| 00:03.06 | l7 | StsN800: have you tried personal menu? |
| 00:03.13 | l7 | it gets even better |
| 00:30.29 | *** join/#maemo texel (n=june@74.125.59.1) |
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| 00:31.20 | ds3 | does there exists an alternate media player that supports OGG's and do not try to create its own UI? |
| 00:31.21 | texel | Hm. Random question: what is /etc/resolv.conf supposed to be linked to on Diablo tablets? |
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| 00:32.42 | texel | Oh. Wait. |
| 00:32.53 | texel | So /etc/resolv.conf has to have a nameserver line containing 127.0.0.1? |
| 00:33.19 | ds3 | it is probally proxying DNS since glibc likes to cache the contents of /etc/resolv.conf |
| 00:34.01 | texel | Nope. |
| 00:34.03 | texel | it's dnsmasq. |
| 00:34.08 | texel | Broken. |
| 00:34.10 | texel | Gr. |
| 00:34.27 | texel | Fixed it by setting the nameserver to 127.0.0.1 and now DNS resolution works fine. |
| 00:34.52 | texel | And no, glibc does /not/ cache the contents of /etc/resolv.conf -- that's what nscd does. =op |
| 00:35.33 | ds3 | uh... maybe caching isn't the right word but getting a running program to reread /etc/resolv.conf is a bit difficult |
| 00:36.04 | texel | That's because many programs cache the nameserver themselves. |
| 00:36.10 | texel | Firefox is notorious for that. |
| 00:36.18 | texel | There may be other gnome apps that do the same. |
| 00:36.27 | texel | But glibc by default does not. |
| 00:36.33 | ds3 | glibc does |
| 00:37.02 | ds3 | anyways |
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| 00:53.16 | texel | ds3: how? |
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| 00:55.34 | texel | Ahh. |
| 00:55.54 | texel | Debian/Ubuntu patched glibc to update the cache upon a stat change. |
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| 01:04.10 | ds3 | texel: it has been a problem I had to deal with before |
| 01:05.27 | texel | Mm. Apparently programs are supposed to call res_init() to recache the contents. |
| 01:05.38 | texel | But most don't know that, or it has other issues. |
| 01:06.06 | texel | The reason why I was confused is because of the change made in Ubuntu/Debian which make it /act/ like it's never cached. |
| 01:06.57 | ds3 | res_init is part of libresolv on some systems, IIRC |
| 01:07.02 | texel | nods |
| 01:07.18 | ds3 | DNS is a mess, easiest to route it through a daemon |
| 01:07.40 | ds3 | the other complication is making dns nonblocking @$%$@#$@#% |
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| 01:50.10 | timeless | is there a doc other than |
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| 01:53.55 | GeneralAntilles | waits with baited breath. |
| 02:00.55 | GeneralAntilles | Anybody want to put together a script to export the translations on the wiki to some .pos? :P |
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| 03:01.29 | johnx | mornin' |
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| 03:06.53 | johnx | Stskeeps, if you're still awake, did you test that it can be loaded by maemo-launcher? |
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| 04:31.01 | GeneralAntilles | wonders what to make of http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=246449&postcount=38 |
| 04:31.12 | glass_ | make pie |
| 04:31.17 | GeneralAntilles | Mmm |
| 04:31.25 | GeneralAntilles | could really go for some cherry. |
| 04:44.59 | johnx | mmm...pumpkin pie |
| 04:45.20 | johnx | probably a song reference |
| 04:46.49 | GeneralAntilles | Urg, now I really want to drive out to the Village Inn and buy a pie. . . . |
| 04:47.34 | glass_ | GeneralAntilles: i don't think maemo forums are a good place to look for cherry.. |
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| 04:54.41 | GeneralAntilles | Get yer mind out of the gutter. :P |
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| 05:01.48 | GeneralAntilles | Alright, the translations are finally done. |
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| 05:03.58 | glass_ | GeneralAntilles: i'm having imsomnia, bad jokes are the only thing i'm good for |
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| 05:39.00 | Stskeeps | johnx: admittedly no but it ought to judging on m-l docs |
| 05:41.28 | GeneralAntilles | shivers. |
| 05:43.22 | Myrtti | decides not to wail loudly and goes to prepare some coffee and ice cream instead |
| 05:45.38 | StsN800 | tries to get his eyes focusing |
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| 05:59.28 | kulve | ds3: do you mean command line ogg capable player? Or a media engine daemon? |
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| 06:00.35 | Jaredu | does irssi work on the n810? |
| 06:03.52 | `0660 | of course |
| 06:04.53 | `0660 | i just haven't found a terminal that would support opening hyperlinks |
| 06:05.07 | Jaredu | mmk |
| 06:05.21 | `0660 | hmm, with n810 they might actually work because it has ctrl key |
| 06:05.39 | Jaredu | yep |
| 06:05.51 | ds3 | kulve: a player... mogg and media player has problems so i am looking for an alternative |
| 06:05.55 | Jaredu | touch highlight ftw :P |
| 06:06.00 | GeneralAntilles | `0660, have you tried tap'n'hold? . . . |
| 06:06.15 | Myrtti | support opening hyperlinks... |
| 06:06.19 | Myrtti | haven't found... |
| 06:06.29 | Myrtti | oh dear god, I must be sleeping |
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| 06:07.24 | `0660 | tap'n'hold used to work with advanced osso-xterm |
| 06:07.34 | `0660 | but it's not maintained anymore |
| 06:08.03 | `Mace | think i'm going to get an e90 soon |
| 06:08.22 | `Mace | i'll have to go see one and play with it but it looks pretty nice |
| 06:10.31 | kulve | ds3: what do you mean by "do not try to create its own UI"? |
| 06:12.52 | ds3 | kulve: things like canola, ukmp, etc they do not behave anything like the normal apps... i.e. they insist on full screen, the +/- keys don't work, scrolling is different, etc |
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| 06:13.55 | kulve | kilikali is a bit more normal, but it's quite unpolished.. |
| 06:14.25 | ds3 | yeah, I tried it... the buttons are too small |
| 06:14.48 | ds3 | if media player didn't drop all the OGG's from the playlist when it gets suspended, it would have been fine |
| 06:15.55 | kulve | ds3: when did you try it? The UI got rewritten awhile ago and I put it to extras-devel this week.. |
| 06:16.19 | ds3 | kulve: I just installed it sunday |
| 06:16.53 | kulve | ok |
| 06:18.59 | ds3 | I spent sunday evening trying out different players and they are either too buggy or too wild in how they deviated from the stock UI |
| 06:21.03 | ds3 | most irritating seems to be Kagu not liking nonfull screen modes |
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| 06:34.00 | *** join/#maemo shizhan (n=chatzill@221.223.225.191) |
| 06:35.47 | shizhan | hello all, who knows how to make the vlc media player for os2008? |
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| 06:52.29 | doc|home | shizhan: something I can help you with? |
| 06:53.21 | shizhan | oh ,I'm not familiar with this tool,so sorry |
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| 06:57.15 | shizhan | baaba: ping |
| 06:58.58 | shizhan | doc|home:sorry to disturb you |
| 06:59.54 | shizhan | doc|home: Do you know how to cross-compile vlc media player for os 2008? |
| 07:02.09 | shizhan | Who knows how to cross-compile vlc media player for os 2008? many thanks |
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| 07:17.19 | `Mace | hi |
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| 07:21.09 | doc|home | shizhan: no |
| 07:21.51 | shizhan | doc|home: thanks all the same |
| 07:22.05 | shizhan | `Mace: hi |
| 07:23.48 | shizhan | `Mace: just now , I enter the virtual machine ,so don't see your message, you know it ? |
| 07:23.56 | `Mace | huh? |
| 07:24.32 | shizhan | `Mace: how to cross-compile vlc media player for os 2008 ? |
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| 07:24.47 | `Mace | er |
| 07:24.58 | `Mace | don't know. never did it |
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| 07:25.31 | `Mace | anybody here use an e90 w/ att? |
| 07:28.34 | qwerty12 | Stskeeps, qole got background changing working with the command line in a fashion: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=246465&postcount=844 :D |
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| 07:46.33 | Stskeeps | qwerty12: yeah, i suspected it was just like that |
| 07:46.51 | Stskeeps | but that probably isn't memory effective |
| 07:47.11 | qwerty12 | meh, xsetmgr is killed afterwards |
| 07:47.39 | qwerty12 | Though chrooting may add time which is why I compiled hsetroot anyway |
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| 07:56.52 | Stskeeps | tries to wake up |
| 07:57.32 | qwerty12 | sets up a pizza shop outside Stskeeps's residence |
| 07:57.38 | qwerty12 | Now will you get up? |
| 07:58.35 | Stskeeps | got a pizza in the fridge |
| 07:58.36 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 07:58.45 | qwerty12 | damn :D |
| 07:59.56 | Macer | hey |
| 08:00.02 | Macer | anybody here know much about wimax? |
| 08:00.05 | Stskeeps | morn macer |
| 08:00.08 | Macer | has no clue how it works |
| 08:00.09 | Macer | heh |
| 08:00.30 | Macer | i wanted to cancel att and see if i could use skype with wimax on an n810 |
| 08:00.39 | Macer | but i don't know how i'd go about doing that |
| 08:01.26 | Macer | hm.. wonder if it's possible. i don't see why not but i need more information on wimax in chicago |
| 08:02.30 | Macer | The WiMax Edition is optimized to support Sprint's "Xohm" WiMAX service, which is launching in Chicago, Baltimore, and Washington DC this Spring, with more cities to follow later. |
| 08:02.39 | Macer | well. guess i'll have to look at sprint then :) |
| 08:05.28 | Myrtti | wimax, is it something edible... oh no, wait, more coffee. |
| 08:05.37 | Macer | heh |
| 08:05.41 | Macer | well... i guess sprint offers it |
| 08:05.46 | Macer | i wanted to get a wimax n810 |
| 08:05.54 | Macer | use skype and cancel any voice plan :) |
| 08:06.45 | johnx | that sounds like a recipe for annoyance :) |
| 08:07.30 | Macer | heh |
| 08:07.45 | Macer | not if wimax doesn't suck. and sprint is said to have great wimax coverage in Chicago |
| 08:09.58 | johnx | handoffs aren't quite the same as GSM, and I'm not sure about latency |
| 08:10.14 | Macer | it's ok. i don't mind the handoffs too much |
| 08:10.32 | johnx | you don't mind randomly dropped calls? |
| 08:10.37 | Macer | i'm usually stationary and i want it more for the data than the voice calls |
| 08:10.41 | Macer | no |
| 08:10.42 | Macer | ;) |
| 08:10.49 | Macer | i don't talk on the phone more than 5 mins anyways |
| 08:10.57 | Macer | unless it's my gf.. and then i can at least blame it on a drop |
| 08:10.57 | Macer | haha |
| 08:11.07 | Macer | "thank god!" |
| 08:11.16 | Macer | i hate talking on the phone |
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| 08:15.57 | Macer | well.. i will call sprint tomorrow and let you know how that works out |
| 08:15.57 | Macer | ;) |
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| 08:24.04 | StsN801 | johnx, what was the initial issue that lead to the executable vs so? |
| 08:24.58 | johnx | it wouldn't load with maemo-invoker, so I guessed (incorrectly it seems) that the fact that it was an executable was the problem |
| 08:25.06 | johnx | sorry to send you on a wild goose chase :( |
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| 08:26.07 | StsN801 | hehe, it's fine, i discovered how launcher works |
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| 08:27.01 | StsN801 | is the maemo launcher daemon running? else use the .launch (if executable) |
| 08:28.06 | johnx | yeah, it was, let me try this again and get the error message |
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| 08:38.38 | StsN801 | hah. maemo launcher: child_died_painfully() |
| 08:40.04 | johnx | ow :O |
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| 08:42.16 | StsN801 | or kindergarten_release_child |
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| 09:01.59 | johnx | Here's what I'm seeing: http://pastebin.com/m5b5bd7f |
| 09:02.35 | johnx | that's what lead me to look towards whether hildon-desktop.launch was a shared object or not ... |
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| 09:03.51 | johnx | that's after maemo-invoker /usr/bin/hildon-desktop.launch is run in another terminal |
| 09:05.09 | Stskeeps | lookìn' |
| 09:06.15 | Stskeeps | that's kinda weird, yeah |
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| 09:10.00 | johnx | if I link with -pie instead of -shared it starts for a sec and segfaults .. |
| 09:10.45 | Stskeeps | try get lp:~carsten-munk/m-r/hildon-desktop |
| 09:10.49 | Stskeeps | it has it making it as an .so |
| 09:11.52 | johnx | trying... |
| 09:11.52 | Stskeeps | hm, there's difference in pie and pic |
| 09:13.06 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
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| 09:15.56 | johnx | maemo-launcher told me to :P |
| 09:17.36 | Stskeeps | yeah, i was surprised too |
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| 09:21.59 | johnx | seg fault |
| 09:22.02 | Stskeeps | sucks.. |
| 09:22.14 | Stskeeps | i'll look into it, but atleast we have it more traced down now |
| 09:22.24 | Stskeeps | okay.. sometimes it's really astonishing how many professors, postdocs, and stuff that come to my office uninvited |
| 09:22.27 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 09:23.15 | Stskeeps | for weird reasons ranging from wanting to find a firewire cable to asking about names of projects that they have no idea about.. |
| 09:23.55 | Stskeeps | which is, also, the reason why i keep my door locked. |
| 09:23.55 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 09:24.34 | johnx | ahaha |
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| 09:31.41 | RST38h | sts,john: moo |
| 09:31.46 | Stskeeps | moo, RST38h |
| 09:31.48 | johnx | yo RST38h |
| 09:34.01 | RST38h | "I don't see anything in Android which would make it better than Linux maemo," Lappalainen said. |
| 09:36.39 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 09:37.54 | johnx | A Nokia spokesperson doesn't see how their competitor's product is better? What a surprise... |
| 09:39.48 | robtaylor | johnx: andriod is pretty horrible compared to maemo, imho |
| 09:40.25 | johnx | they're pretty different systems |
| 09:40.40 | robtaylor | at least maemo uses standard gnome/freedestop parts. android is no different to any of the other phones that are built on a heavily hacked-up linux kernel with a custom userspace |
| 09:41.12 | johnx | well, except that the custom userspace is open |
| 09:41.19 | robtaylor | just "open source", and i use the quotes justifiably... |
| 09:41.46 | robtaylor | in the loosest possible sense, try submitting a patch and see what kind of speedy reponce you get.. |
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| 09:41.50 | johnx | heh, it is funny they end up locking down the g1, but that doesn't force other people to do the same |
| 09:42.41 | johnx | reponse at bugs.maemo.org hasn't always been terribly stellar either |
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| 09:44.31 | robtaylor | johnx: that's true, that's true |
| 09:45.18 | robtaylor | johnx: but at least there's an upstream to push bugs to.. in android they're packagers and upstream. |
| 09:46.42 | johnx | fair enough, I haven't tried to submit patches to either, but it also strikes me that more of android is actually open sourced compared to OS2008 |
| 09:46.57 | johnx | I am looking forward to the Fremantle alpha SDK though |
| 09:47.27 | RST38h | johnx: Android *is* pretty raw and limited |
| 09:48.00 | johnx | yeah, it's a mobile phone OS |
| 09:48.03 | RST38h | And the funny part is that if Nokia really wants it, it can run Android inside its existing platform :) |
| 09:48.29 | RST38h | johnx: Android is not an OS, it is a framework + apps |
| 09:48.32 | johnx | you mean maemo or symbian? |
| 09:48.36 | RST38h | Yes |
| 09:48.46 | RST38h | Maemo - for sure. Symbian - maybe, given compatibility layer |
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| 09:51.13 | johnx | eh, android is really the whole thing though. It's linux+davlik |
| 09:51.25 | johnx | I guess it depends on how you define what an OS is |
| 09:51.55 | RST38h | johnx: Dalvik is a freaking JVM. It shouldn't care what OS it is running on |
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| 09:52.12 | RST38h | If it does, this should and will be fixed (if the source is open) |
| 09:52.38 | johnx | ok, I didn't said it did care |
| 09:53.00 | RST38h | So, the "linux" component can most likely be replaced with relative ease |
| 09:53.15 | johnx | ok |
| 09:53.19 | johnx | same as maemo |
| 09:53.22 | johnx | what's your point? |
| 09:53.27 | RST38h | Not very important, except for inducing wows from penguin worshippers |
| 09:53.56 | RST38h | johnx: Current Maemo is much more tied to Linux than Android. Have you noticed that we STILL do not have a Windows based SDK? ;) |
| 09:54.24 | johnx | well, it's certainly tied to a Unix-based OS |
| 09:54.25 | RST38h | And that the Linux based SDK basically creates a self contained linux environment? ;) |
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| 09:55.04 | RST38h | Exactly - because stuff like DBus, GConf, ESD, ALSA, X11 is part of the Maemo platform |
| 09:55.06 | johnx | you could develop just fine in cygwin I'm sure, but you'd have to compile in an emulator |
| 09:55.22 | RST38h | compiles with i386-based cross compiler |
| 09:55.39 | RST38h | But the main shit starts happening if you try using autoconf on which Maemo also relies now |
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| 09:55.48 | johnx | heh, autoconf |
| 09:55.50 | RST38h | So, no, Maemo is not Android |
| 09:55.59 | johnx | yeah, no kidding |
| 09:56.04 | RST38h | Android's java frameworks are not tied to anything specific. |
| 09:56.08 | johnx | but x11, dbus and gconf aren't linux |
| 09:56.27 | RST38h | johnx: They are Unix, which I do not differentiate from Linux, really |
| 09:56.57 | johnx | which is kind of funny, because there's only one currently supported OS on the desktop that *isn't* unix... |
| 09:56.57 | RST38h | But try running this stuff on top of Windows or Symbian and while I watch you tearing your last hair out =) |
| 09:57.37 | RST38h | No, there are three! WinXP, Vista, and Windows Server! =) |
| 09:57.47 | johnx | :P |
| 09:58.12 | johnx | is there a posix layer for symbian? :D |
| 09:58.26 | robtaylor | RST38h: actually, their IPC depends on kernel support |
| 09:58.42 | robtaylor | (and they have an ugly device driver to support it) |
| 09:58.47 | RST38h | robtaylor: But can't it be faked? |
| 09:58.58 | RST38h | johnx: Yes. Two! |
| 09:59.23 | RST38h | johnx: There is early posix support (including stdio!) they added when porting JVM |
| 09:59.43 | robtaylor | RST38h: hmm, possibly, depends on the underlying arch |
| 09:59.45 | RST38h | johnx: And then there is more modern posix that lets you compile C software for Symbian |
| 10:00.05 | robtaylor | RST38h: its for cross-process reference counting. very hard to get right in user space, hence the kernel hack |
| 10:00.10 | RST38h | robtaylor: I mean, inter process communication isn't really rocket science... |
| 10:00.47 | robtaylor | RST38h: reliable cross-process reference counting is a bit |
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| 10:01.12 | robtaylor | its one of the main reasons all the big iron guys moved away from CORBA to message buses |
| 10:01.36 | RST38h | robtaylor: I am sure it is resolvable though :) |
| 10:01.36 | robtaylor | (and one of the reasons we moved away from CORBA to message buses ;)) |
| 10:02.01 | RST38h | ~curse JAVA and CORBA |
| 10:02.02 | infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, JAVA and CORBA ! |
| 10:02.07 | RST38h | hehe |
| 10:02.09 | johnx | ironic |
| 10:02.10 | robtaylor | RST38h: maybe, maybe. Android is really broken in this regard, imho |
| 10:02.16 | robtaylor | rofl |
| 10:02.48 | RST38h | oh, there is a bonus meaning to that curse |
| 10:08.24 | RST38h | ...former CEO of Open Source Development Labs, has written an op-ed on BusinessWeek claiming that the traditional open source business model, which relies solely on support and service revenue streams, is failing to meet the expectations of investors. |
| 10:09.10 | RST38h | wonders what took 'em so long? Didn't want to say that in the open while investors were giving them money? =) |
| 10:10.22 | johnx | hope no one tells RedHat |
| 10:10.38 | robtaylor | RST38h: works ok for quite a few companies |
| 10:13.47 | RST38h | johnx: Redhat has a different model |
| 10:14.00 | RST38h | and we do not really know how well it works for them |
| 10:14.10 | johnx | they're publicly traded |
| 10:14.13 | johnx | we know how it works |
| 10:14.21 | johnx | look at their revenue :P |
| 10:14.37 | RST38h | true :) |
| 10:14.53 | johnx | and yes, they have pretty much the same model: you pay for support. don't want support? Use fedora or centOS |
| 10:15.03 | RST38h | But Redhat basically takes somebody else's OSS software, package it, and ship it |
| 10:15.17 | RST38h | Their development costs must be pretty low |
| 10:15.18 | johnx | they pay a lot of devs |
| 10:15.28 | johnx | kernel devs, gnome devs, etc, etc |
| 10:15.29 | RST38h | They do, but they are not developing the whole thing |
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| 10:15.55 | RST38h | The original "OSS business model" was "Develop your software, release it under GPL and make money on support" |
| 10:16.11 | RST38h | And THAT model does not work. |
| 10:17.07 | johnx | you mean oracle's model? |
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| 10:18.05 | RST38h | Oracle's DBMS is closed source and you pay per-CPU |
| 10:18.37 | johnx | er, wait, sorry, I was thinking of postgres I think |
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| 10:23.00 | RST38h | Hehe, N97 is causing some major soul-searching on iTT :) |
| 10:23.32 | RST38h | "It is a new tablet! But it is a phone! It runs S60! I will NEVER buy it! But it is a tablet!" |
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| 10:24.42 | johnx | eh. I think people who like developing for the tablets will stick with it |
| 10:25.09 | johnx | if some of the users are happy on a $700 phone than good for them |
| 10:26.42 | baaba | how exactly does the usb support work on the n810? |
| 10:26.59 | baaba | it seems that during normal operation i'm unable to reach anything above usb1 speeds |
| 10:27.14 | *** join/#maemo eichi_ (n=eichi@vpn0549.extern.uni-tuebingen.de) |
| 10:27.42 | baaba | but when flashing the device it's sending data at 7.5 megabytes per second |
| 10:28.12 | johnx | is this with the tablet as host or the tablet as a device attached to a computer? |
| 10:28.22 | johnx | anyways, back in a bit |
| 10:28.29 | baaba | device when flashing, host otherwise |
| 10:28.39 | baaba | is that what causes it? |
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| 10:41.55 | kleist | hello maemoistas! to get access to my linux filesystem, the easiest way is to use samba? |
| 10:44.56 | RST38h | access from where? |
| 10:45.49 | kleist | from my N810 |
| 10:46.38 | kleist | it would see SMB "mounted" filesystems? like windows does? |
| 10:47.24 | RST38h | yes but only if your smb share is public |
| 10:47.52 | kleist | ok, thx |
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| 11:02.32 | lardman | morning |
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| 11:57.28 | johnx | augh! now hildon-desktop non-maemo-launcher version is segfaulting on startup O_o |
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| 11:58.33 | Stskeeps | file hildon-desktop.launch? |
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| 12:03.45 | johnx | nope, I rebuilt it with nolauncher |
| 12:03.54 | johnx | (*&$% |
| 12:04.21 | Stskeeps | well then we have a reason why it -also- fails in non-maemo-launcher :P |
| 12:04.32 | Stskeeps | you use my branch or something else? |
| 12:04.55 | Stskeeps | cos that one is hardwired to launcher |
| 12:05.25 | johnx | this is the one I was working on, applying the debian packaging to your branch, removing dependencies on the osso-af-startup, etc |
| 12:05.53 | johnx | however, hildon-desktop will also segfault if the right pngs aren't in the right place |
| 12:06.54 | Stskeeps | k |
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| 12:17.19 | Stskeeps | johnx: avoid stripping package maybe |
| 12:17.25 | Stskeeps | verify it's not a .so, btw :P |
| 12:17.35 | Stskeeps | it will segfault else |
| 12:17.46 | johnx | it's an executable |
| 12:17.52 | johnx | it runs for a while, tries to draw a panel |
| 12:18.41 | johnx | it's complaining about missing icons again...it's done something similar before and it turned out to be just icons, and I need to sort those out anyways (hopefully remembering where everything is supposed to go this time) |
| 12:18.53 | Stskeeps | k |
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| 12:25.01 | johnx | wonder if it has to do with running in a chroot ... |
| 12:27.27 | *** part/#maemo thopiekar (n=Thomas_P@p57A153E0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:28.33 | Stskeeps | dunno |
| 12:28.42 | Stskeeps | missing dbus? |
| 12:28.57 | johnx | or not connecting to it correctly... |
| 12:29.02 | *** join/#maemo datachaos (n=datachao@c9155740.virtua.com.br) |
| 12:29.07 | Stskeeps | is writing a usb imager for mer-i386 |
| 12:29.21 | Stskeeps | plug in, boot up, installs mer image on hd/ide compact flash/etc |
| 12:29.21 | johnx | why don't you just use ubuntu's? |
| 12:29.21 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 12:29.30 | Stskeeps | hm? |
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| 12:30.16 | johnx | ah, I guess that's for installing the whole system on a usb-stick, not making a usb installer |
| 12:30.29 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 12:31.08 | Stskeeps | sfdisk is actually more flexible than i realized |
| 12:31.09 | *** join/#maemo danilocesar (n=danilo@200.184.118.130) |
| 12:31.24 | johnx | oh, it's flexible alright |
| 12:31.25 | Stskeeps | ,,L makes a linux partition fitting the entire thing |
| 12:31.29 | johnx | it's just arcane |
| 12:31.31 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 12:32.04 | johnx | I kind of resent partitioning being made that much of a PITA |
| 12:32.50 | johnx | well, granted that ,,L isn't a pain once you know it... |
| 12:33.04 | johnx | I guess it's just the vi of partitioning |
| 12:33.51 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 12:37.43 | johnx | I can't picture how much partitioning someone would have to do before deciding that this kind of shorthand needed to exist... |
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| 12:53.35 | `Mace | i really want to see what sprint has in a way of wimax |
| 12:53.39 | `Mace | so i can get a wimax n810 |
| 12:54.03 | `Mace | i've been with att for a while and they just seem to get more and more retarded with each passing month |
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| 13:02.19 | timeless | help? |
| 13:02.24 | timeless | how do i undo karma? |
| 13:03.39 | `Mace | be a better person? |
| 13:03.55 | timeless | i mean in planet |
| 13:04.13 | johnx | ah, accidentally voted something up or down? |
| 13:04.24 | *** join/#maemo andre___ (n=andre@g224236054.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:04.37 | johnx | come here and ask someone to do the opposite, then it'll even out :D |
| 13:05.35 | timeless | heh |
| 13:06.01 | `Mace | i should call sprint and ask about their xohm wimax stuff |
| 13:06.14 | `Mace | i don't want voice.. just data |
| 13:06.32 | `Mace | but knowing typical multi billion dollar conglomerates |
| 13:06.43 | `Mace | they probably force you into a voice contract just to get wimax |
| 13:06.52 | johnx | it's not sprint anymore |
| 13:06.54 | johnx | it's clearwire |
| 13:07.11 | johnx | and no, they offer no voice plans that relate to wimax |
| 13:07.19 | `Mace | really? |
| 13:07.32 | johnx | really truly |
| 13:09.14 | `Mace | Thank you for your interest in Clearwire. We currently do not offer service in the location you entered. Please enter your contact information below and we will contact you as soon as we have coverage in your area. |
| 13:09.21 | `Mace | wtf |
| 13:09.46 | johnx | hmm? but you think that sprint used to cover that area with xohm? |
| 13:09.55 | RST38h | That was a pleasant, diplomatic way of saying "fuck off" |
| 13:09.58 | `Mace | yes |
| 13:10.01 | `Mace | it's chicago ;) |
| 13:10.04 | `Mace | it rolled out here |
| 13:10.19 | `Mace | well.. baltimore.. but chicago is in the sights |
| 13:10.26 | `Mace | http://www.xohm.com/ |
| 13:10.54 | johnx | so there was never live service in chicago, right? |
| 13:11.03 | `Mace | Sorry, XOHM isn't available here. |
| 13:11.07 | `Mace | guess that's a no |
| 13:11.09 | `Mace | sucks |
| 13:11.17 | johnx | why did you think it was already out? |
| 13:11.53 | `Mace | http://www.xohm.com/apps/coverage-tracker/ |
| 13:12.01 | `Mace | because i read an article on it |
| 13:12.02 | *** join/#maemo etrunko (n=edulima@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:12.12 | `Mace | looks like chicago and dallas/ft worth are getting it next |
| 13:12.16 | johnx | yeah, they ended up massively behind schedule |
| 13:12.46 | `Mace | that sucks |
| 13:12.50 | `Mace | i want a wimax n810 |
| 13:13.07 | `Mace | i guess i'll just wait a while until it comes here and the n810s come down in price |
| 13:13.27 | `Mace | well that's fucking lame |
| 13:13.37 | *** join/#maemo abinader (n=bruno@189.2.128.130) |
| 13:13.53 | johnx | Stskeeps, ha! looks like a dbus in chroot thing. |
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| 13:13.56 | johnx | gah |
| 13:13.59 | timeless | ping? |
| 13:14.01 | timeless | http://maemo.org/news/planet-maemo/ |
| 13:14.06 | timeless | could someone load that page w/o js enabled |
| 13:14.19 | timeless | and copy the thumb down link for ' |
| 13:14.19 | timeless | N97 - No, it won't replace the Internet Tablet |
| 13:14.20 | timeless | ' |
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| 13:15.22 | johnx | top article? |
| 13:15.25 | `Mace | wimax n810 would replace everything if there was wimax everywhere like there was supposed to be :) |
| 13:16.03 | johnx | so wait, no js in the s60 browser? that kinda sucks |
| 13:17.49 | johnx | often confuses himself |
| 13:17.55 | RST38h | there is js |
| 13:18.04 | RST38h | just slow and unstablr |
| 13:18.47 | *** join/#maemo Dar (n=Dar_K@nat/sun/x-cb7cfbd474278e3b) |
| 13:20.16 | bergie | interesting: http://gadgets.boingboing.net/2008/12/03/nokia-going-linux-bu.html |
| 13:20.22 | timeless | bergie: ping |
| 13:20.31 | bergie | pong |
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| 13:20.46 | *** join/#maemo datachaos (n=datachao@c9155740.virtua.com.br) |
| 13:20.49 | johnx | probably not good to read too much into statements like that :) |
| 13:21.31 | *** join/#maemo birunko (n=birunko@200.184.118.130) |
| 13:21.36 | timeless | can you look through the website bugs i'm filing now? |
| 13:22.22 | bergie | timeless: not right now, but during the evening, yes |
| 13:22.40 | bergie | unless there is something extremely urgent, of course |
| 13:22.54 | bergie | in the evening's meeting we need to decide what we want done during Dec |
| 13:24.30 | timeless | i'd like to unbury some articles |
| 13:25.18 | bergie | timeless: there is UI for "unfavoriting" in http://maemo.org/news/favorites/ but not for unburying IIRC |
| 13:26.06 | *** join/#maemo errordeveloper (n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 13:26.37 | bergie | timeless: so an UI favor unburying should be easy to make |
| 13:26.44 | bergie | please file a ticket |
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| 13:27.33 | timeless | ok, i filed a bug saying the read crumb was wrong |
| 13:27.44 | timeless | you can fix the bug some other way :) |
| 13:30.01 | bergie | timeless: well, those tickets are a different thing... |
| 13:30.13 | bergie | file another for enabling unburying :-) |
| 13:31.36 | timeless | alright. |
| 13:32.46 | bergie | thx |
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| 13:47.56 | Stskeeps | tries to understand what moblin actually is. |
| 13:49.29 | GAN800 | freezes to death |
| 13:49.55 | GAN800 | A mobile Linux distro based on Red Hat? |
| 13:50.19 | woglinde | lol |
| 13:51.27 | Stskeeps | GAN800: or a maemo clone :P |
| 13:51.44 | Stskeeps | (no, i don't intend to use moblin) |
| 13:51.58 | johnx | not a clone so much as an old version of maemo running on brick-like intel hardware... |
| 13:52.06 | Stskeeps | .. true |
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| 14:15.50 | Stskeeps | scary, just realized i've worked with the guy who wrote agetty linux port :P |
| 14:16.07 | woglinde | haha |
| 14:16.34 | Stskeeps | surprises comes in man pages occasionally |
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| 14:23.47 | Stskeeps | johnx: seems like box.net went commercial 100% |
| 14:24.00 | johnx | no more free account? |
| 14:24.17 | Stskeeps | or maybe.. hmm |
| 14:24.25 | johnx | still free |
| 14:24.48 | johnx | you did remind me I should play with it again though :) |
| 14:24.49 | Stskeeps | okay, i must have looked at some other site then |
| 14:24.59 | johnx | boxfs was fun, but rather slow and sketchy |
| 14:25.02 | Stskeeps | johnx: we should definately make something with boxfs in mer :P |
| 14:25.11 | Stskeeps | could introduce an interesting twist |
| 14:25.47 | *** join/#maemo Disconnect (n=dis@sigkill.net) |
| 14:26.15 | Stskeeps | more of a cloud OS |
| 14:26.48 | johnx | there's lots of fun stuff to do with fuse :) |
| 14:26.52 | johnx | I just never get around to it |
| 14:27.06 | johnx | for a while I kept my ~/documents in version control :) |
| 14:27.24 | Stskeeps | hehe |
| 14:27.37 | johnx | but I never write anything at home in a word processor, so that folder is mostly static these days anyways |
| 14:28.11 | Stskeeps | would really love something like dropbox, put mp3s in a folder, sync to n800 |
| 14:28.23 | Stskeeps | without having to ssh in and scp it over |
| 14:28.23 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 14:28.34 | johnx | well, start with sshfs :P |
| 14:28.59 | johnx | err...your desktop is windows isn't it? |
| 14:29.01 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 14:29.01 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 14:29.28 | johnx | <sales pitch>it's really great in nautilus, just drag and drop to transfer by sftp |
| 14:29.37 | Stskeeps | hehe |
| 14:31.05 | johnx | I tend to do it as I'm walking out the door and the transfer finishes by the time I'm out of wifi range :D |
| 14:31.16 | Stskeeps | yeah,s ame |
| 14:31.49 | Stskeeps | i really need to do my sync-the-songs-i'm listening to-based-on-last.fm thing sometime.. |
| 14:33.05 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, sftp? :P |
| 14:33.32 | johnx | there's a nice GUI sftp client for windows I thought |
| 14:33.44 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: something that automatically syncs my tablet and stuff is better than sftping in and out :P |
| 14:34.00 | GeneralAntilles | There's an icon on my desktop I can just drop stuff on. |
| 14:34.38 | Stskeeps | there should really be wiki pages "integrating your tablet into your computing environment" |
| 14:35.03 | Stskeeps | sftp, rsyncing, usb networking, x11vnc, .. rdesktop, etc |
| 14:35.03 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 14:35.11 | GeneralAntilles | There's a "getting media on your tablet" |
| 14:35.30 | GeneralAntilles | There's a VNC/RDesktop page, too, but it really sucks. |
| 14:35.45 | Stskeeps | i wouldn't mind a suite you could install on your pc really :P |
| 14:36.09 | Stskeeps | "Your N810 is in range, would you like to sync" (avahi) .. and so on |
| 14:36.32 | johnx | uhm, the jaiku build commands are really neat, but it won't let me type the same thing twice...how do I rebuild? O_o |
| 14:36.41 | Stskeeps | johnx: delete the old one |
| 14:36.48 | johnx | fair enough |
| 14:36.57 | Stskeeps | jaiku builders are awesomely slow atm |
| 14:37.16 | Stskeeps | i'll move repo sometime today probably, and try to make it into a http redirect instead |
| 14:37.49 | Stskeeps | .. if apt even supports that |
| 14:38.04 | johnx | hmm |
| 14:38.09 | Stskeeps | nop, seems not |
| 14:38.13 | johnx | I remember it choking on 302s |
| 14:38.14 | johnx | yeah |
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| 14:38.27 | Stskeeps | it'll be packages.mer.tspre.org probably |
| 14:38.44 | Stskeeps | (or repository.. im not sure which one i added |
| 14:38.52 | RST38h | Sts: rsync |
| 14:39.02 | RST38h | Sts: + some scripts I guess |
| 14:39.10 | Stskeeps | yeah.. and a decent cron / alarmd interface |
| 14:39.14 | Stskeeps | we had this discussion i guess :) |
| 14:39.42 | Stskeeps | is so looking forward to get home from work |
| 14:39.58 | johnx | the thing is, I don't know what I want synced until I actually am ready to sync it... |
| 14:40.20 | Stskeeps | avahi + sftp might be nice, appear as an icon |
| 14:40.23 | Stskeeps | and just drag-and-drop |
| 14:40.51 | johnx | I guess avahi would be nice |
| 14:41.56 | johnx | I just keep static DHCP and assign hostnames automatically |
| 14:42.20 | johnx | I don't get new devices often enough that it's a real problem :) |
| 14:42.54 | RST38h | Hmm...home from work...that will be at least 1:40, probably more. |
| 14:43.20 | RST38h | johnx: Get 'em more often, don't supress your urge =) |
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| 14:43.43 | johnx | RST38h, the problem is I seem to have developed an addiction to eating daily... |
| 14:44.14 | RST38h | johnx: A deadly addiction indeed |
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| 14:44.28 | johnx | yes, I've heard it's terminal in all cases |
| 14:44.47 | johnx | though I'd like to avoid that indefinitely :) |
| 14:45.22 | Stskeeps | johnx: so it looks like tslib and omapfb built fine :) |
| 14:45.34 | Stskeeps | .. or not |
| 14:45.41 | Stskeeps | what was the issue with tslib? |
| 14:45.48 | johnx | hmm? |
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| 14:46.13 | johnx | forgot to apply the button-release patch from the debian bug report |
| 14:46.15 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 14:46.33 | johnx | remembered as soon as I tested on zaurus :/ |
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| 14:50.21 | Stskeeps | hmm.. "HildonStackableWindow" |
| 14:50.34 | johnx | something new? |
| 14:50.57 | Stskeeps | cp using it now |
| 14:53.49 | Stskeeps | right, i'm off home |
| 14:56.20 | GeneralAntilles | wonders if X-Fade's still dead. |
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| 15:01.55 | bergie | GeneralAntilles: he is not on Jabber, which is quite a sign |
| 15:02.22 | GeneralAntilles | bergie, any chance you could tell me if integration@maemo.org points anywhere? |
| 15:02.35 | bergie | no idea about the mail setup, sorry |
| 15:09.43 | lardman | johnx: going back a bit, Nautilus is pretty unstable for me when doing sftp (backend not supported errors all the time) |
| 15:10.01 | johnx | lardman, what release are you on? |
| 15:10.20 | johnx | it's been rock solid here in gnome from ubuntu 8.04 and 8.10 |
| 15:10.26 | lardman | no idea, whatever comes with ubuntu upgrades |
| 15:10.43 | johnx | well, it depends on what version of ubuntu you're on :P |
| 15:10.55 | lardman | 8.04 I guess, not the very latest |
| 15:11.57 | johnx | ~lart hildon-desktop for not giving any clear indication of why it dies |
| 15:11.57 | infobot | accelerates a free AOL cd to 50,000 rpm and lets hildon-desktop feel it for not giving any clear indication of why it dies |
| 15:12.59 | lardman | infobot: not sure they can take that sort of speed |
| 15:13.08 | lardman | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:13.09 | lardman | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:13.09 | lardman | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:13.09 | lardman | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:13.09 | lardman | http://www.powerlabs.org/cdexplode.htm |
| 15:13.09 | aquatix | i think you will have fragmented that disk long before it reaches 50000 rpm |
| 15:13.12 | lardman | oops |
| 15:13.19 | lardman | the wonders of WinXP copy & paste :) |
| 15:13.38 | RST38h | larrdmann |
| 15:13.45 | johnx | ah, the fun of spinning CDs on dremels :D |
| 15:14.14 | lopz | hola |
| 15:14.27 | RST38h | ahh, centroids...tasty they are! |
| 15:14.40 | lardman | :) |
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| 15:19.27 | lardman | RST38h: but pictures are better (not sure what's happened to this one mind you): http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/untitled.jpg |
| 15:20.07 | RST38h | lardman: how colorful! how mean! =) |
| 15:21.17 | lardman | always best to work with pretty colours, keeps one happy while coding :) |
| 15:23.14 | RST38h | yea, even if it is only syntax highlighting... |
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| 15:31.21 | GeneralAntilles | The N97 threads are getting a little silly. |
| 15:31.31 | GeneralAntilles | Cellular pundits and S60 fans always crack me up. |
| 15:35.04 | johnx | WTH is conkeror? |
| 15:35.36 | qwerty12 | Something that was named by somebody who felt the need to copy KDE |
| 15:35.54 | johnx | I guess so ... O_o |
| 15:36.13 | johnx | some mozilla based browser that ended up installed without me telling it to be |
| 15:37.59 | GeneralAntilles | The talk about Linux as an alternative on Nokia's high-end phones is kinda interesting. |
| 15:38.27 | GeneralAntilles | Being able to swap between Symbian and Maemo(?) might actually make me care about phones. |
| 15:38.47 | qwerty12 | misses having an S60 phone |
| 15:38.58 | johnx | getting my phone into a reboot loop and losing my contacts would make me smash that phone against a wall |
| 15:39.07 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe |
| 15:39.16 | RST38h | General: Don't tell me you are willingly participating in the N97 brouhaha |
| 15:39.20 | GeneralAntilles | Well, we're talking Harmattan+ here. ;) |
| 15:39.36 | jaska | harmageddon |
| 15:39.41 | johnx | considering that Nokia invented the Linux reboot loop... |
| 15:39.46 | GeneralAntilles | RST38h, no, I'm willing paying attention to real comments by a real Nokia spokesperson about long-term possibilities. ;) |
| 15:39.57 | RST38h | johnx: Smashing your phone against the wall significantly increases your risk of never recovering your contacts |
| 15:40.19 | johnx | RST38h, but the contacts were trapped inside, I just had to get them out |
| 15:40.22 | RST38h | General; Ah, the comment on the long term goal of using Linux in smartphones |
| 15:41.00 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, anyway, current stability isn't necessarily an indicator of stability 2 years down the road. :P |
| 15:41.05 | RST38h | johnx: Try screwdriver and pincers then! =) |
| 15:41.25 | GeneralAntilles | I haven't had a reboot loop in a while |
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| 15:41.34 | RST38h | Anyways, people, what are you talking about? Maemo is ways more stable than Symbian |
| 15:41.36 | GeneralAntilles | anybody using their tablet normally shouldn't run into them. |
| 15:41.56 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, I'm not convinced that an essentially "desktop" environment will make a reasonable "phone" environment |
| 15:42.01 | RST38h | Unless you hack it or happen to have tablet hw Nokia prematurely rashed to the market |
| 15:42.08 | GeneralAntilles | My only real "Symbian" experience is with a 6682, then briefly with an N80 and an N93i. |
| 15:42.13 | lardman | RST38h: "Symbian" aka EPOC used to be very stable |
| 15:43.06 | RST38h | lardman: It is deadlock hell right now |
| 15:43.06 | lardman | RST38h: shame Psion sold it on really |
| 15:43.06 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, I guess we'll see what direction Fremantle moves us in. |
| 15:43.06 | johnx | RST38h, everyone's been hit with an app causing a power drain at one point or another, or a simple packaging mistake leading to a reboot loop |
| 15:43.06 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, but that gap between "desktop" and "phone" is closing rather rapidly. |
| 15:43.06 | RST38h | lardman: The way Symbian works, it will remain deadlock hell |
| 15:43.10 | Summeli | ehh, you shouldn't get deadlocks in symbian, because the activeobjects don't do that :) |
| 15:43.18 | lardman | RST38h: as in the structure of the kernel? |
| 15:43.33 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, in terms of power yes, but in terms of what apps get to do, not really |
| 15:43.33 | RST38h | johnx: drain: all the drain cases were tracked down to two-three apps |
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| 15:43.55 | lardman | Summeli: well they certainly can do, as active objects are cooperatively multitasked |
| 15:44.04 | johnx | RST38h, if we only consider Nokia's included apps, then yes I believe that |
| 15:44.06 | RST38h | johnx: packaging: same problem may occur with Symbian if you provide it with a screwed up package |
| 15:44.19 | Summeli | lardman: no, they can not |
| 15:44.28 | johnx | heh, well, then I don't want a symbian phone either it seems |
| 15:44.34 | lardman | Summeli: why not? |
| 15:44.39 | Summeli | thats the whole reason they were invented in the first place |
| 15:45.20 | Summeli | safe way of doing things |
| 15:45.27 | lardman | Summeli: Ah, I'm not takling about deadlocks in the real sense of the word, just that active objects can continue running for too long |
| 15:45.29 | Summeli | deadlocks are for c-coders |
| 15:45.44 | Summeli | when threads starve etc. |
| 15:46.10 | lardman | yeah i agree with that |
| 15:46.22 | Summeli | you have different problems in symbian ;-) |
| 15:46.32 | lardman | though if the code using the active object method is poorly written you just get really crap and slow code |
| 15:46.39 | lardman | s/code/interaction |
| 15:46.59 | Summeli | lardman: i agree with that :) |
| 15:47.07 | johnx | I guess for me there is an inherent contradiction between having a hackable OS on a device I depend on |
| 15:47.22 | RST38h | lardman: Symbian is based on running system calls in separate threads |
| 15:47.23 | Summeli | however they should make coding "easy" |
| 15:47.35 | RST38h | lardmanL Uses its own threading model, its own exception model |
| 15:48.06 | RST38h | lardman: It all sounds very advanced but in practice there is no way you can insure that this system will work effiociently and reliably |
| 15:48.07 | lardman | RST38h: yes manager processes |
| 15:48.21 | Veggen | johnx: Just because you can don't mean you would :) |
| 15:48.34 | RST38h | lardman: having said that, it is miles ahead of WinMobile |
| 15:48.37 | lardman | RST38h: except that it used too, perhaps it doesn't now, I don't know |
| 15:48.57 | lardman | I'd say the original version of Epoc was miles ahead of Linux for the task it was designed for |
| 15:48.59 | Veggen | johnx: besides, a phone os more of a general computer nowadays, so making it easier to port to it would be a benefit. |
| 15:49.05 | lardman | certainly in terms of memory usage |
| 15:49.57 | johnx | Veggen, but given that it's depended upon I think the core OS should take some more active measures to make sure the device is usable |
| 15:50.14 | Veggen | yah, agreed. |
| 15:50.51 | johnx | which can be difficult enough without supporting mostly unmodified C code, which drags in a whole lump of random libraries |
| 15:51.07 | Veggen | virtualization? core functionality runs on one virtual instance, user app on another, core functionality exports services to the user space? |
| 15:51.28 | RST38h | throws up at the mention of virtualization |
| 15:51.37 | Veggen | ...with hard prioritizing in the OS between the virtual instances. |
| 15:51.44 | johnx | RST38h, you *write* *emulators* :P |
| 15:51.55 | RST38h | (and then the virtual machien manager dies and takes all your cute little VMs with it) |
| 15:52.13 | Veggen | don't need to be full virtualization either. Something like openvz would be great. |
| 15:52.26 | RST38h | johnx: Yes, but I never try virtualizing them =) |
| 15:52.39 | Veggen | RST38h: well. Sure. you'll make sure it's rarely necessary to modify on that one. |
| 15:52.43 | johnx | RST38h, well, then let's just run user stuff in an emulator :) |
| 15:52.57 | RST38h | johnx: This is what Android does, doesn't it? |
| 15:53.15 | johnx | RST38h, kinda like that, but it doesn't have that nice retro feel :( |
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| 15:56.26 | johnx | pictures using a phone that consists of a linux core, running user apps inside of a newton emulator |
| 15:56.30 | lardman | argh, bug #987 |
| 15:59.07 | Stskeeps | johnx: http://repository.mer.tspre.org/ |
| 15:59.15 | RST38h | johnx: Why not go for the ZX Spectrum UI? |
| 15:59.16 | johnx | awesome! |
| 15:59.18 | Stskeeps | can you test the speed of that (mer apt) |
| 15:59.34 | johnx | sure, but it might not mean much |
| 15:59.43 | johnx | my inet connection is pretty unreliable |
| 15:59.51 | johnx | s/unreliable/inconsistent/ |
| 15:59.59 | qwerty12 | But fast right? :D |
| 16:00.09 | Stskeeps | johnx: meh, can't be worse than 2500b/s .. |
| 16:00.10 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 16:00.22 | johnx | well, it *usually* isn't |
| 16:01.09 | GeneralAntilles | Who ever thought something as simple as this would be some difficult to add? :\ https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2326 |
| 16:02.06 | qwerty12 | Knowing yerga, if the bastards didn't keep a trivial thing such as an applet closed, he'd have patched it himself |
| 16:02.14 | johnx | average of 220KB/s but it was up to almost 300KB/s for part of it |
| 16:02.19 | Stskeeps | johnx: fine |
| 16:02.29 | Stskeeps | it'll be better when we get mirrors i guess |
| 16:02.37 | Stskeeps | i'll adjust the builders |
| 16:03.07 | lardman | qwerty12: I guess it would be possible to write a replacement with the available info though |
| 16:03.09 | johnx | I have hildon-desktop w/ maemo-launcher support running on real ARM hardware :) |
| 16:03.21 | RST38h | Speed contacts applet is useless anyway |
| 16:03.31 | RST38h | too large font, too few contacts |
| 16:03.38 | GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, we should elect yerga as the maemo.org patchmaster. ;) |
| 16:03.59 | GeneralAntilles | RST38h, it was good previously |
| 16:04.04 | GeneralAntilles | Could add plenty of contacts |
| 16:04.14 | GeneralAntilles | Then they fucking broke it and now they refuse to fix it. |
| 16:04.28 | RST38h | The first one I got to use was the one in Chinook and it already sicked |
| 16:04.51 | RST38h | s/sicked/sucked |
| 16:04.52 | GeneralAntilles | For some reason they thought 4 contacts with avatars was more useful than 8 or 10 without. |
| 16:04.59 | Stskeeps | johnx: it works now? |
| 16:05.00 | qwerty12 | It's one thing keeping things like BME closed but keeping an contacts applet makes me want to smack the person who made that decision in the balls. |
| 16:05.07 | johnx | Stskeeps, yeah, I linked with -pie |
| 16:05.09 | Stskeeps | johnx: btw builder just went tits up :P |
| 16:05.19 | GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, it wouldn't be so bad if they weren't so retarded in the implementation. |
| 16:05.21 | GeneralAntilles | But damn. |
| 16:05.27 | qwerty12 | True :( |
| 16:05.36 | Stskeeps | Advanced Contacts? |
| 16:05.37 | Stskeeps | :P |
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| 16:05.45 | qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, Was the bora version good? |
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| 16:05.50 | GeneralAntilles | You'd get better use of screen real estate by filling the space taken up by speed contacts for 4 contacts with clocks. |
| 16:05.56 | *** join/#maemo philipl (i=1000@c-67-164-5-76.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:06.03 | GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, it was exactly like the current version, except with a useful number of contacts. ;) |
| 16:06.14 | GeneralAntilles | Because no stupid avatars. |
| 16:06.32 | GeneralAntilles | "Avatars are more important than having friends" apparently. |
| 16:06.36 | qwerty12 | hehe |
| 16:06.47 | johnx | Stskeeps, no problem, anyways, was -export-dynamic getting eaten along with -shared ? |
| 16:06.51 | Stskeeps | johnx: nop |
| 16:06.58 | Stskeeps | i just think -pie wasn't included |
| 16:06.59 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, when should I start playing with Mer? :P |
| 16:07.12 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: we're working on it :P |
| 16:07.13 | johnx | Stskeeps, should work without -pie though, right? technically? |
| 16:07.26 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, what do you want to help with? |
| 16:07.39 | Stskeeps | johnx: i think the issue is really that maemo-launcher cflags doesn't set correctly |
| 16:07.45 | Stskeeps | so no -fpie for example |
| 16:07.56 | Stskeeps | is it possible to combine -fpie and -fPIC? |
| 16:07.56 | johnx | hmm, the pkg-config looked right |
| 16:08.03 | Stskeeps | it has -pie in it? |
| 16:08.20 | johnx | no, it didn't but there should have been two ways, right? |
| 16:08.29 | Stskeeps | mm, true |
| 16:08.30 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, PR? Documentation? :P |
| 16:08.34 | johnx | with -shared or -pie? |
| 16:08.52 | Stskeeps | johnx: i guess fix will be adding -pie in src/Makefile.am in h-d |
| 16:08.53 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, in that case, help by not attracting too many users right now :) |
| 16:09.05 | johnx | Stskeeps, it can be added in debian/rules just fine |
| 16:09.08 | Stskeeps | k |
| 16:09.12 | johnx | LAUNCHER_LDFLAGS = -pie |
| 16:09.14 | Stskeeps | true |
| 16:09.23 | johnx | tested, builds, runs |
| 16:09.36 | *** join/#maemo Interocitor (n=Rhoruns@ip98-165-84-98.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 16:09.40 | Stskeeps | i'll add it to my branch - any other changes? |
| 16:09.41 | GeneralAntilles | johnx, but I was gonna make a giant announcement on itT about Fremantle for N8x0 available right now. :P |
| 16:09.53 | johnx | kries :( |
| 16:09.53 | Stskeeps | dear god |
| 16:10.06 | Stskeeps | wants fremantle sdk |
| 16:10.06 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 16:10.10 | Stskeeps | atleast the alpha |
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| 16:10.28 | GeneralAntilles | "All signs point to some time before the end of the year." ;) |
| 16:10.33 | johnx | GeneralAntilles, I'd just run. I'd shave my head and join a WinMo forum if you sicked the users on me like that O_o; |
| 16:10.49 | GeneralAntilles | Ehehe |
| 16:11.18 | GeneralAntilles | I think I'd also have to put together some really easy to use, but also really brittle install scripts. |
| 16:11.21 | qwerty12 | How is mer installed? I do not want to replace the install on flash but I'm not averse to debootstrapping on an SD or mounting an jffs2 image and dumping the files straight on an SD. |
| 16:11.41 | lardman | Stskeeps: patience |
| 16:11.58 | GeneralAntilles | Hrm, I think my microwave is broken. :( |
| 16:12.00 | johnx | qwerty12, right now, i setup by debootstrapping ubuntu jaunty and installing the mer stuffs |
| 16:12.15 | qwerty12 | cool |
| 16:13.41 | *** join/#maemo booiiing (n=[booiiin@e180031238.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:14.04 | johnx | one of the next things I do after a little more testing on hildon-desktop is to put up the first draft of a meta package that pulls in enough to run hildon-desktop |
| 16:15.24 | johnx | Stskeeps, do you think there's some advantage to staying close to Nokia's packaging of hildon-desktop or does it seem reasonable to mostly borrow Debian's? |
| 16:15.45 | qwerty12 | Burn netsplit, burn! |
| 16:16.07 | johnx | I figured they were running from my meta-package :) |
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| 16:16.25 | qwerty12 | johnx, Not for long it seems :P |
| 16:16.42 | johnx | <johnx> Stskeeps, do you think there's some advantage to staying close to Nokia's packaging of hildon-desktop or does it seem reasonable to mostly borrow Debian's? |
| 16:17.58 | Stskeeps | johnx: what were the differences again? |
| 16:18.25 | johnx | one sec |
| 16:20.30 | johnx | basically, that the debian one has a much cleaner rules file |
| 16:20.54 | johnx | and already has the init stuff removed and switched to start-hildon |
| 16:21.30 | Stskeeps | fine - and i guess there's some dependancies removied? |
| 16:22.56 | johnx | well, the lack of dependency on the whole hildon-initscripts osso-af-startup is the only one it seems |
| 16:23.56 | Stskeeps | k |
| 16:24.22 | johnx | also, the package layout is more debian than Nokia :) |
| 16:25.14 | johnx | so far, moving it forward from 2.0.7 to 2.0.19 was almost no work, so I don't see big problems continuing to follow Nokia's hildon-desktop with the debian/ from Debian |
| 16:28.13 | *** join/#maemo simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 16:29.00 | Meiz_n810 | Jauntys packages.gz is one meg bigger than hastys... still no LXDE or MID packages... |
| 16:29.31 | *** join/#maemo StsN800 (n=user@84.238.94.136) |
| 16:29.45 | johnx | Meiz_n810, whip out that compiler :D |
| 16:30.03 | Meiz_n810 | :) |
| 16:30.25 | StsN800 | of course it starts hailing at the same time my server stops answering.. |
| 16:31.02 | Meiz_n810 | i wanna port something to mer. I am now debootstrapping jaunty on my ubuntu-box. |
| 16:31.14 | Meiz_n810 | well, at least try to |
| 16:31.21 | johnx | well, I'll push hildon-desktop to lp and if you want to take a look you can, but at this point it seems to work perfectly |
| 16:31.37 | johnx | Meiz_n810, that sounds absolutely great! The more the merrier :D |
| 16:31.56 | qwerty12 | johnx, well, I just installed the "SDK" :D. Any requests? |
| 16:32.26 | johnx | qwerty12, whatever you think is needed. |
| 16:32.46 | StsN800 | trac/mer repo is down .. going to go reboot it in 5 |
| 16:33.18 | Meiz_n810 | i got forbidden |
| 16:33.40 | GeneralAntilles | Should Maemo-Upgrade-Description offer "pretty" formatting? |
| 16:33.40 | qwerty12 | I have no idea of how any of this works nor what packages would be nice. Ah well, I'll leave it installed as an option but time to go back to some maemo modding :) |
| 16:34.17 | johnx | qwerty12, alright, alright. How about a browser :) |
| 16:34.41 | GeneralAntilles | It'd be a lot more user friendly to display a clean bulleted list instead of a bunch of * ... * ... |
| 16:34.53 | qwerty12 | johnx, Sure! apt-get source links :P |
| 16:35.21 | johnx | I was thinking about something already hildonized. :P maybe midori? or tear? |
| 16:36.24 | qwerty12 | I'll try midori, compiling tear will require me to compile webkit and I don't have the copious amounts of caffeine needed to keep me awake :) |
| 16:37.52 | johnx | qwerty12, you're building on x86, right? |
| 16:38.01 | qwerty12 | johnx, yep |
| 16:38.24 | johnx | it should be built in jaunty |
| 16:38.39 | qwerty12 | root@faheem-desktop:/# cat /etc/lsb-release |
| 16:38.39 | qwerty12 | DISTRIB_ID=Ubuntu |
| 16:38.39 | qwerty12 | DISTRIB_RELEASE=9.04 |
| 16:38.39 | qwerty12 | DISTRIB_CODENAME=jaunty |
| 16:38.39 | qwerty12 | DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION="Ubuntu jaunty (development branch)" |
| 16:38.39 | qwerty12 | root@faheem-desktop:/# ls |
| 16:38.41 | qwerty12 | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:38.50 | johnx | or is there a maemo specific fork of webkit for tear? |
| 16:39.05 | qwerty12 | No, Bundyo is using the old one in chinook extras |
| 16:39.07 | GeneralAntilles | It's really old these days. |
| 16:39.20 | johnx | ah, and a new one won't just drop in? |
| 16:39.21 | woglinde | johnx hm maybee the new qt 4.5 packages have it |
| 16:39.47 | qwerty12 | johnx, Bundyo no idea, I know Bundyo got the new one to compile for Diablo but some problem or other |
| 16:39.54 | qwerty12 | s/Bundyo/I have/ |
| 16:39.56 | johnx | hmmm, qt "auto-hildonizes" stuff, right? |
| 16:41.03 | woglinde | johny jupp |
| 16:41.17 | woglinde | or better gtkstyled |
| 16:41.17 | qwerty12 | Something like that, I think menubar, "main window" & input method is done |
| 16:41.21 | woglinde | and hildonized |
| 16:41.36 | johnx | this might be extremely awesome :) |
| 16:43.16 | johnx | maybe I should try to get maemo qt4 packaged and install arora :) |
| 16:43.47 | woglinde | hehe |
| 16:44.09 | johnx | well, it would make a good test |
| 16:44.29 | woglinde | hopefully it will work |
| 16:44.44 | qwerty12 | grr, stupid rules file uses cdbs. |
| 16:45.02 | johnx | well, even if it doesn't work, it's valueable to find roadblocks early :) |
| 16:45.32 | woglinde | qwerty na |
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| 16:46.26 | qwerty12 | woglinde, cdbs makes me want to shoot myself and the person who devised it :) |
| 16:46.52 | johnx | yeah, I'm a big fan of plain old dh_make now |
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| 16:47.31 | johnx | I might as well start with qt4.5 I suppose |
| 16:49.32 | *** join/#maemo Stskeeps (n=chobits@84.238.11.16) |
| 16:49.55 | Stskeeps | there we go |
| 16:50.01 | johnx | so your server is outside in the hail? |
| 16:50.14 | johnx | did you bring it inside? :P |
| 16:50.39 | Stskeeps | hehe.. have some problems with the HD cables i suspect, so it dies rather than loosing data, which is fine |
| 16:52.19 | mikkov_ | cdbs isn't that bad, it just doesn't work on maemo ;) |
| 16:53.03 | johnx | hmm, you mean scratchbox or maemo? |
| 16:53.42 | Stskeeps | qwerty12: we have vala in mer already just fyi, (regarding Tear) |
| 16:53.48 | mikkov_ | scratchbox |
| 16:53.57 | qwerty12 | oh, I can build/modify packages using it fine, just the syntax pisses me off. I don't understand for example why I have to use CFLAGS_packagename instead of a plain CFLAGS = etc |
| 16:54.02 | qwerty12 | Stskeeps, cool |
| 16:54.46 | johnx | Stskeeps, I think as a break from hildon-desktop I'll try bringing in maemo QT4.5 :) |
| 16:55.41 | Stskeeps | k |
| 16:55.46 | qwerty12 | Stskeeps, do you have h-a-m in Mer? (Asking so I know whether I should include maemo-select-menu-location in the postinst) |
| 16:55.56 | Stskeeps | qwerty12: not yet, atleast, feel free to see if it compiles :P |
| 16:56.47 | qwerty12 | k :) |
| 16:57.15 | johnx | qwerty12, just got hildon-desktop running a couple minutes ago. you're pretty much left with a main menu that has nothing in it :) |
| 16:58.09 | qwerty12 | johnx, :) |
| 16:58.32 | johnx | actually, running hildon-desktop inside a chroot turns out to be less than straightforward |
| 16:58.56 | johnx | borrowing that osso-af-startup.sh (or whatever...) script from scratchbox might make it work though |
| 16:59.36 | qwerty12 | af-sb-init? |
| 16:59.43 | johnx | right, that :) |
| 17:00.02 | johnx | sighs |
| 17:00.25 | johnx | af-sb-init might need to be modified though |
| 17:02.22 | Stskeeps | johnx: xephyr or not? |
| 17:02.24 | johnx | is a little fuzzy on where qt4.5 is in the svn repo... |
| 17:02.33 | Stskeeps | qt4-maemo.garage? |
| 17:02.33 | johnx | Xephyr isn't a problem |
| 17:02.35 | Stskeeps | or the likes |
| 17:02.56 | johnx | well, qt4.4 is in svn, and qt4.5 is only available as a package AFAICT |
| 17:03.08 | Stskeeps | is it in extras? |
| 17:03.52 | johnx | extras-devel |
| 17:03.56 | johnx | qt4.5 preview |
| 17:04.05 | johnx | anyways, I'll just go from the source packages there |
| 17:04.18 | Stskeeps | k |
| 17:04.39 | Stskeeps | something tells me qt4.5 building on jaiku builders will make them keel over |
| 17:04.47 | johnx | uhm, qt is ... big |
| 17:04.52 | johnx | Stskeeps, I'll keep it local for now |
| 17:05.47 | johnx | I'm already dying a little inside at the thought of how bzr will cope with this source tree |
| 17:07.33 | Stskeeps | hehe |
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| 17:16.25 | Stskeeps | notes that repository.mer.tspre.org and repository.mer.maemo.org is way too similar. |
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| 17:17.57 | lopz | |
| 17:17.57 | lopz | Hirvinen, how can I move to the next track console? as does audtool of audacious, I want to control the player from console |
| 17:18.07 | lopz | hi* |
| 17:18.24 | lopz | slap tab |
| 17:19.21 | Stskeeps | johnx: builder much faster at actually getting packages now :P |
| 17:19.22 | kost-bebix | Hi! Is there a way to format internal flash drive to fat32 if system on tablet is broken? I tried to install diablo to my n810 when vfat on internal card was broken. I thought it will format internal sd, but it didn't and now tablet is some kind of "dead" ( |
| 17:19.45 | *** join/#maemo MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.130) |
| 17:20.11 | kost-bebix | Or should I go to some service center and ask them to format internal drive? (I think diablo will then install fine) |
| 17:21.20 | johnx | kost-bebix, there are two internal drives. The one formatted as fat is just storage space. The actual OS is installed to a 256MB flash memory chip |
| 17:21.47 | johnx | What exactly do you mean by "dead"? |
| 17:22.40 | kost-bebix | johnx: I mean system on it is broken and it can't be turned on (it reboots all the time). One second, I'll find my post to mail-list |
| 17:22.55 | lopz | any ideas? |
| 17:23.37 | Stskeeps | kost-bebix: does it show the nokia logo? |
| 17:23.55 | johnx | lopz, there is a dbus interface: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/42197 |
| 17:24.05 | johnx | lopz, maybe you could use that information with dbus-send? |
| 17:24.05 | kost-bebix | Stskeeps: yep. I can even try to install diablo through usb (it loads the kernel, but then shows error) |
| 17:24.26 | johnx | kost-bebix, what error exactly? |
| 17:24.46 | kost-bebix | here it is http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-users/2008-November/036009.html |
| 17:25.24 | lopz | johnx, hi, The idea is to control the player bluetooth |
| 17:26.01 | kost-bebix | Because everyone who had similar error were just typing -r instead of -F. When they typed -F everything worked (but not for me :-( |
| 17:26.11 | johnx | kost-bebix, it looks like it finished |
| 17:26.31 | johnx | but after that it doesn't boot? |
| 17:27.04 | *** join/#maemo netx (n=rlange@n1-26-67.dhcp.drexel.edu) |
| 17:27.07 | kost-bebix | johnx: no. It stays on nokia boot image. And after about 30 seconds reboots... and again and again |
| 17:27.31 | kost-bebix | johnx: Sending request 0x52 failed! is the error while installing diablo. |
| 17:28.09 | johnx | kost-bebix, but it prints that *after* it finishes flashing |
| 17:28.19 | kost-bebix | johnx: yes) |
| 17:28.29 | johnx | did you have other problems before you reflashed? |
| 17:28.44 | johnx | it could be a hardware problem |
| 17:28.44 | kost-bebix | johnx: no. Only broken vfat on mcc1 |
| 17:29.48 | kost-bebix | johnx: as I already said, people who typed -r instead -F had similar simptoms (it finished flashing), but still wasn't working. |
| 17:30.13 | Stskeeps | johnx: think we'll stick with repo upload being at trac.tspre.org - upload seems fine, download is just crap :P |
| 17:31.18 | lopz | johnx, Using mplayer, I can not control console, without using keys? something like, for example mplayer --next-song |
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| 17:32.54 | johnx | lopz, look up mplayer slave mode |
| 17:33.18 | johnx | kost-bebix, I've gotten the same error message before and my tablet booted after that. You could try reflashing again I guess |
| 17:33.20 | lopz | johnx, ok, thanks :) |
| 17:33.32 | Stskeeps | heh |
| 17:33.34 | Stskeeps | johnx: http://labs.o-hand.com/xoo/ |
| 17:34.00 | kost-bebix | johnx: thanx. Maybe I'll try install another (earlier) version of diablo. |
| 17:34.04 | johnx | Stskeeps, sounds good. about to pull the trigger on qt4.5 build and go to bed |
| 17:34.14 | johnx | kost-bebix, that's not the problem ... |
| 17:34.31 | johnx | the latest version is fine |
| 17:34.43 | johnx | Stskeeps, that looks pretty cool actually |
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| 17:35.51 | Stskeeps | johnx: k, i'll work on improving our "developer tools", i think |
| 17:35.56 | Stskeeps | did you get it going in chroot? |
| 17:36.03 | kost-bebix | johnx: well, I tried to reinstall that several times. What if it won't work, can I request another n810 from company? Or if I tried to reinstall software I can't do that anymore? |
| 17:36.05 | johnx | hildon-desktop? not yet |
| 17:36.20 | *** join/#maemo b1ackd3ath (n=b1ackdea@static-98-110-205-26.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:36.35 | Stskeeps | k |
| 17:36.45 | johnx | kost-bebix, yes, if your device doesn't work you should get Nokia to replace it. installing software doesn't affect your warranty |
| 17:37.00 | kost-bebix | johnx: thanks a lot!) |
| 17:37.18 | kost-bebix | it's a good news for me :-) |
| 17:37.28 | b1ackd3ath | dose any one know make the boot menu come up with out holding down the home key? |
| 17:38.28 | *** join/#maemo Pio (n=sean@207.181.14.102) |
| 17:38.45 | johnx | b1ackd3ath, I don't think it's possible. may I ask why you want to do that? |
| 17:38.59 | Stskeeps | johnx: .. editing linuxrc probably does the trick |
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| 17:39.24 | b1ackd3ath | so it dosnt boot into the the default flash right away |
| 17:40.00 | b1ackd3ath | cuz id rather boot on to my external mmc card |
| 17:40.27 | johnx | you've hear of fanoush's bootmenu, right? |
| 17:40.35 | b1ackd3ath | im using it |
| 17:40.53 | b1ackd3ath | i guess i could just change the order of the mdnu |
| 17:40.58 | b1ackd3ath | *menu |
| 17:42.10 | b1ackd3ath | but i was mainly woundering about the no having to press the home key |
| 17:43.02 | b1ackd3ath | *not ug my n810 keyboard is messing up my type o's sorry |
| 17:43.07 | johnx | I don't have to on mine...that's why I thought you weren't using it |
| 17:43.17 | Meiz_n810 | Bootmenu have always been showed on my n810, i have never pressed the home key to use it |
| 17:44.20 | b1ackd3ath | so by best bet is to just modify intifs |
| 17:44.48 | b1ackd3ath | yeh thats what i'll do |
| 17:47.14 | b1ackd3ath | has any on changed there /etc/systemui/systemui.xml to add the reboot option? |
| 17:47.25 | qwerty12 | yes, works fine. |
| 17:47.49 | b1ackd3ath | on the internal flash too? |
| 17:48.50 | b1ackd3ath | cuz i cant get mine to work i got it to work on the default flash os but not my internal flash |
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| 17:50.10 | b1ackd3ath | be right back gonna reboot my n810 |
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| 17:52.38 | b1ackd3ath | back nvm |
| 17:52.50 | b1ackd3ath | rebooting made it come up |
| 17:53.38 | b1ackd3ath | anyone have any trouble with the advanced power manager? |
| 17:56.34 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12 (n=faheem@78-86-35-231.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 17:56.46 | *** join/#maemo ron1n (n=ron1n@208.253.111.18) |
| 17:56.49 | qwerty12 | Fuck. I have to learn where the lock screen and hibernate button is >.< |
| 17:57.36 | Proteous | ... |
| 17:57.57 | johnx | alright, qt4.5 is starting to build, and I'm gonna catch some sleep |
| 17:58.05 | johnx | 'night all |
| 17:59.11 | Stskeeps | nini |
| 17:59.18 | b1ackd3ath | pc im out too takes for the help |
| 18:04.53 | Stskeeps | johnx: i'll stage hildon-desktop and build it on builders |
| 18:05.23 | *** join/#maemo AngieQ (n=AngieQ@66-189-144-100.dhcp.mdfd.or.charter.com) |
| 18:06.11 | *** join/#maemo Pebby (n=PebbyWeb@c-24-5-47-161.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 18:06.18 | Meiz_n810 | if i add deb-src http://repository.maemo.org/ diablo free non-free, will i be able to apt-get source maemo packages? |
| 18:07.03 | qwerty12 | no |
| 18:07.03 | qwerty12 | deb-src http://repository.maemo.org/ diablo/sdk free |
| 18:07.28 | Meiz_n810 | then i can port maemo things for mer? |
| 18:07.33 | qwerty12 | oh, yeah, with the proper deb-src line, yes apt-get source will work |
| 18:09.07 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: you're better off just grabbing the .dsc .diff.gz and .tar.gz from the /pool directories really |
| 18:09.15 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: there's a guide for it on the blueprint page |
| 18:09.22 | Meiz_n810 | k |
| 18:09.40 | *** join/#maemo fab__ (n=bellet@bellet.info) |
| 18:09.52 | Stskeeps | you can try out with applications in extras first, probably more interesting |
| 18:10.12 | Stskeeps | (http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/diablo/) |
| 18:10.28 | Stskeeps | source is in http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/diablo/free/source/ |
| 18:10.52 | Meiz_n810 | what app should i try first :) |
| 18:11.18 | Stskeeps | advanced backlight |
| 18:11.19 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 18:11.30 | Stskeeps | that's usually our test app |
| 18:11.34 | Meiz_n810 | ok |
| 18:11.38 | Meiz_n810 | i'll try |
| 18:11.48 | Stskeeps | .. but ok, that one might not apply on i386 |
| 18:11.48 | Stskeeps | sec |
| 18:11.59 | Meiz_n810 | i'll still try |
| 18:12.03 | Meiz_n810 | <--- Really n00b with things like this... :) |
| 18:12.34 | *** join/#maemo netx (n=rlange@n1-26-67.dhcp.drexel.edu) |
| 18:12.54 | Stskeeps | .. try to find one that makes sense, simple hildon app, i guess |
| 18:12.55 | *** join/#maemo chelli (n=chelli@p54B86307.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:13.03 | Stskeeps | maemo mapper is out of the question cos of gpsbt |
| 18:13.03 | Meiz_n810 | k |
| 18:13.29 | qwerty12 | Stskeeps, please, please can I port an hildonized hello world? |
| 18:13.38 | Stskeeps | qwerty12: go ahead :P |
| 18:13.44 | Stskeeps | maemopad? :P |
| 18:13.44 | qwerty12 | wheee!!!! |
| 18:15.21 | qwerty12 | hehe |
| 18:16.05 | lcuk | port liqbase, its only small |
| 18:16.25 | lcuk | laughs evily |
| 18:16.30 | *** join/#maemo eton_ (n=eton@ppp-58-8-2-234.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 18:16.37 | qwerty12 | adds in a northerner notice for liqbase mer edition |
| 18:17.07 | qwerty12 | now it's my turn to laugh :P |
| 18:17.20 | qwerty12 | But I see the <lame> humor is not share |
| 18:17.23 | qwerty12 | shuts the fuck up |
| 18:17.42 | lcuk | heh |
| 18:20.44 | *** join/#maemo briglia (n=X@189.2.128.130) |
| 18:23.49 | *** join/#maemo solmumaha (n=solmis@mikkeli.wsoy.fi) |
| 18:24.56 | *** join/#maemo hvelarde|stealth (n=chatzill@189.136.175.241) |
| 18:25.52 | etrunko | cool picture |
| 18:25.54 | etrunko | http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/gizmodo/2008/12/n97_maemo_494.jpg |
| 18:26.13 | etrunko | from http://feeds.gawker.com/~r/gizmodo/full/~3/R5ASCqY2G8k/nokias-down-with-making-a-high+end-open-source-phone-just-not-with-android |
| 18:27.27 | GeneralAntilles | Totally invalid use of that logo. . . . |
| 18:27.39 | Stskeeps | hehe |
| 18:27.42 | Stskeeps | "Maemophone" |
| 18:28.37 | GeneralAntilles | Anybody feel like pulling up one of the "The next tablet's pricing will be mostly inline with current hardware" quotes? |
| 18:28.45 | GeneralAntilles | Qole is being babyish about it. |
| 18:29.11 | Stskeeps | if it doesn't have voice in it, it should definately be below n97 pricing |
| 18:29.12 | qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, These channels are logged. |
| 18:29.19 | Stskeeps | :> |
| 18:29.22 | GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, :P |
| 18:29.27 | qwerty12 | hehe :P |
| 18:30.16 | GeneralAntilles | Oh well, he can believe me or not. One of us will be proven wrong when RX-51 is finally out. :P |
| 18:31.29 | GeneralAntilles | Man, Igor and fanoush and Mark can't pull his head out of his own ass. |
| 18:31.45 | Stskeeps | where's the trouble these times? |
| 18:31.55 | GeneralAntilles | -users, as usual. :P |
| 18:31.55 | Stskeeps | s/these/this/ |
| 18:31.56 | Stskeeps | ah. |
| 18:32.12 | GeneralAntilles | http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail//maemo-users/2008-December/036046.html |
| 18:32.39 | Stskeeps | yeah, readin' |
| 18:33.44 | Stskeeps | well that was a couple of minutes wasted of my time |
| 18:33.55 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe |
| 18:34.04 | GeneralAntilles | Nobody held a gun to your head. :P |
| 18:34.14 | GeneralAntilles | Hrm, I don't have any tasks to pick up for December. |
| 18:34.22 | qwerty12 | disables the missiles pointed at Stskeeps |
| 18:34.39 | *** join/#maemo madhav (n=Administ@122.167.134.182) |
| 18:42.07 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: community distribution: collaboration, structure/management maybe, how should one be managed and formed? I mean, what i've seen is just proposals on what it should include.. |
| 18:42.24 | Stskeeps | but not how it's managed and structured/manned |
| 18:42.34 | Stskeeps | (vision stuff, not right-here-and-now) |
| 18:42.53 | GeneralAntilles | Hrm, I dunno. |
| 18:43.07 | GeneralAntilles | I kinda want something concrete to start happening before I kick off anything like that. |
| 18:43.27 | Stskeeps | yeah, of course, just putting it out there cos i'm starting have thoughts in that direction |
| 18:43.42 | Stskeeps | cos any distribution keels over without proper structure when it attracts enough attention |
| 18:44.01 | *** join/#maemo ron1n (n=ron1n@208.253.111.18) |
| 18:44.38 | qwerty12 | Stskeeps, I've got a dirty build of maemo mapper... but I've to gtfo of my computer now >.< |
| 18:44.48 | Stskeeps | hehe, okay |
| 18:45.19 | qwerty12 | any way of testing in a i386 chroot or will I have to compile on device :)? |
| 18:45.19 | GeneralAntilles | Hrm, well. |
| 18:45.41 | GeneralAntilles | etrunko's got some of that with https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Collaboration_infrastructure |
| 18:45.55 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=faheem@78-86-35-231.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:46.35 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: i would assume it would be possible to start dbus daemons and use xephyr or something in chroot.. but im not sure, johnx was on that |
| 18:46.51 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: but alone maemo mapper compiling, dirtily, is a good sign |
| 18:47.07 | *** join/#maemo dforsyth (n=dforsyth@pool-72-66-93-104.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 18:47.11 | *** join/#maemo lardman (n=simon@78.145.159.111) |
| 18:47.51 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, I dunno if I feel like breaking it up into smaller chunks for this Sprint |
| 18:48.05 | qwerty12_N800 | while libgpsmgr are closed, redistribution is allowed |
| 18:48.12 | GeneralAntilles | But if we want to start pushing Variants and Collaboration infrastructure, I'm all in. :) |
| 18:48.47 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: collaboration infrastructure and variants is definately a topic to be worked on |
| 18:50.19 | Stskeeps | collaboration and publishing branches for maemo (OS) should be as easy as it is on launchpad |
| 18:50.41 | Stskeeps | if you want access to fool around on Mer launchpad (mer launchpad -is- a experimental part of the project too), you can just say :P |
| 18:51.26 | qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, version control isn't my thing :) |
| 18:52.15 | *** join/#maemo guardian (n=guardian@ANantes-252-1-34-143.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 18:54.48 | *** join/#maemo lele (n=lele@2a01:2d8:42:42:21a:92ff:fe28:ff59) |
| 18:55.10 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: i've really learnt to appreciate it.. bzr also has local branches which helps a lot |
| 18:55.45 | *** join/#maemo netx (n=rlange@n1-26-67.dhcp.drexel.edu) |
| 18:56.20 | qwerty12_N800 | :) |
| 18:57.03 | Stskeeps | so you can commit to your local branch and then push to the public one |
| 18:57.54 | *** join/#maemo gnuton (i=52b5a118@kde/developer/aloisio) |
| 18:57.58 | gnuton | Hi there |
| 18:58.08 | GeneralAntilles | Hey, gnuton. |
| 18:58.29 | gnuton | Hello GeneralAntilles ! :D |
| 18:59.05 | woglinde | hi gnuton |
| 18:59.22 | gnuton | Hey woglinde |
| 18:59.24 | gnuton | :D |
| 19:00.10 | *** join/#maemo error_developer_ (n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 19:00.34 | lcuk | ninja flying kick |
| 19:00.46 | woglinde | lcuk haha |
| 19:00.53 | qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, You may want to take a look at maemo's libfontconfig (if you haven't done so already) - it has the important device_symbols.h file |
| 19:01.01 | woglinde | lcuk you fall down on your butt |
| 19:01.05 | woglinde | will |
| 19:01.08 | lcuk | oh hiya woglinde i guess that was the wrong chan ;) |
| 19:01.26 | lcuk | mmm qwerty libfontconfig |
| 19:01.35 | lcuk | is that a normal thing and does it enum the fonts in the system? |
| 19:02.22 | Jaffa | train spods |
| 19:03.18 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: device_symbols does what? |
| 19:03.30 | lcuk | jaffa? typo or have you stopped training pods now |
| 19:04.07 | lcuk | ahhh |
| 19:04.13 | Jaffa | is spodding from the the train |
| 19:04.20 | woglinde | train spotting |
| 19:05.30 | qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, "defines unicode values for device symbols of hardware buttons" - i presume maemo-mapper needs it for its all important ability to manipulate the map etc |
| 19:05.36 | lcuk | "Spodding" is also a specific common verb used in fishing to denote the use of a "Spod" or "Spod Rocket" to deliver lose feed for fish to a specific area of a water or river for the purposes of fishing. |
| 19:05.42 | lcuk | mmmm is that legal from a moving train? |
| 19:06.04 | Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: you chairing the 2000 UTC meeting tonight? |
| 19:06.21 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah I guess I should. |
| 19:06.25 | GeneralAntilles | forgot about that. |
| 19:06.44 | lcuk | to be clear, this meeting, is it in 55minutes |
| 19:06.51 | GeneralAntilles | It is. |
| 19:06.54 | woglinde | *g* |
| 19:06.56 | GeneralAntilles | This should help, though. https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints ;) |
| 19:06.58 | lcuk | hates utc |
| 19:07.03 | Jaffa | lcuk: Probably the more "do computery things, spc. online MUDs, talkers and IRC" |
| 19:07.06 | woglinde | lcuk why? |
| 19:07.25 | GeneralAntilles | has to duck out for a bit, will be back. |
| 19:07.32 | lcuk | i want my computer to automatically translate all times and dates into northern |
| 19:07.35 | qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, works for me as we're +0000 atm :) |
| 19:07.43 | lcuk | for now |
| 19:08.14 | Jaffa | lcuk: eight o'clock,lad. Be back from down t'pit by then, or yersen'll be late |
| 19:08.17 | Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: a |
| 19:08.18 | Stskeeps | h |
| 19:08.19 | lcuk | pushes for a proper true northern dialect en-nt |
| 19:08.21 | lardman | qwerty12_N800: I think he means, "ee uup lad, in the moorning" or similar... ;) |
| 19:08.44 | qwerty12_N800 | lol |
| 19:08.50 | lardman | all at once we attack lcuk :) |
| 19:09.01 | lcuk | aye thanks thar jaffa, shall just have time to duck in'th tub as long as me dad n gradnda 'ave finished |
| 19:09.18 | lcuk | you southern jessies couldnt handle it |
| 19:09.31 | lcuk | i was out in the snow iwth only a vest, tshirt, jumper and coat today! |
| 19:10.02 | qwerty12_N800 | yeah, yeah... |
| 19:10.07 | Jaffa | Pfft, I'm from Macclesfield I'll have yer know. Ye don't want a Macc Lad on yer case ;-p |
| 19:10.54 | lcuk | :D you must like your beer n sex n chips n gravy then :D |
| 19:11.28 | qwerty12_N800 | Us East London boiz do the best ting with our zut's n' shanks. i'll fuk up manchester & macclesfield rascal :p |
| 19:11.46 | Jaffa | lcuk: spot on |
| 19:11.49 | woglinde | wahahaa |
| 19:11.57 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: auch @ argument by ignorance |
| 19:12.37 | Proteous | what is a jumper? |
| 19:13.09 | lardman | doesn't say anything about being 1/2 Australian, I think that's in the South somewhere... |
| 19:13.13 | *** join/#maemo Pakke (n=pakke_m@a91-153-24-79.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 19:13.35 | lcuk | Proteous, knitted sweater |
| 19:14.02 | Proteous | ah |
| 19:14.16 | Proteous | so no trousers? |
| 19:14.17 | lcuk | lardman, didnt know that , were you born up here or down there? |
| 19:14.36 | lcuk | Proteous, i suppose you could use a jumper as your trousers, but it would look a bit daft |
| 19:14.48 | Proteous | well, you didn't say you were wearing anything over your legs |
| 19:14.53 | lardman | lcuk: up here |
| 19:15.38 | lardman | where's the component versions list gone to? |
| 19:15.42 | lcuk | cool, ist here much family down there to have an excuse to get away from the weather |
| 19:15.59 | lardman | lcuk: yeah loads over there, not much here other than immediate |
| 19:16.46 | qwerty12_N800 | lardman, http://repository.maemo.org/stable/diablo/4.1_vs_4.1.1_content_changes.html |
| 19:16.58 | lardman | thanks qwerty12_N800 |
| 19:17.09 | Jaffa | Next summit in .au, then ;-) |
| 19:17.16 | *** join/#maemo eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-5-46.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 19:17.18 | lardman | sounds ideal to me :) |
| 19:17.49 | lcuk | we might need another maemo bugmaster, some of the insects down there are bad |
| 19:17.56 | Jaffa | Your relatives' house for a barbie? |
| 19:18.12 | lardman | Jaffa: sure :) |
| 19:18.16 | lcuk | jaffa, its worth way more than a barbie, include a ken as well |
| 19:18.42 | Meiz_n810 | ported mediabox... |
| 19:18.43 | *** join/#maemo wms (n=wms___@198.146.5.4) |
| 19:18.46 | Proteous | what about the beach house |
| 19:18.52 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: compiled without issue? |
| 19:18.57 | Meiz_n810 | yes |
| 19:19.14 | Meiz_n810 | is there a log i can view you |
| 19:19.14 | lardman | Proteous: bbq on the beach then? |
| 19:19.19 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 19:19.41 | Proteous | at the barbie beach house? |
| 19:19.44 | Proteous | count me in |
| 19:19.52 | Proteous | only if I can drive the barbie convertable |
| 19:20.12 | Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: honestly i have no idea if it should work now, it gave me some warnings... |
| 19:20.13 | lcuk | ok smithers |
| 19:20.15 | lardman | presses ctrl-- repeatedly to see if Proteous can fit |
| 19:20.27 | *** join/#maemo chmac (n=chmac@200.56.179.245) |
| 19:20.28 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: warnings are the norm :P it probably doesn't work on i386 that well |
| 19:20.41 | Meiz_n810 | k |
| 19:20.56 | lcuk | starts his code timer |
| 19:21.01 | Stskeeps | i'll set up a /extras repository eventually, but good that it ported without big issues |
| 19:21.16 | Meiz_n810 | should i upload it to launchpad? |
| 19:21.17 | Stskeeps | jaiku that you succeeded in building it |
| 19:21.33 | Stskeeps | since you didn't have to edit source upload isn't needed i guess |
| 19:21.42 | Meiz_n810 | k |
| 19:21.58 | Stskeeps | (keep the .deb and .tar.gz and .changes) |
| 19:22.04 | RST38h | Stskeeps <--- the evil twin of the whole Nokia Maemo team |
| 19:22.06 | Meiz_n810 | #reconstructedPOC? |
| 19:22.12 | Stskeeps | RST38h: shadow maemo sw |
| 19:22.14 | Meiz_n810 | or merbuilder? |
| 19:22.14 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: yeah |
| 19:22.17 | Meiz_n810 | k |
| 19:22.20 | Stskeeps | (r-poc) |
| 19:22.56 | yerga | GeneralAntilles, I deserve that title ;) |
| 19:23.13 | Stskeeps | yeah, i'm inclined to think so too :P |
| 19:23.33 | Stskeeps | tries debootstrapping ubuntu, again. |
| 19:23.47 | Stskeeps | http://labs.o-hand.com/xoo/ , quite neat :> |
| 19:23.53 | Stskeeps | (i know it's silly, but still) |
| 19:24.41 | *** join/#maemo Pakke (n=pakke_m@a91-153-24-79.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 19:26.38 | lcuk | cant believe how much of liqbase has been ripped to shreds |
| 19:26.56 | lcuk | is left with a single purple rectangle |
| 19:27.07 | woglinde | lcuk lol |
| 19:27.16 | lardman | http://www.ti-estore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=dEmbSoft |
| 19:27.27 | lardman | yow, I wonder if that's a single device license...? |
| 19:27.38 | lardman | s/license/licence |
| 19:27.57 | lcuk | oh crap, thought i was #liqbase blogging lol woglinde, ive gutted lb and am rebuilding furiously |
| 19:28.36 | Proteous | wake up~! |
| 19:28.50 | *** join/#maemo fnordianslip (n=darren@78.33.82.89) |
| 19:28.58 | GeneralAntilles | is back. |
| 19:28.58 | lcuk | lardman, what are you after from there |
| 19:29.01 | *** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@host-88-217-185-158.customer.m-online.net) |
| 19:29.02 | lcuk | and have you got a voucher |
| 19:29.07 | lcuk | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:29.14 | GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, auch? |
| 19:29.32 | lardman | lcuk: was following a random link from the web |
| 19:29.36 | woglinde | ah damnit |
| 19:29.42 | woglinde | joost is broken somehow |
| 19:30.18 | lcuk | ahh |
| 19:30.18 | qwerty12_N800 | boost? |
| 19:30.38 | RST38h | lcuq |
| 19:30.47 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: good one :P |
| 19:30.52 | lcuk | lardman, these are more in line |
| 19:30.53 | lcuk | http://www.ti-estore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=dLiterature |
| 19:31.51 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181192153.pp.htv.fi) |
| 19:33.25 | woglinde | http://www.joost.com |
| 19:33.36 | *** join/#maemo ron1n (n=ron1n@208.253.111.18) |
| 19:33.39 | qwerty12_N800 | ah, my bad, cool |
| 19:34.00 | Stskeeps | loathes joost |
| 19:34.01 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 19:34.13 | woglinde | wanted to see another episode of one of anime series |
| 19:34.18 | qwerty12_N800 | has an addiction to the boost energy drink. made in Leeds too, damn northerners :p |
| 19:34.27 | woglinde | boost library |
| 19:34.58 | *** join/#maemo netx (n=rlange@n1-26-67.dhcp.drexel.edu) |
| 19:37.01 | Meiz_n810 | I also compiled mytube for mer. but is it even needed? |
| 19:37.20 | Meiz_n810 | (should it install without rebuilding) |
| 19:39.02 | *** join/#maemo housetier (n=housetie@unaffiliated/housetier) |
| 19:39.05 | lcuk | is mer actually running hildon now? |
| 19:42.22 | Meiz_n810 | yes, it is possible |
| 19:43.36 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: i'll work a bit on getting boot scripts and such up |
| 19:43.37 | Stskeeps | and so you can test on i386 |
| 19:44.25 | qwerty12_N800 | whee (qwerty12 wants to see if maemo-mapper shits out on him wth a segfault :P) |
| 19:44.40 | Stskeeps | waiting on apt-get stuff on my own stuff atm :P |
| 19:44.51 | Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: ok |
| 19:44.58 | Stskeeps | and wondering why i get 1000kb/s download.. |
| 19:44.58 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 19:45.12 | Meiz_n810 | :P |
| 19:45.36 | Meiz_n810 | i get max 56.9 kb/s |
| 19:45.45 | Stskeeps | i usually get max 200k/s |
| 19:45.46 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 19:46.03 | Meiz_n810 | i live in the middle of nowhere |
| 19:46.06 | *** join/#maemo crashanddie (n=crashand@SecuraBit/listener/crashanddie) |
| 19:46.30 | Stskeeps | at least you have dsl. :P |
| 19:46.42 | Meiz_n810 | adls |
| 19:46.47 | Meiz_n810 | *sl |
| 19:46.51 | Meiz_n810 | in 2011 they will get cables outta here |
| 19:47.04 | Meiz_n810 | then i have to use 5kb/s GPRS |
| 19:49.04 | lcuk | is there a simple way to close hildon entirely or prevent it from running in the first place |
| 19:49.17 | woglinde | rm -rf |
| 19:49.37 | qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, but still have x running? |
| 19:49.38 | lcuk | i should add i want to be able to re-run it later |
| 19:49.43 | lcuk | yeah |
| 19:49.56 | lcuk | if i go down the ps list my machine reboots |
| 19:50.17 | qwerty12_N800 | qole does it with the debian stuff & penguinbait does it with kde |
| 19:50.27 | lcuk | mmm ill take a look |
| 19:50.46 | lcuk | might get a little less variation with stuff |
| 19:50.58 | lcuk | then again i might just leave it |
| 19:51.03 | qwerty12_N800 | if you want to experiment killing programs, easy way is to set the no-lifeguard-reset rd flag |
| 19:51.14 | lcuk | but thats not a users device |
| 19:51.21 | lcuk | i wont know what works and what doesnt |
| 19:51.32 | lcuk | ie whats required and whats not |
| 19:52.42 | qwerty12_N800 | if you look through the android section, there is a list of what you can kill without the n8x0 rebooting |
| 19:52.58 | *** join/#maemo tekojo (n=tekojo@a91-154-124-73.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 19:53.16 | lcuk | i could also find it inside /etc somewhere cant i |
| 19:53.25 | lcuk | init.d rings a bell? |
| 19:53.40 | lcuk | huzzah it looks right |
| 19:54.09 | qwerty12_N800 | /etc/rc2.d contains the items that are started by n8x0 when booting from battery |
| 19:55.50 | lcuk | what are the other rcX.d things? |
| 19:57.10 | qwerty12_N800 | not really relevant on maemo except for rc5.d which programs in there are started when booting with charger in. rest is debian standard runlevels |
| 19:58.03 | lcuk | ahhh cool, thank you former northern but now southern jessie boy |
| 19:58.15 | qwerty12_N800 | grr, :P |
| 19:59.11 | lcuk | right, i must vanish, ill leave the apps running for now, but it would be interesting to find the total core minimal subset of apps required to run an x app at some point |
| 20:00.54 | qwerty12_N800 | is he reduced his time to make proper dbus-send cmd lines from 30m to 5m :p |
| 20:01.01 | qwerty12_N800 | ^glad |
| 20:03.10 | *** join/#maemo _marcell_ (n=marcell@a91-152-160-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
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| 20:04.27 | CerealKiller_713 | Hey I just installed the kde boot but I was in kde when I did it .... now I am getting the loop at the start |
| 20:05.17 | CerealKiller_713 | Is there any way to fix this with out recloning and redownloading ? |
| 20:05.25 | *** join/#maemo hannesw (n=hannes@chello062178166147.12.14.vie.surfer.at) |
| 20:06.38 | CerealKiller_713 | I can still use the flash but my mmc is looping .... please help ! |
| 20:06.45 | dneary | lardman: you're in London? |
| 20:07.36 | lcuk | forgot about the meeting |
| 20:07.38 | woglinde | ah joost is working again |
| 20:07.52 | qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, +1 :/ |
| 20:08.00 | CerealKiller_713 | <~~~ US ( I wish i was in London ) |
| 20:08.23 | Meiz_n810 | libtoolize: command not found... Where can i get libtoolize? |
| 20:08.28 | lardman | dneary: no, Bath |
| 20:08.29 | qwerty12_N800 | to say it started at 20:00 UTC, it's a hive of activity :) |
| 20:08.38 | woglinde | Meiz_n810 install libtool |
| 20:08.41 | dneary | lardman: Shower, usually |
| 20:08.51 | dneary | But I do occasionally like to soak |
| 20:08.53 | Meiz_n810 | woglinde: thanks |
| 20:09.34 | tekojo | qwerty12: waiting for everyone to be there :-) |
| 20:09.37 | *** join/#maemo lm2_510 (n=86ae8cd8@chathostplus.com) |
| 20:09.47 | qwerty12_N800 | tekojo, ah :) |
| 20:09.59 | Meiz_n810 | okay aclocal-1.7 is mising too... where can i get that :L |
| 20:10.07 | woglinde | 1.7? |
| 20:10.10 | woglinde | muaha |
| 20:10.13 | woglinde | stone age |
| 20:10.37 | Meiz_n810 | k |
| 20:10.41 | lm2_510 | hey y'all. where can I find list of those "flick"/"throw" motions that change cases without shifting? |
| 20:11.13 | CerealKiller_713 | is there anone in here that knows the comand to uninstall the kde boot.deb ????? |
| 20:11.45 | lm2_510 | I'd like to know what *other* flick/throw commands there are |
| 20:12.57 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: autoconf, automake |
| 20:13.40 | Meiz_n810 | thanks |
| 20:14.06 | Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: i already have them |
| 20:15.26 | Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: autoconf-1.7 installable too, or autoconf1.7 |
| 20:15.37 | Meiz_n810 | ok |
| 20:16.46 | Meiz_n810 | there is no 1.7 version of autoconf installable |
| 20:17.04 | Stskeeps | sure? :P |
| 20:17.50 | *** join/#maemo EspeonEefi (i=eefi@STRATTON-TWO-EIGHTY.MIT.EDU) |
| 20:18.09 | Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: |
| 20:18.11 | Meiz_n810 | root@tietokone:/mer/load-applet/load-applet-0.8.2# apt-cache search autoconf autoconf - automatic configure script builder |
| 20:18.18 | Meiz_n810 | shit |
| 20:18.20 | Meiz_n810 | wait |
| 20:18.28 | Stskeeps | ok, i mean automake1.7 (or automake-1.7) |
| 20:18.48 | Meiz_n810 | ok |
| 20:19.14 | *** join/#maemo ron1n (n=ron1n@208.253.111.18) |
| 20:21.10 | Stskeeps | ponders idly on hildon-initscripts |
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| 20:28.02 | l7 | hmm, can giving the processor too much to do at once cause a spontaneous reboot? |
| 20:28.59 | l7 | i was using reduced procesor performance mode while downloading a file with links and trying to open a new tab in roxterm |
| 20:29.05 | l7 | when the system rebooted |
| 20:29.18 | woglinde | l7 could be wlan driver |
| 20:29.23 | l7 | hmm |
| 20:29.56 | l7 | all my other spontaneous reboots seem to have been related to periods of high activity too |
| 20:30.38 | lcuk | l7, if you run in powersave mode perhaps you are hiting the watchdog cos it hasnt got enough time to poll everything |
| 20:30.39 | l7 | sounds plausible to me... i guess i could file a bug report under the wlan driver |
| 20:30.55 | lcuk | does it do same in normal cpu mode |
| 20:30.57 | l7 | watchdog cos? |
| 20:31.14 | l7 | i guess i'd have to do some more tests |
| 20:31.27 | l7 | i think it did also crash in normal cpu mode |
| 20:31.48 | l7 | the trick is getting the right combination of events that will replicate the bug consistantly right? |
| 20:32.02 | l7 | also, something else weird happened |
| 20:32.20 | l7 | i was running from an SD card |
| 20:32.41 | l7 | but it rebooted into flash when i didn't hit the menu key in time |
| 20:33.12 | l7 | but the boot sequence got stuck in the middle of booting from flash and the machine shut down |
| 20:33.51 | l7 | booting from sd worked fine afterwards, but it's an interesting bug that i haven't seen before |
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| 20:37.38 | l7 | hmm, i tried downloading a video from links, opening a tab in roxterm and launching mplayer |
| 20:37.41 | l7 | no crash this time |
| 20:38.01 | *** join/#maemo lbt (n=david@78.32.229.233) |
| 20:38.07 | l7 | i think it tends to crash more if there's some uptime on the system |
| 20:38.55 | l7 | maybe some kind of combination of memory lost from memory leaks or whatever contributes to instability |
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| 20:44.30 | lardman | yay! Australia are beating the Ba-bas :) |
| 20:45.09 | qwerty12_N800 | Go on you Aussies! :) |
| 20:46.15 | lardman | ~curse Sky for having the rights to lots of rugby matches |
| 20:46.16 | infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, Sky for having the rights to lots of rugby matches ! |
| 20:46.52 | qwerty12_N800 | No Sky Sports for you either? :( |
| 20:47.03 | lardman | X-Fade: what's wrong with you? |
| 20:47.14 | l7 | hmm osso_startup_greeting is a neat command to play with |
| 20:47.15 | lardman | qwerty12_N800: no chance, credit crunch an all ;) |
| 20:47.24 | l7 | maybe handy if you're testing startup themes |
| 20:47.35 | qwerty12_N800 | lardman, hah |
| 20:47.46 | lardman | qwerty12_N800: but mainly as I'd prefer to do stuff rather than have to sit in front of TV to get my money's worth |
| 20:47.58 | X-Fade | lardman: Yeah, some virus or whatever. Been in bed for 2 days now. |
| 20:48.00 | qwerty12_N800 | lardman, bittorrent is my sky box office :) |
| 20:48.14 | lardman | X-Fade: oh, sorry to hear that, get well soon |
| 20:48.36 | lardman | qwerty12_N800: yeah, I'll be looking out on emule for that rugby match in another hour or so |
| 20:49.04 | X-Fade | lardman: I'll survive ;) |
| 20:49.17 | qwerty12_N800 | lardman, hehe, the queues on ed2k put me off... #4210... |
| 20:49.54 | qwerty12_N800 | + I miss Razorback (the original) :( |
| 20:51.22 | lardman | I want to watch 24, DVD seems pretty dear still |
| 20:51.30 | lardman | has never seen any of it |
| 20:55.46 | derf | It's highlarious. |
| 20:56.24 | lardman | not worth watching then? |
| 20:56.34 | derf | It's worth watching if you like comedies. |
| 20:56.42 | lardman | People do seem to talk about it a fair bit still, I should watch an hour or two at least |
| 20:57.01 | lardman | the 1st and last probably :) |
| 20:57.19 | *** join/#maemo eichi (n=eichi@p5B2023FD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:57.20 | derf | Nah, you'll spoil the Big Reveal. |
| 21:00.38 | *** part/#maemo Semilia (i=semi@xob.kapsi.fi) |
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| 21:01.57 | l7 | hmm, maybe it was the wlan driver |
| 21:02.20 | l7 | i tried opening a tab and opening mplayer while links was downloading a video file |
| 21:03.01 | l7 | and then the desktop crashed in a funny way, such that applications still worked, but could not be accessed after they were minimized |
| 21:03.14 | l7 | desktop still shows all your applets, but you can't load anything |
| 21:03.20 | l7 | and you can't ssh in either |
| 21:03.40 | RST38h | I bet something is taking all the CPU |
| 21:03.51 | l7 | trying to ping the tablet results in "Host is down" |
| 21:04.11 | l7 | well maybe... but i was still able to use roxterm |
| 21:04.24 | l7 | i couldn't get back to it after minimizing it though |
| 21:04.49 | l7 | i wonder if it's a problem with roxterm or links |
| 21:05.07 | l7 | i have noticed that downloading large files seems to tie up the processor |
| 21:05.57 | l7 | wget may leave your system slightly more usable while downloading |
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| 21:17.59 | Stskeeps | ooh. found out how to make python-jaiku send to a channel. |
| 21:19.35 | Proteous | lookout |
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| 21:21.46 | *** join/#maemo cowbellemoo (n=cowbelle@207.97.40.1) |
| 21:22.25 | cowbellemoo | Would this be the appropriate place to ask a support question or is it strictly a dev channel? |
| 21:25.40 | Stskeeps | cowbellemoo: .. it ranges |
| 21:26.07 | cowbellemoo | : / |
| 21:26.19 | Stskeeps | so just ask, if you get ignored, then noone either has an answer or wants to answer :) |
| 21:26.33 | cowbellemoo | mmmkay. |
| 21:27.04 | l7 | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:27.18 | l7 | this nice little USB stick is getting 8-9MB/s |
| 21:27.33 | l7 | quality seems to vary drastically though |
| 21:28.13 | Meiz_n810 | 17: wikipedia |
| 21:29.24 | l7 | Meiz_n810: which page / section? |
| 21:29.57 | cowbellemoo | I have MediaServ (with tablet-encode) set up to stream video. It works -- but only half the time. Once launching a video, I get "media file not found" errors from Media Player on my n810 even though I can see mencoder plugging along on the video file on my server. I thought it might be a filename or format glitch, but that doesn't seem to be the case after testing. Can anyone shed some light? |
| 21:30.11 | l7 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital_card#SDHC seems to have a link to hjreggel.net which is somewhat good |
| 21:30.18 | l7 | and a ton of other stuff that's not |
| 21:31.28 | Jaffa | cowbellemoo: you could try upping the thread timeout from 30s. Alternatively, is there a pattern of filenames? |
| 21:31.52 | Jaffa | Worst case, can you send me logs and stuff (andrew@bleb.org) |
| 21:32.45 | cowbellemoo | Jaffa: Not that I can tell. I can have a season of a show with uniform filenames, size, and format but have some stream and others not. |
| 21:33.19 | cowbellemoo | Jaffa: would the log be in .Mediaserv? |
| 21:33.23 | Jaffa | cowbellemoo: same stream intermiitently? |
| 21:33.37 | Jaffa | cowbellemoo: /tmp, IIRC. |
| 21:34.42 | *** join/#maemo netx (n=rlange@n1-26-67.dhcp.drexel.edu) |
| 21:34.48 | cowbellemoo | Jaffa: Not sure. I think only once when I've retried a stream has it gone through on 2nd attempt. Whenever I can start a stream, the file plays fine (no interruptions) |
| 21:34.58 | cowbellemoo | Jaffa: let me see if I can pull the log |
| 21:35.23 | Jaffa | cowbellemoo: might have to be via mail - bed soon |
| 21:38.52 | cowbellemoo | Jaffa: I'll try the timeout option and look through the log (didn't know it kept one!) on my own for now, but thanks for pointing me in the right direction. |
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| 22:00.52 | winston_ | hi, does anyone have a guess when the successor to the n810 will be in stores? |
| 22:01.16 | GeneralAntilles | winston_, total guesswork: Summer 2009. |
| 22:02.27 | Scumgrief_ | Oh Hi general - I know you from the ITT forums |
| 22:03.08 | GeneralAntilles | I'm everywhere. :P |
| 22:03.32 | Scumgrief_ | I really don't think there is a device better suited for me than the n810, for its like a low power linux pocket machine |
| 22:03.44 | Scumgrief_ | as it seems you are everywhere =P |
| 22:04.55 | `0660 | i don't think he ever sleeps |
| 22:05.12 | Scumgrief_ | would you recommend a go everywhere machine the size of the n810 or smaller that is linux based other than the n810? |
| 22:05.20 | GeneralAntilles | `0660, not this evening, anyway. <_< |
| 22:05.20 | Scumgrief_ | yeah, he seems to not sleep |
| 22:05.46 | *** join/#maemo crashanddie_ (n=crashand@SecuraBit/listener/crashanddie) |
| 22:06.20 | GeneralAntilles | updates wiki pages and triages some bugs. |
| 22:06.34 | `0660 | Scumgrief_, i think it depends |
| 22:06.56 | `0660 | the smaller the device is, the more portable it is. in the other hand, the smalle the device is, the more limited it is |
| 22:07.05 | Scumgrief_ | like the size of the n810 |
| 22:07.11 | Scumgrief_ | i mean pocktable |
| 22:07.27 | `0660 | it's big compared to mobile phone, and small compared to a netbook |
| 22:07.32 | `0660 | very small |
| 22:08.17 | Scumgrief_ | yeah, I did have an EEE PC but that was too limiting, i couldn't run it off batt very long, nor could I use it on the go |
| 22:08.30 | Scumgrief_ | a netbook i will get when I get a job lol |
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| 22:09.23 | *** part/#maemo cowbellemoo (n=cowbelle@207.97.40.1) |
| 22:12.15 | `0660 | i think mobile phone, internet tablet, netbook, and desktop all have their own slot to fill |
| 22:12.56 | Scumgrief_ | yeah, i agree. |
| 22:19.33 | *** join/#maemo efleury (n=fleury@200.184.118.130) |
| 22:31.36 | Proteous | I want a mobile phone + internet tablet device combo that doesn't suck |
| 22:32.02 | *** join/#maemo florian (n=fuchs@f054165011.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:32.04 | Proteous | er, combo device, not device combo |
| 22:32.14 | qwerty12_N800 | 3310 + 770 = the shit |
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| 22:34.40 | `0660 | Proteous, who knows, n900 might be able to make calls :) |
| 22:35.53 | Proteous | I'm sorta lusting after the new n97 |
| 22:36.05 | GeneralAntilles | VoIP, surely. |
| 22:36.07 | Proteous | could be cool or could suck |
| 22:36.11 | GeneralAntilles | But definitely not cellular voice. |
| 22:36.27 | Proteous | not sure if it will ever make it to the states though... |
| 22:36.33 | `0660 | i guess voip might actually work ok |
| 22:36.38 | Proteous | heh |
| 22:36.54 | `0660 | because of the 3g stack... |
| 22:37.14 | qwerty12_N800 | Proteous, probably would on t-mobile or at&t |
| 22:37.19 | Proteous | right now I pair up my n810 with my pantech c150 which works well but it's a lot to carry around |
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| 22:39.30 | disco_stu | wow the n97 i sooo cool |
| 22:39.50 | Proteous | I like that the screen is at least somewhat high rez |
| 22:40.25 | Proteous | need to be able to fit more then 3 lines of an ssh session on there for it to be a usefull device to me :) |
| 22:40.31 | Stskeeps | what century are you in that 640x350(sp) is high res? :P |
| 22:40.45 | Proteous | for a phone it's not bad |
| 22:41.02 | Proteous | it's not 800x480 like my n810 but that's okay, it's a narrower device |
| 22:41.17 | disco_stu | well in real use it doesn perform like in the nokia demo |
| 22:41.40 | Proteous | there are some hands on videos |
| 22:41.57 | disco_stu | yeah, i just saw them |
| 22:43.36 | disco_stu | the ui is slow |
| 22:43.42 | disco_stu | and buggy |
| 22:44.45 | `0660 | i thought they still ahd 6 months to fix bugs? |
| 22:44.47 | `0660 | had |
| 22:44.51 | Proteous | yeah |
| 22:44.52 | derf | disco_stu: You've just described every hand-held deivce ever. |
| 22:44.56 | Stskeeps | oh, that's an interesting hinge |
| 22:45.11 | disco_stu | derf: iphone is the opposite |
| 22:45.22 | disco_stu | and it is a handheld device |
| 22:45.26 | *** join/#maemo netx (n=rlange@n1-26-67.dhcp.drexel.edu) |
| 22:45.37 | Proteous | 640x350 is way better then the iphone 480x320 iphone screen |
| 22:45.56 | Proteous | er, -iphone#2 |
| 22:47.03 | solca | ping Stskeeps |
| 22:47.16 | Stskeeps | pong solca? |
| 22:47.52 | solca | Stskeeps: Hi, I have an idea about a new kind of installer and I would like to know what do you think about it |
| 22:48.10 | solca | and if it could be useful for your reconstructed stuff |
| 22:48.20 | Stskeeps | *nod* i'm all ears |
| 22:49.10 | solca | the thing is that I port the Android OS to my N810 using the omap head tree (2.6.28-rc6) |
| 22:49.19 | solca | and I even have WiFi working |
| 22:49.34 | woglinde | solca what are you porting kernel only? |
| 22:49.37 | solca | but everything works with this kernel |
| 22:49.53 | solca | woglinde: userspace too |
| 22:49.54 | Stskeeps | solca: oh, you're with those nth.. something people? |
| 22:50.03 | solca | Stskeeps: no |
| 22:50.06 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 22:50.10 | GeneralAntilles | is now hungry. |
| 22:50.11 | solca | I did it myself not knowing about them |
| 22:50.22 | Stskeeps | hehe, quite an effort then |
| 22:50.28 | solca | I read today in the forum that they did something similar |
| 22:50.33 | solca | but with 2.6.25 |
| 22:50.42 | woglinde | hm dont know how well fb will work on the nxx |
| 22:51.09 | solca | I try that way but was painful so I use the 2.6.27 android kernel branch and port it to 2.6.28 so Wifi works |
| 22:51.20 | l7 | hmm |
| 22:51.26 | solca | but I was wondering about a new kind of installer |
| 22:51.40 | solca | this is my idea, please correct me or comment about it: |
| 22:51.41 | disco_stu | GeneralAntilles: do you know if it is possible to modify behaviour of d-pad within the browser |
| 22:51.59 | GeneralAntilles | disco_stu, yes, there's a bug with a .deb that'll do it for you even. |
| 22:52.08 | derf | disco_stu: A quick Google suggests that your opinion of the iPhone is not unanimous: http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/08/07/18/iphone_3g_and_2_0_affected_by_buggy_software_sensors_wireless.html |
| 22:52.28 | solca | minimal kernel and minimal userspace based on my omap port for openwrt |
| 22:52.43 | GeneralAntilles | disco_stu, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2423 |
| 22:52.46 | solca | this kernel + userspace needs to fit in the 2MB kernel partition |
| 22:52.56 | GeneralAntilles | and with that, I am officially Maemoed-out for the day. . . . |
| 22:53.02 | solca | this kernel would be kexec capable |
| 22:53.28 | solca | and with a UI based on... let me find it... |
| 22:53.49 | disco_stu | GeneralAntilles: thanks Ryan |
| 22:53.50 | woglinde | solca hm klibc |
| 22:54.07 | solca | openwrt used uclibc |
| 22:54.37 | woglinde | kexec image in oe is klibc based |
| 22:55.05 | Stskeeps | solca: so basically a glorified bootloader i guess? |
| 22:55.36 | Stskeeps | (have you had kexec work, btw?) |
| 22:55.39 | solca | woglinde: kexec is a kernel feature + userspace that talks to the kernel via /proc |
| 22:55.55 | woglinde | solca yes |
| 22:55.56 | solca | can't find the UI url |
| 22:56.36 | woglinde | the goal of the kexec image is that you can choose your kernel from either internal flash or sd card or whatever devices you have |
| 22:56.38 | solca | the thing is that this UI is used for a bootselector in the playstation 3 with openwrt for PS3 |
| 22:56.45 | solca | woglinde: exactly! |
| 22:56.55 | woglinde | yepp |
| 22:56.55 | solca | and this UI is very nice |
| 22:57.10 | solca | even it detects bootable images from usb when connected |
| 22:57.16 | solca | and reacts apropriately |
| 22:57.30 | solca | so I was thinking about doing this for my android port |
| 22:57.42 | solca | and can be useful for the maemo reconstructed and deblet too |
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| 22:58.16 | Stskeeps | this something you could see being multi-platform, too? |
| 22:58.16 | solca | so one can choose which partition boot |
| 22:58.27 | woglinde | jeep sounds nice |
| 22:58.33 | woglinde | and do not touches the bootloader |
| 22:58.35 | solca | in this way one could boot to the normal maemo, or to deblet or whatever |
| 22:58.44 | Stskeeps | solca: http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/petitboot/ ? |
| 22:58.47 | solca | it just touch the kernel particion |
| 22:58.58 | solca | exactly |
| 22:59.05 | solca | but modified for the N810 |
| 22:59.17 | woglinde | shouldnt be this hard |
| 22:59.30 | Stskeeps | solca: can i ask again, have you had kexec working on n810? |
| 22:59.55 | solca | I have it my running kernel but I didnt try it |
| 23:00.11 | solca | is there something I should know about it? |
| 23:00.24 | Stskeeps | alright, guess it's worth looking into, - i've heard of some problems getting it to work but it might have changed in newer kernels |
| 23:01.11 | solca | the "bootselector" could be any kernel as long as it can read from storage and boot the other kernels |
| 23:01.38 | solca | but now that you mention in I'll take a look |
| 23:01.53 | solca | so what do you guys think about this plan? |
| 23:02.38 | solca | the hard part is fit everything in 2MB |
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| 23:03.18 | woglinde | solca not really |
| 23:03.19 | Stskeeps | well. in my new, if we have to do it "right", it shouldn't be limited to n8x0 platforms. as in, it should be possible to port it to x86, other armel devices etc |
| 23:03.27 | woglinde | using klibc or dietlibc it should work |
| 23:03.33 | Stskeeps | new=view |
| 23:03.37 | woglinde | with ugly curses interface |
| 23:04.25 | woglinde | Stskeeps in openembedded some guys working on it with klibc for the zaurii |
| 23:04.25 | Stskeeps | solca: and there should be elements of rescue menu stuff in it |
| 23:04.44 | solca | Stskeeps: like the deblet rescue menu? |
| 23:05.13 | solca | must say that he loves the deblet rescue menu |
| 23:05.44 | solca | it help me a lot when I was figuring out how all the stuff was structured |
| 23:05.46 | Stskeeps | kinda like that, but in terms of restoring images from mmc, / exposing internal flash to USB, etc |
| 23:05.59 | Stskeeps | maybe boot options for OS'es |
| 23:06.04 | woglinde | if there is place |
| 23:06.08 | Stskeeps | yeah :P |
| 23:06.12 | woglinde | the image should contain ubifs stuff |
| 23:06.21 | woglinde | that would be nice |
| 23:06.22 | solca | Stskeeps: the nice thing is that at least for me wifi works reliably with the new driver |
| 23:06.47 | woglinde | solca is wpa_suplicant working now? |
| 23:06.47 | solca | woglinde: I was using it (ubifs) but its very hard to make a partition image |
| 23:06.53 | solca | woglinde: yes |
| 23:06.57 | woglinde | ah cool |
| 23:07.18 | Stskeeps | solca: you did look into Mer i presume? |
| 23:07.30 | solca | yes I have a very early tar installed |
| 23:07.31 | woglinde | so you could set all the cool stuffup with guessnet if/up down and wpa_suplicant |
| 23:08.30 | solca | Stskeeps: I have it installed but I lost a month with android |
| 23:08.52 | solca | Stskeeps: but it is very nice and I think it could benefit from a bootselector and installer like this |
| 23:08.54 | Stskeeps | solca: alright - well, if you would like to, try to make a writeup for a "boot selector"/rescue/device behaviour thing in http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint#Appendixes , and how you would like to see a distribution-agnostic "init phase" |
| 23:09.06 | Stskeeps | just make a section calling it "Draft" |
| 23:09.29 | woglinde | solca hm why is it so hard with ubifs? |
| 23:09.36 | Stskeeps | there's a draft on system architecture already, you may draw some ideas from there |
| 23:10.18 | solca | Stskeeps: I write too a maemo initilizer script which runs all the proprietary stuff too |
| 23:10.29 | woglinde | hahah |
| 23:10.30 | woglinde | UBIFS is a new flash file system developed by Nokia engineers |
| 23:10.43 | woglinde | so fremantle must have ubifs on internal flash |
| 23:10.43 | Stskeeps | heh, didn't know that |
| 23:10.53 | woglinde | otherwise |
| 23:11.10 | solca | woglinde: I didnt try to hard to make it work but there is the ubifs and another layer to make it work |
| 23:11.14 | Stskeeps | woglinde: do consider they also have a openwrt-home gateway thing |
| 23:12.14 | woglinde | reading the ubifs site right now |
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| 23:12.41 | Stskeeps | solca: and if you have some ideas on how vendors could support multiple distributions and aiding this part, it's also interesting |
| 23:13.08 | Stskeeps | it is kinda nice to show a device you can show booting android if you want, mer/hildon if you want, ubuntu mobile, .. windows 3.11 |
| 23:13.11 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 23:14.15 | solca | Stskeeps: exactly that would be nice |
| 23:14.37 | solca | here it is the proprietary laucher I wrote for android |
| 23:14.38 | Stskeeps | Mer/Reconstructured is not only for the distribution, but also making a foundation for tablet like devices |
| 23:14.45 | solca | but could be useful for other things |
| 23:14.50 | solca | http://guug.org/nitboot.txt |
| 23:15.05 | solca | its basic now but can be improved |
| 23:15.26 | Stskeeps | yeah, looks similar to what initfs does |
| 23:15.42 | solca | the idea is to not boot to initfs |
| 23:15.56 | Stskeeps | yeah, i know, it's more of an initrd like system |
| 23:16.07 | Stskeeps | solca: you're missing out on dyntick stuff btw |
| 23:16.15 | Stskeeps | in that script |
| 23:16.40 | solca | Stskeeps: yea, because android do it in it's init part |
| 23:16.49 | Stskeeps | ah |
| 23:16.54 | solca | but can be added to and not do it in android |
| 23:17.39 | solca | so I was thinking about using this "boot selector" as installer too |
| 23:17.46 | Stskeeps | you have jaiku per chance? (if not, msg me your e-mail and you'll get an invite.), that way you can track the development of Mer, which may have implications for you too |
| 23:18.04 | Stskeeps | for imaging purposes or? |
| 23:18.32 | solca | my idea was embedd a minimal initramfs with the kernel and flash it to the "kernel" partition |
| 23:18.58 | solca | and this initramfs ideally use the petitboot and could install deblet, android maemo-recontructed etc |
| 23:19.09 | solca | the limiting part is the 2MB in the partition |
| 23:19.28 | woglinde | solca 2mb is lot of space |
| 23:19.30 | solca | Stskeeps: my email is solca@guug.org |
| 23:19.57 | Stskeeps | invited |
| 23:19.58 | solca | woglinde: depends: my playstation3 have 8MB so petitboot have a lot of space |
| 23:20.02 | solca | Stskeeps: thank you |
| 23:20.27 | solca | woglinde: but my WRT54GL have just 4MB and I have a WRT54G which just have 2MB |
| 23:20.29 | Stskeeps | solca: well. noone says we can't use a initfs in some generic fashion, even if it would switch between kernels |
| 23:21.16 | solca | Stskeeps: for having more space so you say? |
| 23:21.20 | Stskeeps | yeah |
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| 23:21.32 | solca | Stskeeps: but where? |
| 23:21.53 | solca | I dont want to touch initfs and rootfs |
| 23:22.19 | Stskeeps | well. i guess i have the luxury of being able to ignore old time stuff |
| 23:22.21 | solca | and one bootselector installer for rule them all |
| 23:22.45 | solca | all the projects (deblet,android,maemor) |
| 23:23.03 | solca | Stskeeps: well normal people want to swithc between oses |
| 23:23.08 | Stskeeps | yeah, obviously |
| 23:23.38 | Stskeeps | so, if i looked at it cynically, having a kexec capable kernel, a bootmenu initfs that could do kexec, would do similar things? |
| 23:24.39 | solca | Stskeeps: I presume |
| 23:25.02 | solca | my idea was not touch initfs and rootfs because there already is the proprietary software |
| 23:25.30 | solca | so with the nitboot script I could launch that software without distributing it |
| 23:25.38 | Stskeeps | *nod* |
| 23:25.39 | solca | and not violationg some EULA |
| 23:25.50 | Stskeeps | well, things might change a bit eventually regarding remixing and "variants" |
| 23:26.20 | solca | Stskeeps: but ideally if I could rewrite initfs that would be owesome |
| 23:26.28 | Stskeeps | i'm mostly talking from point of view that we can break down any walls we want, as we are building the "new" platfor |
| 23:26.31 | Stskeeps | m |
| 23:27.35 | solca | do you redistribute proprietary stuff with deblet? |
| 23:27.48 | Stskeeps | nop |
| 23:28.37 | Stskeeps | we do two tricks: 1) we don't distribute any images of installed deblet 2) deblet is entirely bootstrapped and everything on tablet 3) we retrieve some blobs in same manner as a SSU would |
| 23:28.46 | solca | good, but the new wifi driver needs a proprietary tool that is not even distributed with diablo right now |
| 23:28.48 | Stskeeps | (by apt. and authenticating our model number) |
| 23:28.55 | Stskeeps | oh, i have a creative script for that.. |
| 23:28.55 | Stskeeps | sc |
| 23:29.04 | solca | Stskeeps: excellent |
| 23:29.22 | Stskeeps | http://trac.tspre.org/svn/deblet/trunk/packages/non-free/stlc45xx-cal/debian/postinst |
| 23:30.18 | solca | Stskeeps: hmm thats the kind of stuff that I don't like but I think it is necessary |
| 23:30.21 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 23:30.22 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 23:30.30 | Stskeeps | (don't edit this so the user invisibly answers yes, it is better to keep nokia happy in terms of binary blobs.) |
| 23:31.13 | Scumgrief_ | wifi driver on maemo for n810 is propietary? |
| 23:31.37 | solca | Stskeeps: congrats, clever script I must say |
| 23:31.49 | solca | Stskeeps: can I use it in the Android port? |
| 23:32.05 | derf | Scumgrief_: Do you know of a wifi driver that _doesn't_ contain a binary blob? |
| 23:32.14 | Stskeeps | solca: go ahead, my only "demand"/wish is that you ask the user to agree to this license |
| 23:32.20 | Scumgrief_ | derf: I wish |
| 23:32.22 | woglinde | derf in whole or for maemo? |
| 23:32.31 | derf | woglinde: Yes. |
| 23:32.40 | woglinde | ??? |
| 23:32.56 | woglinde | madwifi and athereos are now without bin blob |
| 23:33.02 | derf | Really? |
| 23:33.12 | Scumgrief_ | i could say that lol |
| 23:33.19 | derf | (also, why are those two separate things?) |
| 23:33.43 | Scumgrief_ | derf: different authors i think.. |
| 23:33.49 | woglinde | derf history |
| 23:33.53 | woglinde | madwifi was the frist |
| 23:33.54 | derf | I had an atheros card 2~3 years ago... it worked for about 15 minutes, and then never again. |
| 23:34.10 | woglinde | then atheros vendor hires a driver hacker |
| 23:34.10 | solca | Stskeeps: so does deblet or maemo-r have a special req for the kernel? |
| 23:34.15 | derf | I tried getting into the driver to figure out why, but gave up. |
| 23:34.23 | woglinde | and now the open up the bin blob too |
| 23:34.26 | Stskeeps | solca: nada right now |
| 23:34.48 | Stskeeps | solca: my focus is on Mer these days. deblet is hard to make sane wrt power saving |
| 23:34.54 | derf | Now I just make sure not to buy machines with Atheros cards. |
| 23:35.37 | solca | Stskeeps: yea, I would like to help a lot with mer but I'm busy with android but |
| 23:35.47 | solca | we can benefit for an improved installer/bootselector |
| 23:36.02 | Stskeeps | solca: yeah.. as said before, initial device initialization is a field we can cooperate on |
| 23:36.17 | Stskeeps | we don't want reboot loops in either mer or android, obviously :P |
| 23:36.34 | solca | yea :) |
| 23:37.17 | solca | Stskeeps: ok so I'll work on this stuff and will ping you when I have something |
| 23:37.21 | Stskeeps | also, mer's focus is not just on n8x0/770/n900, we look towards how it's possible to make maemo more of a generic platform |
| 23:37.23 | solca | hopefully this weekend |
| 23:37.26 | Stskeeps | so it's worth thinking that into |
| 23:37.35 | Stskeeps | alright. #reconstructedPOC on jaiku is what we do |
| 23:38.23 | solca | Stskeeps: excellent, I will port petitboot and try kexecing a kernel and when that works |
| 23:38.29 | Stskeeps | *nod* |
| 23:38.40 | solca | I'll ping you so we can cooperate in the installing/initiliazing stuff |
| 23:38.44 | Stskeeps | ponders how maemo would be like on a PS3.. |
| 23:38.44 | Stskeeps | :P |
| 23:39.00 | solca | Stskeeps: that would be very insteresting! |
| 23:39.22 | GeneralAntilles | Crazy fast? |
| 23:39.38 | Stskeeps | cell-accelerated? :P |
| 23:40.04 | solca | Stskeeps: well if something can benefit from vector processing, sure |
| 23:40.21 | lcuk | if maemo was on a cell processor we would still not have access to most of the cores |
| 23:40.31 | solca | Stskeeps: but in general maemo on the ps3 would be very nice |
| 23:40.53 | lcuk | solca, wouldnt it get a bit tiring carrying around a ps3 and a screen? |
| 23:41.10 | GeneralAntilles | lcuk, home theater. . . . |
| 23:41.19 | solca | lcuk: why? the linux port uses all cores except one |
| 23:41.33 | solca | lcuk: :) yea that would be tiring... |
| 23:41.50 | lcuk | solca, we cannot use all cores on the current processor, what makes you tihnk the cell will be any different :P |
| 23:42.20 | solca | lcuk: define what you mean about current processor |
| 23:43.12 | lcuk | omap2420 |
| 23:43.57 | lcuk | ofc.. |
| 23:43.57 | GeneralAntilles | lcuk, stop being silly. <_< |
| 23:43.57 | Stskeeps | alright, i'm off to bed |
| 23:43.57 | Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: i still want to see maemo on a wii.. :P |
| 23:43.57 | GeneralAntilles | lcuk, the two things aren't even vaguely analogous. |
| 23:43.59 | solca | Stskeeps: then we could port maemo-r to the iphone when the kernel matures a bit too ;) |
| 23:44.37 | lcuk | reaffirms his sarcasm tag :P:P:P ^ |
| 23:44.55 | GeneralAntilles | Text fails at sarcasm. :P |
| 23:45.02 | Stskeeps | solca: for good measure we call maemo-r proof of concept mer, as it's not maemo and there's trademark issues :) |
| 23:45.05 | Stskeeps | bbl |
| 23:45.30 | solca | oh |
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