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| 07:14.48 | florian | hi all |
| 07:18.34 | pigeon | hello florian |
| 07:25.16 | florian | hey pigeon |
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| 09:22.44 | florian | hello pb_ |
| 09:23.17 | pb_ | hi florian |
| 10:11.26 | florian | bbl |
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| 11:44.37 | florian | re |
| 11:45.03 | pb_ | florian: wb |
| 11:45.59 | pigeon | yo florian and pb_ |
| 11:46.04 | pb_ | pigeon: g'day |
| 11:47.01 | pigeon | pb_: Even more on my dead box. memtest giving all the errors for all 3 ram modules with my p3 1g cpu, but I memtested all 3 rams on another box, no errors, now I'm testing them with my old p3 cpu, seems no errors too :\ |
| 11:47.47 | pigeon | "what can I say?" |
| 11:48.02 | pb_ | Ah, sounds weird. |
| 11:48.13 | pb_ | Maybe those dimms are just incompatible with your motherboard for some reason. |
| 11:48.33 | pigeon | Hmm you mean the cpu? |
| 11:49.05 | pb_ | No, but that's another possibility. |
| 11:50.01 | pigeon | board a + cpu a -> error, board b + cpu b -> no error, board a + cpu c -> no error. |
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| 16:15.08 | sangamon | Cheers. I'm trying to add a folder for apps to the desktop. Does anyone have a hint on how to to it? |
| 16:16.07 | florian | sangamon: hi |
| 16:16.13 | florian | sangamon: look at /usr/share/matchbox/vfolders/ |
| 16:17.26 | sangamon | florian: :) |
| 16:17.28 | sangamon | florian: /mnt/flash/usr/share/matchbox |
| 16:17.28 | sangamon | intimate:/mnt/flash/usr/share/matchbox# ls |
| 16:17.28 | sangamon | defaults icon.xpm kbdconfig mbdock/ mbmenu/ |
| 16:17.28 | sangamon | intimate:/mnt/flash/usr/share/matchbox# |
| 16:17.49 | sangamon | seems I lack the directory vfolders? |
| 16:18.33 | florian | Do you have mbdesktop installed? |
| 16:19.20 | sangamon | florian: I think I'm running this: May 17 07:21 bootgpe2-v0.7-rc2-h3600.jffs2 |
| 16:20.06 | sangamon | i'm rebooting to check mbdesktop |
| 16:22.56 | florian | then you have mbdesktop... maybe this changed, i'm running unstable... |
| 16:23.14 | pb_ | yeah, I have a feeling vfolders are only in matchbox 0.6.x. |
| 16:24.23 | sangamon | there's a process "mbdesktop" running |
| 16:25.51 | florian | pb_: ahh... where did old matchbox keep the folders? |
| 16:26.48 | pb_ | florian: they were hard coded |
| 16:26.56 | sangamon | I've grepped through the filesystem for "Utilities" "Settings" "Games" and I seem to find these strings in binaries like /usr/bin/gpe-conf. Are the folders hardcoded in a binary perhaps? |
| 16:27.19 | sangamon | /usr/bin # grep Games * |
| 16:27.19 | sangamon | gpe-conf:Games |
| 16:27.19 | sangamon | mbdesktop:Games |
| 16:27.19 | sangamon | mbmenu:Games |
| 16:27.19 | sangamon | x-menu-manager:Games |
| 16:27.31 | sangamon | not good for me :( |
| 16:27.58 | pb_ | You could consider upgrading to unstable, or wait for Familiar 0.7.2. |
| 16:29.06 | sangamon | pb_: I'll wait. |
| 16:29.29 | pb_ | sangamon: ok. should be just a few weeks. |
| 16:29.54 | sangamon | You just saved me 4 more hours of search. You're great :) |
| 16:34.10 | florian | :-) |
| 16:34.17 | sangamon | :-) |
| 16:34.41 | florian | Yep, updating to unstable is maybe a little bit tricky at the moment.... |
| 16:34.58 | florian | pb_: Any news about h5xxx kernel? |
| 16:35.49 | pb_ | florian: none yet. I've been busy with glibc the last day or so. |
| 16:36.51 | florian | pb_: oh, do we have a problem with the current one? |
| 16:37.13 | pb_ | florian: this was debian, not familiar. |
| 16:37.36 | pb_ | see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=glibc |
| 16:40.12 | moray | pb_: once I get the section sorted out etc., are you likely to have time to sponsor some more GPE stuff into experimental, or should I look for another victim? |
| 16:40.28 | pb_ | florian: it seems we have 189 normal bugs, 26 important bugs, 5 serious bugs, 7 grave bugs, and one critical bug outstanding. |
| 16:40.35 | pb_ | moray: sure, I can do that. |
| 16:40.50 | florian | pb_: ookay, i see... |
| 16:41.13 | moray | pb_: (it at least seems worth getting the new gpe-todo in soon, since it fixes bugs in the existing package) |
| 16:41.49 | pb_ | yep |
| 16:42.23 | moray | pb_: thanks. incidentally, I finally got assigned an AM, though he hasn't yet dealt with the key response I sent back immediately - well, immediately after I got him to fix his mail system so I could reach him at all ;) |
| 16:42.33 | pb_ | moray: heh, right. |
| 16:42.35 | pb_ | who's your AM? |
| 16:42.55 | moray | pb_: csmall (seeS) |
| 16:43.05 | pb_ | ah, right |
| 16:45.23 | *** topic/#gpe by pb_ -> GPE Palmtop Environment | gpe.handhelds.org |
| 16:46.08 | pb_ | hm, is there any debian page that will show me a list of all the packages I maintain? |
| 16:47.30 | pb_ | (using the word "maintain" in a loose sense, obviously) |
| 16:48.06 | moray | pb_: 'yes' is the answer, though I'm just seeing if I can find the URL |
| 16:48.30 | moray | http://qa.debian.org/developer.php |
| 16:49.12 | pb_ | aha |
| 16:49.53 | pb_ | hm, it says I only have one. That doesn't seem right. |
| 16:51.01 | pb_ | oh, I see. if you search by name, it looks up the first email address associated with that name and then searches the package directory based on email. |
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| 17:12.54 | florian | bbl |
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| 17:33.08 | reenoo | hi |
| 17:34.04 | pb_ | re |
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| 19:06.03 | florian | re |
| 19:29.12 | sangamon | ~ # ipkg update |
| 19:29.13 | sangamon | Downloading http://familiar.handhelds.org/releases/v0.7/base/armv4l/Packages |
| 19:29.13 | sangamon | Downloading http://familiar.handhelds.org/releases/v0.7/x/armv4l/Packages |
| 19:29.13 | sangamon | ~ # ipkg list | grep python-pygtk |
| 19:29.13 | sangamon | python-pygtk - a python wrapper for gtk support |
| 19:29.14 | sangamon | ~ # ipkg install python-pygtk |
| 19:29.17 | sangamon | Cannot find package python-pygtk. |
| 19:29.19 | sangamon | Check the spelling or perhaps run 'ipkg update' |
| 19:29.28 | sangamon | hmm, doesn't that look kind of peculiar? |
| 19:29.51 | pb_ | try it with -V 2 |
| 19:32.50 | sangamon | pb_: I't doesn't say much unfortunately. |
| 19:33.03 | sangamon | something about python2.3 |
| 19:33.07 | pb_ | what does it it say that it didn't say before? |
| 19:33.25 | sangamon | ~ # ipkg -V 2 install python-pygtk |
| 19:33.25 | sangamon | pkg_info_preinstall_check: updating arch priority for each package |
| 19:33.25 | sangamon | pkg_info_preinstall_check: update file owner list |
| 19:33.25 | sangamon | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:33.25 | sangamon | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:33.27 | sangamon | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:33.34 | sangamon | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:33.35 | sangamon | Cannot find package python-pygtk. |
| 19:33.35 | sangamon | Check the spelling or perhaps run 'ipkg update' |
| 19:33.35 | sangamon | configuring unpacked packages |
| 19:33.36 | sangamon | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:33.38 | sangamon | hash_table[pkg-hash] n_buckets=1423 n_elements=1619 max_conflicts=5 n_conflicts=444 |
| 19:33.40 | sangamon | hash_table[file-hash] n_buckets=1423 n_elements=1948 max_conflicts=12 n_conflicts=548 |
| 19:33.43 | sangamon | hash_table[obs-file-hash] n_buckets=1423 n_elements=0 max_conflicts=0 n_conflicts=0 |
| 19:33.45 | pb_ | ah. |
| 19:33.45 | sangamon | I aplologize for the flood :(( |
| 19:34.06 | pb_ | I wonder why python2.3 is providing python-pygtk. That doesn't seem right. |
| 19:34.25 | sangamon | i tried with 2.3 before, without success |
| 19:35.37 | pb_ | what happens if you "ipkg -V 2 install python2.3"? |
| 19:38.30 | sangamon | that installs python2.3 successfully |
| 19:38.40 | sangamon | but still pygtk fails to install |
| 19:38.53 | pb_ | well, python2.3 is claiming that it _is_ pygtk. |
| 19:39.05 | pb_ | if that's not correct, you should take it up with the maintainer. |
| 19:39.06 | sangamon | this time however without mentioning 2.3 |
| 19:39.33 | sangamon | whoa, i'm a newbie on talking with maintainers :\ |
| 19:39.54 | sangamon | how do I even find them? := |
| 19:40.02 | sangamon | s/:=/:) |
| 19:40.08 | pb_ | ipkg info python2.3 |
| 19:40.15 | pb_ | look for where it says "Maintainer:" |
| 19:40.47 | sangamon | is it ok to mail them? |
| 19:40.59 | pb_ | yep |
| 19:41.04 | sangamon | ok, will do |
| 19:41.47 | pb_ | cool |
| 19:42.48 | sangamon | how did you see that python2.3 claimed to be pygtk? |
| 19:43.04 | sangamon | from the line " adding python2.3 to providers" ? |
| 19:43.07 | pb_ | yeah |
| 19:43.13 | pb_ | did ipkg info say anything about "Provides:"? |
| 19:43.20 | sangamon | no |
| 19:43.34 | pb_ | hm, ok. let me look at the available file a minute. |
| 19:43.53 | sangamon | oh, sorry |
| 19:44.05 | sangamon | the "ipkg info" said lot of stuff about Provides: |
| 19:44.10 | pb_ | ah |
| 19:44.19 | pb_ | oh, yeah, I see it. |
| 19:44.25 | pb_ | Provides: python-base,python-binascii,python-codecs,python-compiler,python-compression,python-crypto,python-curses,python-db,python-distutils,python-email,python-errno,python-fcntl,python-file,python-format,python-gdkpixbuf,python-html,python-i18n,python-image,python-io,python-l2v,python-lang,python-libold,python-math,python-mime,python-misc,python-mmap,python-net,python-pickle,python-pygtk,python-re,python-readline,python-resource,python-shell,py |
| 19:44.25 | pb_ | hon-stringold,python-sylog,python-syslog,python-threading,python-time,python-tkinter,python-xmlbase,python-xmlrpc,python-zlib |
| 19:44.36 | pb_ | well, that does include python-pygtk. |
| 19:44.46 | sangamon | yes. But 2.3 does not provide pygtk. I tried that before. |
| 19:45.00 | pb_ | ok. in that case, the packaging is erroneous. |
| 19:45.04 | sangamon | ok |
| 19:45.17 | sangamon | i'll double check and call the maintainer |
| 19:45.22 | pb_ | cool |
| 19:45.25 | sangamon | s/call/mail |
| 20:29.02 | ade|desk | pb_: i have finally got around to looking into which packages should be optional on the 3600s care to see the ones that need removing ? |
| 20:29.22 | pb_ | sure |
| 20:29.48 | florian | ahh.. better - no H....... here :-) |
| 20:30.38 | pb_ | florian: lol |
| 20:30.38 | pb_ | :-) |
| 20:31.07 | florian | He is my very special friend :-/ |
| 20:31.15 | ade|desk | Package: blueprobe |
| 20:31.15 | ade|desk | Package: bluetooth-modules |
| 20:31.15 | ade|desk | Package: bluetooth-uart-modules |
| 20:31.15 | ade|desk | Package: bluez-libs |
| 20:31.15 | ade|desk | Package: bluez-pin2 |
| 20:31.16 | ade|desk | Package: bluez-sdp |
| 20:31.18 | ade|desk | Package: bluez-utils |
| 20:31.20 | ade|desk | Package: gpe-bluetooth |
| 20:31.22 | ade|desk | Package: h3800-modules |
| 20:32.00 | pb_ | ade|desk: how much space does this save? |
| 20:32.09 | sangamon | pb_: how do people create all those packages? I have Intimate on a microdrive, will that do? |
| 20:32.18 | ade|desk | not sure as yet |
| 20:32.45 | pb_ | ade|desk: ok. can you find out? I don't want to start shipping a separate image if it will only save a handful of kilobytes. |
| 20:33.16 | ade|desk | sure np |
| 20:33.23 | pb_ | cool |
| 20:35.14 | florian | ipkg is still very buggy :-/ |
| 20:35.23 | pb_ | florian: what problems are you having? |
| 20:35.38 | pb_ | the "upgrading matchbox" bug should be fixed now, I think. |
| 20:36.14 | florian | "void_list_remove_elt: ERROR: element not found in list" |
| 20:36.30 | pb_ | ah, yes, antiproxy mentioned that this morning as well. |
| 20:36.35 | pb_ | you should probably talk to jamey about it. |
| 20:37.00 | florian | I filed a bug... i think three days ago |
| 20:37.06 | pb_ | ah, ok |
| 20:39.43 | florian | Oh... anyone aware of trouble with the serial port on H3800? |
| 20:40.34 | pb_ | Not heard of any. |
| 20:41.06 | florian | Hmm... i need to check if my GPS works... |
| 20:42.40 | ade|desk | pb_: saves 208K |
| 20:42.40 | florian | Hmm... network setup needs a facelift... |
| 20:42.54 | florian | A bluetooth setup applet would be nice... |
| 20:43.34 | florian | A filesystem mounter - no, nice but not necessary. |
| 20:43.35 | pb_ | ade|desk: ok. probably not a big enough saving to be worth building a different image, but we can make it so that you can remove those with ipkg after installing. |
| 20:43.48 | pb_ | florian: what kind of bluetooth setup are you thinking of? |
| 20:43.54 | pb_ | it doesn't really need any afaik. |
| 20:44.08 | ade|desk | pb_: problem is that h3800-modules is dep on kernel-modules |
| 20:44.22 | pb_ | ade|desk: I can weaken that to a recommends. |
| 20:44.34 | ade|desk | pb_: and bluetooth-uart-modules is dep on task-bootstrap |
| 20:44.38 | pb_ | likewise |
| 20:45.03 | florian | pb_: For the really basic stuff i agree - but you maybe want to switch security,pin,discoverable mode on.... |
| 20:45.40 | pb_ | florian: mmm. discoverable probably ought to be a switch in gpe-bluetooth. Is there any reason to switch security off? |
| 20:45.45 | florian | Do we have the possebility to share files using bluetooth? Is there a profile for this stuff? |
| 20:46.11 | pb_ | depends what you mean by share. There's the OBEX profile, of course, which lets you beam files from one machine to another. |
| 20:46.18 | florian | pb_: Is it on per default? Where do you change the pin? Where your device name? |
| 20:47.00 | pb_ | florian: I think security should always be on. I'm not sure what you mean by the pin; you're prompted to enter a pin whenever one is needed. Device name probably ought to be the same as hostname. |
| 20:47.04 | florian | pb_: I saw this in ppc - but i think they do smb over pan or something else. |
| 20:47.22 | pb_ | florian: ah. well, no reason we couldn't install samba and do the same :-) |
| 20:47.28 | ade|desk | pb_: oops sorry its 308K saved forgot to uninstall bluetooth-modules, heh, that is dep on task-bootstrap too |
| 20:47.35 | pb_ | ade|desk: aha |
| 20:48.07 | ade|desk | pb_: now give the h3600s about 2 meg free from std install |
| 20:48.16 | pb_ | right |
| 20:48.26 | florian | pb_: What about the pin to acces your device? |
| 20:48.40 | pb_ | florian: Don't you get prompted for that also? That's how it ought to work. |
| 20:48.42 | florian | pb_: yep, we could - but samba is fat! |
| 20:48.51 | pb_ | florian: if that prompting isn't happening, there is a bug somewhere. |
| 20:49.34 | florian | pb_: ok, maybe i was not clear enough - what if you want to protect your device by a pin? |
| 20:49.55 | pb_ | florian: sorry, I still don't understand. |
| 20:50.04 | pb_ | florian: protect in what way? |
| 20:51.24 | florian | pb_: afaik access to any bluetooth device may be restricted, in this case i think you need to authenticate yourself by a pin. |
| 20:52.10 | pb_ | florian: I think this only happens during pairing, and in that case gpe-bluetooth will ask you to enter a PIN. |
| 20:52.51 | pb_ | I don't know of any pin-based protection for devices that are already paired. I guess it is up to higher level protocols to provide protection there. |
| 20:54.21 | florian | pb_: ok - then how do you restrict access to your ipaq while it is discoverable? |
| 20:55.14 | pb_ | florian: well, in order to do anything you first need to pair with the ipaq, which requires a PIN. if you are already paired, it doesn't make any difference whether it is discoverable or not. |
| 20:57.25 | ade|desk | how much space do directories take up on jffs2? |
| 20:57.36 | pb_ | ade|desk: no idea. ask dwmw2, maybe |
| 20:59.01 | florian | pb_: ok, then you still need to set this pin to protect your device from illegal pairing attemts... correct? |
| 20:59.17 | pb_ | florian: the PIN isn't a pre-set thing, you enter it for each pairing attempt. |
| 20:59.55 | pb_ | florian: the general procedure for pairing is that you input a PIN on both devices, and the connection is allowed so long as you entered the same thing at each end. |
| 20:59.56 | florian | pb_: ah - now this is clear... bluetooth is wired :-/ |
| 21:01.09 | pb_ | florian: there are a few dumb bluetooth peripherals (like my old Nokia 6210 cellphone) that do have just a single hard-coded PIN, but these are rare. |
| 21:01.55 | *** join/#gpe ade|home (~adrian@modem-4057.gorilla.dialup.pol.co.uk) |
| 21:02.04 | pb_ | I guess we could have a mode in gpe-bluetooth where you provided a "default" PIN that it would remember and use for all future connection attempts. That might be a neat feature. |
| 21:02.36 | florian | hmm... why did ppc need this complicated bluetooth manager? |
| 21:03.10 | florian | hm yes - this ia a good idea - but we don't need a config applet for this... |
| 21:07.11 | florian | Is a fork a cheap call? |
| 21:13.21 | pb_ | florian: not really, no. |
| 21:13.32 | pb_ | if you are going to call exec() immediately afterwards, vfork() is cheaper than fork()/ |
| 21:14.45 | florian | pb_: I thought about improvement of gpe-conf... it forks a non-suid process instantly after start. |
| 21:17.27 | florian | But i think in this case cow does the most of the work for me... |
| 21:27.00 | pb_ | florian: ah, right. |
| 21:29.16 | *** join/#gpe ade|beth2 (~adrian@modem-1917.gazelle.dialup.pol.co.uk) |
| 21:29.39 | ade|beth2 | pb_: what feed do you take your debian Xserver from ? |
| 21:29.45 | florian | It's because gpe-conf is quite large now and doesn't start that fast... |
| 21:29.55 | pb_ | ade|beth2: experimental, I think |
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| 22:00.26 | *** join/#gpe dc_ (~dctanner@213.78.85.204) |
| 22:00.28 | dc_ | hey! |
| 22:00.48 | pb_ | dc_: yo yo yo |
| 22:01.06 | dc_ | I am alive. |
| 22:01.13 | pb_ | phew! |
| 22:01.21 | dc_ | laptop should be picked up tomorrow to be fixed. |
| 22:01.23 | dc_ | which is good. |
| 22:01.24 | pb_ | obviously we feared the worst. |
| 22:01.28 | pb_ | ah, yes, that's good news. |
| 22:01.30 | dc_ | and I have work... |
| 22:01.33 | dc_ | which is god in a way |
| 22:01.39 | dc_ | good... |
| 22:01.44 | pb_ | indeed. |
| 22:02.03 | florian | hi dc_! |
| 22:02.56 | dc_ | hey florian |
| 22:03.05 | dc_ | hrm, and now I need some sort of right click on this appl emouse. |
| 22:03.20 | pb_ | ah, that old problem. |
| 22:03.59 | dc_ | debian didn't like my apple hardware : |
| 22:04.01 | dc_ | :/ |
| 22:04.07 | dc_ | so I'm back to mandrake. heh. |
| 22:04.53 | florian | hmmm... i think this is not that funny for coding :-/ |
| 22:05.01 | florian | but looks nice :-) |
| 22:05.09 | pb_ | dc_: ah, oh well. |
| 22:06.33 | dc_ | it's painless to install, and has no distractions |
| 22:09.57 | pb_ | sounds ideal then. |
| 22:12.24 | pb_ | dc_: so, any gpe-filemanager news? |
| 22:12.44 | dc_ | not really :/ |
| 22:12.59 | dc_ | I could never get libgpewidget to compile on OS X |
| 22:13.09 | dc_ | even with next to no modules |
| 22:13.15 | pb_ | oh, yeah, I remember mibus explaining what a drama that was. |
| 22:13.33 | dc_ | did he manage it? |
| 22:13.46 | pb_ | yeah, but only with some ghastly makefile hack I think. |
| 22:14.04 | dc_ | doh |
| 22:14.29 | pb_ | seems like OS X has some wacky system for shared libraries. |
| 22:14.46 | dc_ | indeed. |
| 22:14.51 | florian | Maybe ask pierre... i think he used OS X |
| 22:14.53 | dc_ | their uber dynlib |
| 22:15.20 | dc_ | anyhow, it won't be a problem for 10 days or so |
| 22:15.23 | pb_ | florian: mmm. haven't heard from pierre in quite some time. |
| 22:15.37 | pb_ | dc_: right. |
| 22:15.55 | florian | pb_: yes, i think he showed up some time ago but dissapered again very fast. |
| 22:15.58 | pb_ | oh, thinking of mibus reminds me, I should try to do something with his gpe-nmf patch. |
| 22:16.58 | dc_ | mm. |
| 22:17.55 | florian | pb_: maybe talk to nils about this - i was short before coding a better media player.... |
| 22:18.16 | pb_ | florian: right |
| 22:21.01 | *** topic/#gpe by pb_ -> GPE Palmtop Environment | gpe.handhelds.org | Familiar 0.7.2 approaches: time to stabilise code in unstable! |
| 22:22.06 | florian | ok - wait till i release gpe-conf 0.1.0! |
| 22:22.35 | pb_ | florian: okay :-) |
| 22:22.44 | pb_ | I think 0.7.2 is still a few weeks away at least. |
| 22:23.30 | florian | ah ok - then i'll have some time to spread next version of gpe-conf pre for field test :-) |
| 22:24.56 | pb_ | right :-) |
| 22:25.29 | pb_ | when do you think that might be ready? |
| 22:26.21 | florian | i think most parts are more or less stable - at the moment i think about which parts are missing. |
| 22:26.54 | pb_ | ok |
| 22:30.07 | florian | is it possible to make a nonblocking read from a stream? |
| 22:30.21 | pb_ | yeah, you can set it O_NONBLOCK. |
| 22:30.39 | florian | ah yes - this was it... |
| 22:30.52 | florian | hell i get old... |
| 22:30.59 | pb_ | hehe |
| 22:32.54 | pb_ | florian: oh, what would be the chances of having simpad support in 0.7.2? |
| 22:34.33 | florian | pb_: yeah - this would be great, i'll do my best... but my time is limited at the moment. |
| 22:34.47 | pb_ | florian: great. |
| 22:35.07 | pb_ | I'll see if I can help too, though I have the same problem with time. :-/ |
| 22:48.11 | dc_ | heh |
| 22:55.13 | florian | night all |
| 22:57.08 | dc_ | night |
| 23:11.15 | dc_ | ibot message for Morn: if your could create a new account for tanner@rstanner.com, then move all the current mail over to another backup account it may solve the not being able to delete messages problem |
| 23:11.20 | dc_ | heh |