| 00:06:37 | spung | prpplague: i'm no guru, but shoot |
| 00:09:24 | prpplague | spung: i'm cross compiling this, i want to do a make install but i want to install in a dir i can tarbal over to my pda, if i use the --prefix=/tmp/matchbox are the binaries built to look for the file in /tmp/matchbox/..... ? |
| 00:11:23 | spung | prpplague: have a look at the GPE CVS, the Makefile.ipkg_dpkg file should give you a hint |
| 00:11:59 | prpplague | spung: ok thanks |
| 00:14:08 | spung | prpplague: have you tried make ipkg? |
| 00:14:19 | spung | prpplague: that's the easiest way i thin |
| 00:15:57 | prpplague | no but i will look at it now, problem is i'm building this for the zaurus, i make have to make some changes |
| 00:17:17 | prpplague | hmm, need a command called fakeroot.... |
| 00:17:22 | prpplague | googles |
| 00:28:49 | spung | prpplague: what? you don't use debian? =) |
| 00:29:04 | prpplague | spung: sorry no, i'm a rhat head |
| 00:29:18 | spung | =) |
| 00:29:35 | prpplague | spung: someday, i'll move UP to debian, lol |
| 00:29:50 | spung | UP, yes :) |
| 00:36:59 | prpplague | flypiper: vening |
| 00:37:11 | prpplague | flypiper: evening |
| 00:38:59 | flypiper | prpplague: evening |
| 00:55:52 | moray | realises it's really time to go to bed, after following up on the wrong bug in bugzilla... |
| 00:56:20 | flypiper | moray: but did you fix it? |
| 00:56:39 | moray | flypiper: fix what? |
| 00:56:46 | flypiper | the bug...LOL |
| 00:57:19 | moray | flypiper: well, I added an entire program in the patch I wrote, so I think that counts as 'yes' ;) |
| 00:57:56 | flypiper | moray: yea..kewl.. I know how you feel:( |
| 00:58:58 | moray | good night, anyway |
| 00:59:10 | flypiper | moray: have a good nite! |
| 07:28:51 | mallum | hey |
| 07:34:00 | colin_werk | Hey mallum |
| 07:34:32 | colin_werk | Wow. Backdoor in openssh at openbsd.org. |
| 07:37:29 | pb | morning folks |
| 07:37:39 | mallum | hey pb |
| 07:37:45 | mallum | check slashdot ... |
| 07:38:08 | pb | OMG :-) |
| 07:38:28 | mallum | indeed ... |
| 07:38:58 | mallum | comments are pretty positive for a change, though theres alot of shit in there |
| 07:39:08 | pb | always is. :-/ |
| 07:39:11 | pb | I'm reading them now. |
| 07:39:43 | colin_werk | Hi pb |
| 07:39:50 | pb | hi colin |
| 07:39:57 | mallum | Yeah If I start really reading them, I'll spend my day replying to all the ones that annoy me ... ;) |
| 07:41:12 | pb | hmm, yes, the usual "X sucks, it's bloated, use Qt" school is pretty well represented there. |
| 07:41:18 | mallum | yeah |
| 07:41:28 | mallum | yet most people say X is faster than opie |
| 07:41:43 | pb | yeah. |
| 07:41:44 | mallum | todayonly.co.uk have some nice stuff today .... |
| 07:41:55 | pb | one guy on slashdot says: " X11 is low footprint. X11 is smaller, for example, than a comparable Qt/Embedded environment." |
| 07:42:02 | pb | don't know whether to believe that or not, but still. |
| 07:45:28 | pb | "Of course, for the ultimately efficiency, Matchbox is GREAT!" |
| 07:45:28 | pb | :-) |
| 07:46:03 | pb | ah cool, my CF card has arrived, now I can install GTK 2 :-) |
| 07:46:25 | mallum | woohaa |
| 07:46:54 | mallum | I have to move all my stuff of my udrive and onto a cf. udrive just drains too much power in a cf sleeve :( |
| 07:47:05 | pb | only problem of course is that I can't use the CF and ethernet at the same time, so I will have to resort to USB networking. |
| 07:49:40 | mallum | You need to hack your usb cable to charge the ipaq too. you will like it more then |
| 07:49:46 | pb | yeah |
| 07:49:59 | pb | at the moment I only have a full usb cradle, I ought to invest in a separate cable. |
| 07:50:13 | pb | there seem to be loads of iPAQ usb cables on ebay.co.uk for 1 pound. |
| 07:50:57 | colin_werk | "If anyone's interested, I just ported this to Mac OS X, so you can use this WM with XDarwin." |
| 07:51:19 | pb | (ah damn, no coffee in the office.) |
| 07:52:11 | mallum | colin_werk: I think I should add a 'do not run on OSX evil' cluase in the license ;p |
| 07:52:19 | colin_werk | :) |
| 07:52:47 | pb | mallum: we would have to throw it out of debian if you do that :-) |
| 07:52:54 | mallum | hmm, I wonder if the geeks here at work pick up on my secret sideline |
| 07:53:06 | mallum | pb: MUHAHAHAHA |
| 07:53:11 | colin_werk | mallum: Like http://www.fefe.de/nowindows/ |
| 07:53:47 | mallum | colin_werk: oh yeah thats the tinylibc crackpot guy - right ? |
| 07:54:02 | colin_werk | Yup |
| 07:54:46 | mallum | arg, my new maintainter manager actually said about tinylibc being better than uclibc - and I wanted to point him at that ... but couldn't find it |
| 07:55:59 | colin_werk | Would be interesting to compare them |
| 07:56:29 | mallum | I think uclibc is much more advanced now, IIRC tinylibc can only do static |
| 07:56:34 | colin_werk | sets out to make a pdf from http://www.palmos.com/dev/support/docs/ui/UIGuidelinesTOC.html |
| 07:57:00 | pb | mallum: yeah, uclibc certainly seems to be the way ahead. |
| 07:58:18 | colin_werk | I just asked somebody, and yes, it can. It's called dietlibc BTW, I mixed that up too |
| 07:59:55 | pb | anybody know how to profile a program that uses dlopen? |
| 08:03:50 | mallum | colin_werk: me too |
| 08:10:42 | pb | stupid xchat :-| |
| 08:11:37 | colin_werk | irssi in screen rules. Or erc.el |
| 08:11:50 | pb | maybe I'll try irssi. |
| 08:12:22 | colin_werk | Just pasting things with tabs in the beginning of the line gives me trouble. |
| 08:12:30 | pb | hmm |
| 08:12:45 | colin_werk | I bet this can be fixed. |
| 08:13:13 | pb | you'd think so, it doesn't sound like the kind of problem that would have the world's greatest minds baffled. |
| 08:15:24 | mallum | pb: erc.el is nice |
| 08:33:22 | pb | hmm, just been looking at the light sensor thing. |
| 08:33:44 | pb | the 0x23 value really does seem to be what comes back from the microcontroller. :-/ |
| 09:01:11 | mallum | watches his mailbox fill with crackpot emails |
| 09:02:45 | pb | ah, the price of fame. |
| 09:02:56 | pb | wait til you start getting stalkers. |
| 10:20:33 | colin_werk | pb: Is it possible to define default categories in gpe-contacts? We should have Business and Private as defaults |
| 10:22:25 | mallum | pb: do you know what a system called 'pick' is ? |
| 11:23:19 | pb | mallum: dunno, the only Pick I can think of is an old-time database OS. |
| 11:23:51 | pb | colin_werk: yes, categories just aren't implemented yet. When they are, you will be able to define defaults. |
| 11:28:11 | colin_werk | pb: Cool. |
| 12:36:42 | pb | colin_werk: Andy seems to have figured out how to make the light sensor work! |
| 13:10:21 | pattieja | morning |
| 13:10:21 | pb | hey |
| 13:17:59 | prpplague | mallum: dude! you got slashdotted! |
| 13:18:05 | prpplague | mallum: congrads |
| 13:18:54 | prpplague | mallum: well, i got all my fonts issues solved and got matchbox running on my thinclient as well as the zaurus |
| 13:19:15 | prpplague | mallum: now all i have to do is finish putting it into the buildroot for openzaurus |
| 13:29:09 | pb | prpplague: sounds cool. |
| 13:29:24 | pb | prpplague: what's the state of the X server on zaurus these days? |
| 13:32:26 | prpplague | pb: right now i'm using 4.1 with an ipaq build, but the z's ts api is different than the ipaq |
| 13:33:43 | prpplague | pb: i'm pretty close to getting everything fixed so that you can use standard ipaq ipkgs |
| 13:34:33 | cmarqu | pb: Wow. Light sensor is cool. I cannot test it though since I run this stupid 2.4.17 kernel in my initrd, and the module is most likely not compatible... :/ |
| 13:35:05 | cmarqu | moray: Are you here? |
| 13:35:05 | pb | cmarqu: ah, damn. Why do you use that kernel? |
| 13:35:25 | cmarqu | pb: Because I'm too stupid to make my own initrd. Or at least too little time to figure it out. |
| 13:35:42 | cmarqu | I guess I could try Goetz' latest initrd |
| 13:36:18 | pb | cmarqu: fair enough. So, next question, what does the initrd actually do for you? |
| 13:37:33 | cmarqu | But Mom, everybody has it! |
| 13:37:33 | cmarqu | :) |
| 13:37:33 | cmarqu | Well, I guess it gives me a basic system with some tools? |
| 13:37:59 | pb | In case you break the real system on flash you mean? Yeah, I suppose so. |
| 13:38:29 | cmarqu | I need something for setting up the CF stuff in the first place, no? |
| 13:38:51 | cmarqu | I don't grok that stuff fully... |
| 13:39:31 | cmarqu | Is anybody aware of a packaged mixer that can adjust bass/treble? Otherwise, I'd package aumix. |
| 13:39:35 | pb | Well, you should be able to do all that stuff from the ipaq's internal flash and then pivot_root into the new filesystem if you want to boot from cf. |
| 13:39:47 | mallum | prpplague: sounds liek your getting there... |
| 13:40:13 | cmarqu | pb: Ah. The internal flash is occupied by, uh, dare I say it, wince. |
| 13:40:31 | cmarqu | Which I never run, I swear! |
| 13:40:43 | pb | Ah, all becomes clear now! |
| 13:41:32 | cmarqu | Damn. I lost my ipaq power cable for the car... |
| 13:57:56 | cmarqu | pb: Can you take care of morays patch for gpe-logout? As you know, I cannot test it easily, and I'm busy (and will be away for the weekend) |
| 13:58:04 | pb | cmarqu: sure. |
| 13:58:57 | cmarqu | Thanks. |
| 14:01:04 | cmarqu | This self-powered usb cable... I guess it's the same if you want to power the usb cradle instead? |
| 14:01:17 | pb | Guess o. |
| 14:01:25 | pb | I think there are instructions on the web for hacking your USB cradle. |
| 14:01:40 | cmarqu | Indeed. |
| 14:02:54 | pb | I keep meaning to do that, just to reduce the power-cable clutter under my desk a bit. In theory USB isn't rated for a high enough current to run the iPAQ, which I guess is why Compaq didn't ship the cradles that way, but I gather it works ok in practice. |
| 14:04:40 | cmarqu | Yeah, Tangent has it, for instance. I also have a powered usb hub which I'll use then. |
| 14:06:27 | pb | Right. |
| 14:22:24 | mallum | pb: I hjave a home made usb charger cable and one I purchased in the states |
| 14:28:53 | cmarqu | mallum: Is the US one an official one from Compaq? |
| 14:37:18 | mallum | cmarqu: no, not official |
| 14:37:45 | cmarqu | mallum: Well, it works, that's all we need. |
| 15:50:31 | pb_ | hey mallum |
| 15:50:46 | mallum | hey pb |
| 15:50:56 | mallum | they worked me to the bone today |
| 15:51:06 | pb_ | :-( |
| 15:52:45 | mallum | I tried to tell the guy who Im working for to Capitalise his globals and put constants in all CAPS ( this is php ) |
| 15:53:20 | mallum | he informed me that wasn't the way to do it and it was fine to keep everything how you wanted |
| 15:56:36 | mccarthy | mallum: wow, man. you are a celeb... you got slashdotted! |
| 15:57:33 | mccarthy | hey. does anyone know if "freeware" projects ever get government funding? (say from the NSF?) |
| 16:00:51 | mallum | mccarthy: ;) |
| 16:01:19 | mallum | mccarthy: the coolest thing about that slashdot article is it seems people are finally realising X is not bloatware |
| 16:01:46 | PaxAnima | X bloat? |
| 16:02:10 | mccarthy | mallum: well, not every poster, but yes many did.... there were also a bunch of noops that said "why not simply use qtopia" |
| 16:02:54 | PaxAnima | how optimized is the X on the ipaq? |
| 16:06:21 | mccarthy | yippee! I got the rtcd to re-start a process and *then* make it set off its alarm! |
| 16:07:03 | mallum | PaxAnima: its about an 800k binary ( the server ) and memory usage is low as well |
| 16:10:26 | PaxAnima | mallum: but can it get any faster? the refresh isn't always the best |
| 16:11:43 | pb_ | mccarthy: cool! |
| 16:12:10 | mccarthy | pb_: I will have a gpe-calendar that cheats off of the gpe-alarm app in a bit... |
| 16:12:11 | mallum | BeerAnima: you mean on the ipaq ? |
| 16:13:11 | pb_ | mccarthy: even better. |
| 16:14:16 | mccarthy | pb_: it will be a nasty hack though.... and I am not sure I would like to package it up.... |
| 16:14:25 | mccarthy | but it will work for me?! |
| 16:14:31 | pb_ | heh |
| 16:21:00 | mccarthy | pb_: 30 seconds til test.... |
| 16:22:09 | mccarthy | pb_: worked nicely except for the comment string.... |
| 16:22:22 | mccarthy | pb_: the reason I dont want to package it is: |
| 16:22:31 | mccarthy | I would need to package libgpe |
| 16:22:34 | mccarthy | then gpe-alarm |
| 16:22:34 | mccarthy | then rtcd |
| 16:22:55 | mccarthy | and even then gpe-calendar would depend on *all* of them |
| 16:23:11 | mccarthy | and it would open gpe-alarm whenever an alarm would sound |
| 16:23:52 | mccarthy | so it needs more work, but Nils never answered my email so I dont know which way to go |
| 16:24:13 | mccarthy | so (as usual) I want it to work for me and then "whatever" |
| 16:24:34 | pb_ | right. |
| 16:24:42 | mccarthy | I will be glad to amek it work for others in a reasonably *real* way later... |
| 16:24:52 | mccarthy | but I *will* put packages in my feed |
| 16:24:56 | mccarthy | in the meantime |
| 16:25:01 | pb_ | can you have another go at establishing a dialogue with Nils, maybe get him to package rtcd and gpe-alarm too? |
| 16:25:22 | mccarthy | pb_: but I had to hack both to get this working.... |
| 16:25:37 | mccarthy | pb_: should I commit that to CVS? (we could always go back later, right?) |
| 16:25:40 | pb_ | yeah, I was hoping the dialogue would include sending him your changes :-) |
| 16:26:04 | pb_ | mccarthy: no, I don't think you should commit changes to Nils' stuff without asking him first. |
| 16:26:28 | mccarthy | pb_: oh... OK |
| 16:30:14 | spung | mallum: hi there, mr. i-have-nice-teeth :) |
| 16:30:29 | mccarthy | pb_: I think we need to coordinate with Nils (and others) as to what an "alarm" structure should look like... |
| 16:30:37 | pb_ | mccarthy: good idea |
| 16:30:44 | mallum | spung: :D |
| 16:37:38 | mccarthy | pb_: I cc'd you on the email ;) |
| 16:37:50 | pb_ | cool. |
| 16:38:10 | mccarthy | pb_: should I commit the changes to gpe-calendar? since it sort of breaks things with alarms until the rtcd and gpe-alarm stuff is hashed out... |
| 16:38:32 | pb_ | make a branch if you want |
| 16:38:39 | pb_ | probably best not to commit them to the mainline until it works. |
| 16:38:42 | mccarthy | pb_: no idea how |
| 16:38:51 | pb_ | rtfm :-) "cvs tag -b ..." |
| 16:39:26 | mccarthy | pb_: I *would* rtfm if it was *my* idea ;p |
| 17:02:43 | mccarthy | pb_: do you have rsync installed on europa.armlinux.org? |
| 17:03:20 | mccarthy | pb_: why dont I simply make a branch off of Nils' stuff too then? |
| 17:04:06 | pb_ | mccarthy: uh, no, I don't think europa has rsync, why do you ask? |
| 17:04:38 | mccarthy | pb_: because I wanted to move my stuff from here to there (since I wan't going to commit it all) |
| 17:04:40 | pb_ | mccarthy: it's a bit impolite to make any changes to his code without asking him first, though I guess making a branch would probably be OK. |
| 17:05:05 | pb_ | mccarthy: ah, fair enough. I can install rsync easily if you want it. |
| 17:05:28 | mccarthy | pb_: that would be easier than tagging Nils stuff! |
| 17:05:35 | pb_ | righto. |
| 17:07:29 | mccarthy | pb_: wow! now something is broken... |
| 17:08:26 | pb_ | mccarthy: rsync is installed now. |
| 17:08:26 | pb_ | what's up? |
| 17:08:27 | mccarthy | pb_: I did cvs tag -b alarm_stuff |
| 17:08:27 | mccarthy | pb_: then cvs commit |
| 17:08:27 | pb_ | ah |
| 17:08:27 | mccarthy | pb_: now I seem to be stuck in something that looks like a vi |
| 17:08:27 | mccarthy | but I cannot get out |
| 17:08:31 | mccarthy | (:q does nothing) |
| 17:08:37 | pb_ | well, that's lucky, because it sounds like you were about to check in to the mainline by mistake :-) |
| 17:08:50 | pb_ | cvs tag -b just creates a branch, you need to use cvs update -r to actually start working on it. |
| 17:09:14 | pb_ | I've no idea what the strange quasi-vi you've encountered is about though. |
| 17:13:22 | mallum | I just got a load of xkbd patches |
| 17:14:02 | pb_ | mallum: cool, what do they do? |
| 17:15:23 | mallum | pb_: on fixes xft defines and add xpm defines so it will work with out xpm too |
| 17:30:42 | mallum | pb_: another locks modifier keys if pressed twice |
| 17:30:44 | mallum | pb_: and I havn't quite figured out what the third one does |
| 17:30:45 | lars_g | mallum: are you around? |
| 17:30:45 | pb_ | mallum: I started writing a daemon to do persistent XSettings storage |
| 17:30:45 | mallum | lars_g: yes indeed |
| 17:30:46 | mallum | pb_: oooh nice :) |
| 17:30:46 | mallum | pb_: did you test the latest matchbox CVS with the an XResources property thing on root BTW ? |
| 17:30:46 | lars_g | mallum: I just wanted to congrat you on the great article you got up on linuxdevices.org |
| 17:30:47 | pb_ | mallum: yep, I tried it yesterday, seemed to work fine. |
| 17:30:47 | lars_g | mallum: and to tell you that I hope matchbox continues to grow and develope for many years to come, it does has a lot of potential. |
| 17:30:47 | pb_ | lars_g: let's hope it doesn't grow too much! |
| 17:30:47 | pb_ | ;-) |
| 17:30:47 | lars_g | mallum: just don't ever let it get overgrown or buldge. :) all extras can be added externally :) |
| 17:30:48 | lars_g | mallum: all in all, congrats man :) |
| 17:30:48 | mallum | lars_g: dont worry , it will get smaller ( binary size ) before it gets larger :) |
| 17:30:48 | lars_g | mallum: you're one of the big ones now :) |
| 17:30:48 | mallum | lars_g: heh ... if only ;) |
| 17:30:49 | mallum | lars_g: thanks dudeo |
| 17:30:49 | pb_ | absolutely, he will be giving keynote addresses at LinuxWorld before you know it. |
| 17:30:49 | mallum | heh |
| 17:30:49 | lars_g | lol |
| 17:30:50 | lars_g | just clear me something |
| 17:30:51 | mallum | dinner time ... brb .. |
| 17:30:51 | lars_g | I didn't realize matchbox in it's still debugging stage had many more users beyound the ipaq or these that have a zaurus and tested it on there too, I am pressuming that the other machiens you've mentioned ar eones you've tested on or someone who knwos matchbox risked gettign it there and wrote you to tell it worked fine... |
| 17:30:52 | lars_g | But what is all this about: "I've also been told small children enjoy using Matchbox on desktop machines" |
| 17:30:52 | lars_g | ?? |
| 17:30:52 | lars_g | lol |
| 17:30:52 | pb_ | heh |
| 17:30:53 | lars_g | pb_: pardon my manners man... How do you do? |
| 17:30:53 | pb_ | hey lars_g, not so bad. |
| 17:30:53 | lars_g | pb_: glad to hear |
| 17:30:53 | lars_g | pb_: btw what is the problem with gpe-contacts? |
| 17:30:54 | pb_ | lars_g: which problem do you mean? |
| 17:30:54 | lars_g | I donwloaded the lattest feed ipkg, it seems pretty usseable |
| 17:30:54 | lars_g | it might be a little TOO ocnfigurable for the end user but it seems to be in workign order |
| 17:30:54 | pb_ | lars_g: yeah, we reached quite a milestone earlier in the week, you can actually save and retrieve contacts now :-) |
| 17:30:54 | lars_g | pb_: btw did DaveH finally show up with the changes or definitive scheme for gpe? |
| 17:30:55 | lars_g | if I had just time :( |
| 17:30:55 | mccarthy | cmarqu: what was that include for "make ipkg"? |
| 17:30:55 | lars_g | I dreamt of contributing gpe's own Obex lib.... |
| 17:30:55 | pb_ | lars_g: no, haven't heard from Dave in a while. I decided in the end to just implement something in gpe-contacts based on what we had so far. |
| 17:30:55 | pb_ | lars_g: the main things it's lacking at the moment are working categories, and the ability to search by name rather than just browse the list. |
| 17:30:55 | lars_g | pb_: I saw. |
| 17:30:56 | lars_g | being an ex palm user I'd suggest searching on any matched criteria rather than on name only |
| 17:30:57 | lars_g | if the scheme hasn't changed much since the last time I saw it, it shouldn't be too hard, just a single or couple of select where like's :) |
| 17:30:57 | pb_ | yeah, it needs two modes really. |
| 17:30:57 | pb_ | there's a small text box on the main page, and the idea was that you could enter characters into that one at a time and get a kind of interactive search. |
| 17:30:57 | pb_ | for more complicated things, yes, it would be nice to have a real "search" dialog that let you match any field. |
| 17:30:57 | lars_g | more like a filter applied on each change of the boxe's content you mean. |
| 17:30:58 | lars_g | not a bad idea. |
| 17:31:22 | lars_g | also we could add an alphabetical progressive filter like the Rex's have you seen it? |
| 17:31:45 | lars_g | on a stylus based machine it should be breathtaking fast to use |
| 17:34:21 | pb_ | no, I haven't, do you have a pointer to that? |
| 17:36:09 | lars_g | hmmm I do not know if there is a demo or similar feature online I experience dit directly on a rex but I cna describe the system |
| 17:36:28 | lars_g | the rex is a pda in pcmcia format |
| 17:36:42 | lars_g | to sync you put it in a pcmcia port and it syncs |
| 17:36:42 | lars_g | it's extremelly small |
| 17:36:49 | lars_g | and has only 5 buttons to handle it. |
| 17:37:56 | lars_g | the contatcs interface is veyr smart, you have tabs. I think ti where five (we can try any number until it fits the ipaq/zaurus screen size easily) |
| 17:37:57 | lars_g | a-f, g-j, k-n etc tec |
| 17:38:02 | lars_g | you selct a tab it opens tabs on the same range while showing bellow only the persons with first/last names startign in that range. |
| 17:38:29 | lars_g | you have many people ? for exampel you select p-t and are lookign for thomas too many people with names form p to t |
| 17:38:42 | lars_g | you have new tabs up with ever letter in the range: p,q,r,s,t |
| 17:38:58 | lars_g | select T, and you have only the first an dlast names startign with t bellow |
| 17:39:46 | lars_g | need more? now you have the tabs ta,te,ti,to,tu up (and if there are some non standrard american names like Tsun Tsu you have a Ts tab) seletc it and the list filter once again |
| 17:40:00 | lars_g | it's a filter with progresive coarsiness |
| 17:40:22 | lars_g | very fast and very efficient, on the rex ussing three buttons to navigate (four if you count back) it is very fast |
| 17:40:27 | pb_ | I see |
| 17:40:30 | pb_ | very cool. |
| 17:40:33 | lars_g | on a pda where you can tap the tab directly it should do better yet |
| 17:40:55 | pb_ | can you put a description of it in the wiki on the CurrentThingsToDo page? |
| 17:41:01 | lars_g | I will |
| 17:41:03 | pb_ | just pasting in the text you just wrote would be fine. |
| 17:41:22 | lars_g | and I will look first check there is no Tm or (c) on the technique too :) |
| 17:41:33 | pb_ | ah, good plan. |
| 17:41:51 | lars_g | Rex was bought by xircom and then by Intel, the newer models are very diferent than the old one I had and might nto use the same iface but we better be sure |
| 17:47:56 | lars_g | today I've been forced to make something for windows for the first time in a looong time :( |
| 17:48:18 | pb_ | oh dear :-( |
| 17:49:11 | lars_g | they want me to find or worse to make (ack) a log analysis tool for an IIS server :( |
| 17:49:20 | lars_g | I do not do windows!!! but try tellign that to your boss |
| 18:02:58 | pb_ | Nasty. You have my sympathy. |
| 18:02:58 | flypiper | lars_g: :\ |
| 18:02:59 | lars_g | thank you both |
| 18:03:05 | BBrox | mallum: what a star :-) |
| 18:03:05 | lars_g | LOL |
| 18:03:06 | mallum | BBrox: heh ;) |
| 18:03:06 | mallum | [OT] ANyone know much about amd cpu's and bus speeds ? |
| 18:03:07 | pb_ | mallum: little bit, why do you ask? |
| 18:03:08 | mallum | pb_: well I have a abit kt7-raid mother board and Im trying to figure out what the fatest CPU is it will support ... |
| 18:03:08 | pb_ | mallum: how fast does its bus go? |
| 18:03:09 | mallum | pb_: 200mhz |
| 18:03:09 | mallum | pb_: I think I safest if I can find somewhere selling old athlon thunderbirds |
| 18:03:10 | pb_ | guess so. |
| 18:03:38 | pb_ | you might be able to look in the BIOS, find out what the maximum clock is it can run the cpu at. |
| 18:03:50 | mallum | pb_: problem is cant find anywhere :( |
| 18:03:55 | pb_ | ah. |
| 18:04:08 | pb_ | abit web site? |
| 18:04:44 | mallum | yeah not much help |
| 18:05:33 | mallum | I think my best bet may be tcr computers fairs for a slightly older athlon |
| 18:05:33 | pb_ | sounds like a good plan. |
| 18:05:33 | pb_ | I think the worst that will happen if you get one that's too new is it won't run at top speed. |
| 18:15:13 | mccarthy | pb_: do you use a prism2-based card? |
| 18:20:23 | pb_ | mccarthy: yes. |
| 18:20:24 | pb_ | mccarthy: it's an Actiontec something or other. |
| 18:20:25 | mccarthy | pb_: do you get this "watchdog" error all the time? |
| 18:20:26 | pb_ | mccarthy: NETDEV WATCHDOG you mean? |
| 18:20:29 | mccarthy | yep |
| 18:20:34 | pb_ | hmm, don't think so. |
| 18:20:43 | pb_ | I get that a lot with USB. :-} |
| 18:30:33 | mccarthy | pb_: what is supposed to happen if no ine is logged in and an alarm is to go off? |
| 18:30:33 | pb_ | mccarthy: good question |
| 18:30:33 | pb_ | mccarthy: I suppose it should be configurable whether it pops up anyway. |
| 18:30:33 | mccarthy | pb_: *could* it pop-up over top of the gpe-login window? |
| 18:30:33 | pb_ | mccarthy: yes, I think so, gpe-login is not all that powerful. |
| 18:30:34 | pb_ | mccarthy: might have to set override redirect or something. |
| 18:30:34 | mccarthy | pb_: one small problem is that the rtc driver seems to be run by the user rather than root... |
| 18:30:34 | mccarthy | pb_: what does crw-r----- mean? (the perms on the rtc device) |
| 18:30:35 | mccarthy | Ive never seen c before |
| 18:30:35 | pb_ | character device. |
| 18:31:07 | mccarthy | pb_: well, it looks like I changed the necessity of keeping an app *open* to the necessity of being logged in... |
| 18:32:41 | pb_ | hmm, well, that's an improvement at least. |
| 18:32:41 | pb_ | we'll have to think more about the not-logged-in issue. |
| 18:34:48 | pb_ | mallum: I checked in a first rough cut at gpe-confd |
| 18:34:58 | pb_ | mallum: untested so far, but at least it compiles. |
| 18:38:28 | mallum | pb_: cool, Im just trying out these xkbd patches |
| 18:39:31 | pb_ | mallum: excellent. |
| 18:39:47 | mallum | pb_: the modifier key one is pretty nice. You hit the key twice ( say shift or control ) and it locks it like caps |
| 18:41:21 | pb_ | mallum: now all we need are some XSettings clients :-) |
| 18:41:21 | pb_ | mallum: sounds good. |
| 18:41:21 | mallum | pb_: did you make the server serialise etc ? |
| 18:41:21 | mallum | updates |
| 18:41:21 | pb_ | mallum: yes. |
| 18:41:22 | pb_ | mallum: it uses Berkeley DB for the on disk storage. |
| 18:41:23 | pb_ | mallum: I invented a simple protocol to allow clients to set settings: you basically put the new setting into a property on one of your own windows and send the daemon a ClientMessage telling it where to find the data. |
| 18:42:18 | lars_g | I am soooo close of totally dropping the cute opie and keep with gpe only :) |
| 18:42:30 | pb_ | lars_g: wahey! :-) |
| 18:42:33 | lars_g | I miss only... hmmm, three things? |
| 18:42:40 | lars_g | A good Fm. |
| 18:42:44 | mallum | pb_: maybe more efficent to send a message like how clients message the dock ...? |
| 18:42:46 | lars_g | A fully working contacts |
| 18:43:05 | lars_g | and finally a good encrypted password database. |
| 18:43:16 | lars_g | and I would kill for a hierachiral notepad ;) |
| 18:43:22 | lars_g | brb switching from gaim to everybuddy |
| 18:44:19 | pb_ | mallum: yah, maybe. I doubt there's much in it. |
| 18:44:24 | mallum | pb_: when I try and update I get : protocol error: directory '/cvs/gpe/base/GPE-BatMon' not within root '/usr/cvs' |
| 18:44:32 | pb_ | mallum: rm -r GPE-BatMon |
| 18:45:01 | pb_ | mallum: but CVS seems pretty fucked at the moment, don't quite know what's going on. |
| 19:00:57 | mallum | pb_: I had to delete storm/icons too, ok now |
| 19:00:57 | pb_ | cool. |
| 19:00:57 | mallum | pb_: if I get some convert time tommorow do you want me to attempt to patch it so client can set with just client messages ? |
| 19:00:57 | pb_ | mallum: sure, if you like. I just copied my protocol from the X selection stuff. |
| 19:00:57 | mallum | pb_: ok I'll take a look |
| 19:00:57 | pb_ | cool. |
| 19:00:58 | pb_ | I'll have a go at implementing a libgconf client next. |
| 19:00:58 | pb_ | looks like it should be fairly straightforward: the gconf operations map fairly naturally on to xsettings stuff. |
| 19:00:59 | mallum | pb_: cool, its really nice |
| 19:01:00 | mallum | pb_: you is xlib hacker too now :) |
| 19:01:00 | pb_ | heh |
| 19:01:00 | mallum | pb_: shall I fire a post at the xsg list asking about xsettings being set from clients ? |
| 19:01:01 | pb_ | good idea, yes. |
| 19:01:01 | mallum | pb_: cool will do that now |
| 19:01:42 | mallum | pb_: do you want too subscribe to xdg-list@freedesktop.org so you can follow it ? |
| 19:02:10 | mallum | https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/xdg-list |
| 19:02:18 | mallum | pb_: its low volume |
| 19:02:50 | pb_ | cool, will o |
| 19:03:06 | mallum | ok, taking a break ... |
| 19:11:22 | mccarthy | pb_: does the esd stuff and soundserver work for you? |
| 19:12:10 | pb_ | yes. |
| 19:12:33 | pb_ | I think cmarqu has also had good luck with it. |
| 19:12:34 | mccarthy | pb_: using madplay, gpe-media, ...? |
| 19:12:51 | pb_ | haven't tried either of those. |
| 19:12:59 | mccarthy | pb_: what have you tried? |
| 19:13:07 | pb_ | it works with gpe-soundbite, and scummvm (via esddsp) |
| 19:13:30 | pb_ | I also tried a handful of clients on my desktop connecting to a remote server on the ipaq, though I forget which ones. |
| 19:13:43 | pb_ | Colin did have a go at getting madplay to work, I think he had some trouble. |
| 19:14:32 | ade | evening all |
| 19:15:08 | ade | can someone point me to the lastest feed for GPE ? |
| 19:15:21 | pb_ | it's all in familiar. |
| 19:15:23 | | installing gpe is easy: just make sure i am running Familiar unstable or 0.6, and "ipkg install gpe". or possible by directly flashing the bootgpe image in 0.6 |
| 19:15:23 | pb_ | ibot, installing gpe? |
| 19:15:51 | ade | ta muchly |
| 19:16:06 | ade | does 0.6 == unstable ? |
| 19:16:43 | mccarthy | sh-2.03$ madplay /tmp/maybe.mp3 MPEG Audio Decoder 0.14.2 (beta) - Copyright (C) 2000-2001 Robert Leslie audio: /dev/dsp: Device or resource busy |
| 19:17:03 | ade | esd has a lock on the dsp i think |
| 19:17:09 | pb_ | no, 0.6 has been forked, it's in pre-release state at the moment. |
| 19:17:11 | mccarthy | ade pb: yep |
| 19:17:21 | pb_ | mccarthy: you need to either use esddsp, or configure madplay to talk esd directly. |
| 19:18:24 | mccarthy | pb_: how does one "use" esddsp? |
| 19:18:51 | pb_ | mccarthy: $ esddsp madplay ... |
| 19:19:09 | pb_ | mccarthy: however, esddsp falls into the "never use this program" category. |
| 19:19:18 | mccarthy | pb_: why? |
| 19:19:46 | mccarthy | pb_: I cannot get the sounds importnat to me to work otherwise... |
| 19:19:47 | mccarthy | pb_: like mp3s and gpe-alarm(!) |
| 19:19:47 | pb_ | mccarthy: esddsp is a gruesome hack, it works sometimes but it's rather hit and miss. |
| 19:20:14 | mccarthy | pb_: I think I will temporarily ditch the soundserver and esd stuff then... |
| 19:20:20 | pb_ | mccarthy: the right thing to do is add native esd support to the appropriate programs. Certainly that's what we should do for gpe-calendar, and I'm pretty sure madplay can do that too. |
| 19:20:24 | mccarthy | pb_: and have my linuxrc chmod the devs |
| 19:20:37 | pb_ | should be no need for any chmodding. |
| 19:20:47 | pb_ | you can just kill off esd and you should be in business. |
| 19:21:21 | mccarthy | pb_: who changes the ownership of the devs? |
| 19:22:11 | pb_ | pre-session I think. |
| 19:22:11 | pb_ | one of the session scripts, anyway. The soundserver wouldn't run if the permissions were wrong. |
| 19:22:21 | mccarthy | pb_: so for now I can ditch esd and be fine... |
| 19:22:27 | pb_ | yeah. |
| 19:24:53 | ade | should there be a wrapper around the sound stuff, thus keeping the extra code out of the apps , less code = less size :) |
| 19:24:56 | lars_g | hmmm |
| 19:38:29 | lars_g | it does works but I am nto satisfied |
| 19:44:30 | lars_g | Hello all :) |
| 19:44:30 | ade | lo |
| 19:44:31 | lars_g | hmmm well |
| 19:44:31 | lars_g | /join #handhelds.org |
| 19:44:31 | lars_g | sigh |
| 19:44:34 | pb_ | ade: libesd.so is basically that wrapper. |
| 19:44:34 | pb_ | ade: programs just need to use it instead of OSS directly. |
| 19:44:34 | lars_g | /me cries |
| 19:44:35 | ade | pb_: ah right ta for pointing that out .. might use it then :) |
| 19:44:35 | pb_ | lars_g: what's wrong? |
| 19:44:35 | pb_ | oh, he's gone. |
| 19:44:38 | ade | how is the mediaplayer coming along , i haven't checked the cvs in a while ? |
| 19:44:39 | pb_ | ade: not much progress to report. Damien is working on it though. |
| 19:44:49 | mccarthy | pb_: any idea what the /boot/params should be for 0.6? |
| 19:45:34 | ade | hi lars_g |
| 19:46:37 | lars_g | hi ade |
| 19:47:04 | lars_g | i'm back and back to gaim, happier now |
| 19:47:07 | lars_g | I might not have file transfers but the UI is much much nicer |
| 19:47:30 | lars_g | mallum: man have you seen slashdot? mostly positive comments :) |
| 19:49:49 | lars_g | mallum: next thing you know you'll be working along Alan and David on redhat :) |
| 19:53:40 | lars_g | appart from the client/server no-client/server thread |
| 19:55:12 | lars_g | boy how does it feels to be suddenly more famous thanks to a work well done? |
| 19:58:41 | pb_ | mccarthy: no idea, sorry |
| 19:58:54 | mccarthy | pb_: no worries. all better |
| 19:59:06 | pb_ | oh right, cool. |
| 19:59:13 | mccarthy | see yins (as we say here in the 'burgh) |
| 20:02:03 | lars_g | sigh |
| 20:02:03 | lars_g | Ok i'll do it |
| 20:02:03 | lars_g | I need to recode the microkbd driver once and for all, better now than never |
| 20:14:21 | mallum | lars_g: Im too good looking for red hat ;) |
| 20:18:34 | pb_ | mallum: hmm, we also need an XSettings method for deleting keys, I just realised. |
| 20:26:14 | mallum | pb_: yeah I guess you'd specify the type of operation in the clientmessage |
| 20:26:23 | pb_ | yep, guess so. |
| 20:27:25 | prpplague | mallum: ha too good looking? |
| 20:27:45 | mallum | prpplague: ha |
| 20:28:09 | mallum | pb_: hmm, just got a reply from the xsg list re xsettings |
| 20:28:36 | pb_ | ah, what does it say? |
| 20:28:42 | pb_ | my subscription doesn't seem to have come through yet. |
| 20:29:25 | prpplague | mallum: got a quick question, what would it take to add an option to turn off the popup add/remove menu? |
| 20:29:37 | mallum | pb_: "The spec is intentionally read-only." |
| 20:30:11 | mallum | prpplague: just set the timout to a massive value , thats the easiest way |
| 20:30:57 | prpplague | mallum: ahh that would do it, that code is not that big is it? probably around 5-10k? |
| 20:31:09 | pb_ | mallum: hmm. |
| 20:31:18 | mallum | prpplague: -t switch it is |
| 20:31:27 | mallum | prpplague: yeah probably about that |
| 20:31:51 | mallum | prpplague: probably would be too hard to remove, just look for mbmenu_* calls in dock.c |
| 20:32:04 | mallum | prpplague: if you can do it with ifdefs and send me a patch, that'd be great |
| 20:32:08 | prpplague | mallum: think it would break anything if i ifdef'd it out? |
| 20:32:16 | prpplague | mallum: doh |
| 20:32:16 | pb_ | mallum: oh yeah, found it in the archive. |
| 20:32:24 | mallum | prpplague: shouldn;t do |
| 20:32:25 | prpplague | mallum: i'll look at it tonight |
| 20:32:29 | mallum | prpplague: cool |
| 20:32:40 | mallum | pb_: archived already ? was just about to cut and paste it |
| 20:33:18 | pb_ | yeah, most list archives are virtually real time these days :-) |
| 20:34:51 | pb_ | well, Owen's point seems like a fair one, I guess we shouldn't worry about it too much. |
| 20:35:51 | mallum | pb_: yeah , I dont know how much the user thing is valid |
| 20:36:12 | mallum | pb_: multiple keys thing is not the end of the world |
| 20:36:50 | mallum | pb_: can gconf be compiled without gnome ? |
| 20:37:02 | pb_ | Yeah. |
| 20:37:15 | pb_ | It needs glib though. |
| 20:38:02 | mallum | pb_: and some sort of cobra stuff ? |
| 20:38:07 | pb_ | ORBit |
| 20:38:14 | mallum | pb_: how small do you think it could go with deps ? |
| 20:38:22 | mallum | pb_: and not hacking much of it |
| 20:38:31 | pb_ | dunno, the idea of CORBA scares me quite a lot, lemme look. |
| 20:39:01 | mallum | pb_: yeah me too |
| 20:39:06 | pb_ | 139520 9860 28 149408 247a0 libgconf-2.so.4 |
| 20:39:06 | pb_ | 208327 32920 32 241279 3ae7f libORBit-2.so.0 |
| 20:39:40 | pb_ | 24530 6444 32 31006 791e liblinc.so.1 |
| 20:40:00 | pb_ | 401388 3660 68 405116 62e7c libglib-2.0.so.0 |
| 20:40:00 | pb_ | 8544 512 24 9080 2378 libgmodule-2.0.so.0 |
| 20:40:22 | pb_ | 12355 608 40 13003 32cb libgthread-2.0.so.0 |
| 20:40:23 | pb_ | 8544 512 24 9080 2378 libgmodule-2.0.so.0 |
| 20:40:27 | pb_ | that's about it. |
| 20:40:48 | pb_ | obviously, on a GTK system, you will already have the last four. |
| 20:44:18 | mallum | yep indeed |
| 20:44:36 | mallum | I wonder how much memory/cpu corba uses too |
| 20:44:52 | pb_ | I've no idea at all. Probably quite hard to measure that as well. |
| 20:46:04 | pb_ | My inclination at the moment is to stick with the idea of doing a reduced gconf on top of xsettings. |
| 20:46:40 | mallum | pb_: yeah, Im gonna try and argue my point with him a little though |
| 20:46:45 | pb_ | sure. |
| 20:51:46 | mallum | I think I can put across a good arguement |
| 20:53:47 | PaxAnima | free coffee |
| 20:54:43 | mallum | free crack too |
| 20:54:56 | PaxAnima | oh.. that hard? |
| 20:58:32 | mallum | did owen taylor write the gimp ? or just a load of gtk ? |
| 20:58:47 | pb_ | mmm, not sure. |
| 20:59:45 | pb_ | ah, now, we have another problem. |
| 20:59:57 | pb_ | GConf-2 is kind of heavily bound up with GLib 2.0 |
| 21:00:10 | pb_ | so it will be a nightmare to implement in our existing GTK 1 world. |
| 21:00:30 | pb_ | Implementing GConf-1 would be okay, but that seems like a waste of time. |
| 21:01:19 | PaxAnima | what does gconf do? |
| 21:01:42 | pb_ | I'm not sure if it's reasonable to punt on the whole gconf thing until we have a working GTK 2 solution. |
| 21:01:45 | | Configuration storage library, like libproplist or the Windows Registry. URL: ftp://ftp.gnome.org:/pub/GNOME/sources/GConf/GConf-0.1.tar.gz |
| 21:01:45 | pb_ | ibot, gconf? |
| 21:02:01 | PaxAnima | ok.. |
| 21:02:05 | pb_ | wow, that's old |
| 21:02:12 | | pb_: I forgot gconf |
| 21:02:12 | pb_ | ibot, forget gconf |
| 21:02:47 | | OK, pb_. |
| 21:02:47 | pb_ | ibot, GConf is a system for storing application preferences: http://www.gnome.org/projects/gconf/ |
| 21:02:51 | mallum | pb_: heres what Im gonna post; |
| 21:02:55 | mallum | I like to use it as a lightweight basic configuration system on |
| 21:02:55 | mallum | embedded type platforms where GConf and KDE's config system, although |
| 21:02:55 | mallum | very nice, are just not suitable for platforms where resources are |
| 21:02:55 | mallum | scarce ( Im talking as little as 4megs of flash filesystem here ). |
| 21:02:56 | mallum | Its seems to me, with XSETTINGS you get alot for free, leveraging what X |
| 21:02:58 | mallum | already offers - making it ideal for embedded type systems running X. |
| 21:03:13 | pb_ | sounds reasonable to me. |
| 21:03:17 | mallum | then |
| 21:03:56 | mallum | I think the issues you raise may not become so apparent on this type of platform |
| 21:04:16 | mallum | do you think that last sentence is ok ? |
| 21:04:34 | pb_ | I think I'd leave that bit out. |
| 21:04:47 | mallum | just leave as the two paragraphs |
| 21:04:56 | pb_ | Yeah. |
| 21:05:11 | mallum | cool - sent. |
| 21:05:24 | pb_ | top. |