irclog2html for #gllug on 20030709

`01:59.16`	`Jenson`	`I'm guessing we're all asleep`
`02:07.13`	`gregj`	`guys, spelling: conversion or convertion ?`
`02:07.18`	`gregj`	`which one is correct ?`
`02:08.18`	`Jenson`	`the first one`
`02:09.01`	`gregj`	`thanks ;)`
`02:09.30`	`Jenson`	`yw, WTF do you need to know that at this time for?`
`02:11.30`	`gregj`	`Jenson: \|03:11 < CIA> kdenonbeta/kopete/protocols/gadu gj: adding cp1250->iso conversion on`
`02:11.33`	`gregj`	`Jenson: \| imported users list`
`02:11.35`	`gregj`	`Jenson: that`
`02:11.43`	`gregj`	`Jenson: i had to commit a change to cvs`
`02:11.44`	`gregj`	`;)`
`02:11.57`	`Jenson`	`lol ffs go to sleep`
`02:12.08`	`Jenson`	`the two ppl i foubnd awake on irc are playing with linux lol`
`02:12.26`	`gregj`	`hehe`
`02:12.31`	`gregj`	`which one is a second pl ?`
`02:12.36`	`gregj`	`i dunno any here`
`02:13.14`	`Jenson`	`im so tired, but i cant sleep`
`02:13.25`	`Jenson`	`i'd play with linux too if i had a clue what i could do to it`
`02:13.44`	`gregj`	`well, i am developer`
`02:13.56`	`gregj`	`since i remember, i do code and develop`
`02:13.57`	`gregj`	`:]`
`02:13.58`	`gregj`	`but`
`02:14.07`	`gregj`	`help, does not mean - write software`
`02:14.08`	`Jenson`	`i'm a girl...does that count?`
`02:14.21`	`gregj`	`only if you care about that`
`02:14.31`	`gregj`	`otherwise nobody will take care about that`
`02:14.57`	`gregj`	`just don't be affraid to ask, and don't be scared when we are switching over to technicalies here`
`02:15.44`	`Jenson`	`Last night I had to ask waht a router was....I'm sure router means two things`
`02:16.39`	`gregj`	`tell me :]`
`02:18.15`	`gregj`	`so ?`
`02:18.27`	`Jenson`	`oh yeh`
`02:18.28`	`Jenson`	`sorry lol`
`02:18.34`	`Jenson`	`A router, I've decided is`
`02:18.53`	`Jenson`	`1) Those weird little things they have in PCWorld (or was that a hub lol)`
`02:19.07`	`Jenson`	`2) The computer you use as a server on your network`
`02:19.13`	`Jenson`	`3)or none of those`
`02:19.18`	`gregj`	`hmm`
`02:19.45`	`gregj`	`to realise what router is, you first have to learn about IPs and netmasks, subnetworks`
`02:19.56`	`Jenson`	`and for the PCWorld mention, blame zimm for dragging me there why he checked out ADSL stuff there`
`02:20.01`	`gregj`	`this is not a magick knowledge, thus`
`02:20.43`	`Jenson`	`Eventually someone will teach me networking lol`
`02:21.13`	`gregj`	`not me, or not today`
`02:21.16`	`gregj`	`i am tired`
`02:21.29`	`Jenson`	`nah`
`02:21.32`	`Jenson`	`at a sensible time`
`02:21.37`	`Jenson`	`when i might remember it lol`
`02:21.41`	`gregj`	`i have to prepare presentation for talk tommorow`
`02:23.36`	`gregj`	`ok, i'm off for today`
`02:23.47`	`gregj`	`time to hit the bed`
`02:23.49`	`Jenson`	`kthen`
`02:23.50`	`Jenson`	`night`
`02:23.53`	`Jenson`	`seeya tomorrow`
`02:23.57`	`gregj`	`cu`
`02:38.08`	`Jenson`	`Oh well time to try to sleep`
`05:09.36`	`new2unix`	`moin all.`
`05:46.03`	`*** join/#gllug Tarragon (~Tarragon@public3-stoc3-3-cust62.oldh.broadband.ntl.com)`
`06:53.16`	`*** join/#gllug zachary (~zachary@host217-39-4-122.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`06:53.47`	`zachary`	`moin`
`07:08.13`	`JD`	`hi`
`07:16.24`	`murble`	`well atleast if you've lost it already you solve your travel insurance problem`
`07:19.14`	`JD`	`murble: I haven;t even got it yet`
`07:19.21`	`JD`	`and I don't have travel insurance either`
`07:19.30`	`JD`	`breakfast and other such things`
`07:26.41`	`murble`	`JD: travel insurance or the camera?`
`08:21.17`	`JD`	`both`
`09:07.04`	`*** join/#gllug SPQR (~a4266@194.106.34.53)`
`09:07.09`	`SPQR`	`morning all`
`09:09.39`	`*** join/#gllug cup (~cup@host213-120-148-49.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`09:09.46`	`cup`	`W`
`09:13.46`	`SPQR`	`w?`
`10:01.43`	`*** join/#gllug sash (voidzero@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG)`
`10:24.10`	`zachary`	`moin sash`
`10:25.24`	`sash`	`Morning Zach`
`10:25.44`	`Tarragon`	`Morning sash`
`10:26.27`	`*** join/#gllug nasrat (~paul@62.190.209.125)`
`10:26.39`	`sash`	`Tarragon: Morning`
`10:34.30`	`sash`	`Tarragon: Andrew Lee (Taiwan, Chinese GNU/Linux Extensions) will be back in London soon.`
`10:38.00`	`Tarragon`	`Cool. Is he intending to stay long?`
`10:38.21`	`zachary`	`Debianites: What are the packages to install XFree86? I tried apt-get install XFree86.`
`10:39.23`	`zachary`	`using 3.0r1.`
`10:39.32`	`sash`	`apt-get install x-window-system ?`
`10:40.12`	`Tarragon`	`xserver`
`10:41.44`	`sash`	`Tarragon: For two wks. He is also looking for a UK uni to study CS in (I'm trying to dissuade him and get him to self study).`
`10:42.04`	`Tarragon`	`do an apt-cache search xserver`
`10:42.38`	`zachary`	`apt-get install x-window-system is working. Thanks sash.`
`10:50.40`	`sash`	`Tarragon: Andrew will be in London at the end of July.`
`11:04.04`	`Tarragon`	`Doesn't the self study/course depend on what he wants it for? If he is after a piece of paper to say he has done something then wouldn't a course be better?`
`11:25.46`	`sash`	`Tarragon: He can get a cheaper piece of paper in Taiwan rather than in the UK. He wants knowledge.`
`11:29.53`	`dankolb`	`Foo`
`11:31.29`	`sash`	`Baaaah`
`11:31.51`	`Tarragon`	`Depends whether he thinks the piece of paper is more valuable from here than Taiwan`
`11:34.00`	`sash`	`Tarragon: Where it's from doesn't matter to him overly. If he can demonstrate good coding skills and perhaps have worked for a reputable company too, the degree cert shouldn't matter.`
`11:34.48`	`sash`	`Tarragon: His grasp of English needs to be improved (he admits this).`
`11:37.10`	`sash`	`Just reading a post from Xander where he states that his pushbike was nicked. He only used one type of lock, what does he expect?`
`11:40.51`	`sash`	`It is recommended that you use three different types e.g. D lock, motorcycle lock and armoured chain.`
`11:41.56`	`sash`	`Bike thieves usually go equipped to tackle one particular lock type.`
`11:43.11`	`dankolb`	`Flamethrowing lock?`
`11:44.08`	`sash`	`Eh?`
`11:44.42`	`sash`	`So you'd want to face charges for damaging pedestrians who happen to jostle your locked bike?`
`11:45.09`	`dankolb`	`There's lots more pedestrians around.`
`11:45.11`	`dankolb`	`:)`
`11:45.43`	`sash`	`dankolb: This is not the bike version of Carmageddon.`
`11:45.51`	`dankolb`	`Damn.`
`11:47.26`	`sash`	`I did collide with a pedestrian who crossed through stopped traffic. I broke my nose, while she suffered some bruising!`
`11:47.37`	`sash`	`Me and my ninja bike.`
`11:48.46`	`dankolb`	`Yes...`
`11:52.33`	`SPQR`	`WHAT WAS YOUR SCORE FOR HITTING HER?`
`11:52.39`	`SPQR`	`gah, soory. caps`
`11:52.41`	`SPQR`	`*sorry`
`11:56.01`	`SPQR`	`I nicked a guy on a bicycle the otherday. Just lost a bit of leather off my shoe`
`11:57.03`	`sash`	`SPQR: s/nicked/kicked/ ?`
`11:57.03`	`dankolb`	`Nicked a guy? Isn't that stealing?`
`11:57.09`	`sash`	`Heh`
`11:57.16`	`SPQR`	`nicked ;)`
`11:57.32`	`SPQR`	`as in scraped ;)`
`11:57.32`	`sash`	`Look, here's one I brought home earlier.`
`11:57.42`	`SPQR`	`hehe`
`11:58.07`	`SPQR`	`nicked is also arrested isn't it? ;)`
`11:58.20`	`dankolb`	`Yes.`
`11:58.48`	`sash`	`SPQR: Is this some kind of new underground urban pursuit that the fashionistas engage in nowadays?`
`11:59.27`	`sash`	`If it was me, I'd have whacked you with my crowbar a la Road Rash.`
`11:59.54`	`sash`	`What is the world coming to?`
`12:00.03`	`SPQR`	`there'd of been a problem with that, I was going about 30mph ;)`
`12:00.12`	`SPQR`	`I was on a moped at the time :D`
`12:00.38`	`SPQR`	`I'd kicked ya a la Road Rash 3D :)`
`12:01.32`	`sash`	`SPQR: Pfft, I can do 30mph.`
`12:01.47`	`SPQR`	`Don't know what its coming to, but its shaping up to be fun }-]`
`12:02.08`	`sash`	`SPQR: I'd have caught up by the next red light.`
`12:02.09`	`SPQR`	`I can also do 60mph :P Its only a 125cc mind :(`
`12:02.25`	`SPQR`	`not if you'd been the guy on the bicycle :P`
`12:02.27`	`sash`	`Ah, a pizzawhisk.`
`12:02.51`	`SPQR`	`not quite, a pizzawhisk with style, its a 4 stroke :P`
`12:03.35`	`sash`	`Ooh, the kind the dotcommies ride.`
`12:03.37`	`sash`	`:)`
`12:03.38`	`SPQR`	`I want me a ninja too!!`
`12:03.50`	`SPQR`	`yup, it even has the @ on it :P`
`12:04.22`	`SPQR`	`its me work supplied machine btw, hence the lack of power`
`12:05.04`	`*** join/#gllug SpudULike (~colin@pc-80-193-219-32-ca.blueyonder.co.uk)`
`12:05.23`	`sash`	`Reminds me. In the city, I saw a suited and booted on a push scooter?. LOL.`
`12:05.30`	`SPQR`	`hey Spud`
`12:05.32`	`sash`	`Hello Spud,`
`12:05.43`	`SPQR`	`lol!! Heard if those`
`12:05.51`	`SPQR`	`*of`
`12:06.05`	`SPQR`	`I'd prefer a board though...`
`12:07.35`	`sash`	`I saw a chap get off the Tube on blades and power his way up the stairs out of the station. Wow!`
`12:07.45`	`SPQR`	`cool :D`
`12:08.57`	`sash`	`Are bladers required to use roads?`
`12:09.23`	`SPQR`	`not that I know of. Same with boards`
`12:10.14`	`SPQR`	`I tihnk they fall into the non powered class.. Anyway, if they were required to, lots of mom's would get the hump 'cause their little shi... kids use blades`
`12:11.01`	`SpudULike`	`Hi guys.`
`12:11.49`	`*** join/#gllug zimm (Administra@host217-36-202-110.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`12:11.51`	`SpudULike`	`new2unix: I don't think you need to worry about getting your tickets to me. I have 4 tickets of my own. I think Sash want to come, so that leaves 2 spare.`
`12:13.23`	`zimm`	`has anyone seen resudaed today ?`
`12:14.55`	`SPQR`	`saw him last night at hokme..`
`12:14.57`	`SPQR`	`*home`
`12:15.08`	`SPQR`	`probly be seeing him again this evening`
`12:15.29`	`zimm`	`SPQR: do you know whats going on with www.resudaed.com ? cos io cant login using ssh anymore`
`12:15.47`	`zimm`	`is my box even still online at all ?`
`12:15.57`	`SPQR`	`as far as I know its still on`
`12:16.15`	`zimm`	`hmm , cos its refusing my pass when i try to log on ..`
`12:16.28`	`zimm`	`beths too , (unless she's changed it)`
`12:16.31`	`SPQR`	`he did mention taking it off whgen he sleeps their 'cause of the noise, but he did say he's put you hd into another machine`
`12:17.00`	`zimm`	`well at the mo i cant even log in to his box`
`12:17.04`	`SPQR`	`but I don't think he'd got around to doing that..`
`12:17.20`	`SPQR`	`let me see if I can loging at all`
`12:17.20`	`zimm`	`cos i was having to log in to his then from that to mine ,,`
`12:17.27`	`zimm`	`k :)`
`12:17.49`	`zimm`	`btw , i should be up to get my stuff at the end of next week :)`
`12:17.59`	`SPQR`	`naa, can't get in either :(`
`12:18.03`	`zimm`	`bummer`
`12:18.06`	`SPQR`	`cool :)`
`12:18.19`	`SPQR`	`heh`
`12:18.31`	`SPQR`	`I'll give him a quick to ask him to check it out`
`12:19.21`	`zimm`	`yeh , soeey ive been so long getting sorted , the guy im staying with was in the process of moving so i couldnt get my stuff till now , but emma is moving next week now , so we will hire a van and move both of us in one go :)`
`12:20.07`	`zimm`	`how have things been for you guys anyway ? everything cool and funky ?`
`12:20.29`	`SPQR`	`yup, alls well :)`
`12:20.43`	`zimm`	`glad to hear it :)`
`12:20.49`	`zimm`	`tent still up ? lol`
`12:20.57`	`SPQR`	`ok, bit of bad news, his bax is dead. Proceeser is gone`
`12:21.03`	`zimm`	`FSCK!!`
`12:21.08`	`SPQR`	`lol, naa. That went down a few weeks back :)`
`12:21.12`	`zimm`	`hehe`
`12:21.24`	`SPQR`	`bax? gah. Can't type today`
`12:21.52`	`SPQR`	`w00t11`
`12:22.01`	`zimm`	`hehe , was fsckin CLASS`
`12:22.08`	`SPQR`	`lol!!`
`12:22.27`	`SPQR`	`ya taking any recording equiment with ya? ;)`
`12:22.28`	`zimm`	`used the police as my alibi, walked straight in , even got given wrist-bands and an all area's pass !`
`12:22.39`	`SPQR`	`!!`
`12:22.48`	`SPQR`	`I take it ya had fun?`
`12:22.58`	`zimm`	`hoh yes indeedy`
`12:23.10`	`SPQR`	`hehe`
`12:23.10`	`zimm`	`it was weird actually ..`
`12:23.19`	`sash`	`Yikes!`
`12:23.28`	`zimm`	`had a bit of a drink , 2 reefers ... just wandered round , quite a chilled weekend`
`12:23.42`	`zimm`	`had to be at work for 9am on monday though :(`
`12:23.52`	`SPQR`	`heh. that kinda sucked :(`
`12:24.06`	`sash`	`How did you use the police?`
`12:24.21`	`zimm`	`s'not too bad , Glastonbury is opnly 30 miles from here .. quite a quick trip on the bike`
`12:25.00`	`sash`	`Watch out for SPQR's antics on the moped though. Admitted to kicking a cyclist.`
`12:25.07`	`SPQR`	`you bought that savalged bike then?`
`12:25.18`	`SPQR`	`;) nicking him!!!`
`12:26.48`	`zimm`	`SPQR: well , Will did , we havent finished it yet`
`12:27.02`	`zimm`	`its got a baby blade motor fitted , polus a twin disc front end ..`
`12:27.07`	`zimm`	`its fast as FSCK`
`12:27.13`	`SPQR`	`hehe`
`12:27.24`	`zimm`	`ive been riding a CX500 custom that belongs to my girlfriend ..`
`12:27.25`	`SPQR`	`baby blade? Fire blade?`
`12:27.29`	`SPQR`	`ahhh`
`12:27.35`	`zimm`	`400cc version of the blad yeh , its an import`
`12:27.41`	`SPQR`	`cool :)(`
`12:27.45`	`SPQR`	`*:)`
`12:27.58`	`SPQR`	`now thats gonna fly!!`
`12:28.11`	`zimm`	`130ish mph yeh`
`12:28.16`	`zimm`	`nop fairing so ..`
`12:28.28`	`SPQR`	`gets a bit windy`
`12:28.31`	`zimm`	`streetfighter styling by the time we have finished it`
`12:28.35`	`SPQR`	`and dragged a bit..`
`12:28.38`	`SPQR`	`:)`
`12:29.05`	`SPQR`	`sweet!`
`12:31.00`	`SPQR`	`now I gotta get myself a decent bike...`
`12:31.30`	`zimm`	`hehe`
`12:31.33`	`zimm`	`bikes rule`
`12:32.00`	`SPQR`	`hell yeah!!`
`12:32.10`	`SPQR`	`brb, getting some lunch :)`
`12:37.32`	`SPQR`	`back`
`12:37.37`	`zimm`	`:)`
`12:46.44`	`SPQR`	`yo yo biatch`
`12:53.57`	`sash`	`Bye all`
`13:24.10`	`*** join/#gllug jason_ukfsn (~jason@public1-watf3-5-cust60.watf.broadband.ntl.com)`
`13:24.12`	`jason_ukfsn`	`afternoon all`
`13:24.17`	`nasrat`	`afternoon`
`13:31.39`	`*** join/#gllug sash (voidzero@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG)`
`13:37.13`	`eye69`	`Men vafan. Linux tycker att min gamepad har 7 axlar och 15 knappar.`
`13:37.20`	`eye69`	`Oops.`
`15:40.42`	`*** join/#gllug gregj (~gj@80.253.107.41)`
`15:42.59`	`*** join/#gllug JD_ (~david@212.56.237.101)`
`15:46.13`	`*** join/#gllug nasrat (~paul@62.190.209.125) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`15:49.32`	`*** join/#gllug eye69 (magnus@3ffe:200:170:100:0:0:0:2) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`16:18.37`	`*** join/#gllug zimm (~Tim@host81-134-8-85.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`16:33.47`	`*** join/#gllug cup (~cup@host213-120-148-49.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`18:19.07`	`*** join/#gllug zachary_ (~zachary@host217-39-4-122.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`19:35.52`	`*** join/#gllug Leeds (~richardc@user-669.bbd04tcl.dsl.pol.co.uk)`
`19:36.53`	`zachary_`	`evening Leeds`
`19:36.58`	`Leeds`	`hey`
`19:37.32`	`Jenson`	`welcome home Leeds`
`19:37.36`	`Leeds`	`thanks :-)`
`19:37.56`	`Leeds`	`I should point out that I didn't leave the house until about 1115 this morning...`
`19:39.30`	`Leeds`	`so what`
`19:39.37`	`Leeds`	`what's new?`
`19:40.24`	`Jenson`	`I'm investigating whether I wanna buy a new phone...other than that`
`19:40.39`	`Leeds`	`mate just bought a T610`
`19:41.31`	`zachary_`	`just installed debian on my laptop.`
`19:44.47`	`*** join/#gllug nasrat (~paul@pc-62-30-151-127-hr.blueyonder.co.uk)`
`19:44.58`	`zachary_`	`wb nasrat`
`19:45.03`	`Leeds`	`hey paul`
`19:45.05`	`nasrat`	`ty`
`19:45.11`	`nasrat`	`hi Leeds`
`19:45.48`	`nasrat`	`Leeds: do you know anyone on the java licensing side of things?`
`19:46.13`	`Leeds`	`um... I could probably find someone if I had to - big company :-)`
`19:46.44`	`nasrat`	`might get back to you.`
`19:50.30`	`zachary_`	`Leeds: That's sick!`
`19:51.43`	`Leeds`	`I'm just watching my ships...`
`19:52.08`	`zachary_`	`Right :)`
`19:55.23`	`nasrat`	`ppl coming to heckel me Saturday?`
`19:56.13`	`Leeds`	`nope`
`19:56.28`	`Leeds`	`gonna be in Bournemouth - nothing personal :-)`
`19:56.49`	`zachary_`	`I guess I'll be there.`
`19:57.13`	`Jenson`	`I'll be there to heckle at the pub, but i guess that dont count`
`19:57.38`	`nasrat`	`pub is always a good idea`
`19:59.26`	`*** join/#gllug skugg (~stig@braut.plus.com)`
`20:08.34`	`nasrat`	`hey skugg`
`20:09.23`	`skugg`	`hi nasrat :)`
`20:09.32`	`skugg`	`i got the networking running ;)`
`20:09.38`	`skugg`	`now got sound left to do`
`20:09.48`	`skugg`	`alsa don't seem quite willing`
`20:10.37`	`skugg`	`plus i've got to figure out what it is that makes my boot so "unclean"`
`20:10.43`	`nasrat`	`skugg: feel free to mail me your config`
`20:10.51`	`skugg`	`thanks :)`
`20:11.04`	`nasrat`	`skugg: ahh, the verbosity level, but you can't change it atm despite their being a .config option`
`20:11.27`	`skugg`	`i want to look at framebuffer console as well, and possibly disable acpi again so that suspends start working again...`
`20:12.11`	`nasrat`	`skugg: you'll need mm2 for framebuffer to work`
`20:12.12`	`skugg`	`nasrat, it's complaining about a few missing modules (PANIC!) etc`
`20:12.26`	`skugg`	`mm2? square millimeter?`
`20:12.28`	`skugg`	`:)`
`20:13.16`	`nasrat`	`mirror.ac.uk/sites/ftp.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/apkm/`
`20:14.46`	`skugg`	`hm. okay.`
`20:14.50`	`skugg`	`by the way...`
`20:15.24`	`skugg`	`you wouldn't happen to know how I could shrink my ext2/3 partition on this machine, do you?`
`20:15.37`	`nasrat`	`gnu parted`
`20:15.40`	`skugg`	`many years ago I had this partitionmagic floppydisk that would do it`
`20:15.48`	`skugg`	`it will do it without dataloss?`
`20:16.09`	`nasrat`	`ext2/ext3 should be fine`
`20:16.17`	`skugg`	`(well, the floppydisk in itself wouldn't do it, but the software on it worked ;)`
`20:16.21`	`skugg`	`woo! cool.`
`20:17.55`	`skugg`	`i'm going to re-install here.. need to change disks around a bit.`
`20:18.07`	`skugg`	`only have / and /home, and too little space on /`
`20:19.03`	`skugg`	`i also have a complete mirror in /home/ftp of all software i have installed, so don't really want to nuke and restard if i can avoid it ;)`
`20:19.29`	`skugg`	`wonder if i should do a / /usr and /home, but don't think it's really worth it for a laptop system...`
`20:23.43`	`nasrat`	`food bbl`
`20:24.11`	`skugg`	`nasrat, thanks :)`
`20:51.38`	`nasrat`	`back`
`20:52.19`	`Jenson`	`wb`
`20:52.44`	`nasrat`	`skugg: you still about`
`20:53.13`	`skugg`	`nasrat, yeah.`
`20:53.24`	`nasrat`	`mail me your .config`
`20:53.27`	`skugg`	`backing up a bit before trying parted on this machine :)`
`20:53.37`	`skugg`	`'mkay.`
`20:54.46`	`skugg`	`attachment or in-body?`
`20:55.03`	`nasrat`	`attachment`
`20:55.51`	`skugg`	`okay :)`
`20:55.59`	`zachary`	`i'm off to bed, good night`
`20:56.05`	`nasrat`	`night zachary`
`20:56.21`	`Jenson`	`seeya zachary`
`20:56.56`	`nasrat`	`I've got a modular config that works for me, plus arjanv has just produced an rpm. You might also be intrested in the modutils / module-init-tools combine patches`
`20:58.49`	`nasrat`	`skugg: also send me your current lsmod, modules.conf and modprobe.conf`
`20:59.23`	`skugg`	`oh. okay. they will come in separate mail, 'cause i didn't see it until now and i've sent the first one ;)`
`20:59.31`	`nasrat`	`np`
`20:59.50`	`skugg`	`i've got the module-init-tools that comes with debian`
`20:59.53`	`nasrat`	`I may not get a chance to look tonight but will get back to you tomorrow`
`21:00.13`	`skugg`	`that's fine -- i don't have that much time left i think either.`
`21:00.39`	`skugg`	`going to attempt not dying in the heat before going to bed i think.`
`21:02.24`	`Clyphox`	`I think I have a memory Leak`
`21:02.28`	`nasrat`	`yeah it is a bit toasty`
`21:02.36`	`Clyphox`	`any idea how to find out whats stealing the RAM?`
`21:02.40`	`Clyphox`	`and how too clear it?`
`21:03.21`	`Jenson`	`I do with Win, but I guess you mean Linux`
`21:03.43`	`nasrat`	`top then hit M to give processes using most memory`
`21:04.20`	`Clyphox`	`nasrat: it doesn't show anything using more than 4M.. yet out of half a Gig I only have 81mb free`
`21:04.27`	`Clyphox`	`init 1 doesn't even help..`
`21:04.38`	`Clyphox`	`remounted all my tmpfs mounts too :-(`
`21:04.59`	`Clyphox`	`I'm going to have too reboot as if I'm running Windows!!!!!`
`21:05.15`	`nasrat`	`Clyphox: what happens if you umount tmpfs mounts`
`21:05.22`	`nasrat`	`don't remount them\`
`21:06.01`	`Clyphox`	`not much.. still way outta ram :-(`
`21:08.18`	`nasrat`	`ram is also used for caching various stuff for i/o - unless you are swapping heavily I wouldn't worry`
`21:09.21`	`Clyphox`	`okies..`
`21:09.24`	`Clyphox`	`I don't understand.. all I know is gkrellm krell is WAY on the wrong side.. its just not normal`
`21:09.36`	`nasrat`	`http://www.csn.ul.ie/~mel/projects/vm/`
`21:10.41`	`nasrat`	`though that may be more low level than you want`
`21:12.00`	`Clyphox`	`hehe`
`21:12.12`	`Clyphox`	`I've just recompiled my entire OS`
`21:12.17`	`nasrat`	`Rather than gkrellm, install sysstat ( sar, iostat) and fire that off from cron to profile memory usage. Then if you are still concerned you have real numbers`
`21:12.22`	`Clyphox`	`sourcemage is REALLY a good distro..`
`21:12.48`	`Clyphox`	`hehe.. nah I just like stuff that looks nice.. I am no real admin hehe`
`21:13.05`	`nasrat`	`also cat /proc/slabinfo and /proc/meminfo`
`21:13.36`	`nasrat`	`OK, well unless vmstat shows a lot of swap in/swap out don't worry too much`
`21:13.49`	`skugg`	`gah.`
`21:13.57`	`Clyphox`	`I wonder whats in slabinfo.. /me pokes around`
`21:13.58`	`skugg`	`how do i install grub again?`
`21:14.17`	`skugg`	`'grub-install /dev/hda' simply?`
`21:16.35`	`*** join/#gllug NisoRamen (~dwilson@host217-35-16-24.in-addr.btopenworld.com)`
`21:16.44`	`NisoRamen`	`Evening All`
`21:17.09`	`skugg`	`evening NisoRamen :)`
`21:17.09`	`Jenson`	`3hi NisoRamen`
`21:17.26`	`NisoRamen`	`Nice to see people alive. Makes a pleasent surprise in here :)`
`21:17.37`	`NisoRamen`	`skugg: still enjoying the job?`
`21:18.42`	`skugg`	`NisoRamen, yeah. got aircondition :P`
`21:19.02`	`NisoRamen`	`Ahh ok. A valid reason for once ;)`
`21:19.26`	`skugg`	`yep. devilishly hot today.`
`21:19.30`	`NisoRamen`	`Everyone looking forward to GLLUG this Saturday? :)`
`21:19.34`	`nasrat`	`no`
`21:19.37`	`skugg`	`heh.`
`21:19.40`	`NisoRamen`	`Best time to go talent spotting...`
`21:19.47`	`skugg`	`not sure i'm going...`
`21:20.04`	`NisoRamen`	`Nasrat i thought i asked you to get your talk moved to later. I'm losing my layin. OI hope you apreciate this ;)`
`21:20.22`	`NisoRamen`	`Skugg how can you not come and heckle Nasrat?`
`21:20.29`	`skugg`	`nasrat, what's your talk going to cover?`
`21:20.33`	`NisoRamen`	`Its your duty as a TULian.`
`21:20.42`	`skugg`	`NisoRamen, i take no joy in heckling friends ;)`
`21:20.50`	`NisoRamen`	`Wuss.`
`21:20.53`	`nasrat`	`skugg: from basics to programming the api`
`21:20.56`	`skugg`	`(okay, just a little)`
`21:21.14`	`NisoRamen`	`And self maintained update servers? Will it? will it?`
`21:21.19`	`skugg`	`nasrat, would it be useful for a .deb-user?`
`21:21.20`	`nasrat`	`yup`
`21:21.55`	`nasrat`	`well lots of the theory holds, and it's a useful skill.`
`21:22.13`	`NisoRamen`	`Skugg you may use debian but most of the real companies dont :P`
`21:22.16`	`skugg`	`if it was the second talk i would come for it, but i'm probably going out in the evening and would appreciate the lay-in...`
`21:22.27`	`nasrat`	`np`
`21:22.32`	`skugg`	`NisoRamen, pfft :P`
`21:22.34`	`NisoRamen`	`again i say: Wuss`
`21:22.52`	`NisoRamen`	`./ autorespond skugg "Wuss"`
`21:22.53`	`NisoRamen`	`hehe`
`21:23.04`	`skugg`	`NisoRamen, i'm not afraid to say i agree. what does that make me? :)`
`21:23.17`	`NisoRamen`	`On the side of the Angels :)`
`21:23.40`	`nasrat`	`NisoRamen: not on the side of Spike and Drew?`
`21:24.03`	`NisoRamen`	`Buffy reference... did i wander into London PM....`
`21:24.08`	`NisoRamen`	`Hope not.`
`21:24.29`	`NisoRamen`	`Dan, that one time at bandcamp....`
`21:24.48`	`nasrat`	`AH`
`21:25.09`	`Jenson`	`NisoRamen: he had to put up with me aaying that lol, poor ma`
`21:25.28`	`Jenson`	`s/ma/man`
`21:25.30`	`Jenson`	`anyway sleep time`
`21:25.32`	`Jenson`	`night all`
`21:25.45`	`NisoRamen`	`Night. Forgot it was a school night :P`
`21:27.49`	`nasrat`	`bah humbug`
`21:28.06`	`NisoRamen`	`Talk writing getting to you? :)`
`21:28.25`	`nasrat`	`NisoRamen: nah, I can always adlib :)`
`21:28.42`	`nasrat`	`either that or recite from max-rpm`
`21:28.42`	`NisoRamen`	`better not get to hammered Friday then!`
`21:29.04`	`nasrat`	`yeah I'm not going out on Fri`
`21:29.23`	`NisoRamen`	`LOL good responsable Nasrat`
`21:31.29`	`nasrat`	`yeah well I have to do my slides sometime ;)`
`21:33.04`	`NisoRamen`	`I might have to slip out before the second talk begins... After seeing Mark and Tigrian speak about the kernel i'm a little bit jaded ;)`
`21:33.28`	`nasrat`	`I enjoyed those`
`21:33.31`	`skugg`	`Tigrian?`
`21:33.36`	`nasrat`	`tigran`
`21:33.48`	`NisoRamen`	`I did. Thats sorta why i'm not too keen on a beginners talk on them.`
`21:33.49`	`skugg`	`you referring to simon trimmer's talk at framestore?`
`21:34.23`	`skugg`	`and the gcc port to 64 bit or whatever it was?`
`21:34.47`	`NisoRamen`	`skugg: http://www.tldp.org/LDP/lki/index.html`
`21:35.30`	`NisoRamen`	`Trimmer did a lot of talks and they were all pretty cool. One i liked the most was different virtual machines. As a vmware user i found it interesting`
`21:35.36`	`NisoRamen`	`;)`
`21:36.04`	`nasrat`	`now you get me`
`21:36.14`	`nasrat`	`sadly not as cool or intresting`
`21:37.36`	`NisoRamen`	`bah bollocks. I've seen you sapeak before. if i didnt like it then you'd not get me up and out before noon :)`
`21:37.49`	`nasrat`	`cheers`
`21:38.08`	`skugg`	`. . o O ( remember the powersupply this time ;] )`
`21:38.14`	`NisoRamen`	`LOL`
`21:38.20`	`nasrat`	`:P`
`21:38.25`	`NisoRamen`	`Yeah especially as John wants to borrow the machine afterwards!`
`21:38.36`	`nasrat`	`yeah, it may be running 2.5.74`
`21:38.39`	`NisoRamen`	`Nasrat you got a wireless card?`
`21:38.46`	`nasrat`	`yes`
`21:38.55`	`*** join/#gllug stephanb (~frog@dsl-80-46-195-180.access.uk.tiscali.com)`
`21:38.57`	`NisoRamen`	`Want me to bring the ibook in case? I can charge it the night before`
`21:39.14`	`nasrat`	`I could bring my ibook too`
`21:39.34`	`stephanb`	`hello everybody`
`21:39.34`	`NisoRamen`	`You forgot the power supply, you'll remember a redundent machine? :P`
`21:39.42`	`NisoRamen`	`Evening Stephan`
`21:39.57`	`stephanb`	`NisoRamen: I like your nickname !`
`21:40.23`	`NisoRamen`	`You can have it when i log off ;)`
`21:41.03`	`NisoRamen`	`So is Hearnas actually speaking at gllug? Its not mentioned on the home page`
`21:42.26`	`NisoRamen`	`How old is portman inn that film? seven?`
`21:43.34`	`NisoRamen`	`humm 13/14 according to imdb...`
`21:43.48`	`dankolb`	`Going away with band next week, though`
`21:44.02`	`nasrat`	`camping?`
`21:44.08`	`NisoRamen`	`Dan your not a drummer are you? :)`
`21:44.45`	`stephanb`	`dankolb: hi there, we meet again.`
`21:45.15`	`stephanb`	`NisoRamen: this reminds me of a dutch band called "Jesus couldn't drum"`
`21:45.47`	`NisoRamen`	`LOL memorable name.`
`21:46.51`	`NisoRamen`	`There has to be SOMETHING worth watching on telly.`
`21:47.06`	`skugg`	`NisoRamen, quite likely not.`
`21:47.26`	`dankolb`	`No, I'm a clarinettist`
`21:47.27`	`skugg`	`nasrat, parted wants an unmounted filesystem i guess? :)`
`21:47.34`	`dankolb`	`And not camping, either`
`21:47.35`	`nasrat`	`yup`
`21:47.49`	`stephanb`	`NisoRamen: TCM ? (Turner Classic Movies)`
`21:48.21`	`stephanb`	`well the clarinet can hardly be described as a percussive instrument :-(`
`21:48.25`	`NisoRamen`	`stephen: I'm stuck with terestrial...`
`21:48.53`	`skugg`	`nasrat, well. i guess this is me signing off then`
`21:49.28`	`NisoRamen`	`School hard`
`21:49.32`	`nasrat`	`yup`
`21:49.36`	`NisoRamen`	`Has he broken into the schoolyet?`
`21:49.46`	`Leeds`	`just been chatting to my Dad - he does the odd bit of investment in startups, and I've just spent 30 minutes shooting down the latest :-)`
`21:49.47`	`NisoRamen`	`"I messed up all yoour doileys..."`
`21:49.49`	`Leeds`	`School Hard`
`21:49.50`	`nasrat`	`yeah angel just pretended to be angelus`
`21:50.17`	`NisoRamen`	`the first evil?`
`21:50.21`	`Leeds`	`NisoRamen: indeed`
`21:50.29`	`NisoRamen`	`Angel doesnt die. Boring.`
`21:50.32`	`NisoRamen`	`lol`
`21:50.48`	`nasrat`	`yeah but recent angel series was better than buffy`
`21:50.58`	`Leeds`	`I'm quite impressed by Sky - just before the last ep, they started showing all of it from the very beginning - add TiVo and you get one-a-day Buffy-on-demand :-)`
`21:51.04`	`NisoRamen`	`Agreed.`
`21:51.14`	`Leeds`	`true... Buffy got a little lost`
`21:51.17`	`NisoRamen`	`Alexa Davios. Yum.`
`21:51.26`	`nasrat`	`have you seen firefly?`
`21:51.38`	`NisoRamen`	`Nah, not really my kind of thing.`
`21:51.41`	`Leeds`	`firefly very very good`
`21:52.02`	`NisoRamen`	`Might have to go leech then.`
`21:52.15`	`stephanb`	`NisoRamen: I have given up on terrestrial the year C4 launched Film Four, and all the good movies went there`
`21:52.47`	`NisoRamen`	`Do they do what Sky do anmd repeat the same films for six months?`
`21:53.22`	`Leeds`	`NisoRamen: they're better - except for their new "we show the same 3 films every night for a week" channel`
`21:53.24`	`nasrat`	`they do repeat stuff but not daily, more it'll play over a month or so so you can miss it`
`21:53.42`	`stephanb`	`NisoRamen: they must do a lot of repeats, but not for six months, coz I see them changing the posters on the 3rd floor every 2..3 months`
`21:53.58`	`Leeds`	`TiVo largely defeats the object of them...`
`21:54.29`	`NisoRamen`	`Oz and Willow?`
`21:54.33`	`Leeds`	`yeah`
`21:54.48`	`Leeds`	`I'm impressed - I haven't seen a lot of the older ones for a while :-)`
`21:54.52`	`NisoRamen`	`I might have to look at film four then. A lot of their stuff is pretty neat.`
`21:55.14`	`Leeds`	`film four is worth having if you've got the time/inclination to watch it`
`21:55.50`	`NisoRamen`	`There seems to be bugger all else on.`
`21:56.29`	`NisoRamen`	`that was a film four and the dogs nadgers.`
`21:56.36`	`stephanb`	`NisoRamen: http://www.tcmonline.co.uk/ you can download the uk schedule in pdf, press on the listings button.`
`21:56.55`	`skugg`	`. . o O ( radiotimes.com )`
`21:57.48`	`nasrat`	`bed now, I'll prod your .config tomorrow`
`21:57.58`	`skugg`	`'mkay.`
`21:58.06`	`skugg`	`i'm going to log off now too.`
`21:58.07`	`skugg`	`bye.`
`21:58.10`	`NisoRamen`	`Night all.`
`21:58.18`	`Leeds`	`night skugg, NisoRamen`
`21:59.48`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: how much is film four ? do i need sky for it ?`
`22:00.06`	`Leeds`	`stephanb: you need sky or cable - it's about 6 quid a month (think 2 film rentals)`
`22:00.24`	`Leeds`	`www.filmfour.com :-)`
`22:01.07`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: i saw this ad for a mail-order dvd rental Co, �10/month, as many movies as you like, one dvd at a time`
`22:01.30`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: unfortunately they didn't have much arthouse and classic stuff, which is what i like.`
`22:02.28`	`Leeds`	`stephanb: yeah, I've seen them... but you only get like one film at a time for ?10, and you probably have to wait for popular stuff - or find they don't have less popular stuff - and wait for delivery and restocking and all`
`22:04.31`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: what goes into the TiVo can't be dumped onto DVD or a hard drive, does it ?`
`22:04.41`	`Leeds`	`somewhat`
`22:05.09`	`Leeds`	`I've got a third-party network card installed in my TiVo and it's apparently possible to grab video from it...`
`22:05.30`	`Leeds`	`but I've never tried and don't really feel much of a need to - with 100Gb of disk in the TiVo :-)`
`22:06.09`	`Leeds`	`can be dumped to VHS easily, but VHS sucks`
`22:06.54`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: what bitrate does the TiVo run at ? 2MB/s MPEG-2 ?`
`22:07.19`	`Leeds`	`there are 4 quality levels available - I don't know what the bitrates are for them... it's online somewhere`
`22:07.54`	`Leeds`	`the TiVo is mainly a consumer device, remember... while I've added hard drive and network card (and therefore HTTP control) to it, I still use it largely as an advanced consumer device`
`22:09.19`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: does your drive hold about 14 hours of media ?`
`22:09.32`	`Leeds`	`far far more`
`22:09.34`	`Leeds`	`hang on`
`22:10.34`	`stephanb`	`hang on, i made the usual mistake streams in bits / storage in bytes`
`22:10.37`	`Leeds`	`32 hours at top quality, 112 at lowest`
`22:11.01`	`stephanb`	`your drive holds 8*14 = 112 hours`
`22:11.38`	`Leeds`	`If I tell it to specifically record something, I almost always do it at best (top) quality - unless it's a radio programme... if it decides to record something itself, it does it at High (one down from top) quality`
`22:11.52`	`stephanb`	`well "lowest" is 2Mbit/s, which is normally ok for a feature film`
`22:12.00`	`Leeds`	`hmm... it's 43degrees inside the TiVo...`
`22:12.20`	`Leeds`	`and I'm opted out of profiling`
`22:12.48`	`stephanb`	`"top" quality is 7Mbit/s that's the maximum rate a DVD can do.`
`22:13.01`	`Leeds`	`thought DVD was 10Mbit?`
`22:13.41`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: maybe that's a theoretical max, but in practice encoding even at higher than 6Mbit/s is considered "risky"`
`22:13.55`	`stephanb`	`meaning won't play back on certain domestic players`
`22:14.07`	`Leeds`	`really? I'm sure I've seen mplayer reporting that from DVDs`
`22:14.23`	`stephanb`	`mplayer is not a domestic player`
`22:14.37`	`Leeds`	`right - but I'm talking about commercial DVDS`
`22:14.55`	`Leeds`	`fellowship of the ring seems to be at 7500.0 kbps video`
`22:15.15`	`Leeds`	`and 448.0 kbit audio`
`22:15.20`	`stephanb`	`yeah that's probably the max. rate the industry will apply`
`22:15.54`	`Leeds`	`even with 'superbit' or whatever it's called?`
`22:16.46`	`stephanb`	`in fact the issue is different with the TiVo because the TiVo has to process a noisy signal (if you watch analog tv)`
`22:17.07`	`stephanb`	`in which case, you will want to increase the bitrate, otherwise the picture will look horrible`
`22:17.42`	`stephanb`	`when producing a feature-film DVD, you can tweak the noise reduction in Telecine as much as you want`
`22:17.45`	`Leeds`	`even digital TV is somewhat noisy after it's been decoded and thrown out through a scart cable`
`22:18.18`	`Leeds`	`and of course since they're both using the same codec (AFAIK) any artefacts get multiplied, potentialls`
`22:18.20`	`stephanb`	`because digital TV brings another sort of noise in the form of encoding artefacts`
`22:19.14`	`stephanb`	`well.. not quite, if it's the same codec with the "blocs" aligned at the same position there is only a limited degradation`
`22:19.39`	`stephanb`	`which is why you can do 50 dubs of DigiBeta to DigiBeta befor seeing a major problem`
`22:20.18`	`stephanb`	`of course digital broadcasting will use Codec A, and Tivo Codec B, so there is going to be a noise increase`
`22:20.21`	`Leeds`	`if you say so... I'm not a techie film geek :-)`
`22:20.33`	`stephanb`	`even if A and B are both MPEG-2`
`22:21.13`	`stephanb`	`sorry that was a bit like the EBU technical review`
`22:21.16`	`Leeds`	`anyway, the point about TiVo...`
`22:21.53`	`stephanb`	`... is that you hardly need to burn anything onto CD/DVD`
`22:22.05`	`stephanb`	`until you rdrive dies :-ooOOO`
`22:22.10`	`Leeds`	`is that yeah, it's a Linux box, and yeah it's a monthly subscription... but yeah, it's really well coded and yeah, it really does change how you watch TV and yeah - it's honestly the best piece of tech I've ever owned - even without the hackability`
`22:22.37`	`stephanb`	`??? monthly subscription ???`
`22:22.44`	`Leeds`	`monthly subscription`
`22:23.08`	`stephanb`	`??? it's not a device you can buy ??? like a VCR ?`
`22:23.09`	`Leeds`	`10 quid`
`22:23.42`	`Leeds`	`you buy the device - it's a box with a hard drive, a hardware codec, and some other gubbins, made by Tompson (or not made anymore)`
`22:24.07`	`stephanb`	`the buzzword in the industry 4-5 years ago : "near video on-demand"`
`22:24.30`	`stephanb`	`why is there a subscription fee ?`
`22:24.46`	`Leeds`	`you buy the service - programme guide which is longer-term and far more complete than the Sky one, albeit occasionally a little erratic - and the ongoing software upgrades and support (also not really happening now) from TiVo Inc.`
`22:24.51`	`Leeds`	`let me type! :-)`
`22:25.38`	`stephanb`	`oic... which makes the success of the device, because there is no housewife-gets-a-headache at programming the VCR ?`
`22:25.59`	`Leeds`	`since I bought mine over 2.5 years ago, the software upgrades have added a large amount of extra functionality`
`22:26.24`	`stephanb`	`what's the TCO ? sky + filmfour + TiVo`
`22:26.33`	`stephanb`	`assuming i don't watch football`
`22:27.00`	`stephanb`	`or the TCR rather (total cost of Rental)`
`22:27.10`	`Leeds`	`right - the point is that it knows what's on TV, and it can control the sky box - it makes the sky box an accessory to the Tivo - and you tell it what you like - and it provides what you like`
`22:27.29`	`Leeds`	`note that you can't actually buy a new TiVo in this country at the moment, or for the foreseeable future :-(`
`22:27.40`	`stephanb`	`how exciting`
`22:28.11`	`Leeds`	`minimal sky package is 12.50 a month`
`22:28.15`	`Leeds`	`TiVo is 10 a month`
`22:28.24`	`stephanb`	`and also that they are not putting the sky or DVB decoder inside the TiVo`
`22:29.07`	`stephanb`	`is film four on digital terrestrial ?`
`22:29.14`	`Leeds`	`TiVo works with terrestrial, freeview, NTL, telewest, Sky...`
`22:29.48`	`Leeds`	`don't think so`
`22:29.59`	`Leeds`	`in fact, certainly not - there are no subscription channels on freeview`
`22:30.53`	`Leeds`	`I pay Sky 25.50 a month - in fact, I paid them today :-)`
`22:31.27`	`Leeds`	`ah, filmfour is 7 a month`
`22:31.40`	`Leeds`	`and I am on the 18.50 sky package`
`22:34.02`	`stephanb`	`hmm`
`22:34.50`	`Leeds`	`it's not cheap - but I like TV :-)`
`22:36.16`	`stephanb`	`hmm, i don't like tv`
`22:36.51`	`Leeds`	`in which case this isn't such a good plan for you...`
`22:37.05`	`stephanb`	`i'll like tv when it's on-demand, like webcast, which is not gonna come for a while`
`22:37.19`	`Leeds`	`TiVo is pseudo-on-demand`
`22:37.38`	`Leeds`	`that is, it's on-demand, but from a non-on-demand source`
`22:37.51`	`stephanb`	`yes i told you the term in the industry : "near video on-demand"`
`22:38.24`	`Leeds`	`ah - I didn't realise that was what you means`
`22:38.26`	`Leeds`	`meant`
`22:38.45`	`stephanb`	`that's what it means :-)`
`22:38.46`	`Leeds`	`I thought you meant the 'we have hundreds of channels, so we can show films at 15 minute intervals'`
`22:39.16`	`stephanb`	`it was that when the term was coined 4 years ago and there were no TiVos`
`22:39.25`	`Leeds`	`TiVo was starting up 4 years ago`
`22:39.53`	`stephanb`	`it takes a while for tv bosses to know that technology is available`
`22:40.01`	`stephanb`	`even longer to make good use of it`
`22:40.07`	`stephanb`	`think of the web`
`22:40.25`	`Leeds`	`heh`
`22:40.29`	`stephanb`	`think how many mega corporations still pay 100's of M$ Office licences`
`22:41.42`	`Leeds`	`well, yeah`
`22:41.46`	`Leeds`	`I think about that all the time`
`22:41.58`	`stephanb`	`let's not end on this, it depresses me`
`22:43.06`	`Leeds`	`it's possible that the growth of broadband will destroy some TV anyway - I have a good friend who rarely watches TV, but is as up on the latest American shows as I am... he just downloads them a couple of hours after (or before!) they're on in the US`
`22:43.39`	`Leeds`	`completely illegal, unfortunately - would be nice if there were a middle ground`
`22:44.09`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: same problem as napster`
`22:44.35`	`Leeds`	`somewhat`
`22:44.49`	`stephanb`	`i would be more than happy to pay �10/month and be able to dl legally, DivX encoded movies`
`22:44.58`	`Leeds`	`except that the point of getting TV online isn't so much about getting it free - it's more about getting it quickly`
`22:45.18`	`Leeds`	`not having to wait for the Fox/Sky monopoly to get around to showing it over here`
`22:45.33`	`stephanb`	`Leeds: i don't care about getting quickly, i care about choice`
`22:46.03`	`stephanb`	`i don't mind leaving my PC on, all day, getting filled up by what i'm gonna watch in the evening`
`22:46.29`	`Leeds`	`and the nice thing about a broadband connection is that it's truly multi-purpose... none of this "one box for talking, one for watching broadcast video, one for watching rented video, one for music, one for radio, etc."`
`22:48.23`	`stephanb`	`yeah, but the true suffering is then for broadcasters. one transmitter happily serves millions of viewers`
`22:48.53`	`stephanb`	`read the EBU technical review and you'll realise the investment in servers, just for radio broadcasters...`
`22:49.20`	`stephanb`	`doesn't webcasting cheap and easy for the broadcasters`
`22:49.38`	`Leeds`	`I don't read the EBU technical review... I'm more likely to read Dr. Dobbs or USENIX stuff :-)`
`22:49.53`	`Leeds`	`people buying lots of big servers is good for me :-)`
`22:49.59`	`stephanb`	`that's why i take the liberty to point this to you`
`22:50.44`	`Leeds`	`anyway - I don't want streaming stuff, for TV at least - I've been spoiled on having it local and on-demand...`
`22:50.49`	`stephanb`	`sure, but if at some point, everybody is supposed to get a 2Mbit/s stream to his phone socket... there is going to be a problem with the 50:1 contention ratio...`
`22:51.07`	`Leeds`	`I want it downloadable - overnight, during the day, whenever`
`22:51.26`	`stephanb`	`i guess what i'm trying to say is, the current adsl/cable modem infrastructure is not ready to replace broadcasting`
`22:51.38`	`stephanb`	`yes it can do downloadable`
`22:51.44`	`Leeds`	`it's fine for streaming audio`
`22:51.50`	`Leeds`	`it's fine for downloadable video`
`22:52.18`	`Leeds`	`put a 120Gb hard drive in a box and you've got quite a few hours of local video storage :-) and that much HDD is cheap nowadays`
`22:53.25`	`stephanb`	`ok`
`22:53.30`	`stephanb`	`enough talking`
`22:53.33`	`Leeds`	`heh`
`22:53.49`	`stephanb`	`i'm gonna brush my teeth`
`22:53.58`	`stephanb`	`see you on saturday ?`
`22:54.01`	`Leeds`	`noope`
`22:54.11`	`stephanb`	`see you some other time then`
`22:54.17`	`Leeds`	`I'm going to be in Bournemouth on a religious thing instead :-)`
`22:54.24`	`Leeds`	`picnic in August?`
`22:54.33`	`stephanb`	`oh you do religious stuff as well ???`
`22:54.49`	`Leeds`	`I think we discussed this - Jewish stuff`
`22:55.07`	`stephanb`	`oh ok, didn't know you were invovled with your community`
`22:55.09`	`Leeds`	`didn't I point you at www.limmud.org?`
`22:55.24`	`Leeds`	`I'm more active communally than religiously...`
`22:55.39`	`stephanb`	`yeah, a bit too much for my oh so limited knowledge of judaism`
`22:55.54`	`Leeds`	`really?`
`22:56.06`	`stephanb`	`we'll have to talk about it some more`
`22:56.22`	`stephanb`	`i wasn't brought up in any practice`
`22:56.35`	`Leeds`	`have a look through last year's conference programme - there's a fascinating mix of stuff in there`
`22:56.45`	`stephanb`	`my parents denied/rejected their own religion`
`22:56.45`	`Leeds`	`I'm part of the tech (read web) team...`
`22:57.38`	`Leeds`	`anyway...`
`22:57.40`	`Leeds`	`g'night`
`22:58.13`	`stephanb`	`nite nite`
`22:58.20`	`stephanb`	`nice talking 2u`
`22:59.10`	`Leeds`	`yeah, you too`
`22:59.20`	`stephanb`	`bye !`
`23:00.36`	`*** part/#gllug stephanb (~frog@dsl-80-46-195-180.access.uk.tiscali.com)`

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