IRC log for #maemo on 20090323

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00:00.23OffensiveNicknobody is on drugs here :(
00:00.45t_s_ocaffeine forever ;)
00:01.13OffensiveNickthat's a drug!
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00:01.32OffensiveNickt_s_o have you ever tried caffeine with tobacco with ginkgo biloba? tons of fun
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00:03.08slypheedhey guys...application menu went blank...any tips/links on rebuilding it (i.e. besides update-desktop-database)?
00:03.22slypheedon an n810/diablo/os2008
00:03.36GeneralAntillesslypheed, there's a default file somewhere you can copy.
00:03.47GeneralAntillesslypheed, did you run out of space during an install or something?
00:04.28qwerty12_N800slypheed: cp /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu /home/user/.osso/menus/applications.menu && update-desktop-database :p
00:04.36slypheedquite possible...moved my root to the 2gb internal instead of flash...so been installing apps a bit heedlessly..
00:04.57slypheedthanks much, i'll give it a try
00:05.17PedoBearqwerty12_N800 hmmm are you talking about cp?
00:05.17PedoBearputs his coolface
00:05.40GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N800, can you add a comment for it here? https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3795
00:06.04qwerty12_N800PedoBear: lol, cp as in copy - not some dirty concotion
00:06.08qwerty12_N800GeneralAntilles: sure
00:06.34PedoBearwhat a shame qwerty12_N800 :(
00:09.08qwerty12_N800GeneralAntilles: hmm, not sure what to comment on, you already say how to get the menus back
00:09.18GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N800, oh, did I?
00:09.20GeneralAntillesWell then. . . .
00:09.41slypheedawesome, thanks so much qwerty12_N800..so much nicer :p
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00:30.42xntwants his own diy uav
00:30.43xnthttp://diydrones.com/profiles/blog/show?id=705844%3ABlogPost%3A44814
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00:31.04xntmaybe I can control it with maemo?
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00:38.01DavidePalmis there an irc channel for maemo mapper?
00:38.13fireunthat seems a little specific for irc
00:38.30DavidePalm:D
00:39.26DavidePalmwell there is for canola and xchat
00:39.58*** join/#maemo Shadow__X1 (n=Good@rh-laureln-cs1-129-67.njit.edu)
00:41.36DavidePalmanyone know what the 'generic error' issue with maemo mapper is about?   Happens when trying to download a route
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01:35.25xntb-man: http://xceleo.com/mer-ui-mockup.png Mer UI Mockup :)
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01:42.18xntb-man16: http://xceleo.com/mer-ui-mockup.png Mer UI Mockup :)
01:42.30luke-jryou *just* said that :o
01:42.34xnt:P
01:42.36xntyeah
01:43.19xntb-man|compiling: hello :P
01:44.23b-man|compilinghello
01:45.15xntb-man|compiling: http://xceleo.com/mer-ui-mockup.png :P
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01:45.44b-man|compilingnice :)
01:45.46xnt:)
01:46.19b-man|compiling's tablet is getting pushed to it's limits atm XD
01:46.49b-man|compilingcompiling LFS
01:47.05b-man|compilingon my tablet XD
01:47.26xnt:P:P XD
01:48.33b-man|compilingis still having issues with binutils :P
01:48.41xnt:P
01:48.53b-man|compilingbut i made more progress :)
01:49.49b-man|compilingxnt: what have you been up to? :)
01:51.00b-man|compilingbesides making that mock-up XP
01:51.44b-man|compilingwich is awsome btw
01:52.04b-man|compiling*witch :P
01:52.11xntnothing, just looking at this :P http://www.avbrand.com/projects/carpc/
01:52.48b-man|compilingheh
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01:54.50b-man|compilinggets an " BFD does not support target {armv6l-unknown-linux-gnueabi}" error :P
01:55.18b-man|compilingis going crazy
01:55.36xnt:P
01:55.44b-man|compiling:P:P
01:56.50b-man|compilingtrys again
01:57.04xnt:P
01:57.17b-man|compilingi don't give up easily ;)
01:57.42xnt:)
01:58.18b-man|compilingXD
01:59.45xntwants a car :P
01:59.52xntwith a linux carpc
01:59.57b-man|compilinglol
02:00.08z4chhbman what's you compiling?
02:00.15b-man|compilingbinutils
02:00.22b-man|compiling:P
02:00.58b-man|compilingit's complaining about the system architecture
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02:01.27xntomfg I must get this on my car when I get mine :)
02:01.27b-man|compilingxnt: how old are you btw?
02:01.30xnthttps://www.timekiller.org/carpc/index.php
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02:19.31*** join/#maemo JackaLX (n=steve@sxemacs/project-lead/JackaLX)
02:21.57JackaLXSo what do you do when your n810 won't boot, the initial "Nokia" splash screen is as far as it gets and that is borked, and reflashing just results in a usb write error (resource temp unavailable), and the only way to turn the pig off is to pull the battery?
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02:36.19z4chhb-man, what does the b stand for?
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02:47.02b-manBrian :)
02:47.04b-manmy real name
02:47.07b-manb -(brian) m -(mckenzie) an
02:47.08b-manthe "an" means adam - my middle name
02:47.10b-manand the 16 i occasionally use is my age :P
02:47.12b-mandidn't chose his username for nothing :)
02:48.21boredom:P
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03:06.03b-mani'm back :)
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03:30.15JackaLXI'm getting `usb_bulk_write: Resource temporarily unavailable' when trying to reflash my n810.  Anyone have any ideas/suggestions?
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03:54.44zakkmJackaLX: what you using to reflash? whats the line
03:55.56JackaLX./flasher-3.0 -F image -f -R
03:56.23zakkmare you running as root?
03:56.29JackaLXyes
03:56.41zakkmthe nokia has the usb logo when reflashing?
03:56.48JackaLXyes
03:57.15JackaLXit sends the xloader ok, and dies on secondary image with 0 bytes sent
03:57.26zakkmtry other usb slot?
03:57.34JackaLXyes
03:57.57zakkmis maemo installed fine?
03:58.09JackaLXit was :-)
03:58.15zakkmlol
03:58.23zakkmim thinking you could of tried fiasco-flasher
03:58.40JackaLXit won't boot :-(
03:59.04zakkmso do initfs?
03:59.09zakkmnot whole image
03:59.56zakkmlinux?
03:59.59JackaLXI'll give it a try... what flasher opts do I need for that --flash-only initfs?  anything else
04:00.00JackaLXyes
04:00.21zakkm--flash-only=initfs
04:00.31zakkmit would redo "bootloader"
04:00.36JackaLXok
04:00.53zakkmotherwise you would have to redownload/reinstall shit if you do whole image ;p
04:01.48zakkmJackaLX: did you try taking out battery for a few seconds
04:01.53zakkmput back in .. and try
04:02.17JackaLXyeah... atm it's the only way to turn the pig off :-O
04:02.35zakkmit will auto turn off from nokia screen in like 2 min.. btw
04:02.38zakkmbut uhh
04:03.19zakkmcan you show me whole line
04:03.25zakkmcounting the __$: and image name
04:03.57JackaLX# ../tools/flasher-3.0 -F RX-44_DIABLO_5.2008.43-7_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R
04:04.50zakkmtry without root
04:05.08zakkmmount -t usbfs usbfs /proc/bus/usb
04:05.09zakkmtry that too
04:05.15zakkmthat as root, of course
04:05.28JackaLXyeah I mount that normally anyway
04:05.34JackaLXmy UPS needs it
04:05.50zakkmim just taking educated guesses here you know
04:06.00JackaLXsure, that's cool
04:06.20zakkmtry without root
04:06.33zakkmor if it really needs do sudo.. dont become root
04:06.54JackaLXnon-root is no good... perms.
04:07.03JackaLXmay I ask why?
04:07.17zakkmyou did chmod +x flasher .. right?
04:07.30JackaLXyes :-)
04:08.02zakkmwhy as sudo?
04:08.11zakkmrun as user with root permissions, rather than run as root
04:08.26zakkmuser specifics settings might of been an obstacle
04:08.43JackaLXyeah I know what sudo is... I'm wondering why you want me to avoid root here
04:08.50JackaLXBTW, sudo won't do that
04:09.23JackaLXthe processes you run via sudo run as the user you sudo to (root if you don't specify a user)
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04:09.39zakkmthen am i referring to su?
04:09.59JackaLXsame thing basically
04:10.06zakkmi swear one of them is just permission, not as the user
04:10.56JackaLXcrap, this bloody thing won't even power up now
04:11.15zakkmyou can try unpacking the binary
04:11.21zakkmand then install the initfs.jff2
04:11.28zakkmlol
04:11.31zakkmout of batteries?
04:12.07JackaLXit's a little low... 2.9 volts
04:12.37zakkmtakes alot to power on and off
04:12.40zakkmand battery removed
04:12.49JackaLXhad it on charge all fooking night last night
04:13.03zakkmwhy do you think they say not to turn off nokia
04:13.10zakkmjust to leave it in sleep
04:13.36JackaLXit'd be dead flat before I woke up
04:13.52zakkmdo you have a memory card inserted to nokia?
04:13.52JackaLXbut I normally do leave it on all the time anyway
04:14.00JackaLXnot atm
04:15.09zakkmbad linux install?
04:15.15JackaLXno
04:15.28zakkmhave you tried a livecd or something?
04:16.27Macerblah
04:17.17JackaLXerm, no
04:17.28Macerhm
04:17.42zakkmjust try it
04:17.48zakkmmount it, so you dont have to redownload image
04:17.52zakkmchmod again and yeah
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04:57.33GeneralAntilles'morning, qgil.
04:59.21qgilhi GeneralAntilles, just read your email
04:59.29qgilgood call in maemo-community
05:00.17GeneralAntillesProbably should've started sooner, but hopefully it'll pick up steam.
05:01.52qgilwhat do you think about this thread moves in ITt, worth doing and helping people to post in the right places?
05:03.01GeneralAntillesThe initial reaction is probably going to be negative (itT has been a bit wild west for most of its life), but people actually being able to find what they're looking for in logical places is incredibly important.
05:03.29qgilok, good to know your opinion  :)
05:03.34GeneralAntillesEspecially with the big traffic bump we're probably going to see (RSN, right? ;))
05:03.49GeneralAntillesYou should also look at merging and splitting threads.
05:03.58qgilit's not the most intellectually challenging task I'm doin'g these days...  ;)
05:04.10GeneralAntillesTry the jumble. :P
05:04.12qgilRSN?
05:04.39GeneralAntillesReal Soon Now. Sorry, fishing for hints. :P
05:05.28qgilIn a universal scale, everything is RSN anyways  ;)
05:05.34GeneralAntillesHehe
05:06.17qgilsplitting threads, I thought about it in some cases but the fact that I'm a Nokian might not help........
05:06.27qgilso I'm just doin' the obvious sorting
05:07.08GeneralAntillesMaybe prod the other mods to be on the lookout then they can do it for a while until people acclimate.
05:08.08qgilCancel issue in Alpha SDK thread, N8*0 support issue in Maemo 5 features thread... if you go for the split they would deserve someone might even be more encouraged to keep the discussion unite
05:08.24qgilor maybe I'm just paranoid, but web forums are a good place for paranoia
05:08.50GeneralAntillesWe need to start pushing to keep people on-topic.
05:08.56timelE61igood place to avoid, like dark alleys
05:09.16GeneralAntillesRunning rampant with the topic is fun and all, and it's alright for smaller forums, but gets a little out of hand when they start really growing.
05:09.27GeneralAntillesUntil you end up with 1000 page threads going all over the place.
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05:12.55qgilagreed, but many times when that happens there is some Nokia-hot-issue involved, so this is why I won't be the one touching that
05:13.10qgilthose threads are seen by the rest of moderators anyway, so no need to ping them myself
05:13.13GeneralAntillesIt's like beekeeping. ;)
05:15.03qgilalso, I think it's good to leave thore redirects with a 1 month life, at least now for the first weeks before we have forum descriptions and sticky topics, and people get more used to post in the right place
05:15.27GeneralAntillesAs long as the redirects expire.
05:15.53qgilI agree now they look silly... but they reflect the current "silliness" (no offense to anyone)  :)
05:17.54GeneralAntillesOne thing I've noticed about the Ubuntu forums is that google results tend to be populated by threads with either no responses or no useful responses.
05:18.33GeneralAntillesI wonder if it would be bad to kill threads that don't get resolved after a certain time period.
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05:20.27qgilGeneralAntilles: it takes enough time to follow what is living, to follow as well what is dead...
05:22.25GeneralAntillesMaybe it could be automated somehow, but, yeah, a fair point.
05:23.38GeneralAntillesGoogling for answers and running across dead Ubuntu threads over and over again has gotten old, I guess. ;)
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05:32.34z4chhw00t finished my gsoc proposal rough draft! :D
05:51.39KhertanGeneralAntilles: hum ... the french ubuntu community don't have so much dead thread ...
05:52.01GeneralAntillesKhertan, what's their strategy? Being French? :P
05:52.14Khertanthere is two solution ... some guys use there time to answer
05:52.31Khertans/there/their
05:52.40Khertanor some use their time to delete it
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05:53.05Khertanok i' ll try to see why it s like that
05:53.23GeneralAntillesKhertan, I suspect dead thread deletion is a good strategy.
05:53.35GeneralAntillesThe manual overhead on it can probably be reduced, too, with a little scripting.
05:53.37KhertanGeneralAntilles: maybe
05:53.49Khertanbut i see an other solution instead of deletion
05:54.02GeneralAntillesWe could probably get the software to generate a "digest" of threads meeting the deletion criteria for mods.
05:54.22Khertanto push them to archive and force robot to not index it
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05:54.56Khertanso there is no deleting ..
05:55.16Khertanand when people search answer with google ... no dead thread without any answer
05:55.33Khertanand as it s archive ... same things for the internal search engine
05:55.56GeneralAntillesYeah, that'd work.
05:56.16GeneralAntillesPlus, since there's no deletion, it can be automated without any guilt.
05:56.26Khertanyep
05:56.40Khertanhappy to help the community :)
05:57.46Khertanso now ... i ll run .... i ll be to late to take my train ...
05:57.47GeneralAntillesJust gotta remember to write this up for -community later.
05:57.52Khertanhave a good day ...
05:57.53Khertan::)
05:57.59GeneralAntillesOr itT, I guess.
05:58.00GeneralAntillesLater.
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06:37.22Stskeepsyawns and stretches
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06:56.22qgilextras-devel is getting populated (16 items now) and I can see already evident bugs e.g. libraries visible to the user and installed apps not showing any icon and needing to be booted via console
06:56.32qgil(Fremantle, I mean)
06:57.04qgilI wonder whether we should start pushing those apps to bugs.maemo.org, or at least show in the package info a URL or the project to file a bug
06:57.31GeneralAntillesqgil, I was waiting on the h-a-m categories patches to ship to start bugging maintainers again. :(
06:58.23GeneralAntillesandre__, timeless, jeremiah and myself have been projects to b.m.o here and there as things come up.
06:58.43GeneralAntillesBut until we get some bugzilla updates there's a lot of manual overhead involved.
06:59.00timelE61iquim: i'm willing to add the products
06:59.09timelE61iBut someone needs to give me a list
06:59.18timelE61iI'm not running maemo5 :)
06:59.22qgilGeneralAntilles: ok, but we could say that a package needs to state a project URL in info if it wants to ever be promoted to extras-testing
06:59.46qgilnow I want to file bugs and the onyl thing I see in some cases is an email of a maintaner
06:59.55GeneralAntillesDoes Debian provide a facility for that in debs?
06:59.55timelE61iGan: did you post the instructions i gave you?
07:00.05GeneralAntillestimelE61i, yeah, they're on the wiki.
07:00.14timelE61iQgil: give me a list of products and i'll deal w/ them now
07:00.15StskeepsGeneralAntilles: there's a Homepage: field in debs
07:00.49qgilGeneralAntilles: don't ask me, but at least they let you add a description where a URL can be added
07:01.00qgilah, Stskeeps gave a better answer
07:01.01GeneralAntilleshttp://wiki.maemo.org/Bugs:Administration_guide
07:02.01timelE61iMy computer is killing itsewlf!
07:02.32StskeepstimelE61i: it's monday. it's perfectly natural.
07:02.42Stskeepsi expect disasters when i sit down at my machine today.
07:02.46timelE61iQgil: better hold off that list until my computer reincarnates
07:03.19GeneralAntillesqgil, for now, emailing the maintainers is fairly effective.
07:03.36timelE61iQgil: i'd rather setup bugzilla
07:03.46timelE61iThat way you can walk them through using it
07:04.01GeneralAntillesStskeeps, does Fremantle's h-a-m have the patches (I think I've asked before, but I don't recall the answer)?
07:04.32GeneralAntillesStill no Fremantle on MXR? :(
07:04.50StskeepsGeneralAntilles: i can't tell currently, - HAM is one of the packages we didn't update yet
07:05.43timelE61iGan?
07:06.00timelE61iWhy doesn't repo.m.o support directory listings?
07:06.10GeneralAntillestimelE61i, doesn't it?
07:06.19StskeepstimelE61i: it does in most places except for the nokia-closed stuff
07:06.56timelyhttp://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/dists/fremantle/free/Packages
07:06.57timelyerr
07:07.00timelyhttp://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/dists/fremantle/free
07:07.56GeneralAntillesGuess Fremantle Extras-devel is setup funkily
07:08.03timelyqgil: so um...
07:08.04GeneralAntillesWell, http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/
07:08.11timelydo you want to give me a list of products in order
07:08.20timelyor should i just create one for each i can find in extras-devel?
07:08.36timelygan: re mxr, i'm halfway through reincarnating the xref builder
07:08.53timelybut sadly this week i have to waste the entire week writing meaningless documentation
07:12.04GeneralAntillesMy pathetic r.m.o pre-draft if anybody feels like looking: http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/repository.maemo.org.html
07:12.47Stskeeps"Chinook eEtras"
07:13.10GeneralAntillesNice
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07:15.52timelyi don't like it :)
07:16.04timelyare you opposed to tables? :)
07:16.24timelyoddly, people can easily scan tables
07:16.30timelytablets are a different matter
07:16.30GeneralAntillesUnless the data actually calls for it.
07:16.38GeneralAntillesBut, what's your proposal?
07:17.04timelyone column per release
07:17.21timelyreleases which are latest for their thing get a <th> instead of a <td> for the head
07:17.27timelythat draws attn to the important releases
07:17.35timelyalternatively relegate the older ones to a second table
07:17.38timely(probably better)
07:17.49timelythen you stick the repositories as rows
07:17.56timelyw/ extras as a dedicated row
07:18.04timely(and extras-devel and ...)
07:18.44timelyso... is "dialcentral" really something in 5.0 extras-devel that needs a product?
07:19.10timelyqgil: actually, how about this
07:19.18timelywe give you a generic product for "extras-devel"
07:19.23GeneralAntillesIt's likely to go unmaintained.
07:19.24timelyyou file your first bug for each product there
07:19.31timelyand we hunt down assignees
07:19.36timely(mostly you, actually)
07:19.50timelywhen you find an assignee and have filed a bug, then someone (gan/myself) creates a product
07:19.56GeneralAntillesCan Extras go at the top of the page?
07:19.59timelythis way products only grow when bugs are reported
07:20.23Stskeepsi'm a bit against product requirements for extras nomination, as there might be porters like qwerty12 who do general ports and it is in such a wide range that it might not fit in a single product.. how about bugs against maintainers? :P
07:20.28Stskeeps<PROTECTED>
07:20.47GeneralAntillesStskeeps, requirements?
07:20.50timelyproducts=packages w/o versions
07:21.01timelyStskeeps: what i'm offering is that the first bug is filed in 'extras-devel'
07:21.06timelyand then someone like me creates a product
07:21.10timelyhaving seen demand
07:21.22StskeepsGeneralAntilles: as in that if a package needs to go into extras you have to link it to a garage product?
07:21.25timelyinstead of someone like me creating all possible products and most of them being empty and a waste of time
07:21.29Stskeeps.. if i understand this conversation
07:21.37timelyStskeeps: oh, that's different
07:21.42GeneralAntillesOK, new order is: Extras repository for community applications, SDK releases, Repositories for SDKs
07:22.07GeneralAntillesStskeeps, these are bugzilla products.
07:22.17GeneralAntillesGarage has projects, Bugzilla has products.
07:22.38Stskeepsah, ok
07:22.46Stskeepsfair enough, i misunderstood :)
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07:23.41GeneralAntillesAnybody want to think up a clever title?
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07:24.30GeneralAntillesmaemo.org - Repositories ?
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07:25.38timelE61isure
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07:31.56GeneralAntilles.installs were new in Bora, correct?
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07:54.28Stskeepshttp://everythingrandom.net/post/50714879/via-joy-of-tech
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08:05.44GeneralAntillesOK, updated: http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/repository.maemo.org.html
08:06.01GeneralAntillesHTML's default tab length is ma-ma-ma-massive.
08:06.35qwerty12I personally go to the pool folder than I do the dists
08:07.05GeneralAntillesIgnore the URLs
08:07.14GeneralAntillesThey're mostly just copy-paste monstrosities
08:07.17GeneralAntillesformatting and layout for now.
08:07.19qwerty12Ah, ok, fair enough :)
08:08.04qwerty12Seems to work for me imo :)
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08:09.00GeneralAntillesExtras-devel needs to go in there, too.
08:09.06GeneralAntillesGonna make it a bit tall. . . .
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08:23.11GeneralAntillesUpdated again: http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/repository.maemo.org.html
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08:26.41X-FadeLooks great ;)
08:29.28GeneralAntillesJust need some .installs, now.
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08:30.49Stskeepsok, i officially don't understand my screen anymore :P
08:32.52GeneralAntillesWell, see, it's a big grid of these tiny things called pixels. . .
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08:34.36Stskeepsyeah, i know that :P
08:35.17GeneralAntillesNo wonder my web browsing experience was sucking
08:35.22GeneralAntillesforgot to switch back to Monaco 9
08:35.28GeneralAntilles<3 Monaco 9
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08:58.33JaffaMorning, all
08:58.54Stskeepsmorning Jaffa
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09:07.16StskeepsJaffa: (from my perspective) it could be interesting to have the new council determine what it's role in the Mer project is/what it ought to be - as Mer does fit under the maemo.org auspices (sp)
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09:12.07JaffaStskeeps: there should be a thread about this on maemo-community shorlty
09:15.35StsN801k
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09:20.12JaffaFeel free to chip in thre
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09:23.22StsN801on the one day i forget my tablet headphones there's a primary school class in bus..
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09:27.06x29ahaaahaaa </nelson>
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09:29.48StsN801lo yerga
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09:30.04yergaMorning
09:31.48b0unc3_good morning
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09:58.51Myrttigood morning!
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10:04.55_berto_hi Myrtti
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10:26.23Stskeepsqgil: your jaiku URL on amsterdam summit has awkward <i>Summit</i> in it
10:27.15floriangood morning
10:28.19Stskeepsmorning florian
10:30.04Stskeepsflorian: you can probably utilize http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Documentation/Common_Packages#Current_package_status in the GSoC OE+Maemo idea - the packages are modified to be built in modern OS'es/build environments
10:30.15Myrttihappiness is warm fuzzy slippers in the morning. srsly.
10:30.31StskeepsMyrtti: but coffee comes in on a great second
10:31.47GeneralAntillesI read that as "spiders" for some reason.
10:31.50Myrttiyeah, I bought a 6-cup Bialletti moka pot on Saturday, some decent fairtrade espresso roast and a thermos mug that holds the whole pot and some milk
10:31.56Myrttibliss
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10:37.54Khertan_At_WorkHello !
10:38.00Stskeepslo khertan
10:38.14Khertan_At_Worklo Stskeeps
10:42.11florianStskeeps: yes indeed, that would be a pretty good base.
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10:48.45Stskeepsflorian: from my perspective the OE stuff would be interesting for those systems we cannot reliably put a ubuntu base on, at least
10:50.59Stskeepsand we increase the portability of the hildon/maemo code
10:51.22florianStskeeps: Yes indeed - we should try to make sure to keep things binary compatible. It shouldn't be hard to achieve - some people build packages for Maemo using OE already.
10:52.48florianStskeeps: Portability is quite a problem currently, every single bit that improves Maemo portability will be win for it.
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12:00.25timelE61ihey
12:00.33timelE61iAnyone here familiar w/ code analysis tools?
12:00.53Stskeepsonly from theoretical pov :P
12:01.27GeneralAntillestimelE61i, I'm asking about another batch of t-shirts to spread around.
12:01.35timelE61ithere's a tool depends.exe (dependency walker)
12:02.08timelE61iWhich lets one find out which external functions are provided by which libraries
12:02.21timelE61iIt's kinda  a cross between nm and ldd/ld
12:03.29timelE61iI'm wondering if there's a similar tool for unix
12:03.59timelE61iMy guess is there isn't and that i'll basically have to run nm on everything and use perl/python to answer questions
12:04.41Stskeepsor use libelf
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13:20.09lcukapt-get bacon
13:20.24lbttimelE61i: when building debian packages there is some debug info that says "needlessly depends" and seems to be based on library function analysis. Clearly something in the packaging is doing this - maybe a starter for 10....
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13:21.58lcuklbt, maybe thats a difference between the makefile and the /debian contents
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13:22.41lbtdon't think so - it's quite detailed IIRC - sounds like an analysis
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13:24.02lcukoooh
13:27.38lopzhi
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13:29.50salty_horsehi. I just received an email from hudson.fremantle@nokia.com about a successful build of microb-engine. it was sent to me and many others. anyone know what's it about?
13:31.58lcuksalty_horse, at a guess its a mail telling you about a successful build of microb-engine
13:32.28lcukdont take my word for it though :D
13:33.36salty_horseit kind of looks like spam, since it was sent to 136 addresses.. some appear to be mozilla devs, and googling tells me the project is related to maemo
13:34.10lbtsounds like your email got added to an autobuilder
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13:34.44salty_horselbt, an autobuilder which lists all of its recipients in CC? :)
13:34.52salty_horsenever mind. I'll see if it happens again
13:35.00lbtit's highly unlikely to be 'spam'
13:35.05lbtas such
13:35.56lbtsalty_horse: but if it does happen again and you want help getting off the list then someone here may be able to help
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13:36.23salty_horseyou're probably right. it points to a LAN ip address
13:36.35salty_horsedo you know who Hudson Fremantle is?
13:37.41GAN800Codename for a Fremantle autobuilder, probably.
13:37.50andre__i'm sure it's not a real person. but fremantle is the name of the next software version
13:38.12andre__(at least i can't find any dev with that name in the list)
13:38.50salty_horseah :)
13:39.00salty_horseanyway, thanks for the help
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13:45.04lbtandre__: are you a libosso ossowm dbus guru?
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13:51.39andre__lbt, no. maybe in next life. but still i'd love to read your question though i won't be able to answer it :-P
13:52.23hhahlohi, i usually keep volume off but now i boot volume on, and heard linus voice? if i recall right stock diablo doesn't speak at linus voice? what caused that, virus ;)
13:52.25lbtah, I thought you were, hence the ping - question posted to maemo-dev :)
13:52.41lbtor drugs
13:53.27Stskeepshhahlo: no, just insane clone-to-SD authors
13:53.48hhahlohehe, cool
13:55.23hhahloi was really surprised :)
13:56.06lcuknot half as surprised at linus. waking up one morning squashed in a little nokia tablet
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14:45.22ccookeHuh. Has the fluff about the Next Device actually calmed down finally, then? Or am I just not looking in the right places? :-)
14:46.50aquatixlcuk: :)
14:49.11Stskeepsccooke: time to start new rumours!
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14:53.29lardmanccooke: yep, people are now excited about the sw on the next device, as a stand-in
14:53.54Stskeepslo wazd
14:54.21Stskeepswazd: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer-ui3.png :)
14:54.21ccookelardman: even that seems to have died down quite a bit. I guess the interested folk are busy porting stuff, giving the naysayers a break from things to react to ;-)
14:54.55lardmanccooke: yeah, though we're all waiting really, wanting to see the finished product (both hw and sw)
14:55.04ccooke*nod8
14:55.33ccookeIt never ceases to amuse me, though, how many people get outraged about this stuff :-)
14:56.07lardmanwhat? the delay? ;)
14:56.37ccookeEvery single little delta between the next system and the n800? ;-)
14:57.09lardmanwell people need something to fill their time :)
14:57.22ccookeI guess so...
14:57.46lardmanI'm sure I'd be doing the same, more than I am, if I weren't pretty busy
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15:08.40ccookeOh, yes... I keep meaning to ask.
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15:09.47ccookeI've not yet been able to find any reference to the stability of Mer. Is it actually ready for (semi-)general use?
15:10.03Stskeepsit's not 1.0 (day to day usable) just yet :P
15:11.11ccookeheh. If you're using 1.0 to mean 'usable', you might want to state that somewhere. We use hundreds of not-yet-and-likely-never-1.0 software every day :-)
15:11.11Stskeepsbut it is in good development
15:11.17Stskeepshehe
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15:12.00ccooke(I remember when 1.0 actually *meant* something... :-)
15:12.13Stskeepsccooke: as in you can put it on your tablet and use it without contemplating booting to maemo :P
15:12.32Sho_ccooke: there's a 0.9 review on lwn.net that calls it "not ready for end-users yet"
15:12.47Sho_(or something along those lines)
15:12.50ccookeSho_: Ah ha. thanks.
15:13.05Sho_ccooke: http://lwn.net/Articles/322693/
15:13.05Stskeepsccooke: best way to see it really is to try it out - we've made huge leaps, and 0.11 will be a huge leap as well
15:13.21Sho_ccooke: Stuff like email, instant messenging, etc. are missing, I guess
15:13.24ccooke(I use my tablet too much to put a dev environment on it, unfortunately)
15:13.42Sho_(personally, though, I don't use email on the tablet, and prefer Pidgin for IM anyway)
15:13.49lardmanccooke: me too
15:14.00ccookeI use the built-in IM. it does the job very well.
15:14.09lardmanbut with some instructions about which repos to add and which packages to install it can be made usable
15:14.14ccookewhat's more, I use it for SIP
15:14.19Sho_Stskeeps: Working on Mer? Kudos - nice to know my N810 will have an upgrade path
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15:14.58ccookeI'll be buying the next device when it's out. I'll probably put Mer onto the n810 after that.
15:15.03jeremiah_moo
15:15.08StskeepsSho_: yeah, i guess i'm lead developer, but i think of myself of just a faciliator of the project bringing together the pre-existing efforts in the community
15:15.10jeremiah_seen X-Fade
15:15.11Stskeeps'lo jeremiah_
15:15.23jeremiah_Hey Stskeeps, How are you?
15:15.37Stskeepsjeremiah_: i'm good, had first masters thesis meeting with my advisor today and it went fine
15:15.49Stskeepsit's nice that you feel your brain waking up and feeling intellectual again for once :P
15:15.53jeremiah_Stskeeps: Excellent, glad to hear it!
15:15.57jeremiah_Good for you.
15:16.02lardmanjeremiah_: ~seen you mean?
15:16.05Sho_Stskeeps: Nice, rock on then :-) I don't doubt my tablet will end up running Mer pretty soon
15:16.11jeremiah_BTW, you will most like be in Copenhagen?
15:16.20jeremiah_lardman: Yes, that is what I mean. :)
15:16.27jeremiah_~seen X-Fade
15:16.55infobotx-fade is currently on #maemo (7d 12h 47s). Has said a total of 57 messages. Is idling for 6h 50m 14s, last said: 'Looks great ;)'.
15:16.55Stskeepsjeremiah_: yeah, wouldn't miss it
15:16.55lardmanthis is where infobot is asleep
15:16.55jeremiah_Stskeeps: Excellent, I will be there too. :)
15:17.17lardmanwould like to be, but is getting married that weekend, not sure my wife-to-be would be happy with me delaying things
15:18.00aquatixlardman: congrats in advance :)
15:18.09lardmanthanks
15:18.18Stskeepswonders when he and the fiancee will find time for the wedding
15:18.44lbtmy suggestion...
15:18.52lardmandon't do it too soon, really cramps your evening programming time
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15:19.12Stskeepslardman: ah, we already live together for 1 1/2 year
15:19.17lbtpick a date you can remember - we both have birthdays on 20th - so 20th it was.... then find a suitable 20th
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15:19.37lardmanStskeeps: Same here, just lots of extra planning/organising now
15:19.49lardmanlbt: lol
15:19.52Stskeepslbt: so far relationship start at 16/2, and engagement day on 1/1, so nice numbers
15:19.55Stskeeps:P
15:20.00lardmanlbt: or get it tattoo'd on your palm?
15:20.17aquatix22/7 is also nice, approximating pi ;)
15:20.28lbthey - she just laughs 'cos I never remember how many years
15:20.30aquatix(and summer weather and stuff generally)
15:20.35lbtits >10 < 20
15:20.39jeremiah_X-Fade: Ping: Can we put a new ssh key on g.m.o?
15:21.16Sho_Stskeeps: Btw, is Mer compatible with Maemo themes?
15:21.29jeremiah_So I 'cloned' my debian machine in virtualbox so I could take it with me as I travelled.
15:21.51StskeepsSho_: somewhat. fact is that we're applying a new hildon desktop ui
15:22.03ccookeOh, god, wedding planning. We're nearly at our fourth anniversary and I can still bait my wife out by suggesting we organise another get-together "like the wedding" ;-)
15:22.13jeremiah_But, when you do that, Virtualbox changes the disk ID, and linux uses a UUID for the disk - so my vdi machine won't boot!
15:22.17StskeepsSho_: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer-ui3.png
15:22.36jeremiah_heh, we are going on our ten year anniversary trip this year. :P
15:22.57Sho_Stskeeps: Basically my question aims at my love for the LCARS themes ;)
15:23.43StskeepsSho_: personal launcher maybe.. but yeah, LCARS is difficult with this layout
15:23.45Myrttiblinks at men talking about wedding planning
15:23.54StskeepsMyrtti: geeks love their girls :P
15:24.19Sho_Stskeeps: personal launcher?
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15:24.45StskeepsSho_: well, the problem is that in both fremantle (i think) and mer we have done away with the sidebar
15:24.54Stskeepsand a sidebar is pretty usual in LCARS themes, isn't it?
15:25.00Stskeepsif i remember my trek corretly
15:25.01Stskeeps+c
15:25.10aquatixMyrtti: geeks never cease to amaze ;)
15:25.15Myrtti"can't you just go to the magistrate and get the official stuff done, roast a pig, give people paper plates and mugs, then start getting people drunk?"
15:25.23Sho_Stskeeps: yep, indeed
15:25.40Sho_Stskeeps: so you mean for LCARS I'd need to run a personal as in alternative launcher?
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15:26.12StskeepsSho_: no, as in, make some hack to get a similar experience .. i honestly don't know
15:26.31Stskeepsisn't there some Trek-acceptable non-sidebar theme? ;)
15:26.34ccookeStskeeps: huh. So all apps are now full-screen all the time?
15:26.45Stskeepsccooke: semi - there's always the marquee
15:26.45Sho_Stskeeps: ah well, we'll see ... I'm sure the LCARS theme authors will probably switch to Mer at some point as well ;)
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15:26.56ccookeStskeeps: ah ha.
15:26.58Stskeepsccooke: see the png above
15:27.17ccookeStskeeps: so it's now a case of showing or hiding that?
15:27.29Stskeepscorrect
15:27.37Stskeepsso you have the whole 800px width
15:27.47Stskeepsrotation is also a lot nicer i guess
15:27.52Stskeepswhole 640px
15:27.59xntStskeeps: is there a mer installer, for x86, like a disc I insert into a machine?
15:28.11Stskeepsxnt: no, it takes a bit more effort to make something like that :P
15:28.23Stskeepsxnt: there's a guide for it on Mer/Documentation
15:28.49xntso I have to extract the fs?
15:28.52Stskeepsyeah
15:28.56Stskeepsand set up grub
15:29.02ccooke(Today appears to be 'interrogate Stskeeps' day)
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15:29.58xntso I have to hook up an external cd rom to my eeepc download and extract the mer rootfs and setup grub
15:30.09xntfrom a live cd
15:30.14StskeepsSho_: anyhow, noone says the sidebar has to be a hildons style sidebar
15:30.39ccooke(and as such...) Stskeeps: This is starting to get really quite interesting. From what I've read, Mer coexists nicely with Meamo? Might be worth grabbing a copy as long as I don't have to run it during the day :-)
15:30.48Stskeepsccooke: yeah, dual-boot
15:30.57Stskeepsyou can flash to jffs2 too but it's not that good yet
15:31.20StskeepsSho_: lcars seem to implicate the toolbar is on the left in an application
15:31.22ccookeRight. Time I spent a while researching dual boot on the tablets, then :-/
15:31.43Sho_Stskeeps: well, check out http://synthesize.us/LCARS_PADD
15:31.56StskeepsSho_: yeah, i know, ian hangs out in here occasionally
15:32.09Sho_Stskeeps: http://synthesize.us/Image:PADD_media.png - the existing ITOS UI caters well to LCARS
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15:32.45Stskeepsyes.. i wouldn't be surprised if the sidebar was influenced by trekkies
15:32.45Stskeeps:P
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15:33.10xntqwerty12: :P
15:33.13StskeepsSho_: we'll see what happens. maybe we'll morph the code to take multiple hildon desktop layouts. i dunno
15:33.21qwerty12xnt, lol, what? :P
15:33.24xntmaEMO :P
15:33.31qwerty12Oh, hehe :p
15:33.38xntheh
15:33.55Sho_Stskeeps: Well, just keep us poor Trekkies in mind while you develop Mer. Consider we currently have no Trek series on TV, and the upcoming movie looks to be rather bad. The internet tablets are our only source of joy! ;-)
15:34.19StskeepsSho_: i used to have entire TNG,DS9 and voyager laying around :P
15:34.33Sho_Oh, I have all the DVDs as well ;)
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15:35.10ccookeBah. Sometimes I wish I was less of a server-side type. There's a lot of interesting work going on here, but I doubt I can be any help :-/
15:36.09Stskeepsi doubt i can find interest in it, but i wouldn't mind a more pervasive computing angle to tablets. i mean, why shouldn't my tablets be a part of my existing home infrastructure
15:36.20Stskeepsbut that's maybe a longer term goal
15:36.29ccookeStskeeps: Interesting idea.
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15:36.39ccookeIt's one that's already somewhat there, though
15:36.42Stskeepsyeah
15:36.50xntStskeeps: will advanced-power work in x86
15:36.54Stskeepsand why shouldn't my two tablets running mer be able to cooperate
15:36.55ccookeme and my wife use our tablets as remote controls, for instance
15:36.56Stskeepsxnt: no
15:37.09xntso I can't see my batter status?
15:37.17xnt*battery
15:37.18Stskeepsxnt: with a bit of rewrite maybe
15:37.22xntok
15:37.23Stskeepsand why shouldn't my tablet be able to use the power of the sheevaplug in the corner :)
15:37.35jeremiah_Stskeeps: Cool idea
15:37.37ccookeStskeeps: well, with avahi...
15:37.46jeremiah_Stskeeps: Do you have a sheevaplug?
15:37.56Stskeepsjeremiah_: no, but i am considering to get one
15:38.01MyrttiI so want one
15:38.07ccooke(it's often occurred to me that [lots of people] could do a lot more with avahi.
15:38.10Myrttior the vigan whatever with xubuntu
15:38.26ccookeWith a few standardised protocols, say, you could get an automatic remote control interface working
15:38.26Stskeepsmy current shopping list is rx-51, beagleboard (for home), sheevaplug and touch book
15:38.30Stskeeps:P
15:38.32ccookeand that would be *fun*.
15:38.34jeremiah_I want one too.
15:38.41Stskeepsccooke: one thing i find interesting is that OSSO/hildon has support for hibernation
15:38.45Stskeepswhy shouldn
15:38.58Stskeeps't this be usable for moving state of the app to another machine
15:39.06jeremiah_Stskeeps: Touch Book?
15:39.09jeremiah_Have to ask google
15:39.14Stskeepsjeremiah_: yes, you have to
15:39.19ccookeStskeeps: um. Because that's a horrifically difficult proposition? :-)
15:39.30Stskeepsjeremiah_: http://gizmodo.com/5162584/always-innovating-touch-book-is-part+netbook-part+tablet-open-source-frankenstein
15:39.40Stskeepsccooke: sortof. people are researching cyber foraging at my work atm
15:39.57Stskeepsthings like python stackless looks extremely interesting for stuff like this
15:39.57ccookehibernation might get you able to move your entire running image from one identical machine to another, but you're still at serious risk of data loss if your storage isn't identical
15:40.14ccookehowever, there have been tools to move unix *processes* between systems.
15:40.17Stskeepsyeah.. and that's the problem of posix :)
15:40.45jeremiah_Well, can't one do iSCSI and virtual machines with VLAN?
15:40.48Stskeepsjeremiah_: think mobile beagleboard, part laptop, part tablet
15:40.51ccookethey're fraught with dangers and I haven't seen one that was actually maintained in the last five years, but they did work (for a limited class of things :-)
15:41.09jeremiah_Stskeeps: But big, with a sorta weak processor. OMAP 3
15:41.25Stskeepsjeremiah_: yeah - and (at least) 10-12 hour battery lifetime
15:41.26Stskeeps.. for 300$
15:41.39jeremiah_Yeah, that is actually a good deal
15:41.56Stskeepsi want one. i dont want it to replace my tablet, but it would be useful for work
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15:46.46aquatixStskeeps: indeed
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15:49.25andre__sigh... people closing bug reports as invalid because it's less work than correctly reassigning them... nice attitude :-/
15:49.52Jaffaandre__: nice
15:50.15JaffaX-Fade/bergie: seen the "duplicated hearts/favourites" on p.m.o and the right-side of /news/?
15:50.21JaffaOh no. My fault.
15:50.24JaffaJS turned off.
15:51.09bergieJaffa: yeah, it could degrade more nicely to those situations
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15:51.47jeremiah_How waoping
15:51.53jeremiah_whoops
15:52.01jeremiah_how was linkoping_
15:52.21jeremiah_Sorry I couldn't be there.
15:52.52z4chhany gsoc mentors here able to answer a question about the maemo student proposal template?
15:53.37andre__z4chh, please don't ask to ask, just ask the question itself (though i'm not a mentor)
15:54.18z4chhandre__, well im looking more for someone to raise their hand..so i can pm them, it is kind of personal :P
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15:54.39andre__ah, ok
15:55.13z4chhthanks though, ask to ask can be highly inefficient :D
15:55.27z4chh!ask
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15:59.01z4chhspeaking of ask to ask...this is a funny question
15:59.04z4chhcan i ask a question about asking a question?
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16:00.35rkirtiz4chh, andre__ : May I join in if there are guidelines being discussed.I am applying as well and would be glad to get some pointers.
16:00.53z4chhrkirti, you a student?
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16:01.34rkirtiz4chh, yes. [Computer Science, undergrad]
16:01.39andre__if i remember correctly vdvsx was the main guy working on that, but not sure
16:01.50z4chhhe is the org admin
16:02.01z4chhi was going to shoot him a pm, but he no here :'(
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16:26.19lfelipez4chh: I'm helping to admin as well, what do you need ?
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16:36.06jeremiah_Do people use Gizmo?
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16:36.27jeremiah_Or do people not really care about video on their NITs?
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16:37.18thopiekaris someone of you familar with chroot?
16:37.18till-sometimes ppl use gizmo
16:37.30till-but the image quality is bad
16:37.38thopiekaraaah jeremiah_..
16:37.53thopiekarI waited for you sooo long...
16:37.54jeremiah_thopiekar: Hi there
16:38.01mgedminwould say that video on my NIT doesn't work well enough for me to care about it
16:38.10jeremiah_thopiekar: Sorry, I have been traveling and haveing hardware issues
16:38.18mgedminthe google talk video calls work fine, but only if you recipient also has a NIT
16:38.20Stskeepscan't view video, or use canola in a reasonable manner on his n800
16:38.27jeremiah_mgedmin till- okay, thanks for the info
16:38.53thopiekarthere is a package in extras-devel called graphviz.. it conflicts with libltdl3 (libtool)...
16:38.59mgedminlost an r in his last sentence
16:39.18mgedmingraphviz conflicts with libtool? hwy?
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16:39.40thopiekarI would like to fix that but sources of graphviz from ubuntu need mesa
16:40.03thopiekarthere are files in graphviz which are also in libltdl..
16:40.05till-i used gizmo mainly to call home while i was on vacation
16:40.09mgedminI'm sure you can remove that from build-depends: and the package will build
16:40.19mgedminmaybe with some tweaking of the ./configure line in debian/rules
16:40.23till-but with my mobile :)
16:40.59jeremiah_mgedmin: Hmm, that is what makes maemo weird, it should not build if it does not have build-depends satisfied.
16:41.20jeremiah_That is what build-depends is for, creating a dependency on a package at build time
16:41.23mgedminwell, I'm assuming graphviz in maemo extras-devel was not build from pristine ubuntu packages then
16:41.48jeremiah_mgedmin: What would it have been built from instead?
16:41.48mgedmininstalls graphviz with no conflicts
16:41.56mgedmina good question
16:42.00jeremiah_:)
16:42.02mgedminask the person who built it
16:42.09jeremiah_So thopiekar, did you add a build-depends?
16:42.17qwerty12mgedmin, nope, binaries uploaded in a "source package" with cp in its rules...
16:42.20mgedminI'd guess the package from debian, with maybe patches
16:42.20thopiekarI mailed with the maintainer of graphviz he told me that he rates him self as a noob in debianizing..
16:42.33mgedminouch and yes, that explains it
16:43.06mgedminYIKES, graphviz's deb ships /usr/lib/libltdl.so.3 !!!
16:43.15thopiekarjeremiah_: no but I'm thinking of making a newer package of ubuntu or debain..
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16:43.28mgedminapt-get removes it asap
16:43.35jeremiah_thopiekar: Take it from debian first
16:43.52jeremiah_Try and build it in scratchbox
16:43.56mgedminwould mud-builder help here?
16:44.06mgedminit's supposed to make porting debian packages to maemo easy
16:44.17thopiekarI'm myself maybe not better than the maintainer of graphviz but I use others source-folders instead of making mayself starnge ones..
16:44.18jeremiah_I have little experience with mud-builder so I can't answer that.
16:44.22mgedminI don't know if it can do things like remove build-deps
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16:44.55jeremiah_Removing build-depends should never work.
16:44.57mgedminI once built a vim package with mud, but it was a horrible package (version number: 70.  Just '70'.  no 7.0-1 or anything)
16:45.14jeremiah_That line is designed to specify which package you need to build your package.
16:45.16mgedminjeremiah_: it works when those deps are optional for the upstream sources
16:45.26mgedmin./configure often checks for the presence of various libraries
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16:45.32jeremiah_Then they should not be in build-depends
16:45.33mgedminand builds optional components when those are present
16:45.44mgedmindebian wants to build those optional components always
16:45.52mgedminit all makes perfect sense, really
16:46.14mgedmindebian splits optional parts into different .deb files, but wants to build all of them from a single source package
16:46.21mgedminotherwise it would be building the same sources again and again
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16:46.43mgedminbut if maemo doesn't have mesa (or opengl at all, at least currently), then we never want to build the optional opengl backend for graphviz
16:46.54mgedmintherefore maemo graphviz package shouldn't depend (or build-depend) on mesa
16:47.08mgedminand if debian/rules explicitly says ./configure --with-mesa, then we should strip that out
16:47.13mgedminthat's assuming graphviz even uses autoconf
16:47.15mgedminI haven't checked
16:47.26mgedminI just sort of assume every self-respecting unix tarball uses autoconf nowadays
16:48.49*** join/#maemo DrIk (i=drik@sauron.cs.hope.edu)
16:49.25jeremiah_Most tarballs do use autoconf it seems
16:49.47qwerty12cries at midori using waf
16:49.52jeremiah_I don't understand thopiekar why you would want graphviz on the tablet. Do you have a use case?
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16:50.47Stskeepsqwerty12: wtf is waf
16:51.08thopiekarnot actually jeremiah_ I only need it for a package needed for pulseaudio..
16:51.13qwerty12Stskeeps, Some python autoconf wannabe
16:51.31*** join/#maemo simon_ (n=simon@90.146.223.204)
16:51.35qwerty12I remember the shit I had to do to get it to accept an extra define last time :(
16:53.17*** join/#maemo kozak (n=subbu@117.192.2.8)
16:53.19andre__geez. where in http://repository.maemo.org/pool/ is the metalayer-crawler package?! am i blind, or am i just stupid?
16:53.29thopiekarhates it working with corrupt packages..
16:53.35qwerty12andre__, it's closed source
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16:53.54andre__qwerty12, i know, but there's still a non-free section
16:54.04qwerty12Oh, you want to reinstall it?
16:54.10qwerty12It's in the update repo
16:54.17andre__theoretically :-P  (= not me myself)
16:54.31andre__update repo?!
16:54.36andre__i want something http'ish :-)
16:54.46qwerty12Going through the update repo means knowing nokia password but Eero has attached a newer version to a bug somewhere
16:54.46andre__that wasn't browsable iirc... :-/
16:54.56qwerty12Download the packages file ;)
16:55.11andre__yeah, that's the bug i refer to. ok. so i can't help... hmmpf
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17:11.16xnthates his camera
17:11.28Myrttihates her brain
17:11.34xnt:P
17:11.53Stskeepshates the lack of coffee, but is getting strangely addicted to this tea his gf brought home.
17:12.08MyrttiI've got my own moka pot Ć¢Ā™Ā„
17:12.09xnthates asus for soldering on the ssd onto the motherboard
17:12.17Myrttia Real Bialletti one Ć¢Ā™Ā„
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17:13.07xnthas compiz working out of the box for some strange reason
17:13.11xnton my eee
17:14.29*** join/#maemo beav1s (n=mk@p4FC3205D.dip.t-dialin.net)
17:15.01xnthttp://xceleo.com/mer/eee-images/DSC02490.JPG ???
17:15.46xntstskeeps: mer+compiz?
17:16.13qwerty12learns his lesson: don't leave dist-upgrading your scratchbox targets to the last minute.
17:16.39*** join/#maemo renatof_ (n=renato@200.184.118.130)
17:18.13Veggenqwerty: I once had to let my Linux laptop compile a kernel while sitting in my backback on my way to a networking talk that depended on that kernel :)
17:18.44qwerty12Ouch :)
17:18.46xntVeggen: :P
17:18.53xntin your backpack?
17:19.06xntdidn'y it overheat
17:19.20Veggenxnt: nah, it wasn't a very new and powerful one.
17:19.32Stskeepsxnt: not impossible, but then newer hildon-desktop would be more useful
17:19.44xntwill never put a laptop on in his backpack, especially one compiling a kernel
17:19.51xntStskeeps: ok
17:20.42xntbrb
17:21.28xnthas to go to the router room to connect his ee to the internet to download the mer x86 image because ubuntu doesn;t have atheros drivers by default :P
17:21.35xnt*eeePC
17:21.42xntoh wait
17:21.56xntdamn usb cd :P
17:22.00fireunI put my laptop in a padded sleeve, it would certainly overheat if it was compiling a kernel there
17:23.04*** join/#maemo briglia (n=briglia@189.2.128.130)
17:24.04Stskeepsheh, this is almost for a movie
17:24.24Stskeepsin .dk, there's a criminal case.. a woman who is a terminal cancer patient
17:24.30xntonce put his powerbook in his backpack, with the insomnia app (shuts off screen only) and I had an ssh session open , when I took it out it was extremely hot (as hot as a gpu heatsink when running a game such as crysis :P))
17:24.38Stskeepswho starts poisoning people around her
17:24.44Stskeepsincluding her husband
17:25.00xnt:P
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17:25.32xnthas to run an ethernet cable from his router room to his eeepc
17:25.54xntwishes that his parents would let him put the router in his room :P
17:26.11Stskeepsheh
17:26.16Stskeepsi had a cable upstairs and that was that
17:26.29xnt:P
17:26.30Stskeepsi even didn't have a cable until i was like 16 or something
17:27.42*** join/#maemo mgwpub (n=mgwpub@193.170.134.162)
17:28.26xntIm 14 and i have fios, who know when im 16 Ill have a 4GBPS up/down connection :P
17:29.04mgedminno wifi?
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17:29.12xntyeah
17:29.21xntno wifi on my eee
17:29.29xntbut I have 3 wifi aps :P
17:29.48mgedminah, atheros
17:29.59mgedminwon't new ubuntu release have free drivers for that one?
17:30.04xnthates asus for not putting an orinoco card on the eee
17:30.07mgedminthinks he might have heard something in passing
17:30.56xntmgedmin: 8.10?
17:31.06mgedmin9.04 perhaps
17:31.27xntjust booted up 8.10 on his eee
17:31.39xntwell...
17:31.49mgedminintel wifi drivers are kind of nice
17:31.53xntbrb
17:31.56mgedminat least when you run in managed mode
17:32.05mgedminI've no idea if ap mode is even possible
17:32.10xnt:P
17:32.10qwerty12Doesn't madwifi do atheros? At least madwifi was used on my old Netgear DG834GT.
17:32.11mgedminand adhoc had problems talking to my n810
17:32.40mgedminqwerty12: madwifi does atheros; madwifi isn't free (big binary blob in the middle), therefore probably disabled by default in ubuntu
17:32.42*** join/#maemo ezadkiel_mB (n=chatzill@net1.senecac.on.ca)
17:32.53mgedminhey, doesn't ubuntu have all the restricted drivers on cd? installable with a single gui mouse click?
17:33.02qwerty12mgedmin, aha, thanks, I was always under impression it was fully free
17:33.08mgedminwell, where I say "cd", read "the sd card that you copied your cd onto"
17:33.22mgedminqwerty12: I think it may have recently rewritten to be fully free
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17:34.40mgedminmadwifi.org is b0rked
17:34.47mgedmins/.org/.net/
17:34.58mgedminwait, it's .org in the url, but .net in the page title
17:35.02mgedminwaaah, b0rked
17:35.13xnt:P
17:37.39jeremiah_wow, gizmo video quality is pretty bad
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17:37.58till-yep :)
17:38.16qwerty12To be fair, the tablet isn't much cop wrt video playing anyway and the included camera is a joke :)
17:38.49jeremiah_Well, I suppose it is more of a proof of concenpt for the next device. :)
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17:42.12xntqwerty12: so the next nit will have an hd quality cammer
17:42.17xnt*camera
17:42.46qwerty12Yeah, I can't be arsed with rumors personally, I like to see the real thing :)
17:43.09*** join/#maemo Zic (n=zic@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.zic)
17:43.23xntok :)
17:43.35xntis hungry
17:43.53xntgets a snack
17:45.48z4chhshouldn't you be in school xnt >.<
17:47.17xntz4chh: I don't have school, its a rating day :P
17:47.21xnt*today
17:48.49z4chhxnt, where do you live?
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17:49.32xntz4chh: NY
17:49.41z4chhcool :D
17:49.47z4chhin ohio with bman xD
17:49.51xnt:P
17:50.05z4chhim in*
17:50.08khertan_mibbit_fHello !
17:50.16z4chhkhertan_mibbit_f, sup man
17:50.26khertan_mibbit_fis using mibbit on fennec
17:50.28khertan_mibbit_f:)
17:50.46khertan_mibbit_fseems to work better than  on micrpb
17:51.04xntkhertan_mibbit_f: hi
17:51.15*** join/#maemo chenca (n=chenca@sdprx01x.ext.nokia.com)
17:51.33khertan_mibbit_fdoes there is some python guru in the room ?
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17:52.55xnt:P
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17:56.15khertan_on_microfennec is unusable with this stuid gesture
17:56.43khertan_on_microand the delete key binded to previous page is really a stupid idea
17:57.03khertan_on_microhow i delete a char on a word !
17:57.20khertan_on_microreally silly idea
17:58.13xnt:P
17:59.27jeremiah_khertan_on_micro: Which version of fennec?
17:59.33jeremiah_Did you pull it from the repos?
18:00.16xntis it alpha or beta?
18:00.53xnt:P
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18:05.33asasakispeaking of, jeremiah_ X-Fade did you get a chance to get the beta in extras? =)
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18:06.53bensonemoli
18:07.06bensonsry, wrong window
18:07.17Stskeepslo benson
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18:15.12wazdHey everybody :)
18:15.24wazdhttp://lotro.ucoz.ru/omw.html <- it works!)
18:15.58wazdNot dynamic though :(
18:17.34Stskeepswazd: thumbs up :)
18:18.00jeremiah_asasaki: Not yet, I think we are still waiting from word from Mozilla
18:18.16jeremiah_wazd: Two thumbs up!
18:18.40asasakijeremiah_: i think stuart gave the thumbs up in email last week
18:18.45jeremiah_Not sure if Niels has added the beta yet.
18:18.54asasakik
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18:19.03jeremiah_asasaki: Well, I had heard from Pavlov and from someone else that they were going to wait
18:19.15jeremiah_I think they are shooting for this week
18:19.26jeremiah_I am going to have to upload it by hand
18:19.41jeremiah_And no one has contacted me about it yet so I don't think it is ready
18:19.47asasakithat was me =) we're ready... we released on ftp.mozilla.org last week
18:19.59jeremiah_asasaki: Cool! :)
18:20.23asasakihttp://www.mozilla.org/projects/fennec/1.0b1/releasenotes/
18:20.23jeremiah_Great, I had heard something about documentation, but I guess that is resolved?
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18:20.32jeremiah_asasaki: Fabulous.
18:20.35asasakistuart was working on the above link
18:20.58asasakianyway, when you get a chance. i know it's late over there.
18:21.22jeremiah_asasaki: I have traveled to the US, so it is not late :)
18:21.26jeremiah_I am in EST
18:22.07jeremiah_I would like to co-ordinate with X-Fade however, so perhaps it will wait until tomorrow?
18:22.14jeremiah_He is currently not around.
18:22.35ShadowJKWhat fennec is in extra right now? apt-cache show fennec says "1.0b1"
18:22.53Pavlovah, yeah, i think email was sent to x-fade
18:22.57Stskeepsyeah, i saw a fennec in extras
18:23.05asasakijeremiah_: sounds good, thanks
18:23.16Pavlovjeremiah_: x-fade may have pushed it to extras
18:23.23Pavlovsorry for confusion!
18:23.30asasakioh, cool
18:24.34jeremiah_No problem, I thought he might have
18:24.39ShadowJKI have a vague memory of one of the browser things doing something dubious and not uninstalling cleanly
18:24.52jeremiah_I was travelling so I think he went ahead and uploaded.
18:24.57ShadowJKwas that fennec or was it something else? maybe the webkit engine for microb
18:25.05jeremiah_I will test it now actually.
18:25.13PavlovShadowJK: i don't think it is fennec, but who knows
18:25.27Myrttire skibur's quit message: NO IT'S EVEN
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18:28.40yergafennec is in extras-devel from the 18th
18:28.45yergahere: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/f/fennec/
18:29.03jeremiah_Hmmm.
18:29.08jeremiah_Is that the latest?
18:29.46timelE61iyOu guys only wanted releases
18:29.49timelE61iNot nightlies
18:30.10timelE61iSo hopefully they aren't releasing releases more often than  monthly :)
18:30.49Pavlovthat looks like the right builds
18:31.53jeremiah_I thought that was supposed to go to extras, not extras-devel.
18:31.59jeremiah_But I may be confsed.
18:32.06jeremiah_confused even
18:32.14jeremiah_Have to talk to X-Fade about it
18:32.24Pavlovyeah, was supposed to be in extras
18:32.24Pavlovheh
18:32.31Pavlovwe'll sort it all out soon enough
18:32.38jeremiah_Pavlov: Yes indeed. :)
18:32.46timelE61idid you guys figure out how to get it there w/o ruffling too many feathers?
18:33.20jeremiah_timelE61i: I suppose, my feathers certainly are not ruffled, but whomever has any ruffled feathers, please speak up!
18:33.40jeremiah_=)
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18:43.12jeremiah_Has anyone installed fennec from extras-devel?
18:43.19ShadowJKyes
18:43.23ShadowJKi just did
18:43.23mgedminyup
18:43.28ShadowJKhelp!
18:43.35mgedminyes?
18:43.42ShadowJKit's stealing focus like crazy
18:43.46ShadowJKor was
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18:44.05mgedminhuh
18:44.14jeremiah_It is not showing up here in apt or in AM. Hmmm
18:45.05ShadowJKI switched to xterm, i typed one or two chars, then xterm froze, fennec forced itself ontop
18:45.31mgedminheh
18:45.34mgedminmicrob also likes to do that
18:45.38mgedminprecisely twice
18:45.42ShadowJKi switch back to xterm, manage to type anothe few chars, and fennec pops up again
18:45.58jeremiah_That is annoying.
18:46.03ShadowJKfennec did it about 12 times before it stopped :(
18:46.26ShadowJKYes, extremely
18:46.32jeremiah_fennec may be downloading items in the background and when it completes it lets you know, by stealing focus
18:46.51mgedminwell, 12 times is excessive
18:46.55Stskeepsdislikes stealing focus
18:46.57mgedminactually, even 2 times is 2 times too many
18:47.15jeremiah_stealing focus is bad
18:47.15Stskeepsnotification, maybe, but not focus stealing :P
18:47.27mgedminbut there's probaby some holy book called "UI Spec" in a Nokia shrine somewhere that requires it...
18:47.40mgedminflashing taskbar icon would be sufficient
18:47.44mgedmin"now the page is fully loaded"
18:47.45ShadowJKfirefox does it too
18:47.59mgedminon desktop modern window managers disallow focus stealing by default
18:48.04Stskeepsrevolution time, get out your pitchforks
18:48.05Stskeeps:P
18:48.06mgedminsome of them do it badly
18:48.18mgedmine.g. compiz lets firefox steal the focus, but not raise the window
18:48.24ShadowJKbut most windowmanagers on linux desktop proper have focus theft prevention specifically for firefox
18:48.25mgedminso I get a focused background window and I cannot see where my keys go
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18:50.14ShadowJKoh and it hasnt loaded the pahe i tried to load :)
18:50.31mgedminyes, that's the most irritating thing: it steals focus before the page is ready
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18:54.01ShadowJKI cant figure out how to scroll in a page (this sentence interrupted 5 times by focus theft)
18:54.04ShadowJK6
18:55.21jeremiah_Sounds like time to file a bug or two
18:55.44ShadowJKhm
18:56.36asasakiyup
18:56.42mgedminpanning?
18:57.01mgedminnow, if you figure out how to select text in an input box, tell me
18:57.07mgedminit's all panning as far as fennec is concerned
18:57.19mgedminor, better yet, how to get it to use a larger font size
18:57.21ShadowJKit scrolled a bit with stylus tap-drag but then it went completely white and reloaded the page and placed me at the top again
18:57.36mgedmin+/- (or double-tap) work fine for zooming, but horizonal scrolling is incompatible with reading text
18:57.36StskeepsShadowJK: heh, directly missing microb again? ;)
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18:58.27ShadowJKi might add that microb loads the same page faster ;)
18:59.00ShadowJKI got no response from the zoom keys
18:59.03mgedminI have a feeling that fennec spends a noticeable bit of cpu scaling fonts (or perhaps images)
18:59.18mgedminwhat page are you looking at? and how near are you to running out of RAM?
18:59.40mgedminthat's the other thing fennec is good spending time on: swapping
19:00.35sp3000ShadowJK: it thinks you double-tapped, probably
19:01.39ShadowJKtablet got somewhat warm on the back so it was probably swapping
19:02.00jeremiah_It would be good if you guys passed some of this info back to mozilla, this is a testing release and they will want the feedback.
19:02.47ShadowJKI think it needs to come with a tutorial video on how to use the interface
19:03.03jeremiah_ShadowJK: Good idea actually
19:03.33*** join/#maemo chmac (n=chmac@75.172.96.43)
19:06.40Stskeepswazd: do you know of any tshirt sites that could make tshirts not unlike the mer wallpaper + logo, btw?
19:07.00asasakiShadowJK: there are a couple videos here: http://blog.pavlov.net/2009/03/17/fennec-1-beta-1/
19:07.04Stskeepsi know it's probably easier to do in hand with batique but ..
19:07.05Stskeeps:P
19:07.49*** join/#maemo victorgp (n=victorpo@189.73.101.155)
19:08.07born2wonderhi all, my fn key isnt recognized in latest ubuntu (b-mans latest instructions), i tried instaling xkb-data from mer repo but that breaks my sys-env-x as it requires a newer version of xkb-data. any ideas?
19:08.35born2wonderfn key isnt recognized in xev as well
19:09.35*** join/#maemo VDVsx (n=valerio@bl5-198-42.dsl.telepac.pt)
19:09.39Stskeepspoke b-man to learn what version dependancies have of consequences :P
19:10.02born2wonderok thanks
19:14.16ShadowJKmicrob feels heavenish now :)
19:14.31ShadowJKguesses he needs more ram
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19:18.23VDVsxhello :)
19:18.28Stskeepslo VDVsx
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19:30.56wazdStskeeps: nope, sorry(
19:31.03Stskeepswazd: k
19:31.27Stskeepsalternative would be dark blue tshirt with logo i guess
19:32.53lcukyo! VDVsx
19:33.10lcukdid you beat them up about the remote control thing last night
19:33.19VDVsxlcuk, nah
19:33.49VDVsxI don't like universal remotes too :)
19:34.06lcukhas a tcp remote control that just works here
19:34.27lcukit would be nice to add some other connection methods to it one day :)
19:34.59lcukbut i have no need just yet
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19:39.07VDVsxlcuk, but talking about TV,Video, hi-fi, do you like a universal remote for everything, or just one for each of those :) ?
19:39.41VDVsxsome of the discussion was about it :P
19:41.12lcukVDVsx, sometimes i wish i had a remote for everything :)
19:41.22xnt:P this is the time I get home from school :)
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19:42.04qwerty12_N8007:41? Your school sucks :P
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19:52.36xntqwerty12_N800: over here its 3:40 :P
19:53.03qwerty12_N800lol, gathered :D :P
19:53.40xntIm in NY where are you?
19:53.49qwerty12_N800London :)
19:53.56xnt:P
20:00.17joyrideris it normal that i still can't login in the maemo.org website when i created and actived my account on garage.maemo.org like yesterday
20:00.46qwerty12_N800maemo.org & garage accounts are separate iirc
20:01.34joyrideryes but it doesn't allow one to create one on maemo.org it says to create a garage account and it should allow you to login in maemo.org after a few minutes
20:02.21joyriderwhich it obviously doesn't (given it's an automated system) might be normal if it's not automated
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20:07.48VDVsxjoyrider, do you have upper cases chars in your garage login ?
20:08.20*** join/#maemo benh (n=benh@147.17.168.202-static.velocitynet.com.au)
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20:29.37joyriderVDVsx no i used all lower case
20:30.56VDVsxjoyrider, and when you log in maemo.org, what message do you got ?
20:31.35joyriderUsername or password was invalid.
20:31.35joyriderNote to new users
20:31.35joyriderIf you just created your account in garage.maemo.org, try again in a few minutes.Thank you.
20:31.41*** join/#maemo L0cutus (n=L0cutus@94.160.39.56)
20:31.53joyrideri can login in to garage just fine with same username and password though
20:32.29VDVsxhumm,but garage works fine for you ?
20:32.32joyrideryes
20:33.10VDVsxyou have to talk with x-fade :P
20:33.17joyriderok
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20:48.41soussouhi
20:48.59soussouis there any one???
20:50.28VDVsxhello soussou
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21:22.15*** join/#maemo Neocognitron (i=93ae4d1b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-35062c7e99acb349)
21:23.45NeocognitronHello, I have an apparently odd issue when compiling the "gtk_helloworld" test program in Scratchbox/Maemo
21:24.33*** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.130)
21:24.33Neocognitronthis is my error message upon attempting to compile: http://pastebin.com/d23e39b69
21:24.46*** join/#maemo Terr[593] (n=poder@cm-93-156-18-127.telecable.es)
21:25.24Neocognitronand then scratchbox exits (logout)
21:25.34*** join/#maemo dlnh (n=you@194.197.235.58)
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21:29.02Terr[593]ola
21:29.06Terr[593]alguien habla espaƱol
21:30.08Neocognitronany bites?
21:30.10*** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@78.59.255.122)
21:30.28mgedminI want a remote control for a N810 :-)
21:30.40mgedmincan I tell the osso media player to start playing an internet radio station over dbus?
21:31.17qwerty12_N800set up anyremote & use your phone :P
21:33.26*** join/#maemo Neocognitron (i=93ae4d1b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0a146607b1277f56)
21:35.35timeless_mbpmgedmin: it should be possible
21:35.48mgedmindbus is not easily introspectable from the cmdline
21:36.03mgedminit'll be shorter for me to get my ass off the couch and walk to the other side of the room and push the button
21:36.18*** join/#maemo matahari (n=philipp@85-127-16-68.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at)
21:36.24mataharihi all
21:36.39qwerty12_N800mgedmin: dbus-send --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.osso_media_server /com/nokia/osso_media_server com.nokia.osso_media_server.video.play_media string:"http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/realaudio/media/r1live.ram"
21:37.16qwerty12_N800is glad to see he has shortened his time to make dbus-send cmds
21:37.46mgedminhmm
21:38.00mgedminwhen you add a multimedia bookmark, you get a dropdown choice: internet radio, or video stream
21:38.12mgedminyet here I see you call video.play_media with a url that looks like radio
21:38.18mgedminI suppose it doesn't matter to the backend?
21:38.30mataharii am having problems with dualbooting my n810. It worked for several months now, but today i switched the nokia off, and when switching it on again, it hangs at the Nokia screen with the progress bar. I am botting from external sd Card. I already took the card out of the nokia and run e2fsck on my laptop and indeed it found some broken inodes, but after fixing them it still won't work. Is there something i can do further?
21:38.54mgedminhow long does it hang?
21:39.05mgedminperhaps it's simply the jffs2 garbage collector being busy?
21:39.16NeocognitronAny ideas on what is wrong with my scratchbox/maemo installation?
21:39.37mataharimgedmin: it hangs about 1 min and then reboots automatically (i can see the bootmenu again and select a different entry)
21:39.48mgedminI've seen that with the jffs2 gc
21:39.57mgedminit blocks the cpu so hard the watchdog reboots it
21:39.58Neocognitronscratchbox crashes with a segfault upon attempting to compile a simple GTK program (gtk_helloworld).
21:40.04mataharimgedmin: that means?
21:40.04mgedminI think mine fixed itself after a couple of reboots
21:40.15timeless_mbpmatahari: pulll the battery
21:40.18qwerty12_N800mgedmin: I guess not, this is just one of the default feeds and it's just an real audio stream if memory serves me correctly
21:40.20timeless_mbpthen put it back
21:40.33mataharimgedmin: well, i am sure i rebooted it about 20 times now
21:40.49mgedmintry the battery thing then
21:40.50Terr[593]skyhusker
21:40.51mataharitimeless_mbp: also with pulling battery outside it won't change
21:41.13mataharior do you mean removing the battery when booting (before it hangs)?
21:41.28mgedminif that fails, maybe it's time to pull out the flasher and disable the watchdog?  the wiki had instructions somewhere...
21:41.29*** join/#maemo florian (n=fuchs@f054212224.adsl.alicedsl.de)
21:41.51Terr[593]someone knows skyhusker
21:42.04qwerty12_N800matahari: tried booting with the charger plugged in? odd but such a simple action has saved my ass so many times
21:42.21florianre
21:42.33florianTerr[593]: a little bit... why?
21:43.41mgedminmy accesspoint probably implements power saving incorrectly... ssh to a n810 is painful
21:44.32matahariqwerty12_N800: you are my king for today
21:44.38matahariqwerty12_N800: IT WORKED!!!!!!!
21:44.40matahari:-)
21:44.42mataharithanks a lot
21:44.50qwerty12_N800hehe, np :)
21:45.25RST38hhas finally got a new laptop
21:46.01mataharithanks a lot guys! now i can go to bed and sleep calm :-)
21:46.04RST38hUgly little thing, all fake aluminium with little shiny parts
21:46.06mataharibye!
21:49.02*** join/#maemo b-man (n=b-man@pool-71-124-111-94.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
21:49.57Neocognitronanyone here with experience building apps in scratchbox?
21:51.42Stskeepsooh. OSS Canola
21:51.42fiebradsucks.net
21:51.47Stskeepsthe end times must be near!
21:51.49fieefin <3
21:52.18Neocognitronor at least this: If I am having a problem with the dev-env, and I need to compile my own programs, but I am not modifying Maemo, --  should I subscribe to the developer's mailing list or the user's?
21:53.00qwerty12_N800-developers
21:53.32Neocognitroncool, thanks
21:58.27*** join/#maemo fireun (n=tako@72-160-123-63.dyn.centurytel.net)
22:02.53mgedminNeocognitron: I joined the channel too late to see your problem description
22:03.26mgedminremembers there are irc logs
22:03.28mgedmin:)
22:03.37mgedminwhoa, segfaul
22:04.35mgedminwhat os is this?  32 or 64 bit?  what kernel version?
22:04.57mgedmindid you apply both sysctl workarounds?  i.e. the vdso and the mmap_addr?
22:05.03mgedminIIRC the second one resulted in some apps segfaulting
22:05.18mgedminNeocognitron: try sudo sysctl -w vm.vdso_enabled=0 vm.mmap_min_addr=4096 before you sb-login
22:06.34mgedminwhat OSS canola?
22:07.05*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (n=timeless@a88-115-12-126.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
22:07.06mgedminwants to go to Guademy...
22:09.00GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, new laptop?
22:09.07timeless_mbpyep
22:09.16timeless_mbpmy dell will retire very soon
22:09.28timeless_mbpi'm setting up the last couple of things here
22:10.06*** join/#maemo chenca (n=chenca@189.2.128.130)
22:10.57GeneralAntillesHaha. Leopard, finally, then. ;)
22:11.31lbtooh, shiney: http://etrunko.blogspot.com/2009/03/canola-is-free.html
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22:17.00timeless_mbpyeah, corporate mac :)
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22:18.07Neocognitroni've got vm.vdso_enabled=0  and vm.mmap_min_addr=4096 set.  In fact I couldn't install without those.
22:18.14*** join/#maemo gnuton (n=gnuton@kde/developer/aloisio)
22:18.26gnutonHi
22:18.35GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, really? Interesting.
22:18.37GeneralAntillesHey, gnuton!
22:18.45lbthello gnuton :)
22:18.51gnutonhi guys! :
22:18.54gnutonlbt: are you david?
22:18.59gnutonDavid :D
22:19.02lbt:D
22:19.20gnutongreat.. I'm looking for the closeEvent problem
22:19.27lbtit's nasty
22:19.36lbtI posted an email earlier
22:19.40lbtdid you see?
22:19.44*** join/#maemo crashanddie (n=crashand@SecuraBit/listener/crashanddie)
22:19.58gnutonlbt: yes I did
22:20.01Neocognitronas to the previous questions, 32 bit Ubuntu
22:20.20mgedminhmm
22:20.27*** join/#maemo timeless_mbp (n=timeless@a88-115-12-126.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
22:20.28lbtOK
22:20.42mgedminhas 32-bit ubuntu
22:20.43gnutonlbt: have you received replies?
22:20.48lbtno :(
22:21.05lbtbut it's monday :)
22:21.05crashanddie~ping
22:21.06infobot~pong
22:21.12gnutonlbt: I'm not sure.. but most probably there is something wrong in Qt or in the WM
22:21.24Neocognitronkernel 2.6.27-11-generic
22:21.25lbtI think WM
22:21.47lbtand I suspect it's not broken
22:21.53lbtjust badly documented
22:21.59lbtI went into libosso
22:22.06gnutonlbt: Qt sets or at least it tries to set the WM_DELETE_WINDOW protocol
22:22.11lbtand found osso-rpc.c
22:22.25gnutonAre you sure that it's managed by libosso?
22:22.44lbtwell, I think the osso-wm is not an Xlib WM :)
22:23.00gnutonok :D
22:23.18lbtand osso-initialize() tells the WM to use DBus instead of WM_*
22:23.45lbtso it's freedesktop.org stuff
22:23.58lbtbut I think there is a magic handshake
22:24.03lbtand we don't know it
22:24.34lbtI found com.nokia.hildon.hdwm.startupnotification
22:25.29lbtso my hunch (that's all it is) is that we are missing something like that
22:25.43lbti recall other non-gtk apps having similar problems
22:26.06lbtand things like X-Osso-service in .desktop files
22:26.20gnutonmmm....
22:26.24lbtOnce I put that in, my app wouldn't even start!
22:26.33lbtuntil I added in the dbus-1 file...
22:26.47lbtso all just feelings and stuff at the moment
22:27.05qwerty12_N800Have you looked through hildon-desktop, when I was looking though it (for something else so I wasn't paying ATD to osso stuff), I'm pretty sure H-D is programed to do other stuff when finding x-osso-service in a desktop file
22:27.53lbtqwerty12_N800: it's a maze of twisty passages when you only have a laser beam for a torch!!!
22:27.59lbtI am looking there
22:28.04qwerty12_N800:)
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22:29.33lbtideally I'd like Kimmo (?) to comment
22:29.42lcukWARNING: DO NOT LOOK INTO THE LASER WITH YOUR REMAINING EYE!
22:29.47lbthe wrote most of it AFAICT
22:30.07NeocognitronI've never even heard of a segfault while compiling.
22:30.07*** join/#maemo skibur (i=1000@12.197.204.154)
22:30.07lbtlcuk: oh, I'm blind too - did I not mention that?
22:30.24NeocognitronThat is normally reserved for fun with runtime.
22:30.25gnutonlbt: yes I think that Kimmo knows what we need... :D
22:30.54lbtso I think we've done the next best thing to solving the problem
22:31.00lbtfind someone to blame :)
22:32.23gnutonahah :D exactly! :D
22:32.28crashanddieAfter One Time Passwords, One Time Eye Authentication. Scanning burns out your first eye, authentication burns out the second one. Use your authentication wisely
22:33.52lbtgnuton: http://pastebin.com/d58d633c3
22:34.01gnutonlbt: Btw Qt sends the closeEvent only when qapplication_x11 receives a WM_DELETE_WINDOW atom...
22:34.12crashanddieAAAAAARRGGGH
22:34.13crashanddieQT
22:34.15lbtyes, I mentioned this in #qt
22:34.15crashanddieI die
22:34.39lbtand eventually we should go to QSession
22:34.48gnutoncrashanddie: Do you prefer cocoa? :P
22:34.48lbtand add a HILDON_WS in there
22:35.10lbtto add ossoConnection() or similar (as per that pastebin)
22:35.16crashanddiegnuton, never used cocoa to be honest, so can't judge
22:35.20*** join/#maemo alehorst (n=alehorst@201.47.14.175.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br)
22:35.32crashanddiegnuton, I've been trained to work with Qt, it's just I don't like it
22:35.33*** part/#maemo dougt__ (n=dougt@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)
22:35.53lbtcrashanddie probably doesn't like chips or bacon either
22:36.04crashanddieI love chips and bacon :)
22:36.07lbtsad, sad person
22:36.15lbtyou can't
22:36.18lcuklikes some bits of qt and wonders if a new branch of widgets would work :)
22:36.20crashanddiechips dressed with vinegar, salt and pepper
22:36.23lbtthey are reserved for Qt people
22:36.57crashanddielbt, says who?
22:36.58lbtlcuk now has to become a Qt god to make up for all the bacon he's eaten
22:37.17lbtcrashanddie: The Spaghetti Lord
22:37.31lbtanyhooo
22:37.31lcuki have a whole project of q*, i did them years ago, i dont like its position personally
22:37.39lcuki seem to like v* :)
22:37.41crashanddielbt, keep asserting blasphemy like that and I'll be forced to trace you and kick you in the bollocks until they ressemble bacon
22:38.16crashanddiehmm... Human bacon
22:38.19crashanddieponders...
22:38.20lbtdon't tell me about blasphemy! I'll set his noodleness on you
22:38.35lcukstop saying bacon! my irc looks like a blood bath
22:38.35crashanddieYou can't touch me with noodles
22:38.45crashanddieI'm protected by the power of after eight!
22:38.46lbtnoodles have a long reach
22:39.19crashanddieSubtle mint with chocolate extracts, and if you really want to push me, I'll have to invoke baileys!
22:39.32lbtnow go read some gtk stuff until you feel better - I suggest libosso :)
22:39.40lbtI found a bottle of baileys last night
22:39.49lcukdid you give it back to her?
22:39.50lbtit's a sign
22:40.22crashanddiebut to be honest, a chipmunk extinguisher doesn't qualify for olympic games in alternate universes nor does it in harry potter disguises
22:40.40lbtare you trying to scare gnuton off again?
22:41.18crashanddieand, as we all know, the most direct line between two entities is immensely disproportionate to the penguins requiring motherly care on a california highway patrol
22:41.22*** join/#maemo b-man16 (i=60e88828@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ee3fe1111b22137)
22:41.24gnuton:D
22:41.30lcukcertainly not, gnuton hows qt on the whole doing
22:42.01gnutonhey lcuk! :D
22:42.07crashanddieanyway, I need to send teal'c through the chapa'hai
22:42.12*** join/#maemo chmac (n=chmac@75-172-114-35.tukw.qwest.net)
22:42.49lcuki read that as teal.c and wondered what functions it had
22:43.49crashanddieI wonder why people would call their kids "Timothy"
22:43.58crashanddieit's like labeling the kid with weakness right from the start
22:44.30timeless_mbpgrabs mer0.9 for virtualbox
22:44.42b-manthere are TWO b-mans!!!
22:45.01lcuknot agaiN!
22:45.05lcuk-cap
22:45.24qwerty12_N800Kill the fake! Shank or shoot him!
22:45.28b-manyup - me and b-man16
22:45.30b-manlol
22:46.31b-man|realeats dinner
22:46.48xnt:P
22:46.54xntshoots b-man16
22:47.10b-man16dies
22:47.28b-man16comes back from the dead
22:47.31qwerty12_N800shoots xnt/b-man16 ;)
22:47.31xntnoooo
22:48.04xntuses Stskeeps as a shield
22:48.29b-man16cant be killed
22:48.39qwerty12_N800Bah. Time for the RPG.
22:48.56b-man16:P
22:49.44b-man16kills xnt/half-dead Stskeeps
22:49.49xntdies
22:51.11xntturned into a zombie
22:51.36xntnoooooo
22:51.38xnt:P
22:51.51xntnow there a copy of me :P
22:52.21xntslits xnt14's throat
22:52.29xnt14dies again
22:52.45*** part/#maemo xnt14 (i=60e88828@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ee3fe1111b22137)
22:52.53xntyay
22:52.58*** join/#maemo tulkastaldo (n=tulkas@24-236-213-147.dhcp.trcy.mi.charter.com)
22:54.55*** join/#maemo Firefox16 (i=60e88828@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ee3fe1111b22137)
22:55.01xntnooooooooooo :P
22:55.41xntsneaks towards firefox16
22:55.49*** part/#maemo Firefox16 (i=60e88828@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ee3fe1111b22137)
22:56.01lcukBAD TOUCH! BAD TOUCH!
22:56.11xnt:P
22:56.24*** join/#maemo Qwerty12 (i=60e88828@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ee3fe1111b22137)
22:56.31xntwtf?
22:57.22qwerty12_N800proceeds in killin' this fake imitation
22:57.33Qwerty12steals Qwerty12_N800's N800
22:57.47xntsteals it from Qwerty12
22:57.47lcukwont you disappear up your own ass?
22:57.57xnt:P
22:58.10qwerty12_N800sets mode +merc xnt qwerty12_N800
22:58.27*** part/#maemo Qwerty12 (i=60e88828@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ee3fe1111b22137)
22:59.00xnt:P
23:00.01*** join/#maemo jnettlet (n=jnettlet@c-76-24-25-45.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)
23:01.16*** join/#maemo konttori_ (n=konttori@a88-113-140-230.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
23:02.32xntis bored
23:02.36xntplays nexuiz
23:03.01b-man|realhehe
23:04.24*** join/#maemo hellwolf-n810 (n=hellwolf@213.22.175.166)
23:05.04gnutonnight GuyS!
23:05.16xnt|nexuizgnuton: bye
23:05.18lcukgnite gnuton \o happy hacking
23:05.29gnutongNite lcuk, xnt|nexuiz! :D
23:06.36*** join/#maemo kaltsi (i=kaltsi@a88-114-88-228.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
23:09.20lbtlcuk: did you see : http://etrunko.blogspot.com/2009/03/canola-is-free.html
23:09.50lcukyes i did!
23:11.29*** join/#maemo zer0mdq (n=zer0@190.244.13.249)
23:13.21*** join/#maemo Mousey (n=welcomem@dsl231-036-060.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
23:15.45*** part/#maemo b-man (n=b-man@pool-71-124-111-94.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
23:16.18*** join/#maemo b-man (n=b-man@pool-71-124-111-94.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
23:16.49*** join/#maemo gmargo (n=gmargo@adsl-70-132-17-137.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net)
23:19.27*** join/#maemo xnt` (i=477c6f5e@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-4ce1f063e94db112)
23:20.16*** join/#maemo drjnut (n=drjnut@caladan.darksnow.org)
23:20.42timeless_mbpStskeeps: wow, virtualbox just worked w/ mer :)
23:20.44*** join/#maemo xnt` (i=477c6f5e@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-eb06c5dcd585faf9)
23:21.41xnt`hehe
23:22.03b-man:)
23:23.58*** join/#maemo secureendpoints (n=chatzill@cpe-24-193-47-88.nyc.res.rr.com)
23:29.53*** join/#maemo VDVsx (n=valerio@bl5-198-42.dsl.telepac.pt)
23:32.15timeless_mbptries to remember how to set the locale for mer
23:33.15b-mandpkg-reconfigure locales?
23:34.43timeless_mbpi don't think so
23:35.09b-manhmm
23:36.03b-man:P
23:42.33*** join/#maemo ccooke (n=ccooke@cpc3-walt12-2-0-cust129.13-2.cable.virginmedia.com)
23:42.54*** join/#maemo AD-N770 (n=jep@24.Red-80-26-22.staticIP.rima-tde.net)
23:47.16b-manstarts writting responses to his ubuntu-n8x0 thread
23:47.54timeless_mbpso, i set LC_ALL to en_US
23:48.03timeless_mbpand now i have no strings :(
23:49.57timeless_mbpah, setting LANG works a lot better :)
23:50.41timeless_mbpactually, no
23:50.44timeless_mbp:(
23:52.39*** join/#maemo xnt (n=xnt@pool-96-232-136-40.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)

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