| 00:15.01 | merlin1991 | anybody got some intel on what the 16kb dev-mode update does? |
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| 00:57.32 | Aranel | which component I should use to create a header (apps name, clickable) with same harmattan look & feel? |
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| 02:00.47 | z720 | #mer |
| 02:00.48 | the-boss | z720: Error: "mer" is not a valid command. |
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| 06:16.07 | heeeegua_ | anyone konw how to implement a plugin for Calendar of N9 |
| 06:16.09 | heeeegua_ | ?! |
| 06:16.37 | heeeegua_ | are there anybody have relevant experiences>?! |
| 06:17.28 | heeeegua_ | I just want to implement a plugin for internal calendar application of n9 by myself. |
| 06:17.53 | heeeegua_ | any points can comment! |
| 06:27.23 | ieatlint | !! |
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| 09:53.15 | Jaffa | MohammadAG: ping |
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| 09:59.11 | abe | Hello, I have a question regarding the N9 |
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| 09:59.49 | abe | Is there anyway to set a custom avatar for myself to use with the skype app? |
| 10:00.58 | abe | I know how to set custom avatars for my contacts, but is there anyway to set a personal one so they could see it on their side? |
| 10:02.26 | abe | I'll post this question on #N9 |
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| 10:22.03 | djszapi | zz_gri: where can I find the "icon-m-web2sms" icon ? |
| 10:23.27 | djszapi | oh okay: https://gitorious.org/web2sms/web2sms/blobs/master/messaging-ui/icon-m-web2sms.png |
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| 10:28.49 | djszapi | kernel source is updated: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan-beta3/free/k/kernel/ |
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| 10:38.20 | gri | djszapi: Why do you need it? :) |
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| 10:41.05 | djszapi | because I also need to install icons for obvious reasons :) |
| 10:41.10 | djszapi | wanted to take an example.. |
| 10:41.18 | djszapi | but I will do it differently in the end. |
| 10:41.30 | gri | if you find out how to rebuild the icon cache, I want to know that :) |
| 10:41.47 | djszapi | I told ya everything last time, remember ? |
| 10:42.13 | gri | No, you said you'll investigate |
| 10:42.45 | djszapi | you are confused. |
| 10:42.53 | gri | might be true |
| 10:42.59 | djszapi | I investigaeted, and clearly stated the facts. |
| 10:43.27 | djszapi | as far as I can tell, I cannot help with fixing the platform bug in that area. |
| 10:43.44 | gri | yeah, so there's no solution |
| 10:43.56 | djszapi | well, reboot only. |
| 10:44.11 | gri | yep ... I've put a warning on the start screen of the application |
| 10:44.20 | djszapi | but I mean.. I do not care too much |
| 10:44.23 | djszapi | it is not an apocalypse. |
| 10:44.33 | gri | in red letters it tells you that you need to reboot your phone when it does not find the images from theme daemon |
| 10:45.18 | gri | and ovi qa is still not doing any testing with my app |
| 10:45.36 | gri | they still think they need a german sim card even though I told them twice they don't need one |
| 10:45.50 | gri | seems they don't read the text in emails |
| 10:49.41 | djszapi | gri: I think you make a fuss about it :P |
| 10:50.31 | gri | hmm? |
| 10:51.41 | djszapi | it is not that a huge problem to get the phone restarted. |
| 10:51.48 | djszapi | I mean I wish that was the biggest problem ever :) |
| 10:54.01 | gri | ah that one, is no problem for me |
| 10:54.28 | gri | I added the warning just for the qa team that they don't reject it because of having no idea that's a system bug |
| 10:54.35 | djszapi | I wonder which icon size would fit in the provider list, but maybe 64x64 and not 80x80 ? I need to test it. |
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| 10:59.51 | gri | djszapi: icon-m-* is in the provider list, those are 64x64 |
| 11:00.03 | gri | you can see that from the other .provider files |
| 11:00.41 | djszapi | yeah, I have already done that actually. |
| 11:00.58 | djszapi | not sure why you made an "l" icon (80x80) :P |
| 11:01.13 | gri | about screen |
| 11:01.20 | djszapi | if you meant to put a launcher icon, I would call it foobar-launcher.png |
| 11:01.23 | gri | and launcher icon |
| 11:01.58 | gri | I just did named them like the nokia applications did |
| 11:02.09 | gri | -one did :) |
| 11:02.16 | djszapi | account plugins do not call it that way, nope |
| 11:02.43 | djszapi | they use the term "foobar-launcher.png" (imo correctly). |
| 11:03.49 | gri | launcher: Icon=icon-l-twitter |
| 11:03.53 | gri | provider file: <icon>icon-m-service-twitter</icon> |
| 11:04.22 | djszapi | check out skype |
| 11:04.30 | gri | don't have skype on the n950 :) |
| 11:04.36 | djszapi | and I still stick by, "foobar-launcher.png" is a better identifier than "l". |
| 11:04.46 | djszapi | you do not have n9 ? |
| 11:04.53 | gri | I have but that's at home |
| 11:04.59 | gri | can't use two phones at once |
| 11:05.12 | djszapi | I have 3 at once :P |
| 11:06.02 | gri | I mainly use the n950, don't like the n9 screen that much for some reason |
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| 11:07.17 | djszapi | interesting, the icon names are mixed up. "l" is preferred, and "foobar-launcher.png" is also used. wow |
| 11:07.43 | gri | take a look at the theme dir |
| 11:07.46 | djszapi | at any rate..."launcher" is more verbose, so my vote on that. |
| 11:07.48 | gri | there are a lot of icon-l and m |
| 11:07.50 | djszapi | I did. |
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| 11:10.43 | djszapi | it would be nice if javispedro can embed some png2svg converter internally into the Harmattan icon generator. |
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| 11:14.01 | djszapi | gri: also, provider icons are not equal to the launcher icon here. |
| 11:14.08 | djszapi | that is another logic why it cannot work this way. |
| 11:14.22 | Venemo_N950 | hey |
| 11:14.42 | gri | djszapi: Well I'm happy that I atleast have an icon :) |
| 11:14.47 | djszapi | I have 5 :P |
| 11:15.46 | the-boss | [APPS] package fahrplan was ACCEPTED for promotion to Apps |
| 11:15.55 | Jaffa | djszapi: There's no good algorithm for turning an arbitrary PNG into a decently scalable SVG. |
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| 11:16.33 | djszapi | Jaffa: tell me a better way if you do not have the SVG :P |
| 11:16.46 | djszapi | without too much work. |
| 11:17.10 | djszapi | so how can I get a Harmattan icon generated properly from an svg for instance. |
| 11:17.15 | djszapi | png* |
| 11:17.46 | djszapi | also, javispedro's site does not seem to accept the generated svgs from pngs. |
| 11:22.18 | gabriel9|job | i would like to see some control panel for adding and removing icons from App screen |
| 11:23.41 | gabriel9|job | that would be nice feature, maybe to add that to Application list, like option beside Uninstall |
| 11:24.54 | gabriel9|job | Show this App In Main Screen, or checkbox, or sliderbutton |
| 11:27.16 | gri | also "move to settings" would be nice for applications like "swipe manager" which does not deserve an launcher icon in my eyes :/ |
| 11:27.47 | gabriel9|job | yes |
| 11:27.50 | gabriel9|job | that also |
| 11:28.41 | gri | a shame that's not opensource ... availability of ovi store leads to more closed source ... |
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| 11:35.15 | leinir | same with fLPMC |
| 11:35.33 | leinir | it's not so much a deserve (i'm very happy with them), it's just well... they fit better in settings |
| 11:36.10 | leinir | Mind you, there's nothing stopping you from adding things to the settings app - apparently that's intended to be possible :) |
| 11:36.20 | leinir | ...just it's also not straight forward ;) |
| 11:38.09 | phako | but documented |
| 11:40.17 | gri | leinir: adding swipe manager to settings is impossible since it's not opensource so I can't do a patch ... |
| 11:40.58 | gri | I could do it on my phone but not publish it .. |
| 11:41.03 | leinir | Oh right! Sorry :) |
| 11:41.12 | leinir | my bad, the "it" up there was a bit ambiguous ;) |
| 11:41.44 | djszapi | gri: I could send a patch though :P |
| 11:41.50 | leinir | i /did/ think you'd likely know about the settings thing already :) |
| 11:42.20 | gri | djszapi: ? |
| 11:42.41 | djszapi | gri: I have access to the codebase. |
| 11:42.53 | gri | djszapi: unfair |
| 11:43.01 | djszapi | huh ? unfair to help ? |
| 11:43.06 | gri | no |
| 11:43.13 | gri | unfair it's not open :) |
| 11:46.06 | djszapi | I think what is important to establish a common structure for plugin dev from third party pov. |
| 11:46.22 | djszapi | as far as I see, doing yet another plugin is almost copy paste of my current plugin code. |
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| 11:46.41 | djszapi | unsure why the devs behind it did not put these things into the library. |
| 11:47.18 | Jaffa | djszapi: My point is there're no settings which javispedro's HIG could use to automate it. And SVGs from Inkscape which has scanned PNGs WORKSFORME |
| 11:47.39 | flux | is there a way to make swipes work according to the application orientation instead of device orientation? |
| 11:47.55 | djszapi | Jaffa: there are sites generating bar from foo, like foo2bar |
| 11:48.07 | djszapi | Jaffa he could embed those once they work compatibly with his generator. |
| 11:48.22 | gri | flux: annoying thing, would also like to behave it different :) |
| 11:48.30 | flux | gri, definitely |
| 11:49.16 | flux | also, it'd be great if the home screen was able to do landscape, because the current behavior now causes superfluous window rotations when switching between landscape apps.. |
| 11:49.33 | flux | be able as in be able to do it without annoying bugs :) |
| 11:50.07 | Jaffa | djszapi: <sigh/> Yes, there are sites & tools for generating foo2bar, including png2svg. My *point* (again) are that getting good results from those tools requires fiddling with things like scanning algorithm, number of passes etc. |
| 11:50.31 | djszapi | I do not need super results. I have never said that. |
| 11:58.01 | djszapi | and I bet, the good quality is also viable through a web service since it can run anything in the background. |
| 11:58.13 | djszapi | it is just a frontend after all. |
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| 12:25.00 | djszapi | zz_gri: any special reason why not use a "normal" section name and "Maemo-Flags: visible" ? |
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| 13:57.06 | djszapi | X-Fade at least the afm icon appeared on the screen and the widget. I have some work to do and debugging with the authentication though/. |
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| 14:00.46 | faenil | he guys |
| 14:00.49 | faenil | hey guys o/ |
| 14:00.52 | faenil | listen to this |
| 14:01.10 | faenil | I have copied all my videos from the N9 DCIM folder to my notebook |
| 14:01.20 | faenil | and then deleted all the files in DCIM folder |
| 14:01.35 | faenil | now I can't record videos anymore |
| 14:01.41 | faenil | it always says the memory is full |
| 14:01.56 | faenil | as if the videos are still there...when they're not |
| 14:02.07 | faenil | how can I force the tracker update? |
| 14:02.10 | faenil | it's really annoying |
| 14:02.28 | X-Fade | faenil: remove the usb cable :) |
| 14:02.41 | X-Fade | djszapi: Cool! |
| 14:02.53 | faenil | x-Fade: lol |
| 14:03.14 | faenil | X-Fade: this thing has been going on for days |
| 14:03.21 | faenil | I have also switched it off and on |
| 14:03.24 | faenil | multiple times |
| 14:03.28 | faenil | it still says memory is full |
| 14:03.37 | X-Fade | And taking pictures works? |
| 14:03.45 | faenil | yes but just because they take less space |
| 14:04.06 | faenil | Settings -> Device -> memory info |
| 14:04.15 | faenil | reports 9,3/9,5 Gb in use |
| 14:04.18 | X-Fade | Time to go to the terminal and do some digging. |
| 14:04.19 | djszapi | does not still have a clue how to publish a Harmattan source code in a sane way |
| 14:04.26 | X-Fade | Perhaps filesystem corruption |
| 14:04.48 | faenil | I just plugged it to my linux distro and copied and deleted files from that folder... |
| 14:04.52 | faenil | also safely removed the device xD |
| 14:05.10 | gri | djszapi: "normal" section name? |
| 14:05.19 | djszapi | indeed |
| 14:05.29 | djszapi | upstream debian thing |
| 14:05.41 | djszapi | you do not need to mess up that with user, just use the maemo flag. |
| 14:06.13 | gri | I just took the default control file which QtCreator created :) |
| 14:06.19 | faenil | does anybody know anything that could help me? some bash cmd, dunno |
| 14:06.21 | faenil | terminal command.. |
| 14:06.22 | gri | never changed the section |
| 14:07.45 | djszapi | phantastic qtcreator... |
| 14:07.54 | djszapi | so someone should send a patch against that mess. |
| 14:11.10 | gri | in maemo it was also user/something |
| 14:11.27 | djszapi | which is a nasty concept |
| 14:11.34 | djszapi | and that is why the visible flag was introduced. |
| 14:12.04 | gri | I don't care about the concept as long as it does work for me |
| 14:12.35 | djszapi | it does not work |
| 14:12.41 | djszapi | that is the the problem |
| 14:13.00 | djszapi | it will fail in many cases where the debian policy expects it otherwise |
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| 14:13.17 | djszapi | so instead of mixing up the way it's been handled for ages, using a flag is the nice way. |
| 14:14.27 | gri | I can't discuss here since I never did any debian packaging before maemo5 |
| 14:14.38 | gri | so I have no clue whats the "right way" |
| 14:14.41 | X-Fade | djszapi: Yeah, the problem is that nothing really looks at that flag ;) |
| 14:14.59 | djszapi | X-Fade: what do you mean ? |
| 14:15.41 | X-Fade | The only part where you might see it in action is for uninstalling hidden far away in settings. |
| 14:16.20 | djszapi | I do not understand what you mean since it is considered by pkgmgr, for instance in case of installation |
| 14:16.29 | djszapi | and by other things as well. |
| 14:16.34 | X-Fade | Yeah, but you never see that. |
| 14:16.45 | X-Fade | As people tend to install through a client. |
| 14:16.52 | djszapi | actually nope |
| 14:17.15 | djszapi | people tend to install from console which is the use case for this for instance along weith the section. |
| 14:17.23 | djszapi | with* |
| 14:17.37 | X-Fade | Ok, well heh. End of discussion then. |
| 14:17.42 | djszapi | if you do not wanna be root, and then i is uninstallable and all that jazz. |
| 14:18.20 | djszapi | so basically these entries were established for special consideration by the pkgmgr for certain cases. |
| 14:24.17 | djszapi | X-Fade: err..it is not for satisfying the most common use case, but add an option for people trying to use these features. |
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| 14:31.18 | djszapi | gri as for me, the providers are in a random order, if I do not use any /etc/ magic. |
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| 14:52.59 | *** join/#harmattan Creteil (~bigbob@62-193-60-158.stella-net.net) |
| 14:53.04 | Creteil | Hi all |
| 14:53.32 | Creteil | can someone explain how I can add repository from : http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/ |
| 14:54.06 | faenil | djszapi: got any idea about someone who could be able to help me out? |
| 14:54.34 | djszapi | Creteil: have you tried this: deb http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/ harmattan/sdk free non-free ? |
| 14:55.26 | Creteil | djszapi, not already, but I'm gona check right now ... :-) |
| 14:58.49 | Creteil | Unpacking bash (from .../bash_4.1-3+maemo6+0m6_armel.deb) ... |
| 14:58.51 | Creteil | aegis-installing bash (from '') |
| 14:58.52 | Creteil | Setting up bash (4.1-3+maemo6+0m6) ... |
| 14:58.54 | Creteil | update-alternatives: using /usr/share/man/man7/bash-builtins.7.gz to provide /usr/share/man/man7/builtins.7.gz (builtins.7.gz) in auto mode. |
| 14:58.56 | Creteil | Updating desktop entries... Done |
| 14:58.57 | Creteil | ^^^^ does it mean I have bash as default shell now ? |
| 14:59.33 | Creteil | Doesn't seem .. |
| 14:59.54 | djszapi | please use paste.kde.org or other services if you have more than 3 lines to paste. |
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| 15:00.17 | djszapi | ash is the default, not bash |
| 15:00.22 | *** join/#harmattan briglia (~briglia@189.2.128.130) |
| 15:00.32 | Creteil | Anyhow, before I break the device, can someone know if I can set bash as default shell (editing) '/etc/passwd' like under my N900 ? |
| 15:01.19 | SpeedEvil | If you do that, you stop the n900 booting |
| 15:03.01 | Creteil | SpeedEvil, I have currently : |
| 15:03.02 | Creteil | root:xxxxxxxxxxxx:0:0:root:/root:/bin/bash |
| 15:03.04 | Creteil | user:xxxxxxxxxxxx:29999:29999::/home/user:/bin/bash |
| 15:03.10 | Creteil | and all goes well ... |
| 15:03.35 | SpeedEvil | maybe the scripts have been updated in PR1.4 |
| 15:03.37 | SpeedEvil | 3 |
| 15:04.17 | Creteil | SpeedEvil, I don't know, but can I do same under the N9 '/etc/passwd' file ? |
| 15:04.47 | djszapi | just try |
| 15:04.58 | SpeedEvil | I would assume that the passwd file is watched by aegis, and you can't go editing it without causing a MALF |
| 15:05.14 | Creteil | djszapi, I don't to have to reflash ... :-) |
| 15:05.22 | Creteil | djszapi, I don't want to have to reflash ... :-) |
| 15:05.35 | djszapi | a developer should never worry about reflashing |
| 15:05.43 | djszapi | that is a consequence of hacking after all |
| 15:06.00 | djszapi | but it works on my N9 |
| 15:06.04 | djszapi | with the beta1 image. |
| 15:06.07 | djszapi | myN950* |
| 15:06.13 | Creteil | djszapi, ok, buy me a 2nd N9 device, then no problem ... ;-) |
| 15:06.21 | djszapi | huh ? |
| 15:06.29 | djszapi | even if it does not work, you can use the NSU |
| 15:06.37 | djszapi | or just avoid hacking since it can happen anytime anyway |
| 15:06.56 | djszapi | but I have just checked it out for you, and no harm here on N950 even with beta1 |
| 15:07.48 | Creteil | djszapi, what about rebooting with bash set as default shell ? You also checked that ? |
| 15:07.57 | djszapi | yes... |
| 15:08.33 | Creteil | ok |
| 15:08.41 | djszapi | but it is N950 and beta1 |
| 15:09.11 | Creteil | tsss |
| 15:09.57 | Creteil | you don't have a N9 to break to verify ? :-) |
| 15:11.14 | djszapi | if you are that scared off, just use ash |
| 15:12.08 | djszapi | actually the second boot did not work somehow. |
| 15:12.15 | djszapi | it is now in a loop without a malf screen |
| 15:12.19 | djszapi | so you better go with ash. |
| 15:12.22 | Creteil | lol |
| 15:12.24 | Creteil | ok |
| 15:13.46 | djszapi | ok I now got a malf screen after 5 minutes continous rebooting: some dnsmasq error message. |
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| 15:14.04 | Creteil | ??? |
| 15:14.18 | *** join/#harmattan Sazpaimon (wat@c-68-32-58-174.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 15:14.22 | Creteil | what dnsmasq have to do with the default shell modification ? |
| 15:14.50 | Creteil | damn, I also remember I have modified /etc/dnsmasq.conf ... |
| 15:14.58 | djszapi | well, if you are a developer, you can know that it is basically anything in the background without further debugging... |
| 15:15.17 | djszapi | but thanks for giving me the idea to break my device :P |
| 15:15.23 | djszapi | need to find a beta1 image somewhere. |
| 15:15.28 | Creteil | :-) |
| 15:16.35 | Creteil | Edition of dnsmasq.conf doesn't seem to cause troubles on the N9 : |
| 15:16.48 | Creteil | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 450 Dec 9 20:16 /etc/dnsmasq.conf |
| 15:16.50 | Creteil | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 209 Dec 9 20:16 /etc/dnsmasq.conf-backup |
| 15:16.51 | Creteil | ~ $ uptime |
| 15:16.53 | Creteil | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:16.57 | djszapi | paste.kde.org ! |
| 15:17.43 | Creteil | I don't see flood for some lines ... |
| 15:19.31 | Creteil | Does you IRC client cry about flood alert for theses lines I pasted ? |
| 15:19.55 | djszapi | please do not argue about it, it is a general rule to paste somewhere else above 3 lines as I already said above. |
| 15:21.44 | Creteil | ah ok, as you already say ... |
| 15:21.54 | djszapi | gri: mmm, it seems to be feature complete: https://gitorious.org/accounts-sso/libaccounts-ui/blobs/master/lib/AccountsUI/credentialwidgetview.h |
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| 15:35.18 | rafael2k | people, can the neno be used instead of harmattan for dailly phone usage? |
| 15:35.23 | rafael2k | nemo |
| 15:35.33 | djszapi | #nemomobile |
| 15:35.34 | the-boss | djszapi: Error: "nemomobile" is not a valid command. |
| 15:35.43 | rafael2k | ok! |
| 15:35.56 | djszapi | but I would like to warn you, you lose the warranty of your expensive phone. |
| 15:36.12 | rafael2k | I paid nothing for it |
| 15:36.20 | rafael2k | : ) |
| 15:36.24 | faenil | rafael2k: short answer is no anyway :) but come to #nemomobile ;) |
| 15:36.51 | rafael2k | thanks! Id like to use the phone in aegis open mode... |
| 15:37.05 | djszapi | why not the open kernel then ? |
| 15:37.11 | djszapi | is it too buggy still ? |
| 15:37.48 | rafael2k | where can I find info about running harmattan in aegis open mode/open kernel? |
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| 15:38.23 | rafael2k | I really have not done this yet |
| 15:38.51 | djszapi | normal because it has not been supported so far |
| 15:39.14 | djszapi | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/openmode_kernel_PR1.1/ |
| 15:40.11 | rafael2k | great, thanks!!! |
| 15:44.11 | *** join/#harmattan westlunder (~westlunde@89.143.176.138) |
| 15:44.56 | westlunder | hey |
| 15:45.12 | westlunder | where can i download this firmware for the nokia n9? |
| 15:45.13 | westlunder | DFL61_HARMATTAN_20.2011.40-4.NORTHERNEUROPE_EMMC_NORTHERNEUROPE.bin |
| 15:45.35 | djszapi | just use NSU |
| 15:45.49 | westlunder | can't do it through nsu |
| 15:46.26 | *** join/#harmattan faenil (~faenil@131.114.170.109) |
| 15:46.44 | djszapi | why ? |
| 15:47.10 | westlunder | with the default product code i don't even get the update |
| 15:47.15 | westlunder | after i changed the product code |
| 15:47.45 | westlunder | NSU says: nokia software updater has lost its connection with your device, follow these steps to help reconnect your device,.. |
| 15:47.57 | westlunder | it just doesn't update |
| 15:48.04 | westlunder | tried it several times |
| 15:49.29 | djszapi | on Windows ? |
| 15:49.55 | westlunder | ye |
| 15:52.44 | westlunder | found it on navifirm |
| 15:52.51 | westlunder | thanks for the telp |
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| 16:04.37 | ZogG_laptop | noone wants to try my app |
| 16:05.30 | ZogG_laptop | djszapi: piiiing |
| 16:09.03 | djszapi | pong |
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| 16:24.34 | gri | hmm, meecast and gpodder are in both, ovi store and apps for meego - so that is ok?! |
| 16:25.34 | djszapi | why wouldn't it ? |
| 16:25.54 | djszapi | they are different stores after all |
| 16:25.59 | gri | thought ovi wants the exclusive distribution right |
| 16:26.43 | djszapi | it sounds like you think Ovi has some agreement with the publishers about not being able to publish somewhere else. |
| 16:27.13 | gri | that's what I was thinking |
| 16:28.32 | djszapi | well, you should know it since you published things to Ovi :P |
| 16:29.51 | leinir | gri: it's some stipulation in there, i believe it says something which boils down to you not being allowed to sell anything which you sell on ovi anywhere else... but if it's free distribution, i /think/ it's ok... ianal, but... yeah |
| 16:30.57 | gri | djszapi: I consider removing it from ovi myself since the qa guys don't seem to understand what the application is for and don't want to start testing |
| 16:31.14 | djszapi | I do not think it is a problem actually in the practice. |
| 16:31.37 | djszapi | so people publishing to other stores like AFM, will not remove it from there after publishing to Ovi. |
| 16:31.53 | thp | gri: if you uninstall the ovi-distributed package you can install the apps.formeego-distributed package and vice versa (at least that was the case when i last checked it) |
| 16:32.30 | thp | you also have to uninstall the ovi-provided package if you install a new package built from scratch (i.e. for testing) |
| 16:32.45 | gri | thp: And if I have installed the ovi version but the afm one gets updated faster I am unable to update? |
| 16:32.49 | djszapi | thp: we are discussing from legit pov :P |
| 16:33.17 | djszapi | gri: yes of course |
| 16:33.19 | thp | djszapi: what's not legit about the things i wrote? ;) |
| 16:33.24 | djszapi | since it comes from less trusted source... |
| 16:33.41 | djszapi | it is basically the same for the platform packages. |
| 16:34.01 | djszapi | thp: well, you said something technically, not legit pov, right ? |
| 16:34.15 | thp | gri: uninstall the package, then install from afm |
| 16:34.31 | djszapi | that might be though a pain, if someone packages the stuff badly. |
| 16:34.47 | djszapi | or is all the ovi package uninstallable from the Ui ? |
| 16:34.59 | djszapi | I guess it is just up to the packaging. |
| 16:35.15 | djszapi | so for an end user, and not hacker, it might be a no-go. |
| 16:35.15 | gri | thp: I know, I just thought that there might exist dumb users which just see "update failed" and don't know how to continue |
| 16:35.33 | thp | djszapi: no, i mean even in my case, i distribute gpodder in ovi but sometimes i send updated versions to users as .deb and they have to uninstall the ovi version before installing the .deb provided by me |
| 16:35.56 | djszapi | mr joe. does not know console. |
| 16:36.08 | thp | (usually an update that fixes some user's issue that waits in ovi QA so that the user doesn't have to wait for the package to appear in the store) |
| 16:36.44 | thp | djszapi: all that can happen in the UI. uninstall via settings/applications, then install via .deb copied to MyDocs and the "Search" feature (or any filemanager app) |
| 16:36.52 | djszapi | I would agree with gri here, even ui uninstall/install is painy for them |
| 16:37.00 | thp | yes it is |
| 16:37.04 | djszapi | thp: that is not a mr. joe workflow |
| 16:37.35 | djszapi | vica versa works though. |
| 16:37.41 | djszapi | vice* |
| 16:37.47 | thp | i'm not saying it's a good/easy solution. i'm just saying that this is the workaround that users who want to have updated packages can do with some work |
| 16:39.07 | djszapi | I am unsure whether Nokia and Ovi solved the fact, to not show up a "new update available" message, if the update is available only less trusty source. |
| 16:41.00 | djszapi | since it makes no sense to show that, if the update is available from less trusty source. I would expect that. |
| 16:41.12 | djszapi | if they solved it, it is not a real problem. |
| 16:42.16 | gri | on my phones "updates available" does not even show up for ovi applications :) |
| 16:42.43 | gri | the phone tells me "update available" when I manually started the update in ovi store o_O |
| 16:42.52 | djszapi | lol |
| 16:43.05 | djszapi | also, AFM could show up a message, it is already installed from OVI or X, please remove it first. |
| 16:43.18 | djszapi | would easy to check against an Ovi install precisely. |
| 16:43.21 | djszapi | be* |
| 16:43.44 | thp | or even offer to uninstall and reinstall (given that there are no dependency problems) after a confirmation |
| 16:43.51 | djszapi | rather, it could even help with the removal. |
| 16:44.04 | djszapi | "Would you like to first remove the package from Ovi?" |
| 16:44.24 | thp | yep. write that down somewhere. is there a bug tracker for the AFM client? |
| 16:44.37 | djszapi | what dependency problems ? |
| 16:44.45 | djszapi | AFM should have a proper workflow for the dep thingie. |
| 16:44.57 | djszapi | QA workflow. |
| 16:45.21 | djszapi | Ovi app cannot be the dep for anything else, thus I do not see such a problem. |
| 16:46.05 | thp | that's true. so it might not be a problem after all. i hope the same holds true in AFM as well (i.e. nothing can depend on a "user/*" package) |
| 16:46.19 | djszapi | http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-applications/meego-apps-client -> gitorious sucks for several reasons, for instance the missing project mailing list and bugtracker. |
| 16:46.28 | djszapi | so I would expect you need to report it on the meego bugtracker. |
| 16:46.54 | djszapi | user/* should not be used at all |
| 16:47.28 | thp | why not? otherwise it won't show up on the uninstall screen of the built-in application manager? |
| 16:47.36 | djszapi | why not ? |
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| 16:48.02 | djszapi | if not, that is a bug since Maemo-Flags: visible was designed for that. |
| 16:48.09 | djszapi | this user/* was a nasty hackery back then |
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| 16:48.39 | thp | ah, good to know. didn't about that, although I was wondering about the purpose of Maemo-Flags earlier today |
| 16:49.17 | thp | so the handling of Section: user/* is deprecated in harmattan? can fremantle's application manager also deal with Maemo-Flags:? |
| 16:50.09 | djszapi | I owuld not say it is deprecated, and I have no clue about Fremantle. |
| 16:51.05 | djszapi | thp: I documented it here: http://community.kde.org/KDE_Mobile/Harmattan#Packaging_your_KDE_Mobile_application_with_shared_libraries |
| 16:51.20 | djszapi | from the part: "You can see the "Section: user/kde" and "Maemo-Flags: visible" entries." |
| 16:51.23 | *** join/#harmattan faenil (~faenil@dynamic-adsl-78-12-93-193.clienti.tiscali.it) |
| 16:52.07 | djszapi | faenil: so have you tried to figure out where the consumption is, in which directory, or is it clean memory usage ? |
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| 17:03.28 | faenil | djszapi: I have no videos...no photos... |
| 17:03.35 | faenil | what can take 9gb of memory? |
| 17:04.04 | djszapi | is it memory or hard disk space ? |
| 17:04.24 | faenil | inbuilt N9 memory ? :P |
| 17:04.25 | djszapi | in other words: is it some left-over temporary or backup or memory issue ? |
| 17:04.41 | faenil | I don't know... |
| 17:04.50 | faenil | it just says user data: 9,3/9,5Gb |
| 17:05.28 | djszapi | what says that ? Please gimme full output |
| 17:07.44 | faenil | Settings->Device->Data storage |
| 17:08.17 | djszapi | I have 57-58 GB |
| 17:08.19 | djszapi | but ok |
| 17:09.04 | faenil | eh, you have 64gb model :P |
| 17:09.11 | djszapi | at any rate cat /etc/mtab |
| 17:09.17 | djszapi | or something like that, and go figure out |
| 17:09.24 | djszapi | you might have some left-over backup or temporary |
| 17:09.33 | djszapi | try to localize the folder where that big size resides. |
| 17:10.06 | faenil | ok...but this is not likely to be the issue, because it happened when memory was full because of videos, I deleted videos, and it was still full...no change :D |
| 17:10.10 | faenil | anyway, checking |
| 17:10.26 | djszapi | you need to understand which folder is that full right ? |
| 17:10.45 | faenil | well, actually I think it's just the tracking reporting wrong "free" memory value |
| 17:11.01 | djszapi | user data is not memory |
| 17:11.10 | djszapi | I have never seen 64 GB memory on a phone yet |
| 17:11.22 | djszapi | it is the disk stuff imho |
| 17:11.28 | faenil | ofc... |
| 17:11.32 | faenil | not memory as RAM |
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| 17:12.31 | djszapi | you need to localize as much as possible which folder reports that |
| 17:12.36 | faenil | what should I look for in mtab? |
| 17:12.48 | djszapi | which partition is that 9.5 GB |
| 17:13.43 | deram | unfortunately flash memory is memory... |
| 17:13.57 | djszapi | probably /home/user/MyDocs/ |
| 17:14.10 | faenil | yes most probably |
| 17:14.30 | faenil | but mtab doesn't report size of most of the entries |
| 17:14.44 | deram | probably some du /home/user/MyDocs/ |sort -n could give some estimate what is taking most of the space |
| 17:14.49 | djszapi | but it reports what partitions are partitioned |
| 17:15.00 | djszapi | so that is an initial step to get information about partitions |
| 17:15.09 | faenil | yeah |
| 17:15.15 | faenil | but I guess it's mydocs 99% |
| 17:15.40 | djszapi | go and figure out which consumes the space |
| 17:15.43 | djszapi | not that a hard task :) |
| 17:16.18 | faenil | nope...I just thought there was a way to force resource refreshing... |
| 17:16.35 | faenil | ok got it |
| 17:16.36 | djszapi | not sure what you mean. |
| 17:16.54 | faenil | MyDocs/.Trash-1000 |
| 17:16.55 | faenil | -.- |
| 17:17.08 | faenil | how the hell did files got there? :P |
| 17:17.35 | w00t | thank your file browser |
| 17:17.44 | deram | you deleted the files using computer, with phone in udb-storage mode |
| 17:17.52 | faenil | did it from Nautilus |
| 17:17.57 | deram | and it recycled them not deleted |
| 17:18.05 | djszapi | faenil: why not delete stuff with rm ? |
| 17:18.11 | djszapi | instead of trusting some ui app ? :P |
| 17:18.17 | faenil | djszapi: of course, now that I know where they are :P |
| 17:18.19 | Sput | and that's why I still do most file operations from the shell. |
| 17:18.19 | djszapi | actually I use rm -rf |
| 17:18.32 | deram | in nautilus there is option to empty the trash |
| 17:18.42 | faenil | djszapi: just coz I was copying files to the notebook...and just deleted them after copying, as everyone does |
| 17:18.48 | deram | (and also disable trash folders on removable medias) |
| 17:18.54 | djszapi | so in my experience for this type of issue: |
| 17:19.09 | djszapi | 1) Trash 2) Backup 3) Some big temporary file |
| 17:19.10 | faenil | thanks deram, did not know about trash on removable medias |
| 17:19.42 | faenil | thought they would have been transferred to MY trash, not my n9's... |
| 17:21.47 | djszapi | faenil: you are welcome ;) |
| 17:21.58 | deram | hmm.. unfortunately I can't find that option anymore... |
| 17:22.01 | faenil | was writing command :P |
| 17:22.06 | faenil | ok much better now :) |
| 17:22.13 | faenil | thanks djszapi and deram :) |
| 17:22.24 | deram | gnome is surely going to the more user friendly way |
| 17:22.57 | djszapi | have you tried gnome3 or/and unity on tablet ? It is pretty amazing |
| 17:23.02 | djszapi | way better sadly than PA. |
| 17:24.12 | ZogG_laptop | gnome/kde/unity sucks |
| 17:24.15 | deram | haven't tried yet.. been dodging the unity since it crashed on friend of mine.. |
| 17:24.43 | ZogG_laptop | just make it productive and simple and not shinny and slow |
| 17:24.52 | deram | probably it would be worth a try in my htpc |
| 17:26.06 | faenil | djszapi: don't be in a hurry, thanks will come ;) |
| 17:31.32 | faenil | I'm currently using Gnome3 on linux mint 12...find it very nice :) |
| 17:31.32 | faenil | don't know why people hate it so much... |
| 17:31.32 | faenil | lack of lot of options though |
| 17:31.32 | faenil | tooooo few options in the menus and submenus |
| 17:31.32 | leinir | faenil: well, if it works for your workflow, you're good, the problem is when it doesn't, then you're pretty much stuffed |
| 17:31.33 | faenil | :) |
| 17:31.33 | djszapi | I wish PA reached the stability level of Gnome3 or/and Unity even just on tablets. |
| 17:31.33 | faenil | It's ok for fighting against qt for android :D |
| 17:31.33 | faenil | djszapi: PA looked very nice on my n950 |
| 17:31.35 | deram | what is PA in this context? |
| 17:31.35 | djszapi | you serious ? |
| 17:31.35 | djszapi | deram: http://plasma-active.org/ |
| 17:31.37 | djszapi | faenil: from what I saw, it was not scaling well for handset at all... |
| 17:31.37 | faenil | nope, but the UI idea was nice |
| 17:31.37 | deram | thanks, didn't find anthing relevant with standard google first.. |
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| 17:33.15 | djszapi | faenil: PA is even very unstable on tablets. Did I now show you in Munich it could not even establish a network connection for 4 days properly ? |
| 17:33.22 | djszapi | not* |
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| 17:34.56 | djszapi | I wanted to show angry birds on tablet with the html5 version to people, and .. well, I was a bit ashamed of its buggyness about not even connecting to the network for a simple game. |
| 17:36.36 | faenil | :D |
| 17:36.44 | faenil | djszapi: I didn't remember it was PA :) |
| 17:36.53 | faenil | anyway, I like the UI idea, still :P |
| 17:37.18 | djszapi | the idea is not enough for succeeding :P |
| 17:37.41 | djszapi | cannonical imho employs way more developer on a gnome tablet version. |
| 17:37.49 | djszapi | developers* |
| 17:38.30 | faenil | :D |
| 17:46.53 | Venemo_N950 | hmhm |
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| 18:09.40 | faenil | have to go guys :) cya tomorrow ;) |
| 18:09.43 | faenil | enjoy! :D |
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| 18:55.10 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: I don't think etc/passwd should get monitored by aegis - makes no sense basically |
| 18:55.53 | DocScrutinizer | anyway on fremantle it's not bash but the toolbox that breaks initscripts |
| 18:56.25 | DocScrutinizer | just replacing sh by bash still leaves all the friggin busybox aliases for toolbox cmds |
| 18:59.53 | DocScrutinizer | and iirc we tracked the initscript problem down to some nonsense like ls, mount, date, foo giving an output format that the proper toolbox cmd either doesn't know at all (too crippled), or at very least would need a cmdline option parameter to behave like friggin busybox builtin does without that parameter |
| 19:02.08 | DocScrutinizer | alas POSIX doesn't specify output format of commands to the last space and comma |
| 19:05.50 | DocScrutinizer | t900:~# ps|head |
| 19:05.51 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:05.53 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:06.03 | DocScrutinizer | jr@halley:~> ps|head |
| 19:06.04 | DocScrutinizer | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:06.06 | DocScrutinizer | 11911 pts/4 00:00:00 ps |
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| 19:52.36 | lizardo | did anyone notice a silent upload of the latest N9 kernel source to http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan-beta3/free/k/kernel/kernel_2.6.32-20113701.10+0m6.tar.gz around yesterday? |
| 19:53.35 | djszapi | yes |
| 19:53.39 | Stskeeps | heh heh |
| 19:53.41 | djszapi | I pasted the link this morning :P |
| 19:53.43 | lizardo | right in time for xmas :) |
| 19:53.52 | Stskeeps | they ran out of burnable dvds ;) |
| 19:54.08 | djszapi | but it is only a kernel update we did. |
| 19:55.15 | djszapi | so if you need more, you still need to request the DVD |
| 19:55.57 | kimju | so which image that source matches? pr1.1 ? |
| 19:56.48 | lizardo | BTW, do you remember which toolchain the signed kernel is built with? cs2009q3-eglibc2.10-armv7-hard ? |
| 19:56.52 | djszapi | kimju: yeah |
| 19:56.55 | ieatlint | probably... that appears to be from week 37, and pr1.1 is from week 40 |
| 19:57.20 | djszapi | lizardo: why do you ask ? |
| 19:57.46 | lizardo | djszapi, I want to build a kernel image as closest as possible to the signed one |
| 19:58.11 | djszapi | what is the purpose of your own kernel ? |
| 19:58.23 | lizardo | I tried using the toolchain from Madde (Qt SDK) but the image was a few KB bigger |
| 19:58.52 | ieatlint | heh, ask a simple question, get several questions about your motives |
| 19:58.58 | lizardo | djszapi, bluetooth experiments :) |
| 19:59.05 | djszapi | lizardo: that is the one we use. |
| 19:59.22 | djszapi | we do not use linaro, nor soft as android does. |
| 19:59.36 | djszapi | nor 2.8 version of eglibc2 |
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| 20:00.15 | djszapi | though, I have no clue about madde since we use sb. |
| 20:01.11 | lizardo | djszapi, theoretically it is binary compatible (otherwise Qt apps would fail to run) but for kernel I would rather use the exact same toolchain from the official images |
| 20:02.49 | djszapi | many things should be theoritically compatible in qtcreator, to put it mildly :) |
| 20:07.46 | djszapi | lizardo: in other words, wehave not changed since you left Nokia :) |
| 20:10.12 | lizardo | djszapi, well, I have not left Nokia because... INdT is still inside a Nokia factory site :) |
| 20:10.28 | djszapi | so do you still work for Nokia ? |
| 20:11.14 | djszapi | just on a different project, or what do you precisely mean ? |
| 20:11.24 | lizardo | djszapi, yes, in some way... But projects have been shifting away from MeeGo, as you might suspect |
| 20:12.20 | lizardo | but INdT still works for Nokia's supported ecosystems (anyway, this might be off-topic here) |
| 20:12.42 | djszapi | I still work for Nokia and Harmy. I am too loyal to the customer and the project. :) |
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| 20:13.20 | ZogG_laptop | harmy? |
| 20:13.23 | lizardo | djszapi, is Harmy a fancy name for harmattan or something else ? never heard of it |
| 20:13.59 | djszapi | lol never thought Harmy is vague as a nickname for Harmattan :) |
| 20:14.12 | djszapi | (on this channel) |
| 20:14.59 | kimju | usually it seems to be called HARM. |
| 20:15.26 | ZogG_laptop | so is it harmattan? |
| 20:15.55 | djszapi | NO, it is Android! |
| 20:17.00 | ZogG_laptop | maybe it's some name for company |
| 20:17.12 | ZogG_laptop | djszapi: i know what you mean by loyal to customers |
| 20:18.46 | ZogG_laptop | i work for company when sometimes her decisions are not the best but still i do try to help customers even it's more than i should |
| 20:19.14 | djszapi | I think helping the customer is not enough. You need to make them win :) |
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| 20:20.02 | ZogG_laptop | djszapi: btw if you do work i have one question. i do understand the problems of QA test before releasing any software or updates, but why critical bugfixes are not released separetly? |
| 20:20.54 | djszapi | ask the people who chose Elop :) |
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| 20:23.50 | djszapi | I do not have any relation with the product and release management. I am just a poor dev. :) |
| 20:24.54 | ZogG_laptop | =( |
| 20:25.17 | ZogG_laptop | it was the same with maemo before elop actuall |
| 20:25.19 | ZogG_laptop | y |
| 20:25.34 | djszapi | except that they did have enough resurce. |
| 20:25.37 | djszapi | resource* |
| 20:27.51 | djszapi | also, the wow-effect is bigger if you do not release every tiny bit, so it is not just about the overhead they do not have capacity for. |
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| 20:43.13 | ZogG_laptop | bug 123 is not one person should expect everyday |
| 20:43.18 | _MeeGoBot_ | Bug https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=123 maj, Highest, ---, ext-risto.lahti, RESO FIXED, accounts passwords are not remembered accross reboots |
| 20:43.42 | ZogG_laptop | and if answer is to flash than it's ok if i have full control of phone i mean no aegis |
| 20:43.56 | ZogG_laptop | like my PC |
| 20:43.59 | ZogG_laptop | i have bugs |
| 20:44.08 | ZogG_laptop | but i choosed to use certain programs and OS |
| 20:44.19 | ZogG_laptop | so it is my choice |
| 20:44.41 | ZogG_laptop | while here they say user shouldn't install and do whatever he wants |
| 20:44.52 | ZogG_laptop | but on other side it's okay for end user to flash |
| 20:44.59 | ZogG_laptop | nonsense |
| 20:59.01 | jonni | answer was wait for pr1.2 :) |
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| 21:13.25 | ZogG_laptop | jonni: it asks for password every 20 mins |
| 21:13.57 | ZogG_laptop | wazd is a devil =) - http://tabletui.wordpress.com/2011/09/06/web-browser-of-today/#more-431 |
| 21:16.14 | jonni | yep, it usually does that if it roams between wifi/2g/3g, bug in PR1.1 |
| 21:18.14 | jonni | i've already got used to entering my password quite fast on N9 PR1.1 device |
| 21:29.34 | ZogG_laptop | jonni: don't think it's solution =) |
| 21:29.52 | ZogG_laptop | btw what does request quote means? |
| 21:31.44 | ZogG_laptop | http://www.nfctags.com/upm-bullseye-nfc-tag-mifare-1k-classic - does it mean free sample or what? |
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| 22:32.24 | gabriel9 | night all |
| 22:33.09 | djszapi | sleep well. |
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