IRC log for #maemo on 20080421

`00:00.01`	`GeneralAntilles`	`AStorm, the help is incredibly excellent`
`00:00.07`	`GeneralAntilles`	`and available online.`
`00:00.14`	`AStorm`	`wheee`
`00:00.22`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: "from somewhere"`
`00:00.24`	`AStorm`	`thanks`
`00:00.31`	`AStorm`	`esp. none are relevant for Poland`
`00:00.39`	`GeneralAntilles`	`None of what?`
`00:00.44`	`AStorm`	`routes and sites`
`00:00.50`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Open Street, Google, Microsoft, or Yahoo?`
`00:00.52`	`GeneralAntilles`	`None work?`
`00:00.57`	`AStorm`	`maps do works`
`00:01.01`	`AStorm`	`*work, routes don't`
`00:01.14`	`AStorm`	`esp. voice nav. doesn't work :>`
`00:01.23`	`GeneralAntilles`	`flite not set up for that? :P`
`00:01.25`	`unixSnob`	`is maemo mapper free (as in free beer)?`
`00:01.47`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: I have flite, doesn't work still`
`00:01.49`	`AStorm`	`unixSnob: yep`
`00:01.58`	`unixSnob`	`nice`
`00:02.07`	`AStorm`	`ofc. the maps are non-commercial, except (quite poor) Open Street`
`00:02.21`	`unixSnob`	`i'm glad the free one will work w/ google maps`
`00:02.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's free as in everything.`
`00:03.13`	`GeneralAntilles`	`The guy who wrote it goes by gnuite. ;)`
`00:03.21`	`*** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa)`
`00:03.33`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: so how do I set up that voice nav. and where do I get POI db for Poland? :-)`
`00:03.53`	`GeneralAntilles`	`You just install flite.`
`00:04.03`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: I have that, still no voice nav.`
`00:04.05`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`00:04.16`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Did you download a route?`
`00:04.24`	`unixSnob`	`ok, so if the navicore product is a different beast, what does it do that mapper doesn't?`
`00:04.26`	`AStorm`	`where?`
`00:04.34`	`AStorm`	`unixSnob: it has paid maps`
`00:04.37`	`AStorm`	`;P`
`00:04.42`	`GeneralAntilles`	`From one of the map repositories.`
`00:04.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Google/Yahoo/Microsoft/Open Street`
`00:04.55`	`AStorm`	`...`
`00:05.10`	`AStorm`	`can't I make one myself?`
`00:05.11`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Or something else if you have something else.`
`00:05.18`	`AStorm`	`make maemo mapper autofit to roads?`
`00:05.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It'll load GPX routes.`
`00:05.21`	`unixSnob`	`IOW, it offers teleatlas maps - is that the only significant difference?`
`00:05.30`	`unixSnob`	`Guess mapper is what i'm after`
`00:05.32`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Erm, they're just bitmaps.`
`00:05.49`	`GeneralAntilles`	`"Map" is like a traditional GPS navigation unit.`
`00:05.56`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: hmmhmm`
`00:05.59`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Maemo Mapper is like a supercharged Google Local`
`00:06.14`	`AStorm`	`the problem is, how do I set such a route?`
`00:06.33`	`AStorm`	`argh, what I feared most`
`00:06.37`	`GeneralAntilles`	`You could do it with Google Earth`
`00:06.50`	`GeneralAntilles`	`There isn't a single mapping site that provides maps for Poland, though?`
`00:06.57`	`AStorm`	`which totally fails for Poland :>`
`00:07.19`	`AStorm`	`it fails to find some of the streets`
`00:07.37`	`AStorm`	`even quite major`
`00:08.18`	`KotCzarny`	`hmm`
`00:08.23`	`KotCzarny`	`i think google maps works quite well`
`00:08.27`	`KotCzarny`	`and openmaps too`
`00:08.36`	`KotCzarny`	`at least for bigger cities`
`00:08.41`	`AStorm`	`maps, sure`
`00:08.45`	`AStorm`	`route planning, uhm, no`
`00:08.52`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:09.00`	`KotCzarny`	`i wouldn't trust gps anyway`
`00:09.14`	`AStorm`	`it's useful as a guide`
`00:09.45`	`AStorm`	`there's a problem with Google Earth`
`00:09.49`	`AStorm`	`it's for Windows :P`
`00:09.58`	`AStorm`	`ah, no, 4.3 is for Linux too`
`00:10.17`	`AStorm`	`does the free version have .GPX support?`
`00:10.26`	`KotCzarny`	`google earth requires 3d accel`
`00:10.26`	`KotCzarny`	`:>`
`00:11.14`	`AStorm`	`I have that`
`00:11.19`	`KotCzarny`	`on n8x0 ?`
`00:11.20`	`KotCzarny`	`O.o`
`00:11.22`	`AStorm`	`the problem is twofold`
`00:11.26`	`AStorm`	`not on n8x0`
`00:11.30`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:11.44`	`AStorm`	`so, loses`
`00:11.49`	`AStorm`	`anyway`
`00:11.52`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:11.57`	`*** join/#maemo christefano (n=christef@ppp-71-129-22-20.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net)`
`00:12.00`	`AStorm`	`we need real GPS apps`
`00:13.13`	`*** join/#maemo luizirber (n=lc@200-180-180-12.paemt706.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br)`
`00:14.17`	`unixSnob`	`is the navicore app fully functional on the stock n810?`
`00:14.31`	`KotCzarny`	`trial`
`00:14.32`	`GeneralAntilles`	`If you register it.`
`00:14.42`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It works fine as a "Map" unregistered.`
`00:14.47`	`GeneralAntilles`	`But there's no navigation.`
`00:14.58`	`unixSnob`	`wow, all that extra expense for the n810.. and i thought that was for gps functionality`
`00:15.07`	`GeneralAntilles`	`No, it's for expensive hardware.`
`00:15.11`	`KotCzarny`	`just install maemo-mapper`
`00:15.12`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:15.16`	`unixSnob`	`s/gps/navigation/`
`00:15.43`	`unixSnob`	`i will.. i have the n800, btw`
`00:15.56`	`KotCzarny`	`hehe`
`00:16.30`	`unixSnob`	`The only benefit to navicore seems to be Teleatlas maps - and that's a shortcoming from my standpoint (teleatlas screwed up the local maps where i am)`
`00:17.18`	`unixSnob`	`teleatlas maps are better in europe, from what I understand`
`00:17.32`	`unixSnob`	`and navteq is better in the US`
`00:17.49`	`KotCzarny`	`as most of the global apps`
`00:19.53`	`AStorm`	`and none are better in Poland, which is mapped worse than Russia, even`
`00:19.54`	`AStorm`	`:/`
`00:20.07`	`KotCzarny`	`russia is bigger`
`00:20.09`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:20.34`	`KotCzarny`	`astorm, maybe you can snatch some maps from pilot.pl or something?`
`00:20.45`	`KotCzarny`	`ie. figure out the proper link and maybe it will work?`
`00:20.56`	`unixSnob`	`interesting that maps would be lousy in poland.. from what I understand, the roads don't change much in most of europe - meaning they just need to get it right once`
`00:21.14`	`KotCzarny`	`unixsnob: someone has to do it`
`00:21.18`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: actually, google maps are mostly ok`
`00:21.27`	`AStorm`	`the problem is.... lack of navigation :-)`
`00:21.28`	`KotCzarny`	`and once someone does he wants money for it`
`00:21.29`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:21.40`	`*** join/#maemo cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo)`
`00:21.56`	`KotCzarny`	`hmm, i don't know, /me checks something`
`00:25.02`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: I would pay, but not for navicore lack of maps`
`00:25.03`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`00:25.13`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:27.42`	`unixSnob`	`AStorm: you can always migrate away from poland, and return when the maps are right`
`00:27.57`	`KotCzarny`	`astorm: ve street maps are quite ok`
`00:27.59`	`*** join/#maemo jnettlet (n=jnettlet@218.104.123.129)`
`00:28.00`	`AStorm`	`that means "when Poland is a prosperous country"`
`00:28.12`	`KotCzarny`	`that means 'then there's no more poland'`
`00:28.13`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:28.17`	`AStorm`	`which also means "When Hell freezes over"`
`00:28.17`	`KotCzarny`	`*when`
`00:28.23`	`AStorm`	`:-)`
`00:28.39`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: maps are ok, lack of navigation isn't`
`00:28.58`	`KotCzarny`	`you can always plan using a paint program`
`00:28.59`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:29.30`	`unixSnob`	`AStorm: what do you mean? why would you not be able to navigate?`
`00:30.00`	`AStorm`	`unixSnob: because maemo mapper has no real route data`
`00:30.06`	`AStorm`	`:-)`
`00:30.09`	`*** join/#maemo ImMelody (n=Melody_L@ool-457709f8.dyn.optonline.net)`
`00:30.21`	`AStorm`	`I could plan a route myself, but that is an extremely painful process :P`
`00:30.30`	`AStorm`	`and time consuming`
`00:30.30`	`ImMelody`	`Is there a good/reliable way to run a OS2008 scratchbox from windows?`
`00:30.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`AStorm, does Google, etc not provide routing AT ALL for Poland?`
`00:30.43`	`AStorm`	`ImMelody: using vmware and Nokia image`
`00:30.51`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: it does provide "some" routing`
`00:31.01`	`AStorm`	`but is missing a lot of streets, even in major cities`
`00:31.10`	`AStorm`	`(from routing, not from maps)`
`00:31.34`	`unixSnob`	`interesting.. so some streets appear on the map, but they're not part of the vector graphic?`
`00:31.37`	`ImMelody`	`a free good/reliable way*`
`00:31.45`	`KotCzarny`	`yup`
`00:31.51`	`KotCzarny`	`immelody: vmware image`
`00:31.58`	`KotCzarny`	`os independent`
`00:32.12`	`ImMelody`	`I was under the impression vmware cost money.. Am I wrong? XD`
`00:32.17`	`KotCzarny`	`yup`
`00:32.25`	`KotCzarny`	`vmware player is free for personal use`
`00:32.33`	`ImMelody`	`oh ok`
`00:32.47`	`GeneralAntilles`	`unixSnob, there are no vector maps involved in any of the web-mapping stuff.`
`00:32.50`	`KotCzarny`	`but you should learn linux anyway`
`00:33.03`	`KotCzarny`	`because that's what is used on tablet`
`00:33.04`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:33.23`	`ImMelody`	`I know linux, but I don't feel like asking my husband for another computer to put it on, and I really don't want to dualboot :P`
`00:33.31`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:33.39`	`KotCzarny`	`add second drive`
`00:33.49`	`KotCzarny`	`even usb one will do`
`00:33.56`	`unixSnob`	`how does it work then? w/out a vector map, I'm not sure how a route could be computed`
`00:34.03`	`KotCzarny`	`as most of the pcs can boot from usb nowadays`
`00:34.40`	`KotCzarny`	`unixsnob: i guess there are some pre-programmed routes`
`00:34.49`	`KotCzarny`	`otherwise it's a salesman dillema`
`00:34.50`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`00:35.08`	`KotCzarny`	`and that's where all nav apps could go lacking`
`00:35.12`	`AStorm`	`yup`
`00:35.32`	`AStorm`	`actually, they could autodetect possible routes automatically using gfx map`
`00:35.43`	`KotCzarny`	`but that could go wrong`
`00:35.44`	`AStorm`	`and some smart algorithm, like A*`
`00:35.46`	`KotCzarny`	`terribly wrong`
`00:35.47`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`00:35.54`	`AStorm`	`why terribly? one-way?`
`00:36.03`	`AStorm`	`no problem with that ;P`
`00:36.19`	`KotCzarny`	`hey, there's a bridge with 2m of the light!`
`00:36.25`	`KotCzarny`	`or very narrow`
`00:36.27`	`lcuk`	`http://kotaku.com/381802/two-brothers-meditating-upon-questions-of-pac+man`
`00:36.29`	`KotCzarny`	`or closed`
`00:36.33`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: yes, that happens`
`00:36.47`	`AStorm`	`that's why GPS is only a guide`
`00:37.01`	`AStorm`	`if you find a problem, you go around it, not INTO it, like some idiot`
`00:37.14`	`KotCzarny`	`lcuk: heh`
`00:37.17`	`lcuk`	`salesman dilemma with only 1 root though`
`00:37.30`	`KotCzarny`	`pacman operates on pure energy`
`00:37.34`	`lcuk`	`if you add alternative expected stopoffs it becomes more difficult`
`00:37.40`	`KotCzarny`	`and energy is very.. what's the word?`
`00:37.41`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:38.17`	`KotCzarny`	`diluted`
`00:38.18`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:38.24`	`lcuk`	`you start at the destination and throw outwards until you hit the destination. give each a TTL and you are rocking`
`00:38.46`	`lcuk`	`add extra weight to the larger routes..`
`00:38.51`	`lcuk`	`its not a tough problem`
`00:39.01`	`KotCzarny`	`hmm`
`00:39.02`	`ImMelody`	`Figures. I can't download VMWare right now =\`
`00:39.07`	`lcuk`	`though you may find examples where it goes wrong`
`00:39.16`	`KotCzarny`	`then it should be possible to write an algo to operate on bitmap maps`
`00:39.24`	`lcuk`	`ie being routed across the continent before coming back`
`00:39.40`	`lcuk`	`not really, using vectors you have priority`
`00:39.52`	`lcuk`	`with bitmaps you would be screwed by resolution`
`00:40.04`	`KotCzarny`	`but with maemo-mapper you have bitmaps`
`00:40.04`	`unixSnob`	`well it's an unsolved problem from what I understand. There's infinite possibilities. So an algorithm necessarily will overlook paths - possibly the best path`
`00:40.45`	`lcuk`	`unixSnob, its an evolving function. if a path is missed at first it can be updated and it will be usable by people in future`
`00:40.55`	`*** join/#maemo eton_ (n=eton@ppp-58-8-2-12.revip2.asianet.co.th)`
`00:41.18`	`lcuk`	`if a new motorway opens up it can be added quickly and all old functional routes become redundent unless you throw in traffic to the weighting`
`00:41.27`	`GeneralAntilles`	`unixSnob, there's a database and routing algorithm.`
`00:42.32`	`lcuk`	`the problem i see with gps mapping is out of date vectors ie sending big lorries through small towns`
`00:42.56`	`KotCzarny`	`sometimes longer route is faster`
`00:42.58`	`lcuk`	`using a one size fits all lookup means that it will send a small person on a motorbike along the motorway`
`00:43.04`	`KotCzarny`	`because of speed/quality`
`00:43.05`	`*** join/#maemo greentux (n=lemke@Z4028.z.pppool.de)`
`00:43.12`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: it's called A*`
`00:43.19`	`KotCzarny`	`k k`
`00:43.34`	`AStorm`	`add coarse/fine distinction and it will be fast enough`
`00:43.36`	`KotCzarny`	`i wasn't on IT course`
`00:43.38`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:43.47`	`AStorm`	`it's like a Dijkstra, but informed`
`00:44.00`	`*** join/#maemo Paulius (n=Paulius@unaffiliated/paulius)`
`00:44.06`	`Paulius`	`How can I enable host USB support on the 770?`
`00:44.16`	`AStorm`	`you could set rough points and it would search for the track`
`00:44.18`	`Paulius`	`I know I need a power injector, and I'm working on that. But host mode is first`
`00:45.46`	`dragorn`	`Paulius: flasher`
`00:45.57`	`Paulius`	`could you elaborate?`
`00:46.06`	`dragorn`	`Paulius: flasher3.0 -h. it's one of the switches.`
`00:46.16`	`Paulius`	`oh it's a command?`
`00:46.28`	`dragorn`	`yes, for the tool you use to flash the device.`
`00:46.30`	`*** part/#maemo dtad (n=dtad@unaffiliated/dtad)`
`00:46.36`	`Paulius`	`flash it to what?`
`00:46.38`	`dragorn`	`which I don't have installed right now, so.`
`00:46.38`	`Paulius`	`Another OS?`
`00:46.52`	`KotCzarny`	`hmm, i should see the barber soon`
`00:47.02`	`KotCzarny`	`or find a way keeping my hair out of my eyes`
`00:47.20`	`lcuk`	`no, you can use the flasher tool to send commands to the device. one of the commands is "enable host mode" (according to dragorn )`
`00:47.33`	`lcuk`	`cut it. i did unfortunately`
`00:47.34`	`KotCzarny`	`lcuk, shouldn't you be in bed alredy?`
`00:48.02`	`lcuk`	`:( but mum can i just stay up and watch this?`
`00:48.04`	`*** join/#maemo TPC (n=andreas@pdpc/supporter/student/TPC)`
`00:48.10`	`KotCzarny`	`no, you can't`
`00:48.15`	`KotCzarny`	`it's dark`
`00:48.20`	`lcuk`	`oh i hate you. its so unfair.`
`00:48.31`	`KotCzarny`	`your eyes will hate YOU`
`00:48.35`	`KotCzarny`	`otherwise`
`00:48.35`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`00:48.39`	`lcuk`	`nahhh im thinking`
`00:48.58`	`KotCzarny`	`k k, just kidding`
`00:56.49`	`AStorm`	`lcuk: oh, are you?`
`00:57.12`	`lcuk`	`always`
`00:57.40`	`lcuk`	`wonders what he just answered to`
`00:57.59`	`ImMelody`	`I think he's insinuating that you don't think.. but I might be wrong`
`00:58.30`	`ImMelody`	`is glad she's a woman and can take huge steps in logic like that.`
`00:59.50`	`unixSnob`	`the left column on the app manager is just a few characters wide. I can't seem to widen the column. The column marker is not draggable`
`01:00.04`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Fixed in svn`
`01:00.08`	`GeneralAntilles`	`or Diablo`
`01:00.26`	`GeneralAntilles`	`For the time being, you can display by category`
`01:00.32`	`GeneralAntilles`	`or disable the bad repository`
`01:00.34`	`AStorm`	`or just use apt`
`01:01.13`	`lcuk`	`has it changed from 1 category per program?`
`01:01.31`	`lcuk`	`ImMelody, i think you're right`
`01:01.56`	`KotCzarny`	`huh`
`01:01.59`	`*** join/#maemo WormFood (n=wormfood@59.40.76.158)`
`01:02.17`	`KotCzarny`	`i turn my eyes away from the chan for a few mins and there's a hundreds of lines`
`01:02.37`	`lcuk`	`get a neural interface :P`
`01:02.54`	`KotCzarny`	`what? are you crazy?`
`01:02.56`	`WormFood`	`what did I miss? :`
`01:03.05`	`KotCzarny`	`conencting irc directly to neural if is dangerous`
`01:03.06`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`01:03.07`	`WormFood`	`I leave for a few hours and miss thousands of lines`
`01:03.13`	`KotCzarny`	`if=interface`
`01:03.33`	`ImMelody`	`only in your mind ;)`
`01:08.52`	`AStorm`	`If you can't handle that much of fuzz... then yeah`
`01:09.47`	`ImMelody`	`ok... I'm SOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooo confused`
`01:09.59`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`01:10.03`	`KotCzarny`	`too much irc?`
`01:10.26`	`ImMelody`	`too many antihistamines`
`01:10.50`	`KotCzarny`	`take some antiantihistamines`
`01:11.11`	`ImMelody`	`wouldn't that bring the histamines back?`
`01:11.48`	`*** join/#maemo Tuco (n=Y@unaffiliated/tuco)`
`01:12.06`	`KotCzarny`	`i have thought you have stated your problem with 'too many'`
`01:12.07`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`01:12.37`	`AStorm`	`allergy = no fun`
`01:12.46`	`*** join/#maemo l7 (n=l7@evil-wire.org)`
`01:12.49`	`KotCzarny`	`move`
`01:12.50`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`01:13.04`	`Mel\|Dozing`	`I didn't think about the fact that one of my regularly daily meds for anxiety is an antihistamine before taking another antihistamine earlier today`
`01:13.32`	`KotCzarny`	`then just go to sleep`
`01:13.33`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`01:13.40`	`Mel\|Dozing`	`We haven't had supper yet XD`
`01:14.08`	`Mel\|Dozing`	`but I think I'll nap til my husband makes some..`
`01:14.14`	`Mel\|Dozing`	`bibi!`
`01:14.29`	`KotCzarny`	`bibi?`
`01:15.07`	`shapr`	`bye bye?`
`01:15.10`	`KotCzarny`	`ahm`
`01:15.39`	`*** join/#maemo Cymor (n=Cymor@unaffiliated/cymor)`
`01:21.31`	`*** join/#maemo christefano (n=christef@ppp-71-129-22-20.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net)`
`01:22.09`	`*** join/#maemo Jsn0327 (n=User@12-203-96-31.client.mchsi.com)`
`01:22.46`	`Jsn0327`	`Hey. has anyone installed the kde desktop to your MMC Card?`
`01:23.23`	`KotCzarny`	`probably`
`01:23.36`	`KotCzarny`	`someone was fighting with it yesterday`
`01:23.39`	`KotCzarny`	`with success afair`
`01:25.05`	`Jsn0327`	`well i followed the guide from tablethack.com and got it to install, and boot to the mmc card, but for some reason it installed to the wrong partition. I created a 1.5 gig partition for the OS and a 400 mb partition for storage, and for some reason it installed to the 400mb partition. Does anyone know how I can fix this?`
`01:26.00`	`pupnik`	`copy the filesystem over to the other one?`
`01:27.03`	`Jsn0327`	`yeah how do i copy it?`
`01:28.10`	`lcuk`	`right, im off for the evening. another week starts`
`01:28.25`	`lcuk`	`gnite KotCzarny, pupnik and everyone else :)`
`01:28.56`	`KotCzarny`	`nite nite`
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`02:01.15`	`*** part/#maemo Cymor (n=Cymor@unaffiliated/cymor)`
`02:02.51`	`*** join/#maemo herz1 (n=herzi@p578EBF9F.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`02:12.44`	`WormFood`	`I'm trying to download "pushit" (sokoban clone) for the N800 (OS2008), but the only url I can find is broken....does anyone happen to have a working url for that package?`
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`02:12.53`	`pupnik`	`tearsync works up to 11 fps, breaks at 12 fps`
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`02:14.21`	`pupnik`	`at 256x240 @ 8bpp with sdl`
`02:16.09`	`Navi`	`:o`
`02:17.07`	`pupnik`	`just makes me more impressed at ssvb and lcuk's work`
`02:17.20`	`pupnik`	`but horizontal scrolling is the torture test`
`02:17.21`	`KotCzarny`	`:>`
`02:18.04`	`KotCzarny`	`rotating wheel is also nice`
`02:18.13`	`KotCzarny`	`in the way of showing tearing`
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`02:23.05`	`pupnik`	`sorry WormFood`
`02:23.20`	`KotCzarny`	`?`
`02:23.28`	`pupnik`	`Navi: you can try it if you're curious. http://pupnik.de/SDL_scrolly_sync.tgz`
`02:23.46`	`pupnik`	`untar it somewhere and run ./scrolling [FPS]`
`02:23.50`	`Navi`	`I'm curious about something?`
`02:24.02`	`Navi`	`Oh, right.`
`02:24.10`	`Navi`	`Yay, no tearing`
`02:24.17`	`pupnik`	`actually i'm curious if maybe my oprofile kernel is screwing things up`
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`02:24.29`	`pupnik`	`right now 50fps looks pretty good`
`02:24.33`	`pupnik`	`./scrolling 50`
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`02:25.42`	`pupnik`	`but i can still see waves, at least on my device`
`02:25.51`	`pupnik`	`holding the unit vertically`
`02:28.20`	`pupnik`	`20 fps is atrocious`
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`02:29.45`	`pupnik`	`it's as if my sync is fighting another sync`
`02:31.48`	`unixSnob`	`looks like the maemo mapper automatically downloads maps on demand, as needed, so I don't need to store maps of cities I won't travel.. is that correct?`
`02:32.02`	`pupnik`	`maybe this horrible SDL video mode of 800x480 is actually telling lcd controller to refresh the whole screen on sync, even if pixel doubling is on and only a small area is updated?`
`02:32.29`	`pupnik`	`cause the motion in between jerks at 20fps looks about as smooth as 60 fps`
`02:32.38`	`KotCzarny`	`unixsnob: as long you have inet connection..`
`02:33.02`	`KotCzarny`	`pupnik: i believe that may be true`
`02:33.12`	`unixSnob`	`i have a portable evdo hotspot! this will be cool indeed`
`02:33.17`	`pupnik`	`http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/engine?do=post_view_printable;post=19711;list=maemo there's perhaps ssvb's best (incomplete) explanation of this`
`02:33.48`	`unixSnob`	`the only thing I don't like is that bluetooth gps devices can only pair to one unit at a time`
`02:34.13`	`unixSnob`	`So I can't use both tomtom for the palm and maemo mapper at the same time`
`02:34.20`	`pupnik`	`i think that i'm also losing for missing this ioctl(fd, OMAPFB_UPDATE_WINDOW, &update);`
`02:34.44`	`KotCzarny`	`pupnik: i think you have to tell sdl not to update fb automatically too`
`02:34.56`	`KotCzarny`	`but thx for the link`
`02:35.01`	`KotCzarny`	`that will come handy`
`02:36.40`	`pupnik`	`On N800 (OS2007 2.2006.51-6), every YUV screen update (OMAPFB_COLOR_YUY422)`
`02:36.40`	`pupnik`	`takes about 41ms without tearsync enabled and 41-58ms with tearsync. It does`
`02:36.40`	`pupnik`	`not matter what video resolution we try to watch, the result is the same. So`
`02:36.40`	`pupnik`	`the maximal screen update rate is about ~24fps without tearsync and ~20fps on`
`02:36.41`	`pupnik`	`average with tearsync.`
`02:36.57`	`pupnik`	`:(`
`02:37.10`	`KotCzarny`	`i could live with 20fps`
`02:37.10`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`02:37.26`	`KotCzarny`	`as long it's stable`
`02:37.54`	`pupnik`	`if that's true it means pixel doubling is fucking useless`
`02:37.55`	`unixSnob`	`wow.. it's interesting to look at zoom level 1 on the mapper, and see how inaccurate the GPS signal actually is.. my stationary receiver is drawing a large blob`
`02:38.21`	`pupnik`	`how many meters off is it unixSnob`
`02:38.49`	`KotCzarny`	`pupnik: not true, you still gain some cp cycles`
`02:38.51`	`KotCzarny`	`*cpu`
`02:38.54`	`pupnik`	`ok true`
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`02:39.12`	`GeneralAntilles`	`What GPS, unixSnob?`
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`02:39.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Practically speaking, consumer GPS is plenty accurate, though.`
`02:39.29`	`KotCzarny`	`unixsnob: remember some maps NEED offset`
`02:39.30`	`unixSnob`	`i'm not good at eyeballing distances.. but looks like 50 meters`
`02:39.40`	`KotCzarny`	`so it's not entirely gps inaccuracy`
`02:39.40`	`unixSnob`	`Holux GPSlim240`
`02:39.44`	`GeneralAntilles`	`You indoors?`
`02:39.56`	`pupnik`	`i've been off at most about 2-3 meters`
`02:39.58`	`KotCzarny`	`it would be inaccurate if you observe DRIFT`
`02:40.08`	`KotCzarny`	`constant drift`
`02:40.16`	`unixSnob`	`yes, indoors, signals coming through skylights`
`02:40.24`	`GeneralAntilles`	`There's your problem.`
`02:40.51`	`unixSnob`	`and that's w/ 6 satellites`
`02:40.57`	`KotCzarny`	`i think maemo-mapper allows entering offset`
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`02:44.44`	`GeneralAntilles`	`6 satellites is a weak lock.`
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`03:23.42`	`unixSnob`	`it would be useful for the maemo mapper to emulate a BT GPS device -- then it could be paired w/ a real BT GPS, and other devices could then pair to the emulated one`
`03:24.04`	`KotCzarny`	`mail the author`
`03:24.05`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`03:24.41`	`unixSnob`	`i just wonder how many folks are really in my situation of having the need for that`
`03:25.17`	`unixSnob`	`it would be cool to have tomtom on the palm navigating, and have the NIT showing a satellite map or something`
`03:27.40`	`unixSnob`	`the maemo mapper shows a repeat of all the types of maps available under the "maps" menu choice`
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`05:32.21`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`Hi !`
`05:33.21`	`*** join/#maemo WormFood (n=wormfood@218.17.234.177)`
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`05:41.34`	`lopz`	`bye`
`05:42.52`	`WormFood`	`can anyone find the "pushit" package for me? Maybe someone downloaded it, and still has it laying around. The web site link is broken last few times I tried it`
`05:44.27`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`pushit ?`
`05:45.30`	`WormFood`	`yes`
`05:48.21`	`WormFood`	`it is a sokoban clone for the n800`
`05:48.44`	`WormFood`	`I've played all the way though marbles game....hard, but enjoyable`
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`05:50.40`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i don t have it, and repository seems absent : 404 error`
`05:50.42`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`sorry`
`05:51.01`	`WormFood`	`that is why I was hoping someone had downloaded it, and still has it laying around`
`05:51.20`	`WormFood`	`I've gotten into the habit now of saving all my packages, that way I don't have to download them again`
`05:51.28`	`WormFood`	`sometimes my internet connection is SUPER slow!`
`06:02.31`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`bye`
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`06:15.53`	`inz`	`Worm, did you play it through on the hardest level?`
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`06:59.18`	`else58`	`~root`
`06:59.21`	`infobot`	`[root] not a Good Thing to use when using IRC. Please use a different account.`
`06:59.37`	`*** join/#maemo sergio_ (n=sergio@cm5209.red91-117.mundo-r.com)`
`07:00.22`	`*** join/#maemo StormEveryDay (n=ff@222.92.90.170)`
`07:00.45`	`StormEveryDay`	`Hi`
`07:01.06`	`Tama^2`	`root`
`07:01.22`	`Tama^2`	`~root`
`07:01.23`	`infobot`	`root is probably not a Good Thing to use when using IRC. Please use a different account.`
`07:01.23`	`StormEveryDay`	`Who can help me? My 770 have problem...`
`07:02.02`	`BugBlue`	`what problem?`
`07:02.24`	`StormEveryDay`	`It just stuck at begining, just show me the "NOKIA" logo, then it automatically off after several minutes`
`07:02.48`	`StormEveryDay`	`The detail description is:`
`07:02.48`	`StormEveryDay`	`1,push the "power" button to let the N770 start to boot`
`07:02.48`	`StormEveryDay`	`2,N770 show the "NOKIA" in screen then it stopped, dont show the "hand shake" screen.`
`07:02.48`	`StormEveryDay`	`3,wait several minutes, it automatically power off(At least screen goto off).`
`07:03.08`	`StormEveryDay`	`try to use Flasher-3.0 to flash the official image(2006 or 2007HE), flash succeeded, but still have same result.`
`07:03.35`	`*** join/#maemo blassey (n=blassey@192.130.196.120)`
`07:03.40`	`StormEveryDay`	`I have posted it in internettablettalk`
`07:03.40`	`BugBlue`	`sounds like a hanging driver or so`
`07:03.47`	`BugBlue`	`do you have any SD cards in it?`
`07:03.52`	`BugBlue`	`tried to remove them?`
`07:03.59`	`StormEveryDay`	`I have a RS-MMC card`
`07:04.13`	`BugBlue`	`[disclaimer: I have a N810 and don't know the 770]`
`07:04.26`	`BugBlue`	`remove it from the device and try to boot again`
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`07:04.57`	`StormEveryDay`	`OK,I will try it`
`07:05.18`	`StormEveryDay`	`!!! great! it seems working now!!`
`07:05.47`	`StormEveryDay`	`How you think about it? really unbeliveable!`
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`08:21.08`	`Italodance`	`http://n800.bloggercomm.com/2007/08/wimax_version_of_n800_coming_t.php`
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`08:21.11`	`Italodance`	`huh!?`
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`08:24.05`	`anidel`	`good morning`
`08:24.14`	`qwerty12`	`good morning`
`08:24.24`	`anidel`	`hey qwerty, hi`
`08:24.34`	`qwerty12`	`hi anidel :)`
`08:24.46`	`anidel`	`did you see how far Xournal went ? :)`
`08:24.50`	`qwerty12`	`Yeo`
`08:24.56`	`qwerty12`	`s/Yeo/Yes`
`08:25.00`	`anidel`	`awesome :)`
`08:25.11`	`qwerty12`	`It's great! Brilliant work :)`
`08:25.39`	`anidel`	`I have mailed Denis about it...`
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`08:49.14`	`lardman`	`morning all`
`08:49.21`	`anidel`	`morning`
`08:49.24`	`qwerty12`	`morning`
`08:49.34`	`X-Fade`	`morning`
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`08:56.11`	`*** join/#maemo jwatt___ (n=roslea@colbert-ext.lid.theveniceproject.com)`
`09:02.31`	`Jaffa`	`Morning, all`
`09:02.37`	`qwerty12`	`Morning`
`09:02.38`	`pancake`	`porning`
`09:02.49`	`Italodance`	`umm where can i find backgrounds for my n800 os2008?`
`09:06.05`	`*** join/#maemo fr01 (n=jex_o_je@212.30.2.18)`
`09:06.55`	`Jaffa`	`Response to my blog post seems to have been well received :-)`
`09:07.21`	`X-Fade`	`Jaffa: Sure, would you expect anything else?`
`09:07.35`	`Jaffa`	`Nice to be sure`
`09:08.15`	`*** join/#maemo johnx (n=john@softbank221106232002.bbtec.net)`
`09:08.21`	`Italodance`	`hi qwerty12`
`09:08.37`	`anidel`	`hey Jaffa.. it was a very cool post indeed`
`09:08.49`	`Italodance`	`qwerty12 xmms has an icon for menu? or only run with x-term ??`
`09:09.52`	`*** join/#maemo mbuf (n=shakthim@61.16.248.242)`
`09:10.41`	`Italodance`	`qwerty12 can u reply me?`
`09:13.10`	`qwerty12`	`Italodance, it has a icon in the menu.`
`09:13.32`	`Italodance`	`qwerty12 where is the full package for download?`
`09:13.54`	`qwerty12`	`Read the first post in the thread, it tells you everything.`
`09:14.17`	`Italodance`	`yes but http://debfarm.free.fr/???????? the page is down?`
`09:14.30`	`qwerty12`	`http://debfarm.free.fr/pool/`
`09:14.37`	`Italodance`	`oh tnx`
`09:14.58`	`Italodance`	`qwerty12 it doesn't hurt to my device?`
`09:15.10`	`Italodance`	`afraid cos it is not an official app!`
`09:15.11`	`qwerty12`	`Mine is working fine with it installed.`
`09:16.21`	`*** join/#maemo _berto_ (n=berto@cm216016.red83-165.mundo-r.com)`
`09:16.32`	`AStorm`	`ok, time for a major Q:`
`09:16.53`	`AStorm`	`does N810 present itself as an USB high load device? (500 mA per standard)`
`09:17.19`	`lardman`	`I'd guess not as it doesn't recharge over usb`
`09:18.02`	`AStorm`	`might still, who knows`
`09:18.14`	`AStorm`	`I'd have to grab a dump out of the controller`
`09:18.30`	`AStorm`	`fortunately, as it is Linux, we can easily negotiate high current in software`
`09:19.03`	`*** join/#maemo murrayc (n=murrayc@u25-56.dsl.vianetworks.de)`
`09:19.24`	`lardman`	`Why do you ask?`
`09:19.42`	`AStorm`	`guess`
`09:19.53`	`AStorm`	`want to mod N810 to charge directly over USB`
`09:20.00`	`lardman`	`oh I see`
`09:20.10`	`lardman`	`well in that case a change to the kernel should do the trick`
`09:20.12`	`anidel`	`it'll be a hardware hack, will it ?`
`09:20.23`	`lardman`	`(asking for more current that is)`
`09:20.25`	`AStorm`	`anidel: partially, adding two diodes`
`09:20.47`	`AStorm`	`and a connection between usb port power lines and power connector`
`09:21.06`	`anidel`	`a friend of mine bought the USB cable from Nokia for charging it... 25â¬!!! damn them.. so expensive`
`09:21.27`	`AStorm`	`and it still has the stupid small 5V plug`
`09:21.29`	`AStorm`	`:-)`
`09:21.29`	`glass`	`just adding a charger plug to usb cord is easy`
`09:21.37`	`anidel`	`AStorm: if it's easy to do, I'll do it.. when mine is not under warranty anymore :)`
`09:21.42`	`AStorm`	`anidel: :>`
`09:21.48`	`aquatix`	`anidel: eh? you can charge it with that cable?`
`09:21.54`	`aquatix`	`thought it wasn't possible by default`
`09:22.00`	`AStorm`	`not that one`
`09:22.13`	`anidel`	`aquatix: sure.. it's USB to Nokia charger plug.. it charges all the nokia's recent phone and the N800/N810 as well`
`09:22.16`	`AStorm`	`it's USB -> Nokia 2mm connector`
`09:22.16`	`pupnik`	`has anybody tried the 4x NiMH AA without regulator?`
`09:22.19`	`aquatix`	`anidel: oh :)`
`09:22.25`	`AStorm`	`pupnik: well, there's DC-8`
`09:22.26`	`aquatix`	`meh`
`09:22.28`	`lardman`	`pupnik: I have on the Zaurus`
`09:22.29`	`anidel`	`last day it was chargint the N95 and later the N810 as well`
`09:22.29`	`AStorm`	`buy one and destroy`
`09:22.43`	`anidel`	`I don't remember the cable name`
`09:22.48`	`AStorm`	`I guess a tiny regulator would work`
`09:22.52`	`AStorm`	`it's just 0,2V up`
`09:22.53`	`anidel`	`probably`
`09:23.15`	`AStorm`	`pupnik: if it works over USB, then it should with 4,8V`
`09:23.28`	`AStorm`	`as USB of high charge can provide 4,75V per spec`
`09:23.39`	`anidel`	`it's the CA-100 cable`
`09:23.41`	`AStorm`	`unless they added a step up in the cable`
`09:23.59`	`anidel`	`it Italian: http://www.nokia.it/ca-100`
`09:24.03`	`AStorm`	`which I find plausible (it has negotiation electronics too)`
`09:24.14`	`*** join/#maemo monkeyiq (n=monkeyiq@124.148.55.38)`
`09:24.38`	`AStorm`	`DC-8 charger is for 4x AA`
`09:25.05`	`pupnik`	`dc-8 not available in germany`
`09:25.30`	`AStorm`	`unfortunately`
`09:25.33`	`AStorm`	`or in Poland`
`09:25.49`	`pupnik`	`heh bp-4l from nokia 53 euro`
`09:26.06`	`AStorm`	`yup`
`09:26.10`	`AStorm`	`but no desk charger`
`09:26.25`	`AStorm`	`w/o a desk charger it's somewhat pointless ;>`
`09:26.29`	`pupnik`	`lols and wires together 4aas`
`09:27.01`	`anidel`	`going for a coffee.. ttyl`
`09:27.21`	`KotCzarny`	`erm`
`09:27.27`	`KotCzarny`	`dc-8 is ~30 EUR`
`09:27.33`	`KotCzarny`	`for a piece of plastic and connector?`
`09:27.35`	`KotCzarny`	`O.o`
`09:27.41`	`AStorm`	`yup ;>`
`09:27.51`	`aquatix`	`KotCzarny: that's commercial chargers etc for you...`
`09:27.53`	`AStorm`	`and a diode`
`09:28.05`	`KotCzarny`	`that's a piece of... plastic`
`09:28.05`	`AStorm`	`LED, actually`
`09:28.06`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:28.13`	`AStorm`	`and some metal`
`09:28.19`	`AStorm`	`and it's bad shape too`
`09:28.20`	`KotCzarny`	`mostly plastic`
`09:28.31`	`KotCzarny`	`yup, bad for tablet`
`09:28.39`	`AStorm`	`we want a flat version`
`09:28.57`	`AStorm`	`I think tablet has its own power regulator, which should easily swallow 0,2V difference`
`09:29.23`	`KotCzarny`	`someone should try 4x aa (nimh preferably)`
`09:29.32`	`AStorm`	`yes, NiMH would be safer`
`09:29.39`	`AStorm`	`4x AA might be frying ;P`
`09:29.53`	`AStorm`	`and definitely need an additional power regulator`
`09:29.55`	`*** join/#maemo soman (n=somu@61.16.248.242)`
`09:30.31`	`AStorm`	`6V to 5V limiter (read, like a zener)`
`09:30.48`	`KotCzarny`	`http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L99cw05nmSI&feature=related`
`09:30.49`	`KotCzarny`	`lol`
`09:31.35`	`*** join/#maemo Crfrod (n=Crfrod@88.214.193.26)`
`09:31.37`	`KotCzarny`	`ah, and i have forgot.. piece of plastic with some metal and NOKIA logo`
`09:31.38`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:32.05`	`AStorm`	`yes, that logo is the most expensive thing`
`09:32.05`	`*** join/#maemo foka_ (n=foka@123.115.240.223)`
`09:32.19`	`KotCzarny`	`definitely`
`09:32.44`	`AStorm`	`pupnik: just drop in a buck power regulator (dirt cheap, like 0,5$)`
`09:33.42`	`pupnik`	`i read the thoughtfix blogthread on it.`
`09:34.15`	`AStorm`	`even a linear regulator could do, if you're feeling cheap`
`09:34.36`	`AStorm`	`but then you'd get less power out of the batteries (like, 80%? and it'd heat up a bit)`
`09:36.18`	`AStorm`	`like, a cheap LM2575S`
`09:36.40`	`KotCzarny`	`http://www.goldengadgets.com/product_info.php?products_id=396{1}36`
`09:36.44`	`KotCzarny`	`this one is interesting`
`09:36.51`	`KotCzarny`	`probably with builtin regulator`
`09:37.04`	`KotCzarny`	`as it operates on 1 (one) AA`
`09:37.05`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:37.11`	`KotCzarny`	`and is a little cheaper too`
`09:37.19`	`AStorm`	`and it drains the battery fast?`
`09:37.32`	`soman`	`how to play avi file using gst-launch ... i mean the exact pipeline syntax for running it on N810`
`09:37.33`	`AStorm`	`I'd think like 4x as fast ;>`
`09:37.39`	`KotCzarny`	`kind of`
`09:37.45`	`KotCzarny`	`but look at the price`
`09:37.49`	`KotCzarny`	`just get 4 of them`
`09:37.50`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`09:37.55`	`AStorm`	`# Output Voltage: 5.7V +- 5%`
`09:37.58`	`AStorm`	`FRIED`
`09:38.04`	`KotCzarny`	`nope`
`09:38.05`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:38.10`	`AStorm`	`why nope`
`09:38.15`	`AStorm`	`it's over 10%`
`09:38.35`	`AStorm`	`and charging current is too low, just 400mA`
`09:38.43`	`AStorm`	`to charge N with it, you'd have to shut it down`
`09:39.08`	`AD-N770`	`soman: you can use playbin, gst-launch-0.10 playbin uri=file://<absolute path to file>`
`09:39.09`	`KotCzarny`	`i'm willing to take a try`
`09:39.18`	`KotCzarny`	`let's find shipping price`
`09:39.35`	`KotCzarny`	`2.15$`
`09:39.35`	`AStorm`	`I'd rather build one myself`
`09:39.36`	`KotCzarny`	`hum`
`09:39.40`	`AStorm`	`on 2x AA`
`09:39.48`	`KotCzarny`	`do 6$ total`
`09:39.53`	`soman`	`AD-N770: i tried playbin,, but im unable to redirect the video output... its coming in a different window`
`09:40.11`	`*** join/#maemo kaie (n=kaie@s15277822.onlinehome-server.info)`
`09:40.14`	`AStorm`	`so, that'd easily give me 800 mA`
`09:40.30`	`AStorm`	`(with alkaline batteries - normal can go much higher, so can NiMH)`
`09:40.53`	`AD-N770`	`soman: gst-launch will create their own window, you need to write code to specify your app window if you need it`
`09:41.06`	`KotCzarny`	`still, with 3Ah nimh you would get ~2h of work`
`09:41.12`	`KotCzarny`	`on a single AA`
`09:41.17`	`AStorm`	`you're funny`
`09:41.23`	`pupnik`	`hmm maybe you'd really want 2 (parallel) x 4AA (serial) to handle the current`
`09:41.24`	`AStorm`	`these cost more than it's worth`
`09:41.35`	`AStorm`	`I'd rather buy the Li-Poly BP-4L then`
`09:41.44`	`AStorm`	`pupnik: no`
`09:41.49`	`AStorm`	`that's way too much`
`09:42.03`	`AStorm`	`it'd provide with alkalines 800 mA`
`09:42.13`	`pupnik`	`no NiMH`
`09:42.16`	`AStorm`	`and direct 4,8V-6V`
`09:42.19`	`AD-N770`	`soman: http://webcvs.freedesktop.org/gstreamer/gst-python/examples/play.py?view=markup`
`09:43.09`	`AStorm`	`do you think this one would do?`
`09:43.12`	`AStorm`	`LM1086`
`09:43.19`	`*** join/#maemo timeless (n=timeless@webwizardry.net)`
`09:43.21`	`AStorm`	`or is it too weak? ;P`
`09:43.28`	`timeless`	`anyone here know where i can find htop?`
`09:44.02`	`AD-N770`	`soman: self.imagesink.set_xwindow_id(self.window.xid)`
`09:44.12`	`*** join/#maemo jott (n=j@unaffiliated/jott)`
`09:44.18`	`johnx`	`extras maybe? or extras-devel?`
`09:44.42`	`KotCzarny`	`http://www.mobileplace.co.uk/product/2093.html`
`09:44.51`	`KotCzarny`	`it lists n800 on a compatibility list`
`09:45.02`	`KotCzarny`	`i know that it's nothing`
`09:45.08`	`johnx`	`nevermind, it looks like htop is in the main maemo repository (not extras or -devel)`
`09:45.57`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: it is possible that Nxxx have a real power regulator`
`09:46.00`	`AStorm`	`which can do 20%`
`09:47.08`	`KotCzarny`	`astorm, even if it wouldn't work as expected it would provide plug and a regulator for self-made project`
`09:47.09`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:47.17`	`AStorm`	`oh, we could use the ubercheap LM350T`
`09:47.18`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`09:47.33`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: Not the regulator`
`09:47.49`	`KotCzarny`	`stepup, let it be`
`09:47.49`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:47.56`	`AStorm`	`yup, LM350T will do, it can be set to regulate anything from 1,25 to 33V`
`09:47.57`	`AStorm`	`3A`
`09:47.57`	`anidel`	`back from coffee :p`
`09:48.11`	`*** join/#maemo TPC (n=andreas@pdpc/supporter/student/TPC)`
`09:48.26`	`KotCzarny`	`http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11867`
`09:48.30`	`KotCzarny`	`this one could be nice`
`09:48.34`	`KotCzarny`	`but the color is meh`
`09:49.10`	`KotCzarny`	`- Comes with LED/UV search light`
`09:49.11`	`KotCzarny`	`lol`
`09:49.26`	`AStorm`	`rotfl`
`09:49.29`	`KotCzarny`	`worldwide free shipping`
`09:49.30`	`KotCzarny`	`O.o`
`09:49.31`	`AStorm`	`ok, have to fly now :-)`
`09:49.49`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: if you grab 1000 pcs?`
`09:49.54`	`KotCzarny`	`nope`
`09:49.58`	`KotCzarny`	`even with 1`
`09:50.25`	`KotCzarny`	`who uses ugly red plastic`
`09:50.26`	`KotCzarny`	`ugh`
`09:50.41`	`AStorm`	`cheap people`
`09:50.47`	`AStorm`	`we'll talk later :-)`
`09:50.55`	`KotCzarny`	`hmm`
`09:50.58`	`KotCzarny`	`interesting`
`09:51.05`	`AStorm`	`I think LM350T plus some switch to pick the set of resistors would rock`
`09:51.27`	`KotCzarny`	`can you beat the price?`
`09:51.31`	`KotCzarny`	`4.76$ shipped`
`09:51.32`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:51.45`	`*** join/#maemo kpel (n=mcu@pdpc/supporter/active/kpel)`
`09:51.51`	`*** join/#maemo alextreme (n=alex@53512E41.cable.casema.nl)`
`09:51.58`	`kpel`	`hi`
`09:52.11`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: yeah, I can`
`09:52.18`	`AStorm`	`2 PLN per package of 5`
`09:52.27`	`KotCzarny`	`assembled?`
`09:52.28`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`09:52.30`	`AStorm`	`but I'll still have to build the case ;P`
`09:52.30`	`AStorm`	`no`
`09:54.28`	`AStorm`	`need a current limiter, I think 1A will do`
`09:54.37`	`AStorm`	`that LM could be used for that`
`09:54.45`	`AStorm`	`the only downside is the efficiency ;P`
`09:54.57`	`AStorm`	`argh, no`
`09:54.58`	`KotCzarny`	`don't skimp 1$`
`09:55.09`	`KotCzarny`	`get the >90% efficient one`
`09:55.12`	`AStorm`	`it's minimal input voltage of 4,2V`
`09:55.15`	`KotCzarny`	`http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.6655`
`09:55.20`	`KotCzarny`	`this one is interesting`
`09:56.07`	`*** join/#maemo MangoFusion (n=jamesu@host217-44-66-133.range217-44.btcentralplus.com)`
`09:56.22`	`AStorm`	`http://www.chipcatalog.com/National/LM2621.htm`
`09:56.26`	`AStorm`	`this one is more like it`
`09:56.47`	`AStorm`	`note that with a plug change, I could use it for car charger too`
`09:57.20`	`AStorm`	`but it's damn expensive ;P`
`09:57.36`	`AStorm`	`and it's a step-up`
`09:57.44`	`AStorm`	`so, for car, I'd need a step-down ;P`
`09:58.42`	`*** join/#maemo ustunozgur (n=ustun@88.252.63.113)`
`10:00.50`	`AStorm`	`http://www.chipcatalog.com/Maxim/MAX1687.htm whee`
`10:01.32`	`AStorm`	`still too high Vin`
`10:01.44`	`KotCzarny`	`just get 4xAA`
`10:02.01`	`AStorm`	`that's large`
`10:02.12`	`AStorm`	`what for if we have nice regulators?`
`10:02.26`	`KotCzarny`	`4xAA has a benefit of more juice`
`10:02.28`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`10:02.40`	`AStorm`	`2x AA can get 4000 mAh`
`10:02.45`	`AStorm`	`so?`
`10:02.52`	`AStorm`	`or more`
`10:02.57`	`KotCzarny`	`heh, at 1.2V :P`
`10:03.01`	`AStorm`	`yes`
`10:03.09`	`AStorm`	`if I get nice enough regulator, it'd rock`
`10:03.17`	`KotCzarny`	`but not too long`
`10:03.18`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`10:03.32`	`AStorm`	`http://www.chipcatalog.com/Maxim/MAX1700.htm`
`10:03.37`	`AStorm`	`why not for long? ;P`
`10:04.13`	`KotCzarny`	`nokia could just have used 2xAA for powering :/`
`10:04.17`	`AStorm`	`slightly small Iout this time`
`10:04.22`	`AStorm`	`exactly, they could`
`10:04.27`	`AStorm`	`but the device would be too heavy`
`10:04.37`	`KotCzarny`	`lol`
`10:04.41`	`KotCzarny`	`you're kidding, right?`
`10:04.46`	`AStorm`	`I'm not`
`10:04.49`	`AStorm`	`it's heavy as it is`
`10:04.54`	`AStorm`	`for holding in a hand`
`10:05.01`	`AStorm`	`bbml`
`10:05.33`	`KotCzarny`	`btw. stepups have lower efficiency with lower Vin`
`10:05.41`	`glass`	`4000mah at 1.2v vs 1500(or what is it at) at 3.7v....`
`10:06.00`	`*** join/#maemo christefano_ (n=christef@adsl-69-230-175-116.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net)`
`10:06.14`	`AStorm`	`3.7V?`
`10:06.15`	`AStorm`	`wtf?`
`10:06.20`	`KotCzarny`	`glass: with 90% efficiency it's 3600mAh @ 1.2v`
`10:06.25`	`AStorm`	`3,6V is 3x NiMh`
`10:06.51`	`johnx`	`3Whr vs 5.550 Whr (roughly)`
`10:06.52`	`KotCzarny`	`but for that you would have to hack the battery`
`10:06.58`	`johnx`	`wait, that can't be right`
`10:07.11`	`KotCzarny`	`you have to divide`
`10:07.14`	`KotCzarny`	`not multiply`
`10:07.14`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`10:07.20`	`AStorm`	`no, no and no`
`10:07.25`	`AStorm`	`multiply, really`
`10:07.33`	`glass`	`just multiply`
`10:07.58`	`glass`	`4000x1.2 vs 3.7x1500(or whatever the batt is, i forgot)`
`10:08.05`	`KotCzarny`	`ok ok`
`10:08.14`	`AStorm`	`battery is 3,7V, yes`
`10:08.22`	`AStorm`	`2-cell I think`
`10:08.39`	`AStorm`	`maybe 4 cell`
`10:08.40`	`KotCzarny`	`still, it's not 4000`
`10:08.56`	`KotCzarny`	`ok, 4000 with 2x2200`
`10:08.57`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`10:08.59`	`AStorm`	`yeah, if we could just grab the cells... and correct charging`
`10:09.08`	`*** join/#maemo ttmrichter_ (n=ttmricht@221.235.57.224)`
`10:09.12`	`AStorm`	`then it'd rock`
`10:09.24`	`KotCzarny`	`i wonder if it would charge with 5V`
`10:09.26`	`AStorm`	`you'd get ultralight expander, costing 125$`
`10:09.26`	`KotCzarny`	`:>`
`10:09.27`	`KotCzarny`	`erm`
`10:09.29`	`KotCzarny`	`with 3.6V`
`10:09.42`	`AStorm`	`well, it will`
`10:10.00`	`AStorm`	`but unless it's a smart battery, you'd fry it`
`10:10.15`	`AStorm`	`I don't know if it's one`
`10:10.40`	`AStorm`	`I think it is`
`10:10.51`	`AStorm`	`as I've seen no li-poly charger inside N810`
`10:10.52`	`johnx`	`I used to use the pelican PSP external Li-Ion pack with my zaurus, until it got recalled as a fire risk...`
`10:10.59`	`AStorm`	`hehehe`
`10:11.08`	`KotCzarny`	`:>`
`10:11.14`	`johnx`	`it made a great squealing noise when in use`
`10:11.21`	`glass`	`ha`
`10:11.21`	`johnx`	`it annoyed everyone in the room`
`10:11.37`	`AStorm`	`haha, 300MHz charger ;P`
`10:11.52`	`AStorm`	`where certain harmonic is 15kHz`
`10:12.00`	`AStorm`	`and another is 3kHz`
`10:12.02`	`AStorm`	`:P`
`10:12.05`	`johnx`	`probably`
`10:12.21`	`AStorm`	`s/300MHz/300kHz/`
`10:13.05`	`AStorm`	`ok, bbml, I'm already late :P`
`10:13.17`	`johnx`	`'later :D`
`10:14.20`	`*** join/#maemo Cptn-N800 (n=user@158.36.200.185)`
`10:19.33`	`*** join/#maemo becksbier (n=becksbie@ip-40.net-89-3-100.rev.numericable.fr)`
`10:27.14`	`*** join/#maemo eichi (n=eichi@ip-80-226-0-1.vodafone-net.de)`
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`10:44.00`	`*** join/#maemo b0unc3_ (n=b0unc3@host-84-223-136-70.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
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`10:55.07`	`*** join/#maemo ijon_ (n=ijon@dhcp218-147.yandex.ru)`
`11:02.08`	`*** join/#maemo _berto__ (n=berto@fanzine.igalia.com)`
`11:13.14`	`*** join/#maemo ab__ (n=ab@nat/ibm/x-50c7916f08277d33)`
`11:15.48`	`*** join/#maemo Crfrodf (n=Crfrod@88.214.193.26)`
`11:17.12`	`*** join/#maemo \|thunder (n=user@c-68-61-172-71.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`11:21.46`	`*** join/#maemo \|thunde1 (n=user@c-68-61-172-121.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`11:26.03`	`*** join/#maemo keesj (n=keesj@ip49-193-210-87.adsl2.versatel.nl)`
`11:26.25`	`Mikho`	`does anyone know why does my hildon_play_system_sound() call throw error messages like "arguments to dbus_message_new_method_call() were incorrect, assertion "_dbus_check_is_valid_path (path)" failed in file dbus-message.c line 797`
`11:26.39`	`*** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@office.pov.lt)`
`11:26.59`	`Mikho`	`the weird thing is that it plays the sound alright`
`11:27.27`	`Mikho`	`I have this problem only on the N770. The dev PC side works perfectly`
`11:29.07`	`Mikho`	`Maybe it tries to get the volume level from gconf but fails`
`11:31.52`	`lardman`	`It would be worth adding a bug for it`
`11:32.05`	`KotCzarny`	`heh`
`11:32.07`	`lardman`	`Even though it has no effect, there is presumably something going wrong in either the code or the reporting method`
`11:32.09`	`KotCzarny`	`it must be late`
`11:32.18`	`KotCzarny`	`i have misread your nick as 'lartman'`
`11:32.19`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`11:32.30`	`lardman`	`:)`
`11:32.37`	`KotCzarny`	`k, bedtime ;)`
`11:32.52`	`lardman`	`'night`
`11:33.07`	`Mikho`	`It's just one method call with one parameter: the sound file name`
`11:33.16`	`Mikho`	`what can go wrong?`
`11:33.25`	`*** join/#maemo m3mberman (n=m3mberma@125-238-149-165.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz)`
`11:34.28`	`lardman`	`Mikho: is the source available?`
`11:35.10`	`Mikho`	`hildon-widgets/hildon-system-sound.h should be available, I guess`
`11:36.09`	`Mikho`	`gah, can't find the c file`
`11:38.58`	`Mikho`	`I think the gconf call fails for some reason`
`11:38.58`	`lardman`	`the source should be in the reop`
`11:39.05`	`lardman`	`repo`
`11:39.52`	`lardman`	`somewhere in here I imagine http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.0/free/d/dbus/`
`11:40.15`	`*** join/#maemo lcuk_work (i=5189c2d8@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-3d240f3aa9d93fef)`
`11:40.18`	`lardman`	`http://dbus.freedesktop.org/doc/api/html/dbus-message_8c-source.html was what a quick Google found, but the line number doesn't match so there's probably a version or patch difference`
`11:40.49`	`Mikho`	`there are maybe 15 rows of error messages, that's just the first`
`11:41.45`	`Mikho`	`it might be the line numbers don't match because of all the #ifndef and #endif blocks`
`11:42.43`	`*** join/#maemo Dazgar1 (n=kroyer@mla78-1-82-240-17-188.fbx.proxad.net)`
`11:42.43`	`lcuk_work`	`dont compilers normally account for that and store the actual line number no matter whether you ifdefed or not`
`11:42.46`	`Dazgar1`	`hi there`
`11:43.03`	`lardman`	`lcuk_work: That's what I would have thought...`
`11:43.04`	`Dazgar1`	`anyone here having bad wifi performance here ?`
`11:43.25`	`Dazgar1`	`i can't get more than 200ko with my n800`
`11:43.28`	`lardman`	`Mikho: I see there's a test case here: https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-1/tests/check-hildon-system-sound.c`
`11:43.59`	`Cptn-N800`	`Kb or kB?`
`11:44.10`	`Mikho`	`hmm`
`11:44.34`	`lardman`	`https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-libs/hildon-widgets/hildon-system-sound.c there's the code`
`11:44.41`	`lardman`	`lunch time`
`11:45.05`	`Cptn-N800`	`Ive had abot 200KB, but my line isnt faster :p`
`11:47.40`	`Mikho`	`argh, I don't have time for this`
`11:48.08`	`Dazgar1`	`ï»¿Cptn-N800: sorry`
`11:48.20`	`Dazgar1`	`kB`
`11:48.56`	`Dazgar1`	`but 200KB is miserable, even my n95 is faster than that !!`
`11:49.36`	`Dazgar1`	`i can't do any serious x11 forwarding with such bad performance :(`
`11:49.40`	`Cptn-N800`	`...What do you need that fast speed for?`
`11:49.46`	`lcuk_work`	`is this specific tested wifi speed only, or a single site that your using for testing?`
`11:49.52`	`Dazgar1`	`X11 forwarding :)`
`11:50.09`	`Dazgar1`	`and to control ardour from my n800 when recording`
`11:50.32`	`lcuk_work`	`when you say your n95 is faster - is that using wifi?`
`11:50.43`	`lcuk_work`	`ie is it doing the encryption/decryption?`
`11:50.46`	`Dazgar1`	`ï»¿lcuk_work: yes using wifi`
`11:51.04`	`ImMelody`	`mornin'`
`11:51.12`	`Dazgar1`	`the n800 is of course encoding for the ssh suppport`
`11:51.36`	`lcuk_work`	`mornin ImMelody, did you get your supper :P`
`11:51.37`	`Dazgar1`	`but the device never get high cpu usage when doing so`
`11:52.00`	`ImMelody`	`he never woke me up... so I slept until 4am when all the junk wore off`
`11:52.03`	`lcuk_work`	`dunno then`
`11:52.22`	`lcuk_work`	`:D hit him round the head with your nokia`
`11:52.28`	`Dazgar1`	`lol`
`11:52.29`	`Dazgar1`	`:D`
`11:52.35`	`ImMelody`	`I don't want to do that to my nokia ;)`
`11:52.40`	`lcuk_work`	`(gently so you dont break it ;) )`
`11:53.01`	`Cptn-N800`	`Maemo Assaultweapon`
`11:53.27`	`Cptn-N800`	`Wants n800 with tazer attachementi`
`11:53.31`	`lcuk_work`	`sharpen the edges and use it as a shuriken`
`11:53.37`	`*** join/#maemo \|thunder (n=user@c-68-60-36-234.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)`
`11:53.43`	`ImMelody`	`Now that would be awesome!`
`11:53.53`	`ImMelody`	`the tazer attachment`
`11:54.08`	`Cptn-N800`	`And technically possible`
`11:54.35`	`lcuk_work`	`its hardly fear inducing to tell the crook to wait whilst you whip out your stylus, navigate the menus and finally run the app you want before tazer barbs emerge`
`11:54.36`	`Cptn-N800`	`No problem making a n800 controlled tazer`
`11:54.46`	`Dazgar1`	`im transfering a file to teh n800 now : 320KB :s`
`11:54.47`	`lcuk_work`	`you would want some sort of gesture recognition on the front screen`
`11:55.25`	`ImMelody`	`That's why you put a button on your desktop just for it ;)`
`11:55.28`	`Cptn-N800`	`Voice recognition`
`11:55.28`	`lcuk_work`	`a quick zorro mark on the screen, select power rating and BOOM`
`11:55.38`	`Cptn-N800`	`"Deploy tazer"`
`11:55.38`	`Dazgar1`	`with an other device using teh same wifi network i can get ~1MB`
`11:56.00`	`lcuk_work`	`Dear aunt, letâs set so double the killer delete select all.`
`11:56.40`	`lcuk_work`	`Cptn-N800: would it actually pop out of the top like inspector gadget type equipment`
`11:56.44`	`ImMelody`	`of course, the problem comes if a thief grabs your nokia as part of his loot.. then he could tase you`
`11:57.03`	`lcuk_work`	`self tazing :D reverse the polarity of the case`
`11:57.24`	`ImMelody`	`finger print recognition? :D`
`11:57.25`	`lcuk_work`	`obut dont tell anyone the secret arming code or they will shout it at you`
`11:57.38`	`lcuk_work`	`heh, im working on fake fingerprint activation at the moment`
`11:58.01`	`lcuk_work`	`it will look and act like a security app, but obviously wont do it properly`
`11:58.09`	`lcuk_work`	`but it will block out people who dont know the trick`
`11:59.57`	`Cptn-N800`	`Built one of those robot puppy n800's on youtube and pout in a tazer`
`12:00.29`	`lcuk_work`	`Don't Taze Me Elmo!`
`12:01.01`	`*** join/#maemo jamey (n=jamey@38.99.207.90)`
`12:01.14`	`ImMelody`	`lol... I'll bbiab.. gotta get kiddo up and ready for school`
`12:01.34`	`Dazgar1`	`by the way, is it possible to do xdmcp with maemo ?`
`12:01.36`	`lcuk_work`	`k taze ya later`
`12:02.05`	`Dazgar1`	`i mean accessing my destop from my n800`
`12:02.05`	`Cptn-N800`	`Inmeldoy: operate a bt module into your kid and control him with your it`
`12:02.18`	`*** join/#maemo jebe_ (n=jpeura@office1.brainalliance.com)`
`12:02.24`	`Cptn-N800`	`Eat_your_fucking_brokoli.deb`
`12:08.41`	`Navi`	`Wasn't there a gtk editor designed for the tablets somewhere?`
`12:09.04`	`lcuk_work`	`you mean gtk widget editor or code editor`
`12:09.29`	`Navi`	`either one, I don't know.`
`12:09.52`	`lcuk_work`	`pygtkeditor (khertan) uses a gtk text editing component`
`12:10.10`	`lcuk_work`	`which is highlighting and configurable for languages`
`12:11.52`	`lcuk_work`	`must dash`
`12:12.00`	`lcuk_work`	`back after work`
`12:15.59`	`*** join/#maemo ken_ (n=user@84.92.70.37)`
`12:17.58`	`*** join/#maemo ssvb (n=ssvb___@192.130.196.118)`
`12:20.57`	`*** join/#maemo trbs (n=trbs@82-171-82-139.ip.telfort.nl)`
`12:22.36`	`*** join/#maemo MangoFusion (n=jamesu@host217-44-66-133.range217-44.btcentralplus.com)`
`12:24.19`	`*** join/#maemo gribouille (n=rrrrrr@96.27.100-84.rev.gaoland.net)`
`12:24.25`	`gribouille`	`hi`
`12:24.39`	`gribouille`	`is xchat available for OS 2008 ?`
`12:25.11`	`mgedmin`	`it's not on maemo.org/downloads`
`12:25.15`	`mgedmin`	`I looked for it this morning`
`12:27.17`	`mgedmin`	`hm, OS 2007 xchat is also not found there`
`12:29.24`	`mgedmin`	`found the sources`
`12:30.28`	`X-Fade`	`I gave skyhusker rights to upload it to extras. He was planning to do that.`
`12:30.45`	`X-Fade`	`It doesn't seem be in extras yet though..`
`12:30.50`	`mgedmin`	`whois skyhusker?`
`12:30.55`	`mgedmin`	`Santtu Lakkala?`
`12:31.23`	`*** join/#maemo iDS (i=Persia@92.61.181.103)`
`12:32.05`	`mgedmin`	`sighs`
`12:32.28`	`mgedmin`	`I want a "porting maemo 3.x apps to maemo 4.x" HOWTO`
`12:32.37`	`mgedmin`	`what replaced HildonProgram?`
`12:34.59`	`GeneralAntilles`	`http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/`
`12:35.06`	`hrw`	`gribouille: it is`
`12:35.19`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I should just script that.`
`12:35.24`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I've already got a bind for it. <_<`
`12:35.24`	`hrw`	`~xchat`
`12:35.25`	`infobot`	`rumour has it, xchat is an IRC client for unix and windows at http://www.xchat.org or http://www.silverex.org/news/`
`12:35.32`	`hrw`	`~xchat-maemo`
`12:35.33`	`mgedmin`	`GeneralAntilles: no sources in there -- not good`
`12:35.44`	`hrw`	`mgedmin: normal when it comes to maemo packages`
`12:35.55`	`*** join/#maemo sven-tek (i=linux@p508ED40E.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`12:35.56`	`mgedmin`	`"normal" is the wrong word`
`12:35.59`	`mgedmin`	`"usual", perhaps`
`12:36.11`	`mgedmin`	`"illegal" as well`
`12:36.24`	`hrw`	`infobot: xchat-maemo is X-Chat for OS2008 is done by skyhusker and can be fetched from http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/ and should be in 'extras' soon`
`12:36.25`	`infobot`	`hrw: okay`
`12:36.29`	`hrw`	`~xchat-maemo`
`12:36.29`	`infobot`	`i heard xchat-maemo is X-Chat for OS2008 is done by skyhusker and can be fetched from http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/ and should be in 'extras' soon`
`12:37.03`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Illegal is the wrong word.`
`12:37.08`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's not a criminal offense.`
`12:37.19`	`hrw`	`GeneralAntilles: it is against license?`
`12:42.24`	`ImMelody`	`I wasn't aware that maemo was released under GNU license`
`12:43.51`	`hrw`	`ImMelody: only parts`
`12:44.01`	`hrw`	`and only some versions of components`
`12:45.59`	`hrw`	`ImMelody: basically maemo is mix of open/close components. some of closed ones were open in previous versions etc`
`12:46.22`	`ImMelody`	`That was my point. Can't be illegal or against license if it's only partially under GNU. I'm pretty sure that it's totally under Nokia license which protects them.`
`12:46.29`	`*** part/#maemo Cptn-N800 (n=user@158.36.200.185)`
`12:46.51`	`GeneralAntilles`	`We're not talking about maemo.`
`12:46.57`	`hrw`	`ImMelody: what does mamemo has to xchat?`
`12:47.29`	`ImMelody`	`I don't think I read far enough back up then.. XD`
`12:47.47`	`ImMelody`	`I was going off the statement "normal when it comes to maemo packages"`
`12:48.13`	`*** join/#maemo TPC (n=andreas@pdpc/supporter/student/TPC)`
`12:48.36`	`ImMelody`	`Ignore me then :)`
`12:48.36`	`*** join/#maemo borism (n=boris@88-196-80-47-dsl.krw.estpak.ee)`
`12:49.22`	`*** join/#maemo Cptn-N800 (n=user@158.36.200.185)`
`12:49.29`	`*** join/#maemo mwaldron (n=iru09954@63.224.176.123)`
`12:51.45`	`*** join/#maemo borism (n=boris@88-196-80-47-dsl.krw.estpak.ee)`
`12:53.38`	`*** join/#maemo NetBlade (n=osku@wlangw.uiah.fi)`
`12:54.47`	`*** join/#maemo pleemans (n=peter@81.188.93.130)`
`12:55.25`	`gribouille`	`is it possible to start applications automatically when the tablet boots (like Autostart) ?`
`12:58.42`	`Cptn-N800`	`Dont think so`
`12:58.54`	`Cptn-N800`	`I seem to remember someone asking that some months ago`
`13:00.02`	`xuser`	`why not, its linux...`
`13:00.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17168 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=169203`
`13:06.39`	`*** join/#maemo \|\|cw (n=chris@vpn.wilsonmfg.com)`
`13:09.44`	`*** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132)`
`13:12.02`	`*** join/#maemo jegp (n=jegp@main.netvision.com.py)`
`13:14.34`	`gribouille`	`the solution is a lot more complex than with ubuntu !`
`13:16.19`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Meh`
`13:16.27`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's not an officially supported feature.`
`13:17.28`	`gribouille`	`unfortunately, many featues common in linux distros are not supported`
`13:18.31`	`*** join/#maemo ssvb (n=ssvb___@192.130.196.118)`
`13:19.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Because it's a mobile platform`
`13:19.45`	`GeneralAntilles`	`The capabilities of a desktop or laptop system are practically unlimited compared to the tablets.`
`13:19.55`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Things have to be slimmed down for it to work at all.`
`13:22.05`	`gribouille`	`but why prenvent the user from customizing his tablet if he wants to ?`
`13:22.19`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Nothing does.`
`13:22.55`	`*** join/#maemo SDuensin (n=Scott@228.sub-75-204-55.myvzw.com)`
`13:23.18`	`gribouille`	`GeneralAntilles, I mean without having to hack the OS`
`13:23.37`	`*** part/#maemo Dazgar1 (n=kroyer@mla78-1-82-240-17-188.fbx.proxad.net)`
`13:23.37`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Back to my first point.`
`13:25.58`	`*** join/#maemo seraph1 (n=ecrespo@150.187.78.31)`
`13:26.11`	`RST38h`	`Are we at the "let's use Ubuntu" topic again?`
`13:26.48`	`*** join/#maemo skibur (n=skibur@12.197.204.137)`
`13:26.58`	`wnd`	`I think we're getting there ;-)`
`13:27.52`	`keesj`	`the modest client starts by default`
`13:28.03`	`X-Fade`	`Trying to let people understand that a machine with about 5% of the power of your desktop can do the same as your desktop.`
`13:28.33`	`gribouille`	`it's not really 5%`
`13:28.51`	`RST38h`	`Can or can't?`
`13:29.06`	`X-Fade`	`RST38h: Can't.. sorry..`
`13:29.26`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: As funny as it is, it can (and it is a bit more than 5% anyway)`
`13:29.43`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: But most applications spend an awful lot of time waiting for user input, so it is not that bad`
`13:30.15`	`X-Fade`	`RST38h: I have 4GB in my desktop with a 4 core cpu that has all kind of multimedia optimizations..`
`13:30.25`	`X-Fade`	`It can run a lot more at the same time.`
`13:30.30`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: But there is still screensize, memory size, available storage, and input method defficiencies to consider`
`13:30.32`	`Mel\|BRB`	`I don't understand the feeling of "wanting more" when what the nokia does is incredible in the first place`
`13:30.40`	`keesj`	`funny enough it is the bt keyboard that is not handler in a timely fasion`
`13:30.58`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: That is you. I have a plain 1.1GHz Centrino with 1GB`
`13:31.05`	`hrw`	`Mel\|BRB: o yes, they do lot. and how much in bad style..`
`13:31.06`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: It still does the job`
`13:31.46`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: With Trident video (the post-bankrupcy one)`
`13:32.01`	`*** join/#maemo jnettlet (n=jnettlet@218.104.123.72)`
`13:32.06`	`X-Fade`	`RST38h: Sure, but remove 800 mb ram, disable swap etc. Then you will feel the pain too.`
`13:32.39`	`Mel\|BRB`	`5 yrs ago we couldn't have imagined that something so small could do all that we can do on our nokias. And in 5 more years there will be even more that you can do with space so small.. but wanting tomorrows technology today seems a bit unfair..`
`13:33.30`	`Mel\|BRB`	`Okay.. Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now :P`
`13:33.37`	`hrw`	`Mel\|BRB: 5 years ago I did not thought that one day I will have to hack 'open' device to have something done right...`
`13:33.55`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: I did a lot of development on FreeBSD running on a 90MHz Pentium ;)`
`13:33.59`	`RST38h`	`8MB RAM`
`13:34.16`	`X-Fade`	`RST38h: Yeah, but try to run current firefox on it..`
`13:34.22`	`hrw`	`my slowest linux box was 386sx+fpu+5MB ram + 120MB hdd`
`13:34.25`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: But still, I do not understand why people want full Ubuntu on a palmtop`
`13:34.29`	`hrw`	`with vga mono monitor`
`13:34.36`	`X-Fade`	`People expect to run current software on 'old spec' hardware.`
`13:34.44`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: Even at THAT time Firefox proved to be a problem ;)`
`13:35.03`	`RST38h`	`OMAP2 is not old spec, it is just in a different class`
`13:35.19`	`RST38h`	`It's a bicycle, not a car`
`13:35.25`	`X-Fade`	`RST38h: Sure, but if I have to explain that to newbies :)`
`13:35.27`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: but why microb was not updated at all since chinook? it is known to be slow and gecko 1.9 moved a lot since microb/chinook...`
`13:35.45`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: Ask timeless, I really don't know.`
`13:35.46`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: Just inform them of power requirements`
`13:36.08`	`Mel\|BRB`	`hrw: I can understand that nokia wants to protect itself. The fact that it's the only products of it's "kind" and we don't have to pay a cent for anything past the model itself leaves me happy.`
`13:36.14`	`RST38h`	`N810 reports 5 hours of active battery use or 10 days standby with full battery`
`13:36.28`	`*** join/#maemo cktakahasi (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132)`
`13:36.39`	`X-Fade`	`RST38h: Those figures are way too low ;)`
`13:36.45`	`Mel\|BRB`	`I tell my mom the things I can do on it. You know what she says, "I can do that on my palm too. I just need to go buy the program." Sorry if I'm happy with what I have.`
`13:36.53`	`RST38h`	`That is 1.1Wh active or 23mWh standby`
`13:36.53`	`X-Fade`	`A month standby can be done..`
`13:36.54`	`*** part/#maemo Cptn-N800 (n=user@158.36.200.185)`
`13:37.00`	`hrw`	`wich 'normal' distro I can just upgrade browser to newer version to get speedups`
`13:37.02`	`GeneralAntilles`	`hrw, blame the release cycles of bundled software.`
`13:37.14`	`hrw`	`GeneralAntilles: or nokia/maemo itself`
`13:37.22`	`RST38h`	`X-Fade: Well, I guess they mean "standby with this particular set of bg apps"`
`13:37.23`	`GeneralAntilles`	`i.e. Nokia`
`13:37.25`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: chinook is not capable of updates without flashing..`
`13:37.32`	`RST38h`	`Because these numbers are computed dynamically`
`13:37.38`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: Let's see when diablo is out..`
`13:37.42`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: none of maemo releases is and rather none will be`
`13:37.53`	`hrw`	`s/is/was`
`13:38.09`	`RST38h`	`But if you compare 1.1/0.23 with Atom's declared figures, it is laughable`
`13:38.18`	`RST38h`	`0.023, sorry`
`13:38.41`	`RST38h`	`Just the Atom CPU (800MHz) requires 2.5Wh/0.1Wh`
`13:38.52`	`*** join/#maemo Crfrod (n=Crfrod@88.214.193.26)`
`13:39.05`	`RST38h`	`Yes, you can run "full Ubuntu" on it, but not for very long, and what for?`
`13:40.06`	`hrw`	`RST38h: basically you will get hit very fast when try to use non-maemo system on nokia tablets`
`13:40.18`	`RST38h`	`hrw: Not necessarily`
`13:40.21`	`hrw`	`RST38h: no battery status`
`13:40.31`	`RST38h`	`hrw: First, you are unlikely to do any worse than 5 hours`
`13:40.40`	`*** join/#maemo wms (n=wms___@198.146.5.197)`
`13:40.55`	`hrw`	`RST38h: depends on what is running`
`13:40.59`	`RST38h`	`hrw: Which is still pretty decent for this kind of system with this kidn of battery`
`13:40.59`	`dragorn`	`RST38h: unless you don't put the wifi device to sleep properly, then you get about 2`
`13:41.25`	`hrw`	`RST38h: no one likes to have device dying just because battery out`
`13:41.26`	`RST38h`	`hrw: Second, nothing prohibits you from implementing power-saving`
`13:41.38`	`hrw`	`dragorn: if you will get wifi working`
`13:41.53`	`RST38h`	`Let's assume that you sign an NDA and get the documentation`
`13:41.56`	`hrw`	`RST38h: do you have datasheets for hardware?`
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`13:42.19`	`RST38h`	`hrw: I don't, but somebody the size of Canonical should have no problems getting them`
`13:42.21`	`hrw`	`RST38h: brb`
`13:42.22`	`dragorn`	`hrw: I have yet to find a way to restore the power save settings from inside nokia, let alone from a hacked firmware, and I've spent a fair amount of time on it. Then again, it also turned out to NOT be the cause of the drivers sucking, they just still suck.`
`13:42.38`	`hrw`	`daughter calls`
`13:43.19`	`dragorn`	`As far as wifi drivers, the chipset is already understood, it's a prism54 with a softmac. the problem is conexant put a bunch of custom stuff on it and stuck it on the SPI bus. The custom stuff makes calibration hard/obscured.`
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`13:47.31`	`*** join/#maemo teenel (n=chatzill@222.131.139.81)`
`13:48.46`	`hrw`	`dragorn: spi bus is not so big problem`
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`13:49.19`	`fysa`	`wonderful wide scrollbar`
`13:49.42`	`dragorn`	`hrw: correct, other than breaking things until it's supported. However the configuration data nokia uses IS a big problem. if you really care, go look on the linux kernel wireless mailing list logs and look at johannes' work`
`13:50.14`	`hrw`	`dragorn: thx but I already fought a bit with umac.ko and companies and got tired`
`13:50.38`	`hrw`	`for now I will stay with 'running non-maemo on tablets are not granted to be usable'`
`13:50.41`	`dragorn`	`yup, but this has nothing to do with umac.ko, this is about implementing an open driver. But whatever.`
`13:50.54`	`dragorn`	`and running maemo on it is not granted to be usable in any edge cases, unfortunately`
`13:51.07`	`hrw`	`dragorn: at least it gives working battery/bt/wifi`
`13:51.16`	`dragorn`	`hrw: depending what you need to do with wifi, yup`
`13:51.16`	`hrw`	`and non-working i18n ;D`
`13:51.37`	`hrw`	`dragorn: scan for networks, connect to clean/wep/wpa ones`
`13:51.57`	`hrw`	`dragorn: I use n810 as irc/im/web client mostly`
`13:52.03`	`dragorn`	`hrw: my biggest gripes are a broken usb dma system making some of my hw unworkable, worked in the beta and not in the release so all that code is worthless now, and completely borked rfmon making my other primary use for the device useless as well.`
`13:52.10`	`hrw`	`it lack good PIM with alarms`
`13:52.55`	`hrw`	`dragorn: simple - next time you will choose hardware more detailing`
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`13:53.19`	`dragorn`	`hrw: yes, it's obviously my fault that I wanted to support additional platforms with my stuff, my mistake.`
`13:53.32`	`dragorn`	`hrw: thanks for clearing that up`
`13:53.39`	`hrw`	`that was not what I wanted to say but let it be`
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`13:54.00`	`mgedmin`	`has a toaster that could use some extra software... not really`
`13:54.26`	`hrw`	`dragorn: it is hard to require nicely working HW from companies which do not care too much`
`13:54.43`	`mgedmin`	`I admit when I bought my first 770 I thought all of the software on it was opensource, and was very disappointed`
`13:54.46`	`*** join/#maemo sergio_ (n=sergio@fanzine.igalia.com)`
`13:55.09`	`dragorn`	`hrw: it's unfortunate that the team at nokia who did the device did such a good job, and appear to have no support from anyone else in the company towards taking it the last steps to make it a great devie`
`13:56.17`	`dragorn`	`especially when code that would sell more devices for them won't work solely because of software inadequacies.`
`13:56.24`	`mgedmin`	`fears that there are more people in the world who think the ultra-closed iPhone is a great device than people who think the completely-open OpenMoko is a great device`
`13:56.57`	`hrw`	`daughter calls`
`13:59.16`	`Navi`	`While the iPhone is puke, it has a better form than the Freerunner`
`14:01.11`	`MangoFusion`	`ideals and implementations are two different things ;)`
`14:04.03`	`hrw`	`indeed`
`14:04.21`	`hrw`	`openmoko team needs more time to give usable software for their hardware`
`14:04.27`	`lardman`	`I would simply like to have more transparency in the decision making process`
`14:04.31`	`hrw`	`hardware with 8 years old gsm modem...`
`14:04.43`	`lardman`	`I would like to know why such and such hasn't been done, etc`
`14:04.56`	`hrw`	`lardman: or why was done in wrong way`
`14:05.02`	`lardman`	`indeed`
`14:05.30`	`hrw`	`mgedmin: iphone has nicer hardware then openmoko phones`
`14:06.13`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: I don't think you will ever get the tech docs for the gsm modem in the iphone ;)`
`14:06.21`	`lardman`	`hrw: but the fun is in making it work surely; not so much fun to have something that already works (imo anyway)`
`14:06.58`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: officially I do not have openmoko one too`
`14:07.16`	`lardman`	`hrw: though it's also not much fun not knowing how to get something to work...`
`14:07.38`	`hrw`	`lardman: I would prefer to get opensourced maemo`
`14:08.21`	`hrw`	`hacking open maemo would be probably more fun then writing from scratch 5th set of openmoko ideas`
`14:09.04`	`X-Fade`	`Getting tech docs for hardware will always be hard if companies think that it is their IP. And I think they keep certain things under NDA because they have flaws..`
`14:09.18`	`X-Fade`	`And don't want to look bad for othere..`
`14:09.23`	`*** join/#maemo Xxaxx (n=combat@users.stanitsa.org)`
`14:09.28`	`X-Fade`	`*others.`
`14:09.36`	`lardman`	`hrw: yes indeed, I was thinking more of the hardware`
`14:10.07`	`MangoFusion`	`nah, its just to keep the competition at bay`
`14:10.20`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: at least they could make some steps to make it easier to hack for users`
`14:10.30`	`lardman`	`X-Fade: do you think that really matters to them? The people they sell to will see the flaws when they get access to the docs, etc.`
`14:10.48`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: I can use Poky on 770 or n810 but what sense it has without battery info? or with broken wifi?`
`14:11.01`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: Let me think, sell 100M chips for symbian phones without troubles or sell a few openmokos..`
`14:11.01`	`lardman`	`hrw: well we can get battery info`
`14:11.11`	`X-Fade`	`That is how hardware companies think..`
`14:11.29`	`lardman`	`hrw: just rather granular, but I understand your point.`
`14:12.17`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: and when they buy those 100M chips for symbian phones they get 100K of crap gps chips to use in anything for free. I think thats how n810 got gps -- no one in nokia wanted to use it :D`
`14:12.26`	`X-Fade`	`Try to get that point across to the TI hardware department is not easy..`
`14:12.41`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: They work fine with symbian ;)`
`14:12.45`	`lardman`	`I see they are opening up the newer chips though`
`14:12.50`	`X-Fade`	`My n95 has a fix in 10 seconds.`
`14:13.00`	`lardman`	`the 35xx arch manual is available, etc.`
`14:13.01`	`X-Fade`	`lardman: Yeah that looks promising..`
`14:13.10`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: magic letter 'A' in AGPS :D`
`14:13.13`	`lardman`	`shame they don't "back port" the changes ;)`
`14:13.19`	`X-Fade`	`lardman: Is the new hardware that much different?`
`14:13.32`	`*** join/#maemo mazzen (n=mortel@vpn-ce242024.extern.uni-duisburg-essen.de)`
`14:13.41`	`lardman`	`dunno, but for me, the IVA is a newer version and the PowerVR the same`
`14:13.42`	`X-Fade`	`lardman: That they now dare to publish it and not for older versions? :)`
`14:13.55`	`lardman`	`PowerVR the same as in a newer version; so not much use`
`14:14.02`	`*** part/#maemo eton_ (n=eton@ppp-58-8-2-12.revip2.asianet.co.th)`
`14:14.31`	`*** join/#maemo pleemans (n=peter@d5152DF12.access.telenet.be)`
`14:14.40`	`hrw`	`-> food`
`14:17.12`	`mgedmin`	`X-Fade: the wikipedia page about GPS is a good way to reduce your expectations and learn to love the n810's built-in one`
`14:17.14`	`*** join/#maemo eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-2-12.revip2.asianet.co.th)`
`14:17.21`	`MangoFusion`	`X-Fade: fix in 10 seconds? which way are you holding it?`
`14:17.47`	`X-Fade`	`MangoFusion: It uses agps. So it practically does a warm start.`
`14:18.02`	`dragorn`	`mgedmin: I love that it HAS one. I don't love the one it has. :P`
`14:18.24`	`MangoFusion`	`mine tends to take minutes rather than seconds. though then again i usually don't have the maps open 24/7`
`14:18.43`	`lardman`	`Setting up AGPS infrastructure (or piggybacking) is the sort of thing that would be interesting to do if we had some more info about whether we could even achieve the end goal`
`14:19.34`	`X-Fade`	`lardman: The symbian team already does it, the maemo team would need to implement the same.`
`14:19.48`	`mgedmin`	`how? bluetooth to a phone?`
`14:19.55`	`mgedmin`	`AGPS needs GSM or equivalent`
`14:20.01`	`mgedmin`	`hm, AGPS over Internet?`
`14:20.03`	`lardman`	`GPRS message from the base station probably`
`14:20.50`	`lardman`	`fed by that supl.nokia.org server (iirc)`
`14:20.54`	`X-Fade`	`mgedmin: geoclue could provide some info about your location. It could be used to lookup the info..`
`14:21.15`	`lardman`	`X-Fade: the looking up is not the issue, it's how to communicate that with the AGPS chip`
`14:21.36`	`lardman`	`that's the sort of thing that Nokia could give us and people would enjoy (me at least) getting it to work`
`14:23.02`	`X-Fade`	`lardman: I'm affaid that that info is only available under NDA from TI.`
`14:23.36`	`*** join/#maemo Disconnect_ (n=dis@sigkill.net)`
`14:23.36`	`lardman`	`in that case an interface could be provided presumably`
`14:23.36`	`X-Fade`	`Nokia can't just give out this info. (Believe me, I tried to get it for you when I was at the office :)`
`14:23.36`	`lardman`	`Thanks :)`
`14:24.27`	`*** part/#maemo Xxaxx (n=combat@users.stanitsa.org)`
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`14:26.36`	`GeneralAntilles`	`New personal menu out.`
`14:26.42`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Much more efficient.`
`14:27.10`	`dragorn`	`putting the stupidity of NDAing functionality aside, this is something that should have had a dbus api or something so people could at least talk to that API`
`14:27.21`	`*** join/#maemo zserfsnz (n=rrrrrr@96.27.100-84.rev.gaoland.net)`
`14:27.34`	`*** join/#maemo Cptnodegard (n=none@unaffiliated/cptnodegard)`
`14:27.40`	`hrw`	`re`
`14:28.01`	`lardman`	`dragorn: yep, the problem of avoiding the NDAs is an interesting one`
`14:28.26`	`zserfsnz`	`is someone aware of microB extensions for developers ?`
`14:28.45`	`dragorn`	`lardman: Not really, they've been doing it on the other stuff (ie wireless). People will still bitch, but all it would take is another nokia "we won't give you the source" binary with a dbus hook`
`14:29.06`	`dragorn`	`lardman: send x.y.z dbus signal with guessed location to seed the agps`
`14:29.07`	`X-Fade`	`dragorn: Yes, I agree. That is the best way to get around that.`
`14:29.30`	`dragorn`	`lardman: then their own stuff, skyhook, whatever can use it`
`14:29.31`	`lardman`	`dragorn: Yes, I didn't mean difficult, more that we need to somehow persuade Nokia that it's worth a small investment (time) on their part to make us happy & productive`
`14:29.55`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Has anybody filed an enhancement request?`
`14:30.00`	`lardman`	`yes`
`14:30.06`	`GeneralAntilles`	`#?`
`14:30.08`	`lardman`	`I'll find the bug number, hang on a tick`
`14:30.10`	`dragorn`	`lardman: going back to, I get the impression there's like a dozen people at nokia who are really dedicated to the device, with no support from the company at large.`
`14:30.35`	`lardman`	`2890 for AGPS`
`14:30.57`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Voted.`
`14:31.35`	`*** join/#maemo simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at)`
`14:32.28`	`*** join/#maemo NetBlade (n=osku@253-195.dyn.song.fi)`
`14:35.54`	`lardman`	`I've added the interface thing explicitly`
`14:36.01`	`lardman`	`to the bug that is`
`14:38.31`	`*** join/#maemo Trbs810 (n=Trbs@82-171-82-139.ip.telfort.nl)`
`14:38.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's disturbing that the Vista theme has more downloads than mplayer on garage.`
`14:39.10`	`lardman`	`I wonder if that's a problem with some of the enhancement requests; they are read as "some users want a complete solution, we can't do that (for whatever reason, probably time)", while in fact they mean "give us just enough info to do it ourselves, please"`
`14:39.14`	`ImMelody`	`there's a vista theme?`
`14:39.15`	`Navi`	`It's not disturbing :P`
`14:40.04`	`ImMelody`	`I got NuvoPearl and haven't looked at themes since`
`14:40.26`	`GeneralAntilles`	`My personal finding has been that all of the 3rd party themes pretty much suck.`
`14:40.32`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Minus LCARS, of course.`
`14:40.37`	`GeneralAntilles`	`But I can't be seen with that in public.`
`14:40.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Echo is the way for me.`
`14:40.56`	`ImMelody`	`I like the look of Nuvo, except they did a sucky job with arrows`
`14:41.04`	`Navi`	`I like NuvoClear`
`14:41.23`	`Navi`	`but it needs some gtk widget drop-ins`
`14:41.31`	`ImMelody`	`The arrows to scroll bookmarks just look cheap considering`
`14:41.33`	`Navi`	`buttons don't fit very well`
`14:48.08`	`*** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com)`
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`14:52.25`	`*** join/#maemo GvzEvxre (n=timr@70-7-148-110.area7.spcsdns.net)`
`14:53.55`	`*** join/#maemo Disconnect (n=dis@sigkill.net)`
`14:56.03`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (i=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`14:59.03`	`lopz`	`hola`
`15:00.26`	`*** join/#maemo jnettlet (n=jnettlet@c-76-118-159-90.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)`
`15:02.26`	`*** join/#maemo denny (i=denny@freenode/staff/denny)`
`15:02.27`	`denny`	`heyla`
`15:03.23`	`denny`	`trying to install the rtcomm thing, but I'm getting the 'contains updates to packages installed from a diff source, likely to harm system' error. I've gone into red pill mode and I get the same error but with a 'continue anyway' button, which I'm kind of scared of... any thoughts?`
`15:05.02`	`GeneralAntilles`	`http://rtcomm.garage.maemo.org/#install2`
`15:05.05`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Follow those instructions.`
`15:05.33`	`denny`	`that's what I was doing`
`15:06.02`	`denny`	`stage 4 gives me the 'likely to harm your system' error`
`15:06.16`	`GeneralAntilles`	`That's just Application manager being stupid.`
`15:06.16`	`hrw`	`use terminal not appmanager?`
`15:06.25`	`denny`	`so it's safe to continue?`
`15:06.36`	`denny`	`for 'hey, it's only a toy anyway' values of safe, at least :)`
`15:07.15`	`aquatix`	`denny: it might blow up your house`
`15:07.16`	`denny`	`GeneralAntilles: you've done this?`
`15:07.25`	`aquatix`	`chances aren't that large though`
`15:07.38`	`denny`	`aquatix: if I've still got one... some guys were there today installing a ventilation system`
`15:07.52`	`denny`	`apparently I have shiny new holes in my walls o.O`
`15:07.57`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's been a while since I installed the beta.`
`15:07.59`	`aquatix`	`it worked fine here btw`
`15:08.12`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I just use the Collabora telepathy extensions for AIM support.`
`15:08.24`	`aquatix`	`denny: that's the idea of ventilation right? ;)`
`15:08.34`	`denny`	`pretty much, yeah`
`15:09.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Usually not the walls, though. :P`
`15:09.33`	`denny`	`"any hole's a goal", as the saying goes`
`15:10.31`	`*** join/#maemo harry (n=kcome@222.94.48.195)`
`15:10.33`	`aquatix`	`sounds rounchy`
`15:10.37`	`aquatix`	`*raunchy`
`15:10.40`	`zuh`	`denny: I hope you are talking about golf, not sex`
`15:10.45`	`aquatix`	`ghehe`
`15:11.24`	`denny`	`zuh: tetris ;)`
`15:11.35`	`aquatix`	`denny: riiight`
`15:11.38`	`denny`	`I worked out a complete philosophy of life based on tetris once...`
`15:11.43`	`aquatix`	`haha`
`15:11.45`	`denny`	`1. if it fits in the hole, stick it in the hole`
`15:11.51`	`denny`	`2. if it doesn't fit in the hole, try a different angle`
`15:11.57`	`denny`	`2. if it still doesn't fit, try a different hole`
`15:12.00`	`denny`	`uh, 3`
`15:12.10`	`denny`	`4. if it /still/ doesn't fit, just ram it in the hole anyway`
`15:12.19`	`denny`	`I think that was it.`
`15:12.22`	`hrw`	`can someone fix repository.maemo.org server?`
`15:12.23`	`aquatix`	`does it involve hammers?`
`15:12.35`	`denny`	`someone quotefile those two lines ;)`
`15:12.47`	`*** join/#maemo unixSnob (n=jgombos@72.59.84.241)`
`15:13.00`	`hrw`	`it has broken directory listings - no possibility to change ordering, default ordering is by date which is insane`
`15:13.07`	`*** join/#maemo stulli (n=who@dslb-084-057-233-177.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`15:13.18`	`*** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@189.70.20.63)`
`15:17.12`	`*** join/#maemo s_tec (n=william@adsl-76-212-159-238.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net)`
`15:17.57`	`*** join/#maemo ralann (n=ralann@oit-138-84.OIT.EDU)`
`15:18.31`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: What is the problem?`
`15:19.14`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: it has broken directory listings - no possibility to change ordering, default ordering is by date which is insane`
`15:22.49`	`*** join/#maemo cyberholic (n=Miranda@c218236.adsl.hansenet.de)`
`15:23.04`	`cyberholic`	`Hi veryone :)`
`15:27.25`	`*** join/#maemo behdad (n=behdad@209.167.232.101)`
`15:28.39`	`*** join/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@74-61-118-40.anc.clearwire-dns.net)`
`15:29.33`	`unixSnob`	`searches for a GPS tracking app`
`15:29.53`	`unixSnob`	`finds nothing for maemo`
`15:30.01`	`GeneralAntilles`	`"tracking"?`
`15:30.52`	`*** join/#maemo smackpotato (n=user@69.158.250.136)`
`15:30.56`	`unixSnob`	`I want to be able to have my gps position published, in real-time, on the web or the like`
`15:31.11`	`GeneralAntilles`	`gpsd + an http server`
`15:31.14`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Should be damn simple.`
`15:31.34`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Heck, I'm fairly certain somebody has done it.`
`15:31.39`	`unixSnob`	`cool.. i'll check it out`
`15:32.08`	`unixSnob`	`can gpsd access the gps device at the same time as another app (like mapper)?`
`15:33.04`	`mgedmin`	`unixSnob: I think yes, if both use libgpsbt/libgpsmgr`
`15:33.12`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Of course`
`15:33.16`	`GeneralAntilles`	`That's purpose`
`15:33.25`	`GeneralAntilles`	`to provide the gps data to multiple applications and devices. ;)`
`15:33.27`	`RST38h`	`web server may not be such a good idea`
`15:33.30`	`unixSnob`	`i'll probably try to get a little more elaborate.. and try to immitate functionality of http://www.findmespot.com/Home.aspx`
`15:33.54`	`unixSnob`	`I'd like non-technical users to be able to track me.. and perhaps see my position on a google map`
`15:33.55`	`RST38h`	`don't want to run it on the tablet, would probably want to make tablet contact stationary web server by http and upload positions`
`15:34.05`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yeah, actually.`
`15:34.14`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Interfacing with gpsd over the net would be a better idea.`
`15:34.27`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Send the gpsd info to a remote webserver.`
`15:34.44`	`RST38h`	`there may be a service like this already`
`15:34.55`	`RST38h`	`Nokia's Personal Web Server comes to mind`
`15:36.03`	`anidel`	`going home.. bye bye guys`
`15:36.11`	`unixSnob`	`is nokia's service GPS smart? Eg. I just send it position, and it puts it on a map for visitors?`
`15:38.17`	`RST38h`	`unix: I do not know what they are currently doing. Just know that they had a feature like that in development`
`15:38.49`	`chrisak`	`nothing on the forum yet; did the modest update/fix work for anyone?`
`15:40.03`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Is it available yet?`
`15:40.20`	`smackpotato`	`i want to connect a serail terminal over bluetooth over bluetooth can anyone point me in the right direction`
`15:40.53`	`RST38h`	`http://www.gps-practice-and-fun.com/other-gps-tracking.html`
`15:40.56`	`RST38h`	`Check out these`
`15:41.01`	`chrisak`	`just updated via app manager about 15 min ago. now trying fresh install instead of update`
`15:41.20`	`RST38h`	`Modest breaks backup/restore process.`
`15:41.55`	`RST38h`	`One of its XML config files contains "@" characters for email addresses and Nokia Backup dies on these`
`15:42.39`	`\|\|cw`	`smackpotato: pair the rfcomms and connect`
`15:43.42`	`*** join/#maemo ac7s1 (n=ac7ss@c-24-17-138-99.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)`
`15:44.10`	`smackpotato`	`is that simple`
`15:44.48`	`cyberholic`	`ok, i left my girlfriend and quit my job this morning. What for? I am going to start a rock career! http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4356965146143564549&hl=en`
`15:44.59`	`\|\|cw`	`never tried, not sure what you'd connect the rfcomm to on the host though`
`15:45.10`	`\|\|cw`	`unless it's a real serial port or something`
`15:45.38`	`MangoFusion`	`cyberholic: bet you can't press two`
`15:45.42`	`MangoFusion`	`at once`
`15:45.47`	`MangoFusion`	`drums that is`
`15:45.50`	`X-Fade`	`hrw: Yeah, I had noticed the same problem. I don't have access to that machine, but will contact the one responsible for it.`
`15:45.51`	`MangoFusion`	`;)`
`15:45.53`	`chrisak`	`<PROTECTED>`
`15:45.59`	`cyberholic`	`Mango: lol. i thought you meant my girlfriend(s) :)`
`15:46.10`	`smackpotato`	`ill read some more`
`15:46.42`	`cyberholic`	`i was sweating after this 2 minutes! lol`
`15:47.25`	`RST38h`	`Motorola has invested in mobile virtualisation provider VirtualLogix, creating the possibility of a handset that can switch between different OSs almost as quickly as Motorola declares support for them.`
`15:47.35`	`RST38h`	`Umgh.`
`15:47.47`	`iDS`	`Nokia N880 is on the way :D`
`15:48.03`	`chrisak`	`modest prob jusst confirmed on itt; guess wait for "18" :)`
`15:48.16`	`*** join/#maemo TPC (n=andreas@pdpc/supporter/student/TPC)`
`15:48.25`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It works fine.`
`15:48.37`	`GeneralAntilles`	`W17 works fine for me`
`15:48.41`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Not sure what brontide's issue is.`
`15:50.26`	`chrisak`	`odd, wonder what i'm doing wrong on my end :\`
`15:52.10`	`hrw`	`X-Fade: thx`
`15:52.54`	`*** join/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@guest-226.mountainview.mozilla.com)`
`15:54.35`	`*** join/#maemo juergbi (n=juerg@80-219-17-53.dclient.hispeed.ch)`
`15:56.51`	`X-Fade`	`GeneralAntilles: Modest isn't fixed for me too.`
`15:57.00`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Weirdness`
`15:57.07`	`X-Fade`	`I still have the wrong port error..`
`15:57.54`	`chrisak`	`antilles, just to confirm, your .17 can connect to gmail imap?`
`15:57.54`	`X-Fade`	`Rebooted 3 times, changed server settings to imap tls, reboot, back to imaps..`
`15:58.01`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yeah, works fine.`
`15:59.20`	`*** join/#maemo jpuderer (n=jpuderer@76-10-140-107.dsl.teksavvy.com)`
`16:00.04`	`*** part/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@74-61-118-40.anc.clearwire-dns.net)`
`16:00.21`	`iDS`	`what are tv tools for n800?`
`16:00.30`	`cyberholic`	`myth i think.`
`16:01.15`	`iDS`	`and?`
`16:01.25`	`iDS`	`where can i find myth?`
`16:01.35`	`cyberholic`	`well... what exactly do you want? have you tried the download section at maemo.org ?`
`16:01.57`	`*** join/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@74-61-118-40.anc.clearwire-dns.net)`
`16:01.59`	`*** join/#maemo blassey (n=blassey@pc-a81192.wlan.inet.fi)`
`16:02.12`	`iDS`	`cyberholic yes couldn't find it`
`16:02.21`	`cyberholic`	`And the garage?`
`16:02.27`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's in Extras, I believe.`
`16:02.32`	`iDS`	`tnx`
`16:02.55`	`iDS`	`by the way where is the folder of my n800 internet downlod?`
`16:05.56`	`*** join/#maemo Mousey (n=AreYou@dsl093-144-195.sba1.dsl.speakeasy.net)`
`16:06.13`	`*** join/#maemo zoran (n=zoran@239.45.broadband3.iol.cz)`
`16:07.56`	`iDS`	`https://garage.maemo.org/projects/mtv/ here is it?`
`16:08.24`	`*** join/#maemo Ikkakujyu (n=Shiro@ip68-7-66-29.sd.sd.cox.net)`
`16:08.41`	`hrw\|gone`	`bye`
`16:10.26`	`GeneralAntilles`	`X-Fade, also works fine with a clean OS2008 install.`
`16:16.16`	`*** join/#maemo red-zack (n=mk@p5B04512F.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`16:20.11`	`*** join/#maemo pH5 (n=ph5@e178223158.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`16:20.51`	`*** part/#maemo smackpotato (n=user@69.158.250.136)`
`16:21.03`	`*** join/#maemo jani_ (i=[U2FsdGV@pcuf.fi)`
`16:27.36`	`solmumaha`	`anyone know how to make hildon-application-manager to install a local package? via dbus or commandline. i can't seem to find proper documentation for that, they only mention .install files and dbus-monitor didn't help`
`16:29.41`	`derf`	`Why not just use dpkg -i`
`16:29.49`	`*** join/#maemo WormFood (n=wormfood@59.40.76.158)`
`16:30.36`	`*** part/#maemo ImMelody (n=Melody_L@ool-457709f8.dyn.optonline.net)`
`16:31.19`	`*** join/#maemo Synchronicity (n=dieb@unaffiliated/relate)`
`16:32.25`	`*** join/#maemo Masca (n=Masca@131.178.167.167)`
`16:34.39`	`solmumaha`	`it's for an application and dpkg would require root privileges`
`16:38.28`	`*** join/#maemo qwerty12 (n=qwerty12@host-84-9-52-128.dslgb.com)`
`16:39.15`	`*** join/#maemo jwatt___ (n=roslea@ip1-182-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl)`
`16:40.11`	`*** join/#maemo bedboi (n=bedboi@193.204.59.123)`
`16:40.15`	`bedboi`	`hi there.`
`16:42.11`	`*** join/#maemo megabyte405 (n=ryan@146.Red-88-16-221.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net)`
`16:45.55`	`*** join/#maemo jlee17_ (n=jlee17@host-VLTH6x-178.dhcp.stevens-tech.edu)`
`16:46.02`	`*** part/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@74-61-118-40.anc.clearwire-dns.net)`
`16:46.06`	`*** part/#maemo jlee17_ (n=jlee17@host-VLTH6x-178.dhcp.stevens-tech.edu)`
`16:46.27`	`*** join/#maemo rsalveti (n=salveti@189.44.51.122)`
`16:46.36`	`*** join/#maemo jwatt___ (n=roslea@ip1-182-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl)`
`16:51.05`	`*** join/#maemo k-s (n=gustavo@dhcp-178.dynamic.lsd.ic.unicamp.br)`
`16:51.36`	`*** join/#maemo Khertan_on_n810 (n=khertan@193.253.141.89)`
`16:51.47`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`Hi!`
`16:52.08`	`qwerty12`	`Hello, new pypackager seems nice :)`
`16:52.38`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`Thx`
`16:52.51`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`do u have try it ?`
`16:53.10`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`as i need to explain how it works`
`16:53.11`	`qwerty12`	`Not yet I haven't, I just got back from a day out and I'm quite tired actually >.<`
`16:53.45`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and make a documentation on packages upload process`
`16:54.03`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`it s not very easy the first time`
`16:54.35`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`obtain a maemo repository account make a gpg sign key`
`16:55.01`	`qwerty12`	`For me, I don't upload anything to any repos. Any quick and rubbish ports I make, I just mediafire them and place the links on ITT :)`
`16:55.26`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`:)`
`16:55.43`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`so i don t know your port :)`
`16:55.57`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (i=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`16:56.04`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i read less and less itt`
`16:56.11`	`qwerty12`	`Hehe, nothing special what I've done :)`
`16:57.03`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`reading that ubuntu is a great thing for nit ...make me anxious for the future ...`
`16:57.39`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`so i only post about my soft and answer to user having problem with my soft`
`16:57.50`	`qwerty12`	`I love Ubuntu, I use it as my main distro but I don't think it's really designed for the N8*0's. I think the packages available will be great though.`
`16:58.39`	`*** join/#maemo giskard (n=giskard@82.84.127.101)`
`16:59.15`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i don t use it since the auto update feature kill the kernel and rescue kernel 3 times`
`16:59.39`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i prefer less update but more stable process`
`17:00.03`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`it s why i use debian`
`17:00.16`	`qwerty12`	`That's bad luck. My kernel's been updated a lot of times but it still works, the only thing that got killed for me is usbnet so I can't use N800 in usbnetworking mode anymore.`
`17:00.22`	`qwerty12`	`Ah, debian seems great too.`
`17:00.47`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I don't think anybody with any real knowledge has actually contributed anything useful to the Ubuntu discussion so far.`
`17:00.53`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and i think in future i ll give a try to GreenOS`
`17:01.01`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Mostly it just seems to be a lot of idiocy and misunderstanding.`
`17:01.32`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`GA > right ...`
`17:01.37`	`*** join/#maemo hfwilke (n=hwilke_@gateway.grayinsco.com)`
`17:01.46`	`*** join/#maemo greentux (n=lemke@Z4028.z.pppool.de)`
`17:01.47`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and it s`
`17:01.52`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Thoughtfix's latest posts have been more idiocy. <_<`
`17:02.02`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`more and more true for many itt topics`
`17:02.10`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Sadly`
`17:02.15`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's been going downhill for a while, though.`
`17:02.28`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`don t rea anymore thoughtfix`
`17:04.47`	`qwerty12`	`I can't decide whether this will be a good thing or a bad thing. More packages is always good but it means that Maemo may get less developers. If that PDF from the Mojo project is anything to do on, less developers doesn't sound good. At the end of the day, Maemo is designed for Internet tablets and the like and Ubuntu is for desktops. Even Ubuntu Mobile edition has hildon as the gui.`
`17:05.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Like I said, I haven't seen any meaningful or useful analysis of it so far.`
`17:05.51`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`an other thing that irritate me on itt is the war about qt over gtk`
`17:06.01`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`as i don t like qt :)`
`17:06.16`	`GeneralAntilles`	`One thing I _don't_ think will be happening is Nokia moving to just bundling Ubuntu`
`17:06.21`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Since that just plain can't work.`
`17:06.28`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, +1`
`17:06.51`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Way too much stupidity on ITT. <_<`
`17:07.06`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`ga + 1`
`17:07.17`	`*** join/#maemo halleck (n=kororaa@c-66-229-77-129.hsd1.fl.comcast.net)`
`17:07.30`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Reading back through those old technut threads . . .`
`17:07.36`	`qwerty12`	`Anyone know any good hex editors for Linux? All the ones I found suck. I like Hex Workshop and WinHex in windows.`
`17:07.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`absolutely nothing useful came out of all that talk.`
`17:08.00`	`*** join/#maemo jhe_ (n=jhedberg@vipunen.hut.fi)`
`17:08.01`	`*** join/#maemo liia_ (n=liia@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi)`
`17:08.01`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`ga + 1 again`
`17:12.09`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`ga > do u still use my home* applet ?`
`17:12.25`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Just internal temperature for now.`
`17:12.31`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`do u have notice battery drain ?`
`17:12.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Which I'd still like a F/C switch for :D`
`17:12.44`	`gribouille`	`Incredible : the command 'dpkg -L dbus' lists the file /usr/share/man/man1/dbus-send.1.gz, but the file does'nt exist !`
`17:12.57`	`qwerty12`	`gribouille, docpurge?`
`17:13.00`	`GeneralAntilles`	`^`
`17:13.06`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`:)`
`17:13.08`	`GeneralAntilles`	`No documentation is included.`
`17:13.09`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Saves space.`
`17:13.23`	`GeneralAntilles`	`johnx recommended a fortune applet, Khertan_on_n810. :D`
`17:13.45`	`qwerty12`	`That would be fun, does fortune exist for OS2007/8?`
`17:13.55`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Dunno`
`17:14.05`	`GeneralAntilles`	`But it wouldn't be particularly difficult to package.`
`17:14.29`	`*** join/#maemo dhr (n=hugh@CPE00606767ed59-CM000f9fa81660.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`17:14.30`	`qwerty12`	`Nope, cant find it on my tablet. I'll see if I can do it now.`
`17:14.39`	`mgedmin`	`hmm, fortune home applet`
`17:14.56`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`lol`
`17:15.01`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`so why not`
`17:15.03`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`:)`
`17:15.29`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`once someone can compile it`
`17:15.33`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`for maemo`
`17:15.41`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i ll do it :)`
`17:15.43`	`qwerty12`	`I'll go start? But which version lol`
`17:15.54`	`qwerty12`	`I'm leaning towards the debian repos`
`17:15.57`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`the last one ? ;)`
`17:16.17`	`*** join/#maemo _matthias_ (n=matthias@w216-2.wist.uni-linz.ac.at)`
`17:16.21`	`qwerty12`	`From what I read, it varies on distro's, *nix's etc`
`17:16.49`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Just stick to the Debian stuff. :P`
`17:17.06`	`qwerty12`	`Fortune-mod it is :P`
`17:17.21`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Although, I suppose you should make sure it can limit the size.`
`17:17.30`	`GeneralAntilles`	`As a number of them are rather large.`
`17:17.52`	`qwerty12`	`Hmm, why don't we all try? I suckzors :p`
`17:18.03`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`lol`
`17:18.30`	`GeneralAntilles`	`qwerty12, if you do get the initfs logo changed, let me know.`
`17:19.05`	`GeneralAntilles`	`So much more badass than the stupid Nokia hands -> http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/err.zip :D`
`17:19.26`	`qwerty12`	`lol`
`17:19.37`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, I'd like to try but I cannot figure out what that format is. I think it's some sort of binary format due to ash trying to exec it once.`
`17:19.39`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It'd also be nice to change the background color to black rather than white, too.`
`17:19.44`	`*** join/#maemo Crfrodf (n=Crfrod@88.214.193.26)`
`17:20.06`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Since the slow image redraw rate becomes quite apparent when the white blocks show up.`
`17:20.06`	`*** join/#maemo WorkingOnWise (n=workingo@97-83-156-31.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com)`
`17:20.44`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, Not sure about the image (but I guess it can be done with a new logo) but bootmenu.sh can be changed to swap the colours around.`
`17:20.53`	`GeneralAntilles`	`orly?`
`17:21.05`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Blue-on-black to match the images would be nice.`
`17:21.27`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`connection will drop`
`17:21.27`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i unter subway`
`17:21.31`	`WorkingOnWise`	`is there any way to get full flash working in the built in browser, or is there minefield browser now that works properly on the N800? his is for OS 2008.`
`17:21.44`	`GeneralAntilles`	`We have full flash on the built-in browser.`
`17:21.47`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, Yeah the colours are in hex, supplied on the command line. I'll give it a go later, I've been reflashing initfs for most of the day so I don't really mind another go.`
`17:22.04`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I haven't played with the initfs much`
`17:22.10`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I assume I can change it on a booted system?`
`17:22.26`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, no, the initfs is mounted read only.`
`17:23.11`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Mount it somewhere else or change it in fanoush's flasher and reflash?`
`17:23.11`	`qwerty12`	`with initfs flasher, it can be done though if you reflash initfs.`
`17:23.26`	`qwerty12`	`Change it in fanoush's flasher.`
`17:23.34`	`WorkingOnWise`	`nope. If I go to iscrybe.com with the built in browser and hit the login lin I see no login dialog. If I go there with minefield, I can log in but without the menus and popup keyboard working right it is not useable.`
`17:23.47`	`qwerty12`	`Before it asks to flash bootmenu.conf, open a new terminal and cd to initfs_flasher and cd to initfs in that.`
`17:23.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Erm, is flash turned on?`
`17:23.56`	`GeneralAntilles`	`We have full Flash 9 with MicroB`
`17:24.02`	`GeneralAntilles`	`The tablets have ALWAYS had full Flash.`
`17:24.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Are you sure it's Flash and not some AJAX messiness?`
`17:24.43`	`*** join/#maemo db48x (n=db48x@cl-76.qas-01.us.sixxs.net)`
`17:24.56`	`WorkingOnWise`	`GeneralAntilles: that could be. iscrybe is a very ajax heavy site`
`17:26.10`	`WorkingOnWise`	`so is there some way to get a more tables friendly minefield? Or ajax friendly builtin browser?`
`17:26.26`	`WorkingOnWise`	`tables=tablet`
`17:27.06`	`GeneralAntilles`	`You could build the MicroB svn`
`17:27.15`	`qwerty12`	`Hehe someone else can do fortune-mod :P. It needs librecode. GeneralAntilles, I'll work on the black bootmenu.`
`17:27.15`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Though I've yet to hear of anybody having success there.`
`17:27.24`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Hehe`
`17:28.22`	`*** join/#maemo Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback)`
`17:29.09`	`WorkingOnWise`	`so I will have to wait.... iscrybe is the perfect planner for the IT too!`
`17:33.05`	`*** join/#maemo \|\|cw (n=chris@vpn.wilsonmfg.com)`
`17:33.08`	`*** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@pdpc/supporter/active/bilboed)`
`17:35.06`	`*** join/#maemo Synchronicity (n=dieb@unaffiliated/relate)`
`17:38.16`	`gribouille`	`does hildon support drag and drop ?`
`17:38.27`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yes.`
`17:39.05`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (i=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`17:39.21`	`gribouille`	`something I find extremely frustrating is the absence of shortcuts for applications`
`17:39.42`	`GeneralAntilles`	`"shortcuts"?`
`17:39.46`	`*** join/#maemo Khertan_on_n810 (n=khertan@193.253.141.90)`
`17:39.50`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`re`
`17:40.06`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`still no port of fortune yet ?`
`17:40.14`	`GeneralAntilles`	`qwerty12 gave up.`
`17:40.39`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`(ps : i ve never use it)`
`17:40.52`	`*** join/#maemo ustunozgur (n=ustun@88.252.63.113)`
`17:41.19`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`the homefortune applet is near ready :)`
`17:41.37`	`gribouille`	`GeneralAntilles, if there is an app you use often, it is better to simply click on a button to laounch instead of going through the menu hierarchy`
`17:41.51`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Install Personal Menu, IDEA or simplelauncher then. ;)`
`17:42.09`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i ven t still found how to make prefs panel for applet in python ...pfff`
`17:42.41`	`qwerty12`	`Khertan_on_n810, you ported fortune? :)`
`17:42.56`	`gribouille`	`GeneralAntilles, which one is the best ?`
`17:43.00`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`no i m waiting your port`
`17:43.20`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Probably simple launcher`
`17:43.23`	`qwerty12`	`Khertan_on_n810, I had to give up. I'm doing something else ATM. Sorry.`
`17:43.29`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Personal Menu accomplishes a slightly different goal`
`17:43.32`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Worth installing, too.`
`17:43.33`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`no prob`
`17:43.35`	`fysa`	`any ReadBurner users?`
`17:43.52`	`fysa`	`they seem to support Google Reader somehow now, with a possibly more microb-friendly interface.`
`17:44.19`	`*** join/#maemo pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be)`
`17:44.33`	`fysa`	`oh, nevermind, it's silly.`
`17:44.39`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, I've made modifications to bootmenu.sh, after the reboot to restore original inifs, I'm gonna try the white text on black background out.`
`17:46.22`	`*** join/#maemo Disconnect_ (n=dis@sigkill.net)`
`17:47.13`	`qwerty12`	`Khertan_on_n810, I'll try fortune again after I've done this. Meanwhile, someone please port fortune, would save time (and I'm not guaranteed to even make a working port)`
`17:48.19`	`GeneralAntilles`	`begins prodding qwerty12 with a sharpened stick.`
`17:48.29`	`qwerty12`	`OUCH`
`17:51.03`	`*** join/#maemo jegp (n=jegp@200.26.178.71)`
`17:51.23`	`*** join/#maemo jamey (n=jamey@38.99.207.90)`
`17:53.54`	`qwerty12`	`fook, I've half done it. I took the lazy way out with find and replace. Here's what I got so far. I need to finish this off. http://i25.tinypic.com/2u40hfa.jpg`
`17:54.19`	`*** join/#maemo geaaru (n=geaaru@host113-221-dynamic.11-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`17:54.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Ha`
`17:54.30`	`*** join/#maemo MangoFusion (n=jamesu@host217-44-66-133.range217-44.btcentralplus.com)`
`17:54.48`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`grrrr ratp and sncf reclaim now that we use their stupid navigo pass but can t deliver it outside idf !!!`
`17:55.04`	`qwerty12`	`sncf is some French thing right?`
`17:55.21`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`right a stupid thing !`
`17:55.48`	`*** join/#maemo Disconnect (n=dis@sigkill.net)`
`17:55.51`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`maybe the leader in stupidity !`
`17:55.58`	`*** join/#maemo nabaHome (n=naba@a91-154-113-150.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`17:56.02`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and worst useable site !`
`17:56.27`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Woo stupid French things.`
`17:58.10`	`*** join/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@guest-226.mountainview.mozilla.com)`
`17:59.00`	`qwerty12`	`Okay, qwerty12 , think in opposites. I've got the boot menu options sorted out in theory. Now it's time to see if the clear function of text2screen lets you choose a background colour.`
`18:00.15`	`*** join/#maemo zwnj (n=behnam@213.207.217.39)`
`18:00.30`	`WorkingOnWise`	`has anyone got a clue how to get Opera 8 from OS2007 onto OS2008? I really need an AJAX capable browser that I can use on the IT.`
`18:00.55`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`microb is ajax enabled`
`18:01.00`	`qwerty12`	`WorkingOnWise, it would probably depend on Bora specific libs.`
`18:01.12`	`WorkingOnWise`	`that would get messy fast!`
`18:01.12`	`gribouille`	`what other desktop applets are highly recommanded ?`
`18:01.28`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`not mine :)`
`18:01.38`	`qwerty12`	`WorkingOnWise, if you have linux on desktop computer, a good place to start is mounting the bora rootfs and reading the dpkg list for the opera packages.`
`18:01.49`	`qwerty12`	`but the final result probably wouldn't work.`
`18:02.04`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Opera is the absolute WORST choice for AJAX`
`18:02.21`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`gribouille > what applet do u need ? maybe i can do it ...`
`18:02.39`	`*** join/#maemo dholbert (n=dholbert@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)`
`18:03.03`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Besides, you'd be better served investing time into getting the svn compiled than trying to port the (closed) Opera.`
`18:03.17`	`gribouille`	`I need an applet that shows the system parameters like memory usage, IP address, free storage, etc`
`18:03.33`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`it s already available`
`18:03.35`	`GeneralAntilles`	`gribouille, they're all in Extras-devel.`
`18:04.01`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`take a look on maemo.org downloads`
`18:04.08`	`*** join/#maemo hfwilke (n=hwilke_@gateway.GRAYINSCO.COM)`
`18:04.41`	`WorkingOnWise`	`well I have a site I want to use, iscrybe.com, that uses flash and ajax. I cant even log in with microb. I can with minefield but between improper textbox/keyboard popup and not being able to go full screen, minefield isnt reasonable yet. I guess I dont understand why a browser that has full flash and ajax abilities cand do one or the other or both properly, but minefield can.....`
`18:04.45`	`gribouille`	`GeneralAntilles, I have one for each paramter, but I need one with all the parameters`
`18:04.56`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Why?`
`18:05.00`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`why ?`
`18:05.07`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Just arrange all the little ones to look like one big one.`
`18:05.28`	`qwerty12`	`Meh, I think Khertan_on_n810 got it right with separate applets. I don't need every one of them.`
`18:05.43`	`GeneralAntilles`	`WorkingOnWise, because Chinook MicroB is built from a much older Gecko snapshot.`
`18:05.50`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Diablo MicroB will bring it up to date.`
`18:06.30`	`gribouille`	`GeneralAntilles, because I don't need to see all the parameters at once. the applets I have are scattered and take mutch place for little fuctionnality`
`18:06.49`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`ouch deezer work on microb ! great !`
`18:06.49`	`GeneralAntilles`	`So, what, you want something scrollable or somesuch?`
`18:07.11`	`WorkingOnWise`	`Diablo is the next OS?`
`18:07.16`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yes.`
`18:07.20`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Due "Q2 2008"`
`18:07.41`	`*** join/#maemo fab_away (n=bellet@bellet.info)`
`18:08.05`	`WorkingOnWise`	`how good is Nokia at keeping their timelines? please let it be better that Motorola and MS.....`
`18:08.26`	`qwerty12`	`Meh, Motorola and MS both suck.`
`18:08.53`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`gribouille > i ll make a big one when i ll be able to make pref panel for it ... so u can choose what want`
`18:08.55`	`WorkingOnWise`	`lol...and they cand use a calendar at ALL!!`
`18:09.12`	`*** join/#maemo unixSnob (n=jgombos@70-9-216-160.area4.spcsdns.net)`
`18:09.16`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`but at this time i ll keep it separate`
`18:09.42`	`GeneralAntilles`	`WorkingOnWise, if there's a delay, it's only on the scale a few weeks at most.`
`18:09.54`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`but if u want a big one u still can edit the code and merge all. it s can be done easily`
`18:10.26`	`gribouille`	`Khertan_on_n810, ok`
`18:10.40`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`get_ip is the function to edit`
`18:10.59`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`it s return the text to be display`
`18:11.14`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, This is my second go. Wish me luck :/. my battery is about to die soon. off the fetch the charger from upstairs.`
`18:11.42`	`*** join/#maemo _matthias_ (n=matthias@w216-2.wist.uni-linz.ac.at)`
`18:13.24`	`WorkingOnWise`	`well with that info I guess I'll just sit patiently waiting for Diablo, expecting it to solve all the worlds problems :D`
`18:13.30`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i don t understand why so many user like gpe tasks and gpe dates .... it s useless`
`18:13.44`	`WorkingOnWise`	`Khertan_on_n810: i SO agree!`
`18:13.58`	`qwerty12`	`I just like GPE Todo with GPE Summary because then I can put "notes on the desktop"`
`18:14.12`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`hum ...`
`18:14.13`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Khertan_on_n810, have you tried Pimlico?`
`18:14.22`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`ga > yes`
`18:14.29`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`but can t sync it`
`18:14.59`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and it s a bit hard to use whitout stylus`
`18:15.22`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and more hard to access data in python to sync it`
`18:15.39`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`but pimlico task is a great thing.`
`18:15.47`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`not agenda ...`
`18:16.12`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`pimlico tasks need an home applet :)`
`18:16.29`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`but python binding isn't finish`
`18:17.53`	`qwerty12`	`Arg, my N800 sucks :(, I just connected usb cable to computer and I get USB device not supported :(`
`18:18.16`	`MangoFusion`	`i have yet to find a decent pim suite for a tablet`
`18:19.02`	`*** part/#maemo jamey (n=jamey@38.99.207.90)`
`18:19.06`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`i m sometimes working on making a good one ... by modifying winzig to be really useable without stylus`
`18:19.15`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (n=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`18:19.16`	`*** join/#maemo ijon_ (n=ijon@dhcp218-147.yandex.ru)`
`18:19.30`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and make it simple`
`18:19.45`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`at this time the agenda is almost done`
`18:19.53`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`but there is no alert`
`18:20.54`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`and i m still have problem with this stupid hildon widget that have only one signal : 'error'`
`18:21.50`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`is there a way to display a picture in background of gtk.window ?`
`18:22.35`	`pupnik`	`one would hope so`
`18:22.50`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`?`
`18:23.09`	`*** join/#maemo djcb (n=djcb@a88-114-93-194.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`18:23.19`	`pupnik`	`maybe it's related to theming and overrides`
`18:24.03`	`pupnik`	`inz: you know anything about framebuffer? :)`
`18:25.01`	`pupnik`	`this should be running much faster than it is http://pupnik.de/SDL_scrolly_sync.tgz only takes 0-0.5% cpu (depending on nice level)`
`18:26.22`	`gribouille`	`could domeone tell me what homenetstats does ?`
`18:27.08`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, Got it! The boot options could do with some fixing however but I cannot not be officially bothered :P. http://i32.tinypic.com/nq5z0w.jpg. Also linuxrc will need a tweak, I'll look into it.`
`18:27.26`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Cool`
`18:28.36`	`GeneralAntilles`	`OK, I'm starting a wiki article on Modest.`
`18:28.39`	`*** join/#maemo lcuk (i=lcuk@cpc2-oldh5-0-0-cust994.manc.cable.ntl.com)`
`18:29.32`	`gribouille`	`could domeone tell me what homenetstats is meant to do ?`
`18:29.57`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: you were the one who wanted last directory saved in vgba?`
`18:30.21`	`pupnik`	`hi RST38h yeah i think that'd be a good feature`
`18:30.59`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: Done`
`18:31.19`	`pupnik`	`cool :) Thank you sir!`
`18:31.39`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: will be out with the next release. BTW, I am also going to release Maemo version of EMULib in a few days`
`18:31.39`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`bye`
`18:31.44`	`qwerty12`	`Bye Khertan_on_n810`
`18:31.51`	`RST38h`	`Maybe it will be of some help porting other stuff`
`18:31.52`	`pupnik`	`RST38h: you might be interested in that last link i posted`
`18:31.55`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, Arg, linuxrc will take some modding. I'll start on that now.`
`18:31.56`	`RST38h`	`Yep`
`18:32.24`	`RST38h`	`I have added x3 maginfication to EMULib but did not try integrating FB support yet`
`18:32.27`	`lcuk`	`gribouille, you should have asked khertan_on_810 - he hosts homenetstats`
`18:32.33`	`RST38h`	`Still using GtkImage`
`18:32.44`	`lcuk`	`i have no idea what it does`
`18:33.31`	`lcuk`	`gets a lemsip`
`18:33.37`	`pupnik`	`yes i need to do tests using GtkImage vs SDL_UpdateRect`
`18:34.25`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Hrm . . . somebody want to get me a fullsize screenshot of Modest?`
`18:34.31`	`pupnik`	`or some thing else. It looks like there i'm not getting more than about 20fps real drawn frames in 256x240 @ 8bpp`
`18:34.32`	`gribouille`	`is diff available for maemo ?`
`18:34.33`	`GeneralAntilles`	`The ones on the website are small.`
`18:34.49`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: Why the hell are you drawing at 8bpp?`
`18:35.06`	`pupnik`	`because my emu only needs 8bpp. SDL/X does the conversion`
`18:35.10`	`lcuk`	`because most emulators expect a paletted surface`
`18:35.35`	`lcuk`	`hi pupnik btw :)`
`18:35.37`	`*** join/#maemo dougt (n=dougt@guest-226.mountainview.mozilla.com)`
`18:35.42`	`pupnik`	`servus lcuk`
`18:35.52`	`pupnik`	`yes most emus actually`
`18:35.53`	`lcuk`	`have you heard anything about tickets yet?`
`18:35.57`	`djcb`	`GeneralAntilles: http://bp3.blogger.com/_kGFGcbwevHE/R17cA0q0h9I/AAAAAAAAANU/TynEOxfVi5U/s1600-h/modest3000.png`
`18:36.23`	`pupnik`	`no and i'm not making any plans or adjustments until it happens, and my personal deadline is 3 weeks in advance`
`18:36.25`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yeah, saw it on the site, not 800x480.`
`18:36.35`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It'll work for now, though, you mind if I use it on wikipedia?`
`18:36.47`	`djcb`	`no, that's fine`
`18:36.53`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Thanks!`
`18:36.56`	`MangoFusion`	`clipping text with "..." gets very annoying very quickly on a NIT :(`
`18:37.14`	`lcuk`	`MangoFusion, what do you mea...`
`18:37.19`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Does Modest have any sort of logo?`
`18:37.44`	`MangoFusion`	`i mean it just clips just wh...`
`18:37.49`	`djcb`	`hmmm`
`18:38.02`	`lcuk`	`its damn annoying, especially when she is just takin...`
`18:38.08`	`djcb`	`well, if anything it would be it's application manager icon`
`18:38.16`	`djcb`	`ie. the envelop with the maemo-M`
`18:38.31`	`djcb`	`GeneralAntilles: are you make a wikipedia entry?`
`18:38.31`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: Ok, here is the deal`
`18:38.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I'm putting together a draft at the moment.`
`18:38.44`	`djcb`	`cool`
`18:38.52`	`MangoFusion`	`e.g. when i am searching youtube f...`
`18:39.03`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: The display is 16bpp, so whatever code you have drawing 8bpp bitmap will have to do color translation`
`18:39.13`	`djcb`	`i'm sure i can get you some better shots tomorrow`
`18:39.20`	`pupnik`	`yes RST38h`
`18:39.38`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: Color translation 1) takes time and 2) prevents it from using hardware blitter (usually)`
`18:39.52`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Cool, that'd be excellent.`
`18:39.54`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: SO my suggestion is to draw at 16bpp`
`18:40.19`	`RST38h`	`You will be moving twice as many bytes, true, but at least it will have a chance to make use of the hw`
`18:40.30`	`pupnik`	`same thing happens. the problem is with framebuffer sync and/or making sure that framebuffer controller does not try to update more than 256x240`
`18:40.35`	`*** join/#maemo jeddy3 (n=mattiast@81-237-230-160-no83.tbcn.telia.com)`
`18:40.36`	`lcuk`	`RST38h, technically the 8bit palette stuff must be optimised somewhere within sdl since its used by lots of applications and will likely be better in the general case than a single specific fix that can be put in. but i agree in principle what you are saying`
`18:40.58`	`RST38h`	`lcuk: Generalized 8bit paletter will need table lookups`
`18:41.18`	`RST38h`	`lcuk: And no matter how you optimize them, memory lookups suck on ARM`
`18:41.23`	`lcuk`	`and how do you propose to do color lookups without a table?`
`18:41.38`	`RST38h`	`Now, if you want to use a fixed 3:3:2 palette, there is a way...`
`18:41.48`	`lcuk`	`you still need to say palette entry 27== RGB(65524)`
`18:41.58`	`RST38h`	`You write a little piece of ARM code that shifts bits to make 5:6:5 colors`
`18:42.02`	`lcuk`	`the table MUST exist somewhere`
`18:42.19`	`pupnik`	`just recompiled it @ 16bpp jerkiness is slightly different looking at 19 and 21 fps`
`18:42.38`	`pupnik`	`(it's changing one define - no big deal)`
`18:43.15`	`RST38h`	`lcuk: the code looks longer and more complicated than table lookup, but because it is read in a pipeline it works faster`
`18:43.16`	`lcuk`	`but in the specific case, doing SDL at 16bit is faster instantly because its not doing the conversion. however the conversion is required. i said this yesterday to pupnik then slept on it and the palette code is probably the simplest most general approach`
`18:43.52`	`RST38h`	`lcuk: Heheh, you see, if his emulated system has 8bit video, it is probably palette based anyway ;)`
`18:43.58`	`lcuk`	`but this isnt the problem as the arm can push many frames at this low resolution. the actual problem is the tearing`
`18:44.11`	`RST38h`	`And it does not matter whether those emulated palette entries are 8bit or 16bit ;)`
`18:44.23`	`pupnik`	`you could compile the source and run it`
`18:44.33`	`pupnik`	`16bpp`
`18:44.34`	`pupnik`	`Average FPS: 60.004`
`18:44.34`	`RST38h`	`So, no, if he goes 16bpp, it will not cost him extra, most likely`
`18:44.35`	`lcuk`	`back after tea`
`18:44.35`	`pupnik`	`Underruns 122, UPS: 2.166`
`18:44.44`	`RST38h`	`pupnik: What was it at 8bpp?`
`18:44.57`	`lcuk`	`palette entries ARE 16bit, there is a table of 256 of them`
`18:45.00`	`pupnik`	`16bpp`
`18:45.11`	`RST38h`	`lcuk: Exactly.`
`18:45.37`	`pupnik`	`but the framebuffer controller is clearly discarding updates`
`18:46.02`	`pupnik`	`i have to read more about omapfb and the epson controller i guess`
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`18:47.20`	`qwerty12`	`GeneralAntilles, Got it perfectly! Only thing that looks weird is the boot menu options as from previous screenshot but everything except for initial nokia logo is black background with white text. I have to go now and school is starting tomorrow so I'll link to the modified files later tommorow.`
`18:47.52`	`*** join/#maemo playya (n=playya@pD9E08550.dip.t-dialin.net)`
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`18:59.20`	`pupnik`	`RST38h: oh sorry i misread you it was 4 UPS at 8bpp.`
`18:59.51`	`pupnik`	`so that's certainly interesting`
`19:01.32`	`RST38h`	`UPS = ?`
`19:01.39`	`pupnik`	`underruns per second`
`19:01.43`	`RST38h`	`Oh`
`19:02.01`	`pupnik`	`there is a predictive delay that hard-locks the main loop to X frames per second`
`19:02.03`	`RST38h`	`You have just saved one color translation step, that's all :)`
`19:02.16`	`pupnik`	`at fps above 50 i get underruns when using frame buffer tearsync`
`19:02.35`	`pupnik`	`and the tearsync doesn't exactly tearsync very well`
`19:02.43`	`pupnik`	`so i still don't know what's happening`
`19:02.59`	`RST38h`	`Well, there is one more issue`
`19:03.24`	`RST38h`	`Whatever goes on between OMAP and that Epson chip, the Epson chip still refreshes its display at 50-60Hz`
`19:04.10`	`RST38h`	`So, whatever set of regions you are transferring to it, they can't transfer faster than that`
`19:05.25`	`*** join/#maemo hfwilke (n=hwilke_@gateway.GRAYINSCO.COM)`
`19:06.11`	`lcuk`	`thats resolution dependant. if you are running at 800*480 you get 25fps. lower resolutions==faster refresh.`
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`19:07.14`	`*** part/#maemo xuser (n=boo@unaffiliated/xuser)`
`19:08.02`	`lcuk`	`(but you cannot transfer 16bit RGB data at that resolution from main memory to the LCD in that time)`
`19:13.16`	`lcuk`	`documentation for the lcd is here: http://vdc.epson.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=189&Itemid=40`
`19:13.25`	`lcuk`	`(i hope thats the right one now, ive got 2 sets)`
`19:13.46`	`lcuk`	`there is a section indicating the frame rate calculations`
`19:13.49`	`*** join/#maemo ralann (n=ralann@oit-138-84.OIT.EDU)`
`19:14.00`	`lcuk`	`(section 12 of the spec document)`
`19:15.34`	`*** join/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@199-187-165-209.mvl.nwc.static.gci.net)`
`19:16.27`	`lcuk`	`so unless the scaling and display characteristics of SDL->x11->framebuffer are to always setup a full (800*480)screen no matter what selected required resolution is the maximum available refresh rate should change with resolution`
`19:16.35`	`lcuk`	`stops talking to himself now`
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`19:19.25`	`pupnik`	`i find nothing to disagree with`
`19:19.28`	`pupnik`	`reading epson stuff`
`19:20.01`	`pupnik`	`that's the correct one lcuk. used in the n800 and n810 from what i've read`
`19:20.06`	`pupnik`	`a different one is in the 770`
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`19:21.22`	`lcuk`	`the shame of all this is that the lcd should support full hardware double buffering, but because of the framebuffer interaction (and possibly other complications) we dont appear to have access to the interface`
`19:22.03`	`pupnik`	`btw your bookreader looks 'finished' to me from a performance standpoint`
`19:22.28`	`pupnik`	`now add pdf :P`
`19:22.29`	`pupnik`	`ducks`
`19:22.31`	`lcuk`	`i agree :) im just putting in user options now and a file selector.`
`19:22.40`	`lcuk`	`basic pdf should be doable and fast..`
`19:23.11`	`*** join/#maemo frade (n=ivan@a88-114-90-214.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`19:23.19`	`lcuk`	`but i dont know enough about the format to handle bigger ones, maybe we could head towards integrating one of the other readers using liqbase to do the rendering`
`19:23.37`	`chrisak`	`bookreader? sounds interesting, will watch for it :)`
`19:23.39`	`lcuk`	`there are other things which need handling first.`
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`19:24.17`	`lcuk`	`linuxtag invitation being one of them - i want something to take with me that makes me and others go "wow" and i think ive got enough as long as i dont get sidetracked`
`19:24.40`	`lcuk`	`(which i have done for the last 2 days...)`
`19:24.57`	`*** part/#maemo richieeee72 (n=richard@host86-153-229-69.range86-153.btcentralplus.com)`
`19:26.11`	`*** join/#maemo sbaturzio (n=sbaturzi@88.36.136.244)`
`19:26.29`	`sbaturzio`	`Aloha!`
`19:27.06`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Ok GeneralAntilles, I've got the files ready if you want them? File hoster or irc send?`
`19:27.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`DCC is flaky here.`
`19:27.21`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Better put it up somewhere.`
`19:27.39`	`lcuk`	`just try it once`
`19:27.42`	`lcuk`	`you might surprise yourself`
`19:28.02`	`qwerty12_N800`	`GeneralAntilles: ok, i only trust sendspace on tablet, mediafire crashes microb`
`19:28.44`	`lcuk`	`coughs`
`19:28.49`	`lcuk`	`splutters`
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`19:30.52`	`*** join/#maemo practisevoodoo (n=practise@cpc2-lutn1-0-0-cust375.lutn.cable.ntl.com)`
`19:31.14`	`practisevoodoo`	`mocks you all with his new n810`
`19:31.51`	`lcuk`	`wimax edition?`
`19:31.55`	`practisevoodoo`	`no`
`19:31.58`	`lcuk`	`or did you buy an old one :P`
`19:32.21`	`*** join/#maemo vcgomes (n=Vinicius@189.70.242.120)`
`19:32.25`	`lcuk`	`(don't worry, my 810 is nearly new - ive had it since xmas)`
`19:32.33`	`practisevoodoo`	`i wasnt willing to spend the extra for a wimax one, i have a 3g phone, im not in a wimax area`
`19:33.05`	`lcuk`	`you like it though?`
`19:33.25`	`*** join/#maemo MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@189.70.58.68)`
`19:33.34`	`GeneralAntilles`	`OK, here's my abortion of an article on Modest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modest_%28application%29`
`19:33.46`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Muhaha, old but N800 does me fine :)`
`19:33.53`	`practisevoodoo`	`so far, am currently just fighting it while i figure out how to get it to do what i want`
`19:34.14`	`practisevoodoo`	`right now i am working on finding an easy way to see where all my space is going`
`19:34.24`	`qwerty12_N800`	`GeneralAntilles: Nice article :)`
`19:34.33`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's a shit article! :P :D`
`19:35.15`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Ok shit :p but good for the 1st revision (spelling?) :D`
`19:35.26`	`lcuk`	`:O:O general, you are getting bold`
`19:35.27`	`lcuk`	`This software-related article is a stub. You can help Wikipedia by expanding it.`
`19:35.27`	`lcuk`	`Bow before GeneralAntilles or you shall perish.`
`19:35.56`	`lcuk`	`(i bet hes gone back and checked ;))`
`19:36.09`	`GeneralAntilles`	`What, it is a stub. :P`
`19:36.50`	`chrisak`	`size isn't important :D`
`19:36.52`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Stud eh?`
`19:37.43`	`GeneralAntilles`	`If somebody wants to flesh out the history section to a point where it's not entirely embarrassing. . . .`
`19:37.50`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I's got nuttin'`
`19:38.03`	`GeneralAntilles`	`is currently staring at an infobox for Tinymail.`
`19:38.33`	`*** join/#maemo megabyte405 (n=ryan@84.126.78.159.dyn.user.ono.com)`
`19:39.04`	`lcuk`	`does it have to be specific history? or can i talk about my grandma in there?`
`19:39.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`You're welcome to talk about whatever you want.`
`19:39.28`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (n=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`19:39.29`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Then I'll take great pleasure in deleting your drivel. :P`
`19:40.01`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Hehe, off topic, but I should be getting a cat soon, which one is unknown ^-^. My old one died :(, a cheeky bastard when he wass alive though.`
`19:40.08`	`qwerty12_N800`	`s/wass/was`
`19:40.21`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Shelter or breeder?`
`19:40.45`	`qwerty12_N800`	`breeder i think`
`19:40.48`	`lcuk`	`:( @ cats passing`
`19:40.52`	`*** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@189.70.232.141)`
`19:41.24`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Why breeder?`
`19:41.29`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Save a cat, go to the shelter. :P`
`19:41.58`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Hehe, my sister wants a new born kitten`
`19:42.00`	`lcuk`	`got a pair of cats from the shelter (18months old each)`
`19:43.12`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Although, I wouldn't mind one from the shelter. Some of the rspca's stories are horrible :(`
`19:43.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`You know what's interesting?`
`19:44.12`	`qwerty12_N800`	`GeneralAntilles: Enlighten me.`
`19:44.18`	`GeneralAntilles`	`PITA's euthanization rate is worse than any other stray protection agency.`
`19:44.28`	`GeneralAntilles`	`(failed at spelling euthanization there for a little while. ;))`
`19:44.59`	`GeneralAntilles`	`(probably still failed anyway)`
`19:45.03`	`lcuk`	`but do they have highest intake?`
`19:45.28`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Also: s/PITA/PETA/`
`19:45.31`	`lcuk`	`just because X does more of Y does not mean they are any worse than other similar operations`
`19:45.38`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Rate`
`19:45.43`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Percentage`
`19:45.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`97% to be exact`
`19:46.16`	`lcuk`	`thats about 97% worse than i would like`
`19:46.18`	`*** join/#maemo unique311 (n=chatzill@ool-457ae2a6.dyn.optonline.net)`
`19:46.48`	`GeneralAntilles`	`The national average is somewhere in the ~30-40% range.`
`19:47.11`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Anybody here good with IPA?`
`19:47.44`	`GeneralAntilles`	`"Tinymail is named after the girlfriend of the maintainer, Philip. Her name is Tinne. That's why you pronounce tinymail as tinnie-mail instead of taainie-mail."`
`19:48.56`	`*** join/#maemo JussiP (n=jpakkane@xdsl-83-145-207-155.nebulazone.fi)`
`19:49.07`	`\|\|cw`	`then why isnt it tinnemail`
`19:49.19`	`lcuk`	`cos shes a midget?`
`19:49.22`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Because it's a small e-mail framework.`
`19:49.35`	`\|\|cw`	`sounds like it's named after being small then`
`19:49.52`	`*** join/#maemo Dantas (n=Dantas@201.35.247.192)`
`19:49.52`	`GeneralAntilles`	`OK, whatever who cares.`
`19:49.55`	`GeneralAntilles`	`How do I IPA it?`
`19:49.56`	`\|\|cw`	`:P`
`19:50.14`	`lcuk`	`coincience, but let the guy off - he wanted to make her feel better "look sweetie, im not ignoring you for no reason, im coding something in your name" :D`
`19:50.20`	`*** join/#maemo Hrw (n=user@c33-187.icpnet.pl)`
`19:50.23`	`Hrw`	`hii`
`19:50.47`	`lcuk`	`renames liqbase liqtracy or tracybase`
`19:51.27`	`qwerty12_N800`	`liqtracy?`
`19:51.43`	`Hrw`	`someone fremember which xserver was used in os2005 or 2006?`
`19:51.52`	`lcuk`	`yer, its a good hobby`
`19:52.00`	`qwerty12_N800`	`lol`
`19:52.09`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Was it not Xomap, Hrw?`
`19:52.26`	`Hrw`	`GeneralAntilles: was. but which ver?`
`19:52.27`	`lcuk`	`right, im goin hiding inside vmware for a while`
`19:52.29`	`lcuk`	`back later`
`19:53.12`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Hrw: Try checking the 05/06 repos?`
`19:54.18`	`hrw\|n810`	`qwerty12_N800: it is part of os so no packages`
`19:54.49`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Ah, I thought maybe source package at least may be available.`
`19:55.30`	`hrw\|n810`	`was`
`19:55.34`	`hrw\|n810`	`thx for idea`
`19:55.46`	`hrw\|n810`	`it was 6.6.3`
`19:55.55`	`qwerty12_N800`	`np :)`
`19:57.39`	`*** join/#maemo TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org)`
`19:59.04`	`*** join/#maemo megabyte405 (n=ryan@84.126.78.159.dyn.user.ono.com)`
`20:01.30`	`*** join/#maemo hfwilke (n=hwilke_@gateway.GRAYINSCO.COM)`
`20:02.24`	`*** join/#maemo flo_lap (n=fuchs@f048227247.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`20:02.33`	`hrw\|n810`	`hi florian`
`20:02.43`	`flo_lap`	`re`
`20:03.11`	`*** join/#maemo seraph1 (n=ecrespo@200.47.151.107)`
`20:03.36`	`*** join/#maemo becksbier (n=becksbie@81.56.110.31)`
`20:04.32`	`*** join/#maemo mk8 (n=GLaforge@151.16.207.205)`
`20:04.33`	`*** join/#maemo _newbie_ (n=GLaforge@151.16.207.205)`
`20:07.03`	`qwerty12_N800`	`is away: I'm busy`
`20:08.16`	`*** join/#maemo megabyte405 (n=ryan@84.126.78.159.dyn.user.ono.com)`
`20:08.18`	`*** join/#maemo Khertan_on_n810 (n=khertan@AAmiens-151-1-24-77.w83-192.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`20:08.27`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Damn, xchat announce >.<, I've got an 2 1/2 english essay due in tommorow to start lol`
`20:09.01`	`qwerty12_N800`	`^ 2 & 1/2 pages. now im really away.`
`20:09.03`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`how can i force gtkrc_image which is set to false in a python gtk application ?`
`20:10.01`	`hrw\|n810`	`fscking appmanager`
`20:10.29`	`hrw\|n810`	`when maemo will get adept or synaptic... or aptitude`
`20:11.20`	`qwerty12_N800`	`hrw, synaptic and aptitude are no goes :(, unless someone gets me a version that uses apt libs on os2008`
`20:11.28`	`Navi`	`:P`
`20:11.31`	`*** join/#maemo Ivan_Chelubeev (n=ijon@ppp85-141-83-111.pppoe.mtu-net.ru)`
`20:11.32`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`lmoura seem have post a solution some time ago ... but the pastebin link was deleted (too old)`
`20:12.56`	`qwerty12_N800`	`I ported synaptic but the nmap errors kept coming up with version 7 of libapt which was newer than the os2008 one. Aptitude was same problem.`
`20:13.00`	`hrw\|n810`	`qwerty12_N800: no goes? simple recompile would be good for start but rather hard to use`
`20:13.25`	`hrw\|n810`	`fscking maemo`
`20:14.43`	`Navi`	`What version apt libs does OS2008 use?`
`20:15.21`	`qwerty12_N800`	`I tried symlinking to maemo libs but missing symbols. The one with right librariies would crash with numap (smething like that) problems on startup. Worked in sbox fine though :(`
`20:15.26`	`qwerty12_N800`	`6 something`
`20:15.39`	`hrw\|n810`	`6.3`
`20:16.16`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Good news is that diablo should use 7 as the latest svn of app manager needs 7 to build.`
`20:16.42`	`Navi`	`Etch uses 6.3`
`20:17.02`	`*** join/#maemo shackan (n=frob@host192-147-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`20:17.06`	`fysa`	`GeneralAntilles, hey modest master, did we get an update today? ;)`
`20:17.06`	`*** part/#maemo nuxlli (n=nuxlli@189.26.53.34.adsl.gvt.net.br)`
`20:17.15`	`hrw\|n810`	`Navi: iirc os2008 follows etch versions`
`20:17.16`	`Navi`	`Did you try to build against the maemo apt libs using the version of synaptic Etch currently uses?`
`20:18.26`	`Navi`	`http://packages.debian.org/etch/synaptic`
`20:18.31`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Yes, fysa.`
`20:18.34`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It's out and working fine.`
`20:18.38`	`fysa`	`nice`
`20:18.41`	`Navi`	`Woo, fine.`
`20:18.41`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Navi, no. I didn't know such a version existed. If my memory serves me well, only a few modifications were needed for straight recompile.`
`20:18.48`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Navi, thx`
`20:19.15`	`NOCmadman`	`quick question i just installed ssh and from xterm i am trying "ssh root@localhost" and it is giving a bad host key verification it is not even giving me a chance to enter the password. Can i simply delete the hostkey or is there something else i msut do first`
`20:19.18`	`Navi`	`qwerty12_N800, I search the Etch repos before I look at the Ubuntu ones`
`20:19.35`	`qwerty12_N800`	`I was in debian unstable :/`
`20:19.39`	`Navi`	`Heh :/`
`20:20.36`	`qwerty12_N800`	`I had to reflash my n800 because of broken newer apt and app manager and synaptic.`
`20:20.42`	`Navi`	`Mmk`
`20:20.59`	`Veggen`	`NOC: hmm..delete the relevant entry from ~/.ssh/known_hosts ?`
`20:21.31`	`Veggen`	`(should say which line in the error message)`
`20:21.37`	`NOCmadman`	`ok i wanted verification before i tried that`
`20:21.46`	`NOCmadman`	`just moved it and it worked fine with my password`
`20:22.01`	`NOCmadman`	`no clue where the key came from as i dont remember putting it there`
`20:22.57`	`chrisak`	`hey qwerty, i'm looking at the screencapture you posted in the 'idea' thread... is that omweather you've got on tthe desktop?`
`20:24.18`	`*** part/#maemo jegp (n=jegp@200.26.178.71)`
`20:24.55`	`NOCmadman`	`one last quick question before i go back to lurking does os2008 support ipv6 ?`
`20:25.52`	`qwerty12_N800`	`chrisak: yes`
`20:26.03`	`qwerty12_N800`	`NOCmadman: with hacks, yes`
`20:26.06`	`Navi`	`My omweather is borked`
`20:26.11`	`NOCmadman`	`what do i need to add as when i do ifconfig it only shows ipv4`
`20:26.26`	`NOCmadman`	`oh just now getting into it not ready for any real hacks just yet`
`20:26.31`	`qwerty12_N800`	`A new kernel and quite a few packages`
`20:26.34`	`chrisak`	`ok. looks di`
`20:27.07`	`chrisak`	`looks cooler then mine. i must have missed an update`
`20:27.10`	`NOCmadman`	`im to scared to break it jsut yet to change the kernel will try it in a scratchbox first just to experience it before i touch any kernel changes on the actual device`
`20:27.43`	`qwerty12_N800`	`I don't think you can flash a kernel in sbox`
`20:27.52`	`qwerty12_N800`	`compile them certainly`
`20:28.13`	`Navi`	`qwerty12_N800's screenshots are always sexy, especially that cool rss applet`
`20:28.36`	`NOCmadman`	`ok well i will come back to that i have to leave work now boss is shooing me away from the pc lol`
`20:28.39`	`*** join/#maemo megabyte405_ (n=ryan@84.126.78.57.dyn.user.ono.com)`
`20:28.49`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Navi: ;)`
`20:30.07`	`Navi`	`I wish my omweather wasn't completely borked`
`20:30.22`	`Navi`	`It shows today as the second day, and a question mark for today`
`20:30.37`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Reinstall? :p`
`20:30.40`	`Navi`	`Did`
`20:31.17`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Wait a sec, I know the locations of all the settings.`
`20:33.17`	`Navi`	`amazing, app manager just segfaulted`
`20:34.13`	`hrw\|n810`	`Navi: normal`
`20:34.25`	`Navi`	`It's a first for me.`
`20:34.39`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Ok, remove omweather for good measure. rm -rf /usr/share/omweather , rm -rf ~/apps/omweather and with gconf-editor, remove apps/maemo/omweather`
`20:34.51`	`qwerty12_N800`	`happens to me on a daily basis :(`
`20:35.14`	`Navi`	`Yay, gmail's working`
`20:35.24`	`Navi`	`Bah, it's complaining about certificates`
`20:35.32`	`qwerty12_N800`	`too many repo's and apps. app manager insists on caching all the packages.`
`20:36.03`	`chrisak`	`navi, mine does too`
`20:36.23`	`fysa`	`app manager is almost unusable in redpill mode ;)`
`20:36.33`	`Navi`	`modest should get around to adopting a multi-page viewer`
`20:36.35`	`hrw\|n810`	`GeneralAntilles: when diablo release?`
`20:36.45`	`Navi`	`scrolling with a few thousand messages is a pain`
`20:36.56`	`hrw\|n810`	`fysa: same in normal mode :)`
`20:36.58`	`Navi`	`not a viewer, a multi-page list`
`20:37.21`	`fysa`	`I would like something similar to the way Google Reader has 'never-ending scrolling'`
`20:37.40`	`fysa`	`i.e. populate 50 items until you scroll near the bottom, then populate 50 more.`
`20:38.03`	`KotCzarny`	`qwerty12: you should invest some time into unionfs`
`20:38.15`	`qwerty12_N800`	`CustomiseGoogle has a feature like that.`
`20:38.16`	`KotCzarny`	`that way you can make a stable os, then just mount some other partition for changes`
`20:38.28`	`qwerty12_N800`	`KotCzarny: My bash skills are bad`
`20:38.29`	`KotCzarny`	`then if you break something you just remove that overlaid partition`
`20:38.37`	`KotCzarny`	`without actually reflashing anything`
`20:38.39`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:38.44`	`qwerty12_N800`	`The module is fine though :)`
`20:38.59`	`KotCzarny`	`hi everyone`
`20:39.10`	`qwerty12_N800`	`If anyone wants, they can take over that.`
`20:39.15`	`qwerty12_N800`	`KotCzarny: hi`
`20:39.19`	`KotCzarny`	`qwerty12: that were my 2cents, what you will do with that information is up to you :)`
`20:39.40`	`fysa`	`unionfs will be excellent.`
`20:39.58`	`GeneralAntilles`	`hrw\|n810, "Q2 2008"`
`20:40.03`	`KotCzarny`	`i think it should be named 'onionfs'`
`20:40.04`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`20:40.06`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Navi, file an enhancement request.`
`20:40.13`	`hrw\|n810`	`GeneralAntilles: so july`
`20:40.15`	`Navi`	`GeneralAntilles, no thanks`
`20:40.24`	`fysa`	`can you have a unionfs on top of a unionfs? :P`
`20:40.30`	`KotCzarny`	`probably`
`20:40.36`	`fysa`	`USB storange on mmc2 on top of internal flash`
`20:40.38`	`qwerty12_N800`	`KotCzarny: :) but I can't ze shell script :p`
`20:40.43`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Then why the hell did you mention it if you don't actually want it?`
`20:40.48`	`qwerty12_N800`	`^fix ze`
`20:40.50`	`hrw\|n810`	`GeneralAntilles: let me guess - input methods still closed and broken?`
`20:41.00`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I don't know, hrw\|n810.`
`20:41.03`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I don't have a copy.`
`20:41.05`	`Navi`	`GeneralAntilles, I want it, but I'm too lazy to do anything about it`
`20:41.07`	`hrw\|n810`	`ok`
`20:41.17`	`Navi`	`GeneralAntilles, you should know me better than that`
`20:41.22`	`KotCzarny`	`qwerty12: shell script is just a text file containing commands you would like to execute :)`
`20:41.28`	`hrw\|n810`	`GeneralAntilles: nokia internals only?`
`20:41.45`	`qwerty12_N800`	`KotCzarny: This script is looong`
`20:41.48`	`djcb`	`GeneralAntilles: nice work`
`20:42.02`	`KotCzarny`	`longcat is looong`
`20:42.03`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:42.17`	`GeneralAntilles`	`djcb, if you wanted to write up some sort of "About Us" page or something that I could use to flesh out the History section. . . .`
`20:42.21`	`qwerty12_N800`	`It's the script from the 770 unionfs with small modifications for Os2008`
`20:42.31`	`GeneralAntilles`	`hrw\|n810, Hmm?`
`20:42.45`	`djcb`	`yeah, i'll give it a try`
`20:42.46`	`hrw\|n810`	`GeneralAntilles: diablo testing`
`20:42.47`	`KotCzarny`	`but unionfs mounting should be a oneliner, i think`
`20:42.56`	`GeneralAntilles`	`I have no access to anything, hrw\|n810.`
`20:43.03`	`hrw\|n810`	`ok`
`20:43.06`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Diablo isn't released yet. ;)`
`20:43.09`	`Navi`	`He likes to act like he does though`
`20:43.19`	`GeneralAntilles`	`It makes me feel all important n'stuff.`
`20:43.26`	`Navi`	`Leaking information he got from me and refering to official stuff too`
`20:43.27`	`fysa`	`ugh. app manager, why must you update every time I view package info.`
`20:43.28`	`lcuk`	`GeneralAntilles is our cheerleader`
`20:43.29`	`*** join/#maemo alex-weej_ (n=alex@cpc1-acto9-0-0-cust931.brnt.cable.ntl.com)`
`20:44.13`	`KotCzarny`	`hmm`
`20:44.19`	`lcuk`	`evening kot`
`20:44.25`	`qwerty12_N800`	`KotCzarny: it is but the script makes it easy :), if you wanna try it out w/out the script, grab one of the kernels or compile your own with the info I gave and insmod the module :)`
`20:44.33`	`KotCzarny`	`someone should write a pygtk script for an apt-get/cache :>`
`20:44.39`	`GeneralAntilles`	`djcb, if you want me to use that maemo-M email icon as a logo, would you happen to have a copy that is larger than favicon size?`
`20:44.50`	`KotCzarny`	`qwerty: my os is stable :)`
`20:45.01`	`djcb`	`GeneralAntilles: i'll have a look a that as well`
`20:45.02`	`KotCzarny`	`and i have a working base partition for instant cloning`
`20:45.04`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Hehe, good choice`
`20:45.08`	`KotCzarny`	`(~4minutes of work)`
`20:45.14`	`djcb`	`i guess it will take some drawing :)`
`20:45.19`	`*** join/#maemo henrique (n=henrique@unaffiliated/henrique)`
`20:45.26`	`*** join/#maemo seraph1 (n=ecrespo@200.47.151.107)`
`20:45.31`	`sp3000`	`listens to a minute of rather loud new mail notification chiming`
`20:45.34`	`KotCzarny`	`hi lcuk`
`20:45.35`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:45.44`	`lcuk`	`is shuffling`
`20:45.56`	`sp3000`	`wonders if it might want to, uh, throttle that a bit :)`
`20:46.17`	`KotCzarny`	`is yawning`
`20:46.18`	`*** part/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-52-128.dslgb.com)`
`20:46.31`	`*** join/#maemo dforsyth (n=dforsyth@precision.student.umd.edu)`
`20:46.41`	`*** join/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-52-128.dslgb.com)`
`20:47.13`	`*** part/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-52-128.dslgb.com)`
`20:47.28`	`*** join/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-52-128.dslgb.com)`
`20:47.32`	`KotCzarny`	`heh..`
`20:47.37`	`*** join/#maemo dforsyth (n=dforsyth@precision.student.umd.edu)`
`20:47.47`	`KotCzarny`	`should i start cycling too?`
`20:47.58`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:48.04`	`qwerty12_N800`	`moving channel bar to right is bad idea...`
`20:48.23`	`fysa`	`how much extra memory does modest auto-download use?`
`20:49.06`	`Veggen`	`KotCzarny: I hope to get around to bicycling to work, soon. 12.7 km each way.`
`20:49.18`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`none as it doesn t work :)`
`20:49.23`	`KotCzarny`	`i was talking about channel cycling..`
`20:49.24`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:49.29`	`qwerty12_N800`	`lol`
`20:49.32`	`lcuk`	`if you do, get a dynamo and chanrge your devices from it as you ride to work`
`20:49.42`	`KotCzarny`	`2 dynamos > 1 dynamo`
`20:49.49`	`lcuk`	`4 > 2`
`20:49.59`	`qwerty12_N800`	`6 > 4`
`20:50.03`	`qwerty12_N800`	`1000 > 500`
`20:50.08`	`KotCzarny`	`* > 1000`
`20:50.37`	`qwerty12_N800`	`<3 > 100`
`20:50.45`	`qwerty12_N800`	`*1000`
`20:50.59`	`Navi`	`</3 > <3`
`20:51.12`	`KotCzarny`	`<3 is just a hidden perversy for women`
`20:51.21`	`KotCzarny`	`they think it's romantic`
`20:51.24`	`Veggen`	`lcuk: I had a year bicycling to work where I almost never let the weather stop me. worst was when I used an hour to work because it was 20 cm snow on the bicycle way :)`
`20:51.28`	`KotCzarny`	`when all it's about is an a*`
`20:51.33`	`qwerty12_N800`	`lol, im'a perv by name ;)`
`20:51.48`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`how can i surclass gtk theme to have icon in gtk button ?`
`20:51.49`	`qwerty12_N800`	`not by nature. :p`
`20:51.52`	`lcuk`	`cool veggen :) braver than most`
`20:52.09`	`KotCzarny`	`snow isn't that bad`
`20:52.10`	`lcuk`	`how did you cope with the ermmm odour?`
`20:52.13`	`Veggen`	`but last automn, I let it slip. and parked the bicycle for the winter.`
`20:52.31`	`Veggen`	`odour?`
`20:52.44`	`lcuk`	`yes, cycling 13km in a morning has to take the freshness off`
`20:52.58`	`KotCzarny`	`:>`
`20:53.00`	`Veggen`	`oh. shower at work.`
`20:53.15`	`lcuk`	`:) double bonus then, if my place had one i would jump at it`
`20:54.02`	`hrw\|n810`	`bye`
`20:54.08`	`qwerty12_N800`	`bye`
`20:54.33`	`lcuk`	`damns not having code generation up and running yet`
`20:54.45`	`KotCzarny`	`code generation?`
`20:55.09`	`Navi`	`You tell the computer what you want and it generates code for you, duh.`
`20:55.10`	`lcuk`	`yer if i am building lots of similar classes i usually template it and give myself all the results from one small definition file`
`20:55.37`	`chrisak`	`i'm confused by some itt threads re: starting/stopping bluetooth using personal-menu command... am i understanding correctly that the hciconfig needed is simply not available for 2008?`
`20:55.45`	`lcuk`	`but the current templates and functions i have are all vb oriented`
`20:56.03`	`qwerty12_N800`	`chrisak: switchonbt ;)`
`20:56.09`	`qwerty12_N800`	`google it`
`20:56.16`	`KotCzarny`	`lcuk: write a converter?`
`20:56.17`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:56.21`	`lcuk`	`lol!`
`20:56.23`	`chrisak`	`willdo, thanks :)`
`20:56.55`	`lcuk`	`ill just take some classes ive done in c as base templates and generate around them - they are in style i require but i need MOAR of them`
`20:57.07`	`*** join/#maemo p\| (n=pi@62.13.169.90)`
`20:57.08`	`lcuk`	`has a plan for linuxtag and it involves lots of code`
`20:57.15`	`KotCzarny`	`lcuk: http://freshmeat.net/projects/vb2c/`
`20:57.16`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`20:57.38`	`lcuk`	`no - ive done all the code i need now - ive built enough little pieces to basically pull off what i want to achieve`
`20:57.58`	`lcuk`	`it certainly doesnt need vb - my mind is totally back into c - vb is a grind now`
`20:58.46`	`KotCzarny`	`hoorray?`
`20:58.46`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`20:58.57`	`lcuk`	`i think so`
`20:59.20`	`lcuk`	`i feel better about it all now and can see a really good project`
`21:00.03`	`Mousey`	`so is it just me or does the new modest crash for everone?`
`21:00.18`	`KotCzarny`	`mousey: downgrade`
`21:00.33`	`Navi`	`Mousey, just you`
`21:00.33`	`Mousey`	`rlly`
`21:00.40`	`Mousey`	`waugh!`
`21:00.53`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`arg !!!!! set_use_stock() don't work too !!!!!`
`21:00.59`	`Mousey`	`does it have a way to do message filtering yet?`
`21:02.05`	`*** join/#maemo dholbert (n=dholbert@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)`
`21:02.16`	`*** join/#maemo dholbert_ (n=dholbert@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com)`
`21:02.24`	`qwerty12_N800`	`Khertan_on_n810: If no one ports fortune tonight (please do someone), I'll do it tommorow.`
`21:02.26`	`qwerty12_N800`	`bye`
`21:02.41`	`KotCzarny`	`desperate call?`
`21:02.42`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:03.46`	`AStorm`	`well, my N810 works correctly after that dissection`
`21:03.47`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`21:04.13`	`KotCzarny`	`..yet`
`21:04.27`	`AStorm`	`no, forever`
`21:04.42`	`AStorm`	`it's really easy to disassemble and reassemble, compared to some laptops`
`21:04.53`	`KotCzarny`	`assuming you have correct screwdriver..`
`21:04.54`	`*** join/#maemo X-Fade_ (n=xfade@159.99-247-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)`
`21:04.54`	`AStorm`	`really built like a cell phone - for easy servicing`
`21:04.54`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`21:05.07`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: nah, for 8 screws total I don't need one :>`
`21:05.11`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`noone know how to bypass gtkrc image theme pref to show stock icon in a gtk button ?`
`21:05.23`	`KotCzarny`	`khertan: ~/gtkrc`
`21:05.29`	`KotCzarny`	`i mean gtkrc-2.0`
`21:06.19`	`KotCzarny`	`heh, scratch that`
`21:06.21`	`KotCzarny`	`i misread`
`21:06.30`	`Mousey`	`holy!`
`21:06.30`	`KotCzarny`	`i'm still sleeping`
`21:06.35`	`Mousey`	`sells his olpc stock`
`21:06.50`	`KotCzarny`	`mousey: what happened?`
`21:07.34`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`KotCzarny > yes but i want only to do it for my python app`
`21:07.37`	`AStorm`	`http://www.chipcatalog.com/Maxim/MAX1703.htm - I'll buy that chip`
`21:07.50`	`KotCzarny`	`buy 10`
`21:07.56`	`KotCzarny`	`i believe they will come handy`
`21:08.03`	`AStorm`	`why? :>`
`21:08.50`	`*** part/#maemo AStorm (n=astralst@unaffiliated/astralstorm)`
`21:08.51`	`*** join/#maemo eichi (n=eichi@ip-80-226-0-1.vodafone-net.de)`
`21:09.05`	`KotCzarny`	`and you could make more sets and sell them :)`
`21:09.08`	`*** join/#maemo AStorm (n=astralst@unaffiliated/astralstorm)`
`21:09.14`	`KotCzarny`	`and you could make more sets and sell them :)`
`21:09.21`	`AStorm`	`heh`
`21:09.32`	`AStorm`	`If I had that much time.`
`21:09.45`	`KotCzarny`	`once you do one it will be easy`
`21:09.51`	`AStorm`	`anyway, there probably are commercial products`
`21:10.01`	`AStorm`	`and I can't compete with China`
`21:10.14`	`KotCzarny`	`yes, you can`
`21:10.16`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:10.34`	`KotCzarny`	`just slap in some fud ;)`
`21:11.24`	`AStorm`	`blah blah ;>`
`21:11.29`	`AStorm`	`too simple a circuit`
`21:11.58`	`KotCzarny`	`Warning - visiting this web site may harm your computer!`
`21:12.01`	`AStorm`	`the only minor problem with this MAX1703 is operating current, 120 mA`
`21:12.03`	`KotCzarny`	`for: www.ffshrine.org/ff8/ff8.php`
`21:12.04`	`AStorm`	`;P`
`21:12.05`	`KotCzarny`	`O.o`
`21:12.15`	`KotCzarny`	`is google overreacting or what..`
`21:12.22`	`AStorm`	`ah, wrong`
`21:12.27`	`AStorm`	`0,12 mA`
`21:12.31`	`AStorm`	`now that's miniscule`
`21:12.33`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`21:12.39`	`KotCzarny`	`but look at Iout`
`21:12.41`	`AStorm`	`excellent step-up regulator`
`21:12.44`	`AStorm`	`max 1,5A`
`21:12.46`	`AStorm`	`excellent`
`21:13.04`	`*** join/#maemo giskard (n=giskard@82.84.126.53)`
`21:13.13`	`*** join/#maemo vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim)`
`21:13.35`	`KotCzarny`	`i think operating A means how much it wastes on operating`
`21:13.35`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:13.59`	`AStorm`	`yes`
`21:14.04`	`*** join/#maemo zce (n=zce@189.4.109.228)`
`21:14.04`	`Khertan_on_n810`	`bye`
`21:14.05`	`AStorm`	`but it's excellent, 0,12mA`
`21:14.07`	`AStorm`	`max`
`21:14.15`	`KotCzarny`	`so where's the problem?`
`21:14.16`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:14.41`	`AStorm`	`price`
`21:14.47`	`AStorm`	`3,3$ at 1k`
`21:14.53`	`AStorm`	`I'll check local prices`
`21:15.08`	`AStorm`	`one costs 20 PLN ;P`
`21:15.14`	`AStorm`	`not too shabby`
`21:15.25`	`*** join/#maemo ken_ (n=user@84.92.70.37)`
`21:15.33`	`AStorm`	`another 33 PLN ;P`
`21:15.36`	`*** join/#maemo seraph1 (n=ecrespo@200.47.151.107)`
`21:16.12`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic303995.html`
`21:16.13`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`21:16.35`	`*** join/#maemo zumbi_ (n=zumbi@121.132.219.87.dynamic.jazztel.es)`
`21:17.56`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: bonus: http://www.kktj.pl/kaciki/techniczny/led/pompy01.html`
`21:18.06`	`KotCzarny`	`ta, widze w linkach`
`21:18.07`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:21.35`	`AStorm`	`well, it has about 80% efficiency at 1,2 Vin, 100 mA`
`21:21.37`	`AStorm`	`too low`
`21:21.48`	`AStorm`	`2.4 is much better`
`21:21.57`	`KotCzarny`	`mhm`
`21:22.00`	`term-sig`	`gowno prawda.`
`21:22.08`	`KotCzarny`	`they are most efficient with high Vin`
`21:22.16`	`KotCzarny`	`24V usually`
`21:22.17`	`KotCzarny`	`;)`
`21:22.25`	`AStorm`	`nah`
`21:22.30`	`AStorm`	`this one is best at 3.6V`
`21:22.45`	`KotCzarny`	`i'm talking about general case`
`21:22.48`	`KotCzarny`	`not this one`
`21:23.09`	`AStorm`	`but it could easily drive N with fairly high efficiency with 2,4V in`
`21:23.19`	`AStorm`	`90-something efficiency`
`21:23.27`	`KotCzarny`	`anything over 90% is ok`
`21:23.28`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:23.51`	`AStorm`	`it's slightly below 90% at 2,4Vin, 700 mA, 5V out`
`21:24.07`	`KotCzarny`	`sounds ok for me`
`21:24.08`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:24.36`	`AStorm`	`if we can get 3,6V, you could drive full 1,5A`
`21:24.51`	`KotCzarny`	`you wouldn't have i think`
`21:25.04`	`KotCzarny`	`it was you with 630mA charger?`
`21:25.05`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:27.12`	`AStorm`	`yes, worked, but lousily`
`21:27.24`	`AStorm`	`750 mA works ok, but is fully loaded`
`21:27.25`	`AStorm`	`:P`
`21:27.38`	`AStorm`	`AC-4E is also close to fully loaded`
`21:27.43`	`AStorm`	`rated 890 mA`
`21:27.58`	`*** join/#maemo Cptnodegard (n=none@unaffiliated/cptnodegard)`
`21:28.53`	`AStorm`	`on 2 NiMH, it can get up to 950 mA current`
`21:28.55`	`AStorm`	`easily :>`
`21:29.14`	`AStorm`	`so, more than enough. Win.`
`21:29.23`	`KotCzarny`	`burn.`
`21:29.24`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:29.34`	`AStorm`	`which part of "up to" confuses you?`
`21:29.59`	`AStorm`	`I'd expect more like 800 mA`
`21:30.01`	`KotCzarny`	`external part`
`21:30.12`	`KotCzarny`	`then why are you concerned about amps?`
`21:30.25`	`AStorm`	`I'm not`
`21:30.39`	`AStorm`	`just thinking... could use it to drive circuitry from the battery port`
`21:30.45`	`AStorm`	`additional win, 3,7V output`
`21:30.50`	`AStorm`	`higher efficiency`
`21:31.07`	`*** join/#maemo practisevoodoo (n=practise@cpc2-lutn1-0-0-cust375.lutn.cable.ntl.com)`
`21:33.49`	`AStorm`	`could drive it from 2x AA with efficiency over 90%`
`21:34.12`	`KotCzarny`	`don't forget a charging port`
`21:34.29`	`KotCzarny`	`so you won't have to get the charger with you`
`21:34.30`	`AStorm`	`you mean?`
`21:34.35`	`AStorm`	`ah, that one`
`21:34.43`	`AStorm`	`charging NiMH is too tricky`
`21:34.52`	`AStorm`	`dV/dT charger is needed`
`21:35.11`	`AStorm`	`it's not as simple as charging that Nokia battery ;P`
`21:35.12`	`practisevoodoo`	`is there anyway to reduce to font size in the programs menu?`
`21:35.35`	`KotCzarny`	`practisevoodoo: yes, theme gtkrc or /home/user/.gtkrc-2.0`
`21:38.18`	`AStorm`	`KotCzarny: well, the charger wouldn't be that hard`
`21:38.24`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:38.32`	`AStorm`	`fortunately that nice MAX1703 has 1,250V reference`
`21:38.38`	`AStorm`	`guess what it'd be useful for`
`21:39.11`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (n=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`21:40.34`	`KotCzarny`	`i wonder on what part all those chinese one-cell chargers are based`
`21:41.10`	`*** join/#maemo Zic (n=Zic@ubuntu/member/zic)`
`21:41.20`	`AStorm`	`i suspect not this one`
`21:41.24`	`AStorm`	`but some linear charger`
`21:41.34`	`AStorm`	`uhm, linear converter`
`21:41.45`	`AStorm`	`that's why they heat up`
`21:44.04`	`practisevoodoo`	`KotCzarny, is there a url for gtkrc editing on the n810`
`21:44.38`	`KotCzarny`	`i would advise looking into existing themes..`
`21:44.49`	`AStorm`	`practisevoodoo: just use the usual gtkrc guides`
`21:44.55`	`AStorm`	`plus read the themes there are`
`21:46.18`	`AStorm`	`wow, 554 transistors in this MAX1703`
`21:46.28`	`AStorm`	`;>`
`21:46.32`	`KotCzarny`	`quite a lot`
`21:47.01`	`AStorm`	`well, there are quite a few op-amps inside`
`21:47.29`	`*** part/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@199-187-165-209.mvl.nwc.static.gci.net)`
`21:47.53`	`AStorm`	`hmm, will need a few tiny caps and a Schottky diode`
`21:48.21`	`*** join/#maemo TPC (n=andreas@pdpc/supporter/student/TPC)`
`21:49.10`	`AStorm`	`and a microinductor too :>`
`21:52.39`	`AStorm`	`hmmhmm`
`21:52.41`	`AStorm`	`http://www.maxim-ic.com/appnotes.cfm/appnote_number/1134`
`21:53.34`	`KotCzarny`	`The diode's forward voltage drop, however, can reduce battery life and efficiency.`
`21:53.39`	`KotCzarny`	`you don't need it`
`21:53.47`	`KotCzarny`	`because you have it already in device`
`21:53.59`	`KotCzarny`	`that is, device runs from battery all the time`
`21:54.10`	`KotCzarny`	`with a little help of charger sometimes`
`21:54.29`	`AStorm`	`...`
`21:54.36`	`AStorm`	`see the real solution in the next pic`
`21:55.05`	`KotCzarny`	`still, it's for devices you create from grounds up`
`21:55.08`	`KotCzarny`	`i guess`
`21:55.46`	`AStorm`	`it's a USB UPS, so, no :P`
`21:55.51`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`21:57.21`	`AStorm`	`stupid diode could be used, but it'd need at least 3,6V`
`21:57.24`	`AStorm`	`and it's wasteful`
`21:57.31`	`AStorm`	`this regulator is much better`
`21:59.22`	`*** part/#maemo zce (n=zce@189.4.109.228)`
`21:59.29`	`practisevoodoo`	`arg, how are you supposed to edit gtkrc? alternativly is there anyway to get root access?`
`21:59.51`	`KotCzarny`	`yes`
`21:59.55`	`KotCzarny`	`install ssh`
`21:59.56`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`22:00.05`	`KotCzarny`	`and mc`
`22:00.20`	`GeneralAntilles`	`practisevoodoo, install easyroot from here: http://nitapps.com/`
`22:00.35`	`AStorm`	`there's vim too`
`22:00.44`	`KotCzarny`	`vim is hc`
`22:00.51`	`KotCzarny`	`mcedit is good for most uses`
`22:00.57`	`AStorm`	`blah, blah ;)`
`22:00.59`	`KotCzarny`	`simple and intuitive`
`22:01.07`	`AStorm`	`and ctrl-happy`
`22:01.09`	`AStorm`	`;P`
`22:01.13`	`KotCzarny`	`and you don't have to remember keymagic`
`22:01.16`	`practisevoodoo`	`yeah i was trying to use vim to edit it but didnt have write rights`
`22:01.27`	`AStorm`	`practisevoodoo: d'oh, use easyroot`
`22:01.35`	`AStorm`	`or set up sudo right`
`22:02.08`	`KotCzarny`	`or just install ssh`
`22:02.09`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`22:02.21`	`KotCzarny`	`openssh that is`
`22:02.41`	`AStorm`	`or dropbear, which is ultralight`
`22:03.08`	`KotCzarny`	`nah.`
`22:03.40`	`GeneralAntilles`	`dropbear is underfeatured.`
`22:03.46`	`GeneralAntilles`	`OpenSSH + easyroot is the way to go.`
`22:03.52`	`AStorm`	`exactly`
`22:04.04`	`KotCzarny`	`if you have openssh then you don't need easyroot`
`22:04.25`	`AStorm`	`nah, local shell is still better`
`22:04.35`	`KotCzarny`	`in what sense?`
`22:04.36`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`22:04.42`	`KotCzarny`	`it's non standard`
`22:05.06`	`KotCzarny`	`and redundant`
`22:05.25`	`AStorm`	`why non-standard?`
`22:05.29`	`AStorm`	`it's almost standard su`
`22:05.40`	`KotCzarny`	`su is standard.`
`22:05.51`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`22:06.41`	`*** join/#maemo MangoFusion (n=jamesu@host217-44-66-133.range217-44.btcentralplus.com)`
`22:07.27`	`KotCzarny`	`one should be trained with 'su' not with 'easyroot'`
`22:08.48`	`AStorm`	`;>`
`22:14.20`	`Veggen`	`I added a line to /etc/sudoers so that I can sudo <anything>`
`22:14.45`	`Veggen`	`(even sudo su if I wish)`
`22:14.54`	`KotCzarny`	`i just switch to root and run mc`
`22:14.54`	`AStorm`	`Veggen: sudo -s, not sudo su`
`22:16.22`	`Veggen`	`ok :) (didn't know about that one, perhaps because sudo su isn't that long to type :)`
`22:16.39`	`KotCzarny`	`one should use su -`
`22:16.40`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`22:17.28`	`*** join/#maemo corq-FL (n=MI5@197.138.204.68.cfl.res.rr.com)`
`22:31.05`	`*** join/#maemo b0unc3_ (n=b0unc3@host-84-223-136-6.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:36.08`	`AStorm`	`hey peeps`
`22:36.28`	`AStorm`	`tell me about package needed for canola to support Vorbis`
`22:44.22`	`*** join/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@199-187-165-209.mvl.nwc.static.gci.net)`
`22:44.56`	`*** join/#maemo j0tt (n=j@unaffiliated/jott)`
`22:50.12`	`*** part/#maemo chrisak (n=chrisak@199-187-165-209.mvl.nwc.static.gci.net)`
`22:51.17`	`megabyte405_`	`AStorm: pick an ogg support package form maemo.org and cross your fingers`
`22:54.35`	`AStorm`	`nope`
`22:54.38`	`AStorm`	`that's not enough`
`22:54.52`	`AStorm`	`lardman said something else is needed`
`22:55.30`	`*** part/#maemo shackan (n=frob@host192-147-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`22:55.30`	`AStorm`	`whee, these Senn CX400 sure are bass happy`
`22:55.56`	`AStorm`	`or I'm too used to bass thin Beyers DT 231`
`22:56.12`	`AStorm`	`or both`
`22:57.14`	`AStorm`	`N810 on AC is audibly noisier than on battery ;P`
`22:57.40`	`AStorm`	`or I need Ohm adapter`
`22:58.01`	`*** join/#maemo legind (n=legind@c-65-96-169-226.hsd1.ma.comcast.net)`
`22:58.03`	`AStorm`	`yes, I need an adapter, N810 output is prepared for 32 Ohm, not 16 Ohm`
`22:59.04`	`AStorm`	`hmm, most of the noise disappears on real load`
`22:59.23`	`AStorm`	`(not hides, but disappears)`
`23:00.10`	`AStorm`	`blah @ cheap electronics ;P`
`23:00.27`	`AStorm`	`analog part of the sound chain could use some work`
`23:00.48`	`KotCzarny`	`The RapidShare Happy Hours are active right now. Have fun!`
`23:00.50`	`KotCzarny`	`lol`
`23:00.51`	`KotCzarny`	`:)`
`23:03.08`	`AStorm`	`N810 has 2x too much power for these efficient earplugs`
`23:04.06`	`*** join/#maemo mazzen (n=mortel@u30-237.dsl.vianetworks.de)`
`23:04.37`	`Navi`	`Heh`
`23:10.33`	`*** join/#maemo halleck (n=kororaa@c-66-229-77-129.hsd1.fl.comcast.net)`
`23:11.58`	`*** join/#maemo SDuensin (n=Scott@12-226-44-250.client.mchsi.com)`
`23:22.38`	`practisevoodoo`	`is there someway to get the fn key to stay on?`
`23:24.45`	`*** join/#maemo DaniloCesar (n=DaniloCe@201-11-39-215.ctame705.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br)`
`23:27.48`	`lcdd`	`keep punching it`
`23:39.17`	`*** join/#maemo lopz (i=Gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz)`
`23:41.21`	`*** join/#maemo dieb_ (n=dieb@189.3.46.22)`
`23:44.27`	`AStorm`	`practisevoodoo: hit it twice`
`23:47.33`	`Mousey`	`is there some special magic key combo i can use to bypass the NOKIA whitescreen of no-info on boot?`
`23:47.44`	`GeneralAntilles`	`What do you mean?`
`23:47.44`	`AStorm`	`no`
`23:47.50`	`AStorm`	`use some other initfs`
`23:47.55`	`AStorm`	`e.g. Fanoush'`
`23:47.56`	`Mousey`	`it's not booting again`
`23:47.59`	`*** join/#maemo woodwizzle (n=corey@user-0c6sr2a.cable.mindspring.com)`
`23:48.12`	`Mousey`	`i'm DOOMED to RTFM the fanoush voodoo magicks!!`
`23:48.32`	`Mousey`	`why god must i learn this tablet inside and out and know everything about it, why can i not just be a simple user?!`
`23:48.38`	`AStorm`	`what?`
`23:48.38`	`woodwizzle`	`does the n800 have a cam like the n810? or is the camera an n810 only feature?`
`23:48.48`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: it has a pop-out camera`
`23:48.58`	`AStorm`	`Mousey: it's real simple`
`23:49.00`	`woodwizzle`	`AStorm: oh sweet.`
`23:49.07`	`Mousey`	`next thing i know, i'll be installing sratchbox and crosscompiling my brains out and CONTRIBUTING and crap!!`
`23:49.14`	`Mousey`	`sigh`
`23:49.16`	`AStorm`	`Mousey: have you already flashed in .51 version?`
`23:49.21`	`Mousey`	`AStorm: no`
`23:49.22`	`Mousey`	`well`
`23:49.23`	`Mousey`	`i did`
`23:49.29`	`woodwizzle`	`AStorm: does the cam work in skype? (if you upgrade skype)`
`23:49.32`	`Mousey`	`but then i sent it to PALCO, and when i got it back, it was the old version again`
`23:49.33`	`AStorm`	`.50 has a nasty bug, but I think .49 is shipped`
`23:49.39`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: no, it isn't on N810 either`
`23:49.56`	`woodwizzle`	`AStorm: damn, then whats the point?`
`23:49.59`	`AStorm`	`Mousey: N8xx or N770?`
`23:50.01`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: SIP`
`23:50.03`	`AStorm`	`:>`
`23:50.07`	`Mousey`	`n810`
`23:50.16`	`AStorm`	`Mousey: mhm`
`23:50.18`	`woodwizzle`	`AStorm: is that like Ekiga?`
`23:50.29`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Gizmo`
`23:50.29`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: yes, Ekiga uses SIP protocol`
`23:50.34`	`AStorm`	`Gizmo too`
`23:50.45`	`woodwizzle`	`I couldn't ever get Ekiga to work under gnome, and all my buddies use skype :(`
`23:50.54`	`AStorm`	`heh`
`23:51.00`	`Navi`	`Skype is annoying`
`23:51.07`	`Mousey`	`can't we all just SIP along?`
`23:51.07`	`AStorm`	`another hit - that Skype 1.4 doesn't support conferences`
`23:51.21`	`AStorm`	`and tends to stutter and die on heavier CPU load`
`23:51.22`	`Mousey`	`AStorm: and skype on n8x0 doesn't support video`
`23:51.27`	`AStorm`	`Mousey: exactly`
`23:51.28`	`woodwizzle`	`Yeah, so is AIM, but I use it over jabber simply because its what the people i know use`
`23:51.39`	`Mousey`	`jabbers all the time jabbers all the time`
`23:51.43`	`Navi`	`Skype likes to be the most popular VoIP service, even though there are better alternatives`
`23:51.46`	`AStorm`	`actually, AIM <<<< Jabber`
`23:51.55`	`AStorm`	`Navi: better? nope`
`23:51.58`	`AStorm`	`more open, yes`
`23:52.12`	`GeneralAntilles`	`These days AIM IS Jabber.`
`23:52.16`	`hrw`	`re`
`23:52.20`	`AStorm`	`their protocol is really nice, and they found a great way to turn users into zombies^Wrouters`
`23:52.29`	`Mousey`	`GeneralAntilles: blah.. nonsense. i run my own jabber server`
`23:52.34`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: more or less`
`23:52.35`	`hrw`	`night watch with daughter ;(`
`23:52.36`	`Mousey`	`i can't run my own AIM server`
`23:52.43`	`Mousey`	`and aim + ssl = not!`
`23:52.46`	`elb`	`GeneralAntilles: AIM is not jabber`
`23:52.47`	`Navi`	`You can log into AIM using the official gtalk client now`
`23:52.49`	`GeneralAntilles`	`Erm, Mousey, AOL is moving over to Jabber. . .`
`23:52.54`	`Mousey`	`XMPP maybe`
`23:53.02`	`AStorm`	`Navi: over a gateway`
`23:53.05`	`Navi`	`Nah`
`23:53.05`	`Mousey`	`GeneralAntilles: oh, well it's about time`
`23:53.06`	`elb`	`there is a beta xmpp AIM service, but it's ... not very stable`
`23:53.14`	`Navi`	`AStorm, not a transport`
`23:53.17`	`AStorm`	`things are changing`
`23:53.22`	`AStorm`	`I want people to use Jingle`
`23:53.32`	`AStorm`	`and more Jingle clients to support video`
`23:53.38`	`AStorm`	`:-)`
`23:53.43`	`AStorm`	`it owns SIP`
`23:53.54`	`hrw`	`AStorm: .51.3 does not differ from .50 release - only bootloader was changed. but for some devices (like mine n810) this was BIG change`
`23:54.00`	`elb`	`I don't know that I'd say that`
`23:54.04`	`Mousey`	`people should all just run their own Asterisk boxes and get it over with`
`23:54.07`	`AStorm`	`actually, Jingle->SIP gateway would be easy`
`23:54.10`	`elb`	`jingle and SIP aren't really in the same space`
`23:54.19`	`AStorm`	`as Jingle allows the use of RTSP`
`23:54.36`	`AStorm`	`elb: they are`
`23:54.38`	`woodwizzle`	`Yeah,but my point still stands. IM protocols are only as good as the people that use them. I could write a flawless open source protocol that could do 1080p video over dialup. But if the people I want to talk to don't use it, it becomes less functional than skype for me`
`23:54.43`	`AStorm`	`Jingle is also XMPP negotiation protocol`
`23:54.55`	`elb`	`AStorm: no, SIP is its own session protocol, jingle requires XMPP`
`23:54.59`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: convert the heathens!`
`23:55.03`	`AStorm`	`elb: yes`
`23:55.08`	`woodwizzle`	`AStorm: I try`
`23:55.08`	`elb`	`well, "jingle" is several things`
`23:55.09`	`AStorm`	`but a gateway would be trivial`
`23:55.30`	`elb`	`but the session part of jingle is an extension to XMPP, which already does a large part of what one wants a session management protocol to do`
`23:55.40`	`AStorm`	`exactly`
`23:55.45`	`woodwizzle`	`we need a big vender like google to make it more mainstream. Google talk is on the way.`
`23:55.52`	`AStorm`	`I mean, Jingle -> SIP is easy`
`23:56.01`	`AStorm`	`esp. if your Jingle client supports RTSP`
`23:56.08`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: sure`
`23:56.09`	`*** join/#maemo pupnik_ (n=pupnik@dslb-088-068-116-233.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`23:56.17`	`elb`	`SIP can use a transport other than RTSP`
`23:56.24`	`AStorm`	`but doesn't usually`
`23:56.29`	`elb`	`SIP is nothing but session negotiation, it doesn't care what you negotiate`
`23:56.34`	`AStorm`	`the only other I know are H.26x`
`23:56.42`	`AStorm`	`s/are/are in use/`
`23:56.52`	`AStorm`	`blah`
`23:57.04`	`AStorm`	`*are in use are`
`23:57.06`	`elb`	`anyway, XMPP + Jingle is fine`
`23:57.11`	`elb`	`a bit heavy weight, but still`
`23:57.17`	`AStorm`	`not that heavy weight`
`23:57.17`	`elb`	`SIP is baroque in its own way`
`23:57.21`	`elb`	`pretty damn heavy`
`23:57.23`	`woodwizzle`	`Other than a slide out keyboard. Does the n810 have anything the n800 doesn't?`
`23:57.31`	`woodwizzle`	`oh and crummy GPS.`
`23:57.39`	`elb`	`requiring XML + all the namespaces crap is the definition of heavy :-P`
`23:57.42`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: micro-USB`
`23:57.50`	`woodwizzle`	`AStorm: oooh`
`23:57.50`	`AStorm`	`miniSD port`
`23:57.53`	`GeneralAntilles`	`transflective screen.`
`23:58.04`	`elb`	`yes, transflective screen is important`
`23:58.05`	`AStorm`	`ah, yes, the screen, which is very nice in sunlight`
`23:58.11`	`woodwizzle`	`yeah but I'm really leaning twoards the n800 for its 2 full size SD ports`
`23:58.16`	`AStorm`	`but still glares too much ;)`
`23:58.23`	`*** join/#maemo seraph1 (n=ecrespo@200.47.151.107)`
`23:58.36`	`GeneralAntilles`	`That's what screen protectors are for, AStorm.`
`23:58.37`	`AStorm`	`keyboard transforms N800 into a real computer`
`23:58.47`	`AStorm`	`GeneralAntilles: sure, I still have to get some good ones`
`23:58.53`	`woodwizzle`	`A real old computer =)`
`23:59.04`	`AStorm`	`no, ubernew high-tech ;>`
`23:59.06`	`woodwizzle`	`i mean common, 400mhz???`
`23:59.12`	`AStorm`	`just with limited CPU power and memory`
`23:59.24`	`hrw`	`<PROTECTED>`
`23:59.29`	`AStorm`	`woodwizzle: it's as powerful as a typical Core Solo`
`23:59.36`	`AStorm`	`it's ARM, not some x86`
`23:59.43`	`AStorm`	`and has a DSP :>`
`23:59.55`	`woodwizzle`	`no 3D accel, and limited RAM`

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