| 00:11.03 | dankolb | 'night all |
| 00:21.07 | SpudUAway | Bend zee kneeez! |
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| 10:10.38 | formi | anybody here ??? |
| 10:19.50 | formi | .. |
| 10:19.51 | formi | ... |
| 10:22.10 | eye69 | I am. |
| 10:22.18 | eye69 | Just woke up. |
| 10:27.01 | Tarragon | Sort of but trying to get some sleep |
| 10:28.02 | eye69 | Sorry for keeping you awake. |
| 10:30.33 | Tarragon | Wish I could sleep :-( |
| 10:31.22 | formi | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:31.27 | formi | see ya |
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| 11:44.56 | Clyphox | Hi all |
| 11:48.18 | Davilion | hi |
| 11:56.22 | Clyphox | :-) |
| 11:56.48 | Davilion | im just up |
| 11:57.45 | Clyphox | Good good.. |
| 11:57.55 | Clyphox | Its Saturday after all.. nice weather to |
| 11:57.55 | Davilion | i feel tired. |
| 11:58.00 | Davilion | yeah its a nice day outside |
| 11:58.06 | Davilion | but im now in the office installing my workstation |
| 11:58.34 | Clyphox | I'm in the office trying to get a customers sendmail going ok.. |
| 11:59.12 | Davilion | ah bollox to that, i want to get my wireless lan working :P |
| 12:00.50 | Davilion | then, im going to get mplayer working followed by xawtv, |
| 12:00.58 | Davilion | of course thats after i've got sound sorted out |
| 12:03.29 | Clyphox | tried mplayer-xp ? |
| 12:03.39 | Clyphox | How do you install mplayer too btw? |
| 12:03.49 | Davilion | whats mplayer-xp? |
| 12:04.01 | Davilion | and im going to use the cvs version today methinks. |
| 12:04.15 | Clyphox | its mplayer but with "Xtra Performance.".. basicly its multi-threaded thats all |
| 12:04.18 | Leeds | I just use mplayer... |
| 12:04.26 | Leeds | has mplayer-xp actually gone anywhere? |
| 12:05.29 | Clyphox | Dunno.. I've reverted due to the lack of mplayer-xp docs.. couldn't get ffmpeg's divx codecs going.. |
| 12:05.53 | Clyphox | I normally just install the mplayer CVS plus the ffmpeg codecs that way.. |
| 12:06.27 | Leeds | I tend to stick to mplayer releases - there are enough of them :-) |
| 12:06.51 | Clyphox | How do you get the divx codecs then? |
| 12:07.15 | Leeds | either use the included ones, or I think I installed a bunch a while ago... |
| 12:08.16 | Clyphox | Its just that the libavcodec is the best I know for encoding. The only way I know to install it is with the mplayer CVS.. (Use it to DivX my DVD's :-) ) |
| 12:08.59 | Leeds | ah - I don't encode very much... but libavcodec is in the mplayer releases, isn't it? |
| 12:09.36 | Clyphox | There is a directory.. |
| 12:09.48 | Clyphox | Never tried.. just done what the docs said really.. |
| 12:10.03 | Clyphox | I can't stand the GUI either :( |
| 12:10.18 | Clyphox | It tends to open a x11 and a SDL window sometimes.. |
| 12:10.36 | Clyphox | Gotta love the aalib output :-) |
| 12:10.39 | Leeds | there's a GUI? :-) |
| 12:10.51 | Clyphox | yup.. don't recommend it.. |
| 12:11.01 | Leeds | I know... I don't like it either... |
| 12:11.24 | Clyphox | I find it lags for DVD playback on all my systemd |
| 12:11.40 | Clyphox | from PII200's to dual P3 system. |
| 12:11.53 | Leeds | the one thing I find missing is DVDnav support... but I've got a DVD player, and I can choose different chapters anyway |
| 12:12.03 | Clyphox | I had to use funny commands to try to adjust the audio delay.. |
| 12:12.19 | Clyphox | I just use xine when I feel like DVD anyhow.. |
| 12:12.51 | Clyphox | but most of the time I just put it in. Lanuch acridrip and dump the Divx. (and watch cause it encodes at DVD quality in realtime :-) |
| 12:12.59 | Clyphox | The joys of a dualy :-) |
| 12:13.08 | Leeds | I tend to go in the other room and use the DVD player with the big TV :-) |
| 12:13.31 | Clyphox | I want to get vlc goin.. |
| 12:13.49 | Clyphox | you can actually dump the dvd with the menu's and all.. |
| 12:14.00 | Clyphox | And play it back anywhere on the network etc.. nice.. |
| 12:14.06 | Leeds | nice |
| 12:14.28 | Leeds | except that I've only got one box with a head on my network, ignoring my iPAQ... |
| 12:14.37 | Clyphox | Yup.. it must be over 2 years old now and I've still never tried hard to get it going |
| 12:15.03 | Clyphox | I just like the way you can dump all the menu's etc.. |
| 12:15.17 | Clyphox | But then I also like "just" the dvd on divx |
| 12:15.26 | Clyphox | no crap.. |
| 12:34.47 | Clyphox | I'm 21 now |
| 12:37.33 | Davilion | congratulations, you must be less stupid than many |
| 12:40.50 | Clyphox | why? |
| 12:41.48 | Davilion | because im sure stupidity accoutns for lots of deaths of sunb 21 year olds :P |
| 12:42.05 | Davilion | it used to be survival of the fittest |
| 12:42.11 | Davilion | now i think its more survival of the least stupid |
| 12:42.12 | Clyphox | lol |
| 12:42.35 | Clyphox | the world is changing.. |
| 12:42.50 | Clyphox | even compare this "war" against 11 years ago.. |
| 12:43.05 | Davilion | yeah. |
| 12:43.23 | Davilion | what scares me is the way things are happening, like, it just looks like all they want is oil. |
| 12:44.45 | Davilion | we;re helping the iraqis by getting rid of their government for one we can buy oil from so we can make the country very rich. |
| 12:48.30 | Clyphox | I'm afraid if ppl really cared about what is right Idi Amin wouldn't still be alive and happy.. |
| 12:49.05 | Clyphox | btw: do I HAVE to reboot to apply my new hostname? |
| 12:49.23 | Davilion | no. |
| 12:49.25 | Davilion | hostname foo |
| 12:49.32 | Davilion | will set the system hostname |
| 12:49.40 | Clyphox | excelent.. |
| 12:52.24 | Clyphox | init 1 should do it too.. |
| 13:06.47 | highbury | you may need to edit /etc/HOSTNAME |
| 13:09.30 | Clyphox | heh.. I know that... :-) |
| 14:03.52 | dpash | hi all |
| 14:04.43 | highbury | hey |
| 14:04.58 | dpash | hmmm too much to be inside |
| 14:05.06 | dpash | /much/nice/ |
| 14:05.12 | dpash | no friends to be outside with |
| 14:05.14 | dpash | bah |
| 14:06.29 | dpash | that sucks. just marked all emailas as read rather than showing unread |
| 14:07.36 | dpash | and everyone here is not here bah |
| 14:08.29 | highbury | what email client? |
| 14:09.54 | dpash | mutt |
| 14:10.34 | highbury | hmm, the should surely be an option to select and mark emails |
| 14:11.55 | highbury | but unfortunately I don't use mutt, so can't really say |
| 14:14.36 | Clyphox | bored? |
| 14:14.42 | Clyphox | Why not come to my party maybe? |
| 14:15.00 | Clyphox | Some other gllug ppl will be there.. |
| 14:15.44 | Clyphox | I must confess I like pine because the menu's are reasonably simple and intuative for me.. |
| 14:16.50 | highbury | agreed, although I nowadays use kmail, pine is rock solid and very flexible |
| 14:19.38 | dpash | pine is (was?) not very good and non-free |
| 14:19.49 | dpash | Clyphox: when is party? |
| 14:19.51 | dpash | tonight? |
| 14:22.12 | Clyphox | pine, non-free ? didn't know that.. |
| 14:22.41 | Clyphox | dpash, starts 7.. only goes till 11 but I'm sure its gonna spill over at home.. (starts at a dumb hall) |
| 14:24.28 | Clyphox | I use imap and then for clients pine/sylpheed or squirelmail.. the imap directories are great.. |
| 14:25.48 | dpash | Clyphox: Clyphox so do I |
| 14:25.51 | dpash | oops |
| 14:26.01 | dpash | I use kmail (when it works) and mutt |
| 14:26.18 | dpash | I'm in the process of making mutt nicer to use |
| 14:26.43 | Clyphox | I tend to prefer gtk programs but I am starting to warm to kde again cause gnome2 is soo slow.. |
| 14:29.42 | highbury | dpash: you are being misleading when you say non-free about pine |
| 14:30.09 | Clyphox | The source is available... |
| 14:30.19 | Clyphox | in fact they gave use imap iirc |
| 14:30.19 | highbury | ok, it is its own license |
| 14:30.29 | highbury | but its not very restrictive |
| 14:30.42 | Clyphox | prolly less restrictive than GPL :( |
| 14:30.55 | highbury | yep Washington did the original specs |
| 14:31.06 | dpash | highbury: it is non-free according to the DFSG |
| 14:31.06 | highbury | and less open to abuse than BSD |
| 14:31.33 | dpash | highbury: and the DFSG is the basis for the Open source definition |
| 14:31.37 | highbury | IIRC that just because it doesn't use GPL |
| 14:31.50 | dpash | highbury: no, go read the DFSG |
| 14:31.50 | Clyphox | hehe |
| 14:32.38 | dpash | http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines |
| 14:32.50 | highbury | well Debian has its own interpretations of Open vs Free, its very political, and very confusing to most people |
| 14:33.14 | dpash | highbury: nope, debian has a very clear interpretation of free |
| 14:33.41 | Clyphox | I feel its a great pity that gnu code can't be used in other opensource code.. |
| 14:34.28 | dpash | LGPL can be |
| 14:34.28 | highbury | yes, its just the rest of the "Open" community feel it may be a bit strict |
| 14:35.27 | highbury | and besides many of us don't run Debian (although I am an ardent Knoppix fan, and am downloading the first 3.2 release now) |
| 14:36.03 | dpash | However, redistribution of a modified version of Pine requires explicit permission from the University of Washington. |
| 14:36.10 | dpash | http://www.washington.edu/pine/faq/legal.html |
| 14:36.17 | dpash | that kinda makes it non-free |
| 14:36.27 | highbury | dpash: but you are interchanging the word "Free" and "Open" which is also slightly confusing |
| 14:37.00 | highbury | I'd agree "non-Free as per Debian's definition" |
| 14:37.19 | dpash | I've only used the word open once |
| 14:37.23 | dpash | [14:31] < dpash> highbury: and the DFSG is the basis for the Open source definition |
| 14:37.55 | highbury | on what basis do you say that? |
| 14:38.17 | dpash | The Debian Free Software Guidelines (DFSG) part of the contract, initially designed as a set of commitments that we agree to abide by, has been adopted by the free software community as the basis of the Open Source Definition. |
| 14:38.24 | dpash | http://www.debian.org/social_contract |
| 14:39.15 | highbury | Whats the relationship between "free software community" and non-debian people? |
| 14:39.48 | dpash | Origins: Bruce Perens wrote the first draft of this document as "The Debian Free Software Guidelines", and refined it using the comments of the Debian developers in a month-long e-mail conference in June, 1997. He removed the Debian-specific references from the document to create the "Open Source Definition." |
| 14:39.53 | dpash | http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php |
| 14:40.34 | highbury | ahh thanks for the link |
| 14:41.14 | dpash | so pine is even non-Open as per clause 3 of the OS definition |
| 14:42.24 | dpash | and IIRC Free is Open, but Open isn;t nessaccerily Free |
| 14:42.27 | highbury | hmmm, that must cover a lot of software which is included in most commercial distributions |
| 14:42.36 | dpash | highbury: yes it does |
| 14:42.46 | dpash | except Debian |
| 14:43.12 | dpash | and possibly others, but Debian is the main one |
| 14:44.00 | dpash | Even if debian gets permission to distribute something as part of Debian it still can't be part of Debian |
| 14:45.45 | highbury | hmmm, is there a term which differentiates between things like pine (which is binary and source available) and full proprietary software? |
| 14:46.09 | highbury | Freely distributable? |
| 14:46.44 | dpash | no, not really |
| 14:46.57 | dpash | Phil will be able to explain this stuff much better than I could |
| 14:47.28 | dpash | "freely available"? |
| 14:47.40 | dpash | software gratis |
| 14:47.49 | dpash | and not software libre |
| 14:48.06 | dpash | free beer, not free speech |
| 14:48.52 | highbury | hmmm, more for me to ponder. |
| 14:49.20 | highbury | so how is XFree86 categorised? |
| 14:49.52 | dpash | it is in main, so it isn't non-free |
| 14:50.29 | dpash | it is under the MIT license |
| 14:50.32 | highbury | hmmm, though some of the recent furore makes one think :-) |
| 14:51.26 | highbury | ok, I'm off to the shops, then to play with htmltidy and xmllint |
| 14:52.30 | highbury_shops | dang! I wish I knew how to change my nick only on one channel |
| 14:53.10 | dpash | you can't, unless you join the server multiple times |
| 14:53.24 | dpash | can your irc client let you do that? |
| 14:55.18 | Clyphox-a | off to meet Dan.. cyas |
| 14:58.30 | dpash | bah |
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| 17:18.36 | pdr | ahoy |
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| 17:48.45 | marko85_uk | hi everyone |
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| 18:04.09 | denivri | evening all |
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| 18:36.11 | gj_ | re |
| 18:53.26 | pdr | bbl |
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| 21:15.21 | denivri | ayeup |
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| 22:45.01 | dpash | hi all |
| 22:45.16 | Leeds | evening |
| 22:45.22 | dpash | cupis: ping |
| 22:45.27 | dpash | how is everyone? |
| 22:45.33 | cupis | hey all |
| 22:45.37 | Leeds | not bad... tired |
| 22:46.40 | dpash | the people they have to advertise the channel have such a horrible accent it puts you right off |
| 22:47.14 | dpash | okay they may be naked, but they sound like they should be walking around council estates pushing prams |
| 22:52.19 | dpash | anyone else awake? |
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| 22:52.28 | dpash | hi paul |
| 22:54.54 | Leeds | Bruce Dickinson is such a cultured and polite rocker :-) |
| 22:55.58 | dpash | unlike the filth on TV |
| 22:56.08 | dpash | who definitely were not cultured |
| 22:57.40 | cupis_ | re |
| 22:59.25 | dpash | cupis: have you larted the k3b-i18n maintainer yet? |
| 23:00.07 | Leeds | dpash: actually, while you're here... is kde 3.1.1 a big change from a building/packaging view? |
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| 23:00.24 | dpash | Leeds: from 3.1.0? no |
| 23:00.41 | dpash | from 3.0.0, yes |
| 23:00.53 | dpash | from 2.2.2 heck yeah |
| 23:00.58 | cupis | dpash: why would I do that? |
| 23:00.58 | Leeds | cool... our KDE guy almost had a fit when he saw there was a new release - he's been working on 3.1.0 for months :-) |
| 23:01.43 | cupis | dpash: have you seen #184847? |
| 23:02.03 | dpash | Leeds: we (well calc) works with branch, so he always has most recent version |
| 23:02.11 | dpash | changes are gradual |
| 23:02.43 | Leeds | it's a big enough deal for us that we tend to ignore minor releases... but since he hasn't delivered 3.1.0 yet... |
| 23:02.58 | dpash | cupis: yeah I have |
| 23:03.00 | Leeds | either way, he' |
| 23:03.15 | Leeds | argh... he's changed the way it builds so it should be easier to update in future |
| 23:03.18 | dpash | cupis: surely you should ship the i18m crap |
| 23:03.36 | cupis | dpash: I don't maintain k3b? |
| 23:03.46 | dpash | I thought you did |
| 23:04.01 | dpash | hmmm maybe I'm thinking of cdbakeoven |
| 23:04.07 | cupis | dpash: cdbakeoven, and no, I don't currently ship the i18n stuff, though upstream does |
| 23:04.30 | dpash | ibot: lart me |
| 23:04.36 | dpash | w00t |
| 23:05.25 | dpash | cupis: what do you think I should do about that bug? |
| 23:05.38 | dpash | I should perhaps contact him |
| 23:05.54 | dpash | I don't particularly have a problem with the package name |
| 23:06.32 | cupis | well imo you should have some dialog with him |
| 23:06.47 | dpash | yeah |
| 23:06.54 | cupis | if his package dep's on -snapshot, the package name might want to reflect that, but I don't think so |
| 23:07.29 | dpash | he says that he is duplicating headers so perhaps he should be using irssi-dev |
| 23:07.31 | cupis | I just wanted to check you'd seen it, been contacted - couldn't be bother to email. |
| 23:07.52 | dpash | cupis: I had seen it, but had forgotten about it |
| 23:08.07 | dpash | can you ping me about it tommorw in case I forget |
| 23:08.40 | dpash | I'm sure kubrick would have made a better film |
| 23:09.15 | cupis | dpash: what did you make of the last half-hour, from a film-go-ers point of view |
| 23:10.37 | dpash | before or after the freezing |
| 23:10.43 | cupis | after |
| 23:10.55 | cupis | from the freezing point onwards |
| 23:11.02 | dpash | not quite sure |
| 23:11.29 | dpash | wasn't exactly fast paced |
| 23:11.34 | cupis | seemed v.long and drawn out to me |
| 23:12.16 | dpash | the scene were they are travelling through the ice seemed overly long |
| 23:12.32 | dpash | I'm sure the book will be better too |
| 23:12.45 | dpash | which reminds me I still have minority report to read |
| 23:13.01 | dpash | cupis: did you watch it today too or a while ago? |
| 23:13.46 | cupis | dpash: a while aho |
| 23:13.59 | cupis | s,aho,ago, |
| 23:14.56 | dpash | they seemed to remove a bit form top&bottom and only add a little left&right |
| 23:21.32 | dpash | okay I'm officially bored |
| 23:21.44 | dpash | I can't find anything interesting to read on the web |
| 23:21.53 | dpash | jackass is on mtv2 so no decent music |
| 23:22.38 | Leeds | grab frotz... |
| 23:23.34 | cupis | mmmm, bagels |
| 23:24.07 | cupis | did you ever speak to kandalf about pinentry in sid? |
| 23:24.15 | dpash | yeah |
| 23:24.21 | cupis | and? |
| 23:24.22 | dpash | he was going to do it |
| 23:24.30 | dpash | I don't recall him filing a ITP |
| 23:24.38 | dpash | and it certianly isn;t ther yet |
| 23:24.54 | cupis | maybe time for an rfp :) |
| 23:25.22 | dpash | time for a lart ;) |
| 23:26.33 | cupis | dpash: if you're in a lart-ing kind of mood, checkout the bug reports for martin@debian.org |
| 23:28.33 | dpash | elvisnox won't do X |
| 23:31.53 | Leeds | bagel time... |
| 23:32.26 | dpash | cupis: he has lots of bugs |
| 23:32.32 | cupis | dpash: yes |
| 23:32.39 | cupis | though aparently he is active |
| 23:32.48 | dpash | really? |
| 23:33.01 | dpash | well he has closed 2 count them 2 bugs in the last 28 days |
| 23:33.03 | cupis | you wouldn't guess that from his bug list, would you? |
| 23:33.25 | cupis | he uploaded one of his packages on the 18th? |
| 23:34.20 | cupis | #161885: cdrdao: New upstream version - fixed in NMU |
| 23:35.00 | dpash | cupis: can you look at http://packages.qa.debian.org/i/irssi-snapshot.html and tell me why it hasn't gone into testing yet? |
| 23:37.44 | dpash | hmm debcheck mentions that libssl0.9.6 is in oldlibs on arm |
| 23:37.50 | dpash | could that be related? |
| 23:38.48 | cupis | dpash: the arm buildd maintainer does not seem to have uploaded the arm package yet |
| 23:39.38 | cupis | may be related to libssl |
| 23:40.36 | dpash | I think arm may not have a libssl0.9.7 |
| 23:40.49 | cupis | dpash: they do |
| 23:41.33 | cupis | but they have not uploaded your package - maybe wanting to rebuild against 0..9.7, maybe just slow |
| 23:41.46 | cupis | dpash: you could always ask then |
| 23:42.17 | dpash | there was a buildd build on arm 9th Mar |
| 23:42.57 | dpash | of which I can see no problem |
| 23:43.10 | cupis | dpash: it has been built. it has not been uploaded |