| 00:20.44 | *** join/#gllug macooo (n=veeragan@host-87-74-40-111.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 00:20.56 | macooo | hi all |
| 00:21.21 | wethrin | ahoy |
| 00:22.02 | secretlondon | hi macooo |
| 00:22.19 | macooo | hi secretlondon |
| 00:22.23 | macooo | how is ur day |
| 00:22.46 | secretlondon | i was up all night so my day hasn't been very long so far |
| 00:23.12 | macooo | working on some project |
| 00:23.39 | secretlondon | well i was doing ubuntu bug triage and drinking cheap lager (it helps ;) |
| 00:23.53 | secretlondon | i'm going to play with packaging tonight |
| 00:24.33 | secretlondon | i'm sick of "firefox crashed when i picked my nose" bugs |
| 00:25.06 | macooo | hmmm interesting |
| 00:25.43 | wethrin | secretlondon: No, cheap lager doesn't help |
| 00:25.50 | wethrin | I hada very tasty Innis & Gunn |
| 00:25.59 | secretlondon | nice beer would help more |
| 00:26.06 | wethrin | Exactly |
| 00:26.22 | z00dax | hello all you nutters |
| 00:26.27 | secretlondon | i need to import it into camberwell |
| 00:26.33 | secretlondon | hi z00dax |
| 00:26.40 | z00dax | secretlondon: i need a place to live, closer to work . |
| 00:27.03 | secretlondon | z00dax: I only have a one bed flat I'm afriad |
| 00:35.01 | z00dax | secretlondon: where do you put the computers ? |
| 00:35.15 | secretlondon | front room (it's not a bed sit) |
| 00:35.24 | secretlondon | my living room is my domestic lab |
| 00:35.32 | z00dax | :( |
| 00:36.00 | z00dax | maybe i should move some of them to the living room to |
| 00:36.06 | z00dax | s/m to/m too/ |
| 00:36.17 | secretlondon | se5 is cheap though and near the tube. we do have hacker friendly 24 hour shops though |
| 00:36.51 | macooo | where do u live secret london |
| 00:36.56 | secretlondon | camberwell |
| 00:37.06 | macooo | which tube is near |
| 00:37.08 | secretlondon | zone 2, and cheap as it's south of the river |
| 00:37.16 | secretlondon | oval, and elephant and castle |
| 00:37.21 | macooo | i live in harrow |
| 00:37.45 | macooo | i hope i live in zone 2 |
| 00:37.51 | macooo | my uni is zone 2 |
| 00:38.04 | wethrin | Harrow is about Zone 4 |
| 00:38.09 | secretlondon | macooo: which one do you go to? |
| 00:38.25 | macooo | london met |
| 00:38.31 | macooo | hollaway road |
| 00:38.42 | secretlondon | ah - ex university of north london |
| 00:38.45 | *** join/#gllug Erwin (n=erwin@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/Erwin) |
| 00:38.57 | macooo | yes |
| 00:39.16 | z00dax | wethrin: i had some strongbow today... |
| 00:39.21 | wethrin | Ew |
| 00:39.28 | z00dax | could / would / should have had some whisky instead |
| 00:39.38 | wethrin | Yes. Yes you should. |
| 00:39.43 | z00dax | secretlondon: which part of town is that ? |
| 00:39.59 | z00dax | specially the ones that start with 'blackheath' |
| 00:40.09 | secretlondon | z00dax: i'm se5, blackhealth, and dulwich are a tad posh for me |
| 00:40.40 | secretlondon | we're poor and multicultural with fabulous public transport |
| 00:40.42 | z00dax | secretlondon: yes, i know that feeling, hence why live out in the sticks, as hali put it |
| 00:40.59 | secretlondon | z00dax: oval |
| 00:41.10 | z00dax | is that inside or outside the CC zone ? |
| 00:41.13 | secretlondon | se5=camberwell, but oval will do as a location |
| 00:41.16 | secretlondon | outside (just) |
| 00:41.32 | z00dax | i've dont 18k miles on it so far, this year |
| 00:41.38 | z00dax | i know camberwell... |
| 00:43.19 | *** join/#gllug gadgerama (n=gadgeram@5ac21513.bb.sky.com) |
| 00:58.08 | z00dax | secretlondon: any idea what the prices are like for a half decent 2 bed flat to rent in that area ? |
| 01:01.53 | *** join/#gllug secretlondon (n=secretlo@wikipedia/secretlondon) |
| 01:03.45 | *** join/#gllug gadgerama (n=gadgeram@5ac21513.bb.sky.com) |
| 01:04.11 | gadgerama | test |
| 01:05.28 | secretlondon | fail |
| 01:05.30 | gadgerama | bored. thought i'd see who's awake. |
| 01:05.41 | secretlondon | my wifi died and i had to reboot |
| 01:06.13 | gadgerama | hah. haven't got wifi going yet ... |
| 01:06.49 | secretlondon | the zd1211 may be sucky, but the zd1211rw driver is worse |
| 01:07.12 | z00dax | secretlondon: any idea what the prices are like for a half decent 2 bed flat to rent in that area ? |
| 01:07.15 | macooo | any mac users |
| 01:07.21 | z00dax | macooo: sure, me! |
| 01:07.28 | macooo | good |
| 01:07.30 | secretlondon | z00dax: not a clue, i'm a housing association tenant |
| 01:07.34 | macooo | what is this ilife |
| 01:07.59 | macooo | iweb is like web publishing |
| 01:08.02 | macooo | and it is not free |
| 01:08.02 | z00dax | macooo: google knows, i run linux on all my macs. runs really quick and actually uses the h/w capabilities |
| 01:08.14 | macooo | u mean g4 |
| 01:08.17 | z00dax | secretlondon: righto, will look when i am not as much browser challenged as now |
| 01:08.25 | macooo | i got a mactel |
| 01:08.33 | z00dax | macooo: and the dualcore dual g5 |
| 01:09.01 | macooo | u got g4 powerbook |
| 01:09.06 | z00dax | macooo: I'd race your mactel with osx, against my g5 with linux :) |
| 01:09.20 | z00dax | dont have powerbooks :( both my mac's are powermac's |
| 01:09.33 | macooo | i got this mac book pro |
| 01:09.36 | macooo | 2.16ghz |
| 01:09.44 | macooo | and got on student discount |
| 01:09.54 | macooo | 3 years apple care for 1500 |
| 01:09.57 | z00dax | nice. now go install linux on it |
| 01:10.07 | macooo | actually 1699+230 |
| 01:10.30 | macooo | but i dodnt use my apple developer discount |
| 01:10.54 | macooo | i am going to use when they come up with quad core,blue ray mac books |
| 01:10.58 | macooo | :) |
| 01:13.55 | z00dax | thats actually quite a lot of money for a portable |
| 01:14.04 | z00dax | you could've got yourself a nice Clevo for that much |
| 01:14.30 | z00dax | kinda like a AMD4800+ with 400 gigs of harddrive space, a 17"display and lightscribe dvd-rw |
| 01:14.34 | z00dax | and its a laptop too |
| 01:15.18 | *** join/#gllug gadgerama (n=gadgeram@5ac21513.bb.sky.com) |
| 01:20.20 | z00dax | zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz time |
| 01:25.15 | macooo | i know |
| 01:25.23 | macooo | it is expensive |
| 01:25.45 | macooo | but mbna is giving student loans as well which i cannot resist |
| 01:25.49 | macooo | 50£ per month |
| 01:25.56 | macooo | not bad at 14.9 apr |
| 01:26.10 | macooo | may be less i assume |
| 01:26.15 | secretlondon | macoo: better than id' get as an fe student - we don't count |
| 01:26.30 | macooo | fe? |
| 01:26.51 | secretlondon | adult education (fe=further education) |
| 01:26.51 | macooo | futher education u mean |
| 01:27.12 | secretlondon | it's generally written fe (compare to he = higher ed) |
| 01:27.14 | macooo | know they got the core duo2 with 2 gig ram and 160 gb |
| 01:27.20 | macooo | for same price |
| 01:27.58 | macooo | for fe u will get good discount comapred to just education discount |
| 01:28.21 | macooo | for fe they give without vat |
| 01:28.28 | macooo | u save 17.5 |
| 01:29.21 | macooo | u guys heard about bitspyder |
| 01:29.25 | macooo | or bitme |
| 01:29.38 | secretlondon | macoo: we don't get loans etc. I can't afford anything.. |
| 01:29.55 | macooo | this is my first loan tough |
| 01:30.06 | macooo | i used to get refused when ever i applied |
| 01:30.28 | macooo | i think my credit score is increasing a little bit |
| 01:30.32 | macooo | :) |
| 02:06.34 | Leeds | foo |
| 02:12.52 | secretlondon | boo |
| 02:15.07 | macooo | where do u work secret london |
| 02:17.01 | secretlondon | i'm an employed fe student |
| 02:17.16 | secretlondon | unemployed |
| 02:27.35 | macooo | same like me |
| 02:27.38 | macooo | what r u doing |
| 02:27.51 | macooo | i mean what course |
| 02:27.57 | secretlondon | cisco ccna |
| 02:28.05 | macooo | ur age |
| 02:28.23 | secretlondon | mature student |
| 02:28.30 | macooo | 23 |
| 02:28.39 | secretlondon | much older |
| 02:28.58 | macooo | so how is life |
| 02:29.12 | macooo | doing any voluntary job |
| 02:29.13 | secretlondon | i'm trying to package something |
| 02:29.16 | secretlondon | and thats about it atm |
| 02:29.36 | secretlondon | my voluntary work is with ubuntu (if you can call it that) |
| 02:43.22 | Leeds | Amy Winehouse does not come across well on Buzzcocks |
| 03:46.26 | macooo | hi leeds |
| 03:46.47 | macooo | u guys heard about bitspyder |
| 03:59.38 | Leeds | nope, what is it? |
| 04:10.57 | macooo | IT IS THE BEST PLACE FOR RESOURCE SHARING |
| 04:11.08 | macooo | ebooks,cbts,magazines |
| 04:11.13 | macooo | excellent |
| 04:12.11 | macooo | try it www.bitspyder.net |
| 04:12.22 | macooo | it is a community |
| 04:14.28 | Leeds | uh, what? |
| 04:14.42 | Leeds | you mean it's a private bittorrent tracker? |
| 04:14.59 | macooo | yes |
| 04:15.16 | macooo | for sharing ebooks and education stuff |
| 04:15.26 | Leeds | so "RESOURCE SHARING" means ripping off authors of commercial content? |
| 04:15.29 | macooo | excellent collection |
| 04:15.49 | Leeds | or is it only stuff which is shared with the author's and publisher's permission? |
| 04:16.08 | macooo | well |
| 04:16.46 | macooo | i dont think book sharing is a ripp off |
| 04:16.50 | macooo | for any one |
| 04:16.58 | macooo | it is for education purpose |
| 04:17.10 | macooo | only ebooks and cbts |
| 04:17.13 | macooo | magazines |
| 04:17.24 | Leeds | so you don't think authors of books deserve royalties if the book is educational? |
| 04:17.29 | macooo | i dont think it is a violation of any laws |
| 04:17.48 | Leeds | that's not what I asked |
| 04:17.53 | Leeds | and, of course, you're wrong on that anyway |
| 04:18.47 | Leeds | unless the stuff is explicitly licensed for sharing - i.e. Creative Commons or similar - it's illegal to distribute copies of it without the author's and/or publisher's permission |
| 04:19.16 | macooo | hmmm.... |
| 04:19.26 | Leeds | I'm not saying I don't do my share of downloading copyrighted stuff, but I don't kid myself that it's for educational purposes and therefore legal |
| 04:19.53 | macooo | well most of them are college or uni class videos |
| 04:20.04 | macooo | so i dont think it illegeal stuff |
| 04:20.11 | macooo | they publish on uni sites |
| 04:20.21 | macooo | these guys collect them and seed them |
| 04:20.44 | Leeds | 'most' meaning except for the ebooks? |
| 04:20.55 | Leeds | listen - if it was all legal stuff, there'd be no need to make it a private tracker |
| 04:21.23 | macooo | i m not arguing it is legal or illegal |
| 04:21.37 | Leeds | yes you are - you said it was legal |
| 04:21.46 | macooo | i am saying what the stuff bitspyder has |
| 04:21.58 | Leeds | "<macooo> i dont think it is a violation of any laws" |
| 04:22.39 | macooo | :D |
| 04:23.59 | secretlondon | educational purposes means nothing sorry |
| 04:24.15 | secretlondon | it's as copyrighted as anything else |
| 04:24.43 | secretlondon | there is no educational opt out of copyright law - we have fair dealing like everyone else |
| 04:25.20 | secretlondon | warez is still warez, whether you're a student or not |
| 04:25.43 | Leeds | well... there is a real or implied right to copy small amounts of content for educational purposes - photocopy a page or two out of a book, cut'n'paste content for handouts in class, etc. |
| 04:25.56 | secretlondon | that's fair dealing afaik |
| 04:26.28 | secretlondon | "fair dealing" is the UK version of US "fair use" |
| 04:26.50 | macooo | but compared video,music,software and games |
| 04:26.56 | macooo | this is not much |
| 04:26.59 | macooo | i think |
| 04:27.07 | secretlondon | macooo: it's still nicing it |
| 04:27.09 | secretlondon | nicking |
| 04:27.38 | macooo | one should allow open policy on electronic ebooks |
| 04:27.49 | secretlondon | macooo: then why make ebooks? |
| 04:27.51 | macooo | on ebooks |
| 04:28.08 | secretlondon | shouldn't people be allowed to sell ebooks? |
| 04:28.17 | macooo | say for the purpose of refrence |
| 04:28.32 | macooo | most of the ebook readers print the content |
| 04:28.34 | secretlondon | if I write a book and someone turns it into an ebook do I lose the rights to my work? |
| 04:28.49 | macooo | no. |
| 04:29.15 | macooo | but u need to impose res. |
| 04:29.24 | macooo | like educational purpose |
| 04:29.35 | macooo | no printing without permission |
| 04:29.39 | macooo | and so on |
| 04:29.52 | secretlondon | so no market in educational textbooks - yeah right.. |
| 04:30.26 | macooo | how many fe students will be there in uk |
| 04:30.42 | macooo | if they valid they r uni students |
| 04:30.48 | macooo | then they will get free |
| 04:31.00 | macooo | rest will pay |
| 04:31.25 | Leeds | oh, that's a great laugh in the morning - just got some mail with the subject: One of the best MBA/ MA/ BSC courses in HK |
| 04:31.28 | secretlondon | macooo: I'm going to get back to my packaging as I'm bored. you don't seem to see that textbooks are only bought by students |
| 04:31.59 | Leeds | open the mail up, and it's mainly an image, which starts with the line: If you have to choose one course then choose one you can be proud of..... |
| 04:32.19 | macooo | leeds any chance u got ps3 |
| 04:32.20 | Leeds | on the next line, in big letters: University of Bradford |
| 04:32.26 | secretlondon | whaa |
| 04:32.35 | Leeds | :-) |
| 04:32.38 | macooo | from HK |
| 04:32.54 | Leeds | it'll be an affiliate, or a remote learning thing |
| 04:33.05 | secretlondon | yes |
| 04:33.19 | secretlondon | they will have the right to award uni of bradford degrees |
| 04:33.41 | macooo | but they charge same amount as the uni |
| 04:33.44 | macooo | a little less |
| 04:34.29 | macooo | liverpool affiliate virtual learning |
| 04:34.33 | Leeds | it's actually RDI Hong Kong (.com) - who also offer qualifications from Sunderland and Leicester |
| 04:34.34 | macooo | mba 8000£ |
| 04:34.44 | Leeds | oh, those Liverpool ads annoy me... |
| 04:34.47 | macooo | :O |
| 04:35.11 | Leeds | I used to be proud of being a Liverpool grad :-) |
| 04:35.30 | macooo | i saw PS3 SELLING IN HK EBAY WEBSITE |
| 04:35.32 | Leeds | macooo: no, I don't have a PS3 - I'm trying to resist the urge to get a Wii, which should be available in HK today or tomorrow |
| 04:35.45 | Leeds | the HK retail price for the PS3 is the lowest in the world - they |
| 04:36.22 | macooo | my girlfriend is from HK |
| 04:36.31 | Leeds | they're all sold out, of course... the street price for Japanese imports is through the roof - $6800 for the 60GB, well over £450 |
| 04:36.40 | Leeds | good for you... |
| 04:36.57 | macooo | i am going HK in feb |
| 04:37.04 | Leeds | does she know anyone back home who needs to hire a Linux hacker for a highly-paid job? :-) |
| 04:37.13 | macooo | lol |
| 04:37.55 | Leeds | serious question |
| 04:37.56 | macooo | HK -- the best place in the planet for gadgets(price wise) |
| 04:37.59 | Leeds | I need work |
| 04:38.06 | Leeds | can't afford gadgets! |
| 04:38.14 | macooo | what r u doing right now |
| 04:38.51 | Leeds | not working... |
| 04:38.54 | macooo | u r working in UK for atleast 40K |
| 04:38.59 | macooo | i guess |
| 04:39.00 | Leeds | I was, yes |
| 04:39.17 | Leeds | right now I'm drinking diet lemon tea in bed in Hong Kong |
| 04:39.28 | macooo | ur in HK |
| 04:39.30 | macooo | cool |
| 04:39.56 | macooo | i guess u should be getting at least 40k per annum in UK |
| 04:39.58 | macooo | isnt it |
| 04:40.03 | Leeds | right |
| 04:40.11 | Leeds | I'm after 40k per month in HK :-) |
| 04:40.26 | macooo | really |
| 04:40.37 | macooo | 40K per month |
| 04:40.58 | macooo | can we earn that much in HK |
| 04:41.24 | macooo | i m going to move after my M.Sc then |
| 04:41.24 | Leeds | HKD, not GBP, obviously |
| 04:41.41 | macooo | but in UK 40k or more |
| 04:41.46 | macooo | u used to get |
| 04:41.57 | Leeds | yes, but almost 40% of it went to the government |
| 04:42.09 | macooo | thats true |
| 04:42.11 | Leeds | plus 17.5% of every retail transaction, etc. etc. |
| 04:42.21 | macooo | when did u finish ur graduation |
| 04:42.28 | Leeds | uh, 8 years ago |
| 04:42.41 | Leeds | I'm an experienced engineer, not a new grad |
| 04:42.41 | macooo | ur 30 |
| 04:42.52 | macooo | i can see that |
| 04:43.22 | macooo | ur age will be around 29 -31 |
| 04:43.24 | macooo | right |
| 04:43.25 | Leeds | yes |
| 04:43.52 | macooo | say u finished ur grad at 21 |
| 04:43.58 | macooo | u got 8 years exp. |
| 04:44.07 | macooo | 8) |
| 04:44.35 | macooo | i m looking for exp. |
| 04:44.45 | Leeds | I'm looking for work... |
| 04:44.55 | Leeds | well... I'm actually looking for pay :-) |
| 04:44.58 | macooo | u got 8 years exp. |
| 04:45.07 | macooo | u r looking for good pay |
| 04:45.21 | Leeds | yes |
| 04:45.32 | Leeds | but I'd quite happily take pay without work :-) |
| 04:45.36 | macooo | how did u start when u finish ur grad |
| 04:46.00 | macooo | i m going to finish my pg in may |
| 04:46.06 | macooo | i m already 24 |
| 04:46.21 | macooo | i need to get 4 to 5 years expo |
| 04:46.24 | Leeds | what have you been doing with your time? |
| 04:46.41 | macooo | i finished my grad at 21 |
| 04:46.51 | macooo | then project management for 1 |
| 04:47.06 | macooo | and pg 1 1/2 |
| 04:47.13 | Leeds | you mean your bachelor's? |
| 04:47.20 | macooo | masters |
| 04:47.26 | Leeds | at 21? |
| 04:47.44 | macooo | 21 grad |
| 04:47.50 | secretlondon | what's a "grad"? |
| 04:47.57 | macooo | 22 project management course |
| 04:48.03 | macooo | 23 M.s |
| 04:48.07 | macooo | M.Sc |
| 04:48.15 | Leeds | what did you get when you were 21? |
| 04:48.16 | macooo | 24 looking for job |
| 04:48.19 | Leeds | what qualification? |
| 04:48.28 | macooo | b.tech in computer science |
| 04:48.40 | Leeds | uh, btec? |
| 04:48.43 | macooo | yup |
| 04:48.57 | secretlondon | or B.Tech (overseas qualification?) |
| 04:49.13 | macooo | B.Tech 4 years |
| 04:49.16 | secretlondon | btech is a below university qualification in the uk |
| 04:49.17 | macooo | overseas |
| 04:49.21 | secretlondon | hi cat |
| 04:49.30 | catalyst | heyo |
| 04:49.43 | Leeds | was it a bachelor's degree, or a Business & Technology Education Council qualification? |
| 04:49.58 | macooo | no bachelor's degree |
| 04:50.00 | secretlondon | Leeds: he's foreign. it's a bachelors level thing in technolofy |
| 04:50.09 | secretlondon | ~B.Sc |
| 04:50.20 | Leeds | right... where was that from? |
| 04:50.27 | secretlondon | not the piss poor fe qualification called btec |
| 04:50.33 | macooo | B.Sc is a three year degree |
| 04:50.36 | Leeds | and was it worth doing years' more study after that? |
| 04:50.58 | macooo | B.Tech is a four year |
| 04:51.03 | macooo | it from india |
| 04:51.09 | macooo | it is from india |
| 04:51.10 | Leeds | ah, India... |
| 04:52.20 | macooo | when i join M.Sc my uni said |
| 04:52.26 | macooo | b.tech == hnd |
| 04:52.37 | macooo | ii dont know what it is |
| 04:52.46 | Leeds | it's less than a degree |
| 04:53.04 | macooo | u mean hnd |
| 04:53.09 | Leeds | yes |
| 04:53.38 | macooo | but for doing M.Sc u need to do atleast degree with 2-1 |
| 04:54.40 | Leeds | converting qualifications like that between countries can be complicated |
| 04:56.10 | catalyst | and for my next trick |
| 04:56.38 | secretlondon | macooo: say you have a 4year bachelors degree in technology, the british qualification btech isn't very good (and isn't what you have) |
| 04:57.06 | secretlondon | but they shouldn't have let you on to an msc with a btec - so presumably they worked it out |
| 04:57.25 | macooo | i dont have btec |
| 04:57.33 | macooo | which is a part time |
| 04:57.36 | macooo | i assume |
| 04:57.55 | Leeds | I would assume it's a regular bachelor's degree, in technology, rather than science or arts - which are the two main types in the UK |
| 04:58.12 | macooo | mine is a 4 years bachelors degree in computer science |
| 04:58.22 | macooo | which is a engineering |
| 04:58.26 | macooo | we call |
| 04:58.43 | Leeds | in the UK, a comp sci degree is a BSc - I've got one |
| 04:59.21 | macooo | back home we got B.Sc also |
| 04:59.50 | macooo | which is bach in computers or what ever u choose |
| 04:59.57 | macooo | b.tech we have 4 years |
| 05:00.16 | macooo | we get more lab works |
| 05:00.45 | macooo | is b.sc here in uk three years |
| 05:01.21 | secretlondon | b.sc is 3 years, you get some m.eng that are 4 years |
| 05:02.08 | Leeds | in general, I would consider a B to be 4 years, and an M to be 4 - or B+1 |
| 05:02.28 | Leeds | ugh! B is *3* years |
| 05:03.01 | macooo | what btec means here |
| 05:03.49 | secretlondon | btec is a qualification a bit like alevels, but seen as good as a-levels |
| 05:04.06 | macooo | B.Tech back home means |
| 05:04.10 | secretlondon | a vocational, rather than academic qualification for 16-18 year olds |
| 05:04.22 | macooo | Bachelor of Technology |
| 05:05.10 | macooo | after we finish our a levels(+2 back home) |
| 05:05.23 | macooo | we write state level engineers exam |
| 05:05.28 | Leeds | b.tech is not btec - completely and utterly different things, which happen to be homonyms |
| 05:05.35 | macooo | to get qualified |
| 05:06.01 | macooo | mean to study engineering depending upon ur score |
| 05:06.18 | macooo | if u get less u need to choose civil |
| 05:06.23 | macooo | or mech |
| 05:06.35 | macooo | then electrical,electronics |
| 05:07.18 | macooo | but if u get less and like to choose computers u pay the government a fee |
| 05:07.34 | macooo | its hard tough |
| 05:07.42 | macooo | no open book system |
| 05:07.49 | macooo | i first saw when i caame here |
| 05:08.06 | Leeds | open book system? |
| 05:08.34 | macooo | yes |
| 05:08.48 | macooo | u can bring what ever u like to the exam |
| 05:09.02 | macooo | for PG tough |
| 05:09.34 | macooo | laptop, books, hand outs |
| 05:09.36 | macooo | what ever u like |
| 05:09.41 | Leeds | not that much of an exam then |
| 05:09.45 | secretlondon | well that's not a real exam then |
| 05:09.46 | macooo | it is |
| 05:09.54 | macooo | u can bring anything |
| 05:09.57 | Leeds | secretlondon: :-) |
| 05:10.05 | macooo | but u will not use anything |
| 05:10.14 | secretlondon | so what are they testing you on - your reading ability? |
| 05:10.42 | macooo | since the subject that allows open book exams are logical |
| 05:10.47 | macooo | say software project management |
| 05:10.56 | Leeds | I would say it's effectively supervised coursework |
| 05:11.30 | macooo | the question u will be find the critical path or draw a gannt chart |
| 05:11.35 | macooo | for a sceanrio |
| 05:11.46 | macooo | what u will do with ur books, laptops |
| 05:11.56 | macooo | but for refre. u can say |
| 05:12.02 | Leeds | okay, this is wrong - two mentions of gannt charts in two days |
| 05:12.37 | macooo | my other exam |
| 05:12.47 | macooo | advanced software engineering |
| 05:13.23 | macooo | calculate kloc |
| 05:13.42 | macooo | back only sci cal is allowed |
| 05:13.42 | Leeds | what is kloc good for? |
| 05:13.49 | macooo | lines of code |
| 05:14.01 | macooo | for a program |
| 05:14.21 | Leeds | yes, I know what it is - but it's an offensively meaningless term |
| 05:15.04 | macooo | u can find whether the project is semi |
| 05:15.51 | Leeds | semi? |
| 05:16.50 | Leeds | code should be measured in quality - in features, in bugs, in security, in maintainability... not in lines |
| 05:17.01 | macooo | u need them to estimate the cost |
| 05:17.08 | macooo | for developing a software |
| 05:17.37 | macooo | using kloc u can find what project u r dealing with and what cocomo model u need to apply |
| 05:17.44 | macooo | basic, intermediate |
| 05:18.15 | macooo | depending upon the project |
| 05:18.26 | Leeds | cocomo? |
| 05:18.30 | Leeds | and no you don't |
| 05:18.46 | macooo | cost estimation model |
| 05:18.53 | Leeds | if you're measuring code in lines, you'll get exactly what you pay for - lines of code |
| 05:19.09 | Leeds | if you measure code in quality, you'll get exactly what you pay for - quality |
| 05:19.43 | Leeds | hate to say it, but I would refuse to work under someone who considered lines of code to mean anything at all |
| 05:20.28 | Leeds | surely the whole point of a gannt chart is to do away with crap like loc? |
| 05:20.40 | macooo | loc? |
| 05:20.46 | macooo | lines of code u mean |
| 05:21.49 | Leeds | yes |
| 05:22.14 | macooo | well gannt chart is a project management tool u can say |
| 05:22.25 | macooo | to keep up with ur project |
| 05:22.44 | Leeds | yes, I know what gannt charts are |
| 05:23.14 | macooo | i know that u know what gantt charts are |
| 05:23.37 | macooo | u r a geek |
| 05:23.41 | Leeds | and I know that you know that I know what gannt charts are... but I'm still worried that you seem to think loc have any meaningful use in the real world |
| 05:23.44 | Leeds | I'm a technologist |
| 05:24.25 | macooo | u say loc is crap |
| 05:24.26 | Leeds | yes |
| 05:24.31 | macooo | thats what ur point is |
| 05:24.57 | Leeds | maybe not crap - just meaningless, and offensive in use |
| 05:25.25 | Leeds | incidentally, are you in the UK now? |
| 05:25.31 | macooo | yup |
| 05:25.38 | Leeds | but not sleeping? |
| 05:25.42 | macooo | yup |
| 05:25.48 | macooo | 5:25 am |
| 05:26.10 | Leeds | well... you're obviously not sleeping :-) |
| 05:26.37 | macooo | ii am looking for my M.Sc project |
| 05:26.40 | macooo | what to do |
| 05:26.51 | macooo | my submission is on jan 19th |
| 05:26.59 | macooo | not even 2 months |
| 05:27.19 | Leeds | submission meaning you submit your completed project? |
| 05:27.20 | macooo | london met is too crap in regualtions |
| 05:27.29 | macooo | yup |
| 05:27.33 | Leeds | oooh - london met :-) |
| 05:28.01 | Leeds | I still find it funny how a bunch of poly's took the name metropolitan - i.e. metro-poly :-) |
| 05:29.18 | secretlondon | london met was a merger of the uni of north london with something else |
| 05:29.18 | macooo | very strict in rules and grabbing fees |
| 05:29.27 | macooo | yes |
| 05:29.50 | Leeds | still a poly |
| 05:30.31 | macooo | i m looking for a good topic |
| 05:30.47 | macooo | which can be done in 2 months |
| 05:30.48 | secretlondon | we have gllug meetings in the university of westminster's computing fascilities - they look rather nice |
| 05:30.59 | secretlondon | even tho that's a former poly too |
| 05:31.10 | macooo | poly? |
| 05:31.30 | Leeds | polytechnic |
| 05:31.33 | secretlondon | polytechnic - there used to be universities and polytechnics |
| 05:31.39 | macooo | ok |
| 05:31.44 | macooo | same like back home |
| 05:31.52 | secretlondon | polys were less good - then the govt changed the rules and allowed them all to call themselves universities |
| 05:32.03 | Leeds | essentially, second-tier institutions, mainly differentiated from universities by an almost complete lack of research - they were just teaching insitutions |
| 05:32.16 | macooo | thats true |
| 05:32.27 | macooo | i paid 8000£ for M.Sc |
| 05:32.30 | Leeds | that changed in about 1994, but most people will still know a poly |
| 05:32.41 | secretlondon | £8000? |
| 05:32.47 | macooo | uni fee |
| 05:32.50 | secretlondon | jesus |
| 05:32.50 | Leeds | secretlondon: foreign student |
| 05:32.53 | macooo | overseas |
| 05:33.11 | Leeds | personally, I doubt it's worth it |
| 05:33.12 | secretlondon | Leeds: true, I can't imagine how you get that sort of money in india |
| 05:33.32 | secretlondon | London met isn't a very good college |
| 05:33.38 | Leeds | there are *plenty* of middle-class Indians nowadays |
| 05:33.44 | secretlondon | true |
| 05:33.57 | macooo | we got good lands back homw |
| 05:34.04 | Leeds | like... 10s if not 100s of millions |
| 05:34.05 | macooo | that gives three crops |
| 05:35.04 | macooo | now a days any one in india can afford 10000£ for education |
| 05:35.10 | macooo | say middle class |
| 05:35.11 | Leeds | not anyone |
| 05:36.05 | secretlondon | I don't imagine many dalits have £10,000 |
| 05:36.05 | macooo | there is corruption that is making india lag |
| 05:36.22 | macooo | they have unoffically |
| 05:36.33 | macooo | they dont pay taxes like here |
| 05:36.38 | macooo | black money |
| 05:36.39 | secretlondon | bs |
| 05:38.49 | macooo | when coming to dalits, that is another case |
| 06:40.13 | trousers | Morning |
| 06:41.19 | Cope | moin |
| 06:42.24 | *** mode/#gllug [-o Cope] by ChanServ |
| 06:43.46 | secretlondon | morning |
| 07:17.02 | *** join/#gllug secret_ (n=secretlo@5ac0b8b3.bb.sky.com) |
| 07:22.49 | sabinef72 | morning |
| 07:24.42 | secretlondon | morning |
| 07:35.59 | Leeds | you know... the more I read about Sri Lanka being back at war, the happier I am to not be going back there in a hurry |
| 07:36.02 | morsing | sabinef72! |
| 07:36.55 | morsing | Leeds: Nice |
| 07:37.00 | morsing | Mmm... Bonding |
| 07:37.41 | trousers | Humph, two exams today |
| 07:38.28 | Leeds | trousers: open book? |
| 07:38.31 | trousers | And I don't know if I have any other trousers apart from my torn ones >.< |
| 07:38.35 | trousers | Leeds: No, mock GCSE |
| 07:38.53 | Leeds | ah, so you get to laugh at GCSEs? |
| 07:39.10 | trousers | Not exactly |
| 07:39.12 | *** join/#gllug Gunde (n=spamyous@82.153.170.213) |
| 07:39.31 | trousers | They more mock us for not being bothered to do any revision whatsoever |
| 07:39.40 | Gunde | good morning |
| 07:39.48 | sabinef72 | morsing ! |
| 07:39.50 | Leeds | thunder... lightning... frightning! |
| 07:39.50 | morsing | Gunde! |
| 07:39.57 | trousers | I'm hoping I can blag my way into acceptable grades, however |
| 07:39.59 | morsing | Leeds: What did you have for breakfast? |
| 07:40.01 | Leeds | afternoon Gunde |
| 07:40.03 | trousers | Morning, Gunde |
| 07:40.29 | Leeds | morsing: 2 bowls of cereal, 2 muffins, carton of diet lemon tea, 2-stick white kitkat... |
| 07:40.45 | trousers | My 6th form entry criteria is 2xAs 4xBs, I already have 1 A, so it shouldn't be too hard |
| 07:41.05 | Leeds | piss easy |
| 07:41.51 | trousers | Hopefully so, unless my school makes the mocks hard to scare people into working |
| 07:42.07 | Leeds | all GCSEs are awarded to parents nowadays anyway, right? |
| 07:42.14 | serris__ | Hi trousers |
| 07:42.16 | serris__ | Hi Leeds |
| 07:42.24 | secretlondon | Leeds: or the people you buy the coursework from |
| 07:42.31 | Leeds | secretlondon: indeed |
| 07:42.46 | trousers | Leeds: Eh? |
| 07:43.27 | morsing | Mmm... Cheap beer |
| 07:43.29 | serris__ | Are we still on the GCSEs convo? |
| 07:43.46 | Leeds | serris__: more like on it again... we did degrees overnight |
| 07:43.57 | trousers | serris__: Well, yes, I have exams until next Thursday |
| 07:44.13 | serris__ | Do mocks even matter? |
| 07:44.34 | secretlondon | Leeds: yes indeed - from someone who's paying £8,000 to study at london met uni - more fool him |
| 07:44.36 | morsing | secretlondon: So you're coming on Saturday then? |
| 07:44.43 | secretlondon | morsing: I hope so |
| 07:44.45 | trousers | serris__: Well I don't think so, being a cynic at heart, but the teachers keep saying they're important |
| 07:44.57 | serris__ | So did mine |
| 07:44.59 | trousers | But as long as I scrape acceptable grades I'm sure it'll be fine |
| 07:45.01 | serris__ | I've never been questioned about 'em since |
| 07:45.14 | serris__ | I got a bunch of D's as far as I can remember |
| 07:45.17 | trousers | Where is it on Saturday? |
| 07:45.21 | secretlondon | serris__: but you did mess yours up massively, though |
| 07:45.25 | serris__ | ... |
| 07:45.30 | serris__ | I didn't mess them up |
| 07:46.05 | secretlondon | serris__: oh you intended to do poorly and get a job at sainsbury's? |
| 07:46.08 | serris__ | I got into all the courses I wanted to wtih 'em, I got a job with 'em so they can't really be that messed up |
| 07:46.10 | Gunde | morsing: Are you coming on Saturday? |
| 07:46.27 | serris__ | I didn't intend to do poorly nor did I intend to put any effort into it |
| 07:47.12 | morsing | Gunde: Of course |
| 07:47.44 | Leeds | airplane reference in family guy :-) |
| 07:48.05 | trousers | WHere is it on Saturday?! |
| 07:49.14 | Leeds | are you not on the social list? |
| 07:49.46 | sabinef72 | frogs will be in London.... |
| 07:49.51 | serris__ | I should get a part time job at TESCO since it's closer and then I can get more savings cards |
| 07:49.53 | trousers | Leeds: No? |
| 07:49.57 | morsing | Now there's a disturbing danish breakfast picture: |
| 07:49.58 | morsing | http://www.naturistnet.org/data/site_28/archive/176/suppe%201.jpg |
| 07:50.28 | Leeds | trousers: well you should be |
| 07:50.47 | sabinef72 | loooool |
| 07:50.48 | Leeds | morsing: NSFW!!!!! |
| 07:50.59 | Leeds | NSFE!!!!1!!1!1111 |
| 07:51.11 | morsing | Leeds: :) What, someone eating breakfast? |
| 07:51.38 | secretlondon | morsing: not that bad |
| 07:52.24 | *** join/#gllug deep-blue (n=evil1337@82-44-63-50.stb.ubr02.mort.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 07:52.30 | morsing | deep-blue! |
| 07:52.31 | serris__ | hi db |
| 07:52.52 | serris__ | oh morsing, had anything good for breakfast? |
| 07:53.18 | morsing | serris__: I wasn't naked |
| 07:53.19 | secretlondon | hi deep-blue |
| 07:53.29 | serris__ | Good to know |
| 07:53.58 | serris__ | I'm just having some Pringles for breakfast |
| 07:54.29 | trousers | Well, I'm off |
| 07:54.38 | serris__ | cya |
| 07:56.05 | Leeds | mmm... pringles |
| 07:56.29 | secretlondon | trousers: good luck |
| 07:56.46 | serris__ | These ones are scary cheese |
| 07:57.56 | secretlondon | halloween branding? |
| 07:58.00 | mozrat | scary cheese? |
| 07:58.29 | serris__ | Yeah it was from halloween.. left over |
| 07:58.31 | serris__ | Hi morsing |
| 07:58.34 | serris__ | mozrat* |
| 07:58.46 | mozrat | hey! |
| 07:58.47 | mozrat | :-) |
| 07:59.05 | mozrat | No-one has mistyped me for a while |
| 07:59.13 | morsing | ibot FWIW |
| 07:59.15 | ibot | [fwiw] for {what,whatever} it's worth |
| 07:59.24 | morsing | ibot mozrat |
| 07:59.25 | ibot | mozrat is probably a geek, or pissed, or not morsing ALIVE!!!, or not a CNAME for morsing, or so pissed he can't update his factiod, or and we won!!!!!!, or not even Australian, or a piker, or morsing, or completelylylyl pissed |
| 07:59.41 | morsing | Ha ha :) |
| 07:59.48 | mozrat | :( |
| 07:59.58 | mozrat | That factoid is getting more and more random |
| 08:01.04 | serris__ | Time for a beer! brb |
| 08:01.33 | secretlondon | ibot pissed |
| 08:01.35 | ibot | Look you guys, I'm getting pretty damn pissed. I don't need to put up with this bot abuse!!! |
| 08:01.47 | secretlondon | bah bot needs anglicising |
| 08:02.02 | morsing | ibot beer |
| 08:02.03 | ibot | ACTION has disconnected (Read error: 99 (Connection reset by beer)) |
| 08:02.15 | secretlondon | oh noes - it ran away! |
| 08:04.05 | Leeds | real storm outside... |
| 08:06.40 | secretlondon | ibot drunk |
| 08:06.41 | ibot | yay! |
| 08:07.06 | Gunde | morsing: The newspaper in the picture is not Danish... |
| 08:08.08 | Leeds | ibot rain |
| 08:08.09 | ibot | Seattle has too much of it this year! |
| 08:08.21 | secretlondon | ibot leeds |
| 08:08.23 | ibot | hmm... leeds is a bloke called Richard making bras in Hong Kong, or a bloke called Richard, or a rubbish footie team, or better than Google, or a Solaris freeware and Perl expert, or a regexp expert, or been fired from the bra company, or not my problem, or a very sociable guy, or a sexy alian |
| 08:08.39 | Leeds | ibot thunder |
| 08:09.03 | Leeds | ibot thunder is the noise you get when the gods move their furniture around |
| 08:09.04 | ibot | Leeds: cannot alter locked factoids |
| 08:09.43 | secretlondon | ibot sudo |
| 08:09.44 | ibot | hmm... sudo is (SUperuser DO) better than su, according to talon.It is able to give limited super user privileges to specific users, or can allow you to do silly things like run X apps with root perms, or good in scripts with "username ALL = NOPASSWD: /some/program", or http://www.aplawrence.com/Basics/sudo.html |
| 08:10.06 | Leeds | ibot sudo is also good for ordering sandwiches |
| 08:10.08 | ibot | Leeds: okay |
| 08:10.09 | sabinef72 | ibot secretlondon |
| 08:10.21 | sabinef72 | nothing about secretlondon ? |
| 08:10.31 | Leeds | ibot sabinef72 |
| 08:10.32 | ibot | i heard sabinef72 is an hour ahead, or a lady in the future, or full name Sabine PAPILLAULT, or 72 yeard old, or a little old lady |
| 08:10.39 | secretlondon | ibot sudo should be pseudo but isn't |
| 08:11.02 | Leeds | secretlondon: why should it be pseudo? |
| 08:11.19 | secretlondon | Leeds: I always presumed it was pseudo-root |
| 08:11.28 | sabinef72 | !ibot morsing |
| 08:11.37 | morsing | It's Shift User DO |
| 08:11.41 | sabinef72 | ibot morsing |
| 08:11.43 | ibot | morsing is probably a nice and very knowledgeable guy who often buys rounds of beer, or mozrat, or living in a virtual universe where AIX resembles Unix. capable of having bee-wax applied to the plucking end, or mozrat, or verb: to paste random crap devoid of context, or not a CNAME for mozrat, or a Python expert, or a philistine |
| 08:11.47 | morsing | Not SUperuser DO |
| 08:12.10 | Leeds | I always read it as su-do - compared with the existing su |
| 08:12.46 | secretlondon | ibot sudo |
| 08:12.47 | ibot | rumour has it, sudo is (SUperuser DO) better than su, according to talon.It is able to give limited super user privileges to specific users, or can allow you to do silly things like run X apps with root perms, or good in scripts with "username ALL = NOPASSWD: /some/program", or http://www.aplawrence.com/Basics/sudo.html, or good for ordering sandwiches |
| 08:13.32 | secretlondon | ibot sudo is not pseudo |
| 08:13.33 | ibot | ...but sudo is already something else... |
| 08:14.26 | Leeds | ibot secretlondon is probably in London, and otherwise a secret |
| 08:14.27 | ibot | Leeds: okay |
| 08:14.39 | secretlondon | ibot sudo sounds like pseudo |
| 08:15.04 | Leeds | secretlondon: if something is already set, you can only add to it (is also) rather than set it (is) |
| 08:15.04 | secretlondon | bah it really does want thing is a thingey |
| 08:15.10 | secretlondon | thanks |
| 08:16.04 | secretlondon | ibot sudo is also not pseudo |
| 08:16.05 | ibot | secretlondon: okay |
| 08:16.15 | Leeds | unless you wipe out the factiod completely (forget) and start again - but that's very run unless it's your factoid or it's new and/or almost empty |
| 08:16.36 | Leeds | ibot forget secretlondon |
| 08:16.37 | ibot | Leeds: i didn't have anything called 'secretlondon ' to forget |
| 08:16.47 | Leeds | ibot secretlondon |
| 08:16.48 | ibot | from memory, secretlondon is probably in London, and otherwise a secret |
| 08:16.54 | Leeds | ibot forget secretlondon |
| 08:16.54 | ibot | i forgot secretlondon, Leeds |
| 08:17.01 | Leeds | ibot secretlondon is probably in London, and otherwise a secret |
| 08:17.02 | ibot | okay, Leeds |
| 08:17.30 | Leeds | ah, you've got to love forecastfox - just popped up a little window to let me know there's a thunderstorm going on outside |
| 08:17.52 | secretlondon | ibot sudo |
| 08:17.53 | ibot | [sudo] (SUperuser DO) better than su, according to talon.It is able to give limited super user privileges to specific users, or can allow you to do silly things like run X apps with root perms, or good in scripts with "username ALL = NOPASSWD: /some/program", or http://www.aplawrence.com/Basics/sudo.html, or good for ordering sandwiches, or not pseudo |
| 08:17.57 | Leeds | for those who may be confused... ibot apparently doesn't strip whitespace from the end of a line, so "forget secretlondon " and "forget secretlondon" aren't the same thing |
| 08:18.07 | secretlondon | ibot root |
| 08:18.08 | ibot | from memory, root is not a Good Thing to use when using IRC. Please use a different account. You will probably not be able to speak until change your user account. |
| 08:18.24 | Leeds | ibot IRC |
| 08:18.25 | ibot | from memory, irc is Internet Relay Chat or a massive time sink, or eternally the cyber land of the rising sun |
| 08:19.02 | secretlondon | ibot root is also see sudo |
| 08:19.04 | ibot | ACTION uses a keylogger to pwnz all is also see sudo 's boxen. |
| 08:19.16 | secretlondon | eh? |
| 08:19.21 | Leeds | ibot root secretlondon's machine |
| 08:19.23 | ibot | ACTION uses a keylogger to pwnz all secretlondon's machine 's boxen. |
| 08:19.28 | secretlondon | ah |
| 08:19.36 | Leeds | ibot root Fred |
| 08:19.38 | ibot | ACTION uses a keylogger to pwnz all Fred 's boxen. |
| 08:20.03 | Leeds | anyway, I'm off out into the thunder and lightning - got to go book the bowling, then get to the pub by 5:30 to meet Claire :-) |
| 08:20.22 | secretlondon | have fun. i should go to bed really |
| 08:20.41 | secretlondon | ibot pissed |
| 08:20.42 | ibot | Look you guys, I'm getting pretty damn pissed. I don't need to put up with this bot abuse!!! |
| 08:21.15 | Leeds | ibot chill |
| 08:21.16 | ibot | chill is probably cool, or usually found in #huizebb |
| 08:21.33 | Leeds | alright, *gone* - have a good day, all |
| 08:21.51 | secretlondon | ibot pissed is also what happens after vast quantities of alcohol |
| 08:21.52 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:22.12 | secretlondon | ibot pissed |
| 08:22.14 | ibot | Look you guys, I'm getting pretty damn pissed. I don't need to put up with this bot abuse!!!, or what happens after vast quantities of alcohol |
| 08:22.53 | secretlondon | ibot linux |
| 08:22.55 | ibot | it has been said that linux is the cure for cancer, AIDS and slavery to corporations |
| 08:23.06 | secretlondon | ibot bsd |
| 08:23.07 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, bsd is a UNIX operating system. An asterisk port is currently being worked on. |
| 08:23.22 | secretlondon | ibot unix |
| 08:23.24 | ibot | rumour has it, unix is A lot like DOS, but a MUCH more powerful operating system. It was developed at Bell Labs and is now being developed by many other corporations. It is mainly used as a multi-user server for mainframes, although companies like Novell offer it for the desktop market as well. not at all like dos beyond the superficial similarities in the command ... |
| 08:24.14 | secretlondon | ibot bored |
| 08:24.15 | ibot | La ... lalalala ... beer! |
| 08:24.35 | secretlondon | ibot beer |
| 08:24.37 | ibot | ACTION has disconnected (Read error: 99 (Connection reset by beer)) |
| 08:24.57 | secretlondon | ibot ibot |
| 08:24.58 | ibot | i heard ibot is a blootbot written in perl run by TimRiker on his server. logs on http://ibot.rikers.org/<chan>/ , ibot, jbot, apt are all the same process. It uses sqlite, but mysql or other SQL storage is also supported. |
| 08:25.16 | secretlondon | ibot ibot ibot |
| 08:25.18 | ibot | ACTION does... erm... I dunno... some bot stuff or something to ibot. |
| 08:25.54 | secretlondon | ibot ibot ibot ibot |
| 08:25.55 | ibot | ACTION does... erm... I dunno... some bot stuff or something to ibot ibot. |
| 08:26.26 | secretlondon | ibot apt |
| 08:27.20 | secretlondon | ibot apt isn't ibot or jbot, it's the debian package manager |
| 08:27.52 | secretlondon | ibot apt is the debian package manager and nothing to do with ibot |
| 08:27.54 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:28.02 | secretlondon | ibot apt |
| 08:28.03 | ibot | methinks apt is the debian package manager and nothing to do with ibot |
| 08:28.18 | secretlondon | ibot debian |
| 08:28.19 | ibot | debian is, like, a really cool way to spend the night without having to listen to your woman whining about how she never gets any attention. your very last OS :), or a horrible way to install an OS... use the knoppix installer to get debian |
| 08:28.41 | secretlondon | ibot debian is also /rules |
| 08:28.43 | ibot | secretlondon: okay |
| 08:28.55 | secretlondon | ibot debian |
| 08:28.57 | ibot | debian is, like, a really cool way to spend the night without having to listen to your woman whining about how she never gets any attention. your very last OS :), or a horrible way to install an OS... use the knoppix installer to get debian, or /rules |
| 08:29.25 | secretlondon | ibot debian is also Ubuntu's mother |
| 08:29.26 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:29.48 | secretlondon | ibot Ubuntu |
| 08:29.49 | ibot | ubuntu is probably a distribution of Linux that is <Based on Debian>, please visit http://www.ubuntu.com/ and/or visit #ubuntu, on irc.freenode.net. Ask me about <Based On Debian> for an explanation of why we are unable to support Ubuntu here. |
| 08:30.18 | secretlondon | ibot <Based On Debian> |
| 08:30.40 | secretlondon | ibot Ubuntu is also brown |
| 08:30.41 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:32.15 | secretlondon | ibot Kubuntu |
| 08:32.35 | secretlondon | ibot Kubuntu is like Ubuntu, but blue and kde-ish |
| 08:32.37 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:33.10 | secretlondon | ibot Xubuntu |
| 08:33.26 | secretlondon | ibot Xubuntu is like Ubuntu, but blue and xfce-ish |
| 08:33.27 | ibot | secretlondon: okay |
| 08:33.39 | secretlondon | ibot Edubuntu |
| 08:34.04 | Gunde | secretlondon: Having fun all alone? (: |
| 08:34.07 | secretlondon | ibot Edubuntu is like Ubuntu, but orange and educational |
| 08:34.08 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:34.12 | mozrat | Gunde!! |
| 08:34.15 | mozrat | ibot Gunde |
| 08:34.16 | ibot | i heard gunde is 163cm tall (in high heels) |
| 08:34.18 | secretlondon | Gunde: I'm procrastinating |
| 08:34.49 | Gunde | mozrat (: |
| 08:36.17 | morsing | ibot SpudUlike |
| 08:36.18 | ibot | i guess spudulike is often to be found looking for his lost marbles. or a man not to be messed with!, or |
| 08:36.27 | morsing | ibot Tarragon |
| 08:36.29 | ibot | well, tarragon is a tall Northern bloke. |
| 08:36.43 | secretlondon | ibot boudiccas |
| 08:37.01 | secretlondon | ibot Boudiccas was the queen of the icini |
| 08:37.15 | secretlondon | ibot Boudiccas is the former queen of the icini |
| 08:37.16 | ibot | secretlondon: okay |
| 08:38.24 | secretlondon | ibot trousers |
| 08:38.25 | ibot | methinks trousers is the new and improved George without the defects and with all the acne |
| 08:38.39 | morsing | ibot Jason_ukfsn |
| 08:38.40 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, jason_ukfsn is the guy who runs UK Free Software Network, the FLOSS supporting ISP that keeps it's financial promises, or a barbie girl |
| 08:39.33 | secretlondon | ibot trousers is also what American's call pants, not to be confused with what British people call pants, which are what Americans call under-pants |
| 08:39.34 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:41.39 | secretlondon | ibot trousers |
| 08:41.40 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, trousers is the new and improved George without the defects and with all the acne, or what American's call pants, not to be confused with what British people call pants, which are what Americans call under-pants |
| 08:42.07 | secretlondon | ibot trousers is also plural |
| 08:42.10 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:42.34 | secretlondon | ibot z00dax |
| 08:42.54 | secretlondon | ibot keithlard |
| 08:43.28 | secretlondon | ibot keithlard is not his real name |
| 08:43.29 | ibot | okay, secretlondon |
| 08:43.35 | secretlondon | ibot keithlard |
| 08:43.36 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, keithlard is not his real name |
| 08:44.02 | secretlondon | ibot coffee |
| 08:44.16 | secretlondon | ibot caffeine |
| 08:44.18 | ibot | it has been said that caffeine is the nectar of the gods in concentrated form or the jiuce which runs through our veins |
| 08:44.58 | secretlondon | ibot bored |
| 08:44.59 | ibot | La ... lalalala ... beer! |
| 09:27.26 | morsing | mmm... |
| 09:55.02 | mozrat | keef! |
| 09:55.12 | keithlard_ | hi |
| 09:55.17 | mozrat | how is it? |
| 09:55.21 | morsing | keithlard_! |
| 09:56.08 | keithlard_ | the power went out last night about 5pm, so we all went down to the pub! |
| 09:56.41 | mozrat | excellent. Did you plug it back in this morning for the toaster? |
| 10:00.59 | keithlard_ | that is the type of monday i can do business with reely |
| 10:01.25 | morsing | Monday? |
| 10:05.09 | *** join/#gllug fail-need_a_job (n=failure@host86-136-13-163.range86-136.btcentralplus.com) |
| 10:07.05 | secretlondon | ello failure |
| 10:08.49 | morsing | fail-need_a_job! |
| 10:09.09 | secretlondon | morsing: it's just our old friend failure, slightly repackaged |
| 10:20.44 | z00dax | morning |
| 10:20.52 | morsing | z00dax! |
| 10:20.58 | z00dax | morsing: ! |
| 10:25.07 | secretlondon | z00dax |
| 10:27.27 | *** join/#gllug JAV (n=jose@84.77.96.89) |
| 10:27.30 | morsing | JAV! |
| 10:27.44 | JAV | hello morsing :D |
| 10:28.20 | JAV | (and everybody) |
| 10:28.53 | *** join/#gllug Jasperw (n=jasperw@62.49.196.35) |
| 10:29.44 | morsing | Jasperw! |
| 10:29.57 | *** join/#gllug CopeUK (n=3ebd3982@mozrat01.vm.bytemark.co.uk) |
| 10:30.24 | secretlondon | JAV! |
| 10:30.59 | JAV | hi secretlondon |
| 10:32.19 | JAV | splendid day |
| 10:32.34 | keithlard_ | what up! |
| 10:32.35 | morsing | It's freezing in here |
| 10:32.39 | morsing | keithlard_: STOP IT |
| 10:33.01 | morsing | keithlard_: Either say "What's up?", "Whazzup?" or "Word up!" |
| 10:33.26 | CopeUK | ooooh |
| 10:33.30 | morsing | What you're saying makes no sence. As an absolute minimum, you should have a "?" at the end not a "!" |
| 10:33.32 | CopeUK | hello keithlard_ |
| 10:33.41 | keithlard_ | hey! |
| 10:33.51 | JAV | splendid day as in I'm happy without a reason |
| 10:33.58 | keithlard_ | it's a very nice day |
| 10:34.06 | morsing | I'm never happy without a reason, esspecially today |
| 10:34.08 | JAV | It's cold here |
| 10:34.52 | JAV | morsing, you should try |
| 10:34.58 | morsing | Try what? |
| 10:35.16 | wethrin | beer |
| 10:35.31 | *** join/#gllug goibhniu (n=cillian@grail1.oxfam.org.uk) |
| 10:35.32 | keithlard_ | would anyone like coffee |
| 10:36.25 | morsing | goibhniu! |
| 10:36.38 | wethrin | keithlard_: Please |
| 10:36.49 | JAV | :) |
| 10:37.04 | goibhniu | morsing! |
| 10:38.53 | z00dax | uhmm.... cawfee |
| 10:39.19 | *** join/#gllug andrew__ (n=andrew@vm.black1.org.uk) |
| 10:40.18 | andrew__ | hi there |
| 10:41.06 | morsing | andrew__! |
| 10:41.17 | morsing | andrew__: Why did you leave #aix? |
| 10:41.37 | wethrin | hash aix? |
| 10:42.02 | z00dax | its the end of the road for Aix |
| 10:42.46 | morsing | z00dax: Ha ha :) |
| 10:42.57 | z00dax | morsing: indeed |
| 10:44.14 | morsing | Is that why it's the only commercial Unix with growing sales? |
| 10:44.49 | morsing | Or that they've had to increase the price of pSeries servers because they were too popular and stole market shares from the enterprise systems? |
| 10:45.03 | morsing | z00dax: Get your facts right... |
| 10:47.27 | z00dax | morsing: osx outsells aix by a few hundred to 1 |
| 10:47.33 | z00dax | osx, too is a commerical unix |
| 10:47.50 | z00dax | you really should not believe all the stuff that $vendor marketing sends your way |
| 10:50.14 | morsing | z00dax: Not Unix |
| 10:50.36 | z00dax | morsing: of-course OSX is unix.. |
| 10:50.41 | morsing | Nope |
| 10:50.46 | z00dax | elaborate |
| 10:50.52 | z00dax | what makes you think its not ? |
| 10:51.00 | z00dax | you dont consider bsd unix ? |
| 10:51.20 | cpufreak | OSX is Unix Like. |
| 10:51.29 | morsing | z00dax: You also mis-read what I said |
| 10:51.38 | morsing | I didn't say it was the best selling |
| 10:51.43 | cpufreak | OSX 10.5 will be /Unix/ |
| 10:51.51 | cpufreak | as it'll be approved by the Open Group |
| 10:52.03 | cpufreak | Apple's getting it certified for Unix 03 |
| 10:52.21 | z00dax | morsing: you said growing. considerin osx had zilch sales a few years back.. i'd say its the fastest growing |
| 10:53.02 | z00dax | also for someone who has 10 sales/yr to suddenly make 20 the next implies a 100% growth in sales. when you have 12 million, its not that easy to make 24 million in a year. |
| 10:59.08 | goibhniu | so there! |
| 11:01.38 | CopeUK | morsing - can you not see what I was writng? |
| 11:02.52 | morsing | CopeUK: Huh? |
| 11:03.10 | morsing | z00dax: OSX didn't exist a few years back |
| 11:03.30 | morsing | You can't create a new product and then claim it's "growing" |
| 11:03.56 | morsing | CopeUK: I can't see anything? Have you registeret your nick? |
| 11:04.28 | morsing | z00dax: In your mind, AIX doesn't sell in millions? |
| 11:04.44 | keithlard_ | funny, i do not get anything from nickserv at all |
| 11:05.04 | z00dax | keithlard_: prolly dead |
| 11:05.12 | CopeUK | keithlard_ - hello |
| 11:05.21 | CopeUK | likewise |
| 11:05.23 | z00dax | morsing: considering ibm does not sell the h/w it runs on by the millions, no i dont think aix sells in the millions at all |
| 11:05.33 | CopeUK | oooh |
| 11:05.59 | *** join/#gllug Dick_Turpin (n=Dick_Tur@host217-34-163-21.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 11:06.30 | Dick_Turpin | moin |
| 11:06.42 | keithlard_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:08.59 | morsing | Dick_Turpin! |
| 11:09.14 | Dick_Turpin | morsing: watcha |
| 11:09.22 | keithlard_ | i'm not sure i fancy a jewel that's been in someone's pants! |
| 11:10.17 | morsing | z00dax: There must be at least a 5 digit number of POWER5 servers in the UK alone. A million sales is definately not unrealistic |
| 11:10.41 | z00dax | morsing: per year ? |
| 11:10.55 | morsing | POWER5 has only been out for 2 years |
| 11:11.08 | morsing | They sell LOADS! Believe me |
| 11:11.10 | z00dax | morsing: you do realise that Apple is today the largest retailer of individual machines in the world |
| 11:11.21 | morsing | But are they growing? |
| 11:11.25 | z00dax | ibm-business isnt even in the top 20 |
| 11:11.35 | morsing | Especially now they're going to PCs |
| 11:11.42 | z00dax | morsing: yes, they outstripped dell 2 years back |
| 11:11.58 | morsing | Anyway, got work to do... |
| 11:12.05 | z00dax | ok :) |
| 11:14.59 | CopeUK | keithlard_: talk to me on yahoo/msn - since I can't register and talk here |
| 11:15.21 | keithlard_ | man i have not fired up gaim in ages you realise |
| 11:22.19 | Dick_Turpin | Any Debian guys in? |
| 11:22.47 | CopeUK | do you actually have a question? |
| 11:22.56 | CopeUK | or are you just conducting a poll? |
| 11:23.39 | Dick_Turpin | Bum sorry, yeah one or two questions but I'm not ready to ask yet just preping |
| 11:23.40 | wethrin | CopeUK: Why can't you register? |
| 11:23.59 | CopeUK | Dick_Turpin: ok... well sing out when you're ready |
| 11:24.09 | CopeUK | wethrin: i believe nickserv to be dead |
| 11:24.32 | rhowe | heh, IT supplier accidentally justifies our switch away from Exchange 2 years ago: "According to research by WinMark, UK firms suffer an average of 4 ExchangeServer failures a year. By the time you take into account lost productivity and the cost of repair, each failure is estimated to cost around £68,000*, amounting to more than £250,000 a year." |
| 11:24.40 | rhowe | So do I claim I saved the company £500k? :) |
| 11:25.00 | z00dax | each failure costs 68k ? |
| 11:25.09 | z00dax | damn, i need to get into ExchangeServer consulting work . |
| 11:25.14 | Dick_Turpin | I'm using Debian testing under VM having a bit of a bugger getting VM tools installed but didnt want to ask just yet |
| 11:25.18 | z00dax | and find some clients like rhowe |
| 11:25.48 | wethrin | CopeUK: It's responding to me |
| 11:26.02 | Dick_Turpin | apt-get update |
| 11:26.02 | wethrin | CopeUK: You could just link CopeUK to Cope |
| 11:26.20 | Dick_Turpin | Sorry wrong screen :-S |
| 11:27.26 | rhowe | z00dax: heh, we haven't run Exchange for 2 years :) |
| 11:28.34 | z00dax | rhowe: :( |
| 11:28.44 | z00dax | rhowe: recommend me some people who do |
| 11:29.05 | rhowe | z00dax: MS? |
| 11:29.06 | wethrin | z00dax: University of Durham |
| 11:29.49 | wethrin | They've recently aquired an Exchange installation |
| 11:30.43 | z00dax | wethrin: SIGTOOFAR |
| 11:31.05 | z00dax | rhowe: hey, for 68k for a few days job, yea - I'd do MS |
| 11:31.19 | z00dax | or well, maybe not - i'd subcontract |
| 11:35.26 | morsing | rhowe! |
| 11:35.36 | andrew__ | Hi there. Can anyone point me to a good guide on the various ways of starting X-sessions (eg XDMCP, tunelling over SSH ....) |
| 11:38.59 | fail-need_a_job | hi |
| 11:39.32 | fail-need_a_job | could someone suggest me a place where to buy a suit without spending 200 pounds on it? |
| 11:39.41 | CopeUK | charity shop |
| 11:40.00 | CopeUK | seriously though - the retail "suit" shops have "cheap" suits |
| 11:40.23 | fail-need_a_job | which shops? |
| 11:40.37 | fail-need_a_job | i don't know London |
| 11:40.40 | CopeUK | can't recall the names |
| 11:40.42 | CopeUK | suts direct etc |
| 11:42.01 | goibhniu | I always buy from charity shops |
| 11:42.12 | Erwin | There is always some some going out of business that sells them at a discount. Although whether that is an appropriate suit to wear in a business environment, I don't know |
| 11:42.20 | wethrin | You'll get a better suit at a proper tailor, though |
| 11:42.34 | goibhniu | I don't think many IT jobs that expect you to turn up in a suit though ... even in England |
| 11:42.36 | Erwin | For 200? |
| 11:42.45 | wethrin | Don't know |
| 11:42.48 | fail-need_a_job | it's for interviews, mainly |
| 11:43.10 | goibhniu | sorry ... I'm crap at english .. I meant for interviews |
| 11:43.13 | fail-need_a_job | Erwin: i want to spend quite less than 200 |
| 11:43.44 | Erwin | fail-need_a_job: Charity shops. Especially in posh neighbourhoods, where some rich guy tired off his Hugo Boss gives it away and you can have it for peanuts. |
| 11:44.06 | Erwin | e.g. there's an Oxfam in Mayfair. |
| 11:44.26 | fail-need_a_job | Erwin: i'll have a look, thanks |
| 11:45.31 | Erwin | Or somewhere around there.. Chelsea perhaps. At least that's what Timeout recommended |
| 11:47.07 | goibhniu | Erwin that's a brilliant strategy .. also Oxfam have recently added a lot of their stuff to ebay ... although the prices may well be higher there |
| 11:50.04 | CopeUK | i wear a suit every day |
| 11:50.37 | goibhniu | the last interview I went to I wore a suit ... and felt like a complete knob ... when the interviewer came out to the lobby to call me in he first approached a guy who was just waiting there who was wearing rather urban clothes assuming it was him |
| 11:57.04 | fail-need_a_job | that's the thing... but many other times they don't consider you just because you were wearing casual clothes... |
| 11:57.44 | fail-need_a_job | almost all agencies tell me to wear smart for interviews |
| 11:58.33 | goibhniu | you're right of course ... it's best to play it safe ... suits just make my skin crawl |
| 11:58.51 | goibhniu | but if it's a media related job you may be better off without |
| 11:59.01 | goibhniu | maybe |
| 12:00.13 | goibhniu | I do web dev ... they kind of expect you to wear an orange kilt and die your hair blue |
| 12:02.49 | fail-need_a_job | hehe |
| 12:05.51 | Dick_Turpin | Thats it I give up! where the buggery bollocks is the equivelant of /usr/src/include/linux (On Debian) I can find /usr/include/linux but the vmtools keeps spitting me out |
| 12:15.25 | secretlondon | what are you looking for? kernel headers? |
| 12:16.54 | secretlondon | i have a usr/include/linux here, and headers in /usr/src |
| 12:17.01 | Dick_Turpin | yeah I reckon, Ive done this loads of times under rpm and usually you have to have the kernel-source |
| 12:18.44 | secretlondon | headers live in usr/src/name-of-header |
| 12:19.09 | Dick_Turpin | hang on just running the script again |
| 12:22.25 | morsing | Nice |
| 12:22.51 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: Oh crap theres nothing in /usr/src |
| 12:23.27 | wethrin | Did you install the -dev Debian package? |
| 12:24.25 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: is that kerenel-dev ? |
| 12:25.33 | secretlondon | Dick_Turpin: I'm actually using ubuntu so they are called linux-headers |
| 12:27.04 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: Aaaaahhh theres millions, hang on a tick :-( |
| 12:37.07 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: I think I'm getting thr correct one will let you know |
| 12:37.26 | secretlondon | yay |
| 12:40.07 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: I edited the sources.list to disable the cd-rom and now its complaining about no public key for A70DAF536070D3A1 whatever that is? |
| 12:40.37 | secretlondon | Dick_Turpin: not a clue |
| 12:42.04 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: stuff it, I think I'm getting somewhere /usr/src/ now has linux-headers in it |
| 12:42.16 | secretlondon | :) |
| 13:12.22 | *** join/#gllug iTron (n=tron@unaffiliated/itron) |
| 13:16.33 | morsing | iTron! |
| 13:19.36 | *** join/#gllug fail-need_a_job (n=failure@host81-129-158-158.range81-129.btcentralplus.com) |
| 13:19.40 | morsing | fail-need_a_job! |
| 13:21.55 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: Ta Da! /usr/src/linux-headers-2.6.17-2-686/include is what was needed (H) |
| 13:22.03 | secretlondon | yay |
| 13:22.05 | *** join/#gllug gadgerama (n=gadgeram@5ac21527.bb.sky.com) |
| 13:22.39 | Dick_Turpin | back in a tick have to logout and back in |
| 13:22.52 | *** part/#gllug Dick_Turpin (n=Dick_Tur@host217-34-163-21.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 13:24.09 | iTron | morsing! |
| 13:38.26 | *** join/#gllug Dick_Turpin (n=Dick_Tur@host217-34-163-21.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 13:39.56 | morsing | iTron: How are you? |
| 13:39.59 | Dick_Turpin | secretlondon: Well that was a waste of time, vmtools installed but I still have to do ctrl alt to release the cursor |
| 13:40.24 | iTron | morsing: I have this bloody terrible cold. |
| 13:41.33 | iTron | morsing: How about you? I hope you're happeir of late than I've seen you :) |
| 13:41.37 | iTron | Gah. |
| 13:45.47 | goibhniu | the ebuyer linux laptops are in the clearance section! £270 ... I'm not sure if that's a good thing or not |
| 13:45.48 | morsing | iTron: Wasn't I happy last time we met? |
| 13:46.13 | morsing | I'm ok, trying to come up wit christmas present ideas for people but am useless at it |
| 13:46.47 | goibhniu | morsing: http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/103124 |
| 13:47.08 | goibhniu | the nice thing is that the windows version, also in clearance costs almost £100 more |
| 13:48.59 | iTron | yeah this whole Yule thing is coming up again. |
| 13:49.17 | secretlondon | i'm going to bed |
| 13:49.26 | iTron | secretlondon: Excellent idea. |
| 13:49.41 | secretlondon | yes i am living on gmt atm - but i'm running on bizarre hacker time |
| 13:49.42 | iTron | secretlondon: I wish I too were going to bed. My own bed of course. |
| 13:50.08 | secretlondon | i am also only going to my own bed,, |
| 13:50.18 | iTron | That's good thing. ;) |
| 13:50.23 | iTron | a good thing even. |
| 13:50.24 | secretlondon | indeed |
| 13:50.57 | iTron | Well I'm glad we got that straightened out. |
| 13:51.17 | trousers | Afternoon all |
| 13:52.51 | morsing | goibhniu: Thanks but link doesn't work |
| 13:54.24 | morsing | goibhniu: Thanks but she already has a laptop/powerbook whatever it's called... |
| 13:54.28 | *** join/#gllug keithlard (n=john@host217-34-140-129.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 13:54.48 | trousers | morsing: Am I missing half the conversation or...? |
| 13:55.05 | morsing | goibhniu: How about this: |
| 13:55.06 | morsing | http://www.beautifulthings.co.uk/acatalog/compmissb.jpg |
| 13:55.22 | keithlard | wooo |
| 13:55.23 | morsing | trousers: goibhniu posted a link to a laptop |
| 13:55.26 | morsing | keithlard? |
| 13:55.47 | trousers | morsing: Socks! You can never go wrong with a nice cosy pair of socks. |
| 13:56.16 | morsing | Or a scarf |
| 13:56.47 | morsing | javascript:ShowPopUp('info%5fGF063%2ehtml',400,350); |
| 13:56.50 | morsing | Wow |
| 14:06.53 | iTron | Heh |
| 14:13.42 | goibhniu | morsing: no ... it might seem like fun now .. but try not to focus on the speech you're going to make explaining how funny you thought it was when you first saw it |
| 14:14.03 | goibhniu | an oxfam goat and a bar of chocolate |
| 14:15.04 | goibhniu | and a surprise ticket to paris ... in the evening |
| 14:15.20 | goibhniu | or is it for your mother? |
| 14:22.17 | Erwin | What's the verdict? I'm pondering an unnecessary upgrade |
| 14:22.55 | *** join/#gllug gadgerama (n=gadgeram@5ac21527.bb.sky.com) |
| 14:25.18 | morsing | gadgerama! |
| 14:25.45 | morsing | goibhniu: Huh? I don't get it... |
| 14:25.57 | morsing | Ohhh that thing |
| 14:25.59 | morsing | :) |
| 14:26.06 | morsing | goibhniu: No - for a friend |
| 14:30.38 | Erwin | Is a Core 2 Duo 1.8GHz fater than a Dual Core Pentium D @ 2.8? |
| 14:31.45 | cpufreak | Depends on what you're doing. |
| 14:31.53 | goibhniu | Erwin: I dunno ... I've only been looking at notebooks |
| 14:31.56 | cpufreak | but generally, yes. |
| 14:32.16 | cpufreak | as a netburst architecture pentium only really works well above 3.4ghz |
| 14:34.13 | gadgerama | hi all, had to nip out |
| 14:34.54 | Erwin | Oh well, I should probably wait until this PC is at least 3 years old before upgrading; there are limits to how many frames per second xemacs can do :-) |
| 14:38.32 | Erwin | Huh, there's apparently now a replacement of SCSI around, called SAS; this computer provider claims a 3ms seek time on the 36G SAS ahrddisk |
| 14:38.59 | goibhniu | I gather asus are the cream of notebooks these days |
| 14:39.40 | Erwin | Has IBM lost its place after being Lenovoed? |
| 14:40.35 | goibhniu | I heard they've gone to shite |
| 14:41.46 | morsing | Erwin: How's that unusual? And SCSI/SAS has nothing to do with how fast a disk is... (still) |
| 14:47.03 | morsing | I'm not in a good mood today... |
| 14:47.39 | goibhniu | morsing: coffee? |
| 14:51.59 | morsing | goibhniu: Oh thanks. That would make me feel better I think |
| 14:54.45 | rhowe | Chances of SlayerXP making the switch to gobolinux? http://gobolinux.org/index.php?page=at_a_glance |
| 14:58.00 | morsing | goibhniu: :) |
| 15:01.15 | goibhniu | rhowe: that's genius! ... except I wish you could just add that feature to an existing distro |
| 15:08.58 | *** join/#gllug catalyst (n=catalyst@allegro/user/angelchild) |
| 15:09.48 | morsing | catalyst! |
| 15:10.08 | catalyst | morsing! |
| 15:21.49 | CopeUK | lo |
| 15:22.26 | CopeUK | z00dax? |
| 15:22.55 | *** join/#gllug gethoper (n=gethoper@203.249.98.168) |
| 15:23.03 | morsing | gethoper! |
| 15:24.23 | iTron | You scared him away! |
| 15:24.33 | morsing | :( |
| 15:29.55 | *** join/#gllug gethoper (n=gethoper@203.249.98.168) |
| 15:30.01 | morsing | gethoper! |
| 16:39.33 | goibhniu | what's more frustrating than having everything you need except some stupid cable ... argghhh! |
| 16:40.24 | goibhniu | I'll bet it's listed as a form of torture under the Geneva convention |
| 16:41.40 | Leeds | morning all |
| 16:42.14 | iTron | Leeds: Greetings |
| 16:42.25 | *** join/#gllug Dick_Turpin (n=Dick_Tur@host217-34-163-21.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 16:43.48 | Leeds | morning Dickie |
| 16:44.21 | Dick_Turpin | Leeds: Goodnight |
| 16:44.29 | Leeds | yeah, that too |
| 16:44.59 | Dick_Turpin | Leeds: seriuosly its goodnight here |
| 16:45.25 | z00dax | CopeUK: ! |
| 16:45.56 | Leeds | Dick_Turpin: uh... it's 4pm, surely? |
| 16:46.04 | Leeds | well, getting on for 5 |
| 16:46.50 | Dick_Turpin | Leeds: but the boss is out so I'm gonna have a kip |
| 16:47.10 | CopeUK | z00dax! |
| 16:47.12 | Leeds | nice :-) |
| 16:50.17 | Dick_Turpin | Been conversing with some French guy who is a member of the NUI on the opensuse list not sure how he has got himself in the mess he has but he's had gangs gate-crash his meetings making threats and phoning his house. Can this M$/Novell stuff get any worse? |
| 16:52.00 | Leeds | NUI? |
| 16:52.36 | Dick_Turpin | Leeds: Yeah that caught me out as well I think its Novell Users International |
| 16:52.55 | z00dax | what ? both of them decided to create an association ? |
| 17:06.02 | Leeds | oh, and I got a (drunken and very provisional) offer of part-time bar work this evening :-) |
| 17:08.07 | cpufreak | anyone know anyone at Homechoice? |
| 17:08.13 | *** part/#gllug Dick_Turpin (n=Dick_Tur@host217-34-163-21.in-addr.btopenworld.com) |
| 17:09.14 | *** join/#gllug JohnDoe666 (n=JohnDoe6@82-69-10-95.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 17:27.43 | YoussefAssad | gah, all I'm getting from monster.co.uk is support gigs... |
| 17:31.46 | Leeds | 2% inflation. 14% growth, employment at 64-month high, stock market at all-time high... |
| 17:32.20 | Leeds | this has been the Hong Kong economic report - now, back to you in the studio |
| 17:37.15 | YoussefAssad | you have no clue how much I'd love to move back to HK... |
| 17:39.08 | rhowe | Leeds: Would you say you're attuned to reading job specs? |
| 17:39.42 | Leeds | YoussefAssad: what's stopping you? |
| 17:39.55 | Leeds | rhowe: uh, not enormously, but I'm happy to give it a go |
| 17:40.06 | rhowe | A new position has arisen to lead a team of consultants delivering Systems Engineering solutions for customers. Reporting directly to the Board, the Director of Systems will be expected to provide high calibre Systems Engineering expertise to identify and satisfy customer needs. He/she will have a broad remit to ensure business stream sustainability by developing the team, expanding its market presence and developing the capability. He/she will be required |
| 17:40.13 | rhowe | The successful candidate will have excellent business acumen and business development skills with a strong appreciation of systems engineering tools and techniques. He/she will hold a first degree in an appropriate technical discipline and have a minimum of five years experience of systems engineering, analysis or architecture design. Study to Master’s level in an appropriate discipline would be an advantage. |
| 17:40.43 | Leeds | whoa, flood :-) |
| 17:40.54 | YoussefAssad | Leeds: lots of things. My fiancée is one; she's Italian and doesn want to stray very far from her family |
| 17:41.04 | Leeds | ah, one of them |
| 17:41.21 | YoussefAssad | one of them, yes |
| 17:41.32 | Leeds | rhowe: first line truncated at "He/she will be required" |
| 17:42.29 | iTron | Job description translation : "We are a pile of wank. Do not work for us. Ever." |
| 17:42.41 | Leeds | rhowe: is it "Systems Engineering" or "systems engineering"? I'd try to find some better way to phrase "He/she"... "The successful candidate", maybe? |
| 17:42.47 | YoussefAssad | Erm, yea. That's broad enough to turn me off |
| 17:42.50 | Leeds | oh, wait, you used that one |
| 17:43.10 | Leeds | YoussefAssad: who turns you off - rhowe or iTron? |
| 17:43.21 | YoussefAssad | Leeds: the job description |
| 17:43.37 | Leeds | is it the sort of position you'd be after? |
| 17:43.56 | iTron | But, it doesn't even say what the job is for. |
| 17:44.05 | rhowe | "He/she will be required to meet business stream targets and contribute to the development of company-wide capability." |
| 17:44.32 | iTron | I stand by my translation. |
| 17:44.32 | Leeds | it's marketing bollocks, really |
| 17:44.40 | rhowe | Leeds: That's on the internal vacancies board :) |
| 17:44.45 | YoussefAssad | Leeds: It's precisely what I do, albeit on a regional microfinance level with middle eastern institutions. But yes, I can do that kind of thing and I've suffered through enough SoWs to see that one's too broad. Anyone reading that and coming in for an interview will be a good BS'er |
| 17:44.51 | rhowe | Different part of the group, fortunately |
| 17:45.40 | Leeds | ah, so not a new boss for you then, for when iTron drops you headfirst into the rubble ;-) |
| 17:45.56 | YoussefAssad | rhowe: It'd work better restated as bullets restricted to < 12 words per, arranged into sections (responsibilities|qualifications|etc.) |
| 17:46.14 | YoussefAssad | lord knows my SoW with the Gramen Foundation is a nightmare |
| 17:46.38 | Leeds | oh, you're with Gramen? |
| 17:46.42 | Leeds | cool... |
| 17:47.24 | YoussefAssad | mostly, yes :) Working as much as one does, no |
| 17:55.45 | trousers | Howdy |
| 18:11.17 | *** join/#gllug Gunde (n=spamyous@82.153.170.213) |
| 18:14.28 | macooo | hey leeds |
| 18:14.28 | macooo | did u get wii |
| 18:15.43 | YoussefAssad | :help python <--- very nifty indeed |
| 18:18.54 | Leeds | YoussefAssad: in vim? |
| 18:19.17 | YoussefAssad | yessir |
| 18:19.28 | Leeds | morning macooo - no, I didn't... I went and booked my bowling for the weekend (paid for 4 lanes for 2 hours for a group I've organised - going to go to 5 lanes, I think) then went out to meet friends |
| 18:19.41 | YoussefAssad | far preferable to vim scripting semantics |
| 18:19.43 | macooo | good |
| 18:19.57 | Leeds | why good? |
| 18:19.58 | macooo | u r having a nice day |
| 18:20.31 | macooo | leeds i saw ps3 in uk |
| 18:20.37 | Leeds | I had a pretty nothing day, then a very nice evening - saw a friend who I hadn't seen since I got back, because she's working days->evenings now, so isn't around to socialise |
| 18:20.40 | macooo | in one of the xe stores |
| 18:20.44 | Leeds | xe? |
| 18:20.50 | Leeds | oh, cex? |
| 18:20.58 | macooo | yes |
| 18:21.17 | macooo | its not for sale tough |
| 18:21.47 | macooo | the graphics are same as xbox 360 |
| 18:21.55 | Leeds | (you mean though, not tough) |
| 18:22.21 | Leeds | the *potential* graphics are much better, but nothing is really going to push it for a while |
| 18:22.22 | macooo | thats what the kids |
| 18:22.35 | macooo | saying around me |
| 18:22.48 | macooo | how is the weather in HK |
| 18:23.03 | macooo | today it is freezing out here |
| 18:23.27 | macooo | does any one here use usenet providers |
| 18:23.32 | Leeds | cool and wet with thunderstorms... when I say cool, it's forecast to fall below 20C, at night, later this week, for the first time since spring |
| 18:23.39 | Gunde | macooo: yes |
| 18:23.51 | Leeds | there was some very heavy rain while we were sitting in Bar George this evening... |
| 18:24.01 | Leeds | I use easynews for... entirely legal stuff... :-) |
| 18:24.25 | macooo | i am with newsdemon |
| 18:24.43 | macooo | they gave me 25% discount on unlimited plan |
| 18:24.54 | macooo | so 7.30£ per month |
| 18:25.15 | Gunde | macooo: news.individual.net 10 Euro/year |
| 18:25.36 | Leeds | I pay US$10 per month for 6GB, with unlimited rollover, and I use a lot less than that |
| 18:26.06 | macooo | they say 88+ retention but only 40+ |
| 18:26.09 | Leeds | Gunde: for binaries? |
| 18:26.17 | Gunde | Leeds: no binaries |
| 18:26.20 | macooo | i dont think so |
| 18:26.37 | macooo | giga news is too exp. |
| 18:27.37 | Leeds | I've got along very well with easynews... good web interface, nice quick tubes, good retention AFAICT |
| 18:28.06 | macooo | i just saw news.individual.net (no binaries) |
| 18:28.07 | *** join/#gllug eyore (n=eeyore@84-43-28-203.ppp.onetel.net.uk) |
| 18:28.39 | Leeds | I'm sorry... that's 20GB per month, not 6GB |
| 18:29.37 | macooo | 20GB for $9.98 |
| 18:29.52 | Leeds | yes, but with unlimited rollover |
| 18:30.56 | macooo | leeds do u download movies ? |
| 18:31.05 | trousers | Okay, I just got a new USB device, I don't think there are any drivers for Linux, but I can see it as a USB device, where should I start for getting it to work? |
| 18:31.41 | Leeds | macooo: sometimes... not often, and not from easynews |
| 18:31.48 | Leeds | trousers: what sort of device? |
| 18:32.16 | trousers | I think it's a chip + pin reader, USB |
| 18:32.20 | trousers | I found the website for it |
| 18:32.40 | trousers | Model: ActivCard SRR200 -- made by Activcard |
| 18:33.03 | Leeds | hmm... well, start by getting the USB id for it... should tell you the class of device, I think, and/or the vendor |
| 18:34.47 | trousers | As in: "Bus 002 Device 002: ID 04e6:1001 SCM Microsystems, Inc. |
| 18:34.50 | trousers | ? |
| 18:34.58 | Leeds | yes |
| 18:36.30 | trousers | Leeds: Can I do anything with the Windows driver, like is there an NDISwrapper equivalent for USB? |
| 18:38.08 | Leeds | ugh, don't think like that |
| 18:38.33 | trousers | Why not? I've found some Windows drivers... |
| 18:39.23 | *** join/#gllug catalyst (n=catalyst@allegro/user/angelchild) |
| 18:39.52 | Leeds | ugh... just.. ugh |
| 18:40.14 | trousers | Well, is there any way I can monitor the USB bus for data, per chance? |
| 18:40.17 | *** join/#gllug porkypunk (n=david@ip-89-168-14-35.cust.homechoice.net) |
| 18:41.00 | Leeds | yes, there is software to do that |
| 18:43.07 | trousers | Called? |
| 18:44.46 | Leeds | uh... probably usbmon(itor) or usbspy or something along those lines |
| 18:46.50 | macooo | leeds any chance u r coming to uk before christmas |
| 18:46.58 | Leeds | macooo: very unlikely |
| 18:47.35 | Leeds | unless someone wants to pay for my flight :-) |
| 18:47.37 | macooo | i heard LG released a 5 mega pixel camera in HK |
| 18:47.55 | macooo | *phone |
| 18:47.58 | Leeds | ah |
| 18:48.29 | macooo | expected to hit UK after christmas or before |
| 18:50.04 | porkypunk | are there places in london where someone can swap skills. for example, i have a problem getting my airport extreme card to work with ubuntu that no amount of howtos seem to help (my limited knowledge is such that i can't troubleshoot when things go wrong), and i could swap help for that with design help. That sort of thing? |
| 18:50.11 | porkypunk | or am I living in a fantasy world? :) |
| 18:51.28 | Leeds | porkypunk: you could do worse than bring it to a gllug meeting |
| 18:53.13 | porkypunk | wouldn't that be a bit presumptuous though? |
| 18:53.45 | porkypunk | and if I turned up witha mac laptop, wouldn't I get stoned? ;) |
| 18:53.57 | macooo | porkypunk |
| 18:53.58 | Leeds | why? if it's running ubuntu, it's 'on-topic' |
| 18:54.18 | macooo | i heard about a website from UK |
| 18:54.22 | macooo | SKILL SWAP |
| 18:54.53 | Leeds | I've never heard of anything like that - and helping people with Linux is the point of gllug |
| 18:55.31 | macooo | i think leeds is right |
| 18:55.56 | macooo | i saw a site in metro on skill swap |
| 18:56.03 | macooo | but forgot |
| 18:56.29 | Leeds | anyway, I'm really going to sleep now... almost 3am... g'night all |
| 18:56.36 | trousers | Leeds: Okay, what can I do? Just Google the device type? |
| 18:56.40 | porkypunk | goodnight, and thanks leeds |
| 18:56.40 | trousers | Okay, g'night |
| 18:57.09 | Leeds | trousers: I assume you've read everything you can on the Linux USB site? |
| 18:57.32 | trousers | Leeds: I'll check it out, cheers |
| 18:57.50 | Leeds | you should have started there... really really *gone* |
| 18:58.55 | macooo | catch u later leeds |
| 19:04.54 | morsing | Leeds! |
| 19:10.02 | macooo | hi morsing |
| 19:14.33 | morsing | macooo! |
| 19:14.38 | morsing | Are you mozrat? |
| 19:15.30 | *** join/#gllug xotl (n=yaa@82-35-62-79.cable.ubr04.camd.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 19:16.42 | macooo | no |
| 19:18.05 | morsing | xotl! |
| 19:18.18 | xotl | good evening |
| 19:23.30 | *** part/#gllug porkypunk (n=david@ip-89-168-14-35.cust.homechoice.net) |
| 19:26.34 | morsing | How much is 4000 gauss? |
| 19:26.47 | morsing | No stupid replies please |
| 19:26.53 | wethrin | Um. |
| 19:27.47 | wethrin | 0.4 Tesla |
| 19:29.22 | wethrin | Why? |
| 19:30.30 | morsing | wethrin: Meaning? |
| 19:30.44 | morsing | Can it make a pidgeon go wrong? |
| 19:31.12 | trousers | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_%28unit%29 |
| 19:31.15 | wethrin | It's a unit of magnetic flux. |
| 19:31.30 | xotl | you mean fly in the wrong direction? |
| 19:31.34 | morsing | Yes |
| 19:31.38 | wethrin | Unlikely |
| 19:32.35 | xotl | wethrin: what is the gauss level generally experienced by pigeons? |
| 19:32.54 | wethrin | I dont' know |
| 19:33.07 | wethrin | What's the Earths' magnetic field? |
| 19:33.15 | xotl | how do you know that 4000 is not enough to put it off then |
| 19:34.34 | xotl | 0.3 gauss |
| 19:34.56 | xotl | apparently |
| 19:35.19 | trousers | morsing: Are you trying to confuse pigeons in some sicks experiment? :P |
| 19:35.33 | trousers | s/cks/ck/ |
| 19:35.48 | wethrin | I never said I nkow or not. Just said unlikely |
| 19:36.19 | morsing | trousers: Would it confuse wethrin enough to make him go off beer? |
| 19:37.22 | xotl | well if its normally 0.3 i imagine it is quite likely |
| 19:38.11 | wethrin | morNah |
| 19:38.26 | trousers | Can somebody help me out with this USB device? |
| 19:39.08 | xotl | wethrin: what gauss level would it take to put you off beer? |
| 19:39.19 | trousers | xotl: Something lethal, I'd expect ;) |
| 19:39.42 | morsing | No - I was just wondering about this: |
| 19:39.43 | morsing | http://www.presentsdirect.com/go/Product_1000616.html?categoryId=509 |
| 19:39.47 | morsing | Don't ask why |
| 19:40.29 | trousers | "# A modern neodymium-iron-boron (NIB) rare earth magnet has a strength of about 1.25 T. A coin-sized neodymium magnet can lift more than 20 pounds, and can pinch skin and erase credit cards." |
| 19:40.54 | trousers | So that's ~3x the strength of that bracelet |
| 19:41.29 | xotl | the bracelet has each bead with 4000 gauss |
| 19:41.40 | xotl | i dont know if they add up or not |
| 19:41.53 | trousers | xotl: I don't know, either |
| 19:42.08 | trousers | I would expect so, but the field won't be that big |
| 19:42.26 | xotl | wethrin you're an engineer aren't you? |
| 19:42.34 | wethrin | I deny everything! |
| 19:42.38 | morsing | A beer drinking engineer |
| 19:43.00 | wethrin | In Soviet Russia, beer drinks you! |
| 19:43.11 | morsing | Soviet rules |
| 19:43.28 | xotl | In Soviet Russia, beer is flavoured with thallium |
| 19:43.37 | trousers | Holy crap! |
| 19:43.52 | trousers | But seriously, any help with the USB reader? |
| 19:44.11 | wethrin | Card reader? Plug it in, plug a card in, it should work |
| 19:44.47 | wethrin | The fields wouldn't just add up. There'd be interference |
| 19:45.15 | wethrin | Anyway, you get strong magnetic fieldws in lots of physics labs, and in NMR macscanners |
| 19:45.18 | morsing | So not 128x4000? |
| 19:45.21 | trousers | wethrin: This is a spart card? |
| 19:45.26 | morsing | spart? |
| 19:45.31 | trousers | s/sp/sm/ |
| 19:46.12 | wethrin | Oh, dunno |
| 19:46.40 | trousers | I can see the usb device in lsusb, but I can't seem to detect it anywhere else |
| 19:46.56 | wethrin | morsing: Unlikely. EM is always a very strange subject |
| 19:47.33 | trousers | wethrin: Why wouldn't there be any cumulative effect, and doesn't that mean that the size of a magnet means nothing? |
| 19:48.01 | *** join/#gllug Provito (n=Provito@80-193-56-44.cable.ubr06.enfi.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 19:48.08 | morsing | Provito! |
| 19:48.11 | trousers | And why does more coils on a solenoid cause a higher gauss reading? |
| 19:48.18 | wethrin | trousers: No, but it depends on the interference of the field |
| 19:48.43 | trousers | s/es// |
| 19:49.19 | xotl | it must depend on the relative location of the magnets as well |
| 19:50.40 | trousers | Okay, Wethrin, from searching my internets, it seems this is the only device with this USB code |
| 19:50.44 | trousers | "04E6:1001=ActivCard SCR301 USB Smart Card Reader" |
| 19:57.06 | morsing | THE TOMATO! |
| 19:57.10 | morsing | *sigh* |
| 20:17.09 | trousers | Somebody? Help? |
| 20:19.07 | morsing | trousers? |
| 20:19.16 | trousers | morsing: Yes? |
| 20:20.45 | *** join/#gllug trousers_laptop (n=trousers@82-43-176-23.cable.ubr06.newm.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 20:22.39 | morsing | trousers! |
| 20:22.48 | morsing | What do you need help with? |
| 20:23.12 | trousers_laptop | This bitch of a USB smart card reader |
| 20:23.19 | trousers | "04E6:1001=ActivCard SCR301 USB Smart Card Reader" |
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| 20:37.31 | *** part/#gllug david_edmundson (n=david@82-43-56-32.cable.ubr04.croy.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 20:37.38 | morsing | Nice |
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| 23:25.51 | floo | good evening chaps |
| 23:26.54 | wethrin | ahoy there |
| 23:33.24 | floo | You're up late |
| 23:34.31 | wethrin | Not really. I'm not that young! |
| 23:34.43 | wethrin | I'm also watching Sunday's Torchwood |
| 23:42.34 | rhowe | bad bad bad webcoder |
| 23:44.55 | wethrin | What've they done to you? |
| 23:45.26 | rhowe | see the ML |
| 23:50.13 | wethrin | Oh. Not read that for a little bit of time |
| 23:51.37 | xotl | rhowe: the file download thing? |
| 23:52.01 | rhowe | xotl: *nod& |
| 23:52.51 | xotl | which bit? |
| 23:53.08 | psnl | wethrin: does torchwood still suck? |
| 23:55.32 | wethrin | This one's pretty good |
| 23:57.39 | psnl | scary |
| 23:58.15 | wethrin | :) |
