| 00:01.14 | azeem | I guess they weren't dumped overnight, that only happens at Wall St. |
| 00:02.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, for sure they weren't. It's been known since long that PR1.3 is probably last publication ever from Nokia for maemo/meego |
| 00:03.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | idly ponders to actually check that twitter (waaaaah!) page again |
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| 00:14.53 | Aard | DocScrutinizer05: well, there needs to be someone around for the next two years with the ability to releases in case critical breakages occur, though I can't talk about how they solved that |
| 00:18.11 | tehdely | maybe they can have Accenture do it ;) |
| 00:18.31 | Aard | whistles a bit |
| 00:21.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | Aard: as if Nokia showed to care about anything like "long term" support for their 'carp' |
| 00:22.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | N900 wasn't even fixable after < 24 months from initial rollout, due to Nokia dumped all spare parts |
| 00:22.35 | Aard | well, they did a fix for the n900 when there was thet CA desaster ;) |
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| 00:34.41 | M4rtinK | IIRC there are still shops selling N900 spare parts |
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| 02:30.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | well yes, those that Nokia dumped and they bought those by the kg |
| 02:43.10 | GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer05, could be worse. |
| 02:43.12 | GeneralAntilles | Could be Android. |
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| 06:46.30 | pa | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:46.57 | pa | but honestly it doesnt look to me that it's faster or that it occupies less ram, unlike what i read on tmo |
| 06:47.12 | pa | (i did the factory reset) |
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| 07:46.01 | Jeffrey04 | is easy_install and pip available for harmattan? |
| 08:02.15 | jonni | Jeffrey04: no |
| 08:02.38 | Jeffrey04 | jonni even after i enabled sdk repository? |
| 08:04.58 | Jeffrey04 | i should get easy_install after installing python-setuptools from the sdk repository right? |
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| 08:14.50 | Jeffrey04 | lol, install python-setuptools and used easy_install to install pip |
| 08:14.54 | Jeffrey04 | not sure if this is the right way |
| 08:15.06 | Jeffrey04 | but got pip installed at /usr/local/bin |
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| 08:33.23 | Jeffrey04 | argh… https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=978 is still not fixed? |
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| 08:42.11 | jonni | Jeffrey04: you cannot add sdk repo to device, sdk repo is only for scratchbox env. |
| 08:42.25 | Jeffrey04 | no? |
| 08:42.31 | Jeffrey04 | er, ok |
| 08:43.09 | jonni | (or if you add, then your phone is quite likely going to be screwed at some point). |
| 08:43.24 | Jeffrey04 | oh ok |
| 08:43.26 | Jeffrey04 | didn't know that |
| 08:43.30 | Jeffrey04 | got it from here http://my-meego.com/faq/showquestion.php?fldAuto=15&faq=1 |
| 08:43.49 | Jeffrey04 | http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan/free/h/harmattan-repository/ |
| 08:44.02 | Jeffrey04 | so that's actually for the platform sdk? |
| 08:44.12 | jonni | yep thats only meant for scratchbox |
| 08:44.28 | Jeffrey04 | ok, thanks for informing |
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| 09:05.21 | pawky | Great that finally pr 1.3 has come out! :-) Sad though they haven't fixed the obvious bug you cannot edit the text of an E-mail you want to forward or reply to... :-( |
| 09:05.42 | Jeffrey04 | hahahaha, it is not out for everybody |
| 09:05.50 | Jeffrey04 | at least i haven't receive it via OTA |
| 09:05.52 | Jeffrey04 | :) |
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| 09:30.27 | japh | me neither |
| 10:03.26 | rzr | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1233288#post1233288 |
| 10:03.59 | Jeffrey04 | rzr: huh? what does that mean? |
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| 10:09.50 | Jeffrey04 | http://www.linkedin.com/company/jolla apparently they are going to sell new MeeGo devices in future |
| 10:10.39 | SpeedEvil | Great! |
| 10:10.46 | SpeedEvil | I await the new smartphone revolution. |
| 10:10.56 | Jeffrey04 | but isn't the development of MeeGo discontinued? |
| 10:11.38 | chouchoune | thay might be based on Mer |
| 10:11.54 | Jeffrey04 | most probably |
| 10:11.57 | chouchoune | no idea though |
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| 10:12.33 | Jeffrey04 | there isn't much info available for now though |
| 10:17.23 | Jeffrey04 | oh, so they are not going to provide updates for N9? https://twitter.com/JollaMobile/status/221547029971730432 |
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| 10:18.23 | alterego | We should all join #jolla or something to talk about this. |
| 10:18.32 | alterego | Hard straddling over several channels ;) |
| 10:18.39 | Stskeeps | not an official channel |
| 10:18.43 | alterego | Yer |
| 10:19.06 | Jeffrey04 | erm, but there's nothing much to talk about for now, no? |
| 10:19.35 | Stskeeps | best thing to do is follow the twitter and wait for press release |
| 10:19.46 | Jeffrey04 | :) |
| 10:19.59 | rzr | http://identi.ca/tag/jolla |
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| 10:58.03 | denism | "agressively hiring" |
| 10:58.41 | denism | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:59.02 | Aard | denism: yep, if you have interesting skills you might find you in the back of a van suddenly ;) |
| 10:59.07 | alterego | unlikey |
| 10:59.20 | alterego | re ip |
| 10:59.40 | denism | Company size: 51-200. Hmmm. |
| 11:08.41 | SpeedEvil | Aard: :) |
| 11:14.24 | denism | Aard: seems they are located in Helsinki again, so no cakes for other cities without relocation |
| 11:14.44 | Stskeeps | denism: what city are you in? |
| 11:14.56 | denism | Stskeeps: Tampere :) |
| 11:15.17 | Stskeeps | denism: FWIW, i'm not even in Finland and working with them |
| 11:15.36 | Aard | denism: I'm a jolla member, and we do have offices not only in helsinki |
| 11:15.57 | denism | Stskeeps, Aard: remote work is another case, but thank you for the info, really interesting then |
| 11:17.02 | Stskeeps | denism: if you're interested, please send a CV to carsten.munk@jollamobile.com |
| 11:17.35 | denism | but anyway, I think now, after the official announce - there will be hundreds CV for any position :) Even inside Finland. |
| 11:17.42 | rzr | I'll have to do that ... |
| 11:17.43 | denism | Stskeeps: thank you, I will try. |
| 11:18.04 | SpeedEvil | Aard: Stskeeps - whoever else - good luck! |
| 11:18.10 | rzr | but i am sure most nokia employee will ring the door before I hit the send email button |
| 11:18.36 | rzr | anway doing things too fast is not good at the end |
| 11:19.27 | Stskeeps | denism: in your specific case, attach portfolio |
| 11:24.24 | denism | Stskeeps: yes of course, thank you |
| 11:25.22 | dm8tbr | rzr: most probably already did before today ;) |
| 11:25.50 | dm8tbr | it's not like jolla magically happened today... |
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| 11:57.18 | macmaN | so there is no openvpn gui for harmattan yet? tray icon indicator, on/off switch perhaps.. |
| 12:08.02 | ZogG_laptop | macmaN: you are welcome to make mt-toggle |
| 12:09.06 | macmaN | yeah, of course that will kind of stop it from being widely used |
| 12:17.32 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: still waiting for anything helpful with sigong-oauth2 |
| 12:21.19 | Venemo_N9 | heya |
| 12:22.42 | Venemo_N9 | what's up? |
| 12:23.13 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: don't have, sorry |
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| 13:13.01 | Sput | Jolla should open an office in Ulm :> |
| 13:13.17 | Lava_Croft | jolla should remove the rpm stuff right away |
| 13:14.19 | Stskeeps | Sput: i live in Warsaw, Poland and work with them.. |
| 13:14.26 | Stskeeps | who needs offices when you have sofas :) |
| 13:14.45 | Sput | I actually enjoy sharing an office with fellow devs |
| 13:14.51 | Stskeeps | :nod: |
| 13:15.14 | Stskeeps | so do i, at times |
| 13:15.14 | Sput | that's the worst thing about Nokia closing the Ulm site... destroying a few really good teams |
| 13:15.21 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 13:15.35 | Aard | Sput: then you should come to finland. it's nicer here anyway ;) |
| 13:15.39 | Sput | well, I guess BMW will be happy to get a bunch of top-notch developers |
| 13:16.26 | Stskeeps | yes, especially in those IVI times |
| 13:16.29 | SpeedEvil | imagines rotary-sofa surfing teams. |
| 13:16.30 | Sput | yep |
| 13:16.45 | Sput | I think half of my team already applied there. |
| 13:17.02 | Sput | Nokia is really stupid to let all that talent go |
| 13:18.29 | Stskeeps | yeah |
| 13:18.40 | Stskeeps | i can't imagine how their research branch is feeling about all this.. |
| 13:21.30 | Sput | I'm not sure if they still have a research branch |
| 13:21.38 | Stskeeps | that's a good point |
| 13:21.47 | Sput | you don't need one for being an OEM anyway |
| 13:22.52 | Lava_Croft | the killing of knowledge by Nokia is just staggering |
| 13:23.10 | Lava_Croft | Nokia has the people that made it possible to run desktop linux on a ridiculously underpowered mobile device |
| 13:23.16 | Lava_Croft | and its like "naw dont need" |
| 13:23.26 | Lava_Croft | we gots wintoons |
| 13:23.41 | Sput | they're not killing it. they're handing it over to the competition, which currently rejoices about a flood of top-notch engineers on a market that has way more demand than supply... |
| 13:23.55 | Lava_Croft | killing as in killing it inside nokia |
| 13:24.02 | Lava_Croft | you can kill it alltogether |
| 13:24.03 | Lava_Croft | cant* |
| 13:24.23 | Lava_Croft | and to be fairly honest |
| 13:24.30 | Lava_Croft | i think all the developers etc are much better off outside of Nokia |
| 13:24.34 | Lava_Croft | since apparentlt Nokia just doesnt care |
| 13:24.37 | Sput | BMW showed up in Ulm the other day... "hey look, we're hiring 150 developers currently" |
| 13:24.44 | Lava_Croft | logical |
| 13:24.49 | Lava_Croft | BMW already uses meego, right |
| 13:25.07 | alterego | It is a funny move, considering a certain Linux based mobile OS is dominating the market. |
| 13:25.12 | Sput | not sure what they use currently... Genivi was supposed to be based on Meego in 2010, but there's multiple compliant implementations |
| 13:25.16 | Sput | probably Tizen these days |
| 13:25.20 | Sput | and QNX of course |
| 13:25.30 | alterego | But it also shows that the rumoured plan B of Android that some people like to dwell on is obviously false. ;) |
| 13:25.38 | Lava_Croft | lol |
| 13:25.47 | Lava_Croft | nokia wont do android |
| 13:25.50 | alterego | I know |
| 13:26.03 | Sput | Android would've been stupid two years ago, and it's even stupider today |
| 13:26.04 | alterego | Some people still think it's a possibility though, which is kinda hilarious. |
| 13:26.06 | Sput | (for Nokia) |
| 13:26.17 | Sput | in the market Nokia still makes money in, you need full control of the platform |
| 13:26.59 | Sput | can't rely on Google (or MS) to scale down their OSes to a point where your beautiful low-cost hardware runs properly with it |
| 13:27.32 | Sput | since this is so obvious to me, I probably am not manager material. |
| 13:28.35 | SpeedEvil | It's slightly questionable if 'throw windows away, put android on n9/all non s40 phones/all windows phones' might not cause dramaticlaly more sales. |
| 13:28.50 | Sput | oh, more than the WP8 strategy probably |
| 13:30.05 | SpeedEvil | At n9 launch time - there was a closing window of people who hadn't really used android or ios, but finally decided they needed a smartphone. |
| 13:30.19 | Sput | could've sold drastically more N9s |
| 13:30.22 | SpeedEvil | This demographic has now largely evaporated. |
| 13:30.28 | Sput | and created the mythical third ecosystem even a year ago |
| 13:30.39 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. |
| 13:30.47 | Sput | maybe even throw the N950 in the mix |
| 13:30.55 | SpeedEvil | yup |
| 13:31.05 | Sput | so you have two top-notch smartphones at a time where users were frustrated with both Android and iOS |
| 13:31.16 | Sput | (plus a lot of people considering to switch from feature phones) |
| 13:41.41 | Elleo | /16/28 |
| 13:41.42 | Elleo | oops |
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| 13:44.19 | ZogG_laptop | Elleo: is you twitter Mike sheldon? |
| 13:44.34 | ZogG_laptop | /s/you/your/ |
| 13:44.42 | ZogG_laptop | s/you/your/ |
| 13:44.48 | ZogG_laptop | lol |
| 13:50.05 | Elleo | ZogG_laptop: yep, @mikesheldon |
| 14:06.57 | ZogG_laptop | ~source |
| 14:06.57 | infobot | To build Debian packages from source code: first, add a deb-src line to your sources.list file. Then "apt-get build-dep _pkg_" and "apt-get -b source _pkg_" to retrieve the build-dependencies, and the source. The resulting .deb files will be in `pwd`. |
| 14:07.02 | ZogG_laptop | ~sources |
| 14:07.02 | infobot | I guess you mean the handhelds sources, see http://handhelds.org/sources.html |
| 14:07.28 | ZogG_laptop | what is the link for the 1.2 sources? |
| 14:12.56 | Lava_Croft | here, some hype for the Qt fans: |
| 14:12.56 | Lava_Croft | 1605 <+Lava_Croft> god why am i even defending that treehugger |
| 14:12.58 | Lava_Croft | er |
| 14:12.58 | Lava_Croft | what |
| 14:13.02 | Lava_Croft | oh my god paste |
| 14:13.09 | Lava_Croft | http://www.theglobeandmail.com/technology/your-rim-questions-answered-ceo-thorsten-heins-responds/article4395605/?page=1 |
| 14:13.12 | Lava_Croft | i meant that:D |
| 14:13.19 | Lava_Croft | flees the scene |
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| 14:22.07 | pa | my impression or 1.3 drains battery? |
| 14:24.18 | alterego | Apparently the bug is actually the battery indicatot. |
| 14:24.21 | alterego | indicator .. |
| 14:24.33 | alterego | Sounds like something Apple would do. |
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| 14:25.40 | pa | that jumps to something to 4%? |
| 14:25.41 | pa | yes |
| 14:25.45 | pa | but i meant in general |
| 14:25.59 | pa | is it only my impression that it drains the battery faster? |
| 14:27.34 | alterego | Can't say I've noticed it. |
| 14:27.57 | alterego | Seems I'm using it the same as always and getting the same battery life :) |
| 14:28.19 | Elleo | alterego: I think the bug you're thinking of (battery drain by indicator) is in a 3rd party app |
| 14:28.29 | Elleo | alterego: it adds a battery indicator icon to the launcher |
| 14:28.53 | Elleo | but updates it really frequently and causes lots of other stuff to wake up too (because tracker has to wake up when an application icon changes) |
| 14:29.03 | Elleo | it doesn't have anything to do with the core harmattan stuff |
| 14:29.07 | alterego | Ah, right. |
| 14:29.12 | Elleo | personally I've not seen any battery different between 1.2 and 1.3 |
| 14:29.16 | Elleo | difference* |
| 14:29.35 | Elleo | or not enough of a difference to notice at any rate |
| 14:30.19 | pa | ah okay |
| 14:30.24 | pa | then it is probably okay |
| 14:30.32 | pa | Elleo, did you reflash, or upgrade ota? |
| 14:30.36 | Elleo | ota |
| 14:30.39 | pa | ok |
| 14:30.54 | alterego | if anything it seems better to me |
| 14:37.51 | pa | is it possible to have suid root exes in harmattan? |
| 14:38.13 | pa | i mean on our own apps |
| 14:40.53 | Aard | pa: aegis provides the same functionality, though I'm not sure if it'd go through ovi store qa |
| 14:41.18 | pa | Aard, you mean suid functionality? like to write to a 644 file? |
| 14:42.02 | Aard | no, you'll have to request the proper aegis credentials in the packages manifest. file modes are irrelevant |
| 14:46.04 | macmaN | still waiting for 005 to get 1.3 :/ |
| 14:46.23 | macmaN | sort of regretting now i didnt flash with 001 before i configured everything |
| 14:49.01 | pa | hm okay thanks! |
| 14:55.25 | jesuschrist^ | i noticed 1.3 battery to be lower to 1.2 too |
| 15:06.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | \o/ Jolla ??? |
| 15:07.31 | Aard | DocScrutinizer05: you're trying to figure out if you should be happy, or not? |
| 15:07.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm trying to figure out if I like twitter or not |
| 15:08.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | nah, I already decided I don't like that shit |
| 15:09.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | since it seems impossible to get a decent chunk of info >120char |
| 15:10.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | tewitter == neutered IRC for losers |
| 15:12.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, I can't even comment on jolla since I got no clear idea what it's all about |
| 15:13.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>Ex-Nokians form Jolla to continue MeeGo for N9 development! bit.ly/PuJp4P #n9 #meego .@jollamobile<< if this is to the point then good luck as meego is a very fuzzy term |
| 15:14.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | meego for N9 is dead end anyway |
| 15:14.16 | ZogG_laptop | you always can check it with battery app that shows how it drains what and what apps draing what |
| 15:14.23 | Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer05: and further down, working with #merproject |
| 15:14.33 | Stskeeps | but yes, meego's a fuzzy term these days |
| 15:14.35 | Stskeeps | more like an idea |
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| 15:14.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | Stskeeps: hi! :-D |
| 15:15.06 | ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps: more like the basics people start with to make somethig more serious =0) |
| 15:15.45 | ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps: btw mer has no idea to make hardware or end-os but only base for that right? |
| 15:16.10 | Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: correct, we do a core and just a core, with ability for hardware adaptations to tap into, and vendors to put that + uis on top |
| 15:17.04 | Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: very intentional, too - so multiple companies can work together without clashing on typical areas |
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| 15:17.28 | Lava_Croft | and the work for you guys remains overseeable too |
| 15:17.39 | Stskeeps | that too, is easier to QA |
| 15:17.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmmm |
| 15:18.03 | Lava_Croft | i dont think there's any other viable option besides Mer on the 'market' anyway |
| 15:18.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | feels like one more project 24 months late and never catching up |
| 15:18.43 | Lava_Croft | to what does it have to catch up |
| 15:18.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | not the first one I've seen |
| 15:19.28 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: I think it's different, because they're utilizing community openly, and it's built from some very talented engineers from inside Nokia and outside. |
| 15:19.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: will this change things, really? |
| 15:20.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | in 3..6 months, there's no more N9 to buy in shops, just like N900 now |
| 15:21.01 | Jeffrey04 | DocScrutinizer05: there will be used units |
| 15:21.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 15:21.18 | Jeffrey04 | there are some folks in malaysia starting to sell their units off |
| 15:21.23 | Jeffrey04 | claiming it problematic |
| 15:23.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | good luck anyway with "meego on N9" - to me it feels like it's among the worst base to start such project from |
| 15:23.27 | Jeffrey04 | lol |
| 15:23.41 | Aard | DocScrutinizer05: n9 is of no relevance to jolla. n9 is a nokia-phone. |
| 15:23.48 | Lava_Croft | yup |
| 15:23.59 | Jeffrey04 | I have heard people saying they are gonna base their work with mer |
| 15:24.00 | Jeffrey04 | iirc |
| 15:24.10 | Jeffrey04 | nothing official so far though i guess |
| 15:24.31 | Stskeeps | Jeffrey04: it's official on twitter, "works with #merproject" |
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| 15:24.34 | Lava_Croft | from what i understand, the do not intend to make software for nokia devices at all, officially |
| 15:24.45 | Jeffrey04 | Stskeeps: lol, I think I missed that one |
| 15:25.11 | Stskeeps | Lava_Croft: there is a long range of complications with that.. along with the hw blobs for n9xx saying not for commercial usage |
| 15:25.13 | Jeffrey04 | Stskeeps: too many people are spamming things about #jollamobile LOL |
| 15:25.15 | Stskeeps | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:25.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | twitter is great, isn't it? |
| 15:25.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | at least great for spreading rumour and pseudo-info |
| 15:25.40 | Stskeeps | Lava_Croft: but through participation in merproject, there should be benefits anyway.. |
| 15:25.42 | Aard | Lava_Croft: yes, nokia devices will obviously still be supported by mer/nemo, but we'll not provide anything for that from jolla side |
| 15:25.49 | Lava_Croft | aye |
| 15:26.34 | ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps: but today market is between OS's, is there anyone laready interested in mer? i mean someone who intend to do end-user hrdware with it? |
| 15:26.54 | ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps: i still do not understand how it would work out |
| 15:27.03 | Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: there's ongoing projects in various companies, but remember that mer focuses on small to medium enterprises |
| 15:27.09 | Lava_Croft | it's becoming easier and easier for smaller parties to get their 'own' hardware |
| 15:27.21 | Stskeeps | and for what it matters, we don't always know people are doing projects with us |
| 15:27.26 | Stskeeps | until we accidentially hear about them |
| 15:27.32 | Stskeeps | like, what a contributor really works on |
| 15:28.20 | dm8tbr | like today ;) |
| 15:28.24 | Jeffrey04 | guess I should start saving money to buy a device from them in future |
| 15:28.26 | Jeffrey04 | hahahahahahahhaha |
| 15:28.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, some others would call all this "fud" - I hate that term |
| 15:29.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | but fact is the amount of *decent* info available makes it feel silly to even discuss the whole thing |
| 15:29.46 | alterego | What do you want to know DocScrutinizer05 ? |
| 15:29.54 | alterego | Ask questions, and maybe you'll get answers .. |
| 15:30.14 | Stskeeps | or 'we can't tell you yet', as it does happen |
| 15:30.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, let's start with "what is jolla?" |
| 15:30.52 | alterego | Jolla is a company started by ex-nokians that worked on maemo/meego, they plan on distributing handsets based on Qt and the merproject. |
| 15:31.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | or even more generic: "is there *anything* worth reading? related to linux on mobiles" |
| 15:31.27 | Jeffrey04 | just out of curiousity, is jolla related to cloudberrytech? |
| 15:31.31 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: I'm not sure what you'd find interesting ;) |
| 15:31.36 | Jeffrey04 | will you guys co-operate? |
| 15:31.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: WUT? ex nokians plan to distribute handsets? |
| 15:31.45 | alterego | Jeffrey04: no, not exactly, but I think they're friends and may collaborate. |
| 15:31.56 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: yes. manufacturer and sell handsets. |
| 15:32.00 | alterego | -r |
| 15:32.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | hey, now THAT sounds interesting |
| 15:32.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | for me as EE |
| 15:32.33 | Aard | Jeffrey04: we are not related, apart from the fact that we were colleagues in nokia. |
| 15:32.47 | Stskeeps | DocScrutinizer05: next problem, we actually know you ;) |
| 15:33.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: however I have a hard time believing in that detail of Jolla Inc going to be a hw manufacturer |
| 15:33.50 | Stskeeps | [17:27] <Lava_Croft> it's becoming easier and easier for smaller parties to get their 'own' hardware |
| 15:35.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, rant |
| 15:35.17 | alterego | iirc cloudberry are the workers from oulo? |
| 15:35.25 | alterego | ollo? |
| 15:35.31 | alterego | doesn't remember details ... |
| 15:35.40 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: why? |
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| 15:35.46 | *** join/#harmattan lbt (~david@Maemo/community/contributor/lbt) |
| 15:35.47 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: and I don't think that matters ;) |
| 15:35.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | RL experience |
| 15:35.54 | alterego | What you believe I mean. |
| 15:36.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm dealing with "building own hw" since ~5 years now |
| 15:36.15 | alterego | You're not a company. |
| 15:36.26 | alterego | And you don't have the combined experience of these Nokia engineers. |
| 15:36.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm as much a company as jolla |
| 15:36.36 | alterego | And you don't have the investors these guys have. |
| 15:37.01 | alterego | And by investors they have, I mean, you don't have investors :P |
| 15:37.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, they have investors? |
| 15:37.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | whom? |
| 15:37.32 | alterego | How would I know :P |
| 15:37.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, of course I won't get to know... that s business |
| 15:37.47 | alterego | I don't work for them, I'm just going by what I've read today. |
| 15:38.11 | Jeffrey04 | guess i should bookmark the logs and check back when i wake up tomorrow :P |
| 15:38.37 | alterego | And they've stated their intention to develop and distrubute handsets based on Mer/MeeGo, they also mentioned having partners and investors going along with them. |
| 15:38.39 | Aard | DocScrutinizer05: we do have international investors, but that's as much as you get ;) |
| 15:38.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | more than I expected |
| 15:38.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | thanks |
| 15:39.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | so that sounds kinda promissing |
| 15:39.32 | alterego | Right, so now I have something to actually look forward to, and I don't have to go Android or something else. |
| 15:39.33 | ZogG_laptop | Aard: so you are part of that? |
| 15:39.35 | alterego | Hopefully :) |
| 15:39.45 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: yes, I'm a jolla employee |
| 15:39.56 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: the question is it would be anoother stop again |
| 15:40.21 | ZogG_laptop | like N900 was awesome but suddenly meego comes and than n9 and than tizen and than that and next would be something else |
| 15:40.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | if a statement like "those molds for the case are ~200k$" isn't already a killer for your project, that's a nice situation for you |
| 15:40.31 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: they've also mentioned their intention to be as open as possible, which is also something to look forward to. |
| 15:40.40 | ZogG_laptop | while the thing here is just to keep working on 1 thing and polishing it |
| 15:41.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: a statement a former employer of me also had as their major mantra |
| 15:41.21 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: I see what you mean with Tizen, but N900->MeeGo->N9 was just a progression. |
| 15:41.24 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: Nokia said maemo and meego are linux phones but than closed things and aegis come =) |
| 15:41.36 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: it wssn't progression |
| 15:41.44 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: they didn't close anything that wasn't already closed :P And they openned quite a lot up. |
| 15:42.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: and believe me, it's an annoying fight with chip manufs to get clearance to disclose datasheets |
| 15:42.01 | alterego | The entire MeeGo Touch Framework, formerly DUI was open-sourced for MeeGo. |
| 15:42.38 | alterego | DocScrutinizer05: I'm aware of logistical issues with these things, but I'm sure they wouldn't have attempted this endeavour without being sure of themselves. |
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| 15:42.58 | ZogG_laptop | and missing parts and docs and manuals |
| 15:43.01 | alterego | Jolla have been forming for almost a year. I'm sure they've been very busy planning their strategy. |
| 15:43.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | I doubt anybody inside Nokia ever really wrapped his head around that particular aspect |
| 15:43.15 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: but n900 was step 6 of 6 while n9 was setp 0 of X =) |
| 15:43.37 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: N900 was step 4/5, N950 was 5/5. N9 was 0 of X |
| 15:44.04 | alterego | Harmattan is clearly the progression on from Maemo5 |
| 15:44.10 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: wouldn't agree as n950 in my eyes is n9 as we talk about platform and not HW |
| 15:44.15 | alterego | They only called it MeeGo because it was an agreement they had with Intel. |
| 15:44.36 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: your eyes don't matter, this is reality :P |
| 15:44.47 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: harmattan is like not really meego but alredy not maemo =\ |
| 15:45.05 | alterego | The fact is Harmattan is maemo6 really. With MeeGo Touch Framework giving it a somewhat MeeGo 1.2 compliant API |
| 15:45.20 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: reality? so where did you get that n950 is 6/6 ? was it intent to run real maemo? |
| 15:45.30 | alterego | It's a progression of Maemo, it was being planned years before the N900 came out. |
| 15:45.43 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: I said N950 was originally to be step 5/5 |
| 15:45.44 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: that just proves that they changed core part instead of evolutioning it |
| 15:45.51 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: what core? |
| 15:45.58 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: the core is still a deb based linux system. |
| 15:46.10 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: n9/n950 was the 'do a device for consumers' step of the big plan. n900 and before were strictly speaking hacker devices, not consumer ready |
| 15:46.12 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: originally it was n900 to be step 5/5 but than it suddenly became 5/6 =) |
| 15:46.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | guys, does nomenclature about step x of y matter anyway? |
| 15:46.26 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: no, 4/5 |
| 15:46.52 | alterego | Step 1: 770, 2: N800, 3: N810, 4:N900, 5: N950/N9 |
| 15:46.52 | ZogG_laptop | Aard: that's why i say it wasn't in line with maemo devices |
| 15:47.11 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: no, it is in link, since it builds on everything that has been done before |
| 15:47.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | Aard: does your company already have any "face" (URL, whatever)? |
| 15:47.16 | alterego | The move to Qt, the creation of DUI was all planned for step 5 (N9/50), it was planned even during Maemo4. |
| 15:47.28 | Aard | DocScrutinizer05: we will have soon. |
| 15:47.53 | alterego | Harmattan is 100% Maemo, |
| 15:48.04 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: both on the n9 (and on mer/meego) you'll find several components from ancient maemo origin |
| 15:48.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | Aard: so let's assume I'd be interested to participate on a professional level, what am I supposed to do? |
| 15:48.16 | alterego | MeeGo 1.2 was used, because DUI, now MTF, was the toolkit for creating handset UXs that Nokia bought to the MeeGo table. |
| 15:48.20 | Aard | you just don't see them as developer since they're acting as backends for qt apis |
| 15:48.23 | alterego | Aegis was always planned. |
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| 15:48.35 | ZogG_laptop | Aard: i think parts are less relevant than core. |
| 15:48.56 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: and the core is Maemo, through-and-through .. |
| 15:49.19 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: even in times of maemo? |
| 15:49.37 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: yes, I have stated that fact several times :P |
| 15:49.46 | Aard | DocScrutinizer05: depends on what kind of participation. we're working on mer and related projects in the open, and can use any help we get there. or you can contact us by irc or mail addresses which were published about less public cooperations (or send us your CV) |
| 15:50.24 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: the core is maemo. qt-mobility is just a nice api around maemo legacy core |
| 15:50.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | Aard: thanks, will /query you about that eventually |
| 15:50.30 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: it was such base that people working on project to make fremantle stuff to run on harmattan and it is hard work |
| 15:51.27 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: During Maemo4, Nokia planned to use Qt as a strategy across all their handsets, so they moved development away from Gtk/Hildon and started working on DUI, built on the Qt Graphics Framework. When Maemo 5 came out and the N900, we got Qt, so developers would start writing Qt applications to work on Maemo5, which would be completely Qt based, DUI continued to evolve, but Nokia teamed up with Intel, Nokia's contribution to MeeGo was DUI, which |
| 15:51.58 | ZogG_laptop | DUI? |
| 15:52.00 | ZogG_laptop | ~DUI |
| 15:52.13 | ZogG_laptop | developer ui? |
| 15:52.13 | alterego | Direct User Interface, it was the original name for MeeGo Touch Framework. |
| 15:52.14 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: the hard work comes from not supporting gtk or classic qt on harmattan anymore -- there were attempts to make classic qt look nice, but they were abandoned |
| 15:52.29 | ZogG_laptop | a |
| 15:52.36 | Aard | ZogG_laptop: 'developing under influence' |
| 15:52.38 | alterego | It was a pain in the ass. |
| 15:52.42 | ZogG_laptop | Aard: i think it's about to be able to run them somehower at all |
| 15:52.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | regarding "kind of participation" my interests and competences are with hw-review/design, general system architecture with emphasis on the hw side, and interface between hardware and software departments, as well as interface to community about stuff that needs filtering prior to disclosure |
| 15:52.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | Aard: ^^^ |
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| 15:53.29 | ZogG_laptop | pitty i have no degree or knowledge to work in suh startups ever =) |
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| 15:53.56 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: so you see after all meego step was step aside, thats why 5/5 never came in real |
| 15:55.15 | alterego | It did become real |
| 15:55.22 | alterego | N9/50 was Step 5/5 |
| 15:55.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | Aard: typical work package: "review this schematics please. List all design glitches and possible zero/low-cost improvements" |
| 15:55.29 | alterego | But it was too late. |
| 15:56.02 | alterego | Elop had already destroyed that department and claimed their new strategy, which was going to be Maemo 6 / MeeGo / Harmattan, was now Microsoft Windows Phone. |
| 15:56.45 | alterego | So step 5/5 happened, that is the N9 and the N950, it is MeeGo/Harmattan. It was also the end of Nokia's journey with GNU/Linux in the highend market. |
| 15:57.31 | alterego | So the team that were working on Maemo started working on a new project, Meltemi, which was a Linux stack for mid-range smartphones, their next billion strategy, built on Harmattan and all the Maemo revisions before that. But targetted at the emerging smartphone markets. |
| 15:57.39 | alterego | That got destroyed a few weeks ago. |
| 15:58.00 | alterego | And thus ended Nokia's workings with Linux platform development. |
| 15:58.31 | ZogG_laptop | maybe you are right but i think originally planned 5/5 was not that |
| 15:58.40 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: yes, it was. |
| 15:58.44 | alterego | And it always had been. |
| 15:59.16 | alterego | The Maemo team executed the 5 step plan as intended. Not without disruptions, their company falling down around them, and toolkit changes. |
| 15:59.25 | alterego | But their 5 step plan was executed as intended. |
| 15:59.48 | alterego | And it worked, it was just a little too late, if it was before Elop had arrived, Nokia would be somewhere quite different today. |
| 16:00.00 | alterego | And we wouldn't be having this conversation, we wouldn't even be in this irc channel. |
| 16:00.31 | alterego | Even now, I think N9 has out sold all of the Lumia devices |
| 16:00.37 | alterego | Though maybe not now with the 900 |
| 16:00.38 | Aard | alterego: well, maybe you'd be in this irc channel, but instead discussing the next 10 cool nokia harmattan devices ;) |
| 16:01.05 | alterego | Aard: neah, if it had worked, if Elop hadn't had screwed us all over. We'd all still be in #meego |
| 16:01.09 | alterego | Working with Intel. |
| 16:01.51 | alterego | tbf, Nokia has predictably always fallen down when it's attempted to work openly with other companies. |
| 16:01.58 | Aard | as someone who has worked on meego quite early on I'm not that sure about that ;) |
| 16:02.15 | alterego | If Nokia had not joined forces for that short time with Intel, we would have had the N950 probably 6-12 months before we had it. |
| 16:02.31 | Aard | alterego: no. |
| 16:02.42 | alterego | No? |
| 16:02.47 | alterego | All the parts were finished. |
| 16:03.07 | Aard | hardware, yes. software, no. |
| 16:03.15 | alterego | It was only after the partnership with Intel that Nokia rewrote the software for swipe ui |
| 16:03.24 | alterego | We wouldn't have swipe ui, but we would have had the devices. |
| 16:03.43 | alterego | I think at least, but obviously, no one really knows for sure :) |
| 16:04.01 | alterego | And I've always been an outsider, until January this year when I was working on AF maintenance. |
| 16:04.26 | Aard | well, I'd say the rewrite would've happend without the cooperation as well. MTF was crap |
| 16:04.29 | alterego | So my maemo history account there was purely from what I've seen and been told :) |
| 16:04.42 | alterego | Aard: sure, but swipe ui is written in MTF :P |
| 16:05.00 | alterego | I would have liked to have seen the original Harmattan UI. |
| 16:05.17 | alterego | I remember seeing the slides for it, and it looked interesting, a continual desktop like widget thingy. |
| 16:05.23 | alterego | s/thingy/canvas/ |
| 16:05.32 | Aard | alterego: I believe you've seen one version of it ;) |
| 16:05.39 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: may you show me slides |
| 16:05.40 | alterego | Yeah, I heard there were many ;) |
| 16:05.51 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: not sure I can find them, it was a long time ago. |
| 16:06.03 | alterego | Aard: I've obviously also seen the MeeGo Handset UX reference |
| 16:06.18 | alterego | Which I'd imagine was a point of contention in Nokia, hence the swipe ux |
| 16:07.17 | alterego | Anyway, after this mammoth 7 year journey, to have all of this and finally Meltemi collapse, you can understand me being slightly annoyed :) |
| 16:07.23 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: i thought harmattan is what it was meant to be |
| 16:07.27 | Aard | there were many things going on. imo it would've been better to just finish one version, push out a device, then go on, that way we'd have a bunch of devices with improvements now, but that does not work in a dinosaur with management overhead |
| 16:07.43 | Aard | well, meltemi is not a surprise |
| 16:07.55 | alterego | No, I wasn't suprised at all. |
| 16:08.02 | alterego | I saw it coming a mile off. |
| 16:08.17 | alterego | It was too good to be true to be fair. After all we've been through. |
| 16:08.20 | ZogG_laptop | btw i never understood how when harmattan was dead already meltmi was going to be out? why not finish one thing? |
| 16:08.45 | Aard | alterego: I refused several offers on meltemi since I didn't believe it had a future, after I've seen some details of the project |
| 16:09.01 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: Meltemi was based on HArmattan, but wasn't a highend contender, it was meant as a smartphone for the next billion subscribers in emerging economies and markets. |
| 16:09.20 | ZogG_laptop | today kids have iphones |
| 16:09.28 | alterego | Aard: I was going to work on it after working on Harmattan, but obviously that never happened ;) |
| 16:09.35 | ZogG_laptop | what is low end smartphone than? |
| 16:09.52 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: leak the source as revenge |
| 16:09.53 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: not low end, middle range, cheap and functional for places like India and Africa. |
| 16:10.08 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: I still signed an NDA, I'll never leak anything. |
| 16:10.24 | alterego | But the information I do know, I will gladly help people reach their goals :P |
| 16:11.00 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: i told you what i need to complete my app =) |
| 16:11.01 | alterego | If I can, I didn't work on the entire platform. Though did work on a fair few chunks of it. |
| 16:11.10 | alterego | ZogG_laptop: told you I couldn't help there, sorry :P |
| 16:12.32 | ZogG_laptop | alterego: so no facebook source or dropbox? |
| 16:13.03 | alterego | Nope |
| 16:13.30 | ZogG_laptop | damn |
| 16:13.38 | alterego | That would probably effect my future career options :P |
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| 16:18.51 | mike7b4athome | Twitter is exploding todays thanks to @ollamobile :D |
| 16:19.01 | mike7b4athome | @jollamobile * |
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| 16:43.51 | jabis | nice to hear teh jolla news |
| 16:44.16 | jabis | "not all is lost" ^^ |
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| 16:58.46 | jaywink | cool news, maemo/meego has got too far and produced the best smartphone ever imho - good to know there are people who are determined to make use of what has been accomplished :) |
| 17:01.45 | jaywink | "MeeGo-based" trending on Twitter as well :) |
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| 17:07.26 | nibbler | jaywink: i would sign that. in verbatim. |
| 17:10.48 | Aard | hey nibbler. yet another known face I see here ;) |
| 17:12.00 | heymaster | unix:!isEmpty(MEEGO_VERSION_MAJOR) {} << Why does is triggered if I use Qt simulator target ? |
| 17:13.03 | heymaster | what to use for harmattan and Qt Simu;ator ? |
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| 17:31.24 | heymaster | Is N9 is armv6? |
| 17:31.48 | virtuald | armv7l |
| 17:32.25 | virtuald | i guess the l is for little endian but i don't really know |
| 17:32.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep, afaik |
| 17:33.19 | heymaster | virtuald: so what to use if i want to compile library with gcc ? -arch armv7 ? |
| 17:35.09 | heymaster | --with-arch=armv7-a looks like |
| 17:35.48 | virtuald | sorry i don't know |
| 17:36.59 | heymaster | ok :) |
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| 17:46.49 | jonni | -O3 -march=armv7-a -mtune=cortex-a8 -mfpu=neon |
| 17:51.05 | heymaster | jonni: thanks.. -arch was not recognized option. I'm using gcc from QtSDK Madde dir. I think this compiler will compile proper executable |
| 17:51.40 | heymaster | Without any options |
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| 18:23.03 | djszapi | https://twitter.com/JollaMobile -> funky |
| 18:23.07 | ptl | Hi, how can I get a compiled 'aiccu' package for my N9 to setup an ipv6-to-ipv4 tunnel? |
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| 18:24.33 | koe | djszapi, pity it's meego, not harmattan |
| 18:24.55 | djszapi | koe: well, meego is way more open system than harmattan. |
| 18:25.16 | ptl | no aiccu for my N9? |
| 18:26.24 | koe | ptl, i can only suggest easy debian |
| 18:28.04 | koe | djszapi, yep, but harmattan at least has apps and one device, while meegos tizens and other b2g's have none |
| 18:30.37 | djszapi | koe: it is not about the past |
| 18:30.48 | djszapi | koe: it is about building the future. |
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| 18:33.19 | ptl | <- trying to find easy debian for the N9. |
| 18:34.07 | djszapi | ptl: why would you? |
| 18:34.12 | koe | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82114 |
| 18:34.21 | koe | ptl ^ |
| 18:34.24 | djszapi | Cannot you just contribute to the community repository by packaging that stuff ? |
| 18:34.40 | djszapi | why would you run into a way more convoluted debian way? |
| 18:35.04 | koe | and http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1180952&postcount=57 |
| 18:37.24 | ptl | is there any place that has application like vim and irssi compiled for the N9? |
| 18:38.29 | djszapi | ptl: yes, the community repository |
| 18:38.35 | djszapi | ptl: irssi is even available in Ovi. |
| 18:39.26 | ptl | searching |
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| 18:43.03 | ptl | deb http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/rzr:/harmattan/MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan_Maemo.org_MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan_standard/ ./ |
| 18:43.06 | ptl | I found this one |
| 18:43.09 | ptl | isn't that for 1.2 only? |
| 18:43.13 | ptl | I've got PR1.3 |
| 18:44.56 | djszapi | unsure what you mean. |
| 18:45.11 | djszapi | should work with 1.3 |
| 18:45.48 | ptl | "Meego 1.2 harmattan" |
| 18:45.59 | ptl | ok |
| 18:47.42 | djszapi | ptl: wrong name selection. |
| 18:48.45 | ptl | The following packages have unmet dependencies: irssi: Depends: libperl5.10 (>= 5.10.1) but it is not going to be installed tmux: Depends: libevent-1.4-2 (>= 1.4.13-stable) but it is not installable |
| 18:49.04 | ptl | Did I use the right repository? |
| 18:53.07 | ptl | :( |
| 18:56.35 | ptl | djszapi? |
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| 19:04.50 | ptl | sorry |
| 19:04.52 | ptl | I got disconnected |
| 19:05.25 | ptl | anyone got any response on how to install irssi, mpg321, vim, lynx or any other common text-mode utilities via repositories? |
| 19:05.30 | rzr | ptl, we'll have to rebuilt those for pr1.3 i supose ... |
| 19:05.36 | rzr | -p+pp |
| 19:05.39 | ptl | oh |
| 19:05.42 | ptl | thanks, rzr |
| 19:05.46 | ptl | so I've got to wait, right? |
| 19:05.50 | rzr | i used to work before |
| 19:06.03 | rzr | or try to rebuild yourself |
| 19:06.08 | rzr | just fork them |
| 19:06.18 | ptl | I just got my N9 today |
| 19:06.20 | ptl | updated to PR1.3 |
| 19:06.27 | ptl | still reading about this goddman aegis |
| 19:06.59 | ptl | I had a N900 before |
| 19:07.07 | ptl | thought it would be easier to install these |
| 19:07.19 | japh | and what do you think? |
| 19:08.21 | japh | I was horrible disapointed when I went from n900 -> n950... still not convinced someone thought the ui through. but it's at least usable now |
| 19:08.46 | ptl | N950? you are lucky |
| 19:09.03 | japh | it seems |
| 19:09.10 | japh | first time in my life :) |
| 19:10.18 | ptl | anyway, I bought N9 even after knowing that PR1.3 was the last update before the Nokia layoff |
| 19:10.29 | ptl | too bad it's sort of 'the end', but hope Tizen will get adopted by samsung or something |
| 19:13.08 | pa | do you think it's possible to compile evince for harmattan? |
| 19:14.44 | japh | ptl, yeah... but otoh the phone I had prior to me fetching the n900 was the 3310 :p |
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| 19:22.47 | pa | or okular |
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| 19:24.46 | Joku | Hi, I'm workind in a harmattan app and I was wondering if I create a lot of pages but I don't push them into the stack, will that consume memory? do I need to use a loader? |
| 19:25.14 | rzr | <ptl> too bad it's sort of 'the end', but hope Tizen will get adopted by samsung or something |
| 19:25.14 | rzr | you missed some info today |
| 19:25.40 | rzr | ptl, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1233288# |
| 19:28.41 | koe | >>the distro is rpm based |
| 19:28.50 | koe | thats not good |
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| 19:29.19 | koe | and starnge considering maemo/harmattan was deb-based |
| 19:30.46 | Aard | koe: meego was rpm-based. |
| 19:32.49 | koe | yes, i know. |
| 19:33.50 | Aard | both package formats are not that well suited for mobile devices, and both have different advantages/disavantages |
| 19:36.25 | tehdely | i bet this channel has been busy today |
| 19:59.48 | ptl | rzr: checking, thanks |
| 20:04.07 | ptl | good news that one |
| 20:04.30 | ptl | I cannot see why deb would not be well suited for mobile devices |
| 20:04.43 | ptl | or rpm for that matter. |
| 20:05.28 | tehdely | the lack of built-in DRM support is the only thing i can think of |
| 20:05.33 | tehdely | and some of us look at that as a feature :) |
| 20:05.37 | Aard | some operations are too expensive |
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| 20:19.06 | ptl | Aard: like what? post-install scripts? |
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| 20:20.57 | Aard | ptl: dpkg relies a lot on parsing text files, which is awfully slow; the package itself is archive-in-archive, which is not that elegant, and makes accessing packagage metadata slow |
| 20:22.20 | Aard | after having used both formats for some time I prefer rpm with zypper, now that zypper is stable enough for daily use |
| 20:22.37 | admiral0 | pkg.tar.xz <3 |
| 20:22.46 | ptl | somehow I don't see that as a big deterrent, just minor speed differences maybe |
| 20:23.18 | Aard | ptl: on the n900 it was a pain (and no, I'm not talking about the package manager frontend, which made the situation even worse) |
| 20:24.08 | Aard | on the n9 it's less noticable due to more powerful hardware, but could still be sped up drastically |
| 20:24.47 | japh | agreed, dpkg is really really slow, being used to libalpm |
| 20:24.59 | ZogG | Aard, i prefer portage |
| 20:25.26 | ZogG | Aard, btw as i heared from funtoo devs, chromeOS use it as base |
| 20:26.36 | ZogG | tehdely you want DRM as dev or for what reasons? |
| 20:27.04 | Aard | DRM is so dead nowadays ;) |
| 20:29.35 | tehdely | ZogG: oh, i don't want DRM at all |
| 20:29.48 | tehdely | but it seems to be a requirement for a lot of carriers and vendors |
| 20:29.57 | tehdely | so i was just pointing out lack of built-in DRM as a potential downfall for a mobile package system |
| 20:30.02 | tehdely | not my priorities; theirs |
| 20:30.12 | ZogG | tehdely, it doesnt work anyway |
| 20:30.17 | ZogG | like iTunes |
| 20:30.35 | ZogG | i need to upload music into itunes to upload to phone |
| 20:30.35 | tehdely | indeed |
| 20:30.40 | tehdely | it is destined for the dustbin of history |
| 20:30.43 | tehdely | (i hope) |
| 20:30.47 | tehdely | & |
| 20:31.07 | ZogG | it would be painful, but it checks if it's DRM on phone and not if i downloaded it from TPB |
| 20:31.56 | ZogG | do it even worse by macking my local music DRM official music on phone =) |
| 20:32.05 | ZogG | i jsut can't send it over phone to people |
| 20:32.34 | ZogG | ooooh, so bad, because i can just share with flash drives or P2P is i want - so what exactly is the poin? |
| 20:32.36 | ZogG | point |
| 20:34.38 | ZogG | tehdely, i hope it would die soo, i hope flash would be replaced, vendors would support linux and the patents war would stop being ridiculous. So people can be involved in developing new things and new technology =) |
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| 22:16.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | tehdely: (DRM requirement of carriers) they can go FOAD, if they have no better ways than DRM to ensure their business model |
| 22:18.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | no ISa PC ever had real DRM, and still Microsoft managed to sell windoze crap to everybody and his dog. And apple with their itunes stuff binned DRM finally, as they found it reduced ther ROI |
| 22:20.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | the only real reason and ratinale for this particular flavour of DRM (aka aegis) we're talking about here is carriers subsidizing hardware and making money with their customers as hostages |
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| 22:21.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | for *everything* else they want to sell you stuff like aegis for, there are better more lightweight more user friendly solutions |
| 22:31.44 | rzr | invite spanish speakers to translate http://debconf12.debconf.org/video/talkroom2.en.xhtml |
| 22:32.08 | rzr | looks it is aegis related |
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| 23:34.14 | mato__ | Hi all. Does anyone know how can I play MPEG files on my Nokia N9? |
| 23:36.13 | mato__ | I found VLC and Mplayer port. Mplayer worked the best but I found it missing some parts of the picture. I was only able to see the top of the picture but not everything. |
| 23:36.43 | japh | mato__, mash f ? |
| 23:36.57 | japh | mato__, and if that doesn't cut it, play with the args for -fstype |
| 23:37.05 | japh | or hell even try -rootwin |
| 23:38.50 | mato__ | What do you mean? |
| 23:40.44 | japh | fullscreen |
| 23:40.51 | japh | mplayer -fs -fstype help |
| 23:40.54 | japh | etc |
| 23:43.05 | mato__ | Lets see if it works. I can't say yet because I can't forward to the point I'd have the show, playing some MythTV recordings. But for now it seems to work great. |
| 23:43.28 | mato__ | Yeah, I think it is good. Thanks. |
| 23:43.43 | japh | I'm using only mplayer for both video and audio on n900 and n950, and I'm very pleased |
| 23:43.58 | mato__ | Do you have N950? |
| 23:44.05 | japh | yes |
| 23:44.26 | mato__ | Cool. I wish I could have got one but I'm fine with N9. |
| 23:44.30 | mato__ | N900 was awesome. |
| 23:44.35 | japh | indeed.. |
| 23:45.36 | mato__ | How can I prevent this from locking screen unless I press the button? I don't like to be opening it up again and again while watching a movie. |
| 23:46.05 | japh | well that's what I meant with --rootwin |
| 23:46.12 | japh | I think it should work |
| 23:47.45 | mato__ | How do I use --rootwin? Sorry, I'm quite new with this command-based system even though I've been using Linux a few years. |
| 23:48.01 | japh | mplayer -rootwin porn.mkv |
| 23:48.05 | japh | (one dash) |
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| 23:50.29 | mato__ | It's good otherwise but I actually can't get to watch the video. |
| 23:50.37 | japh | hm? |
| 23:50.48 | mato__ | It plays, I can hear the sound, but I can only see the command line window. |
| 23:53.58 | mato__ | I suppose I could put it from the settings to prevent it from locking screen. |
| 23:56.01 | mato__ | Except I can't find a setting for it. |
| 23:57.44 | mato__ | japh you must have been a developer at Nokia, right? |
| 23:57.59 | japh | no |
| 23:58.08 | japh | I'm not quite sure what you mean 'locks up' |
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| 23:58.29 | japh | > grep fixed-vo ~/etc/mplayer/config |
| 23:58.30 | japh | fixed-vo = 1 |
| 23:58.33 | japh | does that help? |
| 23:59.21 | mato__ | When the screen goes black and you can see the clock and then you have to double-tap or press the button and slide out the screen with a picture. Is it a wallpaper or something? |
| 23:59.26 | mato__ | How did you get a N950? |