| 00:00.07 | pb_ | dc_: heh |
| 00:00.49 | mallum | hey dc_ |
| 00:01.01 | PaxAnima | how did the hacking weekend go? |
| 00:01.01 | mallum | I fixed up the reset of the window stuff for that theme |
| 00:01.03 | dc_ | mallum: get back alright? |
| 00:01.06 | dc_ | PaxAnima: good :) |
| 00:01.25 | dc_ | mallum: oh and I did some stuff to my gtkrc theme file on the train |
| 00:01.44 | dc_ | mallum: i.e. make it use the mist engine and have flat buttons |
| 00:02.13 | moray | dc_: so you got home fine? |
| 00:02.28 | dc_ | moray: 'just' |
| 00:02.44 | moray | 'just' at Cambridge, or one of the later changes? |
| 00:02.55 | dc_ | hehe yah, just at cambridge. |
| 00:03.00 | moray | ah |
| 00:03.02 | dc_ | the trains there were fine |
| 00:03.08 | dc_ | but from then on it was hell. |
| 00:03.13 | moray | ah |
| 00:03.16 | dc_ | lots of underground trips. |
| 00:03.20 | dc_ | but I made it back |
| 00:03.26 | moray | well, that's good anyway. |
| 00:03.41 | moray | you wouldn't want to be late for school tomorrow, after all. |
| 00:03.52 | dc_ | oh yeah, heh. that would be just terrible |
| 00:07.34 | pb_ | dc_: by the way, can we safely remove the update-mime-db from gpe-gallery postinst? |
| 00:07.39 | pb_ | Nils was reporting that it caused errors. |
| 00:07.57 | dc_ | pb_: god yes, from everything |
| 00:08.06 | pb_ | heh, right |
| 00:08.09 | pb_ | I'll deal with that forthwith. |
| 00:08.24 | dc_ | great |
| 00:08.56 | pb_ | oh, he also complained that filemanager still lacks scrollbars. |
| 00:09.17 | dc_ | do hyes |
| 00:09.19 | mallum | dc_: yeah go back fine. I also edited the theme to make it white |
| 00:09.19 | dc_ | doh yes |
| 00:09.22 | dc_ | it does |
| 00:09.27 | dc_ | mallum: ah cool. |
| 00:10.46 | pb_ | dc_: ok. well, if you could add them, that would rock. |
| 00:11.02 | dc_ | right. |
| 00:11.14 | dc_ | let me see. |
| 00:22.10 | dc_ | sleep for me |
| 00:22.16 | dc_ | hrm... |
| 00:22.19 | dc_ | maybe not. |
| 00:22.29 | moray | ha |
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| 03:16.08 | dneuer | jg: you really here? |
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| 05:30.12 | PaxAnima | damn oscars |
| 05:31.16 | pigeon | Been waited for a while. |
| 05:31.48 | PaxAnima | too bad it takes time before the movies actually arrives to Norway |
| 05:33.02 | pigeon | Ah. |
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| 12:07.22 | pb_ | hi root |
| 12:19.32 | mallum | hey pb_ |
| 12:19.43 | pb_ | hi mallum |
| 12:19.57 | mallum | I discovered some new schueduler based switches for tinyx today, which alter its performance |
| 12:20.33 | mallum | unfortunatly they seem pretty much undocumented :( |
| 12:20.53 | pb_ | ah. Do they alter performance for the better? |
| 12:22.32 | mallum | well as far as I can tell you can increase screen updates etc, but lower interactivity |
| 12:23.01 | mallum | pb_: the switches are -schedInterval & -schedMax |
| 12:23.14 | mallum | pb_: Im pretty sure the values they expect are ms |
| 12:25.07 | mallum | pb_: the defualt value for -schedInterval is 20 by the looks of it |
| 12:26.02 | mallum | pb_: and the next is 200 |
| 12:27.39 | pb_ | right |
| 12:29.04 | mallum | pb_: ah, also alot of japanese cl-700 sites seem to suggest using an sd card as swap. I guess though the card will eventually become trashed, that could be quite a while till that happens ( eg months ) ? |
| 12:30.31 | pb_ | depends how heavily you use it, I guess. |
| 12:30.31 | chrisime_ | hi |
| 12:30.38 | pb_ | could be days, weeks or months. |
| 12:31.45 | pb_ | hi chrisime_ |
| 12:33.15 | mallum | hey chrisime_ |
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| 13:34.42 | spung | ibot: ahh, shut up |
| 13:34.43 | | wish i knew, spung |
| 13:36.09 | mallum | spung: I dont know why ibot thinks rewt == root |
| 13:36.19 | spung | yeha |
| 13:37.00 | mallum | ~lart ibot |
| 13:37.15 | mallum | ~lart himself |
| 13:37.24 | spung | well, gotta study now |
| 13:37.49 | spung | :\ |
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| 14:05.56 | dneuer | hey pb_ |
| 14:07.08 | pb_ | dneuer: yo! |
| 14:07.54 | dneuer | pb_: do you have any reports of anyone successfully flashing the 0.7pre images onto a 31xx series machine? |
| 14:08.28 | dneuer | specifically bootgpe2, that is |
| 14:09.23 | pb_ | dneuer: hm, not sure. I think at least one person has tried it, though they reported that most programs failed to run due to out-of-memory. |
| 14:09.38 | pb_ | I guess you got your machine unbricked in the end, then? |
| 14:10.47 | dneuer | yep. I flashed 0.7pre6 on to my 3650. Nice work! |
| 14:11.11 | dneuer | But I couldn't get it onto the 3150 either through ymodem or xmodem |
| 14:11.23 | pb_ | Strange. What went wrong? |
| 14:11.49 | spung | pb_: did you guys take any photos this weekend? |
| 14:12.43 | pb_ | spung: Colin took loads. |
| 14:12.47 | dneuer | it just stops and the bootldr becomes unresponsive during the upload. I've seen that before when the upload image was too big. The 3150 only has 16 MB of RAM, and the image is 13 MB. What happens is, the bootldr loads the whole image into RAM before writing the flash, and if the image is too big, it raps around to memory location 0x0, overwriting the bootldr in RAM |
| 14:13.47 | dneuer | Now, I wouldn't think that the bootldr would take up 3 MB of RAM (it certainly doesn't take up that much space on flash!), but maybe there's a memory leak or something |
| 14:15.46 | spung | mallum: http://handhelds.org/~luis/gpedevweek/mallum.jpeg |
| 14:16.44 | mallum | spung: very clever |
| 14:16.45 | dneuer | pb_: well, just got the answer from jamey: the bootldr takes up about 4 MB in RAM |
| 14:17.19 | spung | mallum: :D |
| 14:20.29 | dneuer | pb_: the 3100.jffs2 image needs to be smaller, or the only way to load it onto a 31xx machine will be from CF. |
| 14:20.36 | mallum | spung: I have a big head eh ? |
| 14:20.41 | dneuer | pb_: about 11MB is probably OK |
| 14:21.17 | spung | mallum: huh, do you? |
| 14:22.08 | mallum | pb_: I I cat /dev/console and physically rotate the display on the c700, I get some bytes :-) |
| 14:25.38 | mallum | pb_: if I wrote a little program that listened on /dev/console for these particular byes and rotated the X display accordingly, would that be the right way to go about things ? |
| 14:28.58 | pb_ | hm, seems unlikely. I guess you should have whatever is doing input processing convert them into normal keystrokes. |
| 14:29.08 | pb_ | Presumably that'd be the X server in this case. |
| 14:29.29 | pb_ | dneuer: hrm. |
| 14:29.46 | dneuer | pb_: the games could probably go |
| 14:29.52 | pb_ | well, the idea of building a smaller "core gpe" image, leaving out games and so on is one that's been discussed several times. |
| 14:29.59 | dneuer | pb_: I don't know what else is "non-essential" |
| 14:30.22 | pb_ | Yeah, it's difficult. In some sense, everything is non-essential - there are people who don't want any of the PIM stuff, for example. |
| 14:30.23 | dneuer | pb_: it seems like a good idea, at least for the 3100 image |
| 14:30.53 | pb_ | ok. wanna have a play with make-busyboot and the task packages and see if you can come up with something that fits? |
| 14:31.00 | dneuer | pb_: well, given that people are loading "GPE", a "full" handheld environment, I'd say the PIM functionality is key |
| 14:32.02 | dneuer | pb_: I guess I could. It's been a looooong time since I made a jffs2 image for iPAQ. Pre all the make-thisandthat, task-automatedflibbertygibbet long ago |
| 14:32.58 | dneuer | pb_: I'd probably want your advice about what should be dumped. I mean, if people don't want the PIM functionality, they can just load bootstrap.jffs2, right? |
| 14:33.12 | pb_ | It's pretty easy. Check make-busyboot out of CVS, adjust the package list, run it, inspect image size, rinse, repeat. |
| 14:34.53 | dneuer | pb_: excellent; I'll give it a try then |
| 14:35.23 | dneuer | pb_: that presumes one has mkfs.jffs2 on one's machine, correct? |
| 14:35.45 | pb_ | yeah. |
| 14:37.01 | dneuer | pb_: I'll have to build it again (new desktop) |
| 14:38.14 | pb_ | ah, right. |
| 14:41.07 | dneuer | OK. Gotta get to work. Later |
| 14:41.27 | pb_ | dneuer: later. |
| 14:48.22 | mallum | pb_: hmm, it does appear X gets a key event :-) I didn't think it did :-) |
| 14:48.53 | pb_ | aha. |
| 14:49.57 | mallum | pb_: now the question is, does xfree have a keysym defined for screen rotation :-) |
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| 17:08.20 | pb_ | hi paul |
| 17:08.30 | paul | hi phil |
| 17:08.39 | paul | how did sunday finish up? |
| 17:08.46 | pb_ | made it back to the emerald isle then? |
| 17:08.54 | paul | i think so :) |
| 17:09.27 | pb_ | Not a huge amount happened after you left. We carried on until 7pm or so, fixed a few more bugs, that kind of thing. |
| 17:09.42 | pb_ | There's a new gpe-login in unstable now. |
| 17:09.58 | paul | aha.. excellent :) |
| 17:10.27 | paul | i'll have a look at splitting up the gpe locale.alias file later. |
| 17:10.47 | pb_ | cool. |
| 17:11.26 | pb_ | gpe-login also translates its own messages now, see http://handhelds.org/scap/port.12020.png |
| 17:12.40 | paul | ah, nice. using the locale X property? |
| 17:12.43 | pb_ | yup |
| 17:13.02 | pb_ | the "Record recalibrates..." one would also be translated, but de.po is out of date. |
| 17:13.29 | paul | very nice. "language" also needs to be added :) ("Taal" iirc)# |
| 17:13.38 | pb_ | oh yes. |
| 17:13.53 | pb_ | I should make a gpe-login distribution and send it to the Translation Project. |
| 17:15.27 | pb_ | It might be cool if we could obtain icons for each country's national flag, and add them to the menu as well. |
| 17:15.47 | pb_ | Dunno how easy that would be. |
| 17:16.09 | paul | indeed. |
| 17:16.18 | paul | be nice anyway. |
| 17:16.42 | paul | also - the spawn_xbd - is that pretty much how one would spawn xstroke? |
| 17:17.12 | paul | and something i dont understand. is gpe-login also handling the screen lock from resume?# |
| 17:17.26 | pb_ | xstroke is kind of tricky, because it wants to dock itself into the system tray. |
| 17:17.35 | paul | ah |
| 17:17.57 | paul | and it doesnt proceed until it does so? |
| 17:18.04 | pb_ | right. |
| 17:18.25 | paul | hmm.. |
| 17:18.40 | pb_ | in principle it'd be possible to make gpe-login behave like a system tray. That would allow you to also dock things like minitime, which some people have asked for. |
| 17:19.12 | pb_ | I'm not sure where on the screen it would go. Maybe a row at the top. |
| 17:20.02 | *** join/#gpe dc_ (~dc@modem-185-53-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 17:20.06 | pb_ | dc_: afternoon |
| 17:20.12 | dc_ | pb_: hey |
| 17:20.46 | paul | hi dc |
| 17:21.14 | paul | pb_: minitime might be interesting. |
| 17:21.15 | dc_ | paul: hey there, get back alright? |
| 17:21.17 | pb_ | dc_: I made a new gpe-gallery ipk with that postinst removed. I'll build a new gpe-edit a bit later too, with that save dialog thing sorted out. |
| 17:21.17 | paul | pb_: |
| 17:21.21 | paul | oops.. |
| 17:21.36 | dc_ | pb_: great :D |
| 17:21.41 | paul | pb_: i guess mallum is the one to talk to about example "i am a dock" code |
| 17:22.18 | pb_ | paul: yeah. There are specs on freedesktop.org, I think, and libgpewidget/tray.c will show you what dock clients are expecting. |
| 17:22.30 | stargirl | you can look in the xkbd source or the minipredict source, no? |
| 17:22.36 | paul | dc_: yep, bit of a queue at stansted to get through security (30 minutes of a queue), but i'd accounted for that. was grand after that, even managed to continue looking at gpe-irc. |
| 17:22.48 | paul | pb_: excellent. |
| 17:22.54 | dc_ | paul: huray |
| 17:22.55 | pb_ | stargirl: xkbd and minipredict don't actually dock in the tray, they use monolaunch for the tray icons. |
| 17:23.28 | paul | stargirl: i have 5 spare marges and a spare homer. what have you got to trade? :) |
| 17:23.42 | dc_ | stargirl: hey. |
| 17:23.51 | dc_ | stargirl: how's my dasher going ;)? |
| 17:26.25 | pb_ | dc_: ah, you should also send your programs to the translation project. |
| 17:26.37 | dc_ | pb_: how does that work? |
| 17:27.10 | pb_ | dc_: create a "release tarball" with make dist, put it on the ftp site, send a note to the TP coordinator announcing it. let me find the URL for you. |
| 17:28.06 | pb_ | see http://www.iro.umontreal.ca/contrib/po/HTML/maintainers.html |
| 17:28.38 | dc_ | pb_: then what happens? |
| 17:29.19 | pb_ | dc_: the translators will do their translating thing and send you back .po files to check in. |
| 17:29.47 | dc_ | pb_: how cool :} |
| 17:30.26 | pb_ | dc_: indeed :-) |
| 17:34.36 | pb_ | brb, need to install some new hardware |
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| 17:45.05 | mallum | dc_: hey |
| 17:55.57 | stargirl | dc_: just fine thanks ;-) |
| 18:21.40 | *** topic/#gpe by mallum -> GPE Palmtop Environment | http://gpe.handhelds.org | http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/CurrentThingsToDo | http://europa.debian.org/bugzilla | bootgpe2 images now at http://familiar.handhelds.org/releases/v0.7/boot/ | Familiar 0.7 issues: http://www.handhelds.org/bugzilla/showdependencytree.cgi?id=99 | New matchbox website with screenshots and docs - > http://handhelds.org/~mallum/matchbox/ |
| 18:52.11 | *** join/#gpe pb_ (~pb@pc2-cmbg4-3-cust239.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) |
| 18:52.33 | pb_ | darn, my desktop at the office seems fux0red. |
| 18:54.06 | mallum | pb_: doh :( |
| 18:56.23 | pb_ | oh well. |
| 18:58.19 | mallum | pb_: whats happened to it ? |
| 18:59.08 | pb_ | oh, nothing too terminal, I just seem to have destroyed my GNOME install with incautious use of apt. I guess I will reinstall tomorrow. |
| 19:10.30 | pb_ | dc_: just uploaded gpe-edit 0.16. |
| 19:19.12 | *** join/#gpe dc__ (~dc@modem-246-50-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 19:20.54 | pb_ | now to generate some locale packages, I suppose. |
| 19:57.31 | chrisime_ | pb_, should i create new diffs for libgpewidget? |
| 19:57.41 | chrisime_ | i think you didn't apply the last ones |
| 19:58.00 | dc__ | chrisime_: what do your diffs actualy do? |
| 19:58.10 | chrisime_ | s/gtkobject/gobject |
| 19:58.20 | dc__ | oh, heh |
| 19:58.36 | chrisime_ | you dumped then!!! ;) |
| 19:58.55 | dc__ | heh, wha? |
| 19:58.57 | chrisime_ | s/then/them |
| 19:59.10 | chrisime_ | lol |
| 20:01.08 | pb_ | chrisime_: no, thanks, I still have your old diffs. |
| 20:02.18 | *** join/#gpe jsmanrique (jsmanrique@cmr-213-141-53-108.telecable.es) |
| 20:07.59 | jsmanrique | mallum: nice new matchbox site |
| 20:20.25 | *** join/#gpe dc___ (~dc@modem-49-46-60-62.vip.uk.com) |
| 20:26.15 | pb_ | dc___: any news on gpe-filemanager scrollbars? |
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| 21:14.14 | *** join/#gpe cmarqu (colin@buug.mind.de) |
| 21:14.42 | cmarqu | Hey. |
| 21:28.05 | pb_ | cmarqu: Hey, back in Stuttgart? |
| 21:28.31 | cmarqu | pb_: Yep, just arrived. |
| 21:28.47 | pb_ | Cool. |
| 21:29.04 | chrisime_ | hi cmarqu |
| 21:29.27 | cmarqu | It all went well. We optimized it so much that we arrived on the plane 1 minute late (as last passengers of course). |
| 21:29.30 | cmarqu | Hi chrisime_ |
| 21:31.07 | pb_ | cmarqu: Aha :-) |
| 21:34.07 | cmarqu | Oh, and they wanted to charge paul for all of our rooms, and apparently that was over limit, so they made sad faces when telling us. |
| 21:34.20 | cmarqu | It all worked out though. |
| 21:34.28 | pb_ | Oh dear. Presumably you managed to straighten things out with the hotel somehow. |
| 21:34.35 | paul | heya colin |
| 21:35.01 | paul | cmarqu: they wanted to charge my card? |
| 21:35.07 | paul | cmarqu: shouldnt have been over limit though. |
| 21:35.33 | cmarqu | paul: It was 350 pounds. |
| 21:35.52 | paul | cmarqu: hmm... must check my visa so. it should easily have taken 350 quid. :) |
| 21:36.25 | cmarqu | Somehow it was rejected. Well, eventually they charged you for your room and us for ours as it should have been in the first place. |
| 21:36.36 | paul | cmarqu: although, my card for some reason has been coming up with "call auth centre" recently whenever i try do transactions, even though its not near limit. (and paid off regularly). |
| 21:36.50 | pb_ | paul: Ah, that happens to me sometimes too. |
| 21:36.55 | paul | cmarqu: errmm.. i already paid for mine on sunday though. |
| 21:37.16 | cmarqu | paul: I must have had a wrong phone number though, because I SMS'ed you and also talked to "your" answering machine :) |
| 21:37.35 | cmarqu | paul: Oh. Ooops. |
| 21:37.55 | pb_ | paul: It seems that Visa have some kind of security check that's triggered by "unusual" spending patterns. If you do something that trips it, you have to phone your bank to get them to take this flag off the account, otherwise it goes on saying "call auth centre". |
| 21:37.58 | cmarqu | Hmm. |
| 21:38.24 | paul | pb_: i think its cause i went on a bit of a splurge after christmas, buying APs, ipaq, sleeves, etc.. not all at the same time. maybe somehow my card got 'flagged' because of constant stream of purchases. i dont know. but whenever i ring the issuer they say the card is fine. (weird) |
| 21:38.34 | paul | pb_: aha... yes. |
| 21:38.47 | cmarqu | paul: Maybe mail nils, he was handling that. |
| 21:38.56 | paul | cmarqu: so was i charged again? |
| 21:39.17 | paul | cmarqu: i think i might have your missed call this morning. i slept till late :) |
| 21:39.33 | cmarqu | paul: I think so, but I am not sure. |
| 21:39.53 | paul | cmarqu: i can check it online, will scream if there's a problem :) |
| 21:40.06 | cmarqu | Can you just have a 2nd charge cancelled? |
| 21:41.32 | paul | i can yes. |
| 21:52.16 | pb_ | btw, i uploaded some utf-8 locale-base packages for most of the locales I could think of (including en_IE). |
| 21:53.11 | pb_ | They're currently a bit inefficient; the LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE tables could be shared between all locales and aren't currently, so you will waste some space if you have loads of locales installed. But the files compress pretty well so I'm not too bothered right now. |
| 21:55.28 | cmarqu | Cool. |
| 21:55.56 | cmarqu | 173 for a weekend, not bad :) |
| 21:56.09 | pb_ | cmarqu: also, gpe-login now translates its strings dynamically, as seen in http://handhelds.org/scap/port.12020.png |
| 21:56.49 | cmarqu | Cool. |
| 21:56.55 | cmarqu | Can you also switch back? |
| 21:57.24 | pb_ | Yeah. |
| 21:57.55 | cmarqu | Actually... I am wondering now why the rest of gpe-ownerinfo is not translated. It should have them in the po/mo file. |
| 21:58.28 | cmarqu | Or... is that from the default file written by gpe-conf? |
| 21:58.37 | pb_ | I thought it came from the default file. |
| 21:58.52 | cmarqu | Hmm. Will check tomorrow |
| 22:00.00 | pigeon | Offtopic: Any INN2 guru in the house? |
| 22:33.48 | dc___ | sleep :} |
| 22:44.41 | jsmanrique | how are you? |
| 22:50.11 | mallum | pb_: is something in the gpe image setting the background gradient ? |
| 22:50.29 | pb_ | yes. |
| 22:51.29 | mallum | do you want to decide on a color and I'll set it in matchbox directly as a defualt |
| 22:51.59 | pb_ | I think it's just as easy to set it in the session, to be honest. |
| 22:56.13 | mallum | well Im just trying to figure out the best way to allow a theme to change a background |
| 22:56.46 | mallum | at the moment, if its been set specifically by the user it leaves it alone |
| 22:56.56 | paul | night mallum/pb |
| 22:57.52 | mallum | pb_: and thus at the moment it wont get changed as it thinks its been set by a user |
| 23:00.12 | pb_ | ah, mm, that's an interesting point. I'll have a think about it. |
| 23:00.55 | mallum | pb_: so it'd be better for gpe to leave it alone, or sort out a 'defualt' gpe theme, which sets a background / gtkrc / icons ( or just leaves that alone ) and matchbox theme |
| 23:18.38 | mallum | pb_: tell me when you've though about, so I can get a new mb and release mbcrystal into unstable ... |
| 23:20.44 | pb_ | ok |
| 23:29.05 | *** join/#gpe flypiper (~netwinder@12-222-141-210.client.insightBB.com) |
| 23:45.04 | cmarqu | Night. |
