| 05:43:24 | colin_werk | Morning. |
| 08:25:17 | pb_ | yo |
| 08:31:19 | colin_werk | Hi pb_ |
| 08:35:01 | mallum | hey pb_ |
| 08:35:44 | pb_ | hi mallum, colin |
| 08:35:48 | mallum | pb_: I was thinking more about the xsetting stuff ... |
| 08:38:56 | mallum | pb_: I think we should maybe ccall it something new as its gonna be so much more :)) |
| 08:39:59 | mallum | pb_: also that will avoid any battles with the XSettings people ( of course we could make it use 'legacy' x settings as well ) |
| 08:40:25 | mallum | pb_: binding a load of properties to a display makes a lot of sense with the mogration too |
| 08:41:38 | mallum | pb_: I move my desktop app to my PDA and its icons shrink, it suddenly does click and hold for right clicks all becuase its read the various properties from that display |
| 08:42:30 | mallum | pb_: though I guess XSettings would do that aswell ... hmmm thiniing aloud |
| 08:46:18 | pb_ | Yeah, that's right. |
| 08:47:11 | pb_ | It does seem that XSETTINGS per se is being pitched as a way to configure "core" things that are common to all toolkits, like the double click delay for example. In conceptual terms, what we are doing is closer to GConf than XSETTINGS, even though we are using XSETTINGS technology to do it. |
| 08:47:20 | pb_ | So, perhaps you are right and we should call it something els.e |
| 08:51:06 | mallum | pb_: yeah though thinking about it xsettings should do exactly that when an app migrates - recommend things like a defulat iconsize ( in a gtk toolbar for example ), we have no mouse just a touchscreen etc |
| 08:51:22 | mallum | pb_: its a pity gtk2 has the xsettings stuff locked away :( |
| 08:51:59 | pb_ | yes. |
| 08:52:00 | mallum | pb_: I kind of half think maybe it was just there for the readhat 8 stuff and merging togeather of gnome and kde |
| 08:52:45 | pb_ | indeed, I think that was probably a large part of it. |
| 08:53:28 | mallum | gets the milkfloat |
| 08:57:47 | pb_ | :-) |
| 10:05:12 | pb_ | ok, it's uploaded. |
| 10:12:13 | mallum | pb_: cool |
| 10:13:24 | mallum | pb_: Im building a new CVS matchbox ipkg ( with you flags fix ) |
| 10:13:47 | mallum | pb_: and you can hint for an accept button in the titlebar now |
| 10:16:38 | pb_ | excellent. |
| 10:17:16 | pb_ | the accept button is the thing zecke wanted for opie, right? |
| 10:19:12 | mallum | pb_: yep |
| 10:19:43 | mallum | pb_: we could use it too, but it may need some heaving patching to gtk dialog |
| 10:20:00 | pb_ | mm, right. |
| 10:20:24 | pb_ | could be cool though. Do you have a screenshot of what it looks like? |
| 10:20:31 | mallum | pb_: but we save the space currently taken by the OK / CANCEL buttons |
| 10:20:53 | pb_ | indeed. |
| 10:21:06 | mallum | pb_: I would have a screenshot it xwd worked - my upgrade yesterday seems to have really bukled X :( |
| 10:21:32 | pb_ | trouble is, gtk itself doesn't provide the "ok" and "cancel" buttons in dialogs, that is left up to the apps. |
| 10:21:33 | mallum | pb_: Im not sure if I actually like that behavious though |
| 10:21:58 | mallum | pb_: meaning ce style putting ok button in the titlebar |
| 10:22:03 | pb_ | yeah |
| 10:22:17 | mallum | pb_: for what you save I think its confusing |
| 10:22:53 | mallum | pb_: its gonna be fun seeing how opie fit there dock / appmgr in .... |
| 10:22:56 | pb_ | It would be nice if this was something you could select with a theme. But it sounds like it would be quite a lot of work to make it go. |
| 10:23:20 | pb_ | yeah. |
| 10:23:38 | pb_ | still, it's quite cool that opie is embracing x11 these days. |
| 10:24:02 | mallum | yeah, we'll see |
| 10:24:24 | pb_ | zecke was talking about common gpe/opie ipc and data storage again the other day. |
| 10:24:36 | mallum | pb_: I'll also add the question button which could be more useful |
| 10:24:43 | pb_ | right. |
| 10:26:09 | mallum | pb_: I still need to hack in some code to dynamically position the (?) or (ok) buttons for it to work nice |
| 10:50:47 | moray | reiterates his unconvincedness about putting important buttons in the titlebar being a good user interface move |
| 10:51:12 | moray | (though yes, a help button would be fine) |
| 10:53:03 | moray | (though if people have a dock it's probably more logical to put it there) |
| 11:13:50 | mallum_chores | moray: oh the subject of code have you hacked that replacement ~/.mbdock 'filler' ? |
| 11:33:37 | pb_ | prompting the user if they want to populate the dock, you mean? |
| 12:02:54 | mallum_chores | pb_: yah |
| 12:03:39 | moray | mallum_chores: ah, I forgot to finish it off - I don't think I've got anything else I urgently need to do just now though, so I'll have a look in a moment |
| 12:03:53 | mallum | chores done now :) |
| 12:27:38 | mallum | pb_: do you have a matchbox cvs tree close by ? |
| 12:33:32 | pb_ | mallum: always at hand |
| 12:35:53 | mallum | pb_: could you do a cvs update and check it runs ok for you with just --enable-debug passed to configure ? |
| 12:37:12 | pb_ | mallum: sure |
| 12:37:47 | mallum | pb_: many thanks :) |
| 12:39:08 | pb_ | Failed loading image 'buttacceptdown.xpm' |
| 12:39:48 | mallum | pb_: hmm, did you CVS update ? |
| 12:39:51 | pb_ | yeah |
| 12:40:02 | pb_ | the file is there, it just didn't seem to get installed by "make install" |
| 12:40:14 | mallum | pb_: ah yes |
| 12:40:16 | pb_ | maybe I have some autotools problemette |
| 12:40:24 | mallum | pb_: assuming your in ~/src/matchbox |
| 12:40:52 | mallum | pb_: do a src/matchbox -theme /home/pb/src/matchbox/data/themes/bluxbox |
| 12:41:01 | mallum | pb_: or make install |
| 12:41:52 | pb_ | ok, I installed that file manually, it seems to be working now. |
| 12:42:18 | mallum | cool |
| 12:42:43 | mallum | thanks |
| 12:43:01 | pb_ | any time. |
| 12:43:43 | mallum | pb_: ah; |
| 12:43:44 | mallum | mallum@ti:~$ zcat /usr/share/doc/libfreetype6/changelog.Debian.gz | head |
| 12:43:44 | mallum | freetype (2.1.2-8) unstable; urgency=low |
| 12:43:44 | mallum | * CVS updates as of 2002-10-07 |
| 12:43:44 | mallum | * Applied David Chester's ft-slight patch. Thanks to Roger So for the |
| 12:43:44 | mallum | suggestion. (Closes: Bug#163900) |
| 12:43:46 | mallum | * Turned off the bytecode interpreter. |
| 12:43:48 | mallum | -- Anthony Fok <foka@debian.org> Fri, 11 Oct 2002 02:00:18 +0800 |
| 12:43:53 | pb_ | Aha. |
| 12:44:03 | pb_ | That would explain your bad fonts, I guess. |
| 12:44:14 | mallum | ok Im paying him a visit with my milkfloat |
| 12:44:44 | pb_ | crumbs, is nobody safe? |
| 12:46:13 | mallum | pb_: I wonder why he suddenly turned it off |
| 12:46:21 | mallum | grabs the source package |
| 12:46:40 | pb_ | mallum: I guess somebody threatened to banish it to the non-US ghetto |
| 12:48:21 | pb_ | hmm, see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=164492 |
| 12:50:02 | mallum | pb_: hmm, No, this is NOT an important bug. I have downgraded it to minor, |
| 12:50:02 | mallum | because it is an aesthetic issue. |
| 12:50:09 | pb_ | yeah. :-/ |
| 12:50:24 | pb_ | seems a bit bizarre that aesthetic issues in a font rendering package would be "minor". |
| 12:50:31 | mallum | pb_: I think thats pretty major when freetype is an 'aesthetic' lib |
| 12:50:36 | pb_ | quite. |
| 12:53:03 | mallum | pb_: looks like he's applied some crappy patch to it aswell |
| 12:53:10 | pb_ | yes. |
| 13:07:33 | mallum | cool, I fighting everyone on #opie :) |
| 13:08:03 | mallum | pb_: http://www.handhelds.org/~mallum/screenshots/opie-mb.png |
| 13:08:05 | PaxAnima | "mallum, the X11 warrior" |
| 13:09:41 | mallum | PaxAnima: yeah , Im gonna get the 'X' logo tatood on my arse |
| 13:10:53 | PaxAnima | hmm.. don't want to imagine how that looks... |
| 13:28:32 | pb_ | mallum: ha. |
| 13:37:07 | mallum | PaxAnima: kinda like (_X_|__) |
| 13:38:21 | pb_ | zecke has quit ("*Opie/X11 is so neat*") |
| 13:38:22 | pb_ | ! |
| 13:40:06 | flypiper_work | OPEE..... aaaaaggggggg |
| 13:41:22 | mallum | I think opie is just about to fork .... |
| 13:41:33 | pb_ | mallum: ooh |
| 13:42:08 | flypiper_work | mallum: it forks ... for sure:-) |
| 13:42:35 | mallum | pb_: its a complete battlegound in there |
| 13:43:53 | colin_werk | Who are the two camps? |
| 13:46:19 | pb_ | mallum: so I see :-} |
| 13:47:51 | mallum | pb_: and it all my fault |
| 13:47:56 | mallum | MAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAA |
| 13:48:03 | pb_ | mallum: way to go! |
| 13:48:06 | mallum | needs to grow up |
| 13:48:28 | mallum | pb_: ok now I start being really evil |
| 13:48:48 | pb_ | mallum: I see max is still talking about your previous attempt to infiltrate #opie by stealth. He must have been impressed. |
| 13:49:05 | mallum | haha |
| 13:50:13 | grib | mallum: be nice! the ipaq is a small enough universe without there being enemy camps! |
| 13:50:29 | mallum | grib: shut up old man |
| 13:50:32 | mallum | grib: ;) |
| 13:50:48 | mallum | grib: let me entertain my lonely self |
| 13:51:26 | grib | ok, as long as you keep coding :) |
| 13:51:52 | mallum | grib: I was only joking with my first comment |
| 13:51:57 | mallum | gets paranoid |
| 13:52:24 | flypiper_work | thought mallum was naturally mean to talk to:-) |
| 13:52:40 | mallum | f/me gets more paranoid |
| 13:52:47 | flypiper_work | LOL |
| 13:53:13 | flypiper_work | mallum: gotta try to get ya while your down... just kidding! |
| 13:54:05 | mallum | drives the milkfloat over flypiper_works kneecaps |
| 13:54:38 | flypiper_work | tapes his mouth shut |
| 13:55:13 | mallum | tapes flypiper_works nostrils shut too |
| 13:55:30 | mallum | watches flypiper_work try and breathe through his eye sockets |
| 13:55:54 | flypiper_work | breaths through his ear holes... and gets green |
| 13:56:05 | mallum | its like tag team in there, pb has taken oven |
| 13:56:44 | flypiper_work | kewl .. keep us posted.. I wouldn't get into #opee if someone paid me :( |
| 13:56:54 | colin_werk | Can't wait till I see the ibot logs. |
| 14:00:54 | PaxAnima | hmm... just joined #opie to see the fight, but it's all quiet in there... |
| 14:02:08 | mallum | PaxAnima: yeah everyones dead |
| 14:03:02 | PaxAnima | did you kill'em all? ;) |
| 14:05:43 | mallum | no, I think everyone is tired now |
| 14:10:12 | grib | on irc, you can't see the blood dripping bodies of the dead. which is why Q3A irc makes so much sense. |
| 14:11:44 | mallum | pb_: I installed a new freetype |
| 14:11:56 | mallum | pb_: hopefully that'll fix things |
| 14:14:03 | colin_werk | BBL |
| 14:36:57 | jg | good morning.... |
| 14:38:04 | mallum | jg: hey |
| 14:38:11 | mallum | jg: I have a war for you too wage |
| 14:38:24 | jg | horsing around this morning, eh? |
| 14:38:25 | mallum | jg: check this -> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=164492 |
| 14:39:10 | mallum | jg: no the debian maintainer of freetype has suddenly turned off hinting ( hmmm ), and applied some crappy patch so fonts look awful |
| 14:39:55 | mallum | jg: reading the bottom of that bug report though, he seems to be finally getting a clue |
| 14:40:08 | jg | mallum: yeah, the final people are getting a clue.... |
| 15:09:13 | pierre | tu as tout le temps ton portable? |
| 15:09:13 | pierre | oups, wrong window.. |
| 16:49:03 | prpplague | odd, i just received some gpe mailing list stuff from 10/11/02 |
| 17:01:08 | moray | prpplague: so did I, and it's things I've read before |
| 19:58:14 | nelson | is away: bush-hogging. |
| 20:56:37 | PaxAnima | is getting tired of coding computer vision stuff for his project... |
| 20:56:57 | PaxAnima | project = university stuff |
| 21:38:29 | mallum | moo |
| 21:41:46 | PaxAnima | baa |
| 21:42:22 | mallum | murr |
| 21:42:44 | PaxAnima | woof |
| 21:46:32 | mallum | meow |
| 21:49:48 | PaxAnima | hmm.. running out of animal sounds (at least english versions;) |
| 21:55:29 | Chipaca | hi all |
| 21:56:13 | Chipaca | has anyone tried to compile gpe against uclibc? |
| 21:59:42 | pb_ | Chipaca: not that I've heard of. |
| 21:59:42 | pb_ | mallum: hi |
| 22:00:31 | mallum | pb_: hey |
| 22:00:48 | Chipaca | pb_: any reason? |
| 22:01:12 | pb_ | Chipaca: no, just that nobody has felt the urge I guess. |
| 22:01:37 | Chipaca | weird... i thought this'd've been the first place somebody would've thought about it |
| 22:02:20 | pb_ | well, not really; none of the distributions that gpe currently targets are based on uclibc, so it would be a bit of an academic exercise. |
| 22:02:34 | Chipaca | oh |
| 22:02:43 | Chipaca | I hadn't realized that |
| 22:02:59 | Chipaca | you're right, I should've been asking these questions in familiar, right? |
| 22:03:11 | pb_ | right, I guess. |
| 22:10:02 | pb_ | mallum: any further excitement in #opie? |
| 22:12:05 | mallum | pb_: no I have been watching movies |
| 22:12:24 | pb_ | ah, anything good? |
| 22:12:31 | mallum | pb_: no not really |
| 22:12:40 | pb_ | :-/ |
| 22:12:43 | mallum | pb_: about to watch the count of monti cristo |
| 22:12:57 | mallum | pb_: just watch bruce willis POW , which was dull |
| 22:13:11 | pb_ | Mmm. |
| 22:13:33 | mallum | s/watch/watched/ |
| 22:21:24 | jg_ | mallum: what size is the xserver on your ipaq? |
| 22:21:27 | jg_ | (I don't have mine here tonight). |
| 22:23:24 | pb_ | jg_: I have |
| 22:23:25 | pb_ | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 893204 Oct 8 11:04 /usr/X11R6/bin/Xipaq |
| 22:23:27 | pb_ | if that helps |
| 22:23:32 | jg_ | thanks... |
| 22:23:49 | jg_ | I'm building a new server that has most of the stuff out properly.... |
| 22:23:57 | pb_ | ah, cool. |
| 22:24:14 | pb_ | will this one have freetype support in? |
| 22:25:01 | jg_ | yes |
| 22:25:08 | pb_ | excellent! |
| 22:25:15 | jg_ | the one you have now does too, but freetype 1, rather than freetype2 |
| 22:25:37 | pb_ | ah right. |
| 22:25:50 | badalex | does gpe work on the zaurus |
| 22:25:54 | jg_ | and have freetype as a shared library. |
| 22:26:13 | jg_ | size of a fbdev server on x86 is 718392 |
| 22:26:35 | pb_ | right. |
| 22:26:44 | pb_ | badalex: if you can find a working X server, yes. |
| 22:27:07 | badalex | cant i just download the one for the z? wont that work? |
| 22:27:34 | pb_ | Presumably. I have no idea about the state of the art in X on zaurus. |
| 22:27:57 | badalex | pb i dont need an wm do i? |
| 22:28:17 | pb_ | You will probably find X fairly miserable to use without a wm. I recommend matchbox. |
| 22:28:46 | badalex | well i can get icewm... or wm2 |
| 22:28:56 | badalex | i dont feel like crosscompileing... |
| 22:30:38 | badalex | any one install it on the zaurus? or what handheld do you guys use? |
| 22:30:53 | pb_ | most people here are using ipaqs, I think. |
| 22:31:15 | badalex | welll it should be easy nough then... |
| 22:31:36 | badalex | you have like a howto to install it? |
| 22:32:04 | pb_ | Not that is likely to be much use to you. GPE comes as part of the Familiar distribution for ipaqs. |
| 22:32:20 | badalex | pb_: oh |
| 22:32:30 | pb_ | For the Z, I guess you will have to install the binaries manually. |
| 22:32:41 | badalex | well just kind of curuious about gpe looks kind of cool... |
| 22:32:52 | pb_ | You can get them in .ipk form from the familiar site, or compile your own of course. |
| 22:33:08 | badalex | lol |
| 22:33:12 | badalex | pb_: how would i run it then? |
| 22:33:40 | pb_ | It's just a group of X applications. GPE includes an X display manager and a login program to start the session. |
| 22:35:42 | badalex | oh... pb_ so i start x then i would start gpe right? |
| 22:35:51 | pb_ | right |
| 22:36:00 | badalex | k |
| 22:36:26 | badalex | pb_: well thanks for your help :) |
