| 01:11:56 | cmarqu | Hey. |
| 05:08:56 | colin_werk | Morning. |
| 09:11:11 | pb | grr, bloody courier-imap |
| 09:14:29 | colin_werk | Hi. |
| 09:14:36 | pb | hio |
| 09:14:39 | pb | hi even |
| 09:15:43 | colin_werk | With all the many gpe modules now, shouldn't we have a top level makefile that builds most of gpe? |
| 09:16:00 | pb | possibly, yes |
| 09:16:17 | pb | several of the modules require you to have built and installed libgpewidget before they will compile, though |
| 09:16:34 | pb | similarly, I think a lot of the new stuff that Nils added needs an installed libgpe |
| 09:17:11 | colin_werk | So it could run a "make & make install" for these modules, no? |
| 09:17:40 | pb | yeah, I guess, but that would require you to be root. |
| 09:17:45 | colin_werk | "sudo make install" for me. |
| 09:18:04 | colin_werk | I guess it would be better than nothing. |
| 09:18:18 | pb | indeed |
| 09:18:37 | colin_werk | gpe-icons also needs to be installed. |
| 09:18:55 | pb | alternatively, it could just instruct people to "apt-get install libgpewidget-dev" before commencing. |
| 09:19:14 | pb | gpe-icons is a bit different: it's required at runtime, but not necessary for compiling. |
| 09:19:15 | colin_werk | maybe one could have a different target for these, to be run as root, then the rest as non-root, the final install as root again. |
| 09:19:47 | colin_werk | libgpewidget-dev might not be current enough for CVS builds. |
| 09:20:11 | pb | true, but it suffices in 95% of cases. |
| 09:20:47 | colin_werk | And do all developers have Debian (they should, but who knows :) |
| 09:21:12 | pb | yeah, fair point :-} |
| 09:21:14 | colin_werk | gpe-sketchpad looks nice (on the desktop) |
| 09:21:19 | pb | yup, indeed |
| 09:21:37 | pb | I ought to create a bugzilla component for it so I can file some suggestions :-) |
| 09:22:25 | colin_werk | Although a scribbled note like Sam Engstroms thing is nice too. Or cross-link a drawing to a note, and a note to any calendar event... |
| 09:22:32 | pb | maybe another option for dealing with libgpewidget would be to make its structure in CVS more closely mimic the way the files get installed (ie put all the headers in a "gpe" directory, or make a symlink) so that other packages can go back to using the "CVSBUILD=yes" paradigm. |
| 09:22:50 | pb | yup. |
| 09:22:50 | mallum | pb: does gpe-sketchpad expect to handle a rotation ? |
| 09:23:01 | pb | mallum: no idea |
| 09:23:19 | pb | mallum: it's all Gtk based, so I guess rotation should be mostly handled under the hood, lemme look at the code |
| 09:24:31 | colin_werk | pb: Just yesterday I found out what Nexus does. Nice, I'm in the ASIC/FPGA field myself. |
| 09:24:43 | pb | ah, hmm |
| 09:24:59 | pb | sketchpad_init() hard-wires the size of its drawing area |
| 09:25:07 | pb | drawing_area_width = 260; |
| 09:25:09 | pb | drawing_area_height = 280; |
| 09:25:12 | pb | that's gonna be bad. |
| 09:25:34 | pb | colin_werk: heh :-) |
| 09:25:55 | mallum | pb: maybe it could detect the screen rotation and then just rotate the image ? |
| 09:26:11 | pb | mallum: yeah |
| 09:26:44 | pb | mallum: I think it ought to let the WM size its window and then accept whatever drawing area it ends up with, so it will work on non-ipaq hardware too. |
| 09:26:52 | mallum | pb: I was kind of hoping the guy would go for a bezier curve type vector solution |
| 09:26:59 | mallum | pb: yep |
| 09:27:16 | mallum | pb: an advantage of using a vector format would be it could just scale the images up |
| 09:27:35 | pb | mallum: and I think you get some kind of Gtk signal when rotation happens, so it can spot that and readjust its expectations; I'm not sure what you do about the bits of the image that would then be offscreen. |
| 09:27:44 | pb | mallum: yes, indeed. |
| 09:27:54 | pb | mallum: a vector format would be rather cool. |
| 09:28:25 | colin_werk | BTW, did anybody contact this IPIM guy? |
| 09:28:39 | mallum | pb: I was looking at the bezier approximation code in sodipodi - lots of scary maths |
| 09:28:44 | pb | colin_werk: dunno, I lose track of all the different PIMs. |
| 09:28:52 | mallum | colin_werk: I;ve exchanged a few emails with him |
| 09:29:00 | mallum | colin_werk: re matchbox and his app |
| 09:29:09 | mallum | colin_werk: seems to have a few crackpotish ideas |
| 09:29:15 | pb | mallum: yeah, I think that's par for the course when beziers are involved :-/ |
| 09:29:15 | colin_werk | :) |
| 09:29:28 | colin_werk | mallum: in what way crackpotish? |
| 09:29:56 | mallum | colin_werk: well crackpotish in not doing what I think is right ;) |
| 09:30:23 | colin_werk | Hmm. At least he came to the conclusion that sqlite is right :) |
| 09:30:42 | colin_werk | And a currency converter is a good idea too. |
| 09:30:50 | mallum | colin_werk: seriously, he seems to be writing everything inside his app from window management to inpuyt methods etc |
| 09:31:02 | pb | crumbs |
| 09:31:06 | colin_werk | He might not really be a teamplayer tho. |
| 09:31:13 | colin_werk | mallum: Yeah. |
| 09:32:05 | pb | yeah, currency conversion would be a neat little app to have I guess. |
| 09:32:16 | pb | is there some web site where it could download the current exchange rates? |
| 09:32:19 | mallum | I've definetly suggested to him about gpe |
| 09:32:53 | colin_werk | He does download the ratesm yeah. |
| 09:33:30 | colin_werk | The currency converter could be part of a money tracker app. Storm's SF page has such a thing in python BTW. |
| 09:33:55 | pb | colin_werk: yes, dc_ has plans to work on gpe-money |
| 09:33:56 | colin_werk | Well, gotta go home now. BBIAB. |
| 09:34:23 | pb | mmm, I need to go over to ARM. :-/ |
| 09:34:25 | pb | later |
| 09:34:46 | colin_werk | Cool. I'll be the translator guy for now I guess :) |
| 09:35:02 | pb_[away] | colin_werk: cool :-) |
| 11:20:54 | mccarthy | pb_[away]: nils tells me there is a kernel bug causing his rtc stuff to misbehave. I have not yet tested this as I am too lazy to build my own kernel.... |
| 11:21:18 | mccarthy | I may atch and compile it before my trip to Australia Friday, however, if it isn't fixed before that.... |
| 12:26:02 | mccarthy | mallum: any plans to steal ipim's predictive text thing and make a general applet out of it? |
| 12:33:29 | mallum | mccarthy: no |
| 12:33:42 | mallum | mccarthy: he's not compressing the dictonary |
| 12:34:04 | mallum | mccarthy: find a good dictionary compression algorithm and I'll right one |
| 12:40:06 | mallum | mccarthy: it could also be context sensitive, so if you were running a term, it would complete more weighed towards regular shell commands etc |
| 12:41:34 | mccarthy | what about something really simple like http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=6wox4.2689%248wL.9896350%40news.xtra.co.nz&rnum=9&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DISO-8859-1%26q%3Ddictionary%2Bcompression |
| 12:45:54 | mallum | mccarthy: maybe worth hashing something like that out in perl and seeing what sort of compression you get |
| 12:46:21 | mallum | that looks nice though cos you'd still be able to do lookups quite fast right ? |
| 12:46:41 | mccarthy | mallum: I dont know I just serached google and then barfed it at you |
| 12:46:46 | mccarthy | :) |
| 12:47:38 | mallum | professor, can you set it as a task for one of your students ? |
| 12:48:20 | mccarthy | doesnt have much to do with Chemical Engineering, Im afraid :( |
| 12:48:43 | mallum | they dont need to know that though ! |
| 13:06:31 | spung | hello there |
| 13:06:36 | spung | a little question |
| 13:06:47 | spung | how do I use libgpewidget |
| 13:07:20 | spung | the docs talk about #include <gpe/bla.h> |
| 13:07:32 | spung | but there's no dir gpe ... |
| 13:15:15 | mallum | exams finished ? |
| 13:18:17 | spung | mallum: pretty much |
| 13:18:23 | spung | =) |
| 13:18:36 | spung | a couple of things to do tho ;) |
| 13:19:44 | spung | going to college this year ;) |
| 13:22:15 | mallum | big deal, been there done that ;) |
| 13:22:20 | mallum | hey nelson |
| 13:22:26 | nelson | hey. |
| 13:22:34 | nelson | I"m here to whinge about gpe-soundbite. |
| 13:22:43 | mallum | if your looking for pb, he's not about at the moment |
| 13:22:59 | nelson | mallum: hey, um, didn't you say that the miniapps were going to be on the menu in 0.3? |
| 13:23:40 | mccarthy | I think moray is the one messing with gpe-soundbite anyway... |
| 13:23:47 | nelson | yep. |
| 13:23:52 | cmarqu | They are in the dock's menu |
| 13:24:25 | nelson | hmmm.... my dock has no menu. |
| 13:24:29 | cmarqu | The theme selection could/should be there too IMO, for consistency. |
| 13:24:52 | mallum | nelson: you have to click, hold for a sec, then release on the dock |
| 13:24:56 | cmarqu | Hmm. Mine has. Comes up when I release the pen. |
| 13:25:07 | mallum | nelson: its unfortunatly a little hidden at the moment |
| 13:25:12 | nelson | lemme check version. |
| 13:25:23 | mallum | nelson: suggestions for for making that more obvious welcomed |
| 13:25:33 | nelson | 0.3 |
| 13:25:33 | mallum | cmarqu: the themes are in the menu now |
| 13:25:48 | cmarqu | mallum: BTW, 0.3 rocks. |
| 13:25:52 | mallum | nelson: click the dock and hold for a second, then release |
| 13:25:55 | mallum | cmarqu: thanks :) |
| 13:26:07 | cmarqu | mallum: In the menu, but I think they should be in the dock menu. |
| 13:26:19 | mallum | cmarqu: yeah but dock is not part of matchbox anymore :) |
| 13:26:25 | nelson | done that. no good. Also, when I run a mini-app, I get nothing.... |
| 13:26:26 | mallum | cmarqu: well not in binary form |
| 13:26:46 | mallum | nelson: no menu, no |
| 13:26:48 | cmarqu | Ah. Hmm. |
| 13:26:49 | mallum | dock apps ? |
| 13:28:05 | nelson | no dock apps either, except for mmenu and xstroke. |
| 13:28:30 | cmarqu | mallum: BTW, I was just using ipkg upgrade to get to 0.3, should that take care of everything, or do I need to remove/install more stuff? |
| 13:28:45 | nelson | I'm upgraded entirely to unstable. |
| 13:28:55 | mallum | cmarqu: see fam mail list a couple of days back for matchbox 0.3 announce |
| 13:29:07 | cmarqu | nelson: Me too. |
| 13:29:08 | mallum | nelson: what happens if you do a minitime & from a term ? |
| 13:29:12 | cmarqu | mallum: Oh, okay. |
| 13:31:20 | nelson | oh-ho! I wasn't running what I had updated too. |
| 13:31:24 | nelson | s/too/to/ |
| 13:32:33 | nelson | Oh, crap, something removed /sbin/getty!! |
| 13:40:51 | | moray was last seen on #gpe 13 days, 19 hours, 52 minutes and 9 seconds ago, saying: spung: and it won't try to look at bits of the FS that you haven't asked it about I expect [Tue Jul 2 18:48:42 2002] |
| 13:40:51 | nelson | ibot: seen moray? |
| 13:41:02 | nelson | that's not encouraging. |
| 13:42:13 | spung | heh |
| 13:42:17 | spung | he was talking to me |
| 13:42:18 | spung | :) |
| 13:42:36 | spung | jeez.. that means my ipaq has been dead for like 13 days |
| 13:42:37 | spung | jeez |
| 13:42:44 | spung | i miss it |
| 13:42:56 | spung | does anybody know how i can mount a jffs2 image? |
| 13:43:00 | spung | i want to recover what's in it? |
| 13:43:05 | spung | (wrong channel) |
| 13:44:24 | cmarqu | mallum: Can I make matchbox forget about its session? |
| 13:46:29 | nelson | mallum: suggestion for the menu: at very least, pop the menu up after the delay period, rather than waiting for the button release. |
| 13:47:04 | nelson | mallum: what wrong, though, with popping up the menu on a click? |
| 13:47:56 | cmarqu | nelson: The dock might not have free space for a click that doesn't go to a dock app I guess. |
| 13:47:57 | nelson | mallum: also, why do I need to click in the very, very center of the volume control icon to make the volume control pop up? |
| 13:48:15 | nelson | cmarqu: good point, but still. |
| 13:49:02 | nelson | cmarqu: no, actually, try holding on the clock. Instead of getting a dock menu, you immediately get a balloon. |
| 13:49:30 | cmarqu | Hmm, right. |
| 13:49:43 | nelson | battery monitor is the same way. |
| 13:50:38 | nelson | mallum: xstroke-ma5 doesn't recognize strokes. |
| 13:50:44 | cmarqu | mallum: mbdock should have a -h option. |
| 13:51:03 | nelson | mallum: oh, I see, you have to be over an application first.... |
| 13:53:07 | mallum | nelson: sure the menu is gonna popup just after the delay |
| 13:53:16 | mallum | nelson: not after the release |
| 13:53:42 | mallum | cmarqu: mdock is in progress |
| 13:53:56 | mallum | cmarqu: check the docs http://handhelds.org/~mallum/matchbox |
| 13:56:14 | cmarqu | mallum: I read, but mbdock -n does not clear the session info, the next time with mbdock, all the accumulated docks are there (I now removed them all from the startup scripts I think) |
| 14:00:13 | mallum | mbdock turns off sessioning |
| 14:00:27 | mallum | arg, starting mbdock with -n turns off sessioning |
| 14:01:46 | mallum | cmarqu: do you have apps automatically starting via ~/.xsession etc ? |
| 14:01:54 | cmarqu | Yeah, but onlwhile running with -n. Not when I start mbdock again with no option, right? |
| 14:04:05 | mallum | yeah, you do have dock apps in ~/.xsession ? |
| 14:05:17 | cmarqu | mallum: I used to have stuff in Xsession.d, but purged that now. It still has the stuff in its session, from before I caught it all. |
| 14:05:28 | cmarqu | (sorry, I was lagged) |
| 14:05:39 | pb_ | mallum, mccarthy: funnily enough I was thinking about predictive text at lunchtime, might see if I can implement something later in the week. |
| 14:06:05 | pb_ | nelson, what is your gpe-soundbite complaint? |
| 14:06:08 | mccarthy | pb_: jamey tells me he will fix the kernel today. I will keep you posted... |
| 14:06:30 | pb_ | mccarthy, cool |
| 14:07:08 | mallum | cmarqu: grrrrr ;) |
| 14:07:27 | mallum | pb_: did you see that google link - algorithm made some sense |
| 14:08:32 | pb_ | mallum: haven't looked at it yet, will check it out later |
| 14:09:39 | pb | crap, xchat-gnome keeps crashing when I try to cut and paste |
| 14:10:20 | pb | I can't paste into it at all, and trying to copy out gives me a gdk assertion failure and abort(). |
| 14:13:01 | cmarqu | mallum: Well, let me start again. I used to start the mini apps in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/99xCommon_Start. Now I removed these, but mbdock has alot of mini apps in its session, which I don't want. I want to start fresh. Is that possible? |
| 14:13:58 | cmarqu | Killing the mini apps with kill one by one is just very clumsy. |
| 14:14:09 | pb | cmarqu: remove .mbdock? |
| 14:14:18 | mallum | cmarqu: yeah edit .mbdock |
| 14:14:31 | mallum | cmarqu: all explained in the documentation |
| 14:14:34 | cmarqu | Ah. There we go :) |
| 14:15:41 | cmarqu | Hrrg. I was reading the FAQ part where it talks about -n and though that this was all about session stuff. Sorry. |
| 14:16:04 | mallum | thats ok :) |
| 14:16:20 | mallum | cmarqu: for punishment you have to proof read it ;) |
| 14:18:01 | cmarqu | mallum: Uh. Okay :) Once I slept I while to calm down my jet lag. :) |
| 14:18:54 | mallum | cmarqu: where have you been ? anywhere nice ? |
| 14:19:28 | cmarqu | Xsession.d/65xMenu is not needed anymore, right? |
| 14:19:56 | mallum | cmarqu: nope |
| 14:20:19 | mallum | cmarqu: I dont think that should have ever existed ... its just a nasty ion hack |
| 14:20:38 | cmarqu | mallum: Visited California, to meet old colleagues, and lots of National Parks in Nevada, Arizona and Utah too. |
| 14:22:27 | mallum | cmarqu: nice :)) |
| 14:23:02 | cmarqu | s/"message recieved"/"message received"/ :) |
| 14:47:11 | pb | hell |
| 14:47:17 | pb | lost the root password for our fileserver :-( |
| 14:47:45 | mallum | It you havn't upgraded SSH on it, then it shouldn't be a problem ;) |
| 14:48:08 | pb | heh |
| 14:52:31 | mallum | hometime :)) |
| 14:52:34 | mallum | biab |
| 15:54:43 | spung | mallum: home sweet home |
| 15:54:54 | mallum | indeed :) |
| 15:55:05 | mallum | have my new 'edge' magazine to read on the bus too |
| 15:55:35 | spung | mallum: what about ipaq and sitescooper? |
| 15:56:05 | Leeds | mmmm.... sitescooper :-) |
| 15:56:16 | mallum | spung: the ipaq would get stolen if I got it out on the bus |
| 15:56:35 | pb | mallum, you've gotta get out of that inner city ghetto |
| 15:56:46 | Leeds | I use mine on the Tube regularly... |
| 15:57:27 | mallum | Leeds: your a pretty big guy though |
| 15:57:42 | spung | hah |
| 15:57:45 | spung | i walk at night |
| 15:57:47 | spung | at 4AM |
| 15:57:50 | Leeds | true :-) |
| 15:57:52 | spung | with my ipaq |
| 15:57:54 | spung | with no fear |
| 15:57:58 | spung | i love my city |
| 15:58:05 | mallum | spung: come to Dalston and do that |
| 15:58:22 | Leeds | but I'm not a native Londoner, so I still get scared when it's only me and one other person in a carriage :-( |
| 15:58:29 | mallum | spung: they stab 12 yr olds here for mobile phones |
| 15:58:48 | spung | i love my city |
| 15:58:49 | spung | whooooo |
| 15:58:50 | spung | :) |
| 15:59:09 | mallum | spung: maybe if it was a bit tougher you'd produce better footballers ;) |
| 15:59:36 | spung | mallum: lol |
| 15:59:37 | Leeds | my sister (older than 12) had her phone nicked :-( |
| 16:00:06 | spung | Leeds: well.. we do have STUPID people tho... one guy pushed me to a pool.. so my phone was ruined |
| 16:00:58 | mallum | I also got home to discover, my ladyfriend hadn't locked the door on her way to work this morning ... tut tut |
| 16:01:12 | spung | mallum: heheh :) |
| 16:02:34 | spung | mallum: i'm going to try matchbox for the first time in a sec... prepare for some serious pestering :) |
| 16:02:47 | spung | 0.3 that is |
| 16:02:52 | spung | nelson: moray is here! |
| 16:03:02 | moray | hello people... |
| 16:03:06 | spung | nelson: but you aren't, lol |
| 16:04:15 | mallum | spung: you dont have the right to pester me, till you fullfill all you promises :) |
| 16:04:40 | mallum | spung: everythings explained in the docs anyway so make sure you read them .... |
| 16:05:54 | spung | mallum: i haven't forgot them |
| 16:40:39 | spung | mallum: i see that xstroke won't go inside the new dock... |
| 16:42:11 | mallum | spung: rtfm |
| 16:42:25 | mallum | spung: read the announce on the mailing list too |
| 16:43:41 | spung | mallum: hmm.. ok |
| 16:43:54 | spung | mallum: did you package the xstroke of yours? :P |
| 16:48:31 | spung | mallum: i removed the battery dockapp but its popup stayed there... not anything very important but.. |
| 16:49:02 | Leeds | Works For Me [TM] :-) |
| 16:49:02 | spung | mallum: the popups look nice tho :))) |
| 16:49:28 | mallum | spung: yep I know about that.. |
| 16:50:17 | spung | mallum: why isn't xkbd featured in those menus? |
| 16:51:22 | mallum | spung: cos you didn't read the announce mail ? |
| 16:51:31 | spung | mallum: minivol didn't show up either :\ |
| 16:52:01 | mallum | spung: maybe you dont have a mixer device |
| 16:52:13 | spung | hmm.. |
| 16:53:28 | spung | mallum: why didn't you package the new xkbd? |
| 16:53:31 | spung | oh wait |
| 16:54:17 | mallum | spung: I didn't know there was one |
| 16:54:31 | spung | hmm.. |
| 16:54:32 | spung | lol |
| 16:54:35 | spung | yeah.. |
| 16:54:43 | spung | do i have to restart the dock? |
| 16:55:09 | mallum | yes |
| 16:56:24 | spung | mallum: IMHO, clicking the clock again should hide the popup :) |
| 16:56:53 | mallum | spung: well the source is available ... |
| 16:57:10 | mallum | anyone with flash tell me what http://casero.com/ is ? |
| 16:57:31 | spung | mallum: flash is available :) |
| 16:57:51 | mallum | spung: what for linux powerpc ? |
| 16:58:00 | mallum | spung: come on you use windows .... |
| 17:00:09 | spung | mallum: no i don't! |
| 17:01:03 | spung | mallum: Packaged Residential Gateway Management Software for the Broadband Consumer Market |
| 17:01:55 | mallum | spung: ? |
| 17:02:06 | mallum | spung: oh ok |
| 17:02:16 | spung | gpe-calendar doesn't start |
| 17:02:17 | spung | .. |
| 17:02:20 | spung | is sad |
| 17:02:27 | spung | nothing works on my ipaq |
| 17:02:52 | mallum | thinks spung may be happier if he actually *started* contributing rather than moaning, and pestering people |
| 17:02:57 | spung | yes |
| 17:03:51 | spung | now, these are nice permissions |
| 17:03:52 | spung | d--------- 1 luis root 0 Jul 16 17:50 .gpe |
| 17:06:30 | mallum | spung: make sure you use it and Im sure they'll get fixed |
| 17:07:05 | spung | mallum: yeah, that's what i'm doing |
| 17:07:11 | mallum | ;P |
| 17:07:25 | spung | and it's portuguese.. |
| 17:07:30 | spung | :) |
| 17:12:19 | spung | omg, and the default gtk theme must be changed, it sucks! :) |
| 17:19:59 | pb_ | spung, what's the "sshh" in aid of? |
| 17:20:38 | spung | [19:12] -:- Topic (#gpe): changed by mallum: GPE: GNU Palmtop Environment | gpe.handhelds.org | bugzilla: http://europa.armlinux.org/bugzilla/ | Are all portugese kids annoying ? |
| 17:20:57 | pb_ | ah |
| 17:21:20 | spung | sees so many things broken in familiar |
| 17:21:25 | spung | starts coding :) |
| 17:21:38 | pb_ | just what I was gonna suggest. |
| 17:21:59 | spung | wants su for familiar |
| 17:22:02 | spung | is that possible? |
| 17:22:16 | pb_ | install tinylogin |
| 17:23:14 | spung | nice |
| 17:23:36 | spung | i was suprised the way appmgr updates automatically when i installed new apps |
| 17:23:54 | spung | pb_: what was that update-menus thing? |
| 17:25:27 | pb_ | what thing? |
| 17:25:41 | pb_ | oh, you mean the postinst error? |
| 17:25:44 | spung | sh-2.03# update-menus |
| 17:25:44 | spung | kill: usage: kill [-s sigspec | -n signum | -sigspec] [pid | job]... or kill -l [sigspec] |
| 17:26:10 | pb_ | gpe-appmgr's menu-methods is a bit too dumb, it tries to kill gpe-appmgr even if it isn't running. |
| 17:26:56 | spung | i don't understand what's happening so |
| 17:27:01 | spung | i'll just do a bug report |
| 17:27:07 | pb_ | ok |
| 17:27:10 | spung | with this log |
| 17:28:19 | spung | pb_: why is there no appmgr component in bugzilla? |
| 17:29:19 | pb_ | ask mibus |
| 17:29:26 | pb_ | I think he uses the hh.org bugzilla |
| 17:31:18 | spung | pb_: ok, mail sent |
| 17:31:24 | spung | checks his TODO list |
| 17:31:38 | spung | pb_: gpe-dm... why doesn't it start? |
| 17:33:05 | pb_ | spung: like I said before, I don't know, you will have to debug it yourself |
| 17:33:17 | spung | pb_: i have no idea what's happening :( |
| 17:34:00 | pb_ | well, if you wait half an hour or so I'll make another version that has a proper script rather than the binary in init.d, that might give you some clues. |
| 17:41:39 | nelson | gpe-soundbite problems. Anybody have a newer one than the one in unstable? |
| 17:45:12 | nelson | the one in unstable crashes immediately after it tries to open its window. |
| 17:45:21 | nelson | THere's no obvious reason why when I strace it. |
| 17:49:11 | pb_ | nelson: omit --auto-generate-filename as a workaround |
| 17:58:42 | pb_ | nelson: do you have esd running? |
| 17:58:53 | spung | jeez |
| 17:58:59 | spung | i run su |
| 17:59:01 | spung | and it says |
| 17:59:10 | spung | su: This applet requires root priviledges |
| 18:00:41 | pb_ | spung: u+s |
| 18:01:15 | pb_ | spung: or file a bug, or bitch about it in #familiar |
| 18:01:40 | spung | bitch bitch bitch |
| 18:02:14 | spung | mallum: matchbox bug :\ |
| 18:02:26 | mccarthy | pb_: I need to look at the rtc code a little more. It seems that it needs the app that set the alarm to actually be running (I thought it would respawn the app). |
| 18:02:32 | pb_ | ah |
| 18:02:53 | mccarthy | pb_: this is a might annoying.... |
| 18:04:08 | pb_ | :-/ |
| 18:04:12 | spung | mallum: mbcontrol -desktop not only does not show the desktop it also makes xkbd be badly positioned |
| 18:04:39 | spung | mallum: as you can see on scap |
| 18:05:41 | pb_ | nelson: I uploaded a gpe-soundbite 0.07-2 package with esd turned off again, see if that works better for you. |
| 18:06:26 | spung | mallum: and now X stoped working |
| 18:06:28 | spung | is sad :( |
| 18:08:17 | mccarthy | pb_: it *will* wake up without the app running however. It simply will not actually do anything to annoy you and make you click a button or some such.... |
| 18:08:41 | mccarthy | pb_: I will likely stop playing with it now and check it out on my incredibly long plane ride on Friday |
| 18:08:55 | pb_ | mccarthy: where are you off to? |
| 18:09:01 | mccarthy | australias |
| 18:09:04 | mccarthy | -s |
| 18:09:11 | pb_ | mccarthy: ah, visiting dc and mibus :-) |
| 18:09:13 | mallum | spung: did you implement the desktop type hint in today ? |
| 18:09:21 | spung | mallum: not yet |
| 18:09:29 | mccarthy | pb_: are dc and mibus aussie?! |
| 18:09:36 | mccarthy | pb_: do they live near sydney? |
| 18:09:42 | pb_ | mccarthy: no idea |
| 18:09:48 | mallum | spung: well then, I would say with no desktop the desktop switch is unpredictable |
| 18:09:55 | mccarthy | pb_: dc is still in Japan though, no? |
| 18:10:05 | pb_ | mccarthy: I'm not sure what nationality dc counts as, he was born in australia (and speaks with a slight oz accent) but he lives in the uk. |
| 18:10:10 | pb_ | mccarthy: no, he's in australia now. |
| 18:10:11 | spung | mallum: and why isn't X working now? |
| 18:10:14 | spung | :(((( |
| 18:10:28 | | dc was last seen on #handhelds.org 36 days, 21 hours, 52 minutes and 48 seconds ago, saying: still have to catch up on some C. [Sun Jun 9 21:17:40 2002] |
| 18:10:28 | mccarthy | ibot seen dc |
| 18:10:29 | spung | mallum: after this i can't click anything... nothing works |
| 18:10:38 | pb_ | mccarthy: he was only in japan for a couple of days, en route from england to aus. |
| 18:10:40 | | dc_ was last seen on #gpe 20 hours, 1 minutes and 9 seconds ago, saying: hehe [Mon Jul 15 23:09:31 2002] |
| 18:10:40 | spung | ibot seen dc_ |
| 18:10:41 | mallum | spung: I did not wright X |
| 18:11:14 | spung | i have to go do something else |
| 18:11:14 | mccarthy | i will have to send him email then; is he old enough to join me for a beer? |
| 18:11:18 | spung | i'm stressed |
| 18:11:24 | spung | mccarthy: no :P |
| 18:11:29 | pb_ | mccarthy: not unless the drinking age is much lower in australia :-} |
| 18:11:33 | pb_ | mccarthy: he's 15 |
| 18:11:41 | mccarthy | dc is 15?! wow |
| 18:11:54 | nelson | pb_: checking.... |
| 18:11:59 | spung | mccarthy: he was 14 last year :P |
| 18:12:00 | nelson | mccarthy: you never knew that? |
| 18:12:17 | mccarthy | well, I guess he could have a milkshake while *I* have a beer :) |
| 18:12:17 | spung | familiar is soooooo broken :) |
| 18:12:27 | mallum | mccarthy: yeah and Im 18 and female |
| 18:12:29 | mccarthy | nelson: I knew he was young, just not *that* young |
| 18:12:29 | spung | oh well.. i AM running unstable... but still |
| 18:12:44 | mccarthy | mallum: OK matthew |
| 18:12:46 | nelson | mccarthy: I'd like to figure out how to talk to his parents without letting him know, to tell them that he's pretty impressive. |
| 18:13:13 | mccarthy | nelson: maybe *they* can meet me for a beer :) |
| 18:13:15 | mallum | nelson: I expect they probably know |
| 18:14:17 | spung | yeah... they hit him.. like "damn kid... you think you're so smart, clean the floor, make the beds, code for GPE.. hah" |
| 18:15:01 | nelson | pb_: well, it doesn't crash now, but it doesn't playback correctly. Sounds like only the first bit of each chunk of voice is being played. |
| 18:15:18 | pb_ | nelson: this is the 0.07-2 package? |
| 18:15:41 | nelson | pb_: like it's split up into blocks, and only the first 20% is being played. |
| 18:15:52 | nelson | pb_: yes, just update/upgraded 2 mins ago. |
| 18:15:56 | pb_ | hmm |
| 18:16:26 | pb_ | weird, does strace give any clue what might be wrong? |
| 18:17:13 | spung | spung[meditating] |
| 18:18:15 | nelson | pb_: the non-esd version works fine. and yes, esd was running. |
| 18:19:15 | pb_ | nelson: weird, 0.07-2 shouldn't have had any esd support in at all. |
| 18:19:37 | pb_ | nelson: or is that what you mean by the non-esd version? |
| 18:19:40 | nelson | pb_: no, strace gave no clue. |
| 18:19:57 | nelson | pb_: yes, that's what I mean by the non-esd version, 0.07-2 |
| 18:20:02 | pb_ | ah ok |
| 18:20:11 | nelson | pb_: I still have the strace on my scroll-back if you want to see it. |
| 18:20:15 | pb_ | yeah, it looks like the esd code isn't ready for prime-time yet |
| 18:20:37 | pb_ | nelson: no, don't worry about it, I'll try to debug the esd support some other time. |
| 18:20:47 | pb_ | nelson: it was only turned on by mistake in the previous package anyway. |
| 18:21:12 | nelson | pb_: ahhhhh. Okay, so now how do I figure out where the voice is getting chopped up? |
| 18:21:31 | nelson | pb_: can I send you the voice file so you can play it back? |
| 18:21:38 | pb_ | nelson: sure |
| 18:21:49 | pb_ | nelson: dcc is ok, or email: pb@nexus.co.uk |
| 18:22:35 | moray | pb_/nelson: I'll probably get back to GPE stuff tomorrow, btw - still sorting stuff out after getting back to the UK |
| 18:22:54 | pb_ | spung, gpe-dm_0.13-1 might be in unstable now if you wanna try it |
| 18:22:56 | pb_ | moray: cool |
| 18:23:34 | nelson | pb_: You've Got Mail! |
| 18:23:51 | mallum | Hmm, I've compressed the dictonary down by approx 25% |
| 18:24:35 | nelson | moray: cool, thanks for finally writing gpe_soundbite. We've needed this for SO LONG now! |
| 18:24:36 | mallum | then gzipping it, increases it to 75% |
| 18:24:45 | pb_ | nelson: hmm, yeah, I see |
| 18:25:05 | nelson | moray: I want to use it in pygps to let people record a georeferenced message, and then when they get back to that location, play it back to them. :) |
| 18:25:20 | nelson | pb_: is the voice damaged for you also? |
| 18:25:23 | pb_ | nelson: yes |
| 18:25:46 | pb_ | nelson: sounds like a buffer overflow kind of problem |
| 18:26:11 | pb_ | nelson: oh, what libgsm are you using? |
| 18:26:19 | nelson | pb_: well, actually underflow. Sounds like it's only writing out a portion of the data. |
| 18:26:19 | moray | nelson: yes, I definitely think that gpe-soundbite (and other similar apps) should be integrated into appropriate places rather than just left as standalone programs the user has to know about |
| 18:26:28 | pb_ | nelson: there have been a few dubious versions floating around that were compiled with hardware floating point |
| 18:26:55 | nelson | libgsm1_1.0.10-11gpe1_arm.ipk |
| 18:27:09 | pb_ | nelson: I think that one should be okay, let me check though |
| 18:27:42 | nelson | moray: well, how's this as a suggestion, then: ask gpsd for the current coordinates and store them in the .gsm file. |
| 18:28:13 | pb_ | nelson: yeah, no floating point in that library that I can see |
| 18:28:57 | nelson | moray: it's pretty low-tech. Open port 2947 on localhost, and send it p\n. You'll get back latitude and longitude in ASCII, newline-terminated. |
| 18:29:17 | nelson | moray: or is the .gsm file a standard file format? |
| 18:29:39 | pb_ | nelson: .gsm is standard-ish, it's just a raw stream of GSM frames |
| 18:29:58 | moray | nelson: interesting - we probably want a general system for that kind of thing - I was already advocating some kind of registry of interesting files (to be displayed by gpe-appmgr or whatever); maybe that should (be able to) hold the location when the file was created as well as the date etc. |
| 18:30:00 | nelson | pb_: hmmm.... are they numbered? |
| 18:30:10 | pb_ | nelson: don't think so |
| 18:31:11 | nelson | moray: files need more meta-data storage than vanilla Unix gives us!! |
| 18:32:29 | nelson | pb_: does this gpe-soundbite have any debugging options I could turn on? |
| 18:32:39 | pb_ | nelson: no. |
| 18:32:59 | pb_ | nelson: it looks almost as if you are running out of cpu bandwidth, though I didn't think the gsm codec was that intensive. |
| 18:34:15 | pb_ | nelson: what device are you saving your .gsm files on, ramdisk? |
| 18:35:20 | nelson | pb_: ha! that's it! |
| 18:35:35 | nelson | pb_: can't write 'em to flash! |
| 18:35:51 | moray | ah |
| 18:35:54 | pb_ | ah |
| 18:35:54 | nelson | It worked just fine when I wrote them to /tmp! |
| 18:35:59 | nelson | ah |
| 18:36:02 | nelson | (it's catching) |
| 18:36:20 | pb_ | nelson: right, yeah, jffs2 can have monstrous write latencies |
| 18:36:24 | moray | I've mostly been using a test user account which had its $HOME somewhere in /tmp until we sort out a proper answer |
| 18:36:44 | spung | pb_: it still doesn't work |
| 18:36:57 | pb_ | spung: does it print "Starting GPE display manager"? |
| 18:37:01 | nelson | Okay, so, ... the next obvious question. How do I tell soundbite to listen to the record button, and automagically exit when it's released? |
| 18:37:12 | pb_ | spung: you are actually _in_ runlevel 2, right? |
| 18:37:45 | nelson | I can use a button launcher to make it start, and a shell script wrapper to give it a filename, but how do I make it stop when they release the button? |
| 18:37:50 | spung | INIT: Entering runlevel: 2 |
| 18:37:50 | spung | Configuring network interfaces: done. |
| 18:37:50 | spung | Starting OpenBSD Secure Shell server: sshd. |
| 18:37:50 | spung | familiar login: |
| 18:37:51 | spung | pb_ |
| 18:38:01 | pb_ | hmm |
| 18:38:25 | nelson | I could trap the button release inside pygps, but then I'd have to figure out how to send a synthetic event to soundbite. |
| 18:39:04 | nelson | Oh, silly me! |
| 18:39:12 | nelson | It already listens to that key! |
| 18:39:16 | nelson | W00t w00t!!! |
| 18:39:47 | pb_ | spung: if you run /etc/rc2.d/S99gpe-dm by hand, does it start then? |
| 18:40:05 | moray | nelson: yes, as long as the key release event gets through things work fine (as with keylaunch in GPE; standard keylaunch on the other hand just swallows the keypresses) |
| 18:40:44 | spung | pb_: yes... |
| 18:40:59 | spung | pb_: and gpe-dm/gpe-login don't save xcalibrate settings :(( |
| 18:41:05 | nelson | moray: excellent work, simply excellent! |
| 18:42:43 | pb_ | spung: well, dunno then, you need to figure out what init is up to. |
| 18:42:55 | mallum | pb_: currentTime in xlib was just 0, in header right ? |
| 18:43:04 | pb_ | mallum: yes |
| 18:43:08 | spung | pb_: but, does it work for you? |
| 18:43:11 | mallum | pb_: damn :( |
| 18:43:19 | pb_ | spung: dunno, haven't tried it |
| 18:43:20 | mallum | pb_: cant figure out how to get the real currenttime |
| 18:43:23 | spung | pb_: lol |
| 18:43:27 | spung | LLLLLOOOOOLLLLLLL |
| 18:43:34 | spung | oh well |
| 18:43:44 | spung | i gotta go eat something :) |
| 18:43:46 | spung | cya [] |
| 18:43:57 | pb_ | bye |
| 18:44:00 | mallum | BYE |
| 18:44:05 | spung | mallum: BYE |
| 18:44:15 | mallum | BYE BYE BYE |
| 18:44:27 | mallum | :) |
| 18:44:57 | mallum | pb_: Im sure I've seen a function somewhere to do it .... |
| 18:46:40 | pb_ | mallum: hmm, apropos doesn't suggest anything much. |
| 18:47:11 | pb_ | mallum: what do you want the time for, by the way? |
| 18:48:36 | mallum | pb_: to pop up that dock menu |
| 18:48:59 | pb_ | ah |
| 18:49:23 | mallum | I can do it with norm time() |
| 18:49:27 | mallum | normal |
| 18:49:43 | pb_ | probably easiest |
| 18:50:48 | mallum | Im sure I've seen it done in some source before |
| 18:52:12 | mallum | Wasn't a standard xlib function - theres a clever way of doing it |
| 18:58:47 | pb_ | ah |
| 19:00:08 | mallum | pb_: how do I get the time in milliseconds ? |
| 19:01:25 | mallum | pb_: gettimeofday ? |
| 19:02:24 | pb_ | yup |
| 19:02:46 | mallum | pb_: ewe timezones :( |
| 19:03:13 | pb_ | mallum: ignore the timezone stuff |
| 19:05:29 | mallum | pb_: I can just pass a NULL to that ? |
| 19:06:13 | pb_ | yup |
| 19:09:47 | mallum | how many microseconds in a millisecond - 100 ? |
| 19:09:52 | pb_ | 1000 |
| 19:10:35 | mallum | ta very much ;) |
| 19:14:04 | mallum | cool, menu now comes up automatically' |
| 19:14:37 | pb_ | yay |
| 19:15:46 | mallum | pb_: now it only come up after the timeout ? |
| 19:16:18 | pb_ | mallum: sounds good to me |
| 19:17:30 | mallum | pb_: are you gonna go to the linux expo in october BTW ? |
| 19:18:04 | pb_ | dunno, I hadn't heard anything about it |
| 19:18:07 | pb_ | do you have a link? |
| 19:19:25 | mallum | http://www.linuxexpouk.co.uk/Index.htm |
| 19:21:21 | pb_ | oh yeah, the thing at olympia |
| 19:21:32 | mallum | yeah |
| 19:21:38 | pb_ | yeah, I might go along to it |
| 19:21:47 | mallum | hopefully dc will be back then |
| 19:22:05 | mallum | and a few of us can meet up ( moray? ) |
| 19:22:36 | pb_ | yeah |
| 19:23:01 | spung | mallum: why do i always get 2 mmenus? :P |
| 19:23:03 | pb_ | the exhibition itself isn't usually all that exciting, but it's as good a place as any to meet people. There's usually a debian presence of some kind at that show. |
| 19:24:14 | mallum | spung: becuase you havn't read the announce email ? |
| 19:24:23 | spung | hmmm... |
| 19:24:24 | spung | lol |
| 19:24:47 | mallum | pb_: yeah I went along last year. didn;t really see much that exciting but I got to meet alot of people ( Leeds for example ) |
| 19:25:28 | mallum | pb_: I was speaking to a debian arm guy on the debian stand. He had a Lart and some wierd acorn pc's |
| 19:26:40 | pb_ | mallum: wookey? |
| 19:27:14 | mallum | pb_: dont think it was wookey - wasn't that hairy |
| 19:27:29 | pb_ | heh |
| 19:27:47 | pb_ | oh well, can't think who else it would have been offhand |
| 19:28:21 | mallum | I bought a debian T-shirt there for sid |
| 19:28:32 | mallum | sid has an amazinbg collection of geek t-shirts |
| 19:28:41 | pb_ | :-) |
| 19:28:59 | mallum | spung: did you figure it out ? |
| 19:29:20 | mallum | pb_: just applied the geometry patch BTW |
| 19:29:26 | pb_ | cool, thanks |
| 19:31:50 | mallum | no, thank you :) |
| 19:45:08 | mallum | pb_: woohoo, matchbox frees up more memory now :) |
| 19:46:29 | pb_ | cool, what did you do? |
| 19:47:26 | mallum | pb_: all the memory allocation in the xml parser was crappy |
| 19:47:47 | pb_ | aha |
| 19:48:01 | mallum | pb_: such as the realloc problem ( thanks ) and some other bits |
| 19:48:19 | mallum | pb_: its now all safely freed with no segfualt :) |
| 19:48:37 | mallum | pb_: plus I glad I sorted all that out, cos it was quite manky |
| 19:49:21 | pb_ | cool |
| 19:49:49 | mallum | 0.3.1 v.soon |
| 19:50:33 | pb_ | did you figure out how to do the debian alternatives stuff? |
| 19:50:43 | mallum | no, Im gonna do that now |
| 19:50:54 | mallum | I'll just look at an existing package I guess |
| 19:51:03 | moray | mallum: I went along to Linux Expo one day last year; got bored after 5 minutes then invaded the Debian booth and answered people's questions/showed off my Sony Picturebook running Debian (with gratuitous built-in camera) |
| 19:52:44 | mallum | moray: sid has one of them |
| 19:53:02 | mallum | moray: used to be mine till I gave it to her |
| 19:53:10 | mallum | pb_: add_wm_entry () |
| 19:53:10 | mallum | { |
| 19:53:11 | mallum | update-alternatives --install /usr/bin/x-window-manager x-window-manager $WMentry 50 \ |
| 19:53:11 | mallum | --slave /usr/share/man/man1/x-window-manager.1.gz x-window-manager.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/blackbox.1.gz |
| 19:53:11 | mallum | } |
| 19:53:33 | pb_ | hmm, right |
| 19:53:47 | mallum | in postinst |
| 19:54:45 | mallum | pb_: though theres this too, just above; |
| 19:54:47 | mallum | if [ "$2" ] && dpkg --compare-versions $2 le 0.51.3-12; then |
| 19:54:47 | mallum | update-alternatives --remove x-window-manager /etc/X11/window-managers |
| 19:54:47 | mallum | fi |
| 19:55:08 | pb_ | erk |
| 19:55:27 | mallum | pb_: do you know what $2 is passed to a postinst script ? |
| 19:55:34 | pb_ | well, that looks like some kind of old compatibility cruft, probably best ignored |
| 19:55:51 | mallum | yeah |
| 19:55:52 | moray | mallum: I think it was Linux Expo that my Acorn Risc PC visited in 2000, but I wasn't there with it... |
| 19:56:27 | pb_ | mallum: no, not offhand |
| 19:56:41 | mallum | pb_: ok I'll ignore that for now |
| 19:57:02 | pb_ | mallum: ah, $2 is "most recently configured version" |
| 19:57:21 | pb_ | mallum: google for "dpkg programmers manual" |
| 19:58:41 | mallum | pb_: looks like its just there for a really old version - maybe a buggy old package ? |
| 19:59:31 | pb_ | mallum: looks that way |
| 19:59:42 | pb_ | mallum: surprised postinst arguments weren't part of your T&S exam :-) |
| 20:10:44 | mallum | pb_: havn't done that yet ... ;) |
| 20:14:27 | mallum | pb_: arg theres a dh_installwm ! |
| 20:28:16 | pb_ | ! |
| 20:31:53 | moray | (well, I've signed up for a Linux Expo thing, since getting sent something will remind me of its existence) |
| 20:34:27 | mallum | moray: where abouts in the UK are you ? |
| 20:36:55 | pb_ | good idea, I've registered too now. |
| 20:38:54 | moray | mallum: in Edinburgh at present; probably (back) in Cambridge from October |
| 20:42:17 | moray | (was in London last night, and will be down again before long though) |
| 20:53:56 | mallum | moray: ok, well give me a shout next time your in london and we'll do beerage |
| 20:55:30 | moray | mallum: sounds good :) |
| 20:56:15 | pb_ | let me know when you do, I can make a trip down to the big city as well :-) |
| 20:56:30 | moray | (hm, if I need to get something done for tomorrow afternoon, should I start it now or go to bed and get up earlyish...?) |
| 20:56:51 | moray | I'm expecting to be down in London some time near the end of the month I think |
| 20:57:14 | moray | though I don't know how the weeks/dates fall to know exactly when it's likely to be |
| 21:06:55 | spung | pb_: about gpe-session-scripts |
| 21:07:26 | spung | pb_: if matchbox does its own session managment for dockaps |
| 21:08:00 | spung | pb_: 90xXkbd 65xstroke 65xMenu .. shouldn't be there should they? |
| 21:08:10 | pb_ | probably not |
| 21:08:28 | pb_ | the new matchbox has turned my world upside down :-) |
| 21:08:32 | spung | pb_: don't tell me to do it :) i can't :) |
| 21:08:41 | pb_ | why not? |
| 21:09:09 | spung | pb_: i do not have: 1- CVS access 2- access to the familiar feed ;) |
| 21:09:16 | pb_ | ah |
| 21:09:25 | pb_ | well, fair point I suppose |
| 21:13:26 | spung | pb_: one question |
| 21:13:30 | pb_ | sure |
| 21:13:31 | spung | what's the point of unclutter? |
| 21:13:55 | pb_ | to hide the annoying pointer I guess |
| 21:14:09 | spung | but, it hides it when you're not using it |
| 21:14:18 | pb_ | yeah |
| 21:14:23 | spung | it's annoying when yoou're using it! :) |
| 21:14:30 | moray | spung: it's designed for desktop use - you want the pointer to go away while you're typing etc. |
| 21:14:38 | spung | moray: yeah... that's what i tought |
| 21:14:56 | pb_ | spung: yes, that's why you should use libgpewidget to hide the pointer on your ipaq |
| 21:15:28 | pb_ | spung: (or equivalent technology, if you're a hardcore xlib h4x0r or whatever) |
| 21:15:59 | mallum | pb. moray: I have to poke jg to remove them startup scripts from tinyx |
| 21:16:06 | pb_ | mallum: yes, please do |
| 21:16:24 | mallum | pb_: the xkbd one should stay mind you ( does the xmodmap fix ) |
| 21:16:36 | mallum | pb_: but the menu and xstroke ones should |
| 21:16:37 | mallum | go |
| 21:16:48 | spung | pb_: ideally we'd have some xset option to disable the pointer icon.. don't you agree? |
| 21:16:58 | pb_ | mallum: well, even the xkbd one probably doesn't belong in the tinyx package itself |
| 21:17:02 | mallum | pb_: especially now were treating the ipaq as multi user now |
| 21:17:06 | pb_ | mallum: if anything, xkbd should be providing that itself |
| 21:17:11 | mallum | pb_: I think its part of xkbs package |
| 21:17:13 | pb_ | spung: yeah |
| 21:17:18 | mallum | pb_: IIRC |
| 21:17:27 | pb_ | mallum: oh right |
| 21:17:30 | mallum | pb_: if its not I agree 100 % |
| 21:17:34 | moray | pb_: yes, though presumably we ought to go the same way with the gpe startup scripts too (have them in appropriate packages)# |
| 21:17:47 | pb_ | moray: indeed |
| 21:17:48 | mallum | pb_: menu and xstroke are however |
| 21:18:49 | moray | presumably we only have separate GPE startup stuff because the stuff in main Familiar isn't general enough? |
| 21:19:00 | pb_ | moray: yeah, pretty much |
| 21:19:08 | moray | or, equivalently, some of the startup stuff in the Familiar X packages should be split out |
| 21:19:48 | pb_ | agreed |
| 21:20:06 | pb_ | ah, I see gpe-session-scripts is actually shipping Xinit.d/90xXkbd, that's a bit embarrassing |
| 21:22:13 | ircleuser | hey |
| 21:22:19 | pb_ | I don't even exactly remember the reason why we ended up with a separate /etc/X11/Xsession-gpe.d rather than using the familiar Xsession.d; presumably the latter included some unwanted crud that was difficult to get rid of, but I don't know what exactly it would have been. |
| 21:22:33 | macmallum | hey again |
| 21:22:56 | pb_ | hey |
| 21:23:15 | macmallum | we need to grab to grab jg and ask him ( or let us ) fix the X package |
| 21:23:39 | pb_ | indeed |
| 21:23:52 | pb_ | jg has proven elusive over the last few days however |
| 21:24:26 | mallum | alternatively we could just change the package and mail him a patch and reasoning |
| 21:24:55 | pb_ | yeah |
| 21:26:28 | pb_ | lemme have a look at the tinyx package, see what's actually in it. |
| 21:26:44 | macmallum | cool, sounds good |
| 21:28:06 | pb_ | okay, not all that much is the answer |
| 21:28:27 | pb_ | it ships an empty /usr/share/doc/xserver-tiny-h3600 directory, which is a bit dumb but hardly a cardinal sin |
| 21:28:34 | pb_ | and then... |
| 21:28:41 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/65xstroke |
| 21:28:41 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/50xWindow-Manager |
| 21:28:42 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/30xTs_Calibrate |
| 21:28:42 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/60xXDefaults |
| 21:28:42 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/55xScreenSaver |
| 21:28:42 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/65xMenu |
| 21:28:44 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/20xBacklight |
| 21:28:46 | pb_ | ./etc/X11/Xsession.d/99xCommon_Start |
| 21:28:49 | pb_ | ./etc/rc2.d/ |
| 21:28:50 | pb_ | ./etc/rc2.d/S99x |
| 21:28:52 | pb_ | ./etc/init.d/ |
| 21:28:54 | pb_ | ./etc/init.d/x |
| 21:28:56 | pb_ | ./etc/init.d/x~ |
| 21:28:59 | pb_ | ./usr/X11R6/bin/Xipaq |
| 21:29:13 | pb_ | I tend to feel that only the last file really belongs in that package :-) |
| 21:29:28 | spung | heh |
| 21:29:47 | spung | seriously tho, am I the only one to experience Xipaq lockups? :\ |
| 21:29:57 | pb_ | I haven't had any problems like that. |
| 21:30:09 | moray | spung: lockups when you do what? |
| 21:30:16 | macmallum | spung: would a4ppear so |
| 21:30:26 | macmallum | 4oops |
| 21:30:28 | macmallum | arg |
| 21:30:37 | spung | :\ |
| 21:30:43 | mallum | back to normal now |
| 21:30:51 | spung | moray: i don't know... they seem to be random |
| 21:31:06 | spung | moray: i had one recently after a mbcontrol -desktop |
| 21:31:10 | mallum | spung: if you do loads of rotations real fast it'll crash |
| 21:31:23 | spung | i usually get them when playing scummvm |
| 21:31:26 | mallum | spung: dont run that without a desktop |
| 21:31:27 | spung | mallum: not really |
| 21:31:33 | spung | mallum: ok |
| 21:31:48 | spung | anyway... they happen from time to time.. :\ |
| 21:31:57 | spung | i don't know how to reproduce them :\ |
| 21:32:04 | mallum | spung: we'll test that and get that working real nice when _you_ fix up gpe-today ;) |
| 21:32:30 | spung | mallum: :] |
| 21:34:01 | pb_ | I'm not quite sure what to do about the /etc/init.d/x vs /etc/init.d/gpe-dm business, any ideas? |
| 21:34:27 | pb_ | my original thought was to make an x-session-singleuser package that basically just installed /etc/init.d/x and its rc2.d symlink, and conflicted with gpe-dm |
| 21:35:01 | mallum | pb_: that sounds good |
| 21:35:23 | pb_ | I'm glad you think that. |
| 21:35:41 | pb_ | although I called it my "original" thought just then, a more accurate description would probably be my "only" thought. |
| 21:35:41 | mallum | pb_: or maybe change /etc/init.d/x to check for a x-display-manager and execute that instead of bog standard x ? |
| 21:35:55 | pb_ | mmm, that's an idea |
| 21:36:27 | moray | that one might break fewer things on upgrades too, actually |
| 21:36:39 | mallum | pb_: of course on usual X, only xdm ends up in init.d |
| 21:36:45 | pb_ | also: gpe-session-scripts currently ships /etc/X11/Xserver, which really ought to be in the tinyx package. |
| 21:37:18 | mallum | pb_: it also may be worth do a port of the debian startup scripts |
| 21:37:58 | pb_ | yeah, maybe |
| 21:38:48 | pb_ | it's not completely clear to me what real benefit we'd get from using the debian scripts. |
| 21:39:18 | pb_ | I suppose they probably support things like multiple session types, which might be nice to have. |
| 21:39:48 | mallum | pb_: yeah they do that, they seem to do alot of failsafe stuff |
| 21:39:58 | mallum | pb_: though they are pretty complicated |
| 21:40:12 | pb_ | yeah, it was the "complicated" bit that was giving me pause. |
| 21:40:29 | mallum | pb_: yeah understood |
| 21:40:47 | mallum | pb_: should definetly grok them though |
| 21:40:52 | pb_ | yup |
| 21:41:03 | pb_ | I'll make that my mission. |
| 21:41:18 | mallum | cool :) |
| 21:41:28 | mallum | I'll be happy to help out too |
| 21:41:52 | pb_ | excellent |
| 21:42:27 | cmarqu | mallum: How do you want fixes for the mb docs? diffs for the HTML pages? |
| 21:42:34 | mallum | I want to get mol booting linux, so I can build a familiar like disro and play |
| 21:42:52 | mallum | cmarqu: better if you grab matchbox cvs and diff against doc/manual.sgml |
| 21:43:19 | mallum | cmarqu: but either way would be greatly appreciated :)) |
| 21:43:20 | pb_ | vis-a-vis the X server, I think the most important thing is to get the xserver-tinyx package containing nothing but the server itself (and maybe the /etc/X11/Xserver script, which is effectively what we ought to be installing as /usr/bin/X). Once the server is decoupled from the session stuff it should be much easier to sort out the latter. |
| 21:43:51 | mallum | pb_: agreed, with a new xserver-common package or something ? |
| 21:44:00 | pb_ | maybe, what would you put in there? |
| 21:44:03 | mallum | pb_: that makes things more portable to other devices too |
| 21:44:21 | pb_ | I don't think we really have any common X server files right at the minute. |
| 21:44:36 | moray | I was wondering about a -common, but then ATM we seem to be proposing splitting stuff off because we think it *shouldn't* be common... |
| 21:44:40 | cmarqu | mallum: Ok. |
| 21:45:46 | mallum | pb_: your right, Id assumed that help the xsession scripts , but its looks like mainly docs |
| 21:47:04 | pb_ | mallum: yeah. I think Debian puts the /usr/bin/X wrapper in xserver-common, but that doesn't seem necessary for familiar: people should be able to just install the right X server straight off. |
| 21:47:18 | mallum | pb_: sure |
| 21:47:32 | mallum | Id better head to bed |
| 21:47:44 | mallum | have to get up earlier now I have work :( |
| 21:48:01 | pb_ | yeah, me too in fact |
| 21:48:01 | mallum | g'night all |
| 21:48:04 | pb_ | night |