| 00:09.35 | Cwiiis | Anyone know off-hand how to modify the gconf schema dir/prefix? |
| 00:10.31 | Cwiiis | ah, found it.. |
| 01:07.03 | *** join/#gpe jg (~jg@h0002a5b51d05.ne.client2.attbi.com) |
| 01:20.22 | *** join/#gpe franktom (~frank@61.149.187.19) |
| 02:11.38 | *** join/#gpe Nosklo (~clovis@201.19.140.251) |
| 02:19.11 | *** join/#gpe seva (seva@sevatech.com) |
| 02:22.35 | seva | was there no activity on the mailing list since nov 2004? |
| 02:22.54 | seva | there is nothing newer than 15 nov 2004 here: http://handhelds.org/hypermail/gpe/ |
| 03:07.40 | *** join/#gpe aloph1 (~aloph@cnet-cable-189-84-233.canbrasnet.com.br) |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe seva (seva@sevatech.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe nelson (~nelson@desk.crynwr.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe philippe (~fille@ip-213-49-65-13.dsl.scarlet.be) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe flypiper (~ISP-1@12-202-234-207.client.insightBB.com) |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe aphistic (~aphistic@CPE-65-30-217-110.wi.rr.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe Tonyx (twillber@ext-ssh.movial.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe __moray (~moray@moray.developer.debian) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe dragonk (1000@b62-248-157-125.elisa-laajakaista.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe beattie (~beattie@gw.beattie-home.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe PaxAnima (~petter@dhcp-105-188.idi.ntnu.no) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe gdsx (1742d71a26@xsdg.staff.freenode) |
| 04:02.02 | *** join/#gpe moray (~moray@moray.developer.debian) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 05:48.13 | *** part/#gpe seva (seva@sevatech.com) |
| 06:34.41 | *** join/#gpe unknown26 (unknown26@ACA46C72.ipt.aol.com) |
| 10:16.36 | *** join/#gpe ibot (ibot@apt.bot.TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc) |
| 10:16.36 | *** topic/#gpe is The GPE Palmtop Environment - http://gpe.handhelds.org/ | GPE Wiki: http://handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/GPEProject | unstable images updated: http://handhelds.org/~pb/unstable/ | unstable feed now (sort of) working again | familiar snapshots: http://familiar.handhelds.org/snapshots/ |
| 10:27.57 | *** join/#gpe mallum (~mallum@host81-155-187-221.range81-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 10:30.44 | *** join/#gpe florian_kc (~fuchs@dns.kernelconcepts.de) |
| 10:34.34 | florian_kc | hi all |
| 10:39.06 | Nosklo | florian_kc: hello! |
| 10:41.29 | Nosklo | is there an application to use pda as remote control on gpe, similar to opie-remote? ipkg-find didnt return anything useful. |
| 10:42.04 | florian_kc | Nosklo: no, it would be easy to write one but oone did this so far. |
| 10:42.58 | Nosklo | florian_kc: i just got an ipaq, installed gpe, installed opie, back to gpe, now i want to start programming. i think i will take a shot writing this one... |
| 10:43.59 | Nosklo | florian_kc: any helpful hints to a starting gpe developer? (besides the ones at the wiki of course) |
| 10:44.25 | florian_kc | Nosklo: cool... there should be an excellent library for this remote control stuff. |
| 10:45.14 | florian_kc | Nosklo: gpe is no magic, basically gtk and a more or less unified look and feel. |
| 10:46.06 | Nosklo | i think we need a boost in the gpe project. Its so much cooler than opie, but the opie guys seems ahead somehow |
| 10:47.00 | florian_kc | Nosklo: right, i suppose you will find some people in this channel sharing this opinion :-) |
| 10:47.17 | mallum | Nosklo: GPE has some fundamental problems imho :( |
| 10:47.30 | *** join/#gpe zecke (~freyther@pD9E7CD4F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 10:47.31 | florian_kc | mallum: fix them |
| 10:47.35 | Nosklo | mallum: how come? |
| 10:47.57 | florian_kc | Nosklo: there is a little bit additional information: http://www.kernelconcepts.de/~fuchs/gpe/doc/ |
| 10:48.41 | Nosklo | florian_kc: cool! i will learn more and start doing something. i am very excited.. |
| 10:49.18 | mallum | Nosklo: The project lacks any structure and is unfriendly to developers |
| 10:49.36 | florian_kc | mallum: we are working on it :-) |
| 10:49.53 | mallum | Nosklo: ( when compared to something like GNOME that ultimatly GPE should align itself with ) |
| 10:49.59 | florian_kc | mallum: and #gpe is the most friendly channel! ;-) |
| 10:50.21 | mallum | florian_kc: yes #gpe is friendly, thanks to folks like you ;) |
| 10:50.29 | mallum | ( not me ;) ) |
| 10:50.44 | florian_kc | mallum: heh |
| 10:51.04 | *** part/#gpe RockClimber (~Philip@spud.chem.ox.ac.uk) |
| 10:51.05 | florian_kc | but first we need to survive cebit! |
| 10:51.52 | mallum | Nosklo: unfriendly in terms of lack of developer docs ( though florian is working on this ), building from source, what the base deps are etc etc |
| 10:51.57 | Nosklo | mallum: i think we must work on it. but i dont have the knowledge yet. started fiddling with it only 2 days ago. |
| 10:52.10 | Nosklo | florian_kc: i will certanly bug the channel a lot from now on ;-) |
| 10:52.47 | mallum | Nosklo: the project lacks any real goals/roadmap nor deciding who gpe is actually for - geeks, man on the street, booth ? |
| 10:52.48 | florian_kc | Nosklo: no problem... i hope we will have network access at cebit. :-) |
| 10:53.50 | Nosklo | florian_kc: we should get miniMo to work.. |
| 10:54.36 | mallum | florian_kc: Nils should get more involved with GPE too |
| 10:55.04 | Nosklo | mallum: we can have package tasks for this... someone wanting "man on the street" application should install only a few packages that will do this... |
| 10:55.04 | florian_kc | Nosklo: minimo is nice... but it looks like it still needs a lot of work to make it reall useful. |
| 10:55.39 | florian_kc | mallum: right... that would be good. i'll convince him during our trip to hannover today :-) |
| 10:57.16 | florian_kc | mallum: but for now... go and fix some matchbox bugs ;-) |
| 10:59.09 | mallum | florian_kc: such as ? |
| 10:59.41 | Nosklo | my first gpe experience was terrible.. suddenly it wouldnt log me in at all, no logs, no info about what was happening |
| 10:59.48 | Nosklo | i was just returned to the login screen |
| 11:00.47 | Nosklo | had to reinstall to "unbrick" my ipaq |
| 11:01.13 | *** join/#gpe zecke_ (~freyther@pD9E7C618.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:01.50 | mallum | Nosklo: I think its a much deeper problem than just package tasks .. |
| 11:02.27 | Nosklo | mallum: what i mean is that the project may follow both lines, it need not be stuck to be "only for men in street" |
| 11:02.52 | mallum | Nosklo: I dont think it can |
| 11:03.13 | mallum | Nosklo: well it makes it much harder to be easy to use and geeky at the same time |
| 11:03.24 | mallum | Nosklo: GNOME does not follow that route |
| 11:03.33 | *** join/#gpe freyther (~freyther@pD9E7C618.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:03.48 | mallum | Nosklo: GNOME focuses on ease of use rather than hundreds of options to keep geeks happy |
| 11:03.58 | mallum | Nosklo: KDE on ther other hand ... |
| 11:04.11 | Nosklo | mallum: yup. the gnome options are there, but they are hidden |
| 11:04.24 | mallum | Nosklo: to a degree ... |
| 11:04.38 | mallum | Nosklo: but you get my point |
| 11:04.45 | Nosklo | mallum: one must dig gconf etc. to find them |
| 11:06.26 | Nosklo | mallum: we may have the default "men in the street" configuration, and optional packages to configure everything |
| 11:06.45 | *** join/#gpe bedboi (~bedboi@Cippone.ateneo.uniba.it) |
| 11:07.18 | bedboi | hi there |
| 11:07.27 | Nosklo | mallum: but i got your point. it is indeed something that needs work. |
| 11:07.34 | Nosklo | bedboi: hi! |
| 11:07.50 | mallum | Nosklo: its more fundamental than that - for example try cutting and pasting from one gpe app to another easily |
| 11:08.28 | mallum | Nosklo: look at all the settings menu options too , why so many |
| 11:08.50 | *** join/#gpe freyther (~freyther@pD9E7C14B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:10.35 | Nosklo | mallum: some of the settings menu options may be easily removed by optimum default configs. cutting and pasting is only matter of writing a panel app similar to the opie one... i understand what you say... we need lots of work done. |
| 11:10.58 | Nosklo | mallum: so lets start it... i must go to my job now. be back in a few hours ;-) |
| 11:10.59 | mallum | Nosklo: panel app for cutting and pasting is dumb and you cant do it easily in X |
| 11:11.31 | florian_kc | hi bedboi |
| 11:11.46 | Nosklo | mallum: what about that middle mouse app? |
| 11:12.43 | mallum | Nosklo: and thats easy to use ? |
| 11:12.50 | mallum | Nosklo: come on |
| 11:13.14 | mallum | Nosklo: the apps themsleves should do cut and paste |
| 11:13.38 | mallum | Nosklo: the panel is a total mess as it is |
| 11:14.09 | mallum | Nosklo: it treated like a desktop panel - but it isn't a desktop |
| 11:15.28 | Nosklo | mallum: a gpe-clipboard with an api for all apps to use... that would be the way to go right? |
| 11:15.56 | Nosklo | mallum: and the panel is a mess, but you can hide it, thats cool ;) |
| 11:16.20 | Nosklo | mallum: well... i love to chat, but i am late, we talk more later okay? |
| 11:16.33 | Nosklo | mallum: this conversation is useful, nice talking to you |
| 11:16.42 | mallum | okey |
| 11:16.45 | Nosklo | florian_kc: you too, thanks for help, will be seeing ya |
| 11:19.41 | florian_kc | Nosklo: cu |
| 11:21.39 | florian_kc | mallum: hey... wh just found out why we still don't have a structure in GPE. You were missing at FOSDEM! |
| 11:22.29 | mallum | florian_kc: yeah but it shouldn't be my responsibilty - I dont really do anything for GPE |
| 11:22.42 | mallum | florian_kc: its up to Nils he is project leader right ? |
| 11:22.58 | florian_kc | mallum: you do more than yu think :-) |
| 11:23.03 | mallum | florian_kc: no one else has any official position in gpe - eg release managers etc |
| 11:23.49 | florian_kc | mallum: yes right... |
| 11:25.15 | mallum | which comes back to structure |
| 11:25.34 | mallum | like most decisions seem to be made by pb but with no discussion etc |
| 11:32.03 | *** part/#gpe bedboi (~bedboi@Cippone.ateneo.uniba.it) |
| 12:19.09 | *** join/#gpe somez (~somez@ikhokmobil05.elte.hu) |
| 12:19.09 | somez | exit |
| 12:40.17 | *** join/#gpe reenoo (~r@p54810AD8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:40.26 | reenoo | morning |
| 12:41.08 | koen | hey reenoo |
| 12:43.23 | reenoo | hi koen |
| 12:45.12 | mallum | hey reenoo reenooooo |
| 12:45.54 | reenoo | yo mallum |
| 12:48.31 | koen | florian_kc: when are you leaving for cebit? |
| 12:49.29 | reenoo | koen: is libz1_1.2.2-r{1,2} still in any of the feeds? |
| 12:50.20 | reenoo | I believe it's broken due to kergoth's visibility patch |
| 12:50.23 | koen | libz1_1.2.2-r2_arm.ipk |
| 12:50.45 | reenoo | "After I upgraded libz1 from 1.2.2-r0 to 1.2.2-r1 and restarted" |
| 12:50.47 | reenoo | Opie, my touchscreen stopped working." |
| 12:51.00 | reenoo | from a familiar@ posting |
| 12:51.16 | reenoo | kergoth added the visibility patch in -r1 |
| 12:51.32 | koen | I usually stop reading when people experience opie problems, due to the fact opie 1.1.9 is broken in general |
| 12:52.29 | koen | it that patch still in OE? |
| 12:53.41 | reenoo | an updated version of it is in again, yeah |
| 12:54.03 | reenoo | not sure whether it's functional or not now |
| 12:55.01 | koen | I wonder why opie-ts uses libz |
| 12:55.48 | mallum | lalalalalala |
| 12:56.36 | koen | hey there mallum |
| 12:56.45 | koen | feeling musical today? |
| 12:59.51 | koen | florian_kc: could you poke nils to mail jdub again? |
| 13:13.40 | *** join/#gpe tigrux (~tigrux@charybdis-ext.suse.de) |
| 13:14.54 | reenoo | koen: mail jdub? why? |
| 13:16.08 | florian_kc | koen: eh? jdup? |
| 13:18.20 | koen | florian_kc: jeff waugh |
| 13:18.33 | koen | he emailed nils and pb earlier about gnome adoption |
| 13:18.37 | florian_kc | ah! |
| 13:18.47 | koen | hey tigrux |
| 13:19.02 | tigrux | Hello master koen! |
| 13:19.08 | tigrux | Good afternood florian_kc |
| 13:19.16 | florian_kc | hi tigrux |
| 13:19.46 | reenoo | hi tigrux |
| 13:20.29 | reenoo | koen: gnome adoption as in gpe would become a gnome (sub-)project? |
| 13:20.45 | koen | reenoo: as far as I understood, yes |
| 13:20.53 | koen | don't know much about the details |
| 13:21.06 | reenoo | interesting |
| 13:22.00 | koen | apparently jdub finds GPE very cool |
| 13:27.27 | florian_kc | very good... |
| 13:29.36 | reenoo | ~seen france |
| 13:29.49 | ibot | france is currently on #handhelds.org |
| 13:30.43 | koen | florian_kc: is the gallery working yet? |
| 13:31.13 | koen | france found a work around for the permissions problem just before he left for dinner, don't know if he had time to implement it |
| 13:32.17 | tigrux | reenoo: Sorry, I hadn't seen. Good afternoon. |
| 13:32.56 | florian_kc | koen: nope :-( |
| 13:33.55 | florian_kc | brb |
| 13:42.01 | tigrux | florian_kc: Do you know why minimo does not have scroll bars? |
| 13:43.13 | mallum | koen: I think he finds the idea of it cool at least |
| 13:46.59 | koen | as I said, I don't know the details |
| 13:47.42 | koen | before we attemp anything we should have at least some form of a roadmap |
| 13:48.14 | mallum | koen: iirc jdub attemted to add gpe to garnome |
| 13:48.31 | mallum | koen: it never made it cos of the build system |
| 13:48.36 | koen | D'oh |
| 13:49.15 | mallum | :( |
| 13:55.52 | koen | mallum: but OE has proven that GPE isn't 'unbuildable' |
| 13:56.22 | koen | the Makefile in CVS doesn't work, though |
| 13:56.36 | reenoo | OE has a bunch of Makefile patches for gpe apps |
| 13:56.41 | mallum | koen: yeah but setting OE up and running isn't exactly easy |
| 13:56.56 | reenoo | mallum: ? |
| 13:56.58 | mallum | koen: and the gpe build in oe still regularly breaks pretty badly |
| 13:57.24 | koen | it does, but that's not always the fault of GPE |
| 13:57.37 | reenoo | mallum: setting up OE for gpe builds takes about 5 minutes here |
| 13:57.47 | mallum | reenoo: yeah cos you know what your doing |
| 13:57.56 | koen | reenoo: but it will take John Newbie a lot more time |
| 13:57.57 | reenoo | mallum: no. because I can read |
| 13:57.59 | mallum | reenoo: its aa lot harder than typing ./configure and make |
| 13:58.11 | mallum | reenoo: and you need a good few gigs of space |
| 13:58.51 | mallum | and didn't pb who worte the GPE makefiles add it to OE anyway ? |
| 13:59.02 | mallum | oe and oz were around for ages before gpe was added |
| 13:59.07 | mallum | many people tried and gave up |
| 13:59.39 | reenoo | to my knowledge pb_ was the first one to actually try adding gpe |
| 13:59.48 | mallum | reenoo: well your toally wrong there |
| 13:59.58 | reenoo | ok |
| 14:00.03 | mallum | reenoo: cos I tried long before when I added X and matchbox |
| 14:00.07 | mallum | and people tried after me |
| 14:00.07 | koen | some dude called 'erich' tried first |
| 14:00.25 | koen | according to the bk logs |
| 14:00.53 | mallum | its crazy to tie gpe to oe anyway |
| 14:02.02 | koen | my point was that it should be straightforward to add gpe to garnome when looking at what OE does to build it |
| 14:02.02 | reenoo | mallum: I joined OE a bit after pb_. shouldn't have made assumptions about the time before. sorry |
| 14:02.20 | reenoo | mallum: GPE in OE is basically just one .bbclass |
| 14:02.28 | mallum | reenoo: sure |
| 14:02.48 | mallum | koen: yeah easy for pb who knows the gpe Makefiles etc |
| 14:03.03 | mallum | koen: not for anyone else though |
| 14:03.16 | mallum | koen: would be incredably easy if used autotools |
| 14:04.29 | mallum | reenoo: I was banging on for ages about adding gpe to oe/oz |
| 14:05.43 | reenoo | mallum: I don't get your point really. everything gpe in OE is really dead simple |
| 14:05.50 | mallum | reenoo: people tried but failed or said they couldn't adhere to bk licensing restrictions |
| 14:06.19 | reenoo | the gpe.bbclass consists of merely 15 lines including whitespace |
| 14:06.21 | mallum | reenoo: sure now it is. |
| 14:06.33 | mallum | reenoo: but try and build it outside of oe |
| 14:06.42 | mallum | reenoo: its not checking for dependencies |
| 14:06.58 | koen | mallum: bk licensing as an excuse is bullshit, we have snapshots, cvs and a mailinglist |
| 14:07.00 | mallum | reenoo: autotooled software is so much easier to build and standardized |
| 14:07.18 | mallum | koen: thats the excuse pb used to use ... |
| 14:07.24 | koen | heh |
| 14:07.37 | reenoo | autotools don't help with resolving dependencies |
| 14:07.49 | reenoo | the configure will blow up and that's it |
| 14:08.19 | reenoo | don't get me wrong. the gpe apps I'm writing do use autotools |
| 14:08.34 | mallum | reenoo: so the configure will say 'cant find libxxx dependencie' or somesuch |
| 14:09.06 | mallum | reenoo: whils gpe, you type make and it blows up with loads of compiler errors as it trys non existant, other versioned deps |
| 14:09.19 | mallum | reenoo: what is better for someone building the software ? |
| 14:10.01 | reenoo | ok, makes sense |
| 14:10.14 | reenoo | but what does that have to do with adding gpe to garnome? |
| 14:10.47 | reenoo | all dependency info is readily available in the .bbs |
| 14:10.50 | mallum | you have to look at the source/Makefiles and figure out what the deps are the hardway |
| 14:11.12 | mallum | or you have to try and figure out bitbake in that case to figure out the deps |
| 14:11.17 | mallum | hardly inviting |
| 14:11.54 | koen | mallum: only OE in this case, but that's easy to say as an OE-user |
| 14:11.58 | mallum | also you miss all the standards for things like file install locations autotools give you ( eg like --prefix ) which garnome relys on a lot |
| 14:12.27 | mallum | thus adding gpe to garnome is a fuckload of work |
| 14:12.32 | reenoo | garnome makes a bunch of bad assumptions, yeah |
| 14:12.34 | mallum | when it should be |
| 14:12.39 | mallum | shouldn't be |
| 14:12.50 | reenoo | I'd say garnome is broken in that respect, but yeah |
| 14:12.59 | mallum | reenoo: thats crap |
| 14:13.03 | mallum | reenoo: come on |
| 14:13.10 | reenoo | it's not |
| 14:13.31 | mallum | reenoo: everything thing in garnome ( like *most* o/s software nowadays ) uses autotools |
| 14:13.33 | reenoo | try building on non-linux systems. it will blow up impressively |
| 14:13.58 | mallum | like windows ? |
| 14:14.07 | reenoo | solaris |
| 14:14.18 | mallum | heh, you want to run gpe on solaris ? |
| 14:14.34 | mallum | just try building on on netbsd for a start |
| 14:14.52 | reenoo | no, but we wanted to run gnome on the sun sponsored solaris boxes at linuxtag 2003 |
| 14:14.58 | mallum | Id be very suprised if gnome didn't build fine on solaris |
| 14:15.18 | mallum | considering SUN pretty heavily sponsor gnome and ship it |
| 14:16.13 | mallum | if you think GPE shouldn't use autotools because it wont build on solaris then I dont know what to say |
| 14:16.14 | reenoo | I was a bit surprised, too |
| 14:16.30 | reenoo | I'm not saying anything like that |
| 14:17.03 | mallum | well what are you arguing with me about then ? |
| 14:17.22 | reenoo | all I'm saying is that garnome should support building stuff with a simple "make && make install". if it doesn't it's broken as a build system |
| 14:17.44 | mallum | yes it does to a degree |
| 14:17.44 | reenoo | all gpe apps can be built that way |
| 14:17.53 | mallum | but its much more work to add something like that |
| 14:18.24 | koen | heh |
| 14:18.26 | mallum | heh |
| 14:18.32 | koen | pretty funny when you look at it |
| 14:19.08 | reenoo | look at the .bb's. there's no magic involved. most of them would work with nothing more than SRC_URI set |
| 14:19.08 | mallum | the point is, gpe is not in garnome cos its buildsystem is an abortion |
| 14:19.08 | koen | apparently every apps needs tweaks for $random_buildsystem |
| 14:19.11 | mallum | koen: right |
| 14:19.38 | reenoo | well. were are the tweaks for gpe then? |
| 14:19.50 | mallum | in oe ? |
| 14:19.50 | reenoo | there are none |
| 14:19.52 | koen | too bad a lot of buildsystems assume autotools/x86 |
| 14:19.58 | reenoo | in oe |
| 14:20.07 | mallum | why do we care about oe ? |
| 14:20.14 | mallum | for this argument ? |
| 14:20.21 | koen | becuase it works in OE |
| 14:20.36 | mallum | it still eaier to add an autotooled app to oe that one with a 'homebrew' makefile and no ./configure |
| 14:20.48 | reenoo | it isn't |
| 14:20.58 | mallum | ok |
| 14:21.00 | mallum | prove it |
| 14:21.09 | mallum | I will pick random app with just Makefile |
| 14:21.15 | mallum | you add a .bb for it |
| 14:21.25 | mallum | and I will add an .bb for an autotooled app |
| 14:21.31 | mallum | lets see who is first |
| 14:21.44 | reenoo | that comparison doesn't work |
| 14:21.54 | mallum | why ? |
| 14:21.54 | mallum | chicken |
| 14:22.55 | reenoo | pretty simple reason |
| 14:23.17 | mallum | which is ? |
| 14:23.24 | reenoo | you can screw up writing auto* input files just as bad as you can with Makefiles |
| 14:23.47 | mallum | um, how does that relate ? |
| 14:24.16 | mallum | if auto config files are broken then there broken and should be fixed |
| 14:24.28 | koen | mallum: try adding 'grass' to OE |
| 14:24.29 | *** join/#gpe pb_ (~pb@2002:3e03:42cc:2:20a:5eff:fe00:391e) |
| 14:24.29 | reenoo | same goes for makefiles |
| 14:24.45 | mallum | yes and ? |
| 14:24.50 | reenoo | nothing |
| 14:25.04 | koen | it will fail because they fucked up *.ac |
| 14:25.21 | koen | hey pb_ |
| 14:25.24 | reenoo | koen: it will fail because there is no .ac |
| 14:25.25 | mallum | koen: but that is there fault, get them to fic it |
| 14:25.53 | mallum | Im not advocating GPE adds broken .ac files |
| 14:25.58 | reenoo | koen: worst case is that they've edited the generated configure script and thrown the input files away |
| 14:26.01 | mallum | that would be crazy |
| 14:26.34 | pb_ | hi koen |
| 14:26.49 | mallum | reenoo: Im saying a non buggy autotooled software is easier to add to OE than homebrew Makefile |
| 14:26.52 | *** join/#gpe basiliscus (~dpatti@titanium.diit.unict.it) |
| 14:27.18 | mallum | reenoo: if autotooled stuff is broken its going to be a bitch anywhere its used |
| 14:27.50 | reenoo | mallum: and I'm saying a non-broken Makefile based package is as easy to add to OE as a non-broken autotoolized packages |
| 14:28.11 | reenoo | s/ges/ge/ |
| 14:28.26 | florian_kc | re |
| 14:28.35 | florian_kc | tigrux-lunch: hmmm not really |
| 14:28.46 | mallum | reenoo: I guess you need to define non broken Makefile |
| 14:28.48 | pb_ | florian_kc: good afternoon |
| 14:28.56 | mallum | reenoo: one that dont hardcode install paths |
| 14:29.05 | mallum | reenoo: ? |
| 14:29.55 | reenoo | mallum: the gpe makefiles in OE tend to work for me |
| 14:30.44 | reenoo | mallum: but you're right that it's rather unlikely to find a random hand crafted Makefile that's not broken |
| 14:30.47 | mallum | reenoo: Im not saying they dont |
| 14:31.23 | mallum | reenoo: but initially adding is more work that something that is autotooled because ultimatly you have to write a custom .bb, possibly patch Makefiles etc |
| 14:31.55 | mallum | reenoo: and to a degree that could be true with some autoconfed stuff too - but Id know what I would choose to spend my time packaging |
| 14:32.53 | mallum | reenoo: and the therefore the same applys to many other build systems |
| 14:33.27 | mallum | reenoo: they are very likely going to be easier to work with with autotools cos so much software nowadays uses it |
| 14:33.37 | reenoo | autotools are probably the most common build system |
| 14:33.38 | mallum | ( except gpe ) |
| 14:34.01 | mallum | it may not be the best but it is the most popular ( and likely by far ) |
| 14:34.12 | reenoo | right |
| 14:34.20 | mallum | and GNOME and most of gpe deps use it too |
| 14:35.02 | florian_kc | hi pb_ |
| 14:35.03 | reenoo | so, what do you want? GPE in garnome or all of gpe to be converted to autotools? |
| 14:35.12 | mallum | gpe just to use autotools |
| 14:35.28 | mallum | other stuff will just happen after that |
| 14:36.01 | mallum | because there will be much less of a barrier to adding to things like garnome, jhbuild etc |
| 14:36.34 | florian_kc | I'm still not convinced... the only way crosscompiling stuff doesn't become a major pain seems to be Scratchbox :-/ |
| 14:36.46 | koen | since garnome and jhbuild don't care about fixing themselves to support non autotooled stuff |
| 14:37.10 | mallum | florian_kc: you are seriously not convinced autotools is a better solution than custom Makefiles ? |
| 14:37.12 | koen | florian_kc: which requires a native box |
| 14:37.19 | reenoo | mallum: worthy goal, yeah. but good luck with finding someone to do that job |
| 14:37.28 | florian_kc | mallum: yes |
| 14:37.34 | mallum | reenoo: well if someones not found GPE will just die |
| 14:38.07 | florian_kc | koen: or qemu.... but right, i didn't say that's a perfect solution :-) |
| 14:38.15 | mallum | reenoo: and it will never become close to GNOME |
| 14:38.42 | reenoo | florian_kc: last time I checked qemu was broken |
| 14:38.49 | mallum | florian_kc: I think you have that view because you simply do not understand autotools |
| 14:38.51 | reenoo | florian_kc: qemu-arm that is |
| 14:39.05 | mallum | florian_kc: I mean come on, all of GPE deps use autotools, GNOME use autotools |
| 14:39.21 | mallum | florian_kc: should they be using custom Makefiles as well ? |
| 14:39.36 | florian_kc | mallum: i remember you intended to create example autotools for a gpe app :-) |
| 14:40.24 | florian_kc | mallum: that's possible - but 95% of the developers don't understand it. that's why using it is not better than hardcoded makefiles. |
| 14:40.28 | reenoo | florian_kc: look at the autofoo patches I've written for a few xapps in OE |
| 14:40.46 | mallum | florian_kc: look here http://svn.o-hand.com/view/matchbox/trunk/, lots of exmaples |
| 14:40.58 | mallum | florian_kc: all GNOME devs understand it |
| 14:40.59 | reenoo | florian_kc: I'd say it's time for 95% of developers to read the autotools manualy |
| 14:41.04 | reenoo | manuals even |
| 14:41.08 | koen | so in short it's more a matter of lack off time than religious objections to autofoo |
| 14:41.23 | mallum | koen: who knows |
| 14:41.29 | reenoo | koen: for me yeah. not sure about florian_kc |
| 14:41.33 | reenoo | ;) |
| 14:41.40 | florian_kc | mallum: crosscompiling os most gnome stuff is a major pain... if they would really understand it it just worked. |
| 14:41.44 | mallum | koen: but if people like nils and florian dont push it and accept it, no ones really going to try |
| 14:41.54 | mallum | florian_kc: x-compiling is a major pain full stop |
| 14:41.56 | Cwiiis | Anjuta is quite a nice IDE, makes using autotools a snap - if anyone's interested |
| 14:42.16 | florian_kc | Cwiiis: that's the theory... |
| 14:42.25 | reenoo | Cwiiis: the stuff anjuta generates is the worst autofoo breakage I've ever seen |
| 14:42.31 | florian_kc | koen: that's true... |
| 14:42.33 | mallum | reenoo: heh |
| 14:42.44 | florian_kc | reenoo: yes, it uses autoproject iirc. |
| 14:42.54 | reenoo | florian_kc: whatever it uses is broken |
| 14:42.56 | reenoo | badly |
| 14:43.13 | mallum | autotools is not difficult |
| 14:43.15 | Cwiiis | reenoo: Really? Seems ok to me... |
| 14:43.25 | florian_kc | Anjuta is very nice... but _nerver_ try to use it for autotools! |
| 14:43.25 | reenoo | Cwiiis: it isn't |
| 14:43.33 | reenoo | florian_kc: right |
| 14:44.01 | koen | florian_kc: can you kick nils to publish his super-secret gpe roadmap? |
| 14:44.09 | reenoo | heh |
| 14:44.16 | Cwiiis | Maybe for bigger projects or something? I've compared the files it generates to some of the autotools stuff in the Gnome project and it seems to conform... |
| 14:44.29 | mallum | koen: yeah |
| 14:44.31 | florian_kc | mallum: but koen is right... it is mostly lack of time. pb_ e.g. used autotools for latest gpe libraries. |
| 14:45.02 | mallum | florian_kc: but you are a key dev and you just said you are not convinced it is better than homebrew makefiles |
| 14:45.09 | reenoo | Cwiiis: it's broken. period. |
| 14:45.18 | Cwiiis | Fair enough |
| 14:45.23 | florian_kc | Cwiiis: right... you found the bad side of the autotools story. most stuff around is _bad_. |
| 14:45.36 | mallum | florian_kc: not if done right |
| 14:45.45 | reenoo | florian_kc: that's not the fault of autotools |
| 14:45.58 | mallum | florian_kc: and with recent versions its much better |
| 14:46.39 | florian_kc | mallum: i didn't say it is impossible, but it involves a large investment of time not only to make it but to make it good. |
| 14:47.18 | mallum | florian_kc: but the more you go on creating software without autotools the worse the problem gets |
| 14:48.16 | mallum | florian_kc: I would think its almost worth creating a seprate repo and rebuilding gpe piece by piece making sure each piece is done well |
| 14:48.16 | florian_kc | mallum: well... if you have it working for one app it is easy to adapt to the next. |
| 14:48.48 | florian_kc | mallum: nice idea... would you send me a package of time? ;-) |
| 14:49.14 | mallum | florian_kc: Im waiting for Nils list |
| 14:49.23 | mallum | florian_kc: and to see his plans |
| 14:49.34 | mallum | florian_kc: then I will help out |
| 14:50.02 | mallum | florian_kc: but atm things are in such a mess I dont see any point |
| 14:50.18 | florian_kc | mallum: okay, i'll discuss this with him this week... |
| 14:50.48 | mallum | if nils posts some kind of sort gpe out plan then people can start working on it |
| 14:51.13 | mallum | but Im worried nils is not bothered by it |
| 14:52.18 | mallum | somebody has to lead the project |
| 14:52.32 | koen | having gpe in all sorts of build systems (garnome,jh,portage, etc) would be very nice |
| 14:52.39 | reenoo | mallum: if a "large-scale" autotools conversion is taking place I'll probably join. |
| 14:52.40 | mallum | koen: right and attract more devs |
| 14:52.41 | florian_kc | mallum: That's not the point... if Nils wouldn't do it i would do it. Currently it is mostly a lack of time... need to recover from some project with bad financial influence on us. |
| 14:54.01 | reenoo | mallum: the point being that I've spent most of the past year fixing all sorts of build systems. I want to write apps now :) |
| 14:54.23 | mallum | reenoo: :) |
| 14:56.01 | mallum | florian_kc: if nils dont have the time, he should maybe consider finding someone else with the time |
| 14:56.09 | reenoo | florian_kc: think it would help if I released a gpe app that properly uses autotools for its build system? |
| 14:56.30 | mallum | reenoo: I think it would |
| 14:57.33 | mallum | http://www.mozillazine.org/talkback.html?article=6191 |
| 14:59.19 | reenoo | mallum: ok, I'm still writing on a report that's due next tuesday. I hope to finish the app (don't want to release an only partly functional version) by the end of next week |
| 14:59.34 | mallum | reenoo: cool |
| 14:59.56 | florian_kc | reenoo: yes, it hink that would be useful. |
| 15:00.13 | florian_kc | reenoo: cool! |
| 15:00.26 | koen | mallum: http://www.mozilla.org/projects/minimo/ |
| 15:01.07 | mallum | koen: there is nothing new there though ? |
| 15:01.46 | koen | that announced the CE a while ago |
| 15:02.10 | mallum | koen: yeah but that link I sent had screenshots |
| 15:02.24 | koen | it has :) |
| 15:03.23 | mallum | koen: on CE ? |
| 15:03.46 | koen | yes |
| 15:04.01 | mallum | koen: where ? |
| 15:04.27 | mallum | koen: oh ignor eme |
| 15:04.27 | koen | you mean CE or ppc2003? |
| 15:04.32 | mallum | koen: ignore me |
| 15:04.35 | koen | heh |
| 15:04.37 | mallum | koen: I am full of crap |
| 15:04.38 | mallum | ;) |
| 15:05.49 | mallum | does somebody want to fix mb-applet-wireless ? |
| 15:05.59 | mallum | it has kergoths patches but it dont work prroperly |
| 15:06.06 | mallum | and iwlib is crack |
| 15:08.07 | koen | heh |
| 15:08.31 | koen | reenoo: libz wasn't the cause for the opie breakage (at least, so it seems) |
| 15:08.54 | reenoo | koen: yeah, I've seen that |
| 15:10.13 | koen | I'm hoping that the sync with the OZ release schedule will prevent this kind of situations |
| 15:15.59 | pb_ | florian_kc: enjoy |
| 15:21.31 | Cwiiis | off to uni... |
| 16:01.20 | *** join/#gpe rdwtux_ (~rdwtux@CPE00105ae3e472-CM000f9f7f1eda.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 16:01.23 | *** join/#gpe Cwiiis[uni] (~cil103@flora.ecs.soton.ac.uk) |
| 16:05.57 | *** join/#gpe jg (~jg@192.208.47.142) |
| 16:15.33 | rdwtux_ | hi all |
| 16:15.42 | koen | hey rdwtux_ |
| 16:19.13 | rdwtux_ | hows it going? |
| 16:19.46 | rdwtux_ | got a question (like everyone else on here) I have a zauruz 860... had problems with gpe with keymaps, etc with 3.5.2.. are they fixed in the updates? |
| 16:20.14 | koen | it should be |
| 16:20.29 | koen | the keymaps works on my sl-c700 |
| 16:20.59 | rdwtux_ | i tried it about 2 months ago 3.5.2 and I couldn't even do a | (pipe) so was having tons of probs.. i know I can add my own using another distro, etc.. but haven't had a chance |
| 16:22.02 | rdwtux_ | kewl... i'm going to download and do the updates.. but forgot my power supply at work ;( |
| 16:22.39 | koen | /etc/X11 should have the right keymaps |
| 16:22.48 | koen | I think it's called shepherd.xmodmap |
| 16:23.33 | rdwtux_ | u'r running gpe w/openzaurus? |
| 16:23.47 | koen | yes |
| 16:23.49 | rdwtux_ | k |
| 16:24.06 | koen | a 3.5.3 snapshot from a while ago |
| 16:24.24 | rdwtux_ | where are the snapshots? nothin the /official/snapshot dir |
| 16:24.25 | koen | with kernel 2.6 :) |
| 16:24.30 | rdwtux_ | 2.6? wow |
| 16:24.34 | koen | I compiled my own |
| 16:24.40 | rdwtux_ | OohH |
| 16:24.55 | koen | 2.6 isn't really useably |
| 16:25.11 | koen | most stuff works, but 2.4 is a bit better |
| 16:25.16 | koen | especially when suspending |
| 16:26.48 | rdwtux_ | has there been any work on multisync w/gpe? i know it was alpha a while back... is it workable day to day? |
| 16:27.11 | koen | the gpe plugin is in multisync cvs now |
| 16:27.38 | rdwtux_ | multisync seems to have gone "opensync" or something after 0.82 i guess gpe will be included? |
| 16:28.04 | koen | opensync is a branch, and the gpe plugin is not in yet |
| 16:28.26 | rdwtux_ | ahh... sorry for all the questions.. just always curious ;) |
| 16:28.32 | koen | no problem |
| 17:00.01 | *** join/#gpe mallum (~mallum@host81-156-158-146.range81-156.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:15.54 | *** join/#gpe Timelord0 (~TL@64-147-65-151.access-4.intertex.net) |
| 17:44.34 | *** join/#gpe deeje^ (deeje2@user-4867.lns6-c8.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 18:22.27 | *** join/#gpe aboeglin (~aboeglin@213.154.86.29) |
| 18:34.47 | *** join/#gpe TyggerBob (~myname@64.26.144.98) |
| 18:35.42 | *** join/#gpe zap (~zap@217.170.93.196) |
| 18:36.13 | *** join/#gpe RockClimber (~Philip@spud.chem.ox.ac.uk) |
| 18:36.21 | RockClimber | website update is good |
| 18:36.51 | TyggerBob | re |
| 18:37.41 | RockClimber | what's "re" |
| 18:37.59 | TyggerBob | it's lazy for Hi again |
| 18:38.03 | reenoo | hey TyggerBob |
| 18:38.05 | *** join/#gpe pb__ (~pb@2002:5168:d330:1:a00:1fff:fe06:93c) |
| 18:38.11 | TyggerBob | Hi pb_ |
| 18:38.27 | TyggerBob | Hi pb_Heya reenoo |
| 18:38.30 | TyggerBob | oops |
| 18:38.36 | pb__ | hi TyggerBob |
| 18:39.09 | pb__ | heh |
| 18:39.15 | pb__ | looks like I left myself logged on at the office again |
| 18:39.40 | pb__ | and my VPN seems to be broken for some reason |
| 18:40.08 | pb__ | ah, the old racoon crash. I wish I knew why that happens. |
| 18:42.54 | RockClimber | is there a simple text editor for GPE? and if not, is gedit a possible candidate? |
| 18:43.27 | reenoo | gpe-edit |
| 18:45.17 | TyggerBob | So, it's back to the hospital for Curtis' rescheduled appointment tomorrow |
| 18:45.39 | pb__ | ah, right |
| 18:45.43 | pb__ | hope you have better luck this time |
| 18:46.40 | *** join/#gpe amd (~amd@ip163.cab52.mus.starman.ee) |
| 18:47.51 | *** join/#gpe Timelord (~TL@64-147-65-126.access-3.intertex.net) |
| 18:48.25 | reenoo | TyggerBob: good luck |
| 18:55.07 | *** part/#gpe RockClimber (~Philip@spud.chem.ox.ac.uk) |
| 18:55.18 | pb__ | drat. one of the headlights is out on my car, and the darn retaining screw is rusted so I can't get to the bulb to replace it. |
| 18:58.56 | TyggerBob | back.. boss called. |
| 18:58.59 | TyggerBob | thanks guys.. |
| 18:59.14 | TyggerBob | I just have to keep in mind that it's a simple procedure that they do every day :) |
| 19:02.11 | *** join/#gpe pb___ (~pb@2002:3e03:42cc:2:20a:5eff:fe00:391e) |
| 19:09.17 | TyggerBob_______ | hehehe |
| 19:22.23 | rdwtux_ | pb yer ip6? |
| 19:27.07 | *** join/#gpe rdwtux (~rdwtux@CPE00105ae3e472-CM000f9f7f1eda.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 19:27.13 | *** part/#gpe rdwtux (~rdwtux@CPE00105ae3e472-CM000f9f7f1eda.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 19:32.50 | *** join/#gpe dc_ (~dctanner@81-86-83-164.dsl.pipex.com) |
| 19:33.04 | dc_ | evening |
| 19:33.30 | dc_ | hey pb_ pb___ |
| 19:34.04 | pb_ | hey dc_ |
| 19:34.29 | dc_ | hehe |
| 19:34.51 | pb_ | I tried killing him off, but he just came back again with more underscores. |
| 19:35.00 | pb_ | I'm scared to try that again. |
| 19:35.16 | dc_ | indeed... |
| 19:35.19 | dc_ | mutated tail |
| 19:35.28 | pb_ | yeah |
| 19:37.16 | dc_ | hrm |
| 19:37.26 | dc_ | what would FAT16 be know as to mount? |
| 19:37.37 | mjg59 | fat or vfat |
| 19:37.53 | dc_ | hrm. pb_ was fat16 included in the kernel? |
| 19:39.03 | pb_ | dunno |
| 19:39.08 | pb_ | let me try to find out |
| 19:39.40 | pb_ | CONFIG_FAT_FS=y |
| 19:39.40 | pb_ | CONFIG_MSDOS_FS=y |
| 19:39.43 | pb_ | so, yes |
| 19:40.30 | mjg59 | dc_: /proc/filesystems will tell you what's supported. |
| 19:41.28 | dc_ | my oh my. |
| 19:41.43 | dc_ | it seems linux is the only OS which can access my transflash card. |
| 19:42.19 | dc_ | oh. no. :/ |
| 19:42.40 | dc_ | still more buffer i/o errors. |
| 19:42.41 | dc_ | hrm |
| 19:45.16 | koen | re |
| 19:45.24 | dc_ | hey koen |
| 19:45.29 | koen | hey dc_ |
| 19:46.08 | dc_ | how's it going? |
| 19:46.33 | koen | pretty well |
| 19:46.44 | koen | apart from all the deadlines |
| 19:47.07 | dc_ | ahhh |
| 19:48.34 | *** join/#gpe aboeglin (~aboeglin@213.154.79.4) |
| 19:51.39 | dc_ | I think my cheapo usb card reader is dud. |
| 19:51.52 | dc_ | it doesn't seem to like writing to the transflash card. |
| 19:51.55 | dc_ | what a pain./ |
| 19:55.45 | *** join/#gpe Timelord (~TL@64-147-65-126.access-3.intertex.net) |
| 19:56.36 | pb_ | oh dear |
| 19:56.47 | pb_ | I have an SD card reader like that. I never managed to make it work reliably. |
| 19:58.02 | dc_ | well I hope it's the reader and not the transflash card. |
| 19:58.33 | dc_ | bluetooth is so painfully slow |
| 20:00.17 | dc_ | guess I should buy a branded SD-PCMCIA adapter |
| 20:00.58 | koen | I'm still looking for a place that sells the sd-cf adapter |
| 20:01.18 | koen | which would fit in my cf-pmcia adapter |
| 20:01.20 | dc_ | I wonder if SD-CF-PCMCIA would work :) |
| 20:01.30 | dc_ | indeed. |
| 20:01.41 | dc_ | TF-SD-CF-PCMCIA even; |
| 20:01.42 | dc_ | hehe |
| 20:02.55 | pb_ | hm, looks like upgrading racoon on my firewall was a bad plan |
| 20:02.56 | pb_ | oh well |
| 20:20.14 | *** join/#gpe florian (~fuchs@p5086336B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:20.15 | *** join/#gpe nilsf (~nils@p5086336B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:20.18 | nilsf | Hi! |
| 20:20.47 | koen | hey nilsf & florian |
| 20:21.00 | nilsf | Hi from Hannover ;) |
| 20:21.09 | florian | hi all |
| 20:21.49 | nilsf | mallum: I heard you had some complaints ;) ? |
| 20:26.27 | pb_ | hi nilsf |
| 20:26.28 | pb_ | hi florian |
| 20:27.16 | nilsf | pb_: Hi! |
| 20:27.33 | nilsf | pb_: Oh, BTW: When do you come to Hannover? We will only have the GPE demo point until saturday and not the whole week ... some "misunderstanding"... |
| 20:28.02 | pb_ | nilsf: I will be arriving on Sunday at about 14:00, so I guess I will miss the GPE demo point. That's too bad. |
| 20:28.31 | pb_ | I'm flying back to England late on Tuesday evening. |
| 20:31.50 | florian | pb_: hah, that you need to find out more about the Integral running Linux ;-) |
| 20:32.54 | pb_ | florian: heh |
| 20:38.27 | *** join/#gpe arielMx (~ariel@proxyle02.ext.ti.com) |
| 20:39.11 | nilsf | pb_: Will you stay in Hannover or in Berlin again? I ask because we could have some dinner one night... |
| 20:39.47 | nilsf | pb_: Florian and Ole will be here all week, I will leave on tuesday, I guess. |
| 20:39.56 | pb_ | nilsf: I'm staying in Hannover this year. |
| 20:40.08 | nilsf | pb_: :) |
| 20:40.42 | nilsf | pb_: If we find it again, there was some nice tex/mex restaurant in the inner city, not too expensive, espcially concerning CeBit time. |
| 20:40.57 | pb_ | so, yes, absolutely. Dinner on either Sunday night or Monday night would be great. |
| 20:41.35 | *** join/#gpe rob_w (~roboo@p83.129.217.252.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 20:42.00 | nilsf | pb_: Cool! |
| 20:42.19 | rob_w | hello room |
| 20:42.36 | koen | hey rob_w |
| 20:45.20 | rob_w | koen: sir |
| 20:45.47 | rob_w | koen: your irc presents is quite amazing |
| 20:46.06 | koen | rob_w: 24/7 server + laptop |
| 20:46.40 | koen | and I'm still in report season... |
| 20:46.40 | rob_w | that sounds like a full time hobby ;-) |
| 20:50.36 | nilsf | pb_: Like a little reading? I wrote up a draft for a release management proposal for GPE... TBD |
| 20:51.19 | pb_ | nilsf: sure. would you like to mail it to me? |
| 20:52.37 | pb_ | nilsf: I don't think dcc works through my firewall. |
| 20:52.47 | nilsf | pb_: Ah, OK, email then ;) |
| 20:53.27 | pb_ | I should fix that, I guess. I think I just need to install the irc connection tracking module. |
| 20:54.41 | reenoo | hey nilsf |
| 20:54.47 | reenoo | wb, florian |
| 20:54.51 | florian | hi reenoo |
| 20:54.51 | reenoo | hi rob_w |
| 20:55.58 | rob_w | hi there |
| 20:56.21 | rob_w | pb_: what is that module doing ? |
| 20:57.05 | pb_ | bbiab |
| 21:01.26 | nilsf | reenoo: Hi! |
| 21:18.52 | koen | nilsf: could you mail me a copy of the proposal too? |
| 21:23.23 | nilsf | koen: Sure! |
| 21:23.34 | koen | thanks |
| 21:24.19 | nilsf | koen: Coming! |
| 21:24.34 | koen | great! |
| 21:26.13 | koen | nilsf: received |
| 21:26.38 | nilsf | koen: :) That's *multi* media ;) |
| 21:27.43 | koen | :) |
| 21:32.24 | rob_w | ok .. cu guys .. new gnome looks even sweeter ! |
| 21:32.36 | koen | heh |
| 21:33.03 | koen | metacity annoyed the crap out of me, so /me is back to E16 :) |
| 21:34.02 | reenoo | is it that hard-wired into gnome nowadays? |
| 21:34.21 | koen | you need to use gconf-editer to change wm |
| 21:34.25 | reenoo | I used to run gnome with waimea as the WM |
| 21:34.38 | koen | or I'm not looking hard enough in the config panel |
| 21:35.52 | reenoo | er, I don't expect to find _any option like that_ in the gui |
| 21:36.49 | koen | it used to have one |
| 21:46.11 | reenoo | ~stab evolution |
| 21:46.13 | ibot | ACTION runs at evolution with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut. |
| 21:46.23 | koen | heh |
| 21:53.02 | *** join/#gpe TyggerBob (~myname@CPE00045a265f64-CM000f9f7c58fa.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 21:53.12 | koen | hey TyggerBob |
| 21:53.31 | TyggerBob | HI koen |
| 21:55.34 | *** join/#gpe flypiper (~ISP-1@12-202-234-207.client.insightBB.com) |
| 22:06.08 | reenoo | hrm, my neck hurts again. can't get anything done :/ |
| 22:06.25 | reenoo | ~lart car accidents |
| 22:06.37 | reenoo | ibot: that's yet another lame lart |
| 22:06.49 | reenoo | ~herring ibot |
| 22:06.52 | ibot | ACTION whacks ibot on the side of the head with a large red herring named alfred |
| 22:06.53 | florian | reenoo: :-/ |
| 22:19.00 | philippe | evening all. Is this also a good spot to ask a matchbox related question? |
| 22:19.21 | koen | nilsf: I left out syncing with a desktop out, but thats important too :) |
| 22:19.25 | koen | hey philippe |
| 22:19.34 | philippe | hey koen |
| 22:20.33 | philippe | I would like to have a program only starting a single instance for GPE, but I cannot find more info about _MB_CLIENT_EXEC_MAP. (And cannot find it in the header files I have for matchbox on my system) |
| 22:22.46 | nilsf | koen: Perfect! I'll work it through tomorrow... |
| 22:23.03 | florian | philippe: That should be easier... you want to allow only one instance of an app? |
| 22:23.28 | mallum | philippe: http://projects.o-hand.com/matchbox/documentation/developers/matchbox-key.txt |
| 22:25.10 | philippe | mallum : that is the one I am looking at.... It says it can be used for it, but I cannot find anything mnore descriptive, nor code for it. |
| 22:25.40 | pb_ | philippe: I think there is some code in libgpelaunch. |
| 22:26.22 | philippe | florian : Indeed only one instance. If you start the application for a second It should communicate some info to the existing instance and quit. |
| 22:26.41 | philippe | pb_ : thanks that might be an idea. I'll look into it. |
| 22:26.57 | mallum | philippe: and libmatchbox |
| 22:27.33 | mallum | philippe: iirc its just something like binary-name:winid, binary-name:winid .... pretty simple |
| 22:28.28 | florian | ah okay |
| 22:28.44 | philippe | mallum : ok thanks. I will start digging more then.. |
| 22:28.57 | mallum | philippe: there is a call in libmatchbox which will do what you want |
| 22:29.23 | mallum | philippe: http://projects.o-hand.com/matchbox/documentation/developers/api/group__util.html#ga1 |
| 22:30.22 | mallum | philippe: if your app is gtk2 and has singleinstance: true in its .desktop file, it should just work |
| 22:30.57 | florian | ah right.. that was the easy way :-) |
| 22:31.47 | reenoo | I'm off to bed. 'night all |
| 22:32.01 | florian | reenoo: goodnight |
| 22:32.11 | mallum | night reenoo |
| 22:32.17 | philippe | mallum : Ok that seems to be what I need. It is gtk2, but is the first time I am actually doing something gtk and X related..So I'll have to dig around for .desktop too... But I am learning a lot now :-) |
| 22:32.19 | nilsf | g'night! |
| 22:32.23 | philippe | goodnight |
| 22:32.58 | mallum | nilsf: always complaing ;) |
| 22:32.58 | philippe | mallum : Anyway the api calls seem to be what I need, if .desktop is too limited for me. |
| 22:33.23 | nilsf | mallum: Guessed so... :) |
| 22:33.29 | mallum | nilsf: :) |
| 22:33.42 | mallum | nilsf: when are you going to post your secret list ? |
| 22:34.04 | mallum | nilsf: are you physically near florian atm ? |
| 22:34.04 | nilsf | mallum: Secret list? |
| 22:34.12 | mallum | nilsf: joke. |
| 22:34.18 | nilsf | mallum: Yes, he is oppsite me at the table... |
| 22:34.39 | mallum | nilsf: slap him for still prefering raw Makeifles to autotools ;) |
| 22:34.48 | mallum | nilsf: thanks |
| 22:34.58 | nilsf | mallum: No, I won't ;) |
| 22:35.23 | nilsf | mallum: At least not until you have converted at least several GPE projects to autotools successfully. |
| 22:35.38 | mallum | nilsf: ha |
| 22:35.57 | nilsf | mallum: Not a good deal ;) ? |
| 22:36.03 | florian | ~guinness nilsf |
| 22:36.05 | ibot | ACTION pours a creamy pint of dark bitter guinness stout and hands it to nilsf |
| 22:36.05 | mallum | nilsf: look matchbox is all converted, so is GNOME, X, gtk etc etc |
| 22:36.14 | mallum | ~slap florian |
| 22:36.16 | ibot | ACTION slaps florian, keep your grubby fingers to yourself! |
| 22:36.29 | mallum | thanks ibot |
| 22:36.34 | florian | ~herring mallum |
| 22:36.37 | ibot | ACTION whacks mallum on the side of the head with a large red herring named alfred |
| 22:36.59 | mallum | ~lart florian for cheekyness |
| 22:38.09 | florian | Is there a manual for ibot? ;-) |
| 22:38.29 | nilsf | man ~ibot ? |
| 22:38.36 | nilsf | ~ibot man? |
| 22:38.37 | ibot | methinks man is Displays the manual page for that given command or resource (that is, any system utility that isn't a command, such as a library function. Syntax: man (command). Where command is the name of the command or resource to get help on. Example: man ls gives help on the ls command. |
| 22:38.46 | mallum | nilsf: the only thing I could never figure out how to convert to autotools with GPE was the .po stuff and debian packaging stuff |
| 22:39.27 | nilsf | mallum: Hmm... all other parts worked? |
| 22:40.08 | mallum | yeah easy |
| 22:40.25 | nilsf | Hmm... with proper cross compiling? |
| 22:41.42 | mallum | nilsf: define 'proper' x-compiling |
| 22:41.53 | mallum | nilsf: does it cross compile easily now |
| 22:42.26 | mallum | nilsf: or more improtant does it native compile easily without one know all deps and required dep version etc learnt by hunting through makefiles |
| 22:43.04 | florian | mallum: proper working crosscompiling is if you don't need Scratchbox ;-) |
| 22:43.49 | mallum | florian: well first you have to cross compile all gpe deps, and since they all use autotools the argument goes to /dev/null |
| 22:44.07 | florian | mallum: use the sdk |
| 22:45.08 | mallum | florian: I shouldn't have to |
| 22:45.26 | mallum | florian: I dont have to download an sdk when I build for gnome or whatever |
| 22:45.50 | mallum | florian: x-compiling will always be a pain whatever - thats why things like scratchbox and oe exist |
| 22:45.59 | nilsf | mallum: Yes, I see the point, but also you might get into trouble when after native builds trying to build for ARM. |
| 22:46.17 | nilsf | mallum: So the question is if your autoconf setup also works if in a cross dev environment. |
| 22:46.50 | mallum | nilsf: yes |
| 22:46.56 | mallum | nilsf: matchbox was in oe long before gpe |
| 22:47.21 | mallum | nilsf: because no one could easily add gpe to oe as it is such a non standard build |
| 22:47.21 | florian | mallum: but adding a new gpe app it pretty easy |
| 22:47.29 | mallum | florian: now it is |
| 22:47.29 | nilsf | mallum: OE has several tweak AFAIK to circumvent autotool problems... |
| 22:47.47 | mallum | nilsf: yeah and several to circuvent gpe makefiles |
| 22:48.07 | florian | mallum: i remember all this gtkmm stuff... that's a major pain. |
| 22:48.32 | mallum | nilsf, florian : saying autotool apps wont x-compile is not a good excuse |
| 22:49.05 | mallum | things like scratch and oe exist now which make that much less of a problem |
| 22:49.28 | mallum | come on all your deps use autotools !!!! |
| 22:50.26 | mallum | its totally INSANE not to use it |
| 22:50.30 | florian | mallum: yes... we know and i think it won't get worse using autotools. but currently it is mostly a matter of time. |
| 22:50.31 | mallum | its not a kernel |
| 22:50.32 | nilsf | mallum: Hey hey... nor problem... but I also do want to exchange one plague with another. |
| 22:51.30 | mallum | Im not saying do it tommorow, but it some reasonable timeframe - e.g for GPE 3.0 all apps autotooled |
| 22:51.34 | nilsf | mallum: Autotools *can* handle cross bulding quite perfectly. It is just an art to master it poperly. What I wanted to ask indirectly now directly is if you mastered it. |
| 22:51.43 | mallum | florian: you are keeping the doc in the headers/source now right > |
| 22:51.47 | pb_ | florian: excellent! |
| 22:52.22 | florian | mallum: no... it would be possible but i personally do it in exernal files. |
| 22:52.33 | mallum | florian: arggggggggggggggggggggggg |
| 22:52.51 | mallum | florian: it will get out of sync soooooo easily |
| 22:52.58 | mallum | florian: put it in the HEADERS |
| 22:53.49 | florian | mallum: gtk doc handles this pretty well... it works really nice in gtk and gnome. imho they don't have all of their doc in the headers. |
| 22:53.55 | mallum | florian: that way also I can just look in the headers for docs, I dont need to run devhelp, gtk doc etc |
| 22:53.59 | mallum | florian: sure they dont |
| 22:54.45 | mallum | florian: gtk does ( in source files ) |
| 22:55.06 | florian | mallum: i started to do it in this way in libgpewidget... i think the next library i'll document in the source. |
| 22:55.39 | mallum | florian: just add what you've done to the headers/source , its only cut and paste :) |
| 22:56.07 | florian | mallum: *gnaa* |
| 22:56.13 | nilsf | mallum: And then you have two files to maintain, even greater risk of getting ot of sync. |
| 22:56.22 | mallum | nilsf: uh ? |
| 22:56.37 | mallum | nilsf: dont you maintain your header or sourcefiles then ? |
| 22:56.52 | nilsf | mallum: source/header + external file = two files? |
| 22:56.53 | mallum | nilsf: I mean header or source not both |
| 22:57.04 | mallum | nilsf: thats what florian is doing |
| 22:57.09 | florian | heh |
| 22:57.12 | mallum | nilsf: putting in external files ;) |
| 22:57.21 | nilsf | mallum: I had the impression he wanted to keep it hat way ... |
| 22:57.26 | florian | he really said "cut" :-) |
| 22:57.39 | mallum | nilsf: no drop that way |
| 22:57.42 | mallum | nilsf: its crazy |
| 22:57.52 | mallum | nilsf: it will just get out of sync |
| 22:58.00 | mallum | nilsf: and the docs are less accessible |
| 22:58.34 | florian | mallum: ah quiet... pb_ maintains libgpewidget and will make sure it doesn't get out of sync :-) |
| 22:58.58 | mallum | florian: he is writing docs too then ? |
| 22:59.19 | pb_ | ~herring florian |
| 22:59.21 | ibot | ACTION whacks florian on the side of the head with a large red herring named alfred |
| 22:59.51 | florian | mallum: not currently, but i'm convinced he'll keep it up to date as soon he changes anything :-) |
| 22:59.52 | dc_ | poor alfred. |
| 22:59.53 | florian | *gg* |
| 22:59.55 | mallum | florian: see even pb_ agrees with me, I must be right ! |
| 23:00.02 | pb_ | ah, whoops |
| 23:00.41 | pb_ | florian: heh, true. it does seem that my approach to "maintaining" libgpewidget lately has been one of benign neglect. |
| 23:01.02 | mallum | is libgpewidget even needed anymore ? |
| 23:01.06 | pb_ | it seems to be getting along just fine without me, though, so everyone is happy. |
| 23:01.26 | nilsf | mallum: I guess so ... at least the clock widget is still in there... |
| 23:01.35 | mallum | nilsf: only one app uses the clock widget |
| 23:01.42 | mallum | afaik ? |
| 23:01.44 | nilsf | mallum: At least two... |
| 23:02.01 | pb_ | probably four or five in total. |
| 23:02.07 | nilsf | mallum: It is the watch (hit me baby, yes) and the time/date setup. |
| 23:02.16 | mallum | maybe it should be libgpeclockwidget then |
| 23:02.17 | pb_ | calendar, todo, contacts, watch, gpe-conf, gpe-clock |
| 23:02.27 | pb_ | maybe not contacts, actually |
| 23:02.30 | nilsf | pb_: Yes, thanks. |
| 23:02.42 | mallum | the clock is the thing with the render'd arms ? |
| 23:02.50 | nilsf | mallum: Yep. |
| 23:03.05 | pb_ | yeah, which is part of the time selector combo-box thing |
| 23:03.12 | dc_ | hehe |
| 23:03.13 | nilsf | Quite nice... I like it. |
| 23:03.20 | dc_ | with that lovely day/night image I made :) |
| 23:03.24 | pb_ | which, in turn, is used by more or less every program that needs to get a time from the user |
| 23:03.24 | dc_ | (iirc) |
| 23:03.28 | mallum | is it themeable ? |
| 23:03.28 | nilsf | dc_: Indeed! |
| 23:03.28 | pb_ | dc_: heh, right |
| 23:03.46 | pb_ | no, it isn't themeable at the moment. |
| 23:03.46 | dc_ | mallum: time just wouldn't be the same without it. |
| 23:03.54 | nilsf | mallum: Not really... but it should be easy to add. |
| 23:03.57 | pb_ | patches for that are welcome, of course. |
| 23:04.10 | mallum | I would patch it to /dev/null |
| 23:04.12 | mallum | MUHAHAHAHA |
| 23:04.18 | pb_ | those patches are less welcome |
| 23:04.40 | nilsf | Could it be redone with Cairo and then be resizable? |
| 23:04.49 | pb_ | nilsf: it already uses Cairo |
| 23:04.52 | dc_ | oh oh. |
| 23:04.56 | mallum | oh god |
| 23:05.01 | dc_ | then we could have a fullscreen clock screensaver. |
| 23:05.07 | pb_ | dc_: heh |
| 23:05.09 | nilsf | dc_: Yes!!! |
| 23:05.21 | pb_ | nilsf: and, in fact, it's already resizeable. |
| 23:05.39 | pb_ | (except that you can't use dc_'s very fine image at anything other than the default size) |
| 23:05.39 | mallum | jesus |
| 23:05.46 | nilsf | Whereas I do not like the title "screensaver" that much since it is pretty usefless on a TFT but it seems to have become a synonym for eyecandy. |
| 23:05.56 | nilsf | pb_: It is??? |
| 23:06.03 | mallum | KILL IT |
| 23:06.10 | dc_ | nilsf: m. true. |
| 23:06.10 | mallum | KILL KILL KILL |
| 23:06.11 | nilsf | pb_: But it defaults to a fixed size... |
| 23:06.26 | pb_ | nilsf: well, it defaults to the... default size. |
| 23:06.27 | dc_ | restrain that man. |
| 23:06.31 | mallum | KILL IT ALREADY |
| 23:06.56 | pb_ | nilsf: you can change the size with some kind of gpe_clock_face_set_radius() kind of function. |
| 23:07.04 | mallum | is the cursed clock really so pretty it means gpe is dependant on some random checkout date of Cario ? |
| 23:07.10 | nilsf | pb_: Ah, cool, that's new to me! |
| 23:07.12 | pb_ | oh, or did you mean interactively resizeable by dragging? it can't do that. |
| 23:07.19 | dc_ | so I guess we need an svg image then? |
| 23:07.23 | pb_ | not that it would be terribly hard to add, but still. |
| 23:07.24 | pb_ | dc_: yeah |
| 23:07.32 | nilsf | pb_: Must update the watch to use full screen - tomorrow maybe;) If our booth is too boring... |
| 23:07.40 | pb_ | nilsf: heh |
| 23:07.45 | pb_ | nilsf: by the way, which hall is your booth in? |
| 23:07.46 | mallum | YOU ARE ALL INSANE |
| 23:08.03 | dc_ | nilsf: I can see it being very popular. |
| 23:08.14 | nilsf | pb_: Both are located in Hall 6, but since you will be too late for the GPE demo point only the H& booth remains. |
| 23:08.31 | nilsf | pb_: H&W will be at A46... |
| 23:08.32 | mallum | JUST FOLLOW THE MEN IN WHITE COATS |
| 23:08.40 | pb_ | nilsf: ah, right. Is that the same hall you were in last year? |
| 23:08.42 | nilsf | mallum: white rabbit? |
| 23:08.53 | nilsf | pb_: I think so, yes. |
| 23:08.57 | pb_ | I think the booth where I will be is in hall 16, which (iirc) is just opposite. |
| 23:09.11 | nilsf | pb_: Oh well, long way to walk. |
| 23:09.19 | dc_ | nilsf: good luck with the booth btw. |
| 23:09.34 | mallum | nilsf: out of interest, do you know the cvs date of cairo GPE is dependant on ? |
| 23:09.44 | dc_ | I send my ermm. GPE happiness... :-/ |
| 23:09.57 | nilsf | pb_: Have a booth number so that we can also visit you there? I am really interested to see Receiva (spelling?) product ;) |
| 23:10.02 | mallum | dc_: go back to #myth or whatever |
| 23:10.07 | pb_ | nilsf: um, let me find out |
| 23:10.27 | florian | pb_: eh... do you think we maybe should go through libgpewidget and remove unsused stuff before i continue documenting?! |
| 23:10.28 | nilsf | mallum: Umm...no, why? |
| 23:10.32 | dc_ | mallum: #grumpyoldman |
| 23:10.43 | pb_ | nilsf: Hall 16, C05 |
| 23:10.55 | mallum | dc_: #sensiblesaneperson |
| 23:10.58 | pb_ | florian: probably a good idea |
| 23:11.09 | nilsf | pb_: noted... |
| 23:11.12 | mallum | nilsf: well I need to know to get gpe to build |
| 23:11.17 | dc_ | mallum: #shoutingmadman |
| 23:11.19 | pb_ | nilsf: it's the "Edimax" booth. |
| 23:11.37 | mallum | nilsf: there is no ./configure test to check for required dep versions |
| 23:11.51 | mallum | nilsf: and cairo has not yet had a proper release |
| 23:12.05 | mallum | nilsf: and it would seem the clock needs it to build |
| 23:12.13 | nilsf | pb_: Ah, OK ;) I already searched for a certain booth at last year's Systems and did not find them. They actually were not there. This could have caused me headaches again ;) Thanks! |
| 23:12.14 | florian | hmmm right, that sucks a little bit... |
| 23:12.33 | nilsf | mallum: I guess you will have to ask pb_ for it... |
| 23:12.42 | nilsf | mallum: I just used the widget. |
| 23:12.48 | pb_ | nilsf: One of our guys will be there from tomorrow. I'm sure you will be welcome to admire our technology. |
| 23:12.50 | florian | pb_: oh okay... tomorrow? :-) |
| 23:13.12 | mallum | nilsf: you have to admit that is kind of crazy |
| 23:13.31 | mallum | nilsf: doing things like that just turn potential devs away |
| 23:13.39 | nilsf | mallum: What is crazy? To use the clock widget or to have cairo in it just for the clock? |
| 23:13.54 | mallum | nilsf: to have cairo just for the clock |
| 23:14.07 | pb_ | You can build the clock without Cairo if you want. |
| 23:14.13 | mallum | nilsf: Im not a fan of the clock widget, I think it would be more suited if it looked a bit plainer |
| 23:14.20 | nilsf | mallum: Um... complain to pb_ !? I have no idea why he started using it. |
| 23:14.23 | mallum | pb_: and configure will check for cairo for me ? |
| 23:14.30 | mallum | nilsf: who decides what the deps are ? |
| 23:14.39 | florian | mallum: no... if noone starts to use it they will go on without a release forever. and you can use it without cairo if you want. |
| 23:14.45 | nilsf | mallum: plainer? Why do you use GUI then? Go back to VT100? |
| 23:14.49 | pb_ | No, because (as you know) there isn't a configure script. You can remove "-DWITH_CAIRO" from the Makefile, though. |
| 23:15.01 | mallum | nilsf: You use KDE dont you ? |
| 23:15.11 | nilsf | nilsf: No I do not. |
| 23:15.14 | mallum | pb_: that isnt very nice |
| 23:15.23 | mallum | nilsf: but you like pretty shiny things |
| 23:15.30 | nilsf | mallum: No I do not. |
| 23:15.35 | mallum | nilsf: the clock |
| 23:15.44 | florian | mallum: button bars!!! |
| 23:15.47 | nilsf | mallum: But I like to make use of the technology I have at hand, but at a reasonable rate. |
| 23:15.47 | mallum | nilsf: it looks pretty but it dont fit with everything else |
| 23:15.55 | pb_ | florian: back in your box |
| 23:16.09 | mallum | florian: KILL THE DAMN TOOLBAR ALREADY PLEASE |
| 23:16.18 | mallum | florian: give me CUT AND PASTE |
| 23:16.24 | florian | ~lart mallum for hating buttonbars |
| 23:16.28 | pb_ | mallum: you need CAPS LOCK, not CUT AND PASTE |
| 23:16.40 | florian | *rotfl* |
| 23:16.46 | mallum | cut and paste cut and paste cut and paste cut and paste |
| 23:17.01 | dc_ | hehehe |
| 23:17.02 | mallum | it is such basic functionality |
| 23:17.19 | mallum | gpe has a shiny cairo'd aa'd rendered pretty clock but NO CUT AND PASTE |
| 23:17.21 | florian | mallum: btw... even minimo has nice button bars rigth now :-) |
| 23:17.21 | dc_ | mallum: I'm sure you could manage it. |
| 23:17.24 | nilsf | mallum: What is your intention to solve it with just one pen? |
| 23:17.35 | mallum | nilsf: menu menu menu menu |
| 23:17.51 | mallum | nilsf: go read zen of palm please |
| 23:18.05 | dc_ | yay |
| 23:18.23 | mallum | my point is prioritys are all wrong gpe is full of pretty hacks but useful user stuff is missing |
| 23:18.29 | nilsf | mallum: Oh well, Palm was a complete different class of device, remember, 160x160 black and white, not een gray levels. |
| 23:18.43 | mallum | nilsf: yeha and it was a hell of a lot more functional than gpe |
| 23:18.52 | mallum | nilsf: it even did cut and paste !!!! |
| 23:18.55 | nilsf | mallum: Agreed. |
| 23:19.14 | mallum | I repeat ' gpe has a shiny cairo'd aa'd rendered pretty clock but NO CUT AND PASTE ' |
| 23:19.26 | nilsf | mallum: But that does not mean that a decent color TFT 240x320 PDA does have to look as "plain" as a Palm! |
| 23:19.35 | nilsf | Look at Palm's today... |
| 23:19.47 | mallum | the ui is still the same |
| 23:19.58 | mallum | they dont have toolsbars |
| 23:20.03 | mallum | they sell by the bucketload |
| 23:20.12 | dc_ | they're a company. |
| 23:20.14 | florian | hmm.. in a well designed pda environment you shouldn't need c+p |
| 23:20.24 | florian | same like that terminal.... |
| 23:20.26 | mallum | florian: WTF |
| 23:20.46 | nilsf | mallum: I even do like tap'n'hold, but you hate that... |
| 23:21.06 | mallum | nilsf: tap'n'hold for 'power user' unimportnat functionality |
| 23:21.12 | nilsf | tap'n'hold tap'n'hold tap'n'hold tap'n'hold tap'n'hold |
| 23:21.26 | mallum | nilsf: KPE KPE KPE |
| 23:21.29 | nilsf | mallum: But C&P is easier? Better? More intuitive? |
| 23:21.39 | nilsf | mallum: This was insulting... |
| 23:21.44 | mallum | nilsf: GTK + POCKETPC + KDE = GPE :) |
| 23:21.51 | philippe | drag and drop ? |
| 23:21.52 | nilsf | mallum: Even worse... |
| 23:21.53 | dc_ | eh? |
| 23:22.09 | mallum | nilsf: :) |
| 23:22.10 | nilsf | philippe: Would be nice if we just had more screen space. |
| 23:22.11 | pb_ | philippe: drag and drop is a nightmare with a touchscreen interface. |
| 23:22.38 | philippe | pb_ : indeed, but as we are discussing crazy things... |
| 23:22.39 | mallum | nilsf: get and nintendo DS, that does amazing things with a touchscreen |
| 23:22.41 | pb_ | philippe: heh |
| 23:23.16 | nilsf | mallum: Also PIM and real things and not just games? I am sure there are some at CeBit... |
| 23:23.25 | dc_ | annnyway... enought of this madness for me. |
| 23:23.28 | dc_ | night guys. |
| 23:23.32 | pb_ | dc_: night |
| 23:23.34 | nilsf | dc_: G'night! |
| 23:23.39 | mallum | nilsf: it is games, but just very interesting. very clever with PDAs |
| 23:23.45 | mallum | dc_: good night bitch |
| 23:23.49 | mallum | dc_: ;) |
| 23:23.52 | dc_ | ;-P |
| 23:24.08 | nilsf | mallum: Something bad in your tobacco? |
| 23:24.14 | mallum | nilsf: very creative with touchscreens rather |
| 23:24.17 | mallum | er |
| 23:24.22 | mallum | I better sleep too now |
| 23:24.27 | nilsf | mallum: :) |
| 23:24.28 | mallum | all this ranting |
| 23:24.33 | nilsf | mallum: Hopefully well see one there... |
| 23:24.36 | mallum | WILL YOU EVER LISTEN |
| 23:24.51 | florian | pb_: we maybe should remove that gtk_image_new_from_pixbuf() stuff... and what is that window list? |
| 23:24.56 | nilsf | mallum: There is also y very nice game for mobiles with camera where the camera is used as input device. Cool thing! |
| 23:25.13 | mallum | nilsf: see if you can get your hands on a DS at cebit very cool |
| 23:25.30 | pb_ | florian: which gtk_image_new_from_pixbuf stuff is that? |
| 23:25.35 | mallum | ok good night all, nice talking to you as always |
| 23:26.04 | nilsf | Darn, off he goes before we could get a nice hit ;) |
| 23:26.17 | pb_ | the window list thing is used by gpe-taskmanager and gpe-buttonbox, though the latter probably doesn't have too much relevance these days. |
| 23:26.18 | philippe | goodnight mallum |
| 23:26.22 | pb_ | philippe: too slow! |
| 23:26.33 | philippe | pb_ idd :-) |
| 23:27.03 | nilsf | I guess we should find our beds too now... we'll have to get up at around 700 tomorrow morning :( |
| 23:27.15 | pb_ | ah, nasty |
| 23:27.18 | florian | pb_: that's obsolete stuff in libgpewidget... if there is still something using it we can fix that easily. |
| 23:27.24 | pb_ | how far from the fairground is the place where you are staying? |
| 23:27.36 | pb_ | florian: okay, sounds good |
| 23:27.51 | nilsf | pb_: roughly .75h to 1h by public transport (train). |
| 23:28.07 | nilsf | pb_: And we have to be there before opening, i.e. 900h |
| 23:28.20 | pb_ | nilsf: oh dear. |
| 23:28.37 | nilsf | pb_: Hopefully that's jiust tomorrow ;) |
| 23:29.04 | pb_ | actually, I should go to bed as well. I need to be at the office early tomorrow because we have a new guy starting work. |
| 23:29.28 | pb_ | named Florian, as it happens. |
| 23:29.36 | florian | yes.... |
| 23:29.38 | florian | he+ |
| 23:29.39 | florian | h |
| 23:29.41 | nilsf | pb_: That's mine already! Hands off! |
| 23:29.49 | florian | *gg* |
| 23:29.50 | philippe | well goodnight then. (before I am too late this time) |
| 23:29.57 | florian | :-) |
| 23:30.02 | florian | good night all... |
| 23:30.06 | pb_ | heh. this guy is French, so I think confusion should be minimal. |
| 23:30.08 | nilsf | Good night! |
| 23:30.21 | nilsf | That was a funny IRC :)) |
| 23:30.24 | florian | pb_: do we strip down libgpewidget tomorrow? :) |
| 23:30.31 | pb_ | florian: sure! |
| 23:30.35 | florian | okay |
| 23:30.44 | florian | sleeee....p |
| 23:30.46 | nilsf | But please ... keeo the clock, OK? |
| 23:30.51 | nilsf | keep... |
| 23:31.18 | pb_ | nilsf: never fear, the clock is safe |
| 23:31.53 | nilsf | pb_: Thanks, master ;) |
| 23:31.58 | nilsf | pb_: CU soon! |
| 23:32.01 | *** part/#gpe nilsf (~nils@p5086336B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:35.11 | Cwiiis | What's going to be stripped out of libgpewidget? |
| 23:35.42 | pb_ | Obsolete code. |
| 23:36.30 | Cwiiis | Right |
| 23:42.48 | Cwiiis | Don't suppose you know off-hand the easiest way to retrieve the schema that applies to a key in GConf? |
| 23:43.27 | Cwiiis | nevermind... |
| 23:43.36 | Cwiiis | heh, I always get the answer after asking... |