| 00:00.00 | KotCzarny | Nearly 30% of logged Vista crashes were due to NVIDIA driver problems, according to a Microsoft data included in the bundle. |
| 00:00.01 | KotCzarny | lol |
| 00:01.42 | *** join/#maemo SDuensin (n=Scott@12-226-44-250.client.mchsi.com) |
| 00:01.49 | KotCzarny | http://www.techamok.com/?pid=4307 |
| 00:01.50 | KotCzarny | lol2 |
| 00:03.26 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 00:07.14 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@137.147.45.66.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 00:19.25 | GeneralAntilles | Somebody needs to get gronmayer better hosting. |
| 00:26.03 | AStorm | so, no one will give me a link to multiboot loader? |
| 00:26.13 | AStorm | I had it and lost it |
| 00:26.25 | KotCzarny | search for fanoush ? |
| 00:26.35 | AStorm | ah right |
| 00:27.02 | KotCzarny | debugs xmms |
| 00:29.12 | *** join/#maemo guardian (n=guardian@209.101.250.251) |
| 00:31.59 | KotCzarny | wow |
| 00:32.03 | KotCzarny | doublesize works |
| 00:32.04 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 00:32.07 | *** join/#maemo pupnik_ (n=pupnik@dslb-084-059-063-100.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 00:33.20 | KotCzarny | pupnik: i made xmms double size working :) |
| 00:34.08 | KotCzarny | now let's look at z-pos issue |
| 00:37.27 | *** join/#maemo VRe (n=vre@vre.iki.fi) |
| 00:43.05 | *** join/#maemo tjafk1 (i=timj@e176210084.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 00:43.46 | Tama^2 | Light is seen at the end of the tunnel... on wk 13 Diablo firmware the finger |
| 00:43.46 | Tama^2 | detection appear to work. :-) |
| 00:43.51 | *** join/#maemo guardian (n=guardian@209.101.250.251) |
| 00:43.59 | KotCzarny | nice |
| 00:43.59 | Tama^2 | from : https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1629 |
| 00:44.00 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 00:44.10 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah |
| 00:44.15 | GeneralAntilles | Just saw those in my inbox. |
| 00:44.19 | Tama^2 | how does one get his hands on Diablo? |
| 00:44.28 | Tama^2 | >.> |
| 00:44.33 | GeneralAntilles | We could grab a copy when we go on the trout walloping adventure. :P |
| 00:44.52 | Tama^2 | pfffffff |
| 00:45.19 | Tama^2 | uses the trout on GA's face |
| 00:45.22 | lcuk | diablo == minnow stream isnt it? |
| 00:45.24 | GeneralAntilles | I say we also steal the UI spec while we're there. |
| 00:45.30 | lcuk | or whatever its called for the beta |
| 00:45.44 | *** join/#maemo shackan (n=frob@host210-136-dynamic.10-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 00:46.02 | GeneralAntilles | Sardine. :P |
| 00:46.06 | GeneralAntilles | But Sardine is public |
| 00:46.10 | lcuk | thats the one |
| 00:46.10 | GeneralAntilles | Assuming it's even still relevant. |
| 00:46.31 | lcuk | not sure, but read at the start that that was where the betas live |
| 00:47.21 | GeneralAntilles | Internal builds are different from the public beta stuff |
| 00:47.32 | GeneralAntilles | But I think Sardine stopped being relevant with the N800. |
| 00:49.13 | Veggen | evening. |
| 00:50.11 | milhouse | Sardine... is a waste of time isn't it? Never works... always broken... nobody cares. |
| 00:50.24 | milhouse | Nobody that can fix it, anwyay |
| 00:50.38 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe |
| 00:50.39 | Veggen | ugh. "yah, maybe I can stay at work till around 6pm" ended out being actually 1.30am before I got out of there. |
| 00:50.41 | GeneralAntilles | Howdy, milhous. |
| 00:50.45 | GeneralAntilles | +e |
| 00:50.47 | milhouse | hi |
| 00:50.47 | dtahtbot | GeneralAntilles: Error: "e" is not a valid command. |
| 00:51.02 | GeneralAntilles | +dumbbot |
| 00:51.04 | dtahtbot | GeneralAntilles: Error: "dumbbot" is not a valid command. |
| 00:51.13 | milhouse | +die |
| 00:51.14 | dtahtbot | milhouse: Error: "die" is not a valid command. |
| 00:51.26 | milhouse | +help |
| 00:51.26 | dtahtbot | milhouse: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. |
| 00:51.27 | GeneralAntilles | I don't think that bot has any useful features |
| 00:51.31 | lcuk | you would be shocked if it DID know the command and it actually banned you forever |
| 00:51.35 | GeneralAntilles | I love IRC bot help. |
| 00:51.53 | milhouse | +help help |
| 00:51.53 | dtahtbot | milhouse: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. |
| 00:52.01 | GeneralAntilles | Haha |
| 00:52.04 | Tama^2 | useless bot |
| 00:52.05 | lcuk | +help help help |
| 00:52.06 | dtahtbot | lcuk: Error: There is no command "help help". |
| 00:52.14 | GeneralAntilles | The help command on an irc bot is only useful when you already know the commands. |
| 00:52.15 | lcuk | +i need somebody |
| 00:52.16 | dtahtbot | lcuk: Error: "i" is not a valid command. |
| 00:52.22 | GeneralAntilles | +part |
| 00:52.23 | dtahtbot | GeneralAntilles: Error: You don't have the admin capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified. |
| 00:52.24 | GeneralAntilles | +leave |
| 00:52.25 | dtahtbot | GeneralAntilles: Error: "leave" is not a valid command. |
| 00:52.26 | GeneralAntilles | +quite |
| 00:52.28 | dtahtbot | GeneralAntilles: Error: "quite" is not a valid command. |
| 00:52.32 | milhouse | +exit |
| 00:52.34 | dtahtbot | milhouse: Error: "exit" is not a valid command. |
| 00:52.47 | milhouse | +bagofshite |
| 00:52.47 | dtahtbot | milhouse: Error: "bagofshite" is not a valid command. |
| 00:52.56 | GeneralAntilles | milhouse, when are you gonna resurrect Monkey with triggers? :( |
| 00:53.03 | Tama^2 | +fun -bot |
| 00:53.04 | dtahtbot | Tama^2: Error: "fun" is not a valid command. |
| 00:53.11 | milhouse | ah.... no plans at the mo |
| 00:53.21 | milhouse | still got him around somewhere, snoozing |
| 00:53.25 | lcuk | +stop_it_tama:P |
| 00:53.26 | dtahtbot | lcuk: Error: "stop_it_tama:P" is not a valid command. |
| 00:53.42 | milhouse | my linux box needs a bit of tlc first, once i've finished redecorating |
| 00:53.44 | Tama^2 | moi? look who is talking :P |
| 00:54.33 | lcuk | i want to draw on my screen but i cant be arsed writing the persist/restore code for my strokes |
| 00:54.53 | lcuk | is tired |
| 00:55.01 | jott | +google maemo |
| 00:55.02 | dtahtbot | jott: Search took 0.15 seconds: maemo .org - maemo .org: Maemo is the application development ...: <http://www.maemo.org/>; maemo .org - ApplicationCatalog: <http://maemo.org/maemowiki/ApplicationCatalog>; Maemo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo>; maemo .org - Planet maemo: <http://planet.maemo.org/>; Maemo is the application development platform for (2 more messages) |
| 00:55.37 | lcuk | +google dtahtbot |
| 00:55.39 | dtahtbot | lcuk: Search took 0.19 seconds: IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2008-03-03: <https://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2008-03-03.log.html>; irclog2html for #oe on 20080307: <http://ibot.rikers.org/%23oe/20080307.html.gz>; irclog2html for #maemo on 20080226: <http://ibot.rikers.org/%23maemo/20080226.html.gz>; Channel: 20080207_oe.log: (2 more messages) |
| 00:55.48 | *** join/#maemo guardian (n=guardian@209.101.250.251) |
| 00:56.54 | milhouse | +google |
| 00:56.56 | dtahtbot | milhouse: (google <search> [--{language,restrict} <value>] [--{notsafe,similar}]) -- Searches google.com for the given string. As many results as can fit are included. --language accepts a language abbreviation; --restrict restricts the results to certain classes of things; --similar tells Google not to filter similar results. --notsafe allows possibly work-unsafe results. |
| 00:57.16 | milhouse | +google britney spears |
| 00:57.17 | dtahtbot | milhouse: Search took 0.20 seconds: Britney Spears - The Official Site: <http://www.britneyspears.com/>; Britney Spears - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britney_Spears>; Britney Spears | Blackout Magazine - Britney .Com - Jive Records: <http://www.britney.com/>; Posts from the Britney Spears Category at TMZ.com - Entertainment ...: (2 more messages) |
| 00:57.25 | milhouse | fantastic... |
| 00:57.40 | lcuk | would i be silly if i wanted to persist/restore using a c function syntax? ie the actual file could be used to reconstruct the picture if i decided to compile it up, or i can reopen it using my restore |
| 00:57.40 | GeneralAntilles | milhouse is set for the evening. |
| 00:58.06 | milhouse | one handed typing from now on... ;) |
| 00:58.27 | lcuk | milhouse, its actually more logical to use proper image search |
| 01:00.01 | milhouse | good god no - have you seen her lately? mad as a hatter, and looks it too! |
| 01:00.22 | lcuk | shes not that bad, i'd take care of her |
| 01:00.28 | GeneralAntilles | Catch the South Park episode? |
| 01:00.51 | lcuk | no, and i cant watch legally online yet :( |
| 01:00.53 | *** join/#maemo mankod (n=mankod@dsl-200-67-246-119.prod-empresarial.com.mx) |
| 01:01.25 | milhouse | +google south park britney spears |
| 01:01.28 | dtahtbot | milhouse: Search took 0.25 seconds: Hollywood.com: <http://www.hollywood.com/news/Britney_Spears_Set_for_South_Park/5103725>; " South Park " (1997) - Alternate versions: <http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0121955/alternateversions>; Britney Spears To Appear On ' South Park ' This Week - Starpulse ...: <http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2008/03/18/britney_spears_to_appear_on_south_park_t>; (4 more messages) |
| 01:01.44 | KotCzarny | +google porn |
| 01:01.45 | dtahtbot | KotCzarny: No matches found. (Search took 0.00 seconds) |
| 01:01.48 | KotCzarny | lol |
| 01:01.53 | lcuk | lol |
| 01:01.56 | lcuk | safesearch :D |
| 01:01.58 | KotCzarny | no porn on the internet?! |
| 01:02.11 | KotCzarny | what happened when i was sleeping :) |
| 01:02.25 | lcuk | sorry, i thought my mom was comin upstairs so i deleted it |
| 01:02.31 | KotCzarny | oh |
| 01:02.59 | milhouse | +google porn --notsafe |
| 01:03.00 | dtahtbot | milhouse: Search took 0.23 seconds: OSDir.com :: Open Source, Linux News & Software: <http://osdir.com/>; Department of Energy - Homepage: <http://www.energy.gov/>; W3C Public Mailing List Archives: <http://lists.w3.org/>; Wired News: <http://www.wired.com/>; Sciam Observations Scientific American Community: <http://blog.sciam.com/>; NFL Draft: Jason Avant - MSN Video: (1 more message) |
| 01:03.08 | milhouse | wtf? |
| 01:03.28 | lcuk | i think you just triggered the CIA or somethin |
| 01:03.29 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.132) |
| 01:03.43 | KotCzarny | run to the hills |
| 01:03.44 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 01:04.03 | lcuk | i can confirm that google returns unsafe material for your search |
| 01:04.11 | lcuk | but you already knew that |
| 01:04.12 | lcuk | lol |
| 01:04.21 | KotCzarny | :) |
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| 01:06.15 | *** part/#maemo vivijim (n=vivijim@200.184.118.132) |
| 01:07.11 | milhouse | So have I missed much in the world of ITOS? |
| 01:07.19 | lcuk | KotCzarny, do you think that my ponderment to persist data into a rudimentary source file will be ok? (ive done similar for *cough* before now) |
| 01:07.30 | KotCzarny | huh? |
| 01:07.35 | lcuk | just look up a bit |
| 01:07.46 | KotCzarny | i got up a little bit ago |
| 01:07.57 | lcuk | would i be silly if i wanted to persist/restore using a c function syntax? ie the actual file could be used to reconstruct the picture if i decided to compile it up, or i can reopen it using my restore |
| 01:08.01 | KotCzarny | reads question again |
| 01:08.22 | KotCzarny | use xpm for that |
| 01:08.37 | lcuk | +google xpm |
| 01:08.39 | dtahtbot | lcuk: Search took 0.22 seconds: The XPM Format and Library: <http://koala.ilog.fr/lehors/xpm.html>; Index of /ftp/pub/ xpm: <http://koala.ilog.fr/ftp/pub/xpm/>; X PixMap - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XPM_(image_format)>; XPM - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XPM>; Athlon XP-M 2600+: (2 more messages) |
| 01:09.09 | GeneralAntilles | milhouse, Diablo = 4.1 and it's coming soon and the N810 with WiMAX is coming soon. |
| 01:09.25 | milhouse | so, no then? |
| 01:09.27 | milhouse | :) |
| 01:09.30 | GeneralAntilles | Not really. |
| 01:09.33 | lcuk | noooo, i dont mean for the pixels - i will use bitmap or jpeg or lbm or anything required |
| 01:09.36 | milhouse | thought as much - sighs ;) |
| 01:09.51 | milhouse | what does it break this time? |
| 01:09.56 | KotCzarny | lcuk, but try to minimize writes |
| 01:09.59 | GeneralAntilles | Diablo? |
| 01:10.01 | milhouse | yah |
| 01:10.05 | GeneralAntilles | Nothing, so far as I'm aware. |
| 01:10.10 | lcuk | i mean for the strokes and regions and boxes - the vectors etc. writing will be line based |
| 01:10.14 | KotCzarny | you think about some kind of cache? |
| 01:10.17 | GeneralAntilles | It's a point upgrade, so they wouldn't pull any API breaks anyway. |
| 01:10.36 | milhouse | somethings got to break - it wouldn't be an IT OS release without having to recompile everything! :) |
| 01:10.44 | GeneralAntilles | Though we'll see how the new update system goes. |
| 01:10.55 | milhouse | ah yes, that's been a long time coming... |
| 01:11.06 | GeneralAntilles | I'm pulling for some MicroB updates. |
| 01:11.22 | milhouse | I'd like improved GPS - it's utter pants here... |
| 01:11.23 | GeneralAntilles | Getting a newer revision of Gecko in there would really improve the performance. |
| 01:11.25 | lcuk | can we not post more bugs |
| 01:11.32 | GeneralAntilles | Hmm? |
| 01:11.35 | lcuk | whilst its in development things could get changed |
| 01:11.53 | GeneralAntilles | Post bugs whenever you want. |
| 01:11.55 | lcuk | may be an idea to head over and post some of the annoyances |
| 01:11.57 | Navi | GeneralAntilles, browsers normally use Gecko's stable releases |
| 01:12.09 | milhouse | Fix the mental homescreen widgets by giving them optional dragability |
| 01:12.44 | KotCzarny | ability to hide everything would be nice |
| 01:12.45 | lcuk | yes, enter a layout mode and do your positioning |
| 01:12.45 | GeneralAntilles | MicroB is based on an alpha release. |
| 01:12.55 | KotCzarny | and to use alternative wms |
| 01:13.06 | milhouse | Modest as standard |
| 01:13.10 | milhouse | would be good |
| 01:13.20 | Navi | It probably will |
| 01:13.51 | Navi | It was on the in-house alpha/beta testing build |
| 01:14.00 | elb | KotCzarny: to hide everything, just hold the hard task switcher button down for like 1s |
| 01:14.12 | *** join/#maemo vivijim (n=vivijim@200.184.118.132) |
| 01:14.14 | elb | or push it once, and select 'Home' |
| 01:14.36 | lcuk | or pull the battery. may lose data though |
| 01:14.40 | milhouse | navi: great, it needs more exposure - i see lots of maemo planet posts but i don't know how many are actually using it, not a lot i suspect (in relative terms) |
| 01:14.42 | KotCzarny | elb: elb, i mean status bar, menu bar, task bar |
| 01:14.43 | KotCzarny | etc |
| 01:14.58 | lcuk | KotCzarny, fullscreen mode? |
| 01:15.03 | elb | you want to hide it when you're not full screen? |
| 01:15.10 | KotCzarny | yup |
| 01:15.30 | milhouse | of course fixing long standing bugs rather than adding new whizzy features would be a really good idea(tm) - will it happen? doubt it |
| 01:15.32 | lcuk | but why? just goto fullscreen mode from the program you are in? |
| 01:15.37 | KotCzarny | no |
| 01:15.37 | elb | what would this accomplish? |
| 01:15.42 | KotCzarny | you don't understand |
| 01:15.47 | KotCzarny | it will be selective |
| 01:15.55 | KotCzarny | ie. someone don't likes status bar |
| 01:16.02 | KotCzarny | he turns it off in prefs |
| 01:16.11 | KotCzarny | ie. not everything at once |
| 01:16.23 | KotCzarny | but selectively ability to hide every widget |
| 01:17.39 | lcuk | ahhh now i see, but if you make those sections optional you must supply alternative means to get at them |
| 01:17.48 | KotCzarny | not really |
| 01:18.03 | KotCzarny | one can simply don't want some widget |
| 01:18.08 | KotCzarny | and doesn't need replacement |
| 01:18.19 | KotCzarny | it's up to him to choose what to do about it |
| 01:18.32 | elb | oh, I don't see that happening |
| 01:18.34 | KotCzarny | but there should be a choice |
| 01:18.37 | elb | that would change the contract with hildon apps |
| 01:18.40 | GeneralAntilles | I'm hoping flashless updates mean the bundled apps don't have to be tied to the firmware release cycles. |
| 01:18.47 | lcuk | technically, that should be configurable by the theme |
| 01:18.57 | elb | no, "technically", it isn't |
| 01:18.58 | ds3 | updates of the ether! |
| 01:18.59 | KotCzarny | elb: yeah, i'll install fluxbox sooner |
| 01:19.14 | elb | the Hildon UI dedicates specific screen space to those UI elements |
| 01:19.21 | KotCzarny | elb: one can make taskbar width==0 |
| 01:19.22 | elb | (without an overhaul of Hildon) |
| 01:19.24 | lcuk | no, i KNOW it isnt, but the theme should be able to specify location and sizing of elements |
| 01:19.37 | KotCzarny | but it's a hack |
| 01:20.11 | lcuk | we have been hacking since the beginning |
| 01:20.27 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 01:20.38 | KotCzarny | compiles xmms-1.2.11 |
| 01:20.53 | lcuk | writes a quick persist/restore pair |
| 01:29.01 | *** join/#maemo eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-6-123.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 01:34.10 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 01:34.23 | KotCzarny | how to add arbitrary file to the deb package build? |
| 01:34.34 | KotCzarny | ie. that will be included in final package |
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| 02:14.31 | KotCzarny | maybe i should create my own repository |
| 02:14.35 | KotCzarny | *evilgrin* |
| 02:15.03 | WormFood | what a great idea KotCzarny....do it |
| 02:15.49 | WormFood | 5 minutes ago I couldn't connect to my AP.....now I can....this is fuckin' crazy |
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| 03:11.23 | KotCzarny | umkay |
| 03:11.35 | KotCzarny | z-index bug in xmms found and hacked |
| 03:11.37 | KotCzarny | :) |
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| 04:26.20 | *** join/#maemo dospod (n=dospod@cpe-68-206-127-238.stx.res.rr.com) |
| 04:26.25 | dospod | sup |
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| 04:29.14 | dospod | hey yaall |
| 04:38.41 | KotCzarny | http://maemo.org/maemo_training_material/maemo4.x/html/maemo_Getting_Started/images/very-important-piechart.png |
| 04:38.47 | KotCzarny | hehe |
| 04:46.50 | doc|home | only funny because of the image name :/ |
| 04:46.51 | *** join/#maemo Italodance (i=Persia@92.61.181.103) |
| 04:46.54 | Italodance | hi |
| 04:47.03 | *** join/#maemo Tama^2 (n=me@ip-118-90-51-155.xdsl.xnet.co.nz) |
| 04:52.16 | dospod | hy |
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| 04:59.26 | darx | hi.. i just installed minimo from http://home.ufam.edu.br/~agan/minimo/ repo on my os2008 n800. it doesn't run. what could be wrong? |
| 05:00.24 | darx | anybody home? |
| 05:02.39 | darx | can someone hear me? |
| 05:03.34 | Tester_ | there really is no point in install minimo on os2008, the browser is already gecko based |
| 05:05.38 | darx | Tester_: have you tried it? |
| 05:07.18 | Tester_ | minimo, no |
| 05:07.31 | *** join/#maemo ac7ss (n=ac7ss@c-24-17-138-99.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 05:16.01 | *** join/#maemo briand (n=brian@c-68-35-254-149.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 05:17.57 | darx | then STFU |
| 05:21.39 | Tama^2 | nice, how old are you darx? 12 |
| 05:22.15 | darx | just in case anyone was wondering, the error was libdbus-1.so.2 missing, i fixed it by linking libdbus-1.so.3 to libdbus-1.so.2 |
| 05:25.38 | Italodance | xmms is the same winamp lol!? |
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| 05:37.21 | Italodance | what's the latest version of xmms? |
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| 06:06.07 | Italodance | xmms only works with x-terminal? |
| 06:07.24 | *** part/#maemo ac7ss (n=ac7ss@c-24-17-138-99.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 06:20.21 | fysa | what do you get in minimo? |
| 06:20.28 | fysa | doesn't support add-ons, does it? |
| 06:20.36 | fysa | I know it's all bullshit. |
| 06:20.48 | fysa | I'm just tired of all these star wars. |
| 06:21.28 | fysa | actually. |
| 06:21.33 | fysa | xulrunner armel builds on maemo. |
| 06:21.40 | fysa | xulrunner + touchscreen UI might be good. |
| 06:23.01 | msh_ | hrm, just wondering, has anyone played with matchbox's compositing manager? |
| 06:23.26 | msh_ | whether it could reduce the flickeryness with expose events switching apps etc |
| 06:24.02 | KotCzarny | msh: speaking of matchbox, how to make app to show in task navigator? |
| 06:24.22 | msh_ | no idea, sorry |
| 06:24.27 | fysa | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18035 |
| 06:24.54 | KotCzarny | nice |
| 06:25.22 | KotCzarny | samsung? |
| 06:25.24 | KotCzarny | o.o |
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| 06:29.07 | fysa | maybe a UI for the Q |
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| 06:31.45 | Italodance | is xmms only works with x-terminal? |
| 06:34.32 | Italodance | hellooooo |
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| 07:08.27 | msh_ | anyone got an idea how to stop the windowmanager eithe rwith matchbox.sh or dsmetool? |
| 07:08.30 | msh_ | neither seem working... |
| 07:08.48 | KotCzarny | disable watchdog first? |
| 07:09.01 | msh_ | ah, hm |
| 07:09.10 | msh_ | I think dsme's what's restarting it though |
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| 07:12.11 | zuh | msh_: use 'source /etc/osso-af-init/matchbox.sh stop' |
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| 07:26.46 | KotCzarny | msh: hmm, have you played with compositing on maemo? |
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| 07:41.23 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 07:41.27 | KotCzarny | xcompmgr works |
| 07:41.29 | KotCzarny | :) |
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| 07:43.47 | KotCzarny | looks really nice |
| 07:43.48 | KotCzarny | mm |
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| 08:26.17 | aquatix | morning |
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| 08:35.11 | BugBlue | moin allen |
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| 08:40.04 | aquatix | mogguh BugBlue |
| 08:40.59 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 08:41.13 | qwerty12 | Morning |
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| 09:03.52 | monkeyiq | is there a way to get to see the framebuffer on bootup? so you can see where/what is failing and making the device autoreoobot? |
| 09:04.56 | qwerty12 | Not FB at all but : http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=137088 |
| 09:05.30 | qwerty12 | FB driver fails to compile for me, I looked at the parts where it was failing and fixed it and my N800 wouldn't boot with that kernel :D |
| 09:06.10 | KotCzarny | hehe 'fixed' |
| 09:06.11 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 09:06.19 | KotCzarny | is fixing xmms |
| 09:06.30 | qwerty12 | I thought the same thing :D but it compiled so there! :p :) |
| 09:06.58 | monkeyiq | :( something is killing it after the hand shake, so its fairly late on, but I have no way to know what it is right now. Lucky I have dual boot so I can try methods to debug what is wrong |
| 09:07.32 | qwerty12 | Use that thread I mentioned, IMHO, it seems like a init script if it is that far on. |
| 09:07.49 | monkeyiq | yeah, it looks like it might save me :) |
| 09:07.51 | qwerty12 | fanoush has code in there that will tell you which script is being executed. |
| 09:12.34 | qwerty12 | Does anybody know if you can get the extra information about software information at bootup when rd mode is enabled - without having rd mode turned on? I plan on reflashing fanoush's initfs. Fanoush mentions the show_rd_versions() function but is it enabled if rd mode isnt? |
| 09:13.02 | qwerty12 | i.e can you use the show_rd_versions function if rd mode is turned off? |
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| 09:45.16 | monkeyiq | charmed, '/usr/bin/hildon-desktop ' spawning too fast -> reset |
| 09:45.34 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 09:45.38 | monkeyiq | in syslog. Not quite the easiest thing in the world to fix :/ |
| 09:46.03 | qwerty12 | eek |
| 09:46.23 | monkeyiq | and strangely google seems to know *nothing* about it. |
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| 09:47.55 | qwerty12 | It's mentioned in that thread but you can start usb networking via initfs and boot into OS2008 with usb networking still on. You can also disable watchdog too. |
| 09:49.25 | monkeyiq | hmm, I guess the old remove some random service, or stop networking etc and see if hildon-desktop still death spawns routine might work |
| 09:49.59 | monkeyiq | still analysing the syslog to see if there is anything in there that might give hildon the shits |
| 09:50.30 | monkeyiq | it appears to even be bringing up the WPA2 AP, so its fairly much booted, just hildon-deskop keeps busy respawning |
| 09:50.53 | KotCzarny | install getty ? |
| 09:52.03 | monkeyiq | well, that might work, if I could get a non graphical default runlevel. |
| 09:52.06 | qwerty12 | I'm having a problem with nonworking rotation. I think it's because I flashed one of my testing kernels :(. I'll try the standard kernel with rotation jott has on his site. |
| 09:53.46 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 09:54.56 | qwerty12 | I don't think being in RD mode would affect the rotation :/ . Funny thing was, it was working for me fine before I had to reflash :( |
| 09:59.52 | qwerty12 | w00t, it's my b0ll0x kernel! Time to delete my kernel tree and start over |
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| 10:27.37 | monkeyiq | are the normal maemo repositories accessible via ftp? it seems that without hildon-desktop the other system boots OK, but is quite useless because of no GUI. |
| 10:27.50 | KotCzarny | no, only http |
| 10:27.53 | monkeyiq | I might try an older hildon-desktop pkg to see if i can get it running again |
| 10:28.01 | qwerty12 | You could grab links? |
| 10:28.13 | monkeyiq | IIRC there was something hildon-ish that was updated earler in the day |
| 10:34.42 | monkeyiq | installs http://repository.maemo.org/pool/chinook/free/h/hildon-desktop/hildon-desktop_2.0.6-1_armel.deb and crosses fingers. |
| 10:35.32 | monkeyiq | I guess I did play around with the structure of the menu entries with the GUI today too... just had to make it nice and easy to use. |
| 10:35.39 | monkeyiq | nup, the beep and reboot! |
| 10:36.15 | monkeyiq | looks like I might have to shelve the n810 for a while until I can commit to redoing all the setup work again :/ |
| 10:36.34 | monkeyiq | or a new hildon-desktop pkg becomes available. |
| 10:36.45 | solmumaha | 1 |
| 10:36.49 | KotCzarny | why not a simple reflash? |
| 10:37.11 | qwerty12 | modify bootmenu.sh to enable the option to let you boot with usb networking enabled, disable watchdog and when hildon desktop hangs - kill it and run it yourself and see what the output is. |
| 10:37.18 | qwerty12 | a bit long though |
| 10:37.35 | monkeyiq | well, I can boot of the 256mb card just fine, its all the setup / tweaking I did on the install on the immc2 card that I can't boot into :( |
| 10:37.42 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 10:37.58 | KotCzarny | then copy hildon-desktop from mmc? |
| 10:38.27 | monkeyiq | well, as I just reinstalled hildon-desktop from a deb inside a chroot I imagine that it is fine |
| 10:38.35 | monkeyiq | just that it crashes itself for some reason |
| 10:38.57 | monkeyiq | qwerty12; ok, I'll tag that as a final ray of light :) |
| 10:39.29 | monkeyiq | it's always these sorts of things that happen just before you tar.gz immc2 for safekeeping :/ |
| 10:40.00 | qwerty12 | I know what you mean, I'm sorting out a new install :( |
| 10:40.11 | qwerty12 | I ran rm -rf / by accident and I'm reinstalling apps etc... :( |
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| 11:24.54 | Jaffa | Anyone tried Python-Launcher with Python apps on OS2008 yet? |
| 11:25.15 | qwerty12 | I did, works quite well |
| 11:25.41 | qwerty12 | Canola launches faster imo |
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| 11:29.38 | pupnik_ | thanks for your feedback and stuff in the itt gaming qwerty12 |
| 11:29.56 | KotCzarny | pupnik: i have fixed xmms here and there :) |
| 11:29.56 | pupnik_ | it's a strange world, only like 20 people on earth interested in the games |
| 11:30.04 | lcuk | has anyone seen my vmware desktop session? i had it last night but now its gone. |
| 11:30.14 | pupnik_ | it's my birthday and i am very drunk |
| 11:30.17 | qwerty12 | pupnik_: No problem, thanks for appricating :) |
| 11:30.19 | KotCzarny | lol |
| 11:30.22 | qwerty12 | Happy Birthday! :) |
| 11:30.27 | KotCzarny | you shouldn't drink |
| 11:30.28 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:30.29 | lcuk | good for you pupnik :) enjoy the drunkeness |
| 11:30.52 | pupnik_ | crazy things happened, i won't share them |
| 11:30.54 | lcuk | (and the gaming is good, it might not seen it now but your effort is very worthy ) |
| 11:31.03 | pupnik_ | but one must appreciate crazy days |
| 11:31.16 | GeneralAntilles | Haha |
| 11:31.22 | GeneralAntilles | Happy birthday, pupnik_. |
| 11:32.32 | lcuk | recalls searching google for porn and generating some code then falling asleep |
| 11:32.52 | lcuk | (!) kot, it was your fault |
| 11:32.57 | KotCzarny | yawns |
| 11:33.02 | KotCzarny | it's not me |
| 11:33.07 | KotCzarny | it's the tubes |
| 11:33.07 | qwerty12 | lol :D |
| 11:33.11 | lcuk | it bloody was you i just scrolled back |
| 11:33.11 | GeneralAntilles | I woke up sleeping on my N800 this morning. |
| 11:33.21 | KotCzarny | ^ perv |
| 11:33.23 | lcuk | wet wipes get it clean again |
| 11:33.25 | KotCzarny | (and idiot) |
| 11:33.26 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:33.41 | qwerty12 | Haha lol, i'm a perv by name ;) :P not by nature :P :D |
| 11:33.44 | GeneralAntilles | I think I only got about a quarter of the way through the Lexx episode I was watching. |
| 11:33.54 | lcuk | which series are you up to |
| 11:34.03 | GeneralAntilles | Second season |
| 11:34.21 | GeneralAntilles | I saw most of them when they were on SciFi back in the day. |
| 11:34.26 | GeneralAntilles | But I was young and I don't remember. |
| 11:34.39 | lcuk | still got zev then, or has xev replaced her |
| 11:34.57 | GeneralAntilles | She was replaced. |
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| 11:35.16 | lcuk | prefered the original |
| 11:35.17 | GeneralAntilles | Zev only got 2 episodes in season 2. |
| 11:36.04 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, I do too. |
| 11:38.57 | qwerty12 | hates rotation patch :@. I'm having problems with the kernel patch. This is my 6th compile in 30 mins. Wish me luck :D |
| 11:39.08 | KotCzarny | qwerty: what problems? |
| 11:39.51 | qwerty12 | The rotation sometimes works and sometimes messes up (screen stays landscape) but it rotates right without any screen update etc |
| 11:39.59 | qwerty12 | I think its my recent flash. |
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| 11:40.41 | qwerty12 | Another guy had the same problem and reflashed the N800 but I just reflashed mine yesterday and don't want to do that again. |
| 11:41.01 | qwerty12 | Same kernel that worked for me previously has problems on this flash. |
| 11:41.25 | lcuk | have you installed anything else or restored your backup |
| 11:41.54 | GeneralAntilles | hopes Diablo is coming next week, then qwerty12 is gonna have to do it all over again. :P |
| 11:42.01 | qwerty12 | I've just installed games and no backup restored. Its working for me now but I'm gonna reboot and try again :) |
| 11:42.11 | qwerty12 | General: You are cruel :P :D |
| 11:42.12 | qwerty12 | lol |
| 11:42.24 | lcuk | not cruel, just a sadist |
| 11:42.27 | GeneralAntilles | Not cruel! We'll have Diablo. :] |
| 11:42.32 | Jaffa | zaclty |
| 11:42.57 | qwerty12 | True, but I don't think it will be just me who has to reinstall :p |
| 11:43.04 | GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, what was up with the VOB access, anyway. My mplayer being stupid again? :P |
| 11:43.37 | Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: no, user error - but I've made it smarter so it detects you're accessing a VOB directly and switches to considering it as a whole DVD |
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| 11:44.07 | qwerty12 | Nope, rotation is messing me around again, it works randomly. I guess I have to live with it. |
| 11:44.30 | GeneralAntilles | Randomly was about how well it worked for me when I tried it. |
| 11:45.19 | qwerty12 | For me, I had problems but the screen would always rotate in my last flash. I guess I can live without it :/ |
| 11:45.26 | KotCzarny | qwerty: wanna test my kernel? |
| 11:45.27 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:45.40 | qwerty12 | I don't mind but what features does it have? :) |
| 11:45.45 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 11:45.53 | KotCzarny | mmc patch and rotate for sure |
| 11:46.00 | KotCzarny | were there any others? |
| 11:46.28 | qwerty12 | TBH, I'm not trying to put your work down but fanoush's kernel also has them too :) |
| 11:46.36 | KotCzarny | probably |
| 11:46.37 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:46.50 | KotCzarny | but i have compiled some modules for me |
| 11:47.07 | KotCzarny | so i needed it anyway |
| 11:47.08 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:48.26 | qwerty12 | :). For me, my one has the features of Fanoush's (due to him releasing the patches with the latest release of his :) (backlight, PPTP, MMC & rotation) & the usb powercheck disabled & USB DMA disabled & LUKS support enabled. |
| 11:48.57 | KotCzarny | backlight? luks? |
| 11:48.58 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:49.16 | KotCzarny | and usb powercheck sounds dangerous :) |
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| 11:50.22 | qwerty12 | The full 128 brightness being enabled in kernel :), LUKS is the Linux Encryption (Standard?) http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15742&highlight=LUKS |
| 11:50.27 | qwerty12 | I agree with you :) |
| 11:50.40 | GeneralAntilles | No point doing brightness in kernel |
| 11:50.44 | GeneralAntilles | just use adv-backlight |
| 11:50.49 | KotCzarny | hmm, and default is how much? |
| 11:50.59 | KotCzarny | because i have adv-backlight statusbar plugin |
| 11:51.02 | KotCzarny | that does the same |
| 11:51.03 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:51.04 | qwerty12 | I like adv-backlight but I quite like using blset too |
| 11:51.10 | qwerty12 | I think they do the same TBH |
| 11:51.19 | GeneralAntilles | They do do the same. |
| 11:51.27 | GeneralAntilles | But you don't have to open up an xterm to use adv-backlight. :P |
| 11:51.47 | qwerty12 | True :D |
| 11:51.53 | KotCzarny | and luks is for what? |
| 11:52.02 | qwerty12 | Encryption: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15742&highlight=LUKS |
| 11:52.03 | KotCzarny | ah, sorry |
| 11:52.12 | KotCzarny | haven't seen it :) |
| 11:52.14 | qwerty12 | Although you can use truecrypt too :) |
| 11:52.15 | qwerty12 | : |
| 11:52.18 | qwerty12 | *:) |
| 11:52.48 | qwerty12 | The fun thing is with kernel patch, you can set brightness to 0! Making it impossible to see your devices screen! W00T! :D |
| 11:53.12 | KotCzarny | heh.. |
| 11:53.18 | KotCzarny | i don't know if it's a feature.. |
| 11:53.19 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 11:53.30 | qwerty12 | It's not a bug, I tell you! |
| 11:53.35 | GeneralAntilles | You can do that with adv-backlight, too. :P |
| 11:53.36 | KotCzarny | yeah.. |
| 11:53.39 | GeneralAntilles | Just not on the N800. |
| 11:53.41 | GeneralAntilles | Since it's smart. |
| 11:53.58 | KotCzarny | disco backlight? |
| 11:53.59 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 11:54.01 | qwerty12 | Yeah, I took out my battery when I set it on 0 for fun >.< |
| 11:54.07 | GeneralAntilles | Haha |
| 11:54.13 | GeneralAntilles | I did it once or twice on accident. |
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| 11:54.37 | KotCzarny | i should write a xmms plugin for that |
| 11:54.41 | GeneralAntilles | Pressing d-pad up twice and sending one of the prior settings worked out OK, though. |
| 11:54.42 | KotCzarny | or at least for dpad led |
| 11:54.43 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:54.56 | qwerty12 | I have a bad habit from my SonyEricsson times of taking out the battery |
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| 11:55.20 | KotCzarny | but you will have to discharge it to ~40% first |
| 11:55.21 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:58.31 | KotCzarny | qwerty: make a truecrypt volume inside luks |
| 11:58.34 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 11:58.54 | qwerty12 | I haven't got round to setting up a luks partition yet :p :D |
| 11:59.25 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 11:59.56 | KotCzarny | having fingerprint and/or face password app could be nice too :> |
| 12:00.28 | qwerty12 | I wouldn't like to try out a face pwd app with the N800 camera... :p |
| 12:00.52 | KotCzarny | why, it will only take removing colour |
| 12:00.58 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:01.57 | qwerty12 | Nice :) |
| 12:02.00 | qwerty12 | But I'm not really a fan of the camera on the N800. I don't use my N800 for video calls and I bring out my phone for pictures. |
| 12:02.10 | pupnik_ | death, impregnation |
| 12:02.11 | *** join/#maemo sbaturzio_ (n=sbaturzi@host244-136-static.36-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:02.36 | KotCzarny | pupnik: you are the father? |
| 12:02.37 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:02.40 | GeneralAntilles | Just some of the crazy things you experienced on your Birthday? :D |
| 12:03.20 | *** join/#maemo bilboed-tp (n=bilboed@89.129.157.41) |
| 12:05.44 | KotCzarny | qwerty: i have realized that it will be my music box :> |
| 12:05.55 | KotCzarny | xmms + mikmod/sidplay |
| 12:05.56 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:06.42 | qwerty12 | Cool :). Isn't mikmod & sidplay for music of old games or something? Excuse my ignorance. |
| 12:06.48 | KotCzarny | yup |
| 12:07.34 | KotCzarny | but handles mp3/ogg/mpc as well |
| 12:07.35 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:07.38 | qwerty12 | Oh ok :) |
| 12:10.06 | *** join/#maemo frade (n=ivan@a88-114-90-214.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 12:13.42 | KotCzarny | http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/sys/622714155.html |
| 12:13.43 | KotCzarny | huh |
| 12:13.56 | KotCzarny | i think i'll hold on to my n800 though |
| 12:13.59 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:14.02 | qwerty12 | Atari = ugly :p |
| 12:14.25 | KotCzarny | 8080 based portable :> |
| 12:14.35 | lcuk | yes, but the folie is over 15 years old |
| 12:14.41 | lcuk | folio |
| 12:14.59 | KotCzarny | i'm even older than folio |
| 12:15.04 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:15.49 | *** join/#maemo p|_ (n=pi@62.13.169.90) |
| 12:15.52 | lcuk | well we kind of noticed you were a bit of a fossil :P |
| 12:16.13 | KotCzarny | pf :P |
| 12:16.50 | *** join/#maemo LastLemming (n=a@men13-2-82-224-174-159.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:20.04 | crashanddie | I'm trying to package commoncpp2 into a .deb for a special arch (within scratchbox, for armel), but when I use dpkg-buildpackage I only get a .deb that has the docs, nothing else... Any pointers ? |
| 12:22.26 | KotCzarny | does a commoncpp2 .deb package exist for debian/ubuntu? |
| 12:22.36 | KotCzarny | if yes you can steal debian/ subdir |
| 12:22.37 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:29.31 | KotCzarny | http://packages.debian.org/sid/armel/ |
| 12:29.33 | KotCzarny | mmm, pie |
| 12:34.12 | *** join/#maemo Zic (n=Zic@ubuntu/member/zic) |
| 12:34.41 | *** join/#maemo BabelO (n=Fabrice@lun34-2-82-238-28-28.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:38.39 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, hmm... |
| 12:38.43 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, awesome idea ! |
| 12:41.55 | *** join/#maemo dick-richardson (n=joshua@host-193-138-220-24.midco.net) |
| 12:42.08 | dick-richardson | does the n810 support a2dp? |
| 12:42.45 | jeff1f | Not fully |
| 12:42.47 | jeff1f | I think |
| 12:42.50 | aquatix | hm, good question |
| 12:42.53 | aquatix | too bad |
| 12:43.04 | jeff1f | Apparently it doesn't work too well |
| 12:43.14 | GeneralAntilles | Yes |
| 12:43.17 | GeneralAntilles | But it's a CPU hog |
| 12:43.23 | GeneralAntilles | So you can't really do anything else while you're using it. |
| 12:44.49 | dick-richardson | is it by nature a cpu hog? or are there code optimizations that could address that to some degree? |
| 12:46.53 | GeneralAntilles | It's pretty much a CPU hog no matter what |
| 12:47.02 | GeneralAntilles | But there are a lot of optimizations that can (and are) being done. |
| 12:47.24 | aquatix | hm, too bad |
| 12:48.04 | *** join/#maemo johnx (n=john@softbank221106232002.bbtec.net) |
| 12:48.17 | dick-richardson | just picked up a parrot rk8200 car stereo and am hoping to get my music off the n810 digitally while still being able to use gps |
| 12:48.19 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, it's a shame though, existent .deb only incorporate the debian/control file, and not the debian/rules, which is probably the one where something goes wrong |
| 12:48.25 | aquatix | could've been really cool with such a thing: http://www.laptopmag.com/review/accessories/plantronics-voyager-855.aspx |
| 12:48.42 | KotCzarny | crashanddie: then look for source |
| 12:48.59 | GeneralAntilles | Optimizations are ongoing |
| 12:49.01 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, d'you think the source will have the control file ? |
| 12:49.03 | GeneralAntilles | The INdT guys are doing a lot |
| 12:49.06 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 12:49.06 | GeneralAntilles | AD2P is on the roadmap |
| 12:49.08 | KotCzarny | certainly |
| 12:49.18 | KotCzarny | get all 3 files |
| 12:49.20 | GeneralAntilles | Nokia wont bundle it until it gets somewhat optimized. |
| 12:49.29 | KotCzarny | and do dpkg-source -x somefile.dsc |
| 12:49.50 | KotCzarny | that will unpack and patch original source with debian specific stuff |
| 12:49.59 | KotCzarny | which include debian/ dir |
| 12:50.10 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, thanks |
| 12:50.24 | aquatix | hm, the INdT stuff is a hacked Nokia firmware? |
| 12:50.26 | dick-richardson | I've been out of the loop to some degree, is there an expectation that they're going to kick hildon to the curb and go with a qt based platform? |
| 12:50.53 | aquatix | dick-richardson: ew :P |
| 12:50.56 | KotCzarny | i would prefer gtk2 :/ |
| 12:51.01 | KotCzarny | qt is a mem hog |
| 12:51.09 | KotCzarny | (so is gtk2) |
| 12:51.23 | aquatix | likes the looks of gtk2 progs better generally |
| 12:51.25 | lcuk | no point in buying trolltech if they arent gonna do anything with it |
| 12:51.26 | aquatix | and the applications |
| 12:51.41 | lcuk | but i dont expect things to change overnight |
| 12:51.41 | dick-richardson | lcuk: that's my thought... |
| 12:51.57 | KotCzarny | :/ |
| 12:52.24 | aquatix | it's unlikely they'll change the complete environment suddenly |
| 12:52.35 | KotCzarny | who know |
| 12:52.36 | KotCzarny | s |
| 12:52.39 | *** join/#maemo _ken____ (n=user@84.92.70.37) |
| 12:52.42 | aquatix | maybe they'll start creating smartphone with it first |
| 12:52.45 | aquatix | wouldn't mind that |
| 12:52.58 | aquatix | multimedia phones and such |
| 12:53.06 | KotCzarny | starting from scratch is sometimes better |
| 12:53.06 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:53.48 | aquatix | yeah |
| 12:53.53 | aquatix | Nokia Greenphone :) |
| 12:55.21 | monkeyiq | I presume installing gdb on the 810 is the best way to get a backtrace? |
| 12:55.53 | GeneralAntilles | aquatix, mamona is the all-free SDK/firmware, but it really doesn't have anything to do with their AD2P stuff. |
| 12:56.15 | KotCzarny | hmm, does gdb work? |
| 12:56.17 | GeneralAntilles | dick-richardson, anything about Qt or Hildon and the future is pure speculation right now. |
| 12:56.26 | KotCzarny | last time i tried copying it from scratchbox it failed |
| 12:56.43 | GeneralAntilles | We know Qt WILL play a part at some point in the future (Quim and others have said as much), but we really don't know anything more. |
| 12:56.57 | monkeyiq | well I have it at the point where I can run hildon-dekstop and it segvs on me |
| 12:57.08 | monkeyiq | so I'd like to be able to get a hint as to why. |
| 12:57.18 | KotCzarny | strace ? |
| 12:57.23 | KotCzarny | maybe it's just a missing file |
| 13:00.29 | monkeyiq | yay, raise() in libc after ?? |
| 13:00.35 | monkeyiq | seems quite stack smashish |
| 13:01.37 | monkeyiq | I'll see if strace has any thoughts |
| 13:02.30 | lcuk | before i run this and have a rogue pointer on my hands, is this the correct syntax to use a char * as a short, and will the pointer actually advance 2 bytes or just 1? : *(unsigned short *)buffer++ = xyz; |
| 13:02.52 | KotCzarny | erm |
| 13:03.04 | KotCzarny | sounds like portability hell |
| 13:03.06 | KotCzarny | :> |
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| 13:03.31 | lcuk | im not interested in portability, this is in an 8x0 specific class :) |
| 13:03.52 | KotCzarny | someone will scream over this one day |
| 13:03.53 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:04.09 | elb | I'm not sure about the precedence of ++ versus a cast |
| 13:04.16 | elb | you should probably make that explicit |
| 13:04.24 | lcuk | no they wont because the class will have been replaced with device specifics. elb, thats what i am wondering also |
| 13:04.36 | elb | I would break that into two lines, even |
| 13:04.41 | elb | there's no sense in getting too clever |
| 13:04.43 | *** join/#maemo Sho_ (i=ehs1@kde/hein) |
| 13:04.57 | elb | (that is, the dereference and the advance |
| 13:04.58 | elb | ) |
| 13:05.01 | lcuk | but the optimiser wont update it, buffer is a register variable and i wanted to keep it as one opcode |
| 13:05.40 | elb | is this premature optimization? |
| 13:06.04 | lcuk | well this is inside a blit routine which is already being heavily optimised.. |
| 13:06.12 | monkeyiq | and strace gives nothing interesting either. |
| 13:06.44 | lcuk | ill do a bit of checking |
| 13:06.45 | monkeyiq | so, maybe there are hardware issues here or something. but hildon-desktop doesn't get far at all before segv |
| 13:07.04 | elb | I would at least do *((unsigned short *)buffer)++ |
| 13:08.53 | elb | my general rule on precedence is "if I have to look it up, make it explicit" ;-) |
| 13:08.59 | elb | because the next guy will probably have to look it up, too |
| 13:09.33 | crashanddie | ++ comes after the cast |
| 13:09.34 | dtahtbot | crashanddie: Error: "+" is not a valid command. |
| 13:09.47 | crashanddie | but yeah, explicit isn't bad |
| 13:12.51 | lcuk | elb :) thx - you are right, i just thought the dereference would not update the actual variable, but now I have seen what you put you are 100% and thats how i used to do it |
| 13:13.14 | lcuk | (i just tested by the way and the ++ was going up by a single byte) |
| 13:14.15 | lcuk | boo: liqstars.c:47: warning: use of cast expressions as lvalues is deprecated ;) |
| 13:14.24 | lcuk | works tho |
| 13:15.57 | *** join/#maemo Pio (n=sean@64.251.10.106) |
| 13:16.38 | lcuk | reads up and changes tact :) |
| 13:16.56 | lcuk | puts original nice code back for now |
| 13:18.43 | elb | why is your variable a register variable, by the way? |
| 13:19.08 | elb | if it's not tied to a specific register for specific purposes, the compiler is almost certainly better at assigning registers than the programmer |
| 13:19.09 | lcuk | because it is much faster that way |
| 13:19.31 | lcuk | not tied to a specific, just a hint that it should be on a register |
| 13:19.41 | elb | yeah, you probably simply shouldn't do that |
| 13:20.35 | lcuk | its just the same kind of hint as inline |
| 13:20.37 | elb | unless you've proven that the compiler makes a poorer choice for that particular function empirically, in which case you'll want to reverify that with every release of the compiler to see when it gets better than you are |
| 13:21.28 | elb | inline is *in practicality* a different kind of hint, because gcc has not until recently done much inter-function optimization, or any inter-object optimization at all |
| 13:21.41 | elb | (this is changing, and I expect inline to go the way of the dodo) |
| 13:22.28 | lcuk | but i dont want to have to verify every fudging compiler that i might ever compile against and i know 100% that the few variables i have must under best case scenario be held on a register. |
| 13:22.55 | lcuk | the register flag is there for me to give the compiler that hint so i will leave it in |
| 13:23.41 | elb | (at least think very hard about why you "know" that, and whether it's actually true) |
| 13:24.44 | lcuk | i KNOW that because pushing and popping a decrementing counter of the stack is orders of magnitude slower than using the reg. come on im not stupid, im inside a blit loop there is nothing wrong with it |
| 13:24.45 | KotCzarny | do not think, test |
| 13:24.53 | KotCzarny | erm. wrong |
| 13:24.57 | KotCzarny | think and test :) |
| 13:25.01 | lcuk | i have done |
| 13:25.05 | lcuk | LOTS of tests |
| 13:25.49 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:26.16 | elb | if supplying 'register' truly helps, emprically, you probably should file a bug against the gcc optimizers |
| 13:26.24 | elb | (it's quite possible that the ARM optimizer is simply bad) |
| 13:27.25 | KotCzarny | lcuk: gcc autooptimizing too? |
| 13:27.39 | lcuk | i have written hundreds of functions in this little program and i have chosen 1 single function to use register, stop berating me i'm just sprinkling on the special sauce |
| 13:28.22 | elb | I'm not berating you at all |
| 13:28.40 | elb | in fact, I don't know anything about you or your program |
| 13:28.56 | elb | what I *do* know is that virtually al luses of the keyword 'register' do nothing but hinder the compiler |
| 13:29.02 | elb | some compilers even ignore it, because of this |
| 13:29.33 | elb | I've not done anything but suggest that you check your assumptions -- if you're truly confident in them, you should not feel threatened :-P |
| 13:30.07 | lcuk | http://pastebin.com/d1a1784b1 |
| 13:31.00 | elb | giving every single variable in the function a register is almost certainly not productive :-P |
| 13:31.00 | KotCzarny | ~it's a kind of magic~ |
| 13:31.03 | KotCzarny | ~lalala~ |
| 13:31.25 | lcuk | elb, why not - i have quite a few available to me unless i am using thumb |
| 13:31.44 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-54-198.dslgb.com) |
| 13:31.56 | lcuk | if i dumbed it down to assembler it would be an all reg function |
| 13:33.18 | lcuk | anyway, the best part was what I just removed from the pastebin: 4 lines of: unsigned int dummyslowdown =linecount*srclinejump+dstlinejump-*srcdataptr+dummystore; |
| 13:33.35 | qwerty12_N800 | Kot: Quick q please, in your it talk sig, you say bootloader, do you mean you flashed a custom or something? :) |
| 13:33.53 | KotCzarny | qwerty: no, just a fanoush bootmenu |
| 13:33.54 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:34.13 | *** join/#maemo krau (n=cktakaha@189.70.66.89) |
| 13:34.25 | KotCzarny | i can change it if it confuses you :) |
| 13:34.32 | *** join/#maemo eichi (n=eichi@141.82.61.171) |
| 13:35.26 | qwerty12_N800 | Kot: ok lol, my bad :) |
| 13:36.31 | qwerty12_N800 | I have the most pointless bootmenu set up lol |
| 13:36.40 | KotCzarny | one entry? |
| 13:36.41 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:37.28 | qwerty12_N800 | No, lots of entries for partitions I don't have lol, I use it for showing owner info |
| 13:37.31 | qwerty12_N800 | :) |
| 13:37.43 | KotCzarny | huh :) |
| 13:37.48 | KotCzarny | nice idea :) |
| 13:38.00 | qwerty12_N800 | I need to make changes for rd mode though :/ |
| 13:38.04 | qwerty12_N800 | Thanks :) |
| 13:38.20 | KotCzarny | does flashing with nokias image remove bootmenu? |
| 13:38.22 | lcuk | VERY nice idea |
| 13:38.27 | qwerty12_N800 | I stole the idea from Rodrigo though :D |
| 13:38.31 | lcuk | alternatively, you could just change the boot picture |
| 13:38.51 | qwerty12_N800 | no, bootmenu clears the extended rd mode info |
| 13:38.52 | KotCzarny | lcuk: or desktop wallpaper? |
| 13:39.30 | KotCzarny | qwerty: so it's not that easy to remove too ;) |
| 13:40.20 | qwerty12_N800 | :), when you say image, do you mean .bin? |
| 13:40.35 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 13:40.40 | KotCzarny | fiasco image |
| 13:40.46 | KotCzarny | or whatever it's called |
| 13:40.59 | lcuk | makes a retinal scan program to ensure authorized users only |
| 13:41.11 | qwerty12_N800 | oh, yes reflashing bin image onto flash also reflashes initfs :( |
| 13:41.40 | WormFood | removed lcuk's eye to bypass his retinal scan program ;) |
| 13:42.06 | lcuk | my eyes! the nokia, it does nothing |
| 13:42.07 | KotCzarny | then i guess the only face way is to engrave on the case :) |
| 13:42.17 | KotCzarny | erm |
| 13:42.20 | KotCzarny | s/face/safe/ |
| 13:42.27 | KotCzarny | i should really go to sleep |
| 13:42.55 | lcuk | but i wouldnt wanna buy a nokia with your name on it |
| 13:42.58 | WormFood | go to sleep? what time is it there? |
| 13:43.18 | KotCzarny | lcuk: why should you, it's mine! all mine! mauauhahahaha!1!!1! |
| 13:44.01 | qwerty12_N800 | Kot: hehe true |
| 13:44.02 | lcuk | any device i own with a camera I take a picture of my information. my actual camera download&clear program actually re-uploads this info card everytime i clear the memory card |
| 13:44.12 | WormFood | just change your name to "nokia", then they all have your name ;) |
| 13:44.45 | *** join/#maemo sbaturzio (n=sbaturzi@host244-136-static.36-88-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 13:44.56 | qwerty12_N800 | i don't really fancy naming my self after a Finnish town :p |
| 13:45.20 | lcuk | and people will keep picking you up and trying to find your SIM slot |
| 13:45.41 | WormFood | qwerty12_N800, I'm in china...you should see some of the "english" names people give themselves |
| 13:46.08 | WormFood | I met a woman named "aney", and another named "tramy" (which is too close to "tranny") |
| 13:46.13 | qwerty12_N800 | lcuk:I don't want to be analYsed... |
| 13:46.19 | qwerty12_N800 | wf: lol |
| 13:46.55 | KotCzarny | fu king |
| 13:46.56 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:47.07 | KotCzarny | actual city |
| 13:47.10 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:47.23 | KotCzarny | whole province even |
| 13:47.26 | qwerty12_N800 | bangkok, anyone? :p |
| 13:47.37 | *** join/#maemo setanta (n=setanta@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:47.43 | sp3000 | a whole f****** province!? :P |
| 13:47.50 | Lynoure | WormFood: comparable to WormFood, I'd say =) |
| 13:47.57 | WormFood | the name of the city I'm in is "广州" |
| 13:48.12 | lcuk | old chinese proverb: "man who walks through airport doors sideways is going to bangkok" |
| 13:48.20 | fysa | hahaah |
| 13:48.39 | qwerty12_N800 | lol |
| 13:48.45 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:49.00 | WormFood | do you know how "bangkok" got its name? |
| 13:49.07 | WormFood | it is not called "the city of whores" for nothing |
| 13:50.38 | lcuk | actually, according to wikipedia its called "Krung Thep Mahanakhon Amon Rattanakosin Mahinthara Yuthaya Mahadilok Phop Noppharat Ratchathani Burirom Udomratchaniwet Mahasathan Amon Piman Awatan Sathit Sakkathattiya Witsanukam Prasit " |
| 13:50.43 | WormFood | I understand that when (if) I go back to usa, they will want to search my computer and any CD/DVDs....so I want to get a CD of the most disgusting pictures I can find, and label it "Thailand sex vacation" for the authorities to look at |
| 13:50.46 | lcuk | which is a bit of a mouthful |
| 13:50.50 | qwerty12_N800 | lmao |
| 13:51.19 | KotCzarny | mouthful, yes, thx |
| 13:51.21 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:52.10 | lcuk | WormFood, you would most likely be rejected from entering. but that kind of thinking is what is needed to show how silly this is |
| 13:52.57 | WormFood | "silly"? it is an invasion of my privacy |
| 13:53.10 | WormFood | I will encrypt my hard drive several times over before I go back to usa |
| 13:53.55 | lcuk | they can already search every other part of your luggage, they think they can search everything else |
| 13:54.06 | lcuk | you might be hiding a midget vampire in your case |
| 13:54.30 | WormFood | I actually have more freedoms in China! |
| 13:54.32 | KotCzarny | bag of nuts |
| 13:54.37 | WormFood | I was not searched when I went to china! |
| 13:54.39 | KotCzarny | no, you don't |
| 13:54.43 | WormFood | I was not searched when I went to Hong Kong |
| 13:54.52 | WormFood | I was not searched when I went back to China! |
| 13:55.07 | WormFood | They might censor my internet, but I have more privacy here |
| 13:55.10 | AStorm | hmm hmm |
| 13:55.13 | KotCzarny | lol |
| 13:55.28 | AStorm | does anyone have a build of Tor for maemo? |
| 13:55.32 | lcuk | they dont censor ALL of your internet though :) |
| 13:55.37 | aquatix | WormFood: if you encrypt, they will insist on you entering the pw's |
| 13:55.44 | aquatix | that's the whole issue |
| 13:55.47 | WormFood | I won't have the passwords |
| 13:55.51 | KotCzarny | astorm: proxy over ssl is enough |
| 13:55.52 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:55.54 | aquatix | isn't going to visit US anytime soon |
| 13:55.55 | WormFood | they can get a decrypt with a legit court order |
| 13:56.00 | KotCzarny | (ie. ssh forwarding) |
| 13:56.01 | AStorm | aquatix: no prob, truecrypt has two partitions |
| 13:56.07 | aquatix | AStorm: true :) |
| 13:56.11 | AStorm | uhm, hidden partition |
| 13:56.20 | aquatix | deniable thingee |
| 13:56.22 | AStorm | and you can use a key on usb |
| 13:56.23 | *** join/#maemo amrileria (n=user@a88-114-51-42.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:56.24 | aquatix | whatsitcaleld :/ |
| 13:56.28 | AStorm | and destroy it |
| 13:56.31 | lcuk | but you talking about it here means you know about it |
| 13:56.34 | WormFood | rubber hose encryption |
| 13:56.39 | Lynoure | I'll just stay out of the country... to risky for an opinionated non-native |
| 13:56.41 | AStorm | just drop and step on it |
| 13:56.46 | AStorm | use a flimsy one |
| 13:56.56 | aquatix | Lynoure: :) |
| 13:57.02 | KotCzarny | pocket emp |
| 13:57.03 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 13:57.08 | aquatix | AStorm: `woopsie' |
| 13:57.12 | lcuk | encryption shows you have something to hide. now place your hands against the wall and spread em - i'll go get my gloves |
| 13:57.19 | aquatix | KotCzarny: that'll put you in jail i guess ;) |
| 13:57.24 | aquatix | `terrorist!' |
| 13:57.29 | lcuk | in the uk they CAN put you in jail |
| 13:57.34 | WormFood | there are a lot of reasons to have something to hide, other than doing something wrong |
| 13:57.36 | AStorm | yeah |
| 13:57.39 | AStorm | they can |
| 13:57.40 | KotCzarny | aquatix: made from disposable camera :) |
| 13:57.46 | lcuk | decide quickly: give up your pass codes or go down |
| 13:57.46 | aquatix | KotCzarny: yeah, saw them |
| 13:57.51 | AStorm | but you can say: my key got destroyed |
| 13:57.58 | AStorm | by investigation |
| 13:58.02 | KotCzarny | or 'it's not mine' |
| 13:58.06 | AStorm | simple deathtrap |
| 13:58.07 | lcuk | no, thats worse |
| 13:58.12 | WormFood | I will burn a few DVDs of random data for them to mull over too ;) |
| 13:58.26 | AStorm | lcuk: you didn't destroy it |
| 13:58.28 | lcuk | never carry someone elses luggage over the border |
| 13:58.29 | AStorm | they did |
| 13:58.33 | AStorm | yup |
| 13:58.52 | KotCzarny | 'airlines misplaced them!' |
| 13:58.52 | *** part/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-54-198.dslgb.com) |
| 13:59.02 | WormFood | copy everything over ssh to a drive in usa, then erase your hard drive ;) |
| 13:59.03 | AStorm | KotCzarny: that won't work |
| 13:59.06 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-54-198.dslgb.com) |
| 13:59.09 | aquatix | maybe i'll just wave my government id and say `state secrets, move along' ;) |
| 13:59.11 | AStorm | they keep exact books |
| 13:59.29 | AStorm | aquatix: haha, not everyone has that |
| 13:59.33 | aquatix | AStorm: or `loose' your usb key |
| 13:59.37 | aquatix | AStorm: i know ;) |
| 13:59.45 | AStorm | aquatix: lost can be found |
| 13:59.51 | WormFood | I won't have a key on me |
| 13:59.52 | aquatix | and i'm just a lousy peon anyway |
| 13:59.56 | AStorm | destroyed is very hard to recover |
| 13:59.59 | WormFood | my key will be on another machine |
| 14:00.05 | KotCzarny | ah, well i can simply send key to someone in another country |
| 14:00.08 | AStorm | WormFood: good idea |
| 14:00.14 | AStorm | linked machines |
| 14:00.14 | KotCzarny | 'i don't know the pass, sorry' |
| 14:00.15 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:00.16 | aquatix | WormFood: yeah, `i don't have the key on me, my company has it' |
| 14:00.29 | aquatix | or something |
| 14:00.30 | WormFood | exactly! "I do not know the key!" |
| 14:00.34 | AStorm | selfdestruct if link is broken |
| 14:00.38 | aquatix | deniability |
| 14:00.50 | AStorm | and pass isn'tt entered in x seconds |
| 14:01.01 | WormFood | they will just remove the hard drive and copy it |
| 14:01.04 | lcuk | but they arent running code |
| 14:01.21 | WormFood | the way to get around that is to encrypt the hard drive several times |
| 14:01.22 | lcuk | well - the tsa guys will be doing for efficiency |
| 14:01.22 | KotCzarny | custom hdd firmware? |
| 14:01.23 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:01.36 | AStorm | when they find out, it's too late |
| 14:01.46 | AStorm | KotCzarny: pendrive is more secure |
| 14:01.51 | AStorm | easier to destroy |
| 14:02.01 | AStorm | and much harder to recover |
| 14:02.03 | KotCzarny | harddrives are easy to destroy too |
| 14:02.06 | lcuk | there is no way they have custom equipment able to strip and connect every computer that comes through the border and connect its drive. for instance the n8x0 - how would they extract the drive to run it standalone? |
| 14:02.06 | AStorm | nah |
| 14:02.15 | KotCzarny | 'don't push the cover' |
| 14:02.16 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:02.29 | AStorm | KotCzarny: blah, mechanically |
| 14:02.36 | AStorm | you need a press for that |
| 14:02.41 | GeneralAntilles | Somebody needs to go trout walloping at the TSA. |
| 14:02.46 | GeneralAntilles | Security theater is so awesome. |
| 14:02.51 | AStorm | :) |
| 14:03.04 | AStorm | pendrive only needs a boot |
| 14:03.16 | KotCzarny | nah |
| 14:03.22 | AStorm | the chip is very easy to destroy |
| 14:03.30 | KotCzarny | you won't be able to boot |
| 14:03.33 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:03.46 | AStorm | to drop and step on ot in 2 s' I will. |
| 14:04.00 | KotCzarny | 'blah, mechanically' |
| 14:04.01 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:04.01 | lcuk | use a james bond usb pendrive watch :) |
| 14:04.07 | AStorm | hehe |
| 14:04.14 | GeneralAntilles | It's amazing how all of a society's stupid people amass themselves in government. |
| 14:04.20 | AStorm | nah, normal flimsy tiny pendrive works |
| 14:04.28 | GeneralAntilles | and people want to give government more power. <_< |
| 14:04.30 | lcuk | they arent gonna be checking the ram inside every single piece of equipment, there simply isnt enough time |
| 14:04.35 | AStorm | GeneralAntilles: it's a law of incompetence |
| 14:04.47 | AStorm | lcuk: there is |
| 14:04.50 | KotCzarny | hiding data in cmos? |
| 14:04.50 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:04.54 | lcuk | downloading the data from EVERY ipod or cd or drive will take forever |
| 14:05.00 | AStorm | it's actually quick to check |
| 14:05.10 | AStorm | KotCzarny: too hard to remove |
| 14:05.11 | KotCzarny | lcuk: having badblocks is fun too |
| 14:05.11 | lcuk | is it bollocks, data bus wont handle it |
| 14:05.12 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:05.19 | lcuk | lol kot :D |
| 14:05.28 | aquatix | lcuk: hm, they'll get free music that way though ;) |
| 14:05.36 | GeneralAntilles | and completely and totally pointless. |
| 14:05.52 | AStorm | they'll just scan the files |
| 14:05.54 | lcuk | so i walk in with my camera which has a memory card in it, they would check it and look through my photos, would they know to remove the card and check the internal memory? |
| 14:05.55 | GeneralAntilles | I'm in favor of just opening the borders wide. |
| 14:05.58 | AStorm | for anything suspicious |
| 14:06.06 | AStorm | btw, steganography is fun |
| 14:06.07 | aquatix | lcuk: good point |
| 14:06.11 | GeneralAntilles | With the understanding that people who immigrate illegally don't get any government support. |
| 14:06.12 | aquatix | AStorm: indeed! |
| 14:06.15 | lcuk | no, not sten, just internal memory |
| 14:06.29 | AStorm | so is keyfile of some uhsuspicious file |
| 14:06.32 | KotCzarny | lcuk: if they knew you can be the one |
| 14:06.41 | KotCzarny | they will strip you of everything |
| 14:06.42 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 14:06.47 | lcuk | so TSA are now experts on EVERY piece of hardware |
| 14:06.52 | KotCzarny | and knowledgable people will take over |
| 14:06.52 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:06.55 | AStorm | yup |
| 14:07.02 | GeneralAntilles | TSA are experts on everything. |
| 14:07.14 | AStorm | dram is getting harder and harder to uncover data from |
| 14:07.23 | AStorm | too high refresh rate |
| 14:07.24 | lcuk | yer right. they will peek at the laptops and fondle the ipods and look on the cameras but nothing more than a cursory glance |
| 14:07.36 | AStorm | maybe |
| 14:07.46 | lcuk | simply not enough knowledge in the world |
| 14:07.47 | AStorm | they have automated tools for that |
| 14:08.15 | lcuk | for what? extracting data? get me one of those computers because it would be a dream |
| 14:08.19 | AStorm | no |
| 14:08.24 | AStorm | for scanning data |
| 14:08.41 | AStorm | e.g. grab a list of jpegs |
| 14:08.43 | lcuk | but how can they scan for data they dont know is there? i already said they will look where they know |
| 14:08.49 | KotCzarny | usually it's a human that's the weakest link |
| 14:08.57 | KotCzarny | so they won't have to scan your electronics |
| 14:08.57 | *** join/#maemo celesteh_rules (n=celesteh@82-46-164-29.cable.ubr01.harb.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 14:08.57 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:09.00 | AStorm | or look for certain md5 |
| 14:09.11 | KotCzarny | only scan your background |
| 14:09.13 | AStorm | (e.g. known child porn) |
| 14:09.13 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:09.16 | AStorm | :P |
| 14:09.28 | lcuk | software scanning with data they find is one thing, but they will not know to look in every device |
| 14:09.29 | AStorm | simple and efficient |
| 14:09.38 | AStorm | they will know |
| 14:09.49 | AStorm | they're now scanning everything |
| 14:09.55 | WormFood | what if you take your own pictures? |
| 14:09.56 | AStorm | at least here |
| 14:09.59 | WormFood | how can they scan for that? |
| 14:09.59 | KotCzarny | eavasedropping? |
| 14:10.00 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 14:10.04 | AStorm | they found stuff on a camera |
| 14:10.04 | lcuk | thats the point, they can't know. there is not a single system in the world that will tell them where all the memory chips are and how to access them |
| 14:10.06 | WormFood | that is what they are looking for (or one of the things) |
| 14:10.16 | anima | micro sd up to anus? ;) |
| 14:10.16 | aquatix | lol: http://www.dumpert.nl/mediabase/21956/bb188b0c/poolse_barbie_doet_haar_rijles.html |
| 14:10.32 | aquatix | [polish girl doing her driving lessons] |
| 14:10.34 | lcuk | wont look at any links today |
| 14:10.35 | AStorm | anima: fun idea, but too easy to lose |
| 14:10.54 | AStorm | aquatix: I guess it's old |
| 14:11.10 | KotCzarny | astorm: i saw that :) |
| 14:11.18 | KotCzarny | astorm: do you know 'koperta' ? |
| 14:11.19 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:11.28 | AStorm | :P |
| 14:11.28 | aquatix | anima: right, yet another reason for them to do a cavity search... |
| 14:11.35 | KotCzarny | erm. s/astorm/aquatix/ |
| 14:11.43 | lcuk | cavity search is a known location for lots of contraband |
| 14:11.49 | AStorm | yup |
| 14:12.00 | AStorm | better saw the SD under skin |
| 14:12.04 | GeneralAntilles | TSA agents should only get to do strip searches if passengers get to do them back. |
| 14:12.04 | lcuk | if you are walking like a cowboy you are probably packing |
| 14:12.09 | AStorm | a bit intrusive |
| 14:12.13 | AStorm | but easy to do |
| 14:12.27 | AStorm | ofc if the data is worth it |
| 14:12.30 | lcuk | i would be a TSA agent if i got to strip search some nubile female travellers |
| 14:12.30 | aquatix | KotCzarny: koperta? |
| 14:12.43 | KotCzarny | aquatix: do you understand polish? |
| 14:12.43 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:12.48 | GeneralAntilles | Actually, I think everybody should have to fly nude. |
| 14:12.49 | aquatix | KotCzarny: nope |
| 14:12.51 | lcuk | but i would be bad at my job because i would allow the fat hairy blokes on unsearched |
| 14:12.55 | KotCzarny | ach. |
| 14:12.55 | AStorm | aquatix: it's a parking special mark in Poland |
| 14:12.57 | GeneralAntilles | There'd be no problems at all if everybody were nude. |
| 14:13.05 | aquatix | AStorm: ah, ok |
| 14:13.09 | KotCzarny | it's a skit |
| 14:13.10 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:13.27 | AStorm | GeneralAntilles: there wouldbe |
| 14:13.29 | lcuk | agreed GeneralAntilles thats actually a reasonable plan :) |
| 14:13.31 | WormFood | I'm nude, does that count? |
| 14:13.40 | WormFood | actually, we are all nude...under our clothes |
| 14:13.45 | AStorm | ya |
| 14:13.48 | KotCzarny | nope |
| 14:13.49 | aquatix | WormFood: erm, true, but tmi ;) |
| 14:13.52 | AStorm | a sad truth ;) |
| 14:13.54 | KotCzarny | we are covered with dirts |
| 14:13.54 | lcuk | lol |
| 14:13.56 | celesteh_rules | i'm going to be a lot more concerned if the person next to me is sort of spilling over into my seat |
| 14:13.57 | KotCzarny | and bacteria |
| 14:13.58 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:14.06 | KotCzarny | and dead skin |
| 14:14.09 | aquatix | celesteh_rules: :) |
| 14:14.21 | *** join/#maemo qwerty12_N800 (n=user@host-84-9-54-198.dslgb.com) |
| 14:14.23 | lcuk | celesteh_rules, be more after of the person behind you spilling something into your seat |
| 14:14.29 | dick-richardson | what about winter? |
| 14:14.30 | WormFood | I'm not nude, I'm wearing my birthday suit ;) |
| 14:14.37 | celesteh_rules | augh!! |
| 14:14.50 | GeneralAntilles | dick-richardson, airports and airplanes are generally air conditioned. :P |
| 14:15.00 | WormFood | I'll be back after a while |
| 14:15.02 | lcuk | winter would even up the stakes amongst the men and give us extra coat hangers from the girls |
| 14:15.04 | KotCzarny | air conditioned to 18C |
| 14:15.20 | qwerty12_N800 | lol, go www.google.co.uk ffor some earth hour |
| 14:15.27 | GeneralAntilles | lcuk, <_< |
| 14:15.29 | lcuk | its a long hour though |
| 14:15.53 | lcuk | around the world it went dark last night in lots of places - i turned my lights off as well :) |
| 14:15.55 | celesteh_rules | i think pointy, cold nipples is a human universal |
| 14:16.08 | dick-richardson | yes, but mine aren't nearly as interesting |
| 14:16.16 | lcuk | but womens are ermmm bigger and more impressive looking |
| 14:16.36 | lcuk | (apart from those which sag to the knees) |
| 14:16.39 | KotCzarny | 'women' |
| 14:16.40 | GeneralAntilles | Haha |
| 14:16.50 | KotCzarny | erm |
| 14:16.52 | KotCzarny | scratch that |
| 14:17.06 | KotCzarny | and add ' |
| 14:17.06 | GeneralAntilles | Ms. Chokesondick? :P |
| 14:17.24 | dick-richardson | I had a teacher like that :( |
| 14:17.37 | celesteh_rules | i am never flying to or from a desytination in the american midwest if we all have to be naked |
| 14:17.55 | lcuk | why not, the beer belly will cover up most of the problems |
| 14:17.57 | dick-richardson | I live in the midwest...it really depends on_where_ |
| 14:18.28 | celesteh_rules | hm, actually, i once had a connection in vegas. that's what i'd skip |
| 14:18.30 | dick-richardson | I can assure it isn't anywhere near me, however |
| 14:18.37 | celesteh_rules | and also dallas |
| 14:18.41 | KotCzarny | florida? |
| 14:18.55 | celesteh_rules | never been in or through florida |
| 14:19.06 | dick-richardson | It's good |
| 14:19.09 | lcuk | arent most nude anyway in vegas and florida |
| 14:19.23 | dick-richardson | not the ones you'd hope for |
| 14:19.28 | lcuk | lololol |
| 14:19.33 | KotCzarny | lcuk: on the plane they will be too close |
| 14:20.13 | lcuk | why not, if we got all the blokes to stand at the front of the plane and do our propella party piece then we would save the planet |
| 14:21.17 | dick-richardson | I doubt my ability to generate the necessary thrust |
| 14:21.21 | celesteh_rules | does that, um, generate lift? |
| 14:21.36 | dick-richardson | lol! |
| 14:21.50 | celesteh_rules | ah, lift and trust jokes . . . how about that latest OS release |
| 14:21.53 | dick-richardson | this is quickly spiraling downward |
| 14:21.54 | lcuk | dick-richardson, yes, you have to thrust your hips at the same time |
| 14:22.10 | GeneralAntilles | So, uh, anyway, anybody have an release projections for Diablo. . . . <_< |
| 14:22.14 | lcuk | :D |
| 14:22.59 | celesteh_rules | IRC . . . for when you want to feel like a 14 year old boy again |
| 14:23.40 | KotCzarny | yawns |
| 14:23.44 | lcuk | did any of us really grow up though? seriously when you get together with your friends from school don't you regress? |
| 14:24.24 | dick-richardson | this conversation has me wondering if I ever really PROgressed |
| 14:24.48 | *** join/#maemo Disconnect (n=dis@sigkill.net) |
| 14:25.04 | KotCzarny | PROgesteron |
| 14:25.06 | lcuk | we have i think, but its good to be reminded of your roots |
| 14:25.32 | lcuk | the day i stop having fun will be the day i drop dead |
| 14:26.26 | lcuk | internet: serious business |
| 14:26.33 | KotCzarny | sb |
| 14:27.39 | *** join/#maemo l7_ (n=l7@evil-wire.org) |
| 14:28.12 | *** join/#maemo VimS (n=vims@dslb-084-061-029-038.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 14:32.32 | lcuk | goes and plays shopkeeper |
| 14:32.44 | KotCzarny | eats pancakes |
| 14:32.50 | aquatix | one of the nice things of irc is when you're having fun of weird subjects |
| 14:32.59 | aquatix | just random stuff |
| 14:33.08 | aquatix | screw growing up ;) |
| 14:33.11 | crashanddie | yeah |
| 14:33.20 | crashanddie | I think the guys on IRC stole that from the guys meeting up IRL |
| 14:33.28 | crashanddie | wankers |
| 14:33.45 | KotCzarny | those irc bastards! |
| 14:34.04 | aquatix | crashanddie: growing up? |
| 14:34.06 | lcuk | i have had random conversations about stuff since before irc. it started in school with actual conversations, but wasnt quite as random, then we got CBs and it went really random |
| 14:34.22 | aquatix | lcuk: true :) |
| 14:34.24 | crashanddie | aquatix, "having fun of weird subjects, just random stuff" |
| 14:34.26 | lcuk | odd people who have something to hide behind |
| 14:34.49 | aquatix | likes to be random now and then, also in RL |
| 14:34.55 | KotCzarny | channel hopping? |
| 14:34.58 | lcuk | keeps ppl on their toes |
| 14:35.00 | aquatix | keeps people on their toes around me ;) |
| 14:35.07 | crashanddie | I ought to write a script which pulls the debian source packages and recompiles 'em for all the dependencies I need :/ |
| 14:35.08 | aquatix | ghehe |
| 14:35.10 | KotCzarny | cdma? |
| 14:35.11 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:35.44 | lcuk | KotCzarny, its fun to be an internet troll occasionally :) |
| 14:35.53 | KotCzarny | occasionally |
| 14:36.07 | KotCzarny | it's addictive |
| 14:36.23 | lcuk | now we have pansies who think rickrolling is hardcore |
| 14:37.03 | KotCzarny | dip'eem |
| 14:37.08 | KotCzarny | dip them good |
| 14:37.21 | celesteh_rules | what is rockrolling? i keep seeing that word around |
| 14:37.38 | KotCzarny | and i should be sleeping for a 10 hours already |
| 14:37.52 | aquatix | celesteh_rules: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Never_Gonna_Give_You_Up#.22Rickroll.22_Internet_meme |
| 14:37.53 | lcuk | *ahem* heres a preview of the maemo new interface: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0 |
| 14:38.04 | aquatix | lcuk: :P |
| 14:38.10 | KotCzarny | i hope it's not pr0n |
| 14:38.18 | lcuk | its frikkin youtube |
| 14:38.29 | KotCzarny | good thing i have flashblock |
| 14:38.30 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:38.47 | lcuk | good thing i am on the credits of flashblock :) |
| 14:39.01 | lcuk | helped cure a problem and thinks its the best addin for firefox |
| 14:39.10 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 14:39.13 | celesteh_rules | this is like goatse, but G rated |
| 14:39.24 | lcuk | celesteh_rules, my point exactly |
| 14:39.38 | KotCzarny | lcuk: flash block doesn't work when javascript is off |
| 14:39.39 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 14:39.53 | celesteh_rules | i think pansies would have, um, a more nuanced view of goatse vs rickroll |
| 14:40.10 | aquatix | weird guy, that Rick |
| 14:40.14 | lcuk | flashblock would work if i had my way. im actively considering making a proper exe addin for both maemo and windows/linux |
| 14:40.31 | crashanddie | is going to build the whole maemo platform with -O9 |
| 14:40.38 | aquatix | lcuk: exe addin? |
| 14:40.45 | KotCzarny | there's no such thing as -O9 |
| 14:40.53 | KotCzarny | unless you use 2.9.something |
| 14:40.54 | crashanddie | yeah, I know, note the sarcasm |
| 14:40.56 | KotCzarny | or something |
| 14:41.01 | lcuk | ie: flash is currently services by the adobe exe, replace this with a cover exe for flash and only allow the actual loading of flash after clicking |
| 14:41.24 | lcuk | flashblock currently works with the page DOM AFTER its loaded |
| 14:41.31 | KotCzarny | yup |
| 14:41.45 | aquatix | crashanddie: you riser! ;) |
| 14:41.58 | KotCzarny | but it's a price for 'render while loading' |
| 14:42.01 | KotCzarny | i think |
| 14:42.06 | aquatix | lcuk: you can also just switch the plugin off |
| 14:42.11 | crashanddie | wouldn't a greasemonkey script be more effective then ? greasemonkey is parsed before the loading occurs, right ? |
| 14:42.13 | aquatix | and only turn it on if you want |
| 14:42.13 | lcuk | no, its the only palce to get the code inserted |
| 14:42.37 | lcuk | aquatix, if i swithc it off i cannot watch the items i want to see |
| 14:42.44 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 14:42.49 | KotCzarny | proxy could be a solve |
| 14:42.57 | lcuk | i choose to watch a movie, i choose to play a game, but i dont want my eyes distracted by adverts |
| 14:43.05 | lcuk | i choose to disable animated gifs |
| 14:43.06 | aquatix | lcuk: ah, true |
| 14:43.15 | lcuk | but i actually allow static adverts :) |
| 14:43.16 | aquatix | uses a host file with a lot of adblock thingees |
| 14:43.24 | KotCzarny | uses junkbuster |
| 14:43.29 | KotCzarny | host file sux |
| 14:43.33 | crashanddie | I'm pretty glad flash took back its place on webpages |
| 14:43.34 | aquatix | speeds up browsing on the tablet considerably though |
| 14:43.37 | lcuk | i dont like to censor my web that much - i will not let anyone choose which hosts to block |
| 14:43.52 | aquatix | lcuk: myeah, good point |
| 14:43.53 | KotCzarny | luk: 2o7.net :P |
| 14:43.57 | aquatix | but if i'm browsing over gprs... |
| 14:44.01 | lcuk | besides, how will you know if i page is broken or blocked easily |
| 14:44.01 | KotCzarny | and doubleclick |
| 14:44.25 | KotCzarny | whitelists |
| 14:44.29 | lcuk | wont examine any random domains |
| 14:44.53 | celesteh_rules | and . . . that ws the first time i've seen that video. i think i /was/ 14 when it came out. IS that the real ne. Did we all dance awkwardly to something so very lame? |
| 14:45.07 | lcuk | yes celesteh_rules |
| 14:45.29 | aquatix | celesteh_rules: yeah, i think it was the first time i saw it too :) |
| 14:45.33 | lcuk | there are other horrors from that time, but thankfully the mists of time have eased the pain |
| 14:45.39 | aquatix | 80's video clips rock ;) |
| 14:45.53 | KotCzarny | 80's ads.. |
| 14:45.54 | aquatix | the ones from the 60's and 70's are even weirder |
| 14:46.03 | aquatix | KotCzarny: augh ;) |
| 14:46.13 | celesteh_rules | the reassuring thing, is that 14 and at a school dance, none of us were better dressers or dancers than that guy |
| 14:47.37 | aquatix | celesteh_rules: :) |
| 14:47.52 | lcuk | now, talent - you are right celesteh_rules we are no better. however old style trolls had something different to us. they could do things with their bodies which no normal person would even attempt to attempt |
| 14:48.31 | KotCzarny | preserving body fluids for a cause? |
| 14:49.16 | lcuk | she perserved them? in the brief glance i had i thought she was cleaning the bath |
| 14:49.29 | KotCzarny | life |
| 14:49.45 | celesteh_rules | yeah, trolls today suck. |
| 14:49.53 | KotCzarny | when you grow up you start seeing things differently |
| 14:49.56 | celesteh_rules | kids today |
| 14:50.05 | KotCzarny | and no coming back to happy times |
| 14:50.08 | celesteh_rules | get off my lawn! |
| 14:51.26 | lcuk | happiness is what you make it. if you can get over the lows, the higs are pretty good |
| 14:51.39 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 14:52.14 | KotCzarny | where goes the window after minimizing? |
| 14:52.32 | KotCzarny | it's a simple unmap? |
| 14:52.34 | lcuk | which window/os/program |
| 14:52.40 | KotCzarny | n8x0 |
| 14:52.57 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, which program ? |
| 14:53.02 | celesteh_rules | past happy times = gone forever. future happy times = in the queue |
| 14:53.11 | KotCzarny | not hildonized |
| 14:53.15 | lcuk | its still around - i minimised xchat and rebooted the other day it was in the background |
| 14:53.34 | lcuk | and i got my program stuck - it hada a window but it also has an xv overlay |
| 14:53.37 | KotCzarny | i have though about statusbar plugin for unminimizing |
| 14:53.59 | lcuk | <<<<<<< apps exist over there though on 810 |
| 14:54.09 | lcuk | even minimised ones |
| 14:54.12 | KotCzarny | xlsclients lists minimized windows too |
| 14:54.42 | crashanddie | say, I've ported a few apps for the maemo platform, and I want to put them in the garage, should I create a special project ? Or is a project not obligatory for a package ? |
| 14:55.11 | KotCzarny | crashanddie: how good are the ports? |
| 14:55.18 | KotCzarny | ie. full integration with maemo? |
| 14:55.18 | crashanddie | well |
| 14:55.22 | crashanddie | it's libraries mostly |
| 14:55.24 | KotCzarny | \or just 'compiled and runs' ? |
| 14:55.53 | crashanddie | well, all of them are libs in fact |
| 14:56.37 | Jaffa | crashanddie: a project is not obligatory for uploading to extras. If there are build tweaks required, you might want to submit them to the mud-builder.garage.maemo.org project |
| 14:56.38 | KotCzarny | find an app that will need them |
| 14:56.47 | KotCzarny | and you will have an excuse to post them too |
| 14:56.47 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 14:57.20 | crashanddie | KotCzarny, my apps will use 'em, and the rest are dependencies |
| 14:57.32 | crashanddie | Jaffa, explain "build tweaks required" |
| 14:57.36 | lcuk | then submit your apps instead of the libs |
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| 14:58.08 | crashanddie | lcuk, my apps use the libs :/ Without the libs, said apps won't run ;) |
| 14:58.14 | KotCzarny | crashanddie: 'doesn't compile out of the debian box package -> needs tweaking' |
| 14:58.16 | Jaffa | crashanddie: if you've needed to patch the source of the upstream libs in order to get them Maemoised, but the changes are too specific or too wide-ranging to go upstream |
| 14:58.35 | Jaffa | crashanddie: lcuk's point was that submitting the libs without the apps is pointless |
| 14:58.55 | Jaffa | Especially since most users won't be able to install them (libs shouldn't have the "User/" prefix on the Section heading) |
| 14:59.24 | crashanddie | Jaffa, eh ? |
| 14:59.28 | KotCzarny | jaffa: but will apt-get pick them up? |
| 14:59.39 | crashanddie | Jaffa, but if there's no user/ prefix, then the package manager won't take 'em :/ |
| 14:59.45 | Jaffa | KotCzarny: yes, that's exactly the point of having the "User/" prefix. |
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| 14:59.56 | KotCzarny | jaffa: i mean the libs |
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| 15:00.04 | KotCzarny | without user/ in section |
| 15:00.10 | Jaffa | crashanddie: correct. That's what the "Dependencies:" bit of your apps |
| 15:00.49 | Jaffa | Why would a user ever want to install the libs? They don't. Users want to run apps. Apps have a "User/" prefix in their Section. Libs don't. Apps pull in the libs they need (from any section) using "Dependencies:" |
| 15:01.03 | KotCzarny | jaffa: but if a lib isn't available in any repo |
| 15:01.12 | crashanddie | Jaffa, so by registering the libs as depends, and building them with section: libs (for example), the package manager will still get the libs ? |
| 15:01.13 | KotCzarny | dpkg will refuse to install? |
| 15:01.21 | Jaffa | dpkg won't. |
| 15:01.27 | Jaffa | But everything should be in extras or extras-devel. |
| 15:01.33 | Jaffa | crashanddie: exactly. |
| 15:01.39 | crashanddie | Jaffa, ok, good |
| 15:01.47 | aquatix | any idea why the hildon app manager doesn't want to update/install apps since i updated with apt-get? |
| 15:02.06 | KotCzarny | aquatix: too general question |
| 15:02.07 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 15:02.33 | crashanddie | Jaffa, though, the reason why I'd like to put those libs online, is that I don't feel anyone should compile/package those BEFORE starting the dev on an app, it just limits the devs |
| 15:02.35 | aquatix | KotCzarny: i did some apt-get dist-upgrade's and installs |
| 15:02.51 | KotCzarny | how does apt-get complain now? |
| 15:02.55 | aquatix | KotCzarny: since then, if i want to update my apps or install a new one through the gui app manager, it says it fails |
| 15:03.03 | aquatix | apt-get works fine though |
| 15:03.19 | crashanddie | aquatix, does it say "failed to download file" ? |
| 15:03.46 | Jaffa | crashanddie: that's fine, I don't have a problem with extra libs in extras (or extras-devel), I just get really upset by libraries appearing in my Application Manager :) |
| 15:04.08 | aquatix | crashanddie: no; let me try it and get the exact message, sec... |
| 15:04.09 | crashanddie | Jaffa, yeah, agreed, I'll repackage them taking in account what you said, thanks |
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| 15:08.29 | aquatix | meh, now it hangs on updating the repositories list |
| 15:09.46 | crashanddie | aquatix, then don't |
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| 15:09.59 | aquatix | crashanddie, KotCzarny: it says: "Downloading <packagename> failed" |
| 15:10.06 | aquatix | crashanddie: ;) |
| 15:10.15 | crashanddie | aquatix, your internal memory card is corrupted |
| 15:10.20 | aquatix | euh? |
| 15:10.31 | aquatix | that'd suck |
| 15:10.32 | crashanddie | yeah, happened to me a week or two ago |
| 15:10.35 | aquatix | any idea how? |
| 15:10.45 | crashanddie | had problems rebooting lately ? |
| 15:10.53 | aquatix | dunno, don't reboot that much |
| 15:10.57 | aquatix | but the time i did it, no |
| 15:11.02 | crashanddie | Like maybe you tried to boot it with the battery pretty low on energy ? |
| 15:11.07 | crashanddie | and it shut down hard ? |
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| 15:11.31 | KotCzarny | crashanddie: but it would prevent him from writing anything to the card? |
| 15:11.35 | aquatix | crashanddie: not sure, but could be |
| 15:11.35 | KotCzarny | simple test then |
| 15:11.43 | aquatix | but i can apt-get! |
| 15:11.44 | KotCzarny | write anything to the card |
| 15:11.44 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 15:12.06 | aquatix | i can do anything, from updating files to installing new stuff through apt |
| 15:12.16 | aquatix | but email progs act a bit weird though |
| 15:12.20 | crashanddie | aquatix, take a file from your Documents folder |
| 15:12.25 | KotCzarny | bad dns? |
| 15:12.34 | crashanddie | aquatix, and try to paste it to the internal memory card |
| 15:12.41 | crashanddie | aquatix, it'll say "Nothing to paste" |
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| 15:12.49 | aquatix | claws mail refuses to show contents of a message, but works fine in general |
| 15:12.53 | aquatix | crashanddie: ok, i'll try |
| 15:13.18 | KotCzarny | and i will go to sleep |
| 15:13.20 | GeneralAntilles | Application manager caches to the internal card. |
| 15:13.25 | aquatix | KotCzarny: sleep well |
| 15:13.26 | KotCzarny | night ppl |
| 15:13.29 | GeneralAntilles | So if the internal card is ro, it tends to trip up. |
| 15:13.35 | aquatix | GeneralAntilles: ah, and apt doesn't? |
| 15:13.46 | GeneralAntilles | Alternatively, you can remove the internal card and try Application manager again |
| 15:13.50 | GeneralAntilles | it'll work fine if it was the card. |
| 15:13.52 | crashanddie | no, apt saves to /var/apt/cache/ |
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| 15:14.14 | crashanddie | it can just be the partition that's f'd up, or the mounting of it |
| 15:14.18 | aquatix | ah, nothing to paste |
| 15:14.20 | aquatix | meh |
| 15:14.26 | crashanddie | so a mount remount rw should do the trick |
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| 15:14.32 | crashanddie | couldn't tell you the exact command though |
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| 15:15.33 | aquatix | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:15.38 | aquatix | fyi |
| 15:15.44 | aquatix | tries |
| 15:16.59 | fysa | SO ANNOYING |
| 15:17.01 | fysa | why is nano still broken. |
| 15:17.04 | fysa | god dman it |
| 15:17.45 | crashanddie | heh |
| 15:17.52 | crashanddie | 10Megs in one second |
| 15:17.53 | fysa | search = segfault |
| 15:18.00 | crashanddie | even with my connection that's a pretty nice burst |
| 15:18.16 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe, vi, fysa. :P |
| 15:18.30 | aquatix | crashanddie: hm, that command didn't help |
| 15:18.45 | aquatix | crashanddie: megabytes? |
| 15:18.53 | aquatix | nice |
| 15:19.23 | aquatix | yay |
| 15:19.29 | aquatix | FAT: Filesystem panic |
| 15:19.57 | crashanddie | hmm |
| 15:20.11 | aquatix | invalid cluster chain |
| 15:20.12 | crashanddie | aquatix, oh yeah, forget to tell you, I had to format |
| 15:20.20 | aquatix | meh |
| 15:20.33 | crashanddie | aquatix, remounting it was so I could swapoff |
| 15:20.52 | aquatix | ok, i'll copy to my external card |
| 15:28.09 | aquatix | also explains why it wouldn't change maps :) |
| 15:28.30 | aquatix | crashanddie: btw, reformat is just regular fat format right? |
| 15:28.39 | crashanddie | aquatix, yup |
| 15:28.49 | aquatix | fat32 i'd say |
| 15:29.11 | crashanddie | fat16 doesn't support anything above 4Gig |
| 15:29.12 | aquatix | hm, over usb or on device? |
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| 15:29.22 | crashanddie | aquatix, anyway you want or can |
| 15:29.37 | aquatix | internal is 2GB of course |
| 15:29.51 | aquatix | yeah, wondered whether there are dos tools on it now |
| 15:29.58 | kpel | hi guys |
| 15:30.19 | crashanddie | aquatix, formatting it is done with fstools |
| 15:32.05 | aquatix | yeah, just mkdosfs right? |
| 15:32.12 | aquatix | doesn't format fat often ;) |
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| 15:35.09 | JasonWoof | what's the builtin chat program called? |
| 15:35.54 | JasonWoof | and why can't it connect to jabberd? |
| 15:36.41 | JasonWoof | pidgin on my n810 can't seem to connect either |
| 15:36.56 | JasonWoof | it the tls library or something? |
| 15:37.01 | GeneralAntilles | rtcomm |
| 15:37.02 | *** join/#maemo timo (n=timo@a88-114-51-42.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 15:37.07 | GeneralAntilles | It connects to Jabber fine. |
| 15:37.23 | AStorm | yup, maybe you're port blocked |
| 15:37.25 | JasonWoof | not to my stock jabberd |
| 15:37.30 | AStorm | our wifi is |
| 15:37.40 | JasonWoof | no |
| 15:37.50 | AStorm | JasonWoof: yes, it does connect to stock jabberd |
| 15:38.00 | AStorm | it tries TLS first though |
| 15:38.17 | AStorm | maybe jabberd balks at it, but then it's config error |
| 15:38.42 | JasonWoof | works fine on my laptop |
| 15:38.57 | AStorm | you can set force SSL and port 5223 to use old SSL |
| 15:39.14 | AStorm | it will, but rtcomm tries TLS |
| 15:39.15 | JasonWoof | yeah, I tried that too |
| 15:39.22 | AStorm | some jabber clients don't |
| 15:39.43 | AStorm | try tcpdump to see what's going on |
| 15:39.47 | JasonWoof | my server might not be configured for tls |
| 15:40.02 | AStorm | then rtcomm would connect directly |
| 15:40.03 | JasonWoof | mmm good idea |
| 15:40.28 | AStorm | unless server breaks connection on TLS handshake and not just issues an error |
| 15:40.47 | AStorm | maybe some broken version of jabberd 1 does that |
| 15:49.46 | aquatix | crashanddie: did you format fat32 or fat16? |
| 15:50.06 | crashanddie | aquatix, don't remember |
| 15:50.33 | crashanddie | vfat |
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| 15:59.20 | JasonWoof | oh, any reason the practically empty 2GB internal flash card isn't formatted for unix use and mounted at /home? |
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| 16:00.00 | crashanddie | JasonWoof, ? |
| 16:00.10 | JasonWoof | I wanted to check if it would be a bad idea to reformat it |
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| 16:00.30 | crashanddie | JasonWoof, the package manager stores data on it, the maps are downloaded to it, the swap is stored on it |
| 16:00.35 | pH5 | JasonWoof: because it is exported as usb-storage when you connect via usb, they probably preferred vfat for windows host compatibility |
| 16:00.55 | JasonWoof | I've got a 2GB partition mounted at /media/mmc2 |
| 16:01.44 | JasonWoof | I don't care about windows |
| 16:02.46 | crashanddie | JasonWoof, if you don't want to break the apps, I suggest you mount it on /home like you want to, but add a symlink at /media/mmc2 pointing to a rw directory with sufficient space |
| 16:03.10 | JasonWoof | what bugs me is the idea that my home directory gets wiped when flashing a sys upgrade, and that when I tried moving my home dir there I got messages about not being able to preserve permissions |
| 16:03.24 | fysa | that's what a backup is for. |
| 16:03.38 | fysa | and I don't think I even needed that. |
| 16:03.42 | fysa | my home directory is still here after a flash. |
| 16:05.09 | JasonWoof | pretty sure mine was wiped |
| 16:05.25 | JasonWoof | and I don't see the point of backup |
| 16:06.19 | JasonWoof | I'd like to rsync (or better yet unison) w/ my laptop |
| 16:06.45 | JasonWoof | and the partiton with my home dir is small |
| 16:06.49 | qwerty12 | You can, rsync & unison both exist for os2008 |
| 16:07.01 | JasonWoof | cool |
| 16:07.21 | GeneralAntilles | Diablo eliminates flashing upgrades. |
| 16:07.42 | JasonWoof | does diablo exist yet? |
| 16:07.50 | GeneralAntilles | Next few weeks/months. |
| 16:08.21 | JasonWoof | cool |
| 16:08.47 | timo | Does anyone have a pointer to getting scandic characters working in python? I'm trying to make my small app to support text input in Finnish, but still without success with a umlaut etc. |
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| 16:11.19 | sp3000 | I doubt I know the answer but you'll probably need to specify what you're inputting into what using what |
| 16:11.42 | sp3000 | ok, you may have covered the first what |
| 16:12.38 | crashanddie | libcrypto is a bitch to compile :/ |
| 16:12.55 | sp3000 | why, are the build instructions ...cryptic? :P |
| 16:13.06 | crashanddie | erhm |
| 16:13.07 | crashanddie | no |
| 16:13.13 | crashanddie | it times all the different algorythms |
| 16:13.24 | crashanddie | RSA 3072 bit 36400ms 161310ms 2000ms |
| 16:13.24 | crashanddie | RSA 4096 bit 248680ms |
| 16:13.32 | sp3000 | heh |
| 16:13.53 | timo | sp3000: if you refer to my question I have the most simple hildon app in python with one gtk.Entry. Trying to get åäö working in the gtk widgets. |
| 16:14.47 | crashanddie | timo, what type of strings/encoding do you use ? (dunno how python works, sorry) |
| 16:15.38 | crashanddie | timo, http://evanjones.ca/python-utf8.html |
| 16:15.58 | wom- | timo: öäå seems to work without any hassle for me in python and gtk.entry |
| 16:16.06 | wom- | of course this doesn't help :) |
| 16:16.40 | sp3000 | timo: perhaps http://www.google.fi/search?q=gtk.entry+python+encoding.utf8 helps (or misleads, who knows) |
| 16:16.51 | sp3000 | perhaps you and wom- should have a pastebin party |
| 16:17.21 | wom- | well, there is nothing special in it |
| 16:17.23 | timo | wom: that's not fair. I'm getting [;' instead of åäö in my input field. I'll have to chech that http://evanjones.ca/python-utf8.html |
| 16:17.45 | wom- | timo: is that in scratchbox or device.. i tested on device |
| 16:17.50 | sp3000 | wom-: right but there may well be several ways to do nothing specia, only one of which works :) |
| 16:17.52 | timo | both |
| 16:18.11 | crashanddie | wom-, did you write that python app ? |
| 16:18.15 | wom- | in scratchbox i also get ; instead of ä |
| 16:18.22 | sp3000 | timo: that sounds like ...the wrong keyboard? |
| 16:18.35 | wom- | crashanddie: yes i have one i have written |
| 16:18.37 | crashanddie | sp3000, on both scratchbox and the nokia ? |
| 16:18.40 | sp3000 | suspected encoding first |
| 16:18.56 | crashanddie | wom-, mind sharing the code ? Do you use special strings or anything ? |
| 16:19.12 | wom- | crashanddie: code is here code.google.com/googbus |
| 16:19.13 | sp3000 | crashanddie: shrug, input is unknown magic dragon realm to me |
| 16:19.20 | wom- | crashanddie: code is here code.google.com/p/googbus |
| 16:19.43 | crashanddie | timo, check the code, see if you're doing something wrong |
| 16:21.06 | timo | thanks. I'll check that. Need to bake a cake with my kids now. |
| 16:21.47 | crashanddie | now I understand why noone ever bothered making libgcrypt for the nokia xD |
| 16:26.54 | aquatix | crashanddie: ok, successfully formatted it :) |
| 16:27.01 | aquatix | appmgr works again |
| 16:27.04 | aquatix | thanks! |
| 16:27.12 | aquatix | such a trivial thing :/ |
| 16:27.22 | crashanddie | aquatix, yeah, happy to help man |
| 16:27.48 | aquatix | i think it got corrupted trying to copy an mp3 album to it when in a rush |
| 16:28.03 | aquatix | maybe i didn't unmount correctly or something |
| 16:28.21 | GeneralAntilles | Likely |
| 16:28.23 | GeneralAntilles | Card reader? |
| 16:28.25 | aquatix | noticed something about fat in my pc's log too |
| 16:28.37 | aquatix | GeneralAntilles: internal flash of my n810, over usb |
| 16:30.06 | aquatix | copies 1.5GB of maps back to tablet |
| 16:32.03 | crashanddie | would anyone know why dvips isn't included in tetex ? |
| 16:34.32 | crashanddie | (and yes, in case you were wondering, that's the 30min+ compilation of libgcrypt that failed because of dvips :D) |
| 16:35.41 | Navi | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:36.01 | elb | heh |
| 16:40.12 | BabelO | hi, is some mythtvfrontend user here ? ;) |
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| 16:48.32 | aquatix | yay, now Claws mail shows my mail again too ;) |
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| 16:51.18 | qwerty12 | I fixed my rotation problems from earlier :). I started off with a new kernel tree and reapplied patches and remade changes to .config |
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| 17:27.01 | script | crashanddie: libgcrypt is in extras/ for ages |
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| 17:48.18 | Jaffa | re |
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| 18:09.47 | lcuk | me hates performing surgery on his computer |
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| 18:42.40 | JasonWoof | maemo mapper is awesome |
| 18:43.31 | JasonWoof | it downloads maps of where you look and saves them so when you're offline you can view any place you have before |
| 18:44.19 | GeneralAntilles | We're familiar with it. :P |
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| 18:44.52 | JasonWoof | hehe |
| 18:45.37 | JasonWoof | any chance there's a map editor for openstreetmap that works on my n810 |
| 18:46.58 | GeneralAntilles | Don't think so |
| 18:47.05 | GeneralAntilles | But I haven't paid any attention |
| 18:47.11 | GeneralAntilles | so I could very well be wrong. |
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| 18:49.44 | JasonWoof | ok |
| 18:50.11 | JasonWoof | well, I think that'xs it for my wifi time. thanks |
| 18:50.58 | lcuk | paying by the minute? |
| 18:51.15 | GeneralAntilles | Parents? |
| 18:51.17 | GeneralAntilles | Wif? |
| 18:51.42 | lcuk | thats almost as bad as people being worried about runing up a large dialup internet phone bill by accessing long distance web sites |
| 18:51.48 | Veggen | unbelievable. Microsoft and a close partner in OOXML votes for approving it, in the technical committee working on it. 21 votes against. National Body votes "yes", apparently because there was a "lack of consensus in the committee". |
| 18:52.06 | Veggen | (here in Norway) |
| 18:52.40 | lcuk | the "no" group did not offer as much money |
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| 18:55.11 | lcuk | omg, this makes me giggle and look stern all at the same time : http://www.wired.com/politics/security/news/2008/03/epilepsy |
| 18:55.27 | Veggen | they seem to think that ISO can have a saying in how OOXML is developed in the feature if it's an ISO standard. good luck with that, I say, after following the approval process. |
| 18:55.38 | lcuk | i hate flashing things, but ffs they had an image message board, it was ripe for trolling |
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| 19:03.54 | sp3000 | pretty much anything is |
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| 19:35.59 | KotCzarny | yawwn |
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| 19:39.37 | pupnik_ | http://www.zophar.net/download.php?file=/zsnes/spc/som.rar great music |
| 19:39.46 | KotCzarny | pupnik :) |
| 19:40.16 | KotCzarny | have you seen my patched xmms? |
| 19:40.17 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 19:40.29 | pupnik_ | no i have your page open in browser |
| 19:40.35 | pupnik_ | what is it |
| 19:40.39 | KotCzarny | no package ready yet |
| 19:40.45 | KotCzarny | do you have n8x0 ? |
| 19:40.48 | pupnik_ | y |
| 19:40.53 | KotCzarny | moment then |
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| 19:53.33 | KotCzarny | xmms_1.2.11-1etch1_armel.debx |
| 19:53.40 | KotCzarny | (without x) |
| 19:54.54 | pupnik_ | what's good about it KotCzarny |
| 19:55.06 | KotCzarny | i have fixed file/font dialogs |
| 19:55.13 | KotCzarny | to show over main win |
| 19:55.15 | KotCzarny | not below |
| 19:55.15 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 19:55.26 | pupnik_ | good |
| 19:55.27 | KotCzarny | and added .desktop file |
| 19:55.37 | KotCzarny | that fixes locale bug and double size bug |
| 19:56.02 | pupnik_ | locale bug was annoying - ty |
| 19:56.12 | KotCzarny | also it's compiled for n8x0 |
| 19:56.40 | KotCzarny | i was thinking about basic font package |
| 19:56.48 | KotCzarny | or ttfxfs |
| 19:57.00 | KotCzarny | ttf xfs would be smaller i guess |
| 19:57.06 | KotCzarny | and more flexible |
| 19:57.11 | lcdd | 'fixed' ought to be enough for everyone |
| 19:57.33 | KotCzarny | lcdd: no, i still have to fix 2 things at leat |
| 19:57.42 | lcdd | the font that is :) |
| 19:57.49 | KotCzarny | ah |
| 19:57.50 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 20:04.36 | KotCzarny | xfstt compiled |
| 20:04.37 | KotCzarny | hum |
| 20:04.47 | KotCzarny | i wonder how hard will xomap crash with it |
| 20:04.48 | KotCzarny | :) |
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| 20:12.20 | Ar-ras | hi |
| 20:12.25 | Ar-ras | is there any rar unpacker? |
| 20:12.36 | Ar-ras | for IT OS 2008 |
| 20:12.38 | KotCzarny | probably |
| 20:12.49 | Navi | unrar |
| 20:13.04 | GeneralAntilles | apt-get install unrar |
| 20:13.26 | Ar-ras | *WALL* |
| 20:13.27 | Ar-ras | hehe |
| 20:13.29 | Ar-ras | thx |
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| 20:27.54 | lcdd | are there any themes that minimize borders and other useless use of screen space? |
| 20:28.04 | KotCzarny | probably |
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| 20:32.23 | Ar-ras | re |
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| 20:32.27 | Ar-ras | is there any gui for unrar? |
| 20:32.31 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 20:32.39 | KotCzarny | xarchiver |
| 20:32.47 | Ar-ras | thx |
| 20:32.56 | KotCzarny | but you should really use google |
| 20:33.00 | KotCzarny | or wikipedia |
| 20:33.42 | jott | +lucky archiver frontend linux |
| 20:33.44 | Ar-ras | dude, i had only 2 questions... and i was this time a littlebit lazy and asked... |
| 20:33.45 | dtahtbot | jott: http://xarchiver.xfce.org/ |
| 20:33.51 | jott | ;) |
| 20:33.52 | Ar-ras | cya, and thx ;) |
| 20:34.23 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 20:34.37 | KotCzarny | jott: do you use xmms? |
| 20:34.38 | KotCzarny | :) |
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| 20:35.12 | jott | no i don't like it.. i did not like winamp either ;) |
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| 20:35.15 | KotCzarny | ok |
| 20:35.16 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 20:35.36 | jott | i mainly use mpd and amarok nowadays ;) |
| 20:35.45 | KotCzarny | i think there are 2 kinds of people |
| 20:35.56 | KotCzarny | 1/ that prefer winamp/xmms interface |
| 20:36.02 | KotCzarny | and 2/ that prefer canola like |
| 20:36.04 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 20:36.10 | jott | those who take xmms out of gentoo portage and those who don't ;) |
| 20:36.22 | KotCzarny | don't |
| 20:36.23 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 20:36.31 | Navi | mpd, woo |
| 20:36.44 | jott | na i don't like canola for music playback ;) |
| 20:37.13 | jott | and i don't like xmms interface |
| 20:37.15 | Navi | too bad mmpc kinda blows |
| 20:37.47 | jott | yeah well the hildonized version is actually not *that* bad |
| 20:37.56 | jott | but much room for improvement ;) |
| 20:38.10 | KotCzarny | :) |
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| 20:39.44 | jott | i would more says there are two kinds of people: those who have a properly tagged collection and those who don't ;P |
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| 20:41.01 | pupnik | jott did you 'release' goattracker? |
| 20:41.16 | pupnik | it's fun |
| 20:41.25 | KotCzarny | o.o |
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| 20:41.26 | lcdd | jott: there are people who have proper directory structures and those who don't :) |
| 20:41.28 | jott | no it needs some adjustments to be really usable ;) |
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| 20:41.47 | jott | lcdd: that is so 1990s ;) |
| 20:41.49 | KotCzarny | read 'goatsetracker' |
| 20:41.51 | lcdd | haha |
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| 20:42.31 | lcdd | seriously though, my stuff is properly tagged but just takes a ridiculous amount of time to read the metadata |
| 20:42.53 | jott | well you usually don't scan your collection that often ;) |
| 20:42.55 | lcdd | so i just use filenames |
| 20:43.23 | jott | (given you use a player that persistently stores the data ;) |
| 20:43.56 | Navi | jott, I WAS talking about the hildonized version |
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| 20:45.25 | jott | Navi: yeah as i said much room for improvement .. i often use ncmpc or just mpc ;) |
| 20:45.42 | Navi | Not fun to use it on an N800 :/ |
| 20:45.47 | jott | pff :p |
| 20:45.50 | Navi | I do on the desktop, though |
| 20:45.57 | Tama^2 | good morning |
| 20:46.06 | Navi | afternoon .o/ |
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| 20:46.34 | Tama^2 | your other arm is very short, Navi |
| 20:46.43 | Navi | That's my shoulder |
| 20:47.10 | Navi | :P |
| 20:47.31 | jott | Navi: but still i think the interface of mmpc/hildon is better than other hildon players.. ;) |
| 20:47.36 | Tama^2 | you just lost a chance of getting subsidies ;P |
| 20:47.53 | Navi | I'm fine with that |
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| 20:48.31 | Tama^2 | anyone tried setting up scratchbox2? |
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| 20:48.57 | Navi | I keep telling myself to get around to it |
| 20:49.07 | Navi | but it ain't gonna happen |
| 20:49.54 | jott | sbox1 and oe are sufficient for me atm ;) |
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| 20:51.16 | Navi | hrm |
| 20:51.34 | Navi | Anyone happen to have a working, hildonized wxwidgets 2.6 package/build? |
| 20:52.54 | Tama^2 | looks in his greasy toolsbox... |
| 20:53.00 | Tama^2 | -s |
| 20:53.05 | Tama^2 | Navi, no sorry |
| 20:54.12 | Navi | snaps |
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| 21:07.34 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 21:07.48 | KotCzarny | i guess 'fixed' looks ok in 225dpi |
| 21:08.38 | jott | uses "Terminus" for all terminal applications :) |
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| 21:08.46 | KotCzarny | on n800? |
| 21:08.48 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:08.52 | jott | n810 yes |
| 21:09.02 | jott | looks great |
| 21:09.02 | KotCzarny | terminus is ttf, right? |
| 21:09.04 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 21:09.10 | jott | no bitmap.. |
| 21:09.14 | KotCzarny | hum |
| 21:09.21 | KotCzarny | but it's not selectable in xmms |
| 21:09.25 | jott | bdf or whatever your convert it to ;) |
| 21:09.37 | KotCzarny | not in xlsfonts too |
| 21:09.38 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:09.52 | jott | update your font cache :P |
| 21:10.09 | KotCzarny | still nothing |
| 21:11.06 | KotCzarny | i think fixed and cursor fonts are built into xomap |
| 21:11.41 | jott | that's what you get for using an ancient player ;P |
| 21:11.49 | KotCzarny | nope |
| 21:12.01 | KotCzarny | that's what you get for all apps not using gtk2/freetype |
| 21:12.03 | KotCzarny | :P |
| 21:12.27 | jott | this has nothing to do with gtk2 ;) |
| 21:12.35 | KotCzarny | not true |
| 21:12.46 | KotCzarny | gtk2 is compiled against freetype |
| 21:12.49 | jott | qt works too ;) |
| 21:12.57 | KotCzarny | probably same as gtk2 |
| 21:13.18 | jott | yeah it uses freetype ;) |
| 21:14.06 | KotCzarny | then you're wrong few lines before :) |
| 21:14.30 | jott | no |
| 21:14.40 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 21:14.42 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:14.43 | jott | it just has to do with freetype, not with gtk2 |
| 21:15.00 | KotCzarny | only skype uses qt on n8x0 |
| 21:15.01 | KotCzarny | for now |
| 21:15.02 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:15.05 | jott | no |
| 21:15.08 | KotCzarny | what else? |
| 21:15.16 | jott | all apps you compile for it.. |
| 21:15.34 | KotCzarny | i'm talking about default apps |
| 21:15.38 | KotCzarny | not user packaged |
| 21:15.38 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:16.06 | jott | skype uses gtk on n8x0 |
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| 21:17.14 | sxpert | skype is evil |
| 21:19.19 | KotCzarny | jott: you're right about skype-gtk2 |
| 21:19.25 | KotCzarny | interesting |
| 21:19.27 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:20.18 | KotCzarny | then qt is not used :) |
| 21:20.32 | jott | but freetype is ;) |
| 21:20.35 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 21:20.43 | KotCzarny | that was what i have said |
| 21:20.44 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 21:20.46 | jott | no |
| 21:26.56 | KotCzarny | Font Path: built-ins |
| 21:26.58 | KotCzarny | hah |
| 21:27.03 | KotCzarny | that's what i though |
| 21:27.04 | KotCzarny | t |
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| 22:10.29 | pupnik | d U C k s T A b |
| 22:13.59 | KotCzarny | stupid xomap. |
| 22:14.07 | KotCzarny | probably not supporting xfs. |
| 22:18.24 | lcuk | cripes, jake just nearly went crazy eddie in here |
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| 22:21.30 | KotCzarny | i hate nokia for crippling software |
| 22:22.19 | `0660 | ? |
| 22:22.25 | lcuk | map for one |
| 22:22.28 | KotCzarny | no support for xset fp+ |
| 22:22.49 | `0660 | what option is fp+? |
| 22:22.54 | KotCzarny | font path |
| 22:23.07 | KotCzarny | be it local or remote |
| 22:23.13 | `0660 | oh |
| 22:24.37 | `0660 | and what's the problem with map? |
| 22:24.45 | GeneralAntilles | It's teh suck. |
| 22:25.29 | `0660 | i don't like it either, but isn't it a third party product like skype? |
| 22:26.22 | lcuk | yes, but i bought this 810 because it had capable gps mapping abilities |
| 22:26.43 | `0660 | wasn't there more problems with the gps unit itself? |
| 22:26.48 | GeneralAntilles | Not QUITE like Skype |
| 22:26.51 | GeneralAntilles | But it's not in-house. |
| 22:27.09 | lcuk | thats the annoying thingyou know, like when you buy a car stereo for music then find out you have to pay extra to use the cd slot |
| 22:27.41 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 22:27.48 | KotCzarny | what's the name of xserver package? |
| 22:27.57 | lcuk | add to that the hoops you have to jump through to get it initialized and i am left with a bad taste in my mouth re certain aspects |
| 22:28.16 | KotCzarny | xserver-xomap |
| 22:29.01 | KotCzarny | lcuk: yeah |
| 22:29.09 | KotCzarny | that's why n800 is superior to n810 |
| 22:29.10 | KotCzarny | :> |
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| 22:29.37 | KotCzarny | in similiar way n-gage qd is crippled (comparing to n-gage) |
| 22:29.40 | lcuk | hindsite is a wonderful thing. the most scary part of this is i would not give back this 810 and the 800 doesnt appeal - its got the wrong shape |
| 22:29.59 | lcuk | it was all based on form factor |
| 22:30.34 | lcuk | inever liked onscreen keyboards and i didnt want to always have to carry extra |
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| 23:14.16 | Jaffa | lcuk: Enabling all the features in Map is trivial by editing one 32-bit word of one file. |
| 23:14.37 | KotCzarny | hacker! |
| 23:14.43 | lcuk | hot coffee moment! |
| 23:14.51 | Jaffa | ...if one *wanted* to do that, of course. *cough* |
| 23:15.00 | KotCzarny | is that legal? |
| 23:15.12 | lcuk | i will be examining things with a microscope eventually :) |
| 23:15.19 | Jaffa | Err. |
| 23:15.22 | lcuk | i personally dont see why not - its my device |
| 23:15.27 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 23:15.30 | Jaffa | Actually, I think in the UK it is. As long as I don't tell you how. |
| 23:15.31 | lcuk | the illegal part may be sharing how and what with others |
| 23:15.32 | KotCzarny | yeah.. 'yours' |
| 23:15.53 | Jaffa | hasn't signed any contract saying he won't edit random files on his device. |
| 23:15.57 | milhouse | Could be considered theft of service I suppose |
| 23:16.11 | lcuk | and its no more illegal than unlocking an iphone |
| 23:16.14 | KotCzarny | i think there's something about modifying and disassembling |
| 23:16.15 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 23:16.16 | lcuk | nahhhhh cant be |
| 23:16.18 | KotCzarny | in the license |
| 23:16.24 | lcuk | what license? |
| 23:16.26 | Jaffa | KotCzarny: what licence? |
| 23:16.28 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 23:16.30 | lcuk | i havent read a eula or installed anything |
| 23:16.46 | lcuk | im just examining the data that came preinstalled with my hardware |
| 23:16.48 | KotCzarny | does map app have some help? |
| 23:17.03 | lcuk | it might do, but the barn door will be open then |
| 23:17.15 | Jaffa | KotCzarny: so what if it does? It was shipped to me, and accepting any EULA isn't required to use it (even if such things were actually legal) |
| 23:17.35 | KotCzarny | i'm just kidding |
| 23:17.43 | lcuk | this linux device even tells me that if i want to hack it i can but its not nokias responsability |
| 23:17.46 | KotCzarny | looks at all mp3s and xvids |
| 23:17.47 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 23:17.48 | Jaffa | Such debates are healthy, of course :) |
| 23:17.50 | milhouse | Isn't it the same as taking a time limited version of Vista and unlocking it? Would you argue that is legally permissible? |
| 23:18.23 | lcuk | thx jaffa :) i was wondering the mechanism - now i will find it if required |
| 23:18.33 | KotCzarny | 'you can rent this apartment, but don't go into the basement' |
| 23:18.34 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 23:18.44 | lcuk | timelocked versions of office come routinely with computers |
| 23:18.53 | lcuk | ooops your honour, my clock stopped |
| 23:18.58 | lcuk | silly me |
| 23:19.02 | Jaffa | milhouse: I'm not saying it's /morally/ acceptable, but I dunno about legally. IANAL. |
| 23:19.20 | KotCzarny | does eu license apply in us? |
| 23:19.24 | KotCzarny | and vice versa ? |
| 23:19.32 | lcuk | us thinks their license works everywhere |
| 23:19.36 | milhouse | me neither, but I'd say it's definitely a legal grey area with the benefit of the doubt going to the software author IMHO |
| 23:19.49 | lcuk | eucd is similar to us license |
| 23:20.09 | KotCzarny | once we have nwo there will be no us/eu |
| 23:20.10 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 23:20.19 | milhouse | as to the morals of it, I think it depends on your opinion of the software author :) |
| 23:20.21 | Jaffa | just went to great lengths to ensure his commercial software products (when he sold one) had a demo version which couldn't be unlocked as it was functionally missing code. Now, that's a lot harder to do when you want to time-limit full functionality, but it could've been a lot harder to bypass (and my ARM disassembly skills are *very* rusty) |
| 23:20.23 | KotCzarny | 'one world' fsck it. |
| 23:20.24 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 23:20.25 | *** join/#maemo christefano (n=christef@c-98-203-38-57.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 23:21.14 | Jaffa | milhouse: I'll wait on my conclusion of that when/if Navicore release updated maps - AIUI they haven't been updated since the 770 navigation kit was released. |
| 23:21.14 | lcuk | im waiting to see what transpires with this next update before i do anything |
| 23:21.50 | lcuk | 6 months down the line if the patch is worthwhile and fixes things and improves stuff, then i might just get the 36month license - it includes data updates as well |
| 23:22.07 | milhouse | Jaffa: I'm morally lax where Microsoft are concerned because of their size and attitude, but smaller software houses or "open source" friendly firms should be protected... if Navicore screws us over and doesn't release updates to their buggy shit then rip their faces off, please. |
| 23:22.10 | milhouse | :) |
| 23:22.13 | *** join/#maemo unique311 (n=mobile@cpe-66-24-109-22.stny.res.rr.com) |
| 23:22.21 | Jaffa | lcuk: that's what they've promised; but I don't believe any have ever been delivered. |
| 23:22.23 | Jaffa | milhouse: heh |
| 23:23.07 | lcuk | looking at the older versions of maemo and bitching about things, i think they have made great leaps and bounds (and to the point that '08 feels like a step backwards which i believe they are trying to rectify) |
| 23:23.26 | Jaffa | Indeed. I have high hopes for Diablo (hopefully next week) |
| 23:23.31 | lcuk | its not like they have rested on their laurels, they have tried to give us a worthy product |
| 23:23.39 | milhouse | I want bug fixes first, new functionality can wait |
| 23:23.45 | lcuk | yes agreed |
| 23:23.47 | Jaffa | milhouse: indeed |
| 23:24.03 | milhouse | And a better community process - it sucks so bad that's why I've pretty much lost interest. |
| 23:24.11 | Jaffa | If 4.1 is 4.0 with just some spit and polish around the rough edges |
| 23:24.20 | Jaffa | milhouse: it's still very them/us :-( |
| 23:24.35 | milhouse | Jaffa: We're an inconvenience |
| 23:24.36 | lcuk | 07 was really nice by all accounts, and had lots of stable packages - i can see that starting with 08 - its been a rough few months because lots have shifted |
| 23:24.46 | GeneralAntilles | That's the feeling I get, too. |
| 23:24.50 | GeneralAntilles | and it's very disheartening. |
| 23:25.15 | KotCzarny | hmm |
| 23:25.22 | KotCzarny | where do i set deb_build_options ? |
| 23:25.28 | *** join/#maemo SDuensin (n=Scott@12-226-44-250.client.mchsi.com) |
| 23:25.32 | KotCzarny | .profile ? |
| 23:25.37 | KotCzarny | or it's per package? |
| 23:25.38 | milhouse | I'll see what the Intel devices are like and probably get involved there if the devices are any good, I expect the community involvement to be leaps and bounds better than what Nokia have achieved |
| 23:25.42 | lcuk | we have too many chefs trying to make a single pie |
| 23:25.46 | lcuk | atom |
| 23:26.09 | lcuk | i hate intel processors though :( |
| 23:26.19 | milhouse | They're pretty open source friendly |
| 23:26.23 | milhouse | Which is a plus |
| 23:27.24 | KotCzarny | export DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS="vfp" |
| 23:27.26 | KotCzarny | hah. |
| 23:27.27 | Jaffa | milhouse: indeed. The fact that qgil's admitted recently "Intel/Ubuntu required $FOO to be opened, so we opened [some part of Hildon]" - whilst simultaneously closing other stuff on Maemo is a little annoying. |
| 23:27.47 | milhouse | And of course they won't be using hardware under NDA's *cough* 3D *cough* |
| 23:28.08 | Jaffa | The MIDs are going to be practically OSS from one end to the other, and they're putting a *lot* of effort into the apps to customise the UIs to be really finger friendly and not just desktop clones shrunk down. |
| 23:28.40 | Jaffa | My interest'll just depend on price point, battery life and size of the devices |
| 23:28.47 | milhouse | Jaffa: +1 |
| 23:28.53 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 23:29.34 | milhouse | Though I expect we'll end up disappointed - we'll be calling for Nokia size devices with the Intel community spirit... :) |
| 23:30.24 | lcuk | there is community spirit here, but a lacking infrastructure to allow growth |
| 23:30.28 | GeneralAntilles | Hehe |
| 23:30.43 | milhouse | I'm expecting the Intel kit to be a little bigger/heavier/costlier and slightly more power hungry than Nokias |
| 23:30.55 | lcuk | look, each of us has enough spirit to make a difference - i have a half bottle of scotch, what do you have? |
| 23:31.06 | milhouse | the community spirit is lacking on the part of Nokia, not the users |
| 23:31.16 | milhouse | And without Nokia, we're fcked |
| 23:31.16 | lcuk | corporate firewall |
| 23:31.31 | milhouse | Because so much of the software is still closed |
| 23:31.56 | Jaffa | lcuk: A rather nifty Java web framework on top of struts supporting individual components built together into pages with indepedent lifecycles? |
| 23:31.59 | Jaffa | lcuk: spot on |
| 23:32.08 | lcuk | how close are we to having full linux - ive seen things like montevista etc? |
| 23:32.17 | milhouse | On Nokia or Intel? |
| 23:32.21 | Jaffa | also has a bottle of 70s Royal Navy vodka. Unopened. |
| 23:32.23 | lcuk | either |
| 23:32.42 | milhouse | Suspect it's closer on Intel, as the hardware is fully documented |
| 23:32.49 | lcuk | i just want a hardware supported distro |
| 23:33.01 | lcuk | with this form factor |
| 23:33.26 | milhouse | Can't see that happening with Nokia's while they still have proprietary and undocumented hardware |
| 23:33.51 | milhouse | :( <---- I'm very sad to see this happen, although I moan about it a lot I'm not happy |
| 23:33.52 | lcuk | when i had my pocketpc i felt distrant from the metal. with this i have gotten closer to both the device (I can smell the solder) and also closer to linux |
| 23:34.25 | GeneralAntilles | I wonder why Nokia hates us so much. |
| 23:34.32 | Jaffa | Corporate attitude. |
| 23:34.38 | milhouse | You can get close, but Nokia still prevent you from going all the way and using the devices to their fullest capabilities |
| 23:34.38 | lcuk | i can keep my safety net of windows and at the same time look over there and know i have an entire penguin locked up |
| 23:34.54 | Jaffa | Intel have long been in the "ship stuff so developers use our chips". Nokia, even with Symbian, are in the "we want consumers to buy our devices". |
| 23:34.55 | GeneralAntilles | I'm really pulling for all the boomers to die off or retire already so people with some sense can change that attitude. |
| 23:35.05 | lcuk | but it wont change |
| 23:35.47 | lcuk | when you get close to it you are told not to give away the crown jewels and you dont |
| 23:35.49 | milhouse | It takes time, and I'm not sure I can wait around for Nokia to get with the programme |
| 23:36.10 | KotCzarny | what's the difference between ARM1136JF-S and ARM1136J-S ? |
| 23:36.14 | milhouse | I doubt Intel were open from the start - but they saw the wind of change, realised the benefits and are reaping it now |
| 23:36.25 | milhouse | One has an F, the other one doesn't |
| 23:36.26 | lcuk | nor am i - now i am linux powered, i can choose anything running it - i am thinking of this learning experience as the startings of the next 10/20 years of my life. |
| 23:36.33 | KotCzarny | cool. |
| 23:36.41 | GeneralAntilles | It's so stupefyingly frustrating to watch so much talent and spirit go to waste because Nokia can't manage to pull its head out of its own ass. |
| 23:37.07 | lcuk | but what should they do? react to every single whine? |
| 23:37.17 | Jaffa | milhouse: true, my point was Intel's company is based on selling chips to OEMs, which requires developers. Nokia's company is based around selling closed electrical appliances which they support (supposedly) |
| 23:37.32 | Paavo | You're seeing just one side here. |
| 23:37.42 | Jaffa | wonders if we'll know why tko et al left - better offer or fed up. |
| 23:37.48 | *** join/#maemo unique311 (n=mobile@cpe-66-24-109-22.stny.res.rr.com) |
| 23:37.50 | lcuk | they would be out of business. we are one platform within nokia - they have many. i have seen the NIT develop into something great - why would they throw it away |
| 23:38.19 | lcuk | GeneralAntilles, i hope you meant all us lot here :) |
| 23:38.44 | Jaffa | Paavo: if it's a community effort (whether the NITs, ITOS or even just maemo) there aren't supposed to be any sides ;-) |
| 23:38.49 | Paavo | Pardon me - I'm mostly involved with the S60 organization - but could you summarize quickly what Nokia has done wrong with Maemo? |
| 23:39.05 | milhouse | Jaffa: I agree... Intel have realised there is no money in software, but free software sells hardware... but that doesn't mean that Nokia can't sell boat loads of hardware by having a really neat design - just having nice software won't sell the devices, and having closed software doubly so. |
| 23:39.19 | GeneralAntilles | Generally, it's the whole us vs them attitude. |
| 23:39.37 | milhouse | If Nokia have neat devices, open software, a large community of developers supporting that software then the hardware will sell itself. Again, there is no money in software. |
| 23:39.40 | Paavo | My background is that I fought internally to get Python for S60 open sourced. |
| 23:40.20 | lcuk | the winner from all of this is linux |
| 23:40.23 | Paavo | ...and in the process talked to a fair number of lawyers. |
| 23:40.53 | lcuk | its getting on LOADS of devices now and its on the lips of everyone. you can buy them in most shops, you can give them to your gran, you can get software for them |
| 23:41.18 | milhouse | I don't think Nokia keep software closed source because it gives them a competitive advantage - you've seen Media Player, nobody in their right mind would say that gives them a competitive advantage. They keep software closed because the Corporation as a whole is not onboard with the concept of what Maemo are trying to achieve. |
| 23:41.22 | Tama^2 | lawyers? who said LAWYERS? >.> |
| 23:41.43 | Paavo | did |
| 23:42.13 | Tama^2 | It's a matter of corporate attitude as it was stated before |
| 23:42.20 | Tama^2 | and it's not going to change any time soon |
| 23:42.20 | *** join/#maemo tko (n=tko@adsl-212-16-103-76.taloyhtioverkot.fi) |
| 23:42.35 | milhouse | Nokia loses - on to the next company. |
| 23:42.40 | Jaffa | milhouse: I reckon there are middle managers at Nokia who do think they're GUI apps give them a competitive advantage. At least at the start of the 770 project, they'd've said "OK, you can open source the base, but we'll keep the high-level GUI apps: then it'll be harder for someone to make a clone". Thus missing the point that Nokia's real skill can be in hardware design, packaging and marketing. |
| 23:42.41 | milhouse | I won't shed a tear |
| 23:42.57 | Jaffa | s/they're/their/ (shocking) |
| 23:43.26 | milhouse | Jaffa: 110% agree :( Utter fuckwits with that attitude are killing the next big thing. |
| 23:43.43 | lcuk | nokia doesnt have the right to open up the wifi driver, or the pvr |
| 23:44.21 | milhouse | They bought closed hardware - their fault |
| 23:44.22 | KotCzarny | but they could at least provide them |
| 23:44.34 | lcuk | yes |
| 23:44.39 | KotCzarny | to fully use what's inside the box |
| 23:44.51 | lcuk | binary blobs are tainted, but thats better than what we have now |
| 23:44.51 | GeneralAntilles | What's similar in the range for an ARM device other than OMAP? |
| 23:45.05 | milhouse | But I also find it hard to believe that a customer as large as Nokia could not get the suppliers to change their mind |
| 23:45.31 | *** join/#maemo briand (n=brian@c-68-35-254-149.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 23:45.42 | lcuk | blob side, they could have - the other devices from nokia using the same cpu have pvr available |
| 23:45.58 | milhouse | Particularly when you consider the same hardware is used in top end Nokia phones and they must be selling tens of millions - that must give Nokia tremendous leverage with the suppliers |
| 23:46.01 | Tama^2 | milhouse: do you even think they tried? |
| 23:46.41 | milhouse | Tama^2: I don't think the answer is clear cut |
| 23:46.43 | lcuk | paavo, you said you worked from the inside - are you a nokia employee? |
| 23:46.47 | Paavo | yes |
| 23:47.00 | milhouse | Blimey - Paavo, you're a rarity around here! :) |
| 23:47.01 | Paavo | though not involved with maemo |
| 23:47.09 | milhouse | Ah, that would explain it... |
| 23:47.10 | lcuk | are you aware that we on the maemo side have no power vr (3d graphics) driver available? |
| 23:47.20 | Tama^2 | and it's not only about the hardware, the (lame) system UI is closed |
| 23:47.21 | Jaffa | is still impressed that Nokia *are* doing Maemo and the N810. We just wish it were better ;-) |
| 23:47.32 | lcuk | and is there anywhere you could possibly send an internal mail to to try to find out why? |
| 23:48.14 | lcuk | doesnt have to be serious, but to obtain a corporate stance on the matter would be beneficial |
| 23:48.16 | GeneralAntilles | I like how Quim ignored the PowerVR question in the Skype interview. |
| 23:48.34 | lcuk | even if it is a "we cannot release that driver at this time" |
| 23:48.42 | GeneralAntilles | Something. |
| 23:48.44 | lcuk | something official would be a start |
| 23:48.53 | milhouse | Again I agree Jaffa, but it's failing in so many ways... I read the latest PCW magazine which had about 4 pages in the news section on MIDs - all it talked about were Intel MIDs and ASUS eee's and similar PCs. Not one single mention of Nokia or their Tablets. Nobody knows. Nobody cares. |
| 23:48.54 | KotCzarny | or 'we don't even have a driver nor plans to have one' |
| 23:48.57 | Paavo | Send a mail? I do know the people involved, but I doubt I have any more leverage than you, really. |
| 23:48.58 | GeneralAntilles | I haven't seen a single official word on the issue. |
| 23:49.22 | milhouse | In 10 years time, Nokia Internet Tablets will just be a Wiki footnote on "Internet Tablets" |
| 23:49.41 | lcuk | paavo, for a start, you KNOW them and have their addresses - i think an internal mail would be better than us digging and finding something which might just annoy the wrong person |
| 23:50.07 | GeneralAntilles | Personally, I think the guy we'd have to talk to is Quim. |
| 23:50.11 | Paavo | You sure I'm the only Nokia employee on this channel? |
| 23:50.11 | lcuk | milhouse, irrelivent - all companies become footnotes |
| 23:50.27 | lcuk | you are the first person who has identified themselves as such, yes |
| 23:50.27 | milhouse | lcuk: in time, but Nokia Internet Tablets could have been leading the field |
| 23:50.29 | Paavo | I'd be very surprised if that's the case. |
| 23:50.34 | GeneralAntilles | Not true, lcuk. :P |
| 23:50.43 | lcuk | ahhh ok then |
| 23:50.46 | Paavo | Color me surprised then. |
| 23:50.48 | lcuk | why havent they been quizzed then? |
| 23:51.15 | GeneralAntilles | lcuk, try dropping a line to Quim. |
| 23:51.19 | GeneralAntilles | See if that gets you anywhere. |
| 23:51.49 | milhouse | lcuk: Actually, what's happening with NITs isn't untypical for revolutionary products... it's often the first product on the market that fails to ignite the imagination of consumers until a second version from someone else cleans up... |
| 23:52.11 | milhouse | I'm thinking in the UK of TiVo's which failed yet Sky+ (inferior product) is cleaning up - both are PVRs |
| 23:52.12 | Jaffa | lcuk: that's not quite true. qgil, tko, X-Fade, ferenc and a few others are/were often about. |
| 23:52.18 | Paavo | As for what parts Nokia should fight harder to get open sourced, Ari Jaaksi might be the more appropriate level of contact. |
| 23:52.22 | Jaffa | milhouse: true. |
| 23:52.23 | lcuk | milhouse, look around, its happening everywhere - linux products are taking off big style |
| 23:52.30 | GeneralAntilles | timeless, as well. |
| 23:52.40 | Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: oops, naughty me forgetting timeless |
| 23:52.48 | GeneralAntilles | Who hasn't been around in months. |
| 23:52.49 | Jaffa | There are loads others I'm forgetting too |
| 23:52.56 | Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: hmm, that's true. Worrying. |
| 23:53.09 | GeneralAntilles | and I still haven't gotten my shirt. ;_; |
| 23:53.12 | milhouse | lcuk: I know, great isn't it? :) |
| 23:53.20 | lcuk | right, well since there are enough paavo, my apologies - ill get something together for them :) |
| 23:53.26 | lcuk | milhouse YES |
| 23:53.37 | milhouse | daniels |
| 23:53.48 | lcuk | stone bloke yes of course |
| 23:53.53 | Jaffa | Indeed |
| 23:53.58 | Jaffa | Loads of 'em, see ;-) |
| 23:54.04 | milhouse | I suspect some disappeared as they were simply unable to answer some of the questions due to corporate bollox |
| 23:54.05 | Jaffa | They're just all silent whilst we bellyache |
| 23:54.37 | lcuk | just a documented binary driver is all thats needed to see what a difference we could make |
| 23:54.45 | milhouse | probably gave irc up as a bad idea |
| 23:55.05 | GeneralAntilles | Which is too bad. |
| 23:55.21 | *** join/#maemo gopi (n=gopi@h-67-101-103-211.snfccasy.dynamic.covad.net) |
| 23:55.25 | milhouse | aye... it's not irc that's the problem it's the secrecy which means using irc becomes painful |
| 23:56.39 | Paavo | Let's start with the corporate firewall that blocks IRC ports :) |
| 23:56.43 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 23:56.59 | KotCzarny | how about ssh? |
| 23:57.24 | lcuk | yes, sssssh about the ssh |
| 23:57.29 | Paavo | You pretty much have to have your own irssi/screen server somewhere outside to chat. |
| 23:57.50 | KotCzarny | paavo: anyone involved with *bsd/linux have at least one |
| 23:57.51 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 23:57.53 | Paavo | Fortunately there's an SSH gateway you can use. |
| 23:58.18 | Paavo | True. Or they should have. |
| 23:58.24 | KotCzarny | there's no place like 127.0.0.1 :) |
| 23:58.54 | *** join/#maemo Juhaz (i=juhaz@z79.ip6.netikka.fi) |
| 23:59.02 | KotCzarny | unless it's a corporate policy not to allow ssh sessions to the outside? |
| 23:59.10 | Paavo | It's ironic that with my company phone I can IRC easier with outsiders than with insiders. |
| 23:59.44 | milhouse | And another gripe about Nokia Tablets - when will they sort out the fricking repository madness? I've never seen so much talk about something so fundamentally broken and so little action. |
