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| 08:29.20 | Genesis | yo |
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| 09:53.53 | florian_kc | good morning |
| 10:03.24 | XorA | florian_kc: morning |
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| 13:25.32 | prpplague | pb_: ping |
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| 13:59.42 | prpplague | jg: don't suppose you do any hacking with the libertas driver? |
| 14:00.42 | jg | prpplague: no, Dan and Marcelo do that. |
| 14:01.41 | prpplague | jg: okie dokie, thanks anyway |
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| 17:20.37 | Genesis | bye |
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| 17:40.51 | jcole | hey dude |
| 17:41.01 | jcole | dudes* |
| 17:42.38 | jcole | i installed debian on my ipaq using familiar |
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| 17:42.56 | jcole | i'm quite proud of myself :) |
| 17:43.55 | jcole | it's a bit "Frankensteined" |
| 17:44.52 | prpplague | jcole: you should see some of my frankenstein devices |
| 17:45.15 | jcole | i am using matchbox-window-manager + gnome-panel (sound/res/etc. applets) + xfce-desktop (less memory!) + epiphany browser + gxine |
| 17:45.32 | jcole | can't use gpe since it is not in debian |
| 17:45.43 | jcole | i'm quite happy with my setup |
| 17:45.56 | jcole | i can play my videos and mp3s |
| 17:46.41 | jcole | i'm using the gnome network-manager applet for wifi :) |
| 17:47.31 | jcole | my browser (epiphany) has tabbing/http/javascript |
| 17:47.32 | jcole | https* |
| 17:47.55 | jcole | i had to do some tweaking with the default gnome fonts and default toolbar settings |
| 17:49.15 | jcole | now, i'm trying to make it "pure" debian |
| 17:49.40 | jcole | i have to boot the familiar kernel and boot into X |
| 17:50.19 | jcole | from there, i kick off my desktop session in a debian chroot located on my 512mb cf card |
| 17:50.30 | jcole | export DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:0.0 |
| 17:50.50 | jcole | basically, i'm running debian on top of familiar |
| 17:53.10 | jcole | to get the right desktop, i first "simulated" a debian ipaq session by creating a 480x640 vncserver on my local x86 machine |
| 17:53.40 | jcole | i have hx4700 |
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| 18:05.15 | jcole | anyone here ever converted a .deb to ipkg? |
| 18:25.58 | XorA|gone | jcole: sometimes its as simple as cp *.deb *.ipk |
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| 19:12.55 | jcole | i'm tempted to do an "apt-get --download-only {packages}" then iterate through the /var/cache/apt/archives/*.deb files removing the docs (/usr/share/doc) or whatever else may be "big and unneeded" |
| 19:13.44 | jcole | basically, modifying the cached .debs before installing them... |
| 19:14.09 | florian | re |
| 19:15.55 | jcole | florian: http://pastebin.ca/261654 |
| 19:21.18 | jcole | i'll create a howto with screenshots of how to get debian on one's pda |
| 19:23.13 | jcole | also, wouldn't it be easier on ipaq/familiar/opie/gpe linux developers if they used the debian infrastructure? |
| 19:23.39 | jcole | i do understand how "embedded linux" needs to be more slimmed down with slimmed down kernels, etc. |
| 19:25.13 | florian | jcole: hi |
| 19:25.16 | jcole | why not just create a separate arch? http://www.debian.org/ports/ |
| 19:25.17 | florian | jcole: oh cool |
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| 19:26.18 | jcole | for example, you can run debian on a freebsd kernel |
| 19:26.20 | florian | jcole: sounds like it is time to update the gpe debian packages :-) |
| 19:27.15 | jcole | florian: it would open huge doors of possibility for linux on handhelds |
| 19:27.55 | florian | indeed |
| 19:29.51 | jcole | florian: by creating your own arch in debian, you guys could customize the building of *any* package |
| 19:30.14 | jcole | florian: debian has clusters of build servers |
| 19:32.33 | jcole | florian: for example, if you need a slimmed down version of apt, build the package WITHOUT docs and even moving the docs for apt into a separate package... |
| 19:33.03 | florian | jcole: that's true, but updating the existing packages would be a good start |
| 19:33.41 | jcole | florian: right |
| 19:34.42 | jcole | florian: right now i'm running this port on my ipaq -> http://www.debian.org/ports/arm/ |
| 19:38.01 | neal | http://freshmeat.net/projects/gpe-calendar/ |
| 19:38.06 | florian | jcole: that should be fine... |
| 19:38.08 | neal | I think that is quite out of date. |
| 19:38.14 | florian | yeah |
| 19:38.16 | florian | hi neal |
| 19:38.20 | neal | hi. |
| 19:38.31 | florian | neal: koen promised to update it :-) |
| 19:39.32 | neal | florian: I forget where I'm supposed to apply for an account |
| 19:40.01 | neal | http://gpe.linuxtogo.org/documentation.phtml has lots of links to handhelds.org |
| 19:41.06 | neal | and where can I track changes to gpe-calendar, etc. |
| 19:42.12 | florian | neal: yeah, the website is still a lot of work... we have docbook versions of most of the user docs now too. e.g. |
| 19:42.54 | jcole | florian: another thing to think about is that java is now gpl, and the source is in debian |
| 19:43.03 | florian | neal: http://projects.linuxtogo.org/projects/gpe |
| 19:43.22 | neal | that looks horribe. |
| 19:43.32 | jcole | florian: many *arm based* phones and pdas are running java |
| 19:43.46 | florian | neal: i'm currently trying to fix svn notifications and related stuff |
| 19:44.19 | jcole | florian: what pda do you own? |
| 19:45.26 | florian | neal: very true, gforge is crap... but has some nice features. |
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| 19:45.38 | neal | I'm not impressed by this gforge thing at all. |
| 19:46.18 | florian | jcole: h3870, htc universal, a simpad and i have access to a pile of more at kc |
| 19:46.22 | florian | hi mmp |
| 19:46.36 | neal | navigation is a real pain. |
| 19:46.50 | mmp | hi florian :) |
| 19:47.03 | jcole | florian: if i get a howto guide together of how to install debian on top of familiar, would you be interested in installing? |
| 19:48.32 | florian | neal: it is not really impressive but projects can manage some stuff without the help of privileged users on the hosting site. that was quite important for us... |
| 19:49.03 | jcole | florian: since debian is a bit "heavy" compared to familiar, you'll need powerful hardware and probably a CF card with at least 512MB |
| 19:49.26 | florian | neal: i can imagine that quite some of the usability issues are not too complicated to fix but currently there is no time left here |
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| 19:49.51 | florian | jcole: basically yes, that would be interesting to try... but not this year :-/ |
| 19:51.48 | jcole | florian: are most familiar supported pdas arm-based? |
| 19:52.04 | florian | jcole: imho familiar is arm only |
| 19:52.16 | jcole | florian: great! |
| 19:52.28 | neal | florian: Can you add me to gpe? |
| 19:52.29 | florian | jcole: there are not many pdas that are not arm anyway |
| 19:52.29 | neal | florian: My username is neal |
| 19:52.34 | florian | neal: sure, one sec |
| 19:52.54 | neal | where do I upload ssh keys? |
| 19:55.38 | florian | neal: "My Page" > "Account Maintenance" |
| 19:55.54 | florian | neal: done, welcome :-) |
| 19:56.01 | neal | thanks |
| 19:57.47 | florian | neal: you can't write to svn currently... i installed a broken svn admin script... |
| 19:58.03 | neal | you mean I can't commit? |
| 19:58.35 | florian | right |
| 20:07.54 | florian | their default svn repository administration script is broken for everything |
| 20:13.50 | jcole | florian: i'm a bit surprised that when i go to linuxworld every year that they have all debian based arm devices but *never* familiar based arm devices |
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| 20:15.36 | jcole | florian: some arm systems are compiled from scratch |
| 20:18.09 | jcole | florian: probably because familiar does not target a wide range of hardware, but a particular set of handhelds |
| 20:18.53 | jcole | florian: porting and development using debian is much easier |
| 20:20.02 | florian | jcole: it is intended to be specialized... but quite some people use OE to build custom distributions and toolchains. |
| 20:20.20 | florian | but debian is quite powerful too |
| 20:23.01 | jcole | florian: since debian is designed for portability in mind, debian was the first linux distro to be ported to hppa and ia64/itanium cpus |
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| 20:26.25 | croscato | Hi all. I would like to contribute to the GPE translation to Brazilian Portuguese. How could I do this? |
| 20:26.54 | florian | hi croscato |
| 20:27.19 | florian | hrm... i never know the url of the translation project |
| 20:27.43 | jcole | florian: and i keep forgetting that familiar is based on debian, lol |
| 20:28.43 | florian | jcole: thats history for a long time now |
| 20:31.14 | florian | croscato: http://www.iro.umontreal.ca/translation/HTML/readme.html |
| 20:31.46 | florian | croscato: if you find an outdated bit please send a short message to the gpe mailinglist |
| 20:32.13 | croscato | florian: tanks a lot |
| 20:32.18 | croscato | bye |
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| 20:32.28 | jcole | florian: would it be easier to just convert debian packages to ipkg format? |
| 20:32.42 | jcole | florian: hrm, dependencies... |
| 20:33.44 | florian | jcole: that works to some extend... |
| 20:43.28 | jcole | florian: i'm guessing familiar ipkg dependencies/conflicts/recommended/suggested do not directly map to debian .deb dependencies/conflicts/recommended/suggested... i bit tough to port an app with multiple depends... |
| 20:45.43 | florian | jcole: yes, ipkg is a little bit simpler... except for translation dependencies |
| 20:49.10 | jcole | florian: i wonder it take to not depend on familiar? just strictly using the debian installer? |
| 20:49.30 | jcole | a kernel would need to be available to the debian installer for a particular handheld |
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| 20:50.19 | florian | jcole: and an input method |
| 20:51.01 | jcole | florian: right, might be better to use a preseeded install with no prompts |
| 20:51.17 | jcole | like ubuntu does |
| 20:51.44 | jcole | (in many parts of the installer anyway) |
| 20:53.00 | jcole | are the familiar kernels in ipkg format? |
| 20:53.57 | jcole | can one just simply take the .config from a familiar kernel and build a debian .deb/.udeb version? |
| 20:54.40 | jcole | i notice that familiar breaks up kernel modules |
| 20:55.00 | jcole | for size probably |
| 20:58.24 | florian | right |
| 21:13.14 | jcole | new debian version will be released soon |
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| 21:38.59 | florian | hi pvanhoof, hi goxboxlive |
| 21:39.16 | goxboxlive | hi florian. |
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| 22:32.53 | JAV | hi |
| 22:33.29 | florian | hi JAV |
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| 23:53.03 | jcole | florian_: you wouldn't happen to know how to get xorg to work with a handheld would you? |
| 23:58.57 | florian | jcole: i wouldn't recommend this, use kdrive |