| 00:00.22 | pb_ | paul: yeah, that's actually correct. |
| 00:00.29 | pb_ | paul: gtk 2.2 installs itself as libgtk2.0 |
| 00:00.36 | paul | ah |
| 00:01.23 | paul | PaxAnima: they actually didnt change much for RH8 really. the desktop 'look' is what they seemed to have spent most oftheir time on. |
| 00:03.36 | PaxAnima | paul: a friend of mine has had problems all the way... so he's changed distro.. |
| 00:04.23 | paul | PaxAnima: apart from the desktop sillyness i havnt noticed anything terribly wrong with it. |
| 00:04.32 | paul | very much an incremental advance 'under the hood'. |
| 00:04.38 | dc_ | right! |
| 00:04.52 | pb_ | dc_: aha |
| 00:05.17 | dc_ | been at a beth orton concert. |
| 00:05.19 | dc_ | very good. |
| 00:05.25 | pb_ | ah, cool |
| 00:05.36 | dc_ | what's the latest? |
| 00:06.06 | pb_ | well, I checked in some more code changes for the clock, which should fix the redraw flicker and the problem with excessive shadow alpha |
| 00:06.30 | pb_ | other than that, not much new from me. |
| 00:06.35 | dc_ | ah cool. |
| 00:08.18 | dc_ | loooking good. |
| 00:08.23 | dc_ | pb_: hands are nicer |
| 00:08.46 | dc_ | although.... |
| 00:08.56 | dc_ | pb_: it seem the shadow problem is still there for me |
| 00:09.35 | pb_ | dc_: oh, darn |
| 00:09.49 | dc_ | let me just make sure it's not cvs... |
| 00:09.58 | pb_ | actually no, you're probably right. |
| 00:10.12 | pb_ | I had a last minute change of heart on the redraw code, and probably put that bug back in at the same time. |
| 00:10.22 | dc_ | pb_: defently still there in latest cvs |
| 00:10.28 | dc_ | pb_: ahh :) |
| 00:12.13 | pb_ | dc_: try now, is that any better? |
| 00:15.46 | dc_ | yep |
| 00:15.50 | pb_ | phew |
| 00:15.57 | dc_ | only now I think it's time to put it into libgpewidget. |
| 00:16.02 | dc_ | let me have a go :} |
| 00:16.15 | pb_ | it probably needs to be properly widgetized first. |
| 00:16.23 | pb_ | or at the same time, anyway |
| 00:16.24 | dc_ | i.e.? |
| 00:16.59 | dc_ | I think it'd make sense just to make the clock itself the only thing in the popup |
| 00:17.01 | pb_ | well, make an actual GtkClock widget class or something |
| 00:17.20 | dc_ | pb_: is that needed? |
| 00:17.26 | pb_ | I think it's desirable. |
| 00:17.31 | dc_ | true. |
| 00:18.13 | pb_ | it's not strictly necessary, but for stuff in the library I'd like to have it done properly. |
| 00:18.27 | dc_ | I must say, I think libgpewidget needs some sort of spring cleaning.. |
| 00:18.32 | dc_ | but that's another matter. |
| 00:18.34 | pb_ | yeah |
| 00:18.53 | pb_ | I did a bit of that the other day, but there is still more to do. |
| 00:19.05 | dc_ | it'd be nice to make the source filenames more consisitant. |
| 00:19.18 | dc_ | and stuff like popup_menu is missing the gpe_ prefix. |
| 00:19.28 | dc_ | (my forgetfullness) |
| 00:19.41 | pb_ | ah yes |
| 00:19.59 | pb_ | I always get confused between popup.c and popup_menu.c as well. |
| 00:20.05 | dc_ | so do i :} |
| 00:20.28 | dc_ | and then thre's gpe-iconlist and gpeiconlsit |
| 00:20.34 | dc_ | *gpeiconlist |
| 00:20.52 | pb_ | yeah. I'm not sure if that was deliberate, or just an accident. |
| 00:21.19 | pb_ | probably the latter I guess. |
| 00:24.21 | pb_ | and there's also other crufty stuff like the now-unused first argument to gpe_picture_button. |
| 00:24.36 | dc_ | yes |
| 00:24.49 | dc_ | gpe_picture_button should really be scrapped I think... |
| 00:25.01 | dc_ | maybe some other method could be thought up. |
| 00:25.18 | dc_ | or rather, apps should really just be using stock buttons. |
| 00:25.37 | dc_ | or wait...well. |
| 00:25.57 | pb_ | well, there are always going to be programs that want to use icons for which no stock is available. |
| 00:26.16 | pb_ | you could argue that they should make an icon factory and add them as stocks, but that's a bit heavyweight. |
| 00:26.33 | dc_ | nevermind picturebutton....my main consirn in our icons code |
| 00:26.33 | dc_ | pb_: how needed do you think it is? |
| 00:27.04 | pb_ | dc_: well, lots of applications use it, but mostly only in trivial ways. |
| 00:27.46 | pb_ | i.e. they would be just as happy with a couple of gdk_pixbuf_new_from_file calls. |
| 00:27.59 | dc_ | all this my_icons. |
| 00:28.55 | pb_ | the original purpose of that, if you remember, was to make the icons themable. I'm not sure if that ever really worked out though. |
| 00:30.16 | pb_ | or, well, I'm not sure if anybody has ever tried it with any theme other than "default". |
| 00:31.38 | dc_ | true |
| 00:32.07 | mallum | jg: hi, hows the mallopt stuff going ? |
| 00:32.20 | dc_ | pb_: well, the thing is we should be using gtk themes now |
| 00:32.33 | dc_ | pb_: i.e. the new gtk icon themes. |
| 00:32.52 | dc_ | pb_: so yeah, maybe it should just be restricted for an apps own personal icons. |
| 00:33.21 | dc_ | pb_: maybe we could have it just load up any icons present in /usr/share/gpe/pixmaps/appname/ |
| 00:33.29 | dc_ | pb_: or something |
| 00:33.37 | pb_ | yeah. well, we can easily have it inherit the theme name from Gtk. |
| 00:34.06 | pb_ | that way, individual application icons would be themable if anybody wanted to do so. |
| 00:34.13 | dc_ | yes, but how many apps are going to ship with 3 icons that are all just different themes of the same one |
| 00:34.34 | spung | pb_: renice -20 -u spung :) |
| 00:34.57 | dc_ | pb_: but yeah, I guess our current code is alright how it is |
| 00:35.00 | pb_ | spung: um, er. is the g_signal_emit_by_name() in there required? |
| 00:35.18 | spung | pb_: doesn't seem to work otherwise |
| 00:35.44 | pb_ | dc_: we can certainly invent an update best-current-practice and try to make apps adhere to it, but the current stuff is sufficiently heavily used that I don't feel up to just ripping it out quite yet. |
| 00:36.04 | mallum | dc_: I noticed there is code in gnome api for looking up icon full paths via a image filename and a theme name btw |
| 00:36.19 | dc_ | mallum: ah cool.... |
| 00:36.32 | dc_ | mallum: gnome-vfs? |
| 00:36.34 | pb_ | spung: ah. maybe you could root out whatever is hooked into that signal and see if it can be made to hook the OptionMenu "changed" signal instead. |
| 00:36.50 | mallum | dc_: no I think just normal gnome lib |
| 00:37.02 | mallum | dc_: let me see if I can find it again .. |
| 00:37.36 | spung | pb_: i don't understand, why? |
| 00:38.06 | pb_ | spung: you are not supposed to need to emit signals like that by hand. |
| 00:38.27 | pb_ | and, given that the SimpleMenu "item-changed" just duplicates the other, it should probably be removed. |
| 00:39.03 | spung | pb_: ah, I see what you mean |
| 00:39.39 | mallum | dc_: there is a gnome_icon_theme_new (); |
| 00:40.10 | spung | pb_: but, want me to try and fix gtksimplemenu() is it? my understanding of gtk internals is not much |
| 00:40.24 | pb_ | spung: you shouldn't need to touch gtksimplemenu. |
| 00:40.30 | jg | mallum: dealt with 1000 or more mail messages, and working on Usenix paper due Monday. |
| 00:40.42 | pb_ | spung: it must be something in gpe-calendar that is hooked to that signal. |
| 00:40.54 | mallum | dc_: and gnome_desktop_item_find_icon() I've seen in source |
| 00:41.16 | mallum | jg: ah okey, was the basic plan just to increased the amount of stuff that got allocated with mmap ? |
| 00:41.26 | spung | pb_: ahh, right.. i know what it is, and that'd would fix the problem i'm having? |
| 00:41.38 | pb_ | dunno, but it would be a good thing to change anyway. |
| 00:42.31 | pb_ | spung: btw, minor formatting problem in your patch: missing space in "GTK_OPTION_MENU ()" |
| 00:43.10 | spung | pb_: :) i'm not used to GNU style ;) i'm a k&r guy |
| 00:43.20 | pb_ | heh |
| 00:47.28 | *** join/#gpe paulj (~paulj@hibernia.jakma.org) |
| 00:47.42 | spung | pb_: ok, changed the signal.. it works.. but still the same problem :\ |
| 00:47.46 | pb_ | drat |
| 00:47.53 | pb_ | paulj: congratulations |
| 00:48.08 | paul | pb_: nah... running under gdb :( |
| 00:48.15 | pb_ | ah, heh. |
| 00:48.44 | pb_ | spung: well, you could send me a new patch, and I'll check that in anyway. |
| 00:48.53 | spung | pb_: yeah ok |
| 00:48.55 | jg | mallum: pb has uploaded a glibc that has the default set much smaller. But i suspect the X server can function ok on an iPAQ set to maybe 8k. |
| 00:49.51 | spung | pb_: well, now that i don't emit any signal does this if make sense? |
| 00:49.52 | spung | + if (gtk_option_menu_get_history (GTK_OPTION_MENU (s->optionmenutype)) != menuindex) |
| 00:49.55 | spung | + gtk_option_menu_set_history (GTK_OPTION_MENU (s->optionmenutype), menuindex); |
| 00:50.42 | pb_ | I think you can just do the set unconditionally. |
| 00:52.22 | spung | looks more l33t this way :) |
| 00:52.23 | spung | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:52.24 | spung | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:52.40 | pb_ | quite :-) |
| 00:53.36 | spung | i wonder |
| 00:53.49 | spung | can't i change that to ev->duration == 0 ? |
| 00:53.59 | pb_ | yep |
| 00:54.01 | spung | heh |
| 00:54.13 | spung | my patch is getting tiny |
| 00:55.23 | pb_ | excellent |
| 01:01.23 | mallum | jg: oh okey, no changes to the actual XServer then ? |
| 01:01.40 | spung | hey, time changed here |
| 01:01.54 | spung | i guess i'll witness more DST bugs in gpe-calendar :) |
| 01:02.04 | jg | mallum: about 5-10 lines. |
| 01:02.04 | pb_ | yeah, here too. |
| 01:02.10 | pb_ | spung: oh dear, yes |
| 01:02.13 | jg | command line parsing, and setting the option. |
| 01:02.15 | spung | pb_: you've got mail |
| 01:02.18 | pb_ | spung: great |
| 01:02.38 | mallum | jg: just calling mallopt right ? |
| 01:02.51 | jg | mallum: yes. |
| 01:02.57 | jg | mallum: I just need to test it... |
| 01:03.05 | jg | mallum: I've just had no time at all. |
| 01:03.22 | jg | mallum: I was in the middle of testing it when the XFree86 thing blew up. |
| 01:03.27 | pb_ | spung: looks cool. I'll check it in tomorrow, my gpe-calendar tree is in disarray right now. |
| 01:05.18 | mallum | jg: okey, well Im interested in what your doing so if you need any help give me a nudge |
| 01:07.05 | jg | mallum: at worst, I'll work on it on the dev meeting, as those two days are set aside for X stuff.... |
| 01:08.07 | *** join/#gpe paulj (~paulj@hibernia.jakma.org) |
| 01:09.24 | paulj | well, that`s /me fixed in gpe-irc |
| 01:09.29 | spung | pb_: it still sucks tho :( |
| 01:09.32 | pb_ | great |
| 01:09.44 | pb_ | spung: :-/ |
| 01:10.11 | paul | next up.. |
| 01:10.17 | paul | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:10.53 | pb_ | dc_: maybe we should have the libgpewidget icon code add all the images that it loads to the stock pool. That would provide a forward migration path for applications, and it would also help fix the problem with toolbar icons not resizing properly. |
| 01:11.24 | pb_ | jg: well, I haven't noticed any serious performance hit yet with the new libc6, so I guess that's encouraging. |
| 01:13.23 | dc_ | pb_: ah yes! |
| 01:13.26 | paul | even if there is a small performance hit, as long it makes heap fragmentation less of a problem for Xipaq its probably worth it. |
| 01:13.29 | jg | pb_: yes. Any way we can get stats on the number of mmap calls? |
| 01:13.50 | pb_ | jg: not sure, I'll have to check. |
| 01:14.14 | pb_ | dc_: seems like that would be pretty easy, you just create a new GtkIconSet, add it to a GtkIconFactory, and register it with the stock system. |
| 01:14.24 | pb_ | dc_: I'll do that tomorrow, maybe |
| 01:14.43 | dc_ | cool |
| 01:15.31 | mallum | I think gtk2.4 is going to implement the icon theme spec properly |
| 01:15.50 | mallum | at the moment you have to work around it in the gtkrc |
| 01:15.51 | pb_ | paul: yeah, a small performance hit we can live with. But, mmap does have the potential to make certain allocations slower by a factor of somewhere between 10 and 100, or maybe even worse, so we need to be a bit careful not to tickle any pathological behaviour there. |
| 01:16.11 | paul | hmm... |
| 01:16.23 | jg | paul: it can kill windowing performance if it is run into in X, for example. |
| 01:16.33 | paul | eek. |
| 01:16.41 | jg | paul: the region code uses malloc/free heavily. |
| 01:17.06 | jg | paul: and it did once in the past, so we are very aware of it. |
| 01:17.22 | jg | paul: the allocation sizes however are related to screen size: the ipaq has a small screen.... |
| 01:17.46 | jg | paul: so my guess is we can use a decently small number. |
| 01:17.49 | mallum | jg: yeah but the zuarus and no doubt upcoming ipaqs dont |
| 01:17.56 | paul | aha. so, smaller allocation sizes, so libc 'use mmap' threshold can go up? |
| 01:18.11 | jg | no, the threshold can come down. |
| 01:18.17 | paul | down, yes. doh. |
| 01:18.41 | jg | trying to get used to the new vera sans.... |
| 01:18.53 | pb_ | ah, is it very different? |
| 01:19.11 | spung | pb_: well, i'm going to bugzilla it so I don't forget, wanna be cc'ed ? |
| 01:19.11 | jg | pb_: tighter line spacing: less leading. |
| 01:19.17 | pb_ | spung: please |
| 01:19.32 | jg | pb_: will be useful on the iPAQ. |
| 01:19.38 | pb_ | jg: yeah, sounds like a bonus. |
| 01:19.51 | spung | pb_: i'll just try another idea before :) |
| 01:19.51 | jg | Prima (from which Vera is derived) had an unusually large amount of leading. |
| 01:20.10 | pb_ | ah, I see. |
| 01:20.22 | jg | pb_: I really want Vera mono: so far, Jim's just gotten us Sans... |
| 01:20.42 | pb_ | right, so no terminal font yet. |
| 01:20.57 | spung | jg: ahh is Vera ready yet? |
| 01:21.02 | jg | pb_: should have it by late next week, early following week. |
| 01:21.05 | jg | spung: not quite. |
| 01:21.07 | pb_ | jg: great. |
| 01:21.43 | jg | spung: people asked for tighter spacing: Jim was kind enough to redesign the accents to make that possible, but that was more work than expected before he had that feedback. |
| 01:22.09 | spung | jg: well, no rush... quality first! really |
| 01:22.19 | jg | spung: exactly. |
| 01:22.30 | pb_ | jg: mallinfo() will tell you the "total number of chunks allocated with mmap", among other things. |
| 01:22.53 | pb_ | might be interesting to have the xserver call that on some signal and dump the information to stderr or something |
| 01:23.22 | jg | pb_: yes, maybe I should add that.... |
| 01:23.52 | mallum | bedtime for me, gnight all |
| 01:24.14 | pb_ | jg: it'll also tell you the amount of unused memory that is currently tied up in the heap, which would be interesting data in its own right. |
| 01:24.33 | jg | pb_: yes, very much so. I'll add that for sure then. |
| 01:25.25 | jg | pb_: It would tell us how much VM doing a compacting allocator for pixmaps would provide. |
| 01:26.01 | pb_ | Yes, indeed. |
| 01:28.25 | spung | pb_: ah I seem to have found the first DST bug of the season.. (not sure) |
| 01:28.34 | pb_ | spung: ha, that didn't take long. |
| 01:28.46 | spung | this one segfaults |
| 01:28.50 | pb_ | doh |
| 01:29.12 | spung | but the backtrace points to a gettime() or something so.. |
| 01:35.51 | *** join/#gpe paulj (~paulj@hibernia.jakma.org) |
| 01:36.09 | dc_ | hey paul |
| 01:36.15 | paul | heya dc |
| 01:36.22 | dc_ | paul: nice gpe-irc work :D |
| 01:37.02 | paul | hehe |
| 01:37.27 | paul | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:39.19 | paulj | woohoo |
| 01:39.27 | dc_ | yayy |
| 01:39.28 | dc_ | :D |
| 01:39.45 | paul | :) |
| 01:39.47 | paul | simple bug. |
| 01:39.56 | spung | damn |
| 01:40.18 | spung | paul: wanna try fix two bugs i'm dealing with? :D |
| 01:40.28 | paul | spung: possibly :) |
| 01:41.08 | paulj | spung: what are they? |
| 01:41.23 | spung | i have one for both paul's :) |
| 01:41.43 | paul | -paulj- GPE IRC 0.1, IRC Client for GPE - http://gpe.handhelds.org/ |
| 01:41.44 | paul | hehe |
| 01:42.47 | PaxAnima | spung: http://v058b.studby.ntnu.no/images/test_font.png <-- now I can draw the text on top of images ;) |
| 01:43.16 | spung | PaxAnima: can you make it port pscalc to gtk2? :))))))) |
| 01:43.23 | PaxAnima | spung: ;) |
| 01:43.47 | spung | PaxAnima: wow, that picture reminds me of those statues in easter island |
| 01:43.53 | spung | :) |
| 01:43.59 | PaxAnima | :)= |
| 01:44.26 | spung | PaxAnima: it involves applying a patch of mine to gpe-calendar and discovering why it sucks |
| 01:44.29 | spung | oops |
| 01:44.33 | spung | paul: it involves applying a patch of mine to gpe-calendar and discovering why it sucks |
| 01:44.45 | paul | oh? |
| 01:45.06 | spung | paul: i'll send it to you by mail if you want |
| 01:45.12 | paul | you just want general comment, or do you have specific suckage in mind? |
| 01:45.19 | paul | spung: paul@handhelds.org |
| 01:45.20 | spung | specific :) |
| 01:45.32 | spung | i'll explain the problem in the mail |
| 01:45.34 | paul | k |
| 01:45.51 | spung | because it's secret |
| 01:45.58 | PaxAnima | spung: maybe I'll have a go at porting pscalc tomorrow... |
| 01:46.05 | spung | no one (specially dc_) can hear about it |
| 01:46.15 | dc_ | ... |
| 01:46.27 | spung | nor PaxAnima because he'll render text on it or something |
| 01:46.31 | spung | PaxAnima: cool :) |
| 01:46.38 | moray | dc_: they're clearly up to something ;) |
| 01:46.49 | dc_ | moray: obviously, we must find out :) |
| 01:47.00 | PaxAnima | spung: I'll render text on everything I see!! even psCalc ;) |
| 01:47.02 | spung | ahh, i fear no one |
| 01:47.09 | moray | dc_: I suppose you could just r00t handhelds.org and intercept the message... |
| 01:47.38 | dc_ | moray: ah nice idea. |
| 01:47.41 | moray | hm, maybe I should move towards bed, with it being almost 3 a.m. :/ |
| 01:47.52 | dc_ | apt-get install l33troot-kit, right? |
| 01:48.03 | dc_ | moray: 2am.. |
| 01:48.04 | spung | i have no fear my good isp mail servers run microsoft mail something and i'm using the super secure SMTP protocol |
| 01:48.10 | paul | dc_: clocks have gone forward. |
| 01:48.18 | paul | (though my ipaq doesnt seem to have realised it) |
| 01:48.22 | moray | dc_: your clock is broken :p |
| 01:48.58 | paul | spung: ironic you should say that when only a few hours ago a sendmail update was released to fix a remote root exploit. |
| 01:49.27 | spung | another one? |
| 01:49.33 | *** join/#gpe dc__ (~dc@modem-160-53-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 01:49.38 | paul | yep |
| 01:49.41 | spung | damn |
| 01:49.54 | spung | a few hours you say? |
| 01:49.57 | paul | yep |
| 01:49.57 | spung | it's a weekend |
| 01:50.08 | dc__ | damn it.. |
| 01:50.09 | spung | maybe i can try r00t my school's server? :) |
| 01:50.12 | dc__ | losing an hour of my day |
| 01:50.15 | dc__ | how boring |
| 01:50.21 | spung | dc__: indeed |
| 01:51.35 | moray | spung: are you going to GUADEC? (random question) |
| 01:52.44 | spung | moray: i doubt it, no $$ i have to buy a new bass (900 euros or something) |
| 01:53.17 | spung | moray: why? do they have sendmail exploits there? :) |
| 01:53.43 | spung | moray: although guadec is in spain isn't it? |
| 01:53.48 | moray | spung: no, just thinking about which GPE types still haven't been met face to face |
| 01:54.10 | moray | spung: I think it's in Ireland this year |
| 01:54.28 | spung | moray: ohh, that's pretty far away |
| 01:55.38 | moray | I think Ryanair fly to Portugal, but I suppose flights won't be as cheap as for some other places |
| 01:56.17 | jg | spung: guadec is in Dublin, Ireland this year. |
| 01:56.53 | spung | jg: i've been in dublin once.. they should have had GUADEC there _that_ week, those bastards |
| 01:57.05 | jg | moray: spung, www.guadec.org |
| 01:57.24 | paul | jg: giving any talks? |
| 01:57.38 | jg | paul: no current plans. |
| 01:58.49 | jg | paul: I should probably give a reprise of Keith's and my Usenix talk, though.... |
| 01:59.04 | jg | (usenix is a couple days before Guadec). |
| 01:59.08 | paul | jg: be interesting.. |
| 01:59.26 | paul | hmm... any irc protocol experts here? |
| 01:59.56 | jg | paul: no, only X and HTTP protocol experts.... |
| 02:00.15 | paul | :) |
| 02:00.18 | dc__ | paul: pigeon is the closest we get here :} |
| 02:00.38 | paul | is it fair to say that if the word after PRIVMSG does not begin with #, then it must be a direct msg? |
| 02:00.55 | paul | ie not from a channel. |
| 02:03.41 | paul | dc__: what do you think of perhaps changing the server/channel buttons to 2 option menu's? one for servers, one for joined channels on that server? |
| 02:05.10 | *** join/#gpe moray (814fc0e788@mma29.dar.cam.ac.uk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 02:05.10 | *** join/#gpe pattieja (~pattieja@sc2-24.217.177.39.charter-stl.com) |
| 02:05.31 | spung | paul: you've got mail |
| 02:06.12 | dc__ | paul: yes, that was my original idea. |
| 02:06.22 | dc__ | paul: feel free to impliment it ;} |
| 02:06.37 | paul | dc__: b*stard :) |
| 02:06.43 | dc__ | hehe.... |
| 02:06.48 | dc__ | I have coursework to do :\ |
| 02:06.59 | dc__ | that's my excuse. |
| 02:07.12 | dc__ | if I had more time it'd be done by now :D |
| 02:07.31 | paul | dc__: also the code has a users_list_visible global. but there's no user list. |
| 02:07.46 | dc__ | paul: indeed, unimplimented aswell. |
| 02:08.38 | paulj | /msg paul foo |
| 02:08.56 | paul | ok... |
| 02:08.58 | dc__ | heh |
| 02:09.12 | paul | :) |
| 02:09.28 | paul | i'm learning irc by watching debug messages from gpe-irc |
| 02:09.59 | spung | dc__: what's coursework? |
| 02:10.48 | dc__ | spung: you know, that thing that they make you do before you're 16 at school. |
| 02:11.01 | spung | dc__: homework? |
| 02:11.13 | dc__ | spung: they make you spend large amounts of time writing a 15 page document. |
| 02:11.27 | spung | dc__: weird, why? |
| 02:11.28 | dc__ | spung: that only ends up as 20% of your final grade |
| 02:11.38 | dc__ | spung: it's just the way it's done in the UK. |
| 02:11.56 | dc__ | spung: it's kind of bad....but at the same time it can help get you a better grade. |
| 02:12.13 | spung | bad bad :) |
| 02:12.18 | spung | well, it's bed time |
| 02:12.20 | dc__ | quite :) |
| 02:12.23 | dc__ | no bed... |
| 02:12.24 | dc__ | heh. |
| 02:12.39 | spung | paul: if you have time take a look at my mail :) |
| 02:12.45 | paul | i'm sort of looking.. |
| 02:13.10 | paul | dc__: selling drugs? (as mallum asked at gpe-dev weekend iirc) |
| 02:13.16 | paul | :) |
| 02:13.32 | dc__ | havn't got that far yet. |
| 02:13.45 | spung | paul: it looks like a tough bug, efence doesn't help |
| 02:14.02 | spung | dc__: i hear it's a good business |
| 02:14.17 | paul | spung: my first suggestion would be to look very closely at the call to strptime() |
| 02:14.55 | dc__ | I get to do much cooler things |
| 02:15.00 | paul | :) |
| 02:15.00 | dc__ | than sell drugs.. |
| 02:15.09 | spung | dc__: consume them? |
| 02:15.11 | dc__ | like building a £4000 computer... |
| 02:15.14 | dc__ | spung: ;p |
| 02:15.25 | moray | spung: corrupting the youth? |
| 02:15.30 | spung | paul: gtk calls strptime not gpe-calendar? |
| 02:15.34 | paul | dc__: ah |
| 02:15.39 | paul | sorry... |
| 02:15.41 | paul | spung: ah. |
| 02:15.42 | moray | dc__: ! |
| 02:15.44 | dc__ | and koolance water cooling... |
| 02:15.45 | dc__ | mmmm |
| 02:15.57 | paul | dc__: is this for yourself? |
| 02:16.02 | spung | moray: no no no, i only corrupte people older than me |
| 02:16.05 | moray | dc__: is this some sort of 'spend as much money as possible' thing? |
| 02:16.14 | dc__ | moray: with the 256mb matrox paherllia they'll look great. |
| 02:16.26 | dc__ | paul: sadly, no. |
| 02:16.31 | paul | dc__: good! :) |
| 02:16.31 | dc__ | it's for a client of mine :} |
| 02:16.35 | moray | ha |
| 02:16.38 | paul | dc__: otherwise i'd be very jealous |
| 02:16.38 | dc__ | paul: =} |
| 02:16.51 | paul | dc__: got a little business? |
| 02:16.52 | dc__ | I'm jealous of my damn client. |
| 02:17.07 | spung | moray: btw, you didn't show up in the webcam: http://handhelds.org/~luis/gpedevweek/ |
| 02:17.23 | moray | spung: yes, I was hiding behind a TFT :) |
| 02:17.30 | dc__ | hehe |
| 02:17.38 | paul | spung: how come you didnt save a pic of me? |
| 02:17.51 | spung | paul: i think you're there in mallum.jpeg |
| 02:17.56 | paul | oh yes :) |
| 02:18.06 | spung | paul: let me rename that mallum_and_paul.jpeg |
| 02:18.26 | spung | :) |
| 02:18.38 | dc__ | god no, bad pictures of me there spung |
| 02:18.49 | moray | spung: there are already pictures of me on the internet, though mostly bad ones... |
| 02:19.04 | moray | spung: (e.g. at http://www.morayallan.com/ ;) |
| 02:19.25 | spung | dc__: our pictures are always bad :) |
| 02:19.46 | spung | dc__: well, except maybe if your a playboy playmate, or something like that |
| 02:19.49 | paul | dc__: what are the smiley and dialogue bubble buttons in gpe-irc supposed to do? |
| 02:20.23 | dc__ | paul: they were previously used for predictive text. |
| 02:20.26 | dc__ | http://photo.pho.be/people/moray_allan.jpg |
| 02:20.28 | dc__ | oh no! |
| 02:20.36 | dc__ | spung: be carefull |
| 02:20.37 | spung | paul: there you go :) http://handhelds.org/~luis/gpedevweek/mallum_and_paul.jpeg |
| 02:20.53 | dc__ | moray: good hair cut there ;p |
| 02:20.56 | moray | dc__: quite, although there are worse ones than that I fear |
| 02:21.05 | moray | dc__: that was me just out of the shower (after combing my hair) |
| 02:21.12 | dc__ | ah right |
| 02:21.20 | spung | i had a scotish teacher named allan, quite a character :) |
| 02:21.25 | moray | dc__: someone turned out to have a camera with him at breakfast, which seemed cheating |
| 02:22.32 | spung | we used to annoy him by calling him Hellen on purpose (it's quite common for portuguese at least so say Ehhhlan (allan)and Ehhhve (have)) |
| 02:23.31 | spung | hah, quite nice the hair cut |
| 02:23.32 | spung | :) |
| 02:23.57 | moray | spung: well, it's quite common as a surname (a bit less so as a first name) - although here in England no one can cope with spelling either my first name or surname... |
| 02:24.34 | dc__ | moray: we could have mallum and mallan |
| 02:24.39 | paul | indeed, all moray is missing there is the handlebar moustache, tweed suit and starched collar shirt. |
| 02:24.48 | dc__ | hehehe |
| 02:24.57 | moray | on that photo.pho.be site quite a few of the pictures are amusing, with people's confused expressions etc. as pictures were suddenly taken |
| 02:24.58 | spung | yeah |
| 02:25.09 | spung | moray: you should use mallan |
| 02:25.26 | paul | dc__: care to point a gtk+ newbie at the code that sets up the server and channels buttons? |
| 02:25.28 | moray | spung: what, just to frustrate autocompletion? ;) |
| 02:25.36 | loliveira | maybe I should make that LOLiveira |
| 02:25.44 | moray | loliveira: that's what I was thinking ;) |
| 02:26.18 | dc__ | paul: right, one sec. |
| 02:27.13 | dc__ | paul: look in main.c for gtk_toggle_button stuff, e.g. line 420 |
| 02:27.22 | paul | dc__: i think its somewhere in new_connection_dialog() (spelling? :) ) and join_channel_do(), just not sure. |
| 02:27.55 | paul | dc__: aha. thanks. |
| 02:28.21 | loliveira | hmm, the only pictures of me leaked to the net that I know of were here |
| 02:28.24 | loliveira | http://www.dei.uc.pt/mharc/html/humor/2002-10/msg00090.html |
| 02:28.35 | loliveira | but they seem to have been deleted |
| 02:28.36 | loliveira | :D |
| 02:29.14 | moray | loliveira: so none of these are you...? http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Lu3%ADs+Oliveira&sa=N&tab=wi |
| 02:29.50 | loliveira | it's in the humor list because I was being "Praxado" ... the "Praxe" is when old students make new students do stupid stuff |
| 02:31.11 | loliveira | moray: yeah, the little dog on page 3 :) |
| 02:32.01 | moray | loliveira: ah, mallum will be pleased |
| 02:32.16 | loliveira | moray: no, really, you have to disable the family filter, only naked pictures of me :) |
| 02:32.29 | moray | so, not this one? http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:Y0uyHmfPcB8C:www.animemotionbr.com/Imagens/DNA/homelogo.JPG |
| 02:32.37 | moray | (which was also in the search) |
| 02:32.58 | moray | or maybe http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=www.medslugs.de/photos4/Doriopsilla_pelseneeri_03.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.medslugs.de/E/Med/Doriopsilla_pelseneeri_03.htm&h=415&w=567&prev=/images%3Fq%3DLuis%2BOliveira%26start%3D20%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26sa%3DN |
| 02:33.18 | loliveira | heh |
| 02:33.20 | moray | (Spanish must be close enough, right?) |
| 02:33.38 | loliveira | images.google.com is fun |
| 02:33.51 | dc__ | hehehe |
| 02:33.53 | moray | hm, maybe I should put together a GPE hackers photo page with that one for you ;) |
| 02:34.30 | loliveira | moray: and put mallum: http://handhelds.org/~luis/gpedevweek/mallum_and_paul.jpeg |
| 02:34.35 | loliveira | moray: that's a must |
| 02:34.41 | moray | ah, of course |
| 02:36.11 | loliveira | moray: maybe a http://www.linuxdevices.com/files/misc/mallum-85x110.jpg vs. http://handhelds.org/~luis/gpedevweek/mallum_and_paul.jpeg |
| 02:36.35 | loliveira | moray: with a cgi to vote "Which is the real mallum?" |
| 02:37.11 | paul | :) |
| 02:37.23 | moray | loliveira: what, and gather all the pictures of pb in his hacking shirt? ;) |
| 02:37.30 | moray | (as mentioned the other day...) |
| 02:38.23 | dc__ | okay |
| 02:38.30 | dc__ | sleep for me now :) |
| 02:38.38 | dc__ | night night. |
| 02:38.43 | paul | night |
| 02:39.56 | loliveira | yeah must sleep! |
| 02:42.33 | moray | good nigth |
| 02:42.38 | moray | (good night, even) |
| 02:43.35 | spung | good night |
| 02:45.54 | paul | night |
| 11:20.47 | *** join/#gpe pb_ (~pb@pc2-cmbg4-3-cust239.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) |
| 12:11.51 | spung | hi pb_ |
| 12:12.50 | pb_ | hi spung |
| 12:13.05 | spung | pb_: read my mail yet? :\ |
| 12:13.17 | pb_ | which one? |
| 12:13.22 | pb_ | I replied to a couple of your mails an hour or so ago. |
| 12:13.34 | spung | pb_: ahh let me check |
| 12:15.31 | spung | pb_: ahh yes, no point trying to debug this one really |
| 12:17.54 | *** join/#gpe HET2 (~diman@chello080110105196.509.15.vie.surfer.at) |
| 12:20.13 | *** join/#gpe jimhill (~jimhill@216.184.13.24.unused.swcp.com) |
| 12:20.21 | *** part/#gpe jimhill (~jimhill@216.184.13.24.unused.swcp.com) |
| 12:22.04 | *** join/#gpe PaxAnima (~petter@v058b.studby.ntnu.no) |
| 12:24.35 | pb_ | spung: maybe now I will be motivated to finish the new day view. |
| 12:25.03 | spung | :) |
| 12:25.24 | spung | pb_: what kind of features are you planning for your day view? |
| 12:25.43 | pb_ | well, superficially it will look much like the old one. |
| 12:26.07 | pb_ | but it will have pop-up menus for editing events, the ability to select a time and just start typing to create an appointment, that kind of thing. |
| 12:26.24 | spung | that sounds cool |
| 12:26.30 | pb_ | plus fewer bugs, one would hope. |
| 12:27.11 | spung | pb_: heh. will it draw an event that starts at 13:15 differently than one that starts at 13:00 (unlike the current day view) |
| 12:27.46 | pb_ | hm, what do you mean? |
| 12:28.51 | spung | pb_: it'd be neat if the 13:15 were drawn a bit more far down than the 13:00 one, you see what I mean? |
| 12:29.13 | pb_ | ah, not really |
| 12:29.48 | pb_ | you mean you want the times to go 13:00 - 13:15 - 13:30 - 14:00 or whatever, with an extra line for the event? |
| 12:32.39 | spung | hmm |
| 12:32.53 | spung | pb_: i think the opie calendar does what i mean, let me check for screenshots |
| 12:32.58 | pb_ | ok, cool |
| 12:34.51 | spung | pb_: here it is: http://www.opie.info/~opie/screenies/port.1261.png |
| 12:35.26 | pb_ | ah, I see. |
| 12:35.29 | pb_ | yes, that would be cool. |
| 14:08.46 | spung | pb_: i thought you had fixed the evil C99'isms in gpe-calendar? |
| 14:09.28 | spung | week_view.c: In function `draw_expose_event': |
| 14:09.28 | spung | week_view.c:163: parse error before `*' |
| 14:09.37 | spung | week_view.c: In function `week_view_update': |
| 14:09.37 | spung | week_view.c:276: parse error before `*' |
| 14:09.45 | spung | week_view.c:309: parse error before `*' |
| 14:09.45 | spung | week_view.c:312: `summary' undeclared (first use in this function) |
| 14:13.27 | pb_ | spung: I fixed the one you pointed out yesterday, but I didn't go looking for others. |
| 14:13.56 | spung | oh ok |
| 14:14.11 | pb_ | if you find more, perhaps you could send me a patch. |
| 14:14.20 | spung | i'll make a diff (it's just that the ipaq cluster's gcc is pre-C99) |
| 14:14.36 | pb_ | I think you can export CC=gcc-3.2 to get a C99-capable compiler on the cluster. |
| 14:20.02 | PaxAnima | spung: http://v058b.studby.ntnu.no/pscalc2.png |
| 14:20.32 | spung | PaxAnima: nice going :) |
| 14:23.06 | PaxAnima | spung: got any suggestions for features I might add to it? any usability stuff, etc.? |
| 14:23.56 | spung | PaxAnima: hmm, borderless colorful buttons for starters :) |
| 14:24.04 | spung | not borderless |
| 14:24.09 | spung | just not 3D :) |
| 14:25.11 | PaxAnima | spung: that should be fixed rather quickly.. anything else? |
| 14:26.03 | BBrox | spung: an hexadecimal mode of course ! |
| 14:26.26 | PaxAnima | BBrox: it has that ;) |
| 14:26.29 | spung | i thought pscalc had one already? |
| 14:26.36 | spung | thought so |
| 14:27.41 | BBrox | I did not see the button :-) |
| 14:30.33 | PaxAnima | spung: hmm.. doesn't look like it's possible to remove the 3d look of the buttons while keeping the borders.. :/ |
| 14:31.05 | spung | PaxAnima: hmm |
| 14:31.20 | spung | how does it look like without borders? |
| 14:31.30 | pb_ | The 3d look of the buttons would be a theme issue. |
| 14:31.32 | spung | shouldn't look too bad |
| 14:32.05 | spung | pb_: yeah, for a calculator 2d look is cooler despite the theme 'a la xcalc :) |
| 14:32.55 | pb_ | true. |
| 14:34.01 | spung | PaxAnima: you could make it themable like pocketpc 2002's calc (but their theming sucks, it's fixed res, and portrait only so I guess proper theming would be overkill!) |
| 14:34.07 | PaxAnima | spung: http://v058b.studby.ntnu.no/pscalc2_no_relief.png |
| 14:34.51 | spung | PaxAnima: and I'm sure you can fit your image library in there, somewhere :) |
| 14:34.56 | PaxAnima | spung: ;) |
| 14:35.12 | spung | PaxAnima: it looks ok to me. it'll look even better with color buttons |
| 14:35.42 | PaxAnima | spung: the thing is: you don't get any colours when using GTK_RELIEF_NONE |
| 14:36.29 | spung | PaxAnima: ohh, really? |
| 14:36.41 | spung | are you sure? |
| 14:37.44 | PaxAnima | yes... the "DEC" and "DEG" buttons are greenish, remember.. they only have their colour when the mouse is above the button |
| 14:38.14 | spung | ahh |
| 14:38.16 | spung | that sucks |
| 14:40.34 | PaxAnima | well, I guess it may be a themeing issue as well |
| 14:40.59 | spung | maybe pb has some insight on this |
| 14:42.09 | *** join/#gpe jsmanrique (jsmanrique@cmr-81-9-140-146.telecable.es) |
| 14:42.16 | jsmanrique | hi! |
| 14:42.23 | PaxAnima | hi, jsmanrique |
| 14:42.38 | jsmanrique | anyone knows when Jornada 56x will be supported by Familiar? |
| 14:42.43 | jsmanrique | PaxAnima: hi! |
| 14:45.15 | spung | jsmanrique: try #handhelds.org |
| 14:46.09 | jsmanrique | ok, I was on #familiar without answer :-) |
| 14:46.27 | PaxAnima | jsmanrique: porting psCalc to gtk2 now ;) |
| 14:46.56 | jsmanrique | PaxAnima: cool |
| 14:49.06 | pb_ | jsmanrique: I think jornada 56x is pretty much dead, though I could be wrong about that. |
| 14:49.34 | jsmanrique | pb_: yes, that's what I think |
| 14:50.10 | pb_ | Jornada 720 still seems to have some hope. |
| 14:50.40 | jsmanrique | pb_: yes, but it is too expensive in Spain, and almost impossible to get a FlashROM unit |
| 14:50.51 | pb_ | ah. |
| 14:51.18 | jsmanrique | pb_: I was asking just to help some friends that would like buying a pda, to run gpe on them |
| 14:51.42 | jsmanrique | pb_: so, ipaq is the answer |
| 14:51.45 | pb_ | spung: you should submit gpe-today to the translation project. |
| 14:51.52 | pb_ | jsmanrique: yeah, so it seems. Or Zaurus, possibly. |
| 14:51.56 | jsmanrique | is nils here? |
| 14:52.10 | jsmanrique | just to get some info about simpad |
| 14:52.42 | pb_ | rumour has it that the $200 offer for Zaurus SL-5500 will be starting again next month. |
| 14:53.12 | spung | pb_: good idea |
| 14:53.19 | pb_ | though, I'm not sure if it is possible to get them shipped to Europe at reasonable cost. |
| 14:53.40 | jsmanrique | pb_: yes, that's the problem |
| 14:53.54 | jsmanrique | pb_: in Spain Zaurus costs 699 Euros |
| 14:54.30 | pb_ | jsmanrique: wow, the sl-5500? |
| 14:54.37 | pb_ | jsmanrique: here in the UK they are about 300 euros |
| 14:54.56 | jsmanrique | pb_: yes, the sl-5500 |
| 14:55.20 | pb_ | jsmanrique: you should call an english distributor then. I would have thought shipping within the EU would be no problem. |
| 14:55.34 | jsmanrique | pb_: it is an idea |
| 14:56.06 | *** join/#gpe flypiper (~netwinder@12-222-141-210.client.insightBB.com) |
| 14:56.19 | pb_ | see http://www.digiuk.com/sharp/right_frame/right.asp?section=zar for example. |
| 14:57.05 | jsmanrique | pb_: thanks, I'll see |
| 15:00.45 | jsmanrique | and about simpad, any info? |
| 15:01.09 | pb_ | No, I don't know much about simpad. Nils knows of a cheap distributor in Germany, though. |
| 15:01.27 | spung | pb_: how cheap? |
| 15:01.37 | pb_ | spung: either 200 or 300 euros, I forget which |
| 15:01.47 | jsmanrique | pb_: that's cheap |
| 15:02.12 | spung | jsmanrique: can the simpad work as a laptop replacement? |
| 15:02.21 | jsmanrique | pb_: don't know |
| 15:02.26 | jsmanrique | spung: don't know |
| 15:02.38 | jsmanrique | in Spain, simpad costs 600 Euros |
| 15:02.51 | pb_ | in England, simpad costs 1500 euros (!) |
| 15:02.57 | spung | damn |
| 15:03.01 | jsmanrique | pb_: wow!!!!!! |
| 15:03.03 | spung | those bastards |
| 15:03.12 | pb_ | pays to shop around :-) |
| 15:03.18 | spung | quite |
| 15:03.26 | spung | pb_: does it have builtin wireless? |
| 15:03.34 | jsmanrique | pb_: almost same than TC1000 TabletPC |
| 15:03.38 | pb_ | don't think so, though it has pcmcia slots. |
| 15:03.40 | pb_ | jsmanrique: quite. |
| 15:04.07 | jsmanrique | pb_: incredible |
| 15:04.32 | spung | is there anything for ~250 euros with builtin wireless? |
| 15:04.42 | pb_ | jsmanrique: well, that's just one retailer I know of in England. There are probably others who sell them more cheaply. |
| 15:04.54 | pb_ | spung: not that I can think of. |
| 15:05.35 | pb_ | spung: zaurus with a CF wireless card is probably your best bet. |
| 15:05.55 | spung | well, i guess i won't have a wireless gadjet any time soon.. i failed to buy one from expansys (bastards :\) and now i have to buy a new bass |
| 15:05.58 | spung | :) |
| 15:06.06 | pb_ | heh |
| 15:06.09 | spung | that'd be 800 euros |
| 15:06.10 | spung | so |
| 15:06.15 | spung | gotta save money |
| 15:06.20 | pb_ | right. |
| 15:06.32 | spung | 900, that is |
| 15:07.04 | spung | it's all about priorities :) |
| 15:07.10 | pb_ | yeah, I need to save money also, need to buy a new bike. |
| 15:07.14 | pb_ | spung: indeed |
| 15:07.41 | spung | pb_: ahh, that too! i have to buy a new suspension for my bike, completely ruined it that time I tried downhill |
| 15:08.17 | pb_ | spung: aha |
| 15:08.45 | spung | i should get a part-time job |
| 15:09.08 | spung | anyone want to pay me to fix pb's evil c99's in gpe-calendar |
| 15:09.42 | PaxAnima | has anyone here used GtkTextTag before? |
| 15:11.06 | spung | pb_: btw, i have a patch to change a couple of them.. but one or two still missing.. i'm thinking it might not be worth it? what do you think (as the person who put them there in the first place)? |
| 15:12.22 | spung | pb_: i say this, because these particular ones are not that evil :) |
| 15:15.15 | spung | luis@ipaq2:~/cvs/gpe/base/libdm$ make |
| 15:15.20 | spung | In file included from migrate.c:23: |
| 15:15.20 | spung | auth.h:13:20: gcrypt.h: No such file or directory |
| 15:15.43 | pb_ | spung: well, I didn't put them in deliberately. I have no particular views either way on whether gpe-calendar should require a c99 compiler or not, to be honest. |
| 15:16.16 | pb_ | spung: if you want to take them out, that's fine, but I am not all that interested in conducting a large witch-hunt to root out C99 constructs whereever they might have crept in. |
| 15:16.27 | spung | quite |
| 15:16.36 | pb_ | ah, sounds like you need to send mail to admin@handhelds.org to have libgcrypt-dev installed. |
| 15:16.42 | spung | pb_: ok |
| 15:17.30 | pb_ | spung: I suspect that, even if we take out all the c99 stuff now, it is going to start sneaking back in again before too long simply because I build with gcc 3.2 all the time and so I don't notice the problems. |
| 15:18.14 | pb_ | brb, need to go cut the grass |
| 15:18.28 | spung | indeed |
| 15:19.59 | spung | pb_: ah, what happened in libtododb, i get lots of warnings compiling it |
| 15:36.30 | pb_ | spung: dunno, what kind of warnings? |
| 15:37.09 | spung | a couple of these: |
| 15:37.10 | spung | todo-db.c:347:83: warning: pasting ""insert into todo values (%d, '%q', '"" and ""%q"" does not give a valid preprocessing token |
| 15:37.22 | pb_ | ah, yeah, I saw those too. I'm not quite sure what's going on there. |
| 15:37.39 | pb_ | maybe check the gcc manual |
| 15:38.48 | flypiper | pb_: you cut the grass that quick?? |
| 15:38.56 | spung | flypiper: indeed! |
| 15:39.10 | spung | flypiper: pb keeps some grass in a vase you know |
| 15:39.13 | pb_ | flypiper: heh, my lawn is pretty small. |
| 15:39.42 | flypiper | pb_: takes me 2 hrs on a lawn tractor:( |
| 15:40.03 | pb_ | flypiper: :-/ |
| 15:40.52 | flypiper | pb_: do you use gcc 3.2.2 ??? I can't get a kernel to compile on my unstable winder?? |
| 15:41.24 | flypiper | errr looks like it's 3.3.2 |
| 15:41.26 | pb_ | flypiper: yeah, jamey and I use gcc 3.2.2/3.2.3 to build the h3900 kernels. what goes wrong? |
| 15:42.00 | flypiper | Pukes with a mmap.c error with irq stuff missing |
| 15:42.21 | pb_ | hrm |
| 15:42.36 | flypiper | I have changed headers and tried different patches.. with the same result.. |
| 15:43.10 | flypiper | let me start it again.. and I can give you the exact error |
| 15:43.53 | pb_ | right |
| 16:03.12 | spung | flypiper: any bets? |
| 16:03.37 | spung | flypiper: car washing vs cutting grass |
| 16:05.08 | spung | car wash - 17 min, cutting grass - 18 min |
| 16:05.22 | spung | something like that |
| 16:05.34 | PaxAnima | pb_: has spring arrived in england, or something? ;) |
| 16:05.37 | pb_ | PaxAnima: yep |
| 16:05.45 | pb_ | spung: ah, pretty much a dead heat then. |
| 16:06.28 | pb_ | in fact it's been spring-like here for a week or so. |
| 16:07.13 | spung | 29 minutes on the supermarket yesterday |
| 16:07.46 | spung | ~23 minutes having dinner |
| 16:08.04 | spung | pb_: we know all about you :) |
| 16:08.09 | pb_ | fear |
| 16:09.03 | flypiper | pb_: looks like gcc is 3.2.3 pre-release.. im donwloading 3.2.2 src and will install that and try it:) |
| 16:09.17 | spung | i guess that on average you're the 20 minute guy :) (this cd-burning on this XP maching is taking way to long, nothing interesting to do here :)) |
| 16:09.17 | pb_ | flypiper: cool |
| 16:26.37 | PaxAnima | spung: psCalc2 is coming along quite nicely ;) |
| 16:36.12 | spung | PaxAnima: cool! |
| 16:36.26 | spung | PaxAnima: do you have cvs somewhere? |
| 16:37.24 | spung | PaxAnima: you could put it in gpe cvs, that'd be cool |
| 16:38.38 | PaxAnima | spung: I still need to learn CVS.. but I'll put the dirty code a CVS, so peeople can clean it up, if necesary ;) |
| 16:41.24 | jsmanrique | PaxAnima: does pscalc2 add some extra feature? |
| 16:42.09 | PaxAnima | jsmanrique: not really... I think I might have found some bugs, but otherwise it's the same... |
| 16:43.30 | jsmanrique | does anyone know any string to mathml parser? |
| 16:43.57 | jsmanrique | I mean something to take a text like x^2+5 and translate it to mathml |
| 16:44.24 | jsmanrique | just to play with it and gtk-mathml |
| 16:44.53 | PaxAnima | what's mathml? |
| 16:50.11 | jsmanrique | PaxAnima: xml for maths |
| 16:50.14 | PaxAnima | ah |
| 16:50.25 | *** join/#gpe florian (~fuchs@p50928B2A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:50.29 | florian | hi all! |
| 16:51.33 | PaxAnima | hi, florian |
| 16:51.51 | jsmanrique | PaxAnima: http://www.w3.org/Math/ |
| 16:52.07 | jsmanrique | PaxAnima: http://helm.cs.unibo.it/mml-widget/ |
| 17:09.28 | *** join/#gpe florian (~fuchs@p50928B2A.dip.t-dialin.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 17:10.00 | *** join/#gpe HET2 (~diman@chello080110105196.509.15.vie.surfer.at) |
| 17:10.34 | PaxAnima | "infix" mode is now working in psCalc2 ;) moving on to RPN mode... |
| 17:18.17 | spung | knoppix is SSSSSSSOOOOOOOO cool |
| 17:19.06 | PaxAnima | never tried it |
| 17:22.02 | *** join/#gpe flypiper (~netwinder@12-222-141-210.client.insightBB.com) |
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| 17:27.53 | *** join/#gpe florian (~fuchs@p50928B2A.dip.t-dialin.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 17:28.04 | pb_ | hi florian |
| 17:38.27 | *** join/#gpe dc_ (~dc@modem-180-58-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 17:39.00 | dc_ | evening :\ |
| 17:39.08 | pb_ | dc_: yo |
| 17:39.11 | florian | pb_: hi |
| 17:39.56 | dc_ | I had to go to some national trust park and try and use the laptop in full sunlight. |
| 17:40.04 | dc_ | :-| |
| 17:40.11 | pb_ | hm, whatever floats your boat I guess. |
| 17:40.46 | pb_ | presumably that didn't turn out so well. |
| 17:42.03 | dc_ | indeed, laptops need reflective screens. |
| 17:42.28 | pb_ | yeah, that would be a boon. |
| 17:43.20 | PaxAnima | argh... got some invalid GtkTextIterators somewhere, but I don't see them :/ |
| 17:43.45 | flypiper | dc_: try to use it driving down the road with the sun on it:/ |
| 17:44.10 | dc_ | flypiper: ! |
| 17:44.17 | dc_ | flypiper: a few saftey issues there ;) |
| 17:44.59 | flypiper | dc_: yep... gotta stop ! |
| 17:46.53 | dc_ | hrm |
| 17:47.16 | dc_ | pb_: it seems expansys only sell 128Mb MMC cards, are you aware of anywhere that sells larger ones? |
| 17:47.34 | pb_ | dc_: I think MMC pretty much tops out at 128MB. |
| 17:47.40 | dc_ | damn... |
| 17:47.49 | dc_ | pb_: why is that? |
| 17:48.10 | pb_ | all the larger cards are SD. I'm not sure why. |
| 17:48.26 | dc_ | how boring, oh well |
| 17:49.21 | dc_ | wow, socket wireless SD card is on offer. |
| 17:49.22 | pb_ | You can get CF up to several gigabytes now if you need more space. |
| 17:49.46 | pb_ | oh, it is? cool! |
| 17:49.49 | dc_ | I guess 128Mb will do, it's mainly so I can have wireless and memory in the c700 at the same time |
| 17:49.55 | pb_ | ah right, yeah |
| 17:49.57 | dc_ | http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=WLAN6060&asource= |
| 17:50.22 | dc_ | is 5450 SDIO? |
| 17:50.31 | pb_ | hm, that just says "not announced; available to pre-order" for me. |
| 17:50.38 | dc_ | indeed. |
| 17:50.39 | pb_ | yeah, 3900 and 5400 both have sdio. |
| 17:50.50 | dc_ | it says march |
| 17:50.59 | pb_ | ah, yes, so it does. |
| 17:51.08 | pb_ | well, they'd better hurry up, not much of March left. |
| 17:51.40 | PaxAnima | anyone here used g_signal_stop_emission() before? |
| 17:51.52 | dc_ | pb_: yep |
| 17:52.24 | pb_ | I'd be quite tempted to buy one of those cards. Having wireless lan in the SD slot would certainly be cool. |
| 17:52.42 | pb_ | I guess it should work with your Z as well. |
| 17:52.56 | dc_ | indeed. |
| 17:53.09 | dc_ | I would like to know how large the arial part is. |
| 17:53.14 | pb_ | yeah |
| 17:55.43 | dc_ | bbl, food. |
| 17:57.54 | *** join/#gpe jg (~jg@dialup-63.214.91.155.Dial1.Boston1.Level3.net) |
| 17:58.58 | pb_ | hi jg |
| 17:59.16 | jg | pb_: hi. |
| 18:09.12 | pb_ | cmarqu: I uploaded gpe-what 0.27, which changes the colours as you requested. |
| 18:32.46 | dc_ | pb_: what's the state of our clock today? |
| 18:33.01 | pb_ | dc_: ah, I was about to ask you the same thing. |
| 18:33.10 | pb_ | I haven't done anything to it today. |
| 18:33.19 | dc_ | great minds think alike and all. |
| 18:33.22 | dc_ | pb_: okay. |
| 18:33.44 | dc_ | pb_: well...I had a brief though about the best way to handle this day/night wheel. |
| 18:33.45 | pb_ | flypiper: seems like a bad patch to me. I can't think that would be caused by a compiler problem. |
| 18:33.53 | dc_ | pb_: and really..it needs to be rotated. |
| 18:34.04 | dc_ | pb_: to make it as unconfusing to the user as possible |
| 18:34.15 | pb_ | dc_: well, rotating should be easy enough. |
| 18:34.15 | flypiper | pb_: Thanks.. I will try another patch:) |
| 18:34.30 | dc_ | pb_: with smoothing :} |
| 18:34.59 | pb_ | dc_: oh, you want an animated rotation? |
| 18:35.09 | dc_ | indeed :| |
| 18:35.20 | pb_ | ah. |
| 18:35.24 | dc_ | so it rotates as the hour is changed. |
| 18:35.33 | pb_ | mm, yeah, I see. |
| 18:35.36 | pb_ | that would make sense. |
| 18:35.46 | dc_ | yes. |
| 18:35.58 | pb_ | how many steps of rotation are needed, do you think? It might be easiest just to pre-build the rotated images using the Gimp. |
| 18:36.06 | dc_ | and its function should become very clear to first time users. |
| 18:36.22 | pb_ | You would only need to do rotation for one quadrant, since we can easily rotate by multiples of 90 degrees at runtime. |
| 18:37.10 | dc_ | I guess that would be fine |
| 18:37.58 | dc_ | otherwise, we can always do the polygon thing. |
| 18:38.15 | dc_ | and have a box that is rotated. |
| 18:38.27 | pb_ | yeah. Well, I guess six steps should be enough, since that would give you one for each hour. |
| 18:38.46 | dc_ | um... |
| 18:38.52 | dc_ | pb_: 12 hours? |
| 18:39.02 | pb_ | 24, I was thinking |
| 18:39.37 | dc_ | hrm, well. |
| 18:39.48 | dc_ | let me have a go at the easier polygon method. |
| 18:39.55 | pb_ | righto |
| 18:40.05 | dc_ | and if it's unusable, we'll go the other route. |
| 18:40.14 | pb_ | okay, sounds sensible |
| 18:50.09 | *** join/#gpe chrisime__ (~chrisime@p50802B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:52.39 | PaxAnima | should I add a scrollbar to psCalc? |
| 18:52.58 | PaxAnima | spung? |
| 18:57.43 | pb_ | gah, now I'm out of disk space on this machine too. |
| 18:59.28 | dc_ | arg, brb. |
| 19:18.30 | PaxAnima | yay! psCalc2 is working... and the filesize is even smaller than the 1.2 version.. |
| 19:20.10 | PaxAnima | I'll build an arm binary later today |
| 19:39.02 | *** join/#gpe mallum (~mallum@pc-80-193-218-21-hw.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 19:40.14 | PaxAnima | evening, mallum |
| 19:40.22 | florian | mallum: hi mallum |
| 19:41.52 | mallum | hello ! |
| 19:48.30 | spung | PaxAnima: i guess, so |
| 20:38.43 | mallum | jg: hi, how is your paper going ? |
| 20:39.49 | jg | mallum: we have a cool visualization tool: for the first time it is easy to explore what an application is doing and understand how to improve both it (usually the toolkit) and what we should add to X. |
| 20:41.05 | mallum | jg: wow, sounds cool |
| 20:41.14 | mallum | jg: is it publically availble ? |
| 20:42.18 | jg | yup. You get a plot versus time of all the packets, annotated with which request/reply/event is in the packet. |
| 20:42.33 | jg | mallum: there are some amazingly stupid things going on. |
| 20:42.51 | jg | mallum: some of which should be like shooting fish in a barrel to fix. |
| 20:43.58 | mallum | jg: yeah I can imagine, a tool like that would really help |
| 20:44.16 | jg | mallum: yup. It shure does and will.... |
| 20:45.20 | mallum | jg: so is this something keithp has written ? |
| 20:46.27 | jg | mallum: mostly. We do use a tool that Tim Shephard wrote. The measurement methodology is mine. (I take credit for the ideas here that Keith's been implementing). |
| 20:47.15 | jg | It's an extension of methodology I (and Henrik Frystyk) developed for analysing HTTP/1.1 performance. |
| 20:47.45 | mallum | jg: ah okey, so is it publically available yet ;-) ? |
| 20:48.05 | jg | mallum: if public, you mean in Keithp's CVS, the answer is yes. |
| 20:48.21 | jg | mallum: to exploit it, though, you need to be able to capture packet traces. |
| 20:48.48 | jg | mallum: that takes a bit of hassle to get, say 3 machines, all set up.... |
| 20:49.46 | mallum | jg: you cant use it like you would XScope on 1 machine ? |
| 20:50.36 | jg | mallum: not easily. You need raw packets. |
| 20:51.41 | mallum | jg: are then any basic docs on setting it up to run ? |
| 20:52.09 | jg | mallum: doc's, surely you must be joking. We're in the middle of developing it for the first time.... |
| 20:55.33 | mallum | hehe |
| 20:56.10 | mallum | jg: whats is called, when I get some spare time I'll download it , see if I can figure out how to work it and write some basic docs |
| 20:56.46 | jg | xcap and xplot |
| 20:57.19 | jg | xcap package has the basic packet capture and analysis tools, and xplot is the visualization tool. |
| 21:08.55 | *** join/#gpe paul ([fhzr6kHaV@hibernia.jakma.org) |
| 21:11.44 | *** join/#gpe stargirl (hmw26@potato.newn.cam.ac.uk) |
| 21:12.08 | paul | hi hanna |
| 21:12.13 | stargirl | heya paul |
| 21:12.48 | paul | stargirl: still got those simpson's fridge magnets? :) |
| 21:14.19 | paul | whats dc's email? |
| 21:15.56 | stargirl | paul: yep |
| 21:16.03 | stargirl | hmm, can't remember dc's email address |
| 21:16.06 | stargirl | moray'd know |
| 21:16.15 | paul | dctanner@handhelds.org? is that it? |
| 21:16.51 | stargirl | dunno maybe |
| 21:31.31 | cmarqu | ibot: dc? |
| 21:31.33 | | dc is probably better known as dc_ |
| 21:31.38 | cmarqu | ibot: dc_? |
| 21:31.38 | | well, dc_ is a young iPaq hacker or has an email mailto:dctanner@magenet.com or the "added pixmaps to <file>.c" changelog man or a person who loses mibus' code or http://handhelds.org/~cmarqu/dc.jpg |
| 21:31.45 | cmarqu | There. |
| 21:31.47 | *** join/#gpe jsmanrique (jsmanrique@cmr-81-9-140-146.telecable.es) |
| 21:31.51 | jsmanrique | hi |
| 21:32.12 | mallum | hey jsmanrique |
| 21:32.55 | paul | thank you cmarqu |
| 21:34.19 | *** join/#gpe dneuer (~smoothie@192.204.192.36) |
| 21:34.29 | dneuer | hi all |
| 21:36.28 | mallum | hey dneuer |
| 21:39.13 | jsmanrique | is nils here? |
| 21:39.23 | jsmanrique | I don't know what is his nick |
| 21:39.50 | mallum | jsmanrique: no, nils is rarely here |
| 21:45.04 | jsmanrique | ok |
| 21:59.25 | dneuer | hi mallum |
| 21:59.31 | dneuer | got distracted, sorry |
| 22:18.43 | pb_ | dneuer: apropos your message on ipaq@ list, I think that problem is caused by gcc 3.2.1 miscompiling the h3600_micro driver. |
| 22:18.55 | pb_ | dneuer: try with gcc 2.95 or 3.2.3 |
| 22:24.09 | dneuer | pb_: actually, I was wrong on the list. It's 3.2.3 |
| 22:24.42 | pb_ | dneuer: ah, oh dear. |
| 22:24.53 | chrisime__ | nite |
| 22:30.50 | dneuer | pb_: my guess is it's related to andyc's irq changes |
| 22:31.19 | dneuer | it actually doesn't seem to affect anything in a negative way |
| 22:31.27 | dneuer | but it's mysterious and annoying |
| 22:31.43 | PaxAnima | hmm.. where can I find nice icons? need a calculator icon that doesn't conflict with gpe-calculator |
| 22:32.01 | pb_ | dneuer: that problem has been happening for as long as I can remember with gcc3 compiled kernels. I don't think it's new. |
| 22:32.24 | dneuer | pb_: what do the builders use to build the release kernels? |
| 22:32.36 | pb_ | 3.2.3 for pxa; 2.95.4 for strongarm |
| 22:32.44 | dneuer | pb_; ahhh |
| 22:33.33 | dneuer | pb_: has anyone examined the asm in h3600_micro.c to see what the difference is? |
| 22:34.07 | pb_ | no, not that I know of. |
| 22:35.11 | dneuer | maybe I'll pull down a 2.95.4 toolchain from hh.org |
| 22:35.29 | pb_ | might be a plan. I think that's the easiest way to get it to work. |
| 22:35.41 | pb_ | It'd be nice to fix the problem with gcc3 at some point, obviously. |
| 22:36.13 | dneuer | Well, if I get the 2.95.4 chain I'll have both, so I could conceivably take a look at the difference |
| 22:36.19 | pb_ | cool |
| 22:36.40 | dneuer | So far, the kernel + modules (despite the problem) seem to work fine |
| 22:37.26 | dneuer | pb_: though I'm *so* not an asm person, I'd probably just post the results to the list |
| 22:37.35 | pb_ | hah |
| 22:37.46 | dneuer | though I do have the Big Arm Book |
| 22:38.20 | pb_ | yeah, comparing assembler from two different versions of gcc is always a slightly daunting task. |
| 22:38.54 | cmarqu | PaxAnima: art.gnome.org ? |
| 22:39.00 | pb_ | if you could find some way to pin down which function (or even which part of which function) is going wrong, that would be a help. |
| 22:39.08 | PaxAnima | cmarqu: thanks, looking at it now |
| 22:39.20 | cmarqu | Hi all BTW :) |
| 22:39.23 | pb_ | hi cmarqu :-) |
| 22:39.58 | dneuer | I know exactly where the message is being generated, but I'm not sure why |
| 22:40.05 | dneuer | well, one of the messages |
| 22:40.12 | dneuer | I think it's a timeout issue |
| 22:40.48 | pb_ | right |
| 22:41.02 | jsmanrique | good night |
| 22:41.03 | dneuer | well crap, that doens't work. KERN_INFO goes to the console? |
| 22:41.08 | jsmanrique | see you |
| 22:41.22 | pb_ | dunno, depends on your selected printk level. |
| 22:41.38 | pb_ | I think the default is for INFO to go to the console, but something might have changed it. |
| 22:42.45 | dneuer | pb_: I couldn't find a syslog.conf; is there any way on the iPAQ to change the destination for the loglevels? |
| 22:43.17 | pb_ | dneuer: if all you want to do is control what goes to the console, you can bash at /proc/sys/kernel/printk |
| 22:43.45 | dneuer | pb_: does that hit do_syslog from printk.c |
| 22:43.46 | dneuer | ? |
| 22:44.07 | dneuer | ie echo 6 > /proc/sys/kernel/printk? |
| 22:44.45 | pb_ | no, I think it directly modifies console_printk[] |
| 22:45.34 | dneuer | well, I'm doing a little experiment now to get rid of one of the messages, and correlate statistics between timeouts and the message |
| 22:45.45 | pb_ | right |
| 22:46.12 | dneuer | I bet ACK timeouts and the # of times the message is printed will be the same |
| 22:49.12 | dneuer | There are an awful lot of battery message ACK timeouts |
| 23:03.52 | *** join/#gpe pb__ (~pb@pc2-cmbg4-3-cust239.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) |
| 23:04.01 | pb__ | well, that didn't work so well. :-/ |
| 23:05.13 | dneuer | pb__: I was right; from 'cat /proc/micro/stats' shows, among other things: |
| 23:05.19 | dneuer | ACK timeouts : 60 |
| 23:05.19 | dneuer | Unexpected ACK ids : 60 |
| 23:05.27 | pb__ | dneuer: cool |
| 23:05.53 | dneuer | pb__: is there something, say in GPE, which polls the battery status? |
| 23:07.28 | pb__ | yeah, the battery monitor would do that. |
| 23:07.40 | cmarqu | Night all. |
| 23:09.10 | dneuer | pb__; well, I think the issue is just that the requests are timing out. The output from 'cat /proc/micro/stats' shows a very long 'jiffs' for battery, backlight and SPI read info |
| 23:09.38 | pb__ | dneuer: hmm |
| 23:09.49 | dneuer | pb__: and I can see the code path that would cause the wrong id, but I don't know what the cause of the timeouts would be |
| 23:09.59 | dneuer | maybe those reads just really take longer |
| 23:10.12 | florian | night all |
| 23:10.39 | pb__ | seems a little bit unlikely, but I guess it's possible. |
| 23:11.51 | pb__ | should be easy to try increasing the timeout and see if that helps. |
| 23:12.00 | pb__ | night florian |
| 23:12.59 | dneuer | pb__: right |
| 23:13.13 | dneuer | pb__: you think gcc is clobbering some register used for irqs? |
| 23:14.07 | dneuer | well, I got rid of the message |
| 23:14.16 | dneuer | but I cheated |
| 23:14.23 | pb__ | I doubt that's what's happening. You have to try pretty hard to damage the irq register state, and I don't think gcc is that clever. |
| 23:14.42 | pb__ | ah, what did you do? |
| 23:14.46 | dneuer | backlight still works |
| 23:16.22 | dneuer | but I could swear I just witnessed the backlight message timing out -- took a lot longer holding the button down one time to get it to go off |
| 23:16.39 | dneuer | it's timing out about a third of the time |
| 23:16.46 | dneuer | battery about half |
| 23:17.41 | dneuer | I can't remember what the SPI is for on the Atmel units |
| 23:17.55 | pb__ | Talking to the sleeves, I think. |
| 23:18.05 | dneuer | ahh |
| 23:18.40 | pb__ | They have a microwire eeprom which contains the device ID codes, so the ipaq can tell what you have plugged in. |
| 23:18.56 | dneuer | well, now that the messages are suppressed at least, I need to go eat. Then I'll get back to hacking |
| 23:18.58 | dneuer | later |
| 23:19.04 | pb__ | righto |
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