irclog2html for #gllug on 20060421

`00:48.49`	`rhowe`	`heh, http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/04/20/420_conspiracy/`
`00:48.55`	`rhowe`	`~wtf wtktc`
`01:42.30`	`*** join/#gllug Leeds (n=richardc@202.82.163.139)`
`06:57.14`	`Leeds`	`and... I'm thrashing to death`
`06:59.46`	`morsing`	`Mmm... Fight`
`07:00.24`	`morsing`	`'morning`
`07:02.00`	`*** join/#gllug SlayerXP (n=Tram@ti521110a080-10216.bb.online.no)`
`07:21.42`	`Cope`	`@)`
`07:22.16`	`morsing`	`Cope!`
`07:22.31`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP!`
`07:25.09`	`morsing`	`Anyone use JBOSS?`
`07:25.31`	`Cope`	`don't know much about it though`
`07:26.15`	`mozrat`	`morning`
`07:26.21`	`Cope`	`hello mozrat`
`07:26.25`	`mozrat`	`hi cope`
`07:26.38`	`morsing`	`Apparently it is much much more efficient than WebLogic`
`07:26.45`	`morsing`	`mozrat!`
`07:26.58`	`mozrat`	`hey morsing!`
`07:27.07`	`morsing`	`mozrat: JBoss?`
`07:27.08`	`Cope`	`morsing: i've heard good things about it`
`07:27.25`	`mozrat`	`morsing: I know how to spell it - thats about it`
`07:27.25`	`morsing`	`Cope: Umm... So what does it actually do?`
`07:27.41`	`mozrat`	`Cope, can you op me please`
`07:27.45`	`morsing`	`mozrat: I wasn't even sure about that`
`07:28.04`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: fo sup, ma nizzle?`
`07:28.22`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: There's a guy on Tek-Tips called mbrooks`
`07:28.35`	`SlayerXP`	`not me, I assure you.`
`07:28.48`	`Cope`	`mozrat: ok - 2 tics, just getting coffee`
`07:28.56`	`morsing`	`He's on the Linux, Apache, Perl and a few other of your interests`
`07:29.26`	`SlayerXP`	`perhaps he's my lost lost evil twin`
`07:30.07`	`mozrat`	`"Use Red Hat!!"`
`07:30.21`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: Here's is website even:`
`07:30.27`	`morsing`	`http://mbrooks.info`
`07:30.38`	`morsing`	`Could be you!`
`07:30.40`	`SlayerXP`	`very.... informative.`
`07:31.01`	`SlayerXP`	`nice html`
`07:31.25`	`Leeds`	`JBoss, aka RedHat Java Application Server`
`07:31.30`	`*** mode/#gllug [+o mozrat] by ChanServ`
`07:31.46`	`mozrat`	`Thank you magic chanop fairly`
`07:31.51`	`mozrat`	`fairy**`
`07:32.26`	`SlayerXP`	`this is n+ot a subliminal suggestion +or anything +of that nature at all`
`07:32.35`	`Leeds`	`fnord?`
`07:32.52`	`murb`	`Leeds: didn't you leave a car in oxfnord?`
`07:33.07`	`Leeds`	`it made it back to London, under someone else's power`
`07:33.40`	`*** topic/#gllug by mozrat -> Greater London LUG - Next event TOMORROW!! (Be there!!) (22nd April @ 1330), Westminster Uni: Shane Coughlan (FSFE) and Charles Sibbald (Asterisk PBX Manager) \| http://www.gllug.org.uk and http://planet.gllug.org.uk. Channel stats at http://silenceisdefeat.org/~mozrat/gllug`
`07:33.53`	`*** mode/#gllug [-o mozrat] by mozrat`
`07:34.42`	`morsing`	`mozrat: Who's going?`
`07:34.46`	`Leeds`	`someone's phone just played Auld Lang Syne`
`07:34.53`	`mozrat`	`morsing: you, me, wethrun`
`07:35.03`	`mozrat`	`not George as he is a archery loving girl`
`07:35.21`	`SlayerXP`	`kill them, burn the body and throw throw the ashes into the nearest large body of water`
`07:35.32`	`SlayerXP`	`we'll cover for you, and say it was George who dunnit`
`07:35.34`	`Cope`	`mozrat: going where?`
`07:35.37`	`mozrat`	`Not SlayerXP or Leeds due to some pathetic reason about not being in this country`
`07:35.47`	`mozrat`	`Cope: I'm organising the GLLUG meet on Sat`
`07:35.50`	`Cope`	`yes!`
`07:35.58`	`Cope`	`and you are being pingged`
`07:36.18`	`mozrat`	`I can see you!!`
`07:36.28`	`mozrat`	`maybe I need to register with chanserv - one sec`
`07:40.18`	`morsing`	`mozrat: wethrun isn''t coming`
`07:40.36`	`Cope`	`slacker`
`07:40.39`	`mozrat`	`morsing: k`
`07:40.50`	`morsing`	`mozrat: I'm not going eithetr`
`07:40.52`	`morsing`	`:(`
`07:40.56`	`mozrat`	`k`
`07:41.03`	`morsing`	`Cope isn't going either`
`07:41.06`	`Cope`	`he is`
`07:41.08`	`Cope`	`:)`
`07:41.09`	`mozrat`	`k :( :(`
`07:41.12`	`morsing`	`:)`
`07:41.13`	`Cope`	`with william!`
`07:41.16`	`morsing`	`Eh?!`
`07:41.20`	`morsing`	`Are you serious?`
`07:41.24`	`Cope`	`yes`
`07:41.30`	`morsing`	`God, I have to go now`
`07:41.31`	`mozrat`	`yay`
`07:41.45`	`morsing`	`Hmm... Is he coming to the pub as well?`
`07:41.49`	`mozrat`	`note to self. Invite more toddlers to GLLUG to raise attendance`
`07:43.07`	`SlayerXP`	`george already attends, no?`
`07:43.28`	`mozrat`	`SlayerXP: :)`
`07:43.42`	`murb`	`mozrat: william was in the pub before now!`
`07:44.21`	`SlayerXP`	`On 20/04/06, Steve Kennedy <steve-uknot@gbnet.net> wrote:`
`07:44.21`	`SlayerXP`	`> > OK, installed FC5 from scratch ...`
`07:44.21`	`SlayerXP`	`That's your first mistake.`
`07:44.28`	`mozrat`	`Does the Green Man allow children away from the bar?`
`07:44.41`	`Cope`	`mozrat: no, they must stay at the bar`
`07:44.48`	`morsing`	`murb: Send me the film clip of me on the chair lift!`
`07:45.28`	`mozrat`	`Cope: lol!`
`07:45.33`	`murb`	`morsing: I've not dowloaded my photos yet`
`07:50.48`	`morsing`	`ibot wake wethrin`
`07:50.53`	`ibot`	`wethrin: GOOD MORNING!!!`
`07:51.16`	`morsing`	`Cope: If I wanted to spend a day rebuilding my Exonetric server how would I go about that?`
`07:58.23`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: just one day? or more?`
`07:58.33`	`SlayerXP`	`start with gentoo and you could be there all week`
`08:01.19`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: I'm talking about access and being monitored by Mark Blackman, not the actual build process`
`08:02.00`	`morsing`	`Cope: I assume Mark would have to be present and I don't know how happy he would be about spending a day at Telehouse`
`08:03.51`	`Cope`	`morsing: i'd ask him :) See what he says!`
`08:07.42`	`mozrat`	`rather spiffing beard picture from Tuesday night >> http://beerandspeech.org/uploads/200602/beardsunite.JPG`
`08:08.05`	`SlayerXP`	`good old jono`
`08:08.14`	`morsing`	`Mmm... beard`
`08:08.38`	`SlayerXP`	`he and I did the first ever linux expo in london together under the guise of linuxuk.co.uk`
`08:09.05`	`morsing`	`mozrat: I sent the photo to David and Robin`
`08:09.06`	`Leeds`	`okay, I'm getting used to tabs in vim very quickly :-)`
`08:09.16`	`morsing`	`Vim has tabs?`
`08:09.37`	`mozrat`	`morsing: who and who?`
`08:11.00`	`Leeds`	`morsing: vim7 does`
`08:11.02`	`Cope`	`Leeds: gvim?`
`08:11.30`	`Leeds`	`and console vim`
`08:13.25`	`MacRohard`	`insanity`
`08:13.32`	`Leeds`	`everybody should give money to the Ugandan children`
`08:13.35`	`mozrat`	`tallpaul: ping`
`08:15.09`	`MacRohard`	`Leeds, so they can import mass manufactured chinese trinkets?`
`08:16.04`	`morsing`	`mozrat: Two guys working and Camelot`
`08:16.15`	`Leeds`	`MacRohard: uh, no... are you not aware of vim's license?`
`08:16.24`	`mozrat`	`morsing: are they brothers in the bearded fraternity?`
`08:17.33`	`MacRohard`	`Leeds, ahh. i wasn't.`
`08:17.59`	`Leeds`	`MacRohard: well, you should be... and if you've been using vim for any significant period of time, you owe back donations`
`08:26.55`	`mozrat`	`Interesting ImageMagick problem. On my Bytemark server I have /tmp mounted on a RAM disk and it is 38MB in size which is their default setup`
`08:27.33`	`mozrat`	`when I create a thumbnail from a 1.1Mb image ImageMagick writes a huge file >38Mb to /tmp and fills it up`
`08:27.43`	`mozrat`	`should resize generate temp files that big?`
`08:28.41`	`Leeds`	`I shouldn't think so`
`08:28.59`	`mozrat`	`me either - it happens every time`
`08:30.36`	`morsing`	`mozrat: Not really. David grew a sponsored beard for charity though but Robin is not allowed to grow one for his wife`
`08:32.16`	`SlayerXP`	`mozrat: 1.1mb in what format?`
`08:32.23`	`mozrat`	`JPG`
`08:32.39`	`SlayerXP`	`jpeg data is typically compressed 10:1`
`08:33.45`	`SlayerXP`	`why's your /tmp so small?`
`08:33.58`	`mozrat`	`SlayerXP: that is how Bytemark gave me the server`
`08:34.03`	`morsing`	`What's the cheapest mobile phone deal to go for?`
`08:34.12`	`mozrat`	`never really caused an issue before, but I think I'll change it now`
`08:34.21`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: the "no calls" plan is the cheapest`
`08:34.49`	`Cope`	`morsing: i'd go for the "buy a cheap old phone with no sim card"`
`08:34.54`	`SlayerXP`	`if you keep your mobile switched off at all time, or, better still, don't own one, it'll be completely free.`
`08:35.23`	`SlayerXP`	`i only use my mobile when out and about`
`08:35.34`	`Cope`	`omfg`
`08:35.38`	`Leeds`	`for the first time, today, I saw someone ask for a contact number or a skype address`
`08:35.44`	`Cope`	`you use your mobile phone when you are mobile?`
`08:35.49`	`Cope`	`shock! horror!`
`08:35.54`	`SlayerXP`	`Cope: it's a odd concept I know`
`08:36.13`	`Leeds`	`I have two landlines in Hong Kong - home and work - and I don't know either number`
`08:36.15`	`SlayerXP`	`skype's ace`
`08:36.37`	`Leeds`	`SlayerXP: I require interoperability from my network protocols`
`08:36.46`	`Cope`	`wonder if it is more popular in scandinavia`
`08:36.53`	`SlayerXP`	`i require stuff that just works`
`08:36.56`	`Cope`	`:)`
`08:37.06`	`SlayerXP`	`and stuff that can handle NATs`
`08:37.19`	`SlayerXP`	`you download skype, you install it _and it works_`
`08:37.19`	`Leeds`	`SlayerXP: you're remarkably amoral for a Debian zealot`
`08:37.31`	`Cope`	`Leeds: you misunderstand`
`08:37.45`	`Cope`	`SlayerXP uses Debian because it is currently the best "just works" solution`
`08:37.54`	`morsing`	`Ok, I do have a phone`
`08:38.03`	`Cope`	`if a better solution appeared he would use that instead`
`08:38.09`	`SlayerXP`	`correct.`
`08:38.14`	`Cope`	`he is the ultimate pragmatist`
`08:38.18`	`morsing`	`My new company apparently doesn't allow me to use my company phone for personal calls`
`08:38.21`	`Cope`	`i share his view`
`08:38.23`	`Leeds`	`Cope: that's what I meant`
`08:38.37`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: easy to get round, ban them from using your personal phone for company calls`
`08:38.41`	`morsing`	`So I need a sim card which is cheap even with a decent amount of calls/texts`
`08:38.58`	`Leeds`	`ibot change 200 hkd to gbp`
`08:39.02`	`morsing`	`Hello?`
`08:39.12`	`morsing`	`Does anyone here own a mobile phone?`
`08:39.19`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: I own one, but barely use it`
`08:39.30`	`Leeds`	`morsing: I pay approximately that much a month on a no-fixed-term contract for unmetered GPRS and about 500 minutes a month of voice`
`08:39.31`	`Cope`	`but my work pays for it, including persoal calls`
`08:39.39`	`SlayerXP`	`i use an online PAYG provider, which is cheap enough`
`08:39.47`	`SlayerXP`	`50gbp of credit lasts me 2-3 months`
`08:39.48`	`Cope`	`SlayerXP: good idea`
`08:40.18`	`Leeds`	`I have never gone over my monthly pre-pay level`
`08:40.22`	`SlayerXP`	`http://www.noextras.no`
`08:40.32`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: PAYG is way too expensive`
`08:40.45`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: it works out cheaoer than a contract for me`
`08:40.46`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: PAYG costs me about �20/week`
`08:41.02`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: I use skype for virtually all calls`
`08:41.16`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: From your mobile phone?`
`08:41.21`	`SlayerXP`	`an hour on the phone to the states cost me about 25 pence the other week`
`08:41.32`	`morsing`	`Good for you`
`08:41.42`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: i have a carry round bluetooth handset`
`08:42.13`	`SlayerXP`	`my workstation is permanently switched on anyway, so it just works`
`08:42.49`	`Leeds`	`I pay about 4p per minute to the UK or US from my mobile...`
`08:43.16`	`SlayerXP`	`le'ts have a looksee...`
`08:44.25`	`SlayerXP`	`Apr 18 12:37 +441619319070 United Kingdom �0,017 10:01 �0,187`
`08:44.40`	`SlayerXP`	`ibot change 0.187EUR to GBP`
`08:44.53`	`SlayerXP`	`ibot change 0.187 EUR to GBP`
`08:45.08`	`SlayerXP`	`so 13 pence for a 10 minute call`
`08:45.24`	`SlayerXP`	`from norway to england`
`08:45.50`	`Leeds`	`that's almost a local call - I'm talking intercontinental`
`08:46.44`	`morsing`	`You're not helping`
`08:46.44`	`SlayerXP`	`Leeds: make no odds, skype is bloody cheap`
`08:46.44`	`SlayerXP`	`and free if you're calling another skype user`
`08:46.45`	`SlayerXP`	`i even have my mum using skype`
`08:46.54`	`Leeds`	`SlayerXP: but does it work when you're not at home?`
`08:47.01`	`Cope`	`ibot scale=2`
`08:47.09`	`Cope`	`ibot change 0.187 EUR to GBP`
`08:47.14`	`SlayerXP`	`Leeds: i have my mobile for that`
`08:47.18`	`Cope`	`grr`
`08:47.30`	`Leeds`	`SlayerXP: and how much would that call cost on your mobile?`
`08:47.42`	`SlayerXP`	`I don't know, I wouldn't make it`
`08:48.26`	`SlayerXP`	`if i'm travelling and working, then I have my laptop with me. which has skype installed.`
`08:48.28`	`Leeds`	`I have no doubt that Skype is cheaper than my mobile, but it lacks one very very important feature`
`08:48.45`	`SlayerXP`	`i just find the nearest wireless lan and call that way`
`08:49.10`	`Leeds`	`my mobile works on the tube...`
`08:49.27`	`*** join/#gllug janvb (i=jan@vanbergen.demon.co.uk)`
`08:49.35`	`Leeds`	`janvb!`
`08:49.38`	`SlayerXP`	`which I did last week, i had a very productive meeting whilst sitting at copenhagen airport, involving a norwegian, an american and me.`
`08:49.42`	`janvb`	`morning all`
`08:49.52`	`SlayerXP`	`none of whom were in their own country`
`08:50.39`	`Leeds`	`SlayerXP: if you were to tell me you had a handheld skype phone which could use authentication-required wifi networks, I'd be impressed... but lugging a laptop around to make cheap phone calls is nothing special`
`08:51.02`	`SlayerXP`	`no, I have a laptop with me when working`
`08:51.26`	`SlayerXP`	`the fact I can then use the laptop to save me cash when mobile working abroad is a big plus`
`08:51.39`	`janvb`	`got a sip client on my mobile. is that good enough? ;)`
`08:52.05`	`murb`	`Leeds: wpa auth doesn't require a captive portal or anything like that.`
`08:52.28`	`Leeds`	`murb: I meant one which needs you to login to a http(s) portal of some sort`
`08:52.46`	`murb`	`Leeds: that is what i mean.`
`08:52.47`	`Leeds`	`janvb: that is quite impressive... what mobile?`
`08:52.57`	`murb`	`Leeds: there are other authentcation methods that paying customers can use`
`08:53.07`	`Leeds`	`murb: but not ad-hoc ones`
`08:53.08`	`janvb`	`connecting to the internet via wifi ;)`
`08:53.30`	`murb`	`Leeds: the time of hotspots you find at airports tend to support enterprise authenticatino.`
`08:53.39`	`janvb`	`not available for sale yet though :(`
`08:54.21`	`Leeds`	`murb: really?`
`08:54.29`	`Leeds`	`janvb: any clues? manufacturer? OS?`
`08:54.32`	`murb`	`there is now a chan_skype thing for asterisk but it costs money.`
`08:54.46`	`murb`	`Leeds: yep, i've been working at Fraport this week playing with stuff like that in a lab.`
`08:55.33`	`Leeds`	`mmm... butterscotch :-)`
`08:56.28`	`janvb`	`leeds: it's nokia e70 hw, but sw is not what would go into the shop`
`08:58.04`	`Leeds`	`pity I tend to avoid nokia on principle`
`08:58.35`	`janvb`	`leeds: ok, may i ask why?`
`08:58.50`	`Leeds`	`various reasons - some purely pig-headed...`
`08:58.52`	`murb`	`scandiwegian company?`
`08:59.18`	`Leeds`	`I have no particular problem with Nokia as a company`
`08:59.48`	`Leeds`	`there are a couple of things they've done which disgust me - particularly their part in creating the ringtone market and the replacement faceplate market`
`09:00.27`	`janvb`	`both things i just completely ignore :)`
`09:00.31`	`Leeds`	`I don't like the fact that they seem(ed?) to tend to avoid standards until others had done the work to popularise them - things like bluetooth come to mind`
`09:00.50`	`Leeds`	`they extended mobile java in non-standard ways`
`09:00.55`	`Leeds`	`oh, and the logo market`
`09:01.05`	`janvb`	`something i never understood, why pay to have a ring tone send to you when you can just install any mp3 on your phone and use it as a ringtone?`
`09:01.30`	`Leeds`	`that's my entire point - Nokia were at best complicit and and worse an active participant in creating that problem`
`09:01.47`	`Leeds`	`http://www.shakykaiser.com/blog/archives/2006/04/21/happy-birthday-maam/ - her Maj smiling at her birthday cards :-)`
`09:02.17`	`mozrat`	`Good old queeny`
`09:02.38`	`Leeds`	`I just generally haven't had a technology-friendly, standards-friendly, innovative vibe from Nokia`
`09:02.53`	`Leeds`	`and I like technology, standards and innovation`
`09:03.09`	`janvb`	`fair enough`
`09:03.22`	`SlayerXP`	`Leeds: so you're a big MS fan, then?`
`09:03.35`	`Leeds`	`janvb: I know you are in the industry - I don't know how close to Nokia you are, if at all`
`09:03.53`	`SlayerXP`	`as the old syaing goes "the best thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from"`
`09:04.12`	`Leeds`	`oh, and finally, the fact that the 770 seems to have been launched so softly and so American-only annoys me, because I'll probably want to buy one when I see it :-)`
`09:04.44`	`janvb`	`leeds: they don't pay my wages, if that is what you're asking. But yes I do work closely with them`
`09:05.05`	`Leeds`	`yes, that was what I was asking :-)`
`09:05.14`	`Leeds`	`are my points unfair?`
`09:05.19`	`wethrin`	`hello`
`09:05.26`	`Leeds`	`evening wethrin`
`09:05.28`	`janvb`	`not really`
`09:06.01`	`Leeds`	`for the record, I went through 4 (Sony) Ericsson phones in a row and I'm now very happy with a Treo 650`
`09:06.02`	`janvb`	`and anyway, if that is how you feel, then I am not going to try to convince you otehrwise ;)`
`09:06.24`	`Leeds`	`I would be very interested to hear your thoughts on the matter, since you obviously know more about this stuff than I do :-)`
`09:06.26`	`janvb`	`never used a treo`
`09:06.56`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Can you answer my question from earlier?`
`09:07.23`	`wethrin`	`Can you repeat it?`
`09:07.54`	`morsing`	`I'm too lazy`
`09:08.07`	`wethrin`	`there's too much scrollback`
`09:08.16`	`wethrin`	`give me a timestamp?`
`09:08.46`	`SlayerXP`	`<morsing> Cope: If I wanted to spend a day rebuilding my Exonetric server how would I go about that?`
`09:08.52`	`SlayerXP`	`oh, not that one`
`09:08.53`	`SlayerXP`	`sorry`
`09:09.11`	`SlayerXP`	`wethrin in "is not cope" shocker`
`09:09.37`	`wethrin`	`heh :)`
`09:09.43`	`Leeds`	`SlayerXP: one lives in an ivory tower, one most decidedly does not`
`09:09.53`	`wethrin`	`He didn't target any question at me, though`
`09:10.04`	`wethrin`	`Otherwise it'd be in my away log`
`09:25.40`	`rhowe`	`morsing: Surely a dead badger is more efficient than WebLogic? (never having used WebLogic...)`
`09:29.07`	`morsing`	`wethrin!`
`09:29.27`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Backward search for Mark blackman`
`09:29.32`	`SlayerXP`	`weblogic is utterly annoying`
`09:29.43`	`SlayerXP`	`and fearfully expensive, also`
`09:30.03`	`morsing`	`rhowe: FOAD`
`09:30.40`	`wethrin`	`Ahh`
`09:30.49`	`wethrin`	`Don't you have a serial console on your machine?`
`09:30.54`	`wethrin`	`What does rebuilding it actually involve?`
`09:31.11`	`morsing`	`wethrin: 09:02`
`09:31.25`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Does it matter?`
`09:31.42`	`wethrin`	`Yes - if you can do it over serial console, it'll be easier`
`09:31.58`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Well, I would need to go there twice at least`
`09:32.24`	`morsing`	`OR actually, I could use syslinux`
`09:32.28`	`wethrin`	`I'm sure he'll manage that if you ask nicely.`
`09:32.32`	`morsing`	`Boot from a floppy image`
`09:32.41`	`morsing`	`Or is that only DOS?`
`09:33.01`	`wethrin`	`don't think so`
`09:33.17`	`morsing`	`syslinux can boot a Linux boot floppy fro DOS`
`09:33.21`	`wethrin`	`Ahhh`
`09:33.36`	`wethrin`	`Time for me to head into work. Back in 20 or so!`
`09:33.52`	`morsing`	`Anyway, remote installing a server...`
`09:34.19`	`murb`	`morsing: oyou are thinking of loadlin?`
`09:34.29`	`morsing`	`murb: Ahh... yes - thankyou`
`09:34.51`	`Leeds`	`loadlin???`
`09:35.02`	`morsing`	`murb: So, what would I need to do to remote install a Debian server?`
`09:35.15`	`morsing`	`Not having BIOS access`
`09:35.26`	`murb`	`what access do you have?`
`09:35.36`	`Leeds`	`hometime!`
`09:35.53`	`morsing`	`murb: Serial console`
`09:36.08`	`z00dax`	`morsing, you could always install CentOS over vnc`
`09:36.28`	`morsing`	`z00dax: No thanks. No GUIs.`
`09:36.36`	`morsing`	`I want Debian`
`09:36.38`	`z00dax`	`morsing, at your end ?`
`09:36.45`	`morsing`	`z00dax: Indeed`
`09:36.49`	`z00dax`	`you dont need to install X at the remote end`
`09:36.56`	`morsing`	`Is Ubuntu a good server OS?`
`09:37.05`	`Leeds`	`morsing: ask SlayerXP`
`09:37.06`	`morsing`	`z00dax: No but I'd need VNC`
`09:37.12`	`z00dax`	`well. you can always use a kickstart - or do the install over ssh`
`09:37.19`	`z00dax`	`or over a serial link to another machine`
`09:37.28`	`z00dax`	`or even over fscking telnet to the installer`
`09:37.37`	`Leeds`	`you can telnet to the installer?`
`09:37.43`	`z00dax`	`Leeds, yea`
`09:37.48`	`morsing`	`Ok, First step first. I reboot and the system needs to pickup a boot image from somewhere!`
`09:37.55`	`SlayerXP`	`z00dax: just the chap. I need you to move your MX records`
`09:37.59`	`z00dax`	`its disabled by default. needs specific user input to enable it`
`09:38.05`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: Ubuntu?`
`09:38.08`	`z00dax`	`SlayerXP,`
`09:38.20`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: wet fairies?`
`09:38.35`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: Ubuntu is that good huh?`
`09:38.50`	`morsing`	`z00dax: So where would it pick up a boot image?`
`09:38.55`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: see list for my recent thoughts on ubuntu`
`09:39.35`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: I try to avoid your posts`
`09:39.48`	`z00dax`	`morsing, do you have anything on the machine at the moment ?`
`09:40.20`	`murb`	`morsing: does the machine netboot?`
`09:40.47`	`morsing`	`murb: Yes, but I haven't got BIOS access and I can't remember what it's set to`
`09:41.03`	`SlayerXP`	`z00dax: the node here is norway won't be around for much longer. I'll need to move you to london.`
`09:41.06`	`morsing`	`It should netboot if there are no other methods available`
`09:41.07`	`SlayerXP`	`here in`
`09:41.26`	`z00dax`	`SlayerXP, ok - that reminds me to re-ping $user about that`
`09:41.32`	`z00dax`	`SlayerXP, give me an hours time`
`09:41.41`	`SlayerXP`	`z00dax: no hurry.`
`09:41.58`	`morsing`	`Ubuntu and it's`
`09:41.58`	`morsing`	`army of offshoots and clones have already made themselves incompatible`
`09:41.59`	`morsing`	`with mainstream Debian yet the users wonder why we can't help.`
`09:42.23`	`George`	`meh`
`09:42.35`	`morsing`	`moo`
`09:42.40`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: well said!`
`09:42.46`	`SlayerXP`	`i wish I'd thought of that...`
`09:42.53`	`morsing`	`Ok, I need to wonder over to my server and plug in a floppy then!`
`09:43.22`	`Leeds`	`by the way, everyone should read Tim O'Reilly's analysis of the current state of the tech book market... three parts posted, more to come next week...`
`09:43.24`	`Leeds`	`http://radar.oreilly.com/tag/books`
`09:43.28`	`morsing`	`Leeds: What do you think of the Treo then? And what can it do?`
`09:43.36`	`Leeds`	`Treo++`
`09:43.48`	`morsing`	`Does it have ssh?`
`09:44.00`	`morsing`	`3G? GPRS?`
`09:44.14`	`Leeds`	`it's a general-purpose computer with decent CPU power, storage and battery, slightly limited in I/O, and in my case unmetered GPRS, which is slow but steady networking`
`09:44.43`	`Leeds`	`it does have ssh, yes`
`09:44.43`	`z00dax`	`morsing, can you boot a 2.6 kernel from FDD ?`
`09:45.17`	`morsing`	`z00dax: Yes, with help from LILO (F****** Linux developers!)`
`09:45.35`	`morsing`	`Leeds: But all this only works with GPRS?`
`09:46.02`	`morsing`	`Leeds: Can I use my webmail on it?`
`09:46.04`	`Leeds`	`in the past couple of weeks, I've been using a third-party bluetooth a2dp driver to listen to music - and even streaming radio - on stereo bluetooth headphones... the fact that it's open enough to use a third-party driver like that is interesting`
`09:46.04`	`murb`	`morsing: is it already booted into linux or windows?`
`09:46.21`	`Leeds`	`I only have GPRS... apparently it has EDGE support, but there's no UMTS`
`09:46.40`	`Leeds`	`the web browser is decent... squirrelmail is usable under it, and the gmail mobile interface works fine`
`09:46.49`	`morsing`	`murb: Linux`
`09:47.00`	`z00dax`	`morsing, just use the pxeimages to boot into the installer then`
`09:47.02`	`morsing`	`Leeds: Price?`
`09:47.10`	`z00dax`	`use the bootloader already on the machine : morsing`
`09:47.12`	`morsing`	`z00dax: With?`
`09:47.24`	`z00dax`	`whatever is on the machine at the moment ?`
`09:47.31`	`morsing`	`Huh?`
`09:47.44`	`z00dax`	`if you already have access to the machine, dont you also have access to the bootloader config's ?`
`09:47.45`	`morsing`	`So 'pxeboot /boot/pxeimage'`
`09:47.49`	`z00dax`	`no`
`09:48.11`	`morsing`	`z00dax: But PXE booting requires a server on the network`
`09:48.17`	`z00dax`	`if you have grub on there, setup a new loader block, set that to be the default and point it at the pxe-kernel and initrd`
`09:48.29`	`z00dax`	`morsing, the pxe images are just raw images that the bootloader can load locally too`
`09:48.52`	`morsing`	`z00dax: But I need it to but a Debian installer`
`09:48.59`	`morsing`	`s/but/boot/`
`09:49.20`	`z00dax`	`and debian cant do pxe boot'ed installs ?`
`09:49.40`	`Cope`	`of course it can`
`09:49.42`	`George`	`meh, screw this, I'm going to bed`
`09:50.02`	`z00dax`	`just use those pxe images locally and get your local hdd bootloader to get them running`
`09:50.09`	`z00dax`	`morsing, let me get you a link`
`09:50.25`	`morsing`	`z00dax: It can, if there is a server`
`09:50.51`	`z00dax`	`morsing, you'r missing the point. and i am not being able to explain well - let me get you a url`
`09:51.10`	`SlayerXP`	`z00dax: can you mail me with a reminder of which domains you have and where the mail needs to go to, please? I think I have the complete list but I don't want to leave a domain stranded by mistake.`
`09:51.12`	`z00dax`	`http://www.karan.org/blog/index.php/2005/06/15/p35`
`09:51.36`	`z00dax`	`morsing, take a look at that - ignore the vnc bit, but can you see how grub is being used locally to boot pxe images ?`
`09:51.40`	`mozrat`	`Grrr, everytime the Royal Family has a birth, death, marriage, divorce or BIRTHDAY my internet bandwidth suffers`
`09:51.54`	`mozrat`	`www.royal.gov.uk is downstairs in the serverroom`
`09:52.07`	`z00dax`	`I moved about 150 debian servers over to CentOS last year in November at a datacenter in Australia using this method - didnt loose even a single. start to finish was a 8 hr job.`
`09:54.33`	`George`	`mozrat: FIX MY UTF8`
`09:55.25`	`Cope`	`10:51 < z00dax> http://www.karan.org/blog/index.php/2005/06/15/p35`
`09:55.49`	`morsing`	`z00dax: Sorry I don't see the relevance of the PXE image. Any image can do that and unlike the PXE image the Debian boot floppy can install Debian :)`
`09:56.04`	`George`	`for some strange reason nothing in X11 will display UTF8`
`09:56.33`	`Cope`	`morsing: what are you talking about?`
`09:56.44`	`z00dax`	`morsing, ok - but my point was that if you already have something running on the machine, you should not need to install a FDD or use an external boot mecanism`
`09:57.02`	`z00dax`	`s/mecanism/mechanism/`
`09:57.25`	`*** join/#gllug janvb (i=jan@vanbergen.demon.co.uk)`
`09:57.33`	`morsing`	`janvb!`
`09:57.40`	`morsing`	`z00dax: Ok, point taken`
`09:58.06`	`janvb`	`hiya`
`10:00.33`	`morsing`	`BTW: Can I install Debian Xen over the Internet?`
`10:00.57`	`morsing`	`I suppose it's just a basic Debian install and then load the Xen stuff`
`10:01.02`	`wethrin`	`George: Don't use UTF8`
`10:01.26`	`George`	`wethrin: I don't`
`10:01.28`	`George`	`wethrin: it's horrible`
`10:01.34`	`George`	`wethrin: but it would be nice to have it working`
`10:03.15`	`wethrin`	`Why? Just shout at people to use an ISO set :)`
`10:03.53`	`George`	`wethrin: indeed, but I frequent a chinese IRC chan and they all type chinese chars... I can't read it but it would be nice to have it visible :P`
`10:04.03`	`George`	`wethrin: http://vm.gwright.org.uk/utf8.png`
`10:04.52`	`morsing`	`How much GPRS data would you tpically use on a Treo?`
`10:07.04`	`z00dax`	`morsing, right - you just install a bare debian install, boot there, then setup the Xen stuff, including the Xen kernel`
`10:10.14`	`George`	`UNICODE SUCKS`
`10:10.20`	`George`	`it really, REALLY, suks`
`10:10.39`	`mozrat`	`wethrin: No, just a happy coincidence`
`10:10.53`	`wethrin`	`:-)`
`10:11.35`	`George`	`wethrin: stop imitating mjg59`
`10:12.05`	`wethrin`	`I'm not imitating him!`
`10:12.31`	`wethrin`	`This is purely my own style (maybe with a bit of influence from other people on IRC, some other blogs. But not mjg's)`
`10:12.41`	`wethrin`	`I guess I just have a similar writing style to him`
`10:13.11`	`mozrat`	`I've completely fallen off of planet.gllug.org.uk`
`10:14.24`	`murb`	`morsing: should be trivial to install if you already have debian there.`
`10:15.33`	`morsing`	`HUH?!?!?!?!`
`10:15.58`	`morsing`	`In by other bash screen window if I type <TAB> it says WOOFF - WOOFF`
`10:16.09`	`morsing`	`I can't use TAB-completion`
`10:17.52`	`wethrin`	`Woof-woof is screen's default bell`
`10:18.11`	`morsing`	`'k, what's the name of that disk partitioniing tool?`
`10:18.37`	`z00dax`	`parted ?`
`10:18.57`	`wethrin`	`fdisk`
`10:19.00`	`morsing`	`Found it - fdisk`
`10:19.13`	`z00dax`	`is this an i386 machine you're installing on ?`
`10:19.18`	`morsing`	`Yes`
`10:19.36`	`z00dax`	`ah! why was i thinking ppc ? .... n/m`
`10:19.49`	`morsing`	`Can I shrink a logical partition on a running system?`
`10:20.38`	`*** join/#gllug stephanb2 (n=chatzill@64.236.9.165)`
`10:20.59`	`morsing`	`stephanb2: Can I shrink a logical partition on a running system?`
`10:21.29`	`wethrin`	`z00dax: Because he likes AIX`
`10:24.47`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Everyone who knows AIX likes it`
`10:25.52`	`rhowe`	`For small values of 'everyone'`
`10:26.18`	`wethrin`	`:)`
`10:27.59`	`mozrat`	`Gah, one of hte debian mirrors has set a maximum file transfer size smaller than the size of the DVD ISO`
`10:29.01`	`morsing`	`rhowe: That goes for any value of 'everyone'`
`10:29.25`	`morsing`	`rhowe: How much GPRS data should I purchase with my Treo 650?`
`10:29.45`	`rhowe`	`morsing: Will I be allowed to play with it?`
`10:30.30`	`wethrin`	`mozrat: You should slap them`
`10:30.41`	`mozrat`	`It got to 91%`
`10:31.13`	`stephanb2`	`morsing: i would never touch a partition on a running system. linux rescue cd or DSL are perfectly suited for doing this kinda stuff`
`10:32.08`	`stephanb2`	`im sure there are webpages about this using knoppix \|\| gnoppix as well`
`10:32.10`	`morsing`	`stephanb2: I don't have access to the system`
`10:32.48`	`stephanb2`	`morsing: oic, u want to shrink a partition on a remote system, like through ssh ?`
`10:33.15`	`morsing`	`stephanb2: Yes`
`10:33.31`	`morsing`	`BUT it's a partition used by LVM :)`
`10:33.46`	`morsing`	`So I won't be shrinking any filesystems`
`10:34.09`	`stephanb2`	`i have no experience with lvm, i hava hunch it can be done and that it is in fact the purpose of lvm to b able to do it`
`10:35.46`	`stephanb2`	`however i don't know if it can be done on a "live" system`
`10:35.48`	`stephanb2`	`sorry`
`10:38.37`	`rhowe`	`You can resize the LV, but if you're shrinking it to be smaller than the filesystem expects, you'll be wanting to shrink the fs first`
`10:40.58`	`murb`	`rhowe: have you played with the ext2 onlineresizing?`
`10:41.27`	`Cope`	`woo rhowe`
`10:41.31`	`*** join/#gllug JAV (n=JAV@105.Red-80-34-40.staticIP.rima-tde.net)`
`10:41.35`	`rhowe`	`murb: Nope. I don't think the 2.4.27 kernel we run has support`
`10:41.43`	`rhowe`	`heya Steve`
`10:41.50`	`JAV`	`good morning`
`10:41.53`	`rhowe`	`Cope: I guess you're unlikely to be at Gllug?`
`10:41.58`	`Cope`	`rhowe: incorrect`
`10:42.06`	`Cope`	`rhowe: William and I will be present.`
`10:42.57`	`rhowe`	`Cope: Good. You can take part in Jia's survey (although perhaps not William)`
`10:44.52`	`Cope`	`what is the survey about?`
`10:47.07`	`mozrat`	`why can I not download the Debian DVD from 2 different sources? http://pastebin.com/673029`
`10:47.49`	`wethrin`	`Grrrrr. My hands still smell of ethanol`
`10:58.01`	`stephanb2`	`has anybody here played with openwengo ?`
`10:58.23`	`wethrin`	`no, but I have the t-shirt`
`11:08.26`	`*** join/#gllug yzenez1 (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`11:12.11`	`mozrat`	`ahhhhH!`
`11:12.19`	`mozrat`	`Maximum filesize on FAT?`
`11:12.22`	`mozrat`	`2GB?`
`11:13.27`	`z00dax`	`whats a real man like you doing using a fat filesystem ?`
`11:13.59`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: We have a 500GB USB disk in the office, I was trying to be considerate to my Windows afflicted colleagues`
`11:14.05`	`mozrat`	`screw them, I'm formatting it`
`11:14.40`	`z00dax`	`ntfs ?`
`11:15.18`	`mozrat`	`ext3`
`11:15.20`	`mozrat`	`:)`
`11:18.18`	`rhowe`	`jffs2 :)`
`11:23.32`	`*** join/#gllug yzenez1 (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`11:27.23`	`*** part/#gllug yzenez1 (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`11:31.46`	`Cope`	`ufs`
`11:32.05`	`Cope`	`vxsf`
`11:32.50`	`z00dax`	`ufs i know about - what is vxsf ... /me googles`
`11:33.19`	`z00dax`	`lol. Veritas... ok, that too i know about`
`11:36.51`	`mozrat`	`for a USB disk ext3 is fine`
`11:37.12`	`z00dax`	`with lvm2 under it ?`
`11:37.52`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: No! I'm keeping it simple!`
`11:38.05`	`*** join/#gllug yzenezy (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`11:38.08`	`mozrat`	`wethrin: that was my thinking but then I got the >2GB file size problem`
`11:38.19`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, break it up into 518MB partitions - so msdos can see it too then`
`11:38.23`	`wethrin`	`boh`
`11:40.03`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: No! I'm keeping it simple!`
`11:40.17`	`z00dax`	`oh ok then, have it your way`
`11:43.22`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Tell me an interesting story about me`
`11:44.48`	`morsing`	`ibot wake wethrin`
`11:44.49`	`ibot`	`wethrin: GOOD MORNING!!!`
`11:45.31`	`wethrin`	`About you?`
`11:45.38`	`morsing`	`Yes`
`11:46.00`	`wethrin`	`Umm`
`11:46.12`	`wethrin`	`Surely you should know more interesting stories?`
`11:46.26`	`morsing`	`wethrin: I don't. I'm extremely boring`
`11:47.49`	`morsing`	`wethrin?`
`11:47.58`	`morsing`	`mozrat?`
`11:48.25`	`mozrat`	`hello`
`11:48.45`	`morsing`	`mozrat: Tell me an interesting story about me`
`11:48.55`	`mozrat`	`clears throat`
`11:49.01`	`wethrin`	`Bah. You're not!`
`11:49.05`	`wethrin`	`You drink beer well!`
`11:49.14`	`mozrat`	`"Once upon a time in a land far far away there was a little goat called Henrik. The end"`
`11:49.37`	`wethrin`	`It's a mini adventure!`
`11:50.27`	`morsing`	`Hmm... What do I do then?`
`11:51.01`	`wethrin`	`You're not writing another CV, are you?`
`11:51.03`	`mozrat`	`Nothing much, it is an extremely boring goat`
`11:51.11`	`wethrin`	`Ahh`
`11:51.12`	`morsing`	`What happened to Leeds?`
`11:51.18`	`wethrin`	`He went home?`
`11:51.24`	`morsing`	`wethrin: No - just need an interesting story`
`11:51.42`	`wethrin`	`Ahh. Maybe something about when we were all in Copenhagen?`
`11:51.42`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Tell him about screen(TM)`
`11:51.49`	`morsing`	`wethrin: Hmm...`
`11:51.49`	`wethrin`	`screen++`
`11:51.58`	`morsing`	`Nothing interesting really happened?`
`11:52.22`	`morsing`	`God I hate this kind of thing.`
`11:52.47`	`morsing`	`Why can I just start a job and so work instead of all that psycho crap`
`11:52.53`	`morsing`	`s/so/do/`
`11:56.35`	`wethrin`	`Oh, you're doing that bollocks?`
`11:56.56`	`morsing`	`Yes`
`11:57.00`	`wethrin`	`I hate that`
`11:57.04`	`wethrin`	`Just make something up`
`11:57.11`	`mozrat`	`morsing: tell them the goat story. You'll get a week off for stress`
`11:57.28`	`morsing`	`Hmm...`
`11:57.49`	`morsing`	`Maybe I could tell them the stripper story from Camelot`
`11:57.59`	`wethrin`	`yeah!`
`11:58.02`	`wethrin`	`Make them worry!`
`11:58.12`	`wethrin`	`Beery lunch time!`
`12:03.41`	`morsing`	`Ahh... Maybe I could compile a short list of things that made me 'famous' at my last job`
`12:10.44`	`*** join/#gllug janvb (i=jan@vanbergen.demon.co.uk)`
`12:25.57`	`mozrat`	`morsing: like resigning?`
`12:26.25`	`*** join/#gllug cbz (i=chriseb@vortex.ukshells.co.uk)`
`12:27.57`	`mozrat`	`http://jonobacon.org/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=3493&g2_serialNumber=1`
`12:28.40`	`mozrat`	`Who can we name from left to right`
`12:28.45`	`mozrat`	`2. agk`
`12:28.50`	`mozrat`	`3. Steve Goodwin`
`12:28.56`	`mozrat`	`4. Me`
`12:29.09`	`mozrat`	`5. with his hand up, Ted Haeger`
`12:29.26`	`mozrat`	`10. Paul (ldnblk)`
`12:34.08`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, for the gllug pic gallery - i have a pic of me, in a suit, with rob ( of debianplanet.org fame ) blowing bubbles at someone's wedding...`
`12:34.27`	`mozrat`	`Cool - send it over`
`12:34.46`	`z00dax`	`i wonder if that would be appropriate`
`12:35.11`	`mozrat`	`Looking at the standard set so far I'm worried it is too tasteful`
`12:36.48`	`z00dax`	`hehehe, this needs some Gimp love...`
`12:40.16`	`z00dax`	`what size do we need ?`
`12:40.22`	`mozrat`	`300x*`
`12:42.43`	`George`	`fuck I just slept through lunch`
`12:43.15`	`cbz`	`Skip a meal, it's good for you.`
`12:46.49`	`mozrat`	`George could skip a month of eating and still be OK`
`12:46.58`	`George`	`..`
`12:49.27`	`cbz`	`Sounds like a good way to end up with diabetes.`
`12:50.11`	`*** join/#gllug mikejw (n=mikejw@81-179-87-13.dsl.pipex.com)`
`12:50.17`	`mozrat`	`hey mikejw`
`12:51.50`	`mikejw`	`mozrat: lo :)`
`12:52.11`	`George`	`mozrat: I dislike you`
`12:52.11`	`mikejw`	`#gllug: yo!`
`12:52.57`	`mozrat`	`George: c'mon, you don't really mean that`
`12:53.08`	`George`	`mozrat: yes I do`
`12:53.58`	`George`	`Cope: WHAT THE FUCK`
`12:54.58`	`George`	`mikejw: will we have intarweb on saturday? :P`
`12:55.35`	`mozrat`	`George: you asking me or mikejw ?`
`12:55.49`	`mikejw`	`wifi intarweb?`
`12:55.59`	`George`	`mikejw: wifi`
`12:56.03`	`mikejw`	`not sure, probs`
`12:56.14`	`George`	`ah cool`
`12:56.18`	`mozrat`	`mikejw: what are you up to on Sat??`
`12:57.07`	`mikejw`	`mozrat: also not sure :S`
`12:57.24`	`mozrat`	`mikejw: are you studying in wmin?`
`12:57.35`	`mikejw`	`I'm supposed to be`
`12:57.45`	`mozrat`	`ah, right. I didn't know that`
`12:57.54`	`mikejw`	`:)`
`12:59.59`	`Cope`	`George: homophobe`
`13:00.15`	`George`	`Cope: I'm an Harrovian. What do you expect?`
`13:00.22`	`Cope`	`George: much better`
`13:00.53`	`mikejw`	`I've been struck with infected tonsils for the past few months :(`
`13:00.59`	`Cope`	`George: I would expect you to carry KY or vaseline as a matter of course. Not to do so is the height of discourtesy.`
`13:01.56`	`mozrat`	`mikejw: bad luck`
`13:02.14`	`mikejw`	`it's a bummer`
`13:02.55`	`*** join/#gllug murb (n=murbix@blue.danu.be)`
`13:04.53`	`George`	`Cope: shut up or I'll unleash Alex on you.`
`13:05.38`	`George`	`school has given me permission to go to GLLUG tomorrow`
`13:08.54`	`mozrat`	`yay`
`13:08.55`	`murb`	`please sir can i go and drink beer in london?`
`13:09.28`	`z00dax`	`i need some help`
`13:09.32`	`murb`	`mozrat: well look on the bright side George is arrested for being drunk maybe the school won't let him go again?`
`13:09.48`	`mozrat`	`murb: :)`
`13:09.56`	`z00dax`	`an email was just delivered to me, and i need to reply ( feel the need to reply rather ), and i need some help from fellow glluger's`
`13:09.59`	`mozrat`	`George: I'm glad you are coming. My offer of a lemonade still stands`
`13:10.05`	`George`	`OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH 750GB DISK DRIVES`
`13:10.19`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: same situation here actually!`
`13:10.24`	`z00dax`	`gligamiga submitted the following Information:`
`13:10.24`	`z00dax`	`Email gorangligoric@hotmail.com`
`13:10.25`	`z00dax`	`Location London UK`
`13:10.25`	`z00dax`	`Comments`
`13:10.25`	`z00dax`	`Dear Sir or Madam`
`13:10.27`	`z00dax`	`I am new user for Centos, I put Login Root than password is ok but is coming somthing else`
`13:10.29`	`z00dax`	`<PROTECTED>`
`13:10.32`	`z00dax`	`please help me thanks`
`13:10.34`	`z00dax`	`( sorry about the flood )`
`13:10.37`	`mozrat`	`Someone just sent me a very offensive attachment - mugshot.jpg`
`13:10.51`	`z00dax`	`heh :)`
`13:11.30`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: reply with the following`
`13:11.44`	`mozrat`	`"You should type in the following command..."`
`13:11.58`	`mozrat`	`"find /usr/share/doc/ -type f \| xarg cat \| less"`
`13:12.04`	`mozrat`	`and start reading. When finished come back`
`13:13.03`	`mozrat`	`but seriously the first time I installed Linux I finished the install and had no idea what to type at the prompt`
`13:13.07`	`mozrat`	`a most deflating moment`
`13:13.24`	`mikejw`	`"my name is moles"`
`13:13.40`	`z00dax`	`i'd tell him to init 5, but he prolly didnt install X, or it would have gone there anyway`
`13:14.41`	`George`	`http://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.asp?sku=317167`
`13:14.45`	`George`	`I need one of those :D`
`13:15.56`	`z00dax`	`if i ask this guy to come down to the meet on Sat, George would you give him a 20 min intro to linux talk ?`
`13:16.09`	`George`	`z00dax: aren't you going to be there?`
`13:16.52`	`z00dax`	`George, i lack the art of eloquent speech, you seem to have perfected`
`13:16.57`	`George`	`??`
`13:17.19`	`z00dax`	`you have a nice soothing voice...`
`13:17.22`	`George`	`no I don't`
`13:17.25`	`George`	`I have a grating voice`
`13:17.41`	`z00dax`	`just the thing required for the job`
`13:17.53`	`z00dax`	`should i tell him to come look for you at the meet ?`
`13:18.01`	`George`	`maybe`
`13:18.36`	`z00dax`	`or i'll tell him to reinstall with the GUI bits selected this time...`
`13:19.15`	`George`	`mozrat should help`
`13:19.17`	`George`	`not me`
`13:19.54`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: I'll help if he needs but I'm not staying all that long after the meeting`
`13:19.59`	`mozrat`	`I can give him an hour or so`
`13:20.23`	`z00dax`	`what time does the meet get over ?`
`13:20.52`	`mozrat`	`I'm downloading ISOs for the meet tomorrow - I have FC5, Debian, Ubuntu, OpenSUSE. I know you are all bandwidth rich but for the guys who come tomorrow - what else might they want?`
`13:21.38`	`George`	`Gentoo`
`13:22.04`	`z00dax`	`ooohhh... humm.. I'll try and get a DVD worth of stuff that needs to go upstream .. mozrat any chances of that making it upwords ?`
`13:22.12`	`z00dax`	`( to a remote FTP site.. )`
`13:22.16`	`mozrat`	`sure`
`13:22.22`	`z00dax`	`over the next week or so, whenever you get the time`
`13:22.24`	`mozrat`	`wait until after the queens birthday though :)`
`13:22.30`	`mozrat`	`bandwidth sucks today`
`13:23.01`	`mozrat`	`If my director looks at my bandwidth stats today he'll have a fit - I've done about 20GB`
`13:23.09`	`George`	`mozrat: is everyone in your office downloading queen porn or something?`
`13:23.15`	`mozrat`	`George: ??`
`13:31.57`	`z00dax`	`there is that XGL demo CD as well - not sure what its called, but might be handy`
`13:32.05`	`mozrat`	`ah yes`
`13:32.10`	`mozrat`	`and looking glass`
`13:32.24`	`z00dax`	`i am sure there would be a fair few people interested - since not everyone's distro has xgl and rebuilding from scratch - X isnt the most 'trivial' of tricks`
`13:32.45`	`z00dax`	`will we have some network'ability ? maybe a switch and some cables ?`
`13:33.04`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: I'm thinking of bringing some cisco phones and asterisk@home`
`13:33.25`	`z00dax`	`which reminds me, i need to get the asterisk@home installer done in another 2 weeks time`
`13:34.41`	`z00dax`	`how are you going to handout the iso's ?`
`13:34.52`	`*** part/#gllug yzenezy (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`13:35.29`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: I have a built in CD burner on my thinkpad`
`13:35.35`	`mozrat`	`DVDs - not too sure yet`
`13:35.51`	`z00dax`	`i have a dvd-rw in my laptop`
`13:36.19`	`mozrat`	`excellent`
`13:36.31`	`mozrat`	`I was trying to get one today but couldn't`
`13:36.32`	`z00dax`	`who has the media ?`
`13:36.35`	`mozrat`	`me`
`13:36.40`	`z00dax`	`awrite`
`13:36.51`	`mozrat`	`I'll ask ppl for 50p a DVD just to cover buying some more`
`13:36.59`	`z00dax`	`i have a 25 but dvd-rw media pack, but that burns at 4x, we might get 1 done in the entire afternoon`
`13:37.15`	`z00dax`	`s/but d/pack d/`
`13:37.31`	`mozrat`	`I don't really want to burn them if people just want it for the sake of having it. Liek the guy who might say give me one of each`
`13:37.53`	`mozrat`	`but for people who live on dialup or ldnblk who lives out of internet cafes it is a good thing to do`
`13:39.58`	`z00dax`	`i look fat and yellow`
`13:40.19`	`mozrat`	`heh`
`13:40.54`	`z00dax`	`that is btw, the first and only published picture of me on the internet - ever.`
`13:41.15`	`mozrat`	`well - you are setting a fairly low standard from the "go" then`
`13:41.27`	`z00dax`	`I've made a fairly serious effort to stay off for some reason - not quite sure what that reason was anymore...`
`13:41.53`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, thats it... start low and gradually taper off..`
`13:41.57`	`mozrat`	`eek - no guarantee of any internet access tomorrow`
`13:42.05`	`mozrat`	`they are having a maintainance day`
`13:42.12`	`mozrat`	`it may or may not be available`
`13:45.41`	`morsing`	`Mmm... stripper and beer`
`13:45.50`	`*** join/#gllug yzenezy (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`13:45.56`	`morsing`	`yzenezy!`
`14:03.47`	`mozrat`	`what do you fine people use to burn DVDs apart from k3b?`
`14:06.13`	`boudiccas`	`mozrat; either a blowtorch or a lighter`
`14:06.52`	`mozrat`	`:)`
`14:09.33`	`morsing`	`mozrat: Fire`
`14:10.10`	`mozrat`	`:\|`
`14:10.23`	`morsing`	`mozrat: I normally use cdrecord`
`14:10.29`	`mozrat`	`:(`
`14:10.33`	`morsing`	`or burncd which supports IDE`
`14:10.39`	`mozrat`	`:\|`
`14:10.44`	`morsing`	`burncd rocks`
`14:10.46`	`mozrat`	`:)`
`14:10.48`	`morsing`	`mozrat: Why?`
`14:10.56`	`mozrat`	`a full range of emotions there`
`14:10.59`	`morsing`	`Oh... DVD`
`14:11.13`	`mozrat`	`morsing: k3b doesn't support my DVD burner. Or maybe Linux in general doesn't`
`14:11.14`	`morsing`	`No, shrinkisofs I think supports DVDs`
`14:11.23`	`morsing`	`mozrat: BSD!`
`14:12.00`	`mozrat`	`Not going to throw out my OS on the basis I can't burn DVDs.. not yet anyway`
`14:12.08`	`morsing`	`Xen?`
`14:12.20`	`mozrat`	`No, Linux should be able to do it`
`14:12.28`	`morsing`	`But Linux sucks`
`14:12.32`	`morsing`	`AIX can do it`
`14:15.27`	`wethrin`	`:)`
`14:30.25`	`janvb`	`i'm going home. done enough for one day ;)`
`14:30.41`	`mozrat`	`enjoy the weekend`
`14:31.08`	`janvb`	`mozrat: will do. you have a good time too`
`14:37.33`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, what burner is it ? and does k3b not use growisofs ?`
`14:38.22`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: it is a Samsung SE-W164C and there isn't a lot on Google or the k3b mailing list`
`14:38.36`	`mozrat`	`it detects it fine, but always says there is no media in the drive`
`14:39.40`	`z00dax`	`I've not come across a IDE sort of dvd-rw that wasent supported anymore`
`14:39.53`	`mozrat`	`it is USB`
`14:40.02`	`mozrat`	`I totally ignored your good advice to get an internal one :)`
`14:40.06`	`z00dax`	`gah! ok, pass in that case. i have no idea`
`14:40.13`	`mozrat`	`:)`
`14:40.26`	`mozrat`	`I have literally nothing to plug an IDE interface into`
`14:41.17`	`z00dax`	`not even the Mac ?`
`14:41.30`	`mozrat`	`It's an eMac`
`14:41.52`	`z00dax`	`that should have an ide port :) open the back cover, leave the drive hanging out - will still work`
`14:41.57`	`mozrat`	`heh`
`14:42.32`	`z00dax`	`I have a dell poweredge that i sit on in my machine room at home.`
`14:42.47`	`z00dax`	`no place for a chair, and i had to keep this thing running as well...`
`14:43.59`	`mozrat`	`loo`
`14:44.00`	`mozrat`	`lol`
`14:44.09`	`mozrat`	`very overpowered chair`
`14:44.37`	`z00dax`	`http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?p=917047 <-- anything of interest there`
`14:45.35`	`z00dax`	`nevermind`
`14:45.50`	`mozrat`	`I need to read up on the command line tools for DVD writing - I'm sure it should work if it new what media I had inserted`
`14:45.54`	`mozrat`	`GUIs suck`
`14:49.41`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, growisofs`
`14:50.11`	`boudiccas`	`thats what k3b uses`
`14:51.06`	`mozrat`	`I'll read about it on the way home and try and get it working tonight`
`14:52.05`	`z00dax`	`yum install dvd+rw-tools`
`14:52.16`	`z00dax`	`yes, i know package names with a + suck`
`14:52.22`	`mozrat`	`I have it installed - reading the /usr/share/doc/ thing now`
`14:53.16`	`mozrat`	`but seeing as both k3b and nautilus-burner have issues with this device I don't hold much hope ;(`
`14:53.30`	`z00dax`	`i think they both use growisofs`
`14:53.35`	`z00dax`	`try nero ?`
`14:53.43`	`mozrat`	`on Linux?`
`14:53.49`	`z00dax`	`jah!`
`14:53.52`	`mozrat`	`Hmm!`
`14:54.13`	`z00dax`	`I've not used it myself - but somone reported success with that the other day, iirc was for an external cd-rw`
`14:54.53`	`mozrat`	`thanks for the tip, I'll them both tonight`
`14:55.16`	`z00dax`	`:)`
`15:08.26`	`morsing`	`Moo`
`15:09.09`	`mozrat`	`ummm`
`15:09.14`	`mozrat`	`beefburgers`
`15:09.21`	`mozrat`	`that was a good slip of the fingers`
`15:09.23`	`wethrin`	`beer!`
`15:09.43`	`z00dax`	`finger memory!`
`15:12.56`	`morsing`	`digit`
`15:28.45`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: can you bring 2 cables tomorrow? about 5 metres?`
`15:31.39`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, sure`
`15:31.50`	`mozrat`	`thanks`
`15:35.39`	`stephanb2`	`is tmr's meeting at Cavendish Street, usual lecture hall + lab in the basement ?`
`15:36.07`	`mozrat`	`usual lecture hall - lab is uncertain, unlikely`
`15:36.24`	`mozrat`	`there are builders in that area of campus and it might be closed for Health and Safety reasons`
`15:36.40`	`stephanb2`	`ah no asterix demo with a couple of ekiga clients ?`
`15:37.03`	`cbz`	`gllug meeting tommorrow?`
`15:37.04`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: I'm planning a ad-hoc asterisk demo with a laptop running AAH and a couple of Cisco hard phones`
`15:37.13`	`mozrat`	`def. 2 phones, maybe 3`
`15:37.33`	`mozrat`	`ekiga will be fine if you have a laptop and LAN cable :)`
`15:37.39`	`stephanb2`	`mozrat: woaw a laptop, cisco phones and a hub ?`
`15:37.48`	`mozrat`	`yeah`
`15:38.02`	`mozrat`	`not looking forward to lugging that it`
`15:38.04`	`stephanb2`	`no i still havent bought a laptop to bring @ gllug meetings :-(`
`15:38.05`	`mozrat`	`but - fuck it`
`15:38.12`	`z00dax`	`I have a usb handset that i can get along - used to work with skype fine, it should work here as well.`
`15:38.21`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: well - I can run ekiga on my laptop anyway`
`15:38.29`	`mozrat`	`I'm going to run AAH inside VMware`
`15:38.37`	`stephanb2`	`mozrat: do u need headsets ?`
`15:38.41`	`mozrat`	`and bridge my ethernet - should work OK`
`15:38.52`	`stephanb2`	`mozrat: or even a linux compatible webcam ??`
`15:39.10`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: headset might be handy - webcam probably not so much so`
`15:39.37`	`mozrat`	`setting this up is going to come second to the talks - depends on time really, but I might have a lot of it setup before the meeting starts`
`15:39.42`	`stephanb2`	`mozrat: ill bring my headset then :-)`
`15:39.48`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: awesome :)`
`15:39.54`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: were you there on tuesday?`
`15:40.02`	`stephanb2`	`webcam is a pain 2 setup + u wud need 2 webcams`
`15:40.03`	`z00dax`	`mozrat, switch/hub ?`
`15:40.10`	`mozrat`	`z00dax: I have a small 8 port switch`
`15:40.21`	`stephanb2`	`mozrat: no wot was the lecture on tuesday ?`
`15:40.37`	`mozrat`	`http://gllug.ukfsn.org/index.php?/archives/12-REVIEW-Jono-Bacon-and-Ted-Haeger-speak-at-GLLUG.html`
`15:41.26`	`stephanb2`	`mozrat: oh should the URL not b changed on the header of the irc channel ?`
`15:42.01`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: we are going to repoint gllug.org.uk soon`
`15:42.07`	`stephanb2`	`oic`
`15:42.20`	`mozrat`	`just waiting for jason_ukfsn to show up somewhere where I can get him`
`15:42.52`	`mozrat`	`stephanb2: you are right in that it isn't very good to have this content under a unknown URL :/`
`16:05.33`	`George`	`mozrat: KORORAA`
`16:06.00`	`mozrat`	`is that an orange drink?`
`16:06.44`	`George`	`mozrat: xgl livecd based on gentoo`
`16:06.54`	`mozrat`	`I have the ISO on my portable hard disk`
`16:07.06`	`George`	`liar!`
`16:07.10`	`mozrat`	`what?`
`16:07.11`	`mozrat`	`I do`
`16:09.20`	`stephanb2`	`ok guys time 2 go home.`
`16:09.36`	`stephanb2`	`i should be there tmr with a headset and a digital camera`
`16:09.45`	`mozrat`	`good stuff -`
`16:10.36`	`stephanb2`	`bye now !`
`16:10.41`	`*** part/#gllug stephanb2 (n=chatzill@64.236.9.165)`
`16:22.17`	`*** join/#gllug Erwin (n=erwin@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/Erwin)`
`16:51.49`	`George`	`mozrat: stop cathing up`
`16:52.05`	`wethrin`	`mmm....booze`
`16:52.11`	`George`	`catching`
`16:52.35`	`George`	`I HATE MATHS`
`16:52.48`	`wethrin`	`Do Chemistry instead, then`
`16:52.56`	`George`	`no`
`16:52.59`	`George`	`I really hate chem`
`16:53.03`	`wethrin`	`Bah`
`16:53.03`	`George`	`and you can't do 3 A-levels in Chem`
`16:53.08`	`wethrin`	`Meh :)`
`16:53.38`	`George`	`well, 3.5 a-levels`
`17:05.50`	`*** join/#gllug pdr (n=pdr@pogo.pdr.me.uk)`
`17:06.06`	`wethrin`	`PDR!`
`17:09.54`	`George`	`WETHRIN`
`17:10.19`	`wethrin`	`Grg!`
`17:32.52`	`morsing`	`I'm back`
`17:34.23`	`wethrin`	`I'm not!`
`17:34.45`	`z00dax`	`i am off`
`17:35.13`	`wethrin`	`Aha. That was the smell :)`
`17:35.23`	`z00dax`	`hey~`
`17:35.24`	`pdr`	`wethrin!`
`17:35.27`	`z00dax`	`i am NOT gone yet`
`17:35.47`	`z00dax`	`i am now`
`17:40.05`	`*** part/#gllug yzenezy (n=trobinso@80.168.139.130)`
`17:44.48`	`*** join/#gllug stephanb2 (n=stef@88-109-115-60.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`17:45.56`	`George`	`z00dax: are you going to be there tomorrow then?`
`17:46.09`	`wethrin`	`I'm NOT!`
`17:46.13`	`wethrin`	`HA`
`17:46.20`	`wethrin`	`But I'm going home`
`17:49.50`	`George`	`you suck though`
`17:49.52`	`George`	`so I don't care`
`17:50.46`	`Cope`	`:)`
`17:51.07`	`George`	`Cope too`
`17:51.16`	`Cope`	`George nil`
`17:51.36`	`George`	`?`
`17:51.57`	`George`	`tard`
`17:53.31`	`murb`	`anyoen here tried Colinux recently?`
`17:57.47`	`George`	`i undderstand mozrat is involved with stanic worship`
`17:58.01`	`George`	`*satanic`
`18:00.33`	`murb`	`George: he worships slavs?`
`18:10.39`	`*** join/#gllug cup (n=alex@83.105.110.36)`
`18:12.10`	`morsing`	`ping SlayerXP`
`18:12.14`	`morsing`	`cup!`
`18:12.25`	`cup`	`evening`
`18:12.42`	`George`	`SAUCER!`
`18:37.37`	`SlayerXP`	`pong`
`18:38.37`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: speak.`
`18:56.48`	`*** part/#gllug cbz (i=chriseb@vortex.ukshells.co.uk)`
`19:00.29`	`*** part/#gllug stephanb2 (n=stef@88-109-115-60.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`19:14.57`	`mozrat`	`I'm burning away with my evil proprietary Nero software, thanks`
`19:16.39`	`wethrin`	`heh`
`19:27.55`	`mozrat`	`well, at least I know it works. Just need to get it working in k3b before the eval period runs out`
`19:39.38`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: Forgot what I wanted to say`
`19:40.03`	`SlayerXP`	`morsing: I expect you wanted my address, so you can mail me that cheque`
`19:40.39`	`morsing`	`Cool. Will do`
`19:41.51`	`SlayerXP`	`mart brooks, begmo, 7710 sparbu, norway`
`19:41.55`	`SlayerXP`	`err vegmo`
`19:47.40`	`wethrin`	`morsing: You've been getting mail server help? :)`
`19:49.22`	`morsing`	`wethrin: No - SlayerXP couldn't fix my issue anyway`
`19:49.44`	`wethrin`	`ah`
`19:49.47`	`SlayerXP`	`i couldn't?`
`19:50.13`	`morsing`	`No, you've tried before but given up`
`19:50.25`	`SlayerXP`	`remind me`
`19:51.02`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: Postfix can't properly resolve DNS records`
`19:51.17`	`SlayerXP`	`oh yes.`
`19:51.21`	`morsing`	`But my guess is that it's a Debian bug`
`19:51.46`	`SlayerXP`	`apt-get install exim-daemon-heavy`
`19:52.17`	`morsing`	`SlayerXP: Yeah that's what I mean. You gave up`
`19:52.37`	`SlayerXP`	`yes, usgin soemthing that works is clearly admitting defeat.`
`19:56.13`	`Cope`	`well, if the brief is "fix foo" and you don't fix foo, but replace it with bar, that's admitting that you couldn't fix foo.`
`19:56.58`	`SlayerXP`	`i'm a pragmatist`
`19:57.18`	`wethrin`	`But you advocate Debian :)`
`20:00.56`	`Cope`	`SlayerXP: quite, it is often better not to fix the problem`
`20:01.15`	`Cope`	`SlayerXP: i often say "i wouldn't start from there - do this instead"`
`20:02.20`	`wethrin`	`"Hello, I have this RedHat machine..."`
`20:03.29`	`Cope`	`wethrin: at which point i would argue that in most circumstances the pragmatic thing to do is to work with it;`
`20:04.15`	`wethrin`	`debootstrap! :)`
`20:05.21`	`Cope`	`:)`
`20:12.01`	`*** join/#gllug janvb (i=jan@vanbergen.demon.co.uk)`
`22:14.51`	`*** join/#gllug arika-chan (n=angelic@allegro/user/angelchild)`
`22:43.09`	`*** join/#gllug Gonz0 (n=Gonzo@82-35-9-153.cable.ubr02.hari.blueyonder.co.uk)`
`23:26.19`	`wethrin`	`foo`
`23:38.50`	`arika-chan`	`bar`
`23:51.54`	`wethrin`	`mm`
`23:52.46`	`arika-chan`	`cake`
`23:52.50`	`wethrin`	`Sleep?`
`23:53.05`	`wethrin`	`Night all!`
`23:54.49`	`arika-chan`	`night`
`23:58.00`	`cpufreak`	`evening`

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