IRC log for #kde on 20101106

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00:58.40ComaWhite_anyone know how to get knetworkmanager to work with wpa2 personal tkip+aes? i know the password is correct, but i'm just not getting an ip address
01:03.59e_t_ComaWhite_: Make sure that the access point you're trying to connect to has DHCP turned on (or use a static IP). Otherwise, I'd take a look at /var/log/daemon.log and see what NetworkManager is doing when you try to connect. You might at least get a useful error there.
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01:05.13ComaWhite_e_t_, thanks, but that log doesn't exist
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01:22.12ewoernerComaWhite_: have a look at /var/log/syslog then
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01:24.17comawhite_ewoerner, doesn't exist either
01:24.41ewoernercomawhite_: what distro are you using?
01:24.51comawhite_Gentoo
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01:25.32ewoernercomawhite_: /var/log/NetworkManager.log  ?
01:25.43comawhite_nope
01:26.00ewoernercomawhite_: /var/log/messages ?
01:26.12comawhite_nein
01:27.20ewoernerokay, now i'm out of suggestions
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01:27.56comawhite_ewoerner, hehe, thanks anyways for trying :)
01:29.16Londonerim trying out basket 1.80 on fedora 14 and there was a GTD basket archive on the basket website
01:29.19comawhite_it works now for some reason
01:29.19ewoernercomawhite_: well, those logs have to be somewhere...
01:29.24ewoernerah
01:29.25comawhite_:S
01:29.28Londonerwhen i try to import the archive in basket it gives me an error
01:29.37comawhite_i reset dd-wrt to defaults and started working
01:30.02Londoner'could notwrite to /.kde/share/apps/basket/baskect-icons/xygenicons/16x16/actions/todo.png
01:30.03comawhite_ewoerner, which should I use tkip, aes + tkip, aes?
01:30.28Londonerwould someone point me in the right direction to get this working please
01:31.25ewoernercomawhite_: ideally, aes only
01:31.37comawhite_okay thanks
01:31.59ewoernercomawhite_: but you should really check whether all your hardware supports that
01:32.12comawhite_it supports them all
01:32.31comawhite_dd-wrt has too many bloody options xP
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01:33.13comawhite_now if only i can just get ipv6 to work
01:33.50ewoernercomawhite_: that comment was not about your access point, but about your laptop, mobile phone, ...
01:34.10comawhite_ah okay
01:34.16comawhite_yeah it's all good ^^
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02:01.01panziis there a way to open a plasma notification using a shell command? is there a dbus interface for this?
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02:03.15leo_rockwaypanzi: knotify4
02:03.28panzithx
02:03.32leo_rockwaynp
02:05.29panzierm, is there a documentations of this somewhere? --help is not helpful
02:06.32panziah, I have to use notify-send
02:07.04leo_rockwaythere's also kdialog
02:07.23panzigod the layout of the notification areay is jumping around like mad when you remove an item!
02:07.35leo_rockwayand there's this thread about using it along with dbus http://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=23580
02:07.37panzileo_rockway: nope, no passivepopup in kdialoge anymore
02:07.45leo_rockwaypanzi: it's working here...
02:08.00leo_rockwayit disappears after a few seconds
02:08.09panziI don't have the passive popup option anymore, thats why I ask
02:08.21leo_rockway--passivepopup <text> <timeout> Passive Popup
02:08.34leo_rockway$ kdialog --version
02:08.35leo_rockwayQt: 4.7.0
02:08.36leo_rockwayKDE Development Platform: 4.5.3 (KDE 4.5.3)
02:08.38leo_rockwayKDialog: 1.0
02:09.09leo_rockwaybut you can always use notify-send
02:09.45leo_rockwayI used pynotify from Python
02:10.11panzihm, it works. maybe just the parameters changed? because a script (not by me) that uses it used to work but now only produces error msgs
02:10.26panzipynotify! interesting
02:10.32leo_rockwayI had never used --passivepopup before. Maybe the parameters changed.
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02:12.05panzihm or maybe the script just does not escape arguments properly
02:12.14leo_rockwaythat would be an issue too...
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02:14.19fatpelt_laptopevenin all.  i'm having a problem with knetworkmanager on fedora.  it only shows "networking interface" in the "restrict to interface" dialog box.  have i missed some setting somewhere?
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02:36.05Guest3812Just a quick question - is KDE "resource hungry"?
02:38.10Sho_KDE is very configurable, so it can be configured to a great range of different resource usage profiles, iow you get to decide whether you want to enable features and expend the resources they need
02:38.30Sho_iow, no, it's not inherently "resource hungry"
02:40.37Guest3812Oh fantastic. I'm in 2 minds about switching from a gnome distrobution to a kde one. I'm relatively new to Linux and I like the way the gnome menu's are set out - yet I really prefer the "prettier" graphics of KDE - not to mention, KDE seem to have more native apps than gnome.
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03:44.43EffBeeSo I'm trying to figure out how to get governor switching working with PowerDevil in SC 4.5
03:44.50comawhite_I have my desktop (Windows 7) and my laptop (Gentoo Linux), how can I access my desktop from my laptop?
03:45.03Sho_krdc
03:45.11EffBeeSeriously, you guys made it so that not only can I not select which governor to use, it doesn't even use ANY governor
03:45.23EffBeeI tried getting it to run scripts when the different power profiles are executed
03:45.28EffBeeBut the governor doesn't change?
03:45.31Sho_there's a completely-rewritten PowerDevil 2 coming in 4.6 ..
03:45.38EffBeeSho_: Well, I kinda need this now
03:45.55Sho_yeah, and I'd try to help if I knew anything about PowerDevil, sorry
03:46.06EffBeeIIRC it was changed so that downstream devs could choose how the powersaving occurs
03:46.12EffBeeThere's a single checkbox you can check
03:46.15EffBeeTo enable powersaving
03:46.23EffBeeI am on Arch Linux and the checkbox basically does nothing
03:46.31EffBeeWould really like some more information about this
03:47.05EffBeeI can shave power usage by 20% if I can have the Powersave profile enable the ondemand governor...
03:47.09Sho_You should try to catch drf / drf_ on IRC (PowerDevil author)
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04:05.45sortadicould anybody list some of the main and nicest linux app for controlling things over bluetooth with a smartphone?
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05:37.10ThibitIs there a way to force the toolbar for the netbook plasma desktop to stay shown?
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05:50.17aseigoThibit: let me check...
05:51.49aseigoThibit: yep... click on the panel toolbox and there is a "Autohide" button
05:51.54aseigoThibit: make sure it isn't selected.
05:53.20ThibitHrm... Am unable to find it for some reason
05:56.29aseigoThibit: what version are you running?
05:57.09Thibit4.5.3 vanilla in Arch Linux
05:58.09aseigohm.. right click on the panel, make sure "unlock" is selected?
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05:59.35ThibitHrm...  It's still not showing...
06:00.10aseigogrr.. the machine i have with netbook running on it is not here right now, and marco is asleep as he should be on european time
06:00.27aseigoah! i wonder if this is 4.6 only.
06:00.29aseigogoes to look
06:00.53ThibitI believe that the desktop and netbook plasma desktops have different options available via the UI
06:01.22ThibitThe version change would make a difference though.
06:01.39aseigohm, no, it seems to be in 4.5
06:01.59aseigoshould be in the context menu for the panel after it is unlocked.
06:02.36ThibitWeird... I just found it in the config file though
06:04.01ThibitAha!
06:04.24ThibitI had to click on the cashew before it appeared
06:04.36aseigoah, yes. that's the "panel toolbox" :)
06:05.01ThibitXD
06:05.11ThibitOk, that makes sense now
06:05.25aseigoharbors a personal despisement for the term "cashew" ... it was a funny joke one late night 2 years ago, but is less funny now ;)
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06:07.22ThibitSadly the slang/joke term often reaches farther audiences than the technical term
06:08.27aseigoindeed :)
06:09.07aseigolesson learned. humor is fun, until someone loses an eye .. er .. someone starts using the joke as a serious term
06:09.31aseigonotes that a few terms in plasma started that way.
06:10.45ThibitAye
06:11.36ThibitOutside of the toolbox, what other terms have a more common slang version?
06:11.57aseigoplasmoid :)
06:12.08aseigothat was another joke at one point.
06:12.20aseigoseveral of the internal names, e.g. Corona and Containment
06:13.11aseigoit works well for community stuff. Tokamak is word play, for instance, but it helps give our dev meet ups a nice tone
06:13.15ThibitThe plasmoid is a good term in my own opinion.  Stands out in comparison to widget
06:13.50aseigoyeah, i'm like plasmoid these days. i was initially taken by surprise (== shock) when people starting using that term
06:14.06aseigosince it was, quite literally, a joke during an irc session one night
06:14.22aseigobut it stuck. at least it's a decent term. at least, i was able to get used to it :)
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06:14.34aseigomaybe "cashew" will rub off on me one day too
06:15.11ThibitIt hit me wrong at first too.  Kinda funny now that I look back.  Just suddenly didn't care anymore
06:15.15aseigoanyways, glad you found it :)
06:15.25ThibitAye.  As am I.
06:15.55ThibitAnd thank you for your assistance!
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06:17.03ThibitHrm... I like the idea behind both Corona and Containment, as they literally explain themselves
06:17.17chris000i'm having a problem with kde- i login and it freezes at the splash screen- when the desktop icons appears on the splash screen that is... not sure why it does this. it is only on certain hardware. any ideas?
06:17.37aseigoas long as you are familiar with stars and fusion reactors, yes ;)
06:17.50ThibitXD
06:18.44aseigoodd how many software developers are, though, for "some" reason .. heeh
06:18.48chris000* kde is running on atom hardware
06:19.01ThibitAm afraid that know not the answer to your question chris000.
06:19.15aseigochris000: hm.. does it do this with a new user account on the same machine?
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06:19.50Thibitthinks that it's in part due to just how fascinating the subjects are to logically-minded people
06:20.13aseigolord knows i've spent more time than i care to admit reading about them :)
06:20.22chris000aseiga well, the account i'm logging in as is a new account on the machine. i haven't tried setting up any others.
06:20.25aseigo(and in the case of stars, looking at them in wonder :)
06:20.54aseigochris000: ok; reason i ask is that sometimes such issues are due to configuration data in, e.g., ~/.kde
06:21.00chris000aseiga: it is a fresh oem install
06:21.25aseigochris000: if it happens with even a new user, and it's stuck on the desktop icon ... *thinks*
06:21.34aseigogoes to look at what triggers the next stage in the code
06:22.03EffBeeaseigo: Not sure if you're the best person to answer this, but... why does changing activity icons require Nepomuk? You don't need it to change the activity's name...
06:27.02aseigochris000: hm, how long have you let it sit at that stage?
06:27.26aseigochris000: looking at the startup sequence, there should be a hard timeout at 60 seconds, though that should in theory also not be waited on.
06:28.13aseigoEffBee: because they are stored in nepomuk. there's probably no particularly great reason for that: they could be stored in the fallback much like the names are.
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06:28.33aseigoEffBee: iirc, the reason for that decision was to make the fallback path as reliable and simple (as a result) as possible
06:28.56chris000aseigo: i'm sure i've left it for more than 60 seconds at least on one occasion... however normally i probably have not waited more than 40 seconds. it becomes obvious after a handful that it is stuck.
06:29.18aseigoEffBee: which means all but the bare essentials are sacrificed without nepomuk. lowers the cost of testing and development of the fallback, and raises the reliability of it
06:29.57aseigoEffBee: i think it is debatable whether or not icon configurability is the "right" place to draw that line, but that's where it was drawn by the developers writing that code
06:30.06EffBeeaseigo: Okay, thanks
06:30.13aseigoEffBee: these days, given that nepomuk is really quite stable, i don't think it's a huge issue anymore tbh
06:30.18EffBeeAh
06:30.20aseigoworst case, turn off disk indexing
06:30.20chris000aseigo: the first time i probably waited hours- several
06:30.28*** part/#kde JackFromShadow (~silencer@furious-debiter.volia.net)
06:30.41EffBeeWell, I just have Nepomuk disabled right now because I don't have much use for it currently, and just want to keep footprint down
06:31.05chris000aseigo: how do i turn off disk indexing?
06:31.05aseigochris000: hm. ok, so that implies that something is wrong with the startup sequence itself. if you click on the splash screen, it goes away. can you click on it and see what is behind it?
06:31.26aseigochris000: reason why is i'm wondering if it is "the startup is screwed" or "the splash isn't getting notified of the startup being completed"
06:31.31chris000aseigo: if i click on the splash screen once it becomes stuck nothing happens
06:32.03aseigothat's interesting. that implies that it's not just idling, but has actually died.
06:32.13EffBeeIf you guys can do something awesome with activities + Nepomuk, I might be convinced to turn Nepomuk back on :)
06:32.33aseigothat could be the xserver no longer repainting due to, for instance, desktop effects kicking in and the driver going tits up
06:32.54aseigochris000: disk indexing can be turned off in system settings in the nepomuk control panel, "Desktop Search"
06:33.10aseigofirst tab on that panel, in fact, a simple checbox
06:33.42aseigoEffBee: in 4.6 we have session-follows-activities. meaning windows come and go with activities and apps start/stop as well
06:34.00aseigoEffBee: we have a patch to make the Places entries change with activities as well
06:34.28aseigowe're still just at the start of what's possible though. Activity-via-nepomuk only finally made it in with 4.5. 4.6 is the first release we start to really use it for things reliably
06:34.53aseigoit'll be another couple of releases before we're doing a reasonable % of what is possible.
06:35.23aseigoone thing i'm really looking forward to, for completely selfish reasons, is network-connectivity-triggers-activity-setting
06:35.29EffBeeHmm, okay, Nepomuk's not that bad on resources
06:35.42EffBeeI do wonder what that disk I/O is when I enable it
06:36.00aseigothe first bit of I/O is setting up the RDF store
06:36.06aseigo(virtuoso, e.g.)
06:36.28aseigooh, and akonadi uses nepomuk for indexing
06:36.53aseigowhich makes email searches pretty amazingly fast (not that desktop kontact uses that yet; kontact mobile does though)
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06:37.30aseigonotes that full text searches through 20k emails is sooo sloooow without something like nepomuk
06:37.47EffBeeHmm, this brings up another question
06:38.00aseigosome of the identity stuff that is bubbling is interesting as well .. email + im + desktop searchability
06:38.16aseigobut i'm not sure yet when shippables will land
06:39.16EffBeeI currently use activities for switching between widget sets, namely Folder View for my cloud items, a workspace for putting sticky notes on, one for testing random widgets, and one I use as my main, which includes a couple quick links and a wallpaper slideshow
06:39.28EffBeeWould the new activities stuff present a problem for this use case?
06:40.00EffBeeAs it stands, I use virtual desktops to manage my projects rather than activities
06:40.51EffBeeAnd I'm using activities as mainly a quick access feature
06:40.52aseigothey are orthogonal
06:41.12aseigowe had many long discussions and did some research on how to tie virtual desktops and activities together
06:41.35aseigoand decided "we shouldn't, unless the person does so themselves"
06:42.19EffBeeI must admit, the idea of using activities as a session manager on a per-project basis sounds very cool
06:42.27aseigoone idea that we have considered, and indeed are closer to being able to implement now that we have kwin on board with activities in 4.6, is to let one adjust their virtual desktop configuration with the activity
06:42.32EffBeeAs long as I don't have to strictly follow that paradigm
06:42.45aseigoEffBee: yeah, you're the poster child for why we made the decision we did ;)
06:42.52EffBeeHeh
06:43.05aseigowe enumerated all the actual use cases we could find more than a handful of our users employing
06:43.13aseigotbh, that really sucked
06:43.33aseigobecause it turns out that we have large groups using the desktop + virtual desktops in very, very different ways
06:43.52aseigoany pre-described choice was going to alienate a very, very significant % of people (both current users and future)
06:44.16aseigoso we had to ask ourselves: "can we make a product that doesn't suck and doesn't prescribe one true way?"
06:44.21EffBeeI use first virtual desktop for main web stuff, last virtual desktop for my music player
06:44.25aseigothat was not an easy question to answer either.
06:44.32EffBeeThe virtual desktops in between are sorta fair game
06:44.37aseigoEffBee: yes, for people who use virtual desktops, that is a very common use case
06:44.54EffBeeSometimes I just use virtual desktops to get around stacking clutter
06:45.11aseigodoes web on 1, api documentation on 6, email on 4, IM (e.g. this irc convo) on 2, devel konsoles on 3, media on 5
06:45.12EffBeeIt is almost impossible for me to work efficiently when there's more than two layers of stacking going on
06:45.18aseigoyep
06:45.31EffBeeAnd I expand the number of desktops where appropriate
06:45.42EffBeeThe + - buttons in Desktop Grid are an awesome addition BTW
06:46.00aseigoyeah, that's one of the things we may well end up adding once we figure out a "natural" UI for it: virt desktop config associated with activity
06:46.19aseigoyep. gratuitously borrowed from gnome shell. :)
06:46.41aseigodelivered earlier.
06:47.02EffBeePersonally not very wowed by GNOME Shell
06:47.04aseigo"good artists borrow, great artists steal" and "real artists ship"
06:47.18aseigowe aspire to be great artists ;)
06:47.22EffBeeAdmittedly it would make it very easy for casual users to take advantage of virtual desktops, but eh
06:47.25aseigosomeday we'll be there
06:47.27EffBeeI'm a power user
06:47.40EffBeeI find GNOME kinda bothersome to use
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06:47.47aseigounfortunately, casual users don't care much for virtual desktops
06:47.58chris000how do i get  nepomuk up from the terminal?
06:48.04aseigo"casual" is a synonym for "don't need them"
06:48.19EffBeeWell, the design more or less forces users to activate the virtual desktop display in order to launch applications or reach recent documents
06:48.27EffBeeWhich exposes the user to the functionality
06:48.33aseigochris000: nepomukserver
06:48.48EffBeeSort of a cheap way to expose said functionality though
06:48.58aseigoEffBee: yes, which is my concern with that design. it's modal, which is rarely good. and the modality is one few will likely find comfortable.
06:49.04aseigocasual users don't need it
06:49.08aseigopower users usually don't want it.
06:49.21aseigoso you get a small group in the middle.
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06:49.43aseigobut everyone gets forced into that modality when launching an application
06:50.09aseigocertainly gutsy to optimize for a vertical like that, but i'm not sure it'll end up satisfying many as a result
06:51.02EffBeeThe one thing that sort of bothers me about GNOME as a project
06:51.12aseigocombined with the lack of pretty much any other interesting innovations (no widget API, little extensibility, no applicability to other form factors), things like unity seem like an innevitability.
06:51.32aseigoi hope for the sake of gnome's long term health and well being that it works out for them, though
06:51.40EffBeeI migrated from Windows because I was tired of having an experience pre-molded for me without being able to customize it
06:51.58aseigomonoculture isn't awesome, and single vendor solutions like unity are not healthy mho
06:52.01EffBeeAnd it's gotten worse with the transition to Aero Experience
06:52.08aseigoyep
06:52.28EffBeeGNOME is more of less the same thing... just FOSS instead of proprietary, really.
06:52.46EffBeeFOSS is a nice bonus, but it's not the #1 reason I moved to Linux actually
06:53.15EffBeeActually KDE 3.5 (Kubuntu in the early days) convinced me to give Linux a chance
06:53.27aseigofreedom is most often delivered in a trojan horse ;)
06:53.54comawhite_trojan horse eh?
06:54.01EffBeeLeft KDE when 4.0 came out (at least, for XP / KDE 3.5), went back to KDE when 4.2 came out
06:54.10aseigochris000: oh, right, your stuck desktop problem. hm.
06:54.58aseigochris000: i am curious if turning off desktop effects in the config would make any difference.
06:55.01comawhite_well idk why the distros pushed 4.0 on people
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06:55.25EffBeeKubuntu didn't, but they pushed 4.1
06:55.40comawhite_didn't fedora push 4.0
06:55.42EffBeeAnd that's where most of the backlash came from, really
06:55.55EffBeeSome guy used Kubuntu Intrepid and wrote an angry article about it
06:56.22aseigochris000: open up ~/.kde/share/config/kwinrc in a text editor from a console (even if it doesn't exist yet)
06:56.33aseigochris000: and make sure there is something like this in it:
06:56.39aseigo[Compositing]
06:56.44aseigoEnabled=false
06:57.03aseigochris000: if that isn't it, then we can discount that as a problem.
06:58.07aseigoEffBee: 4.0/4.1 was indeed hard times. realistically i don't know how much different it could have been without making safer choices 2-3 years prior to that but dooming KDE to irrelevance due to not being able to remain competitive
06:58.46aseigorealistically == with the manpower we had, timing of various events both in and out of our direct control and how our relationships were with our distribution partners at the time
06:59.08comawhite_when i seen kde4 i couldn't stand kde3 anymore :P
06:59.12aseigoa lot has improved as a result, if nothing else.
06:59.23EffBeeI honestly kinda miss KDE3 a little
06:59.34EffBeeIf only because it gave a good first impression of Linux
06:59.45EffBeeBut SC 4 is exciting
06:59.59aseigoit certainly did give a good first impression
07:00.09aseigorelative to what was available then
07:00.35aseigoit is a hell of a lot harder to do the same when people have MacOS and Windows 7 as well known options
07:00.38comawhite_i don't miss kde3
07:01.24aseigoon a positive note, something in my last zypper update sped the bloody crap out of x.org on my laptop
07:01.33comawhite_one thing, i hope kde4 gets more popular and more stabled across OSes
07:01.41aseigoswitching windows and desktops is noticeably smoother and faster ... yay!
07:01.47aseigocomawhite_: agreed
07:02.09EffBeeI'm an Arch user. I find OpenSUSE bothersome, but that's just me :)
07:02.15comawhite_the only thing i don't like about kde being on mac/win i can't use C++0x
07:02.16comawhite_xD
07:02.23comawhite_I'm a Gentoo user
07:02.36aseigoand there's a flavor of love for each of us :)
07:02.41comawhite_mhmm
07:02.46EffBeeActually recently switched my laptop from OpenSUSE to Arch
07:02.52comawhite_Gentoo performs nice on my lappy ^^
07:03.00aseigoArch is really getting popular. which is cool.
07:03.05EffBeeAnd in that transition went from 4.4 and 4.5 and noticed that 4.5 is really laptop-friendly. Nice enhancements going on.
07:03.18aseigowe're trying :)
07:03.24comawhite_i love Arch, just don't like the "we don't ship debug/devel builds"
07:03.38chris000i figured out what the problem was- desktop effects was enabled.
07:03.48aseigowoah! blur works properly now too and without speed defects!
07:03.51EffBeecomawhite_: That's forgivable when you get latest stable releases in a matter of days (usually)
07:03.58szalwas very fond of Arch for about half a year, but then Arch started to seriously fall apart... plus KDE4 at that time ran noticeably smoother on openSUSE than on Arch (4.3.x)
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07:04.09aseigomgraeslin's work on that stuff in the last weeks is REALLY paying off ...
07:04.14aseigodoes a bunch of dances.
07:04.16comawhite_EffBee: that's why I stick with Gentoo, I get my last builds, plus all my debug libraries
07:04.41comawhite_plus it only takes like 5 hours or less to install Gentoo from barebones to kde4 full
07:04.45EffBeeI don't have time to compile all my software :P
07:05.00EffBeeI already find it kinda annoying that I have to compile firefox-kde-opensuse
07:05.03comawhite_EffBee: let it go when you sleep :P
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07:05.18comawhite_EffBee: blame mozilla's dumb license :P
07:05.45chris000aseigo:Compositing is what exactly? does that mean that there is no 3d acceleration ?
07:05.58comawhite_wonders why in dragon, the video gets choppy in the middle of the screen
07:06.08*** join/#kde roz (~roz@ip72-196-27-252.om.om.cox.net)
07:07.10EffBeeWhat sort of speed improvements can we see in 4.6? As it stands, I have to set Powermizer to Performance and set QT_GRAPHICSSYSTEM=raster systemwide (or, at least, on plasma-desktop) to keep things snappy
07:07.33EffBeeWith 4.4 I used to be able to just set Powermizer to Performance to have a snappy desktop
07:07.42*** join/#kde MetalDust (~metaldust@75-32-203-61.lightspeed.ftwotx.sbcglobal.net)
07:07.56Sho_there's a fair amount of speed improvements in kwin coming in 4.6
07:07.59rozi have kde 4.4 or 4.5... formerly a dual monitor setup, anyway; the toolbar (whatever Kicker is now called) is gone... it was on my right monitor, and i think since that was #2 its still trying to put it there
07:08.21rozi'm not exactly sure whats wrong or how to get it back
07:08.26EffBeeSomething about 4.5 traded for snappiness in individual applications versus snappiness of the whole desktop. Namely, in 4.5, desktop switching feels sluggish when switching to/from desktops with certain applications
07:08.56roznot sure where the setting is for that..
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07:09.32rozthe mouse wont roll over to a second monitor; so its not that theres one with stuff there that i cant see...
07:09.57EffBeeHas that been sorted out for 4.6?
07:10.03EffBee(Using nVidia binary blob)
07:10.10rozor maybe its not running; but i dont know what "it" is (whatever kicker is now called)
07:10.47EffBeeroz: Panel. Part of Plasma. If you're desperate you can just unlock widgets, right-click and choose Add Panel
07:10.50EffBeeAnd make a new one
07:11.10EffBeeIn 4.5 you have a template for spawning the default panel
07:11.34aseigochris000: yes, 3d accel
07:11.51aseigoEffBee: interestingly, the next version of Qt defaults to raster
07:11.57EffBeeaseigo: Aha
07:12.14EffBeeWill probably cause issues for OpenOffice though
07:12.16aseigoEffBee: but for performance, kwin has seen some massive improvements, plasma is using a HELL of a lot fewer pixmaps, oxygen is faster...
07:12.37EffBeeIts (rather experimental) KDE4 integration depends on Qt using native X11
07:12.44aseigoEffBee: it'll probably just override it if we don't get such issues fixed.
07:12.55rozEffBee:  so the panel is stuck on the other screen...
07:13.05EffBeeaseigo: Will this new Qt version ship with 4.6?
07:14.00aseigoroz: if it shares a screen edge with another existing panel, it won't try and migrate automatically. you can do it with desktop scripting though, using http://techbase.kde.org/KDE_System_Administration/PlasmaDesktopScripting
07:14.10aseigois too tired to write a script here for that, though, right at this very moment
07:14.23EffBeeOpenOffice.org using KDE SC 4 integration just closes out with Qt using raster
07:14.27aseigoi should probably just include a Snippet for that in 4.6
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07:14.48aseigoEffBee: kde 4.6 will depend on Qt 4.7, but when 4.8 is out distros will likely pair it up anyways
07:14.52EffBeeThe new LibreOffice (which seems to have more mature KDE SC 4 integration) just doesn't render the areas where the Qt widgets go :P
07:15.03rozso my default panel is lost, basically until i turn a second monitor back on...
07:15.07EffBeeWhich looks funny
07:15.15aseigoEffBee: in the meantime, distros can already default it to raster ... needs lots of testing, though, which is why i doubt we'll see it widely done before qt 4.8
07:15.25rozOh this is cool stuff
07:15.30roznever played with it before
07:15.41aseigothe desktop scripting? yeah, it's awesome (if i may say so myself ;)
07:16.07aseigoi use it all the time now, though i have rather peculiar use cases as a developer
07:16.15EffBeeI'd like to see KDE SC 4 + Wayland...
07:16.32EffBeeOf course, that's a ways from now
07:16.41aseigowell, regardless of wayland or not, we're moving to opengl rendering
07:16.49Sho_EffBee: you might not once you realize that wayland means losing kwin ;)
07:17.04aseigoor rather more impotantly, scene graph based UIs
07:17.12rozhow do i make the new panel span the width of the scrren?
07:17.18aseigowayland is interesting, but it's not really the answer for applications
07:17.32EffBeeroz: More Settings -> Maximize panel
07:17.35aseigoto really take advantage of what a GPU can do, you have to use a scene graph for the graphical bits
07:17.52rozah thats not what I expected maximize to do
07:17.56aseigowhich means something like QML, not just shoving today's painter based UIs on top of wayland
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07:18.20Sho_aseigo: if I were martin I'd be pretty pissed right now - he came back from UDS happily blogging that he had come to an agreement with Canonical about dropping the client-side window deco plans, and then shortly after UDS they announce the Wayland thing (which, heh, implies csds)
07:18.30aseigoroz: you can also use the sizers manually, or use desktop scripting. but Maximize is the quick way
07:18.48rozOMG i am copying all my data from a PATA drive to the SATA drive; 100s of gigs; system dragging so slow
07:18.52EffBeeaseigo: I think right now my main concerns with X11 are bad performance in the Qt X11 backend, and rather sucky display sync
07:19.05aseigoEffBee: indeed
07:19.07EffBeeI can't rely on EG. games delivering a reliable 60hz unless I disable compositing
07:19.23EffBeeActually, I have the same issue on Windows 7 here
07:19.24Sho_EffBee: Fullscreen games?
07:19.35EffBeeSho_: Windowed. Fullscreen bypasses compositing
07:19.50Sho_EffBee: that's what I was going to point out, yeah :-)
07:19.52Marquelmorning. is it somehow possible to have kde change mouse cursor theme on certain events (like desktopeffects switched off, accu capacity going low) and change back on other events (power brick plugged in)?
07:20.15EffBeeAnyway, I'm not sure, but it looks like OS X has found a way to magically make the desktop and applications display at a flawless 60hz without any random frame dropping
07:20.25EffBeeWhich is sorta why I'm interested in Wayland
07:20.28EffBeeBut again, not really sure
07:20.35aseigogets an emal from cdash.org about a failed automated test in the kde sources .. it's ALIVE!
07:20.43Sho_Marquel: PowerDevil can run scripts on such events iirc (or maybe the trunk version can, anyway?), combine that with the mouse cursor KCM's cursor theme switching code, ..
07:21.03aseigoEffBee: wayland is aimed at addressing the window compositing issues, yes
07:21.34aseigoEffBee: it still doesn't do a damn thing, however, for things like "we'd like animations in plasma run at video game speed and without taking oodles of CPU or power"
07:22.17aseigoEffBee: it also helps that apple controls the hardware and the software and so can ensure that all of its video drivers do sane things with, e.g., vsync
07:22.26Sho_EffBee: the problem with wayland is that it rolls window management into the display server, and recreating kwin-like window management prowess is not an overnight job. it will also likely mean moving window decoration painting into the toolkit, which is a potential consistency nightmare between them.
07:22.55aseigoSho_: yeah, i'm not a fan of many of the design decisions in wayland.
07:23.09EffBeeHmm, yeah
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07:23.32EffBeeFunny thing is that OS X doesn't even support OpenGL 3.0 yet
07:23.38Sho_the X model may be comparatively inefficient, but that inefficiency buys abilities and flexibility you don't have otherwise, which doesn't actually make it that inefficient if you think about it :)
07:23.42EffBeeEven though they're shipping OpenGL 3.3-capable cards
07:23.53aseigowishes ubuntu had someone with more technical genius making these decisions
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07:24.14aseigoEffBee: it's not a gaming console, after all :)
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07:24.43MarquelSho_: that's "kind of abusing powerdevil's notify subsystem", right? at least there i found a setting for program execution on certain events :)
07:25.34EffBeeSpeaking of PowerDevil, still need to figure out how to get cpufreq working again since 4.5 changed it
07:26.14Sho_Marquel: sounds like you've hit upon a knotify standard dialog, which actually isn't what i had in mind, but might indeed work for your purposes too (since all you need is some kind of hook you can launch a script from, after all)
07:26.14EffBeeReplaced the CPU governor selection with a single checkbox which I assume is controlled by downstream developers, but... how?
07:26.19MarquelEffBee: tbh. i'm just using ondemand governor all teh time ;)
07:26.53EffBeeI should consider that, actually
07:27.06EffBeeI have ondemand all the time on my desktop
07:27.28EffBeeBut I have the up_threshold set to 40 instead of the rather high default of... 95 I think?!
07:27.48MarquelSho_: jep. that would also make it possible to hit the script from more than just powerdevil events. powerdevil's profiles do not support arbitrary actions - at least not in 4.5.3.
07:28.17EffBeeMarquel: Is that why I can't run that script changing the governor?
07:28.17Sho_and kwin has a knotify event for compositing suspend/resume, iirc
07:28.33EffBeeOr is it a permissions problem?
07:28.56MarquelEffBee: i think the latter. governor changing requires root privileges iirc.
07:29.07EffBeeYes, it does
07:29.22EffBeeI was just wondering, though, if PowerDevil did any special magic with privs
07:29.32MarquelSho_: now i'll just need to figure out how to change mouse cursor icon set from commandline ;)
07:29.59Marquel(but not now, compiling kde-4.5.3 takes too much of cpu and hd-io. :( )
07:30.07Sho_Marquel: since you're a coder you could do what i'd probably do, which is isolate the moue cursor kcm's code into a standalone executable :)
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07:30.55Marquelneeds a larger harddisc for all the parts of kde he's supposed to be taking apart...
07:30.56Sho_(or read the code, and use the thus-gained knowledge to google for one that may already exist)
07:31.22Sho_http://lxr.kde.org/ always comes in handy for the taking-apart phase ;)
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07:33.14MarquelSho_: you guys have an astonishing set of tools available. (now if only apidox would contain example code....) - no, i don't think i'll write such docs for every class you provide ;)
07:33.39Sho_there's a pretty full kdeexamples module .. :-)
07:33.56aseigoMarquel: http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/KDE/kdeexamples/
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07:34.55Marquelokay, looks like i need to write an ebuild for that thing...
07:36.19aseigoMarquel: contributions welcome of course :)
07:36.25Sho_(extra lxr.kde.org trivia: what many don't know is that it doesn't just offer the ability to perform searches for identifiers in source as well as words and phrases in both source and filenames, but can also just be used to browse and view the sources - and is much faster at that than websvn, with the trade-off that it doesn't have history and syncs less frequently)
07:36.41Sho_(and it even covers git.kde.org!)
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07:40.03rozaseigo: alright   - i got it all back
07:40.14rozand some way cool new things
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07:41.02aseigoroz: yay! :)
07:42.19rozaseigo: I caved and bought a new system
07:42.42Marquelaseigo: one day i'll restart working on kopete-cryptographyplugin. once i figured out how to do settings for each account like OTR already does ;)
07:42.47rozaseigo: had an athlon 1600; have been running gentoo on it for 8 years
07:43.17rozaseigo: just got an intel core i5 with 8gb of ram; kde flies...
07:44.48aseigoroz: niiiice
07:45.37rozoff to bed now  tks for the help
07:47.16EffBeeI run a Phenom II X6 on my system
07:48.01EffBeeI bought a six-core system with the assumption that applications would soon be able to take advantage of the processing power
07:48.06EffBeeOr sometime in the near future anyway
07:50.11MarquelEffBee: i'm afraid they will not. you might be able to run more computing intensive tasks side by side or even more tasks with less response time, but as there are some problems which can not be parallelized, that'll be your only benefit ;)
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07:52.45aseigonotes that both plasma and krunner are threaded :)
07:53.14aseigoand once we complete the move to QML in plasma, we'll be able to make every plasmoid run in its own thread (or not) at runtime
07:53.17aseigo== core usage
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07:58.48rozaseigo: plasma desktop window is screwed up; but i'm not sure how to fix it
08:00.42rozaseigo: its blank; just a blank plama rectangle
08:00.47rozplasma*
08:01.21rozi think it used to contain the desktop items
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08:07.23rozhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/55563878@N03/5150785366/   trying to get rid of the box on the bottom; but not sure what it is...
08:08.02rozalt-tabing says its "plasma-desktop"
08:10.28Thibitwonders if the conversion to fewer pixmaps in 4.6.x will make it harder for those who have minimal VRAM
08:12.25EffBeeErr, why would it
08:12.35EffBeeWouldn't it free up VRAM?
08:12.55ThibitI have not a clue to be honest... XD
08:13.23ThibitAm unedumacated in the realm of video acceleration other than it works or it doesn't for the most part
08:13.44ThibitMakes sense though
08:13.51EffBeeAlso, fewer pixmaps is good news for the nVidia binary blob driver which seems to perform rather poorly when it comes to applications using lots of pixmaps apparently
08:14.09EffBeeOr so it would seem from the Qt X11 backend on Linux
08:14.33EffBeeI'm not a dev, don't take my word for it :P
08:14.36EffBeeI do read the blogs though
08:15.00ThibitI found that KWin has been unable to have rendering acceleration on my GPU since 4.4, so am slightly hoping that it'll be back down the road
08:15.29Thibit16MB of VRAM is a tight fit for everything :P
08:16.36EffBeeHeh
08:16.52EffBeeI have 896MB of VRAM I think
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08:18.29ThibitMight possibly also be the move to a higher level of OGL than my GPU can handle.  'Tis an ATi Radeon Mobility.  Was pleasantly surprised to find that I could have minimal graphical acceleration...
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08:27.59RLain dolphin why there are small rectangles appearing on icons sometimes?
08:30.07EffBeeCould be the SVN integration
08:30.29RLahm, probably
08:30.43RLastill, rectangles seem to be completely random
08:31.46RLayes, these are svn rectangles
08:32.25RLait says "Updating version info" in status bar and then the rectangles appear when the message goes away
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08:37.00ichbinderhey there. It's probably a newbie question, but I found it difficult to search for: i recently installed Krusader and now it keeps poping up every time I log in... I guess it's somehow stored with a KDE session, I heard that this is often a problem. How can I edit/remove things from a session?
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09:34.30JishaxeHello
09:34.35JishaxeCan I ask for help here?
09:34.56*** join/#kde fLoOd` (~fLo0d``@94.26.35.22)
09:34.56cb400fif you need help with kde yes, just ask
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09:35.12Jishaxe'Kay thanks
09:35.27JishaxeQuite a few things I need help with actually
09:35.27cb400fof course there's no guarantee you'll actually get the help you want/need.. but that's a different topic :-)
09:36.13JishaxeI run Linux Mint 9 KDE (Yes I have been asking to no avail in #linuxmint-help for these questions)
09:36.31JishaxeOn an Acer Aspire, uh, 720 I think
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09:38.13Jishaxe1) When I boot, KNetworkManager prompts me for the password for the wallet that contains my router's WPA code. This is very annoying. Is there a way I can get it not to prompt it but the password still in that wallet?
09:38.47JishaxeI would like to be able to boot fully with the only user input my username and password when I log in.
09:38.50cb400fI think you can just set an empty password for kwallet
09:39.05cb400fif it's any consolation a kwallet replacement is in the works
09:39.45JishaxeKinda defeats the point of an encrypted password, but people hitchhike my Wifi all the time. And if my laptop gets stolen they're not exactly going to be near the point, are they
09:39.51JishaxeKthanks, I didn't think of that
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09:40.32maskiohi guys
09:40.44JishaxeHey maskio
09:40.46maskioi got this error: Nepomuk Indexing Agents Have Been Disabled
09:40.58maskioThe Nepomuk service is not available or fully operational
09:41.09maskioThe following problems were detected:
09:41.19maskioCalling the Nepomuk storage service failed: 'The name org.kde.NepomukStorage was not provided by any .service files'.
09:42.11maskio2239 ?        Sl     0:00 /usr/bin/nepomukserver
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09:45.17Jishaxe2) Now this is an ongoing problem I've had for about a month
09:45.55JishaxeIt's very long, so I've written it on a forum
09:46.45Jishaxehttp://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=109&t=58602 read  it if you want, I'll sum it up anyway
09:47.18JishaxeMy screen is stretched, it does not have the correct reselotion
09:47.44JishaxeI also cannot change the brightness
09:48.02JishaxeI know what the right drivers are
09:48.15JishaxeWhen I install them, X stops booting
09:48.28JishaxeSo I have to purge them to get X working again
09:48.37JishaxeBut the screen's still stretched
09:48.47JishaxeHelp would be appreciated, please
09:48.52JishaxeThanks
09:49.38JishaxeIt worked when I ran GNOME
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09:50.08joanHello all
09:50.31joanI-m a noob Linux user
09:50.53joanI use ubuntu allways
09:51.25joani-m searcing a debian based distro with kde
09:51.37Jishaxejoan: LMDE
09:51.46JishaxeLinux Mint Debian Edition
09:51.55joanJishaxe: is ubuntu based
09:51.58joanno_
09:52.00joan?
09:52.04JishaxeLinux Mint is based on Ubuntu and debian
09:52.13JishaxeI mean
09:52.17joanI prefer debian
09:52.19JishaxeLinux Mint is based on Ubuntu
09:52.28joanI see Debian with KDE or Sidux
09:52.30JishaxeLinux Mint Debian Edition is based on Debian
09:52.35JishaxeAnd you can get it with KDE
09:53.16joanI prefer "more debian" for learn
09:54.04joandebian with kde and sidux distro is the two good like distros for me
09:54.37joansidux is rolling release_
09:54.40joan?
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09:55.07cb400fsidux is based on debian unstable.. so should be rolling
09:55.26cb400fbut didn't sidux fork recently?
09:55.29cb400for change name?
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09:56.27pinotreeaptosid, yes
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09:56.49joan_fuck the konkeror close
09:57.03joan_debian testing
09:57.22joan_have a lot of bugs or is posible to normal user_
09:57.29Jishaxecb400f: Do you have any ideas about my question?
09:58.16joan_The new name of Sidux is http://aptosid.com/
09:58.18cb400fwell.. brightness is generally an acpi issue.. shouldn't be hardware specific.. resolution issues depend on your gfxcard and gfxdriver
09:58.36cb400fI meant to say "should be hardware related"
09:58.49cb400fdid you run gnome on mint 9 too?
09:59.15cb400fanyway.. mint9 is old.. based on *buntu 10.04 is it not?
09:59.35joan_i think is correct
09:59.56joan_mint is one number less for every realease
10:00.05joan_than ubuntu
10:00.27joan_debian testing is the same than debian sid ?
10:00.36Jishaxecb400f: Yes, I ran GNOME on Mint9 too.
10:00.43Jishaxecb400f: Mint 10 isn't out yet
10:00.53cb400fnope.. sid is unstable.. iirc things move to testing after 2 weeks in unstable
10:01.05Jishaxecb400f: Brightness worked in GNOME
10:01.06cb400fso "testing" is more stable than "unstable"
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10:01.13joan_ok
10:01.15cb400fJishaxe: on the same base system=
10:01.17cb400f?
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10:01.36joan_Jishaxe: debian lenny / testing / sid ?
10:01.39Jishaxecb400f: Not sure what you mean by that?
10:01.58Jishaxecb400f: I'm running exactly the same I ran a while ago, just KDE
10:02.00cb400fdid you use gnome on the same version of mint.. i.e. mint9
10:02.01JishaxeEditionof it
10:02.04JishaxeYes
10:02.38joan_and testing is rolling realease?
10:02.57cb400fyes.. more or less
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10:03.31cb400fcurrently debian is frozen for the upcoming Squeeze release.. so not much exciting stuff going on in testing nor unstable afaik
10:03.50cb400fbut I should prolly shut up and let someone who actually knows debian do the talking :-)
10:04.37joan_cb400f: but when i install debian 5 and change to testing, when debian 6 realease, I need to reinstall?
10:05.43cb400fno.. testing is what will become Squeeze (debian 6?)
10:06.10cb400fso switching from "testing" repos to stable/squeeze repos should be safe
10:06.11joan_ok perfect
10:07.27joan_have debian, a kde based distro?
10:07.55cb400fdebian has kde .. and they have a cd iso with kde too
10:08.10cb400fand of course sidux, mepis, kubuntu etc. are debian based kde distros
10:09.29joan_my question is about debian distro only
10:09.34joan_sorry for my bad english
10:09.44JishaxeIs there a way to correct the reseloution without installing drivers?
10:09.52joan_http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/weekly-builds/amd64/iso-cd/
10:10.08joan_Here is debian testing iso
10:10.11joan_but i don-t see the kde
10:10.32joan_SORRY
10:10.34joan_is the last !!!
10:11.33joan_downloading !
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10:12.59joan_amd64 is for all x86-64 ?
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10:29.14alesanhi
10:29.29alesanis it possible to create hard links using KDE copy/paste mechanism?
10:29.35alesaninstead of real copies
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11:08.41WinterFlameI am looking for a program I can use to access MSSQL database backup files, any advice?
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11:31.54comawhite_if i put my lappy in sleep mode will ktorrent continue to run in the background?
11:32.24cb400fnah
11:32.34comawhite_blah
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11:32.57comawhite_i need to close my lid so i can go to sleep, and need my network apps to continue to work
11:34.10cb400fwhy can't you sleep with an open lid? noise? light?
11:34.42comawhite_hmm
11:35.10comawhite_well light does bother a little, i would dim it but linux broke my function key =[
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11:37.27pinotreeimagines that a cute penguin went to comawhite_'s home and broke his laptop's function key using a small hammer
11:37.51comawhite_363
11:37.58alesanis it possible to create hard links using KDE copy/paste mechanism?
11:38.01comawhite_wtf
11:38.33alesanor only "copy" or "move" mechanism?
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12:03.36cusementHi! I just accidently stroke some buttons on my keyboard and now all icons on my desktop vanished. Is this some desktop activity setting i accidently changed and might restore?
12:04.24cusementand all panels on the desktop vanished as well
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12:11.53ct529hi guys, I am trying to build a complete theme for kde, that is: bootstrap (after grub), login, ksplsh, plasma and windows decoration .... now I am finding it very, very difficult
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12:13.05*** join/#kde Panke (~Panke@95-88-180-19-dynip.superkabel.de)
12:13.32ct529particularly the ksplash theming .... any help you can give me? I have found documentation on plasma and windows (but auroraedesign does not really work well yet) and a bit on login, but themeing is not brilliant either .... I can theme the login page, but then ksplah reverst to ethais ....
12:13.40ct529anyone who can help me?
12:15.31ct529I am working on kubuntu (10.04 LTS 64 bit)
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12:16.16WinterFlameI can not create a ruby / QtRuby Hello World project in kdevelop, what am I missing?
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12:35.39DamnshockWinterFlame: you could explain your problem
12:35.45Damnshockrather than "it doesn't work"
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12:37.45WinterFlameI just don't have the option for it when creating a new project
12:39.06DamnshockWinterFlame: maybe it still doesn't support qtruby?
12:39.17DamnshockWinterFlame: sorry I can't be of much help
12:39.22Damnshocktry #kdevelop
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12:40.40WinterFlameDamnshock it's supposed to support it since kdevelop 3.3
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13:27.07joanHello all
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13:27.21joanI have problems to install kopete in debian
13:29.37annma#debian-kde might help
13:30.16annmanot on this network though, it's on debian network
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13:32.21barrapontois choqok broken?
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13:33.19annmawhat version?
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13:37.12eshatWow, bugs.kde.org is the slowest page I found since years. Shouldn't KDE consider an upgrade  or change of bug managemnet system?
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13:38.06annmayou're welcome to help in that matter eshat
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13:38.37annmawe need more sysadmins for this kind of things
13:39.00eshatannma: I am just wondering ,that such a big and modern desktop environemnt is using an outdated BTS
13:39.25annmanot so outdated
13:39.31annmaI find it quite good
13:39.50annmaas I said it's up to people to come forward and help
13:39.59eshatannma: come on, the search takes enourmes time, i even got an "server out of respond" message while searching
13:40.13annmayou probably have some expertise in other systems then?
13:40.13einar77eshat: the problem is *not losing* the information if you go to another BTS
13:40.18annmaenormous times?
13:40.45einar77this is not an issue of finding a technically better alternative, but also preserve what has been done so far
13:41.00annmaas my connexion is very poor, everything takes time for me
13:41.00eshateinar77: well bugzilla isn't too unknown, there shoud be import functions for example in launchpad
13:41.15annmaI hate launchpad
13:41.20einar77eshat: like with the Git migration, this needs to be laid out, pros and cons outlined
13:41.27einar77then evaluated
13:41.29annmayes
13:41.39annmaexactly
13:41.57einar77eshat: as a proof that moving "on to the Cool Feature of the Day" was wrong
13:42.08eshatwell I am just wondering, didn't want to start a big discussion
13:42.10einar77sysadmin showed that, despite initial impression
13:42.23einar77using th Gitorious platform for KDE itself was not technically sensible
13:42.29eshatI though maybe the KDE devs are already considering to change the BTS
13:42.35einar77eshat: this has been mentioend
13:42.46annmathe kde devs don't give a damn
13:42.49einar77but there's only so much they can do
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13:42.52annmathe devs develop
13:43.09annmait's a huge task to assess what can be done and how and test it
13:43.10einar77annma: sysadmin has IIRC talked about BTS, but no more than "talk"
13:43.16eshatannma: and fix bugs, or aren't they ?
13:43.17annmain order to change BTS
13:43.28annmathey fix bugs but they get mails for bugs
13:43.36eshatannma: true
13:43.44annmaI get all plasma bugsin my mail for example plus all my progs bugs
13:44.08eshatwell then for people who are using KDe and want it to get better, I think it isn't a good Idea to make them use such an intransparent BTS
13:44.08annmaonly triagers open searches
13:44.45annmawe don't have the manpower at the moment, that's all eshat
13:44.52eshattriagers ? (sorry not native english speaking)
13:45.12annmapeople who triage bugs, who look for duplicates
13:45.17eshatannma: well, if that is the reason, I am sure it will get better in future ;)
13:45.20einar77eshat: those that categorize bugs, see if they can be reproduced, add test cases....
13:45.33eshatahh thanks
13:45.51einar77IOW, improve the signal to noise ratio of the BTS
13:46.23annmaI'll be doing a talk about bugs in KDE in 2 weeks
13:47.25annmawhat do GNOME have as bug system?
13:47.29pinotreebugzilla
13:47.40annmaah OK thanks
13:48.03*** join/#kde SCWLstmp (~quassel@76-250-152-132.lightspeed.snantx.sbcglobal.net)
13:48.20einar77a good number of distros also use bugzilla
13:48.22eshatdebian also has its own developed BTS that has been used for ages  but I think it is much better than bugzilla
13:48.44eshatexecpt the facts, that e-mail adresses are written in clear text and cannot be hidden
13:48.45einar77eshat: in order for a replacement to be considered, IMO
13:48.59einar77it should:
13:49.10einar771. have a verifiable, technical advantage over the current system
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13:49.30einar772. be useful for the workflow in KDE (this is more important than 1)
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13:49.53einar773. Somehow the old data need to be fed into the new system
13:49.58eshateinar77: that would for example be 1. "faster search" 2. "easier to use
13:50.20eshatwell 3 is tricky, I confirm
13:50.22einar774. There are collaries, for example bug hooks, FIXED-IN keywords, and so on...
13:50.26pinotreeeshat: easier to use for who?
13:50.27einar77corollaries
13:50.54eshatpinotree: for people who are not too good technically things, but want to file bugs
13:51.12einar77eshat: it should be that AND be useful for the ones who fix bugs
13:51.28einar77the latter mean a way to plug commit hooks from the SCM to the BTS
13:51.31pinotreeeshat: a bug tracking system is meant to be used mostly by *developers* and more-than-noobies people, not "common users"
13:51.40einar77such as the BUG:XXXX keywords that automatically close bugs
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13:52.23eshatpinotree: is that true ? If I compare the bugs filed in launchpad and in KDE maybe you are right
13:52.34eshatpinotree: but maybe that is a mistake
13:52.40pinotreelaunchpad is for ubuntu, an user-oriented distro
13:52.43einar77eshat: the issue is that there are 2 levels
13:52.45pinotree(mostly)
13:52.51eshatpinotree: KDE isn't user oriented ?
13:52.52einar77first bugs go to the downstream (distros)
13:53.10einar77then if they're bugs not related to them, should be reported upstream (KDE; GNOME, etc...)
13:53.23SCWLstmpeinar77: what BTS is it you are talking about? I joined mid discussion
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13:53.38einar77SCWLstmp: bugzilla and/or alternatives
13:53.42pinotreeeshat: kde's bug tracking system is not for end user support, which is done in launchpad
13:53.51SCWLstmpeinar77: oh I thought you had an alternative you were pitching
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13:53.54eshatpinotree: maybe that is the reason, I had big problems after the upgrade to KDE 4 in our university
13:53.57einar77pinotree: I would argue that bug reports are never meant for user support
13:54.09einar77IMO they're meant to report defets
13:54.11pinotreeeshat: uh?
13:54.12einar77defects
13:54.21eshatpinotree: I had to explain all users how to set up their panel because nobody knew that they had to "unlock widgets"
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13:54.35pinotree(so?)
13:54.50einar77eshat: this is not a matter for a BR, but for our Community Forums
13:54.56eshatI mean, is KDE only for geeks ?
13:54.56pinotreeexactly
13:55.07einar77eshat: a BTS is not meant for such issues, our forums are
13:55.13eshateinar77: well maybe I am mixing things
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13:55.20einar77eshat: let's see
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13:55.34einar77eshat: a bug report is a very specific "incident"
13:55.39cb400feshat: the widgets are not locked by default.. and if they weren't locked, you'd have to help everyone cuz they had accidentally (re)moved something
13:55.40SCWLstmpeshat: I have a good example for you, one second.
13:55.40pinotreeeshat: yes, you are confusing our bug tracking system as end-user support, which has never been
13:56.33eshatpinotree: I see. Ok but in the end, making the BTS mor useable will still be a good thing ;)
13:56.49pinotreeagain the question: for who?
13:56.58eshateverybody
13:56.59SCWLstmpeshat: consider these two issue (not in KDE): http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=5046 / http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=4147
13:57.01pinotreeno
13:57.13pinotreebugzilla is *not* for everybody
13:57.31SCWLstmpeshat:  take a minute to speed read through the "comments" on those issues. They will very quickly illustrate why issue/bug trackers are not well suited for end user participation.
13:57.37pinotreebugzilla is *not* for a casual kde user
13:57.55pinotreebugzilla is *not* for a "how can i do foobar with kde?"
13:58.06eshatSCWLstmp: I will check later, but thanks
13:58.16SCWLstmpeshat: I know I could hunt for equivalent KDE bugs but using a different environment might help illustrate the case.
13:58.20pinotreeand they'll never be that way, because they are *not* designed for that
13:58.50eshatpinotree: but does the serarch function , that takes minutes in some cases not disturb all users
13:59.05eshat(for example)
13:59.25SCWLstmpeshat: the way I look at it and have used bug/issue trackers are a place for the development team to collaborate on solving an issue by investigation and patching. These are oppened to end users in many cases so that they can see the progress and so that things are done in the open. Occasionaly a reporter will be asked for clarification or further involvement.
13:59.26eshat*search
13:59.56pinotreewe have 256000+ bugs tracked, i guess you can imagine doing a full text search in each and in their comments in not exactly quick
14:00.22SCWLstmpeshat: where this becomes problematic is when end users think it is a discussion forum and not a development tool. They get flooded with posts like this: "+1", "Me too!!!", "Fix it NOW!!!!!", "Fix it or I am switching to XXXXXXXXXXX", "You all suck why isn't it fixed".
14:00.23eshatpinotree: well modern databases should do that in less than a sec
14:00.44pinotreeSCWLstmp: +1
14:00.50SCWLstmphahahahhaha
14:00.52eshatSCWLstmp: haha, I see your point, and you're right, I mixed things above
14:01.11pinotreeeshat: assuming you are the only one doing queries to bugzilla, sure
14:01.21SCWLstmpeshat: The only reason things I think are confusing is because in OSS development we open things to users they wouldn't usually be open to
14:01.22eshatBut still I thing, that bugzilla isn't the best choice, even for not end-users
14:01.32einar77eshat: this has been mentioned
14:01.36einar77the problems are
14:01.38einar77a. manpower
14:01.40einar77b. importing
14:01.45SCWLstmpeshat: I used the android tracker issue as an example because millions of android based phones are now in the hands of poeple who have no idea what software development or open source is.
14:01.53einar77in "a" also fall all the technical evaluations
14:02.09einar77sysadmin, for git, took a load of time to properly run an evaluation (and it was time well spent)
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14:02.36SCWLstmpeshat: so all of these "uneducated" people think it is the place to go and make noise, not understanding it is a tool for devs to make things better, not weed through user gripes.
14:02.41eshateinar77: i totally agree, but cannot understand people like pinotree who say, why make it better, if it works
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14:03.14pinotreeeshat: i didn't say that
14:03.31einar77pinotree didn't say that
14:03.35SCWLstmpeshat: Consider closed source projects where there are two different interfaces, the customer facing interface where poeple can say "this **** is broken fix it you idiots!" and the internal dev bug tracker where stuff actually gets done.
14:03.42pinotreei said that if you want bugzilla as end-user tool, you will NOT get that anytime
14:03.51SCWLstmpeshat: for us these get confused because the latter is end user facing as well.
14:03.53einar77eshat: the issue is that you may find a "cool" platform, it may still not be good for KDE
14:03.58eshatbut he said, who should we make it better for, (or similar), at least I understood it that way
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14:04.37SCWLstmpeshat: I think having missed have the discussion that he sees the improvements as benefiting mostly the targeted users being devs and bug reporters, who are used to how it works and dont mind the extra work.
14:05.04SCWLstmpeshat: those who would benefit most from what you are discussing are not the "target audience" and thus I am guessing the priority is low.
14:05.07einar77SCWLstmp: such a discussion, informally, takes place every now and then
14:05.10pthread_akonadi: [ERROR] Can't open and lock privilege tables: Table 'mysql.servers' doesn't exist
14:05.12einar77the issue is in data migration
14:05.34einar77and of course, in making sure it's really beter
14:05.35einar77better
14:05.53SCWLstmpeshat: I am making assumptions here because I missed this discussion, am doing other things, and other than pinotree, do not know the opinions being presented.
14:05.56einar77eshat: along with the BTS itself, as I said earlier, there's a load of infrastructure that depends on it
14:05.57eshatSCWLstmp: that is so true, but maybe devs and bug reported can work more efficient if the BTS get improved, maybe even more devs and reporters will use it (let's forget about the end-user thing)
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14:06.27pinotreeSCWLstmp: no, i think you got my idea
14:06.55SCWLstmpeshat: I agree that is a case you can make and likely get traction with, even if you personally are thinking of benefiting end users, bringing that into the discussion will only be met with "it isn't for end users" because it reality it simply isn't
14:07.26einar77eshat: you also have to think at which kind of reporters use the BTS
14:07.32einar77KDE is more "Upstream" than distros
14:07.40einar77the first level is always distro BTS
14:07.45SCWLstmpeshat: but the catch is as somone mentioned manpower and work involved. The "cost benefit analysis" right now doesn't have the cost as being a benefit because the devs can deal with the shortcomings right now.
14:08.07BajKlol man in /usr/share/apps/kdewidgets and kdeui there are icons that seem to date back to KDe 2?! :D
14:08.11einar77SCWLstmp: I'll add also that there's the git migration underway
14:08.20SCWLstmpeshat: of course this doesn't mean things should be considered, and einar77 said this is revisited every once in a while informally
14:08.32pinotreeBajK: well yes, they are used for kde widgets in esigner
14:08.35SCWLstmps/should/shouldn't
14:08.36pinotree*designer
14:09.06eshatWell, thanks for all the information, in the end I still started a discussion, which I didn't want to :D
14:09.25einar77eshat: as long as you got a better insight, it'd be fruitful
14:09.26SCWLstmpeshat: it is just on the priority list it probably isn't high for all of the above discussed reasons. HOWEVER, if you have some recommended BTS systems mention them and I am sure they would be investigated.
14:09.37eshateinar77: right, maybe the distro BTS should always be more end-user oriented
14:09.52einar77eshat: also, if you have issues with KDE like you mentioned earlier
14:10.00cb400fmost distros prolly use bugzilla too though ;-)
14:10.01SCWLstmpeshat: I for one would be interested. As when I first joined this channel a few minutes ago, I thought I was going to be pointed to some cool BTS to go look at.
14:10.11einar77eshat: direct people to http://forum.kde.org - we are friendly and don't bite :P
14:10.23pinotreeof course, the BTS recommendations should point only to technical concrete points, not to abstract issues ("make it faster") nor to "end-user friendly" things
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14:10.28SCWLstmpeinar77: speak for yourself, I am moody.
14:10.32eshatcb400f: as I said, I am very happy with the debian BTS, it is geeky enough, but way more usable than bugzilla
14:10.49BajKdoes anybody know how I can change the icon *inside* kickoff menu? (Not the launcher icon!) but the icon next to the searchbar/username
14:11.07einar77BajK: as notmart said in #plasma you need a modification to the plasma theme
14:11.23einar77i.e. this stays in the element called "branding.svgz"
14:11.29pinotreeisn't that the login image?
14:11.35BajKhm oh, did not notice it (he did not type my nick)
14:11.48einar77pinotree: no, on the right of the login image
14:11.50einar77opposite side
14:12.00pinotreeah ok
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14:15.49eshatSCWLstmp: wow, just read the comments you linked in the android bugs, Crazy. I as a developer would be very demotivied, when reading things like: "Nice touch google ! You are a bunch of retards"
14:17.05pthread_akonadi: [akonadiserver] FATAL ERROR: Upgrade failed
14:17.31SCWLstmpeshat: you can see why I chose that as an example, although not all bugs are like that, that shows the extreme case of why end user involvement can be bad
14:18.04eshatcheck this, it is a big SPAM thread: http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=5597&colspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Owner%20Summary%20Stars
14:18.25eshatSeems like the arabic people like copy and paste :D
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14:20.30eshatpthread_: did you upgrade to ubuntu 10.04 ?
14:21.44eshatif so, then you must prevent apparmor do block akonadi, here is a good short howto:http://jacob.steelsmith.org/content/akonadi-server-process-not-registered-d-bus
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14:25.43pthread_eshat: i updated to kde 4.5.2
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14:25.49pthread_in fedora
14:26.21eshatwell I do not know if fdora is using apparmor, you can try the commands in the link I posted
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14:26.55cb400fthey definitely don't by default.. but they do use selinux afaik
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14:29.27SCWLstmpeshat: wow, 4568 comments on that issue!
14:29.36SCWLstmpeshat: the arabic one. That is insane
14:29.44eshatSCWLstmp: yes it is :D
14:29.49SCWLstmpeshat: had I seen that one I would have used it as my example :)
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14:30.14eshatSCWLstmp: it is way more shocking :D
14:30.31SCWLstmpeshat: but now that I notice, there is one thing that I see positive. It has more "stars" than comments. So at least some poeple figured out the "star" functionality
14:31.23pthread_Nepomuk Indexing Agents Have Been Disabled
14:31.23pthread_The Nepomuk service is not available or fully operational and attempts to rectify this have failed. Therefore indexing of all data stored in the Akonadi PIM service has been disabled, which will severely limit the capabilities of any application using this data.
14:31.23pthread_The following problems were detected:
14:31.23pthread_Nepomuk is not running.
14:32.06*** join/#kde eshat (~quassel@dslb-092-073-186-062.pools.arcor-ip.net)
14:33.31eshatquassel just crashed, maybe I should use konversation ?
14:33.43SCWLstmpeshat: core or client?
14:34.08eshat??? there are two versons ? I just installed it yesterday because it seems the recommended IRC client
14:34.18SCWLstmpeshat: I am fond of the devs from both and both are good.
14:34.25eshatI have package quassel installed but see, that there is also quassel-client
14:34.53SCWLstmpeshat: quassel allows you to have a core running somewhere, say on a headless server, and then connect with clients so you never get disconnected and so that you can catch up with where you left off.
14:35.24SCWLstmpeshat: konversation is just a good kde irc client.
14:36.04eshatSCWLstmp: ahhh , thanks for the info, well, I don't need that, and therefor will switch to konversation
14:36.10eshatwill reconnect soon
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14:38.29SCWLstmppinotree, einar77: This thread that that eshat found is a gem in terms of end users abusing a BTS: http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=5597
14:39.00eshatSCWLstmp: quassel didn't have shortcuts for switching between channels, that's why I will go for konversation
14:39.10eshatSCWLstmp: it defenetly is :D
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14:39.43pthread_i solved: rm -r ~/.kde4/share/apps/nepomuk
14:39.47SCWLstmpeshat: you might join #quassel and recommend that or do so through any other means, you will be likely to find the feature in a future verison if you do.
14:39.56pthread_restarted nepomukserver
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14:40.22eshatSCWLstmp: I already know that they are aware of that missing shortcuts,
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14:42.03SCWLstmpeshat: ok great
14:42.57SCWLstmpwonders if there are any mysql geniuses in here. I have a report due and #mysql is seemingly idle.
14:47.00BajKwhy does the audiocd:/-kio slave only work when I put in the CD into my cd burner?
14:47.08BajKif I put it into the dvd drive it says "cannot be read"
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15:51.20hey_the kde pack of configuration
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15:51.50hey_how they tell ?
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16:11.28adz21cis it possible to set some sort of timer on when certain events get clear from the plasma notification tray? I find myself clearing it a lot and most of it is stuff I only care about at the point of notification or would only want to review for a min after notification (eg. kopete status notification and amarok track changes)?
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16:13.59hey_i wold like to install kde 4.5 in debian testing
16:14.31hey_were are the repositories?
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16:18.04DexterFhi
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16:18.24DexterFneed to get a umts usb stick working on a 8.10 - any chance?
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16:22.55hey_Alguien sabe donde puedo encontrar los repos de kde 4.5?
16:23.06pumphaushey_: 1. please speak english
16:23.15pumphaushey_: 2. this is #kde, not #debian
16:23.17hey_Any can say me were are the repos of KDE 4.5?
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16:25.54SCWLstmphey_: you could try googling "debian kde 4.5 repo"
16:25.57Damnshockpumphaus: http://www.google.es/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CB0QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fpkg-kde.alioth.debian.org%2F&rct=j&q=debian%20kde&ei=hoHVTM3kI9TNjAfY35TXCQ&usg=AFQjCNHLp3raMUSL-EmmwHZGT_fB79XVGg&sig2=-TkOI8XmdvYw_8AEtsNp4g&cad=rja
16:26.38pumphausDamnshock: rather point that at hey_
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16:31.23ompaulhey_:  KDE SC 4.5.1 packages available at http://qt-kde.debian.net  taken from #debian-kde on oftc
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16:33.39javier_DexterF: what is 8.10?
16:34.00DexterFjavier_: gah, my fault, sorry - kubuntu 8.10
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16:34.39javier_ah ok
16:34.54javier_DexterF: try asking in #kubuntu or #ubuntu
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16:54.43sredna<PROTECTED>
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16:55.03srednado you know if somethign special is required to get the contacts krunner?
16:55.19srednai can not find it, using kde 4.5.3 in arch linux :(
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17:00.34srednadoes anyone know what provides the contact krunner?
17:02.38cb400fbetter ask arch people.. who knows how they split their packages
17:02.44SCWLstmpsredna: sorry I haven't got it so I am not of much help
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17:04.16rozhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/55563878@N03/5150785366/   trying to get rid of the box on the bottom; but not sure what it is...
17:04.18rozalt-tabing says its "plasma-desktop"
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17:05.50SCWLstmproz: are widgets locked?
17:06.10rozSCWLstmp: yes they are
17:06.22SCWLstmproz: if you unlock them and mousehover that, does it give you the close option?
17:07.00rozno it doesn't
17:07.08SCWLstmpbased on placement it also reminds me a little of the window preview/thumbnail functionality
17:07.36SCWLstmpif you mosueover your bash<3> does it fill that same approximate space with previews?
17:08.40rozSCWLstmp: taking another screenshot one sec
17:10.20rozSCWLstmp: http://www.flickr.com/photos/55563878@N03/5151746016/   thats the only time i can get it to fill in with anything that ive seen
17:11.01SCWLstmpdo you know what I am talking about the window thumbnail preview thingy?
17:12.02SCWLstmphmmm yahoo owns flickr? Is that new or did they just recently add "from Yahoo" to the logo?
17:12.04rozi think so but I am not getting that behavior on mouseover
17:12.13SCWLstmproz: ok
17:12.29roz(i want that... how do i get it?)
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17:13.04SCWLstmproz: this next thing isn't a lot of help because I haven't messed with it in a while but here goes. There is a plasma config file which stores placement, size, everything about your desktop widgets etc... you can look in there to see if you can figure out if that is an actual widget and kill it there.
17:13.36SCWLstmproz: from recollection the file was array based and not necessarily easy to read in terms of what corresponded to what. Googling plasma config file or plasma rc file might get you to the file
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17:13.54SCWLstmpor locate plasma | grep "rc$"
17:14.20SCWLstmproz: as for the window preview thingy, if you have desktop effects turned on (which I do not at this precise moment) i think it is default enabled.
17:14.43rozok i havent played with those yet
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17:15.04rozafter this build finishes; i am going to restart KDE see if that helps
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17:17.00rozit would be really nice to save panels and load panels
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17:19.05rozits definitely plasma-desktop, which is in my alt-tab application switcher
17:19.55SCWLstmproz: sorry I couldn't immediately identify it.
17:20.01rozSCWLstmp: brb restarting kde
17:20.04SCWLstmpI am going to be off for a while. See you all later
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18:22.05cjaewill rm ~/.kde4/share/config/kwinrc rebuild it to default settings, since my kwin desktop effects are disabled, but if I create a new user they are there
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18:26.19cb400fcjae: if you delete the file with kwin not running it will revert to default settings on next start
18:26.37cjaethanks
18:27.00goodtimeim new to this os
18:27.11goodtimei cant get plugins
18:27.41goodtimei cant play a mp3 and now im desprate
18:28.15cb400fask your distro.. and tell them what player you're trying to use
18:28.29goodtimewhat pm him
18:29.16cb400fjoin the support channel for your distribution and ask them how to install codecs
18:29.37goodtimeok thanks
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18:48.30rozsound in kde is working; but nothing else (i.e. mplayer)... anyone here have any suggestions
18:49.42vadiHow to listen kpotato sounds?  Of course I  have Menu>Speech>English set, the sound on the system works perfectly and so on. (Debian squeeze)
18:50.16vadi<PROTECTED>
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18:50.54Damnshockvadi: that depends
18:50.56DamnshockI would say no
18:51.05Damnshockas alsa has dmix by default
18:51.29Damnshockyou could also install pulsaudio or jack if you wanted to
18:51.38*** part/#kde svnieuw (~svnieuw@d54C59EE6.access.telenet.be)
18:51.42vadiI see.  So maybe a missing "kpotato sounds" package?
18:51.57Damnshockkopotato?
18:52.00Damnshockkpotato?
18:52.23vadikpotato
18:52.40vadiBoth alsa and pulseaudio packages are installed
18:53.03vadiAlso libjack0
18:53.10Damnshocksystemsettings
18:53.11Damnshockmultimedia
18:53.14Damnshockcheck you devices there
18:53.51vadiRV710...
18:54.04vadiworks perfectly with kaffeine and so on
18:54.19vadiwell, checking
18:55.00Damnshockvadi: what backend are you using?
18:56.39*** join/#kde ichbinder (~ichbinder@129.7.255.106)
18:57.10vadiI am not sure Damnshock
18:57.18vadiWhat do you mean by backend?
18:57.39Damnshockgstreamer
18:57.40Damnshockxine
18:57.42Damnshockmplayer
18:57.44Damnshockvlc?
18:57.52Damnshockon multimedia, check on the backend tab
18:58.25vadixine, is what conf says
18:58.58Damnshockwhat distro are you on?
18:59.15vadiDebian squeeze
19:00.10vadiIt is updated frequently so it it current
19:00.49vadiDebian squeeze is almost ready to be released as the next Debian stable
19:01.18Damnshockis kpotato a kde3 program?
19:02.33*** join/#kde odysseus (~odysseus@pd95c4acb.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
19:02.36vadiI think so but I do not manage to find the program to launch it by hand
19:03.17vadiI am going to look at Menu-edit to see what is the program which the menu is executing
19:05.27*** join/#kde jmho (~quassel@pd95c4acb.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
19:06.25*** join/#kde octocpp (~octo@unaffiliated/octocpp)
19:07.14octocppmy knetwork manager is telling me that my bitrate for my wired connection is 10mbit/s, that cant be right can it?
19:07.56octocppit should be at least 100 mbit
19:09.01*** join/#kde caotic (~caotic@187.138.77.186)
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19:11.15cjaewow separate x screens woot
19:11.17cjaesort of
19:11.38cjaeit like I have two screens on my tv is this something to do with activities
19:11.43cjaeits
19:12.26cjaekde 4.5.3
19:14.50*** join/#kde neverendingo_ (~neverendi@d190060.adsl.hansenet.de)
19:15.14vadiThe Potato Guy is  /usr/games/ktuberling
19:16.30vadiDamnshock, If I launch the application as root user I can listen the sound, but if I launch then as my normal user I do not listen anything in any KDE application, being kaffenine, the Potato Guy one or any other
19:16.50vadi<PROTECTED>
19:17.23cjaeno one touching that
19:17.26vadiDo you think what could be the cause, so that I can just change a setting and enable sound for KDE application in my normal user desktop?
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19:17.53cjaehugs for separate desktops
19:18.07cjaejust gotta tweak it now if possible
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19:18.53*** join/#kde namektran (~namektran@0138300039.0.fullrate.dk)
19:19.15namektranHello kde wont mount my usb drive
19:19.25cjaehow do I delete actvities
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19:20.46Damnshockvadi: then you have a permission problem
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19:22.19vadi<PROTECTED>
19:22.26vadis/I/My/
19:22.50vadiSo I do not understand what permission problem it would be
19:23.32octocppwhere does knetwork manager get its bitrate information for the wired interfaces? I think it is incorrectly stating that my bitrate is only 10mbit/s ?
19:23.38namektranHello can someone please help me
19:23.59namektrankde wont mount my usb drive
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19:26.18namektranhello is somebody there?
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19:31.06namektranis it impossible to mount an usb?????
19:31.26cb400fkde doesn't mount stuff.. and it's relevant what file system is on the thing
19:31.31icwienernamektran: No it is not.
19:32.08icwienernamektran: Is the device shown in "demesg"?
19:32.08namektranicwiener: how do i mount mine usb. Is have fat32 filesystem
19:32.13icwiener"dmesg"
19:33.24namektranicwiener: uhm i dont know
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19:33.38namektranicwiener: but i can mount it from the shell
19:34.01namektranicwiener: oh the device is shown :D
19:36.16namektranicwiener: what to do?
19:36.19*** join/#kde Zaister (~stefan@static-87-79-71-220.netcologne.de)
19:37.05icwienernamektran: Does Dolphin show the device in the Places bar?
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19:37.17namektranicwiener: no
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19:38.53ahiemstranamektran: is hald running?
19:39.14namektranahiemstra: yes
19:39.15Damnshockvadi: I'm sorry, I'm busy with other things
19:39.24Damnshockvadi: I'll have to think about it
19:39.31ahiemstraok, just checking
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19:39.41namektranahiemstra: ok
19:39.59Damnshocknamektran: do you have hal on?
19:40.03ahiemstrasome people incorrectly assumed that since xorg dropped the hal dependency they could do without
19:40.20namektranDamnshock: yes
19:42.11vadiDamnshock, no problem
19:43.10vadi<PROTECTED>
19:43.37namektranso, i cant mount any usb now?
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19:45.06namektranI can find my device in KDE Info Center
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19:46.52rekirssihi i'm in a terminal how can i return to kde ?
19:47.07Damnshockctrl+alt+F7
19:47.11Damnshockor F8
19:47.13rekirssinow i try
19:47.26rekirssino
19:47.31rekirssinothing happens
19:47.40Damnshockvadi: you could try using gstreamer backend
19:47.45Damnshockit usually works much better
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19:48.02rekhi
19:48.07namektranrekirssi: /etc/init.d/xdm start
19:48.08rekit was f6 ctrl alt
19:48.15namektranoh nvm then
19:48.16namektran:d
19:48.20reki'thx
19:48.21vadithanks Damnshock
19:48.28reknew way
19:48.47reknamektran: that vould have started another kde?
19:48.48rek<PROTECTED>
19:48.49Damnshockit's strange that it was F6
19:48.54namektranoh
19:48.59namektranbuuuut
19:49.01Damnshockrek: no, that would have started a display manager
19:49.02rekblank line??? what hte hell
19:49.04namektrancan someone help me now T_T
19:49.04Damnshockto let you log in
19:49.14*** join/#kde sgh (~quassel@0x4dd5bf76.adsl.cybercity.dk)
19:49.16rekmy display or another display because i was already onkde
19:49.26reki was already logged in
19:50.20namektransrly cant someone help me mount an usb T_T
19:51.38Damnshocknamektran: do you have dbus and hal running
19:51.46namektranDamnshock: yes
19:51.47rekhei
19:52.00Damnshockand do you start your session by startx or by kdm?
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19:52.07namektranDamnshock: kdm
19:52.22Damnshockmmm that should set the proper environment variables
19:52.25Damnshockmmm
19:52.52Damnshockrek: it usually fails if you already have one X instance running
19:52.54namektransomething with my kernel maybe?
19:52.58Damnshockdepends on config though
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19:53.06Damnshockmmm namektran it might be
19:53.10Damnshockbut do not know
19:53.15Damnshockwhat distro are you using?
19:53.18namektrangentoo
19:53.21rekso what command
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19:58.38namektranHello can someone help me mount an usb
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20:01.56namektranehm
20:02.06namektranHow do you guys mount an usb?
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20:04.12EffBeeHow come desktop effects are starting off temporarily disabled? I have to press Alt + Shift + F12 twice to get them back for some reason
20:04.15*** join/#kde ritek (~ritek@201.170.42.174.dsl.dyn.telnor.net)
20:04.30DamnshockEffBee: I believe it's a known bug
20:04.40Damnshocknamektran: it should be autoseet
20:04.44junkDawgieati card, EffBee?
20:04.48EffBeeIntel
20:04.58Damnshockyou might have USE flags set that don't allow you to mount automatically the devices
20:05.06Damnshocknamektran: do you have automounter?
20:05.14EffBeeDesktop has nVidia, and it works fine
20:05.16*** join/#kde liquidsky42 (~jan@p5DDF96AF.dip.t-dialin.net)
20:05.37namektranDamnshock: no
20:06.53*** join/#kde gauda (~gauda@sign-4db6b18b.pool.mediaWays.net)
20:07.00junkDawgieyou might disable the functionality check on startup in systemsettings>DesktopEffects>Advancedtab, EffBee.... it's not a solution, but removes the annoyance
20:07.22*** join/#kde jason (~jason@dhcp5-20.geusnet.com)
20:07.58DamnshockEffBee: that hapens to me too on intel card
20:08.00Damnshock;)
20:08.05namektranDamnshock: could it be that i dont have gnome-volume-manager
20:08.17Damnshocknamektran: nope
20:08.20Damnshockit is not related
20:08.24namektranok
20:08.35junkDawgieme too, ati card..... seems unless kde4 gets the expected "nvidia" responses.... it bails
20:08.47Damnshocknamektran: are you in the storage group?
20:08.48EffBeejunkDawgie: Strangely enough, that worked. Thanks.
20:09.05namektranDamnshock: oh, no im not i add myself now
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20:09.21junkDawgiego forth and prosper, EffBee.. :)
20:09.27*** join/#kde Guest6814 (~jason@dhcp5-20.geusnet.com)
20:10.13namektranDamnshock: um, i dont have storage group T_T
20:11.03namektranDamnshock: but i have an usb group
20:11.15*** join/#kde peppe (~peppe@unaffiliated/peppe)
20:11.18Damnshocknamektran: that might be it
20:11.32namektranDamnshock: so i just myself and restart?
20:11.37namektranDamnshock: or
20:12.26Damnshocknamektran: http://www.linux.org.na/index.php?topic=239.0
20:12.30Damnshockcan it be related?
20:13.04namektranuhm
20:13.12namektrani guess so
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20:13.49*** join/#kde Tron1982 (~OConnell9@92.56.7.249)
20:15.13namektranDamnshock: ehm, what can i do then
20:15.14*** join/#kde FSCV (~SCV@189.225.66.83)
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20:15.43Tron1982hi
20:15.45Tron1982how i do to install a printer?
20:15.51*** join/#kde ghostcube (~ghostcube@unaffiliated/ghostcube)
20:15.55Tron1982im using fedora 14
20:16.12namektranDamnshock: i just try to restart
20:16.33DamnshockTron1982: you probably need cups installed
20:16.36Damnshockand running
20:16.41Damnshockthen plugin the printer
20:16.43Damnshock;)
20:16.47Tron1982ok
20:16.51Tron1982ill try
20:16.54Damnshockin fedora all of this probably is already done
20:17.03Damnshockall but the plugin part ;)
20:18.07Tron1982ok
20:18.20Tron1982fedora installs cups automatically
20:18.28Tron1982and it seems works ok
20:18.45Tron1982im trying to configure in kde preferences
20:18.49Tron1982printers
20:18.53DamnshockTron1982: before doing that
20:18.59*** join/#kde cjae (~quassel@142-165-27-101.estv.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca)
20:19.00Damnshockjust try to print something
20:19.16*** join/#kde irielfaid (~Iriel@cpe-24-168-49-14.hvc.res.rr.com)
20:19.19Damnshockyou might not need to configure a thing
20:20.25Tron1982doesnt works. only i have pdf printer
20:20.28Tron1982virtual printer
20:20.46Tron1982i remember in fedora core 1 was easy
20:20.55Tron1982and opensuse 11.3 its fine to configure
20:21.04Tron1982but with fedora 14 and using kde...
20:21.24Tron1982i dont know where the option is?¿
20:21.36cb400fyou could prolly use the same tool as in fedora with gnome
20:21.50*** join/#kde namektran (~namektran@0138300039.0.fullrate.dk)
20:21.51Tron1982and where is that tool¿?
20:22.00cb400for use the cups webinterface (type 'http://localhost:631' in your browser)
20:22.05namektranomg, i found out
20:22.06cb400fask fedora people :-)
20:22.07namektran:D
20:22.09Tron1982nobody configure their printer with fedora 14?
20:22.31namektranDamnshock thanks (;
20:22.40*** join/#kde sortadi (~sortadi@unaffiliated/sortadi)
20:22.45Damnshocknamektran: did that work?
20:23.01namektranDamnshock: yup is was the group "plugdev"
20:23.02Tron1982jesus
20:23.10namektranDamnshock: but see ya
20:23.11Tron1982cups web interface works fine
20:23.21Tron1982correct
20:23.23Tron1982fine
20:23.31Tron1982yes!!! i can add some printers
20:23.32DamnshockI hate gentoo
20:23.38namektranwhy
20:23.43GNU\colossusi hate hate haters
20:23.43namektran:B
20:23.47Damnshockbecause it changes *many* things
20:23.49Tron1982thanks cb400f
20:23.54Damnshockin non default locations
20:23.59Damnshockand non default groups
20:24.01Tron1982sorry about this, but in personal opinion
20:24.03namektranhahah :D
20:24.12Tron1982the best distro actually is opensuse 11.3
20:24.33namektrani love gentoo :P
20:24.35junkDawgiesome people part their hair on the left, some right... and some are bald
20:24.38Tron1982you must install it in your poc
20:24.40Tron1982pc
20:25.02Tron1982opensuse 11.3 have the best kde
20:25.17Tron1982perfectly integrated
20:25.21namektranbuut see ya all ;D
20:25.22Tron1982the best notification system
20:25.31Tron1982and the best optimized
20:25.45Tron1982and the system management tool called yast is the best
20:25.45*** join/#kde Maeztro (~quassel@186.82.128.131)
20:25.54junkDawgieis this the commercial break?
20:25.57Tron1982no
20:25.57DamnshockTron1982: that depends
20:25.59Tron1982sorry
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20:26.10DamnshockI do not like a program doing everything
20:26.10Tron1982depends¿
20:26.14Tron1982me yes
20:26.15Damnshockfor me
20:26.17Damnshock;)
20:26.23Damnshockif it works for you... awesome :D
20:26.34Tron1982im boring using a distro and doing many things to install some apps
20:26.34*** join/#kde michael_cheah (~sc4bbk@66-188-114-207.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com)
20:26.54Tron1982tired of edit files, scripts and some things like that
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20:32.26junkDawgieanybody else have a screensaver malfunction (fails to start) after using the magic corner feature?
20:33.47junkDawgiei get a hung xprop instance and the screensaver never starts
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21:29.21legodudeare Dolphin actions disabled for network files?
21:30.48Damnshocklegodude: what do you mean by actions?
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21:31.07Damnshockohh I see
21:31.11Damnshocklegodude: I don't think so
21:32.09Damnshocklegodude: now that you mention it... I do have some actions disabled
21:33.01legodudedo any work?
21:33.10legodudenone that I have seem to wrok
21:33.11legodudework
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21:35.11Damnshocklegodude: subversion actions work for me
21:35.16cjaehow do I fix this? http://www.glowfoto.com/static_image/06-162413L/9882/png/11/2010/img4/glowfoto
21:35.20Damnshockinstalled by kdesvn
21:35.26legodudehrm
21:35.27legodudestrange
21:35.31legodudeon smb shares? or what?
21:35.47cjaeit is kde 4.5.3 separate x screen or tv
21:35.53cjaeon*
21:36.01legodudeI just created an action that I'd like to work on network shares but it doesn't...
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21:36.04Damnshockuse the systemsettings
21:36.06Damnshockdisplay options
21:36.11DiEOrLivEwhere i can configure plymouth ?
21:36.31pinotreeDiEOrLivE: ask in the channel of your distribution, we don't develop plymouth
21:36.41DiEOrLivEok ty
21:36.44DiEOrLivE;p
21:36.46DiEOrLivEsorry lol
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21:38.34cjaeDamnshock: what do i change
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21:39.12Damnshockcjae: it should be pretty intuitive
21:39.15Damnshockand obvious
21:39.25Damnshockif there is something wrong with the settings that is
21:39.39Damnshockseems like you have the position of the screen misplaced
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21:46.39cjaeDamnshock: well I dont know what you definition of obvious is but from what I understand separate x screens is brand new and kde 4 and I was wondering if it is a bug since I cant see what to change
21:46.57Damnshockcjae: maybe it's a bug
21:47.05Damnshockcjae: could you try using xrandr?
21:47.13Damnshockxrandr -q to query your displays
21:47.14cjaeand the monitor I am using to talk here is just fine
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21:48.24cjaeScreen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1440 x 900, maximum 1920 x 1920
21:48.40cjaeDFP1 disconnected (normal left inverted right x axis y axis)
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21:48.59cjaeCRT1 connected 1440x900+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 408mm x 255mm
21:50.00Damnshockcjae: there seems to be the problem
21:50.05cjaewhat is that digital flat panel
21:50.09cjae?
21:50.10Damnshockboth displays start at the same point
21:50.24Damnshockor... wait a sec
21:50.30Damnshockyou are not using dual display?
21:51.06cjaeno screen stretching here
21:51.16cjaeindependent screens
21:51.49cjaecannot drag windows across screens
21:52.03Damnshockwell, but you have two screens right?
21:52.11cjaeyes
21:52.32cjaeI was just on lcd and one plasma
21:52.53cjaelcd = vga and plasma = hdmi
21:52.59Damnshockmmm
21:52.59cjaesame card
21:53.29Damnshockand you see that thing on both screens? or just in one?
21:53.57cjaeone, plasma
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21:54.07cjaethis screen fine
21:54.48Damnshockcjae: strange problem :S
21:54.53Damnshockdo you have an xorg.conf file?
21:55.33cjaethought maybe it was activities at first but I have deleted all of them
21:55.37cjaeyes one sec
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21:58.06cjaeDamnshock: http://pastebin.com/hxRTbpYj
22:01.42Damnshockcjae:
22:01.48Damnshockyou have two monitors at the same position
22:01.50Damnshockthat might be it
22:02.01cjaeoh
22:02.38cjaeI was looking but it been awhile since I ve edited one by hand
22:02.49Damnshockit's probably that
22:03.39cjaeI dont really understand this absolute positioning thing
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22:06.22Damnshockcjae: I think should not have it
22:06.32Damnshockass you are running different screens on your displays
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22:10.18cjaeDamnshock: sorry phone rang, what now
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22:13.51cjaeall I know if you used to have
22:14.02cjaescreen 0 and screen 1
22:14.23cjaedepths resoutions
22:14.47cjaedevice 0 and device 1
22:14.58Damnshockcjae: I'm no expert with multiscreen
22:15.05Damnshockand... this doesn't seem a kde problem
22:15.13cjaeand server layout left 0 or right 1
22:15.23cjaeof*
22:15.59cjaeI dont know about 0 of 0 and whatever viewport is
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22:19.36cjaeDamnshock: so your saying my xorg.conf is wrong from what you can see
22:21.46Damnshockcjae: again, I'm no expert
22:21.53Damnshockbut seems to be some things you could try
22:21.58Damnshocklike changing the Position option
22:22.16Damnshockand also adding "Screen 0" to the proper section
22:22.23Damnshockas you have "screen 1"
22:22.29Damnshockin on section
22:25.07cjaedidnt even see that 0 was missing
22:25.21Damnshockcjae: don't worry about it
22:25.26Damnshockthat's why you came here ;)
22:25.50cjaeI should be able to take out the option position anyway right?
22:26.06Damnshockcjae: yes
22:26.46whiskasekhey i need good movie :P genre: action OR comedy OR something like that :P
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22:26.59Damnshockwhiskasek: seven
22:27.09cjaeI think the whole thing is slightly messed up
22:27.16cjaesuper troopers
22:27.18whiskasekDamnshock hehe its really old :P
22:27.24whiskaseki want something new :P
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22:28.00Damnshockwhiskasek: this new one of dicaprio
22:28.02Damnshockis quite good
22:28.31whiskasekhmmm inception? am i correct?
22:28.41DamnshockI think so
22:28.47whiskasekhmm ok why not
22:28.49whiskasekthanks
22:29.40cjaeScreen      1   "amdcccle-Screen[1]-1" 1440 0      implies this amdcccle-Device[1]-0" which is actually "Monitor-DFP1" "0-DFP1"
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22:31.39junkDawgieati should be shot for trying to dictate xorg format/names
22:32.09junkDawgiejust confuses an already fubar situation
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22:36.26cjaecjae cant stare any longer put in 12 hours at screen already
22:36.33cjaeoops see
22:36.46cjaeDamnshock: thanks for hekp
22:36.58Damnshockdon't mention it ;)
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