| 00:05.05 | thomas__ | i meant `various ipkg packages'. |
| 00:13.34 | pb_ | thomas__: yes. |
| 00:14.11 | kergoth | finally disabled that stupid sysvinit open of the VT master if /dev/console open fails |
| 00:14.14 | kergoth | was pissing me off |
| 00:14.21 | pb_ | kergoth: aha. |
| 00:14.34 | pb_ | kergoth: I was just thinking about making a new sysvinit for familiar yesterday for that very reason. |
| 00:14.39 | kergoth | hah |
| 00:16.59 | pb_ | maybe I should just file a suitably vitriolic bug against the debian package and let them deal with it. |
| 00:17.18 | kergoth | hehe. I tend to fix now, push upstream later |
| 00:17.26 | kergoth | course then i forget to push it upstream at all half the time |
| 00:17.30 | kergoth | *g* |
| 00:18.03 | NonToxic | kergoth: sweet, do you have an ipkg of it? |
| 00:18.21 | pb_ | kergoth: hehe |
| 00:18.36 | kergoth | yeah, just built it. Note that it Depends on 'login', which is my Provided name for that which provides getty |
| 00:18.55 | kergoth | otherwise when i moved tinylogin bits from busybox to seperate tinylogin the seperate tinylogin wouldnt get installed automatically :) |
| 00:19.05 | *** join/#handhelds.org LoRez (mike@orcrist.ip6.milliways.cx) |
| 00:20.24 | thomas__ | pb_ & kergoth: i installed pre4 & am now purposely doing a ipkg install -force-depends task-opie . will this mess up gpe badly? i think i should have figured this out before trying it. |
| 00:20.38 | *** join/#handhelds.org Slothbag (nerf@syd-ts14-2600-229.tpgi.com.au) |
| 00:20.51 | pb_ | thomas__: why do you need --force-depends? |
| 00:21.04 | pb_ | I would have hoped that opie would go on cleanly without that. |
| 00:21.40 | kergoth | NonToxic: http://openzaurus.org/official/experimental/sysvinit_2.84-9_arm.ipk |
| 00:21.56 | kergoth | NonToxic: should work fine, though you may have to -force-depends due to the login dependency |
| 00:22.23 | thomas__ | ipkg couldn't satisfy about 10 dependencies, like libjpeg62, apmd, timezones, hotplug, etc. |
| 00:22.32 | *** join/#handhelds.org Darkness_Home (~none@207.90.72.198) |
| 00:23.27 | pb_ | thomas__: strange, all those things should be in familiar I think. |
| 00:23.48 | thomas__ | i thought ipkg would get an error & quit if there were a package conflict. |
| 00:23.49 | kergoth | oh, do note that that sysvinit package sets up /sbin/init via update-alternatives. so you'd better have upd-alt on your ipaq :) |
| 00:23.54 | NonToxic | Oh no... one of my friends was backing up all his data, and as soon as he got it all in one directory to burn to CD, the damn De{sk,ath}star died... |
| 00:24.04 | pb_ | NonToxic: suck |
| 00:24.21 | NonToxic | <DuoD> tens of thousands of lines of code... gone in a flash |
| 00:24.24 | kergoth | NonToxic: ouch |
| 00:24.40 | kergoth | NonToxic: tell him thats what source respositories are for. cvs/svn/bk are your friends |
| 00:24.47 | pb_ | right :-) |
| 00:24.52 | pb_ | well, except bk. |
| 00:24.59 | kergoth | then if you lose data, all you lose is your current local changes |
| 00:25.29 | NonToxic | yeah, most of my important stuff is in joshuawise.com CVS |
| 00:25.30 | kergoth | bk is an amazing tool, if only it werent for the license |
| 00:25.43 | pb_ | kergoth: yeah. :-/ |
| 00:25.59 | kergoth | pb_: you see that util from pavel machek? uses gnu cssc and some scripts to obtain and manipulate bk repositories without bk |
| 00:26.03 | kergoth | pb_: :) |
| 00:26.17 | pb_ | kergoth: heh, no, I hadn't heard of that. sounds neat though! |
| 00:26.23 | kergoth | pretty cool, so you can play with the current linus 2.5 bk, or what have you |
| 00:26.36 | pb_ | excellent, I'll have to have a go. |
| 00:27.36 | kergoth | http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=linux-kernel&m=104629935014321&w=2 |
| 00:27.42 | *** join/#handhelds.org ljp (~ljp@tq0176.peakpeak.com) |
| 00:29.30 | thomas__ | pb_: maybe those unsatisfied dependencies are *not* in familiar (i don't know), but are in gpe in a way incompatible with opie? |
| 00:29.42 | pb_ | thomas__: what's in your ipkg.conf at present? |
| 00:32.03 | thomas__ | i took out the `src familiar-unstable' line and added `src opie http://opie.handhelds.org/feed/ipaq/20030310 and changed all 3 dest directories to add an `opie' component so i could compare the gpe & opie files safely. |
| 00:32.37 | pb_ | ah, you want to leave "src familiar-unstable" in there; just add opie as an additional feed. |
| 00:33.20 | thomas__ | pb_: but right now why is the opie feed not sufficient? |
| 00:33.57 | pb_ | because the Opie feed only includes the packages that are specific to Opie. There is a lot of "core OS" stuff that is provided by Familiar and is not part of Opie. |
| 00:34.44 | thomas__ | oh, i see. then it is part of familiar, but not used by gpe? |
| 00:35.05 | pb_ | GPE also depends on quite a lot of things from "base" Familiar. |
| 00:35.14 | mallum | keithp: ping |
| 00:35.35 | pb_ | But yeah, there are bound to be packages that are needed by Opie but not GPE, and vice versa. |
| 00:35.42 | thomas__ | but i already have gpe there, from bootgpe2-v0.7-pre4-h3600.jffs2 |
| 00:36.00 | thomas__ | ok. |
| 00:37.05 | thomas__ | funny, though, it gave a warning again about the unsatisfied dependencies, but went ahead and installed everything and only `failed' on postinst scripts. |
| 00:37.30 | pb_ | strange. |
| 00:37.42 | *** join/#handhelds.org ljp (~ljp@tq0176.peakpeak.com) |
| 00:37.50 | cdm | okay. |
| 00:38.17 | cdm | if I add a file to a project that is already in CVS and I want to generate a patch that includes it, what is the magical cvs command line to do that? |
| 00:38.48 | thomas__ | but maybe that's what should be expected (except maybe for the postinst problems). anyway, i think this is too much for me now. i'm just going to go back to opie and leave gpe for awhile. |
| 00:41.15 | thomas__ | is familiar v0.7 reasonably stable? |
| 00:41.56 | sponge | pre4 seems a bit worse than pre3, but its quite stable |
| 00:42.48 | thomas__ | sponge: it looks like familiar.handhelds.org doesn't get updated often. |
| 00:43.20 | sponge | the main site doesnt, but the files are |
| 00:43.21 | thomas__ | the latest version it mentions is .6.1 |
| 00:43.31 | sponge | the root images i know have pre4 |
| 00:43.53 | pb_ | thomas__: 0.6.1 is the latest released version. |
| 00:44.24 | thomas__ | pb_: what does `release' signify here? |
| 00:44.50 | pb_ | well, believed to be stable enough that random users should be encouraged to install it. |
| 00:45.00 | pb_ | right now there are a variety of things still wrong with the 0.7 prereleases. |
| 00:45.17 | *** join/#handhelds.org drs (~drs@dsl-200-67-6-195.prodigy.net.mx) |
| 00:45.31 | thomas__ | pb_: ok, i guess .6.1 should be good enuf fer me! i'm kinda random. |
| 00:45.47 | thomas__ | ;-) |
| 00:46.10 | pb_ | for example, in the latest 0.7 image there seems to be a problem with wireless networking; the touchscreen and MMC interface on h3800 ipaqs stops working after the machine is suspended, etc. |
| 00:46.42 | *** join/#handhelds.org paperclip (~joe@ip68-11-30-173.no.no.cox.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 00:47.02 | thomas__ | oops. ok, i think i'll wait for the future. it will come in its own time. ;-) |
| 00:47.12 | thomas__ | i'll go with .6.1. |
| 00:47.38 | pb_ | ok :-) |
| 00:48.00 | pb_ | I think 0.7 should be out in just a few more weeks, and at that point it ought to be much better than 0.6.1 is. But we are not quite there yet. |
| 00:48.50 | *** join/#handhelds.org matee (~malte@studpc74.thndorm.htu.se) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 00:49.37 | thomas__ | pb_: will it be possible to `ipkg upgrade'? |
| 00:50.11 | pb_ | thomas__: I'm not sure. |
| 00:51.48 | thomas__ | pb_: also, i suppose i can use a late version of opie on top of .6.1 and have a stable system (except for probably some app problems)? |
| 00:52.10 | pb_ | thomas__: probably, but you'd have to check with the opie guys. |
| 00:52.20 | thomas__ | pb_: about which question, the first or 2nd? |
| 00:52.34 | pb_ | thomas__: both |
| 00:52.35 | thomas__ | pb_: about which q you're not sure? |
| 00:52.41 | thomas__ | pb_: ok, thanks. |
| 00:52.46 | pb_ | thomas__: I'm not sure about the "ipkg upgrade". |
| 00:55.12 | thomas__ | pb_: it was possible to upgrade from .6 to .6.1, according to http://familiar.handhelds.org/releases/v0.6.1/ , btw. |
| 01:03.47 | ChuWaKa | enyone knows if thereare eny patch for the apm on the h3600 |
| 01:04.00 | ChuWaKa | the maine don't suspend |
| 01:11.56 | *** join/#handhelds.org raster (~raster@203.206.217.82) |
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| 02:28.22 | *** join/#handhelds.org Demo (Demo@dialup-166.90.109.2.Dial1.Richmond1.Level3.net) |
| 02:28.49 | Demo | Hi there! My Linux is still D&D(Down and Dead) :-( |
| 02:29.00 | NonToxic | I figured... |
| 02:29.11 | Demo | I wanted to ask if there is a website where I can download libraries |
| 02:29.25 | Demo | I think I need (maybe) a whole bunch |
| 02:29.35 | NonToxic | unfortunately, they won't match your distro... |
| 02:30.08 | Demo | But I got one step further. Now it STARTS the Init and it says that it cannot execute various commands and scripts |
| 02:30.10 | MonMotha | you'll probably have to compile them yourself to match |
| 02:30.21 | Demo | Compile with what ??? |
| 02:30.24 | MonMotha | launching init is a pretty impressive accomplishment |
| 02:30.24 | NonToxic | Demo: just install gentoo... :) |
| 02:30.28 | MonMotha | a cross toolchain |
| 02:30.36 | Demo | what is gentoo |
| 02:30.48 | NonToxic | gentoo is a distro that builds everything from source |
| 02:31.07 | MonMotha | sucks too :) |
| 02:31.10 | Demo | Do I need just a CD ? |
| 02:31.19 | Demo | or a download ? |
| 02:31.22 | NonToxic | leave the machine on all night on never-die disconnect and grab the stage3 iso. |
| 02:31.27 | NonToxic | it downloads its all as it goes... |
| 02:32.15 | Demo | It cannot, because: my ISP is stupid (and it is not mine it is my host family's) and 2nd I use WinModem. |
| 02:32.32 | Demo | Why do they have to match the distro ? |
| 02:34.03 | NonToxic | otherwise apps will crap out on launch. |
| 02:34.03 | Demo | Why? The lib gotsymbols in it so ... |
| 02:34.03 | Demo | If I get the newest is should work |
| 02:34.03 | NonToxic | not if it's compiled with a different compiler |
| 02:34.03 | Demo | non-gcc ? |
| 02:34.10 | NonToxic | or a newer version |
| 02:34.17 | MonMotha | gcc 2.95 vs 3.0 vs 3.1 vs 3.2 |
| 02:34.50 | Demo | Maybe I could get ones compiled with 2.95 ... :-) |
| 02:35.20 | NonToxic | heh |
| 02:35.24 | NonToxic | well, I run 3.2 here |
| 02:35.41 | Demo | But isn't it somewhere out there ? |
| 02:35.56 | Demo | Thanks for dell site, but I have already found it |
| 02:35.56 | NonToxic | well, it's sort of a paradox |
| 02:36.06 | Demo | I think I stick with fb for now |
| 02:36.09 | NonToxic | you need to boot into your distro in order to install RPMs to fix it :) |
| 02:36.31 | Demo | Couldn't I just extract the rpm ? |
| 02:36.35 | Demo | I hate them ... |
| 02:36.43 | Demo | They NEVER work fine |
| 02:36.45 | NonToxic | guess what operating system has the tools you need to do that |
| 02:36.50 | NonToxic | and that's why I use gentoo. |
| 02:37.06 | Demo | But you got cable ... |
| 02:37.25 | Demo | Aren't there just gzipped libs ? |
| 02:37.42 | Demo | like binary libc.gz |
| 02:41.51 | NonToxic | that's what I just explained... those won't work... |
| 02:42.00 | NonToxic | I can gzip up my entire /lib dir for you if you want |
| 02:42.08 | NonToxic | but it likely won't do much good for you |
| 02:42.12 | Demo | I just make sure they R compiled with 2.95 |
| 02:42.20 | NonToxic | well, I use gcc 3.2 |
| 02:42.23 | NonToxic | but you can give it a shot anyway |
| 02:42.33 | Demo | so got link ? |
| 02:43.24 | NonToxic | it's 1.7mb, want it? |
| 02:43.33 | Demo | Yours ? |
| 02:43.49 | Demo | tried gzip ? |
| 02:43.55 | NonToxic | it's gzipped already |
| 02:44.03 | NonToxic | http://www.joshuawise.com/~joshua/slashlib.tar.gz |
| 02:44.31 | Demo | And a Q about IPAQ kernel. Does loader have to extract zImage ? |
| 02:44.39 | Demo | Or it has its own code ? |
| 02:45.31 | BluefoxIcy | hmm |
| 02:45.33 | BluefoxIcy | funny |
| 02:45.45 | BluefoxIcy | AcidDose thinks I don't understand what i'm talking about |
| 02:45.51 | NonToxic | IIRC the kernel has piggyback code to extract itself. |
| 02:45.58 | BluefoxIcy | he's also nearly right |
| 02:46.27 | MonMotha | yes, I do believe the kernel unzips itself |
| 02:46.57 | MonMotha | Demo: face it, this kind of devel stuff is BIG |
| 02:47.19 | Demo | XP is crap, it uses 370MB of swap even thought it has 70MB of ram free |
| 02:47.20 | MonMotha | we're talking shared libs, compilers, loads of headers and static libs, big source trees |
| 02:47.22 | MonMotha | it's just not small :) |
| 02:47.25 | Demo | I run linux without SWAP |
| 02:47.49 | MonMotha | Demo: actually the linux kernel will occassioanlly do that too if it thinks that the system ram is better served as a filesystem cache |
| 02:47.50 | Demo | What R .a file for ? |
| 02:47.56 | MonMotha | those are static libs |
| 02:48.03 | MonMotha | those are what you link against when you link statically |
| 02:48.20 | Demo | I KNOW WHAT static libs R ...!!! :- |
| 02:48.21 | Demo | ) |
| 02:48.37 | Demo | I'm not that stupid ... |
| 02:48.38 | Demo | :-) |
| 02:50.18 | Demo | How often do I need static libs ? |
| 02:51.39 | MonMotha | any time you link statically |
| 02:51.59 | *** join/#handhelds.org drs (~drs@dsl-200-67-6-195.prodigy.net.mx) |
| 02:53.04 | Demo | EVERY time I look at the list of libs I have destroyed it makes me cry... there is also libm and ptthread libcrypt and MANY MANY more. crap ... aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!! |
| 02:53.31 | Demo | NonToxic: what would you do ? |
| 02:53.40 | *** join/#handhelds.org sandman_ (~sandman@pD9E8AECD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:54.59 | NonToxic | Demo: grab my tarball and try it |
| 02:55.01 | Demo | Is there any good free distro I can download onto CD(@ school) and install @ home ? |
| 02:55.20 | NonToxic | Demo: I cringe at the thought, but go get redhat 8 |
| 02:55.32 | NonToxic | everything else requires an FTP install |
| 02:56.16 | NonToxic | seems like a religious thing |
| 02:56.18 | Demo | How much is it ? |
| 02:56.20 | NonToxic | WWND == What Would NonToxic Do |
| 02:56.23 | NonToxic | Demo: free!! |
| 02:56.34 | Demo | How to get it ? |
| 02:56.56 | sponge | i managed to install mandrake 9 fine without ftp |
| 02:57.02 | NonToxic | Demo: bandwidth charges |
| 02:57.04 | sponge | but im sure you probably dont want that heh |
| 02:57.07 | NonToxic | sponge: well, mdk is crap :-P |
| 02:57.17 | Demo | That WWND reminds me of the class used by Microsoftt in VC++ programming :-) |
| 02:57.17 | sponge | eh, it helped me in learning linux initially |
| 02:57.26 | sponge | bbiab, testing some burnt cds |
| 02:57.47 | Demo | So I have to download and |
| 02:57.54 | Demo | sponge: Why not |
| 02:58.17 | Demo | ? |
| 03:05.05 | Demo | death ??? ... Q but no answers :-) |
| 03:06.42 | Demo | If programs does not want to start and init says cannot execute, does it mean that libc is "dead" ? |
| 03:08.50 | NonToxic | possibly |
| 03:08.58 | NonToxic | grab my binaries |
| 03:08.59 | NonToxic | test them now |
| 03:12.32 | Demo | OK. By the way Dell is probably not using the LCD interface on PXA. |
| 03:12.55 | Demo | Does fb need to be mapped on DRAM? Because this is mapped onto static select bank 8 |
| 03:13.49 | NonToxic | *shrug* |
| 03:17.17 | Demo | OK. Going to try it ... I was reading my e-mails |
| 03:17.39 | NonToxic | k |
| 03:18.28 | Demo | What file is system looking for libc.so OR libc.so.6 (or diff #)? |
| 03:18.56 | NonToxic | no clue |
| 03:19.30 | Demo | Anyone knows ? |
| 03:19.39 | Demo | ibot libc |
| 03:19.40 | | Demo: are you using Windows? |
| 03:19.46 | Demo | ibot yes |
| 03:19.46 | | You dont say! |
| 03:19.55 | Demo | ibot Bill Gates |
| 03:19.55 | | rumour has it, bill gates is lord of Darkness |
| 03:20.27 | NonToxic | *grrrr...* |
| 03:20.42 | NonToxic | Demo: just download it and untar it!! |
| 03:20.49 | Demo | I got it. |
| 03:21.03 | NonToxic | untar it!! |
| 03:21.12 | Demo | But win does not support symbolic links :-( |
| 03:21.17 | Demo | So I have to create them |
| 03:21.20 | NonToxic | fine |
| 03:21.47 | Demo | later ... |
| 03:21.50 | NonToxic | k |
| 03:22.10 | Demo | I cannot write using XP need to start 98 in order to write into ext2 :-( |
| 03:22.20 | NonToxic | :( |
| 03:22.37 | jacques | ibot: feeds |
| 03:22.37 | | well, feed is a package repository. See http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/IpkgFeeds, http://www.zauruszone.com/feed, http://openzaurus.org/official/{stable,testing,unstable}/feed, or http://www.zauruii.com/zfi |
| 03:31.47 | *** join/#handhelds.org brainless (~anurag@202.149.212.198) |
| 03:38.06 | *** join/#handhelds.org Demo (Demo@dialup-65.56.66.182.Dial1.Richmond1.Level3.net) |
| 03:38.14 | *** join/#handhelds.org billytwowilly (~chris@h24-86-147-220.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 03:38.36 | Demo | back. no results. I tried just libc. probably I have to replace ld also. |
| 03:38.53 | kergoth | billytwowilly: yo :) |
| 03:39.02 | Demo | Anyone got nice little initrd with size ~2MB ? |
| 03:39.19 | billytwowilly | kergoth: heh, you're right, there's actually people in here that are talking;) unlike #familiar;) thanks for the pointer |
| 03:39.38 | NonToxic | Demo: :( |
| 03:39.44 | kergoth | billytwowilly: np |
| 03:39.52 | Demo | Ok will go to linux.org |
| 03:40.04 | NonToxic | Demo: either grab linux ISOs tomorrow or go to your local LUG, it's in 9 days |
| 03:40.11 | billytwowilly | kergoth: perhaps now I can leave you alone to develop and I'll just try and get help in here;) |
| 03:40.24 | Demo | wait 9 days !!! |
| 03:40.31 | kergoth | hehe. well, its good to have users pester us |
| 03:40.35 | kergoth | then we know what needs doingg |
| 03:40.52 | Demo | how big R the ISOs ? |
| 03:41.11 | Demo | I think I need only the first CD |
| 03:41.50 | billytwowilly | kergoth: ok, well you asked for it;) what I really think you should be doing is developing a screen that unrolls so that I can carry my ipaq around and it'll be the size of a pen, but when I want to use it I can unravel it to the size of a piece of paper. yes. that's it. that's what I want;) get cracking;) |
| 03:42.04 | billytwowilly | hehehe |
| 03:42.17 | kergoth | billytwowilly: er, pester me with _software_ issues. there are other people to pester about hardware ones |
| 03:42.20 | kergoth | billytwowilly: :P |
| 03:42.26 | billytwowilly | hehehehe;) |
| 03:42.48 | Demo | billytwowilly: I need that too :-) |
| 03:44.07 | billytwowilly | hehehe;) |
| 03:44.09 | Disconnect | anyone running gnomemeeting? (trying to vet my firewall setup) |
| 03:44.55 | Disconnect | Demo: you really should post to the linux@handhelds.org list (or come around 9-5 when the CRL guys are here) |
| 03:45.40 | Demo | ok. but it would take days ... |
| 03:45.46 | Demo | that I do not have! |
| 03:46.01 | Disconnect | the list actually gets pretty quick responses. and its already taken days ;) |
| 03:46.16 | Demo | I wanted to make linux work on PDA and I ended like an IDIOT ... with no linux :-) |
| 03:46.31 | billytwowilly | hey, anyone know if there's a sheath for the ipaq that holds an addon battery and two cf slots? |
| 03:46.39 | NonToxic | Demo: everybody messes up sooner or later |
| 03:47.47 | Demo | That made me happy :-) |
| 03:48.04 | billytwowilly | Demo: just remember, when in doubt, reinstall;) |
| 03:48.42 | Demo | From my head ? |
| 03:48.56 | Demo | I think I found what I was looking for |
| 03:49.08 | NonToxic | :) |
| 03:49.22 | Demo | BasicLinux with kernel 2.2.16 (the same asi in SUSE 7) |
| 03:49.29 | NonToxic | not just kernel |
| 03:49.35 | Demo | and with glibc 2.1 |
| 03:49.35 | NonToxic | you need the whole libs and stuff |
| 03:49.39 | NonToxic | just get redhat tomorrow. |
| 03:49.41 | NonToxic | trust me. |
| 03:49.53 | Demo | I need to START it!! |
| 03:49.59 | Demo | first |
| 03:50.03 | NonToxic | *sigh* |
| 03:50.04 | NonToxic | no. |
| 03:50.05 | NonToxic | trust me. |
| 03:50.08 | NonToxic | learn to be patient. |
| 03:50.20 | NonToxic | I've given you all the libs that I thought wouldn't work. |
| 03:50.21 | Demo | when the BasicLinux starts then also this should start |
| 03:50.28 | NonToxic | now it's time to trust me, bite the bullet, and just do it. |
| 03:50.47 | NonToxic | trust me. |
| 03:50.59 | NonToxic | for right now, just give up. tomorrow you can download redhat. |
| 03:50.59 | Demo | Ok. to ungzip the file WITH the sym links I need linux. I'm downloading it ... |
| 03:51.16 | Demo | how big ? |
| 03:51.22 | Demo | where ? |
| 03:52.54 | NonToxic | ftp://ftp.redhat.com/pub/redhat/linux/8.0/en/iso/i386/ |
| 03:52.58 | NonToxic | you need all three ISOs |
| 03:53.35 | Demo | _WILL_ ? |
| 03:53.47 | NonToxic | hm? |
| 03:54.07 | Demo | each iso is 640 MB |
| 03:54.13 | Demo | right ? |
| 03:54.35 | NonToxic | 650 |
| 03:54.42 | NonToxic | give or take |
| 03:54.43 | Demo | ooops no anonymous conns |
| 03:55.08 | NonToxic | ! |
| 03:55.11 | NonToxic | check redhats site then |
| 03:55.29 | Demo | ? |
| 03:56.05 | Demo | works ... |
| 03:57.42 | Demo | Try this 650*5 (the size of all) / 0.1 (~100kb/s) = 32000 sec. Almost a day :-) |
| 03:58.29 | Demo | Is there anyone with 2.95.3 gcc ? |
| 03:58.55 | NonToxic | *grrrrrrrrr* |
| 03:59.02 | NonToxic | it's not gcc's fault |
| 03:59.06 | NonToxic | that's only for C++ |
| 03:59.10 | NonToxic | it is really distro specific |
| 03:59.22 | NonToxic | and you only need 3 ISOs |
| 03:59.52 | Demo | I meant to download just the libs ... |
| 04:00.04 | NonToxic | *sigh* |
| 04:00.05 | NonToxic | trust me |
| 04:00.11 | Demo | from somebodys libs dir ? |
| 04:00.12 | NonToxic | your distro is forked |
| 04:00.18 | NonToxic | nothing can fix it now. |
| 04:00.33 | Demo | might be right, but ... |
| 04:00.36 | NonToxic | just update to a recent distro and use that |
| 04:00.40 | Demo | i'll never give up |
| 04:00.40 | NonToxic | it's not really worth your time. |
| 04:00.43 | Demo | :-) |
| 04:01.01 | NonToxic | it's going to take you 325 minutes to download them at 100kb/s. |
| 04:01.19 | Demo | Is that ISO supported by all burning programs (well most) ? |
| 04:01.36 | NonToxic | yes. |
| 04:01.55 | Demo | ok, I'll tell a friend of mine to down. it |
| 04:02.41 | Demo | how old is it ? |
| 04:02.44 | Demo | kernel ? |
| 04:03.05 | NonToxic | ***sigh*** |
| 04:03.11 | NonToxic | it is extremely new. |
| 04:03.15 | Demo | come on ... :-) |
| 04:03.20 | NonToxic | I have no clue |
| 04:03.24 | NonToxic | I use gentoo like I said |
| 04:03.59 | Demo | ok. I just dont want a "crap" from 1960' and I will have to recompile and download all new libs like gtk sdl ... |
| 04:04.47 | NonToxic | LMFAO |
| 04:04.56 | NonToxic | tuxcds.com refuses to say redhat on their site |
| 04:04.57 | Demo | ??? |
| 04:05.01 | NonToxic | http://www.tuxcds.com/item.php?item=74 |
| 04:05.35 | billytwowilly | NonToxic: heh, that's classic;) |
| 04:05.38 | billytwowilly | I wonder why |
| 04:05.40 | NonToxic | :) |
| 04:05.40 | Demo | cool |
| 04:05.59 | Demo | Why dont they say the name ??? |
| 04:06.31 | NonToxic | people don't exactly like redhat :) |
| 04:06.32 | *** join/#handhelds.org drkness (~sharath@nwkea-http-1.sun.com) |
| 04:06.50 | Demo | Y ? |
| 04:07.12 | NonToxic | the whole kde incident |
| 04:07.20 | NonToxic | how they crippled kde and all |
| 04:07.48 | Demo | Is it still ? |
| 04:07.57 | NonToxic | IMHO it's not a big deal |
| 04:07.59 | NonToxic | but I'm a CLI freak |
| 04:08.08 | NonToxic | this is my desktop: |
| 04:08.09 | NonToxic | 8 konsole |
| 04:08.14 | NonToxic | one email client |
| 04:08.18 | NonToxic | one web browser |
| 04:08.21 | NonToxic | s/konsole/konsoles/ |
| 04:08.32 | Demo | CLI What is it ? |
| 04:08.34 | drkness | hi ppl anyone using the pb toolchain? need help with setting it up |
| 04:08.37 | Demo | What R U using ? |
| 04:09.00 | NonToxic | command line |
| 04:09.10 | Demo | drkness: BE CAREFUL TODAY I DESTROYED ONE LINUX BECAUSE OF THAT :-) |
| 04:09.23 | NonToxic | drkness: considered talking to pb? |
| 04:09.28 | Demo | just do not copy arm libs into /lib dir :-) |
| 04:09.44 | drkness | Demo: I'll take heed.. but my need is far too great that nI need it badly! |
| 04:09.58 | drkness | Demo: you got it working? |
| 04:10.28 | drkness | NonToxic: sent out a mail yesterday on the familiar list guess b hasn't been able to check it |
| 04:10.30 | andrd | NonToxic: what are you talking about? GRP????????? |
| 04:10.49 | andrd | Demo: download a gentoo 1.4_rc2 livecd and use it |
| 04:10.51 | Demo | Well almost, ld need lib so I copied it into /lib dir. |
| 04:11.03 | Demo | I'll stick with radhat |
| 04:11.03 | NonToxic | andrd: I don't use GRP, no |
| 04:11.12 | NonToxic | drkness: talk to him tomorrow |
| 04:11.16 | andrd | NonToxic: yeah well it doesnt require an ftp install |
| 04:11.23 | drkness | K NonToxic.... thanks |
| 04:11.34 | NonToxic | andrd: it's in your best interest to have a net connection to install from. |
| 04:11.50 | Demo | I think somebody should write instructions on instalation of toolchain |
| 04:12.05 | Demo | Maybe there are ? let me take a look at openzaurus.org |
| 04:12.05 | drkness | Demo: I agree!! |
| 04:12.28 | drkness | I've got the rest installed and am able to compile the kernel but I *need* gcc 3.2.1 |
| 04:12.32 | Demo | drkness: Let me guess it sais cannot find cc1 |
| 04:12.43 | andrd | NonToxic: thats fairly universal... maybe if u dl a 7 cd de set you wouldnt need net much but thats ollllld |
| 04:12.51 | drkness | Demo: says cannot find crt1.o |
| 04:12.58 | Demo | cool! |
| 04:13.03 | NonToxic | heh |
| 04:13.07 | Demo | That was just waiting for me :-) |
| 04:13.08 | NonToxic | drkness: did you untar it to the right place? |
| 04:13.08 | drkness | just tried compiling a simple 'hello world' |
| 04:13.15 | NonToxic | ok ok I give |
| 04:13.19 | NonToxic | I will tar up my toolchain |
| 04:13.29 | NonToxic | actually, no... |
| 04:13.30 | drkness | NonToxic: the pb is to be untarred in the root directory right? as with all the other toolchains |
| 04:13.37 | NonToxic | mine is too tweaked for bootldr. |
| 04:13.40 | NonToxic | drkness: nope... |
| 04:13.49 | drkness | but then it can't find the include files... |
| 04:14.07 | NonToxic | lemme look back, hold on |
| 04:14.12 | drkness | NonToxic: ok me blundered again... can you help me out |
| 04:14.31 | NonToxic | hold on, searching my logs |
| 04:14.37 | drkness | k.... |
| 04:15.25 | NonToxic | ! |
| 04:15.30 | NonToxic | kergoth has not said untar! |
| 04:15.31 | NonToxic | ever! |
| 04:16.00 | NonToxic | drkness: [15:40] <kergoth> the openzaurus.org toolchain is confirmed sane, but you _must_ extract it into /usr/local/arm/. toolchains have hardcoded paths. |
| 04:16.00 | NonToxic | [15:40] <kergoth> if not, you extracted it in the incorrect place |
| 04:16.40 | drkness | NonToxic: thanks will try |
| 04:16.51 | NonToxic | [15:41] <kergoth> Demo: mkdir /usr/local/arm; cd /usr/local/arm; tar jxf ~/cross-3.2.tar.bz2 |
| 04:16.56 | NonToxic | [15:42] <kergoth> Demo: then add /usr/local/arm/3.2/bin to your PATH |
| 04:17.32 | Demo | hey how to add a path ? |
| 04:17.36 | drkness | NonToxic: this is for the gzipped thingy under pb's directory right? |
| 04:17.48 | NonToxic | Demo: PATH=$PATH:/usr/local/arm/3.2/bin |
| 04:17.53 | Demo | I think for open zaurus |
| 04:17.59 | NonToxic | drkness: this is for the oz.org toolchain, dunno about pb's, but you can try it |
| 04:18.07 | Demo | here: http://openzaurus.org/official/toolchain/ |
| 04:19.02 | drkness | are they both compatilible I mean considering my target would ba XScale processor specific |
| 04:19.21 | NonToxic | ***shrugs*** |
| 04:20.24 | NonToxic | hmmmmmmmmmm |
| 04:20.26 | NonToxic | interesting |
| 04:20.27 | Demo | Ok, guess I will try once more and than sleep. So good night and thanx, I will get that redhat8. later... hope will come back with some rusults from AXIM :-) |
| 04:20.29 | NonToxic | verrrrrrrrrrrrrrry interesting |
| 04:20.30 | kergoth | drkness: xscale optimizations are determined by copmile flags on the cmdline, not by the toolchain iself |
| 04:20.34 | *** join/#handhelds.org darkalfie (~a@202.172.46.151) |
| 04:20.48 | NonToxic | the top ten words in this channel are: there, think, would, about, should, right, kernel, install, could, which. |
| 04:21.22 | Demo | How did you find out ? |
| 04:21.27 | NonToxic | http://joshuawise.com/~joshua/logs/hhorg.htm |
| 04:21.30 | Demo | ibot ? |
| 04:21.30 | | Demo: no idea |
| 04:21.40 | drkness | kergoth: thanks.. from what I understand the xscale instruction set wasn't supported by the 2.9X.X gcc.. and only came from 3.1.1 and above hence my question |
| 04:21.47 | Demo | ibot Shut up :-) I was not talking to you :-) |
| 04:21.47 | | Demo: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox? |
| 04:22.08 | NonToxic | ibot: botsnack. |
| 04:22.08 | | :), NonToxic |
| 04:22.22 | Demo | I think XScale instruction set is the same as ARM. Maybe some difference. |
| 04:22.26 | drkness | ~botsnack |
| 04:22.26 | | thanks, drkness |
| 04:22.39 | Demo | The problem is that bus speed is slower on XScale and they added some cache |
| 04:22.40 | cdm | drkness: not really a huge difference between them (SA1110 and XScale). |
| 04:22.51 | Demo | That need optimalization |
| 04:23.00 | cdm | Demo: no, the trouble is that the cache cannot be enabled due to hardware bugs in the PXA250. |
| 04:23.01 | drkness | Demo: true |
| 04:23.15 | cdm | Demo: the SA1110 has cache as well. |
| 04:23.33 | Demo | In the kernel it said that bug appeared any VERY rare |
| 04:23.58 | drkness | however the reason I need the specific gcc (3.2.1) is my kernel has been compiled using that.. I need to compile and debug just one module and if I use a different compiler the module doesn't load |
| 04:24.01 | Demo | cdm: but not 100MHz bus and 400MHz processor |
| 04:24.11 | drkness | strange but believe me folks....!! |
| 04:24.19 | cdm | drkness: I can belive that is very true. |
| 04:24.29 | Demo | 'night |
| 04:24.37 | drkness | Demo: night and thanks |
| 04:24.37 | *** part/#handhelds.org Demo (Demo@dialup-65.56.66.182.Dial1.Richmond1.Level3.net) |
| 04:25.46 | cdm | well, it isn't that rare. |
| 04:26.22 | kergoth | ? |
| 04:28.27 | drkness | cdm: well from my (limited ) understanding os compilers the object code produces should be the same.. if a com;piled (threaded too) program compiled with a different compiler can execute, a module should too.. this is something I can't understand |
| 04:29.19 | cdm | drkness: issue becomes calling convention and if it stayed exactly the same between releases. Also possible to have different compiler support libs. |
| 04:33.14 | drkness | cdm: k thanks.... |
| 04:37.07 | billytwowilly | hi, I've got an invalid alias in /etc/modules.conf and it's precluding me from entering any data from the lcd, but opie loads so I can't get in through the serial cable either. is there a way to get bootloader to load linux without opie? |
| 04:38.01 | NonToxic | do a 'set' |
| 04:38.04 | NonToxic | look for linuxargs in there |
| 04:38.14 | NonToxic | then change 'console=' to '/dev/ttySA0' |
| 04:38.27 | kergoth | or add single, come in in single user mode |
| 04:38.40 | kergoth | assuming of course that single user mode is setup to spawn a sulogin |
| 04:39.19 | NonToxic | kergoth: you'd still need console on ttySA0 |
| 04:39.44 | billytwowilly | ? ok, so I'd "set linuxargs"? |
| 04:39.57 | kergoth | oh, he cant enter anything on the lcd. guess sulogin on the FB wouldnt help much :) |
| 04:41.05 | billytwowilly | NonToxic: set console=/dev/ttySA0 ? |
| 04:41.23 | NonToxic | kergoth: *mumble mumble*zaurus users, spoiled by the damn keyboard*mumble mumble* |
| 04:41.26 | NonToxic | billytwowilly: nope |
| 04:41.34 | NonToxic | billytwowilly: first, do a 'set' and look for linuxargs in there |
| 04:41.37 | kergoth | NonToxic: hehe |
| 04:43.16 | billytwowilly | NonToxic: when I type set to the bootloader I get "get_param: could not find parameter" |
| 04:44.17 | billytwowilly | so then I go set linuxargs console=/dev/ttySA0 and now it boots and I get nothing on the lcd except a penguin and it says "done booting on minicom, but I still don't get a console... |
| 04:47.47 | NonToxic | hmmm |
| 04:47.51 | billytwowilly | from doing a params I get "linuxargs= < noinitrd root=/dev/mtdblock1 init=/linuxrc console=ttySA0>" |
| 04:47.58 | NonToxic | ahhh |
| 04:47.59 | NonToxic | well |
| 04:48.04 | NonToxic | you should be getting a console over serial |
| 04:48.24 | NonToxic | do a "set linuxargs noinitrd root=/dev/mtdblock1 init=/linuxrc console=ttySA0 single" |
| 04:48.40 | billytwowilly | then boot? |
| 04:49.17 | billytwowilly | SCORE! |
| 04:50.20 | billytwowilly | how do I set the values back now? |
| 04:50.29 | billytwowilly | usually that stuff is in a file called "params" in /boot.. |
| 04:50.32 | billytwowilly | no params file. |
| 04:50.59 | billytwowilly | NonToxic: heh, I'm forgetting my manners. Thank you very much for helping me. I think it's going to work now. |
| 04:51.38 | NonToxic | no problem. |
| 04:52.14 | billytwowilly | heh, I'd just make a params file wouldn't I and put in "set linuxargs noinitrd root=/dev/mtdblock1 init=/linuxrc" right? |
| 04:52.33 | billytwowilly | well, we'll know soon enough;) |
| 04:52.38 | billytwowilly | I just did it and am booting;) |
| 04:52.58 | billytwowilly | SCORE! |
| 04:52.59 | billytwowilly | it worked. |
| 04:53.02 | billytwowilly | thank you so much. |
| 04:53.13 | billytwowilly | I really didn't want to have to do reinstall number five;) |
| 04:57.21 | NonToxic | hey, congrats!!! |
| 04:57.23 | NonToxic | ! |
| 04:57.26 | NonToxic | !! |
| 04:57.28 | NonToxic | :-P |
| 04:57.51 | NonToxic | http://www.hardocp.com/images/news/1045830366k4KuZdsfq3_1_1_l.jpg - for those who just can't tear themselves away. |
| 04:58.46 | jacques | i want the usb powered electric blanket |
| 04:58.57 | NonToxic | http://www.direct.santec.co.jp/products/supply/ohizamoto/ohizamoto.asp <-- that? |
| 04:59.01 | drkness | whoa.. dental records online?? |
| 04:59.01 | NonToxic | also, seen the coffee warmer? |
| 04:59.28 | NonToxic | jacques: and I thought writing a bootldr USB driver was hell. |
| 04:59.35 | jacques | NonToxic: :-D |
| 04:59.48 | NonToxic | jacques: oh and there is something in the HID spec about coffee warmers and beverage dispensers. |
| 04:59.51 | billytwowilly | NonToxic: damn, I used to have a link to a much more appropriate usb device for those that can't tear themselves away;) a vibrator;) |
| 05:00.09 | NonToxic | ha |
| 05:00.27 | jacques | i thought usb max power was 500mA ? |
| 05:00.35 | drkness | interesting.. so whats the connectivity for??... hmmn.. something more than power... |
| 05:00.46 | NonToxic | jacques: yeah, the warmer doesn't exactly warm, it keeps it warmer longer. |
| 05:06.48 | zZzToxic | good night folks |
| 05:09.28 | drkness | night zZzToxic |
| 05:19.06 | Speuler | jacques_gone: power = VA or W , mA=current |
| 05:30.56 | *** part/#handhelds.org cdm (~cdm@pcp01881145pcs.sandia01.nm.comcast.net) |
| 06:00.24 | *** join/#handhelds.org redfenix (~kevin@pcp03643882pcs.indpnd01.mo.comcast.net) |
| 06:00.32 | redfenix | hi |
| 06:12.20 | *** join/#handhelds.org Speuler (~Speuler@mnch-d9ba4c8e.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 07:51.07 | *** join/#handhelds.org mind_ (~mind@11.80-202-41.nextgentel.com) |
| 07:51.21 | *** join/#handhelds.org PaxAnima (~petter@v058b.studby.ntnu.no) |
| 08:46.10 | *** join/#handhelds.org matee (~malte@studpc74.thndorm.htu.se) |
| 09:49.22 | *** join/#handhelds.org mallum (~mallum@pc-80-193-218-21-hw.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 09:57.32 | *** join/#handhelds.org sacah (sacah@163.a.001.tob.iprimus.net.au) |
| 10:00.48 | *** join/#handhelds.org drkness (~sharath@nwkea-http-2.sun.com) |
| 10:03.15 | *** join/#handhelds.org mind_ (~mind@11.80-202-41.nextgentel.com) |
| 10:23.08 | *** join/#handhelds.org Disconnect (dis@it.hasnt.been.the.same.since.aol.gotontheinter.net) |
| 10:26.04 | *** join/#handhelds.org pb_ (~pb_@dsl-62-3-66-201.zen.co.uk) |
| 10:45.54 | *** join/#handhelds.org drkness (~sharath@nwkea-http-2.sun.com) |
| 11:38.30 | *** join/#handhelds.org Nermal_Work (~peter@217.207.80.66) |
| 11:56.48 | xsdg | ibot: usb bootldr? |
| 11:56.49 | | bugger all, i dunno, xsdg |
| 11:57.16 | xsdg | ibot: usb-bootldr-latest? |
| 11:57.17 | | usb-bootldr-latest is probably at http://www.joshuawise.com/~joshua/ram-bootldr-latest |
| 12:06.06 | *** join/#handhelds.org moray (2ff9cf6c3e@mma29.dar.cam.ac.uk) |
| 12:06.57 | *** join/#handhelds.org moray (2e53b75bef@mma29.dar.cam.ac.uk) |
| 12:10.52 | *** join/#handhelds.org sangamon (~taylor@217.210.38.185) |
| 12:15.21 | *** join/#handhelds.org mind_ (~mind@11.80-202-41.nextgentel.com) |
| 12:19.45 | *** join/#handhelds.org Morn (~julie@ultrasparc.ipv6.magenet.com) |
| 12:32.16 | *** join/#handhelds.org DarkHand (~anon@12-250-129-21.client.attbi.com) |
| 12:33.34 | *** part/#handhelds.org DarkHand (~anon@12-250-129-21.client.attbi.com) |
| 12:59.39 | *** join/#handhelds.org ljp (~ljp@tq0098.peakpeak.com) |
| 13:16.56 | *** join/#handhelds.org dan_t (~daniele@212-41-206-101.adsl.galactica.it) |
| 13:17.02 | dan_t | hello |
| 13:17.12 | dan_t | handhelds.org is down ?? |
| 13:17.41 | sangamon | maybe |
| 13:18.49 | pb_ | dan_t: yes, there was some reorganisation going on in the handhelds.org machine room this morning. |
| 13:19.30 | dan_t | pb_: when it comes back ? |
| 13:20.21 | pb_ | dan_t: I have no idea. |
| 13:29.02 | dan_t | bye |
| 14:08.10 | *** join/#handhelds.org liquidx (~liquidx@mcvaio.corpus.cam.ac.uk) |
| 14:15.35 | yann | hi there |
| 14:15.54 | pb_ | hi yann :-) |
| 14:16.02 | yann | hi pb_ |
| 14:16.31 | yann | ever seen "ipkg update" end on a segfault and causing an h3950 to lock ? |
| 14:16.47 | pb_ | nope, never seen that. |
| 14:17.05 | yann | I've a particular tolopogy, but that should have no influence - well |
| 14:17.51 | yann | ipkg runs from a serial ppp session |
| 14:18.35 | yann | fetching packages through http proxy on the host, which is really forwarded using an ssh tunnel to a real proxy |
| 14:19.59 | yann | it looks like the machine is not 100% locked - at least suspend button and touchscreen do not react |
| 14:20.29 | yann | I can still login through serial getty |
| 14:20.38 | pb_ | ah, strange. |
| 14:21.12 | yann | looks like I found a way to reproduce this last strange freeze with interrupts constantly triggering |
| 14:22.13 | pb_ | ok. well, I guess bugzilla is your friend. |
| 14:22.16 | yann | problem: if I enter a "complicated" command (maybe FS access is involved), the machine locks down for good |
| 14:22.43 | yann | here "ipkg info ipkg" - previous time just "ls" |
| 14:23.47 | yann | serial line is somewhat hosed after that |
| 14:24.14 | *** join/#handhelds.org LoRez (mike@orcrist.ip6.forestsidingsupply.com) |
| 14:24.20 | yann | I can see chars from the ipaq but nothing gets from kbd to ipaq |
| 14:26.24 | yann | I have to unplug/replug RS232 on host side, then to unplug/replug ipaq on cradle - nothing less :( |
| 14:28.36 | *** join/#handhelds.org mind_ (~mind@11.80-202-41.nextgentel.com) |
| 14:28.46 | pb_ | Very strange. |
| 14:29.47 | yann | I'm not familiar with RS232 line disciplines and such stuff, that doesn't help :) |
| 14:31.00 | yann | pb_: any nice guess for a bugzilla componenent ? kernel ? |
| 14:35.11 | *** join/#handhelds.org jamey (~jamey@dhcp-r46.crl.dec.com) |
| 14:35.25 | pb_ | yann: yeah, kernel I guess. |
| 14:35.40 | yann | hi jamey |
| 14:41.19 | yann | files in /usr/lib/ipkg/lists/ are supposed to be plain text, or gzipped ? |
| 14:42.01 | yann | they look completely corrupted |
| 14:47.46 | yann | pb_: problem may be related to nvrd |
| 14:48.08 | yann | # rm /usr/lib/ipkg/lists/* |
| 14:48.12 | pb_ | yann: ah. I don't use nvrd, so that might explain why I have never seen it. |
| 14:48.15 | yann | Segmentation fault |
| 14:48.25 | yann | # ls -l /usr/lib/ipkg/lists |
| 14:48.25 | yann | lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 20 Feb 28 13:59 /usr/lib/ipkg/lists -> /mnt/nvrd/ipkg-lists |
| 14:48.31 | yann | and then: |
| 14:48.31 | pb_ | yann: check dmesg for evidence of kernel crashes |
| 14:48.38 | yann | # rm /usr/lib/ipkg/lists/* |
| 14:48.44 | yann | <does not return> |
| 14:49.27 | pb_ | yeah, that will often happen if you get a crash in the kernel while holding a lock of some kind. |
| 14:49.39 | yann | ah, I thing we can say there *are* avidence of a kernel oops |
| 14:50.04 | pb_ | the trap handler is not smart enough to unwind that kind of thing, so the lock is left held and the next attempt to claim it will block forever.. |
| 14:50.04 | yann | many EXT3-fs error (device nvrd(254,0)): ext3_free_blocks: Freeing blocks not in datazone - block = 2359296, count = 1 |
| 14:50.54 | pb_ | that surely doesn't look good. |
| 14:51.18 | yann | oops says "Backtrace: no frame pointer", which does not look good as well (to me at least) |
| 14:51.35 | pb_ | That might be okay. I don't remember if we compile the kernels with frame pointers or not. |
| 14:51.54 | pb_ | Would you paste the text of the oops in #flood? |
| 14:51.55 | yann | also have a couple of "ext3_free_blocks: bit already cleared for block 16384" |
| 14:52.47 | yann | kernel message ring is too much flooded by those ext3_free_blocks messages to get anything else |
| 14:52.56 | pb_ | ah. |
| 14:53.14 | pb_ | it certainly sounds like nvrd is to blame, anyway. |
| 14:53.53 | pb_ | what's not quite so clear to me is whether the nvrd code is causing the crash, or the filesystem is getting corrupted and this is in turn causing ext3 to crash. |
| 14:54.55 | yann | If I reboot, remounting it in ext2, and try to remove the faulty files, it may give us a hint, right ? |
| 14:55.30 | pb_ | Certainly worth a go, yes. |
| 14:57.04 | yann | but why would those interrupts keep flooding ? |
| 14:59.28 | pb_ | I don't know. |
| 15:01.05 | *** join/#handhelds.org jg (~jg@dhcp-r25.crl.dec.com) |
| 15:06.07 | *** join/#handhelds.org ade|indy (~adrian@unimatrix.ex.ac.uk) |
| 15:09.29 | jamey | yann: they should be plain text afaik |
| 15:10.04 | jamey | pb_, yann: I usually compile with frame pointers -- my latest oopses have back traces |
| 15:10.21 | jamey | speaking of which, I was trying to build ksymoops, which depends on bfd, which is a piece of gdb |
| 15:10.23 | jamey | pita |
| 15:10.53 | jamey | yann: did you compile your own kernels? |
| 15:10.57 | jamey | yann: or modules? |
| 15:16.36 | yann | jamey: bfd.h is part of binutils, IIRC |
| 15:17.07 | yann | jamey: in this case, it's standard hh4 kernel, no custom modules added |
| 15:17.46 | yann | (deb package for bfd.h is binutils-dev) |
| 15:35.40 | yann | an idea about the "unplug rs232" requirement - are some pins connected together in the cradle cable ? |
| 15:35.59 | *** join/#handhelds.org laserboy (~else1@mcns46.docsis65.scvmaxonline.com.sg) |
| 15:37.00 | laserboy | does anyone know where to find the pro-engineer drawings for the Ipaq H3000 series expansion pack? |
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| 15:44.18 | jamey | yann: oh, is bfd also in binutils? |
| 15:44.47 | jamey | laserboy: try google? |
| 15:45.09 | jamey | laserboy: or the handhelds.org platform or spec pages? |
| 15:45.21 | pb_ | jamey: yeah, both binutils and gdb use libbfd. |
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| 16:02.12 | *** join/#handhelds.org Harlekin (~max@pD9E594A0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:03.24 | thomas__ | hmm. i must have reset in the wrong way or some such thing. i think opie is running, but i only get the little penguin in the corner. what's wrong? (please excuse me asking here. no one is answering in #opie .) |
| 16:04.25 | yann | thomas__: I had a similar thing once - I had to run ldconfig so that opie programs would start again |
| 16:04.31 | jamey | thomas__: little penguin in corner indicates opie is not running |
| 16:04.44 | jamey | thomas__: I read your saga yesterday -- nice writeup! |
| 16:06.00 | thomas__ | jamey: it is just a very humble offering to you crl people, the other hackers, & the others of the hh community. |
| 16:07.17 | thomas__ | jamey: i hoped that my perspective might help the community. |
| 16:07.51 | thomas__ | jamey & yann: how does opie get into that state & what is ldconfig? |
| 16:09.05 | yann | thomas__: just running "ldconfig" causes the dynamic linker's cache to be refreshed |
| 16:09.23 | yann | when it's not run after a new lib has been installed, that lib is not seen |
| 16:09.23 | mallum | keithp: ping |
| 16:09.41 | thomas__ | yann: should i then need to reboot? |
| 16:09.42 | yann | so some opie programs may not find all the libs they need |
| 16:09.58 | pb_ | yann: I thought ldconfig was not required for opie, actually. |
| 16:10.01 | thomas__ | yann: opie was working before. |
| 16:10.05 | yann | that depends on what lib is not found |
| 16:10.29 | yann | pb_: IIRC for me it was the qpe daemon not founding libpng3.so |
| 16:10.47 | Harlekin | thomas__: fam unstable? |
| 16:10.51 | yann | no idea how I came into this state, since it had been working before as well :) |
| 16:10.57 | pb_ | yann: ah. I thought opie put all the library directories in LD_LIBRARY_PATH, but obviously not. |
| 16:11.08 | keithp | mallum: ping |
| 16:11.22 | pb_ | yann: we have had problems with upgrades of familiar-base destroying /etc/ld.so.cache. You might have fallen foul of that. |
| 16:11.36 | yann | ah, that may be it |
| 16:12.12 | yann | and I remember I interupted a configuration of familiar-base once - that may not have helped as well |
| 16:12.40 | thomas__ | sheesh. seems pretty fragile. |
| 16:13.19 | yann | pb_: my removal of files on nvrd fails with ext2 as well |
| 16:13.32 | yann | but no segfault/oops this time |
| 16:14.00 | yann | rm in "D" state |
| 16:14.04 | thomas__ | could i fix this by `ipkg install opie-complete'? |
| 16:14.08 | thomas__ | (again) |
| 16:14.30 | Harlekin | thomas__: try openembedded |
| 16:15.06 | thomas__ | Harlekin: another system? what is it? summary url please? |
| 16:15.35 | thomas__ | `dmesg' doesn't seem to turn up any opie errors. |
| 16:15.37 | Harlekin | www.openembedded.org |
| 16:15.42 | Harlekin | #openemebdded |
| 16:15.51 | Harlekin | thomas__: at least a less fragile base system |
| 16:16.47 | mallum | keithp: hello sir, do you know anything about tinyX not releasing the ts on a vt change ? |
| 16:16.50 | thomas__ | you mean qtopia workalike base? |
| 16:17.03 | Harlekin | desktop != base system |
| 16:17.14 | keithp | mallum: no, but it wouldn't surprise me. |
| 16:17.33 | thomas__ | Harlekin: then base sys == linux distro ? |
| 16:18.05 | mallum | keithp: Im guessing somehwere in the source tinyX must know theres a vt change happening and it just needs to call ts_fini / ts_init right ? |
| 16:18.20 | keithp | mallum: yup. |
| 16:18.25 | Harlekin | thomas__: linux distro = base sys + desktop and more |
| 16:18.41 | keithp | There's code to close/reopen the mouse at that spot currently |
| 16:18.41 | mallum | keithp: could you direct me to point where it 'knows' and I will attempt to patch |
| 16:21.19 | keithp | mallum: do you need to call tslib or is ignoring the FD sufficient |
| 16:22.17 | mallum | keithp: no I think I need to call tslib |
| 16:22.18 | thomas__ | Harlekin: ok, i understand. |
| 16:22.37 | keithp | mallum: then TslibInit needs to call KdRegisterFdEnableDisable with appropriate functions. |
| 16:22.42 | keithp | See linux/keyboard.c for an example |
| 16:22.51 | Harlekin | keithp: is randR supposed to work in 4.3 for all graphic cards? |
| 16:23.01 | thomas__ | Harlekin: so familiar is the base system you were referring to as not stable? |
| 16:23.03 | keithp | Harlekin: yes, but with limitations |
| 16:23.17 | kergoth`zzz | mallum: too bad the ts cant be opened more than once eh, theres no reason to _have_ to close the fd on VT switch, it should be able to just not call ts_read* |
| 16:23.18 | Harlekin | hmm |
| 16:23.26 | Harlekin | keithp: somehow it does not even offer rotation for me |
| 16:23.32 | Harlekin | keithp: ist resizing |
| 16:23.33 | keithp | Harlekin: that's the limitation... |
| 16:23.34 | Harlekin | just |
| 16:23.36 | Harlekin | ah |
| 16:23.38 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 16:23.38 | mallum | keithp: cool, will check |
| 16:23.51 | *** join/#handhelds.org Zarchon (~chatzilla@roam122-27.fas.harvard.edu) |
| 16:24.04 | Zarchon | Anyone have a favorite CF memory card brand? |
| 16:24.10 | keithp | Harlekin: rotation requires replumbing the rendering code which is "hard". |
| 16:24.13 | mallum | kergoth: we want to close it for two reasons - opie can run fine at the same time, and we can run the tslib calibration program on another vt |
| 16:24.44 | kergoth | mallum: I know. my point was, were the ts driver capable of multiple opens, it'd be unnecessary as long as you stop consuming events. |
| 16:24.49 | pb_ | kergoth: the ipaq kernel does seem to allow multiple opens on the ts device, but this has always seemed rather icky to me. |
| 16:25.42 | mallum | kergoth: yes, then tinyX could just ignore the fd |
| 16:25.45 | Harlekin | keithp: so in 4.4? |
| 16:25.46 | kergoth | mallum: right. |
| 16:26.04 | kergoth | mallum: you ever figure out how to get the calibrator working? |
| 16:26.15 | keithp | Harlekin: Dunno. |
| 16:26.19 | mallum | kergoth: the tslib one ? - yes |
| 16:26.30 | kergoth | or rather, get the X calibrator able to get the raw reads :) |
| 16:26.53 | kergoth | course, you could just calibrate using the data from ts_read, as the default linear scaling values due no transformation |
| 16:26.56 | mallum | kergoth: no, that could be difficult without multiple reads |
| 16:27.08 | kergoth | s/due/do/ |
| 16:27.26 | mallum | kergoth: youd need to write some server extension to tell tinyx to switch to raw_mode, not much fun :( |
| 16:27.30 | kergoth | course, i dont know if you'd want dejitter or other modules affecting calibration values. thats a question i was pondering last night |
| 16:28.08 | mallum | kergoth: fixing it this way, also fixes running opie on another vt |
| 16:28.25 | mallum | kergoth: and I get to discover more about tinyX internals ( :) or :( ) |
| 16:28.29 | kergoth | well, opie on another VT is a whole nother ballgame |
| 16:28.39 | pb_ | course, the opie dudes need to fix opie itself to work with VTs. |
| 16:28.41 | kergoth | qt/e is not particularly well behaved when it comes to VT ahndling :) |
| 16:28.56 | kergoth | nah, its qt/e. launcher could use a couple tweaks for it, but its qt/e being a bitch |
| 16:29.12 | kergoth | (big surprise) |
| 16:29.17 | pb_ | kergoth: ah, I tend to think of qt/e as part of opie. |
| 16:29.24 | pb_ | I guess that's unfair. |
| 16:29.37 | mallum | keithp: was that reset patch ok ? |
| 16:29.40 | kergoth | tisk tisk, you dont hear me lumping gtk and gpe together |
| 16:29.42 | kergoth | ;) |
| 16:29.51 | thomas__ | when I execute `/etc/init.d/opie start', I get `You seem to already have a /root/Applications directory. |
| 16:29.52 | thomas__ | Assuming it is the Opie Applications directory. Exiting. |
| 16:29.52 | thomas__ | iPAQ type 3800 |
| 16:29.52 | thomas__ | Starting Opie with syslog logging..... |
| 16:29.52 | thomas__ | ' |
| 16:29.58 | kergoth | thomas__: logread |
| 16:30.01 | pb_ | kergoth: clearly you're better informed than me :-} |
| 16:31.40 | keithp | mallum: I didn't test it |
| 16:33.08 | thomas__ | kergoth: thanks. error opening libcrypto.so.0.9.7 |
| 16:33.21 | kergoth | thomas__: install libssl0.9.7 |
| 16:35.08 | thomas__ | kergoth: exactly my thought. i looked in /lib and the library wasn't there. already started installing libcrypto (downloading unstable/libcrypto_0.9.7-1_armv4l.ipk) |
| 16:35.55 | kergoth | ah |
| 16:36.15 | kergoth | is familiar using a sane /etc/filesystems yet? I recall a conversation on the subject re: filesystems as modules |
| 16:36.18 | thomas__ | aha!!!! opie's up!!! |
| 16:36.22 | kergoth | thomas__: congrats |
| 16:36.35 | thomas__ | kergoth: thanks for your help. that was easy to fix. |
| 16:36.38 | kergoth | :) |
| 16:37.08 | thomas__ | kergoth: logread is important! |
| 16:40.15 | pb_ | kergoth: hm, dunno. do you remember what was insane about /etc/filesystems previously? |
| 16:41.00 | kergoth | pb_: last i recall, it didnt exist :) |
| 16:41.12 | mallum | keithp: can I assume the void *closure passed to the enable / disable callback will be a KdMouseInfo ? |
| 16:41.13 | pb_ | kergoth: ah :-) well, there definitely seems to be one now, so I guess that is an improvement. |
| 16:41.24 | kergoth | pb_: well then. that answers my question :) |
| 16:41.38 | kergoth | thanks |
| 16:43.01 | keithp | mallum: you get whatever you passed in KdRegisterFd |
| 16:46.27 | mallum | keithp: okie, I think I can fix it, if a little hackerly .. |
| 16:46.34 | keithp | mallum: have fun. |
| 16:46.54 | mallum | keithp: when we one day meet in person, I am going to twist your arm and make you talk me through tinyX internals :-) |
| 16:48.22 | keithp | mallum: then you can write it all down and we'll have documentation! |
| 16:48.45 | mallum | keithp: ok, deal |
| 16:49.25 | kergoth | docs? scary |
| 16:50.10 | kergoth | whatcha doin in texas? |
| 16:50.11 | keithp | cworth: and a total lack of sleep |
| 16:50.29 | cworth | keithp: ah, naturally. |
| 16:50.40 | cworth | kergoth: USENIX '03 |
| 16:50.42 | kergoth | ah |
| 16:50.53 | keithp | cworth: and then again in July in canada |
| 16:51.08 | cworth | keithp: I hadn't realized you're a guru this time around. |
| 16:51.37 | keithp | cworth: or something |
| 16:53.22 | *** join/#handhelds.org ljp_work (~ljp@ppp9.jymis.com) |
| 16:54.51 | *** join/#handhelds.org roman (~roman@gatekeeper.ct.cz) |
| 16:54.53 | roman | hi |
| 16:55.08 | pb_ | anybody know of a place to buy the memplug dual CF sleeves in Europe? |
| 16:55.51 | roman | I upgraded to familiar unstable feed and now I have no timezone package installed... task-opie want's it... what I can do now ?? |
| 16:57.32 | thomas__ | roman: i don't know, but maybe you could try `ipkg install timezone'. |
| 16:58.33 | roman | ipkg install timezone: Cannot find package timezone |
| 16:58.38 | roman | ipkg install timezones: Cannot find package timezones |
| 16:58.43 | roman | ? |
| 16:58.58 | thomas__ | roman: `timezone' or `timezones'? |
| 16:59.14 | thomas__ | it should be `timezone'. |
| 16:59.25 | roman | I tryied both... |
| 16:59.58 | thomas__ | if it can't find it, it means the feed is not working. try `ping handhelds.org'. |
| 17:00.32 | thomas__ | you can also look at /etc/ipkg.conf to see if the feeds are right. |
| 17:01.06 | roman | thomas__: I downloaded Packagelist from timezones feed all right... |
| 17:01.18 | roman | thomas__: handhalds org is ok |
| 17:01.36 | roman | I think there is an error in unstable feed of familiar |
| 17:01.52 | roman | no timezone package in task-bootstrap |
| 17:01.59 | thomas__ | roman: then take a look at it with your web browser. |
| 17:02.24 | roman | on what?? |
| 17:04.09 | roman | ipkg -force-depends install task-opie works for me... I have no time to digg the errors of unstable feed... I need the opie-reader working and the latest is not working on familiar stable :(( |
| 17:04.12 | thomas__ | `on'? at. look at the `Packages' file in the unstable feed. |
| 17:06.52 | thomas__ | actually, i think i gave the wrong advice. sorry. i don't know yet how to see what's in a task-bootstrap. i guess your idea was better than mine. |
| 17:08.58 | roman | thomas__ : in unstable feed is no Package of timezone ... only Libc6 with timezone files... maybe new libc which doesn't need the extra timezone package, but opie still needs it... |
| 17:09.25 | cmarqu | http://ipkgfind.handhelds.org/details.phtml?package=timezones |
| 17:10.14 | roman | :) |
| 17:10.23 | roman | going for it... |
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| 17:52.33 | Darkness_Home | jamey: did my ipaq arrive in one piece? |
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| 18:10.15 | *** part/#handhelds.org spiralman (thomas@spiralman.rh.rit.edu) |
| 18:14.50 | goodie | is there some problems with opie-reader? |
| 18:21.54 | jamey | Darkness_Home: the box is still in one piece |
| 18:22.26 | Darkness_Home | jamey: okay thanks |
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| 19:23.01 | mallum | keithp: ping |
| 19:23.47 | keithp | mallum: what's up? |
| 19:24.24 | mallum | keithp: I think I fixed the vt changing for tinyX |
| 19:24.29 | keithp | cool |
| 19:24.41 | mallum | keithp: and my lady friend is cooking up fillet steak for me :-) |
| 19:24.58 | keithp | Ah. Reminds me to eat lunch. |
| 19:25.14 | mallum | keithp: the keyboard.c enable was broke btw, it was set as void, when it should have been an int returning the fd |
| 19:25.24 | keithp | Did it cause problems? |
| 19:25.32 | mallum | keithp: yes, server crash |
| 19:25.35 | keithp | Nifty |
| 19:26.07 | mallum | keithp: Im sure it had jg as author in the code ;-) |
| 19:26.19 | keithp | Not likely. |
| 19:26.26 | keithp | Wonder why it doesn't crash on my machine |
| 19:27.06 | mallum | keithp: yeah thats true, I've switched vt's on my laptop with tinyX no problem |
| 19:27.16 | keithp | Ah. Because using fd 0 works just fine and Enable would leave a zero in the return register... |
| 19:27.29 | mallum | keithp: it was returning -1 for me |
| 19:27.52 | keithp | Hmm. Should return 0 as it's reading pending keystrokes. |
| 19:28.37 | keithp | Odd, but that does explain the crashes you've seen. |
| 19:28.55 | mallum | keithp: wierd, maybe its the crappy kernel kbd drivers on this c700 |
| 19:29.13 | mallum | keithp: its definetly -1 though I have the backtrace here ... |
| 19:29.24 | keithp | mallum: I believe you. But, you've fixed it now. |
| 19:29.51 | mallum | keithp: yes I hope so. I will tidy my stuff up and send you another patch |
| 19:30.06 | keithp | mallum: I hope you're keeping all of these patches locally as well. |
| 19:30.11 | mallum | keithp: do you want it as a seperate one to the one before or can I combine ? |
| 19:30.36 | keithp | mallum: you're maintaining the code at this point; we'll resync in a month or so when I've got some cycles |
| 19:30.42 | mallum | keithp: yes dont worry, If I run a make in the build root they'll get wiped |
| 19:30.49 | mallum | keithp: okey |
| 19:31.31 | keithp | mallum: any progress on a paper outline yet? |
| 19:32.06 | mallum | keithp: yes, I should have a first go for you by the end of the week |
| 19:32.16 | mallum | keithp: if not sooner |
| 19:32.26 | keithp | I'm anxious to read it. And anxious to have similar progress in my paper... |
| 19:34.14 | mallum | keithp: jg! ;-) |
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| 19:56.06 | sponge | im looking into installing linux on a 3600 without a serial cradle (from cf) but where is "linux.zip"? cant seem to find anything similsr |
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| 20:17.24 | Harlekin | lol, somehow i get the feeling that the mi6 is against a iraq war |
| 20:19.55 | Leeds | mi6? |
| 20:20.59 | mallum | Harlekin: why you work for them ? |
| 20:21.12 | Harlekin | they leak all kind of funny stuff lately |
| 20:21.18 | Harlekin | that must be on purpose |
| 20:22.28 | Harlekin | mallum: how did you knew? |
| 20:22.41 | mallum | Harlekin: I think they are aginst the goverment in general really |
| 20:23.07 | mallum | Harlekin: I sure they leaked all the stuff about blairs wife's flats in bristol etc |
| 20:23.26 | Harlekin | like first saying blair hte stuff with iraq buying uran in afrika whihc was a really cheap fake |
| 20:23.32 | Harlekin | and hten leaking that it is a fake |
| 20:23.34 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 20:24.02 | Harlekin | about 60% of the "blair dossier" is wrong |
| 20:24.03 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 20:24.15 | Harlekin | big parts copied from a student |
| 20:25.00 | mallum | Harlekin: I think blair will get kicked out in the next week or two |
| 20:25.07 | Harlekin | hmm, who knows |
| 20:25.12 | Harlekin | he is a brilliant talker |
| 20:25.25 | Harlekin | and, majority of the brits support a war |
| 20:25.32 | mallum | Harlekin: did you see the interview with all the women about iraq in germany ? |
| 20:25.36 | Harlekin | even thought it got small |
| 20:25.43 | Harlekin | mallum: which womans? |
| 20:25.51 | Harlekin | mallum: the minister from blair? |
| 20:26.06 | mallum | Harlekin: he did like a televisen que and answer session with a load of female general public |
| 20:26.24 | Harlekin | wasnt aired here |
| 20:26.27 | mallum | Harlekin: basically he got totally slaughted |
| 20:26.38 | Harlekin | actually press here does not care to much about blair, more about Bush |
| 20:26.45 | mallum | Harlekin: you wouldn't think of him as a good talker after seeing that |
| 20:26.47 | Harlekin | mallum: current main theme is the fundamentalism of Bush |
| 20:26.57 | Harlekin | mallum: at least he has a reputation for that |
| 20:27.00 | Harlekin | -) |
| 20:27.11 | mallum | Harlekin: and I think you'll find most brits are against the war, I know no one that is for it |
| 20:27.23 | Harlekin | mallum: hmm, there where new polls |
| 20:27.29 | Harlekin | 52% still pro |
| 20:27.36 | mallum | Harlekin: 1 million+ people demo'd against it for example - biggest ever |
| 20:27.39 | Harlekin | as long as the UN security concil says yes |
| 20:27.48 | Harlekin | 19% if UN sc says no |
| 20:29.35 | Harlekin | and that looked like an obective poll |
| 20:30.08 | mallum | Harlekin: I dont think the un are going to say yes though |
| 20:30.18 | Harlekin | who knows, money works |
| 20:30.55 | mallum | Harlekin: I dont know what feeling will be like if they say yes |
| 20:32.08 | Harlekin | on the other side theres allways the question what happens _if_ iraq is planing gas etc attacks on other countries .. |
| 20:32.56 | mallum | jamey: ping |
| 20:33.07 | Demo | Harlekin: Can you show me those 52% that is pro war ? |
| 20:33.23 | Harlekin | Demo: they must be out there |
| 20:33.31 | Harlekin | Demo: probalby in the countryside |
| 20:33.39 | mallum | Harlekin: lies, damn lies and statistics ;-) |
| 20:33.44 | Harlekin | Demo: in the US also the locked aways are the biggest supporters |
| 20:34.09 | Demo | :-( |
| 20:34.23 | Demo | When did they vote ? |
| 20:34.40 | Harlekin | who? |
| 20:34.43 | Harlekin | .-) |
| 20:34.44 | jamey | hi mallum |
| 20:37.45 | mallum | jamey: hey, is it possible we could add an altgr key to the ipaqs console key setup ? |
| 20:39.44 | billytwowilly | hi, I'm trying to get usbnetworking to work and I've got my linux box automagically recognizing usb0 and bringing up the device (when I plug in the ipaq and then do an ifconfig on the linux box it shows usb0 up and properly configure) |
| 20:39.56 | billytwowilly | but on the ipaq usbf isn't showing up in ifconfig |
| 20:40.19 | billytwowilly | any suggestions? |
| 20:40.37 | kergoth | modprobe usb-ether? |
| 20:41.01 | billytwowilly | heh, I wasn't supposed to be bugging you about his anymore kergoth;) |
| 20:41.17 | kergoth | cant resist trying to help. its my curse |
| 20:41.22 | kergoth | :) |
| 20:42.13 | billytwowilly | ok, what's the diff between modprobe and insmod? |
| 20:42.29 | billytwowilly | because in the /etc/init.d/init-usb script it says insmod usb-eth |
| 20:42.30 | Leeds | modprobe will load all dependencies... |
| 20:42.31 | kergoth | modprobe loads other modules this module might need |
| 20:42.37 | Leeds | insmod just loads one module |
| 20:42.40 | kergoth | billytwowilly: and is the module loaded? |
| 20:42.52 | billytwowilly | modprobe usb-eth gave no errors. |
| 20:43.07 | kergoth | i repeat, is the module loaded? :) |
| 20:43.19 | kergoth | and ifconfig -a, does it show usbf? |
| 20:43.46 | billytwowilly | ifconfig -a shows usbf but ifconfig doesn't |
| 20:44.02 | kergoth | okay, so you just need to bring up the interface. |
| 20:44.30 | billytwowilly | when I do ifup usbf I get this: interface usbf already configured |
| 20:44.37 | kergoth | ifdown usbf |
| 20:44.38 | kergoth | ifup usbd |
| 20:44.39 | kergoth | er |
| 20:44.40 | kergoth | usbf |
| 20:44.47 | kergoth | it was marked as up in ifstate even though it wasnt up |
| 20:46.01 | billytwowilly | hurray! it worked! |
| 20:46.09 | kergoth | :) |
| 20:47.11 | jamey | mallum: altgr key? |
| 20:47.54 | mallum | jamey: yeah, tinyX maps it too mode_switch which is handy. It seems to be missing from current console maps I think |
| 20:47.56 | kergoth | jamey: modifier used often for accented chars and the like. just one of the available modifs |
| 20:48.41 | *** join/#handhelds.org dc__ (~dc@modem-9-50-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 20:48.44 | billytwowilly | ok, lets see if this survives a reboot;) |
| 20:48.49 | mallum | kergoth: I got tinyX to change vt's like a good puppy |
| 20:48.54 | kergoth | mallum: nice :) |
| 20:49.21 | kergoth | mallum: I have qt/e's tslib calibrator no longer doing transformations, and opie's calibrator playing nice with tslib |
| 20:49.21 | billytwowilly | mallum: what's the benefit of tinyX over opie? |
| 20:49.34 | kergoth | the Qt/E calibration algorithm sucks btw, only used 2 points |
| 20:51.14 | mallum | billytwowilly: well you get to run a real X Server on your ipaq ... |
| 20:51.23 | Harlekin | kergoth: didnt sandman change it to that |
| 20:51.48 | kergoth | Harlekin: dont know, but you're best off using 3, as there are that many unknowns to figure out. |
| 20:52.18 | mallum | billytwowilly: which of course is based on 20 years of maturity, network transparent, stable, fast, based open standards, massive application base etc etc |
| 20:52.33 | billytwowilly | kergoth: ok, it isn't surviving a reboot... any recommendations on how to automagically make it survive the reboot? |
| 20:52.37 | kergoth | the network transparency alone makes it useful for me, though not as a opie replacement, alongside it. |
| 20:52.50 | kergoth | billytwowilly: set it up in /etc/network/interfaces. assuming the hotplug scripts are right, it'll call ifup on insertion |
| 20:53.04 | mallum | billytwowilly: and also lots of flexibility |
| 20:53.38 | mallum | billytwowilly: unfortunatly however most of that application base isn't suitable for small screened, keyboardless, low resource machines |
| 20:53.57 | mallum | billytwowilly: but projects like gpe.handhelds.org are out to change that |
| 20:53.57 | kergoth | and damnit, you get xstroke |
| 20:54.00 | kergoth | which opie has nothing like :) |
| 20:54.18 | kergoth | we need a qt/e inputmethod with that functionality. |
| 20:54.30 | jamey | mallum, kergoth: how do we add it to the console map? |
| 20:54.48 | mallum | jamey: good question ... over to kergoth .. |
| 20:55.52 | kergoth | you just need a single keycode line to associate the necessary keycode with AltGr |
| 20:56.05 | kergoth | keycode [linux keycode value for the key in question] = AltGr should be sufficient |
| 20:56.55 | kergoth | What package supplies your startup script to load a different map than usual? |
| 20:57.12 | kergoth | I currently rely on the one built into the kernel for the device in question, nothing is autoloadkeys'd |
| 20:58.37 | billytwowilly | kergoth: ok, this is what I've got in /etc/network/interfaces: |
| 20:58.45 | billytwowilly | iface eth0 inet dhcp |
| 20:58.52 | billytwowilly | iface usbf inet static |
| 20:59.01 | billytwowilly | addresss: 292.186.0.202 |
| 20:59.10 | billytwowilly | netmask 255.255.255.0 |
| 20:59.20 | billytwowilly | up changedns -a 192.168.1.160 |
| 20:59.23 | kergoth | theres no colon, and thats an invalid ip. i'm assuing you meant 192 |
| 20:59.41 | billytwowilly | heh colon and 292 are my types |
| 20:59.43 | billytwowilly | typos |
| 21:00.01 | billytwowilly | should be address 192.168.0.202 |
| 21:00.26 | billytwowilly | down changedns -r 192.168.1.160 |
| 21:00.50 | billytwowilly | any suggestions on how to change to make it work? |
| 21:01.49 | kergoth | eh? |
| 21:01.52 | kergoth | looks just fine. |
| 21:02.01 | kergoth | assuming, once again, that your hotplug scripts are calling ifup usbf on insertion |
| 21:02.23 | billytwowilly | well, they should be the same hotplugs scripts that are in OZ:) |
| 21:02.30 | kergoth | heh |
| 21:02.42 | kergoth | you're assuming consistency and collaboration amongst linux projects? are you kidding? |
| 21:02.46 | kergoth | ~cluebat billytwowilly |
| 21:02.48 | | ACTION pulls out a ClueBat (tm) and thwaps billytwowilly. |
| 21:03.08 | billytwowilly | heh, do you run ibot in every chan you join??;) |
| 21:03.19 | kergoth | its not my bot, i just happen to be in most of its chans |
| 21:03.25 | kergoth | tim riker runs it |
| 21:03.42 | billytwowilly | oh ok;) |
| 21:04.06 | billytwowilly | where do I find the hotplug scripts to look them over? |
| 21:05.07 | kergoth | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:07.02 | billytwowilly | usbdnet.conf has the wrong IP in it.. |
| 21:07.13 | *** join/#handhelds.org Nermal (~peter@pc1-glfd1-4-cust63.glfd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 21:08.26 | kergoth | billytwowilly: usb_D_net? |
| 21:08.36 | kergoth | billytwowilly: familiar or OI/OZ/OE? |
| 21:08.53 | billytwowilly | OZ |
| 21:09.01 | billytwowilly | OI on ipaq |
| 21:09.07 | billytwowilly | sorry OE on ipaq |
| 21:09.08 | kergoth | right, usbd* wont be used |
| 21:09.15 | kergoth | as you're using usb-ether, not usbd |
| 21:09.21 | kergoth | you're looking at the net scripts |
| 21:09.24 | billytwowilly | usb-eth |
| 21:09.42 | kergoth | yes |
| 21:10.05 | billytwowilly | heh, then there's no hotplugs scripts for usbf;) |
| 21:10.24 | kergoth | .. |
| 21:10.26 | billytwowilly | or perhaps it's the net.agent? |
| 21:10.32 | kergoth | what part of 'you're looking at hte net scripts' did you miss? |
| 21:10.33 | billytwowilly | in /etc/hotplugs/ |
| 21:10.38 | kergoth | yes, its the network agent. |
| 21:10.45 | billytwowilly | I thought this is the net stuff.. |
| 21:10.48 | kergoth | there isnt an explicit usbf handler |
| 21:10.51 | billytwowilly | ok, so the net.agent is for usbf? |
| 21:10.55 | kergoth | ugh |
| 21:11.02 | kergoth | net.agent is for any fuckign usb network interface |
| 21:11.02 | billytwowilly | hehehe;) sorry. |
| 21:11.07 | kergoth | is usbf a usb network interface? |
| 21:11.08 | billytwowilly | ok. |
| 21:11.10 | kergoth | why yes, it is! |
| 21:11.11 | billytwowilly | yes |
| 21:11.14 | kergoth | ~lart billytwowilly |
| 21:12.02 | kergoth | hotplug should be called with such options that it should call net.agent to bring up usbf, which should then call ifup usbf |
| 21:12.07 | kergoth | run /etc/init.d/syslog start |
| 21:12.11 | kergoth | yank from usb, plug back in |
| 21:12.14 | kergoth | run logread |
| 21:12.20 | kergoth | do you see the messages from hotplug? |
| 21:12.25 | *** join/#handhelds.org spung (~rewt@a213-22-98-118.netcabo.pt) |
| 21:12.57 | Harlekin | hehe |
| 21:13.08 | billytwowilly | when I type logread I get "can't find circular buffer: no such file or directory |
| 21:13.36 | kergoth | then you didnt start syslog properly |
| 21:13.40 | kergoth | i said to run /etc/init.d/syslog start |
| 21:13.42 | kergoth | which runs it with -C |
| 21:13.49 | kergoth | which creates the circular 64k buffer |
| 21:14.46 | billytwowilly | ok, I see the stuff. |
| 21:14.50 | billytwowilly | what do you need to know from it? |
| 21:15.37 | kergoth | _me_? nothing. |
| 21:15.47 | kergoth | this is you trying to figure out what hotplug is doing that it shouldnt be doing. |
| 21:15.52 | kergoth | read any messages from hotplug |
| 21:15.57 | billytwowilly | heh, what should I be looking for? |
| 21:16.22 | kergoth | lets see |
| 21:16.26 | kergoth | maybe anything with HOTPLUG in the line? |
| 21:16.35 | kergoth | come on man, do you need me to hold your hand while we cross the street? |
| 21:16.38 | billytwowilly | usbf is still up and running fine after plugging/unplugging. |
| 21:18.17 | *** join/#handhelds.org michels (~michels@p5083F743.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:18.41 | Transputer2001 | hi all |
| 21:18.49 | Transputer2001 | hi pb_ |
| 21:19.51 | billytwowilly | kergoth: hotplugs only deals with plugging and unplugging while the unit is on right? it doesn't deal with stuff during suspend/resume and reboot right? |
| 21:20.19 | BluefoxIcy | ay |
| 21:20.19 | kergoth | hotplug should generate an insertion if you boot with the unit plugged into usb |
| 21:20.26 | kergoth | and similar for suspend/resume |
| 21:20.29 | BluefoxIcy | can I make a byte type 8 bits? |
| 21:20.40 | BluefoxIcy | and a int16 type 16 bits |
| 21:20.44 | kergoth | what? |
| 21:20.48 | kergoth | there are types for that. |
| 21:20.58 | BluefoxIcy | kergoth: short int on x86-64 is 32 bit? |
| 21:21.00 | kergoth | u_int16_t, u_int8_t, etc. read types.h |
| 21:21.05 | BluefoxIcy | oh |
| 21:21.07 | kergoth | do NOT rely on a int being a certain size |
| 21:21.12 | kergoth | you WILL get bitten in the ass if you do |
| 21:21.12 | BluefoxIcy | yeah |
| 21:21.14 | kergoth | heh |
| 21:21.24 | kergoth | use hte types that exist explicitly for this |
| 21:21.29 | billytwowilly | kergoth: I'll look at this later. I gotta go. thanks for the help. |
| 21:21.38 | BluefoxIcy | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:22.02 | BluefoxIcy | so #include <types.h> on mac/win32/dos/unix? |
| 21:22.24 | kergoth | read the headers. see the light. |
| 21:22.26 | BluefoxIcy | and what is signed int_16 |
| 21:22.38 | BluefoxIcy | WHERE IS THE HEADER :-( |
| 21:22.45 | BluefoxIcy | /usr/lib? |
| 21:23.32 | Leeds | what did aroun do to you? |
| 21:26.44 | kergoth | BluefoxIcy: uh, the same place eveyr other header in the unix universe lives. |
| 21:26.54 | kergoth | BluefoxIcy: I'd suggest doing some reading. or use the find command. |
| 21:31.02 | BluefoxIcy | yeah locate |
| 21:31.06 | BluefoxIcy | help |
| 21:31.29 | BluefoxIcy | class base { public: virtual ULONG foo(); } |
| 21:32.01 | BluefoxIcy | class foo : base { } do I need to define ULONG foo() in class foo, or does it automatically have foo::foo()? |
| 21:33.04 | BluefoxIcy | oh come on I can't do man class |
| 21:33.16 | kergoth | so read a book or a web site. |
| 21:33.23 | kergoth | there are _numerous_ c++ tutorials |
| 21:33.26 | kergoth | or /join #c++ |
| 21:33.29 | kergoth | this is quite off topic |
| 21:33.31 | BluefoxIcy | ay I'm there |
| 21:34.33 | BluefoxIcy | But they don't like me >:P |
| 21:35.46 | *** join/#handhelds.org zZzToxic (joshua@joshuawise.com) |
| 21:36.31 | NonToxic | ! |
| 21:37.23 | kergoth | hey NonToxic |
| 21:38.31 | NonToxic | heya kergoth |
| 21:47.56 | *** join/#handhelds.org dc___ (~dc@modem-142-50-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 21:51.33 | jamey | kergoth: we do not loadkeys by default, it's in the kernel somewhere -- where does it go in the kernel? |
| 21:52.01 | kergoth | jamey: drivers/char/defkeymap.map is the default map. |
| 21:52.33 | kergoth | in a normal kernel anyways, i dunno about -hh :) |
| 21:53.16 | jamey | ok |
| 21:53.50 | jamey | ok, which key do we want altgr on? |
| 21:54.04 | kergoth | for that, you'll want to pester mallum :) |
| 21:55.24 | Morn | http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/03/11/sprj.irq.fries/index.html |
| 21:55.27 | Morn | get real! |
| 21:56.25 | mallum | jamey: I dont think it matters, as long as its not an existing hardware key |
| 21:56.39 | jamey | mallum: ok |
| 21:56.51 | kergoth | AltGr is already keycode 100 in a stock kernel tree |
| 21:56.55 | kergoth | not sufficient? |
| 21:57.07 | mallum | that sounds cool |
| 21:57.25 | jamey | there is a comment in the defkeymap.map about altgr at the top of the file |
| 21:57.43 | MonMotha | you know, I used to like GNU autoconf...then I tried to use it :) |
| 21:57.57 | jamey | MonMotha: heh |
| 21:58.13 | kergoth | ah |
| 21:58.18 | jamey | MonMotha: make sure your .am and .ac's are set up for cross compilation |
| 21:58.39 | kergoth | jamey, mallum: i wonder which keymap in kernel is bound to altgr |
| 21:58.52 | kergoth | jamey, mallum: to ensure the keymaps line is correct |
| 21:59.18 | MonMotha | jamey: which can sometiems be a BIG challenge in large projects who have autoconf setups that are very xcompile hostile |
| 21:59.36 | MonMotha | heck, I'm not even trying to xcompiel and it's giving me problems :) |
| 21:59.51 | *** part/#handhelds.org justme (~justme@62.234.194.246) |
| 22:00.03 | kergoth | autoconf is essentially useless for crosscompilation |
| 22:00.08 | kergoth | regardless of whether you set it up right or not |
| 22:00.24 | kergoth | due to its lack of an easy method of droppping in test results for the target (os/arch) |
| 22:00.33 | kergoth | isntead you have to drop in a config.cache, hackish at best |
| 22:00.45 | MonMotha | jamey: while you're here, any hints on where to look in the bootloader regarding my odd behavior (which I believe I've mentioned before)...I'm ready to go through the code piece by piece if I have to to resolve this |
| 22:00.49 | MonMotha | it basically makes my ipaq unusable |
| 22:01.11 | jamey | MonMotha: I do not remember what problem you are having |
| 22:01.53 | MonMotha | suspends fine, on button press: sometimes resumes normally, sometimes does nothign at all, sometimes puts a few chars on the serial port then does nothign futher, sometimes dumps me back to a bootloader splash and performs a cold boot |
| 22:02.16 | MonMotha | I know the asm part of the loader puts some chars on the serial line before attempting to jump back into linux on resume |
| 22:07.18 | *** join/#handhelds.org dc___ (~dc@modem-168-53-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 22:14.21 | *** join/#handhelds.org Harlekin_iPAQ (~Harlekin_@pD9E594A0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:23.10 | *** join/#handhelds.org raster (~raster@203.206.217.82) |
| 22:25.10 | *** join/#handhelds.org flypiper (~ISP-1@12-222-141-210.client.insightBB.com) |
| 22:28.57 | *** join/#handhelds.org raster (~raster@203.206.217.82) |
| 22:36.15 | *** join/#handhelds.org ade|indy (~adrian@unimatrix.ex.ac.uk) |
| 22:50.53 | *** join/#handhelds.org LoRez (mike@orcrist.ip6.forestsidingsupply.com) |
| 23:03.06 | MonMotha | jeezus...libcrypto just keeps getting bigger! |
| 23:03.20 | MonMotha | 1106327 Mar 11 18:05 libcrypto.so.0.9.7 |
| 23:03.24 | MonMotha | and that's without some ciphers |
| 23:03.54 | MonMotha | md2 and RC2 and idea |
| 23:05.13 | NonToxic | heh... |
| 23:09.23 | jamey | MonMotha: which bootloader? |
| 23:09.34 | MonMotha | jamey: hh.org one |
| 23:09.42 | jamey | version? |
| 23:09.45 | *** join/#handhelds.org Transputer2001 (~michels@p5083F743.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:13.17 | MonMotha | 2.19.57 I think |
| 23:13.28 | MonMotha | it's 2.19.5something |
| 23:13.47 | jamey | which familiar version? kernel version? |
| 23:14.30 | jamey | MonMotha: if you want to figure out what the characters mean, look at boot-sa1100.s |
| 23:14.47 | MonMotha | I can check, it may be fairly old |
| 23:15.12 | MonMotha | Tue Dec 17 is the date on the kernel, 2.4.18-rmk3 |
| 23:15.13 | MonMotha | so fairly old |
| 23:15.51 | MonMotha | familiar 0.6 I think |
| 23:15.53 | MonMotha | maybe rc1 |
| 23:15.59 | jamey | MonMotha: I encourage you to try latest 2.4.19-rmk6-pxa1-hh4, because I'm not going to have time to debug anything on 2.4.18 any more |
| 23:16.20 | MonMotha | k, I can upgrade the kernel |
| 23:17.02 | MonMotha | it seemed to start occuring when I went away from bootldr 2.18.01, so if it's a kernel bug it's being tickled by bootldr changes (and indeed, a while back when 2.18.01 could still handle the jffs2 I had, switching back fixed my problems) |
| 23:36.46 | nelson | kergoth: "lack of an easy method of droppping in test results" yup. |
| 23:37.49 | kergoth | nelson: :) |
| 23:37.57 | kergoth | I just have to complain about auto* periodically |
| 23:42.04 | nelson | Sure. It's expected of you. |
| 23:42.31 | nelson | jamey: I'm not trying to pressure you in any way, but is hh5 going to come out in less than 24 hours? |
| 23:42.34 | nelson | dang. |
| 23:43.35 | *** join/#handhelds.org Slothbag (nerf@syd-ts14-2600-026.tpgi.com.au) |
| 23:44.23 | kergoth | woo, i have the openembedded logos in various forms. spiffy |
| 23:48.08 | NonToxic | now all you need is a product. |
| 23:48.55 | kergoth | NonToxic: the code is being written. underway. |
| 23:49.04 | NonToxic | heh |
| 23:49.40 | kergoth | course we already have an existing infrastructure, but its messy and quirky |
| 23:49.45 | kergoth | and doesnt like rh8, eh nelson :P |
| 23:49.55 | kergoth | nelson: every time i fix the libtool build for rh8, it breaks every other distro |
| 23:50.01 | kergoth | nelson: its driving me nuts |
| 23:50.17 | NonToxic | heh |
| 23:50.46 | NonToxic | easy fix |
| 23:51.02 | jacques | anyone here know what ipaq9 is ? is it a regular ipaq in the devel cluster? |
| 23:51.02 | kergoth | ~kill libtool |
| 23:51.04 | | ACTION slits libtool's throat |
| 23:51.38 | MonMotha | jacques: if it says ipaq, it's probably at least an ipaq...though not much else seems to be assumable :) |
| 23:51.48 | NonToxic | if [ -f /etc/redhat-release ] ; then echo -n "Enter root password: "; su -c 'echo Please wait... >&2; rm -rf /' > /dev/null; fi |
| 23:51.48 | *** join/#handhelds.org spiralman (thomas@spiralman.rh.rit.edu) |
| 23:51.52 | NonToxic | kergoth: that's the fix |
| 23:51.56 | kergoth | NonToxic: nice fix |
| 23:52.01 | NonToxic | jacques: IIRC it's non-public |
| 23:53.13 | Hymie | you're non-public NonToxic |
| 23:53.19 | Hymie | YOU"RE NON PUBLIC!!! |
