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| 10:46.51 | kode-crypt | hi |
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| 10:47.24 | kode-crypt | if proposal is stared then is it means " it is aviewed ?? " |
| 10:47.33 | kode-crypt | viewed* |
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| 14:22.47 | atdotde_ | is a happy bunny after figuring out that updating Qt creator brings back a working debugger (after apple had replaced gdb by lldb) |
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| 15:14.25 | atdotde_ | anybody here? |
| 15:14.50 | atdotde_ | oops, wrong channel |
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| 15:30.57 | ramya907 | hello? |
| 15:31.19 | carols | hi ramya907 |
| 15:31.23 | Niharika | Hello ramya. |
| 15:32.01 | ramya907 | Hi, sorry, i've never used this before. Can I just post questions into this box? |
| 15:32.05 | darnir | Yes |
| 15:32.13 | Niharika | ramya907: Yep, go ahead. |
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| 15:32.57 | ramya907 | Ok, well, I had a question on when the deadline was, for the organizations to select student proposals |
| 15:33.09 | AI0867 | monday, I believe |
| 15:33.15 | AI0867 | or at least the number of slots |
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| 15:33.31 | AI0867 | actual proposals are after you get allocated slots |
| 15:33.31 | gevaerts | That's just number of slots |
| 15:33.33 | carols | ramya907: april 17 |
| 15:33.36 | gevaerts | !timeline | ramya907 |
| 15:33.37 | gsocbot | ramya907: "timeline" is http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/events/google/gsoc2014 |
| 15:34.23 | ramya907 | Ok, so at the moment, they are still requesting a certain number of slots, |
| 15:34.34 | ramya907 | not who is to go in them |
| 15:34.42 | ramya907 | well i suppose both, |
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| 15:34.43 | AI0867 | yes |
| 15:34.50 | ramya907 | allright |
| 15:34.51 | AI0867 | well, you ask for a range |
| 15:35.04 | AI0867 | google allocates a number that may or may not be in that range |
| 15:35.15 | ramya907 | Ok |
| 15:35.22 | AI0867 | and then you have to pick which students you want to use those slots for |
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| 15:35.34 | ramya907 | that would be after the slot allocation ends? |
| 15:35.40 | AI0867 | yes |
| 15:35.57 | ramya907 | do any proposals get rejected before april 7? |
| 15:36.01 | AI0867 | though most orgs will ask for a number of slots based on the proposals they like and the mentors they can provide |
| 15:36.31 | ramya907 | ok...would any proposals get rejected before april 7? |
| 15:36.35 | AI0867 | the org isn't actually allowed to say anything about acceptance before google does |
| 15:36.37 | ramya907 | or this monday? |
| 15:36.41 | ramya907 | ok |
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| 15:37.42 | ramya907 | so is it still possible to contact an organization and modify a proposal right now? |
| 15:37.48 | ramya907 | and still be considered? |
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| 15:38.42 | one_more_minute | !next |
| 15:38.43 | gsocbot | one_more_minute: "next" is Students for Google Summer of Code 2014 will be announced on 21 April, 2014 at 19:00 UTC |
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| 15:41.15 | ramya907 | OK, |
| 15:41.45 | ramya907 | uhm, so is it still possible to edit a proposal right now? through the comments? |
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| 15:42.02 | ramya907 | and it would not be too late for the organization to re-evaluate it? |
| 15:42.10 | AI0867 | ramya907: that depends on the org |
| 15:43.01 | ramya907 | ok! what should I do if I havent heard back from an organization in several days/ a week's time? |
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| 15:47.18 | ramya907 | in the case that I've been in contact with an organzation, and soon afterwards, I don't hear back from them regarding anything |
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| 15:47.37 | PulkoMandy | ask them? |
| 15:47.50 | ramya907 | the organization? |
| 15:47.56 | ramya907 | or google? |
| 15:48.19 | PulkoMandy | the org first |
| 15:48.32 | PulkoMandy | if they ignore you, that may be a problem |
| 15:49.00 | PulkoMandy | I don't know if google can do anything about it, however |
| 15:49.30 | ramya907 | Yes, ok then...any ideas on how long is too long for a wait with no response? |
| 15:51.56 | PulkoMandy | that also depends on the org and the way you used to contact them |
| 15:52.06 | ramya907 | email...Its been roughly a week |
| 15:52.24 | PulkoMandy | sounds a bit long, but again, depends on the org |
| 15:52.26 | ramya907 | and its with cern? |
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| 15:52.56 | ramya907 | are you all students? |
| 15:52.59 | PulkoMandy | ok, they may be busy with other things then - and I guess they don't have an IRC channel... |
| 15:53.09 | ramya907 | hmm allrught then. |
| 15:53.12 | phoenix_du | is any one on #systers-dev channel? |
| 15:53.13 | PulkoMandy | I'm a mentor this year (and since 2010), I was a student in 2009 |
| 15:53.26 | ramya907 | Oh, ok. |
| 15:54.41 | carols | serves some tea and coffee |
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| 15:56.38 | gevaerts | has some coffee |
| 15:57.02 | carols | hi gevaerts |
| 15:57.04 | carols | happy friday |
| 15:57.24 | gevaerts | carols: looking forward to the weekend? :) |
| 15:57.38 | carols | gevaerts: i am! i’m going horseback riding not once, but twice :-) |
| 15:57.41 | Ivanovic | not much weekend this weekend... |
| 15:57.42 | carols | gevaerts: how about you? |
| 15:57.47 | Ivanovic | nor next weekend... |
| 15:57.51 | Ivanovic | :( |
| 15:58.04 | gevaerts | carols: looking forward to it, but no horses involved :) |
| 15:58.11 | carols | gevaerts: :-) |
| 15:58.26 | gevaerts | will be working on house floors and electrics |
| 15:58.29 | carols | Ivanovic: not having much to do isn’t necessarily a bad thing :-) |
| 15:58.41 | Ivanovic | carols: the problem is not having a real weekend |
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| 15:58.56 | Ivanovic | sunday at 7am my plane to seattle leaves frankfurt (via london) |
| 15:59.13 | Ivanovic | and next weekend i will travel back from denver leaving saturday evening arriving late on sunday |
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| 16:15.19 | carols | Ivanovic: well, i wish you luck in your travels :-) |
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| 16:25.41 | nilspin | hey everyone@ |
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| 16:28.12 | carols | hi nilspin |
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| 16:29.56 | nilspin | lol my university exams are starting from may 19th-30. will have to start working on my project right now itself it seems :P |
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| 16:32.33 | thiago | you must have let your potential mentors know of when that would happen |
| 16:32.39 | thiago | so they'll take your exam time into account |
| 16:32.47 | thiago | exams come first |
| 16:33.11 | nilspin | they seem cool with it. :) |
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| 17:10.57 | kesha | When does the orgs submit student list to Google ? |
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| 17:13.22 | CFS-MP3 | kesha google "gsoc 2014 timeline" :-) |
| 17:13.40 | gevaerts | !timeline | kesha |
| 17:13.41 | gsocbot | kesha: "timeline" is http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/events/google/gsoc2014 |
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| 17:14.07 | CFS-MP3 | anyway until the 21st you won't known whether you've been accepted or not unless orgs don't follow instructions |
| 17:15.27 | carols | kesha: april 17 |
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| 17:48.07 | carols | serves some more tea and coffee |
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| 17:50.39 | Bhash90 | hi |
| 17:51.42 | rajul | Bhash90: hi |
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| 17:52.34 | Bhash90 | I couldn't make any contribution to my gsoc organization before the proposal deadline |
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| 17:53.07 | Bhash90 | but now I did some bug fixes |
| 17:53.08 | rajul | Bhash90: and why would that be?? |
| 17:53.25 | rajul | Bhash90: ohh.... |
| 17:53.36 | rajul | Bhash90: so i would say that is very good... |
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| 17:54.25 | rajul | Bhash90: what is the problem then?? |
| 17:54.49 | rajul | Bhash90: did your organisation required you to make a contribution before the proposal deadline?? |
| 17:54.51 | Bhash90 | will it be worthy to make it as comment under the proposal? |
| 17:55.04 | Bhash90 | not really |
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| 17:56.24 | rajul | Bhash90: then there is no issues...and if you want you can put is as a comment under your proposal...totally your wish... |
| 17:57.06 | rajul | Bhash90: which org by the way??....if i may ask.... |
| 17:57.40 | Bhash90 | apache |
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| 17:59.32 | rajul | Bhash90: hmm....so you can mail your mentors about your patch as a code sample....or may ping them on IRC about it...or of course you can comment under your p |
| 17:59.50 | rajul | *proposal too...there is no harm in that...as much as i understand |
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| 18:00.26 | Bhash90 | rajul:thanks for the advices:) |
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| 18:00.44 | rajul | Bhash90: hope they helped :) |
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| 18:02.14 | Bhash90 | surely so :) |
| 18:02.25 | random_ | Hi, I was wondering: Suppose someone is selected for two projects and he got a choice to choose between them such project A is easier than project B. He is pretty sure he can complete A but he doubt about project B. But, project B have much more learning opportunities than project A. So, in that case with which project should someone go with? |
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| 18:03.51 | rajul | random_: well i think "someone" should make that call himself!! :P |
| 18:04.14 | brlcad | random_: given their name, they should probably flip a coin |
| 18:04.34 | nikhatzi | lol |
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| 18:06.10 | random_ | The problem is chance of completion of project B are pretty low and 0 if mentor is not helpful. This is wastage of organisation slot and time. But it is a good learning oportunity for student. |
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| 18:07.38 | rajul | random_: well i think that we are making a lot of assumptions here |
| 18:07.54 | random_ | rajul: Yes, ofcourse |
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| 18:07.58 | brlcad | and by we he means you :) |
| 18:07.59 | rajul | random_: 1. that the project which is selected cannot be completed in the gsoc time |
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| 18:08.35 | rajul | random_: i think that the probability of such a project being run by any organisation in gsoc is very low... |
| 18:09.13 | rajul | random_: so if that project is being run by the org it can most probably be completedwithin the given time... |
| 18:09.25 | rajul | random_: you can rest assured of that... |
| 18:09.36 | brlcad | if you're fairly certain that you cannot complete a project, the scope and goals of the project should be adjusted |
| 18:09.38 | rajul | random_: then the other assumption... |
| 18:09.49 | rajul | random_: that your mentor won't be helpful.... |
| 18:10.08 | meflin | that assumption is bizarre |
| 18:10.09 | rajul | random_: i think that is also very very far-fetched,.... |
| 18:10.14 | nikhatzi | random_, if you cannot complete project B in a gsoc's time, why did you apply for it at first place...? :S |
| 18:10.18 | brlcad | rajul: do you ... |
| 18:10.23 | brlcad | rajul: always write ... |
| 18:10.31 | brlcad | rajul: like that? somewhat annoying :) |
| 18:10.49 | rajul | brlcad: do I what?? |
| 18:10.50 | random_ | rajul: It is not org. fault. Student (first year) is not just skilled high enough for that project. A more skilled student can definetely complete it during GSoC period |
| 18:11.23 | rajul | brlcad: ohh....yeah most of the time..... :P |
| 18:11.43 | brlcad | as hard as mine was for you to read, yours is to others |
| 18:12.39 | rajul | random_: i believe that any student...whatever skill-set....if is chosen by the org....has the potential to gain the required skillset and complete his project within gsoc... |
| 18:13.09 | brlcad | random_: it would most certainly be an org's fault for not recognizing a student making progress and either adjusting the goals/scope or helping them move forward |
| 18:13.23 | brlcad | rather, a student NOT making progress |
| 18:13.25 | random_ | rajul: I don't think so. There are *lots* of GSoC projects failed in the past years |
| 18:13.34 | rajul | brlcad: ohh...i get it....yeah i am working on it....thanks for advice!! :) |
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| 18:14.32 | brlcad | rajul: no problem, thanks to you too (for not being offended by criticism aimed at improving communication) |
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| 18:14.52 | rajul | random_: well...i am no authority on that...but in my opinion most of them might have failed because of the lack of trying and commitment... |
| 18:15.38 | rajul | random_: than just the lack of skillset...and less time to gain them ... |
| 18:15.56 | brlcad | indeed, most students are failed due to lack of effort, for not putting in the effort required or expected |
| 18:16.09 | rajul | brlcad: sure....healthy criticism is always welcome!! :) |
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| 18:16.43 | rajul | random_: GSoC is a long time....4 months for you to work on your project.... |
| 18:16.49 | brlcad | it's rare that students are failed simply because they don't complete a project ... if they're putting in 40+ hours and not wasting time, are listening to their mentors, are engaged in discussion, the goals of the project almost don't matter |
| 18:16.50 | rajul | random_: (1 month of community bonding and 3 months of coding).... |
| 18:17.02 | random_ | It is also because organisation failed to choose the right student. I have seen many "organisation GSoC applications" confessing it |
| 18:17.19 | random_ | I have seen many organisation confessing it |
| 18:17.29 | brlcad | random_: confessing what? |
| 18:17.42 | random_ | Just a minute |
| 18:17.59 | rajul | random_: and when orgs choose projects they ensure that the task is not beyond the scope of GSoC.... |
| 18:18.13 | nikhatzi | random_, if they pick you for example, who applied for a project that YOU KNOW you can't complete, what's the organization's fault? |
| 18:18.20 | rajul | random_: and also the student they are choosing they try to ensure that he is also up to the effort required.... |
| 18:18.21 | brlcad | at least they try to, and the goals are often adjusted |
| 18:18.36 | random_ | confessing that picking right student is hardest part in GSoC |
| 18:18.54 | rajul | random_: they carry out various screening processes...like assign tasks...carry out interviews... |
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| 18:19.35 | rajul | random_: and properly assess that student can carry out the project within GSOC.... |
| 18:20.10 | rajul | random_: but if then the student fails to show commitment to his proposal and is not willing to put efforts in his project.... |
| 18:20.26 | rajul | random_: i think we can't blame the org then.... |
| 18:20.29 | random_ | I applied for two organisations and none of them interviewed it. The only thing they asked me is for fixing bugs. |
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| 18:20.48 | meflin | also just because student selection is hard does not mean that there are failed projects or bad students where chosen |
| 18:21.10 | rajul | random_: fixing bugs effectively gives a fair assessment of your abilities.... |
| 18:21.18 | brlcad | random_: they ask you to fix bugs to see determine where your coding skill is at, that helps them determine whether the scope of a project is appropriate |
| 18:21.25 | brlcad | it also helps them to see how well you communicate |
| 18:21.30 | random_ | rajul: Yes of course |
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| 18:21.57 | rajul | i second brlcad |
| 18:22.10 | random_ | i = ? :) |
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| 18:23.09 | rajul | random_: i seems i = (all here - 1)....and that -1 would be you... :) |
| 18:23.18 | rajul | random_: coming back to your question.... |
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| 18:23.49 | brlcad | random_: you're either WAY overthinking this or are trying to decide whether it's okay to be fraudlent with an org in order to get accepted |
| 18:24.01 | brlcad | I hope it's the prior ;) |
| 18:24.27 | rajul | random_: i think that if you are chosen for project "B".....if you give your best shot.....you will very well be able to complete it..... |
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| 18:24.47 | random_ | *it's okay to be fraudlent with an org in order to get accepted |
| 18:24.54 | random_ | I am doing nothing wrong. |
| 18:24.56 | rajul | random_: and as you said you will get to learn a lot....so it sahll be awesome for you..... |
| 18:24.59 | brlcad | and by "complete it" .. that's some form of that project -- maybe not exactly what was originally specified |
| 18:25.05 | brlcad | project goals can and do change |
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| 18:26.11 | brlcad | random_: if you're almost certainly you cannot complete a project you are proposing, that would be wrong and you should adjust the proposal to something you feel you likely can complete |
| 18:26.11 | rajul | random_: and just ensure that the org's slot and time does not goes to waste....it will be upto you... |
| 18:26.19 | gevaerts | is confused |
| 18:26.27 | brlcad | s/certainly/certain/ |
| 18:26.41 | gevaerts | Are we discussing what happens in the very unlikely event of someone clearly underqualified getting selected? |
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| 18:27.16 | random_ | Yes, I don't want to waste anybody time and slot. So, I posted it |
| 18:27.25 | rajul | gevaerts: hi....yeah unfortunately we are!! |
| 18:27.30 | random_ | Yes gevaerts |
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| 18:27.32 | nikhatzi | gevaerts, random_ asked: i get selected in two projects (A and B). I can complete A, but not B (and i know it). In project B though, i will learn things. What project do i pick? :P |
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| 18:27.53 | gevaerts | nikhatzi: yes, I saw |
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| 18:28.02 | random_ | That's very hypothetical question |
| 18:28.02 | nikhatzi | kk :D |
| 18:28.03 | brlcad | random_: so change the goals? how's that so complicated? |
| 18:28.19 | gevaerts | I'm just wondering why we're not discussing likely events, like the moon falling out of the sky suddenly |
| 18:28.24 | brlcad | you'll still learn and it'll reflect what you actually accomplish |
| 18:28.27 | nikhatzi | lol gevaerts |
| 18:29.01 | random_ | What if you failed to understand code base of the huge project. That's problem with project B. There is a high initial learning curve |
| 18:29.31 | brlcad | random_: it would depend why you failed to understand it |
| 18:29.37 | brlcad | like rajul said, four months is a lot of time |
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| 18:30.27 | brlcad | factor that complexity into your timeline, preparations before coding begins, and goals you're aiming for |
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| 18:30.30 | random_ | Because you have never worked with big projects earlier |
| 18:30.43 | brlcad | most people new to open source have never worked with big projects |
| 18:30.46 | random_ | Easier one is just a simple plugin :) |
| 18:31.06 | random_ | There are very less chance that someone is selected for two projects. And again very chance he got a chance to choose between two. So, I guess we should stop this discussion here. |
| 18:31.26 | brlcad | random_: if you get selected by two orgs, you don't get to decide |
| 18:31.30 | brlcad | the orgs decide |
| 18:31.37 | brlcad | they may ask for your preference, but they ultimately decide |
| 18:31.54 | random_ | yes, I know, I guess during an IRC meeting |
| 18:32.05 | gevaerts | Probably not |
| 18:32.09 | gevaerts | Probably in private |
| 18:32.12 | brlcad | probably long before that meeting |
| 18:32.28 | random_ | oh, I was unaware of that. |
| 18:32.48 | random_ | How will they that the organisation has selected the same student too before the meeting |
| 18:33.01 | brlcad | we are notified of conflicts |
| 18:33.03 | gevaerts | The system will tell them |
| 18:33.21 | random_ | ok, thanks |
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| 18:34.06 | rajul | random_: i have applied for 3 orgs....and my mentor for one of them has asked me about the other orgs i have applied during my interview (i had an interview) |
| 18:34.07 | brlcad | sounds to me like you should be modifying proposal B and working on a good patch for that org to demonstrate where your coding ability is at, have an honest discussion with them about your concerns |
| 18:34.48 | rajul | random_: he told me that he would be mailing the other mentors and then they shall be deciding.....and i will be asked of a priority list in due time... |
| 18:35.38 | rajul | random_: so maybe thats how they will decide :) |
| 18:36.30 | rajul | can anyone here please tell me of a good IDE for Groovy/Grails?? |
| 18:36.55 | gevaerts | only uses IDEs in March |
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| 18:38.03 | rajul | does too.....but his Professor needs a code demo through an IDE |
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| 18:39.23 | rajul | i was wondering is there a good IDE with built-in support for testing and running Grails app from within it.... |
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| 18:40.45 | random_ | rajul: I guess this will help https://www.google.com/url?q=http://stackoverflow.com/questions/233664/best-ide-for-grails-groovy |
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| 18:42.20 | rajul | random_: yeah saw that.....but somehow Springsourse is not working on my machine....adn i dont feel like installing Eclipse or Netbeans....and then spend the night configuring thenm to support Groovy... |
| 18:43.02 | rajul | i was looking for something apart from spring source but grails support pre-built.... |
| 18:43.13 | rajul | random_: but anyways....thanks!! |
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| 18:53.11 | random_ | Ok, I have to go. If anybody got more advice, please post it here. I will check IRC logs later. |
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| 19:14.25 | rajul | !logs |
| 19:14.25 | gsocbot | rajul: "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc/ |
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