| 00:02.27 | Atarii | man thats some hardcore time outs |
| 00:04.50 | Atarii | anyone here/ |
| 00:05.03 | flip^ | very vaguely, considering its 1am ;) |
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| 00:05.41 | Atarii | :( |
| 00:05.53 | flip^ | people seem to be struggling to stay alive tonight |
| 00:06.05 | Atarii | do u know wat package i need to get ifconfig/iwconfig on maemo? |
| 00:06.18 | Atarii | or everyone is out as its a friday nite... |
| 00:06.26 | flip^ | ifconfig is there from the outset, isn't it? |
| 00:06.39 | Atarii | maybe i need to use the absolute path to it |
| 00:07.16 | flip^ | one mo |
| 00:07.59 | flip^ | /sbin/ifconfig i believe |
| 00:08.21 | Atarii | awesome thanks |
| 00:08.40 | flip^ | sudo gainroot; cd /; find | grep ifconfig |
| 00:08.42 | flip^ | magic :) |
| 00:09.03 | Atarii | :p |
| 00:09.39 | flip^ | and watch as it spasms over loads if io errors on mmc1 :( |
| 00:10.50 | flip^ | *of |
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| 05:14.14 | Blacksitox | bye |
| 05:20.55 | zoran | hm, no priv messages on freenode |
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| 06:33.26 | if | good morning everyone, can I get little help about installing sb2 ? |
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| 08:58.14 | sujan | Hi all |
| 08:58.42 | pupnik | hi |
| 08:58.42 | _Monkey | bonjour, pupnik |
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| 09:04.02 | kpel | hi guys |
| 09:04.38 | pupnik | hi |
| 09:05.24 | pupnik | thanks to Dawnmist for finding how to activate exec on mmc/sd |
| 09:06.13 | kpel | pupnik, do u have a url? |
| 09:06.14 | pupnik | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:07.24 | kpel | the devel docs are great. i was looking at them yesterday. |
| 09:08.40 | pupnik | kpel see /usr/sbin/mmc-mount |
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| 09:17.34 | czr | does the dhcp-client communicate with dbus on N800? |
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| 09:40.25 | sujan | Hi |
| 09:43.00 | kpel | pupnik, thanks |
| 09:43.18 | kpel | hi sujan |
| 09:43.42 | sujan | i am facing a problem kpel |
| 09:44.00 | sujan | I have build a debian package but when i try to install it on N800 , it shows depends on hildon-fmmm,dev-sqlite |
| 09:45.15 | sujan | can you please give me a solution? |
| 09:51.25 | kpel | sujan, no idea. i am really new to the maemo platform :\ |
| 09:52.24 | sujan | Its ok, kpel |
| 09:56.00 | czr | mornin koen |
| 09:57.10 | koen | hey czr |
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| 09:59.16 | czr | anyone have a minimal terminfo for just xterm? |
| 09:59.19 | pupnik_ | sujan: if the package really doesn't need those, edit the debian/control file to remove those dependencies, then re build |
| 10:00.03 | sujan | package need those |
| 10:00.27 | pupnik | then you need to install them |
| 10:00.29 | sujan | because I have used sqlite3 |
| 10:00.50 | sujan | manually in N800? |
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| 10:02.01 | pupnik | if the packages upon which your app depends are not in your repositories, then yes manually |
| 10:02.49 | sujan | Is there any way that it will install dependencies automatically during installation of my package? |
| 10:04.32 | pupnik | yes you can make your own ftp repository, or submit dependencies to an official repository |
| 10:04.36 | pupnik | mud-builder? |
| 10:04.41 | pupnik | mudbuilder? |
| 10:04.43 | sujan | because I am going to deliver it to somebody, who does not know how to install sqlite or hildon-fmmm |
| 10:04.46 | pupnik | maybe that could help |
| 10:05.37 | pupnik | another option would be to add the libraries to your package |
| 10:06.16 | sujan | ya, adding libraries is better, i think |
| 10:06.37 | sujan | Can you help me, how can I do that |
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| 10:07.54 | pupnik | dunno |
| 10:08.06 | sujan | i have used dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot command to make package |
| 10:17.06 | sujan | pupnik: Ok Pupnik, thanks for your help |
| 10:19.48 | pupnik | look in the debian/rules directory |
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| 11:18.05 | opy | good morning (~ugt) |
| 11:18.29 | opy | Pupnik : are you here!! |
| 11:18.46 | pupnik | ya |
| 11:23.02 | opy | Pupnik : I got error when "fakeroot apt-get install maemo-explicit" in armel . Would you like to give me any solution? |
| 11:23.28 | opy | dor maemo 2.2 |
| 11:23.32 | opy | for |
| 11:23.37 | pupnik | last time i asked you a questino about this you did not answer me |
| 11:24.24 | pupnik | or maybe i missed your answer |
| 11:24.39 | pupnik | what is maemo-explicit? |
| 11:25.10 | czr | pupnik, pseudopackage pulling the closed source binaries from nokia |
| 11:25.22 | czr | what has replaced kdbusd? |
| 11:25.34 | pupnik | ah interesting |
| 11:25.37 | czr | I see that it's not on either N800 nor in 3.2 sdk. |
| 11:25.43 | pupnik | what happens whtn you apt-cache search maemo-explicit? |
| 11:26.34 | opy | oh sorry. |
| 11:27.36 | zuh | czr: Maybe ke-recv? |
| 11:27.57 | zuh | Though I'm not sure what kdbusd does... |
| 11:28.14 | czr | it was a light-weight wrapper for kernel -> object/uevents -> dbus |
| 11:28.19 | opy | it is package installation command from repository for maemo 3.1 |
| 11:28.19 | czr | (to system dbus) |
| 11:28.56 | czr | zuh, I can only see ke-recv-l10n-engb and ke-recv-l10n-mr1 packages in the sdk, am I looking in the right place? |
| 11:29.07 | czr | (sdk = apt-cache search in sdk) |
| 11:29.25 | czr | ah, I see two processes/threads of ke-recv running on the device. |
| 11:29.30 | zuh | I doubt it's in the sdk |
| 11:29.39 | zuh | since it's pretty device-specific |
| 11:29.49 | czr | zuh, figures, thanks. |
| 11:29.59 | czr | is there any spec about the stuff that it puts on dbus? |
| 11:30.27 | zuh | but it is in the nokia binaries tarball if you really want to ogle at the package (no sources of course) |
| 11:30.44 | czr | zuh, neh, no source is no good for me |
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| 11:31.02 | czr | this is enough, I assume the basic role is still the same though? |
| 11:32.09 | zuh | Yeah, AFAIK it's just for screaming dbus messages when hw events occur |
| 11:33.14 | czr | right. will do some research, thanks. |
| 11:33.16 | zuh | And it's one of those packages that even nokians seem to think that are so trivial that it's silly it's not open source. (and yet it is not...) |
| 11:33.28 | czr | kdbusd was open in 1.1 (at least) |
| 11:33.36 | zuh | Or so I remember reading from maemo-devel lists |
| 11:35.31 | czr | another silly question. what is the role of the dbus-vfs-daemon? it has it's own socket (@/dbus-vfs-daemon/socket-foobar)? |
| 11:35.56 | zuh | That I don't know |
| 11:36.31 | opy | Pupnik : I got this W: Couldn't stat source package list http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/repository.maemo.org_extras_dists_gregale_free_binary-arm_Packages) - stat (2 No such file or directory) |
| 11:36.31 | opy | W: Couldn't stat source package list http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/repository.maemo.org_extras_dists_gregale_non-free_binary-arm_Packages) - stat (2 No such file or directory) for apt-cache showpkg |
| 11:36.40 | czr | zuh, np :-) |
| 11:36.57 | czr | hmm. I guess netstat doesn't know about netlink sockets then, meh. |
| 11:37.37 | zuh | opy: seems like you haven't run 'apt-get update' or it hasn't succeeded |
| 11:41.49 | opy | I run apt-get update but it hasn't succeeded |
| 11:43.23 | pupnik | aha now we getting somewhere |
| 11:43.38 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.38 | czr | hmm. any way to find out all the anonymous pipes in the system and which processes are holding them open? |
| 11:43.38 | opy | Zuh : after 'apt-get update' i got Hit http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Packages |
| 11:43.38 | opy | Hit http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Release |
| 11:43.38 | opy | Hit http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Packages |
| 11:43.38 | opy | Hit http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Release |
| 11:43.38 | opy | Hit http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Sources |
| 11:43.39 | _Monkey | nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.39 | opy | Ign http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Release |
| 11:43.41 | opy | Hit http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Sources |
| 11:43.43 | opy | Ign http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Release |
| 11:43.46 | opy | Err http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Packages |
| 11:43.47 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.47 | opy | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:43.48 | _Monkey | nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.49 | opy | Ign http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Release |
| 11:43.51 | opy | Err http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Packages |
| 11:43.51 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.52 | _Monkey | nsswitch is, like, http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.53 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.54 | _Monkey | nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.55 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.55 | opy | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:43.55 | _Monkey | nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.56 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.57 | _Monkey | nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.57 | opy | Ign http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Release |
| 11:43.58 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:43.59 | xand | sigh |
| 11:43.59 | _Monkey | i think nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:43.59 | opy | Get:1 http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Sources [11.1kB] |
| 11:44.01 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:44.01 | opy | Ign http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Release |
| 11:44.01 | _Monkey | well, nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:44.04 | opy | Get:2 http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Sources [20B] |
| 11:44.07 | opy | Ign http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Release |
| 11:44.09 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:44.10 | _Monkey | nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:44.10 | opy | Fetched 11.1kB in 36s (306B/s) |
| 11:44.12 | pupnik | nsswitch |
| 11:44.13 | _Monkey | rumour has it nsswitch is http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get |
| 11:44.13 | opy | Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/gregale/free/binary-arm/Packages.gz 404 Not Found [IP: 60.254.154.72 80] |
| 11:44.13 | xand | opy: do you mind? |
| 11:44.16 | opy | Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/gregale/non-free/binary-arm/Packages.gz 404 Not Found [IP: 60.254.154.72 80] |
| 11:44.19 | opy | Reading Package Lists... Done |
| 11:44.21 | opy | W: Couldn't stat source package list http://repository.maemo.org gregale/free Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/repository.maemo.org_extras_dists_gregale_free_binary-arm_Packages) - stat (2 No such file or directory) |
| 11:44.26 | opy | W: Couldn't stat source package list http://repository.maemo.org gregale/non-free Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/repository.maemo.org_extras_dists_gregale_non-free_binary-arm_Packages) - stat (2 No |
| 11:44.44 | opy | ha ha ha |
| 11:44.51 | zuh | Holy copy&paste accident, please don't do that again :) |
| 11:44.51 | xand | pastebin ffs |
| 11:45.15 | czr | did anyone notice my question even? :-) |
| 11:45.27 | czr | (not very maemo/device specific even) |
| 11:46.57 | opy | pupnik: is it 'hosts: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=scratchbox+nsswitch+apt-get' |
| 11:47.46 | czr | I had the same snag with 3.2 (and 4.0b) because of feisty having avahi and that pulling mdns NSS module into nsswitch.conf |
| 11:53.57 | czr | hmm. there doesn't seem to be any interface from the userspace to get the open pipe listing. |
| 11:58.43 | pupnik | sorry, looking at ./debian/* and configure/make stuff PISSES ME OFF |
| 11:59.49 | czr | ok, another question then. is there a package I can install into the ARMEL SDK that contains the necesary kernel headers for the device kernel? |
| 12:00.18 | czr | (running the latest firmware, so I'm assuming the kernel header packages should be per user-image release, right?) |
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| 12:08.31 | zuh | If you are talking about N800, rx-34-kernel-headers |
| 12:09.49 | czr | zuh, yes I am. but how are the differing kernel versions handled then? |
| 12:10.02 | czr | (case the newest user firmware that fixed the memory card stuff) |
| 12:12.06 | zuh | I doubt that made any difference on the kernel headers... But you could probably install a specific version of the headers with "apt-get install package=version". |
| 12:12.45 | czr | zuh, even if apt-cache search kernel-headers only lists 'linux-kernel-headers' and 'rx-34-kernel-headers'? |
| 12:13.10 | czr | hmm. I'll see shortly |
| 12:14.41 | zuh | but what differences you are referring to? AFAIK nokia only supports one image at a time (the lates) and the repositories follow that |
| 12:15.08 | czr | just thinking of writing a module, that would work on N800, that's all :-) |
| 12:15.29 | czr | I've been out of action since 770 came out, so trying to refresh on stuff that might have changed since. |
| 12:17.35 | czr | still a bit unsure how the ke-recv interfaces dbus though |
| 12:17.47 | czr | unless it only opens the dbus connection when there is an event to report |
| 12:20.43 | czr | let's see. |
| 12:22.02 | kpel | is the source of the kernel running on N800 available? |
| 12:24.33 | zuh | yes, 'apt-get install kernel-source-rx-34' or look in http://repository.maemo.org/pool/bora/free/source/ |
| 12:24.43 | *** join/#maemo edistar (n=edwinloc@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 12:26.14 | kpel | thanks zuh |
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| 12:30.42 | czr | meh. strace is having problems decoding connect().. |
| 12:31.01 | Blacksitox | hi :) |
| 12:31.56 | czr | also, the way that ke-recv interfaces with the kernel is weird :-) |
| 12:32.12 | czr | it gets an unix stream socket form the kernel and it seems that it gets the messages over that. |
| 12:32.19 | czr | but I'm having trouble seeing what happens after that. |
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| 12:39.17 | czr | zuh, I guess the reason why ke-recv is now closed is that it contains binary decoding for the mce stuff coming from the kernel side |
| 12:39.31 | czr | the old kdbusd didn't (it only forwarded uevents) |
| 13:01.26 | czr | zuh, the kernel-headers is not kernel-headers as we know it |
| 13:01.31 | czr | scripts is missing |
| 13:01.37 | czr | not possible to build modules against it for example. |
| 13:02.49 | czr | also other stuff missing, like arch-specific Makefile, etc.. |
| 13:07.06 | alterego | You can download the whole source tree. |
| 13:07.40 | czr | alterego, that wasn't the point really. |
| 13:09.44 | czr | alterego, point being: why have a kernel header package if it cannot be used for anything. |
| 13:11.12 | alterego | Yes, |
| 13:11.45 | alterego | I understand that |
| 13:14.07 | GeneralAntilles | Ha, awesome, new firmware and now I can't install rtcom or microb |
| 13:18.42 | alterego | Uh-oh |
| 13:18.55 | alterego | You mean the SDHC kernel update? |
| 13:19.00 | GeneralAntilles | Yes. |
| 13:19.20 | alterego | Interesting. They said only that had changed :) |
| 13:19.36 | alterego | Though .. You shouldn't have had to reflash the whole device .. Just the kernel .. |
| 13:19.46 | GeneralAntilles | I was in a reboot-loop |
| 13:19.49 | GeneralAntilles | so I had to reflash |
| 13:19.54 | alterego | Oh, nasty |
| 13:20.06 | alterego | I've never had that. |
| 13:20.23 | GeneralAntilles | Not an enjoyable experience. |
| 13:20.29 | alterego | Well, something similar, but just taking out the battery for a few seconds and then turning it on again fixed it. |
| 13:22.11 | GeneralAntilles | Finally get a grandcentral invite and the N800 stops being functionally useful. <_< |
| 13:22.21 | alterego | O_o |
| 13:22.29 | alterego | What's a "Grandcentral invite"? |
| 13:22.52 | alterego | Is that like meeting the queen? ^_^ |
| 13:22.53 | GeneralAntilles | http://grandcentral.com/home/intro |
| 13:23.03 | GeneralAntilles | It's a callforwarding service from Google |
| 13:23.24 | GeneralAntilles | Caller rings a number they assign you, and it gets forwarded to up to 3 other lines. |
| 13:24.31 | alterego | Cool. |
| 13:24.35 | alterego | V0IP? |
| 13:25.13 | GeneralAntilles | Yeah, I was planning on setting up my Gizmo account with the SIP client |
| 13:26.17 | alterego | Nice |
| 13:26.35 | alterego | Do you have any SDHC cards? I've not bothered updating my N800 yet. |
| 13:26.41 | GeneralAntilles | Not yet |
| 13:26.45 | alterego | Figure I might as well wait until the next proper release. |
| 13:26.49 | GeneralAntilles | waiting for the 16GB cards to come down. |
| 13:26.59 | alterego | I've got 2x 2Gb SD cards that are fine for now. |
| 13:27.00 | GeneralAntilles | I was going to wait, but the reboot-loop forced me into it |
| 13:27.17 | GeneralAntilles | Evidently Nokia can't roll out a simple kernel patch without breaking everything. . . . :( |
| 13:27.38 | alterego | :) |
| 13:27.58 | sx|lappy | huhu |
| 13:28.23 | alterego | I need to figure out how to setup a PAN between my N800 and a WinXP machine .. |
| 13:28.34 | alterego | Where the WinXP machine is the host with internet connection sharing .. |
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| 13:30.31 | GeneralAntilles | Well, I guess I'll reflash again without restoring from backup. |
| 13:31.45 | kpel | alterego, u need to offer the DUN service on the pc if u want to use bluetooth. or use wifi and make the pc the gateway for the n800 |
| 13:32.15 | alterego | Yeah, no wifi on this particular machine. Hence this trouble. |
| 13:32.25 | alterego | The BT adapter uses the standard Windows BT stack .. |
| 13:32.36 | alterego | There doesn't appear to be a way to setup PAN or DUN |
| 13:32.56 | kpel | has anyone managed to login to maemo from a n800? |
| 13:33.44 | kpel | alterego, u need extra sw. search for DUN for windows |
| 13:35.14 | kpel | the stack is not enough, u need the server too. in linux i think it's called dund. |
| 13:37.08 | alterego | Yeah, I can do it in Linux. |
| 13:37.19 | alterego | But this is someone elses machine that runs XP homo. |
| 13:37.40 | kpel | homo indeed ;p |
| 13:38.07 | czr | human oriented mechanistic obsession? |
| 13:38.50 | czr | reminds me of the vista advert that I saw (just yesterday). it was way too funny (N800 chocked on the flash video though). |
| 13:39.28 | czr | (OT & probably quite old: http://www.mikesplanet.net/2007/10/the-vista-commerical-you-will-want-to-see/ ) |
| 13:40.20 | kpel | alterego, www.magsys.co.uk/dunman |
| 13:40.59 | kpel | let us know if it works |
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| 13:49.25 | GeneralAntilles | Well, has anybody else with the new firmware been able to install either microb or rtcom? |
| 13:49.35 | GeneralAntilles | Another reflash didn't change the situtation. |
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| 13:57.34 | zuh | I'm running microb with 4.2007.26-8, dunno if thats "new firmware" as it's pretty old |
| 13:57.48 | alterego | Hahah |
| 13:59.33 | GeneralAntilles | "new firmware" is 4.2007.38-2 |
| 14:02.46 | zuh | hmm, I thought I had the latest... *shrug* |
| 14:05.04 | czr | anyone managed to succesfully use the kernel-source package to build out of tree modules that load in N800? |
| 14:06.06 | zuh | o/ |
| 14:06.16 | zuh | I rebuilt the wlan driver |
| 14:06.23 | czr | zuh, it's out-of-tree? |
| 14:06.26 | zuh | yeah |
| 14:06.45 | czr | hmm. I'm building the kernel now, since it seems that make prepare isn't enough to make the tree proper |
| 14:06.52 | czr | kbuild complaining about missing modules.symvers |
| 14:07.00 | czr | and scripts/bin/something missing. |
| 14:07.41 | czr | whee. lo and behind. the out-of-tree module build snow |
| 14:07.44 | czr | builds now even. |
| 14:07.48 | czr | behold even too! |
| 14:08.32 | czr | "[108952.505798] Hello, world" |
| 14:09.10 | czr | I still think the kernel-headers package should be fixed so that it would be enough to built out of tree stuff like in any other distro. |
| 14:10.10 | zuh | As if anything worked on maemo like in any other distro |
| 14:10.17 | czr | :-) |
| 14:10.32 | czr | 3.2 isn't as bad as 1.0 though. |
| 14:10.37 | alterego | Hopefully that aspect is getting better :) |
| 14:10.40 | czr | fewer snags so far. |
| 14:10.51 | czr | different snags, but I guess fewer. so far. |
| 14:11.00 | alterego | I'm getting endless segfaults from cputrans though |
| 14:11.10 | alterego | I never used to .. Starting to wonder if it's not my system .. |
| 14:11.23 | czr | of course it's not not your system |
| 14:11.30 | alterego | :) |
| 14:11.44 | czr | qemu code quality is perfect. it cannot fail. ever. |
| 14:11.50 | alterego | Heh |
| 14:12.09 | zuh | sbrsh ftw |
| 14:12.20 | zuh | though it fails in certain things too |
| 14:12.50 | czr | I'm just using ssh to the thing and copying stuff over there when I need to test on the device |
| 14:13.06 | alterego | Sure, I do a lot of testing on the device. |
| 14:13.07 | czr | except for stuff that runs in the sdk. |
| 14:13.18 | alterego | But I'd like to test on my workstation whilst I'm actually developing code. |
| 14:13.34 | czr | I'd like an open-top bmw |
| 14:13.41 | alterego | Meh. |
| 14:13.54 | czr | not that it would be any use here. but still. |
| 14:14.02 | alterego | :) |
| 14:14.45 | alterego | So, anyone know whether chinook is going to be IT2008? or 2007-2 ? |
| 14:15.00 | czr | hmm. at least now the kernel thing is tested. so I'll probably wrote a module that will dump more info about sockets and pipes later in order to find out how all the pieces are related |
| 14:15.28 | alterego | Any more discovery on the random HTTP server? |
| 14:15.34 | czr | alterego, didn't work on that |
| 14:15.43 | alterego | I vaguely remember something about this but I can't think what it is/was .. |
| 14:15.49 | czr | have more concrete issues to solve atm. |
| 14:16.00 | czr | like figuring out all the components of d-bus in the device |
| 14:16.09 | alterego | I'd love that ;) |
| 14:16.18 | czr | heh |
| 14:16.22 | alterego | The whole system/session DBus service API would be awesome. |
| 14:16.26 | czr | also noticed that strace on the device doesn't work properly. |
| 14:16.34 | czr | doesn't decode all the syscalls properly. |
| 14:16.55 | czr | and it's already heavily patched by osso |
| 14:17.11 | alterego | You should post some of this stuff on the mailing lists. I'm sure the folks at nokia would like to see everything working properly and stable ;) |
| 14:17.29 | czr | heh |
| 14:17.39 | czr | I might later on, when I get the current stuff out of the way |
| 14:17.39 | alterego | I completely agree with the linux-headers package issue. I tried compiling fuse and sshfs but obviously couldn't because the package is broken. |
| 14:18.07 | alterego | I didn't bother investigating it further. Though I may do in the future. |
| 14:18.41 | alterego | I'm kind of in a rush to get ruby-maemo completely out of the door. |
| 14:19.01 | czr | you can also throw it out of the window |
| 14:19.30 | alterego | You like throwing things out of the window don't you ;) |
| 14:19.50 | czr | alterego, I need to implement couple of tools to aid the research stuff, and I won't have time for that at least for couple of weeks |
| 14:20.04 | czr | and depending on what I'll find more interesting at that point, can't make promises :-) |
| 14:20.19 | czr | alterego, it's the fastest solution to most problems most of the time.. |
| 14:20.29 | alterego | Hah |
| 14:20.43 | alterego | I'm dreaming that there's svideo out .. |
| 14:21.06 | alterego | Again something I was going to look into but ruby-maemo is taking over my life right now outside of work ^_^ |
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| 14:50.22 | gopi|iPhone | /join #openmoko |
| 14:50.42 | gopi|iPhone | /foo |
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| 14:57.51 | pupnikbeer | mudbuilder? |
| 14:57.56 | pupnikbeer | mud-builder? |
| 14:59.21 | *** join/#maemo celesteh (n=celesteh@147.188.254.201) |
| 15:00.49 | pupnikbeer | _Monkey, mud-builder is "Maemo Unofficial Debs" - an autobuilder for simple source ports that hosts them in a single repository. http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/index.php Forum at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10279 |
| 15:00.50 | _Monkey | OK, pupnikbeer. |
| 15:01.11 | pupnikbeer | _Monkey, mudbuilder is "Maemo Unofficial Debs" - an autobuilder for simple source ports that hosts them in a single repository. http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/index.php Forum at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10279 |
| 15:01.12 | _Monkey | OK, pupnikbeer. |
| 15:01.35 | zoran | there is a chance you talk to the bot |
| 15:07.44 | pupnikbeer | yes i teach the bot zoran |
| 15:07.58 | pupnikbeer | normally i do it in privmsg but maybe Jaffa is around to see it |
| 15:09.01 | pupnikbeer | i would gladly help with documentation but i do not yet understand it |
| 15:09.11 | zoran | he-he |
| 15:09.12 | pupnikbeer | maybe it just needs some more 'edge case' handling |
| 15:09.35 | zoran | what bot, of not a secret? |
| 15:09.53 | pupnikbeer | _Monkey is a bot |
| 15:09.58 | pupnikbeer | hi _Monkey |
| 15:10.03 | pupnikbeer | _Monkey: hi |
| 15:10.04 | _Monkey | privet, pupnikbeer |
| 15:10.12 | zoran | no, I meant what is the software? |
| 15:10.13 | czr | uu, it knows languages too |
| 15:10.23 | pupnikbeer | mud-builder? |
| 15:10.24 | _Monkey | mud-builder is "Maemo Unofficial Debs" - an autobuilder for simple source ports that hosts them in a single repository. http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/index.php Forum at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10279 |
| 15:10.43 | celesteh | _Monkey? |
| 15:10.44 | _Monkey | celesteh? |
| 15:10.44 | pupnikbeer | custom made i think |
| 15:10.55 | celesteh | _Monkey: _Monkey? |
| 15:10.55 | _Monkey | i am the best programmer in the whole freenode IRC right now |
| 15:11.05 | celesteh | hahaha |
| 15:12.07 | zuh | banana? |
| 15:12.52 | *** join/#maemo Gray9Mar (i=surf@gateway/tor/x-c8bd2476eed5a6c8) |
| 15:13.30 | alterego | Heh |
| 15:13.49 | czr | zuh, obviously it's not just any ordinary monkey :-) |
| 15:14.13 | celesteh | _Monkey, banana is something I'd like right now |
| 15:14.13 | _Monkey | OK, celesteh. |
| 15:14.48 | zoran | _Monkey, what _Monkey is called _Monkey |
| 15:14.49 | _Monkey | zoran: wish i knew |
| 15:14.50 | Jaffa | pupnikbeer: anything in particular you'd like to know? |
| 15:15.21 | pupnikbeer | You know mud-builder? |
| 15:17.54 | alterego | mudbuilder? |
| 15:17.55 | _Monkey | well, mudbuilder is "Maemo Unofficial Debs" - an autobuilder for simple source ports that hosts them in a single repository. http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/index.php Forum at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10279 |
| 15:18.12 | pupnikbeer | It tries to download a non-existent source package after i have put the source tarball into build/MYAPP/.build |
| 15:18.13 | zoran | hm mudbuilder? |
| 15:18.13 | _Monkey | mudbuilder is "Maemo Unofficial Debs" - an autobuilder for simple source ports that hosts them in a single repository. http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/index.php Forum at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10279 |
| 15:18.23 | pupnikbeer | and there is no debian source package available |
| 15:18.32 | zoran | hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mudbuilder? |
| 15:18.32 | _Monkey | mudbuilder is "Maemo Unofficial Debs" - an autobuilder for simple source ports that hosts them in a single repository. http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/index.php Forum at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10279 |
| 15:18.39 | alterego | Heh |
| 15:18.44 | *** join/#maemo zwnj (n=behnam@213.207.210.231) |
| 15:18.49 | pupnikbeer | Jaffa, so perhaps i should skip the "mud get mycal" step ? |
| 15:18.54 | zoran | hm n n n n n n n n n n n n mudbuilder? |
| 15:19.05 | Jaffa | pupnikbeer: I'd need to see the XML file, but it sounds like you're specifying the source type as debian, when it's not. |
| 15:19.25 | zuh | zoran: You could do that in privmsgs too, you know ;) |
| 15:19.34 | zoran | :), sorry |
| 15:19.50 | pupnikbeer | that's right Jaffa - thanks for the info |
| 15:19.58 | pupnikbeer | what should go into type="" for a local file? |
| 15:20.49 | Jaffa | Because of the way it works, it's probably best to get it to download the tarball from somewhere. |
| 15:21.09 | Jaffa | See http://mud-builder.garage.maemo.org/docs/index.php?id=packageformat for more details |
| 15:21.16 | Jaffa | In particular, <fetch type="tarball"> |
| 15:21.37 | Jaffa | You can put a local path outside of the mud tree, or a URL |
| 15:22.00 | pupnikbeer | thanks! i should have read through that. sorry. |
| 15:22.42 | Jaffa | No probs, I know the documentation's lacking. |
| 15:22.46 | Jaffa | And I'm sorry for that. |
| 15:23.08 | pupnikbeer | i can help when i understand it - thanks for the response |
| 15:23.38 | Jaffa | Excellent, feel free to ask any question of me at any time, either here, via email direct or on the mud-builder mailing list. |
| 15:24.59 | *** join/#maemo zoran_2 (n=zoran@c-71-224-175-179.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 15:25.26 | pupnikbeer | mud compile sdlscavenger Failed to run compile on sdlscavenger: Unable to read control: No such file or directory |
| 15:25.44 | pupnikbeer | the source tree has no debian/control |
| 15:25.58 | pupnikbeer | should i make one? |
| 15:25.58 | Jaffa | pupnikbeer: hmm, that suggests that running dh_make on it (should automatically happen after the tarball's been extracted) failed. |
| 15:26.16 | Jaffa | pupnikbeer: you can make one yourself, but it should create one from the info in the package XML file if not present. |
| 15:26.27 | pupnikbeer | i manually exctracted the tarball to the .build directory |
| 15:26.36 | zoran_2 | I'd like to ask how to manage something just mundane in ash: how to get rid od path before the prompt; .profile does not give a result (maemo-hackers' xterm0 |
| 15:26.38 | pupnikbeer | ok |
| 15:27.01 | Jaffa | pupnikbeer: you shouldn't need to unpack it yourself into .build |
| 15:27.38 | pupnikbeer | ok |
| 15:27.49 | pupnikbeer | just following directions :) |
| 15:28.21 | pupnikbeer | so i can delete build/sdlscavenger/.build and rerun compile? |
| 15:28.30 | pupnikbeer | or delete build/sdlscavenger ? |
| 15:29.00 | pupnikbeer | where does the xml specify location of tarball? |
| 15:29.24 | Jaffa | delete build/sdlscavenger, make sure your sdlscavenger.xml has <fetch type="tarball">, specifying the location. |
| 15:29.33 | Jaffa | Ah, hang on (yes, that bit of the docs is missing ;-)) |
| 15:30.07 | Jaffa | See packages/vim.xml for an example. |
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| 15:30.56 | pupnikbeer | ok thanks |
| 15:31.05 | Jaffa | So you'll want something like file:///home/pupnik/src/mytarball.tar.gz - or, ideally, a pointer to the upstream so it can be built on others' machines. |
| 15:31.24 | pupnikbeer | okies |
| 15:35.16 | pupnikbeer | niceee.. works good |
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| 15:53.02 | zoran | hm, someone changed prompt in maemo-hackers' xterm, using busybox? |
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| 16:16.27 | alterego | zoran, yes. |
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| 16:41.23 | |R | http://atlas.kennesaw.edu/~rmw1202/dope.html <- anyone running this on an n800 and the latest firmware? :) |
| 16:41.27 | |R | (Dope Wars) |
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| 17:03.02 | czr | alterego, http://koltsoff.com/pub/hello-n800/ . feedback appreciated |
| 17:10.41 | disq | cruel world. heh |
| 17:11.08 | disq | nice doc |
| 17:11.21 | czr | thanks |
| 17:11.31 | rlifchitz | czr: great ! |
| 17:11.40 | czr | probably should post a note about it on the maemo-devel list |
| 17:11.57 | czr | although that would mean subscribing to the list first :-) |
| 17:14.05 | rlifchitz | :) |
| 17:14.13 | disq | you could opt to not receive any mail |
| 17:14.23 | |R | W: GPG error: http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com bora Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG CBFC2BECC6903E72 Nokia Internet Tablet Archive Automatic Signing Key <integration@maemo.org> |
| 17:14.27 | czr | nah, might as well sub |
| 17:14.30 | disq | it sucks anyway you say gstreamer==poo and suddenly all nokia chaps jump on you |
| 17:14.32 | |R | any reasons why i would now be getting this? :/ |
| 17:14.59 | disq | i sometimes get that too |
| 17:15.14 | czr | disq, you say <insert any open source project with significant effort investment>==poo, and suddenly.. well, you know :-) |
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| 17:15.35 | |R | it blocks the application manager from instaling thing as it can't update the list ... i've put the lines in source.list in commentary for now but ... well :) |
| 17:16.14 | disq | :P |
| 17:17.03 | czr | and I didn't even use the p word, mind you. |
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| 17:20.01 | alterego | penis? |
| 17:20.49 | czr | if that is the first p-word that pops into your mind when speaking about GTK+, then.. well.. can't blame you :-) |
| 17:21.49 | disq | gtk+.. and p.. PObject? no, that's not it |
| 17:22.00 | disq | pirates? arrrrr. no, i don't think so |
| 17:22.15 | czr | hmm. I wonder if it would make sense to make a class abstration for PO-files. |
| 17:22.19 | czr | POObject. |
| 17:22.37 | disq | lol. |
| 17:25.52 | |R | anyone still has a mirror for the rdesktop 0.2 package? ehore's one is dead :| |
| 17:27.33 | disq | maemo garage? |
| 17:27.33 | disq | why 0.2? |
| 17:27.48 | |R | disq : the link is dead there... i only found a link by google |
| 17:27.52 | |R | but now that server is dead too |
| 17:27.57 | |R | http://www.ehore.com/apps/it2006/rdesktop_0.2_armel.deb |
| 17:28.00 | |R | (doesn't work) |
| 17:28.04 | disq | why not install https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1052/rdesktop_0.4_armel.deb |
| 17:28.18 | |R | good question :P |
| 17:28.32 | disq | should work just fine on it2006 |
| 17:28.59 | |R | i'm on 2007 here though |
| 17:29.21 | disq | should work even better |
| 17:29.54 | |R | ok then, cool, thanks, where did you find it ? in 2007 it only linked to 0.1 and in 2006 to 0.3a weird! |
| 17:30.31 | disq | where, in maemo.org? |
| 17:30.35 | |R | yep? |
| 17:30.50 | |R | oh damn |
| 17:31.00 | |R | ok i get it.. maemo.org doesn't search the same thing as garage! |
| 17:31.06 | |R | that's a bit odd :P |
| 17:31.07 | disq | weird |
| 17:31.08 | |R | sorry ;) |
| 17:31.25 | |R | next time i'll try both :) |
| 17:31.42 | disq | nope, maemo.org says 0.3a. though it will install the latest since it's installing from the repositories (in this case, 0.4) |
| 17:31.54 | alterego | czr, looks good. |
| 17:31.57 | |R | ok :) |
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| 17:55.15 | czr | damn the text layout engine in opera is crappy |
| 17:55.25 | czr | or maybe the CSS support is "wanting". |
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| 17:58.51 | zerojay | Opera's pretty old now. |
| 17:58.54 | zerojay | 8.5 |
| 17:59.01 | zerojay | I think that's like.. two or three years old. |
| 17:59.41 | czr | I'd assumed that N800 would ship with something more recent then |
| 18:00.06 | zerojay | Until recently, it was the latest mobile version of Opera. |
| 18:00.14 | zerojay | Install Microb then. |
| 18:00.19 | zerojay | Nice and bleeding edge. |
| 18:00.55 | czr | someone was complaining just today that it's not possible to install it with the newest fw |
| 18:01.10 | zerojay | I was able to install it just fine. |
| 18:01.23 | czr | but maybe I'll try it out later, I don't use N800 much anyway, just wanted to see what my text-heavy page looks on it |
| 18:01.29 | czr | oh, ok. user error then :-) |
| 18:01.39 | zerojay | Maybe, maybe not. |
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| 18:12.03 | czr | hmm. I created a account on maemo.org, got redirected to garage.maemo.org (which works fine). However, maemo.org doesn't want me to login anyway. any hints? |
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| 18:28.36 | GeneralAntilles | zerojay, microb worked for you on the latest firmware? |
| 18:28.43 | GeneralAntilles | I haven't had any luck |
| 18:28.45 | zerojay | Yep. |
| 18:28.49 | GeneralAntilles | it seems like the meta-package is missing. |
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| 19:39.30 | yetihwelttil | hi, does anyone know if the webcam in the N800 can be used by flash for things such as direct upload on youtube? |
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| 19:42.57 | pupnik | maybe |
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| 19:44.00 | flip^ | i guess the answer would be "if someone made it happen, then yes" |
| 19:44.11 | flip^ | but someone's gotta want to code it first |
| 19:44.18 | flip^ | and no one wants to code for the n800's sucky camera |
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| 19:45.02 | Atarii | wat megapixel is it? |
| 19:45.04 | yetihwelttil | heh |
| 19:45.10 | flip^ | 320x200? |
| 19:45.13 | yetihwelttil | yeah, i saw some photos from it and it was pretty noisy and.. horrible |
| 19:45.38 | pupnik | are you comparing it to other micro cameras? |
| 19:45.39 | flip^ | it's a nice little novelty feature, possibly ok for something like skype, but that's as far as it goes... "ok" |
| 19:45.42 | pupnik | or real cameras? |
| 19:45.58 | yetihwelttil | to most micro cameras |
| 19:46.00 | flip^ | the low quality camera on my N95 is better ;) |
| 19:46.04 | pupnik | ok |
| 19:46.22 | yetihwelttil | i'm just thinking it would be neat to be able to do flash based video streaming etc via it |
| 19:47.14 | zerojay | The camera's not very good, but it works well enough for my needs. |
| 19:47.49 | zerojay | yetihwelttil: And no, the camera isn't detected by Flash. |
| 19:47.58 | yetihwelttil | aww |
| 19:48.06 | zerojay | yetihwelttil: You'll have to bother Adobe about that. |
| 19:48.36 | yetihwelttil | that could be challenging :P |
| 19:49.59 | zerojay | Build it then. |
| 19:50.07 | zerojay | It's not like it isn't available. |
| 19:50.20 | flip^ | well, it's not much use without a jre as well tbh, and that would be a lot of effort |
| 19:50.32 | pupnik | i want the adobe employee who decided postscript should become non-text to get pancreatic cancer |
| 19:50.32 | zerojay | There is a jre. |
| 19:50.42 | flip^ | yeah, i heard it's not exactly 100% yet |
| 19:50.56 | zerojay | If all you want to do is run Java apps, it'll work. |
| 19:51.05 | flip^ | and i'm only really starting out on getting myself a dev environment for maemo anyway... just copying the vmware appliance to my laptop as we speak in fact |
| 19:51.06 | pupnik | you used to be able to parse postscript with unix tools - sed/awk/perl |
| 19:51.08 | zerojay | Don't expect it to work in the browser or with any gui elements though |
| 19:53.15 | flip^ | if it were trivial to build a jdk, i expect it would have been done by now |
| 19:53.27 | zerojay | It was. |
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| 19:54.49 | zerojay | You can check out Jalimo or try helping out with some fixes on PhoneME Advance's port to the N800. |
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| 19:55.20 | zerojay | Honestly, I don't really see much of a use for Java anyways. |
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| 19:55.34 | zerojay | And what a horrible choice for use in small embedded devices, really. |
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| 19:58.32 | flip^ | Java is useful because its portable without recompiling, and its what I know.... used it plenty of times in places I've worked, so there's clearly demand |
| 19:59.04 | zerojay | It's what I use at work as well. |
| 19:59.08 | zerojay | Unfortunately. |
| 20:00.19 | flip^ | I do more stuff with php these days tbh, but occasionally java has its uses |
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| 20:00.46 | flip^ | wanting to play with maemo stuff leaves me fearing touching C++ again mind |
| 20:00.57 | zerojay | I'd much rather be doing that than Java. |
| 20:01.09 | zerojay | Especially on cell phones. |
| 20:01.59 | zerojay | A hell of a lot nicer than trusting that the JVM's garbage collector even works. |
| 20:02.12 | flip^ | well, maybe... but all of my C/C++ work has been working on the platform I'm compiling for, often working with other people's code... this is the first time I've had a desire to really try something like this |
| 20:02.29 | flip^ | the gc tends to be pretty reasonable these days ;) |
| 20:03.03 | zerojay | Don't be too sure about that. |
| 20:03.18 | flip^ | Well, it collects the garbage I create happily enough generally ;) |
| 20:03.25 | zerojay | At least not on the different JVMs I have to work with. |
| 20:03.36 | flip^ | well, that may be true :) |
| 20:04.02 | zerojay | Wouldn't be so bad if they all used the same one, but they don't. |
| 20:04.22 | zerojay | I hope the open sourcing of Java fixes that in the future. |
| 20:04.32 | czr | I don't ever recall seeing a bytecode compiled java program run the same way on different devices/jvms |
| 20:04.32 | flip^ | the only language I had any real success with on a mobile device was OPL, years ago ;) |
| 20:04.50 | czr | unless they are tested specifically across multiple environments |
| 20:05.02 | czr | and even then it's just "meh" after "meh". |
| 20:05.11 | zerojay | I work on mobile games. |
| 20:05.23 | flip^ | any i might have heard of? |
| 20:05.25 | zerojay | So.. getting it to work across everything is kind of my job. |
| 20:05.35 | czr | zerojay, so you know what I'm talking about :-) |
| 20:05.38 | zerojay | Probably not, unless you're a 16 year old girl. |
| 20:05.52 | zerojay | czr: I know the pain all too well. |
| 20:06.00 | flip^ | nah, I definitely lack every quality needed to be a 16 year old girl |
| 20:06.07 | czr | I got the sense to get out of java when it was still 1.0/1.1ish |
| 20:06.21 | czr | (although I got out of pretty much everything back then) |
| 20:06.33 | zerojay | I want out of mobile so bad. |
| 20:06.44 | zerojay | Thankfully, we're starting work on console games. |
| 20:07.03 | czr | at least there's a limited number of them |
| 20:07.08 | czr | consoles I mean. |
| 20:07.17 | flip^ | and much higher expectations from the audience |
| 20:07.29 | zerojay | Yeah.. 2 or 3 instead of 2 or 3 hundred. |
| 20:08.23 | zerojay | What sucks about mobile is that the carriers have such a strong say in what comes out and what doesn't. |
| 20:08.37 | pupnik | zerojay: in mobile, what portion of development budget goes to graphics and sound vs programming? |
| 20:09.17 | zerojay | If you are making an ambitious game and you know only high end phones will run it.. Sprint will tell you to take a hike if it doesn't run on their top 25 selling models... which are of course all the cheapest phones they have. |
| 20:09.40 | zerojay | In mobile, sound usually gets very little. |
| 20:09.56 | zerojay | Mainly because the phones still can't handle some basic shit like playing two sounds at a time or even looping. |
| 20:10.08 | pupnik | heh |
| 20:10.27 | zerojay | Most of the graphics are done in preproduction. Maybe a month tops unless you've got some major changes. |
| 20:10.29 | flip^ | I like to play games in quiet places anyway ;) |
| 20:10.29 | pupnik | it is a vague question sorry |
| 20:10.54 | zerojay | Programming takes up the most... even for a small ass game, we might have 3 guys working on it for 8 months. |
| 20:11.11 | zerojay | And that's just for our first master. |
| 20:11.25 | zerojay | Add another two or three months with 10 guys for porting to other phones. |
| 20:11.40 | pupnik | eenteresting :) |
| 20:11.54 | zerojay | Thankfully, because of the way things work, most of the time we can have a build working on a phone within 10 minutes. |
| 20:11.59 | zerojay | Unless it's a real shitbox. |
| 20:12.36 | zerojay | There are times where our publisher says "we've got phone X here as a prerelease... give us a build!" |
| 20:12.44 | zerojay | And they don't give us even basic specs. |
| 20:12.53 | zerojay | We have to try making the builds completely blindly. |
| 20:13.09 | zerojay | And wait a day for the people on the other side of the planet to tell us if we guessed wrong. |
| 20:13.49 | zerojay | So.. you've got something like 300 phones to port your game to. |
| 20:13.56 | zerojay | In 13 languages. |
| 20:14.01 | zerojay | For 15 operators. |
| 20:14.08 | zerojay | Each of which has their own wishlist. |
| 20:14.13 | zerojay | Or requirements. |
| 20:14.39 | zerojay | Telefonica (Spain) requires us to have an option advertizing other games, for example. |
| 20:14.56 | zerojay | Or just showing people how to get more games. |
| 20:15.57 | pupnik | big guy pushing little guy around |
| 20:16.17 | pupnik | happened that way when i wrote stuff for a company that made stuff for a biggg company |
| 20:16.25 | zerojay | It also doesn't help that our publisher gives the carriers completely non-sensical deadlines. |
| 20:16.37 | Atarii | zerojay wat company do u work for? |
| 20:17.02 | pupnik | government games |
| 20:17.08 | Atarii | :o |
| 20:17.11 | zerojay | Because this is being logged publically, I don't think I'll be saying that here. |
| 20:17.19 | Atarii | k |
| 20:17.26 | zerojay | A small project from one of the largest game companies out there. |
| 20:17.33 | zerojay | Well, we're not so small now. |
| 20:17.36 | zerojay | 3 offices. |
| 20:17.42 | zerojay | 100ish people. |
| 20:17.46 | czr | ah. you are the people behind nethack! |
| 20:17.53 | zerojay | Hahaha. |
| 20:17.59 | pupnik | that's a good size - don't get much bigger |
| 20:18.12 | zerojay | My office is already too big. |
| 20:18.18 | zerojay | 76 people or so. |
| 20:18.31 | pupnik | for a specific type of company |
| 20:18.49 | zerojay | When I started, there was about 15. |
| 20:18.59 | pupnik | nice |
| 20:19.04 | zerojay | Felt very much like a family atmosphere. |
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| 20:19.31 | zerojay | Nowadays.. not so much. Lots more people that don't really want to do well.. they just want to have something nice to put on their resume. |
| 20:20.55 | czr | it get much worse after 100 though |
| 20:21.09 | zerojay | Yeah.. that's what I'm afraid of. |
| 20:21.20 | czr | slow degradation to about 200, after that you start to read emails from people you've never met, and are likely not to meet. |
| 20:21.34 | czr | and that's where all the "not my problem" stuff starts to happen. |
| 20:21.34 | zerojay | Oh, I already do that all the time. |
| 20:21.41 | czr | since people stop being socially responsible and such |
| 20:22.09 | czr | well, obviously since you have branches around the world, but you get my meaning I hope |
| 20:22.20 | zerojay | Yeah. |
| 20:22.46 | pupnik | well lets help more young idealistic people get into game programming |
| 20:22.56 | zerojay | About 25 coworkers coming in for Guitar Hero 3 night... not bad. |
| 20:22.58 | pupnik | otherwise there won't be anyone for the suits to rape and abuse |
| 20:23.13 | czr | zerojay, heh |
| 20:23.26 | pupnik | and without the idealistic younguns with energy, the whole game collapses |
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| 20:25.11 | czr | most younglings lack perspective. |
| 20:26.13 | czr | not saying that older people have perspective either, but the odds are in their favour. |
| 20:26.21 | pupnik | i need to find more 1920s music |
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| 20:28.11 | ZenGeist | hi all |
| 20:28.18 | ZenGeist | i want to install rtcomm |
| 20:28.38 | ZenGeist | but I can not do this because of dependences :( |
| 20:28.58 | ZenGeist | evolution-data-server, but it is installed already |
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| 21:23.56 | dpryo | Somebody have a kernel for nokia 770 with support for usb-webcam? |
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| 21:36.21 | czr | silly bugs.. |
| 21:36.28 | _Monkey | Bug 2075 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2075 |
| 21:36.38 | czr | I know damn it. just re-opened it. |
| 21:37.06 | rwhitby | _Monkey: die |
| 21:37.06 | _Monkey | rwhitby: what? |
| 21:38.03 | czr | heh, you too. |
| 21:42.42 | dpryo | Is it cumbersome to setup scratchbox for kernel compiling? |
| 21:42.54 | dpryo | My robot/car needs eyes :) http://nesland.net/zen/phidgetsonwheels |
| 21:44.01 | xand | cool |
| 21:45.26 | dpryo | It's almost done, got a client app that uses sdl_joystick as input, and sends the information to the 770 via wlan, that controls the motors |
| 21:46.01 | dpryo | Would be cool to actually see where it's going ;P |
| 21:47.33 | flip^ | anyone care to offer a few thoughts on how i can go from opening the appliance to something that actually does something maemo-ish ;) |
| 21:48.45 | czr | dpryo, not very, at least for N800 |
| 21:49.38 | dpryo | I do have scratchbox setup for some compiling though.. |
| 21:50.00 | czr | dpryo, which device are you building for? |
| 21:50.07 | dpryo | But I doubt make menuconfig && make dep in a standard tree works out of the box ;P |
| 21:50.09 | dpryo | czr: 770 |
| 21:50.24 | czr | ah, then I don't know, guess the maemo.org site contains some stuff on that. |
| 21:50.38 | dpryo | I'm reading this kernel compile howto |
| 21:50.52 | dpryo | but it's a bit old, so it doesn't really describe the current sbox |
| 21:50.55 | czr | any ideas on how to get contents from tcpdump dump, in which the traffic is HTTP but with gzip-transfer encoding? :-) |
| 21:51.10 | dpryo | gunzip? :) |
| 21:51.31 | czr | neh. the data is split over multiple packets |
| 21:51.51 | Atarii | ettercap or wireshark |
| 21:52.18 | czr | Atarii, they don't do deflate/gunzip on transfer-encoded http, do they? |
| 21:52.24 | czr | that's the point. |
| 21:52.32 | czr | the tcpdump was saved from wireshark. |
| 21:52.37 | Atarii | o ok |
| 21:52.51 | Atarii | u can do it with a ettercap plugin, but before capture |
| 21:52.58 | Atarii | filter* |
| 21:54.30 | czr | hmm. is the plugin part of ettercap tarball? |
| 21:54.46 | pupnik | ignore, rwhitby |
| 21:55.01 | Atarii | u need to make an ettercap filter |
| 21:55.19 | czr | meh. |
| 21:55.25 | czr | I thought you said one existed :-) |
| 21:55.33 | Atarii | they do |
| 21:55.38 | Atarii | one sec |
| 21:55.42 | dpryo | czr: You can do it with wireshark, find the request, right click and follow tcp stream, save the stream as raw, and gunzip it |
| 21:55.53 | Atarii | http://ettercap.sourceforge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2833 |
| 21:56.06 | dpryo | (you might need to remove some of the uncompressed text from the raw file) |
| 21:56.09 | czr | dpryo, the problem is that the deflated stuff is within responses, not headers and such |
| 21:56.15 | czr | ah. I see |
| 21:56.21 | czr | well, let me try that |
| 21:56.36 | czr | trying to debug a browser bug in N800 |
| 21:56.44 | czr | and the site is sending the content in gzip TE |
| 21:58.38 | czr | "not in gzip format". oh my. |
| 21:58.48 | Atarii | ? |
| 21:58.49 | dpryo | hm, worked fine for me |
| 21:58.58 | czr | must be cutting from wrong places. |
| 21:59.21 | dpryo | Remember, do a raw dump and not hex or ascii ;P |
| 21:59.27 | czr | I did |
| 22:00.02 | czr | http://koltsoff.com/bugs/n800/2095-raw-http.txt if anyone would like to take a peek |
| 22:00.06 | czr | doesn't contain any sensitive data |
| 22:01.52 | dpryo | hm, you're right. That didn't work |
| 22:02.23 | czr | hmm. I'm wondering whether the "Transfer-Encoding: Chunked" is significant here |
| 22:02.34 | czr | the content-encoding is gzip though. |
| 22:03.04 | czr | the nasty bit is that nokia has put some kind of browser recognition to "protect" the tableteer |
| 22:03.07 | Atarii | wat did u try which didnt work? |
| 22:03.18 | czr | Atarii, what dpryo suggested |
| 22:03.52 | dpryo | ah, cracked it. |
| 22:04.11 | czr | dpryo, what was it? |
| 22:04.12 | dpryo | It's the whole/normal html |
| 22:04.23 | dpryo | php -r 'echo gzinflate(file_get_contents("2095-raw-http.txt"));' ;P |
| 22:04.34 | czr | that's evil :-) |
| 22:05.01 | czr | that explains it. meh. it's not gzip. it's deflate. |
| 22:05.07 | czr | or hmm. let me try that |
| 22:07.45 | czr | dpryo, meh, my php is unhappy. can you put the result up somewhere? |
| 22:07.49 | czr | pastebin is ok too |
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| 22:13.24 | dpryo | http://ondskap.net/2095-raw-http_inflated.txt |
| 22:14.11 | czr | aha! |
| 22:14.16 | czr | thanks a lot, you're a star |
| 22:14.29 | czr | it's not a bug in the browser after all |
| 22:14.35 | czr | it's a bloody broken webpage! :-) |
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| 22:21.20 | czr | Atarii, the ettercap filtering would have required for traffic to be passed through ettercap |
| 22:21.30 | czr | and it would removed the 'gzip' from the request |
| 22:21.42 | czr | so not really a solution in this case, but nice to know for future. |
| 22:22.03 | Atarii | maybe wud hav worked when using live data |
| 22:22.42 | czr | no. it would have required for the data to pass through ettercap |
| 22:23.00 | czr | which I cannot do (running off port-mirror from a switch, with the wlan AP being mirrored) |
| 22:23.11 | Atarii | aaaa ok |
| 22:23.34 | Atarii | unless u used arp spoofing |
| 22:23.37 | czr | although small arp-redirection could have fixed that, but rather not do that unless I want to trip alarms |
| 22:23.41 | czr | indeed. |
| 22:23.43 | Atarii | :p |
| 22:24.44 | czr | is there a webmaster address for the tableteer pages? |
| 22:33.20 | czr | nevermind. |
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| 22:40.22 | czr | night -> |
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| 23:24.03 | sully | Hey guys, just an FYI: I've set up a more tablet-friendly interface for the Internet Tablet Talk Forums at http://blog.yllus.com/itt/ |
| 23:25.58 | Atarii | nice |
| 23:26.17 | Atarii | anyway to hav a quick link to new posts? |
| 23:27.25 | sully | hmm, I'll add it as a to-do item because I'm sick of PHP for today |
| 23:27.26 | sully | haha |
| 23:27.38 | Atarii | :p |
| 23:39.24 | flip^ | is it possible to get man (and the man pages for various stuff) onto a n800? |
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