:28.42 | lcuk | waves dodgy finger |
| 17:28.50 | lcuk | tracy keeps calling it a tampon :| |
| 17:30.31 | RST38h | lcuk: has she tried using it in this function? =) |
| 17:30.34 | GeneralAntilles | penguinbait didn't manage one civil or reasonable reply to anything from yesterday. |
| 17:31.15 | GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, ping? |
| 17:32.13 | _gpg_ | lcuk, http://timeless.justdave.net/repository/repository.maemo.org/pool/chinook/free/s/sp-stress/ looks too old ? what do you think ? |
| 17:32.59 | lcuk | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/s/sp-stress/ |
| 17:33.07 | lcuk | why not use the proper repo, or even apt source |
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| 17:34.10 | _gpg_ | lcuk, i have to wait untill i come back to home to have a linux pc |
| 17:34.53 | lcuk | o_O arent you wanting this for the maemo device.. |
| 17:36.13 | lcuk | ponders what to do with a file called "gary___________readme__________________notes.txt" in the root of my dev folder |
| 17:36.33 | RST38h | Are there others, with different number of underscores? |
| 17:36.38 | lcuk | no |
| 17:36.40 | lcuk | just that one |
| 17:36.44 | RST38h | unusual |
| 17:36.47 | lcuk | its much bigger than all the other files in there |
| 17:36.54 | lcuk | i did it to stand out :) |
| 17:37.03 | lcuk | i miss em if i just make em called "readme" lol |
| 17:37.57 | RST38h | aaa,bbb,ccc,ddd,... usually work for me |
| 17:38.24 | RST38h | aaaaaa for the most important one :) |
| 17:38.50 | lcuk | what if something more important comes in ? |
| 17:40.33 | RST38h | I write it down on paper. |
| 17:41.01 | lcuk | i do that in liqbase, this was actually code notes |
| 17:41.15 | lcuk | pseudocode and stuff |
| 17:41.20 | lcuk | is there a version of wine that i can use to allow running linux binaries to work in windows |
| 17:41.38 | lcuk | variation/similar program |
| 17:41.47 | RST38h | colinux |
| 17:42.21 | lcuk | mmnh thats a bit heavy, but you are right of course |
| 17:42.35 | lcuk | what if i didnt need visual stuff |
| 17:42.39 | lcuk | just console |
| 17:42.50 | RST38h | colinux. |
| 17:43.03 | lcuk | bugger lol |
| 17:43.41 | lcuk | mmmmm can i run explorer.exe in linux? |
| 17:43.58 | ShadowJK | probably not. |
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| 17:46.41 | lcuk | phoey! |
| 17:47.03 | lcuk | will just have to port liqbase to windows |
| 17:47.13 | lcuk | opens visual basic |
| 17:47.25 | locutus | sick |
| 17:47.26 | jaska | closes bomb shelter hatch |
| 17:48.24 | lcuk | lol locutus liqbase began life in vb :) theres components and elements wrote in that - i did the first version of sketching there and in vb.net ;) |
| 17:48.28 | lcuk | ^compact |
| 17:48.44 | locutus | lcuk: my comment still holds |
| 17:48.45 | locutus | lcuk: sick |
| 17:49.28 | lcuk | locutus, making vb work fast and effectively takes as much dedication as writing asm ;) |
| 17:49.40 | lcuk | and is just as obscure lol |
| 17:49.47 | locutus | lcuk: like i said |
| 17:49.49 | locutus | lcuk: SICK |
| 17:49.56 | locutus | lcuk: also, i LIKE WRITING ASSEMBLY :-( |
| 17:50.08 | locutus | i learned programming with m68k assembly, AND LIKED IT |
| 17:50.12 | lcuk | i used do too :) |
| 17:50.18 | lcuk | 68k IS fun |
| 17:50.21 | lcuk | i hate x86 |
| 17:50.30 | lcuk | arm asm reminds me muchly of my amiga :) |
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| 17:50.42 | lcuk | its got 16regs (just like our D and As) |
| 17:51.14 | ShadowJK | I think colinux has no "visual stuff" actually |
| 17:51.22 | lcuk | its got an x11 driver |
| 17:51.27 | ShadowJK | Oh |
| 17:51.27 | lcuk | and can show linux windows through |
| 17:51.39 | lcuk | i had it installed a while ago |
| 17:51.46 | lcuk | but its an entire distro hiding underneath |
| 17:51.51 | lcuk | but i suppose thats whats needed |
| 17:52.00 | ShadowJK | I just had this memory that you needed to run a X server in windows to get any graphics out of it, and that you otherwise could just ssh to the local colinux process |
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| 17:53.06 | ShadowJK | heh, I guess there's quite a small demand for the stuff that's in between msys+cygwin and colinux :) |
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| 18:00.56 | locutus | whats the problem with just using XDMCP to the Colinux host? |
| 18:01.02 | locutus | its like, taking advantage of X :P |
| 18:01.16 | locutus | implementing a full virtual grapics card and all that shit, would just be way to much hassle |
| 18:01.50 | locutus | this way you can even make use of things like native hw accel for graphics |
| 18:07.18 | *** join/#maemo fiferboy (n=quassel@216.185.81.34) |
| 18:08.33 | ShadowJK | LoCusF, yeah :/ |
| 18:08.38 | ShadowJK | uh |
| 18:08.41 | ShadowJK | locutus |
| 18:09.25 | *** join/#maemo trofi (n=slyfox@ip132-79.17.dsl.minsktelecom.by) |
| 18:09.55 | ShadowJK | I had a SD card fail on me |
| 18:10.12 | ShadowJK | It's very disturbing, because it's entirely silent, no errors reported whatsoever at any stage by anything |
| 18:10.27 | ShadowJK | Only noticed it because mp3's were garbled and missing big chunks |
| 18:10.55 | Stskeeps | which is why zfs is nice :P |
| 18:11.11 | ShadowJK | Sure enough, I copy random crap to fill up the card, flush/drop caches, sha1sum data on card and the original, and the sha1 mismatches |
| 18:12.00 | ShadowJK | It's just so stupid, these cards do frickin ECC and the data transfer is checksummed too, something somewhere is either buggy by design or plain buggy if errors don't propagate to me the user |
| 18:13.08 | ShadowJK | And thanks to the wear leveling stuff, these "bad sectors" jump around and even vanish at times |
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| 18:44.36 | fiferboy | lbt: You there? |
| 18:44.44 | lbt | sec |
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| 18:45.10 | fiferboy | k |
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| 18:45.57 | lbt | k |
| 18:46.59 | fiferboy | Have you used Qt Animation Framework at all? |
| 18:47.29 | lbt | not yet |
| 18:47.38 | lbt | I spoke to them though |
| 18:47.50 | lbt | and they said it was overkill for this task |
| 18:47.57 | lbt | it's ported for Mer |
| 18:48.07 | lbt | well, it builds for Mer |
| 18:48.10 | fiferboy | Ok, I was going to say they have some sort of flick widget |
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| 18:48.56 | lbt | yeah, what we're doing is enabling the framework |
| 18:49.01 | *** join/#maemo mikkov_ (n=mtvartia@vipunen.hut.fi) |
| 18:49.09 | lbt | what they're doing is enabling the applications |
| 18:49.17 | *** join/#maemo karbas (i=karbas@thalassa.inside.org) |
| 18:49.18 | lbt | actually so is hildon |
| 18:49.21 | *** join/#maemo jumpula (i=jussi@smooth.piipiip.net) |
| 18:49.25 | fiferboy | What you are doing, anyway. I'm not doing anything. |
| 18:49.50 | lbt | heh - testing is vital |
| 18:49.56 | lbt | so is encouragement ... |
| 18:50.02 | lbt | and having a user |
| 18:50.28 | fiferboy | I'm moral support |
| 18:50.38 | *** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (n=timeless@guest-226.mountainview.mozilla.com) |
| 18:50.43 | lbt | needs it sometimes... |
| 18:51.01 | lbt | this is looking good though... just writing the next bit |
| 18:51.10 | fiferboy | Rubberbanding? |
| 18:51.34 | lbt | trying to decide if I should bounce on the x-axis whilst carrying momentumn on the y. |
| 18:51.39 | lbt | but yes |
| 18:52.44 | fiferboy | I had the bounce independant on the axis, and it looked wierd when x was bouncing while y was still running |
| 18:53.02 | lbt | but if y stops sharply |
| 18:53.22 | lbt | so maybe decelerate both at the same rate... |
| 18:53.49 | lbt | yeah, I just won't reverse direction |
| 18:54.13 | lbt | goes back to emacs |
| 18:55.09 | fiferboy | I notice with overshoot in QtKinetics you can drag as far as you like past the limit, it isn't limited by the same overshoot_maximum as on release |
| 18:55.15 | Myrtti | emacs ⥠|
| 18:55.50 | lbt | fiferboy: mmm, I might.... |
| 18:56.05 | lbt | notes that Myrtti has good taste |
| 18:56.25 | Myrtti | lbt: you'll disagree when I show you a screenshot of mine |
| 18:56.43 | fiferboy | lbt: http://xkcd.com/378/ |
| 18:57.04 | lbt | of course.... |
| 18:57.11 | *** join/#maemo simon_ (n=simon@cpe90-146-223-204.liwest.at) |
| 18:57.46 | lbt | damn... wrong bit... |
| 18:58.11 | fiferboy | :) |
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| 19:16.17 | fiferboy | lbt: from h-p-a "Force applied to the movement, multiplies the calculated speed of the user movement the cursor in the screen" |
| 19:16.24 | fiferboy | Does that sound like your speed boost? |
| 19:16.46 | lbt | heh - pressure sensitive |
| 19:16.48 | lbt | no |
| 19:17.25 | lbt | I just meant slow movements tend to be slowed |
| 19:17.32 | lbt | fast ones accelerated |
| 19:17.47 | lbt | non-linear velocity when you release your finger |
| 19:18.02 | lbt | so a flick is accelerated (as you'd intend) |
| 19:18.08 | fiferboy | Ah |
| 19:18.19 | lbt | but a slow movement stops almost dead (as you'd intend) |
| 19:18.43 | lbt | sometimes it's disconcerting to have it move even though you've *tried* to stop |
| 19:20.32 | *** join/#maemo lmoura (n=lmoura@200.184.118.130) |
| 19:21.43 | fiferboy | lbt: I have a style sheet to make scroll bars look the same as Fremantle |
| 19:22.05 | lbt | you *may* get a .so l8r |
| 19:22.20 | fiferboy | Yay! |
| 19:23.02 | fiferboy | Do you think we should apply the stylesheet by default for Fremantle compiles in the finger scrolling code? |
| 19:23.31 | lbt | lets see |
| 19:23.43 | *** join/#maemo Pakke (n=pakke_m@a91-153-21-144.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 19:25.02 | fiferboy | lbt: Sent you an email |
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| 19:36.18 | pupnik_ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qcnqLZC_uY new pandora vid |
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| 19:38.15 | RST38h | The Pandoras will be handmade in UK! |
| 19:38.19 | RST38h | OMG! |
| 19:39.52 | ukki | anyone have/know where to find iptables nat kernel modules for latest os2006? |
| 19:42.12 | StsN802 | handmade??? |
| 19:43.04 | *** join/#maemo Vulcanis (n=CBabbage@ool-43566062.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 19:43.10 | pupnik_ | i can understand being sick of the delays |
| 19:43.15 | pupnik_ | still, it's the piece of kit i want |
| 19:43.31 | ukki | evening pupnik_ |
| 19:43.38 | pupnik_ | hi ukki! |
| 19:45.06 | pupnik_ | why os2006 - 770 as router? |
| 19:45.41 | ukki | yes |
| 19:47.02 | ukki | got an old laptop i could use if i could get it connected to net somehow |
| 19:47.58 | ukki | it doesn't even have ethernet |
| 19:48.49 | pupnik_ | you have some usb-ethernet for the 770? |
| 19:49.42 | *** join/#maemo L0cutus (n=L0cutus@94.160.45.96) |
| 19:49.53 | ukki | yes, freebsd works nicely with it, i just need to get 770 routing |
| 19:51.17 | ukki | you still have your gregale sdk installed? :) |
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| 20:02.03 | wazd | Heya maemo, long time no see :) |
| 20:02.09 | RST38h | hello wazd |
| 20:04.19 | Jaffa | wazd! |
| 20:04.22 | fiferboy | wazd: Still working on mer ui? |
| 20:04.36 | wazd | fiferboy: omg! Hey Andrew! |
| 20:04.47 | wazd | Jaffa: Heya :) |
| 20:04.49 | fiferboy | Hey, is your Jabber still screwed up? |
| 20:04.51 | pupnik_ | i do not have dev computer up and running - all in boxes |
| 20:05.08 | wazd | fiferboy: Well, I still can't see you online |
| 20:05.26 | fiferboy | Hehe, something is wrong at one of our ends |
| 20:05.26 | *** part/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host86-167-104-90.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) |
| 20:05.30 | wazd | fiferboy: I've switched to the Pidgin but the problem still remains I suppose |
| 20:05.46 | fiferboy | wazd: I'm online now, so I would say so. |
| 20:07.04 | wazd | fiferboy: How are you? Haven't seen you for a thousand of years already :) |
| 20:07.45 | fiferboy | wazd: Pretty good. Working on a per project and trying to eventually find time to work on my other projects |
| 20:07.52 | fiferboy | wazd: What are you up to? |
| 20:08.26 | wazd | fiferboy: well, currently I was MIA cause of work and damn holidays |
| 20:08.43 | fiferboy | Are holidays not good? |
| 20:08.52 | wazd | fiferboy: but I'm still trying to find time to work on various maemo projects andMer :) |
| 20:09.04 | wazd | fiferboy: not THAT holidays :) |
| 20:09.33 | wazd | fiferboy: had to visit 5 or 6 places, almost no rest |
| 20:09.48 | fiferboy | Ah. Not so relaxing |
| 20:10.01 | wazd | fiferboy: so I'm totally dry after all that stuff :) |
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| 20:11.46 | wazd | fiferboy: btw, do you want to join Mer project too?) |
| 20:12.11 | wazd | fiferboy: since you're an uber-gtk-hacker :) |
| 20:12.40 | fiferboy | wazd: Maybe if I get some spare time. |
| 20:12.56 | fiferboy | Actually, I am working almost exclusively in Qt for the moment. |
| 20:13.14 | wazd | fiferboy: aw, that bird-related software? |
| 20:13.24 | fiferboy | wazd: Yep. |
| 20:13.48 | wazd | fiferboy: if you need some UI help - just ask :) |
| 20:14.17 | fiferboy | wazd: Thanks! I am almost at the point where I want to optimize some dialogs for small/large screens |
| 20:14.19 | pupnik_ | i bet solid videophone could help sell RX-51s |
| 20:14.57 | wazd | pupnik_: I think solid existing RX-51 could help sell RX-51 :") |
| 20:17.32 | RST38h | has not seen anyone using videophone outside of Google |
| 20:22.46 | jaska | seeing peoples ugly mugs isnt really always wanted |
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| 20:24.37 | fiferboy | Well, I'm off |
| 20:24.48 | fiferboy | wazd: I'll send you some screenshots in the next few days |
| 20:24.55 | wazd | fiferboy: c ya, I'll try to fix jabber |
| 20:25.01 | wazd | fiferboy: ok |
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| 20:25.18 | fiferboy | lbt: If you get a chance to send an .so, that would be awesome |
| 20:25.35 | lbt | yep... it's not quite working yet |
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| 21:17.21 | thopiekar | X-Fade: got my email? |
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| 22:12.42 | thopiekar | is going to sleep now... cu l8er :) |
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| 22:28.13 | jaska | ugh, 2 days idle -> battery empty, guess i need a new one |
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| 22:53.51 | aspect | when I switch off my nit, why does it sometimes leave the d-pad LED flashing? |
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| 22:59.28 | lbt | aspect: you have a message? |
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