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00:04.18 | T0mW | Crofton: not too much, I guess that we got about 8 inches. most of it is gone with today's warm weather. |
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00:05.13 | T0mW | Crofton: my friend over in Rockaway, NJ had 20+ inches, heh |
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02:36.09 | MonMotha | anyone know any resources for reverse engineering binary kernel drivers? I've got a decent bit of experience with reverse engineering embeded linux userspaces and userspace applications, but not kernel drivers |
02:36.20 | MonMotha | I don't really even know how to attach a debugger to the darn thign |
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05:45.21 | T0mW | MonMotha: still there? |
05:45.52 | MonMotha | yes, I am |
05:45.57 | T0mW | ok |
05:46.19 | T0mW | reverse engineering is a bit problematic. depends on how badly you want something. |
05:46.54 | T0mW | obviously, taking apart something written asm is a lot easier than doing it with optimized C. |
05:47.12 | MonMotha | T0mW: well, this driver was definately written in C, but I still have a bunch of symbols |
05:47.20 | MonMotha | it's not stripped, but it doesn't appear to ahve been compiled with debugging either |
05:47.38 | T0mW | if the C has not gone through and optimized, AND, you've been staring at the output asm of the compiler for a while. You can recognize various conditionals, loops, etc. |
05:48.14 | MonMotha | yeah, I can do that sort of stuff, but in this case I think it may be handy to be able to breakpoint the driver. Is that even possible with a kernel driver? |
05:48.23 | T0mW | MonMotha: the only thing that I am aware of that will help is either objdump using disassemly option, or nm |
05:48.29 | MonMotha | well, I have Ida on it :) |
05:49.03 | T0mW | we made a lot of jokes in high school about a woman named "Ida", obviously you are not talking about the same woman |
05:49.22 | MonMotha | you don't know about Ida? |
05:49.39 | T0mW | no |
05:49.49 | T0mW | ~ida |
05:50.02 | MonMotha | http://www.datarescue.com/ |
05:50.03 | T0mW | ibot: wake up |
05:50.05 | ibot | up: GOOD MORNING!!! |
05:50.09 | T0mW | ~ida |
05:50.11 | T0mW | ~ida? |
05:50.23 | T0mW | something broke there |
05:50.32 | MonMotha | ibot ida is at http://www.datarescue.com/idabase/index.htm |
05:50.33 | ibot | okay, MonMotha |
05:50.37 | MonMotha | ~ida |
05:50.38 | ibot | well, ida is at http://www.datarescue.com/idabase/index.htm |
05:50.47 | T0mW | ~botsnack |
05:50.47 | ibot | thanks, T0mW |
05:51.08 | T0mW | THERE IS IDA'S PICTURE! |
05:51.13 | T0mW | heh |
05:51.56 | T0mW | MonMotha: without reading endlessly, what is it? |
05:51.58 | MonMotha | I'm mostly curious if it's possible to chuck a debugger on a kernel module |
05:52.09 | MonMotha | oh, ida is a graphical disassembler with extensive crossreferencing functionality |
05:52.18 | MonMotha | it'll xref strings, jumps, procedures, etc. |
05:52.42 | T0mW | MonMotha: well, the Abatron BDI2000 documentation claims that you can debug the linux kernel with their pod |
05:53.23 | T0mW | MonMotha: can't you put gdbserver inside the kernel and do remote debugging from another machine? |
05:53.31 | T0mW | one that has the symbol table on it? |
05:53.57 | T0mW | problem is that gdbserver + gdb usually want source to follow |
05:54.27 | MonMotha | yeah, I definately don't have source to this driver |
05:54.28 | T0mW | MonMotha: does Ida use gdbserver? or TCP/Remote connections? |
05:54.40 | MonMotha | it uses its own userspace component |
05:54.45 | MonMotha | it's a rather proprietary product |
05:54.51 | T0mW | ok |
05:56.01 | T0mW | AFAIK, you need some type of symbolic info to do debug. gdb is not like msdos debug where it will disasm blindly. |
05:56.41 | T0mW | MonMotha: I've done reverse engineering of source on X86 and 8 bit controllers. the X86 stuff I really wanted. |
05:57.09 | MonMotha | T0mW: well, I have a full ELF with some symbols |
05:57.32 | T0mW | it was only 22K of compiled code but took me 3..4 months to reverse. It was written in Turbo C and I knew that compiler very well. |
05:57.49 | MonMotha | yeah, I've been doing some other work. It's tough |
05:57.54 | MonMotha | the main program binary is 927k! |
05:57.59 | T0mW | ow |
05:58.04 | T0mW | waaaaay too big |
05:58.07 | MonMotha | well, it statically links a bunch of libraries |
05:58.37 | T0mW | yeah |
05:58.42 | MonMotha | the kernel driver I'm working with is only 50k |
05:59.23 | T0mW | 50K is not that big... However, you need to take a look at the code, did you try running objdump across it? |
05:59.35 | T0mW | just to see what is in there? |
06:00.16 | MonMotha | I ahve the code, and I know what I'm interested in |
06:00.17 | T0mW | MonMotha: what is it? X86 or ARM ? |
06:00.20 | MonMotha | x86 |
06:00.23 | T0mW | k |
06:00.34 | MonMotha | I ened to know what a particular ioctl does |
06:00.41 | T0mW | disassembling arm can make you certifiably nuts |
06:00.49 | MonMotha | I'm just curious if ther'es any better way than following the code in a disassembly |
06:01.19 | T0mW | unless you can fish a gdbserver into the kernel, ... |
06:01.29 | T0mW | s/fish/insert/ |
06:01.39 | MonMotha | ibot fishslap ibot |
06:01.41 | ibot | ACTION slaps ibot up side the head with a wet fish. |
06:01.56 | T0mW | I wish I could opt out of that "feature" |
06:02.22 | MonMotha | yeah |
06:02.29 | MonMotha | btw, what does "mov eax, eax" accomplish? |
06:02.42 | T0mW | waste time? |
06:03.10 | T0mW | I don't know much about the enhanced mode on x86 |
06:03.23 | T0mW | mostly my x86 experience has been with 80c188 |
06:03.26 | MonMotha | I was just curious if it would actually do anything |
06:03.36 | MonMotha | afact it has no effect on flags, anything |
06:04.11 | T0mW | other than being redundant, I wonder if it does something to the X86 internal breakpoint mechanism? |
06:04.42 | MonMotha | is there any reason a compiler would generate that though? |
06:05.40 | T0mW | unless, it is a compiler optimizer hiccup? |
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06:06.43 | MonMotha | it seems to do it quite often |
06:06.50 | MonMotha | with various registers |
06:08.01 | T0mW | MonMotha: maybe CosmicPenguin has more experience with X86 assembler? |
06:08.48 | MonMotha | yeah, this would appear to be a nuance many people aren't familiar with |
06:08.59 | MonMotha | I was thinkign maybe some sort of pipeline hinting for new procs |
06:43.34 | Russ | thats funny, wake up... |
06:43.40 | Russ | ibot: wake high |
06:43.41 | ibot | high: GOOD MORNING!!! |
06:43.45 | Russ | ibot wake low |
06:43.46 | ibot | low: GOOD MORNING!!! |
06:43.58 | Russ | ibot wake ibot |
06:43.59 | ibot | ibot: GOOD MORNING!!! |
06:46.04 | T0mW | wake dead?\ |
06:46.05 | T0mW | wake dead? |
06:46.06 | T0mW | nope |
06:46.21 | Russ | you need to tell ibot |
06:46.25 | Russ | ibot: wake nickserv |
06:46.26 | ibot | nickserv: GOOD MORNING!!! |
06:46.48 | Russ | I like this one |
06:46.55 | Russ | ibot: identify is password |
06:46.56 | ibot | ...but identify is already something else... |
06:47.01 | Russ | ibot: identify? |
06:47.03 | ibot | Extensible Integrated Development Environment. URL: http://www.pietrobo.com/projects/IDEntify/ |
06:47.11 | Russ | ibot: tell nickserv about identify |
06:47.27 | Russ | ibot: register is password |
06:47.28 | ibot | ...but register is already something else... |
06:47.32 | Russ | ibot: register? |
06:47.34 | ibot | Register at http://my.bzflag.org/bb/ for both forum access and global logins in-game |
06:47.42 | Russ | ibot: tell nickserv about register |
06:48.09 | T0mW | Russ: ibot might not be the sharpest knife in the drawer but he is dogged about something it does know about... |
06:48.33 | Russ | its just too bad ibot is already registered with nickserv |
06:48.36 | Russ | hmm |
06:49.11 | Russ | ibot: link? |
06:49.12 | ibot | somebody said link was titled "Convert Hauppauge IR remote control to IRMAN" |
06:49.21 | Russ | ibot: no, link is russ |
06:49.22 | ibot | Russ: okay |
06:49.28 | Russ | ibot: tell nickserv about link |
06:49.44 | Russ | ibot, no link is titled "Convert Hauppauge IR remote control to IRMAN" |
06:49.45 | ibot | Russ: okay |
06:49.54 | kergoth | bleh |
06:50.00 | Russ | feeling better? |
06:50.03 | T0mW | ~lart kergoth |
06:51.19 | kergoth | this morning my stomach started to feel better, this afternoon the dizzy spells stopped, then this afternoon i get hit with a bout of depression hardcore. this is not my week. heh. |
06:51.22 | T0mW | kergoth: coffee? |
06:51.22 | T0mW | kergoth: are you diseased? |
06:51.32 | kergoth | just got hit with some sort of stomach flu or something |
06:51.33 | kergoth | dunno |
06:51.45 | T0mW | kergoth: and ear infection too huh? |
06:52.22 | kergoth | shrug, didnt take anything for it, just let it work itself out |
06:53.28 | T0mW | kergoth: you just moved into a new area, I guess it will take you time to get used to the new germs |
06:53.50 | T0mW | get in sync with the local populace |
06:54.18 | kergoth | yea. doubt the major climate change from minnesota to arizona helped matters |
06:54.35 | kergoth | ah well. |
06:57.47 | T0mW | anybody do USB drivers for linux? |
06:58.50 | T0mW | I've got somebody looking for a consultant to do a Linux USB driver for JTAG unit. |
07:02.23 | T0mW | google sux at finding source |
07:06.10 | Russ | I've done some usb stuff |
07:06.19 | Russ | some drivers you can do in userspace |
07:08.01 | T0mW | Russ: this was from Signum Systems looking for a consultant. You interested in it? |
07:18.40 | Russ | don't have the time |
07:19.09 | T0mW | yeah, and I don't want to get involved with USB |
07:26.03 | MonMotha | T0mW: I've done USB drivers in linux |
07:26.16 | T0mW | you want this job? |
07:26.20 | MonMotha | for a device like that, it's probably more appropriate to use libusb, though. Which I have not done |
07:26.28 | MonMotha | got a description? |
07:27.27 | T0mW | MonMotha: fscking cable modem went offline again. |
07:27.46 | MonMotha | T0mW: fun fun |
07:27.50 | MonMotha | do you have a description of the job? |
07:27.52 | T0mW | MonMotha: you want me to pass your email to them? |
07:28.13 | T0mW | I got your email from the last posting on the LPC2000 group. |
07:28.13 | T0mW | Since you are a consultant, I'd like to know if you have experience with writing USB drivers for Linux. |
07:28.13 | T0mW | Our device is a USB 2.0 JTAG debugger and as such needs a specialized driver. |
07:28.16 | MonMotha | well, do you know what the timeframe looks like? |
07:28.28 | T0mW | that's all they sent me, just an inquiry |
07:28.32 | MonMotha | hum, ok |
07:28.38 | MonMotha | yeah, you can pass them my email |
07:28.42 | MonMotha | monmotha@indy.rr.com |
07:28.57 | T0mW | MonMotha: ok, I'll pass along your email and you can discuss with them. |
07:29.05 | MonMotha | ok. thanks |
07:29.31 | T0mW | MonMotha: do you have a name? other then MonMotha ? heh |
07:29.48 | MonMotha | Brandon |
07:30.20 | T0mW | k |
07:31.26 | T0mW | done |
07:31.49 | MonMotha | ok |
07:31.55 | MonMotha | I have some time coming up, but not a whole lot |
07:32.17 | MonMotha | since I am a full time student, I don't get things done as quickly as many consultants do, so I'm not always an appropriate person to use |
07:33.46 | T0mW | MonMotha: eh, they might not be as picky as you think. |
07:34.16 | T0mW | MonMotha: they might be excited by how cheaply they could get you to do it. :P |
07:34.20 | MonMotha | I know some companies are on more of a timeframe than others |
07:34.30 | MonMotha | and yes, I'm cheap compared to many. The downside is how long I take to do it |
07:34.40 | MonMotha | it really depends on what they're looking for |
07:34.46 | MonMotha | I'm pretty up front with all that stuff |
07:35.01 | MonMotha | some people jump at the opportunity to get it done cheaply, others walk due to the timeline |
07:36.07 | T0mW | yeah, I dunno. I wonder if they made it an opensource initiative and offered cheap units to intereseted developers that that might not be the way to go. No one developer, as a linux based jtag would interest a lot of arm people. |
07:36.43 | MonMotha | yeah |
07:36.55 | T0mW | interest might be generated by seeding some cheap units in the right hands. e.g. "you want this you need to build the driver..." |
07:40.16 | T0mW | I've got a package seqfaulting and I'm sure it is a bad / corrupted lib image. How to find that? |
07:40.37 | T0mW | nothing in logs |
07:40.49 | MonMotha | package? |
07:41.15 | Russ | gdb |
07:41.18 | MonMotha | hey, you happen to know if GCC aligns struct members? |
07:41.27 | T0mW | yeah, it does |
07:41.27 | Russ | MonMotha: architecture specific |
07:41.36 | T0mW | what Russ said |
07:41.43 | T0mW | specific rules based on arch |
07:41.56 | MonMotha | Russ: x86 |
07:42.04 | Russ | you can say __attribute__ ((__packed__)) to make it go away for sure |
07:42.21 | MonMotha | well, what's the default behavior on x86? |
07:42.23 | T0mW | Russ: doesn't x86 do packing by default due to byte nature of x86 cpus? |
07:42.23 | Russ | I haven't seen gcc align any members, but that doesn't mean it won't |
07:42.31 | Russ | (in x86) |
07:42.32 | MonMotha | it would make sense |
07:42.35 | MonMotha | ok |
07:42.44 | T0mW | arm is int32 alignment |
07:42.49 | MonMotha | oh wait, nm |
07:42.55 | MonMotha | the struct has said attribute |
07:43.02 | Russ | some future gcc version optimizing your code for some new x86 proc might decide to align something |
07:43.10 | Russ | T0mW: no, it aligns to word size |
07:43.20 | Russ | a u16 will align to a u16 |
07:43.24 | Russ | a u32 will align to a u32 |
07:45.17 | cdm | yeah, and then performance wise things get crazy with the ARM11. |
07:45.28 | cdm | with the 64bit fetches from cache, etc |
07:45.43 | T0mW | heh |
07:45.54 | T0mW | cdm: grinds gears eh? |
07:46.01 | Russ | I hate people who write api's with unaligned data members |
07:46.38 | T0mW | cdm: fetch a byte aligned member slams it into 1st gear |
07:46.38 | cdm | Russ - I hate people who write(savefile, &somestruct, sizeof(somestruct)) and expect it to work everywhere. ;) |
07:46.45 | Russ | heh |
07:46.55 | MonMotha | cdm: yes, that's annoying. Completely not portable |
07:46.57 | Russ | I just have a lot of get_unaligned put_unaligned all over my code |
07:46.58 | T0mW | unless it's packed |
07:47.05 | Russ | T0mW: even if |
07:47.07 | cdm | T0MW - but then it can crash |
07:47.10 | MonMotha | even if you take care of alignment issues, there's still endianness |
07:47.10 | T0mW | really?! |
07:47.12 | cdm | on SH, ARM, and MIPS |
07:47.13 | Russ | T0mW: endianness, floating point format |
07:47.18 | T0mW | screw endian |
07:47.24 | T0mW | you get nailed anyway |
07:47.40 | Russ | so many subs on the project I work on don't understand whan endianness is |
07:47.41 | cdm | yes - the compiler will emit structs you can't actually access if you pack on those architectures. |
07:47.42 | T0mW | those are givens |
07:47.46 | Russ | sucks |
07:48.18 | Russ | so for this device, the vendor id is little endian, for this device, its big endian, etc |
07:48.37 | T0mW | IIRC someone did a paper on how big-endian was a bad idea for processor memory? |
07:48.56 | Russ | I really don't think it matters anymore |
07:49.10 | cdm | struct crashme { uint8_t foo, uint16_t death, uint8_t bar } __attribute__((packed)) |
07:49.37 | Russ | although a single instruction to swab a register would be nice |
07:49.48 | cdm | Russ - yeah it would. |
07:49.50 | Russ | cdm: only if you don't have an alignment handler, and don't use get/put_unaligned |
07:50.06 | Russ | its not like a swap instruction would be complex |
07:50.09 | Russ | er, swab |
07:50.27 | T0mW | doesn't arm11 do a swab? |
07:50.28 | Russ | heck, make it one of the arithmetic bits, does arm have any of those left over? |
07:50.29 | cdm | Russ - right. Everywhere I worked we killed apps rather then allow them to hide behind an alignment handler. |
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07:51.23 | cdm | same with floating point |
07:51.26 | T0mW | heh, make binary data files illegal, punishable by 6 months in coding school |
07:51.58 | Russ | T0mW: no, you just need to define the data format, and don't define it as just a "struct" |
07:52.13 | T0mW | define it how then? |
07:52.21 | Russ | by byte, and by content |
07:52.30 | Russ | ie, byte 16-20 is a IEEE float |
07:52.38 | T0mW | ok |
07:52.45 | Russ | byte 20-22 is a little endian unsigned short |
07:53.26 | MonMotha | heh, I just write completely unportable code :) |
07:53.36 | MonMotha | though I know I'm doing it and only do it when it REALLY doesn't matter |
07:53.45 | MonMotha | (as in I'm writing something for myself) |
07:54.14 | cdm | Russ - yeah, but people don't like like writing protocol documents. |
07:54.24 | cdm | which is basically what is what. |
07:54.36 | MonMotha | protocol documents are good |
07:54.52 | MonMotha | much better when well done than a single implementation |
07:55.17 | Russ | really? |
07:55.25 | Russ | our documents end up going through a filter |
07:55.52 | Russ | so, sub a writes a document, and describes a data field as an enumeration, and lists the types, but no associated numbers |
07:56.03 | Russ | you just have to assume that the first one is 0, second is 1, etc |
07:56.15 | T0mW | I've a clobbered system, hard drive failed sometime ago. I've an XFS LVM on it, can I salvage that volume if I install a fresh copy of the distro? |
07:56.28 | Russ | prime gets the document, and sees stuff in there that isn't yet a requirement, so we shouldn't see it, so they take it out of the list |
07:56.51 | Russ | T0mW: I would take the drive out and attach it to a running system |
07:57.07 | Russ | ide usb enclosures are cheap |
07:57.17 | T0mW | Russ: I did that, copied the good partition data onto a good drive, that got me going. |
07:57.30 | Russ | I'm confused |
07:57.32 | T0mW | Russ: but, a lot of binaries got screwed |
07:57.35 | Russ | ah |
07:57.43 | Russ | distro? |
07:57.59 | T0mW | Russ: the system ran ok, but with random issues: mandriva 10.1 |
07:58.07 | T0mW | 2.6 kernel |
07:58.11 | Russ | hmmm |
07:58.16 | Russ | I don't know enough about mandriva |
07:58.25 | T0mW | 2.6.8.1 kernel |
07:58.35 | T0mW | Russ: interesting thing. |
07:58.36 | Russ | if it were debian, I would do a minimal install somewhere, copy the binaries on top of the original drive |
07:58.48 | Russ | chroot, and then do a apt-get reinstall of all installed packages |
07:59.13 | T0mW | Russ: the new mandriva 2006 distro will do an orderly shutdown power off if you press the power button on an atx machine! that is cool! |
08:00.12 | Russ | I had a bad situation where I had a raid array with three drives, had one drive fail, didn't notice, and then 2 weeks later, had another drive fail. |
08:00.16 | T0mW | Russ: good suggestion! thanks, didn't think of that. I could partition the new drive the same, copy the lvm parition over, then manually reconstruct the lvm entries in /etc |
08:00.23 | Russ | the second drive that failed wouldn't spin up |
08:00.30 | Russ | the first would, and data could be copied off |
08:00.50 | T0mW | Russ: is /proc/mdstat reliable to monitor the health of the software RAID? |
08:00.51 | Russ | The only things that ended up being screwed up where any files that were modified during that 2 week period |
08:00.57 | Russ | yes |
08:01.15 | Russ | course, you might want email notification, and smartd too |
08:01.34 | T0mW | good, I'm planning on a cron to sweep through /proc/mdstat periodically looking for a failed drive then notifiy by email. |
08:01.44 | Russ | I had to do the whole copy over minimal binaries to get the package manager working again, and then reinstall all installed packages |
08:01.49 | T0mW | this will be a remote machine on the network (VPN) |
08:01.55 | Russ | I'm sure there is already some utility to do that |
08:02.19 | T0mW | the software raid seems to be pretty fast! |
08:02.30 | T0mW | at least at my loads |
08:03.05 | Russ | cdm: you know anything about arm and YUV->RGB? |
08:03.32 | Russ | I may need to do a YUV translation on a 800x600 16 bit color video stream at 30fps |
08:03.57 | T0mW | in realtime? |
08:03.59 | Russ | yes |
08:04.08 | T0mW | Zone Alarm |
08:04.16 | Russ | thats free, isn't it? |
08:04.18 | T0mW | yeah |
08:04.34 | Russ | does it come with spybot search and destroy? |
08:04.36 | T0mW | it is for remote ip / usb / etc cameras |
08:05.32 | T0mW | I've been meaning to get back to do some indepth to see if that will give us some recording monitoring capablilites for a slew of IP cameras (Axis) |
08:05.36 | T0mW | no |
08:05.41 | Russ | it was a joke |
08:05.43 | T0mW | not zone alarm. |
08:05.51 | T0mW | let me look in bookmarks |
08:06.01 | Russ | anyway, it'd be 14 million pixels per second |
08:06.19 | T0mW | Russ: iirc, it touted some on-the-fly codec stuff to translate |
08:06.52 | Russ | I'm just worried because at 433MHz, thats 30 cpu cycles per pixel |
08:07.48 | T0mW | http://www.zoneminder.com/ |
08:07.49 | T0mW | LOL, is that all! |
08:07.49 | T0mW | Russ: you ever think of a dedicated hardware codec? |
08:08.03 | T0mW | that's a lot of data |
08:08.29 | Russ | ya, but I do have a 64bit memory bus |
08:08.50 | Russ | I figure if I lock 2k of lookup tables in the cache, I might have a good chance |
08:09.19 | T0mW | I transcode mpeg2 --> divx regularly. 2gig of mpeg2 takes an hour on an Athlon 2.4GHz (it is 700x400 format? something like that) |
08:09.38 | Russ | right, but I'm just looking to do YUV->RGB |
08:09.46 | T0mW | yah, simpler |
08:10.05 | MonMotha | T0mW: you should play aroung with h.264. Will make your DivX encodes look like they dont' take any time |
08:10.12 | T0mW | mythtv stores it's frame data in YUV format... |
08:10.36 | Russ | its something like R=Y+1.140*V, G=Y-0.395*U - 0.581*V, B=Y+2.032U |
08:11.06 | T0mW | MonMotha: well, it is recorded tv shows, I need to edit the commericials out. So far, all I've found to do that, somewhat reasonably easy, is avidemux |
08:11.22 | Russ | so you'd have a table for 1.140*V, 0.395*U, 0.581*V, and 2.032*U |
08:11.25 | MonMotha | T0mW: you should be able to pass the output of avidemux into an h.264 encoder (mencoder can do it) |
08:12.11 | T0mW | MonMotha: I've tinkered with mencoder, nothing sucessfull |
08:12.25 | MonMotha | I have an line that works to encode to h.264 video |
08:12.29 | T0mW | MonMotha: problem is the cutlists |
08:12.44 | MonMotha | doesn't mythtranscode handle cutlists for you? |
08:12.52 | Russ | load, add, clip, shift, load, subtrack, load, subtrack, clip, shift, orr, load, add, clip, shift, orr |
08:13.15 | T0mW | MonMotha: yeah, it's own cutlist database. But editing cutlists in mythtv is "interesting" |
08:13.22 | MonMotha | I know |
08:13.32 | MonMotha | I've done stuff with MythTV it was never intended to do, I'm sure |
08:13.34 | T0mW | Russ: easy son, you're stuttering! |
08:13.40 | T0mW | :P |
08:14.10 | Russ | editing cutlists in mythfrontend has always been easy for me |
08:14.44 | T0mW | MonMotha: I don't mind doing it offline, the server I have for the videos is doing nothing all day so it might as well run the editing / transcoding |
08:15.15 | T0mW | 300+ movies and counting |
08:15.57 | MonMotha | Russ: Did I imply I was doing it with mythfrontend? :) |
08:16.01 | T0mW | at least DVD-R+ has come down in price lately |
08:16.21 | MonMotha | I have a system for recording HD material that involves SSHing files over a network and doing a manual insert followed by a call to mythcommflag to build the seek table |
08:16.27 | Russ | a |
08:16.31 | Russ | h |
08:16.46 | T0mW | MonMotha: you record HD?! |
08:16.52 | T0mW | HDTV? |
08:16.53 | MonMotha | T0mW: terrestrial broadcast, yup |
08:16.56 | MonMotha | I have a pcHDTV 3000 |
08:16.57 | T0mW | how |
08:16.58 | T0mW | ? |
08:17.01 | T0mW | ah |
08:17.07 | MonMotha | it just feeds me an MPEG2 stream using the DVB API |
08:17.22 | T0mW | does that also do the std NTSC broadcasts as well as HDTV? |
08:17.27 | MonMotha | I'm working on a setup using Dish network, which is fun since it's almost impossible to do legally |
08:17.35 | MonMotha | yeah, but I don't use it for that |
08:17.42 | MonMotha | since it does not have a hardware encoder for that |
08:17.52 | MonMotha | I have a cable box and a PVR-150 for regular stuff |
08:18.15 | T0mW | MonMotha: well, the local cable company has been pushing their HDTV recievers and I've resisted as I dunno if I could record them with a mythtv setup |
08:18.52 | T0mW | subst/recievers/cable boxes/ |
08:19.41 | MonMotha | does it have a firewire port? |
08:19.44 | MonMotha | their box taht is |
08:19.56 | Russ | I'm hoping I'll be able to buy digital tuner pci cards and switch over to digital cable seamlessly |
08:20.09 | Russ | no settop boxes |
08:20.13 | T0mW | Russ: me too |
08:21.06 | T0mW | Russ: my cable company has "cable on demand" and I'm afraid their cable box may have broadcast flag or other crap |
08:21.11 | MonMotha | Russ: in the USA? good luck |
08:21.15 | MonMotha | OpenCable isn't open enough |
08:21.25 | Russ | T0mW: you can still buy cards that ignore the broadcast flag |
08:21.28 | MonMotha | my HD tuner supports unencrypted digital acble, but naturally none is |
08:21.50 | Russ | why would they encrypt it? |
08:21.50 | T0mW | Russ: isn't there a drop-dead date on that? |
08:21.57 | Russ | T0mW: not currently |
08:21.59 | MonMotha | Russ: they all do |
08:22.05 | MonMotha | Russ: we can debate why all night long |
08:22.19 | Russ | http://www.pchdtv.com/hd_3000.html |
08:22.46 | Russ | k...I'm paying for the service, I want a f'ing key |
08:22.52 | T0mW | MonMotha: no, i've little knowledge about hd cable transmission formats. I suspected that it is encrypted channel data, not send in the clear as their analog is. |
08:23.32 | MonMotha | T0mW: you wouldbe correct in 99% of cases |
08:23.38 | MonMotha | Russ: well, that's what the cablecard is for |
08:23.48 | Russ | cable card? |
08:23.53 | MonMotha | however, getting all the licenses and patents worked out to build a hardware device for that with OSS drivers is impossible |
08:23.59 | Russ | you mean the card like directv uses? |
08:24.01 | T0mW | that is one of the reasons I'm avoiding digital cable |
08:24.02 | MonMotha | yup |
08:24.08 | Russ | wonder if cox has those |
08:24.11 | Russ | I don't think they do |
08:24.18 | MonMotha | issue is taht licensing the stuff needed to build the hardware requires that you implement pretty draconian DRM |
08:24.30 | MonMotha | Vista will apparently support it, but XP MCE doesn't have enoguh DRM! |
08:24.58 | Russ | who would use either |
08:25.06 | Russ | (want to use) |
08:25.14 | T0mW | there you go, let microsoft implement DRM + digital cable, then we can hack it |
08:25.20 | MonMotha | Russ: agreed, but Linux will never (legally) support opencable |
08:25.27 | MonMotha | at least not until the patents run out |
08:25.49 | MonMotha | in theory, they'll go away in about 15 years |
08:25.52 | Russ | damned security by obscurity because they are cheap |
08:26.00 | MonMotha | Russ: not really |
08:26.08 | Russ | just use certificates or something |
08:26.11 | MonMotha | you have most of the info needed to build it, but since it's patented you can't do it legally |
08:26.36 | MonMotha | well, the way the card works is it syncs up to a signal on the digital cable and starts spitting out keys |
08:26.40 | MonMotha | it's a smartcard, basically |
08:26.48 | MonMotha | it's fairly secure from waht I've read about it |
08:29.27 | Russ | glitch the card dammit |
08:31.58 | Russ | anyone playing with asterisk? |
08:32.07 | MonMotha | Russ: it's on "the list" |
08:32.25 | MonMotha | the mythtv server doesn't have enough proc time used :) |
08:32.31 | MonMotha | so I was going to do Asterisk |
08:32.39 | Russ | I wanna start by just hooking my home line up to my server |
08:32.51 | Russ | so it can email me messages |
08:33.00 | MonMotha | I was thinking 802.11b runnign in the amateur service |
08:33.10 | MonMotha | nothing like running VoIP over 2.4GHz instead of FM |
08:33.12 | Russ | and maybe I can make and receive calls from my home phone from elsewhere |
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13:31.03 | prpplague | hehe funny funnt |
13:31.05 | prpplague | funny |
13:31.13 | prpplague | http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7467429921.html |
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13:58.02 | chouimat | morning |
14:08.03 | T0mW | prpplague: YO! Where is your name in that article, huh? |
14:09.47 | T0mW | prpplague: aha! I know what the problem is: humble Dave didn't put his name anywhere |
14:09.53 | T0mW | :P |
14:10.36 | prpplague | T0mW: hehe |
14:13.50 | T0mW | prpplague: wanker |
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14:15.04 | T0mW | GPSFan: morning stranger |
14:15.40 | GPSFan | T0mW: hi, how was the "big snow"? |
14:15.43 | T0mW | prpplague: I can't take this anymore <sob> |
14:15.54 | T0mW | prpplague: I'm going out to get a cigar! |
14:15.58 | prpplague | T0mW: hehe |
14:16.06 | T0mW | GPSFan: what snow? |
14:16.09 | GPSFan | T0mW: resist!! |
14:16.19 | T0mW | GPSFan: maybeeee we got 7inches |
14:16.28 | prpplague | T0mW: GPSFan would be able to answer your question about the zipit |
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14:16.38 | GPSFan | melted already ;>( |
14:16.45 | T0mW | GPSFan: now, my friend in Rockaway NJ (outside of Dover) got hammered with 20+ inches |
14:17.01 | T0mW | GPSFan: hey! could a Zipit do IRC? |
14:17.18 | T0mW | GPSFan: are all the peices there but the IRC app? |
14:17.41 | GPSFan | T0mW: yes, that's one of the first programs I got running, |
14:17.58 | T0mW | GPSFan: coool! you've got IRC chat on a zipit? |
14:18.18 | GPSFan | it was called weechat, worked ok except it needed locale support in uclibc, which sorta sucked. |
14:18.34 | T0mW | locale? |
14:18.46 | GPSFan | took a lot of space and had problems with the date. |
14:19.31 | GPSFan | support for different fonts/char sets for different parts of the worle, weechat comes from france.. |
14:19.40 | T0mW | GPSFan: hmm, wonder if you could make it page out to the SD card for more virtual memory space? |
14:20.01 | T0mW | prolly get uClinux all tangled up though |
14:20.28 | GPSFan | not that it took too much ram, uclibc with locale was quite a bit bigger than without. this was before the mmc. |
14:21.14 | T0mW | hmm, still $10 |
14:21.17 | T0mW | hmm, still $100 |
14:21.41 | GPSFan | T0mW: also remember what irc clients like to put on the screen, time stamp, nick, surronded by brackets, etc. crowds a 320x240 screen. |
14:22.00 | T0mW | I don't timestamp here |
14:22.44 | T0mW | 320x240 should be, what, 40 cols * 12 lines? |
14:22.56 | T0mW | 20 lines |
14:23.30 | GPSFan | it was not bad, I had a few patches to it, check the Yahoo site, it's all there. |
14:24.10 | GPSFan | I haven't kept up with weechat development, there have been several releases since. |
14:30.17 | prpplague | GPSFan: you can hack something in called brokenlocal that will allow you not to use all those local files |
14:30.22 | prpplague | GPSFan: iirc |
14:30.59 | chouimat | hey T0mW prpplague GPSFan |
14:31.08 | prpplague | chouimat: hey |
14:31.19 | prpplague | chouimat: see that you have an ice warning tonight |
14:31.44 | chouimat | prpplague: yes ... shit I was planning to get a few beers tonight :( |
14:31.57 | prpplague | hehe |
14:33.45 | GPSFan | chouimat: morning |
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14:45.59 | T0mW | chouimat: hello! ice-man |
14:46.18 | chouimat | T0mW: :) |
14:47.46 | T0mW | GPSFan: cable company tells me that their wifi network is "open" to connect to. But, if you want to get past the firewalls I'd have to login via an HTML page. Sound like this is within the realm of zipit's abilities? |
14:49.13 | T0mW | 16Meg of RAM sounds pretty beefy |
14:49.23 | GPSFan | T0mW: you might have to write some sort of program to actually handle the html challenge/response. might be able to do it with links. |
14:50.09 | GPSFan | 16M is enough for many apps. not many at once. ;>) |
14:51.17 | prpplague | lordy i just do not understand scox's stock price |
14:51.35 | prpplague | they are getting hammered in court, and yet their stock price is slowly creaping up |
14:54.09 | T0mW | GPSFan: yeah, ok. I'm getting the blue one, um, maybe the silver, but, red is so bright.. |
14:57.14 | GPSFan | T0mW: I have a blue and a white. btw it's real linux, not uclinux. the 7312 has an mmu. |
15:03.46 | T0mW | GPSFan: ooo! MMU, cool. I got me a blue one |
15:04.07 | T0mW | plus I think I can scare up some SD card stuff, heh |
15:06.09 | T0mW | prpplague: people keep speculating that IBM will eventually get pissed and purchase SCOX + their assets. |
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15:06.41 | T0mW | prpplague: that IBM will want to "get it over with", regardless of how weak the SCOX case might be |
15:08.19 | T0mW | http://palmtops.about.com/b/a/186625.htm |
15:08.32 | T0mW | The Zipit boots from 2MB of Flash, reportedly, and has 16MB of SDRAM. David Anders is reportedly investigating a way to add an MMC memory card slot to the device, to expand its storage |
15:09.09 | T0mW | prpplague: you can stop working now, you already got your 15minutes of fame |
15:09.28 | T0mW | too bad it was only on a web page |
15:12.40 | CosmicPenguin | Who was looking for me? |
15:12.50 | CosmicPenguin | I'll find you |
15:13.46 | CosmicPenguin | GPSFan: hey - is the snow blowing in horizontally from Wyoming for you too? :) |
15:16.11 | GPSFan | CosmicPenguin: it's bright and sunny here, we had an amazing wind storm yesterday, but the snow went ust north of us. |
15:16.29 | CosmicPenguin | GPSFan: yeah, we're getting it badly right now |
15:17.20 | GPSFan | don't blow away.. |
15:17.42 | CosmicPenguin | I'm just glad to be out of the snow |
15:17.53 | CosmicPenguin | hopefully my wife makes it to work ok - she has to travel a lot farther then I do |
15:18.01 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: I think MonMotha was looking to talk about x86 cra^H^H^Hstuff |
15:18.11 | CosmicPenguin | heh |
15:18.14 | CosmicPenguin | MonMotha: ping? |
15:20.33 | prpplague | T0mW`4cigar: thats funny as GPSFan is the one that got it working |
15:20.49 | prpplague | T0mW`4cigar: i never had time to finish my hack on the zipit |
15:21.07 | prpplague | T0mW`4cigar: i actually was adding a spi gpio chip |
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15:28.37 | chouimat | I remember when I was young and my grandfather told me the legend of the lunar cycle. |
15:28.37 | chouimat | He told me that when every month when the full moon arrived to take food and to go |
15:28.41 | chouimat | to take shelter in the mountain with the other men and wait 5 days that the Great |
15:28.41 | chouimat | Red Anger to be over ... Because this is, son, the price you have to pay to get laid |
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16:27.05 | Genesis | yop |
16:27.23 | Genesis | i've a big problem i would like to submit to you |
16:27.42 | Genesis | i dev on a PIC 16f877 |
16:28.01 | Genesis | plug my card on the serial port |
16:28.07 | Genesis | i write some data on it |
16:28.16 | Genesis | it works perfectly on win98 |
16:28.29 | Genesis | but i read nothing on linux and XP |
16:29.10 | Genesis | it's a big mistake , my electronic professor didn't find the pb :/ |
17:10.31 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: you see my juicebox hack made the headlines in the enquirer^h^h^h^h^hlinuxdevices.com pages? |
17:10.37 | CosmicPenguin | heh - yeah |
17:11.25 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: hehe got a spare room i can rent? i'm ready to run away |
17:16.18 | CosmicPenguin | yeah, come on up |
17:16.30 | Genesis | good job prpp |
17:16.33 | CosmicPenguin | If the INS comes for you though, I don't know you.. :) |
17:17.22 | prpplague | hehe |
17:17.35 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: i'm still a US citizen |
17:18.05 | CosmicPenguin | heh |
17:18.15 | CosmicPenguin | And that is supposed to stop them? |
17:18.24 | CosmicPenguin | I guess that means they'll just spy on you then |
17:18.46 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: hehe yea |
17:19.13 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: last time i came back to the states they grilled me at the INS station |
17:23.13 | CosmicPenguin | man, sometimes gentoo is just plain annoying |
17:23.20 | CosmicPenguin | it took me forever to update to a new version of inn |
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17:34.19 | prpplague | kergoth: don't start that today |
17:35.27 | kergoth | too late |
17:36.44 | kergoth | http://www.animalshaveproblemstoo.com/view.php?id=179 |
17:42.01 | prpplague | kergoth: totally bizarre pages |
17:42.06 | kergoth | yep |
17:42.25 | prpplague | http://www.animalshaveproblemstoo.com/view.php?id=189 |
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18:06.25 | prpplague | there is the man of the hour |
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18:37.13 | prpplague | TimRiker: hehe http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7467429921.html |
18:37.26 | prpplague | TimRiker: hehe your name was the only one mentioned hehe |
18:38.13 | CosmicPenguin | heh |
18:38.18 | CosmicPenguin | "Tim RIker's elinux website" |
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19:24.46 | ljp | anyone know of any NPTL issues with glibc and arm kernel? |
19:47.04 | prpplague | ljp: i've heard rumors of such, but no first hand experience |
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20:16.58 | T0mW | klacto verada nicto |
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22:10.51 | Genesis | bonne nuit |
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