| 00:01.28 | zerojay | ASCIII text. |
| 00:03.04 | pupnik | :) |
| 00:03.26 | pupnik | http://www.vortex.prodigynet.co.uk/misc/ascii_conv.html |
| 00:09.11 | zerojay | pupnik: Are you from France? |
| 00:09.49 | pupnik | non, pourqoi? |
| 00:11.53 | zerojay | Because of the 20 before the 21's. |
| 00:12.46 | pupnik | tht's ascii space, no? |
| 00:12.51 | zerojay | Yes. |
| 00:13.16 | zerojay | It's something most French people do. |
| 00:13.22 | zerojay | Putting a 20 before the 21s like that. |
| 00:13.24 | zerojay | Separating them. |
| 00:13.50 | pupnik | i did not know this :) |
| 00:14.26 | Pio | echo -e "\x52\x4F\x4E\x20\x50\x41\x55\x4C\x20\x32\x30\x30\x38\x20\x21\x21\x21" |
| 00:16.22 | pupnik | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:16.31 | |R | haha |
| 00:16.57 | zerojay | pupnik: It's something you learn when you do a lot of text translations... and because our game would see the space, if it was at the end of the line, it would wrap so that the 21 was at the bottom of the next line all alone. |
| 00:17.11 | zerojay | So I spent a good amount of time adding in A0's instead of 20's for those cases. |
| 00:17.30 | Pio | for i in 52 4F 4E 20 50 41 55 4C 20 32 30 30 38 20 21 21 21 ; do echo -en "\x$i" ; done |
| 00:17.49 | pupnik | oh i like this one |
| 00:29.45 | *** join/#maemo unique311 (n=unique31@ool-457ae2a6.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 00:34.07 | *** join/#maemo febb (n=febb@189.135.59.221) |
| 00:47.26 | *** join/#maemo greentux_ (n=lemke@Z46c2.z.pppool.de) |
| 01:07.45 | *** join/#maemo Robdgreat (i=me@ip70-171-115-241.no.no.cox.net) |
| 01:47.50 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@c-76-109-91-246.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 02:06.12 | *** join/#maemo jacques (n=jacques@nslu2-linux/jacques) |
| 02:27.07 | *** join/#maemo henno (i=henno@gateway/tor/x-be9e19f2da1ec884) |
| 02:27.12 | *** join/#maemo jamey_ (n=jamey_@pool-71-174-240-14.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 02:27.34 | *** part/#maemo jamey_ (n=jamey_@pool-71-174-240-14.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 02:51.45 | *** join/#maemo nad_ (n=nad@adsl-67-120-84-102.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 03:04.00 | lopz | bye |
| 03:14.40 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@c-76-109-91-246.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 03:16.31 | *** join/#maemo erstazi (n=erstazi@unaffiliated/erstazi) |
| 03:18.15 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@c-76-109-91-246.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 03:32.42 | *** join/#maemo hircus (n=michel@adsl-75-62-114-193.dsl.bltnin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 03:41.46 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 03:47.40 | *** join/#maemo Toni (i=twillber@nat/movial/x-8a3f989b0c9d9884) |
| 03:56.59 | *** join/#maemo pdz- (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 04:03.09 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@c-76-109-91-246.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 04:18.08 | *** join/#maemo NaPs (n=Unknown@tecknet.org) |
| 04:29.34 | *** join/#maemo rambokid (n=timj@e176219083.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 04:40.08 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181223139.pp.htv.fi) |
| 04:41.38 | *** join/#maemo tank1770 (i=tank17@gateway/tor/x-b8fe79d957026412) |
| 04:44.28 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 04:44.41 | *** join/#maemo mbuf (n=mbuf@202.63.103.2) |
| 05:00.17 | *** join/#maemo dolske (n=dolske@c-24-7-115-18.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 05:17.04 | *** join/#maemo pleemans (n=peter@leemanpe.ugent.be) |
| 05:35.24 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@crlspr-69.65.71.237.myacc.net) |
| 05:39.18 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@137.147.45.66.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 05:40.02 | *** join/#maemo pdz- (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 05:50.11 | *** join/#maemo geaaru (n=geaaru@host227-218-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 05:54.10 | *** join/#maemo sciboy (n=sciboy@124-170-80-224.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 06:08.05 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@kone1.tmvvision.finnetcom.net) |
| 06:28.06 | *** join/#maemo latzko (n=latzko@dsl5400276E.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 06:28.11 | latzko | hi |
| 06:28.53 | latzko | In Layout mode I got this: Oct 17 08:25:21 Nokia-N800-10 DSME: error reading fd (12): Resource temporarily |
| 06:28.53 | latzko | unavailable |
| 06:29.07 | latzko | and it hangs |
| 06:29.44 | latzko | have you got any tips? thanks |
| 06:34.14 | *** join/#maemo tkharju (n=tikiviha@84-253-228-222.satp.customers.dnainternet.fi) |
| 06:58.40 | |R | FUCK!! |
| 06:58.45 | |R | i just trashed /bin by error |
| 06:59.01 | |R | can't start a shell or anything anymore :((( |
| 06:59.08 | |R | will have to redo EVERYTHING ! |
| 06:59.30 | dpryo | pwnd! |
| 06:59.44 | |R | :/ |
| 07:00.20 | *** join/#maemo red-zack (n=mk@p5B047BE9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:03.38 | *** join/#maemo _guardian (n=Guardian@mar44-1-87-90-32-28.dsl.club-internet.fr) |
| 07:06.33 | *** join/#maemo NetBlade (n=osku@kone1.tmvvision.finnetcom.net) |
| 07:19.17 | *** join/#maemo jwhelan (n=unique1@h87.134.90.75.ip.alltel.net) |
| 07:36.08 | *** join/#maemo slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 07:37.04 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (n=mlpug__@a88-115-165-32.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 07:39.06 | *** join/#maemo javamaniac (n=gerardo@pwnd.gerardo.com.ve) |
| 07:40.23 | *** join/#maemo bmidgley (n=bmidgley@254.sub-70-193-27.myvzw.com) |
| 07:45.32 | *** join/#maemo sKaBoy (n=luogni@host57-218-static.90-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 07:55.32 | *** join/#maemo bilboed (n=bilboed@pdpc/supporter/active/bilboed) |
| 07:58.26 | |R | urhm, anyone know why after reflashing the cards don't get mounted automagically? |
| 07:58.58 | |R | ah doh, usb cable |
| 08:03.31 | *** join/#maemo ab (i=ab@nat/ibm/x-85fd3ac43599da01) |
| 08:14.19 | *** join/#maemo Big_B (n=Big_B@202.4.103.10) |
| 08:14.29 | |R | */&/*($ crap... now microb package breaks the browser and completely kills it if removed... wth! |
| 08:21.01 | *** join/#maemo sujan (n=sujan@202.4.103.10) |
| 08:23.58 | keesj | I had the same problem at one time |
| 08:29.03 | *** join/#maemo fab (n=bellet@monkey.creatis.insa-lyon.fr) |
| 08:31.23 | Jaffa | Morning, all |
| 08:32.21 | keesj | Yo |
| 08:32.50 | sujan | Good morning |
| 08:36.42 | *** join/#maemo jonty (n=jonty@host-84-9-147-67.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 09:06.27 | *** join/#maemo sciboy (n=sciboy@124-170-80-224.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 09:13.22 | *** join/#maemo sp3000 (n=tt@hoasb-ff0ddd00-250.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 09:20.02 | *** join/#maemo sujan (n=sujan@202.4.103.10) |
| 09:20.46 | sujan | Hello! |
| 09:31.22 | *** join/#maemo Big_B (n=Big_B@202.4.103.10) |
| 09:33.56 | *** join/#maemo ramo102 (n=ramo102@81-208-74-190.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 09:34.44 | *** join/#maemo pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be) |
| 09:35.40 | *** join/#maemo AD-N770 (i=jep@nat/fluendo/x-25611bb78a97f714) |
| 09:35.59 | *** join/#maemo obergix[work] (n=olivier@inf-6632.int-evry.fr) |
| 09:37.13 | *** join/#maemo koen_ (n=koen@212.41.157.237) |
| 09:40.34 | *** join/#maemo dpb_ (i=dbainton@nat/movial/x-07dcd4d8ba932b2e) |
| 09:41.59 | AD-N770 | good morning |
| 09:47.11 | flip^ | mornin' |
| 09:51.41 | *** join/#maemo koen__ (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 10:07.58 | *** part/#maemo latzko (n=latzko@dsl5400276E.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 10:12.46 | Jiten_ | anyone else tried using gazpacho? 0.7.2 (the maemo version) seems to be somewhat unstable. |
| 10:24.07 | *** join/#maemo HGFB (n=HGFB@82-71-34-108.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 10:25.06 | Jiten_ | not mention that I can't specify a toolbar for my program with it that works the way as in the tutorials at www.maemo.org |
| 10:28.01 | *** join/#maemo florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 10:28.54 | czr | gday |
| 10:29.56 | *** join/#maemo dneary (n=dneary@251.9.39-62.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 10:32.42 | *** join/#maemo sujan (n=sujan@202.4.103.10) |
| 10:34.04 | dneary | seen qgil |
| 10:34.05 | _Monkey | qgil was last seen on #maemo 29 days, 20 hours, 7 minutes and 24 seconds ago, saying: we have completed the upload and we are doing the last testing before announcing the release [Mon Sep 17 15:26:40 2007] |
| 10:34.05 | Big_B | good morning(~ugt) |
| 10:34.17 | dneary | Thanks _Monkey |
| 10:42.40 | czr | silly question, is using cairo now "a good & sane thing", or is it still dog-slow? |
| 10:44.25 | Big_B | i can't run "fakeroot apt-get install hildon-libsmm-dev hildon-fmmm-dev" command for maemo 2.2 target . Please anybody tell me what should i do to run it |
| 10:45.01 | Big_B | Anybody please!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 10:46.25 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (n=mlpug__@a88-115-165-32.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 10:48.36 | *** join/#maemo alterego (n=alterego@88-110-143-150.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 10:57.06 | mbuf | is there a unique serial number on an N800 device? |
| 10:57.26 | GeneralAntilles | The WLAN code. |
| 10:57.34 | cosmo | Big_B: type it in scratchbox and press enter? |
| 10:59.44 | *** join/#maemo dombalak (n=vedat@81.214.128.73) |
| 11:01.35 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 11:03.14 | Big_B | I did that |
| 11:03.40 | Big_B | but i got this mess" fakeroot apt-get install hildon-libsmm-dev hildon-fmmm-dev |
| 11:03.40 | Big_B | Reading Package Lists... Done |
| 11:03.40 | Big_B | Building Dependency Tree... Done |
| 11:03.40 | Big_B | E: Couldn't find package hildon-libsmm-dev |
| 11:03.40 | Big_B | " |
| 11:11.37 | *** join/#maemo b0unc3 (n=b0unc3@host-84-220-50-161.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 11:16.28 | *** join/#maemo X-Fade (n=xfade@51.128-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 11:25.46 | *** join/#maemo celesteh (n=celesteh@82-46-164-232.cable.ubr01.harb.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 11:26.43 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (n=mlpug__@a88-115-165-32.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 11:28.07 | *** join/#maemo mbuf (n=mbuf@202.63.103.2) |
| 11:28.41 | lardman | kulve: ssvb sent me an mp3 dsp task he found, might be of interest to you, and I could do with some help debugging it |
| 11:28.54 | lardman | kulve: meeting now, will give you an url when I get back ~30min |
| 11:34.54 | *** join/#maemo henno (i=henno@gateway/tor/x-4b7670b9bd0b7afe) |
| 11:37.18 | *** join/#maemo booiiing (i=[booiiin@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0x32459B0C) |
| 11:38.00 | *** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@office.pov.lt) |
| 11:48.34 | *** join/#maemo ruda (n=ruda@poasxf1-vip.terra.com.br) |
| 11:49.17 | *** join/#maemo matt_c_ (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 11:49.34 | *** join/#maemo mlpug (n=mlpug__@a88-115-165-32.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 11:50.42 | *** join/#maemo matt_c_ (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 11:52.52 | *** join/#maemo tank1770 (i=tank17@gateway/tor/x-b5c20e9942cd70ee) |
| 12:02.31 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:03.42 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:04.29 | *** join/#maemo Sho_ (i=ehs1@kde/hein) |
| 12:04.54 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:06.19 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.nokia.com/A4136017?category=n810 |
| 12:06.38 | lardman | kulve: cool :) |
| 12:06.44 | lardman | oops wrong person |
| 12:06.48 | lardman | just a general cool :) |
| 12:07.34 | lardman | GeneralAntilles: Good find |
| 12:07.56 | lardman | kulve: mp3 code here: http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/nokia770/dsp/mp3/ |
| 12:08.20 | lardman | kulve: I've made some changes so it compiles, correctly, will add them to the dir when I head home for lunch in a few |
| 12:09.08 | keesj | it's for real |
| 12:09.41 | GeneralAntilles | nachin007 on itt spotted it |
| 12:09.48 | GeneralAntilles | erm, sachin |
| 12:09.59 | GeneralAntilles | Figured it might interest this group. ;) |
| 12:10.07 | GeneralAntilles | Not sure why they put the d-pad on the slider, though. |
| 12:10.50 | TPC | thats just my luck... |
| 12:10.51 | GeneralAntilles | If it's not a real spec-bump over the N800 I'm going to wait. |
| 12:10.55 | lardman | a slider - rejoice! |
| 12:11.04 | TPC | only weeks after I get a N800 the N810 is announced |
| 12:11.09 | TPC | :( |
| 12:11.19 | GeneralAntilles | What did you pay for the N800? |
| 12:11.21 | czr | it's announced already? |
| 12:11.28 | GeneralAntilles | The pics are up |
| 12:11.31 | GeneralAntilles | no announcement as yet |
| 12:11.47 | TPC | well, its going to be announced |
| 12:11.50 | GeneralAntilles | http://tabletblog.com/ |
| 12:11.54 | GeneralAntilles | That's the place to watch. |
| 12:12.57 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:13.03 | GeneralAntilles | Here's to hoping for a 3000-series OMAP and OpenGL drivers, though! |
| 12:13.16 | czr | ah, I'm just waiting for the official stuff. |
| 12:13.32 | czr | and a picture better than the fcc stuff :-) |
| 12:13.54 | czr | tabletblog = official? |
| 12:13.59 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@189.12.70.184) |
| 12:14.02 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.nokia.com/A4136017?category=n810 |
| 12:14.15 | czr | ah, sry, missed that :-) |
| 12:14.40 | GeneralAntilles | Fullsize USB |
| 12:15.17 | GeneralAntilles | Looks like a 3-position stand, too. |
| 12:15.32 | lardman | GeneralAntilles: I think it'll still be a 24xx series, with higher clock speed. Hopefully the PowerVR mbx will be working though... |
| 12:15.51 | GeneralAntilles | I'm probably not buying if it's 24xx |
| 12:16.00 | GeneralAntilles | How high can they push it, really? |
| 12:16.20 | GeneralAntilles | I want my ~600Mhz CPU. ;) |
| 12:16.49 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:16.55 | czr | GeneralAntilles, I have couple of 550 Celerons spare. |
| 12:17.06 | czr | the question is, how much do you want your 600MHz! :-) |
| 12:17.09 | GeneralAntilles | Will they run on that battery for 3+ hours? :P |
| 12:17.15 | czr | of course |
| 12:17.18 | czr | given large enough battery |
| 12:18.03 | GeneralAntilles | By "that", I mean BP-5L. |
| 12:18.26 | GeneralAntilles | So, anybody more informed about the USB spec than myself wanna confirm if A-port means host-mode? |
| 12:18.41 | czr | A-port I think is the connector type |
| 12:18.47 | czr | so basically just a full size connector. |
| 12:18.47 | GeneralAntilles | Actually, no. |
| 12:18.51 | czr | oh |
| 12:19.00 | GeneralAntilles | That's not a full-size connector on there. |
| 12:19.09 | GeneralAntilles | Scales are a bit off. :D |
| 12:19.22 | czr | looks like it, at least on http://nds3.nokia.com/pressphotos/public/global/devices/n810/n810_15_low.jpg |
| 12:20.08 | GeneralAntilles | It does, but compare it to the one on the N800 |
| 12:20.16 | czr | hmm. let me get it |
| 12:20.50 | czr | you're right |
| 12:20.54 | czr | it's the same as on N800 methinks |
| 12:21.22 | czr | meh. difficult to say from that angle. |
| 12:21.30 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah |
| 12:21.34 | GeneralAntilles | It's deceiving |
| 12:21.48 | *** join/#maemo b0unc3 (n=b0unc3@host-84-220-51-158.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 12:23.23 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:23.34 | czr | hmm. a question relating to sw packaging in maemo. where should I install my files in bora? |
| 12:23.44 | czr | talking about regular application binaries, data files, etc |
| 12:23.59 | czr | in 770 it was under /var/install-blah, but I guess that's wrong nowadays, so any hints/ideas? |
| 12:25.00 | cosmo | czr: have you read maemo packaging howtos? |
| 12:25.09 | czr | cosmo, yes |
| 12:25.19 | czr | they don't mention anything about file paths |
| 12:25.21 | lardman | same as standard Linux |
| 12:25.26 | lardman | i.e. /usr/bin |
| 12:25.30 | czr | lardman, /usr/bin etc? |
| 12:25.31 | czr | great. |
| 12:25.49 | cosmo | 469€ price for 810 in finland (was in verkkokauppa.com) |
| 12:25.54 | czr | in a purely platonic manner of course |
| 12:25.55 | lardman | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:25.59 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.29.147.70) |
| 12:26.03 | cosmo | but where is the stylus? |
| 12:26.04 | _Monkey | it has been said that the stylus is madness |
| 12:26.04 | lardman | so use /usr/bin etc |
| 12:26.20 | czr | lardman, /usr/local/ is for modifications done by the local administration which fall outside package management (in FHS) |
| 12:26.34 | czr | lardman, so in this case /usr/bin would be more correct imho (when speaking about packaged software) |
| 12:27.19 | lardman | czr: is it? I thought it was for packages added ontop of the standard ones |
| 12:27.36 | czr | lardman, well, not sure whether maemo is FHS compliant or not |
| 12:27.43 | *** join/#maemo harobed (n=stephane@arl57-1-82-231-110-171.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:27.46 | lardman | czr: or do you mean stuff compiled and installed is added there? |
| 12:27.53 | czr | lardman, latter |
| 12:27.55 | lardman | s/is/should be |
| 12:28.06 | czr | anyhow, outside package management |
| 12:28.20 | czr | so manually building from source and make install- kind of stuff. |
| 12:30.06 | pupnikU4 | i hope that dpad has gliding motion not clicking presses |
| 12:30.57 | *** join/#maemo Gray9Mar (i=surf@gateway/tor/x-cc9eec1e25137ec3) |
| 12:31.17 | *** join/#maemo kenne (n=kenneth@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:31.50 | pupnikU4 | it should be possible to hold device with first and second fingers while using dpad and keys with thumb |
| 12:32.26 | solmumaha | i hope they stop releasing this often |
| 12:33.06 | *** join/#maemo celesteh (n=celesteh@147.188.254.201) |
| 12:34.58 | GeneralAntilles | How are frequent releases bad? |
| 12:34.59 | pupnikU4 | we've been saying that similar device with different form factors would help sales |
| 12:35.11 | GeneralAntilles | The N800 isn't going to suddenly become useless. |
| 12:35.16 | *** join/#maemo rev (n=rev|x@71-36-213-180.dlth.qwest.net) |
| 12:35.18 | GeneralAntilles | Nokia isn't going to flip a switch and turn it off. |
| 12:35.32 | rev | the n810 sure looks tasty! |
| 12:35.35 | GeneralAntilles | App development has continued just fine for the 770, even with the N800 on the market. |
| 12:35.54 | GeneralAntilles | They've already stated that the N800 is good for at least two more OS updates. |
| 12:36.20 | pupnikU4 | so now ppl have the choice between an 800 w/o kbd and an 810 with kbd. good news! |
| 12:36.33 | GeneralAntilles | Hopefully we get the specs soon. |
| 12:36.36 | rev | GeneralAntilles: has the api changed enough that that would matter? i always saw the 770 2005/OS2006/N800 binary thing as being a matter of abi or something |
| 12:37.02 | solmumaha | GeneralAntilles: they are bad, money wise ;) |
| 12:37.06 | rev | which is to say, in the few external apps i've moved up for myself, i never had to do anything more than recompile, it seems, and notthing with my own app |
| 12:37.38 | rev | ahh ok |
| 12:37.40 | rev | :) |
| 12:37.49 | GeneralAntilles | I just like to talk out my ass a lot. ;) |
| 12:37.58 | rev | don't we all? |
| 12:37.59 | sciboy | Nooblette, gosh that's cute. |
| 12:38.10 | rev | heh |
| 12:38.19 | pupnikU4 | rev you know that 2005-2006 switched from arm to armel, 2006 and 2007 are binary compatible tho |
| 12:39.48 | sciboy | Does any of the browsers, (opera, microb, minimo) have the option to call a url from the command-line and possibly jump directly to fullscreen mode? |
| 12:40.32 | rev | pupnikU4: but are there any other substantial differences? dev-wise? other than not using the camera, say. |
| 12:40.44 | rev | sciboy: i think there's a way to do it via dbus, but i can't recall |
| 12:40.57 | rev | sciboy: not sure about the full-screen part, though |
| 12:41.53 | sciboy | rev, Well thing is I'm making a game for the n800 using javascript etc. all the toolbar options etc. are completely unnecessary and want to design for that extra screen real estate. |
| 12:42.27 | rev | i need to upgrade/flash my N800. i tried installing microb a while back, hosed the browser, and for the last 6 weeks or so haven't been using it nearly as much, because of the non-functioning web browser. uff. |
| 12:42.32 | pupnikU4 | yes some things have been changed between 2006 and 2007 but for the most part, 2006 apps seem to run on 2007 |
| 12:42.44 | sciboy | I still have to wait for my n800 to arrive, or even news of when it may arrive. =/ |
| 12:43.07 | rev | sciboy: yeah, fair enough. have you tried making a popup to ditch most of that stuff? |
| 12:43.40 | rev | sciboy: or, you could just write a shell containing the HTML widget from opera, microb, etc, that'd probably be easier |
| 12:43.40 | sciboy | rev, I recall some javascript to push for fullscreen in IE, not sure about Mozilla or Opera. |
| 12:43.55 | TPC | sciboy, can't you just make a simple gecko frontend that behaves like you want it? |
| 12:43.59 | rev | sciboy: i don't think there'll be a javascript means to push opera fullscreen, but possibly |
| 12:44.03 | rev | yeah, do what TPC sez |
| 12:44.46 | sciboy | TPC, I wouldn't have the slightest idea. |
| 12:45.49 | rev | the answer is yes |
| 12:45.52 | rev | and it's what you'd want to do |
| 12:45.57 | rev | :D |
| 12:45.59 | *** join/#maemo MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:46.38 | sciboy | But how is my question? I'm an animator not a developer, (main reason why I've opting for javascript instead of pygame etc. more graphical) |
| 12:46.47 | *** join/#maemo blkhawk[work] (n=blkhawk@IP-213157024141.static.heagmedianet.de) |
| 12:46.51 | blkhawk[work] | lo |
| 12:47.03 | TPC | sciboy, maybe you should recruit a developer for your project then |
| 12:47.06 | rev | how is your question? i'm not sure if they're an answer |
| 12:47.36 | *** join/#maemo cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:47.37 | rev | sciboy: i think that, time total spent, you could make something happen with a simpler browser shell faster than trying to go down the path you are |
| 12:48.00 | rev | wow, that was poorly woorded, eh? |
| 12:48.22 | rev | sciboy: that is, doing it the way TPC and I are talking about could be done even by someone without much coding experience, with a few pointers from folks like us in the channel, or perhaps an actual dev helper |
| 12:48.34 | sciboy | You think that was bad, I spent a minute puzzling over "But how is my question" speak like yoda you must. |
| 12:48.35 | blkhawk[work] | is that a USB post i spy on the side of the N810? |
| 12:48.36 | rev | especially considering that such a beast would probably be useful to other folks developing similar apps |
| 12:48.47 | rev | sciboy: haha :D |
| 12:49.01 | rev | blkhawk[work]: i hope so! |
| 12:49.18 | rev | are there more photos of the 810 anywhere? i've only seen one front-wise photo at engadget |
| 12:49.30 | GeneralAntilles | I think that's all of them for the moment. |
| 12:49.40 | *** join/#maemo skibur (n=skibur@12.197.204.137) |
| 12:49.58 | rev | er, nevermind, they have a bunch of photos up now |
| 12:50.03 | rev | http://www.engadget.com/2007/10/17/nokias-n810-makes-first-appearance-drops-jaws/ |
| 12:50.09 | blkhawk[work] | :D |
| 12:50.16 | rev | or less annoying http://www.internettablettalk.com/2007/10/17/the-nokia-n810-internet-tablet/ |
| 12:50.33 | blkhawk[work] | well it probably will only power a usb flash stick but its cool nonntheless |
| 12:50.54 | sciboy | rev, I guess so, first though I need to know what resolution I'll be working with, all the content has to be actual-size in order to help performance, so what part of 800x480 is actually usable by the application? |
| 12:50.55 | GeneralAntilles | I don't think that's a USB A port. |
| 12:50.58 | GeneralAntilles | The scale is wrong |
| 12:51.00 | rev | i don't think that's a USB port, not one capable of histing |
| 12:51.02 | GeneralAntilles | Compare it to the port on the N800. |
| 12:51.06 | rev | i think it's the same little guy on the N800 |
| 12:51.20 | GeneralAntilles | I thought it was A when I first looked at it, too. |
| 12:51.25 | rev | sciboy: well, if you actually had it full screen it'd be a full 800x480 |
| 12:51.44 | rev | sciboy: though you might want to have some sort of toolbar, giving you the ability to quit |
| 12:51.58 | pupnikU4 | engadget must be lurking here |
| 12:52.02 | sciboy | rev, Can the user still switch between apps if one is fullscreen? |
| 12:52.20 | rev | sciboy: yeah, but not as easily (e.g. there's no bar w/ icons) |
| 12:52.48 | TPC | [14:50:32] <blkhawk[work]> well it probably will only power a usb flash stick but its cool nonntheless |
| 12:52.53 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.nokia.com/A4136017?category=n810 |
| 12:52.56 | GeneralAntilles | If anybody missed it. |
| 12:52.57 | TPC | would be cool if it could power a usb 3G modem |
| 12:53.12 | GeneralAntilles | It's not an A port |
| 12:53.20 | GeneralAntilles | So I don't think it's going to be powering much of anything. |
| 12:53.38 | sciboy | rev, If I can use the whole screen that'd be pretty desirable since that means I have more control over the experience. But users must have the freedom to pause, quit and switch applications. |
| 12:54.23 | TPC | they can just push the fullscreen button and get out of fullscreen mode |
| 12:54.26 | pupnikU4 | 'All your sdl keyboard problems magically wiped away... along with most of your personality.' |
| 12:54.29 | sciboy | rev, That reminds me, when they hit the power button, it still remains on right? Unless they go out of their way to fully power it down? |
| 12:55.06 | TPC | the power button brings up a menu |
| 12:57.20 | pupnikU4 | dumb comment of the year goes to bunzl2000 |
| 12:57.54 | sciboy | Hmmm, okay well it's good to know that full 800x480 is an option. Everything else, I need to wait on my N800 to actually arrive. =| |
| 12:59.24 | sciboy | Thanks |
| 12:59.29 | lardman | I wonder what that button on the bottom is? |
| 12:59.39 | GeneralAntilles | bunzl2000, pupnikU4? |
| 12:59.42 | lardman | i.e. in the n810_15.jpg image |
| 12:59.53 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, I was wondering that, too, lardman. |
| 13:00.03 | GeneralAntilles | Could be a release for the back panel. |
| 13:00.03 | lardman | keyboard lock perhaps |
| 13:00.09 | GeneralAntilles | Or maybe that. |
| 13:00.23 | GeneralAntilles | Actually, no, it can't be for the back panel. |
| 13:00.27 | lardman | likewise the little square above the front camera |
| 13:00.34 | lardman | microphone perhaps |
| 13:00.42 | GeneralAntilles | That's staying pretty much the same as tho N800 according to the engandget prototype photos. |
| 13:00.48 | GeneralAntilles | Looks like an LED to me. |
| 13:01.48 | lardman | all we need now are some technical specs |
| 13:01.48 | *** join/#maemo ttuttle (n=tom@pdpc/supporter/student/gentoo.contributor.ttuttle) |
| 13:01.48 | ttuttle | Hey. |
| 13:01.50 | *** join/#maemo etrunko (n=edulima@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:02.04 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, lardman. |
| 13:02.19 | lardman | :) |
| 13:02.53 | GeneralAntilles | Hopefully we get our hands on a copy of Chinook for the N800 soon. |
| 13:03.13 | *** join/#maemo ferulo (n=fer@a88-115-27-99.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:04.05 | *** join/#maemo Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:05.50 | *** join/#maemo henno (i=henno@gateway/tor/x-02e12fc3b9fdbb48) |
| 13:06.08 | GeneralAntilles | lardman: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=83050&postcount=48 |
| 13:06.10 | GeneralAntilles | Makes sense |
| 13:06.19 | GeneralAntilles | I remember it being mentioned in the Chinook changes. |
| 13:06.37 | sciboy | Chinook? |
| 13:07.01 | GeneralAntilles | OS2008 |
| 13:07.04 | GeneralAntilles | Maemo 4.0 |
| 13:07.17 | czr | lardman, it's the panic switch |
| 13:07.29 | czr | switching it will cause the device to explode within 20 seconds. |
| 13:07.33 | lardman | GeneralAntilles: cool |
| 13:07.42 | sciboy | Cool, is that due out in the near future? |
| 13:07.51 | GeneralAntilles | Dunno |
| 13:07.58 | GeneralAntilles | It'll be on the N810 whenever it comes out |
| 13:08.11 | GeneralAntilles | Don't know how soon the N800 version will be out. |
| 13:09.17 | Jaffa | http://nds3.nokia.com/pressphotos/public/global/devices/n810/n810_01_low.jpg has nice new status bar icons |
| 13:09.22 | sciboy | Why wouldn't it be out at a similar time? Considering how similar the hardware is. |
| 13:09.40 | *** join/#maemo greentux (n=lemke@ip-217-18-181-130.static.reverse.dsi.net) |
| 13:09.49 | sciboy | Wow that thing looks smexy. |
| 13:09.54 | GeneralAntilles | It probably will be, but not sure when |
| 13:10.32 | Jaffa | Keyboard looks a little cramped for desktop typing (compared with a Psion, of course) |
| 13:11.51 | GeneralAntilles | It is a mobile device. ;) |
| 13:11.51 | pupnikU4 | wait for the magical tardis keyboard tech that shrinks your hands when they get near the device |
| 13:11.57 | *** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@office.pov.lt) |
| 13:12.10 | czr | pupnikU4, does it come with untardising as well? |
| 13:12.13 | Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: so was the revo, it still had a decent-enough keyboard, and as for the Series 5... |
| 13:12.18 | keesj | the 5 finger keyboard? |
| 13:12.21 | bergie | Jaffa: yeah... I'd love a bit better keyboard but other than that it looks quite nice |
| 13:12.33 | pupnikU4 | Clamshell designs aren't 'in' now. Too bad for us techies |
| 13:12.55 | GeneralAntilles | Ha, if I wanted a laptop, I'd buy a laptop. :P |
| 13:13.24 | pupnikU4 | a psion 5mx wasn't a laptop |
| 13:13.26 | *** join/#maemo SDP (n=SteveP@london.cs.uri.edu) |
| 13:13.52 | pupnikU4 | the reason clamshells aren't built is cause they're not 'sexy' |
| 13:14.15 | Jaffa | I like the industrial design of the N810 - looks smooth. Better than the horrible grill on the N800 IMHO |
| 13:14.29 | pupnikU4 | i think it looks beautiful |
| 13:14.39 | pupnikU4 | compare to asian products... |
| 13:14.45 | GeneralAntilles | Can I use that Psion with the keyboard out of the way? |
| 13:15.00 | GeneralAntilles | The 770 looks great, the N800 looks great, and the N810 looks great. |
| 13:15.05 | GeneralAntilles | Maybe I'm just hard to please. |
| 13:15.10 | keesj | it does not look like it contains a gprs modem |
| 13:15.17 | GeneralAntilles | Good |
| 13:15.21 | GeneralAntilles | That's what a cellphone is for. |
| 13:15.23 | lardman | how can you tell? |
| 13:15.37 | lardman | or have you seen the schematics....? :) |
| 13:15.38 | keesj | no dialing in the pics |
| 13:15.49 | GeneralAntilles | Ha. |
| 13:15.58 | lardman | Well I hope it doesn't come with maps of Washington, not much use to me |
| 13:16.07 | GeneralAntilles | Nokia would have to do a lot of work to keep the network safe from those dangerous Linux hackers. |
| 13:16.08 | keesj | hah |
| 13:16.26 | GeneralAntilles | I, for one, hope the IT series products never come with cellular radios. |
| 13:16.31 | *** join/#maemo satd (n=silivay@bas17-toronto12-1096795471.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 13:16.44 | czr | I for one hope they'd invent a better name than IT |
| 13:16.50 | Jaffa | who |
| 13:16.52 | Jaffa | #6/ |
| 13:16.55 | Jaffa | bah |
| 13:16.57 | czr | whoever decides the names :-) |
| 13:17.10 | GeneralAntilles | Weberator |
| 13:17.12 | GeneralAntilles | that's my pick. |
| 13:17.30 | pupnikU4 | haha |
| 13:17.34 | pcfe | if you look at the likes of openmoko you will learn that devices that do come with a phone part are just a black box on usb you can not hack |
| 13:17.52 | pcfe | you just tell the black box you want to dial and it feeds you back audio |
| 13:18.20 | *** join/#maemo luck^ (n=Luciano@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:18.29 | *** join/#maemo fsmw (n=Fernando@200.72.33.75) |
| 13:18.38 | pcfe | not that I think the ITs should have a phone bit, but they could very well have one and still be cool with all the regulatory bodies |
| 13:19.45 | pupnikU4 | the faceplate is a nice texture/color too - gives an iconic look |
| 13:20.51 | Jaffa | Yeah - anything better than the sieve-like chrome of the N800. |
| 13:21.14 | *** join/#maemo dcarter (n=user@210.193.63.44) |
| 13:21.25 | *** join/#maemo ruda (n=ruda@poasxf1-vip.terra.com.br) |
| 13:22.00 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@crlspr-69.65.71.237.myacc.net) |
| 13:22.11 | *** part/#maemo satd (n=silivay@bas17-toronto12-1096795471.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 13:23.34 | *** join/#maemo satd (n=silivay@bas17-toronto12-1096795471.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 13:24.12 | Jaffa | If it were smaller and lighter than the N800, and there was signs of movement towards a fantastically usable UI and powerful built-in apps, I'd seriously consider it. |
| 13:24.59 | lardman | They keyboard is enough for me |
| 13:24.59 | Jaffa | Save gadget bag room by losing the BT keyboard :) |
| 13:25.09 | GeneralAntilles | Specs, specs, specs. |
| 13:25.25 | Jaffa | lardman: it would be for me, if I did more data input. I dunno if I don't do much data input because of the lack of the keyboard, or the lack of the software. |
| 13:26.26 | lardman | Jaffa: I'd be more tempted to try Python on the go with a keyboard |
| 13:26.49 | lardman | Jaffa: Would make it more useful for spreadsheets too |
| 13:27.42 | Jaffa | agreed |
| 13:27.51 | ttuttle | The N800 is ugly. |
| 13:27.57 | GeneralAntilles | ^ lies. |
| 13:28.05 | Jaffa | ITT still working for everyone? Or has it been /.ed? |
| 13:28.14 | *** join/#maemo Tak|770 (n=user@user-12hcosf.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 13:28.20 | disq | no jogdial. bastards. |
| 13:28.21 | GeneralAntilles | It's getting pounded. |
| 13:28.28 | disq | yep |
| 13:28.30 | lardman | how do I work out the framebuffer size programmatically? |
| 13:28.38 | GeneralAntilles | engadget, slashdot and digg. |
| 13:29.10 | *** join/#maemo ttuttle (n=tom@TTUTTLE-LAPTOP.WV.CC.cmu.edu) |
| 13:29.25 | ttuttle | The N800 is ugly. (Sorry if this is a dupe, I was lagged.) |
| 13:29.47 | *** part/#maemo dcarter (n=user@210.193.63.44) |
| 13:30.25 | GeneralAntilles | ^ repeated lies. :P |
| 13:30.38 | GeneralAntilles | also: *YOU think the N800 is ugly. :P |
| 13:30.46 | GeneralAntilles | I, personally, think it looks quite nice. |
| 13:31.07 | keesj | lardman: for a standard framebuffer there are ioctl call |
| 13:32.13 | lardman | keesj: I found some code, thanks |
| 13:33.09 | Jaffa | Ouch. ITT is 404ing now. |
| 13:33.45 | disq | me want developer device program. i doubt they'll do it again for the n810 tho since n800 will also run chinook |
| 13:34.36 | GeneralAntilles | Man, itt went down fast. |
| 13:36.00 | Tak|770 | how do I see a process's memory usage on the device? |
| 13:36.52 | Jaffa | disq: agreed :) |
| 13:37.14 | disq | ossostatusbarcpu or you could run top and hit shift-m (for a "M") to sort by memory usage |
| 13:37.14 | *** join/#maemo renatofilho (n=renato@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:37.43 | HGFB | According to the Jaiku blog it's getting hammered by big tech sites http://jaiku.com/channel/itT |
| 13:37.46 | Tak|770 | aha, /shift/ m! |
| 13:39.12 | Tak|770 | heh, osso-xterm doesn't even register |
| 13:40.10 | Jaffa | Hmm, never seen Jaiku before. It seems to be an IRC/Facebook status/Twitter/shoutbox/chatroom thing. |
| 13:40.18 | *** join/#maemo Mekin (n=nils@blfd-4db54868.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 13:40.58 | *** join/#maemo Gray9Mar (i=surf@gateway/tor/x-158d3fa68bb097d1) |
| 13:41.57 | *** join/#maemo Tak|770 (n=levi@user-12hcosf.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 13:42.33 | lardman | hmm, looking at the dsp framebuffer demo code, neither the dsp nor the arm seem to signal anyone to actually write the data to the screen |
| 13:42.50 | lardman | I'd have expected some sort of ioctl |
| 13:44.48 | Tak|770 | so xchat uses about 8m, and irssi uses about 4m, not counting the mem for osso-xterm, which I couldn't get |
| 13:45.00 | keesj | no mem map memset stuff? |
| 13:46.13 | lardman | on the arm side an fbinfo struct is create and passed to the dsp side |
| 13:46.29 | lardman | but it's just a struct, no attempts to do anything with it |
| 13:46.39 | lardman | unless this all happens in the background on the dsp |
| 13:46.56 | lardman | no idea how it's supposed to be triggered though |
| 13:47.05 | *** join/#maemo Herr_Rob (i=me@ip70-171-115-241.no.no.cox.net) |
| 13:51.06 | *** join/#maemo ch4os_ (n=ch4os@unaffiliated/ch4os/x-059673) |
| 13:53.50 | lardman | http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/nokia770/dsp/framebuffer_test/existing/ take a look at tell me if I'm missing something obvious |
| 13:54.36 | czr | anyone using the vmware images for development? |
| 13:57.22 | *** join/#maemo fr01 (n=jex_o_je@212.30.2.18) |
| 14:01.09 | czr | Tak|770, what are you using to measure memory usage? |
| 14:01.45 | Tak|770 | just top |
| 14:01.52 | pupnikU4 | lardman: what is native framebuffer format? rgb565? |
| 14:01.52 | czr | which field? |
| 14:02.30 | Tak|770 | looking at the mem field and the res field |
| 14:02.35 | czr | Tak|770, http://koltsoff.com/pub/ures , just FYI. measuring memory usage is not very simple always |
| 14:03.16 | czr | and the kernel on the device doesn't have smaps AFAIK so that's as good as it's going to get. also xrestop should be used (not 100% sure about the tool name now though) |
| 14:03.23 | lardman | pupnikU4: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/libvo/vo_nokia770.c?root=mplayer&view=markup |
| 14:03.52 | pupnikU4 | ty |
| 14:04.05 | pupnikU4 | Nokia 770 LCD controller [1] natively supports RGB565 and two packed YUV formats |
| 14:04.33 | pupnikU4 | so the packed yuv format means less bandwidth needed for screen updates? (assuming the stuff to be drawn is in that fmt)? |
| 14:05.02 | lardman | I suppose so, if you read on a little that's also the general codec output format |
| 14:05.04 | pupnikU4 | i guess the main use is for video |
| 14:05.26 | pupnikU4 | so you don't need to do yuv-rgb |
| 14:05.42 | pupnikU4 | hmm |
| 14:05.48 | lardman | yeah, though the format is not quite the same - needs conversion |
| 14:06.41 | Tak|770 | czr: 1) yes, I'm aware of this; I just wanted a quick measure 2) the device doesn't have very sophisticated memory metric tools on board |
| 14:06.57 | czr | Tak|770, indeed. good :-) |
| 14:08.29 | *** join/#maemo philipl (i=1000@c-76-21-109-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 14:08.47 | *** join/#maemo VimS (n=vims@dslb-084-061-085-066.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 14:10.10 | *** join/#maemo X-Fade_ (n=xfade@51.128-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 14:10.10 | *** join/#maemo penguinbait (n=sage-@207.148.201.82) |
| 14:10.37 | penguinbait | http://www.internettablettalk.com/ just pooped |
| 14:10.48 | penguinbait | didnt last long |
| 14:11.12 | GeneralAntilles | It's been in and out since 9:30 |
| 14:11.13 | disq | yep |
| 14:11.26 | GeneralAntilles | (EDT) |
| 14:11.28 | penguinbait | I have been good until just now |
| 14:11.45 | penguinbait | oh, yup its back |
| 14:11.47 | penguinbait | hehe |
| 14:12.12 | penguinbait | is there an sale date yet |
| 14:12.23 | penguinbait | or cpu/mem specs anywhere |
| 14:12.24 | GeneralAntilles | Nope, nor specs. |
| 14:12.28 | penguinbait | doh |
| 14:13.08 | penguinbait | oh well, back to KDE. I can't wait to see how it runs on new hardware |
| 14:14.02 | pupnikU4 | looking to bump the digg story - not finding it |
| 14:14.26 | *** join/#maemo vol (n=shaun@cpe-74-76-187-153.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 14:14.49 | lardman | pupnikU4: Although that sorts out mapping the framebuffer, i still can't see where it's updated |
| 14:15.58 | pupnikU4 | do you mean the n770_x11_init()? that's just to prevent X from drawing afaik |
| 14:16.03 | *** join/#maemo blkhawk[work] (n=blkhawk@IP-213157024141.static.heagmedianet.de) |
| 14:16.04 | GeneralAntilles | pupnikU4: search for N810 |
| 14:16.16 | lardman | pupnikU4: no, in the dsp code - url earlier |
| 14:16.29 | pupnikU4 | oh |
| 14:16.37 | penguinbait | http://www.nokia.com/A4136017?category=n810# |
| 14:16.45 | penguinbait | lots of nice pics |
| 14:17.06 | penguinbait | not sure I like the camera staring at me all the time |
| 14:17.22 | penguinbait | feels like nokia is watching me |
| 14:17.36 | czr | would it help to know that nokia is watching you already? |
| 14:17.42 | penguinbait | just a little parnoid maybe |
| 14:17.46 | penguinbait | hehe |
| 14:17.48 | GeneralAntilles | Ha, Nokia is going to hax ur interwebz and post pictures of your ugly mug all over the world. :P |
| 14:17.53 | ttuttle | lol |
| 14:18.15 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:18.23 | penguinbait | I'm not that ugly |
| 14:18.25 | *** join/#maemo lopz (n=gentoo-D@unaffiliated/lopz) |
| 14:18.27 | penguinbait | hehe |
| 14:18.30 | GeneralAntilles | :P |
| 14:18.49 | lopz | hola |
| 14:19.07 | penguinbait | besides they cant see crap on that n800 camera |
| 14:19.19 | czr | penguinbait, that's why they have the other cameras |
| 14:19.46 | penguinbait | in one of the little holes pretending to be a speaker perhaps |
| 14:19.55 | penguinbait | or behind the touchscreen? |
| 14:20.09 | czr | err, in your cupboards, your TV and windows |
| 14:20.19 | *** join/#maemo _Monkey (n=_Monkey@dsl-217-155-26-150.zen.co.uk) |
| 14:20.22 | GeneralAntilles | showerhead, too. |
| 14:20.28 | czr | GeneralAntilles, sshh. |
| 14:20.29 | penguinbait | no, thats the government |
| 14:20.39 | czr | penguinbait, who says that Nokia isn't one? |
| 14:21.10 | penguinbait | Although I have personal experience with nokia repair, and that may be governmant run |
| 14:21.16 | penguinbait | it would explain alot |
| 14:21.49 | czr | I could tell more, but I'd have to.. file two requests for acquisitions, file three reports, ask my supervisors, etc.. |
| 14:22.09 | penguinbait | no prob, dont go out of your way |
| 14:22.16 | penguinbait | I am sure I am a security rick |
| 14:22.19 | penguinbait | I am sure I am a security risk |
| 14:22.35 | czr | heh. not to worry :-) |
| 14:22.41 | GeneralAntilles | Security Rick! |
| 14:22.45 | czr | as long as you're entertaining, no one will mind :-) |
| 14:23.21 | penguinbait | you know Security Rick, he worked at my lask job |
| 14:23.34 | penguinbait | might have been with a D though? |
| 14:23.39 | czr | I thought that was Security Bob |
| 14:23.42 | penguinbait | s/R/D |
| 14:24.06 | czr | the one who is married to Security Alice. |
| 14:25.28 | czr | hmm. anyone running Xephyr over ssh? |
| 14:25.48 | czr | so that the stuff in the SDK will connect to a xephyr on another host? (doesn't have to be ssh though) |
| 14:27.47 | *** join/#maemo Daniellion (n=Danielli@wst098198.terc.edu) |
| 14:28.07 | *** part/#maemo ttuttle (n=tom@TTUTTLE-LAPTOP.WV.CC.cmu.edu) |
| 14:28.43 | pupnikU4 | speakers are on the sides |
| 14:29.52 | pupnikU4 | does anyone recognize the dpad from another product? i want to know if it's a high-resistance click-type (like the 770/N800) or a low-resistance non-click dpad |
| 14:31.47 | GeneralAntilles | Anybody have a guess when the specs might be announced? |
| 14:33.03 | *** join/#maemo cwiiis (n=cwiiis@86.159.143.156) |
| 14:33.32 | disq | milhouse: really great comments on itt. about the graduate intern and all |
| 14:34.29 | pupnikU4 | Oct 23 will be some kind of announcement i think |
| 14:35.08 | |R | ok what the FUCK.... can someone explain this: i fucked up my latest OS 2007 install by doing rm -rf bin in the wrong folder.... i reflashed, then microB when installed was screwed up on tableteer's page which it wasnt before... then i reflashed again because removing microB killed the whole browser... and now i see preferences from the original INSTALLATION! |
| 14:35.34 | GeneralAntilles | I hope we don't get left with pics without specs for the next 6 days. |
| 14:35.41 | pcfe | you restored backup it would seem |
| 14:36.00 | ab | http://www.nokia.com/A4136017?category=n810 |
| 14:36.05 | pupnikU4 | i am guessing lardman's guess is right :) |
| 14:36.10 | |R | pcfe : uhm yes but that didn't do it the first flashing, but you're right, weird! |
| 14:36.20 | |R | i get very inconsistent results... maybe i should sleep ;) |
| 14:36.27 | Jaffa | disq: soon milhouse'll get a texratting for being too negative. Interesting that ragnar said it's as thick as the non-bumpy bit of the N800. That'd be very impressive. |
| 14:36.39 | pcfe | yes, if the results are inconsistent you should close all root shells, open a beer and relax |
| 14:36.46 | |R | hehe :) |
| 14:37.03 | |R | i had everything fixed and screwed up big time, argh... :/ |
| 14:37.08 | Daniellion | http://synergy2.sourceforge.net/about.html |
| 14:37.15 | Daniellion | wonder if that would work on the tablets too |
| 14:37.19 | Daniellion | :) |
| 14:37.24 | GeneralAntilles | It does |
| 14:37.30 | Daniellion | be on your desktop then use your mouse over to the 770 800 |
| 14:37.31 | GeneralAntilles | but it's a pain to get the pointer turned on and visible. |
| 14:37.34 | |R | there is a quicksynergy package |
| 14:37.36 | Daniellion | Ahh |
| 14:37.45 | Daniellion | im still haveing issues getting it to autostart iin osx |
| 14:37.52 | Daniellion | sigh they should just make a pkg |
| 14:38.08 | GeneralAntilles | Teleport is better for OSX to OSX |
| 14:38.09 | pupnikU4 | synergy? |
| 14:38.09 | _Monkey | synergy is mouse and keyboard sharing between computer and tablet: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/synergy2/ https://garage.maemo.org/projects/unique311/ and for 770 http://pupnik.de/synergy-maemo_1.3.1-1_armel.deb |
| 14:38.47 | Daniellion | very sweet |
| 14:39.04 | Veggen | who is running Monkey, btw? |
| 14:39.50 | Veggen | it's sort of annoying at times. It'd be much better if you had to ask it explicitly, not? |
| 14:39.57 | pupnikU4 | looking at n810 it appears a bit smaller than 770, and maybe 1.4 times as thick |
| 14:40.52 | zoran | keyboard should make it ticker |
| 14:40.55 | pupnikU4 | about 90% of its responses are not useful |
| 14:41.19 | Daniellion | hmmm your refering to the leaked screenshot? |
| 14:41.48 | pupnikU4 | shots |
| 14:42.01 | zoran | small keys could me worse than on the screen board |
| 14:42.46 | pupnikU4 | it appears to have the on screen keyboard also! |
| 14:43.01 | zoran | my fingers are ticker then pen pick |
| 14:43.04 | *** join/#maemo GeneralAntilles (n=GeneralA@c-69-254-213-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 14:44.38 | zoran | wimax? |
| 14:44.50 | GeneralAntilles | Lets hope not. |
| 14:45.20 | zoran | nokia has to sell; they need new device |
| 14:46.01 | Sho_ | Anyone know yet if the N810 has a faster CPU than the N800? |
| 14:46.14 | penguinbait | god I hope so |
| 14:46.35 | zoran | and a battery capable to handle that |
| 14:46.49 | TPC | I really hope it doesn't |
| 14:47.04 | penguinbait | you hope its not faster |
| 14:47.06 | penguinbait | huh |
| 14:47.07 | TPC | if it doesn't then I can be happy with my N800 and a bluetooth keyboard |
| 14:47.11 | zoran | me too |
| 14:47.12 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181223139.pp.htv.fi) |
| 14:47.19 | penguinbait | you can be happy regardless |
| 14:47.23 | penguinbait | thtas silly |
| 14:47.23 | TPC | its better for my wallet that way |
| 14:47.29 | TPC | because otherwise I'll have to get it :P |
| 14:47.33 | disq | i don't think they upgraded the cpu |
| 14:47.37 | ch4os_ | what types of audio streams i can listen on standard maemo audio player? |
| 14:47.52 | penguinbait | you can always skip a tablet, a new one will be out in a year ;) |
| 14:47.58 | Sho_ | Well, actually I hope it doesn't have a faster CPU too ... I have an N800, and while I can do without the keyboard, I'd be jealous of a faster CPU =) |
| 14:48.23 | disq | chinook will run faster on the n800 anyway |
| 14:48.28 | disq | faster than bora i mean |
| 14:48.42 | GeneralAntilles | I really hope we get an OMAP 34xx in there. |
| 14:48.42 | zoran | graphical apps surely |
| 14:48.46 | TPC | disq, oh? |
| 14:48.49 | penguinbait | I want KDE to run faster, who cares about chinook |
| 14:48.54 | disq | they're constantly optimizing the code |
| 14:48.59 | pcfe | disq: aha? any more details on that? |
| 14:49.18 | zoran | kde is bloated |
| 14:49.28 | penguinbait | so I am, but I work well |
| 14:49.35 | zoran | :) |
| 14:49.35 | TPC | kde isn't that bad |
| 14:49.38 | disq | no details. if you try/run sardine, you see the difference. that's all |
| 14:49.41 | TPC | if you don't install every little tool there is |
| 14:49.52 | penguinbait | I love fish in KDE |
| 14:49.55 | TPC | and disable graphical effects and things like that |
| 14:49.58 | penguinbait | konqueor is awesome |
| 14:50.03 | TPC | it can run at a reasonable speed on a slow machine |
| 14:50.16 | TPC | my sister used it as her desktop environment on a P233 this spring |
| 14:50.20 | TPC | ran nicely |
| 14:50.23 | zoran | just wondow manager works wven faster |
| 14:50.28 | zoran | *window |
| 14:50.32 | TPC | of course 1.5 years ago kde was horrible, had so many memory leaks |
| 14:50.39 | TPC | but they have fixed those now, went trought all of it with valgrind |
| 14:51.12 | penguinbait | I can print from the browser, I can print pdf, picture, docs |
| 14:51.20 | penguinbait | I have a real computer |
| 14:51.25 | zoran | this new gadget is not targeting fols on this list, I think |
| 14:51.37 | TPC | penguinbait, print to pdf isn't really among kde's high points |
| 14:51.40 | penguinbait | its faster that my toshiba libretto 166mmx |
| 14:51.52 | TPC | the resulting file looks uglier and is larger file size than it is by creating the pdf with other methods |
| 14:51.54 | penguinbait | print pdf to printer |
| 14:52.05 | penguinbait | printing period |
| 14:52.18 | pupnikU4 | heh |
| 14:52.28 | TPC | I mean even dumping a screenshot of the document to a tiff file and using tiff2pdf produces better result than kdes print to pdf |
| 14:52.34 | pupnikU4 | printing = can o' worms, but it'd be nice |
| 14:53.06 | penguinbait | it already is nice |
| 14:53.27 | pupnikU4 | btw how is printing on the iphone? |
| 14:58.09 | *** join/#maemo lmoura (n=lmoura@200.184.118.132) |
| 15:00.54 | pcfe | both my PalmOS device and my S60r3 phone can print. Apart form 2 or 3 printouts on each device to see it works and show someone it works, I have never needed this |
| 15:01.25 | pcfe | then again I have a deep aversion against putting stuff on dead trees. |
| 15:01.41 | zoran | used camera on n800? |
| 15:01.41 | pcfe | searching on dead trees is just too much of a pita |
| 15:02.07 | pcfe | same, once to see it works when I got it and twicce when testing video calling with another N800 user |
| 15:03.16 | zoran | I found one post that was excited about gps on n810 |
| 15:04.41 | Veggen | pcfe: If I'm gonna do a lot of reading, I prefer dead trees. |
| 15:05.26 | *** join/#maemo celesteh (n=celesteh@82-46-164-232.cable.ubr01.harb.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 15:05.32 | *** join/#maemo Gray9Mar_ (i=surf@gateway/tor/x-6e338c96f87a9329) |
| 15:06.13 | pcfe | zoran: Oh GPS I use a lot, just an external one ATM |
| 15:06.43 | pcfe | if N810 indeed has GPS, the big question will be what chipset they used, crappy one like in N95 or decent onle like Sirf III or better |
| 15:07.16 | *** join/#maemo mgedmin (n=mg@office.pov.lt) |
| 15:08.05 | pcfe | Veggen: yes, I understand some people want to have dead trees. Fair enough. I used to print for the convenience of carriying the reading material to places my computer would not go, but with N800 and a 12" notebook I've stopped doing that |
| 15:08.05 | zoran | maybe people like thing more modular, not all in one? |
| 15:08.53 | pcfe | zoran: look at N95, seems most non-geek users want as many features as possible into one device. That thing sells like hot cupcakes |
| 15:09.24 | pcfe | and Nokia will quite obviously giove the market what it wants, they need to make revenue |
| 15:11.21 | TPC | pcfe, or better? whats better than Sirf III? |
| 15:12.24 | GeneralAntilles | The MTK chipset in the i-blues |
| 15:13.53 | *** join/#maemo czr (n=czr@iohazard.net) |
| 15:14.59 | TPC | interesting |
| 15:15.16 | pupnikafk | yet another way 770/ n800 saves the environment |
| 15:16.08 | lardman | do you think those photos were released by accident? |
| 15:16.36 | lardman | Or are Nokia just trying to build us into a frenzy by not producing a press release with technical details, etc.? |
| 15:17.09 | pcfe | TPC: not sure, last time I looked deeply into GPS chipsets was about a year ago when I got my GPSlim 236 have not looked deeply since, so the 'or better' was just in case something better came out in th elast year |
| 15:17.16 | alterego | Probably no developer program for this device .. |
| 15:17.49 | alterego | ffs, osso has broken :( |
| 15:17.53 | lardman | alterego: what makes you say that? |
| 15:17.55 | alterego | I can't seem to get my bindings working. |
| 15:18.20 | pcfe | lardman: well, is Nokia some small shop that does a product release for the first time, or a big multinational that dominates a big part of the market? ;-) |
| 15:19.31 | zoran | to me it looks that apple made them run faster |
| 15:20.04 | pupnikafk | the keyboard will make it a much better general purpose linux machine |
| 15:20.34 | zoran | if you could find the keys |
| 15:22.14 | pupnikafk | see blackberrys and zaurus for similar sized keys |
| 15:22.16 | *** join/#maemo red-zack (n=mk@p5B047BE9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:23.03 | alterego | Forgot run-standalone.sh :) |
| 15:23.05 | *** join/#maemo Ivan_Chelubeev (n=ijon@ppp85-140-135-197.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 15:24.57 | zoran | pupnikafk, I just try to find reason not to spend the money and buy |
| 15:25.41 | *** join/#maemo snowmoon (n=ew2193@opus.smog.albany.edu) |
| 15:27.43 | *** join/#maemo Ivan_Chelubee1 (n=ijon@ppp85-140-188-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 15:31.09 | snowmoon | http://internettablettalk.wordpress.com/ |
| 15:36.41 | *** join/#maemo Tak (n=Having@user-12hcosf.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 15:36.52 | Jaffa | snowmoon: heh |
| 15:37.32 | snowmoon | c'mon... where are the specs? |
| 15:37.50 | Jaffa | Release date & price, too. |
| 15:37.59 | Jaffa | Release date especially important for IT OS 2008 for our N800s |
| 15:38.35 | Veggen | I'm looking forward to IT OS 2008..(or whatever it is, I hope it comes before christmas ;) |
| 15:39.03 | zoran | just if specs are close enough |
| 15:39.59 | *** join/#maemo ruda (n=ruda@poasxf1-vip.terra.com.br) |
| 15:41.41 | lardman | if one writes to the framebuffer, are the updates propogated eventually (i.e. is there some timeout) if you don;t explicitly use the ioctl to update it>] |
| 15:41.55 | lardman | s/>]/?/ |
| 15:45.48 | *** join/#maemo ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@crlspr-69.65.71.237.myacc.net) |
| 15:55.55 | *** join/#maemo NickDe (n=fd5ffbab@ip68-14-79-70.ri.ri.cox.net) |
| 16:02.26 | nad_ | Is it possible to boot an N800 an not start X11? |
| 16:03.13 | zoran | if you have ssh |
| 16:04.26 | *** join/#maemo booiiing (i=[booiiin@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0x32459B0C) |
| 16:04.54 | *** join/#maemo Atarii (n=Atarii@82-46-182-49.cable.ubr02.perr.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 16:06.03 | zoran | nad_ interesting option would be to start x (for keyboadr) and small manager like evilwm |
| 16:06.47 | nad_ | zoran: I just want to run some tests on the framebuffer, I don't want X around... |
| 16:07.37 | zoran | ah, yes; you must to have hands on it; ssh |
| 16:08.55 | Tak | heh - will there be an OS2008HE for the 770? |
| 16:08.56 | HGFB | The specs are here |
| 16:08.57 | HGFB | http://www.nseries.com/nseries/v3/media/sections/products/tech_specs/en-R1/tech_specs_n810_en_R1.html |
| 16:09.03 | HGFB | Someone just posted them on Tabletblog |
| 16:09.22 | GeneralAntilles | Ugh |
| 16:09.25 | *** join/#maemo gleitz (i=gleitz@31-33-178.wireless.csail.mit.edu) |
| 16:09.26 | GeneralAntilles | Not much of an upgrade. |
| 16:09.28 | nad_ | zoran: sorry I don't understand what you mean by " you must to have hands on it" |
| 16:09.40 | zoran | Tak, lemme chack on my box |
| 16:09.47 | zoran | sorry, nad_ |
| 16:09.55 | Tak | moo? |
| 16:10.07 | snowmoon | that can't be right... 2gb SD support? |
| 16:10.08 | Tak | hmm, specs for the N810 aren't much better than N800 |
| 16:10.23 | snowmoon | nm |
| 16:11.05 | Tak | although hopefully they fixed some of the cockups with, e.g., video bandwidth |
| 16:11.05 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, no buy for me. |
| 16:11.09 | snowmoon | It's the 800 with GPS and thumboard |
| 16:11.12 | GeneralAntilles | I want me OMAP 34xx |
| 16:11.16 | zoran | nad_, looks like you could rename some links in /etc/rc2.d not to have x up |
| 16:11.32 | alterego | Yes |
| 16:11.34 | GeneralAntilles | Well, at least we'll get Chinook soon enough. |
| 16:11.51 | alterego | It says 2008, so I guess it wont be till after christmas. |
| 16:11.56 | GeneralAntilles | "Operating system updates available over the Internet" |
| 16:11.59 | Jiten_ | well, the only thing I like about the new one is GPS ... that was what I was left wanting when I bought my n800 a couple weeks ago. |
| 16:12.00 | zoran | nad_, after that, be sure to have ssh connection to the box |
| 16:12.10 | alterego | They've dumped Opera .. |
| 16:12.22 | Jiten_ | though, the keyboard might be useful. Depends a bit on what it's like to use. |
| 16:13.11 | Daniellion | like the specs.. and internal gps rocks |
| 16:13.19 | snowmoon | It's thinner than the 800 but longer and wider ( WTF? ) |
| 16:13.38 | nad_ | zorane: hmm, right now I ssh over wireless, but it looks like the wireless is started from within X... Do I need a serial console, or there is some other way? |
| 16:13.52 | *** join/#maemo lardman (n=simon@84.13.252.220) |
| 16:14.04 | zoran | nad_, do you have wi-fi net at home? |
| 16:14.09 | *** join/#maemo tank1770 (i=tank17@gateway/tor/x-efa666f9c653ea23) |
| 16:14.19 | alterego | nad_, you can use iwconfig et all. |
| 16:14.19 | HGFB | It'd be a shame if we couldn't get them for months |
| 16:14.41 | snowmoon | lame upgrade... I suppose that's why it's the 810 and not the 900 |
| 16:14.42 | alterego | Well, they wouldn't call it OS2008 if they were releasing it in 2007 would they :P |
| 16:15.23 | snowmoon | My only hope is that it will push down the price on the n800 further |
| 16:15.32 | nad_ | zoran: I do |
| 16:15.56 | HGFB | If we can't buy it until next year that's actually frustrating. I'd rather they'd have held back until they were ready to ship. Didn't they announce the N800 the day they went on sale? |
| 16:16.00 | Tak | alterego: I hope that means significant improvement in the gecko backends |
| 16:16.10 | alterego | As much as I'd love the new device. I think I'll just wait for the N900 or my N800 to break |
| 16:16.10 | Daniellion | see i kinda want somthing that is inbetween the 800 and a laptop |
| 16:16.20 | Daniellion | none of the umpc's ahve both camera and keyboad it seems |
| 16:16.33 | Daniellion | i cant find one that is a good combo of both for less then 1500 |
| 16:16.33 | HGFB | I notice they say the browser is Mozilla based |
| 16:16.34 | alterego | Tak, indeed. |
| 16:16.39 | HGFB | Opera dropped? |
| 16:16.40 | GeneralAntilles | h.264 is on the supported video formats list |
| 16:16.54 | Veggen | alterego: I don't think N810 is different enough for me either. As long as it's similar enough that the OS stays compatible. |
| 16:16.58 | HGFB | Is an N800 fast enough for h.264 in the default player? |
| 16:17.02 | snowmoon | engadget is reporting more ram... shipping in nov for $479 |
| 16:17.03 | HGFB | With the video bottleneck |
| 16:17.17 | lardman | did I miss something? |
| 16:17.18 | nad_ | alterego: where is iwconfig, I can't seem to find it.. |
| 16:17.26 | alterego | nad_, you have to install it. |
| 16:17.34 | alterego | wireless-tools or whatever the package is called. |
| 16:17.35 | zoran | nad_, openssh installed? |
| 16:17.56 | nad_ | zoran: yep |
| 16:17.57 | Tak | oh, yeah - is everybody else seeing the unupgradable openssh upgrade packages? |
| 16:17.58 | alterego | Yeah, it says "maximum of 2Gb internal memory" .. |
| 16:18.13 | GeneralAntilles | It'll run 16GB SDHC |
| 16:18.14 | Daniellion | now if they put kde on it from the get go |
| 16:18.15 | GeneralAntilles | Guaranteed. |
| 16:18.33 | zoran | nad_, if you could connect from desktop, you are up |
| 16:18.37 | alterego | KDE sucks donkey dicks. |
| 16:19.01 | alterego | Want KDE? Get a Zaurus .. |
| 16:19.14 | Daniellion | hell id want osx on it |
| 16:19.18 | Daniellion | ehhe |
| 16:19.21 | GeneralAntilles | http://media.shozu.com/cache/portal/media/259c82/16777246 |
| 16:19.25 | alterego | You're a sad boy. |
| 16:19.30 | GeneralAntilles | Looks like an extra button on top. |
| 16:19.31 | Daniellion | was thinkign if i coud hack a umpc with the osx86 |
| 16:19.57 | GeneralAntilles | Looks like the stylus is up above the right speaker |
| 16:19.59 | Daniellion | drivers would prolly be hell though |
| 16:20.07 | GeneralAntilles | Samsung is what you want for that. |
| 16:20.08 | nad_ | zoran: I can, but I was worried that if X is not up, the wireless will not start... I just installed wireless-tools. I'll try to see if I can make it work with iwconfig... |
| 16:20.09 | lardman | where are these hw specs coming from? |
| 16:20.12 | GeneralAntilles | Evidently it works ok. |
| 16:20.15 | Daniellion | could be a desk lock latch |
| 16:20.23 | GeneralAntilles | Nokia. |
| 16:20.23 | _Monkey | somebody said nokia was a company. It also sponsors maemo using sales of N800s. Buy one. Buy two! |
| 16:20.28 | [31d1] | hmm, iphone SDK |
| 16:20.34 | zoran | nad_, on my 770 ssh starts from separate soft link in rc2.d |
| 16:20.46 | GeneralAntilles | Look at the domain, lardman. |
| 16:21.09 | GeneralAntilles | http://media.shozu.com/cache/portal/media/259c82/16777236 |
| 16:21.09 | Daniellion | please elaborate GeneralAntilles |
| 16:21.20 | GeneralAntilles | On the Samsung? |
| 16:21.44 | alterego | [31d1], you mean Safari? |
| 16:21.52 | ||cw | n800 has 128MB ram right? |
| 16:21.54 | SDP | alterego: I noticed that too... mozilla based browser. interesting. |
| 16:21.58 | GeneralAntilles | Retail package that looks ready to go |
| 16:22.04 | GeneralAntilles | Might be released sooner than you think. |
| 16:22.14 | snowmoon | http://www.engadget.com/2007/10/17/nokia-n810-gets-official/ |
| 16:22.17 | [31d1] | http://www.apple.com/hotnews/ |
| 16:22.23 | GeneralAntilles | I'm really disappointed by the lack of a specs upgrade, though. :( |
| 16:22.25 | alterego | SDP, not very interesting to me until they start shipping libxul .. |
| 16:22.46 | disq | off topic: anybody have a solution to use mc on putty with utf8, with the line drawing characters? LANG=C is not a good idea as it disables utf8 input in mc |
| 16:23.08 | GeneralAntilles | November |
| 16:23.30 | alterego | Anyhow, I doubt they'll do a dev program for this device. |
| 16:23.36 | alterego | As it's really just an N800 with a couple of mods. |
| 16:23.55 | lardman | so there's still no official spec announcment then? |
| 16:23.56 | alterego | There's not benifit to developers, (except maybe for the GPS) |
| 16:24.10 | GeneralAntilles | Too bad. |
| 16:24.22 | alterego | In fact, it wouldn't suprise me if Nokia stop the developer program completely now. |
| 16:24.58 | *** join/#maemo pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 16:25.02 | lardman | GeneralAntilles: Thanks, not sure where I was supposed to see that though... |
| 16:25.04 | disq | http://media.shozu.com/cache/portal/media/259c82/16777248 |
| 16:25.14 | GeneralAntilles | Scroll up. ;) |
| 16:25.18 | disq | ah. yeah |
| 16:25.23 | lardman | I've just joined, at home |
| 16:25.28 | zoran | maps included |
| 16:25.43 | *** part/#maemo snowmoon (n=ew2193@opus.smog.albany.edu) |
| 16:25.50 | *** join/#maemo snowmoon (n=ew2193@opus.smog.albany.edu) |
| 16:25.52 | disq | one SD slot? |
| 16:25.53 | GeneralAntilles | It was sent after you joined. :P |
| 16:26.03 | disq | though makes sense with the bumped up internal mem |
| 16:26.17 | alterego | The themes are getting worse .. |
| 16:26.19 | zoran | 2 slots |
| 16:26.25 | GeneralAntilles | Who cares about the themes? |
| 16:26.30 | disq | 2gig could mean they're not using jffs2 anymore |
| 16:26.31 | GeneralAntilles | The 3rd-party stuff is so much better, anyway. |
| 16:26.35 | GeneralAntilles | Hooray for Plankton! |
| 16:26.36 | disq | as jffs2 is slow |
| 16:26.39 | zoran | inside card |
| 16:26.47 | zoran | outside could be 8 Gb |
| 16:27.00 | nad_ | zoran: ssh needs the network layer to be up, and I don't know if it is started without X11 (it seemed to me that it is started by the wireless applet). I am still investigating how can I start it with the iw* tools |
| 16:27.01 | zoran | probably vfat |
| 16:27.02 | alterego | 3rd party themes? |
| 16:27.11 | shapr | Yay N810! |
| 16:27.13 | alterego | I've seen a couple and they were boring. |
| 16:27.19 | zoran | nad_, don't rush! |
| 16:27.22 | GeneralAntilles | Seen Plankton? |
| 16:27.23 | _Monkey | I haven't seen 'Plankton', GeneralAntilles |
| 16:27.27 | GeneralAntilles | >_> |
| 16:27.30 | GeneralAntilles | He needs a trigger |
| 16:27.30 | disq | "3.5 mm stereo headphone plug (Nokia AV Connector)" "AV"? hmmmm |
| 16:27.30 | zoran | just send a mail to maemo-users |
| 16:27.34 | disq | "V"! :) |
| 16:27.43 | GeneralAntilles | Boo! No specs bump, shapr. ;) |
| 16:27.54 | shapr | Wah? |
| 16:28.06 | Jaffa | disq: I noticed that too |
| 16:28.11 | shapr | It's a bit faster. |
| 16:28.12 | zoran | nad_, do you ahve a min for me to fire up the device? |
| 16:28.23 | GeneralAntilles | 80MHz |
| 16:28.29 | shapr | What's up with the "up to 2GB internal memory" ? |
| 16:28.29 | alterego | disq, that is on the N800 too. |
| 16:28.34 | nad_ | zoran: sure, thanks! |
| 16:28.36 | mgedmin | what, what? n810 is announced already and I didn't notice??? |
| 16:28.41 | alterego | Regardless, the N810 looks really nasty .. |
| 16:28.47 | GeneralAntilles | Bullshit |
| 16:28.49 | GeneralAntilles | It looks great. |
| 16:28.56 | shapr | Looks like the webcam only faces forward. |
| 16:29.02 | shapr | I'll get it for the internal GPS. |
| 16:29.04 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.nseries.com/nseries/v3/media/sections/products/tech_specs/en-R1/tech_specs_n810_en_R1.html |
| 16:29.07 | snowmoon | compared to the bulge... the 810 is slicker |
| 16:29.08 | alterego | GeneralAntilles, we've already discovered your bad taste in aesthetics :P |
| 16:29.19 | GeneralAntilles | By what, Plankton? |
| 16:29.20 | disq | 80mhz bump, plus the filesystem could be ext2/ext3/reiserfs now, using jffs2 is a waste of cpu when you have the space |
| 16:29.23 | GeneralAntilles | You're kidding, right? |
| 16:29.23 | shapr | ooh, ambient light sensor.. is that just the camera? |
| 16:29.25 | alterego | The speakers are on the back. |
| 16:29.28 | GeneralAntilles | Fan of Vista then, right? |
| 16:29.39 | snowmoon | 70mhz... 330->400 ( last I checked that's 70 ) |
| 16:29.40 | alterego | O_o |
| 16:29.56 | alterego | snowmoon, it's exactly the same chip as in the N800. |
| 16:29.58 | GeneralAntilles | Speakers are on the side. |
| 16:30.05 | shapr | Oh, it switched to a Mozilla browser? No more Opera? |
| 16:30.08 | alterego | Back side. |
| 16:30.09 | mgedmin | no N810 article on wikipedia yet |
| 16:30.14 | disq | snowmoon: 320.37 bogomips is probably 320mhz and not 330? |
| 16:30.32 | zoran | nad_, first is fb-progress.sh |
| 16:30.34 | snowmoon | disq: bongomips ~= mhz in any way shape or form |
| 16:30.40 | snowmoon | != |
| 16:30.43 | zoran | then ppp |
| 16:30.52 | zoran | then dnsmasq |
| 16:31.00 | zoran | dbus and ssh |
| 16:31.04 | *** join/#maemo Micker (n=nils@77.182.236.3) |
| 16:31.05 | disq | in intel that is. |
| 16:31.22 | zoran | lmce, x server next |
| 16:31.35 | zoran | af-services |
| 16:31.36 | shapr | disq: Does the AV connector mean the plug does microphone in as well? |
| 16:31.52 | disq | the plug always did microphone |
| 16:31.55 | shapr | oh |
| 16:32.00 | shapr | Even on the 770? |
| 16:32.05 | disq | not on the 770 |
| 16:32.12 | zoran | dsp-init, bluez,bme-proxy,osso-hss |
| 16:32.13 | shapr | Ok, I only have a 770. |
| 16:32.17 | alterego | shapr, yes. Exactly like the N800. |
| 16:32.31 | zoran | esd, osso-systemui |
| 16:32.37 | shapr | Was planning to buy an N800 next month, but I'll get an N810 instead. |
| 16:32.42 | zoran | btcond |
| 16:32.59 | zoran | ke-recv, wlancond |
| 16:33.01 | shapr | hiya mgedmin |
| 16:33.05 | GeneralAntilles | shapr, at $230 versus $480? |
| 16:33.07 | mgedmin | hi shapr |
| 16:33.16 | mgedmin | what, $480 |
| 16:33.20 | mgedmin | that's robbery! |
| 16:33.24 | shapr | GeneralAntilles: Where can you get an N800 for $230? |
| 16:33.26 | snowmoon | MSRP $479 |
| 16:33.28 | mgedmin | good think USD is down right now |
| 16:33.33 | snowmoon | shapr: buy.com |
| 16:33.33 | lardman | Interesting that the Ti website has no mention of an omap 2420 clocked at 400MHz |
| 16:33.33 | _Monkey | it has been said that buy.com is awesome because they ship free and dont charge tax a lot of places |
| 16:33.41 | shapr | In that case... N800 it is. |
| 16:33.53 | zoran | nad_, what do you think about? |
| 16:33.58 | *** join/#maemo satd (n=silivay@bas17-toronto12-1096795471.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 16:34.02 | zoran | safe enough? |
| 16:34.07 | alterego | lardman, if you looked at the docs in more detail you'd see it. |
| 16:34.14 | alterego | It's carefully hidden away. |
| 16:34.20 | mgedmin | $480 ~= $340 EUR --> more or less what I paid for my fist 770 |
| 16:34.21 | nad_ | zoran: still looking |
| 16:34.32 | alterego | I imagine this means that Chinook has got better PM. |
| 16:34.32 | GeneralAntilles | mgedmin: http://www.nokia.com/A4136017?category=n810 |
| 16:34.47 | mgedmin | thanks, general! |
| 16:35.07 | lardman | alterego: indeed, on the first page of the pdf, my mistake |
| 16:35.21 | alterego | :) |
| 16:35.43 | HGFB | I'm in the UK. I wonder when I'll be able to buy one |
| 16:35.44 | alterego | Anyhow, enough of this gibber gabber. |
| 16:38.14 | *** join/#maemo cy-_ (n=cy@is.trapped.in.themetaverse.org) |
| 16:39.30 | mgedmin | hm, the top is not visible in those pictures |
| 16:39.35 | mgedmin | what do the zoom keys look like? |
| 16:39.50 | disq | yeah maybe it's butt ugly |
| 16:39.55 | GeneralAntilles | http://internettablettalk.wordpress.com/ |
| 16:40.00 | shapr | I wonder that also. |
| 16:40.04 | *** join/#maemo k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:40.17 | snowmoon | http://media.shozu.com/cache/portal/media/259c82/16777244 wtf is that connector... it's not standard USB |
| 16:40.31 | *** join/#maemo konttori (n=konttori@a88-114-91-19.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:40.34 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.flickr.com/photos/thoughtfix/ |
| 16:40.38 | GeneralAntilles | Micro-usb |
| 16:40.38 | lardman | no a2dp listed on the supported bluetooth profile list |
| 16:40.53 | shapr | It looks like that's a button on the top left front corner. |
| 16:40.58 | *** join/#maemo Micker_2 (n=nils@blfd-4db54b03.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 16:41.02 | zoran | battery could be weaker for all those parts |
| 16:41.34 | *** join/#maemo konttori (n=konttori@a88-114-91-19.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:41.42 | shapr | lardman: Yeah, that's slightly worrisome. |
| 16:41.52 | *** join/#maemo red-zack (n=mk@p5B047BE9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:42.09 | shapr | Yeah, wtf is that usb connector? |
| 16:42.47 | GeneralAntilles | micro-usb |
| 16:43.10 | snowmoon | If it's micro, how come it looks bigger than mini-usb |
| 16:43.20 | HGFB | looks like we've lost a memory card slot too |
| 16:43.27 | shapr | It's kinda weird to have the d-pad on the slide-in keyboard. |
| 16:43.42 | GeneralAntilles | I didn't name the spec. >_> |
| 16:43.47 | snowmoon | I think the dpad loss was to make it's flootprint much smaller |
| 16:43.58 | snowmoon | http://www.flickr.com/photos/thoughtfix/1601800354/ |
| 16:44.11 | *** join/#maemo Neckar (n=nils@blfd-4db549eb.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 16:44.22 | *** join/#maemo RushPL_ (n=rush@chello089078147065.chello.pl) |
| 16:44.30 | shapr | I do like the smaller footprint. |
| 16:44.49 | GeneralAntilles | N800 is a ridiculously better buy at this point. |
| 16:44.53 | Tak | ugh - dpad on slideout is horrible |
| 16:45.14 | snowmoon | GeneralAntilles: Yep, and this new unit is going to further drive down the price on the 800 |
| 16:45.21 | lardman | shapr: don't worry it's on the todo list, so we'll get it eventually |
| 16:45.42 | GeneralAntilles | Can't wait for Chinook. |
| 16:46.01 | shapr | Good to hear. |
| 16:46.26 | Jiten_ | does someone have any idea why my python program is showing up like a regular gtk-program even though I use hildon.Window? I'm running bora SDK in x86 mode. |
| 16:46.58 | lmoura | Jiten_, running using run-standalone.sh? |
| 16:47.06 | Jiten_ | I don't think so |
| 16:47.40 | Jiten_ | doesn't using hildon.Window make it unnecessary? |
| 16:47.45 | lmoura | Try "run-standalone.sh <your-program-here>" |
| 16:47.57 | mgedmin | a micro usb plug next to a mini usb plug: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:USB_types_2.jpg |
| 16:47.57 | lmoura | Jiten_, in the device, yes |
| 16:48.03 | mgedmin | looks a bit smaller |
| 16:48.16 | mgedmin | shame about not being able to reuse the same cable |
| 16:48.17 | GeneralAntilles | Thinner is the key |
| 16:48.22 | lmoura | while in the SDK, run-standalone.sh sets some env variables to fix it |
| 16:49.04 | Daniellion | wonder if its a powerd usb |
| 16:49.24 | GeneralAntilles | Highly unlikely. |
| 16:49.47 | Jiten_ | ah, right, thank you |
| 16:49.57 | *** join/#maemo script_ (n=script@scriptkiller.de) |
| 16:50.47 | zoran | multimedia tablet |
| 16:52.38 | mgedmin | interesting: "handwriting recognition" is not listed among input methods |
| 16:53.35 | Jiten_ | maybe the binary module cost them too much :) |
| 16:53.58 | mgedmin | "Operating system updates available over the Internet" -- sounds like future OS upgrades via apt-get |
| 16:54.14 | mgedmin | I wonder if the mail client is the old brain-dead one, or if modest is finally ready |
| 16:56.05 | Jiten_ | future updates via apt-get sounds good. |
| 16:56.06 | mgedmin | what's the diff between BP-4L and BP-5L batteries? both are 1500mAh Li-polymer |
| 16:56.17 | mgedmin | different form factor? |
| 16:56.19 | disq | both 1500mah? hmm. form factor then |
| 16:58.22 | TPC | hm.. specs has been posted |
| 16:58.40 | Tak | technically, the method we have now could be called "over the Internet" |
| 17:00.27 | *** join/#maemo Sho_ (i=ehs1@kde/hein) |
| 17:00.59 | *** join/#maemo fab (n=bellet@bellet.info) |
| 17:01.52 | mgedmin | 20g heavier... |
| 17:04.43 | GeneralAntilles | Sounds like you'll have to start working out. :P |
| 17:05.04 | snowmoon | 20g heavier, but a smaller, more pocketable footprint |
| 17:05.32 | TPC | hm.. only miniSD and microSD? |
| 17:05.33 | TPC | that sucks |
| 17:05.36 | lardman | pocketprint |
| 17:06.14 | GeneralAntilles | With the extender |
| 17:06.16 | GeneralAntilles | It's an SD slot. |
| 17:07.25 | *** join/#maemo Andy80 (n=ftrewgg@host56-202-dynamic.22-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 17:07.53 | nad_ | zoran: I need to postpone this until later today, my wifi AP does not like the N800 very much, the link goes down from time to time... I have another AP, but not here and I've never had problems with that one... |
| 17:13.33 | mgedmin | buttons on top: http://media.shozu.com/cache/portal/media/259c82/16777246 |
| 17:17.03 | *** join/#maemo zwnj (n=behnam@213.207.210.231) |
| 17:18.36 | *** join/#maemo celesteh (n=celesteh@82-46-164-232.cable.ubr01.harb.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 17:22.16 | TPC | I wonder if the map application included with chinook can be used on the N800 as well with a bluetooth GPS |
| 17:26.02 | mgedmin | I wonder when chinook will be available for the N800 |
| 17:26.18 | mgedmin | probably time to install scratchbox again, given how it's not binary compatible with bora |
| 17:26.20 | TPC | it says in the announcement on maemo.org |
| 17:26.27 | TPC | the same day sales start, mid november |
| 17:27.08 | TPC | "The Nokia N810 will be in the shops on mid November. As soon as sales start, N800 users will be able to upgrade to the OS2008 as well." - http://maemo.org/news/announcements/view/1192637131.html |
| 17:27.40 | jjo | mgedmin: it kind of depends whether it's compatible or not |
| 17:27.49 | ||cw | http://www.engadget.com/2007/10/17/nokia-n810-hands-on/ |
| 17:28.01 | mgedmin | also http://jaaksi.blogspot.com/2007/10/nokia-n810-announced.html |
| 17:28.11 | jjo | depends on what version of debian devkit you have |
| 17:28.14 | wumpus | the biggest reason that n770 things don't work on the n800 is the built in floating point unit, right? |
| 17:28.22 | lardman | no |
| 17:28.29 | mgedmin | heh, I like the model number "NOO" on that picture |
| 17:28.37 | lardman | the n800 doesn't use the fp unit for much at all |
| 17:28.45 | mgedmin | ooh, translucency effects |
| 17:28.55 | wumpus | unless the n810 has another such big change, I doubt things will get really uncompatible.. at least, I hope |
| 17:30.09 | wumpus | wouldn't like my n800 to be obsolete (by nokia's standards) already |
| 17:30.29 | *** join/#maemo bstock (n=bstock@68.78.185.227) |
| 17:31.07 | mgedmin | isn't |
| 17:31.12 | mgedmin | looks like nokia learned the lesson |
| 17:31.26 | mgedmin | the n810 looks like an alternative to n800 for those who cried (very loudly) for a hardware keyboard |
| 17:31.46 | mgedmin | same software, (mostly) same hardware capabilities |
| 17:31.48 | *** join/#maemo slomo_ (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 17:32.01 | mgedmin | gps is nice, though |
| 17:32.44 | TPC | its a nice upgrade, 70mhz extra, built in gps, keyboard |
| 17:32.55 | TPC | but not worth the extra monkey if you have a 800 already |
| 17:32.58 | TPC | money* |
| 17:33.18 | [31d1] | extra monkey is always worth it |
| 17:33.27 | mgedmin | only when they give it to you |
| 17:33.33 | mgedmin | not the other way around |
| 17:33.46 | wumpus | gps sounds really nice, though it probably means faster battery drain, the keyboard I wouldn't really use anyway |
| 17:33.46 | *** join/#maemo chetan (n=chetan@mail.limespot.co.in) |
| 17:34.36 | mgedmin | I wonder if the maps app is (a) open source (b) based on maemo mapper |
| 17:34.46 | mgedmin | probably no on both counts |
| 17:35.26 | mgedmin | "optional 10GB memory card"? |
| 17:35.30 | TPC | well, nokia did buy some gps company not long ago |
| 17:35.32 | mgedmin | where can I get me one of those? |
| 17:35.37 | TPC | so its probably the app from that company |
| 17:35.42 | *** join/#maemo henno (i=henno@gateway/tor/x-e30c1d356a8f2654) |
| 17:35.45 | wumpus | 10gb? wow |
| 17:36.34 | pupnik | nice find GeneralAntilles |
| 17:36.50 | GeneralAntilles | Which? |
| 17:37.24 | mgedmin | the n810, I suppose |
| 17:37.45 | mgedmin | your link to the tech specs here was the first thing I heard about it |
| 17:37.56 | GeneralAntilles | https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=20105749&postID=1155579090765092763 |
| 17:37.58 | mgedmin | well, okay, shapr talking about it was the first thing I noticed actually |
| 17:38.09 | GeneralAntilles | anonymous user posted the specs. |
| 17:38.15 | mgedmin | having to wait till mid november is no fun :( |
| 17:38.16 | shapr | ? |
| 17:38.41 | mgedmin | otoh maybe my want will wane till then |
| 17:39.04 | GeneralAntilles | I don't desire the N810 |
| 17:39.09 | shapr | I do, I want the GPS. |
| 17:39.12 | GeneralAntilles | It's a pretty pointless upgrade for current N800 users. |
| 17:39.26 | Robot101 | GeneralAntilles: the hardware is muuuuch nicer |
| 17:39.45 | mgedmin | the muchness depends on whether you want a hardware kb |
| 17:39.49 | mgedmin | I want the smaller size and the gps |
| 17:40.00 | GeneralAntilles | shapr: http://www.amazon.com/i-Blue-737-Bluetooth-GPS-Receiver/dp/B000KH7MZ4/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-0809862-2088831?ie=UTF8&s=miscellaneous&qid=1192642792&sr=8-1 |
| 17:40.04 | bstock | i hope there's an optional hard case for it |
| 17:40.09 | GeneralAntilles | GPS is just gonna be a battery waste |
| 17:40.18 | GeneralAntilles | bluetooth GPS units are cheap |
| 17:40.19 | mgedmin | I assume you can turn it off |
| 17:40.27 | mgedmin | lugging around an external gps is not convenient |
| 17:40.34 | GeneralAntilles | and probably a lot more accurate than what's in an external one |
| 17:40.37 | shapr | Yeah, I really want fewer things to lug around. |
| 17:40.41 | GeneralAntilles | It's plenty convenient, I just leave it in the car. |
| 17:40.41 | mgedmin | (whether the convenience is worth an extra $480 is a good question) |
| 17:40.50 | shapr | I'm asking myself that question too. |
| 17:41.10 | shapr | $230 for an N800 and ~$50 for a bluetooth GPS |
| 17:41.12 | GeneralAntilles | Robot101: 70MHz, fewer SD card slots, reduction in hardware button usability? |
| 17:41.18 | shapr | or $480 for the N810 |
| 17:41.20 | mgedmin | still, what does "Up to 2GB internal memory" mean in the tech specs? |
| 17:41.21 | GeneralAntilles | Get the N800 |
| 17:41.26 | shapr | Yeah, I want to know that! |
| 17:41.34 | mgedmin | given that it also says "Supports cards up to 8GB. " |
| 17:41.37 | disq | yeah they say 256m flash, and then in storage section up to 2gig internal memory |
| 17:41.40 | shapr | Where does it mention the card slots for the N810? |
| 17:41.42 | czr | I read somewhere that it has internal memory and two slots |
| 17:41.48 | czr | the internal memory holds gps maps mostly |
| 17:42.11 | mgedmin | I assume those 256megs flash are the internal memory |
| 17:42.25 | mgedmin | maybe you can get a model with more? |
| 17:42.28 | mgedmin | like ipods? |
| 17:42.36 | lardman | Anyone notice this: We will publish tomorrow the details of the N810 maemo device program. |
| 17:42.37 | snowmoon | engadget photos seem to indicate no internal sd slot |
| 17:42.51 | lardman | from the maemo announcment |
| 17:43.04 | shapr | I like the dual SD slots in the N800, if the N810 has only one slot, I'll definitely go for the N800 |
| 17:43.39 | penguinbait | sorry I left for a while, do we have hardware specs? |
| 17:43.40 | mgedmin | I didn't like that bit with eating SD cards in the external slot on the N800 |
| 17:43.45 | TPC | penguinbait, yes |
| 17:43.46 | mgedmin | it ate me a 512mb card |
| 17:43.47 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.maemoapps.com/ |
| 17:43.53 | penguinbait | where? |
| 17:43.53 | Robot101 | GeneralAntilles: its smaller, slicker, has a real keyboard. what do you mean 70MHz? |
| 17:43.56 | snowmoon | With only one slot... how much of that will be taken up by maps on the 810? |
| 17:44.10 | mgedmin | Robot101: the N800 has a 330 mhz cpu, the N810 has a 400 mhz cpu |
| 17:44.14 | TPC | penguinbait, http://www.nseries.com/nseries/v3/media/sections/products/tech_specs/en-R1/tech_specs_n810_en_R1.html |
| 17:44.24 | penguinbait | hmmm, memory |
| 17:44.24 | Robot101 | oh, I didn't realise it was faster |
| 17:44.26 | penguinbait | oh thanks |
| 17:44.38 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that's not a $480 upgrade. |
| 17:44.51 | Robot101 | and I thought it still had two SD slots but I never checked in detail |
| 17:44.57 | snowmoon | what's the "nub" for? http://www.engadget.com/gallery/nokia-n810-hands-on/443959/ |
| 17:45.17 | GeneralAntilles | That's an LED |
| 17:45.26 | GeneralAntilles | Just like the d-pad light on the N800 |
| 17:45.32 | mgedmin | yay, fullscreen separate from zoom buttons |
| 17:46.09 | penguinbait | not real impressive huh |
| 17:46.58 | GeneralAntilles | Nope |
| 17:47.11 | mgedmin | what's the "Chr" button do? |
| 17:47.17 | GeneralAntilles | Hopefully the N900 isn't more than 6 months away. |
| 17:47.29 | GeneralAntilles | mgedmin: I'm guessing it's the same as option on Mac OS X |
| 17:48.06 | mgedmin | entering accented letters? |
| 17:48.07 | GeneralAntilles | Let's you type the extended characters. |
| 17:48.32 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.engadget.com/photos/nokia-n810-hands-on/443966/ |
| 17:48.38 | GeneralAntilles | Stylus, for all the blind out there. |
| 17:48.39 | *** join/#maemo VimSi (n=vims@dslb-084-061-015-073.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:48.46 | mgedmin | hm |
| 17:48.51 | GeneralAntilles | and, evidently, a hardware lock. |
| 17:48.57 | mgedmin | is that a full-size sd slot or a mini-sd slot? |
| 17:49.11 | GeneralAntilles | It better be fullsize. . . . |
| 17:49.36 | GeneralAntilles | Wow, check out the change to the application menu. |
| 17:49.38 | GeneralAntilles | http://www.engadget.com/photos/nokia-n810-hands-on/443984/ |
| 17:51.33 | shapr | Is there a Nokia Internet Tablet facebook group? |
| 17:51.44 | disq | there's one maemo users group and one 770 group |
| 17:52.01 | disq | the app menu changes are not new. |
| 17:52.05 | disq | they're in sardine too |
| 17:53.00 | [31d1] | i wonder if one could get neat new stuff from nokia with the serial of that engadget dealy |
| 17:53.36 | kaltsi | mgedmin also the fact that it says mini SD on the card is a bit of a giveaway :) |
| 17:54.02 | mgedmin | the tech specs were a bit ambiguous: http://www.nseries.com/nseries/v3/media/sections/products/tech_specs/en-R1/tech_specs_n810_en_R1.html#Contents |
| 17:54.26 | mgedmin | it's not clear whether the (with extender) part applies just to microSD or to both in "Support for compatible miniSD and microSD memory cards (with extender)." |
| 17:54.32 | ||cw | it will take a 2GB miniSD AND a 8GB SDHC |
| 17:54.51 | mgedmin | that would be good |
| 17:54.57 | mgedmin | but where's the second slot? |
| 17:55.14 | HGFB | I don't think there is a second slot |
| 17:55.22 | GeneralAntilles | Too bad |
| 17:55.24 | GeneralAntilles | was a nice feature |
| 17:55.48 | shapr | ||cw: huh? |
| 17:56.21 | ||cw | hm, maybe that is ambigious |
| 17:56.39 | ||cw | on first read I though it said 2GB internal and an SDHC |
| 17:56.50 | mgedmin | it does mention sdhc |
| 17:56.54 | shapr | I think it does say that, but it only mentions one slot. |
| 17:56.58 | mgedmin | "(SD cards over 2GB must be SDHC compatible.)" |
| 17:57.20 | ||cw | internal like under the battery like a lot of phones do |
| 17:57.29 | disq | lardman|afk: transparency? |
| 17:57.31 | mgedmin | not visible in the pictures |
| 17:57.52 | lardman|afk | disq: yep |
| 17:58.00 | disq | where |
| 17:58.04 | mgedmin | ||cw: http://www.engadget.com/photos/nokia-n810-hands-on/443977/ |
| 17:58.15 | lardman|afk | disq: http://jaaksi.blogspot.com/2007/10/nokia-n810-announced.html |
| 17:58.25 | disq | ah, that one. lemme read |
| 17:58.26 | *** part/#maemo Ivan_Chelubee1 (n=ijon@ppp85-140-188-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 17:58.31 | ||cw | mgedmin: I know... one of the comments says 2 sd slots though |
| 17:58.34 | shapr | mgedmin: Yeah, that doesn't show a spot for a card. |
| 17:58.35 | lardman|afk | http://bp1.blogger.com/_YaAt2fURNNU/RxXcuew1beI/AAAAAAAAACI/J0KcYVHh-E4/s1600-h/17102007448.jpg to be more exact |
| 17:59.10 | mgedmin | otoh if that indentation in http://www.engadget.com/photos/nokia-n810-hands-on/443961/ indicates the place for the sd card (accessible from the slot in the bottom), then it looks full-size |
| 17:59.35 | ||cw | http://forum2.mobile-review.com/showpost.php?p=620035&postcount=25 |
| 18:00.40 | GeneralAntilles | Yes, flip^. |
| 18:01.01 | GeneralAntilles | http://maemo.org/news/announcements/view/1192637131.html |
| 18:01.44 | ||cw | press releases says 10GB mem card.... |
| 18:01.46 | flip^ | aha |
| 18:01.51 | *** join/#maemo ptman (i=ptman@idler.fi) |
| 18:02.12 | flip^ | I guess I'll be reflashing again next month :D |
| 18:03.18 | shapr | Aha, it is mozilla! |
| 18:03.40 | kaltsi | here's a feature comparison table btwn the different tablets http://www.forum.nokia.com/main/platforms/maemo/index.html |
| 18:03.44 | kaltsi | (at the bottom of the page) |
| 18:05.33 | timeless | speaking of mozilla |
| 18:05.41 | timeless | i'm looking for people here who use microb |
| 18:06.05 | mgedmin | "2 GB in-built, 1 memory card slot (compatible with miniSD and microSD cards up to 8 GB)" |
| 18:06.12 | mgedmin | in addition to the 256 mb flash |
| 18:06.14 | mgedmin | interesting |
| 18:06.18 | ||cw | scroll to the bottom here http://www.forum.nokia.com/main/platforms/maemo/index.html 2GB internal, I think the maps are on this, and microsd slot |
| 18:06.31 | disq | timeless: update on iphone.fb.com? |
| 18:06.31 | timeless | generally they're on the internal, yes |
| 18:06.35 | mgedmin | usb 2.0 otg |
| 18:06.39 | mgedmin | does that mean host mode support? |
| 18:06.40 | timeless | disq: no, sorry |
| 18:06.47 | timeless | mgedmin: that was the goal |
| 18:06.52 | timeless | i'm not quite sure if it happened |
| 18:07.33 | disq | it'd just be better if it came with 2gig flash |
| 18:07.46 | timeless | flip: i haven't disassembled one yet, but essentially from a functional perspective, you might as well think about it that way |
| 18:07.52 | timeless | i.e. it's listed as a memory card |
| 18:08.02 | timeless | and you can corrupt it like an external memory card :) |
| 18:08.07 | timeless | (don't ask me how) |
| 18:08.10 | ||cw | I wonder of the 2GB internal is removable |
| 18:08.16 | timeless | and you don't want 2gb of flash |
| 18:08.18 | mgedmin | with a big enough hammer, yes :-) |
| 18:08.19 | timeless | flash is *slow* |
| 18:08.36 | timeless | it's so slow tha the browser has disk cache disabled |
| 18:08.41 | timeless | precisely because of that |
| 18:08.43 | timeless | which reminds me |
| 18:08.54 | ||cw | mgedmin: there are different types of flash |
| 18:08.54 | timeless | we should really consider forking the browser config based on n810/n800 |
| 18:08.57 | timeless | i.e. we didn't do that :( |
| 18:09.05 | mgedmin | what filesystem does the the internal 2 gb use? |
| 18:09.13 | timeless | presumably fat32 |
| 18:09.17 | timeless | i can check tomorrow |
| 18:09.33 | disq | timeless: isn't flash slow because it uses jffs2? if it was big enough you could use a uncompressed fs |
| 18:09.33 | timeless | i believe since the product is announced, i could have taken one home |
| 18:09.40 | timeless | disq: no |
| 18:09.49 | timeless | at least, i believe it isn't |
| 18:10.15 | timeless | jffs2 is i believe because of the write balancing more than the compression |
| 18:10.20 | timeless | i.e. to avoid burning it out |
| 18:10.27 | mgedmin | hm, I already have 2.1 gig used on my 4 gig sd card in my n800... |
| 18:10.37 | disq | ah, yeah. internal flash doesn't have write balancing like the external cards. true, forgot about that |
| 18:10.38 | timeless | my biggest cards are 2g |
| 18:10.49 | mgedmin | shame, I though I could get away without an external card |
| 18:11.06 | timeless | disq: good, because i'm not a hardware guy, so i can't explain anything beyond that :) |
| 18:11.43 | timeless | it says there's a hw QWERTY keyboard |
| 18:11.53 | timeless | what if i want an AZERTY or QWERTZ keyboard |
| 18:12.02 | timeless | (actually, i believe it has one of those) |
| 18:12.05 | suihkulokki | disq: you might want to google for movinand |
| 18:12.25 | disq | sure |
| 18:12.46 | shapr | I want dvorak. |
| 18:12.58 | timeless | shapr: i haven't seen *any* suppor for that :) |
| 18:13.11 | shapr | I've been using dvorak since 1992! |
| 18:13.40 | mgedmin | "HW keyboard variants: English, German, French, Italian, Spanish-Portuguese, Scandinavian and Russian" |
| 18:14.07 | disq | old. are we. :P |
| 18:14.27 | shapr | I'm old, but at least I don't look old. |
| 18:14.35 | czr | you look ancient? |
| 18:15.17 | timeless | has anyone here looked a the content provided as links from those pages? |
| 18:15.20 | shapr | Nah, I look about 27. |
| 18:16.09 | shapr | timeless: ? |
| 18:16.14 | timeless | http://maemo4mobile.garage.maemo.org/introduction.html |
| 18:16.25 | timeless | > For instance, a web browser on an Internet Tablet is full featured with support to AJAX and Flash. |
| 18:16.31 | timeless | last i checked the 770 doesn't support AJAX or Flash |
| 18:16.49 | timeless | s/doesn't/didn't/ :( |
| 18:16.51 | shapr | Google maps works for me on my 770 with OS2007 Hacker's Edition. |
| 18:17.04 | timeless | shapr: hey're not talking about os2007 |
| 18:17.08 | shapr | oh |
| 18:17.09 | timeless | http://www.forum.nokia.com/main/platforms/maemo/index.html#documentation |
| 18:17.15 | timeless | clearly doesn't lis os2007 in the 770 column |
| 18:17.46 | timeless | they also don't understand how to use a spell checker |
| 18:17.49 | *** join/#maemo vivijim (n=vivijim@200.184.118.132) |
| 18:18.02 | timeless | hrm |
| 18:18.11 | timeless | has no one filed a bug complaining that notes doesn't offer a spell checker? :) |
| 18:18.36 | timeless | eh? |
| 18:18.38 | timeless | right click |
| 18:18.39 | lardman|afk | is the forum nokia support free? |
| 18:18.45 | timeless | that's how i correct people's mistakes |
| 18:18.45 | pupnik | timeless: what does the dpad action feel like - is there a tactile click to move left/right, or is it soft-press? |
| 18:19.02 | timeless | pupnik: eh |
| 18:19.06 | mgedmin | timeless: maybe one of my ffox extensions ate them :( |
| 18:19.08 | timeless | parse error :( |
| 18:19.10 | suihkulokki | This so great example of the maemo sdk people braindamage: http://maemo4mobile.garage.maemo.org/compile_move.html |
| 18:19.12 | timeless | mgedmin: maybe |
| 18:19.13 | disq | timeless: yeah tell us about the new dpad. is it a trackpad? no? |
| 18:19.28 | timeless | disq: it's like some of the newer nokia phones |
| 18:19.31 | Tak | does it feel like 770 dpad, or like a decent dpad? |
| 18:19.31 | pupnik | timeless: when you press dpad on the 770 you feel resistance then a click. |
| 18:19.32 | timeless | we're reusing components |
| 18:19.38 | timeless | personally my favorite dpad is the 770 |
| 18:19.45 | timeless | followed by the n800, and now the n810 |
| 18:19.56 | lardman|afk | hmm, 160 euros per case |
| 18:19.56 | timeless | i think the e61i is the bottom of this short list |
| 18:20.02 | suihkulokki | instead of actually writing an app that makes transferring binaries to _EASY_, lets document this long and tedious process |
| 18:20.06 | timeless | most other nokia dpads are even worse |
| 18:20.09 | *** join/#maemo cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@200.184.118.132) |
| 18:20.16 | disq | timeless: so, when you move your finger on the center square part, you can ie. pan a map? without pressing the side arrowkeys |
| 18:20.16 | pupnik | ok thanks - 770 is close to usable :) |
| 18:20.33 | timeless | disq: no |
| 18:20.36 | *** join/#maemo guardian (n=Guardian@ANantes-252-1-59-83.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 18:20.36 | timeless | it's just a button |
| 18:20.48 | timeless | fwiw, i don't use the n810 much |
| 18:20.52 | disq | ah |
| 18:20.55 | timeless | i started using it jokingly last week |
| 18:21.01 | disq | thanks for the clarification :) |
| 18:21.03 | timeless | i find a couple of bugs in every few minutes of use |
| 18:21.14 | timeless | and spend time trying to find people to get info from my bugs |
| 18:21.18 | timeless | and then i go back to browser problems |
| 18:21.25 | timeless | like, it turns out we're really stupid |
| 18:21.30 | timeless | and most of our strings are really bad |
| 18:21.42 | disq | i should update my sardine and see what's going on |
| 18:21.50 | timeless | anyway, would a few microb users please volunteer to test something for me? |
| 18:22.03 | disq | sure. if it doesn't involve much typing on the vkb :P |
| 18:22.09 | timeless | hrm |
| 18:22.19 | timeless | can you please not use a pastebin? |
| 18:22.28 | timeless | i don't want to be accused of leaking anything |
| 18:22.37 | disq | sure |
| 18:23.26 | Tak | j'accuse! |
| 18:25.26 | *** join/#maemo pdz-_ (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 18:26.21 | *** join/#maemo pupnik_ (n=pupnik@dslb-084-059-034-084.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:26.43 | mgedmin | hm, if I buy a yet another internet table, the empty box won't fit on my shelf where I keep all the empty boxes |
| 18:26.46 | pupnik_ | beh did i miss an answer timeless? |
| 18:27.07 | timeless | pupnik: sorry, did you volunteer? |
| 18:28.08 | pupnik_ | i got disconnected |
| 18:28.16 | timeless | js bindings? |
| 18:28.33 | Tak | mgedmin: you'll have to have a bonfire |
| 18:28.34 | pupnik_ | there will be no devices in the idiot stores in my town |
| 18:28.54 | Tak | pupnik_: you should definitely get a device if they do a developer program |
| 18:29.30 | *** join/#maemo Atarii (n=Atarii@82-46-182-49.cable.ubr02.perr.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 18:30.14 | Tak | (while "should" in the moral sense definitely applies, I meant "should" as in "are likely to") |
| 18:31.06 | timeless | hey |
| 18:31.12 | timeless | quick question, |
| 18:31.12 | _Monkey | quick question, is there a clock taskbar app for IT2006? |
| 18:31.38 | disq | lol |
| 18:31.45 | disq | _Monkey: forget quick question |
| 18:31.45 | _Monkey | disq, I didn't have anything matching quick question |
| 18:31.46 | timeless | _monkey forget quick question |
| 18:31.46 | _Monkey | timeless, I didn't have anything matching quick question |
| 18:31.49 | disq | _Monkey: forget quick question, |
| 18:31.50 | _Monkey | disq: I forgot quick question, |
| 18:31.56 | timeless | wow! |
| 18:32.20 | timeless | _monkey quick question, is <reply> |
| 18:32.20 | _Monkey | OK, timeless. |
| 18:32.32 | disq | _Monkey: quick question,? |
| 18:32.32 | _Monkey | i don't know, disq |
| 18:32.38 | timeless | that's so random... (and yes, i understand how it happened) |
| 18:32.56 | timeless | _monkey literal quick quesion, |
| 18:32.57 | _Monkey | timeless: what? |
| 18:33.03 | timeless | _monkey literal quick question, |
| 18:33.03 | _Monkey | timeless: quick question, =is= <reply> |
| 18:37.23 | timeless | oh fsck |
| 18:37.54 | *** join/#maemo Neckar (n=nils@blfd-4db549eb.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 18:38.27 | lardman|afk | interesting - omapdsp: frame buffer has been exported already! |
| 18:39.06 | pupnik_ | 20:24 <@Michae1> maybe I'll buy a tub of them |
| 18:39.07 | pupnik_ | 20:24 <@Michae1> and take internet tablet baths |
| 18:39.28 | mgedmin | that's a novel use case |
| 18:39.48 | TPC | I did that :) |
| 18:40.02 | TPC | I have a waterproof casing for pdas, with a soft transparant front |
| 18:40.16 | TPC | you can use the touch screen trought it :) |
| 18:40.44 | keesj | lardman what are you doing , it sounds very interesting |
| 18:41.03 | lardman|afk | trying to write to the framebuffer from the dsp |
| 18:41.28 | *** join/#maemo Mekin (n=nils@77.182.237.52) |
| 18:41.43 | lardman|afk | ssvb/serge was interested in doing full screen video in mplayer by offloading the scaling and conversion routines |
| 18:42.34 | lardman|afk | s/was/is |
| 18:42.41 | czr | silly question, when the rootstrap installation script for bora is run, is the apt-get executed within the targets already or in scratchbox using host tools? |
| 18:43.58 | *** join/#maemo tank1770 (i=tank17@gateway/tor/x-804bcc268a08b4c1) |
| 18:44.35 | |R | any idea how many apps will break on OS2008? :) |
| 18:44.45 | lardman|afk | all of them |
| 18:44.58 | lardman|afk | they have moved to a newer version of gtk+ iirc |
| 18:45.00 | flip^ | hopefully most of the ones i use will be updated nice and quick tho ;) |
| 18:45.41 | lopz | adiós |
| 18:46.21 | lardman | anyone know, off hand, where the framebuffer is exported to if CONFIG_FB_OMAP_LCDC_EXTERNAL is set...? |
| 18:48.10 | Jiten_ | it seems calling window.show_all() is the only way to get toolbar buttons to show with pygtk and hildon.Window of course. The toolbar itself does show in either case. |
| 18:48.32 | MDK | Jiten_: it's a bug in bora |
| 18:48.39 | MDK | Jiten_: fixed in chinook |
| 18:48.44 | Jiten_ | I see. |
| 18:49.21 | *** join/#maemo straind42 (n=stupidpe@n080s062.bbr1.shentel.net) |
| 18:50.55 | *** join/#maemo konttori (n=konttori@a88-114-91-19.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 18:51.23 | |R | any idea why Aplication manager would freeze when launched alone? :( |
| 18:51.50 | pupnik_ | what's this little corner thing? http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/10/nokia-n810-hands-on-05.jpg |
| 18:52.19 | timeless | that's the light |
| 18:52.21 | |R | pupnik_ : led |
| 18:52.24 | timeless | it's for annoying people |
| 18:52.28 | |R | hehe |
| 18:52.35 | pupnik_ | to blink for email messages when screen is dark? |
| 18:52.40 | timeless | yes |
| 18:52.44 | suihkulokki | morse |
| 18:52.46 | timeless | it's the same annoying blue as last time |
| 18:53.16 | timeless | fwiw there's also a light indicator, i believe that's the smaller square highlighted by the light gloss in that picture |
| 18:53.37 | timeless | it's designed to let your screen go very bright if you thumb it, i suppose ... dunno |
| 18:54.08 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 18:54.18 | timeless | the light sensor also controls whether the keys have this nokia blue coloring bleeding through the letters |
| 18:54.45 | *** join/#maemo straind36 (n=stupidpe@n080s062.bbr1.shentel.net) |
| 18:54.47 | Tak | |R: you check out the new releases? |
| 18:54.47 | timeless | that picture also shows the fullscreen button |
| 18:54.50 | disq | i thought so. leds draw power |
| 18:55.01 | |R | Tak : the one on garage? |
| 18:55.04 | timeless | what it doesn't show is that you can't really access it when the keyboard is open :) |
| 18:55.20 | Tak | yes; in extras repo as well |
| 18:55.27 | timeless | the zoom buttons are now thankfully no longer interrupted by the fullscreen button (back to the 770 design, yay!) |
| 18:55.31 | disq | where's the menu key? the left keys are escape and home? or is it home? something else? if it's fullscreen, what's the left key on the top side? |
| 18:55.40 | flip^ | menu is on the keyboard |
| 18:55.45 | |R | Tak: well, i did yesterday, before i fucked up big time (trashed /bin instead of ~bin !!) |
| 18:55.45 | timeless | the menu key is protected by the tray |
| 18:55.53 | disq | ah, ok |
| 18:55.54 | timeless | you wouldn't want to use the menu key, would you? :( |
| 18:55.55 | Tak | lol - doh! |
| 18:56.10 | Tak | everything seem ok up until that point? |
| 18:56.23 | timeless | fwiw, there's now a hardware keylock/unlock feature |
| 18:56.25 | timeless | it might work |
| 18:56.26 | disq | now that the dpad is out of the picture (heh) we need to code some pulldown-like menus for kagu |
| 18:56.27 | |R | Tak : now i'm reinstalling and it seems weird, it seems i'm using more space than before with basically not everything reinstalled yet and application manager won't launch... |
| 18:56.27 | pupnik_ | 20% brighter screen is going to be crazy bright |
| 18:56.33 | disq | can't go on with dpad shortcuts |
| 18:56.36 | flip^ | its brighter :o |
| 18:56.41 | timeless | pupnik: i can't speak to the brighter part |
| 18:56.42 | |R | Tak : well yes, except all the but (beside top left) were reverted |
| 18:56.46 | flip^ | pupnik_: think you'll be tempted to splash out? |
| 18:56.55 | Tak | what?! |
| 18:56.55 | timeless | we're in helsinki, and i haven't been able to take the device into the sun until today |
| 18:57.03 | timeless | and i won't be able to until there's sun, say maybe may? |
| 18:57.10 | Tak | with the released -bora4? |
| 18:57.12 | timeless | unless i fly to california... |
| 18:57.17 | |R | let me try my my "fresh" install... |
| 18:57.18 | lardman | timeless: :) |
| 18:57.19 | pupnik_ | heh |
| 18:57.35 | timeless | lardman: ... |
| 18:57.59 | timeless | fwiw, i don't particularly like the home/escape buttons |
| 18:58.14 | timeless | i think they're now much harder to use |
| 18:58.26 | timeless | of note, the home button now only triggers the thumb menu |
| 18:58.33 | timeless | instead of whichever menu you last triggered |
| 18:58.41 | |R | Tak: ah ok, the more space usage problem is the restoration of nokia's video and such... |
| 18:59.39 | |R | Tak: nop, still reverted buttons |
| 18:59.44 | lardman | timeless: is the powervr used now? |
| 18:59.53 | pupnik_ | engadget sure is worth sending an early unit to, for the sweet pix alone |
| 18:59.59 | timeless | um, if that's a hardware thing, i wouldn't know |
| 19:00.07 | lardman | ok |
| 19:00.19 | lardman | in which case, is the alpha blending good? |
| 19:00.31 | lardman | :D |
| 19:00.33 | timeless | i need to file a bug about the browser art |
| 19:00.41 | timeless | the icon we have for the browser app in the menu is wrong |
| 19:00.57 | timeless | they switched art styles for the icons and didn't refresh the browser one |
| 19:02.05 | *** join/#maemo r2d2rogers (n=r2d2roge@c-69-247-187-160.hsd1.la.comcast.net) |
| 19:04.15 | *** join/#maemo Mekin1 (n=nils@77.182.237.138) |
| 19:04.43 | timeless | ok, so, i'm looking for a second person to express an opinion on a web page (w/ microb) |
| 19:06.03 | TPC | I can do it |
| 19:07.02 | timeless | disq: can you repeat the things i asked you to look at for tpc? |
| 19:07.07 | timeless | oops, wrong window |
| 19:08.52 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 19:11.07 | keesj | is python included in 2008? |
| 19:11.18 | |R | we need a dpkg -l ;) |
| 19:15.57 | *** join/#maemo Mekin2 (n=nils@blfd-4db6e517.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 19:16.29 | timeless | heh |
| 19:16.40 | keesj | If i read it correctly we might have the software on the n800 before the n810 hits the market |
| 19:19.56 | *** join/#maemo pdz- (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 19:20.20 | czr | hmm. is there any particular reason why within targets the PATH is by default setup so that /usr/local/bin is after all the system paths? |
| 19:21.50 | *** join/#maemo NetBlade (n=osku@xdsl-206-183.nblnetworks.fi) |
| 19:22.55 | *** join/#maemo bergie (n=bergie@cs181223139.pp.htv.fi) |
| 19:24.02 | czr | ah. sbox breaks down LD_PRELOAD stuff as well. |
| 19:25.35 | suihkulokki | czr: us SBOX_PRELOAD to ld_preload target binareis |
| 19:26.22 | czr | suihkulokki, yeah, except that I'd have to rebuild the software since it does the LD_PRELOADing for me. I'll just ignore it |
| 19:27.33 | czr | suihkulokki, trying to setup a virtual machine image suitable for SDK experementation, and attempted to setup zerotools ( http://koltsoff.com/pub/zerotools/ ) within both targets so that the virtual machine image would remain "clean" |
| 19:27.47 | czr | but, I guess I'll just let it bloat then. |
| 19:34.33 | zeenix | s/filled/flooded/ |
| 19:34.42 | snowmoon | because it's a wimpy update |
| 19:34.57 | Tak | alterego: is there a deb repo for ruby-maemo? |
| 19:35.15 | mgedmin | zeenix: it was, for a while |
| 19:35.21 | wumpus | because most of us probably already have a n800 |
| 19:35.48 | mgedmin | snowmoon: you can't please everyone, either people will complain about update wimpyness, or other people will complain that their brand new n800 became obsolete overnight |
| 19:35.52 | mgedmin | (or both) |
| 19:36.11 | wumpus | I'll probably skip this one, maybe go for the n900 when it's there :) |
| 19:36.18 | alterego | Tak, not yet. There will be soon :) |
| 19:36.25 | HGFB | I'm not sure how they can complain. Apart from the keyboard and gps the N800 is more capable :) |
| 19:36.33 | wumpus | unless they finally activated powervr and it has great 3d support, then I might consider buying one, but I doubht it |
| 19:36.39 | snowmoon | I'm just hoping that the 810 will drive down the prices on the 800 so that I can justify it as a toy |
| 19:36.43 | HGFB | Especially since OS2008 is going to be released very soon |
| 19:36.55 | lardman|afk | wumpus: if they did that, it ought to hold true for the n800 too |
| 19:37.09 | onion | looks nice |
| 19:37.12 | HGFB | I don't think they've activated the powervr. A dev on another blog said the transparancy was cpu based |
| 19:37.20 | lardman | ah, shame |
| 19:37.30 | MDK | wumpus: no changes on this fron, but be patient |
| 19:37.35 | MDK | *front |
| 19:37.44 | lardman | ah, sounds interesting |
| 19:38.06 | MDK | there are very complex issues involved, if it was simple, we would have done it |
| 19:38.27 | lardman | MDK: like negotiating prices? |
| 19:38.28 | wumpus | genuine technical issues or license stuff? |
| 19:38.29 | MDK | complex as in "not technically related" |
| 19:38.31 | onion | but are we 770 user 100% screwed now? |
| 19:38.47 | MDK | don't ask me, I can't talk (I wish I could) |
| 19:38.57 | wumpus | well, if it was technical I'd gladly help :p |
| 19:39.08 | lardman | MDK interesting none the less, thanks for the hints |
| 19:39.22 | guerby | I don't see why Nokia would not release new hardware for N800 as fast as they release phones: everyone knows product are replaced every 6 monthes by something better |
| 19:39.37 | alterego | onion, depends what you mean. The platform is so open I'm sure developers could, on their own, compile root filesystem images from the latest releases. Though I imagine that OS2008 which uses main stream Gtk etc will be very slow on a 770 |
| 19:39.55 | guerby | buying one of these gadget and complaining that something better is out after a few monthes is not logical |
| 19:39.57 | lardman | is H.264 supported on the n800? |
| 19:40.18 | MDK | alterego: the "mainstream gtk" is not slower in OS2008 |
| 19:40.21 | wumpus | guerby: because a stable platform is good for software development, especially if you rely on open source |
| 19:40.22 | alterego | lardman, will be with OS2008 I believe, not sure if it is now. Should say in the spec docs. |
| 19:40.29 | MDK | (than it was in OS2007) |
| 19:40.30 | alterego | MDK, it will be on the 770 |
| 19:40.37 | onion | alterego: developing... I can't afford to get every model that comes out |
| 19:40.46 | lardman | alterego: I was just thinking that the IVA is supposed to decode that |
| 19:40.53 | alterego | The issue here is not with the N800 it's continued OS images for the 770. |
| 19:41.13 | guerby | wumpus, software has to adapt to platform change continuously (especially in the UI world) |
| 19:41.18 | wumpus | people writing OS won't buy a new device every few months, so might get tired of it.. of course, they can release incrementally better devices (like the N810 seems to be) |
| 19:41.20 | alterego | The N800 will be supported until OS2009 I believe. |
| 19:41.46 | wumpus | but breaking compatibility again this soon would be a bad idea |
| 19:41.51 | wumpus | alterego: great |
| 19:41.51 | MDK | guys, remember there is a developer program (or is going to be soon) |
| 19:42.16 | alterego | MDK, you really think they'll have on for the N810? I'm personally not so sure about that .. ;) |
| 19:42.19 | MDK | so you can get discounted device if you have a nice maemo development history |
| 19:42.24 | guerby | wumpus, it looks like N810 will not break compat, but I've no problem if they do break |
| 19:42.24 | Tak | I'm with onion - I'd like to see OS2008HE |
| 19:42.26 | disq | alterego: the maemo announcement says there will be. |
| 19:42.32 | alterego | Oh, that's great. |
| 19:42.34 | MDK | alterego: yes, there will be one for n810 |
| 19:42.56 | wumpus | guerby: I would, I can't be bothered buying a new device every year.. I don't do that for phones either |
| 19:43.05 | alterego | I wonder if ruby-maemo will give me enough credits to be accepted into the program ^_^ |
| 19:43.26 | MDK | alterego: ah, you're the guy doing the ruby stuff? |
| 19:43.27 | guerby | wumpus, yes but in what a new device bother you then? |
| 19:43.30 | wumpus | and phones have JME applets anyway which have been working for a long time |
| 19:43.32 | alterego | MDK, indeed :) |
| 19:43.50 | lardman | what is the cause of the n800's video bandwidth issue? the lcd controller? |
| 19:43.55 | wumpus | guerby: incompatibility, old versus new developers, etc |
| 19:43.59 | *** join/#maemo Mekin (n=nils@blfd-4db6e540.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 19:44.02 | MDK | alterego: ah, I'll test it soon |
| 19:44.04 | guerby | wumpus, did you complain when new phone model came out? |
| 19:44.11 | MDK | alterego: now you see why I asked about chinook support ;) |
| 19:44.17 | alterego | MDK, best wait till the major release. It's only a few days away :) |
| 19:44.25 | wumpus | guerby: phones run java, which remains compatible usually |
| 19:44.43 | *** join/#maemo pauliukas (n=pauliuka@bas1-montrealak-1128729850.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 19:44.47 | suihkulokki | wumpus: the abi break know is to get rid of the forked gtk.. now that it's "mainstream gtk", it shouldn't break |
| 19:44.49 | pauliukas | Well, there we have it. My 770 is officially obsolete. |
| 19:44.57 | alterego | MDK, I've been planning ahead on this project the whole way. After I get 1.0 out I'm going to start working on Ruby1.9/2.0 for the device, ready for when Ruby is released at the end of this year. |
| 19:45.05 | onion | pauliukas: yeah, welcome to the club... |
| 19:45.05 | timeless | "shouldn't" |
| 19:45.08 | *** join/#maemo lodxcol (n=justin@unaffiliated/lodxcol) |
| 19:45.17 | timeless | you mean, until the next time gtk breaks its abis :) |
| 19:45.22 | pauliukas | onion: Thanks for the welcome. |
| 19:45.41 | suihkulokki | timeless: gtk2 in mainstream distro's has not changed soname.. |
| 19:45.45 | alterego | Why do you think it's obsolete? |
| 19:45.50 | czr | you can always make a small gtk-program to turn the 770 into a wireless picture frame ;-) |
| 19:45.56 | alterego | The 770 still has oodles of potential :) |
| 19:45.59 | wumpus | suihkulokki: yes, there will be less reason why an OS might not work on the n880, unless maemo pulls a vista/aero kind of thing, but that'd drain battery like hell |
| 19:46.00 | MDK | timeless: gtk hasn't broken API compatibility since years |
| 19:46.16 | suihkulokki | ..ofcourse, the chinook gtk is still patched and has dozens of unstable #MAEMO_CHANGES things |
| 19:46.24 | MDK | we broke it, because we fucked up the whole thing right from start ;) |
| 19:46.28 | MDK | by forking our stuff |
| 19:46.31 | alterego | Hah |
| 19:46.34 | mgedmin | pauliukas: wasn't it officially obsolete back when the n800 first came out? |
| 19:46.36 | lodxcol | can someone link me to the page that has the package url's for gaim on the nokia 770 |
| 19:46.38 | *** join/#maemo greentux (n=lemke@Z46c2.z.pppool.de) |
| 19:46.41 | MDK | so we needed this disruption to get back on sanity track |
| 19:46.44 | onion | you should get spanked for that ;) |
| 19:46.47 | MDK | yes, it's bad that we broke it |
| 19:46.50 | pauliukas | mgedmin: To me, the 800 wasn't a huge improvement. |
| 19:46.53 | mgedmin | I don't see how n810 changes things for 770 owners |
| 19:47.01 | MDK | but we broke it for a reason not to break it in future |
| 19:47.02 | timeless | tpc: dunno |
| 19:47.09 | TPC | timeless, wrong channel |
| 19:47.16 | alterego | I happen to own an N800 and a 770. To me the N800 is a vast improvement .. |
| 19:47.42 | suihkulokki | MDK: some "minor" things like TAP-AND-HOLD menu might still break if/when upstream chooses another approach |
| 19:48.02 | alterego | Upstream has already chosen an approach. |
| 19:48.13 | Tak | heh, I prefer the 770 |
| 19:48.34 | snowmoon | 770 was just too slow for me to take seriously |
| 19:48.38 | MDK | suihkulokki: we're ina very close contact with upstram |
| 19:48.40 | snowmoon | I played with it for a while |
| 19:48.41 | lodxcol | anyone? |
| 19:49.02 | MDK | also, guys, be reasonable |
| 19:49.09 | alterego | Hah |
| 19:49.13 | timeless | err, don't ask linux users to be reasonable |
| 19:49.17 | suihkulokki | :) |
| 19:49.27 | MDK | seriously, n800 owners (one year old hw) get now full software upgrade |
| 19:49.39 | MDK | with new shit, one year worth of bugfixing etc. |
| 19:49.39 | wumpus | yeah, the 770 was a bit too slow, which is why I didn't buy it when it came out |
| 19:49.54 | MDK | I'm not saying we're perfect |
| 19:49.57 | lardman | lodxcol: have you tried the maemo package list thingy? |
| 19:49.58 | guerby | lodxcol, http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationCatalog |
| 19:50.03 | wumpus | MDK: I'm not complaining |
| 19:50.05 | lardman | that's the one |
| 19:50.05 | MDK | but we're getting better and we learn the lessons ;) |
| 19:50.07 | alterego | Bug fixing and _features_. Not to mention the new API's are a lot nicer. |
| 19:50.09 | wumpus | I love the N800 |
| 19:50.21 | *** join/#maemo ian_brasil (n=ian@dasasob.nokia.com) |
| 19:50.28 | wumpus | there's always stuff that can be done better but the project is coming along well |
| 19:50.30 | MDK | also, I should note that that OS2008 has been FULLY tested on n800 |
| 19:50.33 | snowmoon | who is, MDK, I think the N series has a lot of potential... I was just hoping for more with the 810 |
| 19:50.41 | MDK | so it's not something like -- we just release it for n800 |
| 19:50.42 | wumpus | also a lot of apps available |
| 19:50.56 | MDK | it has been developed and tested all the time on n800 |
| 19:51.05 | wumpus | and quite a good package system |
| 19:51.42 | snowmoon | the gecko based browser is a big step... lots of built in upgrades right there... google docs should work |
| 19:51.56 | alterego | I still want libxul!!!! |
| 19:52.02 | mgedmin | I wish maemo cloned the Ubuntu approach (single shared repository, source-only uploads, build daemons for many architectures, volunteer maintainers that can fix any package) |
| 19:52.04 | zeenix | yup! i see a big positive diff when i compare the new software with the last released |
| 19:52.04 | wumpus | opera will be ditched? |
| 19:52.13 | zeenix | flip^: he does :) |
| 19:52.15 | wumpus | I don't know if I'm really that happy about that |
| 19:52.17 | MDK | wumpus: it's ditched |
| 19:52.40 | timeless | fwiw, someone did google gears for microb |
| 19:52.40 | alterego | mgedmin, ubuntu don't make hardware. |
| 19:52.41 | timeless | they were supposed to write an announcement somewhere |
| 19:52.46 | zeenix | flip^: but i don't, i swear :) |
| 19:52.46 | mgedmin | alterego: maemo.org doesn't either ;-) |
| 19:52.49 | wumpus | at least on my old P550 machine, opera is a lot more responsive and uses less memory than firefox |
| 19:52.55 | timeless | i don't know what happened to it |
| 19:53.02 | snowmoon | with gears it would be dirt simple to sync google to OS2008 and be on the go for a while without WiFi |
| 19:53.10 | wumpus | but I can see why gecko is preferable |
| 19:53.37 | mgedmin | is google gears open-source? |
| 19:53.41 | mgedmin | if so, it can be ported |
| 19:53.49 | mgedmin | iirc microb supports extensions |
| 19:53.50 | konttori | evening guys! |
| 19:53.57 | timeless | it does |
| 19:54.04 | timeless | as i said, someone did a google gears port |
| 19:54.12 | timeless | they were supposed to write an announcement, i don't know what happened to it |
| 19:54.20 | timeless | http://browser-extras.garage.maemo.org/news/ |
| 19:54.41 | mgedmin | oh, right, I missed that |
| 19:54.47 | mgedmin | too much traffic here |
| 19:55.00 | timeless | it could be worse, i have 3 other heres here |
| 19:57.45 | timeless | dunno, trying to push the google search button down i guess? |
| 19:57.49 | timeless | arg |
| 19:58.03 | timeless | gah. i need to consider a graphical irc client |
| 19:59.29 | konttori | timeless: thanks for the greasemonkey. So, now I could for example without much trouble write a script that will open youtube clips directly in uktube or even in mplayer. |
| 19:59.55 | timeless | officially i wasn't involved |
| 20:00.10 | timeless | but i'm glad you liked the link |
| 20:01.00 | konttori | hey, will someone please port xchat for chinook now. |
| 20:01.18 | alterego | Heh |
| 20:01.20 | konttori | as you guys can see, messaging apps will suddendly make much more sense than before |
| 20:01.32 | MDK | is the maemo mappper developer around? |
| 20:01.33 | alterego | konttori, that's a good point ;) |
| 20:01.34 | konttori | I think pidgin is being worked on |
| 20:01.44 | konttori | gnuite? |
| 20:01.46 | roope | Hello. |
| 20:01.48 | MDK | we need to port maemo mapper |
| 20:01.49 | alterego | pidgin is awesome .. |
| 20:01.49 | konttori | hi roope |
| 20:02.14 | *** join/#maemo Lariso (n=jdp@87-194-204-195.bethere.co.uk) |
| 20:02.16 | disq | so, when do we get modest as the default mail client :P |
| 20:02.19 | juh0 | what is the status of os2008 for n800? ready or not? |
| 20:02.28 | timeless | muse? |
| 20:02.28 | Lariso | can anyone help me with running a shell script from the n800 menu? |
| 20:02.35 | roope | Muse, the band. |
| 20:02.53 | pupnik_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:03.07 | disq | konttori: how's kagu behaving on chinook? :P |
| 20:03.14 | konttori | didn't try |
| 20:03.20 | Lariso | i'll try that. i'm using 2007 HE |
| 20:03.24 | konttori | I did port (well.. port ;) ukmp to it |
| 20:03.26 | disq | but you tried ukmp didn't you :P |
| 20:03.30 | konttori | yeah |
| 20:03.33 | Lariso | ^^should have typed n700 up there |
| 20:03.34 | Jiten_ | I guess I should build this application I'm writing right now with an eye on OS2008. |
| 20:03.37 | Lariso | *770 |
| 20:03.37 | konttori | works just fine. |
| 20:03.39 | bmidgley | is that a flash above the n810 camera? |
| 20:03.45 | konttori | Only had to change gstreamer init |
| 20:03.57 | konttori | that's the beauty of python. |
| 20:04.29 | *** join/#maemo bepp (n=tom@pD9E52D59.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:04.34 | snowmoon | bmidgley: light sensor ( according to talk ) |
| 20:05.24 | bmidgley | ok |
| 20:05.53 | bmidgley | what about zoom buttons? are they n800 style or the nicer 770 style? |
| 20:05.59 | konttori | disq: I'll try kagu for you tomorrow |
| 20:06.06 | timeless | zoom nbuttons are 770 style |
| 20:06.09 | konttori | We are still not allowed to take protos home |
| 20:06.13 | timeless | but unsable w/ keyboard open |
| 20:06.17 | timeless | konttori: really? |
| 20:06.21 | konttori | or are we... maybe we are.. anyway, I don't have it. |
| 20:06.28 | timeless | someone said once the real things are known that we should be |
| 20:06.33 | timeless | note: i'm not yet, i don't see the point |
| 20:06.44 | timeless | i.e. the announcement was today |
| 20:06.50 | timeless | and the hardware is clearly in the wild |
| 20:07.01 | konttori | Yeah, so we should be able to use it in public now |
| 20:07.26 | pauliukas | what? |
| 20:07.31 | pauliukas | You had that all the time long? |
| 20:07.47 | timeless | had wha? |
| 20:07.48 | konttori | anyway, I'll take it home tomorrow, but I'll try to test kagu at the office. |
| 20:07.56 | pauliukas | "konttori |
| 20:07.56 | pauliukas | : |
| 20:07.56 | pauliukas | Yeah, so we should be able to use it in public now" |
| 20:07.58 | disq | konttori: thank you :) |
| 20:08.00 | pauliukas | Who's this "we" |
| 20:08.05 | timeless | nokians |
| 20:08.09 | timeless | we've had protos for months |
| 20:08.12 | Lariso | do i have to reboot after installing osso-statusbar-cpu or will it not run on 2007 HE |
| 20:08.20 | konttori | yeah, well, I work for nokia now as well. Started 1,5 months ago. |
| 20:08.20 | pauliukas | motherfu... |
| 20:08.43 | timeless | but you can't talk about products until they're announced |
| 20:08.51 | timeless | so you wouldn't hear anyone talk about them until today |
| 20:08.52 | pauliukas | oh come on. |
| 20:09.00 | pauliukas | You can make loads of money. |
| 20:09.03 | pauliukas | nokiarumors.com |
| 20:09.06 | pauliukas | or something like that. |
| 20:09.07 | czr | you can always wait for some unrelated press-releases to leak out the info though :-) |
| 20:09.11 | pauliukas | 9to5nokia.com :-P |
| 20:09.15 | konttori | we have been relly busy working to get the thing polished for the past weeks, so I haven't had the time to try out any 3rd party stuff on it. otherwise I would have tested kagu already |
| 20:09.17 | timeless | czr: yeah well |
| 20:09.23 | timeless | that means we can talk a day earlier |
| 20:09.28 | timeless | not very helpful, and not like we care |
| 20:09.35 | timeless | i'm not really interested in the n810 |
| 20:09.43 | pauliukas | BS! |
| 20:09.47 | timeless | as a browser dev, i really don't care about the n810 |
| 20:10.01 | timeless | especially given we aren't even taking advantage of its internal mmc for caching |
| 20:10.16 | timeless | which is a bug i intend to file and possibly fix before we ship the n810s :) |
| 20:10.33 | pauliukas | browser dev? |
| 20:10.38 | konttori | I can say that I think it's really a wonderful device. Keyboard extends the usefulness of the device so much that I can really see myself using it to just about anything now. |
| 20:10.38 | czr | timeless, good luck getting that through the test cycle though ;-) |
| 20:10.38 | pauliukas | Isn't Opera doing the browser? |
| 20:10.44 | timeless | no |
| 20:10.52 | MDK | not any more ;) |
| 20:10.53 | pauliukas | And while we're at it, how come the browser crashes a lot on the 770. |
| 20:10.57 | pauliukas | Really? Since when? |
| 20:11.01 | konttori | timeless: why don't you cache there? |
| 20:11.01 | timeless | http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/index.xml |
| 20:11.04 | ian_brasil | mgedmin: gears is BSD licensed |
| 20:11.04 | czr | konttori, they keyboard is useful for real writing? or just IM? |
| 20:11.10 | timeless | konttori: because we're idiots |
| 20:11.20 | keesj | timeless: it' |
| 20:11.21 | timeless | as i said, i'll try to fix it before the n810s ship |
| 20:11.30 | timeless | keesj: i'm speaking as browser architect |
| 20:11.33 | keesj | timeless: it's great that microb made it |
| 20:11.38 | timeless | there are a lot of stupid things we're not doing right |
| 20:11.41 | timeless | that's only one of htem |
| 20:11.42 | pauliukas | what the fu... |
| 20:11.45 | konttori | kb is usefull for even real writing. But it's thumb, so writing is not so fast as on a real kb. But still, quite fast |
| 20:11.49 | pauliukas | why wasn't I told about this before. |
| 20:11.56 | czr | konttori, nice to hear. |
| 20:12.06 | timeless | pauliukas: http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/5/ |
| 20:12.10 | timeless | specifically for meet the team |
| 20:12.18 | alterego | timeless, get them to stick libxul in the rootfs for me :) |
| 20:12.18 | czr | lack of keyb was the only thing that kept me from using the previous ITs for anything. |
| 20:12.24 | timeless | and since i guess someone announced it, the itos 2008 will not include opera |
| 20:12.26 | timeless | only microb |
| 20:12.32 | pauliukas | geez. this is crazy. |
| 20:12.37 | pauliukas | And microb is usable on OS2006? |
| 20:12.41 | timeless | alterego: believe me i want to |
| 20:12.47 | alterego | :) |
| 20:12.50 | timeless | pauliukas: yes, has been since i dunno, a while ago |
| 20:13.00 | alterego | Any chance? I tried compiling it myself but it didn't work out so well ^_^ |
| 20:13.01 | pauliukas | wow... |
| 20:13.04 | pauliukas | downloading it now. |
| 20:13.07 | konttori | good work on getting the browser stable in the past two weeks. It's really working now. |
| 20:13.11 | pauliukas | Hope it doesn't crash as much as opera does. |
| 20:13.18 | timeless | alterego: it works |
| 20:13.19 | alterego | timeless, it'd show those iPhone weiners a thing or two ;) |
| 20:13.37 | alterego | Sweet. |
| 20:13.38 | timeless | setup a scratchbox and pull from garage.maemo.org/svn/browser |
| 20:13.49 | alterego | timeless, you're a star, thanks so much :) |
| 20:13.49 | timeless | just don't include --disable-xul |
| 20:14.04 | timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/browser/ |
| 20:14.07 | alterego | If I'd known it was _that_ easy ^_^ |
| 20:14.09 | timeless | if you want to browse sources |
| 20:14.23 | timeless | that's slightly out of date as i don't updae daily |
| 20:14.33 | timeless | my 't' key doesn't work well, i think it's dying from overuse |
| 20:14.34 | alterego | Well, I'm stuck working on ruby-maemo right now. I'll bookmark and look into it later. :) |
| 20:14.52 | timeless | fwiw, i got someone to write a howto for writing microb extensions |
| 20:14.57 | timeless | i expect it to be posted later this week |
| 20:15.37 | alterego | Great. |
| 20:16.22 | *** join/#maemo t_s_o (n=tso@192.84-49-130.nextgentel.com) |
| 20:16.26 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 20:17.25 | Lariso | my osso-statusbar-cpu doesn't appear in the status bar even though i enabled it :( |
| 20:17.41 | pupnik_ | might be a problem with os2007he, sorry Lariso |
| 20:18.24 | Lariso | i don't mind editing the menu files to make my own shortcuts but .. well, they don't work |
| 20:18.39 | *** part/#maemo bepp (n=tom@pD9E52D59.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:18.43 | Lariso | it's just a little script to start a vpn up. |
| 20:18.44 | pauliukas | damn |
| 20:18.48 | pauliukas | Not enough memory... |
| 20:18.51 | pauliukas | I wonder how much it needs. |
| 20:19.08 | timeless | lariso: the vpnc hing doesn't work for you? |
| 20:19.22 | czr | hmm. would be completely impossible to get a periodic ntp sync from dhcp provided ntp-server list? |
| 20:19.55 | Lariso | vpnc eh |
| 20:20.04 | cesman | To the "Nokians" in the channel... How about N8xx fused with the GP2X for the next model?! |
| 20:20.05 | Lariso | *reading* |
| 20:20.14 | cesman | please put that in the suggestion box ;) |
| 20:23.41 | VRe | 770: MMC, 800: SD: 810: mini/microSD?? |
| 20:25.02 | timeless | vre: yes |
| 20:25.08 | timeless | nokia = consistency |
| 20:25.14 | pauliukas | uhhh |
| 20:25.19 | flip^ | well, 800: mmc/sd/variants |
| 20:25.20 | pauliukas | I installed it but I don't see it anywhere. |
| 20:25.25 | pauliukas | Does it need a restart or something |
| 20:25.45 | timeless | also note tha the hardware layout for zoom/fullscreen/home/keys has consistently changed for each product |
| 20:25.46 | Lariso | does vpnc work with ssh |
| 20:25.50 | VRe | Nice, I can use old MMC (which was burned by kernel-bug) in the new one.. not the nice 4GB SD from n800.. |
| 20:25.51 | timeless | the art work for each button has also changed |
| 20:26.14 | timeless | vre: you can install os 2008 on your n800 before you can buy an n810 |
| 20:26.19 | disq | anybody know how to monitor a file in sysfs? |
| 20:26.21 | VRe | Yeap :) |
| 20:26.31 | wumpus | timeless: I suppose it's still a bit of an experimental project |
| 20:26.51 | VRe | VRe: I was thinking dumping the 800 to gf and getting myself the new toy |
| 20:27.04 | pauliukas | Oh... it replaces Opera? |
| 20:27.08 | pauliukas | Damn. Got an error |
| 20:27.10 | timeless | wumpus: just a bit? |
| 20:27.15 | timeless | the n800 had a radio oto |
| 20:27.27 | VRe | radio is gone? |
| 20:27.37 | timeless | pauliukas: yes, opera's gone |
| 20:27.48 | pauliukas | that's not good. |
| 20:27.51 | pauliukas | I'm getting errors. |
| 20:28.00 | timeless | vre: radio was traded for gps |
| 20:28.19 | mgedmin | VRe: no you can't use an rs-mmc card in a mini-sd slot |
| 20:28.23 | timeless | (not seriously, but if you want to look a it some way) |
| 20:28.24 | pupnik_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:28.26 | mgedmin | ... or can you? |
| 20:28.30 | mgedmin | I'd be surprised |
| 20:28.38 | VRe | Might not work |
| 20:28.46 | VRe | timeless: irssi? Something wrong? |
| 20:28.48 | juh0 | does n800 os2008's map application support bluetooth gps receiver? |
| 20:28.49 | czr | disq, depends on the file in question really. some support dnotify(), most don't |
| 20:29.03 | pauliukas | Sorry. Too lazy to actually write down the error |
| 20:29.06 | pauliukas | http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/8871/photo82bl1.jpg |
| 20:29.07 | czr | disq, i.e., depends on whether the driver producing the file actually signals the kernel with changes or not. |
| 20:29.12 | timeless | <VRe:#maemo> VRe: I was thinking dumping the 800 to gf and getting myself the |
| 20:29.18 | disq | i think so. dnotify. i'll look that up thanks |
| 20:29.31 | czr | disq, might be inotify too. I always confuse the two :-) |
| 20:29.35 | pauliukas | Is that something known or do I now officially need to nuke and pave? |
| 20:29.39 | czr | one is older syscall, one is pretty new |
| 20:29.39 | timeless | file; ? |
| 20:29.44 | disq | yes it's inotify |
| 20:30.02 | VRe | timeless: probably some wtf8 crap cut the sentence down |
| 20:30.16 | timeless | vre: file: should always work |
| 20:30.30 | czr | disq, what are you trying to monitor? |
| 20:31.01 | timeless | disq: so um... what's my status, do i take what i have or should i try to do something else? |
| 20:31.03 | disq | headphone jack |
| 20:31.04 | _Monkey | headphone jack is 4 pins actually, one of them is mic. |
| 20:31.07 | timeless | bump the font size? |
| 20:31.12 | disq | _Monkey: ooh really? |
| 20:31.13 | timeless | _monkey forget headphone jack |
| 20:31.13 | _Monkey | disq: bugger all, i dunno |
| 20:31.13 | _Monkey | timeless: I forgot headphone jack |
| 20:31.19 | timeless | _monkey headphone jack is <reply> |
| 20:31.20 | _Monkey | OK, timeless. |
| 20:31.46 | czr | disq, ah, don't know whether it's notified properly. drop me a note if it is. |
| 20:31.47 | disq | timeless: your status on what? no activity in our secret channel |
| 20:32.26 | VRe | Ok: wishlist for the next device: motions sensors ala wiimote, lightsensor(there is one?), radio, _good_ gps, normal SD slot (for that cheap and available memory), screen that is readable atleast in partial sunlite.. |
| 20:33.13 | mgedmin | one month battery life without recharging... |
| 20:33.17 | VRe | But I think the design-guru & hw-team has already cooked up the next device.. |
| 20:33.21 | mgedmin | built-in coffee machine... |
| 20:33.30 | VRe | mgedmin: sounds like emacs |
| 20:33.46 | timeless | in practice it seems the hardware designers design 2-5 devices in the future, refusing to ever talk to anyone to get feedback |
| 20:33.49 | mgedmin | I wouldn't know, I use vim :-) |
| 20:33.54 | Lariso | so with a menu shell script: i write a shell script, that runs fine from command line with "sh /root/vpn.sh" |
| 20:34.06 | Lariso | what do i put as command in .desktop file to run this? |
| 20:34.21 | VRe | timeless: I have noticed that before too.. that ought to be changed |
| 20:34.45 | timeless | there are lots of things that should be changed |
| 20:35.24 | timeless | vre: i think you'll find just about everything i'm describing is much less than ideal |
| 20:35.30 | VRe | we'll that is just a sign that there is more paychecks coming down in the future.. =) |
| 20:35.47 | timeless | heh, you're a glass is half full guy |
| 20:36.03 | Lariso | oh ffs |
| 20:36.11 | Lariso | i just noticed the top of my script.. #!/bin/bash |
| 20:36.24 | timeless | oh, that'll work well on our devices :) |
| 20:36.47 | pauliukas | Alright guys. |
| 20:36.58 | VRe | timeless: I think the software will start to rock sooner than later - now the same teachings should be applied to other areas aswell |
| 20:37.00 | pauliukas | How can I install OS 2007/8/whatever hacker/cracker edition? |
| 20:37.43 | timeless | the sofware processes still need a lot of work, but yes, we'd love to see useful innovation wrt hardware design |
| 20:38.16 | mgedmin | google results for os2007he don't seem to point to the official page |
| 20:38.20 | *** join/#maemo Sho_ (i=ehs1@kde/hein) |
| 20:38.21 | *** join/#maemo m-vo (i=mvo@cs178034.pp.htv.fi) |
| 20:38.43 | VRe | I was thinking that the 3rd device could be worth actually buying when I saw 770 - got that more or less right. 3rd gen is usually where the device starts to be stable enough for massmarket |
| 20:39.08 | Tak | anybody using xchat plugins on the device? |
| 20:39.45 | *** join/#maemo dolske (n=dolske@corp-241.mountainview.mozilla.com) |
| 20:39.52 | Lariso | ok even with #!/bin/bash fixed the ui does nothing when i click |
| 20:40.15 | Lariso | i assume i'm able to just run a shell script as a command just like a compiled app would |
| 20:40.21 | VRe | btw, is the date/time dialog/elements as hard to use still with the new maemo as with old (just check gpe..) |
| 20:40.26 | czr | Lariso, you launching it with just the script name or with multiple parts with spaces in between? |
| 20:40.33 | Lariso | just the script name |
| 20:40.34 | czr | at least back in 770 days, the desktop file didn't support spaces |
| 20:40.38 | Lariso | hmm |
| 20:40.41 | czr | no sh in front of it? |
| 20:40.46 | Tak | ah, plugin support is disabled :-( |
| 20:40.46 | Lariso | no |
| 20:40.48 | mgedmin | Lariso: is the .sh file executable? |
| 20:41.01 | Lariso | Exec=/usr/local/bin/vpn3.sh |
| 20:41.07 | Lariso | and yeah, 755 i think |
| 20:41.40 | czr | hmm. add some echos into some file in /tmp/ to see whether the script is run at all |
| 20:41.45 | VRe | czr: and everything had to be installed under some obscure subdirectory.. |
| 20:42.06 | czr | VRe, /var/install infact. was trying to find out the proper new directory to install just today ;-) |
| 20:42.36 | czr | kind of funny how none of the maemo.org docs actually mentions anything about the proper directiories to install into now. |
| 20:42.47 | VRe | czr: you have been away long.. |
| 20:43.04 | czr | VRe, yes. I tried to get out, and each time they keep on pulling me back in. |
| 20:43.21 | VRe | czr: it's debian defaults.. ./configure --prefix=/usr |
| 20:43.28 | czr | VRe, well. I know now. |
| 20:43.30 | *** join/#maemo pdz- (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 20:44.02 | Lariso | does a service need to be restarted whenever i change a desktop file or will it take effect immediately |
| 20:44.06 | t_s_o | hmm, maybe i should just regard my wsod 770 as a expensive paper weight and look for a price drop on the N800 now that the N810 is out? |
| 20:44.29 | VRe | The new menu seems to be quite big by looking the pics, I hope it'll handle nice those 40 programs I have installed so I don't need to scroll around |
| 20:44.32 | czr | btw, any nokians want to hint what should I call the application installer component in bora? Application Installer, Application Manager, or Application manager? the docs are contradictory |
| 20:44.36 | mgedmin | the n810 won't be sold before november, but otoh there already was a n800 price drop |
| 20:44.44 | timeless | eh? |
| 20:44.49 | timeless | Application manager |
| 20:44.50 | _Monkey | well, Application manager is maemo's GUI over apt |
| 20:45.03 | timeless | but what do you mean call? |
| 20:45.09 | czr | refer to. in text. |
| 20:45.26 | timeless | exactly as i wrote |
| 20:45.30 | timeless | note the lowercase m |
| 20:45.36 | czr | I did note :-) |
| 20:45.37 | t_s_o | well i have yet to see the local web shops that carry the N800 display any kind of price drop... |
| 20:45.39 | czr | thanks |
| 20:45.42 | timeless | and i blame roope and the rest of Nokia style for the insane spelling/case |
| 20:45.54 | czr | timeless, there are still some docs which use Application Installer too. |
| 20:45.59 | czr | 3.2 ones. |
| 20:46.01 | timeless | czr: file bugs |
| 20:46.17 | timeless | (seriously) |
| 20:46.24 | timeless | i mean, there's no harm |
| 20:46.33 | timeless | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=400000 |
| 20:46.38 | czr | I'm collecting a list of stuff in the various docs and will submit that.. via.. other channels. detest using bugzilla for each small bug |
| 20:46.42 | timeless | sure it's a dupe, not my fault, that's life |
| 20:47.16 | czr | nice number :-) |
| 20:47.22 | timeless | thanks :) |
| 20:47.25 | Lariso | ooh it is running the script |
| 20:47.46 | timeless | i was supposed to be 399998, i messed up the math and the bug i wanted was 400002 :( |
| 20:47.48 | Lariso | "/tmp/foobar" exists |
| 20:47.52 | pauliukas | "The same way it works in 2007, it integrates with the system /usr/bin/browser, you can still switch back to Opera (8.0 in the case of 2006, instead of 8.5 on 2007) at any time." How? |
| 20:48.08 | czr | timeless, 400k is so much more.. convenient to remember :-) |
| 20:48.15 | timeless | pauliukas: when it works, there's a set engine menu |
| 20:48.24 | timeless | when it doesn't work, you can edit ~/.browser and fix hidden=1 |
| 20:48.31 | timeless | and then run the browser to see the menu |
| 20:48.35 | pauliukas | See, that's the problem it doesn't |
| 20:48.38 | timeless | (won't do anything useful if you use os2008) |
| 20:48.40 | pauliukas | And I uninstalled it. |
| 20:48.40 | *** join/#maemo roxfan (n=dunno@134.215-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 20:48.51 | timeless | quit the browser |
| 20:48.55 | pauliukas | okay. |
| 20:49.00 | timeless | pull out sed/perl, fix ~/.browser to have hidden=1 |
| 20:49.07 | timeless | install microb again |
| 20:49.18 | timeless | the logic behind that magic is beyond me |
| 20:49.25 | pauliukas | But it will probably give me the same error. |
| 20:49.25 | czr | wouldn't even. |
| 20:49.29 | pauliukas | http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/8871/photo82bl1.jpg |
| 20:49.41 | *** join/#maemo juergbi (n=juerg@80-219-21-79.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:50.06 | Lariso | it works!! :D |
| 20:50.13 | czr | Lariso, yay |
| 20:50.18 | timeless | pauliukas: load "about:" |
| 20:50.21 | timeless | what does it say? |
| 20:50.31 | Lariso | i think it needed to run itself as root |
| 20:50.31 | pauliukas | Two seconds. Reinstalling it right now as you recommended. |
| 20:51.10 | Lariso | so now i can browse my upnp server from remote vpn |
| 20:52.07 | Lariso | now if i could only get my video transcoder working properly.. |
| 20:53.56 | timeless | czr: post a patch? |
| 20:54.13 | czr | you serious? :-) |
| 20:54.27 | czr | it's a 3 character fix :-) |
| 20:54.46 | timeless | czr: typos happen |
| 20:55.01 | timeless | patches are unambiguous |
| 20:55.09 | czr | well, it's not going to be fixed for chinook |
| 20:55.12 | *** join/#maemo thejapanesegeek (i=3f5697f6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-1eaf3f5e9b9403f6) |
| 20:55.12 | czr | that much I know |
| 20:55.16 | m-vo | czr, it will probably take you more text to describe the change than the patch will take. |
| 20:55.16 | timeless | plus, people should learn o query for patches |
| 20:55.32 | timeless | (and to post them) |
| 20:55.59 | timeless | heh |
| 20:56.02 | timeless | hi sp3000 |
| 20:56.07 | m-vo | czr, what's it about, AppLiCation ManAger naming? |
| 20:56.18 | czr | m-vo, run-standalone.sh bug |
| 20:56.55 | m-vo | Oh, right, I just looked at it. The mere existence of run-standalone.sh is a bug. |
| 20:57.32 | czr | one could extend that thought to cover a lot of other stuff as well.. |
| 20:57.39 | pauliukas | timeless: The error is looping non-stop. |
| 20:57.44 | pauliukas | No way to enter in aboit: |
| 20:57.45 | pauliukas | *about |
| 20:57.54 | timeless | pauliukas: kill -9 browser |
| 20:57.57 | timeless | open a terminal |
| 20:58.04 | timeless | /usr/bin/browser --url=about: |
| 20:58.08 | pauliukas | let me SSH in. |
| 20:58.09 | pauliukas | 2 sec. |
| 20:58.10 | timeless | /usr/bin/browser --url=about: --engine=microb |
| 20:58.16 | timeless | /usr/bin/browser --url=about: --engine=opera |
| 20:58.46 | pauliukas | Okay... |
| 20:58.49 | pauliukas | It loaded the about page. |
| 20:59.00 | pauliukas | What am I looking in it? |
| 20:59.53 | timeless | i dunno, is it opera or microb? :) |
| 20:59.53 | pauliukas | Didn't the about thing specify the engine? |
| 20:59.53 | timeless | about: doesn't |
| 20:59.53 | pauliukas | oh I see. |
| 20:59.53 | timeless | --engine does, i don't know which you used |
| 20:59.53 | pauliukas | MicroB. |
| 20:59.53 | _Monkey | microb is the nokia sponsored gtk2-cairo hack of gecko for use by /usr/bin/browser via eal on n800 (4.2007) |
| 21:00.08 | timeless | ignore _monkey, that's a reasonable response |
| 21:00.32 | pauliukas | oh this is funny. |
| 21:00.36 | pauliukas | It works nicely as root. |
| 21:00.40 | timeless | ok, open settings and check your homepage? |
| 21:00.41 | pauliukas | So probably a permissions problem? |
| 21:00.48 | timeless | could be |
| 21:01.15 | pauliukas | How can I set the default engine to Opera? |
| 21:01.25 | timeless | app menu>set engine |
| 21:01.44 | pauliukas | neat |
| 21:02.07 | pauliukas | ah. good old' opera. |
| 21:02.19 | timeless | i'd like to know what's wrong w/ microb |
| 21:02.30 | timeless | please let me know when you have time to investigate |
| 21:02.55 | *** join/#maemo pdz (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 21:03.13 | pauliukas | Well, how could I help you? |
| 21:03.18 | r2d2rogers | pauliukas, timeless talking aboutthe repeating error alert when it can't get toe a page for example? |
| 21:03.28 | timeless | yes |
| 21:03.34 | r2d2rogers | I see that also |
| 21:03.39 | timeless | cd /usr/lib/micro* |
| 21:03.46 | r2d2rogers | 770, latest 2006 |
| 21:03.49 | timeless | find . -type f|xargs ls -l |
| 21:03.52 | pauliukas | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:04.06 | pauliukas | timeless: Want me to pastebin that or what? |
| 21:04.07 | timeless | does the output seem reasonable? |
| 21:04.11 | timeless | sure |
| 21:04.14 | pauliukas | all owned by root |
| 21:04.19 | timeless | readable? |
| 21:04.27 | timeless | ownership is expected |
| 21:04.27 | pauliukas | yeah. |
| 21:04.35 | timeless | if files aren't readable, that's a problem |
| 21:04.39 | r2d2rogers | big chunk scrolled.. |
| 21:04.46 | pauliukas | -rw-r--r-- |
| 21:04.47 | timeless | use > /tmp/something |
| 21:04.49 | pauliukas | That's readable, right? |
| 21:04.52 | timeless | yes |
| 21:05.10 | pauliukas | All files look about the same: -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 11972 Aug 10 16:51 ./libplc4.so |
| 21:05.20 | timeless | in microb (you can use --engine=microb --url=about:) try entering: |
| 21:05.20 | timeless | / |
| 21:05.27 | timeless | as the entire url and pressing enter/go |
| 21:05.31 | timeless | does it load? |
| 21:05.35 | r2d2rogers | all was readable in my scroll buffer |
| 21:06.06 | pauliukas | This is very weird. |
| 21:06.13 | onion | should microb work in 2007HE ? |
| 21:06.16 | r2d2rogers | yes |
| 21:06.16 | timeless | no |
| 21:06.17 | pauliukas | I now set Mozilla as the engine and it worked fine as non-root. |
| 21:06.20 | r2d2rogers | index of file:/// |
| 21:06.26 | timeless | well, rather, no idea if it works in 2007he |
| 21:06.37 | timeless | someone wanted me to post an annoucement of a specially made version for 2007he |
| 21:06.40 | r2d2rogers | was working fairly well for me last week |
| 21:06.40 | pauliukas | Maybe executing under root made it fix the permissions |
| 21:06.41 | pauliukas | ? |
| 21:06.42 | timeless | which to me seemed both pointless |
| 21:06.44 | timeless | and problematic |
| 21:06.57 | timeless | since it actually had obvious bugs when i tested it |
| 21:06.58 | *** join/#maemo Mickken (n=nils@blfd-4db54809.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 21:07.21 | timeless | anyway, if the normal microb for 2007 works on 2007he, it'd be nice to know |
| 21:07.25 | timeless | i'd love to kill the project |
| 21:07.26 | onion | gives "internal error" |
| 21:07.31 | timeless | ok :) |
| 21:07.44 | r2d2rogers | I only see the popup alert in cases where it can't get to the page |
| 21:07.47 | timeless | if you want, ii have a repo url for a repo w/ a port for 2007he |
| 21:07.48 | pauliukas | Actually, the speed isn't too bad. |
| 21:07.55 | timeless | r2d2: yeah yeah, hold on |
| 21:07.59 | *** join/#maemo thejapanesegeek (i=3f5697f6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-760cb7fa47513950) |
| 21:08.03 | pauliukas | If this doesn't crash like Opera does, I'll be a happy camper. |
| 21:08.07 | onion | that would be nice |
| 21:08.15 | r2d2rogers | timeless, I think I was using the 2006 version of mircob in the 2007 HE |
| 21:08.22 | timeless | can you guys try clicking in turn |
| 21:08.33 | r2d2rogers | no rush |
| 21:08.35 | pauliukas | clicking in turn? |
| 21:08.36 | timeless | usr, lib, microb-engine, chrome, toolkit, content, global |
| 21:08.41 | r2d2rogers | yup |
| 21:08.45 | timeless | ^ one after another as they appear :) |
| 21:08.59 | timeless | sorry, typing takes time,... |
| 21:09.14 | pauliukas | Why not an absolute path instead? |
| 21:09.28 | timeless | because i want to test things piecemeal |
| 21:09.29 | pauliukas | cd /usr/lib/microb-engine/chrome/toolkit/content/global/ |
| 21:09.35 | pauliukas | oh... |
| 21:09.42 | timeless | if you're getting an error, i want to verify things step by step |
| 21:09.52 | pauliukas | I'm not getting errors anymore, heh. |
| 21:10.02 | r2d2rogers | reopening the browser... got impatient |
| 21:10.08 | czr | night -> |
| 21:10.21 | *** join/#maemo roxfan[work] (n=dunno@134.215-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 21:11.34 | czr | sp3000, I didn't thank you, did I? thanks :-) |
| 21:11.43 | sp3000 | np :) |
| 21:12.08 | r2d2rogers | timeless, got to global, no errors |
| 21:12.31 | *** join/#maemo pdz-__ (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 21:12.37 | timeless | click netError.xhtml |
| 21:13.10 | *** join/#maemo doublec (n=doublec@202.180.114.137) |
| 21:13.10 | r2d2rogers | loaded, "Cannot Complete Request" |
| 21:13.21 | timeless | that's fine |
| 21:13.24 | r2d2rogers | the normal error screeen |
| 21:13.26 | r2d2rogers | right |
| 21:13.54 | timeless | ok, try loading somethinglistawful.kahdkjsahdskjahdk |
| 21:13.57 | timeless | what happens? |
| 21:14.02 | r2d2rogers | <G> |
| 21:14.07 | r2d2rogers | did the equivilent |
| 21:14.08 | r2d2rogers | <G> |
| 21:14.11 | r2d2rogers | got the pop up |
| 21:14.15 | timeless | btw, there's an osso_screenshot_tool somewhere, sp3000 might know where |
| 21:14.27 | timeless | what *precisely* does it say? |
| 21:14.31 | timeless | is it really file; ? |
| 21:14.41 | pauliukas | Hmmm |
| 21:14.47 | r2d2rogers | "Address type is unknown or unsupported ..." give the URL to the path we just clicked peicemeail |
| 21:14.48 | pauliukas | Anyone got Flash 9 working on the 770? |
| 21:15.19 | timeless | iirc we tested it internally, it works |
| 21:15.23 | r2d2rogers | file:///usr/lib/microb-engine/chrome/toolkit/content/global/netEWrror.xhtml |
| 21:15.31 | timeless | netEW? |
| 21:15.38 | r2d2rogers | my bad |
| 21:15.50 | timeless | i don't get it |
| 21:15.52 | r2d2rogers | should have rechecked before hitting enter... not after |
| 21:15.54 | pauliukas | timeless: How about for people expternally? |
| 21:16.04 | timeless | we can't legally distribute it |
| 21:16.08 | timeless | buy an n800 |
| 21:16.10 | timeless | copy the file |
| 21:16.13 | pauliukas | Who said it has to be legal. |
| 21:16.16 | timeless | the instructions are mostly on my blog |
| 21:16.21 | timeless | minus one detail |
| 21:16.26 | timeless | the plugins dir is slightly different |
| 21:16.31 | r2d2rogers | except for the extra "W" that's it |
| 21:16.39 | timeless | it's something like /usr/bin/browser/plugins/2007/ ? |
| 21:16.58 | r2d2rogers | hmm but the ok didn't cause a repeat this time.. |
| 21:16.59 | timeless | strace would tell you if strace worked |
| 21:17.04 | r2d2rogers | it went to google for a google search |
| 21:17.19 | pauliukas | Neat. |
| 21:17.32 | pauliukas | My favorite russian cracksite has a zip for Flash9 on the 770. |
| 21:17.35 | pauliukas | With the so and instructions |
| 21:17.41 | timeless | heh |
| 21:17.47 | pauliukas | I'm just kidding. |
| 21:17.57 | r2d2rogers | timeless, the suggested nonsense pattern does cause the repeating pop up |
| 21:18.00 | timeless | instructions would havev been in russian :) |
| 21:18.08 | pauliukas | timeless: Too bad. I can read a bit of it. |
| 21:18.28 | pauliukas | Having close russian friends open up a world of possibilities. |
| 21:18.32 | pauliukas | That's all I'm going to say. |
| 21:19.16 | timeless | hrm |
| 21:19.20 | timeless | can you get strace working? |
| 21:19.32 | pauliukas | MUAHAHAHAH |
| 21:19.36 | timeless | it'd be moderately interesting to know whether or not the file is being checked |
| 21:19.38 | pauliukas | I found a forum with instructions |
| 21:19.39 | pauliukas | YES! |
| 21:19.52 | pauliukas | Yes. Download for libflash is working. |
| 21:19.54 | pauliukas | I'm in business now |
| 21:20.19 | timeless | sorry, re legal, i'm a nokian, i can't do or suggest things that aren't |
| 21:20.31 | pauliukas | I'm not asking you to. |
| 21:20.33 | timeless | and the people who make os2007he while strange are still bound by law |
| 21:20.36 | pauliukas | I just showed my joy. |
| 21:20.39 | timeless | so no flash9 |
| 21:21.00 | *** join/#maemo matt_c (n=mcroydon@137.147.45.66.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 21:21.04 | pauliukas | I'm wondering how the performance is, though. Flash 6 is pathetic on the 770. |
| 21:21.07 | timeless | but you can legally buy an n800 for 240USD and get flash9 |
| 21:21.15 | doublec | I'm having problems with the microb build instructions on the garage site - is anyone able to give me some pointers? |
| 21:21.17 | timeless | 770 had flash7 not flash6 |
| 21:21.23 | pauliukas | Yeah? Tigerdirect sold the 800 for $450 or so |
| 21:21.27 | timeless | doublec: hi |
| 21:21.29 | pauliukas | And the 770 for $150 |
| 21:21.30 | doublec | hi timeless |
| 21:21.41 | timeless | doublec: what's failing? |
| 21:22.04 | timeless | http://www.buy.com/prod/nokia-n800-internet-tablet/q/loc/101/204055141.html |
| 21:22.10 | timeless | Our Price: $239.99 |
| 21:22.11 | doublec | I'm running in scratchbox. I have the svn checked out. changed to microb-engine/microb-engine. fakeroot apt-get build-dep microb-engine gives me: |
| 21:22.11 | timeless | Shipping: FREE |
| 21:22.12 | pauliukas | I'm in Canada. |
| 21:22.16 | pauliukas | Doesn't work that easily. |
| 21:22.26 | doublec | unable to find source package for microb-engine |
| 21:22.28 | pauliukas | TigerDirect is like the only big computer stuff distributor here. |
| 21:22.32 | timeless | pauliukas: you need a friend in NY or Detroit |
| 21:22.40 | pauliukas | timeless: No, man, no... |
| 21:22.43 | pauliukas | A friend in Moscow |
| 21:22.44 | pauliukas | :-P |
| 21:22.52 | timeless | i don't think we sell in russia at all |
| 21:22.54 | pauliukas | Then you could get a stolen 800 |
| 21:22.58 | timeless | which is ... clever in its own right |
| 21:23.01 | pauliukas | Who said you sold to them? |
| 21:23.19 | pauliukas | As sad as it is, it's probably true. |
| 21:23.31 | timeless | doublec: err |
| 21:23.39 | timeless | gah |
| 21:23.44 | timeless | apt sucks |
| 21:23.52 | doublec | if I ignore that and do dpkg-buildpackage I get libidl-dev bc libcairo2-dev as missing build dependancies |
| 21:23.56 | timeless | sp3000: can you help doublec work aroudn apt being stupid |
| 21:23.57 | doublec | should I have something in my apt source? |
| 21:24.10 | timeless | doublec: libidl-dev is in the microb sources |
| 21:24.25 | suihkulokki | ..now that would be a *slow* death |
| 21:24.25 | lardman | yayayay, framebuffer access works from the dsp :) |
| 21:24.56 | timeless | doublec: |
| 21:24.57 | timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/browser/mozilla/trunk/libidl/ |
| 21:25.09 | pauliukas | lol |
| 21:25.11 | timeless | go into that directory and play w/ debian/rules |
| 21:25.16 | timeless | that'll get you libidl-dev, i hope |
| 21:25.23 | doublec | ok, thanks |
| 21:25.32 | timeless | you should have that from your checkout |
| 21:25.42 | timeless | timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test is just a cross reference |
| 21:25.50 | doublec | yes, I have it |
| 21:26.19 | suihkulokki | lardman: cool |
| 21:26.38 | timeless | bc you need to find a repository |
| 21:26.55 | m-vo | doublec, I have a 'orrible script to solve your problem. Let me dig it out. |
| 21:27.00 | doublec | thanks m-vo |
| 21:27.26 | lardman | suihkulokki: going to try piping mplayer output directly to the screen via dsp now |
| 21:28.28 | timeless | i have no idea about libcairo-dev, |
| 21:28.45 | m-vo | doublec, https://garage.maemo.org/svn/sardine/trunk/apt-installbuilddeps |
| 21:28.46 | pyhimys | damn, no new firmware yet |
| 21:28.53 | t_s_o | ok, just watched som videos and holy smokes that 2008 ui is sweet! |
| 21:29.30 | t_s_o | big, finger focued menus with big scroll arrows and all. ok, i dont care if i have to sell my soul for this one, i want it and i want it bad! |
| 21:29.42 | pauliukas | lol |
| 21:29.57 | m-vo | doublec, I was mostly guessing what your problem was. If the script confuses you, maybe I misunderstood. |
| 21:29.58 | timeless | i'll take your soul, you drive a really weak bargain |
| 21:30.02 | lopz | re |
| 21:30.09 | doublec | thanks m-vo, looking at it now |
| 21:33.48 | doublec | ok, now I need to find a repostory with flex in it |
| 21:34.14 | timeless | err |
| 21:34.19 | timeless | what wans flex? |
| 21:34.22 | doublec | libidl-dev |
| 21:34.23 | _Monkey | it has been said that libidl-dev is in the microb sources |
| 21:34.33 | timeless | oh brother |
| 21:34.39 | timeless | yeah, have fun |
| 21:34.43 | doublec | yeah, apt dependancies are fun :) |
| 21:34.51 | timeless | did i mention that apt sucks? |
| 21:34.56 | doublec | once or twice |
| 21:35.11 | timeless | it needs to be repeated :( |
| 21:35.12 | sp3000 | heh shoot the messenger |
| 21:36.22 | sp3000 | timeless: did you get response re versions to the 693 thing |
| 21:36.23 | m-vo | Heh, there are sucky parts in apt, and the whole thing reads like a prototype (which it probably is), but in general it's good. |
| 21:36.42 | timeless | was that the bugs.maemo.org bug? |
| 21:36.46 | timeless | if so, yes |
| 21:37.11 | sp3000 | I guess I have a maemo2.2 test package, not that I have anything to test such a thing with |
| 21:37.29 | m-vo | it doesn't handle broken repositories as well you might want, but then again, repositories should not be broken. |
| 21:37.38 | onion | hih. mapper almost builds under chinook |
| 21:37.49 | timeless | m-vo: shoulds are nice, they're also unrealistic |
| 21:37.53 | alterego | Crikey .. |
| 21:38.09 | alterego | I just looked at the Python API for libosso .. It's horrible. |
| 21:38.30 | m-vo | Maybe for Nokia/maemo but not for normal people. |
| 21:38.31 | sp3000 | timeless: I take it I fell out of cc then |
| 21:38.49 | timeless | sp3000: i'll have to figure out which thing you mean |
| 21:38.50 | Tak | alterego: got xchat-ruby and my plugin going on 770 ;-) |
| 21:39.00 | alterego | Tak, fancy :) |
| 21:39.05 | timeless | oh |
| 21:39.09 | timeless | no, that didn't get resolved |
| 21:39.14 | *** join/#maemo Esworp (n=user@c-68-62-205-27.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 21:39.14 | alterego | Tak, did you use one of my packages? |
| 21:39.17 | sp3000 | k |
| 21:39.19 | timeless | lemme finnish dealing w/ osol |
| 21:39.22 | timeless | finish |
| 21:39.23 | timeless | whichever |
| 21:39.24 | _Monkey | whichever is the current grouper |
| 21:39.24 | Tak | yeah, I used all of your packages |
| 21:39.32 | alterego | Cool, :) |
| 21:39.34 | timeless | _monkey forget whichever |
| 21:39.34 | _Monkey | timeless: I forgot whichever |
| 21:39.40 | timeless | _monkey whichever is <reply> |
| 21:39.41 | _Monkey | OK, timeless. |
| 21:39.46 | Tak | xchat-ruby on top of that, ruby plugin on top of that |
| 21:39.54 | alterego | Nice. |
| 21:39.57 | m-vo | I just have to go on a bit about apt suckage... |
| 21:40.07 | Esworp | monkey, ukmp |
| 21:40.21 | Esworp | monkey, ukmp? |
| 21:40.36 | m-vo | apt-get is not good at configuration management: "Give me all -dbg packages corresponding to libfoo and all its dependencies". |
| 21:40.37 | ||cw | Esworp: it's name starts with an _ |
| 21:40.56 | Esworp | oh, duh. |
| 21:41.01 | *** join/#maemo drcoffee (n=drcoffee@vp085078.reshsg.uci.edu) |
| 21:41.11 | m-vo | It is also missing the "satisfy this Depends: line" operation. |
| 21:41.12 | _Monkey | okay, m-vo. |
| 21:41.36 | Esworp | _Monkey, ukmp? |
| 21:41.36 | _Monkey | ukmp is a Media Player, available for download at http://maemo.org/downloads/product/ukmp |
| 21:41.46 | m-vo | It used to suck at removing unneeded packages, but that seems to have changed. |
| 21:42.14 | timeless | google says tha unneeded is not a word |
| 21:42.17 | timeless | i happen to agree |
| 21:42.32 | timeless | http://www.google.com/url?sa=X&oi=dict&ei=voEWR576Hqb8wwGOqayKCA&sig2=WFDaF_IvAAYAxI8INjHv0g&q=http://www.answers.com/unnecessary%26r%3D67&usg=AFQjCNFq2J-tnRZGVxjJsO9PfCxZPL_mug |
| 21:43.02 | m-vo | Heh, don't try to side-track the discussion. timeless, you are a pedant! :-) |
| 21:43.16 | timeless | i wonder if i can get a newer laptop if i can prove to BI that my t key doesn't work reliably |
| 21:43.26 | m-vo | and "tha" isn' t a word either :-P |
| 21:43.51 | timeless | m-vo: see followup. i'm one response ahead of you :( |
| 21:44.07 | m-vo | Excuses, excuses... |
| 21:44.21 | timeless | oh wierd |
| 21:44.22 | m-vo | anyway, where was I? |
| 21:44.26 | timeless | i'm seeeing a nokia add |
| 21:44.31 | timeless | from ansi vanyoki |
| 21:44.35 | timeless | s/add$/ad |
| 21:44.40 | timeless | from nokia hq in espoo |
| 21:44.56 | timeless | and please don't expect me to be able to spell his name correctly |
| 21:44.59 | Esworp | has anyone else had trouble with ossocpu? the lil cpu graph applet? |
| 21:45.02 | timeless | i don't speak Finnish |
| 21:45.10 | *** join/#maemo roxfan[work] (n=dunno@134.215-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 21:45.21 | m-vo | Then, of course, the libapt-pkg API is C++ from the 70ties. |
| 21:45.34 | Esworp | i install it, but never shows up when i turn it 'on' |
| 21:46.00 | m-vo | should be "vanjoki" I think. |
| 21:46.03 | Esworp | it worked fine before i updated |
| 21:46.33 | timeless | Anssi Vanjoki |
| 21:46.34 | drcoffee | Q - does anyone know of an easy way to adjust (or turn off) the key repeat when using BT keyboards? I have tried xset770, but to no avail. |
| 21:46.44 | timeless | they stuck his name into a graphic for a few seconds |
| 21:47.22 | timeless | Digitali Convergensi |
| 21:47.39 | timeless | sp3000: is he in our management chain? :o |
| 21:47.56 | timeless | heh, Nokia Music Store |
| 21:48.02 | timeless | they didn't translate that |
| 21:48.13 | m-vo | There is a verkkokauppa ad for Nokia phones that show that you can get your name engraved in them, and one of the names is Olli-Pekka. |
| 21:48.18 | Esworp | _Monkey, media player? |
| 21:48.19 | _Monkey | esworp: wish i knew |
| 21:48.39 | timeless | m-vo: Olli and Pekka both seem to be fairly common |
| 21:48.46 | timeless | is that interesting? |
| 21:49.12 | timeless | which reminds me, i need to publish a comment into a bug :( |
| 21:49.12 | m-vo | Olli-Pekka Kallasvuo, the Nokia CEO. |
| 21:49.14 | sp3000 | timeless: what this guy? http://www.nokia.com/A4126347 |
| 21:49.23 | timeless | sp3000: he's on tv now |
| 21:49.34 | timeless | mtv3 |
| 21:49.39 | timeless | um |
| 21:49.42 | timeless | i can't reach nokia.com |
| 21:49.47 | timeless | because nokia *fscks* w/ dns |
| 21:49.52 | timeless | anyone have a mirror? :) |
| 21:50.00 | timeless | he's blond :) |
| 21:50.04 | alterego | Heh |
| 21:50.19 | timeless | oh good |
| 21:50.23 | timeless | there's someone speaking English |
| 21:50.43 | *** join/#maemo Thanatermesis (n=Enlighte@unaffiliated/thanatermesis) |
| 21:50.49 | timeless | oh god |
| 21:50.51 | Thanatermesis | mierda conexion... |
| 21:50.55 | timeless | they're using Holocaus imagery |
| 21:51.06 | timeless | i need a keyboard where the t key works |
| 21:51.19 | timeless | oh no |
| 21:51.20 | timeless | 42 |
| 21:51.31 | Esworp | lookd like it does. :P |
| 21:51.33 | timeless | they just claimed that they have a solution, so they just need to find the problem |
| 21:52.09 | timeless | sp3000: got a tv, or did you decide against paying the tv license? |
| 21:52.16 | timeless | s/the/for the/ |
| 21:52.24 | timeless | good bot |
| 21:52.34 | sp3000 | I have one |
| 21:52.42 | timeless | turn on mtv3, he's on now |
| 21:52.49 | sp3000 | indeed |
| 21:54.13 | *** join/#maemo Tb0n3 (n=Tb0n3@pool-141-149-17-97.alb.east.verizon.net) |
| 21:54.22 | Tb0n3 | well |
| 21:54.23 | Tb0n3 | http://www.internettablettalk.com/2007/10/17/the-nokia-n810-internet-tablet/ |
| 21:54.26 | Tb0n3 | :D |
| 21:55.31 | timeless | err, they showed off the swedish keylayout? |
| 21:55.34 | timeless | why? |
| 21:55.43 | timeless | => sp3000 |
| 21:55.48 | timeless | http://www.internettablettalk.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/004.jpg |
| 21:55.52 | Mikho | swedish? |
| 21:55.58 | sp3000 | shruggery |
| 21:56.04 | timeless | it's not English |
| 21:56.12 | timeless | I'm assuming it isn't Finnish |
| 21:56.19 | Mikho | looks finnish enough to me |
| 21:56.21 | sp3000 | probably the same |
| 21:56.21 | timeless | unless ao is really tha important |
| 21:56.42 | roope | it's finnish. |
| 21:56.57 | m-vo | but not the end! |
| 21:57.01 | timeless | it's the same layout |
| 21:57.19 | timeless | but why would you show off either? |
| 21:57.29 | timeless | this was a launch in sf.ca.us., no? |
| 21:57.29 | *** join/#maemo roxfan (n=dunno@134.215-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 21:57.35 | sp3000 | it's för metäl döts! |
| 21:57.45 | sp3000 | \m/. |
| 21:58.00 | timeless | sp3000: and for those of us unicode challenged? |
| 21:58.20 | sp3000 | it's for metal dots. |
| 21:58.22 | roope | perhaps it is promoting the fact that also other languages than eng work. :) |
| 21:58.31 | timeless | they do? |
| 21:58.35 | timeless | last i checked they didn't :) |
| 21:58.42 | sp3000 | aka http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_umlaut |
| 21:58.45 | roope | well yes, they do. |
| 21:58.52 | timeless | certainly, if you come to the US w/ the Map(*cough*) applet, you'll have a real hard time |
| 21:59.00 | timeless | given that you won't be able to get it to speak to you in Miles |
| 21:59.26 | timeless | it seems we paid extra to make sure you couldn't use Miles if you visited the US and didn't speak English |
| 21:59.53 | roope | The metric system rules the world anyway. |
| 22:00.10 | timeless | because French speaking Canadians, Spanish speaking Mexicans, and German/Russian speakers would never want to visit the US |
| 22:00.12 | *** join/#maemo guardian_ (n=Guardian@ANantes-252-1-15-138.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 22:00.46 | roope | Royale with Cheese. -> |
| 22:01.05 | timeless | eh? |
| 22:04.10 | doublec | the 810 looks nice. what are the chances of it being available in australia/new zealand |
| 22:04.19 | timeless | doublec: nill |
| 22:04.30 | doublec | I guessed :) |
| 22:04.31 | timeless | pick it up the next time you visit stateside |
| 22:04.38 | timeless | doublec: we pay to localize in Russian |
| 22:04.41 | timeless | but we don't sell in Russia |
| 22:04.44 | doublec | hehe |
| 22:04.53 | timeless | we don't pay to localize for Ausies/Kiwis |
| 22:05.21 | ||cw | does AU even need localisation? |
| 22:05.38 | ||cw | other than timezone... |
| 22:06.26 | ||cw | what symbol does AU use for their dollar? |
| 22:06.50 | timeless | technically word choice in Australia is a mix between US and GB |
| 22:06.53 | lardman | $ |
| 22:06.53 | jumpula | they have to have words like outback etc |
| 22:07.01 | timeless | so arguably you should try to get words right |
| 22:07.03 | lardman | arvo = afternoon |
| 22:07.29 | lardman | I'm quite sure the australians can understand English though |
| 22:07.29 | jumpula | arvo in finnish means value :) |
| 22:07.37 | timeless | otoh, we can't get the words right for US or GB |
| 22:07.38 | ||cw | timeless: what kind of words are we talking about? |
| 22:07.43 | timeless | so why start w/ Australia? |
| 22:08.09 | timeless | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_and_British_English_spelling_differences |
| 22:08.19 | ||cw | for most apps, the only difference between US and GB is the symbol for money |
| 22:08.26 | timeless | search for Austral in that article |
| 22:08.30 | sp3000 | timeless: maybe one of them would just match by au by accident :P |
| 22:08.34 | timeless | ||cw: not on our device |
| 22:08.36 | *** join/#maemo _Monkey (n=_Monkey@dsl-217-155-26-150.zen.co.uk) |
| 22:08.37 | sp3000 | s/by // |
| 22:08.42 | lardman | spelling things with a z and without a u are very annoying though |
| 22:08.58 | timeless | lardman: or the reverse |
| 22:09.03 | timeless | thankfully we have a solution |
| 22:09.15 | timeless | our map app says catalog should be spelled w/o the ue for GB |
| 22:09.20 | lardman | everyone learn Finnish? |
| 22:09.24 | timeless | because consistency is taboo |
| 22:09.31 | timeless | lardman: Turn to horizontal |
| 22:09.34 | timeless | Turn to vertical |
| 22:09.49 | timeless | the only good thing about Finnish is that it shows how piss poor the English was to begin with |
| 22:10.04 | Jiten_ | interesting, python2.5-hildon contains module called hildonglade that seems to do what is needed to hildonize a glade file. It's just rather light on documentation. |
| 22:10.24 | timeless | jiten_: people are trying to use glade heavily for the future |
| 22:10.34 | timeless | which is a good thing, because the gtk C code i've seen is awful |
| 22:10.45 | ||cw | ok, so if US and GB aren't consistent, why worry about AU? most poeple have no problem with alternate spellings and are not confused |
| 22:10.47 | timeless | sp3000: if the image is horizontal, do nothing |
| 22:10.58 | timeless | if the image is vertical, do the wrong thing |
| 22:11.04 | ||cw | seems like a silly reason not to sell the device in that country |
| 22:11.21 | timeless | ||cw: having paid to localize it for Russian |
| 22:11.28 | Jiten_ | I'm building a new gui (porting qt application) and building the gtk structure in code gets old rather fast so I started looking again. |
| 22:11.29 | timeless | doesn't it seem sillier not to sell it in Russia? |
| 22:11.40 | ||cw | there are lots of non-russians that speak russian |
| 22:11.57 | timeless | ||cw: i think there are more Russian speakers in Russia than there are... |
| 22:12.05 | ||cw | russia is an oddball country, AU is not very different from US and GB |
| 22:12.06 | timeless | russian speakers elsewhere who would buy teh device |
| 22:12.10 | ||cw | economy wise |
| 22:12.13 | Jiten_ | Well, at least there is the source. |
| 22:12.19 | timeless | s/teh/the/ |
| 22:12.20 | Jiten_ | maybe I'll figure out how to use that |
| 22:12.56 | ||cw | selling products in russia, or in any country for that matter, is more of the political matter |
| 22:13.13 | timeless | if by politics you mean internal corporate, sure |
| 22:13.28 | *** join/#maemo x2 (n=n00b@pool-71-173-116-132.lyncva.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:13.35 | x2 | hey guys |
| 22:13.36 | ||cw | as well as free market politics |
| 22:13.47 | ||cw | it's hard for a non-russian company to sell stuff in russia |
| 22:13.50 | timeless | i'm fairly cerain that doesn't enter it |
| 22:13.54 | x2 | oh the 770, how do you get teh software kb to some back after using a bt kb? |
| 22:14.10 | x2 | im using the os2007 port now and thi sis the only thing bothering me so far |
| 22:14.12 | timeless | turning off bluetooth doesn't work? |
| 22:14.17 | x2 | no |
| 22:14.23 | x2 | it makes no sense :/ |
| 22:14.26 | timeless | www.nokia.com/NOKIA_COM_1/About_Nokia/Press/Press_Events/zz_New_Potential/Russia_backgrounder.pd |
| 22:14.27 | timeless | f |
| 22:14.45 | x2 | I dont have it connected and the software one still wont come up |
| 22:15.05 | timeless | Nokia Phones Go on the Back Shelf - Kommersant Moscow |
| 22:15.05 | timeless | Euroset management has ordered Nokia phones to be sold as cheaply as ... the dispute with Euroset may cost Nokia its leading position on the Russian market. |
| 22:15.06 | timeless | www.kommersant.com/p699966/r_1/Nokia_Phones_Go_on_the_Back_Shelf/ |
| 22:15.13 | timeless | seems fairly clear that Nokia sells in Russia |
| 22:15.20 | timeless | although, perhaps not at the price point they want :) |
| 22:16.01 | *** join/#maemo roxfan[work] (n=dunno@134.215-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 22:17.35 | x2 | any ideas> |
| 22:17.35 | *** join/#maemo playya (n=playya@p508B2A50.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:17.36 | x2 | http://maemo.org/community/wiki/os2007on770/ |
| 22:17.40 | x2 | tahts what I have installed currently |
| 22:17.43 | SLi | I've been thinking maybe I should try to write a better sw keyboard, IMO using qwerty in tap screen is just horrible. Perhaps something like one hand dvorak, I don't know yet. |
| 22:17.58 | x2 | hrm |
| 22:18.32 | Mikho | probably not worth the effort, unless you know dvorak already |
| 22:18.53 | SLi | Mikho, I know dvorak already, though not the one hand variant :P |
| 22:19.26 | SLi | Mikho, but I think putting letters used commonly together next to each other would make the sw keyb a lot more usable. |
| 22:19.55 | Mikho | ah, a live dvorak writer! |
| 22:20.11 | Mikho | yes, but unfortuately it's pretty language dependent |
| 22:20.14 | SLi | It took maybe 2 weeks to get used, now I use it regularly. |
| 22:20.14 | x2 | SLi, do you know how to bring up the software keyboard once its gone? |
| 22:20.17 | SLi | Yeah. |
| 22:20.31 | SLi | x2, what? Gone? |
| 22:20.45 | x2 | When i click in a text field, it will not come up |
| 22:20.59 | x2 | This is asfter using a bt keyboard |
| 22:21.17 | x2 | i tried disabling bt and removing the hardware keyboard and got nowhere |
| 22:21.28 | SLi | Hm. Don't know about that. |
| 22:21.41 | x2 | :( |
| 22:21.54 | x2 | using the hacker edition on the 770 |
| 22:22.09 | SLi | Mikho, well, I'm a Finn, I write mostly Finnish and English with a slightly finnishized dvorak (mostly just adding åäö). If anyone's interested, I haven't found dvorak at least much faster than qwerty, but it's somehow a lot more comfortable for my wrists. |
| 22:22.27 | x2 | hmm |
| 22:22.46 | x2 | guess im screwed? |
| 22:22.47 | x2 | lol |
| 22:22.52 | SLi | Interesting problem. :P |
| 22:22.58 | x2 | i cant put 2006 on my mmc in 30 mins |
| 22:23.00 | x2 | = screwed |
| 22:23.01 | x2 | lol |
| 22:23.06 | disq | i'm looking for an easy way to use dnotify from python. inotify somehow doesn't work |
| 22:23.45 | Mikho | well looks like it has most of the vowels on the center row on thel left |
| 22:23.51 | SLi | Yes. |
| 22:24.59 | Mikho | the finnish layout is actually pretty annoying sometimes |
| 22:25.12 | timeless | heh |
| 22:25.20 | SLi | You mean qwerty-fi or some variant of dvorak-fi? |
| 22:25.23 | x2 | is there a firmware list on maemo? |
| 22:25.25 | Mikho | it's hard to type ~, @, \ and ^ |
| 22:25.29 | timeless | x2: eh? |
| 22:25.42 | Mikho | on normal qwerty |
| 22:25.51 | x2 | like a list |
| 22:26.01 | timeless | http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/index.xml |
| 22:26.01 | x2 | os06, hacker edition |
| 22:26.04 | x2 | are there more? |
| 22:26.11 | timeless | x2: Would you give an approximate mapping? |
| 22:26.18 | timeless | scroll there |
| 22:26.22 | SLi | The most annoying thing with dvorak-fi (or actually dvorak-se) is that they've changed it in X at least twice while I've been using it :P Now I use the latest dvorak-fi (it didn't change that much) and have an xmodmap file for all other environments I need to use to get the same layout. |
| 22:26.27 | timeless | that's the list i had at the time |
| 22:26.51 | x2 | thanks :) |
| 22:26.56 | SLi | Mikho, yeah, that's true. Dvorak doesn't help that... |
| 22:27.07 | timeless | from my perspective, he doesn't count |
| 22:27.18 | timeless | it's supposed to be equivalent to other os's |
| 22:27.36 | SLi | I guess one-hand dvorak wouldn't be a perfect keyboard for touch screens either. |
| 22:27.45 | *** join/#maemo dockane (n=dockane@f049005205.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:27.46 | timeless | there's one image past the last 3.x i listed, but it's just a single kernel fix |
| 22:28.10 | x2 | ok |
| 22:28.26 | x2 | so, basically |
| 22:28.27 | Mikho | maybe I'll hack my keyboard handlers to type ^ and ~ with a single keypress |
| 22:28.31 | x2 | I have to run 06 on my 770 |
| 22:28.34 | x2 | or 07 hackers |
| 22:28.42 | timeless | or 05 |
| 22:28.50 | x2 | yea but bleh |
| 22:28.52 | timeless | there will be an 08 for n800 |
| 22:29.01 | x2 | argg |
| 22:29.02 | SLi | Another idea I've been playing with is teaching my n800 the original palm graffitis (which seem to usually work much better than normal letters, but the stupid system let someone patent using just one stroke for letters so nobody else uses that). |
| 22:29.12 | timeless | and the 770 backport of 2007 is being run on garage |
| 22:29.12 | x2 | I need to find out how to get my software keyboard back |
| 22:29.16 | x2 | I like hackers |
| 22:29.16 | timeless | they may do whatever they like |
| 22:29.27 | x2 | does anyone here use a mmc to boot off? |
| 22:29.29 | x2 | faster? |
| 22:29.31 | *** join/#maemo pdz- (n=paul@135.14.169.217.in-addr.arpa) |
| 22:29.44 | SLi | x2, no, but I doubt it's faster. |
| 22:29.50 | Jiten_ | SLi: so they can't ship something that useful with the device? |
| 22:29.52 | x2 | ah |
| 22:29.59 | x2 | it says its 2x the speed so I was just wondering |
| 22:30.00 | doublec | how often do you boot though? |
| 22:30.07 | SLi | Jiten_, yeah. |
| 22:30.12 | x2 | *overall system speed |
| 22:30.12 | doublec | so i imagine the speed hit is not a big deal |
| 22:30.17 | doublec | oh |
| 22:30.26 | timeless | doublec: i boot often |
| 22:30.32 | x2 | lol me too |
| 22:30.35 | timeless | just to show how slow boots can be |
| 22:30.35 | x2 | i do leave it on a lot though |
| 22:30.38 | doublec | haha |
| 22:30.40 | x2 | lol |
| 22:30.42 | x2 | no kidding |
| 22:30.48 | timeless | mine take well over 30s before i get the progress meter |
| 22:30.51 | timeless | and i have witnesses |
| 22:30.56 | timeless | lots of them, including sp3000 |
| 22:31.01 | timeless | and glazou |
| 22:31.02 | x2 | LOl |
| 22:31.09 | x2 | mine does too |
| 22:31.14 | x2 | hackers seems a bit slower |
| 22:31.18 | x2 | and more unstable |
| 22:31.22 | doublec | you should put a game in the bootup process to give people something to do during boot |
| 22:31.26 | x2 | ill try mmc boot tonight though |
| 22:31.31 | x2 | with it |
| 22:31.36 | x2 | lol |
| 22:31.38 | x2 | pacman! |
| 22:31.39 | _Monkey | i think pacman is even running slow |
| 22:31.44 | x2 | LOL :p |
| 22:31.47 | timeless | _monkey forget pacman |
| 22:31.48 | _Monkey | timeless: I forgot pacman |
| 22:31.52 | *** join/#maemo TimRiker (n=timr@psnet.cc) |
| 22:31.55 | timeless | _monkey pacman is <reply> |
| 22:31.55 | _Monkey | OK, timeless. |
| 22:36.31 | *** join/#maemo mallum (n=mallum@host86-151-66-134.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 22:36.33 | x2 | YES! |
| 22:36.36 | x2 | i got it back lol |
| 22:36.44 | x2 | had to connect my bluetooth kb |
| 22:36.46 | SLi | Perhaps I should start by installing a qwerty soft-kb that logs what I type so I can think about optimizing the layout. |
| 22:36.47 | x2 | then disconnect |
| 22:36.58 | x2 | lol |
| 22:37.17 | SLi | I just don't like the idea of optimizing my keyboard layout so that my password is easy to type with it :P |
| 22:37.25 | x2 | :p |
| 22:37.32 | x2 | ill be back in here on the tablet in class |
| 22:37.36 | x2 | got class at 7 :/ |
| 22:38.20 | doublec | i got libidl to build |
| 22:38.45 | doublec | I needed to follow the steps regarding flex here: http://www.scratchbox.org/wiki/Apophis-r4 |
| 22:39.36 | x2 | oh yea |
| 22:39.43 | x2 | is there any easy way to use ssl with xchat |
| 22:40.01 | x2 | I thought it was included with xchat but I dont see it listed anywhere |
| 22:40.07 | *** join/#maemo mgylfason (n=mg@194-144-27-159.du.xdsl.is) |
| 22:42.19 | alterego | x2 it's in the server editing dialog. |
| 22:42.40 | sp3000 | doublec: enjoying scratchbox eh ;) |
| 22:42.50 | doublec | oh yeah, having lots of fun :) |
| 22:42.59 | x2 | i cant scroll that down though |
| 22:43.05 | x2 | no scroll bar lol |
| 22:43.17 | x2 | i tabbed through it last time |
| 22:43.28 | alterego | :/ |
| 22:46.56 | *** join/#maemo lmoura (n=lauro@189.13.179.30) |
| 22:55.14 | doublec | when hacking on the microb source, do you build/test in scratchbox all the time or in the host linux? |
| 22:56.01 | timeless | mixed |
| 22:56.55 | alterego | Only one SD slot?!?! |
| 22:57.06 | alterego | And it's min!??! |
| 22:57.12 | alterego | >:( |
| 22:58.26 | Jiten_ | is there a point to using miniSD when you could use microSD? |
| 22:58.51 | alterego | That's not the point. I would have expected dual ful SD/MMC slots like the N800 |
| 22:59.00 | Mikho | microsds are easier to misplace |
| 23:00.26 | Jiten_ | Mikho: true, but you could fit 2 slots in the place of one miniSD... at least I'd think so. |
| 23:00.28 | *** join/#maemo Atarii (n=Atarii@unaffiliated/atarii) |
| 23:00.43 | alterego | Oh, it does take SD cards .. |
| 23:00.49 | alterego | Stoopid thoughtfix. |
| 23:01.38 | doublec | what only has one SD slot? |
| 23:01.40 | alterego | Appearantly the sales package doesn't include a complimentary memory card :) |
| 23:01.56 | alterego | I dunno, the spec is somewhat beta. |
| 23:02.19 | |R | seeing the inside, it seemed like the internal SD was plated over with metal.. |
| 23:02.32 | alterego | Having dual memory slots is one of the greatest things abouyt the N800 |
| 23:02.43 | alterego | Seems silly that they'd remove that capability. |
| 23:03.17 | alterego | Maybe that has something to do with the (Up to 2GB internal memory) |
| 23:03.33 | alterego | I heard something about a memory upgrade next year. That's probably it. |
| 23:03.43 | Jiten_ | that 2GB is most likely in that internal SD slot that's plated over. |
| 23:04.01 | alterego | Interesting .. |
| 23:05.04 | Jiten_ | well, at least you won't have to buy expansion to do much of anything with it. |
| 23:05.23 | *** join/#maemo ruda (n=ruda@189.32.76.13) |
| 23:05.31 | Jiten_ | aside from music and videos, 2GB actually is something :) |
| 23:05.43 | Jiten_ | my n800 only has that much currently. |
| 23:05.46 | alterego | Well, I've only got 2GB cards. |
| 23:05.52 | alterego | I have 2x 2GB in my N800 |
| 23:05.56 | alterego | Suits me perfectly .. |
| 23:06.15 | *** join/#maemo snowmoon (n=ew2193@cpe-74-70-152-0.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 23:07.41 | |R | same here, 256MB internal with OS, 128 miniSD on the outside and 2GB microSD inside... basically 2GB if rounded :P |
| 23:08.00 | alterego | I don't use the MiniSD. |
| 23:08.07 | alterego | Just the 2x 2GB SD's I have. |
| 23:08.47 | alterego | Maybe with sshfs I could use the N800 as a second storage device ;) |
| 23:09.22 | |R | haha |
| 23:09.26 | |R | over pand |
| 23:09.40 | alterego | :) |
| 23:09.54 | |R | actually, you could share the gpsd over pand and use maemo mapper on the n800 |
| 23:10.00 | alterego | Well, it has ObexFTP :) |
| 23:10.01 | |R | (while you wait for it to be ported over ;) |
| 23:10.20 | alterego | Clever |
| 23:10.28 | |R | hehe |
| 23:10.37 | |R | not very practical, but hey :) |
| 23:10.59 | |R | http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=1603061298&size=o |
| 23:10.59 | alterego | Life wouldn't be fun if everything was practical :P |
| 23:11.02 | |R | this is not fair :P |
| 23:11.28 | |R | haha |
| 23:14.31 | |R | i just flashed my device and can't remember where/how to activate a .ashrc or equivalent file for aliases...? (/me really wish we had a full bash / ls / tar etc...) |
| 23:15.06 | alterego | ;) |
| 23:15.21 | alterego | Anyhow, goodnight folks. |
| 23:15.25 | |R | hehe |
| 23:21.44 | |R | is OS2008 out for the n800 yet? |
| 23:23.14 | zerojay | It's not mid-November and the n810 isn't on sale yet. |
| 23:23.57 | lardman | interesting comment about the 2008 os upping the n800's clock speed to 400mhz too |
| 23:24.09 | zerojay | I'm not so sure about that. |
| 23:24.23 | *** join/#maemo aloisiojr (n=aloisio@189.12.70.184) |
| 23:24.32 | zerojay | I didn't get that impression when I read the linked e-mail. |
| 23:24.32 | |R | hehe :) |
| 23:29.40 | doublec | success, almost. microb-engine is now building |
| 23:30.42 | *** join/#maemo Thanatermesis (n=Enlighte@unaffiliated/thanatermesis) |
| 23:35.20 | *** join/#maemo rimad (n=mkdir@user63.217-10-121.netatonce.net) |
| 23:35.31 | *** part/#maemo rimad (n=mkdir@user63.217-10-121.netatonce.net) |
| 23:39.08 | lardman | night all |
| 23:39.32 | *** part/#maemo pauliukas (n=pauliuka@bas1-montrealak-1128729850.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 23:40.13 | pupnik_ | LOL |R |
| 23:40.25 | snowmoon | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=83381&postcount=160 |
| 23:46.49 | *** join/#maemo RushPL_ (n=rush@chello089078147065.chello.pl) |
| 23:48.12 | *** join/#maemo unique311 (n=unique31@ool-457ae2a6.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 23:50.53 | pupnik_ | wb unique311 |
| 23:51.35 | unique311 | hello |
| 23:51.53 | unique311 | i feel outdated...with this new tablet all over maemo.org |
| 23:52.43 | *** join/#maemo shapr (n=shapr@c-76-18-120-222.hsd1.al.comcast.net) |
| 23:52.54 | pupnik_ | heh |
| 23:53.05 | *** join/#maemo Thana` (n=Enlighte@80.31.19.23) |
| 23:53.17 | zerojay | I like getting e-mails from Bugzilla whenever people fix something. :) |
| 23:53.54 | pupnik_ | "the micro usb is a now accepted charger standard between all manufacturers. it is the next step forward. my razr2 has it. thanks!" i did not know this |
| 23:54.04 | zerojay | Yep. |
| 23:54.05 | unique311 | so this new OS running on the n810... |
| 23:54.16 | unique311 | when will the 800 users get it? |
| 23:54.25 | zerojay | When the N810 goes on sale next month. |
| 23:54.32 | unique311 | ahh |
| 23:56.08 | pupnik_ | 'tis a happy day! |
| 23:56.17 | unique311 | pupnik...time to upgrade? |
| 23:56.23 | zerojay | Hmm. |
| 23:56.36 | zerojay | Looks like Maemo is now a supported platform on Forum Nokia now. |
| 23:56.38 | pupnik_ | well... people wanted a n800 with keyboard and now they have one |
| 23:56.38 | zerojay | Interesting. |
| 23:56.40 | pupnik_ | thanks nokia |
| 23:57.14 | unique311 | it looka like a umpc? |
| 23:58.51 | pupnik_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:58.52 | sp3000 | your mom lo... oh nevermind |
| 23:59.06 | zerojay | If I didn't already have a tablet, I'd be far more intersted in the N810. As it stands, I'm still interested, but not as much thanks to the IT 2008 update for the N800. |
| 23:59.36 | zerojay | pupnik_: Oh... thanks. Even though I don't know all the nitty gritty details, I hope it was understandable. |
